EU's New Right to Repair Directive Requires 10 Year Component Availability

[Nuke Dukem]

Those are not covered by warranty. Things like physically damaging the card or it's components, the board getting fried by a power surge, custom BIOS. But that is the deal with DIY if your screwdriver slips and you scratch the PCB it's your fault

You misunderstood me, so let me point to your earlier comment and be more clear: the one good reason for manufacturers to use the sticker is simple - there is no way to know if the user has the skills to properly handle the item. If anything goes wrong and the warranty sticker is missing or damaged, as much as it hurts me to say it: yes, it should be assumed that the user is at fault.

The only scenario I see where I could agree with you is if by some miracle you present a document that's written and signed by a certified technician stating that the repair was done by you under his supervision and he automatically assumes responsibility for the repair.

My card should not "suffer" temperatures close to or above 100ºC on vRAM or hot spot for it's warranty period because the manufacturer skimped on QA, thermal pads or TIM. Also my ears would suffer the high noise.

You have lots of other options before tearing into it, like:
1. Undervolting
2. Undervolting with underclocking
3. Setting a custom fan curve
4. Giving it a bit more general airflow
5. Returning the card (within 14 days, assuming it was bought digitally, you know how it goes)
6. Doing some research and not buying crap

I woul agree if i could send the card, my custom TIM and thermal pads and an authorized person at the manufacturers service would swap them for free and reapply the warranty sticker. None are an option ATM.

See now we're thinking alike

i did it too, purposefully difficult do open and swap parts so you buy a new one. Even if it was the law they had to send you a new part to swap, they would super glue everything (like some already do) so you didn't do it

super glue
a million screws of hundred different sizes
weird screws that you need to buy a special tool
warranty stickers
super fragile parts so they almost dare you to not brake it
etc...
and even the new trend that they want to stop you from importing parts (Louis talked about this)

Aaah, yes, the glue, so much glue. Thanks, manufacturers, I hate it!

 

[R-T-B]

See above for what really happens wrt power usage.
One could also say 'try finding a 24 inch OLED and get back to me'

My dude you are on a tech forum. Having a big screen TV without heating your room like a furnace IS the dream.

Also, nits. I said it before. The OLED is FAR brighter. They could make them much more efficient but then this exact forum would complain about contrast ratios.

i found a Sony Z9G (ZG9) lcd consuming 225W and it isn't even that big, there are news of 200'' tv's. Those CRT were extreme cases and rare, they were enormous (the box not the actual screen size) and weighed a ton almost literally. I don't know if these enormous lcds and oleds won't become normal soon and with insane nits to make it worst.

Nits. It's the primary reason they aren't heads and tails ahead of a CRT.

Also the "smart" computer running inside them doesn't help. CRTs were dumb as a brick.

 

[Vayra86]

My dude you are on a tech forum. Having a big screen TV without heating your room like a furnace IS the dream.

Also, nits. I said it before. The OLED is FAR brighter. They could make them much more efficient but then this exact forum would complain about contrast ratios.

Oh yeah I'm not denying this as a recent C2 owner, but still, its an observation that says something about 'old tech' - both display a picture, phasing out 'old tech' quickly isn't actually that good for anyone, its certainly not required due to perceived 'power savings' for example.

Okay, I understood your point about informing your average citizen about his rights, and although legislators may mean well, in the end my life gets more complicated. What GDPR brought me is the need to click on 267 different items to say that I don't want my data being sold just to check out what the weather will be tomorrow.

Now, of course you'll say "But at least now you have the right to choose" and you'd technically be correct, but the end result is that sites are now cumbersome and obtuse. Would it not have been easier to mandate "opt-out by default" and a less intrusive opt-in? What we have now is madness.

I expect this will be more of the same: sounds like a good idea, but it's not so good in practice.

Yes, in theory it sounds good, like a step in the right direction, but in the end when it's in effect if there are so many omissions and loopholes (be they intentional or unintentional), does it even matter?

Whether these regulations will eventually turn into something that is actually usable is unpredictable. Some may hit the mark some may not. An example that did: USB charging standard. We all benefit from it. Another one. Phone roaming tariffs in the EU. And personally, I also consider GDPR a success. Yes, cookie warnings. But at the same time, the stuff is implemented; there is an actual 'right to be forgotten' on the internet now, and we've already seen how much companies that own services can actually do to keep the internet a safer place (and/or at the same time destabilize it) for individuals, or groups. We're also slowly adjusting our stance on global data sharing, in particular with the US. This is all profit imho.

In the end we're dealing with people and they all have opinions. That's why we have the weak sauce and not your optimal opt out by default - I agree completely that its sub optimal. But we also know governments 'nudge' people in democracies, they don't use repression to achieve goals. We're left an illusion of choice, so that eventually we'll get so annoyed by the cookie clicky that we'll demand something better. Or some companies get mega fines for not adhering and commerce itself finds a way to make it work proper. Who knows...

Leadership in anything means stepping in front of the crowd and doing something new. Having a mission and executing plans that follow that mission. Its clear everyone kinda does want these things to happen, or feels the actual need for it - right to repair is a big step towards a smaller footprint and sustainable economy; its a clear no-brainer if you remove the lens of how (twisted?) our current economy works.

 

[droopyRO]

You misunderstood me, so let me point to your earlier comment and be more clear: the one good reason for manufacturers to use the sticker is simple - there is no way to know if the user has the skills to properly handle the item. If anything goes wrong and the warranty sticker is missing or damaged, as much as it hurts me to say it: yes, it should be assumed that the user is at fault.

The only scenario I see where I could agree with you is if by some miracle you present a document that's written and signed by a certified technician stating that the repair was done by you under his supervision and he automatically assumes responsibility for the repair.

Skills for what ? The user is at fault for what exactly ? You have to proove that i did something wrong and that is what caused it to void the warranty. The lack of a small piece o paper glued to a screw is not what caused the defect.

 

[Nuke Dukem]

Skills for what ? The user is at fault for what exactly ?

Skills to:

do maintanance, to clean or install custom cooling on his product, in this case GPU. Or a pre-build PC system, to upgrade RAM or add SSD or clean it.

... for example, as you said yourself. At fault for messing up any of those. I'm honestly surprised you're even asking.

You have to proove that i did something wrong and that is what caused it to void the warranty. The lack of a small piece o paper glued to a screw is not what caused the defect.

Okay, let's go with your example again and say you want to install custom cooling on your graphics card. You do it yourself and it works fine? Cool!

The next day your neighbor hears your success story and decides that he can do the same thing. And so he does it. However, after re-assembles the card, it simply won't work anymore. He then follows your advice and tries to return it, since it's within warranty, according to you.

But wait, is that:

a) a factory defect
b) overtorqued or misplaces screws
c) conductive TIM
d) wrong thermal pads
e) ESD damage
f) broken traces in the inner PCB layers
g) all of the above
h) none of the above

Eh?

Now, you could probably imagine the obscene amounts of time and effort (read "money") it would cost to properly determine the cause of death, respectively who's fault it is, in order to decide if the card should be replaced or not. It would probably cost more than the card itself.

If you're experienced, of course it feels frustrating to have some stupid sticker stopping you from cleaning your card - I get it. At the same time, I'm pretty sure it would feel equally frustrating to have to do do RMA on a particular client's card every other week because he thinks it's funny to try out if a new BIOS flash would let him unlock the higher model's shaders, for example.

If the user is technically inclined, knows what he's doing and is careful, I stand with him - let him do his thing. Conversely, if the user is a complete idiot, he has no business attempting self-service and repair. We're not all equal and determining how capable you are could be tricky, but alas - the rules must be the same for everybody. That's why I said that I'm on the fence on this one.

P.S. It's spelled "prove" and "lose".

 

[droopyRO]

Now, you could probably imagine the obscene amounts of time and effort (read "money") i

So you are shilling for multi million dollar companies ? I hope you get good money from them and don't do it for free. As to your "arguments", they are so paper thin i won't bother to answer them all. Instead i will point you to this video, in wich a trained tehnician finds that the GPU is chipped and a vRAM chip is scratched in under 5 minutes. If that is the case then warrany void, the customer pays for it and shipping. It is as easy as this !

PS:

P.S. It's spelled "prove" and "lose".

Noted.
EDIT:

I see now why you got booted off your local forum.

I'm dropping this one, bye.

Yup, those Americans are really "dumb" to make the stickers illegal. We in the EU are so much smarter then them protecting multi-billion $ companies and screwing honest customers.

 

[Nuke Dukem]

I see now why you got booted off your local forum.

I'm dropping this one, bye.

 

[TheinsanegamerN]

If you use them carefully you can easily get 5 years of use, just buy a rugged case & don't charge over 80-90% & avoid discharge under 10-20% for prolonged battery life ~

BU-808: How to Prolong Lithium-based Batteries

BU meta description needed...

batteryuniversity.com

Yes 5 years old phones are slow but perfectly fine for their primary use.

I haven't had batteries fail in recent times with some phones over 4+ year old. It does take some doing but you can carefully manage their usage & usability over a good amount of time.

Hey, better idea. Make the consumable part of the device (the battery) user replaceable!

Wow, such a difficult answer!

(also, suggesting users give up 40% of their battery capacity is an absolute shit answer to "why cant I replace my battery". If I have to sacrifice a significant portion of my devices capability to make it work more then 3 years, then it is a terrible design, full stop.).

 

[lexluthermiester]

Hey, better idea. Make the consumable part of the device (the battery) user replaceable!

Wow, such a difficult answer!

THIS! YES!

 

[bug]

Hey, better idea. Make the consumable part of the device (the battery) user replaceable!

Wow, such a difficult answer!

(also, suggesting users give up 40% of their battery capacity is an absolute shit answer to "why cant I replace my battery". If I have to sacrifice a significant portion of my devices capability to make it work more then 3 years, then it is a terrible design, full stop.).

I can still remember when Apple was teaching everybody batteries must not be user-replaceable because then the device would be thicker and the battery smaller. Unaware of this, Samsung was selling phones with virtually the same thickness and battery capacity with a user replaceable battery back then.

 

[R0H1T]

suggesting users give up 40% of their battery capacity is an absolute shit answer to "why cant I replace my battery".

I never said that, I said you can easily mage battery life with better (dis)charge patterns! Also suggesting better/more spare parts as an answer to sh!t usage including careless handling is beyond stupid, FYI you don't blow up one complete charge cycle in a day ~ it's very rare in fact. Charging battery from 0-100% & then completely draining it to zero is a full cycle.

 

[lexluthermiester]

I never said that, I said you can easily mage battery life with better (dis)charge patterns! Also suggesting better/more spare parts as an answer to sh!t usage including careless handling is beyond stupid, FYI you don't blow up one complete charge cycle in a day ~ it's very rare in fact. Charging battery from 0-100% & then completely draining it to zero is a full cycle.

You seem to be missing the larger point. The ability to maintain, service and repair ones own property is a RIGHT to be protected, not a privilege that companies/governments should be allowed to infringe upon.

 

[wars]

Hi,
Boy you think items cost a lot now just wait for that to be enacted

I'd rather have a laptop i don't have to be forced to decide how much ram I want to purchase. It will infact bring prices down. They won't be able to force you to buy memory or hard drive capacity to their prices and you will be able to upgrade your device as it gets older. If you have a device that lasts and you don't need to buy a new one they need to have better prices to get you to upgrade.

How much money do you think people spend because a laptop they bought has soldered ram and hard drive and had to get rid of it because they could not upgrade the ram or hard drive.

This is good not bad.

 

[dgianstefani]

I'd rather have a laptop i don't have to be forced to decide how much ram I want to purchase. It will infact bring prices down. They won't be able to force you to buy memory or hard drive capacity to their prices and you will be able to upgrade your device as it gets older. If you have a device that lasts and you don't need to buy a new one they need to have better prices to get you to upgrade.

How much money do you think people spend because a laptop they bought has soldered ram and hard drive and had to get rid of it because they could not upgrade the ram or hard drive.

This is good not bad.

That's not how this works. All this means is spare parts are mandated to be sold, and maybe some guides become available. Not that soldered/on package RAM/SSD stop being a thing.

So now everyone will be Apple, charging the same price for the spare part as them doing the repair themselves.

 

[lexluthermiester]

So now everyone will be Apple, charging the same price for the spare part as them doing the repair themselves.

Good grief let's hope not!