I hope the new PS5 cooler still works well... awaiting more testing

[mtcn77]

So, again, unless you can actually back up your statements with something substantive, please stop digging this hole for yourself.

Again, the burden of proof that you called me out on, being;

I'm not judging, I'm asking you to back up your statements as they run contrary to my own experiences.

"Out of line" is on you.

What you are claiming is utter nonsense. You can't have experience by claiming to never have owned a product, as you say here;

I have literally never bought or owned an Nvidia GPU. Don't be ridiculous.

Yet, you claim what GN reports is true. It does not follow any logical sequence for you to make these assumptions when you have no experience and the party you are talking to(me) was a journalist who can make these calls and you need to heed what comes out from your troll mouth.

I don't have to conform to your ignorant standards as, even if, you 'had' the previously mentioned gpus - it would be the blind leading the deaf... You must have mistaken yourself for someone who makes the news - you cannot shift the goalpost by asking further evidence...

 

[lexluthermiester]

27 minutes and more and yet no PS5 test. Running interference?

I think he was setting expectations and helping people understand the reality of science based testing. IR camera's are great for visualizing heat and heat patterns, which can be useful within the context of understand a heatpump system. However, IR cameras do little for providing specific data & details needed for reaching conclusions that have merit..

 

[Valantar]

Again, the burden of proof that you called me out on, being;

"Out of line" is on you.

Sorry, what? You're the one making new claims here - that GN is biased, untrustworthy, or a shill for some nebulous and mysterious "master" - so the burden of proof is on you. You did try to show some proof for this, but this "proof" was provided without sourcing and when the source was scrutinized turned out to be a highly selective quote with significant relevant context removed, rendering it invalid.

What you are claiming is utter nonsense. You can't have experience by claiming to never have owned a product, as you say here;

I never claimed to have experience with Nvidia GPUs, I claimed to have experience with the quality of GN's coverage.

Yet, you claim what GN reports is true. It does not follow any logical sequence for you to make these assumptions when you have no experience and the party you are talking to(me) was a journalist who can make these calls and you need to heed what comes out from your troll mouth.

I neither know nor care if you are a journalist. You are on these forums as a user, same as me, and unless you're able to provide some sort of backing for your statements, I (or anyone else) have no reason to take them as anything more authoritative than random statements by some random forum user.

And I never commented on the truth (or lack thereof) in this specific case of GN's reporting (clock/frametime spikes with GPU boost), I simply looked at the source and found that they did indeed discuss what you claimed that they omitted. I explicitly said that I have no grounds on which to make a judgement towards the truth of this, but I trust the quality of GN's reporting from previous experience, and don't see that you are providing anything significant to change that.

I don't have to conform to your ignorant standards as, even if, you 'had' the previously mentioned gpus - it would be the blind leading the deaf... You must have mistaken yourself for someone who makes the news - you cannot shift the goalpost by asking further evidence...

Shifting goalposts? Further evidence? (That would require you to have provided any evidence at all, which you haven't.) I've asked you to back up your claims, seeing how you are making new claims that break from general norms and perceptions. You have failed to do so, providing one highly selective quote that collapsed under scrutiny, and then shifted to making some claim to authority by saying you are a journalist (where? covering what? and how is this relevant?), implicitly saying that I (and others here) should take your word as truth simply because you say so. On top of that, isntead of providing sources or evidence, you resort to insults, personal attacks and foul language. Yet you call me "out of line"? Don't make me laugh.

27 minutes and more and yet no PS5 test. Running interference?

Uh... did you watch the beginning of the video? They go into quite some detail as to what this video is. It is a methodology piece on how IR photography is a poor and potentially misleading way of reporting component thermals. They literally didn't have the new PS5 at the time of filming (again, stated in the video), so what could they have tested? They are educating viewers + preparing the ground for their future PS5 thermals video, attempting to make their viewers understand better how the IR thermals relate to whatever thermal results they find by better methods of measurement.

I think he was setting expectations and helping people understand the reality of science based testing. IR camera's are great for visualizing heat and heat patterns, which can be useful within the context of understand a heatpump system. However, IR cameras do little for providing specific data & details needed for reaching conclusions that have merit..

Exactly. They're attempting to educate viewers and make them understand why IR photography is a poor way of measuring component thermals, and why this thus makes the original data here untrustworthy - while simultaneously underscoring that this in no way legitimizes the hate directed towards Austin Evans for this video.

 

[mtcn77]

Sorry, what?

You were making anectodal references of a subject you know nothing about. I think, this ends here.
You're not a newscast director, you cannot 'weight evidence' when you are referring to anectodal ones which, upon further uncovering, you have not provided credence for. Notice, all of this came out of you - not me - so you aren't the slightest in the mindframe of the discussion you are trying to stir up.

I said I don't discuss with trolls. I stand by it. When you know who to discuss, maybe you will get responses without devolving to ad hominem.

this "proof" was provided without sourcing

You keep repeating this like it is some sort of mystery when the quote is present and you are somehow unable to source this like your personal perspective has anything to do with it. If you cannot google it, find someone who can...

I think I have said, "don't move the goalposts": TL;DR; it means factual evidence don't need your explaining and your perception of them to be real.
It is on the net, you are just blind and on coolaid. I don't know when you dropped out of the trends, but you cannot hold me liable to inform you on what is present.

I explicitly said that I have no grounds on which to make a judgement towards the truth of this

That is the punchline you somehow need to repeat to yourself until it sits well with you, but not to me, of course... I'm done with your tail chasing.

 

[Morgoth]

i wonder why they needed to change that stamped sheet metal, making a hole new press die is quite a cotly endouver

 

[TheoneandonlyMrK]

i wonder why they needed to change that stamped sheet metal, making a hole new press die is quite a cotly endouver

That's quite straightforward.
They were trying to improve the product, likely to improve its profitability or viability as a product while using the learned experience of millions of user's for example changing the fan design to give a better audio and cooling profile.

As for the cost of making the heatsink, they'll make millions, it'll be fine.

I have seen a few attempts to assess the change, so far it's not the case that it's considerably worse so i appreciate the OP changing the title to a less confrontational one.

Still isn't absolutely answered beyond doubt though.

 

[Space Lynx]

I have to agree with many of GNs points.

BTW, this is happening;

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChIs72whgZI9w6d6FhwGGHA/community?lb=UgxCRgt-KylkJOmRv8F4AaABCQ

nom nom!

 

[Valantar]

You were making anectodal references of a subject you know nothing about. I think, this ends here.
You're not a newscast director, you cannot 'weight evidence' when you are referring to anectodal ones which, upon further uncovering, you have not provided credence for. Notice, all of this came out of you - not me - so you aren't the slightest in the mindframe of the discussion you are trying to stir up.

I said I don't discuss with trolls. I stand by it. When you know who to discuss, maybe you will get responses without devolving to ad hominem.


You keep repeating this like it is some sort of mystery when the quote is present and you are somehow unable to source this like your personal perspective has anything to do with it. If you cannot google it, find someone who can...

I think I have said, "don't move the goalposts": TL;DR; it means factual evidence don't need your explaining and your perception of them to be real.
It is on the net, you are just blind and on coolaid. I don't know when you dropped out of the trends, but you cannot hold me liable to inform you on what is present.


That is the punchline you somehow need to repeat to yourself until it sits well with you, but not to me, of course... I'm done with your tail chasing.

... sigh. Have I claimed to be a "newscast director" or anything similar? Have I claimed anything more than having a general impression of GN being trustworthy? No. You, on the other hand, have made new claims, claims of them not being trustworthy, and when asked to back them up came up with one context-less, source-less quote that upon even minor scrutiny turned out to not be demonstrative of what you said at all. Here's a tip: if you refuse to link to your sources, and people then find those sources and look them up and find they say something different than what you claim, it's pretty obvious that you're trying to hide your sources so that you can twist things and misrepresent facts.

You claimed that GN "omits those "huge" spikes being verbally mentioned in the article" - yet looking at the article (and the accompanying video), those spikes are explicitly discussed two sentences after the part you quoted. It's right there, staring you in the face. You're entirely welcome to disagree with how they discussed it or their conclusions, but claiming they didn't is an outright lie.

Oh, and just to reiterate: the reason I keep repeating that you posted your (misleadingly selective) quote without sourcing, is that doing so is actively hindering readers from scrutinizing your claims. When such scrutiny then makes it clear that what you said is just not true, that lack of sourcing changes from "lazy" or "a tad disrespectful of your readers" to "actively misleading" and "disingenuous". And in case you didn't notice, I did google it, found the exact article you quoted from, and showed how your quote was misleadingly selective and your claims about it were wrong. Which IIRC is when the personal attacks started flying. Hm. Almost as if you didn't want your claims checked?

And I haven't moved any goalposts - they have always stood firmly planted at "if you make new claims, provide new evidence backing them up, and allow others to scrutinize said evidence". You have consistently failed to meet this bar, and instead resorted to personal attacks when challenged. This isn't moving the goalposts, it's maintaining a minimum standard of accountability.

I'm frankly sad to see you go, as I would love to see any actual evidence for GN being biased. If that were true, I would need to adjust my impression of them, but that would require some form of evidence that stands up to even a modest amount of scrutiny. So far all I've seen from you is "they are shills and so are you" and "you can't question my word because I'm a journalist and you aren't". Neither of that is evidence, neither of that is even an argument, and if that's the level your journalism was at ... oh dear.

 

[Vayra86]

... sigh. Have I claimed to be a "newscast director" or anything similar? Have I claimed anything more than having a general impression of GN being trustworthy? No. You, on the other hand, have made new claims, claims of them not being trustworthy, and when asked to back them up came up with one context-less, source-less quote that upon even minor scrutiny turned out to not be demonstrative of what you said at all. Here's a tip: if you refuse to link to your sources, and people then find those sources and look them up and find they say something different than what you claim, it's pretty obvious that you're trying to hide your sources so that you can twist things and misrepresent facts.

You claimed that GN "omits those "huge" spikes being verbally mentioned in the article" - yet looking at the article (and the accompanying video), those spikes are explicitly discussed two sentences after the part you quoted. It's right there, staring you in the face. You're entirely welcome to disagree with how they discussed it or their conclusions, but claiming they didn't is an outright lie.

Oh, and just to reiterate: the reason I keep repeating that you posted your (misleadingly selective) quote without sourcing, is that doing so is actively hindering readers from scrutinizing your claims. When such scrutiny then makes it clear that what you said is just not true, that lack of sourcing changes from "lazy" or "a tad disrespectful of your readers" to "actively misleading" and "disingenuous". And in case you didn't notice, I did google it, found the exact article you quoted from, and showed how your quote was misleadingly selective and your claims about it were wrong. Which IIRC is when the personal attacks started flying. Hm. Almost as if you didn't want your claims checked?

And I haven't moved any goalposts - they have always stood firmly planted at "if you make new claims, provide new evidence backing them up, and allow others to scrutinize said evidence". You have consistently failed to meet this bar, and instead resorted to personal attacks when challenged. This isn't moving the goalposts, it's maintaining a minimum standard of accountability.

I'm frankly sad to see you go, as I would love to see any actual evidence for GN being biased. If that were true, I would need to adjust my impression of them, but that would require some form of evidence that stands up to even a modest amount of scrutiny. So far all I've seen from you is "they are shills and so are you" and "you can't question my word because I'm a journalist and you aren't". Neither of that is evidence, neither of that is even an argument, and if that's the level your journalism was at ... oh dear.

Don't feed the looney

 

[mtcn77]

Almost as if you didn't want your claims checked?

No, you actually didn't check them and review you opinion even with the data presented on how the fraud is done. I gave '1' example. You don't need me to do the deed and look for the rest.

This is no place for a flood which I'm not doing. If you had better sense, you wouldn't need me to point at the issue in the first place and to quote what you don't want to accept of them, "They do it everywhere on every review". So, I don't need to list a specific one since it is so ubiquitous and even with the internet under your fingers, you choose to be defensive which is why no further reasoning necessarily spent on you.

Have I claimed anything more than having a general impression of GN being trustworthy? No.

That is when your defamation started. Quit arguing ad nauseum, imo. You aren't fooling anyone.
Notice I was very specific on who I claimed this for. It was only your perspective that you took it personal which is beyond me why you are in such vulnerable defense.

 

[maxfly]

When i was a child of 10 or 11 there was an elderly dishevelled gentleman that yelled at the cars driving by. Day after day he stood in the same spot. Screaming incoherently at traffic.

Sometimes, its just best to keep your distance and walk away.

 

[mtcn77]

@Valantar
PS: it is more as if you are 'upset' that I did what you told me when you wanted the evidence, but you weren't ready to accept it? Don't judge people with your perspective because facts are not opinions and internet anonymity does not give you the right to weigh in on a subject about experience.

Again, if you scroll my posts I specifically said "Sony wouldn't do such a thing" and some trolls on the GN bandwagon tried to push their biased view onto the mainstream which turned out to be incorrect afterall.

I'm not at all surprised how they are trying to backtrack while saving face... What a bunch of trolls carrying the banner of cancel culture. They "would" be ashamed of themselves by now if they had any decency.

 

[Tardian]

I recommend that senior TPU personnel review the toxicity of the above and below thread posts.

Whilst a case can be made that it is a fine example of "freedom of speech" it could also be an example of "How not to do it in the future".

I still recommend the thread be deleted. Is this really the TPU brand? When I say 'deleted' it could be 'reshelved' in part of TPU that is rarely accessed, as in:

“But the plans were on display…”
“On display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them.”
“That’s the display department.”
“With a flashlight.”
“Ah, well, the lights had probably gone.”
“So had the stairs.”
“But look, you found the notice, didn’t you?”
“Yes,” said Arthur, “yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying ‘Beware of the Leopard.”

― Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy

 

[lexluthermiester]

Shifting goalposts? Further evidence?

Quit arguing with that user. He's just winding you up for reaction. They don't care about arriving at meritful conclusions or logical fact-finding. They argue for ego...

They're attempting to educate viewers and make them understand why IR photography is a poor way of measuring component thermals, and why this thus makes the original data here untrustworthy

That's the thing, it's not that IR data is untrustworthy, its that it is only useful in a certain set of circumstances and within particular context.

while simultaneously underscoring that this in no way legitimizes the hate directed towards Austin Evans for this video.

Agreed. Austin was very clearly wrong in several ways, but those mistakes were not out of malice. They are sincere and genuine concerns for the cooling principles employed by the engineering of the heatpump action of the new design. The mistakes were in the measurements and collection of data and the conclusions. He was deliberately being an alarmist, but his failure was not doing due-diligence testing. While the hate he's getting is undeserved, no one can argue with any level of credibility that he didn't make a few mistakes.

Notice I was very specific on who I claimed this for. It was only your perspective that you took it personal which is beyond me why you are in such vulnerable defense.

Except that Valatar didn't make it personal, you did. You need to take an exit here...

 

[mtcn77]

Except that Valatar didn't make it personal, you did.

I won't argue further.
Facts are,

• Trolls spearheaded by 'GN' tried to paint a skewed picture on a product not on GN's shortlist of treatment with kid gloves.
• I was correct in calling that is BS. Even now you cannot say GN was right.
• Yet, bias blinds you from the truth that they are on the koolaid and I'm just getting blame for your fall. Sorry that it does not make sense.
• GN reported a false news article which "they" and "their trolls" should have accepted total responsibility for, and already made exits from previous their previous stance,
• And yet, their trolls cannot accept their masters could be in any wrongdoing which forms the basis of their bias as "PS5 is not hotter" and trolls need to vent steam on some other venue.

I hope this 'internet hate' gets the flag it needs and GN zealots fall for the the frame they tried to cast for the normal mainstream people that didn't give in to their petulence.
PS: I think trolls really think they can win in their masters' lost cause. Pretty pathetic!

You need to take an exit here...

Trolls do need to take the exit, those that argued against facts during all this time. Can't spin the facts on a matter of redacted article!

It is disgusting how awful people get with their preferential treatment and calling them out brings the worst in them.

Anybody who tries to argue with me is pretty nonsensical, as I don't write without a factual basis and I can always present more facts that you cannot silence.

 

[Blue4130]

I can always present more facts that you cannot silence.

That is all everyone is asking for. But you continue to not present what you say that you can...

 

[mtcn77]

That is all everyone is asking for. But you continue to not present what you say that you can...

I don't want to flood. I thought it would be simpler if I presented people with evidence, but it strayed from the thread since people don't even accept the conclusion for this thread, let alone the hate squad who comes up with such hate speech.
Therefore I layed it even simpler: you can read the OP and how it was debunked to see the truth.

I just said it in simple terms - GN is not the mainstream. Don't treat them preferentially.

I want to sympathise with you good people with high opinion with them. It is just we are at a crossroads - you treat GN crap as bible and not even PS5 not turning up as hot as they previously claimed can deter you from your mental slumber. You see through their eyes - which I don't. I don't think it needs more moderation. I like it when they get called out for once for all the dealings they try to sway the public opinion on.

 

[lexluthermiester]

That is all everyone is asking for. But you continue to not present what you say that you can...

Not to mention that they continue with more personal jabs and insults. As I stated earlier, arguing ego not merit.

It is disgusting how awful people get with their preferential treatment and calling them out brings the worst in them.

Irony.

 

[mtcn77]

PS5 is not hotter and GN reported bull crap. I will say it and no amount of zealotry can hide the fact that they just push cancel culture and hate speech on anything not on their NDA list. They push libel, okay?

Not to mention that they continue with more personal jabs and insults.

Which is what we should be on the same page with each other, me thinks.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Which is what we should be on the same page with each other, me thinks.

Except I only dish out the jabs when people throw insults my way, as a general rule. That didn't happen here. You started with the insults and then laid more on thick when other users pointed out the flaws in your arguments and logic.

The fact is, GN pointed out the very serious flaws in the methodology of not just Austin Evans but Intel and everyone else who use IR camera's improperly and wildly out of context. You seem to be defending those flawed methodologies and making it personal with all the insults. You're not arguing merits because your conclusions have no merit. You're arguing ego and personal pride, little more.

 

[mtcn77]

The fact is, GN pointed out the very serious flaws in the methodology of not just Austin Evans but Intel and everyone else who use IR camera's improperly and wildly out of context. You seem to be defending those flawed methodologies and making it personal with all the insults.

See, you really devolved what started as a factual statement into the same personal scapegoating arguments.
What you are seeing as insults are facts that are challenging to your perception. GN is trying to backtrack from initial statement in grace. They initially hopped on the bandwagon and no amount of excuses can shift their responsibility.

Do I need to cite which unfounded defamatory claim they streamed this time? - I think I don't. They just search for a fall guy. That is not me, since I have nothing to do with their doing.

It is really amusing how this sums up their and all their trolls' viewpoint: when contradicted by evidence, everyone else is to blame, except for them... how stereotypical of a biased media source.

When IR should in fact be the most standardised benchmark, they argue the opposite like they have somehow put blackbody radiation on recess... I don't think people are dumber for not wearing their own blinders.