# getting ready to pull the trigger on my first build.



## tony5 (Apr 29, 2009)

Ok, so starting my very first build, Unfortunately it will have to be severely budgeted however. So I’ve gone ahead and scoped out parts I feel will not only be good enough per se, but within my budget of around $300ish. I’ve narrowed it down as much as I can, first and foremost let me just point out to you that this machine will NOT be used for any kind of gaming what so ever. it will mainly be used to encode and edit videos using programs such as sony vegas and converxtodvd, downloading large files like movies and other media, and of course web browsing and youtube vids. OS will be XP.  So here goes

CPU: *e5200 $69.99     *OH, I plan to O/C this puppy to around 3.2 because if I needed anymore, that would call for a new cooler. I might be better off spending that money to buy a better cpu ?

MOBO: *gigabyte Ga- g31m-es2l   $52.99*
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128357


HDD: *Western Digital Caviar Black 640 GB  *640gb 32mb  *74.99 *
http://www.amazon.com/Western-Digital-Caviar-Black-WD6401AALS/dp/B001GQYYSQ/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1241036609&sr=8-2

CASE: *COOLER MASTER Elite 341 $29.99*
http://www.microcenter.com/single_product_results.phtml?product_id=0305925

PSU: *Thermaltake TR2 W0070RUC 430W *ATX12V   * $28.99 A/R*
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817153023

RAM: *corsair ddr2 TWIN2X4096-8500C5  $34 A/R *
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145215

total: = *$ 290.95   *not too shabby.


So I just need some advice and or recommendations as to what would be most beneficial to what I will be using this for. Of course I’d like as much speed as I can get away with for the money!! I am also looking at maybe an AMD kuma 9950 build, but haven’t researched mobo’s and such. All recommendations are welcomed even if they’re way off from what I currently have; I am not set on anything just yet.


----------



## angelkiller (Apr 29, 2009)

On that budget everything looks good. I can't think of anywhere to save some money or to get better parts. TT PSU isn't my favorite, but it'll do for a non-graphics card setup. WD Black is only $5 more expensive then the WD6400AAKS, so why go blue? 4GB memory, good. CM case, good. Coincidentally, I just purchased that same motherboard for a backup system. So far, I love it. It's my favorite mATX board in recent times. I was presently surprised when I saw that there was a MIT (Gigabyte's OCing menu) in the BIOS. It's a $50 board! Happily running a E2180 @ 300x10 for a day now. The CPU is also a good choice. Very OC-able. So what you have is about the best you can get for that budget imo.

That said, cores are king when it comes to video editing. I would strongly urge you to try to fit in a triple core or quad core CPU into your setup. However, there's no way to do this on $300. If you stretched to $350, You could get a used Q8200 instead of the E5200. You could probably get 2.8GHz out of it too. Even if you don't, a 2.33GHz Quad > 3.5GHz E5200 when all 4 cores are used. Video encoding definitely utilizes 4 cores. You could also go the AMD route, but I don't recommend it. You'd need a $50 780G motherboard. Then you'd need either a used Phenom I quad core CPU or a used Phenom II 7x0. However both of those will cost around $100. The problem is that the Q8200 will beat a Phenom I and because of the extra core, the Q8200 will be a better choice than the Phenom II 7x0.

So I'd definitely urge you to try to save up some cash so you can get some more cores, because extra cores helps alot with video encoding. If you can't get the money, you've picked out a solid system. GL


----------



## unibrow1990 (Apr 29, 2009)

If you want an AMD build for a CPU I would look at this =>http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103678

With a motherboard like this => http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157154

everything else looks good with either build

If you are willing to expand your budget a bit you could look at the 720BE with the same or a similer motherboard to what i posted. => http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103649&Tpk=720be


----------



## angelkiller (Apr 29, 2009)

unibrow1990 said:


> If you want an AMD build for a CPU I would look at this =>http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103678
> 
> With a motherboard like this => http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157154
> 
> ...


Expanding on the X2 7850 suggestion, I'd like to point you to this article. Anand concluded that the CPUs are essentially equal. The E5300 is better in non-gaming aspects while the X2 7850 is better in games. However, I'd like to add a couple of points. First, OCing ability was not taken into considereation. You'll notice that the E5300 is competitive with the X2 while the X2 has a 200MHz clock advantage. Clock for clock the E5300 is probably a bit faster. But if you do OC them, you'll prolly get higher on the E5300 than on the X2. So a higher clock plus being faster clock for clock, makes the Intel chip better imo. Second, the efficinecy was not taken into consideration. The X2 is based on the realatively inefficient Phenom I archeteture, which causes it to be quite power hungry. While this is a realatively minor differenciation, the E5300 is much more efficient, even when comparing at equal clock speeds. So I'd pick the E5300 over that X2. And the E5200 is essentially the same as the E5300 so my points stay valid for the E5200.

I've already given reasons why not to get the PII X3 720.


----------



## unibrow1990 (Apr 29, 2009)

The kuma's overclock quite well to from what I here, and i think that is the same or a similer motherboard to what someone unlocked all 4 cores on a Kuma with recently though i would never hedge my bets on that. However I have heard that the core 2's are much better at video encoding like Angelkiller said so i would probably stick with the pentium for that reason.


----------



## Darren (Apr 29, 2009)

What is the chances of you increasing your budget slightly by $60 and getting the Phenom II X3 710 or Phenom II X3 720 for a $80 increase. Performance wise you'd be better off if you're encoding videos.

Is Sony Vegas and Cconverxtodvd multi-thread compatible?


----------



## tony5 (Apr 29, 2009)

angelkiller said:


> On that budget everything looks good. I can't think of anywhere to save some money or to get better parts. TT PSU isn't my favorite, but it'll do for a non-graphics card setup. WD Black is only $5 more expensive then the WD6400AAKS, so why go blue? 4GB memory, good. CM case, good. Coincidentally, I just purchased that same motherboard for a backup system. So far, I love it. It's my favorite mATX board in recent times. I was presently surprised when I saw that there was a MIT (Gigabyte's OCing menu) in the BIOS. It's a $50 board! Happily running a E2180 @ 300x10 for a day now. The CPU is also a good choice. Very OC-able. So what you have is about the best you can get for that budget imo.
> 
> That said, cores are king when it comes to video editing. I would strongly urge you to try to fit in a triple core or quad core CPU into your setup. However, there's no way to do this on $300. If you stretched to $350, You could get a used Q8200 instead of the E5200. You could probably get 2.8GHz out of it too. Even if you don't, a 2.33GHz Quad > 3.5GHz E5200 when all 4 cores are used. Video encoding definitely utilizes 4 cores. You could also go the AMD route, but I don't recommend it. You'd need a $50 780G motherboard. Then you'd need either a used Phenom I quad core CPU or a used Phenom II 7x0. However both of those will cost around $100. The problem is that the Q8200 will beat a Phenom I and because of the extra core, the Q8200 will be a better choice than the Phenom II 7x0.
> 
> So I'd definitely urge you to try to save up some cash so you can get some more cores, because extra cores helps alot with video encoding. If you can't get the money, you've picked out a solid system. GL




hey thanks angelkiller. i am tempted to grab the q8200 now. would the rest of my build make due if i were to replace the e5200 with the q8200? the cheapest ive found the q8200 was 144.99 shipped. if i were to swap the cpu's (q8200 for the e5200) and leave everything else the same it would run me exactly $356.01 (got some cred at the egg), if i leave it as is and go with the e 5200 my total would be $275.95 making it about an $81 difference. in your opinion is $81 worth the difference from one to the other, or like you mentioned earlyer would o/c the e5200 to 3.5 make it a bit less of a difference, of course that would mean caughing up $20-30 bones on a cooling system, which would mean about $50 diff in that case. its just that i am not supposed to be spending what i am spending but after a while of saying "what the heck" you know how it goes... i'am not a serious movie editor anyway, just make the casual home vids here and there, and rip movies from online here and there.


----------



## Darren (Apr 29, 2009)

tony5 said:


> hey thanks angelkiller. i am tempted to grab the q8200 now. would the rest of my build make due if i were to replace the e5200 with the q8200? the cheapest ive found the q8200 was 144.99 shipped. if i were to swap the cpu's (q8200 for the e5200) and leave everything else the same it would run me exactly $356.01 (got some cred at the egg), if i leave it as is and go with the e 5200 my total would be $275.95 making it about an $81 difference. in your opinion is $81 worth the difference from one to the other, or like you mentioned earlyer would o/c the e5200 to 3.5 make it a bit less of a difference, of course that would mean caughing up $20-30 bones on a cooling system, which would mean about $50 diff in that case. its just that i am not supposed to be spending what i am spending but after a while of saying "what the heck" you know how it goes... i'am not a serious movie editor anyway, just make the casual home vids here and there, and rip movies from online here and there.




Q8200 @ $144.99 isn't a fantastic deal considering that the X3 720 BE is cheaper, faster and overclocks further for @ $130.

Edit: 

To be fair the Q8200 does have that extra core, but in real terms will it equate to performance today?

Edit 2:

The threadstarter should read this, its 4 pages.

http://ixbtlabs.com/articles3/cpu/amd-phenom-2-720-810-920-p1.html


----------



## n-ster (Apr 29, 2009)

Better HDD

I know it's only 500gb, but it's on ONE platter... MUCH faster the 2 or 3 platter drives... also it's 15$ cheaper... I'm guessing that the one you chose is probably 2 320gb platters

Also, if you get the 720BE, you probably won't need a cooler to OC it, since it is know to run SUPER DUPER CRAZILY cool  You could also possibly unlock a 4th core... (though you need a good mobo (SB750) and the right batch (best is 0904))

IMO, just save up and then get a great PC! All you would need is like 500$... maybe bump your budget to 400$?

If you aren't a very intensive PC user at all, then that's another thing...


----------



## angelkiller (Apr 29, 2009)

tony5 said:


> hey thanks angelkiller. i am tempted to grab the q8200 now. would the rest of my build make due if i were to replace the e5200 with the q8200? the cheapest ive found the q8200 was 144.99 shipped. if i were to swap the cpu's (q8200 for the e5200) and leave everything else the same it would run me exactly $356.01 (got some cred at the egg), if i leave it as is and go with the e 5200 my total would be $275.95 making it about an $81 difference. in your opinion is $81 worth the difference from one to the other, or like you mentioned earlyer would o/c the e5200 to 3.5 make it a bit less of a difference, of course that would mean caughing up $20-30 bones on a cooling system, which would mean about $50 diff in that case. its just that i am not supposed to be spending what i am spending but after a while of saying "what the heck" you know how it goes... i'am not a serious movie editor anyway, just make the casual home vids here and there, and rip movies from online here and there.


 I think the rest of the build would be OK if you got the quad. If you got an aftermarket heatsink, you should be able to hit much higher than 3.5GHz, me thinks. Maybe in the 4GHz range. Your CPU would be the only thing holding the OC back as the motherboard is rated for a 333MHz bus and 333x13=4.3GHz. (That doesn't mean you're gonna get 4.3GHz, it just means that your motherboard can support a 4.3GHz E5300 with ease.) Now here's the hard part. Is the $50 worth it? The more video editing/encoding that you do the more 'worth it' the $50 will be. But you also gotta consider how easily you can get the $50. I can't really make this decision. (sorry) But I will say that a $50 upgrade to a Q8200 is a good deal imo. Even if you don't, you get a 3.5+GHz E5300, which is still really fast.



Darren said:


> Q8200 @ $144.99 isn't a fantastic deal considering that the X3 720 BE is cheaper, faster and overclocks further for @ $130.
> 
> Edit:
> 
> To be fair the Q8200 does have that extra core, but in real terms will it equate to performance today?


That is the price new. The one I have been advocating for is used and costs $100, which makes it a better deal than the X3 720. Even at new prices, $15 extra for and extra core is worth it imo. I think the extra core definitely helps in certain applications.



n-ster said:


> Better HDD
> 
> I know it's only 500gb, but it's on ONE platter... MUCH faster the 2 or 3 platter drives... also it's 15$ cheaper... I'm guessing that the one you chose is probably 2 320gb platters


Hmmm. That drive will be faster in sequential reads due to platter density, so you're right n-ster. However, from the reviews that I've seen, this drive has an access time above 15ms, while the WD6400AAKS has an access time around 12ms. On random reads (which happens _extremely_ frequently, the WD will be quicker. And 320GB/platter is no slouch. Average reads can get up to 90MB/sec. (Compared to ~110MB/sec) Honestly, I'd get the WD because it's plenty fast already, it's larger, and has a lower access time.


----------



## n-ster (Apr 29, 2009)

but the one I suggested is cheaper, and does whatever he does take advantage of the faster MB/sec? I'm thinking so... not sure but yea... lol


----------



## tony5 (Apr 30, 2009)

Darren said:


> What is the chances of you increasing your budget slightly by $60 and getting the Phenom II X3 710 or Phenom II X3 720 for a $80 increase. Performance wise you'd be better off if you're encoding videos.
> 
> Is Sony Vegas and Cconverxtodvd multi-thread compatible?



might maybe do $60 but the cost of another mobo im sure will offset my target price even more. maybe you can suggest an efficient yet cost efffective mobo + 710 combo? i mean this is what this thread is all about isnt it? 





n-ster said:


> Better HDD
> 
> I know it's only 500gb, but it's on ONE platter... MUCH faster the 2 or 3 platter drives... also it's 15$ cheaper... I'm guessing that the one you chose is probably 2 320gb platters
> 
> ...



great points. with hdd's getting cheaper by the minute and there not being a BIG difference speedwise between the drives, and the fact it's going to take me a long time before i hit the point where i'll miss the extra 140gb anyway, this seems like a good route. plus i save $15.



Darren said:


> Q8200 @ $144.99 isn't a fantastic deal considering that the X3 720 BE is cheaper, faster and overclocks further for @ $130.
> 
> Edit:
> 
> ...



thanks for that. the 720 would cost me $151.54 after tax, and thats before what i imagine will be a more costly mobo. the reviews on this chip are awsome though.


----------



## tony5 (Apr 30, 2009)

Thanks alot guys for all of your input thus far. so far i am leaning towards using the original components i listed minus maybe going with the hard drive n-ster recommended, since I ‘am yet to hear that my build "isnt" solid or wont work for what i want. is it the best? no. but i think it will serve as an awesome system for what i am dishing out money wise. right now i am working with absolute crap. the computer i have looks like something somebody threw away, and i dont mean externally. so right now the goal is to get something quick and cheap before anything, which i think i will more than accomplish with e5200 build. it'll be like going from a kia to a honda, the benz comes later when my budget opens up a bit more. id really like to get my hands on the q8200 and just missed a sale microcenter had where they went for $99. I’ll take that as a sign of a price decline hopefully opening up a window for me to scoop one up once they really start to dip knowing my system can handle it..


----------



## n-ster (Apr 30, 2009)

interesting thought... but my philosophy is, that if you could just buy a better one NOW, you won't need to later, and that the final cost will be less... But this depends on what you want and need to do now and what you will fo later with your rig... will you EVER be gaming? Will you EVER to extreme CPU stuff? or will you just do MODERATE ones?

For a PII 720BE build, I'm thinking that the final price A/R will be 360$ or so... (720 BE 140$ shipped from the egg and 63.50 after ship board) or like 410$ A/R for PII 940...

If you plan on gaming later and still doing encoding, getting a 100$ shipped board with PII 720BE or PII 940 would be great (415$ or 465$)

So yes your build is solid, but it depends... If you spend 12-14 hours infront of your comp a day, then you should IMO spend 465$... but you you spend merely 12-14 hours per week, and you don't do intensive stuff, your build is GREAT... but remember the future


----------



## thebluebumblebee (Apr 30, 2009)

I'd step up to a (IMHO) better and quieter PSU. A big indicator of the quality difference between these PSU's is how many amps on the 12v rail.  TT=18, Corsair=33! Yet the Corsair is only "rated" for 20 watts more.  If you plan on overclocking, the first thing you need is clean, stable power.  My rule: NEVER scrimp on the PSU. From JonnyGuru.com: "You can tell a power supply is an ancient design by the presence of a -5V rail, which has been gone from the ATX spec for years now."  and, "So, there you have it folks. It just doesn't pay to try and save that extra $50 on your build budget by buying cheaper power supplies." The TT unit's design is from the Pentium III days!  Also note that the efficiency rating for the TT is only 65% while the Corsair is "up to 85%".  That means that at least 35% of the electricity from the wall is wasted with the TT PSU! You may also want to read this. Also, if, in the future, you want to upgrade or maybe add something like CUDA with a video card, you'd have to upgrade the PSU at the same time.  Maybe think of it this way, would you buy a new car and then get gas for it from some guy's tank "around back" that no one knows how long its been there?  Or, would you get a 3/4 ton pickup with a 100HP 4 cylinder engine?

I'd have to vote for the WD 640GB Blue - it's quieter than the black - and better rated than Seagate.

Think about noise.  You don't want a "hairdryer" sitting next to you while you're trying to listen to something else.

Question for everyone else: Do I remember correctly that the integrated video on the 780G and/or the 790GX can help with video encoding?  This may be an advantage for the AMD argument.  I read too much and remember too little.  There's something about the G31 chipset that bothers me but I can't remember what it is.

I can't help but feeling that you will quickly outgrow a G31 motherboard, and I'm not talking gaming.  The performance of the integrated video may stop you in your tracks.  I have to agree with those who are asking for a $500 budget.  I had a 70 year old friend (he died recently) who went to a PC store (before I knew him) with a $ figure in mind.  They built him a system that seemed to fit his needs, but they did not take into account the guy's curiosity and insatiable appetite for knowledge.  Within 1 year, he was banging his head on the wall and pestering me about why his system could not do this and that and begging his wife for an upgrade which she could not understand why he needed it. (in July of 2005, they built him a Socket A Sempron 2200, IDE only, with integrated video that could not even do Microsoft Virtual Earth.)  Maybe I've spent so much time on this because of Bob and how much I miss him.

I don't think I'd do integrated video on anything less than an AMD 780G (but if you want to overclock AMD, you should have the SB750 South Bridge).  If you want to go Intel, how about a P45 MB with a 9000 series video card from Nvidia or 4000 series from ATI (passively cooled)?


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 30, 2009)

Foxconn boards are surprisingly reliable. 
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813186145

Here's some really really nice ram for the price ..
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148212

Oh and definitely a great hdd, n-ster linked this earlier
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148395

This power supply would give you more longevity..
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817342015

Grab up that Q8200.


----------



## n-ster (Apr 30, 2009)

JrRacinFan said:


> Foxconn boards are surprisingly reliable.
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813186145
> 
> Here's some really really nice ram for the price ..
> ...



better RAM for the price A/R

Better RAM B/R

with shipping, the RAM you suggested isn't worth it compared to these 

IMO, I think I understand you needs, and with what JR and I suggested, you'll have a nice system... At worst, you'll upgrade in a year 

I think we didn't realise your needs so much, since we are used to recommending stuff for gaming... You want a cheap computer, and compared to the garbage you have now, you'll think your running a i7 920 at 4.6ghz


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 30, 2009)

n-ster said:


> better RAM for the price A/R
> 
> Better RAM B/R



Wouldn't consider those better at all, ALTHOUGH the OCZ sticks are rated for a higher bandwith, but their rated voltage is really high.


----------



## n-ster (Apr 30, 2009)

depends... how much is shipping? nvm I'll check lol I realised how lazy that sounded

OMFG I thought it was like 10$ shipping or something... I stand corrected (2.99 egg saver)

The RAM you link is therefore the best  well I consider the G-skills equal, but as a brand I prefer Crucials
IMO get the G-skills if you're scared of OCing... actually, wouldn't G-skills be better for him considering the fact that it's going to be on a 30$ board?

Actually, no... IMO all 3 would be the same performance... What considering the board I say G-skills... correct me if I'm wrong


----------



## n-ster (Apr 30, 2009)

Altered said:


> Not G.skill or mushkin but its not a bad deal. You are talking about 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM ? Right?
> OCZ Reaper HPC 4GB (2 x 2GB) DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory
> $72.99
> Your Price: $57.99
> ...




 I think I found a winner...


----------



## tony5 (Apr 30, 2009)

n-ster said:


> I think I found a winner...




thanks , i was looking at that one before. quick update as to the build. after snooping around on slickdeals this morning i have a new found confidence about actually finding a quad in my range. i seen alot of great deals that have come in gone leaving me the impression that with just a little more patience i might actually find a really nice mobo/quad cpu combo. for example i found that microcenter a few days ago was selling the q8200 for $99, and frys has it on clearance for $89 (to bad my local frys has sold out), thats very liitle more then the e5200 i had been looking at. i'am still very green when it comes to this stuff and getting a quad never even crossed my mind untill yesterday thanks to you guys. btw, whats wrong with the original ram i had listed http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820145215 ? just curious.

nice heads up on the psu deal thebluebumblebee, corsair seems to be pretty fool proof.


----------



## thebluebumblebee (Apr 30, 2009)

$45, after MIR, for that quality of a PSU is a no brainer


----------



## tony5 (Apr 30, 2009)

UPDATE: i was able to place a hold on a q8200 for the $89 (open box but at that price who cares). had a friend of a friend who just happens to work at frys, small world!. this is substantially less then i had anticipated a quad would run me. can somebody recommend a board to go with this, better a board with integrated video? they also have a nice mother board combo deal on a amd 710 that’s ends tomorrow http://http://newspaperads.mercurynews.com/ROP/ads.aspx?advid=32664&adid=7762053&subid=25639009&type= for 129.99 + tax.


----------



## n-ster (Apr 30, 2009)

wow that's a nice price  so either you get the 90$ quad + 30$ board or the 130$+tax deal hmmm...

btw you messed up your link here it is  

The memory you suggested is fine, but you pay more up front etc... anyways, the memory I quoted is cheap as hell 

let's see... I personally would go with the Quad... both mobos are sucky anyways, and for what you are doing the quad seems better to me... and it'll be 25$ cheaper... but wait for others opinions  (kinda super duper tired right now so....)


----------



## n-ster (May 1, 2009)

Good deal I suggest this actually... You'll have a nice GPU that I'm sure you'll need at one point... so 350$ + PSU + CASE... so 380$ + PSU... so If you go for corsair one, A/R, it'll be 425$... Or ask him how much without GPU.. I'm sure he'll give you an amazing price 

EDIT: nvm, I asked him for you


----------



## angelkiller (May 1, 2009)

tony5 said:


> UPDATE: i was able to place a hold on a q8200 for the $89 (open box but at that price who cares). had a friend of a friend who just happens to work at frys, small world!. this is substantially less then i had anticipated a quad would run me. can somebody recommend a board to go with this, better a board with integrated video? they also have a nice mother board combo deal on a amd 710 that’s ends tomorrow http://http://newspaperads.mercurynews.com/ROP/ads.aspx?advid=32664&adid=7762053&subid=25639009&type= for 129.99 + tax.


Good call on the quad. I do not think that the PII X3 720 + that mobo is a good deal. That mobo uses the Geforce 6100 chipset from like, 2005. Plus at the same price Q8200 > X3 720. I don't think you're gonna find a better board for the same price.



thebluebumblebee said:


> I'd step up to a (IMHO) better and quieter PSU. A big indicator of the quality difference between these PSU's is how many amps on the 12v rail.  TT=18, Corsair=33! Yet the Corsair is only "rated" for 20 watts more.  If you plan on overclocking, the first thing you need is clean, stable power.  My rule: NEVER scrimp on the PSU. From JonnyGuru.com: "You can tell a power supply is an ancient design by the presence of a -5V rail, which has been gone from the ATX spec for years now."  and, "So, there you have it folks. It just doesn't pay to try and save that extra $50 on your build budget by buying cheaper power supplies." The TT unit's design is from the Pentium III days!  Also note that the efficiency rating for the TT is only 65% while the Corsair is "up to 85%".  That means that at least 35% of the electricity from the wall is wasted with the TT PSU! You may also want to read this. Also, if, in the future, you want to upgrade or maybe add something like CUDA with a video card, you'd have to upgrade the PSU at the same time.  Maybe think of it this way, would you buy a new car and then get gas for it from some guy's tank "around back" that no one knows how long its been there?  Or, would you get a 3/4 ton pickup with a 100HP 4 cylinder engine?


Good call on the TT PSU. I didn't take a through enough look at that. Anything Corsair is good.



thebluebumblebee said:


> Question for everyone else: Do I remember correctly that the integrated video on the 780G and/or the 790GX can help with video encoding?  This may be an advantage for the AMD argument.  I read too much and remember too little.  There's something about the G31 chipset that bothers me but I can't remember what it is.


I don't recall anything. I don't see how the IGP can help with a encoding task....



thebluebumblebee said:


> I can't help but feeling that you will quickly outgrow a G31 motherboard, and I'm not talking gaming.  The performance of the integrated video may stop you in your tracks.  <snip>
> 
> I don't think I'd do integrated video on anything less than an AMD 780G (but if you want to overclock AMD, you should have the SB750 South Bridge).  If you want to go Intel, how about a P45 MB with a 9000 series video card from Nvidia or 4000 series from ATI (passively cooled)?


I will say that the G31 integrated graphics is probably not amazing, but does it need to be? The OP said that the computer would be "encoding, downloading & internet browsing". Lots of 3D power is unnecessary. Even though integrated graphics have a bad rep, I don't think that it's gonna choke on 2D tasks. Plus, adding a graphics card, even a cheap one, adds significant cost to the build. I seriously doubt that the G31's IGP is _that_ bad.



n-ster said:


> Good deal I suggest this actually... You'll have a nice GPU that I'm sure you'll need at one point... so 350$ + PSU + CASE... so 380$ + PSU... so If you go for corsair one, A/R, it'll be 425$... Or ask him how much without GPU.. I'm sure he'll give you an amazing price
> 
> EDIT: nvm, I asked him for you


That's an insane deal. See my comment in that thread as to why.


----------



## n-ster (May 1, 2009)

angelkiller said:


> That's an insane deal. See my comment in that thread as to why.



Yup, I found it was too... especially that the thing is OCed very well (you couldn't do half that OC with the 30$ board lol...) and it's OCed for him... with a great cool, a good GPU a good board and good RAM... just WOW


----------



## tony5 (May 1, 2009)

angelkiller said:


> Good call on the quad. I do not think that the PII X3 720 + that mobo is a good deal. That mobo uses the Geforce 6100 chipset from like, 2005. Plus at the same price Q8200 > X3 720. I don't think you're gonna find a better board for the same price.



just recalculated my budge and i think i can go maybe $330-$340ish eith this build. leaving me with around $100 to get a cooler and mobo. Would you still recommends the g31, even though im thinking of o/c? 

heres what ive got so far

CPU: got the Q8200   $97

MOBO: any suggestions ? 

COOLER: any suggestions ? (hear the q8200 o/c up to the mid 3's)

RAM: corsair 450w psu  $45 A/R  
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139003

PSU: corsair ddr2 TWIN2X4096-8500C5 $34 A/R  (i hear OCZ is a real hassle about rebates,but thanks for you suggestion anyway n-ster )
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820145215

CASE: COOLER MASTER Elite 341 $29.99
http://www.microcenter.com/single_pr...uct_id=0305925

HDD: Western Digital Caviar Blue 640 GB WD6400AAKS  $53.99
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0017XUX7O/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used

OR

Seagate Barracuda ST3500418AS 500GB @ $59.99
http://www.amazon.com/Seagate-Barracuda-7200-12-Cache-ST3500418AS/dp/B001VKYA5E/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1241154644&sr=1-1

you have no idea how much i appreciate this men. if there was any way i could reach through my monitor and hand you a cold one i would...


----------



## tony5 (May 1, 2009)

n-ster said:


> Good deal I suggest this actually... You'll have a nice GPU that I'm sure you'll need at one point... so 350$ + PSU + CASE... so 380$ + PSU... so If you go for corsair one, A/R, it'll be 425$... Or ask him how much without GPU.. I'm sure he'll give you an amazing price
> 
> EDIT: nvm, I asked him for you



good looking out n-ster. if that were with in my means id take yours and angelkillers word for it and nab the sucker up, but not only that ive already got the q8200.


----------



## angelkiller (May 1, 2009)

tony5 said:


> just recalculated my budge and i think i can go maybe $330-$340ish eith this build. leaving me with around $100 to get a cooler and mobo. Would you still recommends the g31, even though im thinking of o/c?
> 
> heres what ive got so far
> 
> ...


Getting the q8200 in the 3's is gonna be hard. The Q8200 has a multiplier of *7* which is realively low and makes OCing difficult because you need a high FSB. Example, to hit 2.8GHz, you have to run 400x7. 3GHz needs 430*7 and 3.5GHz needs 500*7. I don't know how high a cheap motherboard can go. Definately not 3.5GHz, but I think that that Gigabyte G31 board might be able to do a 400MHz FSB. A 2.8GHz quad is still pretty nice, especially when you consider the budget. But if you have $100 for the mobo and the heatsink, you can get a cheap used P45/P35 board. It shouldn't be too hard to get such a board for $75. As for an amazing cooler, how about a Xigmatek HDT S1283 for $26 after rebates? It's definitely worth the money. You might be able to find that cheaper used also.



tony5 said:


> HDD: Western Digital Caviar Blue 640 GB WD6400AAKS  $53.99
> http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0017XUX7O/ref=dp_olp_used?ie=UTF8&condition=used
> 
> OR
> ...


I'd get the WD6400AAKS over the 500GB 7200.12. Primarily because it's cheapeer and larger. But the WD drive also has a much quicker access time, which is the main reason SSDs are so amazing. 

It's really late so I hope this all makes sense.


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 1, 2009)

How about a G45 MOBO?  I was just reading the reviews on the egg and the MSI and Foxconn (especially) had nice reviews and seemed to overclock well.  The 4000 series IGP will perform better than the G31's as well.  Another benefit is an ICH10R southbridge rather then the ICH7.

This is going to be your main system.  IMHO, don't buy the used HDD.  If this was for a system that was not your main system, or as a second HDD, then I'd say go for it.  As for the Seagate 7200.12, the reviewers were surprised with its lack of performance.  The WD has been, and continues to win the overall crown of HDD reviews.  The egg has been running specials on them every once and a while for $5 off.  Seems to be about time again.  Also, there are some crazy deals on the Samsung Spinpoint F1 1GB HDD's, more money but more space.

You mentioned Slickdeals.  Have you seen Searchalldeals?  It's a site that lists several of the other "deal" sites, including Slickdeals.

This is fun, right?


----------



## n-ster (May 1, 2009)

the 7200.12 500gb 60$ shipped IMO is actually better since it's one platter... and that 640gb is USED.. don't buy USED HDs! so the WD is actually 65$

so I asked him and it's 290$ without GPU... so total 365$ A/R for a CPU OCed to 3.6xx ghz


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 1, 2009)

But then he'd NEED a video card.


----------



## n-ster (May 1, 2009)

why the mobo doesn't have one? anyways he has a lot of good choices to choose from


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 1, 2009)

Well, he now has a CPU, so that deal is not such a deal anymore for him.  And, no, a P35 does not have an IGP.


----------



## n-ster (May 1, 2009)

I thought he could get it... lol didn't know he actually bought it... anyways, for a cooler s1283 with 10$ backpate... mobo I have no idea 

good luck!


----------



## tony5 (May 4, 2009)

Update: ok guys Really good news, just got some unexpected funding coming my way. so instead of 100, i got about 200-250 more to spend (doesnt mean i NEED to spend it all, but its there if necessary). SO, went ahead and bought a corsair 450W psu for 39.99! pretty happy with that. the mobo i am looking at now is this one http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductReview.aspx?Item=N82E16813128368 (these are going for 84.99 A/R at my local microcenter) and this one http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128359 ($105 A/R @ the egg)they appear about the same and have good reviews. my hands are still up in the air about which cooler to settle with  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233003
or http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186134&Tpk=7 pro artic . its still a toss up between the Western Digital Caviar Blue OR Black 640gb. I still need a good for non-gamer video card, looking at this one http://www.fatwallet.com/redirect/b...319&url=http://shop4.frys.com/product/5837943 but would like to get other opinions.  OH and about ram! been doing some thinking, one question, whats better to go with, the 1066 or 800 ?) remember, i plan to OC..
looking at these:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6820148212

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod [...] 6820227289


----------



## JrRacinFan (May 4, 2009)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233003
Theirs the cooler that would give best results for price ...

Regarding mobo ..
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813136060

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131299
...Both are outstanding boards. 

Although if you can get that GB for what I see quite a bit cheaper, then do it. 

RAM? IMO Always go 1066 spec'd ram when planning to OC. It's always best to have more than not enough. Can always, underclock the ram to 1Ghz if needed, but with 800mhz ra, you would be overclocking it at that speed. Oh also your ram links are broken.


----------



## n-ster (May 4, 2009)

get the 7200.12 500gb 60$ drive from the egg IMO... get the Xig s1283 or s1283V

these RAM look like they will OC alot... (1.6V!)

A/R theses look good

mobo I have no clue  I know gig ud3 and asus p5q are popular

GPU seems fine? It's much cheaper than newegg so probably a great deal \

btw you messed up your last 2 links 

good luck


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 4, 2009)

That 9600GSO would be a good Folder! If you're non-gaming, you don't need that much of a card.  And, it's not that efficient.
You're on the cusp of a quiet system.  The WD blue, a passive heatsink video card (9400GT or 9500GT), the PSU you got, a good, but quiet HSF (like the XIGMATEK HDT-S1283), and a case, like the Antec Solo (those MOBO's that you are pointing to are ATX so you will need a larger case than that CM Elite), will make very good ingredients for a quiet and efficient system.


----------



## JrRacinFan (May 4, 2009)

Nice find again n-ster. Throw some heatspreaders on em and a corsair dom fan, they will turn out to be monsters!!!


----------



## n-ster (May 4, 2009)

He doesn't need monsters though


----------



## angelkiller (May 4, 2009)

For the mobo, I say get the Gigabyte UD3R or the Asus P5Q Pro. Both are amazing boards from what I've seen.

The Xigmatek will destroy the Freezer every day of the week, including Sundays.

Me an n-ster disagree about that Seagate drive. Access time is just too high and access time is more important than sequential reads, especially when both drives are really fast. The difference between the WD 640GB Blue and Black is negliable. The Black may be 10% faster and is definately louder. If it's a $5 difference, go for the black. Any more than that, I'd have to stick with the Blue. But either drive will be a good choice.

Video card doesn't matter much. HD 4350 or 94/9500GT on the low end. The 4670 and 9600GSO are both a step up if you want to possibly do some gaming. I'd suggest a passive card as some of these cheaper cards have small fans, which are pretty loud.

RAM doesn't matter much. Get any DDR2-800 4-4-4-12 or DDR2-1066 5-5-5-15. That gives you lots of head room for overclocking. DDR2-800 4-4-4-12 are capable of doing higher speeds, that's why they have tight timings. I'd expect these kits to reach DDR2-1000 no problems. DDR2-1066 is already at 533MHz, which is plenty for OCing. Brand doesn't matter much either. I like Corsair and Crucial. However, OCZ, Gskill and Kingston are perfectly acceptable as well.


----------



## n-ster (May 4, 2009)

angelkiller said:


> Me an n-ster disagree about that Seagate drive. Access time is just too high and access time is more important than sequential reads, especially when both drives are really fast. The difference between the WD 640GB Blue and Black is negliable. The Black may be 10% faster and is definately louder. If it's a $5 difference, go for the black. Any more than that, I'd have to stick with the Blue. But either drive will be a good choice.



indeed, it's access time is 17ms, very high. that is though, because Seagate put it in "quiet" mode

"Seagate's factory programming and shift the drive out of its noise-optimized "quiet" seek mode." is why it's access time is high... but it is quiet 

but doing a bit more research, basically, this Seagate drive is extremely fast doing reads... REAL Fast... where it does less well is writing and copying...

As for black vs blue, I'd pay 7.50$ more for it

IMO, just get the best valued one


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 5, 2009)

Of course....., now that you bought the PSU....., the Egg does this, a VERY quiet case with an Earthwatts 500w PSU for $90, shipping included! Promo Code EMCLSLS23


----------



## n-ster (May 5, 2009)

did he buy a case yet? hopefully he didn't buy a matx only case  I think he'll be much happier with Corsair PSU though  though that deal is pretty darn awesome...


----------



## JrRacinFan (May 5, 2009)

What you mean $30 mid psu? Antec EW 500 is comparable to this ....

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817151040


----------



## n-ster (May 5, 2009)

idk I can't find it anymore  I saw this 500W PSU that wasn't half bad at 30$

My bad, didn't know EW was that good lol


----------



## JrRacinFan (May 5, 2009)

Yeah, here's a quick review if you feel like reading...

http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story&reid=35

Oh and to also add, its not a dual 12v line PSU .... it's a single


----------



## n-ster (May 5, 2009)

Sorry don't feel like reading it atm  but is it comparable to a HX 520?


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 5, 2009)

Sell the EW 500w?  Could probably get $50 for it!


----------



## n-ster (May 5, 2009)

Send back the Corsair!


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 5, 2009)

Corsair has a better warranty, and is known to be quieter.


----------



## JrRacinFan (May 5, 2009)

thebluebumblebee said:


> Sell the EW 500w?  Could probably get $50 for it!



Good thinking 

You would definitely get an easy $50 for it.


----------



## CJCerny (May 5, 2009)

Even though you are not going to use this machine for gaming at all, I would still consider getting a motherboard that has better integrated graphics than the G31 mobo you've selected. The GPU isn't just for gaming any more--more and more software is looking for it and using it if it finds it. You can get a very nice 780G microATX motherboard and AMD processor for around $130 total which gives you a much better ratio of CPU to GPU power. Right now, your build is totally lopsided in favor of the CPU, which really boxes you into a business desktop type use of your proposed new build.


----------



## n-ster (May 5, 2009)

I forgot about the MIR... yea, sell the EW


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 5, 2009)

If I remember right, the only advantage the EW has over the VX450 is that it has 2 PCI-E connectors.  But that does not appear to be an issue here.
I feel that the Earthwatts and the VX series are almost the same quality, with only a slight edge to the Corsair.  The Earthwatts' are one of the best deals going today.


----------



## n-ster (May 5, 2009)

Yea cause they aren't popular


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 5, 2009)

n-ster said:


> Yea cause they aren't popular



I'm assuming you mean the Earthwatts?  The Egg lists 51 PSU's as "best sellers"  These range from cheap low end units to dim-the-house-lights-when-you-turn-your-computer-on units.  Three of the 51 are Earthwatts!


----------



## n-ster (May 5, 2009)

Corsairs are by FAR more popular NOW... Antec's name as suffered lately no?


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 5, 2009)

The Corsair's come at a premium price, exception being their 400 watt unit.  Without a rebate, they are out of my price range.  That's why I pulled the trigger on a 550VX for $65-67 after MIR.  But if I needed a PSU today, and could not find a rebated Corsair, I'd buy an Earthwatts without hesitation.


----------



## Hayder_Master (May 6, 2009)

welcome to TPU
my friend im use this G31 , im try high overclock with it and i see this mobo not have good range in overclock using Pentium D 3.0Ghz , better think about cheap p35 it will be great chose


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 11, 2009)

If you want the WD Black for its speed and warranty, today it is the same price as the Blue at The Egg. Just remember that it is louder than the Blue.


----------



## tony5 (May 12, 2009)

thebluebumblebee said:


> If you want the WD Black for its speed and warranty, today it is the same price as the Blue at The Egg. Just remember that it is louder than the Blue.



thanks thebluebumblebee! good deal there, i'll be putting in an order for one this afternoon. been so busy with school ive had to put things on ice the last few days.

UPDATE: jumped on a deal at frys, got the CoolMaster centurion 590 for $29.99 http://shop3.frys.com/product/5534250?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG , although that earthwatts deal seemed pretty good too. i now have my board, i went ahead and got the ga-ep45-ud3p http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128358 $114 A/R. 

summary: things ive got out of the way! getting close...

cpu:  Q8200  $97
board: Gigabyte EP45-UD3P  $114  A/F
case: Coolmaster centurion 590  $29.99
psu: Corsair 450W CMPSU-450VX  $39.99 A/R
hdd: WD 640gb caviar Black (ordered it this afternoon) $69.99
ram: pending 
vid card: pending
cooler: pending still looking for an alternative to s1283, which will run $32 a/r + $12 aft/shp retention bracket + $9 for artic silver 5 = so about $53


----------



## thebluebumblebee (May 12, 2009)

How about this 9800GT for $77.75 after discounts and rebates?  It would be more card than you need, BUT, it would be ready to help with programs like Photoshop CS4 which can use the GFX card to speed up the process.  Then you could also help with Folding as a thank you!


----------



## n-ster (May 12, 2009)

Get the s1283V, it has a bracket included

for RAM: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227298

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4350425&SRCCODE=PRICEGRABBER&cm_mmc_o=2mHCjCVybgwTyz__wyCjCVqHCjCdwwp

http://www.zipzoomfly.com/jsp/ProductDetail.jsp?ProductCode=10008035


----------

