# Windows Store Games won't have VSync, SLI/CrossFire, Fullscreen or Modding



## btarunr (Feb 26, 2016)

Microsoft is looking to cut itself a lion's share of the game digital downloads pie, by making Microsoft Store (which comes included with Windows 10), sell contemporary AAA games, such as "Rise of the Tomb Raider." Unlike other cross-DRM transactions (eg: purchasing a Steam DLC game through UPlay store), Microsoft Store will serve both sales and DRM roles. You must be thinking "it's a free world, always room for more competition," right? Think again. There are several pitfallls to buying "Rise of the Tomb Raider" or any other AAA game through Microsoft Store, as users on Reddit found out.

To begin with, games purchased through Windows Store are built on Microsoft's Universal Apps Platform, and not the conventional desktop-based executable. The game is essentially a "modern UI" app, and not a conventional Windows application. This has great limitations - no NVIDIA SLI or AMD CrossFire support; no real fullscreen mode (just borderless windowed mode or pseudo-fullscreen); and V-sync being always-on. Other major downsides of UAP apps include no support for modding, and mouse macros. What's more, since UAP apps don't have *.exe extensions, you can't add them to Steam, and so no Steam Controller support. The Store in itself doesn't have a good refund policy along the lines of Steam and Origin limited full-refund policies; and you'll never be able to play your games on Windows versions older than Windows 10. 





*View at TechPowerUp Main Site*


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## vega22 (Feb 26, 2016)

games, for windows, live...


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## RCoon (Feb 26, 2016)

Microsoft are one of the most remarkably moronic companies on Earth.

Let me guess "This is for the PC gamers, we mean it this time, really!"


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## ZeppMan217 (Feb 26, 2016)

btarunr said:


> What's more, since UAP apps *aren't* don't have *.exe extensions


Small typo.

I guess MS just wants to pump Xbox exclusive into their store and hope it works out on its own. Also, Steam Controller will work just fine.


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## RejZoR (Feb 26, 2016)

Only a moron would buy a game from Windows Store when you can get exactly the same games from other way less moronic legit sources. Many of us got burned by the monumentaly retarded Games for Windows Live junk (and how games are not playable unles you're willing to hack that shit around). This, with even more limitations is just straight pissing on us PC gamers. Microsoft, you done fucked this up. Again.

My priority when buying games:

GOG > Steam > Origin

I'm not touching UPlay garbage and neither I'll be ever touching this crap.


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## FYFI13 (Feb 26, 2016)

If game isn't on Steam or Origin - i won't buy it. Ever. And I'm pretty sure Square Enix will release proper PC version as soon as they realize that nobody is using Windows Store.


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## P4-630 (Feb 26, 2016)

I'll never buy games from the windows store anyway

But I did had to modify GTA IV with xliveless to get it working because of a dead stupid GFWL which made the game unplayable.


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## hellrazor (Feb 26, 2016)

Microsoft's riding the short bus, like always.


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## RejZoR (Feb 26, 2016)

P4-630 said:


> I'll never buy games from the windows store anyway
> 
> But I did had to modify GTA IV with xliveless to get it working because of a dead stupid GFWL which made the game unplayable.



Though Rockstar's moronic GTA5 downloader isn't any better. It's stupid, clumsy and useless and will cause problems in the future for sure. Every such retarded system did. Only one that works and will continue to work is Steam. Because they invest into it A LOT and that's why it works.


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## P4-630 (Feb 26, 2016)

RejZoR said:


> Though Rockstar's moronic GTA5 downloader isn't any better. It's stupid, clumsy and useless and will cause problems in the future for sure. Every such retarded system did. Only one that works and will continue to work is Steam. Because they invest into it A LOT and that's why it works.



Luckily I have GTA V on steam as most of my games, the only downside I see from steam is that you can only play games for 2 weeks without internet connection IIRC.


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## zzzaac (Feb 26, 2016)

URgh, and they plan on releasing Gears of War, Quantum Break, Recore and potentially Forza like this


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## RejZoR (Feb 26, 2016)

zzzaac said:


> URgh, and they plan on releasing Gears of War, Quantum Break, Recore and potentially Forza like this



And then they'll complain how people don't buy them and how PC gaming is dead. Mark my words.


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## Ubersonic (Feb 26, 2016)

Lol, my Windows Store randomly stopped working and any apps I try and open just fail so no intention of getting any games from there even if they do fix it


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## Frick (Feb 26, 2016)

I like the idea of a Windows app store and I do like that they really want it to be universal. That is good. Small, casual games, like whatever equivalent to Farmville they have these days, are perfect for it (especially if they make it truly cross platform), but I don't see how they can make it work good with the AA games.


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## AsRock (Feb 26, 2016)

hellrazor said:


> Microsoft's riding the short bus, like always.



Gets me though they say they support PC gaming and yet still manage to piss all PC gamer's off.

Sadly still 20 some years and no replacement for MS OS, what a shame.  But i guess it's finally getting there as i know i would drop MS OS in a heat beat.


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## qubit (Feb 26, 2016)

Without those headline features those games sound rubbish and not worth bothering with. Once again Microsoft shoots itself in the foot with its app store.


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## Siskods9 (Feb 26, 2016)

No multi-GPU or V-Sync or Fullscreen support means I wont buy any games from the Windows store.
Shame really as I was going to buy Gears of War Ultimate Edition and Quantum break from them but not now though.
I will also buy Rise of The Tomb Raider from STEAM instead.
How stupid is Microsoft??? Seems they just can't help themselves.
Listen to your customers or pay the price. Simple as.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 26, 2016)

The sad part is that the sheeple will gobble it up.


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## RejZoR (Feb 26, 2016)

And Microsoft Studios used to be a synonym for quality in the past. If you think of it, they made quite some really good games, some of which were hugely popular and respected, like Midtown Madness which sort of began the GTA series in 3D and Motocross Madness. And then they flop like this with idiotic decisions. Lol.


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 26, 2016)

FYFI13 said:


> And I'm pretty sure Square Enix will release proper PC version as soon as they realize that nobody is using Windows Store.



They already did.  Rise of The Tomb Raider has been out a month on Steam.


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## truth teller (Feb 26, 2016)

btarunr said:


> V-sync being always-on


thats fine with me



btarunr said:


> no NVIDIA SLI or AMD CrossFire support





btarunr said:


> no real fullscreen mode


what da? i havent yet touched the win10 metro sdk, but for god sake its 2016, how come the underlying layer can't interact nicely with the drivers?



btarunr said:


> no support for modding


this one takes the cake, so they are making a completely different packaging system for the games, must be fun, at least with steams system you can still accomplish stuff


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Feb 26, 2016)

This is bad news for the upcoming Gears of War Ultimate Edition PC release as it was spotted on the Windows Store earlier in the week.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 26, 2016)

truth teller said:


> what da? i havent yet touched the win10 metro sdk, but for god sake its 2016, how come the underlying layer can't interact nicely with the drivers?


Probably because the apps run in a virtual machine a la .NET Framework.  Directly accessing the underlying hardware is forbidden for safety sake which inadvertently breaks things like Crossfire/SLI.  At the same time, DirectX 12 supports multi-GPU capabilities so, as long as the game itself is coded to support multi-GPUs, it will probably still do it.  It just isn't SLI/Crossfire per say.

V-sync being required is likely a condition that stems from Surface and the like.  V-sync stops the hardware from running hot/high battery drain because the GPU only does what is necessary.  The same extends to consoles so, universal apps require universal agreement on framerate caps.

Windows Store is a walled garden so no mods/third party extensions being forbidden is not surprising.  I'm sure it could do it but Windows Store likely validates the program before launching so security features forbid modification.


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## ShurikN (Feb 26, 2016)

A fine example of the phrase "Dead on Arrival". Or in this case before arrival.


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 26, 2016)

The introduction of more games into the Windows Store that are not MS Sudios really makes me think that Gabe's prediction a few years back of the windows Store "walled garden" and future exclusion of Steam or any other platform on Windows has some merit down the line.  All MS has to do is get enough publishers to sign on for the Windows Store, and the prediction has credibility.

Granted, it could be years down the line, but it's worth keeping an eye on.


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## HM_Actua1 (Feb 26, 2016)

Wow, not that I was really interested in this but now I'm totally put off. GSYNC or VR really does perform better in fullscreen mode, then to force Vsync on. that just kills both types of VR all together. MS pull your heads out people!


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## MxPhenom 216 (Feb 26, 2016)

rtwjunkie said:


> The introduction of more games into the Windows Store that are not MS Sudios really makes me think that Gabe's prediction a few years back of the windows Store "walled garden" and future exclusion of Steam or any other platform on Windows has some merit down the line.  All MS has to do is get enough publishers to sign on for the Windows Store, and the prediction has credibility.
> 
> Granted, it could be years down the line, but it's worth keeping an eye on.



And that is when i go to Linux.....unfortunately


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## medi01 (Feb 26, 2016)

*Dialogs leaked from Valve's (Steampowered) Headquarters
*
- Hey, Microsoft is going to sell games on Windows store, what can we do to not have our lazy monopolistic ass that grabs nearly 30% of PC gaming market revenue pwned?
- Let's counter with Linux to get gamers off Windows platform!
- By investing into Vulcan (OpenGL) et al?
- Nah, let's have another Linux distro that would allow you to stream games from your windows machine
- Oh, yeah! That will show them! DirectX, we are coming!!!

For some reason, that didn't quite work.

- Hey, what about Steam machine?
- To use with streaming?
- Yeah, but maybe also with Windows!
- Heh, but don't we want to fight Windows?
- Oh, right, let's release overpriced "Steam Machines" that would allow people to stream games from their Windows Machines!
- That will show them!

For some reason, that didn't quite work.

- Hey, maybe we should also take on PS4 and XBone, what about inventing a controller?
- Right, let's make something that lookes kinda like owl and works like half ***ed mouse.
- Hell yeah! Sony, Microsoft, WE ARE COMING!!!

For some reason, that didn't quite work.

- OMG, Microsoft is actually starting to sell games on Windows Store, what are we going to do?
- Let's start FUD campaign!

Yay...





rtwjunkie said:


> He predicted its use as a walled garden



Walled garden "omg this won't work", "omg that won't work" is nothing but part of the FUD campaign.

Valve is too big, you need godzilla to take on it. That's what Microsoft is in this case.

Microsoft does NOT need to create any walls.
Neither would it even try to ban third party applications from its platform. (that would get them insta pwned by EU and company)

They would want to leverage their position to get a nice share of the market.
The way Google did (and does).
Definitely not the way Apple did (and does).


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 26, 2016)

medi01 said:


> - OMG, Microsoft is actually starting to sell games on Windows Store, what are we going to do?
> - Let's start FUD campaign!





To be fair though, tall those actions were following Valve people looking closely at the architecture of Windows 8, before they started the games in the Windows store.  He predicted its use as a walled garden and the exclusion of other features/platforms. 

So, back then, people thought it was FUD, but I'm thinking now, 3 years later, maybe not so much.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Feb 26, 2016)

rtwjunkie said:


> To be fair though, tall those actions were following Valve people looking closely at the architecture of Windows 8, before they started the games in the Windows store.  He predicted its use as a walled garden and the exclusion of other features/platforms.
> 
> So, back then, people thought it was FUD, but I'm thinking now, 3 years later, maybe not so much.



If it really does happen, microsoft could essentially kill gaming on windows based pc's in one fell swoop.


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## 64K (Feb 26, 2016)

I'm suspicious of MS anyway based on their past behavior towards PC gamers but they really do have the potential to go evil on PC gamers. Coerce people onto Win 10. Make DX12 popular with gamers and developers over time and then tighten their grip on us by making the games that use DX12 only available from the Windows Store. I'm not even sure if they could legally do that or if they have any plan to do that in the future though.


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## morphy (Feb 26, 2016)

so long Quantum Break...it was nice knowing ya.


Quantum break sales on Xbone: 99%
PC: 1%
Headlines: PC is dying!!!


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## Frick (Feb 26, 2016)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Probably because the apps run in a virtual machine a la .NET Framework.  Directly accessing the underlying hardware is forbidden for safety sake which inadvertently breaks things like Crossfire/SLI.  At the same time, DirectX 12 supports multi-GPU capabilities so, as long as the game itself is coded to support multi-GPUs, it will probably still do it.  It just isn't SLI/Crossfire per say.
> 
> V-sync being required is likely a condition that stems from Surface and the like.  V-sync stops the hardware from running hot/high battery drain because the GPU only does what is necessary.  The same extends to consoles so, universal apps require universal agreement on framerate caps.
> 
> Windows Store is a walled garden so no mods/third party extensions being forbidden is not surprising.  I'm sure it could do it but Windows Store likely validates the program before launching so security features forbid modification.



Makes me wonder why they bother with the AAA games to begin with. It's a good platform for apps, as I said, but ... I mean deep interaction with the hardware is what games is about. Or rather drivers. I wonder if the games performs differently?


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## lemkeant (Feb 26, 2016)

Man...rough article. Makes it sounds like all of the this permanent and could never be fixed/added. We all know that isnt true. It's not like Steam, Origin, and UPlay 1.0 were flawless and never fixed anything/added features.

I dont want an Xbox but do want to play Gears of War, Quantum Break, etc. So I think this is a pretty decent effort to get their platform off of the ground.

I'll be the minority but I'll buy what I want to buy and play what I want to play. Its not like the games are broken in some way


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## FYFI13 (Feb 26, 2016)

MxPhenom 216 said:


> And that is when i go to Linux.....unfortunately


I'm playing on Linux already as most of my games working perfectly fine (Minecraft, Team Fortress, Left 4 Dead, Counter Strike, 7 Days 2 Die, Ark: survival Evolved, Rust, Dying Light, Borderlands and few other). If Arma 3 (or 4) ever gets proper Linux support i format my Windows partition straight away. I am aware of Arma 3 port for Linux, but no Battleye and game version 1.42 is a deal breaker for me as i play Arma online only.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 26, 2016)

rtwjunkie said:


> The introduction of more games into the Windows Store that are not MS Sudios really makes me think that Gabe's prediction a few years back of the windows Store "walled garden" and future exclusion of Steam or any other platform on Windows has some merit down the line.  All MS has to do is get enough publishers to sign on for the Windows Store, and the prediction has credibility.
> 
> Granted, it could be years down the line, but it's worth keeping an eye on.


Valve will sue and likely win if Microsoft's behavior represents a barrier to entry.  CD Projekt, Electronic Arts, and Ubisoft would likely get in on that suit.  I hope it happens because walled gardens of all types are anti-competitive.

And remember, the last time Microsoft tried this (Games for Windows Live), it failed miserably.



I'll take freebies from the Windows Store (e.g. Minecraft for Windows) but I ain't ever giving them a dime.


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## Sasqui (Feb 26, 2016)

RCoon said:


> Microsoft are one of the most remarkably moronic companies on Earth.



Amen to that brother.  I'm a Win 7 holdout anyways, so I'll stick to Steam, thank you.


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## morphy (Feb 26, 2016)

Haven't they learned anything from the TV and movie industry?
No wonder ppl resort to piracy not that I am condoning it.

Instead if they made it more accessible with reasonable pricing without having users jump thru hoops consumers are more than willing to pay for it.

This is like Sony making all their new BluRay releases only playable on 2016 BDR models only. They would be hanged!
I use Windows all my life (win7 atm) but for the first time I just wish this company would just go into obsolescence like my old VCRs and Blackberrys.


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## TheGuruStud (Feb 26, 2016)

I've been saying it for YEARS! Microsoft is trying to kill PC gaming.

They only pretend to support it (as evidenced based on DX being shit forever and ruining studios/games).

I almost forgot the best part: They will blame us for the downfall of PC gaming b/c we won't buy/support this shit. Kind of like ubisoft blaming piracy for their shitty games (they want to be console only too).


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 26, 2016)

They aren't "trying to kill PC gaming."  They're trying to appeal to the masses.  Windows Store only really serves one purpose and that's exposure--the same as Google Play and Apple Store.  Publishers are still going to release on many platforms because more platforms mean more exposure.

The only problem I see is that Micosoft isn't going to release Microsoft titles anywhere except Windows Store.  The only one Microsoft is hurting is Microsoft.  Microsoft should have learned their lesson with Games for Windows Live.  Microsoft should be well aware now that putting Xbox in charge of PC game publishing is horrible idea.  Microsoft doesn't learn so sales via Windows Store will pale in comparison to other digital distributors.  By extension, Microsoft's self-published titles will do extremely poorly because they refuse to put it on other markets like Steam, GOG, and Origin.

As been stated, Microsoft will blame piracy rather than the true culprit: their walled garden market.  At the end of the day, there are two Microsoft's: headquarters and Xbox division.  Headquarters won't do anything to jeopardize Windows gaming which means continuing to allow third party software to be installed on Windows.  The Xbox division will continue to prance around like a headless chicken.  As long as the division is still profitable through Xbox sales and licensing, I don't see the status quo changing.  Microsoft headquarters just doesn't care enough about PC gamers to fix their own Xbox division.  They have too many other sources of revenue to care.

The only way Microsoft fixes this is if they put Xbox division under the direction of the Windows division.  There's been so much brain drain (Lionhead is effectively dead, FASA Interactive is gone, Rare is deader than a door nail, Digital Anvil is gone, and so on) at Microsoft that doing so would almost certainly result in failure.  Except Halo, Fable, and Gears of War, all of the excellent IPs Microsoft aquired through all of those buyouts have been mostly collecting dust.


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 26, 2016)

TheGuruStud said:


> I've been saying it for YEARS! Microsoft is trying to kill PC gaming.
> 
> They only pretend to support it (as evidenced based on DX being shit forever and ruining studios/games).
> 
> I almost forgot the best part: They will blame us for the downfall of PC gaming b/c we won't buy/support this shit. Kind of like ubisoft blaming piracy for their shitty games (they want to be console only too).



Anybody who wants a good laugh, you've got to read RCoon's rant he put together on Microsofts' "love" of PC gaming from about 18 months ago. 

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/t...ts-love-for-pc-by-doing-nothing-at-e3.202172/

Microsoft could never convince me they've made an about face in 18 months


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## 64K (Feb 26, 2016)

rtwjunkie said:


> Anybody who wants a good laugh, you've got to read RCoon's rant he put together on Microsofts' "love" of PC gaming from about 18 months ago.
> 
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/t...ts-love-for-pc-by-doing-nothing-at-e3.202172/
> 
> Microsoft could never convince me they've made an about face in 18 months



I had forgotten about that. Funny stuff. If I could I would thank RCoon a second time for posting that.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 26, 2016)

I think Phil Spencer is 99% to blame.  Put someone in charge that understands Xbox & Windows gaming and both could prosper.  Until he's gone, Microsoft effectively isn't a player in the PC gaming market.  Well they are but there's indies out there with a larger presence...

...you know...

...like Robert Space Industries...

...that could have been developed by Microsoft...

...if Phil Spencer didn't screw over PC gamers in the name of Xbox.


Hell, look at Shadowrun.  Microsoft owns the IP so they're getting royalties on it but without Microsoft's vice-like grip on development and publishing, the series is doing really, really well.  Microsoft just needs to learn to back the !@#$ off.


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## ShurikN (Feb 26, 2016)

TheGuruStud said:


> I've been saying it for YEARS! Microsoft is trying to kill PC gaming.
> 
> They only pretend to support it (as evidenced based on DX being shit forever and ruining studios/games).



For the first time in many years DX is not shit.


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## Slizzo (Feb 26, 2016)

And to their credit, Phil @ Microsoft has said that they are looking to make improvements to Windows Store to make it more palatable than Windows Live! was years ago.


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## Finners (Feb 26, 2016)

The walled garden store, no multi GPU support and borderless window mode wouldn't really be the end of the world for me, but forced v-sync on is a big no-no. Shame as I was looking forward to playing through GoW but only once I could pick it up cheap.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 26, 2016)

Slizzo said:


> And to their credit, Phil @ Microsoft has said that they are looking to make improvements to Windows Store to make it more palatable than Windows Live! was years ago.


I think Spencer would call any move of Windows towards Xbox an "improvement."  Pretty much everyone at this community would not call that an "improvement."


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## R-T-B (Feb 26, 2016)

lemkeant said:


> Man...rough article. Makes it sounds like all of the this permanent and could never be fixed/added. We all know that isnt true. It's not like Steam, Origin, and UPlay 1.0 were flawless and never fixed anything/added features.



I'm not sure you understand.  These things aren't even exe's.  They use a completely proprietary blackmagic runtime.  Much of this could be architecturally required, and not fixable.

Steam never went this far.  I agree with the above posters, I'm getting pushed closer to linux every day...


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## FreedomEclipse (Feb 26, 2016)

Move along folks, nothing to see here.

Its Microsofts one time of the year when they crawl out from that XBOX shaped rock they've been hiding under for more than a decade with party hats, party poppers, balloons, trumpets and a massive foam glove with #PCMASTERRACE printed on it to let off some pent up steam, shout a few words about what they are doing that's great for the PC Platform/PC Gamers then go crawling back underneath their rock and do absolutely nothing until around the same time next year when the season is right and they come out of hibernation to perform the same part act and scream the same bullshit to the moon again before going back into hiding _hibernation.

_
Anything Microsoft says in regards to PC gaming should be taken with a C-130 packed so tight with salt, even the pilots & crew have shrivelled up into stickmen.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Feb 27, 2016)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I think Spencer would call any move of Windows towards Xbox an "improvement."  Pretty much everyone at this community would not call that an "improvement."



Microsoft is so out of touch with PC Gaming as a whole its sick.


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## HisDivineOrder (Feb 27, 2016)

FreedomEclipse said:


> Move along folks, nothing to see here.
> 
> Its Microsofts one time of the year when they crawl out from that XBOX shaped rock they've been hiding under for more than a decade with party hats, party poppers, balloons, trumpets and a massive foam glove with #PCMASTERRACE printed on it to let off some pent up steam, shout a few words about what they are doing that's great for the PC Platform/PC Gamers then go crawling back underneath their rock and do absolutely nothing until around the same time next year when the season is right and they come out of hibernation to perform the same part act and scream the same bullshit to the moon again before going back into hiding _hibernation.
> 
> ...




I disagree.  I think their reasoning is different.  Before, they did token support of Windows as a way to sell copies of Windows, but never at the risk of damaging their Xbox brand.  The switchover here is that Microsoft is now so twisted around, they're trying to use the popularity of PC gaming to prop up their nearly terminally damaged Xbox brand.

Look.

http://www.gamespot.com/videos/gs-news-update-rise-of-the-tomb-raider-first-month/2300-6429698/



> Research group Superdata today released its digital sales report for January 2016, revealing that Square Enix's Rise of the Tomb Raider sold nearly three times more copies on PC than on Xbox One.



That's right.  Xbox One sold less copies of Rise of the Tomb Raider, even after Fallout 4's fallout was over than the PC version.

Because everyone is buying the game on PC.  Microsoft needs to make Xbox on PC work if they hope to keep Xbox relevant.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 27, 2016)

I wouldn't read too far into that.  Fallout 4 launching on the same day trashed Rise of Tomb Raider sales on Xbox One.  Additionally, it isn't clear what the relationship is here between Square Enix and Microsoft.  There had to be some kind of deal for Xbox to gain temporary exclusivity but we don't know how invested Microsoft is in Rise of the Tomb Raider.  We also don't know if the Windows Store version of the title was part of that arrangement.


Let's assume that, given a platform, the number of reviewers is more or less even.  Windows Store version has 123 reviews; Steam has 8955 reviews.  It's pretty safe to assume that the bulk of the PC sales did not come from the Windows Store.  Microsoft said they are pleased with the sales figures so it is very possible Microsoft is blissfully unaware how poor Xbox and Windows Store numbers were compared to Steam.

Square Enix, on the other hand, would be very aware of how poorly Microsoft performed.  I think it's safe to assume Square Enix won't agree to another time-limited release with Microsoft.


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## ShurikN (Feb 27, 2016)

HisDivineOrder said:


> http://www.gamespot.com/videos/gs-news-update-rise-of-the-tomb-raider-first-month/2300-6429698/
> 
> That's right.  Xbox One sold less copies of Rise of the Tomb Raider, even after Fallout 4's fallout was over than the PC version.
> 
> Because everyone is buying the game on PC.  Microsoft needs to make Xbox on PC work if they hope to keep Xbox relevant.


They chose a really bad date to launch Rise of TR, and that affected the sales as a whole. Once the F4 chaos was over, TR came out on PC. And people basically chose the better platform. Plus there are more people who have only a PC as a gaming platform.


FordGT90Concept said:


> There had to be some kind of deal for Xbox to gain temporary exclusivity


Yeah and its called "mucho dinero"


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## natr0n (Feb 27, 2016)

rabble rabble rabble


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## Ubersonic (Feb 27, 2016)

Title should have read "Windows Store Games won't be any good"


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## raptori (Feb 27, 2016)

Deep interaction with the hardware is what games is about and what MS is telling us that DX12 will do , yet they come with this retard app store that kill games before its birth .... what a bunch of idiots , another reason to not buy anything from ms .


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## Octopuss (Feb 27, 2016)

I don't get it, are developers so retarded they would spend time programming special castrated versions of their games so they could be sold in shitty Microsoft store?


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## FYFI13 (Feb 27, 2016)

Octopuss said:


> I don't get it, are developers so retarded they would spend time programming special castrated versions of their games so they could be sold in shitty Microsoft store?


They aren't retarded, they're getting  paid for that. Pay me 30 euro/hour and I'll make you lick bananas and say "meow" while you sit in a tree. I have some experience on that. Their bosses are retarded.


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## 64K (Feb 27, 2016)

Octopuss said:


> I don't get it, are developers so retarded they would spend time programming special castrated versions of their games so they could be sold in shitty Microsoft store?



The video game industry is cut-throat for the most part. There are tens of billions of dollars up for grabs and no shortage of publishers willing to do whatever it takes to get a slice of that pie. There's plenty of blame to spread around but I think the lion's share of that blame goes to publishers and to us the gamers. The publishers because they push developers to rush games and we end up with unfinished buggy sometimes broken-ass games and us the gamers who having been burned over and over by a publisher's offerings go right on and pre-order or buy the next game right away anyway. It's a loop that pretty much guarantees the status quo. Some developers are lazy minded warts that try to coast on their rep though.


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## abundantcores (Feb 27, 2016)

Microsoft hate PC Gamers!

They see us as a threat to their Console cash-cow, probably blame us for the XBox One not doing as well as expected.

For the past decade they have been trying to hold back PC Game development with their DX API monopoly, DX11 was junk on the day it was released and it was junk for the decade they never updated it.

One could argue "but what about DX12"
Thanks to AMD Microsoft had no choice, had they not reacted to Mantle they would have lost their DX API Monopoly entirely, they would have lost all control of PC Gaming.
What they are doing here is trying to control it in another way, and then gimp the crap out of it.

Ever wondered why the XBox One originally ran on DX11?
That Mantle API was originally meant to be bundled with AMD XBox One hardware, but it had strings attached, that it would also become DX12, those were AMD's Terms, MS refused so they never got the API.
AMD released it for Desktop anyway knowing it would force MS to react.

The argument against that is "But MS said they started DX12 long before Mantle, they worked with Nvidia on it"

Think about that, really?

Are they saying AMD can get a working low level API out before Microsoft and Nvidia combined?
And even if it was true why then did AMD have big name developers queuing up behind AMD in support of something they say they had wanted for years with Microsoft refusing?

AMD made an enemy of Microsoft for not falling into line, Nvidia just thought they would suck up to MS for day to join them in having a stab at AMD.

And before you might say "you're just an AMD fanboi" My GPU is a GTX 970, my CPU is a 4690K

Oh and of course Ashes runs better on AMD, the API its running on (DX12) was originally designed for GCN.


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## TheMailMan78 (Feb 27, 2016)

Don't care. Still gonna buy KI when it comes out.


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## Octopuss (Feb 27, 2016)

@abundantcores
I don't like Microsoft one bit, but the wall of text you produced (which I mostly skipped) is classical case of IT chemtrails. 0/10.


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## abundantcores (Feb 27, 2016)

Octopuss said:


> @abundantcores
> I don't like Microsoft one bit, but the wall of text you produced (which I mostly skipped) is classical case of IT chemtrails. 0/10.



"which I mostly skipped"

so you call it a tinfoil conspiracy without even reading it. well done.


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## ManofGod (Feb 27, 2016)

I have to say I would not have an issue buying this game from their store. However, I also have not payed full price for a game in a long time so I will not be buying it right away anyways. Also, for the one who claimed a Quantum Break sales breakdown of 99% 1%, if you preorder that game now on Xbox One, you will receive a free copy for Windows 10 with your purchase.

XBox One is not dead nor is it in any danger of dying. Also, if Microsoft can fix these issues, that will make a big difference but, we will see. Oh, and Steam is a walled garden, good luck with those who think otherwise. Don't believe me? Try taking your game purchases off of steam? What's that you say, you can't? Exactly.


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## ManofGod (Feb 27, 2016)

abundantcores said:


> "which I mostly skipped"
> 
> so you call it a conspiracy without even reading it. well done.





Octopuss said:


> @abundantcores
> I don't like Microsoft one bit, but the wall of text you produced (which I mostly skipped) is classical case of IT chemtrails. 0/10.



I read it, he is wrong.


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## abundantcores (Feb 27, 2016)

Its very easy to say "your wrong" and not offer up an explanation, anyone can do that... i can accept i am wrong but before considering that i'm interested in an intelligent argument as to why.
Any two word opposition is just valueless noise


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 27, 2016)

ManofGod said:


> Oh, and Steam is a walled garden, good luck with those who think otherwise.



In a sense, but that's not what is meant by the term.  All the games on all the platforms, and even the DRM-free versions you can buy from GOG and play directly from your desktop (unless you download the Linux-enabled versions) require Windows.

By "walled garden", what is referred to is the OS, which can easily be used to prohibit any Windows-required game from running unless it is purchased from and run within the Windows Store.

Is it likely? No (for many reasons, including legal ramifications).  Is MS trustworty? No.  But, is it out of the realm of possibility, with their long history of shady shenanigans? Nope, not at all.


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## DRDNA (Feb 27, 2016)

abundantcores said:


> "which I mostly skipped"
> 
> so you call it a tinfoil conspiracy without even reading it. well done.


The Government of the USA has openly admitted to Chemtrails....just saying .....poor example


Octopuss said:


> @abundantcores
> I don't like Microsoft one bit, but the wall of text you produced (which I mostly skipped) is classical case of IT chemtrails. 0/10.



OFFTOPIC:
The Government of the USA has openly admitted to Chemtrails....just saying .....poor example


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## Octopuss (Feb 27, 2016)

I'm out of here.


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## Prima.Vera (Feb 28, 2016)

The question here is WHY? Why are they intentionally crippling games in WSG?? They do know that if a game cannot Cross/SLI - VSYNC and full screen, is a no brainer that people will go to another store.
Then, why all this stupid drama?


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## Rowsol (Feb 28, 2016)

What a joke.


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## Forza.Milan (Feb 28, 2016)

APK versi windows


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## Ithanul (Feb 28, 2016)

It is that last one, "no modding," that I dislike.  It the only reason I game on PC.

But yeah, they manage to out do GFWL.  At least I could still put SweetFX on top of those without issue and downsample.


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## Frick (Feb 28, 2016)

ms use chemtrails to make windows


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## TheGuruStud (Feb 28, 2016)

Have you read what they said in damage controle mode?  M$ supports vsync and sli/xfire, but the devs have to support it... LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

crooks


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## Countryside (Feb 28, 2016)

*Windows Store Games*


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## dwade (Feb 28, 2016)

It's a work in progress. Anything to get us away from that dump Steam store is better for PC gaming.


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 29, 2016)

dwade said:


> It's a work in progress. Anything to get us away from that dump Steam store is better for PC gaming.



You're partially correct.  I'm not a huge Steam fan, but I use it, because I have had to.  Really, no platform and no DRM is necessary, as GOG has profitably proved.  Every game I can get there that is also offered on Steam, I buy there instead and play from my desktop.

However, we do have to give Gabe and Steam credit.  Without their foresight to offer publishers the idea of using their platform as DRM, instead of packaging game and OS-crippling DRM programs in their games, PC gaming, I daresay, would not be in the strong position of health it is now.  PC gaming was gasping at the time Steam began.


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## Khanivore (Feb 29, 2016)

All the more reason not to even touch Microsoft Store. I've removed it from sight on my OS.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 29, 2016)

I would buy everything on GOG if GOG Galaxy supported achievements.  I often achievement hunt when replaying games.  In games that don't have achievements, I usually end up doing it almost exactly like I did before.  It's a means for developers to suggest to players to try something different.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Feb 29, 2016)

The worst part about this is there will be no real full screen? What in the actual fuck. Anyone can put their 2 brain cells together and realize how ass backwards that is.


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 29, 2016)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I would buy everything on GOG if GOG Galaxy supported achievements



I don't see the point of Galaxy, other than to make all the kiddies who only know Steam feel comfortable.  It's one less thing to have running.  I play all my GOG games from desktop shortcuts, and really don't care about achivements.  I just want to enjoy the game.


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## HisDivineOrder (Mar 1, 2016)

Khanivore said:


> All the more reason not to even touch Microsoft Store. I've removed it from sight on my OS.




It waits in the shadows for the moment when you least expect it and then it will strike.  Not with flash and explosion, but softly.  Silently.

With Master Chief and Fenix.


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## Relayer (Mar 1, 2016)

Consolitis mandated.


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## Liquid Cool (Mar 4, 2016)

*Gears of War developer tells games industry: we must fight Microsoft*

Makes for an interesting read....

Best,

Liquid Cool


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## rtwjunkie (Mar 4, 2016)

Liquid Cool said:


> *Gears of War developer tells games industry: we must fight Microsoft*
> 
> Makes for an interesting read....
> 
> ...



OK, I'm going to read, but my initial reaction to just the title is "It's easy for them to say that after they already cashed in and did Microsoft's bidding."

EDIT: after reading, I have even more to say.  What I brought up the other day about what Gabe predicted 3 years ago, and this bearing watching, now seems even more real. 

The idea, if Sweeney is right, of M$ (yes, I intentionally used the dollar sign) being able to curtail the ability of games to be cutting edge if they DON'T use the Windows Universal Platform (and the Windows Store) is extremely ominous.


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## TheGuruStud (Mar 4, 2016)

rtwjunkie said:


> OK, I'm going to read, but my initial reaction to just the title is "It's easy for them to say that after they already cashed in and did Microsoft's bidding."
> 
> EDIT: after reading, I have even more to say.  What I brought up the other day about what Gabe predicted 3 years ago, and this bearing watching, now seems even more real.
> 
> The idea, if Sweeney is right, of M$ (yes, I intentionally used the dollar sign) being able to curtail the ability of games to be cutting edge if they DON'T use the Windows Universal Platform (and the Windows Store) is extremely ominous.



While this sounds bad, it's probably good. This should accelerate Vulkan adoption and linux.

Big titles are nearly all worthless from a quality gameplay perspective, so M$ can keep the studios that they ruined (so can all the other lamers). Indies will continue to do what is good.

Let them drive themselves out of the market completely. I'm fine with that. Gaming has always pushed the direction of PCs historically, maybe it can do it one last time.


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## Prima.Vera (Mar 5, 2016)

MxPhenom 216 said:


> The worst part about this is there will be no real full screen? What in the actual fuck. Anyone can put their 2 brain cells together and realize how ass backwards that is.


Listen man, I lost all my trust in those idiots knuckleheads from Microsoft. I mean if you think that is a serious issue, just look on what they did with the OS font rendering in Windows 10 or IE/Office 2013 and up... Complete ireversible garbage that is probably never going to be fixed.


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## AsRock (Mar 7, 2016)

Here's MS support for you, i thought i would install some older games like GTA4 as these days it runs totally sweet once you get rid of this problem or and a message after installing their patch, and the game still will not work without removing the crap.





MS Support gaming my ass


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Mar 14, 2016)

CrAsHnBuRnXp said:


> This is bad news for the upcoming Gears of War Ultimate Edition PC release as it was spotted on the Windows Store earlier in the week.


Since I bought GoW for PC just wanted to state. Yes you *can* play this game in fullscreen. No there are not any borders to the game. The game is easy to tab out of. You press ESC to pause the game and if youre on a multimonitor setup you can drag your cursor to the other screen with ease. The cursor locks to the game monitor and will no go off screen when playing.


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## Grings (Mar 14, 2016)

They might get it right this time....


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## xenocide (Mar 14, 2016)

I don't understand how Microsoft is still functioning with how frequently they hamstring themselves.  

I am a Zune HD owner and they did everything right with that platform except market it adequately and then essentially cut support and blamed Apple.  They made a solid OS for Windows Phones but just like with Zune, failed by making all apps go through some nonsense quality test hoping to be more like iOS than Android and sucking worse than both.  They gave the world Vista, then finally fixed it with Windows 7, only to forget everything they learned and release Windows 8 which was clearly designed for Touch Screens from the ground up.  They made a huge dent in the console industry with the Xbox 360--I assume the 360 comes from the fact that they cut so many corners with the hardware it's essentially a circle--and then threw it all away with the announcement of the Xbox One, basically saying they wanted to lock down their console and control everything, oh and you have to buy a Kinect for an extra $100 despite the fact nobody wants it.

They have time and time again failed with PC Gaming, despite it being a pretty damn easy thing to get right.  Between buying beloved studios and running them into the ground, putting up artificial barriers with DirectX, and now this nonsense, Microsoft is basically challenging Nintendo for the "Company With No Idea What The Fuck They Are Doing" Award.  Gamers have been rewarding companies that allow more control, that allow mods and have deep customization options (Skyrim, Minecraft Witcher 3), and shunning developers for making lazy console ports, so naturally Microsoft goes all in with the latter.  WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU GUYS!?>?

The only way I can rationalize all of this, is by saying it's clear Microsoft just wants full control over all their platforms.  It's the main reason a lot of their newer product lines have suffered, they just cannot give up control, and people don't want walled gardens left and right.


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