# bitcoin now over $6100 and looks set to go higher..



## trog100 (Oct 21, 2017)

other coins seem to be going lower.. maybe there is a big move to bitcoin.. it seems that way..

trog


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## the54thvoid (Oct 21, 2017)

I still don't understand.  Envious I was never involved at the start but then, like all speculation, it's a gamble.
The bubble will burst at some point, it's a matter of when, not if.  Bitcoins value isn't driven by the tech anymore, it's being hauled up by ultra wealthy investment funds.


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## R-T-B (Oct 21, 2017)

the54thvoid said:


> I still don't understand.  Envious I was never involved at the start but then, like all speculation, it's a gamble.
> The bubble will burst at some point, it's a matter of when, not if.  Bitcoins value isn't driven by the tech anymore, it's being hauled up by ultra wealthy investment funds.



I agree but don't count out crypto in general.  I strongly believe that when bitcoin bursts something more useful efficiency wise will take its place, and quickly.

There's also the possibility bitcoin could evolve into that on it's own, avoiding a crash alltogether.


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## micropage7 (Oct 21, 2017)

i always think that its a bubble
but i dunno, lets see


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## Vayra86 (Oct 21, 2017)

R-T-B said:


> I agree but don't count out crypto in general.  I strongly believe that when bitcoin bursts something more useful efficiency wise will take its place, and quickly.
> 
> There's also the possibility bitcoin could evolve into that on it's own, avoiding a crash alltogether.



Crypto and blockchain will be hijacked by existing governments and banks, to ever think it will drive a new world era and redistributes power is a utopian thought. It won't happen

Bottom line, it'll provide us a security much needed in the current day (blockchain) and it'll speed up transactions (crypto) but this whole speculative coin principle is going to go, and with that, a shadow economy is going to meet a pretty painful end too. Good riddance IMO, because it is wasteful, pointless, and does nobody any good. Its money that represents no value at all, except a degree of waste of energy and computing power. Essentially bitcoin and derivatives are the perfect example of boundless greed with side effects similar to the good old gold rush.


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## BarbaricSoul (Oct 21, 2017)

Friend of a friend bought like $400 worth of bitcoins several years ago for some game, and lost interest in the game. He just recently logged back into his bitcoin account, and according to him, that $400 worth of bitcoins is now worth $28 million. From what I'm told, the guy is in the process of verifying his identity, and plans to cash out the coins. I'll keep you guys posted about how it turns out if your interested.


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## R0H1T (Oct 21, 2017)

BarbaricSoul said:


> Friend of a friend bought like $400 worth of bitcoins several years ago of some game, and lost interest in the game. He just recently logged back into his bitcoin account, and according to him, that $400 worth of bitcoins is now worth $*28 million*. From what I'm told, the guy is in the process of verifying his identity, and plans to cash out the coins. I'll keep you guys posted about how it turns out *if your interested*.


Oh wow, let me see if he's my distant cousin, uncle  or anything really


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## jboydgolfer (Oct 21, 2017)

I got into them years ago when a 6950 could earn some value. but lost my wallet password & info...i know there wasnt too much cash on it, but there was like 10 or so BC's back in 2008 or maybe 2010....they must be worth some decent dollars now


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## Space Lynx (Oct 21, 2017)

Vast majority of humans on this planet have no money to invest, there is indeed a heavy market cap, especially since most people work 40 hours a week and live paycheck to paycheck. I am not bullish on cryptocurrency at all, but congrats to the people getting wealthy off of it. I mined Bitcoin in 2012 with a 7990, I stopped before I had finished two coins, just figured it would go nowhere, also there is something very sad that we had to pollute the earth even more to make fake money, lol.  Those mining machines are no joke on wattage in Chinese farming mills. Water wars will start up within 30 years as global warming is increasing faster than anyone predicted, Bitcoin will probably do well overall, but governments are always going to remain king, private property protection, laws for a normal society to function, etc... government is here to stay... Bitcoin is flourishing for now, but when people realize how little protection they have (bitcoin ATM's come to mind)... well might as well rob those people instead of robbing black market credit cards, transfer those funds to monero coin then back out to a new bitcoin wallet, basically criminals will become invincible. I'll stick with fiat currency for now, like it or not, if fiat currency ever bursts none of us will be able to afford to eat and your bitcoin won't buy you any food either, everything will collapse. lol thats why it will never collapse, fiat currency, while flawed, everyone is in debt to everyone else, its just too big to fail.  and if it does fail... well good luck finding food workers willing to work for $8 bucks an hour to ship out your veggies and fruits that will cost $60 an ounce that no one can afford, thats what happens when fiat bursts... hence why it will never burst. we all rely on eachother.  bitcoin is a pyramid scheme, it will only continue to rise as it has buyers, no mining exists anymore. and only the rich can invest. so there is indeed a cap, as that leaves out 90% of the human population.


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## R0H1T (Oct 21, 2017)

lynx29 said:


> Vast majority of humans on this planet have no money to invest, there is indeed a heavy market cap, especially since most people work 40 hours a week and live paycheck to paycheck. I am not bullish on cryptocurrency at all, but congrats to the people getting wealthy off of it. I mined Bitcoin in 2012 with a 7990, I stopped before I had finished two coins, just figured it would go nowhere, also there is something very sad that we had to pollute the earth even more to make fake money, lol.  Those mining machines are no joke on wattage in Chinese farming mills. Water wars will start up within 30 years as global warming is increasing faster than anyone predicted, Bitcoin will probably do well overall, *but governments are always going to remain king*, private property protection, laws for a normal society to function, etc... government is here to stay... Bitcoin is flourishing for now, but when people realize how little protection they have (bitcoin ATM's come to mind)... well might as well rob those people instead of robbing black market credit cards, transfer those funds to monero coin then back out to a new bitcoin wallet, basically criminals will become invincible. I'll stick with fiat currency for now, like it or not, if fiat currency ever bursts none of us will be able to afford to eat and your bitcoin won't buy you any food either, everything will collapse. lol thats why it will never collapse, fiat currency, while flawed, everyone is in debt to everyone else, its just too big to fail.  and if it does fail... well good luck finding food workers willing to work for $8 bucks an hour to ship out your veggies and fruits that will cost $60 an ounce that no one can afford, thats what happens when fiat bursts... hence why it will never burst. we all rely on eachother.  bitcoin is a pyramid scheme, it will only continue to rise as it has buyers, no mining exists anymore. and only the rich can invest. so there is indeed a cap, as that leaves out 90% of the human population.


I'd like to correct that a bit, the power brokers & the king makers will always remain king. Governments will come & go, so will politicians, money is here to stay & so are the billionaires. The ones who really yield power are the ones with money, it goes without saying that the avg politician, when in power, also wants to double dip & shake a leg or two with billionaires when they retire.


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## trog100 (Oct 21, 2017)

bitcoin has gone up by %60 in the last month.. if that 28 million figure is just one month old it would be 45 million now..

the market cap is now over 100 billion.. i think its too big now for governments to shut down which is why big money is getting in on the act..

currently there are way too many altcoins.. i see a cull coming with many alternative coins being sold off and money going into bitcoin..

what interesting now is bitcoin going up and most of the other coins going down.. something has changed in the thinking..

trog


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## the54thvoid (Oct 21, 2017)

It's a theives dream.  No moral consequence.  If you steal $10 from someone you steal $10.  That's bad.  But when you consider bitcoin and its investment moonshot, it's actually morally repugnant that rich folk, investing in bitcoin are getting richer because their rich buddies are also investing.  Each investment increases value until it shakes a little with a new scare.  The creation of wealth, by wealth is what bitcoin has become.

It's a symbol of todays ethos - I can't be arsed working for a living - lets mine.  It used to be about a hobby but bitcoin has become a monster of a giant ponzy scheme and unlike a conventional stock tied to a property or a commodity, bitcoins value is inherent to its own hype, not any performance.


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## FordGT90Concept (Oct 21, 2017)

trog100 said:


> the market cap is now over 100 billion.. i think its too big now for governments to shut down which is why big money is getting in on the act..


It was designed for black market and it would be regulated to the black market.



trog100 said:


> what interesting now is bitcoin going up and most of the other coins going down.. something has changed in the thinking..


BTC is like USD--it's the cryptocurrency through all others pass and are measured by.




the54thvoid said:


> It's a theives dream.  No moral consequence.  If you steal $10 from someone you steal $10.  That's bad.  But when you consider bitcoin and its investment moonshot, it's actually morally repugnant that rich folk, investing in bitcoin are getting richer because their rich buddies are also investing.  Each investment increases value until it shakes a little with a new scare.  The creation of wealth, by wealth is what bitcoin has become.
> 
> It's a symbol of todays ethos - I can't be arsed working for a living - lets mine.  It used to be about a hobby but bitcoin has become a monster of a giant ponzy scheme and unlike a conventional stock tied to a property or a commodity, bitcoins value is inherent to its own hype, not any performance.


Very this.  I see the temptation but remember *what* it is and *what* it is fueled by.  Better to have piece of mind and be poor than be rich and morally bankrupt.​


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## jaggerwild (Oct 21, 2017)

Oh goodie I cant buy a new GPU SOON.....SMH!


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## trog100 (Oct 21, 2017)

first off i aint rich but two months back i spend about £4000 building a mining machine mainly for something to do.. call that a hobby if you like..

in retrospect the money would have been far better spent simply buying bitcoin.. the money spent on mining hardware would have bought me say 1.25 bitcoin.. that 1.25 bitcoin would now be worth $7500 US dollars.. 

my mining wallet now has $1200 dollars sat in it.. not bad for a couple of months but a long long way from getting my hardware costs back.. live and learn.. 

trog


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## FordGT90Concept (Oct 21, 2017)

And that's just it: the big wall street investors with billions in assets are the ones pumping all this money into BTC on speculation trading.  Those actually doing the mining get squat by comparison.  Think SemGroup and the 2008 oil bubble/burst.  That's what is happening to BTC.  The moment the speculators decide this is the peak and pull out, BTC becomes Zimbabwe's dollar...without any assets to back it up.


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## R-T-B (Oct 21, 2017)

Bitcoin is far more of a marketplace than you guys make it out to be.  The proof is in the amount of coins that regularly move between known bitcoin payment cashing services.

And no, it was never "intended for the black market," the black market just found it handy much like any vaguely hard to trace currency.



jaggerwild said:


> Oh goodie I cant buy a new GPU SOON.....SMH!



You could've bought mine. 

GPUs have actually been coming down, at any rate.


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## trog100 (Oct 22, 2017)

they are not really coming down in the UK but they are more readily available with less pre-orders.. the next step will be prices dropping maybe..

but mining isnt really profitable enough to justify buying the hardware to do it.. i think bitcoin is gonna keep going up which makes it a good idea to forget mining and just buy bitcoin and sit on it..

trog


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## the54thvoid (Oct 22, 2017)

trog100 said:


> they are not really coming down in the UK but they are more readily available with less pre-orders.. the next step will be prices dropping maybe..
> 
> but mining isnt really profitable enough to justify buying the hardware to do it.. i think bitcoin is gonna keep going up which makes it a good idea to forget mining and just buy bitcoin and sit on it..
> 
> trog



Yeah, so buying a non physical commodity that is propped up by wealthy investors.

Power to the fucking people indeed.  At $6000 a coin most people cannot afford it - welcome to plain and simple, balls out capitalism.  No friend of the masses, loyal to the rich.  I hope quantum comes along and fuck its royally up the ass.  This shit deserves to die.

Tell you what, I'll invest in quantum coin.

FWIW been out drinking with brother - wife got sick - but overall, a clash of principles about how capitalism does not work because rich people do NOT trickle the wealth down.  Wealth creates wealth intentionally to remove it from the poor.


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## R-T-B (Oct 22, 2017)

> At $6000 a coin most people cannot afford it



I'm guessing fractions are a foreign concept to you?

I have never spent an entire bitcoin and never plan to.


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## toilet pepper (Oct 22, 2017)

There's gonna be a new fork on 25th. A lot of people are buying now for the free currency the fork would produce. Kinda like what happened with BCC.


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## silkstone (Oct 22, 2017)

jboydgolfer said:


> I got into them years ago when a 6950 could earn some value. but lost my wallet password & info...i know there wasnt too much cash on it, but there was like 10 or so BC's back in 2008 or maybe 2010....they must be worth some decent dollars now



Similar thing here.

I got into them during the first bubble, when it went to around $20.

It dropped to $1-2 and I transferred my coins to an exchange to 'practice' trading. The exchange went down and I lost all my coins and lost interest in them until the next big rise, when they went to $800. I managed to get some of the money back from the exchange (but no coins) and used it to buy a new video card.
I still kick myself a little bit as when I started, I was just hobbying it. I told myself that I would mine the coins, keep them, and if by retirement they were worth something, then great. If not no harm.

I didn't follow through on my plan, but if I had, I'd be retired now.

I also 'heard about' ETH a couple of years ago, but due to time and money, I didn't really bother doing any research. Had I started mining incidentally back then, I wouldn't be able to retire, but my mortgage would be paid off.

I tell myself that I likely would have cashed out all my coins during the first rise in Bitcoin price anyway. Who could have predicted such a rise in a so short a time?

Right now, I've gone back to my original plan. I mine ZCash, sell and buy a basket of crypto and have said that i'll sell 50% of that basket in 2020 if the prices have risen. If not, I've not lost much and I won't have to live as a bitter old man thinking about what could have been. The electricity cost is a small price to pay for piece of mind.

Vertcoin is performing extremely well at the moment., though I have no idea why


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## trog100 (Oct 22, 2017)

toilet pepper said:


> There's gonna be a new fork on 25th. A lot of people are buying now for the free currency the fork would produce. Kinda like what happened with BCC.



thats one theory as to why bitcoin is going up.. i think its going up simply because its going up and people expect it to keep going up.. its passed its right of passage so to speak..

trog


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## R0H1T (Oct 22, 2017)

trog100 said:


> thats one theory as to why bitcoin is going up.. *i think its going up simply because its going up and people expect it to keep going up*.. its passed its right of passage so to speak..
> 
> trog


Well there's that & then there's *too much free money* still floating around, in the last decade it got into commodities & stocks with just the US near 0% interest rates. This decade it's even worse, the EU, China & the US have done QE & that load of cash is going around in real estate & now alt coins. When you think about it the amount of money floating around, it's actually greater than last decade, maybe not the peak circa 2008 when stocks & oil(?) recorded all time highs but it's still way more than the 2009/10


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## toilet pepper (Oct 22, 2017)

R-T-B said:


> I agree but don't count out crypto in general.  I strongly believe that when bitcoin bursts something more useful efficiency wise will take its place, and quickly.
> 
> There's also the possibility bitcoin could evolve into that on it's own, avoiding a crash alltogether.



BTC has its own benefits like being first and biggest. Like most establishments in most countries would accept USD as a payment. But other cryptos like Etheruem and ZEC are better technologically and offer more uses aside from being a payment service. IMO the whole crypto world is becoming saturated.


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## Totally (Oct 22, 2017)

R0H1T said:


> Well there's that & then there's *too much free money* still floating around, in the last decade it got into commodities & stocks with just the US near 0% interest rates. This decade it's even worse, the EU, China & the US have done QE & that load of cash is going around in real estate & now alt coins. When you think about it the amount of money floating around, it's actually greater than last decade, maybe not the peak circa 2008 when stocks & oil(?) recorded all time highs but it's still way more than the 2009/10



I don't agree there's no such thing as free money it, the money comes from someone and somewehere. Those are loans that you are talking about and those debts will have to be settled at some point and constantly deferring them never ends well for all associated parties.


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## trog100 (Oct 22, 2017)

R0H1T said:


> Well there's that & then there's *too much free money* still floating around, in the last decade it got into commodities & stocks with just the US near 0% interest rates. This decade it's even worse, the EU, China & the US have done QE & that load of cash is going around in real estate & now alt coins. When you think about it the amount of money floating around, it's actually greater than last decade, maybe not the peak circa 2008 when stocks & oil(?) recorded all time highs but it's still way more than the 2009/10



and believe it or not.. bitcoin is actually seen as a safe haven.. he he..

i am one of those people who believe the entire system is overdue for a reset..

trog


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## trog100 (Oct 22, 2017)

Totally said:


> I don't agree there's no such thing as free money it, the money comes from someone and somewehere. Those are loans that you are talking about and those debts will have to be settled at some point and constantly deferring them never ends well for all associated parties.


 
they will never be repaid.. the entire system is being kept afloat by incurring more debt and money printing.. quite what happens next i havnt a clue.. i dont think any one has.. maybe its war..

trog


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## verycharbroiled (Oct 22, 2017)

toilet pepper said:


> BTC has its own benefits like being first and biggest. Like most establishments in most countries would accept USD as a payment. But other cryptos like Etheruem and ZEC are better technologically and offer more uses aside from being a payment service. IMO the whole crypto world is becoming saturated.



I tend to think of btc as the "onramp" to crypto. Buy btc and then exchange to whatever currency you need at the time. 

And of course btc for long term hodling.


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## toilet pepper (Oct 22, 2017)

trog100 said:


> they will never be repaid.. the entire system is being kept afloat by incurring more debt and money printing.. quite what happens next i havnt a clue.. i dont think any one has.. maybe its war..
> 
> trog




Exactly my thought. The world has around 60 trillion USD in debt. It wont be long til the martians come in and collect it.

I think of it as a reset for the whole monetary system. But once these are regulated by government and banks then were back to square one again.


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## FordGT90Concept (Oct 23, 2017)

No one really cares about debts...until someone defaults on it.


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## trog100 (Dec 2, 2017)

well after an "interesting" week bitcoin is now back up over $11000 dollars.. where does it go from here i wonder.. ??

trog


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## Vayra86 (Dec 2, 2017)

trog100 said:


> and believe it or not.. bitcoin is actually seen as a safe haven.. he he..
> 
> i am one of those people who believe the entire system is overdue for a reset..
> 
> trog



That is exactly the sentiment Crypto has been playing into for many people, and it makes no sense at all if you take a while to really think about that.


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## the54thvoid (Dec 2, 2017)

I have £1 million (I wish).  I buy £1/2 milion in Bitcoin.  Price rockets (how investments work).  I can sell it for x% more than I bought it and make a quick killing.  By selling so much stock, price drops (how markets work).  

Rinse repeat.  It's now a rich mans game and its all about who buys up fast and sells up quickly.

I learned everything I know about trading from Trading Places.


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## Space Lynx (Dec 2, 2017)

it is indeed a rich mans game now. I almost bought a full coin at $3k mark, but the price went up to $3800 the next day I was about to buy... so yeah I'll pass now.  I think a lot of people are like me, not willing to just invest in a 0.1 coin.  I think Bitcoin will hit around 15k before it fully collapses though.


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## micropage7 (Dec 2, 2017)

i think it's normal where the price goes up or stay stagnant especially at the end of year, like stock or forex

if you want to see the real thing just wait next year, if you have better sell it when the price is high


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