# Quality Question In Cooling Thermal Pads VS Thermal Paste



## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 18, 2020)

Question of day. 
I have seen some thermal pad online on eBay.  I have used paste in the past, but I've never used pads. Since I'm being prepared to replace my RX 570 radior fans and I'll have to reinstall the cooler once they are shipped to my house and install the thermal material on this GPU. What is different from thermal paste and pads.?  Are these pads are better in cooling efficiency then the thermal paste or they don't make different in quality in cooling. Thanks for your help and support.


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## JackCarver (Feb 19, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> What is different from thermal paste and pads.? Are these pads are better in cooling efficiency then the thermal paste or they don't make different in quality in cooling. Thanks for your help and support.








As you can apply thermal paste thinner on the cpu/gpu as thermal pads it's usually better. You can see above the thermal conductivity of Thermal Grizzly thermal paste vs their Minus Pads.


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## AsRock (Feb 19, 2020)

Use paste when ever possible which are typically non conductive, how ever there are some that are.


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## joemama (Feb 19, 2020)

Thermal pastes usually have higher thermal conductivity than thermal pads and can be applied much thinner, so the cooling efficiency would be much better


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## lexluthermiester (Feb 19, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Question of day.
> I have seen some thermal pad online on eBay.  I have used paste in the past, but I've never used pads. Since I'm being prepared to replace my RX 570 radior fans and I'll have to reinstall the cooler once they are shipped to my house and install the thermal material on this GPU. What is different from thermal paste and pads.?  Are these pads are better in cooling efficiency then the thermal paste or they don't make different in quality in cooling. Thanks for your help and support.


For a GPU, because there are so many points of contact, it's best to use a paste. The Carbonaut pads are excellent *for air cooling* CPU's because there is only one large surface to cover.


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## Valantar (Feb 19, 2020)

Needs clarification: "thermal pad" can describe two very different classes of product. The classic one is what is used on GPU VRAM and VRM components, the rather thick and spongy type. These are generally for low thermal load applications and have relatively poor conductivity, but are great for fitting heatsinks to oddly shaped objects or large areas due to their size and flexibility. The second type is thin carbon pads like the Carbonaut pads mentioned above, which mostly consist of a sheet of vertically oriented carbon nanotubes held by a binding agent. These are electrically conductive and thus can only be used on non-sensitive places like a CPU IHS - anywhere else and you'd risk shorting out stuff. They conform rather poorly to uneven surfaces too, so again, only really suitable for a CPU IHS (there are softer/more flexible and noncondictive variants like what AMD uses on their reference GPUs, but they are rare). Thermally these are much better than the thicker pads, comparable to a mid-range thermal paste. They also generally never wear out over time unlike thermal paste.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 19, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Question of day.
> I have seen some thermal pad online on eBay.  I have used paste in the past, but I've never used pads. Since I'm being prepared to replace my RX 570 radior fans and I'll have to reinstall the cooler once they are shipped to my house and install the thermal material on this GPU. What is different from thermal paste and pads.?  Are these pads are better in cooling efficiency then the thermal paste or they don't make different in quality in cooling. Thanks for your help and support.


Thanks. my GPU being reaching temperature at 192 F° or 89°C it seems to be too hot  for a GPU. One the fans has woble and sometimes it makes noice clacking sounds, but spends..



Valantar said:


> Needs clarification: "thermal pad" can describe two very different classes of product. The classic one is what is used on GPU VRAM and VRM components, the rather thick and spongy type. These are generally for low thermal load applications and have relatively poor conductivity, but are great for fitting heatsinks to oddly shaped objects or large areas due to their size and flexibility. The second type is thin carbon pads like the Carbonaut pads mentioned above, which mostly consist of a sheet of vertically oriented carbon nanotubes held by a binding agent. These are electrically conductive and thus can only be used on non-sensitive places like a CPU IHS - anywhere else and you'd risk shorting out stuff. They conform rather poorly to uneven surfaces too, so again, only really suitable for a CPU IHS (there are softer/more flexible and noncondictive variants like what AMD uses on their reference GPUs, but they are rare). Thermally these are much better than the thicker pads, comparable to a mid-range thermal paste. They also generally never wear out over time unlike thermal paste.


So how long should wait until applied paste or how long does it last until the paste need to be replaced again. It sounds like will paste will ware out in time. I have bought paste before posting this thread. It gold colored. does colors matter on paste as color coded? Or they different in material compounds.


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## FreedomEclipse (Feb 19, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Thanks. my GPU being reaching temperature at 192 F° or 89°C it seems to be too hot  for a GPU. One the fans has woble and sometimes it makes noice clacking sounds, but spends..
> 
> 
> So how long should wait until applied paste or how long does it last until the paste need to be replaced again. It sounds like will paste will ware out in time. I have bought paste before posting this thread. It gold colored. does colors matter on paste as color coded? Or they different in material compounds. View attachment 145320



Dont waste your money on this. Go look for some GD900


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## Valantar (Feb 19, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Thanks. my GPU being reaching temperature at 192 F° or 89°C it seems to be too hot  for a GPU. One the fans has woble and sometimes it makes noice clacking sounds, but spends..
> 
> 
> So how long should wait until applied paste or how long does it last until the paste need to be replaced again. It sounds like will paste will ware out in time. I have bought paste before posting this thread. It gold colored. does colors matter on paste as color coded? Or they different in material compounds. View attachment 145320


Bargain thermal paste off Ebay or wherever that is should generally be avoided. It will work, but it won't be good, and I wouldn't trust it to last. 

Stock thermal pastes like what Intel uses beneath their IHSes tend to be dry and clay-like, but have amazing shelf life and never truly dry out (even if it might look like they do). They normally have rather poor thermal conductivity for a paste though. Retail pastes tend to be much wetter, perform better, but also often dry out over time and lose performance. I'd repaste after 2-3 years or so if it was important (though my HTPC hasn't been touched for much longer than that and is fine, but it never gets pushed very hard either). And I would only ever buy thermal paste that I've seen do well in a review. Lots of brand-name stuff is nearly as bad as cheapo Ebay stuff.


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## biffzinker (Feb 19, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Thanks. my GPU being reaching temperature at 192 F° or 89°C it seems to be too hot  for a GPU. One the fans has woble and sometimes it makes noice clacking sounds, but spends..
> 
> 
> So how long should wait until applied paste or how long does it last until the paste need to be replaced again. It sounds like will paste will ware out in time. I have bought paste before posting this thread. It gold colored. does colors matter on paste as color coded? Or they different in material compounds. View attachment 145320


That paste has poor thermal conductivity 3.05 W/(mK)

Get a tube of Arctic's MX-4 paste. It has a thermal conductivity of 8.5 W/(mK)








						MX-4 | Highest Performance Thermal Compound | ARCTIC
					

The award-winning ARCTIC MX-4 thermal compound guarantees an extremely high thermal conductivity and is very easy to use with an ideal consistency.




					www.arctic.ac


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 19, 2020)

Valantar said:


> Bargain thermal paste off Ebay or wherever that is should generally be avoided. It will work, but it won't be good, and I wouldn't trust it to last.
> 
> Stock thermal pastes like what Intel uses beneath their IHSes tend to be dry and clay-like, but have amazing shelf life and never truly dry out (even if it might look like they do). They normally have rather poor thermal conductivity for a paste though. Retail pastes tend to be much wetter, perform better, but also often dry out over time and lose performance. I'd repaste after 2-3 years or so if it was important (though my HTPC hasn't been touched for much longer than that and is fine, but it never gets pushed very hard either). And I would only ever buy thermal paste that I've seen do well in a review. Lots of brand-name stuff is nearly as bad as cheapo Ebay stuff.


Thanks. What brand do you use? I have gotten some from another member of this site says there 3 types? Im little bit confused about this.



biffzinker said:


> That paste has poor thermal conductivity 3.05 W/(mK)
> 
> Get a tube of Arctic's MX-4 paste. It has a thermal conductivity of 8.5 W/(mK)
> 
> ...


Ok that I have get. I'll check it out now.

Someone just sent me this one from Attic 








						MX-4 | Highest Performance Thermal Compound | ARCTIC
					

The award-winning ARCTIC MX-4 thermal compound guarantees an extremely high thermal conductivity and is very easy to use with an ideal consistency.




					www.arctic.ac


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## eidairaman1 (Feb 20, 2020)

Yes get arctic mx 4.


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## lexluthermiester (Feb 20, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Someone just sent me this one from Attic
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, get a tube of that. Best value for money, IMHO. Great stuff.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 21, 2020)

I have installed the fans, the paste but a different brand from previous building operation from aLast year. Im getting temperature at 86-87 ° degrees Celsius while under heavy load. Its alittle better than 89-90. But I'm still not completely sure or satisfied with this cooling process. I expected better cooling system then before at least 60 to 70 Celsius degrees. I don't know if this the thermal paste or is just normal this way. Fans are blowing full blast at 3140 RPMs with afterburn software on
Paste Brand is Hainzius part# HY710. Thermal continuity 3.17w/m+k
Thermal resistance 0.067 c-in/W ?
Is very small printing on the tube.

I know I'm still going to get the Arctic brand this weekend I just wanted to test the fans what do y'all think about the cooling situation I clean the radiator was warm water with soap dried it with a 300 watt blow hot air gun. Take a look at the motherboard are the GPU and it was really really really dirty so I cleaned it with cotton swab and precision paint brush put the thermal paste put it all together installed it onto the PC and that's all I did today. Any idea thank you


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## lexluthermiester (Feb 21, 2020)

No matter how good a TIM is, a 20C difference is expecting a bit much. You got about what you can reasonably expect. So if you want to improve your temps further, getting an improved cooling solution should be your next goal.


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## xtreemchaos (Feb 21, 2020)

+1 for GD900, beats mx4 by a good bit and you get 30g for about £5.


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## biffzinker (Feb 21, 2020)

xtreemchaos said:


> +1 for GD900, beats mx4 by a good bit and you get 30g for about £5.


The GD900 has a thermal conductivity: 4.8 W/M-K compared to MX-4 with 8.5 W/(mK) 

Higher is better


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## xtreemchaos (Feb 21, 2020)

ive tried both and in my view gd900 is better, give it a try bro I get much better temps from it, the proofs in the pudding mate   .


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## Valantar (Feb 21, 2020)

biffzinker said:


> The GD900 has a thermal conductivity: 4.8 W/M-K compared to MX-4 with 8.5 W/(mK)
> 
> Higher is better


Manufacturers measure thermal conductivity in different ways (there is no standard for this) so numbers between brands are generally not directly comparable.


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## xtreemchaos (Feb 21, 2020)

yes this thermal conductivity numbers are very shadey after all we only have to take there word for it, me I go for what gives me the best temps with the best overclock. Bri from tech yes put me onto GD900 and ive never looked back been using it for 3 years, sod with paying over the top for small tubes with fancy names. if you havnt tried I dare you too


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## lexluthermiester (Feb 21, 2020)

biffzinker said:


> The GD900 has a thermal conductivity: 4.8 W/M-K compared to MX-4 with 8.5 W/(mK)
> 
> Higher is better





xtreemchaos said:


> ive tried both and in my view gd900 is better, give it a try bro I get much better temps from it, the proofs in the pudding mate   .


A difference of 1 or 2 degrees C will not make a big impact in the OP's usage model. The TIM is fine. The OP needs a better cooling solution if his goal is to get down to the 60 to 70 C range.


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## Valantar (Feb 21, 2020)

@PatrioTFreedom45 What case is your GPU installed in? What exact model is the GPU? Do you have plenty of fans bringing in cool air from outside the case and blowing it towards the GPU? What are your ambient temperatures like? What are your CPU temperatures like? 60-70C for a GPU is rather rare unless it has a very beefy cooler, even for a relatively low power one like the RX 570. What are youf fan speeds? 81-82C like in your pic is perfectly fine.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 21, 2020)

It manufacturer brand DYI Model Diamond F-1 gaming series with side tamper glass panel from Newegg for 55$. 4 case fan slots. 3 in the front and one in the back as a exhaust Factory made it. The the front fans I purchase them from another seller. Brand Vetro 1200 +10 % Max RPM about 8$ a piece. I know I have a crappy made PSU Cooler Master RS-500-PCAR which it 70% efficiency 140mm fan. A bad buy. I hope to get another one soon like thermalake or seasonic this weekend. 

The GPU fans I have just received and replaced them last night. They max out in RPM 3140 and still have 80s°c and up. Max monitor reading was 87°C. Which I'm not to happy about it, after all the work done on GPU. Which it still flashing and flickering GPU while gaming. Probably because of the PSU lacking power and the over heating up GPU at same time. 

Note I have taken off the case tamper glass and side pan
els and still getting GPU temperature at 80s and up degrees Celsius. 
Im assuming I'll just take everything out PSU and repasted the GPU with artic mx-4 to see what if the temperature going to be better. 

It manufacturer brand DYI Model Diamond F-1 from Newegg for 55$. 4 case fan slots. 3 in the front and one in the back as a exhaust Factory made it. The the front fans I purchase them from another seller. Brand Vetro 1200 +10 % Max RPM about 8$ a piece. I know I have a crappy made PSU Cooler Master RS-500-PCAR which it 70% efficiency 140mm fan. A bad buy. I hope to get another one soon like thermalake or seasonic this weekend. 

The GPU fans I have just received and replaced them last night. They max out in RPM 3140 and still have 80s°c and up. Max monitor reading was 87°C. Which I'm not to happy about it, after all the work done on GPU. Which it still flashing and flickering GPU while gaming. Probably because of the PSU lacking power and the over heating up GPU at same time. 

Note I have taken off the case tamper glass and side pan
els and still getting GPU temperature at 80s and up degrees Celsius. 
Im assuming I'll just take everything out PSU and repasted the GPU with artic mx-4 to see what if the temperature going to be better.


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## Valantar (Feb 21, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> It manufacturer brand DYI Model Diamond F-1 from Newegg for 55$. 4 case fan slots. 3 in the front and one in the back as a exhaust Factory made it. The the front fans I purchase them from ano


Judging by the pictures that case will have absolutely terrible airflow. Are there any vents along the front at all? From what I can see (the pics are very dark/overly high contrast/low dynamic range) there is a solid front panel (with a groove down the middle which looks to just be decorative), no side vents along the front panel. Is there any front ventilation at all? If not, front fans will do nothing for you whatsoever. Where are they taking in air from? In that situation it really isn't any wonder if your GPU is running hotter than expected. All the front fans will be doing is then just crating some turbulence inside the case (not enough air/too much restriction to create actual flow in any meaningful way), with the rear exhaust creating negative pressure ensuring that some cool air gets in through various cracks and openings around the case. The GPU is then likely getting some cool air from the PCIe slot covers, though that isn't much.

Try taking the front panel off the case, if you have front fans in there temps are likely to drop significantly.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 21, 2020)

Valantar said:


> Judging by the pictures that case will have absolutely terrible airflow. Are there any vents along the front at all? From what I can see (the pics are very dark/overly high contrast/low dynamic range) there is a solid front panel (with a groove down the middle which looks to just be decorative), no side vents along the front panel. Is there any front ventilation at all? If not, front fans will do nothing for you whatsoever. Where are they taking in air from? In that situation it really isn't any wonder if your GPU is running hotter than expected. All the front fans will be doing is then just crating some turbulence inside the case (not enough air/too much restriction to create actual flow in any meaningful way), with the rear exhaust creating negative pressure ensuring that some cool air gets in through various cracks and openings around the case. The GPU is then likely getting some cool air from the PCIe slot covers, though that isn't much.
> 
> Try taking the front panel off the case, if you have front fans in there temps are likely to drop significantly.



I have put back the panels on to see system temperature.
It's designed the air flow is coming from the very bottom opening from front panel and the the three carries the to the top. System temperature are in 39° degrees Celsius with all panels on it. The PSU fan is pointing from the bottom upside down as the case designed it. Airflow from the bottom to the top case. I'll send you a link of case spec maybe it will help.

They sold out on Newegg. Here a Link









						DIYPC Diamond-F1 Black USB3.0 Steel/ Tempered Glass ATX Mid Tower Gaming Computer Case w/Tempered Glass Side Panel, 1 x Blue LED Ring Fan x Rear (Pre-Installed) - Newegg.com
					

Buy DIYPC Diamond-F1 Black USB3.0 Steel/ Tempered Glass ATX Mid Tower Gaming Computer Case w/Tempered Glass Side Panel, 1 x Blue LED Ring Fan x Rear (Pre-Installed) with fast shipping and top-rated customer service. Once you know, you Newegg!




					www.newegg.com
				






lexluthermiester said:


> A difference of 1 or 2 degrees C will not make a big impact in the OP's usage model. The TIM is fine. The OP needs a better cooling solution if his goal is to get down to the 60 to 70 C range.


Ok is there any I can do with GPU cooling XFX AMD RX 570. I wonder if there a better cooler or upgraded one to fit on to the XFX AMD RX 570. Will a Gigabyte Rx or Power Color 3 fan cooler will fit. ? Thanks

98.6 ° degrees Fahrenheit system temperature with all the panels on .. using genuine gigabyte motherboard software that came with motherboard . Case airflow comes from the bottom to the top with 3 led Vetoo fans. There is an big opening in the bottom front panel allows air to flow to the top and middle of the case. The bottom White led fan is acting like a vacuum , which vacuum air from the bottom opening and allow another fans to collect air to the pc. 1200 x 3 RPM . They blow pretty well for 8$ dollar fans.
Note the white bottom fan and back exhausted fan is control by the motherboard by gigabyte software driver. Which self controled by motherboard. The rest is connected to directly to PSU 12v + Molex 4 Pin connectors. I even disconnected all the led stripes to maybe help the PSU have better efficiency in power and and less heating up with LED lights off. The white fan and the back ring blue LED Fan are connected to motherboard 5 volts power supply according to gigabyte motherboard specs.


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## Valantar (Feb 21, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> It's designed the air flow is coming from the very bottom opening from front panel and the the three carries the to the top. System temperature are in 39° degrees Celsius with all panels on it. The PSU fan is pointing from the bottom upside down as the case designed it. Airflow from the bottom to the top case. I'll send you a link of case spec maybe it will help.
> 
> They sold out on Newegg. Here a Link
> 
> ...


That is certainly not a _big_ opening, in fact I would call it _tiny_. It is, what, 1/5 the area of a 120mm fan? Ideally the fan would have its entire working area unobstructed. Also the air is coming in at a 90-degree angle, which means the fan will lose about half its pressure, which is desperately needed to pull air in through such a small opening. Also, it will only provide air to the bottom-most fan - air moves along the path of least resistance, and no air is going to move _across_ the spinning bottom fan to get to the two above. Besides, your bottom fan is mostly blowing into the PSU shroud anyhow, so it's likely not helping temperatures much.

Also, the link you put in there is the exact same one from my post where I talked about looking at pictures of the case. Just FYI. Google works for everyone.

As I said, that case design is choking your fans and heating up your hardware. Your top two fans are doing nothing useful, and even the bottom one won't help much given the size of that opening. Case temps of 39C are ... quite bad unless you are running your fans very, very slow. And it looks like that is at idle, judging by your CPU frequency? Unless your room ambient temperature is above 30C I would call that very bad. Seriously: try removing your front case panel and see how temperatures change. I would recommend letting the PC idle for 10 minutes first, recording temps, running a heavy benchmark for 10-15 minutes and recording temps, then removing the panel while letting the PC cool down and then re-running both tests. I would guess you'd get dramatic drops in idle case temps and all component temps under load. Given that I haven't seen the case or used it myself I might be wrong, but going by the pictures that is a classic looks-focused design that completely ignores airflow and therefore has terrible thermals. For a cheap case with tempered glass that is pretty much expected. You get what you pay for (well, there are bad expensive cases too, but more good ones in higher price ranges). But even the most basic logic tells us that a fan that faces nothing but the back of a solid sheet of plastic will do nothing, and it looks like the source of your thermal problem is choosing a case with a very poor cooling design.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 21, 2020)

Valantar said:


> That is certainly not a _big_ opening, in fact I would call it _tiny_. It is, what, 1/5 the area of a 120mm fan? Ideally the fan would have its entire working area unobstructed. Also the air is coming in at a 90-degree angle, which means the fan will lose about half its pressure, which is desperately needed to pull air in through such a small opening. Also, it will only provide air to the bottom-most fan - air moves along the path of least resistance, and no air is going to move _across_ the spinning bottom fan to get to the two above. Besides, your bottom fan is mostly blowing into the PSU shroud anyhow, so it's likely not helping temperatures much.
> 
> Also, the link you put in there is the exact same one from my post where I talked about looking at pictures of the case. Just FYI. Google works for everyone.
> 
> As I said, that case design is choking your fans and heating up your hardware. Your top two fans are doing nothing useful, and even the bottom one won't help much given the size of that opening. Case temps of 39C are ... quite bad unless you are running your fans very, very slow. And it looks like that is at idle, judging by your CPU frequency? Unless your room ambient temperature is above 30C I would call that very bad. Seriously: try removing your front case panel and see how temperatures change. I would recommend letting the PC idle for 10 minutes first, recording temps, running a heavy benchmark for 10-15 minutes and recording temps, then removing the panel while letting the PC cool down and then re-running both tests. I would guess you'd get dramatic drops in idle case temps and all component temps under load. Given that I haven't seen the case or used it myself I might be wrong, but going by the pictures that is a classic looks-focused design that completely ignores airflow and therefore has terrible thermals. For a cheap case with tempered glass that is pretty much expected. You get what you pay for (well, there are bad expensive cases too, but more good ones in higher price ranges). But even the most basic logic tells us that a fan that faces nothing but the back of a solid sheet of plastic will do nothing, and it looks like the source of your thermal problem is choosing a case with a very poor cooling design.


You think I should maybe drill tiny holes neat way in the front panel on the pc where the fans are to help the airflow Since case is out of warranty now and all the important things are attached to it like power switch, USB ports and rest button. I thought about fabricating up top of case and install more fans like you could put  CPU radiator cooler back then.

Well I guess I still have a lot more work to then I expected. I'll probably either get another PC case or fabricated for cooling better Cooling.

Well after 4 hours hard work Im still haven't had good results in GPU cooling after fabricating a case. I even clean up all the dust off of every part. Someone said the PC case was a problem with the cooling off hardware. Well I did take drill some nice holes in the front of PC nicely done which it wasn't easy. Modification on bottom case for the PSU which some cases wmare made that way. Drilling and more drilling. Finally I've gotten done put it together again. I configurated the front fans, two are blowing cool air in and one is blowing hot air out. Then the back Fan stay the same. I still getting hot in the XFX AMD RX 570 as usual. I really have one or three ideas left. One idea is get brand name thermal paste like artic or something else that is help my RX cooler. Everything checks out well far as the PC system but not sure about FX 4300 CPU temperature are 80+ I know it's 95 Watts but I don't remember it being passed 76 degrees Celsius. Option 2 is to buy a PCI blowers for in the back. To exhausted the heat out of PC chassis. This PC never have gotten hot until I purchase this dumb XFX AMD RX which I believe it's making my PC over heat or just plain hot. One hardware making everything else hot inside. 
Option 3# buy whole another PC case which is my last option that I don't like, but must have to or get those fan replacement might help. . Picture of the day. Enjoy.


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## Valantar (Feb 22, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> You think I should maybe drill tiny holes neat way in the front panel on the pc where the fans are to help the airflow Since case is out of warranty now and all the important things are attached to it like power switch, USB ports and rest button. I thought about fabricating up top of case and install more fans like you could put  CPU radiator cooler back then.
> 
> Well I guess I still have a lot more work to then I expected. I'll probably either get another PC case or fabricated for cooling better Cooling.
> 
> ...


Wow, you actually took a drill to your case without doing any additional testing first? That's... ambitious. Did you try temperature testing with and without the front panel as I asked? You really ought to be doing things step by step if you want this to work out.

Beyond that, sadly even with your drilled holes there's going to be very little airflow there - an eyeball guesstimate says there's something like 10-20x more solid panel than hole there. For proper airflow you would need to enlarge the holes dramatically - as big as possible without mangling the case entirely. Or you could make some square cutouts with a saw or rotary tool and fill them with some pvc mesh if you want to keep dust out. 

But before you do anything more, please do the thermal tests with and without the front panel on. Keep all your front fans as intakes, having them in different directions just messes with airflow and causes turbulence. Don't want them fighting each other.

I would also try removing the fine mesh filters on the front fans - there ought to be so little airflow there dust won't be a problem anyhow, and fine mesh like that restricts airflow quite a bit.


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## eidairaman1 (Feb 22, 2020)

Valantar said:


> Wow, you actually took a drill to your case without doing any additional testing first? That's... ambitious. Did you try temperature testing with and without the front panel as I asked? You really ought to be doing things step by step if you want this to work out.
> 
> Beyond that, sadly even with your drilled holes there's going to be very little airflow there - an eyeball guesstimate says there's something like 10-20x more solid panel than hole there. For proper airflow you would need to enlarge the holes dramatically - as big as possible without mangling the case entirely. Or you could make some square cutouts with a saw or rotary tool and fill them with some pvc mesh if you want to keep dust out.
> 
> ...



See here https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...gaming-wobble-fan-repair.263915/#post-4210992


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 22, 2020)

Valantar said:


> Wow, you actually took a drill to your case without doing any additional testing first? That's... ambitious. Did you try temperature testing with and without the front panel as I asked? You really ought to be doing things step by step if you want this to work out.
> 
> Beyond that, sadly even with your drilled holes there's going to be very little airflow there - an eyeball guesstimate says there's something like 10-20x more solid panel than hole there. For proper airflow you would need to enlarge the holes dramatically - as big as possible without mangling the case entirely. Or you could make some square cutouts with a saw or rotary tool and fill them with some pvc mesh if you want to keep dust out.
> 
> ...


I did test without front panel and nothing good. Same old version. Yes I drilled holes into a 6 month old case. Believe me I don't like it either. Its probably  trash after that. End the day this PC just all junk with no hope in cooling off bad heat. Now I have no  trust in any future opportunities of buying pc cases.  I'm surprised it even stays running and turns on fast nicely. It's funny that I'm starting have heat problems since I've bought the XFX AMD RX 570 40 days ago. I use to have the GTX Nidvia 1050ti before this one but I found out it's a rip-off brand kind, then crappy PSU Cooler Master Brand still installed, two bad hard drives. Now my GPU and PC case won't stay cool. Wow Alot of Bad luck with this build. 

But I will try again when I get home to take the filter mesh and then try the thermal test again , and you the information results with pictures. The GPU is causing the heating up the computers hardware making everything hot including the CPU. 
But anyway thanks for your help and support. I will give you a update.


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## Valantar (Feb 22, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> I did test without front panel and nothing good. Same old version. Yes I drilled holes into a 6 month old case. Believe me I don't like it either. Its probably  trash after that. End the day this PC just all junk with no hope in cooling off bad heat. Now I have no  trust in any future opportunities of buying pc cases.  I'm surprised it even stays running and turns on fast nicely. It's funny that I'm starting have heat problems since I've bought the XFX AMD RX 570 40 days ago. I use to have the GTX Nidvia 1050ti before this one but I found out it's a rip-off brand kind, then crappy PSU Cooler Master Brand still installed, two bad hard drives. Now my GPU and PC case won't stay cool. Wow Alot of Bad luck with this build.
> 
> But I will try again when I get home to take the filter mesh and then try the thermal test again , and you the information results with pictures. The GPU is causing the heating up the computers hardware making everything hot including the CPU.
> But anyway thanks for your help and support. I will give you a update.


It is very strange if there is no difference in thermals when removing the front panel - that normally helps even on well ventilated cases. Also, an RX 570 shouldn't be difficult to cool in an ATX case - I have one (Sapphire RX 570 ITX) stuffed into a tiny modded Dell Optiplex 990 SFF, and it never hits 80°C. It is of course possible that your GPU has a poorly designed cooler, but even then an RX 570 shouldn't be a very hot running GPU.

Pics of test results would be nice, thanks. Preferably use HWInfo64 for monitoring so that we can see all relevant temperatures and clock speeds. And remember to let the stress test run for a while before recording temps, ideally until they stabilize.


Going off the other thread, did you replace your PSU?


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## xtreemchaos (Feb 22, 2020)

Sapphire RX 570s 80s have about the best cooling package out the line up I have both cards and the max temps never go over 75c no matter what I run. + 1 for stressing and HWInfo64 so it can give the over all pic.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 23, 2020)

xtreemchaos said:


> Sapphire RX 570s 80s have about the best cooling package out the line up I have both cards and the max temps never go over 75c no matter what I run. + 1 for stressing and HWInfo64 so it can give the over all pic.


Hello and thank you for your help. I was suggested that I to take the front panel off where the front fans can get more airflow and take off the fiber filter mesh. So did I have some cooling improvements on the other hardware expect the XFX AMD Rx. I wonder if it Overclock GPU. Yes I bought it used but it works ok except gaming by HD 
Video works really well with out heating issues and it doesn't go over 70°degress Celsius while playing movies. The Cooler ones in the data are before starting the OCCT software testing and after the test. I also taped up the front where holes the are empty from the factory manufacture has made. It looks like we finally getting somewhere, the hard drives are more cooler than before the Toshiba Sata drive was at 56° c and WDC HDD was at 49°, CPU is at 50° c before it was at 81, system hardware was at 67 now 37° c compared to yesterday test it approvement just if get the GPU around steady 70 I happy with that.  There also picture of today testing and some yesterday test in full 











Valantar said:


> That is certainly not a _big_ opening, in fact I would call it _tiny_. It is, what, 1/5 the area of a 120mm fan? Ideally the fan would have its entire working area unobstructed. Also the air is coming in at a 90-degree angle, which means the fan will lose about half its pressure, which is desperately needed to pull air in through such a small opening. Also, it will only provide air to the bottom-most fan - air moves along the path of least resistance, and no air is going to move _across_ the spinning bottom fan to get to the two above. Besides, your bottom fan is mostly blowing into the PSU shroud anyhow, so it's likely not helping temperatures much.
> 
> Also, the link you put in there is the exact same one from my post where I talked about looking at pictures of the case. Just FYI. Google works for everyone.
> 
> As I said, that case design is choking your fans and heating up your hardware. Your top two fans are doing nothing useful, and even the bottom one won't help much given the size of that opening. Case temps of 39C are ... quite bad unless you are running your fans very, very slow. And it looks like that is at idle, judging by your CPU frequency? Unless your room ambient temperature is above 30C I would call that very bad. Seriously: try removing your front case panel and see how temperatures change. I would recommend letting the PC idle for 10 minutes first, recording temps, running a heavy benchmark for 10-15 minutes and recording temps, then removing the panel while letting the PC cool down and then re-running both tests. I would guess you'd get dramatic drops in idle case temps and all component temps under load. Given that I haven't seen the case or used it myself I might be wrong, but going by the pictures that is a classic looks-focused design that completely ignores airflow and therefore has terrible thermals. For a cheap case with tempered glass that is pretty much expected. You get what you pay for (well, there are bad expensive cases too, but more good ones in higher price ranges). But even the most basic logic tells us that a fan that faces nothing but the back of a solid sheet of plastic will do nothing, and it looks like the source of your thermal problem is choosing a case with a very poor cooling design.



I did some more work on this PC as more testing and you are right about the air flow. 

So did I have some cooling improvements on the other hardware expect the XFX AMD Rx. I wonder if it Overclock GPU. Yes I bought it used but it works ok except gaming by HD 
Video works really well with out heating issues and it doesn't go over 70°degress Celsius while playing movies. The Cooler ones in the data are before starting the OCCT software testing and after the test. I also taped up the front where holes the are empty from the factory manufacture has made. It looks like we finally getting somewhere, the hard drives are more cooler than before the Toshiba Sata drive was at 56° c and WDC HDD was at 49°, CPU is at 50° c before it was at 81, system hardware was at 67 now 37° c compared to yesterday test it approvement just if get the GPU around steady 70 I happy with that.  There also picture of today testing. Hope you are pleased as well. I believe we are getting somewhere with this PC case



Valantar said:


> It is very strange if there is no difference in thermals when removing the front panel - that normally helps even on well ventilated cases. Also, an RX 570 shouldn't be difficult to cool in an ATX case - I have one (Sapphire RX 570 ITX) stuffed into a tiny modded Dell Optiplex 990 SFF, and it never hits 80°C. It is of course possible that your GPU has a poorly designed cooler, but even then an RX 570 shouldn't be a very hot running GPU.
> 
> Pics of test results would be nice, thanks. Preferably use HWInfo64 for monitoring so that we can see all relevant temperatures and clock speeds. And remember to let the stress test run for a while before recording temps, ideally until they stabilize.
> 
> ...





Valantar said:


> It is very strange if there is no difference in thermals when removing the front panel - that normally helps even on well ventilated cases. Also, an RX 570 shouldn't be difficult to cool in an ATX case - I have one (Sapphire RX 570 ITX) stuffed into a tiny modded Dell Optiplex 990 SFF, and it never hits 80°C. It is of course possible that your GPU has a poorly designed cooler, but even then an RX 570 shouldi tan't be a very hot running GPU.
> 
> Pics of test results would be nice, thanks. Preferably use HWInfo64 for monitoring so that we can see all relevant temperatures and clock speeds. And remember to let the stress test run for a while before recording temps, ideally until they stabilize.
> 
> ...


I took off the mesh it helped with cooling the case plus I reconfigure the fan direction. Sorry for other post my phone Browser is messing up so making me posted more than once.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 24, 2020)

biffzinker said:


> That paste has poor thermal conductivity 3.05 W/(mK)
> 
> Get a tube of Arctic's MX-4 paste. It has a thermal conductivity of 8.5 W/(mK)
> 
> ...


I've purchased this product from eBay last night. I can't wait to see in my mailbox. Artic mx-4 paste brand.



xtreemchaos said:


> Sapphire RX 570s 80s have about the best cooling package out the line up I have both cards and the max temps never go over 75c no matter what I run. + 1 for stressing and HWInfo64 so it can give the over all pic.


I have took off the front panel and 4° degrees Celsius less. I have bought a new tube of artic mx-4 paste and looking for PCI blowers


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## lexluthermiester (Feb 25, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> I've purchased this product from eBay last night. I can't wait to see in my mailbox. Artic mx-4 paste brand.


That is a solid choice. It will last you a long time.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 25, 2020)

Best PC Cooling Thermal solution for GPU/ PCI blowers
					

Hi again. I posted thermal paste for GPU and a cooling issues with PC case. In the results of PC case after taking off the front panel where highly helps with system and hardware but not my GPU. I was reading on Google search to maybe find the best thing to making my PC much, much more cooler...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




New question about thermal cooling off with PCI blowers. 







lexluthermiester said:


> That is a solid choice. It will last you a long time.











						Best PC Cooling Thermal solution for GPU/ PCI blowers
					

Hi again. I posted thermal paste for GPU and a cooling issues with PC case. In the results of PC case after taking off the front panel where highly helps with system and hardware but not my GPU. I was reading on Google search to maybe find the best thing to making my PC much, much more cooler...




					www.techpowerup.com
				






Valantar said:


> It is very strange if there is no difference in thermals when removing the front panel - that normally helps even on well ventilated cases. Also, an RX 570 shouldn't be difficult to cool in an ATX case - I have one (Sapphire RX 570 ITX) stuffed into a tiny modded Dell Optiplex 990 SFF, and it never hits 80°C. It is of course possible that your GPU has a poorly designed cooler, but even then an RX 570 shouldn't be a very hot running GPU.
> 
> Pics of test results would be nice, thanks. Preferably use HWInfo64 for monitoring so that we can see all relevant temperatures and clock speeds. And remember to let the stress test run for a while before recording temps, ideally until they stabilize.
> 
> ...


No not yet but I'm saving money first alittle short for now until this weekend



Valantar said:


> Wow, you actually took a drill to your case without doing any additional testing first? That's... ambitious. Did you try temperature testing with and without the front panel as I asked? You really ought to be doing things step by step if you want this to work out.
> 
> Beyond that, sadly even with your drilled holes there's going to be very little airflow there - an eyeball guesstimate says there's something like 10-20x more solid panel than hole there. For proper airflow you would need to enlarge the holes dramatically - as big as possible without mangling the case entirely. Or you could make some square cutouts with a saw or rotary tool and fill them with some pvc mesh if you want to keep dust out.
> 
> ...


Thanks you it works great for PC case do you know where I can get new front moded panel for better airflow. Thanks


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## Schmuckley (Feb 25, 2020)

Idk, MX-4 is better than Ceramique 2 and almost (1-3c) as good as Gelid.
I got a big whompa-bomba tube of it.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 27, 2020)

Update on the compound thermal paste artic mx-4 paste. I have finally gotten it in the mail. Now all have to do is to install it on my GPUs  Chip. Any suggestions on how thin or the thickness that I have to apply this great stuff. 
Thanks


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## biffzinker (Feb 27, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Any suggestions on how thin or the thickness that I have to apply this great stuff.


You want it to be as thin possible. Two sheets of paper in thinness. The thermal pastes purpose is to push the air out.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 27, 2020)

biffzinker said:


> You want it to be as thin possible. Two sheets of paper in thinness. The thermal pastes purpose is to push the air out.


Thanks for your help..


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## Valantar (Feb 27, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Update on the compound thermal paste artic mx-4 paste. I have finally gotten it in the mail. Now all have to do is to install it on my GPUs  Chip. Any suggestions on how thin or the thickness that I have to apply this great stuff.
> ThanksView attachment 146130


It's not conductive, and the cooler should squeeze out any excess, so don't be afraid to put a decent amount on there. Unless the paste is extremely viscous the mounting pressure from the cooler will ensure proper thickness. Full coverage is the most important for a GPU (if any part of the die is left without paste it can overheat and break), so either spread it by hand (use a thin, flat piece of plastic as a spreader) or put an X across the die with some dots in between the lines. Don't go crazy with the amount (you'll just end up with a mess around the die), but don't use too little either. It's always a good idea to paste, mount the cooler, then remove the cooler and check for spread and contact. You can just put it back afterwards if it looks good. Of course if the cooler has poor mounting pressure it won't squeeze out the excess properly, but then it won't perform as it should with thin paste either due to the low pressure.


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Feb 28, 2020)

I'll will give a hopefully a good report on progress on reinstall the paste tonight.



PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> I'll will give a hopefully a good report on progress on reinstall the paste tonight.


Hi there I have the results in GPU and the PC case, CPU cooling temperature. First picture is at idle without any testing just normal idle with CPU at Overclock 4400mhz settings. The GPU cooling system temperature was at 85-107 degrees Celsius before the artic mx-4 paste 4 grams. From bezel panel is still off like you suggested. and  my roomtemperature where PC is about 67 to 70 degrees Fahrenheit. ￼ second one is when test is starting and finished the test for GPU and CPU system temperature. Looking Alot better with the new artic mx-4 paste compound with thin layer as paper the GPU chip. GPU is not going past around- 71 -75 ° degrees Celsius. I haven't put any on the CPU yet I might consider it since it's cheap paste also came with the 125 mm can and radtior. 







I





Valantar said:


> It's not conductive, and the cooler should squeeze out any excess, so don't be afraid to put a decent amount on there. Unless the paste is extremely viscous the mounting pressure from the cooler will ensure proper thickness. Full coverage is the most important for a GPU (if any part of the die is left without paste it can overheat and break), so either spread it by hand (use a thin, flat piece of plastic as a spreader) or put an X across the die with some dots in between the lines. Don't go crazy with the amount (you'll just end up with a mess around the die), but don't use too little either. It's always a good idea to paste, mount the cooler, then remove the cooler and check for spread and contact. You can just put it back afterwards if it looks good. Of course if the cooler has poor mounting pressure it won't squeeze out the excess properly, but then it won't perform as it should with thin paste either due to the low pressure.


Mx-4 Paste was very thin compared to the cheap paste that was on its. I use a small precision putty knife for electrical that I have in my electronics tool box to spread it out thin layer. I put the mx-4 paste on the middle of the GPU chip  and reinstalled the cooler than tighten up 6 screws to max torque. Still everything is going well for temperature readings on the GPU. I still have alot left of mx-4 paste and going to install it on the CPU today.  Just wanted to know how long does this stuff last inside the tube unused that is left over? Does it have a expire date on the paste like some items inside some tube products like paint in can? Thanks.


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## biffzinker (Feb 28, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Does it have a expire date on the paste like some items inside some tube products like paint in can? Thanks.


The paste in the tube or the application on the CPU/GPU should be fine for 8 years.
From their product page:


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## PatrioTFreedom45 (Mar 3, 2020)

biffzinker said:


> The paste in the tube or the application on the CPU/GPU should be fine for 8 years.
> From their product page:
> View attachment 146197


Thanks


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## eidairaman1 (Mar 3, 2020)

PatrioTFreedom45 said:


> Thanks



To apply mx4, (i prefer even flat spread method, press heatsink onto chip twist 4 times back and forth and secure heatsink.










When are you getting a power supply???


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