# Copying DVD to HDD. Legal?



## Samdbugman (Jul 23, 2010)

howdy. what i want to do is install my dvd movies to a hdd and use an older machine of mine to play the movies on my tv without the disc. i own every movie that is in my collection, and i donot want to copy to disc,i just want to load my movies to a hard drive. what program do i need? is it legal?     thanks all!


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## TIGR (Jul 23, 2010)

Welcome to TPU!

It may be the right forum but the title should be more specific.

It is not legal, to the best of my knowledge, to copy commercial movies to your hard drive (even for personal backup purposes, even when you own a legal copy)—TPU's mods won't allow that to be discussed here. However, you didn't say yet that they are commercial movies—if you specify that they are home movies there should be no problem to get some help doing this.


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## Samdbugman (Jul 23, 2010)

*thanks!*

thanks for the fast reply. new here and dont want to start off on the wrong foot. i will delete post if i can figure it out.


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## Wrigleyvillain (Jul 23, 2010)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD_X_Copy

(E.g. It's not legal to make a copy, even a backup, though if you legitimately own the DVD I feel it should be...not trying to start this discussion here though).

And don't worry about "starting off on wrong foot". It was a simple, legitimate question.


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## Samdbugman (Jul 23, 2010)

thanks. ive read the site for quite a while and i figured if anyone would know it was here.


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## Wrigleyvillain (Jul 23, 2010)

Sure and welcome. For the record, I tried that app back in the day before it was banned and it worked great. Too bad it was legally prohibited.


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## TIGR (Jul 23, 2010)

Wrigleyvillain said:


> And don't worry about "starting off on wrong foot". It was a simple, legitimate question.



+1 to that! Just wanted to give you a heads up before someone less friendly came around.


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## W1zzard (Jul 23, 2010)

whats the legislation in the US for copying a dvd movie that i own onto my ipad, for example?
would that be a similar usage scenario?


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## Easy Rhino (Jul 23, 2010)

W1zzard said:


> whats the legislation in the US for copying a dvd movie that i own onto my ipad, for example?
> would that be a similar usage scenario?



don't tell anyone about it and you won't get a fine 

we are free to copy as we please to devices we own.


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## W1zzard (Jul 23, 2010)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ripping#United_States

seems to agree with that


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## Easy Rhino (Jul 23, 2010)

W1zzard said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ripping#United_States
> 
> seems to agree with that



i think most of us in the US simply adopt a "dont ask, dont tell' policy when it comes to ripping our media onto a bunch of different devices. plus, enforcement agencies are really only concerned with pirate groups that distribute and sell the stuff.


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## n-ster (Jul 23, 2010)

Not a simple solution, but I like to backup my DVDs and games as ISOs... Get poweriso from poweriso.com and make an iso of each DVD, then mount whichever you want to watch.

Postives: If you lose your DVD, you can burn your iso on a DVD and that DVD is the EXACT copy of the original. Usually the best quality you can get out of your DVD

Negative: Takes space, you have to mount the movie when you want to see it (right click + click mount xD)


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## Steevo (Jul 23, 2010)

I use magic DVD ripper. It works for my phone, and I can keep a hardware accelerated AVI file on the compy.


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## W1zzard (Jul 23, 2010)

n-ster said:


> Not a simple solution, but I like to backup my DVDs and games as ISOs... Get poweriso from poweriso.com and make an iso of each DVD, then mount whichever you want to watch.
> 
> Postives: If you lose your DVD, you can burn your iso on a DVD and that DVD is the EXACT copy of the original. Usually the best quality you can get out of your DVD
> 
> Negative: Takes space, you have to mount the movie when you want to see it (right click + click mount xD)



does that work with dvd encryption? if yes then it seems like a perfectly legal way to do it because it is a backup copy and you didnt not circumvent the copy protection


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## n-ster (Jul 23, 2010)

Yes I believe it does... not 100% sure..

but I had 5 recent movies that I had backed up before I had reformatted and they all worked great when I mounted them


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## newtekie1 (Jul 23, 2010)

W1zzard said:


> whats the legislation in the US for copying a dvd movie that i own onto my ipad, for example?
> would that be a similar usage scenario?



It is legal to do, but illegal to use or make any tools to break the encryption that allows it.

So ripping a CD to MP3s so you can listen to them on your iPod or computer is legal, as there is no encryption on CDs.

However, ripping a movie from a DVD to watch on your iPod/Computer is illegal because commercial DVDs are encrypted and breaking that encryption is illegal.


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## Wrigleyvillain (Jul 23, 2010)

Right and that's why DVD X Copy was banned. It did just that. And quite well too.


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## TheLaughingMan (Jul 23, 2010)

Copy to a HDD or other device you own is legal.  You can create 1 copy for personal use such as watching on HTPC, digital library, iPad, etc. as long as you own the original physical disk.  Some companies now provide a couple code or disk with Blu-ray movies that is a simple way to get a digital copy of the movie for you (in DVD quality).

*If you own a physical copy of the disc*
*Copy for your use, legal.
*2 copies for your use, not legal.
*Copy to let others borrow, not legal.
*Copy to sell, obvious.

At least that is how I remember it.


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## BroBQ (Jul 23, 2010)

fairusewizard.com


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## Mindweaver (Jul 23, 2010)

You can also us anydvd i believe?

Edit: then use something like DivX pro converter to divx or avi.
also some of the newer movies have a digital download of the movie for your ipod from the maker.


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## DaedalusHelios (Jul 23, 2010)

DVD43 to crack encryption
IMGBurn to copy the files from the disk
DVDShrink to remove previews or warnings you don't want
Mount Image with Daemon Tools when it is time to play it
Play the movie with windows media center, media player classic, or zoom player.

All that I listed are free ^^


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## n-ster (Jul 23, 2010)

but illegal, at least the first one xD

I have already done that to back up a dual layer DVD into a single layer one


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## DaedalusHelios (Jul 23, 2010)

n-ster said:


> but illegal, at least the first one xD
> 
> I have already done that to back up a dual layer DVD into a single layer one



First, we have trial by jury. Secondly, if you own it you can crack its encryption and reverse engineer products you own. The problem is one law says you cannot crack the encryption and another law says you have the right to do so. It would be a stalemate in court and prosecutors know that. I have read some EFF documents covering its legality and if you possess the originals and if it isn't shared you are fine.

The funny thing is our laws covering a "public showing" of a movie are very much harassment laws. If you have a block party and invite people to view a movie with you on your nice home theater system then technically you are breaking the law. Even though you bought the movie it is still a public showing even though no money was exchanged. But this is US federal law. I have no idea what other countries have covering it. I know Canada has more freedom in regards to "fair use" but I am unsure as to the details of its differences.


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## slyfox2151 (Jul 23, 2010)

DaedalusHelios said:


> First, we have trial by jury. Secondly, if you own it you can crack its encryption and reverse engineer products you own. The problem is one law says you cannot crack the encryption and another law says you have the right to do so. It would be a stalemate in court and prosecutors know that. I have read some EFF documents covering its legality and if you possess the originals and if it isn't shared you are fine.



as correct as that is, as far as im aware you don't own it. you have only paid the rights to watch it as it is and cannot be changed in anyway. you don't own the contents.


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## DaedalusHelios (Jul 23, 2010)

slyfox2151 said:


> as correct as that is, as far as im aware you don't own it. you have only paid the rights to watch it as it is and cannot be changed in anyway. you don't own the contents.



I am referring to US law and its "fair use" legislation. I have no idea what Australia's "fair use" laws are. They are different country to country.


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## TheLaughingMan (Jul 24, 2010)

DaedalusHelios said:


> The funny thing is our laws covering a "public showing" of a movie are very much harassment laws. If you have a block party and invite people to view a movie with you on your nice home theater system then technically you are breaking the law. Even though you bought the movie it is still a public showing even though no money was exchanged. But this is US federal law. I have no idea what other countries have covering it. I know Canada has more freedom in regards to "fair use" but I am unsure as to the details of its differences.



That falls under different laws because it is no longer "private" use.  There is an easy, simply way to contact the content owner for said movie and just ask.  most companies won't care and give you permission to do so, some may change a modest fee.....unless you are a college then it is like $3,000 to license the temporary use of a film. for a single days showing.  I know because I have done the paper work for my school to do this before.


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## DaedalusHelios (Jul 24, 2010)

TheLaughingMan said:


> That falls under different laws because it is no longer "private" use.  There is an easy, simply way to contact the content owner for said movie and just ask.  most companies won't care and give you permission to do so, some may change a modest fee.....unless you are a college then it is like $3,000 to license the temporary use of a film. for a single days showing.  I know because I have done the paper work for my school to do this before.



I just don't think you should have to. Buying a copy and not charging for others to view it at your home should have a fee associated with it. Also it should be your right to not have to inform them of a viewing in your home that is not for profit.


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## eidairaman1 (Jul 24, 2010)

copying it for own personal use is fine as it is a means of backup, but distributing it over the internet via torrents or to other friends, or trying to cash in on it is not legal.


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## Melvis (Jul 24, 2010)

It is illegal to even copy/recorded to a VHS/DVD/HDD from the TV let alone copying a DVD to HDD as an ISO or any other format, but everyone does it and will continue to do so as this sort of thing can not be policed and no one realy cares. Id like to see them police a billion people for copying shows/movies lol. If you copy for yourself and do not distribute and make a profit off the copies (this will get you into trouble) you will be fine, everyone does it my man.


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## eidairaman1 (Jul 24, 2010)

I say aslong as your not cashing in on it yourself and fact is Media doesnt always record perfectly the first time. I see no problem with it.


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## Kreij (Jul 24, 2010)

> It is illegal to even copy/recorded to a VHS/DVD/HDD from the TV



No it's not (at least not in the US). Almost all services (Cable/Satellite) will supply you with a DVR (for a fee) so you can record and watch later. If it was illegal they could not make this offer/service available.


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## eidairaman1 (Jul 24, 2010)

Kreij said:


> No it's not (at least not in the US). Almost all services (Cable/Satellite) will supply you with a DVR (for a fee) so you can record and watch later. If it was illegal they could not make this offer/service available.



U proved the point here, Copying DVDs to another DVD is not illegal as it is a backup means.


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## Mussels (Jul 24, 2010)

while its legal to back them up, its NOT legal to break the security preventing you from copying them.


basically, its a big legal merry go round where its not illegal, but its not legal either...


as for the DVR/VCR comments... same deal. its kinda legal and its kinda not.

its legal to buy a VCR/DVR that can record stuff off the TV, its legal to record it... but its not legal to watch it, according to some.


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## Kreij (Jul 24, 2010)

The problem we have here in the US is that the copyright law (including the Digital Millenium Copyright Act (DMCA 1998)) is so broad in its scope that it still leaves a lot to interpretation when it comes to digital media.

For instance. If you legally download movies, music or games, it is illegal to make a backup of them even for disaster recovery.
This essentially makes RAID1 illegal if you have downloaded copyright protected material on your computer. It also makes having copies of these types of media on an external HD or NAS or whatever, illegal.
The way this is written, it's also illegal to copy the material to a new computer (even if the original version is deleted). 

The DMCA is just poorly written law and needs a complete overhaul.


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## Mussels (Jul 24, 2010)

Kreij said:


> The problem we have here in the US is that the copyright law (including the Digital Millenium Copyright Act (DMCA 1998)) is so broad in its scope that it still leaves a lot to interpretation when it comes to digital media.
> 
> For instance. If you legally download movies, music or games, it is illegal to make a backup of them even for disaster recovery.
> This essentially makes RAID1 illegal if you have downloaded copyright protected material on your computer. It also makes having copies of these types of media on an external HD or NAS or whatever, illegal.
> ...



perfect examples of what i was trying to say above


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## eidairaman1 (Jul 24, 2010)

That or just removed out of laws because it is ridiculous and DMCA doesnt apply globally as our laws only pertain to this nation.




Kreij said:


> The problem we have here in the US is that the copyright law (including the Digital Millenium Copyright Act (DMCA 1998)) is so broad in its scope that it still leaves a lot to interpretation when it comes to digital media.
> 
> For instance. If you legally download movies, music or games, it is illegal to make a backup of them even for disaster recovery.
> This essentially makes RAID1 illegal if you have downloaded copyright protected material on your computer. It also makes having copies of these types of media on an external HD or NAS or whatever, illegal.
> ...


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## twilyth (Jul 24, 2010)

My solution is to lock all of the doors before I do something "illegal", fire up the surveillance cameras and then proceed to do the nasty with my digital media.

I then copy everything to triple encrypted containers (2fish-serpent-AES) so if there's ever a problem, all I have to do is hit the remote that powers down all of the machines.

They'll never get the password out of me and until they have a quantum computer, they'll never hack it either.

Just my way of telling all the digital media vultures to s*** my d***


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## Champ (Jul 24, 2010)

Easy Rhino said:


> don't tell anyone about it and you won't get a fine
> 
> we are free to copy as we please to devices we own.



That's what I was gonna say.  Don't tell everyone you built up an archive off BlockBuster DVDs and you should be okay.  Maybe I'm thinking wrong, but the "Man" sticks you for different things all the time.  Coping a DVD is a small piece of what we all deserve.


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## TheLaughingMan (Jul 24, 2010)

These laws are stupid.  They do need to be overhauled and written from scratch instead of piling new laws on top old laws without regard to if it makes sense or not.

On a side note

*Little know stupid law:  C.B. Radio boosters are legal to buy, legal to sell, legal to own.  It is illegal to use any device to boost the signal broadcast strength of a C.B. radio unless you a civil servant (law enforcement, Fire department, etc.).  The only civil servant departments that offiicially have C.B. boosters listed as usable equipment is Highway Patrol and Forest Rangers.


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## Melvis (Aug 1, 2010)

Kreij said:


> No it's not (at least not in the US). Almost all services (Cable/Satellite) will supply you with a DVR (for a fee) so you can record and watch later. If it was illegal they could not make this offer/service available.



I don't know what the law states for over there, i would think it be the same everywhere? I have no idea. Ill put it this way, when you download a show off the net that has been shown on TV and also record the same show off the TV so then you have a copy what one is illegal? There both the same thing, just done a little differently. Its like Mussels says it is but it isnt.
We have been given the tools to get a copy but who says its legal or not? Going by my download from the net one^ its illegal, so why would it be any different when recording it off the TV?

Food for thought


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## Perseid (Aug 1, 2010)

Melvis said:


> I don't know what the law states for over there, i would think it be the same everywhere? I have no idea. Ill put it this way, when you download a show off the net that has been shown on TV and also record the same show off the TV so then you have a copy what one is illegal? There both the same thing, just done a little differently. Its like Mussels says it is but it isnt.
> We have been given the tools to get a copy but who says its legal or not? Going by my download from the net one^ its illegal, so why would it be any different when recording it off the TV?
> 
> Food for thought



The ability to record TV to videotape is legal because it was specifically declared to be by the supreme court. They basically said that the VCR was only a tool and Sony could not be held liable for making it. That does NOT mean you as a home user have a legal right to record everything you want from TV without permission, however. http://w2.eff.org/legal/cases/betamax/

That's why the DMCA is worded as it is. It doesn't say that tools used to copy are illegal, because that had already been deemed unconstitutional. They weaseled around it by saying that devices used to break encryption for the purpose of copying are illegal, which the supreme court didn't say anything about in the betamax ruling.

So, bottom line, ImgBurn is legal, AnyDVD is not. Copying DVDs that aren't encrypted is probably legal, recording off of TV is probably not. Downloading, obviously, is definitely not. 

It's all a bunch of crap. There is NO reason for copyright law to be as complicated as it is. People go to school to major specifically in copyright law. That's just insane. Give me a napkin and I'll write you a nice one.


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## freaksavior (Aug 1, 2010)

To the op about copying and playing them from the hard drive.

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=108588


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## Samdbugman (Aug 1, 2010)

thank you for the link. that write-up has everything i needed to know!  i have tested it on my main machine, now i need to assemble the old parts i have to make my movie player.


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## DonInKansas (Aug 1, 2010)

TheLaughingMan said:


> These laws are stupid.  They do need to be overhauled and written from scratch instead of piling new laws on top old laws without regard to if it makes sense or not.



The problem with this is that technology changes and expands too fast for the laws to keep up with.  If they completely scrapped and rewrote the DMCA it would still be outdated in 2-3 years.


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## wahdangun (Aug 1, 2010)

i think right now it is legal to *copy/rip *your own DVD, its even legal to crack your own games.

here are the new DMCA


> The Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) got a big revision today that will likely change the way that users may lawfully use and enjoy the products and media that they own.
> 
> Today the Librarian of Congress announced DMCA Section 1201, which adds six provisions whereby "persons who circumvent access controls in order to engage in noninfringing uses of works in these six classes will not be subject to the statutory prohibition against circumvention."
> 
> ...



so right now, you can use that any-dvd program, or download *crack* from TPB site *legaly*


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## mdsx1950 (Aug 1, 2010)

Illegal or Legal? Who is going to know? lol


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## Easo (Aug 1, 2010)

Dont go running around with arms waving and yelling: "HAI GUYZZZ, I COPIEEDDD MAH DISKSZZZ!", and no problem shall ever come to you. Simple as that.


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## mdsx1950 (Aug 1, 2010)

Easo said:


> Dont go running around with arms waving and yelling: "HAI GUYZZZ, I COPIEEDDD MAH DISKSZZZ!", and no problem shall ever come to you. Simple as that.



Lol. Even if people find out. What are they going to do? Search your PC?


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## freaksavior (Aug 1, 2010)

Samdbugman said:


> thank you for the link. that write-up has everything i needed to know!  i have tested it on my main machine, now i need to assemble the old parts i have to make my movie player.



No Problem, of course you can substitute some of those apps as well.


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## Perseid (Aug 1, 2010)

wahdangun;1976986so right now said:
			
		

> crack[/B] from TPB site *legaly*



Unfortunately, no. You can only rip parts of a DVD if you're using a clip from it in another work, such as a documentary or a youtube clip. They're probably doing this because fair use in the copyright law specifically says this is legal and they're attempting to bring the DMCA in line with that. It does NOT mean you can decrypt and rip discs, even ones you own.

You can only crack games to investigate the DRM. For example, if you're worried that Sony is going to rootkit your system again, you can crack it in an attempt to prove or disprove that. It doesn't mean you can download a crack and play the game.


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## 95Viper (Aug 1, 2010)

wahdangun said:


> i think right now it is legal to *copy/rip *your own DVD, its even legal to crack your own games.
> 
> here are the new DMCA
> 
> ...



No...  Don't know who you are quoting, but it is not legal , except under a certain set of constraints.  Read\comprehend the actual statement\recommendations; and, not some other source, before you make an un-informed comment as fact.

And, the Librarian of Congress\US Copyright Office has, only, issued a statement\recommendations relating to Section 1201(a)(1).

Statement of the Librarian of Congress Relating to Section 1201 Rulemaking

Recommendation of the Register of Copyrights in RM 2008-8; Rulemaking
on Exemptions from Prohibition on Circumvention of Copyright Protection
Systems for Access Control Technologies

§ 1201. Circumvention of copyright protection systems

EDIT:



mdsx1950 said:


> Lol. Even if people find out. What are they going to do? Search your PC?



Yes!

Not everyday citizens; but, they (the legal\justice system) will, when a warrant issued, because someone or some organization has drawn up\filed a complaint.  And, when you are taken to jail, you will even get a full physical of body cavities.


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## wahdangun (Aug 1, 2010)

Perseid said:


> Unfortunately, no. You can only rip parts of a DVD if you're using a clip from it in another work, such as a documentary or a youtube clip. They're probably doing this because fair use in the copyright law specifically says this is legal and they're attempting to bring the DMCA in line with that. It does NOT mean you can decrypt and rip discs, even ones you own.
> 
> You can only crack games to investigate the DRM. For example, if you're worried that Sony is going to rootkit your system again, you can crack it in an attempt to prove or disprove that. It doesn't mean you can download a crack and play the game.



its is legal to rip DVD as long as you use it for non-commercial purpose(its mean for personal use only),

and if i still feel unsecure or sick baout DRM, i can download crack and play it, because it doesn't state anything about downloading crack, and "downloading crack" is a means to crack the game.



> Essentially, it comes down to this:
> *People may now rip DVDs *to show clips for educational purposes, criticism, commentary and noncommercial videos.
> People may now legally jailbreak their iPhones and root their Android phones without fear that a corporation will rain down upon them.
> People may now legally unlock their cell phones.
> ...





> (1) Motion pictures on DVDs that are lawfully made and acquired and that are protected by the Content Scrambling System when circumvention is accomplished solely in order to accomplish the incorporation of short portions of motion pictures into new works for the purpose of criticism or comment, and where the person engaging in circumvention believes and has reasonable grounds for believing that circumvention is necessary to fulfill the purpose of the use in the following instances:
> (i) Educational uses by college and university professors and by college and university film and media studies students;
> (ii) Documentary filmmaking;
> *(iii) Noncommercial videos*


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## Perseid (Aug 1, 2010)

You're putting bold text on the parts you like and ignoring the rest:

People may now rip DVDs *to show clips for educational purposes, criticism, commentary and noncommercial videos.*
People may now circumvent the copy protection of PC and video games *for investigative reasons*.

Trust me, they're not going to add exceptions to the DMCA that throw out the entire law.


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## Kreij (Aug 1, 2010)

The above parallels the US fair use law, which was basically put into effect for educational institutions, libraries (archives), journalists and law enforcement. It does not give free reign to home users.

Just thought I would mention that in case you never read the sections on fair use.


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## Hayder_Master (Aug 1, 2010)

sometimes i feel happy cuz im in IRAQ, i have about 500Gb of buleray movies in my HDD's download free from internet and also you can buy any kind copy of DVD like movies and games anything for 2$ only.


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## claylomax (Aug 2, 2010)

hayder.master said:


> sometimes i feel happy cuz im in IRAQ, i have about 500Gb of buleray movies in my HDD's download free from internet and also you can buy any kind copy of DVD like movies and games anything for 2$ only.



You don't need to be in Iraq; take Spain for example, the main reason for people to have internet is to download music, movies and games for "free". Telefonica, the main ISP of Spain and the third largest telecommunications provider in the world, explains in their router support website how to open ports to use Emule or similar programs. And good luck finding original music Cd's shops, you need to be in cities over 500,000 to find one because most of them closed down.


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## mdsx1950 (Aug 2, 2010)

hayder.master said:


> sometimes i feel happy cuz im in IRAQ, i have about 500Gb of buleray movies in my HDD's download free from internet and also you can buy any kind copy of DVD like movies and games anything for 2$ only.



You and I are so much alike lol. 
I have like 100s of DVDs with 700MB movies and almost 500GB of game ISOs LOL.  

Altogether about 1TB of free stuff that's not actually free.


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## Mussels (Aug 2, 2010)

mdsx1950 said:


> You and I are so much alike lol.
> I have like 100s of DVDs with 700MB movies and almost 500GB of game ISOs LOL.
> 
> Altogether about 1TB of free stuff that's not actually free.  http://romancebookmaven.com/wp-content/plugins/lmbbox-smileys/smileys/rbm/muahaha.gif



reach 10TB then come back. small fry 


ofc, mine is all 'legally acquired downloadable material', mmhmm. cough.


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## mdsx1950 (Aug 2, 2010)

Mussels said:


> reach 10TB then come back. small fry
> 
> 
> ofc, mine is all 'legally acquired downloadable material', mmhmm. cough.



Haha.  Well if you do count my lifetime of downloads it would be way past that  Though i've saved just about 1TB of the "illegally acquired non-downloadable material  LOL

Though don't get me wrong... i do have a whole bunch of legal stuff as well.


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