# Microsoft announces next-generation Xbox One console(uses windows kernel))



## natr0n (May 21, 2013)

Microsoft announced its next-generation Xbox One gaming console at a press event held at its Redmond, Wash., headquarters Tuesday morning, finally revealing the device that's been the subject of rampant rumors and speculation for months.

http://www.neowin.net/news/microsoft-announces-next-generation-xbox-one-console

Microsoft announced that the Xbox One will run on the Windows kernel and that now means that Microsoft has that platform running on phones, tablets, laptops, servers, and now the Xbox. 

http://www.neowin.net/news/xbox-one-uses-the-windows-kernal-completes-the-ecosystem


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## Jaffakeik (May 21, 2013)

NO to XBOX anyway,but still will look how it unfolds


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## Frick (May 21, 2013)

It has transistors, and plenty of them!






It will also have USB 3.0, WiFi N, 500GB HDD (which was "designed in-house", whatever that means), Blu-Ray, and it is connected to Azure, which I think is the most interesting thing. They even tell of MP matches with 64 and 128 players. Chunk off processing stuff to the cloud?

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2013/05/xbox-one#hardware


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## KainXS (May 21, 2013)

sony did not reveal their console but ms did huh, I really like some of the features over the PS4 as they seem like things I would use myself, the tv integration is something I would use the PS4 share nonsense is something I would not.

The downside though, . . . . . the games, not much on the gaming side was revealed, there was some ea sports, Forza, and cod ghosts and some other game I did not care about but they did say many more titles would be at E3 anyway.

5 billion transistors did take me by surprise also.


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## Deleted member 24505 (May 21, 2013)

Here's a MOBO pic-






Looks pretty sweet to me.


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## KainXS (May 21, 2013)

looks like its an AMD apu for sure then, jaguar it is.


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## erocker (May 21, 2013)

It runs Windows... So, it's a PC.


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## BiggieShady (May 21, 2013)

Too bad for console gamers that used games will be limited - games are tied to live account and m$ needs some $ to "untie" them  although once registered, you can play offline ... much like on the PC ... not always online, but no internet  - no game install


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## Jaffakeik (May 21, 2013)

KainXS said:


> sony did not reveal their console but ms did huh, I really like some of the features over the PS4 as they seem like things I would use myself, the tv integration is something I would use the PS4 share nonsense is something I would not.
> 
> The downside though, . . . . . the games, not much on the gaming side was revealed, there was some ea sports, Forza, and cod ghosts and some other game I did not care about but they did say many more titles would be at E3 anyway.
> 
> 5 billion transistors did take me by surprise also.



FOr consoles i care only gaming evolution,dont care about integrated TV,size of HDD,or whatever there is more for goodies


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## Deleted member 24505 (May 21, 2013)

KainXS said:


> looks like its an AMD apu for sure then, jaguar it is.




A single 40-nanometer chip contains both the CPU and GPU rather than the two dedicated 90-nm chips needed in the 360. In fact, a custom SOC (system on a chip) module made by AMD contains the CPU/GPU chip, the memory, the controller logic, the DRAM, and the audio processors, and connects directly to the heat sink via a phase-change interface material. Whew.

http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2013/05/xbox-one#hardware


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## 15th Warlock (May 21, 2013)

Frick said:


> It has transistors, and plenty of them!
> 
> http://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/8gb1.jpg
> 
> ...



5 billion transistors... that says nothing about the actual performance of the chip, this and Sony's blurry shots of the PS4 says nothing to me other than console manufacturers are trolling us at this point :shadedshu

EDIT:




tigger said:


> A single 40-nanometer chip contains both the CPU and GPU rather than the two dedicated 90-nm chips needed in the 360. In fact, a custom SOC (system on a chip) module made by AMD contains the CPU/GPU chip, the memory, the controller logic, the DRAM, and the audio processors, and connects directly to the heat sink via a phase-change interface material. Whew.
> 
> http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2013/05/xbox-one#hardware



So 5 billion transistors including embeded RAM? That's even worst than I thought if at all true, even current GPUs from AMD and Nvidia utilize a higher transistor count for the GPU die alone, this can't be right 

EDIT 2: you can clearly see the DRAM modules around the APU in the shot of the mobo you posted, so that transistor count is for the APU only, I was begining to think MS had gone with a Wii U class CPU 

it seems both the XBOX and the PS4 will be on pretty much equal standing in terms of relative performance once they are released


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## insane 360 (May 21, 2013)

i have a 360 slim right now, though i really don't see me upgrading to either the ps4 or the xbox one anytime soon. more than likely this will just push me back to the htpc/gaming box in my living room...

thanks for the pics and links though


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## natr0n (May 21, 2013)

I'm excited for more games on PC since this is basically a PC based console. There is no excuse now not to have PC versions. They can no longer lie either about "porting" since there is nothing to port anymore.


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (May 21, 2013)

tigger said:


> A single 40-nanometer chip contains both the CPU and GPU rather than the two dedicated 90-nm chips needed in the 360. In fact, a custom SOC (system on a chip) module made by AMD contains the CPU/GPU chip, the memory, the controller logic, the DRAM, and the audio processors, and connects directly to the heat sink via a phase-change interface material. Whew.
> 
> http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2013/05/xbox-one#hardware



Thats a bit shit, so the rumours of a dgpu were off then, over a ps4, that dgpu was the only bit keeping my attention on the nextbox tut.


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## KainXS (May 21, 2013)

natr0n said:


> I'm excited for more games on PC since this is basically a PC based console. There is no excuse now not to have PC versions. They can no longer lie either about "porting" since there is nothing to port anymore.



kinda true but their will always be lazy developers here and there that still pull that out.

Another matter is that since both the 360 and PS4 now use(for sure) AMD APU's, nintendo will have to really grab out to third party devs and publishers.:shadedshu


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## remixedcat (May 21, 2013)

No 802.11ac WiFi??? And calling it Xbox one is gonna confuse a lot of people because the original Xbox is often called Xbox 1. Also most people are saying it won't drive a 4k display. 

Good on the use of Windows kernel and the huge multiplayer matches.


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## Delta6326 (May 21, 2013)

I watched the reveal it was meh, I really dislike the name Xbox One... it's the third one! I get what they tried, but I think many people will get confused. I will buy a Xbox One just for Forza 5, but they do seem to have moved more towards family entertainment than gaming.

Loads of pics. http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2013/05/xbox-one-photos/?viewall=true

I like some of the prototypes more than the final layout and it looks like they have a seagate HD, and than fan looks poorly designed only 5 large blades hope its quite.


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## _JP_ (May 21, 2013)

Frick said:


> 500GB HDD (which was "designed in-house", whatever that means)


I probably means you can't just take it off and slap on any other 2.5'' SATA HDD and continue rocking on with more space.
Which was already the case with the xbox 360, I think, but due to the firmware being in it...not some architectural/design thing.


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## LAN_deRf_HA (May 21, 2013)

Games will be at E3. What they showed was much more impressive than I expected. Stuff I can actually use vs the PS4's facebook bullshit. Sooo much money to be saved on the cable bill with this thing. It'll be interesting to see what kinda of gaming can be done with kinect now that it's instant response and higher res.


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## _JP_ (May 21, 2013)

remixedcat said:


> Also most people are saying it won't drive a 4k display.


If today's high-tier cards sweat to run games at that resolution, what makes you think an equivalent to a current entry-level chip could do it?


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## KainXS (May 21, 2013)

_JP_ said:


> I probably means you can't just take it off and slap on any other 2.5'' SATA HDD and continue rocking on with more space.
> Which was already the case with the xbox 360, I think, but due to the firmware being in it...not some architectural/design thing.



If I remember with the 360 you needed to use certain WD hdd's flashed or something on the Fat models, not too sure about the slims. I would say their might be different models with different drive sizes but it looks pretty unlikely.


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## Frag_Maniac (May 21, 2013)

This is all hard to digest/translate if they don't give any graphics power specs. It's said that Sony's PS4 has equivalent to 7850 GPU power. Some have said MS' unit will be graphically weaker, some say more powerful. They need to be more specific on these details.


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## bpgt64 (May 21, 2013)

I don't think it will be capable of driving a 4k display at all, what I find interested is the increase in Xbox Live servers.  It's like they want to be OnLine.


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## LAN_deRf_HA (May 21, 2013)

I like this shot. Simultaneously shows off a great tech feat. (shredding rubber) while still showing how far we have yet to go (sharp poly edges on the bumper.) Also I think from now on we should refer to it as the Xbone. Saying xbox "one" is just aggravating and reeks of Wii "U" levels of stupidity.


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## Ravenas (May 21, 2013)

Horrible name but the console has lots of potential. I predict the PS4 will provide even more competition this generation.


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## Crap Daddy (May 21, 2013)

It won't play xbox360 games.


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## Frick (May 21, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> Saying xbox "one" is just aggravating and reeks of Wii "U" levels of stupidity.



Naaahh you're overreacting. "One" is a pretty good name imo. 360 was a bad name. Xbox 3 would confuse people, 720 would be downright dreadful. One works.


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## Crap Daddy (May 21, 2013)

Like in HTC One?


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## Ravenas (May 21, 2013)

Frick said:


> Naaahh you're overreacting. "One" is a pretty good name imo. 360 was a bad name. Xbox 3 would confuse people, 720 would be downright dreadful. One works.



One works about as well as RT.


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## OneCool (May 21, 2013)

Well the PS4 has 8gigs of GDDR5.What kind of ram is this VCR going to run?


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## WhiteLotus (May 21, 2013)

I'm not an overall fan of the design, it's very boxy and big.


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## LAN_deRf_HA (May 21, 2013)

Frick said:


> Naaahh you're overreacting. "One" is a pretty good name imo. 360 was a bad name. Xbox 3 would confuse people, 720 would be downright dreadful. One works.



One works only in a world where Xbox 1 isn't already a product. Now we have to call that xbox original.


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## Ravenas (May 21, 2013)

WhiteLotus said:


> I'm not an overall fan of the design, it's very boxy and big.



100% agree.


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## WhiteLotus (May 21, 2013)

Ravenas said:


> 100% agree.



I was something a bit more modern, instead of 90's Retro.


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## Frag_Maniac (May 21, 2013)

WhiteLotus said:


> I'm not an overall fan of the design, it's very boxy and big.



Better to have ventilation space and piece of mind than a fashionably slim box with RRoD issues. The mod to screw down the snap-in CPU cooler and add stacked penny heatsinks on the RAM became quite a popular one, but should have never been necessary in the first place.


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## Ravenas (May 21, 2013)

WhiteLotus said:


> I was something a bit more modern, instead of 90's Retro.



I think it looks rushed. Aesthetics aside, this will be an appealing option for competition between the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One.


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## WhiteLotus (May 21, 2013)

Frag Maniac said:


> Better to have ventilation space and piece of mind than a fashionably slim box with RRoD issues. The mod to screw down the snap-in CPU cooler and add stacked penny heatsinks on the RAM became quite a popular one, but should have never been necessary in the first place.



Doesn't have to be slim, why not dome shaped or something. Why stick to boxes all the time? You know try something different.


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## remixedcat (May 21, 2013)

Domes look funny and also might be harder to mount for custom HTPC setups. You gotta design stuff with multiple mounting options in mine... make a funny shape and it presents problems.


I do agree with the majority of the comments saying it looks like a VHS or VCR and it does!!! LOL


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## Frag_Maniac (May 21, 2013)

WhiteLotus said:


> Doesn't have to be slim, why not dome shaped or something. Why stick to boxes all the time? You know try something different.



I was referring to your saying it looked big more than the "box" part. It could just be an unrefined prototype showing the rough size and shape too. The final product could have rounded edges.

I agree it looks like a throwback VHS device. MS are geeks but they're design conscience as far as aesthetics, which is why I doubt this is going to be the final look.

"OK everybody, pop in that VHS video we sent you and let's do a Kinect workout!" LOL


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## LAN_deRf_HA (May 21, 2013)

Does anyone have dimensions? I was hoping it wouldn't have a power brick this time but I guess that's asking too much.


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## Ravenas (May 21, 2013)

I'm wondering why Microsoft opted to use 8GB GDDR3 memory unlike Sony who used 8GB GDDR5.


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## Mindweaver (May 21, 2013)

It's not shaped like a dome, because it's not an XDome One.. It's an XBox One..


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## LAN_deRf_HA (May 21, 2013)

Ravenas said:


> I'm wondering why Microsoft opted to use 8GB GDDR3 memory unlike Sony who used 8GB GDDR5.



They're both just doing what they did before. Sony goes for fast ram, MS goes for a very fast but small edram.


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## Ravenas (May 21, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> They're both just doing what they did before. Sony goes for fast ram, MS goes for a very fast but small edram.



The least of Microsoft's worries is space is this thing.


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## Frag_Maniac (May 21, 2013)

Well, so far we have Xbone suggested as a name, and a dome shape suggested as styling. Combine the two and you have ConDome. LOL

As for the GDDR5 Sony uses, I got the feeling since the PS4's CPU speed is roughly half that of the PS3, they may have had more heat issues than they anticipated, so perhaps they down clocked the CPU and used faster RAM to make up for it.


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## hellrazor (May 21, 2013)

I'm thoroughly confused as to why round edges appeal to people - it looks slick and simple, why would it need to be anything else?


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## LAN_deRf_HA (May 21, 2013)

hellrazor said:


> I'm thoroughly confused as to why round edges appeal to people - it looks slick and simple, why would it need to be anything else?



Because Iphone.

It's funny to me the shape of this is identical to a HTPC case design I sketched many years ago... and rejected due to it's bland appearance.


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## KainXS (May 21, 2013)

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/407912/microsoft-confirms-pre-owned-fee-for-xbox-one/
http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2013/05/xbox-one-analysis/


> Microsoft has confirmed that all Xbox One games will require mandatory installation onto the system's hard drive and, to install the same disc onto another user's drive,* a fee must be paid.*








Say its not so Microsoft:shadedshu

So basically from what I hear if you're in a house with more than one person playing your one and more than one account, and have one copy of a game then one person can play that game with no extra charge, everyone else has to pay a fee to play the game ontop of that.

Thats alone is a killer for me and if it pertains to all used games then . . . . . (walks away)


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## _JP_ (May 21, 2013)

^That hasn't been confirmed. However...


_JP_ said:


> If today's high-tier cards sweat to run games at that resolution, what makes you think an equivalent to a *current entry-level chip* could do it?





Frag Maniac said:


> This is all hard to digest/translate if they don't give any graphics power specs. It's said that Sony's PS4 has equivalent to 7850 GPU power. Some have said MS' unit will be graphically weaker, some say more powerful. They need to be more specific on these details.


Okay, Mid-tier then.


WhiteLotus said:


> I'm not an overall fan of the design, it's very boxy and big.





remixedcat said:


> I do agree with the majority of the comments saying it looks like a VHS or VCR and it does!!! LOL











Ah, who could forget...


Ravenas said:


> I'm wondering why Microsoft opted to use 8GB GDDR3 memory unlike Sony who used 8GB GDDR5.


Has it been confirmed it uses GDDR3?
Maybe because it is cheaper...


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## 15th Warlock (May 22, 2013)

_JP_ said:


> Has it been confirmed it uses GDDR3?
> Maybe because it is cheaper...



Cheaper but weren't prices of DDR3 going up as opposed to DDR5 prices trending down? I read that it was expected for video cards based on DDR3 to see a price increase of 15% in the next months due to this.

Perhaps it was too late in the development cycle of the "one" (geez doesn't that sound cheesy ) for MS to go with DDR5, as doing so may have implied a respin of the whole APU due to the need for a new memory controller.

I think the fact that MS didn't publish any performance figures at all indicates Sony caught MS with the pants down by using DDR5 for PS4.


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## MxPhenom 216 (May 22, 2013)

bpgt64 said:


> I don't think it will be capable of driving a 4k display at all, what I find interested is the increase in Xbox Live servers.  It's like they want to be OnLine.



Its because they are boasting 64-128 multiplayer games. Also itll be linked to Azure which is a high performing cloud computing service, which is supposivily aiding in the online service, and multiplayer games.


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## hellrazor (May 22, 2013)

Here are a bunch of pictures of it.


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## MxPhenom 216 (May 22, 2013)

I really like the design. Going back to the nostalgic box shape. Looks sleek too. I'm concerned with the price though. Assuming the new Kinect sensor will be included I could see this being a ~$500 console at launch.


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## 15th Warlock (May 22, 2013)

MxPhenom 216 said:


> I really like the design. Going back to the nostalgic box shape. Looks sleek too. I'm concerned with the price though. Assuming the new Kinect sensor will be included I could see this being a ~$500 console at launch.



That or... MS could subsidize it just like they do with the $99 360


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## Iceni (May 22, 2013)

lol TY _JP_.... I'm never going to be able to look at it again without thinking of the CDi 

the one thing i don't get is the price tag. Xbox and PS have always been loss leaders. Now that there charging almost the same for the hardware that you would expect from a mITX machine there is no point in using them.

I mean you can get an A8, 8gb ram, 500gb HDD and a case for under £400. The only selling point is kinect and exclusive titles for me, and neither are that important. If I want to stream media you can do it for £50 with a Pi.... these consoles actually offer nothing.


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## erocker (May 22, 2013)

I like the looks of it. It's just missing a nice wood veneer.


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## Guitar (May 22, 2013)

MxPhenom 216 said:


> Its because they are boasting 64-128 multiplayer games. Also itll be linked to Azure which is a high performing cloud computing service, which is supposivily aiding in the online service, and multiplayer games.



64-128 is old news. MAG pretty much demolished that on PS3. I'd much rather have the 4k display IMO, but I understand why they aren't including it.


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## Iceni (May 22, 2013)

Erocker your mission is to build one of them into one of these


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## DannibusX (May 22, 2013)

I like the look of the next Xbox.  I can only assume they're calling it Xbox One to market it as the only device you need in your living room for all of your entertainment needs.

It's not "always on" but it requires the internet at least once every 24 hours to maintain licenses and nonsense.  Lame.

Rumored "online pass" for used games.  Now I know why EA decided to drop the online pass!

Included and required Kinect.  I really don't want to be force fed the Kinect.  If I wanted one, I'd have one.  Besides, it's too Orwellian for me, I mean this console appears to be designed to watch you as much as you watch/play it.

The good things are the 500GB HDD, which will become outdated sooner rather than later.  Full game installs on the system with no disc swapping required.  The jump to an x86 architecture means better ports for PC (and if it really is using the Windows kernel and other parts of the OS means no porting as it will be developed for both platforms at once).

Bottom line.  As nice as the system looks, I will be passing on it.  I already have one sitting next to my desk.  I already have a service that limits my loaning and reselling of games as they remain account bound.  

Did they say whether XBL will continue to be a subscription service?  I like the deal they have with the NFL as long as it is free/included with XBL subscription, but knowing both Microsoft and the NFL it will cost extra.

Those new controllers look legit though, can't wait to use one with my PC.


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## erocker (May 22, 2013)

Iceni said:


> Erocker your mission is to build one of them into one of these
> 
> http://www.labguysworld.com/VR-1000_005.jpg



As you can see I added the luxurious faux stained wood accent along with a desperately needed integrated clock/radio. Got rid of that Kinect mumbo-jumbo witchcraftery!


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## Nordic (May 22, 2013)

erocker said:


> As you can see I added the luxurious faux stained wood accent along with a desperately needed integrated clock/radio.
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130522/xboneclockradio.jpg



I suddenly want to do that to my computer case...


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## KainXS (May 22, 2013)

So in terms of actual Gaming on this "console" now

Xbox One games have CD Keys it seems(just like PC games)


> Xbox One games will require a one-time activation code to use, but you'll still be able to trade and sell them online, Microsoft tells Kotaku



You need to connect to live every 24 hours or all games will be blocked(this is confirmed)


> Kotaku: If I’m playing a single player game, do I have to be online at least once per hour or something like that? Or can I go weeks and weeks?
> 
> Harrison: I believe it’s 24 hours.
> 
> ...



lent out games = fee(games are locked to live accounts via the cd keys so where does this leave preowned games)


> What this means is that if you take a game to a friend's house and try to play the game on their system using their account, you'll need to pay. If you take it to their house and try to play it on their system using your account, you won't need to pay.
> 
> In other words: playing while you're there is free. If you want to lend it to them for a few days/weeks? They'll have to pay.



No backwards compatibility


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## Nordic (May 22, 2013)

KainXS said:


> So in terms of actual Gaming on this "console" now
> 
> Xbox One games have CD Keys it seems(just like PC games)
> You need to connect to live every 24 hours or all games will be blocked(this is confirmed)
> ...



But porting to pc's is a breeze!


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## KainXS (May 22, 2013)

it will be a breeze with the the PS4 also, because based on the gaming aspect the PS4 is looking better now to me, nifty features are nifty but arkics earlier was right, gaming is where it matters and microsoft based on this conference and what they failed to mention(from the obvious backlash) has failed in my mind in that regard. They have alot of work ahead of them.


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## MxPhenom 216 (May 22, 2013)

Guitarrassdeamor said:


> 64-128 is old news. MAG pretty much demolished that on PS3. I'd much rather have the 4k display IMO, but I understand why they aren't including it.



Yeah demolished it, and then failed when the lag was incredibly bad, it was unplayable.


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## FordGT90Concept (May 22, 2013)

erocker said:


> It runs Windows... So, it's a PC.


I knew it!  I think we'll finally see the end of PC neglect.  No more crappy ports, no more severe consolitis, and maybe even multiplayer games that support split screen with multiple Xbox controllers.




KainXS said:


> it will be a breeze with the the PS4 also, because based on the gaming aspect the PS4 is looking better now to me, nifty features are nifty but arkics earlier was right, gaming is where it matters and microsoft based on this conference and what they failed to mention(from the obvious backlash) has failed in my mind in that regard. They have alot of work ahead of them.


Not really.  It sounds like PS4 is still using proprietary libraries for just about everything.  Microsoft's libraries on Xbox and on Windows are virtually the same.  I wouldn't be surprised with the Xbox One if virtually all games are designed for PC first (quicker to test) and then ported to Xbox second.


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## RCoon (May 22, 2013)

Everybody keeps saying things about ports being a thing of the past when these consoles come out. I think you're all going to be hurrendously disappointed. I have no doubt in my mind, that regardless of kernel or hardware, games that are developed for these consoles will still run like trash on anything other than one of these APU box consoles, unless devs make a special effort.


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## NinkobEi (May 22, 2013)

Is anyone else worried that the Kinect can detect emotion/read your heart beat and the xbox won't run without it operating? They're going to read everyone who plays a game/watches TV through it like a book and send it to MS marketing. So much for privacy.


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## 15th Warlock (May 22, 2013)

Having to pay a fee to play used games? No wonder MS avoided the topic completely in the press conference, this is going to anger a lot of ppl, what advantage is there to owning the "one" compared to the PC then, besides a few exclusives?

Yes, you can't let your friend borrow PC games either, but, in the vast majority of cases new PC games get much cheaper way faster than their console counterparts


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (May 22, 2013)

NinkobEi said:


> Is anyone else worried that the Kinect can detect emotion/read your heart beat and the xbox won't run without it operating? They're going to read everyone who plays a game/watches TV through it like a book and send it to MS marketing. So much for privacy.



Don't buy an android or ios phone then as they do just as much tracking etc of course you're right but everyone is watching you already so what can you do.


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## RCoon (May 22, 2013)

theoneandonlymrk said:


> Don't buy an android or ios phone then as they do just as much tracking etc of course you're right but everyone is watching you already so *what can you do.*



Not care in the slightest, my life isnt very interesting, I'm sure they'd agree.


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## NinkobEi (May 22, 2013)

theoneandonlymrk said:


> Don't buy an android or ios phone then as they do just as much tracking etc of course you're right but everyone is watching you already so what can you do.



Can an android phone read your emotion, sense your body heat and tell your heart rate bpm, and everyone of those around you?

The quality of the kinect is outrageous. Watching a TV that watches you back. Scary stuff.


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## HalfAHertz (May 22, 2013)

I see 16 memory chips. Does that mean that the total width of the memory bus is 16x32 = 512 bit?


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## RCoon (May 22, 2013)

I love this Q&A:

Q:    Does Xbox One require an “always on” Internet connection?
*A:    No, it does not have to be always connected, but Xbox One does require a connection to the Internet.*

Will you punch me in the face?
No, i will not. But your face is going to get punched, by me.


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## bencrutz (May 22, 2013)

HalfAHertz said:


> I see 16 memory chips. Does that mean that the total width of the memory bus is 16x32 = 512 bit?



not necessarily, but it means 4 gigabit per chips (hence 8GB in total)


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## BiggieShady (May 22, 2013)

erocker said:


> As you can see I added the luxurious faux stained wood accent along with a desperately needed integrated clock/radio. Got rid of that Kinect mumbo-jumbo witchcraftery!



Kudos for being featured on kotaku


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## Nordic (May 22, 2013)

BiggieShady said:


> Kudos for being featured on kotaku



Link for peoples.
http://kotaku.com/its-a-clock-a-radio-an-alarm-the-new-xbox-is-all-in-509244595




Frick said:


> That thing in all wood would look good actually. We need more wood in our lives.



Yes. Everywhere. Always in our faces.


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## Frick (May 22, 2013)

That thing in all wood would look good actually. We need more wood in our lives.


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## insane 360 (May 22, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> Games will be at E3. What they showed was much more impressive than I expected. Stuff I can actually use vs the PS4's facebook bullshit. Sooo much money to be saved on the cable bill with this thing. It'll be interesting to see what kinda of gaming can be done with kinect now that it's instant response and higher res.



just a note, most of the tv features are all tied to the user having a STB and cable (premium) subscription...only netflix and hulu+ i think don't have to be tied to it...hbo go...espn...

i've even heard talk about abc/cbs/fox all working on different streaming apps but they would be tied to your cable subscription...

sucks for me, i use an antenna on my roof and have an hdhomerun dual that lets me use it through media center and thus through my 360...with the xbone coming out i think they are finially killing media center completely....and going with the fact that you need a cable sub to get much in the way of content.


----------



## Ravenas (May 22, 2013)

I am very happy the Xbox One comes with a Blu Ray player. Finally Microsoft has quit being stubborn about its beloved codecs used in HDDVD and moved on to what the market has chosen.


----------



## Guitar (May 22, 2013)

MxPhenom 216 said:


> Yeah demolished it, and then failed when the lag was incredibly bad, it was unplayable.



Except it wasn't.


----------



## Delta6326 (May 22, 2013)

erocker said:


> As you can see I added the luxurious faux stained wood accent along with a desperately needed integrated clock/radio. Got rid of that Kinect mumbo-jumbo witchcraftery!
> 
> Snip



I really like that look Erocker!they should make one with a cherry wood face wood go with lots of nice speakers out there.


----------



## ste2425 (May 22, 2013)

Im excited because it's new and ill be watching this and the PS4 but I definitely won't be buying either, nor feel any need. Ive got my 360 if I want to play console games and do the whole home entertainment thing, which I never use as I play on the PC. When I do eventually play console I rock the emulators on my Wii anyway.


----------



## Ahhzz (May 22, 2013)

hahahahahahahahahahahahah


----------



## WhiteNoise (May 22, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> One works only in a world where Xbox 1 isn't already a product. Now we have to call that xbox original.




The xbox is just that. Xbox. It was never officially called the xbox 1. So I don't see the issue. In the future just refer to it as the original xbox or just xbox. 

Xbox One sounds much better than xbox 720.

I for one appreciate the design. It will fit right into my audio/video equipment.


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## Frag_Maniac (May 22, 2013)

A fee to play friend's games is a real con. Sony is not doing this. One of the perks of having a console used to be the chance to buy and play a big selection of used games, or borrow them from friends. With the higher price of console vs PC games, plus the higher price of these systems, it's no wonder they spent much of the time talking about TV integration. 

They're going to have to have some pretty good exclusives to compete with Sony, esp with that huge tradeoff of fees for used games. You can't find full length videos of this conference that show the Q&A after where used games are asked about because it's bad PR for them. 

Also a 500GB HDD  is not very big when you have to install every game, esp with the file size of games these days, and these next gen console games are going to be about as large as the PC ones now. In fact 500GB is pretty small when you consider this is an entertainment hub with DVR features.


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## KainXS (May 22, 2013)

Frag Maniac said:


> A fee to play friend's games is a real con. Sony is not doing this. One of the perks of having a console used to be the chance to buy and play a big selection of used games, or borrow them from friends. With the higher price of console vs PC games, plus the higher price of these systems, it's no wonder they spent much of the time talking about TV integration.
> 
> They're going to have to have some pretty good exclusives to compete with Sony, esp with that huge tradeoff of fees for used games. You can't find full length videos of this conference that show the Q&A after where used games are asked about because it's bad PR for them.
> 
> Also a 500GB HDD  is not very big when you have to install every game, esp with the file size of games these days, and these next gen console games are going to be about as large as the PC ones now. In fact 500GB is pretty small when you consider this is an entertainment hub with DVR features.



sadly yes
Xbox One Reveal 2013 Highlights - YouTube
the sad thing is that they defend that fee nonsense by saying,  "you don't need to have the game in the console when you play it, what if you gave the game away so more than one person could play it at once" . . . . .


----------



## lilhasselhoffer (May 22, 2013)

So let me get this straight in my head.

MS spent the majority of this conference talking about the multimedia features of the Xbox One.  We're going to look past the name, the numerous details that MS never mentioned, and the fact that almost no real information was conveyed here.

MS has three problems.
1) Used game market killers will make consumers and retail chains less than happy about spending $60 on a game, as resales will be forced to a lower price to make them reasonable.  Consumers will bear the brunt of the value decrease, as a fat profit margin for used games disappear and the selection of more affordable games evaporates.  This means lower sales figures overall, and consumers waiting for the prices of games to drop to more reasonable levels before purchase.  A lose-lose-lose for consumers, publishers, and retailers.

2) Constant connection.  Any continual dial-home feature is DRM.  Those consumers than cannot have this connectivity will be out in the cold.  Those who believe this "feature" is an excuse to monitor usage will not touch the console.  There is a good reason the idiot that said "just deal with it" got fired.  MS might have done the best thing for PR and fired him, but they might be riding those sentiments into their next console.

3) Exclusivity.  The PS4 and Xbox will functionally be cousins.  They have nearly the same hardware setup, and that necessitates some similarities in design.  Likewise, the PC and a dozen different devices already do what the Xbox One purports to do.  So where does that leave the, presumable, gaming console.  It doesn't bring anything substantially better than a mid-tier PCs parts, it doesn't beat out other media devices for content provision.  It doesn't even deliver a unique input medium, as the controllers are already capable of being used on any windows PC.  Why would anyone with the money for an Xbox buy it?



There is only one way I see the Xbox One succeeding.  Drop the new DRM features.  Make new games cost $45, and have every game have an additional component withheld for $10.  This component needs to not be necessary for the game, but it needs to be something that consumers who like a game would be willing to purchase.  The publisher and MS divvy up this $10 expenditure, which should insure used game sales still benefit publishers.  That comes in at $5 less expense for a customer, and the first time the content is purchased under resale the money that is "lost" will be recouped.    

MS makes used game sales possible, forces prices to the consumers to go down, and still increases their earnings.  I don't think MS has the balls to do this, because they have never shown this much initiative.  In the same respect, I think the Xbox One will languish and be seen as underperforming.  All of this is the fault of MS, as they seem to be stumbling about blindly in the dark.  Windows 8 isn't the revelation MS wanted.  Windows on my gaming console is foolish experiment.


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## Frag_Maniac (May 22, 2013)

KainXS said:


> sadly yes
> Xbox One Reveal 2013 Highlights - YouTube
> the sad thing is that they defend that fee nonsense by saying,  "you don't need to have the game in the console when you play it, what if you gave the game away so more than one person could play it at once" . . . . .



LOL, that was hilarious, maybe they should call this system TeeVee Duty. Personally I think having an assist dog is a nice touch for CoD Ghosts though. Dead to Rights had one called Shadow, and he was one of the cooler features of the game.

I have to say I feel having to install every game is a real downside though. They finally include an optical drive capable of storing entire games on one disc and they make you install games, which just takes time and eats up drive space. Clearly the ONLY reason is to make you validate the game with a code so you can't play used games without a fee.

I understand using the x86 platform to make developing and porting easier, but when you make it so much like PC on the user end, many are just going to say screw it and buy a PC. It's looking like these next gen consoles might sell for around $500. You add the higher price of games at or near launch and that now means in a shorter span of time than before you can now be spending easily as much as a $800 PC. A PC will now pay for itself within a couple years vs 3, maybe even less. If their exclusives don't do well things are not going to be looking good for them.


----------



## Toilet_pepper (May 22, 2013)

I dont think they would sell these consoles for $500 at launch. Not enough profit. I'm guessing it would be near a $1000 and a lot of people would still buy it coz of the holiday season. 

They can show me a lot of shiny screenies and I still ain't gonna be impressed as most likely it would be capped at 30fps and would even have a hard time maintaining that.


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## Guitar (May 22, 2013)

Toilet_pepper said:


> I dont think they would sell these consoles for $500 at launch. Not enough profit. I'm guessing it would be near a $1000 and a lot of people would still buy it coz of the holiday season.
> 
> They can show me a lot of shiny screenies and I still ain't gonna be impressed as most likely it would be capped at 30fps and would even have a hard time maintaining that.



You do realize how bad the PS3 got ripped on for having a $500 launch? I bet it won't be more than $399.


----------



## 15th Warlock (May 22, 2013)

Toilet_pepper said:


> I dont think they would sell these consoles for $500 at launch. Not enough profit. I'm guessing it would be near a $1000 and a lot of people would still buy it coz of the holiday season.
> 
> They can show me a lot of shiny screenies and I still ain't gonna be impressed as most likely it would be capped at 30fps and would even have a hard time maintaining that.



Consoles are notorious for being sold at a loss for the first few years (Nintendo consoles being usually the exception to this rule) console makers usually make their profit from royalties collected from each game sold.

once the cost of manufacturing gets lower, the hardware itself becomes profitable, but that may take years, even more so with each new console cycle as their complexity keeps increasing. 

As for having a bluray drive, the only advantage is you'll be able to watch current movies on it, as games will require a mandatory installation, that 500GB drive will get filled real fast...


----------



## toilet pepper (May 23, 2013)

Yeah. I understand where y'all are coming from. Price it at around $700 and people would still buy it. Same reason people would buy an overpriced graphics card, an overpriced phone or an overpriced headset/earphones. All they have to do is show them a shiny COD clip and that would seal the deal.


----------



## KainXS (May 23, 2013)

Frag Maniac said:


> LOL, that was hilarious, maybe they should call this system TeeVee Duty. Personally I think having an assist dog is a nice touch for CoD Ghosts though. Dead to Rights had one called Shadow, and he was one of the cooler features of the game.
> 
> I have to say I feel having to install every game is a real downside though. They finally include an optical drive capable of storing entire games on one disc and they make you install games, which just takes time and eats up drive space. Clearly the ONLY reason is to make you validate the game with a code so you can't play used games without a fee.
> 
> I understand using the x86 platform to make developing and porting easier, but when you make it so much like PC on the user end, many are just going to say screw it and buy a PC. It's looking like these next gen consoles might sell for around $500. You add the higher price of games at or near launch and that now means in a shorter span of time than before you can now be spending easily as much as a $800 PC. A PC will now pay for itself within a couple years vs 3, maybe even less. If their exclusives don't do well things are not going to be looking good for them.



well we can always hope they will take some of this backlash in and redesign and fix some of these issues because it really is apparent that fee is just a cash grab, they could have made it just as easy to need to have the disc in the tray and just adopted something similar to the PS4's approach but yea . . . . . . . I would not be surprised if publishers wanted the feature in the cons - - - htpc.


----------



## HalfAHertz (May 23, 2013)

Anandtech did a pretty good comparison of the specs. Even tho they're based on the same platform, MS and Sony have went for two very different strategies. Seems like Sony will be packing in a lot more GFX power.


----------



## MxPhenom 216 (May 23, 2013)

HalfAHertz said:


> Anandtech did a pretty good comparison of the specs. Even tho they're based on the same platform, MS and Sony have went for two very different strategies. Seems like Sony will be packing in a lot more GFX power.



Out of everything I have seen so far. Sony looks to have the better next gen console so far. Not just in hardware.


----------



## Frag_Maniac (May 23, 2013)

HalfAHertz said:


> Seems like Sony will be packing in a lot more GFX power.



Wouldn't surprise me. After this reveal it's clear that much of the power of the One is in it's tri level OS that is mostly media based. When they say 5 bill transistors yet don't say anything about graphics compute power, you have to wonder if it's lackluster.


----------



## Conti027 (May 23, 2013)

I really like the look of the Xbox One.


----------



## entropy13 (May 24, 2013)

[yt]KbWgUO-Rqcw[/yt]


----------



## WhiteLotus (May 24, 2013)

I don't get the need to bundle in the Kinect. I'm confused at that one.


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## Melvis (May 24, 2013)

Did anyone see this part about the kinect? if its true what a joke!!


http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/24/xbox-one-kinect-2s-visual-drm-functions-found-in-patent-file-report/


----------



## FordGT90Concept (May 24, 2013)

I think I know who is going to win worst company of the year next year.  Microsoft is bending over backwards for producers at the consumer's expense.  I'm almost hoping/expecting most consumers boycott the Xbox One and it will be one of the largest market failures ever.  If people don't boycott it, these kinds of draconian DRM schemes will infiltrate the entire console market.


----------



## RCoon (May 24, 2013)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I think I know who is going to win worst company of the year next year.  Microsoft is bending over backwards for producers at the consumer's expense.  I'm almost hoping/expecting most consumers boycott the Xbox One and it will be one of the largest market failures ever.  If people don't boycott it, these kinds of draconian DRM schemes will infiltrate the entire console market.



Thousands of people will claim to boycott it, like Modern Warfare 2 or Mass Effect 3, but is will be a resounding success all around, because morons cant keep it in their pants; shiny new things are far too attractive to them to just not buy.
Most digital industry businesses will LOVE the XBone, because of the whole film licensing and preowned game costs, not to mention internet ISP's will receive lots of subscribers from those who need internet connection to run the damn console. This is only the beginning I think.


----------



## KainXS (May 24, 2013)

Melvis said:


> Did anyone see this part about the kinect? if its true what a joke!!
> 
> 
> http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/24/xbox-one-kinect-2s-visual-drm-functions-found-in-patent-file-report/



well this was hinted at before but to see the patent sets it in stone, each day this new xbox the sinks deeper and deeper into the sea of failure man.:shadedshu

and we complained about our drm on pc's . . . . . . . .

cool stories bro
http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/24/xbox-one-pre-owned-game-activation-to-cost-around-35-report/
http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/23/xbox-one-ps4-a-generation-ahead-of-high-end-pcs-says-ea-exec/


----------



## FordGT90Concept (May 24, 2013)

RCoon said:


> Thousands of people will claim to boycott it, like Modern Warfare 2 or Mass Effect 3, but is will be a resounding success all around, because morons cant keep it in their pants; shiny new things are far too attractive to them to just not buy.
> Most digital industry businesses will LOVE the XBone, because of the whole film licensing and preowned game costs, not to mention internet ISP's will receive lots of subscribers from those who need internet connection to run the damn console. This is only the beginning I think.


PC is ahead of the curve.  PC titles went down this path Microsoft is now and it completely backfired (see SimCity, Spore, Anno 2070, etc.).  PC publishers are now backing off the draconian DRM and are sticking to modest DRM.

People will only pay so much for a product/service.  If they can get it for less than that (second hand or piracy), they'll do it.  If they cannot, they simply won't buy.  At the end of the day, I think how much publishers make will be virtually unchanged but complaints will be high.  Just like every other high piracy environment, logic dictates to back off on DRM because it doesn't translate into more revenue but undeniably translates into more unhappy customers.


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## RCoon (May 24, 2013)

FordGT90Concept said:


> PC is ahead of the curve.  PC titles went down this path Microsoft is now and it completely backfired (see SimCity, Spore, Anno 2070, etc.).  PC publishers are now backing off the draconian DRM and are sticking to modest DRM.
> 
> People will only pay so much for a product/service.  If they can get it for less than that (second hand or piracy), they'll do it.  If they cannot, they simply won't buy.  At the end of the day, I think how much publishers make will be virtually unchanged but complaints will be high.  Just like every other high piracy environment, logic dictates to back off on DRM because it doesn't translate into more revenue but undeniably translates into more unhappy customers.



I truly hope you are right.
But sadly, corporations are going to be greedy as and when they can, at our expense.


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## Deleted member 24505 (May 24, 2013)

Its all the drones who are not reading sites like this, that will buy it knowing nothing about what we are discussing here, so the sales will still be high.


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## newtekie1 (May 24, 2013)

It looks like Microsoft has thrown out Indie games as well, what a shame.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/indie-developers-cannot-self-publish-games-on-xbox-one-6408774


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## KainXS (May 24, 2013)

All I can say is wow, that is one thing that is just like wow(head explodes)

That really really suprises me.


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## Melvis (May 25, 2013)

KainXS said:


> well this was hinted at before but to see the patent sets it in stone, each day this new xbox the sinks deeper and deeper into the sea of failure man.:shadedshu
> 
> and we complained about our drm on pc's . . . . . . . .
> 
> ...



Wait wait wait wait....there claiming that its more powerful then the latest PC?


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## NinkobEi (May 25, 2013)

Melvis said:


> Wait wait wait wait....there claiming that its more powerful then the latest PC?









Welp. This settles that. The guy on the left is staring into my soul. The guy on the right, uh, not so much.


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## HalfAHertz (May 25, 2013)

Melvis said:


> Did anyone see this part about the kinect? if its true what a joke!!
> 
> 
> http://www.vg247.com/2013/05/24/xbox-one-kinect-2s-visual-drm-functions-found-in-patent-file-report/



So what happens when you flip the kinect to the side?


----------



## KainXS (May 25, 2013)

> Xbox One will not only use Kinect for voice commands, but the camera will also talk to you and let you know if there is someone in the room it doesn’t recognize, and will ask the person to identify themselves.
> 
> According to source speaking with Polygon, the new person identified will then have their identity saved to the console, and then will be “welcomed” by the system.



does this mean the camera is on 100% of the time?


----------



## Aquinus (May 25, 2013)

KainXS said:


> does this mean the camera is on 100% of the time?



I thought it already was on the 360. It certainly does at the main menu or in a Kinect game. I have one because the wife wanted it. I use it occasionally, it's missing the depth bit though. Between held motion sensors and a camera, I think they could do wonders, but I digress.


----------



## Melvis (May 25, 2013)

NinkobEi said:


> http://i.imgur.com/74Pz3tB.jpg
> 
> Welp. This settles that. The guy on the left is staring into my soul. The guy on the right, uh, not so much.



Yeah the XBOX is smashing the PC graphics right there 





HalfAHertz said:


> So what happens when you flip the kinect to the side?



 Good question, there be some sort of bug, and you be able to avid it lol


----------



## _JP_ (May 25, 2013)

HalfAHertz said:


> So what happens when you flip the kinect to the side?


What happens when you put a mirror in front of it?


----------



## Frick (May 25, 2013)

_JP_ said:


> What happens when you put a mirror in front of it?



It becomes sentient.


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## KainXS (May 25, 2013)

then what happens when put 2 kinects in front of eachother?


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## Guitar (May 25, 2013)

KainXS said:


> then what happens when put 2 kinects in front of eachother?


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## Frick (May 25, 2013)

KainXS said:


> then what happens when put 2 kinects in front of eachother?



Helios.

(on a side note: WHY OH GOD OH WHY GOD DOES THAT GAME HAVE TO HAVE THOSE LOADING SCREENS THAT TAKES FOREVER ON MODERN COMPUTERS RHHGHAHGAEEEEGE)


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## NinkobEi (May 25, 2013)

Hey good news, now you can earn xbox achievements for watching tv! It's a dream come true

http://gamingbolt.com/microsoft-patents-tv-achievements-likely-for-xbox-one


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## Frick (May 25, 2013)

NinkobEi said:


> Hey good news, now you can earn xbox achievements for watching tv! It's a dream come true
> 
> http://gamingbolt.com/microsoft-patents-tv-achievements-likely-for-xbox-one



If you like achivements I don't see why not. "Five Firefly-marathons in a row" is definitevly I want everyone to know. I mean seriously.


----------



## NinkobEi (May 25, 2013)

Frick said:


> If you like achivements I don't see why not. "Five Firefly-marathons in a row" is definitevly I want everyone to know. I mean seriously.



Yeah but now everyone will know that you've watched Two Broke Girls and Mike and Molly.


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## KainXS (May 25, 2013)




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## TheMailMan78 (May 26, 2013)

lilhasselhoffer said:


> So let me get this straight in my head.
> 
> MS spent the majority of this conference talking about the multimedia features of the Xbox One.  We're going to look past the name, the numerous details that MS never mentioned, and the fact that almost no real information was conveyed here.
> 
> ...


Oh please. First off 59 bucks for a video game is cheaper than games were 15 years ago adjusted for inflation. So "Waaaaa games are to expensive" argument doesn't hold water. Not even remotely. Second all this DRM crap IS NO DIFFERENT than steam or origin and the last time I checked PC sales were doing just fine. Wanna place blame on this new console DRM? Look no further than the normal PC gamer logged into steam.


----------



## 15th Warlock (May 26, 2013)

WhiteLotus said:


> I don't get the need to bundle in the Kinect. I'm confused at that one.



This might explain the reasoning behind it (J/K), found this little gem at gametrailers:



> XBOX, PLAY GAME.
> 
> "I'm sorry, Dave. I'm afraid I cant do that."
> 
> ...



Don't know if you guys are fans of the Annoyed Gamer, but here are his reactions to the press conference:

http://www.gametrailers.com/videos/m4yj8z/annoyed-gamer-xbox-one-reaction

This keeps getting better and better, what a joke


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (May 26, 2013)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Oh please. First off 59 bucks for a video game is cheaper than games were 15 years ago adjusted for inflation. So "Waaaaa games are to expensive" argument doesn't hold water. Not even remotely. Second all this DRM crap IS NO DIFFERENT than steam or origin and the last time I checked PC sales were doing just fine. Wanna place blame on this new console DRM? Look no further than the normal PC gamer logged into steam.



American wages have been stagnant longer than games have been overpriced. Until wages increase in step with inflation saying things haven't gotten more expensive is just non-sense. For that matter so is bitching about people saying games are too expensive. Get with the times. Games are too expensive for 95% of titles and they suffer for it in sales. Very few games are guaranteed buys at full price. You need a mega franchise to pull that off. For everything else people bargain hunt. Look at steam. At those price people are getting dozens of a games a year, but on consoles those same people are buying only 1-4 games a year. If the free market is saying games are too expensive then they're too fucking expensive. That's the only metric that matters.


----------



## hellrazor (May 26, 2013)

I can't wait to go on facebook and see people to get the "5 hours of porn in a single day" achievement.


----------



## NinkobEi (May 26, 2013)




----------



## Frick (May 26, 2013)

NinkobEi said:


> http://i.minus.com/iGpVCeVzdBTUf.gif



I really don't understand why people complain about the games. The games will come. Obviously there will be Fifa's and CoD's, but there will also be _other games_. I really don't understand the issue.


----------



## Mussels (May 26, 2013)

Frick said:


> I really don't understand why people complain about the games. The games will come. Obviously there will be Fifa's and CoD's, but there will also be _other games_. I really don't understand the issue.



if you have a CoD game now, throw it in the bin. it wont work on the new console, and the playerbase will be split so it wont work as nicely. and then, soon enough, microsoft will shut down all the multiplayer servers. unlike previous generations, this means with no online play and no servers... the console is useless. this aint no NES you can fire up duckhunt every 10 years.


----------



## _JP_ (May 26, 2013)




----------



## KainXS (Jun 8, 2013)

so now that the real facts are starting to come in about used games what do you think now

straight from xbox.com


> *Buy the way you want—disc or digital—on the same day:*
> You’ll be able to buy disc-based games at traditional retailers or online through Xbox Live, on day of release. Discs will continue to be a great way to install your games quickly.
> 
> *Access your entire games library from any Xbox One—no discs required:*
> ...



and which was discovered after


> With Xbox One you can game offline for up to 24 hours on your primary console, or one hour if you are logged on to a separate console accessing your library. Offline gaming is not possible after these prescribed times until you re-establish a connection, but you can still watch live TV and enjoy Blu-ray and DVD movies.





> Third party publishers may opt in or out of supporting game resale and may set up business terms or transfer fees with retailers. Microsoft does not receive any compensation as part of this. In addition, third party publishers can enable you to give games to friends. Loaning or renting games won't be available at launch, but we are exploring the possibilities with our partners.



The share access part is just sad, the fact that they needed to say that should put you in the mood for this overall situation. The first bit pretty much confirms everyones assumptions that your paying for a disc to install the game like steam now. You can give the game to one person after they have been on your friends list for 30 days and after that the game can not be traded period.(they are stuck with it forever it seems)Then theres the good news, you can trade in used games at certain retailers.(but probably at an elevated price which kinda eliminates it) Where it leaves renting games I have no idea, I personally get games from gamefly from time to time.(found out renting games will die with this approach)

now the saddest thing that has been brought out is that publishers can choose whether or not games can or can't be traded in and even if they do they are sold on their terms it seems, so every EA game, you can forget about it, and most other publishers are not going to lose a new game sale vs a used one. Its really a sad situation, microsoft could have stood up like david vs the goliath(publishers) but it seems they chose to stand down, used games look dead. Deliver us onto our publisher gods microsoft, with this hellspawn of a htpc and a console.


for more info
http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/main
http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06...line?utm_campaign=fbposts&utm_source=facebook

even worst is that sony will probably do something similar.


----------



## TheMailMan78 (Jun 8, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> American wages have been stagnant longer than games have been overpriced. Until wages increase in step with inflation saying things haven't gotten more expensive is just non-sense. For that matter so is bitching about people saying games are too expensive. Get with the times. Games are too expensive for 95% of titles and they suffer for it in sales. Very few games are guaranteed buys at full price. You need a mega franchise to pull that off. For everything else people bargain hunt. Look at steam. At those price people are getting dozens of a games a year, but on consoles those same people are buying only 1-4 games a year. If the free market is saying games are too expensive then they're too fucking expensive. That's the only metric that matters.



Games are not to expensive. Any market report you look at show the gaming industry growing faster than most ALL other entertainment industries. Its even larger than the movie industry now.

Back in 1985 games cost about 39.99 to 49.99. Adjusted for inflation that's close to 100 bucks todays currency. So if you get down to brass tact's games are CHEAPER today then they ever have been before. 59.99 for a game is a STEAL. So really when you cry "Waaaa games are to expensive" all I have to say is maybe you should mow some more lawns and stop buying moon pies and colas from the ice cream man.


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## Mindweaver (Jun 8, 2013)

That's why TMM got a job, because Games are so cheap!  j/k Man! Naw, I'm with you TMM I can remember paying over $79.99 for SNES games.. I can remember my parents buying an Atari 2600 when they came out for $300 bucks! Game prices are fine as long as the dev gets most of it. Game prices fall fast enough, I don't see why anyone can complain over prices. If you don't want to pay $59.99 then wait for it to drop and trust me it will drop.

OH and check out these killer graphics for the XBox One!


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 8, 2013)

Mindweaver said:


> That's why TMM got a job, because Games are so cheap!  j/k Man! Naw, I'm with you TMM I can remember paying over $79.99 for SNES games.. I can remember my parents buying an Atari 2600 when they came out for $300 bucks! Game prices are fine as long as the dev gets most of it. Game prices fall fast enough, I don't see why anyone can complain over prices. If you don't want to pay $59.99 then wait for it to drop and trust me it will drop.
> 
> OH and check out these killer graphics for the XBox One!



I've ALWAYS had a job. Had a full time salary working from home. Just got bored of it.......that and having beer for lunch isn't always a good idea.


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## Frag_Maniac (Jun 8, 2013)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Games are not to expensive. Any market report you look at show the gaming industry growing faster than most ALL other entertainment industries. Its even larger than the movie industry now.
> 
> Back in 1985 games cost about 39.99 to 49.99. Adjusted for inflation that's close to 100 bucks todays currency. So if you get down to brass tact's games are CHEAPER today then they ever have been before. 59.99 for a game is a STEAL. So really when you cry "Waaaa games are to expensive" all I have to say is maybe you should mow some more lawns and stop buying moon pies and colas from the ice cream man.



On PC you certainly have more choices too. Most titles at or near launch can be had anywhere from $30-$45. It's consoles where I feel Spector has a point because it's not only 80% of the sales, the games made for them don't have as much work put into them. Also you're not really factoring in how most games are much shorter now.


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## Mindweaver (Jun 8, 2013)

TheMailMan78 said:


> I've ALWAYS had a job. Had a full time salary working from home. Just got bored of it.......that and having beer for lunch isn't always a good idea.



I know man I was just joking.   And I've had the luxury of working from home and yea it gets boring.  add gaming with beer for lunch and productivity goes down the drain!..lol 

Did anyone check out the LocoCycle trailer? Those graphics have to be for XBox 360...


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## Ahhzz (Jun 9, 2013)

Just stay bent over, console gamers. It'll be easier that way.


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## RevengE (Jun 9, 2013)

They should have kept the name Xbox 720. One is just stupid... BUT I am not a console guy. It looks like a briefcase.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 9, 2013)

Why did they call it the Xbox One?

........................................................................................
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Because they took 359 steps backwards.


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## KainXS (Jun 9, 2013)

As much as I hate whats going on with this . . . . thing, I will wait and see what happens with E3 before I TRULY start to hate this thing and really decide if its worth saving any money for, Microsoft has to do alot of damage control in a few days and it might make or break the Xbox brand at this point.

And Sony is on my list also, they have been sitting back watching, they could be doing much the same Microsoft is.

the name is pretty stupid yea, I don't know how some people defend that........


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## newtekie1 (Jun 16, 2013)

http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Xb...ng-Windows-7-With-Nvidia-GTX-Cards-56737.html

So it turns out all the "XboxOne" games shown at E3 weren't running on XboxOne hardware, or even reasonably comparable hardware, they were actually running on high end Windows 7 computers with GTX780 and some kind of liquid-cooled(guessing overclocked) CPU.  I'm guessing the real XBoxOne games won't look nearly as good as the ones shown at E3 since the XboxOne isn't anywhere near as powerful as a GTX780...  Yet another really shitty move to pull.


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## Frag_Maniac (Jun 16, 2013)

KainXS said:


> As much as I hate whats going on with this . . . .*thing*, I will wait and see what happens with E3 before I TRULY start to hate this *thing*....



Xbox The Thing. It sprouts tentacles and attacks every time you try to disconnect it from the net! LOL


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## Ahhzz (Jun 17, 2013)

X-Cock!


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## Guitar (Jun 17, 2013)

newtekie1 said:


> http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Xb...ng-Windows-7-With-Nvidia-GTX-Cards-56737.html
> 
> So it turns out all the "XboxOne" games shown at E3 weren't running on XboxOne hardware, or even reasonably comparable hardware, they were actually running on high end Windows 7 computers with GTX780 and some kind of liquid-cooled(guessing overclocked) CPU.  I'm guessing the real XBoxOne games won't look nearly as good as the ones shown at E3 since the XboxOne isn't anywhere near as powerful as a GTX780...  Yet another really shitty move to pull.



I'm pretty sure most games there run on hardware like that.



> If true, none of this should be a surprise to most people given that all E3 demos run their games on high-end PCs; it's a smoke and mirrors circus to sell the idea of the game, sort of like how pro wrestling sells the idea of fighting despite being scripted. We should all be used to it by now and it's just common practice [from most studios] given that the dev kits or comparable specs aren't usually finalized at this point.


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## KainXS (Jun 17, 2013)

alot of the time when the final hardware is not available they will either use the dev kits to demo the game or something similar, remember the wii launch, nintendo used modified gamecube dev kits to demo the games at the E3 right before that, if the dev kits aren't available then they use pc's but with this new wave of consoles which are basically pc's anyway, its no real surprise you know, the PS4 games were running on the PS4 dev kits to let u know not normal pc's.

I would like to know what the xbox one dev kits look like though(it its even has a solid one)


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## Ahhzz (Jun 19, 2013)

http://kotaku.com/microsoft-is-removing-xbox-one-drm-514390310

Microsoft gives in, realizes their stupidity 

the short and sweet:

No more always online requirement
The console no longer has to check in every 24 hours
All game discs will work on Xbox One as they do on Xbox 360
Authentication is no longer necessary
An Internet connection is only required when initially setting up the console
All downloaded games will function the same when online or offline
No additional restrictions on trading games or loaning discs
Region locks have been dropped


http://news.xbox.com/2013/05/qa
http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update
Updated verification from MS X-cock website.


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## LAN_deRf_HA (Jun 19, 2013)

Doesn't that mean the PS4 has more DRM on used games than the Xbox one? Thought they said third party games will have the option to restrict. Maybe they'll drop that too in response to this. Funny people wanting you to believe you just have to accept whatever bullshit a company wants to sell you. Proof otherwise here. Be vocal.


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## erixx (Jun 19, 2013)

Is all that limitations stupidity seriously coming from MS? Are they just doing this to "feel" the reactions?

Some of these things I can understand, like always on: that way when you start gaming your box is updated/patched, maybe?


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## RCoon (Jun 19, 2013)

Ahhzz said:


> http://kotaku.com/microsoft-is-removing-xbox-one-drm-514390310
> 
> Microsoft gives in, realizes their stupidity
> 
> ...



Read this update 2 minutes before checking this thread and noticed you beat me to it.
Microsoft backtracked big time, at least they realised their mistake.
Now all we have to do is wait for EA to learn from their millions of mistakes and do the same, then the gaming world can be a better place.


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## Ahhzz (Jun 19, 2013)

RCoon said:


> ....
> Now all we have to do is wait for EA to learn from their millions of mistakes and do the same, then the gaming world can be a better place.




hahahahahahahahahaha



wait for it....




wait for it....






yeah, right.


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## 15th Warlock (Jun 20, 2013)

MS also announced they're changing the name of their new console, it's now called XBOX One-80 

All kidding aside, this is one major win for all costumers! I wasn't expecting a reverse so fast, I guess the ratio of pre orders in favor of PS4 got MS to reconsider all their stupid policies, well good for everyone

Now if we could make them rid of the stupid Kinect in every box, that would really make the Xbone an appealing proposal


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## Melvis (Jun 20, 2013)

http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update

Guess Microsoft is listening to there customers?


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## AsRock (Jun 20, 2013)

Melvis said:


> http://news.xbox.com/2013/06/update
> 
> Guess Microsoft is listening to there customers?



More like they cannot afford to sell the xbox 1 for $14 to make sales like they did with win 8. And i think it's more like forced if they want a positive out come..

And i still would not buy one not due to the charge to be online but for trying this BS in the 1st place.


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## Ahhzz (Jun 20, 2013)

AsRock said:


> More like they cannot afford to sell the xbox 1 for $14 to make sales like they did with win 8. And i think it's more like forced if they want a positive out come..
> 
> And i still would not buy one not due to the charge to be online but for trying this BS in the 1st place.



True that. not coming anywhere near that. I have to throw enough money at M$, there's no way I'm sending any for this. Too little, too late. Screw em.


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## KainXS (Jun 20, 2013)

I agree I am not going to sit back and praise a company for doing the right thing when they should have done that in the first place, and the fact that you need to install a patch to remove these horrible features and the way how they are saying its negatively affecting other features makes me very skeptical, is this just PR, and down the road whats going to prevent them from redoing this if all thats stopping them is a patch.

I personally am still going to wait about 6 months afer release to see whether or not I am going to buy a WiiU or an PS4 but MS can still go fuck themselves for a solid year after release in my mind, why 6 months, I have had 1 dead PS3(have a slim now), 3 dead 360's(1 was a slim, now have a another slim with the hybrid uniclamp + aftermarket heatsink), and I have had not one problem since my gamecube, on the nintendo front seems like the WiiU is just as solid as the Wii in terms of reliability. If the PS4 is a solid console maybe I will get one if the games are good but the WiiU needs some better games.


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## Ahhzz (Jun 20, 2013)

I saw something somewhere, where a MS rep reportedly said that the DRM was hard coded into the X-cocks, and that they were built around the DRM, and couldn't just be "switched off".......


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## Guitar (Jun 20, 2013)

Ahhzz said:


> I saw something somewhere, where a MS rep reportedly said that the DRM was hard coded into the X-cocks, and that they were built around the DRM, and couldn't just be "switched off".......



That's retarded.


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## rtwjunkie (Jun 20, 2013)

Yeah, it's not been a good year and a half for an EXTREMELY arrogant MS.  First they ignore the server enthusiast community and make WHS 2011 the way they wanted, then a year after launch announce it is finished (although it still has mainstream support till 2018), then the whole Windows 8 debacle (no matter what side youre on, I think we can all agree it is a debacle), and now finally the whole deluded requirements list they announced with the X-bone.

Hopefully soon they get a clue and realize they need to stop telling their customers what the customers want, and actually listen to their customers.


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## Ahhzz (Jun 20, 2013)

So. Just read this article at Gizmodo, and wanted to get some reaction to his post here. Any thoughts?
http://gizmodo.com/the-xbox-one-just-got-way-worse-and-its-our-fault-514411905


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## Ahhzz (Jun 20, 2013)

Guitarrassdeamor said:


> That's retarded.



yeah, did some searching, and can't seem to find an original quote... I did find some meme with that basic on there, but couldn't find an "official" statement.... probably just more trolling. Eh, like I said "reportedly"    looks like FUD until someone points to something official   Not that I doubt that some assnut from M$ _would _have said that, just can't find it


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## newtekie1 (Jun 20, 2013)

Ahhzz said:


> So. Just read this article at Gizmodo, and wanted to get some reaction to his post here. Any thoughts?
> http://gizmodo.com/the-xbox-one-just-got-way-worse-and-its-our-fault-514411905



My thoughts?  I'll gladly accept the need to walk to my console and put a disc in it every time I want to play a game in exchange for the ability to freely trade the games.  I refuse to believe that America(or the World) has become so lazy that we will make a big deal about the need to get up off the couch, walk 10 feet to the console and 10 ft back.  The author is just trying to find a negative where there is none.


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## KainXS (Jun 20, 2013)

alot of what he says are simply his opinions and opinions are opinions, not facts.


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## NdMk2o1o (Jun 20, 2013)

Sony have no better ethics, infact they where one of the first companies to impose draconian DRM, anyone remember the whole Sony rootkit debacle? yet lots of people seem willing to trust them now over MS who haven't actually followed through with their DRM proposals and backed out before they came to fruition as opposed to after the event.... 

I like consoles, their like an extension to my e-peen PC and smartphone lol and I am a media consumer so will likely get one of them at some time to play with for 4-6 months before realising my £40 dvd player and PC can provide me with the same requirement without the hassle of buying yet again another overpriced media system that will be a dust gatherer after the initial buzz has worn off! 

P.S this sounds like sarcasm, though is likely how it will play out, I need to have a "next-gen" console and will likely justify in my head reasons for buying one or the other, though alas it will end up being used to watch movies or let the kids play games on cause they're not getting on my PC  

P.P.S sorry, I am droning on a bit, the vodka does that to me sometimes


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## newtekie1 (Jun 20, 2013)

NdMk2o1o said:


> Sony have no better ethics, infact they where one of the first companies to impose draconian DRM, anyone remember the whole Sony rootkit debacle? yet lots of people seem willing to trust them now over MS who haven't actually followed through with their DRM proposals and backed out before they came to fruition as opposed to after the event....



Oddly enough, a lot of people are crediting this backtracking in large part to the fact that Sony didn't play ball with Microsoft and implement the same policies like Microsoft was hoping Sony would.

And I wouldn't say Sony has had any draconian DRM.  They have been pioneers in DRM, but not draconian.  I wouldn't even say the rootkit issue was draconian, it was pretty much the same DRM that was being used in the software industry at the time, DRM that had been in use for quite a while before Sony started doing it.


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## WhiteLotus (Jun 21, 2013)

IF they removed these "features" (I used the word lightly) then they can so easily put them back again. Wait a couple years and you'll see a new update that complies with some bull shit court ruling and you wont be able to play offline.

Also not allowing used games was just out right stupidity. No beyond stupidity, moronic. Do they not realise that second hand retailers like GameStop and the like are the ones that are selling the consoles in the first place, and publishers fall over themselves to make sure they please GameStop by including some stupid DLC if you pre-order from them and not other retailers. 

BAH the whole thing stinks.


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## Frag_Maniac (Jun 21, 2013)

It was weird to see Angry Joe rant at hecklers this time instead of MS.

[yt]xcXdWRJ-xb4[/yt]


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