# Ryzen Zen4: Are both CPU power plugs required now?



## A Computer Guy (Sep 27, 2022)

With Zen2/Zen3 the 2nd plug (usually an additional 4 pin) wasn't necessary.


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## oxrufiioxo (Sep 27, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> With Zen2/Zen3 the 2nd plug (usually an additional 4 pin) wasn't necessary.
> View attachment 263303



Doubtful, a single EPS can do 300W I doubt you can pump 300W into even a 7950X and cool it. Doesn't hurt to plug it in though.


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## Space Lynx (Sep 27, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> With Zen2/Zen3 the 2nd plug (usually an additional 4 pin) wasn't necessary.
> View attachment 263303



Great question, I was wondering this earlier today as well.



oxrufiioxo said:


> Doubtful a single EPS can do 300W I doubt you can pump 300W into even a 7950X and cool it. Doesn't hurt to plug it in though.



How about a 7600x?


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## R0H1T (Sep 27, 2022)

AMD making PSU's great relevant again? Just like with *295x2* or the FX *9590* 








						AMD Radeon R9 295X2 Specs
					

AMD Vesuvius x2, 1018 MHz, 2816 Cores, 176 TMUs, 64 ROPs, 4096 MB GDDR5, 1250 MHz, 512 bit




					www.techpowerup.com


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## Space Lynx (Sep 27, 2022)

R0H1T said:


> AMD making PSU's great relevant again just like with *295x2*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



No, plenty of x570 boards had two eight pin connectors, but most people only used one of them. Actually Hardware Overclocking over on youtube confirmed this on his x570 Tomahawk video.

OP'squestion is legit and not ironic, not sure why you bringing up something like a gpu which has nothing to do with this.


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## oxrufiioxo (Sep 27, 2022)

CallandorWoT said:


> Great question, I was wondering this earlier today as well.
> 
> 
> 
> How about a 7600x?



Both the 7700X and 7600X use less than half the wattage a single eps can provide come on guys. Does that mean a motherboard maker wouldn't make the dumb decision to require both no but neither cpu will draw anywhere near what a single eps will provide and even if you pushed them there is no way in hell you could cool 300w on either cpu.


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## Space Lynx (Sep 27, 2022)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Both the 7700X and 7600X use less than half the wattage a single eps can provide come on guys.



In the past, pre-x570, and on Intel side, it still required you plugin to both slots for it to work, whether or not what CPU you used.

OP question still has not been answered.


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## INSTG8R (Sep 27, 2022)

I just bought a brand new X570S and is is just 8+4 so I still say the single 8 is more than sufficient for the average user


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## oxrufiioxo (Sep 27, 2022)

CallandorWoT said:


> In the past, pre-x570, and on Intel side, it still required you plugin to both slots for it to work, whether or not what CPU you used.
> 
> OP question still has not been answered.



The answer is no to the cpu needing it. That doesn't mean a motherboard manufacturer won't require it to boot although this would be a pretty dumb decision with any current ryzen 7000 CPU.... IF Ryzen 8000 goes up to 24 or 32 cores and 6ghz+ stock then maybe.


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## tabascosauz (Sep 27, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> With Zen2/Zen3 the 2nd plug (usually an additional 4 pin) wasn't necessary.



So many threads on this topic lmao. A modern solid 8-pin hasn't changed, it's still north of 300W.

But as for the cables themselves........it probably still isn't "necessary" but for the 230W parts you may as well just plug it in. Stock PSU cables from reputable brands on good PSUs should always be fine, but with some dodgy third party sleeved cables cheaping out on wire gauge you may actually run into problems. You have to remember that the EPS provides all the power for CPU power plane, including VRM losses. Modern midrange-high end AM4/AM5 VRMs have excellent efficiency but not necessarily at the power level the CPU runs at (ie. way overspecced, kinda like a PSU efficiency curve).

Obviously, no change on the 142W parts (7600X/7700X). But more and more boards will have it now as it kinda makes sense, whereas on AM4 board vendors were adding extra 8-pins for the fun of it.

I have a set of ridiculously chunky Corsair extensions for my SF750 and was benching 5900X close to 230W with no problems on one 8-pin. But at the same time the board did have 2 x 8-pins, just was too lazy to route a whole other cable. I'm not sure I would have trusted one of my Cablemod sets enough to do the same.


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## INSTG8R (Sep 27, 2022)

CallandorWoT said:


> In the past, pre-x570, and on Intel side, it still required you plugin to both slots for it to work, whether or not what CPU you used.
> 
> OP question still has not been answered.


Uh WUT? I have never plugged in more than an 8 pin in ANY board in the last decade, unless you are doing some kind of extreme LN2 shit single 8 pin has ALWAYS been enough...
Edit: Now way back in the day some boards had an extra Molex connnction for multi GPU that I have used in like 2006


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## A Computer Guy (Sep 27, 2022)

tabascosauz said:


> So many threads on this topic lmao. A modern solid 8-pin hasn't changed, it's still north of 300W.


I know right.  You'd think I'd learn my lesson by now.    


tabascosauz said:


> But as for the cables themselves........it probably still isn't "necessary" but for the 230W parts you may as well just plug it in. Stock PSU cables from reputable brands on good PSUs should always be fine, but with some dodgy third party sleeved cables cheaping out on wire gauge you may actually run into problems.


This is why I ask.  I get new information all the time and this seems to be an interesting point in favor of using both connectors.


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## oxrufiioxo (Sep 27, 2022)

tabascosauz said:


> So many threads on this topic lmao. A modern solid 8-pin hasn't changed, it's still north of 300W.
> 
> But as for the cables themselves........it probably still isn't "necessary" but for the 230W parts you may as well just plug it in. Stock PSU cables from reputable brands on good PSUs should always be fine, but with some dodgy third party sleeved cables cheaping out on wire gauge you may actually run into problems.
> 
> ...



Done the same pushed my 5950X pass 200w on a single 8pin eps even though my board has two just messing around. I have a 1000w titanium rated Seasonic psu though but really nobody should be running shoddy psu or cables on next gen parts from either company.



A Computer Guy said:


> I know right.  You'd think I'd learn my lesson by now.
> 
> This is why I ask.  I get new information all the time and this seems to be an interesting point in favor of using both connectors.



If you have both connecters no reason not to plug them in unless you have a tiny case and need all the space you can get.


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## AleXXX666 (Sep 27, 2022)

CallandorWoT said:


> No, plenty of x570 boards had two eight pin connectors, but most people only used one of them. Actually Hardware Overclocking over on youtube confirmed this on his x570 Tomahawk video.
> 
> OP'squestion is legit and not ironic, not sure why you bringing up something like a gpu which has nothing to do with this.


most people don't understand so, why on earth they need such a "high end" board lol


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## INSTG8R (Sep 27, 2022)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Done the same pushed my 5950X pass 200w on a single 8pin eps even though my board has two just messing around. I have a 1000w titanium rated Seasonic psu though but really nobody should be running shoddy psu or cables on next gen parts from either company.
> 
> 
> 
> If you have both connecters no reason not to plug them in unless you have a tiny case and need all the space you can get.


Precisely any decent quality PSU would never require any extra connections


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## oxrufiioxo (Sep 27, 2022)

INSTG8R said:


> Precisely any decent quality PSU would never require any extra connections



That new 6ghz intel cpu might require it assuming anyone can cool it. I guess we will find out next year.


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## Space Lynx (Sep 27, 2022)

AleXXX666 said:


> most people don't understand so, why on earth they need such a "high end" board lol



someone wanting to run a 7600x on the $299 steel legend mobo and a 6800 xt (entire system would pull around 550 watts) my psu is 700w evga gold rated and it is a great psu B-Tier list last I checked. got a great deal on it when it launched and only has 1 8 pin for cpu.

I could upgrade my psu sure, but if there is no need there is no need.



INSTG8R said:


> Uh WUT? I have never plugged in more than an 8 pin in ANY board in the last decade, unless you are doing some kind of extreme LN2 shit single 8 pin has ALWAYS been enough...
> Edit: Now way back in the day some boards had an extra Molex connnction for multi GPU that I have used in like 2006



I must not have misread then, I remember Actually Hardcore Overclocking on yuotube on the x570 tomahawk making a comment about how nice it was that board only needed one 8 pin  plugged in. so i guess i just misread his tone


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## Zach_01 (Sep 27, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> I know right.  You'd think I'd learn my lesson by now.
> 
> This is why I ask.  I get new information all the time and this seems to be an interesting point in favor of using both connectors.


A reviewer I saw yesterday was measuring the CPU EPS 12V rails connector for CPU power draw before VRM losses.
He didn't specify though if he plugged both, I'm guessing he did.


Test was Blender and the power value includes the VRM losses
7950X 250W
7900X 200W
7800X (not yet tested)
7600X 115W

And those are stock settings

In case of 7950X I wouldn't run it on one 8-pin (300W).

In fact, personally I wouldn't run any CPU past 100W on 1 since my PSU has 2 connectors.
I like things distributed.


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## freeagent (Sep 27, 2022)

I use both of the plugs with my 5600X and 5900X. I too like a balanced setup


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## fevgatos (Sep 27, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> With Zen2/Zen3 the 2nd plug (usually an additional 4 pin) wasn't necessary.
> View attachment 263303


No. A single 8pin eps can do 344w or thereabout. If your PSU is crappy, put both I guess. 

Was running a clocked to hell 10900k with one 8pin. Unless you are doing LN2 ocing, temps will stop you before 1 8pin will.


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## ir_cow (Sep 27, 2022)

Zach_01 said:


> A reviewer I saw yesterday was measuring the CPU EPS 12V rails connector for CPU power draw before VRM losses.
> He didn't specify though if he plugged both, I'm guessing he did.


For the a Z690 ITX review, I was pulling 340 watts for 30 minutes. The cable got a bit warm, but thats about it. The main problem is a lot of these cheaper PSUs use 18AWG wire, you need 16AWG if you plan on drawing 300+ through on of these EPS cables.


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## A Computer Guy (Sep 28, 2022)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Both the 7700X and 7600X use less than half the wattage a single eps can provide come on guys. Does that mean a motherboard maker wouldn't make the dumb decision to require both no but neither cpu will draw anywhere near what a single eps will provide and even if you pushed them there is no way in hell you could cool 300w on either cpu.


I was just watching a Hardware Unboxed review and it appears 7950x can pull 355 watts in Blender.


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## Vario (Sep 28, 2022)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Both the 7700X and 7600X use less than half the wattage a single eps can provide come on guys. Does that mean a motherboard maker wouldn't make the dumb decision to require both no but neither cpu will draw anywhere near what a single eps will provide and even if you pushed them there is no way in hell you could cool 300w on either cpu.


Probably to add capacity for 7950X and maybe 7950X3D?


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## oxrufiioxo (Sep 28, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> I was just watching a Hardware Unboxed review and it appears 7950x can pull 355 watts in Blender.



That's total system power.



Vario said:


> Probably to add capacity for 7950X and maybe 7950X3D?



Doubtful that the X3D uses more power. They would really need to go up to 24 cores to require the second 8 pin at least their mainstream chips.

You might be able to push your 12900KS past a single 8 pin with a heavy OC in prime95 with open loop cooling though.


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## Zach_01 (Sep 28, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> I was just watching a Hardware Unboxed review and it appears 7950x can pull 355 watts in Blender.


That is total system power.

GamersNexus did the same measuring 12V EPS 8-pin connector(s) and find 250W. If you ditch VRM losses from that Its below 250W actual CPU package power.
I estimate around 220W for CPU PPT at around 90~95C.


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## A Computer Guy (Sep 28, 2022)

oxrufiioxo said:


> That's total system power.


Thanks for clarifying that.



Zach_01 said:


> That is total system power.


Yep I realized my mistake.


Zach_01 said:


> GamersNexus did the same measuring 12V EPS 8-pin connector(s) and find 250W. If you ditch VRM losses from that Its below 250W actual CPU package power.
> I estimate around 220W for CPU PPT at around 90~95C.



This is really neat what can be done lowering wattage and curve optimizer.


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## Space Lynx (Sep 28, 2022)

A Computer Guy said:


> Thanks for clarifying that.
> 
> 
> Yep I realized my mistake.
> ...



nice find. this is fucking amazing.  30 celsius saved, and basically no performance difference, at least not noticeable in real world usage.  

absolutely insane.


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## dj-electric (Sep 28, 2022)

This has been sort of the thing with most desktop processors since 8700K really. People just don't bother power optimizing their stuff


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## Space Lynx (Sep 28, 2022)

@freeagent I don't know mate, I think you should do the 7700x now after watching that video. to late to cancel your 5800x 3d order?


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## freeagent (Sep 28, 2022)

CallandorWoT said:


> @freeagent I don't know mate, I think you should do the 7700x now after watching that video. to late to cancel your 5800x 3d order?


It’s big bucks just to slide into one.. I needed another cpu anyways for another build coming up. I will wait a bit and see what both companies do.


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## AleXXX666 (Oct 1, 2022)

CallandorWoT said:


> someone wanting to run a 7600x on the $299 steel legend mobo and a 6800 xt (entire system would pull around 550 watts) my psu is 700w evga gold rated and it is a great psu B-Tier list last I checked. got a great deal on it when it launched and only has 1 8 pin for cpu.
> 
> I could upgrade my psu sure, but if there is no need there is no need.
> 
> ...


700w gold evga is very good. but running 7600x with 6800xt out from 550w psu is terrible idea, just don't use psu at max output, i don't tell the 50% is a must because it's pure $$$ waste but something between 70-80% is perfect.



CallandorWoT said:


> @freeagent I don't know mate, I think you should do the 7700x now after watching that video. to late to cancel your 5800x 3d order?


the 5800X3D platform overall would be still much more economically beneficial. if you are all into performance then you could get a server perhaps..


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## Pastuch (Oct 4, 2022)

AleXXX666 said:


> 700w gold evga is very good. but running 7600x with 6800xt out from 550w psu is terrible idea, just don't use psu at max output, i don't tell the 50% is a must because it's pure $$$ waste but something between 70-80% is perfect.
> 
> 
> the 5800X3D platform overall would be still much more economically beneficial. if you are all into performance then you could get a server perhaps..


AMD blew it the moment they dropped DDR4 support from Zen 4. We're going to need DDR5 8400 kits before anything touches Bdie DDR4 in the latency department. If Raptor Lake can do 4400 bus speeds 1:1 with Bdie then the memory latency will get down to 40ns and embarrass DDR5. Samsung Bdie is literally the greatest memory ever created for enthusiasts (IMHO).


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