NVIDIA GeForce RTX 4070 Founders Edition

[Acesbong]

Editors choice award? Me no understand.

Looks like it has bombed though, well done everyone. Garbage product.

 

[SOAREVERSOR]

90% of gpu buyers buy nvidia even if they are more expensive, even if they perform a little worst, even if they are consume a little more power, so how is this news? if you throw a rock in the air, the changes of hitting a nvidia gpu buyer over amd is very high? there are reasons for it and most of it amd's own fault. how is this even related to the vram issue?

damn, these arguments over and over again.

It's not AMDs fault. The way markets and humans work is there is always the desireable object and then the other object. The desriable object is the one people are going to get, regardless of actaul value, because it is desired. That desire factor makes it worth more, even if from a logical standpoint it is not. Being worth more makes it more desirable. This goes on and on and on and in the end it works out to "it costs more, because it costs more, that is enough justification and because it costs more everyone is going to buy it and avoid the other". This is the end result of higher end competition in everything.

There's not much AMD can do outside of managing to release a product that is so crazy nuts they can sell it for more money than nvidia sells their option for. Simply by selling their products for less AMD becomes less desirable and a worse value.

Markets are not rational.

good GPU costs as second a hand car lets end it here

What? An RTX 4090 is 1600 bucks. A used car of a common non absurd model, Honda Accord, is 16000-28000 bucks.

 

[tvshacker]

What? An RTX 4090 is 1600 bucks. A used car of a common non absurd model, Honda Accord, is 16000-28000 bucks.

I bought a car 1250€ (in ~2006) and it still runs great!

 

[oxrufiioxo]

I bought a car 1250€ (in ~2006) and it still runs great!

If you spent 1200 on a car you shouldn't be in the market for a 4090 so what does it matter.

 

[tvshacker]

If you spent 1200 on a car you shouldn't be in the market for a 4090 so what does it matter.

A lot happens in 17 years you know. I'm not in the market for a 4090 because my best judgment won't allow it, not my wallet.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

A lot happens in 17 years you know. I'm not in the market for a 4090 because my best judgment won't allow it, not my wallet.

That would still be like me concerned with the price of a 2023 Raptor due to me spending 100 on a gpu in 2006 that still worked.....

 

[Krit]

The sweet truth if you take away all marketing bias RTX 4070 is the worst price/performance **70 card of all times. In reality this card is much more like **60 card in terms of raw specs.

GTX 970 - 329eur +43% performance increase
GTX 1070 - 449eur +62% performance increase
RTX 2070 - 499eur +40% performance increase
RTX 3070 - 499eur +50% performance increase
RTX 4070 - 599eur +27% performance increase

 

[tvshacker]

The sweet truth if you take away all marketing bias RTX 4070 is the worst price/performance **70 card of all times. In reality this card is much more like **60 card in terms of raw specs.

GTX 970 - 329eur +43% performance increase
GTX 1070 - 449eur +62% performance increase
RTX 2070 - 499eur +40% performance increase
RTX 3070 - 499eur +50% performance increase
RTX 4070 - 599eur +27% performance increase

The 1060 matched the 980 and had 2 extra GB of VRAM
The "4070" matches the 3080 and has 2 extra GB of VRAM

The math is sound!

 

[MarsM4N]

The problem isn't the 6phase VRM but lack of screws to create sufficient cooler pressure on the VRM. The card basically sagged itself to those insane temps because the cooler doesnt have enough screw points.

(Just focusing on the VRM part since bad cooler design might ony affect this particular card).

I am not an engineer, but the history of GPU's has shown again & again, more VRM phases =

• little higher power consumption
• little more expensive
• load shared by more VRM's, resulting in:
• less stress & temp per VRM
• better durability
• better stability (esp. OC'd)
• reduced/eliminated coil whine

Overall a card with more VRM's will be the better deal in the long run, even if it costs a little bit more.

 

[N/A]

The sweet truth if you take away all marketing bias RTX 4070 is the worst price/performance **70 card of all times. In reality this card is much more like **60 card in terms of raw specs.

GTX 970 - 329eur +43% performance increase
GTX 1070 - 449eur +62% performance increase
RTX 2070 - 499eur +40% performance increase
RTX 3070 - 499eur +50% performance increase
RTX 4070 - 599eur +27% performance increase

To think that the transistors have more than doubled, 17400 vs 35800 B. But it's what it is, the price is 700 now - $350 in 2 years, that's 50 cents per day, so i don't care anymore.

 

[Gucky]

Overall a card with more VRM's will be the better deal in the long run, even if it costs a little bit more.

Coil whine is not determend by the size of the VRM. The MSI Suprim is one of the loudest 4090 in coil while and has the biggest VRM.

This is a scaring point. Manufacturers have been “forced” by Nvidia to keep some cards at MSRP, with no many weeks of notice. So it’s possible that some cut some corners on the card. The GPU doesn’t require much power, but a 6-phase power stage is a very cheap solution even for 200W.

There are Supermicro servergrade boards for 24/7 use with a ~200W CPU and only 5 phase VRM, which has a heatsink that is smaller then your finger.
And I think even the most expensive 4070 would have a great margin at MSRP...

 

[Dr. Dro]

I don't personally care what they are making per 4070 be it 50 usd or 300 usd, at it's 600 usd price point at the very least it should have a better pcb.

Sure the FE cooler is nice and likely expensive but but 4070s should have at the very least better pcbs and nvidia should allow enough margin for their aib partners to not have to cut corners.

As much as I wish all the current generation gpus were cheaper that isn't our current reality.

Relatively speaking at 1440p this card has the best price/performance of any current generation card which is kinda sad.

Still at 600 usd we should expect better

So technically everything released has been the fanboy edition depending on what camp you're in.

In Nvidia's eyes, 600 USD is now budget segment, LOL. Which is kind of why despite going all off the rails and shooting everywhere trying to land a hit, the crowd writing "ngreedia" in all caps here has a genuine grievance that I just can't help but sympathize with.

Their arrogance is eerily reminiscent of 3dfx's final days. Speaking of which, watch Gamers Nexus' latest video on the Voodoo 5500. Great stuff, and he goes over the similarities between 3dfx's final project and the 40 series. Where is AMD to make the same inroads in the popular segments like the GeForce 2 GTS did back then? It really had me wondering.

 

[terroralpha]

90% of gpu buyers buy nvidia even if they are more expensive, even if they perform a little worst, even if they are consume a little more power, so how is this news? if you throw a rock in the air, the changes of hitting a nvidia gpu buyer over amd is very high? there are reasons for it and most of it amd's own fault. how is this even related to the vram issue?

damn, these arguments over and over again.

this is true. i have friends in south america who asked me to buy and ship GPUs to them back in december. i offered them 6800XTs that were available for $475 at the time. there were also 6950XTs for $650. but they both DEMANDED nvidia GPUs. i ended up buying an asus 3070ti tuf for $560 and an MSI 12GB rtx 3080 for $710 as per their request. they didn't want to hear about anything "radeon".

one of them had issues with black screens and crashes on some amd GPU at some point. not sure why the other person wanted only nvidia.

we can debate this stuff until we turn blue in the face and pass out, but most people will still buy things based on their prejudices. we won't change anyone's mind.

 

[Prima.Vera]

This card is DOA (dead on arrival). It's slower than a 3080, for more price....
Considering it's a generation leap, this should have been priced at a ~350$ and marketed as an RTX 4060 (Ti). No way this garbage is a 4070 card.

 

[Why_Me]

This card is DOA (dead on arrival). It's slower than a 3080, for more price....
Considering it's a generation leap, this should have been priced at a ~350$ and marketed as an RTX 4060 (Ti). No way this garbage is a 4070 card.

RTX 3080 10GB MSRP: $700
RTX 4070 12GB MSRP: $600

 

[oxrufiioxo]

RTX 3080 10GB MSRP: $700
RTX 4070 12GB MSRP: $600

Here you go with your same two graphs again at least you're predictable i guess


He's obviously talking about 4k and anyone who doesn't expect a 600+ dollar product to not perfom better than a 2.5 year old card that only MSRP for 100 usd higher is a blatant fanboy.

This is the worst 70 class product in the history of 70 class profucts well maybe the 70ti is worse I guess but it's debatable.

 

[Why_Me]

Here you go with your same two graphs again at least you're predictable i guess


He's obviously talking about 4k and anyone who doesn't expect a 600+ dollar product to not perfom better than a 2.5 year old card that only MSRP for 100 usd higher is a blatant fanboy.

This is the worst 70 class product in the history of 70 class profucts well maybe the 70ti is worse I guess but it's debatable.

What PC gamer with an IQ north of a turnip would purchase the 4070 for gaming at 4K when they could save themselves the money and purchase a console for their whopping 60 FPS.

 

[oxrufiioxo]

Let's pretend this is a tech site shall we. With that said what PC gamer with an IQ north of a turnip would purchase the 4070 for gaming at 4K when they could save themselves the money and purchase a console for their whopping 60 FPS.

Keep drinking that green Koolaid bruh it suits you.

 

[Bomby569]

The power saving alone (there is even more performance) is worth it against a 3080.
It's too expensive but then again so are all cards these days

 

[gffermari]

It's not AMDs fault. The way markets and humans work is there is always the desireable object and then the other object. The desriable object is the one people are going to get, regardless of actaul value, because it is desired. That desire factor makes it worth more, even if from a logical standpoint it is not. Being worth more makes it more desirable. This goes on and on and on and in the end it works out to "it costs more, because it costs more, that is enough justification and because it costs more everyone is going to buy it and avoid the other". This is the end result of higher end competition in everything.

It's AMDs incapability to compete. Not fault.
And the markets turn to the better product most of the times.

We all had Intel CPUs for years and now check the system specs here in TPU....Most of them are AMD based.

The market also says that there's no a bad product but a bad price.
That's AMDs fault.
I won't pay 1000+ GBP for a XTX that sucks in RT (for the price), doesn't have CUDA for my apps, is shXt or problematic in CAD/BIM environment, consumes a truckload of power (don't care about power consumption/I care about heat production), comes with a low quality DLSS (to me it's fine but it's generally tested that FSR is worse in every aspect than DLSS), lacks (or comes very late) of features like DLSS3, nvenc etc, (at least they put AV1 in the 7000, the 6000 lineup is a joke)

On topic:
the 4070 may lack of raw performance but it is and will be practically faster than the alternatives where matters.
The memory thing is not an issue.
All these cards will run out of juice before the vram becomes a problem.

 

[Max(IT)]

Coil whine is not determend by the size of the VRM. The MSI Suprim is one of the loudest 4090 in coil while and has the biggest VRM.

There are Supermicro servergrade boards for 24/7 use with a ~200W CPU and only 5 phase VRM, which has a heatsink that is smaller then your finger.
And I think even the most expensive 4070 would have a great margin at MSRP...

Server grade boards are not necessarily good products.
It depends on the rating (5-phase 90A power stage is different from 5-phase 50A power stage), but if you use a 5-phase board for a 200W CPU you are cheaping out on a quite important component.

On topic:
the 4070 may lack of raw performance but it is and will be practically faster than the alternatives where matters.
The memory thing is not an issue.
All these cards will run out of juice before the vram becomes a problem.

Agree.
On the web today is a quite popular topic. Post a video/article saying “VRAM is not enough” and you are going to receive a lot of clicks.
While an 8 GB frame buffer clearly was the wrong move for RTX 3070, you cannot say the same about 12 GB, at least at 1440P

 

[Denver]

To think that the transistors have more than doubled, 17400 vs 35800 B. But it's what it is, the price is 700 now - $350 in 2 years, that's 50 cents per day, so i don't care anymore.

Most of the transistors are being used in a stupid way, as in the part dedicated to AI/RT, the result is that the 3xxx series manages to do more with less transistors, in other words higher performance/transistor.

GPUs simply don't have enough power for "real RT". Why focus on RT when everything else textures, geometry, physics is not equally realistic?

 

[gffermari]

Why focus on RT when everything else textures, geometry, physics is not equally realistic?

Because lighting is the most important factor to make a scene look realistic. Even one without any textures or a joke of textures like Minecraft.
Even if you have 8K textures, they are useless since all objects look like they are on the air flying.
The geometry is not always important. You have low poly sewer pipes or round abouts in cyberpunk. So what?
It's not critical as the car/weapon/story NPC models.

The physics is important when the gameplay relies on that. I like physics (BF for example) but devs have given up going a step further.

 

[Mahboi]

Call me crazy, but I kind of like the 4070.

It's a perfect SFF card. Small, low power, high efficiency, sufficient for all 1440p tasks, a true 7-class card, perfect for the best cost efficiency, size efficiency, power efficiency, just...efficiency. It's an excellent product.

That is, if you lower the price by 25%. 600 dollars will easily become 700 to 750 with taxes, so obviously this is way beyond acceptable. The 4070 is sort of the diametral opposite to the 6700 xt: one is the minimum you can get for good 1440p, the other is the maximum. They both make sense at this resolution and make little sense above or below, the 4070 would be a terrible 4K card while the 6700 xt would be really overpowered for a 1080p card.

I like the 4070 because it fills that position better than any other card. It's a perfectly effective and well-thought 1440p GPU that would satisfy pretty much any use case, save for its smaller VRAM buffer than I'd want. And it's a cute product, small and ready to serve immediately.

But nobody will buy what is ultimately a super efficient 3080 12Go. It's just pointless. Too bad.

Because lighting is the most important factor to make a scene look realistic. Even one without any textures or a joke of textures like Minecraft.

I have to question how important realism is in a game with baby textures. Minecraft is indeed the best example. If you gave me the choice between a highly textured Minecraft with complex shapes (not everything a block) and the standard Minecraft with RTX, I would laugh at the idea of playing the current Minecraft.
It's the difference between a perfectly lit Lego castle and a proper castle model. Sure, each has its charm. But claiming that "realism" is best brought with lighting...nah. Just nah. I'm not denying your point entirely btw, lighting is the most important component for atmosphere, but atmosphere with 0 detail isn't going to suffice. Good lighting AND good textures. If I have to choose between both, I'll simply pick the one that seems to be the most "sturdy", the one that'll work in most cases. That's textures, not lighting.

 

[Blitzkuchen]

To think that the transistors have more than doubled, 17400 vs 35800 B. But it's what it is, the price is 700 now - $350 in 2 years, that's 50 cents per day, so i don't care anymore.

If u buy a wafer from TSMC et all u pay for the wafer and the node, not for transistors...


I like the 4070 really: Cheap Design, Coil Whine, 12GB like a 3060 and this just for about 600-700$