# Help undervolting i7 8750h Throttlestop



## ourozz (Feb 12, 2020)

Hi everyone, 
i bought a msi gp73 8re laptop, over the course of a few days while playing it started to have a high cpu temperature, i decided to research and found the throttlestop, followed some tutorials and my temperature significantly reduced from ~ 85-95 to ~ 65-75,on gaming , but I noticed that I have some yellow frames in the limit table, in gta I have Ring -» edp other (yellow), and after running cinebench I have core-» pl1 (yellow) and Ring - » edp other (yellow) . Should I worry about this? Is there any way to fix it?


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## unclewebb (Feb 12, 2020)

PL1 in the log file shows that you are running into the long term 45 Watt TDP limit.  On some laptops, this limit can be increased.  On many MSI laptops, this limit cannot be increased.  This will force your CPU to throttle so it does not exceed 45 Watts.  In the FIVR window, try checking the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature.  First, click on the Install button beside that feature and follow the directions.  You need to download RwDrv.zip from Mega and then you need to unzip that and install the RwDrv.sys file into your ThrottleStop folder.  This helps some laptops get beyond the 45 Watt barrier.  









						MEGA
					

MEGA provides free cloud storage with convenient and powerful always-on privacy. Claim your free 20GB now




					mega.nz
				




Post a screenshot of your TPL window so I can see what you have your turbo power limits set to.  You have Speed Shift checked on the main screen but ThrottleStop shows that you do not yet have Speed Shift enabled.  If you want to use Speed Shift, you need to enable it in the TPL window.  After you do this, you should see SST in green on the main screen of ThrottleStop. 






Then you can set the EPP variable to 0 for maximum performance like you are doing.  You can set EPP to about 80 for something similar to the Windows Balanced power profile where the CPU will down clock when lightly loaded.  Some people like that.  When plugged in, I always set EPP to 0.  An EPP setting of 255 like the picture shows will turn your computer into a sluggish computer from the 1990s and should be avoided.

Your temps look good in the GTA V log file you posted and your CPU performance looks very consistent.  No problems there.  Happy to hear you got a significant drop in temps.  It makes gaming a lot more enjoyable and less stressful when your laptop does not feel like an oven.


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## ourozz (Feb 13, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> PL1 in the log file shows that you are running into the long term 45 Watt TDP limit.  On some laptops, this limit can be increased.  On many MSI laptops, this limit cannot be increased.  This will force your CPU to throttle so it does not exceed 45 Watts.  In the FIVR window, try checking the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature.  First, click on the Install button beside that feature and follow the directions.  You need to download RwDrv.zip from Mega and then you need to unzip that and install the RwDrv.sys file into your ThrottleStop folder.  This helps some laptops get beyond the 45 Watt barrier.
> 
> 
> 
> ...





First of all I would like to thank you for your help, I still haven't changed any values in the tpl window, can you help me fill in the most appropriate values?
I await reply, thanks again!


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## unclewebb (Feb 13, 2020)

Your TPL screenshot shows that you have the Turbo Boost Long Power Max set to 45 Watts.  Try bumping that up to 60 Watts and see if that is enough so you can run Cinebench without any power limit throttling.  Combine that with the Mega advice from above.  Even with these 2 tricks, some MSI laptops will still be limited to 45 Watts. 

In the TPL window I would check the Speed Shift option and hit Apply.  Also check the Enable Speed Shift when ThrottleStop Starts option.  After that, you can adjust the Speed Shift Min and Max values to the same ones that are shown in the Speed Shift Range box. (1 and 41)

For PP0 Current Limit, set that to 100.

Go do some more testing with Limit Reasons open and see if anything lights up in red.  A Log File is best so you have a thorough record of your CPU's performance.


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## ourozz (Feb 13, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> Your TPL screenshot shows that you have the Turbo Boost Long Power Max set to 45 Watts.  Try bumping that up to 60 Watts and see if that is enough so you can run Cinebench without any power limit throttling.  Combine that with the Mega advice from above.  Even with these 2 tricks, some MSI laptops will still be limited to 45 Watts.
> 
> In the TPL window I would check the Speed Shift option and hit Apply.  Also check the Enable Speed Shift when ThrottleStop Starts option.  After that, you can adjust the Speed Shift Min and Max values to the same ones that are shown in the Speed Shift Range box. (1 and 41)
> 
> ...




Here are the results after the changes, I checked the msi won't let me exceed 45 watts even after the changes! The Limit Reasons are the ones I had before, nothing red.
With this configuration I got the highest result in the cinebench.


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## unclewebb (Feb 13, 2020)

ourozz said:


> I checked the msi won't let me exceed 45 watts even after the changes!


This is a problem for many laptops.  Even laptops that are intended for enthusiasts are so locked down that you cannot get beyond the 45 Watt TDP limit.  During GTA V, power consumption tops out at about 30 Watts so the 45 Watt limit is not a problem.  It allows your CPU to run at full speed without any throttling.

In Cinebench, 45 Watts is not enough.  Cinebench needs at least 60 Watts so the CPU can run at its full rated speed.  As soon as the 45 Watt limit kicks in, you can see PL1 in the log file.  The CPU is forced to slow down ~350 MHz to keep power consumption in check.  This is not horrible compared to what some laptop manufacturers are doing but in my opinion, MSI is setting the bar too low.

MSI could have spent a couple of extra bucks on a better heatsink and went out of their way to make this laptop something really special.  Instead, MSI decided that building an OK laptop was good enough.  Automobile companies do not think like this.  When GM designed their new Corvette, they wanted to be the best.  I will never understand why so many laptop manufacturers think good is good enough.


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## Ch3m1zt (Mar 3, 2020)

oh , seems i m not the only one with the same cpu problem:S 2 days and nights of trying and learning the UV sht. never been a laptop guy so its kinda new for me. any luck with stable underclocks ? if do then maybe i cud have any reference points to start off ?


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## ourozz (Mar 3, 2020)

Ch3m1zt said:


> oh , seems i m not the only one with the same cpu problem:S 2 days and nights of trying and learning the UV sht. never been a laptop guy so its kinda new for me. any luck with stable underclocks ? if do then maybe i cud have any reference points to start off ?


what CPU do you have?
You can see through previous screenshots my configuration, that was the configuration that got the best results, but all cpus are different, you have to try and adjust until you get your best configuration.


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## Ch3m1zt (Mar 3, 2020)

i7 8750H and MSI GF62 8RE with 1060 6 gb and here are my setups so far i have managed to pull on it so i can play division 2 on 3,9 or so on cores and 70-85 c peaks ) still high but!, thats after couple of hours Division 2 around
same - 1.416 on intel IGPU and cache and core. still getting the power limit but there is a tutorial http://forum.notebookreview.com/thr...trol-of-the-i7-8750h-advanced-version.823065/ but havent got time to deal with it any further atm, gonna look into this tomorrow.

i just got somewhat stable enough thermals for today and not knowing sht about this program so yhea learning curve is huge. works so far.


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## unclewebb (Mar 3, 2020)

You have the Turbo Boost Long Power Max set to 46 Watts.  That might not be enough for a 6 core CPU to run at its full rated speed.  That might be why you are seeing power limit throttling.

Undervolting the Intel GPU does not do anything unless you also undervolt the iGPU Unslice equally.  You are using the Nvidia GPU while gaming so there is hardly any reason to undervolt the Intel GPU.  It will not save power because it is not being used and it might lead to instability.

You should be using the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature.

Edit - If your CPU is using Speed Shift, that box should be checked.  Post more pics if you want more advice.

Edit2 - Set the PP0 Current Limit to 100.  The default value of 0 might cause throttling problems.


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## Ch3m1zt (Mar 4, 2020)

_0_ big up for ur help mate and thank you for putting time into this, like i said i have never come across with this kinda problems before.
i ll try change things around and give it a go. i tried locking the turbo power limits and ticked the clamp < and i couldnt reverse it later. no idea what these are and when i dont undervolt the igpu i get different results or laptop shuts down. :S gonna fiddle around with the suggestions and will come back with results 
where the PL1 and PL2 get the values on reaching, i mean what causes PL1 and what changes pl2
PS: great community


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## Ch3m1zt (Mar 5, 2020)

okay, after 2 days of tinkering around and unlocking some settings in bios, fallowing other thread i have results as fallowing which are the highest scores i have got so far in CB15 without massive thermal throttling or power throttling.
will continue stress testing later if other things ironed out. any other suggestions i could improve or change for better score and stable system?
cores are running @ higher clockspeed than before. dunno what caused that


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## unclewebb (Mar 5, 2020)

Ch3m1zt said:


> cores are running @ higher clockspeed than before.


Looks like you are using some core parking software so the majority of tasks are all being forced to run on the first core.  This allows the CPU to use the full 41.00 multiplier.  I am not sure if you are doing this deliberately or maybe Windows is doing this all by itself.

Try running Cinebench R20.  It takes longer to complete so it is a better tool to uncover throttling problems.  


			https://www.maxon.net/en-us/products/cinebench-r20-overview/
		


I would use the, "Download directly from Maxon" link that it provides.

I think a well cooled and properly setup 8750H can make it through the entire run without the multiplier in ThrottleStop dropping below 39.00.  Anything less is a sign of throttling.  

I still like setting the PP0 Current Limit to a fixed value like 100.  If you are not seeing EDP OTHER going red across all 3 columns in Limit Reasons then this might not be necessary.


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## Ch3m1zt (Mar 5, 2020)

thanks mate, i did unlock core parking in bios setup and made reg.edit settings towards it so i cud have free will  i might have been wrong!
btw uncle i have gone further in curve and thanks to ur effort teaching others i have found so much regarding this kinda cpus
for PPO. i dont know the values.... from what.... to where? any directions? coz 100 like i got suggested just turns it bad for real:S
ps: first thing in a morning i ll post what i have done in bios to reflect throttle stop. perhaps that helps out, within all changes so far.bare with me coz i can literally bake an egg on a fkn synaptics pad right now:S
* got all the benches. available to give results , gonna post  20 then fallowing


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## Osmandonate (Mar 10, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> You have the Turbo Boost Long Power Max set to 46 Watts.  That might not be enough for a 6 core CPU to run at its full rated speed.  That might be why you are seeing power limit throttling.
> 
> Undervolting the Intel GPU does not do anything unless you also undervolt the iGPU Unslice equally.  You are using the Nvidia GPU while gaming so there is hardly any reason to undervolt the Intel GPU.  It will not save power because it is not being used and it might lead to instability.
> 
> ...






unclewebb said:


> You have the Turbo Boost Long Power Max set to 46 Watts.  That might not be enough for a 6 core CPU to run at its full rated speed.  That might be why you are seeing power limit throttling.
> 
> Undervolting the Intel GPU does not do anything unless you also undervolt the iGPU Unslice equally.  You are using the Nvidia GPU while gaming so there is hardly any reason to undervolt the Intel GPU.  It will not save power because it is not being used and it might lead to instability.
> 
> ...



Hi guys! First of all thank you for all your insights and testing. I have a question regarding Throttlestop. I have a Razer Blade 15 2019 with an i7 9750h and a geforce 2070 max q.  I was wondering if I'm better off leaving the turbo ratio limits untouched from factory and undervolt or set all turbo limits to 36 (0r even 37) along with the undervolt.

Also, what would be somewhat optimal values for the Turbo boost power limits for the i7 9750h?

Thanks for your help!!!


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## unclewebb (Mar 10, 2020)

@Osmandonate - Every CPU and every laptop is unique.  It is always best to do your own testing on your own laptop.  What a modern 6 core laptop is capable of depends on how well designed the cooling is.  Some Razer laptops are not well cooled so it might be necessary to lower the turbo ratio limits to keep the CPU from overheating.  Some laptops leave the turbo power limits completely unlocked.  Some Razer laptops do the opposite and lock down the maximum turbo power limits.  If that is the case, there will be nothing you can do with ThrottleStop or any other software.  Locked is locked.

Time to start testing.  I find that Cinebench R20 is a good real world test for a laptop. 


			https://www.maxon.net/en-us/products/cinebench-r20-overview/
		


Also run some 1 or 2 thread tests of ThrottleStop's built in TS Bench test.  Laptops are designed to vary their speed based on how many cores are active so you need to test both full load and light load when under volting.  Somewhere around -100 mV to -125 mV for both the CPU core and cache is a good place to start testing.

The default long term turbo power limit for your CPU is 45 Watts.  You can try increasing the long and short in ThrottleStop both to 60 Watts.  You will also need to check the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits option.  Click on the Install button beside this option and follow the directions.  On some laptops, this can make a world of difference but if Razer has locked things down, you might be stuck at a maximum of 45 Watts regardless of any settings in ThrottleStop.

Post lots of screenshots and include a ThrottleStop log file if you would like me to comment on your setup.  In the Options window remember to check, Add Limit Reasons to Log File.


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## Osmandonate (Mar 10, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> @Osmandonate - Every CPU and every laptop is unique.  It is always best to do your own testing on your own laptop.  What a modern 6 core laptop is capable of depends on how well designed the cooling is.  Some Razer laptops are not well cooled so it might be necessary to lower the turbo ratio limits to keep the CPU from overheating.  Some laptops leave the turbo power limits completely unlocked.  Some Razer laptops do the opposite and lock down the maximum turbo power limits.  If that is the case, there will be nothing you can do with ThrottleStop or any other software.  Locked is locked.
> 
> Time to start testing.  I find that Cinebench R20 is a good real world test for a laptop.
> 
> ...



Unclewebb,

Thanks so much for the prompt response and for your time and willingness to help. I will run tests with Cinebench R20 as you have mentioned earlier.
Should I do this testing with the stock Power ratio Limits along with the undervolt?  That is 45, 44, 43, 42, 41, 40. Or should I reduce those power limit ratios along with the undervolt and test?

Again, thanks for your help!


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## unclewebb (Mar 10, 2020)

Just do some testing. I would start with a basic undervolt of -100 mV and I would use the default turbo ratios. See what sort of temps and score you get running Cinebench. Open up Limit Reasons. See if anything is lighting up in red which indicates the reason for throttling.

Let your results guide you. If your CPU is thermal throttling at 45 Watts then there is no point trying to go beyond that unless you can find a way to improve cooling.

Post pics while your CPU is loaded. Your results will show what needs to be adjusted or fixed.


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## Osmandonate (Mar 11, 2020)

UncleWebb,

I just did a run with what you can see below. I noticed I had thermal throttling at -.0125 (both) and lots of PL1's during the multicore R20 run. Also at -0.125 temps seem to be rather high causing the thermal throttling.

I also run a single core with R20.

What is your take? I apologize if I'm missing something.

Thanks again!

Unclewebb,

Also, I seemed to have found a good spot with temps and performance setting all the cores at 3.6 with an undervolt of -0.149. I run Battlefield V for about 10 minutes and there wasn't any thermal throttling or power limit throttling. The average temp for all cores was below 90 degrees (86 average) but threre were a few cores that spiked to 93-93 degrees. In Battlefield V, Performance wise, the results are on par or better that having all the cores running with the stock power ratios (45,44,43,42,41,40) and there wasn't any kind of throttling.

The only throttling that was present was during the Cinebench R20 run was Power limit throttling which started kicking in the middle of the R20 testing.

Cinebench R20 results: Stock Power Ratios Multicore: 2597 (There was thermal throttling, Power limit throttling.......) high temps in all cores
Cinebench R20 results: 3.6 Power ratios Multicore: 2730 (The only throttling was Power Limit throttling) temps stayed cooler for sure, in the 80's.

If you wish I can try to send you screenshots of this scenario 

Would you leave the computer running @ 3.6 or should I stick to the stock ratios and try to undervolt until it becomes stable?


Thanks again!


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## unclewebb (Mar 11, 2020)

What all your info shows is that your CPU can happily run at up to 75 Watts.  Your cooling system was not designed for that so you immediately run into thermal throttling.  Some people like to replace the thermal paste to try and improve cooling.  The max core temps are varying from 86°C to 100°C.  That is a significant amount of variation and is usually a sign that the heatsink is not sitting square on the CPU cores or the thermal paste job was less than great.  

Long term, your CPU is limited to 45 Watts.  Some manufacturers allow the CPU to go beyond this limit.  Long term, Razer clamps things down so you cannot exceed the 45 Watt TDP limit.  There is nothing you can do about that.

For comparison, a well cooled 9750H with unlocked power limits can hit 3200 points in the Cinebench R20 test.  Razer laptops that are locked down cannot compete with this.









						Berfs1`s Cinebench - R20 score: 3203 cb with a Core i7 9750H
					

The Core i7 9750Hscores getScoreFormatted in the Cinebench - R20 benchmark. Berfs1ranks #803 worldwide and #5 in the hardware class. Find out more at HWBOT.




					hwbot.org
				




For the turbo ratios, maybe you can stagger them more.  Instead of going from 45 to 40, you could try going from 45 to 36.  That way you would still have full speed when lightly loaded.  Spend a day or two playing around with all of these settings until you come up with something that works best for you and the apps / games that you normally run.


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## Osmandonate (Mar 11, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> What all your info shows is that your CPU can happily run at up to 75 Watts.  Your cooling system was not designed for that so you immediately run into thermal throttling.  Some people like to replace the thermal paste to try and improve cooling.  The max core temps are varying from 86°C to 100°C.  That is a significant amount of variation and is usually a sign that the heatsink is not sitting square on the CPU cores or the thermal paste job was less than great.
> 
> Long term, your CPU is limited to 45 Watts.  Some manufacturers allow the CPU to go beyond this limit.  Long term, Razer clamps things down so you cannot exceed the 45 Watt TDP limit.  There is nothing you can do about that.
> 
> ...



Unclewebb,

Thanks again!

Also, for the Turbo boost power limits since the laptop won't be able to handle 75 watts should I lower the values so as to get cooler temps in the CPU? Something like 50,70? 

Is there anything else on the snapshots that I should modify?

I really appreciate your help!


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## unclewebb (Mar 11, 2020)

I do not know if there is any difference in smoothness between thermal throttling and power limit throttling.  I think both Intel throttling methods work well.  The CPU is slowed down just enough so it does not exceed either limit.  

Setting your power limits to 50W or 60W for the long term limit and to 65W or 70W for the short term limit should be OK.  Long term, the ThrottleStop requested long term value is going to be reduced to 45W by the Razer firmware.  

Overall your settings look OK.  You seem to be gathering lots of knowledge about how Intel CPUs work and how to control them so they perform the way you want them to.  You can try increasing your undervolt.  Some CPUs might be happy when you go beyond -125 mV.  Many will start showing errors in benchmark tests or you will start to see light load BSOD issues if you go too far.


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## Osmandonate (Mar 11, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> I do not know if there is any difference in smoothness between thermal throttling and power limit throttling.  I think both Intel throttling methods work well.  The CPU is slowed down just enough so it does not exceed either limit.
> 
> Setting your power limits to 50W or 60W for the long term limit and to 65W or 70W for the short term limit should be OK.  Long term, the ThrottleStop requested long term value is going to be reduced to 45W by the Razer firmware.
> 
> Overall your settings look OK.  You seem to be gathering lots of knowledge about how Intel CPUs work and how to control them so they perform the way you want them to.  You can try increasing your undervolt.  Some CPUs might be happy when you go beyond -125 mV.  Many will start showing errors in benchmark tests or you will start to see light load BSOD issues if you go too far.



Unclewebb,

For the turbo time limit do you think I should change the time from 28 to something lower?

Yesterday after I run R20 I increased the PP0 current limit to 100 thinking that I was not getting enough power. Should I revert it back to 0?

Also, should I keep the "lock and disable turbo power limits" tab checked?  

Thanks again! I think I'm done asking you questions 

Once again I appreciate your time.


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## unclewebb (Mar 11, 2020)

Your turbo time limit setting will depend on your power limit settings.  Your cooling cannot handle your CPU at 75 Watts for more than a second.  If you set the short limit to 70 Watts, you will need to lower the time limit to maybe 1 or 2 seconds.  If you decide to go with a 65 Watt short term power limit, you should be able to get away with that for a longer period of time.  The variables and possibilities are endless.  Avoiding thermal throttling  is a good goal.  Try to come up with some settings that give you a couple of degrees of wiggle room.  No need to get too scientific about this.  Thermal throttling or power limit throttling will protect your CPU from damage.  

I do not think the PP0 Current Limit is important.  I would leave it at 100 to make sure it is not a reason for throttling.  Easier to adjust the power limits to control things.

I think the Lock and Disable feature is a good thing to leave checked.  It does not hurt anything using this feature.


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## Osmandonate (Mar 12, 2020)

Unclewebb,

I'm trying to set the turbo ratio limits as follows:

41,40,40,39,39,38 and the CPU only reaches 3.9 accross all cores. Is there anything I need to meddle with?

Any suggestions as of how you would personally set those limits? I'm just not sure how to stack them so it makes more sense.

Thanks again!!!!! You are either a teacher or you should become one   TY


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## unclewebb (Mar 12, 2020)

For the 9750H, the default multiplier when 1 core is active is 45.  Why have you decided to set this to 41?  What is your reasoning behind that decision?  If you run something simple like the TS Bench test and you set that to 1 Thread, is your CPU using too much power or is it overheating and thermal throttling when you have the 1 Active Core multiplier set to 45?

I am thinking, probably not.  When 1 or 2 cores are active, you can probably continue to use the 45 and 44 multiplier for those sort of loads without any worries.  The problem you are trying to fix is when all 6 cores are active.  It makes sense to lower that to 38 to keep the CPU temps from going nuclear.  It might also make sense when 4 or 5 cores are active to reduce those turbo multipliers.  When the CPU is lightly loaded, it is not causing any problems.  No need to change anything or correct a problem if that problem does not exist.

Do some more testing.  Set the TS Bench to a nice long test like 1024M.  Adjust the number of threads.  While this test is running, adjust the turbo multipliers to get a better feel for CPU speed vs heat and power consumption.  Kind of like Science 101.  Kids would have more fun in school if important stuff like overclocking was being taught.


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## Osmandonate (Mar 12, 2020)

Unclewebb,

So would it make sense for me to do something like 45,44,40,41,39,38? Would this make sense?

I'm just not sure if you can stack the multipliers in such order or if it needs to steadily be adjusted such as 45,44,43,42,41,40. With this configuration the CPU still runs hot.

Thanks a lot!!!!


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## unclewebb (Mar 13, 2020)

Osmandonate said:


> With this configuration the CPU still runs hot.


It is a 6 core CPU shoved into a laptop.  If you try to take advantage of all the performance that is available, of course it is going to run hot.  Intel has not made much progress in recent memory when it comes to die shrinks, reducing power consumption and reducing heat.



Osmandonate said:


> 45,44,40,41,39,38?


Did you do some testing or are those just numbers off the top of your head?

As long as the turbo ratio numbers go from highest to lowest, everything is fine.  In your example, you need to switch 40 and 41.

1 Core Active - 45
2 Cores Active - 44
3 Cores Active - 41
4 Cores Active - 40
5 Cores Active - 39
6 Cores Active - 38

If full load testing is too hot, instead of 38, maybe use 37 or 36.


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## Osmandonate (Mar 13, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> It is a 6 core CPU shoved into a laptop.  If you try to take advantage of all the performance that is available, of course it is going to run hot.  Intel has not made much progress in recent memory when it comes to die shrinks, reducing power consumption and reducing heat.
> 
> 
> Did you do some testing or are those just numbers off the top of your head?
> ...



Unclewebb,

Yes, that is exactly the problem I've always had. Squeeze the most of any of my systems......I mainly use the laptop for gaming and a litt



Osmandonate said:


> Unclewebb,
> 
> Yes, that is exactly the problem I've always had. Squeeze the most of any of the systems I own.....I mainly use the laptop for gaming and a little bit for web browsing. Since I'm so used to having my desktop at peak performance without a single issue I'm seeing the laptop as such when it's not ):
> 
> ...



Unclewebb,

For some reason while idling EDP other is constantly blinking across CPU GPU and RING sometimes it quickly glows red. I have checked the log and it's not indicating any kind of throttling. Also, when I check the clocks in HWinfo it's not throttling either but yet in the Limits window in TS is blinking yellow constantly.

I'm not sure why this is happening.....

TY!


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## unclewebb (Mar 13, 2020)

Any throttling while your CPU is idle is not too important.  EDP OTHER across all 3 domains is usually caused by the current limits being set too low.  The TPL screenshot you posted shows that the PP0 Current Limit is set to 0.  Try setting that to 256 and try increasing all of the IccMax values in the FIVR window as high as they can go (255.75).  That might get rid of those lights blinking.

The Limit Reasons screenshot you posted on the previous page does not show any throttling reasons lighting up.  If the above does not help, try setting your turbo ratios back to their default values just for testing purposes.


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## Deadshot330 (Mar 13, 2020)

Hey Everyone,

    I am using an MSI GS63 Stealth 8RE. My PKG Power seems much higher than most, and I am running lower clocks to help reduce temps; but I feel like I am on a thin line between thermal and power throttling. Just wondering if you guys see anything I should change to Help. Thanks.


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## unclewebb (Mar 14, 2020)

Your settings look OK. Laptops with 6 core Intel CPUs run hot. I would set all of the turbo multis to 39. You have lots of temperature headroom. No need to sacrifice performance. 

Intel considers any core temperature under 100°C to be a "safe operating temperature". That is why they have been setting the thermal throttling temperature to that value for the majority of their CPUs for the last decade. I think they know what they are doing. If this was a problem for long term reliability, they could easily lower that value but they don't.


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## TripleD (Mar 18, 2020)

Hi everyone,

I have an I7-8750H and a RTX 2060. I started using ThrottleStop because I saw that my CPU was always at max frecuency when i was using "Max performance" on my battery settings while using AC Adapter.
I tried undervolting and underclocking but I can't find my "sweet spot". A have been using the same settings since a week ago and I had good results until today, that the avg temperature has gone from 86º while playing AC Odyssey to 95º. Also my idle temperatures have always been at 55-60º but I can't get less than that, even with turbo disabled.
Here are my settings, what should I change? (TS screenshoot was before AC Odyssey and HWInfo after 5 mins with AC Odyssey open) I enabled turbo for gaming. 

EDIT: I think that I found some issues. My cpu is always at 5th and 6th core speed, it really doesn't matter if cores 1, 2, 3 or 4 are at less or more "turbo limit". My cpu will always be at cores 5th and 6th frequency. Also they will always be very hot. Unless I set the turbo limit at 28 or less on these cores, my cpu will always be running in games at +85ºC on all cores (and +90 on 5th and 6th)


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## maxsava0202 (Mar 22, 2020)

usually cinebench will be able to determine what is the lowest undervolt you can go, lower by -0.01V for every successful run (do 10 runs), once you hit the BSOD that means you've reached your CPU's undervolt limit. Then with that undervolt value do a long term stress test with prime95 or aida64, let it run for 10 hours, if it doesn't BSOD then you're good.
Showbox jiofi.local.html tplinklogin


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## Wuudsd8634 (Mar 27, 2020)

TripleD said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I have an I7-8750H and a RTX 2060. I started using ThrottleStop because I saw that my CPU was always at max frecuency when i was using "Max performance" on my battery settings while using AC Adapter.
> I tried undervolting and underclocking but I can't find my "sweet spot". A have been using the same settings since a week ago and I had good results until today, that the avg temperature has gone from 86º while playing AC Odyssey to 95º. Also my idle temperatures have always been at 55-60º but I can't get less than that, even with turbo disabled.
> ...


Literally the exact same situation for me, a couple of my cores seem to run WAY hotter than the others. Also running an i7-8750H and 2060.


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## unclewebb (Mar 27, 2020)

Wuudsd8634 said:


> a couple of my cores seem to run WAY hotter than the others


This is typically a sign that your heatsink is not sitting square to the CPU cores.  It might not have been tightened evenly when installed or else the thermal paste job is a mess.


----------



## Wuudsd8634 (Mar 27, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> This is typically a sign that your heatsink is not sitting square to the CPU cores.  It might not have been tightened evenly when installed or else the thermal paste job is a mess.


Thanks for the quick response.

I have a feeling that this may be the case indeed, I'll open it up sometime this week and check the paste. Should I worry about it in the short term?


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## unclewebb (Mar 27, 2020)

Intel CPUs will automatically thermal throttle and slow down as much as necessary to protect the CPU from damage if any of the cores get too hot.  No need to be too concerned as the CPU will look after itself.  For maximum performance, it would definitely be a good idea to investigate further when you have the time.


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## THANATOS (Mar 30, 2020)

Hi everyone,

I have a Lenovo Legion Y540 with i5-9300H so the max turbo for my CPU is 4.1Ghz. The thing is in FIVR control If I set the multiplier on one core to let's say 41x but the rest of the cores I set to 32x, then the clockspeed won't go higher than 3.2GHz. I tried TS Bench with only 1 thread and set SpeedShift-EPP to 0, there was no throttling, I was comfortably within thermal or power limit, yet nothing changed. If I set the other 3 cores to 41x then the clockspeed is 3990Mhz which is OK. Is there some way to set higher turbo to just one core?


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## unclewebb (Mar 30, 2020)

THANATOS said:


> Is there some way to set higher turbo to just one core?


No, that is not possible.  Intel CPUs determine what multiplier to use based on how many cores are active.  That is what the ThrottleStop FIVR - Turbo Ratio Limit adjustment controls.  If you have your turbo ratios set to 41, 32, 32, 32 then during a TS Bench 1 Thread test, you should be seeing an average multiplier as reported by ThrottleStop much closer to 41 than to 32.  Can you post a screenshot of ThrottleStop while running a 1 Thread test so I can have a look?


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## THANATOS (Mar 30, 2020)

Here are the screenshots. I just found out you need to set at least 3 out of 4 cores to higher multiplier to have higher clockspeed.
If I set cores 1-4 to 41x then clockspeed is 4GHz.
If I set cores 1-3 to 41x and the last core stays at 32x then clockspeed is 3.7-3.9Ghz.
If I set cores 1-2 to 41x and 3-4 to 32x then the clockspeed stays at 3.2Ghz and won't go any higher.


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## unclewebb (Mar 30, 2020)

@THANATOS - Is there any reason why you have decided to throttle your computer so much?  Intel CPUs are engineered so they can run reliably right up to the Intel recommended thermal throttling temperature which is not until they reach 100°C.  Your screenshot shows that Lenovo reduced the thermal throttling temperature to 94°C.  Your CPU has no chance of getting anywhere near the 100°C Intel spec.  If you really want to reduce your CPU temps while gaming, you are better off lowering the long term turbo power limit.  I would suggest leaving the turbo ratio limits at their default specs.


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## THANATOS (Mar 31, 2020)

Thanks for the reply.
Lenovo Legion has no FAN control and It's very noisy when the FANs start to spin and I don't like very high temperature, but I will change my settings a bit.


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## siddybaba (Apr 22, 2020)

Hi everyone,

I have an Asus ROG Strix Scar 2 (GL504GM) with i7-8750H and GTX 1060. I read extensively about undervolting the CPU across many different forums and arrived at a stable undervolt value after trial and error.
I passed the TS Bench without errors after multiple tests and I achieved a 10 degree reduction in CPU temp (playing BFV). Couple of days later, I noticed that the CPU started throttling (thermal, power, lower clockspeeds etc. couldn't pass TS bench without errors) and temps hit 95 degrees again!

Can anyone help me fine tune my setup? I'm attaching the screenshots of the exact settings I had before throttling began - thought I had it figured out!
P.S. The Limit reasons also had PL1, PL2, and EDP Other across Core and GPU as well

Any help is much appreciated!


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## unclewebb (Apr 22, 2020)

@siddybaba - ThrottleStop shows a check mark beside the PROCHOT box which means your CPU has been reaching its max temp and has been thermal throttling.  You are never going to see consistent performance from one day to the next if your computer is struggling to keep the CPU cool.  One day your computer might run fine and the next day, the sun comes out, your room temperature is a couple of degrees warmer and then your laptop is thermal throttling and running like a slug.

A turbo boost long setting of 70 Watts is great for performance but if your heatsink and fan cannot handle that power level then you need to either replace the thermal paste or lower this power limit.  Try 65W or whatever your heatsink and fan can handle.  The heatsink and fan are simply not enough to run a 6 core CPU at its full rated speed.

I would clear the BD PROCHOT box on the main screen.  Your CPU will still thermal throttle whether this is checked or not.  The Limit Reasons window shows that your laptop has been using this throttling method.  If you notice sudden and significant drops in FPS, this might be the cause.

I would check the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits box.

Can you undervolt a little more or do you start seeing TS Bench errors if you go much beyond -65 mV?  Many 8750H CPUs are stable at -100 mV.  Yours might not be due to the heat issues.

Lowering the long turbo power limit is the best way to sacrifice some CPU performance.  This will reduce temps and lead to more consistent gaming performance.


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## siddybaba (Apr 24, 2020)

Thank you @unclewebb for your response.

I've now ticked the "Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits" box, unchecked the BD PROCHOT box, and dropped the Turbo Boost Long to 65W as you suggested.
Based on these, couple of things to note:
1. On a cold booted system, I increased the undervolt to -69.3mV with no TS Bench errors.
2. Increased undervolt to -70mV and immediately got errors. Dropped to -69.3mV and got errors again!
3. Then I tested at every subsequent -1mV only to find that -64mV returns no TS Bench errors, giong back to my earlier value.

Finally, I further dropped the Turbo Boost Long to 60W, and now I've got a stablish undervolt at -64mV. Beyond this point, I start to see TS Bench errors.
But, I must say that there have been multiple times when even at -64mV I've run into errors. (I have never read anything like this before in any forum)
Max temps are currently at 88°C which is too high.
Regarding your point of 8750H stability at -100mV, I've read on a separate forum stating Asus laptops aren't undervolt friendly.

Could you please let me know, if there's anything else that I can tweak?

Thank you once again!


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## siddybaba (Apr 25, 2020)

Alright, so this is the best I could do on my own.

Scored 2,801 points on Cinebench R20 but I don't remember what settings I used. Can't seem to replicate it now!
Anyway, I somehow managed to push the undervolt to -70mV which passes the TS Bench test and I dropped Turbo ratio limits. I noticed that keeping 6 cores active at 36x kept the temps  <= 85°C which is what I'm targeting. However, CPU performance takes a big hit (as expected) scoring 2,605 points on R20. I ran BF5 on High settings and got decent (read: better than before) FPS with CPU temps at ~86°C.

What should my optimum Turbo Ratio Limits be? And what about the Turbo Time Limit? The combinations are endless and I'm just not able to find a satisfactory setting. I'm pretty cheesed off with Asus providing lousy thermal solutions. It seems I've to re-paste as last resort.
Current stable TS settings as attached.

Edit 1: I've maxed out the IccMax values. Not sure if that helps? What about PP0 Current Limit set at 100? In my previous screenshots it was at 0 and changing it to any other value would trigger the EDP Other limit immediately.


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## Thrasher (Apr 25, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> @siddybaba - ThrottleStop shows a check mark beside the PROCHOT box which means your CPU has been reaching its max temp and has been thermal throttling.  You are never going to see consistent performance from one day to the next if your computer is struggling to keep the CPU cool.  One day your computer might run fine and the next day, the sun comes out, your room temperature is a couple of degrees warmer and then your laptop is thermal throttling and running like a slug.
> 
> A turbo boost long setting of 70 Watts is great for performance but if your heatsink and fan cannot handle that power level then you need to either replace the thermal paste or lower this power limit.  Try 65W or whatever your heatsink and fan can handle.  The heatsink and fan are simply not enough to run a 6 core CPU at its full rated speed.
> 
> ...




Hello everyone!!
I need your help, I have a msi ge63 8re with i7 8750h and gtx1060.
I leave you my configs.
-
Playing cod warzone reaches maximum 95 degrees with the cooler boost 5 activated, and stays at 3.9ghz.
-
if I leave it in the speedshift at 128 the maximum temp is 84 degrees 
-
I want to clarify that where I live, it makes 34 degrees
I don't turn on the air conditioning because I don't think it's necessary 
 -
I hope you can help me


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## Medic7 (May 8, 2020)

Evening all,

I have watched a ton of videos online and read tons of forums (this one included) in regards to stop thermal and power limit throttling. However I still seem to be getting that issue. While playing games, which are not even of high intensity.

In order to monitor it better I have been using XTU (ONLY TO MONITOR) thermal and power throttling. I did not try undervolt or change any settings with XTU as I used Throttlestop for that. I did hear that running the two together could cause an issue but surely only if you had undervolted on both programs?

Attached are the screen shots of my ThrottleStop setup. Any advice is appreciated as to what I am doing wrong that I still get Thermal Throttled, and Power Limit throttle and my fps drop like crazy.

Edit: It is not in the screenshots, but for the CPU Core Offset Voltage, CPU Cache Offset Voltage and Intel GPU Offset Voltage I have it set to - 135.7 mv. 

Specs: GTX1060, i7 8750H CPU, 16GB


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## unclewebb (May 8, 2020)

When under volting the Intel GPU, you need to under volt the iGPU Unslice equally. If you are using an Nvidia GPU while gaming, I would leave the Intel GPU and the iGPU Unslice offset voltages at their default values. No use causing instability.

If your laptop is poorly engineered and has inadequate cooling, there is not much you can do about that. What laptop model do you have?

Are you using the Windows high performance power profile? The turbo time limit should be set to the default value of 28 seconds. Every time I see that someone has maxed that out to 3,670,016 seconds, I know they have been following a bad guide. That time value is equivalent to more than 42 days. No reason to do that.

Are you willing to disassemble your laptop to try and fix the cooling issues? That seems to be a problem.

Do not use the Speed Shift Max value to control your maximum CPU speed (34) and then use a completely different value (39) for the turbo ratio limits. If your cooling system cannot handle a 45 Watt CPU then lower your long term turbo power limit to a value that your cooling can handle. Maybe 40 Watts or 35 Watts. I was helping one person recently and he could only run his 45 Watt CPU at 15 Watts. Any more and his GPU would get too hot and start throttling. That is just terrible design.

Turn the Log File option on and go play a game. Let's see how your CPU is performing. Turn on the Add Limit Reasons to Log File option and Nvidia GPU monitoring in the Options window. Attach a log file to your next post. It will be in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder.

Do some testing with Cinebench R20. It is a good real world test. It will allow you to keep a close eye on your CPU while this test is running and you can also make adjustments in ThrottleStop while this test is running to get a better feel for the program. A properly engineered laptop with an 8750H can run this entire test at the 39.00 multiplier without a hint of throttling. See how your laptop does against that benchmark.



			https://www.maxon.net/en-us/products/cinebench-r20-overview/


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## Medic7 (May 8, 2020)

Thank you for the response. 

I am not sure if the settings I have correct for ThrottleStop are now better/ correct in your view now? Will attach screenshot for the changes I have made under your advice and from what I understood. 

As for the model of Laptop it is a _Dell G5_ 15 5587 .  I do not want to take it apart even though I'm sure doing a repaste might actually help at this point? 

For the power mode, I don't see the option for high performance. I do however have the power plan set for "Dell Ultra Preformance" which also boosts the fans to the max. 

I have completed the test, and attached a screenshot for when it started with Throttle Stop Limits Open and showing red and a screenshot for when it ended. 

Please let me know, what I should change.


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## unclewebb (May 9, 2020)

Medic7 said:


> it is a _Dell G5_ 15 5587


Dell was going to be my first guess. They have a knack for building laptops which include powerful 6 core CPUs but sometimes they forget to include an adequate heatsink and fan. Excessive throttling and poor overall performance are the result. An 8750H in a properly engineered chassis can score over 3000 points in Cinebench R20. Your laptop definitely has lots of room for improvement. What temperature was your CPU at when running Cinebench? Your pictures are great but you cropped off most of the ThrottleStop data in that picture.



Medic7 said:


> For the power mode


The Dell Ultra Performance power mode looks good to me.

For a baseline, go into the TPL window and set both of the turbo power limits to 45 Watts. Your CPU has a 45 Watt TDP rating so with proper cooling, it should be able to maintain itself at that power level without overheating.

Open the ThrottleStop Options window and check the box, Add Limit Reasons to Log File. This will help with troubleshooting. Also check the Nvidia GPU box. On the main screen of ThrottleStop, check the Log File option and then go play a game for at least 15 or 20 minutes. Hopefully long enough so if your computer has any throttling issues, this information should be recorded in the log file. When you are finished testing, exit your game and then exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize the log file.

Look in your ThrottleStop / Logs folder and you will see the log file. Attach this file to your next post. I need to see some data that shows how your CPU is performing during normal use.

Edit - Your Speed Shift Max value is still set to 35. Set it back to its default value of 41. You can leave the Turbo Ratios all set to 39. That is OK for initial testing purposes.


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## Medic7 (May 9, 2020)

Afternoon,

I have done the corrections on my throttle stop. I will post screenshots again for you to view. I have also run cinabench and taking screenshots of the results and temp from throttle stop during and after running it. Lastly I have run Rising Storm 2 (not a very graphic intense game) for about 20 min and there was major fps dropping. I will attached the log created from throttlestop for it and also another log I made for cinabench.

Clearly these throttlestop adjusts are not working for my laptop correct?


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## unclewebb (May 9, 2020)

Medic7 said:


> Clearly these throttlestop adjusts are not working for my laptop correct?


We have not made any adjustments yet. I am trying to see how your laptop is performing at its default specs. Including lots of pictures and log files will help me understand what is going on with your laptop.

Keep in mind that if a laptop is poorly designed and has inadequate cooling and you are not willing to pull it apart and re-engineer it, there is only so much that you can do. Some of your screenshots show your CPU is getting up to 100°C and thermal throttling. That is just bad design on Dell's part.


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## Medic7 (May 9, 2020)

Yeah... I won't be purchasing a Dell Laptop anytime soon after this... or make sure on how good the thermals on are on a "Gaming Laptop"prior to purchase. Will be waiting for any other advice on further conficguration.


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## unclewebb (May 9, 2020)

Your Gaming log tells the story. When you first start, CPU power consumption is around 25W and everything is OK. Once you get into the game, power consumption increases to 35W and your CPU temperature starts to increase. There are already some random throttling episodes where the CPU MHz briefly drops to just over half of its rated speed. The CPU continues to get hotter until it reaches the maximum thermal throttling temperature. Thermal throttling continues for quite a while. The throttling brings the CPU back towards 25W but still the heatsink and fan cannot keep up. The additional heat within the laptop chassis has the GPU temp going up and up until it too hits 95°C.

Things are out of control so the power limit gets dropped to about 13W. That helps out a little but now Dell decides to get really aggressive and drops the power limit down to about 7.5W. Someone at Dell thinks that a 45W CPU throttled down to 7.5W is acceptable. This causes the CPU MHz to plummet down to 800 MHz. The 8750H is quite capable of running this game at 3900 MHz without a hint of throttling. Dell thinks 800 MHz is good enough. That is disgusting. There is no doubt that when this happens your FPS are going to drop like a rock and your game will become unplayable.

As you continue to try to use your computer, the throttling schemes cycle. Thermal throttling, power limit throttling, severe power limit throttling, severe MHz throttling, etc., over and over again. If Dell claims that this laptop computer can be used for gaming, they lied. A modern computer that throttles down to 800 MHz for 50 second stretches at a time is unusable and unacceptable.

The chassis is not capable of cooling a 45W CPU anytime that the GPU is active such as when gaming. You can use ThrottleStop to reduce your CPU speed or you can use ThrottleStop to reduce your CPU power consumption significantly. The goal is to try and avoid these severe throttling cycles that your laptop is going through. The heatsink and fan are overwhelmed when trying to run at default specs.

Some users use the Disable Turbo feature to try to control things. I prefer setting the long term turbo power limit in the TPL window to a value that the cooling system can handle. For your laptop, when playing this game, I would try limiting your 45W CPU down to 15W. This might give you more consistent performance and will help you avoid the severe throttling that this laptop is prone to. From what I can see, 15W or maybe 20W for the CPU is about all this laptop chassis can handle.


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## Max(IT) (May 10, 2020)

Just to add my experience here, and to highlight a very different behavior on my Dell G7 7790, I'm not experiencing that aggressive level of throttling on my laptop. Quite on the contrary, my notebook used to be quite hot while gaming because the CPU keep very high settings (around 4 Ghz) most of the times, with CPU temps above 90° C while gaming.
Basically it didn't throttle until hit the 100° C threshold, and even then, it throttled very little.
Since I don't like my computer to operate constantly near its limits, thanks to this fantastic utility (Throttlestop ... it is great !) I managed to slightly undervolt the CPU (i7-9750H) to -135mV, rock stable, and I set Turbo Ratio Limits to 45-44-42-41-40-39 (so a very little reduction) just to avoid to hit 90° C when fully loaded.
I also set Speed Shift EPP to 110, which I found to be a good compromise.
Now I'm playing most intensive games (which seems to be Rainbow Six Siege I don't know why) with CPU temperatures in the 80/85° range, and CPU clock in the 3.2/3.6 Ghz interval. Perfect.

I don't know why more recent games like AC Origins seems to be less CPU intensive: temperatures are in the 75/80° C range and CPU clock usually is in the 3/3.2 Ghz range.

As a further clarification, the default Turbo Boost Power Limits where 90W for both shot and long times. I modified it to be 90W on short and 60W on long.
PP0 current limit was set at 170 and I left it unchanged.


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## Thrasher (May 10, 2020)

Hello everyone again.
I leave some captures I hope you can tell me how I'm going.
-
the captures are after seeing past cinebench, I reach 2477 points.
-
notebook msi. i7 8750h and gtx 1060



Max(IT) said:


> Just to add my experience here, and to highlight a very different behavior on my Dell G7 7790, I'm not experiencing that aggressive level of throttling on my laptop. Quite on the contrary, my notebook used to be quite hot while gaming because the CPU keep very high settings (around 4 Ghz) most of the times, with CPU temps above 90° C while gaming.
> Basically it didn't throttle until hit the 100° C threshold, and even then, it throttled very little.
> Since I don't like my computer to operate constantly near its limits, thanks to this fantastic utility (Throttlestop ... it is great !) I managed to slightly undervolt the CPU (i7-9750H) to -135mV, rock stable, and I set Turbo Ratio Limits to 45-44-42-41-40-39 (so a very little reduction) just to avoid to hit 90° C when fully loaded.
> I also set Speed Shift EPP to 110, which I found to be a good compromise.
> ...



Would it only work for 9750?


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## Max(IT) (May 10, 2020)

Thrasher said:


> Hello everyone again.
> I leave some captures I hope you can tell me how I'm going.
> -
> the captures are after seeing past cinebench, I reach 2477 points.
> ...


Most of my settings would be fine on an i7-8750H, since it is very similar to 9750H.
Some other are more specific to the Dell G7 7790, since they are involving TDP and heath management of that specific model.
But you can surely try on your computer.

You seem to be using a quite aggressive downvolting, which is fine if your CPU can manage it. But you are using a setting of 0 in Speed Shift EPP.
On my notebook a setting of 0 means the CPU will stay at maximum clock all the time, which is not so good for temperatures.


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## Thrasher (May 11, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> Most of my settings would be fine on an i7-8750H, since it is very similar to 9750H.
> Some other are more specific to the Dell G7 7790, since they are involving TDP and heath management of that specific model.
> But you can surely try on your computer.
> 
> ...



Thank you very much for answering. What value in undervolt and speed shift epp would you recommend?



siddybaba said:


> Alright, so this is the best I could do on my own.
> 
> Scored 2,801 points on Cinebench R20 but I don't remember what settings I used. Can't seem to replicate it now!
> Anyway, I somehow managed to push the undervolt to -70mV which passes the TS Bench test and I dropped Turbo ratio limits. I noticed that keeping 6 cores active at 36x kept the temps  <= 85°C which is what I'm targeting. However, CPU performance takes a big hit (as expected) scoring 2,605 points on R20. I ran BF5 on High settings and got decent (read: better than before) FPS with CPU temps at ~86°C.
> ...



I am waiting for your great configuration haha


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## Max(IT) (May 11, 2020)

Thrasher said:


> Thank you very much for answering. What value in undervolt and speed shift epp would you recommend?


That’s depends on your system.
I would start with -100 mV, check stability and then move further down, but since you are already at -179 mV, you probably have a lucky cpu. I would set -150 mV just to be on the safe side.
regarding epp, I found a good compromise between 64 and 100 on my system, and I set 100 because my CPU is quite hot (I should repaste it in the future).
Do some tests on your laptop to check temperatures while gaming.


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## Thrasher (May 11, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> That’s depends on your system.
> I would start with -100 mV, check stability and then move further down, but since you are already at -179 mV, you probably have a lucky cpu. I would set -150 mV just to be on the safe side.
> regarding epp, I found a good compromise between 64 and 100 on my system, and I set 100 because my CPU is quite hot (I should repaste it in the future).Do some tests on your laptop to check temperatures while gaming.


Thank you very much for your advice, I had forgotten to activate the cooler boost of the notebook thanks to that I reach 2600 points in cinebench, regarding the fivr what damage can it cause?
I am considering changing the thermal paste because I realize that only one core exceeds 90 degrees.


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## Max(IT) (May 11, 2020)

Thrasher said:


> Thank you very much for your advice, I had forgotten to activate the cooler boost of the notebook thanks to that I reach 2600 points in cinebench, regarding the fivr what damage can it cause?
> I am considering changing the thermal paste because I realize that only one core exceeds 90 degrees.


Too much undervolting usually doesn’t damage anything. It just brings instability to the system.

The fact just one core exceeds 90° most probably isn’t related to its physical position on the die. It is more stressed than others because most of the times the CPU could not share the load in an even way among every cores, so one (or two) could be more stressed than others.


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## Medic7 (May 12, 2020)

Does this make sense to anyone? Maybe this is my problem? The intergrated GPU, CPU and my Nvidiea GPU are running at the same time? Should only the CPU and Nvidea GPU be running when playing a game? Also should the GPU usage also be much higher than 17%?

Also I have made sure through the Nvidea Control Panel to make sure the game uses my Nvidea GPU.


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## Caring1 (May 12, 2020)

Medic7 said:


> Does this make sense to anyone? Maybe this is my problem? The intergrated GPU, CPU and my Nvidiea GPU are running at the same time? Should only the CPU and Nvidea GPU be running when playing a game? Also should the GPU usage also be much higher than 17%?
> 
> Also I have made sure through the Nvidea Control Panel to make sure the game uses my Nvidea GPU.


Try taking a screen shot during the gameplay, not at idle.


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## morgothe (May 20, 2020)

Hello, my laptop Asus ROG GL704GW-DS76 processor i7 8750h, RTX2070. I tried to do undervolting with turbo boost enabled, in this mode, the voltage turned out to lower the maximum by -65.6 mV (and then I caught the BSOD once an hour), if I disable the turbo boost, it turned out to lower to 100.6 and it is stable for me, help me how to configure correctly for my thottlestop processor so that the turbo bus still works stably. BTW my laptop has an unlocked BIOS with all settings.


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## Max(IT) (May 21, 2020)

morgothe said:


> Hello, my laptop Asus ROG GL704GW-DS76 processor i7 8750h, RTX2070. I tried to do undervolting with turbo boost enabled, in this mode, the voltage turned out to lower the maximum by -65.6 mV (and then I caught the BSOD once an hour), if I disable the turbo boost, it turned out to lower to 100.6 and it is stable for me, help me how to configure correctly for my thottlestop processor so that the turbo bus still works stably. BTW my laptop has an unlocked BIOS with all settings.


unfortunately every CPU is different...
An i7-8750H should works fine at -130/-150 mV, but your is different (that's the reason they set the voltage at the default value... to let EVERY CPU to work).
I would not disable Turbo Boost: you are reducing the performance of your CPU.
If you are facing thermal issues, you could slighlty reduce Turbo Boost Ratio Limits.


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## morgothe (May 23, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> unfortunately every CPU is different...
> An i7-8750H should works fine at -130/-150 mV, but your is different (that's the reason they set the voltage at the default value... to let EVERY CPU to work).
> I would not disable Turbo Boost: you are reducing the performance of your CPU.
> If you are facing thermal issues, you could slighlty reduce Turbo Boost Ratio Limits.



Thanks for the answer! And how much do you recommend reducing the Turbo Boost Ratio?


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## Max(IT) (May 24, 2020)

morgothe said:


> Thanks for the answer! And how much do you recommend reducing the Turbo Boost Ratio?


it depends on your system.
IIRC on an i7-8750H defaults turbo ratio are 41-41-40-40-39-39.
On the system I fixed a couple weeks ago the setting 41-40-39-38-37-36 was enough to keep temperatures under control.
And 3.6 Ghz on all cores is much better than the 2.2 GHz you are limiting disabling turbo.

If you have a very poor cooled notebook, you could try something even more conservative (like 41-38-36-34-33-32).
You just have to findo out what fits your needs.

PS: you could also works on Speed Shift EPP, since your is set to 0 (that means your CPU is going for maximum performance every time): try more conservative setting like 99/109 for instance...


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## JustCraftMe (Jun 3, 2020)

Hi everyone!
Despite all these advices, i'm tryin'g to undervolt my I7-8750h on my msi laptop (GP73 Leopard 8re ->8G RAM GTX1060-6G and i7-8750H) and i'm getting all theses BSOD when playing CIV or CS:GO while my pc stays stable when running Prime95 For 12 hours+.

I Was previously running smooth at -170 mv but after te 1st crash in game i got back to a safer -150.
Any help would be appreciated.


Here's some screenshots :







(all these sreenshots were took when i was just browsing this site and some more tabs in Brave browser)


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## Max(IT) (Jun 3, 2020)

not all the i7-8750H can operate at -150 mV core and cache.
I don't understand exactly what is the issue you are trying to solve here. If it is stable at -150 mV, just keep it. It is a good amount of undervolting.

Your notebook is quite hot while just browsing, but that's because of the EPP set to 0 that keeps your CPU almost constantly at 3.9 GHz. There is really no need for that.
I think the impact of EPP in Windows is highly underrated. All the people are looking for 0, which means best performance but also that your CPU is trying to keep maximum speed all the time.
The balance set for my Dell G7 is 84, and I'm using a "game accelerator" that set it to 0 when launching a game and then to 84 again when you exit the game.

By the way, you should show us the TPL tab screenshot also, since the PL2 flag means your notebook reached the maximum short time power limit.


----------



## JustCraftMe (Jun 3, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> not all the i7-8750H can operate at -150 mV core and cache.
> I don't understand exactly what is the issue you are trying to solve here. If it is stable at -150 mV, just keep it. It is a good amount of undervolting.
> 
> Your notebook is quite hot while just browsing, but that's because of the EPP set to 0 that keeps your CPU almost constantly at 3.9 GHz. There is really no need for that.
> ...



The issue is that sometimes my pc just blue screens in games at -150 while not doing that in prime 95 under reaaaaly heavy stress.

I'll change the epp to 80 and see what it does!!

btw here is my TPL Tab:




thanks for your numerous advices, im pretty new to undervolting and the community is really nice!!


----------



## Max(IT) (Jun 3, 2020)

JustCraftMe said:


> The issue is that sometimes my pc just blue screens in games at -150 while not doing that in prime 95 under reaaaaly heavy stress.
> 
> I'll change the epp to 80 and see what it does!!
> 
> ...


The TPL tab seems ok to me, you have a good PL2 of 90W and PL1 of 60W: more than enough for a gaming laptop.

EPP to 84 could help keep temperatures under control during browsing.
If you have BSOD at -150 mV, your CPU isn't really liking it. Try to leave core at -150 mV and reduce the CPU Cache at -125 / -100 mV. Sometimes it helps.
But keep in mind that your CPU could be more sensible than other, and maybe you need to lower your ambitions and just accept -100/-80 mV for both core and cache.
Every CPU is different.


----------



## JustCraftMe (Jun 3, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> The TPL tab seems ok to me, you have a good PL2 of 90W and PL1 of 60W: more than enough for a gaming laptop.
> 
> EPP to 84 could help keep temperatures under control during browsing.
> If you have BSOD at -150 mV, your CPU isn't really liking it. Try to leave core at -150 mV and reduce the CPU Cache at -125 / -100 mV. Sometimes it helps.
> ...


i'll try this and keep you informed, my pc is now at 40 degrees celsius at idle that's much much better Thanks you !!
(cpu core is now -150 and cpu cache is now -125)



Max(IT) said:


> not all the i7-8750H can operate at -150 mV core and cache.
> I don't understand exactly what is the issue you are trying to solve here. If it is stable at -150 mV, just keep it. It is a good amount of undervolting.
> 
> Your notebook is quite hot while just browsing, but that's because of the EPP set to 0 that keeps your CPU almost constantly at 3.9 GHz. There is really no need for that.
> ...


Where is the game accelerator setting btw?


----------



## unclewebb (Jun 3, 2020)

JustCraftMe said:


> stable when running Prime95 For 12 hours+


On  mobile CPUs, an undervolt that is stable during full load Prime95 testing, is rarely stable during normal use. Mobile CPUs use a higher multiplier when lightly loaded and they are designed to significantly drop the voltage when idle. When you add an undervolt on top of this already reduced voltage, BSODs are common.

The TS Bench test has proven to be a good test for setting voltages. Instead of full load testing, use only 1 or 2 threads of the TS Bench. It will report errors when your voltage gets too low. I like Prime95 too. Instead of full load testing, do some partial load testing of 1 or 2 threads of Prime95. These are more real world tests for mobile CPUs. Windows takes this load and continuously bounces it around from core to core. The multiplier used is continuously changing.

The 8750H and 9750H seem to like having the core offset being set to a bigger number compared to the cache offset. It is always the cache offset that holds you back. The advice that @Max(IT) gave you to back off the cache voltage was a wise one. Run some Cinebench R20 tests while reducing the core voltage offset. Some of these CPUs are 100% stable and Cinebench scores continue to improve until the core offset gets to about -200 mV. Too many users for too long have always assumed that these voltages need to be set equal. They do not.

EDP OTHER across all 3 domains is sometimes caused by the PP0 Current Limit. Try bumping that up from 100 to 150. Same with the FIVR IccMax. These are just limits. Your CPU does not need these limits. It will slow down and thermal throttle when it gets too hot.


----------



## Max(IT) (Jun 3, 2020)

JustCraftMe said:


> i'll try this and keep you informed, my pc is now at 40 degrees celsius at idle that's much much better Thanks you !!
> (cpu core is now -150 and cpu cache is now -125)
> 
> 
> Where is the game accelerator setting btw?


40° at idle is perfectly ok.
the “game accelerator “ isn’t a setting. It is an app.
I’m using Razer Cortex but there are many. It basically free up RAM, suspend most of the background tasks and set EPP to zero only when you run a game, restoring everything when you exit the game.
it is not mandatory, but it is good.


----------



## Awroxar (Jun 10, 2020)

Hey everyone,

I´m using Acer Predator Helios 500, i7 - 8750H and gtx 1070, I´ve had problems with temps for quite a long time, while playing some demanding games like Apex my laptop shuts down after some time. Some people said it´s a problem with chipset being too hot and fixed it by having fans on max all the time, that doesn´t work for me and I always play with fans on max. I´m adding my Throttlestop screens I followed many guides and I have no idea if something is wrong or not, I don´t understand these things. I also tried some general fixes like updating drivers, optimizing nvidia controll panel and I´ve repasted with Thermal Grizzly Cryonaut. Can anyone help me please, I don´t want to send it back to Acer again just to wait for them to tell me nothing is wrong and sending it back.


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## Max(IT) (Jun 10, 2020)

Awroxar said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> I´m using Acer Predator Helios 500, i7 - 8750H and gtx 1070, I´ve had problems with temps for quite a long time, while playing some demanding games like Apex my laptop shuts down after some time. Some people said it´s a problem with chipset being too hot and fixed it by having fans on max all the time, that doesn´t work for me and I always play with fans on max. I´m adding my Throttlestop screens I followed many guides and I have no idea if something is wrong or not, I don´t understand these things. I also tried some general fixes like updating drivers, optimizing nvidia controll panel and I´ve repasted with Thermal Grizzly Cryonaut. Can anyone help me please, I don´t want to send it back to Acer again just to wait for them to tell me nothing is wrong and sending it back.


I can’t see anything really wrong in your settings.
What kind of temperature do you have while playing at apex ? Because it is not normal to have the computer to shut down. Usually throttling will start well before you reach the shutting down temperature of the CPU.


----------



## unclewebb (Jun 11, 2020)

The core and cache voltages do not have to be set equally. Do some testing with Cinebench R20. Do multiple runs and keep reducing the CPU core voltage offset. Some of these CPUs will see less heat or better scores up until about -200 mV for the core and -125 mV for the cache.

If your laptop is randomly shutting down it is because something is under designed. Probably not much you can do about that. You might have to lower the turbo ratio limits when gaming down to 36 or lower to try to keep the overall system heat in check.


----------



## Max(IT) (Jun 11, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> The core and cache voltages do not have to be set equally. Do some testing with Cinebench R20. Do multiple runs and keep reducing the CPU core voltage offset. Some of these CPUs will see less heat or better scores up until about -200 mV for the core and -125 mV for the cache.
> 
> If your laptop is randomly shutting down it is because something is under designed. Probably not much you can do about that. You might have to lower the turbo ratio limits when gaming down to 36 or lower to try to keep the overall system heat in check.


even if something is poorly designed, the notebook should not shut itself down. It should throttle down to the base clock, but not shut down. Something is wrong there...


----------



## pieterk (Jun 13, 2020)

@unclewebb

Help, im no expert on this kind of thing, first of all, i experimenting with my throttlestop, in TPL (ofc after reading some article), i check TDP Level Control and lock it with value of "2"
but after i apply , the value turn by itself to "1" and my PC got freeze, no way to even move my mouse pointer, then i decided to hard reset..



I turn on my laptop again and i see the TDP back to default again with value of "0"..
but the nightmare is, after that moment, my laptop consistently freeze in random time and i need to hard reset whenever it happend..

I dont know if my hardware damaged bcz of that??

Please kindly help me, i dont know what to do now..

I was okay using throttlestop for 1 years before this TPL experiment

i use MSI GL62m-7REX
- core i7-7700HQ
- Nvidia gtx 1050ti
- windows 10


----------



## Max(IT) (Jun 13, 2020)

pieterk said:


> @unclewebb
> 
> Help, im no expert on this kind of thing, first of all, i experimenting with my throttlestop, in TPL (ofc after reading some article), i check TDP Level Control and lock it with value of "2"
> but after i apply , the value turn to "1" and my PC got freeze, no way to even move my mouse pointer, then i decided to hard reset..
> ...


It is extremely hard, I would say impossible, to damage the hardware using TS, because your system has protections in place to avoid that.
I don't know why someone said to set a value of 2 there. I didn't touch that option on my laptop.

Are the freezes happening even with your CPU at default settings (Vcore, Vcache and all the other values) ?


----------



## pieterk (Jun 13, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> It is extremely hard, I would say impossible, to damage the hardware using TS, because your system has protections in place to avoid that.
> I don't know why someone said to set a value of 2 there. I didn't touch that option on my laptop.
> 
> Are the freezes happening even with your CPU at default settings (Vcore, Vcache and all the other values) ?



If im not wrong, from what i read, it said it will capp the usage of CPU to about 30W..
so i tried it but gone wrong..

Yes, after hard reset, sometimes even before i start Throttlestop, it freeze again... its frustating...

so is that mean my hardware were damaged already?


----------



## unclewebb (Jun 13, 2020)

pieterk said:


> I dont know if my hardware damaged


You have not damaged your hardware. If something ever goes wrong with your settings, exit ThrottleStop and delete the ThrottleStop.INI configuration file. Shut down your computer so the CPU can reset itself. When you boot up and start ThrottleStop, it will use your CPU's default settings.

The TDP Level Control is for the 15W U series CPUs. There is no reason for you to use that feature.


----------



## pieterk (Jun 13, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> You have not damaged your hardware. If something ever goes wrong with your settings, exit ThrottleStop and delete the ThrottleStop.INI configuration file. Shut down your computer so the CPU can reset itself. When you boot up and start ThrottleStop, it will use your CPU's default settings.
> 
> The TDP Level Control is for the 15W U series CPUs. There is no reason for you to use that feature.



Thanks, i just done like exactly u told, delete throttlestop.ini, i shutdown and turn on my laptop again, after that, all the TS configuration set to default...
this is my new undervolt value...



I apply n run TS bench (size 1024M) 
and my laptop freeze again in the middle of the test... what is that mean sir??


----------



## Max(IT) (Jun 13, 2020)

pieterk said:


> If im not wrong, from what i read, it said it will capp the usage of CPU to about 30W..
> so i tried it but gone wrong..
> 
> Yes, after hard reset, sometimes even before i start Throttlestop, it freeze again... its frustating...
> ...


Well, I would try to delete the .INI file and see if your computer is still crashing or not.
Why you started using TS ? You were trying to solve some issues ?
I can see an idle temperature around 72° in your screenshot above, which is way too high.


----------



## pieterk (Jun 13, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> Well, I would try to delete the .INI file and see if your computer is still crashing or not.
> Why you started using TS ? You were trying to solve some issues ?
> I can see an idle temperature around 72° in your screenshot above, which is way too high.



I use TS to lower my CPU heat

i dont see undervolt solve my heat prob, so mostly i disable turbo.. or did i done my undervolt wrong??


----------



## Max(IT) (Jun 13, 2020)

pieterk said:


> I use TS to lower my CPU heat
> 
> i dont see undervolt solve my heat prob, so mostly i disable turbo.. or did i done my undervolt wrong??


To say that we need more data.
WHich temperature does it reach while gaming ? And running a benchmark ?

And I have a question for you: the Turbo Limits in the screenshot above are locked at 38 (3.8 GHz), for all cores. This is much higher than default (it should be 38-36-34-34). This surely contributes to high temperatures.

Disable Turbo is not a solution. Never.
Try to lower it a little bit, use a setting like 38-35-32-32 for instance. It should lower temps without affecting perfomance too much.
I would also try to raise your Speed Shift EPP a little bit. Try 84 for instance. It will helps to cool your CPU even while at idle.


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## pieterk (Jun 13, 2020)

Max(IT) said:


> To say that we need more data.
> WHich temperature does it reach while gaming ? And running a benchmark ?
> 
> And I have a question for you: the Turbo Limits in the screenshot above are locked at 38 (3.8 GHz), for all cores. This is much higher than default (it should be 38-36-34-34). This surely contributes to high temperatures.
> ...



Before i experiencing this consistent crash, i undervolt my cpucore n cache by -120mv and disabling turbo...
by that setting i got acceptable temp around 70-85 C
and my laptop never crash before... 


Update : after reset TS and reuse my undervolt setting (-120mv) and combine with your advice, lower Turbo boost ratio by 34 now ... 
i just playing CSGO, i got fairly good temp around 80-85 C with 3,4ghz.. but after several round, my laptop crash again ...
i hard reset, turn on laptop and rerun TS, but got crash again while administrator window just appear...

seems like my prob not solved yet...


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## unclewebb (Jun 13, 2020)

Your laptop is going to crash if you set the CPU voltage too low. Your testing shows that -120 mV is too low.

What does ThrottleStop report for C0% when your computer is idle at the desktop? It looks like you have something running in the background, creating heat. A properly setup computer running Windows 10 needs to spend very little time in the C0 state when it is idle.



http://imgur.com/Sjo8mtn


Get the background apps under control and do some testing with the TS Bench and Prime95. Both 1 and 2 thread testing are just as important as full load testing. See how stable your voltage is.



Max(IT) said:


> Disable Turbo is not a solution. Never.


I totally agree.


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## Max(IT) (Jun 13, 2020)

pieterk said:


> Before i experiencing this consistent crash, i undervolt my cpucore n cache by -120mv and disabling turbo...
> by that setting i got acceptable temp around 70-85 C
> and my laptop never crash before...
> 
> ...


Temperatures are absolutely right while gaming, so your crash isn’t related to temperature.
You are probably applying too much undervolting: for a 7700HQ often values like -90/-100 are the maximum.
As unclewebb suggested, try with -100 and a single thread TS Bench.


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## pieterk (Jun 14, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> Your laptop is going to crash if you set the CPU voltage too low. Your testing shows that -120 mV is too low.
> 
> What does ThrottleStop report for C0% when your computer is idle at the desktop? It looks like you have something running in the background, creating heat. A properly setup computer running Windows 10 needs to spend very little time in the C0 state when it is idle.
> 
> ...





Max(IT) said:


> Temperatures are absolutely right while gaming, so your crash isn’t related to temperature.
> You are probably applying too much undervolting: for a 7700HQ often values like -90/-100 are the maximum.
> As unclewebb suggested, try with -100 and a single thread TS Bench.



When in idle condition C0% are around 3-15.

Thanks for advice, i will try to change my undervolt value.. but im still confused, why my laptop still crash even after i just restart it?? (before i rerun my TS)
And i was okay with value -120mV before.. Never crash even i use for rendering in 3dsmax, which is all core goes up to 100% usage with 90+ C degree...


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## Max(IT) (Jun 14, 2020)

pieterk said:


> When in idle condition C0% are around 3-15.
> 
> Thanks for advice, i will try to change my undervolt value.. but im still confused, why my laptop still crash even after i just restart it?? (before i rerun my TS)
> And i was okay with value -120mV before.. Never crash even i use for rendering in 3dsmax, which is all core goes up to 100% usage with 90+ C degree...


Did you set TS as an automatically started service following one of the guides online ?


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## maybecocoa (Jun 17, 2020)

As I didn't find any info googling, I will ask here. 
What does the PP0 Current Limit section? It was set on 170 by default on my Dell G5 5590. I saw advice for other guys to change it's value to 100 but should I do the same or just leave it?


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## unclewebb (Jun 17, 2020)

These are just limits. Many desktop boards set these limits sky high so they do not interfere with the CPU running at its full rated speed. Some Dell laptops might be doing the same thing now.

If your CPU runs at a maximum of 90 Amps, you can set the PP0 Current Limit to 100, 170 or 1070. It does not matter. The CPU will not throttle because of this limit.

If your CPU does show EDP CURRENT throttling across all three domains when this is set to 100 then try increasing this limit.


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## maybecocoa (Jun 17, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> These are just limits. Many desktop boards set these limits sky high so they do not interfere with the CPU running at its full rated speed. Some Dell laptops might be doing the same thing now.
> 
> If your CPU runs at a maximum of 90 Amps, you can set the PP0 Current Limit to 100, 170 or 1070. It does not matter. The CPU will not throttle because of this limit.
> 
> If your CPU does show EDP CURRENT throttling across all three domains when this is set to 100 then try increasing this limit.


Thank you very much


----------



## Aryan (Jul 11, 2020)

ourozz said:


> Hi everyone,
> i bought a msi gp73 8re laptop, over the course of a few days while playing it started to have a high cpu temperature, i decided to research and found the throttlestop, followed some tutorials and my temperature significantly reduced from ~ 85-95 to ~ 65-75,on gaming , but I noticed that I have some yellow frames in the limit table, in gta I have Ring -» edp other (yellow), and after running cinebench I have core-» pl1 (yellow) and Ring - » edp other (yellow) . Should I worry about this? Is there any way to fix it?


So your laptop got about 10 degrees cooler only by undervolting?Or you did something else too?


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## Max(IT) (Jul 11, 2020)

maybecocoa said:


> As I didn't find any info googling, I will ask here.
> What does the PP0 Current Limit section? It was set on 170 by default on my Dell G5 5590. I saw advice for other guys to change it's value to 100 but should I do the same or just leave it?


170 is the default value for Dell notebooks and it is just fine


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## Thrasher (Jul 26, 2020)

hi i have i7 8750h, the laptop is a msi ge63. someone help me? i want to know if the cpu at 4.1ghz gets more fps in games, don't notice much difference from 3.2 to 3.9. 
Another thing I put all the nuclei to 4.1ghz but with msi afterburner it still shows me 3.9 what should I do?


----------



## Caring1 (Jul 26, 2020)

Thrasher said:


> hi i have i7 8750h, the laptop is a msi ge63. someone help me? i want to know if the cpu at 4.1ghz gets more fps in games, don't notice much difference from 3.2 to 3.9.
> Another thing I put all the nuclei to 4.1ghz but with msi afterburner it still shows me 3.9 what should I do?


Reset the turbo ratio limits to 40 maximum as your CPU cannot boost to 4.1 all core, that is max turbo limit and will only boost on one or two cores.


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## Thrasher (Jul 26, 2020)

Caring1 said:


> Reset the turbo ratio limits to 40 maximum as your CPU cannot boost to 4.1 all core, that is max turbo limit and will only boost on one or two cores.


excuse my ignorance XD, where would it be?


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## unclewebb (Jul 26, 2020)

http://imgur.com/hBxsrHt


For the 8750H, max turbo ratio limits are 41, 41, 40, 40, 39, 39. Setting them higher than this is ignored by the CPU.

Run Cinebench R20. Open Limit Reasons and watch for throttling. A laptop with decent cooling should score over 3000 in this test.


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## chplff94 (Jul 27, 2020)

hello,

I'm new here ...

is there any way to get rid of PL1 throttling on 8750H ? or it's locked by BIOS ?


Laptop - ASUS GL503
OS - Windows 10 v1909


Thank You


----------



## unclewebb (Jul 27, 2020)

chplff94 said:


> or it's locked by BIOS?


You set the long term turbo power limit (PL1) to 60W, you are using the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature and you are still being throttled to 45W. That means the manufacturer is using the EC to enforce the PL1 power limit to 45W. This is equal to the TDP rating and there is no easy way around this type of power limit throttling.

OEMs have a right to do this but many do not. In a laptop with adequate cooling, the 8750H can perform significantly better if it is allowed to run up to 70W. All consumers can do is vote with their wallets. Asus laptops look great but based on your testing, I would never buy a laptop from them.


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## chplff94 (Jul 27, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> You set the long term turbo power limit (PL1) to 60W, you are using the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits feature and you are still being throttled to 45W. That means the manufacturer is using the EC to enforce the PL1 power limit to 45W. This is equal to the TDP rating and there is no easy way around this type of power limit throttling.
> 
> OEMs have a right to do this but many do not. In a laptop with adequate cooling, the 8750H can perform significantly better if it is allowed to run up to 70W. All consumers can do is vote with their wallets. Asus laptops look great but based on your testing, I would never buy a laptop from them.



Thank You @*unclewebb *for reply


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## uhlink (Jul 27, 2020)

Hello @unclewebb , My EDP OTHER ring is yellow in the limits. I am trying to reach stable temperatures in idle. I have followed a lot of your replies and adjusted my settings. If you could please take a look at them and maybe shed some light. Attached are the images, alongside log file from TS after running Cinebench R20 and my specs from HWMonitor data. Thank you so much


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## unclewebb (Jul 28, 2020)

The ThrottleStop log file clearly shows your problem.


```
DATE       TIME    MULTI   C0%   CKMOD  CHIPM   BAT_mW  TEMP    VID   POWER
2020-07-27  17:53:33  36.84   98.9  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9784   54.7   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:34  37.24   99.1  100.0  100.0        0  100   1.0007   54.0   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:35  37.04   99.5  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9761   53.4   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:36  37.08   99.4  100.0  100.0        0  100   1.0017   52.8   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:37  37.12   99.5  100.0  100.0        0  100   1.0013   53.5   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:38  36.82   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9788   52.9   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:39  36.93   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9979   52.2   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:40  37.06   99.6  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9769   54.0   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:41  37.07   99.6  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9788   53.2   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:42  37.03   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9773   53.0   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:43  36.94   99.8  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9867   52.8   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:44  36.93   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9814   53.1   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:45  36.94   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9844   52.8   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:46  36.84   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9779   52.9   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:47  36.77   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9843   51.4   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:48  36.65   99.6  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9775   51.8   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:49  36.61   99.6  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9829   51.4   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:50  36.58   99.6  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9836   50.8   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:51  36.56   99.6  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9519   51.2   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:52  36.55   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9761   50.9   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:53  36.55   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9788   51.7   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:54  36.64   99.6  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9771   51.5   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:55  36.64   99.7  100.0  100.0        0  100   0.9524   51.3   TEMP
2020-07-27  17:53:56  36.21   99.7  100.0  100.0        0   96   0.9325   49.7   PL1
2020-07-27  17:53:57  35.00  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   95   0.9323   44.6   PL1
2020-07-27  17:53:58  35.00  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   95   0.9324   44.7   PL1
2020-07-27  17:53:59  35.00  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   95   0.9326   45.3   PL1
2020-07-27  17:54:00  35.00  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   95   0.9331   44.4   PL1
2020-07-27  17:54:06  35.01  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   96   0.9331   44.9   PL1
2020-07-27  17:54:07  35.00  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   96   0.9319   44.7   PL1
2020-07-27  17:54:08  34.98  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   95   0.9064   45.3   PL1
2020-07-27  17:54:09  34.93  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   96   0.9318   44.6   PL1
2020-07-27  17:54:10  35.00  100.0  100.0  100.0        0   96   0.9327   44.7   PL1
```

In the far right column it shows TEMP. That means your CPU is thermal throttling. Why? If you look in the TEMP column your CPU is running at a constant 100°C. Of course it is going to be thermal throttling. It is trying to protect itself from a nuclear meltdown.

After a while the power limit is reduced down to a maximum of 45W. Now the far right column shows PL1. Your laptop is  slowing down (throttling) to keep power consumption just under the 45W long term limit. This can be adjusted in the TPL window. At the moment the long term turbo power limit is set to 45W so throttling at this level makes sense. Your CPU cooling is still struggling at this level.

Your first screen shot shows one of your CPU cores at 74°C while the other ones are at 59°C or 60°C. That is a significant difference and is usually a sign that someone did a really poor job installing the heatsink and fan or the heatsink is not flat and it is not making full contact with the entire CPU. This needs to be closely examined and fixed.

If your first screenshot is when your computer is idle then there is a bigger problem. A properly functioning computer running Windows 10 needs to spend very little time in the C0 state when idle. Typically 0.5% or less. Your screenshot shows 25.0%. Maybe your screenshot was taken when your CPU was not idle but if this is idle, you need to open up the Task Manager, click on the Details tab and find out what is running on your computer. Definitely lots of room for improvement.



http://imgur.com/Sjo8mtn


Until you fix your cooling issues, you will never be able to achieve maximum performance from your laptop. Might as well reduce the short term power limit down to 45W. Your cooling cannot handle your CPU when it is allowed to run at 55W.


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## Thrasher (Jul 28, 2020)

Hello, I followed your advice to try cinebench r20,
gave me this.
As you can see I do not reach 4.1ghz, which is what I want


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## uhlink (Jul 28, 2020)

Hey, @unclewebb This is what's on the details tab, there were more but they either said 0 or were around 1-3.

I re-applied thermal paste and re-seated my heatsink. Temps are closely together but they're hovering between 60-70 C.

I made Core and Cache Offset -125.  Also put short term on 45 as you suggested, i don't know how to make these temps good.

This is a new log file while running Cinebench R20 , no longer temp throttling but instead PL2


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## unclewebb (Jul 28, 2020)

@uhlink - Here is some info about DSAPI.exe









						Serious vulnerability in Dell's PC Doctor Assistant
					

[German]PC-Doctor SupportAssist, which is pre-installed on many Dell systems, has a serious security vulnerability that allows permissions to be exploited. The component is also found in products from Corsair, Staples and Tobi. Dell has released an update.I have already been informed of the topic by



					borncity.com
				




If I bought a new laptop, I would ditch all of the OEM related software and install a clean version of Windows 10 directly from Microsoft. There are a lot of questionable utilities out there that soak up CPU cycles, create heat and accomplish nothing. You can see from my screenshot that a clean version of Windows 10 plus ThrottleStop running uses next to nothing for CPU resources. If your idle C0% is way over 0.5% then you need to do some Windows house cleaning.

You get to choose either power limit throttling or thermal throttling. Either one is going to slow your CPU down and prevent it from reaching maximum or consistent performance. For the 9750H to run at its full rated speed, it needs a cooler that can dissipate about 75W. Your cooler is struggling at 45W. Many laptops provide only enough cooling for the CPU to run at the 45W TDP.

The next step is up to you. You can try re-engineering your laptop to improve the cooling or you can continue using your laptop at its present level where you are losing almost 900 MHz due to barely adequate cooling. Do you have a Dell laptop? What model? They tend to lock the long term turbo power limit internally to 45W because their heatsinks cannot handle anything more than that. Your testing shows this problem.


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## Berfs1 (Jul 28, 2020)

Here's one way to lower your temperatures, lower that maximum cache ratio. Clearly it is adhering to the maximum (37x), if you drop it down to 30, you should be able to get better CPU performance. I have a 9750H, a slightly faster version of your CPU. Basically, I have turbos maxed out for 2 profiles, one that I named Max Performance, and the other Consistent Performance. I use MP when gaming or under lighter tasks, and I use CP when video editing or streaming or anything else that pegs my CPU at 100% and goes over 90C (that's when the fans get really loud). I have MP set to 39x-42x (my laptop adheres to the minimum, not maximum like yours), and CP set to 32x-33x, temperatures drop almost 10°C. That's why I made that profile, because gaming performance drops by about 1 FPS in most games, but in video editing especially when I am rendering videos, it doesn't throttle the core clocks. The reason that is important is, if I use MP for rendering, it will thermal throttle. It will hit 100C, and drop the clock speeds all the way down below 2 GHz, however if I use MP, that never happens, because thermals are hovering below 90°C. In case you are wondering, when video editing, CP uses about 60W, while when using MP, it can burst to 74-75W. My laptop has PL1 of 75W and PL2 of 90W, however 90W is the hard limit. That doesn't mean thermals are okay with it, it means that's the maximum power Dell allowed my CPU to pull, presumably because there are 8 core chips that were also available, but I chose the 9750H because it was cheaper and I had a feeling thermals would be a big issue, and it was with the stock compound. After replacing the thermal compound with IC Diamond, the 9750H's performance went up by more than 10%, pretty embarrassing considering this is Dell's highest end workstation laptop for 15", and they cheaped out on the thermal compound. Anyways, after repasting and tuning (incl. undervolting), package thermals went down 10C in CB20, and 19C in CB15, performance went up 25% and 10.5% respectively, package power dropped 19.4W and 27.3W respectively, and total system power dropped 23.2W and 32.1W respectively. Overall undervolting seriously helped, as well as the thermal compound change.

TLDW: lower your cache ratio by about 8-10x, that will lower your temperatures enough to let your core clocks go higher, while losing minimal performance from cache, and gaining more performance from the increased core speed.

One more thing, about the 8750H, the turbo ratios are 41/41/40/40/39/39, so in CB for single threaded, you should hit 41x provided you max out your turbos and you don't have too many background apps running, because it will run at 41x when up to 2 cores are used. If you disable 4 cores in BIOS (assuming you are able to do that), then see if you can hit 41x, because if you can, then the only reason it isn't hitting it with all 6 cores enabled is because there are too many background apps running. I just opened CPU-Z, and I was able to hit 44x, not 45x like my 9750H is specced for. TBH, the "max turbo frequency" that Intel has provided for years is bogus for real world usage, unless you actually disable enough cores, because basically you almost never are going to hit that single core frequency jump of 100 MHz, nor would you notice it. That's why having the turbo ratios is important; Intel used to provide them, until Skylake (or Kaby Lake, I forgot) came around and they removed  all the turbo ratio tables from their website.



unclewebb said:


> @uhlink - Here is some info about DSAPI.exe
> 
> 
> 
> ...


One method that would be viable is to purchase a cooling pad, or physically raising the laptop on stands, so that there is more room for intake. As for the 45W limit, it's usually for laptops that were meant to be using quad cores before 8th gen hit. It's possible the OP's laptop has a hard limit at 55W, meaning even if they were able to magically lower the temperatures enough, they still would be limited to 55W by the motherboard limits (but a temperature improvement is an improvement nonetheless). I use a DJ Laptop stand and the laptop sits on two metal rails and it provides better air intake, instead of normal setups like on a flat surface, which tends to block the max intake a laptop can take.

Another method that would also be viable is limiting the current. If you can limit it to just enough, you can force your clock speed to hit a certain speed when under full load, and that also will lower temperatures, because you are lowering the current, and V * A = W, if you go from 1.1V * 50A to 1.1V * 40A, your clock speed will drop a bit, so you won't have any instability issues, and your power draw theoretically would drop from 55W to 44W. Obviously that is just a theoretical example, but you will be able to drop the power that the CPU takes by throttling the current, so that you can make as much performance as you can with the limits you have.


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## uhlink (Jul 28, 2020)

@unclewebb 

It's a G3 3590

I7-9750H
1660 Ti Max Q
16 GB Ram ddr4
512 NvME SSD
2TB External

Thank you so much for replying


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## AOne (Jul 29, 2020)

@Berfs1 - awesome post and a very good idea. Congrats.


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## xXxreaperxXx (Aug 16, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> @uhlink - Here is some info about DSAPI.exe
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hello, I have an Acer Aspire 5 notebook with an MX130 and an i5 core 8265U I always played on it and I never had a problem but 2 weeks ago when I play any game the FPS drops from nothing to 60 FPS, I have already restored the notebook and it didn't work, I updated the BIOS and, but I see when the FPS drops, the processor goes from 15W to 12W why does that happen? I never had this problem and now nothing happens, help me please.


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## Kohuke (Aug 24, 2020)

I've been reading this topic and main reason why specially thin gaming laptops tend to throttle and have few cores hotter then the other, is the issue of bad build/placement of components.

I have MSI gs65 Stealth 95G (with i7-9750H @2.60GHz and RTX 2080 Max-Q Design) and even with all of the undervolting still tends to have few cores 20 degrees or so higher then the other, procing the throttling around 93+ degrees C on 2 cores.
My Processor power state has been set to 75% at max level.

Is there any settings that I can play around in BIOS as well (though as TS is not working in BIOS the laptop gets hot very quick, even when it is sitting on a cooling bad above the table) which doesn't take more then few minutes?

Anything else I can do fix the issue of 2 cores running hot or is temps like that under load (rendering HD video and playing) fine?
Laptop has still almost 1 and half of year warranty left, will it break the warranty if I would bring the laptop to my dealer to have the CPU repasted with something decent? Or will it only be done under RMA?


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## Caring1 (Aug 24, 2020)

Kohuke said:


> I've been reading this topic and main reason why specially thin gaming laptops tend to throttle and have few cores hotter then the other, is the issue of bad build/placement of components.
> 
> I have MSI gs65 Stealth 95G (with i7-9750H @2.60GHz and RTX 2080 Max-Q Design) and even with all of the undervolting still tends to have few cores 20 degrees or so higher then the other, procing the throttling around 93+ degrees C on 2 cores.
> My Processor power state has been set to 75% at max level.
> ...


27C difference between cores is huge and indicates poor application of the Thermal interface material.
Having a shop reapply it shouldn't void warranty, you should even be able to do it yourself, but the manufacturer may argue that voids warranty.


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## Kohuke (Aug 24, 2020)

Caring1 said:


> 27C difference between cores is huge and indicates poor application of the Thermal interface material.
> Having a shop reapply it shouldn't void warranty, you should even be able to do it yourself, but the manufacturer may argue that voids warranty.


I will try to contact the seller then and see will they be able to do it, cause I do not feel that comfortable taking the laptop apart myself. I'd rather have someone with more experience do it. But anything else I can tweak to make it run more cooler?


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## unclewebb (Aug 24, 2020)

Kohuke said:


> even with all of the undervolting


Part of the problem is that you are not doing any undervolting. You need to under volt both the CPU core and CPU cache or else the CPU will completely ignore your under volt request.

Start by setting these equally to an offset of -125 mV for both the CPU core and cache. Download Cinebench R20. Do a baseline test of Cinebench and see if you are stable. Do a couple of TS Bench tests. Some light tests like 1 or 2 Threads just to make sure you are stable at this setting. If everything is OK, try decreasing only the CPU core offset in steps of -25 mV and see if your temperatures or performance in Cinebench R20 improve at all.

Download ThrottleStop 9.2 from TechPowerUp. Hopefully the new version can correctly report your C0%. 

Set Speed Shift Max back to 45 and set your turbo ratio limits back to their default values. For your situation, I would lower the turbo power limits as much as necessary. Your cooling solution would be overwhelmed at 90W. Check the Turbo Boost Short Power Max box and start by setting both of your power limits to 45W. If your cooling system is still struggling, go less. A proper under volt will help but ultimately, it looks like you need to replace the thermal paste. People working on an assembly line either do not know or do not care about thermal paste. With a laptop with poor thermal design, application of the thermal paste is critical.


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## Kohuke (Aug 25, 2020)

Thank you, unclewebb, for pointing out my mistak of not touching the cashe bit. 

Tests with 12 threads and 96M size
With both cache and core -125 the result in TS is 15.706
Cache at -125 and Core at -150.4 the Bench on TS is 15.427
Cache still at -125 and core with 154.3 Bench was with score of 11.402

In Cinebench with -125mv undervolt I got 2372 as the result with majority of the cores staying between 75-80 degrees and the 2 hot cores peaked at 96 degrees.
With cache staying -125 and core around -150.4mv the result in Cinebench 2383; the majority temperatures stayed around 75, some cores below 70 and the 2 hot cores around 93 degrees.
With the last setting  in TS the score was the same as with the 1st set of settings, so I guess the bigger number in Cinebench means better performance, so I will go back to 150.4 for co0re. Temperatures stayed on the 2 higher cores around 91 degrees.

I think the power limit of 45 is fine, given that with the medium setting the prochot was not shown. 

I tried 40w on the power setting and then POWER was yelled to me by TS while running the Cinebench test, although the highest peak on the hot cores was 90 (not that big temperature difference), so I assume it is not good and that is way too less. 

The  new version of TS idd shows the c0%

I will try to have my laptop repasted (hopefully the dealer is allowed to do it on premises, rather then send the laptop off to msi...) and will hope that the temperatures go lower. 
Thank you so far for the tips, I will do more testing when I get the laptop back


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## Kohuke (Aug 28, 2020)

I got my laptop back from the dealer where it received new paste. Much cooler now. Even put processor max power state to 80 as well as both cache and core to -125mV.
Upped the Turbo Ratio limits to 40-39-38-37-36-36 and the Cinebench results are now much more crappier: 1485, instead of what it was before.

I put the the turbo limits, to defaults now... Put short term power usage to 90w as it was before and reset all of the voltages, upped the CPU power state to 90% and got my cinebench results to 1678... Temp was 71 the highest.

What else is wrong now? Not that I am complaining nor it matters that much I guess, as my games FPS seem to be the same as it was before, just curious.


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## unclewebb (Aug 28, 2020)

Kohuke said:


> upped the CPU power state to 90%


What setting did you change? Is this the Windows max processor state? This should be set to 100%. 

Did you set the Speed Shift Max value back to 45? 



Kohuke said:


> Temp was 71 the highest.


That is a big problem. The 9750H needs to run a lot hotter than that to achieve maximum performance. Even with great cooling, laptops with these CPUs will be up over 90°C. That is a normal operating temperature for these CPUs.



Kohuke said:


> and got my cinebench results to 1678


That is a terrible result for your CPU. You might want to delete the ThrottleStop.INI configuration file and shutdown your computer so it resets itself. Your CPU is running at half of its rated speed. Turn on the ThrottleStop log file option and show me some more pictures of how you have ThrottleStop setup. You changed something and not for the better.


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## Kohuke (Aug 29, 2020)

@unclewebb The funniest thing is that when I got my laptop back from the thermal pasting and "dust cleaning" from the dealer I didn't touch any of the TS settings and all things where as they were before I sent it to the shop. When I got back, then I ran the test again and got bad results and it is only after that I started to put the settings back bit higher.

Since then I've placed the windows setting of CPU performance back to 100%, deleted the ini-file of TS as well as disableing TS in Task Scheduler. After I've done all of that, I got with the base settings of TS (nothing changed or touched, default settings) , Cinebench result of 2374 with Power/Hot blinking in TS.
Attaching the log from that. Dunno what went wrong in the service, since they didn't have an account/pw to boot to windows - maybe that just a simple starting computer and the shutting down cause TS to do something.

Also attaching a log when the laptop was completely idle (or well I was AFK).

Now I set the TPL for both short and long to 45W, nothing else changed. Running Cinebench again, TS saying POWER with the result of 2120.

With TPL still 45W, CPU core/cache reduced to -125mW, nothing else changed I get the result of 2372, with temperature maxing at 84 degrees, although TS yelling POWER. Attaching a log (..._power.txt)

Powers now set to 50/55, rest as it was before the temperature went to 91 degrees and still yelled POWER to me. Result was the best so far 2490. Log with  ..50.55.txt. So I guess getting to 91 is not still ideal and the TPL should be reduced.

With TPL settings 45/50, CPU core reduced -150.4 and the cashe at -125, getting 80ish degrees and test results in Cinebench with 2486. Log ...45.50.txt

By going back to the guide I found here (with the exception of leaving the Turbo Ratio limits the way they were as well as leaving the TPL the way they was on the previous test), TS still saying power but the temperature seemed fine and the Cinebench  gave me 2490 as the result. ..._final.txt is called that log.
Anything else I can play around to make the power demand go away? What else would you recommend I could change in the TS settings that the temperatures would say normal, but the power demand to go away? Or won't that happen if I want the temps. to be normal? Screens attached below.


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## AOne (Aug 29, 2020)

You've got 20 degrees difference between cores. Guess how "good" the dealer performed the repasting. Just do it yourself.


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## TheEndIsNear (Aug 29, 2020)

I have 2 intel laptops.  An Hp Omen with an 8750h and an msi with a 9300h I think that the number.  But they throttle like crazy.  The Hp omen is a big notebook while the msi is a 4 pounder.  Even undervolting as much as I can with a laptop cooler the omen will still hit thermal throttling, the 9300h which is a 4 core 8 thread I've got right at the sweet spot of just being under throttling temp when gaming.  I had a 4lb haswell laptop that would never get that hot.  It just seems to me that they are too aggressive with their boost clocks.  I had the 6 core omen locked at 3.2 and it would come close to throttling while gaming. Locked any higher than that it throttled.  These are freaking hot chips.  I've been around a while and this is the first time I've seen a chip go so fast to the thermal limit.  Except that time I forget to plug in the pump on a water cooler lol.  It just seems odd.


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## Kohuke (Aug 29, 2020)

AOne said:


> You've got 20 degrees difference between cores. Guess how "good" the dealer performed the repasting. Just do it yourself.


Sadly am not the person to do take the laptop apart. Just so many things what an inexperienced hand can break in there without proper tools.


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## AOne (Aug 29, 2020)

Kohuke said:


> Sadly am not the person to do take the laptop apart. Just so many things what an inexperienced hand can break in there without proper tools.


All you need is a screwdriver and 20 screws to remove. A cloth (earplugs) and that's it. Even my 12 years son can do it and he's not a person with much dexterity  2-3 YouTube clips would be enough.


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## unclewebb (Aug 29, 2020)

AOne said:


> Just do it yourself.


I agree 100%. If you want something done right, do it yourself. It is not rocket science. I recently bought a $10 screwdriver kit and some thermal paste to redo my daughter's laptop. I watched a YouTube video and downloaded the manual from the manufacturer. Not all laptops are easy to disassemble but many recent ones are. 

@Kohuke - The 9750H needs more than 45W or 50W to achieve maximum performance. Your best Cinebench R20 results are a good 500 points less than what they should be.

The CPU heatsink is either poorly installed or marginal at best. A 20°C difference between cores is not good. Your heatsink might not be perfectly flat, the paste might not have been done correctly (again) or perhaps the heatsink was not screwed down evenly. When you also have a RTX2080 putting heat into an under designed cooling system, sky high temperatures are the result.

Adjusting the power limits allows you to choose between power limit throttling or thermal throttling. It does not solve the problem which is poor cooling. Until you fix the cooling issues, if that is even possible, you are going to have days when your computer randomly throttles more compared to the previous day. A slight change in room temperature or a more demanding game might trigger a lot more throttling.


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## Lawrence_phaw (Aug 30, 2020)

Hi everyone,

Here, I would like to share my experience in undervolting i7-8750H.
I bought a gaming laptop from a second-hand retailer last year. It costed me 55% of the original price and came with a defected 1T HDD.
It is a Lenovo Legion Y530, comes with i7-8750H, GTX 1050 4G, 24G RAM @2666mHz and 15.6 in display.
I used to play Pro Evolution Soccer 2020 within Steam App and the temperature was always 97 C.
Yes, that was before I heard of Thermal Grizzly Kryonaut and Throttlestop.
A month ago I bought the thermal grizzly kryonaut and  pasted in my machine.
After that, the temperature never goes above 74 C when I play PES2020 (maybe PES does not demand so much resources).
Today I found out this thread and wanted to try out to get the most out of my machine using Throttlestop and I am quite happy with the result.

My machine:
Lenovo Legion Y530 15INCH
CPU: i7-8750H
GPU: GTX 1050 4G
RAM: 24 G (8+16)@2666MHZ
256 Gb NVMe m.2 SSD

Cinebench Release 20 CPU Ranking : *2946 pts* (*Multi-Thread* *@ 6Cores 12 Threads*)

Throttlestop setting:

Turbo Ratio Limit                 : 41/41/40/40/39/39 (Bios Default)
Speed shift - epp                  :   0
Turbo Long Power Max       : 60
Turbo short Power Max       : 90

CPU Core offset Voltage        : -169.9 mV
CPU Cache offset Voltage     : -145.5 mV
Intel GPU offset Voltage        : -82 mV
iGPU Unslice offset Voltage  : -82 mV
System Agent offset Voltage :  0  (default)

Average PKG Power : 54W
Max Temp                 : 90 C







Cinebench Release 20 CPU Ranking : *2261 pts* (*Single-Thread* *@ 6Cores 6 Threads*)

Throttlestop setting:

Turbo Ratio Limit                 : 41/41/40/40/39/39 (Bios Default)
Speed shift - epp                 :   0
Turbo Long Power Max      : 60
Turbo short Power Max      : 90

CPU Core offset Voltage        : -150.4 mV
CPU Cache offset Voltage     : -145.5 mV
Intel GPU offset Voltage        : -82 mV
iGPU Unslice offset Voltage  : -82 mV
System Agent offset Voltage :  0  (default)

Average PKG Power : 47 W
Max Temp                 : 81 C





There were no throttling for the above results and i7-8750H was running at 3.9 GHz happily. I would like to call it the SWEET SPOT.

Frankly speaking, I have no technical knowledge of fine-tuning the CPUs with Throttlestop.
It was just trial and error. At some point I tried to offset the CPU Cache voltage at -165 mV but it introduced me the infamous *Blue Screen of Death*. I can make it back to -155 mV but -145 mV Cache offset can perform better in my case. I tried to offset the Core voltage at -1000 mV but -169.9 mV is the best that performed.
I started with -100 mV offset and lower the increment like -125, -130, -133, etc...
I think the cooling system of our machines also play a big part in this case.
Ok, that's it. Happy Tuning!! Cheer!!!!

Edited: There are some guys in youtube who can get Cinebench R20* @ 3100+ pts* by using Throttlestop (mostly MSI Gaming Laptops). Yes, that's insane.


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## Thrasher (Sep 9, 2020)

Lawrence_phaw said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Here, I would like to share my experience in undervolting i7-8750H.
> I bought a gaming laptop from a second-hand retailer last year. It costed me 55% of the original price and came with a defected 1T HDD.
> ...


Thank you very much man the truth brought me results, I have been struggling since I bought it half a year ago, can you tell me specifically what model of kryonaut you used?


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## NattyliteSaber (Sep 9, 2020)

I have a msi gs65 with a I7 - 8750H and a RTX2060. I have been playing around with throttle stop. I have the Turbo ratio limits set to 34 for all cores, Offset voltage to -150 and the turbo boost power limits long set to 22 and short to 26 with a limit of 1. With all that being said it has dropped the temps from mid 80's-90 to low to mid 70's. Computer runs fine and I'm happy with it now but am I leaving something on the table with the 34 on all cores and the low turbo boost power limits?

Thanks


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## unclewebb (Sep 9, 2020)

NattyliteSaber said:


> am I leaving something on the table


You are leaving an awful lot of performance on the table. The 8750H has a 45W TDP rating. Cutting the power limit in half reduces maximum performance. 



NattyliteSaber said:


> Computer runs fine and I'm happy


If you want more performance, you will need to increase your turbo power limits and allow your CPU to run hotter. Intel says that any core temperature under 100°C is a "safe operating temperature". You do not need to baby your laptop. If your goal is lower fan noise and heat output then your decision to lower your power limits is the best way to accomplish this. You can leave the turbo ratios at their default values. Your CPU will automatically slow down based on power consumption. No need to slow it down more than it needs to slow down.


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## NattyliteSaber (Sep 9, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> You are leaving an awful lot of performance on the table. The 8750H has a 45W TDP rating. Cutting the power limit in half reduces maximum performance.
> 
> 
> If you want more performance, you will need to increase your turbo power limits and allow your CPU to run hotter. Intel says that any core temperature under 100°C is a "safe operating temperature". You do not need to baby your laptop. If your goal is lower fan noise and heat output then your decision to lower your power limits is the best way to accomplish this. You can leave the turbo ratios at their default values. Your CPU will automatically slow down based on power consumption. No need to slow it down more than it needs to slow down.



I bumped up the turbo boost power limits to 40 and 45 and running at default turbo ratio limits. Jumped temps up to mid to high 80's. Would moving the turbo ratio limits down slightly help with the temps?


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## unclewebb (Sep 9, 2020)

NattyliteSaber said:


> help with the temps


Help what? Your temps are perfectly normal for a modern gaming laptop that has an Intel CPU. I would leave it as is and enjoy its performance.

Are these temps bothering you physically? Some people do not want an oven on their lap or do not want second degree burns when they touch their keyboard. If this is the problem then you might need to reduce the turbo ratio limits and slow your CPU down. Your CPU is not a problem when lightly loaded so maybe setting the turbo ratios to something like 41, 41, 38, 38, 35, 35 might work well. When lightly loaded, your CPU will still be able to run at its full rated speed. It will only slow down when heavily loaded.

Check the Log File option in ThrottleStop and go play a game. CPU power consumption might be fairly low depending on the game. If power consumption is low then slowing your CPU down would be the best option for you to reduce temperatures.


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## NattyliteSaber (Sep 9, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> Help what? Your temps are perfectly normal for a modern gaming laptop that has an Intel CPU. I would leave it as is and enjoy its performance.
> 
> Are these temps bothering you physically? Some people do not want an oven on their lap or do not want second degree burns when they touch their keyboard. If this is the problem then you might need to reduce the turbo ratio limits and slow your CPU down. Your CPU is not a problem when lightly loaded so maybe setting the turbo ratios to something like 41, 41, 38, 38, 35, 35 might work well. When lightly loaded, your CPU will still be able to run at its full rated speed. It will only slow down when heavily loaded.
> 
> Check the Log File option in ThrottleStop and go play a game. CPU power consumption might be fairly low depending on the game. If power consumption is low then slowing your CPU down would be the best option for you to reduce temperatures.



I was having terrible performance because of thermal throttling is why I originally started playing with throttle stop. I have ran the log file and see PL1 PL2 but not sure what that means


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## unclewebb (Sep 10, 2020)

PL1 means your CPU is throttling so it does not exceed the long term turbo power limit. 

PL2 means your CPU is throttling so it does not exceed the short term turbo power limit. 

You lowered your turbo power limits so this makes sense. 

Some users get more consistent game performance with power limit throttling compared to thermal throttling.


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## Lawrence_phaw (Sep 10, 2020)

Thrasher said:


> Thank you very much man the truth brought me results, I have been struggling since I bought it half a year ago, can you tell me specifically what model of kryonaut you used?



It is *thermal grizzly Kryonaut. *


You don't have to apply too much kryonaut. You can learn it from some youtube videos. 
Kind regards.


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## mick353 (Sep 10, 2020)

The 9750H, well an ideal voltage if you want to max it out  with my combo is at a P1 and P2 set to 90.
Set the voltage to a core of between -60 and -80 and a core cache to -120 at the most.
-60 is my sweet spot with - 120 Cache.
Sitting at high 80s all day at 85w. ..

I"ll attach a few screenshots including Cinebench score of 3021
Of course i'm using the RTX2060 90w combo so slight changes..


----------



## daniflin (Sep 10, 2020)

hello, I need help on trying to get the best performace for rendering on my laptop (for architecture)
this are the specs:

model: Acer predator helios (Predator PH315-51)
CPU: i7-8750H CPU 
GPU:  NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060
RAM: 16 GB DDR4 2666MHZ
1 SSD: 256 GB
2 SSD: 500 GB

I got 2397 on cinebench with  this settings on throttlestop









how can I boost this machine? or is at its limits?
thanks


----------



## unclewebb (Sep 10, 2020)

mick353 said:


> Set the voltage to a core of between -60 and -80 and a core cache to -120 at the most.


You might have these two backwards. The cache voltage is always the limiting factor. The best way to adjust voltages is to set the core and cache equally to begin with. Find a point where you are stable. After that, back the cache off a little and then increase the core offset towards -200 mV in steps of -20 mV. Use Cinebench R20 for testing purposes when setting your offset voltages.



daniflin said:


> I got 2397 on cinebench


That is not a great Cinebench R20 score for an 8750H. Start by downloading the latest version of ThrottleStop from TechPowerUp.

Your laptop is using Speed Shift Technology. When you see SST in green on the main screen, do not check the Set Multiplier option. It does not do anything.

The rest of your settings are OK. At default settings, the 8750H will power limit throttle and slow down when heavily loaded. To try to get around this, you need to increase the two turbo power limits in the TPL window. Increase the turbo boost long value from 45W to 60W. Increase the short limit from 56W to 60W. This is just a starting point. Some laptops set internal power limits that cannot be bypassed so I just want to see how this change effects performance.

Run Cinebench R20 again. Open up the Limit Reasons window in ThrottleStop and while this benchmark is running, watch for anything lighting up in red. Watch the CORE column. That is the important one. Typically you will see either PL1 or PL2 if one of the power limits is causing a problem and you will see THERMAL if your CPU reaches its maximum safe temperature. Your CPU will automatically slow down if it gets too hot so no worries there. You might also want to turn on the Log File option in ThrottleStop while testing so you have a record of your CPU's performance that you can attach to your next post. These minor tweaks should improve performance.


----------



## NattyliteSaber (Sep 10, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> PL1 means your CPU is throttling so it does not exceed the long term turbo power limit.
> 
> PL2 means your CPU is throttling so it does not exceed the short term turbo power limit.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the help. If I set my long and short both to 45 with a 1 sec turbo time limit do you think that will cause any issues? After playing with everything I do see that the turbo boost power limits and turbo ratio limits are the most effective with temps.


----------



## unclewebb (Sep 10, 2020)

NattyliteSaber said:


> do you think that will cause any issues?


I don't know. Make some adjustments, do some testing and find out what works best for you.

The turbo time limit controls when your CPU switches from the short power limit to the long power limit. If your power limits are set equally then it does not matter if your CPU switches power limits after 1 second or the default 28 seconds.


----------



## daniflin (Sep 10, 2020)

hey so I tried again with the modification that you said (*unclewebb, *sorry I don't know how to reply on this forum lol).
 I installed the last version of throttlestop (9.2), and changed the TPL values to 60. then I runned Cinebench R20 again and I got 2617 pts (before I had 2397 pts). here are some screenshots and the log file. also I didin't got any THERMAL messages on the Limit Reasonss windows. 













can it be better ?


----------



## unclewebb (Sep 10, 2020)

Your log file shows PL1 throttling at 45W and PL2 throttling at 56W. Some laptops set power limits internally and you cannot go beyond these limits. Try checking the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits option and run another test. If your CPU is still limited to these values, there is nothing you can do.


----------



## daniflin (Sep 10, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> Your log file shows PL1 throttling at 45W and PL2 throttling at 56W. Some laptops set power limits internally and you cannot go beyond these limits. Try checking the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits option and run another test. If your CPU is still limited to these values, there is nothing you can do.


well I checked that option and it didn't change anything . It keeps showing PL1 throttling at 45W and PL2 throttling at 56W  and on Cinebench I got 2617 pts, so I guess that is the limit I can push this laptop. anyways, thanks a lot !


----------



## Dsanik (Sep 11, 2020)

Hello,
I send my max score in Cinebench R20 - 3109cb.
NTB Lenovo Legion Y530
CPU i7-8750H
GPU GTX1060
Ram 32 GB

Throttlestop
Current  undervolt : CPU Core -1000mV, CPU Cache -148mV , iGPU -148mV. Stock paste
PL1 55W
PL2 65W


----------



## Caring1 (Sep 11, 2020)

Dsanik said:


> NTB Lenovo Legion Y530
> CPU i7-8750H
> GPU GTX1060
> Ram 32 GB
> ...


Congrats, your undervolt is not being applied, but your score is good.


----------



## Lawrence_phaw (Sep 12, 2020)

Dsanik said:


> Hello,
> I send my max score in Cinebench R20 - 3109cb.
> NTB Lenovo Legion Y530
> CPU i7-8750H
> ...



Thanks for sharing.
Are the power limits (55W and 65W) BIOS default or you took it down? My legion is set at 60W and 90W (by default).
Thanks for coming here. I am the one from youtube.
I will try your setting. But my machine has only 24G RAM.



Caring1 said:


> Congrats, your undervolt is not being applied, but your score is good.



What do you mean his undervolt is not being applied? Can you explain, please? Thanks in advance.


----------



## unclewebb (Sep 12, 2020)

Lawrence_phaw said:


> What do you mean his undervolt is not being applied?


I think @Caring1 saw that the core undervolt was set to -1000 mV so assumed that the undervolt was not being applied. Unless a screenshot of the FIVR window is posted, you cannot tell.

When the core is set to a ridiculous number like -1000 mV, obviously that is not being applied to the core or the core would be at 0 volts and would immediately crash. What can happen though is maybe -250 mV of that request is being used and the other -750 mV is being ignored by the CPU. In that case, some of the undervolt is being applied. Need to see a screenshot before concluding anything.


----------



## Dsanik (Sep 12, 2020)

My settings Throttlestop






Screen HWmonitor





What is maximum undervolt CPU?


----------



## unclewebb (Sep 12, 2020)

The core and cache undervolt work together.  If cache undervolt is set to -150 mV, maybe max core undervolt is -250 mV. If you set -250 mV for the core or -500 mV for the core or -1000 mV, the CPU will still use -250 mV. The CPU ignores really big voltage request numbers.

Do some testing with Cinebench R20. Start testing with the core at -175 mV and then -200 mV, -225 mV, etc. At some point, your Cinebench scores will stop improving. That is the maximum undervolt for your CPU. Leave the cache at -150 mV for all tests if it is stable.


----------



## Caring1 (Sep 12, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> I think @Caring1 saw that the core undervolt was set to -1000 mV so assumed that the undervolt was not being applied. Unless a screenshot of the FIVR window is posted, you cannot tell.


True, I assumed undervolting a 1.03V CPU by 1.0V would not work.
Interesting to learn that part of that undervolt may be applied linked to Cache.


----------



## Lawrence_phaw (Sep 12, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> The core and cache undervolt work together.  If cache undervolt is set to -150 mV, maybe max core undervolt is -250 mV. If you set -250 mV for the core or -500 mV for the core or -1000 mV, the CPU will still use -250 mV. The CPU ignores really big voltage request numbers.
> 
> Do some testing with Cinebench R20. Start testing with the core at -175 mV and then -200 mV, -225 mV, etc. At some point, your Cinebench scores will stop improving. That is the maximum undervolt for your CPU. Leave the cache at -150 mV for all tests if it is stable.



Thanks. 
Now I can understand why the performance is not improving after -230mV.


----------



## xtess3ractx (Oct 19, 2020)

Hi guys,

Been lurking this forum for about two years intermittently tweaking my undervolts and such but whenever I think I just about found the sweet spot I get random crashes. Particularly games such as MW, APEX.

The strange thing is I can run all benchmark suites without a problem but certain games just seem to crush my thermals and power consumption. For limits I got it too the state, that the only limit that pops up is edp ring, any idea how I can remedy this? and perhaps fix my BSOD (WHEA_UNCORRECTABLE_ERROR) in certain games.

I've included the settings i'm using currently, the first bit where gpu clocks spike is running 3Dmark demo(Timespy), the rest is after running 3 ts benches and writing this.


----------



## unclewebb (Oct 19, 2020)

xtess3ractx said:


> I get random crashes


Random crashes are a sign that you have gone too far with your undervolt. Can you run the 1 and 2 Thread TS Bench tests with 0 errors? Set your turbo ratios back to their default values when testing. 41, 41, 40, 40, 39, 39

If you are not stable, do not undervolt the Intel GPU and iGPU Unslice. Back the cache off to -100 mV and maybe back the core off to -150 mV or -125 mV. You need to get back to a point where you are 100% stable, all of the time. If you find that point, then you can try to increase the core and cache offsets. The Intel GPU is not used when gaming so most users do not bother with it.

The purpose of the Windows High Performance power plan is to run the CPU at full speed regardless of load. You have combined that with a Speed Shift EPP setting of 128 which is telling the CPU to slow down when lightly loaded. You are telling the CPU to do two different things. Pick one or the other. If you want a slow CPU when lightly loaded just set it to the default Balanced power plan in Windows. No need to check the Windows power plan feature in ThrottleStop. You do not need it.

Windows 10 can also take care of the Speed Shift EPP value. That is what the Windows power slider is for. If you do not check the Speed Shift EPP option in ThrottleStop, this will allow Windows to adjust EPP. Open the FIVR window and you can watch in the monitoring table to see what EPP value Windows uses as you adjust the slider. If Windows can handle this, there is no need to have ThrottleStop and Windows both writing different info to the same CPU register.

Some things occasionally lighting up in red in Limit Reasons is not the end of the world. By reducing the turbo ratio limits, you have chosen to throttle your CPU by 700 MHz so what's a little more throttling? Your CPU is running at only 80°C. Why not let it run at the speed that Intel designed it to run at? Temperatures of 90°C to 95°C are normal temperatures for laptops with Intel's 6 core CPUs. Intel says any temperature under 100°C is a "safe operating temperature".


----------



## xtess3ractx (Oct 19, 2020)

Ok, I'll make some adjustments.

I matched the Epp setting in windows.

The reason I capped turbo ratio limits though is because the 1070 starts to throttle around 84°C.


----------



## unclewebb (Oct 19, 2020)

xtess3ractx said:


> The reason I capped turbo power limits


That makes sense. The log file only shows the GPU getting up to 70°C so it looks like you still have quite a bit of headroom before it hits 84°C.


----------



## TripleD (Nov 21, 2020)

Hello, I've just replaced my thermal paste and temperatures got a lot better, but I've went from Thermal Throttling to Power Throttling. When cinebench starts all cores goes at the 5th/6th core clock and it runs between 88º and 95º (before changing the thermal paste it literally thermal throttled just bystarting a game, capped at 2.9ghz with 95º) but after 10 or 20 seconds it power throttles and goes back to 3.3ghz at 85º, running much better than before but still not getting even close to 3.9ghz.

Could I get some help? I've tried everything I could've thought (btw 90/90 on power iare the default numbers on my hp omen 15)


----------



## unclewebb (Nov 21, 2020)

TripleD said:


> Thermal Throttling to Power Throttling


Intel gave the 8750H a 45W TDP rating. Some laptop manufacturers decided to enforce that limit. During any long term test, the CPU will throttle and be limited to 45W. ThrottleStop cannot be used to solve this problem.

When running Cinebench you can try increasing your core offset to -200 mV or -225 mV. That might help a tiny bit but ultimately you will still be limited to 45W.

Now that you have fixed the thermal paste, you can set the turbo ratio limits back to their default values, 41, 41, 40, 40, 39, 39 and set Speed Shift Max back to 41.

If you are going to undervolt the Intel GPU then you also have to undervolt the iGPU Unslice. These two voltages should be set equally. There is very little to be gained. The Intel GPU is not used when gaming if you have an Nvidia GPU. Undervolting the Intel GPU can cause instability so most users do not bother.

Download ThrottleStop 9.2 and copy the new ThrottleStop.exe file into your ThrottleStop folder.


----------



## Kingtanar (Nov 21, 2020)

xtess3ractx said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> Been lurking this forum for about two years intermittently tweaking my undervolts and such but whenever I think I just about found the sweet spot I get random crashes. Particularly games such as MW, APEX.
> 
> ...


I used to have a similar problem as you, trying to find the "sweet spot" for the cpu undervolting. I read on many forums that the I7-8750H was stable around -125mV for the core and cache, however, it was not stable for me (I have an i7-8750H too). Going straight to the point, I currently have and undervolt of -225mV for the core and -120mV for the cache, and no undervolt for the Intel GPU or System Agent. I haven't had any error while using the Throttlestop bench or any BSOD since applying this undervolt settings. As Unclewebb said, backing the cache a little can bring you stability, and then you can start decreasing the core more and more. 

The value I set for the core was tested with TS bench and then Cinebench R23, so when I undervolted more, around -250mV for the core and got a lower score than with -225mV for the core, I knew this was my limit. 

I don't know if this is on any use, but I don't check the Speed Shift EPP, since Windows sets a value of 84 for the balanced (at better performance slider position) power plan.. You can check this on the FIVR window, on the last parameter in the box in the right.

Also, I have a different undervolt when using battery, -130mV for the core and -100mV for cache, due to if I used the same undervolt profile as the plugged in, my laptop had some freezes from time to time. 

I hope this helps you reaching lower temps and keeping the maximum performance your CPU can provide


----------



## abactuon (Nov 22, 2020)

I recently bought MSI GF65 (i5-9300h,1660ti).
Configured by reading this forum:
CPU Core Offset : -220,7
CPU Cache Offset : -109,4
Intel GPU Offset : -70,3
iGPU Unslice : -70,3
Checked with TS Bench.
One problem is noise, I wanted to change the thermal paste, but then I turned it on 'Disable Turbo', and it turned out that the 2400 MHz frequency suits me.
In all my games (Prey 2017, Fallout 4, Red Dead Redemption 2 ...), I have an acceptable setting for me (High,1920x1080). Temperature (GPU,CPU - 70C), no noise.
I even overclocked it a little Nvidia GPU with the help MSI Afterburner, maybe this is not necessary.
*For newbies like me*, this is not obvious.
Is comfort more important than 'Cinebench' ?


----------



## abactuon (Nov 25, 2020)

I have a question :
Why is there only 15W-20W in games, but it is advised to set TurboBoostPL>=45W, or is it something else.
Can I put TurboBoostPL=35W or will it be necessary to increase the voltage then.


----------



## unclewebb (Nov 25, 2020)

abactuon said:


> I turned it on 'Disable Turbo', and it turned out that the 2400 MHz frequency suits me.





abactuon said:


> Why is there only 15W-20W in games


You slowed your CPU down. It will use less power running slow. 

Laptop computers are very powerful. Many games are not programmed to take advantage of a modern CPU. Power consumption will not be high if only half of the CPU is being used.


----------



## abactuon (Nov 25, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> Many games are not programmed to take advantage of a modern CPU.


Yes, but they all always max out the frequency/watts by default, with no improvement in quality/comfort (for my configurations).


----------



## Ch3m1zt (Nov 27, 2020)

i m limited of my knowledge of the time still today, so i turned the turb off and pushed afterburner to get peak on the 1060 6gb, and now started tinkering with this lappy again, 
changed thermals and pads, to kryonout, i was about to go the liquid, but if u cant undervolt or find stable on a lappy, there is no point yet. learning curve has been great ty



unclewebb said:


> You slowed your CPU down. It will use less power running slow.
> 
> Laptop computers are very powerful. Many games are not programmed to take advantage of a modern CPU. Power consumption will not be high if only half of the CPU is being used.


hence we are here trying to tame these 8750`s



abactuon said:


> I recently bought MSI GF65 (i5-9300h,1660ti).
> Configured by reading this forum:
> CPU Core Offset : -220,7
> CPU Cache Offset : -109,4
> ...


 please read the posts from the firsts, and dont add randm numbers, coz every cip and board is different, its the russian rulette with these so ur numbers never gonna fit with other, so u gotta go the long run and step by step safe,


----------



## ke1tht (Nov 30, 2020)

after i install the windows update, the EDP other light up in the Ring section. But before the windows update there are nothing light up even when gaming. Any way to fix that? thx


----------



## unclewebb (Nov 30, 2020)

ke1tht said:


> the EDP other light up in the Ring section


The RING - EDP OTHER limit reason is very sensitive. On some CPUs, it can constantly light up yellow even when a computer is idle with not much going on. You can ignore it. It is only a problem when it is red which indicates that CPU throttling is in progress.  

Do not check the PP0 Power Limit. Clear this box. 

Do some testing with Cinebench R20. There might be room to lower your CPU core voltage some more. There is usually not much reason to undervolt the Intel GPU. During gaming, the Intel GPU is not being used. Undervolting it can reduce overall stability. Better to leave the Intel GPU and iGPU Unslice at +0.0000 so you can undervolt the CPU core some more if possible.


----------



## NattyliteSaber (Nov 30, 2020)

@unclewebb 

I saw you on a thread about the 8750h on notebook review. Anyways I have been playing around with this some more. Can you take a look at my log and give me some suggestions? 
Currently my turbo limits are 41,41,40,40,39,39, under volt for both core and cache -144.5, turbo boost power limits 45 long 45 short turbo time 1. The game I was playing in this log is Star Citizen and it looks like I was reaching 90+. Thanks!


----------



## unclewebb (Dec 1, 2020)

@NattyliteSaber - Your log file shows thermal throttling happening at 90°C. This means that the company that built your laptop are cowards. The Intel specified thermal throttling temperature for the 8750H is 100°C. When thermal throttling starts too soon, you lose out on maximum performance.

Have a look in the Options window. There is a setting called PROCHOT Offset that has been set to somewhere around 10 which is causing this premature throttling. If there is not a lock icon above this setting, you should be able to edit this value. Intel default is zero. Most laptops set this conservatively to 2 or 3.

CPU power consumption is only 15W when this throttling is going on. When a 45W CPU is hitting 90°C at one third of its rated power, that either means the heatsink is completely inadequate or it is filthy. It needs to be cleaned and the thermal paste needs to be replaced with something like Noctua NT-H2. Thermal paste in a gaming laptop does not last forever. This should be considered regular maintenance so learn to do this procedure yourself if you want it done right. At high temperatures, some thermal paste does not last long.

There is no need to undervolt the core and cache equally. Download Cinebench R20 and do some testing. 









						MAXON Cinebench (R20.0) Download
					

CINEBENCH is a real-world cross platform test suite that evaluates your computer's performance capabilities. CINEBENCH is based on MAXON's award-winn




					www.techpowerup.com
				




Set the core and cache to an offset of -125 mV for a baseline run. Now start bumping only the core in steps of -25 mV. Many users see improved performance or temperatures when setting the core and cache to different values. The core can go up to -200 mV to -225 mV and still be stable. Do some light load TS Bench 1 and 2 Thread tests to test for instability.

Fix the cooling first. That is the main problem.


----------



## NattyliteSaber (Dec 1, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> @NattyliteSaber - Your log file shows thermal throttling happening at 90°C. This means that the company that built your laptop are cowards. The Intel specified thermal throttling temperature for the 8750H is 100°C. When thermal throttling starts too soon, you lose out on maximum performance.
> 
> Have a look in the Options window. There is a setting called PROCHOT Offset that has been set to somewhere around 10 which is causing this premature throttling. If there is not a lock icon above this setting, you should be able to edit this value. Intel default is zero. Most laptops set this conservatively to 2 or 3.
> 
> ...



I also forgot to mention that I did the IMON offsets as described in Hackness's thread regarding the 8750H on notebookreview. I have already reapplied the paste once but it was with some off the shelf thermal take paste from best buy. I'll give the Noctua a shot. The BD PROCHOT box on the main page of TS was unchecked and the section under options  was unchecked and set to 10. Should i check both those and start playing with lower values? Thanks!


----------



## unclewebb (Dec 1, 2020)

PROCHOT and BD PROCHOT are two different things. There is no need to clear the BD PROCHOT box unless Limit Reasons shows that you have a BD PROCHOT throttling problem that you are trying to solve.

As for PROCHOT Offset, if you do not see the lock icon then I would reduce this significantly towards 0. Your call whether you want to go right to the Intel default of 0 or leave 2 or 3 degrees of headroom.


----------



## NattyliteSaber (Dec 1, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> PROCHOT and BD PROCHOT are two different things. There is no need to clear the BD PROCHOT box unless Limit Reasons shows that you have a BD PROCHOT throttling problem that you are trying to solve.
> 
> As for PROCHOT Offset, if you do not see the lock icon then I would reduce this significantly towards 0. Your call whether you want to go right to the Intel default of 0 or leave 2 or 3 degrees of headroom.



I updated the bios to see if that would do anything and now i'm getting around 40 watts with temps in the high 80's to mid 90's. I have no idea what changed in the bios to allow this. Playing with the PROCHOT Offset in the options with values from 0-10 I see 90-100 degrees with wattage of 50-25. This with a undervolt of -145 core and cache. I agree that its a horribly cooling system and the main issue and the only way to raise the frequency is to lower the temps. Do you think liquid metal paste will be any better than the noctua? Thanks for all the help.


----------



## dafttitan (Dec 19, 2020)

Hi guys,

I have a macbook with i7-8750h cpu and Razer core external gpu.
I noticed that the bottleneck in my games is the cpu getting hot.
I have read parts of this post (thanks!) and have been trying to configure Throttlestop correctly.

The bios seems to lock undervolting, FIVR settings are not applied.
I changed some other settings, the cpu is still getting hot but cinebench result went from 4900 to 5200 and I get higher fps in my games.

Could someone please have a look and let me know if I did this correctly?

I am attaching config and logs.

Thanks!


----------



## Leooli (Dec 19, 2020)

Hey there guys

I have been playing with some Throttlestop settings lately trying to get the best of my system but I feel i'm losing too much performance maybe because of some wrong setting or misinformation.
Everytime I try to play something more demanding, my CPU instantly gets its temps to the sky, reaching my PROCHOT offset, staying in the 90-95ºC range, the same happens when running Cinebench R20.
I dont know the reasons for the notebook getting so hot even though I guess my setup isn't that bad, maybe it's because the place I live in achieves temperatures of like 30ºC midday and 25º at night? The only case I can make sense of the high temperatures is when I'm emulating some console.
I'm attaching my configs and some logs I made when running Valorant (I guess it's not that demanding) and Cinebench to test.
I also tried different voltages when running the bench and got some values and ended up sticking with the highest of them:

Core - Cache - Cinebench Score
125 125 2015
150 125 2333
175 125 2369
175 150 2405
175 175 2341
200 150 2474 - using this setup atm

My setup:
Notebook G7 7588
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-8750H CPU @ 2.20GHz
16GB RAM
GPU NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1050Ti
Windows 10 Pro 64bit Build 19042


Any help or piece of advice is much appreciated, I've been reading and trying everything I've found through this forum but I don't think I'm doing it right.
Thanks in advance,
Leo


----------



## unclewebb (Dec 20, 2020)

dafttitan said:


> The bios seems to lock undervolting


That is correct. Look at the top middle of the FIVR window. It says, FIVR Control - Locked. That means you cannot adjust the CPU voltages and it also means that you cannot adjust the turbo ratio limits. Both of these are locked. Your CPU supports +4 bins of turbo overclocking but guess what? That is locked too. You have a CPU with lots of performance potential but no way to use it.

The rest of your settings look OK. You can increase the Speed Shift Max value from 41 to 43 but that is about it. Your CPU is hitting the full 100°C thermal throttling temperature. Not sure how user friendly your laptop is. You can try changing the thermal paste. If the laptops heatsink and fan are inadequate, this will probably not solve your problem.

@Leooli - Your CPU is running great during Valorant. It is mostly maintaining the full 39.00 multiplier.

During Cinebench, your CPU is constantly thermal throttling. A well cooled 8750H can score over 3000 points in this benchmark. You can try replacing the thermal paste or just stick to playing games like Valorant. Any game that is more demanding is going to have your CPU pegged at the thermal throttling temperature, just like Cinebench.


----------



## dafttitan (Dec 20, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> That is correct. Look at the top middle of the FIVR window. It says, FIVR Control - Locked. That means you cannot adjust the CPU voltages and it also means that you cannot adjust the turbo ratio limits. Both of these are locked. Your CPU supports +4 bins of turbo overclocking but guess what? That is locked too. You have a CPU with lots of performance potential but no way to use it.



Thanks a lot for the detailed explanation. I did a quick search and it seems there is no way to unlock undervolt on "newer" Mac devices. I am thinking more and more that I should get away from Apple.


----------



## Darwin121 (Dec 26, 2020)

Hi there, 

So I started not long ago studying about undervolting and I've been reading a lot of posts from this forum and tried some configurations, but I think I'm not achieving the results I expect.

I have a MI Gaming Laptop
Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-8750H CPU @ 2.20GHz 
16GB RAM
GPU NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060 
Windows 10 Pro 64bit Build 19042 

I already tried different Core/Cache undervolts, but mainly I have -125mV Cache and -150mV Core (also tried with -250, which gave me the best Cinebench20 Score of 2689)

I think I'm getting Power Limit Throttle as I see on "Limits" at ThrottleStop, but the odd thing for me it's the fact that I raised the Turbo Boost Long Power Max to 75, from the base 45, and as you can see from TS Log it runs for  quite a while reaching 74.7W then Throttles to 45W showing PL1.

Also I think I'm getting to high temperatures.

Another question is that I can't run with higher multiplier than 32/33 when running Cinebench, while at TS Bench it runs at 39 then also drops to 33.

Any help would be appreciated.


----------



## unclewebb (Dec 26, 2020)

Darwin121 said:


> which gave me the best Cinebench20 Score


If an undervolt of -250 mV on the core was working for you, why did you go back to -150 mV?

Check the FIVR Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits option. There are multiple sets of turbo power limits. This feature takes care of the secondary power limits.

Some laptops use firmware that will force a 45W TDP limit regardless of any ThrottleStop setting. In this case, there is not much you can do when a laptop manufacturer forces their laptops to 45W. Some MSI laptops have access to an advanced BIOS feature where you can adjust the IMON Slope variable. This tricks the CPU into reporting less power consumption and can be used to get beyond the 45W barrier. Do a Google search to find out more. 



Darwin121 said:


> Also I think I'm getting too high temperatures.


These are powerful CPUs. When fully unlocked, they consume a lot of power and produce a lot of heat. Some laptops get very hot when these CPUs are allowed to run at full speed.

Try switching to ThrottleStop 9.2.9. It includes a logo with a gray background. 








						ThrottleStop (9.5) Download
					

ThrottleStop is a small application designed to monitor for and correct the three main types of CPU throttling that are being used on many lapto




					www.techpowerup.com
				



Easier on the eyes for those that like the traditional gray theme.





This version also lets you double click on the monitoring table so you can see all of your threads at the same time.


----------



## Darwin121 (Dec 26, 2020)

unclewebb said:


> If an undervolt of -250 mV on the core was working for you, why did you go back to -150 mV?



Because I thought maybe I'm going to far, and reducing performance, because I like I said I'm only getting 3,2Ghz and that's my main question.



unclewebb said:


> Check the FIVR Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits option. There are multiple sets of turbo power limits. This feature takes care of the secondary power limits.



I really don't know why is that unchecked, last time e looked I always had it checked.



unclewebb said:


> These are powerful CPUs. When fully unlocked, they consume a lot of power and produce a lot of heat. Some laptops get very hot when these CPUs are allowed to run at full speed.



I understand, but I see people getting lower temps, that's why I'm asking.

Another question I have is why I can't put my laptop in C8 state.

Thanks for the fast reply.


----------



## unclewebb (Dec 27, 2020)

Darwin121 said:


> why I can't put my laptop in C8 state.


Trying switch to battery power. Still no package C8?

Many laptops are poorly designed. One bad driver can interfere with a CPU using the low power C states. It is very difficult to track these problems down, especially if your laptop never worked correctly when it was new. When idle, what is C0 state activity like? Some users have too many apps running in the background which can prevent the CPU from entering the low power C states.



http://imgur.com/72KvfzA




Darwin121 said:


> I'm only getting 3,2Ghz and that's my main question.


Your log file shows power limit throttling at 45W. Your CPU is being forced to slow down to 3300 MHz so it does not exceed 45W. If you check the Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits box and you are still getting throttling at 45W, there is not much you can do to fix this. Some manufacturers enforce the 45W TDP limit. Check that option and do some more testing.


----------



## jaceknokia (Dec 27, 2020)

Why right after starting the laptop, the power cpu is so much and after some time it suddenly increases by itself?
After on laptop:



But 1-5 hours later:


I I don play any games. I have hybrid uhd630 and 1660ti


----------



## AOne (Dec 28, 2020)

How is this possible? I'm reaching above 35 W on startup. Even on wake up it's higher than 11W. Either your system is tuned really good or I'm using lots of processes in the background. C0 state is about 3-6%, but I'm having tons of services.


----------



## jaceknokia (Dec 28, 2020)

My y540 is never turn off. Actualy after the night:


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## unclewebb (Dec 28, 2020)

jaceknokia said:


> Why


Power consumption is some sort of approximation, calculated within the CPU. It is not measured power consumption. All monitoring software reports the same data using the same Intel recommended method but this data is not 100% accurate. It is just a number used to control the Turbo Boost function.

Here is a 10 core CPU at 5.0 GHz sipping power like a netbook. Probably not accurate. Definitely looks impressive.



http://imgur.com/i4tnKgl


----------



## jaceknokia (Dec 28, 2020)

But when it is 1.2W the fans are not working and when the value suddenly jumps to 11.2W you can hear them.

These values can change themselves. Suddenly.


----------



## rethcirE (Dec 28, 2020)

The key is definitely limiting background programs and services. Try programs like WPD, O&OSU10, non-DCH graphics drivers. Remove GeForce Experience, disable Intel graphics, do not allow Windows to self-update or pre-download drivers. 

The 8750H can sit idle (lowest while running for me is C7 ~ 97 - 98%) at MAX Boost frequency (4.1GHz) while only utilizing C0% ~0.3 and PKG Power ~1.8 - 1.9W with all cores Active/Unparked. Absolutely no reason to limit the CPU to lower frequencies. I found if trying to Park unused cores, the sudden unparking of cores (any workload) can cause your described power spikes. Simply leaving all cores Active but idle solved this for me.


----------



## jaceknokia (Dec 28, 2020)

Will it be the fault of INTEL graphics?

With intel I have 34 degrees and when I turn off Intel I have 41 degrees on 1660ti and then the fans can already be heard.


----------



## rethcirE (Dec 28, 2020)

It will depend on your machine. My laptop runs a tad more power at idle when utilizing the iGPU along with the dedicated RTX card (Hybrid Mode). Switching to dedicated GPU only and disabling the Intel graphics allows the PKG Power to be in the 1.0-2.0W range at idle.


----------



## jaceknokia (Dec 28, 2020)

For 16 hours, the laptop works all the time in hybrid mode. PKG power 1-2W all the time.


----------



## ramops (Dec 30, 2020)

Hi there

Long time lurker here so decided to create an account, I've decided to look into undervolting since I was getting higher temperatures during idle 60-70 degrees and 95-100 during actual gaming. I managed to decrease it to around 50 with light browsing and playing a youtube on youtube. During gaming it still hits 98 degrees.. How stupid it may sound any idea what I can still do here without losing performance?  Also I noticed my PKG power is quite high during gaming it can up to 24/25 and now it just hovering around 7-11 w with occasionaly dip to 5. Keep in mind I'm using an EGPU so the dgpu is disabled. Apparantly it already hit the max of 89/91 without evening gaming!


Happy holidays


----------



## unclewebb (Dec 30, 2020)

Your laptop has disabled CPU voltage control. Your voltage request is being ignored.



http://imgur.com/74yemEf


Your laptop is going to run hot and it will not be able to perform at its full potential. If you want the voltage control feature to work, try finding a previous BIOS version. Intel released an update last December to disable CPU voltage control. What laptop model do you have?

When a Windows 10 computer is idle, here is how much time it needs to spend in the C0 state processing background tasks.



http://imgur.com/72KvfzA


Your computer seems to have something significant running in the background. Open the Task Manager, go to the Details tab, organize your running tasks by CPU usage and try to find out what the problem is. Some antivirus programs are pigs. What antivirus program are you using?

Without voltage control you are really limited. Have you ever disassembled your laptop for a thorough cleaning? Replacing the thermal paste can also help with peak temperatures.

The latest version of ThrottleStop makes a Locked CPU a little more obvious.








						ThrottleStop 9.2.9
					

ThrottleStop 9.2.9 https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-throttlestop/  New Features - added 10850K / 10900K support including a new Turbo Group access window. - updated the TS Bench and the C State window for the 10 core CPUs. - enabled Limit Reasons support for Comet Lake CPUs. -...




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## ramops (Dec 31, 2020)

Thanks a lot for your follow up, I decided to do an undervolt before I decide to repaste since it would be the first time for me. I'm running an XPS15 9570 with BIOS 1.7.1 I guess that seems the culprit.. Now lets see how to unlock these features. However I did notice quite an performance increase and lower temps since I started out with throttlestop so something must've helped there


----------



## bullMoose445 (Feb 28, 2021)

Hi. I am wondering if there's something I did wrong as I keep getting EDP other RING and PL2 CORE throttling all the time during TS Bench or R20 test. I tried changing these values, however, it's still happening. Should I just leave the PP0 power limit to 0 as whenever I tried to change it to 100 or more, it changes to 96 / 80 / 60 on TS 9.3 version (it varies, during testing or idle). Also, every time my laptop turns on, PROCHOT 97°C is always lit up with various limit reasons shown. Is this because of unstable undervolt or bad cooling in general? System is Dell Alienware with i7-8750h. Thanks in advance!


----------



## Caring1 (Feb 28, 2021)

bullMoose445 said:


> Hi. I am wondering if there's something I did wrong as I keep getting EDP other RING and PL2 CORE throttling all the time during TS Bench or R20 test. I tried changing these values, however, it's still happening. Should I just leave the PP0 power limit to 0 as whenever I tried to change it to 100 or more, it changes to 96 / 80 / 60 on TS 9.3 version (it varies, during testing or idle). Also, every time my laptop turns on, PROCHOT 97°C is always lit up with various limit reasons shown. Is this because of unstable undervolt or bad cooling in general? System is Dell Alienware with i7-8750h. Thanks in advance!


Repaste your CPU.
The difference in temps between cores indicates a bad paste job.


----------



## unclewebb (Mar 1, 2021)

bullMoose445 said:


> if there's something I did wrong


Most Dell laptops set turbo power limits internally that cannot be modified by using Intel XTU or ThrottleStop. In a laptop with unlocked turbo power limits, an 8750H can score over 3000 points in Cinebench R20. In your Dell Alienware laptop, that is never going to happen. The power limits that Dell are using will limit this CPU to about 2500 points in R20. The 8750H has a 45W TDP rating so technically it is running within spec so there is nothing you can complain to Dell about. The only problem is that it is not running as well as some of the competition's laptops are running.

There is no need to check the PP0 Power Limit. When this or Power Limit 4 are set to 0, they are ignored and should not be the cause of any throttling.



bullMoose445 said:


> PROCHOT 97°C is always lit up


It is normal for some of the power limits (PL1 and PL2) to be triggered during boot up. Some yellow boxes in Limit Reasons are OK. It is poor design or someone did a poor job applying the thermal paste if PROCHOT is lighting up red during boot up. The load during boot up should not be enough to trigger thermal throttling.

@Caring1 is correct. The significant difference in core temperatures from core to core is usually a sign of a bad thermal paste job or a heatsink that is warped or not sitting square to the CPU.



bullMoose445 said:


> Should I just leave the PP0 power limit to 0 as whenever I tried to change it to 100 or more, it changes to 96 / 80 / 60 on TS 9.3 version


Are you talking about the PP0 Power Limit near the bottom of the Turbo Power Limits window or are you talking about some other power limit? Show me an example if something is changing. Your screenshot shows the PP0 Power Limit is set to 0 and is not being used.

TS 9.3 reports some of the info in the TPL window in real time so it is easier to see if a computer is making changes without your knowledge. I have no idea what sort of dirty tricks Dell is using. Draw a big circle around whatever is changing so it is obvious. Maybe show me two screenshots that show me what is changing. You might need to use the Lock option to prevent this from happening.


----------



## bullMoose445 (Mar 2, 2021)

Hi @unclewebb, Thanks so much for the explanation. And yes, I was talking about the PP0 power limit at the bottom of the TPL window. Here are some screenshots that show it changes into some random values ( I tried to set it to 100 and it changed to 70 - This did not happen with the previous version of TS ). Also, if PL2 is often lit up in the limit reasons, should I lower or increase the limit? Sorry, I am a bit clueless about this part  Thank you.


----------



## unclewebb (Mar 2, 2021)

bullMoose445 said:


> I tried to set it to 100 and it changed to 70


The PP0 Power Limit cannot be set higher than the PL2 power limit. In your screenshot, you have the PL2 power limit set to 70. If you try to set the PP0 Power Limit to 100, ThrottleStop will change whatever number you enter so it is not greater than your PL2 power limit (70). As far as I know, there is no reason to set the PP0 Power Limit. I would not check this box and I would leave it at the default setting which is 0 on most computers.

When you are running Cinebench, leave the Turbo Power Limits window open. Does the PP0 Power Limit randomly change during a stress test? If that happens, that would be unexpected. I will have a look at the code that controls this box tomorrow to see if that makes any sense. 

You are using Speed Shift Technology (SST on the main screen). The BIOS automatically enables Speed Shift on most recent laptops and this cannot be disabled after the BIOS enables it. Best to check the Speed Shift box.


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## bullMoose445 (Mar 2, 2021)

Ahh I got it now. One more question, how do we know if there are any errors or instability by running the TS bench? Does it lit up in red letter or something? As running cinebench would literally fry my laptop, so I would like to use just TS bench for now to test my settings.


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## unclewebb (Mar 2, 2021)

At the top of the TS Bench where it reports the time, if there are any errors, the TS Bench will report the number of errors.  





I usually stop the test immediately if it shows an error. No point in continuing this test. After 5.6 seconds, I know the CPU is not 100% stable. I know the CPU needs more voltage. Time to raise the voltage and test again. On my 10th Gen desktop CPU, I find this test allows me to come up with a fairly stable voltage in a minimum amount of time.


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## bullMoose445 (Mar 3, 2021)

Thanks so much for the help  I will repaste and hopefully see better thermals on the system.


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## Thrasher (Mar 4, 2021)

hello reinstall windows, and download throttlestop again it is version 9.3. It solved my problem with the temperature since I cleaned the fans, my question is that they would change these configs?.
in games like control, cod, fifa in that config with the fans in basic it reaches 85 degrees,
cooler boost at 78 degrees, in 3.2ghz the cores at 77 to 80 degrees in basic and in cooler boost I have not tested it yet


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## unclewebb (Mar 4, 2021)

Thrasher said:


> configs


Your settings look good. If you have any stability issues (BSOD), reduce your cache undervolt to -125 mV or -130 mV. Most 8750H are not 100% stable when the cache is at -140 mV.



Thrasher said:


> 85 degrees


That is a good temperature for a gaming laptop. Many recent laptops are frequently over 90°C while gaming.


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## Thrasher (Mar 4, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Your settings look good. If you have any stability issues (BSOD), reduce your cache undervolt to -125 mV or -130 mV. Most 8750H are not 100% stable when the cache is at -140 mV.
> 
> 
> That is a good temperature for a gaming laptop. Many recent laptops are frequently over 90°C while gaming.


thank you, what helped me was to change thermal paste and clean the fans in addition to the application


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## Badrun (Apr 26, 2021)

I have no idea what i am doing.


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## unclewebb (Apr 26, 2021)

Badrun said:


> I have no idea what i am doing.


There is piles of information available here on TechPowerUp in the ThrottleStop forum and piles more information available on YouTube.

To undervolt your CPU you have to undervolt both the CPU core and CPU cache. If you only undervolt the CPU core like your picture shows, this will not accomplish anything. The CPU will ignore this request.

Typical values for an 8750H are -125 mV for the cache and -200 mV for the core. Start with the core and cache set equally to -125 mV. Run Cinebench R20 for a baseline test and see how it goes. Increase the core voltage in steps of -25 mV and run another test. If you see an improvement, keep going. When your scores or temperatures stop improving then you have gone far enough. A good 8750H can score 3000 points during this test. Some Dell laptops are limited to about 2500 due to power limit throttling issues. 









						MAXON Cinebench (R20.0) Download
					

CINEBENCH is a real-world cross platform test suite that evaluates your computer's performance capabilities. CINEBENCH is based on MAXON's award-winn




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## applebottomjeans (Apr 28, 2021)

new to this and looks like an old forum.
i recently bought the asus m15 (10750h cometlake 1660ti) and it is running really hot at normal use the temps sometimes gets to 73 and averages at 55-61
but while gaming I think the temps are fine (70-77). I have also undervolted this laptop to -75, but I don't think it is doing anything

a reply would be a huge help


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## unclewebb (Apr 28, 2021)

Post a picture of the FIVR monitoring table. Make sure the offset undervolt is applied to both the core and the cache.

Most laptops run at 90C. Your temps are great.


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## applebottomjeans (Apr 29, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Post a picture of the FIVR monitoring table. Make sure the offset undervolt is applied to both the core and the cache.
> 
> Most laptops run at 90C. Your temps are great.


HEYY thanks for the reply!!!

the undervolt was done through bios.  It is locked in FIVR control, is there a way to unlock this? 
I think while under normal use the laptop used to be around 47-49 but now it is somewhere between 54-57 and I want to lower that

Saw your replies about speedshift and after doing that the temps while gaming averages at 68-71   that was really cool


Thanks!!


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## unclewebb (Apr 29, 2021)

@applebottomjeans - You are doing a great job killing the performance of your laptop. When Disable Turbo is checked, your CPU will run at about 60% of its rated speed. Strike 1.

A 10750H is a 6 core - 12 thread CPU. Your screenshot shows that you have disabled half of your CPU. Open the C states window to see if you have a 6 core 6 thread CPU or maybe you only have a 3 core - 6 thread CPU. It is not good either way. Strike 2.

And finally, the PROCHOT temperature is set to 86°C which is 14°C less than the Intel recommended value. This is also going to kill full load performance. Strike 3. You're laptop is out. You might as well have bought a low end tablet.

If you buy a laptop and you cannot run it at its full rated specs without it overheating then you put it back in the box and you take it back to the store for a full refund. How else are manufacturers going to learn that building laptops like this is not acceptable?


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## applebottomjeans (Apr 30, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> @applebottomjeans - You are doing a great job killing the performance of your laptop. When Disable Turbo is checked, your CPU will run at about 60% of its rated speed. Strike 1.
> 
> A 10750H is a 6 core - 12 thread CPU. Your screenshot shows that you have disabled half of your CPU. Open the C states window to see if you have a 6 core 6 thread CPU or maybe you only have a 3 core - 6 thread CPU. It is not good either way. Strike 2.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the reply!!

Disable the turbo is now unchecked and I had also disabled hyperthreading from bios, should I also enable that?
I didn't understand anything about C states in throttlestop and here is the screenshot.
so, I changed the prochot  temps to 100 (I'm pretty sure I hadn't touched that before)

Thanks!


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## unclewebb (Apr 30, 2021)

applebottomjeans said:


> I had also disabled hyperthreading from bios


You paid for a 6 core 12 thread CPU. Might as well use it at its rated spec unless you have a constant 99°C issue that you are trying to avoid.

Here is how the C states look on my desktop CPU when it is idle with Chrome minimized. Cores spending 99% of the time in the low power C7 state is possible. Some users have random glitches and stuttering and do not realize how many background tasks are killing performance.  Get your idle background processes down to a minimum and your computer will perform better.





The Intel thermal throttling temperature is typically 100°C and they set the shut down temperature to approximately 125°C. Some manufacturers have decided that this is too high so they have lowered the shut down temperature to 100°C. If you set PROCHOT Offset to 0, now the thermal throttling temperature and the shut down temperature are exactly the same. This will cause a problem. The CPU will not have a chance to throttle. It will simply get up to 100°C and shut down. If you have any shut downs like this right at 100°C then I would suggest setting PROCHOT Offset to approximately 3 to avoid this from happening.


----------



## applebottomjeans (May 1, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> You paid for a 6 core 12 thread CPU. Might as well use it at its rated spec unless you have a constant 99°C issue that you are trying to avoid.
> 
> Here is how the C states look on my desktop CPU when it is idle with Chrome minimized. Cores spending 99% of the time in the low power C7 state is possible. Some users have random glitches and stuttering and do not realize how many background tasks are killing performance.  Get your idle background processes down to a minimum and your computer will perform better.
> 
> ...


I watched some videos about lowering high temps and followed the steps, they did say the performance will be reduced. But I thought it was fine as long as I got those temps down while gaming. Will doing this shorten the life of the laptop?


And yeah I set the prochot value to 3 just in case.
Btw what might be the glitches and stuttering that you are talking about, and how to avoid those?

Thanks!!


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## unclewebb (May 1, 2021)

applebottomjeans said:


> as long as I got those temps down


Intel CPUs and gaming laptops are designed to run at over 90°C. It is always a good idea to get the temps down but do not completely kill the performance of your computer when doing this. As long as your CPU is not constantly thermal throttling, its temperature is OK.

Some useless apps and poorly written drivers can randomly put a significant load on your CPU. When this happens, you might get a brief stutter in a game. You might get regular stutters.



applebottomjeans said:


> how to avoid those?


Watch the C state data that ThrottleStop reports when your computer is idle. It is a good indication if there are any poorly behaving programs running in the background. Cores spending 99% of their time in the low power C7 state is ideal. Most computers are nowhere near this. They have too many badly behaving apps running in the background. Find out what is running on your computer and decide if it needs to be running or not. ShutUp10 is a good program to manage some of the useless Windows tasks that Microsoft has running on your computer. Your games will run smoother if the CPU is not being constantly interrupted.


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## budafuko (Jun 3, 2021)

ya i have the same chip it runs super hot. just to let you know changing to kryonaut paste lowered my temp by 20 degrees and i barely get red warnings anymore (yellow only show up on startup) and i've only had 1 emergency shutoff. than since i've undervolted its all been good (-125) i tried -150 but get an emergency shutoff when under heavy load. i imagine you can probably go to -135v, -140v but from 125 only lower it by 10 at a time and then test under heavy load.

unfortunately to stop the emergency shut offs during long time heavy loads i had to disable turbo mode but if you dont play for hours at a time it won't happen with turbo on

also raise your thermal limit to 100 (it is set in the 90s as default for desktops but for laptops its supposed to be 100) [this will stop the red warnings even before changing paste]


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## unclewebb (Jun 3, 2021)

budafuko said:


> raise your thermal limit to 100


Some laptops have reduced the thermal shut down temperature to 100°C. Intel does not recommend doing this but that has not stopped laptop manufacturers from doing this.

That might be the cause of your emergency shutoffs. If your laptop has lowered the shut down temperature, I would suggest setting PROCHOT Offset to 3 or 4. This will help prevent the CPU from ever getting to 100°C and randomly shutting down.


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## SeverZV (Jun 17, 2021)

Hello everyone. forgive me, please, for my "english" - this is a translator from google.

half a year I read your forum, because I have the same problem as many visitors - overheating of this processor and throttling. and so I decided to write my post (thanks for the opportunity to register on the forum to the administrator).

my problem: a laptop alienwar m17 with a video card rtx 2060, i7 8750H. from the very beginning, from the moment of purchase, the laptop warmed up even in normal mode (non-game, only a text editor) by a hundred degrees. only after a long search I found out that the processor turned on the turbo mode all the time. I learned how to turn off the turbo mode through the power consumption settings (set the processor power to 90% and the turbo mode was gone). but at the same time the power of the processor has dropped, and the desire to play games has dropped. so I took up further study of the issue and came across this program - ThrottleStop.

help, please, with the help of this program remove the throttling of the processor.

My problem now is that when playing cyberpunk, for example, or some other powerful (or even old - GTA 5) game, the processor heats up to 80 degrees, and after 80 degrees, trotting starts and almost any game turns into a slideshow. here help me, please, so that there is no trotting at 85, 90 degrees, because these temperatures are safe for this processor - why trotting? why is the processor slowing down? help, please, remove trotting.


----------



## unclewebb (Jun 17, 2021)

Here is your problem.





At 38W, your CPU is at 100°C and that is with turbo boost turned off. You have to fix the cooling problem. The 8750H is a 45W processor. It should be able to run at 45W without ever over heating like this. You need to open up your laptop and clean it out and you need to replace the thermal paste. You will never be able to play games if your laptop is running this hot.

ThrottleStop cannot fix your broken laptop.


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## DxOdin (Jun 20, 2021)

I need help is anything ok with this settings? i think power limits is my enemy but better hear other opinions


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## unclewebb (Jun 20, 2021)

DxOdin said:


> power limits is my enemy


You are correct. Your ThrottleStop settings look OK. The problem is that some laptop models enforce the 45W TDP limit. You cannot use ThrottleStop to run your CPU long term at more than 45W. The CPU is forced to slow down so it does not exceed 45W. That is what your log file shows. Lots of PL1 power limit throttling. The result is that when your CPU is fully loaded, it will slow down to 3000 MHz instead of running at 3900 MHz. That is a big loss in performance. 

I wish there was a way to fix this problem but there is not. An 8750H that does not power limit throttle can score over 3000 points in Cinebench R20. With your laptop, that is impossible.


----------



## SeverZV (Jun 20, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Here is your problem.
> 
> View attachment 204312
> 
> ...


I had the same problem right after cleaning the laptop and replacing the thermal paste. and after the purchase. So I ask - how to set up the program so that there is no trotthling?


----------



## unclewebb (Jun 21, 2021)

SeverZV said:


> how to set up the program so that there is no throttling?


If you bought a laptop with bad cooling, you cannot use ThrottleStop to fix that problem. Some laptops are badly designed. You must fix the cooling problem to fix the throttling problem. 

Your ThrottleStop settings are OK.


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## panaxin (Jun 26, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> There is piles of information available here on TechPowerUp in the ThrottleStop forum and piles more information available on YouTube.
> 
> To undervolt your CPU you have to undervolt both the CPU core and CPU cache. If you only undervolt the CPU core like your picture shows, this will not accomplish anything. The CPU will ignore this request.
> 
> ...


unclewebb, I have an Acer nitro 5 notebook with an i7-8750h and I'm following your recommendations to put the CPU core and CPU cache at -0.125mv and go up from -0.025mv core and testing with cinebench. The first test started with 2,523 points and each time it increased it rose almost 100 points, until with -0.200mv it reached 2800 points. I tested it in a game (Path of exile) and the game crashed 2 times, on the third try I had a blue screen of the operating system. After the crashes, I returned the core to -0.150mV, is any of my configuration wrong? If you said that this processor can reach -0.200mV, why is mine crashing?


----------



## pwnchap (Aug 31, 2021)

Years ago I grabbed a Throttlestop configuration from a video which seemed rather good. However, after reading this forum from start to finish I find myself rather confused and not knowing whether it was optimal or not. By confused I mean that some people should Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits under FIVR while others should not, some are setting various PL1 and PL2's. As I cannot make heads or tails for what would fit my system, I've decided to completely wipe my Throttlestop.ini and let the computer figure its own default state out and continue from there, hopefully with some help from this forum 

The only thing I'm fairly sure of what to do with is the undervolting of the CPU core and cache by -0.125mV. I haven't tried to tweak it with Cinebench, but I plan on doing that as part of testing. Can anybody help with the rest? I think (I hope!) I just need a few pointers in the right direction.

My laptop is a TongFang gk5cn6z with a 8750H and a 1060.

Thanks in advance!

I've attached my default setting screenshots except the cpu and cpu cache voltage which I've changed.


----------



## unclewebb (Aug 31, 2021)

pwnchap said:


> undervolting of the CPU core and cache by -0.125mV


That is a rookie mistake. Do some Cinebench testing to get a better understanding of using different core and cache voltages. The 8750H will run better with the core set to a much higher value compared to the cache. Typically the core can be set to -200 mV while the cache is at -125 mV. Here are a couple of examples.






						Cinebench Test.zip
					






					drive.google.com
				




For the EDP OTHER throttling problem across all three domains, go into the FIVR window and set the core and cache IccMax to the maximum, 255.75. In the TPL window, you also need to set "Power Limit 4" to 0.

Above Power Limit 4, check the Speed Shift option. You have an 8th Gen CPU that is capable of using Speed Shift Technology but your laptop manufacturer did not enable this feature. You need to use ThrottleStop to enable this. When this is checked, press Apply and ThrottleStop will show you the appropriate values for Speed Shift Min and Max. For the 8750H, Min is 8 and Max is 41.

After you press OK and go out to the main screen, you should see *SST* in green. Now you can check the Speed Shift - EPP box. Set the EPP value to 0 for full speed all of the time. Set EPP to 80 if you want your CPU to slow down when it is lightly loaded. This is not that necessary when plugged in but some users still prefer doing this. When running on battery power, an EPP setting of 128 or a little higher works well.

Check the MMIO Lock box and clear the Disable Power Limit Control box. Clearing this box tells ThrottleStop that you want ThrottleStop to actively manage your power limits.

I would set Long Power PL1 to 60 and I would set Short Power PL2 to 70. Set the turbo time limit to the default value, 28 seconds. If you have good cooling, these settings will help out with getting maximum performance.

After you do all of that, turn on the Log File option and go do some testing. Run Cinebench or play a game for at least 15 minutes. When finished testing, exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize your log file. Attach a log to your next post so I can see how your computer is running. It will be in the ThrottleStop / Logs folder.


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## Mezzmix (Nov 13, 2021)

i Have a question, i have a Msi Gf72 8re with a i7 8750h and a gtx 1060. I also want to get a good undervolt on my cpu, but everything what i do doesnt really make the job. Heres a few screens of my throttlestop


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## unclewebb (Nov 13, 2021)

The 8750H has a 45W TDP power rating. The heatsink and fan are not designed to run your 8750H at 65W. That is why your computer runs so hot. 

You can try changing the thermal paste or you can lower the power limits to 45W. That is all your cooling can handle.


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## Mezzmix (Nov 13, 2021)

Okey so, ive ran a few tests now with cinebench and got the logfiles too. My big question is, why is it still thermal throttling? I got the cpu core on -250 and the cache at -130!??!?! How is that possible????



unclewebb said:


> The 8750H has a 45W TDP power rating. The heatsink and fan are not designed to run your 8750H at 65W. That is why your computer runs so hot.
> 
> You can try changing the thermal paste or you can lower the power limits to 45W. That is all your cooling can handle.


Okey, so i should but it at somewhere between 45 and 50?

so ive lowered the max tdp, but still it reaches a higher tdp than i have set up?? How can i fix this, thanks in advance


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## unclewebb (Nov 13, 2021)

Mezzmix said:


> why is it still thermal throttling?


Your laptop has bad cooling. Lots of laptops have bad cooling. Have you ever cleaned your laptop and replaced the thermal paste?



Mezzmix said:


> 45 and 50?


The log file shows your computer is running too hot at 35W to 40W. An undervolt can only help a little. You have a BIG cooling problem.


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## Mezzmix (Nov 13, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Your laptop has bad cooling. Lots of laptops have bad cooling. Have you ever cleaned your laptop and replaced the thermal paste?
> 
> 
> The log file shows your computer is running too hot at 35W to 40W. An undervolt can only help a little. You have a BIG cooling problem.


i did clean it out, but the thermal paste is still from factory



unclewebb said:


> Your laptop has bad cooling. Lots of laptops have bad cooling. Have you ever cleaned your laptop and replaced the thermal paste?
> 
> 
> The log file shows your computer is running too hot at 35W to 40W. An undervolt can only help a little. You have a BIG cooling problem.


what would you suggest me to do?? Im helpless at this point


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## unclewebb (Nov 13, 2021)

Try replacing the thermal paste.

If the heatsink is a piece of crap, this might not help. Crap laptops are everywhere.


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## Mezzmix (Nov 13, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Try replacing the thermal paste.
> 
> If the heatsink is a piece of crap, this might not help. Crap laptops are everywhere.


i guess... but is there a way i can upgrade the heatsink?


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## unclewebb (Nov 13, 2021)

Mezzmix said:


> upgrade the heatsink?


Laptop heatsinks are custom designed. There are usually few options to upgrade.

If you are feeling lucky, consider using liquid metal for thermal paste. That will help with the temps.


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## Mezzmix (Nov 16, 2021)

hey once again,
ive noticed that my cpu and gpu run at cool temps now when i play gta 5 for example ( low 70 to high 70) but my cpu, even though its not throttling, is only doing like 3,o to 3,1 mhz. Why is so? Thanks in advance 


unclewebb said:


> Laptop heatsinks are custom designed. There are usually few options to upgrade.
> 
> If you are feeling lucky, consider using liquid metal for thermal paste. That will help with the temps.


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## unclewebb (Nov 16, 2021)

@Mezzmix - Run another ThrottleStop Log File while you are playing GTA 5 for at least 15 minutes. Attach a log to your next post so I can check for any throttling.

If you have made any changes to your settings, post some updated screenshots of those changes.


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## ARB2888 (Nov 23, 2021)

Good day @unclewebb,

I have an almost 4 years old msi gs65-8rf i7-8750h 1070 max q, I had fan issues and replaced them and repasted my cpu (thats what the service center said) before 2 years, I am using a 32 inch 1440p monitor.

 I have read some of your tips and suggestions above, can you please check out my settings and logs to help me maximize my performance and also maybe discover some issues (maybe I need a repaste or there is something wrong with the fans due to heat...)?

The log attached shows a league of legends 35 minutes match, I did not notice any performance issues in the game.

Thank you.


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## unclewebb (Nov 23, 2021)

Download ThrottleStop 9.4. The Turbo Power Limits window is new and improved. It looks better too.

In the new version, open the TPL window and set Power Limit 4 to the maximum, 1023. Open the FIVR window and set IccMax for both the core and the cache to the maximum, 255.75. This can help get rid of some types of EDP OTHER throttling.

Someone has set the thermal throttling temperature of your laptop to 90°C instead of the full 100°C. I am not sure if you did this or if the manufacturer has done this. In the latest version of ThrottleStop, if you want to increase the thermal throttling temperature, open the Options window and change the PROCHOT Offset value from 10 to something less. The Intel default for this is 0. Many laptops set this to 2 or 3 so the CPU starts throttling at 98°C or 97°C. If you see a lock icon near this setting in the Options window, you will not be able to change this setting. Raising the throttling temperature will not hurt your CPU. Intel sets the throttling temperature to 100°C because they are quite confident that their CPUs can run reliably at these kind of temperatures.

If it was my laptop, I would redo the thermal paste. The 8750H has a 45W TDP rating. The CPU starts to thermal throttle when power consumption is barely over 30W due to poor cooling. Increasing the thermal throttling temperature if possible will help but improved cooling would help even more. Time for some maintenance.

The core and cache voltages do not have to be set equally. Reducing the cache offset voltage to -130 mV will probably let you increase the core offset voltage significantly. Here are some examples.






						Cinebench Test.zip
					






					drive.google.com
				




Use Cinebench R20 or R23 when testing different voltages. 









						MAXON Cinebench (R20.0) Download
					

CINEBENCH is a real-world cross platform test suite that evaluates your computer's performance capabilities. CINEBENCH is based on MAXON's award-winn




					www.techpowerup.com


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## ARB2888 (Nov 24, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Download ThrottleStop 9.4. The Turbo Power Limits window is new and improved. It looks better too.
> 
> In the new version, open the TPL window and set Power Limit 4 to the maximum, 1023. Open the FIVR window and set IccMax for both the core and the cache to the maximum, 255.75. This can help get rid of some types of EDP OTHER throttling.
> 
> ...


I entered the advanced BIOS and changed throttling temperature to 98°C. Also if you have suggestion to change anything in the setting in bios that is locked in throttlestop don't hesitate.

I am sill testing undervolting and I am now -170mv stable pc when using the laptop display and not stable (blue screen after the test is done error code WHEA_UNCORRECTABLE_ERROR) with external display and a Cinebench R20 score of 2637 with laptop 1080p display and score of 2540 with my 1440p external display , during the Cinebench tests using internal display the limit window in throttlestop both RING EDP other and CORE Thermal were red but after reaching approximately 80% of the test in CORE the Thermal goes to yellow and a new P1 is red until the end of the test, but using the external display only thermal and othe edp shows in red. Also when the laptop is idle RING EDP other is always in yellow even after clearing.



Here are my current settings and the log of all of my tests.


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## unclewebb (Nov 24, 2021)

The log file you posted only contains 15 seconds worth of data when your CPU was mostly idle. When testing, delete the previous log file before you start testing. When finished testing, exit ThrottleStop so it can finalize your log file. Do not have the log file open when testing. ThrottleStop cannot write data to an open file.

EDP OTHER turning yellow only under the RING column can be ignored. Boxes turning red under the CORE column indicate throttling is in progress.

You are at the limit of your cooling. There is a little more performance to be had but only if you can find a way to improve your cooling.

Some computers automatically enable the Nvidia GPU when you are using an external display. This might cause stability to change when you switch between the laptop display and an external monitor. An active Nvidia GPU will create extra heat in your laptop.



ARB2888 said:


> PL1 is red until the end of the test


When PL1 goes red, have a look to see what power consumption ThrottleStop is reporting. You have set PL1 to 60W in the TPL window. Some laptops ignore this request and instead, they enforce PL1 equal to the TDP. The 8750H has a 45W TDP rating so some laptops are limited long term to 45W.


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## unclewebb (Nov 24, 2021)

ARB2888 said:


> does it indicate that PL1 is set to 60w


Your screenshot shows that you are requesting 60W for the PL1 power limit and 90W for the PL2 power limit. Either you or the BIOS has set these two power limits to these values.





When running a stress test like Cinebench, watch the ThrottleStop Limit Reasons window and watch ThrottleStop to see what actual power consumption is. Some laptops will ignore the power limit values set in ThrottleStop. Some laptops use an embedded controller (EC) to enforce a 45W long term power limit. When you see PL1 or PL2 light up red in ThrottleStop, have a look to see what actual power consumption is. Are you seeing PL1 power limit throttling at 60W or 45W or some other number?



ARB2888 said:


> The first screenshot


Your CPU is only at 11W in your first screenshot. The CPU has to be fully loaded to determine anything.


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## ARB2888 (Nov 24, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> Your screenshot shows that you are requesting 60W for the PL1 power limit and 90W for the PL2 power limit. Either you or the BIOS has set these two power limits to these values.
> 
> View attachment 226476
> 
> ...


Look at the second test in the log file, also I scored 2591.

Also I have went through my bios and inside TDP Configuration there was a custom setting Nominal, if I set PL1 that value to 60 W and PL2 to 90 and configured TDP Boot to Nominal do you think this may do the trick?

This is a proper test.

Do you have any suggestion and thoughts?

I saw that the Package limit is 45W so do you think any of these settings could help?


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## unclewebb (Nov 24, 2021)

The log file tells you everything you need to know.

```
DATE       TIME    MULTI   C0%   CKMOD  BAT_mW  TEMP    VID   POWER
2021-11-24  22:55:00  34.71   99.7  100.0       0   98   0.9366   46.4   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:01  34.57   99.7  100.0       0   99   0.9623   46.3   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:02  34.61   99.7  100.0       0   98   0.9449   46.5   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:03  34.67   99.7  100.0       0   98   0.9410   46.7   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:04  34.64   99.7  100.0       0   98   0.9576   46.6   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:05  34.65   99.8  100.0       0   98   0.9368   46.6   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:06  34.62   99.8  100.0       0   98   0.9620   46.5   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:07  34.63   99.8  100.0       0   98   0.9408   46.4   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:08  34.68   99.7  100.0       0   98   0.9578   46.7   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:09  34.63   99.7  100.0       0   98   0.9358   46.5   TEMP
2021-11-24  22:55:10  34.47   99.8  100.0       0   96   0.9166   46.2   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:11  34.18  100.0  100.0       0   97   0.9330   44.7   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:12  34.20  100.0  100.0       0   97   0.9454   44.8   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:13  34.18  100.0  100.0       0   96   0.9221   44.8   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:14  34.21  100.0  100.0       0   96   0.9321   44.9   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:15  34.20  100.0  100.0       0   96   0.9149   44.9   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:16  34.19  100.0  100.0       0   96   0.9340   44.8   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:17  34.24  100.0  100.0       0   96   0.9265   44.9   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:18  34.20  100.0  100.0       0   96   0.9258   44.9   PL1
2021-11-24  22:55:19  34.18  100.0  100.0       0   96   0.9397   44.8   PL1
```

The first half of this log file shows TEMP which means your CPU is thermal throttling. The log file shows that it is running at 98°C or 99°C so that makes sense. It is throttling for a valid reason. Power consumption when this is happening is at just over 46W so that says that your cooling system cannot handle a 60W CPU. It is barely adequate to handle a 45W CPU.

Next up, this changes to PL1 power limit throttling. The reported power consumption is just a hair under 45W. That means the 60W power limit in ThrottleStop is being ignored. Like many laptops, your CPU is power limit throttling based on the 45W TDP. The CPU is being forced to slow down so it does not exceed 45W. It is difficult to go beyond this limit and even if you could, the cooling is not presently adequate for that.



ARB2888 said:


> I scored 2591


With proper cooling and no power limits, an 8750H should be over 3000 points in Cinebench R20.

There are typically no options in the BIOS to exceed the 45W power limit that the embedded controller (EC) is enforcing. You have to adjust IMON Slope so the CPU incorrectly reports less power consumption than what it is actually running at.


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## ARB2888 (Nov 24, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> There are typically no options in the BIOS to exceed the 45W power limit that the embedded controller (EC) is enforcing. You have to adjust IMON Slope so the CPU incorrectly reports less power consumption than what it is actually running at.


I can see the IMON Slope in my bios, what should I set it to in my case?

I know it should be a negative number...



ARB2888 said:


> I can see the IMON Slope in my bios, what should I set it to in my case?
> 
> I know it should be a negative number...


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## unclewebb (Nov 24, 2021)

There is no point in changing anything unless you can improve your cooling. Your CPU either power limit throttles or thermal throttles right around 45W.



ARB2888 said:


> I know it should be a negative number...


IMON Slope is usually between 0 and 100. I have zero hands on experience with this. Do some Google research to see what values other people use. 

You can also try changing the slope to a different value and see what power consumption ThrottleStop reports when running a steady load like the TS Bench. Test using fewer threads if your cooling cannot handle a 12 thread TS Bench test. Typically reducing the IMON Slope reduces the reported power consumption so you get less or no power limit throttling.


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## ARB2888 (Nov 24, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> There is no point in changing anything unless you can improve your cooling. Your CPU either power limit throttles or thermal throttles right around 45W.


I am aware of that and I will send my laptop Sunday for repaste and cleaning...
I also new have no pl problems and when configured with new fan curves I got a score 2679.

Thank you so much.


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## Thrasher (Feb 26, 2022)

PLEASE I NEED HELP.
tengo windows 11, luego de una actualizacion comenzo a calentar demasiado, pero no noto ningun servicio y no es un virus, analice demasiado y soy muy cuidadoso, luego revise throttlestop y esta muy diferente a como lo habia dejado. al enceder pc y al jugar pasa los 94 grados cuando lo tenia totalmente controlado


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## unclewebb (Feb 26, 2022)

throttlestop dead on windows 11
					

I installed the windows 11 insider preview, loaded up all the programs and games, but as i noticed it seems changing offset voltage no longer does anything and also some of readings are wrong (turbo ratio and memory freq) as seen here   is there a workaround or microsoft added some stuff to...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




You need to disable the Windows 11 virtualization features. Hyper-V, Virtual Machine Platform, Hypervisor, Core Isolation - Memory integrity, etc. After you disable this stuff, exit ThrottleStop and delete the ThrottleStop.INI configuration file before rebooting.

This means that you will not be able to use things like WSL2 in Windows 11 and ThrottleStop voltage control at the same time.

Post your questions in English. Use Google translate if you have to.


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## Thrasher (Feb 26, 2022)

unclewebb said:


> throttlestop dead on windows 11
> 
> 
> I installed the windows 11 insider preview, loaded up all the programs and games, but as i noticed it seems changing offset voltage no longer does anything and also some of readings are wrong (turbo ratio and memory freq) as seen here   is there a workaround or microsoft added some stuff to...
> ...



genius, boss I was able to solve it, Disable-WindowsOptionalFeature -Online -FeatureName Microsoft-Hyper-V-Hypervisor


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## Noirua (May 15, 2022)

Hello, new to the concept of undervolting and wanted some insight on my current setup. My laptop is a Lenovo Legion Y7000p-1060, type 81LF. The processor is an i7-8750H. I've had it for about 3 years now and never really thought to try undervolting because it performed pretty well (in my opinion, at least) but lately it began to struggle and after trying a multitude of different solutions I came to the idea of UVing because I noticed the CPU temp would spike all over the place while gaming and I assumed that it could be a case of severe throttling.

Following a simple guide on YouTube, and a little trial and error to figure out what amount of offset voltage will stop it from crashing, these are my current settings. 






The CPU temps are much more stable and don't jump all over the place, however I can't help but feel I might be undershooting my CPU's performance capability. If any information is missing or if something else could be enhanced or altered, I'd like to learn more about it.

P.S. The temps shown on the main TS window are after I was running Lost Ark for about 2 hours.
P.S.S, figured it was worth including the current highest temp I have on record while gaming. This one is from Halo Infinite's Big Team Battle mode.


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## unclewebb (May 15, 2022)

@Noirua 
The 8750H has a 45W TDP rating. A properly engineered laptop should be able to run an 8750H at its full rated power indefinitely without overheating. Your CPU is reaching 88°C at only 24 Watts. When was the last time you did any maintenance to your laptop like disassembling it and cleaning out the heatsinks? If cleaning does not solve the problem then you should replace the thermal paste too. Not maintaining one's laptop is kind of like buying a car and never checking or changing the oil. It will work for a while but at some point it won't work anymore. 

Reducing the power limits to 24W and reducing the turbo ratios to 34 is just covering up the problem. Fix the thermal problem.


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## Noirua (May 16, 2022)

unclewebb said:


> @Noirua
> The 8750H has a 45W TDP rating. A properly engineered laptop should be able to run an 8750H at its full rated power indefinitely without overheating. Your CPU is reaching 88°C at only 24 Watts. When was the last time you did any maintenance to your laptop like disassembling it and cleaning out the heatsinks? If cleaning does not solve the problem then you should replace the thermal paste too. Not maintaining one's laptop is kind of like buying a car and never checking or changing the oil. It will work for a while but at some point it won't work anymore.
> 
> Reducing the power limits to 24W and reducing the turbo ratios to 34 is just covering up the problem. Fix the thermal problem.


Yeah, I thought as much. The temps had gradually risen over the past 2 years and it's not as though the hardware has changed. I can assume the thermal paste job just probably wasn't the best. I have cleaned the inside but never replaced the thermal paste for the CPU/GPU. I suppose I'll look into that then, thanks.


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## Lawrence_phaw (Jul 11, 2022)

Noirua said:


> Yeah, I thought as much. The temps had gradually risen over the past 2 years and it's not as though the hardware has changed. I can assume the thermal paste job just probably wasn't the best. I have cleaned the inside but never replaced the thermal paste for the CPU/GPU. I suppose I'll look into that then, thanks.


Mine is Legion Y530, type 81 fv and same cpu. I think Legion y7000p is Chinese version of Y530.
If thermal pasting does not improve your cpu. Try these in Throttle Stop.
You better leave the Power Limit as default value. (i.e PL1 55w and PL2 90 w). Not 24s.
Then test the cpu performance in Cinebench.

Edit.
Cpu cache offset should start with -125mV. Then try lower voltage like -130, 135,140.. etc.. Or your PC will have crash.
Max temp for the below benchmark test is 83 c.


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## masCh (Jul 14, 2022)

Hi @unclewebb , Thanks for all your support. I have been reading and trying to understand how it all works. I might have got most of it.

I'm running an Asus GM501 with intel i7 8750H. It often runs into thermal problems.
I used to be able to undervolt this laptop, but I tried again and it says the voltages are locked under FIVR. I understand that's a bios thing but I have no idea if it's possible to roll back to a working bios. I doubt so. And I don't quite understand the risks if I do successfully rollback the bios anyway.

So I downloaded the R20 from your link above and have run it. I only get 2150 score (you said that I should get a score of at least 3000) from it. I've attached my log.
I'm also attaching my TPL screen and the FIVR screen.

I don't see if I could make any further improvements, I've just repasted my CPU last weekend and have cleaned the fans and the fins. Do you see anything that I could improve on?

Thanks in advance, I appreciate all that you do.


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## unclewebb (Jul 14, 2022)

When the BIOS locks out CPU voltage control, you are very limited in what you can do. I am not familiar with your laptop. Do a Google search for your specific laptop model. Some user somewhere has likely installed a previous BIOS version so they could restore voltage control. Is this a 100% safe thing to do? Probably not. 



masCh said:


> And I don't quite understand the risks


The risks are that something could go wrong and you end up with a brick. This is called bricking your laptop. Can you afford to lose everything on your laptop? If you do not know how to repair a laptop when a BIOS flash goes wrong then you need to think twice before deciding to do anything. 



masCh said:


> 2150 score


That is a particularly bad score. When your computer is idle at the desktop, before you run Cinebench, what does ThrottleStop report for C0%? It should be less than 1% when a computer is idle. 0.5% would be even better. If your computer is reporting 10% then you have too much stuff running in the background and your benchmark scores will always be poor. Check the Task Manager Details tab for some clues if you have high idle C0% issues. Most people install junk on their computer with no regards to how it slows their computer down.

The log file shows that your CPU heats up and starts thermal throttling and slows down. Your computer is going to heat soak if you run it at full load for a long period of time. The cooling system cannot keep up. It will have to run slower and slower to keep on the safe side of the thermal throttling temperature. Without being able to reduce voltage, there is not much you can do about this. Lots of Asus laptops have this same problem. They look good but not enough thought was put into proper thermal management. 

What thermal paste did you use? Some thermal pastes are horrible in laptops and can pump out in as little as a week or two. The popular MX-4 has caused issues like this for some users.  

As for your settings, why did you choose 3 million plus seconds for your turbo time limit? That is something like 40 days of full turbo boost. Your laptop cooling system cannot handle that so that setting makes no sense. At 65W, your CPU starts thermal throttling within a few seconds. Long term, the cooling system cannot handle 50W. Based on that, setting PL1 to 45W or 50W and PL2 to 60W and setting the turbo time limit to about 8 seconds makes sense. That is already more than your cooling system can handle.

I would set all of the PP0 Power Limit stuff back to default settings. Clear the check mark out of the Lock box at the bottom right. Clear the PP0 Power Limit box and clear the Clamp box at the bottom near this setting. Set this back to the default value of 0. Press OK and do a full reboot so your CPU can reset itself. Hold the Shift key down on the keyboard when selecting the Restart option in the Windows menu. 

Use ThrottleStop 9.5.


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## masCh (Jul 15, 2022)

unclewebb said:


> When the BIOS locks out CPU voltage control, you are very limited in what you can do. I am not familiar with your laptop. Do a Google search for your specific laptop model. Some user somewhere has likely installed a previous BIOS version so they could restore voltage control. Is this a 100% safe thing to do? Probably not.
> 
> 
> The risks are that something could go wrong and you end up with a brick. This is called bricking your laptop. Can you afford to lose everything on your laptop? If you do not know how to repair a laptop when a BIOS flash goes wrong then you need to think twice before deciding to do anything.
> ...



Thank you!

1. Yes my C0% is between 2% to 5%. I'll fix it
2. Yeah I bought Arctic MX4 and applied it. Maybe I can try do it again with a different one.
3. I didn't know the figure meant seconds. I thought it was just a parameter I didn't understand, so I set it to max. Thanks for explaining it, I have now set it to say 8. The PL2 is now set to 60 instead of 65.
4. I've done the PP0 Power Limit stuff too. THanks for the clear instructions - I didn't know what the check boxes mean (lock, clamp) but I understood your instructions.

I'll let you know if things improve after redoing the thermal paste.

EDIT: Playing around with parameters

I have narrowed it down to
PL1 54W, PL2 65W, Turbo Time Limit 32
This gives me a score of 2498 pts in R20,with most of the Limit Reasons appearing to be PL1. Delta-T offset is 2C under Options.

I could make it go to 2510 if I set Turbo Time Limit higher and change delta-T offset to 1C. Here the limit reasons are always Thermal (and EDP Other Ring). 
This higher setting I'd rather not keep until I have my cooling issues sorted.


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## 3normousz (Jul 15, 2022)

Hi @unclewebb I'm quite new to this software and I don't know where to start. I tried using settings from previous comments and all of them seem to not working for me. Anyway, I use default settings and use cpu-z in order to make my cpu 100% load. Could you please guide me how to lower temp for my laptop ? It's Dell G3 3579 with i7-8750H cpu. I also repasted my thermalpaste week ago (Mx-4). Thanks in advance.


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## masCh (Jul 15, 2022)

3normousz said:


> Hi @unclewebb I'm quite new to this software and I don't know where to start. I tried using settings from previous comments and all of them seem to not working for me. Anyway, I use default settings and use cpu-z in order to make my cpu 100% load. Could you please guide me how to lower temp for my laptop ? It's Dell G3 3579 with i7-8750H cpu. I also repasted my thermalpaste week ago (Mx-4). Thanks in advance.


Can you post up screenshots of your settings as well? Main page, FIVR page, TPL page and Options page


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## 3normousz (Jul 15, 2022)

masCh said:


> Can you post up screenshots of your settings as well? Main page, FIVR page, TPL page and Options page



Sorry, I forgot to put these in the first place.


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## unclewebb (Jul 15, 2022)

Here is what can happen to some popular thermal pastes when used direct die in a laptop.










Your FIVR CPU voltage controls are all locked by the BIOS so there is not much you can do. When you have a 6 core CPU in a laptop and you cannot lower the voltage, it is going to run hot. Most laptops will overheat, thermal throttle and this reduces performance. The only way to fix this problem is to find a way to improve cooling.

The procedure to restore CPU voltage control in Dell laptops is complicated by doable. Do lots of Google research before considering doing this. 









						Undervolting 2020 Dell Laptops like the Vostro 7500 and More Tips to Improve Thermals, Battery Life, and Speed - Brendan Greenley
					

2021 Update: Based on post and Reddit comments, the approach to unlock undervolting works for a number of models, including the XPS, Inspiron, G5, 11th Generation Intel processors, and 2021 Dell models and other lines. If it works for you, please leave a comment below so others may know...




					brendangreenley.com


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## XT785 (Aug 1, 2022)

I have the ultimate solution for lowering temps! Avoid all thermal pastes for laptops, they eventually go bad! Buy *this* and forget all of your thermal concerns! You can thank me later!

How to apply this TIM: https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1pb4y1f7R6 (Skip to 12:12)


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## djeboe (Aug 12, 2022)

Looks like this thread for 8750Hs is still going, so I'll make my inaugural post (under this username, anyway) and ask for what possible help I could get- I've tried to glean information as well as I can get but I still find that I don't understand everything as well as I would like, but luckily Kevin shares not only his programming and PC thermal knowledge, but also his time with us, so here we are. 

What I'm running into is this: I've got a MicroCenter Powerspec 1520 with a 8750H and an RTX2070 in it. Luckily, it was sourced from Clevo and rebadged, but of course it has a crappy BIOS thrown on top of it. I've had this problem happen once before but I'm not quite sure what ultimately fixed it - after a while, or something, my system would not run at max turbo anymore, as it had been previously. I was running at high performance settings in Windows 10, Max CPU State of 100%, etc. I made sure that there was nothing set incorrectly in the Clevo Control Center software. This most recent time, it happened after a BSOD. The rub is that I wasn't running logs prior to the incident. I started late last night, which is why I have 2 logs to attach. I'm running into a strange issue - PL2 is running maxed constantly. The log for yesterday will show a few intermittent times where it was not, and that was when I was dinking around with different profiles to see if there was any sort of change using power saving, etc. There are also times on the logs where I fired up World of Warcraft as well. I even ran Cinebench R23, and that is what was running when I took my screenshot of the Main window/TPL/Limits windows. As you can see, the temps are nowhere near throttling level for this CPU. The GPU wasn't up there either. And the package wattage wasn't even approaching the 45w range. 

Could the BSOD have knocked something wonky that would be causing it to read the PL2 as max and thus throttle it that way? It was bouncing up and down with some turbo action in Wow but not doing constant turbo like it was a few days ago. I even turned down the undervolt to the safer range of -125, but it was only at like -145 previously on the core with -125 on the cache. 

Please look over my logs and screenshots and advise if there is anything you can think of that might be causing this issue?


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## unclewebb (Aug 12, 2022)

@djeboe
You have a power limit throttling problem. The MSR and MMIO power limits that ThrottleStop has access to are being ignored. There is a third set of turbo power limits controlled by an embedded controller (EC) that ThrottleStop does not have access to. It is likely these power limits are being set too low which is causing this problem. The CPU is being throttled down to its base frequency which is a multiplier of 22.00. If your laptop used to work properly then maybe an onboard sensor has failed and it is forcing your computer to run in low power mode.

Have a look in the Device Manager for either the Intel Dynamic Turning driver or the Intel Dynamic Platform and Thermal Framework driver. I would uninstall this driver and do whatever is necessary to make sure it is not re-installed after you reboot. Use Google to learn more about this issue.

I would also uninstall the Clevo Control Center software. You might need this software for fan control but to try and troubleshoot this problem, any software like this needs to be removed.

The Nvidia GPU being active might be what triggers low power mode. You could try uninstalling the Nvidia GPU driver. Just run the default Microsoft driver for testing purposes to see if this allows the CPU to go up to full power. You can also try installing the original Nvidia driver that has been tested with your laptop.

There might be an easy fix or if a sensor has gone bad, there might not be any practical fix. Your ThrottleStop settings are OK. The offset voltage and power limits are set correctly. ThrottleStop cannot be used to fix the throttling problem you are having.

Use ThrottleStop 9.5


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## rethcirE (Aug 12, 2022)

@djeboe I have essentially the same laptop (17" version, 1720) and in the past have had odd behavior after system crashes or BSOD. Firstly I would try loading Default Settings in BIOS or alternatively clearing the CMOS. I can't pinpoint why but after a system crash I too have experienced some power limit throttling that otherwise never occurs. It could be a BIOS bug of some sort.

If that nets you no real changes, have a look at these settings and give them a try (OTHER THAN the undervolt, stick to YOUR predetermined voltage). You may need to update to Throttle Stop 9.5 to match things. This is the 'Performance' profile I use and has no kind of throttling on Max Turbo for my 1720. If it works for you, then you can limit things on other profiles as you see fit.

Additionally, I believe your BIOS may be fully unlocked via this tool (*InsydeH2OUVE_x86_WINx64_200.00.01.00*) - http://en.inspur.com/eportal/fileDi...spur TS860M5/TS860M5_BIOS_4.0.04_20190424.zip








						Unlocking advanced options in Insyde H2O BIOS for Clevo NH70RCQ (Hyperbook)
					

Hello all,  I have a maybe easy question for advance modders. Im looking to buy NH70RCQ (from local Polish brand Hyperbook) without RAM - im buying an HyperX Impact but question is to stick to 2666Mhz or buy a faster one modules like 3200Mhz. I know that some Clevo resellers have more advanced...




					winraid.level1techs.com
				



You'll see 'Setup Menu Insyde Full Show' is set to "Hide". Change to "Full" and options should appear. If you save and boot to BIOS they should be viewable/selectable.

It is how I unlocked my 1720 BIOS and can change PL levels, and about 1000 other settings from Windows or BIOS. It seems to work either way, requiring a reboot if in Windows. If this works for you let me know. It was shared to me from another PowerSpec user.


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## naufalkharits (Aug 13, 2022)

Hi everyone, can I get some suggestions to undervolt my 8750H? Here are the details,
• Alienware m15
• Windows 11
• i7-8750H
• GTX 1070 Max-Q
• Kingpin KPx thermal paste

Tested with Cinebench R23 and monitored with ThrottleStop 9.5 (default settings but "Log File" turned on).


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## unclewebb (Aug 13, 2022)

In Windows 11 you need to disable the virtualization settings to allow ThrottleStop to access the CPU voltage control register. I just talked about this issue yesterday.









						MAJOR Throttling Issue on Core i5 8250U (Lenovo ThinkPad L380 Yoga)
					

Hi everyone, So, I've been using my Lenovo ThinkPad L380 Yoga for almost 2.5 years, mostly for light use but recently once I started using it for my semester works (ArcGIS, AutoCAD, and a tad bit of music production), I am noticing one of its biggest flaws.  The laptop seems to work fine when...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




After you get that problem fixed, you should be able to undervolt the cache approximately -125 mV and the core approximately -175 mV. Use Cinebench R23 for testing purposes. Follow the advice previously posted in this thread, in all of the other TechPowerUp ThrottleStop threads and the 101 YouTube videos that are available.


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## XT785 (Aug 13, 2022)

naufalkharits said:


> Hi everyone, can I get some suggestions to undervolt my 8750H? Here are the details,
> • Alienware m15
> • Windows 11
> • i7-8750H
> ...











						Help undervolting i7 8750h Throttlestop
					

Hi @unclewebb , Thanks for all your support. I have been reading and trying to understand how it all works. I might have got most of it.  I'm running an Asus GM501 with intel i7 8750H. It often runs into thermal problems. I used to be able to undervolt this laptop, but I tried again and it says...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




My settings for reference are attached! Also, follow @unclewebb's every instruction to the letter!


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## naufalkharits (Aug 14, 2022)

Taking my first undervolting, quite impressed with the results (performance & temp). Here are the details of what I did,
• Disabled virtualisation
• Core set to -175.8 mV
• Cache set to -125 mV

Not much changed, I haven't read much yet on other threads, prefer safety and stability first for now.
Thank you for the advice.

Anyway, my 8750H almost managed to surpass 12C/24T CPU


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## unclewebb (Aug 14, 2022)

Your undervolt is working correctly.

The only problem now is your Alienware cooling system appears to be inadequate. Have you ever disassembled your laptop to clean it out? Blowing the dust bunnies out of the heatsinks might solve your overheating issues. If you are still seeing temperatures hit 100°C during Cinebench then I would also replace the thermal paste.

Dell is known for using barely adequate heatsinks. With a high priced Alienware laptop, I would hope that the heatsink, when properly cleaned, would be a little above barely adequate. Hopefully it just needs servicing but it is possible that this is as good as it gets.


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## Thrasher (Aug 14, 2022)

XT785 said:


> Help undervolting i7 8750h Throttlestop
> 
> 
> Hi @unclewebb , Thanks for all your support. I have been reading and trying to understand how it all works. I might have got most of it.  I'm running an Asus GM501 with intel i7 8750H. It often runs into thermal problems. I used to be able to undervolt this laptop, but I tried again and it says...
> ...


Man, I loved your configuration, it works incredibly smooth for me, when I play with another monitor it also works better, thanks.


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## naufalkharits (Aug 15, 2022)

unclewebb said:


> Your undervolt is working correctly.
> 
> The only problem now is your Alienware cooling system appears to be inadequate. Have you ever disassembled your laptop to clean it out? Blowing the dust bunnies out of the heatsinks might solve your overheating issues. If you are still seeing temperatures hit 100°C during Cinebench then I would also replace the thermal paste.
> 
> Dell is known for using barely adequate heatsinks. With a high priced Alienware laptop, I would hope that the heatsink, when properly cleaned, would be a little above barely adequate. Hopefully it just needs servicing but it is possible that this is as good as it gets.


I regularly clean up my laptop's cooling system.

What's your thermal paste recommendation? I still have the rest of Kingpin KPx, is that quite good for a laptop?


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## XT785 (Aug 15, 2022)

naufalkharits said:


> I regularly clean up my laptop's cooling system.
> 
> What's your thermal paste recommendation? I still have the rest of Kingpin KPx, is that quite good for a laptop?





XT785 said:


> I have the ultimate solution for lowering temps! Avoid all thermal pastes for laptops, they eventually go bad! Buy *this* and forget all of your thermal concerns! You can thank me later!
> 
> How to apply this TIM: https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1pb4y1f7R6 (Skip to 12:12)


If Honeywell PTM7950 TIM doesn't work out for you then your cooling system is flawed like @unclewebb mentioned previously!

My cinebench R23 score and max temp 83°C considering 90% humidity and 30°C ambient temperature using Honeywell PTM7950 below


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## naufalkharits (Aug 15, 2022)

Testing-2
Did another testing,
• IccMax (core & cache) set to max

Not impressed with the temp, but performance managed to surpass the 12C/24T CPU.

---

Testing-3
I think I found the sweet spot,
• PROCHOT Offset set to 10
• Locked MMIO
• Power Limit 4 set to 0

Very impressed with the results, by doing this the temp even didn't reach 95℃, and the performance was only reduced by less than 5%.

---

So far what I did,
• Disabled virtualisation
• Core set to -175.8 mV
• Cache set to -125 mV
• IccMax (core & cache) set to max
• PROCHOT Offset set to 10
• Locked MMIO
• Power Limit 4 set to 0

I'll update with gaming test.



XT785 said:


> If Honeywell PTM7950 TIM doesn't work out for you then your cooling system is flawed like @unclewebb mentioned previously!
> 
> My cinebench R23 score and max temp 83°C considering 90% humidity and 30°C ambient temperature using Honeywell PTM7950 below View attachment 258151


Hard to find that thing you mentioned in my country, and I'm too lazy to order from foreign countries, you know tax, cc, and such.


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## XT785 (Aug 15, 2022)

naufalkharits said:


> Hard to find that thing you mentioned in my country, and I'm too lazy to order from foreign countries, you know tax, cc, and such.


Well, if you're lazy then I cannot help you anymore because you are not willing to put any effort! I have given you the link where to order it from! It ships from China so it will take some time. Just order it and stop making lame excuses. I ordered it too and had to go through taxes and customs clearance etc. and ever since I didn't look back! Best decision I made after thorough research!



Thrasher said:


> Man, I loved your configuration, it works incredibly smooth for me, when I play with another monitor it also works better, thanks.


How are your thermals?


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## Thrasher (Aug 16, 2022)

XT785 said:


> How are your thermals?


91 degrees maximum, and it's time to clean the coolers. I was looking for what you recommended to replace the pasta, Tim, but I can't find it in Argentina, would you have the name to be able to look for it or what do you recommend instead?


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## XT785 (Aug 16, 2022)

Thrasher said:


> 91 degrees maximum, and it's time to clean the coolers. I was looking for what you recommended to replace the pasta, Tim, but I can't find it in Argentina, would you have the name to be able to look for it or what do you recommend instead?


I have the ultimate solution for lowering temps provided your cooling system design is adequate enough! Avoid all thermal pastes for laptops, they eventually go bad real fast! Buy *this* and forget all of your thermal concerns! It ships from China so it will take some time.

How to apply this TIM: https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV1pb4y1f7R6 (Skip to 12:12)


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## pechtowerup (Aug 17, 2022)

Haven't messed with any settings other than both core and cache to -0.22.  -0.23 crashes.  I see here that y'all suggest a lower cache-- when I start stress testing should I just start lowering cache until stable?

MSI GL63-8RD, i7-8750h / 1050ti, win 10


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## unclewebb (Aug 17, 2022)

Rare to see an 8750H that is 100% stable with the cache set to more than -135 mV.

The TS Bench test will report errors fairly quickly when the CPU needs more voltage. 

Use Cinebench R23 for testing purposes. Set both voltages equally until you find a stable setting. After that, increase only the core until your R23 scores max out.


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## pechtowerup (Aug 18, 2022)

unclewebb said:


> Rare to see an 8750H that is 100% stable with the cache set to more than -135 mV.
> 
> The TS Bench test will report errors fairly quickly when the CPU needs more voltage.
> 
> Use Cinebench R23 for testing purposes. Set both voltages equally until you find a stable setting. After that, increase only the core until your R23 scores max out.


Thank you!  Stable setting in TS Bench?  Cinebench seems to run fine until -210 mV.  Or do you mean the longer stability test in Cinebench?

I tried TS Bench and you are right-- it throws errors at -205.  Backed down to -175 (core/cache) and I'm running the longer TS Bench and getting no errors, which makes me think I'm doing something wrong (not selecting the right options for the bench).


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## unclewebb (Aug 18, 2022)

TS Bench is usually a better test for setting voltages compared to Cinebench.  There are some games where you might have to reduce your undervolt some more. Just use your computer normally and add voltage if you see a BSOD.


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## pechtowerup (Aug 18, 2022)

unclewebb said:


> TS Bench is usually a better test for setting voltages compared to Cinebench.  There are some games where you might have to reduce your undervolt some more. Just use your computer normally and add voltage if you see a BSOD.


Gotcha.  Stable at -185mV core/cache for the duration of the 7680M TS Bench test so i dunno!  I still think maybe that means I have a setting wrong on the test, but I didn't go checking or unchecking things, just used it stock right after install.  I've got it running the 30min Cinebench R23 test so if it doesn't crash I'll start lowering the core and retesting.  Thanks so much!  Given new life to my teenager's hinge-broken screenless laptop.  Maybe it'll be enough for Steam or Nvidia gamestreaming.


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## unclewebb (Aug 18, 2022)

Every CPU is unique. Your cache can undervolt more than most. That is OK. Nothing to worry about.

Intel does not have infinite time on the assembly line to come up with the perfect voltage. They always use a little more than is necessary to be on the safe side so they can guarantee long term stability. Removing the excess is fine as long as you have the time to run a variety of stability tests.


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## djeboe (Aug 24, 2022)

rethcirE said:


> @djeboe I have essentially the same laptop (17" version, 1720) and in the past have had odd behavior after system crashes or BSOD. Firstly I would try loading Default Settings in BIOS or alternatively clearing the CMOS. I can't pinpoint why but after a system crash I too have experienced some power limit throttling that otherwise never occurs. It could be a BIOS bug of some sort.
> 
> If that nets you no real changes, have a look at these settings and give them a try (OTHER THAN the undervolt, stick to YOUR predetermined voltage). You may need to update to Throttle Stop 9.5 to match things. This is the 'Performance' profile I use and has no kind of throttling on Max Turbo for my 1720. If it works for you, then you can limit things on other profiles as you see fit.
> 
> ...



I finally got around to messing with the BIOS unlock that you provided properly, as I had been trying to document all that it did so that I could see if it did the things that @unclewebb was asking for, since I couldn't find the Intel drivers he was mentioning anywhere in my Driver Manager. I had problems with my Chrome which I admittedly run with far too many tabs, and a bunch of other things going on and far too little patience or energy to deal with all of it. So I decided to fiddle around with unlocking the settings tonight, and I went, did the thing to unlock the settings, and then simply saved it and rebooted, went into my BIOS and discovered that the Intel DPTF is disabled at the BIOS level, and lo and behold when I got back into windows, everything is running smoothly. I think that the unlock must have cleared up some settings or something that allowed it to start working again. Maybe that is what disabled the DPTF? I'm not certain since I already couldn't see the drivers. Oh well. Gonna run a Cinebench and see how everything looks now. I don't dare mess with the other settings at that granular of a level as I'm really going from the good  graces of everyone in here knowing how to tweak things on hardware that is similar enough to mine, with software that is proven to do so. I can just put these things together, not get in at that level and tweak with sh*t lol.


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