Time to update the motherboards layout!

[Waldorf]

larger case?
mounted behind the MB?

can be as an option for those who care..
not many do ITX/SFF, yet enough stuff, for folks who want it.


short:
multiple options, what can be done, without having to change MB layout (as much).

 

[ThrashZone]

would be easier/simpler, just to offer ATX boards that are "extended" on the bottom part,
with the gpu slot as very last thing (no fan ports etc), and cases the are made for the gpu being in that location,
thus offering a separate "chamber", to isolate airflow, lowering temps.

Hi,
They do itx/ mini atx with an upside down case hehe
I had an old acer aspire it's gpu was at the very top so OP didn't really look to hard at cases that do what they want to be done.

 

[Bill_Bright]

Again, an external enclosure for the graphics solution would greatly add to the distance between the CPU and GPU. Not good. And it would mean the data (this is a 64-bit bus) would have to go through a complex (read: expensive) cable system, with connectors, all introducing resistance and even more latency issues. A lot of "wait states". Definitely not good.

I note the RAM is located in close proximity to the CPU for this very same reason.

 

[Waldorf]

@ThrashZone
now that you mention it, i was interested in that one, until i saw mAtx,
had one only to miss on ports within 1y.

@Bill_Bright
this isnt new, there are more than a handful of brands DOING it already.
quick web search

this was to show options, other than (major) MB layout changes to have only (air) gpus benefit..

and short of a full slot at bottom of MB, as i have the case for it,
i cant complain about layout for my use.

 

[AusWolf]

So, because the motherboards remain unchanged for 20 or even 30 years, I think the legacy motherboards layout and the components placement do not work optimally and efficiently any more.
We've got extremely power hungry and hot CPUs and GPUs which are placed next to each other and dump hot air over each other.

I think the GPUs placement should be on top, preferably in a separate compartment, isolated from the other PC parts, just like today we put the PSUs in own compartments.
Also, the GPUs should be turned with the fans upward, and the fans should pull hot air from the PCB upward, in order to naturally accelerate the heat dumping convection process.
Heat moves upwards. Hot air is lighter, cold air is heavier.

View attachment 343155

Moving the graphics card up is not a bad idea if (and only if) motherboard makers can work together with GPU makers with pull style designs. The only problem is that GPUs would have to support both designs.

As for the DDR and m.2 slots, I wouldn't bother swapping them, I can't see any benefit.

 

[Bill_Bright]

this isnt new, there are more than a handful of brands DOING it already.

I know it is not new. The idea has been around for decades with roots going back to docking stations for laptops. In fact, the laptop gaming market is what these still are primarily for, not PCs except those with very limited graphics card support.

Note the marketing docs for the Gigabyte where it says,

transforming ultrabooks into game platforms

Or the Razer Core X (either one) where it says,

Boosts Thunderbolt 3 laptop performance

In fact, look at the first line in the first paragraph of your link where it says,

If you own a laptop, NUC, or any other PC that doesn't have a dedicated graphics card or a PCIe port to install one, you can connect a desktop-class GPU to your PC with the help of an external GPU enclosure.

 

[Waldorf]

oh, sure, but thats with its own psu and everything, not primarily for removing desktop gpu from inside the case.
as in a case just for the gpu, with cables for mb (pcie) and psu (power) only.

just offered multiple options that exist, and dont require completely rearranging layout.
even offering a full sized slot on the bottom, would (only) require swapping the position with the x1/x4 we have there now,
and could be done within or separate niche.

i dont mind changing stuff, has happened a lot of times since 1GHz Athlon and 100MHz ram,
but changing everything to have a small group of gamers benefit (air cooling an above mid range gpu), while making every single user "pay",
instead of getting something i mention before, water cooling/external/case etc,, which only gets paid for, by those that care.

 

[ARF]

So a totally new form factor standard is not going to happen! There just isn't any big advantage or incentive for manufacturers or consumers. A properly designed case, and properly configured case cooling can effectively cool even the most power hungry, heat generating components now.

Moving the graphics card up is not a bad idea if (and only if) motherboard makers can work together with GPU makers with pull style designs. The only problem is that GPUs would have to support both designs.

As for the DDR and m.2 slots, I wouldn't bother swapping them, I can't see any benefit.

The benefit is that you will have more M.2 slots right next to the CPU with the shortest possible distance, and you will have more space for large PCI-E 5.0, 6.0 and 7.0 SSDs heatsinks.
I already see users complain that the large M.2 SSDs interfere with the graphics cards position.

Also, moving the GPU on top will be visually pleasing (you will be able to first enjoy your beautiful GPU), instead of hiding the GPU as is now in a hole (bottom) and making it invisible, unless very transparent case and vertical mounting.

 

[Waldorf]

@ARF
ummm, i need min five m.2 slots..

and:
like this?
(sorry, didnt care to remove tinted front glass)

 

[AusWolf]

The benefit is that you will have more M.2 slots right next to the CPU with the shortest possible distance, and you will have more space for large PCI-E 5.0, 6.0 and 7.0 SSDs heatsinks.
I already see users complain that the large M.2 SSDs interfere with the graphics cards position.

But that's not a problem anymore if the GPU is already at the top of the board, right?

 

[Bill_Bright]

The benefit is that you will have more M.2 slots right next to the CPU with the shortest possible distance

Nah! Sorry, and no disrespect meant but that really is nonsense. You are not looking at the big picture, but rather your own, much smaller personal desires and trying to impose them on every one else.

For one, current ATX form factor motherboards can already have 1, all the way up to 6 M.2 slots with 2 or even 3 being common. Very few users will EVER need more, especially as these drives keep getting bigger and bigger.

Also, moving the GPU on top will be visually pleasing

Sorry, but that is more total nonsense and 100% your personal opinion - totally subjective.

Only a very few people could give a rat's a$$ about appearances, just as a very few care about RGB lighting.

Does that improve performance? Decrease heat production? Increase efficiency? Improve performance? (worth repeating). No, no, no, and double no.

Many, in fact MOST computer users care what is happening on our monitors, not what is going on inside our cases. In fact, I want... no... I demand my cases sit quietly and discreetly off to the side and NOT draw attention to themselves. I do NOT want such non-productive "distractions" to draw my attention away from what is really important and that is what is happening on my monitors.

 

[mechtech]

Be nice if they had 4 m.2 on the back side.............if the pc case had a cut-out for it.

 

[LabRat 891]

I see OP's point. However, adaptations to the existing ATX standard, have already covered most of the issues.


Intel tried to push BTX onto Dell and other OEM partners, no one cared for it.

Today, the 'oddball' quasi-ATX boards are 'Halo-boutique priced' and entirely proprietary to the AIB's PSUs and/or select GPUs.

Moving towards Inverted-ATX (iATX? ) as 'chassis standard' would address this w/o compromising long-standing compatibility.
-CPU-connected PCIe x16 and x4 M.2 are already *very* close to the CPU(SoC).
-Some mobos do have RAMslots even closer to the socket, for signal integrity.

 

[arbiter]

I see OP's point. However, adaptations to the existing ATX standard, have already covered most of the issues.


Intel tried to push BTX onto Dell and other OEM partners, no one cared for it.

Today, the 'oddball' quasi-ATX boards are 'Halo-boutique priced' and entirely proprietary to the AIB's PSUs and/or select GPUs.

Moving towards Inverted-ATX (iATX? ) as 'chassis standard' would address this w/o compromising long-standing compatibility.
-CPU-connected PCIe x16 and x4 M.2 are already *very* close to the CPU(SoC).
-Some mobos do have RAMslots even closer to the socket, for signal integrity.

its easy fix with making a case that flips board so pci is on top, cpu on bottom. all current MB/GPU a good.

 

[Gica]

So, because the motherboards remain unchanged for 20 or even 30 years, I think the legacy motherboards layout and the components placement do not work optimally and efficiently any more.
We've got extremely power hungry and hot CPUs and GPUs which are placed next to each other and dump hot air over each other.

I think the GPUs placement should be on top, preferably in a separate compartment, isolated from the other PC parts, just like today we put the PSUs in own compartments.
Also, the GPUs should be turned with the fans upward, and the fans should pull hot air from the PCB upward, in order to naturally accelerate the heat dumping convection process.
Heat moves upwards. Hot air is lighter, cold air is heavier.

View attachment 343155

Your proposal has a big problem, especially for gamers: the video card takes all the hot air generated by the CPU and VRM. In fact, it takes all the hot air from the case because the hot air has a bad habit of rising.

 

[freeagent]

Just get a BTX style case, if you want your GPU up top, no? My Stacker can go either way. I prefer the ATX layout I think.

 

[Shrek]

CPUs and GPUs which are placed next to each other

They need to talk to each other and so need to be close.

At 3GHz, light travels just 10cm in a cycle, and electricity travels slower.

 

[Hardcore Games]

My socket 7 rig was ATX and with an AMD CPU running Windows 95. Had 4MB RAM back then.

 

[AsRock]

Aren't there VRM's needed in your "Modern Layout" ?....

Even more so when they move the low voltages from the PSU.

EDIT, and not everyone only uses one PCI-e slot either.

 

[taka]

Maybe this approach will fit better for some airflow optimization.

 

[Waldorf]

@Gica
not if any fans are installed (forced air makes the "heat rises" of components, irrelevant).

 

[SL2]

Also, moving the GPU on top will be visually pleasing (you will be able to first enjoy your beautiful GPU), instead of hiding the GPU as is now in a hole (bottom) and making it invisible,

What a load of bs. Do you even know what goes in the top of a case currently, and how visible it is?

Look at this picture, and imagine that the graphics card is placed where the radiator is. How does that make it more visible?
Also please note how INVISIBLE the graphics card currently is, and in a.. hole?

The only reason you think this is a good idea is because you don't speak from experience, you've only seen pics from ads where the camera angle is from the surface of the desk.

The thing is, unless you're 5 years old, you don't have that perspective when sitting.
What do I care, I'm not 5 anymore so I've stopped staring at rotating fans..

Currently, if you have a 2 slot wide graphics card, you potentially leave room for other cards, even if not that common these days. With your idea, you need to leave space enough between the PCIE slot and the CPU area for the widest graphics cards imaginable, and just pray that they won't get any wider because it won't fit.

If you want a clearly visible graphics card you might as well go for a PIO board with a horizontal slot (instead of BTX). I've only seen budget models tho.
This clearly has its drawbacks, but if you're going for looks this layout might be it. Also, you could easily fit an 8-slot graphics card.

 

[Waldorf]

@SL2
and yes, if i lower my chair all the way, i HAVE that view btw.
not every case with windows is for 5y olds or for RGB, nor do all of us care to look at spinning fans.

with glass panels, i can glance not only at my loop (even that i never had any LC fail on me or anyone i used it for a build),
but see the the mb/gpu diagnostic leds (at boot), and more importantly the temp display my board has (2 digit status display switching to show cpu temp after POST).

you have a preference what your pc should look like, others do to, doesnt make one more "valid" over the other


many incl me are old "enough", to know that "change is the only constant",
but, short of things like special parking (close by/more spacious) and ramps to give access to places to the "few" that have trouble walking (to say it simple),
why should "all" pc owners have to endure a complete redesign of most things around the MB, so a small amount of ppl with higher tier gpus that are air cooled
can benefit, all why we already have a few options (starts with water cooling it), to remedy the issue, while being more cost effective (for everyone else).

same with things like sli, which really only makes sense on the fastest single chip gpu (at that time), to have the option to add more processing power,
but that shouldn't mean "make" all others pay more, just so all relevant pc parts support sli
(e.g. all psus with "double output" and more pcie plugs, all mb with more than 1 full sized pcie slot, etc.)

 

[SL2]

@SL2
and yes, if i lower my chair all the way, i HAVE that view btw.
not every case with windows is for 5y olds or for RGB, nor do all of us care to look at spinning fans.

with glass panels, i can glance not only at my loop (even that i never had any LC fail on me or anyone i used it for a build),
but see the the mb/gpu diagnostic leds (at boot), and more importantly the temp display my board has (2 digit status display switching to show cpu temp after POST).

You're not wrong, but you're offtopic. Nothing you say involves moving the graphics card like the OP suggests, or explains why it should be done. And I said nothing about glass panels..

Also, I haven't read all the posts, but have we forgotten about BTX-style cases for regular ATX boards, with window on the other side? The graphics card gets on top and is visible.

you have a preference what your pc should look like, others do to, doesnt make one more "valid" over the other

I don't even know what you mean. The OP tries to solve a problem while not doing it. Doesn't sound vaild to me.

If anyone wants their card clearly visible.. well it can be done.

 

[Waldorf]

@SL2
(my windows are made of glass, so a little different than side-panels "turned" into windows,
which tend to have at least some parts of the panel covered by an opaque area around the edges,
restricting view a little, as visible on the rgb fan case.)

my answer was in regards to:
"The thing is, unless you're 5 years old, you don't have that perspective when sitting.
What do I care, I'm not 5 anymore so I've stopped staring at rotating fans.."

we all have different ideas of how the pc should look, and if ppl like to stare at there fans, so be it, doesnt mean they are "wrong"
or that they shouldnt, just because "we" dont.

and im just saying we have enough options to "fix" the problem (hot gpu), like LC,
or using cases that allow MB and/or gpu to be installed "rotated" compared to normal pos,
or cases that allow to install the gpu to the sidepanel behind the MB, all improving on the "old" spot below the cpu location,
and only affecting those financially, that care about it, instead of changing to "CTX" boards for all and every mb being made from here on,
or as BTX shows, being less relevant vs the options i mentioned before.

and that's not even accounting for the changes affecting countries where ppl can barely afford a pc,
now having to come up with even more money,
while nothing "improved" for +80% of global pc users, as they tend to use igu/apu or low/mid range gpus not requiring it..

and just to look at the numbers from the poll, changes to hw/rise in cost affecting 100% of users, when wanted by less than 30%..

@ARF
not saying your idea is "crap", as i was thinking about similar things with ppl using big cards on air,
but virtually all other options compared to changing (MB) layout/routing etc, are cheaper,
and only have to be carried by those "who care", not the masses not really benefiting,
and the main reason why i "gave" up that..