# Help to decide - 3200 CL16 / 3600 CL16?



## saarxee (Jan 27, 2021)

I going maybe to buy kit of 64GB ram.
The memory module is Z Royal which is a very good for overclocking (I think)
and the price difference between them is 100$.

The processor is 5900X so.. it efficient more with 3600?
I can overclock the 3200 to 3600 CL16 maybe?
This kits are supported by the mobo in the Gskill QVL site... (X570 Taichi)


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## kapone32 (Jan 27, 2021)

That sounds like you are going to use all 4 DIMM slots. My thought process is to get the 3600 16. Even though the MB may be able to OC to 3600 from 3200 I doubt that you will see 16 timings. 3600 is the best speed for AM4 as it gives a 1 to 1 FCLK (1800 mhz). The other option would be to get the 3200 set and try to downclock them to 14 timings. I know you may be set on Royal Z but Adata D60G RAM are also good and the whole heat spreader is ARGB. 






						ADATA XPG Spectrix D60G RGB 16GB DDR4-3600 CL18 Dual Channel Kit (2x 8GB), Tungsten Grey  - PC4-28800 DDR4 3600 - Memory Express Inc.
					






					www.memoryexpress.com


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## freeagent (Jan 27, 2021)

I bought 2 3200 CL14 kits and am running at 3800 CL14. One set of my mixed setup are Royals, and the other are their Black and Whites.

Just saw you want 64GB.. sorry cant help you there


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## saarxee (Jan 27, 2021)

kapone32 said:


> That sounds like you are going to use all 4 DIMM slots. My thought process is to get the 3600 16. Even though the MB may be able to OC to 3600 from 3200 I doubt that you will see 16 timings. 3600 is the best speed for AM4 as it gives a 1 to 1 FCLK (1800 mhz). The other option would be to get the 3200 set and try to downclock them to 14 timings. I know you may be set on Royal Z but Adata D60G RAM are also good and the whole heat spreader is ARGB.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



umm not sure. I can buy 2X32GB sticks of 3200 CL16.
but if in the future I will upgrade to 128GB and buy same sticks.. not sure if that works properly.
And the D60G is CL18.. not very good.
Some people told the best for AM4 is maybe 3800 or 4000.



freeagent said:


> I bought 2 3200 CL14 kits and am running at 3800 CL14. One set of my mixed setup are Royals, and the other are their Black and Whites.
> 
> Just saw you want 64GB.. sorry cant help you there


The royals worth that? really beauty?


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## ThrashZone (Jan 27, 2021)

Hi,
You really don't have to get the royal line any b-die which is 3600c16 will do fine on amd or intel.
3200c16 is not a good set period, total waste of money at what ever price except maybe free.
You don't show a region so just use that app for amount and brand.
B-Die Finder


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## saarxee (Jan 27, 2021)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> You really don't have to get the royal line any b-die which is 3600c16 will do fine on amd or intel.
> 3200c16 is not a good set period, total waste of money at what ever price except maybe free.
> You don't show a region so just use that app for amount and brand.
> B-Die Finder


I dont understand you..
The design of the royals is fine and he support with my mobo on QVL so why not? The Taichi have short list of RAMs..


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## ThrashZone (Jan 27, 2021)

saarxee said:


> I dont understand you..
> The design of the royals is fine and he support with my mobo on QVL so why not? The Taichi have short list of RAMs..


Hi,
Thought I was pretty clear
Royal line might be more than other trident z series is all, mine are either black on black or white on silver but none are rgb but they perform great.
If you like the royals then buy them.


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## freeagent (Jan 27, 2021)

I don't know if they are worth it.. They are my first set of DDR4 sticks. They had the speed and timings I was looking for. Price was a little higher then the others but I'm worth it  My original plan was to have a 5000 series CPU, and my kids would get this one with a cheap board and the black and whites. Those B+Ws are rated for the same speed and timings. They just don't clock as nice.. and were a lot cheaper.

Edit:  

I am running 4x8GB at 1900 14-15-15-35 1.5v because my B+Ws cant do that speed at 14-14-14-34 like my Royals can @ the same voltage.


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## ThrashZone (Jan 27, 2021)

Hi,
Bottom line 3200c16 is garbage 
3200c14 yeah this one is a nice kit.


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## Deleted member 193596 (Jan 27, 2021)

octa rank 4 dimms can be a bit tricky if you got a really bad imc...


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## saarxee (Jan 27, 2021)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Bottom line 3200c16 is garbage
> 3200c14 yeah this one is a nice kit.


But it doesnt appear in the QVL of gskill site.. only 3200 cl16 and 3600 cl16


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## thesmokingman (Jan 27, 2021)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Bottom line 3200c16 is garbage
> 3200c14 yeah this one is a nice kit.


This. For ex. 3200c14=3600c16 but 3200c16 is not only much slower but guaranteed hynix or other lower tier IC.


saarxee said:


> But it doesnt appear in the QVL of gskill site.. only 3200 cl16 and 3600 cl16


It may sound strange but I don't ever bother looking at them, instead I focus on getting quality IC and stick to good brands like g.skill.


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## Zach_01 (Jan 27, 2021)

Go for some 3600MHz CL16 kit. And it doesn’t have to be super tight timings.
A CL16-18-18-18-36/38 would be just fine. Or even CL16-19-19-19-38...

Unless you have money to throw and go for 3600MHz CL16-16-16-16-36 or even a 3600MHz CL14. Crazy money without really have the same perf increase. On real life performance I mean and not just memory benchmarks.


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## freeagent (Jan 28, 2021)

Zach_01 said:


> Go for some 3600MHz CL16 kit. And it doesn’t have to be super tight timings.
> A CL16-18-18-18-36/38 would be just fine. Or even CL16-19-19-19-38...
> 
> Unless you have money to throw and go for 3600MHz CL16-16-16-16-36 or even a 3600MHz CL14. Crazy money without really have the same perf increase. On real life performance I mean and not just memory benchmarks.


Black Friday was a good time to buy


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## crimsontape (Jan 28, 2021)

Wasn't it recently discussed across some reviews that the Zen3 architecture does better with 4 DIMMs over 2, and dual-rank DIMMs actually offer greater peak bandwidth? I recall it was a point of huge debate for a while because of the discrepancies between different reviewers. Some reviewers pointed to a lower average IPC gain for Zen3 as a result, leading to confused poo-pooing of the CPU. Meanwhile, the "32GB 1600MHz CL16" RAM each was employing was the issue. Was it 4x8GB, 2x16GB, single or dual rank, optimized or just XMP profiled?

For speeds and latency, I'm pretty sure 3600MHz CL16 will be a good bet. I would stick to 4 DIMMs. And, I personally think the simpler the better. LEDs are the loudest thing ever, and they'll slap them on everything up to a ham sandwich. They add unnecessary expenses and points of failure. That said... Them G.SKILL Trident Z Royal are reeeaal peerrrrty hahaha


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## Zach_01 (Jan 28, 2021)

And to add on the RGB matter...
The software for controlling RGB is the worst ever made. Causing issues, from not letting CPU to fall to low C-States up to system crashes. I literally hate them...


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## RandallFlagg (Jan 28, 2021)

crimsontape said:


> Wasn't it recently discussed across some reviews that the Zen3 architecture does better with 4 DIMMs over 2, and dual-rank DIMMs actually offer greater peak bandwidth? I recall it was a point of huge debate for a while because of the discrepancies between different reviewers. Some reviewers pointed to a lower average IPC gain for Zen3 as a result, leading to confused poo-pooing of the CPU. Meanwhile, the "32GB 1600MHz CL16" RAM each was employing was the issue. Was it 4x8GB, 2x16GB, single or dual rank, optimized or just XMP profiled?
> 
> For speeds and latency, I'm pretty sure 3600MHz CL16 will be a good bet. I would stick to 4 DIMMs. And, I personally think the simpler the better. LEDs are the loudest thing ever, and they'll slap them on everything up to a ham sandwich. They add unnecessary expenses and points of failure. That said... Them G.SKILL Trident Z Royal are reeeaal peerrrrty hahaha



2x Dual rank, or 4x single rank.  And it benefits both Intel and AMD.  Best way to get the performance boost is to get 2x16GB DIMMs (32GB) as the 16GB dimms are almost all dual rank - I would verify that on the specific kit though.  You also have lower latencies accessing different ranks on the same dimm vs going back and forth between DIMMs (this becomes apparent if you mess with sub-timings a bit).  Whether it benefits or not, depends on the benchmark / application being run.  

I'm not sure of the effect of going 64GB with 4x 16GB DIMMs though, there may be a performance penalty there with more memory transactions to different DIMMs.  More is not always better.


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## 80-watt Hamster (Jan 28, 2021)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Bottom line 3200c16 is garbage
> 3200c14 yeah this one is a nice kit.



At what point did 10ns memory become crap?


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## RandallFlagg (Jan 28, 2021)

80-watt Hamster said:


> At what point did 10ns memory become crap?



Happened on Dec 7th 2020 during a power outage at a Micron factory.  Sanjay Mehrotra immediately declared DDR4-3200 CL16 and slower to be crap.

/s


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## freeagent (Jan 28, 2021)

The gains from four sticks over two are pretty noticeable in some benchmarks, I really have to lean on this thing to get 2 sticks to perform close to 4.

If you run your 4 sticks of CL16 at 1900 or so you can get some really good performance. Even more so if you put in a little time to tune it.

Crazy good.


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## lexluthermiester (Jan 28, 2021)

saarxee said:


> I going maybe to buy kit of 64GB ram.
> The memory module is Z Royal which is a very good for overclocking (I think)
> and the price difference between them is 100$.
> 
> ...


How is this a question? Unless you really NEED 64GB, buy a 32GB 3600mhz kit. If you *do* need the 64GB, spend the extra money on the 3600mhz kit. It's worth it for any task that will actually use that much RAM.


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## Fry178 (Jan 28, 2021)

Your wasting your money in every aspect.
Outside video/photo editing/rendering/benchmarks etc, your not gonna see big gains for things like gaming.
for 64gb its gonna be at least four sticks (SR), or two sticks in DR, which will increase bandwidth, but add latency/"delay" vs 2 SR stick's (of lesser cap)
and it can make it harder on some boards to go past 2933/3200 (2 sticks DR, or 4 sticks SR)'
unless this changed with zen3.

outside that, most 5xxx cpus will allow 2000mhz for FCLK, and able to run ram at 2ghz as well (and 1:1 ratio)
so a two stick (SR) 16gb-4000 kit makes more sense, would be faster on clock and gain some fps.

and a (not top grade) b die kit is about 100-30$, and runs fine at lower speed with tighter timings if needed,
before i took rig apart (case/upgrades), i got 15-15-15-15/1T@1.34v (incl much better 2nd/3rd timings as well).

and dont worry about qvl or "quality" brands.
my +300$ board will not post with any gskill kit (qvl), but all the "stay away from" /non qvl corsair veng/pro kits i tried, ran at xmp/better, and didn't require 1.35 just to post with 2133 speeds like the gskills.

Not saying i wouldnt check if its on there, but i have seen enough times where being on qvl means "nothing" for stability.

i would recommend buying HCI (deluxe, so u can make a bootable usb), check to 100% with auto settings/jedec specs,
then use xmp/manually set tmings/voltage, and run hci to min 400% (16gb), better to 1000% overnight.


Patriot Viper Blackout
Steel series is same kit with different color, get whatever is cheaper (got mine for 90$).

edit to shorten..


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## thesmokingman (Jan 28, 2021)

freeagent said:


> The gains from four sticks over two are pretty noticeable in some benchmarks, I really have to lean on this thing to get 2 sticks to perform close to 4.
> 
> If you run your 4 sticks of CL16 at 1900 or so you can get some really good performance. Even more so if you put in a little time to tune it.
> 
> Crazy good.


It's not 4 sticks, it's four ranks. It doesn't matter the number of sticks.


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## Night (Jan 28, 2021)

thesmokingman said:


> It's not 4 sticks, it's four ranks. It doesn't matter the number of sticks.


4 sticks can either be dual rank, quad rank, 4 sticks != quad rank.


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## Zach_01 (Jan 28, 2021)

Yes but, 4 sticks could also mean 8 ranks and complicate things... The performance uplift is with a total of 4 ranks or 2 ranks/channel. So stick count is (?)irrelevant
Speaking with ranks is the proper way.


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## freeagent (Jan 28, 2021)

Sorry, I meant rank.


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## Durvelle27 (Jan 28, 2021)

I’ll just leave these here

these were taken from the tech spot review 

“Bottom line, if you’re a gamer wanting to maximize performance, if and when you run into CPU limited situations, and want the best bang for your buck, then we recommend getting DDR4-3600 CL16 memory. For most we suspect 16 GB will be fine, but if you can afford more, 32GB is nice and it means if you purchase two 16GB kits you’ll also have the advantage of dual ranked operation.”


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## Night (Jan 28, 2021)

Durvelle27 said:


> I’ll just leave these here
> 
> these were taken from the tech spot review
> 
> “Bottom line, if you’re a gamer wanting to maximize performance, if and when you run into CPU limited situations, and want the best bang for your buck, then we recommend getting DDR4-3600 CL16 memory. For most we suspect 16 GB will be fine, but if you can afford more, 32GB is nice and it means if you purchase two 16GB kits you’ll also have the advantage of dual ranked operation.”


Should also be noted that not all 16 GB DIMMs are dual rank, some are single rank.


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## Deleted member 193596 (Jan 28, 2021)

Night said:


> Should also be noted that not all 16 GB DIMMs are dual rank, some are single rank.


i've never seen single rank 16gb Dimms for desktop.
the only that i know are SO-Dimms from crucial.


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## Durvelle27 (Jan 28, 2021)

Just to add I run 32GB( 2x16GB) Dual rank @3600


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## Night (Jan 28, 2021)

WarTherapy1195 said:


> i've never seen single rank 16gb Dimms for desktop.
> the only that i know are SO-Dimms from crucial.


Some of the newer models should be single rank.


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## freeagent (Jan 28, 2021)

I've been inspired to pull 2 sticks out and push some buttons


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## ThrashZone (Jan 28, 2021)

80-watt Hamster said:


> At what point did 10ns memory become crap?


Hi,
Crap as in over clocking ability 3200c16 I doubt will ever do 3600 stable might only be worth 200mhz over rated speed and that's a big maybe heck it might not even do 3200 stable lol
Cas latency in this sets example 3200c16
c16 x 2 = 32 same number as the speed this always means oc ability is poor,* low bin this is why it's usually cheaper* in the op question "is 3600c16 worth 100.us more" and the best answer, yes it is
But there are also cheap kits at 3600c16 too but the op is preferring to stay on the qvl so between the two sets posted 3600c16 yes it's worth 100.us more seeing it can do 4000mhz easily so it is a far superior product.



Zach_01 said:


> And to add on the RGB matter...
> The software for controlling RGB is the worst ever made. Causing issues, from not letting CPU to fall to low C-States up to system crashes. I literally hate them...


Indeed from the pits of hell lol


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## freeagent (Jan 28, 2021)

ThrashZone said:


> Indeed from the pits of hell lol


I have never used RGB before, but Asus is terrible. The VRM light is messed up, I know its a software issue because the last time it happened a bios update fixed it lol.. Swore I would never use it again but couldn't leave it alone and now its borked again. Bios update didn't fix it   

Its terrible. I don't know what I was thinking 

OTH the system is pretty happy with only 2 sticks in. Took a small hit but nothing I can tell by using it with no 3D. Honestly I don't even care, I'm just going to run the one pair.. Ill tune it a bit more but just going to leave it after that.

It was fine @ stock lol..


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## ThrashZone (Jan 28, 2021)

freeagent said:


> I have never used RGB before, but Asus is terrible. The VRM light is messed up, I know its a software issue because the last time it happened a bios update fixed it lol.. Swore I would never use it again but couldn't leave it alone and now its borked again. Bios update didn't fix it
> 
> Its terrible. I don't know what I was thinking
> 
> ...


Hi,
Yeah I turn rgb off in bios 
Avoid rgb on hardware memory especially none of my kits have it 
Entered g-skill for platinum and gold drawings pretty sure I'd just sell the memory kits if I won either of them 4000c18 2x16 or 3600c16 2x16
Head phones or keyboard keys I wouldn't even pay for shipping... lol

G.SKILL International Enterprise Co., Ltd.


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## thesmokingman (Jan 28, 2021)

Night said:


> 4 sticks can either be dual rank, quad rank, 4 sticks != quad rank.


And you'd be wrong cuz you're ignoring the fundamental underneath like literally ignoring the number of ranks. As Zach mentioned sticks can be dual or single rank, so no you count the ranks not sticks.


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## saarxee (Jan 28, 2021)

kapone32 said:


> That sounds like you are going to use all 4 DIMM slots. My thought process is to get the 3600 16. Even though the MB may be able to OC to 3600 from 3200 I doubt that you will see 16 timings. 3600 is the best speed for AM4 as it gives a 1 to 1 FCLK (1800 mhz). The other option would be to get the 3200 set and try to downclock them to 14 timings. I know you may be set on Royal Z but Adata D60G RAM are also good and the whole heat spreader is ARGB.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I quoted you on the first page.. you can help please?


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## kapone32 (Jan 28, 2021)

saarxee said:


> I quoted you on the first page.. you can help please?


You are correct you don't want 2x32 GB  sticks but if you want 64 GB you could get 32GB for now and get another 32GB later. 






						XPG Spectrix D60G Dual RGB 32GB (2x16GB) 3600Mhz DDR4 U-DIMM CL18 Desktop Gaming Memory Kit (AX4U3600316G18A-DT60) : Amazon.ca: Electronics
					

XPG Spectrix D60G Dual RGB 32GB (2x16GB) 3600Mhz DDR4 U-DIMM CL18 Desktop Gaming Memory Kit (AX4U3600316G18A-DT60) : Amazon.ca: Electronics



					www.amazon.ca
				




vs 









						G.SKILL Trident Z Royal Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 4000 (PC4 32000) Desktop Memory Model F4-4000C18Q-32GTRS - Newegg.com
					

Buy G.SKILL Trident Z Royal Series 32GB (4 x 8GB) DDR4 4000 (PC4 32000) Desktop Memory Model F4-4000C18Q-32GTRS with fast shipping and top-rated customer service. Once you know, you Newegg!




					www.newegg.ca
				




You could buy 2 of the Adata 32GB sets for less money and still have excellent lighting effects.


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## ThrashZone (Jan 28, 2021)

Hi,
Yeah 3600c18 at least would be closer to your optimum frequency on amd
OC ability would still be as bad as 3200c16 without much if any left 1-200mhz


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## saarxee (Jan 28, 2021)

kapone32 said:


> You are correct you don't want 2x32 GB  sticks but if you want 64 GB you could get 32GB for now and get another 32GB later.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You read my quote on the first page?
If I buy 2X16GB right now I not sure it does work if in the future I upgrade to 64GB.. with xmp and all


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## thesmokingman (Jan 28, 2021)

saarxee said:


> You read my quote on the first page?
> If I buy 2X16GB right now I not sure it does work if in the future I upgrade to 64GB.. with xmp and all


There's a disconnect here. What are you after dram density or performance, because you're not going to get both.


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## saarxee (Jan 28, 2021)

thesmokingman said:


> There's a disconnect here. What are you after dram density or performance, because you're not going to get both.


Why not...
and I see some 4000 CL18 sticks also


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## thesmokingman (Jan 28, 2021)

saarxee said:


> Why not...
> and I see some 4000 CL18 sticks also


That doesn't mean they'll run that speed, duh! Look up the dram specs, max density specification is 2667mhz on Zen 2/3.


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## ThrashZone (Jan 28, 2021)

Hi,
Think the goal posts were moved a tad bit


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## lexluthermiester (Jan 28, 2021)

saarxee said:


> You read my quote on the first page?
> If I buy 2X16GB right now I not sure it does work if in the future I upgrade to 64GB.. with xmp and all


As long as you buy a matching set(running specs not brand) you'll be fine.


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## saarxee (Jan 29, 2021)

lexluthermiester said:


> As long as you buy a matching set(running specs not brand) you'll be fine.


Not sure..
some people complain about that.. they buy same sticks and it doesnt work.


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## lexluthermiester (Jan 29, 2021)

saarxee said:


> Not sure..
> some people complain about that.. they buy same sticks and it doesnt work.


You'll be fine


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## Fry178 (Jan 29, 2021)

not for amd, unless the chips on the stick are identical. 
intel is no problem, but so far the only mixed sticks working on amd are either running jedec (not xmp) or have same die, to run stable.
just the fact that kits of same model/density/clocks/timings are being released with different dies, and manufacturer are actually saying you should NOT use the intel on amd or mix an intel and a amd on amd platform. 

still not seen one reason for +16gb, nor the need for DR, unless you want to impress with benchmarks. 
gaming will improve much more saving the difference between 16 and 32/64gb, and put it towards gpu/other upgrades. 

its like installing a 209gal tank in your car, just so you only have to fill up once a year, while wasting energy driving around with lots of mass/weight to do so.


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 7, 2022)

Appreciate this thread is old, but I came across it looking at what to do re. RAM upgrade.

A couple of things on here don't seem right to me - for example "3200 CL16 will never overclock to 3600". Well, my 16GB Corsair 3200s are running fine at 3600CL16 right now.

Also, the "not for AMD, unless the chips on the stick are identical". Well, I borrowed a pair of 3200CL16 Crucials from my kids' PC, and they run fine at 3200CL16 with the Corsairs. I.e. 4x8, two Corsairs, two Crucials.

I'm torn between getting two more Corsair 3200CL16s, and overclocking the resultant 4x8 to 3600CL16 - because I know at least two sticks will do it - or getting Corsair 3600CL16, so that only two sticks will be overclocked.

So the question is really will 4 sticks overclock in a similar fashion to 2 sticks. Something in the back of my mind says it's harder to OC 4 sticks though.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 7, 2022)

Hi,
Yep old thread 

Corsair is hit or miss 
Mostly miss for myself but corsair sticks have a VER# on each stick if they match they are from the same bin so will work better than if they don't match.

I highly doubt 3200c16 can do 3600c16 but here you can post results








						Share your AIDA 64 cache and memory benchmark here
					

Hey folks, how about sharing some cache and memory benchmark you get using AIDA 64?  Rules: Use the latest stable(non alpha/beta) version of AIDA(currently 4.50.3000)   So here goes mine.    All the best. :)  Table as requested. In order of entry.... Only the best scores of an individual are...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




Also fill in your system spec's


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 7, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> I highly doubt 3200c16 can do 3600c16 but here you can post results


What would you like as proof?

Here's CPU-Z:





The modules are CMK16GX4M2Z3200C16.

I used 1usmus's calculator to get the timings. Haven't had any issues, either on my Asus Prime X470, or on my current MSI X570 Tomahawk.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Apr 7, 2022)

saarxee said:


> I dont understand you..
> The design of the royals is fine and he support with my mobo on QVL so why not? The Taichi have short list of RAMs..


QVL is pretty irrelevant.


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## Taraquin (Apr 7, 2022)

If you plan on running XMP the difference between 3600cl16 and 3200cl16 is minor at best, if you tweak sometimes a 3200cl16 kit can have better dies that overclock far better, for instance if you get Micron rev E in the 3200 kit while the 3600 kit has Samsung D.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 7, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Yep old thread
> 
> Corsair is hit or miss
> ...





Yearofthegoat said:


> What would you like as proof?
> 
> Here's CPU-Z:
> View attachment 242842
> ...


Hi,
You removed what to do from my post 

Here it is again run aida64 and post it on the thread I linked to.
You can get cheap aida64 full versions off ebay for like 3.us just look for guarantied to activate I've used them before.


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## chrcoluk (Apr 8, 2022)

In my experience if you have a IMC or board limitation with 4 dimms, its probably only going to restrict the clock of the ram, not the latency, so if e.g. your 3600 CL 16 ram has to run at 3200mhz, you can probably crank the timing down to the equivalent latency.  On my 8600k I used to run my 3200CL14 ram at 3000CL12. (which was actually superior latency, equal would have been CL13).

I would expect 3600CL 16 ram to be better binned than 3200CL 16, so assuming price isnt an issue here, go for the 3600.


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 8, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> You removed what to do from my post


I did no such thing, your post is still there.

@chrcoluk Thanks, yes I think I'll go for the Corsair 3600CL16; that way it can run at more or less stock alongside the OC'd 3200. From what I could see in various tests, its the speed not the CL that counts, especially with 3600 being equal to the IF for my current R53600.


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## Fry178 (Apr 8, 2022)

@Yearofthegoat
for ram calc: lots stuff isnt what you actually want to use up mto even "completely" wrong/made up (voltage etc),
at least to most with proper understanding of am4/boards/ram/bios

'working" doesnt mean anything, but to make it short:
can you pass +1500% in something like TM5 or HCI (running on windows) with it?


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 8, 2022)

Sorry I can't understand what you're trying to say.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 8, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @Yearofthegoat
> for ram calc: lots stuff isnt what you actually want to use up mto even "completely" wrong/made up (voltage etc),
> at least to most with proper understanding of am4/boards/ram/bios
> 
> ...


Hi,
You're wasting your time.


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## Speedyblupi (Apr 8, 2022)

Yearofthegoat said:


> What would you like as proof?
> 
> Here's CPU-Z:
> View attachment 242842
> ...



Some 3200 CL16 kits can OC to DDR4-3600. Most can't. You got lucky, but not everyone who buys a 3200 CL16 kit will.


Taraquin said:


> If you plan on running XMP the difference between 3600cl16 and 3200cl16 is minor at best, if you tweak sometimes a 3200cl16 kit can have better dies that overclock far better, for instance if you get Micron rev E in the 3200 kit while the 3600 kit has Samsung D.


It can, but it probably won't. The overwhelming majority of the time, you'll get better chips on a 3600 CL16 kit than on a 3200 CL16 kit. 3200 CL16 is more likely to be Samsung C-die or Micron 8Gb Rev B, which is usually worse than D-die.


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 8, 2022)

Seems to be a lot of grumpiness on here. All I wanted to know was whether to go ahead with 3600CL16, given that I have 3200 modules successfully OC'd to 3600.

What does "_or ram calc: lots stuff isnt what you actually want to use up mto even "completely" wrong/made up (voltage etc),
at least to most with proper understanding of am4/boards/ram/bios_" mean? I'm serious. Are you saying the Ryzen calculator was made up? It worked for me at least. What is "mto"?

FWIW I checked, and I tested the RAM with MemTest at boot time, as well as HCI MemTest 7.0 (2019) under Windows 10. I remember leaving it running for around a whole day. No errors at the time. To this day, no errors, no WHEA etc. It's fine.


----------



## Fry178 (Apr 9, 2022)

fact that you take the calc info as (gold) standard, tells me you want to read up a little more on it.

1 out of 4 times the settings for 3600 xmp are not stable, or at least way too much aggressive/lose, where they shouldnt have to be (as in not producing any gains).
e.g. i have not seen anything that needs 1.45v to run at 3600, unless its something like my b-die doing C14 and some of the lowest sec/tert i have found that are stable,
but those are SOLD as 3600/C16 1.45v kits...

usually you can expect to lower cl by 1 or 2, or you can ago up in speed by 1 or 2 steps, depending on what die is used.
as such, stating (any) kit sold as a certain speed, can reach something better, is blatantly false.
(completely ignoring tha kit does NOT equal what die is used, this can vary on the same kits).

running a prog a day doesnt mean anything, you want test (HCI) to pass 1200-1500%, so even areas used (prior) by win have been covered.
never seen ppl that know there stuff, claim "stable", below those numbers.

unless of course, there isnt any data on your drives that you care to keep, than go ahead..


----------



## Yearofthegoat (Apr 22, 2022)

@Fry178 Thanks for posting back. I've since upgraded my CPU to a 5900X, which is working fine with some PBO/Curve Optimizer.

The XMP ('A-XMP' in the MSI BIOS) setting in my board doesn't work with these sticks. I had to set the primary timings myself and after contacting Corsair they recommended upping the voltage to 1.37v. That worried me a bit and backed it off to 1.36v which works fine at stock 3200CL16 (and at 3600CL16).

Re. the calculator, yes, I didn't have any reason to doubt it and it was initially just a way to see if I could get the RAM to run at 3600 - just 3600 at all, not aiming for CL16 or anything other than stability. The reason for that was again advice that Ryzen liked RAM at 1:1 with the infinity fabric. I bought the 3200 RAM because at first that was touted as the 'sweet spot' for an R5 3600, IIRC. But of course the R53600 runs at 3600 (1800), so maybe that was just a mistake.

I haven't bought more RAM yet, as I'm not totally convinced that I really need it. I have 16GB but I read lots of recommendations for 32GB RAM - for audio sample libraries in Cubase/Reaper etc.  If I can just add two more 8GB sticks and get them to play nicely (i.e. 3600CL16) with the existing pair, then great, but if it's too difficult to set up I'll wait until I can buy a 'proper' set of 32GB 3600 (or maybe 3800) and sell the original 16GB pair.

Seeing as I've changed the CPU I'll go ahead and re-test the current 16GB with MemTest (HCI). I did a shorter test which was fine but, as you say, it doesn't test all of the RAM since Windows is using some.

I have a program called MemTestHelper which sets the values for HCI (I believe anyway). So I'll go ahead and see what happens. The RAM timings haven't been changed and thus far seem stable (they are a bit looser than those in 1usmus's calculator). The MemBench section in the calculator - after an 'Easy' 6GB test - reports latency of 62.1ns, which I believe is okay?


----------



## eidairaman1 (Apr 22, 2022)

Save the headache and get a Crucial 3600 32GB kit


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## Bones (Apr 22, 2022)

I'll leave this here. 
The specs of the kit and so on are within the tabs of CPU-Z and yes, this was a sub I did for validation of it.

This is the exact set I bought and ran for this: G.SKILL TridentZ Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) Intel Z170 / Z270 / Z370 / X299 Desktop Memory Model F4-3600C16D-16GTZSW - Newegg.com






BTW the board you use matters, sometimes to a good extent. 
Must say my X470 Tachi Ultimate is NOT a RAM champ by any means, has difficulty making it to 3600 with these or any others I pop in but the X570 ACE has no issues about it as shown.


----------



## Taraquin (Apr 22, 2022)

Yearofthegoat said:


> @Fry178 Thanks for posting back. I've since upgraded my CPU to a 5900X, which is working fine with some PBO/Curve Optimizer.
> 
> The XMP ('A-XMP' in the MSI BIOS) setting in my board doesn't work with these sticks. I had to set the primary timings myself and after contacting Corsair they recommended upping the voltage to 1.37v. That worried me a bit and backed it off to 1.36v which works fine at stock 3200CL16 (and at 3600CL16).
> 
> ...


What is the ram dies on the new and old kit according to thaiphoon burner? I would also say eidaraman1s advice of Crucial is best, they are garanteed rev E or B which overclocks like champs and can tune most timings a lot. Easy 15% boost in many games when cpu bound vs running xmp timings.


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## Fry178 (Apr 23, 2022)

@Yearofthegoat
dont use amp. voltages get boosted, and other stuff might be wacky.
always do it manually..

@Taraquin
with amd i still prefer timings to go as low as it goes and still gains in perf (3600),
had no trouble dropping by 2 on main timings with A0, havent gotten time to test more.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Apr 23, 2022)

Bones said:


> I'll leave this here.
> The specs of the kit and so on are within the tabs of CPU-Z and yes, this was a sub I did for validation of it.
> 
> This is the exact set I bought and ran for this: G.SKILL TridentZ Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 3600 (PC4 28800) Intel Z170 / Z270 / Z370 / X299 Desktop Memory Model F4-3600C16D-16GTZSW - Newegg.com
> ...



Nice ram that. mine is this B die 32gb kit-
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/team...00c16-3600mhz-dual-channel-kit-my-002-8p.html


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 23, 2022)

Taraquin said:


> What is the ram dies on the new and old kit according to thaiphoon burner? I would also say eidaraman1s advice of Crucial is best, they are garanteed rev E or B which overclocks like champs and can tune most timings a lot. Easy 15% boost in many games when cpu bound vs running xmp timings.


the dies are Hynix CJR revision A0 on the current 2x8GB kit. I don't do any gaming, just looking for stable 1800 clock for Ryzen CPU (although I'm not certain it's worth all the effort). If I buy new RAM, I'll buy 3600, no need for overclocking (apart from the manufacturer rated spec).


Fry178 said:


> @Yearofthegoat
> dont use amp. voltages get boosted, and other stuff might be wacky.
> always do it manually..
> 
> ...


I don't use A-XMP (it wasn't stable at stock 3200, never mind 3600). All the settings were manual from 1usmus' calculator, and for memory only apart from IF clock set 1:1. I have, however, now got PBO dialled in, plus Curve Optimizer for the 5900X. (Runs really nicely. Cinebench 23 reports 1633 single core @4.93GHz and 23099 multicore @4.58GHz. Temps max 76C).

I ran HCI memory test up to 1600% yesterday with no errors. I read, though, that it's not a great test as it runs under Windows and can't ever test all the RAM (is that actually correct?). So I also ran MemTest 86 off a bootable CD. Again no errors.

I think I'll get the Corsair 3600CL16 2x8GB pair. If they work with my OCd 3200 pair, then great. If they don't - but work on their own of course - then I guess I'll sell the 3200s and just get another 2x8GB 3600CL16 pair.


----------



## The King (Apr 23, 2022)

Taraquin said:


> If you plan on running XMP the difference between 3600cl16 and 3200cl16 is minor at best, if you tweak sometimes a 3200cl16 kit can have better dies that overclock far better, for instance if you get Micron rev E in the 3200 kit while the 3600 kit has Samsung D.


I agree my Crucial Ballistix 3200 CL16 does 3600 CL14 easily with Rev. E


----------



## AusWolf (Apr 23, 2022)

If you care about overclocking, get the 3600 kit. Its higher rated factory speed might mean it's better quality too.

Though personally, I wouldn't bother, as RAM overclocking only gives you a few unnoticeable percents of extra performance at best.


----------



## Bones (Apr 23, 2022)

Yearofthegoat said:


> the dies are Hynix CJR revision A0 on the current 2x8GB kit. I don't do any gaming, just looking for stable 1800 clock for Ryzen CPU (although I'm not certain it's worth all the effort). If I buy new RAM, I'll buy 3600, no need for overclocking (apart from the manufacturer rated spec).
> 
> I don't use A-XMP (it wasn't stable at stock 3200, never mind 3600). All the settings were manual from 1usmus' calculator, and for memory only apart from IF clock set 1:1. I have, however, now got PBO dialled in, plus Curve Optimizer for the 5900X. (Runs really nicely. Cinebench 23 reports 1633 single core @4.93GHz and 23099 multicore @4.58GHz. Temps max 76C).
> 
> ...


Corsair with AM4 _is just asking for trouble_, *esp* if getting a set from the Vengeance line. 
Too many issues and troubleshooting posts about it to even count between a set of Vengeance sticks and Ryzen, it's best to grab a set of G.Skills instead and don't worry about it.


----------



## ThrashZone (Apr 23, 2022)

Hi,
Buying a 2x8gb kit these days is not wise.


----------



## Yearofthegoat (Apr 23, 2022)

Bones said:


> Corsair with AM4 _is just asking for trouble_, *esp* if getting a set from the Vengeance line.
> Too many issues and troubleshooting posts about it to even count between a set of Vengeance sticks and Ryzen, it's best to grab a set of G.Skills instead and don't worry about it.


Yeah, I've read that a lot. Mine were fine at stock after a bump in the voltage and avoiding A-XMP. I bought a set that were specifically labelled as 'optimized for Ryzen', don't know if that's a factor, but they've been okay since, although at 3600 they needed tweaking.

Maybe I'm reading your post wrong, but would a set of G.Skills work with the existing Corsairs? Everything I've read says not to mix brands. I'm trying to save ca. £100 by adding RAM rather than buying a new set of 32GB, so that would mean more Corsairs.


----------



## lexluthermiester (Apr 23, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Buying a 2x8gb kit these days is not wise.


Why?


----------



## AusWolf (Apr 23, 2022)

Bones said:


> Corsair with AM4 _is just asking for trouble_, *esp* if getting a set from the Vengeance line.
> Too many issues and troubleshooting posts about it to even count between a set of Vengeance sticks and Ryzen, it's best to grab a set of G.Skills instead and don't worry about it.


I used to have a set of 4x 8 GB Dominator Platinum sticks with a 5950X. They ran on an Asus Tuf B550M without a hitch.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 23, 2022)

lexluthermiester said:


> Why?


Hi,
2x16gb is going to be more useful in the future 

If you have a four slot board buying 2-2x8gb kits at the same time will at least give you a better chance of getting close to the same binned chips instead of adding another 2x8gb later.
Or opt for a quad kit 4x8gb now should still work fine on a dual channel board.


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## lexluthermiester (Apr 23, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> 2x16gb is going to be more useful in the future


Currently 8GB is considered standard, 16GB is overkill for most people unless they're doing some 4k gaming. 32GB like you suggest is even more overkill.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Apr 23, 2022)

I got 2x 16gb as i though fuck it, why not. Have more apps open, more web pages left open, etc.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 23, 2022)

Tigger said:


> I got 2x 16gb as i though fuck it, why not. Have more apps open, more web pages left open, etc.


Hi,
Yep I'm looking for a nice b-die 2x16gb to for my z490 apex 

Best so far is 4000c16 2x16gb 300.us not sure why I haven't jumped on it yet except only a couple rgb puke sets available atm 
I really don't want rgb even in the royal series but might be stuck with it seeing there isn't any non-rgb around I sold one of my 3600c16 4x8gb kits so I have funds for it.


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## AusWolf (Apr 23, 2022)

Tigger said:


> I got 2x 16gb as i though fuck it, why not. Have more apps open, more web pages left open, etc.


Me too. Not that I'd recommend anyone on a budget to do the same - there's not much point.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 23, 2022)

lexluthermiester said:


> Currently 8GB is considered standard, 16GB is overkill for most people unless they're doing some 4k gaming. 32GB like you suggest is even more overkill.


Well 4k gaming is where everything is going.


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## AusWolf (Apr 23, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Well 4k gaming is where everything is going.


4K gaming is where Intel, AMD and nvidia *would like* everything to go. 

Personally, I see absolutely no reason behind it. A 4K monitor is not just expensive, but also pointless, and (ideally) you're sitting far enough from a 4K TV so that a 1440p or 1080p resolution will suffice.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Apr 23, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Yep I'm looking for a nice b-die 2x16gb to for my z490 apex
> 
> Best so far is 4000c16 2x16gb 300.us not sure why I haven't jumped on it yet except only a couple rgb puke sets available atm
> I really don't want rgb even in the royal series but might be stuck with it seeing there isn't any non-rgb around I sold one of my 3600c16 4x8gb kits so I have funds for it.


These are mine, pretty good B die
https://www.overclockers.co.uk/team...00c16-3600mhz-dual-channel-kit-my-002-8p.html



AusWolf said:


> 4K gaming is where Intel, AMD and nvidia *would like* everything to go.
> 
> Personally, I see absolutely no reason behind it. A 4K monitor is not just expensive, but also pointless, and (ideally) you're sitting far enough from a 4K TV so that a 1440p or 1080p resolution will suffice.



It's not just the monitor you need, its a 3080ti at least for AAA 4k gaming.


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## AusWolf (Apr 23, 2022)

Tigger said:


> It's not just the monitor you need, its a 3080ti at least for AAA 4k gaming.


That too. Most people don't have money for that. 4K gaming won't become the mainstream in the next few generations, if ever.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Apr 23, 2022)

AusWolf said:


> That too. Most people don't have money for that. 4K gaming won't become the mainstream in the next few generations, if ever.


 
4k gaming is for forum show offs


----------



## Bones (Apr 23, 2022)

Yearofthegoat said:


> Yeah, I've read that a lot. Mine were fine at stock after a bump in the voltage and avoiding A-XMP. I bought a set that were specifically labelled as 'optimized for Ryzen', don't know if that's a factor, but they've been okay since, although at 3600 they needed tweaking.
> 
> Maybe I'm reading your post wrong, but would a set of G.Skills work with the existing Corsairs? Everything I've read says not to mix brands. I'm trying to save ca. £100 by adding RAM rather than buying a new set of 32GB, so that would mean more Corsairs.


Depends - They could work well together or piss all over your expectations because it's largely going to be a matter of what IC's are in the sticks and if they are compatable with each other.
This is also why it's not a great idea to mix-n-match sets, some IC's really don't like being in the same system others may be in, it's all hit or miss when you try things that way.

If the Corsairs you have are working fine another set of those would be what to go for..... However Corsair is also infamous for changing what IC's in a model line, even if it's the same thing by it's specs and all else.
Even _versions_ of the same thing (Such as Corsair Pro PC3200 2-2-2-5 v1.2 as an example) by name and model/spec between sets could be shown as being the same but could also have different IC's under the heatspreaders and that has been seen before from Corsair.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 23, 2022)

Tigger said:


> These are mine, pretty good B die
> https://www.overclockers.co.uk/team...00c16-3600mhz-dual-channel-kit-my-002-8p.html
> 
> 
> ...


Hi,
Did they ever add temp sensors to their dimms 
If not I'd pass besides I'm trying to move up from 3600c16 a bit
4000c16 should do 4400 easily under 1.5v.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Apr 23, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Did they ever add temp sensors to their dimms
> If not I'd pass besides I'm trying to move up from 3600c16 a bit
> 4000c16 should do 4400 easily under 1.5v.



How would i find out if they have?


----------



## ThrashZone (Apr 24, 2022)

Tigger said:


> How would i find out if they have?


Hi,
Hwinfo64 would list dimm temp for each stick if they did.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Apr 24, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Hwinfo64 would list dimm temp for each stick if they did.



Shame if they haven't as they are nice well binned by 8 pack sticks


----------



## kapone32 (Apr 24, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Yep old thread
> 
> Corsair is hit or miss
> ...


This! One of the problems with running 4 sticks is stability. I recently used 3 MSI AM4 MBs from X570 to X570S and none of them would be stable with 4 sticks installed. The other thing is buying a particular RAM today does not mean it will be the same 3 months later.



ThrashZone said:


> Hi,
> Hwinfo64 would list dimm temp for each stick if they did.


Gskill Royal support that but the Adata D60G does not support that


----------



## lexluthermiester (Apr 24, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> Well 4k gaming is where everything is going.


Maybe, but not in the next few years unless GPU's that can do 4k solidly come down in price so that the masses can access them, to say nothing of 4k displays. 1080p is going to be with us for a few years yet.



AusWolf said:


> Personally, I see absolutely no reason behind it.


I can see the reason, but it's just too expensive currently. That always changes but we're still a ways away from affordability that will make it a true standard.


----------



## agent_x007 (Apr 24, 2022)

2x8GB for 100$ : https://www.amazon.com/Patriot-4000MHz-16-16-16-36-Low-Latency-Memory/dp/B09NLBNLZ4


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## zx128k (Apr 25, 2022)

Patriot Viper Steel DDR4 16GB (2 x 8GB) 4400MHz Performance Memory Kit - PVS416G440C9K is good if you want to go for the highest frequency or get tightened timings at a lower fequency.


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## ThrashZone (Apr 25, 2022)

lexluthermiester said:


> Maybe, but not in the next few years unless GPU's that can do 4k solidly come down in price so that the masses can access them, to say nothing of 4k displays. 1080p is going to be with us for a few years yet.
> 
> 
> I can see the reason, but it's just too expensive currently. That always changes but we're still a ways away from affordability that will make it a true standard.


Hi,
People tend to do a lot more while gaming to 
Lots of benefits to 32gb memory whether 2x16 or 4x8gb, hell for a lot of people this isn't even enough 

Virtual machine
Ram cache favorite programs and vm's to for that matter just a couple main needs now days

How many times have you read people gaming while have 20 or more tabs open with youtube videos running.. using chrome chomping away at memory and wonder why they got bsod or ask why is my machine freezing 

Either way I finally pulled the trigger on T-Z royal 4000c16 2x16gb at 16-16-16-36 @1.4v for my z490 apex only a 2 slot board so 2x8gb was fine but I was getting to close to that usage
My prior 3600c16 4x8gb kit was pretty awesome best performing was 4200c16 just under 1.5v 
I still have one more 3600c16 4x8gb kit waiting to be put back into my x299 apex I sold it's kit months ago for a 2x16gb replacement for z490.

G.SKILL Trident Z Royal Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 4000 (PC4 32000) Desktop Memory Model F4-4000C16D-32GTRSA - Newegg.com


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## AusWolf (Apr 25, 2022)

ThrashZone said:


> How many times have you read people gaming while have 20 or more tabs open with youtube videos running.. using chrome chomping away at memory and wonder why they got bsod or ask why is my machine freezing


And those people wonder why they're not happy when they can't even pay full attention to something that's actually supposed to be fun and entertaining. When fulfilling needs demands excessive resources, then one should investigate the importance and validity of such "needs"... my 2 cents.


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## Fry178 (Apr 25, 2022)

@AusWolf
define ocing. going from 3600C18 to a 3600C14 is a big difference, especially with rfc tuned.

@Yearofthegoat
get the deluxe version, comes with dos one you can isntall on stick, uses almost all ram, and you dont have to worry about os/driver issues interfering.

@Bones
according to what?
ignoring that the highly recommended gskill kit i bought, didnt even post (was on QVL), didnt tweak,
all 7 corsair kits i used in builds (half of em not even on qvl; incl my LPX) worked as expected, right out of the box,
4 kits doing lower cl at same V, my lpx kit runs 14-14-14-28-42/1T (havent gotten time to try lower).

unless you have +5000 customers with same issues, sample size is too small to be statistically relevant or making statements like yours.


@ThrashZone
for what? unless you play MS flight sim or do video editing, games are fine with 10-12gb, so no need for more than 16gb.
you dont buy a fullsize truck, just so you can drive everthing around you own, just to have it..
if ppl are too stupid to close things before running heavy load or gaming, has nothing to do with min recommended amount

and good luck finding kits with SS 16gb sticks doing 3600C14, im not gonna take the hit on performance..


----------



## AusWolf (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @AusWolf
> define ocing. going from 3600C18 to a 3600C14 is a big difference, especially with rfc tuned.


Define "a big difference".  Do you actually experience going from 3600 CL16 to CL14 in applications / games?
By OCing, I mean deviating from factory default / recommended specs. Using a 3600 MHz RAM kit is not OCing by the RAM's standards, but it definitely is by CPU memory controller standards. Personally, I always go with my platform's highest officially supported speed and leave it at that. Anything above is a waste of money, imo.



Fry178 said:


> @ThrashZone
> for what? unless you play MS flight sim or do video editing, games are fine with 10-12gb, so no need for more than 16gb.
> you dont buy a fullsize truck, just so you can drive everthing around you own, just to have it..
> if ppl are too stupid to close things before running heavy load or gaming, has nothing to do with min recommended amount


Agreed!


----------



## Fry178 (Apr 25, 2022)

@AusWolf
yes, or i hadnt switched.
about 10% higher transfer rate on avg, going from C16 kit i used before, latency around 54-55.
but then again, i use 3 Ms and a 2080S under water, so impact is more noticeable..


----------



## The King (Apr 25, 2022)

On Zen 3 3600 CL16 Dual rank 16GBx2 should noticeable outperform 3600 CL14 8GBx2 Single rank dimms unless you run a 8GBx4.

In regards to gaming performance.


----------



## Fry178 (Apr 25, 2022)

how is DS supposed to improve with Dual Channel on ryzen?
im getting 53,5 GB/s read, havent seen much higher except on quad channel.


----------



## The King (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> unless board is quad channel, how is DS supposed to improve with 2 sticks?


----------



## ThrashZone (Apr 25, 2022)

Hi,
@Fry178 
If you or anyone can get by with 16gb total memory good, you can always add another 2x8gb kit and take your chances but saying it's a waste is just fos

Most people buy trucks "In Texas it's our Cadillac"   to haul things or throw a camper on it for outings/... it's cheaper than hiring someone or renting one when you need to do something simple as moving/.... or weekend/ vacation outing not a good example you tried to make.

The cost of c14 is only more dimm voltage bottom line


----------



## Fry178 (Apr 25, 2022)

@The King
im not running 3200C14 he tested, mine is 3600C14, little difference.

@ThrashZone
its a good example, as its only single country, representing only 5% of the planets population, that does that.


----------



## AusWolf (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @AusWolf
> yes, or i hadnt switched.
> about 10% higher transfer rate on avg, going from C16 kit i used before, latency around 54-55.
> but then again, i use 3 Ms and a 2080S under water, so impact is more noticeable..


Transfer rate... latency... those are not applications.  The difference that you _feel_ and the difference that you _measure_ are totally different things.

Personally, I couldn't even tell the difference between single and dual channel without an FPS counter on screen.


----------



## ThrashZone (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @The King
> im not running 3200C14 he tested, mine is 3600C14, little difference.


Hi,
3600c14 is just a higher bin of the same chips but this even depends on it xmp dimm voltage if more than 1.35 to do 3600c14 it's not a higher bin just another line of the same bins.


----------



## Fry178 (Apr 25, 2022)

@AusWolf
everything you do goes thru ram, so yes, transfer rate is relevant,
or you wouldnt have HEDT using quad channel.
latency is relevant (on amd), and so far, anyone that i had trying 3200C18 vs 3600C14, could tell the difference (for the games relevant to us).

@ThrashZone
i know, just wanted to have the option to run C14 right away, until i got timings tweaked to what goes.
and i got A0, seems to like lower timings (without more voltage needed).


----------



## The King (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @The King
> im not running 3200C14 he tested, mine is 3600C14, little difference.


Is not so much about the CL more about the Zen 3 architecture.

It prefers 4X single rank 8GB dimms or 16GBx2 Dual ranks dimms.

If you add another 8GBx2 dimms your latency may go up but your gaming fps will increase more than going from 3600 CL16 to 3600 CL14


----------



## AusWolf (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @AusWolf
> everything you do goes thru ram, so yes, transfer rate is relevant,
> or you wouldnt have HEDT using quad channel.
> latency is relevant (on amd), and so far, anyone that i had trying 3200C18 vs 3600C14, could tell the difference (for the games relevant to us).


With or without an FPS counter on screen? 

I'm not saying that there's no difference - I'm saying that the difference doesn't matter in everyday scenarios. The reason why people say it does matter is due to obsession with the maximum 5%. Nothing else.


----------



## ThrashZone (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @ThrashZone
> i know, just wanted to have the option to run C14 right away, until i got timings tweaked to what goes.
> and i got A0, seems to like lower timings (without more voltage needed).


Hi,
Easy as in using xmp profile 
AMD is finicky about memory for sure thankfully 5k series was a needed improvement in this area if 5950x wasn't so overpriced at release or even months after I'd have one.


----------



## Fry178 (Apr 25, 2022)

@The King
dont need more fps, not with 5800x and 2080S @2.1ghz 

@AusWolf
not interested in fps, only latency/system response.
i do run OS/games at 2160p, so not saying this will be noticeable (as much), when using 2k or  1k res.


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## AusWolf (Apr 25, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @AusWolf
> not interested in fps, only latency/system response.
> i do run OS/games at 2160p, so not saying this will be noticeable (as much), when using 2k or  1k res.


I'm not sure I follow. I'm using 3200 MHz CL16 RAM, and my system seems pretty responsive to me.


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 26, 2022)

The 'trouble' with Ryzen is the link between the RAM and the processor. My R53600 and my R95900X both boost / clock higher with 3600 RAM than with 3200. With the FCLK==UCLK and same CPU settings otherwise. So faster RAM gives you a double benefit.

Whether that ends up being noticeable depends on the individual and what they're doing with the machine, of course.


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## Bones (Apr 28, 2022)

Fry178 said:


> @Bones
> _*according to what?*
> ignoring that the highly recommended gskill kit i bought, didnt even post (was on QVL), didnt tweak,
> all 7 corsair kits i used in builds (half of em not even on qvl; incl my LPX) worked as expected, right out of the box,_
> ...


My personal experience from years of doing computers as a hobby and as a competitive OC'er with others I know (Overclockers) that remove heatspreaders out of habit to check their IC's to know if it's a decent or better set to OC or not...... And they do mention things like this whenever they run into it.

And it's also the fact it's based on the same experience you just referred to for yourself in Italic as quoted.

*That's what. *

So you've had a good experience.... That's actually great but doesn't mean everyone will have the same everytime as you.

Whether it's something that's only encountered on occasion or even rarely, the fact it has happened does bear mentioning.
Making people aware of it isn't something bad to do because it's real and anyone of us, and I mean anyone can be the "One" that gets a set with different IC's in them vs another set of the same stuff and have problems because of it.

I've said what I've said and *I stand by it all.*

So there is no need to repeat or keep repeating myself here.
With respect to this....
*Done~*


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## Yearofthegoat (Apr 28, 2022)

Bones said:


> Depends - They could work well together or piss all over your expectations because it's largely going to be a matter of what IC's are in the sticks and if they are compatable with each other.
> This is also why it's not a great idea to mix-n-match sets, some IC's really don't like being in the same system others may be in, it's all hit or miss when you try things that way.
> 
> If the Corsairs you have are working fine another set of those would be what to go for..... However Corsair is also infamous for changing what IC's in a model line, even if it's the same thing by it's specs and all else.
> Even _versions_ of the same thing (Such as Corsair Pro PC3200 2-2-2-5 v1.2 as an example) by name and model/spec between sets could be shown as being the same but could also have different IC's under the heatspreaders and that has been seen before from Corsair.


I've bought Corsair RAM since, well, as far back as I can remember - certainly TwinX days, possibly even before DDR2 was a thing. Reason for that was reputation at the time, and a 'lifetime' warranty. I haven't looked yet what the warranty policies are for the likes of Patriot, G-Skill or Crucial. In fact, the only time I had to return RAM was three returns of Crucial Ballistix (years ago, some bright orange CL4 DDR2 things - BL12864AA804.8FE5 according to the wrapper. Yes I'm a hoarder).

Since then I've had no issues with Corsair RAM, apart from the M2Z3200C16s initially not working under A-XMP. But I was expecting to have to dial in the RAM settings - it was like that before A-XMP/DOCP/XMP anyway. Right now those sticks are running happily at 3600C16 with slighly looser timings, but stable as far as I can test (HCI MemTest >1500%, Memtest86 boot disk no errors) so I'm happy enough.

You're right about the changing of the ICs of course. I looked online earlier to see what ICs people had in their 3600C16 and 3600C18 sticks, and it varies between Hynix AFR, CJR, Samsung non-B, and Nanya - going by review comments and images people have posted.

If I want to get more RAM it seems like there's no guarantee that their ICs will match any more than another brand's sticks would, so I'll look at those next.


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## Bones (Apr 28, 2022)

That's exactly what was saying earlier, I don't know or can't say _why_ they would do that but they did and it's proven fact. 

I also know they aren't the only ones but out of all Corsair seems the worst of the lot about it. Not saying their sticks are bad, I have a few sets that's actually quite good but the fact remains they would start making sticks with a different IC within the same model line and sometimes even sticks with the same version when compared will have different IC's in them.


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## 95Viper (May 1, 2022)

Stay on topic.
Quit the bickering.
Stop the insults.
If you have nothing to contribute in regard to the topic... don't post.


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## zx128k (May 1, 2022)

If you are going to get new RAM the website b-die finder is useful. Samsung b-die appears to work well compatibility wise and has good performance.  Also make sure the motherboard plays well with the new RAM, the motherboards memory QVL and the memory manufactures QVL can help. 

If you are going to get 4xDIMMs, getting a quad channel kit will help guarantee they work together. Normally two dual channel kits will work but people have stated the IC's can change.  Just make sure the motherboard supports 4 dimms for the memory you do get which should be fine if you get Samsung b-die.


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## eidairaman1 (May 1, 2022)

Or Micron


zx128k said:


> If you are going to get new RAM the website b-die finder is useful. Samsung b-die appears to work well compatibility wise and has good performance.  Also make sure the motherboard plays well with the new RAM, the motherboards memory QVL and the memory manufactures QVL can help.
> 
> If you are going to get 4xDIMMs, getting a quad channel kit will help guarantee they work together. Normally two dual channel kits will work but people have stated the IC's can change.  Just make sure the motherboard supports 4 dimms for the memory you do get which should be fine if you get Samsung b-die.


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