Windows 11 General Discussion

freeagent · Nov 2, 2021

For me it runs fine. Games fine, internets fine, but L3 is still very low. Not as pitiful as it was, but I should be approaching 1000GB/s in L3 performance in Aida, but I am in the lower to mid hundreds. I haven't run my 5600X with 11 yet, but I can say even that was getting higher numbers that what I am seeing now lol. Whatever.. I'm sure it will get fixed at some point.. I hope.

phanbuey · Nov 2, 2021

freeagent said:
For me it runs fine. Games fine, internets fine, but L3 is still very low. Not as pitiful as it was, but I should be approaching 1000GB/s in L3 performance in Aida, but I am in the lower to mid hundreds. I haven't run my 5600X with 11 yet, but I can say even that was getting higher numbers that what I am seeing now lol. Whatever.. I'm sure it will get fixed at some point.. I hope.

I thought they fixed it?
Ryzen Is Fixed! Windows 10 VS Windows 11 (282 Patch) - YouTube

Did you turn off VBS (bcdedit /set hypervisorlaunchtype off)?
Windows 11 vs. Windows 10: Gaming, Application & Storage Benchmarks - YouTube

freeagent · Nov 2, 2021

phanbuey said:
I thought they fixed it?
Ryzen Is Fixed! Windows 10 VS Windows 11 (282 Patch) - YouTube

Did you turn off VBS?
Windows 11 vs. Windows 10: Gaming, Application & Storage Benchmarks - YouTube

I may have to look into that.. but no I didn’t turn anything off other than spread spectrum :oops:

phanbuey · Nov 2, 2021

freeagent said:
I may have to look into that.. but no I didn’t turn anything off other than spread spectrum

That's probably what's crushing FPS -- same thing happened to me on intel - it's virtualizing the kernel by default so there's all that extra overhead for gaming.

R-T-B · Nov 2, 2021

MxPhenom 216 said:
Hows Win 11 been for those of you with Ryzen systems? I know a bunch of updates have come from Microsoft and AMD fixing the L3 cache problem.

Honestly? Fine. Even without the patch. With the patch even more fine, because benchmarks look correct.

Mussels · Nov 2, 2021

phanbuey said:
I thought they fixed it?
Ryzen Is Fixed! Windows 10 VS Windows 11 (282 Patch) - YouTube

Did you turn off VBS (bcdedit /set hypervisorlaunchtype off)?
Windows 11 vs. Windows 10: Gaming, Application & Storage Benchmarks - YouTube

Wait, whats the details on this?
I only just turned virtualisation on to test something else, is that what its about?

phanbuey · Nov 2, 2021

Mussels said:
Wait, whats the details on this?
I only just turned virtualisation on to test something else, is that what its about?

So short version is if you turn on Virtualization in your bios Windows 11 automatically enables Virtualization Based Security (VBS) on a fresh install (you can see if it's running in system info). In later versions of windows 10 this happened if you installed Hyper V, then VBS and some other background virtualization would turn on.

This basically eliminates anywhere from 0-15% FPS in games, robs you of some cache and CPU performance, and basically adds an additional layer of overhead -- for example for me, shadow of the Tomb raider goes from 152FPS min and 160FPS 5% lows to 132 FPS min and 142 5% lows, losing about 10FPS on average at 1080P with just that one setting.

Basically anyone that runs WSL2/VMS/Docker and games on the same system is automatically virtualizing their Kernel and has been for a while -- so the trick is to keep your VMs running just disable the Hyper V auto start with that bcdedit command in powershell and start all of your VMs explicitly (i use virtualbox -- works great).

Windows 11 with VBS is extra painful because it also enables all of the memory integrity and control flow options along with this, and babysits memory IO as the game is running. Disabling all of these things feels like a mini processor upgrade.

Mussels · Nov 2, 2021

phanbuey said:
So short version is if you turn on Virtualization in your bios Windows 11 automatically enables Virtualization Based Security (VBS) on a fresh install (you can see if it's running in system info). In later versions of windows 10 this happened if you installed Hyper V, then VBS and some other background virtualization would turn on.

This basically eliminates anywhere from 0-15% FPS in games, robs you of some cache and CPU performance, and basically adds an additional layer of overhead -- for example for me, shadow of the Tomb raider goes from 152FPS min and 160FPS 5% lows to 132 FPS min and 142 5% lows, losing about 10FPS on average at 1080P with just that one setting.

Basically anyone that runs VMS/Docker and games on the same system is automatically virtualizing their Kernel and has been for a while -- so the trick is to keep your VMs running just disable the Hyper V auto start with that bcdedit command in powershell and start all of your VMs explicitly (i use virtualbox -- works great).

See i turned that on and installed Hyper-V today to test something, fortunately it didnt enable those things for me - they were off by default

phanbuey · Nov 2, 2021

Mussels said:
See i turned that on and installed Hyper-V today to test something, fortunately it didnt enable those things for me - they were off by default

Best way to test is to turn off Virtualization in the Bios - run a benchmark (SOTR trial works great), then turn it back on and run the bench again - if you see 10-15FPS drop in the CPU game column you know they got turned on in the background.

R-T-B · Nov 2, 2021

For fun, AMD 5800X with DDR-3200 Samsung C-Die with 8ranks AIDA64 cachemem benchmark with VBS on/off

off:

on:

lexluthermiester · Nov 2, 2021

Flanker said:
Was all smooth, except the snip and sketch tool broke lol

That's one of the first things I uninstall. No big loss IMO.

Flanker said:
Thankfully I don't need to do screenshots too often.

Buttons on your keyboard: Shift + PrintScreen(likely just Prt Scr). Then open up Paint or whatever image editor you prefer and paste or hit Ctrl + V.

R-T-B said:
For fun, AMD 5800X with DDR-3200 Samsung C-Die with 8ranks AIDA64 cachemem benchmark with VBS on/off

Unless VBS is needed it needs to be off by default. Most users don't need VBS.

Mussels · Nov 2, 2021

Whats wrong with Win+shift+S?

Works for me on 10 and 11, and always has?

Chomiq · Nov 2, 2021

Is there an option to turn on small taskbar icons in W11? From the screenshot I saw it looks like you can only use big icons which means it's going to take a lot of desktop real estate when paired with <=FHD screens.

lexluthermiester · Nov 2, 2021

Mussels said:
Whats wrong with Win+shift+S?

What does that do? I just tried it, did nothing..

Splinterdog · Nov 2, 2021

lexluthermiester said:
What does that do? I just tried it, did nothing..

On Win 10 it's for taking a screenshot using Snip.

phanbuey · Nov 2, 2021

R-T-B said:
For fun, AMD 5800X with DDR-3200 Samsung C-Die with 8ranks AIDA64 cachemem benchmark with VBS on/off

off:

View attachment 223326

on:

View attachment 223327

Can u run cpu queen virtualization on / off in bios? I’m wondering if zen 3 has the same impact as intel.

it’s not only vbs there seem other components that get impacted and drain performance

windwhirl · Nov 2, 2021

Chomiq said:
Is there an option to turn on small taskbar icons in W11? From the screenshot I saw it looks like you can only use big icons which means it's going to take a lot of desktop real estate when paired with <=FHD screens.

I don't think there is. Not built-in at least.

There was this registry edit that could change that, but some are saying that it no longer works.

How to Change the Taskbar Size in Windows 11

You can get small, medium or large taskbar and icons.

www.tomshardware.com

phanbuey said:
Windows 11 with VBS is extra painful because it also enables all of the memory integrity and control flow options along with this,

Weird. I had to enable memory integrity manually last time I tested that. I guess Microsoft changed the default behavior later.

lexluthermiester said:
What does that do? I just tried it, did nothing..

Splinterdog said:
On Win 10 it's for taking a screenshot using Snip.

It has the same function on Windows 11.

lexluthermiester · Nov 2, 2021

Splinterdog said:
On Win 10 it's for taking a screenshot using Snip.

Ah. That wouldn't have worked for me as I was only ever running LTSB/LTSC. It seems that it also works the same in 11, but as I remove most of the built in apps... No big loss. Shift+PrtScr has worked fine for decades and will continue to do so.

windwhirl said:
There was this registry edit that could change that, but some are saying that it no longer works.

How to Change the Taskbar Size in Windows 11

You can get small, medium or large taskbar and icons.

www.tomshardware.com

They moved the registry entry. Use WinAeroTweaker to adjust taskbar size.

theFOoL · Nov 2, 2021

Snip tool is on the LTSC version

windwhirl · Nov 2, 2021

theFOoL said:
Snip tool is on the LTSC version

Eh, they were moving that to the Store too, so I'm not sure if it will remain as a standalone inside LTSC Windows for long.

theFOoL · Nov 2, 2021

windwhirl said:
Eh, they were moving that to the Store too, so I'm not sure if it will remain as a standalone inside LTSC Windows for long.

Only time will tell man. I can't see why they would...

I mean I have the store version on my WiN10 drive. Just new UI

lexluthermiester · Nov 2, 2021

theFOoL said:
Snip tool is on the LTSC version

I don't remember it being there, but then again, I might have removed it without a second thought...

theFOoL said:
I can't see why they would...

Because it's useless?

freeagent · Nov 3, 2021

R-T-B said:
For fun, AMD 5800X with DDR-3200 Samsung C-Die with 8ranks AIDA64 cachemem benchmark with VBS on/off

off:

View attachment 223326

on:

View attachment 223327

Mine is broken still.. that 229 moves around. Could be write or copy. Dammit Asus, AMD, whoever

Virtualization was disabled so idkwtf.

Its like when Apple downclocks your SOC.. great, thanks..

Wait.. I upgraded from 10.. not a clean install because I like it dirty. Should I try a clean install? Cleanliness is godliness right?

Edit:

Forgot the screen cap

lexluthermiester · Nov 3, 2021

freeagent said:
Should I try a clean install? Cleanliness is godliness right?

Couldn't hurt to give it a try. I've been seeing other issues with upgrades and as such have been recommending fresh installs as a general rule.

Edit: use a spare drive though.

Mussels · Nov 3, 2021

lexluthermiester said:
What does that do? I just tried it, did nothing..

It's the built in snipping tool for 10 and 11...

Processor	AMD R9 9900X
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Processor	AMD R9 9900X
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Video Card(s)	Zotac 4070 Ti Trinity OC @ 3045/1500
Storage	WD SN850 1TB, SN850X 2TB, 3x SN770 1TB
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Power Supply	Seasonic Vertex GX-1000, Monster HDP1800
Mouse	Logitech G502 Hero
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VR HMD	Oculus 3
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Memory	64GB DDR5 6600 1:2 CL36, FCLK 2200
Video Card(s)	RTX 4090 FE
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Power Supply	Corsair SF750
Mouse	DeathadderV2 X Hyperspeed
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Benchmark Scores	They're pretty good, nothing crazy.

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Windows 11 General Discussion

freeagent

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phanbuey

freeagent

Moderator

phanbuey

R-T-B

Mussels

Freshwater Moderator

phanbuey

Mussels

Freshwater Moderator

phanbuey

R-T-B

lexluthermiester

Mussels

Freshwater Moderator

Chomiq

lexluthermiester

Splinterdog

phanbuey

windwhirl

How to Change the Taskbar Size in Windows 11

lexluthermiester

How to Change the Taskbar Size in Windows 11

theFOoL

windwhirl

theFOoL

lexluthermiester

freeagent

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lexluthermiester

Mussels

Freshwater Moderator

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