# AT&T No Longer Offering Broadband In Most Areas



## newtekie1 (Jan 30, 2015)

Yesterday the FCC voted to raise the definition of Broadband from 4Mbps to 25Mbps. In most service areas AT&T only offers a maximum of 24Mbps download internet speeds.  That means, that for most of it's service area, AT&T will no longer be offering what is considered Broadband Internet and can not legally market it as such.

http://www.ubergizmo.com/2015/01/broadband-internet-definition-changed/


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 30, 2015)

newtekie1 said:


> Yesterday the FCC voted to raise the definition of Broadband from 4Mbps to 25Mbps. In most service areas AT&T only offers a maximum of 24Mbps download internet speeds.  That means, that for most of it's service area, AT&T will no longer be offering what is considered Broadband Internet and can not legally market it as such.
> 
> http://www.ubergizmo.com/2015/01/broadband-internet-definition-changed/



Its copper based telephony/dryloop they cant, it have to be fiber to home


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 30, 2015)

No one even calls it "broadband" around here in the first place.  They all call it "high speed internet" which means the FCC definition change has zero impact.  I mean, what ISP is going to invest millions of dollars in upgrades just so they can use the word "broadband?"


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 30, 2015)

In order to get 24 Mbps youd need to be less that 1500 feet loop length from a node on copper plant with no metallic faults/bridge taps/open/short faults/unbonded untwisted cable pairs) Same goes for 45Mbps Bonded pair. I guess they mean non uverse (vdsl/ipdsl) which is ATM (Adsl-Legacy/Swbell/Sbc)


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## xfia (Jan 30, 2015)

att is kinda lame..  they charge out the ass for data on cell phones and have shitty internet.

everyone around here knows you get comcast internet for the same price or cheaper than att with double or more the speed.


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 30, 2015)

xfia said:


> att is kinda lame..  they charge out the ass for data on cell phones and have shitty internet.
> 
> everyone around here knows you get comcast internet for the same price or cheaper than att with double or more the speed.



Att entered the market with uverse in 2006, still a young service. However in neighborhoods that were built Greater than 10 years ago are non fiber plant (copper from node to home) And some newer neighborhoods are that way. Copper corrodes, chafes, gets crushed causing opens and shorts .sometimes dealing with copper plants 30+ years old). Uverse is at its best on fiber. Coaxial is copper and suffers if the dilectric gets wet, there's unecessary coax lines on the splitter in home without a terminator (f resistor cap or Modem/tv box) due to stray rf, kinks in the coax(opens/shorts), short from braid to conductor, shield to conductor, shield to braid or all 3, coax has to be RG60 now aswell not R59. Bad tap in outside plant or coax drop from tap, unbonded cable.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 30, 2015)

eidairaman1 said:


> In order to get 24 Mbps youd need to be less that 1500 feet loop length from a node on copper plant with no metallic faults/bridge taps/open/short faults/unbonded untwisted cable pairs) Same goes for 45Mbps Bonded pair. I guess they mean non uverse (vdsl/ipdsl) which is ATM (Adsl-Legacy/Swbell/Sbc)


The direction everyone needs to be going in is fiber to the home (FTTH).


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## xfia (Jan 30, 2015)

google should just hook up the whole west with fiber and let some smaller companies get a peace of the action


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## newtekie1 (Jan 30, 2015)

FordGT90Concept said:


> The direction everyone needs to be going in is fiber to the home (FTTH).


I'd be happy with FTTdp.


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## remixedcat (Jan 31, 2015)

a guy from frontier was goin door - to - door and he said it was .....

wait for it....


fiber from the pole to the home but from there was copper from the "central to the node" then fiber from the pole to the home at only 34Mbps...

I had a tummy ache from that shizz


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## jjnissanpatfan (Jan 31, 2015)

I actually am mapping fiber in Chicago, and surrounding communities for ATT. I work at communications company and ATT is building fiber everywhere. I think i read somewhere last week they had a 4 billion quarter 4 loss, attributed to the building new networks.


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## brandonwh64 (Jan 31, 2015)

We offer a 10, 20, 30, 50MBPS with 5MBPS upload on all packages. We never got this memo from the FCC


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 31, 2015)

newtekie1 said:


> Yesterday the FCC voted to raise the definition of Broadband from 4Mbps to 25Mbps.





FordGT90Concept said:


> which means the FCC definition change has zero impact.


This is just political BS so that the Obama administration can point out how few people have "broadband".  An effort to get the government to install "broadband."  This is one of his early promises.  This is typical of his administration, change the definition to suit his purpose.  (If you try to enter the US and are turned away from the border, this administration, and only this administration counts that as a deportation)  Mark my word, I expect a report - or something from Obama's administration bemoaning the lack of "broadband" in the US in the very near future.  My 15Mb is more than I've ever needed, but I guess I don't have broadband either.


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## newtekie1 (Jan 31, 2015)

thebluebumblebee said:


> My 15Mb is more than I've ever needed, but I guess I don't have broadband either.


Holy shit.  How do you live with 15Mbps internet... I can't get by with anything less than 50.  Also, the FCC works entirely independently of the federal government, so Obama doesn't really have any say in the matter.  This really comes down to the fact that our Internet infrastructure is a joke compared to most other developed countries.

A large part of that has to do with laws that are basically designed to limit competition.  If Google gets their way and has internet fiber reclassed as Class II Telecommunications, then it would give fiber providers much more access to utilities and drastically reduce the cost of FTTH/FTTdp. If Obama had the power you seem to think he has, this would have happened a long time ago.  As you said, he's been pushing it since the day he took office.


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## Deelron (Jan 31, 2015)

newtekie1 said:


> Holy shit.  How do you live with 15Mbps internet... I can't get by with anything less than 50.  Also, the FCC works entirely independently of the federal government, so Obama doesn't really have any say in the matter.  This really comes down to the fact that our Internet infrastructure is a joke compared to most other developed countries.
> 
> A large part of that has to do with laws that are basically designed to limit competition.  If Google gets their way and has internet fiber reclassed as Class II Telecommunications, then it would give fiber providers much more access to utilities and drastically reduce the cost of FTTH/FTTdp. If Obama had the power you seem to think he has, this would have happened a long time ago.  As you said, he's been pushing it since the day he took office.



I have two choices in my area, Comcast or Century Link. I had Comcast 50Mpbs for some time (of course paying quite a bit more) and regularly got 15, particularly to anything that wasn't being from Comcast.  I switched to Centurylink and on their 12 Mbps per second and get...15.  Damned either way but at least one is half the price then the other.

Of course my LTE tablet gets regularly gets 30-40....


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## R-T-B (Jan 31, 2015)

brandonwh64 said:


> We offer a 10, 20, 30, 50MBPS with 5MBPS upload on all packages. We never got this memo from the FCC




What company?


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 31, 2015)

newtekie1 said:


> the FCC works entirely independently of the federal government


Sure they are.


> Tom Wheeler was sworn in as the 31st Chairman of the Federal Communications Commission on November 4, 2013. Chairman Wheeler was *appointed by President Barack Obama* and unanimously confirmed by the United States Senate.





> Mignon Clyburn served as Acting Chairwoman of the Federal Communications Commission, following her *appointment by President Barack Obama* on May 20, 2013. She was nominated for her first term as Commissioner on June 25, 2009 and sworn-in on August 3, 2009. As Commissioner, she is serving a second term for which she was sworn in on February 19, 2013.


I could continue - all 5 commissioners have been appointed by the Obama administration.  If the president has the power to hire and fire the heads of an agency, how independent is it?
 Okay, my bad, I just saw that Netflix is recommending 25Mb for Ultra HD (4K).  Since that's where we are going, I can agree with 25Mb's.


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## newtekie1 (Jan 31, 2015)

thebluebumblebee said:


> I could continue - all 5 commissioners have been appointed by the Obama administration. If the president has the power to hire and fire the heads of an agency, how independent is it?
> Okay, my bad, I just saw that Netflix is recommending 25Mb for Ultra HD (4K). Since that's where we are going, I can agree with 25Mb's.


Do your research.  The commissioners are appointed by the president, with the approval of the Senate, but can not be removed.  And while all 5 were appointed by the Obama administration, 2 of them not only voted against it also argued pretty hard against it.  Michael O’Rielly, appointed by Obama in 2013 with senate approval, was actually pretty outspoken against raising the minimum speed.

The commissioners and chairman are like Supreme Court Judges.  They get appointed and then hold the seat as long as they want with no fear of loosing it.


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 31, 2015)

FordGT90Concept said:


> The direction everyone needs to be going in is fiber to the home (FTTH).



Yuppers however to shove fiber up to those homes is expensive, and att wants to provide service for cheap as possible.



newtekie1 said:


> Holy shit.  How do you live with 15Mbps internet... I can't get by with anything less than 50.  Also, the FCC works entirely independently of the federal government, so Obama doesn't really have any say in the matter.  This really comes down to the fact that our Internet infrastructure is a joke compared to most other developed countries.
> 
> A large part of that has to do with laws that are basically designed to limit competition.  If Google gets their way and has internet fiber reclassed as Class II Telecommunications, then it would give fiber providers much more access to utilities and drastically reduce the cost of FTTH/FTTdp. If Obama had the power you seem to think he has, this would have happened a long time ago.  As you said, he's been pushing it since the day he took office.



Yup he's the one trying to get the ones who refuse to work free everything while the workers foot the bills.

In order for vdsl to work properly you need at least 25Mbps (vdsl) for tv(iptv),internet,phone(voip from modem/rg) to work on Uverse at less than 2500 feet loop. When going over that youre pushing your luck and might need bonded pair which at times is unstable and frustrating even for premesus techs.


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## brandonwh64 (Jan 31, 2015)

R-T-B said:


> What company?



http://www.dutil.com/optilink/


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 31, 2015)

brandonwh64 said:


> http://www.dutil.com/optilink/



Ethernet or coax to modem?


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## thebluebumblebee (Jan 31, 2015)

newtekie1 said:


> The commissioners and chairman are like Supreme Court Judges. They get appointed and then hold the seat as long as they want with no fear of loosing it.


Nope, not lifetime appointments.  If they were, why have all of them been appointed by Obama?  Also, the President can always ask an appointee to resign.  That's being fired.


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Jan 31, 2015)

It's a good thing I have comcast.


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## newtekie1 (Jan 31, 2015)

thebluebumblebee said:


> Nope, not lifetime appointments. If they were, why have all of them been appointed by Obama? Also, the President can always ask an appointee to resign. That's being fired.



Well, true, they aren't lifetime appointments.  They serve 5 year terms.  But the President can't ask them to resign.  We'll, I guess technically he can _ask _them to resign, just like he could ask anyone in the government to resign, but he can't force them to resign and can't fire them.  Once appointed, they are there until their term is up.  Also, that is why they have all been appointed by the Obama administration, the terms of the previous office holders have all expired since Obama has taken office.


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## brandonwh64 (Jan 31, 2015)

eidairaman1 said:


> Ethernet or coax to modem?



FTTH (Fiber to the home)


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## R-T-B (Jan 31, 2015)

When will you expand to the Thurston County area of Washington state Brandon?

Lol...  I have to deal with comcast, and believe me, it's been painful.  Could be worse I suppose.  I could have DSL...  (but then, that'd be about 1/5 of the price too).


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## eidairaman1 (Feb 1, 2015)

brandonwh64 said:


> FTTH (Fiber to the home)



PON, to ONT to Ethernet in back of Modem.


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## brandonwh64 (Feb 1, 2015)

eidairaman1 said:


> PON, to ONT to Ethernet in back of Modem.



Pon to ONT to gig Ethernet no modem


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## remixedcat (Feb 1, 2015)

CrAsHnBuRnxp: 3231475 said:
			
		

> It's a good thing I have comcast.



Try that on a different speed test site. ISPS whitelist speed test.net
Try that on a differe


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## newtekie1 (Feb 1, 2015)




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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 1, 2015)

Just saw a CableOne TV ad.  Bet you can guess what they were selling: "High-Speed Internet."  I haven't seen the word "broadband" in advertising materials in over a decade.  The FCC effectively made the word taboo when they "defined" it years ago.


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## R-T-B (Feb 1, 2015)

"Broadband" actually has a sort of obsolete ring to it, don't you think?  Kinda feels in the same category as "ISDN" and such now.  Almost feels like the word would be more harmful to use than not, regulation be damned.


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## xfia (Feb 1, 2015)

that is def a lot to spend on improving infrastructure. competition is good and all but It's so much better to see companies working together. don't really want att to sink ship.


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## remixedcat (Feb 1, 2015)

thing is if you future proof and build well you spend less on repairs overtime and get more profits... instead they went cheap and have something with a higher TCO. Shortsightedness at its worst.


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## R-T-B (Feb 1, 2015)

remixedcat said:


> thing is if you future proof and build well you spend less on repairs overtime and get more profits... instead they went cheap and have something with a higher TCO. Shortsightedness at its worst.



The article makes it sound like they ARE future proofing their network, it's just not ready yet.  Or am I misunderstanding?


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## eidairaman1 (Feb 1, 2015)

brandonwh64 said:


> Pon to ONT to gig Ethernet no modem



ok so the ONT acts like the modem for that Setup, because How do you get Wifi then? a Residential Gateway(modem)? or just a router?

Uverse DSL Equipment other than 7340/42

http://www.dslreports.com/faq/uverse/5.2_AT_T_U-Verse_Equipment

for Uverse FTTP- ONT is either GPON or BPON on home to ethernet http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/100BASE-TX#100BASE-TX

then to the RG which feeds TV, Internet and Phone. Either the Pase 2Wire Model 3800(B/GPON), 3801(B/GPON), or the Motorola/Arris NVG 589 (GPON Only)


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## brandonwh64 (Feb 1, 2015)

eidairaman1 said:


> ok so the ONT acts like the modem for that Setup, because How do you get Wifi then? a Residential Gateway(modem)? or just a router?
> 
> Uverse DSL Equipment other than 7340/42
> 
> ...



We either give the customer a static IP (5$ charge) or they run of our own dynamic NAT that runs through 3 ISG-2000 juniper firewalls and Infoblox DHCP server. These are being replaced with a new DNS setup as well as a new firewall. The reason for the NAT at the ISP level is the shortage in IPV4 addresses we got from our BGP. We are trying to get more blocks of IP's to give customers a public IP but until we do or change over to IPV6 we have to do this.


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## eidairaman1 (Feb 1, 2015)

brandonwh64 said:


> We either give the customer a static IP (5$ charge) or they run of our own dynamic NAT that runs through 3 ISG-2000 juniper firewalls and Infoblox DHCP server. These are being replaced with a new DNS setup as well as a new firewall. The reason for the NAT at the ISP level is the shortage in IPV4 addresses we got from our BGP. We are trying to get more blocks of IP's to give customers a public IP but until we do or change over to IPV6 we have to do this.



Good Explanation.


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Feb 2, 2015)

remixedcat said:


> Try that on a different speed test site. ISPS whitelist speed test.net
> Try that on a differe


Taking suggestions on that one. Im unaware of any other type of site like speedtest.


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## eidairaman1 (Feb 2, 2015)

CrAsHnBuRnXp said:


> Taking suggestions on that one. Im unaware of any other type of site like speedtest.



testmy.net


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## xorbe (Feb 2, 2015)

AT&T also just slashed my and my parents' DSL connections from 9.0 to 7.5Mbps, how nice.


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## remixedcat (Feb 2, 2015)

CrAsHnBuRnXp said:


> Taking suggestions on that one. Im unaware of any other type of site like speedtest.


speedof.me


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 2, 2015)

remixedcat said:


> Try that on a different speed test site. ISPS whitelist speed test.net
> Try that on a differe


 I can believe this.  The last time one of the Charter guys was at my house, to check if his repair work succeeded in fixing my speed, he went to speedtest.net!


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## eidairaman1 (Feb 2, 2015)

xorbe said:


> AT&T also just slashed my and my parents' DSL connections from 9.0 to 7.5Mbps, how nice.



could be a issue with the modem, data chord, jack, home wiring, adsl/vdsl-pots splitter or line protector in the phone box outside(demarcation point), buried or aerial drop wire going from home to aerial/burried/encapsulated terminal, or burried/aerial cabling to the street Cabinet then VRAD/IPDSLAM RT/CO



rtwjunkie said:


> I can believe this.  The last time one of the Charter guys was at my house, to check if his repair work succeeded in fixing my speed, he went to speedtest.net!



those are the only 2 i know that can give a guage of your connection speed. I've repaired customers service when they were only getting 15Mbps on a 18Mbps HSIA profile, and afterwards they'd get 20Mbps (2mbps bufffer), Too many fixes to count honestly, a good start is a Brand new Modem/RG (Not refurbed), from there its wiring all the way to the cabinet, beyond that its the customers account/co troubles


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