Ryzen Owners Zen Garden

[Athlonite]

When i flash mine, on the 1st boot it always a black screen and of course you wait and wait just in case but it just stays black, a little nerve racking for sure. and to get it to boot right you have to do the cmos battery again.

Yeah that is something that should not be needed when you flash the bios all settings from the previous version should be lost as the new file only has the default settings come with it

 

[AsRock]

I'd consider picking one up for $280. Is this a special going on somewhere, or a local sale?



The 5800x3d kicked the crap out of the 5950x for gaming.

I am just going by his specs, is that the case gaming wise with a RX6750 ?. Sure there might be with some CPU bound but.

 

[Nordic]

I am just going by his specs, is that the case gaming wise with a RX6750 ?. Sure there might be with some CPU bound but.

You normally would not be wrong about my gpu needing to be upgraded first. I just upgraded to the 6750 last fall. What you don't know is that the one game is an unoptimized early alpha and benefits dramatically from the additional cache. 30% more cpu performance is great when the game is incredibly cpu bound. At my resolution of 1080p my 6750 is a bit overkill for every game I play.

Going from a 5950x to a 5800x3d should increase my fps from approximately 30 to 40. That would be worth it to me.

 

[Mussels]

I can get a 5800x3d for $280 right now. I am going to buy it and see if that 30% in my one game with low performance actually improves 30%. If the performance is really that good I will sell the 5950x.

You probably will - dealt with someone else with the same motherboard as you and he had issues with VRM heat, and the lower wattage x3D solved it

He went back to his 5950x and we re-created it with a bunch of different PBO settings and found that with CPU only load he was fine, but when GPU and NVME (more load on PCI-E power?) were all active at once, he got stuttering issues unless things were capped down <120W (It was mostly the EDC and TDC that seemed to be the issues, but i honestly forgot those values)


My x3D stomped my 5800x, just like it stomped my 3700x. The difference is really, really large if you arent GPU limited - and that really shows up in some titles (SC2 is a massive one here, seeing no dips at all is insane when you're doing 4v4 matches late game)

I am just going by his specs, is that the case gaming wise with a RX6750 ?. Sure there might be with some CPU bound but.

people always have a way to confuse themselves on this, you get told you'll see no difference at low res, high res, weak GPU, fast GPU - it's such a large difference in the minimums, with a reasonable boost to the maximums too

It's because that extra cache changes things, it's not like throwing a few hundred MHz on the same CPU Design - it's getting the data out much much faster from that cache, so you get greatly improved minimums even on -perhaps especially on- weaker hardware.
Like how suddenly they dont care about C18 ram vs C14 ram - it's suddenly more tolerant of slowdowns anywhere else in the setup

 

[Badgerz]

Does anyone have any experience with a piece of software called Fan Control?

yes i have been struggling with fancontrol for quite a while, it works differently on different motherboards/CPUs, pain in the butt, but if you use Linux, not much choices out there, but i am open to new ones if anyone has any suggestions.

 

[Mussels]

yes i have been struggling with fancontrol for quite a while, it works differently on different motherboards/CPUs, pain in the butt, but if you use Linux, not much choices out there, but i am open to new ones if anyone has any suggestions.

PWM fan hub to a single mobo header, all settings in motherboard BIOS. Only works well with matching fans, of course.

I've been using my corsair commander pro since it rememberd the previously set setting internally and survived reboots for static fan speeds, but the ports have begun blowing out.

 

[AsRock]

You probably will - dealt with someone else with the same motherboard as you and he had issues with VRM heat, and the lower wattage x3D solved it

He went back to his 5950x and we re-created it with a bunch of different PBO settings and found that with CPU only load he was fine, but when GPU and NVME (more load on PCI-E power?) were all active at once, he got stuttering issues unless things were capped down <120W (It was mostly the EDC and TDC that seemed to be the issues, but i honestly forgot those values)


My x3D stomped my 5800x, just like it stomped my 3700x. The difference is really, really large if you arent GPU limited - and that really shows up in some titles (SC2 is a massive one here, seeing no dips at all is insane when you're doing 4v4 matches late game)


people always have a way to confuse themselves on this, you get told you'll see no difference at low res, high res, weak GPU, fast GPU - it's such a large difference in the minimums, with a reasonable boost to the maximums too

It's because that extra cache changes things, it's not like throwing a few hundred MHz on the same CPU Design - it's getting the data out much much faster from that cache, so you get greatly improved minimums even on -perhaps especially on- weaker hardware.
Like how suddenly they dont care about C18 ram vs C14 ram - it's suddenly more tolerant of slowdowns anywhere else in the setup

Not saying he's wrong but worth while ?.

You normally would not be wrong about my gpu needing to be upgraded first. I just upgraded to the 6750 last fall. What you don't know is that the one game is an unoptimized early alpha and benefits dramatically from the additional cache. 30% more cpu performance is great when the game is incredibly cpu bound. At my resolution of 1080p my 6750 is a bit overkill for every game I play.

Going from a 5950x to a 5800x3d should increase my fps from approximately 30 to 40. That would be worth it to me.

Well one thing for sure is that you don't need 12 cores for gaming so if you don't need those why not. And maybe you will be lucky to get 10%. A chance to get a little money back and a win win for some other games to boot.

You sure the GPU iis not the limiting factor ?, you checked ?.

 

[Ruru]

I don't want to start a new thread so I'm asking here. Which is a wiser choice as I'm upgrading from R5 3600; 5700X or 5800X3D? I have a RX 6700 XT and I'm gaming at 4K60.

 

[Veseleil]

I don't want to start a new thread so I'm asking here. Which is a wiser choice as I'm upgrading from R5 3600; 5700X or 5800X3D? I have a RX 6700 XT and I'm gaming at 4K60.

I have/had the same dilemma for some time. I'm strongly biased towards the 5800x3d, even though it's 150eur more over the 5700x price in my country.

 

[Ruru]

I have/had the same dilemma for some time. I'm strongly biased towards the 5800x3d, even though it's 150eur more over the 5700x price in my country.

I could get an used one for 300EUR. Not bad?

 

[Mahboi]

I could get an used one for 300EUR. Not bad?

It's good, even for 350€ I'd say it's good.
However I really don't think that a 6700 xt for 4K60 is even close to realistic.

 

[Ruru]

It's good, even for 350€ I'd say it's good.
However I really don't think that a 6700 xt for 4K60 is even close to realistic.

I don't play newer games on maximum settings as the card isn't capable. Med-high (not ultra) and if needed, I use FSR. For example, RE4 remake runs about 50-60fps and those little dips are fine as I have freesync. And of course raytracing is disabled always.

 

[Veseleil]

I could get an used one for 300EUR. Not bad?

Since I can get it ~400€ new, I would probably take used one for 300€ under warranty.

 

[Ruru]

Since I can get it ~400€ new, I would probably take one for 300€ under warranty.

Sorry, this is in Finnish but a new one is cheaper. Though I still could save if I get the used one from my interwebz buddy.

 

[Mahboi]

For me it's a tie between 5900x and 5800x3D in terms of price and value.
But if your only big workload on the CPU is gaming, go for the x3D, it's being massively bought for a reason. Very worth it at 330€ IMO.

 

[Mussels]

Not saying he's wrong but worth while ?.

Going from VRM stuttering and erratic performance to a 20% higher max and the minimums simply never dropping?
Yes.

The ~48 hours i tested it with my GTX1080 showed gains, despite the 5800x boosting to 5050MHz vs 4450MHz

 

[Ruru]

Going from VRM stuttering and erratic performance to a 20% higher max and the minimums simply never dropping?
Yes.

The ~48 hours i tested it with my GTX1080 showed gains, despite the 5800x boosting to 5050MHz vs 4450MHz

Whoa, with PBO or have you tuned it manually?

For me it's a tie between 5900x and 5800x3D in terms of price and value.
But if your only big workload on the CPU is gaming, go for the x3D, it's being massively bought for a reason. Very worth it at 330€ IMO.

And remember what I said, I can get an used one for 300EUR

 

[Mussels]

Whoa, with PBO or have you tuned it manually?

Thats PBO with +200 on the 5800x, can do 5.05Ghz low threaded and anywhere from 4.3GHz to 4.5GHz all core, depending on motherboard VRM's and honesty
(some are inaccurate with the settings, set 105W and get 120W so they clock higher, but run hotter)

From what i've seen asus clock the lowest of all the brands, but are the most accurate (and coldest) - but i also havent used the TUF line personally after seeing how bad some of them are, only the ROG/STRIX models. Gigabyte and MSI were the least honest but it helped them win "stock" benchmarks

The x3D i can keep at 4450 all the time, but i cant clock it higher than that. Be nice to be able to try, with voltage/amperage limiters for safety. Right now undervolting just gets me that sweet spot of maxing out clocks no matter the load.

 

[Ruru]

Thats PBO with +200 on the 5800x, can do 5.05Ghz low threaded and anywhere from 4.3GHz to 4.5GHz all core, depending on motherboard VRM's and honesty
(some are inaccurate with the settings, set 105W and get 120W so they clock higher, but run hotter)

From what i've seen asus clock the lowest of all the brands, but are the most accurate (and coldest) - but i also havent used the TUF line personally after seeing how bad some of them are, only the ROG/STRIX models. Gigabyte and MSI were the least honest but it helped them win "stock" benchmarks

The x3D i can keep at 4450 all the time, but i cant clock it higher than that. Be nice to be able to try, with voltage/amperage limiters for safety. Right now undervolting just gets me that sweet spot of maxing out clocks no matter the load.

Noice! I suppose that it's fast as hell in games which aren't that multi-threaded so they benefit such high clocks?

 

[tabascosauz]

Noice! I suppose that it's fast as hell in games which aren't that multi-threaded so they benefit such high clocks?

Games that *actually* prefer clocks over cache are very rare, and usually very old. Often times Vcache either makes no difference, or a massive difference (try something like 90 vs 150fps in Insurgency Sandstorm in cluttered scenes).

Either way, the 5800X3D is just better prepared for anything that comes down the line.

A couple months ago I could see the 5700X being a great deal. Now the X3D has come down significantly in price.

 

[Ruru]

Games that *actually* prefer clocks over cache are very rare, and usually very old. Often times Vcache either makes no difference, or a massive difference (try something like 90 vs 150fps in Insurgency Sandstorm in cluttered scenes).

A couple months ago I could see the 5700X being a great deal. Now the X3D has come down significantly in price.

Yeah, mostly. Though I'm still thinking of CSGO what it comes to popular games AND single-threaded ones.

 

[tabascosauz]

Yeah, mostly. Though I'm still thinking of CSGO what it comes to popular games AND single-threaded ones.

CSGO doesn't fall into the clock camp, it falls into the no-difference camp. 5800X and 5800X3D behave identically. Source 2 may change that, too early to tell.

As games start to use more cores, the avg fps gain will be less, but the 5800X3D brings to the table a noticeably improved user experience in general that will not be replicated by regular Vermeer parts. DCS is a great example - outside of VR there used to be minimal difference, but now the 5800X3D provides an absolute butter experience, on top of inherent gains from the multithreading openbeta update. Which, at the end of the day, should have been the reason for you to buy one in the first place - consistent fps, not max fps

If you have middling DDR4 and are not into OC, the 5800X3D is also a good choice.

 

[Mussels]

Good to see board makers learned their lessons on VRM design, and arent segmenting the market or anything (With the average board handling 65W CPUs only, and needing pay a ton more to get mid-tier VRMs)

I just went and googled for Starcraft II (being heavily single threaded, one for the game and one for the rendering) and found results with older GPUs to cover the upgrade pretty well

If you focus on "max FPS 4% faster" you see nothing, but that min FPS going up 58% is life changing

Having watched the HUB video now, jesus christ they did NOT learn a thing.
AMD are making it clear all their boards are universal, but hey - buy an A620 and you know it's for 65W chips.

But this mess? They need to reign these idiots in for ruining their image.

HUB is clear this is at an enforced 21C ambient and say the VRM's are a minimum of 10c hotter since they're the other side of the PCB, and that hotter climates - like mine that gets into the 40c range, these would go beyond overheating and just crash or die. at stock.

None of this had GPU heat added in either


B series boards shouldnt be treated as overclocking boards, but these are *stock settings*
Look at the wild clock speed differences from 4870Mhz through 5070MHz and 291W through 396W
The Vcore goes wild from 1.157v through 1.347v. At. Stock.
This shit is why people have nightmares with stuttering issues, and even dead CPUs because to win at benchmarks or save a penny, they just cut every corner possible and do not learn.

That asrock board at the top in red? Hardlocked 75c limit for the CPU, so it throttled performance massively. Altering that setting had this board in the middle of the pack with good VRM temps, so it's ironic the one board with a default limit is the one that didn't need it.

The Asus Prime are so bad they released a II series, which only runs colder by having lower default power limits throttling the performance. Wooo. Go asus.

Performance was wildly different between them all, and they cover how shite memory support was - the same CPU that worked fine on the other boards just couldnt on some of these.
That asrock board at the top of the thermals chart reported really high clock speeds, but that temperature throttle made it run like ass.

The performance difference between these boards sits around 5.5% - Clearly lower wattage gaming wont be as big right?

Oh wait, now its a 9.1% difference

These shitty ass basic bitch motherboards are enough to make a 7950x run worse than a zen3 CPU

 

[Ruru]

CSGO doesn't fall into the clock camp, it falls into the no-difference camp. 5800X and 5800X3D behave identically. Source 2 may change that, too early to tell.

As games start to use more cores, the avg fps gain will be less, but the 5800X3D brings to the table a noticeably improved user experience in general that will not be replicated by regular Vermeer parts. DCS is a great example - outside of VR there used to be minimal difference, but now the 5800X3D provides an absolute butter experience, on top of inherent gains from the multithreading openbeta update. Which, at the end of the day, should have been the reason for you to buy one in the first place - consistent fps, not max fps

If you have middling DDR4 and are not into OC, the 5800X3D is also a good choice.

Yeah, I got my 32GB kit about 2 years ago and it can still live on. And well, I don't see any actual benefits OC'ing a modern(-ish) AMD CPU, having PBO doing its magic is enough

 

[Nordic]

Not saying he's wrong but worth while ?.



Well one thing for sure is that you don't need 12 cores for gaming so if you don't need those why not. And maybe you will be lucky to get 10%. A chance to get a little money back and a win win for some other games to boot.

You sure the GPU iis not the limiting factor ?, you checked ?.

This one game is notoriously cpu heavy. Other people have shown dramatic gains doing similar cpu swaps. In my personal testing tested I have seen it waiting 6ms or more for the cpu and never waiting on the gpu at 1080p. If I use whatever super resolution software and set it to 1440p the gpu becomes limiting in some situations.

I got my 5950x for WCG crunching purposes. I don't need 16 cores although it is nice to have.

You probably will - dealt with someone else with the same motherboard as you and he had issues with VRM heat, and the lower wattage x3D solved i

I don't think I have been experiencing this. My vrm's don't seem to have a problem staying cool. Maybe because I have a bench case?