# Very inconsistent latency (20ms-1000ms)



## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

Hello everyone

One minute my internet will be completely fine, the next it will lag like crazy. This started happening maybe a week ago. Ususally the spikes last for a few seconds at a time or similar. I have tried restarting my connection, but that does not work. I have yet to talk with my ISP, but I will do that as soon as possible. I'd appreciate it if you could help me determine if this problem is in fact coming from my ISP or my own system.

I am the only person who uses my connection and I am using a cable connection. I have a Netgear CG3000 modem which is maybe one or two years old.

Here are some of the things I have tried:

Speedtest:






My upload speed is supposed to be higher than this. I don't remember exactly, but at least 10mb/s instead of 2. Every speedtest I run seems to give me a result similar to this. For some reason, when it tests the upload, it takes a while, and it goes up to 6-7mb/s, but then it gives me this result of around 2 MB/s in the end. Sometimes the test just hangs and doesn't finish when trying to determine the upload, which never used to happen before.

Pingtest:















These tests were completed just a few minutes apart. As you can see the connection is very unstable. I can't test packet loss because of some problem with Java apparently, but I figured that it isn't necessarily very relevant.

Traceroute:


Amazon.co.uk



Techpowerup.com





I'm not really sure what the red ones on the techpowerup trace is, but I'm assuming that's because I'm located in Denmark and the server is far away or something. Anyway, I can see that my ISP which is the one with "tdc.net" at the end is actually a bit laggy with 49ms and 105ms max. I don't understand how that could cause my insane ping, though. Still, I'm leaning towards the problem being on their end, but to be honest I am clueless. If there's anything else I should try please let me know.

Hopefully you can shed some light on this!


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## remixedcat (Nov 21, 2014)

have you looked into getting a new modem and router as seperate components? those perform better.


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## Frick (Nov 21, 2014)

Yeah it's elsewhere probably. Do traceroutes and hope you find where it fails, to have something good to show the ISP. Use the same IP every time (it might take different routes though, but at least there's some consistency). It looks like it's fine in your neighbourhood.



remixedcat said:


> have you looked into getting a new modem and router as seperate components? those perform better.



It will matter squat if it's a router/switch somewhere not doing it's job.


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## Aquinus (Nov 21, 2014)

100ms to get to TechPowerUp and back from your location isn't unrealistic. The spikes need to be caught when they occur and a traceroute should tell you where the slowdown occurs, but nothing here stands out to me.

Poor HFC signals can cause this issue. If the modem/router has logs, it may indicate a problem. I know that Motorola surfboards will.


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

Thank you for the very quick replies!



remixedcat said:


> have you looked into getting a new modem and router as seperate components? those perform better.



I have not. My ISP gave me this modem when I bought the connection. I guess I could try it.



Frick said:


> Yeah it's elsewhere probably. Do traceroutes and hope you find where it fails, to have something good to show the ISP. Use the same IP every time (it might take different routes though, but at least there's some consistency). It looks like it's fine in your neighbourhood.



Are there some specific IP's or websites that you suggest I should try tracerouting? What about the techpowerup traceroute where it shows a max ping of 105 from my ISP? Is that something to show them? Appreciate the help!


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## remixedcat (Nov 21, 2014)

Get them to help you as well that's what you pay extra fees for... milk em! get new hardware on their bill if you can lol


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

Should I just keep traceroute running on amazon.co.uk for a while or something else? I'm sorry I'm not really sure how best to do it and what exactly to look for.  Every time I run traceroute after seeing the really high ping on pingtest, the traceroute doesn't show a high ping at all.


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## eidairaman1 (Nov 21, 2014)

Phone (rj11), ethernet (rj45)or cable router?


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

eidairaman1 said:


> Phone (rj11), ethernet (rj45)or cable router?


It's this one:
http://www.netgear.dk/service-providers/products/cable/gateways/cg3000-cg3100.aspx

And yes I am using cable


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## eidairaman1 (Nov 21, 2014)

Netgears are pretty good.

Do you have internet only or tv service too?


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

eidairaman1 said:


> Netgears are pretty good.
> 
> Do you have internet only or tv service too?


I have TV with them as well, but it's not set up through the same connection if that makes sense. It doesn't go through the same plug. I've had this TV service for a good 5-6 years I believe and only got this internet maybe 2 years ago.


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## eidairaman1 (Nov 21, 2014)

does your TV service run on coax, did you have a packaged deal for TV/internet

Topology for Coax Based setups at least in the US is, You have a coax drop line running from a Tap (whether aerial/buried in front or back yard) up to the home to normally a phone box, from there it attaches to a splitter/diplexer or to a piece of coax going from outside to inside of attic/crawlspace to a splitter/diplexer, then to your cable lines going to coax jacks in the home.

Kinks in the coax, improperly terminated f-connector ends (Mounted improperly on the coax wire), not tightened down f-connectors on the barrels, non high freq/multi freq barrels being used, old splitters/diplexers, even a stray coax line going to the splitter/diplexer (no box on it/ nothing terminated on it) can cause erratic connectivity/errors. Even the drop going to the tap not being tightened properly or damaged can cause problems, short term or in the long run


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## Aquinus (Nov 21, 2014)

g0aky said:


> I have TV with them as well, but it's not set up through the same connection if that makes sense. It doesn't go through the same plug. I've had this TV service for a good 5-6 years I believe and only got this internet maybe 2 years ago.



Maybe this will help: http://kb.netgear.com/app/answers/d...vel-guidelines-for-netgear-cable-modem-router

As it suggests, login to your modem/router and check the connection single strength. That will tell us if it's the coax at fault. Also recently my daughter had pulled at the coax for my internet too much as well and I needed to replace the cable as the internet was intermittently cutting out due to a damaged cable. The signal strength reflected that though.


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## eidairaman1 (Nov 21, 2014)

RG6 is highly recommended


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## Athlonite (Nov 21, 2014)

you also need to do those tracerts to the same ISP's you used in your ping tests otherwise they're meaning less


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

Aquinus said:


> Maybe this will help: http://kb.netgear.com/app/answers/d...vel-guidelines-for-netgear-cable-modem-router
> 
> As it suggests, login to your modem/router and check the connection single strength. That will tell us if it's the coax at fault. Also recently my daughter had pulled at the coax for my internet too much as well and I needed to replace the cable as the internet was intermittently cutting out due to a damaged cable. The signal strength reflected that though.



Is this it?





EDIT: Right now the connection seems to be stable. Should I post this screenshot when I feel that it becomes unstable or should that not matter?


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

eidairaman1 said:


> does your TV service run on coax, did you have a packaged deal for TV/internet
> 
> Topology for Coax Based setups at least in the US is, You have a coax drop line running from a Tap (whether aerial/buried in front or back yard) up to the home to normally a phone box, from there it attaches to a splitter/diplexer or to a piece of coax going from outside to inside of attic/crawlspace to a splitter/diplexer, then to your cable lines going to coax jacks in the home.
> 
> Kinks in the coax, improperly terminated f-connector ends (Mounted improperly on the coax wire), not tightened down f-connectors on the barrels, non high freq/multi freq barrels being used, old splitters/diplexers, even a stray coax line going to the splitter/diplexer (no box on it/ nothing terminated on it) can cause erratic connectivity/errors. Even the drop going to the tap not being tightened properly or damaged can cause problems, short term or in the long run



The cable that goes to my TV looks like this:


It was not a package deal. This internet setup is much more recent than my TV setup.

My internet setup looks like this (without the TV cable):





Not sure how helpful that is. I don't really know how it's set up beyond this box.

Also right now I'm pinging google.com and it shows this:





So the ping is actually fine, but the connection keeps timing out? This also happens if I ping other IPs like techpowerup. Again not sure how helpful this is, but I thought it was worth mentioning.


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## Aquinus (Nov 21, 2014)

Can you try pinging your router to make sure it's not timing out on your local network? If you're okay in your own network I would do a traceroute to google and ping each hop to see if the drops start showing up.


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## HTC (Nov 21, 2014)

Next time you encounter instability with the connection, make sure you do speedtest provided by your ISP: my ISP has a speedtest page on their site that they can monitor WHILE i'm doing the speedtest.

Try proving (screenies) to your ISP that there IS instability with the connection, but *make sure* there is nothing in you computer causing this (to not get an extra invoice later) so you can have the ISP do their job: fix the problem.

EDIT

A while back my connection got lost and nothing i did worked to get it back. I ended up calling my ISP and, after a while, they said they couldn't fix the problem and told me to call their "partner in crime" tech service (a paid service that is very expensive) and i was on the phone for nearly 29 minutes trying to sort out the problem.

Turns out that 1 of 3 settings they have on THEIR system which i can NOT access was different the the other 2 (all 3 settings are supposed to be the same)and that was causing me no internet so, once that was corrected, i got internet back.

Later, when the monthly invoice came, i got quite a lot more on my phone to pay because of THAT phone call so a went to their store and made a written complain: i had lost internet because of an incorrect setting on THEIR end which i have NO ACCESS to and it required me to made a lenghty EXPENSIVE phone call in order to fix a problem that was NOT MY FAULT.

The next invoice, i had quite a discount to compensate for the extra i had paid in the previous invoice.


Unlike me, you still have internet BUT, if it's not like it's supposed to be and *you're sure there's nothing wrong with your system*, you're not getting what you're paying for, so complain to them and have them fix it.


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

Aquinus said:


> Can you try pinging your router to make sure it's not timing out on your local network? If you're okay in your own network I would do a traceroute to google and ping each hop to see if the drops start showing up.



 

Not sure what to take from this. If I am doing something wrong please let me know.


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

HTC said:


> Next time you encounter instability with the connection, make sure you do speedtest provided by your ISP: my ISP has a speedtest page on their site that they can monitor WHILE i'm doing the speedtest.
> 
> Try proving (screenies) to your ISP that there IS instability with the connection, but *make sure* there is nothing in you computer causing this (to not get an extra invoice later) so you can have the ISP do their job: fix the problem.



I have tried their speedtest and it seems to show almost exactly the same as speedtest.net.

There are usually three possible outcomes of both the tests:
1. 40+ download speed & 9-10 upload speed w/ 1ms ping
2. 40+ download speed & 1-4 upload speed w/ 10-20ms ping
3. 40+ download speed and then when it gets to the upload speed it just hangs and gets nowhere

As for something in my computer causing the problem, I don't know what that should be. Would love to hear some suggestions on what to do to check for it. I'm running AVG antivirus and formatted my pc fairly recently.


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## HTC (Nov 21, 2014)

g0aky said:


> *I have tried their speedtest and it seems to show almost exactly the same as speedtest.net.*
> 
> There are usually three possible outcomes of both the tests:
> 1. 40+ download speed & 9-10 upload speed w/ 1ms ping
> ...



But there IS a BIG difference: it's done with THEIR OWN speedtest so they can't dismiss it arguing it's a 3rd party test.


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## g0aky (Nov 21, 2014)

HTC said:


> But there IS a BIG difference: it's done with THEIR OWN speedtest so they can't dismiss it arguing it's a 3rd party test.


Alright, I understand.


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## Aquinus (Nov 22, 2014)

g0aky said:


> View attachment 60547
> 
> Not sure what to take from this. If I am doing something wrong please let me know.


Woah, what is that 10.50.0.1 network. I see two private subnets here which confuse me and consider they seem to begin with the 10.50.x.x address. 10.x.x.x is a private class A network. It is not used on the internet, just in local networks behind the NAT. The same is true of the 192.168.x.x network which is private and a class B network, as well as a special off case 172.16.0.0/12 (255.240.0.0) which contains 16 class Cs.

The point is that I see nested private networks which is confusing. Could you explain your *entire* network setup. I suspect your modem is not providing you with that 10.50.x.x address but rather something one the internet and that you have nested private networks in your own network and that you're dropping packets between your modem/router and another device server up another private subnet. Something feels like it may be configured incorrectly.

Edit: I would be super pissed off if my ISP wasn't giving me a real IP on the internet. That, in my personal opinion, is unacceptable.


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## g0aky (Nov 22, 2014)

Aquinus said:


> Woah, what is that 10.50.0.1 network. I see two private subnets here which confuse me and consider they seem to begin with the 10.50.x.x address. 10.x.x.x is a private class A network. It is not used on the internet, just in local networks behind the NAT. The same is true of the 192.168.x.x network which is private and a class B network, as well as a special off case 172.16.0.0/12 (255.240.0.0) which contains 16 class Cs.
> 
> The point is that I see nested private networks which is confusing. Could you explain your *entire* network setup. I suspect your modem is not providing you with that 10.50.x.x address but rather something one the internet and that you have nested private networks in your own network and that you're dropping packets between your modem/router and another device server up another private subnet. Something feels like it may be configured incorrectly.
> 
> Edit: I would be super pissed off if my ISP wasn't giving me a real IP on the internet. That, in my personal opinion, is unacceptable.



192.168.0.1 is my own router I believe. At least that is the IP I use in my browser to access the router. However, in the "modem status" in the router GUI it tells me that the "cable modem IP address is "10.50.0.50". Not too sure what that means.
As for my network setup, it is literally just a coax cable that goes into the plug in the wall, as shown in one of my previous posts in this thread, and from there to the modem and from there an ethernet cable to my PC. Don't know what else there could be.

Actually, I just remembered that I received a message one month ago and then another one 10 days ago about my ISP upgrading some gear in one of their centrals and that it would cause some disconnects those two nights. Is it possible that they configured something wrong that could cause this? I will call them tomorrow morning and explain the problems that I am having. Not sure I will be able to explain this weird thing with the subnets to them, but I'll try.

EDIT:

Could this event log be of any help? It seems there are a lot of errors and notices.


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## xvi (Nov 22, 2014)

Aquinus said:


> Woah, what is that 10.50.0.1 network. I see two private subnets here which confuse me and consider they seem to begin with the 10.50.x.x address. 10.x.x.x is a private class A network. It is not used on the internet, just in local networks behind the NAT. The same is true of the 192.168.x.x network which is private and a class B network, as well as a special off case 172.16.0.0/12 (255.240.0.0) which contains 16 class Cs.
> 
> The point is that I see nested private networks which is confusing. Could you explain your *entire* network setup. I suspect your modem is not providing you with that 10.50.x.x address but rather something one the internet and that you have nested private networks in your own network and that you're dropping packets between your modem/router and another device server up another private subnet. Something feels like it may be configured incorrectly.
> 
> Edit: I would be super pissed off if my ISP wasn't giving me a real IP on the internet. That, in my personal opinion, is unacceptable.


It's very possible that they're using 10. for management and internal routing. Normally, this is blocked by a firewall rule on the modem or gateway. Public IP merely routes through 10.x.x.x and comes out where peering happens. As long as you're assigned a public IP, it's nothing to worry about.



g0aky said:


>



Notice that latency jumps up considerably between Tele Danmark (tdc.net) and gtt.net, granted that it's not jumping up much. This implies that the peering connection between Tele Danmark peers and gtt.net is oversaturated. If in the future you see sub-100 ms latency up to that point and 1000+ ms latencies after it hands off to gtt.net, the issue is very likely due to Tele Danmark being out of bandwidth at that peering point. If that's the case, submit that screenshot to them and inform them you are seeing excessive latency and slow speeds and that traceroute reveals that the excessive latency starts between them and gtt.net.


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## g0aky (Nov 22, 2014)

xvi said:


> It's very possible that they're using 10. for management and internal routing. Normally, this is blocked by a firewall rule on the modem or gateway. Public IP merely routes through 10.x.x.x and comes out where peering happens. As long as you're assigned a public IP, it's nothing to worry about.
> 
> 
> 
> Notice that latency jumps up considerably between Tele Danmark (tdc.net) and gtt.net, granted that it's not jumping up much. This implies that the peering connection between Tele Danmark peers and gtt.net is oversaturated. If in the future you see sub-100 ms latency up to that point and 1000+ ms latencies after it hands off to gtt.net, the issue is very likely due to Tele Danmark being out of bandwidth at that peering point. If that's the case, submit that screenshot to them and inform them you are seeing excessive latency and slow speeds and that traceroute reveals that the excessive latency starts between them and gtt.net.



When you say that the latency jumps up between tdc.net and gtt.net do you mean the 7th hop? Also I am not sure how to go about checking when exactly the latency sky rockets, since whenever I ping servers the high ping doesn't really show. I think I am going to need some step by step if I am to do what you're saying.

Not sure if this is at all relevant but here is a newer traceroute where it shows gtt.net at the 7th hop:



I'm going to head to bed for now. I will look at the thread when I wake up. I really appreciate this help, you guys seem to know what you're talking about!


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## Aquinus (Nov 22, 2014)

xvi said:


> Notice that latency jumps up considerably between Tele Danmark (tdc.net) and gtt.net, granted that it's not jumping up much. This implies that the peering connection between Tele Danmark peers and gtt.net is oversaturated.



You mean the link that's going over submarine cable across the ocean from Denmark to NYC? Yeah, I would expect 100ms round trip on something like that. If you didn't notice he's losing packets on the 10.x.x.x network. I suspect there is a problem closer to home.


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## g0aky (Nov 22, 2014)

I just talked to my ISP and the woman I talked to said that the readings from the modem could indicate some sort of problem with it. I'll update after the technician has been here which will probably take a few days.


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## g0aky (Nov 24, 2014)

I borrowed a modem so I could narrow down the problem, and it seems my modem was the root of the problem. I tried with the borrowed modem and everything was completely fine. I also tried my old coax cable with the new modem and it still ran smoothly. I then talked to my again, and they will be sending me a new modem free of charge. 

I thank you all for the help, I appreciate it very much!


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