# Intel X6 i5-9600KF based system (5.00Ghz project)



## storm-chaser (Feb 11, 2020)

Long overdue for a new system, and the time has finally come!

After losing a good lead on a cheap 8086K, I've spent the afternoon comparing alternative CPUs to replace it. I've decided to go with the fastest 9th gen core I5 CPU instead... I know, I know, it's not top tier, but I am still planning on getting 5000Ghz out of it.  I'd say I have a 50/50 chance of making that happen. This CPU is second only to the 8086K in terms of overclockability averages (if going by the userbenchmark.com stats)... As you can see, the bell curve doesn't just drop off like a cliff, indicating this CPU has very good overclocking potential with the right hardware and doesn't face a "hard limit" as some other CPUs do. Here is the OC freq curve for the i5-9600KF, from userbenchmark.com







After this revelation, and realizing the $600+ and up price tag for the high-high end Intel chips, I've come to some additional conclusions regarding the purpose of this build and how it will be used. Meaning we will not be going flat out on the best hardware with this. This will be my daily driver, not an extreme overclocker, and I want to focus on single-thread performance vs brute force. This leads me to the Intel Core i5-9600KF, a 9th gen unlocked 6 core CPU that boosts to 4.6Ghz. The price/performance ratio cannot be beat, as they go for about $200 shipped. Seeing as how single-thread performance is nearly on par with the 9900k or the 8086k, I realized I likely won't notice any difference in day to day usage (short of benchmarking). And my target goal of 5.0Ghz all core is still intact. I like the KF chips without the GPU, so that's my new CPU choice. 

I also realized I don't need all new components as I have a good Coolermaster case here, and Antec 650W PSU, as well as an MSI RX580 GPU to throw at it. 

I think I found a pretty sweet motherboard on newegg to go with it as well. Seeing as how the video card and motherboard are all MSI I decided to top it off with the MSI Core Frozr XL 120mm air cooler.. so this should be a handsome build when it's all said and done, especially when resting in the Coolermaster padded case. In terms of the RAM I backed off just a little from my 4500Mhz goal and downgraded to 4000Mhz Gskill Trident z b-die at 18-19-19-39 

Here is a list of the parts I just purchased on Newegg:

Memory = G.SKILL TridentZ Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 4000 (PC4 32000) Intel Z270 / Z370 Memory (Desktop Memory) Model F4-4000C18D-16GTZ 
$200




CPU = Intel Core i5-9600KF Coffee Lake 6-Core 3.7 GHz (4.6 GHz Turbo) LGA 1151 (300 Series) 95W BX80684I59600KF Desktop Processor Without Graphics 
$200




CPU Cooler = MSI Core Frozr XL 120MM
$120




Motherboard = MSI MAG Z390 TOMAHAWK
$160




SSD = SAMSUNG 970 PRO M.2 2280 512GB PCIe Gen3. X4, NVMe 1.3 64L V-NAND 2-bit MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) MZ-V7P512BW 
$170




I figured I would go for broke with the m.2 NVMe SSD, so this one ranks pretty high up in the speed department and seems to get rave reviews with one user even claiming a 5 second boot time (seems dubious but at the very least I am future proofing) 





the case I will be using:





I just ordered all the parts tonight. So expect an update by Friday!


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## Vario (Feb 11, 2020)

5 GHz should be easy.  It was with the 8600K.


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## timta2 (Feb 12, 2020)

> I figured I would go for broke with the m.2 NVMe SSD, so this one ranks pretty high up in the speed department and seems to get rave reviews with one user even claiming a 5 second boot time (seems dubious but at the very least I am future proofing)



Unless you're going to be doing heavy writing (video editing, etc), you're probably wasting your money, there.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

timta2 said:


> Unless you're going to be doing heavy writing (video editing, etc), you're probably wasting your money, there.



My reasoning was go fast or go home. But yeah, not ever going to be able to saturate the bandwidth capabilities of this SSD

at least not for the next couple years, thats for sure.


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## SirKeldon (Feb 12, 2020)

Good luck trying to achieve those 5GHz, that cooler seems fancy enough to achieve it! 

I'd love to see some pictures soon! Keep it on!


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

Kinda an odd build....... I get you want to do 5ghz and that's cool but a 6 core 6 thread chip is a bad buy for longevity when with that cooler you purchased you could have gotten a 3700X instead.... Your only sensible upgrade path in the future without buying a new motherboard is a 9900k but the motherboard you picked isn't adequate according to reviews I've read on it. 

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/mag-z390-tomahawk-core-i9-9900k-msi-atx-motherboard,5914.html


I see you have a RX 580 so even then a much cheaper 2600/1600AF would have given you the same gaming performance with much better multitasking performance and a substantially better upgrade path.
Even if all you plan on doing is 60hz gaming which the 9600K should handle for 2-3 years a 3600 would still have been a better buy. 


Also the 10 series i5 is going to have 12 threads and probably similar or better clocks making a 9600KF even at 200 bucks look like a pretty bad buy when it releases. 


oh and never use userbenchmarks for anything its a joke.  










Otherwise I hope I am completely wrong on the longevity of a 6 core chip without hyperthreading but look at the 7600k that was thought to be good enough and tons of people on this Forum said the same thing and now it chokes hard in GPU intensive games losing to a relatively slow 1600 just 3 years later in a lot modern games. 












At the end of the day only you can decide what hardware is best for you with the $$$ you have and if you did your research and came to the conclusion that said hardware is best for you then nothing I've said really matters at the same time if I purchase something regardless of what it is I have zero issues with someone pointing out what I could have done better.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Kinda an odd build....... I get you want to do 5ghz and that's cool but a 6 core 6 thread chip is a bad buy for longevity when with that cooler you purchased you could have gotten a 3700X instead.... Your only sensible upgrade path in the future without buying a new motherboard is a 9900k but the motherboard you picked isn't adequate according to reviews I've read on it.



I don't mind the criticism - Matter of fact I've sold me on the idea of a better motherboard. I usually do better than this. In my eagerness to go MSI with everything I think it was an emotional buy... I didn't even read a review for it which is the first time that's ever happened. lol 

So as I said, I am still sticking with MSI, but upgrading to the Gaming plus Z390, a board that appears to have much better overclocking potential. Matter of fact it appears to be the best value / performance ratio out of any Z390 motherboard on the market right now. Not that it matters, but this gaming board matches up with the color scheme of my RX 580, which is also the gaming model / spec. I will pull the trigger on this unless you can recommend something in the $250 range that will better suit my system and OC potential. 

I should have set some expectations first. I'm simply refreshing my old Phenom II system with new life. That means new mobo, CPU, memory and SSD. Don't get me wrong, I do have the budget to plunk down $1000 on a CPU and water cooling system but this is my daily driver where my primary goal is per-thread performance NOT massive number-crunching low-end torque (I'm aiming more for top end horsepower with this). In single-threaded performance, according to userbenchmark.com, the 9600KF just edges out the 3700x, and pulls ahead slightly further when overclocked. Besides, the 3700x has a hard limit of around 4.5Ghz no matter what your hardware, and as you can tell from the title, my goal is 5.0Ghz. So the AMD counterpart is out for a number of reasons.  Plus, I've never been picky about names before, but I just don't like the term Ryzen. Just something about it feels wrong, at least to me. I've never been OCD either, so I shouldn't be that picky, yet I am. I've also been into AMD for many, many years. It was time for a change!

Bad buy for longevity? How so? You do realize the majority of people that that buy 8 core CPUs will never reach their performance potential in average everyday tasking, right? My CPU will arguably be faster (and is rated faster on userbenchmark.com) than the 3700x for workloads at six cores or less. *Also, note the 3700x is over $100 more than the 9600KF so the price to performance ratio is hard to beat (best price/performance ratio of any Intel chip on the market, that's for sure).* 



oxrufiioxo said:


> I see you have a RX 580 so even then a much cheaper 2600/1600AF would have given you the same gaming performance with much better multitasking performance and a substantially better upgrade path.
> Even if all you plan on doing is 60hz gaming which the 9600K should handle for 2-3 years a 3600 would still have been a better buy.



I said this was a 5Ghz project? Please explain to me how I am going to get 5Ghz out of a 2700x or 1600AF? 
Those two CPUs are actually much slower than the 9600KF as well. 

As I said, this is my upgrade path and I chose Intel, not AMD. The Ford vs Chevy debate will rage on just the same. lol 
The RX 580 will be sufficient for most games for the next few years, I'm not concerned. If the time comes when I need to upgrade the GPU or CPU I will. 



oxrufiioxo said:


> Otherwise I hope I am completely wrong on the longevity of a 6 core chip without hyperthreading but look at the 7600k that was thought to be good enough and tons of people on this Forum said the same thing and now it chokes hard in GPU intensive game losing to a relatively slow 1600 just 3 years later in a lot modern games.



You are completely wrong on the longevity of a 6 core chip. I still game and work from my Phenom II hexacore rig and it still holds it's own just fine. Matter of fact I can pull tighter memory latency than a lot of DDR4 systems due to a CL of 7 (and I have the NB overclocked to 3000Mhz, so that helps with processor performance as well). Indeed, it still has plenty of muscle and is really only limited by instruction set. The Phenom II was a great processor, it sucks AMD had to ruin it with the FX line of slugs. I always thought they should have done a die shrink on the Thuban and bumped the memory and cache performance. Would have made for a stout chip!



oxrufiioxo said:


> Also the 10 series i5 is going to have 12 threads and probably similar or better clocks making a 9600KF even at 200 bucks look like a pretty bad buy when it releases.


Hyperthreading aside, I won't need it. And now you are bench racing. 

*In point of fact the 9600K has the best cost / performance ratio of any intel chip on the market right now. *

Moreover*, I think the system overall has a very good cost / performance ratio. In fact, you'd be hard-pressed to find an intel system that can compete with this setup in terms of performance per dollar. *


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## cucker tarlson (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> *In point of fact the 9600K has the best cost / performance ratio of any intel chip on the market right now. *
> 
> Moreover*, I think the system overall has a very good cost / performance ratio. In fact, you'd be hard-pressed to find an intel system that can compete with this setup in terms of performance per dollar. *


very true.
it should be faster or equal to 3800x that's like +60% more expensive













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what is questionable is the z390 platform,cause people are right,you are gonna need to upgrade that 9600k at some point due to lack of threads.\

and btw an 8700k should do 5ghz fine too.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

For a possible future 9900K upgrade I would look at something with an 8 phase or more. My Maximus Z390 Code gets very hot in the VRM department at 5ghz under extended load even though it is better than the majority of the budget boards. The other thing you should be looking into is memory support cheaper boards are going to have substantially worse memory traces not a big deal for say 3200/3600 but definitely for 4000+ regardless of what the motherboard manufacture spec page says.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> very true.
> it should be faster or equal to 3800x that's like +60% more expensive
> 
> View attachment 144585
> ...


Graphs without 1% lows are pointless

Even at 5ghz its a whopping 40% slower than a 9900k when it comes to 1% lows in SOTTR and this is only going to become more common as games get more demanding.


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## cucker tarlson (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Graphs without 1% lows are pointless
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment 144586View attachment 144587View attachment 144588


no,but they serve different purpose.
if that 9600k can match 3800x in odyssey and shadow of the tomb raider,it means it's fine for heavily multithreaded games for now.
I don't think the 7600k story will literally happen again.we went from single threaded games to ones that use 12-16 threads pretty quickly.If a 6/6 cpu can match a 8/16 one in a multithreaded game,I'd say it's fine.Especially when it costs much less.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> no,but they serve different purpose.
> if that 9600k can match 3800x in odyssey and shadow of the tomb raider,it means it's fine for heavily multithreaded games for now.
> I don't think the 7600k story will literally happen again.we went from single threaded games to ones that use 12-16 threads pretty quickly.If a 6/6 cpu can match a 8/16 one in a multithreaded game,I'd say it's fine.Especially when it costs much less.




Yeah I agree, but 6 core 6 thread chips are already struggling with 1% lows in some games so to be on the safe side anyone should be purchasing a 12 thread chip even if the averages are slightly lower because chances are you're going to get much more longevity out of it.


Again if all the OP is ever going to do is 60hz game is irrelevant the 9600k should be more than adequate for a while... I would still buy the best motherboard I could just in case I needed a 9900k down the line though.


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## cucker tarlson (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Yeah I agree, but 6 core 6 thread chips are already struggling with 1% lows in some games so to be on the safe side anyone should be purchasing a 12 thread chip even if the averages are slightly lower because chances are you're going to get much more longevity out of it.


overclocked to 5ghz,running on 4000 c18 ram,I'd say he'll be fine with 1% too.

though imo he should have got vbiper 4400 c19 memory.better and cheaper.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> overclocked to 5ghz,running on 4000 c18 ram,I'd say he'll be fine with 1% too.
> 
> though imo he should have got vbiper 4400 c19 memory.better and cheaper.




I'm pretty sure I linked him that kit in his last post.

@storm-chaser I know this is $22 more than your budget but It really is one of the best Z390 boards and definitely the best MSI one minus the crazy eatx ones.... The 9900k is no joke and if there is even a slight chance you grab one down the line the extra $$ will be well spent.... The gigabyte boards are a much better value when it comes to VRM vs Cost but they're not nearly as good at high memory frequency as the TOP MSI/Asus Boards afaik.

The Pro Carbon also has mediocre memory overclocking so I would guess most boards under it will as well.






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## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> oh and never use userbenchmarks for anything its a joke.



I personally do not agree. All CPU's tested are run through the same benchmarks, it's not like they are skewing the averages in favor of Intel. Not to mention the fact it gives the best breakdown on the web (short of a benchmark suite) of CPU performance and overclocking potential. Of course, it's ballpark only. But it will get you pointed in the right direction. And it also gives a great chart with the CPU clock speeds mapped out... very good information!

And believe it or not the overwhelming majority of computer users (other than hardcore gamers or overclockers) never use more than a couple cores at a time. My X4 Q9650 rig boots up in 20-30 seconds. *The point being, any difference between CPUs at this stage in the game is purely theoretical. *Real-world performance is going to be nearly identical across the board. It's only in benchmarks where you will see a difference. 

The people that really need CPU crunching power - you know who you are - but they are few and far between, to be honest with you.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> I personally do not agree. All CPU's tested are run through the same benchmarks, it's not like they are skewing the averages in favor of Intel. Not to mention the fact it gives the best breakdown on the web (short of a benchmark suite) of CPU performance and overclocking potential. Of course, it's ballpark only. But it will get you pointed in the right direction. And it also gives a great chart with the CPU clock speeds mapped out... very good information!
> 
> And believe it or not the overwhelming majority of computer users (other than hardcore gamers or overclockers) never use more than a couple cores at a time. My X4 Q9650 rig boots up in 20-30 seconds. *The point being, any difference between CPUs at this stage in the game is purely theoretical. *Real-world performance is going to be nearly identical across the board. It's only in benchmarks where you will see a difference.
> 
> The people that really need CPU crunching power - you know who you are - but they are few and far between, to be honest with you.



if it helps you pick your cpu good for you if I paid attention to it it would want me to pair my 2080 ti with a quad core..... 







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## ppn (Feb 12, 2020)

You should be able to get 10600KF and Z470 soon and 11600K next year with +40% better IPC. The move to 9600KF makes no sense. It is like pentium4 compared to core2duo.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

ppn said:


> You should be able to get 10600KF and Z470 soon and 11600K next year with +40% better IPC. The move to 9600KF makes no sense. It is like pentium4 compared to core2duo.



I think 40% is pushing it but 15-20% wouldn't surprise me if they can nail the clocks.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

ppn said:


> You should be able to get 10600KF and Z470 soon and 11600K next year with +40% better IPC. The move to 9600KF makes no sense. It is like pentium4 compared to core2duo.



Where are you getting this 40 percent IPC improvement? Don't you think that would be a little on the high side?

Listen, I want to be clear. I have plenty of money and could have easily put together a powerhouse rig but that's just not in my field of vision at the moment because I needed upgrades across the board in terms of technology, this was not just one machine on my mind. Let me explain, I just spent close to $1800 today on much needed technology upgrades for the whole house....

23" gaming monitor
5.1 Logitech surround sound system
8" Asus Tablet
15.6" Lenovo T510 laptop (plus an 8gb ram kit for it)
MSI MEG Z390 ACE LGA1151 motherboard

And this is in addition to the parts I have listed above... so cut me some slack here lol

*And actually, in single thread performance the 9600KF is almost as quick as the flagship 9900k. There would be nearly zero difference in observable performance unless you were doing some serious gaming or video editing. *

When the time comes I will upgrade to the 10th gen. That will be in about 10 years. lol

No, I understand what you are saying, but I'm not waiting for that. I need to get my system upgraded now.

I just pulled the trigger on this better MSI board so I can upgrade to the 9900k when the prices come down in a few years.

So come back when you can find a system that even comes close to the cost / performance ratio of the system I just built! lol



oxrufiioxo said:


> if it helps you pick your cpu good for you if I paid attention to it it would want me to pair my 2080 ti with a quad core.....


It's not that I use it to pick my CPU like a guide or something, It's just that I find it a good resource to get some perspective on potential overclockability.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

Glad you grabbed the Meg Ace. I have a feeling you're going to love it.


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## R0H1T (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Where are you getting this 40 percent IPC improvement?


Let's just say more on the impossible side, I know he's said this multiple times but unless he's also counting some massive IPC loss (after smeltdown) there's no possible way Intel will achieve that 40% or above (across a range of applications) coming from Skylake or it's derivatives.


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## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

R0H1T said:


> Let's just say more on the impossible side, I know he's said this multiple times but unless he's also counting some massive IPC loss (after smeltdown) there's no possible way Intel will achieve that 40% or above (across a range of applications) coming from Skylake or it's derivatives.



I liked his post because it made me chuckle pretty hard but it'll probably be 3-4 architecture's before we get that sort of gain.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

ppn said:


> You should be able to get 10600KF and Z470 soon and 11600K next year with +40% better IPC. The move to 9600KF makes no sense. It is like pentium4 compared to core2duo.



*And for the love of God man, it's like you think the i5 9600kf is like a celeron processor or something!* Take with a grain of salt, but Userbenchmark has it ranked the 9th fastest CPU out of 1209. Obviously this result leans more toward single threaded workloads (which, by the way are still in the overwhelming majority) this does not take into consideration the CPUs with massive core count, but again, most people will never use more than 5-6 cores at a time anyway. So to put this into perspective the 9600kf goes TOE TO TOE with a 9900k all the way up to four cores. They are basically the same CPU, with the 9900K having slightly more cache. But again, the overclockability of the 9600kf is better than that of the 9900k, when averaged out its 5.45ghz to 5.25ghz. The numbers cannot be trusted but they were all submitted by end users, thousands of them... so it's got to count for something.

Lastly, it's known to be Intel's BEST MID LEVEL CPU. Aside from boost clocks, and slightly less cache there is very little difference between it and a 9900k.


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## Flanker (Feb 12, 2020)

Nice rig! Looking forward to seeing how far you can push it.


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## dgianstefani (Feb 12, 2020)

Ice lake on mobile has a 10% performance improvement with a boost speed of 1.5-2ghz lower compared to the 14nm++ alternatives. 

Assuming they can get Ice Lake on desktop, or Tiger Lake whatever to run at 4ghz+, we should be seeing 20% minimum improvements, and if they hit 5ghz, 30%+ over current offerings, assuming core counts are the same.


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## Deleted member 178884 (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> In terms of the RAM I backed off just a little from my 4500Mhz goal and downgraded to 4000Mhz Gskill Trident z b-die at 18-19-19-39


That 4500mhz goal is more obtainable with a $100 ram kit, Teamgroup dark pros are around $100 on sale (3200 14-14-14-31) and I've seen plenty of users doing 4500mhz cl18 or tight timings like 4000mhz cl14 both 1T, not sure why you spent double on a kit that's actually a worse bin (oh and if you don't believe me about 4000mhz cl14:




)
The same applies to the 4400cl19 viper steel kit.
I think the build overall could have been much better, but enjoy, I guess - I won't knock it further.


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## Chomiq (Feb 12, 2020)

Why the crappy CM case?


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## Rahnak (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> CPU Cooler = MSI Core Frozr XL 120MM
> $120


Odd choice. I hope you ended up with something better. Also, I would put a better case on the upgrade list.



dgianstefani said:


> Ice lake on mobile has a 10% performance improvement with a boost speed of 1.5-2ghz lower compared to the 14nm++ alternatives.
> 
> Assuming they can get Ice Lake on desktop, or Tiger Lake whatever to run at 4ghz+, we should be seeing 20% minimum improvements, and if they hit 5ghz, 30%+ over current offerings, assuming core counts are the same.


If they could, you wouldn't be seeing 14++++++++++ on 10th gen.


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## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

The CPU is a good choice for the near future, but not long term. It is generally held that a 4c/8t system or 6c/6t system would be considered a _*minimum*_ spec (assuming the budget supports it). That said, I do not know if you are a gamer, but every month new titles come out and core/thread requirements up - there are several titles today that have a glass ceiling with a 4c/8t or 6c/6t CPU. With consoles being released this year running higher core/threads counts, we'll finally start to see some real traction on the core war AMD started. More and more things use more and more cores. Upgrading to a 9900K later is a curious and likely more costly move in the long run (depending on when you buy it...(you're already in $200).. and in 3 years, the 9900K will have been supplanted by AMD or Intel CPUs easily. At least you get more performance now and down the line with ONE purchase. Then in a few years, you can look at the landscape again and see what your needs are.



storm-chaser said:


> As you can see, the bell curve doesn't just drop off like a cliff, indicating this CPU has very good overclocking potential with the right hardware and doesn't face a "hard limit" as some other CPUs do. Here is the OC freq curve for the i5-9600KF, from userbenchmark.com


As we can see? What does that chart show us, actually? Overall performance, right? It isn't for overclocks. Regardless, compare it to a 9900K, the charts look the same (as far as falloff goes). The 'hard limit' found on the 9900K, you will also find with your CPU... temperatures. This CPU has the same size and hardness 'wall' you talk about that the other chips do. If you look at hwbot, average on air is a bit over 5 GHz.



storm-chaser said:


> It's just that I find it a good resource to get some perspective on potential overclockability.


But, it doesn't show overclockability... just the overall performance is what that curve shows...obviously some of those results are overclocked, but you cannot extrapolate overclockability from that, really.

Wondering where you got your information regarding average overclocks on these chips... 5.4 GHz isn't typical on anything Intel at all. That said, 5 GHz shouldn't be an issue (depends on thermals).



storm-chaser said:


> , and Antec 650W PSU


That Neo blue is a 10+ year old design and was average then. It is well out of warranty as well.. time to get something with modern protections and internals, and is actually 80+ rated, when you can.


As far as your RAM... yikers... I see what people are saying about the lopsided build. You pay through the nose for DDR4 4000 (after being talked down off 4500), but you get a 6c/6t CPU.. That makes no sense. Life of that machine and performance today and tomorrow would have been better served by going DDR4 3600 (something reasonable for a daily driver) and a 8c/16t CPU.

That case looks like it came from Y2K. Poor airflow it looks like...scary for today's systems running at 5Ghz...

The cooler... $100+???? It isn't a great performer at all. You could have saved $50 and went with a true spirit 140 for $50 or spent the same and bought a much better performing AIO. I hope it can handle your 5 GHz goals inside that old case!





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Xx Tek Tip xX said:


> I think the build overall could have been much better, but enjoy, I guess - I won't knock it further.


This. Feels like it was parted together with little consideration of what is what, frankly. Overpaid for RAM with too high of speed ($ for the returns), 6c/6t CPU... poor $/performance cooler...closed off case in 2020... better choices could have been made for a better system today, tomorrow, and done for strikingly similar costs...

... and that isn't even talking about the viable, and perhaps better choice of running an AMD system.




In the end, this is a huge improvement over what you have listed in your system specs. It just could have been more finely tweaked for todays and tomorrows performance. Enjoy your machine!


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## Elysium (Feb 12, 2020)

The point of the thread went about 50 miles over everyone else's heads but I'm personally looking forward to seeing what you can reach, I almost purchased a 9600K myself when I saw OCUK getting good clocks on them, as far as 5.2 at one point IIRC, however I figured I'd wait for Comet Lake instead. Case could be better-looking, otherwise GLHF!


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

Elysium said:


> The point of the thread went about 50 miles over everyone else's heads but I'm personally looking forward to seeing what you can reach, I almost purchased a 9600K myself when I saw OCUK getting good clocks on them, as far as 5.2 at one point IIRC, however I figured I'd wait for Comet Lake instead. Case could be better-looking, otherwise GLHF!


I don't think we missed anything...the build isn't optimal and some decisions/choices made were based on questionable grounds which can potentially hamper the 5 GHz goal and life of the PC (cooler choice, case). We're here to help... even if it means being honest about the choices made. Hard to know and learn if everyone around you simply nods their heads in agreement, ya know?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> I don't think we missed anything...the build isn't optimal and some decisions/choices made were based on questionable grounds which can potentially hamper the 5 GHz goal and life of the PC (cooler choice, case). We're here to help... even if it means being honest about the choices made. Hard to know and learn if everyone around you simply nods their heads in agreement, ya know?



I will look into upgrading the memory because one thing I am interested in is latency. Other than that this is geared towards single-thread performance, not sure why it is such a mystery for you guys to understand this. 

*You guys do realize you don't need 8 cores for browsing the web, playing games from the early 2010s and stuff like that, right?

First of all I just want to point out something that did go right over everyone's head. The Cost to performance ratio of this CPU is the best on the market (for intel chips). Bear that in mind before you respond again. *

Calm down, guys! I'm not much of a gamer, it's not like* I'm going out and desperately buying games every week in hopes that I can* "play them furiously" on my new system. *It was a calculated buy,* not geared towards maximum number crunching performance, but with a focus on single threaded workloads instead. This is the first time I've done this, but I chose the CPU cooler for aesthetics. Matching MSI mobo, video card and cooler. I know I overpaid for it, I don't mind, I like the look. I like the look of it and it should be able to keep my hexacore running nice and cool. If it sucks I can get something else. 

If my Phenom II x6 system @ 4.0Ghz lasted almost 10 years in the same case pushing a higher TDP, I don't know why this particular case would be a problem for a far superior motherboard (with much better power delivery ) and a CPU with a lower TDP. The reason I retained the case is due to the fact that it has insulated panels that block out a good bit of the noise. Call me crazy, I just don't like the look of most new cases. I like the older business look more than that of these giant gaming rigs with about 20lb of glass on each side everyone seems to have now a days. The case is in fine shape.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

Xx Tek Tip xX said:


> That 4500mhz goal is more obtainable with a $100 ram kit, Teamgroup dark pros are around $100 on sale (3200 14-14-14-31) and I've seen plenty of users doing 4500mhz cl18 or tight timings like 4000mhz cl14 both 1T, not sure why you spent double on a kit that's actually a worse bin (oh and if you don't believe me about 4000mhz cl14:
> View attachment 144619
> )
> The same applies to the 4400cl19 viper steel kit.
> I think the build overall could have been much better, but enjoy, I guess - I won't knock it further.



Okay, thanks for pointing this out. I hear you on the memory and will take your advice in upgrading to something better.

Can you please provide details or links so I know exactly what to buy? thanks!

EDIT: Do you think I should go with the viper kit or the other one? I would prefer tight timings to speed...

And as I said, If you had no idea what was under the hood and someone asked which one has the better processor it... there would be ZERO way to tell because there would be ZERO difference in performance vs a 9900k! (For basic gaming and everyday tasking)


----------



## Deleted member 178884 (Feb 12, 2020)

I'd opt for the viper steel (4400 cl19-19-19-39 bin), also your CPU choice is fine, I do not agree with your cooler choice, motherboard choice and NVME choice.
EDIT: If the viper isn't available in the US opt for the 3200 cl14-14-14-31 teamgroup instead


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

Xx Tek Tip xX said:


> I'd opt for the viper steel (4400 cl19-19-19-39 bin), also your CPU choice is fine, I do not agree with your cooler choice, motherboard choice and NVME choice.
> EDIT: If the viper isn't available in the US opt for the 3200 cl14-14-14-31 teamgroup instead



Okay, now what's wrong with the motherboard and NVME choice?


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

If you don't need it, SC, you don't need it. Just saying more can be had if other options used elsewhere. Although there is a massive IPC and clock increase, you'll find 6c/6t will get long in the tooth sooner than later. A good in between perhaps is a 8c/8t (or 6c/12t Ryzen 3000). 



storm-chaser said:


> because one thing I am interested in is latency.


Why though? Do you know, really or just chasing after a word? I'm not trying to be an ass, but really think about why you are paying a premium. Users cannot tell the difference outside of benchmarks on memory latency... save $100 (and maybe get a better chassis - one that has a windowed side panel to actually show off your MSI build or a new PSU) and get a simple low latency DDR4 3600 kit is my take.

That cooler is MEH (read the link), NVMe drive can drop to the EVO level and save some cash (while not noticing a difference outside of benchmarks)...there are also cheaper similarly performing drives than the Samsungs.


----------



## Deleted member 178884 (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Okay, now what's wrong with the motherboard and NVME choice?


The motherboard is not that great for memory overclocking, in my opinion the Z390 Sli/AC from ASRock can overclock ram significantly better, although if you're going for your wild long shot aim of 4500? You'll want a Z390i phantom ITX or a Z390i edge AC for this as 1DPC is significantly easier to overclock ram on and it will definitely not hold you back.
As for the NVME, you spent $170 for 512gb on a pure performance orientated SSD that will likely offer you no real world performance gains over a cheaper NVME.
Also, as for the cooler choice you spent $120 on a cooler that probably performs worse or equal to an AIO or cheaper cooler such as a scythe.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

Xx Tek Tip xX said:


> The motherboard is not that great for memory overclocking, in my opinion the Z390 Sli/AC from ASRock can overclock ram significantly better, although if you're going for your wild long shot aim of 4500? You'll want a Z390i phantom ITX or a Z390i edge AC for this as 1DPC is significantly easier to overclock ram on and it will definitely not hold you back.
> As for the NVME, you spent $170 for 512gb on a pure performance orientated SSD that will likely offer you no real world performance gains over a cheaper NVME.
> Also, as for the cooler choice you spent $120 on a cooler that probably performs worse or equal to an AIO or cheaper cooler such as a scythe.



-I wanted an air-cooled build this time around. I'm a little sick of radiators in my PCs. 
-As I said I chose the cooler based on looks. Not normally something I would do but why not, ya know? Make it your own.
-*There is no real need to "overclock" memory that is already going to be blistering fast at 4000Mhz* (but I will be trying for some improvements, see below) - And I will have you know, you will only see theoretical gains in benchmarks or very very heavy resource-intensive gaming, etc. Heck, even my 1600Mhz DDR3 8GB kit in my Phenom II x6 rig still has plenty of throughput for everything I need to do. 
-I was future-proofing with the Nvme SSD drive (it was well under $200) - I want a responsive system, can you blame me? lol
-The ASRock Z390 Phantom Gaming SLI/ac has difficulty staying cool under heavy loads (some have even said the VRMs overheat with a stock 9900k)

I will most likely upgrade to the Viper kit, but that being said, does anyone have experience overclocking the G.SKILL TridentZ Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 4000 (PC4 32000) Intel Z270 / Z370 Memory (Desktop Memory) Model F4-4000C18D-16GTZ ? It's B-die right?

I'm just contemplating what I want to do with the memory...


----------



## Deleted member 178884 (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Model F4-4000C18D-16GTZ ? It's B-die right?


Is it b-die? Yes.
Is it good b-die? Not really.
Note that not all b-die is good.


storm-chaser said:


> -I was future-proofing with the Nvme SSD drive (it was well under $200) - I want a responsive system, can you blame me? lol


Cheaper NVMEs do that too, and as stated prior there is no real world difference, but sure stick to that.


storm-chaser said:


> -The ASRock Z390 Phantom Gaming SLI/ac has difficulty staying cool under heavy loads (some have even said the VRMs overheat with a stock 9900k)


Still a better board regardless, though again for big RAM speeds you'll want 1DPC 
Either way, again, enjoy your build.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

Xx Tek Tip xX said:


> That 4500mhz goal is more obtainable with a $100 ram kit, Teamgroup dark pros are around $100 on sale (3200 14-14-14-31) and I've seen plenty of users doing 4500mhz cl18 or tight timings like 4000mhz cl14 both 1T, not sure why you spent double on a kit that's actually a worse bin (oh and if you don't believe me about 4000mhz cl14:
> View attachment 144619
> )
> The same applies to the 4400cl19 viper steel kit.
> I think the build overall could have been much better, but enjoy, I guess - I won't knock it further.



Sounds like the teamgroup is really good stuff. I see they also have a 3466Mhz kit, do you think I will:
a) Be able to get ~4000Mhz out of it with my motherboard?
b) If I can overclock, should I get the 3200 or the 3466?

 TEAMGROUP T-Force Dark Pro DDR4 16GB Kit (2 x 8GB) 3466MHz (PC4 27700) CL 16 288-Pin SDRAM Desktop Gaming Memory Module Ram - Gray - TDPGD416G3466HC16CDC01


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

Xx Tek Tip xX said:


> Is it b-die? Yes.
> Is it good b-die? Not really.
> Note that not all b-die is good.
> 
> ...



Absolutely, I agree. I just wanted the best of the best in the SSD department.

Okay, I think you have me sold on the Teamgroup stuff - that is if my current board has the potential to be able to push them harder?

As for the ASrock, I wouldn't want to go near it if it's having difficulties with a stock 9900k.

So what's the takeaway here? 

The takeaway here with this entire build is *NO REAL WORLD DIFFERENCE!
I could spend $3500 and boot to windows in 10 seconds
Or I could spend $850 and boot to windows in 11 seconds. 

The choice is pretty clear if you ask me. 




			Cheaper NVMEs do that too, and as stated prior there is no real-world difference, but sure stick to that.
		
Click to expand...


So it would be paradoxical to bash on the CPU choice if we are following this logic, right? 

That's more of a rhetorical question.*


----------



## Vario (Feb 12, 2020)

I've built an 8600K, 8400, and 9900K, all with ASRock Z3x0 boards, 970 Evo/Pros, 16GB+ G Skill 3200+ ram and they are all indistinguishable for general use.  The 9900K is noticable if doing something with a lot of threads.  Just build the 6 core, and if it goes obsolete in 4 years then build another machine at that time.  Everything will be obsolete eventually who cares.  Another route is snipe a used 8700K off eBay.

Having no issues at all with Z370 Extreme 4 (i5 8400), Z370 Taichi (i5 8600K), and Z390 Taichi (i9 9900K).  ASRock makes some good boards for the price range.

Went with the i9 9900K for the most recent one because an open box one at Microcenter was just $380.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 12, 2020)

I've recommended the Team Dark Pro kit in every memory post I've seen. 

https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/b/BMtgXL - £3.5k workstation build with 2x16gb kits. Running at 3200/14-14-14-30 with 4 dimms no problem.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 12, 2020)

Well it was £3.5k when I built it 9 months ago.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> I've recommended the Team Dark Pro kit in every memory post I've seen.
> 
> https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/b/BMtgXL - £3.5k workstation build with 2x16gb kits. Running at 3200/14-14-14-30 with 4 dimms no problem.



Okay, I will pull the trigger on a 16GB kit of the Dark Pro. 

Is there any reason I should go with the 3466 variant as opposed to the 3200 kit?


----------



## Vario (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Okay, I will pull the trigger on a 16GB kit of the Dark Pro.
> 
> Is there any reason I should go with the 3466 variant as opposed to the 3200 kit?


Anything CL14 (14-14-14-34) is B Die.  3000/3200CL14 is an easy way to find it.  Its harder to distinguish B Die kits from the others on most of the 3000-4000 kits because the Hynix and Micron/Crucial have improved quite a bit but they generally have worse timings.  Generally though, the really really high frequency kits are also b-die.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Okay, I will pull the trigger on a 16GB kit of the Dark Pro.
> 
> Is there any reason I should go with the 3466 variant as opposed to the 3200 kit?



no only the 3200 CL14 kit is good afaik


----------



## Vario (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> no only the 3200 CL14 kit is good afaik


I have the G Skill of this ram and it is really good.  I can overclock really high with it.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

Vario said:


> I have the G Skill of this ram and it is really good.  I can overclock really high with it.



I have the Team T force legend variant it also overclock really well... Although diminished returns on ryzen beyond 3800mhz....


----------



## Vario (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> I have the Team T force legend variant it also overclock really well... Although diminished returns on ryzen beyond 3800mhz....


I was able to validate 4300 19-19-19-39 with 1.35V but it wasn't stable, maybe could have dialed it in with more voltage.  Then lost interest in overclocking it so it sits at 3200C14.








						Intel Core i5 8600K @ 4801.15 MHz - CPU-Z VALIDATOR
					

[qpyumu] Validated Dump by Vario (2018-01-19 22:05:35) - MB: ASRock Z370 Taichi - RAM: 16384 MB




					valid.x86.fr
				




Theres a lot of potential with the 3200C14 b die.


----------



## moproblems99 (Feb 12, 2020)

No offense intended but if you wanted 5ghz and played old games with tangible performance not really mattering....why not just build an FX8350 system?  Pretty sure you can hit 5ghz on that.

Additionally, you will save a ton of money on parts.



storm-chaser said:


> So what's the takeaway here?
> 
> The takeaway here with this entire build is *NO REAL WORLD DIFFERENCE!
> I could spend $3500 and boot to windows in 10 seconds
> Or I could spend $850 and boot to windows in 11 seconds. *



I'm sorry but I almost spit out the water I wasn't drinking when I read this.  This thread has been brutal to read but wtf does system boot time have to do with anything?


----------



## Mats (Feb 12, 2020)

Even if I wouldn't choose the same CPU as the OP did, get this: *HE HAS ALREADY BOUGHT IT.*
No point in telling him to get something else.. 

Cheers


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

Mats said:


> Even if I wouldn't choose the same parts as the OP did, get this: *HE HAS ALREADY BOUGHT THEM.*
> No point in telling him to get something else..
> 
> Cheers


Knowledge is power.


----------



## dont whant to set it"' (Feb 12, 2020)

Intel trew your way an under achiever with regards to oc because of Prof |pic. 2 and a square half ! Factored as a vector such as it is .. cents.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

Vario said:


> Anything CL14 (14-14-14-34) is B Die.  3000/3200CL14 is an easy way to find it.  Its harder to distinguish B Die kits from the others on most of the 3000-4000 kits because the Hynix and Micron/Crucial have improved quite a bit but they generally have worse timings.  Generally though, the really really high frequency kits are also b-die.



Contemplating my next step here. I've also heard the Gskill trident z overclocks pretty good as well? Will I be able to run tighter timings on the Teamgroup memory (vs the G.skill)?
Someone earlier in the thread said there is a performance variation with some b-die memory modules?



moproblems99 said:


> No offense intended but if you wanted 5ghz and played old games with tangible performance not really mattering....why not just build an FX8350 system?  Pretty sure you can hit 5ghz on that.
> Additionally, you will save a ton of money on parts.



I'm laughing because I already have an FX system that hits 5.0Ghz

I'm also laughing because my new system is going to be just as fast as yours for about 1/3 the price.





moproblems99 said:


> I'm sorry but I almost spit out the water I wasn't drinking when I read this.  This thread has been brutal to read but wtf does system boot time have to do with anything?



You are reading too far into this. I only brought up the boot time comparison to highlight the point that both systems will be identical in terms of real-world performance.* Up to 4 cores, the 9900K and the 9600KF are basically the same speed *and due to the lower TDP of the 9600KF, I may have more of a thermal margin which could help when it comes to overclocking


----------



## Mats (Feb 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Knowledge is power.


Exactly, too many in this thread obviously felt tl;dr about the OP and missed the small part that he already had ordered everything he needed, hence the following outburst about what he should have bought.

Yes, EarthDog, I'm choosing to make your quote about something else.


----------



## Vario (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Contemplating my next step here. I've also heard the Gskill trident z overclocks pretty good as well? Will I be able to run tighter timings on the Teamgroup memory (vs the G.skill)?


Probably doesn't matter which one you buy.  Buy the cheaper.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Contemplating my next step here. I've also heard the Gskill trident z overclocks pretty good as well? Will I be able to run tighter timings on the Teamgroup memory (vs the G.skill)?
> Someone earlier in the thread said there is a performance variation with some b-die memory modules?




Both kits should do 4000 with decent timings beyond that its going to be silicon lottery/imc/motherboard traces holding you back.


Maybe its just me but overclocking memory on intel system is a pita.... So if you don't have a ton of experience doing it find someone who does.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

I think really what's really happening here is that people are simply getting caught up in the core count hysteria. lol 
AMD and Intel have you right where they want you 

Another example:
I could spend $3500 to run Battlefield 4 on ultra settings for like 120-130 FPS

OR







*spoiler*









I could spend $850 and run Battlefield 4 on high settings for* 120-130FPS

And as I said before, not a single one of you guys has an intel system that can compete with this in terms of cost/performance ratio. *


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

Mats said:


> Exactly, too many in this thread obviously felt tl;dr about the OP and missed the small part that he already had ordered everything he needed, hence the following outburst about what he should have bought.
> 
> Yes, EarthDog, I'm choosing to make your quote about something else.


In fairness, he hasn't bought the memory and the board changed from the OP...it is tough to follow a bit what was actually purchased. But knowing what to base what on is valuable information moving forward. I'd hate to be an enthusiast and use userbenchmark as a barometer for overclocking potential... as one example. Or having an unrealistic 24/7 goal of DDR 4500 memory (for almost literally zero reason - latency my bawls, lol).

Anyway, you enjoy SC!!! T-minus 9 months until this all goes away anyway!!! 

EDIT: 





storm-chaser said:


> I think really what's really happening here is that people are simply getting caught up in the core count hysteria. lol
> AMD and Intel have you right where they want you


lulz. The irony is, I don't and one of the most vocal when it comes to not buying too much! I despise AMD for going wide like this when software hasn't caught up. What AMD has done to the mainstream is, IMO, kind of fucked up dropping in 16c/32t processors on mainstream...Much over 8c/16t will suffice for years for most users. I'm of the mind to buy once, I guess.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> I'm laughing because I already have an FX system that hits 5.0Ghz
> 
> I'm also laughing because my new system is going to be just as fast as yours for about 1/3 the price.




Not sure what you're going on about here...... His system is faster in gaming (vega 56 vs Rx 580) his will obliterate yours in MT task so not sure what your point was.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Both kits should do 4000 with decent timings beyond that its going to be silicon lottery/imc/motherboard traces holding you back.
> 
> Maybe its just me but overclocking memory on intel system is a pita.... So if you don't have a ton of experience doing it find someone who does.



Then I might as well stick with the G.skill for now. If I'm not happy with their performance I can always upgrade later.



EarthDog said:


> In fairness, he hasn't bought the memory and the board changed from the OP...it is tough to follow a bit what was actually purchased. But knowing what to base what on is valuable information moving forward. I'd hate to be an enthusiast and use userbenchmark as a barometer for overclocking potential... as one example. Or having an unrealistic 24/7 goal of DDR 4500 memory (for almost literally zero reason - latency my bawls, lol).
> 
> Anyway, you enjoy SC!!! T-minus 7 months until this all goes away anyway!!!



Yeah, I don't mind the criticism most of these guys are only looking out for the best system for me. *But, they are on the outside looking in for my specific usage scenario. *So I will take advice from anyone willing to respond here so long as they stop referring to the 9600KF as a weak processor.

I will see you over at overclockers.com in about a month earthdog 

Hope you've been well.



oxrufiioxo said:


> Not sure what you're going on about here...... His system is faster in gaming (vega 56 vs Rx 580) his will obliterate yours in MT task so not sure what your point was.



For my usage scenario, both PCs would perform identically. I'm only loading up 3-4 cores for the most part. Meaning, why would I spend over $1000 for a CPU when I can get the same (relative) performance from something like the 9600KF for $200???


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

lolol, your head is so far in the sand man... get help.


----------



## moproblems99 (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> I'm also laughing because my new system is going to be just as fast as yours for about 1/3 the price.



Well, now, no need to be snarky.  You said yourself you were really only going for 5ghz.  That was your main goal.  Additionally, how do define fast? A single core? 2 cores? 6 cores? 12 cores?  Oh....wait.

Let's have a race and run 6 vms.  Oh, that isn't your use case?  Well, it is mine.  I am glad that you built a system that YOU want.  I am hope that you get a ton of enjoyment out of it.  However, you could have built a waaaaaay more balanced system that would have likely been faster and cheaper had you been willing to listen to some of the (albeit harsh) criticism.

This was never a pissing match.  You could buy an 8700k that would perform about the same single threaded and have the multithreaded boost and still have the same upgrade path, as one example.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> lolol, your head is so far in the sand man... get help.




Wait!!!!!.... I'm confused. Did this just turn into WccfTech!?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> I am glad that you built a system that YOU want. I am hope that you get a ton of enjoyment out of it.



Thank you. Now that wasn't so hard to say now was it? And for the record, I do appreciate the feedback, I am listening, I already swapped to a better motherboard.


----------



## moproblems99 (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Now that wasn't so hard to say now was it?



I'm not sure what you mean?  I am always happy when people spend their money on fun stuff.  

I just shake my head when someone buys a Corolla thinking it's a Supra when they just could have bought a Supra.



storm-chaser said:


> I am listening, I already swapped to a better motherboard.



I don't think anyone here outside of you knows what parts have been bought and what haven't.


----------



## moproblems99 (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> And as I said before, not a single one of you guys has an intel system that can compete with this in terms of cost/performance ratio.



Also, have you actually done a cost/performance comparison?  As I would generally, sincerely even, be interested in seeing how it played out.


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

Not the place... so I'll acknowledge once and move on..

Anyone with half a clue knew this wasnt going to happen. I couldn't have cared less about the whole process. So, no, not remotely butthurt. 



I'm out! See ya in a month.


----------



## Mats (Feb 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> In fairness, he hasn't bought the memory and the board changed from the OP...it is tough to follow a bit what was actually purchased.


True, but it was the CPU that caused most of the noise. I did edit my post shortly after, but you quoted me just before.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> I just shake my head when someone buys a Corolla thinking it's a Supra when they just could have bought a Supra.


*
Under my usage scenario:*

You do realize that the CPU runs stock at 3.7ghz, right?
And it has essentially the same cores as a 3.6Ghz 9900k, right? 
And that most people only use 2-3 cores for general use? 

What does this tell you about the comparative speed? 

People seem to be forgetting I built this rig *with a principle focus on single-threaded or per-core performance. *

I guess I could equate it to building engines. For example, one guy has a 615 cubic inch big block chevy but it's sitting in a car that weighs a bit more than his competitor in the far lane. His opponent has a 408 cubic inch small block chevy that is also built for speed. All other things being equal, sure, the big block smokes him in the 1/4 due to more HP, but the small block chevy gets off the line quicker and takes the win in the 1/8th mile. Believe it or not, cubic inch displacement is not the be-all of engine building. Just like core count is not the be-all of processor performance.


----------



## Mats (Feb 12, 2020)

Nice try, killing your own thread with politics. Based on other locked threads it isn't that hard to do..


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

Mats said:


> Nice try, killing your own thread with politics. Based on other locked threads it isn't that hard to do..



That would be funny if it were true. But it was earthdog who brought up politics in the first place.


----------



## HammerON (Feb 12, 2020)

Leave politics out of this thread please.  Reply bans will be imposed if we cannot stay on topic.
Carry on!


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 12, 2020)

HammerON said:


> Leave politics out of this thread please.  Reply bans will be imposed if we cannot stay on topic.
> Carry on!


Okay will do.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> *And as I said before, not a single one of you guys has an intel system that can compete with this in terms of cost/performance ratio. *


I do.paid a little more for the cpu than you did but this thing just went into my z97 and ddr3 system.
that said,I don't get all the berating.
this is a pretty dope system,one I thought about buillding for myself at some point.

6 core i5 at 5ghz,with fast ram,this is gonna bulldoze through games when overclocked.if you don't need HT specifically it's what you get,especially with 9600kf being quite affordable at this point.
970 pro - expensive,but doesn't get better than this,stellar performance no matter how much you're writing to it at a time,and as far as longevity it's a drive he'll likely pass on to his great grandchildren.

single threaded performance and latency is,was and will be what games run on,unless you know specifically that a game that op is gonna play requires more than 6 fast cores I suggest you move on.yes,just about every modern game out there now can easily use 12-16 threads if available,but that does not mean there's equivalence between single core performance and number of threads.
for the ryzen screaming crowd,look what 3900x and 3700x are doing in games.maxing out best binned cores while half of them and smt don't do jack









						Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order тест GPU/CPU 2019 | Action / FPS / TPS | Тест GPU
					

В «Звёздные Войны Джедаи: Павший Орден», боевике с видом от третьего лица от Respawn Entertainment,  вас ждут приключени




					gamegpu.com


----------



## moproblems99 (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> I guess I could equate it to building engines. For example, one guy has a 615 cubic inch big block chevy but it's sitting in a car that weighs a bit more than his competitor in the far lane. His opponent has a 408 cubic inch small block chevy that is also built for speed. All other things being equal, sure, the big block smokes him in the 1/4 due to more HP, but the small block chevy gets off the line quicker and takes the win in the 1/8th mile. Believe it or not, cubic inch displacement is not the be-all of engine building. Just like core count is not the be-all of processor performance.



Your analogy sucks

How do we know the big block has more HP?  Block size/displacement != More horsepower.



storm-chaser said:


> And that most people only use 2-3 cores for general use?



Elderly people browsing emails or the average person arguing builds on TPU.  Because you are wrong about the latter.



storm-chaser said:


> You do realize that the CPU runs stock at 3.7ghz, right?



And? I am going to combine with the next.



storm-chaser said:


> What does this tell you about the comparative speed?



Absolutely nothing.  Are you implying that a 9700k is faster than a 9900k because it has a faster base clock?  Please no.  Additionally, how much time are the cpus sitting at base clock and not boosting.  Also, aren't 9700ks just rebinned from 9900ks that didn't quite make the snuff?


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> *Under my usage scenario:*
> 
> You do realize that the CPU runs stock at 3.7ghz, right?
> And it has essentially the same cores as a 3.6Ghz 9900k, right?
> ...





I think the confusion comes from the fact that the 3600 is 18% cheaper while being 13% faster at CPU task as tested here.

You do lose 4% in gaming performance but you also need a 2080 ti to get those gains...... which really you should be pairing with an 8700k or faster anyway unless all you care about is averages and not what really matters 1% lows.

So you've put yourself in a scenario where you lose all the MT benefit while gaining zero of gaming benefit with your 580

This really comes down to how long will it take you to get 2080 ti like gpu performance to benefit from your cpu choice.
You also lose out on the ability to upgrade to up to 16 cores in the future if necessary because you chose a dead platform.


Again though at the end of the day its your money do some research and pick whats best for you..... The 9600 is fine cpu nothing wrong with it just because I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot stick doesn't mean it won't serve you well for years to come.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> you also need a 2080 ti to get those gain
> 
> This really comes down to how long will it take you to get 2080 ti like gpu performance to benefit from your cpu choice.


not really how it works.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> not really how it works.



Really? Care to elaborate.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 12, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Really? Care to elaborate.



you're taking the average result from tpu running gpu benchmarks at 720p and applying it to specific scenarios when he's playing at higher resolution but in cpu bound sequences of a game.

example - my 4790k choked the hell out of gtx 1080 at 1440p while driving on the high street in watch dogs 2,though on average it would not be more than a couple of percent slower than a 8700k the way tpu are testing.

the average result is not a consistent result.you're not getting 4% less consistently.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 12, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> you're taking the average result from tpu running gpu benchmarks at 720p and applying it to specific scenarios when he's playing at higher resolution but in cpu bound sequences of a game.
> 
> example - my 4790k choked the hell out of gtx 1080 at 1440p while driving on the high street in watch dogs 2,though on average it would not be more than a couple of percent slower than a 8700k the way tpu are testing.
> 
> the average result is not a consistent result.you're not getting 4% less consistently.



That's why I mention 1% lows something a 9900k destroys a 9600k at in most modern games where even a 3600 does better in a lot of modern game engines.


This is all sorta off topic at this point and technically could be debated till the end of time..... The OP @storm-chaser  is pretty dead set on a 9600 and its his money nothing wrong with that I hope it serves him well for years to come.


----------



## phill (Feb 12, 2020)

Whilst this has been somewhat of an interesting read...  In some ways, do you have any of the hardware in place and working so we can see things rather than just have arguments over who and what is faster??

I was just hoping for some pics and some stats on what was what with the rig


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 12, 2020)

phill said:


> Whilst this has been somewhat of an interesting read...  In some ways, do you have any of the hardware in place and working so we can see things rather than just have arguments over who and what is faster??
> 
> I was just hoping for some pics and some stats on what was what with the rig


Parts come in friday according to the last line I the op


----------



## phill (Feb 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Parts come in friday according to the last line I the op


Thanks   I'll come back Friday and hope for some pics and test results


----------



## moproblems99 (Feb 13, 2020)

phill said:


> Thanks   I'll come back Friday and hope for some pics and test results



We all have a good idea what it will perform like, I wanna see the cost comparison.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

Grab some popcorn - I'm really looking forward to this one - should be a very interesting experiment. I decided to stick with the G.Skill 4000Mhz RAM as it was already ordered and people are saying it overclocks well. Although, my main goal, as everyone knows, is 5.00ghz the CPU. One added benefit of the I5-9600KF is that Intel did switch to a solder-based thermal interface material between its die and heat spreader, enabling higher multi-core Turbo Boost frequencies, reducing heat and potentially raising our overclock ceiling a little bit.

What do you guys estimate I can get out of the NB? I was hoping to see 4.5Ghz... Does that sound feasible given the hardware we are working with here?  

One day, if and when I ever get a chiller, I'd like to try for the trifecta. 
5000mhz CPU clock
5000mhz Memory clock
5000mhz North Bridge


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Grab some popcorn - I'm really looking forward to this one - should be a very interesting experiment. I decided to stick with the G.Skill 4000Mhz RAM as it was already ordered and people are saying it overclocks well. Although, my main goal, as everyone knows, is 5.00ghz the CPU. One added benefit of the I5-9600KF is that Intel did switch to a solder-based thermal interface material between its die and heat spreader, enabling higher multi-core Turbo Boost frequencies, reducing heat and potentially raising our overclock ceiling a little bit.
> 
> What do you guys estimate I can get out of the NB? I was hoping to see 4.5Ghz... Does that sound feasible given the hardware we are working with here?
> 
> ...




5.0 Core/4.8 NB/4400 mem should be doable but getting a kit that already does 4400CL19 would have been a plus there's no gurantee the imc will even like memory that high on a 9600 which typically gets the worse silicon of the three main intel chips. The Gskill kit @Vario was talking about was a 3200CL14 which is a better bin afaik.

Your cooling an case is most likely going to be the determining factor on your Core/NB and also if this is a daily overclock or something you just want to run short benchmarks with.

for daily 5.0 Core/4.7 NB/4000 mem is way more realistic with excellent cooling/airflow

For 5000 mem you'll likely need one of the motherboards @Xx Tek Tip xX  listed otherwise around 4400-4600 will likely be a limit on very good 4 dimm daisy chain boards.
you'd also need to buy a bunch of CPU to test as well though or buy a used one that has been validated to do 5ghz on the mem.


----------



## eidairaman1 (Feb 13, 2020)

@storm-chaser how you been?


----------



## Vario (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> I do.paid a little more for the cpu than you did but this thing just went into my z97 and ddr3 system.
> that said,I don't get all the berating.
> this is a pretty dope system,one I thought about buillding for myself at some point.
> 
> ...


It is the system I have essentially and it is fine for games but I don't play much beyond FiveM, Mordhau, Space Engineers.


storm-chaser said:


> Grab some popcorn - I'm really looking forward to this one - should be a very interesting experiment. I decided to stick with the G.Skill 4000Mhz RAM as it was already ordered and people are saying it overclocks well. Although, my main goal, as everyone knows, is 5.00ghz the CPU. One added benefit of the I5-9600KF is that Intel did switch to a solder-based thermal interface material between its die and heat spreader, enabling higher multi-core Turbo Boost frequencies, reducing heat and potentially raising our overclock ceiling a little bit.
> 
> What do you guys estimate I can get out of the NB? I was hoping to see 4.5Ghz... Does that sound feasible given the hardware we are working with here?
> 
> ...


As far as solder vs paste TIM, the temperatures end up being about the same.  You can delid the pasted ones though which is a bonus for some, delidded temps are better than soldered.
NB should easily do 4.5.  Mine would do it but for some glitch in my bios.  I can set it about as higher if I use XTU in Windows but the bios multiplier setting for NB doesn't retain above 4.3 for some reason.  I have booted as high as 5.2 core on my machine and also set CPU NB to 4.8 before using XTU, I don't see much benefit running that much clock so I just run it as high as my stock voltage of ~1.15-1.16V takes me which is about 4.6GHz.  Latency wise I had noticed a difference overclocking uncore/northbridge particularly in games like GTAIV.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> How do we know the big block has more HP? Block size/displacement != More horsepower.


Dynamometer. Like a benchmark test for your car. Another analogy would be a six cylinder engine vs an eight cylinder engine. Just because the V8 has two more cylinders does not necessarily mean it's the way to go. If you run out of road before getting into the engine's top end powerband, where the serious horsepower is developed, you might as well fold up shop and stick with the V6. What I am getting at is the fact that *if you measure your CPU by PER CORE standards, both processors have nearly identical performance characteristics (9900k vs 9600KF). EDIT: In automotive speak this is usually measured as horsepower per liter or horsepower per cubic inch. *

Sure, the 9900k has more torque. But the question remains, if you never access it than what is the point? It's like buying a 10,000 square foot home for you and your dog. It's nice and pretty but it's expensive and many of the rooms sit empty for years on end.* And again, this is all relative to my particular usage case. Core monsters - you know who you are. *



moproblems99 said:


> Elderly people browsing emails or the average person arguing builds on TPU. Because you are wrong about the latter.


*Heck, you might even be one of those guys who uses at least six cores 99% of the time. lol*



moproblems99 said:


> Absolutely nothing. Are you implying that a 9700k is faster than a 9900k because it has a faster base clock? Please no. Additionally, how much time are the cpus sitting at base clock and not boosting. Also, aren't 9700ks just rebinned from 9900ks that didn't quite make the snuff?


Im not saying its faster, only that the two CPUs are, for all intensive purposes, are basically equal in performance for any workload under six cores.

And I'm talking real world, seat of the pants performance, not theoretical benchmarking here.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

eidairaman1 said:


> @storm-chaser how you been?



Pretty good my friend. Im happy to finally be working with my computers again. I haven't had a lot of time in past few months to set aside for my computer hobby... but now it's off the back burner!




moproblems99 said:


> Also, have you actually done a cost/performance comparison?  As I would generally, sincerely even, be interested in seeing how it played out.



Sincerely, I challenge you to find another current gen Intel chip on the market today with a better cost / performance ratio than the X6 9600kf


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

Noone is arguing with you about cost/performance. It's a defunct response. The point is 6c/6t is obsolete already in 2019. Moving forward in 2020 you're screwed in the long run. 9700k should have been your minimum.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> Noone is arguing with you about cost/performance. It's a defunct response. The point is 6c/6t is obsolete already in 2019. Moving forward in 2020 you're screwed in the long run. 9700k should have been your minimum.


No it really isn't.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> That's why I mention 1% lows something a 9900k destroys a 9600k at in most modern games where even a 3600 does better in a lot of modern game engines


Your own post disproves that 3600 is better








						Intel X6 i5-9600KF based system (5.00Ghz project)
					

Long overdue for a new system, and the time has finally come!  After losing a good lead on a cheap 8086K, I've spent the afternoon comparing alternative CPUs to replace it. I've decided to go with the fastest 9th gen core I5 CPU instead... I know, I know, it's not top tier, but I am still...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




Biggest difference is 96 vs 93 on favor of 3600 OC in sotr at 1080p medium


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> Your own post disproves that 3600 is better
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Not overly difficult to find results where the 3600 does better 22% in BFV is pretty large also not difficult to find where the 9600 does well so that's why I've repeatedly said do your research
Keep in mind its 18% cheaper currently on amazon.



I think I mentioned this already you lose a bit in gaming but you gain much more in MT task and in 2020 if you don't care about MT performance you should if not a 7600k  at 4.8ghz which also has nearly the same IPC as a 9600k wouldn't be losing to a 1600 in a lot of modern games.

I don't think anyone could recommend in good faith a 9600K over a 3600 other than blind intel fanboys. Fanboys of anything are the worse and I hope intel can get down to 10nm or 7nm soon because all the Ryzen love is getting old I mean you have to scroll way down on amazon.com best selling cpu list to even find an i5.

Not to mention its a dead platform with a likely much better i5 that will probably be better than an 8700k coming out this year although with all the mitigation intel is having to pump out who knows.... I haven't notice any noticeable performance degradation with my 9900k since it launched so fingers crossed that isn't the case I'm willing to bet slower cpu with less resources will feel it first though and maybe that's why in SOTTR the 9600k at 5.2ghz is 60% slower than a stock 9900k in 1% lows albeit with unrealistic settings....

I love my 9900k based system its pretty amazing but even it I wouldn't recommend over a 3900X given the choice between the two.


Again we could argue this till the end of time so it's a bit pointless as the OP already decided he was going intel no matter what so its irrelevant.
I worry about the longevity of a 6 core 6 thread cpu but the OP has a 580 so with ultra settings he will struggle to even hit 60 in some games so its probably irrelevant for now.

I hope I was clear as to why I would recommend a 3600 or even a 2600  (the substantially better upgrade path while both of them being cheaper) really over a 9600k doesn't mean I'm right whoever is buying one of these cpu needs to research the games they actually plan on playing and the programs they actually plan on using.

coming from what the OP has just about any modern cpu will be a huge upgrade... I have a feeling he's going to love the 9600KF


I tried to help the OP as much as I could with the gaming/system building experience I have admittedly that's way less than a lot of people on this forum only 30 systems over the last 9 years...

Something @phill said got me thinking and really the best way to make a good decision would be to have both system in front of you doing the things you do unfortunately this is unrealistic for most people so all we can look at is a graph that doesn't always tell the whole story.


----------



## Vario (Feb 13, 2020)

Well hes not spending your money, hes spending his money, so I would give up on the lost cause of trying to convince him to buy a 3600, and just let him build the system he wants to build.


oxrufiioxo said:


> Again we could argue this till the end of time so it's a bit pointless as the OP already decided he was going intel no matter what so its irrelevant.


Exactly, so don't bother.


----------



## Durvelle27 (Feb 13, 2020)

I didn't read through the whole thread as i just want to add 2 cents

I don't believe that cooler will be able to handle heat generated at 5GHz.


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 13, 2020)

Durvelle27 said:


> I don't believe that cooler will be able to handle heat generated at 5GHz.


That, and many other points have already been made... but the OP wanted an all MSI rig in that non-windowed old school chassis sooooo. It is what it is (a $120 cooler that performs as well as a $50 cooler).


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 13, 2020)

Durvelle27 said:


> I didn't read through the whole thread as i just want to add 2 cents
> 
> I don't believe that cooler will be able to handle heat generated at 5GHz.



For AVX loads probably not..... 

For gaming it should be fine,  but it doesn't really seem like he's going to be doing much MT task with it seeing as how fixated on single threaded performance he's is I'm sure he's done his research into what he plans on using the system for so I'm sure he will be fine.


----------



## Durvelle27 (Feb 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> That, and many other points have already been made... but the OP wanted an all MSI rig in that non-windowed old school chassis sooooo. It is what it is (a $120 cooler that performs as well as a $50 cooler).


Dang since you pointed that out as i glanced right pass it. Thar case has terrible airflow

OP I'm not going to comment on the CPU as you made your mind up

But you need a better case and cooler


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

Durvelle27 said:


> I didn't read through the whole thread as i just want to add 2 cents
> 
> I don't believe that cooler will be able to handle heat generated at 5GHz.



That's okay, I like the look of it. I think I will get fairly close to 5Ghz anyway. The cooler is rated for 250w TDP. Yet another reason I didn't go all-in on a 9900K, I wanted to run air cooling on this machine. 

As you may or may not know, the 9600KF has a solder-based thermal interface material, which improves heat transfer, facilitating higher frequencies whether you're using one core or all six. A base clock rate of 3.7 GHz already represents a 100 MHz improvement over the Core i5-8600K frequency floor (and a 100Mhz improvement over the 9900K as well).


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> Noone is arguing with you about cost/performance. It's a defunct response. The point is 6c/6t is obsolete already in 2019. Moving forward in 2020 you're screwed in the long run. 9700k should have been your minimum.



*LOL I love how you are claiming a 9th Gen CPU, what is essentially Intel's most recent release to the processor market, is already obsolete. *Do you think I'm going to pay you any mind with a comment like that?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> I love my 9900k based system its pretty amazing but even it I wouldn't recommend over a 3900X given the choice between the two.



I'm happy you love your 9900K system, and I sure hope you get two use those two outer-most extra cores considering you have A LOT of money tied up in that thing. As for the 3900X, you know I already bought a 9600KF, so you can drop the act now.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Not overly difficult to find results where the 3600 does better 22% in BFV is pretty large also not difficult to find where the 9600 does well so that's why I've repeatedly said do your research
> Keep in mind its 18% cheaper currently on amazon.
> View attachment 144738View attachment 144739View attachment 144740View attachment 144741
> 
> ...


those are stock results dude,not 5ghz,probably nowhere near the ram speed he'll be running,and bf5 is a one off result,seriously questionable with their useless absolute min fps methodology.in the other three 9600k will be faster in 1% once oc'd to 5ghz too.
your whole posts seems like you're pandering to ryzen owners except when you gotta get a cpu for yourself.
we should care about mt performance cause ryzen is here.that's exceptional thinking.keep sweeping the likes like leaves in the fall.
seriously,what for ? for anything remotely workstation related that I'm doing on my computerr my igpu and dgpu will help me more than SMT ever could.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

seriously,people need to check out what obsolete means.
that sku will probably outperform 3600 too,so 3600 is obsolete


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> those are stock results dude,not 5ghz,proabbly nowhere near the ram speed he'll be running,and bf5 is a one off result.in the other three 9600k will be faster in 1% once oc'd to 5ghz too.
> your whole posts seems like you're pandering to ryzen owners except when you gotta get a cpu for yourself.
> we should care about mt performance cause ryzen is here.that's exceptional thinking.keep sweeping the likes like leaves in the fall.
> seriously,what for ? for anything remotely workstation related that I'm doing on my computerr my igpu and dgpu will help me morre than SMT ever could.



I own both a 9900k and a 3900X so I'm well aware of how Ryzen compares.


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 13, 2020)

If it is time to buy, it's time to buy, people... some can't or simply do not want to wait. If this works for him, that is great...but for othe enthusiasts, in particular gamers who play modern titles, it really is a minimum today. I question how it will do in a year or two, especially if he wants to play modern titles especially after the consoles are out, but that said, it's only a glass ceiling. I'm sure it will reach 60 fps so,it will do the job.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> I own both a 9900k and a 3900X so I'm well aware of how Ryzen compares.


that's why you're basing your whole point on one result in bf5 where they're testing absolute minimum obvserved  fps not 1% on stock 9600k and then tell us we should care about MT performance cause of ryzen.

nice!


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> that's why you're basing your whole point on one result in bf5 where they're testing absolute minimum obvserved  fps not 1% on stock 9600k and then tell us we should care about MT performance cause of ryzen.
> 
> nice!


Didnt the other games he showed graphs of show similar behavior?


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Didnt the other games he showed graphs of show similar behavior?


look at them and the ones he posted from gamersnexus


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> look at them and the ones he posted from gamersnexus


Dude this thread is god knows how long.. which post? Link it (you can right click on the post #, copy, and paste, note).

From his links, I see bf v and assassins creed showing significant differences. The other two, not much. I'd bet that hold true through the last 2 cods (it spread the load really evenly across 16c/16t anyway, lol).

Regardless, this only hinders fps in games that can utilize more than 6c. While that is only several titles (some AAA) now,  the list grows monthly.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Dude this thread is god knows how long.. which post? Link it (you can right click on the post #, copy, and paste, note).
> 
> From his links, I see bf v and assassins creed showing significant differences. The other two, not much. I'd bet that hold true through the last 2 cods (it spread the load really evenly across 16c/16t.
> 
> Regardless, this only hinders fps in games that can utilize more than 6c. While that is only several titles (some AAA) now,  the list grows monthly.


ac shows 10% when 9600k is stock,and they're testing miminum observed fps which is just trash methodology when compred to today's standard that is 1%

bf1 - see above.would have to compare 1% oc vs oc to see how much it actually is.









						Intel X6 i5-9600KF based system (5.00Ghz project)
					

And as I said before, not a single one of you guys has an intel system that can compete with this in terms of cost/performance ratio.   I do.paid a little more for the cpu than you did but this thing just went into my z97 and ddr3 system. that said,I don't get all the berating. this is a pretty...




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Regardless, this only hinders fps in games that can utilize more than 6c. While that is only several titles (some AAA) now,  the list grows monthly.


no,it's when 6 cores are not enough,not when a game can utilize six.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> If it is time to buy, it's time to buy, people... some can't or simply do not want to wait. If this works for him, that is great...but for othe enthusiasts, in particular gamers who play modern titles, it really is a minimum today. I question how it will do in a year or two, especially if he wants to play modern titles especially after the consoles are out, but that said, it's only a glass ceiling. I'm sure it will reach 60 fps so,it will do the job.
> 
> Perhaps people shouldn't be claiming a 9th Gen Core processor is obsolete? lol


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Perhaps people shouldn't be claiming a 9th Gen Core processor is obsolete? lol


9350k is.


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Perhaps people shouldn't be claiming a 9th Gen Core processor is obsolete? lol


Obsolete is a bit strong, I agree. 


cucker tarlson said:


> no,it's when 6 cores are not enough,not when a game can utilize six.


what? If a games uses a 6cores, that means there is nothing left for much else slowing down the game and some fos drops will occur. Dont split hairs.


----------



## Durvelle27 (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> That's okay, I like the look of it. I think I will get fairly close to 5Ghz anyway. The cooler is rated for 250w TDP. Yet another reason I didn't go all-in on a 9900K, I wanted to run air cooling on this machine.
> 
> As you may or may not know, the 9600KF has a solder-based thermal interface material, which improves heat transfer, facilitating higher frequencies whether you're using one core or all six. A base clock rate of 3.7 GHz already represents a 100 MHz improvement over the Core i5-8600K frequency floor (and a 100Mhz improvement over the 9900K as well).


Manufactures are known to over exaggerate their cooler capabilities. I mean if you look at reviews your cooler performs worse than a H7 but cost more.

Soldered or not if you can't dissipate the heat it won't matter.

You must realize 9th gen intel runs hot even with a soldered ihs


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

You guys are going to love this...

Depending on my results with the first CPU, perhaps I will go ahead and buy like 5 more in hopes of finding a unicorn.



Durvelle27 said:


> Manufactures are known to over exaggerate their cooler capabilities. I mean if you look at reviews your cooler performs worse than a H7 but cost more.



Right, I knew going in I was sacrificing performance for looks. That being said, if I cannot achieve 5Ghz, do you think an H7 will help me reach that goal? What other air coolers would you recommend for 5Ghz given my CPU choice?

*I have my heart set on air cooling, even though I can fit a 360mm rad in this case.*

Depending on how my first CPU performs, perhaps I should buy like 5 or 6 more in hopes of finding a unicorn... worth it? Essentially, they are so cheap you might as well do your own binning...


----------



## Rahnak (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> What other air coolers would you recommend for 5Ghz given my CPU choice?


Noctua's D15 is the popular choice.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> You guys are going to love this...
> 
> Depending on my results with the first CPU, perhaps I will go ahead and buy like 5 more in hopes of finding a unicorn.
> 
> ...




All of theses should do it but I would go with the D15 they will likely send you a new bracket for any future motherboard you purchase even 5 years down the line if its not supported.






						Amazon.com: Noctua NH-D15 chromax.Black, Dual-Tower CPU Cooler (140mm, Black): Computers & Accessories
					

Buy Noctua NH-D15 chromax.Black, Dual-Tower CPU Cooler (140mm, Black): CPU Cooling Fans - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases



					www.amazon.com
				









						Amazon.com: Scythe Fuma 2 CPU Air Cooler, Intel LGA1151, AMD AM4/Ryzen, 120mm Dual Towers, Black Top Cover: Computers & Accessories
					

Buy Scythe Fuma 2 CPU Air Cooler, Intel LGA1151, AMD AM4/Ryzen, 120mm Dual Towers, Black Top Cover: CPU Cooling Fans - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases



					www.amazon.com
				









						Amazon.com: Scythe Ninja 5 CPU Air Cooler, 120mm Single Tower, Intel LGA1151, AMD AM4, Dual Quiet Fans, Black Top Cover: Computers & Accessories
					

Buy Scythe Ninja 5 CPU Air Cooler, 120mm Single Tower, Intel LGA1151, AMD AM4, Dual Quiet Fans, Black Top Cover: CPU Cooling Fans - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases



					www.amazon.com
				







			https://www.amazon.com/quiet-Dark-Rock-BK022-Cooler/dp/B07BY6F8D9/ref=sr_1_1?crid=TRLE53W2HTL0&keywords=dark+rock+pro+4&qid=1581612052&sprefix=dark+rock+%2Caps%2C206&sr=8-1


----------



## Durvelle27 (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> You guys are going to love this...
> 
> Depending on my results with the first CPU, perhaps I will go ahead and buy like 5 more in hopes of finding a unicorn.
> 
> ...


Noctua DH-14 is one of the top coolers available rivaling AIOs


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

Rahnak said:


> Noctua's D15 is the popular choice.



Thanks. I will keep this in the back of my mind. I do like the dark look now that Noctua has gone away from that ugly tan suitcase color they used to use on everything.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Thanks. I will keep this in the back of my mind. I do like the dark look now that Noctua has gone away from that ugly tan suitcase color they used to use on everything.




The one I linked you is all black... I know you like your Stealth fighter look. I hope I'm not confusing you with someone else who said that.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> The one I linked you is all black... I know you like your Stealth fighter look. I hope I'm not confusing you with someone else who said that.



Yeah, I definitely like the look of them, it's always an option in the future... not ruling it out that's for sure.


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> on my results with the first CPU, perhaps I will go ahead and buy like 5 more in hopes of finding a unicorn.


or save time and likely money, and just get one off siliconlottery.com


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

U12A is better than D15.

But OP has made it clear he doesn't care about performance, only looks so why are we even bothering? More than 50% of the build doesn't make sense, RAM, CPU, mobo (at least he changed it), cooler, case... At what point do we stop flogging the dead horse of offering reasoned advice?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> But OP has made it clear he doesn't care about performance, only looks so why are we even bothering? More than 50% of the build doesn't make sense, RAM, CPU, mobo (at least he changed it), cooler, case... At what point do we stop flogging the dead horse of offering reasoned advice?


Right, because 5000Mhz on a six-core CPU, 4000Mhz on 16GB of memory and up to 500K IOPS in both read and write on my nvme SSD means this thing is going to be an absolute slug.

Brilliant, absolutely brilliant logic you have there.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

Relative to other options for the same overall price it's terrible lmao.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> or save time and likely money, and just get one off siliconlottery.com



I did a quick search on the site and they seem to have no binned 9600KFs...


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> Relative to other options for the same overall price it's terrible lmao.



LOL of course, because everyone knows *the 9900K has a far better cost/performance* ratio than that of a 9600kf.

Try to do a little research first before you post again in ignorance.



dgianstefani said:


> Relative to other options for the same overall price it's terrible lmao.



What, so because I shut down your first argument you decide to move the goalposts? 

smart move LOL


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

"Shut down your argument" Lmao, this guy.
I'm not talking about the 9900k, and if you could read, you'd know that as I mentioned the 9700k. You should have ditched the $100 cooler that performs as well as a $50 cooler. Ditched the crap case that has bad airflow and is expensive. Bought 9700k instead. 
That or build a Ryzen system.

Imagine building an upper mid range system in 2020 that has worse CPU performance than a 2 year old 8700k.
But sure, keep believing you have a great price/performance ratio with your crappy MSI cooler and a 970 Pro haha which is basically one of the worst Price/performance SSDs you can buy, although it is excellent (I have 2).

I sense you may be a little insecure about your purchase. And as many others have pointed out in strong arguments, it doesn't really make sense, your component selection.

But yeah, you're right and we're all wrong.

RX580, $200 memory that is no better than many $120-150 kits, a crappy motherboard. A $120 cooler that performs worse than a $40 cooler... Yeah, you have excellent taste.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> RX580, $200 memory that is no better than many $120-150 kits, a crappy motherboard. A $120 cooler that performs worse than a $40 cooler... Yeah, you have excellent taste.



Are you finished yet? 

No, I was talking about the 9900k... genius. You obviously didn't get my drift.

And In regards to the 9700K, it's nearly double the cost of a 9600K for a CPU that performs the same up to 4x cores. You were saying something about an economical build?

And to make matters worse for yourself, you first make the outrageous claim that I'm not interested in performance, and when I prove you wrong you wrong there, you move the goalposts. Yeah, I'm sure that's going to help your credibility.

ps I already have the case, I've owned it for 10 years now... and the MSI RX580 was a birthday gift.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

If you were interested in performance you would spend $120 on a cooler that made sense. 
Bought a CPU with more than 6 threads when every other platform including consoles is moving to 8+ as a minimum. 
Save $50 from your RAM, $50 from your cooler choice (both without losing any performance at all), swapped the crappy mobo for one $30 less that has better performance (z370/90 extreme 4) and you've got $130 to upgrade to the 9700k.

Easy enough when it's spoonfed?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> You should have ditched the $100 cooler that performs as well as a $50 cooler.



Now are you finished? God, please say yes!

Does a 250 W TDP cooler with 8 heat pipes not classify as high performance in your world? LOL

Did I at any point in this thread ever say I wanted this to be purely an economical build? *Again, do your research before you post again in ignorance.* 

You clearly didn't read all of this thread. If you had, you would have noticed I already pointed out the fact that I purchased the CPU cooler for aesthetics... this is very simple stuff, why are you having trouble wrapping your mind around this? 

I hope you are happy with your 9900k or whatever. You needed it of course because you always have at least 6 cores pegged 24/7

Maybe you have a few too many instances of prime95 running in the background? LOL


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

Pick one, aesthetics or price/performance.

You don't have both in this build.



storm-chaser said:


> Did I at any point in this thread ever say I wanted this to be purely an economical build? *Again, do your research before you post again in ignorance.*





storm-chaser said:


> price to performance ratio is hard to beat (best price/performance ratio of any Intel chip on the market, that's for sure).





storm-chaser said:


> Does a 250 W TDP cooler with 8 heat pipes not classify as high performance in your world? LOL


When you can buy an air cooler with the same capacity and quieter fans for $70 (U12A/NHD15)

The one who needs to do research here ain't me bud.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> If you were interested in performance you would spend $120 on a cooler that made sense.
> Bought a CPU with more than 6 threads when every other platform including consoles is moving to 8+ as a minimum.
> Save $50 from your RAM, $50 from your cooler choice (both without losing any performance at all), swapped the crappy mobo for one $30 less that has better performance (z370/90 extreme 4) and you've got $130 to upgrade to the 9700k.
> 
> Easy enough when it's spoonfed?



How does it feel to know that a 9600K performs just as well as your 8700K for half the price?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> The one who needs to do research here ain't me bud.



Again, ignorance abounds with you, you just can't shake it, can you?


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> How does it feel to know that a 9600K performs just as well as your 8700K for half the price?


LMAO. Yes, your 5ghz 9600k with 6c and 6t performs "just as well" as my 8700k with 6c/12t at 5.2ghz... Keep dreaming.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

Cool how you keep throwing insults like "ignorant" without actually providing any details on how.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

Even if your choice mythically did perform "just as well" why would you buy that more than two years later? And you don't think the build is obsolete? OK bud.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> When you can buy an air cooler with the same capacity and quieter fans for $70 (U12A/NHD15)



You didnt even answer the question!!! Do you or do you not consider a cooler with 8 heat pipes rated at 250W TDP "high performance"?


----------



## Durvelle27 (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Now are you finished? God, please say yes!
> 
> Does a 250 W TDP cooler with 8 heat pipes not classify as high performance in your world? LOL
> 
> ...


250W claimed TDP with 8 heatpipes that aren't very efficient. This isn't a good debate as by no means is this cooler high performance. High price yes but performance not so much. There are many better options widely available. At the price point many AIOs are available that look just as good, are quieter, and would perform much better


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> LMAO. Yes, your 5ghz 9600k with 6c and 6t performs "just as well" as my 8700k with 6c/12t at 5.2ghz... Keep dreaming.


*
Again, do your research before you post again in ignorance. *

Only difference you will see between the two is theoretical or in benchmarks... absolutely no difference in real-world performance. 

I hope you got a good deal on your overpriced 8700K. However, now that you've delidded it, you've absolutely tanked its resale value.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

Durvelle27 said:


> 250W claimed TDP with 8 heatpipes that aren't very efficient. This isn't a good debate as by no means is this cooler high performance. High price yes but performance not so much. There are many better options widely available. At the price point many AIOs are available that look just as good, are quieter, and would perform much better



It's considered a high-performance cooler based on the TDP.

Oh I see, cooling a CPU capable of 250 watts doesn't qualify as "high-performance"? LOL


----------



## eidairaman1 (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Again, ignorance abounds with you, you just can't shake it, can you?



No point in arguing just put em on ignore


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> *Again, do your research before you post again in ignorance. *
> 
> Only difference you will see between the two is theoretical or in benchmarks... absolutely no difference in real-world performance.
> 
> I hope you got a good deal on your overpriced 8700K. However, now that you've delidded it, you've absolutely tanked its resale value.


You heard it here folks. Threads are only good for "theoretical" performance, there's absolutely no difference in "real-world" performance.

Remember kids, i7's are overpriced, but $200 16GB ram kits aren't, and the $120 "high performance" cooler is good value.


----------



## Durvelle27 (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> It's considered a high-performance cooler based on the TDP.
> 
> Oh I see, cooling a CPU capable of 250 watts doesn't qualify as "high-performance"? LOL


The Cryoig H7 is rated at 140W TDP and out performs your cooler which is rated 250W TDP

Do you not realize TDP numbers mean nothing if the cooler isn't designed to dissipate that heat properly.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

It's pointless, like I said earlier, reasoned advice with this guy is beating a dead horse. He's past that point.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> But OP has made it clear he doesn't care about performance



I just wanted to bring this to the attention of all members here again. This is the kind of flawed logic we are dealing with from this fellow. 

And when I proved him wrong on that point, he changed the goalposts. 

This is what you call being intellectually dishonest.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Again, ignorance abounds with you, you just can't shake it, can you?




Yo, @storm-chaser  just so its 100% clear this is what he is saying

This is what you're buying





						System Builder
					






					pcpartpicker.com
				




This is what you could have gotten for less money





						System Builder
					






					pcpartpicker.com
				




There's really no scenario I can think of that a 9700k isn't better.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

Big numbers on the box = good relative performance apparently.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

Durvelle27 said:


> The Cryoig H7 is rated at 140W TDP and out performs your cooler which is rated 250W TDP
> 
> Do you not realize TDP numbers mean nothing if the cooler isn't designed to dissipate that heat properly.



Do you think I should go back to the stock cooler? Since this isn't a high-performance cooler, it obviously won't cool my high-performance Core I5


----------



## EarthDog (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Do you or do you not consider a cooler with 8 heat pipes rated at 250W TDP "high performance"?


On paper, an air cooler capable of managing 250W of heat is impressive and high performance. However, review*S* show that it really doesn't do that well at all (and not even under 250W loads). For instance, all reviews show the D-15 mentioned earlier performing a lot better (a few/several C), yet it, with dual towers and six heatpipes is rated at 220W. It loses out to others rated to remove a lot less heat. Again, you have to know how these are rated at what delta, or look at reviews to see how they really work. It's a neat cooler, but it will be a crapshoot if it can cool your chip at 5 GHz (talking keeping it at/under 90C during stress testing). It will do well enough outside of there and allow some overclocking surely... it will likely fall short of your goal is all (and terribly overpriced).


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Yo, @storm-chaser  just so its 100% clear this is what he is saying
> 
> This is what you're buying
> 
> ...


I guess that's two of you posting in ignorance now, is this what I can expect from you going forward?

Did I at any point in time, state this build was purely economical? LOL


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Do you think I should go back to the stock cooler? Since this isn't a high-performance cooler, it obviously won't cool my high-performance Core I5


Remember guys, the only two options here are the Intel stock cooler and a $120 "250w" MSI piece of junk. There's literally nothing else on the market.


----------



## eidairaman1 (Feb 13, 2020)

Its a Project build, let it be.

Hey @storm-chaser check this out, this will give you an average idea on cooler performance.









						Corsair A500 Dual Fan CPU Cooler Review
					

Corsair's A500 dual-fan CPU cooler is a monster in terms of size, with an appealing design and features that set it apart. We found installation to be remarkably easy as well, but performance could be better. The review also goes into detail about why we had to file down the heat pipes on the A500.




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> There's really no scenario I can think of that a 9700k isn't better.





dgianstefani said:


> Remember guys, the only two options here are the Intel stock cooler and a $120 "250w" MSI piece of junk. There's literally nothing else on the market.



You both need a reality check. Here you go.



> The hex-core i5-9600K is third in Intel’s line-up of 9th generation Coffee Lake CPUs. It has a TDP of 95W and requires an aftermarket cooler (such as the $20 GAMMAXX 400). The 9600K was designed to be overclocked. Once this is enabled in the BIOS (requires a Z-series motherbaord), the 9600K runs 10% faster. In terms of performance, the i5-9600K is almost unbeatable for desktop users and it has sufficient multi-core performance to handle all but the most demanding workstation tasks. For multimedia producers the Ryzen 3000 series offers great 64-core performance at a very competitive price. For example the overclocked Ryzen 3600 is approximately 13% worse for gaming, desktop and normal consumer workloads but it is 27% faster for 64-core processing. At stock clocks the i5-9600K is around 8% slower than Intel’s flagship i9-9900K but when both are overclocked, the 9600K closes the gaming gap to within two or three percent. *Considering that the 9900K is the fastest gaming processor available, and almost twice the price of the 9600K, this is no small feat. The i5-9600K is aimed squarely at gamers who are not willing to compromise on performance but don't want to pay more than they need to. *



Your welcome.


----------



## dgianstefani (Feb 13, 2020)

It's fine to have a project build, as long as you don't try to justify it as having good part choices.

Gaming - 6c6t, 2020, pick one.

What do you mean? The build clearly has great aesthetics!


----------



## ERazer (Feb 13, 2020)

I came for pc pron pics came out disappointed


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> You guys are going to love this...
> 
> Depending on my results with the first CPU, perhaps I will go ahead and buy like 5 more in hopes of finding a unicorn.
> 
> ...


why would you do that when you can buy binned ?


----------



## Durvelle27 (Feb 13, 2020)

This is all i will say and than I'm done

The rig itself is fine but the cooling options should have been better looked into especially the case which is going to be a huge cooling factor


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

Durvelle27 said:


> This is all i will say and than I'm done
> 
> The rig itself is fine but the cooling options should have been better looked into especially the case which is going to be a huge cooling factor


furthermore,why would you put together a rig like that and build it inside an eyersore.

get a lancool 2 dude.for 90 dollars this case is exceptional.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> why would you do that when you can buy binned ?



No 9600ks processors are listed at siliconlottery.com


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> No 9600ks processors are listed at siliconlottery.com


well it's not a bad idea to buy a cpu used,many ppl list their overclocks.it's not a 100% legit,but chances are good.

I don't think I ever bought a cpu new.

celeron 400mhz
duron 700mhz
athlon 900mhz
athlon xp 1800+
core 2 e6320
core 2 quad q6600
i5 2500k - this one was new
i5 3570k
i7 4790k
i7 5775c


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> It's fine to have a project build, as long as you don't try to justify it as having good part choices.



The parts are actually very good choices for my usage scenario. *How many times are we going to have to go over this before you get it through your skull?
*


cucker tarlson said:


> well it's not a bad idea to buy a cpu used,many ppl list their overclocks.it's not a 100% legit,but chances are good.


Good call. Depending on how well my new 9600kf performs, I might as well keep an eye out for deals on eBay, but for the time being not much in the way of used 9600k on there at the moment.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

g 





cucker tarlson said:


> furthermore,why would you put together a rig like that and build it inside an eyersore.
> 
> get a lancool 2 dude.for 90 dollars this case is exceptional.



In case you didn't know, the case (It's a coolermaster Sileo 500) has sound-absorbing panels, keeping it pretty quiet for the most part. So it's a good call for my specifications. 

I had plenty of money to spend on a new case, but to be honest, I prefer the business look over gaming systems. Nowadays, most gaming cases seem bloated, overweight or from an alien planet with 20 lb of glass hanging on each side. Another reason I avoided one of the bigger 140mm air coolers is because of the height. Has to fit under the hood, obviously. 

*Definitely getting my money's worth out of the case and PSU.*


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

all 960


storm-chaser said:


> The parts are actually very good choices for my usage scenario. *How many times are we going to have to go over this before you get it through your skull?*
> 
> 
> Good call. Depending on how well my new 9600kf performs, I might as well keep an eye out for deals on eBay, but for the time being not much in the way of used 9600k on there at the moment.


all 9600k's should hit 5ghz,it's a matter of voltage they need.
the cooler will do fine,it's just gonna be loud since you'll need the fans to run near max to cool the cpu
I don't think the cooler is really that nice looking,you can buy a better and prettier one for sure,but it goes with the card nicely.


----------



## moproblems99 (Feb 13, 2020)

Seriously guys, no matter how reasonable and/or logical your suggestions are, it is very clear OP has made his choice.  Whether the choices are good - aesthetics in a closed case - or $120 coolers that get outperformed by $60 coolers, or ram that could have been bought cheaper, or Ssds that could have been bought with twice the capacity for same performance, no suggestion is going to be taken in good faith anymore.

I would suggest to just move along and not contribute to the toxicity.  The performance of this PC will not affect you from your house.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> g
> 
> In case you didn't know, the case (It's a coolermaster Sileo 500) has sound-absorbing panels, keeping it pretty quiet for the most part. So it's a good call for my specifications.
> 
> ...


a quiet case is one that has enouigh airflow for the components not to ramp up the fan speed.
a case that has dampening material but builds up heat is not quiet.


----------



## bogmali (Feb 13, 2020)

At this point OP you're replying and arguing to peeps that don't understand that its your build and your money. I suggest put them on ignore otherwise I will close it before it becomes an eyesore.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> well it's not a bad idea to buy a cpu used,many ppl list their overclocks.it's not a 100% legit,but chances are good.
> 
> I don't think I ever bought a cpu new.
> 
> ...



I've owned well over 30+ CPUs and yes I'm in the same boat - I nearly always buy used. 

The only 4 CPU's I've purchased new:

AMD K6-3 450Mhz with 3D now!
AMD Athlon XP 3000+ 2.1Ghz (Barton Core, 2.1Ghz, early 400Mhz FSB variant)
AMD Phenom II 970 (Zosma Core) unlocked to X6 Thuban
Intel i5 - 9600kf (current project)

Matter of fact, I bought this used i7 CPU this morning for my Lenovo laptop restoration, a T510 Thinkpad. 



			http://www.cpu-world.com/CPUs/Core_i7/Intel-Core%20i7%20Mobile%20I7-640M%20CP80617004152AE.html
		


Sure it's no quad-core system, but it will turbo up to approximately 3.5Ghz. 

And you know me, I'm all about that per-core performance


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

bogmali said:


> At this point OP you're replying and arguing to peeps that don't understand that its your build and your money. I suggest put them on ignore otherwise I will close it before it becomes an eyesore.



Okay, it's all business from here on out. I would appreciate if everyone can take this lead. The parts have already been purchased and *it will be built to my specifications. *


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> And you know me, I'm all about that per-core performance


for a home/gaming rig,it's what you're gonna feel more than having SMT when you already have a six core.

post pics and oc results soon

and 1% bf5 results so that haters can keep on hating.

btw you've got an rx580 in there,that cpu is way overkill anyway.

@bogmali why aren't double posts merged anymore ? it was such a useful feature.


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> all 960
> 
> all 9600k's should hit 5ghz,it's a matter of voltage they need.
> the cooler will do fine,it's just gonna be loud since you'll need the fans to run near max to cool the cpu
> I don't think the cooler is really that nice looking,you can buy a better and prettier one for sure,but it goes with the card nicely.



Not arguing here, just providing relevant information for tarlson:

Yeah, I prefer the look of the Core Frozr XL to most of the other air coolers on the market, and since I already had a MSI video card and MSI motherboard, I wanted to follow suit with the CPU cooler - it's a little bit like building numbers matching vehicle. Fair enough?



cucker tarlson said:


> btw you've got an rx580 in there,that cpu is way overkill anyway



Yeah, as I said the video card was free. So I'm using it. It's not like I game all the time, either. It does, however, have 8GB ram so it's by no means a slouch.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

how did you even fit that s36 inside that case ?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> post pics and oc results soon



I will have updates for you by the end of the day, or at the latest, tomorrow evening.



cucker tarlson said:


> how did you even fit that s36 inside that case ?



Took out the hard drive trays and framed up a little mounting bracket for it, fits with millimeters to spare. lol


----------



## 95Viper (Feb 13, 2020)

Please, stop double posting.
If not, your posting rights may be remove in the thread... and, any other threads where you do this.
Use the *EDIT *button and add to you last post, instead of adding another post to thread, if they would be in sequence.

Thank You and Have a good day.


----------



## cucker tarlson (Feb 13, 2020)

95Viper said:


> Please, stop double posting.
> If not, you posting rights may be remove in the thread... and, any other threads where you do this.
> Use the *EDIT *button and add to you last post, instead of adding another post to thread, if they would be in sequence.
> 
> Thank You and Have a good day.


don't those get merged ?


----------



## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

95Viper said:


> Please, stop double posting.
> If not, you posting rights may be remove in the thread... and, any other threads where you do this.
> Use the *EDIT *button and add to you last post, instead of adding another post to thread, if they would be in sequence.
> 
> Thank You and Have a good day.



I was under the impression the forum did this automatically. Please forgive me.


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## 95Viper (Feb 13, 2020)

cucker tarlson said:


> don't those get merged ?





storm-chaser said:


> I was under the impression the forum did this automatically. Please forgive me.



Yep, was; however, It is being worked on, until then you can see when it is not working and merge them yourselves, remember like you use to.

Back on topic now, please.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 13, 2020)

*Preview / teaser - I am now in possession of a few boxes from newegg *

It's not the complete system, however, I will un box everything and post additional pictures of the individual parts later on this evening when I have time.

Before everyone jumps on me, yes I know,* my camera phone sucks.* I have an 8" tablet on the way which should arrive tomorrow *so we will get high-quality pics going forward for this build. *

This computer upgrade has been a long time coming. *I'm chomping at the bit to get started here! Pun intended!  *


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

*If you have a slow internet connection this might not be the thread for you. I cut them down about half size, but I'm going to be posting lots more as I document every step. Alternatively, you can bookmark my imageBB album here, all pictures from this build will be uploaded here.*









						Storm-Chaser Core i5-9600KF 5.0Ghz Build
					

Dedicated to my most recent build




					ibb.co
				




**Let me know if you have trouble accessing the gallery above.

The MSI Core Frozr XL 120mm CPU Cooler*, 23" Acer gaming monitor, Logitech Sound System,16GB of G.Skill 4000Mhz RAM and 512GB Samsung Evo Pro 970 arrived today. Just waiting on the 10ft HDMI cable before I can get my dual screens up and running. I chose Acer as it was on sale on Newegg and my existing monitor is also a 23" Acer with the same resolution (1920 x 1080). I've been impressed with that so hopefully, the new one will not disappoint. I'm a bit OCD about size and resolution of my secondary monitor.

The CPU Cooler is about the size of a large head of lettuce and is HEAVY! This thing is a beast! Take a look at sick those heat pipes. I'm really glad I went with the Core Frozr XL, it's going to complement the rest of my system perfectly. Can't wait to see the finished look!
































Acer 23" Gaming monitor:







Logitech sound system and new monitor in place




Old Phenom II rig that will be dismantled to make room for the i5-9600KF (served me very well)




Front view of the case we will be using for this build.




Memory




Glad I chose the G.Skill kit as the color scheme matches the video card and CPU cooler, should compliment the rest of the system very well!




Logitech Sound System:




Samsung 970 Pro 512GB:







More updates to follow tomorrow.


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## Kissamies (Feb 14, 2020)

ppn said:


> You should be able to get 10600KF and Z470 soon and 11600K next year with +40% better IPC. The move to 9600KF makes no sense. It is like pentium4 compared to core2duo.


Better IPC? Isn't it just Skylake 6.0 with even MOAR cores, clocks and 14nm+++++++++++++++++++++++++?


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> Seriously guys, no matter how reasonable and/or logical your suggestions are, it is very clear OP has made his choice.  Whether the choices are good - aesthetics in a closed case ...


I'm obviously not going to overclock with the case closed. 

And knowing me I will probably have the case open most of the time anyway because I never stop tweaking and tuning. I wanted a "numbers matching" PC can you blame me? lol

Some of my inspiration in choosing the Cooler Master Core Frozr XL with all those heat pipes came from the engine out of the Taurus SHO. (I'm getting one pretty soon, by the way, II generation 1992-1995 model years). The engine generated 220HP and made about 76HP/liter, and in 1989 when it came out it was one of the quickest sedans around... total sleeper

Check out this sick intake manifold...


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> I'm obviously not going to overclock with the case closed.
> 
> And knowing me I will probably have the case open most of the time anyway because I never stop tweaking and tuning. I wanted a "numbers matching" PC can you blame me? lol



Honestly, yes.

Since we have the continuation of shitty car analogies (car analogies are ok, these just suck), I am looking at picking up Bel Air.  Yay, I found one!  But shoot, it has the straight six.  Doesn't really make much sense to leave it "numbers matching" when it is going to be a big, slow, pile of turd - does it?  Or does it make sense to actually break this silly notion of "numbers matching" and implement a change that has tangible performance difference?

Now, your case is a little different in that your "matching numbers" shenanigans is actually detrimental to your own cause and may cause you to miss your goal of 5ghz.  On top of that, it could even start to rain on your parade of maximum single core goodness. And to top all that shittyness, it even cost you _more_ money to get _less_ cooling performance.  And one more thing, the whole reason you kept this case was because you liked the business look (and the sound deadening) but now you aren't even going to have the side on.  I am not exactly sure what the business look is but it surely isn't a bunch of unsleeved wires in a rats nest.  There are plenty of cases that have clean lines, no bling, and a reserved, windowed side panel to show off those aesthetics.

Now, if it were me (which it has been made abundantly clear it is not), I would have bought a better performing cooler for less money and then colorized it to fit my "theme".  Now you can have "numbers matching", better cooling performance, less noise, and have a better shot of hitting your other goals that you said are a priority over everything else.

Edited for spelling mistakes.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> Honestly, yes.
> 
> Since we have the continuation of shitty car analogies (car analogies are ok, these just suck), I am looking at picking up Bel Air.  Yay, I found one!  But shoot, it has the straight six.  Doesn't really make much sense to leave it "numbers matching" when it is going to be a big, slow, pile of turd - does it?  Or does it make sense to actually break this silly notion of "numbers matching" and implement a change that has tangible performance difference?
> 
> ...



Are you finished acting like a petulant child?


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

sigh...really?  You asked me a question and I answered it.  I thought it was pretty constructive, lacked insults, and solved problems you are likely to encounter.  If you don't want honest answers to questions *YOU* asked, don't quote my post and ask a question.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> Since we have the continuation of shitty car analogies (car analogies are ok, these just suck),



Here is another car analogy for you. Suppose you have a stretch limo and same car next to it as just a stock 4 door sedan, otherwise, all other things are equal: they have the same engine and transmission.

Sure, you can pile more people into the stretch limo, but it's not going to be any faster getting you to the destination... Get my drift?


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Here is another car analogy for you. Suppose you have a stretch limo and same car next to it as just a stock 4 door sedan, otherwise, all other things are equal: they have the same engine and transmission.
> 
> Sure, you can pile more people onto the stretch limo, but it's not going to be any faster getting you to the destination... Get my drift?



I made no comment about cores.  And technically, the four door sedan _could_ get there faster.  It weighs a lot less.  So, it _could_ get there faster and with better fuel economy.

Edit: LOL, I just saw your previous edit.  It all makes sense now.

Edit 2: I think I see where you may have thought I was referring to cores.  The inline six comment was not directed at cores.  It was directed at the "matching numbers".


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## ppn (Feb 14, 2020)

I hope new case is completely black on the inside.


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

ppn said:


> I hope new case is completely black on the inside.



What new case?


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> I made no comment about cores.  And technically, the four door sedan _could_ get there faster.  It weighs a lot less.  So, it _could_ get there faster and with better fuel economy.
> 
> Edit: LOL, I just saw your previous edit.  It all makes sense now.



Doesn't it become clear after you give it a little thought? That I paid $200 for a CPU that can match an overpriced 9900K up to 4-5 cores.  

Pretty damn good choice if I don't say so myself.


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## ppn (Feb 14, 2020)

You could at least use the angle grinder on those drive bays. Open some space for cleaner look.


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Doesn't it become clear after you give it a little thought? That I paid $200 for a CPU that can match an overpriced 9900K up to 4-5 cores.
> 
> Pretty damn good choice if I don't say so myself.



????

The post had absolutely nothing to do with your choice of CPU.  I don't think I have ever commented about your choice of CPU.  It was 100% about your choices as they relate to your goals.  Also, a Ford Taurus should be inspiration for nothing but things not to do.  Which is perfectly fitting to the situation here.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> Since we have the continuation of shitty car analogies (car analogies are ok, these just suck), I am looking at picking up Bel Air. Yay, I found one! But shoot, it has the straight six. Doesn't really make much sense to leave it "numbers matching" when it is going to be a big, slow, pile of turd - does it? Or does it make sense to actually break this silly notion of "numbers matching" and implement a change that has tangible performance difference?



Sure, plenty of people do numbers matching cars without the biggest V8. It's not like the only people that are doing restorations are V8 owners

Okay, gotcha. That's all well and good, but the 9600kf is not a "big, slow pile of turd" -
Your naive thinking indicates you bought into the core count hype that has been taking over the overclocking community by storm.
because the reality is that in the real world if you call the 9600k a turd you must also call the 9900kk a turd because they are basically the same processor up to 5-6 cores. Remember, core count does not magically improve your per-core performance. Sure, the 9900k can do more work, but its essentially moving at the same pace as a 9600kf until you tap into those two additional cores. Which most people never do, by the way.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> ????
> 
> The post had absolutely nothing to do with your choice of CPU.  I don't think I have ever commented about your choice of CPU.  It was 100% about your choices as they relate to your goals.  Also, a Ford Taurus should be inspiration for nothing but things not to do.  Which is perfectly fitting to the situation here.



Oh the irony. 

Don't know much about the Taurus SHO I see. Don't worry, the vast majority of people, even some car enthusiasts, are with you on that. 

The SHO stands for 
Super 
High 
Output.

I'll let you do the math from here.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

ppn said:


> You could at least use the angle grinder on those drive bays. Open some space for cleaner look.



Thank you for such a brilliant contribution to the thread. I am forever in your debt.


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Oh the irony.
> 
> Don't know much about the Taurus SHO I see. Don't worry, the vast majority of people, even some car enthusiasts, are with you on that.
> 
> ...



Lol 220hp.  Super high output.  It was a piece of shit Taurus.  Always was, always will be.  But it does put a lot of things in context.  I suppose if you put a turbo on a Civic you have a race car.  For the record, I'm a master certified tech.



storm-chaser said:


> Okay, gotcha. That's all well and good, but the 9600kf is not a "big, slow pile of turd" -



Do you understand English when you read? Or do you not read?  I made no mention of your CPU choice.  I repeat, I made no reference to your CPU choice.

I REPEAT, I MADE NO REFERENCE TO YOUR CPU CHOICE.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> Lol 220hp.  Super high output.  It was a piece of shit Taurus.  Always was, always will be.  But it does put a lot of things in context.



You just don't know when to stop, do you? And it's now VERY ironic, not just a little bit.


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> You just don't know when to stop, do you? And it's now VERY ironic, not just a little bit.



I take it you never owned one?


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> I take it you never owned one?



That's where you'd be wrong. I've owned about 25 Taurus SHOs since obtaining my driver's license in 2004.

Edit: I used to fix them up and sell them for a profit out of my garage. Discounts for the family, of course.

I am very well briefed on this particular automobile. I've basically gone through every system on the car multiple times.

I used to drag race in Canada and I've even gone to the SHO convention a couple of times (we meet once a year as owners.)

But anyway lets stay on track here... thanks


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> That's where you'd be wrong. I've owned about 25 Taurus SHOs since obtaining my driver's license in 2004.




You beat me by 24.  But I generally don't make the same mistake twice.  There is a saying about that.  In any case, apparently you may have gotten 25 of the only operable ones.  Maybe you have a knack of getting the "good ones".  Maybe you'll luck out with your cooler in the same way.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> You beat me by 24.  But I generally don't make the same mistake twice.  There is a saying about that.  In any case, apparently you may have gotten 25 of the only operable ones.  Maybe you have a knack of getting the "good ones".  Maybe you'll luck out with your cooler in the same way.



I'm calling BS... lol @ that bluff of yours. You are like a chicken that puffs up his feathers to appear larger than he really is. 

Is that really what you want to be seen as? Think long and hard before you post again in ignorance.


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> I'm calling BS... lol @ that bluff of yours. You are like a chicken that puffs up his feathers to appear larger than he really is.
> 
> Is that really what you want to be seen as? Think long and hard before you post again in ignorance.




Technically, you are right.  I didn't own it but I was the primary operator.  Parents owned it.  I made other terrible decisions like a Dodge Daytona with a digital dash.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> Technically, you are right.  I didn't own it but I was the primary operator.  Parents owned it.  I made other terrible decisions like a Dodge Daytona with a digital dash.



That's unfortunate. My decisions are just bad, but yours? TERRIBLE!

So as an owner you would know what happens at 4,000 rpm, right?

And of course, you would know what the major flaw is with the 3.4L SHO engine used after 1996, right?


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## Vario (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> That's unfortunate. My decisions are just bad, but yours? TERRIBLE!
> 
> So as an owner you would know what happens at 4,000 rpm, right?
> 
> And of course, you would know what the major flaw is with the 3.4L SHO engine used after 1996, right?


The swaged camshafts right?  Would come free of the sprockets so people weld them or am I thinking of different year.


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## EarthDog (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Logitech sound system and new monitor in place


on your way!

I assume you are going to place the speakers more according to their function... the surrounds in back instead of to the left. You can then spread left and right, centering the center channel. 


Edit: New SHO is intriguing (the old ones,  lol, yikes on some).. 400 horse or so? I'll wait for the Acura TL Type-S though. A bit smaller, more nimble.. not a Ford.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> on your way!
> 
> I assume you are going to place the speakers more according to their function... the surrounds in back instead of to the left. You can then spread left and right, centering the center channel.
> 
> ...



New SHO too heavy for my liking. And I don't like the EcoBoost engine. 

As for the speaker system, it's set up correctly you are just not grasping that for some unknown reason.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

Vario said:


> The swaged camshafts right?  Would come free of the sprockets so people weld them or am I thinking of different year.



Yup you got it. And yes they would weld the cams. Sucks to be an interference engine if your cam timing is off.

@moproblems99

What's the weak point of the 3.2L SHO engine?

You better get busy with those search engines.


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## Vario (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> Yup you got it. And yes they would weld the cams. Sucks to be an interference engine if your cam timing is off.
> 
> @moproblems99
> 
> ...


10 years ago I had a 95 maxima with a 2003 maxima engine on the 95 maxima VQ30 ecu and harness and timing cover, the previously variable cams on the 03 (VQ35) were rotated several degrees relative to the sprocket using a washer with a dowel pin and then re-bolted, the goal being to roughly match the 95 cam position.  When I described this to a friend that had many SHO he told me about the V8 camshaft spinning free.


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## moproblems99 (Feb 14, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> not a Ford



I had a Mazda with 2.3L Ford engine it.  I'll be honest, I didn't do a thing to it in the 8 years I owned it but a thermostat.



storm-chaser said:


> What's the weak point of the 3.2L SHO engine?



That it was allowed to be put into a car and driven on the road?


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> That it was allowed to be put into a car and driven on the road?



LOL Of course, it's just another POS, so what if it has an exotic Yamaha engine with a dual runner intake manifold that makes 76Hp/L... When I was asking you to double check your work before posting again in ignorance, I was just looking out for you, really. But you've done it again!

The Taurus SHO (Super High Output) was the fastest American-built four-door sedan; in fact, in 1989 it was the fastest four-door in American automotive history. And it cost less than $20,000. Can you say power to weight ratio? And then say cost / performance ratio? …. You haven't a clue, apparently... both with the car and the pc build!

Now lets stay on track - going forward... the PC build... I expect the motherboard and CPU will be here tomorrow so we will jump right in at that point.

As I said, I especially like the CPU cooler. I think it's going to look sick once we get everything in place.


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## EarthDog (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> As for the speaker system, it's set up correctly you are just not grasping that for some unknown reason.


No need to respond like that...

It looked like you have the rears to your left...


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> No need to respond like that...
> 
> It looked like you have the rears to your left...



No problem.. I could see where you could think that but both cords are long so it's hard to tell from that photo. Lets just stay focused on the build itself not the peripherals.

I should have first overclock results for you guys tomorrow evening.


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## EarthDog (Feb 14, 2020)

Just trying to help (one would think audio setup of the PC is all a part of it...). I'll drop it, but details as to where I am coming from... it seems like a 5.1 system with the two surround speakers sitting to the _left_ of the sitting position when they should be behind you for surround effects. Maybe it's an optical illusion those are positioned properly, behind sitting position. 

Anyway, can't wait to see what the silicon lottery gives you.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Just trying to help (one would think audio setup of the PC is all a part of it...). I'll drop it, but details as to where I am coming from... it seems like a 5.1 system with the two surround speakers sitting to the _left_ of the sitting position when they should be behind you for surround effects. Maybe it's an optical illusion those are positioned properly, behind sitting position.
> 
> Anyway, can't wait to see what the silicon lottery gives you.



lol earthdog, Do you want to come over and do my interior decorating for me as well?

*Now lets get down to business. *

What should I be aiming for in terms of a core voltage target as we approach 5.0Ghz... I assume this will scale similarly to a 9900k in terms of voltage? Where should my temps be and what is TJmax with this CPU?

Any tips or tricks for this platform? I've never overclocked a z390 system, last intel platform I worked with was Sandy bridge.

In terms of memory OCing, should I start with the XMP profile first, and just focus on getting the CPU dialed to start?


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## Kissamies (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> what is TJmax with this CPU?


100C


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## biffzinker (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> In terms of memory OCing, should I start with the XMP profile first, and just focus on getting the CPU dialed to start?


I would leave the DDR4 at the default/safe profile, and proceed with overclocking the CPU cores. That way it leaves out a potential variable that may influence the overclock.


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## storm-chaser (Feb 14, 2020)

Dismantled and gutted the Phenom II rig. The case is ready to be built back up from here...

Prepping windows 10 installation now...

Arctic Silver 5 or the "premium" thermal paste included with the Frozr XL 120? Guess there's only one way to find out...

The fans on this cooler are adjustable depending on RAM height. If I want to swap them out for something a little quieter, I can always do that too. Aesthetics *and* performance - don't settle for anything less.


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## cucker tarlson (Feb 14, 2020)

Using xtu for finding out what voltage you need is the fastest way.
Set it to 5ghz and start at 1.35 or 1.37v then go down as far as you can.


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## EarthDog (Feb 14, 2020)

storm-chaser said:


> lol earthdog, Do you want to come over and do my interior decorating for me as well?





storm-chaser said:


> Aesthetics *and* performance - don't settle for anything less.


Is this trickson's burner account at tpu? 

Anyway...as cuckold said, start at 5ghz 1.35v and see if it is stable. Work your way down. TJmax is 100c, but as mentioned earlier, keep it at 90c or less during stress testing (can get unstable above that and leaves headroom). That cooler likely wont be able to run some stress tests at that high of voltage (depends on stress test though). As always, overclock one thing at a time. Start with the cpu (flash bios to the latest first) and leave the memory on auto/jedec so it doesnt interfere with anything.

Once you find a stable cpu speed, try to enable xmp and see if those pricey 4k sticks will boot. If not, the first thing I would do is add 0.1V System Agent voltage and see if that helps stabilize it.


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## Chomiq (Feb 14, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Is this trickson's burner account at tpu?
> 
> Anyway...as cuckold said, start at 5ghz 1.35v and see if it is stable. Work your way down. TJmax is 100c, but as mentioned earlier, keep it at 90c or less during stress testing (can get unstable above that and leaves headroom). That cooler likely wont be able to run some stress tests at that high of voltage (depends on stress test though). As always, overclock one thing at a time. Start with the cpu (flash bios to the latest first) and leave the memory on auto/jedec so it doesnt interfere with anything.
> 
> Once you find a stable cpu speed, try to enable xmp and see if those pricey 4k sticks will boot. If not, the first thing I would do is add 0.1V System Agent voltage and see if that helps stabilize it.


Cuckold, lol. See @cucker tarlson you've got new nickname. Just in time for valentines.


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## sneekypeet (Feb 14, 2020)

After this last page, shop closed!


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