NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4080 Founders Edition

[AusWolf]

That is simply playing ignorant. Yes, the card is fast, second fastest in the world, woo hoo! But that happened with every GPU release so far from the early 1990' on. How do you comment on the fact that if we had such price increases every generation, a mid to high end card from Nvidia would now cost approximately half a million dollars? How unbelievably amazing would that be, right?

Again, conclusion paints the release if it's something miraculous - when in fact it offers the same kind of uplift as most of the releases in past 10 years, apart from Turing. But saying it like that kind of paints the $500 price hike in a bad light, doesn't it?

We're being told that "more performance comes at a higher price". The question is whether we believe it or not. I personally don't, because it's coming from the company that gave us the 1080 that was 50% faster than the 980 for a 10% higher MSRP. Now we have a 36% faster product (compared to the 3080 at 1440p) for a 71% higher MSRP. How is this not a tragedy for PC gaming?

Edit: If we look at the red side, there's also the 7900 XTX launching soon at the same MSRP as the 6900 XT did, so there's that.

 

[Bwaze]

It might as well be that Nvidia wants to abolish the "new generation, better price/performance" paradigm we became used to since the early days of PC.

The way Ada cards are priced they look like new Ampere products. An imaginary sales pitch at Nvidia surely sounded like this:

"We have a card that is just a bit faster than RTX 3090 Ti, and on a smaller node, and with less memory, let"s call it RTX 4080 instead of let's say 3090 SUPER - because that's the more popular tier. And raise the price a bit above the recently lowered MSRP of 3090 Ti. And call in the reviewers and make sure they point out this was a $2000 card a while ago! They're getting a bargain!

And then we have another new tier above that, we can price that to the moon! Why should we be limited to the prices of previous flagship models?

How silly we haven't thought of this before, 20 years ago, and only raised prices roughly in accordance with inflation?"

 

[W1zzard]

@W1zzard, how do you comment the fact that days after the RTX 4080 launched almost every model is still in stock and available?

Geizhals.eu RTX 4080 availability

WCCFTech has an article about that:

Nobody Wants NVIDIA’s $1199 US GeForce RTX 4080: Despite Lower Shipments, Retailers & Stores Are Stocked With Cards

It seems like nobody really gives a damn if the card is recommended from TechPowerUp...



That is simply playing ignorant. Yes, the card is fast, second fastest in the world, woo hoo! But that happened with every GPU release so far from the early 1990' on. How do you comment on the fact that if we had such price increases every generation, a mid to high end card from Nvidia would now cost approximately half a million dollars? How unbelievably amazing would that be, right?

Again, conclusion paints the release if it's something miraculous - when in fact it offers the same kind of uplift as most of the releases in past 10 years, apart from Turing. But saying it like that kind of paints the $500 price hike in a bad light, doesn't it?



Where do I send you the address for the coupon? I can't say what I'll do, I'm terrible with hypothetical situations. ;-)

Thanks for making me sad and wonder "why am I doing this?" .. on a Saturday .. after working 100+ hours for each week for almost 20 years .. and more and more often the answer is "for the money", which is insanely good these days btw, and not "because I love what I do"

 

[64K]

Thanks for making me sad and wonder "why am I doing this?" .. on a Saturday .. after working 100+ hours for each week for almost 20 years .. and more and more often the answer is "for the money", which is insanely good these days btw, and not "because I love what I do"

Don't let the jokers bother you.

This is not butt-kissing. You really are the best in the tech world and run the best site. It would be a serious loss without your knowledge and experience.

 

[Wasteland]

Thanks for making me sad and wonder "why am I doing this?" .. on a Saturday .. after working 100+ hours for each week for almost 20 years .. and more and more often the answer is "for the money", which is insanely good these days btw, and not "because I love what I do"

It's the best PC hardware site on the internet. I'm glad the money is good; you deserve it.

 

[AusWolf]

Thanks for making me sad and wonder "why am I doing this?" .. on a Saturday .. after working 100+ hours for each week for almost 20 years .. and more and more often the answer is "for the money", which is insanely good these days btw, and not "because I love what I do"

The fact that some of us don't agree with the award that you gave the 4080 and think that it's nothing more than an Nvidia cash-grab that nobody should ever buy for the price it's selling for, doesn't mean that TPU isn't one of the most valuable tech sites on the internet, hugely thanks to you.

This is not butt-kissing. You really are the best in the tech world and run the best site. It would be a serious loss without your knowledge and experience.

I completely agree.

I stand by my argument that the 4080 doesn't deserve any award because of its horrible price-to-performance drop compared to nearly everything that has ever existed on the GPU market.

Regardless of this, I also stand by TPU being my favorite tech site due to the insanely detailed reviews which show the dedication and hard work that writers of most other sites don't bother with.

Thank you, TPU and @W1zzard , please keep it up!

 

[Bwaze]

Thanks for making me sad and wonder "why am I doing this?" .. on a Saturday .. after working 100+ hours for each week for almost 20 years .. and more and more often the answer is "for the money", which is insanely good these days btw, and not "because I love what I do"

I apologize if this came personal, it's not. I hang out here because this site is now really one of the few that still does proper reviews, not just glorified press releases.

And I agree with almost every point of the conclusion of review. It is a good product, often the performance increase like this came with power consumption increase, excessive noise and other problems.

If there wasn't an unprecedented price increase, which in my opinion warrants a bit more than "With a price of $1200 for the RTX 4080 Founders Edition, the GeForce RTX 4080 is expensive.", and then justifying the price by comparing it to crypto inflated prices - which should have now be buried and forgotten with the worst crash of crypto in history. This is kind of material I'd expect from Nvidia PR, and then we'd have reviewer questioning that...

Some reviewers (especially the Youtube kind) were even more defensive of the price - completely ignoring the highest price increase in history, or explaining it away as "luxury performance products warrant such prices".

 

[Deleted member 177333]

Yep, I think both things can be true that due to the price of these cards, they honestly don't deserve any awards, and also people love W1zzard and TPU.

 

[TriCyclops]

it's too expensive IMO.

 

[wheresmycar]

Below you have a material in which I used the minimum video card (100W power, probably performance of GTX 1660 non Ti) and the processor set with Turbo OFF, PL1&2 65W (performance ~i5-10400). In captures you have a ~600$ configuration for cpu, gpu, MoBo and RAM, a configuration of components that definitely offers more performance than the chosen solution for video. New, not second hand.
Don't understand what you don't understand? How many times do I have to repeat that you don't need a mega-ultra-insane system to play?
Does something seem expensive to you? Choose a cheaper option. And you play!
Tragedy is when you need an organ for transplant, it costs $100,000 and you don't have the money. Then, the cheap option is the trick.
It's tragic when you can't pay bills, food, education. Then, the cheap option is the street.
What is so hard to understand?

OH MY GOODNESS!!! You're definitely TROLLING!!

Our entire point of discussion is based around the 4080's MSRP and your impolite mocking of people who are opposed to the new $$ highs.

• Not once have I or anyone else made the claim: we need, in your words, a "mega-ultra-insane system to play" games. Thats a rediculous assertion (or accusation).
  
  
• Not once have I or anyone else made the claim: affordable and performance savvy builds are not possible without the top dog GPUs. The market is full of opportunities.
  
  
• I have no idea why you are injecting life-tragedies, bills, food, education, etc ....and now $100k organs for transplants... a mish mash of imposed correlations in a discussion where nobody is suggesting we are duty-bound to buy into any of these unreasonably priced cards. I haven't seen anyone displaying signs of deprivation, despondency or being famished in pursuit of the 4080. So.....why the mindlessly trivial DRAMA and play-acted diversion?
  
  
• "just dont buy" - your punch-drunk assertion is worn out. You really think most people who are claiming the 4080 is too expensive are going to buy into it? No such thing as a general discussion? or fear of how top-dog prices will affect the GPU segment going forward or the closely impending inevitably pricier tier-down 40-series cards? Actually don't answer that - you might end up fabricating another unrelated argument in its place - who knows maybe something like "...but you dont understand, cigarettes cause cancer, lung disease, etc blah blah blah" lol Crafty Shafty!!

Simply put , you're just manufacturing arguments which have no mention in this thread in an attempt to thwart your earlier blemishes. Your double-dealing insincere methods to carry simple discussions forward is an extremely unattractive proposition... its no different to blatant lying/fabricating smoke-screens. You still have a problem with people suggesting the 4080 is too expensive. IMO, thats a pretty simple premise (with various concerns/pretexts already shared in this thread). It's nice to see you've stopped rediculing these opinions with the "stop whining" and "river of tears" mockery etc etc... i guess there has been some progress but sadly overshadowed with all the mythically fallacious theatre which is immensely expanding on a post-by-post basis.

....a TROLL spanking would be in order!!

it's too expensive IMO.

TBH, that was my feeling since 2017 when upgrading to a 1080 TI. "too expensive" for a 4080 seems too kind... its an absolute strip naked rip-off for the XX80 division.

 

[Gica]

You still have a problem with people suggesting the 4080 is too expensive.

Expensive, but it sells like hot cakes. How would you proceed if you sell something that is in high demand? Are you lowering the price? Do you swear on the Bible that you do that?
Your logic fracture and, probably, trolling pro AMD, sells from where you don't understand (or pretend you don't understand) that 4080/90 are the most powerful video cards on the planet. Compared to the 3090Ti ($1999), the 4080 is really cheap at $1200... if you can buy it at that price. It has new built-in features and is much more efficient at the FPS/Watt ratio. Don't tell me about the AMD variants, with ray tracing at RTX 3070 level for the flagship and with the same productivity performance. Ray Tracing can no longer be ignored in 2022.
The rest is, as I said, lamentation.

AMD reduced the prices of the Ryzen 7000 series. Not because you are screaming on the forums, but because Intel demolished them in terms of price/performance.
And with video cards you will see the same scheme if AMD comes up with something competitive, price/performance. For now, nVidia is playing alone, that's why they released 4090 before 4080, to maximize their profit.

 

[N3M3515]

but it sells like hot cakes

Not really...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Elv3e1BjWmw&t
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXC4z54UGUk

 

[Gica]

https://www.scan.co.uk/search?q=rtx+4080

rtx 4080 | Newegg.com

Search Newegg.com for rtx 4080. Get fast shipping and top-rated customer service.

www.newegg.com

Can you find something under $1200?

 

[N3M3515]

https://www.scan.co.uk/search?q=rtx+4080

rtx 4080 | Newegg.com

Search Newegg.com for rtx 4080. Get fast shipping and top-rated customer service.

www.newegg.com

Can you find something under $1200?

Yeah, just not there.

 

[Gica]

NVIDIA has sold 160K GeForce RTX 40 graphics cards already, but stores are still full of RTX 4080s - VideoCardz.com

NVIDIA RTX 40 sales reports The RTX 4080 is not selling particularly well on the first week. First estimates on RTX 40 series sales have been shared by a few sources, but even despite impressive numbers, retailers are worried it may not as popular a choice as RTX 4090. According to Wccftech and...

videocardz.com

Yesterday, Nov 23:
RTX 4090 (launch: Oct 12): 3023 units sold per day
RTX 4080 (release: Nov 16): 3750 units sold per day
So, they sell. Probably not what some expected (reflex from the glory era of crypto-currencies?), but one should not swallow the idiocy that they are not sold if you find them in stores. The video card is not an egg, throw it away after a few days if you don't sell it quickly.

 

[wheresmycar]

....Expensive, but it sells like hot cakes....

.....Compared to the 3090Ti ($1999), the 4080 is really cheap at $1200.....

"expensive" or "really cheap".... which is it?

Compared to 3090 TI? hehe. Sure now we have a highly qualified position for "relative pricing". I hope you've got your vaccine and boosters in check... pls stay in your 20-foot-under quarantine bunker. Up here on the earths surface the covid/crypto era of mass exploitation is still at work - we'll let you when its safe

Selling like hot cakes? More like moulded low-supply manipulation. Sorry we ain't falling for that again.... Here in the UK, retail stock is sitting idle on the most part. So even low quantities ain't cutting it... some retailers didnt even get a share of the quota (although i suspect at initial stages, none was offered until the out-of-stock illusion for a quick price crank up/bolstered MSRP is achieved).

Ray Tracing can no longer be ignored in 2022.

oops i missed that memo. "RT can no longer be ignored" ....we are so screwed. I bet bob at the estates earning £50 a week is probably considering selling his house. How else will he afford this 2022 inevitability. Hold on aren't you the same Gica selling "just dont buy".... with that odd argument (rephrased to memory) "there being more important things to consider with the likes of hiked up interest rates, bills, loans/mortgages, food, etc" and going as far as (and nuts) introducing medical concerns with "$100k organs for transplants" ........you changed your tune quick. Funny though, i'm surfing a 2080 TI and haven't bothered with RT - oh yeah, performance tax + hardly much content available.

trolling pro AMD

a presumptuous average-joe low-blow.

…doesn’t deserve a response – but I don’t mind asserting my position if you ask me respectfully.

 

[N3M3515]

one should not swallow the idiocy that they are not sold if you find them in stores

You can read my post again if you like, i never said they were not selling. They are just not selling "like hot cakes" and i did show evidence.

 

[Bwaze]

Remember, being OK with 70% price increase will inevitably lead to this:


2022, RTX 4080 - $1200
2024, RTX 5080 - $2040
2026, RTX 6080 - $3468
2028, RTX 7080 - $5896
2030, RTX 8080 - $10022
2032, RTX 9080 - $17038
2034, GTX 1080 - $28965

Solution?

 

[wheresmycar]

Remember, being OK with 70% price increase will inevitably lead to this:


2022, RTX 4080 - $1200
2024, RTX 5080 - $2040
2026, RTX 6080 - $3468
2028, RTX 7080 - $5896
2030, RTX 8080 - $10022
2032, RTX 9080 - $17038
2034, GTX 1080 - $28965

Solution?

View attachment 271473

According to Gica, as long as there is the anomaly of demand it doesn't matter how much a graphics card costs. Apparently nothing else matters... a more recent Gica certified development being, if you oppose these spendthrift prices you must be an AMD-fanboy. In Gica's world, prioritising customer satisfaction alongside a healthy profitable business is absurd.

therefore....

Solution?

Gica: Keep increasing the price until we find the tipping point of no sale. Then underclock the price by small $0.20 cent increments until we find a decent quantifiable sale (maybe 10 sold) and yippee we've got our new standardised GPU price. If anyone complains, Gica has a solution for that too.... "Just dont buy". There, the problem is solved... priceless intelligence from our in-house Gica tech economic expert!!

 

[Gica]

Hmmm (capture1)
Shall we also look at the processors?
I do not excuse them, nor do I criticize them. This is the market. The video card for gaming is a gadget that you can completely do without. If you can afford something, buy it. If not, cry on the forums. You are really embarrassing with your "analyses".

Gica has a solution for that too.... "Just dont buy". There, the problem is solved... priceless intelligence from our in-house Gica tech economic expert!!

I give you a real example that has nothing to do with the it area, but the similarities are damn striking.
By 2018, I think, an anti-EU party, even anti-NATO, modified the off-shore law (for natural gas) in such a way that potential investors took their bags and left. The result: the gas lies in the ground instead of being exploited at current prices, pure gold. And we are not talking about a bottle, but many billions of $. Inevitably, the law was amended, but exploitation of the deposits will only begin in 2026, in the most optimistic scenario.
And now we return to video cards, kindergarten intelligence. Let's admit by absurdity that someone will look into your mouth and make the decision to sell very cheaply. You buy cheap, but the profit decreases, dissatisfied shareholders will migrate to more profitable areas. What is the long-term, average and even short-term result, smart guy? Simple: the profit decreases, the investment in research also decreases, in the future you will receive video cards with marginal performance increases... refresh, refresh, refresh. For many employees: dismissal. You would probably like to work in such a company, LOL.
We are discussing for the sake of discussion because in the real world EVERYONE wants maximum profit and will not hesitate to get it. The only obstacle to unlimited profit is demand, smartass.
Proverb: "It's not stupid who asks, it's stupid who gives" (right photo)

 

[Bwaze]

Profits are already decreasing sharply. Even without our "kindergarden inteligence". How's that satisfying shareholders?

Nvidia's profit cycle in gaming is now very tightly tied to cryptominer buying habits (and wider, since they're hiding the source of income and hiding crypto money under pro hraphics, server). With the largest crypto crash in history (not only in value, but in customer trust), and with largest GPU mineable coin going away from unsustainable "proof of work" there is no end in sight to this bear trend, at least not for home miners.

And what is Nvidia doing? Holding the percieved "high value" in products very little people really want that much, waiting for the market, customers to change.

 

[Gica]

The crypto era is over. This decline was to be expected, but they will not accept an even greater decline because you have idiots in the marketing department. Although AMD does not say, their decline also has deep roots in the crypto collapse.
Yes, kindergarten. nVidia offers manufacturers a graphics chip, specifications and a recommended price (MSRP). It's a long way to the graphics card in its final form (a whole industry operates there, from screws to mosfets, via transport). I guess, (LOL) the final price is imposed by the producers. Without them, nVidia sells nothing. So, the final price of the product you see does not come from nVidia but from the entire chain. If only one says NO, the product does not reach the store. This is where the buyer comes into play, the most important link in the chain. If it seems expensive, don't buy. Stay with the old video card, buy something else, cheaper, or migrate to something else (consoles, smartphone, etc.).
I don't know how to explain it more simply, so you can understand it too.

 

[Bwaze]

The crypto era was over several times before. Coins lost even more value percentage wise in 2018 crash, and I think behaviour of Nvidia in 2018, 2019 and early 2020 was completely guided by waiting for another crypto wave - which happened right when Nvidia promised Ampere cards with great performance uplift and lower prices than previous generation. Which the customers never saw, because mining was already on the rise, and Nvidia could be sure everything would be bought even for a much higher price.

So now we are in a "Turing part II." era. Nvidia can afford to just wait out this crypto bear market, and the coming 2, 3 years blame the ungrateful gamers for the revenue loss. And spend (in secret) a lot of resources and money on planning and promoting next mineable coins - which will be even more inviting for the cryptobelievers than ETH, since they are starting almost from zero! Imagine the profit!

And gamers? Who cares about poor people...

 

[cvearl]

Saldy nVidia chose to use the 4090 with a restricted inventory and very high launch price. This creates a price vaccume below keeping all cards below it artifically higher. Much higher than they should be. Normally 3000 series should be on clearance and dissapear in weeks and be replaced by the 4000 series. That is not how it's being played. Or how WE ARE BEING PLAYED should I say. By doing this sure... they sell less units. Take a few ugly coments on line from gamers but that is ok for nVidia. Look at it this way. They would rather sell 1 card at a $500 net profit than sell 4 at $100 net Profit. Too bad most of us do not understand these things and will still buy this crap. Really it is just a new gen of cards. It is not the second coming. You want to stop this nonsense? Vote with your wallet. AMD better not let the price creap up too. If they do I will skip another whole year and stick with my 6800XT which I paid $300 less than the 3080 at the same store and love it.

 

[wheresmycar]

Hmmm (capture1)
Shall we also look at the processors?
I do not excuse them, nor do I criticize them. This is the market. The video card for gaming is a gadget that you can completely do without. If you can afford something, buy it. If not, cry on the forums. You are really embarrassing with your "analyses".


I give you a real example that has nothing to do with the it area, but the similarities are damn striking.
By 2018, I think, an anti-EU party, even anti-NATO, modified the off-shore law (for natural gas) in such a way that potential investors took their bags and left. The result: the gas lies in the ground instead of being exploited at current prices, pure gold. And we are not talking about a bottle, but many billions of $. Inevitably, the law was amended, but exploitation of the deposits will only begin in 2026, in the most optimistic scenario.
And now we return to video cards, kindergarten intelligence. Let's admit by absurdity that someone will look into your mouth and make the decision to sell very cheaply. You buy cheap, but the profit decreases, dissatisfied shareholders will migrate to more profitable areas. What is the long-term, average and even short-term result, smart guy? Simple: the profit decreases, the investment in research also decreases, in the future you will receive video cards with marginal performance increases... refresh, refresh, refresh. For many employees: dismissal. You would probably like to work in such a company, LOL.
We are discussing for the sake of discussion because in the real world EVERYONE wants maximum profit and will not hesitate to get it. The only obstacle to unlimited profit is demand, smartass.
Proverb: "It's not stupid who asks, it's stupid who gives" (right photo)

...............and??

You've gone back to the GICA magic show of fashioning responses to non-existent disputes. What on earth are you on about with all this self-extrapolated malarky? Preaching the snowballing profit ambition which is indisputably and pointlessly obvious is solving what issue? Has anyone suggested otherwise? Or are we all (the consumer) supposed to shake the booty and do the flattering circle dance in applauding soaring prices?

I've only seen comments (in this thread) exemplifying disappointment with current GPU prices (which nV is no doubt milking with 40-series). Such voicing of concerns/thoughts are far from unusual from a mass-consumer point of view. Nothing alarmingly new here... nothing disturbingly flawed here.... no one is challenging your partisan corporate fruits nor the economic framework in which the profit beasts run their claws.... but you seem extremely adamant in propagandising consumer sentiments into submission – the absurdity of it!! Doesn’t matter what argument you present, you’re not going to change the simple logic - “4080 is overpriced”. The EU, NATO, the Warsaw Pact, even the Incredible Hulk (I’m sure he exists in your weird but magical world) can’t help you capsize this widely cited reality. Although I have to admit, it’s electrifyingly entertaining to see how you’re spinning simple consumer discontentment to all-out WAR in every and any effort (99% off-topic) - in heroic like defence to praise and willfully sanction the corporate milking vehicle (or as it seems, more specifically nV). We get it, the show must go on…

…although - a special request: I would appreciate if your next batch of diversion-filled triviality of a response hits our screens before 7pm (UK time) on Tuesday 29th November. That’s around the time my wife returns after work with the weeks groceries. I’m expecting popcorn and ice cream which would make a perfect treat for the next episode of the “Gica Comedy Hour: Just Don’t Buy and keep Crying” show. Hope she’s buying a couple of tissue boxes too