How to quickly & easily fix coil-whine(coil choke noise)

[Wolverine2349]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B09GLX8S4Y?ref=ppx_pt2_mob_b_prod_image

This one look good u reckon? Says it has 2-5 cps viscosity which looks lower than most brands I see. I’m located in asia and a lot don’t ship out here but this one does. I do have loctite 401 but not gonna try that.

What has lower viscosity the Harbor Freight 10 pack one or that one on Amazon? And is there a such thing as too low viscosity such as it may drip or leak down the PCB even after it fires.

The one on Amazon someone stated they used for Gigabyte Gaming OC and it slid down into PCI-E slot and it would not boot. So is the viscosity maybe too low on the Amazon one.

Post 153

They told me they used the SuperGlue from Amazon linked here: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1&tag=tec06d-20

Does it matter if the card is first broken in by running it before taking it apart to apply the Super glue or no?

 

[lexluthermiester]

What has lower viscosity the Harbor Freight 10 pack one or that one on Amazon?

Below a certain level of viscosity it won't matter much. Whichever one is faster and easier to obtain, go for that.

Does it matter if the card is first broken in by running it before taking it apart to apply the Super glue or no?

It likely wouldn't hurt to let the card run for a few hours.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Below a certain level of viscosity it won't matter much. Whichever one is faster and easier to obtain, go for that.

It likely wouldn't hurt to let the card run for a few hours.

Though if card runs for a few hours, is it better to take it apart immediately then let it sit and cool for an hour before putting the SuperGlue on the chokes?

And have you ever did a Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 and if so what were the results compared to PNY? Reason I ask is because at stock, I find the PNY to have the same or slightly worse coil whine/buzz than Gigabyte Gaming OCs out of multiple ones I have tried. And the last Gigabyte Gaming OC responded so much better to undervolting and underclocking in terms of reducing coil whine/buzz reduction than this current or even my last PNY. Wonder if Gaming OC would be better to try Super Gluing inductors with right kind this time given my stock experiences with each and if you ever tried it?

Though the PNY has all pinhole style inductors around the GPU die and those are supposed to be quieter than the other kind?? Or is that irrelevant now a days? And are those on the PNY, Zotac, Galax and such actually pinhole style inductors as Buildzoid describes, or do they just look closer to pinhole style than the inductors on Asus and MSI and Founders and even Gigabyte, nut are something different?

 

[lexluthermiester]

Though if card runs for a few hours, is it better to take it apart immediately then let it sit and cool for an hour before putting the SuperGlue on the chokess?

No. GPU's do not retain heat in such a way that requires cool down. By the time you have it disassembled it will be properly cooled.

And have you ever did a Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 and if so what were the results compared to PNY?

Again, my sample size is not big enough to render a concerted conclusion. However, historically, Gigabyte cards have been much noisier than PNY.

 

[Wolverine2349]

No. GPU's do not retain heat in such a way that requires cool down. By the time you have it disassembled it will be properly cooled.


Again, my sample size is not big enough to render a concerted conclusion. However, historically, Gigabyte cards have been much noisier than PNY.

Yes that is true I know your sample size is small? However historically Gigabyte cards being much noisier than PNY cards. That's through many generations of video cards, not just 4090s?

Have you had any experience with even one Gigabyte 4090?

 

[lexluthermiester]

However historically Gigabyte cards being much noisier than PNY cards. Thats through many generations, not 4090s right or just 4090s?

Many generations, including the RTX 2000 and RTX 3000 series cards, many of which have had this problem.

You seem to be on the fence about Gigabyte VS PNY. My personal opinion? Go with PNY.

 

[mouacyk]

Have this one. Any thing you can pick out that it wouldn't work?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B8GCY712?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

 

[lexluthermiester]

Have this one. Any thing you can pick out that it wouldn't work?

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B8GCY712?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details

I don't know anything about it. You'll have to test. If that glue has good wicking action, it'll work.

For those in doubt of what to buy the following is the golden standard;

https://www.amazon.com/Super-Glue-15187-12-Pack/dp/B000LGPD64

This stuff is the original and is the correct type. And a 12pack for $10 is a very good value.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Many generations, including the RTX 2000 and RTX 3000 series cards, many of which have had this problem.

You seem to be on the fence about Gigabyte VS PNY. My personal opinion? Go with PNY.

Well I was on the fence, though after recent experiences with multiple Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 responded much better to undervolting and underclocking in terms of taming whine where PNY cards did not improve whine at all after underclock and undervolt. PNY 4090 had just as bad of whine at stock maybe a hair touch worse from multiple PNY 4090 cards I tried. Though for doing a super glue application wonder which one will respond better? Does the fact that I found Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 slightly quieter form multiple samples mean it likely would respond better to a Super glue application to silence coil whine than multiple PNY 4090s? Or is there more to it than just the stock coil whine of the card in term of response to Super Glue?

 

[lexluthermiester]

Well I was on the fence, though after recent experiences with multiple Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 responded much better to undervolting and underclocking in terms of taming whine where PNY cards did not improve whine at all after underclock and undervolt. PNY 4090 had just as bad of whine at stock maybe a hair touch worse from multiple PNY 4090 cards I tried. Though for doing a super glue application wonder which one will respond better? Does the fact that I found Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 slightly quieter form multiple samples mean it likely would respond better to a Super glue application to silence coil whine than multiple PNY 4090s? Or is there more to it than just the stock coil whine of the card in term of response to Super Glue?

I think perhaps you're making it more complicated than it needs to be. Pick a card you like. If it has coil whine, superglue seal the choke coils. If it still has whine after that, you'll just have to live with it. You will never find an ultra performance part like a 4090 that runs dead silent. Some level of noise will always be a part of the experience.

 

[Wolverine2349]

I think perhaps you're making it more complicated than it needs to be. Pick a card you like. If it has coil whine, superglue seal the choke coils. If it still has whine after that, you'll just have to live with it. You will never find an ultra performance part like a 4090 that runs dead silent. Some level of noise will always be a part of the experience.

I am going to go with Gigabyte Gaming OC 4090 then as it was a little quieter at stock:

Which chokes are the ones that need to be super glued:

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/gigabyte-geforce-rtx-4090-gaming-oc/images/front_full.jpg

And I know there is no such thing as dead silence, Even my PC has case fans that make noise, but they are quiet. And the card will have fans too. Though for coil whine, I hope to get something as quiet as the Gigabyte Gaming OC 3090 Ti I had which had coil whine so low and faint it could not be hear din enclosed case and even open case it was faint.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Which chokes are the ones that need to be super glued:

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/gigabyte-geforce-rtx-4090-gaming-oc/images/front_full.jpg

As before, the ones highlighted in red are the most likely culprits but the ones in yellow are possible too.

I would do them all, just to be safe.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Many generations, including the RTX 2000 and RTX 3000 series cards, many of which have had this problem.

You seem to be on the fence about Gigabyte VS PNY. My personal opinion? Go with PNY.

Another question. You stated in this thread you did a PNY 4090 and had great results. Though in PM you stated yu did an MSI, Galax, and Zotacm and Palit 4090s. DId you mean multiple of those, but did one PNY? I know sample size is small but still. And if so which 4090 PNY did you do, The OC or non-OC version and was it XLR8 or EPIC-X RGB or non-RGB?

 

[lexluthermiester]

Another question. You stated in this thread you did a PNY 4090 and had great results. Though in PM you stated yu did an MSI, Galax, and Zotacm and Palit 4090s. DId you mean multiple of those, but did one PNY? I know sample size is small but still. And if so which 4090 PNY did you do, The OC or non-OC version and was it XLR8 or EPIC-X RGB or non-RGB?

If you go look, you were asking me which ones still made noise after being done. The PNY was dead silent, so it was not included in that list. Also, the PNY XLR8 was discussed pages ago and in our PM.

We're going in circles here and it's starting to seem like you're just wasting my time. Seriously, pick the card you want based on the features you want and buy it. If it makes noise, try to seal it. If that works for you, great! If not, live with the noise. If you can't live with the possibility of noise(because ALL video cards make some level of noise), stop gaming.
(Yes, I'm getting a bit irritated.)

Folks,
I created this thread to offer a simple solution to a seriously annoying problem. However, there are no guarantees due to thousands of possible variations in the manufacturing of video cards. Getting one that is perfectly silent is a crap-shoot at best. There are also the variations in superglue formulation and an individual's ability to apply said glue. I've been doing this for over 30years and as result am very good at it, but even I don't get perfect results every time.

I did not create this thread to hand-hold people trying to select a video card. If you need help performing this procedure, I'm your man. If you want advice on what card to choose to avoid choke-coil whine to begin with, I'm not your man. Take your chances like everyone else and try this solution if you get a card that has coil whine.

 

[mouacyk]

If you go look, you were asking me which ones still made noise after being done. The PNY was dead silent, so it was not included in that list. Also, the PNY XLR8 was discussed pages ago and in our PM.

We're going in circles here and it's starting to seem like you're just wasting my time. Seriously, pick the card you want based on the features you want and buy it. If it makes noise, try to seal it. If that works for you, great! If not, live with the noise. If you can't live with the possibility of noise(because ALL video cards make some level of noise), stop gaming.
(Yes, I'm getting a bit irritated.)

Folks,
I created this thread to offer a simple solution to a seriously annoying problem. However, there are no guarantees due to thousands of possible variations in the manufacturing of video cards. Getting one that is perfectly silent is a crap-shoot at best. There are also the variations in superglue formulation and an individual's ability to apply said glue. I've been doing this for over 30years and as result am very good at it, but even I don't get perfect results every time.

I did not create this thread to hand-hold people trying to select a video card. If you need help performing this procedure, I'm your man. If you want advice on what card to choose to avoid choke-coil whine to begin with, I'm not your man. Take your chances like everyone else and try this solution if you get a card that has coil whine.

You're always my man, regardless.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Reading all of this again you mention it is important to wick entire edge of the choke? What does that mean? Meaning glue on the full side all the way to the top? Though it is important that it gets into the cracks at the bottom? where it connects to PCB. SO basically like the picture in your first post Lex, the tip or nozel where the liquid super glue comes out of should be the same height as all sides of the choke from the bottom to the top walls?

 

[stama]

What he means is that you want glue all around the point where the coils touch the PCB. The "edge" he refers to are the bottom edges of the coil, the ones that are in contact (or just above) the PCB.

In case of the Gaming OC, the coils you see there have a height of about 3.5 mm, and the nozzle of your superglue applicator is around 2 mm, which means the nozzle is almost the same height as the coil - it will look just like in the photo of the first post of this thread when you are going to try to do this. In case of a PNY however, the VRM coils are much taller, a photo of such a case would have illustrated better that the glue is to be applied near the PCB.

Sometimes coils are too close to one another, so you can't just fit the superglue pointy applicator between them. So how do you apply glue to the edges on the sides between the coils? That's where the 'wicking' comes in, you apply glue to a point you can reach and the glue simply goes by itself around the edge of the coil. Check the video on this page, you'll see an example of what happens at ~ the 30 seconds mark: https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/de/en/products/encapsulants/underfills.html

See how the solution is applied only to one edge, but it goes by itself under the entire part (and doesn't spill outside of the part area either) - that's the 'wicking' effect in action:

Looking at the Gaming OC PCB photo, I would say the Gaming OC coils are spaced apart far enough to not have to rely on the wicking effect of the glue to apply glue on the sides of the coils, but in case of the PNY coils I am quite sure there's not enough space. Lex could comment on that.

That being said, I also had 4x 4090 cards so far, and in my small sample size the PNY XLR8 OC has somewhat louder coil whine than the Gaming OC, although the fans are much, much quieter on the XLR8.

 

[Wolverine2349]

I made a post with details on how to do it, but it somehow ended under moderator approval...
Is multiple edits of a post for adding details triggering this on this forum?
View attachment 286058

So basically just put the super glue near the bottom where the PCB touches the choke and all around it and it should be good? So not important to get the glue 3.5mm tall? Or is it? Or should you put a separate coating on to get it to top or no is it bad if more coating and could it make coil whine worse or screw up the job already done? on bottom of chokes where it meets PCB?

What he means is that you want glue all around the point where the coils touch the PCB. The "edge" he refers to are the bottom edges of the coil, the ones that are in contact (or just above) the PCB.

In case of the Gaming OC, the coils you see there have a height of about 3.5 mm, and the nozzle of your superglue applicator is around 2 mm, which means the nozzle is almost the same height as the coil - it will look just like in the photo of the first post of this thread when you are going to try to do this. In case of a PNY however, the VRM coils are much taller, a photo of such a case would have illustrated better that the glue is to be applied near the PCB.

Sometimes coils are too close to one another, so you can't just fit the superglue pointy applicator between them. So how do you apply glue to the edges on the sides between the coils? That's where the 'wicking' comes in, you apply glue to a point you can reach and the glue simply goes by itself around the edge of the coil. Check the video on this page, you'll see an example of what happens at ~ the 30 seconds mark: https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/de/en/products/encapsulants/underfills.html

See how the solution is applied only to one edge, but it goes by itself under the entire part (and doesn't spill outside of the part area either) - that's the 'wicking' effect in action:
View attachment 286055

Looking at the Gaming OC PCB photo, I would say the Gaming OC coils are spaced apart far enough to not have to rely on the wicking effect of the glue to apply glue on the sides of the coils, but in case of the PNY coils I am quite sure there's not enough space. Lex could comment on that.

That being said, I also had 4x 4090 cards so far, and in my small sample size the PNY XLR8 OC has somewhat louder coil whine than the Gaming OC, although the fans are much, much quieter on the XLR8.

Well I just got another PNY used for only $1460 after selling the other for $1350. The Gaming OC seems to have a PCB that could break if you remove it from shroud as it is on so tight with sticky thermal pads for Hardware Unboxed so that scared me off a little. Though if this fails on PNY, I will probably just sell it and get Gaming OC and undervolt and just deal with a little more whine than I like as PNY has slightly/somewhat louder whine or almost the same at stock, though it especially does not respond to undervolting and underclocking nearly as well as Gaming OC for reducing any whine.

So I have not yet started to glue on PNY yet but have it taken apart and ready. And am determined to make sure I get it right.

And out of 4 4090s, was it only 1 PNY and 1 Gaming OC where you found PNY to be slightly or somewhat louder coil whine?

And have you had any experience doing Super glue or hot glue on anything to reduce coil whine?

I have also seen videos of those fixing coil whine with hot glue guns for PSUs and using a paper tube to test coils for noise. Not sure how I could do that with GPU with backplaye off as putting GPU in system just PCB with no cooling to test it would fry right away. Or a temp heatsink somehow on the GPU die?

 

[stama]

My post has been approved in the meantime.

Put glue at the bottom, where the PCB touches the choke. If it's a low viscosity fluid, it will spread around the bottom edges of the coil. If you keep on feeding it fluid, it will eventually spill over, so don't overdo it.

I'll let Lex comment on whether you need to apply several layers or just one.

What you need to remember is that you need to wait for a while after you do this to let the bond achieve full strength. The glue will become solid in 5-15 seconds, but full strength is not achieved so quickly. I don't know if you are going to be willing to wait a day or three for it, but do wait a bit.

Another point is that in order for cyano-acrylate glues to harden, they need humidity in the air. If the air is dry, it will take longer to get hard and achieve full strength. If it's cold at your place, then the air is likely dry... air needs to be warm for water vapors to stay in it.

I had one of each: a MSI Trio X, a inno3D iChill X3, a PNY XLR8 OC, and a Gigabyte Gaming OC.
The coil whine was not bad on the PNY, it was just not as good as on the Gaming OC. They're both in another class than Asus or MSI cards.

I know you've already seen the stats on the German forum, so you probably know there are people reporting variance between the same model though, so there can be better or worse Gaming OCs and better or worse PNY XLR8s.

 

[Wolverine2349]

Bah, did too many edits again and once again my post is "awaiting moderator approval".

Here is its content:


Put glue at the bottom, where the PCB touches the choke. If it's a low viscosity fluid, it will spread around the bottom edges of the coil. If you keep on feeding it fluid, it will eventually spill over, so don't overdo it.

I'll let Lex comment on whether you need to apply several layers or just one.

What you need to remember is that you need to wait for a while after you do this to let the bond achieve full strength. The glue will become solid in 5-15 seconds, but full strength is not achieved so quickly. I don't know if you are going to be willing to wait a day or three for it, but do wait a bit.

Another point is that in order for cyano-acrylate glues to harden, they need humidity in the air. If the air is dry, it will take longer to get hard and achieve full strength. If it's cold at your place, then the air is likely dry... air needs to be warm for water vapors to stay in it.

I had one of each: a MSI Trio X, a inno3D iChill X3, a PNY XLR8 OC, and a Gigabyte Gaming OC.
The coil whine was not bad on the PNY, it was just not as good as on the Gaming OC. They're both in another class than Asus or MSI cards.

I know you've already seen the stats on the German forum, so you probably know there are people reporting variance between the same model though, so there can be better or worse Gaming OCs and better or worse PNY XLR8s.

Yes true. I know you need to wait. I am wiling to let it sit and dry for as long as need be. Though I want to get the process started ASAP, but also want to make sure I do it right,

Is 72 hours how much time I should wait.

Well I have my house set to 67F with humidity level at 35%. Is that good for drying it in? And if not, is it just that it takes longer, or do I need to turn up heat and/or humidity level?

 

[stama]

I think people here on this thread said they waited something like a few hours. In the technical documents of the Loctite glues, they mention full bond strength after curing for 24 to 72 hours.

Pick something that works for you, I would personally not wait days for it, I'd maybe leave it from today till tomorrow and that's it. I'm quite sure most people here would find that to be an abnormally long wait though.

Just to make sure you know: I have never done this procedure either.

I have also seen videos of those fixing coil whine with hot glue guns for PSUs and using a paper tube to test coils for noise. Not sure how I could do that with GPU with backplaye off as putting GPU in system just PCB with no cooling to test it would fry right away. Or a temp heatsink somehow on the GPU die?

Noticed this bit in your message only now.

I don't think there is a way to identify which coil whines with that method on a graphic card nowadays, to be honest. They draw too much power, will throttle themselves immediately if they don't get fried first with any kind of improvised cooling solutions.

The hot glue might work, Loqxp on the German forum claimed it worked for him... but he did not detail what he did. Other people reported they did not have success with hot glue in some of the posts on this thread though.

In case of hot glue, the issue is the temperature of the hot glue... On one side you want it to melt at a high temperature so it doesn't start melting while the graphic card is in use, on the other side if its melting point is too high, then when you apply it it will maybe damage the PCB and the electronic components. High melting point glues are at ~ 170C, which is way too hot for the PCB and most of the components. Low melting point glues are at ~ 70C, which is too low to be safe if you look at the thermal image photos of graphic cards under load (like in the Guru3D reviews) around where the VRM coils are located.

 

[Wolverine2349]

I do notice that on PNY 4090, the hardest inductors to glue between are the LR22 near power connector as they are so close to each other. Are there ay universal tip/nozel glue that would fit. WOuld need probably like a mm size.

https://www.amazon.com/PAGOW-Micro-Tips-Applicator-Dispensing-Dispensers/dp/B088LM9GMZ

Though would that work applying to a super glue bottle, or would the fact it is not original tip cause glue to dry too fast in the nozzle before it exits and I would be better getting a specific set of super glue that includes such a small enough tip in addition to others?

Yes Loqxp on German forum stated he silenced PNY 4090 with Hot glue using a Professional glue gun form work, but will not even state what he used or how they did it. Not sure if they do not remember, or just refuse to share it. A shame they will not share it just because it voids warranty. DO not care as we visiting these threads despite audible coil whine/buzz noise and want it fixed and need as much info as possible.

 

[stama]

I don't know if they would fit to any kind of glue tube. They show in the image using them with the Loctite pro glues, which - I forgot to say - don't come with any tips, you do have to buy them separately. Like these ones: https://www.silmid.com/accessories/...on-dispensing-needle-tip-97227-pink-20-gauge/

 

[Wolverine2349]

If I decided to put the bare 4090 PCB in the PC and turn it on, it would be ok unless I fired up a agme or benchmark as they use very little power when idle.

Even at idle there is an itty bit of coil whine though not audible unless you go close to it and even then very tame though turning head right away at case mesh it kind of can be heard at idle, but if I listen close enough it kind of is there. Wonder if those same chokes I could identify at idle that make a very itty but of noise and discover which ones they are?

 

[stama]

I really don't recommend that you try that.

Well I have my house set to 67F with humidity level at 35%. Is that good for drying it in? And if not, is it just that it takes longer, or do I need to turn up heat and/or humidity level?

From the Loctite 401 technical sheet (the TDS document you can download from the product page):

Cure Speed vs. Humidity
The rate of cure will depend on the ambient relative humidity. The best results are achieved when the relative humidity in the working environment is 40% to 60% at 22°C. Lower humidity leads to slower cure. Higher humidity accelerates it, but may impair the final strength of the bond.

Download the TDS from one of the Loctite glues product page and you'll get answers to many questions. Also check the FAQs on those product pages.