andy_usaXFX's Nvidia cards are awesome, their factory overclocked cards are superior than most other brands (at least this is the case with GTX-260 Black Edition). I'm not sure if it's a good idea to make cards for ATI. ATI might mess up their company image given that the ATI drivers are really suck even up till now. ATI really needs to step up and refine the quality of their drive dept. or else Nvidia would just pwn them year after year just like how Intel did to them. ATI is really their last hope of surviving given that it's not too bold of a statement to say that the CPU war is over. It's just a marketing decision from XFX afterall.

How are ATi drivers bad? I mean they were around the HD 2000's but ever since HD 3000 they have been solid. The opposite can be said about nvidia tho.. I had trouble finding good drivers for my 8800GT because it seemed like they had a hundred versions out at once and most of the time the newer drivers sucked.

hell YES!!!!!!! XFX going ATI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ShadowFoldHow are ATi drivers bad? I mean they were around the HD 2000's but ever since HD 3000 they have been solid. The opposite can be said about nvidia tho.. I had trouble finding good drivers for my 8800GT because it seemed like they had a hundred versions out at once and most of the time the newer drivers sucked.

:nutkick::rockout:

nice back talk, too many trash talkers out there that need to be set straight

andy_usanot really trash talking, but honestly speaking ATI's Catalyst sucked is a well known fact among gamers. Just do ur research to see how it compared to nvidia's driver before trying to act like a wise guy... :laugh:

thats actually true, but you could just totally bypass catalyst and problem solved now.

4870x2 with double lifetime warranty.....

*droolzorz*

andy_usanot really trash talking, but honestly speaking ATI's Catalyst sucked is a well known fact among gamers. Just do ur research to see how it compared to nvidia's driver before trying to act like a wise guy... :laugh:

It's not so much a well known fact as it is a well circulated opinion amongst people who (by and large) don't even use ATi cards, much less anywhere close to the majority of the time... I've been using ATi personally since my old Radeon 9200, and been building with nVidia (mainboards and graphics) since even before then, and I can't honestly say that I prefer nVidia's drivers any more than ATi's in terms of usability and long-term reliability.

First off, if a modern computer can't handle CCC, that's flat out pathetic. And if you're still holding out against .NET, you have some imagined fears of Microsoft that you need to deal with... Besides, you could just not install it at all and use either in-game settings or a third party tool. Not a terribly difficult proposition...

ATi's Catalyst team was on the ball throughout '08, and they ended it on a high note with 8.12. I have absolutely no regrets in purchasing a 3850...

XFX 4870 x2 :cool:

andy_usanot really trash talking, but honestly speaking ATI's Catalyst sucked is a well known fact among gamers. Just do ur research to see how it compared to nvidia's driver before trying to act like a wise guy... :laugh:

he is however right NV drivers have come huge lengths compared to what they were around HD2000 times and for a single card they will be just as good quality wise as the NV drivers out right now.

now for multi card drivers NV still has the lead. just hands down, both companies are not the best cards for it at all but NV would get the crown in my opinion right now

F yeah, this is gonna be sweet!

andy_usanot really trash talking, but honestly speaking ATI's Catalyst sucked is a well known fact among gamers. Just do ur research to see how it compared to nvidia's driver before trying to act like a wise guy... :laugh:

TBH I haven't had problems with Cat Drivers since the Cat 3.8s, I'm thinking most people aren't installing them right, aka installing them on top of other drivers where you can't do that, and Nvidia is guilty of that as well. There is always something left in the registry that needs to be cleaned, those cleaner apps, Driver Sweeper from Guru3D and Driver Cleaner Pro from Driver Heaven, don't remove everything that is Driver related so you still have to go into the registry to remove them. Since Nvidia also makes Core logic as well those who use mobos with them need to be extra careful that they don't remove the wrong registry entries that are NV related after removing the vid drivers, otherwise they possibly would have to start fresh-that can apply to ATI Core logic before the AMD Annex. BTW calling me a wiseguy is a compliment because I have given quite a bit of advice to fellow users around here, so :toast: dude :D

NeoCrisisOoOo Black PCB 4850/70 FTW

+1 BIG TIME!

Also another Point, MS is building their OS around .net more than before (Vista is based upon it along with NT) XP- .net 1.0-3.5 is just the tip of the iceberg, and also NV CP utilizes the .net arch.

aj28It's not so much a well known fact as it is a well circulated opinion amongst people who (by and large) don't even use ATi cards, much less anywhere close to the majority of the time... I've been using ATi personally since my old Radeon 9200, and been building with nVidia (mainboards and graphics) since even before then, and I can't honestly say that I prefer nVidia's drivers any more than ATi's in terms of usability and long-term reliability.

First off, if a modern computer can't handle CCC, that's flat out pathetic. And if you're still holding out against .NET, you have some imagined fears of Microsoft that you need to deal with... Besides, you could just not install it at all and use either in-game settings or a third party tool. Not a terribly difficult proposition...

ATi's Catalyst team was on the ball throughout '08, and they ended it on a high note with 8.12. I have absolutely no regrets in purchasing a 3850...

Anyways Lets get back to Topic- I think it was a good move of XFX to expand their Verizon- because they are extremely Popular, if you noticed that Palit/Gainward/XpertVision have ATI Cards now which are popular amongst the TPU Populace amongst other Forum Sights. I'm sure EVGA is soon to follow suit since Both Companies boards are the Same.

ShadowFoldHow are ATi drivers bad? I mean they were around the HD 2000's but ever since HD 3000 they have been solid. The opposite can be said about nvidia tho.. I had trouble finding good drivers for my 8800GT because it seemed like they had a hundred versions out at once and most of the time the newer drivers sucked.

I have been using Nvidia cards for quite a while and practically never had a prob. I recently switched over to ATI and what a pain in the ass..(I used 3870X2, 4830s and 4850s)
The cards work fine, but the drivers are a lot harder to sort out and install than Nvidias.

To me ATIs site for drivers is a lot more complicated than Nvidias, Do I need .Net 2.0 or CCC or not? than there is all the VIVO stuff? WDM? and on and on..

MKmodsI have been using Nvidia cards for quite a while and practically never had a prob. I recently switched over to ATI and what a pain in the ass..(I used 3870X2, 4830s and 4850s)
The cards work fine, but the drivers are a lot harder to sort out and install than Nvidias.

To me ATIs site for drivers is a lot more complicated than Nvidias, Do I need .Net 2.0 or CCC or not? than there is all the VIVO stuff? WDM? and on and on..

AMD States you specifically need .net 2.0 Installed, and if you want full control of your card you need CCC installed, but if you don't want CCC there are options like ATI Tray Tools, ATI Tool, RivaTuner, Rage3D Tweak. You can also find NGOHQ Drivers with the Classic CP but they haven't developed it to the extent that it can be as useful as the CCC.

eidairaman1AMD States you specifically need .net 2.0 Installed, and if you want full control of your card you need CCC installed, but if you don't want CCC there are options like ATI Tray Tools, ATI Tool, RivaTuner, Rage3D Tweak. You can also find NGOHQ Drivers with the Classic CP but they haven't developed it to the extent that it can be as useful as the CCC.

I know that now but didnt at first.. ATIs site and drivers are a lot more complicated than Nvidias.

NGOHQ drivers? Remember not everyone is as bright as you guys..99% of comp users have no clue (or time to mess around) so Simple = Better.

eidairaman1AMD States you specifically need .net 2.0 Installed, and if you want full control of your card you need CCC installed, but if you don't want CCC there are options like ATI Tray Tools, ATI Tool, RivaTuner, Rage3D Tweak. You can also find NGOHQ Drivers with the Classic CP but they haven't developed it to the extent that it can be as useful as the CCC.

This is true, but I dunno about XFX, I know they are good, but I don't think they hold a candle to sapphire, powercolor, diamond, or visiontek though. - but those are 4 only make ATI so thats kinda biased.

either way the more support ATI gets the better

MKmodsI know that now but didnt at first.. ATIs site and drivers are a lot more complicated than Nvidias.

NGOHQ drivers? Remember not everyone is as bright as you guys..99% of comp users have no clue (or time to mess around) so Simple = Better.

that because people are lazy, or don't have time to read...:shadedshu
anyways that info should probably be sticky'd doubt that will happen though.

and I think honestly most people are ill informed about things.

sorry about the dbl post

You guys forget PALIT sells nvidia too ,So what is wrong with XFX doing the same...they could send us those booth babes.........:eek:

As for ATi`s drivers only twice I have had bad downloads or drivers in the last 5 year`s.Ounce you get the .NET fear out of the way and start using CCC it is a nice all around control panel.

MKmodsI know that now but didnt at first.. ATIs site and drivers are a lot more complicated than Nvidias.

NGOHQ drivers? Remember not everyone is as bright as you guys..99% of comp users have no clue (or time to mess around) so Simple = Better.

They are the Stock Drivers with the Classic CP there thats all.

MKmodsI have been using Nvidia cards for quite a while and practically never had a prob. I recently switched over to ATI and what a pain in the ass..(I used 3870X2, 4830s and 4850s)
The cards work fine, but the drivers are a lot harder to sort out and install than Nvidias.

To me ATIs site for drivers is a lot more complicated than Nvidias, Do I need .Net 2.0 or CCC or not? than there is all the VIVO stuff? WDM? and on and on..

i have to agree with MKmods here, i also been a long time nvidia user and just switched to ATI and at first it seemed more complex as well. I never had any driver issues with nvidia and so far ATI drivers seem to be doing their job also, i heard that they improved a great lately, at least Catalyst 8.10 that i'm using is pretty good. I think its more of issue of a learning period when moving to a new graphics platform.

KBDi have to agree with MKmods here, i also been a long time nvidia user and just switched to ATI and at first it seemed more complex as well. I never had any driver issues with nvidia and so far ATI drivers seem to be doing their job also, i heard that they improved a great lately, at least Catalyst 8.10 that i'm using is pretty good. I think its more of issue of a learning period when moving to a new graphics platform.

I agree take time to get use to new things and way`s.

Dunno why you guys have something against ATI's drivers, but all of them work great in my PC... heck i installed 8.12's right over 8.11's and i didn't even need to do a restart...
The only thing that ever happened to me is when i got 8.11 RC1, and they were heating up my VGA more than normal... but thats why its RC1 :D

It's just a matter of getting your OS updated regularily through win update...

oomph cant we get off the Topic of Drivers and Get back on Topic which is XFX Releasing more cards? To end all Driver topics here, Both Companies Make Leaps and Misleaps in Drivers ok, I have been on both sides of the fence and haven't had driver Problems since 2003

Comming into the ball game at a later stage then some of the current heavy weights, XFX seems to be doing rather well for themselves, especially with the amature overclocking crowd.

Preset overclocking settings was a very smart move by XFX and its safe to assume that they will continue to support those of us that dont know shit from clay when it comes to overclocking.

To the more trained user, we can all agree that preset overclocking is just another step that we could have tweaked too within 2 seconds and saved ourselves $100 or so.

Tweaking and then reselling AMD/ATi cards aswell is a logical step, cant believe they didnt get into it straight after the AMD/ATi merge.

Doesn't XFX only make reference-design PCB's? Either way, I don't mind seeing another partner for ATI.

As for the drivers, I've used both NV and ATI, and used both recently. Neither is better than the other. They are just different. ATI releases more WHQL drivers and only a few betas, whereas NV likes the betas, and spaces the WHQL releases out more. Personally, I like benchmarking, so the WHQL releases are what I prefer, but for a pure gamer, it doesn't really matter. Overall, the driver quality seems to be about equal between the two.