# B-die Patriot Viper 4000C9, what timings at 3600...



## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

Do have a corsair veng pro rgb kit (3600C18-22-22-22/42/64) with decent micron E,
but a friend wants RGB bling, so im gonna sell him mine and i need something new.

kit is a 16gb viper kit (amd), but I cant get IF to be doing more than 1800 on stock (volt etc), and i dont plan on trying to make it work,
so i thought i could use the profile (XMP), lower clock to 3600 so it tightens the timings, but board wont take it,
and i have to turn of the profile and set clocks/timings manually.

Just wanted to see what to expect, as the CL16 (safe) and CL15 timings seem a bit bad for this kind of kit,
and the corsair does 16-19-19-19-36/58 already, so i wanted to know if it makes sense to keep it and work on tuning,
as i dont have more than 2 or 3 days before making a decision if i keep the new kit or get something else (3600C16 kit and try to tighten timings on that??).


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## tabascosauz (Dec 7, 2020)

Is this the 4000 CL19 Viper Steels?

The 4000/19, 4133/19, 4400/19 kits all have B-die. Run of the mill quality I'd say. At 3600 you should be able to do 14-14-14 at 1.5V or less, I'd lean more towards 1.4-1.45V if you are decently lucky. The Viper Steels below 4000 can be CJR I think and depends on what you get.

I have 4133 Viper Steels on my Renoir rig doing 4000 16-16-16 at about 1.48V. I couldn't boot 3800 14-16-16 at below 1.6V, but 3600 CL14 should be easy if it's not an incredibly unlucky kit.

The DRAM calc recommendation for A0/B0 B-die is so stupid. Any odd CL on Ryzen should be automatically recommended 2T for anything remotely stable because you can't use geardown. The Safe suggestion for A0 B-die is ridiculously loose and B-die that isn't bottom barrel Corsair should easily be able to do it.

There's no point trying to stick to 1.35V - it's B-die, 1.5V is life. Set it to 1.5V, settle on something you want, and then reduce the extra volts you don't need. Ensure good case airflow, don't exceed 1.55V, and you're fine.


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## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

lol, expected you or someone similar to post first   
yeah "shit" A0 rev.
wanna stay below 1.38, especially since the corsair are doing it on 1.35-1.38 (Gb pushes v above set).

will try with 14 and see how it goes, probably swap them if i cant run it below 1.4,
as i can get a 3600C16 for less, set it to xmp and be done..


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## tabascosauz (Dec 7, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> lol, expected you or someone similar to post first
> yeah "shit" A0 rev.
> wanna stay below 1.38, especially since the corsair are doing it on 1.35-1.38 (Gb pushes v above set).
> 
> ...



If you are keeping it below 1.4V, I don't know what speed you'll top out at for CL14. 3600 14-14-14 likely needs 1.45V at the very least. 3200 14-14-14 is pretty pointless these days even compared to 3600 16-19-19.

A0 is still alright, especially for Viper Steel's price. Unless you're validating 5000+, I don't think you'll feel the loss of max achievable freq compared to A2. I was surprised too when I peered under the heatspreader and found it was A0 layout, was expecting A2 from the reviews. It's just not top B-die, it's still solid B-die.

I understand why you might want lower voltage, as I don't have any dGPU adding extra heat in my APU rig for this reason, but below 1.4V B-die loses all practical advantage because pretty much all ICs (save for a few like C-die and Rev.D) do 1.4-1.45V daily.

Yes, B-die can do flat 16-16-16 that Rev.E/Rev.B/CJR can't do, but you're really not going to notice that difference at the same 3600 @ 1.35V.

Plus, the GB overvolt is easy to compensate for in BIOS. My ITX board is by far the worst; most GB boards overvolt 0.03V, mine overvolts 0.06V.


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## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

yeah, still b-die, and only 95$, so not bad.
just hoped to be able to do a bit better than what i already have,
vs keeping the corsair and slapping some stock 3600/18 on the other rig, but nothing with rgb is good or cheap, or out of stock.

seems i cant get it to post with 3600-14-14-14, even at 1.4,
but 15-15-15/1T@1.36 seems to be promising (all others as calc).
gonna verify if its stable, now i only need a 5800x in stock, lol
another reason i want to keep the 4000 ram, as 5xxx chips seem to do up to 2ghz on IF.


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## tabascosauz (Dec 7, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> yeah, still b-die, and only 95$, so not bad.
> just hoped to be able to do a bit better than what i already have,
> vs keeping the corsair and slapping some stock 3600/18 on the other rig, but nothing with rgb is good or cheap, or out of stock.
> 
> ...



Like I said, you're likely to need more than just 1.4V for that.

3600 16-16-16-36 should be okay for 1.35V, maybe a bit more volts for complete stability. tRFC ideally around 250-270 or lower at 3600, high tRFC can really affect Bdie results.

Be careful with dailying 1T odd tCL; from experience, without massive volts to compensate for lack of 2T or GDM, instability can really do a number on your storage without being overtly obvious.


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## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

even if stable on memtest? 
seems to run fine with 1.37 (bios), 
and passed the 1st run already. 
had minor errors at test 9 with 1.36,
as ive seen with the corsair as well, 
that went away when i added 0.1v.


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## tabascosauz (Dec 7, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> even if stable on memtest?
> seems to run fine with 1.37 (bios),
> and passed the 1st run already.
> had minor errors at test 9 with 1.36,
> ...



What memtest, memtest86? MT86 wasn't able to catch 1T instability at all on my CJR; okay for testing a new kit but pretty useless in my books for mem OC because it's so slow

Run HCI at near full memory capacity to 1000%+ coverage. Or do a run of TM5 with anta777 preset (1h30m approx)

If it's stable then, then it's stable.


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## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

yeah memtest86 v8..4
lost me on hci and TM5. 
sw to run in win?


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## tabascosauz (Dec 7, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> yeah memtest86 v8..4
> lost me on hci and TM5.
> sw to run in win?



Yeah.

HCI: https://hcidesign.com/memtest/

TM5: https://testmem.tz.ru/tm5.rar

anta777 .cfg: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1uegPn9ZuUoWxOssCP4PjMjGW9eC_1VJA/edit

Stock config for TM5 ppl don't generally use, you take the anta777 cfg file, rename it to MT.cfg, and replace in the /bin folder the file with the same name.

I still use HCI to double check, but TM5 is much faster. Also free version of HCI forces you to run a bunch of parallel instances of 3GB to fill up your ram, so there's that.


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## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

kool, thnx.


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## NoJuan999 (Dec 7, 2020)

Memtest Helper is a good UI for using HCI Memtest.
Releases · integralfx/MemTestHelper · GitHub 
Put memtest.exe from HCi into the MemTestHelper folder and click on MemTestHelper2.exe.


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## tabascosauz (Dec 7, 2020)

NoJuan999 said:


> Memtest Helper is a good UI for using HCI Memtest.
> Releases · integralfx/MemTestHelper · GitHub
> Put memtest.exe from HCi into the MemTestHelper folder and click on MemTestHelper2.exe.



Unfortunately, this is on the github mainpage:


  

The Memtesthelper guide is still going though, and as always is an excellent resource for new OCers who want to wean themselves off of using DRAM Calc and start taking matters into their own hands: MemTestHelper/DDR4 OC Guide.md at master · integralfx/MemTestHelper · GitHub

Kinda scummy of them to do that, but I'm guessing it's because the free version of HCI limits you to 3GBs and requires you to repeatedly run the program x times until you can fill your RAM. If the process is automated, it kinda defeats the purpose of the paid HCI lmao

HCI worked great for me at 3600 on CJR, but on B-die sometimes HCI will be stable up in the neighborhood of 8000% before it starts popping an error, whereas TM5 will be spitting out errors 20 minutes in like it's a money printer. So I only use HCI for overnight testing now.

But HCI does work well for catching 1T GDM-off instability.


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## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

hmm, no existing file in folder, copied it anyway, but even when i loaded it thru tool,
it finishes after less than 3 min testing..\
looks like bitdefender didnt like the folder and cleaned it..


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## tabascosauz (Dec 7, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> hmm, no existing file in folder, copied it anyway, but even when i loaded it thru tool,
> it finishes after less than 3 min testing..



During the test, does the message box confirm you're running anta777 config?

I had an issue where I would put MT.cfg in /bin but it always ran 1usmus (my previous .cfg). There was some other log file in /bin that you have to delete if you want to change configs. I'll try to find that forum post again

ah, it's the existing Cfg.link file in /bin that you have to delete before you run a new config you just put in there


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## Fry178 (Dec 7, 2020)

yeah, even at 1.4 im getting errors,
switched cmd to 2T @1.36 and now its past the times i got errors before..

so finished without errors, now back to 1.36 doing 15-15-15-15.
thats enough for now, will go back to tweaking ram after i swapped cpus,
so thanks for pointing me to 1T trouble/TM5...


mods: can be closed


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## Fry178 (Dec 13, 2020)

past test multiple times but as soon as i use XFr i get 1-3 errors (depending on LLC)


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## tabascosauz (Dec 13, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> past test multiple times but as soon as i use XFr i get 1-3 errors (depending on LLC)



XFR as in PBO as it's named for Gigabyte?

If stock CPU settings pass TM5 and HCI with flying colours, then that just sounds like those PBO settings aren't stable then. Seems like a few hours of Prime95 Small is in order. Are you trying to do the EDC trick or something? What are your PBO settings rn.

Honestly, PBO doesn't do much for either one of my chips. I only use it to tighten EDC and give a little PPT headroom for disabled C-states on my 3700X; my 4650G straight up doesn't benefit at all from PBO. It's a little frustrating to see some reviewers still peddling PBO like it's some kind of guaranteed free performance that doesn't rely on silicon quality, firmware and board quality.


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## freeagent (Dec 13, 2020)

I don't think it does much for me neither. I've had this thing for a week or two now and I think it logged 4700+ twice, maybe 3 times. Could be an error.. I tried Ryzen Master once and it set single core turbo to 4725 but I didn't see it go that high. I seem to get a less peaky CPU if I don't install all the chipset stuff, leave most everything on auto and just let windows handle it.. yawn.. It seems to contradict what some people say but I need to spend some more time with it. Also this spire cooler really sucks. Why the eff would they give you that POS when they could have given you a copper core or a couple of heat pipes. They know the CPU is going to want 1.45-1.5v lol.. 1.5v! its crazy. Its killing me man. I can push all the air I want and it doesn't do anything once you get past a certain point. It doesn't really pass 80 so whatever I guess.. So I took some fans out because I don't need them where I'm going.. If I can score an all core of 4600 or 4700 I guess I would be satisfied lol.. cant wait to get my heatsink on it


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## Fry178 (Dec 13, 2020)

just normal pbo, all auto but llc to recommended turbo, and gains are noticeable, 280 eisbaer seems to help with boost clocks.
siege did clock min 4600 and peaks regular to 4.7

turned everything to stock again and still errors, so im now back testing ram with 1.36v, so far passed where it wouldn't before. 
even that the displayed voltage stays at 1.38 in win, changing from 1.36 to 1.35 (bios) seemed to be on the lower end of 1.38, now it shows 1.38-1.39 (win)


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## tabascosauz (Dec 13, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> just normal pbo, all auto but llc to recommended turbo, and gains are noticeable, 280 eisbaer seems to help with boost clocks.
> siege did clock min 4600 and peaks regular to 4.7
> 
> turned everything to stock again and still errors, so im now back testing ram with 1.36v, so far passed where it wouldn't before.
> even that the displayed voltage stays at 1.38 in win, changing from 1.36 to 1.35 (bios) seemed to be on the lower end of 1.38, now it shows 1.38-1.39 (win)



Sounds like the RAM profile still needs some ironing out then. Easy peasy. Just finish the RAM before you do the CPU, or vice versa.

Dunno how it is on the ATX boards, but both my GB ITX boards seem to lump voltage steps together in pairs. As in, if 1.42 (1.48 actual) isn't stable, I need to jump up to 1.44 (1.50 actual) to get a meaningful enough increase in DRAM volts. Pretty much the same goes for Vcore, but more so for DRAM.

There's also enough of a fluctuation in DRAM voltage depending on load that if you're right on the edge of stability, you may have to do a few separate runs of TM5 to verify stability.

Keep an eye on your boost voltages under load with LLC above High. These high end boards have good power delivery, but transient can get real spiky, real high, real fast.


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## Fry178 (Dec 13, 2020)

yeah, was the ram.
with 1.36 (1.39) its finishing fine, before i got errors within 20 min.
gonna redo
funny thing tho the 650w evga G+ i had before was a bit sensitive to (gpu) transients,
and never seen any main voltages stable for more than a sec or two.
with the 750w GF1 Vs are so stable/fixed, that i first thought aida froze 

CTR recommended setup guide (bronze sample 3700x) Turbo, CTR recommended to drop to high,
but when i did everything with the 3800XT, it didnt say that after dia/test run.
had a max of 0.6% with Turbo..

besides that, i saw that the board completely removes the spr spectrum setting when i switched to fixed 100 from auto,
so i reverted back to auto (and spread off) just to see if it had any impact.


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## djisas (Dec 13, 2020)

Allow me to butt in on the nice talk here, maybe I can get a piece of advice as well...
I got a team group UD4-4000CL18 that i got running stable at CL16 but only with latest Asrock bios, it's an hynix die and timings are as recommended by the calc at 16-19-21-36-58 1T ~1.35V.
I haven't tried pushing any further than this, you think they can handle more aggressive timings and push voltage up?
I suspect that it would have zero impact on performance but there's always wanting to push the limits for 1 extra fps...


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## Fry178 (Dec 13, 2020)

oh there is a difference u will notice.
go with the fast timings at 1.37-1.38, 
then lower main timings each.


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## Fry178 (Dec 21, 2020)

funny, using the FAST timings is stable, PBO on (LLC turbo/high) is stable, but both together gives me errors between 1-2h into test (TM5),
but not every time.


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## tabascosauz (Dec 21, 2020)

djisas said:


> Allow me to butt in on the nice talk here, maybe I can get a piece of advice as well...
> I got a team group UD4-4000CL18 that i got running stable at CL16 but only with latest Asrock bios, it's an hynix die and timings are as recommended by the calc at 16-19-21-36-58 1T ~1.35V.
> I haven't tried pushing any further than this, you think they can handle more aggressive timings and push voltage up?
> I suspect that it would have zero impact on performance but there's always wanting to push the limits for 1 extra fps...



You can do 16-19-19 maybe. Should be okay for 3733 and 3800, dunno if at 4000 it'll need to relax to 16-20-20. Hynix don't go tRCD tRP below 19, period. You can throw as much voltage as you like at it (probably degrading it in the process, CJR isn't a voltage freak), you won't be getting 16-18-18 stable enough to not risk corruption at 3600 or above. Rev.E can do 16-18-18, B-die will go as low as you like.


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## Fry178 (Dec 21, 2020)

So not many options on LLC.
High gets about 2%, on medium its 4%, and on auto it crash rebooted on 2nd oc test (CTR).
Its fine, im doing 5171/538 in CB20 with stock settings,  and i might drop the 5xxx upgrade,
and swap the board for am5.


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## dgianstefani (Dec 21, 2020)

B die is completely safe up to 1.7v daily if it's kept under 50c. Lots of people have run 1.7v for years.

I run 1.6v daily 3933


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## Fry178 (Dec 21, 2020)

just because i can, doesnt mean i will.
i bought this kit (bdie) to improve timings, not to get above 3600, and other kits (micron e) did do 3600-16CL@1.36,
so i wont "blindly" give something more voltage, just because it can handle it (especially if "I" have to pay, if something DOES go wrong, for whatever reason   )


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## djisas (Dec 21, 2020)

tabascosauz said:


> You can do 16-19-19 maybe. Should be okay for 3733 and 3800, dunno if at 4000 it'll need to relax to 16-20-20. Hynix don't go tRCD tRP below 19, period. You can throw as much voltage as you like at it (probably degrading it in the process, CJR isn't a voltage freak), you won't be getting 16-18-18 stable enough to not risk corruption at 3600 or above. Rev.E can do 16-18-18, B-die will go as low as you like.



Ty for the tip's...
Now I just need to babysit the rams for a few hours to get any results...

I have always thought the kit wasnt any particularly good, but it was a 4000 kit cheaper than any 3600 16-19-19 kit, and anything better than that still runs upwards 150€...
I might upgrade to 5600-700 next year and should keep the kit until I find a great deal on a better one...


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## tabascosauz (Dec 22, 2020)

djisas said:


> Ty for the tip's...
> Now I just need to babysit the rams for a few hours to get any results...
> 
> I have always thought the kit wasnt any particularly good, but it was a 4000 kit cheaper than any 3600 16-19-19 kit, and anything better than that still runs upwards 150€...
> I might upgrade to 5600-700 next year and should keep the kit until I find a great deal on a better one...



I'm surprised to see Hynix in a 4000+ kit, period.

But even being CJR, the Team kit isn't so bad. Hynix just doesn't have much headroom for OCing, but has decent performance if you know what you're doing and it's easy to set up. It does some tighter secondaries and lower tRFC than Micron so should be slightly better at the same speed.

In terms of actual daily performance, mainstream Ryzen only cares about reasonably tight secondaries, reasonably high speed and dual rank (or 2DPC). You don't have an iGPU to feed (Renoir), you don't have IF that scales to 2200MHz (Renoir), and you don't have an insane 5500+ memory controller (Renoir), so set 3600/3733/3800 at 16-19-19 and be done with it. tRFC can use a bit of exploring to see where the limit of your kit lies, just don't expect to go below 400 at these speeds.


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## Fry178 (Dec 24, 2020)

So i removed anything not needed from win, now it runs 912mb/gb ram, and xmp@3600 with auto timings doesn't become stable until 1.37 (bios settings), its also stable if i use the FAST timings at same speed/volt, so i decided to run 1.38 (bios) to make sure its really stable, but even that im now getting 1.40 under win, ram isnt stable anymore. 

i can repeat it, meaning back to 1.37 (running 1.392) is stable again, same clocks and timings. 
Dont think they're broken, but is this normal for ram to become unstable with higher voltage thats still below rec/safe max numbers?


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## tabascosauz (Dec 24, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> So i removed anything not needed from win, now it runs 912mb/gb ram, and xmp@3600 with auto timings doesn't become stable until 1.37 (bios settings), its also stable if i use the FAST timings at same speed/volt, so i decided to run 1.38 (bios) to make sure its really stable, but even that im now getting 1.40 under win, ram isnt stable anymore.
> 
> i can repeat it, meaning back to 1.37 (running 1.392) is stable again, same clocks and timings.
> Dont think they're broken, but is this normal for ram to become unstable with higher voltage thats still below rec/safe max numbers?



You still at 3600 16-16-16? 

Don't refer to them as "FAST", show us a Zentimings shot with all the timings in view.  The timings are their own entities with their own quirks, not one single FAST banner (and DRAM Calc's recommendations are anything but "fast"). As to voltage recommendations, DRAM Calc's voltage ranges vary from high questionable to downright comedy.

It's common to have a timings or freq "hole" where a specific speed doesn't work but one step faster and slower do. Haven't heard of the same "hole" occurring for voltage; my reaction would be to double check my BIOS settings and test again with a variety of stress tests and play some games.


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## jesdals (Dec 24, 2020)

I run mine at 1,52 1900/3800mhz cl 14


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## Fry178 (Dec 24, 2020)

lol, had the feeling first time i used it, but it worked great on the corsair kits with micron e die.
just seems strange that from 2133 to xmp to manual 3600/15 they all are stable at 1.37, not below or above that, and especially with cl15/tuned subtimings i expected to need more.. 

3600cl15-15-15-15-30-46/2T@1.37, gdwn off, pwr dwn off, bgs off, bgs alt on.
all other timings on xmp-auto are stable, same with fast, running tm right now, will post details after the run..


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## tabascosauz (Dec 24, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> lol, had the feeling first time i used it, but it worked great on the corsair kits with micron e die.
> just seems strange that from 2133 to xmp to manual 3600/15 they all are stable at 1.37, not below or above that, and especially with cl15/tuned subtimings i expected to need more..
> 
> 3600cl15-15-15-15-30-46/2T@1.37, gdwn off, pwr dwn off, bgs off, bgs alt on.
> all other timings on xmp-auto are stable, same with fast, running tm right now, will post details after the run..



No need to spend all that effort digging and memorizing all those numbers









						ZenTimings
					

ZenTimings is a simple and lightweight app for monitoring memory timings on Ryzen platform.




					zentimings.protonrom.com
				




Flat 15 I'm thinking 1.4V isn't unreasonable to require. Are you sure 1.37V is fully stable? P95 Large, LinpackX, HCI, TM5?


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## Fry178 (Dec 24, 2020)

right now only TM5, as i want to get an idea what is working/dial in stuff..

Timings:
tRAS 30T
tRC 46T
tRFC 270T (calc says 302)
tRRD Different Rank: 0T, Same Bank Group: 6T, Diff. Bank Group: 4T
tWR 26T
tRTR Diff Rank: 5T, Diff DIMM: 5T, Same Bank Group: 4T, Diff. Bank Group: 1T
tRTW 9T
tWTR 1T, Same Bank Group: 12T, Diff. Bank Group: 4T
tWTW Diff Rank: 7T, Diff DIMM: 7T, Same Bank Group: 4T, Diff. Bank Group: 1T
tRTP 8T
tFAW 16T
tWCL 14T
tRCDW 15T
tREF 14029T
Idle Cycle Limit 8
Dynamic Idle Cycle Counter                        Enabled

RCPage is on auto, as calc didnt state that timing..

running 1.37v (1.392 eff) TM5@anta passes, 1.38v (1.40) doesnt not,
as it wont go for more than 30-40min before it shows 3 errors.


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## tabascosauz (Dec 24, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> right now only TM5, as i want to get an idea what is working/dial in stuff..
> 
> Timings:
> tRAS 30T
> ...



bro there's a screenshot button in zentimings just hit it and post a pic lol

TM5 is good but it isn't the end all be all, 140ns tRFC comes up stable in TM5 and HCI every time but I can't game below 145ns, games lock up

Also not unthinkable that the Aorus Ultra does some weird firmware shit, maybe there really is a voltage hole

Your tCWL is quite tight, tCL-1. Yet, tWR is hella loose at 26


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## Fry178 (Dec 25, 2020)

lol, ahh i just copied aida.
seems i still have no luck with tweaked sub timings as after cold boot (power down ups),
i still get errors with 1.37 that i didnt get after normal boot (from power down).

just like the fact it takes only 2-3h and i dont need multiple instances..

wouldnt surprise me, as i saw i needed 0.01v more going from F2x to F3x when i stil had the corsair kit.

lol, tWR was on auto.
(almost) no clue on the sub timings (as relation between nbrs), and why i was using ryzen calc.
will do another xmp@3600cl15 with auto (subtimings) after cold boot to see if that passes TM% (did yeterday)
to verify.
anything i should change, let me know, but if i can get cl15 to work with subs on auto, i might just keep that.

i wont gain swapping kit back (cost more, and cl16), and im still thinking about 5800 which would make use of 2ghz clock..


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## Fry178 (Dec 26, 2020)

So far it looks good with 3600/15CL-30-46/2T@1.37v (1.392).
ran TM5, incl right after cold boot (which triggered errors outside above settings),
4h of prime95 large, will now do OCCT for a bit.

how long for something like prime95 (or similar) to have decent accuracy?
i know everyone says "as long as possible", but technically that would mean indefinite.
dont mind running stuff for a few hours, just dont see it making sense for +12h
on a rig thats not mission critical, as even running it a day or two, or even 3 would still not get a "100%" accurate result anyway.


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## tabascosauz (Dec 26, 2020)

Fry178 said:


> So far it looks good with 3600/15CL-30-46/2T@1.37v (1.392).
> ran TM5, incl right after cold boot (which triggered errors outside above settings),
> 4h of prime95 large, will now do OCCT for a bit.
> 
> ...



P95 doesn't measure stability the same way as the others look for tangible "errors". We're just using P95 Large because it puts high heat on the RAM. If you've already successfully run through TM5, you use Large FFT to verify "hot" stability so you don't start crashing when you play games where the GPU heats up the RAM. Which as you can probably tell is important for temp sensitive Bdie.

Just run it for a half hour or hour after the temps reach equilibrium, then go spend a few hours playing demanding games. Stability is too complicated to be a box-checking exercise.


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## Fry178 (Dec 26, 2020)

k.
just wanted some other tools to test and triple check.
temps will never be an issue, as cpu/gpu are lc, and even that i have silent/low rpm fans, the corsair kit never passed 40C on 1.35 (1.37),
new kit doesn't have temp sensors.

none that would POST affected my games noticeable, but System seemed snappier when i got close to what i use now,
and had some weird usb behavior.

to me it seems if you're too far off (clocks/timings) or stuff is broken, you usually see tests throw errors within 20-40 mins, anything past 1h can usually be fixed with a bit more voltage.
i tried another run of tm5 with pbo, just to see, but for now ill run above settings and will redo things when i have the 5800..

thanks for your help, T.


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## Fry178 (Jan 1, 2021)

Sog.
latest bios isnt even stable with CL15 (stability improvements) on auto subs,
but using the 2nd profile (called expert) changed sub timings (not seen it before),
and that seems to do fine with 15@1.37...


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## tabascosauz (Jan 1, 2021)

Fry178 said:


> Sog.
> latest bios isnt even stable with CL15 (stability improvements) on auto subs,
> but using the 2nd profile (called expert) changed sub timings (not seen it before),
> and that seems to do fine with 15@1.37...



Ain't broke, don't fix it - if current BIOS is good and stable, don't go chasing better performance in a new BIOS. Even more true for Gigabyte. I stay on the F10 BIOS for my Renoir because all the F11 revisions have been absolute circuses, even if AIDA benches a few hundred MB/s lower.

Don't buy into the "Improved DRAM performance" changelog hype, it's shite. No Ryzen 5000, no reason to update. Between 1004B and 1100 AGESA there's been plenty of time for refining firmware for 3000.

It was someone at AMD or one of the board makers that advised 3000 users not to keep updating unless absolutely necessary, the new revisions are all for 5000 and can work adversely for older Ryzen, even if technically compatible.


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## Fry178 (Jan 1, 2021)

well, mine is stable on F12/F20 and F30, i just wanted to see if it makes any difference,
especially since im getting the 5800 once they have stock.


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## Zach_01 (Jan 1, 2021)

I find that BIOS ver F22 is the best right now for me. R5 3600 and X570 AorusPro.


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## Fry178 (Jan 3, 2021)

so F31q gave me usb trouble (removed stick still, but tray still shows the icon), so i went back to F31o.
was tweaking the fan curves and rebooted a few times (board doesn't keep sys1 profile) and noticed BCLK being 110 (bios sys info), while bios shows auto selected and 100 mhz as stock value.,
so i loaded defaults and redid everything, and ran TM5 again (cl15, subs at xmp/1.37) and got a pass, but running it after a cold boot and maximizing ram use (start/stop tm5 a few rimes) i get errors within 10-40 min (up to 4) no matter what timings and 15-15-15-15.
gonna go back and try 15/xmp subs @1.38 (1.40), and see if that works.

sure, i could do 16, but the corsair did that already, and i know they can take V, but im not really happy to run +1.4 for 15, when the micron did 16@1.36


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## Nitro-Max (Jan 4, 2021)

I have the viper 
rgb 4133mhz kit 32gb of it, And im running at 3800mhz with 16-16-16-32-42   Im running a 5950x.  I can run @4000mhz+ But prefer the lower timings at 3800mhz


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