# Joining WCG and/or Folding



## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

Thanks to @Norton and crew with another super-tabulous giveaway, I was the lucky recipient of the following in memory of Kreij :

*Gift 4(US/CA)- MSI Z97/Pentium G3258 mb/cpu combo donated by @RealNeil includes bequiet! PURE ROCK cooler donated by @jboydgolfer *

When I entered, I said this would be for my 14 yr old (just turned 15) and his condition was to help build, and use the rig for WCG or Folding when he wasn't using it.  I supply the rest of the PC and electricity 

So I'm outfitting it with 8 GB of 2133 DDR3, a PSU, a re purposed 320GB WD Black drive, DVD drive, 650W PSU, and I think I'm going to give (lend?) him my 2nd 290x.

We'll be overclocking the G3258 (Two cores, no HT & unlocked multi).  It'll go in a brand new Rosewill case I have sitting in storage.

QUESTION:  How can I get the most out of this for WCG or Folding.  Can you do both on the same rig, or just stick to one?  Can the 290x be used for compute power too?  I've looked at a few guides already

Side note:  My son will likely join TPU as part of this endeavor   He already thinks pretty highly of this place thanks in part to the giveaways and this rig!  He's very much looking forward to putting it to good use for WCG or Folding.

TIA!


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## jboydgolfer (Jan 12, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> Can the 290x be used for compute power too?



admittedly my knowledge on this subject is VERY limited, so please take it with a grain of salt, but iirc, GPU work isn't viable or available from what i saw in a serprate thread. but please dont take just my response, other more knowledgable members surely will chime in inevitably.

Im glad you and your Son won, Please enjoy it, and thanks to @Norton for ALL of his HARD work, he is certainly already busy as it is.


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## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

jboydgolfer said:


> admittedly my knowledge on this subject is VERY limited, so please take it with a grain of salt, but iirc, GPU work isn't viable or available from what i saw in a serprate thread. but please dont take just my response, other more knowledgable members surely will chime in inevitably.
> 
> Im glad you and your Son won, Please enjoy it, and thanks to @Norton for ALL of his HARD work, he is certainly already busy as it is.



Thanks, as you can probably tell, I'm looking for a little hand-holding.  Getting the WCG software/client install seems pretty easy.  Folding looks a little more complicated.

He's getting the 290x by default, since I really don't play much on my second rig.  If it can be leveraged for WCG or folding, that would icing on the cake.


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## jboydgolfer (Jan 12, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> Thanks, as you can probably tell, I'm looking for a little hand-holding.  Getting the WCG software/client install seems pretty easy.  Folding looks a little more complicated.
> 
> He's getting the 290x by default, since I really don't play much on my second rig.  If it can be leveraged for WCG or folding, that would icing on the cake.


im certain the team will be glad to have you , and your Sons help. Also a great activity to enjoy, while getting to spend time with your Son. Have fun.


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## mstenholm (Jan 12, 2016)

If he is going to crunch/fold on/off I suggest WCG for the CPU. The folding thing is not complicated at all just download the program and fill out name, teamnumber and passkey do 10 units and the get nice bonus. The problem is that folding on/off on one job will ruin the bonus so unless he let it run all the night or as long as a unit takes (290X - my guess 4-10 hours depending of job) don't bother. Fell free to ask.

Most task can be done at the same times as the GPU is folding. Gaming is not most tasks . I have my GPU runing 24/7 on my work PC and there is were few jobs that interfere with Youtube and "other" video activities.


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## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

mstenholm said:


> If he is going to crunch/fold on/off I suggest WCG for the CPU. The folding thing is not complicated at all just download the program and fill out name, teamnumber and passkey do 10 units and the get nice bonus. The problem is that folding on/off on one job will ruin the bonus so unless he let it run all the night or as long as a unit takes (290X - my guess 4-10 hours depending of job) don't bother. Fell free to ask.
> 
> Most task can be done at the same times as the GPU is folding. Gaming is not most tasks . I have my GPU runing 24/7 on my work PC and there is were few jobs that interfere with Youtube and "other" video activities.



That makes the picture clearer.  Things I don't know such as how the WCG jobs are run, can you pause them, can you line up multple jobs, etc.  ?

There are times when the PC will be idle for days or sometimes a week at a time, but when he wants to play or watch YT, the PC definitely needs to stop working on WCG so he can enjoy it ...particularly since the CPU is limited to two threads.


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## jboydgolfer (Jan 12, 2016)

yes it can be paused/canceled @ any time you see fit iirc. i also believe scheduling/lining up work loads as You see fit is an option as well.


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## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

jboydgolfer said:


> yes it can be paused/canceled @ any time you see fit iirc. i also believe scheduling/lining up work loads as You see fit is an option as well.



Sweet...  I guess we just have to jump in feet first with WCG, see where it goes... and move on to Folding in the hopes the 290x will crunch.  

Plan is to start putting the rig together this evening, tabletop build - in a carboard box for portability


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## stinger608 (Jan 12, 2016)

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet; Folding with the 290x would require one of the cores to be freed up from Crunching. So the G3258 would be crunching with a single core and the other core used for Folding. 

The 290x should, if I remember correctly, give some pretty impressive numbers Folding.


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## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

stinger608 said:


> One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet; Folding with the 290x would require one of the cores to be freed up from Crunching. So the G3258 would be crunching with a single core and the other core used for Folding.
> 
> The 290x should, if I remember correctly, give some pretty impressive numbers Folding.



Was wondering about the CPU with only 2 threads.  The 290x was the most popular card for mining, I suspected it'd be good for folding.  To bad WCG isn't written to take advantage of it!


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## stinger608 (Jan 12, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> Was wondering about the CPU with only 2 threads.  The 290x was the most popular card for mining, I suspected it'd be good for folding.  To bad WCG isn't written to take advantage of it!




I agree. A couple of years ago there were some work units that took advantage of GPU computing power. Man we were all banging out some serious numbers during that time. 

Being an overclocked G3258 I would still fire it up with one core Crunching. Heck, it will still put out work units.


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## manofthem (Jan 12, 2016)

Awesome @Sasqui that your considering joining in! 

BOINC is the crunching program, and it is very simple to pause and resume work units. I'd definitely suggest trying that out and getting used to it.

Folding is awesome too and the 290x would do well if it runs straight. At times before, I would pause folding units and then resume but it really kills production and points, as @mstenholm said. Folding is something I would do if you know there is time to let it run without interruption

WCG units do not punish/bonus based on time, but there is a deadline for the units; it's usually generous and typically you wouldn't have an issue meeting it unless you pause and never resume.


Last thing: when you sign up for WCG, ensure that the team link is used. *This* should be it


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## Norton (Jan 12, 2016)

Awesome that you're interested in crunching and/or folding for our TPU Teams @Sasqui !!! 

Team members have already given so some pretty solid input but I'll toss in a couple of things 

First here's some basic info on joining up and getting started (borrowed from one of our challenge threads):
*
For crunching....
Follow this link to register and join our Team:*
http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/reg/viewRegister.do?teamID=S8TLJ6TFV1
Once you're registered you can follow the prompts and install software- it's all pretty straight forward
If you have any questions you can post them in this thread, our Team thread, or PM an existing Team member.
*Our Team thread:*
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/tpus-wcg-boinc-team.85784/
*For folding....
See this thread to get started:*
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/easy-setup-for-folding-home.200520/
If you have any questions you can post them in this thread, the folding Team thread, or PM an existing Team member.
*Folding Team thread:*
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/tpus-f-h-team.13038/

To respond to some of your questions and/or provide some general comments:

- follow the crunching link and the software download/setup should provide you with a minimal impact profile so the PC will be mostly unaffected by user activity.

When folding....
- your gpu will likely heat up the room it's in, which is great for those chilly nights! 
- I recommend only folding when you have the time to allow the PC to finish the entire job- you are rewarded for finishing a job quickly.

That's all I have time for now... another crazy work day 

Welcome Aboard!!!


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## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

manofthem said:


> Awesome @Sasqui that your considering joining in!
> 
> BOINC is the crunching program, and it is very simple to pause and resume work units. I'd definitely suggest trying that out and getting used to it.
> 
> ...



Not just considering... honored and dragging my 15 yr old in as well, he's excited! 

I read about the BIONIC install on one of the WCG forum sticky's and it looked quite simple.  Yep, sounding more and more like we just need to install and start crunching.  The PC will be up and running by the end of this week if things work out.  My son has mid-terms this week so he's been spending time studying.  I want to tell him how it all goes together and let him do it himself.  Depending on how that goes, I may put my Xeon rig X5470 @ 4Ghz to use for WCG...  I'm assuming the 4 cores in the Xeon would do better than the G3258


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## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

Norton said:


> Awesome that you're interested in crunching and/or folding for our TPU Teams @Sasqui !!!
> 
> Team members have already given so some pretty solid input but I'll toss in a couple of things
> 
> ...




Awesome, thanks for startup guide @Norton !  We'll start with WCG and move onto folding after we've got that nailed.


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## stinger608 (Jan 12, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> I'm assuming the 4 cores in the Xeon would do better than the G3258



Oh yea, absolutely man! The Xeon's crunch very awesome. And I am assuming that the Xeon has Hyperthreading so in reality it will crunch 8 units at a time.


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## Sasqui (Jan 12, 2016)

stinger608 said:


> Oh yea, absolutely man! The Xeon's crunch very awesome. And I am assuming that the Xeon has Hyperthreading so in reality it will crunch 8 units at a time.



http://ark.intel.com/products/35430/Intel-Xeon-Processor-X5470-12M-Cache-3_33-GHz-1333-MHz-FSB

No HT :/  - is there a bench in BIONIC (or another benchmark) that would tell which does better?  4 cores/threads @ 4Ghz on the X5470 vs. 2 cores/threads (@4.5Ghz?) on the G3258.


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## stinger608 (Jan 13, 2016)

Hmm, @Sasqui , I'm not sure if there is a bench showing something like that. I think there is a cpu comparison chart but not sure what the URL is. But I'm quite sure that a Xeon quad would well out perform a dual core Pentium.


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## xvi (Jan 13, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> is there a bench in BIONIC (or another benchmark) that would tell which does better? 4 cores/threads @ 4Ghz on the X5470 vs. 2 cores/threads (@4.5Ghz?) on the G3258.





stinger608 said:


> But I'm quite sure that a Xeon quad would well out perform a dual core Pentium.


I agree. The X5470 should have no trouble beating the G3258.


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## stinger608 (Jan 13, 2016)

Yep, probably over double the output........I would think anyhow.


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## [Ion] (Jan 13, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> http://ark.intel.com/products/35430/Intel-Xeon-Processor-X5470-12M-Cache-3_33-GHz-1333-MHz-FSB
> 
> No HT :/  - is there a bench in BIONIC (or another benchmark) that would tell which does better?  4 cores/threads @ 4Ghz on the X5470 vs. 2 cores/threads (@4.5Ghz?) on the G3258.


I'm honestly not sure.  Penryn -> Nehalem -> Westmere -> Sandy Bridge -> Ivy Bridge -> Haswell is a LOT of generations separating them.  I don't think the gap would be as big as you think, and the Xeon would use a LOT more power to do so.


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## xvi (Jan 13, 2016)

stinger608 said:


> Yep, probably over double the output........I would think anyhow.


Eeeaaah.. The 5400 series is a little dated (basically a Core 2 Quad/Extreme), so while it will certainly be faster, I don't think it'll blow it out of the water.

Edit: Not the cleanest data, but a good place to start none the less. Check out userbenchmark to see these two duke it out real-world.


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## Sasqui (Jan 13, 2016)

xvi said:


> Eeeaaah.. The 5400 series is a little dated (basically a Core 2 Quad/Extreme), so while it will certainly be faster, I don't think it'll blow it out of the water.
> 
> Edit: Not the cleanest data, but a good place to start none the less. Check out userbenchmark to see these two duke it out real-world.



Very dated!  I did the 771 -> 775 mod on an ASUS MB, worked great.  I'm guessing the two extra cores tops it over the G3258.

Is it possible to run the same two jobs with BIONIC and compare speed?  I could always test using Cinebench too.


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## AlienIsGOD (Jan 13, 2016)

Where's the link to the configuration program  so he can  report results immediately   the edit is a godsend if u want consistent points as it uploads results as soon as they are done.   Wish I had bookmarked the thread cause I can't find it for the life of me 

Edit : it stickied,  grab it it's a must have


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## Sasqui (Jan 13, 2016)

AlienIsGOD said:


> Where's the link to the configuration program  so he can  report results immediately   the edit is a godsend if u want consistent points as it uploads results as soon as they are done.   Wish I had bookmarked the thread cause I can't find it for the life of me
> 
> Edit : it stickied,  grab it it's a must have



Awesome, found it:  http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/simple-wcg-ppd-estimator.111026/

I'm on a delay due to my son having mid-terms this week.  He was up till 10:30 and then up at 4:00AM writing an overdue report and studying.  Procrastination!


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## xvi (Jan 13, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> I did the 771 -> 775 mod on an ASUS MB, worked great.


Did the same myself, but didn't have much time to play around with it. I really should dust it off one of these days.


Sasqui said:


> I could always test using Cinebench too.


I tried looking for Cinebench scores too. I can't remember where, but I think I saw some benchmarks that showed the X5470 about 25% faster in multi-threaded benchmarks. I'd have to dig to find sources (later).
Considering the difference in power, I'd say the G3258 would be better to run over the X5470. I've _basically_ retired my dual E5450 server due to power. Does about 350 watts running BOINC and it's good for, uh, 6k-ish?


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## Sasqui (Jan 13, 2016)

xvi said:


> Considering the difference in power, I'd say the G3258 would be better to run over the X5470. I've _basically_ retired my dual E5450 server due to power. Does about 350 watts running BOINC and it's good for, uh, 6k-ish?



That was exactly what I was thinking as well, I'll be breaking out the kill-a-watt after the G3258 is up and running.  The X5470 is no slouch, It's been my second PC going on a year now, quite zippy and reliable.  Thanks to @rtwjunkie , I got an ASUS P5Q for really, really cheap!  And the chip was less than $70 off eBay, & already had 8 GB of DDR2.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 13, 2016)

@Sasqui I'm glad to hear it's getting used!! Great boards deserve to die on the job instead of in a dusty closet somewhere.


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## Sasqui (Jan 13, 2016)

rtwjunkie said:


> @Sasqui I'm glad to hear it's getting used!! Great boards deserve to die on the job instead of in a dusty closet somewhere.



It is quite used!  After my Ivy Bridge rig got a crypto virus, it became my main rig.  I haven't forgotten your generosity, and if the rig does die, it'll die with it's boots on!


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 13, 2016)

There is a benchmark that the client runs.  Once you install the client, switch to Advanced view and then under Advanced, Run CPU Benchmarks.  The results will be displayed in the Event log.  You can use that for comparisons.


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## agent00skid (Jan 13, 2016)

My G3258 at 4,4GHz under Linux with everything but CEP2 running 24/7 seems to be giving about 2500PPD.

I have a power meter that I could throw on it, but it doesn't work with the current setup, so haven't checked it so far.


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## Sasqui (Jan 27, 2016)

agent00skid said:


> My G3258 at 4,4GHz under Linux with everything but CEP2 running 24/7 seems to be giving about 2500PPD.
> 
> I have a power meter that I could throw on it, but it doesn't work with the current setup, so haven't checked it so far.



TL : DR
System was drawing 31w idle and 69w (120v plug load with kill-a-watt) with the Intel iGPU graphics running Prime95 on both cores at 4.5Ghz.  It's rock stable with dynamic core and voltage, Vcore tops at 1.29v and temps are 64c max.

In idle, it draws that 30'ish watt draw, clocks are at 900Mhz and 0.90v (or so).  That's what I was aiming for.

If I bump it up to 4.6, Prime95 dies.  This is ONLY bumping up the multi in BIOS, all the voltages are "Auto" stock.  I'm sure this chip would do 4.8 or more, but I'd loose the dynamic voltage and coreX.  It's a trade off.

The good stuff... 

Put in a case with 8GB 2133 CAS9 Sniper RAM, Corsair HX650w Gold PSU and an XFX 290x.  Nice looking rig, quiet too.

Install of BIONIC and crunching will commence in the next few days   I'm writing this on my laptop at my GFs house this eve *grin*

Here it is!!!  ...I wish the glowing XFX logo showed more...


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## manofthem (Jan 27, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> TL : DR
> System was drawing 31w idle and 69w (120v plug load with kill-a-watt) with the Intel iGPU graphics running Prime95 on both cores at 4.5Ghz.  It's rock stable with dynamic core and voltage, Vcore tops at 1.29v and temps are 64c max.
> 
> In idle, it draws that 30'ish watt draw, clocks are at 900Mhz and 0.90v (or so).  That's what I was aiming for.
> ...



Cruncher pr0n!  

Little headsup: running WCG may prove to be a better stability test for you, long term.  After passing stress tests, a rig can/may start to fail crunching 24/7; but no worries though, just decrease OC a tad. Just keep an eye on your results on your WCG page, look for errors and/or invalids.


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## Sasqui (Jan 27, 2016)

manofthem said:


> Cruncher pr0n!
> 
> Little headsup: running WCG may prove to be a better stability test for you, long term.  After passing stress tests, a rig can/may start to fail crunching 24/7; but no worries though, just decrease OC a tad. Just keep an eye on your results on your WCG page, look for errors and/or invalids.




 Get's me all hot and bothered just looking at it.  My 15 yr old did most of the work putting in components with a a bit of coaching.  He was surprised how fast it was all put together "wow dad, it's almost done?"

We may get the crunching to commence this evening (probably after he installs Steam ) I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes and may play more with voltages and BIOS setting if it's not 100% stable.  Or just knock it down to 4.4 Ghz if I'm feeling lazy!



Edit:  The be quiet! cooler came with a second fan (I think it was a toss-in).  I'd be interested to try a push-pull and see what difference it makes, but I'm not sure how to mount it, open to suggestions...


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 27, 2016)

The cooler didn't come with a second set of "fan mounts"?  Looks like the cooler's set up for a second fan....


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## Sasqui (Jan 27, 2016)

thebluebumblebee said:


> The cooler didn't come with a second set of "fan mounts"?  Looks like the cooler's set up for a second fan....



Yep, fans can be put on either side or both.  The extra fan was not included in the original package as far as I can tell, it's a different model and only 2-pins.  I couldn't find any other mounting clips in the box.


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 27, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> I couldn't find any other mounting clips in the box.


Just found TPU's review and it only comes with one set of fan clips.  Cable ties???  You could e-mail Be Quiet! and see if they'll send you another set.


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## Sasqui (Jan 28, 2016)

thebluebumblebee said:


> Just found TPU's review and it only comes with one set of fan clips.  Cable ties???  You could e-mail Be Quiet! and see if they'll send you another set.



Wouldn't hurt, I'll give that a try.  Have one fan header remaining on the MB.  Side note, love the UEFI BIOS on this board, the fan controls are awesome.

@Norton Onto CRUNCHING!  Here's what I got, son played burnout paradise for an hour or so on the rig and it's nice and zippy!  We resumed BIONIC and ran all night no problems.

Couple of questions:


Any way to gauge performance from this screenshot?  I did opt to let it use the GPU, but apparently it didn't have anything to throw at it (at least this project)

Is the TPU team getting credit for this?  I followed the links from Norton to sign up and install BIONIC...


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## [Ion] (Jan 28, 2016)

Best way to gauge performance is to let it run for a few days and see how it's doing 
Unfortunately no GPU work available right now.
You can join our Team from this link: http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/team/viewTeamInfo.do?teamId=S8TLJ6TFV1


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## Sasqui (Jan 28, 2016)

[Ion] said:


> Best way to gauge performance is to let it run for a few days and see how it's doing
> Unfortunately no GPU work available right now.
> You can join our Team from this link: http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/team/viewTeamInfo.do?teamId=S8TLJ6TFV1



It's running as I type!  

@Norton supplied the same link:  http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/reg/viewRegister.do?teamID=S8TLJ6TFV1

I followed that, registered, etc. .... How can I verify that the Crunching credit's are going to our team?


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 28, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> I followed that, registered, etc. .... How can I verify that the Crunching credit's are going to our team?


In the BOINC manager, click on view and then advanced.
Select the projects tab.  It will be shown there.


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## [Ion] (Jan 28, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> It's running as I type!
> 
> @Norton supplied the same link:  http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/reg/viewRegister.do?teamID=S8TLJ6TFV1
> 
> I followed that, registered, etc. .... How can I verify that the Crunching credit's are going to our team?


Do you see a "My Team: TechPowerUp!" on this page? http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/ms/viewMyMemberPage.do


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## Sasqui (Jan 28, 2016)

[Ion] said:


> Do you see a "My Team: TechPowerUp!" on this page? http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/ms/viewMyMemberPage.do



Thanks, indeed I was NOT part of the TechPowerUp! team. NOW I AM!!! 

Edit:  Not sure if the Crunching going on back home will all of a sudden start crediting TPU, I'll check this evening.  I also just noticed the "Team name:" in my screenshot was blank (duh).


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## Norton (Jan 28, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> @Norton Onto CRUNCHING! Here's what I got, son played burnout paradise for an hour or so on the rig and it's nice and zippy! We resumed BIONIC and ran all night no problems.


Awesome! 

Looks like your other Team members are helping you out with your questions- thanks folks!


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 28, 2016)

Sasqui said:


> Not sure if the Crunching going on back home will all of a sudden start crediting TPU


Yes it will.


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## Sasqui (Jan 28, 2016)

thebluebumblebee said:


> Yes it will.



Cool, rack 'em up


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