# Ryzen 3000 - B450, B450 MAX or X570



## GrimLobster (Aug 20, 2019)

Located in Australia , budget around $1500 USD. Not planning to manually overclock at this stage and just using PC for gaming.

Looking at MSI 450 Gaming Pro Carbon AC but concerned about BIOS, some say it's ok. Very hard at the moment to find stock of the MAX boards - fine out of the box with Ryzen 3000 CPU's. Best I could find that's currently being sold in Aus is Tomahawk MAX. Just read that MSI will have ongoing updates/support regarding BIOS in future for MAX boards, whereas they won't cater to the old boards. Not sure how important that is but maybe a factor to consider. X570 boards an option.

PCPartPicker Part List


Type​Item​Price​*CPU*​AMD Ryzen 5 3600X 3.8 GHz 6-Core Processor​$238.90 @ OutletPC​*Motherboard*​MSI B450 GAMING PRO CARBON AC ATX AM4 Motherboard​$157.89 @ OutletPC​*Memory*​G.Skill Flare X Series 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-3200 Memory​$134.99 @ Newegg​*Storage*​Samsung 860 Evo 500 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive​$74.99 @ Adorama​*Video Card*​Gigabyte GeForce RTX 2070 SUPER 8 GB GAMING OC Video Card​$549.99 @ Amazon​*Case*​Corsair 500R Black ATX Mid Tower Case​-​*Power Supply*​Cooler Master VSM 650 W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-modular ATX Power Supply​-​*Operating System*​Microsoft Windows 10 Home OEM 64-bit​$99.89 @ OutletPC​*Monitor*​Acer Predator XB271HUA 27.0" 2560x1440 165 Hz Monitor​-​​_Prices include shipping, taxes, rebates, and discounts_​​​Total (before mail-in rebates)​$1266.65​​Mail-in rebates​-$10.00​​*Total*​*$1256.65*​​Generated by PCPartPicker 2019-08-20 05:28 EDT-0400​​
Very simplified:

*MSI 450 Gaming Pro Carbon AC* - Best audio, network adapter included - features I want - may have ongoing BIOS issues with 3600X.

*MSI 450 Tomohawk MAX* - Not as good audio, around $20 USD cheaper than Gaming Pro - less or no BIOS issues with 3600X.

*X570 boards* - Around $70 USD more expensive than Gaming Pro Carbon AC at a minimum, depending on model the price will go much higher - less or no BIOS issues with 3600X.

*-* *-* Just wondering about people's experience with Ryzen 3000 with these specific B450 boards or the X570's? Or any advice?

Thanks a lot


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## las (Aug 20, 2019)

Get a B450 board certified for 3000 series and buy 3600 over 3600X.

Don't waste money on X570 for Ryzen 5.

Get NVME x4 SSD like 970 / 970 Plus over that SATA SSD.

I'd personally choose a EVGA, MSI or Asus GPU instead, but I guess that's subjective - My experience with Gigabyte has not been the best, their software is really bad (firmware too, most often).


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## Chomiq (Aug 20, 2019)

B450 Carbon if you manage to find it. Last BIOS update was on July 30th, that's week after non-Max Mortar/Tomahawk got theirs. Considering most people having issues with Mortar/Tomahawk had it on previous BIOS I'd say any issues with Carbon were similarly resolved with the latest update. YMMV.

In regards to your Win 10 Home OEM:








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Haven't used it, but if TPU's running the ad for them I suppose it's safe. Win 10 Pro for $12 instead of a $100.

Ps.
You've got two topics basicly asking the same questions, over here and in System Builder's Advice.


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## GrimLobster (Aug 20, 2019)

Chomiq said:


> B450 Carbon if you manage to find it. Last BIOS update was on July 30th, that's week after non-Max Mortar/Tomahawk got theirs. Considering most people having issues with Mortar/Tomahawk had it on previous BIOS I'd say any issues with Carbon were similarly resolved with the latest update. YMMV.
> 
> In regards to your Win 10 Home OEM:
> 
> ...



Thanks a lot for the link will absolutely check it out.

Yes true, in system builder it was for overall build opinions then it became more specific to motherboards - thought I'd ask here too.

Good point though - should I delete this thread?


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## Liviu Cojocaru (Aug 20, 2019)

I purchased something similar lately and I had to send back the motherboard, RAM compatibility issues (XMP issues to be precise) I opted for the X570 Aorus Elite just for future proofing and better VRM and a few other gimmicks. You can easily go for the B450 PRO Carbon as it has flasback bios so you will be able to update BIOS without a CPU installed.


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## FinneousPJ (Aug 20, 2019)

As long as the CPU support list includes the 3600(x) you can expect it to work or get your money back. I wouldn't worry about it over much.


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## randomUser (Aug 20, 2019)

I have ryzen 3600 and MSI B450M mortar.

The BIOS is not finished yet!

RAID function is not available, the BIOS itself is stripped down.

I would buy MAX version because it has 64MB BIOS flash, so full featured BIOS.


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## thebluebumblebee (Aug 20, 2019)

Don't get a non-MAX MSI motherboard for Ryzen 3000.  Their BIOS is too small, so the updates end up removing functionality from the motherboard.

I personally believe that a person should spend the extra money and get a X570 motherboard, if purchasing a motherboard for a Ryzen 3000 build.


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## FinneousPJ (Aug 20, 2019)

randomUser said:


> I have ryzen 3600 and MSI B450M mortar.
> 
> The BIOS is not finished yet!
> 
> ...


Good point, definitely check that all the functions you require are also available.


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## juiseman (Aug 20, 2019)

I would get the X570. Just incase you want PCI-E 4.0 and future proof a CPU upgrade. I know you only need a Ryzen 5; but AMD could release a refresh with a speed bump and more cores down the line.
If your already spending $1300; I would find the best board you could.
And yea, save on that windows KEY, I've bought 15 keys from Ebay for like $2-$4; all have worked. No issues.
If you don't like that idea, get a old win 7 key; I think they are still activating good.


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## John Naylor (Aug 21, 2019)

I have never found the "cheap" chipsets to be worth the savings.  First thing I always do is scroll down and look at the sound and LAN subsystems, usually it the cheapest of the cheap with ALC 88 or ALC892.  By the time you work ya way up the B450 price tiers to get ALC 1220, you are up to something like the Gaming pro carbon and its $157... and now yoou are $2 short of a X570 board with ALC 1220 ... B450 for $2 ... doesn't seem logical.... if its a gaming box, why settle for 887 or 892 ?


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## Metroid (Aug 21, 2019)

I paid $110 b450 gaming plus, $227 3600 and overclocked to 4.2 all cores 1.32v, you need a good cooling for it, 240 aio minimum. In your case, all depends on price, I would get the cheapest, do not use onboard audio, is a waste, buy a pcie sound card or an external amp audio.


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## Provin915 (Aug 21, 2019)

Anyone got some advice for me? Currently looking for a mobo for 3700x. Preferably black/white with RGB. Also, good VRAM and cooling capabilities. Need USB 3.1 (getting a NZXT H510 case). I'm torn between Asus Prime X470-PRO and MSI B450 Gaming Pro Carbon. Lastly, price max 150 EUR imo.


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## Badelhas (Aug 26, 2019)

I would buy the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max but it's not available in my country yet, I don't understand why since it's been available in Germany for a month now.


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## Sadja (Sep 5, 2019)

Hi there!
Ryzen 5 3600 / MSI B450m Mortar / Corsair LPX cl15 3000mhz 2x8gb / A-data XPG GAMMIX S11 Pro 512GB   working great.  I'm using a passive Power supply Seasonic platinum 400W and a Firepro W5100 grafic card; both are second hand. Budget under 650$.
Bios MB: A80 , no cpu OC, no game OC
RAM: OC to 3600mhz CL 16/18/18/40
Test results: https://www.passmark.com/baselines/V9/display.php?id=124860044495
and https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/19883762


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Sadja said:


> Hi there!
> Ryzen 5 3600 / MSI B450m Mortar / Corsair LPX cl15 3000mhz 2x8gb / A-data XPG GAMMIX S11 Pro 512GB   working great.  I'm using a passive Power supply Seasonic platinum 400W and a Firepro W5100 grafic card; both are second hand. Budget under 650$.
> Bios MB: A80 , no cpu OC, no game OC
> RAM: OC to 3600mhz CL 16/18/18/40
> ...


Which CPU did you have before.
Anyone here coming from the 2500k overclocked?


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## Sadja (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> Which CPU did you have before.
> Anyone here coming from the 2500k overclocked?


I'm currently use an i7 7700/z270/samsung 2x8gb 3466mhz/gtx1070/ samsung evo 960 M2. 
The system with ryzen 3600 use less power with better result. In test for the moment for 3D, video.


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## Kissamies (Sep 5, 2019)

Kinda offtopic, but I've been wondering that could a non-MAX MSI motherboard be upgraded with a MAX bios chip? The boards seem to be identical otherwise.


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Chloe Price said:


> Kinda offtopic, but I've been wondering that could a non-MAX MSI motherboard be upgraded with a MAX bios chip? The boards seem to be identical otherwise.


From what I've read, it could, but you would have to remove de bios chip from the non Max motherboard and solder a 32mb one. Do you have the skills?


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## Kissamies (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> From what I've read, it could, but you would have to remove de bios chip from the non Max motherboard and solder a 32mb one. Do you have the skills?


Yeah, I can handle a soldering iron 

Totally forgot that these aren't socketed always like back in the day.


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

If you're cool with voiding your warranty...


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## Kissamies (Sep 5, 2019)

Chomiq said:


> If you're cool with voiding your warranty...


No problem with that. Now I just need to find a pre-flashed MAX chip somewhere.


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## Rahnak (Sep 5, 2019)

I wouldn't be so sure it's just a matter of replacing the BIOS chip since that wasn't the only upgrade. They also upgraded the USB, you get USB 3.2 instead of 3.1, I believe. Can't keep up with the ridiculous naming.


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## Kissamies (Sep 5, 2019)

Rahnak said:


> I wouldn't be so sure it's just a matter of replacing the BIOS chip since that wasn't the only upgrade. They also upgraded the USB, you get USB 3.2 instead of 3.1, I believe. Can't keep up with the ridiculous naming.


The naming is hilarious, USB3.2 gen1 is still the same as USB3.0.


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Rahnak said:


> I wouldn't be so sure it's just a matter of replacing the BIOS chip since that wasn't the only upgrade. They also upgraded the USB, you get USB 3.2 instead of 3.1, I believe. Can't keep up with the ridiculous naming.


From what I've read the only change is the bios chip.


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## Rahnak (Sep 5, 2019)

Tomahawk has USB 3.1, Tomahawk MAX upgraded it to 3.2. Screenshot from MSI's site comparison feature:





EDIT: Or wait, are these the same thing but they changed the name? I'm even more confused now.


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## Kissamies (Sep 5, 2019)

Interesting. I need to check the differences between X470 Gaming Plus and the MAX version.


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## Rahnak (Sep 5, 2019)

You can just ignore my previous comments. It's the same USB speed. USB-IF just decided 3.0 and 3.1 don't exist anymore and that's why MSI changed the numbers. I swear to god, fuck these USB-IF guys.

3.2 Gen 1 = 3.0 (5 Gbps)
3.2 Gen 2 = 3.1 (10 Gbps)
3.2 Gen 2x2 = 3.2 (20 Gbps)

I apologize for the confusion.


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## Kissamies (Sep 5, 2019)

Rahnak said:


> You can just ignore my previous comments. It's the same USB speed. USB-IF just decided 3.0 and 3.1 don't exist anymore and that's why MSI changed the numbers. I swear to god, fuck these USB-IF guys.
> 
> 3.2 Gen 1 = 3.0 (5 Gbps)
> 3.2 Gen 2 = 3.1 (10 Gbps)
> ...


And they say that AMD's and Nvidia's rebranding of GPUs is confusing..


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Do you guys think I'll notice performance improvements if I upgrade from my good 9 years old i5 2500k@4.7GHz with 8gb DDR3 1600mhz to the 3600 and 16gb Ddr4 3200 CL16 (apart from gaming, of course)? 
The rest of my setup is a nvidia 1070 and a Samsung 850 Evo SSD. 
Cheers


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## Kissamies (Sep 5, 2019)

Yes you do. More cores and threads, more RAM and the CPU has better IPC.


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## Rahnak (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> Do you guys think I'll notice performance improvements if I upgrade from my good 9 years old i5 2500k@4.7GHz with 8gb DDR3 1600mhz to the 3600 and 16gb Ddr4 3200 CL16 (apart from gaming, of course)?
> The rest of my setup is a nvidia 1070 and a Samsung 850 Evo SSD.
> Cheers


Depends on what you do with your PC, but in the majority of situations, I would say yes.
I also have a 2500k and I'm starting to see it bottleneck even my lowly RX 480 in a few games. And I'm also considering a 3600, but I'm waiting for drivers/firmware to mature some more before I commit.
That and I haven't really decided on a motherboard. Initially wanted a B450 Carbon Pro but they're all sold out and not getting the MAX treatment. Tomahawk has lowly audio and no intel lan. B450 Aorus Pro "fixes" that, but I've heard the VRMs aren't great for overclocking. Next up is the B450 Strix-F which is about the same as the Carbon Pro but I haven't read much about that one. Nor do I know how Asus/Gigabyte are handling bios updates for 3rd gen. Do they also lose features like MSI (non MAX variants)?


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Rahnak said:


> Depends on what you do with your PC, but in the majority of situations, I would say yes.
> I also have a 2500k and I'm starting to see it bottleneck even my lowly RX 480 in a few games. And I'm also considering a 3600, but I'm waiting for drivers/firmware to mature some more before I commit.
> That and I haven't really decided on a motherboard. Initially wanted a B450 Carbon Pro but they're all sold out and not getting the MAX treatment. Tomahawk has lowly audio and no intel lan. B450 Aorus Pro "fixes" that, but I've heard the VRMs aren't great for overclocking. Next up is the B450 Strix-F which is about the same as the Carbon Pro but I haven't read much about that one. Nor do I know how Asus/Gigabyte are handling bios updates for 3rd gen. Do they also lose features like MSI (non MAX variants)?


I am also debating if I should spend 400 euros (CPU, MB, RAM) because since I game less and less (have to kids now) and also waiting for the drivers to mature. 
I currently own a Asus P8Z68V_PRO so I believe the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max will be an upgrade. Regarding sound I own an old but still good PCI-E soundcard (Asus Xonar DX) so that won't be a problem. As for the Intel Lan I believed my current MB as a Realtek Lan and have a fiber 100mbit connection and didn't notice any issues with that. Why do you need the Intel Lan for?


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## TheLostSwede (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> Why do you need the Intel Lan for?


You don't. Realtek used to be terrible, but these days, for normal users, there isn't a big difference.
It's just people get hung up on things and even though some companies vastly improve their products, people trash them without having used them for years.
Yeah, Realtek drives might not be as advanced as Intel, but again, for most people, it simply doesn't matter.


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## Rahnak (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> I am also debating if I should spend 400 euros (CPU, MB, RAM) because since I game less and less (have to kids now) and also waiting for the drivers to mature.
> I currently own a Asus P8Z68V_PRO so I believe the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max will be an upgrade. Regarding sound I own an old but still good PCI-E soundcard (Asus Xonar DX) so that won't be a problem. As for the Intel Lan I believed my current MB as a Realtek Lan and have a fiber 100mbit connection and didn't notice any issues with that. Why do you need the Intel Lan for?


I understand you. I'm also reluctant to spend money on it, even though I do still game a fair bit, hence why I've postponed it for so long. :\

Like @TheLostSwede said, I probably don't need it. My current board has Realtek LAN and I can't say that I remember having issues with it. But I keep hearing/reading how Intel LAN is the best thing since sliced bread so since I'm upgrading, I just wanted to see what's what. As for the audio, kinda the same logic. I already have Realtek ALC 892 in my board, don't want to have the same old stuff in the new one. Of course I wouldn't consider these features if the price difference was significant.. but in this case it isn't.
Though if the Strix-F had gimped BIOS for 3rd Gen, I'd probably still take the Tomahawk MAX over it. Sadly it's not out here yet, so I have no idea how much it'll cost (I'm guessing the difference to the Strix-F is going to be around 10€ or less).


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Rahnak said:


> I understand you. I'm also reluctant to spend money on it, even though I do still game a fair bit, hence why I've postponed it for so long. :\
> 
> Like @TheLostSwede said, I probably don't need it. My current board has Realtek LAN and I can't say that I remember having issues with it. But I keep hearing/reading how Intel LAN is the best thing since sliced bread so since I'm upgrading, I just wanted to see what's what. As for the audio, kinda the same logic. I already have Realtek ALC 892 in my board, don't want to have the same old stuff in the new one. Of course I wouldn't consider these features if the price difference was significant.. but in this case it isn't.
> Though if the Strix-F had gimped BIOS for 3rd Gen, I'd probably still take the Tomahawk MAX over it. Sadly it's not out here yet, so I have no idea how much it'll cost (I'm guessing the difference to the Strix-F is going to be around 10€ or less).


Yeah, I still don't get why I can buy the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max from German stores for a month now and there's still nothing on the stores here in Portugal.


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## TheLostSwede (Sep 5, 2019)

Rahnak said:


> I understand you. I'm also reluctant to spend money on it, even though I do still game a fair bit, hence why I've postponed it for so long. :\
> 
> Like @TheLostSwede said, I probably don't need it. My current board has Realtek LAN and I can't say that I remember having issues with it. But I keep hearing/reading how Intel LAN is the best thing since sliced bread so since I'm upgrading, I just wanted to see what's what. As for the audio, kinda the same logic. I already have Realtek ALC 892 in my board, don't want to have the same old stuff in the new one. Of course I wouldn't consider these features if the price difference was significant.. but in this case it isn't.
> Though if the Strix-F had gimped BIOS for 3rd Gen, I'd probably still take the Tomahawk MAX over it. Sadly it's not out here yet, so I have no idea how much it'll cost (I'm guessing the difference to the Strix-F is going to be around 10€ or less).


For onboard audio, these days it's pretty much Realtek or Realtek. That said, there's obviously a slight difference between their various chips and some higher-end boards have additional DACs to help improve the audio quality.
Sadly Microsoft has pretty much destroyed sound cards as a valid upgrade for gaming, imho.

This is obviously not ping/latency related, but I did a quick and dirty comparison of a few different network interfaces at different speeds.








						Quick comparison, 1Gbps, 2.5Gbps, 5Gbps, 10Gbps Ethernet
					

Note that this test is limited by the fact that the target is a mechanical hard drive, even if it's a NAS drive. The NAS also has an Aquantia 10Gbps card in it. This is obviously not a thorough test, but I wanted to see how the Realtek 2.5Gbps chip performed. Take this for what it is, a quick...




					www.techpowerup.com
				






Badelhas said:


> Yeah, I still don't get why I can buy the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max from German stores for a month now and there's still nothing on the stores here in Portugal.


All about the distribution networks and the consumer buying power. The manufacturers will always prioritise markets with big volumes.


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

Yeah I was always using realtek onboard LAN and never had any issues with them, pings were fine and it was all that mattered. Having switch to Intel LAN I haven't noticed a difference. I am running a 50mbit/s connection so it's not like it's a speed demon that would be capped by network adapter performance.


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## kmetek (Sep 5, 2019)

MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX or MSI B450 GAMING PLUS MAX ?


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

kmetek said:


> MSI B450 TOMAHAWK MAX or MSI B450 GAMING PLUS MAX ?


Tomahawk


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## kmetek (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas: why don't you just order from german store? Mindfactory doesn't ship outside but try this shipping system: mailboxde 

Chomig: any details why? You help me a lot, dzięki

Tomorrow football: SLO : POL


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

kmetek said:


> Badelhas: why don't you just order from german store? Mindfactory doesn't ship outside but try this shipping system: mailboxde
> 
> Chomig: any details why? You help me a lot, dzięki
> 
> Tomorrow football: SLO : POL


Better VRM cooling? That's pretty much it.



			https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1wmsTYK9Z3-jUX5LGRoFnsZYZiW1pfiDZnKCjaXyzd1o/edit#gid=2112472504


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

kmetek said:


> Badelhas: why don't you just order from german store? Mindfactory doesn't ship outside but try this shipping system: mailboxde
> 
> Chomig: any details why? You help me a lot, dzięki
> 
> Tomorrow football: SLO : POL


I am think about it. ComputerUniverse, a German store, sends it to Portugal. IThe items have been in my basket for weeks now, I´ve almost pulled the trigger a couple of times 
I´ve been having questions on which particular RAM kit should I choose. Should I just go for the cheapest 3200Mhz LC 16 Kit, even though it´s not on the compatibility with this Motherboard list on MSI support website? Any suggestions? Remember, I am looking for value, not performance only.
Cheers


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> I am think about it. ComputerUniverse, a German store, sends it to Portugal. IThe items have been in my basket for weeks now, I´ve almost pulled the trigger a couple of times
> I´ve been having questions on which particular RAM kit should I choose. Should I just go for the cheapest 3200Mhz LC 16 Kit, even though it´s not on the compatibility with this Motherboard list on MSI support website? Any suggestions? Remember, I am looking for value, not performance only.
> Cheers


Ballistix Sport LT 3200 CL16. Bang for buck.


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Chomiq said:


> Ballistix Sport LT 3200 CL16. Bang for buck.


What about this one? It was release on October 2015 but they are on the compatibility list
https://www.gskill.com/product/165/...VDDR4-3200MHz-CL16-18-18-38-1.35V16GB-(2x8GB)


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## kmetek (Sep 5, 2019)

Or them, ram this






						Crucial Ballistix Sport LT Weiß 16GB DDR4 Kit RAM
					

Crucial Ballistix Sport LT Weiß 16GB DDR4 Kit RAM günstig online kaufen im computeruniverse Online Shop. Bestellen Sie jetzt RAM (Arbeitsspeicher) günstig online! computeruniverse - beste Auswahl, bester Service!




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or this






						Ballistix Sport LT Grau BLS2K8G4D30AESBK 16GB DDR4 Kit RAM
					

Buy Ballistix Sport LT Grau BLS2K8G4D30AESBK 16GB DDR4 Kit RAM online at computeruniverse. Order Ballistix Sport now at incredibly low price! computeruniverse - best choice, best service.




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3000 CL15 or 3200 CL16

On reddit there're report that (both are Micron-E) that CL15 are higher binned?


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

@Badelhas That's your choice, either of them should run fine with Ryzen. I'm using Ballistix in my rig and have no issues.


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

kmetek said:


> Or them, ram this
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for the suggestion. Even though they are much more recent the specs are the same and they are not on the compatibility list. Shouldnt I just go for the one I posted?
Cheers


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> Thanks for the suggestion. Even though they are much more recent the specs are the same and they are not on the compatibility list. Shouldnt I just go for the one I posted?
> Cheers


Not every board maker tests every memory kit out there. If they won't run you can simply return them and get a kit that's on MSI's QVL.


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## kmetek (Sep 5, 2019)

Ballistic Sport LT series should work 99,99%.......


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Chomiq said:


> Not every board maker tests every memory kit out there. If they won't run you can simply return them and get a kit that's on MSI's QVL.


What's your saying is that you own the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max and use a ballistix kit that's not on the compatibility list? I'm going for the ballistix 3200mhz CL16 then since they are much more recent and only cost 2 euros more...


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> What's your saying is that you own the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max and use a ballistix kit that's not on the compatibility list? I'm going for the ballistix 3200mhz CL16 then since they are much more recent and only cost 2 euros more...


What I'm saying is that I'm running this kit on my x570 Aorus Elite. I don't see any reason why it shouldn't work on B450 Tomahawk Max, especially since I see that people use that kit on B450 without any issues.
Crucial brands them with "Ready for Ryzen". They're also low profile, so won't interfere with most of the aftermarket CPU coolers out there.

AFAIK amazon.de should ship it to Portugal without any problem. You'll be able to return it hassle free within 30-day window if there are any issues. Just order two stick 8gb each, instead of a kit of 2x8GB, as single sticks are cheaper there.


			https://www.amazon.de/Ballistix-BLS2K8G4D32AESBK-Speicher-PC4-25600-288-Pin/dp/B07MNJRQB2
		

Verify if it says it qualifies for free shipping to Portugal.


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## kmetek (Sep 5, 2019)

Chomiq: amazon.de has not the best prices and it's always nice to buy from 1 store - shipping costs


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## Chomiq (Sep 5, 2019)

kmetek said:


> Chomiq: amazon.de has not the best prices and it's always nice to buy from 1 store - shipping costs


Hey, amazon's universal. I won't go out googling for local stores in every country. If it's cheaper in Portugal, he can go ahead and order it there. Assuming it's even available.

If you qualify for free shipping and price is low I default to amzn. The site you linked had 6€ shipping cost for DE, I assume it increases for any other country, which means that the final price will probably end up higher that amazon. Add to that potential shipping costs for returns and it's no longer a great option.


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Chomiq said:


> What I'm saying is that I'm running this kit on my x570 Aorus Elite. I don't see any reason why it shouldn't work on B450 Tomahawk Max, especially since I see that people use that kit on B450 without any issues.
> Crucial brands them with "Ready for Ryzen". They're also low profile, so won't interfere with most of the aftermarket CPU coolers out there.
> 
> AFAIK amazon.de should ship it to Portugal without any problem. You'll be able to return it hassle free within 30-day window if there are any issues. Just order two stick 8gb each, instead of a kit of 2x8GB, as single sticks are cheaper there.
> ...


No, they charge me 8 euros for shipping. Only Amazon Spain has free shipping to Portugal. Thanks anyway

I just bite the bullet! AMD Ryzen 3600 + MSI Tomahawk Max + 16GB Ballistix 3200 CL16. Total cost including shipping from Germany: 417€.
Thanks you guys for the incentive!


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## Rahnak (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas said:


> I just bite the bullet! AMD Ryzen 3600 + MSI Tomahawk Max + 16GB Ballistix 3200 CL16. Total cost including shipping from Germany: 417€.
> Thanks you guys for the incentive!


Congrats! Let me know how it performs compared to the 2500k.


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

Rahnak said:


> Congrats! Let me know how it performs compared to the 2500k.


Thanks! I will, since we have similar setups, except you have your OC @4.2Ghz and I have it a 4,7Ghz. 
Hope everything works fine (normally it never does). Also ordered a AMD AM4 Premium Retention Ring Kit for Asetek Liquid Coolers since I have a AIO Watercooler that most definitely is quieter than the stock cooler.

Cheers


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## jesdals (Sep 5, 2019)

My Nephew went with the Msi Tomahawk and the 3800x and is very happe with his build


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## kmetek (Sep 5, 2019)

Badelhas: bravo


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

I just found out that on Crucial Website they state that the Ram you suggested is 100% compatible with the MSI B450 Tomahawk Max 








						DRAM, Solid State Drive (SSD) & Memory Upgrades
					

Find compatible DRAM memory and SSD upgrades for your PC or Laptop with our Crucial Advisor tool or Crucial System Scanner, with FREE US delivery!




					www.crucial.com


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## kmetek (Sep 5, 2019)

i hope 3000 CL15 is too


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## Badelhas (Sep 5, 2019)

kmetek said:


> i hope 3000 CL15 is too


What's the reference number of the kit you ordered? Search Google. That should take you to the official page of the RAM manufacturer. You should find the QVL motherboard compatibility list there.


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## kmetek (Sep 6, 2019)

anyone knows difference betwen LT and AT series?

yes i did check at crucial site, it's QVL


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## Space Lynx (Nov 1, 2019)

Metroid said:


> I paid $110 b450 gaming plus, $227 3600 and overclocked to 4.2 all cores 1.32v, you need a good cooling for it, 240 aio minimum. In your case, all depends on price, I would get the cheapest, do not use onboard audio, is a waste, buy a pcie sound card or an external amp audio.



What's the best way to test stability for an OC on Ryzen?

Also, I am trying to bring my temps down, how do I do an offset negative voltage to bring my temps down?

see screenshot... at stock i hit 90 celsius on noctu anh-d14... at witcher 3 1440p high refresh.... at 1.345 v i still hit those same temps with override volt set  lower than MSI default stock voltage...

i can't figure out what to do to get good temps but still let it boost to 4.2 once in awhile... ignore the minus 3000... i cant figure out what goes where








edit:   @Metroid you are 100% stable at 4.2 all core at 1.320 volts? that seems extremely unlikely, I have never seen a voltage that low work for 4.2 all core no downclocking... what are your exact settings...

I have the MSI B450 Gaming Plus MAX mobo... if someone can share settings with me it would be appreciated


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## Metroid (Nov 1, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> What's the best way to test stability for an OC on Ryzen?
> 
> Also, I am trying to bring my temps down, how do I do an offset negative voltage to bring my temps down?
> 
> ...



I'm very stable at 4.2ghz at 1.31v, last uptime was around 25 days without had to restart it. It was not stable at 1.31v with stock cooler because of temperature, it would spike to 90 degrees celsius in 10 seconds, after I changed stock cooler to coolermaster 240 aio, maximum temperature from 90c to 60, that is around 15 to 30c better temps, also, in my room air conditioner is 24/7. So the radiator air is always 24c. Here are the most important bios settings, hope it helps.


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## Space Lynx (Nov 1, 2019)

Metroid said:


> I'm very stable at 4.2ghz at 1.31v, last uptime was around 25 days without had to restart it. It was not stable at 1.31v with stock cooler because of temperature, it would spike to 90 degrees celsius in 10 seconds, after I changed stock cooler to coolermaster 240 aio, maximum temperature from 90c to 60, that is around 15 to 30c better temps, also, in my room air conditioner is 24/7. So the radiator air is always 24c. Here are the most important bios settings, hope it helps.



I just ran a few tests at override 1.31v and all core 4.2 changed nothing else, and yeah no crashes at all, I am quite surprised.  temps are decent with my noctua nh-d14


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## sepheronx (Nov 1, 2019)

Don't know if its been mentioned but the MSI boards for 450 (most of them) seem to feature Bios Flashback thus these are great to pick up for the 3000 series in that if the board doesn't have the updated bios as is, you can still flash it anyway.  If you can get them for around $150, they are great boards and a good alternative to x570 boards which are just ridiculously expensive atm.


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## Metroid (Nov 1, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> I just ran a few tests at override 1.31v and all core 4.2 changed nothing else, and yeah no crashes at all, I am quite surprised.  temps are decent with my noctua nh-d14



I have done extensive tests and those settings are solid and the best, issues will only happen because of very high temperature, i'd say 80c or more, enjoy.



sepheronx said:


> Don't know if its been mentioned but the MSI boards for 450 (most of them) seem to feature Bios Flashback thus these are great to pick up for the 3000 series in that if the board doesn't have the updated bios as is, you can still flash it anyway.  If you can get them for around $150, they are great boards and a good alternative to x570 boards which are just ridiculously expensive atm.



I had to do the bios flashback to my b450 gaming plus, just follow the guide on youtube and should be fine. The problem about x570 is much higher price and it uses much more power too. I don't see pcie 3.0 to be an issue at moment for gpus, storage wise, I dont need it.


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## sepheronx (Nov 1, 2019)

Metroid said:


> I had to do the bios flashback to my b450 gaming plus, just follow the guide on youtube and should be fine. The problem about x570 is much higher price and it uses much more power too. I don't see pcie 3.0 to be an issue at moment for gpus, storage wise, I dont need it.


Hence why I said its a fantastic purchase.  Only issue is here in Canada, majority of these ATX B450 motherboards are almost as expensive as the cheaper x570 motherboards.  It is really stupid here in Canada for electronic prices.  But I think the cheap MSI B450 Gaming Plus ATX mobo is only about $110 and it also has the bios flash. I believe the VRM are similar to the Tomahawk (4phase) but it should still be enough for something like a 3600 or even up to a 3800x anyway.  Just gotta make sure have good cooling.  Anyway, these boards are cheap and good enough anyway.


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## Metroid (Nov 1, 2019)

sepheronx said:


> Hence why I said its a fantastic purchase.  Only issue is here in Canada, majority of these ATX B450 motherboards are almost as expensive as the cheaper x570 motherboards.  It is really stupid here in Canada for electronic prices.  But I think the cheap MSI B450 Gaming Plus ATX mobo is only about $110 and it also has the bios flash. I believe the VRM are similar to the Tomahawk (4phase) but it should still be enough for something like a 3600 or even up to a 3800x anyway.  Just gotta make sure have good cooling.  Anyway, these boards are cheap and good enough anyway.



In any case you decide, watercooling or aircooling, need to place a 12mm fan on vrm, even though we know it has a solid vrm, it's good to have in there. This is mine.


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## Space Lynx (Nov 1, 2019)

Metroid said:


> I have done extensive tests and those settings are solid and the best, issues will only happen because of very high temperature, i'd say 80c or more, enjoy.
> 
> 
> 
> I had to do the bios flashback to my b450 gaming plus, just follow the guide on youtube and should be fine. The problem about x570 is much higher price and it uses much more power too. I don't see pcie 3.0 to be an issue at moment for gpus, storage wise, I dont need it.




Everything for me is stable, even Witcher 3 after 2-3 hours is only hitting 75 celsius sometimes a boost to 82 celsius  but it drops back down really fast to 75 once I get out of intensive city areas.

I did try prime95 and PC crashed after 5 seconds, so it is not a stable OC, but all my games seem to run fine, so I honestly am not going to worry about it, if I ever run into issues with games I might try 1.35 volt or something.  but sticking with 1.31 for now.


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## Metroid (Nov 4, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> Everything for me is stable, even Witcher 3 after 2-3 hours is only hitting 75 celsius sometimes a boost to 82 celsius  but it drops back down really fast to 75 once I get out of intensive city areas.
> 
> I did try prime95 and PC crashed after 5 seconds, so it is not a stable OC, but all my games seem to run fine, so I honestly am not going to worry about it, if I ever run into issues with games I might try 1.35 volt or something.  but sticking with 1.31 for now.



why dont you get a 240mm aio? https://www.newegg.com/cooler-master-masterliquid-ml240l-rgb-liquid-cooling-system/p/2YM-0004-00015

I got that one, paid $55, helped as much as 30c full load.


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## Space Lynx (Nov 4, 2019)

Metroid said:


> why dont you get a 240mm aio? https://www.newegg.com/cooler-master-masterliquid-ml240l-rgb-liquid-cooling-system/p/2YM-0004-00015
> 
> I got that one, paid $55, helped as much as 30c full load.




because my NH-D14 has 3x 140mm fans on it n push/pull, going water would gain me nothing temp wise.  also, this was meant to be a budget build.  I could have got an x570 mobo for $40 more, a better psu for $90 more, etc etc

all in all, I saved around $500 while still getting around same performance if I went balls to the wall on upgrades.


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## Metroid (Nov 4, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> because my NH-D14 has 3x 140mm fans on it n push/pull, going water would gain me nothing temp wise.  also, this was meant to be a budget build.  I could have got an x570 mobo for $40 more, a better psu for $90 more, etc etc
> 
> all in all, I saved around $500 while still getting around same performance if I went balls to the wall on upgrades.



Well I thought you were with stock cooler, the noctua NH-D14 is as good as that aio I showed you, maybe your ambient temperature is holding it back or the case if you use might be hot inside, well i dont use a case.


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## Space Lynx (Nov 4, 2019)

Metroid said:


> Well I thought you were with stock cooler, the noctua NH-D14 is as good as that aio I showed you, maybe your ambient temperature is holding it back or the case if you use might be hot inside, well i dont use a case.



there you go i updated my system specs, sorry

keep in mind im running a 4.2 core no downclock overclock, 75 celsius is pretty good.


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## Metroid (Nov 4, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> there you go i updated my system specs, sorry
> 
> keep in mind im running a 4.2 core no downclock overclock, 75 celsius is pretty good.



if you can keep that temperature while doing a cpu-z multicore benchmark then is good.

This is what I could do with the coolermaster 240mm aio, 69c, 15 minutes test. Stock cooler 90c, 3 minutes test hehe


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## Space Lynx (Nov 4, 2019)

I just did 15 minutes. 75 celsius was my max, but I am in a soundproof case and you are open air, so that makes sense. im fine with that. i also got 75-79 celsius in small fft prime95 after about 7 minutes.  pretty happy really, I will be leaving everything as it is now and just game ^^


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