Honestly almost more interested to see how the xx60 segment will shake out next gen.

High end is kinda boring since it will be a one horse race (that I'd never buy anyway) and "performance" segment looks like it will revolve around 7900xt performance.

But the "mid-range" xx60 segment is kinda spicy with the introduction of Intel's B580 cards (impossible though they are to find right now), potentially acting as a spoiler for the 5060 and 9060 cards on a whole bunch of fronts (price/performance/RAM)...

Good to see movement

Since these new gpus are toping at around 7900xt levels, i wonder if they are going to stop producing the 7900xtx?

If not, maybe cut the prices and keep selling them for another year, until rdna5 or udna is released?

If it does compete with the 5070, even at a more expensive price, I will buy it. I am glad they are still around and hanging on to allow a viable option to Nvidia. My question mark is about the FSR4.

GodisanAtheistBut the "mid-range" xx60 segment is kinda spicy with the introduction of Intel's B580 cards

Not really. The shift is very subtle since B580 just barely outclasses its direct competition, also still being a raw product that needs a lot of love to reach its final form. Wonder if Celestial will still be plagued with various game breaking bugs that'll disallow you from enjoying older titles, or even newer ones. It's no picnic for Intel, they're working their butts off but this isn't over yet.
5060 is likely to be just a couple inches more profound I guess. I don't think it'll be significantly faster than 4060 Ti. If ever. AMD are apparently in the termnial state of "we don't care for gaming GPU market" so I won't be surprised if 9060, or whatever name the 5060's pricemate will get, will be give or take 1% faster on average, trailing leagues behind in power efficiency, for essentially the same money. Or anything even more NVIDIA favouring.

B580 is only alive till then, dead or discounted either way thereafter. 5060 will be something like "the other options are even worse anyway" and 9060 series will receive the next level of detestment: it'll just be ignored by everybody. "Whatevs, it's an AMD GPU. Can't be less exciting than that."

AMD's fine wine is just regular milk. I don't see a reason to be excited.
4 years ago, 6700 XT traded blows with 3070/2080 Ti.
Today, it trails behind 3060 Ti.

The mid range is a lot more exciting than any of the high end cards, high end prices are just out of control IMO.
Also nice if Navi44 does have a sku under $300, there really needs to be some better price/performance gpu's.

eidairaman1Good to see movement

No offence, but this movement is long overdue! So long, that AMD had to release the cards at CES. Not ramp f*ckin production, in february. AMD behaves, like they are doing regular generational change, and have selling parity with nVidia. AMD has barely any SKUs to suggest. Yet they line up their announcements/releases with nVidia.
Such an idiocy. AMD should have pushed their boundaries, and try to release their mid end GPUs before both Intel, and nVidia. But this is just rubbish.

Neo_MorpheusSince these new gpus are toping at around 7900xt levels, i wonder if they are going to stop producing the 7900xtx?

If not, maybe cut the prices and keep selling them for another year, until rdna5 or udna is released?

Maybe. Would be perfect for me personally. 7900xt with better VRAM and bandwidth, and vastly improved thermal and power efficiency. The only big suspicion is, that AMD might sell these 7900xt rivals, for the 7900xt launch MSRP. Or at least sell overpriced stock to their partners.

However, 7900GRE, which seems should have been made in much greater amounts, is already EOL globally, with no inventory to be replenished. I guess the entire MCM, or at least 7900 stack is waiting the same end soon, if not already. That's obvious. Why make inferior SKUs if new ones are almost there.

Hecate91The mid range is a lot more exciting than any of the high end cards, high end prices are just out of control IMO.
Also nice if Navi44 does have a sku under $300, there really needs to be some better price/performance gpu's.

It should be well under $300. There's nothing in these xx50/xx60/or even xx70 cards from nV and AMD (in particular) to be worth even $250, inflation included. They have half PCIE lines, the bus is rubbish, the chips are repurposed bins, the PCB, that has barely any phases, and coolers, that top at $20-$50 at max.

Neo_Morpheusi wonder if they are going to stop producing the 7900xtx?

I would argue it is unlikely. The 7900 XTX has a very high BoM cost generally incompatible with its inconsistent sale price, and they can use their inventory of Navi 31 chips to produce high margin W7900 professional GPUs, which will no doubt sell well to the AI crowd with their 48 GB of memory and advancing ROCm/HIP support, which isn't quite there yet for consumer cards.

Even though the 9070 XT's performance is slated to be somewhere between 7900 GRE and 7900 XT, it will slot in its place relatively easily as its strengths are what AMD buyers tend to value the most, that is, lower cost and lower power consumption. The improvements to critical areas like the media engine and ray accelerators should also make the 7900 XTX largely irrelevant, anyone who wants more performance than this will have on tap is going to buy Nvidia anyways.

Random_UserNo offence, but this movement is long overdue! So long, that AMD had to release the cards at CES. Not ramp f*ckin production, in february. AMD behaves, like they are doing regular generational change, and have selling parity with nVidia. AMD has barely any SKUs to suggest.

This is the one thing I won't fault them for. The RTX 50 series also won't have broad availability on launch day.

All in all, if they manage to pull a launch with no glaring problems (it will be a first in many years), the 9070 XT might turn out to be well-received, especially if they actually reach the performance level of the 7900 XT or 4070 Ti Super for the right price and with a lower system footprint.

Dr. DroI would argue it is unlikely. The 7900 XTX has a very high BoM cost generally incompatible with its inconsistent sale price, and they can use their inventory of Navi 31 chips to produce high margin W7900 professional GPUs, which will no doubt sell well to the AI crowd with their 48 GB of memory and advancing ROCm/HIP support, which isn't quite there yet for consumer cards.

Even though the 9070 XT's performance is slated to be somewhere between 7900 GRE and 7900 XT, it will slot in its place relatively easily as its strengths are what AMD buyers tend to value the most, that is, lower cost and lower power consumption. The improvements to critical areas like the media engine and ray accelerators should also make the 7900 XTX largely irrelevant, anyone who wants more performance than this will have on tap is going to buy Nvidia anyways.



This is the one thing I won't fault them for. The RTX 50 series also won't have broad availability on launch day.

All in all, if they manage to pull a launch with no glaring problems (it will be a first in many years), the 9070 XT might turn out to be well-received, especially if they actually reach the performance level of the 7900 XT or 4070 Ti Super for the right price and with a lower system footprint.

Yeah! Good points.

The media/convertion is one of the biggest flaws of AMD, for years. They lost so big userbase- people were buying 3060 over 6700XT/7700XT, just because it had a coding/streaming advantage, over AMD higher tier cards. Which is shame.

This is the result of AMD investing for years only into the most profitable areas. They should pump R&D cash into RTG, to make it decent rival, at each point and angle. And only then, they might be able to enjoy the benefits and fat margins, depending on the amount of efforts done.

But still, not launching earlier, because the almost-three-billion-bucks company decided to wait, is kinda dumb. They should undercut nVidia at every point. And now even Intel has sold their entire B580 stock, already.

The article right after:
www.techpowerup.com/330408/nvidia-plans-geforce-rtx-5080-blackwell-availability-on-january-21-right-after-ces-announcement

The 9070 XT can't come at a moment too soon.

Macro DeviceAMD's fine wine is just regular milk. I don't see a reason to be excited.
4 years ago, 6700 XT traded blows with 3070/2080 Ti.
Today, it trails behind 3060 Ti.

Techpowerup recently changed their test suite and it's missing 1% low information. As an RTX3060TI user though,I find my RTX3060TI is running out of VRAM now and my mates RX6700XT isn't.Also,at least in the UK the RX6700XT and RX6750XT have been available for several times under £300 which is pretty much the B580 price in the UK. The 7700XT at one point was almost £300 and the 7800XT under £400.

Hope 9070XT can deliver something on this mid-high tier battles. We know its not going to win medals, but if it still has some extra horses under the hood or at least its fun to "play with " with good AIB support ...
i'm getting to that moment where i decided that this was the last time i spent so much money on a GPU ( 4090 ) and really need to focus on getting the most out of something more "down to earth" :)

mid range $300, they are trying to redefine the market. They did with the naming and they are doing with that classification.

Consumers: AMD please lower prices so you can be competitive
AMD: See we have cheaper high end and low end :D
Consumers: That's not what we asked for
AMD: why don't they buy my shit?

Bomby569mid range $300, they are trying to redefine the market. They did with the naming and they are doing with that classification.

Consumers: AMD please lower prices so you can be competitive
AMD: See we have cheaper high end and low end :D
Consumers: That's not what we asked for
AMD: why don't they buy my shit?

It's more like:

Consumers: AMD, please lower prices so you can be competitive.
AMD: *lowers prices $10 below Nvidia on every tier*
...
AMD: Why don't they buy my shit?

I hope this will change with the RX 9000 series, but based on the article, I have my doubts.

AusWolfIt's more like:

Consumers: AMD, please lower prices so you can be competitive.
AMD: *lowers prices $10 below Nvidia on every tier*
...
AMD: Why don't they buy my shit?

I hope this will change with the RX 9000 series, but based on the article, I have my doubts.

it's clear AMD wants to change that. They are making great efforts on the marketing side, changing names and classifications of what is high and mid end. There is no need to change pricing. /s

Bomby569it's clear AMD wants to change that. They are making great efforts on the marketing side, changing names and classifications of what is high and mid end. There is no need to change pricing. /s

They're really good at learning from Nvidia on that front, I have to admit. :laugh: :(

CAT-THE-FIFTHit's missing 1% low information

What are you even talking about?

CAT-THE-FIFTHmy RTX3060TI is running out of VRAM now and my mates RX6700XT isn't

My 6700 XT runs out of juice way before having more than 8 GB VRAM becomes a necessity. Either my RX 6700 XT is weird or you're playing games that don't care for the calculating power as much as they do for the VRAM size (meaning total outliers because with 99% games, it's the opposite).

Macro DeviceWhat are you even talking about?

My 6700 XT runs out of juice way before having more than 8 GB VRAM becomes a necessity. Either my RX 6700 XT is weird or you're playing games that don't care for the calculating power as much as they do for the VRAM size (meaning total outliers because with 99% games, it's the opposite).

Lots of my gaming mates have RX6700XT,RX6750XT,RTX3060,RTX3060TI and RTX3070 cards as most are mainstream gamers.Run games at 1080p and 1440p. CPUs include Core i5 10400,Core i5 12400,3600,5700X,7600 and 7800X3D on PCI-E 3,4 and 5 systems.Around a dozen examples in total from my last count.

Reviews don't show what happens in extended gameplay scenarios where game VRAM usage can increase or certain areas which are more VRAM heavy.Hardware Unboxed and others have shown this happen with modern game engines which reduce texture quality to maintain FPS.Reviewers use PCI-E 5 systems,which minimise the effects of texture spillover into system RAM.I noticed this going from a PCI-E 3.0 5700X system to a PCI-E 5.0 system - it was somewhat noticeable.

The Nvidia runs out of VRAM quicker than the AMD cards - lower 1% lows and more texture pop-ins. The mates with the 12GB cards can run higher quality textures - I have to drop textures and AA down a bit. It's similar to what my other mates with the 8GB Nvidia cards are also seeing.I actually own an RTX3060TI unlike you and so do mates.

So not sure why you are in disbelief that the 8GB is starting to be a problem. It is and I wouldn't touch an 8GB card with a bargepole in 2024,unless it was £200. The consoles have more accessible VRAM. People keep defending Nvidia putting low amounts of VRAM on its mainstream cards just like everyone defending Apple putting 8GB on it's entry level systems. This funny thread on Anandtech has been going on for years: forums.anandtech.com/threads/8gb-vram-not-enough-and-10-12.2595331/

If you want to upgrade to an 8GB card in 2025,then an RTX5060 has your name on it! :peace:

AusWolfIt's more like:

Consumers: AMD, please lower prices so you can be competitive.
AMD: *lowers prices $10 below Nvidia on every tier*
...
AMD: Why don't they buy my shit?

I hope this will change with the RX 9000 series, but based on the article, I have my doubts.

-AMD has done price wars in the past and all that happens is NV drops the price of their cards too and then everyone buys Nvidia anyway.

Happened with the 4870, happened with the 5700xt, and it will happen again with the 9070xt.

It's why the Halo product is so important, NV can always drop the price of the 5070/5060 to within $50 of whatever AMD/Intel are doing on the low end and crush them.

CAT-THE-FIFTHSo not sure why you are in disbelief that the 8GB is starting to be a problem.

It already is a problem, I never denied that. What I deny is that it's a game changer at this performance level. Vast majority of games still run better on RTX GPUs, DLSS is non-existent for AMD (and let's be real, I know from my experience with my AMD GPU how undesirable it is to use FSR; DLSS is at least somewhat OK looking), RT... welp, at this performance level it's irrelevant. Sure, one needs to disable some stuff but do the games look that worse on lower settings?

Oh btw, gotta check how the 3070 Ti fares. Curious to see if significantly higher VRAM speed does the trick. Last time I watched its reviews 8 GB VRAM was only starting its war on gaming experience (late '21). The reason is this GPU is constantly too expensive for what it offers so it's not interesting. 3080 goes for just sorry 40 dollars more. No brainer.

CAT-THE-FIFTHIf you want to upgrade to an 8GB card in 2025,then you should put your money where your mouth is and get one.

If I were to upgade from a 6700 XT my weapon of choice would definitely NOT be anything mentioned above. RTX 4090 at the very least. Can't be bothered with upgrades less significant than that.
However, I'd happily put a 3060 Ti in my second PC as it has an R9 380, 2 GB variant.

GodisanAtheist-AMD has done price wars in the past and all that happens is NV drops the price of their cards too and then everyone buys Nvidia anyway.

Happened with the 4870, happened with the 5700xt, and it will happen again with the 9070xt.

It's why the Halo product is so important, NV can always drop the price of the 5070/5060 to within $50 of whatever AMD/Intel are doing on the low end and crush them.

Yet AMD/ATI had much higher marketshare. Even in the period of the HD3870,they had more share when the 8800GT outclassed it. The reason is prebuilt sales. Laptop RTX4060 is the second most popular card on Steam.

Look at this release? AMD is using TSMC 4N and GDDR6 - they should have released it by November. Instead AMD just waits for Nvidia to launch and prices it a few percent lower with limited volume.

No system integrator can be bothered with AMD - Nvidia is not much more expensive and they can get reliable volumes on time.

Macro DeviceIt already is a problem, I never denied that. What I deny is that it's a game changer at this performance level. Vast majority of games still run better on RTX GPUs, DLSS is non-existent for AMD (and let's be real, I know from my experience with my AMD GPU how undesirable it is to use FSR; DLSS is at least somewhat OK looking), RT... welp, at this performance level it's irrelevant. Sure, one needs to disable some stuff but do the games look that worse on lower settings?

Oh btw, gotta check how the 3070 Ti fares. Curious to see if significantly higher VRAM speed does the trick. Last time I watched its reviews 8 GB VRAM was only starting its war on gaming experience (late '21). The reason is this GPU is constantly too expensive for what it offers so it's not interesting. 3080 goes for just sorry 40 dollars more. No brainer.

If I were to upgade from a 6700 XT my weapon of choice would definitely NOT be anything mentioned above. RTX 4090 at the very least. Can't be bothered with upgrades less significant than that.
However, I'd happily put a 3060 Ti in my second PC as it has an R9 380, 2 GB variant.

My experience the Nvidia advantage is in some specific Nvidia sponsored games - it goes both ways though.Many COD releases worked better on AMD cards! Texture quality or streaming bugs are noticeable. Whereas in 2021 when I got this card it was not such an issue,I can see the RTX3060TI increasingly on the edge. Once you start using features such as frame generation,raytracing,etc VRAM usage goes up or if you like modding games.

The RTX5060TI should be at least 12GB and be about RTX4070 performance. If it's RTX4070 performance it will be taking the mickey with 8GB. I hope they only release it when the 3GB GDDR7 modules are available.

9070 is midrange. AMD themselves said they are not releasing high-end cards. So marketing department is now calling 9070 "performance-segment"?

The RDNA 4 generation is driven mainly by two chips—the larger "Navi 48," and the smaller "Navi 44." The "Navi 48" will power the RX 9070 series, which are performance-segment and designed to compete with the NVIDIA GeForce RTX 5070 series; but cut-down variants of the chip are also expected to power certain upper mid-range SKUs that go up against the RTX 5060 series. The "Navi 44" chip is expected to power certain high performance/price SKUs in the mid-range, which AMD will use to target price-points well under the $300-mark. This segment is expected to heat up as NVIDIA has current-generation RTX 4060 series, Intel just made a stab with the Arc B580, and is expected to launch a faster Arc B700-series SKU based on a maxed-out "BMG-G21" silicon.

Baba9070 is midrange. AMD themselves said they are not releasing high-end cards. So marketing department is now calling 9070 "performance-segment"?

You can call it whatever you want to. It doesn't change what it is. Performance segment, mid-range, Übermensch class, hot garbage, whatever. It doesn't matter.

AusWolfIt's more like:

Consumers: AMD, please lower prices so you can be competitive.
AMD: *lowers prices $10 below Nvidia on every tier*
...
AMD: Why don't they buy my shit?

I hope this will change with the RX 9000 series, but based on the article, I have my doubts.

It's actually like:

Consumers: AMD please lower your prices
AMD: lowers prices to the point of having razor thin margins

Consumers: WTF why doesn't this GPU cost $100 like it was 2009? This is unfair! AMD GREED??!!!

Macro DeviceNot really. The shift is very subtle since B580 just barely outclasses its direct competition, also still being a raw product that needs a lot of love to reach its final form. Wonder if Celestial will still be plagued with various game breaking bugs that'll disallow you from enjoying older titles, or even newer ones. It's no picnic for Intel, they're working their butts off but this isn't over yet.
5060 is likely to be just a couple inches more profound I guess. I don't think it'll be significantly faster than 4060 Ti. If ever. AMD are apparently in the termnial state of "we don't care for gaming GPU market" so I won't be surprised if 9060, or whatever name the 5060's pricemate will get, will be give or take 1% faster on average, trailing leagues behind in power efficiency, for essentially the same money. Or anything even more NVIDIA favouring.

B580 is only alive till then, dead or discounted either way thereafter. 5060 will be something like "the other options are even worse anyway" and 9060 series will receive the next level of detestment: it'll just be ignored by everybody. "Whatevs, it's an AMD GPU. Can't be less exciting than that."

AMD's fine wine is just regular milk. I don't see a reason to be excited.
4 years ago, 6700 XT traded blows with 3070/2080 Ti.
Today, it trails behind 3060 Ti.

FineWine was always just AMD users coping over AMD leaving performance on the table from lack of optimization, sometimes for years. I'll never forget how proud Polaris users were that FineWine had finally made their 480s faster then the 1060, four years after launch when even the 3060 slapped them silly.

TheinsanegamerNIt's actually like:

Consumers: AMD please lower your prices
AMD: lowers prices to the point of having razor thin margins

Consumers: WTF why doesn't this GPU cost $100 like it was 2009? This is unfair! AMD GREED??!!!

Or like:

Customers: AMD please lower your prices.
AMD: *lowers prices*
Customers: Pff, what a piece of rubbish, Nvidia does RT so much better!