# New Build Thread



## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

Please note this guide is located in the Wiki ( http://reference.techpowerup.com/Category_talk:Guides )

There are a lot of people who need help with new build or just looking to upgrade components.
Well I want to help them and many others.
This guide will help you see how computer components work as well as help people find out what are good bargains for their price range.

*Table of Contents:*
I.     Buying a Pre-Built System
II.    System Components (Builds)
III.   CPU Buyers Guide
IV.   DDR2 RAM Buyers Guide
V.    GPU Buyers Guide
VI.   PSU Buyers Guide
VII.  Motherboard Buyers Guide
VIII. Hard Drive Buyers Guide
IX.   Cooling Buyers Guide
X.    Case Buyers Guide
XI.    LCDS / LCD TVs for Monitors
XII.  Gaming Keyboards / Mice
XIII. Link to a Build Guide

*I. Buying a Pre-Built System:*
A lot of people like to buy Pre-Built Systems.  Of course, these systems are more expensive than building your own, but you dont go through the hassle of RMAing and building a computer.
Here are some good places to check out for pre-built systems.

U.S.
1. Velocity Micro 
2. AVA Direct
3. Puget
4. Falcon Northwest (expensive)
5. Voodoo PC (expensive)
6. Alienware (expensive)

Other Companies:
1. Dell
2. HP
3. Gateway

These companies would be good for getting a really cheap computer.  Other than that, it isnt really worth it.
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*II. System Components (Builds):*
So here are the best values based on price ranges.

*Budget Build:*
CPU:            AMD Athlon64 X2 3600+ Brisbane
Motherboard: Biostar TForce 550
RAM:            2 x 1GB of Value RAM
GPU:            EVGA / XFX / BFG 7600GT/8500GT or HIS/Sapphire/PowerColor X1650XT(if want cheaper 
                        get a lower series card or use onboard)
HD:              Any Hard Drive
PSU:             FSP or Antec PSU (400W - 450W)
CPU Heatsink: Arctic Cooling Freezer CPU Heatsink
Drives:          DVD RW or CD/DVD Combo Drive

TOTAL ~ $700 US

Right now the AMD Athlon64 X2 3600+ brisbane is a great CPU.  It OCs very nicely and is only around $65 (by far the cheapest dual core you can get).  Paired with the Biostar TForce550 board (which is a sub $100 board), you can OC well beyond 3GHZ. There is no Intel platform that is this cheap and that can perform on the same level.

*Intermediate Buid:*
CPU:            Intel C2D E6430
Motherboard: Gigabyte DS3
RAM:            2 x 1GB of G Skill / Corsair / Kingston / OCZ DDR2-800 (PC2-6400)
GPU:             EVGA / XFX / BFG 7900GT/8800GTS 320mb or HIS/Sapphire/PowerColor X1950XT
HD:              Western Digital or Seagate 250 GB +
PSU:             Corsair HX 520W
CPU Heatsink: Scythe Ninja
Drives:           DVD RW or CD/DVD Combo Drive

TOTAL ~ $1200 US

This build can easily OC very high (beyond an E6600) and the CPU will have the same L2 cache (4mb).  Also, the RAMS use Epilida chipsets which can OC nicely (these chips are only outdone by Micron D9 chips).

*High End Build:*
CPU:            Intel C2D E6600 / E6700
Motherboard: 680i Mobo (EVGA / XFX / etc.)
RAM:            2 x 1GB of Crucial Ballistix or Buffalo Firestix DDR2-1066
GPU:             EVGA / XFX / BFG 8800GTX 640MB or HIS/Sapphire/PowerColor X1950XTX 512MB
HD:              Western Digital Raptors (in a RAID)
PSU:             Corsair HX 620W
CPU Heatsink: Thermalright Ultra 120 / Scythe Ninja or Infinity
Drives:           DVD RW and CD/DVD Combo Drive

TOTAL ~ $1800 US

This system will OC very nicely with the E6600.  Also, the RAM utilizes Micron D9 chips which have the highest OCing potential.  Matched with an 8800GTS 640MB this system will be able to run games.  Also, this system can easily be upgraded with another 8800GTX, more RAM and a Quad Core Processor.
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*III. CPU Buyers Guide:*
With all the different types of CPUs out there, it can be difficult to select the perfect one for you.  So here is an idea of the best bang for the buck CPUs.

*CPU Basics:*
The CPU is the processing unit for the computer.  There are two components of the CPU known as the ALU (arithmetic logic unit) and the CU (control unit).  The ALU performs arithmetic and logical operations while the CU retrieves instructions from memory, decodes these instructions and then sends this information to the ALU (if needed).

When looking at the information associated with a CPU, there is a lot of information.  The first thing you see is the operating frequency of the CPU.  This is the speed at which the CPU is set at.  The higher the frequency, the faster and better the CPU will work.

Another thing you will see is L1 and L2 cache.  The L1 cache (or the primary cache)  is the fastest memory in the computer and is the primary memory used by a CPU.  The L2 cache (or secondary cache) is slower than the L1 cache and is used by the L1 cache.  So the bigger the L1 and L2 cache, the more memory the CPU has available to use.

A third thing is the HT (HyperTransport).  This is the speed at which the interface between the CPU, memory and peripheral devices can work.

The last things to look at are the socket type, Core, and if the CPU is multi-core or not.  The socket type will let you know the type of motherboards that are compatible with this CPU.  So for example if you have a socket AM2 CPU than you NEED a socket AM2 motherboard.

The Core will let you know the type of Core that the CPU has.  This is mostly useful information for people who want to OC since certain cores can OC better than others.

Today there are multi-core and single core CPUs.  Multi-Core CPUs are able to run multiple applications or mult-threaded applications better than single core's can.  There are currently dual core (2 cores) and quad core (4 core) CPUs.

*Budget*:
If your on a budget, you do not have very many options.  However, currently Intel platforms are slightly more expensive and may be out of your league.  So here are some options for you.

1. AMD Sempron ~ > $50 US
If your on an extreme budget (below $50 US), than your best bet is one of the AM2 platform Semprons.  These can even OC decently, however, they are limited by their lack of a lot of L2 cache.

2. AMD Athlon64 X2 3600+ ~ $65 US
This CPU is a great OC and one nice deal at $65.  This CPU can easily OC to over 3GHZ making it a nice competition for its much bigger brothers. 

3. Intel Core 2 Duo E4300 ~ $115 US
If you can splurge a little bit than you might want to get the E4300.  This CPU has a lower multiplier than its bigger brothers and can OC really high (higher than 3GHZ).  This is a great CPU and can match its brothers (the only drawback from this and the E6600 is that this one has 2MB of L2 cache, not 4MB).

*Intermediate*:
If you still have a budget, but can spend a bit than the following CPUs would be your best bet.

1. Intel Core 2 Duo E6320 ~ $160 US
This C2D chip is very similar to the E6300 with only one difference.  It has 4MB of L2 cache instead of 2MB (like the E6300).  Due to this it performs identically to the E6600 when it is clocked the same.  This chip can also OC very nicely.

2. Intel Core 2 Duo E6420 ~ $190 US
This C2D chip is very similar to the E6400 with only one difference.  It has 4MB of L2 cache instead of 2MB (like the E6400).  Due to this it performs identically to the E6600 when it is clocked the same.  This chip can also OC very nicely.

3. Intel Core 2 Duo E6600 ~ $230 US
This C2D chip is a nicely clocked chip at a nice price.  It can even be OCed higher than the E6700 stocks speeds.  If you have the extra cash then you might want to look into this chip.

*High End*:
If you still really dont have a budget, than the following CPUs would be your best bet.

1. Intel Core 2 Extreme X6800 ~ $970 US
This C2D chip is the fastest C2D chip currently out.  Also, since this is the same price of the QX6700, might as well get the better chip.  This is the fastest Dual Core Chip Available.

2. Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 ~ $535 US
If you want a Quad Core chip than this is currently the fastest one.  This one will also OC very nicely.
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*IV. DDR2 RAM Buyers Guide:*
There are many types of DDR2 RAM and RAM companies out there these days.  It can be really hard to find out a good pair of RAM.  So please use this guide to try to help you out.  

Also, please note that DDR RAM cannot be used with DDR2 RAM systems.  They are completely different from each other.  Please check your motherboard manual to see which type of RAM the system supports.

*RAM Basics:*
Most RAM these days are considered Dual Channel.  By doing this, the RAM will have increased bandwith and will be able to run about twice as fast.  In order for RAM modules to run dual channel you will need to either have 2 or 4 sticks of RAM.  If you have 1 or 3 sticks, the RAM will run in single channel mode.  By doing this, your RAM will run much slower.

Each pair of RAM has timings and speeds.  For example a pair of DDR2-800 RAM 5-5-5-15 has the timings 5-5-5-15 and the speed of 800.  Below we will discuss more about frequency and timings.

The timings of RAM is the amount of time it takes the RAM to write and read data per clock.  There are many different timings out there, however, there are only four basic timings that are always listed when buying RAM (as shown above).  These four timings are the Cas Latency, tRCD (RAS to CAS Delay), tRP (RAS Precharge Delay) and tRAS (Active to Precharge Delay).

The Cas Latency is the first number in the timings seen above (ex: Cas-5-5-15).  This is the amount of clock cycles it will take the memory to respond to an operation request (or the time between the sending a read command and the time the first piece of output is available).  Therefore, the lower the CAS Latency, the faster the RAM will be.  Please note though, that if this is set too low for your memory, your system may not be stable.

The tRCD is the second number in the timings (ex: 5-tRCD-5-15).  This is the amount of clocks it takes between issuing the active command the read or write command.  Therefore, the lower the tRCD the faster the RAM will be.  Please note though, that if this is set too low for your memory, your system may not be stable.

The tRP is the third number in the timings (ex: 5-5-tRP-15).  This is the amount of clocks the memory is powered for which will allow the computer to read from the memory.  Therefore, the lower the tRP the faster the RAM will be.  Please note though, that if this is set too low for your memory, your system may not be stable.
number of clock cycles taken between the issuing of a precharge command and the active command

The tRAS is the last number in the timings (ex: 5-5-5-tRAS).  This is the amount of clocks the module must wait before the next access to the RAM can start.  This is usually calculated by adding the CAS + tRCD + tRP since if a command is being executed, another cannot be retrieved.  However, if one is being retrieved while a command is being executed, an error will occur with the memory and the system may not be stable.  Therefore, the lower the tRP the faster the RAM will be.  Please note though, that if this is set too low for your memory, your system may not be stable.

The last thing to consider about RAM (besides the timings) is the RAM speed.  The RAM speed is the speed at which information can be retrieved by the memory.  Hence, the faster the speed, the better the RAM.  For example (DDR2-800 5-5-5-15 RAM is faster than DDR2-667 5-5-5-15 RAM).

Also, please note that RAM options should be chosen differently for different platforms in order to optimize performance.
An Intel platform will benefit more with higher frequencies and looser timings.  For example DDR2-1000 5-5-5-15 will be better than DDR2-800 3-3-3-9.
However, an AMD platform will benefit from tighter timings and lower freq. For example DDR2-800 3-3-3-9will be better than DDR2-1000 5-5-5-15.

*Quality Brands:*
Below is a list of some high quality brands (in no order):
1.  Crucial
2.  Buffalo
3.  G Skill
4.  Kingston
5.  Corsair
6.  Geil
7.  SuperTalent
8.  OCZ
9.  Muskin
10. Patriot
11. Team Xtreme

*Budget DDR2 RAM:*
If you are on a budget than look at any Value RAM.  This RAM most likely uses PROMO chips which cannot be OCed very high.  However, they are the cheapest RAM available.  If you currently have a C2D or AMD AM2 system, then try to get DDR2-667 or DDR2-800(only if you are OCing your system).  The reason for this is because a DDR2 system will not gain any benefits from lower freq. RAM.

*Intermediate DDR2 RAM:*
If you aren't on a small budget, but dont want to break the bank than you should look at RAM containing either PROMOS or Epilida chips.  Some good brands are Corsair, Geil, G Skill, Mushkin, Patriot, PNY, PQI, SuperTalent, OCZ.  These sets of RAM will OC better than the Value brands and can be pushed relatively good.  Epilida chips can be pushed to around DDR2-1000.  If you currently have a C2D or AMD AM2 system, then try to get DDR2-667 or DDR2-800(only if you are OCing your system).  The reason for this is because a DDR2 system will not gain any benefits from lower freq. RAM.

*High End DDR2 RAM:*
If you do not care about a budget than you could pretty much go all out.  Most RAM in this category use either Epilida or Micron D9 chips which can be OCed very high.  Some high end brands are Cruical Ballistix (Tracer and non-Tracer modules), Buffalo Firestix, Corsair Dominator, G Skill (Black Heatspreaders), Mushkin Redline.  Please note that only the most expensive Corsair Dominators use Micron D9s now.  The other Crucial Dominators use Epilida chips now.  Currently the best values are the G Skill, Buffalo Firestix and the Crucial Ballistix.
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*V. GPU Buyers Guide:*
There are so many different brands and types of GPUs out today that it may get very confusing on which ones to get.  Well hopefully this will help and break it down for you.  Please note that this will only go over PCI-Express video cards (not AGP).

*GPU Basics:*
When looking for video cards, just like anything else, you should look at benchmarks and reviews.  These will help show you how well the specific card does to others and the pros/cons of the card.  However, here are some very basic information to get you started.

*GPU Interface*
The first thing to look at is to make sure the GPU you are looking at has the same interface that your motherboard uses.  Currently there are two popular intefaces for GPUS which are PCI-Express and AGP.  Graphic Card and Motherboard companies are mostly developing PCI-Express cards and motherboards (since it is the newer interface and supposedly faster), however AGP interfaces are still being developed, but might cost a bit more.  Please note that for this guide I am only to discuss PCI-Express Cards.

*GPU Memory*
Each GPU has memory located on it since it uses its own memory and not the system's RAM.  Therefore, each video card has a memory size.  The majority of today's video cards have 256 mb of memory.  However, cards have anywhere from 64mb (older cards) to 768mb of memory.  You will want more than 256mb of memory only if you have a display bigger than 19".  This is because more than 256mb of memory is only really utilized when you have a bigger resolutions.  The bigger the resolution, the more memory you will use.

A second thing to look for is the Memory type.  There are currently four types of memory on GPUs which are GDDR, GDDR2, GDDR3, GDDR4.  The memory type will only matter to people who want to OC their memory on the GPU (to OC the Memory Clock).  The higher the number of GDDR, the better it OCs.  So for example, GDDR4 is better to OC than GDDR3 and so on.

The last thing to look at for memory is the Memory Clock of the GPU.  The memory clock is how fast the GPU can fetch and retrieve data.  Therefore, the higher it is, the faster the memory works.

*GPU Core Clock*
The Core Clock is the speed at which the core of the GPU will perform.  Therefore, the higher the Core Clock Speed, the faster the GPU is.

*GPU DX9 Shaders*
With DX9 cards (Geforce 7 series and below, ATI X1XXX series and below) there are two types of shaders, pixel pipeline and vertex engines.  Both of these different shaders have different jobs.  The pixel pipelines applies colors, texture and other attributes to pixels within the image.  However, the vertex engines create the look of the objects.  Therfore, the more pixel pipelines and vertex shaders you have, the better the card is.

*GPU DX10 Shaders*
DX10 cards have a different architecure that DX9 cards.  Instead of having two types of shaders, they have one shader that does both jobs called Scalar Shaders.  These Scalar Shaders do both of what the pixel pipelines and vertex engines did in DX9.  Therefore, the more Scalar Shaders you have the better the card is.

By taking a look at ALL of the above will determine which card is better.  Please note that if you just look at one specific part of a GPU and not ALL will not help you detemine which is the best GPU for you.  For example a GPU with a Core Clock of 520MHZ, a Memory Clock of 450MHZ and 12 pixel pipelines will perform less than one with a Core Clock of 480MHZ, a Memory Clock of 450Mhz and 16 pixel pipelines.

*GPU Brands:*
Now lets take a look at brands.
Here are some of the top brands for Nvidia cards (in no order):
1. EVGA
2. BFG
3. XFX

Here are some of the top brands for ATI cards (in no order):
1. HIS
2. PowerColor
3. VisionTek
4. Sapphire

*Budget GPU:*
These GPUs are for people who are on an extreme budget.  In this segment expect to play most new games on lower settings.  On the budget end we are going to look for GPUs below $50 US and $100 US.  Please note that these are in no order.

GPUs below $50 US
1. 7300 LE *(Highly Recommended)*
2. X1300 (LE or vanilla versions) *(Highly Recommended)*
While these video cards do not supply the highest power, they do support SM3.0 and can run newer games easier than their older counter-parts.  Both of these GPUs perform about the same, so you can go with whichever company you prefer.

GPUs below $100 US
1. 8500GT 
2. 7600GT (if cannot find then get 7600GS)
3. X1650XT *(Highly Recommended)*
These cards are a bit more powerful than the ones below $50.  They can pack quite a punch and keep up in modern games.  I also included the only DX10 card available in this category.  The 8500GT is the lowest DX10 card currently avail. and may not be as strong as the others in DX9, however, it can run DX10.  Also, if you can find a 7600GT for under $100 (as there have been some deals on them) then get that one instead of the 7600GS since it is a faster model.

*Intermediate GPU:*
These GPUs are for people who are on an budget, but can splurge a bit.  In this segment expect to play most new games on medium settings.  On the Intermediate end we are going to look for GPUs below $150US and $200 US.  Please note that these are in no order.

GPUs below $150 US
1. 8600GT 
2. 7900GS *(Highly Recommended)*
3. X1950GT *(Highly Recommended)*
I included the DX10 card  (8600GT) for those who want DX10 support.  This is currently Nvidia's second lowest offering.  Please note, that I cannot recommend one since both the 7900GS and the X1950GT perform about the same.

GPUs below $200 US
1. 8600GTS
2. 7950GT *(Highly Recommended)*
3. X1950XT (if cannot find then X1950PRO) *(Highly Recommended)*
I included a DX10 card for those who want to have DX10 support.  This card is a step up from the 8600GT.  Also, please note that the X1950XT has been seen in this price point, however, if you cannot find it (they have been hard to find), then an X1950PRO would be the second choice.  Both the 7950GT and the X1950XT perform about the same.  However, if you cannt find the X1950XT then get the 7950GT since its the better deal than the X1950Pro.

*High End GPU:*
These GPUs are for people who have a big budget to spend on the GPU.  In this segment expect to play most new games on high settings.  On the high end we are going to look for GPUs below $300US and over$300 US.  Please note that these are in no order.

GPUs below $300 US
1. 8800GTS 320mb *(Highly Recommended)*
2. X1950XT (Please read below)
In this category I cannot really recommend another GPU besides the 8800GTS.  This card outperforms any other card in this category and also is also DX10 compliant.  I am not recommending anyone gets an X1950XT over this card, however, I am listing this card since it is the best card that ATI has to offer in this category.

GPUs over $300 US
1. 8800GTX *(Highly Recommended)*
2. 8800 Ultra
3. X1950XTX
4. HD 2900XT
In this category, the better card is the 8800GTX (it is also DX10 compliant).  However, the fastest card in this category is the 8800 Ultra.  I cannot recommend the Ultra though b/c of its high price tag for an Overclocked version of the 8800GTX.  However, if the 8800GTX is out of your price range you can get the HD 2900XT for less.  This card falls just short of the 8800GTX.  Also, I include the X1950XT which is a nice card and can hold its own pretty well against the DX10 monsters.
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*VI. PSU Buyers Guide:*
Most people overlook a very valuable part of their PC and it cheap out on it.  This is a common mistake made by many.  This part is the PSU.  This will help you find a good PSU that will last you for a while.

*PSU Basics:*
Most people look at just the wattage of a PSU.  This is important, however, the amperage on the 12V line(s) is what is the most important.  This line provides most of you computer with power.  A high quality PSU will give you a good amount of amperage on the 12V line.

Above I did mention 12V lines.  This is b/c some PSUs have more than 1 12V line.  It is also more confusing on finding out the total amperage of the 12V lines with these PSUs.  Unfortunately, you cannot just simply add up the amps on each 12V line and there are your total amps.  This is because rails can share their amps with other rails, however, there is an overhead due to this.  So for example there is a 620W PSU that offers 600Watts of power on the 12V lines.  There are 3 12V lines that each have an amperage of 18 amps (this information is found on the back or side of the PSU).  The total output on the 12V line is ~50 amps and not 54 amps.  An easy way to get an idea of this is to take the following equation [(Total Wattage on 12V lines / Total Wattage of PSU) * Amps on all 12V lines added together].  So for our example its 600/620*54 ~ 50 Amps.

Another thing to look for are reviews of the specific PSU you are looking for (a good place to look is http://www.jonnyguru.com/ ).  Within these reviews they will list the amount of ripple and the effeciency of the PSU.  Both of these are important as well.  A high ripple is bad since it will limit the amount of OCing you can do, as well as, shorten the lifespan of your components.  So the lower the ripple the better.
Also, the higher the effeciency of the PSU, the better.  The effeciency of the PSU is the amount of power that is actually being sent to the computer.  Currently a effeciency of 80% or higher is very good.

Also, many people look at PSUs and see that some are SLI certified.  All this means is that the PSU manufacturer paid Nvidia money to get their stamp of approval on this PSU.  However, every SLI certified PSU has 2 PCI-Express connectors, so you can SLI two Nvidia cards together.  Other than that, these PSUs are exactly the same as other PSUs.  Also, you can use this PSU to Crossfire two ATI cards (if they do not require the 8 pin PCI-Express connector).

*PSU Brands:*
First lets list off some quality PSU brands (not in any order):
1.  FSP
2.  Tagan
3.  PC Power and Cooling (expensive)
4.  Zippy (expensive)
5.  Corsair
6.  OCZ (the PowerStream series)
7.  Thermaltake
8.  Silverstone
9.  Seasonic
10. Hiper 

Please note that Antec is not currently up there since they changed the OEM parts they use.  They now use cheaper parts that dont last as long anymore.

Below is a list of some quality PSUs based on price ranges.  Please note though, that it is recommended that you select a PSU that fits your system (not just the price like what many people do).  For example, if you have ~ $1000 system, than select from the intermediate PSU section.

*Budget PSU:*
This section is for those who have a very limited budget of under $100 US.  Here are some quality PSUs for a budget.  Here are some of the best PSUs you can get for this range. 
Any FSP under $100
Thermaltake PurePower Series
Hiper HPU Series
Silverstone ST Series
Corsair HX520

*Intermediate PSU:*
This is for people with a budget, but can spend a little extra cash.  The ranges of these PSUs are from $100 - 200 US.

FSP FX 600W - 800W
COOLMAX CUG 
Silverstone ST Series
Thermaltake Toughpower
Seasonic M12 (modular)
Seasonic S12 (not modular)
Corsair HX620
PC Power and Cooling Silencer
OCZ PowerStream

*High End PSU:*
This section is for $200+ PSUs that are needed for the systems demanding the most power.

Any Silverstone
Seasonic M12
Any PC Power and Cooling
Any Zippy
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*VII. Motherboard Buyers Guide*

*Motherboard Basics*
Motherboards are one of the hardest things to pick for many people.  The main reason for that is because there are so many different types that one can easily become confused.  Here are some basics to look at when chosing a motherboard.

*Socket Type and CPU Type*
The socket type will detemine the line of processors which you can use.  Next, the CPU type will further tell you which processors in the processor line that the motherboard will support.  For example, if the socket type is Socket 939 and the CPU type is AMD Athlon64, then this motherboard will only be able to support processors in the socket 939 line that are ONLY Athlon64.

*Form Factors*
There are also a few motherboard form factors out there.  Here they are list (in no specific order):
1. mATX
2. ATX
3. mBTX
4. BTX

The top 2 forms that are used by desktop builders are mATX and ATX.  The reason for this is bc most cases used by desktop builders are ATX cases and will have the screw mounts for both mATX and ATX motherboards.  However, before buying a motherboard or a case, make sure that the case can fit and support the motherboard.

*Memory*
Each motherboard has memory slots, the memory standard and the max memory supported .  The memory slots are the amount of memory slots that the motherboard has.  ATX motherboards have 4 memory slots and mATX motherboards have 2 slots.

The memory standard is the memory that the motherboard supports at its standard configuration.  So for example, if the memory standard is DDR 400, the motherboard supports DDR memory at a standard configuration of DDR 400.  Please note that if you have DDR 500 RAM the motherboard will default the frequency to DDR 400 unless this is changed in the BIOS.

PLEASE NOTE, DDR memory and DDR2 memory are two types of memories.  So if a board supports DDR memory it cannot take DDR2 memory and vice versa.

The max memory supported is the maximum amount of memory that the motherboard can recognize.  So if you put 8GB in a motherboard that supports a max of 4GB, only 4GB can be utilized and seen by the motherboard.

*Expansion Slots*
These are the slots in which you can put expansion cards.  Some of these cards are video cards, SATA cards, audio cards, etc.  These slots are usually AGP, PCI-E, PCI, etc.

AGP and PCI-E (aka PCI-Express) slots are mainly used for video cards.  Please make sure that you select a motherboard or video card that is supported.

PCI slots are mainly used for other expansion cards such as Audio, SATA Cards, PATA cards, TV Tuners, Fans, etc.

*Storage Devices*
These are the slots that the motherboard has available for Hard, DVD and CD ROM Drives.  There are a two main interfaces available, PATA and SATA (please refer to the Hard Drive section if you want to know more).  Make sure you select the correct amount of interfaces so they support all of your hard drives and DVD/CD drives.

Please note, that most DVD and CD ROM Drives use a PATA interface, however, there are some SATA intefaced ones available.

*Onboard Video and Audio*
If you are not looking to use a video card than you should look for a motherboard that has onboard video.  Even though onboard video is usually weaker than having a video card, it is more cost effective for those who dont need the best and cutting edge graphics.
Please note, that not all motherboards have onboard video.  Using onboard video is not recommended for gamers or graphic intense programs.

Onboard Audio is on every motherboard.  There are many different types of onboard video, however, the most common ones are Realtek audio that supports 6 channels.  The audio is not as crisp and nice as ones on most audio cards, however, if sound is not that important it is cost effective.

*Rear Panel Ports*
The rear panel on every motherboard has a certain number of ports.  These ports include USB, Audio, Video, PS/2, COM, Firewire, etc.  If you need a certain amount of a certain port than this will be important to you since not all motherboards contain the same amount and types of ports.

Please note, that the motherboard is a very important component in the system.  The reason for this is because everything is connected to the motherboard.  Due to this, the motherboard faciliates everything.

*Overclocking a Motherboard*
If you plan to OC, you'll want to make sure the board you have your eye(s) on is good for it. Some boards and brands just cannot OC very well. Some boards are okay, but probably won't push your CPU/RAM very much before becoming unstable. Some boards are rock-solid for overclocking. The best way to determine is to Google the board and/or hop onto a good forum and ask around. Please don't depend on the reviews on retailer sites (you cant trust those).

Overclocking can apply to your CPU, RAM, and graphics port(s). This basically means changing the voltage the motherboard applies to these components. People most commonly overclock their CPU. Many also overclock their RAM to achieve better timings. I do not recommend overclocking graphics ports. Doing so carries the most risk.

Overclocking doesn't appeal to everyone. Don't brush off a motherboard because it has bad reviews. Sometimes the bad reviews are regarding its ability to overclock. If you don't plan to OC, chances are it's still a good board to run your components at stock speeds.

*Quality Motherboard Brands*
This is a list of quality motherboard brands (in no specific order)
1. Abit
2. ASUS
3. EVGA
4. MSI
5. DFI
6. BioStar

Below is a list of some quality motherboards based on price ranges.  Please note though, that it is recommended that you select a motherboard that will support the rest of your system's components.

*Budget Motherboards:*
This is for people with a budget, but can spend a little extra cash.  The ranges of these motherboards are under $100 US.
*AMD*
BioStar TForce550

*Intel*


*IntermediateMotherboards:*
This is for people with a budget, but can spend a little extra cash.  The ranges of these motherboards are from $100 - 200 US.
*AMD*


*Intel*
Gigabyte DS3

*High End Motherboards:*
This is for people with a budget, but can spend a little extra cash.  The ranges of these motherboards are $200+ US.
*AMD*

*Intel*
All 680i boards (ex: EVGA 680i)
Intel BadAxe
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*VIII. Hard Drive Buyers Guide*
There are a lot of different types and sizes of hard drives out there.  There are also a good amount of companies out there today that it can be confusing.  Here are some of the basics and good buys out there.

*Hard Drive Basics:*
There are quite a few things to look at when buying a hard drive.  The first thing you may see is the capacity (or the size) of the hard drive.  This is the amount of storage that a hard drive has.

The next thing you will see is the interface of the hard drive.  This is the interface that is used to pass data from the system to the hard drive and vice versa.  Currently there are two widely used interfaces called IDE (or ATA), SATA and SCSI.  Currently, SATA hard drives transfer data faster than IDE hard drives.  The SCSI interface is the fastest, but are only really used by servers.  Before choosing an interface, please make sure your motherboard has that interface so you are able to connect the hard drive and the motherboard.

The hard drive usually has three different timings called the Seek Time, the Write Time and the latency.  The seek time is the average amount of time it takes the hard drive to find a file.  The write time is the average amount of time it takes to write a file to the hard drive.  The latency is the average time lag between requests for the information stored on the hard drive.

Each hard drive also has a cache and RPM (revolutions per minute).  The cache is the amount of memory that the hard drive has so it can store frequently accessed data for fast access.  The more cache a hard drive has, the more data it can store and access faster.

The RPM is the speed at which the hard disk will spin.  Hence an increase in speed will make the hard drive be able to retrieve data faster.

*RAID Basics:*
RAID (Redundant Array of Independent Disks) is a common term used for servers.  However, more computer builders are using RAIDs in their home computers today.

RAID is a way to backup data by using redundancy.  By using RAID, one backs up their data on multiple disks.  Therefore, if a disk fails in their computer, the data is still available on another disk.

There are quite a few different types of RAIDs out there today.  However, I am only going to list some of the most common RAIDs.

Please note that in order to use RAID, you must have at least 2 hard drives or more.

RAID 0:
This type of RAID has no redundancy or way to backup you data.  This will setup all of your hard disks as one logical drive.  For example, you have 2 hard drives with 150GB each.  In RAID 0, the computer will see that you have 1 hard drive with ~300GB of space.

This RAID requires that you have at least 2 hard drives.

RAID 1:
This type of RAID will duplicated the storage of your data (giving you redundancy).  If you have 2 hard drives, one will be used as your regular hard drive, while the other one will be used as a backup, copying the exact same data from the first hard drive.  Besides data redundancy this RAID does offer faster reading times since the data can be read from either hard drive.  For example, you have 2 hard drives with 150GB each.  In RAID 1, the computer will see that you have 1 hard drive with 150GB of space.

This RAID requires that you have at least 2 hard drives.

RAID 5:
This RAID will store information in stripes on the hard disks.  Therefore, records can be read from any hard drive.  Also, in the event of a failure the RAID array can be reconstructed since all of the information is on a stripe on each hard disk.  For example, you have 5 hard drives with 50GB each.  In RAID 5, the computer will see ~200GB.

RAID 5 w/ hot spare:
This is the same as RAID 5 (described above) with only one difference.  The only difference is that one drive is used as a hot spare or a drive solely used to reconstruct the RAID in case of a disk failure.  This is a very common used RAID today.  For example, you have 5 hard drives with 50GB each.  In RAID 5 w/ hot spare, the computer will see ~160GB.

This RAID requires at least 3 hard drives, but 5 are recommended.

*Quality Hard Drive Brands:*
Here is a quick list of some quality Hard Drive brands
1. Western Digital
2. Seagate
3. HP
4. Samsung

The best place to usually look for hard drives are local brick and mortar retailers.  Online retailers may have them for slightly cheaper, however, shipping usually brings the hard drives to about the same price.  However, make sure that you get a big enough hard drive so you have enough storage for your data.  For example, if you are a gamer or creating a media center, you may want to get a hard drive over 250GB so you can store a lot of movies and games.

*Raptor Hard Drives vs. Others:*
Raptor hard drives are extremely fast hard drives.  These hard drives have very fast data access and can transfer data to the computer extremely fast.  They offer the speed of SCSI drives, but use a SATA interface so regular computers can use it, instead of just servers.  Of course, all of this comes at a premium price.  For example, a Raptor 150GB may cost $250, while you can get a 500GB regular hard drive for $230.

Many people usually ask if the Raptors are worth the money.  The simple answer is, if you want to retrieve your data slightly faster, than get it.  However, if that doesnt make a difference to you, than save your money or get a bigger hard drive for yourself.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*IX. Cooling Buyers Guide*
Coming Soon
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*X. Case Buyers Guide*
In the computer world today there are way too many case companies, sizes, types, etc. that it can become confusing when you want to pick a case.  Even though many people have different tastes and styles it can never hurt learning a little bit of what to look for in a case.

*Case Basics*
*Case Size*
Believe it or not the case size determines quite a few factors.  There are three basic size of cases which are micro tower, mini tower, mid tower and full tower cases.  There are pros and cons of each size.

The micro tower case is the smallest case size you can currently get.  These cases are very good for traveling around with (esp. for LAN parties) due to their small size and ligher weight.  However, these cases offer very little room to hide wires and work in.  Also, this case offers the least amount of expansion areas available for Hard Drives, PCI-E cards, etc.  Sometimes this makes these cases harder to install components.  Also, these cases can only fit micro ATX motherboards (not regular ATX motherboards) due to their small size.

The Mini tower case is slightly bigger than the micro tower case.  This offers some more room to work in, fits both micro ATX and ATX Motherboards and is slightly heavier.

The Mid tower case is the mid sized case.  This case offers more room to work in, hide cables and allows ATX and Micro ATX motherboards.  Also, this case offers more expansion slots than the micro cases.  However, this case is not ideal for traveling with, but it can be done.

The Full tower case is the biggest case size currently available.  This case offer the most room to work in, hide cables and allows all motherboards to fit in them (some do not allow BTX cases).  However, if you are traveling with your computer, this case is not ideal for that.

*Case Materials*
The case's materials usually determines if it will last longer (and is hard to damage) or if it is flimsy and will not last a long time (or dent easily).  A good case usually is made of either Steel or Aluminum.  Cheap cases are usually made of mostly plastic (hence why they are cheap).

Now there are two main difference between a Steel case and an aluminum one.  Aluminum cases are less durable, however they are ligher and easier to carry around.  On the other hand, Steel cases are the most durable cases, but are heavy and hard to lug around.

Another thing some people look for these days are windows in their cases.  Some have them, while some dont.  Quality and non-quality cases both offer them and it is soley a personal choice, if you want them.  However, please note that if you have a window, cable management should be a priority.

*Motherboard Compatability*
An important thing to look at is if you case supports the motherboard you have or you are going to order.  This was said above in the Case Size section, but I will repeat it since it is important.  
Micro towers support Micro ATX motherboards.
Mini and Mid towers both support Micro ATX and ATX motherboards.
Full towers support Micro ATX, ATX and BTX motherboards.  Please note that only some support BTX motherboards, not all.

*Expansions*
On each case there are a number of expansion slots.  There are mainly 4 types of expansion slots which are External 5.25" Drive Bays, External 3.5" Drive Bays, Internal 3.5" Drive Bays, Expansion Slots.

The External 5.25" Drive Bays are the areas that mainly store Media drives (such as CD and DVD readers/writers).

The External 3.5" Drive Bays are the areas that mainly store floppy drives, memory card readers, temperature sensors, etc.

Internal 3.5" Drive Bays are the areas that mainly store the hard drives.  Therefore, this will detemine the amount of hard drives you can have.

The Expansion Slots are the areas in the back of the case where the video card, sound card and other expansion cards' connections are.  This will ultimately detemine the amount of expansion cards that you can have.

*Front Ports*
Front ports are offered on most cases these days.  The most common front ports are USB 2.0, IEEE 1394 Firewire, Audio & Speaker ports.  This makes it much easier to connect and disconnect items.

*Cooling System*
The cooling system of the case is very important since you never want your computer to overheat.  Most cases these days come with 2 fans (1 for intake and 1 for outtake).  Some come ready for watercooling.  Just make sure that the cooling solution you want is supported by your case.

Also, please see this IMPORTANT note.
DO NOT USE A POWER SUPPLY (PSU) THAT COMES WITH THE CASE.  THESE PSUs ARE OFTEN GENERIC AND ARE NOT GOOD AT ALL.  YOU CAN EASILY LOSE ALL OF YOUR COMPONENTS BC OF A BAD PSU.  Do yourself a favor and get a quality PSU and dont skimp on it.

*Quality Case Brands*
There are some brands that build very nice cases out of steel and/or aluminum.  Here are some of those brands (in no order).
1. Thermaltake
2. NZXT
3. Antec
4. Lian-Li
5. Cooler Master
6. Zalman (very expensive)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*XI. LCDS:*

*Quality LCD Brands:*
Here are some quality brands of LCDS currently on the market (not in any order)
1. Dell
2. Viewsonic
3. Acer
4. LG
5. NEC
6. Samsung
7. BenQ
8. HP

These manufacturers use high quality parts in their LCD monitors.  This is why you will usually pay a premium for them.  
If you are looking for a budget LCD see if you can get any of these manufacturers for a cheap price, if not than any other manufacturer is good (just check the specs and compare with others).  Below is a list of some (not all budget LCD makers)

*Budget LCD Brands:*
1. Hanns-G
2. Sceptre
3. X2Gen
3. CHI MEI
4. Rosewill

Other brands use lower quality parts, hence, why they are less expensive.  Below is a list of some quality monitors.  There are way too many to list so these are not all quality monitors.

*17" - 19":*
Acer AL1717Fbd
Dell UltraSharp 1708FP
NEC 70GX2
Samsung 731BF
Viewsonic Optiquest Sereies Q7B

Dell UltraSharp 1907FP
NEC 90GX2
Samsung 941BW
Viewsonic VX922

Please note that all 17-19" have the same resolutions.  The 19" LCDs just stretch out the picture.

*20" - 20.1":*
Acer AL2016
Dell UltraSharp 2007FP
NEC LCD2070VX
Samsung 203B

BenQ FP202W
Dell UltraSharp 2007WFP (20.1")
Dell E207WFP (20.1" w/ TN Panel)
NEC 20WMGX2 (The most expensive, but the best one in the 20.1" category)
Samsung 205B
ViewSonic VX2035WM

*22"-27":*
Please note that all 22" use TN Panels
Acer AL2216
Dell E228WFP (22" w/ TN Panel)
Samsung 225BW
Samsung 226BW
Viewsonic VX2255

Acer AL2423BenQ FP241W
Dell UltraSharp  2407WFP
NEC LCD2470WNX
Samsung 244t
ViewSonic VX2435

Dell UltraSharp  2707WFP
Samsung 275T

*30":*
Dell UltraSharp 3007FPW
Dell UltraSharp 3007FPW- HC

The Dell UltraSharp 3007FPW- HC is a new Dell monitor.  The old one is the Dell 3007FPW (first one listed).  The difference is that the new one uses a brighter and better panel.  Therefore, the monitor will last longer, as well as look Sharper.  Many argue that Apple and HP make good 30" monitors as well.  This is true, but when compared to the Dell they do not come close.  Plus on top of that Dell offer a zero dead pixel policy which no manufacturers can currently compete with.

*LCD TVs:*
Follow the same instructions as you would an LCD monitor. 
1080p LCD TV's work GREAT as monitors. 
1080i LCD's are ONLY 1366x768 and 768 in the vertical direction is NOT enough.
Therefore, when looking for an LCD TV as a monitor get an 1080p.

Currently the cheapest 1080p is a Sceptre on Newegg. 37" @ $999 free ship.

Please note that all UltraSharp Panels use IPS Panels and have USB ports built into them.

*How to Look for a Good LCD:*
Here are some things to look for when buying a new LCD (not in any order)
1. Panel Type - Not all LCDs use the same panel.  You will often (esp. on newegg) see TFT under panel.  All LCDs have a TFT panel.  The question is do they use a TN, IPS, MVA or PVA Panel.  

TN Panel: The TN panel is the cheapest panel to produce and is the one most LCD manufacturers use due to this.  These panels have the fastest reponse time, however, they produce the worst color and the color will slightly change when you move up or down / left to right.  They also have limited viewing angles.

IPS Panel: An IPS is one of the best panels available for an LCD.  These panels offer very good viewing angles and color.  However, these cost much more than the TN panel and have higher response times.

MVA Panel: This panel is more of a hybrid between a TN and IPS panel.  These panels offer a big viewing angle and color (IPS panel is still better in these departments) with a fast response time.  However, these panels cost more than the TN panel, but less than an IPS panel.

PVA Panel:  Very similar to the MVA panel.  However, these panels offer much higher contrast ratios when compared to the MVA panel.

2. Response Time: This is the amount of time it takes for the screen to synchronize.  This is esp. important for gamers since if the response time is not fast enough you will see ghosting or the video lagging.  For gaming anything 16ms and under in response time is good and you should not see any types of ghosting.  Please note, that some monitors with 2ms response times sometimes gets stuck since the response is too fast.

3. Colors Support:  This is the amount of colors that the display can show.  There are currently 2 amounts for this.  Either 16.2 million or 16.7 million.  If a panel has 16.2 million colors it is considered a 6 bit panel.  However, if a panel has 16.7 million it is considered either a 6 bit panel w/ dithering or an 8 bit panel.  If you want your LCD to be have a similar look and feel like a CRT than you will want a panel with 16.7 million colors.  Personally, the 16.2 million color panels seem bleak and dull with their colors.

4. Contrast Ratio:  This is the contrast between colors.  The higher it is the better.  This is more important for people who use visual programs.  However, a nice contrast ratio is nice to have.  LG has a monitor with a 1000:1 contrast ratio.

5. Input Ports:  Most LCDs nowadays have both DVI and VGA (Analog) ports, but just make sure it has the ports you need to connect the monitor to.

6. Brightness:  This is only important if you like to have a bright monitor similar to a CRT.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*XII: Gaming Keyboards / Mice:*
There are a lot of mice and keyboards out there.
If you are not gaming, then may I suggest any keyboard and optical mouse will do.
Gamers might need a little more functionality with their mice and keyboards.
However here are some of the quality ones that are currently out (not in any order)

*Gaming Keyboards:*
1. Logitech G11
2. Logitech G15
3. Razer Reclusa
4. Razer Tarantula
5. Saitek Eclipse
6. Saitek Eclipse II

The Razer boards are not fully lit, but parts of them are backlit.  With these boards you are able to create macros for games.
The Saitek boards are completely backlit blue.  However, with the Saitek II board you can switch between blue, red, and purple.
The Logitech boards are backlit blue and you are able to create macros with these boards.  The only difference between the G15 and G11 is that the G15 has an LCD which allows you to see various things about your system.  This LCD is fully customizable.

*Gaming Mice:*
1. Logitech G5 (new and old one)
2. Logitech G7
3. Logitech VX Revolution
4. Logitech MX 518
5. Razer Copperhead
6. Razer DeathAdder

The Razer gaming mice are small and for those that are used to the traditional mouse, may have a hard time adjusting.  They have nice lighting to them and have nice software to mod your dpi settings with.
However, the Logitech mice are bigger and more like a traditional mouse.  They contain nice software to mod your dpi settings.  
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Link to a Build Guide*
Below is a link to a build guide on how to build a computer.
Please note that this is not my guide and I do not update it (I am not responsible for any information in this guide).

http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/other/144
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*Thanks for Help:*
GJSNeptune

Please note that I will be updating this regularly.

Please support this thread, keep it alive


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 8, 2007)

Sweet this looks awesome. Thanks. I'm looking forward to the LCD section.


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

While a noble idea, the "help me with this new build" threads will never die. Go to any forum. There's no stopping them.


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> While a noble idea, the "help me with this new build" threads will never die. Go to any forum. There's no stopping them.



Agreed.
However, this might help limit it somewhat.
Also, this would be a good first stop for those people.

Putting all this info together too never hurts, esp. if it is stickied


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

Updated.
Added Things to Look for in an LCD


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

Updated again 
Added monitors and updated information for LCD Section.

Anyone want info about Keyboards / Mice included or anything else relating to new builds?


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

The more you include, the more (theoretically) you reduce the appearance of 'new build' threads.


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> The more you include, the more (theoretically) you reduce the appearance of 'new build' threads.



Ok I added that information as well.
Feel free to add your information or two cents if you want.
I dont want to hog all the info.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 8, 2007)

I love my Logitech G5 Gaming Mouse. Sooo butter. Got it on an amazon.com sale a while back for $25. Sweeeet deal.


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## WarEagleAU (May 8, 2007)

What about a substitute on the graphics card for budget systems. Offer those ATI choices as well. Like the X1650Pro or X1950 Pro or summat?


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

WarEagleAU said:


> What about a substitute on the graphics card for budget systems. Offer those ATI choices as well. Like the X1650Pro or X1950 Pro or summat?



Good call there.
I was looking for a card sub $100 US so the X1950PRO is out.
Added the X1650XT and the 8500GT (if you want DX10).

Any ideas with an intermediate build.
Was thinking the E6320 or 6430?


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## ktr (May 8, 2007)

x1950gt comes in and out of the $100 area...


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## Mediocre (May 8, 2007)

You might think about adding LCD TV's to the LCD section. My advice is:

1080p LCD TV's work GREAT as monitors. Follow the same contrast/refresh rate/etc. 

1080i LCD's are ONLY 1366x768 and 768 in the vertical direction is NOT enough. 1080p is 1920x1080. 

Currently the cheapest 1080p is a Sceptre on Newegg. 37" @ $999 free ship.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 8, 2007)

You should have budget, intermediate, high-end, and extreme. I say for C2D: 6320.6430=intermediate, e6600/q6600=advanced, qx6700/x6800=extreme (although I would defintely advise the qx... y buy 2 when you could get 4 for the same price?)


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

Mediocre said:


> You might think about adding LCD TV's to the LCD section. My advice is:
> 
> 1080p LCD TV's work GREAT as monitors. Follow the same contrast/refresh rate/etc.
> 
> ...



Hmm not a bad idea.
I have not kept up to date on LCD TVs for a while now, just regular LCDs.


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## PaulieG (May 8, 2007)

What about C2D based systems?


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> You should have budget, intermediate, high-end, and extreme. I say for C2D: 6320.6430=intermediate, e6600/q6600=advanced, qx6700/x6800=extreme (although I would defintely advise the qx... y buy 2 when you could get 4 for the same price?)



I have added a top of the line build.
Which is the highest of everything.
Still looking around as to what else to put in intermediate


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

Paulieg said:


> What about C2D based systems?



The C2D systems will be Intermediate and up.
However, no Intel system can compete with that cheap AMD system for the price.


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

Might also want to post some of the goto prebuilt brands just in case people overwhelmed can rest assured that they can spend their money wisely without building it themselves.

VelocityMicro/Overdrive
AVA Direct

etc. (and also by country/region)


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

Added an Intermediate System.....
Let me know what you think


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> Might also want to post some of the goto prebuilt brands just in case people overwhelmed can rest assured that they can spend their money wisely without building it themselves.
> 
> VelocityMicro/Overdrive
> AVA Direct
> ...



Hmm I dont know too many that are good.
Please give me some and I will add them.


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

Well for the US, we like Velocity Micro (they just bought OverdrivePC), AVA Direct, Puget, and maybe some others.

Somewhat overpriced, but there's Falcon Northwest, Voodoo PC, etc.

Of course, there's Dell/Alienware, HP, Gateway, etc., but they aren't as personable as the previously mentioned companies.


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> Well for the US, we like Velocity Micro (they just bought OverdrivePC), AVA Direct, Puget, and maybe some others.
> 
> Somewhat overpriced, but there's Falcon Northwest, Voodoo PC, etc.
> 
> Of course, there's Dell/Alienware, HP, Gateway, etc., but they aren't as personable as the previously mentioned companies.



Good idea and its added.

Thanks for all the input thus far guys.
The guide has def. grown.

Keep those brains pumping


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

A laptop section (budget, gaming, etc.) might be a good idea, although it wouldn't exactly fit the 'New Build' part.

I'm guessing after this thread's exhausted, a new one will be made with all of the changes and not all of these replies.


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> A laptop section (budget, gaming, etc.) would be good. I can't recommend any though.



I would rather stay away from that.
The main reason is bc not many build their own laptops since parts are hard to find and it is hard to do.
Mainly Dell, Alienware, HP is the place to get them.

And we might make a new thread once the kinks are worked out, but maybe not.
There are a lot of threads similar to this that have the same thing.

Its all about the tweaks


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 8, 2007)

High End RAM: 4x1GB or 2x2GB. Top-o-the-line RAM: 4x2GB, even thought this is not usable by anyone. Some other good brands of higher RAM: Mushkin, Crucial (esp. Ballistix), Geil. I know those guys r good.


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

Corsair XMS Dominator.


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> High End RAM: 4x1GB or 2x2GB. Top-o-the-line RAM: 4x2GB, even thought this is not usable by anyone. Some other good brands of higher RAM: Mushkin, Crucial (esp. Ballistix), Geil. I know those guys r good.



I would say top of the line should have 2 x 2GB or 4 x 1GB since no OS can use more than that right now (so it is useless).

Top of the End RAM is RAM that uses Micron D9 chips.
So that would be Crucial Ballistix easily or the most expesive Corsair Dominator since the others use Epilida chips.

Geil to my knowledge does not use Micron D9 chips, but PROMOS or Epilida and are not high end.
Muskin does use Micron D9 chips, but only in their really expensive stuff.
Some good cheap Micron D9 chips are either G Skill (w/ Black heatsinks), Buffalo Firestix or Ballistix DDR2-800 RAM.


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

Definitely put Western Digital Raptor hard drives up there for high-end, or even gaming. Multiple Raptors for RAID, although not as crucial. SATA drives with 16MB cache preferred.

I'm partial to WD, but some would recommend Raptors for OS drives and Segates (7200.10) for storage.


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> Definitely put Western Digital Raptor hard drives up there for high-end, or even gaming. Multiple Raptors for RAID, although not as crucial. SATA drives with 16MB cache preferred.
> 
> I'm partial to WD, but some would recommend Raptors for OS drives and Segates (7200.10) for storage.



Haha I was just thinking that and I did that for a high end system...
I am kind of stuck if a high end system should have an 8800GTX or not


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## GJSNeptune (May 8, 2007)

High-end should have at least an 8800GTX. Top-of-the-line should have two.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 8, 2007)

Ya those are the HDDs I'm putting in my system, exactly like that. 
From what I've read, there's a sweet set of Geil Memory that having low timings, are pretty cheap, are very overclockable, and are confirmed D9GMH  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820144062
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1181402 <--confirming D9 Micron
So keep Geil up there bad boy =)

and we've been having some debate about dual 8800GTS 320MB vs single 8800GTX (ask Ketxxx) - see http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=30762

Amen to dual 8800GTX on Top-o-line. Throw a physics card on there too (I've been on that kick... hey if I had the xtra money I'd def buy it).


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> Ya those are the HDDs I'm putting in my system, exactly like that.
> From what I've read, there's a sweet set of Geil Memory that having low timings, are pretty cheap, are very overclockable, and are confirmed D9GMH  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820144062
> http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1181402 <--confirming D9 Micron
> So keep Geil up there bad boy =)



That RAM is not Micron D9.
If they were then they would get past DDR2-1000.
These are Epilida chips which OC nice, but cannot perform on the same level.

Micron D9 is good bc it can take a high level of voltage and still get better results.
With Promos and Epilida, you reach a barrier once you hit 2.2V - 2.3V I believe.

Also, a common misconception about RAM is the tighter the timings the better the RAM.
This is not fully correct.

An Intel platform will benefit from higher freq. and looser timings.  For example DDR2-1000 5-5-5-15 will be better than DDR2-800 3-3-3-9.
However, an AMD platform will benefit from tighter timings and lower freq.  For example DDR2-800 3-3-3-9 will be better than DDR2-1000 5-5-5-15.

Also, for that price you could get better RAM.
Look at the Crucial RAM at Buy.com (there is a thread in Hardforums.com in the deal sections about it).
Much better RAM for a little bit more (It is $120).
Here is the link ( http://www.buy.com/prod/crucial_bal...emory_w_led_lights/q/loc/14982/204538864.html )


----------



## surfsk8snow.jah (May 8, 2007)

Hmm interesting info on the timings for intel vs amd. Good to know. 
Alright I cede from the Geil debate lol, not that important anyway =)
Besides, I am going on your previous recommendation and buying 4GB of those crucial balllistix for myself  w00t.


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## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> Hmm interesting info on the timings for intel vs amd. Good to know.
> Alright I cede from the Geil debate lol, not that important anyway =)
> Besides, I am going on your previous recommendation and buying 4GB of those crucial balllistix for myself  w00t.



Hmm you just gave me a new idea.
I am going to add RAM and CPU section for good bang for the bucks.

But yea the Ballistix are the best


----------



## surfsk8snow.jah (May 8, 2007)

Ya now that would be helpful, cuz there's so many companies and sticks that look comparable, but may be worlds apart. That'd help a lot of people out there. Write a description differentiating the D9 vs epilida vs promos and why D9s are better, and put that timings bit on there too. That was very concisely worded. This is shaping up to be an amazing post bruins. GJ!


----------



## bruins004 (May 8, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> Ya now that would be helpful, cuz there's so many companies and sticks that look comparable, but may be worlds apart. That'd help a lot of people out there. Write a description differentiating the D9 vs epilida vs promos and why D9s are better, and put that timings bit on there too. That was very concisely worded. This is shaping up to be an amazing post bruins. GJ!



Thanks man.
I just want to help people with the knowledge I have.
I also would like to learn new things too 

Oh and by the way the Crucial Ballistix I linked to you have lights on them as well.
Just some extra bling for you


----------



## bruins004 (May 9, 2007)

Added the RAM Section...
Let me know if anything needs more descriptions (besides the areas to be added soon)


----------



## surfsk8snow.jah (May 9, 2007)

Something I just thought about that might help users: pust the approximate price ranges for each build type of build.


----------



## BXtreme (May 9, 2007)

Woah! Incredible thread  I'm sure this'll get stickied 
and how about some good cases ?


----------



## ktr (May 9, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> High-end should have at least an 8800GTX. Top-of-the-line should have two.



GTX??? what about those $850 ultras 

my top of the line rig would be dual quads xeons, like 24+ gb of memory, 1x 88 ultra/x2900xtx (or two, depends if the mobo can do it)...etc..etc...etc...

*dreaming*


----------



## GJSNeptune (May 9, 2007)

Ultras are for idiots with money. 


You don't have room to dream! You have an X2.


----------



## ktr (May 9, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> Ultras are for idiots with money.
> 
> 
> You don't have room to dream! You have an X2.



I barely use that rig ...i dont know why, but i dont.  Kinda hard to decide on what computer to use when they both are equally the same performance.


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## GJSNeptune (May 9, 2007)

I'll take the one you don't want.


----------



## bruins004 (May 9, 2007)

Finished with the builds and added prices.
Only section not done yet is the CPU section


----------



## bruins004 (May 9, 2007)

Finished the CPU Buyers Guide Section

Added the GPU Buyers Guide and the PSU Buyers Guide, but havent started on them yet


----------



## bruins004 (May 9, 2007)

All Sections are completed, except the GPU Buyers guide.
Any feedback is appreciated


----------



## surfsk8snow.jah (May 10, 2007)

I think your prices are a little bit understated. I get around $1800US for high-end, $1200US for intermediate, and like $700US for Budget. The top-of-the-line sounds about right tho.

1)PSU: Nice, good section. I would add the COOLMAX CUG series in the intermediate PSUs tho, that series gets some good reviews from people (CTG is the suck one). And it's in the low 100s vs high, so thats good.
Question: Does a PSU have to SLI rated to run SLI? ofcourse nVidia says so, and so would the PSU companies, but is that necessarily always true?
2)Mobos (High-End & Top-o-Line): You might wanna add the 975x series in here. There's a lot of people who prefer these more than 680i, and they're pretty on-par with each other in OC-ability.
3)Add a HDD section? Describe to peeps the diff between the Raptors and Normal, "SATA2" (even tho it's not really called that), etc. 
4)And maybe a cooling section describing diff cooling options, good CPU fans & why, what makes a case fan good, etc. 

It Looks way good tho. I definitely vote for a sticky on this when its done. Fer sherr dyood. hah


----------



## surfsk8snow.jah (May 11, 2007)

Oh and another fan to add that's pretty good: Tuniq Tower. That thing tie with Thermalright 120 Ultra, and gets second only to Ultra 120 eXtreme.


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## bruins004 (May 11, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> Oh and another fan to add that's pretty good: Tuniq Tower. That thing tie with Thermalright 120 Ultra, and gets second only to Ultra 120 eXtreme.



Ahh thats it.
It was on the tip of my tongue, but I couldnt get it out will update it with that


----------



## bruins004 (May 11, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> I think your prices are a little bit understated. I get around $1800US for high-end, $1200US for intermediate, and like $700US for Budget. The top-of-the-line sounds about right tho.
> 
> 1)PSU: Nice, good section. I would add the COOLMAX CUG series in the intermediate PSUs tho, that series gets some good reviews from people (CTG is the suck one). And it's in the low 100s vs high, so thats good.
> Question: Does a PSU have to SLI rated to run SLI? ofcourse nVidia says so, and so would the PSU companies, but is that necessarily always true?
> ...



Sounds like good ideas.
I will add that PSU to the section.
After taking some looks at it, it isnt a bad one.

1.  An SLI Ready PSU is a PSU that comes with 2 PCI-Express connectors.
However, these PSUs are not mandatory to run SLI, however, you will need a PCI-Express to Molex Coneverter if you wish to run an SLI rig without an SLI PSU.

2.  I only know about a certain amount of mobos so I will need help with this section.  I know the DS3 and the 680 chipsets are pretty good, as well as the BadAxe.  After that I dont know too much else.

3 - 4.  Thats a good idea.  I want to add more sections, but I also want to finish the current ones that are up there as well.  About the cooling section, I only have used air cooling so I wont be able to include water or phase cooling w/o some help of course.]

EDIT: I will update this thread as soon as I can.  I am shooting for today, however, if not today than Monday I def. will be able to.
Keep rolling those ideas in here guys and any help you can give is always welcome.


----------



## bruins004 (May 11, 2007)

Updated the GPU section.
I still have to finish it though, but the Budget, Intermediate and High End are pretty much done.


----------



## ktr (May 11, 2007)

here is god like 

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showpost.php?p=333367&postcount=8


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 14, 2007)

ktr said:
			
		

> here is god like
> 
> http://forums.techpowerup.com/showpo...67&postcount=8


hahah v nice. That's... intense... extravagant to the extreme. But hey, I'm sure in, what, 4 years, that'll be the way things look.


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## DrunkenMafia (May 14, 2007)

There is some really good info there bruins....   very nice thread mate.  I was unaware of the problem with some 2ms lcd's getting stuck.  That is a handy hint.  

Good work


----------



## bruins004 (May 14, 2007)

DrunkenMafia said:


> There is some really good info there bruins....   very nice thread mate.  I was unaware of the problem with some 2ms lcd's getting stuck.  That is a handy hint.
> 
> Good work



Thanks man 
I always like helping people out.

With the 2ms LCD problems I found it kind of funny myself.
About a year ago they started to come out with these monitors (almost every company did).
And the funny thing (well kind of if you didnt own one) was that the monitor couldnt handle the fast responses and often got stuck so you had a infinite response time  

Anyways, sorry for the lack of updates, but like usual, I dont post on the weekends at TPU.
But you have me during the week.

Can anyone help me with the mobo section since that is my weak area in computers
Thanks again guys for the feedback.


----------



## bruins004 (May 14, 2007)

Just an update guys.
All sections are done except the following:
VII. Motherboard Buyers Guide
VIII. Hard Drive Buyers Guide
IX. Cooling Buyers Guide


----------



## Zeratul_uy (May 15, 2007)

Excellent ^^ it helped me a lot, thx


----------



## anticlutch (May 15, 2007)

> 3. Logitech XV Revolution



Did you mean the VX Revolution? or the MX?


----------



## bruins004 (May 15, 2007)

anticlutch said:


> Did you mean the VX Revolution? or the MX?



Nice catch.
It is suppose to be the VX Revolution.
Fixed.

Thanks for looking through it



Zeratul_uy said:


> Excellent ^^ it helped me a lot, thx



Always glad I can help.

By the way what did you choose to get?


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 15, 2007)

WE'VE BEEN STICKIED!!! w000000t! Big ups to bruins004! 
I should hopefully be able to post some mobos stuff tomorrow morn - it's a lil late atm. I've been researching a little bit lately, so I'll offer at least what I know.
Congrats again!


----------



## bruins004 (May 15, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> WE'VE BEEN STICKIED!!! w000000t! Big ups to bruins004!
> I should hopefully be able to post some mobos stuff tomorrow morn - it's a lil late atm. I've been researching a little bit lately, so I'll offer at least what I know.
> Congrats again!



Haha thanks man.
Hey you have helped out quite a bit too so congrads to you too.
I appreciate the help and I am always open to it since I want to learn too.

EDIT: I also have added a sub-section to each section called "Basics".
Pretty much this section will help users understand the basics of how each component works.
I already have this done for PSUs, GPUs and LCDs.
I am going to add it for CPUs, Motherboards, Hard Drives, RAM and Cooling Devices 

If you believe any else should be added just let me know.


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## suraswami (May 15, 2007)

Nice Thread bruins004.

Could you also add some TV tuners (preferably HD tuners) and Video capture cards for those Media Center PC fans?

And also some media center specific cases.  I have a Ahanix and it is wonderful.

I am trying to add a HD tuner card and would benefit if you can add information about HD tuners. 

Thanks.


----------



## bruins004 (May 15, 2007)

suraswami said:


> Nice Thread bruins004.
> 
> Could you also add some TV tuners (preferably HD tuners) and Video capture cards for those Media Center PC fans?
> 
> ...



Good Idea.
Unfortunately I dont know too much about tuner cards myself.

Also, as for cases, I was going to include this section, however, there are some many cases and people usually prefer different types that it really doesnt matter which case you pick, just as long as you have proper cooling in your case.
I would suggest though that it should have at least 3 fans if you going for air cooling.
This is pretty standard these days as most cases have 1 front fan and 1 side fan for an intake and 1 back fan for exhaust.

EDIT: I unfort. couldnt update much today (way too busy).
I will update more tomorrow, however, I am almost done with the DDR2 section and I am looking to moving onto cooling and HDs


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## GJSNeptune (May 15, 2007)

Regarding cases, you could remind people to make sure the case they have in mind supports the motherboard they're considering. Make sure they match mATX to mATX, or that the ATX case has the holes for mATX, etc.

Also describe intake vs. exhaust for air-cooled and other stuff about cases. Doors, HDD racks, I dunno. Or maybe just add a Cooling section.


----------



## bruins004 (May 15, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> Regarding cases, you could remind people to make sure the case they have in mind supports the motherboard they're considering. Make sure they match mATX to mATX, or that the ATX case has the holes for mATX, etc.
> 
> Also describe intake vs. exhaust for air-cooled and other stuff about cases. Doors, HDD racks, I dunno. Or maybe just add a Cooling section.



Yea I was looking to add the intake vs. exhaust in the Cooling Section I have.

But you do bring up a good point about the doors, HDDs, and the other items.
Not a bad idea.
I will add the section and will work on it later on.


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## bruins004 (May 16, 2007)

Ok guys its a late update today due to the busy day.
I just finished the RAM basics part.
Obv. it is more confusing than the other parts.

Please let me know if I can word parts of this section differently if it does not make sense.
I will add a little more tomorrow for frequencies of RAM.

After that I will move onto HDDs.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 16, 2007)

Ya I've been busy too man. But here's some stuff to hopefully help out:

DDR2 Section: 1) Mention somewhere in this article that DDR & GDDR are totally different and are 100% uncorrelated to each other.
2)
Here's a more indepth explanation of memory timings I found, in case you want to use it or pull from it:
"
CAS:

CAS is Column Address Strobe or Column Address Select. CAS controls the amount of time (in cycles (2, 2.5,& 3) between receiving a command and acting on that command. Since CAS primarily controls the location of HEX addresses, or memory columns, within the memory matrix, this is the most important timing to set as low as your system will stably accept it. There are both rows and columns inside a memory matrix. When the request is first electronically set on the memory pins, the first triggered response is tRAS (Active to Precharge Delay). Data requested electronically is precharge, and the memory actually going to initiate RAS is activation. Once tRAS is active, RAS, or Row Address Strobe begins to find one half of the address for the required data. Once the row is located, tRCD is initiated, cycles out, and then the exact HEX location of the data required is accessed via CAS. The time between CAS start and CAS end is the CAS latency. Since CAS is the last stage in actually finding the proper data, it's the most important step of memory timing.

tRCD:

Also known as RAS to CAS Delay, in addition to Column Address Strobe, there is Row Address Strobe. CAS and RAS combined allow for the exact location of memory blocks. There is an interval between RAS (activated when data is first requested) and CAS (activated when RAS is complete), as memory can't locate a block precisely in a single stage. tRCD is the cycle time between the first stage in memory access, the row strobe, and the second stage. However, the performance impact of this setting is often neglible, as memory tries to store data from programs in sequential order. It tries to keep the same row for a single program, and ordered columns to reduce the time for tRCD.

tRP:

Also known as RAS Precharge, this is the amount of time it takes for memory to terminate the access in one row and begin another. To put it simply, after data is set to the pins and activates tRAS, then RAS, tRCD, and CAS; the memory needs to terminate its current row and start all over at tRAS. This is the very basic function of how memory works. This is only an important setting when you're doing massive shifting in data, for example - working with large virtual buffers or video rendering. At that point, several rows are being consumed by a single program, and its advantageous for the program to be able to switch quickly between these rows.

tRAS:

Also known as Active to Precharge Delay, this is the time between receiving a request for data electronically on the pins of a memory module and then initiating RAS to start the actual retrieval of data. This command seems important, but really it isn't. Memory access is a very dynamic thing. Sometimes memory is being hit hard, and other times very sporadically. Though at all times, memory access is at constant, therefore, it is rare that the tRAS command is received to access new data (such as a substantial change, like opening a new program). "
This is obviously a little more in depth, maybe too much for "Basics," but whatever you can pull is good. The current explanation you put up for the tRP is a little confusing.
Or just use the techPowerUp! explanation: http://www.techpowerup.com/articles/overclocking/AMD/memory/131


----------



## surfsk8snow.jah (May 16, 2007)

3)Cooling: 
Here's some help there. It's probably not very organized, or perfectly coherent, but here's something to go off of:

Cooling Can Be Either Passive or Active.
Passive (Conduction & Free Convection) - Generally Heatsinks that disperse heat through metal fins into the ambient environment. These generate no sound.
Active (Forced Convection) - Forces flow of air or liquid past the object needing cooling (or a heatsink attached to it), e.g. - fans. This is always more efficient than Passive Cooling. There are always inherent noise levels as sound is generated. 

Here are the 3 most popular options for cooling:
 I)Air Cooling - Currently the best is the ThermalRight Ultra-120 eXtreme, with the Tuniq Tower & ThermalRight Ultra-120 following closely behind. Here's a picture of benchmarks with all the leading air coolers right now: 





here's another image of the top leading fans: temperature vs. overclocking speed on Intel Core 2 Duo X6800 [from anandtech]:




and the link to the review:
http://www.anandtech.com/casecooling/showdoc.aspx?i=2981&p=3
Zalmans are cheaper and self-contained (don't need to buy a fan) and pretty, Tuniq is self-contained but a little more expensive, TR Ultras are not self-contained and most expensive (but best performance). 

II) Peltier (Thermoelectric) Cooling - "They have a Thermoelectric plate attached to them. In simple terms, a peltier (or TEC as it's sometimes called) is basically 2 disimilar metals fused together, and when you apply voltage to them a certain way, one side gets hot and the other gets cold. On the Ultra. the cold side goes on the cpu, and the hot side gets cooled by heatpipes and the heatsink. It's all controlled by the bay accessory that they give you, to ensure that the pelt doesn't get below ambient temps, and cause condensation." - qtd. Wile_E :: Generally pretty expensive, upwards of $100.

III) Water/Liquid Cooling - I have no experience with this, and know very little about it. All I know is that flowing liquid is the best possible means of cooling anything, especially a liquid with a high specific heat (thus radiator fluid vs. water in cars, etc.). As to application to computers, there's a lot of technical details I do not know.

There are also other coolers that are worth looking at, especially if overclocking or using high performance components: Northbridge/Southbridge Coolers,  DIMM coolers , HDD coolers, VGA Coolers, Mosfet Coolers.


Fans: Pay attention to CFM (Cubic Feet Per Minute) Rating - want high, RPMS (Rotations per Minute) - want variable, dB (decibel - sound intensity) rating - want low, fan size - large = low frequency noise (deep humming), small = high frequency noise (high pitch screaming).


Hopefully I should be able to throw some mobo info up soon. School's keepin me busy atm. Hope this helps.


----------



## bruins004 (May 16, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> Ya I've been busy too man. But here's some stuff to hopefully help out:
> 
> DDR2 Section: 1) Mention somewhere in this article that DDR & GDDR are totally different and are 100% uncorrelated to each other.
> 2)
> ...



Very nice and descriptive.
I am afraid that might confuse people so I just wanted to sum it up in one sentence and give them the basics.

As for the cooling section, very nice.
I have to look into more, but I skimmed over it and it looks good.
Once I finish the HDD section I will start with the cooling.


----------



## bruins004 (May 16, 2007)

Ok had some time to work on this.
Finished the CPU basics section.
Added Ram speeds to the DDR basics section.

Also, began the HD section and I am almost done.
I just have to finish the RAID section.


----------



## surfsk8snow.jah (May 16, 2007)

Best resource I've found for explanation of RAID setups in two years: 
http://www.acnc.com/raid.html

Wikipedia's (not to shabby) attempt: 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_RAID_levels

Remember to note that RAID 0 is not really a true RAID array. It doesn't have data redundancy, as it simply stripes data across two drives to take advantage of reading from both drives concurrently (faster). 

Go back through and re-read the whole thing once. There's a few typos (minor thing), and the tRP explanation under memory timings is chopped up somehow. 

Looks good tho. Keep it coming, and you'll have to start chargin people for this.


----------



## bruins004 (May 16, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> Best resource I've found for explanation of RAID setups in two years:
> http://www.acnc.com/raid.html
> 
> Wikipedia's (not to shabby) attempt:
> ...



Haha thanks.
As for the RAIDs, I used to set them up all the time, so I dont really need a link for them.

I havent read through the whole thing yet, just bits and pieces.
It would help if you could point it out as it is getting hard to update this week since I have been extremely busy and have little time to re-read through it.


----------



## suraswami (May 16, 2007)

bruins004 said:


> Good Idea.
> Unfortunately I dont know too much about tuner cards myself.



Please look at my thread

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=338801#post338801

May be this can add some value.


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## bruins004 (May 17, 2007)

suraswami said:


> Please look at my thread
> 
> http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=338801#post338801
> 
> May be this can add some value.



This can be useful.
I will refer to it later on when I decide to add this section since I still have 3 main sections left (mobos, cooling and cases).

EDIT: Just updated and finished the Hard Drive section.


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## DRDNA (May 19, 2007)

hey how is this PSU>>>>   http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817256020  thinking about buying this to replace my POS OCZ ProXStream 1000watt that died for the second time .My poor EnerMax is currently being abused.

PCI-E Connectors 4 x PCI-E 6Pin
2 x PCI-E 8Pin (NICE)


----------



## GJSNeptune (May 19, 2007)

Silverstone PSUs are good, although their quality is probably similar to OCZ's. I'm not sure who makes Silverstone's.


----------



## erocker (May 19, 2007)

I would consider that a high-end PSU.  A very good and reputable company.


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## bruins004 (May 21, 2007)

DRDNA said:


> hey how is this PSU>>>>   http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817256020  thinking about buying this to replace my POS OCZ ProXStream 1000watt that died for the second time .My poor EnerMax is currently being abused.
> 
> PCI-E Connectors 4 x PCI-E 6Pin
> 2 x PCI-E 8Pin (NICE)



Silverstone is a great company.
The only two better companies out there are Zippy (very hard to find these) and PC Power and Cooling.

By the way why do you need a 1000W PSU?
Seems like overkill since an 8800Ultra SLI system with the most powerful CPU w/ the works will not require 1000Watts.
I would recommend an 750W or 800.
That will power anything as well and save you some money.


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## plamen (May 21, 2007)

great work


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## ex_reven (May 21, 2007)

This is a totally awesome Idea, but keeping it updated is going to totally suck for one person to do. Perhaps the thread should be replicated in the TPU wiki, so that any member can edit the hardware as they see fit in the light of new technological advances 

Then, that way, if there are major edits to the wiki it can be copied and pasted from the wiki into the first post to update the hardware AND if someone screws with the wiki by spamming the article you could just revert the article . Keep the thread alive though, the wiki doesnt get accessed often...

Good work


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## bruins004 (May 21, 2007)

ex_reven said:


> This is a totally awesome Idea, but keeping it updated is going to totally suck for one person to do. Perhaps the thread should be replicated in the TPU wiki, so that any member can edit the hardware as they see fit in the light of new technological advances
> 
> Then, that way, if there are major edits to the wiki it can be copied and pasted from the wiki into the first post to update the hardware AND if someone screws with the wiki by spamming the article you could just revert the article . Keep the thread alive though, the wiki doesnt get accessed often...
> 
> Good work




THanks guys.
I figured it would be very helpful.
Now I just gotta get people to see it more 

Yes Ex I was thinking of doing that, however, I dont want to put it in the Wiki until I finish the rest of the sections.
Just to note, I already updated the new ATI card in the GPU section.

The sections that will only really change drastically are the GPU, CPU, Mobo and Builds sections.
So it shouldnt be as bad as people think since many of the other sections dont change very often


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## Kusimeka (May 22, 2007)

Best guide i've ever seen! answered all my questions and more! 

Thanks Alot!!

A++++


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## bruins004 (May 22, 2007)

Always good to receive a compliment.
Thanks for it and I am glad it helped you


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## bruins004 (May 25, 2007)

Sorry for the limited updates.
I have been extremely busy this week.
Anyone have any info or help on the mobos section and I will include it.

Thanks for the help


----------



## GJSNeptune (May 25, 2007)

Discuss the different sizes. ATX, mATX, uATX, etc. Mention how important it is to match chips to sockets. There are AMD boards and Intel boards. I don't know how in-depth you want to go, whether you want to discuss the different parts of a motherboard. Northbridge, chipset, socket, RAM slots, I/O, all that stuff.


There are definitely some brands to try to avoid and ones to consider, although all makers have good and bad. Not all boards OC well. Some are reasonable OCers, and some offer rock-solid stable overclocking goodness.

Usually, good boards come from Abit, ASUS, EVGA, MSI, DFI, ASRock, etc., and usually Foxconn, and maybe Gigabyte, maybe Biostar. I don't know much about Elitegroup or other brands.

What else is there? I'm blanking.


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## GJSNeptune (May 25, 2007)

Some motherboard basics:

There are two ways to select a motherboard. Either you start with it, or you're matching it to components you already have or know you want to get. Whichever path you take, here is some basic information to help you.

You start out at a fork in the road. Intel or AMD? From there you determine the socket type. Right now, AMD's Sockets 939 and AM2 are very popular, as is Intel's LGA775. If you're fairly fresh to the guts of a computer, you'll probably be swimming in a big puddle of socket goo. Don't worry. The most important thing at this point is to make sure the motherboard supports the CPU, or vice versa. If you're browsing online retailers, the socket type should be easy to identify on both components.

The next step revolve around the size of the motherboard:

*Common Motherboard Form Factors*
-ATX
-mATX
-BTX
-mBTX

For more information, check out motherboard form factors on Wikipedia.

At this point, you want to make sure your motherboard is supported by the case you want or will use. Most ATX cases will also have screw mounts for mATX boards. Some will just be riddled with screw mounts to support more than the ATX form factor.

If you don't know much about motherboards, browse the many boards on sites such as Newegg and look at the pictures. Most have labels for the different parts commonly found on motherboards. These include RAM slots (DIMMs), SATA and IDE ports, AGP and PCI/PCI-E slots, etc. You could also factor in RAID support.

Depending on your budget and/or needs, a video card may be desired. If you plan to buy one, you'll save time by looking only at motherboards *without* onboard/integrated video. If your budget's tight, and your gaming is non-existent or as extensive as Solitaire and maybe a fancy screensaver, onboard video is perfect for you.

Aside from a good power supply, the (aptly named) motherboard is the center and easily the most important component in a system. This is so because it facilitates everything connected to it.

Regarding overclocking, if you plan to OC, you'll want to make sure the board you have your eye(s) on is good for it. Some boards flat-out suck. Some boards are okay, but probably won't push your CPU/RAM very much before becoming unstable. Some boards are rock-solid for overclocking. The best way to determine is to Google the board and/or hop onto a good forum and ask around. You'll want more than just the reviews on retailer sites.

Overclocking (OCing) can apply to your CPU, RAM, and graphics port(s). This basically means changing the voltage the motherboard applies to these components. People most commonly overclock their CPU. Many also overclock their RAM to achieve better timings. I do not recommend overclocking graphics ports. Doing so carries the most risk. Do so only if you're an expert, filthy rich, a computer/electric/mechanical engineering student, or it's on old, cheap components.

Overclocking doesn't appeal to everyone. Don't brush off a motherboard because it has bad reviews. Sometimes the bad reviews are regarding its ability to overclock. If you don't plan to OC, chances are it's still a good board to run your components at stock speeds.

The following list is in no particular order, and all brands are going to have sub par and great boards. Don't blindly buy a motherboard. Definitely do your research (like you should for everything).

*Go-to Motherboard Brands*
-Abit
-ASUS
-EVGA
-MSI
-DFI
-ASrock

Usually you also can expect good things from Gigabyte and Foxconn, and maybe Biostar. There's also Elitegroup, but I don't know much about them.



I know I'm leaving out a bunch of stuff. I'm at work, and now I gotta do some work. Should give you a good start though.


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## Kusimeka (May 26, 2007)

Hi there again, i saw on your guide you put an AMD platform will benefit from tighter timings and lower freq. For example DDR2-800 3-3-3-9will be better than DDR2-1000 5-5-5-15.

Is this benefit a big deal? the ram i wanted to get has 4-4-4-15, and im running AMD, would this be alright or should i look for diffrent ram? with tighter timings?

Thanks!

Kusi.


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## bruins004 (May 26, 2007)

Kusimeka said:


> Hi there again, i saw on your guide you put an AMD platform will benefit from tighter timings and lower freq. For example DDR2-800 3-3-3-9will be better than DDR2-1000 5-5-5-15.
> 
> Is this benefit a big deal? the ram i wanted to get has 4-4-4-15, and im running AMD, would this be alright or should i look for diffrent ram? with tighter timings?
> 
> ...



Its just that they perform slightly better.
That RAM would be fine for an AMD system.
For example that RAM would perform better than most 5-5-5-15 RAM.


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## Kusimeka (May 26, 2007)

ahh thats alright then, cause i dident wanna go buy this ram, when for a bit more or even less i coudl get ram that would peform better, aslong as its not a big deal, then its fine 

Thanks Alot!


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## bruins004 (May 29, 2007)

Kusimeka said:


> ahh thats alright then, cause i dident wanna go buy this ram, when for a bit more or even less i coudl get ram that would peform better, aslong as its not a big deal, then its fine
> 
> Thanks Alot!



Hey no prob. man.
Hopefully tom. I will be able to update this guide a little bit.
It would be nice to get another section done and for this thread to get more exposure


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## surfsk8snow.jah (May 29, 2007)

Ya gj on everything. 
Once the thread is finished, we should re-create it, and rename it "HOW TO: Build a Computer." -lol


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## bruins004 (May 29, 2007)

Thanks 

I am now one step closer to finishing the first pass.
I have just finished the case section and now just have the mobo and cooling sections left.


----------



## GJSNeptune (May 29, 2007)

Did you catch my stuff above?


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## bruins004 (May 29, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> Did you catch my stuff above?



Yes I have and thanks for the help.
I was going to add it right now, but my internet is slow.
I will try to add it later.


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## Kusimeka (Jun 4, 2007)

Hi again, sorry about another question, i know your probably sick of me by now 

I just wanted to know, i decided to go with the G.Skill (Black Heatspreaders) after long thought, and i'm sure i read somewhere they only work with Intel, is this true, because im on AMD till my next upgrade, so would like to know.

Also do you know a good place to get them in the UK, since i live in the UK and it seems like Newegg dont ship to UK.

Thanks!!


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## bruins004 (Jun 5, 2007)

Kusimeka said:


> Hi again, sorry about another question, i know your probably sick of me by now
> 
> I just wanted to know, i decided to go with the G.Skill (Black Heatspreaders) after long thought, and i'm sure i read somewhere they only work with Intel, is this true, because im on AMD till my next upgrade, so would like to know.
> 
> ...



Hey no problem.
I love helping out you guys.
I actually havent posted in a few days, but I figure I would break that trend with you today 

I am curious where you read that those memory sticks are for Intel systems only.
If they are these sticks http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231065 , then they will work with an AMD or Intel system.

Also, what mobo are you looking at or have?
I just want to make sure it isnt a mobo that is picky about its RAM (like DFI).


----------



## GJSNeptune (Jun 5, 2007)

We should probably have a section about putting the components together. Not everyone wanting help picking parts is going to know how they go together.

You know, for the complete noobs.


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## Kusimeka (Jun 5, 2007)

Thats awesome thanks, and we love recieving your top quality advice 

Yeah thats the ram i was looking at, http://www.memory-configurator.com/...C2_6400_HZ_Series_Dual_Channel_kit/index.html is where i saw it, 2nd sentance down.

My current motherboard is MS - 7125 1.0 (nforce4)

Its pretty old, the one i'm looking to upgrade to is: http://www.microdirect.co.uk/(14561)Asus-P5B-Skt-775-Intel-P965-Core2-Extreme.aspx

Though, my overall specs i'm going to get are:

E6600 Core 2 duo

8800 gts or gtx ( i cant decide because of the huge diffrence in heat, would like to know your opionion if possible )

Antec 900 case

the g.skill (black heatspreaders)

But the only thing i dont know what to get is a motherboard!! i hope that one is ok, cause i cant really aford to spend a fortune on a motherboard hence i'm already spending alot (considering i havet to buy from UK sites) and cant use newegg which almost doubles in price !

But if it means having a much longer lasting and better performance motherboard for some more i'd rather save for that 

Thanks Alot!!!


----------



## bruins004 (Jun 5, 2007)

GJSNeptune said:


> We should probably have a section about putting the components together. Not everyone wanting help picking parts is going to know how they go together.
> 
> You know, for the complete noobs.



I agree with you.
However, I know there is a build guide here on TPU.
I will just link it to that.
Good idea Neptune (like always).



Kusimeka said:


> Thats awesome thanks, and we love recieving your top quality advice
> 
> Yeah thats the ram i was looking at, http://www.memory-configurator.com/...C2_6400_HZ_Series_Dual_Channel_kit/index.html is where i saw it, 2nd sentance down.
> 
> ...



Not a bad mobo.
You might want to also look at the Gigabyte DS3 mobo.
They arent that expensive and pack a good punch.
I have heard a lot of good things about them


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## bruins004 (Jun 5, 2007)

Sorry for the double post.
I just added this to the wiki
It is located here http://reference.techpowerup.com/Category_talk:Guides

Please help out and contribute to the 2 remaining sections, cooling and mobo thanks.


----------



## Kusimeka (Jun 5, 2007)

Thanks for that, i was looking at the DS3 before, but i heard they dont like micron d9 chips, and refuse to overclock much on them, only what i heard though, could be wrong.

Thanks though!!


----------



## bruins004 (Jun 5, 2007)

Kusimeka said:


> Thanks for that, i was looking at the DS3 before, but i heard they dont like micron d9 chips, and refuse to overclock much on them, only what i heard though, could be wrong.
> 
> Thanks though!!



I believe that depends on the version you get.
The early revisions of this board had a bit of problems, but I think the newer ones are better now.

I would suggest a 650i board, but they arent supported that well.

The Asus doesnt look like a bad board.
You will prob. have to play with the voltages though since Asus boards usually have lenient defaults set


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## Kusimeka (Jun 5, 2007)

ahh i see, could you give me a link to one of these newer versions? so i could get a look at what they are, also being honest i dont actuley know what 650i is, or what it does, motherboards is from the most confusing for me, i've got everything set now exept a mobo.


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## bruins004 (Jun 5, 2007)

Kusimeka said:


> ahh i see, could you give me a link to one of these newer versions? so i could get a look at what they are, also being honest i dont actuley know what 650i is, or what it does, motherboards is from the most confusing for me, i've got everything set now exept a mobo.



The 650i motherboards are like the 680i motherboards.
They are C2D motherboards that offer SLI support.
However, the main difference (besides the support for them and price) is that the 650i motherboards have 2 PCI-E x16 Slots that work at x8 x8 in SLI mode.
The 680i has 3 PCI-E x16 slots, 2 of which work at x16 x16 in SLI mode.

The 680i boards (the first one made by EVGA) are high end mobos since they offer many different options at a premium.

I do not know the latest revision of the DS3 boards.
I would imagine it is the current ones they are sending out.
Why dont you ask in the mobo section, bc I dont think the DS3 has any problems with Micron D9 chips anymore.


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## bruins004 (Jun 5, 2007)

I have just updated the thread.

1.  Put a link to the wiki article.

2.  Added some mobo information thanks the GJSNeptune (Please note its almost a copied paste version from your post, I will eventually change it up a bit so please bare with me - I did change a little bit but not much at the moment)

3.  Put a link to a build guide

4.  Added a thanks section

5.  Fixed up the bottom of the first thread


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## Kusimeka (Jun 5, 2007)

Thanks man, great work! also glad to see the mobo section coming along, been looking forward to it


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## bruins004 (Jun 6, 2007)

Kusimeka said:


> Thanks man, great work! also glad to see the mobo section coming along, been looking forward to it



Always happy to help.
Yea we are getting there 
Thanks to some help of course.
Just gotta finish up the mobo section, the cooling section and then revise a bit since some price drops did happen


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## bruins004 (Jun 6, 2007)

Updated the motherboard section.
Fixed up the basics area and started the budget, intermediate and high end motherboards.
Also, I am going to add a Sound Cards Section (I knew I forgot something).

I can use some help on the Cooling Section and any good buys for the motherboards section


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Jun 7, 2007)

Did you get my info earlier that i wrote for the cooling section?


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## bruins004 (Jun 7, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> Did you get my info earlier that i wrote for the cooling section?



Haha I knew someone gave me cooling info.
Would it offend you if I asked if you could post it again.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Jun 7, 2007)

no worries, it's on Page 3 of this thread. Here, I'll link to it: http://forums.techpowerup.com/showpost.php?p=338228&postcount=69


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## bruins004 (Jun 7, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> no worries, it's on Page 3 of this thread. Here, I'll link to it: http://forums.techpowerup.com/showpost.php?p=338228&postcount=69



Sweet.
I will take a look at this and format it up a bit.
Prob. tomorrow or Fri (depending on how busy it is)

Also, have any good budget, intermediate or high end motherboards?


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## Sovereign (Jun 22, 2007)

WoW! Can't believe I've never noticed this before! Nice job!

Was just thinking, how about adding some info on companies that specialize in "pick and choose your own custom pc" builds? it's an option to consider if you want that _custom_ build feel but don't know how to or want to bother with building it yourself.

www.cyberpowerpc.com is one that I know of.

They offer a decent _budget_ build for roughly $670 USD and consists of (most of which can be upgraded or downgraded) plus a 3 year standard warranty :

*CASE*: ($20 off Mail-in Rebate) Xion III Gaming Mid-Tower 420W Case with Side Window (BLACK COLOR)
*CPU*: (Socket AM2) AMD Athlon™64 X2 4800+ Dual-Core CPU w/ HyperTransport Technology
*MOTHERBOARD*: (Socket AM2)MSI K9N4 SLI-F nForce 500 SLI Chipset DDR2/800 SATA-II RAID MBoard w/ Dual 16x PCI-Express
*MEMORY*: (Req.DDR2 MainBoard)1GB (2x512MB) PC6400 DDR2/800 Dual Channel Memory (Mushkin Xtreme w/ Heat Spreader)
*VIDEO CARD*: NEW !!! NVIDIA GeForce 7600 GT 256MB PCI Express x16 (Major Brand Powered by NVIDIA)
*VIDEO CARD 2*: NONE
*LCD Monitor*: NONE
*HARD DRIVE*: Single Hard Drive (250GB SATA-II 3.0Gb/s 8MB Cache 7200RPM HDD)
*Data Hard Drive*: NONE
*Optical Drive*: (Special Price) 18X DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW DRIVE DUAL LAYER (BLACK COLOR)
*Optical Drive 2*: 16X DVD ROM (BLACK COLOR)
*SOUND*: HIGH DEFINITION ON-BOARD 7.1 AUDIO

You also get bundled stuff such as internal media card reader, Keyboard & Mouse, Software, speakers and other stuff you don't normaly get when building your own custom built PC. Now thats a decent X2 4800+ AM2 PC with a Geforce 7600GT & 3 year warranty for less than the price of the custom budget build you have listed. You get everything but a monitor with this setup.


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## GJSNeptune (Jun 22, 2007)

I've heard nothing but bad things about CyberPowerPC.

There's a new saying...CyberPowerFucked.


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## nflesher87 (Jul 4, 2007)

hey guys this may be a dumb question but it's about RAID 0
I've always been under the impression that 0 required drives with identical amounts of space (i.e. 80 and 80 or 160 and 160)
however, building my new system I've been interested to consider running 0 but can't find this stipulation anywhere... any explanation only notes "2 drives"
anyone know?


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Jul 5, 2007)

Yes in a RAID 0 setup, you can use 2 drives of different sizes, however, the RAID array only builds to the size of the smaller drive. 
Ex. If you setup a RAID 0 installation using 2 drives, one 120GB Drive and one 100GB Drive, your new RAID 0 combined drive will be 200 GB.
The size equation is then expanded to more than 2 disks by:

Total Drive Size = n * MIN(size[0], size[1], size[2]... size[n-1])
Where n is the # of disks used to build the RAID 0 array, and those are the respective sizes of each independent disk in the array.

Examine the links in the following post for more information : 
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showpost.php?p=338653&postcount=72


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Aug 1, 2007)

BUMP.

How's thing thread doin btw? Should we update it? Is it helpful to anyone? 
Anyone wanna add some more stuff?


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## bruins004 (Aug 1, 2007)

surfsk8snow.jah said:


> BUMP.
> 
> How's thing thread doin btw? Should we update it? Is it helpful to anyone?
> Anyone wanna add some more stuff?



I have included the place in the wiki where any users can help me with this thread.
I unfort. have not had much time to work on this lately.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Aug 2, 2007)

Oh no worries mate I was just wondering. I never actually built that computer way back, cuz I didn't have the budget for it back then. Now I finally have the money that I need (w00t -got my first paycheck as a Structural Engineer-  ), so I was checkin this thread again for info/advice, that's all. I'll prob end up re-researching all the latest parts, so I'll throw whatever new info I find on here for everyone. 
And I'll put up my finalized set-up after I buy it, and let you know how the build goes.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Sep 20, 2007)

Figured I'd bump this thing, and again comment on its amazingness. If people just studied this thing for a lil first when they got here, it would save them and everyone else on TPU a lot of time lol.
It could maybe use an update to a couple sections coming up soon. I should check out the wiki too, see if that's comin along.


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Oct 25, 2007)

Sweet, good to know! Hope your build goes well.


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## Waldoinsc (Apr 25, 2008)

*CPU id #...is it a B3 Phenom*

I just recieved my shiney new Phenom 9850 Black Edition for my latest build (Gigabyte MA790X-DS4, 4GB DDR2-1066, ITB RAID0), and I'm trying to validate the product number, but cannot locate the guide on AMD's website. I'm almost certain this is a B3 stepping, but want to make sure...call me paranoid (the date stamp on the chip shows AMD 2006).  The CPU label stamp shows:

AMD Phenom
HD985ZXAJ4BGH
JAAFB  AA 0811BPMW
9503964C80226

 Anyone know if this is B3 stepping?


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## erocker (Apr 25, 2008)

All 9850 Phenoms are B3.


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## nflesher87 (Apr 25, 2008)

wow out of the archive lol


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## Waldoinsc (Apr 25, 2008)

erocker said:


> All 9850 Phenoms are B3.



yeah, the 2006 date on the CPU case just worried me...the Phenom's with the erradata were the even hundreds (i.e. 9600) and the B3's are redesignated as the 50's (9850, 9650, etc)...it just doesn't show it on the CPU case directly, and I couldn't find any cross-reference list on AMD's website to verify the info stamped on the IHS.


----------



## steelkane (May 6, 2008)

I enjoyed your guide, Very detailed


----------



## Atnevon (May 28, 2008)

Nice Guide. I had a great deal of questions answered here.


----------



## PapawHam (Jun 10, 2008)

*Great Info answers a lot of questions, But?*

WIth the release of MS Home Server 2008 does anyone have this kind of information on building a home multi-use server for a home network (Media-Center, Gaming, and yea for use with work (VPN support to Hospitals).  have had some suggestions but I am looking to dual or multi core processing, maximun ram, digital conversion of (Don't laugh) Vinyl 33 1/3 records to CD/MP3, Home videos, and a lot of storage for Photos (Daughter is a photographer, and then there is the 6 grandkids that each want to play on a computer.

Did I mention the Tech support for hospitals would like to use 3 or 4 monitors.

Well if anyone has some guidance I am all ears.

Thanks and keep up the great work you are all doing to help others.

PapawHam


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## miniquake32 (Jun 23, 2008)

how long did that take you? lol


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## NeotonicDragon3 (Jul 5, 2008)

Thanks, This helps me


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## MacGyverX (Oct 5, 2008)

This is just to add to what Is here, Great advice and If you go to purchase a SATA hardrive and want them in raid configuration make sure they are all the same speed on the raid chain otherwise they all will perform at the speed of the slowest drive and you wont get the performance from the faster drives just thought id add that. Great Guide


----------



## omiknight52 (Oct 22, 2008)

Great Guide


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## scaremonger (Nov 23, 2008)

*up grade*

hey there. i have to tell you that im inpressed with the fact that there is someone out there who would just be happy to help someone else. you rule. so. my situation is this. i went out and bouhgt far cry 2 and it seems that my comp is just not able to run it. so the first thing i did was buy ram. I now have 2 gigs of ram. well that din;t work so then i went on ebay ang got a great deal on an intel duo e86oo. now i found out that my motherboard is not compatiblel. the guy that sold me the cpu gave me this site and said you guys were good guys and would be willing to help. because my comp is bout 4 years old i want to upgrade what i can to finaly play far cry 2. yes im a gamer. im a fast learner but it has to be tought right. if that makes any sence. thanks


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## mlee49 (Dec 5, 2008)

Bruins04:

Hey man you have a great guide here, but it is sorely out dated.  Please please please update with current gen equipement.  If not the original post is in dire needs of being marked that the details are over a year old!


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Dec 5, 2008)

I definitely agree. I forgot about this thread; was one of the contributing original members. Bruins, are you still around?


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Dec 5, 2008)

scaremonger said:


> hey there. i have to tell you that im inpressed with the fact that there is someone out there who would just be happy to help someone else. you rule. so. my situation is this. i went out and bouhgt far cry 2 and it seems that my comp is just not able to run it. so the first thing i did was buy ram. I now have 2 gigs of ram. well that din;t work so then i went on ebay ang got a great deal on an intel duo e86oo. now i found out that my motherboard is not compatiblel. the guy that sold me the cpu gave me this site and said you guys were good guys and would be willing to help. because my comp is bout 4 years old i want to upgrade what i can to finaly play far cry 2. yes im a gamer. im a fast learner but it has to be tought right. if that makes any sence. thanks



I would say make a new thread, and list your complete system specs in that thread, then PM me the title.
If your profile specs are right, its because you have an AMD currently, which is not compatible with intel proc. We'll have to figure out what the best possible AMD proc u can get for that board is. That, or u need to get an intel board. E8600 is dope tho, u won't be dissatisfied.


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## DonInKansas (Dec 10, 2008)

mlee49 said:


> Bruins04:
> 
> Hey man you have a great guide here, but it is sorely out dated.  Please please please update with current gen equipement.  If not the original post is in dire needs of being marked that the details are over a year old!



It is.  There's a post date with every post.


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## bruins004 (Dec 19, 2008)

Its has been a while.
Sorry about that, but have been busy.
If you guys want to help me out I am all for that just send me a PM with info on the area u want to help out with since I cant really update all of it.
It is just such a beast to update by myself (really just need the build and deals sections updated).
I will give credit when due.



surfsk8snow.jah said:


> I definitely agree. I forgot about this thread; was one of the contributing original members. Bruins, are you still around?



Yea I am around from time to time.
Havent been too much in the last 6 months though.
Wow am I the oldest member here these days.

By the way congrads surfsk8snow, forgot to say that in the PM I sent you.


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## bruins004 (Dec 19, 2008)

scaremonger said:


> hey there. i have to tell you that im inpressed with the fact that there is someone out there who would just be happy to help someone else. you rule. so. my situation is this. i went out and bouhgt far cry 2 and it seems that my comp is just not able to run it. so the first thing i did was buy ram. I now have 2 gigs of ram. well that din;t work so then i went on ebay ang got a great deal on an intel duo e86oo. now i found out that my motherboard is not compatiblel. the guy that sold me the cpu gave me this site and said you guys were good guys and would be willing to help. because my comp is bout 4 years old i want to upgrade what i can to finaly play far cry 2. yes im a gamer. im a fast learner but it has to be tought right. if that makes any sence. thanks



Well here is the main problem and that is that your Video card only supports Shader Model 2 and Farcry I believe uses Shader Model 3.  So a new video card is a must.  Obv. u def. need a new mobo, but here is my first question.  The RAM u just bought is it DDR or DDR2, bc the Core 2 Duo needs DDR2 RAM.


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## aesedai (Feb 28, 2009)

The mobo section isnt as much comprehensive as the rest of the sections.
iam looking to buy a new mobo which one should i go for i have about 450$ for the pc excluding the graphics card and tell me which one should i go for DDR2or DDR3 also tell me a bit about the future prospects.
PLZ!!!!
(A full recommendation for the pc would be highly appreciated)


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## black knight (Apr 22, 2009)

*neww builds*

love the article was a great help. very thorugh and and imformative.


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## black knight (Apr 23, 2009)

thanks for the comprehensive help with the new build article bruin004 the hardware is a bit out of date however it doesnt affect the excellant principals.my new build is well under way a high end gamer following the principles you have expressed.research being a bigie.thanks again .


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## Hayder_Master (Apr 23, 2009)

i think you need some update's on the brand , add more not remove


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## patdaddy1987 (Jun 16, 2009)

I built my computer for $375 and that is the tower, motherboard, CPU, CPU fan, 300 GIG HDD, FDD, 2 DVD Burners, 400 WATT Power supply, graphics card, eide cables, fans, windows vista home eddition full verson, and a 20" moniter. all at tiger direct P.S. i bought it pice by pice and built it from the ground up. 
i built it last year


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## surfsk8snow.jah (Jun 17, 2009)

patdaddy1987 said:


> I built my computer for $375 and that is the tower, motherboard, CPU, CPU fan, 300 GIG HDD, FDD, 2 DVD Burners, 400 WATT Power supply, graphics card, eide cables, fans, windows vista home eddition full verson, and a 20" moniter. all at tiger direct P.S. i bought it pice by pice and built it from the ground up.
> i built it last year



Can you perhaps post the specs of your $375 build? Could have been a Pentium 3 for all we know.


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## EnergyFX (Sep 20, 2009)

this needs updated or removed from stickie.


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## BinaryMage (Feb 12, 2011)

If a mod is reading this, can this either be restarted or unstickied? It is multiple years old.


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## michaeltyson (Apr 5, 2011)

holy crap! A+ on this thread. Ive been thinking about building a new desktop but havent really taken any steps. This will definately help me out when i decided to venture on my computer travels.


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## BMarqa (May 27, 2011)

Help a lot especially ......me


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## MacIceberg (Jul 17, 2011)

Perfect! good for begginners like me. This should be updated with the latest technology and preference to keep up with the changes.


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## Zachxlmao (Nov 12, 2011)

I'm new to custom computers I'd like to upgrade my current desktop PC with a new graphics card , motherboard, and processor and i need to know what power supply I'll need to power all of this.
I have a HP Pavillion P600 with 6gb ram,1tb hard drive and a ATI Radeon HD 4200 ( http://www.bestbuy.com/site/HP+-+Pa...rive/1757113.p?id=1218289377288&skuId=1757113 ) And I want to put this graphics card ( EVGA SuperClocked 012-P3-1573-KR GeForce GTX 570 H... ) and this mother board processor combo in it ( Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptop Computers, L... ) Any help and advice is appreciated thanks


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## Jetster (Nov 12, 2011)

Zachxlmao, Since your upgrading just about everything start from scratch. Pick out a nice case and go from there. HP has some preparatory parts, poor air flow and off the shelf parts may not fit right. Ive done this and its a pain.

As far as a power supply. Corsair HX750 or TX750   you could get by with the 650


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## Mr. Extreme 60 (Oct 17, 2012)

*help*

Hi! ...everyone...!

after 3 years, I want to build a new gaming System....
I have 1500$ for now!
and...I need your helps to choose bests...!


thank's to all


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## Mr. Extreme 60 (Oct 17, 2012)

*heeeeelp!*

I'm Wating!

Help me, Please


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## Asus7950DCII (Jan 11, 2013)

sure my friend ^  a minute i will send a private message :bounce:


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## Asus7950DCII (Jan 11, 2013)

Mr. Extreme 60 said:


> I'm Wating!
> 
> Help me, Please



im talking to in private message


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## Kwod (Mar 4, 2013)

What do you guys think of these parts...?

http://www.gamedude.com.au/prod_show.php?art_no=casTHoverseer_rx1

TT Overseer RX1

http://www.umart.com.au/pro/products_listnew.phtml?id=10&id2=207&bid=2&sid=82890

Antec 1100

WRT these cases, my main concern is dust/dust filters.....these both come so equipped, but are they both easy to remove the filters?


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## Kwod (Mar 4, 2013)

http://www.umart.com.au/pro/products_listnew.phtml?id=10&id2=140&bid=2&sid=85939

Is this a worthy PSU?


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## Kwod (Mar 5, 2013)

Should I just start a new build thread?


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