# TechPowerUp! Official IC Diamond Test



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

*May be a few days for Andrew to log in and confirm to everyone, he had to have a very minor surgery this week and is recovering quietly at home. I forgot all about this. He should be in before the week is through. Thanks and sorry for the delay, however everyone will get their ICD24. *


*To all TPU members that qualify!!!! 

All moderators and news posters are also welcome to this give away! *

*Also when emailing your intent to test, please include that your in the TechPowerUp test! Don't forget to include that your a member here at TPU!*


I recently became a representative for Innovation Cooling (IC Diamond 7 manufacture) and have been authorized to present to the awesome members of TechPowerUp! an opportunity to enjoy a free (including shipping) tube of IC Diamond's newest Thermal Interface Material; IC Diamond 24!!!!! 

Below you will see the quoted message from Andrew, the CEO for Innovation Cooling, on how to obtain your free tube of IC Diamond 24. Andrew, by the way is a great person to talk to and will be joining in on this thread very soon. Most likely later tonight or tomorrow sometime. 

I will be contacting Andrew as soon as I have this posted in order for him to join in on the fun! 

Folks, I was actually in on the testing of IC Diamond 7 when it was just being released, and it was a hoot! So don't delay, as there is only 100 tubes available to TechPowerUp! forum members, and have a great time doing what we all love to do anyhow.  






			
				Andrew @ Innovation Cooling said:
			
		

> Innovation Cooling (IC)will giveaway 100 syringes of ICD24 to TechPowerUp! forum members who have at least 50 posts and/or 3 months membership.
> 
> ALL POTENTIAL PARTICIPANTS MUST POST THEIR INTENT TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS THREAD IN ORDER TO RECEIVE THEIR FREE TIM
> (BEFORE OR AFTER EMAILING ME).
> ...



Until Andrew logs in and responds to this thread, if you have any questions or concerns please feel free to contact me via PM's. Try to keep questions, for the time being, to PM's so that this thread does not become flooded with such items.

Have fun guys and gals, and we will see you on the testing grounds. 

Stinger608


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

Guys, when you post your original message of "ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"


Please edit your thread once you have run your current tests with your existing TIM. Don't post a new message as it will make the thread very cluttered. 

Thanks again everyone of participating in this awesome give away.


----------



## t_ski (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS 

Using the system in my sig:

Intel i7 3930K
Asus P9X79 Pro
4 x 8GB Corsair Dominator GT
Triple 7970's (stock coolers)
Triple Asus VW246H LCD's
2 x 120 GB Corsair Force 3 (Raid 0)
500GB WD
Lite-On BluRay
Nickel-plated Heatkiller 3.0 CU
D5 with EK X-top
BIX Quad Rad w/ six Noctua NF-F12 PWM fans on the rad at full speed (4 on one side, 2 on the other to fit around the PSU, which also pulls air through the rad)
BIX 120mm rad w/ one Yate Loon medium speed fan at full speed
Corsair AX1200
Silverstone TJ07

Using MX-4 thermal paste at the moment.  Temps below were after a 5-pass run of Intel Burn Test.







Ambient temps were 21.3C (measured with my laser thermometer at a random, non-heat-producing item in the room).  Loop temps were about 24C, measured at the res.

Let me know if I missed something...


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

t_ski said:


> Using Noctua thermal paste at the moment. Temps below were after a 5-pass run of Intel Burn Test.



Excellent Ski!!! 

How long has the Noctua TIM been used on the chip? 

Also don't forget to include:

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS" LOLOL, never mind, I see ya edited your post to include that man. LOL

*Be sure and email your shipping information to Andrew at support@innovationcooling.com*


----------



## brandonwh64 (Aug 8, 2012)

I would do this but I don't have anything to take apart to test with ATM, all crunchers are happy temps


----------



## t_ski (Aug 8, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> How long has the Noctua TIM been used on the chip?



Since I took the 6970's out of the loop and added my first 7970 (about April maybe?).


----------



## natr0n (Aug 8, 2012)

I use IC diamond, great stuff.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

natr0n said:


> I use IC diamond, great stuff.



 Yes it is. The ICD24 is even better man. Jump in on this if you would like.


----------



## adulaamin (Aug 8, 2012)

*ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS*

Using Tuniq TX-4 at the moment. The max temps were after 10 passes of Intel Burn Test... Ambient Temp: 20.5C






I'll redo tests after TIM has arrived


----------



## Kantastic (Aug 8, 2012)

*ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS*

Great! I just bought a new tube of MX-4. I've been looking for something to put it up against.

GIVE ME MY TUBE OF IC DIAMOND 7!


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

Kantastic said:


> GIVE ME MY TUBE OF IC DIAMOND 7!



 This is new man, it is IC Diamond 24!!!


----------



## Kantastic (Aug 8, 2012)

Oh crap, I put Diamond 7 in my email LOL. Just sent a follow up email correcting myself.

WHERE'S MY FREE PASTE? I have an overheating laptop that's on MX-2 and a copper shim, but that hasn't helped much. Maybe ICD24 can change that!


----------



## pantherx12 (Aug 8, 2012)

Cool offer, can someone from the UK join in on the fun?

Be cool to knock a few degrees of bulldozer temperatures.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

pantherx12 said:


> Cool offer, can someone from the UK join in on the fun?
> 
> Be cool to knock a few degrees of bulldozer temperatures.



 Yes, it will be shipped world wide Panther!!!


----------



## popswala (Aug 8, 2012)

Thanks sting for the link. I'll definitely join in on this. I'm constantly swaping out coolers be it cpu or gpu. I always update the tim. Even when trying out diff cpu coolers to find which does the best job cooling for that paticular cpu. I can list everything I have running but my main ones running are in my sig. I'll be keeping my eye on this one.

o yea "ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS". I actually planned to do a few cpu cooler switching around and this would come in handy.


----------



## theonedub (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

i7 2600k @ 4.3ghz HT enabled (no power saving features on) cooled with a Corsair H100 w/ temp controlled Corsair SP120 fans and Prolimatech PK-1 material. 



Spoiler: Idle Temps













Spoiler: Load Temps


----------



## cadaveca (Aug 8, 2012)

I just spent $67 on TIM.

So:

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS






Hopefully not with chunks like the tube I received during the original tests a few years ago(I still have that tube somewheres).


----------



## hat (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

**edited and reserved, I made some changes like lapping my processor, and it doesn't make much sense to test days apart anyway as ambients can change.**


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Hopefully not with chunks like the tube I received during the original tests a few years ago(I still have that tube somewheres).



If it was on the testing from the beginning of the ICD7 tests, I am sure Andrew will throw in an extra tube of ICD7 for ya man. Once he logs in on this thread, shoot him a PM regarding that.



*Got to turn in for the evening, as it will be an early morning for me. I will answer any PM's before I have to leave in the morning. 

Thanks to all that have joined in so far.......This should be a lot of "cool" fun.........Pun intended. *


----------



## TRWOV (Aug 8, 2012)

Isn't this nice?  I'm running out of IC Diamond 7 

*ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS*


EDIT1:

This is the hardware I'll test with as it's my hottest CPU (130w TDP):


----------



## natr0n (Aug 8, 2012)

will post all tests on same day,using IC7 currently on cpu and gpu
ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS 

=)


----------



## chevy350 (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS.....

Currently using MX-4 and CPU and GPU's in sig, used IC7 in past and had great results, hoping to get same or better results with IC24......will get temp shots posted of before's later today 

Before:

Currently running cpu at 4.5GHz@1.35v, ambient room temp is 26C. Ran IBT for 10 runs on high with HT on...CPU idle 28-29C under load reached 68C


----------



## chr0nos (Aug 8, 2012)

Looking foward for the test results.

shame i'm 36 post's short xD


----------



## hat (Aug 8, 2012)

chr0nos said:


> Looking foward for the test results.
> 
> shame i'm 36 post's short xD



4.) TechPowerUp! forum members who have at least a minimum 50 posts.

5.) Or have been a forum member for at least 3 months

You can still join up.


----------



## Chicken Patty (Aug 8, 2012)

chr0nos said:


> Looking foward for the test results.
> 
> shame i'm 36 post's short xD



But you have been a member for at least three months...


----------



## Protagonist (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

Id like to see what the new temps will be while using the IC Diamond thermal compound


----------



## Completely Bonkers (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

I'm on holiday - so will put up temps before and after once the tim has arrived ready to test!  I will be using it on my dual xeons. Is there enough tim for 2 CPUs?


----------



## Liquid Cool (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

I'll be testing several notebooks with this thermal paste.

Thank you for the opportunity, I sent you an e-mail with my particulars.

Best Regards,

Liquid Cool


----------



## qubit (Aug 8, 2012)

This is cool, stinger. 

You could probably have your custom title added to show that you're a rep, like I've seen others do. You don't need 5000 posts for that.


----------



## DarkOCean (Aug 8, 2012)

i can test this on a few things so "ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"


----------



## DarkOCean (Aug 8, 2012)

i can test this on a few things so "ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"

email sent.


----------



## BATOFF3 (Aug 8, 2012)

Count me in.... "ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"

Im currently using AS5 on my setup with these results.
Keen to do a comparison.


----------



## OneMoar (Aug 8, 2012)

Die hard AC5 fan here http://wawawia.com/posts/40D/869S.jpg
ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"


----------



## TheoneandonlyMrK (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS


I fold on two pcs 24/7 and will definately test on my main rig, the second pc is a pain to re tim but should test A go well, ill start test B on it

email sent rig is listed fully, both are


----------



## H82LUZ73 (Aug 8, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> *To all TPU members that qualify!!!!
> 
> All moderators and news posters are also welcome to this give away! *
> 
> ...



 Congrats on your new Job dude.


----------



## HammerON (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

Currently using AS5 with main rig in system specs. Have been using AS5 for about 5 years so it is time for a change


----------



## coolleo (Aug 8, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

Currently using MX-4 in both CPU and GPU, will take screenshot of both TIM for comparison later.
Wondering how long will it take to ship to the other side of the earth


----------



## mauriek (Aug 8, 2012)

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"

my CPU AMD FX 8120 with Corsair H100, currently i use Arctic Silver 5 and happy with the result, i like this TIM viscosity, easy to spread, and last long..i'm curios to see the result with this new TIM.


----------



## Frogger (Aug 8, 2012)

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"
will use rig in spec currently MX4 on CPU & GPU will test both 
will update this thread as needed....1st runs uploaded ...Hotter than usual 30c room temp 08/8/12  9pm


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 8, 2012)

*Off to work guys and gals. I will try to jump in here a couple of times during the day, however if I don't get back until I get off work, it will be around 5:30 Mountain time, and I apologize for any delays. Have a great day everyone. *





Chicken Patty said:


> But you have been a member for at least three months...





hat said:


> 4.) TechPowerUp! forum members who have at least a minimum 50 posts.
> 
> 5.) Or have been a forum member for at least 3 months
> 
> You can still join up.





chr0nos said:


> Looking foward for the test results.
> 
> shame i'm 36 post's short xD



Exactly what these guys stated Chr0nos, you have been a member for well over 3 months, so you qualify man. 


Wow, great turn out over night! Thanks to everyone that has jumped in on this so far. 

I am sure that Andrew will be jumping in here today sometime LOL. To introduce himself and discuss further details with everyone.


----------



## copenhagen69 (Aug 8, 2012)

Yep this is good stuff, I got like 3 tubes at the moment I use ...


----------



## newtekie1 (Aug 8, 2012)

*ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS*

I'm in.  I'll probably test on the following:

Phenom X6 1605T @ 3.6GHz(Unlocked x4 960T)
Thermalright Ultra-120(non-Extreme)
GTX470 & GTX465

Currently using Arctic Silver Alumina on everything.


----------



## popswala (Aug 8, 2012)

Here's a few of my rigs I can try it on. I'll work on getting screenshots of the others.


----------



## DeviousTom (Aug 8, 2012)

Hah, just made an account today and noticed this thread and remembered the old one. I can't say anything about ICD24, but I had a tube of ICD7 as it was about the only paste thick enough to settle the large gap on the heatsink in my laptop and it was absolutely fantastic. Easily a drop of 10 degrees. Great stuff, and I can't wait for all the results around here. Hopefully someone can compare it to the old stuff and post the results? Perhaps that would give me the initiative to clean out my laptop again . And if it can beat out the more popular competitors (as I remember ICD7 just barely scoring lower than the best pastes) then I'd even consider it for my gaming rig. Just remember people, it is REALLY thick, I mean seriously thick. Also if you don't want to scratch up the IHS on a CPU or GPU or a heatsink, do a careful cleaning, preferably with some of those thermal paste removing compounds, of this stuff (at least ICD7) since its mixture of diamonds can cause lots of microscratches (removed some of the lettering from my GPU when I was doing some testing of pastes).

Have fun peoples. Jealous am I.


----------



## de.das.dude (Aug 8, 2012)

CONGRATS on the awesome job 
too bad im in india


----------



## Arctucas (Aug 8, 2012)

What is the difference between ICD 24 and ICD 7 (which is what I am currently using)?

In the past, I seem to recall (and please correct me if that is wrong) the difference was only the amount of TIM in the syringe.


----------



## VulkanBros (Aug 8, 2012)

*"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"*

Using Antec Formula 7 Nano Diamond right now on all crunchers - so it would be fun to throw it against that.....


----------



## scaminatrix (Aug 8, 2012)

theoneandonlymrk said:


> ON MY HONO*U*R IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS




Fix'd! 

I swore I would never remove my CPU cooler again unless it was life and death as it's close to impossible without breaking something so I'll have to pass. Seems my days of hardcore testing and lulz have come to an end 



de.das.dude said:


> CONGRATS on the awesome job
> too bad im in india



I'm sure that dosen't matter  Hell, I'll even pay for the shipping if you want some and shipping is the issue


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 9, 2012)

*Please note the top of the original post! I forgot that Andrew had to have minor surgery the beginning of this week.*





de.das.dude said:


> CONGRATS on the awesome job
> too bad im in india



Doesn't matter De.Das. Innovation Cooling will ship it world wide.



Arctucas said:


> What is the difference between ICD 24 and ICD 7 (which is what I am currently using)?
> 
> In the past, I seem to recall (and please correct me if that is wrong) the difference was only the amount of TIM in the syringe.



IC Diamond 7= 7carat

IC Diamond 24= 24 carat


----------



## 1freedude (Aug 9, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

Using IC7 now.  Email sent.  Might have desert tests!


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 9, 2012)

Thanks stinger608 for your efforts, Much appreciated.

First batch mailing will go out tomorrow. Just to note we will mail worldwide on this  if you met the other qualifications 50 posts and/or 3 months membership

Andrew 

Innovation Cooling


----------



## Frogger (Aug 9, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> First batch mailing will go out tomorrow



thanks for the update Andrew gald to see your back to work


----------



## natr0n (Aug 10, 2012)

forgot to ask, how many grams in syringe ?


----------



## TRWOV (Aug 10, 2012)

4.8g, I assume


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 10, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Thanks stinger608 for your efforts, Much appreciated.
> 
> First batch mailing will go out tomorrow. Just to note we will mail worldwide on this  if you met the other qualifications 50 posts and/or 3 months membership
> 
> ...



Andrew!!!!!!! Ya made it my friend! Nice to see ya over here on the "dark side." 

Seriously man, TechPowerUP, or as well all pretty much refer to it as "TPU," has a great member base. Awesome people and very honest.

For example, Copenhagen, who is a long time member, currently has 3 tubes of the ICD24 and backed out of the free give away. Figured he didn't need any more and didn't want to deprive another member from receiving a tube!!  Very awesome of him to do this. 

That is the kind of folks that are in this great community. I think you'll find some very awesome people roaming around in here Andrew!!!

Oh and I would like to give you a huge:

*WELCOME TO TECHPOWERUP!!! *


----------



## Brusfantomet (Aug 10, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

am not at the system it would be used on atm (but wil bee tomorrow) so temps would have to wait

intel I7 920
MSI x58 Pro-E
Nocuta NH-U12P SE1366
2 x HIS radeon HD 6950 with a  Artic cooling accelero extreme + II  
TIM: AS5 atm, applied Jan 2012. 

I am tho in the process of deciding what kind of watercooling i am getting for that setup.

don't have 50 posts, but have been a member since march.

Edit:
ok here are the temps (see pics)
ambient was 24 degrees C (according to a cheap thermometer i got, feels like 21 tho). The CPU cooler was set at 870 RPM(probably the reason i got over 70 degrees C), and the GPU had control over its fans.


----------



## Arctucas (Aug 10, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> <SNIP>
> 
> 
> IC Diamond 7= 7carat
> ...



So, I am correct; the only difference is the quantity?

Then, "IC Diamond's newest Thermal Interface Material; IC Diamond 24!!!!!" is really the same stuff? 

It is good TIM, I have no complaint about the performance, but it is rather difficult to spread, and it stains the IHS and heatsink base.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 10, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> So, I am correct; the only difference is the quantity?



 Quantity of what? The amount of TIM in the tube, or the amount of diamonds in the chemical make up? 

It is a different chemical make up, so no your not correct actually.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 10, 2012)

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"

System in my System Specs

System Name:	Black Box
Processor:	Ivy Bridge i7 3770k @ 4.6 GHz
Motherboard:	Biostar TZ77XE4
Cooling:	Thermaltake Water 2.0 PRO 2x Delta 115cfm fans 
Memory:	Mushkin Redlines 1866 9-10-9-28-1T 2x4gb (8gb)
Video Card:	ASUS Radeon HD 7970 Direct Cu II 1125 / 1425
Hard Disk:	120gb Adata S510 ssd + 5.5 TB storage
Optical Drive:	2 LG Dual layer sata burners
CRT/LCD Model:	Samsung T24A350 1920x1080, Acer AL2016W 1680x1050
Case:	Fractal Designs Define XL Black Pearl
Sound Card:	onboard
PSU:	Thermaltake Toughpower Grand 1050W 80+ GOLD
Software:	Windows 7 64bit Professional


the 3770k is toasty little bugger would be nice to shave a few more temps off, i have MX4 to compare against as well as plain old nasty white goop. so would be nice to have some sexy badass TIM to test with.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 10, 2012)

crazyeyesreaper said:


> "ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"
> 
> System in my System Specs
> 
> ...




Glad to see ya jump in on this Crazy!!!!!


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 10, 2012)

yea i got 3 tims to test and a hot chip so if i can get some and it drops temps 1-2c its epic win in my book. If i wasn't such a pansy id try it on my GPU as well lol but it already runs cool so its moot there. anyway rambling aside...

I must haz cheezeburger or IC Diamond 24 or hell anything they want to give me. Beggars can't be choosers


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 10, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> So, I am correct; the only difference is the quantity?
> 
> Then, "IC Diamond's newest Thermal Interface Material; IC Diamond 24!!!!!" is really the same stuff?
> 
> It is good TIM, I have no complaint about the performance, but it is rather difficult to spread, and it stains the IHS and heatsink base.





Arctucas said:


> So, I am correct; the only difference is the quantity?
> 
> Then, "IC Diamond's newest Thermal Interface Material; IC Diamond 24!!!!!" is really the same stuff?
> 
> It is good TIM, I have no complaint about the performance, but it is rather difficult to spread, and it stains the IHS and heatsink base.



ICD24 Is the same mix as the ICD7 - only difference is volume - 4.8 gm is = Carat = .2 grams X 24 = 4.8 We weigh all tubes as filling machine has a tolerance of =/- 5%  machine is set to a +10% so there are no under fills.

We strongly discourage manual spreading as our investigations have shown that manual application whips air into the mix and resulting air bubbles

Manual Spread






Same application as above clamped between two glass slides note the white spots these are the initial air bubbles. Again the issue or problems with air bubbles is that air is very difficult to compress and will expand under heat and pressure which will displace the TIM with voids - *This will impact performance and reliability which is why we recommend a Compression spread only* Please Review Application Notes






We recommend cleaning thoroughly with acetone then a final wipe with IP - Most true staining noted was on the copper only due to copper oxidation with some copper bleed to the nickel IHS was due to improper cleaning. 

Chemically there is not much there to react with it is Mostly Diamond (92 %) a couple % carbon black, couple % polymeric binders and a drop or two synthetic oil.

Contamination will cause a stain so cleanliness is important. 

We always recommend that the sink be cleaned thoroughly also especially when they are new from the factory as some residue from the factory cleaning may remain as we have noted in the past these will react with the polymeric binders and will harden to a rock hard consistency. . It happens infrequently as I have only two examples in the last five years.

Note the halo around the hardened ICD This is a signature of contamination. Manufacturing heat sinks is a dirty process, nickel plating, flux cleaners, multiple washes and minuscule droplets of a industrial cleaner can cause a problem, So good shop practice is clean all with a good solvent before assembly. 








Many of the stain pictures I have seen posted have been a misconception as Copper under heat will oxidise at a faster rate but the area in contact with the CPU is under compression and air tight and so does not oxidise and is as shiny as the day it was lapped so the contrast between the naturally oxidised copper and the n-oxidised area is misconstrued as a stain.

The oxidation is only 400 to 600 atoms thick and has no effect on performance and is a cosmetic that is buried from the light of day so I wonder at people preoccupation with it. In any event it can be easily removed for those perfectionists with any thermal compound as most compounds, AS5, Shin Etsu, MX4 etc. contain aluminium oxide (what they make sand paper out of) and are natural lapping compounds, a little dab on a clean cloth and 10 seconds of vigorous polishing and it will be gone.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 10, 2012)

^ that is good to know


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 10, 2012)

Contact and Pressure  - The Only Thing You Ever really need to Know About thermal Compound

Besides adequate application amount the only 2 things anybody has to know to understand thermal compound reliability and thermal compound performance is good contact/pressure (C/P). 

It's that simple, if the sink's barely touching the CPU Performance will drop.

If the sink's barely touching the CPU, perhaps only 25% contact area you have 3X heat transfer through 1/4 the area. The solder iron effect with the increase in heat density will kill any paste or LM in short order, even solder joints fail under these thermal stresses.

If you had a 100 Identical PC Systems all with a great mounting system and running the same wattage results would be pretty much identical in performance and reliability. The issue in variability of mechanics in mounting are reflected in the variability of results.

Following charts show a non trivial 9 C spread- To qualify a result it has to be quantified.










[/QUOTE]


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 10, 2012)

One of the things we will be looking at in this survey is Water block/Thermal Compound performance. On our last survey at OCUK there was a high % water blocks tested, almost 25% and  most cluster in the low performance range and would like to see if the trend continues


I thought this was an Interesting breakout of the numbers Delta' between compounds on the Water Cooling shrink considerably about 2C on the MX2 and MX3 and 2.75C on the MX4.

The only one cooler that bucked the trend was the Corsair and perhaps the EK block with better mounting schemes.







Below is a data sort of the test results The blue bars are air cooling all others in red are water cooling.

The Corsair results are marked in green and follow the usual distribution






More later


----------



## de.das.dude (Aug 10, 2012)

scaminatrix said:


> Fix'd!
> 
> I swore I would never remove my CPU cooler again unless it was life and death as it's close to impossible without breaking something so I'll have to pass. Seems my days of hardcore testing and lulz have come to an end
> 
> ...





stinger608 said:


> *Please note the top of the original post! I forgot that Andrew had to have minor surgery the beginning of this week.*
> 
> 
> 
> ...




yes i know, but indian customs will confiscate it and probably throw it in the incinerator


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 10, 2012)

Thanks Andrew for all the informative posts my friend.


----------



## digibucc (Aug 10, 2012)

On my honor in exchange for free compound i do solemnly swear to test and post my results


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 10, 2012)

hell ill do more than post results ill do a mini review lol

also i epic fail forgot to send the Email till just now


----------



## Arctucas (Aug 10, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> Quantity of what? The amount of TIM in the tube, or the amount of diamonds in the chemical make up?
> 
> It is a different chemical make up, so no your not correct actually.



I see, your initial reply was somewhat vague in that regard.

So, exactly how new is this formula?


----------



## Arctucas (Aug 11, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> ICD24 Is the same mix as the ICD7 - only difference is volume - 4.8 gm is = Carat = .2 grams X 24 = 4.8 We weigh all tubes as filling machine has a tolerance of =/- 5%  machine is set to a +10% so there are no under fills.



Thank you for the clarification.


<SNIP>



IC Diamond said:


> We recommend cleaning thoroughly with acetone then a final wipe with IP - Most true staining noted was on the copper only due to copper oxidation with some copper bleed to the nickel IHS was due to improper cleaning.
> 
> <SNIP>
> 
> Contamination will cause a stain so cleanliness is important.





If improper cleaning/contamination is the reason for the discoloration, I wonder why I have only noticed it from using ICD and not other TIM such as MX-4, Shin-Etsu 7783D, or T-C 0098 or Quantum? 

I always use the same cleaning method; 91% IPA on a paper coffee filter.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 11, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> Thank you for the clarification.
> 
> 
> <SNIP>
> ...



People can post pictures of any staining here they encounter if they wish - can not analyze what you can not see, lets get some feedback I am OK with that.

post em up











> The oxidation is only 400 to 600 atoms thick and has no effect on performance and is a cosmetic that is *buried from the light of day so I wonder at people preoccupation with it*. In any event it can be easily removed for those perfectionists with any thermal compound as most compounds, AS5, Shin Etsu, MX4 etc. contain aluminium oxide (what they make sand paper out of) and are natural lapping compounds, a little dab on a clean cloth and 10 seconds of vigorous polishing and it will be gone.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 11, 2012)

Just an Idea here - How about we include some* Contact & Pressure Paper* with each sample Similar to what you see as  raw image in data points 1 & 2?

The test is simple - just mount the paper between your sink and IHS then remove it -Raw prints can give allot of information about your mount - A great tool - we might like to even take a few and do a full lab analysis.

it would just delay the samples a day or two any interest?







[/QUOTE]


----------



## popswala (Aug 11, 2012)

+1

That is a good idea cause most cpu coolers have different retentions and may get tighter then others given that most of the testers are installing there coolers the right way lol.

I'm in for this one.

also will we get an email if we were selected or we'll just get in the mail?


----------



## Arctucas (Aug 11, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> People can post pictures of any staining here they encounter if they wish - can not analyze what you can not see, lets get some feedback I am OK with that.
> 
> post em up



Perhaps on my next teardown, around the first of next year.


----------



## fullinfusion (Aug 11, 2012)

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"
Cool thread, I already use the IC Diamond 24K paste. I've been using it for about a year now.

Best of the best imho.. I was testing the size to apply all day yesterday and found a blob about a tad smaller then an eraser on a pencil.. that much in the center was perfect to cover the 2700k cpu without any being squeezed out around the cpu... It actually spread perfect and I was surprised.

Here is a screen shot of my temps under stress..

I got about an 8c drop in temps over other paste... Not going to mention the names but MX-4 AS5 is crap compared to this stuff... I know the MX guys are going to flame me but whatever 

Im not trying to sell, or tell ya to buy this stuff! But if you don't win go grab a tube of it. You cant go wrong and you wont be dissapointed


----------



## Frogger (Aug 11, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Contact & Pressure Paper


 are we talking about this type
$$$  $61.00/12 in. x 10.6 in. (30.5 cm x 27 cm).


----------



## fullinfusion (Aug 11, 2012)

Frogger said:


> are we talking about this type


Nice find, and interesting too


----------



## fullinfusion (Aug 11, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> So, I am correct; the only difference is the quantity?
> 
> Then, "IC Diamond's newest Thermal Interface Material; IC Diamond 24!!!!!" is really the same stuff?
> 
> It is good TIM, I have no complaint about the performance, but it is rather difficult to spread, and it stains the IHS and heatsink base.


Bull shit!!! Arctucas! The only stain in in your shorts 

Holly hell man!! This stuff you dont need to spread.... read my other post as I spent all day yesterday testing this stuff out... If you spread any paste your a fool, and I mean that in a kind way! Never spread the TIM... Dab it on the center of the cpu and place on the HS and let the heat of the cpu and pressure of the HS to spread it out. 

I'll be glad to pop off my water block and take a picture of my EK-Supreme HF nickel plated water block, and wipe it clean with 99% rubbing alcohol and show you no stains! You better get your shit straight b4 commenting on bullshit... let me guess your a MX user? 

I had the IC paste on for 6 months and the only reason I pulled off the block was to change all my O-rings on all the fittings for my loop. The surface of the block is still a mirror a finish like day one lmao!


----------



## Jimmy2k9 (Aug 11, 2012)

I just got some IC Diamond 7 yesterday for my new cpu/hs and used it, says it takes around 2 hours for peak performance, seems to be doing good so far.


----------



## fullinfusion (Aug 11, 2012)

Jimmy2k9 said:


> I just got some IC Diamond 7 yesterday for my new cpu/hs and used it, says it takes around 2 hours for peak performance, seems to be doing good so far.


Bahh, It's good to go!  straight after heating it up for one time... This stuff really dont cure but stays flexible is the only way I can describe it.... Works like a charm! 

have you removed the HS to see how it spread?


----------



## Arctucas (Aug 11, 2012)

fullinfusion said:


> Bull shit!!! Arctucas! The only stain in in your shorts
> 
> Holly hell man!! This stuff you dont need to spread.... read my other post as I spent all day yesterday testing this stuff out... If you spread any paste your a fool, and I mean that in a kind way! Never spread the TIM... Dab it on the center of the cpu and place on the HS and let the heat of the cpu and pressure of the HS to spread it out.
> 
> ...



Whatever you say...

All I know is what I have personally experienced, if you have different results, I cannot comment on that.

And, I use a copper base block (Heatkiller 3.0) so your assertion that your nickel plated block is comparable is flawed. Tell me, how does the CPU IHS look?

Also, I discovered that the 'grain of rice' application method is most suitable, and I was not saying that I ever spread TIM, yet ICD appears to not 'spread out', when the heatsink is applied, as easily or completely as some other thinner TIM, which is to be expected given the viscosity.

As to being a "MX user", I tend to try different TIM over time, MX being one of several.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 11, 2012)

Frogger said:


> are we talking about this type




That's the stuff


----------



## hat (Aug 12, 2012)

Just wanted to bring some attention to the first post in this thread, in case any record keeping over on IC's side has been done. I have lapped my processor, so that introduces a change in temps (looks like a 5c drop, roughly...). I'm also now running at 4GHz, so that introduces more heat. I'll post up current temp results when I get the paste. Hopefully IC Diamond knocks it down some more for me!


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 12, 2012)

hat said:


> Just wanted to bring some attention to the first post in this thread, in case any record keeping over on IC's side has been done. I have lapped my processor, so that introduces a change in temps (looks like a 5c drop, roughly...). I'm also now running at 4GHz, so that introduces more heat. I'll post up current temp results when I get the paste. Hopefully IC Diamond knocks it down some more for me!



We are including some Contact and Pressure Paper with all samples so you can check your lapping


----------



## Brusfantomet (Aug 13, 2012)

awesome, the only ting missing is that i did manage to register right.


----------



## VulkanBros (Aug 13, 2012)

Is there a preferred bench software we should use? in order to better compare results?


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 13, 2012)

VulkanBros said:


> Is there a preferred bench software we should use? in order to better compare results?



These were some on the concerns on the last give away at OCUK - So let's put it out for discussion and you people can decide, perhaps a Poll?





> *** HEADS UP *** Post # 149
> 
> For the people running the test I would recommend using LinX. I have just done a run with Perihelion and noticed the load temps where 5'C better with Noctua NT H1. However after looking at the LinX results you can see that the Noctua NT H1 was infact causing thermal throttling with the time/GFLOP going all over the place. Anything from 31 GFLOP to 48 GFLOPs. Obviously using Primeor .... you would never know and Noctua NT H1 would come out on top.
> 
> ...


----------



## Frogger (Aug 14, 2012)

most  interesting results on GPU's


----------



## OneMoar (Aug 15, 2012)

I hope I get a chance to try this stuff I gotta redo all the machines in the house
ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS
systems will include a cedermill p4
AMD althlon II and a prescott p4


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 15, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> I hope I get a chance to try this stuff I gotta redo all the machines in the house
> ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS
> systems will include a cedermill p4
> AMD althlon II and a prescott p4



Don't forget to record the current temps at idle and load OneMoar.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 15, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> Don't forget to record the current temps at idle and load OneMoar.



First group hit the post this morning approx 30 samples out - *Plenty of samples still available*.

I will start a separate Results Thread for posting results with instructions for format, application and how to use the Contact and Pressure paper.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 15, 2012)

i hope i was one of the 30 lol


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 15, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> I hope I get a chance to try this stuff I gotta redo all the machines in the house
> ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS
> systems will include a cedermill p4
> AMD althlon II and a prescott p4



and do not forget to send address


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 15, 2012)

Frogger said:


> most  interesting results on GPU's
> http://i291.photobucket.com/albums/ll300/ICD7/OCUKICDvsgpuSTOCKFINAL.png



From EVGA test series


----------



## cdawall (Aug 16, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

I'm in for this. I have a couple overly hot GPU's and some watercooling to test.

Some AM3 cpu watercooled
CH3
GTX 295 watercooled
Watercooled by a laing d4 and d5, swifty 480, 320, and 240 rads with 255cfm fans in push/pull.

Xeon 3440@4.2 on an H70
GB H55N
GTX 470 high end air cooler

Pair of old netbooks with overlooked L310's.

Out of curiosity do you want any sub zero testing done? Not making any guarantees but I might be able to get a bit of dry ice going.


----------



## dr emulator (madmax) (Aug 16, 2012)

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"

yes i'll give it another go (i already have some 24carat diamond paste) (never hurts to apply some new)


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 16, 2012)

I sent each of you guys 3 Contact & Pressure Tests and your raw test results will look like the images below - It's a great tool for analysing performance, If you feel so inclined and not embarrassed by your result you can scan or photograph it and post along with your thermal results to compare.

I would also like to survey the end users here as to how this(C/P) would work as a stand alone product I can buy in bulk and repackage into test kits perhaps with a retail of $3 per test.

The target here is not so much profit but our view is the more people have a full view of the process the better for our paste sales. It's not rocket science & with a few comparison examples end users should be able to do the analysis on their on their own and trouble shoot any mounting problem.




> From the onsite Review
> 
> *Testing/Troubleshooting Notes*
> 
> ...


----------



## KainXS (Aug 16, 2012)

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"

Planning to test on my GTX460, GTX560 and Q8400 and my Dell Precision as I am getting bad temps on those with tuniq and they're overclocks,

good luck on your new job man


----------



## t_ski (Aug 16, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> I sent each of you guys 3 Contact & Pressure Tests and your raw test results will look like the images below - It's a great tool for analysing performance, If you feel so inclined and not embarrassed by your result you can scan or photograph it and post along with your thermal results to compare.
> 
> I would also like to survey the end users here as to how this(C/P) would work as a stand alone product I can buy in bulk and repackage into test kits perhaps with a retail of $3 per test.
> 
> The target here is not so much profit but our view is the more people have a full view of the process the better for our paste sales. It's not rocket science & with a few comparison examples end users should be able to do the analysis on their on their own and trouble shoot any mounting problem.



I think the ideal would be to include multiple sheets.  I know if I put one on and tested it as I currently have my block mounted and found that I had uneven pressure, I would want to test different ways to mount it.  At least yould offer a multi-pack, too, in addition to single sheets.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 16, 2012)

t_ski said:


> I think the ideal would be to include multiple sheets.  I know if I put one on and tested it as I currently have my block mounted and found that I had uneven pressure, I would want to test different ways to mount it.  At least yould offer a multi-pack, too, in addition to single sheets.



My only concern would be pushing the retail price too high as I think most could be done with a couple of tests although I could test market something like 6 X 9 sheet or 8.5 X 11? Maybe nice to have around when you need it but then you are talking $10's of and not spare change


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 16, 2012)

for most coolers i feel 2-3 sheets would be all thats neccessary in my situations only two would be needed first to test pressure second to test a correction its not rocket science most coolers tend to have 1-4 parts to tighten knowning to loosen 1 tighten another to gain better overall pressure would be enough i feel.


----------



## t_ski (Aug 17, 2012)

If you're talking one 2"x2" square of contact paper for $3, I don't think $9 for a three-pack would be out of the question.  I feel one would be a test to see how it looks, then another if you need to change something, and a third just in case.  And if it works fine the second time, you have a spare to mess around with if you want to play around with something in the future.

Now, if I misunderstood you and it's actually three pieces for $3, then that would be awesome.  A ten-pack would be only beneficial to the card-core people out there with multiple rigs and to hardware reviewers.


----------



## SonDa5 (Aug 17, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"


Please send me a sample and I will gladly participate.  I have a HD7950 and i5-3570k that I currently run on a water cooling loop.  I use IC Diamond right now and would like to try the new formula.


----------



## Frogger (Aug 17, 2012)

t_ski said:


> If you're talking one 2"x2" square of contact paper for $3, I don't think $9 for a three-pack would be out of the question.


That would be the right size pack @ the right price. As ski also noted a multi pak for  multiple rigs and to hardware reviewers would fit right in to a marketing program.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 18, 2012)

Just wanted to say thank you to all of the great members joining in on this awesome test and give away!!!!!!!

This will be a ton of fun for sure.


----------



## brandonwh64 (Aug 18, 2012)

If you have any left I think I can test now since I need to install a different cooler on the I7-920 for crunching. If not its ok I am glad you got to do this for the community.

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"


----------



## erocker (Aug 18, 2012)

Just want to say thanks for the sample! I have a new 3770k on the way and I will be using the IC Diamond on that as well as my 2500k processor along with my 7970. I look forward to the results.


----------



## chevy350 (Aug 18, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> Just wanted to say thank you to all of the great members joining in on this awesome test and give away!!!!!!!
> 
> This will be a ton of fun for sure.



Thanks for the notice on the give away


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 18, 2012)

brandonwh64 said:


> If you have any left I think I can test now since I need to install a different cooler on the I7-920 for crunching. If not its ok I am glad you got to do this for the community.
> 
> ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"



Plenty of samples still available.


I found a retailer that will do some test marketing on the C/P paper So I will send them 50 test kits next week. My intent here is to turn it over to them so I won't make any money off of it. 

I do have a motivation of raising the bar here on internet testing in general and end user performance improvement , the reviewer in post 98 while he had a 3 C improvement in IC Diamond over AS5 at the end of the exercise his total improvement was 5C with the total lapping exercise which is fairly typical when using this paper combined with lapping. another on the OCUK giveaway one end user had a 7C improvement on his TR sink on the overall.

Maybe TechPowerup could be the first to review the new Product........?





> Originally Posted by t_ski View Post
> If you're talking one 2"x2" square of contact paper for $3, I don't think $9 for a three-pack would be out of the question.





> That would be the right size pack @ the right price. As ski also noted a multi pak for multiple rigs and to hardware reviewers would fit right in to a marketing program.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 18, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Plenty of samples still available.
> 
> 
> I found a retailer that will do some test marketing on the C/P paper So I will send them 50 test kits next week. My intent here is to turn it over to them so I won't make any money off of it.
> ...




See folks, this is why Andrew is so awesome!!!!!! He wants TPU users to be a first in new product review!!!!!! Very awesome IC!!!


----------



## chevy350 (Aug 18, 2012)

Just recieved my sample and contact paper, unfortunately I'm scheduled for work so it looks like I will be doing the contact test and paste change tomorrow and get some results up shortly after.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 18, 2012)

chevy350 said:


> Just recieved my sample and contact paper, unfortunately I'm scheduled for work so it looks like I will be doing the contact test and paste change tomorrow and get some results up shortly after.



Don't forget to get the "before" readings prior to installing the new thermal past Chevy!


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 18, 2012)

got my sample today, gonna have to wait till i get a free day off to test it out but ill be posting my numbers here and doing a small article for a Total War Center publication testing MX4, and of course the IC diamond paste.


----------



## OneMoar (Aug 18, 2012)

just got my sample today I replaced the paste on my system with AC5 last night I will have test results later today


----------



## OneMoar (Aug 18, 2012)

test 1. AC5 /W 12H cure now applying the IC dimond
my 2500k rig is out of commission until I can buy a new psu

http://cl.ly/Ioym


----------



## TRWOV (Aug 18, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> test 1. AC5 /W 12H cure now applying the IC dimond
> my 2500k rig is out of commission until I can buy a new psu
> 
> http://cl.ly/Ioym



you have to edit your original post for the tests:




stinger608 said:


> Guys, when you post your original message of "ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"
> 
> 
> Please edit your thread once you have run your current tests with your existing TIM. Don't post a new message as it will make the thread very cluttered.
> ...


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 18, 2012)

TRWOV said:


> you have to edit your original post for the tests:



I am setting up a separate results thread so we can track the data more readily


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 18, 2012)

Now posted for results

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170709


----------



## hat (Aug 18, 2012)

Got the paste in today. Looks to be about the same as MX-2, but it looked like the paste was much thicker than MX-2, so I'll wait about a week or so and give it some curing time, give it some time to spread out all nice and even...


----------



## HammerON (Aug 19, 2012)

It would be nice to know who was on the list to be sent the paste to test. I have not received mine as of yet.


----------



## popswala (Aug 19, 2012)

I got mine. Thats a big tube it comes in. Very sweet. Should be getting to trying it out in the next few days.


----------



## 1nf3rn0x (Aug 19, 2012)

Any more tubes left? I have a system that hasn't had the cpu thermal paste changed since the first time I installed it (e7400+p5ql-se) so I wouldn't mind seeing how well this paste goes against the stock intel 
ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

If there is any left I wouldn't mind a tube 

And to apply this put a 5.0-5.5 mm bead and then let the cooler do the spreading?


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 19, 2012)

1nf3rn0x said:


> Any more tubes left? I have a system that hasn't had the cpu thermal paste changed since the first time I installed it (e7400+p5ql-se) so I wouldn't mind seeing how well this paste goes against the stock intel
> ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS
> 
> If there is any left I wouldn't mind a tube
> ...



*Plenty of Tubes Left*

I allotted 100 tubes for this Give-away and have given out about 30 samples so far


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 20, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Plenty of Tubes Left
> 
> I allotted 100 tubes for this Give-away and have given out about 30 samples so far



Second bulk mailing goes out tomorrow so get your requests in


----------



## VulkanBros (Aug 20, 2012)

Not got Any TIM.... guess its a long way to Denmark


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 20, 2012)

Last mailing I did to the UK was on avg 7-10 days - depends on whether they use the slow or fast boat....


----------



## VulkanBros (Aug 20, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Last mailing I did to the UK was on avg 7-10 days - depends on whether they use the slow or fast boat....



Slow boat.... You are not without humor,  Sir


----------



## t_ski (Aug 20, 2012)

I got mine today on my lunch, but will be a while before I can swap out the TIM.  Hopefully before Thursday.

What's the recommended way to warm up the tube to make it flow more easily?  Is there a certain temp I want the water to be?


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 20, 2012)

I do not warm it up myself - should be okay as is, I usually recommend that in the winter months with colder room ambient temps or when you pull it out of the mailbox and it's -10 C outside. you can always just put it in your pocket, heat vent, on top of a piece of warm electronics if you deem necessary. 

I even microwave it myself for a few seconds when I come into the office in the winter with heat turned down. You do have to watch it closely though when you do that

Not recommended for any other compound, I absent mindedly microwaved  a metal oxide compound a couple years ago and had a nifty little toxic fire going, it was pretty exciting lol


----------



## cadaveca (Aug 20, 2012)

Hi, IC Diamond.

So, I got a PM telling me staff would get seperate mailings from everyone else.

Well, you previously did the same sort of test, years ago, on another website, and the same applied. Except the sample I got back then had chunks in it that killed two VGAs byu scratching the surface of the GPUs when mounting the heatsink. This cost me over $800 in replacements.


So, info from between then and now, tells me that the sample was contaminated, so either the user that was responsible for shipping to staff on that site screwed with my sample, or you guys sent out some bad stuff.

I will not place my hardware under the same risk. I'd love to take part in the testing, but unless you send to me directly, I will not participate.

Thanks!


Dave.


----------



## hat (Aug 20, 2012)

Truth be told, I'd really like to see cadaveca's results with this stuff...


----------



## t_ski (Aug 20, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> I do not warm it up myself - should be okay as is, I usually recommend that in the winter months with colder room ambient temps or when you pull it out of the mailbox and it's -10 C outside. you can always just put it in your pocket, heat vent, on top of a piece of warm electronics if you deem necessary.
> 
> I even microwave it myself for a few seconds when I come into the office in the winter with heat turned down. You do have to watch it closely though when you do that
> 
> Not recommended for any other compound, I absent mindedly microwaved  a metal oxide compound a couple years ago and had a nifty little toxic fire going, it was pretty exciting lol



I just saw that somehad commented that it's very thick and was easier to spread if it was warmed up a little.


----------



## SonDa5 (Aug 20, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Hi, IC Diamond.
> 
> So, I got a PM telling me staff would get seperate mailings from everyone else.
> 
> ...



Could you post a photo of the damage.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 20, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Hi, IC Diamond.
> 
> So, I got a PM telling me staff would get seperate mailings from everyone else.
> 
> ...



So back then... you were part of a giveaway and you had extensive damage and did not mention it? Odd.


Point of fact is we have had over 23 giveaways with over 900 tests by end users and no reports of damage as you decribe- I have never had an email or phone call from any user with a complaint about wholesale damage to their equipment. And I can confidently say you never contacted me.

Contamination is very unlikely, we contract mix our compound to a company that uses multi million dollar mixing machines in a clean room environment, heated and under a vacuum. This is unlike our retail competitors  who do their mixing in an open air environment with unfiltered air. 

We buy our diamond from the number 1# Diamond Supplier in the USA and they supply to companies that make diamond optical lapping paper. "large Chunks" would not be possible and demonstrate a lack of understanding of the screening process, our contract mixer then samples all material for conformity to specifications. We then fill from the shipped can transferring the compound into sterile syringes. There is no opportunity for contamination in fact I seriously doubt any other manufacturer is a rigorous as we are.

We are not a bunch of Yahoos we make every effort to produce a high quality professional product. IC Diamond is used extensively in mission critical systems where performance and reliability is key to their use. It is used today in avionics, servers on Navy ships, Speciality LED lights for mining operations and oil rigs as well as emergency medical devices etc.

If you had that experience perhaps it was contamination on your end we always recommend cleaning sink and cpu. In any event end  users here can report their results and we will see how things look at the end of the exercise.


----------



## TheoneandonlyMrK (Aug 20, 2012)

i posted and emailed ages ago, what with the anticipation i now cant be assed, i posted weeks ago and no show. yes email was sent. see post 34


----------



## brandonwh64 (Aug 20, 2012)

I sent in an email this morning, how long is the turn around for a conformation that I will be involved in the sample testing?


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 20, 2012)

there is none brandon you just end up getting it in the mail lol.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 20, 2012)

t_ski said:


> I just saw that somehad commented that it's very thick and was easier to spread if it was warmed up a little.



Our suggested method of a 5.5mm bead on centre is a compression spread, most good retail heat sinks are 50 psi + in pressure. Add some heat and the viscosity changes so the compound spreads easily on it's own (cures as they say) without entraining or whipping(as with a manual spread) in any air which will cause performance/reliability issues. Unless you are in a sub 60F ambient room temperature no warming should required.


----------



## brandonwh64 (Aug 20, 2012)

crazyeyesreaper said:


> there is none brandon you just end up getting it in the mail lol.



Ahh ok Crazy, I will just be on the look out. I will go ahead and install my cooler to get my cruncher back up and then change the paste once it arrives.

Will be comparing it to Arctic Silver Ceramique


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 20, 2012)

theoneandonlymrk said:


> i posted and emailed ages ago, what with the anticipation i now cant be assed, i posted weeks ago and no show. yes email was sent. see post 34



we bulk ship once maybe twice a week - first shipment was last week - slow boat 10 days fast boat 7 days


----------



## Kenshai (Aug 20, 2012)

Will give this a shot. Going on my 2500k under a Xigmatek Gaia with it's stock paste on it. 

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS


----------



## DOM (Aug 20, 2012)

On my honor in exchange forfreecompound i do solemnly swear to test and post my results


----------



## cadaveca (Aug 20, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> So back then... you were part of a giveaway and you had extensive damage and did not mention it? Odd



Actually, I did. With pictures. I was also staff on that forum. 

As I mentioned, it's clear the sample was contaminated. However, not by myself, as I have always been careful. I have been doing this PC hobby thing in a big way for the last 12 years. 

So, rather than worry about it, I'd like one from you directly, that is all. No need to defend anything. I wanna give it a try, with a good sample, rather than what I got last time.


----------



## Arctucas (Aug 20, 2012)

@IC Diamond,

Are the samples you are giving out in any way different than those available at retail?


----------



## brandonwh64 (Aug 20, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Actually, I did. With pictures. I was also staff on that forum.
> 
> As I mentioned, it's clear the sample was contaminated. However, not by myself, as I have always been careful. I have been doing this PC hobby thing in a big way for the last 12 years.
> 
> So, rather than worry about it, I'd like one from you directly, that is all. No need to defend anything. I wanna give it a try, with a good sample, rather than what I got last time.



Do you have a forum post on this over at their site? I would like to see this before I use it as well. Not taking any sides here but want to see the issue for myself. I pay for my hardware and really do not want to ruin something due to a 5$ thermal paste.


----------



## cadaveca (Aug 20, 2012)

brandonwh64 said:


> I pay for my hardware and really do not want to ruin something due to a 5$ thermal paste.



I really do not think you need to worry. I received that sample via a third party, and somewhere between me getting it, and it being sent, the tube was spoiled. Because of this, I'd rather avoid the third party.

I tested both CPUs and GPUs, back in 2009. Only the post with the CPU results still exists. I still have those cards in my garage somewhere . Anyway, in those threads back then, there are reports of staining, and the compound polishing off the writing on CPUs. The staining is an indicator of contamination, apparantly.


----------



## brandonwh64 (Aug 20, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> I really do not think you need to worry. I received that sample via a third party, and somewhere between me getting it, and it being sent, the tube was spoiled. Because of this, I'd rather avoid the third party.
> 
> I tested both CPUs and GPUs, back in 2009. Only the post with the CPU results still exists. I still have those cards in my garage somewhere .



Ahhh ok well I understand dave.


----------



## cadaveca (Aug 20, 2012)

Forthe CPU testing, it was good, to be honest, but now I have CPUs with much higher power draws, so I very much want to check that out. I mean, I do have like eery current CPU, and then some.


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 21, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> @IC Diamond,
> 
> Are the samples you are giving out in any way different than those available at retail?



It is the exact same tube as buying retail Arctucas.


----------



## t_ski (Aug 21, 2012)

I got home today and the drywall dust was already floating around, so I'm down for at least a week.  I don't want to have to clean that crap out of my system (again  )...


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 22, 2012)

Come on folks, still have tubes available!


----------



## DarkOCean (Aug 22, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> Come on folks, still have tubes available!



mine still haven't arrived


----------



## chevy350 (Aug 22, 2012)

DarkOCean said:


> mine still haven't arrived




Mars is a long way away 
Mine may have been sent out in the first mailing and it took about 9 business days, just depends on when it was sent and to where.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 22, 2012)

We shipped yesterday so up to date - Just to note we ship once or twice a week so there may be a few days added delay on normal snail mail delivery times.

*Still plenty of tubes left*


----------



## itsakjt (Aug 22, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS.
Currently my system is running with Cooler Master Thermal Fusion 400 and after 10 runs of Intel Burn Test, my CPU maximum hits 58-59 degree C. I am using the stock cooler and all other specs are on my profile. 
I would be happy if I get one of those thermal compounds. Thank you.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Aug 22, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> We shipped yesterday so up to date - Just to note we ship once or twice a week so there may be a few days added delay on normal snail mail delivery times.
> 
> *Still plenty of tubes left*



Hope more people get in on this, as for me ill finally start testing soon most likely this weekend, so ill update my post in the other thread with stock vs stock and overclock vs overclock against my current MX-4, also still got some Noctua NTH1 laying around as well i think.


----------



## DOM (Aug 23, 2012)

So do you get an email back after you email the info or just wait and see if you receive tube ?


----------



## hat (Aug 23, 2012)

Pretty sure you just wait for the tube to come in.


----------



## Nokiron (Aug 23, 2012)

Id love to test this. Will be really interesting in how this perfoms. Im also thinking about using it on my 580's aswell.

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS


----------



## Kantastic (Aug 23, 2012)

Computer was supposed to be finished today, but ran into a slight hiccup so the replacement won't be here until Friday. Should have results between MX-4 and IC Diamond 24 by Saturday.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Aug 23, 2012)

I've purchased this in the past actually. I found the spread difficult and the cleanup later difficult as well. Just my personal experience. 

I'd give it an other whirl though after reading through this thread and reading the preferred method of application. I'll try that this time. 

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 23, 2012)

AphexDreamer said:


> I've purchased this in the past actually. I found the spread difficult and the cleanup later difficult as well. Just my personal experience.
> 
> I'd give it an other whirl though after reading through this thread and reading the preferred method of application. I'll try that this time.
> 
> ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS



Nothing is easier than a compression spread as we recommend, The problem that most have with removal is that they do not understand good shop practice in that you have to let the solvent do the work not your elbow - removal takes only 10 - 20 seconds you have to re- liquefy the compound with the solvent then dab off. Simple and easy when I have time to final edit the application video I will post it here.


----------



## Kenshai (Aug 23, 2012)

Recommend the compression method for HDT coolers as well? I've taken to filling in the minor spaces first on the bottom of the cooler.


----------



## t_ski (Aug 23, 2012)

With HDT coolers it was recommended to wet the bottom of the pipes a little first to help fill in the gaps.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 23, 2012)

Kenshai said:


> Recommend the compression method for HDT coolers as well? I've taken to filling in the minor spaces first on the bottom of the cooler.



Yes you are right about that - the video link below the guy does essentially the same thing and most seem to get great results with this technique. -Just to note His removal of the old compound is what I was talking about earlier and is a perfect example of how not to do it.. He uses little solvent, does not re- liquefy the compound  and the removal is more of a scrubbing exercise. Solvents are designed to do the work which is why you use them and I am surprised how many people miss that..

Proper removal you would take a cotton ball or a piece of waded up paper towel saturate with a solvent like acetone and liberally dab it/ saturate the surface with solvent. This mixes with compound in a few seconds it is literally a liquid at this point and remove with a dab or a single swipe.

This works even with rock hard situations with the exception for expediency you tease off the larger chunks(usually the excess that is squeezed out on application) with your fingernail then follow the same process for the compound in the contact area, it takes only seconds.



http://youtu.be/rlO6Gx7Uf6g


----------



## SonDa5 (Aug 23, 2012)

Where are you guys located?  Still haven't received the TP.


----------



## DOM (Aug 24, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> Where are you guys located?  Still haven't received the TP.



got mine today it came from CT


----------



## Kenshai (Aug 24, 2012)

Got mine yesterday as well, will put it through the test this weekend.


----------



## Brusfantomet (Aug 24, 2012)

haven`t received one either, but both US - Norwegian postage and the Norwegian customs may slow it down.


----------



## EarthDog (Aug 24, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

Currently rocking MX-4. Was part of the testing at OCF for the IC7.

3770K
DDR3 2666Mhz
GTX680 Lightning
Seasonic 1KW PSU


@ Stinger/ IC Diamond - How good is this product with sub-zero cooling? Has that been tested yet? Does it hold up its cooling properties with DI temps? LN2? LHe?


----------



## DOM (Aug 24, 2012)

I was going to try it out on ss -50c and maybe ln2 not sure what time Im gettin out of work today, where doing inventory


----------



## stinger608 (Aug 24, 2012)

EarthDog said:


> @ Stinger/ IC Diamond - How good is this product with sub-zero cooling? Has that been tested yet? Does it hold up its cooling properties with DI temps? LN2? LHe?



Thanks for the question EarthDog. That I am not sure of. We will have to wait to hear from IC Diamond on that.


----------



## SonDa5 (Aug 25, 2012)

My IC Diamond and C/P arrived today.  I'm looking forward to seeing how good of mount I am getting with my i5-3570k and my new DT Sniper water block.


I did have a slight confusion over this "newest" IC Diamond product.  The IC Diamond 24 that I have been using for a long time now looks just like the tube that you guys sent me.

Is the formula that you sent me different than what I have been using?  

Since first using IC Diamond a few years ago it has been the only TP that I use because it has worked so well for for me.  

I do have some Prolmatech PK-1 that I will be comparing it to.


----------



## EarthDog (Aug 27, 2012)

I *think* that may be for testing applications/spread? Not sure...


----------



## Brusfantomet (Aug 27, 2012)

got mine today as well. time for some testing then.

Ant tank you very much.


----------



## [NEX] (Aug 27, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

currently running an i7 2600k overclocked to 4.7 and a 1.340 vcore asrock z77 extreme9 with NT-H1 pea in the center method and a corsair H80, Intel burn in test shoots up to 81C degrees and BF3 is 70C, ambient temperature is 30 degrees humidity has been 80% lately (Beijing China, can you ship international?)
I also got 2 HD6950 in crossfire with NT-H1 that are about 64-70C on load.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 27, 2012)

We ship international


----------



## vega22 (Aug 27, 2012)

hey icd, i was part of these tests a while back on another forum and while it continued to work great on the 8800gts it did degrade after extreme voltages on my cpu.

1.7vcore to my q9550 for a few hours benching turned the tim to mostly powder with a couple of stone like bits in it. it was also under a mount which had been mod'd for very high mounting pressure.

not arsed about the pitt marks it left on the cpu or heatsink tbh but i thought i would let you know it had happened.


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 27, 2012)

marsey99 - I remember you - Not the forum but the name.

So What temps were you running? We do our reliability testing  @ 125C 1000 hours with thermal cycling with no problem - Max recommended is 150C with short spikes to 200C. above 150C the polymeric binders break down under extended use is about the only way to get to a powder. 

I have one guy at Anandtech who is 4 years on the same mount with no change in Temp and he runs in the 40's C range. On notebook review I have several in the 1-2-3 years running in the 60's to 70's C range with little or no degradation.

Contact is a real issue when you are looking at long term reliability as it relates to the watt density, for example say you 100% contact with 1.75 sq inches running 150 W . I have some images on files that are less than .25 inches contact so now apply 150 W to .25 sq inches and you have a soldering iron effect, the compound that is in the contact area will degrade faster as it is over stressed and when that fails the heat is then transferred inefficiently through the low contact area compound causing failure across the whole joint. the compound "sees" some multiple of power with reduced vs full contact.

I would note that some of the imprints posted here on TechPowerup  have high pressure in the contact areas above the 85 lb pressure limit of the paper while contact is perhaps only in the 25% to 50% range. High pressure improves performance and is the dominate factor but the joint will not reach full potential without good contact.

I only have a couple of examples of rock hard solvent insoluble IC Diamond on a dismount and at least from the limited samples they were determined to be contamination from the factory something like a residue flux or industrial cleaner. But we have always recommended cleaning the IHS and Sink I think people look at a new sink and just assume it's clean, A view that they would not have if they saw the process first hand.




> Is high viscosity (thickness) a desirable characteristic in a thermal compound?
> Yes, OEM's Spec bulk loadings actually recommend above a 90+ % for reliability. IC Diamond boasts a 94% bulk loading which includes 92% diamond + miscellanous material.
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 27, 2012)

EarthDog said:


> ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS
> 
> Currently rocking MX-4. Was part of the testing at OCF for the IC7.
> 
> ...



http://innovationcooling.com/gilgamesh1.htm

Works well follow the link - I would let the compound cure at room temp to give it time to spread minimum 10 min with a re-torque if it is a screw mount.


----------



## driver66 (Aug 27, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS .

I currently am using arctic ceramique and would love to give your compound a try! Sounds like fun !!


----------



## dr emulator (madmax) (Aug 28, 2012)

hm if i receive some i'm going to remount this Zalman cnps10x extreme 

i have recently discovered that my cooler was missing the back-plate, so i'm going to bug both overclockers.co.uk and Zalman about it, as obviously someone either removed the plate from the box or it wasn't in there, so i'm owed at least an explanation


----------



## EarthDog (Aug 28, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/gilgamesh1.htm
> 
> Works well follow the link - I would let the compound cure at room temp to give it time to spread minimum 10 min with a re-torque if it is a screw mount.


Great news. Just let it get spread is all. Very nice.


----------



## Nokiron (Aug 28, 2012)

Just got mine. Will do some tests tonight 

Edit: Have you guys tried it on a GPU yet? is it beneficial there aswell?


----------



## IC Diamond (Aug 29, 2012)

*plenty of tubes left*


Shipping on Friday


----------



## Novulux (Aug 30, 2012)

ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS!

Giving this lurker a reason to post.


----------



## TissueBox (Sep 1, 2012)

On my honour, in exchange for free compound, I do solemnly swear to test and post my results. 

I'll be testing it with my 2500K @ 4.8GHz, with an NH-D14. I'm currently using Noctua's NT-H1, but I believe I applied it wrong since my temperatures are worse than my previous Corsair A70 . I'll reapply it to test, then apply the IC Diamond 24 afterwards to test and compare. My intent would be to decrease my temperatures a bit with the IC Diamond 24 to bump up my clocks more.


----------



## DOM (Sep 3, 2012)

was going to do the pressure test again but my kids gots the b papers


----------



## itsakjt (Sep 5, 2012)

I still didn't get it :-(


----------



## itsakjt (Sep 6, 2012)

I just got my thermal compound direct at my doorstep! 
Thanks a lot. I have fever now. Will try it very soon.
Thanks a lot again.


----------



## newlife (Sep 8, 2012)

damn wish i had been a member for 3 months or had 50 posts im using arctic sliver 5 and would love to try something better


----------



## Kantastic (Sep 8, 2012)

Okay so I still don't have a system up and running, but I will soon. Managed to buy a Maximus IV Gene w/ a glitchy PCI-E slot and RMAed it. Once that gets back I'll be able to test the TIM. The good thing is I have a Thermaltake Water2.0 Extreme coming in, so that'll be a great cooler to pair the IC Diamond with.


----------



## itsakjt (Sep 14, 2012)

Today, I tried the thermal compound on my friends laptop.
It is definitely good. 
Application is slightly difficult as it is the direct on-chip application.
Have a suggestion. Make the thermal compound's density slightly less.
I mean it should be more viscous. 
More tests coming. 
Including the pressure tests on my desktop.
AMD Phenom II X4 955 CPU.
So stay tuned.


----------



## Random Murderer (Sep 14, 2012)

Stinger, is it too late to hop in on this?
Running the OC I am, every degree helps
System tested would be my X79 rig in my specs to the left.


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 14, 2012)

Plenty of tubes available


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 14, 2012)

itsakjt said:


> Today, I tried the thermal compound on my friends laptop.
> It is definitely good.
> Application is slightly difficult as it is the direct on-chip application.
> Have a suggestion. Make the thermal compound's density slightly less.
> ...



The high viscosity relates to high reliability. 



> *Is high viscosity (thickness) a desirable characteristic in a thermal compound?*
> 
> Yes, OEM's Spec bulk loadings actually recommend above a 90+ % for reliability. IC Diamond boasts a 94% bulk loading which includes 92% diamond + miscellaneous material.
> 
> ...


----------



## Random Murderer (Sep 14, 2012)

ic diamond said:


> plenty of tubes available



*ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS*

Thanks, and I'll be emailing Andrew any time now.
EDIT: Email sent.


----------



## D007 (Sep 14, 2012)

Do we have any conclusive results on this yet? Graphs and comparisons ftw.. ^^
Been using AC5 for a long time and it's treated me well. Dare I move on? I'm waiting to see..


----------



## TRWOV (Sep 16, 2012)

got my tube today. I was thinking we'd get 5 grams or something but it's pretty big


----------



## camoxiong (Sep 16, 2012)

Do this count for stock cooling? If so, I'll be testing on a AMD Athlon x3 450 unlocked to AMD Phenom ii x4 B50 @3.2ghz, plus 2 120mm fans(1 intake and exhaust). I'll do my first testing.

Edit: I just email support@innovationcooling.com my info


----------



## adulaamin (Sep 16, 2012)

I received my paste a week ago and I will be testing within this week... I've been really busy with work lately so I'll be probably be doing the test on my day off... Thank you very much IC!


----------



## itsakjt (Sep 16, 2012)

This is the best thermal compound I have used so far!
Results:





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16

Before IC Diamond 24(Cooler Master Thermal Fusion 400)





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16

After IC Diamond 24





By itsakjt at 2012-09-16

So you can see that is a straight 1 degree C difference with the fan speed lower as well.
I am sure the difference will be more drastic with a better cooler(I am using the stock AMD cooler).

My specs are on the left.
NOTE: The day I tested the Cooler Master was cooler(2-3 degree C) than today. So my conclusion is IC Diamond 24 is the best thermal compound I have used so far. 
Next test coming- My Sapphire Radeon HD 6770 1 GB DDR5.
And if you can, can you please tell me the proper method of application on GPUs and laptop CPUs(direct on-die)?


----------



## itsakjt (Sep 16, 2012)

UPDATE:
It seems that the thermal compound is doing even more awesome under high overclocks.
Previously, I could not get to 3.8 GHz as the CPU temp exceeded 64 degree C.
Today I tried 3.8 GHz even with the IMC at 2834 MHz and the RAM at 1744 MHz.
System is super stable. 
Temps didn't go above 61 degree C even after 1 hr of Prime95. 
I am going to buy an IC Diamond 24 after this one's finished and post a pic of it here.
Love you guys at IC Diamond!
All the best.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Sep 16, 2012)

I'm tempted to put on my GPU as well but I take it you just but far less on it then you did for the CPU.


----------



## Frogger (Sep 17, 2012)

AphexDreamer said:


> I'm tempted to put on my GPU as well but I take it you just but far less on it then you did for the CPU.



used a 3mm dot on gpu in spec
results for GPU run 
from rig in specs
GPU:core 1070 mem 1400 stk voltage stk fan profile
Before Compound: MX4
Ambient Temp:30c 08/8/12 9pm 
Idle Temp:38c 
Load Temp:92c @stk_FurMarkv1.9.1 fan profile Auto [avg 3 runs]

ICD
Ambient Temp:29c 26/08/12 7pm
Idle Temp:36c
Load Temp:76c @stk_FurMarkv1.9.1 fan profile Auto [avg 3 runs]



GPU_o/c 1100core/1500mem stk voltage fan 95%
Before Compound: MX4
Ambient Temp:30c 08/8/12 9pm 
Idle Temp: 35c 
Load Temp:84c FurMarkv1.9.1 [avg 3 runs]


ICD
Ambient Temp:29c 26/08/12 7pm
Idle Temp:35c
Load Temp:78c FurMarkv1.9.1 [avg 3 runs]
source


----------



## Random Murderer (Sep 17, 2012)

damn, now I know I'll be reapplying the paste on my cards. still on the stock gunk!


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (Sep 17, 2012)

I'm curious does this use lab diamonds or the old fashion sort?


----------



## Morgoth (Sep 19, 2012)

i used  IC Diamond 7 in the past, but its to expensive for me atm, it does work great i tell you that,
my xeons would love to try 24 type


----------



## TRWOV (Sep 19, 2012)

How much cure time should I allow for the IC24? It seems that my temps didn't improve, at least not the idle temps. I left the PC on overnight and the temps are the same still. 

I was using IC7, so maybe IC24 it isn't a big improvement over it? Should I "bake" the TIM? maybe run OCCT for a few hours or something?


----------



## Random Murderer (Sep 19, 2012)

TRWOV said:


> How much cure time should I allow for the IC24? It seems that my temps didn't improve, at least not the idle temps. I left the PC on overnight and the temps are the same still.
> 
> I was using IC7, so maybe IC24 it isn't a big improvement over it? Should I "bake" the TIM? maybe run OCCT for a few hours or something?



I haven't received mine yet but was wondering as well. Maybe you have to heat cycle the 'puter like with AS5? You know, cold boot, heat it up nice and toasty(Intel Burn test or similar), let it idle til temps drop again, shut down and let the system cool to ambient. Rinse and repeat a few times.
Not sure if this stuff requires the same sort of burn-in, but it sure helps set AS5 a hell of a lot quicker(~five heat cycles versus up to a month of regular computing)


----------



## TRWOV (Sep 20, 2012)

Random Murderer said:


> I haven't received mine yet but was wondering as well. Maybe you have to heat cycle the 'puter like with AS5? You know, cold boot, heat it up nice and toasty(Intel Burn test or similar), let it idle til temps drop again, shut down and let the system cool to ambient. Rinse and repeat a few times.
> Not sure if this stuff requires the same sort of burn-in, but it sure helps set AS5 a hell of a lot quicker(~five heat cycles versus up to a month of regular computing)



I'd like to know too. Yesterday I saw a 1C improvement in load temps but it could have been the weather as it rained. I've run four cold-hot cycles already.


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 21, 2012)

Random Murderer said:


> I haven't received mine yet but was wondering as well. Maybe you have to heat cycle the 'puter like with AS5? You know, cold boot, heat it up nice and toasty(Intel Burn test or similar), let it idle til temps drop again, shut down and let the system cool to ambient. Rinse and repeat a few times.
> Not sure if this stuff requires the same sort of burn-in, but it sure helps set AS5 a hell of a lot quicker(~five heat cycles versus up to a month of regular computing)



Process of curing is a function of heat and pressure where the compound resolves down to the average particle size- We initially tested curing time by using a synthetic IHS clamped between two glass slides with 4 binder clips at approx 60 PSI with IC Diamond applied at ambient room temp and then with a micrometer at one min intervals measured the compound's bond line thickness (BLT) after 5 min we were at 98% of the average particle size overnight 100%.

Most of the C/P images on TPU have been exceptionally light so cure times can vary and some may be so light that the final BLT may never be reached. 

Pressure does impact your cure time as well as your final performance so a delayed cure would be an indicator of light pressure and *room for improvement* in the mount.


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 21, 2012)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> I'm curious does this use lab diamonds or the old fashion sort?



Synthetic Diamond in selected multiple sizes  to maximize contact between particles optimized for the best heat transfer.

Not as simple as one would think as a single size perhaps for example a 9 micron particle compound would give you the same performance or worse than a stock compound.


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 21, 2012)

We shipped on Monday and are doing another shipment Saturday. 

Plenty of tubes Left


----------



## TRWOV (Sep 21, 2012)

The pressure paper did show an extremely light pressure, as if the heatsink was concave. The fact that is mounted horizontally might affect that too as gravity would pull away from the mount. I drew a crossed circle on the heatsink and lapped with 1500 grit until it was erased and the pressure improved somewhat but still there's a lot of light pressure on the center.

I'll try with the board outside the case to let the heatsink rest on the socket.


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 21, 2012)

TRWOV said:


> The pressure paper did show an extremely light pressure, as if the heatsink was concave. The fact that is mounted horizontally might affect that too as gravity would pull away from the mount. I drew a crossed circle on the heatsink and lapped with 1500 grit until it was erased and the pressure improved somewhat but still there's a lot of light pressure on the center.
> 
> I'll try with the board outside the case to let the heatsink rest on the socket.



Remember that the sink is only 1/2 the contact equation the other half being the IHS. In some cases the IHS may be so deformed that good contact is not possible without lapping the IHS also.

It may be that the sink is deflected by it's weight but there should be adequate pressure to secure it tightly so this should no be an issue so perhaps a shim of some sort?

Over tightening can be an problem also - Some end users tell me that with water blocks they tighten to the point we the board begins to bend and then back off a bit, if the board is bent this will pull the processor away from the sink losing contact.

Enough to try the patience of the most dedicated mechanic.

Ideally you would lap the IHS and sink together with a lapping compound for a perfect fit like they used to do with the old Saab engine block and head so they needed no head gasket.


----------



## TRWOV (Sep 21, 2012)

My CPU is lapped as well:






I'll try to lap the heatsink more over the weekend.


----------



## 1freedude (Sep 23, 2012)

Ok, SABERTOOTH x58 i7 920 at stock cmos:

Idle at desktop:  35
Intel Stress Test from Extreme Tuning Utility:  43
F@H 8 threads:  56

This is using 4GB 1333 DDR3 Triple Channel, and an old application of IC Diamond.

I will remove Dell heatsink, clean, and check with C/P.


----------



## TRWOV (Sep 23, 2012)

I just finished with my tests. I'll post results now.


----------



## itsakjt (Sep 23, 2012)

This thermal compound is awesome.
I have got a HP-430 laptop and so do my college friends-given by our college. The Pentium Dual Core Sandy Bridge model.
In my laptop, I used my Cooler Master Thermal Fusion 400 and the max temp is 79 degree C.
Today I applied IC Diamond 24 in my friend's laptop and believe it his maximum temperature is now 64 degree C that is a straight 15 degree C difference.


----------



## EarthDog (Sep 24, 2012)

EarthDog said:


> ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS
> 
> Currently rocking MX-4. Was part of the testing at OCF for the IC7.
> 
> ...


Ok...... the eagle landed last week and went up H2H with MX-4....

Environment was 21C under custom water for the tests. I remounted the Diamond a couple times to make sure i was getting a good spread/mount as this stuff is STICKY and doesnt spread well it seems. That said after a good contact I saw these results:

Stock: 
MX-4 idle - 27C  (average across cores)
IC D idle - 27C   (    "           "        "   )
MX-4 load - 54C (  "            "          "  )
ICD load - 53C   (   "           "          "   )

Overclocked - 4.9Ghz 1.5v - (no power saving on constant v and clocks)
MX4 idle - 30C
ICD idle  - 29C
MX4 load - 93C
ICD load - 91C


Ugh, the viscosity and the ability of this stuff to spread is thick, wow. It doesnt even like to spread with a credit card or anything it just like clumps and rolls off the processor. Gotta do something about that if possible with the materials you use!

Thanks for the sample, solid product guys.


----------



## Arctucas (Sep 26, 2012)

Who can tell me where, other than SensorProducts (in their various incarnations) where I might buy the Fuji Prescale, or similar, without having to commit to several hundred dollars worth of product?


----------



## Random Murderer (Sep 27, 2012)

Received mine today, but I won't be able to test until this weekend.
It wasn't mentioned anywhere else in this thread that I saw, but it came with two envelopes of pressure paper labeled "A" and "B," and both contain the same size squares. The pressure paper was mentioned, but what's with the two separate envelopes, I thought it just turned pink/red where the pressure is applied? What am I missing here? Am I supposed to use one of each? I've never used pressure paper before, I feel dumb now, lol.

Oh, and thanks again Stinger and Andrew!


----------



## theonedub (Sep 27, 2012)

IC Diamond looks to be performing well, will reevaluate the temps after a few days of use: 



Spoiler: Screen Capture of Tests @ 84F ambient temp:



*On Low:*





*On High*


----------



## stinger608 (Sep 28, 2012)

Random Murderer said:


> Received mine today, but I won't be able to test until this weekend.
> It wasn't mentioned anywhere else in this thread that I saw, but it came with two envelopes of pressure paper labeled "A" and "B," and both contain the same size squares. The pressure paper was mentioned, but what's with the two separate envelopes, I thought it just turned pink/red where the pressure is applied? What am I missing here? Am I supposed to use one of each? I've never used pressure paper before, I feel dumb now, lol.
> 
> Oh, and thanks again Stinger and Andrew!



Hey RM, if you read the first post in the results thread here:

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170709

At the bottom of the original post that IC Diamond wrote you will see a short instruction on how the pressure paper is used. There is also a link to the manufacture site for further detailed instructions on the usage.


----------



## Random Murderer (Sep 29, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> Hey RM, if you read the first post in the results thread here:
> 
> http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170709
> 
> At the bottom of the original post that IC Diamond wrote you will see a short instruction on how the pressure paper is used. There is also a link to the manufacture site for further detailed instructions on the usage.



Well, I didn't bother with the pressure paper yet, but did manage to get some results:

Parts used were as listed in my system specs, particularly the X79 system. Processor clocked at 4630, 128.625 x 36, 1.4Vcore, all cores and Hyperthreading enabled.
I used CoreTemp and HWMonitor to record average and maximum temperatures during a ten minute idle after a cold boot and during a fifteen minute load of OCCT 4.3.1 64bit AVX Linpack. CoreTemp will be abbreviated as CT, and HWMonitor as HWM.
The tests were performed back to back, I cold booted my PC this morning and took down the results for the MX-2 then immediately shut down and remounted with ICD24. This process took a while as it's a bit of a pain(to say the least) to remount this cooler.

Before Compound: MX-2
Ambient Temp: 24C
Idle Temp: avg CT 40C, avg HWM 42C, max CT 47C, max HWM 45C
Load Temp: avg CT 76C, avg HWM 74C, max CT 79C, max HWM 78C

ICD 24
Ambient Temp: 25C
Idle Temp: avg CT 38C, avg HWM 40C, max CT 49C, max HWM 48C
Load Temp: avg CT 72C, avg HWM 70C, max CT 78C, max HWM 76C

I'm pretty sure I can get better temps out of this, the ICD24 tests were run immediately after mounting the cooler and I'm not too sure I achieved a good mount. The extremely high viscosity of the ICD24 is making me question how well the paste spread under this HDT cooler...


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 29, 2012)

Random Murderer said:


> Well, I didn't bother with the pressure paper yet, but did manage to get some results:
> 
> Parts used were as listed in my system specs, particularly the X79 system. Processor clocked at 4630, 128.625 x 36, 1.4Vcore, all cores and Hyperthreading enabled.
> I used CoreTemp and HWMonitor to record average and maximum temperatures during a ten minute idle after a cold boot and during a fifteen minute load of OCCT 4.3.1 64bit AVX Linpack. CoreTemp will be abbreviated as CT, and HWMonitor as HWM.
> ...



Average the load temps, then subtract the ambient temps, then subtract the after result from the before and you have an IC Diamond improvement of -3.75 C













HDT Application Video

http://youtu.be/rlO6Gx7Uf6g


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Sep 29, 2012)

do i get a prize for having the biggest temp change to date?   j/k loving this TIM might replace whats on my GPU at some point.


----------



## IC Diamond (Sep 30, 2012)

crazyeyesreaper said:


> do i get a prize for having the biggest temp change to date?   j/k loving this TIM might replace whats on my GPU at some point.



Best contact so far


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 5, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Best contact so far





By de-lidding the IHS from my i5-3570k I think I have the best contact with my DT SNIPER block.  



Here is contact paper pressure test with my DT SNIPER water block on 3570k IHS and then 3570k direct die.

With IHS.  






No IHS direct DIE!


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 5, 2012)

A suggestion to IC Diamond.


I think the IC Diamond formula is a little too thick and not smooth enough which makes it hard to apply and it is rough which causes small little micro scratches on soft surfaces such as a CPU/GPU die.

I had a problem with a block that I think was caused by IC Diamond.  I had a brand new block and I prepped and cleaned the gpu die and the block.  It was super clean.  I then put a pea size drop of IC diamond in the center and I mounted the block.

A few weeks later I took the block off to reconfigure my water loop and my block had a small hole in it and on the GPU it had a little mark in the same area.  I can post a screen shots later on.

The block manufacturer replaced the block under RMA but they were not able to identify exactly what caused the problem and at the time I wasn't sure.

After doing alot of reading online I have read of many people stating that IC diamond is too hard and can scratch a bare die.  I squeezed out a little IC Diamond and touched it with my figers and flet small little particles.  I think it is not smooth enough and one of these little particles of diamond caused a break in copper of my block and luckily didn't damage my die.

I know these claims are not good news but I really have no other ideas for what could have done this.  I want everyone to know about the problem I had so that people are aware and IC Diamond takes a look at the methods in processing this formula.


IC Diamond should re-do their formula and make it into a super smooth synthetic liquid formula.  Something that goes on like liquid and creates a nice bond like liquid Ultra.

I'm going to be trying some Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra in the next few weeks to see how it compares to IC Diamond.  I haven't seen any reviews of IC Diamond vs. Coollaboratory Liquid Ultra.


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 5, 2012)

Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals were in my  IC Diamond.



Pit in block





Mark on die with some micro scratches.


----------



## OneMoar (Oct 5, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> Reserved for photos of damaged water block and mark on bare die.



the mark on the die could be caused by the paste drying on OR it eating into the die its self  might wanna rethink running that chip in the nude IT Is diamond and diamond is hard ...
my chip also suffered from a slight `polish` nothing to be worried about if you have the IHS protecting it (its accually a good thing helps increase surface contact) it COULD end badly for a bare die tho ... I really should pull the heatsink off my gpu/northbridge and inspect


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 5, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> the mark on the die could be caused by the paste drying on OR it eating into the die its self  might wanna rethink running that chip in the nude IT Is diamond and diamond is hard ...
> my chip also suffered from a slight `polish` nothing to be worried about if you have the IHS protecting it (its accually a good thing helps increase surface contact) it COULD end badly for a bare die tho ... I really should pull the heatsink off my gpu/northbridge and inspect



My HD7950 that I had the problem with doesn't have an IHS and I prefer bare die.  I now think of IC Diamond as Diamond crystal dust cement and I got a bad batch of it.

From the photos it looks like a little glob of diamond crystal cement in the IC Diamond stood strong when I mounted my block and ripped into the block and left a mark on the die.  I don't think it was a "eating" the copper.  This happened fast after mounting it.  I only had the block on the card for about 2 weeks when I took it off to do some loop modding I saw the damage.


----------



## damric (Oct 5, 2012)

"ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS"

I'm due for a TIM change, if this is still available.


----------



## Morgoth (Oct 6, 2012)

I Finaly got the tim, ill start doing test's  tonight


----------



## OneMoar (Oct 7, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals were in my  IC Diamond.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oo thats quite a nasty little divit I don't see how you could have applied enough pressure to cause that tho thats a sizable hole .... hmmm 

did you try re:lapping it ?


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 8, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> IC Diamond should re-do their formula and make it into a super smooth synthetic liquid formula. Something that goes on like liquid and creates a nice bond like liquid Ultra.



High viscosity (thickness) a desirable characteristic in a thermal compound and is the very definition of quality/reliability vs a highly liquid compound


 OEM's Spec bulk loadings actually recommend above a 90+ % for reliability. IC Diamond boasts a 94% bulk loading which includes 92% diamond + miscellaneous material.  

Below is an example from the MPC giveaway of a more liquid compound where the compound failed after400 hours it both pumped out and baked out.

The second image are from a test we ran comparing your more liquid retail compounds to IC Diamond many of which have be tested in this giveaway. The test was run for 20 hours at 150C, the center picture labeled ICD is IC Diamond The test  highlights the stability of ICD7. The competition compounds feature the formation of voids,  and span the range of initial failure to complete failure. IC diamond  was observed to have no visible points of failure under these conditions. The picture is back lighted so the void formation is clearly visible







There are different kinds of thermal resistance. One is contact resistance which the retail compounds mostly rely on by being of higher liquid content so they flow real nice into the voids and air gaps and with great or low contact resistance enhances  thermal performance so that out of the gate many users are thrilled with the performance. Instant gratification

Low viscosity, highly liquid thermal pastes enjoy an initial success but also make them susceptible to Pump Out. Pump Out occurs when the system heats up, the joint compresses,  and a little of the liquid is pushed out. After a sufficient number of cycles, the paste has shrunken in size leaving voids and causing a contact resistance failure. A variant of compound failure, Bake Out , occurs when consistently high thermal stress  causes loss of the liquid by evaporation. Pump Out and Bake Out reflect the research of many in the thermal community and hundreds of technical papers on the exist on the well-documented issue.


Liquid is a necessary component where thermal pastes are concerned otherwise you would be applying a powder. IC Diamond uses much less liquid so consequently is much less prone to failures as the liquid is wicked or baked away The shrinkage of the compound is almost non existent due to the low liquid volume content to begin with and so maintains contact/ thermal performance for extended periods and by design to set up into a crayon like consistency over time, still pliable and relying on the high bulk Diamond conductivity for performance as you are left with basically diamond held coherently together with the polymeric binders and is easily removed when re-liquefied with a solvent

So in short the reason it is thick is that it is harder to pump a solid than a liquid and provides a basis for long term extended reliability.

High viscosity or thickness of compound is a positive feature to seek out and necessary for for long term reliability

It's easy to design a compound for performance and it is also easy to design for reliability

It is very hard to do both in one package


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 8, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> A suggestion to IC Diamond.
> 
> 
> I think the IC Diamond formula is a little too thick and not smooth enough which makes it hard to apply and it is rough which causes small little micro scratches on soft surfaces such as a CPU/GPU die.
> ...



Lots of urban myth out there that lead to misunderstandings.

Diamond while being harder than most materials has an MOHS of 10 on the hardness scale it should be noted that aluminium oxide ( MOHS of 9) which is found in AS5, Ceramiq, Shin Etsu, MX4 etc. is only slightly or incrementally harder. 

Aluminium oxide is what your typical sandpaper is comprised of and is found in most lapping compounds. Diamond will cut glass but so will aluminium oxide and is actually the preferred material when cutting or polishing glass.



> Aluminium oxide is an electrical insulator but has a relatively high thermal conductivity (30 Wm−1K−1[1]) for a ceramic material. In its most commonly occurring crystalline form, called corundum or α-aluminium oxide, its hardness makes it suitable for use as an abrasive and as a component in cutting tools.[5]



In nearly all thermal compounds the manufacturers use variable sizes of grit in order to maximize physical/ thermal contact between particles but generally you will find most in the 400-600 grit range same as you would find in 400-600 grit sandpaper which is why when lapping IHS/Sink you see little or no thermal improvement advantage with a refined lap with say a 1200 grit.

Our grit sizes are comfortably in the same size range as other manufacturers use in their compounds.

Abrasives have to move in order to work or to be abrasive. When cleaning a part all compounds should be adequately re-liquified with a good solvent like acetone so they can be removed without any undue scrubbing action that would polish or scratch. Proper procedure is just good shop practice.

Just to note that we do buy our diamond from the largest USA manufacturer of diamond and is same quality/type they sell for optical lapping. The particle screening process has been pretty well established for over 100 years and if you understand the process you would understand that large particles or rocks as a component of our compound is highly unlikely. This is why you do not find lumps of corn seed in your flour or rocks in your toothpaste or pebbles in your table salt.

We contract mix our compound in a clean room environment in  million dollar mixing machines with the mix heated and under a vacuum. the manufacturer samples all received material and tests for conformity to specifications. The compound is sent to us in containers that are attached directly to our dispensing machines for syringe filling so no chance of foreign particulate matter can enter the system. 

There is no way to determine the source of your divot from your description, I might suggest secondary contamination at your site as a +1000X sized particle diamond off the norm while not impossible is highly unlikely and as noted we make every effort possible to provide a uniform stable product.


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 8, 2012)

IC Diamond that makes sense to me.  Thank you.

I just ordered some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro and now I am having my doubts about using it.  I don't want it to pump out and bake out all of the sudden. 

Are you aware of any of these pump out and bake out conditions that are common with CoolLaboratory liquid Pro?

Do you think it is possible I got a bad batch of IC Diamond that caused the pit to my block?  It was only on it for about 3-4 weeks.

Also when I cleaned it off it left small scratches on my die and block and I did use proper liquids to clean but I rubbed instead of dabbed.  Maby a liquid like package isn't best but is there a way to improve it so that it isn't so abrasive?


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 8, 2012)

when does the die, IHS, or heatsink/ water block get to 150c? Or even close to that?


----------



## DOM (Oct 8, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> when does the die, IHS, or heatsink/ water block get to 150c? Or even close to that?



thats what i was thinking 

but i use the rub off to clean the paste off and this stuff takes longer to take off imo


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 8, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> IC Diamond that makes sense to me.  Thank you.
> 
> I just ordered some Coollaboratory Liquid Pro and now I am having my doubts about using it.  I don't want it to pump out and bake out all of the sudden.
> 
> ...



*See previous post #240*


----------



## OneMoar (Oct 8, 2012)

just had mine apart no pitting or anything a there is some light scuffing but nothing that won't clean up with a mild cloth
could have been a fluke or perhaps the diamond tim reacted with some residue from the previous tim


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 8, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> when does the die, IHS, or heatsink/ water block get to 150c? Or even close to that?



Reliability tests are almost always accelerated stress tests - All the comparison compounds are spec'd  to 150 to 180C peak for extended use. Test is a demo of IC Diamond durability/reliability


----------



## erocker (Oct 8, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals were in my  IC Diamond.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I may be wrong but it looks to me like a defect in the block itself. With a small air pocket in the metal, add heat and the metal around the pocket will degrade/disintegrate causing the pit.


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 8, 2012)

Here is some more reliability data 


0.26% weight loss at 125 C, 1000 hrs
0.01% weight loss under thermal cycle in 1000 hrs (-40 C to +85 C)
0.49% weight loss after 1000 hrs at 85 C/85% RH
2.85% weight loss at 200 C, 24 hrs


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 8, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> Oo thats quite a nasty little divit I don't see how you could have applied enough pressure to cause that tho thats a sizable hole .... hmmm
> 
> did you try re:lapping it ?





I had it RMAd and the manufacturer had no clue what caused it other then they said that they think a foreign object may have found its way into the application of TIM.


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 8, 2012)

erocker said:


> I may be wrong but it looks to me like a defect in the block itself. With a small air pocket in the metal, add heat and the metal around the pocket will degrade/disintegrate causing the pit.





I have never heard of that before but it sounds possible.  That is what I thought when I did an RMA with the manufacturer but they stated that it was impossible because of the high standards in their manufacturing process.   

They did do an RMA out of kindness though.  The block was less than a month old.  

If you could please post some links to similar experiences from others with blocks.  Thanks.


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 8, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> just had mine apart no pitting or anything a there is some light scuffing but nothing that won't clean up with a mild cloth
> could have been a fluke or perhaps the diamond tim reacted with some residue from the previous tim





When I get the Liquid Pro I will be very careful in removing IC Diamond and post photos.  Hopefully there is no damage.


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 8, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> You have good contact on the last C/P image unlike most so no voids to fill, pressure is a little light which plays to LM strengths so worth a shot



Thank you.

I am going to have the Liquid Pro in place in a week or so after I get it and I will post comparison temperature tests between IC Diamond and Liquid Pro.

This will be a good comparison for immediate temperature gratification.


----------



## OneMoar (Oct 8, 2012)

STOP
lquid pro contains Gallium stuff is garbage DO NOT USE IT!@@
DO NOT USE IT ANY-WARE NEAR a heatsink/baredie I REPEAT DO NOT USE IT IT WILL DESTROY IT 
THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU PUT GALLIUM with aluminum  Gallium Induced Failure of a Heat Sink - YouTube
GALLIUM also reacts with:
steel
iron
lead ...
its not stuff you want anyware near a cpu


----------



## erocker (Oct 8, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> If you could please post some links to similar experiences from others with blocks. Thanks.



I don't know of any off of the top of my head, but I'm someone who works with various metals on a daily basis. I cut a lot of it and weld a lot of it, etc.. I've seen very good steel and aluminum have imperfections.


----------



## t_ski (Oct 9, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> I had it RMAd and the manufacturer had no clue what caused it other then they said that they think a foreign object may have found its way into the application of TIM.





SonDa5 said:


> I have never heard of that before but it sounds possible.  That is what I thought when I did an RMA with the manufacturer but they stated that it was impossible because of the high standards in their manufacturing process.
> 
> They did do an RMA out of kindness though.  The block was less than a month old.
> 
> If you could please post some links to similar experiences from others with blocks.  Thanks.





SonDa5 said:


> When I get the Liquid Pro I will be very careful in removing IC Diamond and post photos.  Hopefully there is no damage.





SonDa5 said:


> Thank you.
> 
> I am going to have the Liquid Pro in place in a week or so after I get it and I will post comparison temperature tests between IC Diamond and Liquid Pro.
> 
> This will be a good comparison for immediate temperature gratification.



You can use the multiquote button instead of posting four times in a row


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 10, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> STOP
> lquid pro contains Gallium stuff is garbage DO NOT USE IT!@@
> DO NOT USE IT ANY-WARE NEAR a heatsink/baredie I REPEAT DO NOT USE IT IT WILL DESTROY IT
> THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU PUT GALLIUM with aluminum  Gallium Induced Failure of a Heat Sink - YouTube
> ...



The only caution that I have read in the application manual of Liquid Pro is the following:



> "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" was designed for use with high quality coolers made of copper or silver.  Aluminum coolers are unsuitable (of course this applies only to the cooler's contact surface onto which "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro". is spread).
> 
> 
> Note: Do not use cheap aluminum coolers. Their quality is not very high, and aluminum is not resistant against our Liquid Metal. Aluminum could form an alloy with "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" which would react with the surrounding air's humidity. A black stain forms after a while, showing insulating qualities.  Therefore: No contact of "Coollaboratory Liquid Pro" with aluminum. *NO ALUMINUM COOLERS!*




My concern is that no mention of direct die application is mentioned in the instruction manual.  I haven't heard anything bad about direct die.  Only bad things that I have read about are because of improper metal mixing on aluminum coolers.


----------



## OneMoar (Oct 10, 2012)

are you a 1200% sure of your blocks plating ? if not it could end very quickly and rather wet .... 
gallium is also very conductive not something I would place any-ware near a bare die I don't know what they make the IHS's out of on the 3750k but something tells me it might be reactive .... as for the die its self that i am admittedly unsure if it will kill it they used to use small amounts of aluminium/zinc to "Plate" the die 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallium
gallium attacks most other metals by diffusing into their metal lattice. Gallium, for example, diffuses into the grain boundaries of Al/Zn alloys[1] or steel,[2] making them very brittle. Also, gallium metal easily alloys with many metals, and was used in small quantities as a plutonium-gallium alloy in the plutonium cores of the first and third nuclear bombs, to help stabilize the plutonium crystal structure.[3]


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 10, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> are you a 1200% sure of your blocks plating ? if not it could end very quickly and rather wet ....
> gallium is also very conductive not something I would place any-ware near a bare die I don't know what they make the IHS's out of on the 3750k but something tells me it might be reactive .... as for the die its self that i am admittedly unsure if it will kill it they used to use small amounts of aluminium/zinc to "Plate" the die
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallium
> gallium attacks most other metals by diffusing into their metal lattice. Gallium, for example, diffuses into the grain boundaries of Al/Zn alloys[1] or steel,[2] making them very brittle. Also, gallium metal easily alloys with many metals, and was used in small quantities as a plutonium-gallium alloy in the plutonium cores of the first and third nuclear bombs, to help stabilize the plutonium crystal structure.[3]




Liquid Metal Pro sounds awesome.  

Don't worry about the IHS.  I am not using the IHS.  I only use TIM between the DIE and the water block.

I am using a high quality copper DT  SNIPER water block.

The base is made of Alloy 110 copper.  

Will Alloy 110 Copper be a problem?


----------



## OneMoar (Oct 10, 2012)

If its soild copper should be ok I would be dam careful with the LmP if it gets on one of the traces you are done


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 10, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> If its soild copper should be ok I would be dam careful with the LmP if it gets on one of the traces you are done



I will be very careful. I already have a plan in effect to help contain the LmP to the die area and help transfer heat from the rest of the pcb.

I am going to cut a thermal pad to dress around the DIE that will make contact with the block and hug the sides of the DIE while allowing the DIE to make good contact with the water block.  I'm hoping this will help lower temps even more.

I ordered some Fujipoly Extreme System Builder Thermal Pad along with the Liquid Metal Pro.

http://www.frozencpu.com/products/1...rmal_Conductivity_110_WmK.html?tl=g8c487s1730


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 10, 2012)

OneMoar said:


> If its soild copper should be ok I would be dam careful with the LmP if it gets on one of the traces you are done




The response I got from DT Water Blocks is that the DT SNIPER will not have a problem with Liquid Pro on the the DT SNIPER which is made of  Copper alloy 110 which is a common commercial/electrical grade of pure copper. It is composed of 99.9% (min) copper.


----------



## Arctucas (Oct 10, 2012)

From the lack of replies to my question of September 26 (post #223), it appears safe to presume there is no other source of the Fuji Prescale film.

I had requested a Free sample from Sensor Products (as offered on their website) but I never received any. Sensor Products excuse was; 'Lately it seems we have been having
issues with the USPS and samples.' Personally, I have never had any issue with the USPS, so I am somewhat skeptical.

Now, an individual from Sensor Products, with whom I have be communicating via email, when I declined to buy several hundred dollars worth of the product, has, in my personal opinion, insinuated that I am trying to scam them out of additional samples, which is patently untrue, and refuses to honor the free sample offer.

So, if anyone knows where I could obtain a small piece, even if it costs a few dollars, I would appreciate it.

Thanks


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 10, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> From the lack of replies to my question of September 26 (post #223), it appears safe to presume there is no other source of the Fuji Prescale film.
> 
> I had requested a Free sample from Sensor Products (as offered on their website) but I never received any. Sensor Products excuse was; 'Lately it seems we have been having
> issues with the USPS and samples.' Personally, I have never had any issue with the USPS, so I am somewhat skeptical.
> ...



I have Platinum micro that's agreed to carry it on a trial basis - The deal is I will buy some paper in bulk perhaps enough for 50 or 100 packets of 3 tests and they will test market it. and if Nat has adequate sales on it he will buy it in bulk for sale on his own account.

The ball  is in my court and I have not worked out the packaging details as I have been busy it may take me a week or two to get around to it and maybe a month to hit the shelves.

I can send you a few miss cut pieces gratis if you PM me your address just post your experience with it on the forum here


----------



## Frogger (Oct 10, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Platinum micro



so we should watch for it here would like to have a look @ the 'trial' package art work


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 11, 2012)

Frogger said:


> so we should watch for it here would like to have a look @ the 'trial' package art work



I'll let PMicro worry about the fine points, on my end just a stock colored plastic bag w/instructions.

Perhaps also a colored sticker with contact exposure examples in the red  _*poor -better -best*_ kind of thing?


----------



## SonDa5 (Oct 11, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> I have Platinum micro that's agreed to carry it on a trial basis - The deal is I will buy some paper in bulk perhaps enough for 50 or 100 packets of 3 tests and they will test market it. and if Nat has adequate sales on it he will buy it in bulk for sale on his own account.



Platinum Micro is a great little shop in my neck of the woods.  I will definitely be visiting them and buying some if the price isn't too high.

I think this whold TPU IC Diamond test has been a great success so far.  I really like how well IC Diamond works and I like the contact pressure paper.  I think contact pressure paper will become the norm for testing cpu/block for proper fit in regards to contact area pressure, it is a must do test to ensure effective mount.


----------



## Random Murderer (Oct 11, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> I think contact pressure paper will become the norm for testing cpu/block for proper fit in regards to contact area pressure, it is a must do test to ensure effective mount.



I still have to do my pressure paper test and remount the cooler.


----------



## Arctucas (Oct 11, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> I have Platinum micro that's agreed to carry it on a trial basis - The deal is I will buy some paper in bulk perhaps enough for 50 or 100 packets of 3 tests and they will test market it. and if Nat has adequate sales on it he will buy it in bulk for sale on his own account.
> 
> The ball  is in my court and I have not worked out the packaging details as I have been busy it may take me a week or two to get around to it and maybe a month to hit the shelves.



Thank you for that, do you have any idea regarding pricing? Would you please post a link to the product page at Platinum Micro once the pressure paper is available for sale?



IC Diamond said:


> I can send you a few miss cut pieces gratis if you PM me your address just post your experience with it on the forum here



I sincerely appreciate the offer, but it would be several months (or even as much as a year) before I would be ready to do a tear-down and do the tests, that is why I chose not to participate in the initial sample giveaway of both the TIM and the pressure paper; I believe it would not be fair to you.

I have no issue with buying my own ICD at retail, as well as the pressure paper (if the price is not prohibitive such as the offer I received from Sensor Products).

Thanks again


----------



## IC Diamond (Oct 11, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> Thank you for that, do you have any idea regarding pricing? Would you please post a link to the product page at Platinum Micro once the pressure paper is available for sale?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



We have not settled on the number of tests per packet Most likely in the 5-$8 range for at least 3 tests.

I just ordered the Contact paper today to seed the marketing test so perhaps a week or 3 it should be available.


----------



## Arctucas (Oct 12, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> We have not settled on the number of tests per packet Most likely in the 5-$8 range for at least 3 tests.
> 
> I just ordered the Contact paper today to seed the marketing test so perhaps a week or 3 it should be available.



Excellent news, at that price, I would like to buy two or three packets.

You will post a link to the online store when it becomes available?


----------



## t_ski (Oct 29, 2012)

Andrew (or anyone else for that matter), can you post a pic of a Socket 2011 CPU like a 3930K _without_ the IHS?  I've been googling looking for one and can't seem to find any.


----------



## Random Murderer (Oct 29, 2012)

t_ski said:


> Andrew (or anyone else for that matter), can you post a pic of a Socket 2011 CPU like a 3930K _without_ the IHS?  I've been googling looking for one and can't seem to find any.



I believe the 2011 CPUs have the IHS soldered to the core...


----------



## t_ski (Oct 30, 2012)

I know that is true, but that doesn't mean there aren't any pics out there.  I'm positive I've seen a few failed IHS removal pics, but I can't find them now.


----------



## Random Murderer (Oct 30, 2012)

t_ski said:


> I know that is true, but that doesn't mean there aren't any pics out there.  I'm positive I've seen a few failed IHS removal pics, but I can't find them now.



Here is a guy who screwed up his 3820 by delidding it and taking a few smd components off.

I also found two other images of LGA2011 chips delidded, but that guy removed them from his photobucket, so all that was available were small thumbnails of said images.

Hope this helps for whatever you're planning


----------



## t_ski (Oct 30, 2012)

I'm a firm believer that you need to maximize your heat removal by directing the channels in a waterblock (or the pipes on a HDT cooler) perpendicular to the core.  I'm just trying to make sure mine is done that way.


----------



## Random Murderer (Oct 30, 2012)

t_ski said:


> I'm a firm believer that you need to maximize your heat removal by directing the channels in a waterblock (or the pipes on a HDT cooler) perpendicular to the core.  I'm just trying to make sure mine is done that way.



So that pic is enough for your purposes?


----------



## t_ski (Oct 30, 2012)

Possibly - XS is down for the moment


----------



## Random Murderer (Oct 30, 2012)

t_ski said:


> Possibly - XS is down for the moment



np, mocking up a shitty paint pic for you to demonstrate the orientation.
this post will be edited with said shitty image when i'm done.

EDIT: Here you are, my friend.


----------



## ChaoticG8R (Nov 2, 2012)

Are there still tubes available? ON MY HONOR IN EXCHANGE FOR FREE COMPOUND I DO SOLEMNLY SWEAR TO TEST AND POST MY RESULTS

Got 1 690 and 1 3930K I'd like to try out!!


----------



## Arctucas (Nov 18, 2012)

@ICDiamond,

Five weeks ago, or thereabouts, you said you would make available for purchase sample sized pieces of the Prescale film.

So...?


----------



## stinger608 (Nov 18, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> @ICDiamond,
> 
> Five weeks ago, or thereabouts, you said you would make available for purchase sample sized pieces of the Prescale film.
> 
> So...?



I will contact Andrew regarding this Arctucas. Thanks for the reminder man.


----------



## DOM (Nov 18, 2012)

did anyone notice some weird smell when they removed the block after a few weeks ? and it also leaves a stain....


----------



## cdawall (Nov 18, 2012)

DOM said:


> did anyone notice some weird smell when they removed the block after a few weeks ? and it also leaves a stain....



I did and it also left a stain on mine.


----------



## Random Murderer (Nov 18, 2012)

DOM said:


> did anyone notice some weird smell when they removed the block after a few weeks ? and it also leaves a stain....





cdawall said:


> I did and it also left a stain on mine.



Seem like a chemical reaction of some sort? I haven't pulled my heatsink yet, so I can't confirm.


----------



## Random Murderer (Dec 8, 2012)

Pulled the old Xiggy off to replace it with an H100i. I can confirm that it left an odd smell(almost like fish attractant, that stuff you spray on your lures... it doesn't work, btw) and a very persistent stain. It also seems to be a bit abrasive, as I can no longer read the writing on my chip.

IC Diamond, any explanation of what might be going on here?


----------



## Athlon2K15 (Dec 8, 2012)

Had similar results as you random as did sneeky. I would contribute it to the simulated diamond or whatever they use in the thermal paste,as its obviously abrasive.I actually remember cadaveca saying something about the IC diamond f%cking up some of his gpu cores because if its abrasive properties.

I do know that I will never use it again.


----------



## Random Murderer (Dec 8, 2012)

AthlonX2 said:


> Had similar results as you random as did sneeky. I would contribute it to the simulated diamond or whatever they use in the thermal paste,as its obviously abrasive.I actually remember cadaveca saying something about the IC diamond f%cking up some of his gpu cores because if its abrasive properties.
> 
> I do know that I will never use it again.



On a CPU with a lid, I don't see a problem, but a delidded CPU or a GPU core is definitely out of the question. Good thing I still have some MX-2 and AS5 lying around.


----------



## Arctucas (Dec 8, 2012)

stinger608 said:


> I will contact Andrew regarding this Arctucas. Thanks for the reminder man.



Any word?


----------



## Arctucas (Dec 8, 2012)

@DOM, cdawall, Random Murderer,

Thanks for the confirmation of staining, which I had previously mentioned (Post #57 of this thread). At least I am not the only one.


----------



## t_ski (Dec 8, 2012)

Mine stained, too, but I didn't have it on that long.


----------



## TRWOV (Dec 9, 2012)

mmm... I think IC needs to  offer an user guide or something... I removed my heatsink and found this:














Maybe it doesn't like cooper-cooper mounts?


----------



## Athlon2K15 (Dec 9, 2012)

Diamond is one of the hardest substances on earth while copper is a soft metal...Not surprising this happened.


----------



## SonDa5 (Dec 9, 2012)

TRWOV said:


> mmm... I think IC needs to  offer an user guide or something... I removed my heatsink and found this:
> 
> 
> Maybe it doesn't like cooper-cooper mounts?




That looks almost identical to some damage I had on a water block and gpu die.  

Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals were in my  IC Diamond.



Pit in block





Mark on die with some micro scratches.





I am 99% convinced that some of these tubes of IC Diamond have large chunks of diamond crap that does this.  


I have figure out a way to apply IC Diamond and not have to use high pressure. a little smudge of it with rubbing alcohol smoothed o ut over die.. .Super thin.  I think doing it like this helps ensure no diamond nuggets are present.


----------



## TRWOV (Dec 9, 2012)

Heck, they even have the same shape. Weird.

I understand the pit but the scratches? It's not like I'm grinding the heatsink against the CPU or anything.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Dec 9, 2012)

When you push the heat sink on the dot of IC Diamond it spreads. That is one source of movement. Another source might be from the liquid getting hot. Atoms move around faster when they are heated, but I don't know if that would be enough to cause micro scratches like that. They even recommend to do that for proper application and mention a break in period which occurs afters the liquid gets heated up so it can spread better. 

I am slightly worried. I'm still using the IC Diamond and haven't bothered to check if any damage has been done to my heat sink or CPU. Performance has remained roughly the same so haven't had a reason to check until reading the above posts. Aside from the scratches which could be sanded out that dent is pretty large :/


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 28, 2012)

SonDa5 said:


> That looks almost identical to some damage I had on a water block and gpu die.
> 
> Photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals were in my  IC Diamond.
> 
> ...



Sorry for the long pause here we have been distracted with the commercial end of the business

The diamond we buy for our compound is purchased from one of the largest diamond suppliers in the country, the same sources and sizes that are used for optical lapping. 

The diamond we buy is commonly referred to in the biz as a flour.Here are some pictures posted as IC Diamond scratches magnified 250% it is no big deal to analyze "scratches" which can only be made a certain width/depth by an established particle size, the fact that they represent a particle size 10X+ times the diamond component in our compound should be noted. Any suggested idea particles are larger than this shows a lack of understanding of the screening process as you will not find 1200 grit sandpaper peppered/contaminated with 150 grit sized particles and especially in mission critical optical components like lasers you will not see errantly large particles. We purchase only the highest quality and pay through the nose for it. 

To draw a contrast for you I am privy to a competitors processing technique in which the paste is mixed in paint mixers, in a block building, with unfiltered air. 

We are not Yahoos or hillbilly's, we contract our mixing and the people that do it, do it in a sterile air filtered environment on million dollar machines that heat the compound and mix it in a vacuum to prevent any air being folded into the compound. In addition prior to mixing our contract manufacturer performs QC testing to validate materials received meet specified material requirements.

 The containers we receive from our contract mixer are unopened and tubes are filled directly from the sealed container through the syringe tip. Our processing and quality control are state of the art.

We do pay attention and we do collect reports of supposed scratching and they are analyzed and found with out merit.

When researching a problem you look for a commonality between samples.

Below sample was recently circulated and claimed the belt sanded look was due to the sink sitting stationary on the IHS and that he was excruciating careful cleaning off the compound. Happens to be a different grit size/finish, varying grit sizes? Note the white lettering overlaying scratches. I honestly do not know the question to this - does Intel do white ink print ID on nickel plated IHS's?








So here  is a third one with a North South orientation, this "clear" picture has the addition of a circular scratch finish - This was noted as a lapped IHS. The circular marks are the same as the N/S in size which indicates it was done with the same abrasive medium, both 10X + any particle size in IC Diamond.

So a third with a another different finish - So where is the connection? it's not there.






The images below were final lap with IC Diamond, an intentional abrasion with ICD with no visible scratching, that's it, nada, none, nowhere to be seen, nonexistent, mort, deceased, no longer with us, the parrot is dead. The suggestion is ridiculous and  as a point of fact if you applied Colgate toothpaste to that finish  it would fog the mirror finish not because it is harder but the toothpaste particle size is larger and but still harder than copper to provide a scale of reference for the posted pictures.











*Note* I sent  the pictures on this thread to our supplier and his response 

*"estimating the particle size particle  necessary to produce that kind of damage as a rough estimate is 50 to 100 times larger than the largest size diamond our process can make"
*

The fact here is the particle size is on a scale as to be physically impossible to create and scaling the picture and measuring the mark  it appears to be too large to even fit through the tip of the syringe and any damage is more likely due to contamination on the install.


----------



## TRWOV (Dec 28, 2012)

Obviously the diamond wasn't that size when it was applied: it wouldn't fit trough and I didn't remove a chunk of diamond from that pit. 

Nevertheless something happens with ICD involved, those pits couldn't form on their own. What we must find out is what kind of situation triggers that reaction.

I've always used isopropyl alcohol with a clean cloth to clean the IHS and then paper towels to dry and remove what the cloth couldn't. I finish with a microfiber cloth (same type used for glasses). I don't know what kind of contamination could produce a reaction like this.


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 28, 2012)

AphexDreamer said:


> When you push the heat sink on the dot of IC Diamond it spreads. That is one source of movement. Another source might be from the liquid getting hot. Atoms move around faster when they are heated, but I don't know if that would be enough to cause micro scratches like that. They even recommend to do that for proper application and mention a break in period which occurs afters the liquid gets heated up so it can spread better.



 IC Diamond has an MOHS hardness of 10 Aluminum oxide MOHS of 9 Diamond is harder but only incrementally so

Aluminum oxide the preferred abrasive for etching glass and is used in AS5,Shin Etsu, Mx-4 etc. and would be causing wholesale slaughter of IHS serial numbers with an MOHS of 9 and similar particle sizes.

Nothing is going to move if your sink is tightened down properly, your describing physics that doesn't exist unless your sink is flapping in the breeze. 

It is surprising to me that so few people do not understand the use of  cleaners and solvents. I have watched countless videos of of people cleaning CPU's - they squirt on the cleaner and immediately begin wiping/rubbing vigorously with out giving the solvent enough time to loosen/dilute the grease. except for zinc oxide and LM all thermal grease are a rough equivalent to a 400 to 600 grit sandpaper which is made of aluminium oxide, what they make sandpaper out of. 

Scuff marks on the IHS/CPU are most easily identifiable as a rough cleaning like with a fine grit sandpaper and a little solvent.


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 28, 2012)

TRWOV said:


> Obviously the diamond wasn't that size when it was applied: it wouldn't fit trough and I didn't remove a chunk of diamond from that pit.
> 
> *Nevertheless something happens with ICD involved, those pits couldn't form on their own. What we must find out is what kind of situation triggers that reaction.*
> 
> I've always used isopropyl alcohol with a clean cloth to clean the IHS and then paper towels to dry and remove what the cloth couldn't. I finish with a microfiber cloth (same type used for glasses). I don't know what kind of contamination could produce a reaction like this.



lol, some flies buzzing the thread



> Note I sent the pictures on this thread to our supplier and his response
> 
> "estimating the particle size particle necessary to produce that kind of damage as a rough estimate is 50 to 100 times larger than the largest size diamond our process can make"
> 
> ...



Like I said it is physically impossible on our end where we have control - Lack of any proof like a .1 carat diamond stone not found in your clean up there is nothing to find out.

Also note we sell a commercial version to OEM's with an acetate to thin it so that it can be silk screened on same compound samples you have, same batch just with the added acetate- approximately 100 kg a month and that is 2600 lbs of diamond give or take per year applied through a fine mesh screen and if diamond stones were turning up We would not be meeting spec and they would cease to be our customer and so no stones and they are still our customers.


----------



## adulaamin (Dec 28, 2012)

Interesting... I might try to clean up my system on new years day to see if I have scratches or pits on mine...


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 28, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Like I said it is physically impossible on our end where we have control - Lack of any proof like a .1 carat diamond stone not found in your clean up there is nothing to find out.



I never did get a recent sample.

I also did say that this might happen, so asked for direct shipping, since you claim it MUST be contamination. Yet here we sit, several years alter after my first incident, with many other users reporting issues.


There MUST be something to this issue. This is not a matter of placing blame on you guys directly...rather, an investigation to see what the common factor is here that made for all of these users, myself included many years ago, having the exact same problem from a sampled product.

Since it was samples, many of us consider this "beta" testing, and as such, accept that there are risks involved. In an effort to minimize this risk, users with the problem, are more than likely not going to be happy with the response "you contaminated your sample", when for some users, they took the package out of the envelope, removed the lid, and applied the paste, only to be met with problems later on.

How is it that we ALL manage to contaminate our IC diamond, and are met with similar issues?


As to staining, I do have a solution, and that is to use Artic Silver Cleaning Solution. This two-part cleaner first emulsifies TIM and leaves an oily layer that forces particles to raise off the surface being cleaned. A second chemical, that in the least contains citric acid, removes the left over oil.

It cleans far better that just Isopropyl, even 99.999%(which is what I used to use until I tried this product.).


I wonder if this cleaner will help with "staining" issues?

I can agree that surface contamination is very possible, since dust is floating in near everyone's home, and nearly no-one assembles their system in a clean room. If contamination is really such an issue, perhaps this product wasn't meant for home use.


I know, for a fact, I followed direction explicitly, but was met with issues, your claim of not being possible or not. I will never back down form this, because that's what happened. I got my tube, opened the envelope, cleaned the heatsink and GPU with isopropyl using a soft cotton cloth, opened the tube, applied the paste, installed the heatsink, installed the GPU, and it didn't work.

I hate to say I told you so...but I told ya this would happen, and that was why I wanted you to send me a sample directly, which you refused. That definitely didn't build any confidence in your products on my end.

And I bet all these users here reporting issues will not recommend your product, either. For you to just say "it's not our fault"...well...that's not nice to hear. Just saying.


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 28, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> I never did get a recent sample.
> 
> I also did say that this might happen, so asked for direct shipping, since you claim it MUST be contamination. Yet here we sit, several years alter after my first incident, with many other users reporting issues.
> 
> ...



The fact here is the particle size is on a scale as to be physically impossible to create and scaling the picture and measuring the mark it appears to be too large to even fit through the tip of the syringe and any damage is more *likely due to contamination on the install*.
[/QUOTE]






> Like I said it is physically impossible on our end where we have control - Lack of any proof like a .1 carat diamond stone not found in your clean up there is nothing to find out.
> 
> Also note we sell a commercial version to OEM's with an acetate to thin it so that it can be silk screened on same compound samples you have, same batch just with the added acetate- approximately 100 kg a month and that is 2600 lbs of diamond give or take per year applied through a fine mesh screen and if diamond stones were turning up We would not be meeting spec and they would cease to be our customer and so no stones and they are still our customers.


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 28, 2012)

Yes, yes, you've said this all before, and doesn't answer why this "contamination" is such an issue.


Because no matter how you deny it, it seemingly is a potential problem, or you'd not have these prepared responses, re-posted over and over again.



I'll tell you what. What some other product makers do, when confronted with such issues, is ask for samples to be returned, so that this problem can be investigated.


You, you're refusing to even acknowledge users having an issue, and seemingly just blame the end user. Home end users don't care about your big business customers, and having such clients doesn't create any confidence or sympathy. They get a different product, admitted by yourself above, so why even mention it?

You asked for proof from me in the past, I posted pictures of the chunk and the obvious bad mixing in the tube evident when the label was removed(the product in the tube had both darker and lighter areas, and the chunks where in the darker areas), and that post magically disappeared off that forum.  You had proof, and did nothing is the past, why would you do it now?

Anyway, hopefully many user have no issues, but when this problem gets brought up, I'll bring my canned responses back to go along with yours.


----------



## adulaamin (Dec 28, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> The fact here is the particle size is on a scale as to be physically impossible to create and scaling the picture and measuring the mark it appears to be too large to even fit through the tip of the syringe and any damage is more *likely due to contamination on the install*.



There may be some other factor other than particle size that caused the pits/scratches? A chemical reaction maybe with some ingredient in the paste and copper? Just my 2 cents... 

And just like what cadaveca said:


> If contamination is really such an issue, perhaps this product wasn't meant for home use.


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

@ Dave, I did get a sample of this paste, three tubes actually. Wouldn't you know it, the one tube I picked, and the first application of TIM I used with this paste left scratches in my IHS and the cooler I used on it.

Contamination my ass! This was simply a chunk of "stuff" in the compound that ground into the metals as I spun the cooler a bit to release if from the grip of the TIM. 

First impressions are everything to me, and this IC Diamond stuff has some issues that need fixed before I would send it all over the planet to scratch up users equipment. I never did try the other tubes, but after seeing what the first one did, I don't want to even try them.

So now I can use other TIMs, but I still have a curved scratch in my IHS and also in the base of one of my favorite Noctua coolers


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 29, 2012)

sneekypeet said:


> @ Dave, I did get a sample of this paste, three tubes actually. Wouldn't you know it, the one tube I picked, and the first application of TIM I used with this paste left scratches in my IHS and the cooler I used on it.
> 
> Contamination my ass! This was simply a chunk of "stuff" in the compound that ground into the metals as I spun the cooler a bit to release if from the grip of the TIM.
> 
> ...



Pull the label off the tube, and look for discolouration.


10 uesrs here with "Staining".

Scratching..sure..it's very similar to a polishing compound, and wiping the TIM off the surface would, in essence, be polishing it.

Personally, I think staining is something that you must deal with, and it can be cleaned, and minor scuffing of the surface, fine, since it is quite similar to a polishing compound. 

Large chunks, and discolouration _IN THE TUBE_, I do not know the source of, or excuse.


Really, I don't care. It works good, when it's not chunky.  But do me a favor..pull those labels, look for mixed colour in the tube, and if you find it, post a pic.

Honestly, what I think is that this should come in single-application packaging, not syringes.


----------



## Arctucas (Dec 29, 2012)

Ahem...

Not meaning to distract anyone from the scratching and staining or other 'damage' issues, but whatever happened to the promise of making the Fuji pressure film available for sale?


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 29, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> Ahem...
> 
> Not meaning to distract anyone from the scratching and staining or other 'damage' issues, but whatever happened to the promise of making the Fuji pressure film available for sale?






Oh interesting, my internet is suddenly painfully slow.


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

@ Dave again...

Tubes are fine all solid grey.
As for the base scratch its one deep one, not really a polishing effect.
As for the base of the Noctua, you know the grooves left from the milling, well it looks like there is now holes in the base from where these bits crushed the tips of the high spots.


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 29, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Yes, yes, you've said this all before, and doesn't answer why this "contamination" is such an issue.
> 
> 
> Because no matter how you deny it, it seemingly is a potential problem, or you'd not have these prepared responses.
> ...



Well what do you want? Pictures posted here as proof of damage are what end users posted themselves so we provide an open analysis and argument here on a public forum - That's an  acknowledgement, I do not believe we are hiding or obscuring anything if fact we have been nothing but upfront.

Feel free to argue the proof not some vague accusation or a miss characterization of our character

If a user has damage and posts it (a picture) and it bears no reasonable relationship to the implied problem such as being totally and completely physically impossible to the 99.99999999 chance in hell I am supposed to do what? 

Please note just to humour you we pulled a 2kg sample from that batch and checked it for large stones and found none, go figure.


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 29, 2012)

sneekypeet said:


> @ Dave again...
> 
> Tubes are fine all solid grey.
> As for the base scratch its one deep one, not really a polishing effect.
> As for the base of the Noctua, you know the grooves left from the milling, well it looks like there is now holes in the base from where these bits crushed the tips of the high spots.



IF you squeeze out more paste, and you find more bits? Would make an interesting picture.


Myself, of course, it was like 5 years ago. there were many large chunks, visible through the tube itself, and dark areas in the paste. Personally, I just bought the whole contamination thing, blamed the person who sent it to me, and then when this opportunity presented itself again, I askeds for another sample, sent directly, which never happened.

Now you guys have similar issues, so I will not accept contamination, really, unless the person who shipped you the sample, the person they got it from, the mailman, or your signifigant other, heck even yourself..are trying to sabotage you.


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 29, 2012)

Arctucas said:


> Ahem...
> 
> Not meaning to distract anyone from the scratching and staining or other 'damage' issues, but whatever happened to the promise of making the Fuji pressure film available for sale?



Just got around to cutting it up and will be sending it out to 5 resellers for their test marketing-

four in the USA and one in the UK


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

Noctua NH-L12 base damage after using ICDiamond






As soon as i get my CPU free I will get an image of that in here as well.


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 29, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Well what do you want? Pictures posted here as proof of damage are what end users posted themselves so we provide an open analysis and argument here on a public forum - That's an  acknowledgement, I do not believe we are hiding or obscuring anything if fact we have been nothing but upfront.
> 
> Feel free to argue the proof not some vague accusation or a miss characterization of our character
> 
> ...



Honestly, I don't really care that much. 

Honestly, I believe you that contamination happened, but I do not believe it is the end user, or the product maker, unless extremely careless.


However, I think that you pulling sample from that batch is cool and all.. but that might not be what the end user gets. You need THEIR samples, you need the wipes used to clean the paste..I agree with you on all of this.


You need careful tracking of an issue to identify it's cause.

but why do many users find big chunks here. It is not one or two. And frankly, most of these users, I don't get along with, so it's quite pleasurable for me to see that they report issues similar to my own, since it does seem to justify me posting that this might be a problem, earlier.


I don't care what you do, since I have not had your product except that sample sent near 5 years ago. I wanted to try again, you refused to send me some.


I reported a potential problem, here are other users reporting the same problem. That's all there is here.

I think, performance-wise, IC24 was good, but those chunks did turn me off. With the part of the sample not "contaminated", I noticed a 7c drop vs AS5, which is great, and the product is priced similar to AS5.

Since that is true, I just want it to be a success. Please fix these problems. That is all I ask.


No way should users be reporting problems like this. You say so yourself. But it does re-occur, and only with this product. Why, I am not sure.


----------



## Arctucas (Dec 29, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Just got around to cutting it up and will be sending it out to 5 resellers for their test marketing-
> 
> four in the USA and one in the UK



Thanks for the update.

Any idea when it will be available for retail purchase? What about pricing/quantity?

Thanks again.


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 29, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Honestly, I don't really care that much.
> 
> Honestly, I believe you that contamination happened, but I do not believe it is the end user, or the product maker, unless extremely careless.
> 
> ...



Problem is nobody in 5 years has posted a pic of "chunk" of diamond. 

In 5 years I have never had a complaint from a reseller about chunks of diamond or scratches.

in 5 years I have never had an email or a phone call complaint on chunks of diamond or scratches

In fact this is the only forum where I am hearing many complaints but no proof offered and if I did not know better I would suspect it was one of my competitors trying to swamp the thread as they do occasionally.


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

I just added proof a few posts up?!?!?!?!

As for a competitor, neither Dave nor I are anything in the realm of your competition


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 29, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> Problem is nobody in 5 years has posted a pic of "chunk" of diamond.
> 
> In 5 years I have never had a complaint from a reseller about chunks of diamond or scratches.
> 
> ...



You do not remember me and one other user on Hardware Canucks, about 5 years ago when you did similar on that forum? That's unfortunate, but not surprising, since those posts magically do not exist any more.


The fact Sneekypeet and I agree on something.. well..


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 29, 2012)

sneekypeet said:


> I just added proof a few posts up?!?!?!?!
> 
> As for a competitor, neither Dave nor I are anything in the realm of your competition



Lol I do not see anything at all -you have to help me out on this one where?

how about a before pic? idly posting pics is not proof, get serious I could take a hammer to my sink post the pic and claim damage.

substantiate it, give me something that is connected


----------



## Athlon2K15 (Dec 29, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> The fact Sneekypeet and I agree on something.. well..



Indeed


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> The fact Sneekypeet and I agree on something.. well..



lulz. Maybe we just pay more attention than the average user?

@ IC Diamond dude....

Image of the cooler base from the factory...





Image of base with pitting in it from use of your thermal paste....


----------



## cadaveca (Dec 29, 2012)

IC Diamond said:


> how about a before pic? idly posting pics is not proof, get serious I could take a hammer to my sink post the pic and claim damage.



True enough.

Unless, of course, the user reporting the issue doesn't expect anything other than to report their experience.

I do get where you are coming from though.



sneekypeet said:


> lulz. Maybe we just pay more attention than the average user?




Meh. That's the downside to doing what we do.  Ignorance is bliss, so they say...


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

> how about a before pic? idly posting pics is not proof, get serious I could take a hammer to my sink post the pic and claim damage.



Oh no I am only here to demand you replace the TIM that come free to me, and replace the cooler, which also came free to me... Seriously?!?!?!

Seriously, maybe you should ask your boss to take over here, as you are just frustrated and pushing the blame. I have no reason to lie nor do I have a reason to just show up throwing around random claims. If you are not willing to accept that your TIM is not "perfect" in every instance, I don't know why I am continually talking to the IC Diamond wall!


----------



## t_ski (Dec 29, 2012)

I am very familiar with manufacturing processes and QC testing, and I can guarantee that only a small portion of samples are actually tested.  If any manufacturer were to take the time to 100% inspect all of their product, it would cost too much and probably introduce contamination into the product.

You say prove that there was something wrong, and these guys have posted it.

You say how do I know it wasn't that way to start with and they show you the before pics.

You say how much I've never heard of anybody having trouble with this until I came here, yet the reputation of your company was in question many times when the thread was started.

I don't know what else can be said.  These guys are reviewers and not in the pocket of your competitors.  They see lots and lots of tech: high, middle and low end, and their word has a lot more merit around here than yours.


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 29, 2012)

sneekypeet said:


> Oh no I am only here to demand you replace the TIM that come free to me, and replace the cooler, which also came free to me... Seriously?!?!?!
> 
> Seriously, maybe you should ask your boss to take over here, as you are just frustrated and pushing the blame. I have no reason to lie nor do I have a reason to just show up throwing around random claims. If you are not willing to accept that your TIM is not "perfect" in every instance, I don't know why I am continually talking to the IC Diamond wall!



Thanks that's what I needed

to be fair apply some filters, contrast, brightness to the first image and you make the imperfections in the factory fresh version stand out and it appears to be some match to the after picture "damage" I do not have time time now but tomorrow I will do some work resizing and perhaps do a see-through overlay to see how it all lines up.

A shiny copper imperfection would not be as visible as an oxidized "hole"

Can you post a full size version of the before pic or factory fresh sink higher resolution would give me more points to line up?


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

All I have is what you have for the original image. As for the "now" image, I could change its position and lighting to make it look similar to the original.

Damage is not as visible from this angle...


----------



## IC Diamond (Dec 29, 2012)

First after pic is angled so highlights sink imperfections and hides the prominent stains seen here.

I would keep in mind that machining the base is an intermediate step in the whole process, probably clamped for the soldering, in and out of production bins, probably several cleaning steps on and off assy and packing tables....you are going to get small micro dings out of the gate.

Pure copper has an MOHS of 3 - For comparison On the Mohs scale, graphite (a principal constituent of pencil "lead") has a hardness of 1.5; a fingernail, 2.2–2.5; a pocketknife 5.1

Copper is soft, barely harder than your fingernail add a little weight move it around, stack it  etc. on any uneven surface and you will get micro dings especially in fragile raised areas like with machine tool cuts.

As noted generally they are camouflaged being small and same color as the background.  now use the sink and get a micron or two of oxide or or dirt in the micro depression and now you see something that you did not see before with the new contrast.

a better factory fresh picture with better resolution would provide more points of  comparison with any luck I can line up 10 to 20 with the current sample.


----------



## sneekypeet (Dec 29, 2012)

I already told you I only have the one resolution. Explain away all you want, but your TIM did the damage to this base. If I read your statement correctly, you say that the diamond is too hard for copper bases and will most certainly damage any copper base it is used on. 

Like I said man, I'm just presenting the facts, you can do with them what you will, but these "scripted" explanations are holding no weight with me at the moment. 

I know the base was fine before applying your product...fact.
I tested the product...fact
I removed the cooler and cleaned off the TIM to find pits and damage to my base....fact
Watching you scramble with technical babble about how you try to just pass it off....priceless

At this point I am having more fun watching you squirm than actually bothering to think I would get some logical support from my findings with your product


----------



## DOM (Dec 29, 2012)

So wuts up with the smell ? And it also left a stain on my copper wb and made the letters on the ihs lighter....

Some said about the smell and didn't see any response...


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 1, 2013)

Happy New Year

sneekypeet - Thanks for the pics.

The smoking gun is here. You can clearly see the pits in the tool marks in the left upper quadrant in the contact area of the CPU.

Outside the contact area you find the same type of pits on the tool marks less contrasted without the oxide or grease in the groove between the cuts clean copper scoring against copper would be hard to spot with the naked eye but there they are.

Now as this scoring is outside the contact area and not subject to pressure there could be no crunching as the say to produce identical size type marks so looks to be a case of mistaken identity as to the source

As further confirmation you can send me your sink on my UPS account and I will clean it up and put it under the scope to provide clearer pictures and measure the size and depth of the scoring.

Also send me the sample tube of paste as we can wash it to a powder and put that under the scope and measure the particle size although after looking at this picture I know that finding particles 20X larger than spec is extremely unlikely considering the result or alternatively I could send it to a materials lab for independent testing there is one right up the road from me, either way not a big deal they will just wash it and scope it also.

As noted Pure copper has an MOHS of 3 - For comparison On the Mohs scale,  a fingernail, 2.2–2.5

Machining the base is an intermediate step as clamping the base after full assembly is to awkward, sink was clamped for soldering, I see screws so there was one assembly step at least, a cleaning step to remove machine oil, another to remove flux from soldering, packaging & a lot of physical handling went on between steps, in and out of production bin or carts and unto tables.

 This was a mass production item in China not fine jewelry from Tiffany's New York.

So against a back drop of mass production you have a base with tool marks I'll estimate at .001 in height and width made out of soft copper it would take minimal effort to score a base tool mark, plenty of grit in a production environment  and plenty of opportunities in movement from station to station. This is consistent as the scoring is uniform across the base and same/type as the contact area

In any event I will PM my UPS account number, send me the sink and sample tube and I will run the confirmation tests


----------



## AphexDreamer (Jan 1, 2013)

So how many people are saying their heat sinks took damage from the compound? Is it only certain heatsinks? I've yet to check mine.


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 1, 2013)

I didn't see damage on the heatsink other than some stains (got rid of them with lemon juice) but my CPU showed a pit and light scratches:















Before the test:






The scratches I can understand but I don't know how the pit formed. 

I was using IC7 before the sample arrived and after that I tested with Cooler Master's standard compount, MX-4 and then IC24. IC says that's some sort of contamination and maybe it was because of all the TIM shuffling but I'm still baffled on how that pit formed


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 1, 2013)

I didn't see damage on the heatsink other than some stains (*got rid of them with lemon juice*) 

lol, I will file that advice and use it

If you are concerned you can send me your sample and we can wash it and measure the particles


----------



## RejZoR (Jan 2, 2013)

I'm thinking of ordering some of this stuff if it's really up ti 7°C better. I'll just have to check Amazon or eBay or somewhere else as no one is selling this in my country  But then i'm a bit afraid that i'll get the actual thing (at least for eBay)...

As for the damage, if you add diamond particles between two metals, it's logical that it will scratch it one way or another, even if they are all at specified 40 microns size. If there are so big particles to make dents half a milimeter big, then there has to be massive chunks of diamonds which you'd see during application of thermal compound imo. So it had to be something else.


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 2, 2013)

It really gives results, no doubt. In my case it got about 1-2°C less than MX-4 but needs several hot-cold cycles to get to its optimal performance. Idle temps are nothing to write home about, load temps are stellar.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 2, 2013)

RejZoR said:


> I'm thinking of ordering some of this stuff if it's really up ti 7°C better. I'll just have to check Amazon or eBay or somewhere else as no one is selling this in my country  But then i'm a bit afraid that i'll get the actual thing (at least for eBay)...
> 
> As for the damage, if you add diamond particles between two metals, it's logical that it will scratch it one way or another, even if they are all at specified 40 microns size. If there are so big particles to make dents half a milimeter big, then there has to be massive chunks of diamonds which you'd see during application of thermal compound imo. So it had to be something else.



If you are supposed to apply a blob in the center of the cpu, explain to me how I would see chunks again?


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 2, 2013)

There wasn't a chunk of diamond in the pit if that's what you're wondering. I think it's some kind of corrosion but it'll be nice if IC could replicate it and tell us how to avoid. Maybe offer a cleaning compound along with the TIM?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 2, 2013)

RejZoR said:


> I'm thinking of ordering some of this stuff if it's really up ti 7°C better. I'll just have to check Amazon or eBay or somewhere else as no one is selling this in my country  But then i'm a bit afraid that i'll get the actual thing (at least for eBay)...
> 
> As for the damage, if you add diamond particles between two metals, it's logical that it will scratch it one way or another, even if they are all at specified 40 microns size. If there are so big particles to make dents half a milimeter big, then there has to be massive chunks of diamonds which you'd see during application of thermal compound imo. So it had to be something else.



Plenty of sample tubes left -


----------



## RejZoR (Jan 2, 2013)

So, i only have to submit current temperature vs ICD temperature in order to apply for the sample?

Which version are you sending? ICD7 or ICD24 ? Also what about postage costs if any?


----------



## ALMOSTunseen (Jan 2, 2013)

RejZoR said:


> So, i only have to submit current temperature vs ICD temperature in order to apply for the sample?
> 
> Which version are you sending? ICD7 or ICD24 ? Also what about postage costs if any?


ICD24. Shipping is free.


----------



## RejZoR (Jan 2, 2013)

I'll contact IC Diamond representative for the sample. I wonder how much i'll gain with my ANTEC H2O 920...


----------



## Random Murderer (Jan 2, 2013)

TRWOV said:


> I didn't see damage on the heatsink other than some stains (got rid of them with lemon juice)



Good to know. Just be careful with it, lemon juice is highly conductive.



Still no word on what causes the rancid smell? IC Diamond, I'm looking at you >.>


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 2, 2013)

Random Murderer said:


> Good to know. Just be careful with it, lemon juice is highly conductive.
> 
> 
> 
> *Still no word on what causes the rancid smell? IC Diamond, I'm looking at you *>.>



subjective to the individual, I can barely smell anything, much less than any household cleaning product- 92% diamond couple % polymeric binder and carbon black and a perhaps a drop of synthetic oil per application so the only thing would be the oil.

altogether pretty inert stuff


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 2, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> subjective to the individual, I can barely smell anything, much less than any household cleaning product- 92% diamond couple % polymeric binder and carbon black and a perhaps a drop of synthetic oil per application so the only thing would be the oil.
> 
> altogether pretty inert stuff



I don't think it's "large particles"  of diamond causing the pitting...It's a chemical reaction.


Perhaps a batch of rancid oil used? This might explain the smell, and why some users have issues?


Honestly, to me, the pitting found by some users seem like some chemical etching. Is it possible some left-overs from past paste applications is causing a chemical reaction?

If you look at Sneekypeet's picture, sure, there is a bit of minor pitting there, but where the base of the cooler made contact with the chip, there is far greater pitting. Personally, I'd think that the constant heating and cooling cycles is causing the oil used to become rancid, accelerated possibly by some sort of contamination.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 2, 2013)

I've been using IC Diamond for a few years now and cant say I have ever seen any scratches or have smelled any thing that others are complaining about. 

I did ask for a tube of this test compound but never got anything and it's been months now.

From what I see everyone asked for a test tube and now some are they're bitching?! 
I don't think anyone held a gun to there heads to use this stuff. It was FOR TESTING and like anything else in the world nothing is perfect,,, It's called SHIT HAPPENS so suck it up butter cup!

God it just blows my mind reading some of the posts here and seeing all the bitching and complaining on things... So ungrateful are many ppl.

I pulled off my water block which is a EK-Supreme HF EN Full Nickel block, I seen a slight I mean only at a certain angle in the sun light can you see a stain but just like any other metal it WILL stain! The cpu has more of a stain but who cares? It's not hurting anything.
Metal on metal and different metal on metal will cause some discoloration, its a fact! Be it water blocks, car engines you name it! 

I have a simple solution to all the moaning in here. Just don't use the product. Plain and simple! Thank the rep for the sample and move on. Just be grateful your alive and not 6 ft under...


----------



## theonedub (Jan 2, 2013)

Well I thought I posted my results here, but I may not have. I did get a chance to pull my CPU and look for damage, etc and did not see any of the scratching people have mentioned. The paste did severely stain my block (which will need to be sanded) and the paste did smell really bad. 

Basically the paste performed about 2C cooler than what I had been using before. 


Spoiler: Results


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 2, 2013)

theonedub said:


> Well I thought I posted my results here, but I may not have. I did get a chance to pull my CPU and look for damage, etc and did not see any of the scratching people have mentioned. The paste did severely stain my block (which will need to be sanded) and the paste did smell really bad.
> 
> Basically the paste performed about 2C cooler than what I had been using before.
> 
> ...


Why would you need to sand the block? Your using an H100 correct? It has the worst smoothest surface in a block I've ever seen.

You sand that block and your going to loose cooling effect... What is the stain going to do?
The smoothest surface still has micro pores that you cant see unless under a microscope... Thats what you see as a stain and where it is coming from... If I were you Id leave well enough alone  

Thermal paste is made to fill in micro imperfections and pretty much that's it.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 2, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> I don't think it's "large particles"  of diamond causing the pitting...It's a chemical reaction.
> 
> 
> Perhaps a batch of rancid oil used? This might explain the smell, and why some users have issues?
> ...



 You only can get rancid out of an organic that contains fats and lipids, this is synthetic and contains none. This has essentially the same base as a motor oil no difference and is pretty inert just not much it is going to react to.

 As to acid you might see that in a car engine but it is a by product gas combustion and accumulates over time and can separated or filtered out but does cause the oil itself to be acidic.

 Having just talked to a chemist at the company that produces the oil he tells me that there is no known combination of chemicals that could be introduced that would turn the base oil acidic

Actually you can find the damage in the fresh from factory pic posted, I did not post it as the connection was tenuous but for me provided a clue as to source to look for.

I can only say that in my experience running on test setups with pure copper test dies and sinks from 30W to 200W in time frames from several hours to several months I have never experienced any pitting or scratching on mirror finish contact surfaces.

I enlarged the original and changed brightness and contrast to highlight imperfections






To test whether they were not dust on the camera lens or an artifact from the computer I then used the measuring tool in Gimp on the similarly sized pics I located one point then located the others at the appox. same angle and distance on the second picture  from the original selected point and found 12 or 13 out of 18 that were on the original factory fresh sink. I am not counting the ones marked red and counting the one blue.

Better resolution on the factory fresh & I might have pulled out more but as it was I assumed due to the resolution only the grossest of imperfections would show up and so could be found on the second pic. There is some offset due to perspective angles of approx 20 px on the horizontal and some on the vertical but some good matches in the group.

But as I mentioned this exercise was more of a clue search and the other higher resolution has enough to indicate likely source and we are continuing to look into it.


----------



## Random Murderer (Jan 2, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> I've been using IC Diamond for a few years now and cant say I have ever seen any scratches or have smelled any thing that others are complaining about.
> 
> I did ask for a tube of this test compound but never got anything and it's been months now.
> 
> ...



There's a big difference between bitching about a free product and being angry about damage from a test product. It's obvious some of these tubes should not have passed QC.
And as far as the rep on here trying to say the damage is caused by us contaminating the TIM, that's absolute bullshit, and no, I won't be nice about it. Awfully strange that the only compounds anybody has ever seen this type of damage from are ICD7 and ICD24. Sure, Shihatsu or whatever it's called caused a chemical reaction and caused pitting, but that was actually eating away the metal. This is completely different from that and is actual physical damage, as if something ground into the copper.
Staining? I can deal with that. Dead fish smell when removing the heatsink? I can deal with that, too. Very fine scratches/polishing? Not only can I deal with that, it's to be expected from tiny diamonds and I actually wish all compounds did that, lol. Pitting/gouging from oversized particles and/or manufacturing oversights? COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE, and the fact that the company representative is blaming us compounds the issue.
That being said, I'm not bitching in the least. For me, the product has worked exactly as expected and done a damn good job. In fact, I recently swapped from an air cooler to this H100i. Guess which TIM I'm using? ICD24, and I will continue to use it until I run out or have an issue.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 2, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> ~snip~



What's curious to me is that the "new" pitting shows the copper of the base through quite obviously, while the "pre-pasting" pic does not.

Maybe plating is being removed somehow?


As mentioned before, I did not get a recent test sample, so my interest in this is purely as an intellectual exercise. It's quite curious, to me.

I have a Noctua cooler here, have used it for a couple of years now nearly in my review testing, which means multiple mounts per week, every week. I've used every paste on the market at this point, since actual cooling means little to me testing, and is more for checking fitment issues, but that said, my heatsink has a similar base to the original picture posted by Sneekypeet. I have now sent this cooler to another staff member here. He has a sample tube from you, I think, and I'll ask him to try the paste out and see what happens. Maybe it's some issue with the plating.



I just want to know what's causing the issue..specifically...the idea that it's contamination of some sort, doesn't help prevent the same from being repeated by other users in the future. Properly identifying exactly what causes the problem will go a long way to build consumer confidence, IMHO.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jan 2, 2013)

hmmm interesting


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 3, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> What's curious to me is that the "new" pitting shows the copper of the base through quite obviously, while the "pre-pasting" pic does not.
> 
> *Maybe plating is being removed somehow?
> *
> ...



Looks to me from the last pic this had no plating.

Multiple pits are clear so I would assign no local contamination to it as he might have missed a large piece or two of grit but not a general sprinkling of fine sand.

what is clear is pits outside the contact area of same type and size which indicate it happened prior to his receipt/installation.

I asked for him to send the test sample along with the sink but he had already emptied the tube looking for oversized particles and found none.

 In any event our compound like MX$ Shin Etsu etc. has grit of multiple sizes that are engineered or sized for full best contact. Thermal compounds are mixed for hours so when applied there are no groupings of material, that is if your mix is 1/3 1/3 1/3 any sample from anywhere in the compound will have the same equal 1/3 1/3 1/3 mix. Find a grouping of large particles would be like opening a can of freshly mixed blue paint and finding purple and yellow pigment particles floating on the top

So I took a sample of 20 grams from the batch over the holiday and washed it and found nothing out of spec.

So if you have problem send me the sink and sample I will scope the sink and wash out the compound or send it for independent analysis it is not a big deal to measure and map particle size.

As to the degree of the alleged problem out of 50 or so samples sent so far we have two complaints that are completely different.

 One a single large pit that appears to large to even pass through the end of tube also does not conform to the shape of diamond so would have to be something other than diamond and unlike the multi pit example the entire IHS shows no evidence of damage which would be inconsistent with the multi pit example and with the physics of mixing.

That being if there was a problem it would the same problem not one and then the other.

Also being thoroughly mixed it would be universal throughout so 50 or more people would be reporting the problem.

I would like to resolve this definitively and would prefer no amateur investigations. I can arrange for anyone with a posted problem to send your sample directly at my expense to an independent lab for analysis as to particle size and we will post the result here.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 3, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> I would like to resolve this definitively and would prefer no amateur investigations. I can arrange for anyone with a posted problem to send your sample directly at my expense to an independent lab for analysis as to particle size and we will post the result here.



Thanks, That's exactly the sort of response I was looking for from day one.


But again, I'll re-iterate.. I do not think you can blame this issue on particle size. I do not really think, at this point, that particle quality is the issue.

Either, there is some weird chemical reaction going on, causing excessive corrosion(like the pit on that copper CPU), or, this is an artifact of the paste removal, acting as a polishing compound.


*I appreciate you not wanting amateur investigations, however, when I posed these same issues to you 5 years ago when you made your first public sampling on HWC, you ignored my problem(and my $950 of dead hardware), and here I sit, trying to make sure to solve the problem for others. I feel that I can safely say that had myself and others not raised any concern, you may have even gone this far.*


So, to sum up, again, I think you are ignoring many possible factors here by simply assuming the problem is due to particle size, and secondly, thanks for sticking with this discussion, as unpleasant/unprofessional as it might be.



FYI, my posts here in this thread are my own, and have nothing to do with my position here @ TPU. I would have posed similar questions/etc no matter the forum. I hsven't spoken to W1zzard or any other staff here about this issue, and have taken my own initiative here.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 3, 2013)

^ 
that sounds fair hey.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 3, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> You only can get rancid out of an organic that contains fats and lipids, this is synthetic and contains none. This has essentially the same base as a motor oil no difference and is pretty inert just not much it is going to react to.
> 
> As to acid you might see that in a car engine but it is a by product gas combustion and accumulates over time and can separated or filtered out but does cause the oil itself to be acidic.
> 
> ...



Sorry to say this, but I told you the first image was a Brand New Base....it's dust! Now since I sent my cooler in, I think that is a bad idea since you don't know how to read, and are looking to make damages on a base that is dust. (If you want to be super technical, they are tiny white fibers from the photo-tent I use for images)

I have a strange feeling that you only accepted my cooler so you can have the final word to hush me up. IF you can't even do something as simple as reading, why would I expect you to know how to run a scientific exam of my cooler?

Oh and by the way, you added a magic white dot to the second image that isn't in the first image


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 3, 2013)

Pics of my IC24:

Chunks:













Stretched:







Different colours in the paste:









If this is contamination, it was contaminated by the person who sent it to me. Just my experience with IC Diamond products. I'll see if I can find the pictures of the scratched GPUs. I have the GPUs somewhere in my garage still, just like I still have my tube of IC24.


----------



## OneMoar (Jan 3, 2013)

ouch 
hmm my tube is just fine tho


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 3, 2013)

*ccc*



cadaveca said:


> Thanks, That's exactly the sort of response I was looking for from day one.
> 
> 
> *But again, I'll re-iterate.. I do not think you can blame this issue on particle size. I do not really think, at this point, that particle quality is the issue.
> ...



ssssssss


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 3, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> Pics of my IC24:
> 
> Chunks:
> 
> ...



*Not our product*

we do not sell a tube with a rubber plunger and we have not since 2007 as the compound reacted to or the liquid was absorbed by rubber and the paste hardened like a rock.


----------



## OneMoar (Jan 3, 2013)

I just took the wrapper off my sample tube no rubber plunger but maby there is screwup someplace and he got some old stock


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 3, 2013)

No mistake on our end old stock was a light blue label vs today's black so no way mistakenly sent and besides all stock was destroyed and it was stone hard after 2 months and 5 years later it would not be getting better with age.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 3, 2013)

Same here, I removed the wrapper of 2 of my tubes and used a 220 lumens light to check for any type of irregularities. No rubber plunger, no discoloration of any sort, even pulled the plunger back a few times to see what was what... nada! nice and clean.

Looking closer at Sneakypetes cooler I'm thinking the paste didn't cause the pitting. I'm thinking it's just shitty machine work that's gone bad. Who knows mabey the  plating if the base has any didn't take during the build process?  Seeing any type of lines on the base of any cooler from a lathe IMO is just poor craftmanship period!

I'm not sticking up nor bashing anybody here, but something has got to give. In Chads delema of the coolers base pitting, Could it mabey from poor electro static plating of the base? I mean once ICD cures it's fricken got a tight bond on the cpu... mabey it just pulled off particles from the base that didnt take well during the fabrication?! * You cant dismiss that theory * My AMD cpu was pulled straight from the socket a few different times from the adhesion.


----------



## OneMoar (Jan 3, 2013)

time to put this one to bed
I have in front of me my 5750 thats had ic2 on it for 6 months I am gonna take it apart LIVE on webcam shortly and clean it and show the COPPER surfance  
yall are free to watch

http://onemoar.dyndns.org:5000/

please use flash mode in the selection box I am gonna start in 5m


anyway its just as clean and shiney as it was when I pulled it apart 3 Months ago no pitting no discoloration aside from my failure to clean it good enough its great
and thats all she wrote surface was just as clean as It was when I put it on
and I am used acetone witch is far more reactive then iso and its what i used last time

texture is smooth like talc and no grit at all so that ends that (at least with my sample) it basicly turns to dry feeling poweder if you rub it like I am annnnnnnnd now my hands are covered in tim and as I stated the discoloration was there from the factory tim that I didn't properly clean


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 3, 2013)

OneMoar said:


> dont have any here lol


lol well get some hahahah... the wife gives me shit for using most of her's..



OneMoar said:


> time to put this one to bed
> I have in front of me my 5750 thats had ic2 on it for 6 months I am gonna take it apart LIVE on webcam shortly and clean it and show the COPPER surfance
> yall are free to watch
> 
> ...


Cotton balls? really? You know the drug store sell quilted non lint make up remover pads..

And who cares about the copper being discolored?! for pete sake ever hear of OXIDATION? Really that's all it is...


----------



## micropage7 (Jan 3, 2013)

^
why dont you edit it than you post 3 times


----------



## OneMoar (Jan 3, 2013)

annnnnnnnnd now I gotta go wash my hands lmao


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 3, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> *Not our product*
> 
> we do not sell a tube with a rubber plunger and we have not since 2007 as the compound reacted to or the liquid was absorbed by rubber and the paste hardened like a rock.



Exactly. My sample is from 5 years ago, as I have posted earlier in the thread. 



And seemingly, not so rock hard...I hate to break it to you, but I might be the most honest person ever. Do you know what a boy scout is? The local troop is run out of my house. This is IC Diamond IC24 from 5 years ago, it is not rock hard, and it has chunks in it, which it had when I received the sample. In fact, it hasn't changed much in the 5 years I have had it.


Perhaps the rock-hard batches were contaminated? 

IF it's not your product, then your rep purposely sent me something he concocted himself.

That's why I was pissed in the first place, and asked that this time, you send it to me directly. You refused. I was willing to give it another try.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jan 3, 2013)

Note i am cleaning the items better for install I 'am just to lazy to get in there and fine clean it at 1:40am regardless you can see the wear and tear from normal usage this is before IC Diamond 24, ill be running IC Diamond for the next week while playing with the 3960x test rig 

cleaning before IC Diamond will be done with Artic Clean Arctic Silver Arcticlean Thermal material Remover ...


----------



## theonedub (Jan 3, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> Exactly. My sample is from 5 years ago, as I have posted earlier in the thread.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Technically wouldn't that stuff be IC7? 

In all seriousness I would like to see what's really going on here. I've refrained from using any additional IC24 until the issues are resolved.


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 3, 2013)

IC7 and IC24 are the same. The difference is the amount.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 3, 2013)

theonedub said:


> Technically wouldn't that stuff be IC7?



No, they sent regular users ic7 on that test, but they sent staff IC24, which really, is just a larger tube.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jan 3, 2013)

anyway ill report back in a week on what i find.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 3, 2013)

crazyeyesreaper said:


> anyway ill report back in a week on what i find.



Why bother, The comapany rep is just going to make things up, and then when called on his silliness he will just ignore his misguided attempts to be right while just making things up to make IC Diamond look like it doesn't cause the issue.

I gave before and after images, and as your Noctua base shows marks, he is going to blame Daves uses if the cooler shows damage anyway, just like he is blaming tiny white threads as causing the damage on mine 

This guy is trolling us surely!


----------



## DOM (Jan 3, 2013)

I stopped using it along time ago when it made the letters on the ihs fade and stained the cpu block then the smell was nasty 

But I still have the tube some where on my desk 

But not a product I'll recommend for other people to use


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 3, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> Exactly. My sample is from 5 years ago, as I have posted earlier in the thread.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I can definitively say the what your presenting is not our product there was only one batch and one 2.5 ml syringe. We launched the product in July 2007 and recalled on Aug. 29 2007 those were the one and only rubber piston syringes we have ever used after which we switched to to exclusively HSW with no rubber at all

What you posted has never seen the inside of an Innovation Cooling facility.

Totally different Piston plunger, different lettering, different gradient markings, we dropped the clear cap only last year totally so all together a different manufacturer.

Lucky for you my partner dropped off some old stock he had so we can do a comparison







Old vs new not easily confused 







As you can see pistons do not match







Also the lettering is different






What we use now and only have used since Sept. 2007







All The “old batch” samples dried out, it was fast moving and took only 2 months, it was universal and there were no exceptions. The rubber had changed from semi hard to tacky and pliable and the source was more than obvious.

I cut open a few here







As it did not come from us only 2 possibilities exist.

1. It did not dry out after 5 years so can not possibly be IC Diamond and you some how acquired a fake.
2. It was filled by the spirit world only recently and has not had a chance to harden


Presenting a package that obviously did not come from us with the appearance of having been 'salted” does not help your case.

You say you got it from my “Rep” well I am the “Rep”  and I sure did not send you that 

I know what goes out out of our facility and nothing of that nature,manufacture, configuration has ever crossed our doors.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 3, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> I know what goes out out of our facility and nothing of that nature,manufacture, configuration has ever crossed our doors.



I have no reason to present anything other than the truth. this sample was sent to me in 2009, during a offering you guys had on HWC, where I was staff. I was told there was a different package for staff, and was sent one of those. Who sent it to me, really I do not know, but it was sent in your name(Nademon), and the problems faced by me with that sample were also faced by other users during that test. When the same was offered this time, I requested you send some to me directly instead.

I actually have screenshots of that thread back then, the reporting I did and the other users as well, which has no disappeared off of that forum. I'll gladly save those for another day.


So, I'll leave it up to you to track down with HWC who sent me that tube. you'll find my post in the thread over there asking for a sample, too.

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...n-cooling-7-carat-diamond-tim-giveaway-4.html

So, look...I had a bad experience. You want to say this is not your product, that's fine, and I accept that, and that is why I asked you send me a sample directly earlier in this thread when this offering here first started.


I'm not placing any blame here on anyone. This is just what happened to me, and yes, it did cost me two high-end VGAs.


If HWC staff were misrepresenting themselves as your agents, you might want to look into that as well, and since there are things like the internetwaybackmachine, I have no issue at all stating my side of this story. Anyone with a bit of internet access can follow along and check this all out for themselves.

Anyway this was some time ago, and like I told you, I think you have a good product, that issues here are minor and easily resolved for users in the current test, but what I experienced was definitely far from what you represent as possible. I leave it up to you and anyone that reads this to investigate why.

You can consider this my reporting of long-term testing form that original test I took part in, and that is all.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 3, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Why bother, The comapany rep is just going to make things up, and then when called on his silliness he will just ignore his misguided attempts to be right while just making things up to make IC Diamond look like it doesn't cause the issue.
> 
> I gave before and after images, and as your Noctua base shows marks, he is going to blame Daves uses if the cooler shows damage anyway, just like he is blaming tiny white threads as causing the damage on mine
> 
> This guy is trolling us surely!



I have offered here on public forum to have users send samples directly to an independent materials test lab and we could post the results here.

You did neglect to mention that in a PM that I offered to test the compound but that unfortunately you emptied the tube looking for bits of tim but did not find any.



> but I did end up squeezing most of the tube to look for bits in the TIM. While I could not find any, the TIM was too cold to spread thin making it tough to tell.



Seems fair that I offer a lab analysis on any suspected samples, I do not see where I am being disingenuous here.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 3, 2013)

FYI, he has/had more than one tube.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 3, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> I have no reason to present anything other than the truth. this sample was sent to me in 2009, during a offering you guys had on HWC, where I was staff. I was told there was a different package for staff, and was sent one of those. Who sent it to me, really I do not know, but it was sent in your name(Nademon), and the problems faced by me with that sample were also faced by other users during that test. When the same was offered this time, I requested you send some to me directly instead.
> 
> I actually have screenshots of that thread back then, the reporting I did and the other users as well, which has no disappeared off of that forum. I'll gladly save those for another day.
> 
> ...



Can you point me to the post? I honestly do not remember it and am having trouble finding it.

Here is the thread.

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...est-results-thread-now-accepting-results.html

What you currently have bears no relationship to anything that has left our shop. 

I will send you a sample directly from me along with the contact and pressure paper Just PM me your address


----------



## Frick (Jan 3, 2013)

@dave: how the heck did you destroy gpu's with thermal paste?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 4, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> You did neglect to mention that in a PM that I offered to test the compound but that unfortunately you emptied the tube looking for bits of tim but did not find any.



You also neglect to realize your paste doesn't spread and is why I couldn't find anything! You act as if you think customers can spread the TIM out without it glopping on whatever you spread it with. Hmmm is this why you say not to spread this tim....could it be? You know what, when my cooler arrives just send it back, you have done nothing but prove you are irresponsible and you use peoples information as it suits your needs to build a conspiracy against those who find fault with your products.

How about this, I wont use your compound, nor will I advise anyone else use it either! I dont suggest you send any TIM back with the cooler either, because if you do, I will hold my own scientific tests and go live to my audience with my findings and let the public decide with their own senses instead of having you warp them.

My actual PM to IC Diamond:


> IF you want the cooler, that is up to you, but I did end up squeezing most of the tube to look for bits in the TIM. While I could not find any, the TIM was too cold to spread thin making it tough to tell.



See how if you leave parts out of a comment it skews its meaning?

Also if we are pointing fingers about neglecting things, what about you using dust to compare to pitting in my base, or that fact that you even add dust that isn't in the original image to the second image. See what I mean about how you play the angles, you can't just pick what you want to answer about a problem and say its gospel. Where is your reply to that sort of thing?

Also you have a PM, in which I am not anywhere near as polite as I am here. You sir are evil, and I hope karma finds you soon for the angle you are taking with this whole situation.


----------



## micropage7 (Jan 4, 2013)

wait wait.. i guess it just go further
why dont talk about item per item first
the paste at some cases got too abrasive. it could from:

the hsf material
the paste itself
contamination from previous paste, the paste or from hsf
the way it applied

i believe they report it coz they know theres something that run not right, 
but maybe theres a condition where this paste change into abrasive one
some people may dont realize it since they just use it and replace it like after 1 or 2 years so they dont know


----------



## OneMoar (Jan 4, 2013)

damum sneeky harsh
/me grabs some popcorn

to ICDiamond rep look ill be honest most of the people here at TPU know quiet a lot and a couple of your posts come off like you are denying everything and casting doubt ever-ware but, on your own product at this point it would be better if you just Admit you have a problem even if you don't believe you do.

 I realize this is counter intuitive to what that teach you at marketing school but right now YOU are doing more damage to you and your companies  rep by the tone of your posts

 and do you know what else I would bet money that next time or sneeky or dave or crazy or erocker goes to put tim on something they  will be reaching for MX4 or something from coolit labs I personally have not had any issues with the ICdiamond paste aside from it being a pain in the butt to apply. 
I am done with this thread now good luck to all


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 5, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> You also neglect to realize your paste doesn't spread and is why I couldn't find anything!



Am I reading this right? I'm not taking anybody's side here .
 You say the paste don't spread? I'm confused 

I've been using ICD 24K for a few years and tried MX-4/ and AS5, and have turned back to ICDiamond for the fact on how well it cooled my Amd and intel rigs....

 If needed I'd be happy to pry the water-block off the cpu and take pictures on how well it spread for me.. 
I always put a nice blob on the center of the cpu as what the IC Diamond site suggested and in all honesty have never had a single issue with the product.




theonedub said:


> In all seriousness I would like to see what's really going on here. I've refrained from using any additional IC24 until the issues are resolved.



Seriously? your going to follow the few sheep? *I mean it in the most kind way theonedub ... But have you had any issues with the product?
 If so Im sorry I missed your post and take it back 

This thread turned out to be a real bummer for me, Hell this whole fricken place is been a downer lately with all the negativity and bull shit comments, and Im not talking just about this thread... I'm really surprised Wizzard hasn't said anything yet.

Frankly Im just blown away by all this 

Im sticking to my guns on this one and I make *my own mind up and not let others make it for me!!!*

 ┌∩┐(◣_◢)┌∩┐


----------



## RejZoR (Jan 5, 2013)

Well, what about this theory...

If ICD turns into rock hard substance when it comes in contact with rubber, what about an user side contamination of the paste with similar substance as the one that causes ICD to turn rock hard inside the tube that has rubber plunger.

So user applies the ICD, contaminates it somehow, attaches CPU cooler. ICD turns into hard particles where contaminated and when user takes off the cooler, it scratches the surface.

The question here is, what specific substance causes ICD to turn from a grease into rock hard form. It has to be something that was present in those rubber plungers and it seems to be present elsewhere as well, we just don't know what exactly this substance is. If we'd know that it might be easier to find the actual source of contamination.


----------



## DOM (Jan 5, 2013)

This paste is the worst paste, In terms of trying to clean off it makes a mess and it doesn't spread, no where near as much as other paste I used, even with this using a larger blob... It still won't spread out as much...


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 5, 2013)

DOM said:


> This paste is the worst paste, In terms of trying to clean off it makes a mess and it doesn't spread, no where near as much as other paste I used, even with this using a larger blob... It still won't spread out as much...


Funny how mine spreads out over the entire cpu when using a dap about this big *o* but then again maybe having a good aftermarket back plate and good block mount does do wonders, also I put the cpu under full prime stress for a few min to help it move where it needs to go from the heat build up..

If ppl's coolers dont have enough locking pressure then take your tube and place it in a cup of hot water for 5 min or so... that helps.

Sure the paste is a bit tough to remove but use 99% iso alcohol and makeup removing pads.

These ones work the best and dont leave cotton bunnies behind.







next


----------



## DOM (Jan 5, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> Funny how mine spreads out over the entire cpu when using a dap about this big *o* but then again maybe having a good aftermarket back plate and good block mount does do wonders, also I put the cpu under full prime stress for a few min to help it move where it needs to go from the heat build up..
> 
> If ppl's coolers dont have enough locking pressure then take your tube and place it in a cup of hot water for 5 min or so... that helps.
> 
> ...



I know how to apply paste and remove it still doesn't change what I said lol 

And if you have to put the tube in warm water that's isn't something you should have to do imo


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 5, 2013)

DOM said:


> I know how to apply paste and remove it still doesn't change what I said lol
> 
> And if you have to put the tube in warm water that's isn't something you should have to do imo


It was just a suggestion for others Dom


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 5, 2013)

Actually upon review we have decided that this is a great opportunity for us to deal with this issue once and for all unequivocally and over the next few days or perhaps weeks we will take all the points one at a time and deal with them in excruciating detail. So be patient.

I acquired from my business partner a number of heat sinks when he sold his website. These are the manufacturers best effort sample heat sinks sent to him for review tested once and thrown into a box and never had an application of IC Diamond. 

This post will be edited over the next few days with added subject material.


As a preliminary, a little camera magic 

Note that I have a full range of sinks from high quality Swiftech and Therrmalright to lessor quality sinks of unknown manufacture.

This is a high res picture of one of them shot at an angle, not great, not terrible either






Switch angles and it becomes the second worst out of all that I have and you can note the pits, voids, scratches are now visible in the bottom section. Move up a little and the base does not look so bad. So looks can be deceiving and angles and lighting are critical to picking up defects at the initial stage and a before picture should be obviously clear enough at the outset.

A low res  or poorly lit/angled picture vs a high res  is an apples to oranges comparison.

While ridiculed for noting the white spots on the original sneekypete picture as being the previous indicator  of the grossest damage previous to install visible at low resolution we will deal with this in exquisite detail as this unfolds delving into the hard markers vs smoke and mirror discussion. Much,much more to come


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 5, 2013)




----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 5, 2013)

^ nice emo lmao!


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 5, 2013)

Frick said:


> @dave: how the heck did you destroy gpu's with thermal paste?



There were chunks in the paste that scratched the surface of the GPU deep enough to make it non-functional.




I pasted two GPUs at once, since they both had slightly different temps, and I wanted to see if they'd still perform differently as it seemed they produced slightly different amounts of heat.

I bought new cards the next day. 

Truly, I never really blamed IC Diamond for that, since I had other issues in dealings with HWC at the time, like buying stuff out of their store that was listed as new, but showed up most definitely used. Turns out, they sold the same case twice.

I was hired on as a reviewer at HWC, but they had issues getting me samples(economy tanked then, really not their fault). The management there did try to find other work for me, although they weren't honest with me about anything, and their answer was to have me competing with another user posting news, and each week one of the two of us would get a "prize".

That's not what I signed on for, so I quit. I removed my postings from the forum, and they banned me in an effort to not have me raging all over the forum.

Turns out, HWC was also selling IC Diamond paste out of their store. It is possible they sent me a wrong tube, but there being those chunks in that paste is weird no matter what paste I got. IF it wasn't IC Diamond I was sent, then...I don't have any issues with IC Diamond to complain about, now do I?


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 6, 2013)

A video I've done today to SHOW MY RESULTS!!!! 

There's a brief description in the comments section on each video.

It answers alot of BS postes imo.










[yt]RXCkJ-9HuwI[/yt]

[yt]c9k-3KFgEYo[/yt]

*Pictures of my cpu and block*


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 6, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> While ridiculed for noting the white spots on the original sneekypete picture as being the previous indicator of the grossest damage previous to install visible at low resolution we will deal with this in exquisite detail as this unfolds delving into the hard markers vs smoke and mirror discussion. Much,much more to come




Just in case you missed it, I will say again, that was dust from my photo booth, not damage, but I do already know you can't read so I forgive you Any chance you are going to be at CES, or better, your company will be there so I can talk to someone with some common sense?

@ full, take your fanboyism somewhere else.....that base is not grooved nor made by Noctua, so comparing apples to oranges really doesn't work here, although I am interested to see what reaper gets after a bit of use.

Also since you don't understand English, there is a difference between spreading TIM and compressing it.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 6, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Just in case you missed it, I will say again, that was dust from my photo booth, not damage, but I do already know you can't read so I forgive you
> 
> @ freak, take your fanboyism somewhere else.....that base is not grooved nor made by Noctua, so comparing apples to oranges really doesn't work here, although I am interested to see what reaper gets after a bit of use.
> 
> Also since you don't understand English, there is a difference between spreading TIM and compressing it.


You talking to me Chad?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 6, 2013)

is there another saying that those who oppose this paste are full of BS? Although I did get the name wrong, allow me to edit for clearity.


----------



## cdawall (Jan 6, 2013)

I have put this paste on quite a range of products as of late...I have not seen any issues. 3 GTX 470's with waterblocks (pulled once) fuzion v1 (6+ times) and my CM V10 (3 times) never got any pitting and the finishes are fine. I have had pitting once or twice in the past and every time it was my fault.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 6, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> is there another saying that those who oppose this paste are full of BS? Although I did get the name wrong, allow me to edit for clearity.


Very professional Chad and being a moderator and name calling??

I was posting MY FINDINGS! I thought this is what this thread was about!? Am I wrong?

I wont stoop to your level and call you names nor try to make you look like an ass as your making a good job of it on your own. I did a little video showing my results, is there a problem with MY FINDINGS?

You call me a fan boy because I have no issues with the product! You ridicule me? I post video and pictures and you trash me?

Dude I've lost all respect for you and wish you the best.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 6, 2013)

I get that some people have no issues with this paste, but I thought this was a thread to discuss success and failure of a product, not for someone like me who has nothing to gain to get slammed for showing the failure I had with using this.

Why is it that someone like me who is very reputable in my opinion, is just going to come into a thread like this half cocked, or like I am just out to sully the name of something I didn't even have to pay for. No matter what this rep says, this paste damaged my base, and to make himself feel better, he wont read my posts where I am calling him on every bit of BS he is applying, like lint = previous damage.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 6, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> I get that some people have no issues with this paste, but I thought this was a thread to discuss success and failure of a product, not for someone like me who has nothing to gain to get slammed for showing the failure I had with using this.
> 
> Why is it that someone like me who is very reputable in my opinion, is just going to come into a thread like this half cocked, or like I am just out to sully the name of something I didn't even have to pay for. No matter what this rep says, this paste damaged my base, and to make himself feel better, he wont read my posts where I am calling him on every bit of BS he is applying, like lint = previous damage.


I never once slamed ya man nor anybody else! Out of all the times you put gas into your car have you ever gat a bad tank? Im sure you have, It happens. The way ppl were talking here was giving a company a bad name just because of a few issues... Shit happens in every industry no matter what.

Lets try to work together and fix a problem instead of fight all the time.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 6, 2013)

then dont come off saying we are BS posting because it doesn't match your results. 

As I said, this thread is for success and failure, so be respectful to those who have had issues and not write them off as a troll.

Honestly, what do I have to gain by standing my ground and saying IC Diamond damaged my cooler? Also judging by what I do for a living, I think I would know about these sort of things, and when and where my coolers got damaged


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 6, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> then dont come off saying we are BS posting because it doesn't match your results.
> 
> As I said, this thread is for success and failure, so be respectful to those who have had issues and not write them off as a troll.
> 
> Honestly, what do I have to gain by standing my ground and saying IC Diamond damaged my cooler? Also judging by what I do for a living, I think I would know about these sort of things, and when and where my coolers got damaged



I never insinuated any body or called them a troll. I have been totally respectful in my comments!

I just went back to page 13 and no where have I called anybody BS. And look at post #362,

Post #384 was an honest question because I didn't understand what you were getting at!


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 6, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> It answers alot of BS postes imo.



post 394


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 6, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> post 394


IMO some posts WERE bs just because of what others said, they followed suit... Like someone is a messiah but they themselves didn't have any issues...they just chime in to to add post counts to be heard... Comments like,, this stuff don't spread, its hard to get off, it stains.....

That to me IMO is BS... I showed in my videos, I proved it and found none to be correct FOR ME!. so  I ran my own test just to show the non believers. So I'll shut up, and be the bigger man and move along as I don't click well with certain groups around hear... Kinda like what happened to .....  aww nevermind.. Good luck with your results ppl and 

PS: And Chad there is a reason why your cooler pitted but with out you answering one's post on there theory One is left guessing. I hope you can figure it out. To me it seems like a possible bad machined part you got, bad electro plating that never took straight from the factory... It could be anything. But with my results and conclusion I do support this product. It works best for me so Im continuing to use it. I however dont agree on certian posts but everyone one has there own opinion 

~nobody's perfect, only God's perfect... he gives us knowledge, but it's up to us on how the knowledge is used..


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 6, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Just in case you missed it, I will say again, that was dust from my photo booth, not damage, but I do already know you can't read so I forgive you Any chance you are going to be at CES, or better, your company will be there so I can talk to someone with some common sense?
> 
> @ full, take your fanboyism somewhere else.....that base is not grooved nor made by Noctua, so comparing apples to oranges really doesn't work here, although I am interested to see what reaper gets after a bit of use.
> 
> Also since you don't understand English, there is a difference between spreading TIM and compressing it.



Patience little grasshopper.

The micro world is a messy place and is the play ground of chaos theory with many nooks and cranny’s to be explored.

First off we have ordered   several Noctua sinks as a baseline.

As you have supposedly sent me your sink on my shipping account we will compare it to never used production samples.

We will contact Noctua an acquire their base finish specification to see if all is with in spec.

It is a simple matter to visually locate and mark surface imperfections and then line them up with with the reflected light (white spots) to conclusively prove  a link and have already duplicated this in with our in house sample sinks not a big deal with a microscope and a high resolution camera.

 One angle may reveal 20 imperfections and another 40 it all depends upon the reflected angle move a few degrees one way or another and a different group will reveal themselves with the different reflected light angle. So a one angle shot is a tip of the iceberg view.

Machine tool chatter is a well understood issue and it is always there to some degree. In a worst case you can see it from 5 feet away in another you might need a microscope but it is always there.

A machinist will tune his spindle speed and feed rate to meet a particular spec and identical machines will produce different results, one might have a spindle speed of 8500 RPM and another might be 6500 RPM to produce the same result.

Machine tool pitting is closely related and commonly found on all machined pieces to one degree or another, back fill of material while cutting scores a piece so expecting perfect unbroken tool lines is unrealistic and does not happen in practice and generally partially controlled by the spec'd finish

Another issue to deal with is porosity. All aluminium and copper contains pores from casting depending on the quality of the casting will determine the frequency. It is a problem in welding and dealt with in some cases by hammering flat before welding. We have some pictured examples of this.

In any event as you want to hold us to a micro level standard we will accommodate and respond in detail.

Again the fact that pictured damage existed outside the contact contact area pretty much confirms that it existed prior to ICD application and just waiting further confirmation after receipt of the sink you have sent. 

I would note that in  fullinfusion's video and one moar's live video Friday night both had fine quality contact finishes and would more likely to reveal a problem than the more crude Noctua finish and both were about as good as you can get.

Semantic games aside we call our application method a "compression spread" that is, it is spread by compression and nothing is simpler or as easy as demonstrated by fullinfusion.


----------



## Frick (Jan 6, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> There were chunks in the paste that scratched the surface of the GPU deep enough to make it non-functional.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Good golly they would have to be properly deep then if it cut through the surface.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 6, 2013)

Frick said:


> Good golly they would have to be properly deep then if it cut through the surface.



what really weird to me is that it made no noise or obvious sign it was gouging in that bad, either, until I removed the heatsink. Big chunks, easily 1mm square. One ended up getting stuck in the tip of the tube, even.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Jan 6, 2013)

I was tempted to put on my GPU but I guess I'll hold off now. 

I have yet to check my CPU's heatsink or die but temps are still doing great.

Maybe someone could crack a tube open and examine the contents to see if they can take a picture of any solid particulates in the tube that could lead to hardware damage?


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 6, 2013)

AphexDreamer said:


> I was tempted to put on my GPU but I guess I'll hold off now.
> 
> I have yet to check my CPU's heatsink or die but temps are still doing great.
> 
> Maybe someone could crack a tube open and examine the contents to see if they can take a picture of any solid particulates in the tube that could lead to hardware damage?



Why?


My sample was from years ago, and might not have been ICD. Sneekypeet already checked his, though, since he has his issues.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Jan 6, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> Why?
> 
> 
> My sample was from years ago, and might not have been ICD. Sneekypeet already checked his, though, since he has his issues.



"Why?" To see... 

Did he find anything? Did he takes pics?


----------



## DOM (Jan 7, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> It was just a suggestion for others Dom



But it shouldn't be something you have to do for a paste to work like it should.... correct ?

This thread is funny imo hope they get a new rep


----------



## cdawall (Jan 7, 2013)

DOM said:


> But it shouldn't be something you have to do for a paste to work like it should.... correct ?
> 
> This thread is funny imo hope they get a new rep



Works fine when you have a proper cooler/backplate combo.


----------



## SonDa5 (Jan 7, 2013)

Arctucas said:


> @ICDiamond,
> 
> Five weeks ago, or thereabouts, you said you would make available for purchase sample sized pieces of the Prescale film.
> 
> So...?




I'd buy some more.  Definitely a must have for enthusiasts.


I think the best way to apply this paste is to put a small drop in the center then put a drop of alcohol on it and gently spread it out with finger covered with clear plastic like from a zip lock bag.  It's very messy.  I had good results with IC diamond and dabbing it with alcohol thinly as possible.  Have to do it just right so that it doesn't lose too much of its stock consistency.  Thinner the better.  Alcohol made it much easier to apply thinly.  It may not last as long though.


I think I had my problems with my GPU die with the pea application method because I think it doesn't spread very easily and putting a drop in the middle then apply masive pressure to push the pea size flat causes damage to soft copper heat sink and bare die.  I don't remember finding any hard particles like diamond chips but it did feel very course.


----------



## SonDa5 (Jan 7, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> And Chad there is a reason why your cooler pitted but with out you answering one's post on there theory One is left guessing. I hope you can figure it out. To me it seems like a possible bad machined part you got, bad electro plating that never took straight from the factory... It could be anything. But with my results and conclusion I do support this product. It works best for me so Im continuing to use it. I however dont agree on certian posts but everyone one has there own opinion





There is a difference between an opinion based on a factual personal incident and an opinion based on studying 3rd party information.  I don't think many people have problem with IC Diamond but the facts are that there are a few people that have similar problems.  Just because you didn't have any problems doesn't mean that my problem didn't happen.  I do think that most people will agree that IC diamond is very course and can easily scratch the surface of a block if not carefully cleaned.  

I had a block that was ruined using IC diamond as well.  It was a Swiftech MCW82-7900 water block and it had an awesome perfect surface before I used IC diamond on it.  The pit that was created in a short period of less than a month happend with only 1 application of IC diamond.  To me the pit looked and felt like something was pushed into it.  Whether it was a diamond chip or just a ball of dry diamond dust I think IC diamond caused the damage.  It looked like physical damage to me.  I still use IC diamond but I now mix it with alcohol an spread it as thin as possible.  

Also from my testing Coollaboratory Liquid Pro cools better but is also hard to clean but doesn't cause physical damage.


----------



## vega22 (Jan 8, 2013)

i had my post removed from this thread for stating my exp of this tim from another forum it did trials on.

that post was removed without warning or reason.

i wasnt even posting about it to be arsey, just to share my findings as icd stopped posting on the other forum.

from what i can tell with mine and others who have had issues it is because of higher mounting pressure on surfaces with high copper content, the higher mounting pressure which i was told to use by the other guy who ran the trial on the other forum as thats how to get the best from icd.

it worked fine on gpu, chipsets and vrm byw, just not on my lapped cpu/modded heatsink.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 8, 2013)

marsey99 said:


> i had my post removed from this thread for stating my exp of this tim from another forum it did trials on.
> 
> that post was removed without warning or reason.
> 
> ...



Any reference as to where it was in this thread so I can look into why it has been removed?


----------



## vega22 (Jan 8, 2013)

nevermind i found it 

i swear it had gone last time i went thru this thread


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 8, 2013)

I think that the contamination angle could have some merit though as I had been using IC7 for about six months before the test and it didn't do any damage to my CPU or heatsink. After that I did 2 things:

- Sanded the heatsink to improve pressure
- Swapped 4 TIMs on a short period of time

So I think that either the sample I got had something wrong with it or ICD requires a perfectly clean surface. One thing that I noticed is that IC24 was smoother and less dark than my IC7 but that might just be aging (I've had had that IC7 tube for about 2 years).


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 9, 2013)

DOM said:


> But it shouldn't be something you have to do for a paste to work like it should.... correct ?
> 
> This thread is funny imo hope they get a new rep


Go read your post you replied to me #388 read it before poking at me please.

Here let me help ya.... Read the bold typo oK  

Quote:
Originally Posted by fullinfusion View Post
Funny how mine spreads out over the entire cpu when using a dab about this big  *o* Did you watch my video? 
but then again maybe having a good aftermarket back plate and good block mount does do wonders, also I put the cpu under full prime stress for a few min to help it move where it needs to go from the heat build up..

*If ppl's coolers don't have enough locking pressure then take your tube and place it in a cup of hot water for 5 min or so... that helps.*

Sure the paste is a bit tough to remove but use 99% iso alcohol and makeup removing pads.

These ones work the best and dont leave cotton bunnies behind.

http://img.techpowerup.org/130105/cotton_pads.jpg

next

*I dont find, nor have a problem of the rep. Sure he made a few honest and regretted remarks but do you blame him? no, I sure the hell dont!!! but Others did! and believe me if I had the knowledge and background and a firm belief in something Id be the biggest fukn @$#% around (but's that me so be clear on that) so ppl understand there is alot of testing upon testing that goes on in the back ground. Sure Sneekypeats cooler pitted but I betcha the cooler was faulty IMHO and if the paste did damage the surface then its one in 50 thousand! It just takes one complaint to start the ball rolling in checking mixture/ machines/all the equipment that goes into the making of a product... but to poke at ya DOM, Mabey it was your girlfriends boy friend that got pissed off and tossed a chunk into the batch as a pay back...  One never knows till all the variables  and tests are sorted out.... and please take what I said with a grain of salt!

Picking away at Andrew is so disrespectful and Id feel humiliated on making comments about I'M NEVER GOING TO USE THAT PRODUCT rant rant rant.... but in turn that person/ people never had a single problem with the product... Thats just a follower and not a leader! 

cdawall quoted:

Works fine when you have a proper cooler/backplate combo.  *

Thank you cdawall  Someone who understands the process!!! There is only a few ppl here in all of TPU I trust and believe in and never fucks with cropping and pasting to make things not as they seem... and it's CDAWALL! 

And just to comment on that dude that posted a picture of his cpu and that big gouge out of it!!! LMAO give me a break! I've sampled and sampled and looked and looked but I'll let the rep here explaine whats what


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jan 9, 2013)

finished my testing images will be posted soon. and Full give it a break it could be contaimination could have been a bad batch, essentially shit happens. i need to compare pictures however to see if theres any changes altho i didnt notice anything to the naked eye.

BEFORE:










AFTER:










After comparing the images and my cooler itself before and after i have no pitting or damage, all scratches and scraps etc are from previous use. IC Diamond did not cause any damage in my testing and during hot and cold cycles i saw a minor temp drop at load on the Noctua. If anything the only thing i noticed was some staining which eventually with some careful buffing was removed with Artic clean. I did not see the same outcome or damage that sneaky peet did with the same cooler brand. However considering the fact this isnt a hit or miss issue and has been raised before in other forums and here as well, a Quality control problem could be at fault. With that said i would wager a guess its no worse than a DOA part in that it comes down to the simple explanation of shit happens. Overall it seems someone further up the food chain needs to be taking a closer look at how the paste is being made to see if there are any issues. As far as the smell that brandon talks about my tube does not smell out of the ordinary has the same smell i would attribute to thermal paste in general no foul odor was detected.


----------



## brandonwh64 (Jan 9, 2013)

I took the rest of my tube last night and squirted it out over a sheet of paper. I noticed it did have some types of chunks that could be broken up with a razer blade and the stench of this paste smell like bigfoot took a shit in it LOL. Temps have been good though especially with my H50 on AMD.


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 9, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> And just to comment on that dude that posted a picture of his cpu and that big gouge out of it!!! LMAO give me a break! I've sampled and sampled and looked and looked but I'll let the rep here explaine whats what




Whoa whoa, where that did come from? Dude I did not pick on you or any of your comments (although, frankly, some seemed heavy handed). Just because you don't have problems doesn't mean that nobody has. Sonda also got similar damage on his water block.

And if you had read my posts instead of just giving a pacing glance over the pictures you'd know that I've used IC for a lot of time. That particular CPU had IC7 applied for 6 months BEFORE the test and it didn't even left a mark, that's why I tend to agree with IC on the contamination angle. Is either that or the tube I got had something wrong.

What I'd want IC to do is to replicate the issue and find a way to prevent it. That's it. I'm not claiming that they owe me a CPU or anything (CPU is working fine, if anyone is wondering).


----------



## RCoon (Jan 9, 2013)

Well I've been monitoring this thread from start to finish, and I have discerned three things.

1. I will not be using IC Diamond
2. FullInfusion is horribly horribly biased and condescending
3. Company Reps finally grew balls and stopped pretending "the customer is always right", but in doing so, became incredibly condescending in themselves.

Honestly, he could have just said, "Yeah man, bad sample, my bad, heres some free tubes of paste for you troubles", even if it was user error. But now he looks like a douchebag and has probably lost more customers over the last 17 pages than gained by explaining details.
"We are sorry, here is a free token for your troubles, we will look into the problem." It aint hard, even if you're lying


----------



## brandonwh64 (Jan 9, 2013)

Full, I think that if a handful of people ARE having issues then there is something wrong in the QC department of IC. Yes you may have gotten a good sample but as peet mentioned some people didn't and it did some damage some how. I know my sample didn't damage anything but did have small chunks (looked like dried parts) in it and smelled of sewage (This could be due to chemicals used). Your posts seem to be attacking the ones that are having issues. I don't think the people that had issues are demanding anything other than IC figure out what is going on and try to fix it.


----------



## DOM (Jan 9, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


>





I don't follow no one ive asked the same ?'s ppl have asked about the smell and why does it stain no response, for all I care I still wont use this or recommend it, so what's wrong with my opinion ? 



fullinfusion said:


> but to poke at ya DOM, Mabey it was your girlfriends boy friend that got pissed off and tossed a chunk into the batch as a pay back...


I didnt check your moms vag for the chunks... sorry  

not worth my time to mess with the paste anymore its the only paste that i've had any problem with since 2006 and imo they shouldnt send crap out if they dont wanna hear any negative feedback


----------



## RCoon (Jan 9, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> insert wall of opinionated text here



You seem to forget one huge point.
This rep called Dave a liar. 
Dave is one of TPU's most trusted and highly acclaimed reviewers here. He doesnt talk bulshit. People rely on Dave's advice and knowledge, and more importantly, they trust it.
That is this reps biggest mistake, and his rep levels just went back down to zero.


----------



## Frick (Jan 9, 2013)

RCoon said:


> Well I've been monitoring this thread from start to finish, and I have discerned three things.
> 
> 1. I will not be using IC Diamond
> 2. FullInfusion is horribly horribly biased and condescending
> ...



I don't see how the rep is condescending. He question what is being presented, which he is right to do imo. And where did he call dave a liar?

The rep is good imo. It's a discussion going on and he is clearly interested in what is going on with the results.


----------



## Xenturion (Jan 9, 2013)

Yeah, I've been watching this thread for some time now; Largely because it's such a massive source of drama. The accusatory stance the Rep took is definitely not a page out Marketing 101, at least not if you want to have people purchase your product and respect your company. The reports of damage and a foul odor seem a little too consistent to simply be a coincidence. It's as if he is under the impression that many who accepted the product saw it as an opportunity to get their high-end hardware replaced and decided, collaboratively of course, to damage their heatsinks and IHS with the intention of filing a claim. Even if that rather farfetched theory was the case, I'd be really hard-pressed to believe that anyone would damage their hardware, expecting to get it replaced over a free sample given to them. More than likely, they're here with legitimate questions about why, when they took the paste off, it left a nice little surprise for them.

Challenging people over their tech knowledge and experience is also similarly laughable. People here are largely enthusiasts who know what they're talking about. These aren't people who've never applied an aftermarket TIM before; They're just not used to pulling the heatsink off to reveal what looks like a really rough sanding job on their IHS.


----------



## cdawall (Jan 9, 2013)

RCoon said:


> You seem to forget one huge point.
> This rep called Dave a liar.
> Dave is one of TPU's most trusted and highly acclaimed reviewers here. He doesnt talk bulshit. People rely on Dave's advice and knowledge, and more importantly, they trust it.
> That is this reps biggest mistake, and his rep levels just went back down to zero.



What are you talking about I call BS on dave all the time.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 9, 2013)

cdawall said:


> What are you talking about I call BS on dave all the time.



And not once have I agreed with you when you have.


----------



## cdawall (Jan 9, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> And not once have I agreed with you when you have.



Never said you did


----------



## Scrizz (Jan 9, 2013)

FML I can't believe I missed all this drama.


----------



## Random Murderer (Jan 9, 2013)

Xenturion said:


> To be honest, I'm not sure I understand the use of "diamonds" in the first place. AFAIK, they're neither electrically nor thermally conductive. It sounds to me like IC stumbled into a nice deal on some industrial diamonds and thought, "Hey, people will buy anything with "Diamond" in the name!" Granted, I could see them somewhat improving the contact between IHS and Heatsink , but the same effect could be achieved adding coarse particles to your favorite TIM. I'm thinking something along the lines of dirt, maybe pocket lint. I seriously hope no one applied it direct die because pitting there could make for some interesting issues.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Material_properties_of_diamond#Thermal_conductivity

Google is a wonderful tool. According to what I just posted, most naturally-occurring diamond is 5x better than copper at conducting heat.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 9, 2013)

DOM said:


> I don't follow no one ive asked the same ?'s ppl have asked about the smell and why does it stain no response, for all I care I still wont use this or recommend it, so what's wrong with my opinion ?
> 
> I didnt check your moms vag for the chunks... sorry
> 
> not worth my time to mess with the paste anymore its the only paste that i've had any problem with since 2006 and imo they shouldnt send crap out if they dont wanna hear any negative feedback



ahh its all good. I never took sides, I just thought It was unfair of some of the posts ppl were making. I'll just sit back and enjoy the added cooling and see what unfolds.

Cheers everyone 

PS @ DOM that's impossible, my mum died 3 yrs ago.. but nice poke 

Have a good one Dom and be seeing ya in the Mark11 thread


----------



## EiSFX (Jan 9, 2013)

Xenturion said:


> To be honest, I'm not sure I understand the use of "diamonds" in the first place. AFAIK, they're neither electrically nor thermally conductive. It sounds to me like IC stumbled into a nice deal on some industrial diamonds and thought, "Hey, people will buy anything with "Diamond" in the name!" Granted, I could see them somewhat improving the contact between IHS and Heatsink , but the same effect could be achieved adding coarse particles to your favorite TIM. I'm thinking something along the lines of dirt, maybe pocket lint. I seriously hope no one applied it direct die because pitting there could make for some interesting issues.




As Random Murderer already pointed out what are you talking about Xenturion Diamond is one of the worlds best heat conductors. Which is why this company and a few others have eather made this paste or are starting to make there own diamond past get your facts straight before posting false info like this


----------



## claylomax (Jan 9, 2013)

Scrizz said:


> FML I can't believe I missed all this drama.



Just read the whole thing; I did.


----------



## Xenturion (Jan 9, 2013)

Alright. Fair enough. Clearly, I was misinformed about the thermal qualities of diamond. I'll remove the offending material.


----------



## Frick (Jan 9, 2013)

Random Murderer said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Material_properties_of_diamond#Thermal_conductivity
> 
> Google is a wonderful tool. According to what I just posted, most naturally-occurring diamond is 5x better than copper at conducting heat.





Xenturion said:


> Alright. Fair enough. Clearly, I was misinformed about the thermal qualities of diamond. I'll remove the offending material.



Diamonds replacing silicone has been talked about for ages now. Sometimes the topic pops up. Now they're making quantum computers in diamonds i think.


----------



## qubit (Jan 10, 2013)

Did someone say quantum?!


----------



## radrok (Jan 10, 2013)

qubit said:


> Did someone say quantum?!


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 11, 2013)

Just a thermal update...







66c was the highest core temperature @5.4GHz.  And 19c was the coolest!

This shit rocks!!


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 11, 2013)

So any update on my cooler or when I may actually get it back?


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 11, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> So any update on my cooler or when I may actually get it back?


 PM Andrew and find out?

Im sure he told me he'd replace your cooler if it was the pastes fault


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 21, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> So any update on my cooler or when I may actually get it back?



Again, any updates since we are working on three weeks with my cooler now?


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 21, 2013)

Or, an update regarding the availability of the Fuji Prescale in affordable size pieces?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 23, 2013)

Addressing the complaint of compression damage to sinks and CPU/IHS alleged to be caused by IC Diamond particle contamination

*Introduction*

After a full investigation by Innovation Cooling it was determined to be impossible to recreate the asserted damage as presented by any particle by compression whatsoever under a worst case model.

Detailed examination of the damage was performed and a profile of the particle was developed that allowed an approximate matching model pieces to be manufactured

The investigation encompassed impressing assorted forms of copper and found that  cold rolled, forging or stamping processes hardened the IHS and sinks to a degree that the load required to recreate the asserted damage exceeds the Intel max pressure load specification of 75 lbs. 

With applied loads directly on the modeled pieces we were unable to do more than a nearly negligible  scuffing impression of surface irregularities with  zero embossing imprint into the solid copper itself.

Here are the two complaints the first here on the IHS







The second 






to normalize the pictures we took the first picture and auto rotated it 90 Deg clockwise with the gimp preset without any scaling or other changes 

Then we pasted it alongside the second image for comparison.






Then  marked top and bottom points on each.

Then using the gimp measuring tool  measured center point to center point.

The one on the left measures 112 pixels at an angle of 68.87 degrees.

The one on the right measures 112 pixels at an angle of 68.67 degrees.

While both look exactly the same length in scaling/ratioing the pictures, I estimated the one on the left to be approximately 2mm in length and the one on the right to be 3mm.

The image  the second image was then scaled +50% and then pasted  into the composite to match the 3mm dimension and the top turkey leg width dimension at the maximum point is close to within a couple pixels to identical in width to the dumbbell  upper section.






Ratioing the width on the 2mm long dimension I got an average  width of  .043mm (0.016 in.)

*Initial Observations:*

After normalizing the two images they then were compared for similarities to model the type of material and conditions that could have caused it. The top left has a kind of dumbbell shape wider at the ends and thinner in the middle the second has a more turkey leg appearance. At the 3mm size the Upper Turkey leg area matches the dumbbell within a couple of pixels. The lower part of the turkey leg was problematic to duplicate as we could custom file the approximate shape clamping the piece to do so was non viable . Matching the particle exactly would increase the test piece surface area some, perhaps a square mm but for the sake of convenience and argument a 3mm straight piece will suffice.  

The pictures are a straight forward example of embossing, pressure creating an imprint in the copper. Both shapes have a defined edge and defined flat bottom indicating a hole of some depth. To model the particle to make that sort of imprint you have to  mentally extrude the profile and then locate similar particles. It would have a matching  outline profile with straight uniform edges and a flat regular bottom. The particle while looking the same are very different, the dumbbell has  softer rounded edges perhaps indicating it was exposed to some kind wear while the turkey with it's sharper points looks more like a raw piece with no abrasive action.

The depth of the hole was bothersome as it being it's most distinguishing feature and hard to estimate is it .005? or .010? Along with the flat bottom detail suggests a fairly regular edge in contrast to the outlined shape. All in all a fair ballpark hole depth number might be in the .005 to .008 range with a particle depth and perhaps a actual particle depth size of 2X that in the .010-.020 range. .

* Particles selection:*

 It's not an over sized diamond due to the shape as diamond comes in the form you see below so was the first elimination.







*Selected test Particles:*

We then embarked on a particle hunt. Immediately, all 'naturally' occurring particles were eliminated because 'natural' particles can be round, disk-shaped, exist as chips or flake-like but would not exhibit 'dumbbell' or 'turkey leg' shapes as these are highly unstable configurations.. The other deciding factor was that on our preliminary particle testing *hard does not mean tough* Quartz with an MOHS of 7 would start breaking up at 10 lbs pressure and continue breaking through full range of pressures. At the 70 pound range, granite would just disintegrate etc. Try taking your wife's diamond and hitting it with a hammer or squeezing it in a vice and then posting the pictures, The results would be interesting

As the damage represents classic pressure embossing, the particle selected had to be flat to mimic the flat bottom hole expressed in the pictures.

The shape that caused this damage does not resemble anything one would find in machine shop chaff from milling, drill press grinding etc. In addition, neither aluminum nor copper chaff would not be hard enough to emboss an impression so the selection would have to be elsewhere.  While it was easy to draw mental picture of the particles  it is less so to to imagine a source for a man-made configuration of that type. 

So, in  selecting a particle model for the tests,  a paper staple chosen. Approximate (MOHS of 5, copper MOHS 3). The staples were cut and then filed  to 2 (.08 in) and 3mm (.122in.) sizes (2.03mm and 3.11)   width is .53mm (.021 inches) thickness is .041mm (.017 inches)

In selecting a staple  a material A staple was chosen because a material was required which would be tough enough to handle high stress without breaking, cracking or deforming/losing shape and a staple is also of the approximate dimensions of the alleged particle damage.



Your typical steel staple is pretty tough having been work hardened like the forged hammer you would use to bang a piece of copper into shape

Below are the test pieces utilized in our tests - 3mm above the date 2mm below the date






 A test model was devised to investigate exactly what it would take to create those marks. Below is a picture of the general set up






*Test set up and conditions*

1) A 150lb. Capacity digital scale shipping scale to measure pressure 
2) 1.35mm thick cold rolled copper sheet to model the IHS
3) Anvil to apply even pressure 5/16th drill stock ( we used stock vs an actual drill as the drill twist would not allow it to chuck up level)
4) Drill press to apply & control pressure.
5) 2 and 3mm paper staple particle for testing impressions.

The digital scale was calibrated against a separate Push/Pull spring gage on digital scale center and was found to be in agreement within approx 1 pound. The center of the scale was located, marked, and placed directly under the anvil. A 5in. sq piece of copper sheet was used as a base to uniformly spread the load to minimize any hysteresis that might be introduced into the measurement.

For the purposes on the test, 70 lbs was selected  as a max point.  In the four years Innovation Cooling has been doing public pressure testing, the lowest pressure readingt hat has been measured is 28 PSI and only 2 in the low 70 lb range and on a bell curve the mean is  the 55 PSI range.

Applied pressure was held for 10 seconds to allow the copper to flow as copper is incompressible. 



Calculated test pressures vs copper pressure thresholds


70 lbs. 2mm area  is 0.00168      70/ 0.00168 =41,667 PSI.
70 lbs .3mm area is 0.002562      70/0.002562 =27,322 PSI


Any cold-rolled or cold-forged copper is a hardened copper vs cast copper will have vastly different yield and tensile strengths. Whereas you may be able to make an appreciable embossing mark on pure cast copper at 20,000 psi, on a cold, form-rolled piece the range is much higher in a general range of 50-67,000 PSI. However as we were unable to make any appreciable/measurable embossing marks at 41,667, PSI we will fairly assume we are at some higher PSI number than our indicated test pressures of  27k and 42k PSI.

Cold-forging/stamping sheet copper will further harden the copper and some sources indicate yield strengths to 80,000 PSI including to as high  as 180,000 PSI This is important to note as the IHS had the lightest impression which is of all indicative of  of the higher, cold working pressures (harder).

 A range of 10 heat sinks also tested for hardness and all had been through some kind of cold working process forging, stamping, squeezing or drawing etc. and exhibited the equivalent hardness as seen on the modeled IHS.

For example Innovation Cooling uses Cold-rolled (hardened) copper bar stock to make our heat sinks.






 The test set up provided enough control to imprint to a tenth of a pound  of designated pressure with a high degree of repeatability between test samples.







The test sample below is with drill stock anvil @ 70 Psi of a  2mm and 3mm length with human hair (.003 in.) and a penny for scale. Viewed from a normal perspective, they appear as  minor scuffs on the surface without any depth.







Close up view detail.








Couple of things to note here – the 2mm marks have better definition as they have 42k PSI vs the 27k pressure load of the 3mm marks. 

The 3mm made absolutely no embossing imprint into the metal surface and only slightly marred  the roughened surface features.

The 2mm demonstrates only a marginal embossing print and when compared to the measured .003 in. human hair  or either particle an easy ballpark estimation of  well under .001 can be made. And When Measuring with a microscope from the top edge to the bottom mark from the highest point we could find, the depth measured  .00025 in. Notice that scratch follow through on the imprint and other surface features remain intact.

To then model our particles on an actual IHS we applied the max load of 70 PSI.

At this point we encountered an immediate difference with the 3mm and were unable to make an identifiable mark @ the 27K PSI after repeated tries.

Upon examining the IHS its appearance was more to the look of a forged piece indicating a further hardening beyond what you would experience with a simple cold rolled/worked piece.

So at this point , the 2mm piece was tested the several times and these are the two best partial prints we could manage. 

2mm scuff with combined close-up view produces zero surface penetration @ 70lbs.






View of the second partial print w/ human hair for scale @ 70 lbs..






It was estimated that to fully recreate the alleged particle damage one would most likely have to be in the 200 lb range (+100k PSI more or less) or enough to  plasticize the copper to make a workable impression. 

This is 300% three times the maximum recommended Intel board load and over 4 times the Intel nominal sink loading of 40-45 lbs.

The general concern here would be of fracturing the MB at these  dangerously elevated pressures.

*General discussion and limitations of test*

The primary condition of the test setup deals with a more than worst case scenario beyond what you could possibly experience in real life as the test comprises a tool steel anvil pressed flat and level against a test piece and no where else. In any event it does the job of bringing understanding as to the limits and level of difficulty involved in embossing/damaging at the nominal pressure loads hardened copper.

There were several other limiting factors that would support the fact that the compression damage as presented could not be possibly be the result of any contamination of any kind but these factors are beyond the scope of this effort.

A key point here requires the understanding and emphasis of the  design considerations of the IHS. The IHS's primary role is to protect the CPU both thermally and mechanically. For the thermal aspect, besides the use of conductive copper in heat transfer, close mechanical tolerances are required for CPU contact to the IHS. Intel has a specification requirement of // .002 or Flat and Parallel to within two thousandths of an inch across the surface of the entire IHS. 

This kind of tolerance is the hallmark of a forged part and whether actually forged or manufactured with a forge-like process is immaterial, but what is most important i in the employment of this process is that it is the one chosen when it is desirable to make the structurally hardest copper part possible. Mechanically, you require a piece that will contact the CPU, not flex under load or bend under stress; you need a piece that remains stable during the assembly processes and is resistant to cosmetic dings and scratches etc. 

With a typical cold rolled hardened piece, as you would see in a heat sink, to make an impression of a .005 depth is likely in the approximate pressure range of 140 -150lbs., or 70-85K PSI.

For a forged piece like the IHS a conservative number of 200 lbs + would have to be applied to recreate a + .005 depth. 

When one fully understands the hardness of the copper used in heat sinks and an IHS it is easy to understand the extreme pressure required to emboss them. One can only conclude that as the required pressures to recreate the purported particle/compression damage so far exceed the typical operating range that no particle damage can be assumed and the marks were made by some alternative means.*This being the case there was no particle contamination possible.

Innovation Cooling takes vigorous exception to the suggestion of particle contamination of our product IC Diamond from either our suppliers, contract mixer, or in house processing. Each stage is held to the highest level of standardized industry practice. The diamond utilized in our compound comes from the USA's largest supplier and is of the same quality and is in fact exactly the same material used in lapping high end optical equipment. To imply that large random over sized diamonds or contamination of any kind are part of the mix is an indicator of ignorance of the standardized screening process that have been in place for the last hundred years. This would be like finding silver nuggets in your silver compound or 100 grit particles on your 400 grit sandpaper. It it is extremely unlikely to happen.

Our supplier conforms to standard mil specifications in manufacturing and processing.

Our contact mixer QC's all material for size, shape, consistency etc. to mil spec. upon receipt. We pay for that service. Then mixes the material in a clean room environment on million dollar mixing machines with the material heated and under vacuum. 

The compound is received in sealed containers that are then tapped in a similar manner as you would a beer keg. Material is then pumped through a line directly through a valve into a medical syringe and immediately capped 


*Conclusion*

Under a worst case scenario with extreme pressures we were unable to recreate whatsoever the alleged damage IC Diamond was purported to have caused.

Cold-worked, hardened copper sharply limits any significant damage to above standardized maximum pressures

The marks were not caused by particle contamination and were made by some other means and as such no particle contamination can be assumed.




*Replacement offer*

After Investing the time and effort into this exercise an interest has grown to acquire the actual pieces and we would like to buy the components for full replacement value for a more detailed examination  and will of course pay for all shipping charges.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 23, 2013)

So what about my Noctua?
I mean thanks for finally at least saying something, but jebus man!!!!
So it takes you three weeks to press some bits into metal and write this up and you still have not attempted to tackle my cooler?

Look just send it back already!


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 23, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Again, any updates since we are working on three weeks with my cooler now?



Just got it an hour ago thanks for sending it. Another tenant in the building  took receipt and had it a few days. I had no tracking number to follow progress. I will take a look at it over the next few days.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 23, 2013)

Arctucas said:


> Or, an update regarding the availability of the Fuji Prescale in affordable size pieces?



it's been shipped to a couple of resellers and I assume they will have it up in the next day or two - I will post links when available.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 23, 2013)

Liar liar pants on fire....

It was shipped on your account, you had access to all information, and if it took you three weeks to realize it wasnt there....you really cannot expect me to believe that. (BTW it was scheduled for four days transit, you are blaming FedEx here?)

As I said in the last post, SEND IT BACK, you obviously dropped the ball on this deal. I mean I only asked at two weeks, and at three weeks, and it took you until the three week question to realize you didn't have it? What sort of company is this anyways, you ask for our help and in return get assholes and elbows for excuses, and then expect me to believe this drivel you put on our boards?

SEND IT BACK ALREADY, are we on the same page now?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 23, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Liar liar pants on fire....
> 
> It was shipped on your account, you had access to all information, and if it took you three weeks to realize it wasnt there....you really cannot expect me to believe that. (BTW it was scheduled for four days transit, you are blaming FedEx here?)
> 
> ...



I will send you a new one a new one today I have your address -Who is your favourite reseller?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 23, 2013)

Why cant I have mine?

If you do have a good reason for the above, why on earth do I care where you spend your money?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 23, 2013)

Well yours is horribly damaged and I thought I would be a nice guy and send you a new shiny one.

Also the intent was we were to examine it and see what was going on and I would like to follow through and do the job that was requested of us.

provide us with your resellers name so we can have it shipped today so you suffer no further delay.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 23, 2013)

wait man, don't push this onto me, you had my cooler for 2.5Weeks now. You had access to the tracking information, and you failed to act on what was promised. At no time in my PMs nor in this thread did you say can I borrow your cooler for a month or two! If you had addressed the situation in reality, that IC Diamond cant track their own packages, can't remember that it was even supposed to be there, then after two times of me reminding and getting ignored, you finally "find" my cooler....lame to say the least.

I work with many many companies, and by far this is the worst experience with a manufacturer in the PC aftermarket world I have ever seen, and I had some really shitty experiences in the past!

I'm sorry, but initially calling me a troll, flat out saying it wasn't an issue from your paste, me surrendering the cooler, getting ignored for me efforts to help improve something for a company (no gains on my end), then flat out being lied to in a public setting....at this point your weak attempt to be nice and understanding now is all for nothing!

You all fumbled this whole matter like no other company has done to me before. I will end this by saying, I don't care what you do at this point, get me a cooler, and I am done with this thread, your products, and will never recommend anyone deal with your company, EVER!

sincerely-
Chad Sebring
Case, Cooling, and Peripherals Editor
www.tweaktown.com


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 23, 2013)

I will just pick one then and make sure you get the tracking number


Ordered from newegg next business day - order will be processed according to them in the next 24-48 hours when I have the tracking number I will post it.


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 23, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> it's been shipped to a couple of resellers and I assume they will have it up in the next day or two - I will post links when available.



Thank you, I will check back then.


----------



## Chris_Ramseyer (Jan 23, 2013)

Yes, please send another cool so it can be tested with your TIM again, this time on video with before and after images, lint free, in review quality detail.


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 23, 2013)

IC, I think that the issue is not pressure (although it might be related but not the culprit); besides, as I've said, I didn't find any chunk of diamond or anything. I think that there's some sort of chemical reaction going on that eats the cooper. 


The curious parts are 1) the similar shape of the pit, 2) the fact that is concealed in a single area and 3) it only affected the IHS (my heatsink didn't show any damage).  You'd think that there would be damage everywhere if it was indeed a chemical reaction and that's were pressure would come in (I guess), although my setup didn't have any kind of super pressure or anything as you can see in my pressure paper tests.

Link to my results: http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2729313&postcount=131


In my case I tested 3 TIMs: IC, Cooler Master's standard compound (the small tubes that come with their heatsinks) and MX-4. I cleaned the CPU with isopropyl alcohol and paper towels between each test. When I tested with IC24 I ran 5 hot-cold cycles consisting on 100 loops of Intel Burn Test standard and then turning off the PCfor 1 hour (about 10 hours total). The hottest core was Core 0 although I don't know where is it located on the die and if the heat would be a factor too.




At the end the CPU only sustained cosmeticall damage, temps or performance weren't affected and I only removed the heatsink to install a water cooling kit. If it wasn't for that I wouldn't have known.


As for your offer, well, I already sanded the CPU again and put the last of my IC7 tube on it and I think that Sonda RMAed his block. Sorry.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 24, 2013)

TRWOV said:


> As for your offer, well, I already sanded the CPU again and put the last of my IC7 tube on it and I think that Sonda RMAed his block. Sorry.



Is that your cpu that had the ding in it! Heck how thick is the  cover on the cpu 

From seeing how deep the nick was I think you'd be into the chip itself lol.

Im just happy Andrew offered to replace the parts for full value. 

And Chad (sp) Im not picking on your posts ok so don't think I am please  so PLEASE take this with a grain of salt 

But You cant slam a guy for testing and answering a persons email when they're busy trying to find out if the product is faulty. I know from experience, I get into a project and nothing can take my attention away from what I'm doing until it's done. Andrew IMO did a good job and did a great presentation of his findings... I think TT should hire him for such a good detailed job. Better yet TPU should hire him 

I posted a Bulldozer cpu off to one of the other Moderators last year and what suppose to take 3-4 days with tracking took almost 3 weeks before he received the cpu. I was starting to think I was going to send his refund because it got lost or something but It was the Courier's fault... Yes they are not perfect, only God is perfect.

I agree with the other guy that posted and you place up a video and see what happens with your cooler. I am a simple man.. no video editing abilitys at all. I posted 3 videos on here from You tube showing what my cpu and water block looked like. But I wish you the best of luck and thanks.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I Brad K of The Great white north would recommend this ICDiamond to all enthusiasts out there. I have not been influenced in any way by means of torture, black mail, or cash for My endorsement...* I Fullinfusion gives ICD product 2 thumbs up *


----------



## TRWOV (Jan 24, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> Is that your cpu that had the ding in it! Heck how thick is the  cover on the cpu
> 
> From seeing how deep the nick was I think you'd be into the chip itself lol.




I just lapped it a little more to get rid of the scratches, there's some pit left (about 60% I'd say) but it certainty isn't in the same condition as the pictures anymore... besides it's an ES chip so monetary value is null anyway


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 24, 2013)

@ full, I dropped off the package at UPS, it was billed to IC Diamond, I got no tracking or receipt as I didn't pay for the service. Anywhere in the continental US takes no more than 4 days!

If you had a customer that had an issue, would you not keep tabs on said product being shipped to you? I mean had he said something at the 2 week mark, fine, but he came in read my post, and ignored it. Then in the end when he magically finds my cooler, he says it took 2 weeks to ship it and his neighbor had it a couple days. Funny thing about that is I copied his address to a T, so I guess he doesn't know where he works or how to get a customers product to him safely. They just fumbled the job, lied to me, and called me a troll for reporting my issue in the first place. I don't take your post as criticism, but if you had gone through this as a paying customer, how would you feel about this company???

Yeah let a site hire this thin skinned guy who blames everyone but himself for everything....I bet that job will last a long time

Lastly, the only reason I am getting a BNIB cooler is to try to appease me and make me go away, because I am causing too much of a stir in bad press for standing up for what I know and believe.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 24, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> A full, I dropped off the package at UPS, it was billed to IC Diamond, I got no tracking or receipt as I didn't pay for the service. Anywhere in the continental US takes no more than 4 days!
> 
> If you had a customer that had an issue, would you not keep tabs on said product being shipped to you? I mean had he said something at the 2 week mark, fine, but he came in read my post, and ignored it. Then in the end when he magically finds my cooler, he says it took 2 weeks to ship it and his neighbor had it a couple days. Funny thing about that is I copied his address to a T, so I guess he doesn't know where he works or how to get a customers product to him safely. They just fumbled the job, lied to me, and called me a troll for reporting my issue in the first place. I don't take your post as criticism, but if you had gone through this as a paying customer, how would you feel about this company???
> 
> Yeah let a site hire this thin skinned guy who blames everyone but himself for everything....I bet that job will last a long time


Yeah I know what your saying but at least he offered you a new cooler. But like I said shit happened. All I know is I was told tht Andrew was busy and I never got a word back from him till today (sense I work on the road) but he got back to me.

Chad all I was getting at was we dont live in a perfict world and yes you were called a troll as I was called a fanboy... Not nice but no sence worrying about names. It's water under the bridge. In the end you get a new cooler and others get educated. 

I want some memory! lol going into Memory express tomorrow !


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 24, 2013)

See point above in the edit for the new cooler, and I am here to educate both the people of TPU and this rep. Since it can and does happen to some, it needs to be known and not swept under the rug. The way they handled my cooler is how do I say this....complete shit, and why was I not kept in touch with and ignored all this time? Hopefully those that employ andrew read this and ponder more deeply who they want for their public image, as his take on trolls/fanboys and lying in public settings isn't doing a good job for IC Diamond at all!


----------



## DOM (Jan 24, 2013)

Lol whats his boss email ill like this thread to him


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 24, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> See point above in the edit for the new cooler, and I am here to educate both the people of TPU and this rep. Since it can and does happen to some, it needs to be known and not swept under the rug. The way they handled my cooler is how do I say this....complete shit, and why was I not kept in touch with and ignored all this time? Hopefully those that employ andrew read this and ponder more deeply who they want for their public image, as his take on trolls/fanboys and lying in public settings isn't doing a good job for IC Diamond at all!



FedEx Tracking Number:
550735998072


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 24, 2013)

For the contact paper and Pressure film I have four retailers set up- note I am not taking selling it just supplying a marketing test kit to them after which they will purchase it from Sensor Products  on their own for resale.

In any event they are looking for a website graphic or perhaps packaging picture of a before and after picture of an improvement in contact and pressure as was the thermal improvement we would appreciate a good example if it can be provided.  Thanks in advance


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 24, 2013)

Havent people posted those pictures in the results thread?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 24, 2013)

Not everybody, and need a better picture than what I have seen- something that has not been scaled down + permission


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 24, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Lastly, the only reason I am getting a BNIB cooler is to try to appease me and make me go away, because I am causing too much of a stir in bad press for standing up for what I know and believe.



No I think its to make you happy and there is nothing wrong with that. That way they can test your hardware in greater detail and see what the problem was so If there was a problem they could fix it so it never happens again. Look at the recalls car companies do when they have a big issue, they dont give ppl replacement cars... they correct the problem.

Chad in my honest as god's my whitness I think the problem could have been a bad base on your cooler. Like I said in a previous post mabey the plating of the cooler was fuged up straight from the get go... 

I believe Andrew is going the right thing for you and not to hush you up but to make things rite for you... Thats what a good company does.

Here off topic, I bought a 2013 Kia here last June and bitched about the fuel economy...

Here the dealer found the wrong fuel trim was programed into the computer straight from Korea... Ok that got fixed... Now Kia is issuing us customers a fuel rebate... 20,000km or one year for life as long as you own the car. Here they found one test on fuel economy was off by .01% IMO wipty fukin do but they are making good to there costermers. So all in all Im expecting $120-160 dollars a year on a pre paid credit card... to me thats what makes a company shine


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 24, 2013)

If they were honestly that worried about clearing ther name and keeping customers happy, I wouldn't be made out to be the bad guy, nor would they have lost my cooler for two weeks.

I never once said the TIM did it, I just said after using said product this is what I was left with.

I get where you are coming from, but to me it is still a buy off for the way they screwed this all up from the word go!

Also there is no rebate for being treated like crap, being lied to, nor the complete lack of any caring on their part. What's he gonna do ship me a box of TIM I will never use again?


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 24, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> If they were honestly that worried about clearing ther name and keeping customers happy, I wouldn't be made out to be the bad guy, nor would they have lost my cooler for two weeks.
> 
> I never once said the TIM did it, I just said after using said product this is what I was left with.
> 
> ...


Lol I hear ya, but can I have the TIM


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 24, 2013)

I'm sure if I get a crate of it, I would be making it rain IC Diamond somewhere


----------



## DOM (Jan 24, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> I'm sure if I get a crate of it, I would be making it rain IC Diamond somewhere



GOLDEN SHOWER


----------



## adulaamin (Jan 24, 2013)

DOM said:


> GOLDEN SHOWER



DIAMOND shower...


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 24, 2013)

DOM said:


> GOLDEN SHOWER


Dom with his mouth wide open for either... crazy texans.


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 24, 2013)

As it has taken way too long, in my opinion, to be able to buy sample packs of the Prescale film, I did some research. 

A company called Pressure Metrics LLC sells 12 inch by 10.6 inch (30cmx27cm) pieces of the Ultra-Low for $50. By my calculations, that appears to be enough to do approximately 36 tests for my 950, or ~$1.38 (before tax and shipping) per test.

I do not know what the final price will be from the retailers ICD is talking with, but if anyone wants/needs some now, it is available.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 25, 2013)

Arctucas said:


> As it has taken way too long, in my opinion, to be able to buy sample packs of the Prescale film, I did some research.
> 
> A company called Pressure Metrics LLC sells 12 inch by 10.6 inch (30cmx27cm) pieces of the Ultra-Low for $50. By my calculations, that appears to be enough to do approximately 36 tests for my 950, or ~$1.38 (before tax and shipping) per test.
> 
> I do not know what the final price will be from the retailers ICD is talking with, but if anyone wants/needs some now, it is available.


Want mine? would that sample pack help you? 

I know my block has 100% coverage but if you feel like its taking to long then you can have mine till it all gets sorted out! 

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Shining like a Diamond, cool as the rain, ICD 24 keepin ma 4.9GHz Cool as ice 

Can a moderator change my Custom title to ICD 24K supporter?

Who do I ask to do that for me? The senior Mod? PM W1zzard?


----------



## itsakjt (Jan 25, 2013)

Yes I also found out that IC Diamond does have some coarse particles. I applied the compound in my laptop CPU(bare die) and have found out the CPU has very minor scratches in the die. While trying to clean it with lemon and coffee filter, it even scratched the substrate(PCB) also. I follow this method in all my thermal compound history(CM Thermal Fusion 400, CM IC Essential, HTK-002) but never any one of those caused any damage.


----------



## DOM (Jan 25, 2013)

EarthDog said:


> Dom with his mouth wide open for either... crazy texans.


Haha u slut stop telling ppl what I do to you XD 





itsakjt said:


> Yes I also found out that IC Diamond does have some coarse particles. I applied the compound in my laptop CPU(bare die) and have found out the CPU has very minor scratches in the die. While trying to clean it with lemon and coffee filter, it even scratched the substrate(PCB) also. I follow this method in all my thermal compound history(CM Thermal Fusion 400, CM IC Essential, HTK-002) but never any one of those caused any damage.



You need to build a clean room and wear a clean suit when using this stuff icd isn't at fault.....


----------



## itsakjt (Jan 25, 2013)

DOM said:


> Haha u slut stop telling ppl what I do to you XD
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Nope.  Only IC Diamond caused the damage. It even damaged the chipset also. Those never occured before during my servicing.


----------



## g1lgamesh (Jan 25, 2013)

*icd*

Hey folks

This my first post here, 

If I may shed some light on the situation, however I must state my interests beforehand.

I am sponsored by icd and help them out with the contact/pressure testing etc on various water blocks. So if you wish to take my opnion with a pinch of salt, please feel free to do so. I am just being straight from the start.

I have tested this paste since my intital review (before working with Andrew) since 2009 and not in one instance have I found the issue as shown above. Not doubting the gentlemans word just wondering how it could have happened?

I will say this though, ICD does have a polishing effect on a standard IHS it wears off the cpu markings fairly quickly. On the balance side of things ALL CPU compounds are abrasive in one form or other. Artic silver uses Aluminium Oxide (often to make hard wearing rubies) so they all are abrasive and used often enough can wear off the marking(THIS HAPPENS ON ALL COMPOUNDS) on the CPU.

Personally what I think Andrew should do is either market or develop a cleaning solution good enough even to take off ICD from a CPU in the evento of a HSF/ water block change. In addition I have noticed some people removing ICD from the iHS by almost rubbing the paste off-rather than lifting it off (if you get my meaning) This then makes the polishing effect more pronounced by using the former cleaning method.

BTW if anyone is in the UK I will be selling the paper myself (through agreement iwth Andrew)

anyay just my opinion.

g1lgamesh


----------



## t_ski (Jan 25, 2013)

g1lgamesh said:


> I will say this though, ICD does have a polishing effect on a standard IHS it wears off the cpu markings fairly quickly.



As you have stated, this means that the compound is abrasive, and given the fact that many people are noticing this rather quickly compared to other compounds, that can only meant hat this compound is more abrasive than other compounds.  If it's by some chance not due to the abrasiveness, then this must be due to some chemical reaction.

Both of these points have been made by several people in this thread, and it's been ignored.


----------



## Fourstaff (Jan 25, 2013)

t_ski said:


> Both of these points have been made by several people in this thread, and it's been ignored.



He has said that abrasion is to be expected, but I can't be bothered to find the exact post. As for whether more abrasion happens than usual, I cant remember him saying about that. 

As for chemical damage, official stance is that there should be no chemical damage. So both problem has been "dealt with", just not to satisfaction.


----------



## g1lgamesh (Jan 25, 2013)

Fourstaff said:


> He has said that abrasion is to be expected, but I can't be bothered to find the exact post. As for whether more abrasion happens than usual, I cant remember him saying about that.
> 
> As for chemical damage, official stance is that there should be no chemical damage. So both problem has been "dealt with", just not to satisfaction.



I didnt say more abrasion than usual, one was just saying what i have noticed. I also said all compounds do that if you change CPU's and or water blocks as often as I do amd im talking tjhe marking off my cpu over a 14 month period. However if you rubb off hte compound rather than lift off the compound then you would create a polishing effect this is on ANY manufacturers choice.


----------



## DOM (Jan 25, 2013)

g1lgamesh said:


> I didnt say more abrasion than usual, one was just saying what i have noticed. I also said all compounds do that if you change CPU's and or water blocks as often as I do/



ive only had these kind of issues with ICD and ive never had a paste do what ICD does no matter how many times I reapplied it,  as for AS I havent use that stuff since 06 

but glad I didnt mess up anything or bad just staining on the cpu block and fading of the ihs which I never experienced before with any paste


----------



## Fourstaff (Jan 25, 2013)

g1lgamesh said:


> I didnt say more abrasion than usual, one was just saying what i have noticed. I also said all compounds do that if you change CPU's and or water blocks as often as I do amd im talking tjhe marking off my cpu over a 14 month period. However if you rubb off hte compound rather than lift off the compound then you would create a polishing effect this is on ANY manufacturers choice.



Not referring to you, just repeating what the ICD rep said


----------



## g1lgamesh (Jan 25, 2013)

same here on as5 i dont use it much, however as5 though its poor compared to modern products outsells everoyne else for some reason.

A5 was jsut an example Aluminium Oxide is used in a myriad of differing products.



Fourstaff said:


> Not referring to you, just repeating what the ICD rep said



I think a video or a study on the abrasive effects on the leading manufacturers TIM as compared ot ICD could be a good idea.

Although in my experience the ICD works like a treat, I know it wears off the Marking on the cpu ihs, but then again i have not tested this with other compounds as of yet. I change wc blocks as much as 2 to 3 times a day on the same cpu so could be a good idea like i said to test this.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 25, 2013)

@ gilgamesh, what you say makes no sense.



> I will say this though, ICD does have a polishing effect on a standard IHS it wears off the cpu markings fairly quickly. On the balance side of things ALL CPU compounds are abrasive in one form or other. Artic silver uses Aluminium Oxide (often to make hard wearing rubies) so they all are abrasive and used often enough can wear off the marking(THIS HAPPENS ON ALL COMPOUNDS) on the CPU.
> 
> Personally what I think Andrew should do is either market or develop a cleaning solution good enough even to take off ICD from a CPU in the evento of a HSF/ water block change. In addition I have noticed some people removing ICD from the iHS by almost rubbing the paste off-rather than lifting it off (if you get my meaning) This then makes the polishing effect more pronounced by using the former cleaning method.



I will give you that all compounds are "abrasive" but your experience and testing has failed you. Also how do you expect users to remove the paste, are they supposed to vacuum it off the IHS, I mean wiping or scraping is the only method to use other than dunking the chip in something that would dissolve the paste. Even with a cleaner, you have to wipe off the residue left by it (which would contain diamond bits still).



> ...a 14 month period


That really sucks from a paste! I have an IHS here that was cut from its core in October of 2007 and has tested damn near every compound on the market and cooler up until last year when the TEC plate burned out. It is a little battle worn, but in 5 years of use, with many applications, the lettering is still fine. So to say all are abrasive really doesn't matter when one is like a metal file while the others are more like a babies diaper.

Link to article of the build of the TECC testbed....
http://www.tweaktown.com/articles/1200/thermal_chamber_heatsink_testing_methods/index.html

Image of said IHS I took 10 minutes ago (yes battle worn, but readable as the day this donor proc was released)...






So what is your point to come in here and say that the paste will damage things, we already know that. If you were half the tester you claim to be, and used something other than IC Diamond products since 2009 you might be more aware of real world products and conditions.

I guess the real question is, if they have an in-house tester such as yourself, why not stop drooling over it, and test some other compounds to see how bad and abrasive this product really is. To come in and state our paste will void the CPU warranty in 14 months is a bit absurd from any manufacturer. (IE Intel or AMD will not RMA a proc without the lettering on the IHS!)


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 25, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> Want mine? would that sample pack help you?
> 
> I know my block has 100% coverage but if you feel like its taking to long then you can have mine till it all gets sorted out!



Thank you for the generous offer, but no, if it is all the same to you, I would prefer to purchase mine.


----------



## natr0n (Jan 26, 2013)

I just cleaned my comp and put fresh paste I looked at my heatsink after cleaning and it has tiny pits on it now from the previous Ic Diamond application.I'm pretty upset about this. Never have I ever experienced any thermal paste issues in my many years in this field.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Jan 26, 2013)

natr0n said:


> I just cleaned my comp and put fresh paste I looked at my heatsink after cleaning and it has tiny pits on it now from the previous Ic Diamond application.



What do you mean by tiny pits? Pics Plz? 


I'm wondering if I should begin to concern myself with my ICD application.


----------



## natr0n (Jan 26, 2013)

AphexDreamer said:


> What do you mean by tiny pits? Pics Plz?
> 
> 
> I'm wondering if I should begin to concern myself with my ICD application.



Just uploaded them.


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 26, 2013)

I also, am becoming concerned. Although, I really, really do not want to pull my Heatkiller.

I wonder what commonality there is for those with affected heatsinks?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 26, 2013)

Arctucas said:


> I wonder what commonality there is for those with affected heatsinks?



we used IC diamond.


----------



## itsakjt (Jan 27, 2013)

So natr0n's post verifies it again. I will not use ICD again.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Jan 27, 2013)

This thread seem to be telling me to check mine.


----------



## natr0n (Jan 27, 2013)

I got this stuff on everything cpu, gfx, north and south bridges.

Gonna be a hassle to clean and redo all that.


----------



## itsakjt (Jan 27, 2013)

@Natron-Clean it extra carefully. My laptop chipset and CPU had scratches while I tried to clean the ICD off with coffee paper.


----------



## natr0n (Jan 27, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> @Natron-Clean it extra carefully. My laptop chipset and CPU had scratches while I tried to clean the ICD off with coffee paper.



ah it's no worry, I use goo gone gel. It emulsifies it and easy to remove with qtips.

I will be careful though.


----------



## SonDa5 (Jan 27, 2013)

natr0n said:


> I got this stuff on everything cpu, gfx, north and south bridges.
> 
> Gonna be a hassle to clean and redo all that.





How long has it been sitting?


----------



## natr0n (Jan 27, 2013)

cpu was a few months , yesterday I redid it. mobo/chipsets 6 months I would guess. 1 week on new gpu.


----------



## adulaamin (Jan 27, 2013)

After seeing all these pics I'll be replacing the ICD24 on my CPU as soon as I get home. I'll post pics whether or not I see damage. I don't want to risk damaging my CPU that's just my main reason.


----------



## micropage7 (Jan 27, 2013)

natr0n said:


> I just cleaned my comp and put fresh paste I looked at my heatsink after cleaning and it has tiny pits on it now from the previous Ic Diamond application.I'm pretty upset about this. Never have I ever experienced any thermal paste issues in my many years in this field.
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130126/DSC00145.jpg
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130126/DSC00146.jpg
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130126/DSC00147.jpg
> ...




those marks, its like you dropped it on the road
its like kinda random side effect


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 27, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> we used IC diamond.



Aside from that.


Such as; are they all plated and is the damage only to the plating?

Or, are they all of a certain type, such as air coolers versus waterblocks?

Or, are they all from a common manufacturer?

There are other factors I could list, but you get the idea...


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 27, 2013)

adulaamin said:


> After seeing all these pics I'll be replacing the ICD24 on my CPU as soon as I get home. I'll post pics whether or not I see damage. I don't want to risk damaging my CPU that's just my main reason.


One sheep jump's off the cliff and the rest folllow.

Let me re post my videos to show you my results and trust me there is more mounting pressure then even intel recommends.










[yt]RXCkJ-9HuwI[/yt]

[yt]c9k-3KFgEYo[/yt]

*Pictures of my cpu and block*

















I've unsucribed from this thread. This thread has swayed waay to the left 

later ppl and best of luck.


----------



## adulaamin (Jan 27, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> One sheep jump's off the cliff and the rest folllow.
> 
> Let me re post my videos to show you my results and trust me there is more mounting pressure then even intel recommends.



I'm unsure so I'm gonna remove the paste. It's not only one sheep btw. You should know coz you've been hanging around the thread for quite some time. I spent my hard earned money on the hardware so I have every right to use whatever paste I want. Just like what I said. I don't want to risk it.


----------



## Frick (Jan 27, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> One sheep jump's off the cliff and the rest folllow.
> 
> Let me re post my videos to show you my results and trust me there is more mounting pressure then even intel recommends.
> 
> ...



WE GET IT. No damage to your stuff, which is great. But some people have had strange experiences with this paste. Those dips in natr0n's (and others) heatsink didn't appear by magic. There is something going on, but I think arcturas is on the right track: Do these users have anything in common, aside from the paste?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 27, 2013)

Compound removal


*Overview*

I thought people would benefit from both an understanding of 'how' to remove ICD and irrefutable proof that IC Diamond does not damage the IHS markings. 

A  test model was developed to demonstrate a worst case contact scenario of a high pressure heat sink/IHS mount with IC Diamond as the interface material against surface coating fragile enough to be an indicator of surface polishing under extreme conditions

 For a demonstration to prove that IC Diamond does not damage IHS markings we needed a surface coating/finish that was much thinner than the 1 or 2 micron lettering found on Intel and AMD IHS.  A number of potential candidates were ruled out. Paint was no good as it reacted to solvents on a clean up and was too thick thinner, non reactive coatings  Like AR (anti reflective) and anodized aluminum while thin enough, were too  hard for an adequate comparison.

We finally settled on an oxidized copper sheet. Copper oxidation growth in an open, natural, rural weather environment  proceeds at a very slow rate of  perhaps .5 microns a year . So on some copper sheet that's been sitting around in our lab a couple of years and in an interior , air - conditioned environment,  you can anticipate oxide growth to be 1/10 of an exterior exposure. We had the ideal situation, oxidized copper with a coating of .1 to .2 microns. and with IHS serial markings that have a estimated thickness of just 1 to 2 microns, the copper oxide coating represents approx 10-20 %  the thickness of the the manufacturer serial markings, Additionally is soft enough to polish back to its original shine with nothing more abrasive than a finger, in less than 5 seconds.

Below is the selected copper sheet






*Test Model*

Picture of the test set up







The complete set materials/components used here are

1) A 150 lb. Digital shipping scale
2) 2 pony 40 lb. spring clamps
3) 1 tube of IC Diamond 24
4) One 5X5 1.35 mm thick oxidized copper sheet
5) One 30mm X 3mm thick copper block to model  base heat sink contact
*
Test Description*

The test set up simulates application of IC Diamond  on a contact area approximately equal to to an IHS on a 5 X 5 inch oxidized copper sheet. 

 The copper oxide simulates, at a lower extreme, the 1-2 micron thickness of manufacturers serial markings which are 80 to 90% thicker by comparison to the oxide surface finish. 

The  30mm X 3mm thick copper block is to model  base heat sink contact to which the IC diamond compound is applied.

IC Diamond is then applied to the 30mm square modeled heat sink base and clamped with the spring clamps to the test piece a together at the maximum clamp jaw extension of close to 2 inches to  the scale to simulate  what you would  experience with a heat sink and IHS contacted under pressure with IC Diamond as an interface.

Test notes:

 This test case represents an extreme worst case scenario, room temperature, copper oxide surface finishes are very different from high temperature thermally generated ones and are easily marked with sub  copper MOHS (3) hard materials like a fingernail, paper, piece of wood, etc.

Applied pressure is also worst case scenario,  4lbs. above board specified loads and 30lbs above user averages.


Close up view of the test area to note prior  to the test pre existing scuffs and scratches






Application of Compound – note process mark






With the pony Clamps applied, a pressure of 79lbs (_4lbs higher than Intel max board load specification_) is in place and compound can be seen to be squeezed out the sides.






Disassembled test -slight finish smear  under the #1 process mark when applying the first clamp the piece moved.






Compound re-liquefied  with acetone.






Compound removal 

Solvents in thermal compound removal are used to replace and/or ease mechanical action required to remove a material that has good mechanical adhesion (good mechanical contact = good thermal transfer).   

Most  thermal compounds have exactly the same primary ingredient ( Aluminum oxide) as a lapping compound  or sandpaper (Aluminum oxide), while diamond is hard (MOHS 10) it is only incrementally so,  aluminum oxide (mohs 9) is actually the preferred cutting agent used by the glass industry.  According to these products MSDS's Shin Etsu, AS5, MX4 etc. all contain significant %'s of aluminum oxide.

Despite the highly abrasive nature of these materials when correctly applied and removed no issues should be encountered.  Countless how-to  videos have been observed by Innovation Cooling where the presenter squirts out some cleaning agent and then begins to vigorously scrub the piece much like they cleaning a frying pan. This clearly shows a lack of understanding of basic, common shop practice.

Good shop practice is to let the solvent do the mechanical work to re-liquefy and remove the compound as above by blotting with a solvent saturated paper towel till compound is fully dissolved . Once dissolved, the compound is lifted or loosened from the contact surface *and easily removed with a single wipe or two without abrasion. This works with even the hardest most dried out compound it just requires a little more patience. 




Below is the cleaned piece with no evidence of any marking or damage to the .1-.2  micron thick surface







Note that the surface is so thin and delicate  that nothing more abrasive than a finger can polish it back to it's original shine in under 5 seconds







*Summary Conclusion*

Under extreme conditions the test performed here was above the manufacturer's  maximum load specifications on a material much softer than manufacturer's serial markings on an IHS (as an at home test try removing the markings on your CPU with finger abrasion) and on the order of 10-20%  of the thickness of typical IHS markings. 

Final test result  showed no scratches, no polishing and no visible abrasion of any kind.

When the compound is properly applied and removed,  the typical high end user will experience zero problems with multiple heat sink mounts and dismounts independent of  any external mechanical factors not related to recommended thermal compound application and removal procedure.


I would note that demonstrations of proper removal were performed here by one moar in his live video and FullFusion in his video posted earlier in the thread where they encountered no problems and are great examples of how to do it properly and are referenced here for those that need instruction.


----------



## cadaveca (Jan 27, 2013)

IC diamond, can you try mountings with other pastes, clean using different methods, and then apply IC Diamond?


Replicating any install scenario, checking long-term, may show similar results to these users? or maybe not.


----------



## adulaamin (Jan 27, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> IC diamond, can you try mountings with other pastes, clean using different methods, and then apply IC Diamond?
> 
> 
> Replicating any install scenario, checking long-term, may show similar results to these users? or maybe not.



Or maybe try to let the compound sit for some time, maybe a month to see if it does react to copper? Sorry if it's already been done.


----------



## DOM (Jan 27, 2013)

@ fullinfusion your a joke just cuz some ppl complain you think there just lieing and now that some have seen it and are worried and find similar damage your calling them sheep lol 

I hope more ppl check there stuff maybe then you and icd come to a realisation somethin isn't right with this paste....


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 27, 2013)

natr0n said:


> I just cleaned my comp and put fresh paste I looked at my heatsink after cleaning and it has tiny pits on it now from the previous Ic Diamond application.I'm pretty upset about this. Never have I ever experienced any thermal paste issues in my many years in this field.




It's up to you* now to prove *that IC Diamond was the cause now you have made the claim. Let's send your compound directly to a material analysis company and we will post the results here. On my shipping account.

Any pictures of mirror damage on you IHS? 

Send your sink to me for analysis on my shipping account for analysis and I will replace it even though IC Diamond was not the cause of your damage.


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 27, 2013)

@ICD,

During the above test, was any thermal cycling done? That is, heating and cooling the test materials to simulate normal temperature fluctuations one would expect to experience during typical PC use?

Also, I did not see it mentioned the overall length of time it took to perform the test?

I am not trying to take sides here, only to understand the testing methodology and parameters.


----------



## natr0n (Jan 27, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> It's up to you* now to prove *that IC Diamond was the cause now you have made the claim. Let's send your compound directly to a material analysis company and we will post the results here. On my shipping account.
> 
> Any pictures of mirror damage on you IHS?
> 
> Send your sink to me for analysis on my shipping account for analysis and I will replace it even though IC Diamond was not the cause of your damage.




I have to take pic of ihs when I reapply some other paste when arrives this week. I left it in the socket when I cleaned it. I will look.

I have a feeling your formulation uses Boric acid and that is the cause of these issues for some.


----------



## Tatty_One (Jan 27, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> It's up to you* now to prove *that IC Diamond was the cause now you have made the claim. Let's send your compound directly to a material analysis company and we will post the results here. On my shipping account.
> 
> Any pictures of mirror damage on you IHS?
> 
> Send your sink to me for analysis on my shipping account for analysis and I will replace it even though IC Diamond was not the cause of your damage.



To be honest, if we are at the point where you disbelieve claims of damage etc and need members who say they have used your compound to have "proof" .... what is the point in continuing with this thread, all we are going to end up with is a group of those who have had no issues..... and a group who have... with all of them sending you their coolers, so what do they do, go without a PC for a few weeks whilst you investigate your own product, seems to me that the whole point of having a thread here is to test and report, not have to defend oneself for saying that things didn't work out for some.

As a side note..... I have used your product and have no issues thus far, my concerns however are for the community, and even if they are a minority, the ones who "may" have had a negative experience having to prove they have, little point IMO of a feedback thread if it's not beleived.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 27, 2013)

natr0n said:


> I have to take pic of ihs when I reapply some other paste when arrives this week. I left it in the socket when I cleaned it. I will look.
> 
> I have a feeling your formulation uses Boric acid and that is the cause of these issues for some.




Boric acid is just plain silly

Lets send your tube out for analysis - send me you sink - you make the claim now back it up.

Prove it, this is you opportunity


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 27, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Boric acid is just plain silly
> 
> Lets send your tube out for analysis - send me you sink - you make the claim now back it up.
> 
> Prove it, this is you opportunity



I backed it up, and here we are a month later with no results.....great recommendation there chief 

Also, it is spelled "your"


----------



## Frick (Jan 27, 2013)

Tatty_One said:


> To be honest, if we are at the point where you disbelieve claims of damage etc and need members who say they have used your compound to have "proof" .... what is the point in continuing with this thread, all we are going to end up with is a group of those who have had no issues..... and a group who have... with all of them sending you their coolers, so what do they do, go without a PC for a few weeks whilst you investigate your own product, seems to me that the whole point of having a thread here is to test and report, not have to defend oneself for saying that things didn't work out for some.
> 
> As a side note..... I have used your product and have no issues thus far, my concerns however are for the community, and even if they are a minority, the ones who "may" have had a negative experience having to prove they have, little point IMO of a feedback thread if it's not beleived.



He is taking steps to investigate it.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 27, 2013)

Arctucas said:


> @ICD,
> 
> During the above test, was any thermal cycling done? That is, heating and cooling the test materials to simulate normal temperature fluctuations one would expect to experience during typical PC use?
> 
> ...



Discussion is about scratching - Time and temp are not factors. We have tested both ways raw particle and raw particle in compound if damage is to occur it occurs in the first second of pressure. end of story.

Thanks for the alternate source for the contact film I'll pass it along to the resellers


----------



## Black Panther (Jan 27, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Discussion is about scratching - Time and temp are not factors. We have tested both ways raw particle and raw particle in compound if damage is to occur it occurs in the first second of pressure. end of story.
> 
> Thanks for the alternate source for the contact film I'll pass it along to the resellers



What were the results you reached with the testing you did on Sneekypeet's cooler?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jan 27, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> I backed it up, and here we are a month later with no results.....great recommendation there chief
> 
> Also, it is spelled "your"



No you did not- no tube, no paste, no smoking gun particles.

5 complaints and none willing to produce a tube for an independent analysis- 

The first 3 out of the gate proved not to be IC Diamond - the other two are in process

Frankly if you spend a little time testing you get familiar with the rules of how this stuff works and it might come as a surprise to some or maybe not as what it takes to make what mark.

So just having received your sink I noticed some serious anomalies in the 1 minute I looked at it.

Not to worry though I will give it the special attention it deserves no matter how long it takes as I am sure want my best effort on it 

In any event have some patience.


----------



## Arctucas (Jan 27, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Discussion is about scratching - Time and temp are not factors. We have tested both ways raw particle and raw particle in compound if damage is to occur it occurs in the first second of pressure. end of story.
> 
> Thanks for the alternate source for the contact film I'll pass it along to the resellers



My apologies, I misunderstood. 

My presumption was that there was a concerted effort to determine whether the product caused pitting as a result of some as of yet unknown reaction, as well as the scratching and/or staining issue(s).

Consequently, I would inquire if you are planning to conduct further testing to address those other issues not covered by the previous test?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 27, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> No you did not- no tube, no paste, no smoking gun particles.



Because i was asked to spread it, but again you keep twisting things in your head.

And i know next comes, "you didn't find particles either did you?" To which my response is still the same, YOUR PASTE IT TOO DAMN THICK TO TELL!!!!

Also a TIM that needs special care to remove, your own guy says it strips the lettering off, and then you do some lame ass pressure test and "specially remove" the TIM to prove your own guys story a lie? Or was there another point to your madness?

Also I do have your other two tubes of TIM, but who is to say you will give me the right address this time, or not just blame Fed Ex for you losing my things?


----------



## Athlon2K15 (Jan 28, 2013)

I would have tryed IC Diamond previous to this mess. Now I think I will stick with ARCTIC,as it has none of these issues.


----------



## fullinfusion (Jan 28, 2013)

DOM said:


> @ fullinfusion your a joke just cuz some ppl complain you think there just lieing and now that some have seen it and are worried and find similar damage your calling them sheep lol
> 
> I hope more ppl check there stuff maybe then you and icd come to a realisation somethin isn't right with this paste....


Thanks DOM, never called anyone a lier lol. So by rights, I can call you a lier? hmmm


----------



## HammerON (Jan 28, 2013)

Alright folks, this thread is going no where fast. This TIM testing is dividing our community and there is no need for it.
It is clear that some have had problems and others have not. Please - try to remain civil in your posts


----------



## erocker (Jan 28, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Compound removal
> 
> 
> *Overview*
> ...



Repeat these tests using something polished or nickel please. Your choice of copper plate is rather rough. Also try using a tripod, good lighting and a macro setting on the camera. While I didn't have any issues with the paste I received, the amount of folks having issues leads me to believe that it is not their process or heatsinks causing the issues.

For those who did have issues with this product, I would like to see some pictures, preferably with the paste spread out on a sheet of white paper and check for any kind of particles or other inconsistencies.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 28, 2013)

erocker said:


> preferably with the paste spread out on a sheet of white paper and check for any kind of particles or other inconsistencies.



you would need to heat the paste for this, it is too thick to spread to the point of seeing anything.


----------



## DOM (Jan 28, 2013)

erocker said:


> Repeat these tests using something polished or nickel please. Your choice of copper plate is rather rough. Also try using a tripod, good lighting and a macro setting on the camera. While I didn't have any issues with the paste I received, the amount of folks having issues leads me to believe that it is not their process or heatsinks causing the issues.
> 
> For those who did have issues with this product, I would like to see some pictures, preferably with the paste spread out on a sheet of white paper and check for any kind of particles or other inconsistencies.



i still have some left i can try to spread it out, but i only experienced a nasty smell and staining and the ihs letters got lighter on the ihs but that cpu has been sold



sneekypeet said:


> you would need to heat the paste for this, it is too thick to spread to the point of seeing anything.



in a warm cup of water ? like fullinfusion said a while back to help it spread XD


----------



## sneekypeet (Jan 28, 2013)

DOM said:


> in a warm cup of water ? like fullinfusion said a while back to help it spread XD



sure, just saying out of the tube in ambient temperatures wouldn't work.


----------



## KainXS (Jan 28, 2013)

You know I have been keeping up with this thread and have been just strugging most of the complaints aside as I installed this stuff on a few of my systems and it performed well so cool, but lately I was noticing a very obvious drop in my old laptop(a precision m6300) which i was testing this stuff on.

So I disassemble it and start to remove it, bam fishy smell(I think its caused by friction but who cares its only a smell), but as soon as I start to take it off it starts scratching the die on the cpu ever so slightly and left a minor blemish on it and I was just like wtf, I have used dozens of other tims for years and only had that happen with anything but the cheapest stuff(ebay garbage) and a few of the liquid metals.

Had one more heatsink to go, because this has an old 7950GTX in it and this is where I am somewhat not happy, very very obvious blemishing, and more scratching, I am just surprised that what some of you were saying was actually true, very surprised.

If you guys install this stuff do the die directly, remove it very carefully.

maybe its because they were soft

I don't know, no pics either, not in the mood.

but based on the performance on my desktops I still wouldn't think its that bad as long as you have an ihs(as long as those are not damaged) but on a die directly, not a chance in hell man.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Jan 28, 2013)

Could vibrations from a very strong mounted FAN on a heat sink create the effect needed to put pits in the die? 

Also I could careless about scratches on my CPU die, I just want to make sure it won't pit!


----------



## Tatty_One (Jan 28, 2013)

I have temporarily closed the thread, I beleive it is descending into a bit of a mess with the Pro and negative experience and at times is getting out of hand.

I welcome the hard evidence from investigations that the company is currently carrying out on Sneekypeet's cooler and no doubt others, it is clear that they are attempting to resolve things and I look forward to a honest and open response, at which time I will re-open the thread so the results can be posted here for the community to see and hopefully move forward.... thank you.


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 12, 2013)

Despite no replies or responses from the company to various PM's to date sadly, it's been decided only fair to re-open, please keep things civil and constructive.


----------



## Athlon2K15 (Feb 12, 2013)

oh no! What have you done tatty


----------



## adulaamin (Feb 12, 2013)

Here are my pics when I replaced the TIM on my CPU.












Notice how the stain is only on the copper heatpipes? I'm *assuming* there's something that makes the paste react to copper. It would be good if ICDiamond could do a test where they could simulate what happens if their TIM is used on copper bases for a prolonged period of time.











No damages only staining and a weird smell from the paste just like what some of the other members here are reporting. I've since gon back to using Tuniq TX-4.


----------



## fullinfusion (Feb 16, 2013)

Before ppl call me a fan boy just let me chime in here k!

As most know I've been ... well on ICD's side for most of the tests.

The post above me shows and said it stained the copper base.

I agree but FACT is....

Copper stains regardless on what you put on it. Look! a penny being copper, it stains just from being in your pocket 

Copper pipe for water lines stain just from the atmosphere around it.

And about the smell, What does a person do to say it has a weird order? Do you stick your nose rite into the paste to smell it? It's a question and not a pock at ppl.

I have a copper based water block stored away and guess what... it's also stained. Guess what the paste was? 

MX4 paste!


----------



## t_ski (Feb 16, 2013)

I think there is a difference between oxidation and staining


----------



## fullinfusion (Feb 16, 2013)

t_ski said:


> I think there is a difference between oxidation and staining



But isn't it the same thing? just different ways of staining?


----------



## erocker (Feb 16, 2013)

Oxidation is "rust". It is a chemical reaction and the oxidation is what's left over. As far as the staining goes, stains can be cleaned you just need to right solvent.


----------



## DOM (Feb 16, 2013)

fullinfusion said:


> Before ppl call me a fan boy just let me chime in here k!
> 
> As most know I've been ... well on ICD's side for most of the tests.
> 
> ...



we cant call you somthing you already know what you are already 

and on the smell no I didnt put my nose near it just from removing the wb and the smell came out


----------



## fullinfusion (Feb 16, 2013)

DOM said:


> we cant call you somthing you already know what you are already
> 
> and on the smell no I didnt put my nose near it just from removing the wb and the smell came out


^
lol 

And thank you Erocker! Question answered


----------



## natr0n (Feb 16, 2013)

Cleaned this off my parts few weeks ago. Paste had an odor like a fishy/metal reaction.

My CPU IHS laser etching was worn almost away. I couldn't capture it on camera.

Just wanted to share my experience.


----------



## cdawall (Feb 16, 2013)

DOM said:


> we cant call you somthing you already know what you are already
> 
> and on the smell no I didnt put my nose near it just from removing the wb and the smell came out



I will go ahead and pull the sink after my deployment so everyone can see if it pitted the shiny nickle bottom of my CM V10. Has high RPM fans, is huge and has ICD under it. If anything is going to cause problems it is. Hell it shipped from the US to were I am now in my luggage so you know it was tossed around.


----------



## fullinfusion (Feb 24, 2013)

cdawall said:


> I will go ahead and pull the sink after my deployment so everyone can see if it pitted the shiny nickle bottom of my CM V10. Has high RPM fans, is huge and has ICD under it. If anything is going to cause problems it is. Hell it shipped from the US to were I am now in my luggage so you know it was tossed around.


Be patiently awaiting your report and be safe too bro!


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (Feb 26, 2013)

I'd like to point out to people rushing to check their sinks and IHS for scratches who might not have been paying attention before - scratching and light gouging is normal regardless of paste. Especially on those polished high pressure sinks. If you want to be confident in your complaint I'd take before and after pics mounting with another paste, and then again with ICD. 

I'd just like to see some harder to question results in this thread.


----------



## Tatty_One (Feb 26, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> I'd like to point out to people rushing to check their sinks and IHS for scratches who might not have been paying attention before - scratching and light gouging is normal regardless of paste. Especially on those polished high pressure sinks. If you want to be confident in your complaint I'd take before and after pics mounting with another paste, and then again with ICD.
> 
> I'd just like to see some harder to question results in this thread.



Thats a very good point, I would also like to hear of the results of several weeks of testing IC Diamond have been completing on coolers with these claims, it seems our IC Diamond rep visits here most days but has not as yet updated us.


----------



## SonDa5 (Feb 26, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> I'd like to point out to people rushing to check their sinks and IHS for scratches who might not have been paying attention before - scratching and light gouging is normal regardless of paste. Especially on those polished high pressure sinks. If you want to be confident in your complaint I'd take before and after pics mounting with another paste, and then again with ICD.
> 
> I'd just like to see some harder to question results in this thread.





In the past I used IC Diamond with confidence but don't anymore due to damage my block and die suffered from about a month of usage of IC Diamond.


The surface of block and die was like new before using IC Diamond.


photos from the problem that I had that I think was created by some chunky diamond crystals were in my  IC Diamond.



Pit in block





Mark on die with some micro scratches.







If you use IC Diamond I think it is a good idea to check for damage before it gets worse.  I feel lucky I checked mine after a month.  With more time more damage may have have occurred.


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (Feb 26, 2013)

SonDa5 said:


> The surface of block and die was like new before using IC Diamond.



I'm not saying you're lying. I'm saying we need more people and we need more pictures from before and after ICD use. Something clear cut so we can move on in confidence to determine the cause. And I think we need a strong foundation like that because I'm imagining getting to the bottom of this will be expensive and require a lot real world testing. So the motivation for ICD or someone independent to expend the effort has to be there.

Has no one sent in their tube for testing or tried the warm water and smearing it thing yet?


----------



## SonDa5 (Feb 27, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> I'm not saying you're lying. I'm saying we need more people and we need more pictures from before and after ICD use. Something clear cut so we can move on in confidence to determine the cause. And I think we need a strong foundation like that because I'm imagining getting to the bottom of this will be expensive and require a lot real world testing. So the motivation for ICD or someone independent to expend the effort has to be there.
> 
> Has no one sent in their tube for testing or tried the warm water and smearing it thing yet?





I'm just sharing my experience.  I have learned my lesson with IC Diamond.  I have a little IC Diamond left in a tube and I have been using it sparingly mixed with alcohol and spreading it thin being careful that it doesn't have any hard diamonds in it.   Spreading thin with alcohol and inspecting it I haven't had any problems with it yet. 


I like the performance of diamond material TIM and hope IC Diamond can fix the formula/production problem.


----------



## SonDa5 (Mar 13, 2013)

Tatty_One said:


> Despite no replies or responses from the company to various PM's to date sadly, it's been decided only fair to re-open, please keep things civil and constructive.



Have you heard anything from IC Diamond?


----------



## Tatty_One (Mar 13, 2013)

SonDa5 said:


> Have you heard anything from IC Diamond?



Negative, since I last updated and said that he visits almost daily but has not updated us on his tests on returned coolers he has either stopped coming (last visit 26th Feb) or he comes to look as a guest and does not log on, I can only imagine there is a good reason why he does not want to provide the evidence to support the products integrity that he went to great lengths earlier to defend..... I dunno, perhaps tests do take more than 2 months.

I will probably give him until the end of the month and then close the thread.


----------



## FreedomEclipse (Mar 13, 2013)

I for one hopes he comes back - even though I didnt take part in the test. But I get the feeling  that theres a lot of behind the scenes cloak and dagger going on with an over-proportioned serving of bashing that would make clubbing baby seals seem like mashing small balls of play-doh with a toy mallet.

All the community can ask is that the rep be upfront and honest about his findings when he comes back....*if* he comes back, and hopefully put all the negativity around this product to rest because this is public forum and even if the members effected dont go spreading negative feedback in other forums about IC Diamond, people will eventually google for reviews and find this thread as well about the possible shortcomings of using IC Diamond which shouldnt be happening.

Unless W1zzard decides to delete the thread or bury it somewhere in the forum where members or guests cant get to it then that would be a very sad day in the history of TPU. 


If you were wrong and your product did cause damage then at least be a man, be honest and apologise for it, not just for yourself but also for the company you are representing.


----------



## cadaveca (Mar 14, 2013)

Why would he need W1zzard's response to deal with "customers" he sent product to that are now having issues?

That's rather funny. It only takes a moment to post "still working on it, will update with more info", and that'd be more than enough.

People having issues is no big deal...shit happens. It's how you deal with the issues that matters, and that's really that's made everything else questionable. I think this could have been wrapped up and settled many months ago.


----------



## fullinfusion (Mar 14, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> Why would he need W1zzard's response to deal with "customers" he sent product to that are now having issues?
> 
> That's rather funny. It only takes a moment to post "still working on it, will update with more info", and that'd be more than enough.
> 
> People having issues is no big deal...shit happens. It's how you deal with the issues that matters, and that's really that's made everything else questionable. I think this could have been wrapped up and settled many months ago.


Duno, send him a pm and ask him for yourself. I know no answers


----------



## damric (Mar 29, 2013)

My experience was pretty much a failure.

I'm not sure if something is wrong with my tube, or if I'm just an idiot, but that shit was hard as clay and difficult to even squeeze out of the syringe, and that was only part of my problem. I tried several spreading methods, including dot method, line method, crack fill method, credit card method, and a combination of them all to no avail. The shit just doesn't spread. I could be a spoiled noob, but I'm used to much creamier compounds. I don't get it, I guess.


----------



## Kaynar (Mar 29, 2013)

damric said:


> My experience was pretty much a failure.
> 
> I'm not sure if something is wrong with my tube, or if I'm just an idiot, but that shit was hard as clay and difficult to even squeeze out of the syringe, and that was only part of my problem. I tried several spreading methods, including dot method, line method, crack fill method, credit card method, and a combination of them all to no avail. The shit just doesn't spread. I could be a spoiled noob, but I'm used to much creamier compounds. I don't get it, I guess.



Just heat it in hot water (would say water at around 40-50c) for about a minute, it will be much softer after. Pea size in middle of CPU is the only method that works easily.


----------



## damric (Apr 4, 2013)

Kaynar said:


> Just heat it in hot water (would say water at around 40-50c) for about a minute, it will be much softer after. Pea size in middle of CPU is the only method that works easily.



Thanks for the tip. I'll retry


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

I had an independent analysis done on the photos posted on the IC Diamond Giveaway of alleged damage caused by IC Diamond by the forum members

TRWOV
SonDa5
natr0n

On the following pages

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170121&page=20



http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=170121&page=12

The third Party report can be found here

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf


This was a particularly nasty bit of business doctoring photos to denigrate and slander our product and company.

This was most likely an orchestrated event and not an idle adolescent bid for attention and as such and due to the seriousness of the malicious intent  they should be banned permanently from the website. I have already identified some connections between a couple of the users and believe other deeper connections will follow soon on a number of forum members.

The company that did the analysis can be found here

http://www.fmsconsultation.com/Image.html


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

HAHAHAHAHAH your report shows that the pictures aren't taken with the cameras claimed by the customers (in the image details), why would they lie? Try suing someone then if you feel slandered!!!!!!! You can't win just denying everything.


----------



## t_ski (Jul 18, 2013)

Sounds like it was "Hey FMS - Here's a big check to do an "analysis" on these pics and say it wasn't our fault. Thanks."

Also, big lol here:



> 10) The DCT Map revealed no particularities of interest. Other than the label in lower right hand corner which reads *“Free image hosting by www.techpowerup.com”. *



So FMS did an analysis of the images that were downloaded from the site, most of which had to be reduced in size by some form of image editor in order to meet the site's posting guidelines.  Why did ICD not request the original images to do the study?


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

t_ski said:


> Sounds like it was "Hey FMS - Here's a big check to do an "analysis" on these pics and say it wasn't our fault. Thanks."
> 
> Also, big lol here:
> 
> ...



I read the report. It basically says that all they could do was confirm that the images posted were not the original image files. Our image host has size limits. Break out the tin hats!

also:



> 11) Testing for defective pixels requires the suspect camera to be available.





Sounds like wasted money, and improper testing. I don't think this would be something that would hold up in court.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> I read the report. It basically says that all they could do was confirm that the images posted were not the original image files. Our image host has size limits. Break out the tin hats!



So what exactly has ICD proved here? Right, the same nothing they have proved this whole time!


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> So what exactly has ICD proved here?



That the pictures were re-sized.


----------



## t_ski (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> 11) Testing for defective pixels requires the suspect camera to be available.



So they need us to send in the cameras we took the pictures with, too?  Kinda like the heatsinks that were sent in?


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

t_ski said:


> So they need us to send in the cameras we took the pictures with, too?  Kinda like the heatsinks that were sent in?



It looks like ICD is trying to say that the pictures were faked, but I see no evidence of this, and that report generally indicates the same. There are a couple of images were it seems the picture quality was adjusted, and they mentioned that this could cause artifacting to appear. Also, there are traces of photoshop (GASP!!!) in some image files.


I think all this proves is that ICD is paranoid.

I asked someone who got one of these samples about how it was now...he said it smells funny. I agree..something is DEFINITELY fishy here...and if you sent in a heatsink damaged by this, you can guarantee that it's been destroyed or that you'll enver get it back....so it can't be used in court against them, IMHO. I'd be looking at "Nefarious Device" lawsuits had  I received a sample. lol


----------



## TRWOV (Jul 18, 2013)

> 1) The file format data indicates that the digital image is a JPEG file and the digital camera used to create the image
> is a Canon PowerShot A2200. Pixel dimensions equal 600 x 800, these dimensions are not consistent with the
> resolution capabilities of the Canon PowerShotA2200 digital camera. For this reason img0922ns’s file format is not
> consistent with an authentic digital image created by this camera.
> ...



duh? Of course it was resized. The forum's recomended picture resolution is 800x600 (if your image is larger it resizes it automatically) and I always resize my pictures since imageshack only provides 5GB of storage.

I don't recall if I resized the original images or if I used imageshack's built in resizer but if it's the former I'll be happy to provide the original pictures as soon as I get home.

So you know now guys: resizing = doctoring. 

This is really disappointing Andrew. I was even standing up for you guys (as seen here and here) and now I'm part of a conspiracy to bring IC down :shadedshu


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

TRWOV said:


> duh? Of course it was resized. The forum's recomended picture resolution is 800x600 (if your image is larger it resizes it automatically).
> 
> I don't recall if I resized the original images or if I used imageshack's built in resizer but I'll be happy to provide the original pictures as soon as I get home.
> 
> So you know now guys: resizing = doctoring.



Seems like he's looking to show ways to disprove stuff in court, make "evidence" inadmissible. Except that tpu isn't court. XD Sounds like someone trying to cover their ass.


BTW, I am gathering samples of ICD. I'll hand it off to a friend working at the local university for forensics. Gonna get some of the "stinky" stuff too.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

BTW people, feel free to go to their Facebook page and post what you found. They are on that channel claiming this is all slander and that we as a group at TPU staged this just to put ICD in a bad light...

https://www.facebook.com/pages/IC-Diamond-by-Innovation-Cooling-LLC/178676248816485


----------



## Ahhzz (Jul 18, 2013)

Eh, if he'd spent any time at all checking out the users he's pointing fingers at (and several he ignored), he'd see that they've been here a pretty sizeable time, and have no obvious reason to "sabotage" his test bed. Now, I'll buy into possibly passing comments made by some, as they've been here only a couple of years. Not a good reason, but in light of the extreme paranoia, fine. But Pete, Dave and Ski? Really? What possible reason would they have for scuffing and pitting their personal items, and then blaming ICD? Not to mention, most of the original comments said NOTHING about requesting reimbursement or anything like it, just pointed to a peculiarity, and requested more info and someone to look into it.  Eh, Blow him off.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

I don't think ICD realizes that with that Facebook post, they are now liable for slander.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> HAHAHAHAHAH your report shows that the pictures aren't taken with the cameras claimed by the customers (in the image details), why would they lie? Try suing someone then if you feel slandered!!!!!!! You can't win just denying everything.



Does not matter what the users say - Fact: each Picture contains an EXIF file about the camera. It can contain GPS Data as to where the picture was taken, model of camera, and what software was used to edit the picture plus a lot more information.

EXIF data has a long history of acceptable evidence in numerous court cases.


----------



## Random Murderer (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> BTW, I am gathering samples of ICD. I'll hand it off to a friend working at the local university for forensics. Gonna get some of the "stinky" stuff too.



You can have my tube. I peeled the label off to check for particles, but that's it. It does have a fishy smell to it, though.

For the rep to come in here and blame us for "doctoring photos to denigrate and slander" is ridiculous and upsetting.

Last time I repasted, I cleaned off all the ICD and went back to the old standby: AC MX-2.
I will never use ICD again.



IC Diamond said:


> Does not matter what the users say - Fact: each Picture contains an EXIF file about the camera. It can contain GPS Data as to where the picture was taken, model of camera, and what software was used to edit the picture plus a lot more information.
> 
> EXIF data has a long history of acceptable evidence in numerous court cases.



But it's only relevant when checking the ORIGINAL photo, not a resized image.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> EXIF data has a long history of acceptable evidence in numerous court cases.




Sure. But when these guys show up in court with their cameras and the original pictures and sue you for slander, your ass is toast. Understand that you've simply "set the bar" to disprove your "proof", and prove that your Facebook posting is slanderous.

You should have not posted that public, and saved it for court, as how to disprove that this pictures have been "doctored" is clearly listed in the "report". You might want to hire a lawyer...the court case, appeals and all, each case by individuals so you have to handle them one by one in each individual's state, will ruin you.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jul 18, 2013)

Take a gander at that slander


----------



## KainXS (Jul 18, 2013)

I can't believe they came back and did something like this, its like if you don't like our product then obviously you have a problem, many of us did have issues but they were minor issues like the fishy smell and the blemishing but its just sweeping all of that under the rug and saying nope, never happened cause those guys are out to get us  T.T.

Then to come onto a forum and demand that certain people be banned without even contacting the moderators or admins is just unprofessional, alot of unprofessional things have been done and its sad.

I would be happy to send you my old tubes as well cadaveca, just say where to send it.


----------



## TRWOV (Jul 18, 2013)

Andrew, I'll be happy to provide whatever uncompressed pictures I might still have.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

TRWOV said:


> Andrew, I'll be happy to provide whatever uncompressed pictures I might still have.



IN court, I hope.XD


Realize he said up above you'll full of it, and should be banned.



IC Diamond said:


> due to the seriousness of the malicious intent they should be banned permanently from the website




Yet you're still offering to help him. You, my friend, much respect, much respect.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

Pretty sure you all have my address over there, I will sit by my door and wait for the process server to deliver my subpoena.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> I don't think ICD realizes that with that Facebook post, they are now liable for slander.



Threats are hollow, evidence is clear - I recently sued 8 companies in 5 years all settled in my favour, it was quite lucrative. I'll have to check and see what the options are in CA.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Threats are hollow, evidence is clear - I recently sued 8 companies in 5 years all settled in my favour, it was quite lucrative. I'll have to check and see what the options are in CA.



Oh so making good paste isn't how you make money, it is suing others that makes your house payments, got it!


----------



## Kreij (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> This was most likely an orchestrated event and not an idle adolescent bid for attention and as such and due to the seriousness of the malicious intent they should be banned permanently from the website. I have already identified some connections between a couple of the users and believe other deeper connections will follow soon on a number of forum members.



I've not been part of this discussion, nor have I used your product so I cannot comment either way on its effectiveness nor any problems that it may present.

I do have a question though, given that there is absolutely no monetary, nor other type of compensation, gain for the people who have stated they have had problems with your product, why would they "conspire" to target your company? That does not make a while lot of sense.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Threats are hollow, evidence is clear - I recently sued 8 companies in 5 years all settled in my favour, it was quite lucrative. I'll have to check and see what the options are in CA.



I just find it interesting how you include TPU's name in your postings, but then only focus on the members, and leave the staff's claims out of it.

Picking your fights, I see.

Anyway, all the power to ya, here in Canada, slander is a serious thing, but you haven't slandered me, so I am just enjoying the drama I have no part of. In fact, I'm a bit jealous, because I'd love to take you to court and shake your hand in person. 


BTW, the local Scouting Commissioner is my wife. We have numerous members of our local community that will stand up to re-iterate just how legit I like to have things. As a public figure that other parents trust in educating their kids on how to be prepared for survival and maintaining class and honesty, I'm sure we'd have fun together. Scout's Honor!


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

Kreij said:


> I've not been part of this discussion, nor have I used your product so I cannot comment either way on its effectiveness nor any problems that it may present.
> 
> I do have a question though, given that there is absolutely no monetary, nor other type of compensation, gain for the people who have stated they have had problems with your product, why would they "conspire" to target your company? That does not make a while lot of sense.



I know, it's not like the community as a whole is in the TIM manufacturing business or are receiving kickbacks from other thermal paste companies. 


Reminds me I need to check my mailbox for a check from Vaseline, not only does it keep your lips from being chapped it can help the cooling process of certain parts of pcs.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

Kreij said:


> I do have a question though, given that there is absolutely no monetary, nor other type of compensation, gain for the people who have stated they have had problems with your product, why would they "conspire" to target your company? That does not make a while lot of sense.



Great question, I do not know if they were compensated or not, do you? Look at the ELA and the DCT and EXIF data and then ask them  - your speculation is as good as anybody's


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Great question, I do not know if they were compensated or not, do you? Look at the ELA and the DCT and EXIF data and then ask them  - your speculation is as good as anybody's



You are the only one in this thread speculating. There were no kickbacks! You asked us to report our findings, got butthurt at the results, spent a shit ton of money to prove nothing, lost coolers that would prove you are at fault, now say we all lied just to give ICD a bad name? 

All of this is on you and your company. The fact that you say that we had a conspiracy to slander you is so laughable I am glad my dealings with your lies and smoke and mirrors is over...'nuff said.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> your speculation is as good as anybody's



But you're the only one who stands to gain or lose anything here. Well, the drama is fun, I guess, and the others gains some entertainment. Good show, sir, good show. I do hope you understand that for many, you are simply digging your own hole. I wonder how many of the 38 people in this thread right now would side with you....sounds like something that might deserve a poll.!


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond makes a terrible product. I would advise everyone reading this to not purchase anything they manufacture and to remove any product that you may have currently in your rig. What's more, they also treat their customers poorly so forget about any service if you take issue with what you bought.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

TRWOV said:


> Andrew, I'll be happy to provide whatever uncompressed pictures I might still have.



that's good, if you have the raw images still available we can make arrangement for third party independent analysis, only way to prove they are not manipulated.


----------



## brandonwh64 (Jul 18, 2013)

Who woke up and said LETS FUCK IC Diamond!!! I sure didn't because until this thread was posted I never knew who you were. You came to this forum wanting feedback on your product and thats what you got BUT when it did not swing your way you demanded proof which was provided. Once proof was presented you threw up the defense flag and claimed all proof was bogus. People even sent you the evidence to you directly which magically "vanished".

Honestly you got what you came for on a PUBLIC forum.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

EXIF data can be modified simply using Windows 7(and perhaps 8) built in tools. Everything from Camera model, date taken etc etc can be changed.

EDIT: True, IC Diamond cooled my components just like any other TIM. But it damaged the IHS of my CPU(scratches), GPU die(scratches), laptop CPU die(scratches) and the laptop chipset(scratches again). :/


----------



## d1nky (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Threats are hollow, evidence is clear - I recently sued 8 companies in 5 years all settled in my favour, it was quite lucrative. I'll have to check and see what the options are in CA



Look how many people are viewing this thread already. 

that quote is the pincher for me.


----------



## erocker (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> that's good, if you have the raw images still available we can make arrangement for third party independent analysis, only way to prove they are not manipulated.



You're not much of a people person are you? 

Protip. Don't treat customers like shit, and especially don't blame them with some sort of conspiracy theory that they are to blame and they're trying to make your company look bad with no basis for doing so. If you are the owner of this company I would suggest that you hire a very good customer service rep. immediately. 

If you are the customer service rep., may I have the phone number to your boss? 

Your company's behavior is atrocious and you're not helping yourselves whatsoever by making these ridiculous claims that even though they aren't pointed at myself, I find them highly insulting as a business owner myself that a company with CS such as this can even stay in business.

This could of been handled much much better and if it was I wouldn't have to not recommend this product on any forum, contest, event or otherwise I participate in. 

I actually used your product and thought it worked quite well! Never again.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

ICD asked for the members to be banned..I say we ban ICD.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> EXIF data can be modified simply using Windows 7(and perhaps 8) built in tools. Everything from Camera model, date taken etc etc can be changed.



Of course it can -but the data was taken from the pictures posted on then forum which is out of my hands and under control of the people that generated them. Third party professional analysis was performed here which adheres to a chain of custody

http://www.fmsconsultation.com/Image.html



> Our commitment to results
> Every matter we consult on is treated as though it will go to trial from the beginning. This means we maintain chain of custody, we document every step in our process, we follow SWGIT and SWGDE guidelines, we mitigate biases in our analysis, and we prepare our reports in a way that can be understood by the layman.
> 
> Our experience
> We have consulted image enhancement and image authentication matters for both private and judicial reasons in the United States and abroad. We have provided expert testimony and forensic image reports.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

So get to the suing already and move along. There is no point in what you posted since this thread died down a long time ago.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

You know if he would just come in and conduct himself with honesty and integrity, this thread could be great for his company and TPU. But no we get a douche thats makes the thread not even fit for GN.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

hello, could you please tell me if the diamond dust in your product comes from blood diamonds?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

brandonwh64 said:


> You should have known that our forums require the picture to be resized and after cruising through this thread, I did not see were you asked for raw images.



because he didn't, and even if he did, they would magically get lost like my cooler did


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> hello, could you please tell me if the diamond dust in your product comes from blood diamonds?



If so how did you get them from the Blood Dragons?

Sorry I couldn't help it.     Back on topic


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

ThE_MaD_ShOt said:


> If so how did you get them from the Blood Dragons?
> 
> Sorry I couldn't help it.     Back on topic



I am being serious.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_diamond


----------



## brandonwh64 (Jul 18, 2013)

LOL someone deleted my post! HAHAHA


----------



## KainXS (Jul 18, 2013)

its the frozen tears of everyone who has ever tested this crap and had it scratch up their dies and IHS's


----------



## erocker (Jul 18, 2013)

brandonwh64 said:


> LOL someone deleted my post! HAHAHA



Yes, you did.


----------



## brandonwh64 (Jul 18, 2013)

erocker said:


> Yes, you did.



How.......? I guess my ADD kicked in and clicked the wrong thing. Anyway yea NO RAW PICTURES were requested until now...


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

Hi guys, please call IC Diamond at 203 732 5312 and launch a complaint against their online rep. I am tired of feeling harassed.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

Do we have the guys name?



Maybe they will make it right and send everyone here a free tube of paste.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> Hi guys, please call IC Diamond at 203 732 5312 and launch a complaint against their online rep. I am tired of feeling harassed.



I have a strong feeling you are going to be complaining to this IC Diamond rep

@ TMS, his name is Andrew....http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2693982&postcount=51


----------



## adulaamin (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> Hi guys, please call IC Diamond at 203 732 5312 and launch a complaint against their online rep. I am tired of feeling harassed.



He's the CEO of the company, not an online rep. 



stinger608 said:


> Below you will see the quoted message from *Andrew, the CEO for Innovation Cooling*, on how to obtain your free tube of IC Diamond 24. *Andrew, by the way is a great person to talk to* and will be joining in on this thread very soon.
> 
> I will be contacting Andrew as soon as I have this posted in order for him to join in on the fun!
> 
> Stinger608





IC Diamond said:


> Thanks stinger608 for your efforts, Much appreciated.
> 
> First batch mailing will go out tomorrow. Just to note we will mail worldwide on this  if you met the other qualifications 50 posts and/or 3 months membership
> 
> ...



As it turns out, he's not a great person to talk to after all. 

Edit: Sneeky beat me to it...


----------



## Random Murderer (Jul 18, 2013)

ThE_MaD_ShOt said:


> Maybe they will make it right and send everyone here a free tube of paste.



If they do, it had better not be IC diamond, lol!


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

I think this discussion is long over. We all are against only one person here. Many against one - The former always wins.


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 18, 2013)

ThE_MaD_ShOt said:


> Do we have the guys name?



He's Andrew Lemont, and apparently he's not just a rep but the CEO... 

http://www.linkedin.com/pub/andrew-lemont/69/248/7a5


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

Black Panther said:


> He's Andrew Lemont, and apparently he's not just a rep but the CEO...
> 
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/andrew-lemont/69/248/7a5



have you seen the building that his company is based out of? yikes! 

https://maps.google.com/maps?oe=utf...=us&ei=qjjoUZiCBNO64APJz4GgBQ&ved=0CC0Q8gEwAA

also, looks like another company may be based out of that location. seems like Andrew does not want anyone to know where he does his business. i smell blood diamonds.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

yes when I sent my cooler it went to some aeronautics company with ICD tagged in at the end of the address.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> yes when I sent my cooler it went to some aeronautics company with ICD tagged in at the end of the address.



Lemont Aircraft Corp?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> Lemont Aircraft Corp?



Not positive at this point, I would have to dig through my files to find the Fed Ex tag.


----------



## d1nky (Jul 18, 2013)

i smell a fish......... trawler/troller LOL


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

here is some more information if you feel the need to contact Andrew directly.

http://whois.net/whois/innovationcooling.com


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> Lemont Aircraft Corp?



Lemont Aircraft...Andrew Lemont...

I see.


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> Lemont Aircraft Corp?



He's also the vice-president of that corporation http://opencorporates.com/companies/us_ct/0280276


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf

Must have hit a nerve attacking the messenger because you do not like the message - read the report and we can debate the  ELA and DCT analysis on local area manipulation.

I gave TRWOV the contact info BTW on where to send his raw images for analysis


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

holy sh!t. looks like he sued cooler master AND best buy for patent infringement...

http://www.patexia.com/lawsuits/Lemont-Aircraft-Corp-v-Cooler-Master-USA-Inc-et-al-id-23268


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

Black Panther said:


> He's Andrew Lemont, and apparently he's not just a rep but the CEO...
> 
> http://www.linkedin.com/pub/andrew-lemont/69/248/7a5



I guess calling would be a moot point as it would fall on deaf ears.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> and we can debate the ELA and DCT analysis on local area manipulation.



Why would you want to do that?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> 
> Must have hit a nerve attacking the messenger because you do not like the message - read the report and we can debate the  ELA and DCT analysis on local area manipulation.
> 
> I gave TRWOV the contact info BTW on where to send his raw images for analysis



Your report and analysis is a fraud. Your findings show that the images aren't even from the cameras in the details.....come on, we were so bored we took images and doctored up all of the details, including the camera maker just to get over on you? For no other reason than to slam your product?

   


This thread needs deleted and this rep/CEO should be banished from TPU based on stupidity alone!


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> This thread needs deleted and this rep/CEO should be banished from TPU based on stupidity alone!



But that'd be less entertaining. I wanna see this play out.


 Please Mr wise moderator, no closing of threads. This old goat requests your leniency! 


The whole idea that image analysis proves anything...wow...he's already stated that these three users are linked, and he has proof...let's see that proof.

 Idunno why he involved TPU in this, other than that the thread is here, but let's see that proof of his that there is some conspiracy, beyond a doubt...he's even indicated they were paid to do this....


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> But that'd be less entertaining. I wanna see this play out.



I want to know why they threw away my cooler, since it was signed for and shown to arrive at the airplane toilet manufacturers. Some things will just never get a real answer!

@ dave, we all post at TPU, therefore we are linked together, it is obvious!


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

Guys, this is VERY telling about Andrew and his business practices. Lemont Aircraft Corp is an Intellectual Property firm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Abort , abort!! This guy makes profit from suing, not from actually manufacturing anything!!


----------



## Ahhzz (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> holy sh!t. looks like he sued cooler master AND best buy for patent infringement...
> 
> http://www.patexia.com/lawsuits/Lemont-Aircraft-Corp-v-Cooler-Master-USA-Inc-et-al-id-23268



and silverstone and GBT  . wow... he's a litigious one, ain't he?


----------



## v12dock (Jul 18, 2013)

Why go this far to defend a flawed product? Why not just apologies for the incident pay for the $50 damages and use the data to improve your product. You are making you and your company look bad. I almost want to buy some and try and scratch some mirrored surfaces.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> Guys, this is VERY telling about Andrew and his business practices. Lemont Aircraft Corp is an Intellectual Property firm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Abort , abort!! This guy makes profit from suing, not from actually manufacturing anything!!



So this is just like Rambus where you sue for income rather than actually working?


----------



## Ahhzz (Jul 18, 2013)

hmm... course, it looks like at least one was just dismissed...
"ORDER granting [35] Stipulation of Dismissal filed by BestBuy.com LLC, Cooler Master USA 
Inc, Best Buy Stores L.P., Lemont Aircraft Corp. Signed by Clerk on 6/7/2010."


----------



## KainXS (Jul 18, 2013)

sadly yes, seems like the scum might have been setting this up from the beginning


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

better steer clear from doing any business with this guy. spread the word to other forums you visit to not purchase ic diamond compound.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

Isn't it amazing what happens when educated people dig into something?


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

KainXS said:


> sadly yes, seems like the scum might have been setting this up from the beginning



Well, I just finished hacking his computers and found proof he set these users up and purposely sent bad samples to users with issues. I am handing this data over to forensics experts locally and will submit a PDF with the data showing his scams, forget suing him like I normally would, public exposure is more fun, and entertaining!!!


----------



## v12dock (Jul 18, 2013)

http://www.boliven.com/legal_proceeding/3:07-cv-00875-JCH - Another case but was dismissed by Lemont Aircraft Corp 

"19 ORDER re 18 Notice of Voluntary Dismissal filed by Lemont Aircraft Corp. SO ORDERED by Judge Janet C. Hall on 11/9/2007. (Sanders, C.) (Entered: 11/14/2007)"


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> Well, I just finished hacking his computers and found proof he set these users up and purposely sent bad samples to users with issues. I am handing this data over to forensics experts locally and will submit a PDF with the data showing his scams!



BWAHAHahahahaha...


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Isn't it amazing what happens when educated people dig into something?



i would say that Andy has had a bad day. He has been exposed as an IP scum sucker who hates his customers and makes a questionable product. He even ADMITS that earning revenue through litigation is beneficial to him!!

see Andy, this is what happens when you take personal business matters public. you will be eventually be exposed. we know who you are, where you do business, and how you earn a living.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> Your report and analysis is a fraud. Your findings show that the images aren't even from the cameras in the details.....come on, we were so bored we took images and doctored up all of the details, including the camera maker just to get over on you? For no other reason than to slam your product?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Third party independent analysis - data does not lie

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> data does not lie



But you do. Or rather, you interpret data in a way that could be construed as such.




All you proved is that the posted images are not the original images. Shock and horror.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

Ahhzz said:


> hmm... course, it looks like at least one was just dismissed...
> "ORDER granting [35] Stipulation of Dismissal filed by BestBuy.com LLC, Cooler Master USA
> Inc, Best Buy Stores L.P., Lemont Aircraft Corp. Signed by Clerk on 6/7/2010."



Dismissial was because we settled out of court - you missed Apple btw


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Third party independent analysis - data does not lie
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf



Nope it does not, and this shows the pictures simply resized to meet forum requirements. Dipshit


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jul 18, 2013)

Having used IC Diamond paste I had no problems however seeing the childish antics of a Company CEO I will forgo using the product on my personal hardware and in all future customers PCs. Have a good day and thanks for the sample.


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 18, 2013)

File extensions allowed: gif, jpg, png, *maximum size: 2 MB*

One _has to_ resize the photos in order to upload them on these forums.
Resizing doesn't mean they were photoshopped to show false information as you are implying.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

ThE_MaD_ShOt said:


> Nope it does not, and this shows the pictures simply resized to meet forum requirements. Dipshit




Read he DCT and ELA analysis

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf


----------



## erocker (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Third party independent analysis - data does not lie
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf



You're right. Unfortunately the data isn't relevant to begin with.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Third party independent analysis - data does not lie
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf



Constantly repeating a link does nothing. So you paid some fly by night company to produce results that say the images don't even come from the cameras we took them on. Then to say there is manipulation to them and is why our images are faked is total BS. Not everyone has a photo booth at their house, but that does not mean they want to provide some nasty dark image. So by adding some brightness to the image, you now consider them void. Funny thing is that when I gave you an image, you were marking what was obviously dust in one image, and in the second image doctored by yourself in this thread, those same dust markers weren't used.

The only thing you have proved today is that you are butthurt, sell a crap product you wont stand behind, you doctor results to fit your needs, and you are making damn sure through your lack of people skills that I highly doubt anyone who may have liked ICD7 would continue to use it after this circus you have presented here at TPU!

Enjoy your day Andrew, had you not manipulated evidence and straight out lied to me and the members of TPU in the past, I might actually have backed your findings, but again, nothing you have shown proves squat!


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Read he DCT and ELA analysis
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf



learn how to post a link. Let me show you how(since you posted a bunch of broken links):

REPORT HERE


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

hey andy, don't you have somebody to go sue? slow day?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

Black Panther said:


> File extensions allowed: gif, jpg, png, *maximum size: 2 MB*
> 
> One _has to_ resize the photos in order to upload them on these forums.
> Resizing doesn't mean they were photoshopped to show false information as you are implying.



Dct, ELA show areas of local manipulation Combined with EXIF makes a strong case


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Dct, ELA show areas of local manipulation Combined with EXIF makes a strong case



A case of what, exactly? Like, I fail to grasp what you are trying to say here. Can you please spell it out, exactly, for me?


----------



## Ahhzz (Jul 18, 2013)

Jackassery combined with litigious assholery makes a strong ass.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Dct, ELA show areas of local manipulation Combined with EXIF makes a strong case



Just like when you tried manipulating dust as damages?


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> A case of what, exactly?



nothing. the report that he paid for does nothing but prove he has no idea what he is talking about.


----------



## Ahhzz (Jul 18, 2013)

So. whaddya think guys? Would someone really go to the extent of setting up somewhere sending out samples, in order to try to get a bunch of tech guys to speak poorly about a poor product, just to get someone to go overboard, in order to try to sue? Or is that a little convoluted, even for an IP company?


Edit:

hmmm "Current Activity: Modifying Post"  good thing our mods have such strong archive skills


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

seems like andrew has a huge chip on his shoulder about life, we are just the next page in his tornado of madness!


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> seems like andrew has a huge ship on his shoulder about life, we are just the next page in his tornado of madness!



That's fine. I purposely go out of my way to keep my integrity intact, so... I'm all for the bit of drama...it generates more traffic.


Thanks, Andrew!


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

I don't know why anyone would take up issues on a public forum like TPU. Really it points to desperation. Andy, take responsibility for your actions and make amends. Recognize that some people who used your product had real problems. Then apologize to this community and then go on your merry way.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

Their own photo says it all.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...51402.178676248816485&type=1&relevant_count=4

I can clearly see dots....

Tell them to have a meet with me. I still have some IC Diamond left. I will SHOW THEM in a new chipset whether it damages them or not!

That thing have damaged my CPU IHS, my GPU die and all are scratches from diamond dust or whatever that s**t is.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

do we know if IC Diamond paste is using real diamonds or synthetic?

i would also like to point out that diamond dust is EXTREMELY USEFUL for polishing and or lapping metal. use extreme caution!

edit: we also need to know the abrasiveness of said dust. it is very possible Andy cheaped out on some batches and used the less fine grained material. this would explain why some users saw damage and others did not.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

I also wonder why there isn't any cpu, hsf, or chipset photos on IC's FB page showing the surfaces after extended use of there paste.


Also if you can show absolute proof these guy conspired against you and your company I will leave this thread. It's getting to be recess time here at the "home" anyway. We get a snack if we are good.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

there could be a real lawsuit on our hands here if we can prove Andy purposefully cheaped out on his diamond dust causing damage to customers products.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

Another thing, we all know Diamond is a bad conductor of heat! How come it is made of REAL DIAMOND? 
Physics experts needed.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf

Every thing but the kitchen sink perhaps you guys should read up on photo forensics then you could Talk intelligently about the subject


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> Another thing, we all know Diamond is a bad conductor of heat! How come it is made of REAL DIAMOND?
> Physics experts needed.



it is possible that the diamond dust is used to rough up the surface of the chip so that the paste makes the best contact possible. people could be unwittingly damaging there stuff with this product!


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> 
> Every thing but the kitchen sink perhaps you guys should read up on photo forensics then you could Talk intelligently about the subject



Or you could admit to the issues and not be such a shyster


----------



## Kreij (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> Another thing, we all know Diamond is a bad conductor of heat!



Back to science class for you. Diamond is a very good heat conductor.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

OMG IC how many more times are you going to post the same link forfucksake?


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

diamond dust is used AS AN ABRASIVE. if you put diamond dust in your paste you are literally putting a metal abrasive in your paste that is making very very tight contact with the cpu.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> 
> Every thing but the kitchen sink perhaps you guys should read up on photo forensics then you could Talk intelligently about the subject



I asked you some intelligent questions, but you're ignoring me. I'm quite curious what you mean by posting this, and what you are after, and what YOU THINK the data present implies, and what those implications mean.


I mean, clearly, many posters here don't understand what you are saying here, so please, can you explain this a bit more explicitly? Seriously, I'm quite curious what you are thinking here. I didn't get a sample from you( yourefused to send me samples directly until I bitched about it excessively), so I have absolutely nothing to gain or lose here, except to align my curiousity with your thoughts.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf

https://sites.google.com/site/elsamuko/forensics/ela


----------



## Strontium_dog (Jul 18, 2013)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohs_scale_of_mineral_hardness


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf
> 
> https://sites.google.com/site/elsamuko/forensics/ela



I ask YOU to explain, not post some documents that I might not understand. Can you interpret them for me, please?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> I asked you some intelligent questions, but you're ignoring me. I'm quite curious what you mean by posting this, and what you are after, and what YOU THINK the data present implies, and what those implications mean.
> 
> 
> I mean, clearly, many posters here don't understand what you are saying here, so please, can you explain this a bit more explicitly? Seriously, I'm quite curious what you are thinking here. I didn't get a sample from you( yourefused to send me samples directly until I bitched about it excessively), so I have absolutely nothing to gain or lose here, except to align my curiousity with your thoughts.





IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf
> 
> https://sites.google.com/site/elsamuko/forensics/ela



He is simply stating we faked every last one of our images!


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> 
> Every thing but the kitchen sink perhaps you guys should read up on photo forensics then you could Talk intelligently about the subject



I DON'T understand that IF YOUR PRODUCT DIDN'T CAUSE DAMAGE TO US CUSTOMER'S products, WHY ARE WE ALL COMPLAINING? Its not a situation like only 5 people have damaged CPUs, GPUs, coolers etc.. MAJORITY of the users had their PRODUCT DAMAGED. I think you are MENTALLY SICK- Schizophrenia??

Your attitude is really DISGUSTING. 

And as for the foul smell, it is there. I still have it applied in my laptop CPU die. Come to my home with your paid and BIASED FORENSIC EXPERT and I will show him LIVE!


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

That is all we are asking IC, tell us what we are missing.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> He is simply stating we faked every last one of our images!



Oh? That's not how I interpret the data. I've got a friend sitting here next to me that actually does this sort of thing for a living, he's rather confused as well, since there is no evidence that all damage shown in the images has evidence of manipulation, only a couple images do, and not everywhere that the damage is. At most, he might prove some images have added info in them, others are simply resized.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

just so you know, Andrew, in a couple of days when someone does a google search for IC Diamond this thread will be on the first page of google hits. you have done yourself a serious disservice and have cost your company. i hope you will learn your lesson.

edit: oh hell, nevermind! it already is!


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

I think we should all report against this company and especially this person!


----------



## seronx (Jul 18, 2013)

Did you guys use the hot water trick?


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

seronx said:


> Did you guys use the hot water trick?



That would introduce contaminants. I do not recommend.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

why would you put the most abrasive material that exists on your cpu????


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

The resaved image was digitally modified: books were copied and a toy dinosaur was added. ELA clearly shows the modified areas as having higher ELA values.

So compare result against Report  ELA and DCT 

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

seronx said:


> Did you guys use the hot water trick?



I didn't. 

Also I have 2 motherboards of my friends which still has ICD applied.

Time for me to post a video and show it to the world.


----------



## seronx (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> That would introduce contaminants. I do not recommend.


It is recommended by all diamond-based thermal paste manufacturers.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> I didn't.
> 
> Also I have 2 motherboards of my friends which still has ICD applied.
> 
> Time for me to post a video and show it to the world.



Please do post the vid. Oh wait you may be accused of doctoring it.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited.jpghttp://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited-ela.png
> 
> The resaved image was digitally modified: books were copied and a toy dinosaur was added. ELA clearly shows the modified areas as having higher ELA values.
> 
> ...



omg how many times do we have to go over this... TPU resizes and compresses images!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited.jpghttp://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited-ela.png
> 
> The resaved image was digitally modified: books were copied and a toy dinosaur was added. ELA clearly shows the modified areas as having higher ELA values.
> 
> ...



Omg posted same link again. I will be glad when the nurse makes her rounds and gives me my happy pills.

Just give us undoubtable proof the images where doctored to make you/your company look bad. We want your proof. No a link to some report by a questionable company that simply states the photos have been resized.


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

Wow this thread is still going.
Though I took the time to read your interesting report. And I am amused. You're using the most amusing tactics to disprove these claims.
Let me explain this simply.
You are claiming the image is edited, a filthy lie, and holds no true evidence of anything because:
It was taken on a camera that takes pictures in a different resolution
The picture was saved as a JPG (so its, you know, universally accepted by everything and everyone, and able to BE UPLOADED) so its been re-compressed
By recompressing the image (TO MAKE IT APPLEING UNIVERSAL) it COULD HAVE masked any photoshopping done to the image?

Man, you are the dumbest apple I have ever encountered. You're not even providing full proof counter evidence, you're just trying to smear the evidence you have been provided.
You should take a lesson or two from all the reps we have on here at TPU, learn to be like them.
I hope you get burned good for this.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

seronx said:


> It is recommended by all diamond-based thermal paste manufacturers.



Which is stupid, since water quality and composition varies form city to city, nevermind from country to country. Things like chlorine and fluoride may very well foul the paste.



And on the image stuff, I bet the images that show NO PROBLEMS show the same sort of data. Actually, we looked at his pics HE posted on Facebook for marketing, and they show similar data as well...so he's merely highlighted that he has faked his own pictures, as well.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

Let us all email him the images. :/ 
Also I will make videos. I will take legal support. I will call the police to supervise. I will tell them the entire story. I will convince the police to take the videos.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

it is very sad that tpu members are being harassed by the guy who runs the company.


----------



## SonDa5 (Jul 18, 2013)

Pit in block





From the long winded report.



> Consistent with Samsung SGHT98




That would be my phone camera that I took the photo with. 


From the report:



> 1) The file format data indicates that the digital image is a JPEG file and the digital camera used to create the image
> is a Samsung SGH-T989 digital camera. Pixel dimensions equal 1326 x 1260, these dimensions are not consistent
> with the resolution capabilities of the Samsung SGH-T989 digital camera. For this reason img0925G’s file format is
> not consistent with an authentic digital image created by this camera.










If you look at the reflection off of the die you can see I am shooting the photo with my  Samsung SGH-T989 through a *magnified* circular light.  Similar to this one: http://www.lumiram.com/magnifying-lamps/112-comfort-view-round-magnifying-lamp.html


Ever hear of magnification in lenses?  

The report is incomplete and inaccurate.


IC Diamond apologize and work on a fix for your TIM if possible.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> omg how many times do we have to go over this... TPU resizes and compresses images!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Yes, but does not show areas of local manipulation - study up on it


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> I had an independent analysis done on the photos posted on the IC Diamond Giveaway of alleged damage caused by IC Diamond by the forum members
> 
> TRWOV
> SonDa5
> ...



i find this post very threatening.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited.jpghttp://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited-ela.png
> 
> The resaved image was digitally modified: books were copied and a toy dinosaur was added. ELA clearly shows the modified areas as having higher ELA values.
> 
> ...



So what you mean to say is that we deliberately damaged our products bought from hard earned money? Or we made the dents and scratched deliberately?

WHAT THE FU*K IS YOUR POINT????


----------



## SonDa5 (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> i find this post very threatening.




I can understand the defensive nature of this report but if you read it carefully it does provide data that could also show that the photos are valid.  In the case of the photo of my damage block the report did correctly identify my Samsung Galaxy S2 to be the device that took the photo. 


I am not threatened at all.  All this report does is defend their product to deter customers from believing the "false" claims of the problems that we truly did experience.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Yes, but does not show areas of local manipulation - study up on it



you do understand that the forensic findings simply point out that the images were manipulated with compression software, correct?


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> you do understand that the forensic findings simply point out that the images were manipulated with compression software, correct?



Precisely. That and that the 'techpowerup' watermark was 'manipulated' into the image.

Beneath all photos in the linked report it is said: 



> Copy/Paste detection reveals no areas of suspect pixels.
> The DCT Map revealed no particularities of interest. Other than the label in lower right hand corner which reads “Free image hosting by www.techpowerup.com”.









It is obvious that the resolution of the uploaded photos won't match those of the camera with which they were taken. The photos needed to be reduced to below 2MB to be uploaded here. Even my cellphone takes larger pictures than that...

If you really wanted to do a good job you should have asked for the original photos (in fact TRWOV told you he's ready to supply them to you). Even the forensics company you employed told you so:



> FMS informed LAC that the original digital image files would yield the most relevant results, however, the original digital image files are not available and the next best evidence was used from the provided links.



Yet instead of asking for them you told them that the original digital images are not available? And you're interpreting inconclusive tests due to this fault as being voluntary manipulation... :shadedshu Duh...


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

oh andy, did you not read the report you paid good money for?


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> http://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited.jpghttp://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited-ela.png
> 
> The resaved image was digitally modified: books were copied and a toy dinosaur was added. ELA clearly shows the modified areas as having higher ELA values.
> 
> ...





IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf
> 
> https://sites.google.com/site/elsamuko/forensics/ela





IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> 
> Every thing but the kitchen sink perhaps you guys should read up on photo forensics then you could Talk intelligently about the subject





IC Diamond said:


> Yes, but does not show areas of local manipulation - study up on it



DIDIDIDIDIDIDIDIDI DA DA DA DIDIDIDIDIDIDIDIDI DA DA DA DA DA DA
 I CANTZ HEAR YOUZ!!!!


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

RCoon said:


> Wow this thread is still going.
> Though I took the time to read your interesting report. And I am amused. You're using the most amusing tactics to disprove these claims.
> Let me explain this simply.
> You are claiming the image is edited, a filthy lie, and holds no true evidence of anything because:
> ...



 Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed

http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

Black Panther said:


> Yet instead of asking for them you told them that the original digital images are not available? And you're interpreting inconclusive tests due to this fault as being voluntary manipulation... :shadedshu Duh...



Guilty until proven innocent, its the americanIC Diamond way



IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf



Ok, so its designed to find areas of manipulation on an image that has been MULTIPLY COMPRESSED. Those images have been compressed ONCE. And your sucky software cant find any full proof evidence of manipulation.
Your own report proves you wrong.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Yes, but does not show areas of local manipulation - study up on it



Was this done to all pictures submitted? NO 
Is there a likely reason this was done to the very few? probably (to highlight affected area)
Was it done to hurt you or your company? NO
Are these the raw images straight from the cameras in question? Nope


But thank-you for that explanation. We may be heading down a good road now. Just stop at you explanation and leave the quip out and you maybe taking the first steps at redeeming yourself. I can sorta understand you a tad bit. You are going by what was told to you by the forensic people.  Now let the people who took the pictures explain what they did to them. Also it does say in the report that the raw images would be best to have. Did you ask for those at anytime during the examination of evidence? Not that I can tell. Maybe you should have.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

Also I see no images of my Noctua in your testing....So you just pick the ones you think are suspect? Funny thing is, out of all the people to post an image, mine is likely the least manipulated since I did take the image under photo booth lighting, but I guess that would skew the invalid results you produced anyways, so it likely wouldn't help much anyways


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf



the area of 'manipulation' that the report is referring to is NO WHERE near the damage marks in the photos. good lord, how many times do we have to explain it to you.


----------



## Random Murderer (Jul 18, 2013)

Wow. This thread has made my day.
Andrew, grow the hell up. Treat your customers and voluntary testers better. Conduct yourself as the head of a company should, even if that company's business model is that of a spineless douche who's sole method of making money is by suing reputable businesses.
And with that, I'm out. I'm just going to sit back and watch the fireworks.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

protip #1: don't make a thermal paste out of a highly abrasive material and then get mad when users point out that it has damaged their components.


----------



## d1nky (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf


----------



## SonDa5 (Jul 18, 2013)

I can easily contact Swiftech about the mark on my die and ask them about the whole incident.  I was in contact with them when I noticed the problem because I thought it was related to an issue with the block itself at first.  Swiftech defeneded the high quality of their block but they also offered me a replacement block just to please me.


IC Diamond I have not been contacted by anyone over the problems I had with IC diamond.  I have only shared what I believe to be true.  I still have the damaged GPU that works fine but the mark is there.  I can easily take another photo of it with a different camera other than my phone.


You guys are way off.  I don't wish your company failure but you guys are looking hokey with this report and then accusing your customers of being in some type of scheme to hurt you guys is over the top.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

has anyone passed this thread along to our friends over at hardwarecanucks and hardforums? i am positive the guys over there would love to know about all of this.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

I have original photos! I can mail that bs person and to all of you here.


----------



## seronx (Jul 18, 2013)

Just upload them to flickr.


----------



## d1nky (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> has anyone passed this thread along to our friends over at hardwarecanucks and hardforums? i am positive the guys over there would love to know about all of this.



and the rest.


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

[/IMG]


----------



## theonedub (Jul 18, 2013)

This thread should be saved and distributed to companies as 'What not to do when your customers have problems.' 

I thought this was just a poorly misinformed rep, but these posts are from the owner of the company?! 

This is a Paula Dean level PR disaster.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

theonedub said:


> This is a Paula Dean level PR disaster.



this is worse. paula dean at least admit she was wrong.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

Easy Rhino said:


> has anyone passed this thread along to our friends over at hardwarecanucks and hardforums? i am positive the guys over there would love to know about all of this.





d1nky said:


> and the rest.



Okay mods be ready for the possible influx of temporary new members.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

RCoon said:


> Wow this thread is still going.
> Though I took the time to read your interesting report. And I am amused. You're using the most amusing tactics to disprove these claims.
> Let me explain this simply.
> You are claiming the image is edited, a filthy lie, and holds no true evidence of anything because:
> ...



 Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed

http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html

http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf


----------



## Athlon2K15 (Jul 18, 2013)

I wouldn't be surprised if this independent company that analyzed the photos was in Andy's pocket lol


----------



## d1nky (Jul 18, 2013)

RCoon said:


> http://img.techpowerup.org/130718/old-spice1.png[/IMG]



people keep saying it smells fishy, maybe its crushed fish bones.

calcium plus other materials = abrasion and reactive



AthlonX2 said:


> I wouldn't be surprised if this independent company that analyzed the photos was in Andy's pocket lol



about time someone said that lol


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf



OK, but, the report does highlight the areas that might have been manipulated, and not all the "damage" is in those areas. So...your point is what, exactly?


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf



Fine. Let me put a few obvious examples, plus the photos you've been given through Amped Five. Good enough for the army, good enough for me. Two can play forensic image manipulation game.
Guys, please email your pictures to n.layhe@googlemail.com


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

cadaveca said:


> OK, but, the report does highlight the areas that might have been manipulated, and not all the "damage" is in those areas. So...your point is what, exactly?



his point is nothing. he knows the "evidence" in that PDF would not hold up in court if he had to use it to protect himself. 

that brings me to my point. Andy is afraid of being sued for damages because he manufactures ( or pays someone to manufacture) a highly abrasive product (often used to polish metal!) in a thermal paste. this guy made a HUGE miscalculation coming on TPU throwing around threats and acting like he understands image forensics. he doesn't even understand the report he paid for!!


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 18, 2013)

RCoon said:


> Fine. Let me put a few obvious examples, plus the photos you've been given through Amped Five. Good enough for the army, good enough for me. Two can play forensic image manipulation game.
> Guys, please email your pictures to n.layhe@googlemail.com



That would be the original untouched, unresized pictures. If you still have the camera email  or the sd card maybe you can have the email pull the image straight from them.


----------



## SonDa5 (Jul 18, 2013)

From the report:



> 1) The file format data indicates that the digital image is a JPEG file and the digital camera used to create the image
> is a Samsung SGH-T989 digital camera. Pixel dimensions equal 1326 x 1260, these dimensions are not consistent
> with the resolution capabilities of the Samsung SGH-T989 digital camera. For this reason img0925G’s file format is
> not consistent with an authentic digital image created by this camera.











If you look at the reflection off of the die you can see I am shooting the photo with my  Samsung SGH-T989 through a *magnified* circular light.  Similar to this one: http://www.lumiram.com/magnifying-lamps/112-comfort-view-round-magnifying-lamp.html


Ever hear of magnification in lenses?  

The report is incomplete and inaccurate.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf



I find it funny that you are so legally smart, and want to throw around terms that aren't what you want to say (slander...maybe you should google that word before you look more like an idiot), but at the same time, by repeatedly posting the same link over and over again, you fit the definition of a spammer to TPU, I suppose you are working to get removed from here by not following the guidelines of posting. For someone who is so read up on everything, you would think the easy stuff wouldn't get buy you so easily

In the end you appear to be a martyr and are looking for retaliation from TPU as some form of proof that we are attacking you, when in reality, you are the one attacking, and have been all day since you couldn't keep your fingers idle and wanted to trash us as a whole on FB.... Remember Andy, Those in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. No matter what proof you have, in public you look like an arrogant ass who is out to get anyone who has issue with your sub-par product.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

SonDa5 said:


> I can easily contact Swiftech about the mark on my die and ask them about the whole incident.  I was in contact with them when I noticed the problem because I thought it was related to an issue with the block itself at first.  Swiftech defeneded the high quality of their block but they also offered me a replacement block just to please me.
> 
> 
> IC Diamond I have not been contacted by anyone over the problems I had with IC diamond.  I have only shared what I believe to be true.  I still have the damaged GPU that works fine but the mark is there.  I can easily take another photo of it with a different camera other than my phone.
> ...



Your EXIF data, your camera, your picture, your ELA your DCT. -independent analysis by third party professionals

Send your Raw photo into a third party for analysis to prove that it is real otherwise it is as it stands


----------



## SonDa5 (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Your EXIF data, your camera, your picture, your ELA your DCT. -independent analysis by third party professionals
> 
> Send your Raw photo into a third party for analysis to prove that it is real otherwise it is as it stands




You call Swiftech and ask them about this.  They may know and if they don't remember and you ask them kindly to call me then if they call me I will remind them of the incident.


I'm not making this up.  Your report proves nothing and I hope you didn't have to spend money to get it done.  Save your pennys and fix your company right. 


Right now you should apologize to your customers and work on improving your product.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Send your Raw photo into a third party for analysis to prove that it is real otherwise it is as it stands



You could learn to ask nicely so you don't look like such a toolbox. You have the burden of proof, and to be honest, if I was any of these guys I wouldn't send you shit, I would take my originals and any information I had to court with me when you start sending out your subpoenas. I also assume you plan to sue TPU since that is what your FB post states!


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

Come on guys. Send me your originals. Ready and waiting.


----------



## TRWOV (Jul 18, 2013)

I'm at work now but I'll look for them as soon as I get home.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

Here goes. My Sapphire Radeon HD 6770 1 GB DDR5




DSC00407 by itsarijit21, on Flickr




DSC00406 by itsarijit21, on Flickr

You will be able to see scratches and dents and dots all over the die. Taken on Sony Cybershot WX50

Before ICD, it was like this. Sorry for the bad quality. Taken on Samsung Galaxy Y GT S5360




2012-09-29 23.58.14 by itsarijit21, on Flickr


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> Here goes. My Sapphire Radeon HD 6770 1 GB DDR5
> 
> [url]http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3734/9317330142_74106b4e04_o.jpg[/url]
> DSC00407 by itsarijit21, on Flickr
> ...



IC Diamond apple-face, please state where on these images the manipulation could have occured.


----------



## brandonwh64 (Jul 18, 2013)

We are not the only people that have had problems with IC Diamond

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2073442

http://www.evga.com/forums/tm.aspx?m=695748&mpage=1

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=649643

http://www.silentpcreview.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=42128

MANY MORE!


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

Here are my findings
Original Raccoon image, clearly edited, also multiply re-compressed. I can clearly show area where manipulation has occurred.









I will upload my reports shortly.


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

SonDa5 said:


> From the report:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Obviously magnification in lenses has nothing to do with anything as it does not explain the local area of manipulation.

This picture was an odd one so not surprised you selected it as the area of manipulation was not where the damage was alleged to have occurred which actually shows nothing perhaps a grease smear?- and one can only speculate as to reason it was done.

Otherwise the magnification argument is silly as the DCT's and the ELA's only appear in the alleged damaged areas and no where else and is a marker for local area manipulation


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Obviously magnification in lenses has nothing to do with anything as it does not explain the local area of manipulation.
> 
> This picture was an odd one so not surprised you selected it as the area of manipulation was not where the damage was alleged to have occurred which actually shows nothing perhaps a grease smear?- and one can only speculate as to reason it was done.
> 
> Otherwise the magnification argument is silly as the DCT's and the ELA's only appear in the alleged damaged areas and no where else and is a marker for local area manipulation



CHECK my IMAGES you ****. Where can you find any manipulation? Come to my place and I will show you the damage!


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> CHECK my IMAGES you ****. Where can you find any manipulation? Come to my place and I will show you the damage!



I see no evidence of manipulation except in two areas, I cannot deny or confirm manipulation in those two spots. Besides that, all legit damage.


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

RCoon said:


> I see no evidence of manipulation except in two areas, I cannot deny or confirm manipulation in those two spots. Besides that, all legit damage.
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130718/possible.jpg



Thanks a lot. That says it all. And RCoon, I didn't tell you to check my image in that post. I told that IC Diamond named user here. Just thought should let you know because you quoted my post I meant for him.


----------



## NdMk2o1o (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> CHECK my IMAGES you ****. Where can you find any manipulation? Come to my place and I will show you the damage!



I'm disliking this douche the more I see him blindly repost the same useless links and totally disregarding counter arguments with generic bullcrap, if anything I think TPU should be the ones filing a lawsuit for defirmation


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

itsakjt said:


> CHECK my IMAGES you ****. Where can you find any manipulation? Come to my place and I will show you the damage!



Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.

Some conditions do apply to "evidence"


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.
> 
> Some conditions do apply to "evidence"



Wow. You just became the internets next Gr33n Gecko. Goodbye Andrew. I hope you enjoyed having a job. You've just publicly disgraced yourself.


----------



## HammerON (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.
> 
> Some conditions do apply to "evidence"



That sir was out of line. You have absolutely no customer service skills let alone people skills. How you can even run a business is beyond me:shadedshu
Infraction for you sir. Please do not sue me.


----------



## NdMk2o1o (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.
> 
> Some conditions do apply to "evidence"



Wow, that is your response? you do realise you make a product that is geared toward enthusiasts and overclokcers and that you're on one of the most frequented enthusiast forums on the web that have many links and members that are also on many of the other top enthusiast forums who are likely to see how you are responding to people who have used your products right?


----------



## IC Diamond (Jul 18, 2013)

In any event those in the report that would like to have the original raw images  provided to an independent third party can email The address in the report


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> In any event those in the report that would like to have the original raw images  provided to an independent third party can email The address in the report



How about you ask for them in the first place
How about you do your job as a rep
How about you conduct yourself properly on a forum of prospective buyers
How about you take your arrogance some place else

I personally hope you crash and burn.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> In any event those in the report that would like to have the original raw images  provided to an independent third party can email The address in the report



I see your LinkedIn has ZERO contacts. I was not surprised by that.

I'm just some lowly reviewer, who posts reviews from his living room, and gets paid nearly nothing to do it. In other words, I'm just some broke, jobless loser posting on the internet. I get new contacts every week.

Consider that for a moment...while you re-read that post you made above.



I remember when you started the IC Diamond thing way back when, as I've been part of the PC enthusiast community for many years, on many different sites. I wish you some success, but please, consider your actions and the responses you've received.


----------



## Frick (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.
> 
> Some conditions do apply to "evidence"



That is something I would write, and it's classy AS TITS.

Embrace the Rage-Boner.


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 18, 2013)

Guys, I'm appealing to _everyone_ to keep the discussion civil and on topic.
Thanks.


----------



## RCoon (Jul 18, 2013)

Alright.
I ran his original image through a forensic analysis program, and found two possible marks, despite this mystical re-compression you keep stating. Please take that image and reanalyse. I am dying to see your results.


----------



## TeXBill (Jul 18, 2013)

I can't believe he is making such an @!! of himself on a public forum. What does he gain from all of this? Nothing, but showing everybody what an @!! he is. The more I read, the more I dislike him and his diamond paste crap. I actually bought some of this stuff back a year or so ago and didn't like it then. Now I'm sure to not ever buy any of this paste or anything else that comes from his company. Such a BUTT !!!!


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 18, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.
> 
> Some conditions do apply to "evidence"



Oh you are real smart I see. Well if you ARE the only one FU*KING with us, I am afraid the results can be different. You mean to say that I have deliberately damaged my hardware bought with hard earned money? Why would I do that? I don't know you, I have no grudge on you or your company. So tell me why we all are complaining for the same problem over and over again?
I doubt you know anything about law. If the statement you made is correct, then all evidences ever found can be said manipulated! WHERE'S YOUR PROOF? I HAVE DONE MY PART AND NOW ITS YOUR TURN TO PROVE THAT THE IMAGE IS MANIPULATED!


----------



## Conti027 (Jul 18, 2013)

So I take it IC Diamond isn't good.. 
Now I know to stay away from it. 
I use AS5 now and was going to try IC Diamond next but not after all this.


----------



## the54thvoid (Jul 18, 2013)

I actually read through the entire forensic report and it clearly alludes to certain things being 'irregular'.  The majority of irregularities are from compression sizes not matching the original camera capture size.  No biggie there.

Some show certain features that may be attributed to the picture being doctored but you know what?  None of it is relevant in a purely legal framework as the original digital images have not been subjected to analysis.  It clearly states in the report:



> FMS informed LAC that the original digital image files would yield the most relevant results



Furthermore their finding:


> It is the opinion of FMS to a reasonable degree of scientific certainty in the area of forensic digital image authentication that all of the digital images are inconsistent with authentic digital images created by their respective digital cameras.



is based more on the inconsistent image format (through compression for upload) than the doctoring of images.  Also, proper physical evidence (as was lost by company in question) would be far more telling as an admission.

However, the points above are moot because what the company is failing to see is the massive damage that can be done not by defamation or slander (as this thread is neither) but by the arrogance of it's owner, is unforgivable.
To show such open contempt and to display such aloofness form the target market simply marks your service skills as a no go zone and your company as a potential RMA nightmare.  

IC Diamond?  

no...  IC a very badly managed public image.


----------



## HammerON (Jul 18, 2013)

The fact that you think our members "doctored" their pictures (for what advantage I do not know) is just deplorable. Instead of taking the route that maybe your TIM actually did cause damage to their heat sinks and CPUs you challenge the pictures instead. Wow - that is just evil.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jul 18, 2013)

I think we can all agree that giving money to this guy is a terrible idea. Perhaps to make up for the lost revenue he can find another business to sue for patent infringement.


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (Jul 18, 2013)

So to be clear, the accusation is that tpu members got together through pms or whatever and decided let's ruin this company with expertly edited images and vanishing packages?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 18, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> So to be clear, the accusation is that tpu members got together through pms or whatever and decided let's ruin this company with expertly edited images and vanishing packages?



Indeed, that is exactly what his facebook post presents.


----------



## Fourstaff (Jul 18, 2013)

Look, is it too hard to try to replicate the surface damage under normal use conditions? By normal I mean buy a few cheap CPUs, mount various coolers on, and report your findings? We have all seen the lab test attempting to replicate the damage, but it came out negative. It will be so much easier for all of us if you have went "look guys, I mounted various CPUs and heatsinks, let it cure for a few weeks while applying normal heating/cooling cycles for typical computer usage. Can't find any damage, so I am not quite sure how you damaged yours." Or "yeah I found that ICD scratches the surface, be careful when you use them". So much more useful than going "I can't replicate the pitting, so you must be lying and trying to flame the product. Results show that you manipulated the images, you little trolls". 

There are quite a few rep of different companies in TPU, and whenever we present them with a problem they will always try the hardest to fix things, not to sling mud all over the place.


----------



## cdawall (Jul 18, 2013)

Stack of ebay 8400GS's would work quite well naked die and you can get any kind of cooler on them.


----------



## hat (Jul 19, 2013)

I'm having difficulty coming up with anything to say other than that I am utterly amazed by this turn of events.

Andy, I'd really like to see you try to sue TPU. Try and sue this website for libel (it would be libel, not slander).


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 19, 2013)

hat said:


> (it would be libel, not slander).



And the kid from Ohio wins the prize!!!!!!


----------



## cdawall (Jul 19, 2013)

hat said:


> I'm having difficulty coming up with anything to say other than that I am utterly amazed by this turn of events.
> 
> Andy, I'd really like to see you try to sue TPU. Try and sue this website for libel (it would be libel, not slander).



TPU is also not at fault for anything said on it. He would have to try sueing individual people.


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (Jul 19, 2013)

Don't ship out any more hardware. If it comes down to it you can bring the hardware to court and bypass this photo editing nonsense.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 19, 2013)

cdawall said:


> TPU is also not at fault for anything said on it. He would have to try sueing individual people.



http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2943644&postcount=581

I hope he enjoys my PC and my 1978 Pontiac as it is all I own.


----------



## remixedcat (Jul 19, 2013)

theonedub said:


> This thread should be saved and distributed to companies as 'What not to do when your customers have problems.'
> 
> I thought this was just a poorly misinformed rep, but these posts are from the owner of the company?!
> 
> This is a Paula Dean level PR disaster.



I had no clue of this company till I heard about this. Sticking with AS5 or MX4.


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (Jul 19, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> I hope he enjoys my PC



He'd just ruin it by applying IC diamond anyways.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jul 19, 2013)

I don't see how the image being compressed makes any difference, they would have been looking for image manipulation in the area of the alleged damage. Does it mention any manipulation in these areas in the report? 

Wow what a thread.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 19, 2013)

I can't see this going anywhere and still haven't a clue as to why he came back in the first place. He did not help his cause any today. Andy's forensic photo team that works out of the back of an Arby's somewhere didn't help his cause either. people like this just make me sick to my stomach. Sue happy is so wrong in so many ways.


----------



## TheMailMan78 (Jul 19, 2013)

Man after reading this thread I decided to remove my heat sink because I have been using IC Diamond for years. The odor smelled of ass and sun tan lotion and I think I can even see some of the of the actual diamond left on it!


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 19, 2013)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Man after reading this thread I decided to remove my heat sink because I have been using IC Diamond for years. The odor smelled of ass and sun tan lotion and I think I can even see some of the of the actual diamond left on it!
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130718/WP_20130718_001.jpg



Oh shit. I don't even want to know where the hair came from.


----------



## cadaveca (Jul 19, 2013)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Man after reading this thread I decided to remove my heat sink because I have been using IC Diamond for years. The odor smelled of ass and sun tan lotion and I think I can even see some of the of the actual diamond left on it!
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130718/WP_20130718_001.jpg



Better send that for chemical analysis


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 19, 2013)

I am guessing that is Aluminum Oxide residue from not completely cleaning off the previous TIM prior to ICD usage. Some sort of chemical reaction, much like a kidney stone!


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jul 19, 2013)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Man after reading this thread I decided to remove my heat sink because I have been using IC Diamond for years. The odor smelled of ass and sun tan lotion and I think I can even see some of the of the actual diamond left on it!
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/130718/WP_20130718_001.jpg



You crack me up fella


----------



## drdeathx (Jul 19, 2013)

Andrew gave me about 20 tubes of IC7. I have used it for years with literally 30 heatsinks and reapplied it to my waterblock a hundred times along with using it 20 times with my Dice Runs and the product works perfect so I  have no idea why the rant....


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 19, 2013)

this isn't about ICD7 it is about ICD24, and I'm guessing a very specific batch.


----------



## drdeathx (Jul 19, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> this isn't about ICD7 it is about ICD24, and I'm guessing a very specific batch.



Never used it... It seems like it may be an isolated instance or is there more than 1 case. If there is not more than 1 case it could be a heatsink issue with the metal(s) used. I am late to the party on this.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 19, 2013)

drdeathx said:


> Never used it... It seems like it may be an isolated instance or is there more than 1 case. If there is not more than 1 case it could be a heatsink issue with the metal(s) used. I am late to the party on this.



since there is a lot to read in this thread I would point you to look at all the ICD reps posts with links to the pdf that shows all the damages reported aside from mine to show it was more than one person with various coolers. I do suggest reading the last 8-10 pages to fully catch up though.


----------



## DannibusX (Jul 19, 2013)

If it turns out that a bad batch was manufatured, hell that kind of crap happens all the time, that's a more than forgivable offense.

The outright hostility and douchebaggery from a company rep and/or CEO means I will never consider your product.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 19, 2013)

Also if anyone is interested in trying out some other paste with a much more calm and relaxed environment, it seems that Thermaltake is on the move with an offer that should give those who want to remove ICD24 from their procs, but have no other paste, or general testers for their various formulations they are trying out now! http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187422

might as well right?


----------



## TRWOV (Jul 19, 2013)

Ok, here are the pictures. I've included them in a zip file to avoid alterations in the upload process (watermarks, recompression, etc.)


Content's of README.TXT



> DESCRIPTION OF CONTENTS:
> 
> IMG_0922.JPG - Original picture of the one referenced in page 25 of http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> IMG_0923.JPG - Original picture of the one referenced in page 28 of http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> ...



Andrew, I sent them to Chris too, as instructed. YGPM.


----------



## Mussels (Jul 19, 2013)

this seems a bit ridiculous. the PDF report shown in the post above mine pretty much says 'the image was resized and recompressed, but we cant find anything to show its doctored'



the hostility here is amazing. no efforts to verify the batch sent out was bad, and a lost cooler?


shit, this would have been good publicity if they'd just replaced anything that was damaged (sure it'd cost em a few bucks, but it'd be good PR) instead of this crap.


----------



## TRWOV (Jul 19, 2013)

Mussels said:


> shit, this would have been good publicity if they'd just replaced anything that was damaged (sure it'd cost em a few bucks, but it'd be good PR) instead of this crap.



Andrew offered that (see bottom of this post) and in fact replaced sneeky's heatsink. Sonda had already RMAed his block and my CPU was an ES chip so I couldn't really give it up (no $ value and could potentially give a friend some problems).


----------



## Mussels (Jul 19, 2013)

i'm going to hazard a guess as to what really happened here.

either by accident or by design (cheaping out) diamond flour larger than in previous ICD TIM's was used.

When compressed tightly against a somewhat brittle surface (a smoothed CPU/GPU die) it has caused small chunks to fragment off, pitting the surface. none of the hardware was destroyed - merely surface damage.


So in this case, why didnt ICD simply check the batch for contaminants and let us know about that? why was no replacement thermal paste offered, confirmed free of contaminants?

Why instead was threats of legal action, comments about shooting dead grandmothers, and comments about a massive conspiracy theory all manufactured by the CEO of ICD?


----------



## TRWOV (Jul 19, 2013)

They did check (or at least they said they did, check the previously referred post). I always thought it was related to all the TIM shuffling I did but I wanted them to come to a solution (maybe an IC approved surface cleaner, a la Arctic Clean) not invent a conspiracy.


----------



## Mussels (Jul 19, 2013)

TRWOV said:


> Andrew offered that (see bottom of this post) and in fact replaced sneeky's heatsink. Sonda had already RMAed his block and my CPU was an ES chip so I couldn't really give it up (no $ value and could potentially give a friend some problems).



i missed that (its a big thread). kudos to andrew for that one.


----------



## drdeathx (Jul 19, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> since there is a lot to read in this thread I would point you to look at all the ICD reps posts with links to the pdf that shows all the damages reported aside from mine to show it was more than one person with various coolers. I do suggest reading the last 8-10 pages to fully catch up though.



I need cliff notes


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 19, 2013)

LAN_deRf_HA said:


> So to be clear, the accusation is that tpu members got together through pms or whatever and decided let's ruin this company with expertly edited images and vanishing packages?





sneekypeet said:


> Indeed, that is exactly what his facebook post presents.



EXACTLY! He is trying to say that we all have conspired against him and his goddamned company and throwing manipulated results.


----------



## r9 (Jul 19, 2013)

I think I know what is going on. It can be one of two things you either are payed from competitors company to kill the reputation of you present company or you are just impostor not even working there. You must wonder how I figure this out it is quite simple, it is unrealistic how much you suck at your job. I`m going to name term after you "Suicide PR" at first I was thinking about "Harakiri PR" but harakiri is about honor and dignity and you can`t be more far away.

I would like to nominate you IC Diamond for Darwin Award - 
"They recognize individuals who have contributed to human evolution by self-selecting themselves out of the gene pool via death or sterilization via their own (unnecessarily foolish) actions."


----------



## Sir B. Fannybottom (Jul 19, 2013)

why is everyone getting all butt hurt here? What image are we even talking about?


----------



## Frick (Jul 19, 2013)

Sir B. Fannybottom said:


> why is everyone getting all butt hurt here? What image are we even talking about?



Read the thread. A bunch of people reported damaged chips/IHS, the rep wanted pictures, they took pictures, posted them here, sometime there the pictures changed sizes, rep sends them to a forensic company that came to the conclusion the images have been resized. Also that some of them have been tampered with ie doctored to make IC look bad. Mild shitstorm occurs, unsurprisingly.


----------



## FreedomEclipse (Jul 19, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.


----------



## RCoon (Jul 19, 2013)

FreedomEclipse said:


> http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n210/FinalFreedomEclipse/nCc5I_zpsce65f2cd.gif



Pissed myself


----------



## SonDa5 (Jul 19, 2013)

TRWOV said:


> They did check (or at least they said they did, check the previously referred post). I always thought it was related to all the TIM shuffling I did but I wanted them to come to a solution (maybe an IC approved surface cleaner, a la Arctic Clean) not invent a conspiracy.





I was never offered anything.  An apology or at least recognition of the problem that I had would have been satisfactory.  Swiftech was the hero in my situation.

IC D you still have time to make things right and get back on track to moving forward with your TIM.  You really do owe an apology.


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 19, 2013)

SonDa5 said:


> I was never offered anything.  An apology or at least recognition of the problem that I had would have been satisfactory.  Swiftech was the hero in my situation.
> 
> IC D you still have time to make things right and get back on track to moving forward with your TIM.  You really do owe an apology.



And this my friend is why this guy is such a douche nugget. I for one go through a hell of a lot of thermal paste. I don't give a shit if the goes comes up with the greatest thermal paste ever known to man, I still wouldn't use his shit. I would rather use the $2 to $3 crap paste and let my stuff sweat then give him any of my money. It is just not right what he did to our community and to our fellow members here. We have each others back here at TPU.


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 19, 2013)

This man can't even take criticism.
I wonder what he's doing running a business if he goes into panic mode at the first signs of feedback.

He's just removed all the posts which some TPU members had made explaining what happened to them when they used IC Diamond. But obviously he didn't delete his original where he said that TPU members were orchestratedly attacking him and photoshopping photos...

What a coward.


----------



## RCoon (Jul 19, 2013)

Dont worry guys, I got your back


----------



## remixedcat (Jul 19, 2013)

My post was as neutral sounding and as friendly as I could make it and I was blockedfrom page interaction.


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 19, 2013)

remixedcat said:


> My post was as neutral sounding and as friendly as I could make it and I was blockedfrom page interaction.



Me too. I can't write anything even if I "like" his page.

So don't get your hopes high Rcoon about re-posting the link to this thread if he deletes it!


----------



## de.das.dude (Jul 19, 2013)

hmm. i didnt join this test. thank god, but that doesnt mean i am not mad at what happed to the rest of my tpu mates.

in anycase....

diamod = hardest natrual stubstance

metal = pretty soft. so scratches and dents should be common?


----------



## AlienIsGOD (Jul 19, 2013)

he's changed privacy settings on FB page.  Therefore i am @ tagging IC DIAMOND on my own wall posts and reposting throughout the day, with pics and links to the original thread.


----------



## RCoon (Jul 19, 2013)

Black Panther said:


> Me too. I can't write anything even if I "like" his page.
> 
> So don't get your hopes high Rcoon about re-posting the link to this thread if he deletes it!



I can make new accounts. I can make as many AOL mail accounts as I like = unlimited facebook accounts.


----------



## DannibusX (Jul 19, 2013)

IC Diamond said:


> I had an independent analysis done on the photos posted on the IC Diamond Giveaway of alleged damage caused by IC Diamond by the forum members
> 
> TRWOV
> SonDa5
> ...





IC Diamond said:


> Does not matter what the users say - Fact: each Picture contains an EXIF file about the camera. It can contain GPS Data as to where the picture was taken, model of camera, and what software was used to edit the picture plus a lot more information.
> 
> EXIF data has a long history of acceptable evidence in numerous court cases.





IC Diamond said:


> Threats are hollow, evidence is clear - I recently sued 8 companies in 5 years all settled in my favour, it was quite lucrative. I'll have to check and see what the options are in CA.





IC Diamond said:


> Great question, I do not know if they were compensated or not, do you? Look at the ELA and the DCT and EXIF data and then ask them  - your speculation is as good as anybody's





IC Diamond said:


> that's good, if you have the raw images still available we can make arrangement for third party independent analysis, only way to prove they are not manipulated.





IC Diamond said:


> Of course it can -but the data was taken from the pictures posted on then forum which is out of my hands and under control of the people that generated them. Third party professional analysis was performed here which adheres to a chain of custody
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/Image.html





IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> 
> Must have hit a nerve attacking the messenger because you do not like the message - read the report and we can debate the  ELA and DCT analysis on local area manipulation.
> 
> I gave TRWOV the contact info BTW on where to send his raw images for analysis





IC Diamond said:


> Third party independent analysis - data does not lie
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf





IC Diamond said:


> Dismissial was because we settled out of court - you missed Apple btw





IC Diamond said:


> Read he DCT and ELA analysis
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf





IC Diamond said:


> Dct, ELA show areas of local manipulation Combined with EXIF makes a strong case





IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf
> 
> Every thing but the kitchen sink perhaps you guys should read up on photo forensics then you could Talk intelligently about the subject





IC Diamond said:


> http://innovationcooling.com/image/I...lingreport.pdf
> 
> https://sites.google.com/site/elsamuko/forensics/ela





IC Diamond said:


> http://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited.jpghttp://fotoforensics.com/img/books-edited-ela.png
> 
> The resaved image was digitally modified: books were copied and a toy dinosaur was added. ELA clearly shows the modified areas as having higher ELA values.
> 
> ...





IC Diamond said:


> Yes, but does not show areas of local manipulation - study up on it





IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf





IC Diamond said:


> Yes but re-compressing an image does not add local area manipulation as on these examples and This software is designed to identify  areas of manipulation even on photos that have been multiply compressed
> 
> http://www.fmsconsultation.com/FIAS_Software.html
> 
> http://innovationcooling.com/image/Innovationcoolingreport.pdf





IC Diamond said:


> Your EXIF data, your camera, your picture, your ELA your DCT. -independent analysis by third party professionals
> 
> Send your Raw photo into a third party for analysis to prove that it is real otherwise it is as it stands





IC Diamond said:


> Obviously magnification in lenses has nothing to do with anything as it does not explain the local area of manipulation.
> 
> This picture was an odd one so not surprised you selected it as the area of manipulation was not where the damage was alleged to have occurred which actually shows nothing perhaps a grease smear?- and one can only speculate as to reason it was done.
> 
> Otherwise the magnification argument is silly as the DCT's and the ELA's only appear in the alleged damaged areas and no where else and is a marker for local area manipulation





IC Diamond said:


> In any event those in the report that would like to have the original raw images  provided to an independent third party can email The address in the report





IC Diamond said:


> Just because you dig up your dead grandmother put a couple of bullets in her and post her bullet ridden corpse  on a forum as proof I killed her does not mean that's what happened.
> 
> Some conditions do apply to "evidence"



I'm in the business of preserving evidence, simply because you deleted legitimate postings on your Facebook page and I want the world to experience your douchebaggery if you decide to come to TPU and edit some shit.

Of course, you'll probably just hire some "independent third-party expert" to refute the quoted posts above.

Good day, sir!


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 19, 2013)

I say fight fire with fire. Ban him here. Also he for some weird reason didn't delete my post. He must have missed it. .


----------



## FreedomEclipse (Jul 19, 2013)

RCoon said:


> I can make new accounts. I can make as many AOL mail accounts as I like = unlimited facebook accounts.



DDoS the innovationcooling website! take that trash down!


----------



## RCoon (Jul 19, 2013)

FreedomEclipse said:


> DDoS the innovationcooling website! take that trash down!



I have a few hundred computers at my disposal this summer due to kids summer holidays. Maybe.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jul 19, 2013)

FreedomEclipse said:


> DDoS the innovationcooling website! take that trash down!





RCoon said:


> I have a few hundred computers at my disposal this summer due to kids summer holidays. Maybe.



Be careful saying things like that, you know how the british gov is about these kind of things, just saying ok


----------



## RCoon (Jul 19, 2013)

tigger said:


> Be careful saying things like that, you know how the british gov is about these kind of things, just saying ok



PRISM will get me V& 
I'll just be a douche on his FB with only 207 likes for now.


----------



## de.das.dude (Jul 19, 2013)

i have a theory...

diamond particles is really hard, and is used as abrasives in industrial applications.
one such example is this being sold on alibaba
http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/733590813/industrial_diamond_dust.html?s=p
i know this because i have studied machining and machine tool designs as a part of my degree in mechanical engg.

now i do not know about the structure of diamond particles used in this particulat thermal paste.
As far as i know, based on the chemical atomic structure of diamond, the only ways it can exist, is always crystalline, i.e. with sharp edges.

so we are at this point where.. they are basically putting abrasive particles in your thermal compound. i may be wrong, as i have little clue on artificial diamond manufacturing processes, and there might be some special way to get non abrasive diamond particles. (well, i did a google check and it doesnt produce relevant results)

this would explain the scratches formed on the surfaces.

now to wards the pitting.
i have analyzed the pictures, and most of the cases the pitting seems to have formed on the lower side of the CPU(assuming most people use desktop standing PCs).

my theory is that... after the heatsink has been mounted and set up right, the diamond particles being heavier than the suspension medium, have a tendency to fall under gravity.

this can be tested by applying a small anount of the stuff on an acrylic plate, then putting another one on top, with a small gap between. if my hypothesis is correct the diamond dust will reach the bottom faster and hence tend to be concentrated towards the bottom a bit more.


now the pitting action.

the pitting action is actually a more advanced form of the previous problem.

we all know that the temp cycles go about 30C difference in between noload and loaded conditions.

this produces tiny deformations in the thin IHS of CPUs and in heatsinks. What i mean is, that due to expansion and contraction, the IHS and surfaces will act like a diaphragm and this will sort of provide a pumping action, agitating the particles and further facilitating the previous problem.

now because of any microscopic imperfection in the surface or because of contamination, a small diamond particle might get lodged in a place. now this diamond particle will attract the other atoms on other diamond particles and slowly a large mass will be gathered.

now this will be pressured by repeated movements of the diaphragm action which may result in the pitting action.

also another theory is its just abrasion from movement. like in a sand blaster.
there is already movement from the diaphragm action. maybe it was making distinct same currents everytime? it was eroding like a river


----------



## TRWOV (Jul 19, 2013)

de.das.dude said:


> now because of any microscopic imperfection in the surface or because of contamination, a small diamond particle might get lodged in a place. now this diamond particle will attract the other atoms on other diamond particles and slowly a large mass will be gathered.
> 
> now this will be pressured by repeated movements of the diaphragm action which may result in the pitting action.



That's a good guess but none of us found a big chunk of diamond in the pit.


----------



## de.das.dude (Jul 19, 2013)

its not a chunk, its a cluster of particles.

also another theory is its just abrasion from movement. like in a sand blaster.
there is already movement from the diaphragm action. maybe it was making distinct same currents everytime? it was eroding like a river


----------



## remixedcat (Jul 19, 2013)

ThE_MaD_ShOt said:


> I say fight fire with fire. Ban him here. Also he for some weird reason didn't delete my post. He must have missed it. .





FreedomEclipse said:


> DDoS the innovationcooling website! take that trash down!



I posted about how this guy is throwing a baby fit and how he is on a baby throwing a tantrum video. I suggest you do so as well. He he!


----------



## de.das.dude (Jul 19, 2013)

remixedcat said:


> I posted about how this guy is throwing a baby fit and how he is on a baby throwing a tantrum video. I suggest you do so as well. He he!



bet he is like this now


----------



## d1nky (Jul 19, 2013)

LOL at the FB shizz...... have ya ever seen those FB pages that are an attack on another...... 

ANTI-IC.... STOP THE TYRANT IC..... JUSTICE AGAINST IC....


----------



## Mussels (Jul 19, 2013)

Black Panther said:


> This man can't even take criticism.
> I wonder what he's doing running a business if he goes into panic mode at the first signs of feedback.
> 
> He's just removed all the posts which some TPU members had made explaining what happened to them when they used IC Diamond. But obviously he didn't delete his original where he said that TPU members were orchestratedly attacking him and photoshopping photos...
> ...



he has deleted my comments off the facebook page, and banned me from posting there.

The man truly is a coward.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jul 19, 2013)

Just proves, he knows he was wrong and wont come clean as he will lose face now.


----------



## LAN_deRf_HA (Jul 19, 2013)

I think he finally figured out this is not good for PR. This is why companies have proper PR staff. They can handle all this stuff in a professional manor. CEOs are normally a bit wonky and are supposed to be shielded from public interaction.


----------



## Mussels (Jul 19, 2013)

maybe its because i posted links to at least 5 forums where people have had problems including voided warranties because his diamond paste polished away CPU serial numbers....


----------



## Sasqui (Jul 19, 2013)

Mussels said:


> maybe its because i posted links to at least 5 forums where people have had problems including voided warranties because his diamond paste polished away CPU serial numbers....



We're all amongst friends   Please do post the links here!


----------



## Mussels (Jul 19, 2013)

Sasqui said:


> We're all amongst friends   Please do post the links here!



they were copied from someone elses post in the longer thread.


----------



## FreedomEclipse (Jul 19, 2013)

Well, He might be able to control his FB page but he cant control the rest of the internet.

If there are any bloggers - blog about this situation on your sites, even if its not tech related. tweeters tweet about it, create an Anti-IC FB group. above all, go to other forums and make sure they know about the bad paste and other forums/web communities that have also suffered as a result of taking part in this TIM test.

screenshot and upload all of his responses. We might not be able to comment on his FB but we can do elsewhere and people will ask questions when they google up so many hits about these tests that went so wrong. 

He wants to be an asshole? then lets show the rest of the internet/world what an asshole he really is.


----------



## AlienIsGOD (Jul 19, 2013)

Mussels said:


> he has deleted my comments off the facebook page, and banned me from posting there.
> 
> The man truly is a coward.



same... and i dont even have any vested personal interest in this, other than the fact he isnt conducting himself like a proper individual


----------



## remixedcat (Jul 19, 2013)

FreedomEclipse said:


> Well, He might be able to control his FB page but he cant control the rest of the internet.
> 
> If there are any bloggers - blog about this situation on your sites, even if its not tech related. tweeters tweet about it, create an Anti-IC FB group. above all, go to other forums and make sure they know about the bad paste and other forums/web communities that have also suffered as a result of taking part in this TIM test.
> 
> ...



http://remixedcat.blogspot.com/2013/07/innovation-cooling-ceo-throws-tantrum.html


----------



## ThE_MaD_ShOt (Jul 19, 2013)

I just may, if there is enough support for it, live stream a commentary on this incident then post it to youtube.


----------



## RCoon (Jul 19, 2013)

ThE_MaD_ShOt said:


> I just may, if there is enough support for it, live stream a commentary on this incident then post it to youtube.



We could all just go on TPU teamspeak, have a conversation, I'll FRAPS it and add some commercial looking TPU image over it and post it up.


----------



## crazyeyesreaper (Jul 19, 2013)

People could just hit him where it hurts send messages to Newegg / Tiger Direct / Amazon that the company CEO is highly abusive toward consumers threatens lawsuits etc. You can even tell newegg to NOT stock Ic Diamond lol. To be completely honesty easiest way to prove a point is to shut off the flow of money.


----------



## Over_Lord (Jul 19, 2013)

And I was missing out on all the fun until now.


----------



## sneekypeet (Jul 19, 2013)

By the way people, you do realize that you can still report the page on FB for various reasons right?


----------



## AlienIsGOD (Jul 19, 2013)

sneekypeet said:


> By the way people, you do realize that you can still report the page on FB for various reasons right?



did that already


----------



## Killer_Rubber_Ducky (Jul 19, 2013)

dude, ditto. Got a posse spreading the word too. Among my tech friends too.

Also. found this post about a Silver-Diamond composite the feds have been working on for a few years. Seems like this is where IC got the idea. Not sure what the rest of the goop is made from but this uses Silver and Diamonds.

http://phys.org/news/2011-03-silver-diamond-composite-cooling-capabilities-electronics.html


> Researchers at the Georgia Tech Research Institute (GTRI) are developing a solid composite material to help cool small, powerful microelectronics used in defense systems. The material, composed of silver and diamond, promises an exceptional degree of thermal conductivity compared to materials currently used for this application.
> 
> The research is focused on producing a silver-diamond thermal shim of unprecedented thinness – 250 microns or less. The ratio of silver to diamond in the material can be tailored to allow the shim to be bonded with low thermal-expansion stress to the high-power wide-bandgap semiconductors planned for next generation phased-array radars.


----------



## drdeathx (Jul 19, 2013)

This is getting out of hand IMO. Sheesh just leave it be


----------



## AlienIsGOD (Jul 19, 2013)

drdeathx said:


> This is getting out of hand IMO. Sheesh just leave it be



point taken, but many of us feel otherwise about the situation


----------



## itsakjt (Jul 19, 2013)

I request admins to make his profile such that he cannot edit or delete his own posts. We need them.... THAT MOFO INSULTED ME BY TALKING ABOUT MY GRANDMOTHER! HOW DARE HE????


----------



## erocker (Jul 19, 2013)

I think it's about time everyone settle down a bit and take a break from this thread.


----------

