# I think I killed my MSI Z97 U3 PLUS Motherboard!!!



## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

Working on installing a brand new Vega 64, and 34" monitor to complete my dream machine.

First step, hook up the 34" to the on board graphics.  PC will boot into windows, but won't show the UEFI Bios screen.  I plug my 24" Dell monitor and it works fine.  I noticed that the BIOS on my MSI Z97 was way old (first version).

I download the BIOS, put it on a USB thumb drive and run M-Flash.  Goes through the BIOS ME update, then 100% through the BIOS update itself.  Says success and says I can wait 5 seconds or reboot myself.

I wait 5 second and let it reboot on it's own... fans spin up, no beep, no nothing.  No signal on the screen.

Take out battery, unplug, reset CMOS, wait 15 minutes, same thing.  Fans spin up, but no beep and absolutely no signal to the monitor.  Tried 3 different times.

This board has a soldered on BIOS chip and no second BIOS.  I'm sooooo pissed.  My new toys (over $1,000 worth) are sitting next to a dead box.


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 21, 2017)

What monitor is connected, Dell or newest?

look at this:  *https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=180978.0*


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> What monitor is connected, Dell or newest?



Tried both, Dell with DVI and LG with HDMI.  No signal.  They were working before the flash.


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## steen (Nov 21, 2017)

Typical Asus behavior. Remove all USB, PCIe devices. Use igpu & Dell display. Boot with a single RAM module. Try different slots. When clearing CMOS via jumper, remove battery & short out battery terminals too - belt & braces...


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 21, 2017)

See edit *LINK* above and *https://www.bing.com/search?q=MSI+Z97+Bios+recovery&src=IE-SearchBox&FORM=IESR4A&pc=EUPP_

Says to wait 30 min for bios recovery.*


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> See edit *LINK* above and *https://www.bing.com/search?q=MSI+Z97+Bios+recovery&src=IE-SearchBox&FORM=IESR4A&pc=EUPP_
> 
> Says to wait 30 min for bios recovery.*



Worth a shot, put the USB stick back in the 2.0 slot, turned it on.  No monitor signal same as before, guess I'll check in the AM


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## Jetster (Nov 21, 2017)

That sucks


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## Solaris17 (Nov 21, 2017)

do you have a eeprom flasher?


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 21, 2017)

steen said:


> Typical Asus behavior. Remove all USB, PCIe devices. *Use igpu & Dell display*. Boot with a single RAM module. Try different slots. When clearing CMOS via jumper, remove battery & short out battery terminals too - belt & braces...



Make sure to use the* iGPU and Dell.  *I read somewhere that the new monitors can have an issue if not on Windows 10  and I see your on W7 per specs.
*
That MSI Flash said something about hitting F2,  https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=180978.0



*


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> Make sure to use the* iGPU and Dell.  *I read somewhere that the new monitors can have an issue if not on Windows 10  and I see your on W7 per specs.
> *
> That MSI Flash said something about hitting F2, https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=180978.0
> *



*The keyboard and mouse isn't initializing, no lights.  Tried letting it sit, it even turned itself off after a while (no idea how long).*
*

@Solaris17 pointed me to an eprom device that specifically works on MIS boards.  Going that route next.
*


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 21, 2017)

There are some *other links/ resolutions* in the second search that might be useful.
*https://www.bing.com/search?q=MSI+Z97+Bios+recovery&src=IE-SearchBox&FORM=IESR4A&pc=EUPP_*

*Did you disconnect SSD's, VEGA and other non essentials?*

Hope you have success.

Perhaps a different flash utility from MSI, *https://forum-en.msi.com/faq/article/printer/user-guide-for-msi-hq-forum-flash-tool*


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> There are some *other links/ resolutions* in the second search that might be useful.
> *https://www.bing.com/search?q=MSI+Z97+Bios+recovery&src=IE-SearchBox&FORM=IESR4A&pc=EUPP_*
> 
> *Did you disconnect SSD's, VEGA and other non essentials?*
> ...



While I wait for the gadget to arrive, I'm going to try those.  I wanna play games over the holiday weekend!


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 21, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> Perhaps a different flash utility from MSI, *https://forum-en.msi.com/faq/article/printer/user-guide-for-msi-hq-forum-flash-tool*



I made an edit above: https://forum-en.msi.com/faq/article/printer/user-guide-for-msi-hq-forum-flash-tool

I used this flash tool on a MSI Z68A-GD65 (G3) had to search MSI Forums for updated Bios due to B3 error when trying an external GTX1050, it only wanted to use the iGPU.  It would not boot at all with the gtx1050 as primary, Black screen with small B3 in upper left corner.  After I found the correct bios and it worked, I also had to change a bios setting that was obscurely explained for the gtx1050 to work, due to the iGPU. 

I'm crying with you, what a PITA.


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## jboydgolfer (Nov 21, 2017)

What does Dr. debug say when you power on?

 I only buy asrock motherboards (so excuse me) is it not common for all motherboards to come with Dr. debug nowadays?


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

jboydgolfer said:


> What does Dr. debug say when you power on?
> 
> I only buy asrock motherboards (so excuse me) is it not common for all motherboards to come with Dr. debug nowadays?



From all the googling and whats on my board, most mid range MSIs come with a blue LED that give a clue.  If I power down with a power button hold down, sometimes the LED will flash about 10 time or so (I didn't count)... That's all I can find for any kind of diagnostics.


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## jboydgolfer (Nov 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> From all the googling and whats on my board, most mid range MSIs come with a blue LED that give a clue.  If I power down with a power button hold down, sometimes the LED will flash about 10 time or so (I didn't count)... That's all I can find for any kind of diagnostics.



Maybe see if there is something in the manual?

http://download.msi.com/archive/mnu_exe/7922v1.0_ASIA.zip


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

jboydgolfer said:


> Maybe see if there is something in the manual?
> 
> http://download.msi.com/archive/mnu_exe/7922v1.0_ASIA.zip



I didn't see anything last night, I'll check again


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## jboydgolfer (Nov 21, 2017)

it seems like theres nothing. i read the manual, i saw NOTHING regarding any diagnostic info.....thats another reason im glad i buy asrock.....i suggest you do the same from now on....DrDebug is a must have. rarely you need it, but when you do, like a sweater its invaluable.

it just sucks when this shit happens....after SO much preperation, and purchasing.....im sorry man, i hope it gets worked out Quickly


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## Vario (Nov 21, 2017)

Its probably not permanently bricked, EEPROM flasher should get it or buy another bios chip, flash it, then solder that on.  Will probably be a hassle though.


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## EarthDog (Nov 21, 2017)

Just a side note, asrock has plenty of boards without a debug led display. Its more about the tier of board than it is brand. 

To the op, a "msi z97" in your system specs tells us a little above nothing since they had around half dozen plus boards (it is in teh title though, I see now).


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## silentbogo (Nov 21, 2017)

No need to solder anything. There is an SPI breakout right on the motherboard for easy servicing( *JSPI1*, right below the front panel USB3.0 connector). 
If @Solaris17 suggested our favorite Flashcat as a tool for the task, then you should get some 2mm dupoint jumpers in the bundle instead of the normal 10-pin ribbon cable.


Haven't found the pinout in the manual, so just in case:






I have a few broken MSI boards in the office. Wait a few hours, and I will confirm the proper pinout for JSPI1


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> No need to solder anything. There is an SPI breakout right on the motherboard for easy servicing( *JSPI1*, right below the front panel USB3.0 connector).
> If @Solaris17 suggested our favorite Flashcat as a tool for the task, then you should get some 2mm dupoint jumpers in the bundle instead of the normal 10-pin ribbon cable.
> 
> 
> ...



Bingo... MSI does have a backdoor into the EEPROM chip!  I just ordered this:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00F2P9AS6/?tag=tec06d-20





and this:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B015W4PKR6/?tag=tec06d-20


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## ShiBDiB (Nov 21, 2017)

Why not just RMA the board and get a new one before you go down roads that could void any future RMA requests.

https://service.msicomputer.com/msi_user/support/rma_form.aspx


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## EarthDog (Nov 21, 2017)

He 'wants to play games' this weekend...


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## silentbogo (Nov 21, 2017)

Well, your kit does include 2mm jumpers, so you don't really need a clip.
I've checked the pinout on Z97 MPOWER board and it seems to be exactly the same (of course, except the ChipSelect switch for dual BIOS). 
Good luck flashing! Let us know how it goes.


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

EarthDog said:


> He 'wants to play games' this weekend...



EXACTLY... I'd also like to say I flashed an EEPROM and got a computer working... with a little help from friends at TPU



silentbogo said:


> of course, except the ChipSelect switch for dual BIOS



I hate you


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## silentbogo (Nov 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I hate you


Next thing we are going to teach you is how to mod your motherboard to have as many BIOSes as you want


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## Solaris17 (Nov 21, 2017)

the cool thing about the programmers is if your board doesnt allow you to save profiles you can even dump the BIOS after you config it so if you ever somehow mess it up you can just flash it back.

sure did recommend the flash cat. Just remember to get at us incase its blanked and we can help you switch it to DFU mode and flash the SPI programming to the controller.


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> the cool thing about the programmers is if your board doesnt allow you to save profiles you can even dump the BIOS after you config it so if you ever somehow mess it up you can just flash it back.
> 
> sure did recommend the flash cat. Just remember to get at us incase its blanked and we can help you switch it to DFU mode and flash the SPI programming to the controller.



First thing I did before flashing was write out the original BIOS to the thumb drive. I'm patting myself on the back lol.

What is DFU?


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## kurosagi01 (Nov 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> What is DFU?


Can't really help you with your mobo but DFU = Device Firmware Upgrade generally


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## Solaris17 (Nov 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> First thing I did before flashing was write out the original BIOS to the thumb drive. I'm patting myself on the back lol.
> 
> What is DFU?





kurosagi01 said:


> Can't really help you with your mobo but DFU = Device Firmware Upgrade generally



yup the flash cat can do other things other then SPI, it can also flash NAND JTAG and some others. so sometimes when you buy a new device the units controller will be blank. So we just have to grab the provided software package from flashcat themselves and flash the flashcat if you will to tell it we will be working with SPI devices. Since all fo those different modes (JTAG, NAND, SPI etc) speak different languages if you will. We want it to speak SPI so it can talk to your bios chip.


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> yup the flash cat can do other things other then SPI, it can also flash NAND JTAG and some others. so sometimes when you buy a new device the units controller will be blank. So we just have to grab the provided software package from flashcat themselves and flash the flashcat if you will to tell it we will be working with SPI devices. Since all fo those different modes (JTAG, NAND, SPI etc) speak different languages if you will. We want it to speak SPI so it can talk to your bios chip.



Aside from all the acronyms, it sounds pretty straightforward


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## jboydgolfer (Nov 21, 2017)

EarthDog said:


> asrock has plenty of boards without a debug led display



 I can't say yes or no to that (because I haven't looked into it) but I was specifically speaking to this thread & the Z type motherboard series (which I have owned many of from asrock & every one had Dr. debug not to mention even the H motherboards I've owned had Dr. debug , all from asrock). Of course its anecdotal (but thats obvious.) even the $40 h110m has drdebug. im curious now , which of their boards DONT have Dr debug??

hell, my board actually has more than one bios built in from factory...i didnt even know what the switch was.


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## infrared (Nov 21, 2017)

Good luck Sasqui


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

infrared said:


> Good luck Sasqui



I'll definitely be back with results.  Wouldn't have even know if it wasn't for @Solaris17 ...he's offered to help when I get into the thick of using the FlashCAT


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## Vario (Nov 21, 2017)

ShiBDiB said:


> Why not just RMA the board and get a new one before you go down roads that could void any future RMA requests.
> 
> https://service.msicomputer.com/msi_user/support/rma_form.aspx


I don't think its worth RMAing the board.  They might send him a refurb that performs worse than his current.  He is best off fixing this himself, IMO.  I don't see how anything he does will void, hes just flashing a bios.


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## jaggerwild (Nov 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Bingo... MSI does have a backdoor into the EEPROM chip!  I just ordered this:
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00F2P9AS6/?tag=tec06d-20
> 
> ...




LOLZ!
 All you had to do is an over night CMOS clear, them gadgets are worthless sold by  failure's. Another "TOMSHARDWARE" save.........


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## silentbogo (Nov 21, 2017)

jaggerwild said:


> LOLZ!
> All you had to do is an over night CMOS clear, them gadgets are worthless sold by failure's. Another "TOMSHARDWARE" save.........


...Only if used by whiners with no skills. 
Overnight CMOS clear? I won't even ask why....


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## Solaris17 (Nov 21, 2017)

jaggerwild said:


> LOLZ!
> All you had to do is an over night CMOS clear, them gadgets are worthless sold by  failure's. Another "TOMSHARDWARE" save.........



eeprom flashers arent worthless, they save tons of hardware. Dont think its a gimmick because its something you clearly dont have enough experience with. Overnight CMOS clear....on a chip that has corrupt data on it...are you from TOMS?


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## eidairaman1 (Nov 21, 2017)

jboydgolfer said:


> What does Dr. debug say when you power on?
> 
> I only buy asrock motherboards (so excuse me) is it not common for all motherboards to come with Dr. debug nowadays?



My board didn't in 2014


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> eeprom flashers arent worthless, they save tons of hardware. Dont think its a gimmick because its something you clearly dont have enough experience with. Overnight CMOS clear....on a chip that has corrupt data on it...are you from TOMS?



Ok, don't mention that name here!  Lol.  You should post the vid you sent me.  I'm a believer


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## eidairaman1 (Nov 21, 2017)

I say breadboard this rig for starters, disconnect power completely, check your cpu installation, ram etc, reseat everything, find out what the primary display connector is. Make sure the monitor is on the correct input. Do a clear cmos with battery inserted, then remove it. Wait a few hours, reinsert battery then move bios jumper back to correct position. Only have mouse and keyboard hooked up with monitor, try starting, if no dice try a bios reprogram as @Solaris tried or rma the board stating it wont post...


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

eidairaman1 said:


> I say breadboard this rig for starters, disconnect power completely, check your cpu installation, ram etc, reseat everything, find out what the primary display connector is. Make sure the monitor is on the correct input. Do a clear cmos with battery inserted, then remove it. Wait a few hours, reinsert battery then move bios jumper back to correct position. Only have mouse and keyboard hooked up with monitor, try starting, if no dice try a bios reprogram as @Solaris tried or rma the board stating it wont post...



Seeing how the problem started immediately after rebooting from what looked like a successful flash, I have my doubts about ripping the guts out.  That said, if I have time Friday, that's what I'll probably do.  I don't even know what the board has for a warranty, but an RMA is my very last resort.


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## Solaris17 (Nov 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Ok, don't mention that name here!  Lol.  You should post the vid you sent me.  I'm a believer



I mean @davidm71  brought his foxconn nano back to life like last week.

https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/bad-flash-foxconn-nt-525-netbox-paperweight-now.238615/

@silentbogo  remembers that too. maybe @jaggerwild should ask that happy camper how snakeoil that epprom flasher result was.


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## Sasqui (Nov 21, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> I mean @davidm71  brought his foxconn nano back to life like last week.
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/bad-flash-foxconn-nt-525-netbox-paperweight-now.238615/
> 
> @silentbogo  remembers that too. maybe @jaggerwild should ask that happy camper how snakeoil that epprom flasher result was.



That thread was a fun read, and positive results too.


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## jaggerwild (Nov 21, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> ...Only if used by whiners with no skills.
> Overnight CMOS clear? I won't even ask why....




 If you googled Easy Z97 fix in this sub form.


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## eidairaman1 (Nov 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Seeing how the problem started immediately after rebooting from what looked like a successful flash, I have my doubts about ripping the guts out.  That said, if I have time Friday, that's what I'll probably do.  I don't even know what the board has for a warranty, but an RMA is my very last resort.



Ok on another perspective, to work with a programmer you will want the board laying horizontally on a non conductive table out in the open with bright light, no shadows over your eeprom contacts when you repro the chip. If it was possible Id go back to plcc chips, why the market got away from them drives me nuts


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## ShiBDiB (Nov 22, 2017)

Vario said:


> I don't think its worth RMAing the board.  They might send him a refurb that performs worse than his current.  He is best off fixing this himself, IMO.  I don't see how anything he does will void, hes just flashing a bios.



What? His current literally doesn't work at all..


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## Vario (Nov 22, 2017)

ShiBDiB said:


> What? His current literally doesn't work at all..


If its just a bios problem it will perform great once he gets a bios successfully onto it.  Doing an RMA and he might get a previously actually physically damaged and then repaired board.


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## Sasqui (Nov 22, 2017)

jaggerwild said:


> If you googled Easy Z97 fix in this sub form.



Link?



Vario said:


> If its just a bios problem it will perform great once he gets a bios successfully onto it.  Doing an RMA and he might get a previously actually physically damaged and then repaired board.



Spot on, not to mention shipping costs and time

I'm very much looking forward to diving into the flash-it-myself route


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## jaggerwild (Nov 22, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Working on installing a brand new Vega 64, and 34" monitor to complete my dream machine.
> 
> First step, hook up the 34" to the on board graphics.  PC will boot into windows, but won't show the UEFI Bios screen.  I plug my 24" Dell monitor and it works fine.  I noticed that the BIOS on my MSI Z97 was way old (first version).
> 
> ...




Boot the board, the bios flash was good. When the board hangs on boot, hit "RESET"(with the board powered on), board will boot then. You can send me money when it works too!


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## Sasqui (Nov 22, 2017)

jaggerwild said:


> Boot the board, the bios flash was good. When the board hangs on boot, hit "RESET"(with the board powered on), board will boot then. You can send me money when it works too!



Easy enough that it's worth a try, will let you know either way


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## Sasqui (Nov 22, 2017)

jaggerwild said:


> Boot the board, the bios flash was good. When the board hangs on boot, hit "RESET"(with the board powered on), board will boot then. You can send me money when it works too!



Sorry man, no money coming your way.  Tried it 100 different ways to Sunday just 15 minutes ago.  I even had the CMOS clear jumper on with the battery out since last night.  Took off the CMOS jumper and put the battery back in, powered up, nothing, held the reset button nothing.  Just spinning fans.  Held the power button down, shut off, turned on, held the reset button, still same thing.

If I shutdown by holding the power button, that's when the blue LED comes on, it blinks 16 times then stops.


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## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

@Solaris17 @silentbogo

Ok, now things are getting weird.  I was looking into the BIOS I saved from the motherboard and comparing it with the VER 1.A I downloaded from MSI, then the apparent VER 1.0, the file sizes are different, does that indicate I've got the wrong ROM?






Here's a pic of the MB:





Here's where I downloaded the 1A and 10 BIOS files you see above:

https://us.msi.com/Motherboard/support/Z97-U3-PLUS

I google MS-7922 and it lands on *Z97S SLI Krait Edition
*
Is the V1.1 a "one-off" of the Z97 U3 PLUS?


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

So if you have the wrong bios, why did it not say there was a mismatch and say you have the wrong version and can't proceed?


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## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> why did it not say there was a mismatch and say you have the wrong version and can't proceed



Good question, because it didn't.  I watched the whole process.  It did an update of "BIOS ME" first, then an update of "BIOS"

...and there's no mismatch between the MB model and the MSI support page.  The only thing that seems off is the VER 1.1  and I searched for that as well, with no results.


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

What ver bios did you flash? I thought ver 1.4 was newest then found ver 1.6 here:

*http://drivers.softpedia.com/get/BIOS/Msi/MSI-Z97-U3-PLUS-BIOS-1-6.shtml

EDIT:  This page shows 1.A as newest:
https://us.msi.com/Motherboard/support/Z97-U3-PLUS#down-bios

Look at ver 1.8 notes regarding Intel graphics driver???*


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## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> What ver bios did you flash? I thought ver 1.4 was newest then found ver 1.6 here:
> 
> *http://drivers.softpedia.com/get/BIOS/Msi/MSI-Z97-U3-PLUS-BIOS-1-6.shtml
> 
> ...



The .1A0 version in the screenshot above, file size 8,192 KB

All of the versions on softpedia are *8,192 KB* ....as are the ones on the MSI site.  The one I saved from the MB is *6,656 KB*  (refer to screenshot above)


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> The .1A0 version in the screenshot above, file size 8,192 KB
> 
> All of the versions on softpedia are *8,192 KB* ....as are the ones on the MSI site. The one I saved from the MB is *6,656 KB* (refer to screenshot above)




Do you have another BLANK USB drive to try blind flashing another ver bios nearest the top but not 1.A.  Also, are you using the correct USB port on the back of the MB??

*EDIT: That MSIHQ DOS Flash Utility saved my ass.*


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## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> Do you have another BLANK USB drive to try blind flashing another ver bios nearest the top but not 1.A.  Also, are you using the correct USB port on the back of the MB??



No idea how to blind flash, honestly.  USB was plugged into one of the 2x USB 2.0 slots on the IO panel, it wouldn't work on any of the USB 3.0 slots


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## Solaris17 (Nov 23, 2017)

They aren't related. 1.1 is the PCB version of the board not an indication of what BIOS was one it or what one it should have. The web page would indicate that difference otherwise. 1.A is the newest BIOS since it comes after 1.9 and this boards naming scheme ends numbers with 9 so there would not be a 1.10 for example. 

The bios sizes can vastly change depending on changes specifically to the UEFI structure since it takes more space and more so boards that belong to generations of CPUs that change alot after launch. x299 is a big contender here since there is alot of varience in what the chips can do and alot of the chips were un-released at launch so the BIOS sizes vary wildly.


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## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> They aren't related. 1.1 is the PCB version of the board not an indication of what BIOS was one it or what one it should have. The web page would indicate that difference otherwise. 1.A is the newest BIOS since it comes after 1.9 and this boards naming scheme ends numbers with 9 so there would not be a 1.10 for example.
> 
> The bios sizes can vastly change depending on changes specifically to the UEFI structure since it takes more space and more so boards that belong to generations of CPUs that change alot after launch. x299 is a big contender here since there is alot of varience in what the chips can do and alot of the chips were un-released at launch so the BIOS sizes vary wildly.



If you look at the screenshot, the DOWNLOADED .100 BIOS and .1A0 BIOS are the same size, BUT not the same size as the .100 BIOS saved from the MB.

My GIGA UD5H had two MB versions 1.0 and 1.1, each have their own BIOS version, I know that firsthand ...EDIT (but Gigabyte makes that clear on the support site)


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> No idea how to blind flash, honestly. USB was plugged into one of the 2x USB 2.0 slots on the IO panel, it wouldn't work on any of the USB 3.0 slots




You prepare the usb stick put it in the back slot and boot tapping the F2 key to get a prompt

Do you have the CD that came with the motherboard.  Often there is a Bios restore utility on the disk.


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## Solaris17 (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> If you look at the screenshot, the DOWNLOADED .100 BIOS and .1A0 BIOS are the same size, BUT not the same size as the .100 BIOS saved from the MB.
> 
> My GIGA UD5H had two MB versions 1.0 and 1.1, each have their own BIOS version, I know that firsthand.



Yes because the updates include the firmware for Intel ME but ME is not part of the main BIOS block and would not be dumped.


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## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> You prepare the usb stick put it in the back slot and boot tapping the F2 key to get a prompt
> 
> Do you have the CD that came with the motherboard.  Often there is a Bios restore utility on the disk.



The board will not boot at all after the flash to .1A, see the OP 



Solaris17 said:


> Yes because the updates include the firmware for Intel ME but ME is not part of the main BIOS block and would not be dumped.



When I flashed with M-Flash, it did an update of "BIOS ME" first, then an update of "BIOS"


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## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

See these instructions:

*https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=184066.msg1323020#msg1323020



Sasqui said:



			The board will not boot at all after the flash to .1A, see the OP 

Click to expand...


That's blind flashing, you don't get a screen at all but the disk will restore the factory bios.
The manual should have instructions.*


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## Solaris17 (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> The board will not boot at all after the flash to .1A, see the OP
> 
> 
> 
> When I flashed with M-Flash, it did an update of "BIOS ME" first, then an update of "BIOS"



yup. ME stands for Management Engine the main BIOS block "BIOS" is all the stuff you see when you hit DEL at startup. Thats the stuff you actually interact with.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> See these instructions:
> 
> *https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=184066.msg1323020#msg1323020*



I had no problems with the BIOS flash up until the part after it said it was successful and to either restart manually or wait 5 seconds.  I let it reboot and the system was bricked.



Solaris17 said:


> yup. ME stands for Management Engine the main BIOS block "BIOS" is all the stuff you see when you hit DEL at startup. Thats the stuff you actually interact with.



So that's all contained in the .1A0 file?  The download includes that and a .EXE file (along with a .TXT file)


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I had no problems with the BIOS flash up until the part after it said it was successful and to either restart manually or wait 5 seconds.  I let it reboot and the system was bricked.
> 
> 
> 
> So that's all contained in the .1A0 file?  The download includes that and a .EXE file (along with a .TXT file)



yup the txt is usually just instruction. the exe is just the flash tool. all the good stuff is in the actual binary BIOS file.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> yup the txt is usually just instruction. the exe is just the flash tool. all the good stuff is in the actual binary BIOS file.



Here's the contents of the BIOS download from MSI (Ver .100):

...AFUDE238.EXE is a flash tool?


----------



## Final_Fighter (Nov 23, 2017)

if you can get a .bin image from a bios recovery business there is a way to program the chip without having to solder it off. you would need these 2 things and the drivers.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/SOIC8-SOP8...ST-SHIP-USA-/253229896571?hash=item3af5ad937b

https://www.ebay.com/itm/CH341A-Ser...r-Pin-board-/282708460008?hash=item41d2bcc1e8










the drivers are in the description.

i emailed a company that does bios recovery to see if i can get an image and let you know. sometimes the programmer cant read the bios when its on the motherboard and you need to have it removed then program it. its a hit and miss type situation. if you need to remove it its not that hard to do, just look up some youtube vids.

edit: with this programmer you cant just flash the bios image from the msi website, they are structured differently. you have to get one thats all setup and ready to go like they are when they are programed by them when new. i would need to email msi to see if they can get a fresh bios. usually they will just give me the run around. if you email them tel them you need one that you can flash directly onto the chip because you have a programmer.

edit 2: the way the guy shows it in the video is with the bios removed. with the adapter i listed you can just clip it onto the motherboard. 

here is another rundown of how to use it.

http://www.overclock.net/t/1612108/...o-unbrick-flash-almost-any-card-amd-or-nvidia


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

Final_Fighter said:


> if you can get a .bin image from a bios recovery business there is a way to program the chip without having to solder it off. you would need these 2 things and the drivers.



There's a way to do it without slaughtering the MB   See this post:  https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...-z97-u3-plus-motherboard.238973/#post-3757569

I also save the original BIOS file before I flashed


----------



## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

So when you use the MSIHQ tool to create a bootable USB drive,  when the tool opens, you have to add the .bin file(or whatever the .extension file is) and run the program.  It incorporates the Bios into the program and makes a bootable USB drive.

The Master USB ports are the ones nearest the keyboard/mouse inputs.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Here's the contents of the BIOS download from MSI (Ver .100):
> 
> ...AFUDE238.EXE is a flash tool?
> 
> View attachment 94204



Yup. what you would do is create an MS-DOS startup disk using RUFUS for example. then you would put the .exe and the BIOS on the drive and boot from it. You would land at an old school looking DOS prompt and you would literally type AFUDE238.exe and it would run the flash tool.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> So when you use the MSIHQ tool to create a bootable USB drive,  when the tool opens, you have to add the .bin file(or whatever the .extension file is) and run the program.  It incorporates the Bios into the program and makes a bootable USB drive.
> 
> The Master USB ports are the ones nearest the keyboard/mouse inputs.



The system is bricked as far as I can tell, no video signal, no lights on keyboard and mouse.  The fans power up but nothing else.  I did notice the light on the USB drive come on, but no activity, just stays lit.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

Busy day tomorrow, need sleep   Thanks all for the help.  The FlashCAT is arriving Friday and I plan to re-flash with the original bios file to start with.


----------



## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

Keyboard usb or din plug?  If you have a old keyboard with DIN, use that.


----------



## Final_Fighter (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> There's a way to do it without slaughtering the MB   See this post:  https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...-z97-u3-plus-motherboard.238973/#post-3757569
> 
> I also save the original BIOS file before I flashed



thats your best bet. i did not read threw the whole forum but had just figured you were still having this problem and needed a solution.

good luck

edit: i just got a reply back from that company i use. they do have an image you can flash onto the chip if yours fails for whatever reason. they want 13 bucks for it. ill send there info your way if you need it. i would contact msi first tho because they might be able to provide it for free.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> Keyboard usb or din plug?  If you have a old keyboard with DIN, use that.



Only USB.

And I'm back, because I forgot I had some cyber black Friday shopping to do, have to wait for midnight it appears... lol

...Edit:



Final_Fighter said:


> i just got a reply back from that company i use. they do have an image you can flash onto the chip if yours fails for whatever reason.



What form, a BIOS EEPROM file???


----------



## Final_Fighter (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Only USB.
> 
> And I'm back, because I forgot I had some cyber black Friday shopping to do, have to wait for midnight it appears... lol
> 
> ...



ya, they send it in .bin format and you just flash it onto the chip using your programmer.

edit: it really does not matter the extension so long as the file structure is how its supposed to be.


----------



## silentbogo (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Ok, now things are getting weird. I was looking into the BIOS I saved from the motherboard and comparing it with the VER 1.A I downloaded from MSI, then the apparent VER 1.0, the file sizes are different, does that indicate I've got the wrong ROM?


Can you upload it? I wanna check what's inside.
I've already checked both A0 and 00 versions from MSI website, and both are in Intel HEX format and do include BIOS and ME regions, which means those images are ready to flash as-is and do not require any modifications.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> Can you upload it? I wanna check what's inside.
> I've already checked both A0 and 00 versions from MSI website, and both are in Intel HEX format and do include BIOS and ME regions, which means those images are ready to flash as-is and do not require any modifications.



Yea, be glad to... question is how to upload here?  Could share a Dropbox or Google Drive link too.


----------



## FireFox (Nov 23, 2017)

steen said:


> Typical Asus behavior.



You don't start blaming the Manufacturer, and btw i don't see where the OP mentioned Asus, am i retarded


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

Knoxx29 said:


> You don't start blaming the Manufacturer, and btw i don't see where the OP mentioned Asus, am i retarded



Lol, didn't even catch that.  Yea, nothing to do with ASUS


----------



## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

@Sasqui , Read this entire post: https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=180978.0

USB stick should be formatted FAT32 and be under 32GB in size.  Some drives are finicky so maybe try different ones.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> @Sasqui , Read this entire post: https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=180978.0
> 
> USB stick should be formatted FAT32 and be under 32GB in size.  Some drives are finicky so maybe try different ones.



It's FAT 32 and 8GB.  The flash completed without a hitch ... except it bricked the board lol .  I'm convinced there's a BIOS mismatch or something else


----------



## jsfitz54 (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I'm convinced there's a BIOS mismatch or something else



So have you contacted MSI so you can get the correct bios when the FlashCat arrives? (save time)

EDIT: Also, like I said previously, try a lower version Bios nearer to the top, if there is a mismatch on MSI website regarding ver. 1.A.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> So have you contacted MSI so you can get the correct bios when the FlashCat arrives? (save time)



I saved the original BIOS, so that's try #1


----------



## jaggerwild (Nov 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Busy day tomorrow, need sleep   Thanks all for the help.  The FlashCAT is arriving Friday and I plan to re-flash with the original bios file to start with.




 Can't you just short two of the pins(while the chip is on the board), I assume its a 8 pins BIOS chip? Should have just got an EPROMM adapter that way you cant flash any and all EPROMMs for now on?
 Your Avatar is freaky!! Keep looking at its belly button talking to you


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 23, 2017)

jaggerwild said:


> Can't you just short two of the pins(while the chip is on the board), I assume its a 8 pins BIOS chip? Should have just got an EPROMM adapter that way you cant flash any and all EPROMMs for now on?
> Your Avatar is freaky!! Keep looking at its belly button talking to you



Shorting of pins I don't think will help a bad 6 MB BIOS flash.

Yes, that's my bellybutton talking, lol ...it's a skew on this meme:


----------



## jsfitz54 (Nov 24, 2017)

@Sasqui 

So what's the verdict?


----------



## jaggerwild (Nov 25, 2017)

If you short 2 of the pins together, it basically clears the Eprom so it can be loaded with a good bios(I am the last person should be giving bios info)!


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

He hasn't reached back out yet, but he did work today. I promised id walk him through the sequence when he was in front of the parts.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> He hasn't reached back out yet, but he did work today. I promised id walk him through the sequence when he was in front of the parts.



Well... after a bunch of figuring out how to connect the Flashcat to the MB, I might be looking at a BIOS chip that they don't support.  Flashcard is also saying the firmware is out of date, but I can't find how to update it anywhere.

You around later today or tomorrow?

I'll post a pic of the BIOS chip after I get back from breakfast with the GF


----------



## jaggerwild (Nov 25, 2017)

You sure you have the right chip? easy to confuse other chips. Down near the old north-bridge location(near the PCI-E)?


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Well... after a bunch of figuring out how to connect the Flashcat to the MB, I might be looking at a BIOS chip that they don't support.  Flashcard is also saying the firmware is out of date, but I can't find how to update it anywhere.
> 
> You around later today or tomorrow?
> 
> I'll post a pic of the BIOS chip after I get back from breakfast with the GF



Send me a picture of your board and ill walk you through how to setup the flash cat and get it connected to the board.


----------



## silentbogo (Nov 25, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I might be looking at a BIOS chip that they don't support


That's impossible. Most likely a loose wire or bad connection somewhere.
If you are using a clip with jumpers, then for the sake of  compatibility you need to use a single-channel SPI (see an attached pic)

 


Sasqui said:


> Flashcard is also saying the firmware is out of date


There is a PDF in  _"FCUSB\Documentation"_  folder. Scroll down to page 9 and follow the instruction.
It's actually very-very simple: just toggle a switch as shown in description, attach, start the tool and once you get a DFU pop-up - just point it to the new firmware. Then disconnect and set the switch back to its initial position.
The fresh firmware is also located in _"FCUSB\Software\Firmware"_ folder. You need an _FCUSB.CLASSIC.xxxx.SPI.hex, _not the other ones.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> That's impossible.



pretty much this. the tool isnt configured yet or there is a bad contact point/it isnt hooked up right.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Will send a few pics later


----------



## stinger608 (Nov 25, 2017)

I'm very interested in seeing how this FlashCat works! 

I hope this takes care of your board @Sasqui !!!!! That would suck to have a Z97 paperweight.


----------



## jsfitz54 (Nov 25, 2017)

Is this what we are talking about?

*http://www.embeddedcomputers.net/software/*


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

The BIOS chip is a Macronix 25L6473E , it's not specifically listed in the manual as being supported, but I'm guessing it is:






*Getting over Hurdle #1, loading the new firmware (Done!)* - Took some time to find the damn firmware ...it was in a folder included with the software and using the bootloader procedure took some careful instruction reading.  Thanks to @silentbogo for adding that post.

*Hurdle #2 Connecting the FlashCAT to the motherboard (Still working on this one)*

Problem:  When connected to the MB, the FlashCAT is not recognized by the software

*Mistake #1*, Using the MSI SPI header and assuming the pin diagram for the SPI MB header applied in my case.  My board has an 11-pin SPI header, there's an additional connection to be made to pin 11:





What I think I'm going to do - Use the direct "Chip Clip" method.  The only hurdle is this will involve some soldering, as one of the pins does double-duty on the BIOS side of things (see red dots).  I..E - the VCC on the FlashCAT splits off to *both *VCC and HOLD# on the board.

@Solaris17 - did you run into this?


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

do you have aligator clip?


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> do you have aligator clip?


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

just plug that directly into the flash cat and clip onto the bios chip. no soldering. additonal voltage is only needed when doing diect pin on 11 pin connectors.

It doesnt actually matter to the chip. Make sure the selector on the side of the flashcat is set to 3.3v and make sure no power is going to the mobo. also remove the bios battery. NO VOLTAGE should be present.


----------



## eidairaman1 (Nov 25, 2017)

With this kind of trouble it makes me want to wire in a socket like plcc based motherboards are.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> It doesnt actually matter to the chip



I see VCC on the FlashCAT going to *BOTH* VCC and HOLD# on the Chip.  Won't matter?

I guess no harm in trying it.  Just wired it up.

FlashCat headers:






Chip Clip headers:


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

im confused. does your clip not pull out of that smaller board? I meant unplug from that smaller board and plug directly onto the flashcats SPI pins then clamp right onto the BIOS chip.


----------



## jsfitz54 (Nov 25, 2017)

A hush falls over the crowd, then...

Do it, Do it, Do it, Do it, Do it, Do it, Do it!


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Partial success:


----------



## HammerON (Nov 25, 2017)

Sub'd to see what happens....
Good luck!


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Nope:





One thing I noticed was the "Erase" button was not available:





Also.. what's up with this during write?  I'm trying to write the original BIOS back to the chip it's way bigger than 2,048


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

yup its not connected correctly. Please stop jumping ahead this isnt without its risks and you could damage the ROM.

Disconnect the clip from the board and the small board that you have it connected too. plug the ribbon into the flash cats SPI pins ribbon side out (hanging of the end). 

At this point find some white out or a small sticker or silver sharpie so you can do yourself a favor later.

connect the clamp to the BIOS chip itself. making sure ALL connections are snug and its not easy. plenty of times you will think you havent but you wont.

When the chip is properly detected mark the side of the clamp that is connecting to PIN #1 on the BIOS chip (via your picture) this will speed up future flashes since you will know the orientation.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> Disconnect the clip from the board and the small board that you have it connected too. plug the ribbon into the flash cats SPI pins ribbon side out (hanging of the end).



Problem.... the ribbon cable for the clip has 8 pins.  The flashcat has 10 pins.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Problem.... the ribbon cable for the clip has 8 pins.  The flashcat has 10 pins.



That is a problem. Is that aligator clip FROM flash cats website?


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> That is a problem. Is that aligator clip FROM flash cats website?



No, and now I wish I had ordered is from them.  http://www.embeddedcomputers.net/products/SerialAdapters/  ...bottom of page, SOIC-8

So, I'm sort of rolling my own here.  That's why the 1 pin from the Flashcat going to 2 pins on the BIOS was the big question:

The way I have it now, there is no wire going to HOLD# (the connection from VCC on the Flashcat needs to be split)


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

Not the end of the world. Let me just think for a min how to fix this.



Solaris17 said:


> Not the end of the world. Let me just think for a min how to fix this.



ok. Heres what were gonna do.

Pull out your PSU. I want you to leave the BIOS battery out. I want you to wire DIRECTLY to the flash cat and board using your jumper cable.

Follow the pin diagram on the flash cat side then follow the pin diagram for the 11 pin side and I want you to NOT connect the VCC wire. Were going to flash the board warm.

Before plugging in the USB cable, but after its all been connected. I want you to boot the board. Were going to have the mobo provide the 3.3 for us so we dont need to split it.

if this works NEVER DO IT THIS WAY.

so no VCC on flashcat side

and NO

WP or VCC on mobo side.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> ok. Heres what were gonna do.
> 
> Pull out your PSU. I want you to leave the BIOS battery out. I want you to wire DIRECTLY to the flash cat and board using your jumper cable.
> 
> ...



I saw a similar read either in the manual or on-line where the flashcat couldn't provide enough for the 3.3v.  I'll give it a try, but I need to take a powder for now.  Need to do some other things, then heading out to cut a rug this evening.

I just want to play games.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 25, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I saw a similar read either in the manual or on-line where the flashcat couldn't provide enough for the 3.3v.  I'll give it a try, but I need to take a powder for now.  Need to do some other things, then heading out to cut a rug this evening.
> 
> I just want to play games.
> 
> View attachment 94285



the mobo will provide the voltage no problem. the issue is your socket type wants 2 VCC rails basically. but your not going to get that from a split 3.3 wire. so we need the board to hold itself up while we program it.

this would be simple if we had the right aligator clip but since we are going to have to work through the socket. this is how its gotta be.


----------



## eidairaman1 (Nov 25, 2017)

Rule of thumb, always use the correct tools.

@Sasqui @Solaris17, I pray y'all resurrect this board to operational status.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

eidairaman1 said:


> Rule of thumb, always use the correct tools.



Pretty easy to say in hindsight (not knowing what the right tools were), but hey that's how we learn


----------



## eidairaman1 (Nov 25, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Pretty easy to say in hindsight (not knowing what the right tools were), but hey that's how we learn



@Solaris17 @Sasqui 

This may or may not help despite being a different motherboard.

https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=180978.7


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

eidairaman1 said:


> @Solaris17 @Sasqui
> 
> This may or may not help despite being a different motherboard.
> 
> https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=180978.7



I'm going to dig back into that fix (I read another version of it elsewhere), worth a shot.  Hopefully I haven't buggered the BIOS in the meantime if I have, it's back to Flashcat.  ...I'm getting weary of this whole thing.


----------



## eidairaman1 (Nov 25, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I'm going to dig back into that fix (I read another version of it elsewhere), worth a shot.  Hopefully I haven't buggered the BIOS in the meantime if I have, it's back to Flashcat.  ...I'm getting weary of this whole thing.



Your usb 2.0 ports are under the ps2 port. Make sure the bios that was working is the only 1 on the drive.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 25, 2017)

eidairaman1 said:


> Your usb 2.0 ports are under the ps2 port. Make sure the bios that was working is the only 1 on the drive.



The 3.0 (I think there are 8 or 10) on the back are BLUE, the 2.0 are BLACK, so pretty easy to tell


----------



## eidairaman1 (Nov 25, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> The 3.0 (I think there are 8 or 10) on the back are BLUE, the 2.0 are BLACK, so pretty easy to tell



 I know that because I read your manual


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 26, 2017)

eidairaman1 said:


> I know that because I read your manual



Sad part is, the MB has been awesome and easily takes the devils canyon up to 4.7 with no problem.  I also treated it to an SSD recent;y, so booting was fast as hell.  More USB 3.0 ports than I've seen on any other MB ...not that I use them, lol.  I so want to get it back up and running.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 26, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Sad part is, the MB has been awesome and easily takes the devils canyon up to 4.7 with no problem.  I also treated it to an SSD recent;y, so booting was fast as hell.  More USB 3.0 ports than I've seen on any other MB ...not that I use them, lol.  I so want to get it back up and running.



Well when you get the time man. @silentbogo  is pretty well versed in it as well so who ever happens to be on should be able to atleast get you to flash it. Worst case scenario if things are really south and you try to RMA and they tell you to get bent if your willing you can ship the board to me and ill do it. Shoot me a PM.


----------



## silentbogo (Nov 26, 2017)

Ok. Daddy's here! 

So, let's go over it point by point:
0) Hotflashing is a dangerous thing, so don't do it
1) As I mentioned earlier, you don't really need a clip, since you've got access to JTAG header and 2mm jumpers.
2) Hook up everything according to pinouts:


FCUSB | JSPI1
1(GND) | 6 or 7 (they are tied together)
2(VCC) | 1 or 2 (same thing)
4(MOSI) | 4
6(MISO) | 3
8(SCLK) | 6
10(#CS) | 5
-- | 11(#WP), pull-up to VCC
-- | 12 (#HOLD), pull-up to VCC

#HOLD and #WP pins must be pulled up to 3.3V. You can simply put a jumper on pins 11&12,and then hook it up to VCC with a paperclip, thin wire, or any metal object which will not short out other pins.

Alternatively you can use a quad-SPI mode:



FCUSB | JSPI1
1(GND) | 6 or 7 (they are tied together)
2(VCC) | 1 or 2 (same thing)
4(SIO1) | 4
6(SIO0) | 3
8(SCLK) | 6
10(#CS) | 5
3(SIO2) | 11
5(SIO3) | 12 

In this case you don't need any jumpers.

When you open an FCUSB tool, you should see the proper device ID: MX25L64xx SPI and you can finally start the process.

P.S. Also, if you ever happen to use a clip again, remember that when you clip it onto the chip, your pin layout becomes mirrored.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 26, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> Ok. Daddy's here!
> 
> So, let's go over it point by point:
> 0) Hotflashing is a dangerous thing, so don't do it
> ...



Tried both and each time, I get this when it connects:






Might be sending the board to @Solaris17 ... I'm trying the boot with USB stick and ROM in it a few more times.


----------



## silentbogo (Nov 26, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Tried both and each time, I get this when it connects:
> 
> View attachment 94299
> 
> Might be sending the board to @Solaris17 ... I'm trying the boot with USB stick and ROM in it a few more times.


Maybe it was not a bad flash, but a bad chip initially. Not just a wrong ID, but also a wrong vendor and even device bus.... 
I hope @Solaris17 can fix it for you, cause shipping to my place will cost almost as much as the motherboard itself


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 26, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> Maybe it was not a bad flash, but a bad chip initially.



Could be... also, the memory size of 2,048 is wayyy off, not to mention the option to erase the chip was disabled in all cases where I got the flashcat connected,  I've been using this board for over 2 years now, it's been rock solid even with a 4.7 OC.  Initially used if for crunching till I got the x58 boards.

Looked on eBay for a replacement, 2 sold earlier this month for $40, and now the only one there is $131 from China, no thanks.  Saved the search, maybe something will pop up.

While checking if it will "self-recover" from USB, I noticed the blue LED flashes 16 times when I shutdown holding the power button.  The weird thing is, it only flashes like that every 2-6 power down cycles, doesn't seem to be any pattern to it.  Also, while the LED is flashing, I can't power it back on, only after it stops blinking.

What a waste of time, but can't fault me for not being persistent.  Thanks for your help!


----------



## silentbogo (Nov 26, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> What a waste of time, but can't fault me for not being persistent. Thanks for your help!


It was worth trying. As someone once said (or maybe I just made it up) "there is no bad experience".

If you have no use for that flashcat, lemme know. I might scrape some cash on my PP and get it off your hands. At least it'll help a bit with financial trauma, though I'm not sure what to do with psychological distress caused by this wretched motherboard


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 28, 2017)

Yeah @Sasqui the story doesnt need to end here. If you ship it to me I'll ship it back to you. I can cover my shipping. Just include the CPU cooler and a stick of ram since I dont have any DDR3 at home RN. I'll flash it for you if the CMOS chip isnt baked and ship it back.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 28, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> Yeah @Sasqui the story doesnt need to end here. If you ship it to me I'll ship it back to you. I can cover my shipping. Just include the CPU cooler and a stick of ram since I dont have any DDR3 at home RN. I'll flash it for you if the CMOS chip isnt baked and ship it back.



Thx, I'll PM you.  I still want to try the power on method you suggested.  Contacted EC.net about chip compatibility, they say 12 hour s


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 28, 2017)

@Solaris17 @silentbogo  ...here's what they said and it's promising. I know that SPI EEPROM was the default mode, I never changed it assuming it was auto-selected.  Hope I have time tonight to try it!



> Hi, in your settings, you need to have SPI Normal mode selected. I think you are using SPI EEPROM mode.
> EC



My note to them...



> Hi, I purchased a Flashcat USB classic (from Amazon), PCB version 2.1 . Trying to flash the BIOS on an MSI Z97 U3 Plus (failed BIOS update using MSI M-flash), BIOS chip is Macronix 25L6473E . Updated the firmware to 4.29, but I'm not having any luck. Flashcat Classic software shows the chip as "Microchip 25AA160A (2,048 bytes). Erase chip button is disabled and attempting to flash yields a failed to flash / write. I guess the first question is if that chip is supported? It's not in the list of supported chips in the manual or your website. I'm using an 8-pin SO-8 clip, connected to the flashcat header via jumpers. Hope you can help or point me in the right direction. Thanks


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 28, 2017)

....did you look in the software and have it set to SPI Normal in the drop down at the top?

I cant read.


Yes it is the default I never thought to tell you sorry!!


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 28, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> ....did you look in the software and have it set to SPI Normal in the drop down at the top?



Was that somewhere in this thread?  I sure missed it 

I don't see "SPI Normal" in the settings menu:






I tried selecting each one before connecting the USB cable.  Only SPI EEPROM recognizes any device, it's the same "25AA160A (2,048 bytes)" device as before.


----------



## sneekypeet (Nov 29, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Was that somewhere in this thread?  I sure missed it





Sasqui said:


> I don't see "SPI Normal" in the settings menu:
> 
> View attachment 94364
> 
> ...



Would not assume I have to remind a seasoned member on how to post. Public warning. More multiple posts will result is the lost of ability to post.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 29, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Was that somewhere in this thread?  I sure missed it
> 
> I don't see "SPI Normal" in the settings menu:
> 
> ...



There has to be some sort of connection problem. Or that simply is not the actual BIOS chip.

EDIT: Looks to be it. 64mb ROM.

You can try and email EC with this link to the spec sheet.

http://www.macronix.com/Lists/Datasheet/Attachments/6207/MX25L6473E, 3V, 64Mb, v1.4.pdf

and ask them if it has support (just because it isnt on the "list" doesnt mean its not supported since literal thousands of diff models can interface the same way) just incase it uses some different mode or something.

Technically the flash cat is programmable. one of the tabs is the SPI block space where you can program the values of any chip using the info in the spec sheet. Its a very powerful device but unfortunately I dont know how to read the sheets so I cant give you the values.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 29, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> There has to be some sort of connection problem. Or that simply is not the actual BIOS chip.
> 
> EDIT: Looks to be it. 64mb ROM.
> 
> ...



Well I emailed them again with the same info as I wrote above... I hope to keep the dialog going with them and press the chip support, I'm suspecting that's it.

@sneekypeet ...those posts were many hours apart ... like 6-8 hours and edit posts don't allow rich text edits to paste pics.  Well aware of the forum "rules" , so my deepest apoligies for sullying the walls of TPU


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 29, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Well I emailed them again with the same info as I wrote above... I hope to keep the dialog going with them and press the chip support, I'm suspecting that's it.
> 
> @sneekypeet ...those posts were many hours apart ... like 6-8 hours and edit posts don't allow rich text edits to paste pics.  Well aware of the forum "rules" , so my deepest apoligies for sullying the walls of TPU



They were pretty good about it for me. they programmed in an IC I had on some hitachi drive I was combing through like 2 years ago.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 29, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> They were pretty good about it for me. they programmed in an IC I had on some hitachi drive I was combing through like 2 years ago.



Here's the reply, they are suggesting the same as you:



> You only want to use "SPI NOR FLASH".
> 
> Connect it to the Flash, dont connect VCC, apply power with the PSU and then try and see if it connects.
> 
> ...



...so I'll be trying the live PSU flash tonight if I have a free moment.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 29, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Here's the reply, they are suggesting the same as you:
> 
> 
> 
> ...so I'll be trying the live PSU flash tonight if I have a free moment.



yup. just re-read what I posted.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 29, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> yup. just re-read what I posted.



Here's the message when connecting with power ON:


Successfully opened device in SQI mode

Connected to Flash (RDID:0xEEEEEE)

For read write support email contact@embeddedcomputers.net with the CHIP ID
Wrote them another email an included the link to the Macronix spec sheet you posted.  Wish me luck


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 30, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Here's the message when connecting with power ON:
> 
> 
> Successfully opened device in SQI mode
> ...



Good luck!


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 30, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> Good luck!



Here we go...  more work on this tonight:



> The chip is supported, you are just not connecting it correctly some how. Send me a picture of how you are connecting to it.
> Regards Michael


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 30, 2017)

Yessssss I KNEW IT try powering the board first.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 30, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> try powering the board first.



What do you mean by that?


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 30, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> What do you mean by that?



.... use the board to power itself while you just connect the data pins and leave VCC off.


----------



## silentbogo (Nov 30, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Here we go...  more work on this tonight:


That series is supported. I've flashed many macronix 3.3V SPI chips on ASUS routers and laptops.



Solaris17 said:


> .... use the board to power itself while you just connect the data pins and leave VCC off.


No. Connect FCUSB to the motherboard while it's OFF.
Only then you should plug in USB cord and start the application.

In theory it should work while hot, but I've never been able to flash it that way. Usually I get the correct chip ID, but immediately get write errors once flashing process is started.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 30, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> That series is supported. I've flashed many macronix 3.3V SPI chips on ASUS routers and laptops.
> 
> 
> No. Connect FCUSB to the motherboard while it's OFF.
> ...



He's exhausted every other outlet available. He obviously is not connecting it correctly. and attempts to jump WP have not worked for him.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 30, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> .... use the board to power itself while you just connect the data pins and leave VCC off.



That's what I did last night and the message on the console was posted above.  Had all pins connected except VCC


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 30, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> That's what I did last night and the message on the console was posted above.  Had all pins connected except VCC



Then you did it wrong.


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 30, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> Then you did it wrong.



Thanks for pointing out what they already told me 

...And I double checked so many times, I'm going to be really surprised if there is something wrong.  The only thing that may be messed up is I might have mirrored the pin layout on one end or the other.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 30, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Thanks for pointing out what they already told me
> 
> ...And I double checked so many times, I'm going to be really surprised if there is something wrong.  The only thing that may be messed up is I might have mirrored the pin layout on one end or the other.



Either way good luck! I'm really surprised he is going so far granted I'v never tested the boundries but I would assume it would stop at "yeah the chip is supported" so this is good!


----------



## Sasqui (Nov 30, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> I'm really surprised he is going so far



Yea, nothing like suffering a NooB like me, lol.

I'll spoon feed him the layout diagram and corresponding pin pictures at each end, so there's no missing an assumption.


----------



## Solaris17 (Nov 30, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Yea, nothing like suffering a NooB like me, lol.
> 
> I'll spoon feed him the layout diagram and corresponding pin pictures at each end, so there's no missing an assumption.



Thats a good way to do it. Though at the end if it still doesnt work you can always return the clip you have and but the one from EB. then just jack onto the chip itself.


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 1, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> Thats a good way to do it. Though at the end if it still doesnt work you can always return the clip you have and but the one from EB. then just jack onto the chip itself.



Here's yet one more option: https://www.findchips.com/search/mx25l6473e


----------



## Solaris17 (Dec 1, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Here's yet one more option: https://www.findchips.com/search/mx25l6473e



I mean not really. soldering aside you still run into the same issue with flashing a blank eeprom.


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 1, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> I mean not really. soldering aside you still run into the same issue with flashing a blank eeprom.



I'm just being a pessimist, lol.  Those chips are hard to find!  There's a place in Germany selling pre-flashed chips on eBay for $14, but not sure about shipping.  

No time to send pics to EC yesterday evening, plan on doing it over the weekend and reporting back.


----------



## silentbogo (Dec 1, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I'm just being a pessimist, lol.  Those chips are hard to find!  There's a place in Germany selling pre-flashed chips on eBay for $14, but not sure about shipping.
> 
> No time to send pics to EC yesterday evening, plan on doing it over the weekend and reporting back.


Chips themselves are cheap as hell and are abundant, if you know what to look for. I'm buying most of my Winbond and Macronix stock from China or local retailers for less than ~$1/ea.
For US residents it's even easier, 'cause you have amazing stores like Digikey, Arrow, Newark etc. Plus, you have an option to order stuff directly from manufacturer, or get some cool useful sh#t as free samples.
And even China ships to US much faster than the rest of the world.

https://www.aliexpress.com/premium/MX25L6473E.html?SearchText=MX25L6473E


----------



## Solaris17 (Dec 1, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> Chips themselves are cheap as hell and are abundant, if you know what to look for. I'm buying most of my Winbond and Macronix stock from China or local retailers for less than ~$1/ea.
> For US residents it's even easier, 'cause you have amazing stores like Digikey, Arrow, Newark etc. Plus, you have an option to order stuff directly from manufacturer, or get some cool useful sh#t as free samples.
> And even China ships to US much faster than the rest of the world.
> 
> https://www.aliexpress.com/premium/MX25L6473E.html?SearchText=MX25L6473E



Not to mention if he was handy he could even solder on a socket and just swap to an easier chip. A boy can dream. Maybe I'll do that on my micro ITX board.


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 1, 2017)

Solaris17 said:


> Not to mention if he was handy he could even solder on a socket and just swap to an easier chip. A boy can dream. Maybe I'll do that on my micro ITX board.



I would have no hesitation to try swapping chips.  It's all surface mount, so pretty easy with a good soldering pen, good magnifier and thin solder... oh and the flux   After moving a capacitor the size of a pepper grain on my EVGA board, this would be a cakewalk


----------



## jaggerwild (Dec 1, 2017)

Just buy a Borked board of flee bay, swap the Chip boom, sell me the clam shell for the 1 i need?


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 1, 2017)

jaggerwild said:


> Just buy a Borked board of flee bay, swap the Chip boom, sell me the clam shell for the 1 i need?



I searched for Z97 MSI boards on eBay and there's a ton of non-working ones.  How many could be salvaged by swapping the BIOS chip?  No clue but I suspect a healthy percentage.

Edit:  Looked and there's more with bent pins than anything else it seems


----------



## davidm71 (Dec 11, 2017)

Sasqui,

Have you seen this:  JSPI1 Adapter  (click the link to purchase).







This adapter is made specifically for MSI boards. I just got mine yesterday. Not that I need to use it but when you mod its best to be prepared for an emergency.

I also experimented with my FlashcatUSB on a MSI B85M Gaming's JSPI1 port and I tried to hook up those jumper wires every which way without luck.
The FlashcatUSB is either bugged, doesn't work, or we're doing it wrong. As was mentioned earlier I had a similar issue on an old Foxconn board and no matter
what I tried I couldn't get the FlashcatUSB to recognize the chip.

Finally I reached for my CH341A Black Usb mini programmer and despite the 5v issue it worked like a charm.

Heres another photo of the adapter in use:






Unfortunately the pins on the adapter mounting plate can't be directly attached to the flashcat without jumper wires which
complicated the ease of use. I think embedded computers sells an adapter for the Flashcat to make it work like the Ch341a
so you can insert that yellow mounting plate easily onto the Flashcat. Not sure if the other end of the cable can even be
placed directly onto the FlashcatUSB to have correct pin layout.

Anyhow this is what you need. Going to try it out maybe tomorrow if I feel motivated enough to do so.

Good luck!

PS: Whats wrong with this site.. Missing all my notifications!


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 11, 2017)

davidm71 said:


> Sasqui,
> 
> Have you seen this:  JSPI1 Adapter  (click the link to purchase).
> 
> ...



I'm getting used to this new look myself... notifications have been ok here, I got one for your post 

Anyway, thanks for that.  The only catch is that my MB has an 11-pin JSP1, that one you're showing is for the 9 pin, do they make one for that case? ...the Flashcat has instructions for 11-pin, but it needs a splitter.  I was going to solder one together this weekend (and last weekend, lol), but just too much going on.  The pin-out is below, the colors correspond to the jumper wires I have:


----------



## davidm71 (Dec 11, 2017)

You know I just noticed that its two pins short ten minutes ago  

Also found your review on Amazon. Small world.

I suppose you were able to get it going finally?


----------



## eidairaman1 (Dec 11, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> I'm getting used to this new look myself... notifications have been ok here, I got one for your post
> 
> Anyway, thanks for that.  The only catch is that my MB has an 11-pin JSP1, that one you're showing is for the 9 pin, do they make one for that case? ...the Flashcat has instructions for 11-pin, but it needs a splitter.  I was going to solder one together this weekend (and last weekend, lol), but just too much going on.  The pin-out is below, the colors correspond to the jumper wires I have:
> 
> View attachment 94659


Sounds pretty straight forward, connect as per diagram
..


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 11, 2017)

davidm71 said:


> Also found your review on Amazon. Small world.



Too funny, I forgot the moniker I used there was the same, lol.

Will update post in a day or so when I get it hooked up.  Meanwhile, I ordered a 10 pack of the same chip from china for $8 shipped... should arrive by Christmas so I have a fall-back, assuming I can program one of them with the flashcat.  Shame I threw away a junk Dell MB I had laying around, want to practice desoldering and replacing a surface mount chip if it comes to that.


----------



## silentbogo (Dec 11, 2017)

BTW, guys at Embedded Computers have updated the manual in a new software version with MSI SPI pinout (though, an older 10-pin version).
NVM, didn't see your prev. post...
... and I'm finally getting a Pro version in a few weeks!



Sasqui said:


> Will update post in a day or so when I get it hooked up. Meanwhile, I ordered a 10 pack of the same chip from china for $8 shipped... should arrive by Christmas so I have a fall-back, assuming I can program one of them with the flashcat. Shame I threw away a junk Dell MB I had laying around, want to practice desoldering and replacing a surface mount chip if it comes to that.


Don't sweat, I'll do a walkthrough if you need help w/ soldering. I'm not a fan of removing SOIC with iron, but I've done it too (guilty as charged). Or you've probably already watched youtube videos from questionable people about it 
The trick is, get as much leaded solder on those pins as possible, in order to dilute the lead-free stuff, and carefully heat-up each side, while gently pulling the IC upwards. Just don't pull too hard and don't ever pry anything SMD! You'll tear pads and traces for sure. Much easier w/ hot air.

Here's an example:









BTW, just looked at this stuff (Chipquick kit?):









Looks like a typical Rose's alloy, but I've never used it this way...


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 11, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> BTW, guys at Embedded Computers have updated the manual in a new software version with MSI SPI pinout (though, an older 10-pin version).
> NVM, didn't see your prev. post...
> ... and I'm finally getting a Pro version in a few weeks!
> 
> ...



I watched a few clips on Youtube and just like you point out, the trick is plenty of solder, but moreso to get it all flowing on one side of the chip, then gently lifting it a bit not too hard, next clean off the solder, then heat up the other side, lift off and cleanup trace contacts.  One guy posted a vid sawing contacts at the chip and then de-soldering each pin individually.  All sorts of ways to skin that cat.

Im hoping it doesn't come to that


----------



## davidm71 (Dec 11, 2017)

Thats the last resort. I also noticed new firmware and manual for the Blackcat. The problem as I see it is that the Blackcat is incomplete as it only comes with a 6 pin full size jumper cable and only a 8 pin full size to mb header size jumper cable which is not enough pins to hook up to a jspi1 port never mind apparently you need to join wp with vcc.
I believe it’s doable though unfortunately the jspi1 wiring details is hard to find but if it would help having two less pins wired maybe worth a shot seeing if it would work with the board powered on?

Side note: Played around with the Blackcat last night with new firmware and was finally able to communicate with a standard 8 pin dip style Winbond bios chip. The only thing is I recommend you route SO to SO and SI to SI as running the inverse does not work. Even the manual now says to route it directly. Read in other forums to swap them but did not work for me. But I had to set it to SPI NOR mode. Also I measured the voltages on the Ch341a Black and Blackcat and both read out at 3.3 volts so non of this 5v business I’ve been reading about. The only other difference is the Blackcat expects the bios file to be packed in a Zip file which only complicates things. At least the Ch341a takes the bios bin file directly. Weird.


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 11, 2017)

davidm71 said:


> Side note: Played around with the Blackcat last night with new firmware and was finally able to communicate with a standard 8 pin dip style Winbond bios chip. The only thing is I recommend you route SO to SO and SI to SI as running the inverse does not work. Even the manual now says to route it directly. Read in other forums to swap them but did not work for me. But I had to set it to SPI NOR mode. Also I measured the voltages on the Ch341a Black and Blackcat and both read out at 3.3 volts so non of this 5v business I’ve been reading about. The only other difference is the Blackcat expects the bios file to be packed in a Zip file which only complicates things. At least the Ch341a takes the bios bin file directly. Weird.



Thanks for posting and welcome to the Flashcat party.  Very interesting about the SO and SI if my routing doesn't connect, that's an easy fix.  And yes to 3.3v ONLY and SPI NOR mode.  Did NOT know about the .bin file needing to be zipped!


----------



## Solaris17 (Dec 11, 2017)

davidm71 said:


> Blackcat expects the bios file to be packed in a Zip file which only complicates things.



For what programming the BC or the chip? because it doesnt either way. Also by forums Im assuming you must mean these.

https://blackcatusb.net/index.php

because that site is NOT the official in any way shape or form.


----------



## silentbogo (Dec 11, 2017)

davidm71 said:


> The only other difference is the Blackcat expects the bios file to be packed in a Zip file which only complicates things


When did that happen? After almost 2 years of daily use I never had to zip my BIOS dumps for flashing. You are confusing something.


----------



## davidm71 (Dec 11, 2017)

It happened last night when I tried to flash my Winbond chip. The Blackcat software rejected the bios file saying it was invalid. So I read from the chip and it saved the backup as a zip file with the bios file named Bios.bin and an xml file in there. So I swapped the bios file and the Blackcat software flashed it without complaint.

Also about the SO Si swap yeah I read about it in that Blackcat forum I think.


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 11, 2017)

davidm71 said:


> It happened last night when I tried to flash my Winbond chip. The Blackcat software rejected the bios file saying it was invalid. So I read from the chip and it saved the backup as a zip file with the bios file named Bios.bin and an xml file in there. So I swapped the bios file and the Blackcat software flashed it without complaint.
> 
> Also about the SO Si swap yeah I read about it in that Blackcat forum I think.



Im aiming to try the wiring I posted this evening.  I did find a post from someone who did NOT reverse the SI/SO and it failed but when they did it SI-SO it worked: https://blackcatusb.net/index.php?t...ts-not-curently-supported-msi-board-help.453/


----------



## davidm71 (Dec 11, 2017)

Wonder if you can connect the second unused Vcc to WP# ? That is if the 3.3v current would flow into the second Vcc from the first Vcc? That way you wouldn’t have to join wires together. Btw WP I found out stands for Write Protect so I wonder if you could read in any case if not volted. As for Si-So swap try both. Good luck.


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 11, 2017)

davidm71 said:


> Wonder if you can connect the second unused Vcc to WP# ? That is if the 3.3v current would flow into the second Vcc from the first Vcc? That way you wouldn’t have to join wires together. Btw WP I found out stands for Write Protect so I wonder if you could read in any case if not volted. As for Si-So swap try both. Good luck.



I just soldered the splitter for VCC and WP#.  Will be trying shortly:


----------



## davidm71 (Dec 12, 2017)

This another way to do it with the CH341A. I’m taking the extra Vcc current for the WP from the unused set of top rows on the Ch341a. Haven’t tested it yet. The only thing I don’t understand is why with just 9 pins the WP# is ignored and not with 11 pin setup.


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 12, 2017)

*... YEAHAAAAHHHH!!* @Solaris17 @silentbogo 

The pin out worked.  The whole process was flaky*, wouldn't recognize the chip until I put power to the board, then all sorts of weirdness... but *finally*, *FINALLY!!!*

*I think the jumpers to VCC and #WP were wonky... they were for different size jumpers but eventually it flashed to the latest BIOS





Wohooo!!!









... I need a drink badly


----------



## eidairaman1 (Dec 12, 2017)

Congrats dude now we need a PIN this and I would honestly write up a flash procedure for this


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 12, 2017)

eidairaman1 said:


> Congrats dude now we need a PIN this and I would honestly write up a flash procedure for this



Or better documentation for newbies like me.  If I had started with the right clip from Embedded Computers, this thread would be a lot shorter!


----------



## eidairaman1 (Dec 12, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> Or better documentation for newbies like me.  If I had started with the right clip from Embedded Computers, this thread would be a lot shorter!


 Well definitely write a guide


----------



## davidm71 (Dec 12, 2017)

Congrats! Way to go! It’s a great feeling isn’t it?! Please detail every step for the rest of us with lots of photos too! 

Thanks


----------



## Solaris17 (Dec 12, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> *... YEAHAAAAHHHH!!* @Solaris17 @silentbogo
> 
> The pin out worked.  The whole process was flaky*, wouldn't recognize the chip until I put power to the board, then all sorts of weirdness... but *finally*, *FINALLY!!!*
> 
> ...




told you my dude she wasnt dead! EEPROM flashers are a hell of a life saver great work for your first go and congratulations! we'll have to catch some multiplayer sometime!


----------



## silentbogo (Dec 12, 2017)

Congrats on your first unbricked board!


----------



## jsfitz54 (Dec 12, 2017)

*Congrats!*    I've been checking back to see how this goes.

I noticed that there is a Bios v1.1 and newest is v1.A and what shows on your screenshot is v1.10, so *I am confused by the MSI number scheme, or at least by how it is displayed.*

Was there anything you had to do with the ZIP folder as mentioned above?

Did you have to flash the saved bios first or did you jump straight to the newest?

*YES, please write up a stickie with the correct procedure for the uninitiated, with pictures.*


----------



## Sasqui (Dec 12, 2017)

jsfitz54 said:


> *Congrats!*    I've been checking back to see how this goes.
> 
> I noticed that there is a Bios v1.1 and newest is v1.A and what shows on your screenshot is v1.10, so *I am confused by the MSI number scheme, or at least by how it is displayed.*
> 
> ...



The BIOS had the extension .1A0 - but shows as 1.10 as you can see on the BIOS screens.  I had to rename it to .BIN, that's all, nothing to do with ZIP files.

Quite honestly, I could write up something about what NOT to do   I first flashed with the original saved BIOS ...that was a different size from what the downloaded versions are but couldn't get it to boot again, just turn on.

When I re-flashed with the latest BIOS, it wouldn't boot, then I realized I had left the jumper shunt from VCC to WP# on the board, duh.  When I took that off...





I could write a few tips on getting started.  The first of which was getting the USB drivers loaded.... the second flashing the firmware on the Flashcat itself

The other thing that was weird is it not recognizing the BIOS a few times, then all of a sudden it would.  At one point, plugging in the USB cable would not recognize the Flashcat, requiring a PC reboot.  The first time I got it to correctly recognize the chip was with the PC powered on, the second time was just only the PSU turned on, board off.  Again, I think it had something to do with the ghetto jumper setup I had.  Soldering on the wires was all good and solid.


----------



## Kyan31 (Feb 23, 2018)

Hi guys, I'm new to the forum and I'm sorry to bring up an old thread but I need help, really would be appreciated. I recently updated my bios on my MSI Z97S Krait Motherboard and put shortly it messed up the BIOS chip, but reflashing it using an SPI programmer should fix it. Now I just wanted to ask, has anyone used the CH341A SPI Programmer to reflash the BIOS through an 11-pin JSPI1 port on their board? I have purchased the SPI programmer and some standard 2mm motherboard jumpers which I will wire manually, but I was hoping someone could help me out on which programmer pin corresponds to which pin on the motherboard JSPI1 port. I have read through this entire thread so I am fairly confident on where most of the connections should go but if someone has actually already done it, that would definitely make me feel a lot more confident about this if they could give me a diagram or something for the headers. My BIOS chip is a Winbond 25Q64FV which is rated between 3.0V and 3.6V, so I don't need to worry about the supply I assume. Also I just wanted to ask, if I reprogram the BIOS chip am I supposed to have the motherboard connected to the power supply of my computer or not? I would assume not, but just asking to be sure. Thank you very much for this thread by the way, wouldn't have even known SPI programming is a thing without stumbling upon this, you guys might have saved me months of waiting for an RMA as I was about to go down that route.


----------



## Jetster (Feb 23, 2018)

Kyan31 said:


> Hi guys, I'm new to the forum and I'm sorry to bring up an old thread but I need help, really would be appreciated. I recently updated my bios on my MSI Z97S Krait Motherboard and put shortly it messed up the BIOS chip, but reflashing it using an SPI programmer should fix it. Now I just wanted to ask, has anyone used the CH341A SPI Programmer to reflash the BIOS through an 11-pin JSPI1 port on their board? I have purchased the SPI programmer and some standard 2mm motherboard jumpers which I will wire manually, but I was hoping someone could help me out on which programmer pin corresponds to which pin on the motherboard JSPI1 port. I have read through this entire thread so I am fairly confident on where most of the connections should go but if someone has actually already done it, that would definitely make me feel a lot more confident about this if they could give me a diagram or something for the headers. My BIOS chip is a Winbond 25Q64FV which is rated between 3.0V and 3.6V, so I don't need to worry about the supply I assume. Also I just wanted to ask, if I reprogram the BIOS chip am I supposed to have the motherboard connected to the power supply of my computer or not? I would assume not, but just asking to be sure. Thank you very much for this thread by the way, wouldn't have even known SPI programming is a thing without stumbling upon this, you guys might have saved me months of waiting for an RMA as I was about to go down that route.



Should have started a new thread

Anyway, it doesn't have a removable chip or BIOS switch?

And you tried the clear cmos jumper? remove battery?


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## Kyan31 (Feb 23, 2018)

Jetster said:


> Should have started a new thread
> 
> Anyway, it doesn't have a removable chip or BIOS switch?



Sorry about that, I thought continuing the thread would be more appropriate as I didn't want to clutter the forum, but I will definitely make a separate write up about this after if I end up fixing my board for anyone in the same position as me, and nope it has neither unfortunately, but it does have a 11 pin JSPI1 header. I have checked out the schematic for my SPI programmer and a lot of the pin Labels correspond with a JSPI1 diagram I found online, but some of the pins don't so I'm a little confused on what connects where, I have attached images of my programmer and the JSPI1 diagram below:


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## Sasqui (Feb 23, 2018)

Jetster said:


> Anyway, it doesn't have a removable chip or BIOS switch?
> 
> And you tried the clear cmos jumper? remove battery?



MSI boards (most) have a single BIOS and it's soldered.  In the case of a bad flash, which is all too common, there is an MSI unpublished back-door BIOS header known as JSPI-1.  That's what the OP is trying to use.

I used a different flash device, the Flashcat USB which was made with several purposes, including the MSI JSPI1 header. After hours of trying, I finally saved my board.

I don't have any experience with the CH341A... so I can only offer the pin-outs that worked for the Flashcat... This diagram: https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...3-plus-motherboard.238973/page-8#post-3767632


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## Kyan31 (Feb 23, 2018)

Sasqui said:


> MSI boards (most) have a single BIOS and it's soldered.  In the case of a bad flash, which is all too common, there is an MSI unpublished back-door BIOS header known as JSPI-1.  That's what the OP is trying to use.
> 
> I used a different flash device, the Flashcat USB which was made with several purposes, including the MSI JSPI1 header. After hours of trying, I finally saved my board.
> 
> I don't have any experience with the CH341A... so I can only offer the pin-outs that worked for the Flashcat... This diagram: https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...3-plus-motherboard.238973/page-8#post-3767632



Thank you for confirming a working diagram, I believe our boards are very similar so its a big help, I will attempt to reflash my bios as soon as my jumper cables arrive in the mail and I'll post my outcome here later, will make a guide here too if successful.


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## Sasqui (Feb 23, 2018)

Kyan31 said:


> Thank you for confirming a working diagram, I believe our boards are very similar so its a big help, I will attempt to reflash my bios as soon as my jumper cables arrive in the mail and I'll post my outcome here later, will make a guide here too if successful.



What are you using for jumper cables?  I made my own from the cables that came with it, and got it working but wow it was flaky.  Then I bought a purpose built one from embeddedcomputers.net ... but I cannot get it to work at all!    I've tried it on two different boards.


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## Kyan31 (Feb 23, 2018)

Sasqui said:


> What are you using for jumper cables?  I made my own from the cables that came with it, and got it working but wow it was flaky.  Then I bought a purpose built one from embeddedcomputers.net ... but I cannot get it to work at all!    I've tried it on two different boards.
> 
> View attachment 97590



I'm going to use standard 2mm jumper cables, same ones you'd use for any Arduino or rasperberry pi kit etc. and if that doesn't work I will probably purchase a bios clip instead, the jumper cables should do the trick though as that's how the FlashcatUSB works.



Sasqui said:


> What are you using for jumper cables?  I made my own from the cables that came with it, and got it working but wow it was flaky.  Then I bought a purpose built one from embeddedcomputers.net ... but I cannot get it to work at all!    I've tried it on two different boards.
> 
> View attachment 97590


Regarding your issue, you should email embedded computers, they reply very quickly.


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## Sasqui (Feb 23, 2018)

Kyan31 said:


> I'm going to use standard 2mm jumper cables



To do the pinout with the DIY cables, I had 2mm, but had to use 2.54mm cables for the split since I ran out of 2mm headers (for VCC and WP#).  That's probably why it was flaky.



Kyan31 said:


> Regarding your issue, you should email embedded computers, they reply very quickly



They have been amazing and pretty quick in replying.  Honestly, I think there is something wrong with the JSPI1 cable I got from them.  I also bought the SOIC8 clip... I'm able to flash loose chips with it (I bought 10 just for testing sake), but can't get it to connect to the chip on-board... again, tried two different boards.

Also, I noticed if I left the CMOS battery in, the PC would not recognize the Flashcat period when I plugged the USB in.


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## Kyan31 (Feb 23, 2018)

Sasqui said:


> To do the pinout with the DIY cables, I had 2mm, but had to use 2.54mm cables for the split since I ran out of 2mm headers (for VCC and WP#).  That's probably why it was flaky.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thank you for the tip on the CMOS battery, will make sure it's removed before flashing the bios, and yes it is possible your cable is faulty but I'm sure embedded computers will be happy to send you a replacement, by the way the cable seems to only be 10 pin and most JSPI1 ports are 11 so that could be an issue, but I assume one of the pins is simply a reserve pin so probably not.


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## Sasqui (Feb 23, 2018)

Kyan31 said:


> Thank you for the tip on the CMOS battery, will make sure it's removed before flashing the bios, and yes it is possible your cable is faulty but I'm sure embedded computers will be happy to send you a replacement, by the way the cable seems to only be 10 pin and most JSPI1 ports are 11 so that could be an issue, but I assume one of the pins is simply a reserve pin so probably not.



What you're looking at is 10 pins 2.54mm header to the Flashcat header.  The other end (black with small trace PCB) is 11-pin (12 in reality) 2mm for the JSPI1 ...it's also compatible with the 9-pin version of JSPI1


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## Kyan31 (Feb 23, 2018)

Sasqui said:


> What you're looking at is 10 pins 2.54mm header to the Flashcat header.  The other end (black with small trace PCB) is 11-pin (12 in reality) 2mm for the JSPI1 ...it's also compatible with the 9-pin version of JSPI1


Ah I see, that's a pretty handy cable, might have to pick up something similar in the future for situations like this haha.


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## Sasqui (Feb 23, 2018)

Kyan31 said:


> Ah I see, that's a pretty handy cable, might have to pick up something similar in the future for situations like this haha.



If it would only work!  Sometimes it'll connect but the chip ID is wrong each time.  I tried every configuration since you can plug it in 2 different ways each end.  When I have time, I'm going to try my original DIY cable configuration


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## Kyan31 (Feb 23, 2018)

Sasqui said:


> If it would only work!  Sometimes it'll connect but the chip ID is wrong each time.  I tried every configuration since you can plug it in 2 different ways each end.  When I have time, I'm going to try my original DIY cable configuration



Seems like your best bet, I have no clue why it doesn't work for you as it really should but yeah with the right set of jumper cables you can redo what you did before with success, good luck!


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## Kyan31 (Feb 24, 2018)

Little update, I managed to fix my motherboard! Went pretty smoothly and now my system is up and running again, thanks to everyone here who provided all the diagrams and stuff, was a ton of help and thank you @Sasqui for the tips, appreciate it so much. I really thought I killed my motherboard but now it's working better than ever, cheers all


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## Sasqui (Feb 24, 2018)

Kyan31 said:


> Little update, I managed to fix my motherboard! Went pretty smoothly and now my system is up and running again, thanks to everyone here who provided all the diagrams and stuff, was a ton of help and thank you @Sasqui for the tips, appreciate it so much. I really thought I killed my motherboard but now it's working better than ever, cheers all



Nice work dude, and congrats!  Did you use JSPI1 and the individual wire headers?


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## Kyan31 (Feb 25, 2018)

Sasqui said:


> Nice work dude, and congrats!  Did you use JSPI1 and the individual wire headers?



Yup, wired it individually by following the JSPI1 diagram you showed me and I just matched it up to the corresponding pins on my programmer, for the extra write pin (since it's an 11 pin header) I just used one of the spare available pins on my programmer to supply power, it worked a charm.


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