SLI (or is it called NVLink now) is confirmed as for the rich only. Even RTX2070 lacks it, making the $800 RTX2080 the entry point for this... and the bridge is $80. Nice. SLI bridges used to come for free with motherboards, and were usable on even low end cards. Not that I ever liked SLI anyway, but this gives me another reason to dislike it.

hatSLI (or is it called NVLink now) is confirmed as for the rich only. Even RTX2070 lacks it, making the $800 RTX2080 the entry point for this... and the bridge is $80. Nice. SLI bridges used to come for free with motherboards, and were usable on even low end cards. Not that I ever liked SLI anyway, but this gives me another reason to dislike it.

If this was just a piece of plastic with funky leds for $20 with no practical value, people would say "expensive but looks awesome". How much premium do people pay today for gaming looks of their mobos or cooler? How much for LEDs?
But because it's NVLink and your brain whispers "it's just a wire!", you're shocked by those $80. :)
I've been saying this for a long time. The reason for PC gaming becoming so expensive is PC gamers are willing to pay. And companies are willing to earn. It's a perfect symbiosis.

Also, since NVLink is a proprietary tech coming down from enterprise segment, we should expect some fat licensing fee included, so Nvidia may be earning more on this $80 AORUS-branded wire than Gigabyte does. :p

It expensive for a wire? Yes.
Is it expensive for people that already bought two 2080Ti and want the best GPU performance available? Possibly not. Especially when they already spent $500+ on pure esthetics, which isn't unheard of.

Just grotesque kind of business from nGreedia & partners.
I sincerely hope you ALL burn in Hell, greedy arseholes!

Hey, if people are stupid enough to throw $1500-$2000+ at a couple of GPU's for SLi, Nvidia and the rest, are smart enough to take another $80 off them just to get it working...

notbIf this was just a piece of plastic with funky leds for $20 with no practical value, people would say "expensive but looks awesome".

I'd expect a swarm of sarcastic MOAR RGB comments...

notbHow much premium do people pay today for gaming looks of their mobos or cooler? How much for LEDs?

Not sure. It seems most people, at least here, are kinda sick of all the flashy "gaming" junk and marketing.

notbBut because it's NVLink and your brain whispers "it's just a wire!", you're shocked by those $80. :)

Shocked? No... I don't think this word is the right one.

notbI've been saying this for a long time. The reason for PC gaming becoming so expensive is PC gamers are willing to pay. And companies are willing to earn. It's a perfect symbiosis.

Unfortunately, I agree with you on this point. It used to be you could build a respectable computer in the same range of a gaming console, maybe a little more... these days a single component can eclipse that price. Still, personally, as much disdain as I have for Intel with their business practices lately, I'd still cough up for a K series processor (even though paying a huge premium for overclocking parts, at least for many of us, was never a part of the game)... but $800 RTX2080, or worse, the 2080 Ti, I will not. Everyone has a line, and I believe nVidia is searching for it.

notbAlso, since NVLink is a proprietary tech coming down from enterprise segment, we should expect some fat licensing fee included, so Nvidia may be earning more on this $80 AORUS-branded wire than Gigabyte does. :p

Well, you know how I feel about proprietary stuff... this is one result of that.

notbSo is it expensive for a wire? Yes.

Agreed!

notbIs it expensive for people that already bought two 2080Ti and want the best GPU performance available? Possibly not.

I don't like this... but agreed again. Like I said, nVidia is searching for the line.

hatSLI (or is it called NVLink now) is confirmed as for the rich only. Even RTX2070 lacks it, making the $800 RTX2080 the entry point for this... and the bridge is $80. Nice. SLI bridges used to come for free with motherboards, and were usable on even low end cards. Not that I ever liked SLI anyway, but this gives me another reason to dislike it.

Well yeah that to be seen. TU106 does not have nvlink same way as gp106 does not have sli. So if xx70 is x06 chip from now on, there will be no nvlink in the future either. But if xx70 series moves back to x04 chip, it might actually get it back. And yes it's only for very rich with current gen. Turings, while I would not say it's not very poor men's solution with dual gtx1070 either.

hatUnfortunately, I agree with you on this point. It used to be you could build a respectable computer in the same range of a gaming console, maybe a little more... these days a single component can eclipse that price. Still, personally, as much disdain as I have for Intel with their business practices lately, I'd still cough up for a K series processor (even though paying a huge premium for overclocking parts, at least for many of us, was never a part of the game).

Actually, I quite like Intel's business practices, while I'm not a huge fan of how AMD positions and advertises their products. Intel is just so stable, sustainable and organized. Compared to that AMD is in full kamikaze mode with every new product.

I'd love to see a correlation of Intel/AMD fanboyism vs being attracted towards investing in bonds and mining crypto. :-P

but $800 RTX2080, or worse, the 2080 Ti, I will not. Everyone has a line, and I believe nVidia is searching for it.

Privately, I'm not that happy with the pricing. And the fact that RT/Tensor cores likely won't make it to cheaper cards this time. 2070 for $500 is way too much for me. There's a slight chance that I'll get some financing from taxpayers' money, so there's still a chance to catch the first wave...

On the other hand, the big picture seems fairly coherent (like always with Nvidia). Initial RTX looks like a showcase product for the new tech. It may have been planned as a low-volume generation from the start, so we can't be surprised by the pricing.

Well, you know how I feel about proprietary stuff... this is one result of that.

Well. I'm a fan of the idea, but that has little impact on my opinion here.
Realistically, a single 2080Ti is already a huge cost.
Nvidia is adding 2 performance steps with dual 2080 and dual 2080Ti.
But let's imagine there is no SLI nor NVLink accessory and you simply can get those dual cards as a set.
It would go like this:
2080: $700
2080Ti: $1000
2x2080: $1480
2x2080Ti: $2080 :-D

I bet no one would care that a dual 2080 is $80 more expensive than two separate 2080.

hatSLI (or is it called NVLink now) is confirmed as for the rich only. Even RTX2070 lacks it, making the $800 RTX2080 the entry point for this... and the bridge is $80. Nice. SLI bridges used to come for free with motherboards, and were usable on even low end cards. Not that I ever liked SLI anyway, but this gives me another reason to dislike it.

Actually motherboards come with sli hb bridges. Why techpowerup users always complain and hate everything. Toxic cesspool!

notbIf this was just a piece of plastic with funky leds for $20 with no practical value, people would say "expensive but looks awesome". How much premium do people pay today for gaming looks of their mobos or cooler? How much for LEDs?
But because it's NVLink and your brain whispers "it's just a wire!", you're shocked by those $80. :)
I've been saying this for a long time. The reason for PC gaming becoming so expensive is PC gamers are willing to pay. And companies are willing to earn. It's a perfect symbiosis.

Also, since NVLink is a proprietary tech coming down from enterprise segment, we should expect some fat licensing fee included, so Nvidia may be earning more on this $80 AORUS-branded wire than Gigabyte does. :p

It expensive for a wire? Yes.
Is it expensive for people that already bought two 2080Ti and want the best GPU performance available? Possibly not. Especially when they already spent $500+ on pure esthetics, which isn't unheard of.

PC gaming becomes expensive because technology advances. Sigh. And people who buy pair of 800$ video cards have no problem spending 80$ on a bridge.

Prima.VeraJust grotesque kind of business from nGreedia & partners.
I sincerely hope you ALL burn in Hell, greedy arseholes!

You are just poor to buy Nvidia products. Find a job and stop complaining.

The Quim ReaperHey, if people are stupid enough to throw $1500-$2000+ at a couple of GPU's for SLi, Nvidia and the rest, are smart enough to take another $80 off them just to get it working...

Stupid? Maybe people want to maximize gaming performance? To play in 4K resolution on ultra settings and 120 fps. Jealousy and hatred.

So many people here buttmad that nvidia isnt giving away their GPUs for $200 for every impoverished gamer out there, complete with free nvlink bridges. :cry::cry::cry:

Guys, gaming is, :eek: shocker :eek:, a luxury, not a necessity. SLI even more so. SLI has, for most of its existence, been for people with tons of money to throw at the problem, as a single GPU has always been more cost effective and reliable then two slower SLI GPUs.

If you dont want to pay $80 for the nvlink bridge, then just dont. There are plenty of mid range and high end GPUs for you to choose to play minecraft with. For everyone saying "well well well PC GAMURZ ARE WILLING TO PAY, SO EVERYTHING IS EXPENSIVE!" The $150 RX560 didnt go anywhere, neither did the RX470, or 480, or 1050ti, or 1060. You know you can still buy those, right? And you know the vast majority of gamers, according to steam, are using sub console hardware, right? None of that is going anywhere, just like VW owning Bugatti doesnt mean they will stop making golfs.

It's like none of you remember the days of $1000 FX CPUs, and $800 GPUs in the early to mid 2000s.

:laugh: lolcalmdown :laugh:

TheinsanegamerNSo many people here buttmad that nvidia isnt giving away their GPUs for $200 for every impoverished gamer out there, complete with free nvlink bridges. :cry::cry::cry:

Guys, gaming is, :eek: shocker :eek:, a luxury, not a necessity. SLI even more so. SLI has, for most of its existence, been for people with tons of money to throw at the problem, as a single GPU has always been more cost effective and reliable then two slower SLI GPUs.

If you dont want to pay $80 for the nvlink bridge, then just dont. There are plenty of mid range and high end GPUs for you to choose to play minecraft with. For everyone saying "well well well PC GAMURZ ARE WILLING TO PAY, SO EVERYTHING IS EXPENSIVE!" The $150 RX560 didnt go anywhere, neither did the RX470, or 480, or 1050ti, or 1060. You know you can still buy those, right? And you know the vast majority of gamers, according to steam, are using sub console hardware, right? None of that is going anywhere, just like VW owning Bugatti doesnt mean they will stop making golfs.

It's like none of you remember the days of $1000 FX CPUs, and $800 GPUs in the early to mid 2000s.

:laugh: lolcalmdown :laugh:

finally reasonable user on techpowerup forums. Agree with

ZhangirDuysekePC gaming becomes expensive because technology advances.

Which would make PC gaming one of not so many human activities that become more expensive because of technological advancement.
Or maybe the only one?

notbWhich would make PC gaming one of not so many human activities that become more expensive because of technological advancement.
Or maybe the only one?

You used to need a $600 CPU and a $500 GPU to play the latest games at 1080p.

Now you can do that with a $500 budget PC.

I'm not sure where these "PCs are more expensive" comments are coming from. Sure, RAM is stupid expensive, as are GPUs, but thats due to manufacturer collusion and miners, respectively, nothing to do with the tech itself.

TheinsanegamerNYou used to need a $600 CPU and a $500 GPU to play the latest games at 1080p.

Now you can do that with a $500 budget PC.

I'm not sure where these "PCs are more expensive" comments are coming from. Sure, RAM is stupid expensive, as are GPUs, but thats due to manufacturer collusion and miners, respectively, nothing to do with the tech itself.

Well, I didn't say I agree with what @ZhangirDuyseke said, did I?

But you know... there's also something called "expectations"... and they evolve.

I'm playing in just the same way I did when I was a teenager 15 years ago (but for 5h a week, not 30). Games look much better. Otherwise it's the same thing.

A modern gamer is not just after... well... gaming. We have those weird looking "gaming" PCs. We have streaming (moar cores!). We have this whole ecosystem of gadgets, accessories, clothes and subscriptions that people are willing to pay for.
Also games got fairly expensive - especially for early adopters. Assassin's Creed: Odyssey is $60. And that's the poor man's version. The top one is double that!
And then there are countless add-on's, season passes and so on. Holy f...k.

When you add all these things, gaming really becomes an expensive hobby.

So here's the thing.
We spend less on hardware, but we most likely spend just as much on gaming. Or maybe even more. Core PC parts simply represent a smaller portion of the whole budget.
It's fairly naive to think that manufacturers didn't notice and won't try to bring back the good old times. ;-)

ZhangirDuysekeActually motherboards come with sli hb bridges. Why techpowerup users always complain and hate everything. Toxic cesspool!

PC gaming becomes expensive because technology advances. Sigh. And people who buy pair of 800$ video cards have no problem spending 80$ on a bridge.


You are just poor to buy Nvidia products. Find a job and stop complaining.

Stupid? Maybe people want to maximize gaming performance? To play in 4K resolution on ultra settings and 120 fps. Jealousy and hatred.

TheinsanegamerNSo many people here buttmad that nvidia isnt giving away their GPUs for $200 for every impoverished gamer out there, complete with free nvlink bridges. :cry::cry::cry:

Guys, gaming is, :eek: shocker :eek:, a luxury, not a necessity. SLI even more so. SLI has, for most of its existence, been for people with tons of money to throw at the problem, as a single GPU has always been more cost effective and reliable then two slower SLI GPUs.

If you dont want to pay $80 for the nvlink bridge, then just dont. There are plenty of mid range and high end GPUs for you to choose to play minecraft with. For everyone saying "well well well PC GAMURZ ARE WILLING TO PAY, SO EVERYTHING IS EXPENSIVE!" The $150 RX560 didnt go anywhere, neither did the RX470, or 480, or 1050ti, or 1060. You know you can still buy those, right? And you know the vast majority of gamers, according to steam, are using sub console hardware, right? None of that is going anywhere, just like VW owning Bugatti doesnt mean they will stop making golfs.

It's like none of you remember the days of $1000 FX CPUs, and $800 GPUs in the early to mid 2000s.

:laugh: lolcalmdown :laugh:

Guys! I think we found the line!

notbActually, I quite like Intel's business practices

There's really only two things that stand out in my mind right now. One is seriously off topic, and the other, while still OT, is a little closer to being on topic, at least, and I've already mentioned it. Care to fathom how many TPUers would be rocking Intel 8400s or 8100s if they could be overclocked? They've been locking it down since Sandy Bridge onward.

ZhangirDuysekeActually motherboards come with sli hb bridges. Why techpowerup users always complain and hate everything. Toxic cesspool!

And they're useless for NVLink... which now requires a separately purchased $80 adapter.

ZhangirDuysekePC gaming becomes expensive because technology advances.

No... PC gaming becomes expensive because everyone wants a bigger slice of the pie. This $80 adapter is a perfect example.

ZhangirDuysekeAnd people who buy pair of 800$ video cards have no problem spending 80$ on a bridge.

You're probably right, but that doesn't mean it should cost $80.

ZhangirDuysekeYou are just poor to buy Nvidia products. Find a job and stop complaining.

That's going a bit far...

ZhangirDuysekeStupid? Maybe people want to maximize gaming performance? To play in 4K resolution on ultra settings and 120 fps. Jealousy and hatred.

If I had infinite money, I still wouldn't do this. SLI is laden with issues and poor performance scaling since the beginning of time. It's okay in the few games that specifically support it, otherwise, it's a wash. As for me, I'd sooner get a Titan, or better yet, the full fat Quadro. The full Pascal Quadro has been shown to surpass even the Titan in gaming, and as a single card, it comes with reliable performance in any scenario.

TheinsanegamerNSo many people here buttmad that nvidia isnt giving away their GPUs for $200 for every impoverished gamer out there, complete with free nvlink bridges. :cry::cry::cry:

Guys, gaming is, :eek: shocker :eek:, a luxury, not a necessity. SLI even more so. SLI has, for most of its existence, been for people with tons of money to throw at the problem, as a single GPU has always been more cost effective and reliable then two slower SLI GPUs.

If you dont want to pay $80 for the nvlink bridge, then just dont. There are plenty of mid range and high end GPUs for you to choose to play minecraft with. For everyone saying "well well well PC GAMURZ ARE WILLING TO PAY, SO EVERYTHING IS EXPENSIVE!" The $150 RX560 didnt go anywhere, neither did the RX470, or 480, or 1050ti, or 1060. You know you can still buy those, right? And you know the vast majority of gamers, according to steam, are using sub console hardware, right? None of that is going anywhere, just like VW owning Bugatti doesnt mean they will stop making golfs.

It's like none of you remember the days of $1000 FX CPUs, and $800 GPUs in the early to mid 2000s.

:laugh: lolcalmdown :laugh:

I have no problem with $1000 or more cards or CPUs existing, as long as there are reasonable options available. The 8800 Ultra was one of the most expensive cards ever to exist. But $80 for a simple bridge is really pushing it.

hatThere's really only two things that stand out in my mind right now.

You struggle to understand why I like the business strategy of a company that knows how to make money? Really? ;-)

Care to fathom how many TPUers would be rocking Intel 8400s or 8100s if they could be overclocked?.

I'd hope: none.
But I'm not doing any OC anymore, so here's a question for you. How much does it cost to make a system ready for significant overclocking? I mean the premium over a setup with similar features but not prepared for OC? Mobo, RAM, power supply, cooler?
Any idea? :-)

Just to quicken the intellectual process: 8600 is 10% faster than 8400 (just on clocks). Price: +$30
More importantly: 8400 is 50% faster than 8100 (core bump) and still a decent 10% in single-thread as well. Price: +$60.
You think you could beat that?

They've been locking it down since Sandy Bridge onward

And I've been a huge advocate of this process. Same for Nvidia limiting SLI/NVlink. And so on.
Both lineups are built around offering performance, not tinkering opportunities.

Keep the discussion related to the topic and no more personal remarks/insults directed towards other members.
Thank You and Have a Nice Day!