# HD3650's in crossfire or 8800GS .. "??"



## JrRacinFan (Feb 10, 2008)

Yup that time is coming around again, it's been about 2 years since my last video card purchase. This time I am going to need some help though.

I need opinions on the above and please no suggestions of different cards or fanboyish comments. I was very close to settling on the 8800GS for my next purchase.

Let me remind you, my board is 8x+8x, my monitor max's at 1440x900. Thanks in advance.


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## Xazax (Feb 10, 2008)

you do understand that the HD 3650's are 2600PRO replacements lol, meaning the 8800GS will stomp them, if you look at pure specs the 2600XT is still acutally better....


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## theonetruewill (Feb 10, 2008)

8800GS by a long way. Forget Xfire- it's overrated and not great on the wallet for what you get.


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## Corrosion (Feb 10, 2008)

SLi ftw. id go 8800gs bro


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 10, 2008)

8800GS .. dont waste ur money ...


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## Xazax (Feb 10, 2008)

lol your telling to buy a 8800GS that will be out dated in a month and not waste his money 

buy a HD 3850 there going on newegg.com for $150


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 10, 2008)

your actually correct .. theyre that cheap now?


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## Xazax (Feb 10, 2008)

Well i guess the rebate is no longer running there was an HIS HD 3850 for 170 with a $20 MIR however i suggest you check out this GeCube HD 3850 512mb for a mere $180 with free shipping.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814241068


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## imperialreign (Feb 10, 2008)

TBH - Crossfire or SLI isn't worth it unless you can get both cards for dirt cheap


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## Tatty_One (Feb 10, 2008)

I would wait a couple of weeks and probably get the 512MB 9600Gt when it's out, it will be $160 - $180 so around the price of a 3850 but a little faster.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 10, 2008)

I was looking at these specifically ...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102726
 $80 each ... 

And according to the few reviews I read they are on par in gaming with 2600XT's (about 5k 3dmark06 -e6600@stock 2GB on a P35) but pull ahead with video playback/HTPC media features.


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## niko084 (Feb 10, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> I was looking at these specifically ...
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102726
> $80 each ...
> 
> And according to the few reviews I read they are on par in gaming with 2600XT's (about 5k 3dmark06 -e6600@stock 2GB on a P35) but pull ahead with video playback/HTPC media features.



No 3650's get eaten for lunch of 2600xt's especially the gddr4s...
Already built 4 machines with 3650s...

Anyways like said above get a HD3850....


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 10, 2008)

Even if I get one 3650 it will still eat my 7600GS for dinner. Mind you whatever I do, it won't be for at least a couple months. 

Also, you guys feel a card past an 8600GTS be a waste when the only "real" resolution of my monitor is 1440x900? I am trying to do a balance of price vs overkill.

Thank you for the suggestion Niko, I have thought about it alot ... Almost anything nowadays can eat my 7600GS alive.


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## niko084 (Feb 10, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Even if I get one 3650 it will still eat my 7600GS for dinner. Mind you whatever I do, it won't be for at least a couple months.
> 
> Also, you guys feel a card past an 8600GTS be a waste when the only "real" resolution of my monitor is 1440x900? I am trying to do a balance of price vs overkill.
> 
> Thank you for the suggestion Niko, I have thought about it alot ... Almost anything nowadays can eat my 7600GS alive.




Very true... Bang for buck, an 2600xt gddr4 will destroy a 3650, 8600GT/GTS is a good shot if you are looking to keep it cheap.

3850 is such a great card for the money.

Really also if your not looking for dx10, you could try to find a 1950pro/xt also...

And no really 1440x900 is a slight bit smaller pixel count then my 1280x1024 and I got a huge boost going from my 1300xt-2600xt-3850 in this machine. I can actually when I clock my card play Crysis maxed without AA/AF in Dx10.

The 256bit bus really helps.... But around the 3850/8800gs line would be about where I would cut it off if your not looking for spectacular performance.


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## farlex85 (Feb 10, 2008)

If you are going to wait a couple of months, I would wait and see what is out in a couple of months. There could be something at a similar price point. You know the 3850s might be less that $150 at that point to compete w/ nvidias new line, so, I would say don't settle for either just yet.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 10, 2008)

@ farlex
Very very true, think they would drop that much in price by that time?

@ niko
Do you think a DX10 card would prove itself @ 1440x900?


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## niko084 (Feb 10, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> @ niko
> Do you think a DX10 card would prove itself @ 1440x900?



Dx10 is just for gaming, if you run vista and play dx10 games and want the dx10 effects, then ya its worth it... If you run xp or don't care about dx10 effects, then no doesn't matter, it wont hurt you or help you.

Resolution has nothing to do with it


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## niko084 (Feb 10, 2008)

Here are a few I would recommend.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130084
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130085
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814103049
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127305

Great few cards for your dollar...


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## farlex85 (Feb 10, 2008)

Well, it would be foolish to say anything for sure, but I would say it would be reasonable to think they would drop that much once the 9000 series comes out.


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## das müffin mann (Feb 10, 2008)

i would go for the better single card


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 11, 2008)

@niko

I am still pondering the idea of 2 3650's though, I mean I like this card:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161097

But 2 3650's would pretty much own it, or one would assume so, also I really REALLY would like single slot cooling solutions nad yes I would run with a stock HSF as long as possible.

Now I have also pondered the thought of running SLi w/ hacked intel drivers, finding myself maybe a 7300GT, dumping the bios and altering it to look look like a 7600GS on a bios level. That would involve a bit of work though, but in the end the hacked SLi mentioned, would run same performance in between 2600XT/8600GT and 8600GTS.

@muffin

Ok name a single card that performs in between HD3850 & HD3870 that costs less than $150? That's my whole point of this thread.


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## das müffin mann (Feb 11, 2008)

2900pro


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 11, 2008)

Are you sure? Only thing I could find on newegg was 2900GT, and imo they perform worse than hd3850 due to power consumption.


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## Tatty_One (Feb 11, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> @niko
> 
> I am still pondering the idea of 2 3650's though, I mean I like this card:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161097
> ...



Cannot understand why....if your on a budget you would possibly even consider Xfire?  even with good scaling your going to only get 50-60% performance out of the 2nd card, thats half it's value flushed down the pan, just get a single card that will perform better for around the same price....no scaling issues....no game compatibility issues and half the fookin tweaking!


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 11, 2008)

Tatty_One said:


> just get a single card that will perform better for around the same price....



That's the problem, I mean 2 3650's = roughly 1 3850 for $30 cheaper. Show me somethin that performs about the same for $140.


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## Tatty_One (Feb 11, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> That's the problem, I mean 2 3650's = roughly 1 3850 for $30 cheaper. Show me somethin that performs about the same for $140.



Not sure about the same, but in comparison to what you have this aint bad for $120........

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102712


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 11, 2008)

My whole justification of not doing the 2900GT thing is due to power consumption and it not having a single slot cooler.


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## asb2106 (Feb 11, 2008)

I say do whatever you want, your not shooting for the top, not at all, so if the allure of crossfire grabs you, then go with it.  

When the 1900xt's were out, I bought 2 1950 pros instead.  It didnt perform any better than an xt but it was the dual video card setup that I liked.

If you want to do it, then do it.  It will play games, not great, but neither will any of the other cards, so do what you want and have fun!


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 11, 2008)

LOL @ asb

Of course, I do what I want all the time, and I understand what you're trying to tell me completely. I think the problem is that I am too frugal "Mr. Budget-Buyer". I see something I like but then start to think "what if i could do **yadada** and improve it for less". Know what I mean man? in basics, That's what happenned with my 7600GS a couple years ago.

@Tatty (&for eeryone else who would like to comment)

You think the 8800GS or 9600GT would be better than a 2900GT?


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## Dr. Spankenstein (Feb 11, 2008)

I'm going to throw my opinion in the mix...

While I have (very) recently become a convert to the CF camp, I think the 3650 CF sounds like a lot of work for not much return. But, I can't think of a more cost effective way to test the waters....


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## Xazax (Feb 11, 2008)

Is everyone missing my post that the HD 3650 are replacing te 2600PRO's? lol your better off Crossfiring those two 2600XT GDDR4's


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## asb2106 (Feb 11, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> LOL @ asb
> 
> Of course, I do what I want all the time, and I understand what you're trying to tell me completely. I think the problem is that I am too frugal "Mr. Budget-Buyer". I see something I like but then start to think "what if i could do **yadada** and improve it for less". Know what I mean man? in basics, That's what happenned with my 7600GS a couple years ago.
> 
> ...




Im the same way, I like the best I can get for as cheap as possible.  

I think its in your best interests though to just save up some and get a 3850/3870, or a 8800GS(are these out yet?) or GT


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 11, 2008)

Thanks Dr. S. There is just oen downfall I see to the whole crossfire, then again it may not be bad.

If I wanna switch out the video card again, I would have to replace both or go with something that supports crossfireX, grab a single video card and work with those.

EDIT: ^^8800GS is about $180

@Xazax

Even with that point, my current video card still falls short in performance of the 2600 Pro.


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## asb2106 (Feb 11, 2008)

Xazax said:


> Is everyone missing my post that the HD 3650 are replacing te 2600PRO's? lol your better off Crossfiring those two 2600XT GDDR4's



I think going with older hardware is a bad idea, it just causes you to buy newer sooner.  

I think the same thing for going with a slow card too though, thats why i would say go with a 3850, and if you get the itch you can add another in the mix later and have one hell of a system(for the price)


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## captainskyhawk (Feb 12, 2008)

Xazax said:


> you do understand that the HD 3650's are 2600PRO replacements lol, meaning the 8800GS will stomp them, if you look at pure specs the 2600XT is still acutally better....



Eh... I don't know about that.  I just got a 3650, and as I search through Futuremark's database for similar-speced systems, my system with a 3650 is beating any similar system with a 2600 XT that I can find...

It wasn't a bad card for $99 on NewEgg (the 3650).


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## Xazax (Feb 12, 2008)

http://www.legitreviews.com/article/652/1/

HD 3650                              

Core Speed 725                    
Memory 1.6Ghz                     
174Gflops                            
DX 10.1                               

2600XT
Core speed 800mhz
Memory 1.6/2.0Ghz For GDDR4 verisons
192Gflops
DX 10

I still say a GDD4 verison which is going for newegg.com right now for $85 After MIR

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127305

Is a much better choice, thats just me then if you got a HD 3650 and it works well then hey thats great. the Cheapest HD 3650 only has GDDR2 and thats $80..

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102726


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 12, 2008)

Thanks guys. But it won't be for a while.


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## niko084 (Feb 13, 2008)

FYI 2900GT = TRASH.... 

I have bought 6 of them because people wanted a cheap decently quick card... Not worth it, about the speed of a 1950pro, and way more power hungry and hot...


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

niko084 said:


> FYI 2900GT = TRASH....
> 
> I have bought 6 of them because people wanted a cheap decently quick card... Not worth it, about the speed of a 1950pro, and way more power hungry and hot...



GT - trash
PRO - not so much.  

I wouldnt get a GT but a pro can hold its own if you flash the bios up to an XT and overclock it up.  I have used a GT once before and it really does perform around the level of a 1950pro, with the benefit of DX10


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## niko084 (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> GT - trash
> PRO - not so much.
> 
> I wouldnt get a GT but a pro can hold its own if you flash the bios up to an XT and overclock it up.  I have used a GT once before and it really does perform around the level of a 1950pro, with the benefit of DX10



That is true even a non flashable 2900pro is not so bad if you can get them cheap enough, power hungry yes.... But not as bad by all means, the ones that will flash to an XT well then you got a nice card, power hungry and hot but a nice card by all means.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Well that's the issue I am having niko. Trying to stay away from more power hungry cards. Main reason of why I thought of 2 HD3650's, I am thinking they would consume less power.


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## niko084 (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Well that's the issue I am having niko. Trying to stay away from more power hungry cards. Main reason of why I thought of 2 HD3650's, I am thinking they would consume less power.



Eh 2 3650's would suck more power than a 3850, or even a 2900pro... So that would be a waste of money... A single 3850 will destroy upside down and backwards a set of 3650's, cost you less and use less power, *almost half the power*.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Really!? They each use as much power as the 3850? Hmmmm ....


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## AddSub (Feb 13, 2008)

About a month ago there were some 2900Pro cards (512bit, 512MB) going for about $170 on Newegg, but I don't think they'll be in back in stock. My local Microcenter had 3850 256MB cards going for $150 flat, no rebates involved, TD had a similar deal going on. 2900GT cards are not bad, but they eat lot of power and driver support is poor. I actually have some benchmarks I did on a Sapphire 2900GT card that a family member of mine owns. I got 3DMark01, 03, 05, 06 and Fur:







If you are interested, but I warn ya, they need lot of power.

Also, like somebody already mentioned, a nice x1900xt/xtx or x1950xt/xtx card would a great choice if you are not interested in Dx10. I also have some personal experience and benchmarks for some of those cards.


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## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

Get a 3850, I have 1 and It plays gears of war maxed out at 1600x1200 4aa

the 3850's are some very powerful cards for their prices and overclock like crazy, mine is sitting at 903/1100 right now on air

I have used a 2900gt before and they are absolute trash, they can barely play gears at 1280x1024, they are trash, if you can get a 512bit pro then you should go for that but I have heard that sapphire has one which dosen't overclock too well

the 3850 is a little slower than the 9600gt but the price keeps dropping and at this point they will destroy nvidia's 8600 series

I know someone with an overclocked 8800gs and I'm going by their house later today so I will see how it performs against my overclocked 3850

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150275

its 160 dollars on newegg but I bought 1 of my 3850's for 129 on ebay

I was actually going to sell my 3850 a little while ago but after going from 4x to 16x pcie because of that stupid 4coredual I am getting much more performance from it now, 4x will murder a pcie 2.0 cards performance and cause artifacts for some reason.


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## Tatty_One (Feb 13, 2008)

I say either 8800GS now (if you have to buy now) or 9600GT in around 3 weeks.


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## -=CrAnSwIcK=- (Feb 13, 2008)

this quarter nvidia has the 9600gt which will fall in the HD 3850 arena, for around the same price, with slightly better performance, as already mentioned, so if you're not going to upgrade for a bit, then that might be worth a look, since it will probably outperform the 8800gs,  Q2 this year is rumoured to host the launch of a new mid-range card from ATi, possibly based off R700 architecture...


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Thanks for the suggestions guys, but does the 3850 require a 6 pin/8pin? 

@ Kain

Thanks for the info, I would be gaming @ 1440x900 so maxing out a game at that res with a 3850 should be no sweat then. Question being, would it be overkill? 

@AddSub

Think I could find an X1950xt in $100-120 price range?

Just a reminder guys, Crysis does not look interesting to me. Most graphics performing game I play right now is probably between F.E.A.R. and Guitar Hero 3. Although I did like GoW, it just didn't do justice for me, I had it running on my old setup with 768MB ram @ 1024x768 medium.

So as you can see I am not one that needs the all out best card, I am just at a moot point, should I buy an 8600GTS, go for broke with an HD3850, or just pickup a 2nd 7600GS (if price  is right) and perform around a single 8600GT?


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## cdawall (Feb 13, 2008)

3650=garbage 128bit mem bus...

go for the 2900GT it is better than your 7600GS and the best bang for the buck right now your PSU can handle it so why not?


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## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

Just got back from the guys house and his XFX 8800GS is now dead from overclocking it 120mhz on the core on water from the stock 580 and it died shortly after, that cards a horrible overclocker, he will get back the rma in like 2 weeks though

its not the same core as the 8800gts and gt, i guess they put the cores that couldn't handle the 8800gt clocks in the gs

I think you should wait for the 9600GT


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

@cdawall

But, 1 would outperform my 7600GS, and If I buy one, I am definitely buying a 2nd.

@Kain

Thanks for the info, what brand was it?


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 13, 2008)

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=985&num=5

hd3650 kick out the 8600gt teeth clean clean


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## cdawall (Feb 13, 2008)

the 3650 is a terrible card...

here is a review

http://www.overclock3d.net/reviews.php?/gpu_displays/powercolor_hd3650_extreme_pcs_edition/1

8600GT beats it in every test

here is a MSI one with a good cooler for $80 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127306

why not do that?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Hmmmmm, Thanks for the link IRA.

@cdawall, think single slot bud.

How well do you guys think this would do?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150247

Also, do I need 512MB?


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## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

if your on a budget then get the 2900gt, your psu can handle it and its eqaul to ans\d most times faster

and no most 128 bit cards will only use up to 256mb

2 to look at
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127305
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102712

the 2900gt is faster than the 8600gts and 2600xt so 130 dollars is a very good price if your seriously on a budget

http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/nvidia_geforce_8800_gt_performance/page6.asp


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Single slot Kain. Think single slot.


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## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

oh, you need a single slot card


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## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

you might as well buy that 8800gs for 160 on newegg because if you have only 1 slot your cooling and overclocking options are limited anyway unless your gonna watercool it, or a 3850 if you can find a store around you selling it, my local pc store(privately owned) has it for 149.99 now.

there are also alot of X1950's and 7900's on ebay selling for under 100 dollars like this one.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ATI-Radeon-X195...ryZ40158QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

the X1950's and 7900/7950 are still faster than the 8600 series cards


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 13, 2008)

x1950, 8800gs, 3850 ...


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Well, I don't need a single slot card, but it is preferred so I don't lose access to my single PCI slot and 1 of my PCI-e X1 slots.

Remember if I find the cards cheap enough I will upgrade my psu and run crossfire.

EDIT: But if I stay with nVidia, unless someone comes out with hacked drivers, I won't be able to run SLi. So, dual slot nVidia or Single slot ATi.


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## Wile E (Feb 13, 2008)

Seriously man, you keep resisting it, but the people that mention it are right, get a 3850. Way better than Crossfiring 2 lower boards, plus it gives you the option of picking another up later if you need/want even more performance.

Quit thinking strictly from a price to performance standpoint, there are other factors to consider here. Like compatibility issues, complexity. etc.

It's always better to buy a single card vs 2 lower cards at the same performance level.


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> I think going with lesser hardware is a bad idea, it just causes you to buy newer sooner.
> 
> I think the same thing for going with a slow card too though, thats why i would say go with a 3850, and if you get the itch you can add another in the mix later and have one hell of a system(for the price)





Wile E said:


> Seriously man, you keep resisting it, but the people that mention it are right, get a 3850. Way better than Crossfiring 2 lower boards, plus it gives you the option of picking another up later if you need/want even more performance.
> 
> Quit thinking strictly from a price to performance standpoint, there are other factors to consider here. Like compatibility issues, complexity. etc.
> 
> It's always better to buy a single card vs 2 lower cards at the same performance level.


looks like we agree


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 13, 2008)

Wile E said:


> Seriously man, you keep resisting it, but the people that mention it are right, get a 3850. Way better than Crossfiring 2 lower boards, plus it gives you the option of picking another up later if you need/want even more performance.
> 
> Quit thinking strictly from a price to performance standpoint, there are other factors to consider here. Like compatibility issues, complexity. etc.
> 
> *It's always better to buy a single card vs 2 lower cards at the same performance level.*



also more efficient


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

@ Wile E 
Grrrr ....
Alright fine, 3850 it is. You convinced me. But, from a few pics, Does it take a 6pin or an 8pin?

Also, would this be ok for a psu?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817341012

It won't be for a while til I get the actual graphics card.


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## OCQuadNick (Feb 13, 2008)

im selling two bfg 8600gts for less than 150 each and they are basically new


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

OCQuadNick said:


> im selling two bfg 8600gts for less than 150 each and they are basically new



I can buy a brand new 8600GTS for less than that


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> @ Wile E
> Grrrr ....
> Alright fine, 3850 it is. You convinced me. But, from a few pics, Does it take a 6pin or an 8pin?
> 
> ...



6 pin, and that PS will be more than enough for one 3850, glad to see your doing just one good card, youll be happy


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Although this does look tempting....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130084


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 13, 2008)

OCQuadNick said:


> im selling two bfg 8600gts for less than 150 each and they are basically new



for both?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

@ Nick

That would be a good price IF that was for both cards, but then I would have to replace my board and PSU as well. WHich would overthrow the price vs performance cost.


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Although this does look tempting....
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130084



thats a toss up that is completely up to you.  I think they are both OK, but I think the 3850 will get you alittle better results.


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## OCQuadNick (Feb 13, 2008)

[I.R.A]_FBi said:


> for both?



nope >.> this card is 200+ new


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Then again, anything above an 8600GT may be overkill for my monitor. Max is 1440x900, little something to throw out there. Although, I could overthrow that fact and add some FSAA in there.

@nick

Throw me a link.


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

OCQuadNick said:


> nope >.> this card is 200+ new



$99 bucks after rebate


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Then again, anything above an 8600GT may be overkill for my monitor. Max is 1440x900,



not a chance, 1440 x 900 you would need a GTX or 3870 to max that out.


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## OCQuadNick (Feb 13, 2008)

both of these cards are oc edition.
model number: bfgr6256gtsoce
heres a link to one : http://cgi.ebay.com/BFG-GeForce-860...ryZ40161QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Sweet, thanks asb.

@nick

Is it this one?
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814143113&Tpk=bfg+8600gts


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## OCQuadNick (Feb 13, 2008)

actually this one is different


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## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> not a chance, 1440 x 900 you would need a GTX or 3870 to max that out.



sure, This is what I think, go with a 3850, get a bios mod for it that allows you to up the voltage to ~1.33, and you will be able to overclock the card almost to the level of a 3870.  It will run great and play every game, some not great(crysis), but it will play anything


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## Wile E (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> @ Wile E
> Grrrr ....
> Alright fine, 3850 it is. You convinced me. But, from a few pics, Does it take a 6pin or an 8pin?
> 
> ...



lol.  Can you stretch a few more dollars in the psu department? Found a nice Seasonic for 69 on the egg. That OCZ only does 27A combined on the 12V rails, the Seasonic does 34A.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151040


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Hmmmm

Thanks but no thanks. Think I will pass.

@ Wile E

@ BestBuy they have a combined Antec case+psu earthwatts 430W combo. It has 17a+17a 12v rails, the combo is like $92.


----------



## Darren (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> I need opinions on the above and please no suggestions of different cards or fanboyish comments. I was very close to settling on the 8800GS for my next purchase.



Why not get the *3850*, it's both cheaper and faster than the 8800 GS. Remember the 3850 is only slightly slower than the 3870, most times performance is identical.


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> $99 bucks after rebate



thats a money wrench there ...


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

Wile E said:


> lol.  Can you stretch a few more dollars in the psu department? Found a nice Seasonic for 69 on the egg. That OCZ only does 27A combined on the 12V rails, the Seasonic does 34A.
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151040



the seasonic is a good PS, but its not that much better, he doesnt have alot of hardrives of alot of CDroms so I think that OCZ will do him well.  And OCZ does make really solid PSU's


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

OK, so now I am torn, 8600GTS for cheap or full out on HD3850. My board WILL NOT support SLi in the future but single card would work ok for the nVidia then I could do dual slot cooling if needed.

EDIT: Also, I think I may do the combo previously mentioned. I need a new case and I also have a $25 BB gift card.


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> OK, so now I am torn, 8600GTS for cheap or full out on HD3850. My board WILL NOT support SLi in the future but single card would work ok for the nVidia then I could do dual slot cooling if needed.



well before rebate the GTS is only 10 bucks less, to me thats not even a choice, get the 3850 and call it a day.  My buddy has the MSI 8600GTS OC edition, he likes it but even he would say to get a 3850, even with the price difference.  Crysis is barely playable on his rig, and its got 4 gigs ram, and a e6600 OCed to 3.0.  Held back by the graphics card......


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> EDIT: Also, I think I may do the combo previously mentioned. I need a new case and I also have a $25 BB gift card.



Thats not a bad idea, the earthwatts in a good PS, but i dont know if it has a 6pin PCIe power, does it.  Ill check now....

EDIT: it has 1 PCIe power


----------



## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

not done deciding


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

Trust me Kain. I am like really really close.


----------



## Wile E (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> OK, so now I am torn, 8600GTS for cheap or full out on HD3850. My board WILL NOT support SLi in the future but single card would work ok for the nVidia then I could do dual slot cooling if needed.


Get the 3850. lol. Boy you're stubborn.  



JrRacinFan said:


> EDIT: Also, I think I may do the combo previously mentioned. I need a new case and I also have a $25 BB gift card.


Go for it. 30A on the 12V rails combined. It's also a Seasonic built unit.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

the 3850 is as fast as the 8800GTS 320, a 8600GTS is nowhere in its league, go with the 3850

when overclocked enough you can even go against the 2900XT with it

look at the fur benchmark I did with my 256mb version, the only cards faster are the 8800GT, 2900XT, and 3870 and I think I can go much higher with a voltmod

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=40981&highlight=fur+benchmark


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 13, 2008)

OK here, is the Antec combo.

http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=10006031&prodlist=cj

Now I have not decided on exactly which HD3850 to go with but I would really like to stick with HIS or Sapphire.


----------



## Wile E (Feb 13, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> OK here, is the Antec combo.
> 
> http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=10006031&prodlist=cj
> 
> Now I have not decided on exactly which HD3850 to go with but I would really like to stick with HIS or Sapphire.


Don't get the Antec Combo if it's only a 380W psu. get it with the 430W at Best Buy, like you mentioned above.


----------



## -=CrAnSwIcK=- (Feb 13, 2008)

where are these BIOS mods for HD 3850 everyone's talking about?? people keep pointing me towards a pencil mod...

anyways, whoever says a 3850 won't play crysis, it depends on your system...if you have a core2duo and have the 3850 and CPU overclocked then you can play crysis on high settings @1280x1024 without AA no problem, cause i do with an Athlon 64 X2 @ 2.6ghz...but for sub 200$ there's nothing that can even think about AA samples in crysis...

My friend has an 8600gts and my 3850 stomps it...


----------



## KainXS (Feb 13, 2008)

Yeah that PSU won't cut it, Antec used to pack a pretty powerful 380 watt psu with 12v dual vrails @18A each but they switched it to earthwatts in the newer models of the case, but your gonna want about 430 watts to be safe

theirs a bios editor for the 3850 now, all you have to to is get your bios and edit it but you need the unlocked bios to go over 860 on the core for the 3850

I'm still wondering why ATI only puts 669 on the core at default when the 3850 can easily hit 3870 clocks on the gpu.

It'll just run hot


----------



## Wile E (Feb 13, 2008)

KainXS said:


> Yeah that PSU won't cut it, Antec used to pack a pretty powerful 380 watt psu with 12v dual vrails @18A each but they switched it to earthwatts in the newer models of the case, but your gonna want about 430 watts to be safe
> 
> theirs a bios editor for the 3850 now, all you have to to is get your bios and edit it but you need the unlocked bios to go over 860 on the core for the 3850
> 
> ...


Marketing reasons I assume.


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

the 380 does have the chops, but its cutting it close, I actually use the 4480B case at work here for our computers, and the ones I get comes with the 380 earthwatts.  I have a cad machine running a q6600 and a 3850 with 4 gigs ram and 2 250GB HDs in RAID, and it does fine.  

Even though I know it works I still dont recommend it.  I told our CFO here that I needed to put a better PS in the case but he said just see if it works first, it did so I have to leave it until it frys   Ahh well, not my problem.  It has held up now for 4 months with out issue, and it gets heavy use as it also serves as our computer for our plotter(printer for arictectual drawings)


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 13, 2008)

Darren said:


> Why not get the *3850*, it's both cheaper and faster than the 8800 GS. Remember the 3850 is only slightly slower than the 3870, most times performance is identical.



Which is why I suggested the 9600GT, it will be around the same price as the HD3850 BUT faster   although, going by recent trends, on first release it might cost more.


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 13, 2008)

-=CrAnSwIcK=- said:


> where are these BIOS mods for HD 3850 everyone's talking about?? people keep pointing me towards a pencil mod...
> 
> anyways, whoever says a 3850 won't play crysis, it depends on your system...if you have a core2duo and have the 3850 and CPU overclocked then you can play crysis on high settings @1280x1024 without AA no problem, cause i do with an Athlon 64 X2 @ 2.6ghz...but for sub 200$ there's nothing that can even think about AA samples in crysis...
> 
> My friend has an 8600gts and my 3850 stomps it...



Strange, everyone here tells me that Crysis is not CPU dependant....totally GPU dependant.


----------



## AddSub (Feb 13, 2008)

> Think I could find an X1950xt in $100-120 price range?



Oh yeah, brand new X1950XT cards (256MB model) were going for $109 on Newegg few days ago, no rebates or any tricks. They went out of stock pretty fast though, but I would keep my eyes open, since a new batch is almost guaranteed to reappear. You can get a x1900xt/xtx or a x1950xt/xtx card on eBay, but prices fluctuate widely (as with any auction site) and you might end up paying anywhere from $50 to $150. The thing of it is, x1950xt/xtx cards are extremely powerful and unless you really want Dx10 compatibility, they would be just fine for you. 

8600 series cards are junk, GT or GTS. Again, a family member of mine had one 8600GTS (XFX XXX model) until it was sold on ebay, but I benchmarked the heck out of it before that was done. It was a great overclocker (822Mhz on the core) but even with that high OC on the core it performed pretty poorly. 



> Also, do I need 512MB?



Until year or two ago, 256MB was just fine, but if you play games like STALKER or Oblivion then you will need all the VRAM you can get. Both STALKER and Oblivion are known to take in excess of 600MB to 800MB or more for texturing purposes, so even 512MB might not be enough for games like those.


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

Tatty_One said:


> Strange, everyone here tells me that Crysis is not CPU dependant....totally GPU dependant.



its not dependant on the CPU but I can say when I was running it on my e6600 @ 3.6 Ghz it used about 54% during regular game play.  And thats not a weak proc, I could see it maxing out a e4300 or 6300 running at stock pretty easily


----------



## niko084 (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> its not dependant on the CPU but I can say when I was running it on my e6600 @ 3.6 Ghz it used about 54% during regular game play.  And thats not a weak proc, I could see it maxing out a e4300 or 6300 running at stock pretty easily



Pretty much the fact of the matter.

Hd3850 FTW, if you are looking at a case combo-
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129033

That psu will handle a HD3850 and a clocked system easily.


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

niko084 said:


> Pretty much the fact of the matter.
> 
> Hd3850 FTW, if you are looking at a case combo-
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129033
> ...



my friend with the GTS just bought that exact case 2 weeks ago, it is identical to the 4480B except the USB plugs are vertical instead of horizontal, and its a great case, it has really really nice removable HD cage, makes it real easy to work, rubber grommets on the HD mounts, for silence, all in all great case.


----------



## niko084 (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> my friend with the GTS just bought that exact case 2 weeks ago, it is identical to the 4480B except the USB plugs are vertical instead of horizontal, and its a great case, it has really really nice removable HD cage, makes it real easy to work, rubber grommets on the HD mounts, for silence, all in all great case.



I have thrown together 4 computers with this exact case, 2 with hd3850's, 1 with a 8800GT and 1 with a G92 8800GTS works great.

Don't expect massive clocks on a quad with 5 drives and sli/xfire out of the psu but.


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

niko084 said:


> I have thrown together 4 computers with this exact case, 2 with hd3850's, 1 with a 8800GT and 1 with a G92 8800GTS works great.
> 
> Don't expect massive clocks on a quad with 5 drives and sli/xfire out of the psu but.



my bro's computer is has 4HD's a DVDRW 6 fans, a 8600GTS, 4 gigs ram, and a E6600 clocked @ 3.0.  I would expect youll get away good, if im not mistaken you have 2 HD's right?

Oh yah, and with xfire, I would recommend a new one too!!!  Atleast a 600 at that point


----------



## niko084 (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> my bro's computer is has 4HD's a DVDRW 6 fans, a 8600GTS, 4 gigs ram, and a E6600 clocked @ 3.0.  I would expect youll get away good, if im not mistaken you have 2 HD's right?
> 
> Oh yah, and with xfire, I would recommend a new one too!!!  Atleast a 600 at that point



Pretty much, drives don't take much but I figured with a big quad core you might run into issues... I mean I have no issues with mine if you check my system.


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

niko084 said:


> Pretty much, drives don't take much but I figured with a big quad core you might run into issues... I mean I have no issues with mine if you check my system.



I didnt know there was that much of a power consumption difernce between a quad and a dual, I thought duals were like 65w and duals were like 85 w

i figured one HD would take more than that difference


----------



## niko084 (Feb 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> I didnt know there was that much of a power consumption difernce between a quad and a dual, I thought duals were like 65w and duals were like 85 w



They are but when you clock them it multiplies... So a E6600 @ 3600 might use 110 watts, a Q6600 @ 3600 uses closer to 170.

*I can't quote those numbers directly, but that is how it changes as you clock the separation grows in multiples*

A hard drive 7200rpm when fully spun up generally only uses 20-30 watts.
*And thats only when at max, idle they use 5-10 watts or less even*


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 13, 2008)

niko084 said:


> They are but when you clock them it multiplies... So a E6600 @ 3600 might use 110 watts, a Q6600 @ 3600 uses closer to 170.
> 
> *I can't quote those numbers directly, but that is how it changes as you clock the separation grows in multiples*



ahh i c, thank you


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Guys, I appreciate the input and thoughts, but I am not going Quad anytime soon, so the power supply in the Antec should work wonders. I did a power supply calculation including the HD3850 @ stock and my whole system consumes 285W. 

I know its close but the power supply is supposedly cut and dry rated for 80+ efficiency. I am positive and sure I will be ok. 

I have played Oblivion quite a bit beforehand it was ok and really didn't like the demo of crysis (30 fps @1024x768 low, I didn't like the gameplay). S.T.A.L.K.E.R., I haven't been able to get much into that game. There is currently 2 games that I am mainly interested in, Stranglehold & Assassin's Creed. 

Well, hope the above helps any, like was stated before, not going Quad, my e1200 works fine and max I will be overclocking it to is 3.1Ghz and 776Mhz ram with decent timings, so the PSU should do the trick quite well.


----------



## Wile E (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Guys, I appreciate the input and thoughts, but I am not going Quad anytime soon, so the power supply in the Antec should work wonders. I did a power supply calculation including the HD3850 @ stock and my whole system consumes 285W.
> 
> I know its close but the power supply is supposedly cut and dry rated for 80+ efficiency. I am positive and sure I will be ok.
> 
> ...


I'm of the belief that it's always better safe than sorry. Ocing will increase the load on the psu by more than you think. I wouldn't be comfortable with running that on a 380w psu.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Then, what would happen if I ran dual PSU's?

EDIT: Nevermind, that was the most n00bish thing I have ever said. All I know is that's the case and psu I want.


----------



## candle_86 (Feb 14, 2008)

lol you can run dual PSU's ive done it before when i had a PSU take a crap and ran the video card from its own PSU once lol, only had a 250 and a 350 availble at the time and my 6800GT moded to Ultra wouldnt run with the 350 with the rest plugged in so i ran it off the 250 and the rest from the 350 and it worked fine, just make sure to switch both on at the same time lol.


----------



## Urbklr (Feb 14, 2008)

Hmmm, if you not buying for a bit, why not wait and see what the 9600GT does..?? It should be cheap, if it isnt, id say go with the 3850, i ran Crysis All high DX9 at 1680x1050, with a 2.8GHz e2140. It ran pretty well, it'd run better at your res.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Oh don't worry, I already decided I want an HD3850. Question still being though, would my power supply cringe at the thought?!


----------



## niko084 (Feb 14, 2008)

I really wouldn't push that on a 380.... Take it from years and years of experience and that power supply calculators are retarded and inaccurate.

I have no doubt it will run on that psu, but it might not run for long, especially if you want to keep clocking.


----------



## Urbklr (Feb 14, 2008)

I think you PSU will be fine. I built that one with a 550 Muskin....ran fine.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Oh I would no doubt go easy on the overclock if I had to. At my 2.6Ghz profile it starts running to where no matter how much I overclock I have close to no gain besides responsiveness with the current ram and video card.


----------



## Urbklr (Feb 14, 2008)

That 3850 will be somewhat bottlenecked at 2.6GHz


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Well, my 3.1ghz profile does 21.2 SuperPI. The 2.6Ghz does about 23 because I am able to tighten the ram timings. You have to remember, my chip and ram have more potential than what my motherboard can provide, but I love the board and plan on keeping it.


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 14, 2008)

what chipset is ur board?


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

975X. Oldest 8x+8x PCI-e X16 non-nVidia chipset.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> 975X. Oldest 8x+8x PCI-e X16 non-nVidia chipset.



when you get your 3850 make sure you beat my fur score of 3126, its not very hard to beat

UPDATE:
I talked to my friend on the phone and he said his 8800GS had memory rated for 700mhz but XFX already ran it at 800Mhz on default, I looked around and found reviews that proved what he said, The cooler on the GS is a piece of sh*t.

So its overclocked 100Mhz on the memory already with a terrible cooler

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews/XFXGS_3850/8800GSXXX.php

I always trusted XFX but thats just wrong

8800GS = sh*tty overclocker that will probably die when overclocked

they tested the 3850 256mb as well


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

LOL Speaking of fur benchmark: I know this is extremely fake but ... I had to post it:









It's called minimize LMAO


----------



## KainXS (Feb 14, 2008)

lol man, why would you do that


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

I dunno, seriously, I get like 900. I just figured you need a good laugh.


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 14, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> its not dependant on the CPU but I can say when I was running it on my e6600 @ 3.6 Ghz it used about 54% during regular game play.  And thats not a weak proc, I could see it maxing out a e4300 or 6300 running at stock pretty easily



Yep, but thats not the same.....there is a point where for every GPU to hit it's max performance/potential it needs a CPU speed to back it up that speed is dependant on the GPU of course, take for instance the 2900XT, that GPU is VERY Cpu dependant and on say an E4300 @ 3.2gig the user will only ever see around 60% of the potential of the card know matter what they do (generally speaking) but once that CPU speed is acheived to allow the GPU to run at max potential.......in Crysis there should be no improvement in frames beyond that so if that CPU speed is 3.6gig.......4gig will not give better Crysis performance, well thats the theory as I have been told anyways.


----------



## DrunkenMafia (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> I was looking at these specifically ...
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102726
> $80 each ...
> 
> And according to the few reviews I read they are on par in gaming with 2600XT's (about 5k 3dmark06 -e6600@stock 2GB on a P35) but pull ahead with video playback/HTPC media features.




I see 2 things on that page Jr.  I see *128 bit* and *DDR2*......  its just not worth it these days man. :shadedshu If you have to have one of those 2 types then get the GS other wise go for a HD3850 or you can surely grab a 2nd hand 8800gts / 2900pro for around $160 or so...


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 14, 2008)

DrunkenMafia said:


> I see 2 things on that page Jr.  I see *128 bit* and *DDR2*......  its just not worth it these days man. :shadedshu If you have to have one of those 2 types then get the GS other wise go for a HD3850 or you can surely grab a 2nd hand 8800gts / 2900pro for around $160 or so...



I hope you dont see 128bit for the 8800GS?............only cause it's 192bit


----------



## cdawall (Feb 14, 2008)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817171018
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817701007
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817701003
how about one of those PSUs?


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 14, 2008)

DrunkenMafia said:


> I see 2 things on that page Jr.  I see *128 bit* and *DDR2*......  its just not worth it these days man. :shadedshu If you have to have one of those 2 types then get the GS other wise go for a HD3850 or you can surely grab a 2nd hand 8800gts / 2900pro for around $160 or so...



hell if anyone wants to sell me a 8800gts for that price let me know, because I will get it!


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

@Drunken
Hey man! Haven't seen you around here in a while. I am pretty sure I decided on an HD3850, unless I can scrounge up a good deal on an 8800GT for $160 (which I highly doubt).

@cdawall
I really really am settled on the Antec combo. I like it alot.

@Tatty
I didn't understand a single word you just said. LOL

@asb
Agree with you totally, if someone can come along with an 8800gts(g80) for 160 damn straight you would know when I jump on that sucker!


----------



## KainXS (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> @Drunken
> Hey man! Haven't seen you around here in a while. I am pretty sure I decided on an HD3850, unless I can scrounge up a good deal on an 8800GT for $160 (which I highly doubt).
> 
> @cdawall
> ...



If I could trade my card for a gts, I would but I'm know the gs would get stomped by my overclocked card

I bought an antec combo a while ago and their is pretty much only 1 combo with a powerful enough psu in that range, I can take a picture of that psu If you want later

I would actually consider trading it for the older gts since I don't really game anymore


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

It's probly the 430W Earthwatts model. I think the 380W would be enough but some beg to differ.

Anyways, I am still contemplating the video card. I may have something coming around though and it involves a Sapphire HD3850 256MB. I would kinda like to get an 8600GTS only cause it seems the price for its performance would be a good mixture.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> It's probly the 430W Earthwatts model. I think the 380W would be enough but some beg to differ.
> 
> Anyways, I am still contemplating the video card. I may have something coming around though and it involves a Sapphire HD3850 256MB. I would kinda like to get an 8600GTS only cause it seems the price for its performance would be a good mixture.



maybe you should get the 2900GT instead because that dual core celeron might be unable to power anything above HD3850 and the 2900GT should be a good performance mix

you should try overclocking, If that celeron can hit 3GHZ then you should be able to max out the cards in the area you want right now

your stuck in the huge gap that that the release of the 8800GT and then 3850 made and nvidia and ATI don't want to go in it


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

The celeron isn't the problem, it's got tons more potential than the motherboard. I really don't want to get rid of this motherboard either. It can hit 3.5 easily on decent air with a P35 board.

EDIT: Also see my specs , those are 24/7 stable on this motherboard.


----------



## happita (Feb 14, 2008)

8800gs or an HD 3850 if you want to save a bit more money.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Happita, please read through the whole post. I have decided to not get the 8800GS, but am having a hard time deciding on an 8600GTS, 2900GT, or HD3850, in price order.


----------



## asb2106 (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Happita, please read through the whole post. I have decided to not get the 8800GS, but am having a hard time deciding on an 8600GTS, 2900GT, or HD3850, in price order.



the 3850 is gonna be the best choice, it really is.  The GTS is just shooting yourself in the foot(waste of money), the GT needs alot of power and doesnt give much in return, the 3850 doesnt need much power and it can be overclocked to perform amazing!  especially for the price.

Doooo it!


----------



## mdm-adph (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Happita, please read through the whole post. I have decided to not get the 8800GS, but am having a hard time deciding on an 8600GTS, 2900GT, or HD3850, in price order.



Check the "performance per dollar" charts at any of the video card reviews here at TPU -- there's never a better deal than a 3850.


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> @Drunken
> Hey man! Haven't seen you around here in a while. I am pretty sure I decided on an HD3850, unless I can scrounge up a good deal on an 8800GT for $160 (which I highly doubt).
> 
> @cdawall
> ...



You didnt understand that the 8800GS is 192bit not 128bit???


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 14, 2008)

mdm-adph said:


> Check the "performance per dollar" charts at any of the video card reviews here at TPU -- there's never a better deal than a 3850.



Does that include the 9600GT?


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Happita, please read through the whole post. I have decided to not get the 8800GS, but am having a hard time deciding on an 8600GTS, 2900GT, or HD3850, in price order.



If you are only considering those 3 cards (why not 9600GT?......faster than all of them!) then Def I would go with the HD3850.


----------



## cdawall (Feb 14, 2008)

could you just wait and save for the 9600GT? or ati's price drop reaction to it so that you could xfire?


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 14, 2008)

cdawall said:


> could you just wait and save for the 9600GT? or ati's price drop reaction to it so that you could xfire?



Makes good sense to me!


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Whats' the MSRP going to be at release?


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 14, 2008)

round 169ish


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Hmmmm, there is an option as well.

I still think I may go HD3850 only in case if I want to go crossfire later I can.


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 14, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Hmmmm, there is an option as well.
> 
> I still think I may go HD3850 only in case if I want to go crossfire later I can.



OK.....pleeeeeeze just buy it quick!


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 14, 2008)

Won't be for a while and I am not worried about it, truthfully.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 15, 2008)

Alright guys, money came through. I have a problem though.

It's either the Antec combo + $100 for a card 

OR

I can go all out for a card at about $170 and hope and pray my psu will be ok.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 15, 2008)

just buy the 3850, it uses as much power as the 2600xt


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 15, 2008)

Do you think i will have a problem though with my current power supply?

I mean, I will have to even use a molexadapter for it


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 15, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Do you think i will have a problem though with my current power supply?
> 
> I mean, I will have to even use a molexadapter for it



On a 550W?.....god no thats plenty for a 3850.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 15, 2008)

we have been at this for a while


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 15, 2008)

KainXS said:


> we have been at this for a while



Yep, gettin painful now


----------



## DrunkenMafia (Feb 15, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> hell if anyone wants to sell me a 8800gts for that price let me know, because I will get it!



here is one at newegg BRAND new for $180 after MIR.....  

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127328&Tpk=8800gts

I am sure there are 2nd hand ones on ebay for around $160..   But hell man, for $180 just grab a new one.  They also have an EVGA model on there for $199


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 15, 2008)

@Tatty

So, if I get a molex adapter, everything should be honkee dorre? I only have 4 molex's and 1 sata on my psu. 3 molex's and the SATA are being occupied at the moment.

@Drunken

Little more than what I can spend now. 

I really would like to get this Antec combo, I have a $25 gift card from best that I could use towards it. Not everyday you can get a kickass case and psu, same day for $65.


----------



## tkpenalty (Feb 15, 2008)

HD3850 & 8800GS blow the HD3650 out of the water... 

Yeah guys dont forget about the older 8800GTSs.... they arent exactly crap, very cheap and cooler running (thanks to the better cooler).

And on average 8800GTS users get a better case gallery score due to the better looking cooler


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 15, 2008)

Tk I appreciate the comments, but please read the whole thread. I know it's a long read but now I am tied in between an Antec psu/case + 2600xt/8600GTS OR HD3850. I really really like the case.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 16, 2008)

Ok found my card:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150275


But you know what ..... I think i may just get a cheaper vid card and get some more ram .... shit ...


----------



## Xazax (Feb 16, 2008)

I still dont think 8800GS is a good buy, there going to be outdated far too quickly and to me its nothing but bits and peices of a 8800GTS/8800GTX slapped on a G92 Core.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 16, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Ok found my card:
> 
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150275
> 
> ...



I can't take it any more

you do understand that this is the slowest 8800GS their is, even nvidia's reference card has 1600mhz DDR3 and 600 on its core but this has 1400mhz ddr3 and 580 on the core and after seeing what XFX did on the other GS, this card might have pre overclocked memory like their other 8800GS

but you should buy it, since its newegg, you can return it if thats the case and they're using 600Mhz DDR3 on the card and we'll be able to warn people in the future if that happens


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 16, 2008)

Everyone, I am sorry for the long painful thread. Kain, even though its slowest one their is its still a tons bigga hella upgrade.


----------



## Xazax (Feb 16, 2008)

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews/XFXGS_3850/index.php

a review 8800GS v HD 3850 256mb

"The 8800GS was overclocked using the Nvidia N-Tune utility and the maximum overclocks achieved were 703MHz core and 808 MHz memory. These are increases of 23MHz core and 8MHz memory although it should be taken into account that the card is pre-overclocked when purchased."

Guess if you buy the non-OC you can expect those kind of clocks.


----------



## Wile E (Feb 16, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Everyone, I am sorry for the long painful thread. Kain, even though its slowest one their is its still a tons bigga hella upgrade.



ARrrrrrrrrgggggGG!!!!!!! Get the 3850!!!!!!!! You indecisive bastage!!!  

Seriously tho, the 3850 is the best deal in that price range, period. You shouldn't even be considering anything else for that price range, unless the 9600s drop in that range and performs at that level. Even then I still suggest the 3850, cause that leaves the possibility of Crossfire open to you. Buying an Nvidia card locks you into a single card setup.

And screw the case man. Usability is much more important than looks. Your current psu will be fine, and you can always get a case later. Hell, look around and you may be able to find the case you want, used, for a killer price.


----------



## DrunkenMafia (Feb 16, 2008)

^ Amen bruva


----------



## trt740 (Feb 16, 2008)

get this 8800 gs 159.00 shipped it will kill a 3650 and a 3870. It uses the exact same ram as the XXX version and will match it. It kills a 3650 and beats the 3870 in just about everything and from what I read a 9600 won't much faster if at all.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150275


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## xmountainxlionx (Feb 16, 2008)

sorry to get off subject but i have a 8800gts 640 i would sell you in a couple of months, when i go to BMT for 6months, and my computer will be sitting here rotting...


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 16, 2008)

LOL @ Wile E

Not indecisive, I have a $25 BestBuy Gift card and that combo would be killer after using the card.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 16, 2008)

trt740 said:


> get this 8800 gs 159.00 shipped it will kill a 3650 and a 3870. It uses the exact same ram as the XXX version and will match it. It kills a 3650 and beats the 3870 in just about everything and from what I read a 9600 won't much faster if at all.
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150275



no it dosen't it overclocks like crap, check out all the benchmarks for it, and I know that the XFX version dies easily when you overclock the memory

oh please

its faster than the 3650 but you got some problems if you think this is faster than the 3870 especialy when its overclocked

you gotta remember that the GS is using the failed GT cores

but at this point I don't really care anymore, just buy something already


----------



## wolf (Feb 16, 2008)

go out and do eeny meeny miney mo over a 3850 and 8800gs. that'll settle this for sure.

remember that if playground rules aren't in effect then this is anarchy!


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 16, 2008)

LOL @ Kain.

Don't worry. I won't make any irrational decisions, for example 2600Pro for $150.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 16, 2008)

well you said you were going to get the GS so go for it, we need someone here on the forums to get that card to tell us how it performs, specifically the card that you want

but the specs for the 4850 series is out now and they have GDDR5 and 480 shaders but 16 rops

still I would like to see how GDDR5 performs so I might sell my 3850 and play the waiting game


----------



## cdawall (Feb 16, 2008)

i would get an ati card so you could xfire in the future...maybe kain will be nice and sell you his 3850


----------



## KainXS (Feb 16, 2008)

cdawall said:


> i would get an ati card so you could xfire in the future...maybe kain will be nice and sell you his 3850



I would only sell my heavily overclocked 3850 for at least about 200 dollars and It plays everything nicely so I might keep for like another month

my card is clocked right now at 943/1143

I had it over 1000 but the fan on it went because I replaced the VF-900's fan but it died and I'm using a cheap one now, I have a noctua on the way here right now

The bios is set to always boot at 850/1000


The one thing I noticed on the 38XX series is that overclocking the memory will give alot more performance than overclocking their cores.


sadly the second 3850 I had die in battle while trying to overclock it


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 16, 2008)

Going to be heading to Best buy soon. I may just do an 8600GT and wait for the HD4xxx's. To me that seems liek the best option with those cards confirmed to be released soon.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 16, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Going to be heading to Best buy soon. I may just do an 8600GT and wait for the HD4xxx's. To me that seems liek the best option with those cards confirmed to be released soon.



No one knows when they will be released but the 9600GT looks promising, but when the Hd4000 and the high end Geforce 9000's are released, we should see some very fast cards, I think Nvidia is going to start including physics proccessors on their cards since they bought nvidia and it looks like ati is going to try to counter that by doubling their GPU's proccessing power, things will get pretty interesting by the end of the year

but I went to walmart yesterday and saw something funny, this kid thought that the radeon 9600, and yes my walmart still sells that, was the 9600GT

that was really messed so I had to stop him

The 9600GT will come out next weak, If you wanna buy the 8800GS, your better off waiting and buying the 9600GT because it is faster, you waited how long already, whats a week


----------



## cdawall (Feb 16, 2008)

gotta agree with kain wait for the new cards and get either an el-cheapo midrange card to bridge the gap or just sit with your 7600GS another couple weeks


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 16, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Going to be heading to Best buy soon. I may just do an 8600GT and wait for the HD4xxx's. To me that seems liek the best option with those cards confirmed to be released soon.



Soon, at th end of the 2nd quarter soonest which means June time.


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 16, 2008)

KainXS said:


> well you said you were going to get the GS so go for it, we need someone here on the forums to get that card to tell us how it performs, specifically the card that you want
> 
> but the specs for the 4850 series is out now and they have GDDR5 and 480 shaders but 16 rops
> 
> still I would like to see how GDDR5 performs so I might sell my 3850 and play the waiting game



spoke to wizz since day, he said its a better bang than a 3850, he's benching one as we speak.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 16, 2008)

Guys are gonna flip! 

Instead of the case I got an Antec Earthwatts 500W.

And my video card choice .......

DUNN DUNN DUNNNN

**drum rolls** 

A once nVidia fanboy turns to an ATi Radeon HD2600XT 512MB DDR3 for $110 on clearance at Best Buy!

Time for a long awaited installation ......


----------



## Xazax (Feb 16, 2008)

booo.... did we not point out, heck i even pointed out... the 2600XT GDDR4 for $85!!!

man, but if your happy then be happy!


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 16, 2008)

Booooooooooooooooooooooooooo

but if it floats ur boat ...


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 16, 2008)

Well .... got it same day and paid only lil extra, s'all good cuz same day right?


----------



## Xazax (Feb 16, 2008)

Please return it please, save yourself some cash and get this.

not only is it $5 cheaper then that one u bought at bestbuy, its the GDD4 Verison with a Dual Slot Cooler, but not ONLY THAT its free shipping which is 3 day with newegg.com and to top it all off it comes with a $30 MIR, making this baby a grand total of $75 
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127305

please take it back to besybuy even if you dont send in the MIR its still $5 cheaper and u get the faster GDD4 verison without the useless 512mb of memory.

just my 2 cents, im glad you got the 2600XT its a decent card for its price, just dont get ripped off by BB!


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 16, 2008)

Xazax said:


> Please return it please, save yourself some cash and get this.
> 
> not only is it $5 cheaper then that one u bought at bestbuy, its the GDD4 Verison with a Dual Slot Cooler, but not ONLY THAT its free shipping which is 3 day with newegg.com and to top it all off it comes with a $30 MIR, making this baby a grand total of $75
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127305
> ...



Seconded


----------



## cdawall (Feb 16, 2008)

Xazax said:


> Please return it please, save yourself some cash and get this.
> 
> not only is it $5 cheaper then that one u bought at bestbuy, its the GDD4 Verison with a Dual Slot Cooler, but not ONLY THAT its free shipping which is 3 day with newegg.com and to top it all off it comes with a $30 MIR, making this baby a grand total of $75
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127305
> ...



thirded


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Yah well Xazax .. $25 off from a gift card doesn't sound bad now does it?


----------



## Xazax (Feb 17, 2008)

AH but you said you payed $110, if you payed 110 then -$25 ok thats good your just scaring me because you acutally bought something from BB lol


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

paid 120 after tax - the $25 gift card but s'all good.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

after all of our advice you ended up with a 2600XT, bad form my friend.

i mean no offense but that card is weaker than four harnessed toddlers.

wolf.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Then sell me one of your 8800GT's for 100.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

i only have one, and no 

my move would have been to wait, then again i say that now but when it comes to new gear i can get impatient.

honestly i jsut thought there are better options than a 2600XT out there for around the same price, an 8600GT per say.


----------



## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Then sell me one of your 8800GT's for 100.




Neither the 8600 or 2600XT is worth considering, they are the type of cards you buy for temporary usage until you can afford something better. There are much better cards to be had if you're serious about sustaining a gaming rig with longevity cheaply, such as the 8800GS, 3850, 2900Pro.

Edit: Wolf forget about the over clock factor of the 8600, it's not worth the hassle; performance will still be average in newer games and abysmal in the batch of next generation games.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

agreed. however 8600 > 2600, especially when you take into account the massive O/C's you can pull off a 8600GT


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Ok Darren ... Mr. "ASUS Ati Radeon X1600"

Just whatever ....


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

LOL JrRacinFan, point WELL made, lol......

and if the 2600XT is weaker than 4 harnessed toddlers, just imagine how weak the x1600 is, lol.

jolly good show chaps.


----------



## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Ok Darren ... Mr. "ASUS Ati Radeon X1600"
> 
> Just whatever ....



Exactly I've got first hand experience on low end cards, so take the advice from me. The X1600 was a good card when I bought it over a year ago. I'm not all about buying the latest and greatest card whenever Nvida and ATI decide to release new hardware, I choose the best bang for my buck, and at the time the X1600 was the best bang for my buck. The 8600GT and 2600XT have never been a good bang for your buck type cards.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

i gotta disagree with you there darren.

i bought two 8600GT XT editions for around 100$ each US 8 months ago, and they jsut clocked up so high.......

for around 75$ US LESS than a G80GTS at the time, they exceeded the G80GTS's performance by about 10%

so i paid around 20% less for them together, and got 10% more performance, not to mention one card scores 6,800 06'3dmarks, which chops the last gen products.

im sorry but to me, thats bang for buck.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

**ignores Darren** 

@wolf
Ok so what if I said Visiontek 2600XT 512MB or PNY 8600GT 256MB / Same price ... "??"

I only went with the Radeon for crossfireable and 512MB


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

hmmm, i still would say the 8600GT, purely because the cards aren't powerful enough to game at a res that would make use of all of the ram, not to mention its all castrated 128bit ram anyway.

and you can seriously get 20+% more performance from a o/c 8600GT, from what i hear the 2600's don't clock up that high, and even when they do, the performance impact is marginal at best.

still dude, this is all just my take on it, and i have a mate with a 2600XT, hes very happy, but he is in no form whatsoever a tweaker.


----------



## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

Wolf, I suppose it depends geographical location as far as prices. In the UK the 8600 is about £55-70, the 8800GT is £140 so it makes logical sense to get one 8800GT rather than SLI the 8600 because one 8800GT is the faster card. 

JrRacinFan, you appear to act like an immature little kid, you come on here asking for a comparison of the 3850 and 8800GS then decide to get a "lesser" card despite the community giving you excellent feedback that has generated 9 pages of peoples personal time.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

yeah it was only a great purchase at the time, now that the 8800GT is out, its cheaper and better than the old 8800GTS.

mainly i said that because you wrote that "The 8600GT and 2600XT have never been a good bang for your buck type cards." and that isn't true. not in my opinion.

personally i'd say 8800 ftw but since his budget is so low there isn't much leeway for one.

the only reason im not flogging off my 8600's is cos nvidia will implement a physics processing software for them.


----------



## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

Indeed, at one point in time the 8600GT was a great buy, I'm not going to lie I've considered purchasing both the 8600GT and 2600XT, the off putting aspect was that last generations of DX 9.0 cards perform equivalent or better such as the x1950 and 7950.  But I solely agree the 8600 did hold the midrange slot although for a brief time. 

Wolf surely you agree with me that at present time neither the 2600XT or 8600 isn't the best upgrade choice. Actually don't agree lets leave JrRacinFan to dig his own grave with regret and a burnt wallet.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

agreed. they were never the best upgrade choice, but no, i wouldn't recommend either to anyone, at this point in time. compared to whats out there, they are weak as piss.

the 8800GS or 3850 would trump either for not too much more at all.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

EDITED OUT AND CENSORED!

All apologies.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

dude, i don't agree with your choice being dumb or digging your own grave or anything, darren said that not me. however i do disagree with your choice, no more no less.

in the end people will buy whatever they want to buy and thats that, i just put my opinion out there.

the 2600XT will game, and i dare say not badly at all, and i wish you the best of luck with it.

honestly my intention was never to piss you off, and since i have i offer my sincere apologies. i have too many enemies already, i dont want another. sorry dude.

oh and youre quite right, it will be better than a 7600GS.


----------



## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Or how about you just STFU Darren.
> 
> Oh really wolf? you can STFU up too.
> 
> All i goddamn know is its better than that fucking 7600GS and better than your damn X1600 "WTF" Edition Darren



Maybe I have an x1600 Pro because I don't game often have you considered that? Not everyone is a gamer. x1600 Pro is a temporary card until I can start gaming hardcore again in the summer, by which time I'll purchase a shiny new 3870 or 2900 XT.

Both Wolf and I were trying to help you, but you insult us. Why create a forum just to ignore advice and yell like a kid. We obviously have more knowledge in this area than you, but you can lead the blind.

Edit: Sorry if I offended you, but you need to grow up and accept constructive criticism.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Same here Mr. Darren. Maybe I bought the 2600XT because i knew that it would hold me over as well. It's been quite a while since my last video card purchase. Look, I am quite a calm person, and when i outburst like that then you know something is wrong.

I mean c'mon, look at my specs, tell me I'm not a budget guy. 

My apology goes out to you, I know you were trying to help but sometimes in context it looks like criticism, for both of you Darren & wolf.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

in all honesty i got carried away, and its easy to do that when im sitting here with a 8800GT.

and taking a look at the system, yeah dude, if budget is your thing, the 2600XT will slot in nicely with the rest of the gear.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

its cool. I needed to upgrade my psu so thats where $65 also went. If i didnt have to do that I would not have minded doing the wait for an HD3850.


----------



## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Same here Mr. Darren. Maybe I bought the 2600XT because i knew that it would hold me over as well. It's been quite a while since my last video card purchase. Look, I am quite a calm person, and when i outburst like that then you know something is wrong.
> 
> I mean c'mon, look at my specs, tell me I'm not a budget guy.
> 
> My apology goes out to you, I know you were trying to help but sometimes in context it looks like criticism.



I'm actually quiet disappointed that you insulted Wolf, You should apologize to Wolf personally.

Not disputing the 2600XT's capabilities as a budget card, I'm disputing its capabilities as the *best performing * budget card. It should be fine for casual gaming on a temporary basis, but you have to accept the 8800GS and 3850 is still the better deal especially if you are the type of person that upgrades every two years or so.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

I did over pm. Of course I never did say in this whole thread that 8800GS/HD3850 was a rip-off.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

maybe we should just lay this one to rest.

choices have been made, as have apologies, maybe its best left alone now.


----------



## Xazax (Feb 17, 2008)

lol im just wondering how this has gone to 9 pages and ended up with a 2600XT when the OP wanted a HD 3650/8800GS


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Nah man, its cool. He can say what he wants, I just feel like I made a decent decision and being as that I had a limited budget of $180 and had to buy a power supply too.

@ Xazax

2600XT's are a little better IMO, and if I really don't truly like the looks of 9600GT or any of the 4xxx series, I will just get another and crossfire them, sprouted from there .... 

My budget got limited and really didn't want to wait for a card.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

you did what you could with the resources you had, and what was available to purchase, what more could you want.

now you have psu and gfx, game away son!


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Oh and to show you guys, I got the PCI-e version of this:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814129090


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

the plus side of this card is even without all the horsepower, the 512 ram should keep in in the arena for a year or 2 maybe, given the game dev's just keep loading on bigger and bigger textures.

so like i was saying, it may not be as fast as the 8600GT even, but in a year if we compare it to a 256 meg 8600GT...who knows, imo in 2 years it'll be on top for sure.

back in 03-04 the word around the water cooler was that only the ram speed was of importance, not the size. nowadays theres so much more to take into account, size is crucial, speed is crucial, and so is the bus. so basically the bandwidth and size are what you need to consider imo.


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 17, 2008)

jr  ...please tell me in a paragraph what u want and how much u want to spend.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

IRA, never said you werent one of the closer members. I got the card I want, does the games I play at the resolution and eye candy I want them to play at.

In all honesty though with that being said, I would have loved to grab myself an HD3850, but I know it would be wayyy overkill. I am pretty happy with my choice, later on if i need a lil more oomph I can always crossfire. 

Remember, i am not one to upgrade my graphics often, because I usually do it for a generation of games that I like. Days in the life of the casual but "loves-eye-candy" gamer.


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 17, 2008)

ok. i guess if ur satisfied, who am i to say anything.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

What were you getting at buddy?


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 17, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> What were you getting at buddy?




not getting at anyhting im jsut saying if ur comfortable thats all that matters.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Oh mmk. Truthfully if I didn't want to get a new psu I would have just waited on shipping for an 8800GS, like was said before.


----------



## KainXS (Feb 17, 2008)

I'm confused now, what is going on

we went from 2900gt to 2600xt to hd 3850 to 8800gs to hd 3850 and now were back to 2600 xt

I'm just glad its over, its over 200 posts man , wow


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

LMAO, Yeah sorry for the long painful one. Truthfully, I was mixed between getting a new psu and not.


----------



## Wile E (Feb 17, 2008)

Well, it isn't what I would've done, but I can't argue with your logic. A good psu is always a good purchase.

I think I would've waited for a 3650 instead of the 2600 tho.


----------



## wolf (Feb 17, 2008)

arent the 3650 and 2600XT like almost the same? in terms of power that is.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Hate to add to the thread. Last night the 2600XT died from overheat,started artificating during gaming and wasn't even overclocked.In short, got the 8600GT from a return. Let's just hope this thing lasts even longer.


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Feb 17, 2008)

orly?


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

Yah, unfortunately.


----------



## cdawall (Feb 17, 2008)

and you wonder why it was on clearance at BB?


as for the 8600GT you can just go of to sols thread and do all his mods


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

LOL 


For the 8600GT .... It's about 50% better....
This is with the proc @3Ghz and video card completely stock ...


----------



## KainXS (Feb 17, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> LOL
> 
> 
> For the 8600GT .... It's about 50% better....
> This is with the proc @3Ghz and video card completely stock ...



thats why we tried to push you away from the 2600XT

you should be able to get a little over 8600GTS performance with that card

can you take a pic of it

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814133199

if thats the card, then it should be pretty similar to the chaintech 8600GT on this page right

http://www.ixbt.com/video3/g84-3.shtml


----------



## JrRacinFan (Feb 17, 2008)

That is the exact same card, Kain. Cooler is a little different, but everything else is the same.


----------



## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

ive got 8600's running at 742 core 1836 shader and 1700 memory, stock volts.

at this speed they trump a stock GTS by about 10%, even though the memory bandwidth is lower, the core and shaders hum along nicely enough to make it sing!

in short, just follow the steps in sols guide, or simply, oc in increments, testing for stability at each stop, and when you've gotten to the roof, write it up a bios, and sit back and enjoy.

for what they cost, i still think a 86GT is a solid card, enjoy mate.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

Thanks wolf. Here is what I have so far.


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

very nice man, keep at it, shouldn't take more than a few more hours to suss out about where she'll top out.

edit: oh and remember to force 100% fan in rivatuner.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

What's a safe temp for her? She idle's in my hot apt at 56C.


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

dont exceed 80-85, but really youll want her to top out under load at 70 degrees or less, thatll keep her living for years.

jsut remember to force 100% fan in rivatuner, and it should be fine.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

Sweet thanks man.


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

never a problem to help out TPU brethren.

so did forcing 100% fan change your temps much? and what cooling is on your 8600? stocko?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

Unfortunately stock. Nope, not really, at those clocks it got up to 82 under load on Mother Nature. I cut it back to only a lil bit over stock.

You wouldn't beleive how well this thing performs over my old card. I maxed 11k in 3dM03 and 82K in AM3.


On a side note, I can't run AM3 or NFS:Carbon with anything other than the CD drivers. Any clue?


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

good to see your liking it, and theres a host of mods for that card.

good thing is its not a very hot card, so even a cheaper after market cooler (if you wanted to go down that road) would suffice quite well.

the zalman VF 700 is pretty much bottom of the barrel and that keeps my 8600's under 65 degrees in a hot Australian summer. i believe they can be had at around 20$ US

edit: these are the cards i have http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150258 but with an even higher oc 
       and although newegg doesnt say it, it is the most recent XXX version.


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

which drivers have you tried?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

169.25's & tweaksrus 171.23's


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

ive been on 169.21'a for a while now and they dont let me down....still, a very odd problem, im looking into it for ya m8.

edit: you say you cant run those particular games, what exactly is happening, from the moment you double click the .exe?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

Well Carbon just crashes with an error report although I can run it in safe mode and Aquamark artifacts and locks-up right at the screen where it says "select measurement".


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

that may not be a driver error, but since you can run them with the CD drivers........

still looking into it.


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## KainXS (Feb 18, 2008)

the stock heatsink is trash

http://www.ixbt.com/video3/images/g84-3/chaintech-8600gt-cooler1.jpg

you can buy a pretty cheap heatsink to cool it and get much better results and let the beast out in that thing

look at one of these, they're great coolers on a budget

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186017

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835128020

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118116

I would reccomend the accelero s2, its a great cooler

heres a review of the accelero s2 on a 8600gt

http://xtreview.com/review199.htm

you should get a 120mm fan with it and it will drop the temps massively on it


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

agreed, when kept around 60 degrees, they can really let loose in terms of sheer gpu mhz.

i mean stock 8600gt on stock vcore is 540... ive pushed 740, and i know sols gone higher.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

Trust me I've looked Kain.

WHat do you think it could be wolf?


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

i dont think its specific to drivers, i think theres something else at play here...but i cant put my finger on it.... how fresh is your current windows install?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

I would say .... about a month but theres tons of crap on this drive.

EDIT: Nevermind, still no clue.


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## wolf (Feb 18, 2008)

iunno man, i got nothin aye. my process goes:

reinstall the application
reinstall the drivers
reinstall the windows

if all that fails, then youll need to speak to the higher ups.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

I figured it out though. It was a combination of the 169.21's (using 163's right now), improperly set vcore and improperly set resolution for my monitor.


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## cdawall (Feb 18, 2008)

its nv drivers mine locked up in games on _most_ newer drivers i'm running the ones on the disk now and will throw the tweaksrus 17x.xx on it


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 18, 2008)

Meh, everything works now with Beta 169.04's. I am going to leave it as is. 

So far 600/700/1400 clocks on the card. Aquamark runs up to around 118, 3dmark03 close to 16k. So far I am extremely happy with my choice.

Although the only downfall is that this vid card requires more northbridge voltage than the 7600GS but that is to be expected. cdawall, You almost finished with your Intel build?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 19, 2008)

*For pos_pc*

Take a look. Post yours in reply....


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## Xazax (Feb 19, 2008)

check this out.

"After carrying out this process we managed to reach a 693MHz core and a 913MHz (1826MHz DDR) memory frequency, which was proven to be completely stable after a 4 hour continuous loop in 3Dmark2006."

8600GT OC'ing guide using stock cooler via Legionhardware
http://www.legionhardware.com/document.php?id=657&p=1

you have quite some headroom there.


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## wolf (Feb 19, 2008)

i'd say most 8600GT's clock up to about 700 on the core and over 1620 on the shaders.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 26, 2008)

Some new benches....








http://www.techpowerup.com/gpuz/46mf9/


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## Wile E (Feb 26, 2008)

Run 06. I can't judge things based off of 03. lol.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 26, 2008)

No problem. But here is the bad, I can't force a 1280x1024 res, so the results would have to based off 1152x864.

EDIT: about 8k in 3dm05 and about 4.5-5k in 3dm06. But I will run it and post.


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## Wile E (Feb 26, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> No problem. But here is the bad, I can't force a 1280x1024 res, so the results would have to based off 1152x864.
> 
> EDIT: about 8k in 3dm05 and about 4.5-5k in 3dm06. But I will run it and post.



Uninstall your monitor drivers (use the MS PnP driver), and turn off scaling in the NV cp. Should let you run default then.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 26, 2008)

K will try it.


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 26, 2008)

Here yah go Wile E.

http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=5445276


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## Wile E (Feb 26, 2008)

Not too shabby. It's about equal to my old X1800XT. Should keep you chugging along at at least medium for a while.

Here's mine, for shits and giggles. lol.
http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=4602198


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 26, 2008)

Im just wondering, if I get me some cooling other than stock I could probably push the ram a little higher. Yeah should hold me over for a while.

Think I will go crossfire in the future though. I am bad I am already planning on what is next.

EDIT: Nice score! Isn't that a little much for a 19" LCD? Practically same model specs I have.


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## Wile E (Feb 26, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Im just wondering, if I get me some cooling other than stock I could probably push the ram a little higher. Yeah should hold me over for a while.
> 
> Think I will go crossfire in the future though. I am bad I am already planning on what is next.
> 
> EDIT: Nice score! Isn't that a little much for a 19" LCD? Practically same model specs I have.


Yeah, it is, but I'm mainly a benchmarker, and most benches have a low default res anyway. Getting fast hardware is more important overall. Once I get my QX, I'll start saving for a 1920x1200 monitor.


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## p_o_s_pc (Feb 26, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Some new benches....
> 
> 
> 
> ...



nice...  I still am at around 20-21k in 03 and our 05 and 06 are about the same.


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## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

very nice Jr


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 26, 2008)

Thanks guys.


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## p_o_s_pc (Feb 27, 2008)

Have you run 3dmark 05? If so what is your score?


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## JrRacinFan (Feb 27, 2008)

I have run it, currently my DSL is down and can only post while on break at work. I will have to dig through and add my score.


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## p_o_s_pc (Feb 28, 2008)

ok..


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## JrRacinFan (Mar 18, 2008)

Sorry for not replying sooner POS.

Here's a link.
http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=4040418


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## wolf (Mar 18, 2008)

dude u gotta pencil mod that 8600 and let her flyy!! over 800 on the core and over 1750 on the shaders with pencil mod is piss easy i rekcon. imo since the memory is so narrow getting a little more outta that wont do you much good, but you can get plenty from that core


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## p_o_s_pc (Mar 18, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Sorry for not replying sooner POS.
> 
> Here's a link.
> http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm05=4040418



thx. damn your system is about the same in the benchs as mine. You have a nice rig there.


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## FlipIt (Mar 21, 2008)

The 8800 GS is much more better cause its cheaper then 2 Ati's and you could even save more money and purkase 2 8800 GS
PS dont worry about the resolution ...


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## JrRacinFan (Mar 21, 2008)

And you could read the whole thread. But thanks for the input!


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