Cryptocoin Value and Market Trend Discussion

[R0H1T]

Do you remember 2008 when the entire Real Estate sector went under?

Except it didn't, you still had real assets on the ground albeit highly overvalued just a few months back! And yeah I remember quite vividly the first shock to my investments back in the day, it's almost comical to compare crypto to anything (real)

Your recollection about the 2008 crash is also somewhat dubious. The entire crash happened in large parts because of CDO's & other "exotic" derivatives IIRC, not just the real estate sector overheating!

In fact drawing a tangent from that, one could argue crypto being the vaporware that it is actually mimics CDO's a lot

 

[Bomby569]

And less legitimate as ever.

Bitcoin has lost its way. It's not even a shadow of its original intent. Look how it is tied so close to other markets! Look how people leverage it so one market colapses another! Now tying it to a maniac is a good thing? This liar gives us credibility. Lol

Some people are in for a rude awakening.

you can't have it both ways, it now holds real value, and if it does off course it will react to the markets just like any asset. If it didn't, it would be a clear sign it hold no value.

it's original intent was a decentralised coin, it was achieved.

Except it didn't, you still had real assets on the ground albeit highly overvalued just a few months back! And yeah I remember quite vividly the first shock to my investments back in the day, it's almost comical to compare crypto to anything (real)

Your recollection about the 2008 crash is also somewhat dubious. The entire crash happened in large parts because of CDO's & other "exotic" derivatives IIRC, not just the real estate sector overheating!

In fact drawing a tangent from that, one could argue crypto being the vaporware that it is actually mimics CDO's a lot

CDO's played a big part for sure, but there was a very real problem in the market, deregulation. Someone without a job shouldn't be able to get a loan for 3 houses like by some accounts. CDO's were a consequence not the root cause of the problem.

Not all crypto is equal, BTC is no longer vaporware, we must accept this and move on, it now holds value even if there is no underlying physical asset attached to it. It's scarcity gives it its value.

 

[R0H1T]

The "big crash" was triggered by Lehmann's insolvency, it was also because of a liquidity crunch as no one was willing to shell out real money on possibly junk/worthless derivatives. At least if some of the movies made on it are remotely true, the housing "bubble" could've been managed if people also didn't lose trillions in the stock/debt markets.

Not all crypto is equal, BTC is no longer vaporware, we must accept this and move on, it now holds value even if there is no underlying physical asset attached to it. It's scarcity gives it its value.

You don't have to explain to me what value implies for anything really, I've been explaining the underlying principle behind it for years even here ~

Power resides where men believe it resides. No more and no less.

In that If I can get 2 billion people to believe that BTC is worthless it would be close to that just as quickly.

The big difference between vaporware, in the virtual world, and things in the material world being that there's a lot more to fall back with the latter. Now whether you believe it's worth it for you or not is an entirely different topic.

 

[Bomby569]

The "big crash" was triggered by Lehmann's insolvency, it was also because of a liquidity crunch as no one was willing to shell out real money on possibly junk/worthless derivatives. At least if some of the movies made on it are remotely true, the housing "bubble" could've been managed if people also didn't lose trillions in the stock/debt markets.

you started by disagreeing it was a problem with the real estate sector and now you're talking about the trigger event. There is a fundamental problem there of understanding causes and consequences, actions and reactions, that's what it seems to me.
Lehman's insolvency was not the trigger, it was merely the first corpse to fall on the ground.

 

[R0H1T]

I wasn't disagreeing with you so you had no reason to step in, stocks of most companies also have real physical assets so comparison to crypto is BS. Although I agree that stock market is just as a much a scam as crypto exchanges! As for real estate again there was something on the ground that had (some) utility, BTC does nothing which say a UPI cannot do for a fraction of the (energy) cost & it's much safer

And what does a "decentralized" coin even mean, who does it benefit except the top 0.1% at the helm?

 

[Bomby569]

stocks of most companies also have real physical assets so comparison to crypto is BS.

did anyone compared it to stocks?
still you could look at the pe ratio of Nvidia and tell me what real physical asset is behind that?

 

[ty_ger]

you can't have it both ways, it now holds real value, and if it does off course it will react to the markets just like any asset. If it didn't, it would be a clear sign it hold no value.

Lol. 'It has real value.' Just like some of the other overvalued hype stock. Some stock is a scam, some stock is real. This crypto is definitely not real regardless of which thing you tie its 'real value' to, IMO.

If you think the stock market will just keep shooting to the moon, I guess you think this insanity makes sense. In the real world, I think most people believe that this won't last forever and are looking for their peak that they plan to sell at. If the stock market goes down a lot -- and I think it will -- bitcoin will go down exponentially more, IMO.

The most recent legitimacy is an 'external revenue service' slush-fund of ill-gotten funds? ...Started by billionaires, controlled by billionaires, and argued about by billionaires as to who gets to funnel from it and use it for their purposes. A tower waiting to crumble. People will eventually want it to be destroyed. Who likes open corruption when it comes for them? Everyone short-sightedly likes it when it seems their bet on corruption is paying off, but when their golden age leaves them in the dust, a retribution comes.

 

[R0H1T]

Go back to the post I originally quoted, he said the entire real estate sector went under ~ it didn't. And if you can't make heads/tails out of that then stop pestering me!

did anyone compared it to stocks?
still you could look at the pe ratio of Nvidia and tell me what real physical asset is behind that?

Who cares? Didn't I say stock market is a scam, not unlike crypto

Someone could practically take down all crypto (wallets) & exchanges tomorrow & all of it would be worthless then, can you say the same about a home?

 

[ty_ger]

As linked, starting at 1:45, keep in perspective that every winner is at the cost of a loser. There is no magic in this greater fool ponzi scheme.

Where are you in the chain? Sell.

 

[ty_ger]

How's everyone feeling?

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

Buy the dip.

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

Did you buy the dip?

 

[LFaWolf]

Did you buy the dip?

No, but my average cost is $17k so I am going to just ride it out. Not adding any for the moment.

 

[ty_ger]

Buy the dip.

Sell the peak.

You have the under-hand in this more than ever. Now that pumping and dumping crypto is openly legal, bribery is openly legal, and political and ecomic whales are involved, you have less and less chance to survive in this stupid game. They make the news and buy and sell at the same time. The rug pulls are at an epic scale. Only the blind are unable to see that this is nothing but a ponzi scheme.

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

Or - BUY THE DIP and HODL.

 

[ty_ger]

Or - BUY THE DIP and HODL.

People are actively legislating the best way to take your money. You're crazy to see it any other way. It still has no utility and it is nothing but a donation box that some people put money in, and others take it out. The value only goes up when people put money in it, goes down when people take it out, and it is completely legal to mislead 'investors' in order to take their money. The people with the greatest money and megaphones win every time.
The people with the megaphones who say 'HODL!', sell every time. And the people who actually HODL, lose their money every time because they are suckers. Where do you think their money goes?

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

How? How are they going to take my Crypto with 90% stored in offline wallets. How? They can legislate all they want that doesn't magically make my crypto leave the wallet. How are they going to tell the Market (Millions of people that already agree it has value) that it is now worthless because they "say" it is worthless. They can't change shit and that is the exact reason Crypto was created AND isn't going away. Good luck to any government that thinks they can control it.

Did you know Fraud and Murder are illegal and yet it happens every minute of every day. Now imagine them trying to control something as benign as crypto.

 

[ty_ger]

How? How are they going to take my Crypto with 90% stored in offline wallets. How? They can legislate all they want that doesn't magically make my crypto leave the wallet. How are they going to tell the Market (Millions of people that already agree it has value) that it is now worthless because they "say" it is worthless. They can't change shit and that is the exact reason Crypto was created AND isn't going away. Good luck to any government that thinks they can control it.

Did you know Fraud and Murder are illegal and yet it happens every minute of every day. Now imagine them trying to control something as benign as crypto.

You act so naive. It isn't so complicated that it is hard to figure out. It's actually a more straight-forward scam than most.
They take your money by crashing the value. You can't buy anything with the quantity. You buy stuff by exchanging the value. It has no value after they take other people's value and the remaining run for the exit.
You can have a ton of worthless nothing, or sell it. It's really simple. It will continue to go down, with almost certainty. Only way it can't is if everyone is stupid AND everyone else is greedy.
You can fix stupid with education, but you can't fix short-sighted greed.
The HODLs who lose are always the greediest, not the smartest.
If you want to own all the nothing after it is worthless, good on you.
At least with the stock market and world economy there is some complexity. Some unknown. Products with perceived value. This is none of that. This is a scam distilled down to nothing after its original intent failed a decade ago.

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

Typical. Deflect with insults, especially when you have no answer, because you have no idea what you are talking about..just trolling and making up stuff as your go.
It isn't complicated your right. Everything you describe is exactly the same as the stock market and for that matter fiat. All perceived value, but knowing you are a master at trading I'm sure you already drew that conclusion. Don't be mad you didn't get in early. 5% is still 5% you could still make some money and maybe even retire someday.

 

[ty_ger]

I can't help you, but I hope I helped others.
I'm not intending to insult. It's just the truth. I'm sorry if it offends you that you are greedy and refuse to see the truth.
It really is a very simple scam that people try to over-complicate.
People should have sold a month ago.
I'm doing just fine with real objects of real value that I use to create even further value. Traditional skills never get old.

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

No, that's not the truth. That's your opinion. Just because words came out of your mouth do not make them true or facts...just another trolls opinion that adds absolutely no value to anything in this thread.

 

[ty_ger]

Time will tell.
It is true that it has no utility.
It is true that it is unregulated.
It is true that it has no intrinsic value.
It is true that buying or selling directly affects its value.
It is true that it is worthless in any quantity on paper.
It is true that people pump and dump it.
It is true that people use it in a predatory way.
It is true that people manipulate buyers of it in order to cash out their investments.

I don't know which fact leads you to a different conclusion.

This troll is trying to help educate those who coul use it, but can't help the greedy.

 

[ZenZimZaliben]

It is true that it has no utility. - Your Opinion. Its utility is in the unregulated section that you somehow list as a negative.
It is true that it is unregulated. - Yes, so explain to me again how .GOV is going to regulate it? LOL.
It is true that it has no intrinsic value. - Opinion
It is true that buying or selling directly affects its value. - Same as any commodity
It is true that it is worthless in any quantity on paper. - Same as any stock.
It is true that people pump and dump it. - Yes, same as any traded asset.
It is true that people use it in a predatory way. - You ever hear of Cash?
It is true that people manipulate buyers of it in order to cash out their investments. - You every hear of Fraud or Market manipulation?

So how exactly do you think money markets work? Or exchanges? Is it magic? Or is it driven by the Market place placing value on supply/demand?...hmmmm.

 

[ty_ger]

So you agree, but can't put your one foot in front of the other.
The problem is that fraud and market manipulation are traditionally considered fraud and market manipulation. In this case, not. In this case its just another day where the greedy and needy give the rich the money that they should have never gambled. Traditional securities have regulations. All regulations for crypto in the US have now been ebolished and the richest and most powerful are now openly pumping and dumping crypto with impunity. They have zero care for its future; only care for taking the value that they extract from it. How long do you think they will repeat their actions before trust is destroyed? Trust is destroyed more and more every day. And thus its value is destroyed. Thus it has no future. Its ultimate destiny is worthlessness. It's simple and obvious.
There is nothing complex about it to even confuse poor suckers that there is some additional value that they should invest in. It is simply a money exchange where hypers' cash out suckers' money. It can't go on forever before enough realize it.
Crypto failed its goals a decade ago. Now only the greedy and the needy fall for it.
Cash out before the majority do for you.

Don't worry. The stock market has greed and fraud too. It will also fall. Not as hard as crypto though. And fraud will at least be punishable. Even without any fraud, the stock market is facing a decline. When half the stock market is owned by boomers who will cash it out eventually, that future is sealed. Crypto, even more certainly doomed.

If you think that because crypto is worse than the stock market, that makes it better, I cannot help you.

 

[Bomby569]

It is true that it is unregulated. - Yes, so explain to me again how .GOV is going to regulate it? LOL.

there are clear signs that not only is unregulated, but it's even going to get worst with Trump. At this moment actual crimes are being actively and purposefully ignored and criminals feel more bold with what they do. Trump is after all in on the crimes.