# sapphire x800se help!!!



## pcgamer21 (Feb 11, 2005)

Dudes can ya flash this card to a x800pro or xt, and unlock all pipes!!!!


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## gerrynicol (Feb 11, 2005)

I have been asking this same question on this forum, no real reply yet, I was gonna try it once I get a better cooling solution(somtime next week) I will let you know how I get on.

Gerry.


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## ADV4NCED (Feb 11, 2005)

From what I know, all Se cards can get softmodded or flashed to to Pro.  Correct me if i'm wrong, but your card can only be flashed if it has the right type of core as the version you want to flash your card to.  I.e 9800Pro (R350) cannot be flashed to 9800XT (R360) because they use different cores. Sorry, I don't have much knowledge about X800 cards.


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## gerrynicol (Feb 11, 2005)

I think(im a little short on the knowledge front as well) that the X800 series, with the exception of the XTPE X850, are R420 I know for sure the SE and Pro versions are but after that ?????

Gerry.


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## ADV4NCED (Feb 11, 2005)

Check out the GPU Database for information on different cards: http://www.techpowerup.com/gpudb/


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## gerrynicol (Feb 12, 2005)

I have both bios's. I will try it once I have adiquite cooling!!!!.


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## mR Yellow (Feb 16, 2005)

I don't think u will unlock the extra pipes..especially on the newer x800pros. Ive tried...but no luck


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## Nergal (Feb 16, 2005)

you have to hradware-mord the pros.

I think the SE will unlcok 1 set op pipes (4 extra to 12) and then you'll have to hardware-mod for the extra 4.


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## mR Yellow (Feb 17, 2005)

Nergal said:
			
		

> you have to hradware-mord the pros.
> 
> I think the SE will unlcok 1 set op pipes (4 extra to 12) and then you'll have to hardware-mod for the extra 4.



Umm...ive done that, but still no luck. The new revisions come with another from of protection.


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## steelmind (May 13, 2005)

hi there got the same card and the same thoughts, overclocking is never enough i got had my sapphire x800se up to 564.55 core and 537 mem, but all i can think about is getting those piplines open, got crossed fingers for ya gerrynicol, i got this little baby in pc world and the nets a little dry on success stories for it.


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## gR3iF (May 13, 2005)

hm just do it? nothing can happen u can flash it back always in cause it didnt work look for some laser cuts and so on


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## gerrynicol (May 14, 2005)

I got a new card now so sorry folks, went for a 6800GT, I read up as much as I could and it seems like this is a no go anyway, Some stories say the card just dies after a flash.


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## gR3iF (May 14, 2005)

hm  or take a x800xl | 6800gt are same speed


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## VulkanBros (May 18, 2005)

soo.....END OF STORY..????
I hope not.....I too have a x800se ( MSI ).......
found some stuff on a german website on hard-modding a x800 PRO....but not a x800se...!!!
Correct me if I am wrong : the X800se has a R420 core and the PRO allso have a R420 core....
So why is´nt it possible to unlock the extra pipes ????


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## gerrynicol (May 18, 2005)

Both the pro and se have 420, I checked on my card and it never had any laser cuts either.  I have read some articles, when they have tried to mod the se but it just dies, I dunno, never wanted to try just in case.


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## gR3iF (May 18, 2005)

just oc the card is also good but the flash cant work someone from inside telled me that the card is a 8 pp and the 12 arent reachable trough flashing


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## steelmind (May 18, 2005)

I to hope this is not the end, how much more performance wise would we achieve opening these pipes. i already feel like im missing out, with my massive lack of knoledge on flashing, and that it seems you need shit proof undies to have a go, is making me feel that i had better offically buy myself out of the 8 pipe trap im in. x800 xt or x800 pe what can i pick these up for and where do you sugest i look for a good deal.


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## VulkanBros (May 19, 2005)

Hmmm..... has anyone of you guys tried the "X800 Pro VIVO to XT PE Bios Mod" 
Link : http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/vidcard/100
......on a x800se card..???
Or do I have to be the first...?


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## the-x-gamer (May 19, 2005)

No1 has tried it with success.Try it and tell your results.If it will not unlock the 12 or 16 pipes ill go to X800XL...


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## VulkanBros (May 19, 2005)

OKAY....I´ll give it a shot......Try it tonight.....
I will post results tonight or tomorrow ....hopefully.....If my graphic card survive
If no posts tonight/tomorrow....well you then know why.....


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## steelmind (May 19, 2005)

Ive Got All My Lucky Charms Out For You Vulkan Bros, My, You Must Have Some Shit Proof Cacks. If It Does Work Then Surely You Would Have Found The Cheapest Way Of Getting To The Xt Pe Performance Level. Fortune Favors The Brave. If By Any Chance Someone Knows That This Is Deffently Gonna Harm Vulkan Card Could They Please Get A Message In, Instead Of Watching Him Fry His Card, Know Theres A Good Comunity. By The By Has Anyone Been Keeping Up On The Latest Mame Developments This Little Program Makes Well Happy Just Like To Know If There Are Any New Roms In Town ... Chow


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## VulkanBros (May 20, 2005)

Thanx for the your concern steelmind......

Well....I did manage to flash my MSI x800se card.......but....
Nothing happend....ATITool tells me, that I am running with "only" 8 pipelines....
and my core and memory speeds are the same as before ( 400/400 )
The card is now identified as a X800 XT card ( nothing about PE ?? )

FACTS :
Card : MSI RX800SE-TD256 256MB GDDR3 2 ns ( NO LASERCUT )( AGP )
Flashtool used : Modified flashrom
BIOS used : MSI X800 XT PE (AGP) 256 MB
The flashing went well without errors....

Question : Has it anything to do with the fact that my memory is 2.0 ns and the XT PE original is 1.6 ns ??
Should I try another BIOS ? ATI or GIGABYTE ??


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## the-x-gamer (May 20, 2005)

Try to enable the xtra pipes using AtiTool.You can also open XT PE bios with rabit and save it to a new one with 2ns and try flashing again.


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## the-x-gamer (May 20, 2005)

Did you try any benches?it also may seem to be 8 piped but in benches may be some differences.


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## VulkanBros (May 20, 2005)

I have bench´ed it with HL2 Bench and 3DMark....no or very very little gain.....
ATITool do not give me the possibility to enable any extra pipelines....
I will try edit the BIOS file with ( ? rabit ? ) a BIOS-file-editor, to see if its possible
to alter the speed of the memory....
I will be back......


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## wazzledoozle (May 20, 2005)

http://www.softpedia.com/get/Tweak/Video-Tweak/ATi-Radeon-BIOS-Tuner.shtml

There are newer versions floating around, but they are hard to find.


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## the-x-gamer (May 21, 2005)

Try modding the bios with R@BIT and then flash it.I think it will success....Or at least i hope so...


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## steelmind (May 22, 2005)

hows it going, vulkanbros, do you know that i am awaiting your response like a old woman addicted to coranation street. if you can manage to open those exstra pipes i wil too try and achieve this if not ive just been scowting around for a x800xtpe and you can pick em up under 300 pounds. but i am hoping your gonna be succesful and save my notes. any how best of luck.


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## 65tweet (May 22, 2005)

Hmmm just curious, but have any of you looked at your cores? If so did the laser cut look the same as the picture? http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/vidcard/100 Is it on the same side or maybe two of them?


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## gerrynicol (May 23, 2005)

Nope, I don't think there is any laser cuts on the SE cards, they are just using there "crappy" chips fot these cards, you will be lucky to unlock 4 "good" pipes


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## VulkanBros (May 23, 2005)

Hmmm....
Tryed RaBit v. 1.5.... with "MSI.X800XT.256.Samsung16_040719.bin" BIOS file........
When I tryed flashing the x800se card I get a error message saying : "wrong Device ID"

Tryed with "ATI.X800XT.256.Samsung16.040609.bin".....got the same error message...

Maybe I am doing something wrong....anyone knows if there are a "user manual" to RaBit ???

Or any other suggestions ??


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## the-x-gamer (May 23, 2005)

Try to fix device ids with rabit.In the first page use your cards device id,subsystem id and subvendor.You can see your cards with rivatuner.Good Luck


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## VulkanBros (May 23, 2005)

....found this : RaBit v. 1.7 here : http://www.overclockers.ru/cgi-bin/files/download.cgi?file=452

Trying with this new version + Device ID + SubSystem ID + SubVendor ID

....


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## VulkanBros (May 23, 2005)

Now I am really confused........

I edited with RaBit v. 1.7 and using "ATI.X800XT.256.Samsung16.040609.bin"
with new version + Device ID + SubSystem ID + SubVendor ID.....
I still got the "wrong Device ID" error.......hmmm...

Then i tryed flashing my card with " ATI.X800PRO.256.Samsung20_040719.bin "
( is a X800PRO - 256 MB MEM - 2,0 ns )......and well that worked.....now i got 12 pipelines
instead of 8....    great, hurraaa..... .......but......there is but......my computer has become very unstable....
freezes every now an then, sometimes it makes warm-boot whitout any user interferance.....

As far as Im can see....the only difference between X800XT bios and the X800PRO bios is the
core and the memory speeds......
Where is the information about the pipelines...? Is that information not stored in the BIOS...???

WARNING : I will not recommend doing what I have done with my graphic card

I will post again, if I can manage to get the damn thing stable......


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## the-x-gamer (May 23, 2005)

Now remove your drivers using Driver Cleaner(google it) and also use CabCleaner.Then install the newest drivers(i reccommend omega/dna).And really u have 12 pipelines???This sounds gr8.Ill try it on my sapphire...And in benches is there any difference?


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## steelmind (May 23, 2005)

wow i missed so much well done vulkan bros, i hope you can stabalise your card but your the first i believe  to open exstra pipes on an x800se. i hope x gamer idiea is a help too just wish i could understand a tenth of what the hell you did to get there. im still in two minds whether to buy a x800 xt pe or try for glory as youve done, cheers for keeping us so well informed theres nothing worse than when a thread goes dead, good luck too thexgamer se ya guys later !->


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## VulkanBros (May 24, 2005)

the-x-gamer said:
			
		

> Now remove your drivers using Driver Cleaner(google it) and also use CabCleaner.Then install the newest drivers(i reccommend omega/dna).And really u have 12 pipelines???This sounds gr8.Ill try it on my sapphire...And in benches is there any difference?



grr.....what a nightmare.....I would still not recommend to try doing what I have done.....
I cant get it stable.....10 minutes is the top....then the machine freezes/crashes or I am getting massive artifacts......

I have tryed DH Driver Cleaner Pro ( http://www.drivercleaner.net/ ) and installed ATI Catalyst 5.5..
But that did not help anything at all.....

I think I have to flash it back to the original .... if that is possible....
I hope not I have fryed my card...I´ll be back.....


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## 65tweet (May 24, 2005)

VulkanBros said:
			
		

> I cant get it stable.....10 minutes is the top....then the machine freezes/crashes or I am getting massive artifacts......



I had a similar problem with freezing when I flashed to XT PE. Everything would freeze at 520 core. I upped the core voltage from 1.43 to 1.48 and now get to 543 without artifacts. I would recommend going with 1.4 volts if you’re trying to run XT speeds. Another problem may be your cooling. Did your card come with standard X800 cooling or a crappy small SE one. Start off slowly with SE speeds and see if that helps with crashing. just down clock the card with ATI TOOL and keep it there..


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## VulkanBros (May 24, 2005)

65tweet said:
			
		

> I had a similar problem with freezing when I flashed to XT PE. Everything would freeze at 520 core. I upped the core voltage from 1.43 to 1.48 and now get to 543 without artifacts. I would recommend going with 1.4 volts if you’re trying to run XT speeds. Another problem may be your cooling. Did your card come with standard X800 cooling or a crappy small SE one. Start off slowly with SE speeds and see if that helps with crashing. just down clock the card with ATI TOOL and keep it there..



Thanx 65tweet.....lowered the core and mem speeds with 50 MHz ( core=425/mem 400 ) now it seems to run stable....so far I did´nt get any artifacts......My colling unit is a Zalman VF700-CU....
I will use ATITool for some intensive artifacts scanning......


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## the-x-gamer (May 24, 2005)

Whaaaattt?You are stable with 12 pipelines?Run a benchmark now and tell me the difference.I didnt think core and mem woyld be a problem,but it seems to have less ocing ability,because of the 12 pipelines.Ill do it with a modded x800pro sapphire bios@425/400(default)


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## the-x-gamer (May 24, 2005)

And dont forget to tell us your max core/mem when u find them.....


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## KnightKiller (May 24, 2005)

SO i have a X800XE R423 (PCIE-16x) 128MB DDR  256bit 8Pipelines DefaultCore425MHZ/DefaultMem350MHZ from the Dell Dimension 8400 and a Lasercut.

I tried to flash with the Dell X800 XT (PCI-E 16x) but after reboot the screen stay black and i had to type the commands blind to get the old bios loaded.....very depressing.

So i guess it isn't possible to mod my card.


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## VulkanBros (May 24, 2005)

Original card : MSI RX800SE-TD256 256MB GDDR3 2 ns ( 8 pipelines )
3DMark05 : 4112 3DMarks

BIOS modified card : ATI.X800PRO.256.Samsung20_040719.bin ( 12 pipelines )
3DMark05 : 4308 3DMarks

Original core/mem speed : 425/400
MAX ATITool artifacts scanning ( 20 min. ) core/mem : 440/410 

Hmm....my computer went down again.....5 min. after finishing the artifact test.....
Not good....Tonight I will re-flash my card....and hopefully get my good old x800se  with 8 pipes back
There is no good in having a 12 pipe card ...that crashes every now and then.....
Thanx guys for your support.....


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## 65tweet (May 24, 2005)

What is your core voltage? A pencil mod to 1.4 my be what you need. It's likely that your voltage is about 1.3 because it's an SE. The default for XT & VIVO PRO's is about 1.41 so not much chance that upping yours will give you any problems. Also what are your temps? If your cooling isn't working properly that will cause the card to shut down as well for protection.


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## the-x-gamer (May 25, 2005)

Yes.Try the pencil mod,that seems to be easy.What your card may be in need for is some voltage.


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## VulkanBros (May 27, 2005)

NO volt or pencil-mod.....I tried to "flash-back" my card.......
Well ...lets put it this way.....I am running with my old Club3D 9600 PRO card again....
.....anyone who would like to buy a "slightly" fried MSI X800SE card....???


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## VulkanBros (Jun 15, 2005)

I went down to my  computer-shop ( where I buyed my MSI x800se card and told the manager what happend.....And you know what.....he said that he would send the defektive card to the manufacturer to see if the garantie would cover it....
That was 2 weeks ago....
Today he called me to tell, that the manufacturer will give me a new card....
From now on I will start believe in "there is more between the sky and earth than you know"......
Well....then we can start testning again......


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## 65tweet (Jun 19, 2005)

It sounded like you were getting someplace with the last card. You quit just as it was getting exciting! What you are doing may be easy to do, just not simple to get right. A volt mod is more than likely necessary for your task. Remember SE cards typically have chips that have some sort of defect. A multi meter is your friend….happy modding!!!


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## Mome (Jun 19, 2005)

What about flashing or hardmodding the SE now?
Did it work this time or did this card die, too?
My SE runs very fast (565/583) but 12 pipes would be very nice, and it would sound better if you say that you have a X800pro   
hope you were lucky with modding your card...
then I'll try, too.


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## Inteleron (Jul 12, 2005)

Aren't the SE and PRO arround the same price now?


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## Mome (Jul 12, 2005)

Maybe they are at the same price, now.
But I do have a SE and so I would like to know if VulkanBros was successfull with his Pro mod.
Then I would try it too


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## elka (Aug 4, 2005)

*question*



			
				VulkanBros said:
			
		

> NO volt or pencil-mod.....I tried to "flash-back" my card.......
> Well ...lets put it this way.....I am running with my old Club3D 9600 PRO card again....
> .....anyone who would like to buy a "slightly" fried MSI X800SE card....???


does it mean that your reflashing (back to X800SE original bios) was successfull but your card still was not working properly ?
Did you try before if your card is able to run with PRO's core and mem speed ?

thanks

eLKa


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## Mome (Aug 4, 2005)

I wasn't able to wait for VulcanBros...   

Today I flashed my SE with a modified Pro Bios (12Pipes but Clocks at 425/400).
When I restarted after flashing I was happy, that there was a picture and that everything worked. Then, when booting Windows, a new graphics adapter was found...X800XT   .
Then I started Atitool, but I still showed 8 Pipes...  
After that I flashed the original Pro Bios, but it didn't make a difference, still 8 Pipes.
A disgusting result!

I think it's because of a Lasercut on my SE, but I thought, that this Lasercut would only cut 16 Pipes.

So I have to cope with 8 Pipes and a Core Speed of 570/590    
But I'm also happy, that my card is still working...


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## mitsirfishi (Aug 12, 2005)

well from my experances i had a 9800se and unlocked it and clocked it to a 9800pro and the improvements was impressive but regardin the x800se it will either be a faulty pro or faulty x800 and all they do is clock it down and shut down the pipelines but u mayb lucky to unlock 4pipes but it depends if its agp or pci-e but if you dont have any sucess then just clock it up abit


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## Inteleron (Aug 12, 2005)

the X800XL has been on my mind l8ly, it has 16 pipes 256mb gddr3, how come it performs lower than x800xt? could it be jsut becaue the clocks are slower? or its gpu is of different design? is it possible to make an x800xl as fast as an x800xt by overclocknig it?


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## mitsirfishi (Aug 12, 2005)

well to be honest the x800xl has the x850 features but for some wierd reasons it has its own wierd code name which does make it relate to either the x850 or x800 but the xl was made just be a raw performer at not to highly priced and the pcb is slightly different


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## Quazi (Aug 13, 2005)

I think the reason V due was having issues was because of the clock speeds of the bios he flased it with. If he would have used rabit to lower the clock speeds to what his card could handle stable, then I believe he would have been alright.


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## Mome (Aug 21, 2005)

the first Bios I flashed was changed with RaBit, but it didn't help either.


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## 65tweet (Aug 22, 2005)

Mome, Did you reinstall the ATI drivers?  When I flashed to XT PE ATI Tool showed only 12 pipes but when I reinstalled there were 16. What BIOS did you use? It took an original Gigabyte XT PE BIOS to unlock my extra pipes. For some reason that bios completely replaced the original one thus unlocking the extras. No other one would do it. It also sounds like a laser cut issue.  If you sucessfuly hardmod it you may get 12 pipes, however I’d do the BIOS first.  Caution though XT PE speeds will have a high likelihood of causing lockups when windows loads so I’d down clock first thing until you know it’s stable. Happy modding!


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## dolf (Aug 22, 2005)

Not only Gigabyte BIOS can override completely the pipe info which usualy remains unchanged useing the normal flashrom (atiflash) when flashing the BIOS on X800Pro ViVo's. You also can use modified flashrom to do that but the advantage of this method is that it is completely convertable. Read this:
http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/vidcard/100 and be sure that you haven't got lasercut on the core - one or two (you have to remove the heatsink and to see). For BIOS editing on X800 serie use RaBit 1.7 and for flashing flashrom 2.37 or 2.40 with command line a:\flashrom -f -p 0 (zero not letter "o") biosname (max 8 symbols).sufix (.bin or .rom)

Probably you will not succeed with enabling of the remaining pipes on the newer X800se/pro cards and PCIx but there is no reason to don't even try.

Successfull modding.


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## Mome (Aug 22, 2005)

I used a Sapphire X800Pro nonVIVo Bios, because I have a Sapphire X800SE.
And I do have reinstalled the drivers...
And the card doesn't produce higher Benchmark scores. So I'm sure it still has 8Pipes.


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## x800se_owner (Sep 13, 2005)

Hi all, i also have that x800se card, and all i can say i am happy with it's performance, as it was the best bang for buckets on AGP in Germany.
Any other card are well above that 160€ or not even faster, or not availiable.
So even that said, i am interested by nature in unlocking the pipes on that card.

reading all that is stated here, i think that it should be posible to reach the goal of may be 12 pipes.

but even having laying around my former ti4280 vid card, i not want to lose my x800se.
So bevore i start flashing and moding (1,4v sounds nice to me) the holy shit out of my se, i have some questions to those who already have tried zthat.

1. is it possible to flash back the original x800se bios if problems occure?
For me  the experiences of Vulkan let me assume that this won't work...

2. if i save my current bios with ATITool, ist that oky as a backup messure?
ore could it be posible that the so created bios file isn`t any good and i should use ATIflash or some other dos based BIOS tool.

3. If the Bios flashing goes wrong, is al  wich has to be done a starting with  an PCI card or flashing with an DOS boot disk, having some fancy autoexec. bat flashing comand on it?

So no we come to what i planed to do:

First i want to flash the Sapphire  	X800 Pro (AGP) 256 MB 475 450 Bios,
due to the lack of any x800 bios.
 I think i will do that with atiflash 3.xx and the "new bios " option.
if possible to disable (may be rabit?) vivo funktion, the  ATI X800 AIW 256 MB bios sounds good ideal to me, even if the glocks are a bit high (500 / 500
Samsung 2.0 ).

But i am loocking for an MSI x800 pro AGP Bios with 400 /450 and Samsung 2.0 ram.
As far as i know, the Sapphire x800se i have is produced by MSI (same red PCB, same layout, all the same even power con).

So if there are some stability probs, i woudn't hesitate to do the volt mode,
so no limit in this way.

At the moment the card is runing fine with  550 core /500 mem clock.
But if unlocking pipes will do, i think those large overclock's will gone, i think to avoid the voltmod at the first step it is better to underclock the card first with the aprobiate bios.
if i won`t be able to free the pipes, i will loock if there are some lasercut's to close.


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## Mome (Sep 13, 2005)

as I said I flashed my SE.
There was no Problem with flashing the card.
You can save the Bios with Atitraytools (Atitool?), when editing it via RaBit you'll see it's the same as the Bios you can load down. But you can also save the Bios with Atiflash.
First I took a Pro Bios and changed the Core/Mem Speed down to the SE clocks, to avoid the accident of VulcanBros.
But with my card it didn't work.
But I'm looking forward to see your results   .
Maybe I have found somebody who can connect my cuttet pipes. But this will cost money and has a high risk of killing the card...


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## x800se_owner (Sep 13, 2005)

ok then i will try ist,
but have you ever tired to flash back again?
do you have set the -newbios option of the flash program?

I have loaded several x800 bioses and opend them with rabit,
then i saved the log and go throw the differenzes.
the most important thing that i could see was the ASIC Config.
it is obvious that this determin the number of pipes.
But to my supriese there are even differenzes between the Sapphire x800se and the MSi x800se, and that is what me makes a little bit confused, but ok it could be possible that there are different pipelines disabled, depending on the chips they have used.

I think if you flash with the new BIOS option, then the ASIC block will get flashed too, which indeed is probabely what we want do doo.

Can you tell me which BIOS from the dl page u used? and wat x800se you have, the MSI one or the Sapphire one?

Dont get me wrong, id on't want to know what label is there, i want to know wich color your card has, as stated above, the Sapphire are relabeled MSi.
But as there are different Bios i think it is best to lock at rabit's log, the interesting part is the ASIC Config at 0x7A= , which is 0x22 on the MSi and ATI one (like mine) and 0x20 for the Sapphire se card.
The thing is clear, if that is a difference in card ore chip layout, this is something we have to consider.
I think all we should do is to analyzing the differenzes in this section, may be we can decipher the code.
In my opinion flashing a completely diffrent BIOS could be realy the wrong way, but of course the easiest.

How is it possible to change the number of pipes using rabit? i'v never seen that option.


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## x800se_owner (Sep 14, 2005)

So, i flashed the ATI.X800PRO.256.Samsung20_040719.bin bios to my x800se card altered to 425.25/ 398.99 clocks. After some thought's on risking my x800se, i hit the button:   

ATIFLASH.EXE -newbios -f -p 0 ati800pm.rom

After rebooting, w2k rededected my x800se as x800xt.

ATI Tool dont showed me some more pipes, but 3dmar03 gives me about 7010 point with  425.25 /400.
So at the moment i think that there is no succes, but ok the card still do oc to 500/450 and gives me in that config 7800points in 3dmark03.
As i am  running it with the stock cooler, and temp is going beyond the line with 83°C, i think i will not use this core overclock, until better cooling is there.

Interesting ist, that rabit states some interesting things:


Active pipelines: 8, GB_TILE_CONFIG = 0x00010017
MPP_TB_CONFIG = 0x01FF0000

This has not altered by the flash, so i think that there is an other thing wich will determin the amount of pipes.
And as far as i know, the new BIOS file was only around 55kb, whereas the used flash chip is staed as 64kb size.
So i think the pipe information are stored in that space.
But ok, the only card wich changed Pipes was vulkans, and this has not that good ending.
So at the moment i don't know if i stay with the new bios or revert back to the x800se one.
But i think at least it would be a good information, if i can do that, without frying the x800se card.
Then i would feel more pleasant during messing around with x800 Bioses.
Next step is to dismount the hs, and check if there are any lasercut in my chip.


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## x800se_owner (Sep 14, 2005)

So today i locked under the hsf of my x800se card, an hey there are some laser cut.
But the other one i have senn is that there are some resistirs, and some free soldering plates, thus i thinkl 2 of the resistors could have placed to another configuration.
If someone could post some nice photos of an x800pro GPU, may be i find the right setting.
on the other hand, my chip is't labeld r420, it is lable x800se and that makes me a little bit confused.
ok making another printing is easy compared with setting up another chipproduktion....
I tried reconnecting the cut, but as my ssl are a little bit tried out, i think there are no proper contact, ore it just won't do the trick.


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## Mome (Sep 14, 2005)

first of all were are you from? (I'm from Germany)
so you had the same experience as me... 
My card is also from Sapphire (I could send you some pictures...).
So the Pro Bios I loaded from the Bios Database was a Sapphire X800 Pro nonVivo Bios.
The easiest thing to see if a bigger Bios fits is to look for the file size of the original Bios you saved with Atitraytools or with Atiflash. With my card, the file size was about 55KB, so I have a 56KB Bios and I would kill my card with a 66KB Bios...

Another question:
Whats the rest of your system?
With my System (look at my Sig) I break the 10000Points at 3DMark03 with graphics clock at 575/590. So I was surprised, that you're getting only 7800 Points.


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## x800se_owner (Sep 14, 2005)

Yes i am from Germay too.
And yes my system is now (not with the ti4280  ) badly limmited by my CPU.   
But there are IMHO no way to go further with the sockel A.
I have her an Semperon 2000, may be  i will chek out the mobile mod, as with mine i have no succes yet.
2200Mhz would be that what i think should be reachable, but more i think is in no way someting which will make sense, apparently if i conisder that an Asrock 939 mobo with sis chip will only cost me 55€+ the 100 venice.
May be the dual slot Asrock wit Ali Chip will be an option.
The a64 are so damed fast.....and ocing is so an pleasure...
My sys:
http://www.nethands.de/pys/show.php4?user=pcfreak2


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## x800se_owner (Sep 14, 2005)

no, you dont kill your card with an 64kb one, the chip is 64kb.
I think may be in the left space, the pipe information could be stored.
the other thing is, as far as i know there is an other EEPROM, may be thy stored the asic config there.
But ok, if i got some nice Aceton to thin my SSL, i will trie the laser cut mod again.
I think at keast it should do somethin.
But of course, it is possible that ATi hase locked the information in the mentioned EEPROM, this would be not impossible to alter, but hey we have to know how.
All in all i am sure that the x800se and the non vivo's could be changed, but may be this is far beyound some easy biosflashing or hw hacking trick.
I think if someone skiled in this area would try it, may be with one ore two testcard's, he will find the trick.
this is comparable with intels PII, no hobbyist could crack that multi lock, but i have seen PII cores, which are modified with an simple litle microchip atached, and are selled in the far east with a huge margin.
But the fact that vulkan has managed it to show the pipes, i think it could be possible.
May be we are on the right way, but only some driver glitches make us stuck.
As far as i know, vulkano changed the device ID's bevore runing in thos problems, but at that moment he has the pipes.
may be was this only a side efeckt, and thus his card is brocken.

it is clear that at the moment i am not willing to brick my card, but some intelligent prepared things i will try.


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## Mome (Sep 14, 2005)

I've got a great idea, because you are from Germany, too. 1 We could write in German (aber echt jetzt Junge   ) oder du schaust mal in den Thread  hier rein. Da sind nämlich nochmehr leute die sich mit dem Pipe freischalten beschäftigen. Und der Sisko da könnte dir zur not deine auch entcutten, d.h. er könnte dir die Pipes wieder verbinden. Mein Name da dürfte nicht allzu schwer herauszufinden sein.

Aso und wenn du ganz günstig aufrüsten willst kannst du auch ein S754 Board mit Sempron 2600+/2800+ in Betracht ziehen... die gehen nämlich auch super zu ocen und sind nur minimal langsamer als die A64...


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## x800se_owner (Sep 14, 2005)

ok, the secret is discovered.
May be i will took the soldering iron out of the box......

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=4971&page=2&pp=10

Ja ja habe ich ATI doch mal wieder überschätzt, echt mal low tech protection.....  
na ja hm mal sehen.
ich denke so groß ist der Preisunterschied ja nicht zum so939 und a64.
Hm na ja so ca. 60€.
Aber eigentlich bin ich gerade so halbweg abgebrannt, aber nu  ja ich weis das ich am limit bin, was ich echt nicht für möglich gehalten hätte werde ich das schon mal überlegen.


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## Mome (Sep 15, 2005)

wenn du ein Sempron 2800+ + ein DFI Lanparty UT3 bei dem bekannten Internet Auktionshaus    kaufst kommst du für ca 45 + 50 Euro raus. Und der Sempron lässt sich meist bis auf 2400MHz übertakten, womit er dann ca. so schnell wie ein 3500+ für S939 ist...
War nur ne Überlegung.

With the X800SE I will do a Hardmod with Silberleitlack, which I have to buy first.
How to do you can see in the Topic on Forumdeluxx.


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## x800se_owner (Sep 16, 2005)

Ja so habe ich das noch nicht betrachtet, der so 754 war für mich eigentlich schon tot bevor er da war...  
Aber bei den Preisen muss ich das mal überlegen.....  
Ist der Semperon so754 tatsächlich vergleichbar mit dem So939? (ok singel channel  Ram..aber das ist wurscht)
Also aus den Sockel A Kernen denke ich kann man nicht annähernd die Speed eines venice 3000 rausholen, obwohl man ja wesentlich höher tacktet.
Also ma schauen, denke wenn semperon da doch schon lieber so nen 64Bit fähigen.....
man das aufrüsten hat ja echt mal kein ende......   dachte das einzige was mich gerade ausbremmst wäre die gute Ti4280 gewesen....und nun selbst in HL2 bremst mich die CPU....damn thing hätte ich das nur vorher gewusst, dann hätte ich gleich ne 5900 von ebay gezogen, das hätte gereicht.
Was solls.
Ma schauen wo ich mir die 100 ocken aus den Rippen schneide....  
Hast mich da echt auf was gebracht.
Aber erst spiele ich noch mit dem Semperon So. A, den ich da rumliegen habe, rum   und mach ma den mobile mod.... mal sehen ob es geht.
mit meinem aktuellen Tbred A geht er nicht.

Nen netten Zalman VF700CuAl  liegt gerade neben mir, ne Flasche Aceton um meinen SSL wieder Flüssig zu bekommen auch.....mach das aber erst morgen, muss früh raus...und für den Lasercut Mod braucht man schon ein bisle ruhe...

Und dann werde ich mich einer irsinnigen Grafikkarte erfreuen, deren Potenzial ich nicht halbwegs heben kann....aber irgendwie trotzdem cool ne x800XTPE@16P für 160....  na ja wurst wens nicht klappt, ist mir ja eh jetzt schon zu schnell.


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## Sly.P.I. (Jan 29, 2006)

*X800se Agp Aiw R420*

I was following you guys untill the German kicked in and totally confused me.
I have 
X800SE AIW AGP 256mb (265bit)
8 pipes

Did anyone get 12 or 16 pipes stable?

If so, how??

Cheers, Steve


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## Mome (Jan 29, 2006)

Sly.P.I. said:
			
		

> I was following you guys untill the German kicked in and totally confused me.
> I have


sorry! But it was easier to talk then 

I and X800SE owner haven't been able to unlock 12 or 16 Pipes.

But I heard of someone in a German Forum, who was able to unlock two SE Cards to 16Pipes.

There are two different types of Lasercut. If your card has a "external" Lasercut, you can fix it. If your card has a "internal" Lasercut, you can't fix the Cut and have to cope with the 8Pipes.

You can look for this in Atitool when looking at the fuses.


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## Sly.P.I. (Jan 29, 2006)

*X800se*

Thanks, it has external laser cut, can be seen by removing heatsink
Here's the ati tool thing...
what does it tell me?
Thanks, STeve


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## Mome (Jan 29, 2006)

maybe there's an internal and an external Lasercut.

You have to try to unlock the Lasercut. 
Nobody really knows whats the point with the abbility to unlock...


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## x800se_owner (Jan 29, 2006)

That shows the used core and that your card using a 4x4 kombination so you hav the usual  8 pipes.


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## Istarion (Aug 23, 2006)

Hello!
I've a MSI x800SE too, but I think the settings looks a little bit different:

Vendor: 0x1002, SubVendor: 0x1002 (ATI Technologies Inc)
Device: 0x4A4A (R420/M18), SubSystem: 0x0002
CONFIG_XSTRAP.8P_DISABLE = 0x02
On Board EEPROM: ST M25P05/c (64 Kb)
Active pipelines: 8, GB_TILE_CONFIG = 0x00010017
GB_PIPE_SELECT = 0x00019940
CONFIG_DIE_FUSES = 0xFFF39FFF, 8 died pipeline(s)
CONFIG_SUBSTRATE_FUSES = 0xFFFFFE9D, 8 disabled pipeline(s)
CONFIG_ROM_FUSES = 0x00000022
CONFIG_REGISTER_FUSES = 0x00000000

Do I've something to do? or I better leave it alone? I think I haven't any kind of laser cut, but I've to assure it...


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