# 4K Plex Server CPU Recommendation



## Durvelle27 (Apr 23, 2018)

What’s up guys. Been out of the scene for a little but I’m trying to put together a Rig/HTPC for 4K playback as a Plex Server strictly as cheap as possible. I tried using a Pentium based build but the 4K playback constantly lags and buffers with the CPU pegged between 90-100% load. Do you guys have any recommendations 

I already have a case, HDD, PSU, and OS


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## dorsetknob (Apr 23, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> I tried using a Pentium based build but the 4K playback constantly lags and buffers with the CPU pegged between 90-100% load.


Can you supply us the Info on the Board and CPU  you have tried ?


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## Kursah (Apr 23, 2018)

I'd probably go no less than a higher-end i3 or more likely, i5's or better for 4K streams. Plex also supports GPU transcoding so that might be an option too. But ya it does seem a Pentium isn't going to handle it, though maybe if you have a spare GPU you could use, that might help mitigate the need for a different CPU, MB, etc. 

Here's some more info: https://support.plex.tv/articles/115002178853-using-hardware-accelerated-streaming/

Plex server system requirements: https://support.plex.tv/articles/200375666-plex-media-server-requirements/

Plex does recommend an i7 for 4K transcoding: https://support.plex.tv/articles/201774043-what-kind-of-cpu-do-i-need-for-my-server/

I don't stream 4K, but my virtual instance of Plex with 4 threads from my 4790K handles my 1080 streams with ease.


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## hat (Apr 23, 2018)

You'll need a beefier CPU to transcode 4k for sure. Plex can direct steam though if the target device natively supports your content, which poses no impact on the server besides just sending data.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 23, 2018)

dorsetknob said:


> Can you supply us the Info on the Board and CPU  you have tried ?


I can’t remember the model right now but I know it’s a dual core @2.8GHz and 4GB of DDR3 



Kursah said:


> I'd probably go no less than a higher-end i3 or more likely, i5's or better for 4K streams. Plex also supports GPU transcoding so that might be an option too. But ya it does seem a Pentium isn't going to handle it, though maybe if you have a spare GPU you could use, that might help mitigate the need for a different CPU, MB, etc.
> 
> Here's some more info: https://support.plex.tv/articles/115002178853-using-hardware-accelerated-streaming/
> 
> ...


1080 playback works perfectly fine just 4K is unpleasant 



hat said:


> You'll need a beefier CPU to transcode 4k for sure. Plex can direct steam though if the target device natively supports your content, which poses no impact on the server besides just sending data.


Devices should

1x Xbox One X
1x Xbox One S
2x Smart TVs with Plex Built in


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## Kursah (Apr 23, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> I can’t remember the model right now but I know it’s a dual core @2.8GHz and 4GB of DDR3
> 
> 
> 1080 playback works perfectly fine just 4K is unpleasant
> ...



Out of those, how many are displaying in 4K?


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 23, 2018)

Kursah said:


> Out of those, how many are displaying in 4K?


All of them when viewed are viewed in 4K


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## neatfeatguy (Apr 23, 2018)

No issues with a couple of devices running 1080p on my i5-4460 Plex server. Also a few outside devices stream 720p (limited to 720p due to my upload speed) - even with all 4-5 pulling videos at once we don't experience any hiccups. Usually it's no more than 2 at a time, but every now and then everyone's looking to watch something off the server.

Clearly they recommend an i7, but perhaps if you can find a decent i5 (cpu/mb combo) at a good price it might be worth trying out.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 23, 2018)

I assume Plex uses FFMPEG which means the more cores the merrier.  I'd use a Ryzen 6-8 core.


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## Kursah (Apr 23, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> All of them when viewed are viewed in 4K



Depending on the device that should minimize the need for transcoding if the source file is something the remote device can play natively. If that isn't the case then transcoding will still have to happen, and on top of that much more network bandwidth must be used to stream the file over to the device. 

How is your home network setup?
Are all of these devices wired on Ethernet, is it 100Mbps? 1000Mbps/Gigabit? 
Are anyconnected via WiFi?
If connected to WiFi, what is the connection rated at? N150/300? AC867+?

Check out the links I shared in my previous post as well, should provide some good information for possibly utilizing GPU transcoding and/or what you may consider moving forward. I also agree to consider a Ryzen build...like the one in your system specs or more. You could even run a test Plex server from your system, stream a 4K movie and see how it performs as a reference.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 23, 2018)

A single 4K stream can use upwards of 60 Mbps.


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Apr 23, 2018)

What are you using to RIP the 4K Blurays? I am also looking to add 4K content to my server.



FordGT90Concept said:


> A single 4K stream can use upwards of 60 Mbps.


There is a new video standard (cant recall the name of it atm) but it will allow the compression of say 10GB 4K video files down to 3GB or less.

Edit: Here it is


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 23, 2018)

Video: MPEG4 Video (H264) 3840x2160 25fps *31397kbps* [V: Alias Data Handler [eng] (h264 main L5.1, yuv420p, 3840x2160, 31397 kb/s)]
Audio: AAC 48000Hz stereo *317kbps* [A: Alias Data Handler [eng] (aac lc, 48000 Hz, stereo, 317 kb/s)]

AV1 is supposedly 30% more compact which would translate to a still-heavy 22200 kbps.

Since OP is in USA, it's more likely to be 30 fps than 25 fps (the source I used above was produced in Poland) so expect 20% more bandwidth requirement than given.


I'd be most concerned about those two TVs.  If they don't support whatever encoding the videos are in, Plex is going to make the server transcode.


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## cdawall (Apr 23, 2018)

You can use an nvidia gpu for a maximum of two streams, but it'll do 4k fine.

Even my 16 core broadwell e xeon cannot do 4k transcoding


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 23, 2018)

Kursah said:


> Depending on the device that should minimize the need for transcoding if the source file is something the remote device can play natively. If that isn't the case then transcoding will still have to happen, and on top of that much more network bandwidth must be used to stream the file over to the device.
> 
> How is your home network setup?
> Are all of these devices wired on Ethernet, is it 100Mbps? 1000Mbps/Gigabit?
> ...


So far I’ve tried 4 different Movies on all the devices and at some point it buffers during playback so I would assume they are all transcoding for some odd reason. 

My LG 4K TV is Wired
Xbox One X is Wired
All the rest is wireless utilizing Wifi 5GHz AC
WiFi Connection Rated for 1300Mbps on 5GHz
ISP Speeds is for 300/50 

I read the link a little and I see the GPU must support H.265 decoding which I would assume only newer gens do 

Actually I no longer have the rig in my specs tragically, I just never got around to remove it 



CrAsHnBuRnXp said:


> What are you using to RIP the 4K Blurays? I am also looking to add 4K content to my server.
> 
> 
> There is a new video standard (cant recall the name of it atm) but it will allow the compression of say 10GB 4K video files down to 3GB or less.
> ...


ATM I’m not ripping any Blu-rays. My collection consists of disc and digital copies through Ultraviolet and Amazon


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## cdawall (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> I read the link a little and I see the GPU must support H.265 decoding which I would assume only newer gens do



You can slap a GT 1030 in it to do a single stream of 4K from what I understand, but most recommend a 1060 3GB.


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## Jetster (Apr 24, 2018)

Newer Intel 7th gen CPUs have way better 4K playback. Better than most older GPUs

Also I don't care for plex on local playback. It tends to decrease sound quality.


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## neatfeatguy (Apr 24, 2018)

CrAsHnBuRnXp said:


> What are you using to RIP the 4K Blurays? I am also looking to add 4K content to my server.
> 
> 
> There is a new video standard (cant recall the name of it atm) but it will allow the compression of say 10GB 4K video files down to 3GB or less.
> ...



I'd hate to see what a 4k video size is not compressed. Since I'm still in the process of copying my DVDs, just the other day I pulled a copy of Finding Dory from Blu-Ray and it was 20+GB in mkv format. Changing it over to mp4 and it went down to about 6GB. Using AnyDVD+Handbrake and Blu-Ray would be 3.5-5GB.



Durvelle27 said:


> So far I’ve tried 4 different Movies on all the devices and at some point it buffers during playback so I would assume they are all transcoding for some odd reason.
> 
> My LG 4K TV is Wired
> Xbox One X is Wired
> ...



Bit of looking around and this wiki page should give a complete list of current (and past) GPUs and what they can do for encoding/decoding. Hopefully this helps you out some if you haven't already come across this info.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

Would a newer Gen APU be sufficient since you get both a CPU and newer R7 IGP


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## Jetster (Apr 24, 2018)

The i3 8350 is the perfect 4k htpc cpu


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

Jetster said:


> The i3 8350 is the perfect 4k htpc cpu


The entry for intel is just to high

Like mentioned not trying to spend an awful lot. Preferably under $300

I was eye balling a Quad Core APU & a small board with 4GB-8GB of RAM


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## Jetster (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> The entry for intel is just to high
> 
> Like mentioned not trying to spend an awful lot. Preferably under $300
> 
> I was eye balling a Quad Core APU & a small board with 4GB-8GB of RAM



Yea I saw that after i wrote it. 4k is tough and with plex its not Ideal. Plex is designed to reduce quality when bandwidth and hardware is limited.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

Jetster said:


> Yea I saw that after i wrote it. 4k is tough and with plex its not Ideal. Plex is designed to reduce quality when bandwidth and hardware is limited.


Problem is Plex is the only widely used app that supports multiple plateform a out the gate 

So doing as much reading as possible 

Would a cheap dual core rig and a modern GPU get the job done versus being strictly CPU as it seems even i7s struggle at 4K transcoding.


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## Jetster (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> Problem is Plex is the only widely used app that supports multiple plateform a out the gate
> 
> So doing as much reading as possible
> 
> Would a cheap dual core rig and a modern GPU get the job done versus being strictly CPU as it seems even i7s struggle at 4K transcoding.



If you just want 4K on the host yes. Depends on which dual core.

What I do is run Kodi for local and Plex to stream. But I dont do 4 k

Keep in mind. A Plex Pass is required for hardware accelerated streaming

https://support.plex.tv/articles/115002178853-using-hardware-accelerated-streaming/


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

Something I just found out which seems to be working pretty good so far
The Plex DirectPlay which basically just sends the raw file to whatever device pulling it no transcoding involved at all. But the device must support the original file.

Playing Fate of the Furious 4K HVEC from the server to my Xbox One S the CPU usage is around 20% and the movie has not buffered any and plays greatly. I’d still have to test on the smart TVs though

Still want to build a dedicated server though


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## Jetster (Apr 24, 2018)

FreeNAS has a Plex add on


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

So far what I noticed goes for both 4K and 1080P

4K HVEC plays fine H.265 Plays Fine but H.264 requires transcoding


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## cdawall (Apr 24, 2018)

Dedicated server just needs an i3 and an nvidia gpu. Technically amd is not supported yet and mixed results are seen.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

cdawall said:


> Dedicated server just needs an i3 and an nvidia gpu. Technically amd is not supported yet and mixed results are seen.


New gen i3 or any i3 or any dually as newer Pentiums are close to i3s or newer AMD like Raven Ridge or Bristol Ridge


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## cdawall (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> New gen i3 or any i3 or any dually as newer Pentiums are close to i3s or newer AMD like Raven Ridge or Bristol Ridge



I would personally do one of the new quad core i3's, just because that one time you try to push one too many streams and it does have to transcode. I like the have and not need idea. An AMD ryzen chip would be fine too. I however do not know how the GPU implementation works. I only know their notes say quicksync and nvidia work and quicksync on the intel IGP is only so good.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> Problem is Plex is the only widely used app that supports multiple plateform a out the gate
> 
> So doing as much reading as possible
> 
> Would a cheap dual core rig and a modern GPU get the job done versus being strictly CPU as it seems even i7s struggle at 4K transcoding.


Emby aka Media Browser.

Cheap and media server don't really mix.



Durvelle27 said:


> 4K HVEC plays fine H.265 Plays Fine but H.264 requires transcoding


H.264 4K is extremely heavy (that's what the file I described before is).  The Xbox Ones should be able to handle it no problem but your TVs will croak.  You need something at least as strong as the NVIDIA SHIELD to handle 4K H.264 decoding.


> Up to 4K HDR playback at 60 FPS (H.265/HEVC)
> Up to 4K playback at 60 FPS (VP8, VP9, H.264, MPEG1/2)
> Up to 1080p playback at 60 FPS (H.263, MJPEG, MPEG4, WMV9/VC1)


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

cdawall said:


> I would personally do one of the new quad core i3's, just because that one time you try to push one too many streams and it does have to transcode. I like the have and not need idea. An AMD ryzen chip would be fine too. I however do not know how the GPU implementation works. I only know their notes say quicksync and nvidia work and quicksync on the intel IGP is only so good.


I might do the AMD route since it’s cheaper than an i3 Quad 



FordGT90Concept said:


> Emby aka Media Browser.
> 
> Cheap and media server don't really mix.
> 
> ...


First part threw me off 

Cheap doesn’t mean mediocre. You can build cheap capable rigs especially in this day and age with upto 8 cores being mainstream 

The Xbox Ones buffers during H.264 playback and the CPU spikes to 100%


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> The Xbox Ones buffers during H.264 playback and the CPU spikes to 100%


Does Plex have FFMPEG logs?  You should be able to see why Plex thought it necessary to transcode.  I've played 4K H.264 MP4 on my Xbox One S and SHIELD without issues.

You can use MPC-HC, open the file, then do File -> Properties to get the details of the stream.

What container is it?  If it isn't a supported container, Plex is forced to transcode it:
https://support.xbox.com/en-US/xbox-one/console/media-player-faq#27b16eeabc08471684b879bece6df03c


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## cdawall (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> I might do the AMD route since it’s cheaper than an i3 Quad



The i3 quad can do quicksync with the IGP as a benefit however.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Does Plex have FFMPEG logs?  You should be able to see why Plex thought it necessary to transcode.  I've played 4K H.264 MP4 on my Xbox One S and SHIELD without issues.
> 
> You can use MPC-HC, open the file, then do File -> Properties to get the details of the stream.
> 
> ...


How do I pull the logs 

The containers are .mkv



cdawall said:


> The i3 quad can do quicksync with the IGP as a benefit however.


But it will still struggle at transcoding without a ddg


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> How do I pull the logs


What process do you see taking the CPU to 100%?  Is it FFMPEG or something else?  Plex has this page but it says utterly nothing helpful:
https://support.plex.tv/articles/200250377-transcoding-media/


> Plex Universal Transcoder: The original Plex Transcoder will be replaced completely by the Plex Universal Transcoder. It includes all the smarts of the old transcoder but is much more powerful, faster and smarter. If you see an option in a client to use the Universal Transcoder, it should generally be enabled. If you’re having problems with certain media, try turning the Universal Transcoder off.


Not FFMPEG.  Could try turning "Universal Transcoder" off as it says forcing it back to FFMPEG.



Durvelle27 said:


> The containers are .mkv


Not the container then.  Gotta be something about the video/audio streams that the Xbox One doesn't natively support.  Or could be an error in Plex where it is transcoding when it shouldn't be.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> What process do you see taking the CPU to 100%?  Is it FFMPEG or something else?  Plex has this page but it says utterly nothing helpful:
> https://support.plex.tv/articles/200250377-transcoding-media/
> 
> Not FFMPEG.  Could try turning "Universal Transcoder" off as it says forcing it back to FFMPEG.
> ...


All the audio portions are AC3


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 24, 2018)

That could be the problem.  Mine is AAC and I've seen my server remux (not transcode) AC3 to AAC.  If Plex transcodes instead of simply remuxing...yeah, there's probably you're problem.  Transcode is a huge burden where remuxing isn't.

More info: https://www.macxdvd.com/mac-dvd-video-converter-how-to/aac-vs-ac3-comparison.htm

It's hard to say for certain though without seeing some logs detailing why the transcoding is happening.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> What process do you see taking the CPU to 100%?  Is it FFMPEG or something else?  Plex has this page but it says utterly nothing helpful:
> https://support.plex.tv/articles/200250377-transcoding-media/
> 
> Not FFMPEG.  Could try turning "Universal Transcoder" off as it says forcing it back to FFMPEG.
> ...


Weirdly i don't see any plex processes but the server itself



FordGT90Concept said:


> That could be the problem.  Mine is AAC and I've seen my server remux (not transcode) AC3 to AAC.  If Plex transcodes instead of simply remuxing...yeah, there's probably you're problem.  Transcode is a huge burden where remuxing isn't.
> 
> More info: https://www.macxdvd.com/mac-dvd-video-converter-how-to/aac-vs-ac3-comparison.htm
> 
> It's hard to say for certain though without seeing some logs detailing why the transcoding is happening.


So i've been playing with it all night and i modified the DLNA Client preferences to force 4K and DirectStream so now all the 4K movies play good on my LG TV but they still buffer on H.264 on my Xbox's


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## cdawall (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> But it will still struggle at transcoding without a ddg



Well that means you need to go the same route as me. This and a standalone GPU is unbeatable.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 24, 2018)

cdawall said:


> Well that means you need to go the same route as me. This and a standalone GPU is unbeatable.


Like we all have thousands to throw


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 24, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> So i've been playing with it all night and i modified the DLNA Client preferences to force 4K and DirectStream so now all the 4K movies play good on my LG TV but they still buffer on H.264 on my Xbox's


Great! Now to figure out why Xbox One S can't stream it.  Like I said, copying the properties of it from HPC-MC would be helpful.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Great! Now to figure out why Xbox One S can't stream it.  Like I said, copying the properties of it from HPC-MC would be helpful.


I can’t find the logs you mentioned


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> Like we all have thousands to throw



That chip was less than you think.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

cdawall said:


> That chip was less than you think.


less tan 1K more than $500


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## Jetster (Apr 25, 2018)

My understanding is if you streaming from your Plex server over network or ip the standalone GPU does nothing. Its all CPU rendering.

I use an i3 and that's it. Watch at work, on my phone, my brothers house, daughter watches it at her house


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

Jetster said:


> My understanding is if you streaming from your Plex server over network or ip the standalone GPU does nothing. Its all CPU rendering.
> 
> I use an i3 and that's it. Watch at work, on my phone, my brothers house, daughter watches it at her house


If that’s the case that really sucks

So i couldn't pull logs but i screen shoted this 










As seen on the Xbox One X its transcoding both the Audio and Video

on the LG TV its directly streaming the video but transcoding the Audio

even the audio transcoding is weird as my HT supports Dolby Digital


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> I can’t find the logs you mentioned


It's apparently in the server log.  Where that is, I don't know.  On a search, I did find this:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...9GklVycFTfqBTYidRs5bqT2onI/edit#gid=101193936

And there's the problem... mkv (≤2160p) h.264 is not supported.  I verified myself.  My mp4 4K h.264 is just a green video on the Xbox One S.  Pathetic.  The Xbox One has enough GPU power to decode it yet for some reason, Microsoft prohibits it.

I suspect it is downsampling it instead of actually transcoding it (because h.264 to h.264).  Either way, transcoding 4K video is a bad idea.


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## neatfeatguy (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> It's apparently in the server log.  Where that is, I don't know.  On a search, I did find this:
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...9GklVycFTfqBTYidRs5bqT2onI/edit#gid=101193936
> 
> And there's the problem... mkv (≤2160p) h.264 is not supported.  I verified myself.  My mp4 4K h.264 is just a green video on the Xbox One S.  Pathetic.  The Xbox One has enough GPU power to decode it yet for some reason, Microsoft prohibits it.



I think the issue you may be having is the fact that Xbox One (from what I can find) doesn't support mp4. Here's a list of video/media files Xbox One media player is compatible with (can find it here):

*3GP audio*
*3GP video*
*3GP2*
*AAC*
*ADTS*
*animated GIF*
*.asf*
*AVI DivX*
*DV AVI*
*AVI uncompressed*
*AVI Xvid*
*BMP*
*JPEG*
*GIF*
*H.264 AVCHD*
*M-JPEG*
*.mkv*
*.mov*
*MP3*
*MPEG-PS*
*MPEG-2 MPEG-2 HD*
*MPEG-2 TS*
*H.264/MPEG-4 AVC*
*MPEG-4 SP*
*PNG*
*TIFF*
*WAV*
*WMA*
*WMA Lossless*
*WMA Pro*
*WMA Voice*
*WMV*
*WMV HD*
As for the server log, I don't know if this is what you're specifically looking for, but you can download the logs from the Plex Server. Go into Settings > Server > Help and you should see this page so you can download the logs:


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

"H.264/MPEG-4 AVC" it supports it, just not at 4K or greater resolutions.  Plex's list is accurate.  Xbox One S only supports 4K HEVC or MPEG4 (*not h.264*).  Xbox One X also adds support for 4K VP9.


I'm thinking the best solution is to convert it from h.264 to HEVC.  HEVC is what ATSC 3.0 is moving towards anyway.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> It's apparently in the server log.  Where that is, I don't know.  On a search, I did find this:
> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...9GklVycFTfqBTYidRs5bqT2onI/edit#gid=101193936
> 
> And there's the problem... mkv (≤2160p) h.264 is not supported.  I verified myself.  My mp4 4K h.264 is just a green video on the Xbox One S.  Pathetic.  The Xbox One has enough GPU power to decode it yet for some reason, Microsoft prohibits it.
> ...


No clue here either 

Not sure where you found that google doc but man that really clears everything up for sure. So basically only my Smart TVs with Plex support direct play with no transcoding which accounts for 2 of my TVs the other 2 don’t have Plex Apps

Neither Xbox One nor my Chromecast Ultra support DirectPlay @4K though 

Definitely need a better server than for transcoding the media 



neatfeatguy said:


> I think the issue you may be having is the fact that Xbox One (from what I can find) doesn't support mp4. Here's a list of video/media files Xbox One media player is compatible with (can find it here):
> 
> *3GP audio*
> *3GP video*
> ...


That list really isn’t that helpful as I’ve seen it numerous times but it doesn’t account for 4K



FordGT90Concept said:


> "H.264/MPEG-4 AVC" it supports it, just not at 4K or greater resolutions.  Plex's list is accurate.  Xbox One S only supports 4K HEVC or MPEG4 (*not h.264*).  Xbox One X also adds support for 4K VP9.
> 
> 
> I'm thinking the best solution is to convert it from h.264 to HEVC.  HEVC is what ATSC 3.0 is moving towards anyway.


I can confirm the Xbox One does play 4K HEVC just fine 

Converting from H.264 to HEVC would still require a better rig for the process. Likely a decent Quad


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> less tan 1K more than $500









 They got cheaper than this too.


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## Jetster (Apr 25, 2018)

MP4 is supported. If the compresion is not supported it will trans code it
This is why I was saying Plex is not the best option for 4K. If it does not support the compression it will transcode it an deduce the quality

Getting ready to rebuild my NAS collecting 6 Tb drives


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> Neither Xbox One nor my Chromecast Ultra support DirectPlay @4K though


Xbox One does if it is HEVC or MPEG4.  I'm going to try using Handbrake to convert mine to HEVC.

Edit: Core i7-6700K at stock is going to take 14.5 19.5 21.5 hours (and keeps rising) to transcode the 88 minute video at 25 fps.  cdawall wasn't joking.  Live transcoding this isn't going to happen.  It's estimating over a day now.


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Xbox One does if it is HEVC or MPEG4.  I'm going to try using Handbrake to convert mine to HEVC.
> 
> Edit: Core i7-6700K at stock is going to take 14.5 19.5 21.5 hours (and keeps rising) to transcode the 88 minute video at 25 fps.  cdawall wasn't joking.  Live transcoding this isn't going to happen.  It's estimating over a day now.



With my 16 core xeon humming it can get 10 minute batches done at a time live transcoding, but then it sits and buffers on 4K.






Mind you that is with file sizes like that...and full dolby atmos surround.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

8 hours and 25% done.  I only have the one 4K file so it's worth it to me to git-r-done.  This one was 20 GB coming in so quite a bit smaller than yours.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> 8 hours and 25% done.  I only have the one 4K file so it's worth it to me to git-r-done.  This one was 20 GB coming in so quite a bit smaller than yours.


Most of my 4K files range between 20GB-60GB



Jetster said:


> MP4 is supported. If the compresion is not supported it will trans code it
> This is why I was saying Plex is not the best option for 4K. If it does not support the compression it will transcode it an deduce the quality
> 
> Getting ready to rebuild my NAS collecting 6 Tb drives


But Plex is the only universal server available that’s supported by my Xbox’s and my TVs

But you guys think even with a better rig it still won’t work well. Just need 4K playback on the fly.


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## Jetster (Apr 25, 2018)

I think it will work great. Just might not be 4k when all said and done but go for it


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> Just need 4K playback on the fly.


Without direct play, that's just not possible unless you're prepared to blow five digits worth of money on a transcoding server (probably a four-way EPYC).  Even that might still buffer.

Emby has similar support but it won't solve your 4K problem.



Durvelle27 said:


> Most of my 4K files range between 20GB-60GB


How many do you have?  Does all your play back equipment support HEVC?  The most sane solution is to set up a separate computer (because the conversion will load the system to 100%) to convert them all.  Once they're converted, you're good to go on your current hardware.

I think Handbrake actually runs its conversion threads at low priority.  I'm able to play Battletech and can't even tell my CPU is still busy on the conversion.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Without direct play, that's just not possible unless you're prepared to blow five digits worth of money on a transcoding server (probably a four-way EPYC).  Even that might still buffer.
> 
> Emby has similar support but it won't solve your 4K problem.
> 
> ...


Right now like 20 many movies which will continue to grow over time 

Yes all my devices support 4K HVEC

And the whole idea was to have a computer dedicated as a server. It wouldn’t be used for anything else outside of that.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

So about a month to transcode on a high-end quad-core.  Make sure to rip future movies as HEVC.  Seems like the best solution to me and costs you nothing but some time.

I am not doing this conversion on my server because I don't want to interrupt it in case it has to transcode something else on demand.  I usually don't leave my computer running 24/7 but I can make an exception for two nights.


Like I said, ATSC 3.0 is going to adopt HEVC for OTA content.  HEVC is going to become more prevalent in the future, not less.  This is why I have no problem spending the ~34 hours it takes to convert it.  It's future proofing in a sense because I can't count on Microsoft not being stupid with h.264 4K support.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> So about a month to transcode on a high-end quad-core.  Make sure to rip future movies as HEVC.  Seems like the best solution to me and costs you nothing but some time.
> 
> I am not doing this conversion on my server because I don't want to interrupt it in case it has to transcode something else on demand.  I usually don't leave my computer running 24/7 but I can make an exception for two nights.
> 
> ...


My rigs normally run 24/7 

I think it’s kind of a selfish move by Microsoft to limit the range of compatible formats considering they push Xbox to be the all around best entertainment system


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## arroyo (Apr 25, 2018)

My Asustor AS6204T NAS is doing as Plex server with perfectly fine performence and it is only Celeron N3150.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

arroyo said:


> My Asustor AS6204T NAS is doing as Plex server with perfectly fine performence and it is only Celeron N3150.


If you read through the thread Plex runs and plays fine but when it comes to 4K H.264 it’s a struggle


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> I think it’s kind of a selfish move by Microsoft to limit the range of compatible formats considering they push Xbox to be the all around best entertainment system


Only reason I can think of that they don't is because perhaps the Jaguar CPU cores can't handle it.



arroyo said:


> My Asustor AS6204T NAS is doing as Plex server with perfectly fine performence and it is only Celeron N3150.


Direct streaming, Plex/Emby could run on a toaster.  The moment something requires transcoding, that's when toasters won't do.  Modest processors can handle 1080p.  2160p is a completely different animal (exponentially more costly to transcode than 1080p).


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Direct streaming, Plex/Emby could run on a toaster. The moment something requires transcoding, that's when toasters won't do. Modest processors can handle 1080p. 2160p is a completely different animal (exponentially more costly to transcode than 1080p).



Exactly I have tested up to 8 1080P transcodes simultaneously with my xeon. It cannot handle one 4k transcoding.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

cdawall said:


> Exactly I have tested up to 8 1080P transcodes simultaneously with my xeon. It cannot handle one 4k transcoding.


That’s just insane


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

I think Vega or even Polaris can maybe do it (supports HEVC encoding and h.264 decoding) but the software side of things isn't really there.  About the only thing I found on this subject: 




__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/4yjaya

There's apparently a Windows-only library that works but Plex/Emby support is virtually nonexistent.  NVENC gets a lot more love for some reason.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I think Vega or even Polaris can maybe do it (supports HEVC encoding and h.264 decoding) but the software side of things isn't really there.  About the only thing I found on this subject:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Most Nvidia GPUs also support both encoding and decoding of H.264 & HEVC as well


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

Yeah but Radeon cards have a lot more compute horsepower for the buck and also no arbitrary limit on number of streams.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Yeah but Radeon cards have a lot more compute horsepower for the buck and also no arbitrary limit on number of streams.


I’m going to get a cheaper AMD GPU that supports HEVC and H.264 and see if it helps if any and pair it with a Quad. Hopefully that can geter done


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

I wouldn't recommend it.  I've never successfully used Radeon to transcode.  People using NVENC is spotty too.

Edit: https://support.plex.tv/articles/115002178853-using-hardware-accelerated-streaming/
Plex only supports QuickSync and NVENC.  MediaFoundation may support encoding on Radeon cards but I wouldn't put money on that.

Edit: Emby has a lot more options but your mileage may vary:





Edit: MF for Plex and AMD AMF for Emby are Windows-only.


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## HammerON (Apr 25, 2018)

Sub'd out of interest for a future project.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I wouldn't recommend it.  I've never successfully used Radeon to transcode.  People using NVENC is spotty too.
> 
> Edit: https://support.plex.tv/articles/115002178853-using-hardware-accelerated-streaming/
> Plex only supports QuickSync and NVENC.  MediaFoundation may support encoding on Radeon cards but I wouldn't put money on that.
> ...


OS I’m using is Windows 10 so that’s no issue


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> That’s just insane



I don't think plex can scale to all of the cores correctly. It seems ok pushes multiple small transcodes to 2-4 threads, but giving 32 threads one job doesn't work.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

cdawall said:


> I don't think plex can scale to all of the cores correctly. It seems ok pushes multiple small transcodes to 2-4 threads, but giving 32 threads one job doesn't work.


I wonder if it’s possible to force the use of multiple threads. I remember seeing a setting that asked how many threads to use when transcoding. I have the lastest version as well.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

You already said that it's using 100% CPU.  This is a dual core yeah?  It's already multithreaded.  I mean, what transcoding software isn't?  Multithreaded is the only way to do it in real time.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> You already said that it's using 100% CPU.  This is a dual core yeah?  It's already multithreaded.  I mean, what transcoding software isn't?  Multithreaded is the only way to do it in real time.


Yep dual core 

I was more responding to his statement about plex not using over 4 threads


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 25, 2018)

Yeah, there should be an option to change that somewhere in the config.  Emby for sure has an option (defaults to "Max").


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2018)

Pretty positive anythibg I could set to max is set to max. That doesn't mean it can use everything however.


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## Kursah (Apr 25, 2018)

There is a setting for CPU that I set to "Make my CPU hurt" but that's all I recall for PLEX GUI CPU configs.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 25, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Yeah, there should be an option to change that somewhere in the config.  Emby for sure has an option (defaults to "Max").


I believe there is 



cdawall said:


> Pretty positive anythibg I could set to max is set to max. That doesn't mean it can use everything however.


Very true as it depends on how Plex sees and uses resources 


Kursah said:


> There is a setting for CPU that I set to "Make my CPU hurt" but that's all I recall for PLEX GUI CPU configs.


But does it push over 4 threads


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## cdawall (Apr 25, 2018)

There are my current settings give me a sec I am checking to see how many threads it uses.

So this is suicide just the audio transcode, while it does a conversion on another file zero issues at all






Now this is 4K to 1080P "High quality 20MBps" no background conversion active. Definitely does not load all of the threads that I can tell?






4k to 4k (@49.1MBps) for the same video does seem to load her all the way up though 






and here is two 1080P to 720P streams going


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## Kursah (Apr 26, 2018)

Durvelle27 said:


> But does it push over 4 threads



Don't know, the VM I run it on (that also hosts other services) only is allocated 4 threads.

These are my settings:





I don't stream 4K nor try, I don't have a 4K screen in my home lol. But I have streamed 4-5 1080P without issue. I am a Plex Pass member, bought the lifetime license back in 2015 and have been pretty damn happy with it. Most of its deployment life has been in a virtual 2012R2 environment and I gotta say it has performed excellent for my needs.

Also, not sure why I even have hardware acceleration checked being on a VM lol. But it doesn't seem to be kicking up errors or issues.

I will say I did notice a performance improvement going to make my CPU hurt from default, I didn't really test anything else in between and it can absolutely saturate the provisioned threads when there's a lot going on, but again, I have only allocated 4 threads.


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 26, 2018)

cdawall said:


> *snip*


Are all those streams smooth though?  The idea of transcoding is to not use 100%, just maintain a higher conversion rate than the client needs (e.g. 30 fps for a 30 fps video).  If those conversions aren't smooth then yeah, Plex sucks.


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## cdawall (Apr 26, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Are all those streams smooth though?  The idea of transcoding is to not use 100%, just maintain a higher conversion rate than the client needs (e.g. 30 fps for a 30 fps video).  If those conversions aren't smooth then yeah, Plex sucks.



The only one that isn't smooth is the 4k one everything else is fine. I also need to retest that tonight on a hardwired machine and not just to my iPad. Wireless ac is nice, but it has its limits.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 26, 2018)

I found a cheap 8 Core Xeon that hopefully can get the job done. Also looking into FirePro for the GPU


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 26, 2018)

It has to be Polaris or newer to support HEVC.


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 26, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> It has to be Polaris or newer to support HEVC.


Anything that supports UVD 5.0 or Higher


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 26, 2018)

No, UVD = Universal Video Decoder.  It's the VCE (Video Coding Engine) that's important server side.  VCE lags behind UVD because accelerating encoding is more difficult than accelerating decoding.

HEVC support started with VCE3, implemented in GCN3 (Tonga, Fiji).


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 26, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> No, UVD = Universal Video Decoder.  It's the VCE (Video Coding Engine) that's important server side.  VCE lags behind UVD because accelerating encoding is more difficult than accelerating decoding.
> 
> HEVC support started with VCE3, implemented in GCN3 (Tonga, Fiji).


Ahhhh ok


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 26, 2018)

I'm trying to figure out what changed in VCE4 (Vega).  It might be the addition of VP9 encoding which is kind of important but can't confirm anything yet because references are scarce...


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 26, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I'm trying to figure out what changed in VCE4 (Vega).  It might be the addition of VP9 encoding which is kind of important but can't confirm anything yet because references are scarce...


Yes it seems Vega and RX400 series added support for VP9 and 8 & 10 Bit decoding unlike the rest


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## FordGT90Concept (Apr 26, 2018)

My 40 hour transcode was successful.  20 GB h.264 -> 3.5 GB HEVC.  Ironically, HEVC doesn't work on my computer because my R9 390 doesn't support it.  It works on the Xbox One S though.  I'm going to have to keep both files until Microsoft gets their head out of their bum (I hope).  I mean, if a SHIELD can handle 4K h.264 then why can't an Xbox One?


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## Durvelle27 (Apr 26, 2018)

FordGT90Concept said:


> My 40 hour transcode was successful.  20 GB h.264 -> 3.5 GB HEVC.  Ironically, HEVC doesn't work on my computer because my R9 390 doesn't support it.  It works on the Xbox One S though.  I'm going to have to keep both files until Microsoft gets their head out of their bum (I hope).  I mean, if a SHIELD can handle 4K h.264 then why can't an Xbox One?


That’s a long time for 1 file 

And yea that’s true. Even more so for the Xbox One X that has a Polaris GPU

So this is what I’m looking at

Xeon 8 Core
16GB RAm
GT 1030


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