Youtube, Discord, Visual Studio Code are flickering with black checkered squares/vertical lines. Partial solutions to this issue.

[KsushaTeaKisa]

Hello everyone,

I'm on RTX 4070, 5950x, w11, 2K 144hz with g-sync compatible enabled. I've been getting this chromium based app artifacts since day one of the brand new RTX 4070 swap(asus dual, no OC or undervolt, all at stock). I've been updating the driver with the latest version with no change at all between the newer versions.
As far as browsers are concerned, switching to angle opengl reduces occurrence big time, at least in my case.
Disabling Hardware Acceleration is not even a workaround as far as I'm concerned as this just reduces performance.

What I found is that if I switch the GPU power state to "Prefer maximum performance" from the nvidia control panel, the problem goes away entirely. No more glitches in browsers. No more disabling any app features.

The issue seems to be directly linked to the way nvidia handles the low power state of the GPU.
As a drawback, the switch to "prefer maximum performance" increases power usage a lot at desktop. Power goes from ~10W at desktop to ~40W, with GPU core and memory locked at very high values all the time. This is with only one 2K display at 144HZ

I wonder if this works for everyone or only in my case.

View attachment 318166

View attachment 318167

That's right, to reproduce this bug you need low power state of GPU. This is precisely the reason why I cannot reproduce this bug when I have the game running or when screen recording is running or when I connect a second monitor to my GPU
Using OpenGL API or DirectX 9 API in the browser or using launch flags are the best solutions to fix this bug for now.

How to use flags:
Create a shortcut to the browser and add these arguments to "Target" field of the shortcut: --disable-features=DCompPresenter --disable-direct-composition-video-overlays

 

[Mussels]

Hello everyone,

I'm on RTX 4070, 5950x, w11, 2K 144hz with g-sync compatible enabled. I've been getting this chromium based app artifacts since day one of the brand new RTX 4070 swap(asus dual, no OC or undervolt, all at stock). I've been updating the driver with the latest version with no change at all between the newer versions.
As far as browsers are concerned, switching to angle opengl reduces occurrence big time, at least in my case.
Disabling Hardware Acceleration is not even a workaround as far as I'm concerned as this just reduces performance.

What I found is that if I switch the GPU power state to "Prefer maximum performance" from the nvidia control panel, the problem goes away entirely. No more glitches in browsers. No more disabling any app features.

The issue seems to be directly linked to the way nvidia handles the low power state of the GPU.
As a drawback, the switch to "prefer maximum performance" increases power usage a lot at desktop. Power goes from ~10W at desktop to ~40W, with GPU core and memory locked at very high values all the time. This is with only one 2K display at 144HZ

I wonder if this works for everyone or only in my case.

View attachment 318166

View attachment 318167

Someone on AMD saw this too
Set a game profile for your browser and set that to prefer max performance to keep your idle clocks working correctly, it may be a better solution


This is why GPU's clock up (VRAM especially) in multi monitor situations, is this just that they're competing for power efficiency so hard they're not clocking up when they should be?

 

[mkdr]

Is this related?

https://www.reddit.com/r/obs/comments/16kfiae

1483742 - chromium - An open-source project to help move the web forward. - Monorail

bugs.chromium.org

I noticed it gets better if you disable MPOs but not totally vanishes:

NVIDIA Support

nvidia.custhelp.com

 

[KsushaTeaKisa]

Is this related?

https://www.reddit.com/r/obs/comments/16kfiae

1483742 - chromium - An open-source project to help move the web forward. - Monorail

bugs.chromium.org

I noticed it gets better if you disable MPOs but not totally vanishes:

NVIDIA Support

nvidia.custhelp.com

Hello,
I wrote about this earlier that disabling the MPO with this file unfortunately does not change the situation, so this is not a solution to this bug. On the contrary, when I disable MPO (using Nvidia regedit file) + HAGS, the flickering appears more often. I haven’t tested this for a long time, so I can’t say exactly how things are now, but I doubt that anything has changed.
At the moment, there are two main solutions to this bug, which I wrote about above in my post.

Yes, what you showed is a current bug.

 

[mkdr]

@KsushaTeaKisa This bug exists since 3 years or so and has the root cause in Windows DWM.exe (windows desktop manager) when they introduced MPOs. I had already reported this 2-3 years ago to several people at Nvidia, Intel and MS, also directly to some MS developers via email. As you see, they didnt care to fix it so far. I noticed the issue 2-3 years ago on my laptop with Intel UHD 630. So it is not a Nvidia only issue. Disabling MPOs fixes the issue on Intel UHD 630 for example to 99% or maybe 100%.

You can also read about it here for AMD:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/yvyqc7
I got a new desktop PC 2 months ago with RTX4080, so now I also noticed it on there. The issue is manifesting there though a bit differently. See both links above for examples. It seems there are 2 issues here affected together or maybe 3, and it seems 1 or 2 of the 3 can be fixed with disabling MPOs on Nvidia, so most of the issues like corruption (rectangles, lines) and so on vanish if you disable MPOs. One issue seems to stay though in Chrome for example of randomly objects flicker in and out of existence, and overlays flicker back and forth (see last video example in above Chrome bug link). I never saw that one on Intel though so it seems that is a nother bug also happening here, maybe exclusive to Nvidia, and does not vanish if you disable MPOs.

The issue happens with way higher chance if a video is playing in Chrome for example Twitter or Twitch. It might be related to video decode swap chains. I reported a driver bug for Intel a long time ago for this, and the solution was to disable video decode swap chains. Read about it here:

1258325 - chromium - An open-source project to help move the web forward. - Monorail

bugs.chromium.org

1107403 - chromium - An open-source project to help move the web forward. - Monorail

bugs.chromium.org

I have a theory since some time, that the issue is also happening globally in Windows using swap chains and also happening on Nvidia.

There is also another bug mostly connected with this too, that you see video memory corruption all over Windows for a short millisecond you see drawing of old content drawn in windows or parts where 3d acceleration is on. Mostly another DWM bug.

I dont use Discord so I cant speak for it, so maybe it also happens there as Discord uses 3d acceleration too. You mostly see this anywhere in 3d accelerated apps, where the video card is not under heavy load.

 

[KsushaTeaKisa]

@KsushaTeaKisa This bug exists since 3 years or so and has the root cause in Windows DWM.exe (windows desktop manager) when they introduced MPOs. I had already reported this 2-3 years ago to several people at Nvidia, Intel and MS, also directly to some MS developers via email. As you see, they didnt care to fix it so far. I noticed the issue 2-3 years ago on my laptop with Intel UHD 630. So it is not a Nvidia only issue. Disabling MPOs fixes the issue on Intel UHD 630 for example to 99% or maybe 100%.

You can also read about it here for AMD:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/yvyqc7
I got a new desktop PC 2 months ago with RTX4080, so now I also noticed it on there. The issue is manifesting there though a bit differently. See both links above for examples. It seems there are 2 issues here affected together or maybe 3, and it seems 1 or 2 of the 3 can be fixed with disabling MPOs on Nvidia, so most of the issues like corruption (rectangles, lines) and so on vanish if you disable MPOs. One issue seems to stay though in Chrome for example of randomly objects flicker in and out of existence, and overlays flicker back and forth (see last video example in above Chrome bug link). I never saw that one on Intel though so it seems that is a nother bug also happening here, maybe exclusive to Nvidia, and does not vanish if you disable MPOs.

The issue happens with way higher chance if a video is playing in Chrome for example Twitter or Twitch. It might be related to video decode swap chains. I reported a driver bug for Intel a long time ago for this, and the solution was to disable video decode swap chains. Read about it here:

1258325 - chromium - An open-source project to help move the web forward. - Monorail

bugs.chromium.org

1107403 - chromium - An open-source project to help move the web forward. - Monorail

bugs.chromium.org

I have a theory since some time, that the issue is also happening globally in Windows using swap chains and also happening on Nvidia.

There is also another bug mostly connected with this too, that you see video memory corruption all over Windows for a short millisecond you see drawing of old content drawn in windows or parts where 3d acceleration is on. Mostly another DWM bug.

I dont use Discord so I cant speak for it, so maybe it also happens there as Discord uses 3d acceleration too. You mostly see this anywhere in 3d accelerated apps, where the video card is not under heavy load.

Yes, I saw how people with AMD cards disabled MPO in Windows using this file and their issues with various flickering in browsers and even Windows explorer were solved, but unfortunately this file is useless for Nvidia videocards, because this is really something additional with Nvidia GPUs (exclusive, as you expressed). I have tested this file on 2060, 2060S, 3060 8Gb and 12Gb. I had no experience using Intel GPUs, thanks for sharing this information! I also equate this bug to a issues with Windows DWM and MPO.

I also tried to report this to Microsoft last year, but they still didn't want to notice it until Nvidia told them about it, so I wanted Nvidia to know about this bug first.

 

[Mussels]

I get the feeling the upcoming fixes from Microsoft to DWM will be tied in with this
I've posted it here before, but the more we find it affects all GPU brands equally the more it seems like a windows issue.

They just cant merge mixed frame rate content without occasional glitches, and somethings being done to cause them to happen more often in some setups than others


One of the more reasonable interpretations on MS's patch notes

Although Windows 11 currently supports different refresh rates on different monitors, this update sounds like it's designed to assist with two monitors higher than 60Hz being used simultaneously, whereby the refresh rate is adjusted on the fly according to the content displayed.

Windows 11 to Improve How It Handles Different Refresh Rates for 2 or More Monitors | Extremetech


The original blog post
Announcing Windows 11 Insider Preview Build 25915 | Windows Insider Blog


That first point would be what makes a lot of sense here, with different refresh displays being fairly common - one display may work problem free (especially if it's a plain 60Hz display) while the higher spec monitor has the glitches.

The second point explains what the actual purpose is - VRR for DWM.exe and for more than the primary screen. With luck that means MPO may work on multiple monitors as well.

Problem is these are part of the 25xxx builds, and the beta channel is still at 22xxx, meaning that theres no way to get this without being on the insider builds for several months.

These glitches can be from things as simple as mixed DPI scaling between displays, fullscreen exclusive apps, traditional vs DXGI apps and so on... theres dozens of individual parts with hundreds of combinations so this ones a total bitch to understand, let alone fix.

 

[Pap3rEmperor_]

I get the feeling the upcoming fixes from Microsoft to DWM will be tied in with this
I've posted it here before, but the more we find it affects all GPU brands equally the more it seems like a windows issue.

They just cant merge mixed frame rate content without occasional glitches, and somethings being done to cause them to happen more often in some setups than others


One of the more reasonable interpretations on MS's patch notes


Windows 11 to Improve How It Handles Different Refresh Rates for 2 or More Monitors | Extremetech


The original blog post
Announcing Windows 11 Insider Preview Build 25915 | Windows Insider Blog


That first point would be what makes a lot of sense here, with different refresh displays being fairly common - one display may work problem free (especially if it's a plain 60Hz display) while the higher spec monitor has the glitches.

The second point explains what the actual purpose is - VRR for DWM.exe and for more than the primary screen. With luck that means MPO may work on multiple monitors as well.
View attachment 318695


Problem is these are part of the 25xxx builds, and the beta channel is still at 22xxx, meaning that theres no way to get this without being on the insider builds for several months.

View attachment 318696

These glitches can be from things as simple as mixed DPI scaling between displays, fullscreen exclusive apps, traditional vs DXGI apps and so on... theres dozens of individual parts with hundreds of combinations so this ones a total bitch to understand, let alone fix.

Know if these fixes will be coming to windows 10? Currently, my issue is resolved as long as I keep hardware acceleration disabled. When I reenable it, it comes back with the checkered black boxes. The only thing with the software encoding, I get a subtle a horizontal glitchy line on some videos, not an issue though, I think.

 

[KsushaTeaKisa]

Know of if these fixes will be coming to windows 10? Currently, my issue is resolved as long as I keep hardware acceleration disabled. When I reenable it, it comes back with the checkered black boxes. The only thing with the software encoding, I get a subtle a horizontal glitchy line on some videos, not an issue though, I think.

They should release a patch for Windows 10 in the same way as for Windows 11. Windows 10 is still relevant and will still be relevant until at least 2025. I know that they are moving away from Windows 10 and do not want to add new features there, but this is a bug fixing, not adding new functionality. This is a issue with their OS and it is their responsibility to fix it.

 

[Pap3rEmperor_]

They should release a patch for Windows 10 in the same way as for Windows 11. Windows 10 is still relevant and will still be relevant until at least 2025. I know that they are moving away from Windows 10 and do not want to add new features there, but this is a bug fixing, not adding new functionality. This is a issue with their OS and it is their responsibility to fix it.

Exactly. I just hope it gets resolved.

 

[KsushaTeaKisa]

Exactly. I just hope it gets resolved.

I also hope so, I don't like the experience of using Windows 11

 

[moist_wethole]

I also hope so, I don't like the experience of using Windows 11

Win 11 hater here, I tried it and adjusted the settings to my liking and it's not much different from Win 10 tbh.
Will test the new update and let you guys know if things work as intended.

Update:
Testing on 22635.2486 , seems like the issues have been resolved. Reset all of my browser settings to see if I get any of the usual checker box things in YouTube, so far nothing.

Update #2:
After using it with the new update for 2-3 hours, I've experienced 1 artifact, so the issue has not been completely resolved, but it's by 90% better how it was before so far.

 

[Mussels]

Know if these fixes will be coming to windows 10? Currently, my issue is resolved as long as I keep hardware acceleration disabled. When I reenable it, it comes back with the checkered black boxes. The only thing with the software encoding, I get a subtle a horizontal glitchy line on some videos, not an issue though, I think.

Unlikely, 10 is already on life support. Too many of these fixes require the updated hardware requirements of 11.


Things like DirectX 12 ultimate and the new WDM model - the OS needs to support them and so does hardware, adding them to 10 would be pointless if they then had to change 10's hardware requirements to directX 12 ultimate GPUs to enable these features

 

[KsushaTeaKisa]

Unlikely, 10 is already on life support. Too many of these fixes require the updated hardware requirements of 11.


Things like DirectX 12 ultimate and the new WDM model - the OS needs to support them and so does hardware, adding them to 10 would be pointless if they then had to change 10's hardware requirements to directX 12 ultimate GPUs to enable these features

I doubt that fixing this bug requires features that are not present in Windows 10. These are all just theories that we are discussing, but we don't know how exactly Microsoft will fix it.

 

[Pap3rEmperor_]

We will all see then.

 

[Kardahim]

I think I see more bugs like 1 random frame in yt video. But I dont have any problems with discord. I'm curious if they will fix it or pretend that the problem doesn't exist.

 

[moist_wethole]

I think I see more bugs like 1 random frame in yt video. But I dont have any problems with discord. I'm curious if they will fix it or pretend that the problem doesn't exist.

On OS build: 22635.2486 I see way less bugs and artifacts. It's almost completely gone, whereas before I was getting one artifact per hour or more.

Moving on to test with a new update: Cumulative Update for Windows 11 Insider Preview (10.0.22635.2552) (KB5031448) - Will update.

 

[Kardahim]

On OS build: 22635.2486 I see way less bugs and artifacts. It's almost completely gone, whereas before I was getting one artifact per hour or more.

Moving on to test with a new update: Cumulative Update for Windows 11 Insider Preview (10.0.22635.2552) (KB5031448) - Will update.

I see artfacts os specific yt videos, for example today i see a lots of it, but for last month i didnt see any. Its weird. I use windows 10

 

[ThirtyNinety]

Someone on AMD saw this too
Set a game profile for your browser and set that to prefer max performance to keep your idle clocks working correctly, it may be a better solution


This is why GPU's clock up (VRAM especially) in multi monitor situations, is this just that they're competing for power efficiency so hard they're not clocking up when they should be?

So... this mitigates, or removes the checkerboard artifact issue on youtube?

 

[KsushaTeaKisa]

So... this mitigates, or removes the checkerboard artifact issue on youtube?

View attachment 319123

I would say that this rather minimizes the appearance of artifacts, but it certainly does not removes. Click, but I want to correct myself in the fact that I can still see these artifacts at maximum performance or for example while any heavy for GPU game is running, but very very rarely.

 

[tabascosauz]

I would say that this rather minimizes the appearance of artifacts, but it certainly does not removes. Click, but I want to correct myself in the fact that I can still see these artifacts at maximum performance or for example while any heavy for GPU game is running, but very very rarely.

It's also extremely dependent on the GPU and monitor hardware you have, and definitely not any sort of universal or even consistent solution. Different Nvidia generations and GPUs react differently to setting Prefer Maximum Performance. iirc I could get VRAM upclocking out of my 2060 Super, but my 3070 Ti, RTX A2000 and 4070 Ti all do not care about what is set in NVCP, they will not change VRAM behaviour unless the monitor configuration physically changes.

Recently my 4070 Ti has been doing better in this regard but the checkerboarding appears rather frequently on my RTX A2000. Only for Youtube, however.

For Youtube specifically, it seems like it might have to do with the background context-dependent coloured blur on most of the page, which YT has had for a while and changes depending on what is playing in the video. Checkerboarding appears outside the immediate boundaries of the video itself (ie. when in default player size).

 

[saulob]

Could someone please summarize the issue? I'm trying to understand if this is a bug in Windows or the NVIDIA driver.

Is there a specific driver version that addresses this issue? Who can we expect to provide the solution to this problem?

Thank you in advance

 

[moist_wethole]

OS build 22635.2486 was great, but the new Win update 22635.2552 ruined everything and the GPU artifacts are back.

 

[SinNovedad]

Now I have 4 devices in total with this problem, 3 laptops (1 Asus, 2 MSI) and 1 PC, one of them has Windows 10 and also has the problem.

 

[Abracababra]

One thing maybe worth checking out,

go to regedit -> Computer\HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\GraphicsDrivers\Configuration

I had lots of duplicates for the same monitor, and also old monitors. Just delete all the configs and reboot. Setup your screen resolutions and refresh rates after reboot again

@Mussels post here got me thinking that maybe because of the multiple configs, MPO gets disabled some time after boot. (After login I always got a short black screen, like if it was changing resolutions/switching configs between login screen and desktop).

Tested it for an hour now and no checkerboard yet.
Chrome still with default settings.

Hi! After you edit the Configuration, Is there no such checkerboard problem in Chrome?


Thank everyone for all the work you've done.
I also have this checkerboard problem in Chrome.
I change the backend from default to OpenGL,But when I watch a Video,from the taskmanager,the video decode is always zero,Does this mean GPU no longer decode the video?
I haven't tried this method:add these arguments to "Target" field of the chrome shortcut.
OS: Win11 beta 22635.2700,hags activated.
GPU:4070Ti,driver is 546.17 11/14/2023.
If Microsoft should fix this bug,I think this bug will last for a long time,because I use the beta Win11 OS for almost two years,it has not been fixed.