# When to upgrade from an E6600 based system?



## oldswab (Aug 27, 2010)

(edit, I'll upgrade my system tab on the left in a bit lol...been a while since I've posted here!)  Maybe a lot of you are in a similar boat? I've got a pretty nice system circa 3-ish years ago--

E6600 @~3.4ghz
2x2gb + 2x1 gb for 6gb of ddr2 @ ~950mhz
Asus P5E (x38 chipset)
hd4870 512mb
2x samsung 160gb (hd160hj) single-platter hd's
Thermalright si-128 cpu hsf
Antec trio 650w
Antec p180

So, I'm thinking about ebaying the processor, ram, gpu, and mobo while they are still worth something ($250 all together?) and moving onto either an AMD or Intel-based DDR3 system with a couple of SSD's and an hd 5870. Aside from swapping the hd's for solid states, though, I'm not really sure that dropping $1700-$1800 (after ebaying the old stuff) is going to get me much of an improvement over the trusty old C2D with six gigs of good-enough memory and my 4870.

I use my pc to crunch numbers (multiple DNA similarity alignments that run over the course of hours to days) and play stuff like LOTRO on a 23.6" 1080p monitor, although I'm thinking about getting back into the FPS thing.  LOTRO was my first MMO and while it's been an interesting ride, it's beginning feel like a second job when I log in, lol.

Also, how much longer do I trust my current PSU? I've had it now since 2007 and I'm a big fan of antec, but I was really hoping to JUST replace the guts this time, instead of rebuild from scratch... 

Something like (below) begs the question of whether I'm getting my money's worth?  Also, I'm married so I plan/budget to spend a couple of thousand every two-and-a-half-to-three years, but not much in the middle.  Therefore, I'm thinking about a system that will scream now for $2k and at least still yelp vigorously in 30 months.  The only spot I sense that I might be overpaying ridiculously might be doubling up on the SSD's, but I've almost always run with twin hd's for either RAID0 or putting the OS (or OSes) on one HD and the programs/media on another.

Anyway, cheers and thanks in advance for input and suggestions.  I DO have the itch to build again, but I may just mod my 4870 with an old hr03gt/chooped off stock cooler for vrms I have hanging around if it looks like my options are southward.


Intel Core i7-930 2.8GHz LGA 1366 130W Quad-Core Desktop Processor
Item #:N82E16819115225
Return Policy: CPU Replacement Only Return Policy
		$289.99

2x OCZ Gold 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Low Voltage Desktop Memory Model OCZ3G1333LV8GK
Item #:N82E16820227539
Return Policy: Memory Standard Return Policy
	-$25.00 Instant
$30.00 Mail-in Rebate Card
	$439.98
$389.98

ASUS Rampage III Gene Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
Item #:N82E16813131658
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
		$239.99

SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 5870 (Cypress XT) 100290SR Eyefinity 6 Edition Video Card
Item #:N82E16814102888
Return Policy: VGA Replacement Only Return Policy
	-$40.00 Instant
	$499.99
$459.99

OCZ Vertex 2 OCZSSD2-2VTX100G 2.5" MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD)
Item #:N82E16820227529
Return Policy: Limited Replacement Only Return Policy
	-$20.00 Instant
$30.00 Mail-in Rebate Card
	$699.98
$659.98
Grand Total:	$2,039.93


----------



## Dent1 (Aug 27, 2010)

> 2x OCZ Gold 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Low Voltage Desktop Memory Model OCZ3G1333LV8GK
> Item #:N82E16820227539
> Return Policy: Memory Standard Return Policy
> -$25.00 Instant
> ...




Not worth it..8GBs of ram DDR3 shouldnt cost more than $200-230




oldswab said:


> $239.99
> 
> SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 5870 (Cypress XT) 100290SR Eyefinity 6 Edition Video Card
> Item #:N82E16814102888
> ...



Not worth it, the 5870 should be priced @ $350-400


Overall the computer looks good, value for money is lost due to the high prices.


----------



## oldswab (Aug 28, 2010)

Dent1 said:


> Not worth it..8GBs of ram DDR3 shouldnt cost more than $200-230
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The ram is actually a double helping for that total price (16gb for $390, and the speed is a wee step (??) down from the 1600mhz stuff with a giant price delta imho).  I should have made the 2x a bit more prominent 

And yeah, definitely did I wonder whether 2gb in ram on a 5870 is going to be worth it for an extra hundred bucks.  I don't see myself ever having more than a single monitor, and 1080p is as high as things will get for a few years...?  Are there any advantages with 2gb versus 1gb on the horizon?

Ty for the response!


----------



## Dent1 (Aug 28, 2010)

No 2GBs is not worth the extra $100 for the 5870. Buy the cheapest one, if you are worried about noise buy aftermarket GPU cooler.

Edit, problem solved

G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB $175 or $348 for 16GBs worth! That is cheaper than your OCZ quote.


G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 ...


----------



## dhdude (Aug 28, 2010)

You should really be looking for a Triple Channel Memory Kit, rather than a dual channel one for that i7 930 man


----------



## oldswab (Aug 28, 2010)

Ah, there's a rebate on the ocz ram taking it down to $165.  The voltage looks better on the ripjaws though--they were out of stock the last time i was shopping (two days ago, lol!).

The geil's look like better ram, huh?


----------



## oldswab (Aug 28, 2010)

dhdude said:


> You should really be looking for a Triple Channel Memory Kit, rather than a dual channel one for that i7 930 man


3x4gb instead of 4x4?

sorry to be naive but it's been two years since i really, really followed the chipset/feature scene...


----------



## Widjaja (Aug 28, 2010)

Never ask when to upgrade here.
If you do not have the latest that is out there, it's always a good time to upgrade at TPU 

But yeah as was said before.....
If you are looking at getting an i7, may as well go for triple channel RAM.
If it's there on offer, go use it.
Triple channel offers more bandwidth than dual therefore better performance than 4x4GB dual channel RAM.

BTW my brother did the 4x4GB dual channel thing with his i7 and found he had better performance with 2x4GB.
Yes he's not very happy but eh...his money


----------



## oldswab (Aug 28, 2010)

Widjaja said:


> Never ask when to upgrade here.
> If you do not have the latest that is out there, it's always a good time to upgrade at TPU
> 
> But yeah as was said before.....
> ...



there are some ram drive utilities i was also considering using the expanded memory (around 4-6gb) for...  i'm not really looking to benchmark for the best bandwidth, but if it was a large difference between 3x4 in tri-channel and 4x4 in dual that would be interesting.  i'm guessing there are some stickies around that cover that topic?  i'll have to take a peek!  thanks!


----------



## [I.R.A]_FBi (Aug 28, 2010)

wait on sandybridge


----------



## mstenholm (Aug 28, 2010)

[I.R.A]_FBi said:


> wait on sandybridge



+1. That will stay with you (hopefully) the next five years and still have faster /more cores.


----------



## oldswab (Aug 30, 2010)

Ok, thanks all.  I guess I will tinker around with my current set up and upgrade in a few more months instead of right now, which is what I was itching to do.

Thanks for helping to guard my credit card for the (hopefully) best outcome!

(p.s., that's a joke.  don't ever finance kit on credit card.)


----------



## ShiBDiB (Aug 30, 2010)

eyefinity edition cards are for when u have an assload of high res screens... aside from that ur wasting money


----------



## hat (Aug 30, 2010)

I wouldn't do anything with your rig. Maybe upgrade the HDDs.


----------



## oldswab (Sep 13, 2010)

Updated:  what I ended up getting: 

1090T proc AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition Thuban 3.2GHz...
2 60gb ssd's OCZ Vertex 2 OCZSSD2-2VTXE60G 2.5" 60GB SATA II ML...
3x4gb 1333mhz G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 12GB (3 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3...
895fx chipset  ASUS Crosshair IV Formula AM3 AMD 890FX SATA 6Gb/s...
BR burner    LG  WH10LS30K 10X Blu-ray Burner - LightScribe Sup...

It came out to $1148, and I'll reuse my hd 4870, p180, and antec trio 650w psu.  I will RAMdrive some of the memory, so it really isn't that ridiculous, even if three sticks in a dual channel mobo is less than ideal.  The 4870 I will probably replace when the new 6870 (equivalent or whatever they call it) comes out and I can grab a 5870's after the price drop.  I just couldn't justify splashing out $350 for a new gpu.

My big question is using my si-128 in the am3 board.  Is the S-bracket enough to hold it in place securely/properly?  Should I look for a bolt-thru kit?  I haven't had any (noticeable) cantilever problems in my current setup, but I don't want to take chances.  My last amd proc was a thunderbird (1.2ghz!), so I'm way way out of the loop on the newer sockets, aside from cursing intel's socket design every time I did an upgrade lol.

edit:  I'm guessing I need to pick up one of these retention modules:
http://www.svc.com/am2rm-revb.html

edit 2:  or maybe the mobo will have a natively compatible rm as suggested here:
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article719-page3.html


----------



## Dent1 (Sep 13, 2010)

Nice rig, confused why you went 4GBX3, AMD doesnt support triple channel memory only dual channel. The motherboard is way overpriced, unless you're going crossfireX (4 video cards) its a waste, normal crossfire boards based on a equally high end 890GX chipset are around $90-110. 

I think you should check Ebay and find yourself a second 4870, should be able to grab one for cheap, like $80-100. 4870 in CF = 5850 for cheaper.


----------



## oldswab (Sep 13, 2010)

Dent1 said:


> Nice rig, confused why you went 4GBX3, AMD doesnt support triple channel memory only dual channel. The motherboard is way overpriced, unless you're going crossfireX (4 video cards) its a waste, normal crossfire boards based on a equally high end 890GX chipset are around $90-110.
> 
> I think you should check Ebay and find yourself a second 4870, should be able to grab one for cheap, like $80-100. 4870 in CF = 5850 for cheaper.



You're obviously spot on with the ram, and I realize it's less than ideal.  I'm going to grab another 4gb later--I ran into a budget wall for the time being at $1150 and another 4bg stick would have cost almost another hundred bucks.  If the performance really sucks (i don't think it will for practical applications, but will see) then I'll either return them for a 2x4 kit or just take a stick out until i find it's pair.

With the mobo, I've always been a little superstitious/religious (yeah, that's probably what it boils down to, lol) about getting something top end for the higher-end components (remember the leaky capacitors on THOUSANDS of lower end mobos back in 2002-ish?  I sure do...we had to replace 3/5 pc's in my old laboratory because of volcano capacitors.)  I've also read really great reviews over that board, and it was only 1/3 higher than the next step down.  I guess I'm also an unabashed fan of Asus mobo's because of the overall quality and features, and also the little things they do like push-button resets, the new dials (gimmicky?  maybe a little, we'll see), o/c fail safe mode on reboot, and even the standoff for case connectors.

Reckon I can run 2x4870s and overclocked 1090t with my psu?
Antec True Power Trio TP3-650 650W ATX12V SLI Cert...


----------



## Sasqui (Sep 13, 2010)

oldswab said:


> You're obviously spot on with the ram, and I realize it's less than ideal.  I'm going to grab another 4gb later--I ran into a budget wall for the time being at $1150 and another 4bg stick would have cost almost another hundred bucks.  If the performance really sucks (i don't think it will for practical applications, but will see) then I'll either return them for a 2x4 kit or just take a stick out until i find it's pair.
> 
> With the mobo, I've always been a little superstitious/religious (yeah, that's probably what it boils down to, lol) about getting something top end for the higher-end components (remember the leaky capacitors on THOUSANDS of lower end mobos back in 2002-ish?  I sure do...we had to replace 3/5 pc's in my old laboratory because of volcano capacitors.)  I've also read really great reviews over that board, and it was only 1/3 higher than the next step down.  I guess I'm also an unabashed fan of Asus mobo's because of the overall quality and features, and also the little things they do like push-button resets, the new dials (gimmicky?  maybe a little, we'll see), o/c fail safe mode on reboot, and even the standoff for case connectors.
> 
> ...



@ the PSU.  Don't try it.  I was pushing the envelope with one 4870 on a 580w Hiper that eventually went bad.  Playing games, the system was pullung near 500w.

Capacitor problem is gone as far as I know.  There was a junk manufacturer who stole the ingredients for eletrolye and made a bunch of shit that really rocked (screwed) the industry.  It's a non-issue, the vendors are quick to point out how great their capacitors are these days


----------



## Dent1 (Sep 13, 2010)

oldswab said:


> If the performance really sucks (i don't think it will for practical applications, but will see) then I'll either return them for a 2x4 kit or just take a stick out until i find it's pair.



I doubt that you'll notice a performance degration that will impact your performance, its like you said its just not ideal.



oldswab said:


> With the mobo, I've always been a little superstitious/religious (yeah, that's probably what it boils down to, lol) about getting something top end for the higher-end components (remember the leaky capacitors on THOUSANDS of lower end mobos back in 2002-ish?  I sure do...we had to replace 3/5 pc's in my old laboratory because of volcano capacitors.)  I've also read really great reviews over that board, and it was only 1/3 higher than the next step down.  I guess I'm also an unabashed fan of Asus mobo's because of the overall quality and features, and also the little things they do like push-button resets, the new dials (gimmicky?  maybe a little, we'll see), o/c fail safe mode on reboot, and even the standoff for case connectors..



I havent heard of any leaky capacitor issues with components as of late, 2002 was a long time ago. Asus do 890GX chipsets too, 890GX is still considered a high end chipset too but with a more realistic features and pricetag.



oldswab said:


> Reckon I can run 2x4870s and overclocked 1090t with my psu?
> Antec True Power Trio TP3-650 650W ATX12V SLI Cert...



Is there is a trick question, that PSU is more than enough to run CF or even a single high end GPU of your choice.

The Thermalright SI-128 is a tiny heatsink compared to the tower styles that are out now a plastic retention bracket should be fine, however if its got mounting to bolt in it I have a preference for using it as it means that I can transport the PC without worrying about it breaking when taking bumps. I would rather use the  S-curve than a plastic retention.



Sasqui said:


> on a 580w Hiper that eventually went bad.  Playing games, the system was pullung near 500w  Hiper that eventually went bad.  Playing games, the system was pullung near 500w.



Not true his Antec is more than up to the task. Hiper isnt exactly known for making PSUs of Antec's caliber. Two 4870s pull knowhere near 500W, sounds like your Hiper PSU was garbage or it was starting to fail anyways.


----------



## qu4k3r (Sep 13, 2010)

oldswab said:


> I can run 2x4870s and overclocked 1090t with my psu?
> Antec True Power Trio TP3-650 650W ATX12V SLI Cert...


I think, yes you could use it.







That psu has 52A@12V, it's good enough for that.
I've seen Antec EA-650 (45A@12V) handling 2x 4870's in CF with OC included.
But you must use pcie-molex adpaters for 2nd card.


----------



## Sasqui (Sep 13, 2010)

Dent1 said:


> Not true his Antec is more than up to the task. Hiper isnt exactly known for making PSUs of Antec's caliber. Two 4870s pull knowhere near 500W, sounds like your Hiper PSU was garbage or it was starting to fail anyways.



Perhaps... the thing was flakey for a while.  With two cards, it'd be pulling somewhere around 360w total.  Even with a beefy 12v rail, probably pushing it.


----------



## oldswab (Sep 13, 2010)

Dent1 said:


> Is there is a trick question, that PSU is more than enough to run CF or even a single high end CPU of your choice.
> 
> The Thermalright SI-128 is a tiny heatsink compared to the tower styles that are out now a plastic retention bracket should be fine, however if its got mounting to bolt in it I have a preference for using it as it means that I can transport the PC without worrying about it breaking when taking bumps.



Thanks again for your valued input.  The subsequent model, SI-128SE was a bolt-in variant by default but I can not find a definitely compatible bolt-thru kit for my SI-128 (I lucked out in keeping the S-bracket that works with a plastic AM2/AM3 retention module).  Shame, because I would really like to lock the thing down in the new build.  It is a great product that I pair with one of these http://www.svc.com/ca-f12ppwm.html (older version w/out pwm) to help cool the ram, vrms, and spread a little cold(er) air all over the mobo.  Wonderfully quiet, also.

I SUSPECT that there are compatible kits but since it has been phased out, thermalright just does not list compatibility with their "legacy" coolers, but I have emailed them asking specifically whether they offer a bolt-thru kit compatible with my trusty ol' top-down.


----------



## oldswab (Sep 14, 2010)

Ok, just a final follow up--Here's the response from thermalright in case anyone wants to know in the future.  Looks like the si-128 can be used with most of their bolt-thru kits, even if compatibility is not explicitly stated.  I just hope they give us some notice before they change their block dimensions!

Dear -----------

Thanks for your mail.
You can use the

AMD Socket AM2 / AM3 Bolt-Thru-Kit Rev.2

http://tinyurl.com/nnesg5

AXP-14-AM2 / AM2+ / AM3 Bolt-Thru-Kit

http://tinyurl.com/mzeks5

The first one is easily accessible and the second one can offer a easier installation.

You can see the fins of the SI-128 has block the application of screw drivers so if you use normal AM2 Bracket ( the first link), you will have to use the wrench to secure the screws.

For the second solution, although it’s made for AXP-140, it can be use on most of our coolers as well, you will need 4 extra screws so if you choose the second solution, please notify us so we can send you the screws.



GOOD NEWS!!
*Facebook launched for Thermalright! : http://tinyurl.com/dmpl22
please add us and support TR!! post your ideas or comment!!
you can now submit your own TR rigs video to us,
just provide us your youtube link, and we will post it up
on our website for you!! at www.thermalright.com
Also on:
*Twitter : http://twitter.com/thermalright
*Youtube : http://www.youtube.com/user/Thermalrightonutube


Best Regards,
Armand Cheng
Lea-Min Tech., Co., LTd.
(Thermalright, Taiwan)



Contact Message, From---------)




* Subject：

Bolt-thru for SI-128

* Topic：
support@thermalright.com


Hi,

I have an SI-128 (NOT se version) and I would like to use it with an Asus Crosshair IV socket AM3 motherboard. What bolt-thru kits and/or retention modules should I use? The SI-128 is such a great product, I really want to find a way to keep using it.

Thank you!


----------



## brandonwh64 (Sep 14, 2010)

Me personally, i would search the forums for a high clocking I7 920 used and then build around it. also like others have said, triple channel ram would be the key in an X58 although dual channel works as well


----------



## oldswab (Sep 14, 2010)

brandonwh64 said:


> Me personally, i would search the forums for a high clocking I7 920 used and then build around it. also like others have said, triple channel ram would be the key in an X58 although dual channel works as well


Appreciate it; I decided to go with a more budget-oriented build around a 1090t and keep my old gpu for a while longer.

Going to take some shots once everything is here and running 

Oh, and I also picked up a vrm cooler for my 4870 for $25, so hopefully I can safely install my hr-03gt and finally get rid of that jet airplane in my pc!


----------



## Millennium (Sep 14, 2010)

Let us know what you think of the AMD setup, I went intel but im not so sure that was a good idea now  Thanks


----------



## Widjaja (Sep 14, 2010)

Have fun installing the GPU cooler and make sure those heat sink stink to the chips.


----------



## oldswab (Sep 14, 2010)

What I'm really looking forward to is being able to set my pc up at home in the morning and have it crunching data while I'm at work, and ditto when I'm sleeping.  Anyone have any experience with running linux on a Win7 64 machine?  I've dabbled with ubuntu (dapper drake days) and DSL (damn small linux), but it's been a while.  Should I raid my current platter hd's and use them to boot into e:\Ubuntu, and use the SSD's separately for c:\windows and d:\programs ?  

This is the program I'll be specifically using when I'm not blowing up stuff in BF:BC2 

from 

http://www.agcol.arizona.edu/software/pave/V2/SystemGuide.html#overview

"PAVE is computationally intensive, so a fast machine with at least 1 GB of RAM is recommended (for larger assemblies, allow 5 KB per EST, or 5 GB for a 1M EST project). PAVE can run multiprocessor which is recommended for large assemblies. On a six-core, 2.4Ghz AMD Opteron platform, a 700k EST assembly requires ~16h, and a 1.5M EST assembly requires ~3 days. "

My new rig will (ballpark) run between three and five times as fast?  Maybe even speedier?


----------

