Been away from PC gaming, a bit lost...

[Vayra86]

We already know that games tend to need more and more multicore performance. Cache is also beneficial, but it don't know how it could make up lack of multicore performance, so I wouldn't mix both here. One thing is sure - 7800X3D will lack multicore performance sooner than 13/14th gen i7.

And btw and to be clear: by "13700" and "14700" I meant their whole families, so multiple models differing with letters. Prices of them are always a mess, so man can find e.g. K chip cheaper than KF.



You are right with the heat and it sucks - I know from my experience of owning even worse offenders But I don't know if OP cares.

I don't think games ever needed 'cores'. Games (all apps) need threads and they need to be able to run certain threads uninterrupted, or with the lowest possible latency, to maintain the FPS. Now this is not the thread count that it shows on your CPU box. CPUs run many more of them concurrently, they just don't need to be working in real time all the time. We see with recent CPUs that they cap out in performance with a substantially lower core count than much older ones. There is some gain to be had from core count, but it tends to plateau abruptly, and that happens at or around 8x. Now ofcourse CPUs with more cores can divide the work over more cores. But a faster CPU with a lower core count can and does achieve the same, or better, FPS. For background tasks the same thing occurs. If you have enough cores to move the threads to, having more of them makes no difference. Whereas if you have a faster CPU, you need fewer cores to move threads to because the work's done faster.

This is also why clockspeed is so so important a differentiator for CPUs in the gaming space - much more than core count.

 

[#22]

I don't think games ever needed 'cores'. Games (all apps) need threads and they need to be able to run certain threads uninterrupted, or with the lowest possible latency, to maintain the FPS. Now this is not the thread count that it shows on your CPU box. CPUs run many more of them concurrently, they just don't need to be working in real time all the time. We see with recent CPUs that they cap out in performance with a substantially lower core count than much older ones. There is some gain to be had from core count, but it tends to plateau abruptly, and that happens at or around 8x. Now ofcourse CPUs with more cores can divide the work over more cores. But a faster CPU with a lower core count can and does achieve the same, or better, FPS. For background tasks the same thing occurs. If you have enough cores to move the threads to, having more of them makes no difference. Whereas if you have a faster CPU, you need fewer cores to move threads to because the work's done faster.

This is also why clockspeed is so so important a differentiator for CPUs in the gaming space - much more than core count.

In whole thread I didn't even use the word "cores" Games and apps in general tend to need more are more multicore performance. With games it works for years like having more may only smoothen your frametime or having not enough massacrate it. I also brings additional improvements like games compiling shaders or loading levels faster. Whatever you do on your pc may only benefit. There're quality of life improvements.

 

[DiogoCDS19]

Going for this:

CPU: Intel Core i7-14700K 3.4 GHz 20-Core Processor 440.04€
CPU Cooler: Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 EVO 40€
Motherboard: MSI PRO Z790-A MAX WIFI ATX LGA1700 Motherboard 247.01€
Memory: Team Group DIMM 32GB DDR5-7200 (2x 16GB) Dual-Kit White 174.90€
Storage: Western Digital Black SN850X 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive 99,49€
Video Card: Zotac GAMING Trinity OC GeForce RTX 4080 SUPER 16 GB Video Card (white) 1080€
Case: Fractal Design Torrent Compact ATX Mid Tower Case (white) 119,90€
Power Supply: be quiet! Dark Power 13 750 W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply 178.45€

Total: €2379.79

Spending 180€ more than I initially said .

Changed RAM from Corsairs to Team Group because they are really tall and didn't want to mess with them for the cpu cooler to fit.
Changed the SSD to 1TB (I will be fine), I will be also using my 2TB HDD that I had from previous build.

Ended up going for a RTX4080 Super for 1080€ (cheaper than normal prices here)
And picked a better quality PSU.

And I know that white ram and white gpu costs more

I guess that is it

Thanks!

 

[64K]

Going for this:

CPU: Intel Core i7-14700K 3.4 GHz 20-Core Processor 440.04€
CPU Cooler: Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 EVO 40€
Motherboard: MSI PRO Z790-A MAX WIFI ATX LGA1700 Motherboard 247.01€
Memory: Team Group DIMM 32GB DDR5-7200 (2x 16GB) Dual-Kit White 174.90€
Storage: Western Digital Black SN850X 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive 99,49€
Video Card: Zotac GAMING Trinity OC GeForce RTX 4080 SUPER 16 GB Video Card (white) 1080€
Case: Fractal Design Torrent Compact ATX Mid Tower Case (white) 119,90€
Power Supply: be quiet! Dark Power 13 750 W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply 178.45€

Total: €2379.79

Spending 180€ more than I initially said .

Changed RAM from Corsairs to Team Group because they are really tall and didn't want to mess with them for the cpu cooler to fit.
Changed the SSD to 1TB (I will be fine), I will be also using my 2TB HDD that I had from previous build.

Ended up going for a RTX4080 Super for 1080€ (cheaper than normal prices here)
And picked a better quality PSU.

And I know that white ram and white gpu costs more

I guess that is it

Thanks!

Well, looks like an excellent gaming rig to me. You're spending a bit more than you planned but going up to a 4080 Super from the original 4070 Super is a big step up. Around 30% faster average in benchmarks done on TPU.

 

[freeagent]

That is a system you can use for everything, not just gaming.

Nice.

AMD X3D still annoys me even though I have one.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Looks awesome man, glad you were able to fit in some extra horsepower on the gpu side.

A very well rounded build that should last you years to come.

The storage situation isn't the best but that's literally the easiest thing to add later you definitely want any game to be run from SSD and I prefer them to be on a separate drive from my OS. I'm sure you'll be fine though in the short term.

 

[#22]

@DiogoCDS19

I don't think it's worth going 4080 Super over 4070 Ti Super - imo unnoticeably faster for noticeably more, especially when you spend more than you planned. I also don't like Dark Powers 12 and 13 for having rattling fans - you will hear it even from meter away. And I'm not a fan of Torrent Compact when you - as we can see - aim higher end components, so one needing bigger coolers. Torrent is a great case, so one not giving reasons to change, but there're already GPUs it won't fit. It would bad needing to change a good case, only because it's too small.

 

[Vayra86]

In whole thread I didn't even use the word "cores" Games and apps in general tend to need more are more multicore performance. With games it works for years like having more may only smoothen your frametime or having not enough massacrate it. I also brings additional improvements like games compiling shaders or loading levels faster. Whatever you do on your pc may only benefit. There're quality of life improvements.

Agreed. But again. You say multicore performance but it simply plateaus and that happens way before reaching the insane core counts on high end cpus. With 8/16 you are golden unless you really do specific workloads that benefit. Even with a discord, browser and media playing behind your game.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Agreed. But again. You say multicore performance but it simply plateaus and that happens way before reaching the insane core counts on high end cpus. With 8/16 you are golden unless you really do specific workloads that benefit. Even with a discord, browser and media playing behind your game.

The issues on Intel is they also castrate the cache as the cores go down unlike with ryzen where each CCD gets a similar amount it's why on Intel I probably would still go i9 becuase even if you limit it to the same core count and clockspeed of an i5 you still get the majority of the perfomance gains.

 

[#22]

Agreed. But again. You say multicore performance but it simply plateaus and that happens way before reaching the insane core counts on high end cpus. With 8/16 you are golden unless you really do specific workloads that benefit. Even with a discord, browser and media playing behind your game.

If you agree, what you discuss with now?

 

[Vayra86]

If you agree, what you discuss with now?

One thing is sure - 7800X3D will lack multicore performance sooner than 13/14th gen i7.

^ this comment.
The additional cores on intel wont make a substantial difference if you are gaming with a few things in background. I doubt you would even notice. Not now or 5 years from now.

 

[#22]

One thing is sure - 7800X3D will lack multicore performance sooner than 13/14th gen i7.

^ this comment.
The additional cores on intel wont make a substantial difference if you are gaming with a few things in background. I doubt you would even notice. Not now or 5 years from now.

These are only your predictions you confront with mine It's strange to me that you think so, because I think totally opposite, but fine - in the end man can only form predictions basing on what he knows and assume that tendencies already shown will continue.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

One thing is sure - 7800X3D will lack multicore performance sooner than 13/14th gen i7.

^ this comment.
The additional cores on intel wont make a substantial difference if you are gaming with a few things in background. I doubt you would even notice. Not now or 5 years from now.

I at least try not to make any future guesses on how hardware will or won't perform the 7600K died fast but so did Zen 1 and Zen 1+ really and it also depends on the type of games you play and what fps you want to target. IF game engines go wide 3 years from now the intel cores might give it an advantage but given developers track record probably not lol. The best we can do is guess and given that both the 14700k and 7800X3D are two of the best performing cpu's in games they likely will game just fine for the foreseeable future.

 

[Vayra86]

I at least try not to make any future guesses on how hardware will or won't perform the 7600K died fast but so did Zen 1 and Zen 1+ really and it also depends on the type of games you play and what fps you want to target. IF game engines go wide 3 years from now the intel cores might give it an advantage but given developers track record probably not lol. The best we can do is guess and given that both the 14700k and 7800X3D are two of the best performing cpu's in games they likely will game just fine for the foreseeable future.

Not happening, engines aint going anywhere. The API already evolved to 'multicore optimized'.

These are only your predictions you confront with mine It's strange to me that you think so, because I think totally opposite, but fine - in the end man can only form predictions basing on what he knows and assume that tendencies already shown will continue.

History is proof. Games STILL run fine on 4c8t CPUs as long as they are recent; and I still run everythjng on a 6c12t 8700K. And they still benefit most from frequency not core count bumps, after a certain number. Not everything is complicated.

People can live their CPU dream all night for all I care but when it comes to gaming and related use cases, we have reached a point where there are little surprises left. You never needed high core count CPUs to game and it wont change, because the simple fact is this realtime workload is mostly sequential of nature.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Not happening, engines aint going anywhere. The API already evolved to 'multicore optimized'.


History is proof. Games STILL run fine on 4c8t CPUs as long as they are recent; and I still run everythjng on a 6c12t 8700K. And they still benefit most from frequency not core count bumps, after a certain number. Not everything is complicated.

People can live their CPU dream all night for all I care but when it comes to gaming and related use cases, we have reached a point where there are little surprises left. You never needed high core count CPUs to game and it wont change, because the simple fact is this realtime workload is mostly sequential of nature.

For sure cache and frequency and IPC are the three most important things a modern quad core 8 thread part would kill your 6 core part and my 9900k/6700k died long ago in MP online games although the 6700K struggled in SP stuff as well but I'm always pairing my stuff with the fastest or near fastest gpu if I was on somthing in the ballpark of a 4070 super it would be a different story I'm right on the edge currently at 4k and UW DLDSR 2.25 on top of 1440p in most games.

 

[Solaris17]

I don't think games ever needed 'cores'. Games (all apps) need threads and they need to be able to run certain threads uninterrupted, or with the lowest possible latency, to maintain the FPS. Now this is not the thread count that it shows on your CPU box. CPUs run many more of them concurrently, they just don't need to be working in real time all the time. We see with recent CPUs that they cap out in performance with a substantially lower core count than much older ones. There is some gain to be had from core count, but it tends to plateau abruptly, and that happens at or around 8x. Now ofcourse CPUs with more cores can divide the work over more cores. But a faster CPU with a lower core count can and does achieve the same, or better, FPS. For background tasks the same thing occurs. If you have enough cores to move the threads to, having more of them makes no difference. Whereas if you have a faster CPU, you need fewer cores to move threads to because the work's done faster.

This is also why clockspeed is so so important a differentiator for CPUs in the gaming space - much more than core count.

Someone that gets it. Lets hold hands. Fun point of interest. You can see this differentiation clearly with pretty much any MMO (character location calculations) or software physics (early havok).

Going for this:

CPU: Intel Core i7-14700K 3.4 GHz 20-Core Processor 440.04€
CPU Cooler: Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 EVO 40€
Motherboard: MSI PRO Z790-A MAX WIFI ATX LGA1700 Motherboard 247.01€
Memory: Team Group DIMM 32GB DDR5-7200 (2x 16GB) Dual-Kit White 174.90€
Storage: Western Digital Black SN850X 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive 99,49€
Video Card: Zotac GAMING Trinity OC GeForce RTX 4080 SUPER 16 GB Video Card (white) 1080€
Case: Fractal Design Torrent Compact ATX Mid Tower Case (white) 119,90€
Power Supply: be quiet! Dark Power 13 750 W 80+ Titanium Certified Fully Modular ATX Power Supply 178.45€

Total: €2379.79

Spending 180€ more than I initially said .

Changed RAM from Corsairs to Team Group because they are really tall and didn't want to mess with them for the cpu cooler to fit.
Changed the SSD to 1TB (I will be fine), I will be also using my 2TB HDD that I had from previous build.

Ended up going for a RTX4080 Super for 1080€ (cheaper than normal prices here)
And picked a better quality PSU.

And I know that white ram and white gpu costs more

I guess that is it

Thanks!

Nice job man! should be a solid system!

Since we are veering OT though and OP is happy im going to lock this for now which is a gift better than infractions down the line.