# Windows 10 can we talk?



## trickson (Jan 23, 2018)

I just wanna talk about the looks of windows 10. 

So I really like all the new features and start menu I mean it all runs fast and sweet and has tons of new apps and goodies just one thing struck me as odd. 
It looks like a five year old kid designed all the icons and menu displays in windows.
The posted screen shots say it all. No flare NO artistic quality at all, Nothing like the previous few OS's, Like they reverted to original windows. Windows 95 looked fancier. 
So my question is why? Did they really think about this? It's like the quality of the OS is far better than ever yet the looks are far worse than ever. 
Is it just me or did they sacrifice visual and aesthetically pleasing for speed and functionality? it's almost like they just couldn't combine the 2 yet. 
Maybe it's just me but I think it could look a bit more aesthetically pleasing.  
What do you think? After all the years of improvements why this?


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## natr0n (Jan 23, 2018)

I think it makes it more user friendly to people who are new to computers.

Although to us it's like wtf is this mess.


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## Papahyooie (Jan 23, 2018)

They were going for a smooth, clean, modern look. Kind of like what Apple does.. Neutral colors, minimalist design, low frills...

...They failed miserably....


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## trickson (Jan 23, 2018)

Papahyooie said:


> They were going for a smooth, clean, modern look. Kind of like what Apple does.. Neutral colors, minimalist design, low frills...
> 
> ...They failed miserably....


lol!


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## silentbogo (Jan 23, 2018)

trickson said:


> What do you think? After all the years of improvements why this?


It's a modern fad. Just look at Nougat icons comparing to JB as an example, or the new iOS interface comparing to older iOS6, and you'll notice lots of similarities (everything is as flat as ballerina's boobs).


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## jboydgolfer (Jan 23, 2018)

_  you have to keep in mind that windows 10 was designed for all devices afaik ,Xbox as well as phones & tablets and desktops. so you kind of get a little bit of that "touchscreen" clutter flavor when you may not want to. There is customizations and modifications that you can get to alter the taskbar. my windows 10 looks more like Windows 7 than anything else tbh _


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 23, 2018)

Papahyooie said:


> They were going for a smooth, clean, modern look...minimalist design, low frills...
> ...They failed miserably....


No, they didn't fail all. They were going for exactly what you described, and they accomplished just that.

The minimalist design with low frills is really the important part.

More and more people are moving to smaller screens and hand held devices. A minimalist design fits those screens better.
And more and more of those devices rely on cell based networking so low frills to minimize data usage was also a requirement for better wireless speeds and lower data usage/costs.
And because it just makes good business sense to have a uniform and familiar user interface across all platforms, and to make it easier (less expensive) to port apps from one platform to the other, going with a minimalist, low frills approach is just the better option.
Note that "modern" is just a marketing term. And in reality, aesthetics (one way or another) does not improve or degrade performance. So while I too miss the more visually pleasing aesthetics of Windows 7 and Office 2007 and other apps of that era, I do understand and appreciate the reasoning for the looks of the current offerings.

And actually, it does not take long to get totally used to the new looks either.

Edit add: jboydgolfer just beat me to it, so consider my post just an affirmation of what he said.


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## Papahyooie (Jan 23, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> No, they didn't fail all. They were going for exactly what you described, and they accomplished just that.
> 
> The minimalist design with low frills is really the important part.
> 
> ...



That's all well and good, and I understand all the reasoning. But that doesn't mean it doesn't look like crap... in the eye of the beholder, of course.


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## er557 (Jan 23, 2018)

I just posted the solution to visuals in windows 10, two threads below

https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...709-without-modifying-any-system-file.240836/


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## trickson (Jan 23, 2018)

er557 said:


> I just posted the solution to visuals in windows 10, two threads below
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...709-without-modifying-any-system-file.240836/


Yes there are ways to change the back ground and customize the look some but no way to change the windows settings menu at all. it is what it is and well that is unacceptable on any device!
See that screen below?
YOU CAN NOT CHANGE THE LOOKS ! It looks like (Pardon me for this) Crap!

Oh and WOW excellent conversation love the amazing articulate comments. 
Thank you so much keep them going.


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## er557 (Jan 23, 2018)

Actually in next windows release, rs4, fluent design is going more strong all around the modern apps and settings, i.e. the transparency and the super new design language. Also, in settings and any modern app I am getting the title bar look exactly as I want, aero like windows 7 and any  theme is compatible, so even in modern settings, the caption buttons and title bar theming is supported by modern frame dll which is included in the distributive I linked to.


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## DRDNA (Jan 23, 2018)

Yeah they needed to get a unified look across their platforms of mobile, semi mobile, and desktop choices; I think they did a decent job as of now but when 8 first hit it was pretty messy. Things are heading in the right direction now.


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## er557 (Jan 23, 2018)

Cant live in windows 10 without classic shell, oldnewexplorer, 3rd party themes, aero glass, windows update mini tool, winaero tweaker, classic calculator, classic msconfig, win 7 classic games for win 10, desktop gadgets, and more.


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## Jetster (Jan 23, 2018)

I tought the same thing when I first switch. But just like any OS change you get use to it. The point is it works


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## trickson (Jan 23, 2018)

Jetster said:


> I tought the same thing when I first switch. But just like any OS change you get use to it. The point is it works


Just not the point of the thread, But yes it works.
Also WE shouldn't have to get used to it they should listen to the customers. Not sure they are.


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## DRDNA (Jan 23, 2018)

Jetster said:


> I tought the same thing when I first switch. But just like any OS change you get use to it. The point is it works


Right, plus supporting Windows 10 is just the same ole same ole.....I think for me it is a bit more stable than 7 but that's opinion and opinions can be flawed.


trickson said:


> YOU CAN NOT CHANGE THE LOOKS ! It looks like (Pardon me for this) Crap!


EDIT...And yes I loath the Windows Settings front page and for that matter the sub pages too, but I'm use to it now.


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## MyTechAddiction (Jan 23, 2018)

Well its better with W10 compared to 8.
I never really understood why didn`t Microsoft bought Stardock and incorporated their Windows Blinds software into windows so that we can have proper themeing.
Other misteries are why do you have to stare at hard colors in desktop.Makes sense to mobile with all those tiny and mostly crappy screens.Flat design is just another word for dull,boring,uninspired.
Its interesting how the control pannel doesn`t have all the controls.


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## Frick (Jan 23, 2018)

Without having read all the posts I don't really see the issue. It's not like Windows 7 was much clearer, just different.


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## EarthDog (Jan 23, 2018)

LOL, you have been gone for three years if you are just now bringing this up!! Welcome back!

As to configuring the look, there are apps which do so.


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## Vya Domus (Jan 23, 2018)

To be perfectly honest Windows 10 looks better than any previous version by far. I cannot stand skeuomorphism , give me flat icons and UI elements with a little bit of transparency here and there and it's perfect for me.


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## er557 (Jan 23, 2018)

I liked xp and vista ui a lot better


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## Sasqui (Jan 23, 2018)

trickson said:


> It looks like a five year old kid designed all the icons and menu displays in windows.



I worked in UX (user experience design and product design) for 11 years, and know that it's akin to a sausage factory.  The new trend is to hire kids out of school who have "design degrees" to make this stuff.  There are so many flaws in things MS did with Win 10, I can't even begin.

The big thing they were trying to accomplish was mimic the simplicity of a smartphone, since that was their main target market (actually it was both).  Hence the "clean minimalist" look.  But in doing so, they lost sight of the DNA of windows.... Want to use the scroll bar now?  First, try to find it... then try to click on it and use it.  It takes work, and it's not supposed to.

Anyway, I could go on, but I won't.  I feel your pain.


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 23, 2018)

Papahyooie said:


> .. in the eye of the beholder, of course.


That's the kicker. And of course, once you start your program, that's on those developers, not Microsoft (unless Word, Excel or something).


er557 said:


> Cant live in windows 10 without classic shell,


Just remember, the developer of Classic Shell has decided to cease development. See: http://www.classicshell.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=8147

You might want to consider what I use, Start10.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 23, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> No, they didn't fail all. They were going for exactly what you described, and they accomplished just that.
> 
> The minimalist design with low frills is really the important part.
> 
> ...



Have to agree completely with this. I really do fancy the W10 GUI right now. Start Menu is better than ever... and power user stuff is just hidden a bit better but still there. Really, this is what Windows should look like: neutral! You can do with it whatever you please, you can just find a nice color to go with your favorite backgrounds and done. Its also a whole lot better at scaling.

Now that whole metro UI Tiles thingy, that I don't like at all. Its like watching a billboard. Horrible.

I mean look, this, in my mind, is just glorious in terms of a Start Menu.


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## trickson (Jan 23, 2018)

Vayra86 said:


> Have to agree completely with this. I really do fancy the W10 GUI right now. Start Menu is better than ever... and power user stuff is just hidden a bit better but still there. Really, this is what Windows should look like: neutral! You can do with it whatever you please, you can just find a nice color to go with your favorite backgrounds and done. Its also a whole lot better at scaling.
> 
> Now that whole metro UI Tiles thingy, that I don't like at all. Its like watching a billboard. Horrible.
> 
> I mean look, this, in my mind, is just glorious in terms of a Start Menu.View attachment 96294


Till you see this.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 23, 2018)

I dont, I hit Start, and do this, hit enter...


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## trickson (Jan 23, 2018)

Vayra86 said:


> I dont, I hit Start, and do this, hit enter...
> 
> View attachment 96296


LOL. I just think they really need to start living things up there so stale and sterile it's like a child did it. no imagination. No artistic value at all just mind numbinglly plain. Get used to it Idiocracy lives.


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (Jan 23, 2018)

trickson said:


> I just wanna talk about the looks of windows 10.
> 
> So I really like all the new features and start menu I mean it all runs fast and sweet and has tons of new apps and goodies just one thing struck me as odd.
> It looks like a five year old kid designed all the icons and menu displays in windows.
> ...


they had to take it away to give it you back in a bit, the visual cleanliness is'nt that bad though just dull.


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## Aquinus (Jan 23, 2018)

Ehhhh. I got kind of turned off after automatic updates did a major update and screwed up my machine twice. The first time it didn't estimate properly how much disk space the upgrade would take and it reverted the upgrade while leaving my SSD array full of crap because it ran out of space mid-upgrade. It was also in a funky state. The second time, it worked but, it screwed up so many drivers that it eventually just got to the point where is BSOD'ed every time on boot, even in safe mode. The second time made it so I couldn't actually use my computer for work on a day I wanted to work from home which was the last nail in the coffin. I honestly like Windows 10. As an OS, it works very well and I was pleased with it but, I simply won't tolerate using an OS that decides to do things that can render it inoperable without any user interaction... and even if I don't use it, I'm constantly fixing audio drivers on my wife's laptop because of updates and this isn't a problem I have with Ubuntu.

tl;dr: Windows 10 is great if you block Windows Update with the Windows firewall to prevent it from auto updating and disabling the rule when you want to update but, I shouldn't have to do that, so I use Ubuntu.


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## er557 (Jan 24, 2018)

No need to fuss- use windows update mini tool to disable auto updates. also use it to check for updates manually and decide for yourself what to install.


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## neatfeatguy (Jan 24, 2018)

It's just like the fad of websites - Facebook is widely popular and has a godawful look (to me). Yet so many sites started to try and make themselves look/feel like FB.

I used to visit a handful of gaming sites years back, but they all took on the same awful look and all went with the clickbait articles that I rarely visit them these days. My HTPC has Win 10 on it and I'm not in that computer very much, just streaming movies from it to other devices, so I don't have to use it much, but minor things with Win 10 irritate me. For example, it's no longer called "My Computer"......it's now called "This PC" - seriously? WTF?

First time I installed Win 10 and was looking for My Computer, it boggled my mind that I couldn't find it. My younger brother had used Win 10 for a bit in a couple of college courses and told me it's now "This PC". It may just be a name change, but it irks me to no end. I don't enjoy much of Win 10 for the looks, but damn, that OS is fast to boot, even on a 5400RPM HDD RAID1 build.....as long as Windows isn't trying to update.


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## jboydgolfer (Jan 24, 2018)

neatfeatguy said:


> I used to visit a handful of gaming sites years back, but they all took on the same awful look and all went with the clickbait articles that I rarely visit them these days.



have you visited Youtube in the last day or two? if you dont like changes, your not going to be happy. for months they have been offering a *"new experimental"* version for members to try out (free public R&D) and after trying it for about 5 minutes, i was out of there, and back to the older version.....well, last night when i got home from friendlies, i opened YT, and Boom! that "tech preview" is now the default site(it may have just auto updated for me , i dunno if its the new default, sorry), i was so pissed, it looks and functions lie Dog$h!t.

i know they added a "dark theme" but that was already available thru my browser, and they say its a "faster framework" , but my daughter & I have noticed longer loading times over the old site.

just found this tho  . & it updated on its own, i never chose to retry it, so others may need to revert thru this method if they find themselves in the same situation i was in.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 24, 2018)

trickson said:


> YOU CAN NOT CHANGE THE LOOKS


You can, with aftermarket, such as ClassicShell or my personal favorite, Start10.


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## neatfeatguy (Jan 24, 2018)

jboydgolfer said:


> have you visited Youtube in the last day or two? if you dont like changes, your not going to be happy. for months they have been offering a *"new experimental"* version for members to try out (free public R&D) and after trying it for about 5 minutes, i was out of there, and back to the older version.....well, last night when i got home from friendlies, i opened YT, and Boom! that "tech preview" is now the default site(it may have just auto updated for me , i dunno if its the new default, sorry), i was so pissed, it looks and functions lie Dog$h!t.
> 
> i know they added a "dark theme" but that was already available thru my browser, and they say its a "faster framework" , but my daughter & I have noticed longer loading times over the old site.
> 
> ...



I don't really frequent youtube....in fact, it's been a handful of weeks since I was last on it and the new layout is fugly. I tried to "Restore old YouTube", but the layout is exactly the same as the new one (unless I'm missing some minor thing). To me, I guess it won't bother me since I rarely visit the site, but I can say with fact that I don't like it. Maybe it's different for someone that actually has an account setup with youtube, but I don't so I guess I'll never know.


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## phill (Jan 24, 2018)

This may or may not be the place for this but, is anyone having any issues with when right clicking onto the icons on the taskbar, do they find sometimes they get a menu and sometimes they do not??...


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## EarthDog (Jan 24, 2018)

Works fine for me.


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## phill (Jan 24, 2018)

One of the things that drives me nuts in Windows 10...  So far, Windows 7 gets my vote


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 24, 2018)

Windows 8, 8.1, and 10 have a unified design mentality:
1) make it low power (because tablets and laptops)
2) make it touch friendly
3) improve accessibility features for the visually and hearing impaired

All of the user interface changes serve one, or both, of those purposes.  Windows 8/8.1 made the atrocious mistake of completely taking mice users for granted.  Windows 10 basically merged the Windows 7 mice-centric design with the Windows 8 design that focused on the three elements above.  The result is an operating system that is competent with both.

Examples:
1) Because of the minimalist UI design (especially no animations), the GPU can almost completely shut off when just displaying the static desktop conserving a lot of power.
2) The start menu, the change to settings, and the big buttons and sliders everywhere are to allow enough area for big fingers to touch without touching something accidentally.
3) Most people think Cortana during setup is annoying but, imagine if you were blind.  Cortana can take you through the bulk of the set up by simply using your voice.  Another example is that changing DPI actually works as expected now.

They've hidden the old Control Panel and similar legacy UI because they haven't (or reasonably can't) update it to support touch.  It's still available if you need it but they're trying to move as much as they can to the touch-friendly Settings.


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 24, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Windows 8/8.1 made the atrocious mistake of completely taking mice users for granted.


The atrocious mistake, pushed by the MS marketing department and backed by MS execs, was Microsoft shoving the new (totally inflexible ) "Metro" UI down users throats on the arrogant assumption we would automatically love and accept it. Their scam... err... scheme ...err... plan was for everyone to fall in love with the new UI so when users went shopping for a new smart phone, they would pickup a Windows Phone and immediately be familiar with it, fall in love with it, and buy it instead of an iPhone or Android phone.

I don't think W8 took mouse users for granted. I think it dismissed and ignored mouse users and instead, wanted to push everyone to touchscreens. Why? Because the Windows Phone used touchscreens and Microsoft was failing miserably in the smartphone market.

In reality, W8 was a great OS - if you define an OS as a "secure" program designed to facilitate communications between all the hardware and software. The developers did a great job there and I am convinced they would have also made a great, very flexible and intuitive UI had the marketing weenies and execs (and their bean counters) kept their mitts out of the design process and didn't interfere with the development. 

I am also convinced Microsoft shot itself in the foot, or rather both feet with that atrocious W8 mistake. The PC market was already declining due to more and more users moving to handheld devices for all their computing needs. Microsoft's marketing and executive misguided, bungled direction with W8 just convinced millions and millions more users (and government agencies and big corporations) to stick with W7 and not invest in new hardware technologies, and W8. This mistake just perpetuated and accelerated the decline in PC sales which continues to decline despite the rise in demand for "gaming" PCs. 

How's that from someone often accused of being a Microsoft shill?


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 24, 2018)

Windows 10 is what Windows 8 should have been.  Steve Ballmer got fired for a reason.  It wasn't just Windows 10/8 though, it was abandoning PC gamers in favor of Xbox gamers, failing to make Windows Phone an open platform so it could succeed against Android, pouring so many resources into Windows 8 RT only to squander it on expensive pet products like Surface RT and Windows Phone, and the list goes on and on.  Yeah, Ballmer overall grew the company but it alienated a lot of loyalists along the way.


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## EarthDog (Jan 24, 2018)

One thing trickson hasn't forgotten in three years is to spam the like button.


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## trickson (Jan 24, 2018)

EarthDog said:


> One thing trickson hasn't forgotten in three years is to spam the like button.


Why is it there then? 
I like the LIKE button.


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## EarthDog (Jan 24, 2018)

Just giving you some flak since you have been gone. 

But to answer, thanks/like is useless when its used in damn near every post. Dilutes the meaning quite a bit. I have been asking this place to add a 'like' limit for years as the people here like to beat on that button quite a bit.


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## trickson (Jan 24, 2018)

EarthDog said:


> Just giving you some flak since you have been gone.
> 
> But to answer, thanks/like is useless when its used in damn near every post. Dilutes the meaning quite a bit. I have been asking this place to add a 'like' limit for years as the people here like to beat on that button quite a bit.


LOL I liked you again!! 

To be honest it is unfair to have one without the other. An Un-Like button would get the same if not MORE abuse. So why not just like everyone? Tis the new age of Like minds!


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## Upgrayedd (Jan 24, 2018)

If you want to talk to Win10, talk to Cortana. 
That is a much much bigger disappointment than some flare. Along with forced updates that you cannot turn off. They begged and begged people to voluntarily update their systems to Win10 then once they did they force you out of optional future updates. Can I download that Chinese version?


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 24, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Windows 10 is what Windows 8 should have been.


I agree 100%. Even 8.1 was not enough to fix it. 

FTR, Steve Ballmer was not fired. You don't fire someone then let them stay in the same CEO position for 7 more months. When someone is fired, they are escorted out the door and all access privileges are terminated so they cannot do any damage on their way out.

The board did announce a restructuring at Microsoft and did announce that will include a new CEO "within the next year", but it was by mutual agreement he would "retire". And the board did not offer any incentive for him to stay. So clearly there was not a lot of love lost.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 25, 2018)

CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are never "fired" in a traditional sense.  They're pushed out of the plane with a golden parachute.  That's off topic though.


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## Frick (Jan 25, 2018)

trickson said:


> LOL. I just think they really need to start living things up there so stale and sterile it's like a child did it. no imagination. No artistic value at all just mind numbinglly plain. Get used to it Idiocracy lives.



So what OS does have imaginitive artistic values in its icons?

And "Idiocracy lives" is a term only used by aholes and - strangely enough - idiots.


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## trickson (Jan 25, 2018)

Frick said:


> So what OS does have imaginitive artistic values in its icons?
> 
> And "Idiocracy lives" is a term only used by aholes and - strangely enough - idiots.


I would have to say windows 98 was a nice one then XP it was really nice looking. windows vista was  windows 7 was also really nice I liked the look and feel as well. 
Windows Vista by far had the most visual stimulation IMHO.


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## erocker (Jan 25, 2018)

Try messing around with rainmeter. Lots of desktop customization stuff. https://www.rainmeter.net/


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are never "fired" in a traditional sense. They're pushed out of the plane with a golden parachute.


Never say never. It depends on the reason(s) why. If poor company performance, then traditionally, you are right and they forced to retire early or resign. But even then, they generally don't stick around for months after the board says goodbye.

If fired for other reasons, ethical reasons for example, insider trading (suspect or real) or some other scandal, they are given a couple boxes to pack up their office (with guards watching), then shown the door.

Yes, OT, but it seems the whole thread is off on different directions. 

@alecx121 - you need to start your own new thread.


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## EarthDog (Jan 25, 2018)

alecx121 said:


> When I installed Windows 10, it was my nephew's call to upgrade from Windows 7 to 10. He likes to mess with tech thing. When we did, it was making many problems like hanging, finding a particular option was too difficult and many similar problems. I asked him to install Windows 7 again. Please.


Should have tried a fresh install instead of the upgrade. I bet there will be fewer or no problems. Its the upgrades that can get ya. 



Bill_Bright said:


> Yes, OT, but it seems the whole thread is off on different directions.


Junk thread is junk thread. We have been talking about this for years across multiple threads here already. Trickson just managed to lift the rock off his head and come back to play. 



Bill_Bright said:


> @alecx121 - you need to start your own new thread.


I don't think he was asking for help. I think he was sharing a story as it was declarative throughout.


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## trickson (Jan 25, 2018)

EarthDog said:


> Junk thread is junk thread. We have been talking about this for years across multiple threads here already. Trickson just managed to lift the rock off his head and come back to play. .


I don't think this is a Junk thread, That is YOUR opinion. I am talking about the looks of the new OS nothing more, about how uninspired and dull it is and that to me is not JUNK it is an ISSUE. I would hope they can and are going to fix. Have some pride in your work for the love of god! Or at least make it look like you do. This just looks like NO ONE GAVE A FU##!

@ *EarthDog* You shouldn't go around calling other peoples threads junk, it is rude!


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## EarthDog (Jan 25, 2018)

That is my opinion. And there are half a dozen other threads which have discussed it ad nauseum already is my point. But, hey, when you see the light for the first time in three years, some reshashing is bound to happen!


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## R-T-B (Jan 26, 2018)

trickson said:


> LOL I liked you again!!
> 
> To be honest it is unfair to have one without the other. An Un-Like button would get the same if not MORE abuse. So why not just like everyone? Tis the new age of Like minds!



I liked your post, because I like the idea of an "un-like" button.

Is that messed up or what?


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## jaggerwild (Jan 26, 2018)

I think the OP should take the Windows install CD n smash it into a 1000 bit's, see if you feel betta?


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## trickson (Jan 26, 2018)

jaggerwild said:


> I think the OP should take the Windows install CD n smash it into a 1000 bit's, see if you feel betta?



Are you advocating violence against CD's? LOL
Smashing it would only occurs if it FAILS to work. IT is in NO way nonfunctional I really love the new OS just think it could be far more visually pleasing with some imagination.


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## cornemuse (Jan 26, 2018)

alecx121 said:


> When I installed Windows 10, it was my nephew's call to upgrade from Windows 7 to 10. He likes to mess with tech thing. When we did, it was making many problems like hanging, finding a particular option was too difficult and many similar problems. I asked him to install
> Windows 7 again. Please.



Have a Toshiba laptop with W7 on it. When 10 still had a free upgrade I deciced to give it a try. But with what I had heard, I cloned the hdd (so I wouldnt have to go through re-installing 7 if 10 was not to my liking. Good thing!! I have to say, installing 10 is a downgrade, imho.

-c-

(I now have 2 comps w 10, other one is a refurb Dell from Frys Elec, $49.99 on sale, several comps w 7, several with XPP-64 & 32, this comp here & now, online is XP Pro) (32)


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## Readlight (Jan 26, 2018)

I will only get it when it will cost 5 euro, because who knows when motherboard will die and win8.1 was much faster.


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## EarthDog (Jan 26, 2018)

Readlight said:


> and win8.1 was much faster.


It was??? In what?


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## StrayKAT (Jan 26, 2018)

Not to diminish his concerns, but "speed" hasn't been a prob for me for quite awhile. Modern hardware/software has made improvements so incremental at this point that I can barely tell the difference. I could understand if you're running Win 10 though on 2007-ish hardware.


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## Noyand (Jan 26, 2018)

It's a general trend that goes beyond OS.
old maya :






new maya:





I've found the flat icons easier in the eyes, it just look cleaner to me.


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## StrayKAT (Jan 26, 2018)

Noyand said:


> It's a general trend that goes beyond OS.
> old maya :
> 
> 
> ...



It is nicer looking actually..

But I don't know a damn thing about Maya. Wish I did. I have some artistic skills, but I can't wrap my head around 3d progs.


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## Noyand (Jan 28, 2018)

StrayKAT said:


> It is nicer looking actually..
> 
> But I don't know a damn thing about Maya. Wish I did. I have some artistic skills, but I can't wrap my head around 3d progs.


yhea, 3D prog can be overwhelming, especially if you are trying to make sense of all the tool by yourself. It's really the kind of domain where you need to be guided to get the basics.


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## jboydgolfer (Jan 28, 2018)

trickson said:


> A



I agree with this


erocker said:


> Try messing around with rainmeter. Lots of desktop customization stuff. https://www.rainmeter.net/



Its impressive what changes can. Be made.

*The environment can become entirely unrecognizable*




*each of the designs you see are customizable , and optional, you can go as far or as little as you want away fro mthe standard win10 experience.*


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## theFOoL (Jan 29, 2018)

Yeah when I first looked around Windows 10 and saw that the Windows 7 look was kept in the explorer side of things and not just UI the whole thing I was like wtf? Ha! But I still use it


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 29, 2018)

rk3066 said:


> Yeah when I first looked around Windows 10 and saw that the Windows 7 look was kept in the explorer side of things and not just UI the whole thing I was like wtf?


I think they learned their lesson with W8. Too much radical change too quickly will not be tolerated or accepted - and more importantly, purchased.


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## theFOoL (Jan 30, 2018)

Yeah half-in-half is fine for me just wish there was a option to select what you wanted before a full install


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## R-T-B (Jan 30, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> I think they learned their lesson with W8. Too much radical change too quickly will not be tolerated or accepted - and more importantly, purchased.



It was a counter-lesson to how quickly the market swallowed the win95 change, honestly.  Times have changed.


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 30, 2018)

Counter-lesson? 

Windows 95 was not nearly the radical change from Windows 3.x as W8 was from W7. W95 was seen as familiar and a big, welcomed improvement. W8 was seen as something totally different and awkward being shoved down our throats; a setback, not an improvement.


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## EarthDog (Jan 30, 2018)

W3.x to W95 was a pretty dramatic change... It wasn't really until W8 where there was another drastic GUI change after XP. From XP to W7, people would recognize it easily.


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## theFOoL (Jan 30, 2018)

The thing about W8 is they wanted us to use touchscreen monitors which still today cost a butt load of money


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 30, 2018)

EarthDog said:


> W3.x to W95 was a pretty dramatic change...


Yes, but not near as dramatic going from W7 to W8. 

If you knew W3.x, you could step up to a W95 system and fairly easily find your way around. Stepping up to a W8.x machine for the first time was like a Word user trying to use WordPerfect - Bambi in the headlights.


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 30, 2018)

Its boring to me. Heck I dont like iphones or where Android 7 is going with this.


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## EarthDog (Jan 30, 2018)

Both the change from W3.x to W95 and W7 to W8  were both equally as dramatic. Now, 95 and its changes were good and regarded as such, while on the contrary, W8 wasn't received very well. That said, they are both equally as dramatic and head scratching in their own way. Not one less than the other, my point.


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 30, 2018)

EarthDog said:


> Not one less than the other, my point.


Well, from your viewpoint, anyway. And I respect that. 

But there was still a desktop in W95 and the introduction of the new Start Button/Start Menu instantly took Windows from confusing to very intuitive.

W8 reversed all that, doing away with both the familiar desktop and the Start Button/Start Menu. The missing Start button/menu and desktop was so sorely missed in W8, it sparked a whole new industry spawning popular programs like Start8, Classic Shell, Pokki and others.


I think we can at least agree that W8 was a step backwards, not intuitive, and had a steep learning curve.


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