# CAT7 cables worth it?



## puma99dk| (Jun 27, 2012)

i dunno what CAT my network cables r atm, but i have through about change the cable i got from the fiberbox to my Linksys E2500 router and from router to PC out with CAT7 S-STP Straight cables, will that give me anything in the long term or will it just be a waste of money?


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## 1nf3rn0x (Jun 27, 2012)

Unless your LAN/ Internet is over 100mbps then no. But cat 7 would future proof your connections.


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## puma99dk| (Jun 27, 2012)

1nf3rn0x said:


> Unless your LAN/ Internet is over 100mbps then no. But cat 7 would future proof your connections.



atm i run 30/30mbit but lan connection from my fiberbox atm is 100mbit and from my pc 1000mbit, but i can get that changed from my fiberbox to my router aswell but i don't think that will give me a big advanced or am i wrong?

but future proof would be nice, but for how long? only until CAT8 or 9 comes around or they jump to something else


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## 1nf3rn0x (Jun 27, 2012)

puma99dk| said:


> atm i run 30/30mbit but lan connection from my fiberbox atm is 100mbit and from my pc 1000mbit, but i can get that changed from my fiberbox to my router aswell but i don't think that will give me a big advanced or am i wrong?
> 
> but future proof would be nice, but for how long? only until CAT8 or 9 comes around or they jump to something else



cat7 is 1gb/ps so I think it ain't gonna be replaced any time soon...


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## puma99dk| (Jun 27, 2012)

thx 1ef3rn0x, still thinking about buying a 10meter and put it from the box to router and than around 1~2meter from router to my pc ^^;


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## Kreij (Jun 27, 2012)

Cat 7 is for 10Gb/s. Both Cat 5e & Cat 6 are for 1Gb/s.
Certainly wouldn't hurt to go with Cat 7, but unless you can push over 1Gb/s it's not going to do a whole lot for you.
It's definitely superior for elimination of crosstalk and emi, but that is not usually a problem in a typical home network.


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## Aquinus (Jun 27, 2012)

Unless you're running REALLY long ethernet cables I think CAT7 is overkill and completely unnecessary even for future-proofing purposes. However I would recommend using CAT6 if you're interested in at least 1Gbps. Cat5e is a little more suseptible to crosstalk and can't be run as far because of the higher impedance. So my answer is:

No to Cat7, yes to Cat6, but it's not like you're really going to notice the difference unless you have a lot of internal traffic switching from 5e to 6 which also depends on the number of cables (and their grade,) that you have running next to each other (in tandem to a fully loaded network and other potential sources of EMI.)



puma99dk| said:


> thx 1ef3rn0x, still thinking about buying a 10meter and put it from the box to router and than around 1~2meter from router to my pc ^^;



At that distance, Cat6 will have the same result. In fact for a home network Cat5e might even still work just as well since it isn't going far. I would recommend higher grade cable if you're going to be, let say, running Ethernet through the walls of your place of residence.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 27, 2012)

CAT 7 is for 10 gigabit ethernet at runs up to 100m.  CAT6 can handle 10 gigabit ethernet up to 37-55m depending on how hostile the environment is electrically.


CAT 7 competes with optical too so if you were to invest big bucks in that cable, 10 years down the road when 10 gigabit routers/switches are affordable, the market may have already adapted optical meaning you should have just gone with CAT6.

As is, CAT6 is substantially more expensive per foot than CAT5e.  CAT7 is even more expensive than CAT6.


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## puma99dk| (Jun 27, 2012)

cat 6a is more expensive than cat7 only normal cat 6 beats them both on price, but i am planning about buying a flat HDMI 5meter cable in good quality the same place together with sata to esata cables.

these cables i will buy:

Cat 7 S-STP Netværkskabel - 2 m

Cat 7 S-STP Netværkskabel - 10 m

SATA til eSATA kabel - 2 m

High Speed fladt HDMI kabel - 5 m

flat HDMI cable bcs it goes through a door and i wanna be cable to close it sometimes not totally but just so it ain't totally open 24-7.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 27, 2012)

You're only talking 10m? CAT6 could handle 10gbe that far.  I think you should compare the prices of CAT6 to CAT7 and decide if it is worth paying the difference for something you probably won't be using for at least 5 years (cutting edge NIC equipment doesn't come down in price very quickly unfortunately).


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## Kreij (Jun 27, 2012)

If you only have one PC on the network and your internet is 30Mb/s, I don't see any reason to upgrade the cables at all if you currently have cat 5e. If you have more than one PC on the network and the router is 1Gb or less, there is still no reason to upgrade IMO (unless your just want to. lol )

There is probably no need to use STP either.


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## lilhasselhoffer (Jun 27, 2012)

To the initial question:

No, Category 7 wire is not a justifiable expense right now.
Most higher end consumer hardware is 1000Mb/s.  The rating for category 7 is 10000Mb/s.  Your internet connection is going to lag behind, but more importantly your home network won't even be able to push data at that speed.

Additionally, there are no SSDs or HDDs that can push that kind of speed.  

So, you should have a length of category 6 running your network.  You'll save money, and be good for a while (assuming that you're not going to be spending a couple thousand euros upgrading all your storage to SSDs in the near future).


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## Aquinus (Jun 27, 2012)

Kreij said:


> There is probably no need to use STP either.



I agree, I doubt that the area that these cables will be in will be hostile enough to justify any STP cable. A regular UTP Cat6 cable should do what you want. Heck, Cat5e UTP should at those kinds of lengths unless you're prepping for 10Gbps, in that case you'll be spending a lot of money for a NIC where you're still stuck with 30Mbit once you leave your network. Also what good is 10Gbps if there aren't any other computers on your network that it will be communicating with?

Let me put it this way, at work we have a small rack on site with 7 servers, 3 1Gbps switches, and one 100Mbit PoE switch and I can tell you that we've got nowhere close to using all the bandwidth except for transferring files between servers for backup purposes, and even then those tasks are scheduled to run in the middle of the night. All of this is wired for Cat6 UTP and the area is extremely hostile in terms of other cables and EMI and I've seen 1Gbps full-duplex at its finest. What you're looking at getting really is overkill. 

If I can remember, I will take a picture for you so you can see what I mean when I get into the office.


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## Kreij (Jun 27, 2012)

My network at work is very similar, Aquinus, and it's all Cat 5e UTP. No problems.
I ran STP in the toolroom because there are EDM machines, but I ran out and ran a couple of lines using UTP and have no problem whatsoever.

I do believe that if you go into the ceiling and have to go over air ducts code requirements are to use plenum cable.


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## Aquinus (Jun 27, 2012)

lilhasselhoffer said:


> Additionally, there are no SSDs or HDDs that can push that kind of speed.



Two SATA 6Gb SSDs in RAID-0 at full speed running at ~1000MB/s gets really close to 10Gbit, but even then you don't need those kinds of speeds on a home network. Hell, I don't even need those kinds of speeds at work!  (Although if backups ran that fast I would be ecstatic.)


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## lilhasselhoffer (Jun 27, 2012)

Aquinus said:


> Two SATA 6Gb SSDs in RAID-0 at full speed running at ~1000MB/s gets really close to 10Gbit, but even then you don't need those kinds of speeds on a home network. Hell, I don't even need those kinds of speeds at work!  (Although if backups ran that fast I would be ecstatic.)



They can run up to that speed, I'm not contesting that point.  The issue is that you'd need a couple in RAID0, and another couple to receive and store that kind of data.  For anything less than a few thousand euros you'll wind up with a rather small storage array, if you value speed above anything else.

In short, this is possible but absolutely insanely expensive, and requiring an extensive home network.


The catch, again, is that you've got an internet connection that will never see these kinds of speeds, and a home network that is small at best.


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## Disparia (Jun 27, 2012)

This isn't Goldilocks and bowls of porridge!

1Gb = Too cold! (SSD and some MHD > 1Gb)

10Gb = Too hot, but that's alright, we're going to sip it (2-4Gb) until it becomes just right.


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## dir_d (Jun 27, 2012)

Your cabling to that linksys doesn't matter, it will never get the sustained throughput to support 1gb/s or higher, so stick with 5e.


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## Aquinus (Jun 27, 2012)

Here is a reason for using CAT 6 and higher as well as STP. I bet you that your environment isn't this hostile so it doesn't make sense for the speeds you're going to use it for and how "quiet" its surroundings are. 

I did promise a picture so here it is.


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## puma99dk| (Jun 27, 2012)

thx all, so maybe i should just keep the cables i got, i was just thinking about seeing if i could get some more speed out of my 30/30mbit but if that's not gonna happen no use ^^


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## Aquinus (Jun 27, 2012)

puma99dk| said:


> thx all, so maybe i should just keep the cables i got, i was just thinking about seeing if i could get some more speed out of my 30/30mbit but if that's not gonna happen no use ^^



If you need cables in the future, I would go with Cat6 UTP instead of Cat5e. I find that Cat6 cables tend to be less susceptible to wear and tear over 5e. The build quality of Cat6 is definitely noticeable and there isn't an incredible leep in price for Cat6 either, but for performance sake, holding on to what you have should be fine. You can squeeze more out of your internet by making your local network (which is already faster,) more resilient to EMI. If there is anything to check, if you have Cable internet, login to the modem and make sure that your Coax is within spec for what ever standard is used where you live (at work its DOCSIS 3, and at home its DOCSIS 2 for me.) High SNRs and power levels that are too high or too low can cause issues, but it sounds like you just want to squeeze more out of it.


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## brandonwh64 (Jun 27, 2012)

Aquinus said:


> Here is a reason for using CAT 6 and higher as well as STP. I bet you that your environment isn't this hostile so it doesn't make sense for the speeds you're going to use it for and how "quiet" its surroundings are.
> 
> I did promise a picture so here it is.
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=47595&stc=1&d=1340823597



HEHEHEHEHE and this is just one!


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## Aquinus (Jun 28, 2012)

brandonwh64 said:


> HEHEHEHEHE and this is just one!
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/120627/highspeed.jpg



We don't need that much... yet.


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## brandonwh64 (Jun 28, 2012)

Aquinus said:


> We don't need that much... yet.



We have two of these big ones and 20 of the size of your picture. We have a BIG facility in chattanooga.


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## Kreij (Jun 28, 2012)

puma99dk| said:


> thx all, so maybe i should just keep the cables i got, i was just thinking about seeing if i could get some more speed out of my 30/30mbit but if that's not gonna happen no use ^^



Yeah, Puma. Since your router ports are only 100Mb (Fast Ethernet) going to cat7 (or even cat6) will not do anything for you. IF you upgrade your router in the future with one that has Gigabit ports, that's would be the time to think about re-cabling. No need to spend the money at the moment.

Interesting router, if you have a wireless device it can transfer (theoretically) at 300Mb on both channels but gets bottlenecked at the ports.


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## Aquinus (Jun 28, 2012)

Kreij said:


> Interesting router, if you have a wireless device it can transfer (theoretically) at 300Mb on both channels but gets bottlenecked at the ports.



300Mb is actually 150/150. It's doesn't run "full duplex" (I think that term is incorrect for wireless but the idea is the same). Also that is at full signal strength and more often then not you have other networks nearby that add interference. The only time I've seen the full speed kick in is on my 5ghz wireless (no other 5ghz networks are around me,) with my laptop practically in line of sight of the router (within 25ft).

I suspect the router can't handle full wide 40mhz channel speeds, and even if it did, you're not losing much due to overhead.


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## Kreij (Jun 28, 2012)

According to the cisco specs on the router, it's 300 + 300. That would seem to indicate 300MB on both bands.
That being said, the ports will still not give you over 100Mb/port.
He could get multiple NICs and load balance/trunk them together, but I doubt the router will do that.


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## Aquinus (Jun 28, 2012)

Kreij said:


> According to the cisco specs on the router, it's 300   300. That would seem to indicate 300MB on both bands.



That's 150/150 per freqency range on both 5ghz and 2.4ghz, I have an E4200 that has 300 for 2.4 and 450 for 5ghz. (3x3 MIMO for 5ghz, and 3x2 MIMO for 2.4ghz). Each direction on one channel at full speed is rated for something like 72Mbit on 802.11n, so 150 is a rounded theoretical number. That is why with each extra channel you get increments of 150, such as 150, 300, and 450, but that is still max throughput and you typically don't get it.


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## Sinzia (Jun 28, 2012)

I use Cat7 when I'm going from my router up to the top floor of the house where there's a switch for my office. I use cat7 because it wasn't much more expensive, and it has the really nice metal reinforcements on the rj-45's.

I don't -need- cat7, but I did want the best cable for the job, since its in-wall. Otherwise, a good cat5e is more than adequate for home users.


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## theeldest (Jun 28, 2012)

brandonwh64 said:


> We have two of these big ones and 20 of the size of your picture. We have a BIG facility in chattanooga.



he he he. I think I win this contest. The building at this site has a few hundred racks. We have a couple more buildings at this site, also with a few hundred racks. 

A second site the next town over has a few hundred more racks.

Then we have sites in Tennessee, Minnesota, New Hampshire, and Texas. 

I only get 17 racks that I get to play with, though. :-(


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## Aquinus (Jun 29, 2012)

theeldest said:


> he he he. I think I win this contest. The building at this site has a few hundred racks. We have a couple more buildings at this site, also with a few hundred racks.
> 
> A second site the next town over has a few hundred more racks.
> 
> ...



This isn't a contest? Just because you have a ton of rack servers to play with doesn't mean that something lesser (like my little 7 server rack at work,) doesn't suit our purposes. For what I do and the company I work for, that would be overkill and a waste of money for hardware, space, and cooling for servers that we wouldn't be using or need to use. Just wanted to throw that out there.


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## Delta6326 (Jun 29, 2012)

...I would go with Cat 7 go big or go home...

Unless im looking at it wrong Cat 7 is not expensive....
Rosewill RCNC-11045 15 ft. Cat 7 Red Shielded Twis...


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## Aquinus (Jun 29, 2012)

Delta6326 said:


> ...I would go with Cat 7 go big or go home...
> 
> Unless im looking at it wrong Cat 7 is not expensive....
> Rosewill RCNC-11045 15 ft. Cat 7 Red Shielded Twis...



If the current ethernet cable fails or if *she* needs another one, then I would say if you want to spend the money go for it, but there is no point in replacing a cable that already works.


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## theeldest (Jun 29, 2012)

aquinus said:


> but there is no point in replacing a cable that already works.



+1


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