# Ivy Upgrade



## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Instead of dragging this thread further[/URL], I've decided to make a new one that will be more on topic.

So I have decided to update to Ivy Bridge. Combing through reviews, I've settled on the following components:

Intel Core i7 3770K
AsRock Z77 Extreme11
Thermalright Silver Arrow SB-E

Rest of the hardware will remain as per my system specs; I am aware that my GPU is rather old but I can update that at a later date (read: next paycheck).

Any thoughts on this constellation? I would throw everything into a Corsair 540 case, which seems to barely accept that Thermalright behemoth, clearance wise. Overclocking, intense gaming, benchmarking and crunching will be done. I'm open to suggestions, especially about CPU coolers. WC-Kits like the Corsair H are not an option, as well as custom loops. Not at this time, at least.


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## Chetkigaming (Dec 9, 2013)

i`ve decided upgrade to TeraScale 2
look: Amd radeon hd 5970
i7 950
asus mobo
hdd( when ssd came out to the market i`ll definitely get one.


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## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Uh, ok, good for you.


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## Frick (Dec 9, 2013)

Why not Haswell?


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## RCoon (Dec 9, 2013)

Frick said:


> Why not Haswell?


 
^ This ^


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## puma99dk| (Dec 9, 2013)

RCoon said:


> ^ This ^



maybe bcs not every Haswell is just plug in and run and it's stable?


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## BarbaricSoul (Dec 9, 2013)

Your current RAM, is it rated for 1.5 volts? SB, IB, and Haswell systems only work with 1.5 volt rated RAM IIRC


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## RCoon (Dec 9, 2013)

puma99dk| said:


> maybe bcs not every Haswell is just plug in and run and it's stable?


 
But every Haswell processor is plug and play. Every processor in existence is plug and play and they are all stable.
If a processor isnt stable from the word go then it needs RMA'ing


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## BarbaricSoul (Dec 9, 2013)

Personally, I don't see a problem with opting for the 3770k over the 4770k. Ivy Bridge is a better OC'er,  is only 10% slower than Hawell, and Intel is not going the make another socket 1150 CPU that would be worth upgrading to from either the 47770k or the 3770k, just like they didn't with the 2600k and 3770k.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 9, 2013)

MRCL said:


> Instead of dragging this thread further[/URL], I've decided to make a new one that will be more on topic.
> 
> So I have decided to update to Ivy Bridge. Combing through reviews, I've settled on the following components:
> 
> ...



you could have kept the Megahalems its a pretty good heatsink or go for the HR-02 Macho Rev.A (its what i use on my Xeon E3-1275v2) from review to review the Macho is not far from the SA SB-E and you can also make it work with dual fan setup or like i do (CF: your PC ATM thread) or even switch the TY-147 for the TY-143 2500rpm of the SA SB-E extreme 




as for the mobo good choice i have a Z77 Extreme 4 and its pretty flawless atm (if we except the paper thin pcb of the Ex 4 )


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## RCoon (Dec 9, 2013)

BarbaricSoul said:


> Personally, I don't see a problem with opting for the 3770k over the 4770k. Ivy Bridge is a better OC'er,  is only 10% slower than Hawell, and Intel is not going the make another socket 1150 CPU that would be worth upgrading to from either the 47770k or the 3770k, just like they didn't with the 2600k and 3770k.


 
Personally I'd rather have a 2700K than any other i7. But that's just me.


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## Jetster (Dec 9, 2013)

Haswell over Ivy. If for no other reason just incase they keep the socket and there is more to follow and higher ram speeds. As far as cooling get the H100i


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 9, 2013)

Jetster said:


> Haswell over Ivy. If for no other reason just incase they keep the socket and there is more to follow and higher ram speeds. As far as cooling get the H100i


he wrote no AIO WC  also the Z77 chipset  handle 2800+  for ram (OC rate from ASRock in fact) isn't that enough atm?

also Ivy eat less watts than what he has actually (i went also from a Bloomfield to a Ivy) and Haswell are prone to overheat afaik (harder to cool by any mean and seen on some review +magazines)

also SA SB-E Extreme is more efficient than a H100i (same cost ) but more noisy so the SA SB-E classic should be good and cheaper


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## puma99dk| (Dec 9, 2013)

RCoon said:


> But every Haswell processor is plug and play. Every processor in existence is plug and play and they are all stable.
> If a processor isnt stable from the word go then it needs RMA'ing



well i haven't RMA'et mine and since day one i have battled with it to get stable, and i asked caseking but they never had an issues and i don't wanna buy like 50euro's or something to send it back so i never did it, but mostly i think it's my OS that needs a reinstallation.


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## BarbaricSoul (Dec 9, 2013)

BarbaricSoul said:


> Your current RAM, is it rated for 1.5 volts? SB, IB, and Haswell systems only work with 1.5 volt rated RAM IIRC




 I want to make sure you see this post MRCL




RCoon said:


> Personally I'd rather have a 2700K than any other i7. But that's just me.



Why you think I'm still running a 2600k if I can afford a GTX 780ti. Overall, it's the best generation of the past 3 IMHO.


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## Sasqui (Dec 9, 2013)

BarbaricSoul said:


> Your current RAM, is it rated for 1.5 volts? SB, IB, and Haswell systems only work with 1.5 volt rated RAM IIRC


 
<-  I've got 1.65v ram in my system... AFAIK, that restriction was only for SB?

After reading how much more complicated it is to OC Haswell, I'd probably go with a 3770k myself.


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## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Frick said:


> Why not Haswell?



Been mentioned. The golden middle, so to speak. Also, moar availability.



BarbaricSoul said:


> Your current RAM, is it rated for 1.5 volts? SB, IB, and Haswell systems only work with 1.5 volt rated RAM IIRC



Yes. Its stated at 1.65V but is also rated for 1.5. No issue there.



GreiverBlade said:


> you could have kept the Megahalems its a pretty good heatsink or go for the HR-02 Macho Rev.A (its what i use on my Xeon E3-1275v2) from review to review the Macho is not far from the SA SB-E and you can also make it work with dual fan setup or like i do (CF: your PC ATM thread) or even switch the TY-147 for the TY-143 2500rpm of the SA SB-E extreme
> 
> View attachment 53303
> 
> as for the mobo good choice i have a Z77 Extreme 4 and its pretty flawless atm (if we except the paper thin pcb of the Ex 4 )



I don't think the Megahalems comes close to that Thermalright thing. 



BarbaricSoul said:


> I want to make sure you see this post MRCL
> 
> Why you think I'm still running a 2600k if I can afford a GTX 780ti. Overall, it's the best generation of the past 3 IMHO.



I did  Well as you know the 2600K was my initial target, however lack of availability and high price drove me away.



Sasqui said:


> <-  I've got 1.65v ram in my system... AFAIK, that restriction was only for SB?
> 
> After reading how much more complicated it is to OC Haswell, I'd probably go with a 3770k myself.



I've read on numerous sites that 1.65 is not a problem, its even under warranty.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 9, 2013)

MRCL said:


> I don't think the Megahalems comes close to that Thermalright thing.



i didn't meant that but a i7-3770K do not heat too much even a good OC one, so the middle between a megahalems and a SA SB-E would be the HR-02 Macho Rev.A, cost versus perf also, but if you don't mind the price then go for the SA SB-E (the Macho is also easier to fit in a case, im a bad exemple due to my In Win GR one being a huge case  )


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## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Preference, yes. I quite like having lots of headroom, temperature wise. I always opted for top tier coolers ever since I melted that AMD chip 10 years ago.

Well seems like the setup I picked is a decent one. I may have to upgrade the PSU, too. Cooler Master V series seems rather nice. I like having headroom there, too. And my current one is old, and in almost 24/7 use since a few years. Never hurts to have a healthy, capable PSU.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 9, 2013)

well it's basically the same setup as i have atm (except for GPU unless by a strike of luck you find a 2nd XLR8   ) but with a unlocked CPU and 8gb ram more (E3-1275v2 is a i7-3770k for frequencies without the unlocked multi) and i can say it's a strong one since mine can handle anything i throw at it (actual games crunching and other)


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## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Well lol the 16GB I threw at it were due to Minecraft  Before that I had four GB. You can never have too much RAM.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 9, 2013)

i am waiting on Steg/TopD to restock G.Skill ARES 2133 atm  indeed you never have too much ram


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## Vario (Dec 9, 2013)

BarbaricSoul said:


> Personally, I don't see a problem with opting for the 3770k over the 4770k. Ivy Bridge is a better OC'er,  is only 10% slower than Hawell, and Intel is not going the make another socket 1150 CPU that would be worth upgrading to from either the 47770k or the 3770k, just like they didn't with the 2600k and 3770k.



http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1164

Its less than 10% dude.

No difference really between Haswell and Ivy, Ivy overclocks better, cheaper motherboards.  Get a pre binned i7 3770k.  The newer batch i7 3770k seem to suck at OC from my experience (2 Costa Ricas at Microcenter).  If you can get a binned i7 2600/2700k or 3770k that can do 5.0ghz from a forum member thats the way to go.  Then get a Z77x board of your choice.  Nice thing about ivy over sandy is you get pcie3.0.


Its just too hard to find a good 4770k from what I've read.  Its rare to get over 4.4.


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## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Vario said:


> Get a pre binned i7 3770k.


 
What do you mean by that? Also, how would one go about to check wether its old or new batch? Is that sort of like with the E0/C0 steppings of the old C2D CPUs?


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## Vario (Dec 9, 2013)

By that I mean find someone elses used CPU that has been proven to overclock well.  A lot of people jumped to Haswell here and on Hardforum and other places.  Check into Sb/ivy people moving to haswell.  If you buy a new 3770k, well the last few Ivy I have bought have sucked.  I live near a MC so I can flip em if they suck.

Try to get someone elses gold chip.

The other alternative is Ivy Bridge E and a cheap x79 like the AsRock one.


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## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Vario said:


> By that I mean find someone elses used CPU that has been proven to overclock well.  A lot of people jumped to Haswell here and on Hardforum and other places.  Check into Sb/ivy people moving to haswell.  If you buy a new 3770k, well the last few Ivy I have bought have sucked.  I live near a MC so I can flip em if they suck.
> 
> Try to get someone elses gold chip.
> 
> The other alternative is Ivy Bridge E and a cheap x79 like the AsRock one.


 
Okay but is there any way to distinguish the newer batches from the older ones? Different serial or something?


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## Vario (Dec 9, 2013)

No idea they just seemed to suck.  I bought a 3570k and it couldn't hit 4.5ghz then a couple xeons that undervolted well then a 3770k that sucked (couldn't surpass 4.3ghz) I returned it and got another that can't surpass 4.2 on air. I mean, I could run more than 1.3v but I don't on principle.  Seems to kill the chips longterm.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 9, 2013)

Vario said:


> http://www.ocaholic.ch/modules/smartsection/item.php?itemid=1164
> 
> Its less than 10% dude.
> 
> ...




ohhh great review and the 3770 is the less demanding in power  thanks Vario very interesting, even for me.


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## MRCL (Dec 9, 2013)

Yish. Okay, after reading around, contemplating again, I have decided to stick by my plans. Ivy 3770K it is, I shall test my luck. I'm on good terms with the shop I plan to buy from, they'll take the CPU back if it oc's badly.


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## Sasqui (Dec 10, 2013)

MRCL said:


> Yish. Okay, after reading around, contemplating again, I have decided to stick by my plans. Ivy 3770K it is, I shall test my luck. I'm on good terms with the shop I plan to buy from, they'll take the CPU back if it oc's badly.



The limiting factor on most IB & Haswell chips *still* is thermal paste.  An unlocked i7-3xk chip will usually max out 24/7 at 4.5-4.7 Ghz under both air and water if it has the right thermal paste application, even if it's stock.  I don't think Haswell is much different.


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## MRCL (Dec 10, 2013)

Thermal paste from the DIE to the heatspreader, or from the heatspreader to the cooler base? I have some Xigmatek (I think) paste lying around, good stuff, better than that Zalman paste I used before.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 10, 2013)

MRCL said:


> Thermal paste from the DIE to the heatspreader, or from the heatspreader to the cooler base? I have some Xigmatek (I think) paste lying around, good stuff, better than that Zalman paste I used before.



psshhhh Arctic MX-4, swiss FTW!  and by far the best i used
(tho the chill factor 2 that should come with the SA SB-E is good too)

but Sasqui meant the TIM under the IHS to the die indeed



Sasqui said:


> I don't think Haswell is much different.


Haswell is not different indeed : it is worse it produce more heat but has a higher tdp, unlike SB to IB 

i7-2700K 95w i7-3770K 77w i7-4770K 84w

still when i compare my i5-2400 or the i7-2700K from a friends rig to my Xeon E3-1275v2 my temps are lower (a i7-3770K stock should be same)


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## Sasqui (Dec 10, 2013)

GreiverBlade said:


> but Sasqui meant the TIM under the IHS to the die indeed


 
Yes, indeed, aka "delidding"  Look at my sys specs, I went one step further and have been running the die naked for quite a while now.  The only catch there is the clearance to the top of the die is less with the IHS removed.  Took a few tries to get the waterblock seated right.  And at the end of the day (surprisingly), it didn't make much of a difference over delidding alone.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 10, 2013)

well a delidded one the IHS can be maintained by the locking system of the socket, a friend do so with a i5-3570K and Arctic MX-4 in place of the original TIM well take a bit of time to get a decent lowering but it work (he use also a Macho like i do) but my E3-1275v2 do not produce to much heat so for me a delidding would be useless (56° at max) i wonder if the Xeon serie has a better TIM or a Fluxless soldering


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## MRCL (Dec 10, 2013)

I just ordered the stuff. Can probably pick it up in a week or two, mainboard and case aren't in stock right now.
Oh and I also ordered some MX-5 paste, that GeilD paste I had, I don't know how old it is and I won't take any chances.


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## Ja.KooLit (Dec 10, 2013)

a little bit off topic...

is the 4770k really sucks compared to 3770k for OCing? 

I am planning to build another rig.... wanted to get 3770k (another) but damn, I cannot get any z77 mobos here in korea.... they dont sell anymore or atleast the mobo I like.....

thats why I opt to 4770 + z87 mobos. dont want x79 build cause its already old chip and I need a lot of sata connections for raid configuration


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## BarbaricSoul (Dec 10, 2013)

night.fox said:


> a little bit off topic...
> 
> is the 4770k really sucks compared to 3770k for OCing?
> 
> ...



Sucks? No, but the 3770k and 2600k do generally OC better. But even with them, it's a bit of luck as to how good the chip will OC, and what voltage is needed for the OC.


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## Ja.KooLit (Dec 11, 2013)

BarbaricSoul said:


> Sucks? No, but the 3770k and 2600k do generally OC better. But even with them, it's a bit of luck as to how good the chip will OC, and what voltage is needed for the OC.




alright. Thanks.....


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## MRCL (Dec 11, 2013)

By the way my timing was perfect, when I ordered it, the CPU was on sale, 50 bucks cheaper than yesterday


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## Vario (Dec 11, 2013)

Its always $200-245 at microcenter here...

I don't recommend delidding really.  If you ever move your computer around and take it places its gonna shift the damn thing.  The clamping isn't really perfect.  Also CLU is probably the best right now for direct die to lid.  Don't use it lid to anything else it will ruin it (ruined my h100).

You should have gone IVB-E that has a soldered on lid and has socket 2011 support so more x16 slots anyway.



night.fox said:


> alright. Thanks.....



Get IVB-E?


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## MRCL (Dec 11, 2013)

Vario said:


> Its always $200-245 at microcenter here...
> 
> I don't recommend delidding really.  If you ever move your computer around and take it places its gonna shift the damn thing.  The clamping isn't really perfect.  Also CLU is probably the best right now for direct die to lid.  Don't use it lid to anything else it will ruin it (ruined my h100).
> 
> ...


 
Lucky bastards.

Wouldn't have done that anyways.

Eh, Ivy is fine, really. 2011 is more expensive and I don't need a bajillion x16 slots. Ivy 3x suits me the best.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 11, 2013)

Vario said:


> Its always $200-245 at microcenter here...
> 
> I don't recommend delidding really.  If you ever move your computer around and take it places its gonna shift the damn thing.  The clamping isn't really perfect.  Also CLU is probably the best right now for direct die to lid.  Don't use it lid to anything else it will ruin it (ruined my h100).
> 
> ...


and cost a leg+a kidney for limited improvement (i don't mean the cheaper IB-E wich is not even on par with a 3770K) i could get a X79DSI from intel at 80$ but when i saw the perf of the cheaper and the cost of the middle and top CPU well ... not worth it.

also @MRCL MX-5? does she even exist? i thought MX-4 was the highest of Arctic  and for past aging : i used a tube of Thermalright Chill Factor on my phenom X4 9600B (from a IFX-14 2008) still lowered the temp from the original TIM from 10° and ~5° from the Spire Bluefrost i used before it (blueworst ... 0.5g for 4.90chf ... pfff MX-4 4g for 11chf and waaaaay better)


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## MRCL (Dec 11, 2013)

GreiverBlade said:


> also @MRCL MX-5? does she even exist? i thought MX-4 was the highest of Arctic  and for past aging : i used a tube of Thermalright Chill Factor on my phenom X4 9600B (from a IFX-14 2008) still lowered the temp from the original TIM from 10° and ~5° from the Spire Bluefrost i used before it (blueworst ... 0.5g for 4.90chf ... pfff MX-4 4g for 11chf and waaaaay better)


 
I'm sorry its Arctic Silver 5, must've mixed it up. 13 bucks for 3.5g.
Yeah I guess it wouldn't even be that bad but as I said I don't take any chances. I don't want to order and wait for new paste.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 11, 2013)

MRCL said:


> I'm sorry its Arctic Silver 5, must've mixed it up. 13 bucks for 3.5g.
> Yeah I guess it wouldn't even be that bad but as I said I don't take any chances. I don't want to order and wait for new paste.


uccck the "fake" Arctic, altho good performances but i really don't like that brand (Arctic=\=Arctic(cooling) ) , wait for order? i receive my MX-4 the day after the order usually.

from review to review : AS5 tend to dry up, has a cure time and cost more than MX-4 for not much improvement  (the MX-4 is equivalent to the Gelid GC Extreme in fact)


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## MRCL (Dec 11, 2013)

GreiverBlade said:


> uccck the "fake" Arctic, altho good performances but i really don't like that brand (Arctic=\=Arctic(cooling) ) , wait for order? i receive my MX-4 the day after the order usually.
> 
> from review to review : AS5 tend to dry up, has a cure time and cost more than MX-4 for not much improvement  (the MX-4 is equivalent to the Gelid GC Extreme in fact)


 
Lol, alright, changed the order, MX-4 now instead of Arctic Silver. Victim of marketing scheme, I am.
Yeah some of the stuff is ready for pickup, but the board and cooler will be at the 19th, the case is slated for mid december, whatever that means. Christmas gifts lol.


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 11, 2013)

MRCL said:


> Lol, alright, changed the order, MX-4 now instead of Arctic Silver. Victim of marketing scheme, I am.
> Yeah some of the stuff is ready for pickup, but the board and cooler will be at the 19th, the case is slated for mid december, whatever that means. Christmas gifts lol.


x) ahah Christmas gift are the best ... tho my anniversary is on the 12th dec may i kindly ask you to change the delivery address from yours to mine , for that occasion ?  (i know lame joke eh?  )4


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## MRCL (Dec 11, 2013)

GreiverBlade said:


> x) ahah Christmas gift are the best ... tho my anniversary is on the 12th dec may i kindly ask you to change the delivery address from yours to mine , for that occasion ?  (i know lame joke eh?  )4


 
I believe you mean birthday (you from the Romandie?)


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## GreiverBlade (Dec 11, 2013)

i meant birthday indeed, and im from the one and only place in Switzerland that is not Swiss: Wallis, joking obviously but we are proud to be Walliser  (aka: On est Valaisan avant d'être Suisse) btw birthday anniversary is a anniversary afaik


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## MRCL (Dec 11, 2013)

GreiverBlade said:


> i meant birthday indeed, and im from the one and only place in Switzerland that is not Swiss: Wallis, joking obviously but we are proud to be Walliser  (aka: On est Valaisan avant d'être Suisse) btw birthday anniversary is a anniversary afaik


 
Schaffhausen is also not Swiss, so is my hometown (which incidentally also isn't schaffhausisch)  I'm in Zurich now, tough. Which I dislike but what can you do, there's only one Skyguide center in Switzerland. You dirty Russian, you (if you get it)
Yeah but anniversary is usually used to describe a yearly... ok I get it but birthday is more clear on the matter 

OT off


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## Ja.KooLit (Dec 11, 2013)

Vario said:


> Its always $200-245 at microcenter here...
> 
> I don't recommend delidding really.  If you ever move your computer around and take it places its gonna shift the damn thing.  The clamping isn't really perfect.  Also CLU is probably the best right now for direct die to lid.  Don't use it lid to anything else it will ruin it (ruined my h100).
> 
> ...



nah dont want the x79 mobo. i need lots of sata connection for raid... x79 refresh mobo's now just use controllers for additional sata... which gives lots of delays for startup... i disable my current mobo's asmedia controller cause it gives about 30 secs more delay for startup and they are almost half slower than sata connected to pch...


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## Sasqui (Dec 11, 2013)

Vario said:


> I don't recommend delidding really.  If you ever move your computer around and take it places its gonna shift the damn thing.  The clamping isn't really perfect.  Also CLU is probably the best right now for direct die to lid.  Don't use it lid to anything else it will ruin it (ruined my h100).



Wuss!   It does sound like night.fox will end up with a 4770k.  Just so much more complicated to overclock from every thread I've been through.


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## Chetkigaming (Dec 11, 2013)

asus rog hero overclocks to 4.8 ghz almost every 4770k


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## Kursah (Dec 11, 2013)

It took me two tries to get a good clocking Haswell but has been a great experience so far and cost the same as a 3770k setup would've...though that was back in late-June. My first one was a fight to get to 4.4... second one effortlessly hits 4.5 @ 1.24v...I'm actually running 1.23v stable atm too under my cooler it stays below 70C this time of year. Haswell does run hotter...that doesn't hurt it...it will throttle if it hits 100C...but yes for many it's more of a pain to cool. Might not be worth it to some...I have setup many rigs using the cheap CM 212+ Evo with an OC near mine and they were fine..ran hotter but were a-okay. FWIR heat doesn't kill Haswells, voltage does.

But seeing as you chose the 3770K that should be a good chip! I hope you luck out and get a good one! You should consider buying this when you do:

http://click.intel.com/tuningplan/

For $25, it's no questions asked RMA from Intel, so if you do give your chip too much voltage and the store won't take it back..Intel will replace it. That's a solid investment IMHO. Not sure if that was suggested, but anyone buying a K chip that doesn't want to delid, I feel should strongly consider this route!

Good luck with your purchase, it will be a good one that lasts you a while! I've been thorougly amazed by my Haswell setup, it runs so cool and quiet and smooth and freaking fast!

 to custom PC's, building them, making your own choice, doing your research and building a badass machine with your hard earned money!


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## MRCL (Dec 11, 2013)

Kursah said:


> It took me two tries to get a good clocking Haswell but has been a great experience so far and cost the same as a 3770k setup would've...though that was back in late-June. My first one was a fight to get to 4.4... second one effortlessly hits 4.5 @ 1.24v...I'm actually running 1.23v stable atm too under my cooler it stays below 70C this time of year. Haswell does run hotter...that doesn't hurt it...it will throttle if it hits 100C...but yes for many it's more of a pain to cool. Might not be worth it to some...I have setup many rigs using the cheap CM 212+ Evo with an OC near mine and they were fine..ran hotter but were a-okay. FWIR heat doesn't kill Haswells, voltage does.
> 
> But seeing as you chose the 3770K that should be a good chip! I hope you luck out and get a good one! You should consider buying this when you do:
> 
> ...



Well I hope I do luck out indeed. We'll see. I keep you updated.

Hm, that sounds like a good plan. Will have to investigate if that applies to worldwide or just US.

True dat, building your own stuff rocks! I'm so glad my Radeon x600 died five years ago, otherwise I wouldn't have ended up on TPU, met all you brilliant guys and I would have never tossed out hundreds of Dollars of some silicon... huh.


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