# AMD Radeon HD 6850 CrossFire



## W1zzard (Oct 21, 2010)

AMD's new Radeon HD 6850 is priced at an extremely affordable $179. This poses the question whether two cards in CrossFire can manage to claim the price/performance sweet spot in the $360 segment or if other alternatives are better.

*Show full review*


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## bear jesus (Oct 22, 2010)

Just finished all 5 of the TPU reviews, all of them are great as always and i have to say i am very impressed with the 6850 and 6870 alone but both of them in crossfire really supprised me.
Under water and overclocked/volted either cards would make for an amazing setup.


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## Coffeinfreak (Oct 22, 2010)

Power consumption?


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## Yellow&Nerdy? (Oct 22, 2010)

Pretty good scaling on these cards, especially if we take into notice, that these are the first drivers. As they release more mature drivers, the scaling will probably even be slightly better. Too bad they don't support 3- or 4-way Crossfire.


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## Disparia (Oct 22, 2010)

Very nice. Price, performance, 1 x 6-pin - could drop in two 6850's and use my current PSU without adapters.

Unfortunately for AMD I'm still too pissed about the new naming to buy anything right now. Perhaps they should take a cue from a company we used to know - ATI!


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## Hayder_Master (Oct 23, 2010)

seems good deal, great work w1z


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## Melvis (Oct 23, 2010)

Awesome review, this just puts alot of pressure on the current GTX460 in SLi, going by the results the 6850 in crossfire out performs the GTX460 in SLi in most of the games tested and at about the same price point here in AUS.

Just a shame they call it a 6850.


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## Kariddi (Oct 24, 2010)

It seems like the final Crossfire scaling value is wrong.

(The one in this picture)







In almost every tested game there is an FPS increase that is almost double than the single card excluded some cases (call of juarez, WOW and supreme commander 2). 

Excluding Call of Juarez (that is bugged in the drivers) the average increase should be more than 80 % instead of 59% (@fullhd resolution), including Call of Juarez it should be 78-79%.

The graphs should be corrected.

Cheers


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Kariddi said:


> It seems like the final Crossfire scaling value is wrong.
> 
> (The one in this picture)
> 
> ...



I thought some of the numbers were a bit low but i assumed i may have been missing something and i was too lazy to do the math myself


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

Kariddi said:


> It seems like the final Crossfire scaling value is wrong.
> 
> (The one in this picture)
> 
> ...



Yes, that's true.

Techpowerup guys made the same mistake also in the gtx 460 sli review (and I think in other xfire/SLI review).

Here the right values for a 6850 crossfire config:
*
Scaling @ 1920x1200 Games:
*

1) Alien Vs Predator : Image

*+96,9% !*

2) Bad Company 2 : Image

*+100,07% !*

3)BattleForge : Image

*+97,8% !*


4)Call of Duty 4 : Image

*+87,1% !*

5)Call of Juarez 2 : Image

*-0,9%% !(relevant driver issue)*

6)Crysis: Image

*+96,8%% !*

7)Dawn of war 2 : Image

*+91,2% !*

8)Dirt 2 : Image

*+85% !*

9)Far cry 2 : Image

*+100% !*

10) HAWX : Image

*+95% !*

11) Metro 2033 : Image

*+90% !*

12) Riddick : Image

*+90% !*

13) Stalker :Image

*+97% !*

14)Supreme Commander 2 :Image

*+25% !*

15) UT3 : Image

*+76% !*

16) WoW : Image

*+34% !*

*
Scaling @ 1920x1200 Bench:
*

1) Unigine Heaven 2 : Image

*+98,3% !*

2) 3DMark03 : Image

*+91% !*

3) 3DMark05 : Image

*+30% !*

4) 3DMark 06 : Image

*+36% !*

*So, Scaling boost with Games (no Bench) @ 1920x1200 in crossfire 2 x 6850 config, (excluding call of juarez 2 for relevant driver issue) is +84,12%!*

*Scaling Boost including everything: Games,Bench, and also Call of Juarez 2, is: +75,8%*


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## oily_17 (Oct 24, 2010)

For crossfire in WOW, W1zz has already answered the question, see here -

 AMD Radeon HD 6870 CrossFire


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

oily_17 said:


> For crossfire in WOW, W1zz has already answered the question, see here -
> 
> AMD Radeon HD 6870 CrossFire



Tnx, but this is not an answer to the mistake.

The problem it is completely different.

Based on the review's bench, the final "scaling" boost graph is wrong.


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## oily_17 (Oct 24, 2010)

Ahh I see what you mean, but I suppose W1zz had to include all the tests he had run.If he didn't people would complain that he was picking and choosing which results to include.

Maybe these benchmarks could be dropped from future crossfire/SLI reviews.


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> *So, Scaling boost @ 1920x1200 in crossfire 2 x 6850 config, (excluding call of juarez 2 for relevant driver issue) is +84,12%!*
> 
> *Including also Call of juarez 2 it is +78,8%!*



That does sound much better but i'm still to lazy (or stupid ) to do the math myself so i can't be sure, all i know is with the games i play it is around 95 to 100% scaling so i'm very happy


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

oily_17 said:


> Ahh I see what you mean, but I suppose W1zz had to include all the tests he had run.If he didn't people would complain that he was picking and choosing which results to include.
> 
> Maybe these benchmarks could be dropped from future crossfire/SLI reviews.



I've also includeded on the final scaling values ALL the test in the review.
But the final value it is completely different.

No way that it could be 59%.


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

updated with also bench values.


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> updated with also bench values.



If your math on the 1920x1200 numbers is right then does that not mean every one of the crossfire scaling numbers for each res and overall are wrong?
Also would it apply to the 6870 crossfire numbers as well?


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

bear jesus said:


> If your math on the 1920x1200 numbers is right then does *that not mean every one of the crossfire scaling numbers for each res and overall are wrong?*
> Also would it apply to the 6870 crossfire numbers as well?



you're right.

I don't really know what the numbers in the "performance scaling summary" represent:






But they DO NOT represent the performance boost from one single card to 2 crossfire card.
The correct values are the one i've posted before.


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> you're right.
> 
> I don't really know what the numbers in the "performance scaling summary" represent.
> 
> But they DO NOT represent the performance boost from one single card to 2 crossfire card.



This is starting to get confusing  hopefully w1zzard will pop into this thread at some point and let us know a little more.

To be honest though no matter what those numbers at the end of the review mean or are relative to it does not effect me as i have already ordered my 2 6870's and know that at the closest res to what i want to run the few games benchmarked here that i want to play they scale around 95% to 100% and to be honest i would have been really happy with 80%


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

bear jesus said:


> This is starting to get confusing  hopefully w1zzard will pop into this thread at some point and let us know a little more.
> 
> To be honest though no matter what those numbers at the end of the review mean or are relative to it does not effect me as i have already ordered my 2 6870's and know that at the closest res to what i want to run the few games benchmarked here that i want to play they scale around 95% to 100% and to be honest i would have been really happy with 80%



I hope that's not a fault of my bad english that generate confusion 

I'me agree with you: the important values are the single game chart


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> I hope that's not a fault of my bad english that generate confusion
> 
> I'me agree with you: the important values are the single game chart



No definatly not because of your english, it seams pretty much perfect to me.
I have been up all night so i'm probably just confusing myself with numbers as i'm not that great with math  

I was just thinking of the individual games and how they effect me and never thought about how relative that was, you are right about how importaint they are, if i played a lot of call of juarez 2 it would almost instantly stop me buying 2 6870's and make me get just the one


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## Anarchy0110 (Oct 24, 2010)

Would be great if we see some summary and comparison between GTS 450 SLI; GTX 460 SLI and HD6850; HD6870 CrossFire


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Faith[ROG].Anarchy said:


> Would be great if we see some summary and comparison between GTS 450 SLI; GTX 460 SLI and HD6850; HD6870 CrossFire



That would be quite helpful for a lot of people who can't decide between them yet... plus i hope (looks like 6870 crossfire would come out on top but i can't be sure due to lack of sleep ) it would be something else i can use to make my gamer friends even more jelous


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

Faith[ROG].Anarchy said:


> Would be great if we see some summary and comparison between GTS 450 SLI; GTX 460 SLI and HD6850; HD6870 CrossFire



Just for example, in the gtx 460 SLI review, the scaling summary says that for the 1920x1200 resolution, it was 72%, vs the 59% of the 6850 crossfire.

GTX 460 SLI:





6850 Crossfire:






But if you made the math yourself, (of if you just see the game performance), you see that the increase of performance with the 6850 CF @ 1920x1200 is about 90% every game.
*The correct value is the one i've posted before (around 80%) and NOT 59%.
*
So, the scaling performance summary for the 6850 crossfire, is wrong. I've not done the math, as i've done for the 6850, for the 460 SLI. I may assume that it is right for the 460 SLI. But for the 6850 CF it is definitely wrong.


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> Just for example, in the gtx 460 SLI review, the scaling summary says that for the 1920x1200 resolution, it was 72%, vs the 59% of the 6850 crossfire.
> 
> 
> But if you made the math yourself, (of if you just see the game performance), you see that the increase of performance with the 6850 CF @ 1920x1200 is about 90% every game.
> ...



When i was reading through the review and looking at the frame rate increases from one to two cards i was expecting the kind of numbers that are shown on the 460 chart you just linked to.


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

bear jesus said:


> When i was reading through the review and looking at the frame rate increases from one to two cards i was expecting the kind of numbers that are shown on the 460 chart you just linked to.



the real number are much better than the 460 SLI 
if you cut out bench and 2 or 3 games that are not well supported: it will read an AVERAGE 90% of increase


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## Bhairava (Oct 24, 2010)

I'm sure W1zzard, who is respectable and reliable person, and one of the best reviewers we have, will soon explain the reason why he used those numbers.


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## bear jesus (Oct 24, 2010)

Bhairava said:


> I'm sure W1zzard, who is respectable and reliable person, and one of the best reviewers we have, will soon explain the reason why he used those numbers.



I'm sure w1zzard will be able to explain, that's one of the reasons i didn't put the effort into trying to work it out for myself as i'm sure i would have just missed something... plus i hate math  but only as i suck at it 

But right now all i can do is look at and think about the numbers untill my 6870's arrive during the week and then i won't care about the numbers... i will care about my eyefinity and crossfire problems


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 24, 2010)

Bhairava said:


> I'm sure W1zzard, who is respectable and reliable person, and one of the best reviewers we have, will soon explain the reason why he used those numbers.



I'm sure too 
My purposose was only to show a possibile error in the result summary, to let Wizzard correct it


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## pantherx12 (Oct 24, 2010)

Wing zero are the 6870 scaling graphs correct?


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 25, 2010)

pantherx12 said:


> Wing zero are the 6870 scaling graphs correct?



If I had to be honest, I don't like to waste my time to re-do the math also for 6870 crossfire.
Sorry, that will take time.

Otherwise, they are very stupid calcs, I'm sure that you can calculate the average scaling increase by yourself


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## bear jesus (Oct 25, 2010)

pantherx12 said:


> Wing zero are the 6870 scaling graphs correct?



I had mainly been looking at the 6870 numbers and i really think they are off as well, they seam to have as many games that scale between 90% and 100% yet have lower scaling percentage in the end of the rerview than the 6850 does.

I wish w1zzard would come set us straight


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## forces (Oct 26, 2010)

where is power consumption and temperatures? a great review has always power consumption and temperatures, if it doesn't it's just a "review" without "great"...


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## pantherx12 (Oct 26, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> If I had to be honest, I don't like to waste my time to re-do the math also for 6870 crossfire.
> Sorry, that will take time.
> 
> Otherwise, they are very stupid calcs, I'm sure that you can calculate the average scaling increase by yourself




I could, hell I wouldn't even need to do it myself  Computers do things like this for me now XD

Will try.


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 29, 2010)

I've sent a pm to w1zzard 

Waiting for a public answer


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## W1zzard (Oct 29, 2010)

yes, something seems wrong with the calculation but i'm still looking into where the problem is with my script that generates these numbers


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 29, 2010)

W1zzard said:


> yes, something seems wrong with the calculation but i'm still looking into where the problem is with my script that generates these numbers



Tnx for the fast answer! 

I'l try to show you where is the error:

If whe have these values:

*A: is the fps number on single card

B: is the fps number in Crossfire*

The right calc is this:

*Pecentage Scaling performance from A to B is*: *[ (B-A)/A ] * 100
*
In example:

A= 60 fps (single card)

B= 115 fps (Crossfire cards)

Scaling performance is: [ (115-60)/60 ] *100 ---> this is equal to : +91,66%

I think instead that you've done [ (B-A)/B] * 100 (instead of A)


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## HTC (Oct 29, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> Tnx for the fast answer!
> 
> I'l try to show you where is the error:
> 
> ...



Maybe my math skills suck because i divided the biggest number by the smallest one * 100 - 100.

Take a look @ post # 86 of the *6870* crossfire numbers:  AMD Radeon HD 6870 CrossFire

@ the time, i didn't include the 3DMark benches as well as Unigine bench (editing and including them now). Did i forget anything else? Maybe we're missing something in our calculations.


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 29, 2010)

HTC said:


> Maybe my math skills suck because i divided the biggest number by the smallest one * 100 - 100.
> 
> Take a look @ post # 86 of the *6870* crossfire numbers:  AMD Radeon HD 6870 CrossFire
> 
> @ the time, i didn't include the 3DMark benches as well as Unigine bench (editing and including them now). Did i forget anything else? Maybe we're missing something in our calculations.



oh yes, that is the same.
You can also do B/A (where B is the crossfire fps, and A is the single card fps) and then you'll have a number like like "1,XX" where XX is the percentage of increase 

look:

B= 115 fps
A= 60 fps

B/A= 1,91 --> 91% of performance increase (if you had as result 2.00 it means a 100% of performance increase). the you moltiply for 100 = 191 and you cut off 100 --> 91.

It is the same thing i had described in my post  *( B/A *100 ) -100 * IS MATHEMATICALLY THE SAME OF * [(B-A)/A] *100  *. 

Guys, after all that is only a simple operation. I can't believe at all the problems that this simple op created ^^


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 29, 2010)

SO HTC, you've done for the 6870 the same thing i've done for the 6850  Good!

So we can say that the scaling summary for both reviews are wrong :/


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## HTC (Oct 29, 2010)

Wing_Zero said:


> SO HTC, you've done for the 6870 the same thing i've done for the 6850  Good!
> 
> So we can say that the scaling summary for both reviews are wrong :/



Seems so, hehe 

EDIT

Question is: is it wrong for only these reviews?

Assuming the same script was used for other scaling reviews (ATI and nVidia), this means all those reviews are wrong as well, no?


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## Wing_Zero (Oct 29, 2010)

HTC said:


> Seems so, hehe
> 
> EDIT
> 
> ...


...it is strange but for the NVIDIA-side, they are correct.

EDIT: W1zzard, I hope that you'll update it very soon...there many people I know that are having a bad idea of 6850 & 6870 crossfire, simply reading the result summary.


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## pantherx12 (Oct 29, 2010)

Several people including myself have posted correct scaling for 6870 on the crossfire review comments.

HTC
 AMD Radeon HD 6870 CrossFire

Me : no unigine BM or 3dmarks  AMD Radeon HD 6870 CrossFire

Including everything
 AMD Radeon HD 6870 CrossFire




I see that HTC has already said anyway, cool!


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