# New gaming headset to replace Fatal1ty [thoughts on Razer]



## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

I'm a big fan of budget headsets wit mics, ever since I picked up a Fatal1ty HS800 a few years back.






I'm now on my third pair, which lost mic function. I'm close to buying another one yet thought about possibly looking into a few Razer models.

There are however so many of them now, I do not know where to begin(and that's just Razer. I know Turtle Beach, Sennheiser, and so many others exist). 

My requirements:

I don't want to spend more than about $50-70, or £25-50.
Surround is not necessary as I don't believe that it's ever true and ends up sounding wrong and inaccurate.
No USB models
Detachable microphone would be a great bonus.
I'll go used too, if the advertisement looks promising.

The two Razer that have stood out are the Raptor and the Caracharias.


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## Fourstaff (Jan 25, 2014)

Fatality user here, its very difficult to find one headset below £50 which comes close to it. You can take a look at Corsair's offerings, or consider getting a standalone mic. 

This is good guide: http://www.head-fi.org/t/534479/mad...ng-guide-updated-1-9-2014-shure-srh1840-added


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

Ah, good a fellow user!

Thanks for the link and I will check out some Corsair.
Razer Chimaera are spiffy for the wireless aspect but I do wonder if that's really worth it when you they're designed for XBox use and you end up only getting analogue output. My sound card should be doing most of the audio work though..


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## Fourstaff (Jan 25, 2014)

My experience with the few Razer products I have come across are generally good, except quite expensive for what they are capable of. The only time my Harman Kardon BT beats my HS800 is when I need to take a toilet break, so that is something to keep in mind.


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

Yes, wireless would be nice. 
Any experience with USB models that have their own driver built-in? Surely this is pointless if you have a sound card.

I had a look for some Corsair, and the HS1 seems to be end of life. The Raptor comes up in all search results. It this their goto model now?


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

Four, any idea what set this gentlemen is wearing?


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## ZetZet (Jan 25, 2014)

Siberia v2 good value in my opinion, very comfortable. I went from fatal1ty to siberia and was very impressed.


newconroer said:


> Four, any idea what set this gentlemen is wearing?


Logitech g930


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

Yes! Siberias are a good option.
How about Roccat Kaves?


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## ZetZet (Jan 25, 2014)

newconroer said:


> Yes! Siberias are a good option.
> How about Roccat Kaves?


They have all the fancy softwares, while siberia are just plain analog with 50mm drivers, also the hideable mic is good.


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

Well the Kave's are 5.1 over 3.5mm instead of their own USB, which means I can use my sound card in conjunction.

Though if I go back to stereo, Siberia v2 look pretty good. It will be either those or Corsair Vengeance 1300 I think.


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## erocker (Jan 25, 2014)

I really like the Siberia V2's, they sound pretty good. Only thing that is bad about them is their head adjustment. Very cheap and easy to break.


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

erocker said:


> I really like the Siberia V2's, they sound pretty good. Only thing that is bad about them is their head adjustment. Very cheap and easy to break.


Hmm I thought the little stretch cables and metal construction was supposed to make the Siberia's selling point to be durability.


Turtle Beach DX11 look promising.

Though I'm still torn about 'true' surround with multiple physical speakers, or simulated dolby through an encoder box and how that works or does not work in conjunction with sound cards.



EDIT: Hah, top ten gaming headsets 2013    HS800 at number 6!


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 25, 2014)

I'm on my second set of Caracharias.  The first set had a defective left woofer and they replaced them under warranty.  The only real complaint I have is that, when you first get them and you have a big head, they kind of hurt.  Once they've stretched to fit your head, they might actually get a little loose.  I like them though and wouldn't hesitate to buy another set when these die.


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

I feel the same about the HS800, and the Caracharias do seem to offer the same experience, if not slightly better or slightly worse.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 25, 2014)

The reason I went with Caracharias is because the woofers are connected using metal ergo, they're more likely to survive being dropped (and dropped they have).  I don't like the look of HS800 from a structural standpoint.


Do NOT get "surround" headsets.  Games these days use positional audio processing by varying the power to each woofer to simulate "surround sound" better than physical "surround sound" headphones can manage.  Not to mention, stereo headphones are much better for music and general listening as well.


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

I did read that headphones with several physical speakers are not good, despite what you would think.
Then you have the headphones with only USB connectivity that try to process audio on their own.
And now we have the headphones that admit they use simulated surround, but do it through an encoder and optical connection (still relying on your sound card). I.e. Turtle Beach DX11, Tritton AX 5.1 etc.

http://www.amazon.co_uk/dp/B004EBUSJY/?tag=tec053-21

If you're saying the DX11 and similar products are still a part of the gimmick era, then I suppose I'll stick with stereo analogue headphones and Razer surround.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 25, 2014)

newconroer said:


> I did read that headphones with several physical speakers are not good, despite what you would think.


Because to fit 3+ speakers over a single ear, they have to be small woofers.  Small woofers means trouble producing low frequencies.  Think the small woofers in your smartphone or in LCD TVs.  Their lows are horrendous/nonexistent.



newconroer said:


> Then you have the headphones with only USB connectivity that try to process audio on their own.


What is a sound card?  A DAC (digital to analog converter).  Because human ears are analog and USB is a digital signal, all headphones that use USB have a DAC.  It doesn't matter how fantastic (or not) the sound card is in your computer because it won't use it.  It will use the DAC in the headphones and that DAC is often junk by comparison.  USB headphones/speakers reek of cheap.



newconroer said:


> And now we have the headphones that admit they use simulated surround, but do it through an encoder and optical connection (still relying on your sound card). I.e. Turtle Beach DX11, Tritton AX 5.1 etc.


I'd rather the computer/device handle the simulated surround sound than anything in the headphones.  That way, at bare minimum, you have control over whether or not it is done.  Headphones also inevitably fail so if that is something you really want, it's better to invest in a DAC that does it than headphones that have a built in DAC that does it (needlessly adds to the cost).



newconroer said:


> If you're saying the DX11 and similar products are still a part of the gimmick era, then I suppose I'll stick with stereo analogue headphones and Razer surround.


Look at the best of the best headphones on the market.  They aren't surround.  Instead, they've invested lots of money into better woofers; usually that means getting bigger sound out of the same space.


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

I picked up on something I had not considered before, that as you say in order to future proof headphones like the DX11, I'd need a DAC. And I assume that I would want it to be compatible or optimized for use with that particular pair of cans. I question whether such a device would be had at a budget.

I agree about best headphones - they are immensely more in depth than gaming headsets.



Thank you. This was a concise and informative response 

Lastly, I read that the Carcharias can be a bit weak in the mid range/mid tones. Have you noticed this? I'm pretty familiar with audio equalizing and wondered if you have any settings to address it.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 25, 2014)

I haven't noticed any problems with the audio performance but I'm no audiophile.  I don't use anything to adjust how it sounds--just plugged in and listen.

I will say that they aren't capable of going as loud as some others I've used but as long as ambient noise isn't bad, that shouldn't be a problem.


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## newconroer (Jan 25, 2014)

Well they are ordered now, so we shall see - may even put a review up on Overlord Gaming.

Thanks


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## erocker (Jan 26, 2014)

newconroer said:


> Hmm I thought the little stretch cables and metal construction was supposed to make the Siberia's selling point to be durability.



Nah, that's their weak spot. The cables don't actually stretch. They are connected to a thin elastic strip is easily broken. I managed to fix mine with a couple of staples on each side.

Oh, and +1 on the Caracharias. They don't sound as good as the Siberia V2's but I still have my set that I bought quite a while ago and they're still 100%. My mic just tends to bleed through at times.

Also, post the review up here!


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## TheMailMan78 (Jan 26, 2014)

erocker said:


> Nah, that's their weak spot. The cables don't actually stretch. They are connected to a thin elastic strip is easily broken. I managed to fix mine with a couple of staples on each side.
> 
> Oh, and +1 on the Caracharias. They don't sound as good as the Siberia V2's but I still have my set that I bought quite a while ago and they're still 100%. My mic just tends to bleed through at times.
> 
> Also, post the review up here!


This. I had a set and loved the sound. However they didn't last a month before they were covered in duct tape. Now I'm running a set of Razor Blacksharks. Nice indeed.


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## erocker (Jan 26, 2014)

TheMailMan78 said:


> This. I had a set and loved the sound. However they didn't last a month before they were covered in duct tape. Now I'm running a set of Razor Blacksharks. Nice indeed.


Sucks for such a nice looking headset. So the wiring is bad? Bad manufacturing. 


*Bah, you were talking about the Steelseries.. which really doesn't change what I said. lol.


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## BumbleBee (Jan 26, 2014)

let me make it simple for you.

Sennheiser and Beyerdynamic PC Gaming headsets are the best because the drivers used in these headsets are the same ones used in both companies high end headphones. years of R&D goes into making these drivers and manufacturing is all done in US, Ireland and Germany.

Sennheiser and Audio Technica have new lines out for 2014

http://en-us.sennheiser.com/pc-gaming-headset
http://www.audio-technica.com/cgi-bin/product_search/headphones/headphones_cat.pl?select_multiple_3=Gaming Headsets

you can save money by building your own headset

what is this black magic?

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0042A68R8/?tag=tec06d-20
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0045JHJSS/?tag=tec06d-20

for a microphone there are different ways to go about it

http://www.modmic.com/collections/frontpage/products/modmic-3-0
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004QJREXM/?tag=tec06d-20
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000EOPQ7E/?tag=tec06d-20

these microphones are becoming increasingly popular with gamers. I see them all the time on peoples desks. please don't buy a PC Gaming headset unless you enjoy the revolving door.


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## -1nf1n1ty- (Jan 26, 2014)

If you're looking for a new headset, I would always personally stray away from Razer. I had my fair share when they started making the headphones and those old mice (Barracuda, Piranha, Copperhead, Lachesis, Diamondback)and the only thing I could recommend from Razer if I had to is probably the Piranha for audio and the Copperhead but they all broke pretty easily :\ . I treat my products very well, but I can honestly say they still make pretty lacking products in my opinion. The price tag is just way to overpriced for quality, its just I think Razer just got so popular and people just buy it and go "IT GLOWS". Razer is what I always stay away from nowadays, as well as turtle beach(I heard good things but never experienced those good things), and Astro (except their mixamp really).
Like mice, I feel that it starts coming down to what is comfortable. I had an AD700 for a good couple of years and just recently upgraded to a AKG Q701. Both great headphones and I can't stress that enough.

I wore the new logitech headsets at a bestbuy and they were REALLY good:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00BFOEY4I/?tag=tec06d-20

Steelseries Siberias v2 are just flat out amazing:
http://www.amazon.com/SteelSeries-Siberia-Full-Size-Gaming-Headset/dp/B005HGBDBM/ref=sr_1_35?ie=UTF8&qid=1390722950&sr=8-35&keywords=headset gaming

never had a Plantronics headset that didn't sound good:
http://www.amazon.com/Plantronics-GameCom-780-Surround-Headset/dp/B00B1KJK22/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1390722924&sr=8-8&keywords=headset gaming

Corsair is also a good brand:
http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Vengeance-1500-Headset-v2/dp/B00EXPNFQO/ref=sr_1_191?ie=UTF8&qid=1390723113&sr=8-191&keywords=headset gaming

But all in all we all have different preferences and what we think we want/need. There have been times I couldn't find a better pair of headphones than my AD700s in terms of gaming. For a while I was ready to buy a second pair of AD700s (AD700x I think) decided to go for Q701 and just saved. If I were you I would either save to get a true pair of headphones that come with what you want like the AD700 or something easy to drive or just flat out find the fatality headphones again. So in the end my conclusion a lot of the "gaming headsets" sound all the same....like it's muddy or too much bass and it isn't clean.

EDIT: and I noticed you made your decision already well damn I was late lol


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## MT Alex (Jan 26, 2014)

BumbleBee said:


> please don't buy a PC Gaming headset unless you enjoy the revolving door.



I realize that the OP has already made a choice, but I couldn't agree more.  Everyone is mentioning multiple headsets they have had to replace, and it makes me a little flabbergasted.  My AD700s are four years old and I'm sure I'll get another four out of them.  It doesn't take very many mediocre headsets to equal the price of decent headphones, and they they wipe the floor with anything mentioned earlier in this thread.


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## newconroer (Jan 26, 2014)

Lots of great replies here, and some thought provoking as well - thanks to this I can confidently try various headsets in the future should I need to.

I appreciate that gaming headsets do not equate proper headphones. I've picked the Carcharias because they were recommended as durable, comfortable and slightly better than HS800s in quality.
In the meantime I will seek out more appropriate headphones for when I am not on the mic.


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## BumbleBee (Jan 26, 2014)

here is a hot tip. the Sennheiser HD518 ($79) I linked use the same driver and build as the Sennheiser HD598 ($250). it sounds different because Sennheiser uses different dampening and other materials inside the ear chamber. Sennheiser acoustic engineers are very clever.


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## BumbleBee (Jan 26, 2014)

this is the HD518







this is the HD598






both the HD598 and HD558






Sennheiser updated the driver cover at some point to a solid one but other than that it's the same as the transparent one.

the grills on all three of them are different.






the HD518 has a weird plastic grill with adhered logo. the HD558 has a piece of stocking over a plastic grill with adhered logo and the HD598 has a metal grill with painted logo.

the dampening materials are also different

the HD518 has a piece of black fabric and spider web structure.
the HD558 has a piece of foam tape, black fabric and honey comb structure.
the HD598 has a piece of paper and spider web structure.

all these minor differences give each headphone it's unique sound signature.


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## FreedomEclipse (Jan 26, 2014)

I owned a pair of HS800s for about 5 mins before selling it to a friend. Didnt like the sound of it at all. Siberia V2s are great but they are more expensive than the HS800s so you get what you pay for.


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## newconroer (Jan 26, 2014)

Freedom, what did you not like about HS800?
I see you have a dedicated sound card. Did you enable 5.1? Did you try Razer surround?

I found that as a pair of plug and play stereo headphones, the HS800 were nothing special. It was when I used my Xonar software to do a 5.1 positioning and did a manual equalizer profile, that it increased ten fold(Note, not Dolby simulated - that's awful and reverberates badly).
I later added Razer surround to fine tune some of the stereo and bass enhancements.


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## BumbleBee (Jan 26, 2014)

i'm going to try and do a headphone giveaway in a couple months if erocker ever messages me back. I want to buy a couple Sennheiser HD518 or Grado SR60i to help increase awareness because this forum sure needs it.


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## FreedomEclipse (Jan 26, 2014)

newconroer said:


> Freedom, what did you not like about HS800?
> I see you have a dedicated sound card. Did you enable 5.1? Did you try Razer surround?



I just didnt like the sound of them. they came across slightly muffled with not much in the way of mids or highs, tweaking the EQ just made them worse as they started to distort. I couldnt get the clear and crisp sound that i was looking for but they only cost me £20 anyway and i sold it for the same price so no loss on my part.

My friend isnt as anal about his sound as i am so i let him have it as he wanted a headset anyway


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## newconroer (Jan 26, 2014)

We shall see then concerning the Carcharias, as I was mentioning to GT, I am told they are a bit hollow in the mid range. Maybe a bit of EQ will warm them up.


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## BumbleBee (Jan 26, 2014)

oh you mean hot garbage


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## TheMailMan78 (Jan 26, 2014)

MT Alex said:


> I realize that the OP has already made a choice, but I couldn't agree more.  Everyone is mentioning multiple headsets they have had to replace, and it makes me a little flabbergasted.  My AD700s are four years old and I'm sure I'll get another four out of them.  It doesn't take very many mediocre headsets to equal the price of decent headphones, and they they wipe the floor with anything mentioned earlier in this thread.


Some of us have bigger heads than others.......


I had a set of BOSE for 6 years. Loved em. Just cannot afford another set. I KNOW OMG BOSE WHAT JUNK! But.....they lasted 6 years with rough use.


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## Solaris17 (Jan 26, 2014)

I had a pair of Caracharias both of them broke left side damage and lost sound in the left headphone. I resoldered the lead and it was fine. then I lost mic gain and switched to my current set of kaves. They are great comfy and work fantastic but the bass is a little lacking though I havent found it to be too much of a concern. I really like siberias and really considered them as well though.


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## newconroer (Jan 26, 2014)

Thanks Solaris,

At what spot did they break? Could you circle it on a picture? Despite the solid framed shape of my HS800, none of the three have bent or cracked in anyway.


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## Solaris17 (Jan 26, 2014)

It didnt physically break it looked fine on the outside. the wires inside solder to a PCB on the inside of the can and they are short by nature so they break off of the PCB.


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## newconroer (Jan 26, 2014)

Ah I see what you mean now about soldering the lead.
Well let's hope I don't have to bust her out within the first year.


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## -1nf1n1ty- (Jan 27, 2014)

newconroer said:


> Lots of great replies here, and some thought provoking as well - thanks to this I can confidently try various headsets in the future should I need to.
> 
> I appreciate that gaming headsets do not equate proper headphones. I've picked the Carcharias because they were recommended as durable, comfortable and slightly better than HS800s in quality.
> In the meantime I will seek out more appropriate headphones for when I am not on the mic.


My friend had the Carcharias and drove them into the ground, did they break? no, they still are fine aside from not being able to hear on one side and the mic completely killed itself. So is it a good headset? oh yeah if it lasted him that long hell yeah, would I personally buy it? lol no, like I said I stay away from Razer. Just wanted to give you insight on your purchase and let you know, YES you made a good one, in the future I would get an AD700 and feel/hear the difference the only things that broke on my AD700s were the wings but I am willing the bet you could replace it, I ended up giving them to my Dad since he's a big sound guy (likes speakers home theater stuff)He loves them even after they've been burned in for 4+ years it's crazy.


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## v12dock (Jan 27, 2014)

Excellent headphones + Excellent Mic is what I am currently using
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000E9VKUQ/?tag=tec06d-20 + http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000EOPQ7E/?tag=tec06d-20


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## newconroer (Jan 28, 2014)

Hey v12, yes that exact combination was suggested to me already and I look forward to upgrading to it in the near future.



-1nf1n1ty- said:


> My friend had the Carcharias and drove them into the ground, did they break? no, they still are fine aside from not being able to hear on one side and the mic completely killed itself. So is it a good headset? oh yeah if it lasted him that long hell yeah, would I personally buy it? lol no, like I said I stay away from Razer. Just wanted to give you insight on your purchase and let you know, YES you made a good one, in the future I would get an AD700 and feel/hear the difference the only things that broke on my AD700s were the wings but I am willing the bet you could replace it, I ended up giving them to my Dad since he's a big sound guy (likes speakers home theater stuff)He loves them even after they've been burned in for 4+ years it's crazy.



Very kind of you, thanks.


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## remixedcat (Feb 9, 2014)

I have this:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0016MNAAI/?tag=tec06d-20
and this is my DAC/amp
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003N0XDT4/?tag=tec06d-20

I plan on getting a yeti mic for my recordings. 


The setup I have is awesome for gaming. I love these headphones becuase they are bass-head ones and they work awesomely for gaming!


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## newconroer (Feb 9, 2014)

Hey Remixed. Thanks. I've already upgraded since then.

Glad it works for you.


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## remixedcat (Feb 9, 2014)

You're welcome


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## MakeDeluxe (Feb 9, 2014)

^^ Hafta ask, how do those DT 770's feel on your head? Do they move around when you shake your head and so forth?


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## remixedcat (Feb 9, 2014)

Comfyyyyyy ^___^


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## Kovoet (Feb 9, 2014)

They are definitely comfy. I prefer the qpad qh~90


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## Doc41 (Feb 9, 2014)

I have the same headphone as in the picture of the first post, less than a month ago i asked in the forum for opinions on a new one but got negative feedback on the razer's i mentioned (apparently most of their products break quickly)
after some research i got an HD 518, it doesn't have a mic but i don't use it anyway and everything else was way better than the creative, i didn't personally try razer headset's but i'm quite happy with my purchase as it will stay with me for a long time.

anyway good luck and enjoy your new headset


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