# P4 2.4C overclocking questions



## thegave (Feb 16, 2008)

There's a 2.4C on ebay that goes up to 3.6 easily on stock volts. But I don't know if my TCCD will be able to handle 300mhz, so if I used a 3:2 divider my memory would be running at stock speeds, right?

If my memory is only running at 200mhz then do I lose the benefit of having an overclocked FSB?

Also, what would perform better, a 2.4C OC'd to 3.6 (or beyond) or a 3.4C that.. I don't know how high they clock, 3.8 at best? Ordinarily I know the 2.4 would win because of the much higher FSB but if memory is being run with a divider how does that change things?

How likely is the 2.4C to be able to go beyond 3.6GHz / 300MHz FSB... ?


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## cdawall (Feb 16, 2008)

your TCCD will do 300mhz just fine timings 3-4-4-8 and 2.8-2.9v and you should have it


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## thegave (Feb 16, 2008)

Doesn't loosening the timings so much negate a lot of the performance benefits of higher clocks?

I'm guessing then that 2.4@3.6 with 300MHz FSB 1:1 will be faster than a 3.4 at 3.8?


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## cdawall (Feb 17, 2008)

should be the FSB will be higher and the ram will be clocked higher

as for the ram it will be very similar to DDR800 4-4-4-12 running DDR600 3-4-4-8 loosing the timings wont negate the performance that much


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## thegave (Feb 17, 2008)

What would stop me at 3.6, if the CPU was still on stock vcore? Ram? If I wanted to go beyond 300MHz FSB for higher CPU clocks... Would it be counter-intuitive to run the RAM in a divider to get higher a CPU clock?

Btw is 1.512v stock vcore for a 2.4C?


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## revin (Feb 17, 2008)

Seem's like I was able to boot my 2.4c 30 capper @about 325 @ 1.625v w/the OCZ 500EB's. but did do the 300 1:1 @1.6v very easy and even tried 3.3.2.6, but it was not as good as the 3.4EE at stock 1:1

 You could run the 5:4, as I did with the 3200XLPT's w 2.2.2.5 and even the C2PT's, albeit at 2.3.3.6.

 It may just be a crap shoot as to how it turns out.

 I have went backwards to 2 gigs 4x512 DDR400, instead of 2 or 4 x1024.
 I was able to get 2.3.2.6 with the 4x1024 @ 218/222FSB on the EE, but the 4x512 @220 and 2.2.2.5 has give me the slight edge for performance, but I do see a slight differance in inittal startup w/the smaller amount of ram.

 It seems that differant boards like strange setups.


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## revin (Feb 17, 2008)

thegave said:


> What would stop me at 3.6, if the CPU was still on stock vcore? Ram? If I wanted to go beyond 300MHz FSB for higher CPU clocks... Would it be counter-intuitive to run the RAM in a divider to get higher a CPU clock?
> 
> Btw is 1.512v stock vcore for a 2.4C?



 1.525 for my newwer 30 capper 8/1/04 Malay chip


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## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

Generally speaking lowering the memory bus will negate the frequency or FSB being raised. Any overclock will not be noticeable on newer applications and games due to the processor being a major bottle neck and therefore rendering the overclock pointless. Your better of investing in the cheapest motherboard and core 2 duo setup


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## revin (Feb 17, 2008)

Darren said:


> Generally speaking lowering the memory bus will negate the frequency or FSB being raised. Any overclock will not be noticeable on newer applications and games due to the processor being a major bottle neck and therefore rendering the overclock pointless. Your better of investing in the cheapest motherboard and core 2 duo setup



 I agree, 'bout the only way to get the best bang on that platform is a EE, and only then if you can get lucky enough to get 1 like I did for new OEM $122 shipped[ guy had 100 of them on Express like that!!]

 Another thing is that if that board has any form of PAT, using the 667 bootstrap tricks the mem, and gives the performance boost.

 Again, there was a huge differance from the C @ 300 1:1 and the EE@200 1:1

Unless its a real great buy [less that $100], think if you really want to stay in that platform.
I ended up haveing to get the top of line of everything to just get my 865PE to the entry level of the newer platforms, ......... you really wanna spend that kind of money  

 You have a very good system now, and really a CPU[ an EE hopefully ] would be 'bout the only thing that you would need to get a boost, if you wanted to "hang" in there for a while longer.
I dont have any of the hardcore new games to play, but this machine serves my family very very nicely, and the graphics in BZII os outstanding, as are newer demo's,  and even when I had the 2.4C and the BFG 7800 w the XLPT's, it was really nice too.

 Just depend on "whatcha wanna spend"   now or later


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## hat (Feb 17, 2008)

Ummm... no.
If the processor is a bottleneck, overclocking it will make it less of a bottleneck.


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## Darren (Feb 17, 2008)

hat said:


> Ummm... no.
> If the processor is a bottleneck, overclocking it will make it less of a bottleneck.



Just because it's less of a bottleneck doesn't mean the overclock is worthwhile, justifiable or financially feasible.


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## FR@NK (Feb 17, 2008)

Ummmm havent you heard of the pentium M chips? They are the best you get for that asus board. Faster then any other chip in gaming on that socket.

http://techreport.com/articles.x/8585/5


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## revin (Feb 17, 2008)

Corsair XMS3200C2PT 2x512 220 5:4......................................................................................................Same w/ 1:1 BUT using the 667 BootStrap= PAT fully enabled










And here's a shot of 204FSB w 5:4 divider






The biggest gain is not just from the higher FSB, but in this case, the PAT being enabled as in an 875 board.
Again your'e miliage will vary


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## revin (Feb 17, 2008)

FR@NK said:


> Ummmm havent you heard of the pentium M chips? They are the best you get for that asus board. Faster then any other chip in gaming on that socket.
> 
> http://techreport.com/articles.x/8585/5



Damn that hot!!!!!

There you go, that's gotta be a winner!!!!! And if you can enable PAT, whoa baby!

Reminds me of my slot1[BX6 Rev.2] to flip chip[Abit sloket]. Still have that whole setup and even the Golden Orb!!!

Did a P3 FC600[66fsb] celery to 928[100fsb] and then got ahold of a rare FC1Ghz 100FSB chip, and believe it or not there was an extreme differance.

 All because of haveing twice as many pipelines enabled on the P3 vs. 1/2 on the celery.

EDIT:

Did I understand that right that it's a 400/533 only chipper?


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 17, 2008)

Forget about overclocking a 2.4C to the extreme.  If you dont want to do a whole system rebuild... try and find a Gallatin 3.2EE or 3.4EE.  You can just "drop it in" for a great system boost... and overclock it a bit if you want.

If you end up spending more than EUR 70 or $100, then, like many others here, I truely recommend you move over to Core 2 platform.  It makes a BIG difference in performance... and is lower power... and quieter to cool.

Consider an ASROCK Conroe865PE.  This board will let you use your existing DDR, and your X1950AGP, and move to Q6600 G0.  Just get one off ebay. Make sure the BIOS is 1.70 and enjoy the performance improvement. I moved from Gallatin 3.2EE to the Q6600 transferring all my stuff over. There is a BIG performance hike on the Q6600. It's worth the extra spend and OS reinstall to do it.


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## cdawall (Feb 17, 2008)

i have a s478 P4 prescott 3ghz if you want it


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## thegave (Feb 17, 2008)

Damn those Q6600s are expensive. 

I'm sure it will be a huge performance boost. Hm. Are there any boards similar to the ASRock? None on eBay and Google Products only gives me one retailer which says it's discontinued. 

cdawall thanks but no thanks, I already have the 3.4 Northwood which I think will do just as well? Plus shipping will be a bitch. I'm following an untested 3.4EE on the 'bay at the moment... If it stays under 20 pounds I'll probably give it a bid.


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 17, 2008)

If you are worried about the Q6600 price... then wait until April... then the Q6700 comes down to the same price... so you get a lot more for your money.

Also consider the E4xxx range Dual Core. They overclock nicely and will also be much better than the P4EE.


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## thegave (Feb 17, 2008)

Thinking about it I don't mind shelling for a G0 now since the motherboards are quite cheap... The only problem is finding one, can't find the ASRock anywhere... 

Are there any other alternatives that support Quad cores, DDR and AGP? I've found a few boards that only have 2x DDR and 2x DDR2 but I want to use all 2gb of my ram... =(

Oh and I know the Pentium-M chips are amazing. I'm using one at the moment... A 2.0GHz 400MHz FSB powered laptop. But a)Another P-M would be frucking expensive, and b)I want to keep using this laptop so I'm not going to take the proc out.


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## imperialreign (Feb 17, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> If you are worried about the Q6600 price... then wait until April... then the Q6700 comes down to the same price... so you get a lot more for your money.
> 
> Also consider the E4xxx range Dual Core. They overclock nicely and will also be much better than the P4EE.



I'm not even really sure you get that much more with a Q6700 than you do with a Q6600 - the only difference I've seen, based on Intel's spec sheets, is that the Q6700 runs a x10 multiplier, wheras the Q6600 runs a x9.  Aside from that, the two CPUs appear identical.

But, I'm sure when the 6700 drops in price, the 6600 will drop a bit, too.


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## thegave (Feb 17, 2008)

Two more questions:

Are G0 and SLACR the same thing? I know G0 is stepping and SLACR S-spec, but do G0 steppings have other s-specs or vice versa?

And secondly, why did ASRock go with the Springdale and not the Canterwood chipset?


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 17, 2008)

1./ You say "Q6600, G0 stepping" or you say "SLACR".  Same thing

2./ Canterwood (875) chipset was 50% more expensive than Springdale (865).  Canterwood also had "PAT" technology and EEC. Springdale didnt. Caterwood targeted at servers and workstations. ASROCK is a budget mb manufacturer and does more mainstream stuff rather than premium stuff. However ASROCK also do some fancy innovation, like the mixed DDR/DDR2 boards, or the socket 478 with PCI x16, or socket 775 with AGP.  They deserve credit for thinking out of the box.


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## thegave (Feb 17, 2008)

I'm guessing there's no alternative then for AGP on S775..

How is overclocking on ASRock boards? Is there any point going for a G0 if the board won't be able to stretch it? Does ASRock not do the Bios-mod thing to enable PAT on Springdales?


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 17, 2008)

The 865 chipset is already being overclocked to get to the 1066 FSB. 865 was only designed for 400/533/800 so getting to 1066 is already a good overclock for the chipset.

What this means in practice is that the Core 2 chip you put in there is going to run pretty much at stock. You will get some overclock if you try... but the mainboard isnt going to give you the mega-overclocks that a modern mb can.

Dont worry though. A stock Q6600 or whatever is still a HUGE improvement over your existing system.  I'm running one and I'm quite satisfied.

PAT is not such a big deal.  It was more a marketing feature.  It typically added just 3% performance improvement clock-for-clock. What was important was the lower latency... but with a Core you already have a BIG cache with very low latency, so PAT is going to be making less than a 3% difference like it did with the P4.

You'll get much more performance out of the Conroe865PE by using one of the new SATA HDDs like the 32MB cache Samsung F1.


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## thegave (Feb 17, 2008)

=0

aren't those drives like 1TB? sod that. the conroe865pe only does sata1.5 anyway... 

I don't understand how the memory runs at 400 with the fsb at 1066... Special divider?

I can imagine the jump from a P4C to a Quad-core being quite large.. I'm not sure if I'm in this more for the tweaking and overclocking or for the gaming performance and that's one thing I'll have to decide. 

I guess if I go down this route then it doesn't really matter what stepping Q6600 I get then. 

I've been trying for hours but I can't get the German listed mobos to show up through the UK website? I've tried filtering results by both EU and Worldwide but nothing comes up.


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## cdawall (Feb 18, 2008)

what about the PT880 boards?

from all the reviews i read they not only oc'd better but the offered better performance


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## thegave (Feb 18, 2008)

? From what I remember all the Via ASRock boards only had 2 dimms...

Find one that has four =)


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## cdawall (Feb 18, 2008)

thegave said:


> ? From what I remember all the Via ASRock boards only had 2 dimms...
> 
> Find one that has four =)



they all have 4 2 DDR1 dimms and 2 DDR2 dimms

but that wont help you sell your 4x512 here and pick up a 2x1024 of DDR2


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## thegave (Feb 18, 2008)

The one lemonade recommended has 4x DDR... 

Just found out the 3.4 I got is a 30cap (SL793)... Supposed to clock real good. I think I'll take my XP-120 and the breezy cool winter air and see how high I can push it. May very well stick to this setup because it's a bit of a pain tbh selling everything on and sourcing the new hardware. But quad-core... Mmm


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 18, 2008)

1./ The Samsung 32MB 750GB SATA2 drives are less than GBP100.  SATA2 works fine on SATA1 mainboards.  The SATA2 interface is "overspecced".... no SINGLE HDD is going to pump through that amount of data.    On a quick benchmark the F1 is TWICE as fast as the PATA Samsung 7200.7 it replaces.

2./ At 1066 FSB the memory is on a 5:4 divider, although there are BIOS hacks available to run it at 1:1 if you gave DDR500 memory.

3./ Go to the german ebay site and find search for conroe865pe and see what comes up. Use your regular login and bid. Most german guys who sell PC equipment speak english... so send them a message to check if they will ship to UK.  The "buy a new one" link I gave you ships worldwide.

FYI, my setup:

Q6600 G0 on Conroe865PE, BIOS 1.70
4x512MB Corsair XMS
Samsung 750GB F1
ATI FireGL X3-256 AGP.  (I have problems getting past POST with this GPU so I am currently running an X800 until I can fix the issue.  I might upgrade to AGP 3850 since it's only GBP 120 to do so)


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## thegave (Feb 18, 2008)

how much OC are you getting out of the G0?

Is that PC3200XL you're using?

Haa the F1 sounds very fun.. but is another excuse for me to spend money.. =/

Hah what the f? Do people not sell harddrives on ebay? [edit] Nevermind haha found one for £77 in London so may be able to save on the £10 shipping... Goddamnit. [edit2] F that, it's one of those VAT-not-included auctions and doesn't offer collection... [edit3] Nah none of the HD753LJ are under £100. Maybe I'll pick one up when I'm stateside.

BTW it's not the buying thats a pain. I've found all the German listed ones, and the French ebay site doesn't have any. I have shipping prices for all of them. The problem is getting rid of my old stuff to make money to buy the new stuff =/

The reason I'm tempted to go this route is because then it reduces the CPU bottleneck and opens up the possibility of upgrading to a HD3850 or even newer if Sapphire etc decide to continue release AGP cards. But <£120, where? Is this in the US?

No second hand AGPs and cheapest new is £154.


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 18, 2008)

http://geizhals.at/deutschland/

Type what you want in the box... watch the results.

Currently:  

Q6600 G0 = EUR 188
Samsung F1 = EUR 112
AGP 3850 = EUR 157

All those prices INCLUDE local VAT @19%

Are you getting ripped off in Britain? LOL


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## thegave (Feb 18, 2008)

Yes. Really hard.

Does that website ship int'l? Then I wouldn't have to pay the 19% hahahahahaha!

What's special about the Samsung F1's with KIT appended to the product code?

Are you German?


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 18, 2008)

You need to have an EU VAT registration number to avoid the 19% VAT, otherwise... either it is paid in DE, or you have to pay the 17.5% when it arrives in customs in the UK.

KIT means WITH cables etc. (typically the retail boxed product). Otherwise, just a BARE drive shipped in a plastic carrier.

ENGLISH.


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## thegave (Feb 18, 2008)

Are the bare drives OEM?

Hahahhaha the site is called Cheapskate..

How good are the LGA775 3.73GHz EE cpus? There's one on the bay for quite cheap, and I was thinking if I got the ASRock board I could get that CPU as a stopgap and wait for Q6600 prices to drop..

?


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## revin (Feb 19, 2008)

*lemonadesoda........*


thegave said:


> how much OC are you getting out of the G0?
> 
> Is that PC3200XL you're using?



 Since me and thegave,[and some others] are in the ball park in AGP systems, could you please give us Aqua, Fur, and 3Dm06 '05 results to compare to?

 Especially since i;m the most maxed out with the EE and Bliss on a canterwood killer springdale board, when I have the PAT again utilizied it's not that shabby of a system.

  When I compared '06 video scores[less the cpu] i've still got a competive system that reaches up into pci-e x16 scores.

 I dont think that even getting whatever may be the "baddest" AGP card now, compared to my "crippled 7900" would give me a real differance, other than mabey a few more #'s?

FWIW, my system "feels" faster with the 4x1024 Dimms, but it sure did a lot better in the bench with the new 4x512, and mainly due to having the PAT to perform as it is designed to

 To me it appears that I'd have to step quite a big jump to gain a realworld cost effective system from where i'm at now.

 I'm not talking about just getting better "CPU" marks or just "video" marks, but an entire unit.

 I dont have any of these newest games, but that demo of frozen planet or whatever it is, was very nice.


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 21, 2008)

Your request is really a GPU not a CPU benchmark.  At the moment, I cant get my FireGL-X3 to work on the Conroe865PE. If I have some spare time, I'll try editting the BIOS and then running the tests you requested.

In the meantime, why not try cinebench10, a CPU test: Rendering (x CPU) = 9784 CB-CPU

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showpost.php?p=669253&postcount=250

Or the WinRAR benchmark: 632 kb/sec







Compare your results to mine, and post.


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## thegave (Feb 22, 2008)

Well it seems like I can get my 3.4 Northy no higher than about 3.8... Laxed the timings to 3-4-4-8 vdimm 2.85 vcore 1.7v and it still refuses to boot into windows... 

So, would a 2.4 at 3.6 with 300MHz FSB perform faster than a 3.4 at 3.7?


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 22, 2008)

^^ just run cinebench, winrar, and superpi tests on your machine and decide whether all this Northwood overclocking is worth it.

IMO... If you have a P4... and have a *need for speed* then time to upgrade to Core 2 platform.  The P4 is still a great machine... use it as your #2, or for productivity software, etc. But if you need high scores on benchmarks or you are running modern games... REALLY... do the upgrade. A 15-35% speedup on overclocking a P4 is timewasting compared to 150%-300% improvement by going Core 2 Quad.

P.S. Previous to my Core 2 Quad, I moved from P4 3.0 to P4 3.2EE Gallatin.  Those chips were $1000+ on launch.  I paid $200 for my P4 when I got it, and $100 for the P4EE on ebay just a couple of months ago. The upgrade to P4EE was great... 10-30% depending on the application. But wtf is 30% when you can get 300% by going Core 2 Quad. In hindsight, buying the P4 3.2EE was a waste of time.


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## thegave (Feb 23, 2008)

If I get the Q6600 I will waste the exact same amount of time (if not more) doing exactly what I'm doing now, which is trying to squeeze every last drop of juice out of it. I don't know why but I have this problem with trying to speed shit up.

All I play are GTA San Andreas, COD4 and TF2 which all run fine at stock speeds. Yet I still did the 1.47v gpu mod and now I'm stability testing it at stock to make sure it hasn't destabilised my card. I just have this addiction with souping shit up. It's terrible, it's a waste of time and I hate it.


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 23, 2008)

I understand the addiction. But if you are going to squeeze... then start squeezing something worth squeezing. Really, IMO, upgrade is worth the fun.


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## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

thegave said:


> Well it seems like I can get my 3.4 Northy no higher than about 3.8... Laxed the timings to 3-4-4-8 vdimm 2.85 vcore 1.7v and it still refuses to boot into windows...
> 
> So, would a 2.4 at 3.6 with 300MHz FSB perform faster than a 3.4 at 3.7?
> 
> ...



Get that vcore under 1.7!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

3.8 is a strecth for the skt 478 24/7 even at 1.65v.

Keep working the the things as PM'd, and try for 218 1.625 and see if all 4 dimms will retain 2.2.2.5 2/max vdimm

Not sure what the H/D errors are at this time, but a fresh format might help get a clean BoH


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## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> Your request is really a GPU not a CPU benchmark.
> 
> Compare your results to mine, and post.



Dont have aclue as to what i'm doing w/ it!!

 It appears that this ole dog aint too shappy after all eh

I just typed in my cpu speed???? !!!~~?? [212FSB]






And O/C to 220FSB






 It appears that this ole dog aint too shappy after all eh !!?????
Great vid score for an OpGL = 5323
Single CPU not too far off from you, 

BUT that Multi you ran KILLS it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

And WinRAR test
212FSB = 518





And 220FSB = 545


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## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

lemonsoda::

And since were both on an 865 board, how do the mem B/W compare??
Will the C2d make a differance?
CTIAW






Everst


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 24, 2008)

Memory read/write/copy driven by memory clock. Mine is 200Mhz. Yours is 220Mhz, ie 10%. If you look at your memory figures, you are indeed better on average due to your basic memory clock.

But look at the cache figures (CPU dependent). Your CPU clock is about 40% higher. Your L1 cache read rate is indeed 40% higher. So clock for clock there is parity. (I was surprised, becuase I though the Q6600 G0 was a more efficient cache than net burst. It seems NOT for "read").

But look at Write and Copy. The Q6600 PWNS your P4EE, even with your P4EE being 40% higher clock!

L2 is pretty much similar performance, but the Q6600 has 2x4MB of it, and you have 512K. Your extra 2MB of L3 doesnt make up the difference... since the L3 is about twice the latency and 50% of the speed of L2.

You HAVE got a great machine there. As good as a P4/S478 can get 

But the Q6600 will meet or beat your machine in single-thread... and PWN on multiple thread or multi-tasking.

There REALLY is a *feel* difference to regular desktop use with the Q6600. As I mentioned before, I used to have (or still have in my #2 machine) a P4 3.2EE.  The Q6600 is significantly different experience in real life use. Great examples are in productivity software like Word/Excel that I use a lot. While working on a document, there is not a lot of difference since with the UI a regular P3 is even enough. But PRINT, or PDF a document, and the Q6600 does this like lightening.

Running multiple applications (like explorer over multiple drives/directories, iexplorer, office, etc) makes a big difference. There is no *wait* in one window while a task is being completed in another. Makes every day use much better. There's none of that fraction-of-a-second wait that tends to slow th USER's brain down over prolonged use. Everything is instantaneous.

NOTE
The Conroe865PE is limited to 300FSB. This is probably a sensible limit for the 865 without killing the thing.  Without a BIOS hack, the memory is locked 3:2, meaning with 300FSB the memory is at 200. BIOS mods are available for 1:1 timing, but then DDR memory is not happy at 300/600DDR. So dialling the FSB back to 266 would be possible, but its better to run a faster CPU FSB with a big cache and slower memory than slower CPU and faster memory.


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## thegave (Feb 24, 2008)

Any time you feel like getting rid of the 3.2ee... pm me =)


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 24, 2008)

SECOND COMMENT

Look: I#ve got the 865 running at FSB300. You are still at 220. I think you have some headroom for further overclock if you could ONLY cool that hot P4EE.  Perhaps a SLOWER P4EE with a HIGHER overclock would be better if the CPU cannot go more than 3.6/7.

e.g. P4EE3.0 at FSB 250 and memory at 250. That would definitely be nastier.

THIRD THOUGHTS

I better check that passive heatsink on my 865 at load. At idle it is finger cool... but I better check I dont fry it when rendering/gaming.


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## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> Memory read/write/copy driven by memory clock. Mine is 200Mhz. Yours is 220Mhz, ie 10%. If you look at your memory figures, you are indeed better on average due to your basic memory clock.
> There's none of that fraction-of-a-second wait that tends to slow th USER's brain down over prolonged use. Everything is instantaneous.



 Stock.............................................................................................................................................................220









Here's a stock run.

You have now better abeled people to understand the advancements in technology!
 And its nice to see where some of the differances are, and to have them explained in terms for most common people to understand Thank you

 Also how do you see the results of the cinebench, and rar test?  albeit it's overclocked, but as old vs new?


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## thegave (Feb 24, 2008)

lemonade are you sure there's a 3.0EE? I've found a 3.2EE on ebay for 28 pounds Buy It Now seller claims its working.. I'm slightly hesitant.


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## lemonadesoda (Feb 24, 2008)

@thegave
OMG 3.2EE for 28 pounds!!!??? I dont think that can be right. I just searched for it on ebay and didnt see it. Send me the link and I'll check it out for you. Seems dodgy at that price... they normally go between 70-100 pounds second hand.

P.S. Check it ISNT a 3.2 Prescott, but a 3.2 Gallatin with L3 cache.

I think you are right... there isnt a 3.0EE. However, does your 3.4EE have an UNLOCKED MULTIPLER? If it does... and your mainboard allows you to UNDERCLOCK it, then take the multiplier DOWN to 15x. (ie. 3.0Ghz on FSB 200). Check it works ok. Then crank the FSB up to 250FSB. You'll get much better benchies ;-)

*****
@revin

Thanks for the stock figures. Interesting comparison.

Look at your CINEBENCH xCPU (multiple cpu score). This shows the value of Hyperthreading. 1.18x = 18% improvement. Not bad. But NOTHING compared to a true second, third or fourth core. 

PS. I have my Q6600 cooled by a Zalman 9500 with fan running at 1500RPM. It's practically silent. How noisey is your P3.4@3.7 P4EE?

Send me a superpi. Heres mine:


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## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> @thegave
> OMG 3.2EE for 28 pounds!!!??? I dont think that can be right. I just searched for it on ebay and didnt see it. Send me the link and I'll check it out for you. Seems dodgy at that price... they normally go between 70-100 pounds second hand.
> 
> P.S. Check it ISNT a 3.2 Prescott, but a 3.2 Gallatin with L3 cache.
> ...



Yhats freaking sweet!!
i got 1 posted here somewhere, 34 sec or so

Skt 478 EE Multi's are 3.2EE=16x  3.4EE=17x and the ES EE's[enginering samples] multi 12-17

Thank you again for staying in and helping us, and good thought about checking his multi, I never thought about, and even been going back and forth like crazy with PM's, for tweaking the board/ram/pat...............


----------



## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

FYI had about 7 IE 7's open and a 1 had 8 tabs, another 4, and all of a sudden, bam got the ole temp spikes, and started the intermiten stutters.

TaskedM'd a couple items but the temps are still hanging up there!
Gotta do a reboot
................................................................................8 min later...............heres after the reboot, defi got an ie7 issue, it hung me after the reboot keep getting BAD POOLER CALL error


----------



## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

Another thing, any1 understand this overflow bla bla

enabled.....................................................................................................................................................................disabled??


----------



## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

Another thing, do the EE search for  the EE's as

SL7AA =for 3.2EE skt478

SL7CH =for 3.4EE skt478 Theres 1 now but $255 bid, the others are all well over $300


----------



## thegave (Feb 24, 2008)

I made damn sure I wasn't reading my shit wrong... I have the stepping codes for 3.2EE and 3.4EE memorised because I search ebay a couple times a day for them to pop up

Listing is here:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....m=290209179099&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=019

As you can see I decided to go for it, because on the one hand if it isn't a 3.2EE I can probably claim it as an Item Not Described, and if it IS a 3.2EE then i can keep it and sell my 3.4Northy for at least as much. There's one at the moment up to 33 pounds.


----------



## revin (Feb 24, 2008)

thegave said:


> I made damn sure I wasn't reading my shit wrong... I have the stepping codes for 3.2EE and 3.4EE memorised because I search ebay a couple times a day for them to pop up
> 
> Listing is here:
> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI....m=290209179099&ssPageName=STRK:MEWN:IT&ih=019
> ...




DAMN dude you nailed it!
It says right there in the title "Tested working Perfectly"
thats the ticket, and PayPal should back you up also.


----------



## revin (Feb 25, 2008)

Lemonsoda

how do you read my video score??

TBH i didnt understand any of it till u explained like that 18% stuff.

Boy howdy thegave hit it good!


BTW I take it thats a cheap price like what in $USD?


----------



## thegave (Feb 25, 2008)

It's probably around $56 but I'll see what happens keep my fingers crossed I don't get ripped off. 

My 3.4 isn't an Engineering Sample, if it were you guys would've probably never heard the end of it from me. There was one on ebay though, and I was watching/thinking about bidding but then I stumbled across the EE instead. 

Hopefully I'll be able to get the £30 back selling off my 3.4.

Which brings me to another question: My Optiplex, which I'm planning to sell off as a full system, came with a 2.8GHz cpu. Would it be better (make more money?) to stick the 3.4 into the Dell and sell that as a unit and sell the 2.8 on its own or the other way around?


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 25, 2008)

WOW. You got an UNBELIEVABLE DEAL there. Looks liket the item was sold by someone that didnt know what they had. Selling it as a regular P4, didnt know they had an EXTREME. That would normally sell 3-4x the asking price. 

@revin

Your OpenGL is a good score... better than my X800SE. But then the X800SE isnt that amazing either.  I cannot get my FireGL X3-256 to boot on the Conroe865PE. I cannot understand why.

I'll take a look on the nets for people running similar CPU as me, but with cards like X1950 or X2600XT to see how much better they are.

I would imagine with your card, and a Q6600, you'd be in the 6000 figure, since you are scaling with your overclock, albeit with diminishing returns.


----------



## thegave (Feb 25, 2008)

That's what I figured. Anyhoo, can't wait for it to arrive..


----------



## cdawall (Feb 25, 2008)

and you see just how much single channel ram and a crappy stick of TCCC holds back my system :shadedshu

i will have a s478 P4HT run soon


----------



## cdawall (Feb 25, 2008)

here is with a s775 PD930@stock

ran in safemode






ran in normal OS boot






in comparo with the Q6600 and P4EE



revin said:


> lemonsoda::
> Everst





lemonadesoda said:


> Memory read/write/copy driven by memory clock. Mine is 200Mhz. Yours is 220Mhz, ie 10%. If you look at your memory figures, you are indeed better on average due to your basic memory clock.
> 
> But look at the cache figures (CPU dependent). Your CPU clock is about 40% higher. Your L1 cache read rate is indeed 40% higher. So clock for clock there is parity. (I was surprised, becuase I though the Q6600 G0 was a more efficient cache than net burst. It seems NOT for "read").
> 
> ...


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 25, 2008)

I am always stunned at how *rubbish* Prescott and Presler were. Look at cdawall's numbers with a CPU that is 2 generations later than Northwood/Gallatin and on s775 rather than s478 and it is not any faster at stock, and SLOWER when Northwood/Gallatin is overclocked.

What a rip off Prescott and Presler were. Terrible value for money. Moore's law was going horribly wrong for Intel for a few years there... but

Intel has however FULLY REDEEMED itself with Core 2 Quad. Amazing performance and not only back on track with Moores law, but MADE UP for the lost years of Prescott and Presler.


----------



## cdawall (Feb 25, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> I am always stunned at how *rubbish* Prescott and Presler were. Look at cdawall's numbers with a CPU that is 2 generations later than Northwood/Gallatin and on s775 rather than s478 and it is not any faster at stock, and SLOWER when Northwood/Gallatin is overclocked.
> 
> What a rip off Prescott and Presler were. Terrible value for money. Moore's law was going horribly wrong for Intel for a few years there... but
> 
> Intel has however FULLY REDEEMED itself with Core 2 Quad. Amazing performance and not only back on track with Moores law, but MADE UP for the lost years of Prescott and Presler.



that presler is also running @ 3-3-3-8 on the ram and its an i865 vanilla not PE

and beats the read scores of your Q6600 with lower timings and a 865PE board?


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

more reasons not to buy prescott

it would be better but i cant get the mobo to run dual channel it already took forever getting the ram to work right turns out when your ram comes up as AMD on an intel it doesnt like that so i flashed both stick to the same thing and now it a pair of centon DDR333 sticks instead of a AMD DDR266 stick and a centon DDR400 stick 







butr the cahce seems to run just as fast as revins


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 26, 2008)

No faster at same clocks. In fact, on same clock, the Q6600 on 865PE is still 10% faster clock-for-clock than your Presler D930.  

Anyway, you are looking at the WRONG figures. We are talking CPU, not memory! We are all on 865 platform, so no point discussing regular memory reads.  (They will be pretty much identical clock-for-clock).

No, you need to compare CPU power which is my point. Check cache speeds, and check benchmarks.

cdawall, please do a superpi run and a cinebench run.


***

Your post above... yes, that's the point. Your cache running the same as revins... but you are 2 generations on from Northwood/Gallatin. That's what is so bad with the Prescotts/Presler (2 Prescotts). Power hungry, hot, but not really any performance lift, other than FIRST TIME two cores on one chip and on a consumer desktop.


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> No faster at same clocks. In fact, on same clock, the Q6600 on 865PE is still 10% faster clock-for-clock than your Presler D930.
> 
> Anyway, you are looking at the WRONG figures. We are talking CPU, not memory! We are all on 865 platform, so no point discussing regular memory reads.  (They will be pretty much identical clock-for-clock).
> 
> ...



will do


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

cdawall said:


> that presler is also running @ 3-3-3-8 on the ram and its an i865 vanilla not PE
> 
> and beats the read scores of your Q6600 with lower timings and a 865PE board?



But to be fair, like he pointed out, look at his L1 he's got about thirty freaking thousand MEGA bites more of thruput than us.

Thats a HUGE differance, even if the timing is twice as slow [.5ns vs 1.1ns]

! thing that it[screenies]/he[lemonsoda] taught me is about WHY it gets so irrirtating when this get's in a lag zone.


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

shit i gotrta stop working 70hr week!!!
didnt see the posting when I started typing

srry guys, 
anyway i guess what i said makes sence


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:
			
		

> Presler (2 Prescotts)



presler=2x cedar mills
smithfield=2x prescott

now onto the SS

no idea were my cinebench for the celly went but it was an unimpressive 1207 if you want proof i will run it again later (please don't want proof it took bloody forever)


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 26, 2008)

^^ LOL

(thanks for doing the benchmarks...ps where is your OpenGL test on CINEBENCH )

See what I mean about performance of the Presler D compared to Northwood/Gallatin  (same-ish) and compared to Core 2 Quad (PAWNED)? Superpi is single thread. 42 secs vs. 19. LOL, and the Q6600 is clocked 10% slower than the D930.

****

>> NOTE.  On anyone with AGP/DDR considering getting a Q6600, I recommed waiting until April when the price of a Q6700 comes down to the same as a Q6600.

Why is that important? Although the multiplier on the Q6700 is only 10x where the Q6600 is 9x, the fact is that we are hitting FSB walls.  On my Conroe865PE I am limited to FSB 300. So my max is CPU 2.7Ghz. With a Q6700 I would be at 3.0Ghz.

Intel really needs to give us a Q6800 with 12x. That would be nice. Unfortunately all their efforts are going on the 1333 and 1600FSB.  But us oldtimers want a higher multiplier on the lower FSB. If only we could HACK the dam Q6600 CPU to make do 12x. It could go there quite easily if you see other peoples success overclock Q6600. Some get it to 4GHz on air!


----------



## thegave (Feb 26, 2008)

Can the Q6700 handle it?


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> WOW. You got an UNBELIEVABLE DEAL there. *Yea baby*
> 
> ,since you are scaling with your overclock, albeit with diminishing returns.



 Not really sure what that means about the returns?

I did see a much higher 3DM06[3d app][but not if Fur OpGL] score with my FSB up from stock to the 220.

The CPU score in it on changed from 811 to 833, but my SM2&3 went up alot.

Anyway thanks for the compliments about my old system, and a big thanks for stopping by and helping explain these things for all of us!!

BTW, any idea about the "overflow" enabled/disabled in the CTIAW screenies?


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

revin said:


> shit i gotrta stop working 70hr week!!!
> didnt see the posting when I started typing
> 
> srry guys,
> anyway i guess what i said makes sence




MAN u guys did it again to me


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> ^^ LOL
> 
> (thanks for doing the benchmarks...ps where is your OpenGL test on CINEBENCH )
> 
> See what I mean about performance of the Presler D compared to Northwood/Gallatin  (same-ish) and compared to Core 2 Quad (PAWNED)? Superpi is single thread. 42 secs vs. 19. LOL, and the Q6600 is clocked 10% slower than the D930.



i didn't feel like running all the test so i just clicked 1cpu and the the xcpu one it is using a FX5700 do you really want to see what an fx5700 scores in opengl?


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 26, 2008)

No idea about CTIAW. I saw your screenies with WRONG info on FSB/mem clocks and can only assume the tool is so out of date for modern chipsets that the info may be bogus.

"diminishing returns"... as you scale your CPU, e.g. 10%, you are getting 10% better scores on CPU benchmark. The OpenGL benchmark increases too, but NOT by as much as 10%. You are GPU bottlenecked. As CPu goes higher, the rate of increase of GPU will get slower and slower.


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 26, 2008)

cdawall said:


> i didn't feel like running all the test so i just clicked 1cpu and the the xcpu one it is using a FX5700 do you really want to see what an fx5700 scores in opengl?


YES! Its a very quick test.


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> YES! Its a very quick test.



ugh i turned that beast off i will run it tomorrow when i have a chance


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

my 7800GS+a64 will have to do for now 







the opengl score is low because the vid card dropped into low power 3D mode :shadedshu which equates to 400/740 for the run


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> No idea about CTIAW. I saw your screenies with WRONG info on FSB/mem clocks and can only assume the tool is so out of date for modern chipsets that the info may be bogus.



Thats the Trick that the Abit GAT and PAT use on the shipset.
Its fooling the board into "thinking" that a CPU/Dram ratio is on 667/mhz, instead of 800, but is really running the Ram at the set FSB{800,860 ect and ram is 400, 430 ect, unlike the 5:4 divider that truley is downclocking the ram.

That make sence??

About the Q chip, still means gotta find an asrock board???


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

cdawall said:


> my 7800GS+a64 will have to do for now
> 
> the opengl score is low because the vid card dropped into low power 3D mode :shadedshu which equates to 400/740 for the run



that cant be that bad for a 16pp card eh?
i take it's the killer bfg, and what'da clock it at?

I can run the crap outta the core in OpGL, mine was at 690 for Fur, and used the 204FSB


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

revin said:


> that cant be that bad for a 16pp card eh?
> i take it's the killer bfg, and what'da clock it at?
> 
> I can run the crap outta the core in OpGL, mine was at 690 for Fur, and used the 204FSB



since the pencil mod didn't take i'm at a lowly 530/740 for gaming but the card only has a 1.2vgpu yours is 1.3-1.4v hence why it puts out more heat and needs all that extra cooling while mine has a low-profile single slot hunk of copper keeping it @45C load 

right now i'm looking for a circuit writer pen but the couple of radioshacks i went to were sold out  but once i get a hold of one 700-770mhz will be stable @1.5vgpu


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

cdawall said:


> yours is 1.3-1.4v hence why it puts out more heat and needs all that extra cooling while mine has a low-profile single slot hunk of copper keeping it @45C load
> 
> right now i'm looking for a circuit writer pen but the couple of radioshacks i went to were sold out



Actually, i'm only a 1.2v card, and cant change in there either!!!!!!!!! But has some killer timings thou!


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

revin said:


> Actually, i'm only a 1.2v card, and cant change in there either!!!!!!!!!



wtf? there is no way thats right!


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

cdawall said:


> keeping it @45C load



revin slaps cdawall for being so cool 

now i'm running................................................
 to bed got 6 more weeks of 12hr on the clock, and 4am rolls around way too fast.



dont beat on me for the joke, or i'll burm my bliss



......................................................................................................................
man youre too fasr for me to keep up!!!!

no really it's true, this thing is a hybreed motha fcukre,

i'ts really a wierd rare item!!!!
and to find 1.2ns Sammy chips was like WTF, evry1 thinks wierd!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

c u all tommorew


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

revin said:


> revin slaps cdawall for being so cool
> 
> now i'm running................................................
> to bed got 6 more weeks of 12hr on the clock, and 4am rolls around way too fast.
> ...



ha i found my problem 3D mode is only 1.1v stupid card 






time to flash on up to 1.2v


----------



## revin (Feb 26, 2008)

pci-e from the bfg???????????

i'll have to get mine back out, cause it's an agp native card,  not like mine with the hsi chip.

i c if i  can upload the bios from it


thegave got youre eye on the post????   !!!!!

i'm waiting on my x540 to show up!!!!!


----------



## cdawall (Feb 26, 2008)

mines not native its got an HSI chip

im trying to flash it to higher clocks/higher vgpu as we speak (thru windows so if this works i will post a nv windows flash how to)


edit-

winflash=no go oh well i guess i will just have to make a bootable usbdrive


----------



## thegave (Feb 26, 2008)

Yeah I'm still here. You guys kind of lost me a page back... And I'm still waiting for my EE.


----------



## revin (Feb 27, 2008)

thegave said:


> Yeah I'm still here. You guys kind of lost me a page back... And I'm still waiting for my EE.



srry i did nean the post delivery

also sory this has gotten sidetracked, but have really learned alot in this thread.

after a trial run thru stock for an evaluation perion,i like to suggest that you run the chip 220@1.6-1.65v, and mabey with only 2 of the xlpt's and will still need max vdim[2.85?]

i really had a hard time keeping my xlpt's stable over 215 even w/3+v !!!

1 thing for sure is these cores will fry at any ungiven time w/1.7v. that has been what a few tech people have informed my


----------



## thegave (Feb 27, 2008)

Reading through a second time I just realised that's what you meant..
Nah still not here yet =( But my sekisui thermal tape came so have been playing with that on my X1950...

I doubt any of the XLPTs will do 220MHz at 2-2-2-5 even individually. =( think they need more powah. might read into the vdimm mod but i can't really be bothered.

how do you get them to 220 then? mess around with the slots?


----------



## revin (Feb 27, 2008)

thegave said:


> how do you get them to 220 then? mess around with the slots?



I had to go w/ 3.0-3.2volts, but they really didnt stay stable.

TBH if you can go about 212-215FSB, that'll be a real great setup..

That's what i'm back at now, but the thing is, I've tried all these other ram's OCZ ddr500 EB's and some other corsair c2pt's,[2x1024 and 2x512 together=3gb, and seperatly] and not even the xlpt's had what these OCZ ELPT Rev2 have!!!!!!!!!

The closest that I had got was the 4x1024, when useing the 667bootstrap, I got PAT fully enabled, but they didnt like to stay at 218+ FSB for long time.


----------



## thegave (Feb 27, 2008)

i would've loved to get some ocz rev2 as well. there were some on ebay a long long time ago but i'd already had one pair of 3200xl's


----------



## revin (Feb 27, 2008)

I think theres something of a ram booster, but not sure how it works???


----------



## thegave (Feb 27, 2008)

yeah but it goes into a dimm slot and i like having 2gb.

intel_igent has one for sale in the F/S forum if you're interested. good price.


----------



## revin (Feb 28, 2008)

thegave said:


> yeah but it goes into a dimm slot and i like having 2gb.
> 
> intel_igent has one for sale in the F/S forum if you're interested. good price.



same boat as u all 4 dimms,'cept my board is super killer adjust to 3.20 vdimm volts!
Abit really put alot of thought into the design of the ai7!

and even have a vcore to 1.95 volts?!?!?!?!?!!!!!!


----------



## cdawall (Feb 28, 2008)

im leaving AGP!


----------



## thegave (Feb 28, 2008)

That's why I wanted an IC7-Max3, but the price and vdimm droop problem put me off.

Even now they sell for about £100 second hand. That was the price of my Asus WITH a 3.4 Northy.

Anyway just got an email back from the seller, said she only put it in the post this morning =( 

But she said she tested it again to make sure it works. So, I guess I can afford to wait. But I'll be away all weekend =(

Sorry to see you go cda =(

Garrr! Now she's saying expect it Saturday (instead of Friday), something about staying late at work...
But I just realised why no one's noticed it before... If you go back to the listing you'll see it's actually listed under Graphics/Video Cards...

Score for me.


----------



## cdawall (Feb 28, 2008)

i have a MSI PT880 based neo2 that is well known to outperform i865PE if you want it


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 28, 2008)

Can you get your PT880 to FSB300? I can on my 865PE ;-P


----------



## cdawall (Feb 28, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> Can you get your PT880 to FSB300? I can on my 865PE ;-P



its s478 and i don't have a good cooler and the cpu is a prescott so i have no idea how high it can go 

but the asrock PT880 LGA775 boards can do 3xxmhz

here is a shot of one with FSB280 and here is a FSB305

neither are mine i found them on HWBOT


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 28, 2008)

№ 1:  IMPRESSIVE 

№ 2:  I wonder how far the 865PE can go...


----------



## revin (Feb 29, 2008)

my 865pe was at 312 w/2.4c, but ram was 5:4. o'yea stock intel cooler ang bfg gs/oc

I might try with this ninja and my ocz ddr 500 eb's again.

ran it for a quick run for a few minutes here recently at 280 like that, but got tired of trying to tweak for 3dm06 and bliss.

might have been partly of that scaleing you,  lemonsoda talked about, i keep trying to push the card into 600+/1600, ahereas i shoulda used higher fsb and stockier timings for the bliss!


----------



## lemonadesoda (Feb 29, 2008)

If you managed to *reach* to 312... then I would say that 300 is a good topline to be running at. There's little point pushing a chipset so hard only to get 3-4% more improvement and have stability problems... and have to play with voltages.  Personally, I DONT agree with overclocking that requires increased voltages. You are taking the CPU/GPU/chipset out of its designed operating range, can fry, get a lot more heat, stability problems, and shortened live. I DO agree with decreasing voltages when you can... either for underclocking silent machines, or using the ability of some Intel processors to operate quite happily at 0.9v rather than stock 1.30v.

If the 865 could get to 350+ FSB, then that would be something else! Then I would HACK the Conroe865PE BIOS to give me 333 as the topline... therefore taking my Q6600 to 3.0Ghz. 

But rather than fry the poor thing... since the 865 is NOT going to be happy above 300, then its probably better to trade my Q6600 and get me a Q6700 with a 10x multipler (after April when the Q6700 prices halve). Then I can get to 3.0Ghz on a 300FSB and I can kick back and relax, since once you get to 3.Ghz, you have *arrived*.


----------



## revin (Mar 1, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> If you managed to *reach* to 312...  correct not stable, but 280-85 was good with 1.650v on the 2.4C 30 capper.
> It was very happy w/275 1.6v.
> Just like this EE, unless I get it on water, theres no sence in trying to keep it at 3.8 or even 3.74, which is very hard to maintain!! and as you have pointed out in this thread, there is a limit where deminishing results vs. life of product!!!!
> If the 865 could get to 350+ FSB, then that would be something else!
> ...



I like that


----------



## thegave (Mar 1, 2008)

craptastic. *Still* not here, even though the seller assured me it was sent Special Delivery on Friday.

Unless SD doesn't do Saturday deliveries.


----------



## revin (Mar 1, 2008)

CRAP

Hang in there!!!!  

BTW a poster at abit mentioned in a bliss thread that it would srtuggle to play cod4, so I just spent about 30min with it maxed and the card at stock and was very smooth!!!

That must be why it's called Goes Like Hell !!!!

That chip will really wake you up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## lemonadesoda (Mar 2, 2008)

http://cgi.ebay.de/ASRock-Conroe-86...yZ131952QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

going cheap (bad search keyword)


----------



## Unleashed (Mar 2, 2008)

Hey guys!

I have a question about P4 2GHz.

Have locked multiplyer on 20x. I'm stuck at 140 FSB and 1.625V, ram set to asynchronous, voltage 2.7 (highest possible), timings 3-4-4-7 (highest possible) at 201MHz (402MHz) - divider 6:4 (DDR:FSB). 
CPU temperatures are from 28C-35C. 

I have some space with vcore voltage till 1.7V + 100mV offset (1.8V peak)
141 FSB goes with 1.675V. 

Do you think I should go any higher with voltages or not to take risk?


----------



## revin (Mar 2, 2008)

revin said:


> 1 thing for sure is these cores will fry at any ungiven time w/1.7v. that has been what a few tech people have informed my


----------



## lemonadesoda (Mar 2, 2008)

Unleashed said:


> Hey guys!
> 
> I have a question about P4 2GHz.
> 
> ...


You have the following chipset:
North Bridge: SiS 648 
South Bridge: SiS 963L 

It is design for MAXIMUM 133FSB. You *might* be able to overclock it to 150, but it wont go much higher than that.  I think vcore is irrelevant... I think the problem is the chipset not the CPU.

Buy a cheap second hand 865PE chipset mainboard. It really will cost you nearly nothing. Then transfer your stuff over. And get that P4 to run at a much higher FSB.  You will also be able to run DDR (dual channel)... that will make a big performance difference too.

Cost of upgrade = approx 15 EUR. (+time to reinstall operating system).


----------



## Unleashed (Mar 3, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> You have the following chipset:
> North Bridge: SiS 648
> South Bridge: SiS 963L
> 
> ...



THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!!! 

There is the f****** bottleneck.... I didn't pay attention, there's information on FSB speed in CPUID and mine is hitting the wall with 533MHz... First READ the "owners" manual carefully!  

lemonadesoda


----------



## thegave (Mar 3, 2008)

Well it's here... Markings on the CPU are correct so she didn't lie...

Gonna grease it up, pop it in and let you know how it runs


----------



## lemonadesoda (Mar 3, 2008)

@unleashed... happy to have helped
@thegave... remember to compare your BEFORE and AFTER benchies


----------



## thegave (Mar 3, 2008)

meh read my system specs..

i'm too good for benching =p

it's booted... the P4 logo now has Extreme Edition written along the side.

um. I guess I should just burn in the proc to make sure it works and everything...

okay off the bat i _lost_ 3 seconds in sp 1m =( but this is with only 210fsb and 512mb ram so i guess sheer clockspeed more than made up the difference in cache.

gona burn in now and do more tweaking later, probably tomorrow


----------



## Unleashed (Mar 3, 2008)

Hey guys!

I'm taking your advice lemonadesoda and buying new MB. Now I'm a little bit confused: AGP 8x 0.8V and 1.5V??!!! what's the deal? I'm having now AGP 8x 1.5V, but let's say ASUS P4P800 and ABIT IS7 has at 0.8V?
Also I have noticed at QDI motherboards it says supports intel northwood from 1.6-2.2 533 FSB, intel 2.0-3.2 800 FSB? Is bios locked or...


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## revin (Mar 4, 2008)

thegave said:


> meh read my system specs..
> 
> i'm too good for benching =p
> 
> ...



Youll need to fool around again to get the PAT working again.

220@1.625v or so should be pretty stable, if not 218 is mainly my 24/7.

Just keep fiddling for PAT, and DO NOT USE 1.7v


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## thegave (Mar 4, 2008)

I don't get the whole fooling around business... *Why??*

And my desktop is on hold while I solve the mystery of the loose cap.

Revin please visit the X1950Pro club thread or the "Get your X1950Pro BIos here" thread to see if you can help me out with my problem


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## revin (Mar 5, 2008)

thegave said:


> I don't get the whole fooling around business... *Why??*
> 
> And my desktop is on hold while I solve the mystery of the loose cap.
> 
> Revin please visit the X1950Pro club thread or the "Get your X1950Pro BIos here" thread to see if you can help me out with my problem




  First i'm clueless about the cap, srry!

About the PAT, i only wanted to suggest that you may need to some of the experiments like we pm'd about that got youre PAT working with the other proccy/ram setup..

 I apologize about not being much help, and hope that I have not upset u about the sitiation

 Hope it all works out very smooth for you,


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## revin (Mar 9, 2008)

Here's a shot of the 3.4EE at 225FSB







And CineBench






And a shot at 230FSB= *3.9Ghz*


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## thegave (Mar 9, 2008)

Holy crap is 230 still at 2-2-2-5 full PAT? Goddamn.

Don't worry, I wasn't upset at you. Just a little annoyed that it's so difficult and tedious to tweak it up.

Don't worry about the cap either, for some reason I had in my mind the idea that you had an X1950. Forgot you had a 7800GS. Partially why I was so eager to try and beat your benchies. Not that that's ever going to happen. 

General question: Does it make sense to have PAT and all that Performance Mode crap enabled even if my timings aren't 2-2-2-5?


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## revin (Mar 9, 2008)

YES,

look back at those eirler everest tables for stock and 667b/s[=pat]
 a big differance

page 1 post 13


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## revin (Mar 9, 2008)

dont tell me the ati is dead???????


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## thegave (Mar 9, 2008)

nah the ATI works fine. I think. But I found a capacitator on the floor that looks like it should be on the vga (same markings, same plastic base thing) but can't work out where it might have gone. 

I know PAT makes a big difference at 2-2-2-5 but will it continue to make the same difference after you loosen the timings? Say I want to go for a higher FSB so I loosen it up to 2.5-3-3-8... Will PAT still help me or does it become useless?

And what the hell! Why isn't there a bootstrap for my board?


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## revin (Mar 10, 2008)

i went right over to that thread that day, but knew that was way out of my knowlage!

After using the Abit GAT settings[PAT] i seen that at least 1 uses 2336 timings, so it appears that it still functions with various timings.
*Also my OCZ DDR500 EBPT's are 3328, and was able to run them in windows at 2326!!!!*
My B/S is found under N/B CPU, not unlike the divider choice. of which I have both







here's a link if u[or any1 else] have an intrest to look it over.
It's a very well though out bios, but coulda used a couple more functions

http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NTQxLDIsLGhlbnRodXNpYXN0


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## revin (Mar 10, 2008)

BTW, i gotta tell ya, i took the pc outside to get those low temps, but it did tell me that I prolly can get at least the 3.9 or more with a water setup.
And that Bliss was just soooo cool!
 It was just to test out the limits mostly.
My 3dm06, came in a little slower??????????????
But the FUR climbed a good deal. Back to having the remps stay cool.


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## revin (Mar 10, 2008)

Cleaned it up alot also, got the Kaza's, and HardCano9 back out!
Just put the 2 AeroCool fans on the bottem.


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## Morgoth (Mar 10, 2008)

you call that clean?


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## revin (Mar 10, 2008)

Morgoth said:


> you call that clean?



I know, but better than before   srry, ill keep workingg on it  gonna get a 4in 1 cage to move the drives soon

TBH, I think hitting 3.9 on air with the EE is a far better post!!!!


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## thegave (Mar 14, 2008)

Why does it say in your bios you have a 3.00?

I thought you run at 2225?

Oh, and what's the harm in running 1.7+ through a P4? Electron-migration?


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## revin (Mar 14, 2008)

thegave said:


> Why does it say in your bios you have a 3.00?
> 
> I thought you run at 2225?
> 
> Oh, and what's the harm in running 1.7+ through a P4? Electron-migration?


 That screenie is from that hardopc link and the 1,7v was from abit forum


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## revin (Mar 15, 2008)

Now i'm home and can see youre screenie,

GREAT JOB !!!!!!

Did ypu try to enable the PAT with memset?

It's off to a great start!!!!

ATI ok now??

o yea the 1.7,  has something to do with just frying the very fine lines inside somehow, it's just a crap shoot on when it happens.

I did the 3.9 with 1.675, prolly coulds tried less, but had very short time to play


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## thegave (Mar 15, 2008)

I don't know why but I just can't get it to run stably on 3.8GHz, even with the laxest timings (3-4-4-8), even though 3.77 runs fine at 2.5-3-3-6 which is much tighter. How does 2MHz FSB make so much difference? Do you think it's a vcore issue? RAM can't handle the speed? Not enough vdimm (2.85)? 

I've heard lowering vdimm helps overclock so I might try that.

With memset I don't understand why PAT is always set to disable when it's enabled in BIOS.. =/ It does work with PAT enabled though, but I don't think I have a SP1m time for it


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 15, 2008)

IMO its best to find your max overclock, ie. 3.77GHz, and dial back 5%, for a permanent fix. ie, although you got it to 3.77, put it at 3.5 default.

Overclocking and *overvolting *are the quickest route to killing an expensive CPU.


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## Mussels (Mar 15, 2008)

thegave said:


> I don't know why but I just can't get it to run stably on 3.8GHz, even with the laxest timings (3-4-4-8), even though 3.77 runs fine at 2.5-3-3-6 which is much tighter. How does 2MHz FSB make so much difference? Do you think it's a vcore issue? RAM can't handle the speed? Not enough vdimm (2.85)?
> 
> I've heard lowering vdimm helps overclock so I might try that.
> 
> With memset I don't understand why PAT is always set to disable when it's enabled in BIOS.. =/ It does work with PAT enabled though, but I don't think I have a SP1m time for it



lots of CPU's (and mobo chipsets) have FSB walls. My mobo can take this quad to around 430 FSB, but a dual in here managed 500 (and people are reporting 550 on 45nm). (this is with lowered multi of course, same overall MHz between tests)


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## thegave (Mar 15, 2008)

=(


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## Mussels (Mar 15, 2008)

thegave said:


> =(


also FSB holes exist - example

400 works, 401 through 403 doesnt. 404+ does.

Its odd, but sometimes something just doesnt like that exact frequency


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## revin (Mar 15, 2008)

Might give this a read, http://www.legitreviews.com/article/43/1/ but from what I have read is that the skt478's will indeed fry over 1.7v, but it was not at any given time. that came from some Guru's  that had lots of experiance, and had something to do with "sudden death of northwood's", which are basaclicly failed EE's.  They also stated that they have very many live for years at 1.65-1.675v is proper air cooled systems. They had no idea why there was no concestiant data about the failure's, just that all had been over 1.7v when occurred.

 For me 212-215 24/7 at default 1.55v.
218 1.6v 12/7, 220 and up 1.65/675, but for short run's

As for the ram on my XLPT's, I had to use 3+ volts to run stable, and again with these 4x512 OCZ's i'm needing to use 2.8 for 215,[430] and 3.0 for 225.
So yes it's a voltage[less] issue for that ram.
I've tried alot of ram to get back to where i'm at now. The 2x1024OCZ ddr500 EB's work pretty well, for me, just tweaked them thru windows after boot, to 2326, and then enabled PAT..

 Could run the 667 B/S to get pat with them also, but default timing was 3328.

I've had to play around ALOT, and still do to find the better "fineline"


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 15, 2008)

For an extra 5% performance its not worth risking a P4EE CPU. Dial back those voltages into the safe-zone


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## thegave (Mar 16, 2008)

Wait so 1.675 is still not safe? How low then, under 1.65?


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## revin (Mar 16, 2008)

The EE was a 1.6v chip, so it's safe to use that, but again you want the lowest volt, for best 24/7 stable performance. I just wanted to point out about the 1.7v death for you.

 I have tried to use up to 1.8v back when I had the same XLPT's, and even 3.2vDimm, but they would not allow me to remain stable.

I feel that for safty sake you have had a good boot, use 3.6 and lowest volt to stable, the EE's seem very happy at that, and for YOU, it's even extra FSB over me!!!!
 When the testing resumes just don't be overzelous and think that more vcore will do the trick, it wont.  The issue I feel is that the ram is indeed holding you back, either lack of voltage, and or combo of many other things.

 I still think you have an awesome rig now, and it will do well for many years!!, and I didn't see a differance playing COD4 at 204FSB vs 218FSB.

FWIW, here's some info that relates to what lemonsoda was talking about the 2 gen newer Prescott's not having much adoo over the ole "EE's" 

SNIP:.................................
Pumpkinierre, I think you are totally wrong on the cause of the Prescott slowdowns. Without getting technical, let me just assure you that it has pretty much everything to do with the 31 stage pipeline in the Prescott compared to the 20 stage pipeline in the Northwood (and P4EE).

The larger cache can help the Prescott overcome the effects of the long pipeline, but in certain types of code, you're basically screwed. Even the branch prediction can't help in some instances. Say a program has a lot of branches, and they're spread over a large enough area that the predictor can't track all of them. If you "overflow" the size of the branch prediction table, then the penalties of the longer pipeline are going to become very apparent.

It appears that games are quite capable of doing this, and Comanche 4 in particular seems to have a lot of unpredictable branch code. Really, though, who cares? Comanche 4? I tried it, and thought it was pretty lame. At least UT2K3 and Q3 are pretty fun to play, even if they're old now. .........................................................................................


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## revin (Mar 16, 2008)

Heres my stock Pi


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## Mussels (Mar 16, 2008)

thats not a bad score, for the often hated P4


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## revin (Mar 16, 2008)

Mussels said:


> thats not a bad score, for the often hated P4



Here's  my 12/7 OC


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## revin (Mar 16, 2008)

Same but using thegaves basic mem config

PS 1.6v, but you can see the flux involved here


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## revin (Mar 16, 2008)




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## Mussels (Mar 16, 2008)

i dont think anyone here uses everest for testing - its orthos or OCCT for CPU and memtest for ram.


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## revin (Mar 16, 2008)

Mussels said:


> i dont think anyone here uses everest for testing - its orthos or OCCT for CPU and memtest for ram.



Yea, it's really outdated, but can give a quick stabiliaty test, but not accurate for  a long term setting. 
  I just wanted to show thegave the voltages, and thru in the temp screenie's.
Thats with 1.6v, but the board run's it about .05v less under load.
But the mem was 2.95, but as with most Abit's, it's slightly higher, but usally remains that steady, whereas the Vcore flux's a bit.

 those run's outside have opened a new door for me, to look into water cooling.
I got a lot of studing to do, but want to go really really simple


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 16, 2008)

Gentlemen,

try out this benchmark with your overclocked P4EE's

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=55244


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## revin (Mar 17, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> Gentlemen,
> 
> try out this benchmark with your overclocked P4EE's
> 
> http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=55244



done


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 17, 2008)

hooooo....... haahahaaaaahaaaaa

ROFL

hhehehehhehe.......haaaa hiiiiiiii 

;P


Whip that P4EE harder baby!


hhhhaaaaa   eeeeeee


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## revin (Mar 17, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> hooooo....... haahahaaaaahaaaaa
> 
> ROFL
> 
> ...





So what did that test info tell you?
Is in line with the cinebench and CPUmark2, and superpi results?

 You seem to pretty good at  decifiering these results.
I really need another cold day outside to get 3.9 to run!!!!!!

It seems too confusing to try to get the proper water cooling setup, especially for that dam Bliss card!!!

I kinda want to get a 3850 now

If I could just find a conroe865 board!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 17, 2008)

revin... dont worry. Your results are fine for a P4, just aweful compared to the Conroe architecture. The x264 test is really a multi-threaded test. There's NO WAY you are going to score any decent numbers with a single core CPU.  Your results are fine... but it does show how much faster, at some tasks, a Qxxxx is than the old P4s.

In most applications, esp. gaming, the code is still (mainly) single threaded. So the P4EE is still a great machine.

But if you want to do any encoding... or if you want to be ready for next years games... then a double/quad core really is becoming the minimum standard.

Remember, I too got a P4EE to upgrade a Northwood. It was noticably better. But a month later i went Q6600 it blew away the P4EE. To be honest, while is was *fun* to own the P4EE that was SO EXPENSIVE and an "ultra CPU" in its time... in 2008... it is a waste of time compared to the alternatives.

I also think that P4EE's are overpriced on the secondhand market. For a cheaper price, you can get a more powerful CPU, by a factor of 2x.  it's a good time (still) to sell them. 

I'm thinking of dumping all my s478 stuff while there is still some "price value". (I've got 4 x s478 machines and and plenty of s478 based "spare stuff").


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## intel igent (Mar 17, 2008)

I need a EE!

Where are they? I looked on eBay but nothing caught my eye


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 17, 2008)

There are LOTS on ebay... either .com, or .co.uk, or .de.  No idea about canada. However, they arent cheap.


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## intel igent (Mar 17, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> There are LOTS on ebay... either .com, or .co.uk, or .de.  No idea about canada. However, they arent cheap.



id like to find 1 close to me that has a buy it now type deal going.

i hate auctions and i hate shipping 

unless i can find one from a forum member


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## revin (Mar 18, 2008)

intel igent said:


> I need a EE!
> 
> Where are they? I looked on eBay but nothing caught my eye



this might be something!!??? shows that it's 312+54 usd though, really steep, but water cooled

http://cgi.ebay.com/Intel-Pentium-4...ryZ96868QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZbuydigisell


another, ships to canada $15
http://cgi.ebay.com/Intel-Pentium-4...ryZ80144QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


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## revin (Mar 19, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> revin... dont worry. Your results are fine for a P4, just aweful compared to the Conroe architecture. The x264 test is really a multi-threaded test. There's NO WAY you are going to score any decent numbers with a single core CPU.  Your results are fine... but it does show how much faster, at some tasks, a Qxxxx is than the old P4s.
> 
> In most applications, esp. gaming, the code is still (mainly) single threaded. So the P4EE is still a great machine.
> 
> ...



 Thanks L/S
I did notice that i'm holding top honners for a single core
I need a cooling solution for that EE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 I mean 3.9 on air, thought that was really great myself


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## thegave (Mar 19, 2008)

I got mine for 30 quid which is why I'm happy feeding it 1.7 =)

I've stepped it down to 1.65. I run at 231MHz 2-3-3-6 PAT etc enabled 24-7 now seems to be pretty stable. I get sporadic crashes but I'm not sure if that's due to the CPU/memory or my video card. 

Can't really be bothered to tweak it further...


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## intel igent (Mar 19, 2008)

have you tried to disable PAT and see how far she'll go?


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## thegave (Mar 19, 2008)

No... doesn't everyone say any gain is pointless if you've disabled PAT?

I lied btw, the previous specs weren't stable since I couldn't get the x264 bench to finish... Fail.

It's a pretty good stability tool I guess.


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## intel igent (Mar 19, 2008)

PAT always caused me instabillity issues so i dont use it


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## 3870x2 (Mar 19, 2008)

how old is the p4 2.4 ghiz?


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## thegave (Mar 19, 2008)

The original one I was talking about? Who knows. It's disappeared off the face of eBay. I don't think anyone ever bid for it.


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## cdawall (Mar 19, 2008)

revin said:


> Thanks L/S
> I did notice that i'm holding top honners for a single core
> I need a cooling solution for that EE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I mean 3.9 on air, thought that was really great myself



i got a 3000+ that does 3.3ghz  wonder if i can take that spot from you



lemonadesoda said:


> revin... dont worry. Your results are fine for a P4, just aweful compared to the Conroe architecture. The x264 test is really a multi-threaded test. There's NO WAY you are going to score any decent numbers with a single core CPU.  Your results are fine... but it does show how much faster, at some tasks, a Qxxxx is than the old P4s.
> 
> In most applications, esp. gaming, the code is still (mainly) single threaded. So the P4EE is still a great machine.
> 
> ...



dump them thats why i got rid of mine ~$165 for a P4HT 3ghz prescott, MSi neo2 PT880, 256mb DDR400, ti4200 128mb, enremax case/PSU, 40gb IDE


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## 3870x2 (Mar 19, 2008)

I tried water cooling, but it just fried my motherboard, just about everything on it! I called intel to gripe them out because they said that water cooling should be fine for this model of processor, and APPARENTLY you need "pipes" and "water blocks"...


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## revin (Mar 20, 2008)

3870x2 said:


> I tried water cooling, but it just fried my motherboard, just about everything on it! I called intel to gripe them out because they said that water cooling should be fine for this model of processor, and APPARENTLY you need "pipes" and "water blocks"...



I Love this!


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## revin (Mar 24, 2008)

cdawall said:


> i got a 3000+ that does 3.3ghz  wonder if i can take that spot from you



Did you give up on trying to get the BFG "a run for my money" yet?

Never know, you might be in there with me on that 3000, but you better try hard, cause i've uped the ante again

BTW, I do have my Bliss able run 650ish in 3D now


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## cdawall (Mar 24, 2008)

revin said:


> Did you give up on trying to get the BFG "a run for my money" yet?
> 
> Never know, you might be in there with me on that 3000, but you better try hard, cause i've uped the ante again
> 
> BTW, I do have my Bliss able run 650ish in 3D now



woops forgot to mention thats pci-e  so 8600GTS going to kill your bliss

my BFG can burn its pissing me off


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## 3870x2 (Mar 24, 2008)

this is what needs to be done to break the 8ghz benchmark effectively:
take an old air conditioner, gut some of the unneeded parts, and build your pc inside of it, add water cooling, then put all of that into a freezer with (very important) DRY ice.  Then add some USB ports to the freezer.  You should be able to OC to about 15ghz with the right soldering and such.  BTW you will need antifreeze instead of water for watercooling...


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## intel igent (Mar 24, 2008)

3870x2 said:


> this is what needs to be done to break the 8ghz benchmark effectively:
> take an old air conditioner, gut some of the unneeded parts, and build your pc inside of it, add water cooling, then put all of that into a freezer with (very important) DRY ice.  Then add some USB ports to the freezer.  You should be able to OC to about 15ghz with the right soldering and such.  BTW you will need antifreeze instead of water for watercooling...



why must you spam? get outta here


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## 3870x2 (Mar 24, 2008)

after 7 pages, this thread is a spam, and has gone off topic several times.  If you look at all of my posts, they are right on topic!
btw the coke cat is about the most hilarious shit ive seen.


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 24, 2008)

The related topics in this thread are far from "gone off topic".  Idle BS about taking old refrigerators apart to build a PC cooling system is, I have to agree, just thread spam. Although a little funny if one were in the mood, your joke fell on deaf ears... Better to leave it that way than to dig a deeper hole.


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## cdawall (Mar 24, 2008)

i wouldn't call it a spam thread its more of a P4 overclocking club now


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## revin (Mar 25, 2008)

cdawall said:


> woops forgot to mention thats pci-e  so 8600GTS going to kill your bliss
> my BFG can burn its pissing me off




What, :shadedshu below this was all from the AGP Club:

You been misleading us here?
Remember when I questioned about why youre BIOS showed it as a PCI card?



cdawall said:


> ha i found my problem 3D mode is only 1.1v stupid card
> 
> 
> 
> ...



 So, in reailty, youre BFG 7800 is PCI-e, and second why did you add the "+" to the sig?
Gainward's are the producers of 7800GS"+", because of legal issues of releasing the card.
BFG's are not a "+" card.

Crap any1 can get thier card to GPU-z at an enernomus "clock" showing, big deal, look at mine....... it's still a FAKE!!!!, just like youres!

I've always tried to be cordial to you, even when you appear to be a little "boasty" about this or that, but to me it feels like a betrayal to the fourm members here!



cdawall said:


> ti 4200 (@340/580), FX5700 VIVO (@521/720), 7800GS (@569/1520)





cdawall said:


> lol got my 7800GS up faster 700/1600



Originally Posted by revin  
I just tapped 630/1600 and all i did is change the fan


cdawall said:


> dont feel bad im not stable @700/1600 but its fun to run the fuzzy box and get 500 or so FPS
> 
> 
> im looking at doing a vmod after xmas ang modding my a64 cooler to fit this card  that should get at least 700mhz core stable


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## intel igent (Mar 25, 2008)

cdawall was playing the joker :shadedshu 

revin : you should consider getting a 3850 to go along with your CPU


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## revin (Mar 25, 2008)

The results that a friend gave me from ABIT, are well to say the least, 2x better!!!!!!!
Thats a tough decission!!!!!$$$

I want you on an EE also, very bad, thegave got a good snatch, so mabey it's youre turn!!!!!!

Well talk water soon...... got another 12hrs on the clock to bash thru


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## cdawall (Mar 25, 2008)

revin said:


> What, :shadedshu below this was all from the AGP Club:
> 
> You been misleading us here?
> Remember when I questioned about why youre BIOS showed it as a PCI card?
> ...



hahaha your misunderstanding what i'm going to do with the switch to pci-e since its not my main card anymore that means its time to push it until it pops i have all the stuff to vmod it up to 1.5vgpu which if reviews have been correct 740mhz is about were these are topping out. oh and this card is considered a "+" card since it was designed around the G71 A2 core and not the G70 core.

also the card was running @700/1600 in atitools when i did the validation it was artifacting a little on scrolling etc. so i backed the clocks down and then some more cause fro some reason it wasn't stable @600 anymore  i didn't want to continue pushing the card only to have it die on my while it was in my main rig that would suck! and on top of all that i don't have bus locks so i can't push the cpu without making the VGA not post...if i hadn't sold my P4 rig to xazax you would see some insane OC on cpu+vga but this mobo leaves me unable to do that

Do you really think i would betray the AGP club after its been so good to me 


cards AGP BTW  	






thats why i didn't flash it to a higher vgpu i was nervous it would have issues considering its detected as a 7900GS pci-e....


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## 3870x2 (Mar 25, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> The related topics in this thread are far from "gone off topic".  Idle BS about taking old refrigerators apart to build a PC cooling system is, I have to agree, just thread spam. Although a little funny if one were in the mood, your joke fell on deaf ears... Better to leave it that way than to dig a deeper hole.



you are the last one to talk about thread spam, you've done it plenty, one post where you don't even say a word, just a laugh...

go on, dig your own hole


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