# Cuzza's Sega SC-3000H Nano-ITX Mod



## Cuzza (Jul 5, 2009)

Here's the old Sega in all its glory:







Some info:

_The SC-3000 is a computer based on the hardware of the first videogame system released by Sega in Japan : the SG-1000 series. It can use the same game cartridges marketed for these consoles. 

The SC-3000 Computer was released in 1983 by SEGA in Japan. It became a competitor of many others 8 bit based computers and its popularity was different in each country it was introduced.

It was mainly sold in Japan, and two important overseas market: Australia & New Zealand. It has found a little distribution in South Africa, Italy and Spain. Probably there were also some sales in other countries but very little is known about this computer and it is difficult to find out precise information._

This one is stuffed. So I plan to rip out the guts of this thing and put something useful inside, namely a nano-itx board and supporting hardware. Stay tuned....


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## Cuzza (Jul 5, 2009)

So, first thing I want to know is can I get the keyboard to work?

I think so. Can use one of these:





This guy gives you an idea of how it will work.

Some more web searching led me to the key matrix for the Sega:





Pulled the kb off, it connects with some nice green ribbons:





So I took the keyboard right to bits to see which connection on the ribbons goes where. Then put all the info together, this is the plan:


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## h3llb3nd4 (Jul 5, 2009)

wow that is complicated!!
G/L man! can't wait to see the end product!!


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## Cuzza (Jul 5, 2009)

h3llb3nd4 said:


> wow that is complicated!!
> G/L man! can't wait to see the end product!!



thanks bud. keep watching, i'm going to need moral support when time comes to buy the parts


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## h3llb3nd4 (Jul 5, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> thanks bud. keep watching, i'm going to need moral support when time comes to buy the parts



np man
I shall see this project to the end...


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## Th0rn0 (Jul 5, 2009)

Wow. Very cool idea. Looking forward to seeing this complete and I love the keyboard


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## Mark_Hardware (Jul 5, 2009)

It's beyond me my friend good luck


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## erocker (Jul 5, 2009)

Awsome Cuzza! I was a big Sega fanboy back in the day, can't wait to see it in action.


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## Yukikaze (Jul 5, 2009)

Tag!

I wanna see this happen. Very cool idea.


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## MKmods (Jul 5, 2009)

Subscribed

It looks like you could use a bunch of plugs from old LEDs,Power/reset switches to test that out.


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## Cuzza (Jul 6, 2009)

Here's the news: New Zealand is pretty light on retailers/etailers/suppliers/anyone who I can buy the nano-ITX stuff i'm going to need for this project. And the ones who do often charge extortionate prices so I think that some complicated international ordering is going to have to happen here 

Back to proceedings; now I always love reading other people's detailed project logs on TPU so I'm going to try to be in-depth here to pay that one forward as it were. I hope you guys like it.

Here's the Sega with the keyboard off:






Note build date 1983, same age as me, even has the same initials, SC! I think this was meant to be.

Here it is in bits. I threw the old circuit board out, it was stuffed, salvaged a couple of the headers (I need the keyboard connection ones) and some resistors that was about all.






Now, what can I fit in here? Made some quick templates to see what will work?






Mini-ITX it seems is possible, but very VERY difficult, because the case narrows so much at the front:






So the board would fit but the heatsink would not, nor would the memory module. The heatsink could be swapped for a heatpipe latop jobbie, that would work but how to make the memory fit? Are 90deg DIMM risers available? I couldn't find one low enough. I know _someone_ who's posted here who likes resoldering motherboards, maybe he would like to solder a bunch of floppy cables to 240 pins beneath the board and mount the DIMM slot somewhere else (as a personal favour).

No, I think that idea is just crazy. I mean  the guy ansking this question seems to have been working on it for 7 years and failed. So I'll go with Nano-ITX instead.


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## MKmods (Jul 6, 2009)

you could mount the mobo upside down below the keyboard (sticking out the bottom with a bit taller feet)


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## mlee49 (Jul 6, 2009)

What if you mounted the M-Itx upside down?

damn it, cut off my MkMods.  good thing he's here to help, I'm afraid I suck.


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## HammerON (Jul 6, 2009)

Cool project!
Subscribed~


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## MKmods (Jul 6, 2009)

mlee49 said:


> What if you mounted the M-Itx upside down?
> 
> damn it, cut off my MkMods.  good thing he's here to help, I'm afraid I suck.



great minds think alike

Right now the Intel Atom 330 is a pretty good deal....If you want REALLY cheap PM me as I have my old VIA EPIA PD in the closet somewhere...(and a 200 watt PS)
http://www.mini-box.com/s.nl;jsessi...34Pa38Ta38Oc3j0?it=A&id=301&sc=8&category=981


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## Cuzza (Jul 6, 2009)

MKmods said:


> you could mount the mobo upside down below the keyboard (sticking out the bottom with a bit taller feet)





mlee49 said:


> What if you mounted the M-Itx upside down?
> 
> damn it, cut off my MkMods.  good thing he's here to help, I'm afraid I suck.



Good idea, had not thought of that. but it wouldn't help, the keyboard atcually takes up more space inside the case that the pictures show, so the board's appendages would still hit the other side. I will keep the suggestion in mind!


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## Cuzza (Jul 6, 2009)

On a posting mission here, so I'll post some more.

Here's the Nano-ITX board I'm thinking of getting, Via's EPIA-NX










Great thing about it is everything is very low to the board and all the connectors plug onto board headers, so I can mount them easily into the side of the case no matter where I mount the board.

Now some people have suggested I get one with an Intel Atom. That sounds like a pretty good idea, but I haven't found an Atom board with the same packaging flexibility of this one. (actually I haven't looked very hard, I think there's a Via fanboy deep within me somewhere, lol).

Still wide open to suggestions here, so fire away if you have any.

Cuzza


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## MKmods (Jul 6, 2009)

here are a couple shots of the Via EPIA PD... Notice the ps mounted in the background, very low profile (especially for 200 watts)









*LOL, I just priced the Epia Nano*
http://www.idotpc.com/TheStore/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=115&idproduct=482


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## Cuzza (Jul 6, 2009)

MKmods said:


> here are a couple shots of the Via EPIA PD... Notice the ps mounted in the background, very low profile (especially for 200 watts)
> 
> *LOL, I just priced the Epia Nano*



No memory on that board? Audio plug connector is too tall anyway!

Oh yeah, not cheap, but hey, as far as the internet can tell me, no one has done this before. So I think it's worth it to break new ground.

EDIT:

Have found a New Zealand retailer for this Via board. *NZ$607! = US$382* oh noes...

EDIT 2:

I see idotPC ships international. Will see how much that charge is...


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## Cuzza (Jul 6, 2009)

I'm a bit stuck here

These are the headers off the Sega board which the keyboard matrix ribbons plug into






Now the ribbons go into these and then I need to connect the pins to the floppy cable somehow. I don't want to solder the wires directly onto the pins. Any suggestions?


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## craigbru (Jul 6, 2009)

Very cool project.  I always love when someone takes older hardware and updates it.  I'll be watching, and good luck!


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## Cuzza (Jul 7, 2009)

*Progress....*

Hey team, here's what I've done today.

Realised the original key diagram was wrong. Updated:






Managed to answer my own question of how to connect the keyboard ribbon headers, by making an adaptor board. This will also save connecting the floppy cable wires individually. here's the plan:






Nice pretty picture. Easier drawn than made though! Went and bought some bits and set to work soldering. I have never soldered a circuit board before so I quickly found my technique left a lot of room for improvement, but four hours later it was done:






And the bottom, not so pretty!






It all works though; I tested all the connections with the multimeter, everything seems just fine. Here it is connected:






Phew, it has been a hard day to produce that, and my room is a mess! I have too much time on my hands. Luckily my assistant is working hard....






Damn, I am totally committed now, no excuses. Things are looking good on the job front so I should be able to afford the bits I can't make.

Peace out
Cuzza


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## Yukikaze (Jul 7, 2009)

Looking good !


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## Mark_Hardware (Jul 7, 2009)

lol @ the kitty....
I will definitely be watching this. I am planning a mini ITX build in the future so I am always interested in what hardware people use.


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## h3llb3nd4 (Jul 7, 2009)

GUd progress! cant wait


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## Cuzza (Jul 9, 2009)

Not much happening here because I'm busy ordering parts at the moment, trying to do this without spending a fortune is difficult. Times like these I wish I was American! I have a friend in Oregon who I am trying to get some orders sent to then he'll forward them to me for cheap, but he is not going to be there long so I might need another friend.

Also debating whether to put an optical drive in this thing. Does anyone know the power draw from a laptop style optical drive? Maybe I'll just google it. Typing as I think BTW. While watching Win98 install on an old PC. I miss 98.


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## MKmods (Jul 10, 2009)

the draw from Laptop Hdds and DVDs is practically nothing (they also run off 5V too)

As an example, right now I am using my Intel Atom 330 (1.6Ghz X 2) with 2 gigs of memory, a 10K raptor Hdd and a full size DVD and my comp draws 30 watts of power.

One other thing is the small PSs like I linked to before are much more efficient than standard ATX PSs (I think they are in the 95% range). I notice my comp draws about 10 more watts when I use an ATX PS.


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## Cuzza (Jul 10, 2009)

OK so that's not an issue. I'll worry about putting a drive in it later. I think a slot load one at the front would be pretty swish.

Planning on this for the power supply:
http://www.idotpc.com/TheStore/pc/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=629






It has the wide input range so I'll pick up an old laptop charger I've seen a few 16V ones selling for about $10 that can feed this thing.


Minor update today, had to install the adaptor board in the case, so needed some sort of standoffs. Took some old car-tyre valve caps cut them in half, drilled them and glued them in place.






And the board just screws onto that. easy.


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## Cuzza (Jul 20, 2009)

While I'm waiting for bits to arrive from America this is all that has happened recently on this mod: The AC adaptor showed up! (wow I know)

Thanks to the good people at IBM for this baby.





And it should fit nicely inside the Sega (that's mostly luck rather than good planning), so no silly adaptor on the floor to trip over.


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## Meecrob (Jul 30, 2009)

I would/would have gone with the mitx setup, mound it upside down and add some taller rubber feet, you could also make ur own cooler for the board depending on what you have access to.

if u really wanted to go all out, you could try and find a picoitx board, uber small


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## p_o_s_pc (Jul 30, 2009)

Subscribed. I want to see how this goes


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## m4gicfour (Jul 30, 2009)

*drool* this kind of stuff gives me so many ideas! Since I don't have any old Sega machines anymore, I'll share my idea; maybe you'll want to try it out.

Does the board you are planning on using have a parallel port header?

If it does you may want to look at this: ppJoy software. Run joystick adapters from parallel ports... such as the original Sega controllers (all plug into a standard serial port style plug, you just need a circut... such as the NTPADXP interface from that site. 






Sorry, that site wouldn't navigate to the page from the link... so here's the gif; its under:
Supported interfaces > Sega Genesis > NTPADXP. (I've built that one. works good - in fact if I can find the convertor I built you could have it for free)

Then you could wire up the existing ports from your SC-3000H or just buy some D-sub connectors from radioshack (DB9). and then EMULATOR GLORY with original Sega pads, kekeke  You may be able to find some on ebay...






How 'bout an authentic SG-1000 game? Elevator Action!





Meka's a good emulator for early Sega machines (such as yours)
http://img.techpowerup.org/090729/Elevator Action (SG-1000) [!]-01.png


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## Cuzza (Jul 30, 2009)

Meecrob said:


> I would/would have gone with the mitx setup



I'm not sure what you mean, I've worked through the possibilities and there is really no way to make it fit, even upside-down. Are you suggesting feet under the case and cut holes in the bottom to let the board components stick out a bit?




m4gicfour said:


> Does the board you are planning on using have a parallel port header?



Nope, though I bet I can buy a small USB - parallel port adaptor.

Thanks for those links, you know I hadn't even considered what I was going to actually use this thing for... Sega emulator would be pretty cool. I think I will worry about that after I have the rest of it working. And I'm not ordering the (expensive!) n-ITX board, picoPSU and memory until I know that the keyboard works (the X-keys is on a boat from America as I speak.. hopefully...)

Damn, i should have kept the gamepad connectors off the SEGA motherboard! .....


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## Maban (Jul 30, 2009)

I have a few Genesis controllers I guess i could sell(not free, plan to use it again) to you. And also some some kind of 2 to 4 port thing from EA.


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## m4gicfour (Jul 30, 2009)

grr. had to edit my post. That ppJoy site seems to go to the homepage no matter where you link to (that or my firefox is buggered.)

I'm going to look for that converter i made. It's nothing special, but its yours if you want it.



Cuzza said:


> Nope, though I bet I can buy a small USB - parallel port adaptor.
> 
> Thanks for those links, you know I hadn't even considered what I was going to actually use this thing for... Sega emulator would be pretty cool. I think I will worry about that after I have the rest of it working. And I'm not ordering the (expensive!) n-ITX board, picoPSU and memory until I know that the keyboard works (the X-keys is on a boat from America as I speak.. hopefully...)
> 
> Damn, i should have kept the gamepad connectors off the SEGA motherboard! .....



If you do go for a parallel-to-usb adapter, be careful. I've heard that most only support printers (perhaps only emulate a specific PP mode or protocol?) If that's the case, it'd be useless anyway. That said, I haven't actually used any USB-PP adaptors so I don;t know YMMV


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## Cuzza (Jul 30, 2009)

Maban said:


> I have a few Genesis controllers I guess i could sell(not free, plan to use it again) to you. And also some some kind of 2 to 4 port thing from EA.



Thanks for the offer, if I can't get hold of one here in NZ I'll ask you next



m4gicfour said:


> I'm going to look for that converter i made. It's nothing special, but its yours if you want it.



That would be great.


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## Meecrob (Jul 30, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> I'm not sure what you mean, I've worked through the possibilities and there is really no way to make it fit, even upside-down. Are you suggesting feet under the case and cut holes in the bottom to let the board components stick out a bit?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



yeah, mostly the cpu/chipset coolers and if needed the ram, it would lead to better temps (fresh air on the coolers) and if u gota dremel it shouldnt be that hard to keep it pretty covert looking, saw a guy do that with an old dead amega computer that was just a bit larger then what you got there, but he was even able to mount a laptop optical drive sticking out the back!!!


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## Cuzza (Jul 31, 2009)

interesting idea, might keep it in mind for future upgrades. but for now I want to keep the case stock, which means nano-ITX. i have also obtained a slot-load optical drive out of a iBook which I am already struggling to find space for,there would definitely be no room to fit that in if i go m-ITX. thanks for the input though!


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## Cuzza (Aug 2, 2009)

*ZOMG Actual Progress!!!*


OK team, here's the latest:

I picked up this slim optical combo drive for $20. It's a slot-load job out of an iBook G4






So to mount this I had to cut a slot in the side of the case. It will go through the two joystick port holes.






This is the result, I'm very pleased considering I used an angle grinder and an old soldering iron to cut the plastic. You can see through the gap the sticky foam strips I'm using to raise the drive and also dampen vibrations.






So the drive mounts in there like so






And this is what it looks like from the outside






Now I need some input: Do you think I should paint the bezel on the drive black? Would be more stealth, make things look more stock I guess. But I kinda like the white. Opinions welcome.


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## Mark_Hardware (Aug 2, 2009)

very nice work, man! some of this stuff is way over my head lol


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## a111087 (Aug 2, 2009)

paint it


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## Cuzza (Aug 3, 2009)

a111087 said:


> paint it



OK






It does look good painted. This photo really shows up my scuff marks and dodgy paintwork, you hardly notice that with the eye.


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## djshadow (Aug 3, 2009)

Can't wait to see some testing pictures . I believe in all 100% that it will be success . Subd


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## Meecrob (Aug 3, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> OK
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/090803/SV402778.jpg
> 
> It does look good painted. This photo really shows up my scuff marks and dodgy paintwork, you hardly notice that with the eye.



if you want some advice on how to clean the scuff marks off, grab some brasso and give it a good scrubing


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## h3llb3nd4 (Aug 3, 2009)

wow you're mking progress Cuzza!


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## Cuzza (Aug 4, 2009)

Meecrob said:


> if you want some advice on how to clean the scuff marks off, grab some brasso and give it a good scrubing



seriously? brasso on plastic?


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## Meecrob (Aug 4, 2009)

yeah, i have used it to buff out all sorts of scuffs and scratches, google stuff like "ipod brasso" or "zune brasso" for example, its a wonder to see how many uses brasso has!!!

I also found the silver polish made by the same company to be quite good, but its not as abrasive so you have to scrub ALOT longer, if you wanting to get ultimate shine, use brasso then silver polish to get a nice mirror effect(mostly for metal or pmp screens)


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## Cuzza (Aug 5, 2009)

OK i'll try it

EDIT

Dug around in the shed found an old can of Brasso, this must be 20 years old lol






But still works, check it out, shiny.........


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## Cuzza (Aug 7, 2009)

*The most important day of this project so far...*

Well guys, the X-keys board finally showed up! check it out:






I went to hook it up and realised that my diagram was wrong, AGAIN, DUH! 
Here's the updated version, I know this one is right:






Now, here it is installed next to my adaptor board in the Sega case:






Connect them with the floppy cable:






And this is the final product:






And guess what? It works!  Have a look at the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2UKTwX8dUo

So pleased right now, if this didn't work the whole project was fucked. But now it's game on.
And just for fun here's a pic of the hard drive which showed up today as well:


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## Yukikaze (Aug 7, 2009)

Awesome !


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## p_o_s_pc (Aug 7, 2009)

congrats on that working  hope the rest goes fine


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## Cuzza (Aug 7, 2009)

not as awesome as chopping up perfectly good video cards with a dremel, but yeah, pretty awesome


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## Yukikaze (Aug 7, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> not as awesome as chopping up perfectly good video cards with a dremel, but yeah, pretty awesome



Nah, chopping up video cards isn't awesome, that's insanity


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## EnergyFX (Aug 7, 2009)

cool mod cuzza!


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## Easo (Aug 7, 2009)

Niiiiiiice...


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## Cuzza (Aug 8, 2009)

Thanks for the comments guys, you always make my day with that.

Now that I know the keyboard works I have ordered the other bits I need

$207.00 VIA Epia NX15000g nano-itx m/b 
$20.00 1gb ddr2 533 sodimm 
$50.00 picoPSU-60WI 
$4.00 IDE adapter for slim optical drive 
$50.00 USPS express mail 

US$  331.00.00 total

= NZ$505.48 arghhhhhh I am so poor now


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## Mark_Hardware (Aug 8, 2009)

gee whiz no small order. err, well I mean it is small stuff but, whatever lol.
Looks good, can't wait to see how it all works.


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## SC-3000-Survivors (Aug 8, 2009)

*Welcome Back Sc-3000h*

Hi!
I'm Francesco the Head of SC-3000 Survivors site  I'm very glad you has started this project, seems really cool...  

I must admit that in the beginning I was "shocked" about how you could "hurt" the chassis, but I realized that the irresistible charm of SC-3000 has "captured"  your attenton 

Why not running Mess emulator at the start of the system ? You could rn C64 emulation with an SC-3000, funny! 

However you showed a great creativity and I just can't see the time you will post some pictures of the running system  

We will celebrate with a beer  What about some quotation of your project on our site ?


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## Cuzza (Aug 9, 2009)

Francesco, Hello! You may remember I had an email from you some months ago, I was asking how to get my Sega to work. Thanks for your reply, I tried to email you again but your email address kept rejecting my emails so I gave up. Anyway, I tried to power up the Sega but it didn't go, so I'm doing this instead. I hope you like it.


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## SC-3000-Survivors (Aug 9, 2009)

HIIIII  
I'm sorry for my email address... I've encountered many problems... but It was nice to know you are doing this project! 
I'm sorry to hear that your SC-3000 is dead  but... I think that this project may go futher than one may think!  
We have some ideas for the site and the SC-3000 community that this SC-PC can be really interesting  So keep up the good work and go on! 


By the way, can we document this w.i.p. on our site ?

oh, I forgot, that video is amazing!!!!! For many people may seems silly but for SEGA SC-3000 survivors it's great!!!!!


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## MKmods (Aug 9, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Thanks for the comments guys, you always make my day with that.
> 
> Now that I know the keyboard works I have ordered the other bits I need
> 
> ...



LOL, bot have things come down in price......I paid like $300 just for my old VIA Epia PD mobo back in the day.
Excellent job on the wiring and the good deals.


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## SC-3000-Survivors (Aug 9, 2009)

Have you thought about what o.s. to use ?


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## Cuzza (Aug 9, 2009)

SC-3000-Survivors said:


> HIIIII
> By the way, can we document this w.i.p. on our site ?



Yes, go ahead. Maybe your members have some ideas for me? And running C64 emulation on it, that would be funny. 



SC-3000-Survivors said:


> Have you thought about what o.s. to use ?



I was planning to put WinXP on it but I have just installed my only copy of that on my old Socket A machine. So maybe it will be Linux. I have very little experience with Linux so any suggestions there are appreciated.



MKmods said:


> LOL, bot have things come down in price......I paid like $300 just for my old VIA Epia PD mobo back in the day.
> Excellent job on the wiring and the good deals.



Burn! Well, that's always been the way. Give it another year and I will probably feel horribly ripped off.:shadedshu


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## MKmods (Aug 9, 2009)

I find it hard to believe stuff will continue to get cheaper (HD 4770 for around $100 is an insane value)

I think in the next year or so stuff will start going up quite a bit...


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## Cuzza (Aug 10, 2009)

better spend up large now then!


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## dr emulator (madmax) (Aug 17, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Hey team, here's what I've done today.
> 
> Realised the original key diagram was wrong. Updated:
> 
> ...


yes my assistant usually looks like that until it's all quiet then he attacks the back of my neck at 2 in morning with a wet nose scaring the crap out of me .
have you much to do on ya project?


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## Cuzza (Aug 17, 2009)

All the hard work is done. Basically just waiting on the motherboard, PSU and a couple of other cables and things to arrive in a box from the states. Then I just need to install them which shouldn't take too long.


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## MKmods (Aug 17, 2009)

looking forward to the updates. 

I just picked up a Vic-20 from eBay so in the future I will be doing one of these too. I will definitely  need your help with the keyboard. Thanks for this thread.


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## Cuzza (Aug 18, 2009)

Well, I guess you could do it my way (the hard way) or this is the easy way

http://www.vesalia.de/e_keyrah.htm


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## MKmods (Aug 18, 2009)

I was thinking of taking the keys out of my new Razor lycosa and using that but than I thought I really need to keep some of the origional stuff....Thanks Cuzza for that link.


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## Cuzza (Aug 18, 2009)

NP my friend. I was originally planning to get an Amiga 600 and use one of these Keyrah things in it, but I found the SC-3000H and modded that instead. Turned out to be much more fun and unique.


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## Cuzza (Aug 25, 2009)

Well after a couple of weeks of waiting because the company I'm ordering my parts from was out of stock, they are finally on their way. That means in about 2 weeks I should have this baby up and running. Just working on little things right now, like pulling off the funny little stickers that are on the keys. Don't know what they're about but they're ugly and useless so they're outta here.


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## MKmods (Aug 25, 2009)

Im waiting too for parts to show up (Red CF and my Vic 20) waiting sucks.


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## erocker (Aug 25, 2009)

Awesome stuff! Mk, I can't wait to see the VIC-20! First computer I ever bought.


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## MKmods (Aug 25, 2009)

LOL, I owe it to Cuzza. His build looked so like so much fun I just had to try it.


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## Cuzza (Aug 25, 2009)

a couple of pics if anyone is interested

keyboard with no stupid stickers, also rearranged some keys into more standard layout:







and here is the key matrix sheet, someone said it is reminiscent of a golf course, i'm not so sure


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## morpha (Aug 25, 2009)

Youve got M and N around the wrong way in that picture.


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## Cuzza (Aug 25, 2009)

oops, f*ck, i thought I would probably get some keys wrong when i put it back together! good spotting


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## Mark_Hardware (Aug 25, 2009)

lmao


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## Cuzza (Sep 1, 2009)

Had another idea.




See this hole in the side of the case? That's the cartridge slot. I was going to leave it open for cabling access (specifically network cable) but I think what would be better would be to get a small wireless mouse that slots in there, and can live there as part of the computer.

So I went searching and found this on ebay 






This mouse is the perfect dimensions to slot into that hole. I imagine it is a shit mouse, but that's what you get from no-name chinese manufacturers. Should be good enough for my purposes.

So if anyone has seen a similar product let me know just so I can have some options. It has to be less that 24mm (1 inch) tall and less than 88mm (3 1/2 inch) long. width no big deal.

Quick update on the other bits, track-and-trace says my package in in NZ customs. Almost here!!


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## MKmods (Sep 1, 2009)

good idea...
I wanted to say thanks again for inspiring me to do this to the Vic-20. (mine just showed up today) Lucky for me the Vic-20 is a thicker housing so there is more room to hide parts.


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## Cuzza (Sep 1, 2009)

np dude. Are you going to be keeping a log on here for the vic-20 project?


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## Cuzza (Sep 8, 2009)

*New parts! Exciting....... !!!*

Got a package today all the way from California:






After paying NZ customs $56 tax! Grrrrr /tax gripe

Anyway, must be worth it because here is my swish new Via Nano-ITX board














Here's the pico-PSU






Got it all hooked up, and installing XP






So it all works fine. Now just need to fit it all in the Sega case, going to be tricky. The heatsink needs to undergo some serious mods.

Only thing that is annoying me is that I found out now that this board doesn't do widescreen resolutions! What is that about? I just naively assumed it would. Thanks a lot Via, time to get with the program.


----------



## MKmods (Sep 8, 2009)

Nice job on getting the new mobo,  I have a similar Pico PS as well and its amazing how well it works for being so small.



Cuzza said:


> np dude. Are you going to be keeping a log on here for the vic-20 project?



after I get the CF and get the Qpack mod done I will do a log on the Vic-20 (finish yours first)


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## Cuzza (Sep 9, 2009)

lol, yes I have been procrastinating! 

I've been searching around, looks like I can mod the BIOS on the Via board to get widescreen, I'm pretty sketchy about doing it though, so that can definitely wait. Don't want to brick my brand new board.

Got some more pics to show but TPU image hosting seems to be playing up? might try again later. 

Also, going to have to choose between the integrated-mouse idea and putting the power brick inside the case. What do you reckon?


----------



## m4gicfour (Sep 9, 2009)

Well, looks like you've made some progress since I last checked in 

I've been randomly looking around the house for that old sega joystick-adapter I mentioned way back when and I can't find it, sorry. Come to think of it, I may have given it away when I gave my Sega Master Systems (x2) and my Genesis W/32X away.

Oh well. Its not like its hard to build or buy that sort of thing so if you really did want something like that I'm sure you could work it.


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## Cuzza (Sep 9, 2009)

*more pics*

so I had to make a mess of the heatsink so it would fit. here's the underside, nice chewing gum under there, thanks for that crap via, soon to be replaced with arctic silver.






here's the naked board






After a lot of dicking around with pliers and angle grinder I managed to mangle it into this:






looks like this installed:






freakin ugly but oh well, can't see it while you're driving.

I maxed out ATItool to get some heat into it, seems to cope OK.replacing the thermal pads probably made up for loss of surface area and less favourable fan placement....

BTW, i got average 17 FPS on the 3dview on ATItool, S3 unichrome FTL!

Fantastic news! I can get widescreen resolutions afterall, just had to disable the mini-LCD output, which I'm not using anyway. Should probably share this finding with other suckers on the Via forums who thought they had the same problem... or maybe let them suffer lol


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## 1Kurgan1 (Sep 9, 2009)

Looking good, but when you reapply Thermal Paste go with something diff than AS5, that eventually will wear out and need to be replaced. MX-2 or OCZ Freeze are both good, but not sure on prices where you are at.


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## MKmods (Sep 9, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Also, going to have to choose between the integrated-mouse idea and putting the power brick inside the case. What do you reckon?



Honestly I wont know what I will do till I do it (im not much of a planning kind of guy)


1Kurgan1 said:


> Looking good, but when you reapply Thermal Paste go with something diff than AS5, that eventually will wear out and need to be replaced. MX-2 or OCZ Freeze are both good, but not sure on prices where you are at.



+1, I havent tried it yet but I got a tube of MX-3 the other day, If ur gonna get one look for it



Cuzza said:


> BTW, i got average 17 FPS on the 3dview on ATItool, S3 unichrome FTL!



While the intergrated video on the Intel/Atom mobo I have is ok for surfing and barely ok for Netflix I wish I had waited a bit and got better onboard graphics. I am thinking of getting a 9500GT (PCI) but havent decided if its worth close to $100


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## Mark_Hardware (Sep 9, 2009)

Looking good, man, nice hardware! Makes me impatient to get my stuff. cept I wont be using mini itx after all


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## erocker (Sep 9, 2009)

I like the bent-up heatsink. You could lightly sandblast it to make it look nice, but yeah it really doesn't matter. Looking good!


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## Cuzza (Sep 10, 2009)

1Kurgan1 said:


> Looking good, but when you reapply Thermal Paste go with something diff than AS5, that eventually will wear out and need to be replaced. MX-2 or OCZ Freeze are both good, but not sure on prices where you are at.



Wear out? Why? How soon? How bad will it get? Obviously I haven't had much experience with different thermal pastes, it was the only one I could find locally. I think I have some generic stuff somewhere that shipped with on old Athlon I bought a while back, would that be better?

Developments: Decided not to bother with the mini-mouse idea, can't be bothered ordering it in from China, and it would be a shit mouse anyway.

@erocker, I don't have the equipment for that, hell I don't have any equipment. I really need a Dremel. could have made the heatsink look respectable if i'd cut it with a precision tool rather than my stone age methods

@MK, nah I don't think it would be worth it for the 9500, id say put that towards a better motherboard


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## Cuzza (Sep 10, 2009)

*We're rocking along now*



Today's mission was to mount the motherboard. I had to go to the local recycling centre where I found some plastic cupboard handles.






I cut a slice of these to make some feet for the motherboard to stand on, and glued them to the case.






Here it is mounted






I had a good time routing the IDE cable under the board, it looks very good IMHO






So once I plugged everything in I started finding several clearance issues, the killer problem was the mobo power connector which jutted up too high.

Solution? pull the plastic connector right off the board, because it is only a shroud for the pins, and the plug will slot directly onto it. Also get ghetto and slice some plastic out of the top so the wires come out more laterally. This saves about 5mm in height (damn should have taken a "before" pic!)






After a lot of cocking about I managed to get the picoPSU and the HDD in position to clear the underside of the keyboard:






So all is going to plan. The major item left is cutting the case to fit USB, VGA and PS2 plugs, and fitting the power brick. Stay tuned.....


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## h3llb3nd4 (Sep 10, 2009)

wow, going as planned I see
nice work cuzza


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## Mussels (Sep 10, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Wear out? Why? How soon? How bad will it get? Obviously I haven't had much experience with different thermal pastes, it was the only one I could find locally. I think I have some generic stuff somewhere that shipped with on old Athlon I bought a while back, would that be better?
> 
> Developments: Decided not to bother with the mini-mouse idea, can't be bothered ordering it in from China, and it would be a shit mouse anyway.
> 
> ...



AS5 lasts several years

i cant recall exactly when it was, but i built a PC back when i went to london (2005 i beleive) with AS5 and that AS5 has dried up in the last few months - that poor athlonXP runs at 65C idle now and i'm having to show a girl how to regrease her CPU over webcam.

you should look at a laptop touchpad or a trackball


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## MKmods (Sep 10, 2009)

Nice work making the wiring lower profile


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## Cuzza (Sep 11, 2009)

*At this rate I'll have it done in a few days, then what the hell will I do?*



Today was time to mod the case itself some more.

Cut hole in the back for the power plug. Looks rough but don't worry, polish that up with brasso, wil be mint






Here's the power brick in place and plugged in:






unfortunately I had some more clearance issues and had to cut a chunk off the corner of the power brick






So I taped it up and put it back, and it squeezed in, just!






The good thing about mounting it here is it blocks up the cartridge slot, so no ugly eexposed wiring (sorry crap photo)






Then I cut some more holes in the side and mounted the USB sockets











Good times.

@m4gicfour, thanks for looking for that stuff dude, I'd kinda forgotten about that Sega-emulation type stuff. Too busy just getting it going as a regular puter.


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## Cuzza (Sep 11, 2009)

Also cut a hole and mounted the VGA plug in the case


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## Cuzza (Sep 12, 2009)

*Wow, this is almost over, rather pleased with myself*



Carrying on.... I went down to the electronics store today and bought some switches wires and buttons.

Here's the one I'm using for the power switch






And mounted in the case






I rigged up a reset button as well. Had to jam wires onto mobo headers as had no connectors for the tiny pins. Damn you again VIA






So here's what that looks like from the back






And this is the lead I made to put an audio jack in the back of the case






If you are following the pattern here you probably know what pic is coming next. Note dodgy wires jammed onto headers in background. oh BTW the orange "reset" button on the keyboard is now wired directly to the mobo power on header. the wee button on the rear of the case does the reset function.






So, yeah that's about it. Just had to wire up everything, and find a way to get the cables to fit. I did it, it's not terribly pretty but there ain't no side windows in this puppy....






And again....






Screw her together, plug her in, switch her on, TADA!!!!!!!







OK, so it's 99% done. Still have to wire in the power LED, and maybe a HD LED if I can be bothered. Then get a USB wireless network adapter. That just needs plugging in. And maybe a wireless mouse. And would also like a SD card reader. Maybe I should find a way to get another fan in there, it seems to run pretty hot... to much to think about. And I thought I was finished? Maybe you never finish modding.

Right, I am proper shagged. Going to watch F1 qualifying and go to bed. Will post a case gallery at some stage. Spot you later gang. Peace. Cuzza.


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## Frick (Sep 12, 2009)

Nicely done!


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## Mussels (Sep 12, 2009)

looks terrible from the inside view lol


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## morpha (Sep 12, 2009)

complete win


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## Cuzza (Sep 12, 2009)

Thanks for the constructive criticism Mussels! lol. I never did set out with interior aesthetics in mind. About the only thing I could possibly do to improve it would be to custom make all the cables to exactly the right length and route them accordingly, something I have neither the ability or the desire to do.


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## Mussels (Sep 12, 2009)

it doesnt need to be pretty, you blocked any view of it from the outside, and it all seems to look good externall.


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## MKmods (Sep 12, 2009)

Hey Cuzza it was really fun watching this thread, it gave me many new ideas on how to do my own

its so cool to see "other" ways to do comps.


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## Cuzza (Sep 12, 2009)

I'm glad you liked it! Thanks for your input and ideas, it all helps in many ways. That goes for everone who has posted here.


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## Cuzza (Sep 13, 2009)

check it out in the case gallery

http://www.techpowerup.com/gallery/2336.html


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## Random Murderer (Sep 13, 2009)

wow. now i wanna do this with my old atari 2600...


morpha said:


> complete win


indeed.


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## a_ump (Sep 13, 2009)

i wasn't here to watch it but i just read all 5 pages and DAM NICE is all i can say. This is definitely one of the most interesting and unique mods i have seen on these forums. nice job man, i've always wanted to get into modding just don't have the place for it. can't say it enough but very enjoying read. 

and you already got thermal paste i assume on there, i used AS5 on my computer with my q6600, after 10 months or so my idle temps crept up some and i was like meh. then bout 4 months later i realized i was idling at 56-58 celcius  haha so i finally reaplied the paste.


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## Cuzza (Sep 19, 2009)

Almost gave myself a heart attack! Had the Sega apart to work on cable management, make some space for a USB wifi dongle, and that went nicely. Went to power it up afterwards, no picture.....

Since the only thing I had been messing with was cables I figured I had damaged the VGA link cable while bending it around the components.

So out came the multimeter, checked all the pins and everything is OK, still no picture, but can tell by HDD sounds and everything else is normal it is booting OK. Really worried at this point...

Then I pulled it all to bits, cleared CMOS and tried again, great success! Picture on screen. So I dunno what the hell I did, but I needed a bloody stiff drink after that. US$250 to replace a bricked board is something I really don't want to cough up right now.

Was thinking about my next project, but now I have to get this thing back together, grrr, also need a new cable to the keyboard because I fucked the original one and now I can't program the keyboard. Can still type but some keys are still redundant, irritating.

currently bidding on a few old puters






http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=241612114





http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=241659901





http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=241761665


We'll see how they go. MKmods, if I win the Vic20 we can have a race! No wait, I can't beat you at that. Well, we can have a lot of fun comparing notes anyway. Whatever one I get (if any) it will be fun.


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## [Ion] (Sep 20, 2009)

Amazing, I am very impressed


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## MKmods (Sep 20, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> We'll see how they go. MKmods, if I win the Vic20 we can have a race! No wait, I can't beat you at that. Well, we can have a lot of fun comparing notes anyway. Whatever one I get (if any) it will be fun.



LOL, a race? I accept
(Il keep mine in its box and in 1 piece till I hear more)


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## Cuzza (Sep 20, 2009)

Thanks, [Ion], this is my first go at this sort of thing so hopefully I can do even better.



MKmods said:


> LOL, a race? I accept
> (Il keep mine in its box and in 1 piece till I hear more)



You an take yours out mate. The bid on the Vic20 and the amstrad went out of my price range. But I got the Mac for $5.50!

As for the sega, I've done the power LED, and improved cable management. 

I have also managed  to damage the keyboard matrix ribbon, scratched a tiny bit of one of the conductors and it broke the connection, and I managed to make it worse, and ruin another conductor while trying to find the fault. But I think I can fix that with some conductive paint... right? If so, not really sure where to get some, or what sort, any advice there???







anyway, may as well post some pics

Updates to cable management, should provide space for the wifi and bluetooth dongles atop the DVD drive






and here is the power LED i wired up, the yellow wires again jam onto mobo pin headers.







Edit: one more thing, if anyone can recommend to me a good, quiet, 60mm x 60mm x 10mm fan, that would be awesome, because the little 40mm one in there is a little loud. In fact does anyone have one they'd like to part with? I'll pay you to ship it over here


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## Cuzza (Sep 23, 2009)

My Dad suggested I go visit this man he knows who fixes car speedo's, so I did, and he knew just what I needed, so he got out a big catalogue and we looked the stuff up and I ordered it. $17 for this:










Painted it on there and voila! Fixed.

Then the issue of no picture reared its ugly head, and, after clearing CMOS and stripping the board bare I finally got it to POST and into the BIOS. But can't be bothered putting the bastard back together now. I think something may be shorting, somewhere, when it is all put together. Will get back on this issue.

Anyway, again, any advice on the fan issue? (see previous post)


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## Necrofire (Sep 29, 2009)

I have a few AMD fans (70mm?) and possibly a 60mm (but taller than 10mm, I think)
I'll check when I get home, PM me if you don't get another offer before tomorrow evening


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## p_o_s_pc (Sep 29, 2009)

hate to tell you this but you could have got stuff for a defroster repair kit and used it. Can get it at most auto parts stores for about $10. If you have room for a stock AMD fan there great. Put out nice amount of air  without too much noise


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## Cuzza (Sep 29, 2009)

I've never seen such a kit, but I imagine it would have the right stuff in it. It would probably be about the same price anyway. Maybe I'll have a look and see I got burned.

10mm is maximum height I have space for, 70mm wide might fit but I think 60mm is max. I found a 60mm fan at the junk store, it's good size but it was noisier than the 40mm.

If I can't find one on the cheap I might order one of these:
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/6157/fan-328/Cooljag_Everflow_60mm_x_10mm_Fan_126010DL.html




Won't be cheap to send out here. Anyway, I don't have anything better to blow cash on do I?


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## Cuzza (Oct 18, 2009)

I made a video of the Sega. Check it out on YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6F7lVB_MDXs


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## MKmods (Oct 18, 2009)

Looks cool Cuzza, thanks again for the help


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## Cuzza (Oct 30, 2009)

I've designed a new custom heatsink for the sega. About 4 hours on sketchup for this:






Drawing it is one think, but making one, that's a different kettle of fish!! lol. Pipedreams.....


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## 1Kurgan1 (Oct 30, 2009)

If you made it with all the measurements couldn't you just contact a business that specializes in that field, send them the file and have them make it?


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## Cuzza (Oct 30, 2009)

1Kurgan1 said:


> If you made it with all the measurements couldn't you just contact a business that specializes in that field, send them the file and have them make it?



Oh I'm sure that's possible, but I doubt I can afford it.


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## Lazzer408 (Oct 30, 2009)

Yukikaze said:


> Nah, chopping up video cards isn't awesome, that's insanity



I'm not insane. 



Cuzza said:


> I've designed a new custom heatsink for the sega. About 4 hours on sketchup for this:
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/091030/sega heatsink.png
> 
> Drawing it is one think, but making one, that's a different kettle of fish!! lol. Pipedreams.....



Cuzzo, turn all those fins in the same direction. How will the air get from the fan across the fins if they're sideways? Or did you have something else in mind?


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## Cuzza (Oct 30, 2009)

Lazzer408 said:


> I'm not insane.
> 
> Cuzzo, turn all those fins in the same direction. How will the air get from the fan across the fins if they're sideways? Or did you have something else in mind?



You raise a good point. Here's what it's supposed to do right now:






Air is blown under the fan and down the fins underneath it. When it reaches the central section it can go left or right. This is the only point around the heatsink where there is much room for exhaust, on top the case/underside of the keyboard is very close so won't get much flow that way. I suppose if I made the fins on the front part of the heatsink slope the other direction some could go there, that would probably help. In fact, now that I think about it I really should make it go that way because the fins don't need a base there and the air can escape underneath.  So I'm going to redesign.


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## F2K (Oct 30, 2009)

Great mod Cuzza.

Just read through the whole topic and it really inspired me to try something similar


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## Cuzza (Oct 30, 2009)

F2K said:


> Great mod Cuzza.
> 
> Just read through the whole topic and it really inspired me to try something similar



Good for you. What do you have in mind? I hope you will keep a log thread to share your experiences.


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## Lazzer408 (Oct 30, 2009)

Pardon my paintbrish skills, but if you cut out the middle you could make your fin layout work. That's the only way I can see you getting away with optimizing that design.

On another note. Look into removing the fan's housing and just leave the motor base and screw it to the heatsink. Everywhere you see plastic around the fan, you would have fins.

EDIT - Like I did in the second pic. This will take all night but you get the idea and can see the fin area you will gain. That's how I would have done my heatsink if I had a mill handy. Notching mine out like I did was easy on the bandsaw.


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## bigsharn (Oct 30, 2009)

I love it, that working keyboard must have been a nightmare


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## Cuzza (Oct 30, 2009)

Lazzer, great idea removing the fan housing, I never thought of that! i still want it to be able to exhaust out the sides so i'll  make that work. sketchup is going to be busy.

@bigsharn, the keyboard was only hard in the planning stage. it took a lot of effort to work out, but was easy enough to execute. glad you like it!


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## Lazzer408 (Oct 30, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Lazzer, great idea removing the fan housing, I never thought of that! i still want it to be able to exhaust out the sides so i'll  make that work.



The edited picture I posted was just to show the fin area gained. Without your build in hand it's hard to suggest anything optimal. You get the idea and that's what matters. I actually just found this thread yesterday. lol Now I know wtf you were talking about before. Looking good. Good luck with it.


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## Cuzza (Oct 31, 2009)

*Custom Sega Heatsink mkII*







Redrawn from scratch. This one took me about 6 hours, lol. My sketchup skills have slipped lately! And the PNG didn't render very well this time, not sure what's going on there.

Anyway, Lazzer I took your idea on board and this would be much more effective. If you can't work it out the airflow goes like this






You have to realise that in the case there is no space (about 1-2mm) above the heatsink. So most of the air will go where the fins direct it. There is maybe 4-5mm above the fan, not ideal but should give enough air for it to be effective, even at low (silent) fan speeds.

You like?


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## Lazzer408 (Oct 31, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> http://img.techpowerup.org/091031/heatsink multi.png
> 
> 
> Redrawn from scratch. This one took me about 6 hours, lol. My sketchup skills have slipped lately! And the PNG didn't render very well this time, not sure what's going on there.
> ...



Now your cooking with gas! That's a win there cuzzo. Thats more what I was thinking about how to get out the sides. Make pegs.

EDIT - Why are the rear fins blocked off?


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## Cuzza (Oct 31, 2009)

Lazzer408 said:


> Why are the rear fins blocked off?



I was wondering about that. Ostensibly they are blocked off because there is very little outflow available at that side, so I thought to block it completely so all the air can go to the front. Then I thought maybe the air on that side of the fan won't go anywhere at all and will just slow the fan down like it's pushing against a wall. Opening it up could actually help the fan overall. What do you think?

The other thing I was wondering about it the slots underneath the fan - they are not very wide, and the fins there won't be doing that much cooling anyway since they are away from the heat source, so getting rid of a few of them won't hurt and will increase airflow towards the front.


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## Lazzer408 (Oct 31, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> I was wondering about that. Ostensibly they are blocked off because there is very little outflow available at that side, so I thought to block it completely so all the air can go to the front. Then I thought maybe the air on that side of the fan won't go anywhere at all and will just slow the fan down like it's pushing against a wall. Opening it up could actually help the fan overall. What do you think?
> 
> The other thing I was wondering about it the slots underneath the fan - they are not very wide, and the fins there won't be doing that much cooling anyway since they are away from the heat source, so getting rid of a few of them won't hurt and will increase airflow towards the front.



When an axial fan (airflow parallel to it's rotating shaft) is used in this way it will have no choice but to push the air out the sides like a centrifugal fan (airflow perpendicular to shaft). You see Zalman doing this all the time. Don't worry too much about not having fins below the fan. The air IS going to be pushed out the perimeter of the blades. Blocking the rear fins is only restricting the airflow because that's where the air is being pushed to. Depending on what's above your fins back there, the air will have no choice but to make that 90 and head upwards where the fins are open, but this is less efficient. Picture your heatsink filled with water. You want the water to flow out as easy as possible without asking it to change direction. That only makes turbulence. Opening those fins will allow more water to "spill out" from that area. If anything you should block the top of the fins to force all the air through the heatsink.


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## Lazzer408 (Oct 31, 2009)

Here's a small fan from a cheap harddrive cooler. I broke it off just for you.  It's actually a very quiet fan but it shows just how effective an axial fan can be when up against a flat surface. The airflow stays close to the surface (the lighter is against the table) and you can see it's effect. I think you'll be impressed with just how well your heatsink design will work. 






In all honesty it would be just as effective, if not more, to keep things moving in a line.


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## Cuzza (Oct 31, 2009)

Cool bananas. So I've got the basis of a pretty good design in terms of fucntionality. But do you think it is practicable to make?


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## Lazzer408 (Oct 31, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Cool bananas. So I've got the basis of a pretty good design in terms of fucntionality. But do you think it is practicable to make?



It's twice as much machining time if you have to cut channels in 2 directions. If you can keep all your fins running in the same direction it's cheaper to manufacture. In fact, you could buy fin-stock already made and the machine shop would only have to cut the fins off the area for your mounting hardware and then cut the bevel for your keyboard clearance.

EDIT - Maybe you could find something like this and save some shop time. Search for soc771 heatsinks.  Overall Dimension 89.0 x 78.5 x 25.7mm Anything close to what you need? http://cgi.ebay.com/Dynatron-T119-S...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item518d1d27d8


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## Cuzza (Nov 1, 2009)

Next job is to simplify the design. Right now it's at the "ideal but unlikely" stage. I will trim it down around the edges, make it more basic. 

Hey lazzer how much space above the fan do you think is minimum for it to work? I figure I could drop the fan in deeper if necessary, since you seem confident of the radial airflow it will put out

This pic shows the clearance it will have as things are.






I was wondering, maybe the low clearance on that side will make the fan less effective on that side, and if the fins are opened up at the other end (as we had discussed) more air will go that way. What do you think?


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 1, 2009)

Let me go see what that fan in the pic likes. one sec.

Ok the little fan I tried doesn't work well with any less then 1/2" space above it. If you only have 5mm above your fan then it's not going to work. Do you have room to mount the fan off to the side? I'll have to go back and look at your pics. Can you take a nice shot of the area where this cooler will go?

Cuzza. Can you get your hands on an old single slot videocard? The fan's in those are centrifugal and are designed to function even if another card was next to it. Were talking mm here. They suck! It's a good thing.

Like this. Get your hands on this type of fan and your golden.


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## Cuzza (Nov 1, 2009)

I don't have one, but I bet I can find someone willing to part with one.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 1, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> I don't have one, but I bet I can find someone willing to part with one.



There you go. Toss a want add on tpu. I found a fried 3870 I needed some smt components off of to fix mine and it was free. 

Look for a fried x1950 pro or gt. I know the pro was a single slot with a good fan. 4-wire PWM fan! And you can probably use the shrowd too. A little heat to conform it maybe?

Do you have Yahoo? I'm (edit) Kickerfox on it.


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## Cuzza (Nov 1, 2009)

edit: no i don't have yahoo, sorry

PWM is no good, no PWM on my mobo! but that aside, any of those single slot coolers will probably do the job, i'll start looking.

just so you know, here's where the heatsink will go






compare:


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 1, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> http://img.techpowerup.org/091101/hs placement.jpg



Can the fan be moved to the right? That way you can have full fins where the fan is in the picture. Not having PWM isn't an issue. The fan will run at full speed without the PWM signal wire connected. You can just use a resistor to slow it down from there.

Get yahoo. It makes it easy to point at stuff while your watching. lol

EDIT - BTW, use a smaller fan. A slight breeze on more surface area is always better then high cfm on less surface area.


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## Cuzza (Nov 1, 2009)

Fan can only go where it is. You may not be able to see in this picture but the space is very very limited in all directions. I measured it up quite carefully and the heatsink I have designed uses ALL the available space.

Smaller fan? No way. The whole point of this exercise is to use a larger fan, so I can run it slower. The 40mm that's in there at the moment is too darn loud.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 1, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Fan can only go where it is. You may not be able to see in this picture but the space is very very limited in all directions. I measured it up quite carefully and the heatsink I have designed uses ALL the available space.
> 
> Smaller fan? No way. The whole point of this exercise is to use a larger fan, so I can run it slower. The 40mm that's in there at the moment is too darn loud.



What I'm saying is the benefit from more surface area is greater then the loss of cfm from a smaller fan. The small fan doesnt have to spin at 5000rpm and move the same cfm as the larger one. It can spin as slow as the large fan and move less cfm but be more effective because of the surface area gained. Follow?

Put it this way. 20cfm across 10" of surface area is more effective then 40cfm across 5" area.

What's in this area? It would help significantly if you could vent the air out the back of the case. You'll probably heatsoak the inside of the case without any flow in and out. If the cpu fan could blow out that would keep air circulating in the case. I got it. Flip the mobo upside down so it gets fresh air off the bottom. lol


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## Cuzza (Nov 1, 2009)

Yeah I get what you are saying, but with the positioning of the fan dictated as it is, using the smaller one isn't going to give much more surface area anyway. And the new heatsink will have much more surface area than the old one, big fan or small fan. so may as well go with the bigger fan. 

compare:






I figure by reverting to 40mm fan I'd gain about 20% in the area of fins, and the blue area is short fins anyway, so I'd say 10-15% more surface area with smaller fan. I'd rather have the (substantially) greater airflow of the larger fan.


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## Cuzza (Nov 1, 2009)

Lazzer408 said:


> What's in this area? It would help significantly if you could vent the air out the back of the case. You'll probably heatsoak the inside of the case without any flow in and out. If the cpu fan could blow out that would keep air circulating in the case. I got it. Flip the mobo upside down so it gets fresh air off the bottom. lol



as things are there is very little airflow in or out, it certainly gets pretty hot in the case, i've run it all day and it doesn't overheat, but it's a bit worrying nonetheless 

here's a close up. sorry its blurry, my camera battery just died so couldn't try again






you can see a few air holes in there. I don't think it's possible to vent out there but  I guess it would be possible to cut a bigger gap there and make a duct to bring air in to the centrifugal fan (which I don't have yet so can't plan anything for). the centrifugal fan can mount much lower in the heatsink allowing space above it for the duct.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 1, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> as things are there is very little airflow in or out, it certainly gets pretty hot in the case, i've run it all day and it doesn't overheat, but it's a bit worrying nonetheless
> 
> here's a close up. sorry its blurry, my camera battery just died so couldn't try again
> 
> ...



I'm bent on having a duct in mine. I know it helps alot. It works much better that way since the cpu fan isn't bringing in hot air from inside the case. And what do you mean not much more surface area? That fan is like 1/3 the size. lol. I guess if you count "total" surface area. I'm kinda feeling out the "effective" area just above the CPU. I think the centrifugal fan and air duct is going to make a huge difference though. For the life of me I cant find this old 6800 I had kicking around. I'd mail it out to you if you can't locate a fan. 

BTW I'm a fan of retro anything and I love the project.  I have an old 70s Yamaha CS50 analog synth I thought about putting in a PC, touchscreen, and Reason 4.0


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## Cuzza (Nov 2, 2009)

Thanks man. And thanks for all your help. I thought I had finished this project, but it looks like I'm going to be tinkering with it for a while yet!


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## dr emulator (madmax) (Nov 2, 2009)

dam shame your not in my country as sir_real gave me an old ati fan very similar to the one in that pic
never mind ya projects coming along well


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## Cuzza (Nov 3, 2009)

dr emulator (madmax) said:


> dam shame your not in my country as sir_real gave me an old ati fan very similar to the one in that pic
> never mind ya projects coming along well



Looks like I've found someone locally (in NZ that is) who's sending me one for free. It's off a 4850 reference cooler.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 3, 2009)

Can use the 4850 cooler -and- heatsink? If you could cram the whole thing in there shroud and all I bet work great. I can send you this one too if you need it.


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## Cuzza (Nov 3, 2009)

too big. thanks anyway


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## pantherx12 (Nov 3, 2009)

D: I threw away a heatpipe cooler from a laptop that would of been handy for this.

Might see if I can salvage some more laptops and if I find any more decent ones I'll let you know!


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 3, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> too big. thanks anyway



 It's smaller then a 4850 fan.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 4, 2009)

Lazzer408 said:


> It's smaller then a 4850 fan.



Nevermind I burned it up.


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## Cuzza (Nov 4, 2009)

Lazzer408 said:


> It's smaller then a 4850 fan.



Well, the casing is too big. The chap who's sending me a 4850 fan said it was 60mm across, which is the most I can deal with. Unless I got my inches-mm conversion wrong...

EDIT: He's sending me the fan only, no casing, no heatsink.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 4, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Well, the casing is too big. The chap who's sending me a 4850 fan said it was 60mm across, which is the most I can deal with. Unless I got my inches-mm conversion wrong...
> 
> EDIT: He's sending me the fan only, no casing, no heatsink.



Cool. Those little fans blow like crazy for their size. Hope it works out for you.


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## Cuzza (Nov 4, 2009)

When it gets here I'll be back on sketchup seeing how to make it fit.

Until then, here's what I've done. Made up a model showing the case and clearances involved around the back of the heatsink. There are other parts not shown in the model (yet) which dictate the heatsink can't be made any bigger. 

You can see at the back of the case where I am considering putting an air duct. I could cut the duct upwards, make it taller, but I don't want to do that because that would mean cutting two separate sections of the case, and would make it rather obvious detracting more from originality which I don't want to do. Second pic shows the opening of the duct at the rear (it won't be blue when/if I make one. I realised that if the air is coming in (or maybe out) a duct at the back then I can extend the heatsink upwards into the few mm of free space. You'll see this extension marked.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 4, 2009)

Do you have room back there to pull this off? Have the duct open on top as well. I figured if you ever go through the trouble then any little bit helps.

EDIT - or better yet. (image updated)

Are you putting holes in the top of the case for the air intake? If not you can't add your "extension" on top because you need the sides open for air inlet.


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## Cuzza (Nov 4, 2009)

No holes in top. And I want to leave a gap in that top corner to route cables.

:facepalm: ! I had forgotten to leave space for the keyboard! duh... updated pic...






So the plan is to embed the fan within the heatsink. It will draw air from above and below and exhaust out the rear.


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## Cuzza (Nov 7, 2009)

here's the fan I scored:


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## Cuzza (Nov 10, 2009)

Turns out the fan is just not as narrow as I had hoped. Embedding it in the heatsink will just be too tricky. But by mangling the case a bit more I can put it on top, and those cables will just have to go somewhere else. Here's the latest design showing the fan ducting and airflow:





The fan cannot intake from across all the fins so I figured cut some holes to allow some of the air to flow back down along them. Warm air better than no air.


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## Cuzza (Nov 11, 2009)

Today I made up a cardboard model (thanks old cereal box) of the heatsink, just to check for size/fit.


















It seems that somehow my measurements have actually proved correct; it fits!!


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 11, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> it fits!!



Sweet.  Cuzza, what diameter fan do you need?


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## Cuzza (Nov 11, 2009)

The fan I already have will be fine, thnx!


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## Cuzza (Nov 14, 2009)

I had another idea to save space: pull apart the USB wifi dongle. The thing doesn't get very good signal inside the case so question: Is it worth extending the aerial on it?






Is this the antenna? Can I attach a long wire to that to get a better signal?


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## m4gicfour (Nov 14, 2009)

I seem to remember a post (somewhere on the internets) where some guy took apart one of those after-market range boosting router antennas, and all that was inside it was a coil of wire. He tested soldering a coil of wire (wrapped some insulated wire around a screw, left a section straight on each end) onto his old antenna and it worked just as well as the store-bought rangebooster antenna.... forgive my MS-paint skills.





I'll see if I can find that article I was talking about. For now this'll have to do.

Edit
It was an instructable! here: Linky

Hope that helped. I'm pretty sure (guessing, that is) that the PCB trace you pointed out IS the antenna there on that dongle (anyone who knows what they're talking about care to chime in?).   You should be able to (Carefully) scrape the sealant off of the top of part of that trace to expose the bare copper, and (again, CAREFULLY) solder right onto it.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 14, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> I had another idea to save space: pull apart the USB wifi dongle. The thing doesn't get very good signal inside the case so question: Is it worth extending the aerial on it?
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/091113/SV402976.jpg
> 
> Is this the antenna? Can I attach a long wire to that to get a better signal?



Yes it is but you can't just attach a longer wire to get a stronger signal. The antenna has to be a proper length to avoid standing waves aka. SWR. If you follow that trace back you'll see a loop to ground. You need to cut that loop and use those two point to connect a coax cable. The loop will then need to be placed on the other end of the coax as well as the antenna segment. Need a drawing? I'm going to sleep now but I can doodle it up tomorrow if you didn't follow.

One of these would work well.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Pair-Laptop-Wir...emQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item518def1ec4
They are antennas from laptops and found in the LCD panel. Cut off the tiny connector and solder it to the usb adaptor and you can locate the antenna inside the computer away from noise sources. I need to see a close-up of the usb adaptor to suggest what to cut/remove.

Get me a close-up of this area.


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## Cuzza (Nov 15, 2009)

Lazzer408 said:


> Get me a close-up of this area.



Yes sir.

You did lose me there, somewhere....


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## driver66 (Nov 15, 2009)

Cuzza. I must say this is an EPIC mod


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## Cuzza (Nov 16, 2009)

Whoa, just randomly stumbled upon this...

http://www.techeblog.com/index.php/...personal-computer-transformed-into-windows-pc

I've been blogged!


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## MKmods (Nov 16, 2009)

ur famous do we need to refer to you as "ur Majesty" now?


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## Cuzza (Nov 16, 2009)

On your knees, peasant!


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 17, 2009)

That gets the internal antenna out of the way.


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## Cuzza (Nov 17, 2009)

Cheers Lazzer, i'll give it a go


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 17, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Cheers Lazzer, i'll give it a go



No problem. The link M4gic posted... http://www.instructables.com/id/WIFI-Antenna-Hack!/ ...should work fine.


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## Cuzza (Nov 17, 2009)

Lots of little things on the go at once... Today I have cut a hole in the bottom of the case to mount an exhaust fan. It's the only place I had left to put a fan. Lazzer, I did some tests to see how effective it would be as an intake, and looks like you were right, it needs more clearance underneath. But as exhaust it's ok (running it at low speed btw)












Looks a bit rough underneath, but I will tidy that up some time. I'll sort out the wiring first.


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## Cuzza (Nov 17, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> Cheers Lazzer, i'll give it a go



On second thought, I can't solder that! It's too small! It's beyond my skill, equipment and quite frankly, eyesight.


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## Lazzer408 (Nov 17, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> On second thought, I can't solder that! It's too small! It's beyond my skill, equipment and quite frankly, eyesight.



you cahn doo eet!

Can you grind your tip smaller?


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## Cuzza (Nov 18, 2009)

I don't think that's a good idea. I'm going to give up on this antenna extension for now.

In other news, here's the proof that the fan is working:






Unfortunately, it seems to be taking most of its air straight in from the nearby slots:






I'll have to cover those up somehow.

But overall it's looking pretty good. I've moved a few things around, unsheathed the wifi dongle, glued the keyboard cable along the side of the case, taped up the mobo power cables, got rid of the unused molex connector, removed all that unsightly white insulation tape and shifted the power connector block to make room for the fan. Everything it fitting quite snugly now.


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## pantherx12 (Nov 18, 2009)

You could always use some little rubber stick on feet to get some extra clearance if having the fan as intake would work better.

( Simple mods are fine too  )


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## Cuzza (Nov 23, 2009)

OH yah that's always an option, but I don't want to raise it because that would make the keyboard harder to use. As standard it is just low enough that I can reach all the keys with base of palms resting on desk, and I'm a lazy typist.


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## Yukikaze (Nov 23, 2009)

I've said it before and I'll say it again. You, good sir, are a genius 

If only my mITX builds were half as cool I'd be happy !


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## MilkyWay (Dec 10, 2009)

you done anything to it recently or is this it finished forever?

i liked that idea of replacing the heatsink but it seems like a pipe dream


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## Cuzza (Dec 10, 2009)

It's definitely not finished forever, just on the backburner. I will get back to the heatsink next year hopefully.


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## MilkyWay (Dec 14, 2009)

Cuzza said:


> It's definitely not finished forever, just on the backburner. I will get back to the heatsink next year hopefully.



what amazes me is how you got the keyboard to work as a normal keyboard for windows ect

its a good idea to put it to one side and tweak it later on


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## Cuzza (Sep 3, 2010)

Hey dudes, not much progress lately just thought you might like to see this shot of my sister playing Wolf3D on the sega! 






Sadly, it has been sitting in a box lately. Now that I have it in the same room as the router I can actually get internet through the wireless and maybe I will use this thing for some casual internetting. The poor little VIA C7 really struggles with youtube though, which is rather disappointing.


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## Lazzer408 (Sep 4, 2010)

Cuzza said:


> Hey dudes, not much progress lately just thought you might like to see this shot of my sister playing Wolf3D on the sega!
> 
> http://imagehost.losias.net/images/sv403457.jpg
> 
> Sadly, it has been sitting in a box lately. Now that I have it in the same room as the router I can actually get internet through the wireless and maybe I will use this thing for some casual internetting. The poor little VIA C7 really struggles with youtube though, which is rather disappointing.



Cram a quad core and a 5870 in it.


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## brandonwh64 (Sep 4, 2010)

Lazzer408 said:


> Cram a quad core and a 5870 in it.



LOL that would be tits if he could find a quad core laptop with a nice onboard videocard and a busted screen that you could take the motherboard out and mod in the sega!


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## Lazzer408 (Sep 5, 2010)

brandonwh64 said:


> LOL that would be tits if he could find a quad core laptop with a nice onboard videocard and a busted screen that you could take the motherboard out and mod in the sega!



They make ITX boards that'll run quads with no problem at all. Grab a flex pci-e cable and stick a gfx card any angle you want. It's the powersupply that becomes the issue. ASK ME HOW I KNOW?! Right Cuzza? haha


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