The State of Cryptocurrency

[erocker]

Ah, the power issue is catching up with Iceland...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-43030677

I was wondering when this would show up.

 

[yotano211]

Governments are regulating it right now, and that is a good thing for the price long term. Furthermore are you aware that the need for cheap energy mining firms are demanding is accelerating renewable resource adoption in multiple locations?

P.S. Saying something is "a bubble" is a non-statement. Everything new is a bubble. The internet is still here after the dot.com crash, and people who bought Amazon stock at $7 ended up being pretty smart didn't they?

I bought mastercard on the 1st day of its IPO, still have it to this day. I bought google on 2nd day of its IPO but only had $2000 back them. Also still have it to this day.

 

[Captain_Tom]

It depends on the bank. There are some banks that I wouldn't be comfortable leaving more than a couple of grand in and account with. Which is about the same amount I'd be comfortable leaving at home. At least in the home, you can hide the money or install a safe. Home insurance will also, usually, cover cash losses in case of a break in. When someone steals from your bank account, you can usually get it back, but it takes a long time and isn't always guaranteed.

A large number of people I know have had money stolen from their accounts, some of them from big name banks too. Sometimes due to card skimmers, sometimes dodgy retail outlets, but other times it's been bank employees stealing their details to make purchases.

With money, the saying 'don't keep all your eggs in one basket, is very pertinent. I have money spread in 3 bank accounts (2 local and one overseas), stocks, gold, crypto, cash, and property (my home). Not that I have a lot in any, but i've set it up in such a way that it is easy to put money into any. Keeping all of your money in one place is a really bad Idea. I would never recommend having more than 5% of your total assets in something as risky as crypto though. Stock market investors use a similar strategy of diversification with a small amount allocated to high risk/reward investments.

Finally a level-headed comment lol. Say what you will about crypto, but there are a lot of indicators that we could go through both a stock market and housing crash very soon. Diversify people...

I bought mastercard on the 1st day of its IPO, still have it to this day. I bought google on 2nd day of its IPO but only had $2000 back them. Also still have it to this day.

Yeah but we should all call you dumb right?

 

[yotano211]

Finally a level-headed comment lol. Say what you will about crypto, but there are a lot of indicators that we could go through both a stock market and housing crash very soon. Diversify people...



Yeah but we should all call you dumb right?

oh everyone called me dumb back then, esp. my dad, who thinks that the stock market is for rich people. My sister also thinks the same way, she prefers to keep her money into her house that she still pays on it. I havent told her that my house is paid for and I wont tell her. I dont treat houses as a investment but she does.

 

[silkstone]

Finally a level-headed comment lol. Say what you will about crypto, but there are a lot of indicators that we could go through both a stock market and housing crash very soon. Diversify people...

The USD also isn't doing very well against other currencies at the moment. A real bitch for me as I get paid in USD, but owe some money in a (small) GBP loan (something I'd never usually do, but it was a loan for a down-payment).

There are so many options for diversification today, that you can protect yourself much better in the case of a recession or extreme inflation.

oh everyone called me dumb back then, esp. my dad, who thinks that the stock market is for rich people. My sister also thinks the same way, she prefers to keep her money into her house that she still pays on it. I havent told her that my house is paid for and I wont tell her. I dont treat houses as a investment but she does.

Property is, historically, a pretty safe investment, and it actually makes sense to pay it off as quickly as possible if you have high interest rates on a mortgage. At the time of your investment, I'm guessing you were quite young with little other debt and so high risk-reward investments wouldn't have effected you as much had they not panned out.

I'm looking at a 13% APR on my mortgage so I plan to pay that bitch off within 5 years. I will continue to diversify and keep some funds in other equity, but the bulk needs to go into paying that. If I were younger, without kids, I'd be open to putting a greater amount into higher risk investments.

I have friends with multiple properties and the rent generated from them allows them to continue buying more property. It's actually something I'd look at doing, as I get older and have more money. As a general rule, the older you get, the higher proportion of funds you keep in property and bonds.

The money I have in crypto is basically 'play' money as I mine it. I took enough profits to pretty much cover the hardware costs and the only additional money I put in now is the cost of electricity. I'll hopefully recoup some of that in the future as I sell portions of what I mine.

 

[Captain_Tom]

oh everyone called me dumb back then, esp. my dad, who thinks that the stock market is for rich people. My sister also thinks the same way, she prefers to keep her money into her house that she still pays on it. I havent told her that my house is paid for and I wont tell her. I dont treat houses as a investment but she does.

Haha. Yeah well your dad was half right - the stock market is for rich people these days, but anyone can profit off of it.

Well we will see how things pan out, but whatever happens in any of these markets we are discussing - it will be interesting. As my anthropology teacher said: "Everyone asks to live in interesting times until they actually have to survive them. The good and the bad news is that you do live in interesting times kiddies."

 

[silkstone]

Haha. Yeah well your dad was half right - the stock market is for rich people these days, but anyone can profit off of it.

Stocks should be for everyone. Even if you have very little, treat it as a long-term savings account/retirement fund and put a little each month into index funds/ETFs.
Playing the stock market is a young man's or rich man's game as they can afford to absorb the losses more that most.

The problem is that most people have too much debt nowadays, good for the economy, but bad for the state as there will be a whole generation of older people with no retirement funds in the future and the debt will be passed down through the generations.

Well we will see how things pan out, but whatever happens in any of these markets we are discussing - it will be interesting. As my anthropology teacher said: "Everyone asks to live in interesting times until they actually have to survive them. The good and the bad news is that you do live in interesting times kiddies."

The (misquoted) Chinese curse comes to mind - "May you live in interesting times." Interestingly enough the closest Chinese proverb is actually "Better be a dog in peace than a man in anarchy"

I was wondering when this would show up.

It's pretty interesting. I forget where I saw it, but I do know that some big data centers use water cooling where they then pump that heated water from the system to people's homes. If I were in a cold country, I wouldn't give a shit about the electricity I used as I'd use it to heat my rooms.
I feel a little guilty where I am now as it is hot as hell all year round, but I balance it out in other ways most don't. I don't drive a car, I don't have a central cooling system for my house, a lot of the electricity here is from hydro, I don't spend a tonne of money on buying the latest, greatest gadgets, etc. Even with mining crypto currency, I don't think my environmental footprint would be as high as If I lived in the west even if it is a lot higher than most locals. I actually used to get by on about $15 of electricity a month for years and years, so I'm kind of recouping that early deficit. My current energy bills are never over $200 a month (for a family of 4) and electricity is around $0.15 per kWh here.

 

[Outback Bronze]

you can hide the money or install a safe.

Our safe got ripped of the wall with a lot of cash in it...

only a fool would keep everything in a bank.

I keep everything in the bank now. I must be a fool...

 

[kastriot]

This civilisation is based on profit, with it comes greed, crypto based on mining it's a big lie, but virtual currency based on real money or federal gold reserves is reality and that's it.

 

[dorsetknob]

but virtual currency based on real money or federal gold reserves is reality and that's it.

No your wrong the only money involved with crypto is Investor money no federal or gold reserve is involved
unless its hidden under a coat of tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theory

 

[silkstone]

Our safe got ripped of the wall with a lot of cash in it...



I keep everything in the bank now. I must be a fool...

Really? No property, stocks, shares, gold, businesses? Just to clarify, I'm not saying that one should keep all of their cash at home either. I'm saying it's a good idea to diversify. I don't keep a tonne of cash at home, but enough that were something to happen with my bank accounts, I would be able to use cash for a short while until my accounts were sorted out.
When your safe was stolen, did your insurance cover the loss?

 

[Outback Bronze]

Really? No property, stocks, shares, gold, businesses? Just to clarify, I'm not saying that one should keep all of their cash at home either. I'm saying it's a good idea to diversify. I don't keep a tonne of cash at home, but enough that were something to happen with my bank accounts, I would be able to use cash for a short while until my accounts were sorted out.
When your safe was stolen, did your insurance cover the loss?

Mate, I aint going into the logistics of it all. It upsets me. All you need to know is my Bank handles all our money.

Like I said in a previous post, 37 years I've been on this earth and my bank has never once stolen from our bank accounts.

My money is better off in the bank were it collects interest.

 

[trog100]

bitcoin just broke above the psychologically important $10000 figure.. crypto is on the rise again..

trog

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

bitcoin just broke above the psychologically important $10000 figure.. crypto is on the rise again..

trog

Yes it is and I am glad I bought more during the nice and predictable drop. Eth is already up $350 from Feb 6th. LTC is up to $225 from $100 in same span so it more than doubled. Now if some of my other alt coins follow suit I will be quite happy.

 

[silkstone]

What split of coins do people generally hold? I look into the coins and split them into Tier 1, Tier 2, Tier 3 and Shitcoins. and keep a 35-35-20-10 mix. I was thinking of employing a 'dogs of the dow' type strategy, but there si the risk of missing out when/if any of the Tier 2/3 coins shoot up in value.

 

[lexluthermiester]

Its still safer leaving it in the bank than around the house..

That depends on your house, but I disgress..

Governments are regulating it right now

Name one please. A lot of them are talking about, but AFAIK, none are actually doing it. Granted, I think they need too and highly support regulations on cryptocurrencies.

 

[silkstone]

That depends on your house, but I disgress..


Name one please. A lot of them are talking about, but AFAIK, none are actually doing it. Granted, I think they need too and highly support regulations on cryptocurrencies.

China (if by regulate, you mean ban).

 

[lexluthermiester]

China (if by regulate, you mean ban).

That's not that same. Regulation by definition means allowing something but conditional upon following a set of rules. A ban is just that.

 

[R-T-B]

Can you explain how mining is a ponzi scheme?

I've yet to see anyone succesfully do so. It's just became the catchphrase as of late.

 

[moproblems99]

I've yet to see anyone succesfully do so. It's just became the catchphrase as of late.

I have yet to have anyone put up a decent argument to any of the questions. I may be pro-mining but I don't mind having legit discussions about it. I understand people don't like it but I would at least like people to be informed with truths and not like it for real reasons instead of parroting crap that they read from Warren Buffet who has most likely been screwing people for years. After all, his money had to come from someone...

 

[R0H1T]

I've yet to see anyone succesfully do so. It's just became the catchphrase as of late.

Pyramid Scheme? IIRC most crypto currencies (ICO) are marketed as an alternate to the current fiat based system, now if they can't achieve their goal without the need to be converted at an (crypto) exchange for USD or EUR, then what's the point of crypto again? What are crypto currencies at their heart? A system to move away from the SWIFT based banking, an alternate to legit fiat currencies, commodity that's traded for profit/loss (this is what's happening atm) or none of the above?

 

[moproblems99]

Pyramid Scheme? IIRC most crypto currencies (ICO) are marketed as an alternate to the current fiat based system, now if they can't achieve their goal without the need to be converted at an (crypto) exchange for USD or EUR, then what's the point of crypto again? What are crypto currencies at their heart? A system to move away from the SWIFT based banking, an alternate to legit fiat currencies, commodity that's traded for profit/loss (this is what's happening atm) or none of the above?

What does that have to do with describing mining as a ponzi?

 

[FordGT90Concept]

I've yet to see anyone succesfully do so. It's just became the catchphrase as of late.

The miners are the bulk of the pyramid while the ICO operators are at the top pulling the strings. The miners only get paid enough to stay interested while the operators cash out at the peak (and trigger a crash).

Edit: SEC - Ponzi Scheme

1. High returns with little or no risk.
2. Overly consistent returns.
3. Unregistered investments.
4. Unlicensed sellers.
5. Issues with paperwork.
6. Difficulty receiving payments.

About the only one that doesn't apply is 2 and 5. 5 and 6 could be assigned to exchanges though.

Edit: Oh look, they have one literally titled SEC - Investor Alert: Ponzi Schemes Using Virtual Currencies

 

[R-T-B]

The miners are the bulk of the pyramid while the ICO operators are at the top pulling the strings. The miners only get paid enough to stay interested while the operators cash out at the peak (and trigger a crash).

In a ponzi, one must actively pilfer profits from the bottom rung poor, and that is not what I see in crypto.

 

[moproblems99]

In a ponzi, one must actively pilfer profits from the bottom rung poor, and that is not what I see in crypto.

Certainly not the miners. Which is the exact reason mining is not a ponzi. Miners' investments are in hardware. Not the scheme itself.