RTX 5090 ridiculous price!

freeagent · Monday at 2:07 AM

Ruru said:
No matter the price, sheep will buy these and we can thank them for continuously increasing prices.

Wonder why practically no gamer bought a GTX Titan/Titan Black/Titan X/Xp for ~1000EUR but now it's totally okay to get a 2500EUR+ card every two years. Inflation isn't a valid answer.

If you could you would, you know it..

People who can will, and some people who cant will find a way.

Sound_Card · Monday at 2:11 AM

Ruru said:
No matter the price, sheep will buy these and we can thank them for continuously increasing prices.

Wonder why practically no gamer bought a GTX Titan/Titan Black/Titan X/Xp for ~1000EUR but now it's totally okay to get a 2500EUR+ card every two years. Inflation isn't a valid answer.

It's always comforting to know that there are still sane people alive. Reading how these people rationalize this segment is absolutely wild.

evernessince · Monday at 2:12 AM

Zach_01 said:
Nice comedy here

Drivers was bad 22-23 years ago and that is a valid argument…

And what is the meaning of real RT?
Does AMD fakes RT?
Jeez…

Don't bother with that guy, he said the exact same thing early and never replied to comments rebutting his points. Bad drivers 20+ years ago is definitely a valid argument but an experience that long ago reflects nothing on the current company and products.

Dr. Dro said:
Oh, these will sell to gamers alright. The extreme specs don't necessarily translate to "it's a professional or AI GPU", it's just the next-generation's flagship product. It's not just the AI crowd. The latest Steam Hardware Survey places the RTX 4090 at a higher utilization rate than even the RX 580, which is by far the best selling GPU model of all time (thanks to cryptocurrency miners). List here includes iGPUs and mobile dGPUs:

View attachment 380673

As a 4090 owner who only purchased a 4090 for AI, those steam 4090 numbers are almost certainly influenced by the hobbyist AI market. The StableDiffusion reddit is a top 1% reddit in size and I'd be willing to bet a sizable number of those individuals also have steam installed. Factor in the 4090's use for OLLAMA and other AI hobbyist use cases as well and you have a significant number of users, particularly for a top end card.

freeagent said:
For what you get.. the price really isn't that bad. Once all the software is laid out and in place, AI in game should be pretty cool. And you get the beef of a 4090 in 2 slots.

The price is high given the lack of improvement this gen and the fact that they are using the same node, which has come down drastically in price since the 4000 series.

2 slots is nice but the drawback of a smaller cooler will likely be a reliance on the fans. Fatter coolers will likely be able to sustain zero RPM fan mode for longer / up to a higher TDP than a 2 slot design. Plus one has to ask the question of if the cables connecting the PCBs on the FE have longevity drawbacks. Carrying a PCIe 5.0 signal over cable alone is a feat, ensuring long term reliability is another. When those cables carry your PCIe and IO data that's a big deal. Can't say I've ever had data lines on a PCB ever go bad but I've had plenty of cables go bad, and that includes some expensive enterprise cables. It would have been vastly preferable IMO to have a hard PCB style bridge instead of cables.

freeagent · Monday at 2:13 AM

I'm sure it will be fine.

Sound_Card · Monday at 2:17 AM

evernessince said:
As a 4090 owner who only purchased a 4090 for AI, those steam 4090 numbers are almost certainly influenced by the hobbyist AI market. The StableDiffusion reddit is a top 1% reddit in size and I'd be willing to bet a sizable number of those individuals also have steam installed. Factor in the 4090's use for OLLAMA and other AI hobbyist use cases as well and you have a significant number of users, particularly for a top end card.

Is that the new cover? "We are AI hobbyist". Wait ... I think I actually hear Jen chuckling all the way from California. lol.

DirtyDingusMcgee · Monday at 2:27 AM

Things I want but cannot afford cost too much...

I should immediately be given a 5090, a Lamborghini LP 670-4 sv, Versailles, a solid gold teddy bear, and an oil-tanker filled with cocaine to serve as my personal yacht.

Or perhaps, i could live within reality (and my means) and deal with it.

freeagent · Monday at 2:32 AM

Ahoy matey!

Yep, midrange life over here.

Zach_01 · Monday at 2:55 AM

evernessince said:
Bad drivers 20+ years ago is definitely a valid argument

IMO it’s not, because… well you answered it already…

evernessince said:
but an experience that long ago reflects nothing on the current company and products.

Different times, different place and 90+% of today GPU issues are related to other than drivers causes such as PSU/power, CPU/system and Windows/software errors.

GPU Drivers: same old sour candy that never melts out but many like to suckle and never spit either.
It’s exhausting.

Raffles · Monday at 2:55 AM

Ruru said:
No matter the price, sheep will buy these and we can thank them for continuously increasing prices.

Wonder why practically no gamer bought a GTX Titan/Titan Black/Titan X/Xp for ~1000EUR but now it's totally okay to get a 2500EUR+ card every two years. Inflation isn't a valid answer.

This. I remember thinking it was nuts we suddenly had £1000 GPUs, and you're right, it seemed like barely anyone bought them.

I blame tech YouTubers. They've whipped everyone up into a tech frenzy, and now it's suddenly become normal to spend £2000 on a GPU

That and PC gaming becoming more mainstream I guess.

Klemc · Monday at 2:56 AM

This prices are so fun, just laugh and nothing more to say, tbh.

Zach_01 said:
IMO it’s not, because… well you answered it already…

Different times, different place and 90+% of today GPU issues are related to other than drivers causes such as PSU/power, CPU/system and Windows/software errors.

GPU Drivers: same old sour candy that never melts out but many like to suckle and never spit either.
It’s exhausting.

Drivers will become better if they drop older hardware support ?.. like next driver !

Zach_01 · Monday at 2:58 AM

Klemc said:
Drivers will become better if they drop older hardware support ?.. like next driver !

I didn’t get it…
Meaning?

DemonicRyzen666 · Monday at 3:53 AM

evernessince said:
Source? I believe you are conflating stopping production with any official price increase. There is no "limited availability", Nvidia said they were and have stopped production.

No I am not. It was mentioned about 8 months ago right here On Techpowerup here that the MSRP would go up to $1,999. Stop production just happened recently. In the summertime you could not get any RTXX 4090 under $2,100 with tax. I am pretty sure that it was leaked in or around the mist of the RTX 4080 super, 4070 super Ti, & 4070 super launch to make them seem like better deals.

DirtyDingusMcgee · Monday at 4:59 AM

freeagent said:
Ahoy matey!

Yep, midrange life over here.

Ain't it the truth. My PC addiction lived off of boneyards and scrapheaps for so many years. Computers are so powerful and easy now. I really don't understand the fuss.

Dr. Dro · Monday at 10:31 AM

Raffles said:
This. I remember thinking it was nuts we suddenly had £1000 GPUs, and you're right, it seemed like barely anyone bought them.

I blame tech YouTubers. They've whipped everyone up into a tech frenzy, and now it's suddenly become normal to spend £2000 on a GPU

That and PC gaming becoming more mainstream I guess.

I don't blame tech YouTubers. I blame hardware becoming extremely advanced and difficult to manufacture, with ever higher standards of quality to be met.

Look at a 8800 GTX, made of plastic with a blower and a hunk of metal installed. Hell here's mine, the fancy professional model, that's really it.

Compare that to a modern GPU where instead of some plastic you have a die cast steel frame, instead of cheap blower you've got 4 carefully designed fans, there is no lighting, no fancy anything, even the chokes on a modern card are leaps and bounds ahead of the time GPUs were perceived to be a lot cheaper.

I don't think many people are even accounting for these things. Meanwhile it's not only that, software development and engineering costs have also gone through the roof, research and development budget is probably a thousand times that of G80's...

So yeah GPU prices will go up across every segment but especially the flagship tier which is where they will have margins to fund the whole venture.

Onasi · Monday at 10:44 AM

freeagent said:
If you could you would, you know it..

People who can will, and some people who cant will find a way.

Nah, it’s a question of necessity and sanity. I can buy a 4090 even at todays inflated price and will be able to buy a 5090 (though cringing all the way). I did not and will not, though. If I needed it for work - sure, a tool is a tool and will pay for itself. As a toy though? Nah, miss me with that shit. I don’t play AAA slop and wasting more than 500-600 bucks just to play some vidya is insanity to me. I could and would put that money to better use. A vacation in Goa maybe or something. Games and purrdy graphics are just not that important. No shade towards those who WOULD buy one just to play some games, who am I to tell them what to do with their money?

Bomby569 · Monday at 10:50 AM

Dr. Dro said:
I don't blame tech YouTubers. I blame hardware becoming extremely advanced and difficult to manufacture, with ever higher standards of quality to be met.

Look at a 8800 GTX, made of plastic with a blower and a hunk of metal installed. Hell here's mine, the fancy professional model, that's really it.

View attachment 380690

Compare that to a modern GPU where instead of some plastic you have a die cast steel frame, instead of cheap blower you've got 4 carefully designed fans, there is no lighting, no fancy anything, even the chokes on a modern card are leaps and bounds ahead of the time GPUs were perceived to be a lot cheaper.

I don't think many people are even accounting for these things. Meanwhile it's not only that, software development and engineering costs have also gone through the roof, research and development budget is probably a thousand times that of G80's...

So yeah GPU prices will go up across every segment but especially the flagship tier which is where they will have margins to fund the whole venture.

that's not were the money is going, that's a drop in the bucket, the one getting great margins is Nvidia not the ones building the card or selling the card.
And it would be more costly for Nvidia to do all the R&D and negotiate prices with everyone, back then as a small niche company as opposed to now as one of the largest companies in the world and diluting costs with other segments that are even more profitable.

Dr. Dro · Monday at 10:59 AM

Bomby569 said:
that's not were the money is going, that's a drop in the bucket, the one getting great margins is Nvidia not the ones building the card or selling the card.
And it would be more costly for Nvidia to do all the R&D and negotiate prices with everyone, back then as a small niche company as opposed to now as one of the largest companies in the world and diluting costs with other segments that are even more profitable.

As far as I know, GPU vendors usually sell the main chip and accompanying memory chips as a kit to AIBs, shouldering the biggest bulk of R&D and validation costs, that's generally why advanced aftermarket models have an even higher cost in general.

Drop by drop, the bucket gets full though. So might be a drop here and a drop there, over time these things can and will add up.

Bomby569 · Monday at 11:12 AM

Dr. Dro said:
As far as I know, GPU vendors usually sell the main chip and accompanying memory chips as a kit to AIBs, shouldering the biggest bulk of R&D and validation costs, that's generally why advanced aftermarket models have an even higher cost in general.

Drop by drop, the bucket gets full though. So might be a drop here and a drop there, over time these things can and will add up.

Nvidia is one of the largest companies in the world, 3rd i think now. EVGA dropped gpu's because it wasn't profitable.

Dr. Dro · Monday at 11:19 AM

Bomby569 said:
Nvidia is one of the largest companies in the world, 3rd i think now. EVGA dropped gpu's because it wasn't profitable.

EVGA had many many internal issues, and was plagued by poor management. It did not fail as a business because of Nvidia.

Other AIBs already filled the vacuum left by EVGA's demise, with ASUS taking the luxury segment previously filled by their Classified and Kingpin cards by storm.

Bomby569 · Monday at 11:23 AM

Dr. Dro said:
EVGA had many many internal issues, and was plagued by poor management. It did not fail as a business because of Nvidia.

maybe, but Nvidia has some famous blunders in his past but they can always fail upwards because of their position in this market. Even when they screw pricing it's mostly other people's problem, just like AMD is doing now:

AMD Radeon RX 9070 XT "bumpy" launch reportedly linked to price pressure from NVIDIA - VideoCardz.com

Radeon RX 9070 launch with retailer background PC Games Hardware reports that their moderator “pokerclock,” a well-informed person within retailer circles, has shared a new update on an upcoming Radeon GPU launch. Previously, this source provided insights on the GeForce RTX 50 series launch...

videocardz.com

Frick · Monday at 11:27 AM

DirtyDingusMcgee said:
Ain't it the truth. My PC addiction lived off of boneyards and scrapheaps for so many years. Computers are so powerful and easy now. I really don't understand the fuss.

High end GPUs being expensive isn't a big problem as such, but it is annoying that they are getting more expensive and my pay does not keep up. I could see myself paying €1000 for the highest end GPU, but today it's barely enough fof high end.

Bomby569 said:
Nvidia is one of the largest companies in the world, 3rd i think now. EVGA dropped gpu's because it wasn't profitable.

Second, but that is market cap. If you go by revenue they're not in the top 50.

Athlonite · Monday at 11:30 AM

I don't know what all the pissing n moaning is about it's a Halo card so ofcourse it's going to carry a Halo price tag
When AMD failed to produce a viable competitor to nVidia's halo cards it gave nVidia carte blanche to charge whatever they fricken well wanted for their Halo GPU's.
You could always show nVidia how angry you are at them for their shitty pricing by just not buying their overpriced GPU's. But who am I kidding you're going to buy it no matter what the price is aren't you!

Onasi · Monday at 11:32 AM

Frick said:
Second, but that is market cap. If you go by revenue they're not in the top 50.

Yup, market cap is a metric that’s important mostly for investors. It’s not a measure of how “big” or “important” a company is necessarily. I mean, unless someone wants to unironically argue that Ferrari is a bigger automaker than VW, GM or Hyundai.

Bomby569 · Monday at 11:57 AM

Frick said:
Second, but that is market cap. If you go by revenue they're not in the top 50.

Revenue depends on a lot of things, volume for example, it's a side discussion, but Walmart (number #1 according to google) isn't in a better position than Tesla, Apple or Nvidia. Maybe you wanted to say profit not sure.
But market cap is absolutely relevant especially in R&D, it's easier to make your own money when you can sell your own stocks for insane pricing and makes any type of debt cheaper.

LittleBro · Monday at 12:12 PM

Linking my post from other thread. AIB cards cost a serious premium over MSRP.

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RTX 5090 ridiculous price!

freeagent

Moderator

Sound_Card

evernessince

freeagent

Moderator

Sound_Card

DirtyDingusMcgee

freeagent

Moderator

Zach_01

Raffles

Klemc

Zach_01

DemonicRyzen666

DirtyDingusMcgee

Dr. Dro

Onasi

Bomby569

Dr. Dro

Bomby569

Dr. Dro

Bomby569

AMD Radeon RX 9070 XT "bumpy" launch reportedly linked to price pressure from NVIDIA - VideoCardz.com

Frick

Fishfaced Nincompoop

Athlonite

Onasi

Bomby569

LittleBro

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