# Beginner trying to Undervolt/Improve Temps i5-9300h (Acer Nitro 5) Using ThrottleStop



## NathanJ95 (Aug 31, 2021)

Hello guys,

I am an absolute beginner at all this. When I first got my Nitro 5 a few months ago I knew nothing about temperatures/throttling/performance. I started to monitor my temps with NitroSense while gaming and noticed 85C-92C temps when playing games like RDR2 and WarZone. After reading many threads here about undervolting and seeing how responsive unclewebb is on the forum I decided to try to undertake the process and see if I could at least make something of an improvement to my system. 

I have only just started undervolting the CPU and am at a pretty stable place right now after some hours of gaming and stress tests. I think I can go lower but I feel a bit overwhelmed with all the information on throttlestop. I don't know what is optimal for me and other than knowing I would like my temps to be a little lower I don't know where to set anything. 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated! 

I will attach some screenshots of where I am as of right now in the process. The attached Log is from the most recent CinebenchR20 Test.


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## unclewebb (Sep 1, 2021)

NathanJ95 said:


> I feel a bit overwhelmed


If you are new to ThrottleStop, it is not unusual to be a little overwhelmed. It took me 10+ years to write this program. If it takes you a day or a week or a month to learn what ThrottleStop can do, that is normal.

I noticed a couple of issues in the TPL window. The MMIO PL1 power limit is set to 45W. That is what is causing your CPU to throttle. The best thing to do is put a check mark in the MMIO Lock box and then press the Apply button. This will disable the MMIO power limits. These secondary limits are not necessary.





The other thing I noticed is that the Maximum value for Speed Shift is 41 for your CPU. Why did you set that to 225?
If you got this advice from a guide, you need to find a better guide.  

HWMonitor does not correctly report the CPU voltages so I would avoid using it.

It looks like the BIOS set your thermal throttling temperature to 92°C. When PROCHOT Offset is set to 8, that tells the CPU to start throttling 8°C before it reaches the Intel spec which is 100°C. If this setting is locked, you cannot use ThrottleStop to change this. It looks like you set PROCHOT Offset to 2 but this is not working because it was already locked. In the Options window, do not check PROCHOT Offset and do not check Lock PROCHOT Offset. Press OK and then reboot your computer. If you boot up your computer and you see a Lock icon beside this setting, leave it alone. You cannot change it because it is locked.

This setting can only be changed when it looks like this.
No lock icon.





If the BIOS has locked this setting, there is not much you can do. You will lose a little bit of performance with the throttling temperature set to 92°C but nothing you can do about it.

The rest of your settings look OK. You might be able to get the cache offset voltage up to -125 mV and you might be able to get the core up to -175 mV without losing stability. Adjust in small steps and do lots of testing. Use your computer for a day to make sure everything is stable. There is no need to come up with the perfect voltage settings in one day.

Run another log file after you make those changes. Some laptops are hard locked to 45W internally and there is no easy way to get beyond this limit.


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## NathanJ95 (Sep 1, 2021)

Thank you for your prompt reply! Really appreciate it. 



unclewebb said:


> If you got this advice from a guide, you need to find a better guide.



lol I do not remember what made me do that. I think maybe I was reading on one of the threads here that the Speed Shift range is between 0-225 and when I saw 41 on the TPL page I thought I had it set wrong.


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## unclewebb (Sep 1, 2021)

NathanJ95 said:


> the Speed Shift range is between 0-225


The Speed Shift EPP range is between 0 and 255. You can adjust EPP on the main ThrottleStop screen.

The Speed Shift Min and Max values in the TPL window refer to the minimum and maximum CPU multiplier that a CPU supports. The good news is that this one does not matter that much. Whether you set Speed Shift Max to 41, 225 or 255 makes no difference. All of these values tell the CPU to use the maximum multiplier. I just enjoy giving users a hard time when I see a value that defies explanation.


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## NathanJ95 (Sep 1, 2021)

Thank you for all of your detailed explanations on all this. I'm learning a lot....finding it a lot of fun playing around with these settings and trying to get better results. I'll post another log once I change and test new voltage offset values. 



unclewebb said:


> I just enjoy giving users a hard time when I see a value that defies explanation.


lol I don't like just plugging random numbers in and checking off random boxes....but that one was a complete lack of understanding of what it was and I just guessed.

Oh yeah I unchecked Lock PROCHOT Offset and PROCHOT Offset and rebooted and still have that lock symbol. Looks like the BIOS has locked me out.



unclewebb said:


> You might be able to get the cache offset voltage up to -125 mV and you might be able to get the core up to -175 mV without losing stability.



One more question on this: Should I leave cache where it is for now and slowly bring core up first?


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## unclewebb (Sep 1, 2021)

Cache is the important one. I would try to bump that one first.


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## NathanJ95 (Sep 4, 2021)

Here is where I am at so far. Just finished running a new Cinebench test. Log attached. I ran single core and full on cinebench. The first half has pl2 throttling.


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## unclewebb (Sep 5, 2021)

NathanJ95 said:


> pl2 throttling.


This is normal for Acer laptops. Many of them are hard locked to 45W. This limit is set by an embedded controller (EC). The ThrottleStop power limits are ignored and this 45W limit is enforced.

Did you try pushing the core voltage some more? -120 mV cache and -170 mV core might improve things. If you lose stability, drop the cache to -115 mV or -110 mV and test again.


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## NathanJ95 (Sep 5, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Many of them are hard locked to 45W



I had a feeling this was the case. How much of a performance loss does this cause? When playing games like Warzone it seems to be constantly at 45W but FPS sit somewhere between 75-80 without dropping. 



unclewebb said:


> Did you try pushing the core voltage some more?



Not yet. You recommended that I push the cache first so I was trying to go for a target of -125mV and then bring the core hopefully up to around -175mV. I just never know how much to adjust at any time. I've been doing like 5-10mV at a time and testing for about a day.


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## unclewebb (Sep 5, 2021)

NathanJ95 said:


> never know how much to adjust at any time.


The best setting for the cache is going to be somewhere close to -125 mV. I would adjust that one in steps of 5 mV. For the core, I would adjust that in steps of 25 mV. If you get a BSOD, it is usually the cache setting that is causing the problem. That is why I recommend adjusting the cache first if there are any problems. 

Taking it slow and adjusting it a little day by day is the best way to fine tune the voltage. I always recommend doing this but most people are too impatient to follow this advice. Your final voltage settings should never be the cause of a BSOD. If you ever see a BSOD, you have probably gone a little too far and need to back up. By adjusting in small steps, you will have a much better idea of what works and what does not. 



NathanJ95 said:


> How much of a performance loss does this cause?


Not sure. All I know is that you cannot do anything about this so it is what it is. Reducing the core voltage can sometimes help reduce power consumption a watt or two which can help avoid power limit throttling. This means your CPU is able to run a little faster. Not a huge difference but every little bit helps the cause. It makes me full good when I know a laptop is dialed in and running as good as it can.


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## NathanJ95 (Sep 5, 2021)

So I didn't see your reply on reducing core voltage by 25mV until just now but I did do -10mV. Ran TSBench to check stability and it seemed OK. So i ran Cinebench and found the results interesting. I was at 100 percent CPU and 47.2W with no PL2 throttling. It went down to 45W and immediately started power throttling and continued to do so for the rest of the test. Just curious how it could go to 47.2W if it is locked at 45W?

Also my Cinebench score went from 1996pts to 2008pts just by reducing core another 10mV. 



unclewebb said:


> It makes me full good when I know a laptop is dialed in and running as good as it can.



Me too! And I want to say thanks again for reading my posts and caring to leave detailed replies. Helps a lot!


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## unclewebb (Sep 5, 2021)

NathanJ95 said:


> how it could go to 47.2W if it is locked at 45W?


Intel CPUs have a short term and a long term power limit. For a short period of time, your computer can go beyond 45W but in any long term test, it will be limited to 45W. 

Long term, the CPU is forced to slow down so it does not exceed 45W.

Try -120 mV cache and -175 mV core. I would also set the turbo ratios back to their default values of 41, 41, 40, 40. That might be worth a few more Cinebench points.


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## NathanJ95 (Sep 11, 2021)

I feel like temperatures have been higher since under-volting. I played some Warzone to test, and with fans set to max through Nitrosense I was 93-95C the entire 15-20 minutes of play. The attached log will show this. Just wondering if this should just be expected with these laptops and just use it until it quits or if I need to go through the trouble to thermal paste it. Maybe there is a tweak in ThrottleStop that would help some?

I was getting BSOD with -115mV cache so I brought it back to -110mV. So far everything seems pretty stable.


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## unclewebb (Sep 11, 2021)

NathanJ95 said:


> temperatures have been higher since under-volting


Undervolting cannot make your temperatures higher. Thermal paste that was improperly applied or if it is degrading; that is what causes your temperatures to get higher. Some pastes do not perform well long term when the CPU is constantly over 90°C like your CPU is.

The log file shows lots of TEMP messages in the far right column so your CPU is thermal throttling. This interferes with maximum performance and it interferes with smooth performance. Your ThrottleStop settings are fine. The only way to fix the throttling problem is to improve the cooling. Some laptops are poorly engineered. They might run at over 90°C even with the best paste money can buy.


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## NathanJ95 (Sep 11, 2021)

Bummer. Well, I guess I will just use it and try to keep it as cool as possible. I'm not sure if it will be worth trying to re-paste the Acer Nitro 5. I didn't know these "gaming" laptops had temperature issues to this degree. 

Thanks again for all your help/advice.


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