• Welcome to TechPowerUp Forums, Guest! Please check out our forum guidelines for info related to our community.

Why did we abandon hydrogen cars so quickly?

Joined
Nov 29, 2022
Messages
832 (1.12/day)
Processor Intel i7 77OOK
Motherboard Gigabyte Aorus something
Cooling Noctua NH-U12S dual fan
Memory Ballistix 32 Go
Video Card(s) MSI 3060 Gaming X
Storage Mixed bag of M2 SSD and SATA SSD
Display(s) MSI 34" 3440x1440 Artimys 343CQR
Case Old Corsair Obsidian something
Audio Device(s) Integrated
Power Supply Old Antec HCG 620 still running good
Mouse Steelseries something
Keyboard Steelseries someting too
Benchmark Scores bench ? no time to lose with bench ! :)
Remember, Honda have (had ?) an Hydrogen car too, the Clarity ...
So for Toyota/Yamaha to do it in 2023 is just silly; what exactly are they trying to prove? Until or unless they solve the containment problem, they might as well not bother.
Maybe it won't go far, they're trying ... Or something good will out from somewhere, for buses or trucks ...
They have a Hydrogen Corolla making some race in Japan :)
 

Space Lynx

Astronaut
Joined
Oct 17, 2014
Messages
17,371 (4.68/day)
Location
Kepler-186f
System Name Paladin
Processor 7800X3D -25 all core
Motherboard B650 Steel Legend
Cooling Frost Commander 140
Memory 32gb ddr5 (2x16) cl 30 6000
Video Card(s) Merc 310 7900 XT @3100 core -.75v
Storage KC3000 1TB
Display(s) Agon 27" QD-OLED Glossy 240hz 1440p
Case NZXT H710 (Red/Black)
Audio Device(s) Asgard 2, Modi 3, HD58X
Power Supply Corsair RM850x Gold
Mouse Naga X
Keyboard KBD Adam Lego Mech with MX Black
VR HMD Valve's Next Gen (TBD)
Software Linux Mint Cinnamon

new topic posted today

key quote from that article RIP... lol

"Currently, about 96% of the world’s hydrogen comes from coal (brown) and gas (grey), with the rest created from nuclear (pink) and renewable sources like hydro, wind and solar."
 

stinger608

Dedicated TPU Cruncher & Folder
Joined
Nov 11, 2008
Messages
11,215 (1.91/day)
Location
Wyoming
System Name Dean Machine/2020 Ryzenfall
Processor Intel 4790K/AMD Ryzen 5800X
Motherboard MSI 1150 Gaming mATX/Asus ROG STRIX B550-F Gaming Wifi
Cooling Cooler Master Hyper 212 LED/SilverStone AH240 AIO
Memory 16 gigs Crucial Ballistix Tactical Tracer/32 gigs G.Skill TridentZ NEO DDR4
Video Card(s) Gigabyte 1660 Super/EVGA GTX 1080 FTW Hybrid Gaming
Storage Crucial SSD 256 and 2TB spinner/Dual Samsung 980 Pro M2 NVME 4.0
Display(s) Overlord 27" 2560 x 1440
Case Corsair Air 540
Audio Device(s) On board
Power Supply Seasonic modular 850 watt Platinum/EVGA T2-850 Titanium
Software Windows 10 Pro/Windows 10 Pro
This is an interesting supercar powered by hydrogen.

 
Last edited:

Morgoth

Fueled by Sapphire
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
4,248 (0.67/day)
Location
Netherlands
System Name Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor 5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard aorus x570 pro
Cooling air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s) sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage 300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
Display(s) AOC display 1080p
Case SilverStone SST-CS380 V2
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply Corsair 850MX watt
Mouse corsair gaming mouse
Keyboard Microsoft brand
Software Windows 10 pro 64bit, Luxion Keyshot 7, fusion 360, steam
Benchmark Scores timespy 19 104
Hydrogen is far cleaner to the planet than Lithium batteries ever be. a single nuclear plant can produce 150.000 tons of hydrogen per year a single reactor last 6 years on its fuel rods before needs replacing
 

Space Lynx

Astronaut
Joined
Oct 17, 2014
Messages
17,371 (4.68/day)
Location
Kepler-186f
System Name Paladin
Processor 7800X3D -25 all core
Motherboard B650 Steel Legend
Cooling Frost Commander 140
Memory 32gb ddr5 (2x16) cl 30 6000
Video Card(s) Merc 310 7900 XT @3100 core -.75v
Storage KC3000 1TB
Display(s) Agon 27" QD-OLED Glossy 240hz 1440p
Case NZXT H710 (Red/Black)
Audio Device(s) Asgard 2, Modi 3, HD58X
Power Supply Corsair RM850x Gold
Mouse Naga X
Keyboard KBD Adam Lego Mech with MX Black
VR HMD Valve's Next Gen (TBD)
Software Linux Mint Cinnamon
Hydrogen is far cleaner to the planet than Lithium batteries ever be. a single nuclear plant can produce 150.000 tons of hydrogen per year a single reactor last 6 years on its fuel rods before needs replacing

how many tons are needed for x amount of Toyota Mirai's to run say an average of 15,000 miles per year? I suck at math.

anyways:


Mycobacterium smegmatis can literally turn hydrogen into electricity


as long as the tech keeps finding interesting things like this above, maybe we will finally see some magic happen so to speak
 

Morgoth

Fueled by Sapphire
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
4,248 (0.67/day)
Location
Netherlands
System Name Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor 5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard aorus x570 pro
Cooling air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s) sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage 300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
Display(s) AOC display 1080p
Case SilverStone SST-CS380 V2
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply Corsair 850MX watt
Mouse corsair gaming mouse
Keyboard Microsoft brand
Software Windows 10 pro 64bit, Luxion Keyshot 7, fusion 360, steam
Benchmark Scores timespy 19 104
how many tons are needed for x amount of Toyota Mirai's to run say an average of 15,000 miles per year? I suck at math.

anyways:


Mycobacterium smegmatis can literally turn hydrogen into electricity


as long as the tech keeps finding interesting things like this above, maybe we will finally see some magic happen so to speak
no clue. but since we need Electricity any way and solar and wind cant provide 24/7 baseload.. nuclear is the beter option. i asume once we have nuclearplants all over the planet. hydrogen production would be the least of our problems
 

Space Lynx

Astronaut
Joined
Oct 17, 2014
Messages
17,371 (4.68/day)
Location
Kepler-186f
System Name Paladin
Processor 7800X3D -25 all core
Motherboard B650 Steel Legend
Cooling Frost Commander 140
Memory 32gb ddr5 (2x16) cl 30 6000
Video Card(s) Merc 310 7900 XT @3100 core -.75v
Storage KC3000 1TB
Display(s) Agon 27" QD-OLED Glossy 240hz 1440p
Case NZXT H710 (Red/Black)
Audio Device(s) Asgard 2, Modi 3, HD58X
Power Supply Corsair RM850x Gold
Mouse Naga X
Keyboard KBD Adam Lego Mech with MX Black
VR HMD Valve's Next Gen (TBD)
Software Linux Mint Cinnamon
no clue. but since we need Electricity any way and solar and wind cant provide 24/7 baseload.. nuclear is the beter option. i asume once we have nuclearplants all over the planet. hydrogen production would be the least of our problems

I don't disagree with you:

 
Joined
Mar 21, 2021
Messages
5,108 (3.75/day)
Location
Colorado, U.S.A.
System Name CyberPowerPC ET8070
Processor Intel Core i5-10400F
Motherboard Gigabyte B460M DS3H AC-Y1
Memory 2 x Crucial Ballistix 8GB DDR4-3000
Video Card(s) MSI Nvidia GeForce GTX 1660 Super
Storage Boot: Intel OPTANE SSD P1600X Series 118GB M.2 PCIE
Display(s) Dell P2416D (2560 x 1440)
Power Supply EVGA 500W1 (modified to have two bridge rectifiers)
Software Windows 11 Home
no clue. but since we need Electricity any way and solar and wind cant provide 24/7 baseload.. nuclear is the beter option. i asume once we have nuclearplants all over the planet. hydrogen production would be the least of our problems

Unless battery technology catches up
 

Morgoth

Fueled by Sapphire
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
4,248 (0.67/day)
Location
Netherlands
System Name Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor 5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard aorus x570 pro
Cooling air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s) sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage 300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
Display(s) AOC display 1080p
Case SilverStone SST-CS380 V2
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply Corsair 850MX watt
Mouse corsair gaming mouse
Keyboard Microsoft brand
Software Windows 10 pro 64bit, Luxion Keyshot 7, fusion 360, steam
Benchmark Scores timespy 19 104
Unless battery technology catches up
doest matter. you going to glass the planet and build large ammount of wind farms in order to charge up those batteries
 
Joined
Mar 21, 2021
Messages
5,108 (3.75/day)
Location
Colorado, U.S.A.
System Name CyberPowerPC ET8070
Processor Intel Core i5-10400F
Motherboard Gigabyte B460M DS3H AC-Y1
Memory 2 x Crucial Ballistix 8GB DDR4-3000
Video Card(s) MSI Nvidia GeForce GTX 1660 Super
Storage Boot: Intel OPTANE SSD P1600X Series 118GB M.2 PCIE
Display(s) Dell P2416D (2560 x 1440)
Power Supply EVGA 500W1 (modified to have two bridge rectifiers)
Software Windows 11 Home
Don't need to cover a lot of area given that most home solar cells don't use the whole roof.
 

Morgoth

Fueled by Sapphire
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
4,248 (0.67/day)
Location
Netherlands
System Name Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor 5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard aorus x570 pro
Cooling air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s) sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage 300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
Display(s) AOC display 1080p
Case SilverStone SST-CS380 V2
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply Corsair 850MX watt
Mouse corsair gaming mouse
Keyboard Microsoft brand
Software Windows 10 pro 64bit, Luxion Keyshot 7, fusion 360, steam
Benchmark Scores timespy 19 104
yea but you seen wat china is doing? wat about apartments and skycrapers? doest have enoug roof area to provide solar power for the dwellers
 
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
5,847 (0.81/day)
Location
Ikenai borderline!
System Name Firelance.
Processor Threadripper 3960X
Motherboard ROG Strix TRX40-E Gaming
Cooling IceGem 360 + 6x Arctic Cooling P12
Memory 8x 16GB Patriot Viper DDR4-3200 CL16
Video Card(s) MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti Ventus 2X OC
Storage 2TB WD SN850X (boot), 4TB Crucial P3 (data)
Display(s) 3x AOC Q32E2N (32" 2560x1440 75Hz)
Case Enthoo Pro II Server Edition (Closed Panel) + 6 fans
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ 2 Platinum 760W
Mouse Logitech G602
Keyboard Razer Pro Type Ultra
Software Windows 10 Professional x64
solar and wind cant provide 24/7 baseload
They can, if used with pumped storage - an energy storage method that has existed for literally centuries.
doest matter. you going to glass the planet and build large ammount of wind farms in order to charge up those batteries
Rubbish.
yea but you seen wat china is doing? wat about apartments and skycrapers? doest have enoug roof area to provide solar power for the dwellers
There are these places called "deserts" where people don't live, but solar panels work great. Our planet has a lot of these places.
 

Count von Schwalbe

Nocturnus Moderatus
Staff member
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
3,136 (2.79/day)
Location
Knoxville, TN, USA
System Name Work Computer | Unfinished Computer
Processor Core i7-6700 | Ryzen 5 5600X
Motherboard Dell Q170 | Gigabyte Aorus Elite Wi-Fi
Cooling A fan? | Truly Custom Loop
Memory 4x4GB Crucial 2133 C17 | 4x8GB Corsair Vengeance RGB 3600 C26
Video Card(s) Dell Radeon R7 450 | RTX 2080 Ti FE
Storage Crucial BX500 2TB | TBD
Display(s) 3x LG QHD 32" GSM5B96 | TBD
Case Dell | Heavily Modified Phanteks P400
Power Supply Dell TFX Non-standard | EVGA BQ 650W
Mouse Monster No-Name $7 Gaming Mouse| TBD
Personally, I can't wait for Fusion to become available. Nuclear power without the ridiculous oversight required for Fission would be a hell of a lot cheaper, and much more sustainable too.
 

Morgoth

Fueled by Sapphire
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
4,248 (0.67/day)
Location
Netherlands
System Name Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor 5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard aorus x570 pro
Cooling air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s) sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage 300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
Display(s) AOC display 1080p
Case SilverStone SST-CS380 V2
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply Corsair 850MX watt
Mouse corsair gaming mouse
Keyboard Microsoft brand
Software Windows 10 pro 64bit, Luxion Keyshot 7, fusion 360, steam
Benchmark Scores timespy 19 104
They can, if used with pumped storage - an energy storage method that has existed for literally centuries.

Rubbish.

There are these places called "deserts" where people don't live, but solar panels work great. Our planet has a lot of these places.
making dams to hold water is eco destruction..
plastering the desert with solar panels is also a ecological destruction...
and having all the stuff in 1 place ist realy safe.. when it comes to terrorism or war. they can control the engergy.... just dumb...
and there are countrys that are flat that dont have hills for dams.....
1678574706827.png


Personally, I can't wait for Fusion to become available. Nuclear power without the ridiculous oversight required for Fission would be a hell of a lot cheaper, and much more sustainable too.
dont worry the anti nuclear party wil think of reasons to ban it to
 

Attachments

  • 278349234_5018582561589431_7813332585460627838_n.jpg
    278349234_5018582561589431_7813332585460627838_n.jpg
    161.8 KB · Views: 51

Count von Schwalbe

Nocturnus Moderatus
Staff member
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
3,136 (2.79/day)
Location
Knoxville, TN, USA
System Name Work Computer | Unfinished Computer
Processor Core i7-6700 | Ryzen 5 5600X
Motherboard Dell Q170 | Gigabyte Aorus Elite Wi-Fi
Cooling A fan? | Truly Custom Loop
Memory 4x4GB Crucial 2133 C17 | 4x8GB Corsair Vengeance RGB 3600 C26
Video Card(s) Dell Radeon R7 450 | RTX 2080 Ti FE
Storage Crucial BX500 2TB | TBD
Display(s) 3x LG QHD 32" GSM5B96 | TBD
Case Dell | Heavily Modified Phanteks P400
Power Supply Dell TFX Non-standard | EVGA BQ 650W
Mouse Monster No-Name $7 Gaming Mouse| TBD
making dams to hold water is eco destruction..
It can, but there are ways to mitigate that. The entire area around me is a net exporter of hydroelectricity, and it has actually generally improved the ecology by managing the water supply. Much less flooding and more stable rivers.

Lots of dams around me dating from the depression, but the areas they are built in are very steep, so little land is lost for a high capacity of water.

We also have a bunch of "micronuclear" around us - it seems much more economical than centralized nuclear.

It seems to me that more efficient nuclear would be a big benefit - currently the most promising nuclear tech I have seen is ~30% efficient. (X-energy modular system)

If there was a way to efficiently capture the energy wasted in cooling towers, even fossil plants would benefit greatly.

I haven't seen a thermal concentrating solar plant for a while, have those died or are they just not news-worthy anymore?
 
Joined
Jan 31, 2010
Messages
5,549 (1.02/day)
Location
Gougeland (NZ)
System Name Cumquat 2021
Processor AMD RyZen R7 7800X3D
Motherboard Asus Strix X670E - E Gaming WIFI
Cooling Deep Cool LT720 + CM MasterGel Pro TP + Lian Li Uni Fan V2
Memory 32GB GSkill Trident Z5 Neo 6000
Video Card(s) Sapphire Nitro+ OC RX6800 16GB DDR6 2270Cclk / 2010Mclk
Storage 1x Adata SX8200PRO NVMe 1TB gen3 x4 1X Samsung 980 Pro NVMe Gen 4 x4 1TB, 12TB of HDD Storage
Display(s) AOC 24G2 IPS 144Hz FreeSync Premium 1920x1080p
Case Lian Li O11D XL ROG edition
Audio Device(s) RX6800 via HDMI + Pioneer VSX-531 amp Technics 100W 5.1 Speaker set
Power Supply EVGA 1000W G5 Gold
Mouse Logitech G502 Proteus Core Wired
Keyboard Logitech G915 Wireless
Software Windows 11 X64 PRO (build 23H2)
Benchmark Scores it sucks even more less now ;)
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
12,476 (5.78/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
System Name Nebulon B
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Motherboard MSi PRO B650M-A WiFi
Cooling be quiet! Dark Rock 4
Memory 2x 24 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR5-4800
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6750 XT 12 GB
Storage 2 TB Corsair MP600 GS, 2 TB Corsair MP600 R2
Display(s) Dell S3422DWG, 7" Waveshare touchscreen
Case Kolink Citadel Mesh black
Audio Device(s) Logitech Z333 2.1 speakers, AKG Y50 headphones
Power Supply Seasonic Prime GX-750
Mouse Logitech MX Master 2S
Keyboard Logitech G413 SE
Software Bazzite (Fedora Linux) KDE
There are these places called "deserts" where people don't live, but solar panels work great. Our planet has a lot of these places.
There are several videos and articles about why populating our deserts with solar panels would be a bad idea, like this one:

TL;DW: Covering the hottest areas of the planet with black surfaces would have detrimental effects on average global temperatures.

dont worry the anti nuclear party wil think of reasons to ban it to
There is an anti-everything party, but if fusion is really the way, then governments will find ways to silence them.
 
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
5,847 (0.81/day)
Location
Ikenai borderline!
System Name Firelance.
Processor Threadripper 3960X
Motherboard ROG Strix TRX40-E Gaming
Cooling IceGem 360 + 6x Arctic Cooling P12
Memory 8x 16GB Patriot Viper DDR4-3200 CL16
Video Card(s) MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti Ventus 2X OC
Storage 2TB WD SN850X (boot), 4TB Crucial P3 (data)
Display(s) 3x AOC Q32E2N (32" 2560x1440 75Hz)
Case Enthoo Pro II Server Edition (Closed Panel) + 6 fans
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ 2 Platinum 760W
Mouse Logitech G602
Keyboard Razer Pro Type Ultra
Software Windows 10 Professional x64
making dams to hold water is eco destruction..
plastering the desert with solar panels is also a ecological destruction...
and having all the stuff in 1 place ist realy safe.. when it comes to terrorism or war. they can control the engergy.... just dumb...
and there are countrys that are flat that dont have hills for dams.....
View attachment 287420


dont worry the anti nuclear party wil think of reasons to ban it to
Ah yes, quoting as a source a website that is literally dedicated to spreading anti-green energy FUD while promoting nuclear energy.

Stop wasting my time with BS. While the anti-nuclear hysteria from so-called "green" parties has been disproportionate and harmful to ending the fossil fuel dependence, the fact of the matter is that nuclear had its opportunity and blew it. Dishonest pro-nuclear lobbying websites are not going to change that.

TL;DW: Covering the hottest areas of the planet with black surfaces would have detrimental effects on average global temperatures.
Do you know what else will have detrimental effects on average global temperatures, and in fact already is? Fossil fuels. It never ceases to amaze me how all these hand-wringing and hypothetical studies of how solar could be bad for the environment, continually ignore how bad continued reliance on fossil fuels is now.

There is an anti-everything party, but if fusion is really the way, then governments will find ways to silence them.
Please shut up with the conspiracy theory stupidity. No government is going to say no to a power source that is effectively limitless, effectively free, and requires zero dependency on other nations.
 

Count von Schwalbe

Nocturnus Moderatus
Staff member
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Messages
3,136 (2.79/day)
Location
Knoxville, TN, USA
System Name Work Computer | Unfinished Computer
Processor Core i7-6700 | Ryzen 5 5600X
Motherboard Dell Q170 | Gigabyte Aorus Elite Wi-Fi
Cooling A fan? | Truly Custom Loop
Memory 4x4GB Crucial 2133 C17 | 4x8GB Corsair Vengeance RGB 3600 C26
Video Card(s) Dell Radeon R7 450 | RTX 2080 Ti FE
Storage Crucial BX500 2TB | TBD
Display(s) 3x LG QHD 32" GSM5B96 | TBD
Case Dell | Heavily Modified Phanteks P400
Power Supply Dell TFX Non-standard | EVGA BQ 650W
Mouse Monster No-Name $7 Gaming Mouse| TBD
Please shut up with the conspiracy theory stupidity.
Give me 5 minutes, and I will find a group of people opposed to anything. Not really a conspiracy theory.
No government is going to say no to a power source that is effectively limitless, effectively free, and requires zero dependency on other nations.
Nope. But they will probably argue with each other over how to regulate it until everyone else has it and then they wonder what went wrong.
 

Morgoth

Fueled by Sapphire
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
4,248 (0.67/day)
Location
Netherlands
System Name Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor 5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard aorus x570 pro
Cooling air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s) sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage 300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
Display(s) AOC display 1080p
Case SilverStone SST-CS380 V2
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply Corsair 850MX watt
Mouse corsair gaming mouse
Keyboard Microsoft brand
Software Windows 10 pro 64bit, Luxion Keyshot 7, fusion 360, steam
Benchmark Scores timespy 19 104
Ah yes, quoting as a source a website that is literally dedicated to spreading anti-green energy FUD while promoting nuclear energy.

Stop wasting my time with BS. While the anti-nuclear hysteria from so-called "green" parties has been disproportionate and harmful to ending the fossil fuel dependence, the fact of the matter is that nuclear had its opportunity and blew it. Dishonest pro-nuclear lobbying websites are not going to change that.


Do you know what else will have detrimental effects on average global temperatures, and in fact already is? Fossil fuels. It never ceases to amaze me how all these hand-wringing and hypothetical studies of how solar could be bad for the environment, continually ignore how bad continued reliance on fossil fuels is now.


Please shut up with the conspiracy theory stupidity. No government is going to say no to a power source that is effectively limitless, effectively free, and requires zero dependency on other nations.
infact im even gona waste ur time even more with more bullshit than you can handle
this is your little solar farm looks like. no sun to engergy.
1678620096440.png

this it how it looks like after a heavy storm
1678620187132.png

now whos going to pay for that? where ur going to get power from? dont forget wind turbines burn down. wear down. and can't turn on heavy wind need to be parked..
and all that junk is going to turn up to a landfile....

No government is going to say no to a power source that is effectively limitless, effectively free, and requires zero dependency on other nations.
you said place it in a desert where no one lives. that makes other nations DEPENDENT on OTHER Nations
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
12,476 (5.78/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
System Name Nebulon B
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Motherboard MSi PRO B650M-A WiFi
Cooling be quiet! Dark Rock 4
Memory 2x 24 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR5-4800
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6750 XT 12 GB
Storage 2 TB Corsair MP600 GS, 2 TB Corsair MP600 R2
Display(s) Dell S3422DWG, 7" Waveshare touchscreen
Case Kolink Citadel Mesh black
Audio Device(s) Logitech Z333 2.1 speakers, AKG Y50 headphones
Power Supply Seasonic Prime GX-750
Mouse Logitech MX Master 2S
Keyboard Logitech G413 SE
Software Bazzite (Fedora Linux) KDE
Do you know what else will have detrimental effects on average global temperatures, and in fact already is? Fossil fuels. It never ceases to amaze me how all these hand-wringing and hypothetical studies of how solar could be bad for the environment, continually ignore how bad continued reliance on fossil fuels is now.
Did you see me arguing for the continued use of fossil fuels? No. All I said was populating the Sahara desert with solar panels is a bad idea. I never said there weren't any alternatives.

Watch the video before commenting.

Please shut up with the conspiracy theory stupidity. No government is going to say no to a power source that is effectively limitless, effectively free, and requires zero dependency on other nations.
I don't think I gave you a reason to be rude, so don't shut up me, okay? Besides, you just confirmed my exact point.
 
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
5,847 (0.81/day)
Location
Ikenai borderline!
System Name Firelance.
Processor Threadripper 3960X
Motherboard ROG Strix TRX40-E Gaming
Cooling IceGem 360 + 6x Arctic Cooling P12
Memory 8x 16GB Patriot Viper DDR4-3200 CL16
Video Card(s) MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti Ventus 2X OC
Storage 2TB WD SN850X (boot), 4TB Crucial P3 (data)
Display(s) 3x AOC Q32E2N (32" 2560x1440 75Hz)
Case Enthoo Pro II Server Edition (Closed Panel) + 6 fans
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ 2 Platinum 760W
Mouse Logitech G602
Keyboard Razer Pro Type Ultra
Software Windows 10 Professional x64
infact im even gona waste ur time even more with more bullshit than you can handle
this is your little solar farm looks like. no sun to engergy.
View attachment 287486
this it how it looks like after a heavy storm
View attachment 287487
now whos going to pay for that? where ur going to get power from? dont forget wind turbines burn down. wear down. and can't turn on heavy wind need to be parked..
and all that junk is going to turn up to a landfile....
Posting a random picture of a destroyed solar panel farm, without providing any sort of source for said picture, is not an argument. For all I know that's a picture of a solar farm after anti-progress yokels like yourself have been through it.

No government is going to say no to a power source that is effectively limitless, effectively free, and requires zero dependency on other nations.
you said place it in a desert where no one lives. that makes other nations DEPENDENT on OTHER Nations
We were talking about fusion power, dear. Do try to keep up.

Did you see me arguing for the continued use of fossil fuels? No. All I said was populating the Sahara desert with solar panels is a bad idea. I never said there weren't any alternatives.

Watch the video before commenting.
Sorry, let me rewind.

My comment about covering deserts with solar panels was a somewhat flippant response to the poster who was spreading FUD about how we don't have enough surface area for solar panels. They then compounded their FUD by posting a graphic purporting to show how much of the USA would need to be covered with solar and wind to satisfy the nation's energy needs - a graphic with zero information on how that area was calculated, from a website known to be anti-solar and anti-wind. That's not science, that's doubling down on FUD.

You then responded with a - completely valid - video about how covering the Sahara with solar panels is probably not a good idea. You and the video are completely correct and I agree completely! Just because we can do something, doesn't mean we should, and a lot of the trouble we're currently in in regards to the climate could and would have been avoided if we'd had a similar caution about basing our entire civilisation on hydrocarbons, as opposed to diversifying our energy sources long ago. It makes complete sense to learn that lesson and not proceed down a road that will have similarly negative consequences in future.

However, my point in regards to that video - which I admit was poorly communicated - is that I was circling back to the original anti-solar FUD from the other poster. Every time someone says "solar", about a million anti-solar pundits come out of the woodwork claiming that it won't work for about a trillion different reasons, most of which - like the original poster's "reason" - are complete and utter rubbish. But this FUD is exactly what the anti-nuclear lobby (whom I despise, by the way) used back in the 70s and 80s to essentially kill big nuclear, and I'm so very tired of things that are necessary for our world being pushed to the wayside because people are afraid of them for no good reason. That is all.

I don't think I gave you a reason to be rude, so don't shut up me, okay? Besides, you just confirmed my exact point.
Of course you did - conspiracy theories are the opposite of science and as such, have zero place in a thread discussing science.

Unless you were being flippant, in which case I apologise unreservedly.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2019
Messages
12,476 (5.78/day)
Location
Midlands, UK
System Name Nebulon B
Processor AMD Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Motherboard MSi PRO B650M-A WiFi
Cooling be quiet! Dark Rock 4
Memory 2x 24 GB Corsair Vengeance DDR5-4800
Video Card(s) AMD Radeon RX 6750 XT 12 GB
Storage 2 TB Corsair MP600 GS, 2 TB Corsair MP600 R2
Display(s) Dell S3422DWG, 7" Waveshare touchscreen
Case Kolink Citadel Mesh black
Audio Device(s) Logitech Z333 2.1 speakers, AKG Y50 headphones
Power Supply Seasonic Prime GX-750
Mouse Logitech MX Master 2S
Keyboard Logitech G413 SE
Software Bazzite (Fedora Linux) KDE
Sorry, let me rewind.

My comment about covering deserts with solar panels was a somewhat flippant response to the poster who was spreading FUD about how we don't have enough surface area for solar panels. They then compounded their FUD by posting a graphic purporting to show how much of the USA would need to be covered with solar and wind to satisfy the nation's energy needs - a graphic with zero information on how that area was calculated, from a website known to be anti-solar and anti-wind. That's not science, that's doubling down on FUD.

You then responded with a - completely valid - video about how covering the Sahara with solar panels is probably not a good idea. You and the video are completely correct and I agree completely! Just because we can do something, doesn't mean we should, and a lot of the trouble we're currently in in regards to the climate could and would have been avoided if we'd had a similar caution about basing our entire civilisation on hydrocarbons, as opposed to diversifying our energy sources long ago. It makes complete sense to learn that lesson and not proceed down a road that will have similarly negative consequences in future.

However, my point in regards to that video - which I admit was poorly communicated - is that I was circling back to the original anti-solar FUD from the other poster. Every time someone says "solar", about a million anti-solar pundits come out of the woodwork claiming that it won't work for about a trillion different reasons, most of which - like the original poster's "reason" - are complete and utter rubbish. But this FUD is exactly what the anti-nuclear lobby (whom I despise, by the way) used back in the 70s and 80s to essentially kill big nuclear, and I'm so very tired of things that are necessary for our world being pushed to the wayside because people are afraid of them for no good reason. That is all.
Ah, I see - fair enough. :) I suppose I didn't get the tone of your reply, so I apologise.

The key is, as always, balance, I guess. Different sources of power have different merits, and are suitable for different use cases. In this sense, the "let's just use fossils because they're cool" camp is equally wrong as the "everybody should go battery electric" camp, or the "nuclear = bad" camp, in my opinion. What's good for me isn't necessarily good for you. Fun fact, that with all the famous incidents of the past, nuclear is still one of the safest and environmentally friendliest sources of power when handled right. This is why I'm just as excited about fusion power as I am about hydrogen-powered cars.

Of course you did - conspiracy theories are the opposite of science and as such, have zero place in a thread discussing science.

Unless you were being flippant, in which case I apologise unreservedly.
I appreciate it, although I wasn't being flippant, nor was I theorising around conspiracies. My point was (meant to be) similar to yours, even if I didn't communicate it right: if fusion is the way forward (which I believe it is), then governments will and should find ways to convince (or silence) the anti-mob. As you said (or at least implied), people are anti-everything by nature, even in cases where change is measurably positive.
 
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
5,847 (0.81/day)
Location
Ikenai borderline!
System Name Firelance.
Processor Threadripper 3960X
Motherboard ROG Strix TRX40-E Gaming
Cooling IceGem 360 + 6x Arctic Cooling P12
Memory 8x 16GB Patriot Viper DDR4-3200 CL16
Video Card(s) MSI GeForce RTX 4060 Ti Ventus 2X OC
Storage 2TB WD SN850X (boot), 4TB Crucial P3 (data)
Display(s) 3x AOC Q32E2N (32" 2560x1440 75Hz)
Case Enthoo Pro II Server Edition (Closed Panel) + 6 fans
Power Supply Fractal Design Ion+ 2 Platinum 760W
Mouse Logitech G602
Keyboard Razer Pro Type Ultra
Software Windows 10 Professional x64
Ah, I see - fair enough. :) I suppose I didn't get the tone of your reply, so I apologise.

The key is, as always, balance, I guess. Different sources of power have different merits, and are suitable for different use cases. In this sense, the "let's just use fossils because they're cool" camp is equally wrong as the "everybody should go battery electric" camp, or the "nuclear = bad" camp, in my opinion. What's good for me isn't necessarily good for you. Fun fact, that with all the famous incidents of the past, nuclear is still one of the safest and environmentally friendliest sources of power when handled right. This is why I'm just as excited about fusion power as I am about hydrogen-powered cars.
Absolutely, and that is why I am so disgusted with the so-called "environmentalists" that blocked nuclear "on principle". If we'd built more nuclear and thus used less fossil fuels, the climate crisis probably wouldn't be a crisis, and we'd also have been in a much better place to address it via the simple act of building even more nuclear.

Even today, with nuclear power mostly being accepted by true environmentalists, there is still the idiotic NIMBY'ing over where to store the waste that is preventing the construction of more nuclear plants. Meanwhile the current plants are forced to store spent fuel on-site basically forever, which is a massive and unnecessary cost increase and a far greater risk than just storing it all in a single, secured, centralised location.

It never ceases to blow my mind how South Africa, the third-world country I was born in, has a nuclear waste storage program that has been working without issue for literally decades - yet the USA, the so-called greatest nation in the world, the one that literally invented nuclear power, simply cannot agree on selecting one of hundreds of thousands of disused deep mines shafts for the same. It boggles my mind.

Now, I will not disagree that there are problems with nuclear (and I do not consider spent fuel storage one of them) - in particular, the people in charge of running nuclear power stations have shown dangerous levels of incompetence (Three Mile Island and Fukishima - I'm purposefully ignoring the Soviet levels of incompetence at Chernobyl, because those levels of incompetence are something you can't really design against). This is something that can and should be addressed by wholly independent nuclear regulation agencies that have the budget and manpower to perform random inspections on a regular basis. Further, as the state of the art in terms of construction and safety around nuclear evolves, this same regulatory body should include scientists and engineers who are empowered to quite literally go into any NPP and force it to be shut down immediately because it is no longer safe according to new information (e.g. the wall height vs tsunami wave height at Fukushima). If we'd been building more nuclear plants, this wouldn't have an effect on the grid because we'd have more than enough of them for redundancy!

I appreciate it, although I wasn't being flippant, nor was I theorising around conspiracies. My point was (meant to be) similar to yours, even if I didn't communicate it right: if fusion is the way forward (which I believe it is), then governments will and should find ways to convince (or silence) the anti-mob. As you said (or at least implied), people are anti-everything by nature, even in cases where change is measurably positive.
Ah, then I doubly apologise for my offence towards you. And I think fusion is going to be very different to nuclear in this regard, because not only is it inherently fail-safe, the people involved in it have been very careful to control the media narrative to prevent any sort of anti-fusion hysteria from getting a grip. I'm sure you'll find that sort of FUD in the fringe publications, and I'm sure it'll start to leak into the mainstream once the first commercial fusion plants come online, but I think the marketing around fusion has been a lot better than fission was.
 

Morgoth

Fueled by Sapphire
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
4,248 (0.67/day)
Location
Netherlands
System Name Wopr "War Operation Plan Response"
Processor 5900x ryzen 9 12 cores 24 threads
Motherboard aorus x570 pro
Cooling air (GPU Liquid graphene) rad outside case mounted 120mm 68mm thick
Memory kingston 32gb ddr4 3200mhz ecc 2x16gb
Video Card(s) sapphire RX 6950 xt Nitro+ 16gb
Storage 300gb hdd OS backup. Crucial 500gb ssd OS. 6tb raid 1 hdd. 1.8tb pci-e nytro warp drive LSI
Display(s) AOC display 1080p
Case SilverStone SST-CS380 V2
Audio Device(s) Onboard
Power Supply Corsair 850MX watt
Mouse corsair gaming mouse
Keyboard Microsoft brand
Software Windows 10 pro 64bit, Luxion Keyshot 7, fusion 360, steam
Benchmark Scores timespy 19 104
Posting a random picture of a destroyed solar panel farm, without providing any sort of source for said picture, is not an argument. For all I know that's a picture of a solar farm after anti-progress yokels like yourself have been through it.


We were talking about fusion power, dear. Do try to keep up.


Sorry, let me rewind.

My comment about covering deserts with solar panels was a somewhat flippant response to the poster who was spreading FUD about how we don't have enough surface area for solar panels. They then compounded their FUD by posting a graphic purporting to show how much of the USA would need to be covered with solar and wind to satisfy the nation's energy needs - a graphic with zero information on how that area was calculated, from a website known to be anti-solar and anti-wind. That's not science, that's doubling down on FUD.

You then responded with a - completely valid - video about how covering the Sahara with solar panels is probably not a good idea. You and the video are completely correct and I agree completely! Just because we can do something, doesn't mean we should, and a lot of the trouble we're currently in in regards to the climate could and would have been avoided if we'd had a similar caution about basing our entire civilisation on hydrocarbons, as opposed to diversifying our energy sources long ago. It makes complete sense to learn that lesson and not proceed down a road that will have similarly negative consequences in future.

However, my point in regards to that video - which I admit was poorly communicated - is that I was circling back to the original anti-solar FUD from the other poster. Every time someone says "solar", about a million anti-solar pundits come out of the woodwork claiming that it won't work for about a trillion different reasons, most of which - like the original poster's "reason" - are complete and utter rubbish. But this FUD is exactly what the anti-nuclear lobby (whom I despise, by the way) used back in the 70s and 80s to essentially kill big nuclear, and I'm so very tired of things that are necessary for our world being pushed to the wayside because people are afraid of them for no good reason. That is all.


Of course you did - conspiracy theories are the opposite of science and as such, have zero place in a thread discussing science.

Unless you were being flippant, in which case I apologise unreservedly.
just like you randomly bloating about shit and calling names
 
Top