# Stability testing...Cinebench R23 mystery



## PaulieG (Feb 1, 2021)

Ok, I figured this was the best place to post this, as it's driving me crazy. I posted something similar in another sub forum much earlier in my testing and thought I had it solved, but now it's happening again. I have a Ryzen 3600x running at 4.4ghz on 1.29v. Memory is at 3838 18-19-19-42 on 1.39v. SOC v is 1.18v. I can run and pass 2 hours of realbench, an hour of the AIDA64 stress test with no errors. Cinebench R20 with no errors. I've run memtest5 for a couple of hours with no errors reported. Unigine Superposition benchmark runs give me scores competitive with others who have similar systems. However, when I run Cinebench R23, it will run down to 0:00 with no apparent problems. However, it will stay in "running" mode, and never quite finish the last rendering. Is there something it's picking up that even CB20 isnt? If I back off the clocks quite a bit, it will run all the way through.  Possible it a software glitch? Insight from anyone?


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## freeagent (Feb 1, 2021)

Did your monitor go to sleep?


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## PaulieG (Feb 1, 2021)

freeagent said:


> Did your monitor go to sleep?


Hmm. That's a good question. It's quite possible. That would do it? I'll try a run tonight and make sure it doesn't.


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## Regeneration (Feb 1, 2021)

Either your stress testing methodology is bad, too short, or something (e.g. LLC, C-states) interfering with the CPU voltage.


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 1, 2021)

I noticed the question about the monitor, but did you come back to a black screen? was the system responsive when you see it at 0:00 remaining or was it frozen?

This sounds like the renderer was reaching the end but could not complete. If you back down the clock and it passes, I would try a tiny touch more on the VCore just to see if it passes natively the same way it does when you "back down the clock"

Also, what is peak temp observed during these tests? Have you confirmed VCore/SOC with DMM especially under load to check actual voltage making it into CPU?

I have many follow up questions but let's start there.


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## freeagent (Feb 1, 2021)

I know the monitor thing was kind of outta left field. I noticed that same problem when my monitor goes to sleep.


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 1, 2021)

freeagent said:


> I know the monitor thing was kind of outta left field. I noticed that same problem when my monitor goes to sleep.


I am legit interested in what you mean. Like was your monitor trying to go to sleep unsuccessfully causing stability issues?


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## freeagent (Feb 1, 2021)

be quiet! - Shannon said:


> I am legit interested in what you mean. Like was your monitor trying to go to sleep unsuccessfully causing stability issues?


Maybe Ill run it again, because now I feel like what I am saying is making no sense.

Running R23, no problem.. but sometimes if my monitor sleeps while it renders, it will not complete rendering, yet shows me a score. The only thing I could think of that would cause it would be the monitor going to sleep. I extended the time to let the monitor run and the test completed with a score. I think that has happened to me 2-3 times on different windows installs. I suppose it could have been slightly unstable too, but seems unlikely as I try to find stability of some sorts before I bench a setting to make sure its not just being a random number generator.


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## thesmokingman (Feb 1, 2021)

Cinebench is NOT a stability test. R20 is actually really easy to run and R23 a little bit harder. Aida is not a stability test either really. If you want to prove stability run Prime 95 small for 20 minutes at the least or blend for 30-40 minutes.


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 1, 2021)

freeagent said:


> Maybe Ill run it again, because now I feel like what I am saying is making no sense.
> 
> Running R23, no problem.. but sometimes if my monitor sleeps while it renders, it will not complete rendering, yet shows me a score. The only thing I could think of that would cause it would be the monitor going to sleep. I extended the time to let the monitor run and the test completed with a score. I think that has happened to me 2-3 times on different windows installs. I suppose it could have been slightly unstable too, but seems unlikely as I try to find stability of some sorts before I bench a setting to make sure its not just being a random number generator.


Ok cool, I understand that, as you come back and the monitor was off/asleep and you wake it up and it didn't complete.

I am wondering if the OP had the same thing, as I didn't see him say his monitor was asleep.

being the precise OC the OP has cultivated, I am betting they are simply hitting a very specific loading point that tips stability on its side a bit and could be tuned to handle it.

Although I do want to mention that when I discuss OC advice I always tell people to stress test how they would use the system, otherwise to get something like Linpack stable can take a ton more voltage than actually necessary if you are simply gaming on the rig.

However, if the rig is being used for production/rendering... Well, you have to hit it with everything you got to ensure it is rock stable for these sorts of workloads.

Memory is paramount in this case as memory OC's and the SOC/IMC volts and overall quality can raise hell with stability. The IF has error correction, and can make an OC seem stable when in reality you lose performance which is an indicator that it is not super stable but the error correction is saving your bacon, so to speak.


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## PaulieG (Feb 1, 2021)

be quiet! - Shannon said:


> I noticed the question about the monitor, but did you come back to a black screen? was the system responsive when you see it at 0:00 remaining or was it frozen?
> 
> This sounds like the renderer was reaching the end but could not complete. If you back down the clock and it passes, I would try a tiny touch more on the VCore just to see if it passes natively the same way it does when you "back down the clock"
> 
> ...



I have confirmed all voltages with HWInfo. Everything is stable. Basically the CB23 clock goes to zero, and everything on the PC works as it should. It's just a few of the final rendering sections on the outer wall haven't completed and the running status doesn't go away, but nothing is actually frozen. I can just click start and the benchmark will start over. It's just weird that it can pass CB20 and all other benchmarcks I've thrown at it.


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 1, 2021)

PaulieG said:


> I have confirmed all voltages with HWInfo. Everything is stable. Basically the CB23 clock goes to zero, and everything on the PC works as it should. It's just a few of the final rendering sections on the outer wall haven't completed and the running status doesn't go away, but nothing is actually frozen. I can just click start and the benchmark will start over. It's just weird that it can pass CB20 and all other benchmarcks I've thrown at it.


Ok cool, but just as I'm sure you know HWInfo, or any other software measurement can be good but in many cases wildly inaccurate. This is why I asked if you had tested it at a hardware level to see if you are dealing with any droop/fluctuation which can lead to instability.


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## PaulieG (Feb 1, 2021)

thesmokingman said:


> Cinebench is NOT a stability test. R20 is actually really easy to run and R23 a little bit harder. Aida is not a stability test either really. If you want to prove stability run Prime 95 small for 20 minutes at the least or blend for 30-40 minutes


I should have mentioned prime95. I did run it for about 30 minutes without errors. I don't like running chips on prime for hours and hours anymore.


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## thesmokingman (Feb 1, 2021)

be quiet! - Shannon said:


> Ok cool, but just as I'm sure you know HWInfo, or any other software measurement can be good but in many cases wildly inaccurate. This is why I asked if you had tested it at a hardware level to see if you are dealing with any droop/fluctuation which can lead to instability.


Not many ppl have that ability. And there are many things to check before even getting to that point. 

OP is runnig a manual overclock and he's most likely not stable.



PaulieG said:


> I should have mentioned prime95. I did run it for about 30 minutes without errors. I don't like running chips on prime for hours and hours anymore.


Did you run it in blend? It matters which prime test you run as each tests a different aspect. Small/Smallest is for heat, power, cooling. Large is memory. Blend combines all test, takes a bit longer to run.


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 1, 2021)

thesmokingman said:


> Not many ppl have that ability. And there are many things to check before even getting to that point.
> 
> OP is runnig a manual overclock and he's most likely not stable.


I agree, it is very likely not stable which is why I made the recommendations as I did.

As far as the ability to test, a DMM is really cheap, and even said cheap model will do a good enough job (comparing cheap harbor freight DMM to my Flukes and they are comparable) to confirm your volts, and well a DMM is honestly a good tool to have on hand when pushing PC components.

If you are referring to where to measure, that also is quite easy to do as the choke/inductor legs make great probe points as long as you are careful.


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## freeagent (Feb 1, 2021)

thesmokingman said:


> Did you run it in blend? It matters which prime test you run as each tests a different aspect. Small/Smallest is for heat, power, cooling. Large is memory. Blend combines all test, takes a bit longer to run.


Prime 95 is a complete waste of time. You can be 24 hour prime stable and still have a game crash, still get blue screens. Still have shutdowns. Waste of time and electricity.


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## thesmokingman (Feb 1, 2021)

freeagent said:


> Prime 95 is a complete waste of time. You can be 24 hour prime stable and still have a game crash, still get blue screens. Still have shutdowns. Waste of time and electricity.


Yea, if you run only small which just creates heat and is more of a cooling test, duh.


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## freeagent (Feb 1, 2021)

thesmokingman said:


> Yea, if you run only small which just creates heat and is more of a cooling test, duh.


Yeah maybe.. lol 

Well whatever 

Edit:

I still like Linpack Extreme better


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 1, 2021)

ahhh, i am probably dating myself here, but I remember when Prime 95 was the end all tell all of PC stability testing. Back when tuning took work, and everything was not a simple toggle in the UEFI, actually pre-UEFI. Also, Everest exists/existed, so you fellow old-timers don't get after me for missing it, same with using WCG to test.

TBH, Prime95 has its purpose, but its usage as a stability test tool has shifted to being part of the suite you may use, but not the primary source of discerning stability.

with the way these new chips work, and especially with AMD's error correction in the IF, you have to see some scores as you OC to know if you are seeing a performance decline. Otherwise, you could be sitting on an unstable OC and not even know it until your OS is hosed or you get crashing within a specific workload.


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## ThrashZone (Feb 1, 2021)

Hi,
All I use is blender opendata or install blender and use some of their free demo files, Cycles renders to be exact which some have gpu tests too but most are cpu renders.
Other than that simple gaming and regular benchmarks
Blender Open Data — blender.org

Blender
Demo Files — blender.org


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## PaulieG (Feb 1, 2021)

thesmokingman said:


> Not many ppl have that ability. And there are many things to check before even getting to that point.
> 
> OP is runnig a manual overclock and he's most likely not stable.
> 
> ...


I always run blend first. Always. However, as Shannon mentioned above, it's no longer the primary focus of stability testing, so I just did a short run.



freeagent said:


> Did your monitor go to sleep?


This was the entire problem. It had nothing to do with stability whatsoever. It was simply allowing my monitor to sleep before the cinebench was done. Do you have any idea how much time you saved me from banging my head against the wall and following dead ends? I owe you one. I never would have thought of this in a million years.


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## freeagent (Feb 2, 2021)

Happy to help! Sometimes its just the little things..


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## harm9963 (Feb 2, 2021)

Ten min test, no sleep or anything ,but 30 men test , will see what happens.

30 min test ,  will complete the loop , even if zero shows .


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 2, 2021)

PaulieG said:


> I always run blend first. Always. However, as Shannon mentioned above, it's no longer the primary focus of stability testing, so I just did a short run.
> 
> 
> This was the entire problem. It had nothing to do with stability whatsoever. It was simply allowing my monitor to sleep before the cinebench was done. Do you have any idea how much time you saved me from banging my head against the wall and following dead ends? I owe you one. I never would have thought of this in a million years.


TIL, I am never too old to learn something new.

I can say I have never seen this before, but good one to deposit in the ole gray matter for future consideration.

Good call freeagent.


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## freeagent (Feb 2, 2021)

Its happened to me a few times.. I have torn apart overclocks looking for any weakness. No weakness. I do have my monitor set to sleep after 5 minutes.. and that's when I put two and two together and experimented with a 15 minute sleep time instead and it completed. I just built this computer a couple of months ago so have been tuning, tweaking and testing quite a bit over the last couple of months.. it was just an observation..


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## be quiet! - Shannon (Feb 3, 2021)

freeagent said:


> Its happened to me a few times.. I have torn apart overclocks looking for any weakness. No weakness. I do have my monitor set to sleep after 5 minutes.. and that's when I put two and two together and experimented with a 15 minute sleep time instead and it completed. I just built this computer a couple of months ago so have been tuning, tweaking and testing quite a bit over the last couple of months.. it was just an observation..



The first thing I change on any new rig is disabling monitor/system sleep and hibernation, so admittedly I have never seen this.


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## phanbuey (Feb 3, 2021)

Cinebench - "Ok, guys I am done!!  CPU, GPU!?! - We're done!!"
CPU - "Oh thank god, I'm melting"
GPU -


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## PaulieG (Feb 3, 2021)

be quiet! - Shannon said:


> The first thing I change on any new rig is disabling monitor/system sleep and hibernation, so admittedly I have never seen this.


Yeah. I took a 5 year hiatus from building, then just built 3 systems over the last 2 weeks, so I'm still a little rusty with the habits that used to be second nature. 

Unrelated. In one of those builds I installed 6 Pure Wings 2 fans. Nice fans, but I wish I had bought Shadow Wing 2 instead for the quieter operation and better anti-vibration.


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