Windows 11 General Discussion

[Onasi]

Hey, this actually took less than the 22H2 did last time. Probably won’t jump on it JUST yet, but good to have it available.

 

[lexluthermiester]

View attachment 372856
Hey, this actually took less than the 22H2 did last time. Probably won’t jump on it JUST yet, but good to have it available.

Give it 3 or 4 months then grab it, lets say March. They're still working out the kinks..

 

[RUSerious]

Give it 3 or 4 months then grab it, lets say March. They're still working out the kinks..

Good advice. There have been some annoyances pop up that I'd didn't notice when I first installed it - and others have had it worse.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Good advice. There have been some annoyances pop up that I'd didn't notice when I first installed it - and others have had it worse.

As stated elsewhere, a fresh install does not have most or all of the issues being experienced. So if you're willing to fresh install you're golden.

 

[Onasi]

@lexluthermiester
Which is rather interesting, by the by, since the update re-installs the OS anyway. Wonder what’s conflicting that’s causing the issues. MS probably won’t tell us, but would be interesting to know. Would be funny if it’s a dreaded comeback of the XP “.dll hell” of sorts and something gets stuck wrongly in the SxS system on an update.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Wonder what’s conflicting that’s causing the issues.

There's a catch...

since the update re-installs the OS anyway.

...this is only partly true. Existing driver assets, user apps & files, user settings are preserved, even much of the OS assets are kept unaltered. As some of the ways the kernel and base services run have changed, dramatically in a few ways(though invisible to the user), some of those settings have to be just right and they're not. This is where microsoft is trying to appeal to those of us complaining about our configs and setting being changed after updates plays into it all.

In all fairness to microsoft, they're trying to get just right something that is VERY complicated. This is why you don't see me complaining too much about this round of update problems and recommending a fresh install.

MS probably won’t tell us, but would be interesting to know.

They kinda have but it's not "public" per-se.

Would be funny if it’s a dreaded comeback of the XP “.dll hell” of sorts and something gets stuck wrongly in the SxS system on an update.

That particular problem can't and won't happen again.

 

[Onasi]

Decided to actually YOLO it and see what happens. If only to see what MS decides to do on the update other than the update itself. So far so good. Of course, they force installed Teams and Bing Search alongside the update (thanks MS!) which were immediately terminated. Also curious how they seemingly totally reset the Services list - the Print Spooler is back, even though it was disabled. So that seemingly doesn’t carry over. Didn’t reset anything in my Settings or CP, so that’s good. Did return the Search Web results because they reset THAT group policy, which is annoying. At least they didn’t try to reset the default browser to Edge, thankfully. No CoPilot nonsense. Immediately searched for and applied the latest KB, so that’s nice, apparently lots of bug fixes in that. Overall, very smooth update process and surprisingly quick. We’ll see how it holds up.

 

[Onasi]

Well, after a couple days of using it without any REAL issues 24H2 is pretty good. I am a tad butthurt about some stuff moving around in settings and the fact that they STILL haven't modernized some things that really should be new by this point, like the new Task Manager still just being a ModernUI skin on top of the old runtime. But the new OS is noticeably snappier than 23H2. This is not placebo or anything, there are less hang ups and apps don't get stuck on processing as much. Obviously, there is a tiny delay on fresh opening of different windows and tools, but it's CONSISTENT now and not random as hell. It uses about the same amount of RAM as it used to, though it SEEMS like it's more aggressive about caching things into said RAM, so it might LOOK like it uses more, but I do not see that as a downside - using RAM when availiable isn't a sin, like some obsessive tweakers think.

 

[windwhirl]

TPM 2.0 – a necessity for a secure and future-proof Windows 11 | Microsoft Community Hub

Learn why Trusted Platform Module (TPM) 2.0 is a non-negotiable standard for Windows 11 now and in the future.

techcommunity.microsoft.com

Just in case anyone was thinking Microsoft would ever lift the TPM requirement, they just went and said it's here to stay and is "non-negotiable"

Outside of that article, I've seen some people comment that it's more likely Microsoft will just extend Windows 10's support further than what it's currently planned (because just pulling the trigger on however many machines still run W10 by 10/2025 would probably look bad), but I don't see that happening.

 

[lexluthermiester]

TPM has flaws in both practical application and in functionality that are unsolvable. Forcing everyone to use it is completely retarded and unacceptable. But we all know microsoft likes to learn things the hard way and make a complete gnaws up of all the things while they're doing it.

 

[Onasi]

Just in case anyone was thinking Microsoft would ever lift the TPM requirement, they just went and said it's here to stay and is "non-negotiable"

So non-negotiable that the LTSC explicitly made it optional. Just MS things.

Even funnier seeing how it took them TWO YEARS and a major update in 24H2 to fix the bug of AMDs fTPM sometimes bugging out and not being detected by Defender, even when it was working properly. I can just feel that commitment.

 

[Onasi]

Article is several days old, bit I just stumbled upon it.

Microsoft ramps up pressure on users running Windows 11 on unsupported PCs

The company is threatening to add a watermark to the desktop of any unsupported PC running Windows 11.

www.zdnet.com

Okay… Two things.
1. This nonsense will also be bypassed.
2. MS please, please, I fucking beg you - stop clowning, this isn’t a good look. I know you are obsessed with trying to control the user experience, but you are not Apple, you are godawful at this whole “vertically integrated ecosystem” thing. Stop trying to dictate how people run their systems and what they do with them and actually focus on making your OS as good as possible. The fact that the only reasonable version of your current OS (out of the box, anyway) is the one meant for fucking kiosk machines speaks for itself. You have a fairly good thing going with the OS at its core. Stop kneecapping it with bullshit.

 

[lexluthermiester]

And here we are less than a week later and it seems microsoft is changing their stance?!?

Microsoft allows Windows 11 to be installed on older, unsupported hardware but specifically nixes official support — minimum requirements for full compatibility remain unchanged

Can they still be considered "minimum requirements" if they are easily circumvented?

www.tomshardware.com

After checking microsoft's own page directly, sure enough, there it is;

Installing Windows 11 on devices that don't meet minimum system requirements - Microsoft Support

Learn what to do when a warning message is displayed showing that a device doesn't meet Windows 11 minimum system requirements to upgrade.

support.microsoft.com

So it seems microsoft is no longer going to prevent users from installing on unsupported hardware. I'm going to grab the latest ISO and test this later today.

Weird.

@ microsoft
Ok, now do away with the account requirement. Why? Because that too is what is correct and right. Asking(strongly even) users to create an account is one thing. Requiring it is completely another and crosses a line that is unacceptable, immoral, unethical and in some places, unlawful. There's your next change.

You want to know why the PC market is in decline? You and all the other greedy fools making dumbass decisions that hurt citizen freedoms and liberties. People are sick of it. Fix your mentally bereft business tactics and make choices that are harmonious for a civilized world.

 

[Halo3Addict]

And here we are less than a week later and it seems microsoft is changing their stance?!?

Microsoft allows Windows 11 to be installed on older, unsupported hardware but specifically nixes official support — minimum requirements for full compatibility remain unchanged

Can they still be considered "minimum requirements" if they are easily circumvented?

www.tomshardware.com

After checking microsoft's own page directly, sure enough, there it is;

Installing Windows 11 on devices that don't meet minimum system requirements - Microsoft Support

Learn what to do when a warning message is displayed showing that a device doesn't meet Windows 11 minimum system requirements to upgrade.

support.microsoft.com

So it seems microsoft is no longer going to prevent users from installing on unsupported hardware. I'm going to grab the latest ISO and test this later today.

Weird.

@ microsoft
Ok, now do away with the account requirement. Why? Because that too is what is correct and right. Asking(strongly even) users to create an account is one thing. Requiring it is completely another and crosses a line that is unacceptable, immoral, unethical and in some places, unlawful. There's your next change.

You want to know why the PC market is in decline? You and all the other greedy fools making dumbass decisions that hurt citizen freedoms and liberties. People are sick of it. Fix your mentally bereft business tactics and make choices that are harmonious for a civilized world.

I'm just very unclear about what this microsoft support page actually changes..

The minimum requirements are the same.. PCs that don't meet the min reqs are inherently unsupported.. they are adding a watermark if unsupported (is this new?).. it just doesn't really seem like their stance has changed.

Have they updated the Win11 installer to accept 'unsupported' hardware?

 

[lexluthermiester]

The minimum requirements are the same.. PCs that don't meet the min reqs are inherently unsupported.. they are adding a watermark if unsupported (is this new?).. it just doesn't really seem like their stance has changed.

Have they updated the Win11 installer to accept 'unsupported' hardware?

Gonna test it soon.

 

[Shrek]

Looking forward to what you discover.

 

[theFOoL]

Well I ofc tried but nope they won't remove the cpu instructions required so yea I had to restore my Image back to 23H2ET AH Ha. I mean... I could careless about this AI Crap. So stupid about the cpu instructions

 

[lexluthermiester]

Well, it seems @Ruru beat me too the task. They tried it already with no success.
I'll still give it a go on spare system and chime in, but not holding my breath. I suspect bypasses will still be needed.

 

[Ruru]

Well, it seems @Ruru beat me too the task. They tried it already with no success.
I'll still give it a go on spare system and chime in, but not holding my breath. I suspect bypasses will still be needed.

Yeah, just as stubborn like before. Tried both fresh install via booting from the media and upgrading from an up-to-date W10 Pro install, both with no success.

edit: That system has a i7-3770K, Asus P8Z77-V LE Plus, 32GB (4x8GB) DDR3-1600 & R9 290X, if that matters...

 

[theFOoL]

Best thing is Flyby11

Works Like a Charm on my Hp 8460p with my Gen1 Intel i7 but I had to roll back bc it doesn't have anything for me

 

[mechtech]

And here we are less than a week later and it seems microsoft is changing their stance?!?

Microsoft allows Windows 11 to be installed on older, unsupported hardware but specifically nixes official support — minimum requirements for full compatibility remain unchanged

Can they still be considered "minimum requirements" if they are easily circumvented?

www.tomshardware.com

After checking microsoft's own page directly, sure enough, there it is;

Installing Windows 11 on devices that don't meet minimum system requirements - Microsoft Support

Learn what to do when a warning message is displayed showing that a device doesn't meet Windows 11 minimum system requirements to upgrade.

support.microsoft.com

So it seems microsoft is no longer going to prevent users from installing on unsupported hardware. I'm going to grab the latest ISO and test this later today.

Weird.

@ microsoft
Ok, now do away with the account requirement. Why? Because that too is what is correct and right. Asking(strongly even) users to create an account is one thing. Requiring it is completely another and crosses a line that is unacceptable, immoral, unethical and in some places, unlawful. There's your next change.

You want to know why the PC market is in decline? You and all the other greedy fools making dumbass decisions that hurt citizen freedoms and liberties. People are sick of it. Fix your mentally bereft business tactics and make choices that are harmonious for a civilized world.

meh

I want to install the kiosk version, let me know when they allow that.

 

[lexluthermiester]

kiosk version

You mean the IoT version. You can do that now. Just have to buy a valid key or it converts to Enterprise Standard.

 

[Onasi]

Well I ofc tried but nope they won't remove the cpu instructions required so yea I had to restore my Image back to 23H2ET AH Ha. I mean... I could careless about this AI Crap. So stupid about the cpu instructions

That is that and this is this. Even if MS removed all the “unsupported” flags related to TPM/Secure Boot it wouldn’t change anything with regards to SSE 4.2. The kernel isn’t being changed. Again, this has nothing to do with AI - Linux has been mandating those instructions for a while now. People screeching about it are the same energy like wondering why newest RT games aren’t supporting their 8800GT.

 

[mechtech]

You mean the IoT version. You can do that now. Just have to by a valid key or it converts to Enterprise Standard.

And how does one do that?

 

[lexluthermiester]

And how does one do that?

Yes. Not sure. Key sellers maybe?