# I'm gonna upgrade my 7 year old gaming PC



## Widd (Apr 18, 2016)

I bought it in 2009 and I'm thinking instead of trying to start from scratch I could probably upgrade it on my own to something reasonable.  It is a prebuilt machine and I'd like to see what you guys would recommend I do to get the most out of what I have.

Here's the specs:

CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-950 3.06 GHz 8M L3 Cache LGA1366
CD: LG 20X DVD+/-R/+/-RW + CD-R/RW DRIVE DUAL LAYER
CD2: Sony 20X Double Layer Dual Format DVD+-R/+-RW + CD-R/RW Drive
FAN: Asetek Liquid CPU Cooling System
HDD: 1TB (1TBx1) SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD
HDD2: 1TB (1TBx1) SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 16MB Cache 7200RPM HDD

MOTHERBOARD: MSI X58 Platinum Intel X58 Chipset SLI/CrossFireX Mainboard Triple-Channel DDR3/1600 SATA RAID w/ eSATA,Dual GbLAN,USB2.0,IEEE1394a,&7.1Audio
MEMORY: 12GB (2GBx6) DDR3/1600MHz (Corsair 2048MB 1600MHz)
OS: Microsoft(R) Windows Vista(TM) (64-bit Edition)
POWERSUPPLY: Corsair TX 750 
VIDEO: NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250 1GB 16X PCI Express
VIDEO2: NVIDIA GeForce GTS 250 1GB 16X PCI Express


Yeah so its still a Vista machine so I would like to upgrade that too (win 7? or 8? or 10?).  It's really not used as much for gaming as it used to be but I would still like to be able to play something once in a while.  Speed doing normal tasks would probably be my main concern.

Thanks in advance!


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## EarthDog (Apr 18, 2016)

Well, honestly, I don't see much wrong with that at all outside of the two budget cards for SLI...

You should be able to overclock with that board, so I would look into overclocking the CPU.

PSU is fine.. ram amount is fine....

About the only things I see there for your listed uses would be to get an SSD, and a better GPU... maybe a GTX 960 or R9 380 for when you play games.


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## dorsetknob (Apr 18, 2016)

$70 to $90  to upgrade Cpu to a Xeon Hex core then overclock it to 3.5+Ghz
will see you Good for another couple of years
New SSD which you can migrate to new system
upgrade your graphics cards also you can migrate then to a future build
in the meanwhile you can save ready for a major upgrade involving
New Motherboard DDR4 ram latest Skylake CPU

edit read the Xeon owners club thread for what you can expect performance gain wise
http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/threads/xeon-owners-club.211143/


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## NdMk2o1o (Apr 18, 2016)

What others have said, you still have a strong cpu though I'm curious did you buy it bk in 2009 with those graphics cards, totally mismatched to the rest of the system, ssd overclock and a decent gpu


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## Widd (Apr 18, 2016)

Yes i bought all of it together.  I didnt know much much about gpus and still dont for that matter, i was just trying to get a couple GBs of RAM.  As far as the SSD goes what size do you recommend?  Im thinking ill just go with windows 10 unless someone has advice not to.  Should i go up on RAM because its cheap or will it really not help me?


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## EarthDog (Apr 18, 2016)

VRAM doesn't 'add up' with multiple cards. 

I would say 256GB on the SSD.

12GB of system ram is fine unless you are close to or are using it all. These days we say 8GB is enough for most users... you have 12GB. More ram doesn't help if you are not using it.


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## BarbaricSoul (Apr 18, 2016)

Agreed with what's been said (except for replacing your current CPU). Add an SSD, upgrade the GTS 250 cards to a single GTX 970 or R9 390, and OC the CPU to 4 GHz (or at least as close as you can get it to 4 GHz, but 4 GHz should be achievable).


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## Widd (Apr 18, 2016)

Ok thanks for the info guys.  Im guessing i will be able to find a good tutorial for OC the processor?  I'd hate to damage it messing around lol.


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## Tomgang (Apr 18, 2016)

That pc has still potential for a longer life if you are willing to offer some money on it.

Here is what i think you shut do.

Yes upgrade from Vista (i hated Vista like a cat hates water) to windows 10 it runs fine on this old X58 setups. Upgrade from Win 7 to win 10 my self and i newer looked back again. By all means win 7 is still great but win 10 is more optimized and win 8 i dit not like.
overclock your current CPU to around 4 GHz and if you use stock cooler now, get a better cpu cooler. An ekstra option cut be getting a 6 core i7 like i7 970/980/980/990X or xeon chip.
Get a GTX 970/980 maybe used.
And a SSD deffently an SSD. Your pc will feels like it new again.

Do this and you will be fine for some time again. Dont belive me? You may want to take a look at this thread about my old pc and X58 in gennerel. lots benchmarks and good X58 info. Take a look and then deside what you want to do.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/t...bsolete-lets-get-some-numbers-and-see.220831/


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## little cat (Apr 18, 2016)

I would get a new video card GTX 960 (or R9 380(X)) . For more future proof GTX 970/R9 390 but new cards are coming , so now only NVidia cards with low TDP i.e. GTX 960/970


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## neatfeatguy (Apr 18, 2016)

My younger brother used to run my old GTX 280 (your GTS 250s are about on par with a single GTX 280) up until about 4 months ago when I finally convinced him to upgrade his old hardware. He started running into games that would literally tell him his video card wasn't supported and he couldn't play them.....so yes, time to dump the GTS 250s and move on to something more practical.

CPU is still decent, better than the PII I have in my spare PC for the kids. If you haven't, you should be able to overclock that i7 to help it stretch it's legs.
Anything in the $200 range should do you wonders for a GPU. It'll let you play any game out there at decent settings for 1080p and not break the bank if you're not looking to have a powerhouse of a gaming machine.
Also get a SSD and install Windows 10. The computer should boot from powered off to the desktop within 15 seconds for you.
RAM is fine.


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## EarthDog (Apr 18, 2016)

Widd said:


> Ok thanks for the info guys.  Im guessing i will be able to find a good tutorial for OC the processor?  I'd hate to damage it messing around lol.


Here is our guide: http://www.overclockers.com/3-step-guide-overclock-core-i3-i5-i7/

One thing I surely wouldn't do in your case, is upgrade to a hex core... there simply isn't a point when you have a quad with HT already. That money is MUCH better spent on an SSD, CPU cooler, and better GPU than it would be the CPU. If you get a hex CPU, you still have the other parts to upgrade. I would take that extra cash and start saving for a new rig in a year or so if you don't drop it on the parts above. A hex + HT isn't really going to last longer than the same IPC quad with HT for your listed uses.


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## peche (Apr 18, 2016)

Upgrade 1: Samsung EVO 128Gb/256GB for OS,

Upgrade2 : GTX970 for most games and 1080p resolution is extra fine, ig you could buy you a GTX 980 go ahead! wont regret!

Overclock its and interesting new and fast world to take! read all you can and always ask! it's pretty interesting dude! don’t worry about it! learn and take the adventure!


fill  all your specs here!


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## trog100 (Apr 19, 2016)

peche said:


> Upgrade 1: Samsung EVO 128Gb/256GB for OS,
> 
> Upgrade2 : GTX970 for most games and 1080p resolution is extra fine, ig you could buy you a GTX 980 go ahead! wont regret!
> 
> ...



yep all it really needs is an ssd for the operating system and a better gpu plus getting rid of vista.. the 980 isnt a good price.. the 970 is better value.. and vista is a resource gobbling pig.. 

i just did up an old core 2 duo laptop/tablet that had vista on it.. giving it an ssd and windows 10 makes it hard to believe its the same machine.. i even bought a retail copy of windows 10 for it.. he he..

trog


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 19, 2016)

Phase 1:
-Windows 10
-SSD for OS/main applications

Phase 2:
-Replace graphics cards with a single, powerful card (waiting until June/July would be ideal). *Make sure it is UEFI Ready!*

Phase 3:
-Replace CPU, motherboard, and memory. I'd probably do Skylake which will effectively halve your power consumption and potentially double your performance.  The main reason for doing this: UEFI for ridiculously fast booting.


Could do all three at once and it would effectively be a new computer.  Could leave that one operational and start from scratch too but then you'll have to buy another case, power supply, and probably HDD for storage.


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## Schmuckley (Apr 19, 2016)

Widd said:


> Ok thanks for the info guys.  Im guessing i will be able to find a good tutorial for OC the processor?  I'd hate to damage it messing around lol.


Google "Miahallen"
Here:
Stay @ or below 1.3 vtt
Set qpi to lowest link above "slow mode"
Most boards top out around 220FSB
Remember to lower your RAM strap.

A lot of programs don't work in Windows 10.

I recommend 7 for more compatibility.


http://forums.tweaktown.com/gigabyt...-sb-overclocking-guides-1155-1156-1366-a.html


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## BarbaricSoul (Apr 19, 2016)

Schmuckley said:


> A lot of programs don't work in Windows 10.
> 
> I recommend 7 for more compatibility.
> 
> ...



Huh? Ok, I prefer Win 7 to 10 myself, but since I upgraded to 10, I have yet to find a single program that worked with XP that doesn't work with 10. Even Mechwarrior 4 from Nov. 2000 works.


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## rtwjunkie (Apr 19, 2016)

BarbaricSoul said:


> Huh? Ok, I prefer Win 7 to 10 myself, but since I upgraded to 10, I have yet to find a single program that worked with XP that doesn't work with 10. Even Mechwarrior 4 from Nov. 2000 works.



I have to second this. Every progran and every game that I ran in 7, and 8.1 runs in W10.  Like you, I've even got American McGees Alice from 2000 running on 10.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 19, 2016)

I played through Thief (1998) and Thief 2 (2000) on Windows 10...they're dinosaurs.

The only thing I've seen that Windows Vista+ may not like that XP did was very low colors (256 colors or less) at 640x480 resolution.  Some older games launch at these settings and I see green flashing dots all over the place.  I suspect the reason for it is that Vista officially killed 640x480 resolution.  Windows 7 may have killed 800x600 (not 100% sure).  On Windows 7 and newer, 1024x768 is the minimum, officially support resolution.  That said, file or registry tweaks often allow you to brute force a higher resolution/color depth to work around the ridiculously low defaults (assuming you can't get into the menu to change it yourself).


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## EarthDog (Apr 19, 2016)

Schmuckley said:


> Google "Miahallen"
> Here:
> Stay @ or below 1.3 vtt
> Set qpi to lowest link above "slow mode"
> ...


I linked to the source of that already (Overclockers.com).


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## eidairaman1 (Apr 19, 2016)

the CPU and board are fine, W7 is a good os still despite ms making updates take an hour on end just to appear because they are trying to force users to W10.

GPU upgrades- 380, 380X, 390, 390X. 970, 970Ti, 980, 980Ti.


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## peche (Apr 19, 2016)

Schmuckley said:


> A lot of programs don't work in Windows 10.
> 
> I recommend 7 for more compatibility.


running win10 flawless... no problems so far, for some versions of win7 there are no updates anymore dude, so i recomend you to update yourself....



FordGT90Concept said:


> Phase 3:
> -Replace CPU, motherboard, and memory. I'd probably do Skylake which will effectively halve your power consumption and potentially double your performance. The main reason for doing this: UEFI for ridiculously fast booting.


thats not completely necessary,the old rig could handle heavy work and last a couple of years more...


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## rruff (Apr 19, 2016)

Widd said:


> It is a prebuilt machine and I'd like to see what you guys would recommend I do to get the most out of what I have.



Gaming bang for buck is a current mid range video card. GTX 950s often go on sale for $120 and would deliver *~3x faster performance than two GTS 250s*. Diminishing returns (FPS/$) above that point. 

You really don't need to change anything else. An SSD, a new OS, and a OC would certainly be nice for general use, but there probably won't be a noticeable increase in gaming performance. Worth it anyway if you have the money and inclination.


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## Schmuckley (Apr 20, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> Here is our guide: http://www.overclockers.com/3-step-guide-overclock-core-i3-i5-i7/
> 
> One thing I surely wouldn't do in your case, is upgrade to a hex core... there simply isn't a point when you have a quad with HT already. That money is MUCH better spent on an SSD, CPU cooler, and better GPU than it would be the CPU. If you get a hex CPU, you still have the other parts to upgrade. I would take that extra cash and start saving for a new rig in a year or so if you don't drop it on the parts above. A hex + HT isn't really going to last longer than the same IPC quad with HT for your listed uses.


Xeon x6*** are binned higher and usually clock higher and stay cooler.

Same with w3520s


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## EarthDog (Apr 20, 2016)

Still... why spend the money for negligible improvements? What is he going to get an extra 100-200Mhz? And that isn't even guaranteed. Again, I wouldn't do it, no way.


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## little cat (Apr 20, 2016)

I agree with Earthdog that it s not worth upgrading the CPU because the prices are high and the single core performance wont change much


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 21, 2016)

Just get a better gpu. ( and W10)


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## peche (Apr 21, 2016)

CAPSLOCKSTUCK said:


> Just get a better gpu. ( and W10)


+ SSD


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 21, 2016)

peche said:


> + SSD



I would spend it on a better gpu and suffer the marginally slower load times.

Is there a budget?


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## peche (Apr 21, 2016)

CAPSLOCKSTUCK said:


> I would spend it on a better gpu and suffer the marginally slower load times.
> 
> Is there a budget?


couldn't remenber, but SSD prices have gotten a drop .. so you can get decent ones for cheap


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 21, 2016)

peche said:


> couldn't remenber, but SSD prices have gotten a drop .. so you can get decent ones for cheap



I cant see a budget but the OP said he wanted to speed up day to day tasks so....yes...ssd too.

£150.00 gets a 120 gb ssd and a used 7970 or 680 in the UK.


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## Robert Cohen (Apr 21, 2016)

those motherboards are really expensive used so u could probs sell that whole system for 500 bucks and make a new one


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## johnspack (Apr 21, 2016)

Evo 850 ssd,  GTX970 for the win!  Yes these old systems still have life in them.  Nothing I can't run 60fps at max settings,  except those games you'd need a GTX980Ti anyways.
I went hex core because it only cost me 70 bucks,  and the xeons will do 4ghz+ all day long.  And I run VMs and do encoding so blah...  Otherwise,  those 2 and you're golden for
a year or 2.


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## Widd (Apr 21, 2016)

I ordered a samsung evo 500gb ssd.  Should get it tomorrow.  I bought win 7 and upgraded to win 10 today.  Moved all my pics and music off of C drive so i can fit everything on the new ssd.  Ive seen a few different posts about cloning the existing drive onto the ssd so once its here thats my plan. I havent pulled the trigger on a gpu yet but id like to spend less than 200.  Im going to get everything upgraded before i try any overclocking the cpu.  Oh yeah and i have to change my motherboard battery so i will do that when i get the new gpu because it looks like its behind the cards i have installed.  So im making some progress.


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## johnspack (Apr 21, 2016)

200 won't get you a good enough gpu...  just saying.  If you're in the States...  300,  get a 970,  please,  you won't regret it.  A 960 is just a waste of money.


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## rruff (Apr 21, 2016)

johnspack said:


> 200 won't get you a good enough gpu... just saying. If you're in the States...  300,  get a 970,  please,  you won't regret it.  A 960 is just a waste of money.



Considering that a GTX 950 would give him ~3x the performance he has now, I have a feeling that might be "good enough". And they are only $120.


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## johnspack (Apr 21, 2016)

Why not go with a 970,  he'll have a viable gaming machine for a couple of years and can save up for whatever is after skylake and pascal?
Neither of which I see is worth spending money on.....


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## little cat (Apr 21, 2016)

R9 380 4GB
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150730&cm_re=r9_380-_-14-150-730-_-Product
or GTX 960
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/gigabyte-video-card-gvn960ixoc4gd
http://pcpartpicker.com/part/evga-video-card-04gp43967kr


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## rruff (Apr 21, 2016)

I figure somebody running GTS 250 isn't at the bleeding edge of gaming. The GTX 970 is little past the FPS/$ sweet spot is well.


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## Schmuckley (Apr 21, 2016)

used 970 or 7970 off the forums is what I'd do.
or a 290x.
There's nothing a 290x can't handle.


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## peche (Apr 21, 2016)

used video cards are great for saving money, also make sense to grab cheap GTX 660ti for example and wait to see pascal performance and prices, i was about to grab a 970 and stay chill but a friend convinced me about this waiting period, GTX 680 still capable and pascal in on the next corner! 

Also there might be excellent deals on used SSD's for giving a boost to your current system, 


Regards,


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## hapkiman (Apr 21, 2016)

The core of your system is still good to go.  The i7 950 is a very fast processor still, but I am a little confused about you running two very low end graphics cards. 

Anyway, here is the most glaring issue looking at your specs:  You have no SSD?  Adding an SSD as your boot drive would show you marked improvements in everything you do.  Then you could do a fresh install of Windows 10 onto it and you would be set for a while longer.  If you are really wanting to upgrade (I know sometimes it's temping with a rig that aged), you can but it'll be expensive.

Here's what I would do:

1) Add Samsung 850 EVO 250GB or 500GB solid state drive as boot drive.
2) Get rid of two graphics cards and add a single GTX 950 (or wait a few months and add one of the newer low cards from AMD or Nvidia)

This would change everything about how your set-up feels.


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## cdawall (Apr 21, 2016)

Grab an eBay 980x/990x they go for $200-300 add a ssd (850 Evo for $70-90) and Windows 10. Then add a 290 refurb mine was under $200.


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## OneMoar (Apr 21, 2016)

x58 is rapidly approaching obsolescence,that being said if you don't game and don't care about graphics you can get anouther year or two before you really need to upgrade


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## cdawall (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> x58 is rapidly approaching obsolescence,that being said if you don't game and don't care about graphics you can get anouther year or two before you really need to upgrade



Only because intel has phased them out. A 980x still outperforms an FX 9590


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## peche (Apr 21, 2016)

cdawall said:


> Only because intel has phased them out. A 980x still outperforms an FX 9590


older processors are beats for overlock... also the triple channel memory bandwidth is something i really miss on sandy bridge for example...


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## EarthDog (Apr 21, 2016)

peche said:


> older processors are beats for overlock... also the triple channel memory bandwidth is something i really miss on sandy bridge for example...


Bet you couldn't tell the difference between dual and triple....................


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## cdawall (Apr 21, 2016)

peche said:


> older processors are beats for overlock... also the triple channel memory bandwidth is something i really miss on sandy bridge for example...



There is literally nothing a 4ghz 980x/990x cannot do.


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## OneMoar (Apr 21, 2016)

a core 2 out performs a FX chip ... you have no point ...
in multi-threaded loads the x58 shows its age relatively quickly as for overclocking thats a crap shoot on x58 and relatively difficult


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## peche (Apr 21, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> Bet you couldn't tell the difference between dual and triple....................


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## brandonwh64 (Apr 21, 2016)

X58 platform is growing harder to come by and prices are quite high for motherboards. If you are wanting to upgrade, now would be the time to get as much as you can out of the X58 stuff on ebay and pickup a newer combo.


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> a core 2 out performs a FX chip ... you have no point ...
> in multi-threaded loads the x58 shows its age relatively quickly as for overclocking thats a crap shoot on x58 and relatively difficult




Last week i completed my 8th x58 system.........all of them have o/c massively and easily.


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## cdawall (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> a core 2 out performs a FX chip ... you have no point ...
> in multi-threaded loads the x58 shows its age relatively quickly as for overclocking thats a crap shoot on x58 and relatively difficult



It is difficult to overclock for a novice I literally just build and clocked an EVGA X58+950 up to 4ghz without issue on an AIO watercooler they are cake to overclock...and in what situation does a C2 outperform an FX chip? The quad core nehalem chips get beaten out by the FX chips it takes the nice 6 core gulftowns to take out the higher end AMD stuff. That is why I was very specific with what CPU's I said.


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## OneMoar (Apr 21, 2016)

cdawall said:


> It is difficult to overclock for a novice I literally just build and clocked an EVGA X58+950 up to 4ghz without issue on an AIO watercooler they are cake to overclock...and in what situation does a C2 outperform an FX chip? The quad core nehalem chips get beaten out by the FX chips it takes the nice 6 core gulftowns to take out the higher end AMD stuff. That is why I was very specific with what CPU's I said.


because IPC for a given architecture is the only thing that matters
a efficient cpu is a fast cpu

x58 are known to be fragile not something you want a novice overclocking
there is no good reasion to stick with x58 if he wants to upgrade
you can score a SB or IvB combo for cheap enough
then there is the whole issue of there is simply no support for older chipsets and some software is starting to reline   heavily on things like AVX and VT-D


the whole argument  is this yes I can go out and buy a 1990-something corvett Z06,and blow the doors off a Chevy cruze
the cruze is more conferrable more stylish gets way better gas mileage, makes more sense to drive daily,and won't be breaking down every 10k
meanwhile that corvett while packing big power, turns like a brick, stops like a freight train and uses more fuel then a 747 ... and for most tasks is slower and less efficient then teh cruze, and it would't take that much tinkering with the cruze to have it make just as much power as that 90 something vett infact what I saved on buying into a classic car I could spend on things like super-chargers and nos =/


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## cdawall (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> because IPC for a given architecture is the only thing that matters
> older chip faster then newer chip for a given amount of powe,per clock cycle



Right so in what situation is an 8350 slower than a c2d? When both are clocked at exactly 3ghz because if that's your argument you can quit now.


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> x58 are known to be fragile not something you want a novice overclocking




wrong.


1. set multi to manual and then  press + key to raise it. 
2. set busspeed to 200
3. Press F10 and enter

run a bench with temp monitor on.

If flakey....lower settings and try again.


The most difficult part is resetting CMOS if you have thick fingers.


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## OneMoar (Apr 21, 2016)

cdawall said:


> Right so in what situation is an 8350 slower than a c2d? When both are clocked at exactly 3ghz because if that's your argument you can quit now.


pretty much any situation that doesn't use more than one dedicated thread 
amd= shit (yes thats my argument see lengthy edit above as to why)


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## peche (Apr 21, 2016)

X58 has a high resale value... thats correct.. also Sandy & Ivy .... so you could get a big penny if you decide to sell...


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## cdawall (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> pretty much any situation that doesn't use more than one dedicated thread
> amd= shit (yes thats my argument see lengthy edit above as to why)



It's a shit argument.


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## dorsetknob (Apr 21, 2016)

cdawall said:


> It's a shit argument.



That sums it up quite nice

Its like that person see's a bear Shit a gold nugget   then too that person   "ITS SHIT " it came out of a bears Ass therefore it is Shit


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## cdawall (Apr 21, 2016)

dorsetknob said:


> That sums it up quite nice
> 
> Its like that person see's a bear Shit a gold nugget   then too that person   "ITS SHIT " it came out of a bears Ass therefore it is Shit



I have a p3 that's faster per clock than c2d must be better.


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 21, 2016)

I was going to do a funky comparison with some of the pcs i have on but,  i really cant be arsed with another pointless Intel vs AMD spat.


Here is a shit Intel cpu........








I am about to vacate the sitting room as She is watching soaps. I will now go and use my equally shit Phenom.


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## Tomgang (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> because IPC for a given architecture is the only thing that matters
> a efficient cpu is a fast cpu
> 
> x58 are known to be fragile not something you want a novice overclocking
> ...



I have to disagree about that. X58 is hard to kill unless you let it run to hot or overvolt it. My I7 920 is the first CPU i have overclokket and it has been oc for the last 3 years and have never failed one bit.
X58 only dies if you are a fool and let it run hot or overvolt it, but these two things would kill any hardware overtime any way.

X58 is a great overclokker and i can comform that whit my own cpu. Stock it running 2,66 GHz (turbo all core 2,8 GHz) and even that it is the first cpu i have oc. It whas easy to get it to 3,8 GHz in the first try and short after it whas at 4 GHz. If i had better cooling it can also do 4,3 GHz 24/7.


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## Tomgang (Apr 21, 2016)

for comparison to CAPSLOCKSTUCK bench and to prove that old cpu can oc very well. Here is how a I7 920 handels the same bench at stock, 4 GHz and 4,35 GHz.

stock





4 GHz








4,35 GHz


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 21, 2016)

i decided to listen to some Prince (RIP) tunes through the sub so i chose to use an Intel cpu.......it  (apparently) would have been shit with AMD so here is another Intel cpu which is better than the shit one from the other room.


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## BarbaricSoul (Apr 21, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> the whole argument  is this yes I can go out and buy a 1990-something corvett Z06,and blow the doors off a Chevy cruze
> the cruze is more conferrable more stylish gets way better gas mileage, makes more sense to drive daily,and won't be breaking down every 10k
> meanwhile that corvett while packing big power, turns like a brick, stops like a freight train and uses more fuel then a 747 ... and for most tasks is slower and less efficient then teh cruze, and it would't take that much tinkering with the cruze to have it make just as much power as that 90 something vett infact what I saved on buying into a classic car I could spend on things like super-chargers and nos =/



Uh, they actually corner very well as long as you have quality tires, brakes are good for road use (road tracks cause them to heat up and fade, issue completely eliminated by upgrading to '97 or newer calipers and rotors), and no Chevy Cruz is going to pass me if I don't want them too and at normal highway speeds, believe it or not, I get between 25-30 mpg. I average around +19 everyday driving. Also, the 2016 Cruz costs over $16k, I have less than $6K in mine. And it doesn't break down every 10k miles like you seem to think they do. Also, talking about stylish, I'll bet money I get more compliments in my 23 year old Vette with a far from perfect paint job than you will in a Cruz (I literally get at least one every time I drive it, even when it's dirty as hell).

Sorry, but you struck a nerve. I'm the proud owner of a '92 Vette. You can go back to arguing about X58 viability as long as you leave my precious alone.


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## Tomgang (Apr 21, 2016)

CAPSLOCKSTUCK said:


> I was going to do a funky comparison with some of the pcs i have on but,  i really cant be arsed with another pointless Intel vs AMD spat.
> 
> 
> Here is a shit Intel cpu........
> ...



If you think you have a shit cpu there. Beat my shitty cpu. Yeah i now, its pretty shitty and slow as hell  any one more shitty?


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## Caring1 (Apr 22, 2016)

Tomgang said:


> If you think you have a shit cpu there. Beat my shitty cpu. Yeah i now, its pretty shitty and slow as hell  any one more shitty?


You beat me, I have the Pentium D 920, which has slightly better clocks.


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 22, 2016)

@Tomgang , remarkably similar to your single thread i7 920 score. 

Bloomfield vs Westmere.......Westmere wins on efficiency (watts)

Xeon X5670  (bloody ancient... )

@4.450


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## Tomgang (Apr 22, 2016)

Caring1 said:


> You beat me, I have the Pentium D 920, which has slightly better clocks.



Haha ok. But they are slow as hell. This CPU is almost useless. I mean mine can hardly handle to show a Youtube video i 720P whitout lag. It is really a pain in the ass to use this crap cpu.
And even tru there are only about 2 years betwen my Pentium D 915 and I7 920. Even at stock and same clocks the I7 920 is over 6 times as fast in single core/thread performence in that bench. Its back when the performence gain every two years where high enough to upgrade. It is nok like that to day. After Nehalem and Sandy brigde came the performence gain have been much lower over the years. alright the price and performence level is also im a different level but still only 2 years and over 6 times as fast at the same clock speed. Pentium D came in 3Q2006 and I7 920 where released in november 2008.



CAPSLOCKSTUCK said:


> @Tomgang , remarkably similar to your single thread i7 920 score.
> 
> Bloomfield vs Westmere.......Westmere wins on efficiency (watts)
> 
> ...



Wow they are really close, but also only one generation between them. It also comforms my claim that after Nehalem/sandy brigde the performence gain is low for the generations after that. About watt off cause your chip is more efficient. It is 45 NM vs. 32 NM on your chip. The lower NM this better performence per watt. The biggest problem whit old chips compared to new ones is not the performence but the power use.


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## EarthDog (Apr 22, 2016)

Guys... correct me if I am wrong, but I don't see a sandybridge chip here. Isn't westmere just a die shrink so instruction sets and IPC should be the same. Im not remotely surprised that single threaded performance is the same/similar. 

Did I miss something?


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## Widd (Apr 22, 2016)

This should probably go in a different thread but after installing my ssd, Samsung magician says its connected to a SATA2 port not a SATA3 so my speeds will be slower.  Is there anyway to tell if any of the ports on my motherboard are SATA3?  I'm guessing they'll all be SATA2 since the board is old.


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## cdawall (Apr 22, 2016)

Widd said:


> This should probably go in a different thread but after installing my ssd, Samsung magician says its connected to a SATA2 port not a SATA3 so my speeds will be slower.  Is there anyway to tell if any of the ports on my motherboard are SATA3?  I'm guessing they'll all be SATA2 since the board is old.



Check the manufacturer page for it they will list the port setup


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## EarthDog (Apr 22, 2016)

Widd said:


> This should probably go in a different thread but after installing my ssd, Samsung magician says its connected to a SATA2 port not a SATA3 so my speeds will be slower.  Is there anyway to tell if any of the ports on my motherboard are SATA3?  I'm guessing they'll all be SATA2 since the board is old.


Def, not the place for this post, LOL!

YOu should fill in your system specs so we know what you have... 

That aside, cdawall has you covered, check at your board's webpage and see.


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## dont whant to set it"' (Apr 22, 2016)

If cash on desk, maybe milk the curent oc'ed one some more vs powerconsumption or not its up to you , I type that knowing an SSD would make an x58 feel as snappy as an z170, or just about any uncloged os for that matter on a relatively modernd pc.


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## OneMoar (Apr 22, 2016)

there is no difference in performance between sata 2 and 3 _unless_ you are copying huge amounts of data
a SSD's true benefit isn't write or read speeds but access time,and how many simultaneous operations can be performed
and again, no matter the use case sticking with a cpu with a inferior architecture is a silly I don't care how many vitrual cores and threads a particular chip has if the underlying architecture is garbage then the cpu is garbage efficiency is everything
the less time the cpu spends at 100% speed the better 

if he doesn't game and can get the 950 up around 3.8Ghz /w triple channel ram then he can squeegee anouther year or so out of it if he doesn't do anything super intensive, I just replaced a x58 machine that I built for somebody 4 years ago with a 6700k and for his use (photoshop and abobe stuff) the difference is night and day


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## Tomgang (Apr 22, 2016)

Im using SSD in my old X58 rig. I have two for thats matter. An old crucial M4 64 GB for OS and a newer Samsung EVO 250 GB for most played games ( for older games two older WD velociraptor 10000 RPM     150 GB in raid 0 for those). An SSD when ever it runs sata 2 or 3 will make your pc much more responsive than a normal mechanical hardrive ever can do. i went from a WD velociraptor harddrive to a SSD for OS about 4 years a go and i never looked back again.

Sata 2 maxes out at 285 Mb/s in read as well as ride. Sata 3 do the same thing at around 580-600 MB/s. So to get sata 3 speed you can take two SSD in sata 2 ports and run those drive in Raid 0 and voila sata 3 speed or you can do as i dit get a Sata 3 PCI controller. Problem solved.

Im using this controller in my motherboard and as a bonus i got USB 3.0 also and thats nice. So i have a 7 year old system with sata 3 and USB 3.0 . I got no complaint.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B002VVQ58M/?tag=tec053-21


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## EarthDog (Apr 22, 2016)

That is a pretty high cost to get those speeds... requiring you to buy two drives... that also leaves you with twice the risk of failure... but, if you need the speed..........


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## Tomgang (Apr 22, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> That is a pretty high cost to get those speeds... requiring you to buy two drives... that also leaves you with twice the risk of failure... but, if you need the speed..........



It is still cheaper than the alternative. Get a never motherboard with onboard sata 3 that also may need a new CPU and if realy a new motherboard also DDR4 memory all together. that can end up much higher cost in the end, unless you also need the power from a newer CPU. When the investment is not so bad. But just to get sata 3, i would deffently just get a sata 3 controller or if you can live with the risk of raid 0 get two SSD´s. Besides SSD are not so costly as they where a few years back and in gennerel SSD are becoming very reliable. My crucial M4 has over 8100 hours powered on.


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## EarthDog (Apr 22, 2016)

You crack me up Tom, you love you some X58 when it is slower than shit compared to anything new... a whole thread dedicated to it in fact!


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## Tomgang (Apr 22, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> You crack me up Tom, you love you some X58 when it is slower than shit compared to anything new... a whole thread dedicated to it in fact!



It is not all that need a 5000 USD pc every second year to have a great time on gaming or just random browsing. But i do admit next time i need new GPU´s it will also be time to say goodbye to X58/I7 920, cause at that time the I7 920 will be to big a bottleneck for two powerful GPU´s. But it will be a sad day to say goodbye non the less. The X58 has served me well over the years and hopefully it can do that a year or two more. After that i will need new GPU´s and if the X58 haven give up on life before that i will be forced to sell.

But yeah i love this old junk to pieces and has been the most stable pc i have ever had. Old but still pretty good, at least for my use.


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## EarthDog (Apr 22, 2016)

Nobody said that (5k machine every other year). Hell $1.5k will last a few years...

But make no mistake about it, X58 holds back multi gpu already. ;

Glass ceiling all around.


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## cdawall (Apr 22, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> Nobody said that (5k machine every other year). Hell $1.5k will last a few years...
> 
> But make no mistake about it, X58 holds back multi gpu already. ;
> 
> Glass ceiling all around.



Just clock it higher that fixes everything.


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## EarthDog (Apr 22, 2016)

Not the glass ceiling on multi gpus... nor stock performamce on 4790k/skylake. It has its uses, but try to game and game with multi gpu, you are capping potential.


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## cdawall (Apr 22, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> Not the glass ceiling on multi gpus... nor stock performamce on 4790k/skylake. It has its uses, but try to game and game with multi gpu, you are capping potential.



Just clock it higher if that doesn't work than add more voltage and clock it higher.


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## EarthDog (Apr 22, 2016)

cdawall said:


> Just clock it higher if that doesn't work than add more voltage and clock it higher.


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## dorsetknob (Apr 22, 2016)

There is a large potion of the world that cannot always afford to upgrade their equipment at the drop of a hat/ next iteration of cpu and graphics Some of us and we know who we are just cannot afford to support the shareholders of intel/ Nvidia/ microsoft  ect in the lifestyle they want and think they deserve,
we eak out the performance and lifespan of our equipment as much and for as long as we can


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 23, 2016)

My "ancient" and rather beautiful pc plays my favourite game (Project Cars)  at 110 fps............... tell me why i should upgrade. ( come on heroes, tell me why).











12 threads at 4.6ghz and yes............ i am totally skint......too sick to work and too sensible to spend money on unneccesary upgrades.

I could sell all of it quite easily for twice what i paid but,................naaaah i would rather not pander to the money makers........fuck 'em.


edited to underline the word  "me"


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## Schmuckley (Apr 25, 2016)

I like x58 
Just sold my 5820k and got this:
http://valid.x86.fr/dcibxr





Still better @ multithread than Skycrap @ 4Ghz


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## EarthDog (Apr 25, 2016)

Schmuckley said:


> Still better @ multithread than Skycrap @ 4Ghz


How so?


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> How so?


I'm curious as well that 6 core chip scales horribly


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## EarthDog (Apr 25, 2016)

Nothing like comparing a 6c/12t CPU highly overclocked to a 4c/8t CPU at stock (with out boost even).


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## Schmuckley (Apr 25, 2016)

EarthDog said:


> Nothing like comparing a 6c/12t CPU highly overclocked to a 4c/8t CPU at stock (with out boost even).


"Stock" = 4Ghz
PS: I definitely can make it scale much more


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## EarthDog (Apr 25, 2016)

Yes, stock is 4Ghz on 6700K, why are you confirming that point?


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## Schmuckley (Apr 25, 2016)

That was just on daily clock ..with crap RAMs.
This here be "highly overclocked" still with junk RAMs (4.5Ghz)


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## EarthDog (Apr 25, 2016)

Thanks for sharing that your CPU with 50% more threads and cores along with a faster clockspeed is faster than a modern processor. 

Have some candy....


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## Schmuckley (Apr 25, 2016)

Beer? 
CPU that costs 1/3 as much..keep that in mind as well.
Oh yeah..and then there's the "not as fragile" factor.

Anything post Ivy Bridge is not sturdy at all.
x99 boards die.
Haswell chips die.
Skylake chips die.
Mesez..Come on AMD!

I probly buy a skl board this week..just fer kix


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## Tomgang (Apr 25, 2016)

Schmuckley said:


> That was just on daily clock ..with crap RAMs.
> This here be "highly overclocked" still with junk RAMs (4.5Ghz)



Why are you using CPU-z 32 bits version?
Are you on a 32 bits windows?

By using 64 bits version of CPU-z you will get a much better score.

I notice that you are only running dual channel memory on your X58 machine. X58 support triple channel = you shut use 3 or 6 modules for the bedst performence on X58.

But i do agreed X58 is hard to kill. It just keep on going and going. But cant say much about failure on newer intel systems since i haven tryed them out and i have not seen other complain about them.

Dit you really sell your X99/I7 5820K and downgrade to X58? Not the move i would have taken if i had X99 system now. By all means X58 is great and i love my old piece of junk, but would nok have downgrade to an older platform. So better have wait for Broadwell E and get one of these chips for X99 and sell the I7 5820K at that time.

Here is the prof with my own X58 system. about CPU-z versions.


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## silentbogo (Apr 25, 2016)

@Schmuckley , your numbers are a bit low.
Here's my X5650 @ 3GHz:




And here is my 4.1GHz overclock in contrast to 6700K@4GHz:




Not bad for an $80 chip and a 7 y.o. motherboard.
I actually got lucky with this chip and it runs fine on the daily basis @3.6GHz with voltage lowered to 1.1V.

Also for fans of hypothetical synthetic benchmarks, I give you the highest i7-6700K score in wPrime1024M on air:
4.7GHz @1.4V =135s

And my X5650:
4.5GHz @1.36V = 123s

At 4.7GHz it is still stable for continuous work, and performs on par with 5820K, but temperature is a bit high (over 80°C at full load).

Regarding SLI:
Z170 = x36 PCI-E lanes gen 3.0 (most boards are only capable of running x8/x8)
X58 = x40 PCI-E lanes gen 2.0 (most do no less than x16/x16)

There is not a single modern card that can really push the boundaries of PCI-E 2.0 bandwidth, so why bother?

And what it means in terms of gaming performance:
http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/answers/id-2694698/pcie.html

The only downfall of x58 is lack of USB 3.0 and SATA-III, but considering that my only USB3.0 flash drive died in less than 2 months since purchase (bought it to keep backups for my laptop), I won't be bothered by this tech at least for another few years (as long as my USB 2.0 flash drive keeps working).


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## Tomgang (Apr 25, 2016)

silentbogo said:


> @Schmuckley , your numbers are a bit low.
> Here's my X5650 @ 3GHz:
> View attachment 73994
> 
> ...



Take a look a my post #98 and se the difference in 32 and 64 bits. Hes low score is caused by using 32 bits version CPU-z bench and you are using 64 bits version.


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## OneMoar (Apr 25, 2016)

you do realise that cpu-z's integrated benchmark is as trust worthy as a box with no bottom right ?
x58 = old and shit
end of story


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## dorsetknob (Apr 25, 2016)

Push the Button on your CD changer @OneMoar pick a new track to play
we realize you don't like X58 anymore as its to old for you


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## CAPSLOCKSTUCK (Apr 26, 2016)

OneMoar said:


> you do realise that cpu-z's integrated benchmark is as trust worthy as a box with no bottom right ?
> x58 = old and shit
> end of story




Why do you keep reading these threads if they are going to upset you so much every time?


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## dorsetknob (Apr 26, 2016)

CAPSLOCKSTUCK said:


> Why do you keep reading these threads if they are going to upset you so much every time?



Moar to the point why does he reply with the antagonistic i hate x58 =shit all the time


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## eidairaman1 (Apr 26, 2016)

keep the rig still effective


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## cdawall (Apr 26, 2016)

I still fail to see why people keep posting benchmarks? My 6 core 12 thread i7 5820K embarrasses a 6 core on X58...which is kind of the point.


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## silentbogo (Apr 26, 2016)

cdawall said:


> I still fail to see why people keep posting benchmarks? My 6 core 12 thread i7 5820K embarrasses a 6 core on X58...which is kind of the point.


I can make the same argument over why people keep pushing a $389 CPU into every upgrade thread.
I understand that 5820K is a nice little chip, and that X56xx lacks certain features, but a $600 (roughly, not including cooling) upgrade over <$100 upgrade with total combined 25% advantage in most synthetic benchmarks is hardly a reason to go that way. The point was that x58 is still a decent platform, and that the OP needs to upgrade his GPU first. Switching form i7-950 to a much cooler x5650 would make OP's life much easier at only $80-$100 investment (plus he gets a better overclock), but it is still optional.


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## cdawall (Apr 26, 2016)

silentbogo said:


> I can make the same argument over why people keep pushing a $389 CPU into every upgrade thread.
> I understand that 5820K is a nice little chip, and that X56xx lacks certain features, but a $600 (roughly, not including cooling) upgrade over <$100 upgrade with total combined 25% advantage in most synthetic benchmarks is hardly a reason to go that way. The point was that x58 is still a decent platform, and that the OP needs to upgrade his GPU first. Switching form i7-950 to a much cooler x5650 would make OP's life much easier at only $80-$100 investment (plus he gets a better overclock), but it is still optional.



I long since said grab an eBay 980x, but people in here one keep arguing that X58 is faster than x, y, z which they aren't, or say something else stupid along those lines.

So here it is. Even an fx 8350 beats the 4 core 8 thread X58 parts. That means they are pretty damn slow. A 6 core 12 thread chip edges out the 9590. It is plenty for most gaming rig the 980x is cheap and easy to overclock. (simpler than the xeons). Drop one of those in set the bastard to 4ghz and move on. It will hold out until zen/7th gen Intel I'm sure.


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## dorsetknob (Apr 26, 2016)

cost of decent AMD ( cough cough ) Cpu + Motherboard + Cooler = greater than just buying 
a Better INTEL 1366 CPU

Boy YOU LOVE Telling other people how to increase their Spending


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## cdawall (Apr 26, 2016)

dorsetknob said:


> cost of decent AMD ( cough cough ) Cpu + Motherboard + Cooler = greater than just buying
> a Better INTEL 1366 CPU
> 
> Boy YOU LOVE Telling other people how to increase their Spending



I never said go amd I said even it performs better? I literally said buy a 980x on eBay. Do I need to quote it?


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## Tomgang (Apr 26, 2016)

Dam can you guys keep on discuss when ever X58 are shit or not.

The short one:
For some people it is shit cause it is to slow for there use and for others it is still good for there use like mine.

The long one:
X58 for the hardcore 4K gamer that want every single game maxed out no matter what or for the person there power is every thing like those who video convert or just need a powerful workstation. For those people X58 is shit cause no 8 or 10 core support, high power use compared to more modern cpu and lag of support for new features and so on.

For the people that just want a cheap gamer pc for 1080P gamming there is X58 plenty for most games to max it out when first OC and backed up by a good GPU. Almost all my games i have including games as late as 2015 my old junk maxes out. Even a game that came out last year called Evolve had a I7 920 stock as the recommended cpu. look here: http://store.steampowered.com/app/273350/

The point is: For some X58 just not have the features they need or power for there triple SLI Titan X 4K gamming rig. And other like me dont need more than what X58 has to offer cause we dont ask nealy as much of what it is suposse to do and can do. Eksample me i just ask it to play games in 1080P at high settings and that is exactly what it does. So i dont need a I7 6700K for my use.

Sure i have wet dreams about a 10 core I7 6950X and two or three pascal GPU powered rig when it comes out. But do i need? no Can i afford it? No Is X58 good enoufh for med? yes and for alot of other people two, but maybe not you deppending on your use.

Why do we X58 people post benchmark when the rigs are old. Cause its fun to compare and X58 is not use less and shit to every one. Long live X58

And we also (at least i dit) posted benchmark so OP can se what potential X58 still has to offer and by that get a pc for cheap, that can keep him going a year or two more


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