# The story of the $550 Athlon X2 4200+



## newtekie1 (Jun 3, 2009)

Let me first start out by saying: Nothing is ever free!

Anyway, as some may know, I used to have an Socket 939 system.  This system has by far lasted the longest out of any system I have ever built for myself.  And to this day, I am still happy with its performance.  Obviously it has gone through some upgrades over the years, the processor was upgraded from an Opteron 148 to an X2 4400+ less than 6-months after I built it, and the video card has went from an X800GTO2 to a 7800GTX, to a 7900GT, to dual 7900GTs, to dual 7600GTs(once it was retired as my main machine), to a single HD4670.  However, the entire time I have been pleased with how the basic system(motherboard, CPU, RAM) has been able to keep up with performance demands of even the latest games.

Now, if you have read this far, you are probably wondering what this has to do with an Athlon X2 4200+ and why I paid $550 for it.  Don't worry I'm getting to that.

Well, I've been getting the itch to upgrade the old girl for a while now, any of the hardware junkies out there know this itch...  The problem is that I didn't want to do just another graphics card upgrade, and I've pretty much maxed out what I could do with the A8N32 board.  So I always kind of ignored the itch since I really didn't need to mess with the system.

Then a few weeks ago I helped a friend upgrade his computer that I had built for him a year or two ago.  He had me put in a Phenom II 810(great processor by the way).  And in return for the free hour of labor, he gave me the old X2 4200+!  I immediately thought "This is a perfect beginning to an upgrade for my 939 machine".  And that is where it begins, if I had known this "free" processor would cost me so much(and I should have known) I wouldn't have accepted it.

So my first plan was to buy a lower-end motherboard, throw some value DDR2-800 in it, with an HD4770 and call the machine done.  But in the end, I didn't do any of that.

First I went searching for the motherboard.  My first idea was to use this board, which I had used in some builds in the past and was very pleased with.  But then I decided I didn't want or need a mATX board, and I wanted something that was capable of crossfire, so I could put another HD4770 in later.  So then I looked at this board, but something about not having true x16 slots bugged me.  So finally, I decided to go with this board.  So what was going to be a $85 investment, quickly shot up to a $190 investment.

Then I started looking at RAM.  I was just going to pick up some cheap G.Skill DDR2-800 value RAM, without any heat spreaders or anything for $40.  But then I figured, if I was getting a high-end motherboard, I'd better get some decent RAM.  So I went with 4GB of G.Skill Pi Black RAM.  $40 became $60.

Finally, video cards...crap no HD4770's in stock... Oh, well I buy the other stuff, then wait for an HD4770 to come in.  No luck, they sell out almost instantly when they come in.  So finally I give up and start searching, and this is when my brilliant idea comes in.  The motherboard is black, the RAM is black, I'll look for a black video card. And what do I find?  The black XFX HD4890... And I just have to have it!  So my $100 video card now costs $260.

Top it all of with a Xigmatech heatsink, and I just spent $550.  Why can't I control my addiction, I think I need to seek treatment.  And what does that $550 buy me?  A machine that will probably be held back by the 4200+ it was originally built for.

I'll be posting some pictures of it as I put it together, the HD4890 just arrive at my shop today(and it is a slow day, which is why I'm sitting here writing this to pass time, I don't expect anyone to actually care or read it).  I also hope to get at least some decent clocks on the 4200+ so it won't totally hold back the system until I can at afford to replace it with a Phenom II, I'm looking real hard at the 810 as I really liked the one I installed for the friend.  But I'll have to look at how the 810's overclock first, but that won't happen for a few months anyway(hopefully we see a price cut by then).

Edit:
It is picture time everybody!

The motherboard, CPU, and cooler installed.  The fans, power supply, and DVDRW were there from the previous build.






Hard Drive cage w/ hard drive installed.  This was a pain in the ass, and probably took the longest to do.  Finding a way to mount the hard drive so it wouldn't hit the RAM or Video Card sucked.  I finally just did it like this for the time being, it is actually pretty secure though.  I'll probably go back later and pop a few extra holes in the hard drive cage, so I can attach the drive properly, and not rely entirely on friction to hold the screws in place.  That SATA power connector is just barely clearing the RAM...





Video card fitted, LED, Switch, and USB cables connected and the extra hidden.  Why do they make these cables so long? And why does this case have 2 extra HDD LEDs? I mean it is great for when a RAID card is installed, but no so much for trying to make the cables look neat and tidy.





Finally, everything connected as it should be, and ready to be fired up.  I did the best I could with the cable management, I don't have any zip ties on hand, and didn't want to run out to the store to get some.





Firing it up, overclocking, and installing OS will happen after I get back from vacation in a week or so.  I only was able to put it together today because I started my vacation a day earlier than I had expected.


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## cdawall (Jun 3, 2009)

roflmao thats the best tech story i have ever heard


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## yogurt_21 (Jun 3, 2009)

you know if the whole rig is a black theme a 940 black edition would go oh so nicely with it. and then you can always go for a sff 780g setup for the 4200x2. okay not helping but hey some of us are vicariously addicted lol.


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## MKmods (Jun 3, 2009)

cdawall said:


> roflmao thats the best tech story i have ever heard



LOL, +1 big time (repeated by the millions of us that have done the same thing)


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## kenkickr (Jun 3, 2009)

Thanks for the story..feel for ya man  I cheaper black graphics card alternative I could recommend is the XFX 4850, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150351


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## Nukki (Jun 3, 2009)

Haha, omg. That was so cool. Like.. I even have to get out of lurker mode to post this. FIRST FREAKING POST.. AND ITS IN YOUR TOPIC.. How cool is that?! xO

But, sersiously? That, was an amazing story.


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## Silverel (Jun 3, 2009)

Similar experiences with me as well.  Good to hear someone else actually posting this kind of story, I'm sure there's many more people out there that have done the same and never admitted it.

Sometimes you just get carried away...


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## HELLSPAWNPR (Jun 3, 2009)

there no such thing as a cheap upgrade, it aways goes out of control  the same is for my rig  in my system specs.  i wanted to make a lan  rig with parts i had lying around. i  had a  3200+ amd and a 7900 GS  and a ECS 939 MB  but needed  DDR400 ram, i wanted to buy 4GB of OCZ  plat edition, but they when for 150.00  plus i needed  a HD and CD burner  wich would have been total of  350.00  aprox, but no a freind of mine says hey  you can buy a better am2 CPU and bord for that price and with a little more money you can get DDr2 memory .  100.00 for 5000+ X2, 4GD ADATA  80.00, 100.00 MSI Mobo , 320.00 3870X2 , 45.00 HD, 25.00 dvd,Corsair  PSU 60.00 got it cheap when comp usa closed ,45.00 pc case. and  i didnt use any of the parts i had lying around lol  but im happy with this set up.


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## newtekie1 (Jun 3, 2009)

yogurt_21 said:


> you know if the whole rig is a black theme a 940 black edition would go oh so nicely with it. and then you can always go for a sff 780g setup for the 4200x2. okay not helping but hey some of us are vicariously addicted lol.



Thanks for pointing that out, and you suck!   

I wish they made a Phenom 8XX Black Edition...


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## _jM (Jun 4, 2009)

Hehehe.. Great little story newtekie1 ! I know exactly how you feel bro! Thats pretty much what happened to me with my current machine. I went from spending around $800-$950 and 2  weeks later Im building a $2,700 Machine!!!!! Some days Im kicking myself in the ass for spending that much (or the wife is) and others Im just plain proud of my new baby! Any ways, good luck on your build, we'll be looking forward to the pictures!


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## newtekie1 (Jun 4, 2009)

Yeah, the worst part is this isn't even going to be my main rig when I'm done, actually not even my backup rig.  It is going to be the backup to the backup.  Though when I'm done, it just might become the backup, and my current backup will be the backup to the backup.  Just depends on if the HD4890 can top the SLi 9600GSOs.


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## HELLSPAWNPR (Jun 4, 2009)

lol


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## Munki (Jun 4, 2009)

Great story bro, i've done that as well, its no fun when you tally-up how much you have actually spent, until you are able to put it together and use it. Can't wait for those pictures.


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## newtekie1 (Jun 5, 2009)

Build pictures are up.  Overclocking results will come after I get back from vacation.


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Jun 5, 2009)

If your going away for vacation, stop by and pick me up!

Great tech story too btw. When you get that itch, just give me the money. It will be better invested.


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## newtekie1 (Jun 5, 2009)

Yeah, I'll think about it.


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Jun 5, 2009)

No you wont.


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## Yukikaze (Jun 5, 2009)

How does it remind me of my tricked out Socket 478 story. I won't clutter your thread with the full details, but that wish for a tricked out S478 rig cost me a Raidmax Sagitta, AGP HD3850, 2xOCZ Platinum Extreme Latency DDR1 and a Ninja II for no reason really.

Upgrades/Wishes *always* go out of control...


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## newtekie1 (Jun 5, 2009)

I find that when I set a budget for a project, by the time I finish that project the budget has grown to fill whatever funds I have available, and sometimes more...


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## Yukikaze (Jun 5, 2009)

newtekie1 said:


> I find that when I set a budget for a project, by the time I finish that project the budget has grown to fill whatever funds I have available, and sometimes more...



I don't have it quite that bad. But my wish for a Phenom II x4 940 mATX rig turned into my current i7 920 monster, so I can definitely relate.


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## newtekie1 (Jun 24, 2009)

Quick Update:

I know it has been a while since I last updated this, but there is a good reason...well a reason, I'm not sure how good it is.

I was attempting to custom make a bracket for the Xigmatech to allow me to mount it bolt through style, with the fan vertical, instead of horizontal like it currently is.  Well, I failed, mainly due to my horrible lack of experience working with Acrylic(I'm a wood man!), and lack of proper tools...  I got something that would work, but looks ugly as sin, so I just said screw it.

I then tried to mount the Xigmatech slightly off center, to at least allow the RAM to use the first slot on the motherboard(I've heard rumors that the board overclocks better when using these RAM slots, don't know how true that is).  I managed to do that, but it puts an extreme amount of pressure on the plastic mounting bracket on the motherboard.  I'm hoping it holds.

After doing all that, I did manage to get some overclocking in on the processor.  3.0GHz is a no go, but since it is a Windsor, I can only manage 2.8GHz out of it, and even then I don't think it is totaly stable.  It passed 4 hours of LinPack when I let it go over night, I know because it generated the graphs at the end.  However, the next morning when I go to check on it, the machine has rebooted.  I can bring up the graphs where OCCT saves them, and at the top it says the test finished sucessfully, with temps never going above 56°C, but I think the machine is just rebooting randomly when idle...  This is very odd to me, and going to take some time to figure out.

Hopefully, even though it might be slightly unstable, I can get a few 3DMark runs in this week to see what the HD4890 can do with this weak processor. Man, I can't wait until I have the money for a Phenom II.

Also, the back case fan is starting to go bad.  Luckily, I have another just like it, but with blue LEDs.  I just have to find the time to put it in.


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## KH0UJ (Jul 12, 2009)

LOL same here bro luckily my sister donated me a motherboard but I really liked the experience on modding from software to hardware and its addictive its an itch im just a newbee on this but I can feel it already


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## hat (Jul 12, 2009)

Yep. 939 certianly had longevity to it. If you had a dual core processor and 2GB ram, you were set for a loooooong time. A dual core 939 and 2GB RAM would still be good today. All it would need is a decent dx10 card... something like a GTX260 or GTS250 and it would totally kick ass. Maybe get 4GB of ram and it's golden.


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## newtekie1 (Jul 12, 2009)

Wow, kind of forgot about this thread.

Update:  Well, the processor is only stable at 2.6GHz.  I tried everything to get it stable at 2.8GHz, even pushed the core voltage up to 1.6vReal(which the xigmatech handled, keeping the processor under 65C under load).  It isn't a board or RAM issue, as I can lower the multiplier to 10 and push the FSB up to where it needs to be, but raising the multiplier back up to 11 makes it unstable.

One thing that interested me, and it is probably because I haven't done any serious overclocking on AMDs since my 939 system.  Why does the RAM speed go up when I raise the CPU multiplier.  Do AMDs base the memory frequency on the CPU frequency.  I ask this because I notice in CPU-z that the memory speed is listed as CPU/5.  Does this mean that the RAM is really running at the CPU speed divided by 5, so when I raise the multiplier on the CPU, it also raises the RAM speed?

Not that it totally matters as I've stuck my DDR2-1100 stick in there and I've loosened the timings on the RAM to 5-5-5-15 so the RAM should be good for at least 1100 and the machine goes unstable way before that.

I haven't really been in the mood to run benchmarks since I can't get the CPU to at least 2.8GHz.  But I probably will in the coming week.  I'm thinking maybe picking up a cheap Brisbane on ebay might be something to consider...



hat said:


> Yep. 939 certianly had longevity to it. If you had a dual core processor and 2GB ram, you were set for a loooooong time. A dual core 939 and 2GB RAM would still be good today. All it would need is a decent dx10 card... something like a GTX260 or GTS250 and it would totally kick ass. Maybe get 4GB of ram and it's golden.



Definitely, my 939 x2 4400+, 2GB of RAM, and HD4670 ran great.  I was using it to play GTA:IV and Crysis without issue.


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## A Cheese Danish (Jul 12, 2009)

hat said:


> Yep. 939 certianly had longevity to it. If you had a dual core processor and 2GB ram, you were set for a loooooong time. A dual core 939 and 2GB RAM would still be good today. All it would need is a decent dx10 card... something like a GTX260 or GTS250 and it would totally kick ass. Maybe get 4GB of ram and it's golden.



My 939 rig kicks some pretty good ass if I do say so myself. All I would really need is a new vid card.

One hell of a story Newtekie!


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## hat (Jul 12, 2009)

Yes, AMD processors calculate memory speed based on core frequency (AM2+ processors use a divider _similar_ to Intel's meathod). Based on what speed you set it at you'll get a different divider, however most of the time the memory actually runs *underclocked* because the divider isn't perfect most of the time.  You can predict what divider you will get by dividing whatever memory speed you are running (before DDR) into the core speed. For example, my old Athlon64 x2 5200+ ran at 2600MHz, so to calculate what divider you will get for DDR800 memory, divide 2600 by 400... you get 6.5. Instead of running the memory overclocked at 433MHz (this is found by dividing the whole number on the low end of the spectrum, 6), ir runs it underclocked at 371MHz (taking the whole number on the other end of the spectrum, 7).


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## Mussels (Jul 12, 2009)

hat said:


> Yes, AMD processors calculate memory speed based on core frequency (AM2+ processors use a divider _similar_ to Intel's meathod). Based on what speed you set it at you'll get a different divider, however most of the time the memory actually runs *underclocked* because the divider isn't perfect most of the time.  You can predict what divider you will get by dividing whatever memory speed you are running (before DDR) into the core speed. For example, my old Athlon64 x2 5200+ ran at 2600MHz, so to calculate what divider you will get for DDR800 memory, divide 2600 by 400... you get 6.5. Instead of running the memory overclocked at 433MHz (this is found by dividing the whole number on the low end of the spectrum, 6), ir runs it underclocked at 371MHz (taking the whole number on the other end of the spectrum, 7).



i hated that. dont know why as the performance difference was negligible, but it really pissed me off to find my CPU clocking my ram down (media PC suffers from it)


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## hat (Jul 12, 2009)

It pissed me off because I couldn't get my memory running at 1000. My Athlon64 x2 5200+ slammed into a brick wall at 2.9GHz, and I would need 3GHz to get it running at 1000. If it were an intel machine, I would have nifty FSB : DRAM ratios, and I could get it to 1000 no problem


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## newtekie1 (Jul 12, 2009)

At least with the ASUS board it lets me pick the devider.  When I set the RAM control to manual, I can pick either CPU/5 or CPU/6.  Though I still know the memory isn't the issue.

If I have it set to 255FSB x11 CPU = 2805MHz / 6 = 468MHz RAM = Unstable.
If I have it set to 255FSB x10 CPU = 2550MHz / 5 = 510MHz RAM = Stable.

So the CPU just must not want to go to 2.8GHz, and I can't think of anything else to try to get it there.  I've raised every voltage I could, with no positive result.  I guess the old Windsor 4200+ just doesn't have it in her...


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