# Are All of My Parts Compatible? Please Help Me Out... I'm New To Building PCs



## RiverFlows73 (Dec 2, 2020)

CPU: Ryzen 5 3600
Motherboard: ASRock B450M Pro4
RAM: Samsung DDR4 8GB RAM x 2
GPU: GTX 1650 Super
SSD: Crucial BX500 240GB

Case & PSU is to be decided... although I may just end up going for a 80+ Standard for the PSU and the cheapest one for the case

BTW I am on a budget... I'm trying to keep the pc, monitor, keyboard, mouse, basically everything combined for lower than $700... I hope thats possible

Thanks


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## kurosagi01 (Dec 2, 2020)

Are you buying from the US? (Assumingly going by your currency)
Power supply is one thing you shouldn't cheap out if possible, maybe something like this if budget fits:


			https://pcpartpicker.com/product/KmgzK8/seasonic-focus-gold-550w-80-gold-certified-semi-modular-atx-power-supply-ssr-550fm
		

Case :


			https://pcpartpicker.com/product/XVbCmG/cooler-master-masterbox-mb320l-argb-microatx-mid-tower-case-mcb-b320l-kgnn-s02
		

Get another fan for exhaust

What speed are those Samsung ram?
You can get 3000-3200mhz speed for under $60.


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 2, 2020)

Hmm.. I don't know if a 80+ gold will fit in the budget.. would a bronze be decent enough?
Thanks on the case and ram suggestions though. I'll look more into those


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 2, 2020)

Cheap&stable ram: G.SKILL Aegis 16GB 3000MHz CL16 DDR4 DIMM KIT OF 2 F4-3000C16D-16GISB
3200 are few bucks pricier, pretty same performance.
80+ bronze is PERFECT for ryzen 3600 and 1650s - SeaSonic S12III 500 W 80+ Bronze or better SeaSonic S12III 550 W 80+ Bronze. They aren't modular, BTW. Modular starts with 80+ GOLD at core GM series. Alternatively, I advise your Corsair PSUs or BeQuiet!

please, consider Crucial MX500 instead of BX series. Or Kingston KC600. Cache-less ssd are suitable for upgrading old systems, they are bad for modern systems!


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 2, 2020)

Oh Are the BX series cacheless? I didn't know that! Thanks for letting me know
I just saw a few videos recommending it and assumed it was decent but now that I know, I'm changing


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## Bill_Bright (Dec 2, 2020)

You broke one of the two cardinal rules when seeking buying advice. The first you met - you stated your budget and that is great!   However, you failed to state the primary purpose for this computer. Will it be used primarily for work and school? Monitoring and updating Facebook? Paying bills, surfing the Internet and checking email? Gaming?

Speaking of your budget, while $700 is certainly doable, when the keyboard, mouse and monitor must come out of that too, that budget is pretty tight. Plus, it is important to understand new computers typically require their own Windows license. Since most Windows licenses are OEM/System Builders licenses, and since those OEM/SB licenses cannot, under any circumstances, legally be transferred to a new computer, you likely need to budget for a new Windows license too - or plan on going with one of the many capable and free versions of Linux. That means you cannot just take an old drive that includes Windows out of an old computer, put it in a new computer and be good to go legally. 

Also, IMO, your SSD is too small. While technically, 240GB will support Windows, all your drivers, and most applications, it will not take long for free disk space to become limited. That will impact performance and can help accelerate aging of the SSD. I recommend at least 500GB. That will give you lots of room for the OS, drivers, and all your applications (except major games) and allow optimal and efficient SSD TRIM and wear leveling operations - essential to ensure maximum life and performance out of your SSDs. 

That said, your question was about compatibility. Fortunately, when it comes to building our own PCs, the ATX Form Factor standard helps ensure components will physically fit together and connect properly in terms of electrical connections and voltages. 

As for other compatibility issues, if you look at your motherboard's support page here, you will see memory and CPU QVLs (qualified vendors lists). These are lists of components the board maker has tested and verified to be compatible with that specific board. There are too many RAM makers and models for board makers to test them all so you don't have to buy listed RAM. But you should buy RAM with the same specs as listed RAM to ensure compatibility. 

Since EVERYTHING inside the case depends on good, clean reliable power, it is a mistake to cut corners in the budget on the power supply. So do make sure you get a decent one from a reliable maker. I like EVGA and Seasonic. Read several reviews from the review sites, including this one. Do NOT rely on user reviews. 

Also, it is important to understand 80 PLUS certification provides absolutely zero indication of a PSU's quality or reliability. It is about efficiency only. And one of the key requirements is for 80 PLUS certified PSUs to be at least 80% efficient from minimum load up to 100% load. The more efficient a PSU is, the less wasted energy there is, and, perhaps more importantly, the less generated heat there is. I generally recommend at least Bronze but prefer Gold. Unless you find a heavily discounted price, Platinum and Titanium PSUs are not worth the extra costs as it can take years to make up the difference in costs with energy savings. 

There is nothing wrong with non-modular (wired) PSUs. In fact, there are fewer parts and obviously fewer connections that introduce additional potentials for problems. But the downside is that wired PSUs greatly increase the need for good cable management. And that is where a quality case comes in. 

IMO, a quality PSU along with a quality case make up the foundation for a quality computer that can support you through many years of upgrades. A decent case will support many large (120mm or larger - preferably 140mm) case fans. It will be "true" - that is, the bends in the sheet metal will be exactly 90.0° to ensure all 4 feet sit squarely on the floor - the case will not wobble or put undue stress on the motherboard and other mounted devices. The cut edges of the sheet metal will be "finished". That is, they will be grounded smooth or rolled to prevent shredding your knuckles and wire insulation. There will be good cable management features. And a must for me is the case will have removeable, washable air filters. 

So my advice, especially since it looks like a keyboard, mouse, monitor and Windows licenses are all needed too, is wait and try to build up your budget a little more. $1000 will provide a lot more options. And if you buy a quality PSU and case now, along with a full retail license of Windows, and a decent monitor, those are 4 items that can carry you through years of updates without having to buy new each time - unless you want to, of course. That's the beauty of building your own. So many options!


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 2, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> You broke one of the two cardinal rules when seeking buying advice. The first you met - you stated your budget and that is great!   However, you failed to state the primary purpose for this computer. Will it be used primarily for work and school? Monitoring and updating Facebook? Paying bills, surfing the Internet and checking email? Gaming?
> 
> Speaking of your budget, while $700 is certainly doable, when the keyboard, mouse and monitor must come out of that too, that budget is pretty tight. Plus, it is important to understand new computers typically require their own Windows license. Since most Windows licenses are OEM/System Builders licenses, and since those OEM/SB licenses cannot, under any circumstances, legally be transferred to a new computer, you likely need to budget for a new Windows license too - or plan on going with one of the many capable and free versions of Linux. That means you cannot just take an old drive that includes Windows out of an old computer, put it in a new computer and be good to go legally.
> 
> ...


Lol, all that bells and whistles - keyboards mice or what made me laugh on the floor - windows license - is NOT obligle components.


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## newtekie1 (Dec 2, 2020)

RiverFlows73 said:


> Hmm.. I don't know if a 80+ gold will fit in the budget.. would a bronze be decent enough?



There is nothing wrong with going with a 80+ Bronze PSU, as long as it is a good quality unit.  The EVGA 700 BQ is a decent Bronze unit.



RiverFlows73 said:


> BTW I am on a budget... I'm trying to keep the pc, monitor, keyboard, mouse, basically everything combined for lower than $700... I hope thats possible



That is going to be an extremely tight budget for everything.  The best I could go with decent components that I trust is about $750.  https://pcpartpicker.com/list/nqtkj2

And that doesn't include a Windows license.  But those can be had for very cheap from those cheap key sites or free if you have an old Win7 key laying around...


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## Bill_Bright (Dec 2, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> Lol, all that bells and whistles - keyboards mice or what made me laugh on the floor - windows license - is NOT obligle components.



I fail to see your point or why you think anything is a laughing matter. The OP specifically included in his opening post, the keyboard and mouse (and monitor), along with the PC in his less than $700 budget. 

As for Windows licenses, complying with the legally binding terms we all agree to abide by when we decide to use Windows after first boot is indeed a legal (and moral) obligation. That's regardless your own moral values about ripping off a company, or honoring terms of agreements you make.


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## milewski1015 (Dec 2, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> Since most Windows licenses are OEM/System Builders licenses, and since those OEM/SB licenses cannot, under any circumstances, legally be transferred to a new computer


Doesn't linking your Windows license to your Microsoft account allow you to do just that?

I agree with Bill: fitting keyboard, monitor, and mouse in addition to the PC into a $700 budget is quite tricky unless you really scour the used market. Saving a bit more to up your budget will provide you better quality components out of the gate, and allow you to not cut corners on parts that, if selected properly, can last for years through multiple builds. I tried to get a $700 list together and couldn't without making some questionable decisions. The $1000 budget is a good recommendation, here's a list meeting that budget I threw together: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/PZyL4d

- CPU: Ryzen 5 3600 - A versatile choice as it provides adequate gaming performance with strong multi-core performance. Good luck getting ahold of it around it's $200 MSRP.
- Cooler: Stock - Free is good. Won't be the coolest or quietest but it does its job.
- Motherboard: MSI B550-A Pro - The spiritual successor to the highly recommended B450 Tomahawk. That board sold like hotcakes because it was reasonably priced, had solid power delivery components and VRM heatsinks, as well as a solid feature-set; the B550-A Pro does the same for B550. Lacks some bells and whistles, sure, but provides you with PCIe 4.0 capabilities and is compatible with a 5000-series upgrade down the road.
- RAM: Crucial Ballistix 3200 C16 - Basically guaranteed Micron E-die which should easily let you overclock this up to DDR4-3600, the sweet spot for Zen 2.
- Storage: WD Blue SN550 1TB - Again I agree with Bill, 250 GBs is way to small for a single drive-solution these days. With some games larger than 100+ GBs (cough CoD cough), 250GB will fill up extremely fast. A 1TB SSD is a happy medium between a reasonable price as well as sufficient capacity. The SN550 is a solid NVMe drive, and, although current games don't take advantage of NVMe speeds to decrease load times, future games might given that both Sony and Microsoft's new consoles tout NVMe SSDs.
- GPU: Nvidia 1650 Super - As mentioned above in the CPU bullet, buying silicon products right now is generally an absolute shit show thanks to scalpers of the new CPUs and graphics cards, increased demand for PC components, etc. The 1650 Super is for sure a lower-end card, but I couldn't squeeze anything more powerful into the $1000 budget without sufficient compromise. The MSI Gaming X I chose here is more of a placeholder for a model with a decent cooler, and me trying to select a model based on PCPP-listed price is impossible at the moment due to awful availability.
- Case: Cooler Master NR600: I was excited as I had originally noticed the NZXT H500 selling for $45 which I originally had in the list, but between crafting the list and writing this post, the listing disappeared from PCPP. The NR600 is a great mesh-fronted budget case, receiving praise from GamersNexus.
- PSU: Seasonic Focus Gold 550W - You can certainly find cheaper decent quality units here that are suitable for a 1650 system, but as Bill mentioned, a good quality PSU can last years. This unit is fully modular, 80+ Gold rated, and fit the $100 budget, as well as being of good quality. It will allow you room for future upgrades as well.
- Monitor: ASUS VP249QGR - Normally I'd recommend the AOC 24G2 ($180 MSRP), but given we're on a budget, the VP249QGR is a good substitute. It's MSRP is $160, so you save some money there, but it comes at the cost of a pretty shitty stand that offers no adjustments. Otherwise, it's a solid budget option - 24" 1080p 144Hz IPS. You could always get a VESA mount at a later date to replace the awful stand.
- Keyboard and Mouse: Forgot to throw this in the write-up originally. Literally just picked a cheapo bundle that'll get the job done. At this tight of a budget, I wouldn't recommend balling out on peripherals out of the gate. They're so easy to upgrade down the line, and because they're so dependent on personal preference, I can't tell you what to buy anyway. When you do decide to upgrade, I would recommend trying to get to someplace like Best Buy or Microcenter if possible to try things out in person to help you decide things like what keyboard switches you want, which mouse fits your mouse grip the best, etc.

Definitely not the only way to throw a system together, and I'm sure others will have different ways of distributing the budget, but I wanted to get an example list made so you could see the improvements an increased budget will bring you.


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## Bill_Bright (Dec 2, 2020)

milewski1015 said:


> Doesn't linking your Windows license to your Microsoft account allow you to do just that?


No. Not unless your license is a full retail license and in that case, you can legally use the same license over and over again AS LONG AS you only use it on one machine at a time. A new computer (or upgraded motherboard) is a new computer. OEM licenses are inextricably tied to the "O"riginal "E"quipment and cannot be transferred. Now for sure, you can change out every other component in your computer - just not the motherboard except as part of a repair and then it must be with an identical board. 


AleXXX666 said:


> I will purchase a LEGAL windows licence for.. say $25. 30. Max. No cent more. $100 for sh@tty Homo Edition? Sorry, they are trying to rip people off.


LOL. And if the brand name was anything other than Microsoft would you feel the same way?   

What if Ikea, or Sony, or Toyota? 

Chances are, if that licenses costs only $25.20, then the seller is not an authorized seller and that license is not legal. It may be a "valid" key and technically work. But that does not make it authorized or legal. And it may not be worth it economically for MS to go after you, but they sure could if they wanted to. Or they sure can invalidate your license - making all but security updates off-limits to you. 

Just because it is Microsoft, that does not make it right to rip them off, even if you do think they are charging too much. You, as a consumer, have options. If you don't like the terms of the end user license agreement (EULA) you absolutely have the option to take your business and money somewhere else and go with a different brand operating system.


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## newtekie1 (Dec 3, 2020)

This thread is not the place to get into a long discussion on the legality of transferring Windows licenses.

The fact is OEM copies of Windows can't legally be transferred from one computer to another. Another fact is that Microsoft activation system allows you to do it.  That's all we need to say, people can take that information and use it however they want.


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## purecain (Dec 3, 2020)

Im not  sure if those ram sticks are E-Die but if you could find some or even older B-Die you will easily be able to oc them with a little voltage.
Ideally your cpu would run at '1800mhz infinity fabric 2000mhz for the XT version of your cpu' and linking this with your memory gives a performance boost.
So you would set your ram to 3600mhz if possible. Lowering the speed of the ram will lower the speed of your infinity fabric.
Apart from that you can pick up a cheap licence on ebay for next to nothing.
Buy a new monitor as theyre so cheap right now. Corsair do some decent cheap Keyboards and mice .
Go for a Seasonic PSU (power supply) and i highly recommend the Thermaltake Versa H22 for a case.
What ever you pick you can always come back here and get help with setting it up.  
As far as transferring a Windows licence, it may work and accept your old code.
Every piece of hardware in your system adds to its Hardware address. Each component adds a number.
When you change too many pieces of hardware at once it makes windows think you have transferred the hard drive to a new unlicensed computer.
Re-adding the code is usually enough but sometimes it doesn't accept it meaning you must buy a new licence.
They are  £10-£20 for a Windows10 Pro licence in the UK.


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 3, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> You broke one of the two cardinal rules when seeking buying advice. The first you met - you stated your budget and that is great!   However, you failed to state the primary purpose for this computer. Will it be used primarily for work and school? Monitoring and updating Facebook? Paying bills, surfing the Internet and checking email? Gaming?
> 
> Speaking of your budget, while $700 is certainly doable, when the keyboard, mouse and monitor must come out of that too, that budget is pretty tight. Plus, it is important to understand new computers typically require their own Windows license. Since most Windows licenses are OEM/System Builders licenses, and since those OEM/SB licenses cannot, under any circumstances, legally be transferred to a new computer, you likely need to budget for a new Windows license too - or plan on going with one of the many capable and free versions of Linux. That means you cannot just take an old drive that includes Windows out of an old computer, put it in a new computer and be good to go legally.
> 
> ...



Wow thanks for the long advice! Currently, with the parts i was planning on buying plus a decent monitor, I've added up the money and it's around the $700 mark. Although after all the advice I've heard from you guys I might change out the PSU, maybe the ram too. That could mean maybe a $800 or $850 budget and I think that would be just fine. 

Oh and on another note, my dad says that I should buy a monitor from bigger companies like Samsung, Acer, Asus, HP, etc. However, there are cheaper options such as domestic brands that are only in my countries' market. (Oh and I'm not from the US so I don't plan on buying things from Amazon)
Is my dad right and should I buy a monitor from bigger companies, or are the "small" companies' monitors reliable enough too? Just you know, like a general opinion on monitors from small companies. BTW, the specs I want are 1080p, and 22-24 inch screen. If possible built in speakers too as I dont have a lot of space on my desk. Also, I don't plan on doing too much gaming on this but I do want the total thing to be able to run games with decent quality. Any recommendations on monitors?


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 3, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> No. Not unless your license is a full retail license and in that case, you can legally use the same license over and over again AS LONG AS you only use it on one machine at a time. A new computer (or upgraded motherboard) is a new computer. OEM licenses are inextricably tied to the "O"riginal "E"quipment and cannot be transferred. Now for sure, you can change out every other component in your computer - just not the motherboard except as part of a repair and then it must be with an identical board.
> LOL. And if the brand name was anything other than Microsoft would you feel the same way?
> 
> What if Ikea, or Sony, or Toyota?
> ...


The deal is not the brand, but the product. Yes, I also say, $700-1000 for Photoshop CS6 (was then days back before cloud subscription trash) was TOO MUCH. They could make a private single use license for same $100, and big corporate edition for their put $1000. The deal is not the brand, the deal is the price. I will buy phone app for, say, $5, but I won’t for $15. It’s PHONE app, not PC software. Maybe my logic is stupid, but that’s it. And I better not say about MS Office prices, or, new subscription piece of “fake office”, lol


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## Athlonite (Dec 3, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> The deal is not the brand, but the product. Yes, I also say, $700-1000 for Photoshop CS6 (was then days back before cloud subscription trash) was TOO MUCH. They could make a private single use license for same $100, and big corporate edition for their put $1000. The deal is not the brand, the deal is the price. I will buy phone app for, say, $5, but I won’t for $15. It’s PHONE app, not PC software. Maybe my logic is stupid, but that’s it. And I better not say about MS Office prices, or, new subscription piece of “fake office”, lol



Why use any of those Calibre Office and Gimp are free and do 99.9% of what those two paid programs do and @Bill_Bright  I've used an OEM license on 3 different mobo's in the same machine MS don't seem to have a problem with it so why should I


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 3, 2020)

Athlonite said:


> Why use any of those Calibre Office and Gimp are free and do 99.9% of what those two paid programs do and @Bill_Bright  I've used an OEM license on 3 different mobo's in the same machine MS don't seem to have a problem with it so why should I


And now the thing is, there is no free alternative to Photoshop, Acrobat and MS Office. So, monopoly time here  I know Gimp, all kinda “office”, “pdf editors” for cheap or free etc., but i just better use MS Paint, wordpad which do on same quality side lol


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## Bill_Bright (Dec 3, 2020)

RiverFlows73 said:


> and should I buy a monitor from bigger companies, or are the "small" companies' monitors reliable enough too?


That's probably impossible for us to answer without knowing specific model numbers. Frankly, your dad's advice could probably be used for just about anything. Sticking with the major brands is typically a "safe" bet that you will get a decent product with a decent warranty and decent support. That does not mean you will get the absolute best product for your money. There are many scenarios when it is better to "_buy local_". 

If me, and I needed to trim the budget today, I would be willing to purchase a cheap, off-brand monitor for now to carry me over for a year or two until I could rebuild my budget for the monitor(s) I really wanted. If going for a budget monitor now means you can get a bigger SSD and better PSU now, I think that would be a wiser decision. 

If my dad was pushing me to go with a major and more expensive brand, I would ask him to pitch in more cash to bump up the budget! 

As far as monitor size, I used to run with two 22" monitors and was very happy with them. Then one died so I upgraded to two 24" monitors. I don't know how I lived with those "little tiny" 22 inch monitors before.  
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





  It's amazing how much bigger and how much more desktop real estate you get with 24 over 22.

As far as your RAM, 8GB is still a decent amount especially with a SSD as the boot drive, and the page file on that boot SSD. And depending on the games you will only occasionally be playing, may be plenty. Still, I personally like to buy all the RAM I think I will ever need during the initial build - just to avoid upgrade compatibility (and availability) issues down the road. So if you can budget for 2 x 8GB for 16GB total, go for it. 

***



AleXXX666 said:


> The deal is not the brand, but the product.


True. But that was not what you were suggesting earlier when you said "_they_" (suggesting Microsoft, the "brand") were "_trying to rip people off"_. And you used that reason to rationalize paying no more than $25. That is clearly a "too good to be true" price IMO, for a legitimate (not the same as authentic) key sold by an authorized retailer. Those keys are typically unused keys from a volume license and by the terms of the volume license agreement (I've bought several), unused keys are not supposed to be split out and sold separately. But they often are.  So authentic (as in working) keys, yes. But legitimate (as in obtained via authorized re-sellers)? No. 


Athlonite said:


> and @Bill_Bright I've used an OEM license on 3 different mobo's in the same machine MS don't seem to have a problem with it so why should I


That's not for me to answer. *I'm no moral judge and I am not the morality cops. And I'm no saint either!* I am just passing along the facts so readers have all the information they need to make "informed decisions".  What people do with that information is their business, not mine. 

I note Microsoft still allows us to upgrade to W10 from W7 and W8.1 too, even though the free upgrade period ended years ago. They could easily modify the code to block the upgrade, but they have left it in. Why? IDK but I suspect it is because they want to keep the MS haters from complaining and  their customers happy  - which is good for business in the long run. 

Frankly, I think $100 for W10 Home is a fair price. Consider Windows 3.0 was released way back in 1990 and cost $149.95. And, it required you already have DOS installed. And we must not forget there are free alternatives. Linux is a great OS and in terms of productivity (as opposed to playing games), is a fully capable OS too. And when it comes to games, there are alternative gaming platforms too. Contrary to what some people may think, Microsoft does not have a monopoly on anything.


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 3, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> That's probably impossible for us to answer without knowing specific model numbers. Frankly, your dad's advice could probably be used for just about anything. Sticking with the major brands is typically a "safe" bet that you will get a decent product with a decent warranty and decent support. That does not mean you will get the absolute best product for your money. There are many scenarios when it is better to "_buy local_".
> 
> If me, and I needed to trim the budget today, I would be willing to purchase a cheap, off-brand monitor for now to carry me over for a year or two until I could rebuild my budget for the monitor(s) I really wanted. If going for a budget monitor now means you can get a bigger SSD and better PSU now, I think that would be a wiser decision.
> 
> ...


Macos is good os for productivity opposed to games. Linux is geek-sex-with-pc-enthusiasist piece of code.


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## purecain (Dec 3, 2020)

RiverFlows73 said:


> the specs I want are 1080p, and 22-24 inch screen. If possible built in speakers too as I dont have a lot of space on my desk. Also, I don't plan on doing too much gaming on this but I do want the total thing to be able to run games with decent quality. Any recommendations on monitors?


I cant help but suggest a tv with that budget. 
How about something like this, if you dont mind 60hz and a big screen ON THE WALL i have a Sony Bravia XD85 55inch for sale, i could ship to you. PM me for a price and we can go through the sellers section of this forum. 

Otherwise i'd say to look at tv's with HDMI2.1 - HDMI2.2 as these all have the bandwidth to run 4k@120hz.

The prices at the moment are ridiculously low. 

If you could place one on the wall in front of you, I can tell you it is a special kind of enjoyable experience. Cinematic almost, I know monitors have very low lag(1-8ms) but these 120hz TV's offer 8ms Grey to Grey which is pretty good for such large screens. 

I went  from Samsung 18"60hz to 24", 40", Sony 55" to LG 65"120hz and i absolutely love the larger TV screens. A monitor at this size would be incredible but i dont have £3000 for an Nvidia BFG. 








						ASUS ROG Swift 65" 4K 144Hz G-SYNC Ultimate DisplayHDR1000 Big Format Gaming Display
					

Buy from Scan - 65" ASUS ROG Swift PG65UQ 4K 144Hz, VA, 3840x2160 4ms, G-SYNC Ultimate, HDR, 4000:1, 1000cd/m², DisplayPort/HDMI/USB




					www.scan.co.uk
				




Let me know you can get any of the new Samsung TV's which have HDMI2.2 in  your area and their price? Like i say they are really cheap in the EU atm. 

Otherwise if you cant mount to the wall, I'd look for a curved wide screen monitor for your desk.


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 4, 2020)

purecain said:


> I cant help but suggest a tv with that budget.
> How about something like this, if you dont mind 60hz and a big screen ON THE WALL i have a Sony Bravia XD85 55inch for sale, i could ship to you. PM me for a price and we can go through the sellers section of this forum.
> 
> Otherwise i'd say to look at tv's with HDMI2.1 - HDMI2.2 as these all have the bandwidth to run 4k@120hz.
> ...


 
Thanks but I don't think I'll be using a TV. I already have a 4K TV but it's in the living room and I don't have a lot of space on my desk.


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 4, 2020)

RiverFlows73 said:


> Thanks but I don't think I'll be using a TV. I already have a 4K TV but it's in the living room and I don't have a lot of space on my desk.


Why don’t you want 24” 1440p then? 1080p is so so old now, and not worth purchasing in 2020 unless for really low spec pc.


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 5, 2020)

hmm i heard that 1440 gaming requires a 6gb graphics card... and although I won't playing too much, I will probably play a bit. So I don't wanna suffer because the graphics card can't handle my monitor that well.
 Correct me if I'm wrong.


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 5, 2020)

RiverFlows73 said:


> hmm i heard that 1440 gaming requires a 6gb graphics card... and although I won't playing too much, I will probably play a bit. So I don't wanna suffer because the graphics card can't handle my monitor that well.
> Correct me if I'm wrong.


Call me idiot but I replaced my 1080.60 monitor with 4k.60.. the funny moment is I have 1660 Super only, lol. I also heard I need 8-10 GB VRAM to run games at 4K. Woow, what you think? It will depend WHAT games you will play! Unoptimized or highly demanding games like Control/RDR2/Rust/Detroit Become Human etc. of course will require you to have 2080 Ti at least to run them normally at 4K, but.. what if you play Fortnite, CSGO and so on? Not my case, but same - games are few years old and don’t need crazy GPU to play. So don’t trust these “sofa analytics”, unless you have found the proofs (tests on youtube for example) that your favourite game requires this and that to run perfectly at some resolution


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## ixi (Dec 5, 2020)

purecain said:


> I cant help but suggest a tv with that budget.
> How about something like this, if you dont mind 60hz and a big screen ON THE WALL i have a Sony Bravia XD85 55inch for sale, i could ship to you. PM me for a price and we can go through the sellers section of this forum.
> 
> Otherwise i'd say to look at tv's with HDMI2.1 - HDMI2.2 as these all have the bandwidth to run 4k@120hz.
> ...


Off topic small.

I have KD-65XE9305
Great tv with good options , but I'm disappointed in their presets torwards. Ps4 and ps5 looks amazing. When I connect nintendo switch or xbox... it looks like garbage with pre-built. There are so many options to change which affects quality, tried changing them but in the vail... Out of my league as I didnt achieve what I wanted or just it's sony. "Dont buy other crap, buy only our stuff".

Few times did connect pc and played games on 4K, that looked  freaking C______C nice, but wondered if it was f***** as well because of sony presets but quality was saved because od 4K..


Back to the monitors.

Look at specific models for comparison. Check nearests deals.


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## Valantar (Dec 5, 2020)

I'm a bit late to the game here, but OP, if you're looking for RAM for Ryzen, get any Crucial Ballistix with "AES" in the part number (just before the letters indicating the color at the end) - those are (at least from what I've seen and been told) all Micron E-die. My Ballistix Sport LT BLS2K8G4D32AESBK  2*8GB 3200C16 hit 3800C16 with no problems on my Renoir HTPC.

As for monitors: unless you're doing productivity work (i.e. something where more pixel real estate will let you see more/do more), 1080p is perfect for a budget gaming setup. No reason to go higher than that - you'll just end up needing to game at a lower resolution than native or reduce details more than necessary to keep up with the higher workload for your GPU. I would stay away from 1080p60 though - there are decent, cheap 1080p75 FreeSync displays out there these days, and even 75Hz is visibly much smoother than 60Hz. Of course if you can afford it, 120 or 144 is even better. As for specific monitors, you'll need to see what's available to you and then check out reviews of those - there's no spec sheet data point that will tell you if a monitor is good or bad. Different LCD panels handle colors, motion clarity etc. very, very differently, and in budget price ranges you'll need to make some sort of compromise no matter what. Reading reviews will let you make the most informed decision possible. And as has been said above, large brands typically means better service and support, but that doesn't mean that smaller brands are necessarily garbage.


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 5, 2020)

Valantar said:


> I'm a bit late to the game here, but OP, if you're looking for RAM for Ryzen, get any Crucial Ballistix with "AES" in the part number (just before the letters indicating the color at the end) - those are (at least from what I've seen and been told) all Micron E-die. My Ballistix Sport LT BLS2K8G4D32AESBK  2*8GB 3200C16 hit 3800C16 with no problems on my Renoir HTPC.
> 
> As for monitors: unless you're doing productivity work (i.e. something where more pixel real estate will let you see more/do more), 1080p is perfect for a budget gaming setup. No reason to go higher than that - you'll just end up needing to game at a lower resolution than native or reduce details more than necessary to keep up with the higher workload for your GPU. I would stay away from 1080p60 though - there are decent, cheap 1080p75 FreeSync displays out there these days, and even 75Hz is visibly much smoother than 60Hz. Of course if you can afford it, 120 or 144 is even better. As for specific monitors, you'll need to see what's available to you and then check out reviews of those - there's no spec sheet data point that will tell you if a monitor is good or bad. Different LCD panels handle colors, motion clarity etc. very, very differently, and in budget price ranges you'll need to make some sort of compromise no matter what. Reading reviews will let you make the most informed decision possible. And as has been said above, large brands typically means better service and support, but that doesn't mean that smaller brands are necessarily garbage.


1080.120 is rare now, unless it’s some new china no-name crap. 1080.144 is money-waste in 2020-2021: you can get 1440.75 for same money, and we are comparing good quality branded monitors lol. So yes, for cheap, 1080.75 is best, but I wouldn’t say that 60 hz is trash. Compare cheap crap 1080.60 to Dell/HP/Lenovo Professional with same 1080.60 monitors - and you should be blind to say it’s no difference.


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## Valantar (Dec 5, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> 1080.120 is rare now, unless it’s some new china no-name crap. 1080.144 is money-waste in 2020-2021: you can get 1440.75 for same money, and we are comparing good quality branded monitors lol. So yes, for cheap, 1080.75 is best, but I wouldn’t say that 60 hz is trash. Compare cheap crap 1080.60 to Dell/HP/Lenovo Professional with same 1080.60 monitors - and you should be blind to say it’s no difference.


I didn't say it was trash, but a decent 75hz panel will look smoother than _any_ 60hz panel. IMO, given the OP's desired display size (24"-ish), budget/GPU choice and use case, 1440p has little going for it. If they were looking for a 27" monitor or were spending >$1000 on the PC 1440p would be a better choice, but going for a 1440p display with a GPU that can handle that resolution only in esports games is not a good idea - it's not like games in the future will become less demanding, after all. 1080p144 gives a lot of room to adjust things to get a good experience, while 1440p75 leaves a rather narrow window in which performance is good enough.


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 5, 2020)

Valantar said:


> I didn't say it was trash, but a decent 75hz panel will look smoother than _any_ 60hz panel. IMO, given the OP's desired display size (24"-ish), budget/GPU choice and use case, 1440p has little going for it. If they were looking for a 27" monitor or were spending >$1000 on the PC 1440p would be a better choice, but going for a 1440p display with a GPU that can handle that resolution only in esports games is not a good idea - it's not like games in the future will become less demanding, after all. 1080p144 gives a lot of room to adjust things to get a good experience, while 1440p75 leaves a rather narrow window in which performance is good enough.


1080.144 is also demanding leaving in future to go to 1080.60 LOL


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## Valantar (Dec 5, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> 1080.144 is also demanding leaving in future to go to 1080.60 LOL


And? Is that somehow worse than 1440p30 in the same time frame? 1080p60 is still perfectly playable after all. Going higher resolution forces GPU upgrades earlier, which going by the OP's budget might not be feasible. A 144Hz monitor gives you a wide range of playable framerates, a 75Hz one gives you a very narrow one. The former is thus obviously a better long-term investment, and will match the rest of your hardware better for longer. Now, I love my 1440p monitor, but I tend to spend a lot more on GPUs than the OP, and also need the screen real estate for work.


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 6, 2020)

Oh i hear ya! Thanks! I might think of getting a 1440 monitor if I can find one with a decent price tag. i did feel that 24inch 1080p monitors had bigger pixels.. so I might get a 1440p monitor. Thanks for the advise!


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 6, 2020)

Valantar said:


> And? Is that somehow worse than 1440p30 in the same time frame? 1080p60 is still perfectly playable after all. Going higher resolution forces GPU upgrades earlier, which going by the OP's budget might not be feasible. A 144Hz monitor gives you a wide range of playable framerates, a 75Hz one gives you a very narrow one. The former is thus obviously a better long-term investment, and will match the rest of your hardware better for longer. Now, I love my 1440p monitor, but I tend to spend a lot more on GPUs than the OP, and also need the screen real estate for work.


Estate of 1440p is NOTHING. We have got 2 1080p monitors. My wife’s monitor became dimmer so I’ve got 1440p new one for her. The main “estate” coming from horizontal pixels here. But I wasn’t very impressed and got 2160p for myself then. Excel spreadsheets, web-surfing, photo works, watching some nature content for fun in YouTube - here is massive 4x1080p screens packed in one. I also thought that 1440p is “so so big”, but now I saw in same product line-up (new Dell S series), i got 4k one which was just ~$100 more than 2k. 
now returning what is long-term investment for OP in 2020: OP is CASUAL player, so GAMES are second position here, not the priority. Why to go with still 1080p leaving yourself without more screen estate then, and as I said about smoothness, go get not-cheapest-brand monotor and you have perfect 60hz picture (Professional or multimedia monitor line-ups, hello).
As about GPU upgrades, 1440p is no A LOT more demanding than 1080p, if you again not want that “gaming 144+ Hz”. 1440.75 is perfect combo for budget now, nice long-term investment, and not very demanding for GPU. Unless we are talking about IGP or 1650 Super, 1440p is OK for modern midrangers.
I have 1660 Super and running GTA V at HIGH settings was EASY in 1440p. Just forget that MSAA sh@t as you have more pixels by resolution already, and turning just A LITTLE settings down gives me SOLID 60-75 fps at 4k!!! And GTA V is not same system requirer as a CSGO, for example.



RiverFlows73 said:


> Oh i hear ya! Thanks! I might think of getting a 1440 monitor if I can find one with a decent price tag. i did feel that 24inch 1080p monitors had bigger pixels.. so I might get a 1440p monitor. Thanks for the advise!


We have 27” 1440p replaced from old small 23” 1080p, and no any pixels are popping to eyes  if you want density, get 24” 1440p.


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## biffzinker (Dec 6, 2020)

newtekie1 said:


> There is nothing wrong with going with a 80+ Bronze PSU, as long as it is a good quality unit. The EVGA 700 BQ is a decent Bronze unit.


I have the EVGA 850 watt BQ, and it's been a stable, and quiet (fan noise) power supply for me.


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## Valantar (Dec 6, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> Estate of 1440p is NOTHING. We have got 2 1080p monitors. My wife’s monitor became dimmer so I’ve got 1440p new one for her. The main “estate” coming from horizontal pixels here. But I wasn’t very impressed and got 2160p for myself then. Excel spreadsheets, web-surfing, photo works, watching some nature content for fun in YouTube - here is massive 4x1080p screens packed in one. I also thought that 1440p is “so so big”, but now I saw in same product line-up (new Dell S series), i got 4k one which was just ~$100 more than 2k.
> now returning what is long-term investment for OP in 2020: OP is CASUAL player, so GAMES are second position here, not the priority. Why to go with still 1080p leaving yourself without more screen estate then, and as I said about smoothness, go get not-cheapest-brand monotor and you have perfect 60hz picture (Professional or multimedia monitor line-ups, hello).
> As about GPU upgrades, 1440p is no A LOT more demanding than 1080p, if you again not want that “gaming 144+ Hz”. 1440.75 is perfect combo for budget now, nice long-term investment, and not very demanding for GPU. Unless we are talking about IGP or 1650 Super, 1440p is OK for modern midrangers.
> I have 1660 Super and running GTA V at HIGH settings was EASY in 1440p. Just forget that MSAA sh@t as you have more pixels by resolution already, and turning just A LITTLE settings down gives me SOLID 60-75 fps at 4k!!! And GTA V is not same system requirer as a CSGO, for example.


Dude, what's with the aggression? Please chill out.

Also, what you're saying here doesn't make much sense - you're arguing as if I'm saying there's no reason to go beyond 1080p, which it should be pretty clear I haven't said - I've just said that doing so makes no sense for a budget gaming setup. You're arguing that the increased screen real estate from 1440p vs. 1080p is "NOTHING", yet you are also arguing for the value of the increase in screen real estate from 1440p to 2160p. Yes, the increase from the next resolution down is _bigger _(125% vs. 78%), and obviously the increase from 1080p is much larger (...) but that doesn't take away from the fact that a 78% increase in pixel real estate is quite massive for productivity, including the vertical axis (1440 vs. 1080 pixels is definitely not nothing). (Of course 2160p at 24" or even 27" requires some sort of scaling, which loses a chunk of that work area advantage.) I entirely agree that 2160p is even better for productivity, but so what? From what the OP has said here so far, there's no reason to suggest a UHD monitor for their use and budget.

Oh, and ...


AleXXX666 said:


> Unless we are talking about IGP or 1650 Super, 1440p is OK for modern midrangers.


Did you even read the OP's component list? A 1650 Super is exactly what they're going for.

The only thing the OP has said about this PC is that it will be used for gaming, but not _that_ much, and that they are stretching their ~$700 budget to ~$850. With a 1650 Super - without buying used I doubt they can find better within their budget range. It would seem they aren't very interested in productivity, as it stands to reason they would mention any important requirements in that regard. The 1650S is _much_ less powerful than your 1660 Super, so just because yours can handle GTA V at that resolution doesn't mean the 1650 S can do so. Does that mean that gaming at 1440p with a 1650S is impossible? Of course not. But even at lowered settings you'll really be stretching the capabilities of the GPU, and you'll be forcing a choice between visibly lowering settings, lowering rendering resolution (losing sharpness), or running at unplayable frame rates in most games. Esports games should obviously be fine, as most of those can run on a potato. But if they're into esports titles, they'll get more enjoyment out of a higher refresh rate than a higher resolution.


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 6, 2020)

Wow I've learned a lot from you guys! Thanks! For me, regarding my small budget, I think I'll try and go for a 1080p 60+hz if I can find one. I was thinking of getting a 1440p, but just felt that I didn't really have too may options on the site I'm buying on. Also, for watching movies or etc that might be better with 4K screens, I do already have a UHD LG TV in the living room. It's just that it's for family use, and I want to have my monitor in my room.  

Again, thanks for the advice!


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## Bill_Bright (Dec 6, 2020)

RiverFlows73 said:


> Also, for watching movies or etc that might be better with 4K screens


Just remember there really is not a whole lot of content in 4K. So 4K on the computer for movies should not be a priority, IMO.


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 6, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> Just remember there really is not a whole lot of content in 4K. So 4K on the computer for movies should not be a priority, IMO.


For free - yes, limited content. If anyone likes to use paid services like Netflix, I believe there is. But 4K for photos.. is beauty. As they could be even bigger than 3840*2160, so this means less scrolling and zooming, more enjoying of quality picture, as did I.


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## Bill_Bright (Dec 6, 2020)

Even paid is limited with Netflix compared to all their other content. Plus, 4K with Netflix costs more per month than other subscriptions. And while I love my 4k UHD OLED TV, if the movie is any good, 5 minutes after it starts, the extra beauty of 4K over standard HD Blue-ray disappears - especially with a decent surround sound system attached. 

I am not saying 4K is not worth it, just saying it is not a "must have" by any means.


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 6, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> require their own Windows license. Since most Windows licenses are OEM/System Builders licenses, and since those OEM/SB licenses cannot, under any circumstances, legally be transferred to a new computer, you likely need to budget for a new Windows license too


uhhh you failed to mention windows can run without a license its just its VISUAL settings are locked away
Also 240g ssd getting full quickly also what are you putting on your ssd My 200g ssd has 100g free after a bunch of apps and windows
and then i installed forza and its got 20 g free WHICH IS Still plenty ive done crystal disk tests
Overall this may sound annoying but its just a bunch of things i feel you should have mention


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## Bill_Bright (Dec 6, 2020)

Isaac` said:


> uhhh you failed to mention windows can run without a license its just its VISUAL settings are locked away


 I did not fail to mention anything. Absolutely nothing in my comments had anything to do with functionality. It was all about complying with license agreements, or not. 

That said, pretty sure your claim is not true anyway. It may work for 30 days, and it may still run in a limited way after that. But once that period is over it will be more than its "VISUAL" settings that are not enabled.


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 6, 2020)

I did not have the money to buy a copy of windows so I ran unactivated for months and It was visual only canan confirm


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## Rei (Dec 6, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> That said, pretty sure your claim is not true anyway. It may work for 30 days, and it may still run in a limited way after that. But once that period is over it will be more than its "VISUAL" settings that are not enabled.





Isaac` said:


> I did not have the money to buy a copy of windows so I ran unactivated for months and It was visual only canan confirm


Can confirm what Isaac said is true. I have installed Win10 Pro 32-bit since September last year just to test on my desktop PC temporarily, so I didn't buy a product activation key & to this day, Win10 is still functioning properly without a product activation key with only the visual altering settings disabled (which includes inability to change wallpaper) as well as a watermark to "Activate Windows" constantly present at the bottom right corner of the desktop. All other components that I have tried & tested seems to be working as intended which includes Windows Updates & virus definition updates (or Security Intelligence as Windows Defender Antivirus calls it).
Haven't gotten around on replacing the 32-bit Win10 with 64-bit as well as purchasing a license key yet.


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## Caring1 (Dec 6, 2020)

There's really no reason not to activate Windows when a Key can be bought so cheaply from sites such as this advertised in the News section.









						KeysOff Presents Cyber Week Sale on Discounted Genuine Software
					

KeysOff presented its Cyber Week Sale, with the store's lowest prices of the year on discounted genuine software; letting you spend more on your next-generation gaming PC hardware, by saving big on genuine software. Get Genuine Windows 10 Pro for just $7.45. Break from the shackles of annual...




					www.techpowerup.com


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## Rei (Dec 6, 2020)

Caring1 said:


> There's really no reason not to activate Windows when a Key can be bought so cheaply from sites such as this advertised in the News section.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If this is in reply to my post (& Isaac's), as I have said mentioned for my case, at the time, I was just testing out Win10 & I haven't gotten around to phasing it out. I will purchase the activation key together with switching out to 64-bit, so thank you for the link. Much appreciate it.


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## Caring1 (Dec 6, 2020)

Rei said:


> If this is in reply to my post (& Isaac's)


It does come across a bit like an advertisement doesn't it.
Sorry about that, it was in reply to the previous posts.


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## Rei (Dec 6, 2020)

Caring1 said:


> It does come across a bit like an advertisement doesn't it.
> Sorry about that, it was in reply to the previous posts.


Don't worry about it.

Wait... Is this a limited time offer???


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 6, 2020)

Rei said:


> (which includes inability to change wallpaper)


You can circumvent this by just right clicking an image lol


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 7, 2020)

Caring1 said:


> There's really no reason not to activate Windows when a Key can be bought so cheaply from sites such as this advertised in the News section.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


CHEAP OEM KEYS?
I know, I know, some time later you will have “boom” - license invalid. Otherwise, why someone will sell $100 stuff for $10 or close to that LMFAO


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## Caring1 (Dec 7, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> CHEAP OEM KEYS?
> I know, I know, some time later you will have “boom” - license invalid. Otherwise, why someone will sell $100 stuff for $10 or close to that LMFAO


I've been using them without issue for over a year now.


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 7, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> I know, I know, some time later you will have “boom” - license invalid


i got a cheap oem licence for windows 7 close to launch IT STILL valid


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## biffzinker (Dec 7, 2020)

Isaac` said:


> i got a cheap oem licence for windows 7 close to launch IT STILL valid


Reminds me of the Windows 8 Professional key I bought from Microsoft for $39.99.


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## Hyderz (Dec 7, 2020)

correct me if im wrong but isnt there an amd gpu thats cheaper and faster than the 1650 super?


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 7, 2020)

The 5500 xt is close as well as the 580


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## Rei (Dec 7, 2020)

Isaac` said:


> You can circumvent this by just right clicking an image lol


Well, that worked. Makes me wonder why I haven't tried it before. Thanks for that.


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## AleXXX666 (Dec 7, 2020)

Caring1 said:


> I've been using them without issue for over a year now.


I know, “this and that”, there are mixed reviews, but, again, very doubtful purchase, if official price from developer is $100, why EVEN buy something from “cheerful mr. Bean” for price heaven away from official? Like to donate scramblers?


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## Valantar (Dec 7, 2020)

I've bought several W10 keys from the sites that advertise here on TPU, and have had zero issues. The only "issue" I've had is that I once bought two licenses together, which apparently used the same key, and initially activated one. When I went to activate the other something like a year later, it didn't work. So I guess I lost something like ... $7? Yeah, I don't see the problem. None of the ones I've activated have ever been deactivated. And besides, with a $10 licence you could re-activate it every year for a decade before reaching the cost of a full price licence.


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## kayjay010101 (Dec 7, 2020)

AleXXX666 said:


> I know, “this and that”, there are mixed reviews, but, again, very doubtful purchase, if official price from developer is $100, why EVEN buy something from “cheerful mr. Bean” for price heaven away from official? Like to donate scramblers?


Can someone translate this into legible english for me?


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## Rei (Dec 7, 2020)

kayjay010101 said:


> Can someone translate this into legible english for me?


LOL!!! I think he is rather skeptical that a $100 software could be sold for much cheaper at a third-party store & that there would be strings attached.

@AleXXX666 To my understanding, the license keys are unsold/unused keys that were purchased by companies & business of various degrees (likely due to overbuying) which were than sold to third party places. It's a fairly common practice. So these keys are in a way; second-hand goods but still considered new. Of course I dunno if this is also the case with TPU's license keys offering. This is also only one such practice, there may be other means/reasons that these keys are sold for cheap & certainly it does not mean that it is illegal... Most of the time anyway...


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## milewski1015 (Dec 7, 2020)

Isaac` said:


> uhhh you failed to mention windows can run without a license its just its VISUAL settings are locked away
> Also 240g ssd getting full quickly also what are you putting on your ssd My 200g ssd has 100g free after a bunch of apps and windows
> and then i installed forza and its got 20 g free WHICH IS Still plenty ive done crystal disk tests
> Overall this may sound annoying but its just a bunch of things i feel you should have mention


And you failed to mention running Windows without activating it is strictly against MS ToS:

"*5.      Authorized Software and Activation.* You are authorized to use this software *only if you are properly licensed and the software has been properly activated with a genuine product key or by other authorized method.* When you connect to the Internet while using the software, the software will automatically contact Microsoft or its affiliate to conduct activation to associate it with a certain device. You can also activate the software manually by Internet or telephone. In either case, transmission of certain information will occur, and Internet, telephone and SMS service charges may apply. During activation (or reactivation that may be triggered by changes to your device’s components), the software may determine that the installed instance of the software is counterfeit, improperly licensed or includes unauthorized changes. If activation fails, the software will attempt to repair itself by replacing any tampered Microsoft software with genuine Microsoft software. You may also receive reminders to obtain a proper license for the software. Successful activation does not confirm that the software is genuine or properly licensed. *You may not bypass or circumvent activation.* To help determine if your software is genuine and whether you are properly licensed, see (aka.ms/genuine). Certain updates, support, and other services might only be offered to users of genuine Microsoft software."


			https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Useterms/OEM/Windows/10/UseTerms_OEM_Windows_10_English.htm
		


@Bill_Bright the following section makes it seem as though MS allows to you transfer the license to a new device as long as the transfer isn't being used to share the license between devices that you own. I don't see any mention of the device having to be the same:

"*b.      Stand-alone software.* If you acquired the software as stand-alone software (and also if you upgraded from software you acquired as stand-alone software), you may transfer the software to another device that belongs to you. You may also transfer the software to a device owned by someone else if (i) you are the first licensed user of the software and (ii) the new user agrees to the terms of this agreement. You may use the backup copy we allow you to make or the media that the software came on to transfer the software. Every time you transfer the software to a new device, you must remove the software from the prior device. You may not transfer the software to share licenses between devices."


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 7, 2020)

milewski1015 said:


> And you failed to mention running Windows without activating it is strictly against MS ToS:


Im sorry so your saying using a feature of windows that was included by Microsoft is against the TOS yeahhhh that makes reallllllyyyy scene
 considering when this WAS valid in the older days of windows you couldn't run the os with out activating it so this is clearly invalid win 7? and


milewski1015 said:


> "*b. Stand-alone software*


this only applys if it is a windows home key and NOT a oem key there is a difference 




aha seems you dident read it * 
Applicability.* This agreement applies to the Windows software that is preinstalled on your device, or acquired from a retailer and installed by you, the media on which you received the software (if any), any fonts, icons, images or sound files included with the software, and also any Microsoft updates, upgrades, supplements or services for the software, unless other terms come with them. It also applies to Windows apps developed by Microsoft that provide functionality such as mail, contacts, music and photos that are included with and are a part of Windows. If this agreement contains terms regarding a feature or service not available on your device, then those terms do not apply. 
So windows did not come preinstalled on my device therfore this toc does not apply to ME


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## newtekie1 (Dec 7, 2020)

Caring1 said:


> I've been using them without issue for over a year now.



I've used several, I've only had issues twice. But for how cheap they are, if I have to buy one again a year or two down the line, big deal.


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## milewski1015 (Dec 7, 2020)

Isaac` said:


> Im sorry so your saying using a feature of windows that was included by Microsoft is against the TOS yeahhhh that makes reallllllyyyy scene
> considering when this WAS valid in the older days of windows you couldn't run the os with out activating it so this is clearly invalid win 7?


I can't explain why Microsoft lets you install and boot into Windows without an activation key at installation. This video has an interesting perspective on it. I wouldn't call it a 'feature' though. They have to know many people just choose to sacrifice the customization options and run it without proper activation.  



Isaac` said:


> this only applys if it is a windows home key and NOT a oem key there is a difference





Isaac` said:


> aha seems you dident read it





Isaac` said:


> So windows did not come preinstalled on my device therfore this toc does not apply to ME



Seems like you're the one that didn't read: 
"*5. Authorized Software and Activation.* You are authorized to use this software *only if you are properly licensed and the software has been properly activated with a genuine product key or by other authorized method...You may not bypass or circumvent activation. *
I went to the trouble to bold the points of note and it seems you skipped over the entire first excerpt (talking about activation) that was directed at you. The second excerpt (that talks about transferring licenses between devices) was directed at Bill.

"*a.      Applicability.* This agreement applies to the Windows software that is preinstalled on your device, *or acquired from a retailer and installed by you*..."

I specifically linked the OEM Windows 10 license ToS as you can see by the link: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/*Useterms/OEM/Windows/10/UseTerms_OEM_Windows_10_English*.htm

The above applicability blub is also present in the retail Windows 10 license ToS: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/*Useterms/Retail/Windows/10/UseTerms_Retail_Windows_10_English*.htm

You're also confusing different Windows editions (Home, Pro, Enterprise, Education, etc.) with different Windows 10 licenses (OEM, Retail, Volume, Academic Volume, etc.).


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 7, 2020)

Use your brain In xp its not possible to boot into os so obv not activating there is against tos
but when windows 10 doesnt require acitvation to run


milewski1015 said:


> can't explain why Microsoft lets you install and boot into Windows without an activation key at installation. This video has an interesting perspective on it. I wouldn't call it a 'feature' though. They have to know many people just choose to sacrifice the customization options and run it without proper activation.


seriously they wouldn't let you do it if its not aloud Hence xp wont let you boot os


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## milewski1015 (Dec 7, 2020)

Isaac` said:


> Use your brain In xp its not possible to boot into os so obv not activating there is against tos
> but when windows 10 doesnt require acitvation to run
> 
> seriously they wouldn't let you do it if its not aloud Hence xp wont let you boot os


I understand that XP required an activation key. Again, I can't explain why MS changed that with Windows 10. The video I linked provided an interesting theory as to why that is, apparently you didn't watch it. To sum up, MS may be willing to prioritize the revenue from Windows Store purchases and other things implemented into Windows 10 than try and squeeze out every dollar from users. They still make money on volume academic and enterprise licenses. 

All I pointed out was that it's technically listed in the ToS that you are not allowed to run Windows without activating it. It doesn't say you're unable to. The same way it has the warning at the beginning of movies that you'll get hit with up to 5 years in prison and up to a $250,000 fine if you reproduce or distribute the movie without authorization. That doesn't mean it's not possible though...


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## Hachi_Roku256563 (Dec 7, 2020)

milewski1015 said:


> To sum up, MS may be willing to prioritize the revenue from Windows Store purchases and other things implemented into Windows


this is true why do you think windows 10 is going to be the last majour version of windows and just have indefinite updates 
also distrubiting a dvd requires external tools computer ect
however you can run unactiavted windows for nothing i do believe Microsoft treats it as a trail


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## milewski1015 (Dec 7, 2020)

Isaac` said:


> this is true why do you think windows 10 is going to be the last majour version of windows and just have indefinite updates
> also distrubiting a dvd requires external tools computer ect
> however you can run unactiavted windows for nothing i do believe Microsoft treats it as a trail


Agreed, they've moved to the "freemium" model. Using the media creation tool to create a bootable USB also requires another computer as well. It's clear they consider it a form of trial (hence the limited personalization features like theme, screensaver, etc. that are locked behind the activation paywall). I would be interested to hear MS's response to the fact that many people just continue to use this "trial" version. 
Regardless, we've derailed this thread enough. Sounds like we've come to a consensus.


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## HammerON (Dec 7, 2020)

Enough chatter about Windows 10.  The OP should have enough information at this point in regards to the OS.


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 8, 2020)

HammerON said:


> Enough chatter about Windows 10.  The OP should have enough information at this point in regards to the OS.


lol yes i do. i was gonna buy a proper one anyways tho


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 10, 2020)

B450 or B550 and why? Please suggest specific models too! Thanks 

Oh and is the ASRock B550M Pro4 worth buying?


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## ebivan (Dec 11, 2020)

Right now you can get b550 for the same price as b450 boards. So its basically a no brainer to get the newer one. With b550 you will have pcie 4 support for gpu and ssd even if you dont have pcie 4 capable components right now, it might be valuable for some future upgrade.

I cannot suggest specific models as there is a pretty big price range even for one chip(set).

rule of thumb, if you don't overclock your cpu and just need a board to plug in a cpu, an ssd and a gpu, you can basically get any b550 board.
if you plan on overclocking the cpu, it gets a lot harder to find a board that has good vrms.

if you need some more specific stuff like wifi, 10gbe, more m.2 slots, a specific sound codec or any special childish rgb stuff, well go find a board that has what you need.

as for the brands, well that's a personal opinion and 10 people here will offer at least 11 different opinions.
my personal opinion is that biostar and msi are shit, so i would recommend asrock, asus or gigabyte.
but as i said, there are many opinions and many people here are doing well with msi for example.


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## EarthDog (Dec 11, 2020)

B550. Out of the box it supports 3000 series processors and with a flash 5000 series. B550 is, generally, more expensive than B450 last I checked, but they are also, generally, better in many ways. Power delivery is better... PCIe 4.0 support... etc.

As far as the Pro4, it's cheap. I'd prefer the Giga B550m Aorus Pro over the ASRock Pro4...especially if you plan on putting a beefy chip on there and overclocking (board is cheap, but capable). But we don't know that, nor your budget, uses, etc... so it's tough to go beyond shotgun help.

EDIT: That said, I'm not sure why this is a different thread from your build thread... this is all about choosing the parts for your build...


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## RiverFlows73 (Dec 12, 2020)

Huh Should I have just stayed here..? Cuz I did post a new thread regarding my newly considered parts. (although im looking to cut some prices and thats why im here)


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