# Best antivirus for Windows XP?



## JonathanX (May 9, 2017)

I am still using Windows XP Professional Service Pack 2 and I would like to know what would be the best antivirus for it. I have been using NOD32 for quite some time, but I couldn't find any more working serials on the net. I tried Avira, but it starting doing weird stuff, like telling me I have a trojan in an application - a small game from 2004 - where NOD32 didn't detect any trojan whatsoever for months, after which it deleted the application. So I uninstalled Avira and now I am using Kasperski 2013. Is this antivirus good for my XP? If not, what else would you recommend?

PS: I suppose that asking about activation keys and serials is forbidden here, right?


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## jboydgolfer (May 9, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> PS: I suppose that asking about activation keys and serials is forbidden here, right?



 If you mean free anything yes that's against terms of use, anything piracy related atleast.

 As far as what's best ,the same as what's best for any windows. Malwarebytes, avast, defender. Etc


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## JonathanX (May 9, 2017)

Yes, but Microsoft dropped any support for XP some time ago, and many antiviruses don't run anymore under XP, that's why I was asking what antiviruses - out of the ones that still work under XP nowadays - are recommended.


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## jboydgolfer (May 9, 2017)

malwarebytes for sure. and id hazard a guess that just about any other 3rd party AV worth its weight as well., it seems as though avast does too from what ive read.

can you not upgrade to win 7, or win 10? a lot of these troubles you run into would be avoided


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## ChristTheGreat (May 9, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> I am still using Windows XP Professional Service Pack 2 and I would like to know what would be the best antivirus for it. I have been using NOD32 for quite some time, but I couldn't find any more working serials on the net. I tried Avira, but it starting doing weird stuff, like telling me I have a trojan in an application - a small game from 2004 - where NOD32 didn't detect any trojan whatsoever for months, after which it deleted the application. So I uninstalled Avira and now I am using Kasperski 2013. Is this antivirus good for my XP? If not, what else would you recommend?
> 
> PS: I suppose that asking about activation keys and serials is forbidden here, right?




I don't think t here would be a better than another one. First SP2 is no more supported since July 13th 2010, and XP SP3 since April 8th 2014, I would say go with the anti-virus that still gives support if they with free version.

If you don't need internet on that computer, just disconnect the internet


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## Caring1 (May 9, 2017)

I had to upgrade an XP Netbook for this very reason, I couldn't find a working free anti-virus solution.
It was easier to install W7 starter on it and then download an anti-virus program.


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## Jetster (May 9, 2017)

Anti virus's are fairly obsolete, especially for XP. Just tred lightly or try Malware bytes. But even that has been buggy lately. They're having issues


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## Athlonite (May 9, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> I am still using Windows XP Professional Service Pack 2 and I would like to know what would be the best antivirus for it. I have been using NOD32 for quite some time, but I couldn't find any more working serials on the net. I tried Avira, but it starting doing weird stuff, like telling me I have a trojan in an application - a small game from 2004 - where NOD32 didn't detect any trojan whatsoever for months, after which it deleted the application. So I uninstalled Avira and now I am using Kasperski 2013. Is this antivirus good for my XP? If not, what else would you recommend?
> 
> PS: I suppose that asking about activation keys and serials is forbidden here, right?




the best thing to install is Windows 10 because most if not all Antivirus makers now will no longer support windows XP its a dead OS


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## Melvis (May 9, 2017)

I still got a few old XP machines and I just run Avast Free on them, works fine with XP. But id update to SP3 first!

I wrote this to you now on a Compaq V4000 With XP


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## natr0n (May 9, 2017)

Here's a tip use ublock origin in your browser it blocks bad websites you wont even need antivirus.

This is what I do.


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## Derek12 (May 9, 2017)

Keep your Karspersky 2013 it's probably the best thing for XP
With XP an antivirus is essential


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## Kursah (May 9, 2017)

Derek12 said:


> Keep your Karspersky 2013 it's probably the best thing for XP
> With XP an antivirus is essential



Agreed. If this still works I'd keep it.

Also I'd add MBAM Free if it still works.

Lastly, set the DNS servers to OpenDNS for some web filtering.

Don't rely on just one solution. Rely on several.


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## DeathtoGnomes (May 9, 2017)

99.9% of all XP viruses were received thru a browser, if you can maximize your protection thru your browser, you could get away with not installing an AV.  You could then also get away with just using an online free virus scan however often you choose, daily or whatever.  

XP doesnt like too many installed programs.


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## erixx (May 9, 2017)

I still see XP everywhere on airport screens, shops, banks, big corporations and institutions, yes those that keep all our data... savely...................................................................


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## Jetster (May 9, 2017)

If I saw XP in a bank I would stop using that bank


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## dorsetknob (May 9, 2017)

Comodo free still works on XP and its still receiving updates


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## rtwjunkie (May 9, 2017)

Athlonite said:


> the best thing to install is Windows 10 because most if not all Antivirus makers now will no longer support windows XP its a dead OS


THIS.  Even the best ones are moving on. There's a couple, but it won't be forever. No sense in providing protection for Swiss cheese OS when they can focus efforts on recent and current OS.


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## Ferrum Master (May 9, 2017)

I would chose using Linux on an old hardware and use Wine for those rare old games.


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## jboydgolfer (May 9, 2017)

as many others have mentioned, your walking the Hypothetical "plank", inevitably your going to reach the end, and fall off , So Your best bet is to move to "a longer plank" i.e. an OS with support/life left to it. Regardless of how often You may see businesses using XP, it Is a dead OS (notice i didnt say dying). Those companies/people who decide to risk their security by running on a vulnerable OS are making very poor decision which will either bite them in the ass, or they will switch to a proper OS, but that doesnt mean since they are doing it You should too (in many cases those companies have decided to stretch their annual budget by holding off on the purchase of new PC's/OS' for another year, they might live to regret that choice) but You know better than them, You know the risks, and an upgrade for You is a tiny financial commitment, as where with a company, it can be many PC's, from 2-200 which costs big $$$ to upgrade , so You cant compare them not upgrading with You not upgrading, as its apples and oranges.

There are still AV's supporting XP, You'll just need to google them individually, and verify before you buy ( i recommend you check how MUCH longer they will continue to support it too, before purchasing BTW).

Good Luck


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## Melvis (May 9, 2017)

Jetster said:


> If I saw XP in a bank I would stop using that bank



https://news.vice.com/article/windows-31-is-still-alive-and-it-just-killed-a-french-airport


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## Bill_Bright (May 9, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> Yes, but Microsoft dropped any support for XP some time ago


As mentioned, that was over 3 years ago for XP SP3, but 7 years ago for SP2!

The best anti-virus for your XP at this point is no networking! Keep it off the Internet. Period. Use it as a stand-alone system only. Don't connect it to a network that has Internet access. That's not for your protection but for ours! 

Sorry JonathanX but because you have failed to even keep XP updated to the most recent service pack, you are not just a threat to yourself, but this system is now a menacing threat to the rest of us. And that is just not cool!  Your system is a target for bad guys to compromise and use to attack us with malware and spam, or to enlist your system into their bot armies as a zombie for DDoS attacks.



Ebo said:


> The best antivirus for XP is windows 10, end of story.


I will assume in this case that will require new hardware. If new hardware is not in the budget, the next best thing is, as Ferrum Master noted, Linux.

As far as banks and airports, etc. still using XP, I can only hope they are connected to a "closed" network - and don't have Internet access. Many of these big organizations also have a development team on staff just to keep patching and plugging holes in XP. For them, that is still less expensive (for now) than upgrading all their hardware, and perhaps having to pay a new development team to totally rewrite their custom XP dependent programs AND migrating all their old data to the new system - and that can be VERY expensive. But you can only put so many band-aids on top of band-aids.


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## Derek12 (May 9, 2017)

Kursah said:


> Agreed. If this still works I'd keep it.
> 
> Also I'd add MBAM Free if it still works.
> 
> ...




Exactly. 

There are many solutions way before the simply "upgrade your OS" as was repeated here ad nauseam.

Some people don't understant that in many cases it's not so easy to upgrade your OS to the latest shiniest one and you have to stay with legacy/obsolete OS.

I am making a industrial control process system for a factory and computers will still use Windows 7.


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## dorsetknob (May 9, 2017)

Brother works in food Industry
some of their packaging machines are nearly 50 yrs old
they are in house Built (Frankinheath Robinsonstien) and run win 3.1 ( they have about 10 of them ).
Program was written also in house and the guy that wrote it Died 30 yrs ago ) no Source code for program either  that was lost years ago

A New machine to replace 1 would cost over £1/4 million and it would be no faster or more productive than the existing machine.


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## alucasa (May 9, 2017)

As long as machines are offline or connected to private Lan, any older OS is fine. The issue when a user wishes to enter the digital wild west with such old OSes.

That said, patch up your browser and you will be okay. Ad-block, No-script etc etc.


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## cornemuse (May 9, 2017)

360 Total Security works for me (XP Pro _32 bit_, _not 64 bit_) I also like 360's os updating method.

https://www.360totalsecurity.com/en/download-free-antivirus/#windows

fwiw, Its a chinese company, , ,


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## Aenra (May 9, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> I suppose that asking about activation keys and serials is forbidden here, right?



Can only speak about Norton, BitDefender and Kaspersky (all paid, proper versions).
Between the three? Kaspersky, no question.

- The only one out of the three that doesn't flag your Windows "key" (you know, that special one you worked so hard to receive.. legally..). You won't even have to make exceptions or exclusion rules, it's fine on its own.
[on Win10, the other two will auto-delete it, no matter what; tried everything, nothing works. My Win7 is legal, so can't tell you if it will be the same there, for you. Am just letting you know how it works on 10, just in case you have to deal with this in the future. Like i was, lol]

- Faster than either of the other two, checked on same PC, exact same OS install (see specs).

- Cheaper than either of the other two, bought mine for 20 bucks i think? Full year license. (if you're going for the Antivirus version that is; the others cost more. I find the Internet Security version superfluous however, as it only adds stuff i'd disable anyway, but YMMV]

- It does not block pirated games, like the other two dictators do, it does not block cracks; like the other two dictators do.

- Have yet to face any "security" issue and never mind what everyone says about its being "bad".
[had a bad opinion about Kaspersky myself, until i tried it again.. it's improved a LOT; highly recommended far as i'm concerned. Best 20 bucks i've spent this year]


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## Athlonite (May 9, 2017)

cornemuse said:


> 360 Total Security works for me (XP Pro _32 bit_, _not 64 bit_) I also like 360's os updating method.
> 
> https://www.360totalsecurity.com/en/download-free-antivirus/#windows
> 
> fwiw, Its a chinese company, , ,



and it's a junk antivirus just like Snorton and Mcstuffies it's easily bypassed and once infected 360 can't get rid of it, something that MBam was able to do in thirty seconds and a reboot


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## alucasa (May 9, 2017)

Majority of viruses/malware nowsdays come from unhealthy habit of clicking everything they find interesting on the Internet. So, as long as you watch what you are doing, you will not encounter issues AV or not.


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## Bill_Bright (May 9, 2017)

Derek12 said:


> Some people don't understant that in many cases it's not so easy to upgrade your OS to the latest shiniest one and you have to stay with legacy/obsolete OS.


It is not about understanding. By now, everybody understands, in some cases, upgrading is not so easy. But that is not the point.

If sticking with XP only impacted the user, then there would be no problem. But that is not the case. People who stubbornly stick with XP and connect to the Internet are a threat to others. That's the problem. And in this case, it is even worse as the OP has not even applied SP3!

I mean, can you really say it is about money? After all these years? Walmart Refurbished Computers for as little as $150.67 with Windows 10 with 1 year warranties.

And again, there is Linux. What can't you do with Linux? Okay, you can't play games but is that a excuse to put others at risk? No. And besides, the hardware for that old a system is not likely to support any decent current games anyway.

As netizens, we have a responsibility for the safety and security of our fellow netizens. You don't drive with no brakes because you might kill someone *else*. You don't run stop signs because you might kill someone *else*. You don't walk around with a loaded gun hanging out of your pocket because you might kill someone *else*.

NOBODY (that I know of) wants to, or enjoys retiring perfectly good electronics that still meet our needs. But doing so is just a fact of life. How many times have you (speaking to the crowd) retired perfectly good cell phones for a new one? Old CRT monitors for new LCD monitors? Old TVs for new bigger screen models? VCR machines, cassette players, CD players and 8-tracks, and more?


alucasa said:


> Majority of viruses/malware nowsdays come from unhealthy habit of clicking everything they find interesting on the Internet. So, as long as you watch what you are doing, you will not encounter issues AV or not.


The majority of malware, yes. But that's by no means all malware. And that philosophy of not being "click-happy" (which I totally agree with) depends on keeping our systems current too. Again, in this case, were still talks SP*2*.


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## JonathanX (May 9, 2017)

First of all, I wanna thank all of you for your input. I didn't expect so many replies, so I'm happy you took the time and answered me, and provided suggestions.

Right now I am trying very hard to get a job so that I will be able to afford the kit I mentioned in a previous thread I created here, or a better PC in terms of hardware, and after that I will definitely switch to Windows 7 or 8. The two reasons I haven't already switched to 10 or upgraded my OS in any way is this: about a year ago I decided to try Windows 7, I got the Ultimate Edition and it caused issues wth my sound card. The drivers weren't working, or if they were, there was no way I could get a proper sound. I have this system at home:







and on Windows 7 it simply didn't work, I mean only the two frontal satellites were giving sound, the woofer and the rest were completely silent/mute. I remembered I fiddled with the sound card and with its drivers and settings until I got gray hairs, and I still couldn't make it work. This made me very disappointed and skeptical towards any OS newer than XP - which NEVER gave me such errors.

And the second reason is this: ever since I heard that Windows 10 is spying on everyone using it with the keylogger and whatnot, I got so mad at Microsoft that I avoid Windows 10 like plague. I believe they're doing a truly callous thing by surveilling every move we make when we're online, I would even go as far as claiming they're breaking the law which reffers to the invasion of privacy. I really don't feel comfortable knowing that Bill Gates or Paul Allen or Steve Ballmer or anyone else knows every single website I visit, every game I play, every post I give a like to on facebook, every song I listen on youtube, every key I press on my keyboard, etc. I don't know about them, so who or what gives them the right to know about me? I don't suppose they'd be very thrilled and filled with gratitude towards me if I invented some form of technology which would allow me to know, for instance, the exact date and time when their cocks didn't work, and with which finger they satisfied their wives/girlfriends whenever that happened, am I correct? I don't bump into their private lives, I invite them not to bump into mine. But I cannot do that on Windows 10, they already made their move, and I won't tolerate it. So, all in all, Windows 10 will get nothing but a big middle finger angrily raised towards it from me. And that's the bottom line.

PS: I will try using Windows 8 and I hope it won't give me problems, once I make enough money for a better PC.


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## Jetster (May 9, 2017)

Working with sound can be a challenge. Its much more complicated than graphics. Really has nothing to do with the OS XP 7 8 10 are all capable of controlling a descent 5.1. You need the correct software and hardware. A separate AVR is best, followed by a USB DAC, then a nice sound card last. Even most Motherboard can do 5.1 . You just need to know a few tricks and use the correct codex like ffdshow

Here is a thread that may be helpful.  https://www.techpowerup.com/forums/...olby-digital-live-and-dts-interactive.193148/

As far as 10 and being spied on. Quit listening to rumors


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## Cvrk (May 10, 2017)

Malwarebytes used to be good. I used it to many years.
Not anymore.
If you add exclusions , it does not respect them. Ignoring the rules you make . it's inexcusable.


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## SnakeDoctor (May 10, 2017)

Can still use Eset nod32 Antivirus version 7 and activate purchased licence
Top Antivirus in my opinion


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## Komshija (May 10, 2017)

Long ago I used AVG (back then you only had free edition) with Win XP, than Eset NOD 32, than Kaspersky. Current AVG Free is one "nasty" program that will spread into your registry and system files like a plague. 

From all AV's I used, Kaspersky proved to be the best, but that was some 10 years ago, so I have no idea how Win XP might work with newer versions.


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## Bill_Bright (May 10, 2017)

Cvrk said:


> Malwarebytes used to be good. I used it to many years.
> Not anymore.


That was true, but they have worked out the bugs from the 3.x fiasco. It is a good program again. 

But, for XP, it requires SP3.


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## eidairaman1 (May 10, 2017)

Used NOD32 then, Been using Avast.


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## Cvrk (May 10, 2017)

SnakeDoctor said:


> Can still use Eset nod32 Antivirus version 7 and activate purchased licence
> Top Antivirus in my opinion


Except you can't turn it off. NO way you can click Exit. On Malwarebytes you can , also on kaspersky. If i can't click Exit and it will close EVERYTHING that has to do with the antivirus it's bad. You must have full control over your own software all the times.

Try to install a security suit and see if it's what you like. I mean the free version, and yes most of the times you can't get the Security Internet full stuff in free edition,and add the key at a later time . This is where i turn to torrents.
Yes i am careful with my words. A version of pirated antivirus is a very bad idea. Hence to many things can go wrong by using a crack, it may stop protecting you when you need it the most etc etc.... just to many things can go wrong. But you should kinda test all these expensive softwares before you buy.

For example Avast Internet Security is expensive. If i would know that you can never turn it off, and give all that money....boy i would be extremely disappointed.
Test your software as much as possible , before purchase


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## StefanM (May 10, 2017)

As previous speakers said update to SP3.

Also there is the "POSready trick" 
This will update the XP kernel to February 9th, 2017.


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## eidairaman1 (May 10, 2017)

StefanM said:


> As previous speakers said update to SP3.
> 
> Also there is the "POSready trick"
> This will update the XP kernel to February 9th, 2017.



SP3 broke some stuff then, so when I did an xp build Id only put in sp2 and then manually update sans sp3.


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## erocker (May 10, 2017)

You shouldn't really need one. In no way should you be doing anything on an XP machine that would require any kind of security in the first place. The O/S is unsecure and no longer supported.


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## JonathanX (May 10, 2017)

erocker said:


> You shouldn't really need one. In no way should you be doing anything on an XP machine that would require any kind of security in the first place. The O/S is unsecure and no longer supported.



Thank you, I thought about that too, because some friends told me that since XP is so outdated, modern viruses and other types of malware and stuff don't even work under XP, so as funny as it sounds, I can't even get infected, like I can't catch a disease from a crocodile, cause biologically it's totally incompatible, scientifically speaking.


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## SnakeDoctor (May 10, 2017)

Cvrk said:


> Except you can't turn it off. NO way you can click Exit. On Malwarebytes you can , also on kaspersky. If i can't click Exit and it will close EVERYTHING that has to do with the antivirus it's bad. You must have full control over your own software all the times.
> 
> Try to install a security suit and see if it's what you like. I mean the free version, and yes most of the times you can't get the Security Internet full stuff in free edition,and add the key at a later time . This is where i turn to torrents.
> Yes i am careful with my words. A version of pirated antivirus is a very bad idea. Hence to many things can go wrong by using a crack, it may stop protecting you when you need it the most etc etc.... just to many things can go wrong. But you should kinda test all these expensive softwares before you buy.
> ...



Am a Eset Partner , use them mostly 
Ive been selling antivirus software for years , Bitdefender,Kaspersky,Eset Partner . I don't see the need to exit the antivirus software completely you could just pause the real time protection .(VIRUS CAN JUST CLOSE THE .EXE ) simply as that
I like to use eset the most Small file size to download(140mb),Good support ,lite on the system resources 

Kaspersky is good was selling it previously ,a few issues now and there with compatibility issue , adobe reader ect but newer version solved the issue 

Must of done a fair share of 500+ licenced bitdefender installation
Crappy gui since for the last 5 years,used to be nice and simple
So much hassle with bitdefender if you want to install on multipul pc you will need to download and install via web on each pc , no way to download Full installation file. So installing on many pc with slow internet can be a hassel  
Had many issues in the past for years , seem fine now but always bitdefender service not responding and need to reinstall the program , can be a fresh install
Had major renew licence issues on 50+ pc from previous year installation, don't even want to go there

Not a fan of free antivirus , seen to many infection in the past when pc scanned with Bitdefender ect (xp days  ) 
Avg 

I install a 30 day trail of Eset or Kaspersky then its up to them


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## Bill_Bright (May 10, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> Thank you, I thought about that too, because some friends told me that since XP is so outdated, modern viruses and other types of malware and stuff don't even work under XP so as funny as it sounds, I can't even get infected


Well, I am afraid your friend does not have a clue. While it _may_ be true that modern malware written for the later versions of Windows _might_ not "infect" your XP machine that really is a totally ignorant, and dangerous viewpoint. First, malware is still being written for XP because bad guys know there are still millions of hold outs. Second, there is still millions of old malware floating around that does infect XP. And third, as I noted several times already, XP systems can be compromised then used to attack other machines.

So, for example, a piece of malware may invade your system because it is incapable of defending against it. Then instead of actually infecting your computer and corrupting your hard drive, for example, it simply steals your Contacts list and infects all your family and friends who have upgraded. Or it uses your system to send spam, distribute malware, or to participate in DDoS attacks - all without you even realizing you are infected.


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## jboydgolfer (May 10, 2017)

Out of curiosity do you have a back up image for this machine in question @JonathanX ??


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## JonathanX (May 10, 2017)

@Bill_Bright :

You are also contradicting erocker here, not only my friends, who happen to be software programmers. The reason I started this thread instead of asking them for opinions was that one of them is in Italy right now on a little holiday with his fiancee, so I didn't wanna bother him at a time like this, and the other guy is a Linux expert who quit working with Windows years ago, but he is still into security and related stuff. Besides, more opinions wouldn't hurt, they are always welcome, but when it comes to you, judging after the other things you posted on this thread, I take it that you consider me unwelcome here because I still use XP and that makes me a liability in your eyes. I don't say I must be liked by everyone, I'm perfectly aware that's impossible, but at the same time I don't need a lawyer to realize that it's my legal right to use whatever OS I desire, and without the slightest intention of being arrogant towards you, I honestly think you are too anxious and/or paranoid.

@jboydgolfer :

What kind of backup image do you mean? Like a photo of my PC or what?


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## alucasa (May 10, 2017)

.... Obviously backup of the most important stuff: porn.


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## jboydgolfer (May 10, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> What kind of backup image do you mean? Like a photo of my PC or what?




No sir, i meant a backup of your OS. JUST in case things go in a "infected" direction (like all these folks have mentioned about the chance of infection etc) i just thought it might be a helpful point to make. XP aside, a backup is something i will always advocate to any user


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## JonathanX (May 10, 2017)

jboydgolfer said:


> No sir, i meant a backup of your OS. JUST in case things go in a "infected" direction (like all these folks have mentioned about the chance of infection etc) i just thought it might be a helpful point to make. XP aside, a backup is something i will always advocate to any user



Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't understand what you meant. My mistake 

Yes, I have my Windows XP on both a CD and a DVD, and I keep all my valuable stuff - movies, music, games, photos, etc - on DVDs. My 500 GB HDD has 2 partitions: one of 20 GB (called C) on which I install the OS, and another one (called D) which is filled with music, games, videoclips, pictures, program kits, etc. If I happen to get infected and I cannot get rid of the virus/trojan,/worm, whatever it is, I simply reinstall Windows, it doesn't affect the data I have on the other partition (D). Luckily for me, it hasn't happened yet for any malware to attack and cause damage to stuff that was on the other partition.

By the way, some people say that only applications or executable files can be infected, while others claim that anything can get infected - mp3 stuff, video files like AVI or mp4, photos, basically anything. What is the truth? Can a virus infect my music or my photos or any other files - like DVDrips?


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## SnakeDoctor (May 11, 2017)

> =" If I happen to get infected and I cannot get rid of the virus/trojan,/worm, whatever it is, I simply reinstall Windows, it doesn't affect the data I have on the other partition (D). Luckily for me, it hasn't happened yet for any malware to attack and cause damage to stuff that was on the other partition.



I would not think you safe without a Antivirus for Windows Xp , If you get infected by a Crypto ransomeware virus very common it will encrypt all you data -.jpg,doc,exl . Making its very difficult to retrieve your data most the time all data is lost
It will go through all you harddrives ,all networked pc in you home will be infected aswell
You could pay the +500$ to the ransomeware people to unlock your files, but unlikely to get anything back
Suspect email related to crypto ransomeware -Letter from Sars , Appear in Court , Cutstanding fines .Could have .zip attachments once open you buggered
Have seen many cases of this virus in my town ( on Xp )

Best way to solve the issue - Format PC an All Data is Lost Forever


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## Vayra86 (May 11, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> First of all, I wanna thank all of you for your input. I didn't expect so many replies, so I'm happy you took the time and answered me, and provided suggestions.
> 
> Right now I am trying very hard to get a job so that I will be able to afford the kit I mentioned in a previous thread I created here, or a better PC in terms of hardware, and after that I will definitely switch to Windows 7 or 8. The two reasons I haven't already switched to 10 or upgraded my OS in any way is this: about a year ago I decided to try Windows 7, I got the Ultimate Edition and it caused issues wth my sound card. The drivers weren't working, or if they were, there was no way I could get a proper sound. I have this system at home:
> 
> ...



You know there are also lots of people that believe in chem trails, pink unicorns, women's thighs and 10000 other oddities. If you want to be one of them, by all means, more power to you.

In the meantime, in the real world, W10 is just fine, 'the spying' really isn't what you think it is, and MS has a pretty damn solid track record when it comes to privacy of its customers. In fact, its track record is SO good, that companies still prefer Windows as the go-to OS and happily migrate their enterprise software towards never versions since XP. Most companies are on W7 right now, and I know for a fact that my employer is soon switching to W10 for the entire workplace. And I'm not a US citizen, I work in the EU, so corporate spying is definitely a consideration. Still, most EU companies use Windows.

Windows has always had an aura of 'tweak it until you drop' surrounding it, but in this day and age, you're much better off to stop fiddling with the OS and let it do its thing. It does things better than you can tweak it in 99% of all cases.

Its the same as with Android: the OS has matured. Back in the early Android days, you'd pop into task manager every ten seconds to close off apps, and today you can keep your phone on years and it'll manage the apps and memory usage better than you ever could.

With regards to your sound system, don't let that hold you back, the problem is not within the OS. When you (if you) upgrade your motherboard, get one with a decent onboard sound chip (most are very decent these days anyway) and keep things as simple as possible, also refer to guides posted earlier to get it to work.

If you really don't want 10, at least get Windows 8.1 so you have extended support for a good while. Its just as solid. Upgrading to 7 in the year 2017 makes zero sense because you'll still be behind the curve.


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## qubit (May 11, 2017)

@JonathanX The best a/v protection is of course to run W10 fully patched with a decent a/v app.

As you can't upgrade the PC right now, then you should install SP3 at the very least and all the millions of patches that came after it. It'll take a while...

It's still shot full of security holes of course, but it's better than it is at the moment.

For a/v I've been using Kaspersky Internet Security since 2006 which has been excellent. If it still supports XP, then I recommend it.

Once you can upgrade your hardware, then I recommend W10 with all the latest patches, even though you don't like it. It's a simple matter of a more secure design and support. Continue with Kaspersky.

Finally, regardless of what OS you use, you _must_ have a hardware firewall or it's just a matter of time until your PC gets infected. This includes Linux.


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (May 11, 2017)

Best AV for XP is to upgrade to at least Win 7


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## JonathanX (May 11, 2017)

qubit said:


> @JonathanX As you can't upgrade the PC right now, then you should install SP3 at the very least and all the millions of patches that came after it. It'll take a while...
> 
> It's still shot full of security holes of course, but it's better than it is at the moment.
> 
> ...



Yes, of course I have the Windows firewall set on "On", that's a must and a default for me, rest assured. Thank you for telling me about Kasperski, it works very well at the moment, so it looks like a good choice for now.

@Vayra86 :

I really don't understand what you mean, because you are making no sense. What do you mean by "women's thighs"? You want to say that women have no thighs, or if they do, they are oddities? As far as my English knowledge goes, here is the definition of the word "thigh" explained by the website called Wikipedia:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thigh

So as far as my understanding of semantics goes, saying that women have no thighs is pretty much like saying men have no elbows, or something like that. Maybe your manner of understanding the natural physiology of human beings presents some oddities, mister. I believe you were either drunk or on something, or you tend to express your ideas in a manner only you understand, otherwise I believe any psychiatrist would raise his eyebrows at what you wrote.

But I sense something else here, and if I'm not mistaken, it's a (more or less) subtle intent of irony towards me. And you know what some people say? "Bluffing is the final act of a desperate person." Well, in your case, I am inclined to think that mocking (ME in this case) is your final act of manipulating me into using Windows 10.

The mere fact that you are trying so hard to convince me of Windows 10's innocence only results in having the opposite effect on me. Just like a guilty person who starts screaming "I've done nothing, leave me alone!" whenever the cops approach him. Because otherwise why would you insist of advocating Microsoft's policies?

Here are just two of the countless websites which state clearly what Windows 10 is doing:

https://www.forbes.com/forbes/welco...soft-confirms-unstoppable-windows-10-tracking

http://bgr.com/2015/07/31/windows-10-upgrade-spying-how-to-opt-out/

Let me help you even further, I'll extract the paragraph from Microsoft’s privacy statement for you:

_Finally, we will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including your content (such as the content of your emails, other private communications or files in private folders), when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary to: 1.comply with applicable law or respond to valid legal process, including from law enforcement or other government agencies; 2.protect our customers, for example to prevent spam or attempts to defraud users of the services, or to help prevent the loss of life or serious injury of anyone; 3.operate and maintain the security of our services, including to prevent or stop an attack on our computer systems or networks; or 4.protect the rights or property of Microsoft, including enforcing the terms governing the use of the services – however, if we receive information indicating that someone is using our services to traffic in stolen intellectual or physical property of Microsoft, we will not inspect a customer’s private content ourselves, but we may refer the matter to law enforcement._

Did you read it? Was it clear enough? So how come you and some other guy here with 5 or 6 or 7 yellow stars can say that it's just a matter of rumors? Hmm?

Tell you what: why don't you just let it go and think something like this: "Hell, why should I bother with this guy? If he doesn't wanna listen to me, then let him stay with whatever OS he desires, and if he gets infected, it's entirely his own problem, he shouldn't come here crying and complaining, since me and so many others warned him from the start".

I understand you think differently from me, but the fact that you show no respect for my right of choosing an OS based on my free preferences is discriminating and insulting. So it's not me who should be ashamed for using an outdated OS because of my own reasons, but you, for disregarding and laughing at my constitutional liberties.

I stated it before and I'm gonna say it again, hopefully for the very last time: I will not, I repeat, I WILL NOT change my XP for Windows 10, only for 8 or 8.1, and that will happen when (and if) I will buy a newer and more performant PC. Is it clear enough? How much clearer do I have to make it? To hell with Windows 10! I will take a such a healthy fresh breath of air the day someone will tell me and prove me that all of its copies have been destroyed and all the algorythm implemented in it for collecting data from users has been erased, and ultimately, that Windows 10 is nothing but a tragic old story, like the Holocaust, for instance.

PS: all in all, I wanna thank everyone who posted here with the genuine desire of helping me, I appreciate your input, but since I sense that there is some chance for these discussions to go in an unpleasant direction, I would like to ask a Moderator or Admin to close this thread, since I already got enough answers, and my current Kasperski is doing a good job so far.


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## Bill_Bright (May 11, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> @Bill_Bright :
> 
> You are also contradicting erocker here,


I am not contradicting erocker at all! He is saying you should not be using XP anymore for anything that requires security. Connecting to the Internet requires security.

I am saying you should not be using XP anymore except in stand-alone mode - that is, when it has no access to the Internet.


JonathanX said:


> my friends, who happen to be software programmers.


Just because some one is a software programmer, that IN NO WAY means they are experts, or even knowledgeable about XP or Internet security.

I see no reason to continue this thread. You have made it clear you have no intention to become a safe user of the Internet by upgrading to a current version of Windows, in spite of all the warning many here have presented.

Sadly, you are closing your eyes to the facts. You also have demonstrated your total lack of understanding over privacy vs security. That's really sad. Microsoft is NOT trying to steal your passwords, your contacts, or your money from your bank accounts. Microsoft is not even trying to determine your real name, your home address, phone number, or other personally identifiable information. 

In fact, if you connect via Ethernet, the closest Microsoft knows of your physical location is your POP (point of presence ), the point where your ISP connects you to the Internet backbone. In my case, that is 10 miles away from my house, in the next town over! 

You cite and blame Microsoft privacy policies as your justification for continuing to be a threat to the rest of us! 

Your ISP knows EVERYTHING you do on the Internet. Microsoft doesn't. Your ISP even knows your real name, your home address, phone number and your billing information.

Your cell phone carrier not only knows your name, address billing information and phone number, they know EVERYONE you have emailed, and texted. And they know where you have been, where you are standing to within a few yards/meters (including the store and aisle!!! you are standing in), the direction you are heading and how fast you are moving.

Yet you are worried about installing the most secure Windows operating system yet because Microsoft knows somebody going by the anonymous username of JonathanX visited Techpowerup! 

I second your request for the mods to close this thread.


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## Vayra86 (May 12, 2017)

JonathanX said:


> Yes, of course I have the Windows firewall set on "On", that's a must and a default for me, rest assured. Thank you for telling me about Kasperski, it works very well at the moment, so it looks like a good choice for now.
> 
> @Vayra86 :
> 
> ...



Oh no, no irony intended, I think you really took that the wrong way. But there is an incredible lack of actual, real-world proof surrounding MS's alleged spying and evil-doing with your personal data, hence the pink unicorns. You'll also note that I pointed you towards not W10, but W8.1 should you want to upgrade. Me, personally, I like to make decisions based on facts, and the internet is well-known to twist facts or turn something small into something unreasonably huge.

The perspective is simple: they have an extremely solid track record on securing private (user) data and also on the way they use it, and more importantly: their business is partially and heavily based on security, stability and reliability, especially in Enterprise solutions. MS can't afford to drop the ball, this is simple economics. This is what solidifies *my* faith in MS to do whats right, and if they ever don't do what's right, I can always choose something else.

All in all, MS gets my 'benefit of the doubt', and I wanted to share this perspective. If you want to stay on XP, be my guest  It's just a huge hassle and that won't ever go away, it'll probably get worse over time. On top of that, there is a security aspect any Windows XP user that connects to the internet is blatantly ignoring, and that is the security of others. Its a minor detail (IMO) but it still is a way to compromise security.


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## Cvrk (May 12, 2017)

Right now you can only buy Win 10. Any other type you won't find on the Microsoft market.


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## Bill_Bright (May 12, 2017)

Vayra86 said:


> But there is an incredible lack of actual, real-world proof surrounding MS's alleged spying and evil-doing with your personal data, hence the pink unicorns.


That's because they are not "spying" or conducting any evil-doing. It makes no sense for them to do any of that. They know they are the most watched and scrutinized software company ever. If there is any evil-eye out there, it is the IT press and Microsoft bashers out there just waiting to pounce on even the appearance of anything mischievous. 

Ed Bott/ZD Net: No, Microsoft is not spying on you with Windows 10. 

The fact, is, it is in Microsoft's best interest to protect our security, not violate it. Why? Because they know they will be relentlessly blamed and bashed by the IT press and Microsoft bashers and their blind, tinfoil hat wearing followers if our security is breached anyway. Even when it is the bad guys committing the offenses, and even though the bad guys were most likely successful because the user failed to maintain safe computing practices. That is, they failed to keep Windows and their security apps current and they failed to avoid risky behavior like being "click-happy" on unsolicited links, downloads, attachments, and popups!  The user is always the weakest link in security. Failing to keep their computers current is essential.

Because Microsoft knows they will be blamed anyway, they would much rather get bashed for forcing Windows Updates on us (thus keeping our computers current and secure) than get blamed for a lack of security. And I applaud them for that.

Again, unless you give it Microsoft, they don't know your real name, your home address, your phone number, your billing information, Social Security or Insurance Numbers, or credit ratings. But your ISP and cell phone carriers sure do. And your cell carriers know your current physical location too. So for anyone concerned about their privacy, they need to stop whining about Microsoft and look at their ISPs and cell phone carriers. Those are the one's who know everything about you, and what you do while using their services. 



Vayra86 said:


> On top of that, there is a security aspect any Windows XP user that connects to the internet is blatantly ignoring, and that is the security of others. Its a minor detail (IMO) but it still is a way to compromise security.


It may be minor in terms of being a "direct" threat to our own personal W10 systems. But these compromised XP systems are typically used to attack our banks, our insurance companies, government agencies and other on-line organizations as part of DDoS attacks. So indirectly, they certainly are threats to us and by no means minor.


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## Frick (May 12, 2017)

I feel like I should point out that "spying" in this context is not a catch-all term and people define it as anything from "MS gathering _anything_, including HID" and "I want them to watch me undress so it's not spying right?"

https://docs.microsoft.com/sv-se/wi...ic-level-windows-diagnostic-events-and-fields

There you go if you are really interested, which y'all might be. Do they need all that? Do they _need _to know my carrier (if installed on say a tablet with a SIM card)? I assume it fills a purpose for them, but you might not agree. I might actually read the entire thing just to be able to have this discussion. A cursory read says that they do gather a whole lot about your system, and your reboot habits, and when you install/remove apps from the Windows Store, and how Windows Update worked, if it respected active hours or not, and when an install was paused was it done by the user or not, and so on. Device colour somehow. Knowing your hardware is essential for them, as is install data if you're to use the Store. Lots of stuff, but it seems to me the mass of it is not as much MS being nefarious as the world being connected and multi-device.



JonathanX said:


> Let me help you even further, I'll extract the paragraph from Microsoft’s privacy statement for you:
> 
> _Finally, we will access, disclose and preserve personal data, including your content (such as the content of your emails, other private communications or files in private folders), when we have a good faith belief that doing so is necessary to: 1.comply with applicable law or respond to valid legal process, including from law enforcement or other government agencies; 2.protect our customers, for example to prevent spam or attempts to defraud users of the services, or to help prevent the loss of life or serious injury of anyone; 3.operate and maintain the security of our services, including to prevent or stop an attack on our computer systems or networks; or 4.protect the rights or property of Microsoft, including enforcing the terms governing the use of the services – however, if we receive information indicating that someone is using our services to traffic in stolen intellectual or physical property of Microsoft, we will not inspect a customer’s private content ourselves, but we may refer the matter to law enforcement._
> 
> Did you read it? Was it clear enough? So how come you and some other guy here with 5 or 6 or 7 yellow stars can say that it's just a matter of rumors? Hmm?



I see no problem with that statement whatsoever. It's how the world works, it's how email providers work, it's how governments works. If you don't like any of it, you go complicated and slow (TOR, heavy heavy encryption, VPNs, move to countries with ISPs that just don't care). If you care, but not that much, you accept that "privacy" is very much a relative term, especially online. I mean cops should be able to go after child predators, right? That is a terrible example and the one every authoritarian begins every argument for increased government control, but it is sadly ... true. Which is why there are checks and controls, or at least there are supposed to be. And then we are in politics and not tech, so nuts to that. Suffice to say that privacy statement is fine for an organization such as MS. Use protonmail.


Anyway, what you should do is go Linux and hack together them drivers on your own. What sound system is that? There might actually be a Linux solution. Then you get to keep that sweet machine AND get a modern, secure machine. 

EDIT: BTW, your really still uses a CRT? What model? A part of me wished I kept at least one of the good Syncmasters I had, but alas.


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## Bill_Bright (May 12, 2017)

Frick said:


> I see no problem with that statement whatsoever.


I don't either and I did read it and note is says nothing about using the information for any sort of marketing or profit. Nor does it say they will share or sell that information to any 3rd party.

So again, if you are a tin-foil hat wearer, I am sure you will read into what Microsoft says as they will steal your first born and sacrifice him or her to their shareholders in spite of the fact expert pundits have tested, dissected and tested again to prove Microsoft is not the evil beast some believe. 



Frick said:


> A part of me wished I kept at least one of the good Syncmasters


They were great monitors but I preferred the Sony Trinitrons. And many still prefer the quality of a good CRT. I relate it to those who prefer the "tonal" qualities of high end "analog" recordings vs "digital". If CRTs weren't so big, heavy and power hungry heat generators for the size of their screens, they might still be around. The fact the tubes contained mercury didn't help either.


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