# Adsl upgrade.



## cookiemonster (May 17, 2018)

Hi I have recently been experiencing a drop in my fibre speed and the openreach engineer said that it could be the signal on the adsl cable between the main box and the router upstairs a cable length of about 5m and suggested that I  upgrade the cable, what cable should I use, I should receive 66 mbs.


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## W1zzard (May 17, 2018)

Take your router right next to the main box with a short cable to check if that's really what makes the difference.

If that helps, install the router near main box and then run Ethernet up to your PC. Ethernet cable length won't affect speed.


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## cookiemonster (May 17, 2018)

I will try that but I would have liked to have kept the router upstairs the engineer mentioned about running a cat 5 cable or cat something.


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## Bill_Bright (May 17, 2018)

5 meters is no big deal. 100 meters is generally considered the maximum allowed. 


cookiemonster said:


> and the openreach engineer said that it could be the signal on the adsl cable between the main box and the router upstairs a cable length of about 5m


  Not likely - unless it was recently subjected to physical abuse and damaged. Indoor cables (those not exposed to the sun or inclement weather) don't suddenly go bad just due to age. Note that physical abuse does not just included being pulled, pinched, or the connectors stepped on. Pets chewing, or rodent/insect activity can do it too.

Even very old CAT-5 cable supports up to 100Mbps speeds. CAT-5e has been around since 2001 and that handles up to 1000Mbps and is most commonly used. CAT-6 is here now and it is "certified" to support 1000Mbps. So if you have to replace your cable, I recommend at least CAT-5e or better yet, CAT-6 for the best future proofing. 

HOWEVER, just as important is the connector. And sadly, many pre-made cables are poorly assembled so I always make my own cables. If you go this route, "invest" in quality crimpers and connectors. And a tester (this works for CAT-5e too). The advantages of making your own are huge. For one, if you need a 18 inch or 7 1/2 foot cable, you can make them instead of buying a 3 foot and 10 foot cable. If pulling through walls or ceiling, it takes smaller holes since you put the connector on after pulling. And you can ensure better quality crimps. It is a bit tedious since the 8 wires are so small, as is the connector. So good lighting is essential and be prepared to sacrifice a few connectors for practice. That's where the tester quickly pays for itself. Even if you buy pre-made cables, having a tester handy for troubleshooting is a good idea.


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## qubit (May 17, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> *It is a bit tedious since the 8 wires are so small, as is the connector.* So good lighting is essential and be prepared to sacrifice a few connectors for practice.


And a nice big, fat, magnifying glass if your vision is anything like mine. 

Making your own cables sounds like a good idea.


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## eidairaman1 (May 17, 2018)

Adsl huh, you could have a DSLAM that is Remote Terminal based-near by where you live, or in the CentralOffice/ Exchange. if it is RT based it shoyld be fiber to curb cabinet then copper for last mile, if co based then your signal could be traveling on copper from the CO to a terminal then from terminal to drop line to nid on home.


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## cookiemonster (May 17, 2018)

As I am new to these cat 5e or cat 6 cables is it a case of plug it into the main box but what about the other end, according to one of the engineers that was out for a previous fault from the cabinet to the house about 400 - 500meters is copper and aluminium ,but to be sure if I rule out the internal then it must be outside.


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## Bill_Bright (May 17, 2018)

qubit said:


> And a nice big, fat, magnifying glass if your vision is anything like mine.


Hey, that's what trifocals are for! 


qubit said:


> Making your own cables sounds like a good idea.


If only making a couple cables in your lifetime, it is probably not worth it since a quality crimper is not cheap. Especially if you wasted money on two cheap crimpers before realizing you should have invested in quality tools from the start.   

But for me, it eventually paid off when a large portion of the basement ceiling in this old house collapsed. Once all the basement ceiling/upstairs floor joists were exposed, it was easy to wire my whole house with CAT-5e.


cookiemonster said:


> As I am new to these cat 5e or cat 6 cables is it a case of plug it into the main box but what about the other end.


Not sure what you mean. We are talking about the Ethernet connection from your ADSL modem to your router, right? And by "main box" you are talking about your ADSL modem, right?  If so, you plug the other end into the router where the current cable is connected. 

If you are talking about the cable going to the ADSL modem, to me, that should be your ISP's responsibility.


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## qubit (May 17, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> If only making a couple cables in your lifetime, it is probably not worth it since a quality crimper is not cheap. Especially if you wasted money on two cheap crimpers before realizing you should have invested in quality tools from the start.
> 
> But for me, it eventually paid off when a large portion of the basement ceiling in this old house collapsed. Once all the basement ceiling/upstairs floor joists were exposed, it was easy to wire my whole house with CAT-5e.


Yeah, it wouldn't be that often that I have to make my own cables, but I can simply use enthusiast logic to get round this one...

A bit off topic here, but I couldn't hack varifocals so returned them after only an hour, so I doubt I'd be able to hack any other combo lens, lol. I now switch between distance and reading glasses which is wearing a groove on the sides of my head.


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## Bill_Bright (May 17, 2018)

qubit said:


> varifocals


If you mean "no-line" bi or trifocals, I couldn't either. But either way, you need to give them a few days to get used to, not an hour.


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## W1zzard (May 17, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> If pulling through walls or ceiling, it takes smaller holes since you put the connector on after pulling.


Technically you are not supposed to use cables with connectors for fixed installation.


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## Bill_Bright (May 17, 2018)

W1zzard said:


> Technically you are not supposed to use cables with connectors for fixed installation.


I don't know what you mean by that. I don't know of any modem or router (or switch, hub, or computer) that uses "hard wired" (soldered) network cables. So you must use RJ-45 connectors to connect your Ethernet cables.


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## Vayra86 (May 17, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> 5 meters is no big deal. 100 meters is generally considered the maximum allowed.
> Not likely - unless it was recently subjected to physical abuse and damaged. Indoor cables (those not exposed to the sun or inclement weather) don't suddenly go bad just due to age. Note that physical abuse does not just included being pulled, pinched, or the connectors stepped on. Pets chewing, or rodent/insect activity can do it too.
> 
> Even very old CAT-5 cable supports up to 100Mbps speeds. CAT-5e has been around since 2001 and that handles up to 1000Mbps and is most commonly used. CAT-6 is here now and it is "certified" to support 1000Mbps. So if you have to replace your cable, I recommend at least CAT-5e or better yet, CAT-6 for the best future proofing.
> ...



As it so happens I completely agree with this post; here is a search you may want to explore in several ways

https://www.google.nl/search?q=crim.....69i57j0l5.3045j1j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

One major screw up you see everywhere is that you get cables where the whole thing (connector + shielding + inner cabling) are all crimped together. This is not the best method. What you'd want is this. Note how the shielding stops UNDER the clamp on the connector. Main advantage: you don't destroy the inner cable when you pull it hard - you just pull down the shielding.

Beyond that I'd look for other causes to this problem to be fair, cable doesn't just go bad unless you can physically see damage.


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## W1zzard (May 17, 2018)

Bill_Bright said:


> I don't know what you mean by that. I don't know of any modem or router (or switch, hub, or computer) that uses "hard wired" (soldered) network cables. So you must use RJ-45 connectors to connect your Ethernet cables.


When you install Ethernet cables in/on walls you shouldn't use patch cables but installation cables and terminate each end with a patch panel / network socket. Then plug ethernet cables into those.


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## eidairaman1 (May 17, 2018)

W1zzard said:


> When you install Ethernet cables in/on walls you shouldn't use patch cables but installation cables and terminate each end with a patch panel / network socket. Then plug ethernet cables into those.



That's the right thing in an office environment however that doesn't always happen example smart panel homes


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## Bill_Bright (May 17, 2018)

Ah! I see what you mean. Not many people use patch panels in their home networks (except maybe in new homes that are wired for Ethernet during the build). But for sure, for a more professional installation, Ethernet wall jacks should be used, then a patch cable to the network device. But many just punch a hole through walls for a direct connection to the device. Not the prettiest solution but it does mean fewer connections that might introduce problems.


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## cookiemonster (May 17, 2018)

hi sorry for not getting back, all I want preferably is a good cable to go from this main socket to the router upstairs or if need be or if I have to move the router downstairs a cable to go from the router to the pc upstairs would an ethernet ( yellow cable) be good enough. how about this one    https://www.amazon.co.uk/15m-Black-...D=31SrJMJ%2BGGL&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch


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## 95Viper (May 18, 2018)

@cookiemonster...  You might get some ideas from "My Mate Vince" he has a few videos on the subjects.
And, some "MY Mate Vince" YouTube channel videos, like:     Increase your Internet Broadband Speed by 60% by using an ADSL faceplate and ADSL extension

Just from your pics... it looks like they used regular twisted pair telephone wire to connect to your router... anyway, if you look at some of the info videos they may give you some ideas.


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## FordGT90Concept (May 18, 2018)

I had a similar problem when I was on ADSL.  What I ended up doing was replacing all the phone lines in the house with shielded CAT6 (overkill) and, most importantly, the phones were on a whole-home filter outside of the house by the phone line box while there was a dedicated line (unsplit and unfiltered) going directly from the phone line box to the ADSL gateway.  The net effect was phone lines were cleaned up (if there's problems it's never on my end unless the external ADSL filter failed) and I was able to get 3 mbps ADSL when everyone else on my line is stuck with 1 mbps.

TL;DR: if it hasn't been done already, run a direct cable from the phone box to the gateway separating internet service from everything else.  Ideally, that cable should be run all the way to where you intend to put the ADSL gateway so you use as little crappy CAT3 cable as possible (I think mine was 2m of CAT3).


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## eidairaman1 (May 18, 2018)

cookiemonster said:


> hi sorry for not getting back, all I want preferably is a good cable to go from this main socket to the router upstairs or if need be or if I have to move the router downstairs a cable to go from the router to the pc upstairs would an ethernet ( yellow cable) be good enough. how about this one    https://www.amazon.co.uk/15m-Black-Network-Cable-enhanced/dp/B003ZAYUEO/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1526598807&sr=8-3&keywords=15+meter+ethernet+cable&dpID=31SrJMJ%2BGGL&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch



This looks like a half Ringer to an extent


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## cookiemonster (May 18, 2018)

Hi tried to order cable from my mate vince but I can't  find his web page I tried this    https://www.mymatevince.com/


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## 95Viper (May 18, 2018)

cookiemonster said:


> Hi tried to order cable from my mate vince but I can't  find his web page I tried this    https://www.mymatevince.com/



You don't have to get your cable from "Vince",  just get decent CAT5e or CAT6 cable in the length you need from ebay, amazon, computer store, department (supercenter) store, etc.. 
And, either you terminate it; or, if you want... get it, already, terminated, if you can get by with it pre-terminated.

The "My Mate Vince" links were so you could watch the videos and get some ideas.  

However, my two cents, I don't believe that 5M (16.4, or so, feet) is going to cause a drop in speed, all of a sudden, _when it was working before_.  Unless, the cable took a turn for the worse.
Had any bad weather, lately... storms, lightning.
Try re=booting your modem / router and any other equipment.  

Some links:
*UK ADSL Broadband Internet Connection Tips and Tweaks*
Freeola Broadband Line Quality Test
Openreach Local network status checker

How to Improve Your Broadband Speed



cookiemonster said:


> I should receive 66 mbs.





cookiemonster said:


> 400 - 500meters is copper and aluminium



How Does Speed Vary with Distance?


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## cookiemonster (May 18, 2018)

Hi I have had all the checks done by talktalk and an Openreach line engineer and according to the line engineer he said that there was 83mbs coming into the main box in the house and all I get when it reaches the pc is 52mbs so I said I would upgrade the cable to rule it out he said that the speed was almost the same when he tested at the end of the cable as it goes into the router, Vince was on about a cat5e cable with an rj45 on one end and an rj11 on the other end I will have a look for that.


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## eidairaman1 (May 18, 2018)

cookiemonster said:


> Hi I have had all the checks done by talktalk and an Openreach line engineer and according to the line engineer he said that there was 83mbs coming into the main box in the house and all I get when it reaches the pc is 52mbs so I said I would upgrade the cable to rule it out he said that the speed was almost the same when he tested at the end of the cable as it goes into the router, Vince was on about a cat5e cable with an rj45 on one end and an rj11 on the other end I will have a look for that.



What the heck on the RJ 11 bit. That terminating box is a halfringer/smartjack then if they could test from it there.

ADSL uses a 1 pair of utp, if it is bonded pair it would be 2 utp. That line from the smart jack, does it go to a modem?. It could be a fault in the smart jack too.


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## FordGT90Concept (May 19, 2018)

You're gonna want an RJ11 surface mount to terminate the CAT5:
http://www.deepsurplus.com/Network-...-Single-Surface-Mount-Jack-Biscuit-Jack-White

Then get/make a really short CAT3 cable to connect that to the ADSL gateway.

RJ11 is too small to terminate a CAT5 cable.


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## cookiemonster (May 19, 2018)

Hi I have uploaded a simple drawing and I will be buying cables with ends attached can you please tell me in simple terms what the red wall socket is called.


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## Bill_Bright (May 19, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> You're gonna want an RJ11 surface mount to terminate the CAT5
> RJ11 is too small to terminate a CAT5 cable.


Pretty sure he meant you want an "RJ-45" surface mount to terminate the "CAT5e" cable. RJ-11 is for telephone wiring and only has 6 connector termination points. RJ-45 has the necessary 8 connector termination points needed for Ethernet. Also, CAT5 is obsolete. It only supports up to 100Mbps. You need to use CAT5e or CAT6 to support 1000Mbps (gigabit) networking.


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## cookiemonster (May 19, 2018)

Will this do  https://www.cablematic.co.uk/ref/RI11?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI58jjqJCS2wIVx7DtCh1lLQfrEAQYAiABEgLq4_D_BwE


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## FordGT90Concept (May 19, 2018)

I thought we were talking ADSL which is on the white/blue + blue twisted pair phone line.  That pair would be hard-wired in the exterior phone box and the other end has 8 wires coming in but only two are in use.

RJ11 = 4 contacts
RJ12 = 6 contacts
RJ45 = 8 contacts


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## eidairaman1 (May 19, 2018)

cookiemonster said:


> Hi I have uploaded a simple drawing and I will be buying cables with ends attached can you please tell me in simple terms what the red wall socket is called.



Ok, the box that is on the outside is typically called the Network Interface Device or Demarcation point. The Cat5 E is your Home Run, it goes into the half-ringer/smart-jack(dedicated adsl2+ jack, colored red)

If you look at your cat 5E cable on the plug end, typically the center 2 conductors/contacts have blue and blue white as your pair that is transmitting the dsl signal in this case (in PBX systems this would be for dialtone).

Your setup is for easy repair atleast replacing the homerun.


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