# Mixing copper and brass in a loop?



## KBD (Dec 4, 2008)

I'm helping a friend with first water cooling project and id like to get the answer to this question. I know you are not supposed to mix copper and aluminum, but what about copper and nickle-plated brass? He has some fittings made of both materials, are they OK to use?


----------



## OzzmanFloyd120 (Dec 4, 2008)

I thought that brass WAS an alloy of copper and aluminum?


----------



## newtekie1 (Dec 4, 2008)

Brass is Copper and Zinc.  If they are nickle-plated, I don't think there is a problem with it, I believe nickle and copper play along together.


----------



## Woody112 (Dec 4, 2008)

You will be good to go. The only ones you don't want to mix is what you already stated. Copper and aluminum.
However you can get around this and alleviate all doubt by using non conductive coolant. Like Feser, etc..


----------



## phanbuey (Dec 4, 2008)

yeah as long as its not aluminum... also use some antifreeze, that'll help make make sure it wont erode.


----------



## KBD (Dec 4, 2008)

Woody112 said:


> You will be good to go. The only ones you don't want to mix is what you already stated. Copper and aluminum.
> However you can get around this and alleviate all doubt by using non conductive coolant. Like Feser, etc..



speaking of coolant, what non-conductive coolant is recomended? He wants to buy non-UV or clear but will be using Feser UV green tubing


----------



## Woody112 (Dec 4, 2008)

KBD said:


> speaking of coolant, what non-conductive coolant is recomended? He wants to buy non-UV or clear but will be using Feser UV green tubing



Feser makes non conductive coolant. Been using that stuff ever since I had a 2k dollar accident with my old rig. If he is using UV green tubing Feser makes non conductive uv green coolant. I'd go with that. 
Go to performance-pcs.com and check it out.


----------



## Woody112 (Dec 4, 2008)

phanbuey said:


> yeah as long as its not aluminum... also use some antifreeze, that'll help make make sure it wont erode.



You don't use car antifreeze in a cooling system on a computer:shadedshu
If you use non-conductive coolant you don't want to mix it with anything else as it will become conductive real quick.


----------



## KBD (Dec 4, 2008)

Woody112 said:


> Feser makes non conductive coolant. Been using that stuff ever since I had a 2k dollar accident with my old rig. If he is using UV green tubing Feser makes non conductive uv green coolant. I'd go with that.
> Go to performance-pcs.com and check it out.



yea, he wants to stay away from UV coolant (and i agree) its been know to cause problems, the UV tubing itself should be enough UV in itself, i looked at Feser coolants, they have this clear one:

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/7...e_Water_-_1000_ml_FA-0054.html?tl=g30c103s183

there are also more expensive fluid XP available there but id tel him to get this if its recomended


----------



## infrared (Dec 4, 2008)

Woody112 said:


> You don't use car antifreeze in a cooling system on a computer:shadedshu



Why not? I did for years with no problems at all. Used a 33/66 mix of antifreeze/distilled water.


----------



## phanbuey (Dec 4, 2008)

ethylene glycol is ethylene glycol (unless its propylene glycol which has the same characteristics)... regardless of how UV reactive the fluid it comes with is... 33/66 and and 80/20 mixtures (with water - not more antifreeze) are fine... and if you read ur fluid ingredients (unless its that "environmentally friendly" garbage) its antifreeze .


----------



## rangerone766 (Dec 4, 2008)

distilled water is non conductive. no need to buy fancy coolants.


----------



## phanbuey (Dec 4, 2008)

rangerone766 said:


> distilled water is non conductive. no need to buy fancy coolants.



also true but then you gotta worry about algea over time no?


----------



## _jM (Dec 4, 2008)

phanbuey said:


> also true but then you gotta worry about algea over time no?



That's when you mix antifreeze with the distilled water


----------



## Woody112 (Dec 4, 2008)

phanbuey said:


> ethylene glycol is ethylene glycol (unless its propylene glycol which has the same characteristics)... regardless of how UV reactive the fluid it comes with is... 33/66 and and 80/20 mixtures (with water - not more antifreeze) are fine... and if you read ur fluid ingredients (unless its that "environmentally friendly" garbage) its antifreeze .



Really I didn't know ethylene glycol is ethylene glycol. How ever I alway tell people not to use automotive antifreeze as alot of them have adatives for automotive that will ruin a water pump on a computer. Good example DCA, final charge, complete charge, etc...
Now if you buy some straight ethylene glycol and mix it with distilled water your good to go. straight prestone is ethylene only, prestone extended life is not.

FYI: the only difference between ethylene glycol and propylene glycol is ethylene is poisonous and propylene is not. In fact the manufacture says you can drink the crap, however I won't be the one to test their theory.


----------



## phanbuey (Dec 4, 2008)

Woody112 said:


> FYI: the only difference between ethylene glycol and propylene glycol is ethylene is poisonous and propylene is not. In fact the manufacture says you can drink the crap, however I won't be the one to test their theory.



 i heard it was sweet and sugary...


----------



## Wile E (Dec 4, 2008)

Woody112 said:


> Really I didn't know ethylene glycol is ethylene glycol. How ever I alway tell people not to use automotive antifreeze as alot of them have adatives for automotive that will ruin a water pump on a computer. Good example DCA, final charge, complete charge, etc...
> Now if you buy some straight ethylene glycol and mix it with distilled water your good to go. straight prestone is ethylene only, prestone extended life is not.
> 
> FYI: the only difference between ethylene glycol and propylene glycol is ethylene is poisonous and propylene is not. In fact the manufacture says you can drink the crap, however I won't be the one to test their theory.



No, automotive antifreeze does not/can not hurt the pump. The materials used in a water cooling pump are also found in countless car cooling systems. If it hurt a computer pump, it would destroy your car.

As far as mixing metals in a loop, even with anti-corrosion additives, the metals will still react over time. The additives only slow the process, not stop it.

Personally, I just use straight distilled water. It cools the best out of everything.


----------



## Woody112 (Dec 4, 2008)

phanbuey said:


> ethylene glycol is ethylene glycol (unless its propylene glycol which has the same characteristics)... regardless of how UV reactive the fluid it comes with is... 33/66 and and 80/20 mixtures (with water - not more antifreeze) are fine... and if you read ur fluid ingredients (unless its that "environmentally friendly" garbage) its antifreeze .





Wile E said:


> No, automotive antifreeze does not/can not hurt the pump. The materials used in a water cooling pump are also found in countless car cooling systems. If it hurt a computer pump, it would destroy your car.
> 
> As far as mixing metals in a loop, even with anti-corrosion additives, the metals will still react over time. The additives only slow the process, not stop it.
> 
> Personally, I just use straight distilled water. It cools the best out of everything.



It eats at the seals in the pump as their not chemical resistant. 
Final charge will eat the hell out of anything as it does on every engine I've seen it put in. 
If it eats seals in a ISX, ISM, N14, QSK60 diesel engine I'm quit shure it will have a field day on a computer.
Antifreeze with DCA is an adative used to protect the liners in diesel engine. May or may not hurt your computer. But seriously is it worth finding out?
The point I'm trying to get across is simple, and people keep picking around it. Point being not all antifreezes are the same just because it says ethylene glycol doesn't mean thats all it has in it. Make shure you know what your buying and putting in your computer.
Actually lets make this even simpler, if it has anything to do with a diesel engine it's pry best to stay away from it.
If you stick with your basic generic antifreeze that you would put in your grandmothers cadilac, ie prestone your good. Just be shure it's 100% ethylene glycol.


----------



## Exavier (Dec 4, 2008)

feser one is still good right? just wondering where I read "UV coolant causes problems" in one of these posts..


----------



## eidairaman1 (Dec 4, 2008)

look at corrosion, galvanic corrosion can set in, which then can lead to Intergranular and then Exfoliation corrosions.


----------



## Wile E (Dec 5, 2008)

Woody112 said:


> It eats at the seals in the pump as their not chemical resistant.
> Final charge will eat the hell out of anything as it does on every engine I've seen it put in.
> If it eats seals in a ISX, ISM, N14, QSK60 diesel engine I'm quit shure it will have a field day on a computer.
> Antifreeze with DCA is an adative used to protect the liners in diesel engine. May or may not hurt your computer. But seriously is it worth finding out?
> ...


I said automotive antifreeze, not antifreeze for commercial vehicles.  Seriously, who the hell is gonna buy Final Charge for their computer anyway? 

And the seals in the pumps I've seen are all materials that can be found in an automotive cooling system. Be it silicon, rubber, nylon, poly, etc.


----------



## Woody112 (Dec 5, 2008)

Wile E said:


> I said automotive antifreeze, not antifreeze for commercial vehicles.  Seriously, who the hell is gonna buy Final Charge for their computer anyway?
> 
> And the seals in the pumps I've seen are all materials that can be found in an automotive cooling system. Be it silicon, rubber, nylon, poly, etc.



Actually the stuff is usually sold at your local auto parts dealer. Especially since your dodge rams have B5.9's in them and ford F450 and up have B5.9's and ISC, ISL diesel engines in them. We get all of our stuff from car quest. 
Seriously though; I just don't want to see this guy grab the first thing he see's on the shelf is all. Not saying he's going to as I'm shure the man is smart enough to look at what he's buying.
As for who is going to put the stuff in their computer. The kid who reads these post thinking that all antifreeze is the same and goes to their dads garage and grabs what ever he has.
I'm just trying to help people make an informed decision is all. Not trying to start an argument or anything with this thread


----------



## KBD (Dec 5, 2008)

hey, guys thnx for all the resposes, we decided to play it safe and just stick to nickel-plated brass, he just ordered  2 fittings to replace the 2 copper ones he had. Brass fittings are more common from what i've seen so i think its a good idea. And, he'll be getting distilled water for coolant as Wile suggested. Prolly we'll wind up getting that Feser stuff i linked to earlier.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Dec 5, 2008)

A piece of silver in your loop stops algea.


----------



## KBD (Dec 5, 2008)

tigger said:


> A piece of silver in your loop stops algea.



interesting, havent seen any silver components at all, what do u use tigger?


----------



## Starcrusher (Dec 5, 2008)

Copper is a good algaecide and much cheaper than silver.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Dec 5, 2008)

I'm using a 3" section of a silver hatpin,in my res.


----------



## eidairaman1 (Dec 5, 2008)

Yup and you want to Change Your Coolant every 10,000 Miles


----------



## Wile E (Dec 6, 2008)

tigger said:


> A piece of silver in your loop stops algea.



Yep, that's why they sell these. http://www.petrastechshop.com/sikibyia.html

Btw, read the description. lol.


----------



## Sonido (Dec 6, 2008)

Wile E said:


> No, automotive antifreeze does not/can not hurt the pump. The materials used in a water cooling pump are also found in countless car cooling systems. If it hurt a computer pump, it would destroy your car.
> 
> As far as mixing metals in a loop, even with anti-corrosion additives, the metals will still react over time. The additives only slow the process, not stop it.
> 
> Personally, I just use straight distilled water. It cools the best out of everything.



Best thermal conductor in that range. The anti-corrosion only slows down the process like he said. Use some anti-freeze with an incredibly small amount of virgin oil. I hear it can help reduce corrosion even more. I can't prove it though, but it has been used on metals.


----------



## EnergyFX (Dec 7, 2008)

Read my nickel plating experiment.

Link in sig.  Be sure to follow the other links within that thread as well.  They're in the first post.


----------



## infrared (Dec 14, 2008)

Wile E said:


> Yep, that's why they sell these. http://www.petrastechshop.com/sikibyia.html
> 
> Btw, read the description. lol.





> Warning: This product contains...uh...Silver!
> 
> • If ingested, you may choke... so just don't do that.
> 
> ...



LOLOL.. I'd buy one just because of that!


----------

