# Aiming for a new AMD PC setup for about $/€1800, plus-minus, but I kindly need some help and advice to get the right parts...



## winterwonderland (Nov 24, 2021)

With Black Friday upcoming and my current PC is not doing its job that well any longer, as it is being overly slow and troublesome when it comes to loading etc. + I cannot play any of the new games that I wanna play because of the specs being bad and whatnot + it's about time to get myself a new PC. This time, I am going for an AMD-setup, and it would be great if it would last for a few years, like 5+ years or so. But, I do not need ALL the parts, as I do have some parts available, such as: monitors (I have 4 available), case (FD R6), power supply (I have a G3 650W now), Noctua-fans in various sizes, mouse and a keyboard. I do need the following parts, however:
- CPU
- CPU cooler
- Graphics card
- Memory
- Motherboard
- SSD
- Power supply

I will use my PC primarily for these things, so it should perform these tasks without any issues:
- Livestreaming and streams (running various streaming programs and other apps in the background)
- Multitasking (I stream while I do other things/projects such as web designing)
- Photo + Video rendering + editing (my current PC takes a long time to perform these tasks, to be honest)
- Light gaming (NO FPS. Mostly sports, RPG, adventure and action games. I am NOT picky when it comes to running all games at max performance/quality etc.)

With Black Friday coming up, I am going to scout for some options, but this time, my budget is about $/€1800, plus-minus.

Any thoughts on a setup that would deal with my tasks nicely?

PS: Look at my listed PC specs for my current setup, if that matters...


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 24, 2021)

Well 5800x CPU for sure.


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## Nike_486DX (Nov 25, 2021)

i suggest to think twice about the gpu, with today's market situation you would only afford maybe a 3060 at best (which is worse than 1080ti). I suggest getting a 5600G for now, (or a used 2400G, since main objective would be getting a somewhat decent igpu without having to pay much as any igpu is ofc really slow). Stock cpu cooling (u dont need anything fancy until u hit 9 series), good psu, fast ram, a decent B550 mobo (such as Msi B550-A Pro), etc. Build it without dedicated gpu for $1000, test it out, etc. And then just buy a 3080ti for what it will worth in a couple of months. Remember,its not only about the shortage and high gpu prices, but its also about sloppily made cards and some quality control issues https://www.notebookcheck.net/More-...rce-RTX-30-series-cards-emerges.561536.0.html. So even if u pay $800 for a 3060ti (which is ofc a ripoff), you may even get a card with issues.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 25, 2021)

Nike_486DX said:


> i suggest to think twice about the gpu, with today's market situation you would only afford maybe a 3060 at best (which is worse than 1080ti). I suggest getting a 5600G for now, (or a used 2400G, since main objective would be getting a somewhat decent igpu without having to pay much as any igpu is ofc really slow). Stock cpu cooling (u dont need anything fancy until u hit 9 series), good psu, fast ram, a decent B550 mobo (such as Msi B550-A Pro), etc. Build it without dedicated gpu for $1000, test it out, etc. And then just buy a 3080ti for what it will worth in a couple of months. Remember,its not only about the shortage and high gpu prices, but its also about sloppily made cards and some quality control issues https://www.notebookcheck.net/More-...rce-RTX-30-series-cards-emerges.561536.0.html. So even if u pay $800 for a 3060ti (which is ofc a ripoff), you may even get a card with issues.



Surely a 5800x will be better than 5600 for this-
I will use my PC primarily for these things, so it should perform these tasks without any issues:
- Livestreaming and streams (running various streaming programs and other apps in the background)
- Multitasking (I stream while I do other things/projects such as web designing)
- Photo + Video rendering + editing (my current PC takes a long time to perform these tasks, to be honest)
And it's very cheap at the moment too.


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## Nike_486DX (Nov 25, 2021)

Tigger said:


> Surely a 5800x will be better than 5600 for this-
> I will use my PC primarily for these things, so it should perform these tasks without any issues:
> - Livestreaming and streams (running various streaming programs and other apps in the background)
> - Multitasking (I stream while I do other things/projects such as web designing)
> ...


yes but it doesn't have igpu (which forces u to get one, with todays situation when there are scammers everywhere and the prices are ridiculously high). also what if u check out a used 2400g and compare it according to its price/performance ratio? *But *that is irrelevant if you can get spare parts from ur older pc (?) IF your pc is the one that is mentioned in your system specs, then sure, get a 5800X into there. But as u have a 980ti (1070 level), i would recommend to stick with it for now, except if u desperately need an upgrade.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 25, 2021)

Nike_486DX said:


> yes but it doesnt have igpu (which forces u to get one, with todays stituation when there are scammers everywhere and the prices are ridiculously high). also what if u check out a used 2400g and compare it according to its price/performane ratio? *But *that is irrelevant if you can get spare parts from ur older pc (?)



he wants it for productivity first, so CPU is more important, games secondary, so he can buy a cheapish shand GPU to tide him over. Same as i did by buying the 980ti. For what he is going to use the machine for, he will need a better CPU than a 5600


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## GerKNG (Nov 25, 2021)

as much as i like AMD there is basically no reason to buy anything else than the 5950x for workstations.
a 5800X costs more (50-100€ depending on sales or not) is on par or slower in games than a 12600k, has a lot less multicore performance than a 12600k, and it's on a dead platform with no upgrade path (raptor lake with up to 24 cores should be compatible with Z690)

and since you want streaming and editing (especially streaming) a 12600k is faster than a 5950X in gaming while (for example) recording.
davinci resolve 4k exports are almost on 5900X level even at stock clocks.
Adobe Premier ingest/proxy is even a lot faster than a 5950x

i'd rather look for a 12600k DDR4 Build (the Z690 Pro A from MSI is fantastic and good enough for everything you can throw in the socket)
and what you save from a b550 board you can spend for the z690 board with a more "future proof" PCIe 5.0 slot and even on the cheapest board available 4 M.2 Slots + proper Intel Lan.

and the 12600k overclocks pretty decent (500Mhz on the P Cores, 600 Mhz on the E Cores and 400-500 Mhz on the Ring is doable without any crazy voltages or cooling requirements)


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 25, 2021)

GerKNG said:


> as much as i like AMD there is basically no reason to buy anything else than the 5950x for workstations.
> a 5800X costs more (50-100€ depending on sales or not) is on par or slower in games than a 12600k, has a lot less multicore performance than a 12600k, and it's on a dead platform with no upgrade path (raptor lake with up to 24 cores should be compatible with Z690)
> 
> and since you want streaming and editing (especially streaming) a 12600k is faster than a 5950X in gaming while (for example) recording.
> ...



I only suggested 5800z as he said he wanted AMD. I have to agree though on the 12600k though.


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## Fourstaff (Nov 25, 2021)

What resolution are you running your monitor on? For 1080, RTX3060 is enough for the next few years at least, but once you step up to 1440, its starting to struggle. Reusing your graphics card will be the best bet for now. 

Don't skimp on the ram either, get 32 or even 64gb if budget allows, since RAM prices are somewhat reasonable right now.


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

minstreless said:


> With Black Friday upcoming and my current PC is not doing its job that well any longer, as it is being overly slow and troublesome when it comes to loading etc. + I cannot play any of the new games that I wanna play because of the specs being bad and whatnot + it's about time to get myself a new PC. This time, I am going for an AMD-setup, and it would be great if it would last for a few years, like 5+ years or so. But, I do not need ALL the parts, as I do have some parts available, such as: monitors (I have 4 available), case (FD R6), power supply (I have a G3 650W now), Noctua-fans in various sizes, mouse and a keyboard. I do need the following parts, however:
> - CPU
> - CPU cooler
> - Graphics card
> ...


What country are you located _(Europe is not a country)_ and what resolution will you be gaming at?


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## ThaiTaffy (Nov 25, 2021)

Sorry but unless you know you can source good parts at reasonable prices there no sane reason to build in the current market your far better off looking for a decent reasonably priced prebuilt better yet a custom builder who can source msrp prices with a small cut for their own labor.


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

No idea what country you are located nor your resolution hence the reason I didn't include a psu and gpu but this gives you a rough idea of what you're looking at cost wise if you decide to go with an Intel LGA 1700 Alder Lake build.

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90848813
GIGABYTE Z690 GAMING X DDR4 €175,63

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90849235
Intel Core i5 12600KF €258,25

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90785407
Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360 €73,87

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90782615
G.Skill Aegis DDR4 3200mhz 32GB (2x16GB) CL16 €96,12

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90742995
Intel 660P M.2 PCIe 3.0 x4 1TB SSD €81,36

*Total: €685,23 *_excl. VAT plus shipping costs_









						Z690 GAMING X DDR4 (rev. 1.0) Key Features | Motherboard - GIGABYTE Global
					

Lasting Quality from GIGABYTE.GIGABYTE Ultra Durable™ motherboards bring together a unique blend of features and technologies that offer users the absolute ...




					www.gigabyte.com
				












						GIGABYTE Releases DRM Fix Tool for Intel Alder Lake Processors to Dynamically Park and Unpark E-Cores
					

With Intel's Alder Lake processors released, the company introduced a rather interesting concept of mixing high-performance and high-efficiency cores into one design. This hybrid approach combines performance P-cores based on Golden Cove architecture with high-efficiency E-cores based on...




					www.techpowerup.com
				












						LGA1700-MOUNTING KITS FOR ALDER LAKE | ARCTIC
					

Starting in mid-October, ARCTIC will provide mounting kits for all Freezer 34 models, the entire Liquid Freezer II series, the Freezer 50 as well as Freezer i13 X & CO.




					www.arctic.de
				





Reviews of that cpu including benchmarks.









						Core i5 12600K processor review
					

With six performance cores and four energy-efficient ones, the Core i5 12600K might become the most budget-friendly and really well-performing Alder Lake series processor. It offers heaps of performan... Introduction




					www.guru3d.com
				












						Intel Core i5-12600K Review - Winning Price/Performance
					

The Core i5-12600K is the price/performance king in the Intel Alder Lake lineup. With its competitive pricing of $300, it's a clear winner against AMD's Ryzen 5 5600X and faster than even the 5800X in many applications and games. This is the gaming CPU you want.




					www.techpowerup.com
				












						Intel Core i5-12600K vs AMD Ryzen 5 5600X and 5800X Face Off: Ryzen Has Fallen
					

The gaming chip showdown




					www.tomshardware.com


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## winterwonderland (Nov 25, 2021)

GerKNG said:


> as much as i like AMD there is basically no reason to buy anything else than the 5950x for workstations.
> a 5800X costs more (50-100€ depending on sales or not) is on par or slower in games than a 12600k, has a lot less multicore performance than a 12600k, and it's on a dead platform with no upgrade path (raptor lake with up to 24 cores should be compatible with Z690)
> 
> and since you want streaming and editing (especially streaming) a 12600k is faster than a 5950X in gaming while (for example) recording.
> ...





Tigger said:


> I only suggested 5800z as he said he wanted AMD. I have to agree though on the 12600k though.





Fourstaff said:


> What resolution are you running your monitor on? For 1080, RTX3060 is enough for the next few years at least, but once you step up to 1440, its starting to struggle. Reusing your graphics card will be the best bet for now.
> 
> Don't skimp on the ram either, get 32 or even 64gb if budget allows, since RAM prices are somewhat reasonable right now.





Why_Me said:


> What country are you located _(Europe is not a country)_ and what resolution will you be gaming at?





Why_Me said:


> No idea what country you are located nor your resolution hence the reason I didn't include a psu and gpu but this gives you a rough idea of what you're looking at cost wise if you decide to go with an Intel LGA 1700 Alder Lake build.
> 
> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90848813
> GIGABYTE Z690 GAMING X DDR4 €175,63
> ...



Oh wow. An Intel-setup is that much better?! And seemingly a lot cheaper too? Is an AMD-setup really not that worthy anymore, huh?

Yes, the 5950X will be overkill for my budget, unfortunately.

I am located in Norway.

My resolution (because of my eyes) will mostly be 1080p. Things get too "detailed" and "small" for me and my eyes at 1440p. Weird, i know, but it's just how it is. Yes, i am aware that eventually, i should consider upgrading to a 1440p-setup too. It should be noted that the monitors that have, are 1440p-monitors...

And yes, i intend getting at least 32gb RAM.

Say if i go for the Intel-setup, how "future proof" will the Intel-setup be?

Thank you all so much for the responses and help!


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## Vya Domus (Nov 25, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Say if i go for the Intel-setup, how "future proof" will the Intel-setup be?



As a platform, it wont be. Not unless you buy into DDR5, even then who knows, Intel is known for switching sockets and chipsets very often.

If possible I'd wait for AMD to make the switch to DDR5.


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

Vya Domus said:


> As a platform, it wont be. Not unless you buy into DDR5, even then who knows, Intel is known for switching sockets and chipsets very often.
> 
> If possible I'd wait for AMD to make the switch to DDR5.


And when do you think AMD will make the switch to DDR5?


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 25, 2021)

This intel socket should be good for at least this and the next intel cpu. He can get a cheapish intel board for AL now and switch boards when DDR 5 is actually available. Unless you switch setups every year AL should be good for a few years at least, better than waiting for AM5


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## Wirko (Nov 25, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90849235
> Intel Core i5 12600KF €258,25


I'd rather pick a 12600K for 265€. Having an working system without a discrete GPU can come in handy. There's also QuickSync as a part of iGPU, maybe it can be put to good use too.






						Intel Core i5 12600K tray Buy
					

Intel Core i5 12600K tray Buy | online at computeruniverse online Shop | High End Deca Core CPU,  tray




					www.computeruniverse.net
				




I've checked several other retailers and the price difference between 12600KF/tray and 12600K/tray is very small, or none at all.


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## dgianstefani (Nov 25, 2021)

12700k, any z690 DDR4 mobo, Noctua NH-U12A, 32gb of 3800/4000mhz c16 or lower ram, a decent 1/2TB ssd from reviews. I would also splurge on a better PSU, like a Seasonic Prime.

Save the spare money for next year when Eth goes POS, then buy your GPU, otherwise you will be spending 2x MSRP. Integrated GPU on 12700k is good enough for 1080p medium gaming anyway.

Otherwise buy a placeholder GPU like a 1050ti.

Reading your post again, you don't need a strong GPU, but a strong CPU would benefit you, further reason to either keep your 970 or use IGPU on the 12700k.


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## winterwonderland (Nov 25, 2021)

dgianstefani said:


> 12700k, any z690 DDR4 mobo, Noctua NH-U12A, 32gb of 3800/4000mhz c16 or lower ram, a decent 1/2TB ssd from reviews. I would also splurge on a better PSU, like a Seasonic Prime.
> 
> Save the spare money for next year when Eth goes POS, then buy your GPU, otherwise you will be spending 2x MSRP. Integrated GPU on 12700k is good enough for 1080p medium gaming anyway.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the input. 

Yes, that seasonic prime seems like a very good one to get. Overall good reviews and seems to do the trick/job as well, at least for my purposes.

So, you're saying that i should KEEP the GPU i am using now, and instead upgrade it at a later point, maybe next year or so?

So.... it all points to the fact that i should opt for an Intel-setup then, huh? That's a massive surprise, but i am definitely up for it if that is the way to go, yes.


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## Selaya (Nov 25, 2021)

An [EVGA] G3's fine, it's a Superflower. If you insist, you can of course buy the Prime but tbh it is quite unnecessary as long as your PSU isn't failing.
Do note that there's still some compability issues w/ E-cores tho, they may or may not get smoothed out in the upcoming weeks and/or months.


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

Selaya said:


> An [EVGA] G3's fine, it's a Superflower. If you insist, you can of course buy the Prime but tbh it is quite unnecessary as long as your PSU isn't failing.
> Do note that there's still some compability issues w/ E-cores tho, they may or may not get smoothed out in the upcoming weeks and/or months.


The board in that build I posted up above.

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90848813
GIGABYTE Z690 GAMING X DDR4 €175,63









						Z690 GAMING X DDR4 (rev. 1.0) Key Features | Motherboard - GIGABYTE Global
					

Lasting Quality from GIGABYTE.GIGABYTE Ultra Durable™ motherboards bring together a unique blend of features and technologies that offer users the absolute ...




					www.gigabyte.com
				












						GIGABYTE Releases DRM Fix Tool for Intel Alder Lake Processors to Dynamically Park and Unpark E-Cores
					

With Intel's Alder Lake processors released, the company introduced a rather interesting concept of mixing high-performance and high-efficiency cores into one design. This hybrid approach combines performance P-cores based on Golden Cove architecture with high-efficiency E-cores based on...




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 25, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> The board in that build I posted up above.
> 
> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90848813
> GIGABYTE Z690 GAMING X DDR4 €175,63
> ...



Interesting. The Intel-setup you posted landed on about €1000 (with VAT + shipping), but without GPU + PSU. What about a CPU-cooler, or that is what the Arctic Freeze II is for, i assume? I have never used liquid cooling, so i am not sure how that works.

What about GPU and PSU..? Will the one i already have (see my setup on my profile) work good, or i need a stronger W one?

So, this seems to be the setup to go for, huh?


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Interesting. The Intel-setup you posted landed on about €1000 (with VAT + shipping), but without GPU + PSU. What about a CPU-cooler, or that is what the Arctic Freeze II is for, i assume? I have never used liquid cooling, so i am not sure how that works.
> 
> What about GPU and PSU..? Will the one i already have (see my setup on my profile) work good, or i need a stronger W one?
> 
> So, this seems to be the setup to go for, huh?


You can reuse your current gpu for now until you find a deal.  Here's an option to have a look at.

*1080P*

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90803642
EVGA 650 GT Gaming 650W 80+ Gold Modular Power Supply  €63,02






						MSI GeForce RTX 3060 GAMING X LHR 12 GB Buy
					

MSI GeForce RTX 3060 GAMING X LHR 12 GB Buy | online at computeruniverse online Shop | NVIDIA® GeForce RTX™ 3060 (LHR),  Overclocked




					www.computeruniverse.net
				



MSI GeForce RTX 3060 GAMING X LHR 12GB €714,28


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## dgianstefani (Nov 25, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> You can reuse your current gpu for now until you find a deal.  Here's a few options to have a look at.
> 
> *1080P*
> 
> ...


Read the OP, he does light gaming in 1080p.


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## winterwonderland (Nov 25, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> You can reuse your current gpu for now until you find a deal.  Here's an option to have a look at.
> 
> *1080P*
> 
> ...



Ok, so i will definitely go for the INTEL-setup, not AMD then. What a surprise that was, but  i love it!

Few questions:
1: If i can get the i7 12700KF to about the same price as 12600KF, i should go for the 12700KF, yes? Otherwise, i will go for the 12600KF.
2: What PSU options are worth for me to get? 650~1000W recommendations would be good. Are EVGA SuperNova still good enough ones to get, yes?
3: The Arctic Cooler, i only need that, and nothing else in terms of external things? Pardon for that newbie question.
4: Will the Z690 X DDR4 fit into my case, which is Fractal Design Define R6, or?


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ok, so i will definitely go for the INTEL-setup, not AMD then. What a surprise that was, but  i love it!
> 
> Few questions:
> 1: If i can get the i7 12700KF to about the same price as 12600KF, i should go for the 12700KF, yes? Otherwise, i will go for the 12600KF.
> ...


Your case is big ... shouldn't be a problem fitting any of those components I listed inside it.  If you want to be on the safe side you can go with a 240mm AIO CPU cooler. btw Arctic Cooling makes a LGA 1700 bracket for it's coolers but contact the PC hardware store that you're ordering from to make sure they send it with the cooler.  That's a 650w EVGA Super Nova I linked and it will easily push your system including an RTX 3060. 









						LGA1700-MOUNTING KITS FOR ALDER LAKE | ARCTIC
					

Starting in mid-October, ARCTIC will provide mounting kits for all Freezer 34 models, the entire Liquid Freezer II series, the Freezer 50 as well as Freezer i13 X & CO.




					www.arctic.de
				




https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90785414 
Arctic Liquid Freezer II 240 €58,74

As far as the cpu ... best to read the reviews imo and choose the one you feel fits your needs _(and your budget)_.

Reviews of the i7 12700K/12700KF including benchmarks.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-core-i7-12700k-review

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i7-12700k-alder-lake-12th-gen/









_View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B14h25fKMpY_


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## Selaya (Nov 25, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> The board in that build I posted up above.
> 
> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90848813
> GIGABYTE Z690 GAMING X DDR4 €175,63
> ...


Prime as in [Seasonic] Prime, the PSU not [ASUS] Prime the board


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

Selaya said:


> Prime as in [Seasonic] Prime, the PSU not [ASUS] Prime the board





Selaya said:


> An [EVGA] G3's fine, it's a Superflower. If you insist, you can of course buy the Prime but tbh it is quite unnecessary as long as your PSU isn't failing.
> *Do note that there's still some compability issues w/ E-cores tho, they may or may not get smoothed out in the upcoming weeks and/or months. *





Why_Me said:


> The board in that build I posted up above.
> 
> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90848813
> GIGABYTE Z690 GAMING X DDR4 €175,63
> ...


I should have bolded that part the first time I quoted your post instead of taking it for granted that my reply was self explanatory.


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## Selaya (Nov 25, 2021)

Uhm, what does the board have to do w/ that? E-core compability is a software-, not hardware issue, nor is it a BIOS thing


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## winterwonderland (Nov 25, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> Your case is big ... shouldn't be a problem fitting any of those components I listed inside it.  If you want to be on the safe side you can go with a 240mm AIO CPU cooler. btw Arctic Cooling makes a LGA 1700 bracket for it's coolers but contact the PC hardware store that you're ordering from to make sure they send it with the cooler.  That's a 650w EVGA Super Nova I linked and it will easily push your system including an RTX 3060.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





Why_Me said:


> I should have bolded that part the first time I quoted your post instead of taking it for granted that my reply was self explanatory.



Ok, but it seems like the 12700KF scores better on every aspect than the 12600KF (obviously), so if i can get the 12700KF for about the same price as the 12600KF, then i should most likely just buy the 12700KF, huh?

Ok, i will check out the prices on PSU's over here, for the mentioned Seasonic and EVGA's.

I will not buy a GPU yet, unless i find an insane good deal, ofc, but for now, i will stick to the GPU i already have.

Yes, i will definitely ask about the LGA-bracket upon ordering the setup. Thanks for the tip! EDIT: this is a picture of what is included within the box, and is that the LGA-bracket, or? https://files.catbox.moe/032t42.jpg

Otherwise, it seems like i am good to go with the Intel-setup, and that for a MUCH cheaper price than i originally intended to spend for the AMD-setup!


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## Why_Me (Nov 25, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ok, but it seems like the 12700KF scores better on every aspect than the 12600KF (obviously), so if i can get the 12700KF for about the same price as the 12600KF, then i should most likely just buy the 12700KF, huh?
> 
> Ok, i will check out the prices on PSU's over here, for the mentioned Seasonic and EVGA's.
> 
> ...


The dealer should have it on hand and send it with the cooler.  If they don't have it on hand then Arctic Cooling will provide it for free according to their website.









						LGA1700 Mounting Kit - Liquid Freezer II Series | MPSAS00891A
					

For mounting the Liquid Freezer II Series on Intel Alder Lake




					www.arctic.de
				




With the LGA 1700 mounting kit, the entire Liquid Freezer II Series is compatible with Intel's new Alder lake processors. Even if the socket and heat-spreader are larger compared to the predecessor, the CPU surface has been reduced and remains centered. The Liquid Freezer II cooler completely covers this area. _ARCTIC will provide the required mounting kit free of charge to customers who submit proof of purchase of a processor with an LGA 1700 socket._


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## winterwonderland (Nov 26, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> The dealer should have it on hand and send it with the cooler.  If they don't have it on hand then Arctic Cooling will provide it for free according to their website.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Great, i will check with the store to hear what they have to say about that.

Regarding the PSU, what other PSU's than the EVGA SuperNova GT 650w you linked to me should i keep an eye on since it's BF going on? 

I guess that except for the PSU, i have everything else in place. 

Ohh! Are there any cases that matches the Fractal Design R6 in terms of super silence/being quiet that i can be on the lookout for?


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## Space Lynx (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> With Black Friday upcoming and my current PC is not doing its job that well any longer, as it is being overly slow and troublesome when it comes to loading etc. + I cannot play any of the new games that I wanna play because of the specs being bad and whatnot + it's about time to get myself a new PC. This time, I am going for an AMD-setup, and it would be great if it would last for a few years, like 5+ years or so. But, I do not need ALL the parts, as I do have some parts available, such as: monitors (I have 4 available), case (FD R6), power supply (I have a G3 650W now), Noctua-fans in various sizes, mouse and a keyboard. I do need the following parts, however:
> - CPU
> - CPU cooler
> - Graphics card
> ...



if possible, be patient a little while longer. I think things will get better in the Spring.

if not possible, consider looking at a gaming laptop and a separate monitor to hook it up to. while gaming laptops are not ideal, you could possibly get a better gpu that way, as miners have been steering clear of gaming laptops for the most part.


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Great, i will check with the store to hear what they have to say about that.
> 
> Regarding the PSU, what other PSU's than the EVGA SuperNova GT 650w you linked to me should i keep an eye on since it's BF going on?
> 
> ...


Seasonic is a good brand.  Can't go wrong with them imo.





						be quiet! Silent Base 601 Midi Tower gedämmt schwarz Buy
					

be quiet! Silent Base 601 Midi Tower gedämmt schwarz Buy | online at computeruniverse online Shop | Midi-Tower (sound dampened)




					www.computeruniverse.net
				



be quiet! Silent Base 601 Midi Tower Black €100,76

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90667911 
be quiet! Pure Wings 2 140mm PWM €10,00

https://www.bequiet.com/en/case/1504 












			https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90820692
		

be quiet! Silent Base 802 Window €151,22









						be quiet!
					

be quiet!




					www.bequiet.com


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 26, 2021)

lynx29 said:


> if possible, be patient a little while longer. I think things will get better in the Spring.
> 
> if not possible, consider looking at a gaming laptop and a separate monitor to hook it up to. while gaming laptops are not ideal, you could possibly get a better gpu that way, as miners have been steering clear of gaming laptops for the most part.


Unfortunately, i cannot wait that long. And no, i will stick with a desktop for obvious reasons of mine.



Why_Me said:


> be quiet! Silent Base 601


Ohh, ok. I gotta check how that is in comparison to FDD S and to the one that i have now... Gotta google that! Thanks for the tip!

WD Blue SN550 M.2 2280 2TB... How is that in comparison to the mentioned​Intel 660p Series M.2 2280 SSD 2TB? I ask as that one is on a special offer on a local shop, and about €30 cheaper than the Intel SSD... (sorry for the bold text, i cannot somehow remove it with the remove formatting-function...)​


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Unfortunately, i cannot wait that long. And no, i will stick with a desktop for obvious reasons of mine.
> 
> 
> Ohh, ok. I gotta check how that is in comparison to FDD S and to the one that i have now... Gotta google that! Thanks for the tip!
> ...


Western Digital Blue is a solid SSD.


----------



## Selaya (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ok, but it seems like the 12700KF scores better on every aspect than the 12600KF (obviously), so if i can get the 12700KF for about the same price as the 12600KF, then i should most likely just buy the 12700KF, huh?
> [ ... ]


Absolutely. Even in the (unlikely) event you have to disable E-cores due to compability you're left with an 8/16 CPU, which should be more than enough.

As for your PSU, your current one's an EVGA SuperNova G3, yes? Is anything wrong with it?


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 26, 2021)

Selaya said:


> Absolutely. Even in the (unlikely) event you have to disable E-cores due to compability you're left with an 8/16 CPU, which should be more than enough.
> 
> As for your PSU, your current one's an EVGA SuperNova G3, yes? Is anything wrong with it?


Ah, okay then i shall keep an eye on both CPU's. 

Yes, that is the PSU i have. Well, nothing wrong with it, but it's only 550W, which is too weak, right?


----------



## Selaya (Nov 26, 2021)

Didn't you write 650W earlier?
650W is fine, any and all GPUs that may require a more powerful PSU are priced well out of your budget, in any case.


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 26, 2021)

Selaya said:


> Didn't you write 650W earlier?
> 650W is fine, any and all GPUs that may require a more powerful PSU are priced well out of your budget, in any case.


Ah, i see. No, i wrote 550W, but @Why_Me suggested EVGA Supernova GT 650W.  Isn't 550W too little?


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ah, i see. No, i wrote 550W, but @Why_Me suggested EVGA Supernova GT 650W.  Isn't 550W too little?



Not for a 12700k and a 970.


----------



## Selaya (Nov 26, 2021)

Nah. the 12700K caps out at like 200W, which'd leave you with 350-400 for the GPU (and the remainder of your system, but that hardly draws any power).  Remember that a PSU usually has some headroom beyond their rating, and basically nothing is capable at loading both CPU and GPU to the max simultaneously.

At 300W you'd be looking at 3080s, which is definitely priced out of your budget.


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ah, i see. No, i wrote 550W, but @Why_Me suggested EVGA Supernova GT 650W.  Isn't 550W too little?


The 650w suggestion was in case you added an RTX 3060 in order to give you some headroom seeing how the Alder Lake systems can be a little power hungry at times.


----------



## Selaya (Nov 26, 2021)

It's only really the 12900K that's gobbling power like mad (and thus the worst ADL part, imho), both 12600K and 12700K are fine, really.
Besides, when you're gaming (full GPU load) you're very rarely also loading your CPU (unless you're like, remuxing a video or something while gaming but honestly, who does that?), so it shouldn't be an issue


----------



## kane nas (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> With Black Friday upcoming and my current PC is not doing its job that well any longer, as it is being overly slow and troublesome when it comes to loading etc. + I cannot play any of the new games that I wanna play because of the specs being bad and whatnot + it's about time to get myself a new PC. This time, I am going for an AMD-setup, and it would be great if it would last for a few years, like 5+ years or so. But, I do not need ALL the parts, as I do have some parts available, such as: monitors (I have 4 available), case (FD R6), power supply (I have a G3 650W now), Noctua-fans in various sizes, mouse and a keyboard. I do need the following parts, however:
> - CPU
> - CPU cooler
> - Graphics card
> ...


5900x
Arctick Liquid freezer II 360
Nvidia Rtx 2060
Gskill ddr4 3800 32 gb cl14
Asus strix-E wifi gaming x570
Samsung 980 pro m2 1TB
BE QUIET 850w 80+Gold Full modular


​​


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 26, 2021)

kane nas said:


> *5900x*
> Arctick Liquid freezer II 360
> Nvidia Rtx 2060
> Gskill ddr4 3800 32 gb cl14
> ...


https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90844550 
ASUS ROG STRIX X570-E Gaming WIFI II *€315,12* 

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90817875 
AMD Ryzen 9 5900X *€444,54* 

vs 

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90848813
GIGABYTE Z690 GAMING X DDR4 *€175,63*

https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90849193 
Intel Core i7 12700KF *€361,34*


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 26, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90844550
> ASUS ROG STRIX X570-E Gaming WIFI II *€315,12*
> 
> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90817875
> ...





Why_Me said:


> The 650w suggestion was in case you added an RTX 3060 in order to give you some headroom seeing how the Alder Lake systems can be a little power hungry at times.





Selaya said:


> It's only really the 12900K that's gobbling power like mad (and thus the worst ADL part, imho), both 12600K and 12700K are fine, really.
> Besides, when you're gaming (full GPU load) you're very rarely also loading your CPU (unless you're like, remuxing a video or something while gaming but honestly, who does that?), so it shouldn't be an issue



Ohh, how about that! Then i can worry about the PSU at a later point when i get myself a proper GPU than the one i have now.

And yes, i will surely go for the Intel-setup as @Why_Me among others have suggested so nicely. 

So with my current 550W, it can still handle the 12600KF/12700KF with the ADL-part, rendering, live streaming, light/basic gaming and multi-tasking/browsing without any problems for the PSU?


----------



## dgianstefani (Nov 26, 2021)

Honestly, PSUs are cheap, you could get the top tier Seasonic Prime TX titanium 750w for less than the cost of a decent z690 motherboard, and a more reasonably priced PX or GX plat or gold model for half that.

Unless you're waiting for ATX 12VO which isn't going to be the standard for another generation at least, if at all, there's no real reason to not replace the 550w model now, if you're going to do it later anyway.

The differences between PSU efficiency at load can often mean 10-20W of waste heat saved from being put into your case.


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 26, 2021)

dgianstefani said:


> Honestly, PSUs are cheap, you could get the top tier Seasonic Prime TX titanium 750w for less than the cost of a decent z690 motherboard, and a more reasonably priced PX or GX plat or gold model for half that.
> 
> Unless you're waiting for ATX 12VO which isn't going to be the standard for another generation at least, if at all, there's no real reason to not replace the 550w model now, if you're going to do it later anyway.
> 
> The differences between PSU efficiency at load can often mean 10-20W of waste heat saved from being put into your case.


That's very reassuring to read, much appreciated for that. Then i shall definitely keep the current 550W of mine and rather upgrade it at a later point, once i decide to up the GPU.

How is the Prime 750W vs my G3 550W? Is the 750W more quiet than my 550W, seeing as i want as quiet of a setup as possible...


----------



## dgianstefani (Nov 26, 2021)

The prime series are so efficient most of the time the fan doesn't spin at all.


----------



## Deleted member 215115 (Nov 26, 2021)

Keep the PSU.


----------



## Selaya (Nov 26, 2021)

The SuperNova G3 is one of the better ones (a revised Leadex II, which in itself is one of the better platforms).
Really just keep it it's fine, dont waste money you don't need to spend.


----------



## Stimer111 (Nov 26, 2021)

minstreless said:


> With Black Friday upcoming and my current PC is not doing its job that well any longer, as it is being overly slow and troublesome when it comes to loading etc. + I cannot play any of the new games that I wanna play because of the specs being bad and whatnot + it's about time to get myself a new PC. This time, I am going for an AMD-setup, and it would be great if it would last for a few years, like 5+ years or so. But, I do not need ALL the parts, as I do have some parts available, such as: monitors (I have 4 available), case (FD R6), power supply (I have a G3 650W now), Noctua-fans in various sizes, mouse and a keyboard. I do need the following parts, however:
> - CPU
> - CPU cooler
> - Graphics card
> ...


- CPU - AMD Ryzen 7 5800X
- CPU cooler - NOCTUA NH-U14S /140mm fan/ - NOCTUA NH-U14S
- Graphics card - RTX 3070 or 6800 - MSI Radeon RX 6800 GAMING TRIO 16G
- Memory -  G.SKILL 32GB KIT DDR4 3600 MHz CL16 Trident Z RGB Neo for Ryzen 3000
- Motherboard - ASUS ROG STRIX X570-F GAMING
- SSD - Apacer PP3480 1TB /2000 TBW/ - Apacer PP3480 1TB
- Power supply - Seasonic PRIME - Seasonic Prime 750 W Platinum
- CASE - be quiet! Pure Base 500DX Black

I am PC builder, I can do this (-:

Best budget options - 5600x + RTX 3070 : 1570 Eur
ASUS ROG Strix GA15 G15DK-R5600X152T Black
Prebuilt - Quiet - Great PC


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 26, 2021)

Stimer111 said:


> - CPU - AMD Ryzen 7 5800X
> - CPU cooler - NOCTUA NH-U14S /140mm fan/ - NOCTUA NH-U14S
> - Graphics card - RTX 3070 or 6800 - MSI Radeon RX 6800 GAMING TRIO 16G
> - Memory -  G.SKILL 32GB KIT DDR4 3600 MHz CL16 Trident Z RGB Neo for Ryzen 3000
> ...


Not bad other than the fact the 12700K/KF mops the floor with both of those cpu's.

https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-core-i7-12700k-review

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i7-12700k-alder-lake-12th-gen/


----------



## kane nas (Nov 26, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> Not bad other than the fact the 12700K/KF mops the floor with both of those cpu's.
> 
> https://www.tomshardware.com/news/intel-core-i7-12700k-review
> 
> https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i7-12700k-alder-lake-12th-gen/


price for ddr5?


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 26, 2021)

kane nas said:


> price for ddr5?











						Aiming for a new AMD PC setup for about $/€1800, plus-minus, but I kindly need some help and advice to get the right parts...
					

With Black Friday upcoming and my current PC is not doing its job that well any longer, as it is being overly slow and troublesome when it comes to loading etc. + I cannot play any of the new games that I wanna play because of the specs being bad and whatnot + it's about time to get myself a new...




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## seth1911 (Nov 26, 2021)

PSU is junk, take a Super Flower Leadex 3


----------



## Deleted member 215115 (Nov 26, 2021)

seth1911 said:


> PSU is junk, take a Super Flower Leadex 3


Surely you're just trolling.


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 26, 2021)

Well, @Why_Me and @Selaya and all others with useful and helpful tips!  Imma wait for Cyber Monday (useless as it is) to kick in, since i will then get the remaining items, seeing as i got the 12700KF for €20 more than the 12600KF. What is left to get: 
- G.Skill Aegis DDR4 3200MHz 2x16GB
- Intel 660p Series M.2 2280 SSD 2TB or WD Blue SN550 M.2 2280 2TB (both are priced the same, which one should i opt for?)
- Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360 (3x120mm)
- Gigabyte Z690 Gaming X DDR4
- The GPU + the PSU i will put on hold until i find a good enough deal on the GPU's that you lot have suggested in this thread.

And i might go for the same case that i already have, FD Define R6, as that one is SILENT/QUIET and spacious, but i gotta consider the be Quiet-cases you lot have mentioned as well. So far, so good. Once again, thank you so much for all the help and advises, and for your patience with my Q's!


----------



## Selaya (Nov 26, 2021)

I would go with the SN550. The 660p is QLC and shouldn't be considered unless it's at a _massive_ discount.


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 27, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ok, but it seems like the *12700KF* scores better on every aspect than the 12600KF (obviously), so if i can get the 12700KF for about the same price as the 12600KF, then i should most likely just buy the *12700KF*, huh?
> 
> Ok, i will check out the prices on PSU's over here, for the mentioned Seasonic and EVGA's.
> 
> ...


You made a wise choice by the looks of it.









						Intel Core i7-12700K vs AMD Ryzen 9 5900X and 5800X Face Off: Intel Rising
					

Core i7 vs Ryzen 9 and Ryzen 7, fight!




					www.tomshardware.com


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 30, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> You made a wise choice by the looks of it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



One last question... Eh.. I kinda went for the "K" instead of the "KF"... I didn't notice that until now. How is the K compared to the KF and/or did i make a mistake? It was only priced €30 above the 12600K (yes, K, not KF), so i thought it'd be a wiser decision to go for the "K" instead of the "KF"... Any inputs on that?


----------



## Why_Me (Nov 30, 2021)

minstreless said:


> One last question... Eh.. I kinda went for the "K" instead of the "KF"... I didn't notice that until now. How is the K compared to the KF and/or did i make a mistake? It was only priced €30 above the 12600K (yes, K, not KF), so i thought it'd be a wiser decision to go for the "K" instead of the "KF"... Any inputs on that?


K is a better choice than KF seeing how the K cpu has integrated graphics so if something ever goes wrong with your gpu you can still use your PC.


----------



## Speedyblupi (Nov 30, 2021)

Selaya said:


> I would go with the SN550. The 660p is QLC and shouldn't be considered unless it's at a _massive_ discount.


New versions of the SN550 are also QLC, and actually worse than the 660p because they're DRAMless.









						Western Digital does the wrong write thing — again – Blocks and Files
					

Comment. Western Digital has done it a second time, and treated buyers of its storage drives with … well, what? Disregard? Disdain? How would you describe the near silent substitution of inferior flash for the original NAND in its M.2 format Blue SN550 SSD? This was found out by a Chinese media...




					blocksandfiles.com
				




WD will replace the drive if it doesn't meet the "performance requirements", but as I understand it, they'll replace it with another QLC drive which would still be much slower and less reliable than the TLC version (which is normally significantly faster than the officially advertised spec of the drive during long writes), and they won't replace it at all if it meets that specification.









						Western Digital Pledges Transparency, Will Replace QLC SN550 for Unhappy Buyers - ExtremeTech
					

If you bought an SN550 that didn't meet your performance expectations, we suggest contacting WD. Please let us know how it goes.




					www.extremetech.com
				




I'd personally get a Kingston A2000 - its controller sucks, but it is at least a TLC drive with DRAM cache, and normally not much more expensive than DRAMless QLC. Using the SN550 shouldn't cause any harm, just be aware that sustained write performance might be a lot worse than benchmarks on older TLC-based versions of the drive indicate.



minstreless said:


> One last question... Eh.. I kinda went for the "K" instead of the "KF"... I didn't notice that until now. How is the K compared to the KF and/or did i make a mistake? It was only priced €30 above the 12600K (yes, K, not KF), so i thought it'd be a wiser decision to go for the "K" instead of the "KF"... Any inputs on that?


The non-F version has an iGPU. If you were just gaming I'd say save your money unless you're really worried about debugging your main GPU, but as you'll be using the PC for photo and video editing, an iGPU would potentially be very useful for GPU acceleration, especially if you use Adobe software like Photoshop and Premiere, which has a lot of Intel-specific GPU accelerated features.


----------



## Selaya (Nov 30, 2021)

Interesting.
Yeah, in that case I'd recommend something non-QLC that is of a similar price. The A2000'll do the job. The Kioxia Exceria seems to be another hot contender tbh.


----------



## Speedyblupi (Nov 30, 2021)

Selaya said:


> Remember that a PSU usually has some headroom beyond their rating, and basically nothing is capable at loading both CPU and GPU to the max simultaneously.


This is true, but it puts you well outside the drive's ideal efficiency range, and can negatively impact long-term reliability. I personally wouldn't use a PSU that's rated for less than 20% more than the expected peak power usage of the PC (e.g. if a PC uses 500W at peak load, I would consider 600W the bare minimum PSU). Erring on the side of caution that much might not be strictly necessary, but considering that failing PSUs can easily damage other PC components and that you'll likely save the money you spent on a more powerful PSU on slightly lower electricity costs over the life of the PC (it might only be 10W or so, but that adds up), it's definitely worth it, in my opinion.

Of course, some people go way overboard, arguably to the point of paranoia, and waste money on 1000W PSUs for 300W systems, but it's worth making sure you have some guaranteed headroom rather than relying on the PSU to be able to run above-spec.


----------



## Selaya (Nov 30, 2021)

I can see your point but the thing is just, how often will the average user hit the maximum possible load (GPU & CPU 100%)?
I'd honestly confident enough to bet my money on [x] never, since generally workloads either load the GPU or the CPU, not both at the same time. And for the _just in case_, the built-in headroom of a PSU should be quite alright.


----------



## Speedyblupi (Nov 30, 2021)

You wouldn't often have all components running at full power (at least outside of stress tests and heavy benchmarks), though it would be a lot more likely in this case than for a typical gaming PC, as (according to OP) this PC would also be used for streaming and video editing, and other types of multitasking while gaming.

Transient power spikes can trigger OCP or OPP even if sustained load is below the PSU's power rating (though this depends on the specific PSU model and what GPU and CPU you have - Nvidia's RTX 3000-series are reported to be particularly prone to large power spikes, for example), and even if the typical load is around 80% of the PSU's rated power, it's still not in the ideal efficiency range for most PSUs (around 50-60% load).

I guess it really depends on how careful you want to be, and how much you care about running in your PSU's ideal efficiency range - you're not wrong, but I'd personally be more cautious.


----------



## Selaya (Nov 30, 2021)

I mean, I'm totally on board with you there, but the fact remains that for the vast majority of users (even streamers/content creators, imho - if you're not an idiot you'll always CPU software render your uploads, and GPU your streams, for instance) oversizing the PSU is just a waste of money, _unless they can afford it_. But being cost-conscious w/ your PSU (sizing) is one of the better ways of shaving off $50-100 your build.
Obviously, you shouldn't be purchasing gutless wonders, but that's something else entirely.


----------



## RandallFlagg (Nov 30, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Well, @Why_Me and @Selaya and all others with useful and helpful tips!  Imma wait for Cyber Monday (useless as it is) to kick in, since i will then get the remaining items, seeing as i got the 12700KF for €20 more than the 12600KF. What is left to get:
> - G.Skill Aegis DDR4 3200MHz 2x16GB
> - Intel 660p Series M.2 2280 SSD 2TB or WD Blue SN550 M.2 2280 2TB (both are priced the same, which one should i opt for?)
> - Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360 (3x120mm)
> ...



Something worth noting with Western Digital drives, you can go to their site and get a free copy of Acronis.  This is a pretty good backup and imaging application.   It can do whole drive images, specific partitions, and even create bootable media to restore a backup image from.  

I recently picked up a Team Group MP33 Pro 2TB m.2, which doesn't come with any software, and used WD's Acronis to copy my old m.2 C:\ drive and then copy a partition from my 1TB WD SATA SSD.   Only reason I could use it is b/c I already have that WD SSD along with a WD external backup drive - it won't work if you don't have a WD product attached.

Just having that software, makes getting the WD worth it.


----------



## winterwonderland (Nov 30, 2021)

RandallFlagg said:


> Something worth noting with Western Digital drives, you can go to their site and get a free copy of Acronis.  This is a pretty good backup and imaging application.   It can do whole drive images, specific partitions, and even create bootable media to restore a backup image from.
> 
> I recently picked up a Team Group MP33 Pro 2TB m.2, which doesn't come with any software, and used WD's Acronis to copy my old m.2 C:\ drive and then copy a partition from my 1TB WD SATA SSD.   Only reason I could use it is b/c I already have that WD SSD along with a WD external backup drive - it won't work if you don't have a WD product attached.
> 
> Just having that software, makes getting the WD worth it.


Oh cool. I have noted this down so now I will just wait for the WD SSD to go down on the price. Thanks for the tip! WD it is for me! 

EDIT: Any experiences with the Kingston NV1 2TB SSD? Hmm... I am asking because that is cut down a lot in the price today...


----------



## Selaya (Nov 30, 2021)

> Today we are taking a look at the Kingston NV1 1TB SSD. This is the third Kingston SSD I have looked at, and was originally intended as something of a companion piece for the Kingston A2000 review. The NV1 occupies the entry-level slot in Kingston’s SSD stack, and as a result is a *DRAM-less QLC* drive with very modest performance targets. Let us see how it stacks up!











						Kingston NV1 1TB NVMe SSD Review
					

In our Kingston NV1 1TB SSD review, we see how well this entry-level PCIe Gen3 NVMe SSD performs next to the competition




					www.servethehome.com
				




No.
Please.
Do not buy this.


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 1, 2021)

Selaya said:


> Kingston NV1 1TB NVMe SSD Review
> 
> 
> In our Kingston NV1 1TB SSD review, we see how well this entry-level PCIe Gen3 NVMe SSD performs next to the competition
> ...


Ok, I won't. I will try to opt for a WD drive, yes. What's the difference between a 1TB and 2TB? Does W10 / W11 require that much space, or?

@Why_Me , @Selaya and others; are there any other similar alternatives for a cooler that fits nicely along with my case (FD R6) + i7 12700K + Gigabyte Z690 Gaming X? What about the mentioned Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3? It's not water cooling, but seems to be a great one nonetheless. I am open for suggestions as the cooler is the one thing I have not yet ordered.

EDIT: I see a trusted PC-fella in my country (he's sold a dozen PC-parts and has 10/10-user rating etc) who is selling the mentioned Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360 with a 70% discount as it has been used for 3 weeks and changed due to an upgrade. How is buying a CPU cooler used, really? Isn't that well worth the money, or? Seeing the pics, it seems to be in top notch condition as well!

EDIT2: Also, are there alternatives to the mentioned DDR4 memory? The one suggested is not available anywhere here where i am; Norway. Or, it is available, but at a big cost.


----------



## Selaya (Dec 1, 2021)

Looks like the Define R6's compatible w/ the NH-D15. I'd go for that, in that case.

As for the Memory, unless you're into Memory OC and are willing to splurge out for some B-Die, any 3600-C16 will do, really. Maybe 3200-C16, depending on whether your 12700K can handle 1,800 MHz on the IMC or not, I guess ...


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 1, 2021)

Selaya said:


> Looks like the Define R6's compatible w/ the NH-D15. I'd go for that, in that case.
> 
> As for the Memory, unless you're into Memory OC and are willing to splurge out for some B-Die, any 3600-C16 will do, really. Maybe 3200-C16, depending on whether your 12700K can handle 1,800 MHz on the IMC or not, I guess ...


Ah, that DH-15 i have seen before, and it's been suggested before as well, so that definitely looks like a solid alternative. And it's just the regular D15, not the other D15 editions?

As for the memory... shouldn't i be going with 3600-C16, yes? If so, any suggestions for a 3600-C16 that will work great with my setup?


----------



## RandallFlagg (Dec 1, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ok, I won't. I will try to opt for a WD drive, yes. What's the difference between a 1TB and 2TB? Does W10 / W11 require that much space, or?



Other than space for apps, in a lot of cases the 2TB drives can be faster.  Not always.  

I personally would just steer clear of "QLC" drives.   They usually have DRAM that is great for smaller, frequent access files and benchmarks like CrystalDiskMark, but once you overload the cache they are slow.  The really cheap QLC ones have SLC in front instead of DRAM, which makes it the worst of all worlds.  

If you want a lot of space for cheap and balanced performance, the MP33 / MP33 Pro I'm using is around $180 for 2TB.  It's very middle of the pack on most things, but very good at sustained writes.  

However, if I did not already have a WD drive, I'd get WD just because of Acronis.









						Team Group MP33 512 GB M.2 NVMe SSD Review - Zero Thermal Throttling
					

Team Group's MP33 SSD is based on 96-layer TLC NAND from Toshiba paired with a new Phison controller that achieves impressive sustained writes and has the best thermals we've ever seen. Even when fully loaded, without airflow, there is no thermal throttling.




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## Selaya (Dec 1, 2021)

It depends on your IMC. As I've said, if it cannot do 3600 (1,800MHz) on 1:1 mode, I'm _pretty sure_ 3200 on 1:1 would be better than 3600 on 2:1. Happy silicon lottery.
As for which kit, honestly w/e is the cheapest and/or visually appeals to you. I'd recommend G.Skill (and avoid Corsair, esp their RGB line), but that's about it. Ultimatively it's Samsung or Hynix (rarely Micron) making those Memory chips anyways, so you can't really do all that much wrong (well, besides buying Elpida or something just as worse, I guess ...)

As for the NH-D15, yes just that. There's the NH-D15S which only features a single fan, but you shouldn't really consider that.
Oh, and one last thing, kinda related to the above: try to find Memory with low profile heatspreaders, or frankly just none at all (if that even exists, w/ XMP profiles) because the fan will overhand your memory.


----------



## AMF (Dec 1, 2021)

minstreless said:


> With Black Friday upcoming and my current PC is not doing its job that well any longer, as it is being overly slow and troublesome when it comes to loading etc. + I cannot play any of the new games that I wanna play because of the specs being bad and whatnot + it's about time to get myself a new PC. This time, I am going for an AMD-setup, and it would be great if it would last for a few years, like 5+ years or so. But, I do not need ALL the parts, as I do have some parts available, such as: monitors (I have 4 available), case (FD R6), power supply (I have a G3 650W now), Noctua-fans in various sizes, mouse and a keyboard. I do need the following parts, however:
> - CPU
> - CPU cooler
> - Graphics card
> ...


cheap and great performance is ryzen 7 3700 pro with x 370  crosshair VI hero wifi ac ( find a very nice used board already flashed to version 7306 dont go past  and you will have pcie 4.0 )with corsair vengence pro rgb ddr4 2666 oc to 3800 gtx 1060 6 GB  500GB wd sn850 around 850 nvme   and a single rail seasonic 80+ gold or better psu should run u around bucks all in 1000 bucks all in


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## AMF (Dec 1, 2021)

xxxAMFxxx said:


> cheap and great performance is ryzen 7 3700 pro with x 370  crosshair VI hero wifi ac ( find a very nice used board already flashed to version 7306 dont go past  and you will have pcie 4.0 )with corsair vengence pro rgb ddr4 2666 oc to 3800 gtx 1060 6 GB  500GB wd sn850 around 850 nvme   and a single rail seasonic 80+ gold or better psu should run u around bucks all in 1000 bucks all in


this is my set up message me if u want to see bernchmarks
'


----------



## Why_Me (Dec 1, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ok, I won't. I will try to opt for a WD drive, yes. What's the difference between a 1TB and 2TB? Does W10 / W11 require that much space, or?
> 
> @Why_Me , @Selaya and others; are there any other similar alternatives for a cooler that fits nicely along with my case (FD R6) + i7 12700K + Gigabyte Z690 Gaming X? What about the mentioned Noctua NH-U14S TR4-SP3? It's not water cooling, but seems to be a great one nonetheless. I am open for suggestions as the cooler is the one thing I have not yet ordered.
> 
> ...


https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90724396 
be Quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4 €62,10 excl. VAT plus shipping costs


----------



## AMF (Dec 1, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90724396
> be Quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4 €62,10 excl. VAT plus shipping costs


bigger drives are usually a tad bit faster   and $$$$$   2 x 500GB nvme in raid should do u good


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 1, 2021)

Selaya said:


> It depends on your IMC. As I've said, if it cannot do 3600 (1,800MHz) on 1:1 mode, I'm _pretty sure_ 3200 on 1:1 would be better than 3600 on 2:1. Happy silicon lottery.
> As for which kit, honestly w/e is the cheapest and/or visually appeals to you. I'd recommend G.Skill (and avoid Corsair, esp their RGB line), but that's about it. Ultimatively it's Samsung or Hynix (rarely Micron) making those Memory chips anyways, so you can't really do all that much wrong (well, besides buying Elpida or something just as worse, I guess ...)
> 
> As for the NH-D15, yes just that. There's the NH-D15S which only features a single fan, but you shouldn't really consider that.
> Oh, and one last thing, kinda related to the above: try to find Memory with low profile heatspreaders, or frankly just none at all (if that even exists, w/ XMP profiles) because the fan will overhand your memory.





Why_Me said:


> https://www.computeruniverse.net/en/p/90724396
> be Quiet! Dark Rock Pro 4 €62,10 excl. VAT plus shipping costs



Ahh, well, there were a lot of stuff i have no clue about and whether they are all useful  to me or not, so perhaps i should go for the 32gb G.Skill Aegis memory 3200mhz that @Why_Me suggested, as that will do the job more than good enough, seeing as there are not any other specific options/suggestions.

Yeah, that DR Pro 4 i have also seen before. I am sure either will do an outstanding job, right?


----------



## Selaya (Dec 1, 2021)

They're both fine. However, you'll have a _really bad day_ installing the DRP4, nothing beats Noctua's SecuFirm installation process. You have to decide for yourself what you value more, $30 of savings or an easier installation of your cooler


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 1, 2021)

Selaya said:


> They're both fine. However, you'll have a _really bad day_ installing the DRP4, nothing beats Noctua's SecuFirm installation process. You have to decide for yourself what you value more, $30 of savings or an easier installation of your cooler



Well, over here, the difference is only $10 between then D15 and DRP4, with the D15 costing the $10 more, which i can most definitely afford. Shouldn't that be a no brainer then, yeah?


----------



## tabascosauz (Dec 2, 2021)

Selaya said:


> They're both fine. However, you'll have a _*really bad day*_ installing the DRP4, nothing beats Noctua's SecuFirm installation process. You have to decide for yourself what you value more, $30 of savings or an easier installation of your cooler





minstreless said:


> Well, over here, the difference is only $10 between then D15 and DRP4, with the D15 costing the $10 more, which i can most definitely afford. Shouldn't that be a no brainer then, yeah?



D15 for pure performance, DRP4 for literally silent operation (I'm not kidding). There's not that much of a difference in performance between the two, D15 has the edge but the disparity in noise is very obvious, so it depends on what you value.

Meh, BQ's mounting system is.........just okay, you don't have to be that dramatic. It can just take a bit of getting used to. It helps immensely to have some empty space in the top of your case above the board (which it appears your Define R6 has a little bit of), because the DRP4's fan clips don't have any tabs on them (it's the fan clips not the mounting that kills you). Honestly, same goes for the D15 even though it has tabbed clips, it is a bigger cooler.

Pro: you get a big screwdriver with the cooler that is literally unparalleled in quality and versaility. Con: you_ need _that screwdriver to mount the DRP4.

Just make sure you are set on getting the Z690 Gaming X. The D15 only works with motherboards that have their first PCIe x16 slot moved down one slot position (no problem for most Z690 ATX boards).


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 2, 2021)

tabascosauz said:


> *D15 for pure performance, DRP4 for literally silent operation (I'm not kidding). There's not that much of a difference in performance between the two, D15 has the edge but the disparity in noise is very obvious, so it depends on what you value.*
> 
> Meh, BQ's mounting system is.........just okay, you don't have to be that dramatic. It can just take a bit of getting used to. It helps immensely to have some empty space in the top of your case above the board (which it appears your Define R6 has a little bit of), because the DRP4's fan clips don't have any tabs on them (it's the fan clips not the mounting that kills you). Honestly, same goes for the D15 even though it has tabbed clips, it is a bigger cooler.
> 
> ...



Ohh... really? So the DRP4 is THAT much quieter than the D15?! Yes, i greatly value noise, since the desktop will be in my mini-studio, hence why noise is an important point. I should have pointed out this earlier, sorry. :O Now i have to reconsider this... heh.

And yes, i have already ordered the Z690 Gaming X, so i am set for that motherboard.

I am not a tech-savvy person when it comes to computers (obviously), so easy mounting would also be good to have in place for a newbie like me. However, if i get great noise reduction vs some fiddling to get it done, the noise reduction wins. Maybe the Arctic LF II 360 is a better option than the D15 / DRP4 since it's water cooled?

EDIT: How is this RAM for my setup: G.Skill Ripjaws V Black DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (F4-3600C16D-32GVKC) - I ask because it's a lot cheaper than the mentioned G.Skill Aegis, and it seems to be more powerful?


----------



## tabascosauz (Dec 2, 2021)

minstreless said:


> I am not a tech-savvy person when it comes to computers (obviously)



You can always just set a lower fan curve for the D15 to reduce noise. Generally with Noctua 140mms they're pretty quiet below a certain threshold. But since you say that, I'm guessing you'll leave it as is, in which case DRP4 is definitely quieter. Especially if you run a 12700K with the stock fan curve (and even with a custom curve, Alder Lake gets hot eventually so it will be ramping up).

If money is no object and you aren't opposed to water, just go with the LF360. Alder Lake 8 cores want all the cooling they can get - yes you can get by with stout air coolers and yes you can make temps more tolerable by undervolting, but water still gets you the best perf.


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 2, 2021)

tabascosauz said:


> You can always just set a lower fan curve for the D15 to reduce noise. Generally with Noctua 140mms they're pretty quiet below a certain threshold. But since you say that, I'm guessing you'll leave it as is, in which case DRP4 is definitely quieter. Especially if you run a 12700K with the stock fan curve (and even with a custom curve, Alder Lake gets hot eventually so it will be ramping up).
> 
> If money is no object and you aren't opposed to water, just go with the LF360. Alder Lake 8 cores want all the cooling they can get - yes you can get by with stout air coolers and yes you can make temps more tolerable by undervolting, but water still gets you the best perf.


I assume that with LF360, you mean the mentioned Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360, yes? But yeah, that is actually priced the same as the D15, so doesn't that mean it's a no brainer to go with the LF360..? If that's the case, then i'll do so, yes! 

What's left then is to decide which RAM to go for with the 12700K + Z690 Gaming X-setup... The mentioned G.Skill Aegis 2x16gb 3200-C16 or something else from G.Skill, seeing that they have gotten very good reviews overall. Any thoughts/suggestions/alternatives on that?


----------



## Selaya (Dec 2, 2021)

Eh. All I know is my NH-D15 (w/ 3900X) has two modes - silent (540 RPM) and full blast. 
It's on silent until like 67C and then hits full blast when it reaches 72C (only does that on a full 24T load, when it will usually stabilise at 73C-76C), and I'm perfectly fine with that since on daily it's basically forever silent.
Obviously ymmv w/ another kind of CPU, but that's what I'm doing w/ mine.


----------



## Speedyblupi (Dec 2, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ahh, well, there were a lot of stuff i have no clue about and whether they are all useful  to me or not, so perhaps i should go for the 32gb G.Skill Aegis memory 3200mhz that @Why_Me suggested, as that will do the job more than good enough, seeing as there are not any other specific options/suggestions.


One of the best ways to find fast RAM at reasonable prices is PCPartpicker. If you select your country in the top right corner, set the "first word latency" filter maximum to around 9-10ns (or set to a specific speed and CAS that you want) and sort ascending on "price per GB" the top results should be the best value options in online shops in your country.



			https://pcpartpicker.com/products/memory/#xcx=0&F=6000000,10000000&sort=ppgb&page=1
		


At the time of writing there's a 2 x 16GB DDR4-3200 CL16 Silicon Power kit selling for only $90 on Amazon in the US, for example.
I'd normally recommend DDR4-3600 CL16, but the Silicon Power kit is 2/3 the price of the cheapest DDR4-3600 CL16 32GB kit at the moment so is probably the better option at the moment unless you really care about the <5% performance difference in latency-sensitive games.

It might be worth spending a bit more on your RAM now to potentially get better performance in games if/when you upgrade your GPU in the future, especially if you play at 1080p, but it probably wouldn't make any difference with a weaker GPU or at above 1440p in most games, as performance would be limited/bottlenecked by the GPU.


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 2, 2021)

Selaya said:


> Eh. All I know is my NH-D15 (w/ 3900X) has two modes - silent (540 RPM) and full blast.
> It's on silent until like 67C and then hits full blast when it reaches 72C (only does that on a full 24T load, when it will usually stabilise at 73C-76C), and I'm perfectly fine with that since on daily it's basically forever silent.
> Obviously ymmv w/ another kind of CPU, but that's what I'm doing w/ mine.





Speedyblupi said:


> One of the best ways to find fast RAM at reasonable prices is PCPartpicker. If you select your country in the top right corner, set the "first word latency" filter maximum to around 9-10ns (or set to a specific speed and CAS that you want) and sort ascending on "price per GB" the top results should be the best value options in online shops in your country.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hehe, silent and full blast. Easy choices that, yes. Well, it seems like the D15 is the one to go for then, if i cannot find that LF360, of course...

Ok, so here are the cheapest DDR4 2x16gb 3600 available for me today. Any of these that are worth for me to buy? (click image for bigger size) - 1500,- = roughly €150 / $160


----------



## Why_Me (Dec 2, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Hehe, silent and full blast. Easy choices that, yes. Well, it seems like the D15 is the one to go for then, if i cannot find that LF360, of course...
> 
> Ok, so here are the cheapest DDR4 2x16gb 3600 available for me today. Any of these that are worth for me to buy? (click image for bigger size)
> View attachment 227322


tbh I'd go for 3200mhz CL16 and call it good. Easier to set your timings and you'll see the same performance.


----------



## Selaya (Dec 2, 2021)

Well if you get something like CJR which is what most low- to mid-tier kits are these days it kinda can't time for shit, you'd need b-die for timings but that's usually an entire different price class.

Tbh tho, if 3600-C16's a lot more expensive than 3200-C16, i'd just go w/ the latter.


----------



## Speedyblupi (Dec 2, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ok, so here are the cheapest DDR4 2x16gb 3600 available for me today. Any of these that are worth for me to buy? (click image for bigger size) - 1500,- = roughly €150 / $160
> View attachment 227322


What website is that from? All of those prices look terrible to me, to be honest. You're Danish, right? PCPartPicker shows similar kits available in Denmark for under 1000kr, and you can get 3600 CL16 for under 1300kr.



			https://dk.pcpartpicker.com/products/memory/#sort=ppgb&F=6000000,9002250&S=3600,6000&Z=32768002


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 2, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> tbh I'd go for 3200mhz CL16 and call it good. Easier to set your timings and you'll see the same performance.





Selaya said:


> Well if you get something like CJR which is what most low- to mid-tier kits are these days it kinda can't time for shit, you'd need b-die for timings but that's usually an entire different price class.
> 
> Tbh tho, if 3600-C16's a lot more expensive than 3200-C16, i'd just go w/ the latter.





Speedyblupi said:


> What website is that from? All of those prices look terrible to me, to be honest. You're Danish, right? PCPartPicker shows similar kits available in Denmark for under 1000kr, and you can get 3600 CL16 for under 1300kr.
> 
> 
> 
> https://dk.pcpartpicker.com/products/memory/#sort=ppgb&F=6000000,9002250&S=3600,6000&Z=32768002



Well, below, i have sorted it to show only 3200mhz, and as you can see, the prices are about the same for 2x16gb, or on the same level as for the 2x16gb 3600mhz....

But sure, you guys know this more than i do, so if you say that 3200-C16 is the way to go, i will scout for offers on that.

*But, do you have any alternatives/suggestions for which of those models would be good for my setup? The G.Skill Aegis 3200-C16 that @Why_Me mentioned are not available for a cheap price as the stores that sell those are out of stock. So, any other alternatives that i can go for? 3200-C16 or 3600-C16?*

I am located in Norway, so DKK-prices are about the same as here in Norway due to the currency conversion. That particular site was prisjakt.no aka pricespy.co.uk. Do note that i cannot order from Amazon either, because of the long shipping time etc.


----------



## Selaya (Dec 2, 2021)

3600-c16 if it's priced the same as 3200-c16


----------



## RandallFlagg (Dec 2, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Well, below, i have sorted it to show only 3200mhz, and as you can see, the prices are about the same for 2x16gb, or on the same level as for the 2x16gb 3600mhz....
> 
> But sure, you guys know this more than i do, so if you say that 3200-C16 is the way to go, i will scout for offers on that.
> 
> ...



Cheap for a certain speed / CL isn't necessarily the best deal.   Also single rank memory can be significantly slower in real application use vs dual rank.

Anyway, I have been doing a lot of research on the topic of RAM for my own potential upgrade to AL.   These are currently in my wish list, they represent 3 tiers.  I should point out the low cost G.SKILL is Hynix.   

You can use Thaiphoon burner's SPD browser to see the exact specs and do more detailed comparison.  

But I think for the price point, these are good examples of 'decent' ($153) 'good' ($219) and 'great' ($279) memory.

I would not pair an AL CPU with DDR4-3200 C16.
​


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 3, 2021)

RandallFlagg said:


> Cheap for a certain speed / CL isn't necessarily the best deal.   Also single rank memory can be significantly slower in real application use vs dual rank.
> 
> Anyway, I have been doing a lot of research on the topic of RAM for my own potential upgrade to AL.   These are currently in my wish list, they represent 3 tiers.  I should point out the low cost G.SKILL is Hynix.
> 
> ...



Hmm, the 'decent' $153 is priced about $25 less than the G.Skill Trident Z Neo DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC) here where i live... shouldn't i go for the Trident Z then, or? My budget for the memory is about $200~ btw...

Any thoughts on that?

Gahh so difficult it was to choose the right RAM... Who would've thought...


----------



## tabascosauz (Dec 3, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Hmm, the 'decent' $153 is priced about $25 less than the G.Skill Trident Z Neo DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC) here where i live... shouldn't i go for the Trident Z then, or? My budget for the memory is about $200~ btw...
> 
> Any thoughts on that?
> 
> Gahh so difficult it was to choose the right RAM... Who would've thought...



With G.skill, all SKUs that have the exact same speed/timings/volts are literally the same. You won't get a higher chance of a better binned product just because you buy expensive heatspreaders. If you can live without RGB (which on Trident Z is a goddamn pain in the ass), save a buck with the Ripjaws. It'll be the same.

Between 3600CL16 (even if 16-19-19) and 3200CL16, there is no reason to go for 3200 unless it's dirt cheap and 3600 isn't. Period.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Dec 3, 2021)

Go with the 3600 kit with the lowest timings you can afford preferably at least 16-16-16


----------



## RandallFlagg (Dec 3, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Hmm, the 'decent' $153 is priced about $25 less than the G.Skill Trident Z Neo DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (F4-3600C16D-32GTZNC) here where i live... shouldn't i go for the Trident Z then, or? My budget for the memory is about $200~ btw...
> 
> Any thoughts on that?
> 
> Gahh so difficult it was to choose the right RAM... Who would've thought...



According to Thaiphoon, that Trident Z Neo is exactly the same kit as the Ripjaws just has RGB.

This is that as a single 16GB Trident NEO stick :









Here's the Ripjaws version :


----------



## tabascosauz (Dec 3, 2021)

RandallFlagg said:


> According to Thaiphoon, that Trident Z Neo is exactly the same kit as the Ripjaws just has RGB.
> 
> This is that as a single 16GB Trident NEO stick :
> 
> Here's the Ripjaws version :



No point in relying too much on Thaiphoon, for G.skill kits it's a horribly convoluted and unreliable way of trying to find out what something is. On G.skill, the 042 code on the DIMM sticker is basically law, AFAIK it's never been incorrect at least for the common ICs. There's plenty of guides over the years on reddit how to decode them, but anything ending in 8820C/8821C will be CJR guaranteed, which all of 3600 16-19-19 should be.

New G.skill packaging might or might not have a cutout to see the sticker, but in any case you'll have to handle the DIMMs anyway so you'll get to see it regardless. And much sooner than you can get to Thaiphoon.

Thaiphoon can only make an educated guess on what's programmed in the SPD, and just as often as it's correct it just goes completely wack. 8Gb C-die is often misidentified as 8Gb B-die, for years Thaiphoon liked to think CJR was DJR (G.skill will not be putting freq-happy DJR in a kit as lowly as 3600CL16), some crazy shenanigans going on with 16Gb dies as well - my own 4Gb E-die kit shows up as 4Gb D-die, which is untrue for various reasons that I don't even have to look at the sticker for.


----------



## winterwonderland (Dec 3, 2021)

tabascosauz said:


> With G.skill, all SKUs that have the exact same speed/timings/volts are literally the same. You won't get a higher chance of a better binned product just because you buy expensive heatspreaders. If you can live without RGB (which on Trident Z is a goddamn pain in the ass), save a buck with the Ripjaws. It'll be the same.
> 
> Between 3600CL16 (even if 16-19-19) and 3200CL16, there is no reason to go for 3200 unless it's dirt cheap and 3600 isn't. Period.





oxrufiioxo said:


> Go with the 3600 kit with the lowest timings you can afford preferably at least 16-16-16


Ahh, the only 2x16gb Ripjaws i can find for an affordable price are these, but how good are these: G.Skill Ripjaws V Black DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (F4-3600C18D-32GVK)... CL18-22-22... Otherwise, i will have to up the price with about $40 to get the one with CL16-19-19... If the difference is that big between the CL18 vs CL16, i can surely go for the CL16, as that one is within my budget. Should i do so or should i go for the $40-cheaper CL18..?

How about these, as these are priced $15 less than the CL16 Ripjaws: Kingston Fury Renegade DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (KF436C16RB1K2/32)

And yes, i do NOT need RGB. It is useless to me and my purposes.  Hence why the Trident Z are not an option for me + they are above my budget.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Dec 3, 2021)

Crucial Ballistix 32GB Kit (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3600 Desktop Gaming Memory (Black) | BL2K16G36C16U4B | Crucial.com
					

Buy Crucial Ballistix 32GB Kit (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3600 Desktop Gaming Memory (Black) BL2K16G36C16U4B. FREE US Delivery, guaranteed 100% compatibility when ordering using our online tools.




					www.crucial.com
				




This available in your region? I believe it's better than all the kits you've listed.

Typically for peope who can't afford decently binned bdie it's what I recommend. I would skip the CL18 stuff but maybe someone else can chime in on them vs that 16-19-19 kit.


----------



## tabascosauz (Dec 3, 2021)

oxrufiioxo said:


> Crucial Ballistix 32GB Kit (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3600 Desktop Gaming Memory (Black) | BL2K16G36C16U4B | Crucial.com
> 
> 
> Buy Crucial Ballistix 32GB Kit (2 x 16GB) DDR4-3600 Desktop Gaming Memory (Black) BL2K16G36C16U4B. FREE US Delivery, guaranteed 100% compatibility when ordering using our online tools.
> ...



I'm not so sure about that one. Last I checked isn't Crucial mixing Rev.E and Rev.B in that bin? If it's 16Gb Rev.B, then you get single rank performance penalty, unless you step up to 2x32GB.

But I suppose it should be quite easy to tell if the sticks are single (Rev.B) or double sided (Rev.E).


----------



## Speedyblupi (Dec 3, 2021)

minstreless said:


> I am located in Norway, so DKK-prices are about the same as here in Norway due to the currency conversion. That particular site was prisjakt.no aka pricespy.co.uk. Do note that i cannot order from Amazon either, because of the long shipping time etc.


Ah, ok.

In that case the prices you were looking at before were a lot better than I thought because Norwegian kr is worth a bit less than Danish kr, and RAM prices are higher in Norway. IMO the best options on that list are the top one (HyperX Fury 3600 CL18) and the bottom one (Crucial Ballistix 3600 CL16). This is because all of the kits apart from the Ballistix are CL18 or 19, with fairly high (20+) tRCD and tRP, and most likely using Hynix CJR or DJR. The Ballistix uses either dual rank 8Gb Micron Rev E or single-rank 16Gb Rev B, both of which can run with significantly lower latency than CJR/DJR (16-18-18-38, and tighter subtimings).

So all of the kits on your list are basically the same apart from the Ballistix, so you may as well get the cheapest one, or if you want something a bit better, get the Ballistix as it's the only one that's significantly faster than any of the others.

The only real downside to the Ballistix is that you don't know how many ranks you'll get (though to be honest that applies to most XMP RAM that isn't Samsung B-die - I'm not sure how many ranks any of the other kits have either). Most new 2x16GB Ballistix 3600 CL16 kits seem to be single, but some are dual-rank. You could guarantee a dual-rank configuration by getting 4 x 8GB, but this would be slightly more expensive and you wouldn't have any free slots to add more RAM in the future. Dual-rank memory is sometimes slightly less stable, but has lower latency, so is faster.

Some Gigabyte Z690 DDR4 motherboards have memory stability issues with the old "F4" BIOS, but the new F6a version is better, and future BIOS versions may improve it further. If you get the motherboard and it has BIOS F4, I would update the BIOS before trying to enable XMP, especially if your RAM turns out to be dual-rank.


----------



## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Dec 3, 2021)

If productivity is your main priority then get Alder lake system.


----------



## oxrufiioxo (Dec 3, 2021)

tabascosauz said:


> I'm not so sure about that one. Last I checked isn't Crucial mixing Rev.E and Rev.B in that bin? If it's 16Gb Rev.B, then you get single rank performance penalty, unless you step up to 2x32GB.
> 
> But I suppose it should be quite easy to tell if the sticks are single (Rev.B) or double sided (Rev.E).



Didn't realize that... The op should purchase from a place with a good return policy then because I'd want the Rev. E for sure. All the kits I've come across (4) have been double sided.


----------



## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Dec 3, 2021)

tabascosauz said:


> I'm not so sure about that one. Last I checked isn't Crucial mixing Rev.E and Rev.B in that bin? If it's 16Gb Rev.B, then you get single rank performance penalty, unless you step up to 2x32GB.
> 
> But I suppose it should be quite easy to tell if the sticks are single (Rev.B) or double sided (Rev.E).


Lots of new ram from multiple brands are single rank due to component shortages  g skill agies is most certainly one of them

Anyway to the OP: Please cancel the sn550 and pick the Samsung 980 M.2, it's one of the better price to performance ssds for budget builds,  also the Crucial P5 is slightly better with Dram cach but slightly pricer, and finally WB just released the new SN 570 drive which seem to be good, just pick the cheapest one and you'll be happy


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## Speedyblupi (Dec 3, 2021)

tabascosauz said:


> I'm not so sure about that one. Last I checked isn't Crucial mixing Rev.E and Rev.B in that bin? If it's 16Gb Rev.B, then you get single rank performance penalty, unless you step up to 2x32GB.
> 
> But I suppose it should be quite easy to tell if the sticks are single (Rev.B) or double sided (Rev.E).


While this is true, most other DDR4-3600 2x16GB kits use 16Gb DJR, which would also be single-rank, but with worse latency timings. I believe some other kits use CJR (which would be dual rank) interchangeably with DJR, similar to what Crucial does with Rev B/E.
If you can find a 2x16GB kit that always uses CJR at a reasonable price it would probably be roughly on-par with single-rank Ballistix, or possibly slightly faster. Timetec sells a 2x16GB 3600MHz kit that they advertise as using CJR, but I don't know if it's available in Norway at reasonable prices.


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## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Dec 3, 2021)

As for the RAM I would pick the Crucial Ballisitx 3600mah, they are very good and reliable kits with rock solid stability, among the most recommended these days, don't mind the single rank concerns they have very minimal performance differences and about 70% of new ram are single ranks so its out of your control, unless you buy dual 16gb kit


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## winterwonderland (Dec 3, 2021)

Speedyblupi said:


> Ah, ok.
> 
> In that case the prices you were looking at before were a lot better than I thought because Norwegian kr is worth a bit less than Danish kr, and RAM prices are higher in Norway. IMO the best options on that list are the top one (HyperX Fury 3600 CL18) and the bottom one (Crucial Ballistix 3600 CL16). This is because all of the kits apart from the Ballistix are CL18 or 19, with fairly high (20+) tRCD and tRP, and most likely using Hynix CJR or DJR. The Ballistix uses either dual rank 8Gb Micron Rev E or single-rank 16Gb Rev B, both of which can run with significantly lower latency than CJR/DJR (16-18-18-38, and tighter subtimings).
> 
> ...





Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:


> Lots of new ram from multiple brands are single rank due to component shortages  g skill agies is most certainly one of them
> 
> Anyway to the OP: Please cancel the sn550 and pick the Samsung 980 M.2, it's one of the better price to performance ssds for budget builds,  also the Crucial P5 is slightly better with Dram cach but slightly pricer, and finally WB just released the new SN 570 drive which seem to be good, just pick the cheapest one and you'll be happy



Ok, i have now checked around a little, and it seems that the Crucial Ballistix Black 3600-C16 are not available either, at least not for the announced price of the shop, unfortunately. But, how are these in comparison to the Black ones: Crucial Ballistix Red DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (BL2K16G36C16U4R)? They are priced a tad bit LESS than the black ones and they are also available right now... How would the RED ones fit greatly to my system, or?

The SN570 1TB would be about €110 cheaper, so i could always order that one and then return the SN550 2TB? Doesn't that sound like a good plan, or?

*EDIT; Wow, so IF the Crucial Ballistix RED will work great with my setup, i can actually order them from the same shop as both the SN570 M.2 1TB (any inputs on that @Solid State Soul ( SSS ) ?) + the Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360, which will save me for some shipping cost as well!*


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## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Dec 3, 2021)

minstreless said:


> : Crucial Ballistix Red DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB (BL2K16G36C16U4R)? They are priced a tad bit LESS than the black ones and they are also available right now... How would the RED ones fit greatly to my system, or?


They are the same kit, just in red 



minstreless said:


> The SN570 1TB would be about €110 cheaper, so i could always order that one and then return the SN550 2TB? Doesn't that sound like a good plan, or?


SN570 just released about a couple months ago, it pack the latest nand chips which gives you better performance than the SN550, which is a VERY popular drive, so yeah, i'd say pick that one up if you can


minstreless said:


> *EDIT; Wow, so IF the Crucial Ballistix RED will work great with my setup, i can actually order them from the same shop as both the SN570 M.2 1TB (any inputs on that @Solid State Soul ( SSS ) ?) + the Arctic Liquid Freezer II 360, which will save me for some shipping cost as well!*


If you can pick those three at a great deal then yes go for it, all three are great products and  i heard very good things about the liquid freezer 2 360m, just make sure it has the LGA 1700 mounting kit or buy one.


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## tabascosauz (Dec 3, 2021)

Speedyblupi said:


> While this is true, most other DDR4-3600 2x16GB kits use 16Gb DJR, which would also be single-rank, but with worse latency timings. I believe some other kits use CJR (which would be dual rank) interchangeably with DJR, similar to what Crucial does with Rev B/E.
> If you can find a 2x16GB kit that always uses CJR at a reasonable price it would probably be roughly on-par with single-rank Ballistix, or possibly slightly faster. Timetec sells a 2x16GB 3600MHz kit that they advertise as using CJR, but I don't know if it's available in Norway at reasonable prices.



DJR is always an 8Gb IC??  

Again, if the info is from 2020 or earlier claiming to be "DJR" in a 3600 kit, it's just misinformed use of Thaiphoon that loves to think CJR is DJR...DJR only really took off in 4000-6000 kits starting this year, has way too much freq headroom to ever be in 3600 16-19-19, and if it OCs like crap and stops at 3800-4000 with basically no voltage scaling, it's CJR.

Hynix's common crappy 16Gb IC seems to be MJR in 2x32GB, but it's a shitty chip that is CL17 or CL18 at 3600.


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## RandallFlagg (Dec 3, 2021)

tabascosauz said:


> No point in relying too much on Thaiphoon, for G.skill kits it's a horribly convoluted and unreliable way of trying to find out what something is. On G.skill, the 042 code on the DIMM sticker is basically law, AFAIK it's never been incorrect at least for the common ICs. There's plenty of guides over the years on reddit how to decode them, but anything ending in 8820C/8821C will be CJR guaranteed, which all of 3600 16-19-19 should be.
> 
> New G.skill packaging might or might not have a cutout to see the sticker, but in any case you'll have to handle the DIMMs anyway so you'll get to see it regardless. And much sooner than you can get to Thaiphoon.
> 
> Thaiphoon can only make an educated guess on what's programmed in the SPD, and just as often as it's correct it just goes completely wack. 8Gb C-die is often misidentified as 8Gb B-die, for years Thaiphoon liked to think CJR was DJR (G.skill will not be putting freq-happy DJR in a kit as lowly as 3600CL16), some crazy shenanigans going on with 16Gb dies as well - my own 4Gb E-die kit shows up as 4Gb D-die, which is untrue for various reasons that I don't even have to look at the sticker for.



I think the XMP timings are more important than trying to guess which exact chip is there, unless someone is looking to do serious overclocking.  That's read from XMP profile, and should be accurate for the two I posted.  Both of those kits are identical in their XMP settings, but yes getting CJR vs DJR is a crap shoot.  I would suspect the Trident maybe has slightly better chance of being a better bin, but that's not guaranteed.  You're still basically paying for LEDs.

The chip bin is irrelevant though unless one is going to OC them, and that uncertainty level doesn't go away by choosing different RAM unless they specifically note it is something like Samsung B-Die.  Even then, it's entirely possible to get B-Die that is crap and won't OC as well.  I don't think OP is someone who is going to seriously OC their RAM though, most are not, and these kits are reasonably fast at just XMP settings.  

Like I said I considered that to be a 'decent' kit.  For someone who wants to do really low latency high speed DDR4, they're still going to need to fork up more like $280 for 32GB kit.


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## winterwonderland (Dec 3, 2021)

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:


> They are the same kit, just in red
> 
> 
> SN570 just released about a couple months ago, it pack the latest nand chips which gives you better performance than the SN550, which is a VERY popular drive, so yeah, i'd say pick that one up if you can
> ...



Awesome! Then i will order all 3 parts (LF360, Crucial Red 32gb + SN570 1TB) from the same store. Great stuff that then! Also, this is what the particular store shows is included within the package, and isn't that the LGA1700 mounting kit, or?:


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## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Dec 3, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Awesome! Then i will order all 3 parts (LF360, Crucial Red 32gb + SN570 1TB) from the same store. Great stuff that then! Also, this is what the particular store shows is included within the package, and isn't that the LGA1700 mounting kit, or?:
> View attachment 227470View attachment 227471


Unfortunately no, thats not LGA 1700 kit for the liquid freezer ii, it would seem you'll have to buy it separately









						LGA1700 Mounting Kit - Liquid Freezer II Series | MPSAS00891A
					

For mounting the Liquid Freezer II Series on Intel Alder Lake and Raptor Lake




					www.arctic.de
				




It should look like what you see inside the link above



minstreless said:


> Awesome! Then i will order all 3 parts (LF360, Crucial Red 32gb + SN570 1TB) from the same store. Great stuff that then!


Hey, happy to help


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## winterwonderland (Dec 4, 2021)

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:


> Unfortunately no, thats not LGA 1700 kit for the liquid freezer ii, it would seem you'll have to buy it separately
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ahh, bummer. It will cost a bit more than i can afford to. HOWEVER, the *Noctua NH-D15* is available for the same price at the same store, so i believe i will just go for the D15 instead. That's not a bad choice, right? It will fit nicely with my i7 12700K + Z690 GX + FD D R6? The mentioned Dark Rock Pro 4 is also available, but about $15 more expensive than the D15... Any thoughts on that?


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## oxrufiioxo (Dec 4, 2021)

D15 will be fine as long as you don't push the 12700k hard  and then run avx on it... It should be about the same as the dark rock cooler just uglier depending on your taste. 


If you are going with a noise focused case  thermals probably arent going to be great unless you have a really low ambient the chip sucks down 150w stock when stressed.


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## winterwonderland (Dec 4, 2021)

oxrufiioxo said:


> D15 will be fine as long as you don't push the 12700k hard  and then run avx on it... It should be about the same as the dark rock cooler just uglier depending on your taste.
> 
> 
> If you are going with a noise focused case  thermals probably arent going to be great unless you have a really low ambient the chip sucks down 150w stock when stressed.





Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:


> Unfortunately no, thats not LGA 1700 kit for the liquid freezer ii, it would seem you'll have to buy it separately
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ahaa, found the LGA1700-kit in the same shop in the end! 

BUT! Is this the mentioned WD SN570 M.2 SSD, or is this another model..?




If that is the right SN570, i shall place the order asap!


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## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Dec 5, 2021)

minstreless said:


> Ahaa, found the LGA1700-kit in the same shop in the end!
> 
> BUT! Is this the mentioned WD SN570 M.2 SSD, or is this another model..?
> View attachment 227593
> ...


It is, go for it



minstreless said:


> Ahh, bummer. It will cost a bit more than i can afford to. HOWEVER, the *Noctua NH-D15* is available for the same price at the same store, so i believe i will just go for the D15 instead. That's not a bad choice, right? It will fit nicely with my i7 12700K + Z690 GX + FD D R6? The mentioned Dark Rock Pro 4 is also available, but about $15 more expensive than the D15... Any thoughts on that?


D15 is the king of air coolers, cant go wrong with Noctua



minstreless said:


> Ahh, bummer. It will cost a bit more than i can afford to. HOWEVER, the *Noctua NH-D15* is available for the same price at the same store, so i believe i will just go for the D15 instead. That's not a bad choice, right? It will fit nicely with my i7 12700K + Z690 GX + FD D R6? The mentioned Dark Rock Pro 4 is also available, but about $15 more expensive than the D15... Any thoughts on that?


D15 is the king of air coolers, cant go wrong with Noctua


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## winterwonderland (Dec 6, 2021)

Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:


> It is, go for it
> 
> 
> D15 is the king of air coolers, cant go wrong with Noctua
> ...



Ordered everything now!  That means my final setup is this:

CPU: i7 12700K
Mobo: Gigabyte Z690 Gaming X
Memory: Crucial Ballistix 2x16gb 3600-C16
SSD: WD Blue SN570 1TB
Cooler: Air Liquid Freezer II 360 + LGA1700 kit

These parts will remain the same until some later point:
PSU: EVGA Supernova G3 550W
GPU: MSI GTX  970

That should be all decent, yeah?


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