# PSU and Consumption issues...



## Greenmousa (Oct 23, 2009)

Hi guys, well this is my question for the day, im sure that everyone here knows...it's a pain in the ass to be upgrading and upgrading PSUs, it's tedious, expensive and you don't really feel an impact in performance so, getting to it, this is my actual RIG:

PHENOM X4 9600 @2.3ghz
OCZ 4x 1GB DDr2 @866mhz
MSI - K9A2-CF edition (worst mother ever, it sucks) 
MSI ATI HD 4850 512mb OC Edition
And the important Part...
POWERCOOLER 550w MODULAR TYPE R2






It has 2 PCIe Connectors since it was made for Xfire (although...i really doubt this would pull any Xfire beyond 2x3870's)

My question is, im going for this rig right now...

PHENOM 2 x3 720 BE @2.8 (planning on taking it to 3.0 at least)
OCZ 2x2gb DDR3 @ 1333
GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P 4DDR3 2PCIE UD3 or MSI 790FX-GD70 AMD 790FX AM3 PCI-E (x16) DDR3
ATI 5850 1gb (any brand actually maybe Saphire or HiS)

And im planning to keep my old PSU, technically the Processor and the VGA won't take much more power than the old ones, or at least that's what i found out by looking at reviews and stuff like that, but well this is my first post in this forum and im really hoping you guys can lend me a hand.

Basically im trying to not change my PSU for all the above reasons and what i didn't mentioned before, im from argentina, here we have HUGE imports taxes going to 51% in some cases so you guys should have that in mind, im a really budget person and trying to be happy with that XD. 

So big question is, based on the 12v rails and total power consumption (i don't use any extras HD nor DVD drives just a 160GB HD and one DVD recorder) do you think that this PSU will hold the load?? 

Thank you all in advance and im really sorry if this is the wrong place to post, i thought this would be the place


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 23, 2009)

You are in the right section.  PC Power and Cooler make great PSU's.  Your new system will overall use less power.  The new CPU is far more power efficient,  The 5850 power efficiency is just plan scary at times.  The new chipsets are a little power hungry, but not enough to matter.  As the PSU ages a little more, it may give you some issues, but for now it should be just enough.


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## Woody112 (Oct 23, 2009)

TheLaughingMan said:


> You are in the right section.  PC Power and Cooler make great PSU's.  Your new system will overall use less power.  The new CPU is far more power efficient,  The 5850 power efficiency is just plan scary at times.  The new chipsets are a little power hungry, but not enough to matter.  As the PSU ages a little more, it may give you some issues, but for now it should be just enough.



I think we might be getting PCP&C "PC Power & Cooling" confused with PC "power cooler". I just looked up that PSU he's showing there and it's not a the PC P&C, that were thinking of.

EDIT: or should I say that I'm thinking of. LOL


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## Woody112 (Oct 23, 2009)

http://powercooler.com.ar/productos/fuente_ps_550tr.html
Here's the one I think he's looking at. Only 76% efficency, can only imagine what the PFC is. I personally wouldn't get this PSU.
New egg has some good deals going on right now for some corsair PSU's.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139006
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139005
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139004


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## angelkiller (Oct 23, 2009)

Ok, expect to pull ~300W DC under CPU + Furmark stress. Probably ~250W under typical gaming situations.

I wouldn't feel comfortable using that PSU. It's not that it can't do it... 76% average efficiency indicates an (relatively) inefficient design. Inefficient designs are that way usually because they use lower quality parts. This leads to poor voltage regulation and the possibility of overloading the PSU. I seriously doubt that thing can put out 550W.

I would recommend you upgrade your PSU. How do you get PC parts in Argentina? Do you have and some online stores?


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 24, 2009)

Woody112 said:


> I think we might be getting PCP&C "PC Power & Cooling" confused with PC "power cooler". I just looked up that PSU he's showing there and it's not a the PC P&C, that were thinking of.
> 
> EDIT: or should I say that I'm thinking of. LOL



Good point, I over looked that.

Brands to Trust with your Computer Power

Cosair
PC Power & Cooling
Seasonic
SevenTeam
Antec


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## Woody112 (Oct 24, 2009)

TheLaughingMan said:


> Good point, I over looked that.
> 
> Brands to Trust with your Computer Power
> 
> ...



+1 Agreed. I would say OCZ also, but just because they bought out PCP&C doesn't make em as good. But they are good PSU's from the reviews I've seen.


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Oct 24, 2009)

Avoid this psu


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## p_o_s_pc (Oct 24, 2009)

Woody112 said:


> +1 Agreed. I would say OCZ also, but just because they bought out PCP&C doesn't make em as good. But they are good PSU's from the reviews I've seen.



OCZ does make some good PSUs. I myself own one and love it. its fairly quiet and is stable.


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## [Ion] (Oct 24, 2009)

p_o_s_pc said:


> OCZ does make some good PSUs. I myself own one and love it. its fairly quiet and is stable.



Yep, the StealthXStream and the GameXStream are pretty good, as is the "Z", but it's not worth how much they charge for it.  The ModXStream isn't a quality PSU according to [H], so I would stay away from it.


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## Woody112 (Oct 24, 2009)

p_o_s_pc said:


> OCZ does make some good PSUs. I myself own one and love it. its fairly quiet and is stable.


Ya they are really good. I'm just not fond of there lower end stuff. But there z-series, gamextreme, and stealthXtremes are very good PSU. Right up there with the best IMO.


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## p_o_s_pc (Oct 24, 2009)

Woody112 said:


> Ya they are really good. I'm just not fond of there lower end stuff. But there z-series, gamextreme, and stealthXtremes are very good PSU. Right up there with the best IMO.





[Ion] said:


> Yep, the StealthXStream and the GameXStream are pretty good, as is the "Z", but it's not worth how much they charge for it.  The ModXStream isn't a quality PSU according to [H], so I would stay away from it.



I agree with both of you. I have the GameXstream and its been just as good as my Silverstone


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## Woody112 (Oct 24, 2009)

[Ion] said:


> Yep, the StealthXStream and the GameXStream are pretty good, as is the "Z", but it's not worth how much they charge for it.  The ModXStream isn't a quality PSU according to [H], so I would stay away from it.





Woody112 said:


> Ya they are really good. I'm just not fond of there lower end stuff. But there z-series, gamextreme, and stealthXtremes are very good PSU. Right up there with the best IMO.



That's funny what are the odd of posting the exact same general comment at the exact same time.


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 24, 2009)

I knew I forgot someone.

Add SilverStone to my tier 1 picks.

Tier 2 I would go with (budget PSU's)

OCZ (see above)
Rosewill
Ultra
BFG (Best non-Active PFC PSUs I know)


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## p_o_s_pc (Oct 24, 2009)

TheLaughingMan said:


> I knew I forgot someone.
> 
> Add SilverStone to my tier 1 picks.
> 
> ...



thats a brand i never thought would even make it on a list of recommended PSUs when they first started showing up on the egg  doesn't BFG have some active PFC psus?

EDIT: a quick look on the egg shows that BFG DOES have active PFC on some of there PSUs http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...&N=2010090058 50001883 1131509966&name=Active


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## [Ion] (Oct 24, 2009)

TheLaughingMan said:


> I knew I forgot someone.
> 
> Add SilverStone to my tier 1 picks.
> 
> ...


Maybe the ThermalTake Toughpower as well?
Enermax for sure (tier 1)
Also maybe Cooler Master Real Power Pro
Some Zalmans
Maybe Xigmatek?  I know it's at CWT PSH like the Corsair TX750 and 850, so it should be good (I haven't seen any reviews of them, so this could be completely wrong)


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 24, 2009)

Don't worry.  I am no authority and I know I forgot some very very good brands.  I am just listed brands I have used myself, a customer, and friends.  That way I can personally vouch for them.

BFG does make some Active PFC PSUs.  I didn't say they didn't.  But their non-active PFC units like my roommates BFG 550 GS has like a 82% average efficiency rating at 40C.  The only reason it is not 80+ certified is efficency drops to 79ish when at full load.  And his PSU was like $43 when he bought it which is damn near stealing.

Rosewill -  Some of them, especially the new ones are really well built.  Some of their older models were crap (Most of the Stallion Series), but they bounced back and upped quality of parts.

Favorite website for PSU reviews is www.hardwaresecrets.com  Those are my guys for PSUs because some sites test, they torture.  Some PSUs fail on their site because they simply do not survive to the end.

TPU is fro GPU's and you guys.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 24, 2009)

Well first of all thank you all for your answers, really, it helps, for your "AVOID THAT PSU" comments i must tell you, i can't avoid it, i already have it XD had it for like...2 years now with this rig and it gave me no problems so far. 

The whole point was, would this PSU be enough for the rig im trying to pull?

I looked at all the options you gave me and let me stress this point enough i mentioned im from argentina, so imports come really tax heavy around here, Powercooler it's a national brand or at least...national manufacture and international licenses...the other available and nice priced PSU i can get is this one:

SATELLITE 600W

AC Input 90v - 264Vac

DC OP:    +3.3V // +5V // +12V1 // +12V2 // -12V // +5Vsb 
SL8600:        24A // 30A // 22A // 22A // 0.5A // 2A // 

That one i can get really cheap right now i must tell you this so you can forget about pages like Newegg and things like that (although i tottally envy you guys for having those options ), the oversea shipment and all will greatly increase the cost of a (for you guys) cheap 43 bucks psu and make it into a raging 100ish bucks product when it reaches my door.

So i know it's a sad thing having so limited options but well...you know...i must work with what i have...

Oh another thing...what about...i just change the Motherboard and the Processor, in that case this PSU will hold up fine?? I really can't see why not but im asking you guys.

So Quick wrap up:

1 ---WILL THE SATELLITE 600PSU MAKE IT AS A POSSIBLE OPTION???
2----IF I DON'T ADD A 5850 TO THE MIX, WILL I NEED ALL THE EXTRA PSU?? OR ILL HOLD UP JUST FINE WITH THE MOTHERS I SUGGESTED IN THE FIRST POST, DDR3 MEMOS AND THE PHENOM 2 X3 720???


Thank you guys again for your huge help


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## Frick (Oct 24, 2009)

Never heard of that thing. If your old PSU took care of your old system no problem, why buy a new one?

BTW, Type R is something from Hiper, right? I think this unit and the Hiper unit came in plastic boxes, so it might be a rebranded Hiper PSU.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 24, 2009)

Yes it came in a plastic box, almost a Tool Box size with compartiments, it's modular and in here ive seen it pull even 4850s in crossfire, nevertheles...im open to advices 

ABout your question of Why buy a new one, it's just because of what i asked, will it be able to pull the same config but with a new Motherboard, ddr3 Memos and a Phenom 2 X3 730??

That's all thank you a lot for your answer 

And by the way you may be Awfully Right!

HIPER:






POWERCOOLER:






Yeap theyre practically the same, as i stated in the second post, many times, brands here in argentina are National Manufacture of International Licenses.


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 24, 2009)

Ok, get what you want.  The 5850, new prosessor, the works and just try it.  Once you got it up and running, run a quick stress test on the entire system and see if it will crash.  If it does, it is most likely the PSU not providing enough clean power.

As stated before, the Phonom X3 720 and the 5850 compared to your old Agena 9600 and 4850 will use less power, not more.  The power consumption on a 5850 is the same as a 4850 in use and idles far lower.  So try your current PSU and see if it will work.  If it does, stick with it.  I think it should be just fine.

Since your choices are limited, if you decide to get a new PSU, just look for these features.  Active PFC is a must for gaming and high end rigs.  One large Single 12V rail is preferred.  Make sure it has enough plugs for what you have and any possible expansion.  I say get no less than 2 PCIe plugs, 4 SATA, 4 Molex, and 24 pin primary with a 4+4 pin or 8 pin CPU plug.  For gaming get 550 to 1000 Watts depending on how many GPU's you plan to have.  If Crossfire/SLI is something you never plan to do, 550 to 650 Watts is a good range.  If you want 2 GPU's at some point, get a PSU with 4 PCIe plugs and 700+ Watts.

I hope I answered all the questions.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 24, 2009)

First of all, thank you for your answer.

Second do i note a certain...anger tone?? I sure hope not since im not being stubborn or anything...in my current position not only choices are limited but also money, so excuse me if i try to stick with a product i allready have instead of buying a new one  i would love to have it any other way but it's just what it is.

Regarding your recomendations:

I know my PSU isn't great at all, but it does cover a serie of points you've stated:

PFC ACTIVE>>>> YES
2 PCIE>>>> YES
4 SATA>>>> YES
8 MOLEX>>>> YES
ATX 20+4 + Aux 4 pin >>> ??? Is that good for the Motherboard im trying to pull down here???

Crossfire or SLI never it's a good idea where it live...it's Texas hot in here....48°C in spring it's overkill for Xfire or SLi with no extra cooling...

So basically im allways stuck with Single GPU solutions, no more than one hard drive and one optic drive.

I will definitelly try to upgrade the CPU and MotherBoard with Memos DDR3 first maybe in the long run when i have more money upgrade my PSU so i feel more confortable with a 5850 or even 70.

Thank you a lot for your answers so far man, you've been helpfull .


Another thing... i come across this Motherboard at a really low price, should i get it??:

ELITEGROUP ECS A790GXM-AD3 1.0  AM3

Here i found a nice review with the bonus of being paired with a Phenom 2 X3 720 

http://pcper.com/article.php?aid=707&type=expert&pid=1

Thanks again!


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 24, 2009)

I do apologize if my listed came across as angry.  I wasn't and wasn't trying to be.  I think the issue was with the first statement of "Ok, get what you want."  I meant that as more of I think your PSU will be fine so don't let it limit your choices of new products.  Sorry for not wording it a little better.

Since you are limited to only one GPU, you can save a lot of money on the Mobo.  That would make the 2 your originally posted complete overkill.  You will not need a 790FX board of any kind as they are gear toward multi-GPU systems.  

I personally have had issues with ECS boards in the past and don't use them any more.

If you are getting these parts only, post a link to the site.  Even if we can't read the site, we should be able to get a better idea of the brands and parts you can get a hold of.  If you are getting these from a local store, what brand Mobo's does it carry?


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## Greenmousa (Oct 24, 2009)

No problem, everyone can have a missunderstanding in forums it's no big deal, 

Regarding what you ask:

Here are my options 

Considering im looking for a Native AM3 board:

*BIOSTAR  TA790GX A3+  AM3

ELITEGROUP ECS A790GXM-AD3 1.0 AM3

GIGABYTE Am3 Ga-ma79xtud4p 4ddr3 2pcie Ud3*


Oddly enough no one offers me lower tier mobos...theyre all in the same price range...around 145-155 dolars for AM3 native Mothers. 

_I may introduce a new ingredient to the mixture in here...._

Im a graphic designer...but...i do character designs for games cause...im a gaming fan and i can't live my life without my games :3 so the PC for me works as a workstation and a gaming platform, i've never tried to go FULL GAMER cause...you know...i gotta eat too...so i can't afford for example a 4870X2 or a Q6660 when they came out, and so i bought a Phenom 9600 and a 8600GT that got upgraded to a 4850 later on...

My current ocupation it's making me use Photoshop a lot...but Corel Draw and Painter are my tools of the trade i divide my day in gaming and working on the wacom and photoshop, so, here are the questions:


*Wich kind of Mobo will suffice??* 

I like to play my games at High specs, no AA nor AF but just in high, i have a 22'' LG monitor with native 1920x1028 res and my 4850 has been holding up quite nicely so far, playing even Need For Speed shift at a decent framerate, also WoW, D&D Online, and well...you get the picture, Prototype, Dead Space, Farcry all of them maxed out with no troubles. My current Mobo (MSI K9a2CF) SUCKS and in addition to that my Phenom 9600 (tlb disabled thank god) can't be overclocked not even 100mhz without leading to a full crash and burn involving hard reset and such... And that's why im asking about the motherboard, ive had bad experiences and particularly i allways used MSI but this time i felt so scammed when i found out that the Phenom 2 processor suport was a big fat lie (at least for the sad Revision 1 owners such as myself) and im willing to try another brand.

So Wich kind of chipset will be enough?? If i get a Phenom 2 X3 720 i might want to overclock it...it's like...at least im going to pull it to 3.0ghz, so it's of my understanding that i might need a good mobo for Ocing.

*Another Thing:*

You guys think that for my needs (Gaming, Photoshop and Corel on Vista 64 SP1) a Phenom 2 X3 720 BE will be ok?? i can get another CPUs for that same price, options are:

Phenom 2 X3 720 BE
Phenom 2 X4 810
Intel Q8200 (ughh...)

I was actually more interested in the 95w part of those two options since lately im all about power consumption XD

*About the Memory*

DDR3 or DDr2, this makes a world of difference, DDr3 means getting a Native AM3 motherboard when getting a DDR2 config allows me to cut some serious bucks... Will i notice a REAL difference in Gaming, Photoshop and other Design Programs?? or it's DDR3 overrated for the use ill give it??

Well...that's all i can think of right now, this is a really helpfull feedback im getting, all my life ive made tiny mistakes when building my rigs for not having this kind of answers. It's good to be here


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 25, 2009)

Recommendations for Budget Processor:

Athlon II X4 620  (better for Photoshop)
Phenom II X3 720 (better for gaming)

Out of the mobos listed:

GIGABYTE Am3 Ga-ma79xtud4p 4ddr3 2pcie Ud3

DDR3 vs. DDR2

Difference?  Yes
Noticable?  Depends on the kits being compared.  Usually, no.

Since you are on a budget, I say stick with DDR2 since I assume you plan to use the RAM you already have in your current system.

Mobo recommendation: (I know you can't shop at newegg.com, but I added the link to give you a picture of the mobo)

Great Budget AM3 board
GIGABYTE GA-MA770T-UD3P
AM2 Option
GIGABYTE GA-MA785G-UD3H

Side note, the Phenom II X4 925 has been released recently.  It basically makes the 810 pointless.  It is defaultly clocked 200 Mhz higher, has a full 6 MB L3 cache, and the 925 is only like an extra $8.


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## DonInKansas (Oct 25, 2009)

I've got personal experience building with the Biostar board and it's solid.  My only gripe would be there's no esata/FW outs but if you don't need them, it's not an issue.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 25, 2009)

Well...

Ive read your comment, and did some research...

First of all i will do my best to get a nice Mobo like that one (either, they both work for me) as long as the memory of my current Rig, i will probably Ditch them, since im planning to upgrade my brother's computer with mine (it's like that old Tux that you used in prom and you gave it to your brother when you couldn't fit in it anymore) So im getting new Memos either DDR3 or DDR2, i will see, anyway i like the posibility of being able to use one or the other, that i love about the migration sistem that AMD implemented (with all theyre flaws...)

I can't quite see myself with an Athlon II....ive read 2 reviews...dude...it's mind blowing what it can achieve for that price but i don't know...i like having a phenom XD!! 

Meanwhile what you just said about the 925, and the 810 being no good or even pointless i stumbled upon this:

http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,697850/AMD-lowers-CPU-prices-and-cuts-several-models/News/

You sir, are correct.

This is counter producting for me right now but it may prove to be an achievement on the long run, i mean, by waiting a week i found out that AMD discontinued 2 products that were in my buying plans...i mean that doesn't mean that they're bad products but you know...i remember when i got my first AMD XP 3500+ S939....it was the bomb...one week later, boom Am2 and there's go the neighborhood... Athlon X2 S939 got discontinued and my cheap upgrade options were long gone...so im tired of buying discontinued things.

On the other hand, the life of the computer builder it's a though one...every week something new comes along and your stuff it's old and so on every other week.

So, Bottom line, if the Phenom 2 X4 925 it's really 95w in power consumption, then im going for it at full speed! If it comes at a more expensive cost than the 720BE i will reconsider...but well...i guess ill have to sit and wait for a nice price on the processor area...

I will keep you guys updated on the subject this week when i start talking to providers and local stores trying to find something worth mentioning, meanwhile, you guys rock thank you for all your help, hope this thread is helpfull to someone else but me.

DoInkansas: Thanks for your feedback, and you are correct eSata and FW are not in my plans XD it's a 3rd world country here dammit XD


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## Woody112 (Oct 25, 2009)

TheLaughingMan said:


> Recommendations for Budget Processor:
> 
> Athlon II X4 620  (better for Photoshop)
> Phenom II X3 720 (better for gaming)
> ...




In regards to what he said I completely agree, if your main purpose is budget, work and mild gaming in mind there is no reason to go for anything more. The only thing I would recommend is with the price of memory so low you might as well go with ddr3 on a new am3 board. Amd is know to suppport older platforms unlike intel and will further future proof your build for the next new thing. I'm sure with AMD's past track record an AM3 board will last for some time to come. Who knows when they will drop ddr2 support all together. At least this way when they come out with a new chip you can be certain it will work on your board.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 25, 2009)

Certainly sir, AM3 mobo and DDR3 it is then, so im going for the best bang for the buck processor.

Thank you again dude


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 25, 2009)

Glad we could help.

One more thing the TDP of 95W is not the power consumption.  TDP means Thermal Design Power.  It refers to how much heat the CPU cooler has to dissipate for the processor to function.  While it is a good parallel as processors that product more heat, need more power, it is not always the case.

What you should look at for power consumption is the Voltage being drawn and number of cores.  Look for a review of the processors you want.  Most review will have a power consumption chart.  While you will most likely not get exact numbers, you can get an idea of which one needs more juice.


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## Woody112 (Oct 25, 2009)

TheLaughingMan said:


> Glad we could help.
> 
> One more thing the TDP of 95W is not the power consumption.  TDP means Thermal Design Power.  It refers to how much heat the CPU cooler has to dissipate for the processor to function.  While it is a good parallel as processors that product more heat, need more power, it is not always the case.
> 
> What you should look at for power consumption is the Voltage being drawn and number of cores.  Look for a review of the processors you want.  Most review will have a power consumption chart.  While you will most likely not get exact numbers, you can get an idea of which one needs more juice.



Good info. I was going to point that out but you hit the nail on the head.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 25, 2009)

You see? that's a good tip right there, didn't know that, my knowledge about voltage it's the knowledge of a monkey about dungeons & dragons.

Thank you sir(s) i will check some reviews based on what's offered to me and bring the results here so you can help me decide, you've been an enormous help so far


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Oct 25, 2009)

Keep ur ear on the ground and u wont buy EOL products


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## Greenmousa (Oct 25, 2009)

Oh and by the way are power supply calculators any good??

i made 2 tests trying my current system and my target system and they both scored 310 watts 

i mean i don't know...i added a 5870 to the mix and the wattage in full load went up only 5 watts so...i reaaaallly doubt thats really accurate...

But then again when it comes to wattage and voltage...this could be telling me the speed of a cheetah running thru the savannah and i wouldn't know so...are those results acurate??


[I.R.A]_FBi:

Yeah... i will try, i was young back in the day but no more...i've made up my mind no more EOLs here. And by the way are you allways so cryptic about your statements? im new here, maybe im not used to them. Theyre like...

"The end...Will come...."


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Oct 25, 2009)

.. indeed it will ...


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## Greenmousa (Oct 25, 2009)

I loled

Any word on the consumption calculation things??


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Oct 25, 2009)

300 to 350 is what id guesstimate


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 25, 2009)

Greenmousa said:


> Oh and by the way are power supply calculators any good??
> 
> i made 2 tests trying my current system and my target system and they both scored 310 watts
> 
> ...



They are and hear is your proof.

Check the power consumption of the 5850 and your current card.

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/HIS/HD_5850/28.html


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## Greenmousa (Oct 26, 2009)

Great, thank you man, it's great to know that it peaks even lower than my 4850  im a happy little person 

Thank you once more dude, ill just have to open a Thank you account just for you XD


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## Greenmousa (Oct 26, 2009)

Guys quick one.

I know im an asshole i didn't bring this up before but...

I am doing the right thing by upgrading my CPU before my GPU right?? I mean if this were the 2 possible scenarios wich one would you do??

1 -LEAVE PHENOM 9600BE, BUY ATI 5850 
2- LEAVE ATI 4850, BUY PHENOM II (ANY MODEL) AND NEW MOBO WITH DDR3 MEMOS

Im asking this cause im afraid that my agena friend over here could be a bottleneck to a 5850, so, im as allways expecting feedback


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## Greenmousa (Oct 26, 2009)

Bumpity bump?


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 26, 2009)

I would upgrade the CPU in your case first.  While I don't think it would bottleneck the card much, the new processors are faster, run cooler, use less power, and OC far better.  I think you would see a bigger difference in overall performance change the CPU first.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 26, 2009)

I have a doubt about that...ive been checking Phenom 9600BE Power Consumption charts, and it seems to consume less than the new ones, i know this is probably wrong but, can you help me prove that the New processors actually use less power?? like...with a link to a chart or something reliable??

Thank you a lot for your constant support


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 26, 2009)

Well to be honest, I am probably wrong about the power consumption when comparing a 9600BE one of the current Phenom II BE's.  Maybe the e models, or the dual and triple cores were being compared on the chart I remember when they Phenoms were first released.  The other this remain true though.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 26, 2009)

> The other this remain true though.



im sorry i don't understand that part 

I found this, Isolated Watt consumption using a volt clamp:

PHENOM 9600BE

 IDLE	           LOAD
 24 watts      88 watts 

PHENOM 2 X3 720

 IDLE            LOAD
 10.4 watts   55.6 watts

*This* it's a really helpfull page, if anyone it's in doubt about the ISOLATED power draw of your CPU:

So im much more confortable now wattage wise than i was before, and yes, im thinking about upgrading my CPU and MOBO first, mainly because i fucking hate my motherboard:

On that subject i got new offerings from local stores!! Tell me wich one do you preffer 

*CPU Offerings*:

CPU AMD PHENOM II X2 550 B.E 3.1GHZ 7MB 80 AM3 BO	$598.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
CPU AMD PHENOM II X3 720 B.E 2.8GHZ 7.5MB 95W AM3	$719.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)

*MOTHERBOARD OFFERINGS:*

MB ASUS AM3 M4A79T DELUXE DDR3 4PCIE	                $1160.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79FXTU5P 4DDR3 2PCI-E UD3	$1095.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P 4DDR3 2PCIE UD3	$820.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB _*MSI AM3 770T-C45 DDR3 GBLAN SND*_	                        $450.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB MSI AM3 790FX-GD70 DDR3 2PCI-EX16 GBLAN	        $1155.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB MSI AM3 790GX-G65 DDR AMD790 DDR3 V/S/R	        $870.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)

So, what do you guys think?? The one in Bold letters is the one i think (following your advices about getting away from 790GX) will be the one for me


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## [I.R.A]_FBi (Oct 26, 2009)

Id keep the cpu and buy the card


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## Greenmousa (Oct 26, 2009)

Damn you for making me choose even between advices!!!


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## Greenmousa (Oct 26, 2009)

Any feedback on the Motherboards and pricings?? 

I guess the CPU or GPU thing will be a matter of pricing mainly and of course user feedback as usual 

Thank you guys in advance


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 27, 2009)

Greenmousa said:


> Any feedback on the Motherboards and pricings??
> 
> I guess the CPU or GPU thing will be a matter of pricing mainly and of course user feedback as usual
> 
> Thank you guys in advance



Since you will not be using two GPU's ever, remove all the FX boards.  Those are more money than you need to speed.  All the brands and boards you picked are top notch.

I am going to pick the board at the bottom of the list because it is my motherboard.  Second place goes to the MB GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P


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## Greenmousa (Oct 27, 2009)

So the one i picked it's no good uh?? :'( i though that finally i could pull a nice budget mobo, life it's unfair...


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## p_o_s_pc (Oct 27, 2009)

The 790GX and 790fx are great boards but i think he is trying to say its overkill for your needs/uses but i highly recommend the 790gx boards to anyone looking for a budget overclocker.

also the GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P is a good board at a decent price

i don't recommend the MSI 770 because it looks to be built cheaply and if your wanting to overclock a tri or quad core the mosfets may have some problems and burn out at higher then stock voltage


BTW what is your price range and what store are you wanting to shop from?


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## Greenmousa (Oct 27, 2009)

Thank you P o s pc i understand what you are saying

Btw ill try to explain the money situation so you get a clear view, here a regular worker earns about 1.000 usd a month, im a college 23 years student and my incomes are low, if you translate that into my income wich is about 1000 pesos a month = 1000/3.68 for dollar equivalent, a $1105  motherboard it's a freaking lot XD, and that's why i asked about the $450 one! if you pair it up with the X3 720 you get $1120 for both CPU and Mobo, i hope this makes it easier to understand. Maybe this im saying it's not helpfull and it's my problem for living in a 3rd world country, but let's say, here being a PC "competitive"  gamer it's really hard and it takes a lot of money.

How this would help my post?? It probably wont...but, well, i will do my best to get the mobo you suggest but i will se what is stronger, my willing to save money or my willing to buy a new CPU and benchmark it... and maybe i must buy the parts one now and one later one cause here technology taxes are impredictable and may suffer a 14% increase one day to another i can only watch the prices sky rocket. That's why i allways intend to buy the whole thing in one sitting 

Besides 27 October it's my birthday  and if i save up enough i may auto gift me a new rig 

Thanks for your advice as usual my friend


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## p_o_s_pc (Oct 27, 2009)

what site you shopping from? I will recommend you a board from there if you give me a link


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## Greenmousa (Oct 27, 2009)

There is no shipping site my friend, mail responses from local retailers: 

Here are my options:

MB ASUS AM3 M4A79T DELUXE DDR3 4PCIE	 $1160.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79FXTU5P 4DDR3 2PCI-E UD3	$1095.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P 4DDR3 2PCIE UD3	$820.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB MSI AM3 770T-C45 DDR3 GBLAN SND	 $450.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB MSI AM3 790FX-GD70 DDR3 2PCI-EX16 GBLAN	 $1155.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)
MB MSI AM3 790GX-G65 DDR AMD790 DDR3 V/S/R	 $870.-(divide this digit for 3.68 to get the dollars result)

Thanks in advance on any input


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 27, 2009)

I just realized your boards are like really, really expensive compared to prices where we are.  The MSI 770 board seems like a good buy.  It is not the best, and OC will be limited, but it has good reviews from customers at the Egg, so get the cheapest one.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 27, 2009)

im glad i could make you see that, you see now how hard is to get a decent gaming rig over here? XD anyway i don't complain that much, im used to build on budget and i KNOW i will never have a top notch pc, not even momentarly, it's simply  out of range for me money wise.

I will do some review research and keep you guys informed, million thank you as usual


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## Greenmousa (Oct 27, 2009)

Do you think that Motherboard will hold up the Phenom 2X3 720 BE Clocked to 3.0 or 3.2??

Im just curious, i know it's a processor that likes Ocing so im willing to give it a try  Please let me know how you feel about it. Other Thing, the 125w Limit on the processor slot, will limit me?? I know it did in my old MoBo, but im wondering, all phenom 2 are coming in 125w or less nowadays right???

I found this review, i kinda like what i see 

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/motherboards/2009/09/17/msi-770-c45-motherboard-review/7

So guys, must hit the bed now, it's my birthday today so im going to sleep dreaming with mobos XD

Thanks in advance!


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## Greenmousa (Oct 27, 2009)

Im narrowing down my options to this 2 Motherboards, please help me make an informed decision with like...pro & cons if you can ? 

GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P 4DDR3 2PCIE UD3

MSI AM3 790GX-G65 DDR AMD790 DDR3 V/S/R

Awaiting for your replies as usual


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## Woody112 (Oct 27, 2009)

Greenmousa said:


> Im narrowing down my options to this 2 Motherboards, please help me make an informed decision with like...pro & cons if you can ?
> 
> GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P 4DDR3 2PCIE UD3
> 
> ...



I don't have any experience with these but from the reviews on egg they both seem like very good boards. PII CPU, and DDr3 sound like a win win at those prices.


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 27, 2009)

Greenmousa said:


> Im narrowing down my options to this 2 Motherboards, please help me make an informed decision with like...pro & cons if you can ?
> 
> GIGABYTE AM3 GA-MA79XTUD4P 4DDR3 2PCIE UD3
> 
> ...



See he weird thing is, those boards are nearly identical.  Both have great OC options, dual BIOS, multiply BIOS profiles, plenty of plugs and SATA ports, etc.  The only real difference in brandname.  I have the MSI 790GX-G65 and I love my board so my option is bias.

I still say get the cheapest one because all the ones in your lists were good to really good boards.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 27, 2009)

By the cheapest you mean the cheapest between this last 2 or the cheapest including the MSI 770??

Anyway i've been reading reviews about the 2 of them, and the gigabyte Secure 3 System, and the space between Memorys and CPU are features that i really appreciate, so i will see, the only think im not too sure about the 770 it's the possibility of not being able to upgrade to a 140w CPU due to voltage capacity, actually in the review i read the guys recommended to stick with 95w CPU's because MSI didn't announced that the wattage it's ensured to last longer than 2 years.
I had a similar trouble with my current MObO and that's why im so doubtfull i hope you guys understand


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## Greenmousa (Oct 28, 2009)

Last minute thingie...

My only wish about the board is this:

Want to install CPU, DDR3s, start pc and nothing else, use it for like 2 or 3 months and the try to hit 3.0ghz with OC, i want a MOther that doesn't give me any bios version trouble or that kind of things, so keeping that into account, wich one would you think it's the best, maybe Users input may help 

Thanks again


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 28, 2009)

Any AM3 board will be up to date on the BIOS, so you should have to mess with it unless you want to.  You are not going to be able to just plug it in though cause your OS is going to be pissed when it bus map is all wrong.  You change the Mobo, you are most likely going to have to reinstall your OS.

All brands have their ups and downs.  Gigabyte is the brand to have right now for consistently good stuff.  MSI's higher end boards are definately built better.

Yeah, I mean the cheapest out of the last two you listed.  Do not include the MSI 770.  I think it will handle a 125W CPU, but I am not sure so forget it.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 28, 2009)

Great thank you a lot for that one yet again man, you the man!


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## p_o_s_pc (Oct 28, 2009)

i agree with what thelaughingman has said 
sorry not going to quote everything


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## Greenmousa (Oct 28, 2009)

Great then it's a wrap.

Ill keep you informed if something else comes up


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## Greenmousa (Oct 29, 2009)

Sorry to bother you guys again! but, a new challenger appears!! and it's us$ 40 cheaper!

ECS A790GXM-AD3 1.0  AM3

Should i reconsider my purchase?? This just came in to my retailer


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## Greenmousa (Oct 29, 2009)

bump for greater urgency


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## TheLaughingMan (Oct 29, 2009)

I got no grip with ECS boards and it seems like a good buy.  I have heard some good things about ECS Black edition boards.


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## Greenmousa (Oct 29, 2009)

It seems that the Black edition did a really good work so far every review i read said nothing but good things 

Thanks once more dude, this will save me up some serious money


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## Greenmousa (Nov 10, 2009)

Hi! im back and i bring news to this whole build thing:

I've been offered with new processors at my provider 

Here are the items:

(PRICE ORDER FROM LOWER TO HIGHER)

AMD ATHLON II 240 (2800 MHZ)   AM3 X2 DUAL-CORE  
AMD ATHLON II 245 (2900 MHZ)   AM3 X2 DUAL-CORE  	
AMD ATHLON II 250 (3000 MHZ)   AM3 X2 DUAL-CORE  	
AMD ATHLON II 425 (2700 MHZ)   AM3 X3 TRIPLE-CORE	
AMD ATHLON II 620 (2600 MHZ)   AM3 X4 QUAD-CORE 	
*AMD PHENOM II 550*  (3100 MHZ)  AM3 X2 DUAL CORE   BLACK EDITION	
AMD PHENOM II 545  (3000 MHZ)  AM3 X2 DUAL CORE	
_*AMD PHENOM II 720*_  (2800 MHZ)  AM3 X3 TRIPLE-CORE BLACK EDITION	
AMD PHENOM II 945   (3000 MHZ) AM3 X4 QUAD-CORE	
AMD PHENOM II 955   (3200 MHZ) AM3 X4 QUAD-CORE	

EDIT: ALSO THEY OFFERED THIS MOTHERBOARD===

MOTHER BIOSTAR  TA790GX A3+  AM3

Please comment on this board 



Italic and bold options are my (i guess) favorites...remember the target for the processor:

GAMING + GRAPHIC DESIGN (PS, Corel, Illustrator, NO 3D PROGRAMS WHATSOEVER)

So, once again i call upon the elders of TPU to assist me!


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## TheLaughingMan (Nov 10, 2009)

Biostar's stuff is ok.  It is fairly inconsistent.  Some are good, others are poo.  That particular mobo seems to be fairly good.  It will OCing a bit, but get the job done.

Get the 720 Mhz.  If you can unlock it great.  If not, 3 cores are better than 2.


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## Greenmousa (Nov 11, 2009)

Thank you as usual my friend, i would like to hear other voices before purchacing this one since apparently any other brand (gigabyte or MSI) rounds the 300 dolars even on mid range boards, so screw them.

Any other kind gentleman?

EDIT:

By the way:

http://www.trustedreviews.com/motherboards/review/2009/07/23/Biostar-TA790GX-A3-/p2

Something is telling me RUN AWAY FROM IT.


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## Greenmousa (Nov 12, 2009)

Ok guys, i am the owner of a Phenom 2 X3 720 BE, 4GB of OCZ GOLD 1666 MHZ DDR3 RAM and a GA-MA785GPMT-UD2H 

Why that board?...well...it's power efficient as hell, allows a whole lot of ram, it's UBER cheap even here in Argentina (90 dolars or so), it's really cool temperature wise,  performs great and allows to unlock the Cores of the 720's and 550's. 

This is a preorder, if i want it ill have it in my hands in 5 days i can take the order back, i just don't see why, if anyone has anything to say please do so now before i seal the deal.

Thanks as usual


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## Greenmousa (Nov 15, 2009)

Yo guys sorry to bother you again...ive been offered with a cheap OCZ Stealth X Stream 600W, if you read the first pages of this thread you will see my current PSU, i want it to support this in case you don't remember or you are new to the thread:

MOTHERBOARD GYGABYTE GA-MA785GPMT-UD2H 
ATI 4850 (Maybe a 5850 6 months from now)
Phenom 2 X3 720 BE with a tiny Overclock (2.8 to 3.0)
2 Hard Drives.
4 or 5 case fans.

So, should i go for it???


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## p_o_s_pc (Nov 15, 2009)

go for it.Should have the power needed...


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