Monday, May 10th 2021

Intel Core "Alder Lake-S" to Launch in November 2021

by
btarunr
 Discuss (21 Comments)
Intel's 11th Gen Core "Rocket Lake-S" could have a brief stint as the tip of Intel's desktop spear. Wccftech reports that its successor, the 12th Gen Core "Alder Lake-S," could launch by November 2021. The processor debuts on the new LGA1700 socket, and will introduce many firsts to the platform. The biggest change will be the heterogenous CPU core architecture. The top-spec "Alder Lake-S" is believed to be a 16-core/24-thread processor. From these, 8 will be larger high-performance cores, featuring HyperThreading, while the other 8 will be smaller high-efficiency cores. The chip is expected to be built on the 10 nm SuperFin process, and hence Intel is expected to significantly lower power draw of desktops when the machine is idling or handling lighter desktop loads.

Besides the major update to the CPU cores, "Alder Lake-S" is expected to continue featuring a Xe LP based integrated graphics solution. Significant changes with the I/O are expected, including DDR5 memory support with backwards compatibility for DDR4, and PCI-Express Gen 5.0. The LGA1700 socket is significantly different from the various LGA115x/LGA1200 sockets Intel has been pulling for its mainstream desktop platforms since 2009. It could trigger the need for new CPU coolers that support the socket.
Source: Wccftech

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21 Comments on Intel Core "Alder Lake-S" to Launch in November 2021

#1
BSim500
I've never liked this "Big/Little" mix simply because it can mess with older games & software that may have been hard-coded to request specific cores. Eg, say you have an old games that uses 2x cores and tries to force the use of Core "0" & "1" (expecting the same cores), and a 12th Gen is arranged 0 = Big, 1 = Little, 2 = Big, 3 = Little, etc, then you can end up with 1x big + 1x little cores (approx 1.3x big core equivalent overall) and worse performance vs the 2x big cores you'll get on a 6 generation old Skylake... Just improve the IPC, process node and stick with big cores.
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#2
Dyatlov A
I dont know how is this big small cores work with Windows 7. If not, than i go to MAC or i use AMD Zen 4 long as possible.
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#3
phanbuey
BSim500I've never liked this "Big/Little" mix simply because it can mess with older games & software that may have been hard-coded to request specific cores. Eg, say you have an old games that uses 2x cores and tries to force the use of Core "0" & "1" (expecting the same cores), and a 12th Gen is arranged 0 = Big, 1 = Little, 2 = Big, 3 = Little, etc, then you can end up with 1x big + 1x little cores (approx 1.3x big core equivalent overall) and worse performance vs the 2x big cores you'll get on a 6 generation old Skylake... Just improve the IPC, process node and stick with big cores.
It will need scheduler support and potential hiding of threads for legacy apps.
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#4
HD64G
Will launch and be sold only in ultra-expensive notebooks for at least a few months.
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#5
shadow3401
This could be Intel's Windows 8 moment whereby a product designed for the mobile segment is being forced onto desktop users with little to no benefit for desktop users.
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#6
ShurikN
HD64GWill launch and be sold only in ultra-expensive notebooks for at least a few months.
The "S" at the end means it's a desktop part.
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#7
Wirko
HD64GWill launch and be sold only in ultra-expensive notebooks for at least a few months.
Every rumour so far has mentioned Alder Lake and LGA1700 in the same sentence, so that's really unlikely at this point.

Intel is already stockpiling and binning the chips, they have mastered volume production at 10 nm (finally) (kind of). There will be enough of them for ultra-expensive desktops too.
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#8
ZoneDymo
BSim500I've never liked this "Big/Little" mix simply because it can mess with older games & software that may have been hard-coded to request specific cores. Eg, say you have an old games that uses 2x cores and tries to force the use of Core "0" & "1" (expecting the same cores), and a 12th Gen is arranged 0 = Big, 1 = Little, 2 = Big, 3 = Little, etc, then you can end up with 1x big + 1x little cores (approx 1.3x big core equivalent overall) and worse performance vs the 2x big cores you'll get on a 6 generation old Skylake... Just improve the IPC, process node and stick with big cores.
You are creating a scenario in your head and then that is your bases/proof to ask for something different?
Kinda...weird.
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#9
thegnome
BSim500I've never liked this "Big/Little" mix simply because it can mess with older games & software that may have been hard-coded to request specific cores. Eg, say you have an old games that uses 2x cores and tries to force the use of Core "0" & "1" (expecting the same cores), and a 12th Gen is arranged 0 = Big, 1 = Little, 2 = Big, 3 = Little, etc, then you can end up with 1x big + 1x little cores (approx 1.3x big core equivalent overall) and worse performance vs the 2x big cores you'll get on a 6 generation old Skylake... Just improve the IPC, process node and stick with big cores.
I'm pretty confident it'll be fixed quite quick like Ryzen got fixed with the multi-die setup. I'm also quite certain the little cores are fast enough for older games anyways. Supposedly as fast as Comet-Lake cores but I'm starting to doubt that.
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#10
qoonik
The new nuc's with Alder Lakes-s could be interesting .....
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#11
BSim500
ZoneDymoYou are creating a scenario in your head and then that is your bases/proof to ask for something different? Kinda...weird.
That's an extremely bizarre comment. There have indeed been games in the past that have been coded to addressed CPU cores directly. Eg, GOG had to create a special patch for The Saboteur to stop it crashing on CPU's with more than 4 threads. Same goes with other games that have performance slower with HT than without. Whatever though...
thegnomeI'm pretty confident it'll be fixed quite quick like Ryzen got fixed with the multi-die setup. I'm also quite certain the little cores are fast enough for older games anyways. Supposedly as fast as Comet-Lake cores but I'm starting to doubt that.
I thought "power saving" Gracemont cores were glorified Atom's (successor to 5-10w Tremont)? I doubt they'll be as fast as any "big" core. Given the choice I'd certainly prefer a proper 12C/24T vs a 8C/16T L + 8C/8T S hybrid with scheduler issues.
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#12
docnorth
I think there is enough time to achieve optimal core utilization, but still I could choose a 8-0-1 or 6-0-1 configuration (i.e. without "small" cores). It might be cheaper, I don't need the multi-multicore performance and can't wait much. 1H of 2022 I must build (or buy) a new office PC, right now it looks like Alder Lake, probably I won't have the time to wait for zen4.
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#13
Prima.Vera
BSim500I've never liked this "Big/Little" mix simply because it can mess with older games & software that may have been hard-coded to request specific cores. Eg, say you have an old games that uses 2x cores and tries to force the use of Core "0" & "1" (expecting the same cores), and a 12th Gen is arranged 0 = Big, 1 = Little, 2 = Big, 3 = Little, etc, then you can end up with 1x big + 1x little cores (approx 1.3x big core equivalent overall) and worse performance vs the 2x big cores you'll get on a 6 generation old Skylake... Just improve the IPC, process node and stick with big cores.
Relax. If that's the case, those old games are not using more than 8 cores anyways. Even today, more than 70% of the games are build with engines that use 4 cores only, so you're pretty safe. Just check the TPU's charts where an overclocked i5 beats almost any i7 or i9 in relatively older games.
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#14
Athlonite
And here I thought Intel didn't use glue and yet here they are goin hell for leather with the sticky shit
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#15
watzupken
I feel Intel's products are getting messed up. Where the big/little config would have benefitted mobile processors more, they are slapping it on their performance CPU for desktop. On the other hand, they are pushing Tiger Lake to their mobile CPU with increasingly higher opportunistic boost clockspeed which can only be detrimental to battery life and with minimal improvement to performance since the boost don't last long.
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#16
AnarchoPrimitiv
DDR5 isn't going to be a thing by the time this launches (as in legitimately affordable consumer options) , and motherboard manufacturers will have to choose whether there boards will use DDR5 or DDR4, so I feel like they'll choose DDR4 and this whole DDR5 thing will be vapor wear until AMD releases Zen4
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#17
Minus Infinity
HD64GWill launch and be sold only in ultra-expensive notebooks for at least a few months.
Huh, S is the desktop CPU, P is the laptop CPU, both are coming late this year.
BSim500That's an extremely bizarre comment. There have indeed been games in the past that have been coded to addressed CPU cores directly. Eg, GOG had to create a special patch for The Saboteur to stop it crashing on CPU's with more than 4 threads. Same goes with other games that have performance slower with HT than without. Whatever though...


I thought "power saving" Gracemont cores were glorified Atom's (successor to 5-10w Tremont)? I doubt they'll be as fast as any "big" core. Given the choice I'd certainly prefer a proper 12C/24T vs a 8C/16T L + 8C/8T S hybrid with scheduler issues.
it has been reported by Intel sources the Gracemont cores have about 2/3rds the peformance of a Skylake core, so are quite decent.
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#18
HansRapad
I heard that the Little core is as fast as Skylake Core, while the big core is 20% IPC more than the current TGL IPC

if this to be true, then it's surely can compete
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#19
Frank_100
Dyatlov AI dont know how is this big small cores work with Windows 7. If not, than i go to MAC or i use AMD Zen 4 long as possible.
If you are going to dump windows may I suggest linux.

OpenSuse or Fedora.
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#20
1d10t
Rocket Lake launch was tainted with a lot BIOS bugs, I can imagine this launch will be even more chaotic.
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#21
Athlonite
Dyatlov AI dont know how is this big small cores work with Windows 7. If not, than i go to MAC or i use AMD Zen 4 long as possible.
Why do people keep expecting new hardware to perfectly perform on an old outdated OS just beggars belief my dog man update the OS and be happy with a better environment for your hardware
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