# Pentium D?



## Papahyooie (May 22, 2009)

Ok so my aging desktop im pretty sure is being bottlenecked by my P4 3.2ghz (running at 3.6) Its single core, not even 64bit. Heres what it is

P4 (northwood? Prescott? Im not at home atm)
3gigs DDR2 667
Asus P5ND2-SLI Deluxe
Geforce 7900gs OR Radeon x1900xt depending on how I feel at the time.
600w thermaltake PSU

Sad specs for a gaming machine but Ive been saving up for my laptop, and a new motorcycle (2007 gsxr woot!) which I finally got both, so havent really upgraded my desktop in awhile. I think the processor is bottlenecking it, but the motherboard wont support C2Duo's and quads and such. 

So here are my goals: Want to upgrade to a dual core x64 so that I can:

Upgrade vista 64 and max out the ram
upgrade to geforce 8800 or 9800 and not be bottlenecked by the processor

Id like to do it as cheaply as possible as in all reality this will be pretty much only a wow machine, or possibly hooked up to my Tv to play games with a 360 controller / media PC. Id like to do it without upgrading the motherboard at the moment, as I want to save up again for the latest and greatest at the time when i'm ready (i7, or whatever is out early next year or so)

So the only dual cores that are available for my board (afaik, correct me if im wrong) are Pentium D's. So are these worth the 100 bucks or so for around a 2.5ghz? Will I see performance increase (in gaming) over my P4? Ive heard terrible things all around about the PD series, but are they that bad that they would not kill a P4? 

Or perhaps should I go for PD 965 Extreme for 200 bucks 3.73ghz? I know that one would kill my P4, but is it worth 200 bucks?

Or am I crazy, not being bottlenecked, or perhaps its not worth it atall and i should wait till I can upgrade the board (i know most of you will say upgrade your mobo, but see my specific needs above... dont want to buy a C2D or C2Q board that I can afford now then have to buy an i7 board early next year.) Then I can move the geforce over to the i7 board, then upgrade piece by piece. 

Whattayathink?


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## Mussels (May 22, 2009)

pentium D's arent worth crap. modern celerons are faster.

Buy a new board first, then get a new CPU. it'll be faster and possibly cheaper.


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## Papahyooie (May 22, 2009)

I will buy a new board when I can get an i7 or whatever is best out when Im ready. But for now? I dont want to buy a new board then just have to scrap it or sell it.


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## angelkiller (May 22, 2009)

Your single core CPU is most likely a bottleneck.

However, _no_ Pentium D is worth more than $50 these days. Where are you getting your prices?

Your board supports a 1066MHz FSB, so it may be compatible with Intel's E6xx0 series. However, I can't find any confirmation of this.

I think a dual core CPU is a solid upgrade, but this is an old machine and you said you'd be upgrading next year. If you've survived this long on that machine, than a dual core CPU should hold you over until you upgrade. But make sure you don't spend more than $50 on a CPU, wheather it be a Pentium D or a Core 2 E6xx0. Any Pentium D with equal clock speed or better will be a decent upgrade imo. If you're interested, I have a Pentium D 805 that I'll sell ya for $30 shipped in the States. 

Oh, and I wouldn't upgrade your graphics at all. Surely you can max out WoW with a 7900GS...? Same thing on the RAM. I doubt you'll notice the difference between 4GB and 3GB. That extra GB is not worth the cost of the RAM+Vista. I think you should get a dual core CPU and see how things go. Any other upgrades won't really be worth it imo. Maybe another 7900GS if you can find one for like $30.


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## Mussels (May 22, 2009)

Papahyooie said:


> I will buy a new board when I can get an i7 or whatever is best out when Im ready. But for now? I dont want to buy a new board then just have to scrap it or sell it.



you're throwing money away on the pentium D's. you wont get much of a speed increase, for a lot of money.


http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813153119
$40 board capable of 333MHz FSB

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116072
$70 CPU, known as a good clocker, 200 FSB.

Since the board does 333MHz FSB and you have 667MHz ram, that means you could clock this chip upto 333Mhz - giving you quite an OC (potentially 4.2Ghz without even going faster than stock speeds on your mobo and ram*). and its nearly the same price as your $100 pentium D.

*you wont get that high on such a cheap board. but 3GHz is quite likely.


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## Papahyooie (May 22, 2009)

Ok so newegg has better prices than TD. I thought the wolfdale was a Pentium D? I guess Pentium Dual core? That looks like a good idea, the CPU and mobo. I'll look into that.
As for graphics, meh I can get 25 frames or so on the 7900gs, and the x1900xt is supposed to be faster but isnt (hence why I think Im bottlenecked). As for vista x64 and the ram, oddly enough, I used to be a vista hater, and now I cant stand xp... I used to format xp once every 3 months or so just to keep it running smoothly... Ive never had to format my vista machines, and after service pack 1 everything is great. So I will be buying vista x64 anyway, so then when I completely overhaul the rig, I will just transfer it to that. And ram is cheap so why not get another gig.


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## phanbuey (May 22, 2009)

Mussels said:


> you're throwing money away on the pentium D's. you wont get much of a speed increase, for a lot of money.
> 
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813153119
> ...



+100... go i7 or Core 2 or don't buy anything at all, unless you just want an antique computer, because you will see 2 FPS increase with a pentium D.  Pentium D = oldschool pentium 4, not c2d.


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## Papahyooie (May 22, 2009)

Ok so im a dumbass, not Pentium D, Pentium Dual core. Like wofldale/allendale (or the extreme edition PDExtreme Presler was the other one.) 

That was what I meant... sorry!

So replace all the above statements with Pentium Dual core. Are they worth it over say C2D (because my board wont support C2D)


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## Mussels (May 22, 2009)

Papahyooie said:


> Ok so im a dumbass, not Pentium D, Pentium Dual core. Like wofldale/allendale (or the extreme edition PDExtreme Presler was the other one.)
> 
> That was what I meant... sorry!
> 
> So replace all the above statements with Pentium Dual core. Are they worth it over say C2D (because my board wont support C2D)



your board doesnt support pentium dual core either.

Your motherboard supports pentium D, which are dual core pentium 4 chips. Pentium dual core are core 2 based chips - if your board supported pentium dual, it would also support core 2.


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## beyond_amusia (May 22, 2009)

Pentium D's aren't so bad - ebay a 3 GHz or higher one that is 9X5 (if you plan to use Intel V get  a 9x0 variant) and OC it. I had a Pentium D 925 OCed to 3.77 GHz and it worked pretty good and ran any game I tossed at it, though I had to use medium settings on most. I just sold it actually for $50 because I moved to a quad core.  My personal advice would be to get a cheap Core 2 based CPU or an Athlon 64 X2 and a cheap but OK board.


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## Papahyooie (May 22, 2009)

Now Im completely confused... screw it i'll just buy a cheap board or wait lol.


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## beyond_amusia (May 22, 2009)

Papahyooie said:


> Now Im completely confused... screw it i'll just buy a cheap board or wait lol.



Blame Intel for making 2 low end brands at once - Celeron and Pentium Dual Core - and for reusing the Pentium name too - It's rather ridiculous IMO.


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## pbmaster (May 22, 2009)

Do something along the lines of what Mussels suggested..you will be much happier.


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## Deleted member 67555 (May 22, 2009)

http://www.starmicro.net/detail.aspx?ID=683
That's a pretty descent chip there for $88 and yes it will run games,until your ready to do a full upgrade that will do fine,I know for a fact that cpu runs games as well as a AMD x2 5600+,but if you decide to go to Vista i do advise upgrading everything but until you do that will work fine


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## Mussels (May 22, 2009)

jmcslob said:


> http://www.starmicro.net/detail.aspx?ID=683
> That's a pretty descent chip there for $88 and yes it will run games,until your ready to do a full upgrade that will do fine,I know for a fact that cpu runs games as well as a AMD x2 5600+,but if you decide to go to Vista i do advise upgrading everything but until you do that will work fine



except that that chip is more expensive than a core 2 based solution which runs circles around it.


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## Papahyooie (May 22, 2009)

meh i will probably just go with a board like mussels says, alot better than paying for just a crappy processor (i knew they were crappy just didnt know HOW crappy) when I could get a better one and a board. Can always sell it here for cheap afterwards. Thanks Mussels!


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## AhokZYashA (May 22, 2009)

I use Pentium D 925 @ stock speed...
this chip is very hot, loud, and slow if compared to the cheaper Pentium Dual-Core E5xxx

It's stock fan works at 4500RPM. had over 100Watt TDP
@ idle the temperature is 60C-65C..

I recommend Pentium Dual-Core E5300 or A Core 2 Duo E4xxx
With some cheap Mobo's...


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## Melvis (May 23, 2009)

Find a nice cheap Mobo that supports a C2D and get the lowest end C2D it will out perform anything that has a "Pentium" name on it, heck even a 939 Dual core of anything would out perform any Pentium Dual core just about. But Honestly if you want a performance increase and don't want to spend alot of money go with a AMD AM2+ mobo with any X2 CPU and you be set.
You wont find cheaper and for a good performance increase then that.


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## PlanetCyborg (May 23, 2009)

Melvis said:


> Find a nice cheap Mobo that supports a C2D and get the lowest end C2D it will out perform anything that has a "Pentium" name on it, heck even a 939 Dual core of anything would out perform any Pentium Dual core just about. But Honestly if you want a performance increase and don't want to spend alot of money go with a AMD AM2+ mobo with any X2 CPU and you be set.
> You wont find cheaper and for a good performance increase then that.



pentium dual core IS Core 2 Duo! do your home work


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## Mussels (May 23, 2009)

Pentium 4
Pentium D

***above this line are P4 based, below are core 2 based***

Pentium dual core
Core 2 duo
Core 2 quad


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## Melvis (May 23, 2009)

PlanetCyborg said:


> pentium dual core IS Core 2 Duo! do your home work



Ummm since when? far as i know Pentium D's came out before C2D (June/july 2006)


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## Mussels (May 23, 2009)

Melvis said:


> Ummm since when? far as i know Pentium D's came out before C2D (June/july 2006)



pentium D and pentium dual core are not the same thing.


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## Melvis (May 23, 2009)

Mussels said:


> pentium D and pentium dual core are not the same thing.



So whats the difference? since Pentium D stands for dual core?


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## Mussels (May 23, 2009)

Melvis said:


> So whats the difference? since Pentium D stands for dual core?



the difference is that pentium D is a dual core P4 design, while the pentium dual core is allendale.


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## Melvis (May 23, 2009)

Mussels said:


> the difference is that pentium D is a dual core P4 design, while the pentium dual core is allendale.



Ahh right thought so, so its just away to distinguish between the old Pentium D's (being on the old arc) and the new Pentium dual cores been on the new C2D design? But would still under perform a real C2D E whatever....


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## LittleLizard (May 23, 2009)

IMO, you should get this and this OR this with this


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## Mussels (May 23, 2009)

Melvis said:


> Ahh right thought so, so its just away to distinguish between the old Pentium D's (being on the old arc) and the new Pentium dual cores been on the new C2D design? But would still under perform a real C2D E whatever....



you can tell they're different by the name. D does not read the same as dual core. one is a letter, one is two words.


Allendale are the original core 2. they were the E4x00 series.


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## LittleLizard (May 23, 2009)

Melvis said:


> Ahh right thought so, so its just away to distinguish between the old Pentium D's (being on the old arc) and the new Pentium dual cores been on the new C2D design? But would still under perform a real C2D E whatever....



nope, the new e5xxx and e6xxx performs better than the core 2 e4xxx like mine one.


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## Melvis (May 23, 2009)

Mussels said:


> you can tell they're different by the name. D does not read the same as dual core. one is a letter, one is two words.
> 
> 
> Allendale are the original core 2. they were the E4x00 series.



lol well yes that is a no brainer there, thats what i mean so people can tell the difference.

Ahh i see now, thats fair enough, old tech becomes the Pentium line of CPU's and newer ones continue with the C2D name etc


LittleLizard said:


> nope, the new e5xxx and e6xxx performs better than the core 2 e4xxx like mine one.



Yea i can understand that from what Mussels is saying, im sure they keep with this name "Pentium " since it was just a so well known name, makes perfect sense.

So lets say just as a eg, the new line of C2D E9xxx comes out then the old E7xxx or E8xxx becomes the new Pentium line of CPU's etc etc

Thanks guys


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## LittleLizard (May 23, 2009)

Melvis said:


> So lets say just as a eg, the new line of C2D E9xxx comes out then the old E7xxx or E8xxx becomes the new Pentium line of CPU's etc etc
> 
> Thanks guys



where in the mother of god you read that there were going a e9xxx series of core 2?. intel next mainstream is going to be core i5


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## Melvis (May 23, 2009)

LittleLizard said:


> where in the mother of god you read that there were going a e9xxx series of core 2?. intel next mainstream is going to be core i5



LMAO omg dude, read it again ^ as i said i put EG means example


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## AhokZYashA (May 23, 2009)

Ok lets get it straight..
"D" in pentium D stands for "Desktop" like "M" in pentium M's which stands for "mobile"
C2D E4xxx is based on Allendale Core and the Pentium Dual-Core E5xxx and E6xxx based on Wolfdale-2M core...

and the Pentium D are based on Presler Core....
which is based on the netburst architecture...

so Pentium Dual-Core E5xxx and E6xxx is slightly faster than the fastest C2D E4xxx


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## Mussels (May 23, 2009)

AhokZYashA said:


> Ok lets get it straight..
> "D" in pentium D stands for "Desktop" like "M" in pentium M's which stands for "mobile"
> C2D E4xxx is based on Allendale Core and the Pentium Dual-Core E5xxx and E6xxx based on Wolfdale-2M core...
> 
> ...



no the D stands for dual core. its a dual core pentium 4.

the difference is that the pentium dual core, actualyl says dual core in the name and not just D.

C2D E2xx0 use conroe 2M (half cache) and E4xx0 use allendale, E6xx0 use conroe (4MB), and above use newer cores, or conroe/allendale with less cache.


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## PlanetCyborg (May 23, 2009)

E5200+G31=awesome budget rig!!!


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## Geofrancis (May 23, 2009)

if you want to keep most of your existing rig get a pentium D with the 65nm presler core and overclock shit out of it those chips will do 4ghz easy. best place to get them is ebay it shoudnt cost you more then $40 if you hunt around.


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## phanbuey (May 23, 2009)

Mussels said:


> you can tell they're different by the name. D does not read the same as dual core. one is a letter, one is two words.
> 
> 
> ...



  This thread is classic.


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## A Cheese Danish (May 23, 2009)

Hmm this was interesting, maybe it will resolve something?


> The new Pentium Dual-Core processors consume considerably less power (65W) than the Pentium D (95 or 130W). They also only have up to 2MB L2 Cache memory while the Pentium D has up to 2x2 MB. Despite these differences the Pentium Dual-Core outperforms the Pentium D in most applications.


It is correct that the M for a Pentium M does stand for Mobile, But I can not find to where it says Pentium D stands for desktop.
So I have to agree with Mussels that it does stand for dual-core.


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## hat (May 23, 2009)

I doubt it stands for dual core. There was a socket 478 Celeron D listed on Newegg for a while but it's gone now. There were also plenty of netburst 775 single-core Celerons that read "Celeron D" even though it was a single core.


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## Papahyooie (May 23, 2009)

Well... I dont really care what the D stands for... all that matters is that PD is slower than P-Dual core. And I cant use the P-dual core, so i'm outta luck. I'll just keep it the way it is till I can buy 
i7.

Oh and the celeron D's are a totally different animal alltogether, I learned that one the hard way a while back. The D in celeron D means desktop. No doubt about that one. They are NOT dual core. The pentium D's are dual core P4s.


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## Melvis (May 23, 2009)

Lets make this simple then, since i agree its just so confusing with intel's naming sceem god.

Dont buy anything with the name "Pentium" on it even if the new ones are based on the new C2D arch blah blah blah, just to make it easier for you, just buy a mobo you can afford that supports CPU's that say this > C2D etc or.............get a mobo you can afford that supports CPU's that say this > AMD Athlon AM2+ X2 etc 

Both ways will be a upgrade for you at the cheapest price without the hassle of the above statements.

Get Motherboard that supports > C2D (intel rig)

Get Motherboard that supports > AMD Athlon AM2+ X2 (AMD rig)

Done!!!


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## Papahyooie (May 23, 2009)

or... do what I said I would and wait? Im not into cheap motherboards. My P5 was awesome when I bought it but that was right before the C2Ds came out. I'll just wait.


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## Melvis (May 24, 2009)

Papahyooie said:


> or... do what I said I would and wait? Im not into cheap motherboards. My P5 was awesome when I bought it but that was right before the C2Ds came out. I'll just wait.



or yes you can wait, up to you realy, if you can live with ya system till you get ya new awesome system then yea why not i say? and i agree i don't like cheap mobo's ether i always get the best mobo i can when building systems (mainly Gigabyte) less hassle that way to with upgrades later on.  If you can hold off then hold.


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## eidairaman1 (May 24, 2009)

His current Processor is a Prescott or Cedarmill, Northwood was 478 Prescott was 478/775, since his machine is DDR2 its 775


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## LittleLizard (May 24, 2009)

LittleLizard said:


> nope, the new e5xxx and e6xxx performs better than the core 2 e4xxx like mine one.





AhokZYashA said:


> Ok lets get it straight..
> "D" in pentium D stands for "Desktop" like "M" in pentium M's which stands for "mobile"
> C2D E4xxx is based on Allendale Core and the Pentium Dual-Core E5xxx and E6xxx based on Wolfdale-2M core...
> 
> ...



THATS EXACTLY WHAT I SAID 



LittleLizard said:


> nope, the new e5xxx and e6xxx performs better than the core 2 e4xxx like mine one.


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## PlanetCyborg (May 24, 2009)

waiting is good i5 + new gfx card = massive upgrade or like japanese would call "Happy Happy Fun Fun Time"


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## Mussels (May 24, 2009)

hat said:


> I doubt it stands for dual core. There was a socket 478 Celeron D listed on Newegg for a while but it's gone now. There were also plenty of netburst 775 single-core Celerons that read "Celeron D" even though it was a single core.



celeron D was a single core of the pentium D. celerons being cut back and all. in this case, it just stood for what generation celeron it was based off.

I also agree that i5 is going to be awesome, around the time i5 comes out theres going to be a loooot of sales for 775 suff too.


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## AhokZYashA (May 24, 2009)

Celeron D's are based on Cedar Mill's Core...
and ALL CELERON is SLOWER than ALL PENTIUM's on It's class...

and the Celeron E1xxx are based on Allendale Core....

and do you ever seen A Pentium D placed on a Notebook even it stands for Dual-Core....???


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