# Thailand Floods: HDD Prices To Remain Extortionately High As Supplies Get Tighter



## qubit (Nov 5, 2011)

The recent dreadful flooding in Thailand has forced the closure of several hard drive factories. The immediate concerns of course, are for the health and wellbeing of the people living and working in the area. The wider concern is the severe restriction in hard drive manufacturing capacity. Already, prices have doubled or tripled, depending on the exact model affected. The biggest HD manufacturer, Western Digital, has been hit the hardest, as IDC predicts that up to 75% of its production will be shut down. This means, that the big corporate HDD customers, those like HP and Dell, who build computer systems in large volumes, will get whatever inventory is available to fully satisfy their needs. Whatever is left is then sold on to the retail channel, for ordinary consumers to buy. IDC believes that hard disk production will reach pre-flood levels by around March, but that HDD levels by then will be very low. The prices should go through the roof then, in the meantime. As expected, this will also increase the prices of complete systems, as such a price hike is too much to absorb fully.

*View at TechPowerUp Main Site*


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## qubit (Nov 5, 2011)

Thanks to Damn_Smooth for the lead.


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## n-ster (Nov 5, 2011)

Damn  I was thinking mid-Feb would be much more than enough to to get to pre-flood prices...

This destroys many of my plans... I had at least 12 HDDs that I wanted to buy. Sucks for me... Though it does suck even worse for Thailand


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## Neuromancer (Nov 5, 2011)

Isn't there already a multipage thread on this?  Should close this one like erocker does for bulldozer threads


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## TheLaughingMan (Nov 5, 2011)

You can't close a news post. If anything happens, the original thread(s) about this will be removed, but I doubt that because it would be mean.


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## n-ster (Nov 5, 2011)

Why thread-crap on this thread? just PM him or a someone else (super-mod? bta?) if you truly think this shouldn't be here... I personally like it as a news post, and this is about how bad the situation actually is vs just stating the situation.

Either way, please people, try not to thread-crap, especially in news posts... Use private communication or what's wrong with the forum?" thread


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## FordGT90Concept (Nov 5, 2011)

I hope HDD manufacturers learned their lesson about putting too many eggs in one basket.  Yes, labor might be cheap there but when there's a 144% increase in commedity price, most people aren't going to buy.


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## Rowsol (Nov 5, 2011)

I hear SSDs are the future.  Lets go back to the future.


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## de.das.dude (Nov 5, 2011)

i was savin up for a new HDD


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## Damn_Smooth (Nov 5, 2011)

It is going to be a long wait until March. I'm in the process of building a system for my brother right now. Luckily he has a hard drive we can use as a temp until then.


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## RejZoR (Nov 5, 2011)

Current HDD prices are insane. Are they made out of gold and platinum or something? :lunatic:


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## Damn_Smooth (Nov 5, 2011)

RejZoR said:


> Current HDD prices are insane. Are they made out of gold and platinum or something? :lunatic:



Nope, they just aren't being made at all.


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## Jack Doph (Nov 5, 2011)

Damn_Smooth said:


> Nope, they just aren't being made at all.



Nonsense.
Less than 25% of HDDs are manufactured in Thailand, so there is most definitely a case for price gouging going on.
It's yet another typical response by businesses to turn a human tragedy into a profit margin.
That said, it is true that WD in particular has invested a lot of their operations in Thailand, but this is far less true for the other manufacturers (Seagate in particular).


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## Jetster (Nov 5, 2011)

What no flood sale?



http://www.crn.com/news/storage/231...;jsessionid=PLXGYIguWUTRR-RLiUisPg**.ecappj01


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## mtosev (Nov 5, 2011)

SSDs FTW


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## rpsgc (Nov 5, 2011)

Free market FTW! Right? Right? Riiiight?


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## HossHuge (Nov 5, 2011)

People will be burning DVD's more until prices come down again.


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## N-Gen (Nov 5, 2011)

Yup, guess my next step will be an optical drive instead of HDD. A BD writer might cover me until prices are down again.


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## Wagoo (Nov 5, 2011)

There are still some bargains out there if you look in shops too slow to react.


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## Jack Doph (Nov 5, 2011)

N-Gen said:


> Yup, guess my next step will be an optical drive instead of HDD. A BD writer might cover me until prices are down again.



You know, I find that very interesting, because if I look at the local prices here (Australia) I'm rather astonished at the fact that external HDDs have barely changed in price.
I wonder if that's just a local thing, or a gamble on customers not looking at the similarities between external and internal drives?


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## NdMk2o1o (Nov 5, 2011)

n-ster said:


> Why thread-crap on this thread?



Cause it's a qubit thread of course, flavour of the month is jump on the bandwagon and trash the new news posters threads, didn't you get the memo?? 

I have just bought 2x 2Tb drives and managed to get them at a good price, you can still find the odd drive or external drive at the same price as they were though they really are few and far between, on a different note at least I can sell my 2 500Gb wd5000aaks drives for more than I bought them for


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## N-Gen (Nov 5, 2011)

Jack Doph said:


> You know, I find that very interesting, because if I look at the local prices here (Australia) I'm rather astonished at the fact that external HDDs have barely changed in price.
> I wonder if that's just a local thing, or a gamble on customers not looking at the similarities between external and internal drives?



External drives here are even more expensive than the internals actually.


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## Wagoo (Nov 5, 2011)

2TB externals here are the ones I found at an unadjusted price. Bought 4 so far, may pick-up some more today. Just a normal Seagate Barracuda Green inside.


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## N-Gen (Nov 5, 2011)

Wagoo said:


> 2TB externals here are the ones I found at an unadjusted price. Bought 4 so far, may pick-up some more today. Just a normal Seagate Barracuda Green inside.



Wish I could do that, I managed to get a 1TB Black before the prices shot up, and I'm running low. Hopefully by the time everything is back to normal we'll have some 4TB drives out.


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## AhokZYashA (Nov 5, 2011)

aaaaannnddd, just in time when all my 2TB HDD's are full, 

how can i save all my files?


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## Jarman (Nov 5, 2011)

AhokZYashA said:


> aaaaannnddd, just in time when all my 2TB HDD's are full,
> 
> how can i save all my files?



do you really need any more porn?


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## Fx (Nov 5, 2011)

this is a lose, lose, lose situation

it sucks for the victims, sucks for manufactures and it sucks for those of us who need more TBs :\


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## kajson (Nov 5, 2011)

what i'm hoping that will happen, is because traditional hhd's will be less interesting compared to SSD as you have to fork over the same amount of money, be it a lot less capacity but still financially same investment. Thus peeps will run to shortterm investment in SSD. 

This will result in SSD production increase and slightly increased prices, (or big increase if we're unlucky) But when the normal HDD production is back on track, the increased SSD production capacity will make the prices of SSD plumet... 

Thats what i'm hoping anyways


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## Jack Doph (Nov 5, 2011)

kajson said:


> what i'm hoping that will happen, is because traditional hhd's will be less interesting compared to SSD as you have to fork over the same amount of money, be it a lot less capacity but still financially same investment. Thus peeps will run to shortterm investment in SSD.
> 
> This will result in SSD production increase and slightly increased prices, (or big increase if we're unlucky) But when the normal HDD production is back on track, the increased SSD production capacity will make the prices of SSD plumet...
> 
> Thats what i'm hoping anyways



Interestingly enough, Seagate is streamlining its offerings of HDDs and some will be hybrid drives, to replace the current line-up of high performance drives.
Also, Seagate will be phasing out its line of 5900RPM drives completely (the infamous 2 dimes savings).
So, in a few months' time, Seagate (not sure about competing offerings) will use 7200RPM drives only, or as part of their hybrid series (SSD & HDD combined - improved XT series, if you will).


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## AhokZYashA (Nov 5, 2011)

Jarman said:


> do you really need any more porn?



yeah, i need more of them,


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## Laurijan (Nov 5, 2011)

I have followed the price of Buffalo 2TB USB 2.0 and the price has increased from 99€ to 165€ the USB 3.0 model is up from 120€ to 217€


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 5, 2011)

Jack Doph said:


> Interestingly enough, Seagate is streamlining its offerings of HDDs and some will be hybrid drives, to replace the current line-up of high performance drives.
> Also, Seagate will be phasing out its line of 5900RPM drives completely (the infamous 2 dimes savings).
> So, in a few months' time, Seagate (not sure about competing offerings) will use 7200RPM drives only, or as part of their hybrid series (SSD & HDD combined - improved XT series, if you will).



I'm using a Seagate 5900rpm drive, i like it coz its very quiet and does not seem to effect my pc or games at all.


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 5, 2011)

please remove the word "extortion" from the news title. there is no extortion happening. news fail.


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## NdMk2o1o (Nov 5, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> please remove the word "extortion" from the news title. there is no extortion happening. news fail.



HDD Prices To Remain Extortionately High 

Extortionately is not the same as extortion, I see nothing wrong with the title


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## hhumas (Nov 5, 2011)

2 weeks ago I went to computer market and asked the shopkeeper to tell the price of WD element SE 1tb usb3.0 its was 8.4k 

 and now 3 days back again asked and he said now 10.4k .. 

its all due to flood


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 5, 2011)

NdMk2o1o said:


> HDD Prices To Remain Extortionately High
> 
> Extortionately is not the same as extortion, I see nothing wrong with the title



it means the same thing. "extortionately" is the adverb describing "high." the title assumes that if extortion were happening hard drives would cost what they do after the flood disaster. so the title links extortion and the current price of hard drives.


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## NdMk2o1o (Nov 5, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> it means the same thing. "extortionately" is the adverb describing "high." the title assumes that if extortion were happening hard drives would cost what they do after the flood disaster. so the title links extortion and the current price of hard drives.



Really the title assumes all that? meh ok 

As far as I am concerned it's fitting they are extortionately high compared to 2 weeks ago, that is not the same thing as saying there is extortion happening and that's why they are so high, but I guess it's how you read it?


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## Wagoo (Nov 5, 2011)

Nabbed another 5 drives, empty shelves in all 3 local branches of the shop now. 18 TB should see me through these terrible dark times!


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 5, 2011)

NdMk2o1o said:


> Really the title assumes all that? meh ok



that's because i'm a critical thinker.



> As far as I am concerned it's fitting they are extortionately high compared to 2 weeks ago, that is not the same thing as saying there is extortion happening and that's why they are so high, but I guess it's how you read it?



so you too assume that if extortion were happening in the HDD industry they would cost the same as they do now? that assumption belongs in the comments section, not in the news title.


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## NdMk2o1o (Nov 5, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> that's because i'm a critical thinker.
> 
> 
> 
> so you too assume that if extortion were happening in the HDD industry they would cost the same as they do now? that assumption belongs in the comments section, not in the news title.



It's your assumption, please don't put words into my mouth or tell me what _you_ think I am thinking. I don't read what you're reading, the joys of the english language are such that there are a myriad of words that can be used in different contexts and situations to describe something, it's all about context. However how would you describe all HDD prices going up from existing inventory and from manufacturers that don't have any manufacturing plants in Thailand? extortionate? supply and demand, opportunistic? same with e-tailors with stock they have had since before all of this happened.

It's figurative and one could say you were being literal or pedantic..


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## virtue (Nov 5, 2011)

I bought a Samsung spinpoint for around 45$ two months ago. Now look at this

SAMSUNG Spinpoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB 7200 RPM 32MB Cac...


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## Jack Doph (Nov 5, 2011)

With all due respect to all concerned, the prices are very much extortionate.
When some 25% (or less) of all HDDs are manufactured in Thailand, yet the price of HDDs is doubling or tripling in price, then the only conclusion that can be drawn is what I mentioned before.

Yes, WD has invested heavily in operations in Thailand, but the other major HDD manufacturers (most notably Seagate and Toshiba) have no such investment, yet their prices have gone up by the same amount, then one has to wonder..

Human tragedy == massive profit.
It's not the first, nor the last time this happens.
If evidence to the contrary can be presented, I'm most curious, especially as I have worked both in a hospital for 7 years, as well as having toured some of the plants where HDDs are made (a clean room that's up to 100 times cleaner than an operating theatre is quite an experience to behold).

Oh mighty dollar :/


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## Damn_Smooth (Nov 5, 2011)

Jack Doph said:


> Nonsense.
> Less than 25% of HDDs are manufactured in Thailand, so there is most definitely a case for price gouging going on.
> It's yet another typical response by businesses to turn a human tragedy into a profit margin.
> That said, it is true that WD in particular has invested a lot of their operations in Thailand, but this is far less true for the other manufacturers (Seagate in particular).



I guess I should probably keep better track of my manufacturing plants and quit believing what I read then. 

I probably won't though because that knowledge won't get the prices any lower.


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## Jack Doph (Nov 5, 2011)

Damn_Smooth said:


> I guess I should probably keep better track of my manufacturing plants and quit believing what I read then.
> 
> I probably won't though because that knowledge won't get the prices any lower.



That is the unfortunate truth - you & I both don't want these prices, yet.. here we are :/


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## Damn_Smooth (Nov 5, 2011)

Jack Doph said:


> That is the unfortunate truth - you & I both don't want these prices, yet.. here we are :/



I'm just hoping nothing critical comes up where I absolutely need a drive, until this blows over. I wonder how high the prices will get if we're still at the beginning. Bah, I don't want to think about it.


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## Jack Doph (Nov 5, 2011)

Agreed.

If only SSDs weren't so bloody expensive XD


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## Damn_Smooth (Nov 5, 2011)

Jack Doph said:


> Agreed.
> 
> If only SSDs weren't so bloody expensive XD



If this keeps up, they might seem cheap. Now that's scary.


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## Jack Doph (Nov 5, 2011)

Damn_Smooth said:


> If this keeps up, they might seem cheap. Now that's scary.




I rue the day XD


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## Damn_Smooth (Nov 5, 2011)

Jack Doph said:


> I rue the day XD



I've wanted one for a long time but I was hoping it would be a good deal because prices came down, not because mechanical prices went up.


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## Neuromancer (Nov 5, 2011)

First, sorry was not trying to thread crap I was just half asleep but it does appear to be a crappy post (mine I mean).

Second,

This does make SSDs look more manageable.

Also externals have not changed much, I got an email last week about 2TB for $79...


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 5, 2011)

NdMk2o1o said:


> It's your assumption, please don't put words into my mouth or tell me what _you_ think I am thinking. I don't read what you're reading, the joys of the english language are such that there are a myriad of words that can be used in different contexts and situations to describe something, it's all about context. However how would you describe all HDD prices going up from existing inventory and from manufacturers that don't have any manufacturing plants in Thailand? extortionate? supply and demand, opportunistic? same with e-tailors with stock they have had since before all of this happened.
> 
> It's figurative and one could say you were being literal or pedantic..



sorry i take news literally. 



			
				Jack Doph said:
			
		

> With all due respect to all concerned, the prices are very much extortionate.
> When some 25% (or less) of all HDDs are manufactured in Thailand, yet the price of HDDs is doubling or tripling in price, then the only conclusion that can be drawn is what I mentioned before.



you do realize that higher prices = less sales right? HDD sales will suffer because of this. nobody is going to gain anything from really high HDD prices. do you know why the prices go up? because supply is down and demand is the same. honestly, i thought this was all common sense...


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## qubit (Nov 5, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> please remove the word "extortion" from the news title. there is no extortion happening. news fail.



There's nothing wrong with the title, Easy. 

It's just a standard turn of phrase in English that means prices are really really high. I could have just as easily used "incredibly" instead of "extortionately" and it would have meant the same thing. In this context, "extortionately" doesn't literally mean that anyone is being subject to actual extortion.


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## hv43082 (Nov 5, 2011)

I wonder how much my WD 2tb black FASS go for now a day?


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## cheesy999 (Nov 5, 2011)

qubit said:


> There's nothing wrong with the title, Easy.
> 
> It's just a standard turn of phrase in English that means prices are really really high. I could have just as easily used "incredibly" instead of "extortionately" and it would have meant the same thing. In this context, "extortionately" doesn't literally mean that anyone is being subject to actual extortion.



Yeah, in fact in Britain it's basically the primary usage of the word, most people don't think to relate it to crimes

"remain extortionately high" = Remain unnecessarily/Incredibly high
"Remain High due to extortion" = Extortion


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## PVTCaboose1337 (Nov 5, 2011)

Neuromancer said:


> Also externals have not changed much, I got an email last week about 2TB for $79...



Yeah I look at external prices and it seems nobody has updated them or something.  Not sure why they are less than internals (in some cases).


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## n-ster (Nov 5, 2011)

From Merriam-Webster







Exorbitant = exceeding the customary

K now can we stop thread-crapping?


Yes, at some places the externals seem to still stay cheap, though I
m betting not for long. I'm guessing they have an overflow of stock? Does anyone know of externals with enterprise HDDs inside them? Guess not, oh well


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## radrok (Nov 5, 2011)

I luckily managed to get my hands in time and at a reasonable price on a 1TB Western Digital RE4, some weeks ago


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## Damn_Smooth (Nov 5, 2011)

n-ster said:


> From Merriam-Webster
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/111105/Capture060.png
> 
> ...



You should know better. qubit posted a news story, someone is going to bitch about something.


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## radrok (Nov 5, 2011)

Damn_Smooth said:


> You should know better. qubit posted a news story, someone is going to bitch about something.



That's odd, in all honesty I think his articles are pretty good and the TPU frontpage is richer since he started his task, especially on week-ends, it always pleases me to open TPU up and see fresh news on Saturday-Sunday

Sorry for the OT: 

Anyway I've noticed that the HDD I purchased some weeks ago now costs 290 EUR instead of 140 EUR, O.O


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## n-ster (Nov 5, 2011)

TBH, talking bout the thread-crapping etc is just feeding/adding to the thread crappers, making the thread more crapped... I know we are fed up with the thread crap, and I'm guilty of feeding/adding to it too, including this post, but let us stop yes?

Let us try this again. Use PM or what's wrong with the forum?

No thread crap beyond this
________________________________________________________________________________________

@ radrok

What HDD was 140 EUR BEFORE the flood?


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## radrok (Nov 5, 2011)

A Western Digital RE4 1TB

Edit : this is the cheapest price at which I could find it now o.o
http://www.prokoo.com/western-digital-wd1003fbyx-7200rpm-64mb-p-8068.html?keywords=RE4

I really hope this situation will solve as soon as possible because if you are going to build a new rig the HDD will increase your final price by a lot


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## qubit (Nov 5, 2011)

Thanks for all your supportive comments people, I really appreciate it. 

Now, if only those hard drive prices would come down...


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## n-ster (Nov 5, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> you do realize that higher prices = less sales right? HDD sales will suffer because of this. nobody is going to gain anything from really high HDD prices. do you know why the prices go up? because supply is down and demand is the same. honestly, i thought this was all common sense...



I agree. WD is going to be making 30 million less HDDs, while Seagate will only be making 5~8m less HDDs. But demand is the same, which is very high, why would they sell all their HDDs now and not have any left later?

However, Seagate and the others WILL profit more from it and WD WILL lose from it. Globally between all the HDD manufacturers, the gain is not going to be very significant like you'd think with this price inflation, but I think there will still be a global profit from this, but it isn't completely intentional IMO, so I don't think the manufacturer's should be blamed

EDIT: I'll also add that mother nature can be unpredictable, so they need a safety net too, which further justifies the price


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## qubit (Nov 5, 2011)

n-ster said:


> I agree. WD is going to be making 30 million less HDDs, while Seagate will only be making 5~8m less HDDs. But demand is the same, which is very high, why would they sell all their HDDs now and not have any left later?
> 
> However, Seagate and the others WILL profit more from it and WD WILL lose from it. Globally between all the HDD manufacturers, the gain is not going to be very significant like you'd think with this price inflation, but I think there will still be a global profit from this, but it isn't completely intentional IMO, so I don't think the manufacturer's should be blamed



It looks like normal supply and demand forces at work here given the flooding, so I agree, there's unlikely to be any dodgy profiteering moves from the HDD companies.


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## NdMk2o1o (Nov 5, 2011)

qubit said:


> It looks like normal supply and demand forces at work here given the flooding, so I agree, there's unlikely to be any dodgy profiteering moves from the HDD companies.



Which is quite the contrary to the etailors who have doubled/tripled prices on existing stock


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## n-ster (Nov 5, 2011)

NdMk2o1o said:


> Which is quite the contrary to the etailors who have doubled/tripled prices on existing stock



This argument is non-sense... The supply is lowered and they have to look out for the future. If you were a gold merchant and bought gold and suddenly it doubled in price, would you sell the gold half price and lose all your stock in 1 day and then have to buy gold at double the price? No, you raise your prices so that your stock doesn't just fly away.

In the same way, if gold is suddenly 1/10th of the price... Will you be selling you gold 10x higher and make 0 sales and lose your business because "your stock was bought at a higher price" ? No, the prices follow the market value and it is much better like that

Again, common sense

EDIT: Sorry, I know I over-utilize caps lol


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## NdMk2o1o (Nov 5, 2011)

n-ster said:


> This argument is non-sense... THE SUPPLY IS LOWERED and they have to look out for the FUTURE. If you were a gold merchant and bought gold and suddenly it doubled in price, would you sell the gold half price and lose all your stock in 1 day and then have to buy gold at double the price? No, you raise your prices so that your stock doesn't just fly away.
> 
> In the same way, if gold is suddenly 1/10th of the price... Will you be selling you gold 10x higher and make 0 sales and lose your business because "your stock was bought at a higher price" ? No, the prices follow the market value and it is much better like that
> 
> Again, COMMON SENSE



That's a good point and it makes a lot of sense, thanks. So really it's just the logic that's flawed as it's the same kind of reasoning that caused the global recession, FUD. 

And there is no need to use ALL CAPITALS TO EMPHASISE A POINT AS I AM QUITE OPEN TO CONSTRUCTIVE CRTICISM AND IT JUST GETS A LITTLE BIT DISTRACTING thrOWIng CaPs in as AnD whEN yOu wanT To MAkE a POiNT


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## twicksisted (Nov 6, 2011)

So selfish of them to have a flood, die and increase the prices of our hardware!


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 6, 2011)

qubit said:


> There's nothing wrong with the title, Easy.
> 
> It's just a standard turn of phrase in English that means prices are really really high. I could have just as easily used "incredibly" instead of "extortionately" and it would have meant the same thing. In this context, "extortionately" doesn't literally mean that anyone is being subject to actual extortion.





n-ster said:


> From Merriam-Webster
> 
> http://img.techpowerup.org/111105/Capture060.png
> 
> ...



Hint: The word extortion is a legal term used to describe gaining money through coercion. The use of the word 'incredibly' would also be incorrect as it is a relative adverb. what is incredible to one person may not be to another. This is why when you read real news stories by real journalists the titles very rarely include adjectives. im not thread crapping im insisting on some sort of journalistic integrity.


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## erocker (Nov 6, 2011)

This thread is redundant. http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=153454

Am I missing something?


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## n-ster (Nov 6, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> Hint: The word extortion is a legal term used to describe gaining money through coercion. The use of the word 'incredibly' would also be incorrect as it is a relative adverb. what is incredible to one person may not be to another. This is why when you read real news stories by real journalists the titles very rarely include adjectives. im not thread crapping im insisting on some sort of journalistic integrity.



Hint: Gay is a term that means joyful or something like that. but it has another meaning... If I say I am gay and I like being the woman in the relationship, I probably don't mean joyful. I would have preferred the term extraordinarily maybe, but extortionately or exorbitantly are still valid terms because one of their meanings is exceeding the customary, which is true.

I'm not against you criticizing him... I see your point. But I have 2 points I'm trying to make:

#1 qubit is not a real journalist so he won't always be perfect in theses matters.
#2 *PRIVATE MESSAGES*. You can PM him and discuss it with him. If you don't like what he has to say, you have the what's wrong with you forums or PM a supermod or probably bta about it. It is sad that I have to repeat this so many times and it still doesn't get through. Hopefully a bigger size, caps, Bold, and red will help? Damn you are a moderator, I'd think you'd know this.

I'll finish with this... I have no problem with you so don't take this personally, I just don't want to see you opinion about his news style writing in multiple news threads every time. Then there are the pro-qubit and anti-qubit that fight it out on his thread and it becomes chaos.



erocker said:


> This thread is redundant. http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=153454
> 
> Am I missing something?



 "impact on its operations in Thailand cannot yet be fully determined" 

We know much more now. Not only can the discussion be more specific, but we know have estimates of how long this will last... Basically it allows a discussion about the same topic, but with more specific details and another time-frame

It is also a WD focused thread, without mentioning if other HDD manufacturers were affected.

Also note how many Thailand Flood threads and "OMG HDD prices" thread have poped up since that news post. I think this news post has a good motive to be there.

This thread is beyond saving at this point I guess, might as well participate in the thread-crapping since mods and super-mods are participating


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## erocker (Nov 6, 2011)

n-ster said:


> "impact on its operations in Thailand cannot yet be fully determined"
> 
> We know much more now. Not only can the discussion be more specific, but we know have estimates of how long this will last... Basically it allows a discussion about the same topic, but with more specific details and another time-frame
> 
> ...



My post was aimed more toward qubit, but you bring up some good points. I still think this post is similar enough to the previous news post the garner it redundant, but that's just my opinion and why I asked qubit the question. I don't appreciate my posts being called crap, but I guess that's your opinion, I won't keep you from it.


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## n-ster (Nov 6, 2011)

erocker said:


> My post was aimed more toward qubit, but you bring up some good points. I still think this post is similar enough to the previous news post the garner it redundant, but that's just my opinion and why I asked qubit the question. I don't appreciate my posts being called crap, but I guess that's your opinion, I won't keep you from it.



http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=thread crapping

Your post isn't crap. By thread crapping I mean this^

It derails the thread and turns it into an argument. It is not off-topic, but doesn't belong here, it belongs in PMs. At this point most of us are thread crapping, including me.

Your posts isn't crap, it at least proves there is some redundancy. I can see how you see it being a bit too redundant, but my main argument against that is the number of OMG HDD PRICES posts and threads that popped up, and also that many people want to know how long this could last.

I said super-mod, but I was being a bit unfair as the thread has already become an argument. You backed up your argument and didn't attack qubit while keeping short and simple so I have no problem with your post that this stage of the thread. So hope you don't take it personally.

And I know it was towards qubit, but I felt obliged to give my opinion ROFL

P.S: Also, I was a tad bit frustrated when I wrote that post


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 6, 2011)

whatever. i just have different expectations for news i guess. but i won't stop bringing up my issues with his news in his news thread. if i read something i know to be incorrect im going to call him out on it. otherwise he will never learn to tone down the rhetoric and write professionally.


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## qubit (Nov 6, 2011)

Ok, here we go...



Easy Rhino said:


> Hint: The word extortion is a legal term used to describe gaining money through coercion. The use of the word 'incredibly' would also be incorrect as it is a relative adverb. what is incredible to one person may not be to another. This is why when you read real news stories by real journalists the titles very rarely include adjectives. im not thread crapping im insisting on some sort of journalistic integrity.





Easy Rhino said:


> whatever. i just have different expectations for news i guess. but i won't stop bringing up my issues with his news in his news thread. if i read something i know to be incorrect im going to call him out on it. otherwise he will never learn to tone down the rhetoric and write professionally.



Oh, you _know_ it to be wrong, do you, because you're some sort of ultimate reference? tsk 

Extortion is a legal term and it's also a turn of phrase as I have explained above and n-ster explained further in post 56. So no, once again, there's nothing wrong with the title. How would _you_ phrase the title then?

I also have plenty of integrity too. What, are you calling me a liar or something? 

If you have a comment to make about my news writing, then you of all people as a mod, should know that the best place to comment on it is in the comments section and/or PM. If you comment over there, then feel free to PM a link to make sure I see your post and we can talk about it. Also, it's nice to get news on the weekend, no? 

If you really think I'm doing such an awful job, then why don't you take it up with W1zz & bta? Clearly they don't think so, or I'd soon hear from them, trust me.

Believe me, I'm not going to change my news style just because you and a handful of others disapprove. In short, I don't do bland news and my style is similar to The Register or TechEye.

So, to repeat, please make your comments in the right place and don't derail my news threads.

Finally, here's a pertinent excerpt of what Kreij wrote in another news thread:



Kreij said:


> A few thoughts from yer Ol' Uncle Kreij ...
> 
> *Qubit's Opinions*
> Every single one of the 2 million+ posts on this forum are someone's opinion. Opinions generate discussion and make for lively threads. People are not used to seeing the opinions in the news article itself, but why should opinions be delegated to resonding posts only?  (Quick Tip : They're not, Bta does it too, he's just more subtle  ) People say that they don't like opinions in news, but they sure have no problem posting _their_ opinion .. do they? IMO, these news articles have made TPU more fun and interesting without sacrificing the hard news because they are "in addition to" the hard news, not replacing or even supplanting it.
> ...



And believe it or not, I do appreciate that you're trying to be constructive, even though our views are diametrically opposite. 




erocker said:


> This thread is redundant. http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=153454
> 
> Am I missing something?



No, it's not redundant, but I can see why you might think so. As n-ster said, it's a development of the situation, or an update if you will. Clearly the other sites that have reported this story, including the one I sourced this one from think there's merit in reporting this. It's basically gonna be a flippin' long time until the recovery from the floods is complete and the prices come down to normal again. A real shame for everyone.


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 6, 2011)

the article itself is pretty good, i just take issue with the title as it is misleading. qubit you have to understand people will react negatively to you injecting your bias into a news article. people want facts so they can make up their own mind. 

i dont think these prices are extortionately high so i don't believe you should have used that word. i believe the prices are actually an accurate reflection of market price after a major disaster. a good title would have been "HDD prices to remain high as supplies tighten."


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## Jarman (Nov 6, 2011)

whatever they are, they are beyond what I am willing to pay


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 6, 2011)

Jarman said:


> whatever they are, they are beyond what I am willing to pay



you and just about everyone else. disasters like this really hurt companies (even those that can recoup some of the loss through insurance policies.) hopefully we will see companies rethink their strategy and start opening HDD plants in other areas of the world.


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## digibucc (Nov 6, 2011)

i didn't think extortionately was a word - that's what i took from this article


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## qubit (Nov 6, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> the article itself is pretty good, i just take issue with the title as it is misleading. qubit you have to understand people will react negatively to you injecting your bias into a news article. people want facts so they can make up their own mind.
> 
> i dont think these prices are extortionately high so i don't believe you should have used that word. i believe the prices are actually an accurate reflection of market price after a major disaster. a good title would have been "HDD prices to remain high as supplies tighten."



Thanks, I'm glad I got something right. 

Yes, your title works, it's accurate and it's fine, but it's _bland_ and I don't do bland. I think extortionately does apply to this, so it all just boils down to... opinion. Again, lol. It gets across the "WTF!!" factor any poor buyer in the market for a hard drive right now feels. I think this is just splitting hairs now, seriously. Hard drives are very expensive right now, regardless of the exact words one uses.

Can we call a truce now please?!


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## n-ster (Nov 6, 2011)

Easy Rhino said:


> whatever. i just have different expectations for news i guess. but i won't stop bringing up my issues with his news in his news thread. if i read something i know to be incorrect im going to call him out on it. otherwise he will never learn to tone down the rhetoric and write professionally.



I don't mind you calling him out, I mind you calling him out HERE... qubit said it again and I'll say in another time, this is not the place for these comments. Why? It derails the thread and it craps the thread (and by that I do not mean you posts are crap, I mean that the thread is derailed and gone in a completely different direction). TBH I see your point. I like qubit's style but not everyone does, but people mistakenly think the qubit doesn't know this. HE KNOWS. There are many places where you can call him out, including PMs, "what's wrong with our forum" and "Our News, your views" threads.

This is why mods usually try to stop the MAC vs PC and INTEL vs AMD comments as they derail threads. The qubit vs not qubit style is what happened here. I mean look at the thread! You can't in all honesty tell me this "calling out" didn't derail the thread



Easy Rhino said:


> the article itself is pretty good, i just take issue with the title as it is misleading. qubit you have to understand people will react negatively to you injecting your bias into a news article. people want facts so they can make up their own mind.
> 
> i dont think these prices are extortionately high so i don't believe you should have used that word. i believe the prices are actually an accurate reflection of market price after a major disaster. a good title would have been "HDD prices to remain high as supplies tighten."



Isn't high technically an opinion too? You could see HDD prices being a steal, and now they are less cheap or normal. Yes the prices are higher, but not necessarily high. I admit the word "remain" neutralizes this point somewhat. Just trying to point out there can be "opinion" in many news titles that you might find appropriate.

Again though, the "extortionately" can mean with extortion, but it can also mean that it exceeds the customary, and the later is true and perhaps the best neutral way of saying it.


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## erocker (Nov 7, 2011)

n-ster said:


> I don't mind you calling him out, I mind you calling him out HERE... qubit said it again and I'
> ll say in another time, this is not the place for these comments. Why? It derails the thread and it craps the thread (and by that I do not mean you posts are crap, I mean that the thread is derailed and gone in a completely different direction). TBH I see your point. I like qubit's style but not everyone does, but people mistakenly think the qubit doesn't know this. HE KNOWS. There are many places where you can call him out, including PMs, "what's wrong with our forum" and "Our News, your views" threads.
> 
> This is why mods usually try to stop the MAC vs PC and INTEL vs AMD comments as they derail threads. The qubit vs not qubit style is what happened here. I mean look at the thread! You can't in all honesty tell me this "calling out" didn't derail the thread
> ...



I think qubit can defend himself. Let's get back on topic now.


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## Neuromancer (Nov 7, 2011)

Back On topic, to both the article and the title.

Extortion is an apt description of the event.  A high price is above market value, extortion is a forced and excessive payment, because no option is left for you. Since retailers unilaterally tripled cost, before shortage even occurred, this is price gouging, something that happens on new releases, and when shortages occur.  It is not justified, and you know prices will fall to what they really should have been adjusted to based on the articles predicted 25% impact on supply. Fact is that these retailers did NOT pay the price they are charging at the minute, so yes.. not illegal just dubious as hell and should not be supported.

I will cinch my data belt and wait till prices fall back down to appropriate levels before I purchase a HDD for myself.  

As to the title, despite its apropos connotations, when people use excessive adjectives in their assessments I tend to dismiss their opinions as juvenile. And that is what it sounds like a teenager writing a news article. (No offense qubit, I do not mean your wording I mean in generally, sensationalist words smack of youthful or ignorant writing.. ). similar consternations would be applied to those that think "Intel murders/rapes/slaughters AMD or crushes, demoralizes, or takes your mother out for a nice seafood dinner and never calls her again!" type of comments.

*free cookie for the first person to name the movie of that last part 

(Sorry for the wordy post, I am in writing mode right now)


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## n-ster (Nov 7, 2011)

erocker said:


> I think qubit can defend himself. Let's get back on topic now.



I know he can, but Easy Rhino was divulging his opinion, I was merely counting his opinions with mine


Neuromancer said:


> Back On topic, to both the article and the title.
> 
> Extortion is an apt description of the event.  A high price is above market value, extortion is a forced and excessive payment, because no option is left for you. Since retailers unilaterally tripled cost, before shortage even occurred, this is price gouging, something that happens on new releases, and when shortages occur.  It is not justified, and you know prices will fall to what they really should have been adjusted to based on the articles predicted 25% impact on supply. Fact is that these retailers did NOT pay the price they are charging at the minute, so yes.. not illegal just dubious as hell and should not be supported.
> 
> ...



Anchorman is the movie

now imana write my post but I wanted to be first lol

What the retailers did was not extortion IMO... It is as simple as supply and demand. If they had kept their prices low, they would have lost precious stock they have. They priced up HDDs to slow down the demand in order to keep enough stock for the months to come. If they didn't, we'd be out of HDDs during the Christmas shopping which is very bad 

Extortionately =/= extortion btw

One of the definitions of extortionately is exceeding the customary. That is exactly what the prices of HDDs are right now, and it is the best way to describe it. Even "remain high" is less correct than "exceeds the customary". Using the turn of phrase would have made the title bland, hence the synonym


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 7, 2011)

i guess they don't teach economics in school anymore.

a disaster of this magnitude first effects the manufacturer. supply is now limited so the price naturally increases to retain some sort of revenue. the retailers then fight each other to acquire as much of the product as possible. this immediately shoots the retail price through the roof as a bidding war begins for the short supply. as a way to off set the long term costs retailers raise the price on their current stock so they have more cash to bid on the short supply. retailers know that some consumers will pay the higher costs because those consumers have a higher demand for the product while others will wait. retailers capitalize on their high demand customers who build a higher cost into their own products and services. this actually softens the blow as the total cost is now spread out to a wider group of people. as supply begins to come back the cost to retailers will decrease adding certainty in the marketplace. costs will then go down for consumers as prices reach an equilibrium for the greatest population of consumer demand. 

tldr; it isn't extortion.


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## qubit (Nov 7, 2011)

Nice bit of economics 101, Easy. 

I couldn't explain it quite like that.


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## Easy Rhino (Nov 7, 2011)

as consumers we often focus on the retailers and say they are gouging us. remember though that retailers are consumers too! they are buying from the manufacturers and other retailers some times. 

if prices on HDDs crash (much lower than they were before the disaster) when the disaster is all cleaned up and people are back to work then we will know the retailers overcharged for their limited stock to the consumer. this is bad for the retailers because they lose on the initial high cost after the disaster and they lose after the disaster because they can't charge enough for the HDDs. it behooves retailers to keep prices as low as they possibly can during a disaster to avoid that.


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## n-ster (Nov 7, 2011)

My simplistic mind did not think of the scenario as detailed as that lol. I didn't think of some of the factors you mentioned

My ECON 1000 class I'm taking didn't cover disasters yet lol, but I'm only 1/4 into the class (a full year class)

At least I came to the same conclusion LOL


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## imitation (Nov 7, 2011)

Well, for now prices are just insane (here in Germany). I bought a bunch of Seagate 500GB 3,5" drives for 28€ a piece half a year ago. Now, the cheapest drive available is a Samsung 1TB 2,5" for 80€, and the aforementioned Seagate is pinned at 135€. Until 500GB cost somewhere close to 30 or 40€ again, i'll refuse to call this "normal".
This is madness!!!


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## fullhd99 (Nov 7, 2011)

WDC hdd prices rose very crazy
because the factory drowned due to flooding

in my country
before Internal 3,5" WDC Green 2TB SATA6 price $90
After flood disaster price $150 

Bonus



Spoiler


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## n-ster (Nov 7, 2011)

fullhd99 said:


> WDC hdd prices rose very crazy
> because the factory drowned due to flooding
> 
> in my country
> ...



That is less of a rise than most other countries, which saw 100+% price increase


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## fullhd99 (Nov 7, 2011)

n-ster said:


> That is less of a rise than most other countries, which saw 100+% price increase



only say Oh my good
in prediction hdd prices will continue to rise 
many stores who have stock hdd in large quantities to take advantage of two and even three-fold,whereas at the time of purchasing stock from the manufacturer with the normal price


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## Chappy (Nov 7, 2011)

They should put their factories at the top of the world.


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## qubit (Nov 7, 2011)

Chappy said:


> They should put their factories at the top of the world.
> 
> http://thestrategyguysite.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/Top_of_the_world.jpg



OMG he's not afraid of heights is he?!  I'd turn to jelly up there.


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## Chappy (Nov 8, 2011)

qubit said:


> OMG he's not afraid of heights is he?!  I'd turn to jelly up there.



I doubt you will, you won't be able to see the ground up there. Even people with Acrophobia won't trigger their fears as there will be no ground to fall to... 
Just look into the clouds 

Anyway how funny it would look if they make a hdd factory up there.


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