# A Beginner's Guide to Overclocking



## xvi (Jan 3, 2007)

This guide has been created from an AMD point of view, but Intel'ers can use this as well.

*Warning: Overclocking isn't always safe. There are safety measures built in to your computer to prevent damage while overclocking, but the safety of your hardware isn't guaranteed (even if you are following the guide).*​
The main pieces in your computer that are affected by overclocking are your CPU, your memory, and your motherboard (but you won't have to worry about your motherboard if you're just beginning to overclock). When you overclock your CPU, you also end up overclocking your Memory, HT link (if you have one), sometimes your AGP/PCI-e and PCI cards, and a few other things. Why? Because of a magical thing called "FSB". 

*What is FSB?*
FSB, as far as overclocking is concerned, is simply a number. Your computer's FSB is the data links between your CPU, Memory, Chipset, and other components. Lots of things in your computer use the FSB to tell it how fast to run. FSB is usually rated in MHz.

*How does my CPU use FSB?*
Your CPU takes the FSB and multiplies it by the CPU Multiplier to get your CPU speed.
In math? FSB (in MHz) times Multiplier equals CPU speed (in MHz)

*How does my Memory use FSB?*
Your memory takes that FSB speed, multiplies it by two (DDR=Double Data Rate), and it gives you your DDR rating.
Sometimes, the processor wants to set the FSB at a high value, but the memory wants to set the FSB at a low value. The motherboard will set a "Divider" that will lower the Memory's FSB so that the Memory can run at the lower speed it wants without affecting the CPU. The Memory Divider is also known as the Memory Ratio.
In math? FSB divided by the memory ratio times two equals DDR Rating.

*Why is PC133 so much slower than PC2100. Don't they run at the same FSB?*
Yes, they run at the same FSB, but PC133 isn't DDR (and it's older technology).

*Wait.. Didn't you say something about a CPU Multiplier? Can't I change that?*
Yes. You can change your CPU multiplier, too. Some processors, such as AMD's Sempron, won't let you increase this, though. If you want to overclock your computer, but don't want to change the FSB, you can change the CPU Multiplier. The advantage of changing this rather than your FSB is that the CPU Multiplier only affects the CPU. FSB, like I said before, affects more than your CPU.

*Lets make it even more complicated!*
Remember FSB? FSB is (and now "was") the link between your CPU, Memory, Chpiset, AGP/PCI-e, and other computer components. As computers started to run faster and faster, a lot of motherboards started getting bottlenecked at these points, so we now have AMD's HyperTransport Technology and Intel's QuadPumped Technology to fix it. Although AMD was the company to bring HyperTransport to fame, AMD, Apple, nVidia, Cisco Systems, Sun Microsystems, and a few other companies all helped develop HyperTransport (HT). HyperTransport links were designed to replace the FSB system. This means that the links between your CPU, Memory, Chpiset, AGP/PCI-e, and other computer components are now three to five times faster than the original FSB system was.
Although HyperTransport was designed to replace the FSB, it hasn't eliminated it. Socket 754's use 4x FSB and Sck939 use 5x FSB. Making your HT Link run faster doesn't make your computer faster, it just gives it the potential to be faster. Making this run too fast will crash your computer.
(Intel plans to release a competitor to HyperTransport that they're calling the Common System Interface (or "CSI"). This is expected in 2008.)
In math? FSB times the HT Multiplier equals the HT Link Speed (or sometimes called "Rated FSB").

*Wait! I still don't understand HyperTransport/QuadPumped! And why doesn't it make my computer faster?*
The CPU, Memory, Video Card, chipset, and everything else in your comptuer all need to be able to talk to eachother, right? Think of the data paths that link all those things together as highways. If you try to fit too many cars down the highway, you get a traffic jam and some cars have to wait before they can get through. HyperTransport puts more lanes in the highway so more cars can flow through it. If you have two lanes, but only one car is going down the highway, adding a third lane won't make that car go faster. If you have a few thousand cars, but only two lanes, adding a third lane would make the flow move faster.

*What about Intel! Don't they have, like, 1GHz FSB?*
Those 800MHz FSB Prescott P4's actually run at 200MHz FSB. Intel also had the same problem with the FSB not being fast enough to support the system. Intel's Pentium 4 line of processors (for example) has their FSB "QuadPumped", which offers the same advantage as HyperTransport. I believe that this is the same story with the "1GHz FSB" Intel processors. If you look at CPU-Z, you should have both FSB and "Rated FSB". For overclocking purposes, we'll only be concerned about the original FSB.
Also, there are rumors that Intel's QuadPumped Technology does *not* increase the link speed between multiple processors whereas AMD's HyperTransport does. Given Intel's plan to move to a mainstream Quad Core, a HyperTransport competitor by Intel (aka: Intel's CSI Bus) suddenly makes sense.

*I'm a visual learner. Can you show me a picture?*
Lets use one that I randomly pulled off of Google's image search.






The image (that should now show up correctly) above represents a Quad Processor AMD Opteron computer (Intel is similar). There is a 6.4GB/s link between each processor and a 6.4GB/s link between the processors and the AMD-8131 Northbridge chipset. The Northbridge connects to the PCI Express bus, SCSI controller, and on-board Ethernet cards. The Northbridge is also connected to the AMD- 8111 Southbridge chipset via a slower 800 MB/s link. The Southbridge connects to slower on-board devices like the on-board audio, USB 2.0, EIDE, etc. This was FSB's job until today's devices became too fast for it. System devices would end up competing for bandwidth. And what shows up like a knight in shining armor? HyperTrasport and QuadPumped Technology.

*Lets do some math!! Can we have an example?*
When stock, my computer runs at 200 FSB. The CPU has a 10x Multiplier. The memory is PC3200 and isn't divided (We call this a 1:1 ratio, or a 1/1 divider). The HyperTransport link runs at a 4x Multiplier. Now that we know all that...

Lets find the CPU speed.
200MHz FSB times 10 (CPU Multiplier) = 2,000 MHz CPU speed, or 2GHz CPU speed.

Lets find the Memory speed.
200MHz divided by 1 times 1 (remember the divider?) times two (Double Data Rate) = DDR400. We can also take that DDR400 and multiply by 8 bytes to give us 3200, or PC3200.

Lets find the HT speed.
200MHz times 4 (the HT Multiplier) = 800MHz HT Link.

Put all that together, and you can see that I have a 2GHz CPU, DDR400 memory, and an 800MHz HT link.

*So what happens when you raise the FSB?*
Lets say I take my computer and run it at 220 FSB. Lets do the example again.

CPU:
220 FSB times 10 (Multiplier) = 2,200MHz, or 2.2GHz. (See the increase?)

Memory:
220 FSB divided by 1 times 1 (1:1 ratio) times two (DDR) = DDR440, or about PC3600

HT:
220 FSB times 4 (HT Multiplier) = 880MHz HT Link

At stock speeds, we had:
200FSB, 2.0GHz, DDR400, and 800MHz HT.
Overclocked, we have:
220FSB, 2.2GHz, DDR440, and 880MHz HT

*What if you just raise the CPU Multiplier?*
Lets say I raise it to 11.
CPU:
200 FSB times 11 = 2,200MHz, or 2.2GHz.
Memory:
200 FSB divided by 1 times 1 times two = DDR400 or PC3200
HT:
200 FSB times 4 = 800MHz HT Link

200 FSB, 2.1GHz, DDR400 and 800MHz HT
Notice how everything is at it's original speed except the CPU.

*Memory dividers are really confusing. Why would I ever want to make my memory run slower? Could you give me an example?*
Sure! Lets say your memory runs at 200 FSB, but can only run at a maximum of 210 FSB before it crashes. We can set a Memory Divider of 5/6 to drop it down from 200 FSB to 166 FSB. Now we can raise your FSB higher without stressing out your memory as much.

200 FSB divided by 6 times 5 times two = DDR333

240 FSB divided by 6 times 5 = DDR400 (Back to where we started, but the FSB is a lot higher and the memory is still in a safe range.)

*How do I know when to stop?*
When your computer will not boot in to Windows (or if it does, will freeze after a few minutes of gaming), you'll know that you have pushed something too far. If you've overclocked to the point where your computer unstable, you can boot into the BIOS and set your FSB back down. If you overclock too far your computer may not boot at all. If your computer does not do anything when you turn it on, you'll need to reset the BIOS. You can do this by unplugging your power cable and removing the silver button battery on your motherboard. Leave it out for at least 5 seconds (15 seconds recommended) and then put it back in. Plug in the power cable and boot. You'll need to go into your BIOS and load the default settings.
An alternative to changing the FSB in the BIOS is to change the FSB with a program such as ClockGen. When your computer crashes, the actual BIOS value doesn't change, so you reset to stock speeds every time you reboot. Once you've found an overclock that works for you, you can try setting it in the BIOS.

Another thing that could stop your computer from running (and could potentially damage your computer) is heat. Overclocking means more power. More power means *heat*. If your CPU, Memory, or motherboard chipset(s) become too hot, they will stop working properly. Overclocking is not recommended on stock CPU coolers. While overclocking, always watch your temperatures! If something becomes too hot, do anything you can to cool it down before you try overclocking again. Most things can be easily cooled by simply adding a fan to blow over it.

*I can't raise my FSB anymore! Is this really as fast as my computer will ever go?*
The exciting answer is "No"! Just because your computer has hit it's limit doesn't mean that everything in your computer has hit it's limit, but rather that one thing in your computer has hit it's limit. If you can figure out what thing that is, you can usually make that one thing run a little slower. For example, if your memory is what's crashing but your CPU can run faster (this is common), you can use the Memory Divider to lower it. With the memory running a notch slower than usual, you can increase your overclock even more.

You'll need to learn a lot more about overclocking if you want to go to the extremes that you see in "The Extreme OC Clubhouse".

*How can I check what my computer is running at now?*
Try using CPU-Z. CPU-Z will let you look at all the fun little numbers that make your computer tick without running the risk of accidentally changing something.

*Okay! I'm confident that I know what I'm doing. Where do I change my FSB?*
Your FSB (and everything else to do with overclocking) is located in your BIOS. Be careful, though. There are a lot of settings in here that shouldn't be played with. Different motherboards will have the FSB in different places. If you can't find your FSB, it may be disabled from the BIOS. You can try asking people in the forums, but each BIOS is unique to their manufacturer. If all else fails, try using ClockGen. ClockGen runs inside Windows and can support a good range of motherboards.

If you have any questions, ask!


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## Jimmy 2004 (Jan 3, 2007)

Haven't read through it yet really but I don't think we have an overclocking guide so *I vote that this gets a sticky*. Remember to do your best to keep it up to date though. Also, in theory it isn't the FSB on AMD64 systems but as a general guide this should be ok.


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## JC316 (Jan 3, 2007)

This is a good versatile guide for overclocking all computers. Talk to a mod, or a super mod and request a sticky. It goes well with my AMD 64 specific guide. Good job!


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## xvi (Jan 3, 2007)

Jimmy 2004 said:


> Also, in theory it isn't the FSB on AMD64 systems but as a general guide this should be ok.



I hate to admit it, but I'm still stuck back in Socket-754-world. I just noticed that TPU had a lot of people flooding the OC forums asking how to overclock. I'm just trying to help keep the forums clean.


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## JC316 (Jan 3, 2007)

Thats the exact same reason I posted mine. With yours and mine, the OC traffic seems to have slowed down.


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## Jimmy 2004 (Jan 3, 2007)

xvi said:


> I hate to admit it, but I'm still stuck back in Socket-754-world. I just noticed that TPU had a lot of people flooding the OC forums asking how to overclock. I'm just trying to help keep the forums clean.



Nothing wrong with S754... I still use it myself! I personally would refer to it as FSB like you have but in reality I think it's called the hyper transport or something like that. Either way, as far as overclocking is concerned they work in a similar way.

Edit: my 754 board does call it FSB and I believe others do to but it is wrong


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## xvi (Jan 4, 2007)

Jimmy 2004 said:


> Nothing wrong with S754... I still use it myself! I personally would refer to it as FSB like you have but in reality I think it's called the hyper transport or something like that. Either way, as far as overclocking is concerned they work in a similar way.
> 
> Edit: my 754 board does call it FSB and I believe others do to but it is wrong



Eh.. I'm going to have to disagree slightly with you there. From what I understood, HyperTransport was the link between the CPU, Memory, Chipset, PCI-e/AGP. I suppose you're right in the sense that it replaced FSB as the link between these components, but it hasn't been eliminated. HyperTransport is based off of the system's FSB, after all.

I'm reading up on it over on Wikipedia. Isn't it just a beefed up Front Side Bus (emphasis on bus)?

Edit: From what I understand from Wikipedia, it's more of an enlarged bus that sort-of works on top of FSB, replacing the actual bus side.

Lets see if I can hotlink this image.




The HT link, as you say, replaces the FSB. But the HT link is still based off of the system's FSB. I suppose we're both right. Call it a draw?

P.S. I still love my S754 board, but I can't find any Athlons for it! Only Semprons.


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## rizzo (Jan 4, 2007)

Jimmy 2004 said:


> Haven't read through it yet really but I don't think we have an overclocking guide so *I vote that this gets a sticky*. Remember to do your best to keep it up to date though. Also, in theory it isn't the FSB on AMD64 systems but as a general guide this should be ok.



I vote if anything... cut and paste to the AMD sticky. The only mention of Intel was this "unbiased" statement. 





> What about Intel! Don't they have, like, 1GHz FSB?
> Those 800MHz FSB Prescott P4's actually run at 200MHz FSB. They say that the FSB is "Quad Pumped", which offers some advantage. It's mostly just marketing. It's sort of like HyperThreading. I believe that this is the same story with the "1GHz FSB" Intel processors.


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## xvi (Jan 4, 2007)

rizzo said:


> I vote if anything... cut and paste to the AMD sticky. The only mention of Intel was this "unbiased" statement.



 I never said it was unbiased. 

I'm not much of an Intel person, but I'm guessing Intel's "QuadPumped FSB" works the same as HT, correct? How do the Core 2 Duo's do it? I heard nVidia's Intel chipsets use HyperTransport.


Edit: The guide has been de-biased. I just didn't feel like writing the Intel section when I wrote it. It's a work in progress, right?


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## tkpenalty (Jan 4, 2007)

STICKY IT!!!  FSB is equivalent to HT speed; both just marketing rubbish.


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## 2THPIC (Jan 4, 2007)

yes, please sticky it.
Reading all the info has helped me understand a lot about o.c'ing. Considering that i'm still a virgen o.c'er. With all the info I feel that I could twek my system a little at a time to bring out the monster inside. Even tho i'm still on a socket A board. I'm willing to push it a little.
Hay, if all else fales a new board and cpu combo don't coast that much........right.


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## Deleted member 3 (Jan 4, 2007)

Jimmy 2004 said:


> Haven't read through it yet really but I don't think we have an overclocking guide so *I vote that this gets a sticky*. Remember to do your best to keep it up to date though. Also, in theory it isn't the FSB on AMD64 systems but as a general guide this should be ok.



I vote that we have a Wiki now for these things.


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## Darknova (Jan 14, 2007)

From what I understand (and I've read many articles on this) AMD boards have BOTH an FSB and the Hypertransport Link. The HT link connects the chipset (NB and SB) and the CPU together. The Front Side bus connects everything else, PCI, PCI-E, memory etc. The Hypertransport runs at a multiplier of the FSB just like the CPU does.

That is my understanding.


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## Gam'ster (Jan 14, 2007)

It's true to its word a beginners guide, sweet i shall read more as it comes   , not that i have a machine capable of O.C'ing , very intresting never the less lol.


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## Jimmy 2004 (Jan 14, 2007)

DanTheBanjoman said:


> I vote that we have a Wiki now for these things.



Surely the forums can still be used for guides? If people are looking for overclocking guides they'll probably come to the Overclocking and Cooling forum first. I can see where you're coming from, but I think if it's going to work like that all the guides that have been stickied should be moved to the Wiki and then unstickied so everything is in one place, rather than being dotted around. I don't mind copying a few of the guides into the Wiki sometime.


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## Scavar (Jan 15, 2007)

It's not a bad guide at all, I used its assistance in OCing my Sempron system. And even if you are using an Intel Processor, it still gives you the basics of how to go about OCing, or so it seems to me anyways.


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## freeboy (Feb 25, 2007)

In the bios setup for my system, 939 mobo amd fx 60.. it states I can have a multiplier from 13 to 25 but I cannot get to any values in the screan, what is up?


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## Jimmy 2004 (Feb 25, 2007)

freeboy said:


> In the bios setup for my system, 939 mobo amd fx 60.. it states I can have a multiplier from 13 to 25 but I cannot get to any values in the screan, what is up?



Is it an OEM system (ie from a company like Dell or HP)? They often lock the BIOS to prevent overclocking.


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## freeboy (Feb 25, 2007)

no it is a barebones ASYS mobo 939.. but I did get a fractional increase my second try by at oc'ing 205fsb


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## xvi (Feb 26, 2007)

freeboy said:


> no it is a barebones ASYS mobo 939.. but I did get a fractional increase my second try by at oc'ing 205fsb



If you can't find anything in your BIOS to change your multiplier, try searching google. Motherboards sometimes have "hidden settings" that can be unlocked by pressing ctrl+shift+F1, or some odd combination like that. If you still can't find it, your motherboard's manufacturer might have disabled it. Try upping the FSB 5 MHz at a time and like I say, watch your temperatures. If your motherboard really won't let you change your multiplier, then all you can really do is look for a better motherboard next time you build a computer.


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## freeboy (Feb 26, 2007)

yep, afterreading I found it, up to 14 playingwith the volts /fsb etc.. at one point was at 210 but now the sys will not allow me to set above 200! okk, I am stable at 205, no real need to oc, just having some fun...


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## Completely Bonkers (Feb 26, 2007)

I think we have too many stickies...

... as a matter of practice... I think stickies should move to the WIKI

P.S.
@16, thanks for putting the time into your post!


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## xvi (Feb 27, 2007)

Completely Bonkers said:


> @16, thanks for putting the time into your post!



It took me a while to figure out who "16" was. 
Thanks! Sometimes, I just like writing.


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## beck92 (Feb 27, 2007)

found out my bios was locked so i wanted to get a program that could oc fsb in windows.
i have an intel e6600 2,4 ghz processor and need my clock generator. i cant open the bos...my parents wont let me...stupid...well so i wondered does all processors of same model have same clock gen? i mean can a guy that has same processor as me check his clock gen and then i have same as he??? plz help me my bios is locked!!!


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## freeboy (Feb 27, 2007)

Will raising latencies on my Centron duel channel 1g chip, 2.5 3 3 7 help me push my very low 210 fsb higher?


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## xvi (Feb 27, 2007)

beck92 said:


> found out my bios was locked so i wanted to get a program that could oc fsb in windows.
> i have an intel e6600 2,4 ghz processor and need my clock generator. i cant open the bos...my parents wont let me...stupid...well so i wondered does all processors of same model have same clock gen? i mean can a guy that has same processor as me check his clock gen and then i have same as he??? plz help me my bios is locked!!!



The clock generator depends on the motherboard. You could try using ClockGen to change it from Windows. Most popular motherboards are supported. If you go too far, your computer will freeze. When you reset the computer, your FSB will be back to normal.

But whatever you do, *don't* unplug the computer and take out the battery for 10 seconds (and put it back in) because that *won't* reset the BIOS and it *won't* clear the password and it *won't* let you change the FSB. 
(If you're going to play around in the BIOS, make sure that you're really careful with what you change. These values won't reset when the computer restarts. If you change something and the computer won't turn on (and it might beep a lot too), unplug all the cables and pull the battery out again. The biggest thing you should absolutely not change is any voltages. Everything else shouldn't damage the computer. Also, your parents will know you've reset the BIOS if they try to go in it and find that there isn't a password.)



freeboy said:


> Will raising latencies on my Centron duel channel 1g chip, 2.5 3 3 7 help me push my very low 210 fsb higher?



Although you haven't told me much, it's probably your memory. Keep in mind that it could also be your processor. My Corsair XMS memory won't do over 207 at their rated 2-3-2-8 no matter how many volts I throw at it. I have to run them at 3-3-3-8 which lets me bring my FSB up around 240. I haven't tried 2.5-3-3-8 yet.

If your motherboard will let you set a memory divider, set the divider to 5/6 (or 166MHz) and try overclocking again. If you can't get a higher overclock, then your memory is probably not to blame. If you can get a higher overclock, you could try raising your latencies or keep the divider.


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## freeboy (Feb 28, 2007)

I am running an asus as 8 mobo, xp, 2 gig of Centron ram 2x1gig, a amd 64fx 60 proc.
500 wats pwr from an ultra. I just brought it to 210 by dropping to 100 Mgh and cranking up the latencies and volts, 2.8 ddr and 1.375 cpu. I do not have a bios "devider" but is not that the same as changing the speed of the chips down to 16 133 or 100?
my cpu temp also went up considerably.
Ok, dropped everything but the multiplier back to stck, looks like a good clean 1000 200 3338 14 with no change in volts. 400 on the chipps 200 is the setting! I was surprised buyt the 2.8 ghz until I looked and saw the multi still at 14! So does this point to a cpu issue or a mobo issue aor a chip issue? I think that at these setting running cool and stable.. seems a mobo issue.. odd though the mobo temps where pretty low? But what do I know, I started this only a few days ago! thanks all.


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## xvi (Feb 28, 2007)

freeboy said:


> I am running an asus as 8 mobo, xp, 2 gig of Centron ram 2x1gig, a amd 64fx 60 proc.


Okay. ClockGen should support that.


> 500 wats pwr from an ultra. I just brought it to 210 by dropping to 100 Mgh and cranking up the latencies and volts, 2.8 ddr and 1.375 cpu. I do not have a bios "devider" but is not that the same as changing the speed of the chips down to 16 133 or 100?


Yep. That's the divider. Try the "166" option.


> my cpu temp also went up considerably.


Increasing your voltage will do that.


> Ok, dropped everything but the multiplier back to stck, looks like a good clean 1000 200 3338 14 with no change in volts. 400 on the chipps 200 is the setting!


*Double *Data Rate. 200 MHz FSB = DDR-400


> I was surprised by the 2.8 ghz until I looked and saw the multi still at 14! So does this point to a cpu issue or a mobo issue aor a chip issue? I think that at these setting running cool and stable.. seems a mobo issue.. odd though the mobo temps where pretty low? But what do I know, I started this only a few days ago! thanks all.


Welll, some motherboards might not be able to handle anything over a certain FSB. Asus should be a pretty good brand to go with, though. What temperatures are you getting? You shouldn't be going over 55c. 60c is the absolute maximum you should be pushing.

Set everything to stock then set your memory to the "166" setting and try pushing up your FSB again. If it doesn't work, then it's not your memory. Set your memory back to stock and lower your CPU multiplier and try pushing up your FSB. If that doesn't work, it's not your processor. If neither of those do anything, check and make sure you have a PCI/AGP lock set. You could also try setting your CPU multiplier up a notch. If that works, your processor should be good. If it doesn't work, it might just be disabled and not mean anything.


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## freeboy (Feb 28, 2007)

ok the multi works see above.. will try your suggestions thanks ...
I am trying to keep temps below 50c per another thread.. is that too low? (on the cpu)
ok,, all at stock save the divider(166) and fsb up to 210 looks good. failed after 220 which was good at 225fsb
back to stock, dropped multi to twelve, have reached 225fsb.. does that mean the problem is the proc? the post above seem qiurky .. but like I said I am a super noob


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## freeboy (Feb 28, 2007)

what is a pci-e lock set?


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## xvi (Feb 28, 2007)

The lower your CPU temps the better. Lower temps make things last longer.

A PCI/AGP lock will make sure the FSB for the PCI/AGP cards does not change when you change your system FSB. For example, your PCI cards run at 33 MHz and AGP at 66 MHz. When you overclock, old motherboards will overclock your PCI and AGP cards too. Newer motherboards will lock the PCI/AGP card's frequencies so they're not affected by the overclock.

This would be good to add to the guide, come to think of it.


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## freeboy (Feb 28, 2007)

ok, I now am at 235 and lower multi to twelve.. so was my problem before that I did not use the auto set for volts and tried to use the multi a 14?.. seems the temps are cool too, I will set all to stck, then raise it and see


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## MrSeanKon (Feb 28, 2007)

tkpenalty said:


> FSB is equivalent to HT speed


Yes you are right.


tkpenalty said:


> both just marketing rubbish.


I agree  


xvi said:


> You could try using ClockGen to change it from Windows.


For further reading to all overclockers *Must have programs and links for overclockers herehttp://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=20251*


xvi said:


> The lower your CPU temps the better. Lower temps make things last longer.


I agree but this is a general approach in the beggining.
AMD crash temperature in OcBible explains this cos I have made a huge AMD database.
But this procedure is for advanced overclockers.
IMHO the thread helps


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## freeboy (Feb 28, 2007)

ok, what does this all mean then?
I was able to go up on teh FSB to 220 by changingthe devider.
I was ablle to go to 235 by lowering the multi to 12


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## freeboy (Feb 28, 2007)

best with multiple considerations, stable with all at stock 1 divider, 13 multi 1000 
at 220 fsb. Seems the mem is holding up, also cranked the volts.


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## MrSeanKon (Mar 2, 2007)

freeboy you mess me. I am not the creator of this thread but I will try to help you.
I think you don't know some of the basics ----> *download Guidemania* and you should post more info for your problem.
12*235=2820 MHz thus your CPU limit seems to be around 2.8GHz.
But are you sure that your RAM is stable there???
What's your timings and Vdimm??
You can increase Vcore but avoid high temps (especially above 50 Celsius).


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## freeboy (Mar 2, 2007)

I am stable in the 220 fsb range at 13 multi on my sys amd 64 fx 60
asus mobo 2gig ram.. only able to increase fsb by lowering the multiplier to twelve. changing the timings 2.5 337 or 3338 higher had no noticable effects.I my memory stable, passes sandra burn in and I am using 60 c as my do not pass temp, pushed 48-50 in burn in.
So changing the htfrom 1000 to 800 no effects. changing the ration, ie 166 133 on the chips settigs in bios does not add higher fsb. The only way I have reached past 230 fsb is the lowering of the cpu multiplier. I have an old version asus bord that supports pci e. But I think my bottleneck is my board. thanks  any insights welcom, temps now stable , low thirty c rang at idle and mid forties under game stress all stock settings for htt and chips fsb at 220 and volts increased to chips and cpu. The one item I could not verify was the freq lock mentioned above for the pci e card. Bios settings for this are "auto", "33" and some higher ones, I am leaving it on auto. 
If anyone knows a way past my mobo, or other issue to add fsb speed that would be great, I am sure the cpu will push 3000 3100 range, and the chips seem to be ok, although I know of know way to directly test them. I did as instructed above without clear results.
Fyi my volts for the cpu are limited in theBios to 1.4 cranked the mem to 2.9 though


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## xvi (Mar 4, 2007)

freeboy said:


> ok, what does this all mean then?
> I was able to go up on teh FSB to 220 by changingthe devider.
> I was ablle to go to 235 by lowering the multi to 12



Did you have your memory divider enabled when you lowered the multiplier? That actually wouldn't make much sense if you didn't. It sounds like your memory is the first thing holding you back and your processor is the second thing. You might just have a bad processor.



freeboy said:


> I am stable in the 220 fsb range at 13 multi.
> I my memory stable, passes sandra burn in and I am using 60 c as my do not pass temp, pushed 48-50 in burn in.
> So changing the htfrom 1000 to 800 no effects.
> changing the ratio, ie 166 133 on the chips settigs in bios does not add higher fsb.
> The only way I have reached past 230 fsb is the lowering of the cpu multiplier.


Ah. So it sounds like it's your processor. You might just have a bad one. Better luck next time.


> The one item I could not verify was the freq lock mentioned above for the pci e card. Bios settings for this are "auto", "33" and some higher ones, I am leaving it on auto.


Most newer boards lock it automatically. One way you could check is to overclock your computer slightly and load up ClockGen in Windows and check the frequencies in there. If they're off, you know it's not locked. You could always try setting it to "33".


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## freeboy (Mar 5, 2007)

so what exactluy is happening when my very cool mobo and cpu will not boot?(from oc) Is it failing some sort of self check?


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## xvi (Mar 5, 2007)

freeboy said:


> so what exactluy is happening when my very cool mobo and cpu will not boot?(from oc) Is it failing some sort of self check?



Basically. Every time your computer boots, it performs a POST (Power On Self Test). The result of that test is reported with a BIOS beep code. A single, short beep means that everything is OK. Any beep code besides that means the POST completed with errors. No beep (and no video usually) means that the POST did not complete at all.

When your computer is pushed past it's limits, it starts mixing up it's 1's and 0's. That's why you'll sometimes see a Blue Screen Of Death (BSOD) when your computer crashes. Too many 1's and 0's got themselves jumbled up and it caused a ton of errors. Windows decided to shut itself down to protect your computer (and loose all your work). It's also why the POST won't complete.

Some motherboards (such as my DFI LanParty UT) will automatically reset themselves after a failed POST and will boot again at normal settings. The BIOS will have all your old settings in it so you can decrease your FSB and try again. I'm not sure how many boards do this.


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## Kneichion (Mar 5, 2007)

*Overclocking*

Hi All, i have been in IT for many years, Its time for me to  take that next step Overclocking.
I have just printed off the above and will read carefully.
What i have found so far is an awful amount of assumtion that you know what things mean and even worse abriviations.
My new computer is sitting next to me awaiting its new power supply, Hmm we we learn, My new Old Zalman dosent have the power or the plugs to boot up my New Asus Crosshair, So the Brand new Coolermaster 850pro should be with me tommorrow, Its going to be drafty with the NZXT Zero Case with all the many fans. I have gone for an AMD Dual core 5000.
2g of OCz 800mg DDR2. Asus EN7900GS PCI-16. all Drives are Sata 2. And Zalman clooler flowers. First Job is get it running stable then look at how to safely overclock.
I would like to take the 2600 cpu to a 3G.
My objective its for the system to keep up with what i am doing, fast as possible, i dont have any great graphic loads yet but some video edding at some point.
So all being well the birth of a new machine tommorrow if the Coolermaster 850 pro turns up.
So far i have read the manual for the crosshair back to front, I havent a clue with most the settings, I need a manual to explain what they do and why they are needed.

To be fair i have to read what looks excellent above before i ask any questions.
What puzzels me is the board is rated at 2000mhz yet in over clocking it talks about 365.
Still let me read and try and understand, I need to get my head round the maths.
As i said my target is 3g is that too much? from a 266 dual core X2 64 cpu?
In the mean time, any links or advice would be welcome.


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## xvi (Mar 6, 2007)

Kneichion said:


> Hi All, i have been in IT for many years, Its time for me to  take that next step Overclocking.
> I have just printed off the above and will read carefully.
> What i have found so far is an awful amount of assumtion that you know what things mean and even worse abriviations.
> 
> ...



Sorry! I tried to keep most abbreviations out of it (or at least keep them explained).
Remember that usually an abbreviation is typed out then abbreviated in parenthesis.
Come to think of it, I'll *add a vocabulary section*. (It's bold so I'll easily see it later)

The 2,000 MHz you're thinking about is the HyperTransport Link speed. Your processor's FSB is most likely going to be around 200 or 266 FSB. Remember that we have a HyperTransport Multiplier that brings this up to 2,000 MHz. I'm not familiar with the Socket AM2 Athlon series, but I can only assume they run at 266 FSB (Nevermind, you just said it above).

As for your question about how far you can expect to overclock, I've heard that most people expect about 15% extra out of most processors. I was able to get nearly 20% on my Socket 754 Sempron. I was able to add 400 MHz to my base of 2.0 GHz. On my roommate's Sempron (My old Sempron), I was able to add a little over 600 MHz.
To answer your question directly, I would expect about 400 MHz extra out of your Athlons and wouldn't be surprised to see them higher. Check the extreme overclocking competitions to see some lucky people with lucky processors. You could probably aim somewhere around there.
I was worried that your memory would hold you back, but OCz is a good brand to go with. Besides, it doesn't look like you went with the cheap stuff. You should be good to go.

I'll look over the guide for any unexplained terminology. I'm making a mental list of things to change and I'll give it a good revision when I have a little more time on my hands (It's my mother's birthday tomorrow. No time then!)


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## Kneichion (Mar 7, 2007)

*Urgent Help needed*

Thank you for your last post, all is helpul. I am wiser reading the clocking.
I wont go into the crosshair South and north settings on the crosshair. Humm

I had a form for years and this probably isnt the place to ask, so bare with me please.
I got to this forum Via the article i read.

Same spec almost, and it said i could not install the SATA but with experience got round it.

I wont go into what i have had to do today a whole day.

Keeping in simple, I have a brand new SATA 2 300g rate, formatted installed the F6 drivers Via the DVD (Not CD rom) fun when your stripping down your old PC.
To a Floppy, installed and when it came to run the XP i had the old NTLDR missing crap?
I had this on my old system thats why i always used an IDE drive to boot from.
I cant belive in this age and all 100% new A list components that i have had to spend a whole day, useing every trick i know just to get a boot from WIN XP.
In the end i have had to use my old IDE drive just to get this post up.

For goodness sake why will it not take a SATA drive for a boot drive, why keep loosing the NTldr file, had my old machine for 5 years, in 2007 why has it not changed???

All my install files have come up with FATAL error messages. Not very good when you have spent $2000 on all new components beliving you will fix all the old problems, only for them to be all the same.
I cant blame the hardware as its all brand new??

Not even got to the clocking yet!

Please some one advise how i can get a SATA drive Working on the crosshair, Its a brand new 250g SATA 2 drive, USed Crosshair to make the Floppy for the drivers.
So far the system is running very badly as bad as the old computer.
Not a happy bunny today, I know i will crack it, but need some wise words.


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## freeboy (Mar 7, 2007)

Continuing on my posts from above..

Couldthe issue be not a bad cpu but under vot? as my mobo litmits v to 1.4?


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## xvi (Mar 7, 2007)

freeboy said:


> Continuing on my posts from above..
> 
> Couldthe issue be not a bad cpu but under vot? as my mobo litmits v to 1.4?



It's odd that it only limits you to 1.4 volts. What's the stock voltage? Does it give you the option to add voltage in percentage? For example, 1.4 volts and then a setting saying "VID * 110%". From what I understand, this means 1.4 volts idle and 1.54 volts under load, although from what I've seen, it simply adds the 110% no matter what.


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## xvi (Mar 7, 2007)

Kneichion said:


> Please some one advise how i can get a SATA drive Working on the crosshair, Its a brand new 250g SATA 2 drive, USed Crosshair to make the Floppy for the drivers.
> So far the system is running very badly as bad as the old computer.
> Not a happy bunny today, I know i will crack it, but need some wise words.



Hmm.. This is a problem with the motherboard or hard drive specifically so I don't think I'll be able to answer it. I'll try, though.

Are you using the same Windows XP disk to install? Try borrowing a friends CD and use your own serial number/CD Key.
Did you have any other hard drives in your computer? Any that you took out? Any external drives?
I had a similar problem. I had a USB flash drive plugged in to my computer when I installed Windows XP last time. Windows put the NTLDR, and other system files on the USB drive, and installed Windows on to my hard drive (even though I had selected the hard drive). When I removed the USB drive, I could no longer boot since NTLDR was now gone.
When installing Windows XP, I highly recommend that you unplug any extra flash drives, flash cards, external hard drives, and internal hard drives.. except the one you're installing Windows on. This will make sure both NTLDR and the Windows folder are installed to the correct locations.

Windows will look at the boot priorities of your computer and install NTLDR and other similar files to the *first boot drive*. SATA drives often come last. If you have any PATA (aka: IDE) drives, Windows will see those first and install NTLDR to the first drive on the list. The order goes something like this. 

1: USB
2: IDE/PATA
3: SATA (and SATA II)
4: SCSI
5: RAID
6: Anything that you had to install drivers from a floppy for. (I think)
(USB might come second or third. I'm not sure. I know it's before RAID, though. Especially when you have to install your own drivers.)

And tell me if I understand you correctly. You had an old computer that would loose the NTLDR file after a while, and now you're having the same problem?
If this doesn't answer your question, it may be a software problem. Even if it's not, it would be better to ask this in a different section of the forum. Good luck!


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## freeboy (Mar 7, 2007)

yep, no setting other than "manual" or auto.. the auto overclock SUX,
manual no other volts modifier..and since it is such a cheap old board, bios 2005 I was hoping ot find a new bios or other fix, I am sure in my own mind it is a mobo issue.. that 1.4 thing if nothing else.
It is a asus A8S-x 939 pci-e  board. Anybody know of any bettter board for reletively cheap?
Must use ddr as I have 2 duel channel 1 gig sticks?
Or some way to tweek an asus BIOS


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## Kneichion (Mar 7, 2007)

*Problems*

I have a huge experience of computers and for my sins worked in a corporate company looking after 18 units accross a campus. Stress we wont go there lol

I didnt have any problems with my old pc as i used an IDE as i could not get sata drives to boot, same problem as i have now.

I set the bios to standard install and it let me put in my old boot drive with XP. Its all messed up tho, so next i try the above and remove all the other hard drives as i have loads.
It was a work of art wiring up this system. Normal PC's i do all the time and is easy.
My computer is never simple.

I always manage to find a way around things some how, going to do a search on the net see if i can find any articles on SATA problems with ASUS boards.  

One thing i have had a brief play with is the AI Nos, very simple to play with and when it over clocks the machine it comes alive and gives the kind of responce i am looking for, I am not the fastest person out there, but i do want the comp to keep up with me.
I over clocked it to over 3g with out a problem at all, so its looking hopefull.
The DDR2 OCz ram overclocked again not a sniff of a problem it came up as 5.5.5.15 wich i belive may be good, still learning, Not played with Volts yet.
First job is to get a system working sharp and clean.
So lets see how things go, I hope its not another stress filled day.
Anyway many thanks for your help


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## MrSeanKon (Mar 8, 2007)

freeboy said:


> passes sandra burn in


Man don't be confused it is a total different the *burn-in process* and system stability.
You must check your system using e.g. SuperPi 32M (not very sensitive for Intel CPUs but good for RAM) or Prime95/StressPrime 2004, OCCT S&M (very good for AMD owners).
You may post some screen captures of your BIOS cos I also have ASUS mainboard and I have not seen +VID everywhere (this option is common for DFIs).


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## freeboy (Mar 8, 2007)

right, I do realize there is a difference between stability and burn in, at 220fsb these are my settings
1000
220fsb
200 So the memory is running faster 
1:1 ratio 
13 cpu multiplier
1.4 v on the cpu
2.8 von the mem
mid 2800s mghz should easily hit low 3000's
so the issue is this as best research idicates..
AND PLEASE do not say I need to lower the devider etc, perhaaps in teh future with the mem stressed, but now everything is Super stable rock solid and a nice little 11% increase or so.

The issue is the ASUS older A* series was poorly designed, they had a known issue and these where "dumpped"
I cannot find one thread in any of 6 power up tyrp forums for this board A8S-x.. like it never was released but several other a8 models including a thread about ASUS not supporting volts over 1.4 for the CPU. 

So I called Asus support, they basically told me to screw, they would not help me and they do nopt support there own features!
NEVER EVER will I get anything from them, I cannot return the board to the place tha sold it to me, although I will call them, because the board is working, no defects just shitty design.

Rant over, and I know Asus provides some good boards, but integrety says if you have a bad design u do not dump it on an unsuspecting public! ok now rant over!

Spoke to another knowledgables Asus techrep, sho then sent me to the VM of their BIOS expert, finger crossed, but at this point have read enough to see next board will be a DFI UT Ultra-D if issue with ASUS A8S-x note resolved. thanks again guys


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## MrSeanKon (Mar 9, 2007)

freeboy you have *this mainboard????*
I try to download the manual just to see if it has any photos of BIOS photos but the server there is very slow.
That's why I said above _post screen captures of your BIOS_


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## Glitched System (Mar 11, 2007)

<deleted>


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## freeboy (Mar 11, 2007)

Thanks for attempted the help Shaun, looks like the bios power is locked/limited to 1.4.. the memory seems to be doing very well, I am returningthe board to Tigerdirect as a non satisfactory working board at their suggustion! AMAZING cutomer support on their part.. getting an asus a8n 32 sli delux. only issue I may need to tweek my HUGE ultra xwind due to the unique passive cooling asus has adopted for this board near the cpu


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## freeboy (Mar 16, 2007)

ok, new mobo a8n32slidlx works wonderfully, too good, I already tried to cook my system with all the volt adg lol.. was wondering why things where so hot, went form Idle at 31 c to close to 50 oops!


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## D007 (Mar 28, 2007)

One thing you should all keep in mind that has saved me many a heart ache when your bios stalls and it will stall lol.. 

(Remember the jumper).. the little blue chip that you can pull off the 3 prongs i assume it's typically along the botom of the MoBo.. you just take the jumper off the 2 prongs it's coveing and switch it to cover the other prong it wasnt covering and one of the ones it was.. it will reset your bios..


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## xvi (May 3, 2007)

D007 said:


> One thing you should all keep in mind that has saved me many a heart ache when your bios stalls and it will stall lol..
> 
> (Remember the jumper).. the little blue chip that you can pull off the 3 prongs i assume it's typically along the botom of the MoBo.. you just take the jumper off the 2 prongs it's coveing and switch it to cover the other prong it wasnt covering and one of the ones it was.. it will reset your bios..



Just remember to unplug the power cord and to put the jumper back where it was before you turn your computer back on!


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## MGrant1957 (Nov 1, 2007)

Quote from thr "guide" up front :
What if you just raise the CPU Multiplier?
Lets say I raise it to 11.
CPU:
200 FSB times 11 = 2,100MHz, or 2.1GHz.

correct me if I'm wrong, but 200 times 11=2200 or 2.2Ghz

Also, just to clear things up a bit.... the HT link is a high speed 16-bit serial link between CPU cores on a dual-core chip. it allows the two cores to communicate at high speed ON CHIP without having to go out past the L1 cache or L2 cache to go through the FSB. The HT link also connects the Cores to communicate with the PCI-e x16 video slots at 2.1GB/s in each direction. It is also used to connect 2 or 4 or 8 CPUs together in multi-chip systems.


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## freeboy (Nov 1, 2007)

ok, so what is the best setting to have this on?


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## xvi (Nov 2, 2007)

MGrant1957 said:


> Quote from thr "guide" up front :
> What if you just raise the CPU Multiplier?
> Lets say I raise it to 11.
> CPU:
> ...



Read your question wrong the first time around. Sorry. You're right. I was trying to show two ways to get the same frequency with two examples. I must of written it too fast. Thanks.

As a side note, many processors have the CPU multiplier locked (or at least to any multiplier higher than stock) so increasing performance via CPU Multiplier might not be an option for most. Also, it seems to be popular to drop your multiplier down and increase FSB to widen the buses and increase memory bandwidth without setting a divider.

Unfortunately, this is only a guide and not a walkthrough.

Edit: Couple more errors fixed. Cleared up the HyperTransport section slightly.


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## MGrant1957 (Nov 2, 2007)

*a few sugestions....*

I knew going in that I was going to be overclocking so I bought 2 1GIG sticks of Corsair's great/cheap stuff the Twinx2048-4000PT sticks. these are rated at 250MHz with timings of 3-3-3-8-1t with just 2.7v. using these I can just set the HT multi to 4, crank the FSB/MEM up to 250 and the CPU stays at 2.0GHZ as well and keeping the HT set at the default 1000MHz. 
I have the lower model of that board, the A8N SLI Deluxe. nice board, but I dont think it will OC as well as a DFI Lanparty. but it does have support for  4 SATA150s and 4 SATA300s. I'm using an Athlon 64 X2 3800+. On stock HSF I have been able to push it up to 2.6GHz stable. with the water I'm shooting for 3GHz+ but I don't think I'll get that high.  CPU @1.35v and MEM @2.75v. 
the problem is that the CPU won't let me up the Multiplier, I CAN lower it. but so far I havn't been able to get the mem much higher than 270 without crashing.

any other sugestions?


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## xvi (Nov 2, 2007)

The CPU speed isn't (or shouldn't be) based off the HT speed. You're trying to run 250MHz FSB and keep the stock CPU speed? I'd try setting the HT multi to 4x anyways, lower your CPU multi to match. I'm guessing it's the the 3800+ 2.0GHz and it's running 200x10. If you want stock CPU speed while taking advantage of memory write speeds, 250 FSB at 8x multi will hit your stock 2000MHz mark.

Your stock HT speed (according to amdcompare.com) should be 2000MHz.

AMD has locked higher multipliers to prevent resellers from upping the multiplier and selling the processor as a higher model. The lower multipliers are unlocked for PowerNow! support. (I think Intel is the same. Not completely sure.)

Umm.. Suggestions.. Suggestions. Are you sure it's your memory? (CPU multi down and OC till it breaks). I'd set your CPU multi to 8x, HT multi to 4x, and max OC again. (..if you haven't already). That should put the most stress on your memory and hopefully give you a definite answer on what exactly is breaking. It could be your motherboard limiting you too. It's hard to say sometimes.


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## MikeJeng (Apr 6, 2008)

It's a bit confusing.



Can I just raise my FSB without changing the voltage?

I have a Q9450 and a P5E motherboard.


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## farlex85 (Apr 6, 2008)

You can definately raise the fsb without changing the voltage, its just a matter of how much they will handle on stock. Your nb will need some extra voltage to get to high fsbs (over 400) and your vcore will need a little more to handle higher proc speeds that come from higher fsb. Then mem voltages and the like may need to be tweaks to get your strap stable.


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## MikeJeng (Apr 7, 2008)

Hmn... lol.



How about... 435fsb X 8 without any voltage changes?


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## xvi (Apr 7, 2008)

MikeJeng said:


> Hmn... lol.
> 
> 
> 
> How about... 435fsb X 8 without any voltage changes?



You just have to try. If it doesn't work, go down until you find a speed that does, then add a little voltage and see if you can get any higher.

Edit: The proper way to do it is to start at stock and increment 5-10 FSB at a time. When you find your limit, try to figure out what component is causing the limit. If it's your CPU, you have a few options.

1: Make the CPU colder. Overclock more.
2: Increase the voltage. Overclock more.
3: Go down a few FSB and accept this as your top speed.

If it's your memory, your options are..

1: Set a memory divider. Overclock more.
2: Relax your memory timings. Overclock more.
3: Replace your memory with higher rated memory. Overclock more.
4: (Only for when you don't plan to overclock your CPU any higher) Lower the FSB slightly and increase your CPU multiplier.

If it's your motherboard, the only two options I can think of are..

1: Check and relax BIOS settings. Overclock more.
2: Get a new motherboard. Overclock more.


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## MikeJeng (Apr 7, 2008)

How much should I increase voltage?



"Eye HERD IT wuz deng-gerous"


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## xvi (Apr 8, 2008)

MikeJeng said:


> How much should I increase voltage?
> "Eye HERD IT wuz deng-gerous"



It *is* dangerous. You can try +0.1 volt and see if you can get higher. If that works, maybe try +0.2.

Voltage is a little different than FSB in the sense that when you go to high with your FSB, you just reset the BIOS and try again. If you go too high with your voltage, you go back to the store and buy a new processor... and try again.


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## dipsta (Aug 29, 2008)

i've been educated thanks


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## MGrant1957 (Aug 30, 2008)

*Been a long time since I've been in here so...*

here's the update:

New Processor is an Opty 185
New RAM is 2GB of Corsair Twinx-2048-4400PRO DDR550
New watercooling system includes:
water blocks for CPU, SB, motherboard VRM, both 7800GTX cards, 
both VGA VRMs, and 2 custom backside RAM blocks for the backside RAM on the
video cards. 2 2x120 blackice pro radiators, DD12vD5 pump with 1/2 inch tubing
on the cpu, SB, and GPUs, with 1/4 inch on all 3 VRMs and teh backside VGA-RAM

stock CPU settings is 200x13 for 2.6GHz, I'm hoping to get 3.2GHz
from what I've read, this RAM tops out around 280MHz
and the video cards run stock at 460 and 650 core/mem, I still have to see how far
I can push them on water.

what I really want to do is through in a few peltiers... on the CPU... the VGA chips...
and maybe the VGA RAM and SB though I dont think it will to much good on the SB.

any ideas????


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## xvi (Aug 30, 2008)

MGrant1957 said:


> here's the update:
> 
> New Processor is an Opty 185
> New RAM is 2GB of Corsair Twinx-2048-4400PRO DDR550
> ...



If you're going to go to all that trouble, you might as well just do water cooling instead. Peltiers can be dangerous.

RAM isn't going to get very hot and nor will the southbridge. GPU RAM will get hot, but there isn't much reward in cooling it. If you're going to go to extreme cooling methods, it would only be worth it for CPU and possibly GPU. RAM needs nothing more than a heatspreader and possibly a fan.


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## MGrant1957 (Aug 31, 2008)

*did you read the last post?*

It IS water cooled.... 2 radiators and 9 water blocks.

what I'm wondering is weather putting peltiers on the GPU and VRAM will give me that much of a boost in framerate. And will putting small peltiers on the VRAM will help with overclocking the VRAM a noticible amount.

I've got peltiers for both GPUs and all 16 Memory chips on the VGA cards.
Will a 127W peltier be enough for the GPUs?
Will 8W/3.3v peltiers be enough for the RAM chips on the VGA cards?
and how much additiional radiarot will I need to cool all of that?

thanks.


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## CDdude55 (Sep 3, 2008)

What if i want to OC just my CPU. So all i would need to do is raise the Multiplier? But what if the highest it can go is 10x(which is the default for my Core 2 Duo E4400)?


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## xvi (Sep 3, 2008)

I did read the last post, but it seems that you have not attempted an overclock on your current cooling system. Because of that, I assumed that it was either recently installed, not installed or not yet ordered.

I'm no water cooling expert (and barely a novice), but I'm not so sure that adding extra radiarot would help cooling at all.

The peltiers themselves won't increase or decrease your frame rate. The only thing they will do is bring your temps down so you can increase voltage and clock speed even more (which would bring your temps back up).
Otherwise... Yes, I would imagine that adding a peltier to your GPU would let you overclock more. No, I do not think adding peltiers to your GPU memory will help all that much.

I would worry less on the wattage of the peltier and more on the efficiency of the water block. If the peltier spits out heat faster than the block can take it in, it might trap heat between the block and the core. If I recall correctly, even a 1 watt peltier would move a small amount of heat and lower your temperatures (although it would do so ever so slightly). Does anyone else agree, or would I be wrong to state that adding a, say, 50 watt peltier to a 50 watt processor would give 100 watts of heat?

If it's extreme cooling you want, you might as well look in to compressor cooling. 

Also, this might not be the appropriate place to ask these types of questions as this is "A Beginner's Guide to Overclocking". What you're talking about is a bit more advanced.

Honestly, I would see how far of an overclock you can manage on just water cooling alone. It sounds like you have a fairly nice cooling system as it is and I don't think you've said you've overclocked on it yet.


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## xvi (Sep 3, 2008)

CDdude55 said:


> What if i want to OC just my CPU. So all i would need to do is raise the Multiplier? But what if the highest it can go is 10x(which is the default for my Core 2 Duo E4400)?



Raising your multiplier is one option. Since your multiplier is most likely locked at 10, you would have to rely on raising your FSB. Remember that FSB times your Multiplier equals your clock speed. Also remember that raising your FSB raises everything attached to it (Memory, chipset, etc). On older motherboards, the PCI and AGP bus are also influenced by the FSB. Most, if not all, newer motherboards have the expansion buses locked to their original values.


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## xvi (Oct 12, 2008)

dsouza said:


> that"s cool But what if the highest it can go is 10x(which is the default for my Core 2 Duo E4400)?



That means your CPU multiplier is locked. Almost all of today's processors have a locked multiplier. This makes it harder for a dishonest company to take a slower processor and advertise and sell it as a faster processor (since the only difference between some processors is simply the CPU multiplier).

You will have to rely on raising your Front Side Bus (FSB) from the default 200 FSB to something higher. If you'd like, you can try starting with 210 FSB (for a very simple 5% overclock). If your computer does not boot, you will need to find the reset jumper and/or remove the BIOS battery from your computer.
You might need to consult your motherboard's manual for the location and proper operation of the BIOS Reset Jumper (and/or BIOS battery) as well as how to properly change your FSB.


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## xp0zed (Nov 8, 2008)

Ok i've currently clocked my pc to 4.2ghz on my core 2 duo e8500 using 433x9.5 and jacked my vcore to 1.36 problem is while im booting into windows its really slow for some reason.. takes time to load programs and stuff.

It also says i have 1 Core? lol here is screenshot..


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## xvi (Nov 10, 2008)

xp0zed said:


> Ok i've currently clocked my pc to 4.2ghz on my core 2 duo e8500 using 433x9.5 and jacked my vcore to 1.36 problem is while im booting into windows its really slow for some reason.. takes time to load programs and stuff.
> 
> It also says i have 1 Core? lol here is screenshot..



That's.... odd.

Remember that your FSB is also tied to your Northbridge. This may cause errors. Go to CPUID and download PerfMon. Check for things like "L1 Data Cache Success Rate" and the same with anything else that says "Success rate". (You may do so by clicking one of the four graphs and choosing from the list that pops up.)

I'm not familiar with Intel boards, but down near the bottom, it should say something about "something-something bandwidth". That will hopefully not be maxed out when you stress your system (example, a game or a benchmark/stress-test utility).

If you're still having problems, try making your own thread not many people will see your post here.


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## Charper2013 (Dec 13, 2008)

Great Post!


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## Aristaqis (Sep 26, 2009)

*Current Information?*

Hi, I came across this post and would like to know if it is still considered current, and if not where I might find a more up to date guide.

Thank you


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## twilyth (Sep 27, 2009)

Aristaqis said:


> Hi, I came across this post and would like to know if it is still considered current, and if not where I might find a more up to date guide.
> 
> Thank you



I did a search (overclocking guide -> then click options -> click 'recent results') and found

Core2's:  http://forums.overclockersclub.com/index.php?showtopic=71656

Phenoms:  http://forums.guru3d.com/showthread.php?t=267708

i7:  http://www.clunk.org.uk/forums/overclocking/22106-core-i7-overclocking-guide-beginners.html


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## xvi (Oct 4, 2009)

Aristaqis said:


> Hi, I came across this post and would like to know if it is still considered current, and if not where I might find a more up to date guide.
> 
> Thank you



It's more of a "generic" guide that helps you understand more of what's actually happening inside your computers. A Phenom will clock up differently than a Core 2. An nVidia chipset will be more or less finicky than an AMD or Intel chipset, etc. This guide is more of a starting point.

Good luck!


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## benzedirk2012 (Mar 17, 2011)

*Easy tune 6*



Jimmy 2004 said:


> Surely the forums can still be used for guides? If people are looking for overclocking guides they'll probably come to the Overclocking and Cooling forum first. I can see where you're coming from, but I think if it's going to work like that all the guides that have been stickied should be moved to the Wiki and then unstickied so everything is in one place, rather than being dotted around. I don't mind copying a few of the guides into the Wiki sometime.



can you please help me over clock my machine....I am stuck at the FSB part...new at overclocking and new to the forms.the fsb is at 200 mhz..Check out my configuration on my machine.Thanks =)


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## michaeltyson (Apr 5, 2011)

I have been looking for a nice guide to start overclocking with! Thanks so much! definately a very useful guide. =D


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## BMarqa (May 28, 2011)

Good illustration


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## Mobo friyer (Nov 29, 2011)

thanks for the guides...


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## roderickpaulate (Feb 1, 2012)

What a simple helpful guide! Thanks


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## Yo_Wattup (Feb 1, 2012)




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## yoknipas (Sep 7, 2012)

this thread is good for beginner


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## hitclub (Oct 13, 2012)

How long i need to test the proc with prime to be sure that oc is stable ?


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## Wells (Oct 18, 2012)

Haven't read through it yet really but I don't think we have an overclocking guide


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## Bo$$ (Oct 18, 2012)

Wells said:


> Haven't read through it yet really but I don't think we have an overclocking guide



Check first page of this thread :shadedshu


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## MrSeanKon (Nov 23, 2012)

hitclub said:


> How long i need to test the proc with prime to be sure that oc is stable ?


It's up to you.
Well *check this old poll* at PcPer forum.
Generally speaking you should run OCCT or Prime95 (or your tester of your choice) at *least* for one hour.


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## Hawaiis_Finest (Feb 11, 2013)

Bo$$ said:


> Check first page of this thread :shadedshu



I just did - still would like some advice, as I'm a total newbie to this stuff.


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## Calle2003 (Nov 13, 2018)

xvi said:


> I never said it was unbiased.
> 
> I'm not much of an Intel person, but I'm guessing Intel's "QuadPumped FSB" works the same as HT, correct? How do the Core 2 Duo's do it? I heard nVidia's Intel chipsets use HyperTransport.
> 
> ...


You're not much of an Intel person, still you have an Intel laptop now, time changes eh?  Ontopic: this is a useful guide to my older computers which now are retro...


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## GoldenX (Nov 13, 2018)

Nice necropost.


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## Calle2003 (Nov 14, 2018)

GoldenX said:


> Nice necropost.


Thanks, last time I logged in to TPU before today was the year 2012 so...


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## xvi (Nov 16, 2018)

The original post started out as a reply to a question in another thread (which definitely contributed to its less-than-neutral wording) and grew to the point where I thought it would do better on its own. Rizzo was very correct to point out that a guide like this should be unbiased especially considering there was talk of it being stickied.

The times do indeed change. Back in 2007, I chose AMD because I was concerned about price/performance with an emphasis on price. These days, my finances, priorities, and undeniably maturity sit somewhere closer to where I'm more concerned with what-can-I-cram-in-a-laptop/performance and power bill/performance. The beauty of both manufacturers is in the variety these two giants provide so that we, the consumers, have the power of choice. Something I was admittedly more blind to originally.


It appears this is going to end up being a brief addendum to the original post since I keep tacking on more and more outside the topic of the recent messages.
Looking over this guide, a lot of it still seems to apply, just a bit of the terminology has changed. I'm less in touch with the world of overclocking these days, but looking at modern architecture should provide some insights. I'll compare to my Team Blue CPU, the Intel i7-6700K, and reference this nice article on wikichip.org which documents the Skylake architecture and lists what they're referring to as clock domains.

FSB can basically be interchanged with BCLK, something true at the time of writing for the original article as well. This is, as I understand it, still used as a primary clock reference for many sub-systems (memory, PCI-E clock, etc).
CPU speed, referenced above, is commonly referred to as core clock or core speed and is the main spec of a processor.
Intel's QPI and AMD's HyperTransport can be interchanged with Ring for modern Intels and, apparently, Infinity Fabric on modern AMDs. This provides the heavy lifting of internal data transfers between your PC's main components (CPU to PCIe bus, for example).
Memory clock speed hasn't changed much at all, although the formulas for the ratings have. In the scope of overclocking, I wouldn't recommend worrying about much other than the speed in MHz since memory ratings change between physical generations and (generally) cannot be swapped out.

The primary purpose of this guide was to answer some of the basic questions of overclocking and provoke new questions deeper into the field. I was and still am thrilled to see it has helped. Happy tweaking!


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## azls73 (May 18, 2022)

GRADE A GUIDE !!
Cheers !!


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