# Radeon HD 6970 Launch May Face Delays



## btarunr (Nov 8, 2010)

Originally slated for a November 22 launch, AMD's next-generation enthusiast-grade GPU, the Radeon HD 6970 may face some launch delays, according to industry sources. Apparently the company is yet to finalize a launch driver and BIOS for the HD 6970, and that could push back launch by a little. Meanwhile, a Zol.com.cn contributor let out some juicy pictures of the HD 6970 reference design accelerator. 



 

 



*View at TechPowerUp Main Site*


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## n-ster (Nov 8, 2010)

I hope it does not have delays.... I'd prefer sucky drivers that will be fixed in a months time, but have the original launch date!


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## Wile E (Nov 8, 2010)

n-ster said:


> I hope it does not have delays.... I'd prefer sucky drivers that will be fixed in a months time, but have the original launch date!



Not me. I'm tired of being a beta tester with early adoption. I'd rather wait for a decent product to be released, than to spend big money on something that's unusable until they update.


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## caleb (Nov 8, 2010)

With the red team you're always a beta tester


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## halfwaythere (Nov 8, 2010)

Thats simply a tactic to prevent leaks and give nvidia some shivers down their spine. The cards are already shipped to several testers and providing them with bioses and drivers is a no hassle job. 

I think the 580 launch date surprised them a little and as a consequence they want their launch kept pretty tight.


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## Hayder_Master (Nov 8, 2010)

ok any final details about it
i remember this
850 core , 1600 memory , 256 bit , 32 rops


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## Radical_Edward (Nov 8, 2010)

May? That's quite a wait.


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## Fourstaff (Nov 8, 2010)

6+8 pins for power? And that card looks looooong.


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## n-ster (Nov 8, 2010)

Radical_Edward said:


> May? That's quite a wait.



NOOOOOO lol... they may face delays means they perhaps will face delays


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## Radical_Edward (Nov 8, 2010)

Ahhh... I was going to say, damn dude.


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## function69 (Nov 8, 2010)

caleb said:


> With the red team you're always a beta tester



Ain't that the truth 

I'd prefer for the card to come out asap, so the price war begins.
Plus, I can't wait to see how 6970 stacks up against gtx 580 that comes out this Tuesday!


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## caleb (Nov 8, 2010)

halfwaythere said:


> Thats simply a tactic to prevent leaks and give nvidia some shivers down their spine.



Really ?
Nasdaq : Nvidia Q32010 Revenue 903million $
NYSE : AMD Q32010 Revenue 1,6 billion $


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## gumpty (Nov 8, 2010)

Two crossfire fingers. Crikey doodle dandy.

They improved the Crossfire scaling with the 6870, I wonder if the CrossfireX scaling is improved too?


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## csendesmark (Nov 8, 2010)

This new is nonsens!
AMD is always bringing it's products in time!  (at least in the past few years)


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## Eva01Master (Nov 8, 2010)

That's AMD, not only Ati...


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## crow1001 (Nov 8, 2010)

Card design looks cheap for a highend part.


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## erixx (Nov 8, 2010)

There are some statements in here that could qualify as "suicidical fanboyism", lol. 

Deliver regardless of state of completion? my azz, no!!! haha


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## HossHuge (Nov 8, 2010)

It's like a soap opera around here...


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## jagd (Nov 8, 2010)

Im curious ,are they have a source for this news or repeating what Fudzilla wrote


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## n-ster (Nov 8, 2010)

crow1001 said:


> Card design looks cheap for a highend part.



It looks clean, simple and professional


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## killerbee (Nov 8, 2010)

caleb said:


> Really ?
> Nasdaq : Nvidia Q32010 Revenue 903million $
> NYSE : AMD Q32010 Revenue 1,6 billion $



... AMD Q32010  net loss : 118m $ .... totally irrelevant the quantity of revenue, if there was no profit, but there is a massive loss...


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## caleb (Nov 8, 2010)

Yeah I just wanted to give an idea of why would Nvidia give a F about anything what AMD does nowdays.


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## Nosada (Nov 8, 2010)

I give it another 10 posts before they start comparing AMD to Hitler. Godwin's law HAS to be obeyed!


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## pantherx12 (Nov 8, 2010)

caleb said:


> Yeah I just wanted to give an idea of why would Nvidia give a F about anything what AMD does nowdays.




Because in terms of current gen market share ATI are smacking nvidia around, if they continue to do so then ATI will be on top.

( source, see any hardware data website, steam hardware for example, DX11 and dx 10.1 hardware ati are way infront)




Also GOOD news, for me ! longer to save up.


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## killerbee (Nov 8, 2010)

pantherx12 said:


> Because in terms of current gen market share ATI are smacking nvidia around, if they continue to do so then ATI will be on top.
> 
> ( source, see any hardware data website, steam hardware for example, DX11 and dx 10.1 hardware ati are way infront)
> 
> ...



hmmm.... Q32010 : 7,67m AMD discrete desktop vga (11% incr) vs 11m NV discrete desktop vga (28% incr)... 42% AMD vs 58% NV...
_
"ATI are smacking nvidia around"_

full market share Q32010, inc. discrete mobil vga and igp 50,3% AMD vs 49,6% NV...


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## DigitalUK (Nov 8, 2010)

drivers is one thing, but bios with 14 days to go doesnt sound good


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## HalfAHertz (Nov 8, 2010)

csendesmark said:


> This new is nonsens!
> AMD is always bringing it's products in time!  (at least in the past few years)



I think you forgot about the HD2900 which was much more late(and underperforming) than Fermi


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## claylomax (Nov 8, 2010)

This has been on the Fudzilla website since Friday; this is next in the story: http://fudzilla.com/graphics/item/20770-cayman-reportedly-plagued-by-manufacturing-issues


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## meirb111 (Nov 8, 2010)

in one of the pictures it looks like the card was involved in a  car accident


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## Imsochobo (Nov 8, 2010)

meirb111 said:


> in one of the pictures it looks like the card was involved in a  car accident



just plastic to protect a black surface


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## csendesmark (Nov 8, 2010)

killerbee said:


> hmmm.... Q32010 : 7,67m AMD discrete desktop vga (11% incr) vs 11m NV discrete desktop vga (28% incr)... 42% AMD vs 58% NV...
> _
> "ATI are smacking nvidia around"_
> 
> full market share Q32010, inc. discrete mobil vga and igp 50,3% AMD vs 49,6% NV...



http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/
check the DX11 section
AMD ownz 66+%


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## bmwm3gtr (Nov 8, 2010)

hayder.master said:


> ok any final details about it
> i remember this
> 850 core , 1600 memory , 256 bit , 32 rops



AMD has improve a lot on their drivers and hardware products lately, such as Barts Pro and XT..Plus it support 3D stereoscopic too...Hope they will introduce new hardware physics processing units..I know this sound impossible~ AMD


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## claylomax (Nov 8, 2010)

meirb111 said:


> in one of the pictures it looks like the card was involved in a  car accident



If that's true, I'm sorry for the other car, it must be a wreck!


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## mdm-adph (Nov 8, 2010)

Bloody software is holding it back?  Actually, I have no problem for -- just this once -- AMD taking a little more time to make sure it's working right first, judging from the usual state of their software.


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## Cheeseball (Nov 8, 2010)

AMD's OpenCL framework (formerly ATI Stream) is STILL completely shit though. I wish they would concentrate on that more as stream processing has now become NVIDIA's cashcow in the developer's segment (and this is big). CUDA is the only reason why I have a GTX 460 768MB on my 3rd PCI-E slot.

They didn't even update their SDK since August.


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## Yellow&Nerdy? (Nov 8, 2010)

God damn, it looks to be even longer than the 5870... I hope the launch isn't delayed too much.


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## csendesmark (Nov 8, 2010)

Cheeseball said:


> AMD's OpenCL framework (formerly ATI Stream) is STILL completely shit though. I wish they would concentrate on that more as stream processing has now become NVIDIA's cashcow in the developer's segment (and this is big). CUDA is the only reason why I have a GTX 460 768MB on my 3rd PCI-E slot.
> 
> They didn't even update their SDK since August.



OpenCL is not only "AMD"
its _OPEN_


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## Cheeseball (Nov 8, 2010)

csendesmark said:


> OpenCL is not only "AMD"
> its _OPEN_



I mean it's implementation (SDK, compiler, support, etc.) is still much to be desired.


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## Steevo (Nov 8, 2010)

caleb said:


> With the red team you're always a beta tester



How would you know other than drinking the green kool aid? 

Your using the equivalency of a wal-mart computer, at 1280X1024 resolution. I have no issues with my 5870, I even went into the registry and xml files to unlock all the options possible. Makes games look amazing, and the only games I have issues with are the ones that just have issues for both the red and green team.


So, in your professional Wal-Mart opinion, I am a beta tester for AMD/ATI? 


Just because AMD/ATI moves on with technology and the newest drivers don't give your three generation old card a 20% performance boost you get pissy? Amazing.


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

Considering the "fun" I have with Cypress-based cards, and Eyefinity's corrupt cursor(still present in 6-series cards, too), I'd say very much so that consumers are placed in the role of "beta tester".

You did reg hacks?  Perfect example of what I mean.

Eyefinity should NOT have been released. BETA tech, all teh way...heck, even on the 6-series, most hardware parts needed for Eyefinity don't even exist today. I am refering, of course, to the DP 1.2 multi-stream boxes, and the daisy-chainable monitors.

Someone's been drinking the red Koolaid, I'm afraid. Obviously, because if you check the Eyefinity thread here, and other other forums...oh, look...tonnes of problems.:shadedshu 

Everyone here has cursor corruption...


Eyefinity still hasn't left beta, but they hype it to no end. Unless, of course, you want to call a card that artifacts on desktop a properly working part...


IN case you missed it *ALL AMD EYEFINITY-supporting CARDS RUNNING DUAL OR MORE MONITORS ARTIFACT WHILE ON DESKTOP, IF USING A DISPLAYPORT CONNECTION.*

I could tell you the real reason why these cards are delayed...I've been saying that they would be for over a month now...but fanboys will be fanboys, and clearly, I'm not one of those any longer, so I am unsure whether my fanboy language will translate clearly now.


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## the54thvoid (Nov 8, 2010)

Well, perhaps AMD believes the 580's will NOT bve readily available at 'launch' and feel it is justifiable to tweak things.  
Either way, I'll be hoping both camps cards come out in synchronicity so we can gauge against each other.

But if the Cayman slips to 2011, this will be hugely embarassing having been touted as super dooper reliable with the 5 series.

The 580 won't steal the show for Nvidia though.  It's purely an e-peen card and i guess going to be limited.  

I'm still waiting for the SOC 480 from Gigabyte.  That card could be my single card quiet(ish) dream.


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

I think AMd has been sniffing glue for months now.

AMD's own, David Hoff:




> A one year cadence is about the best you're ever going to see on a new architecture," he continued. "We've got another unbelievable launch, with a wide range of products. That's about the best we could dream of.




Read more: http://www.techradar.com/news/compu...mas-717388?src=rss&attr=newsall#ixzz14i0JQ84n


Hmmm...2 cards is a "wide range of products"?



WHUT!?!




:shadedshu



So saw it here, boys. This is the best AMD could dream of...."delayed" cards.


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## KainXS (Nov 8, 2010)

they probably just want to launch the 6950, 6970 and 6990 together.


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## Steevo (Nov 8, 2010)

Reg hacks. Yes. I changed a "0" to a 1"" 


I am a leet haxor by changing some numbers in the windows registry. For options that are beta, or may have compatibility issues with other driver features.


I choose to enable parts of software in the driver pack that aren't meant to be. Nvidia does the same, otherwise why would we have software that allows you to enable it from third partys? Ahhh, right. Nvidia does no wrong. You will get their options like Physx supported on 13 games with GPU acceleration, when it has been proven that a modern CPU will outperform their GPU implementation when the software is written on a platform that isn't made for a 486DX.


How is Nvidia or ATI supposed to test every single CPU/MOBO/GPU/RAM/OS/SOFTWARE combination? Yet every user with a issue immediately blames them for issues.


If you don't like their product, don't buy it.


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

KainXS said:


> they probably just want to launch the 6950, 6970 and 6990 together.



Just FYI, my link is from September 17th, a short time before the launch.


ALso note that shortly after this, is when my whole attitude, about 4-D shaders, and everything else AMD, changed. I guess I know something no other "journalist" in tech knows.....or they've been paid to shut up...


Steevo said:


> Reg hacks. Yes. I changed a "0" to a 1""
> 
> 
> I am a leet haxor by changing some numbers in the windows registry. For options that are beta, or may have compatibility issues with other driver features.



Yeah, you did something clearly AMD could not. Unless, of course, you are lying, and things are NOT working just fine for you...because if they really worked fine, why wouldn't AMD enable it themselves?

:shadedshu


Do you need some help getting those feet out of your mouth?

Also, I might have some inside info you do not. Try something...ask AMD what they used for thier Eyefinity demos, and how they avoided the cursor corruption. The answer may suprise you...even more so considering they seem to have forgotten to let Eyefinity users know how to avoid the problem.


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## Athlon2K15 (Nov 8, 2010)

Steevo said:


> Reg hacks. Yes. I changed a "0" to a 1""
> 
> 
> I am a leet haxor by changing some numbers in the windows registry. For options that are beta, or may have compatibility issues with other driver features.
> ...







You Mad? I get it that your a fanboi,just clean the sand out of your vag and go on with life its a video card.


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## boise49ers (Nov 8, 2010)

*Cargo container !*

That thing looks like a cargo container.I wouldn't be able to afford it any way. 
That's why I just bought the 6870. That should keep me in the 
loop for at least another year :  )


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## erocker (Nov 8, 2010)

It's not as big as some of you may think.

HD 5870





HD6970


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

1/2 inch longer PCB. 5870's pcb stops short of the end of the cooler shroud, 6970 goes right to the end. The extra plastic on the end of 5870 was intentional so OEMs could build cases and such in which these card fit.  Welcome to the new size of high-end single-gpu VGAs.


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## the54thvoid (Nov 8, 2010)

There's an awful lot of nastiness kicking in here.

It's evident there are people taking sides and that's human nature - that's why the world sucks.  So cant' we leave it out of a freaking tech forum.  We're all geek (to some power or other).

On track - The delay is a rumour until AMD says "Oops., we're late guys!"

Can people stop being nasty?  It's a f*cking expensive toy that lets you play games FFS! Or a Folding tool that lets you think you're saving the world.

My two cents - AMD and Nvidia have both become tits this past year.


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

They already said "Ooops" during the 6870/6850 launch. Just none but me heard them.  

And I agree, both have failed hard, but really, It's not thier fault, except when they lie to cover up the problems. Honesty wins all, with me. They can make mistakes, that's no big deal...it's the lying about it that gets me going.


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## bogie (Nov 8, 2010)

hayder.master said:


> ok any final details about it
> i remember this
> 850 core , 1600 memory , 256 bit , 32 rops



I heard it was gonna be 900 or 950 on the core! Almost guaranteed 1GHZ o/c! Yay! 

I would not believe these false reports about being late, pure FUD!


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## the54thvoid (Nov 8, 2010)

cadaveca said:


> They already said "Ooops" during the 6870/6850 launch. Just none but me heard them.
> 
> And I agree, both have failed hard, but really, It's not thier fault, except when they lie to cover up the problems. Honesty wins all, with me. They can make mistakes, that's no big deal...it's the lying about it that gets me going.



I'm assuming you're implying TSMC.  Many people think it stands for Taiwanese Semiconductor Manufacturing Company but it does in fact stand for "Take Shit and Make Crap"


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## Steevo (Nov 8, 2010)

Perhaps the issue with the cursor is specific combination of hardware, software, drivers, OS.....etc

All things beyond their control. If one piece of software for playing DVD's causes a fast switch issue and thus the large cursor, is it ATI's fault, or the software?


I enabled things like geometry instacing, a few different patterns of AA, AF and the ability to force DXVA and WMV hardware accleration. It has gotten me a couple times of video hangs due to codec problems, but once I sorted them it works great. 


Take the average user that tries to enable it with a incompatible codec or one known to cause issue and they will cry like a little bitch about how horrible ATI is with their drivers.


Issues I have are currently.

Even with a custom BIOS the fast switch hang and video corruption still occurs with the codecs i have to use with my HG20 camcorder. I can't blame ATI for Pixelas shitty software though.

Occasional hang and green flash video. Voltage, GPU speed, memory speed, multi-monitor, Windows 7 and Vista. No difference, so I tend to blame Adobe for flash, as silverlight with hardware acceleration on Netflix is flawless.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/graphics/2006/04/07/transparency_adaptive_aa_explained/2

For ATI cards the ability to use reg hacks to enable things that are no officially supported has been around for a long time. 

"It's also possible to get Adaptive AA working on any GPU that is newer than Radeon 9700 via a registry hack. This is not officially supported by ATI, and performance implications are quite large. However, if you're interested in giving it a try for yourself, please read our news story covering the topic."


Nvidia does some things differently, however I have used alot of third party tools on their cards to enable features.


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

Steevo said:


> Perhaps the issue with the cursor is specific combination of hardware, software, drivers, OS.....etc




I have eliminated all those possibilities. Differnt rig, board, mem, vgas, HDD's, psu...It's been over a year, and I hafvee eve ntried both AMd and Intel...and EVERY USER IN THE EYEFINITY THREAD HAS CORRUPTION. EVERY ONE. THe only commonality is using a DP connection on AMd cards.

I know what the problem is, exactly, with the cursor. It will basically NEVER be fixed on 5-series cards, 100% for sure...it's been 13 months now!


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## Steevo (Nov 8, 2010)

Are you using adapters?

It occurred on my new 5870 but as soon as I flashed my custom BIOS on it it has never happened sense.


If we could find WHY it happens, or WHEN it happens. Is it a scaling issue, does changing to a different pointer fix it?


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

timings for DVI and DP are different. AMD hardware has issues translating that. It's hardware-based...no driver will fix it. Been saying this for months now. Adapters don't make any difference. Driver's only change the end result, but do not prevent corruption.

Likewise, a bios will not fix it. I am running the most recent bios from AMD.


I have tried both reference and non-reference cards.


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## wolf (Nov 8, 2010)

reminds me of when I bought my 5870 at launch and there was driver issues with a fair few games, and a lot of cloudyness surrounding eyefinity.

In fact I remember the 5870 product page on the official AMD/ATI website at the time, had a disclaimer at the time to the effect of;

*driver support for 5800 series cards sheduled for 2010


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## Steevo (Nov 8, 2010)

Have other users replicated it on DP monitors, with the same result?


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

NO offense, Steevo, but what part of ALL EYEFINITY USERS ON THIS FORUM(and others) HAVE THE PROBLEM do you not understand?

It's not software, it's the display output of the 5-series cards that causes the issue. 6-series cards have DP1.2, to fix the problem, but it only works with either the multistream boxes, or daisy-chained monitors. Without either of those, even the 6-series cards ahve the problem, as the DP and DVI outputs have different timings and protocols. 

To eliminate the corruption, you must use the same type of output for all monitors, however, as it stands today, this is not possible, as the hardware is not on the market, and will not be, until next year.

And with that said, Eyefinity isn't even Beta...it's more like "alpha"...bare functionality, but broken as hell.


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## yogurt_21 (Nov 8, 2010)

erocker said:


> *It's not as big as some of you may think.*
> HD 5870
> http://i403.photobucket.com/albums/pp112/erocker414/5870.jpg
> HD6970
> http://i403.photobucket.com/albums/pp112/erocker414/6970.jpg



that's what she said!

didn't expect it to be much larger, even despite being stuck on 40nm it doesn't seem like the core is goign to get that much larger and 256-bit mem says they don't have to add too many chips onthe board either.


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## bear jesus (Nov 8, 2010)

I have to chime in on this, i started getting the corrupt cursor yesterday (no idea why it took so long to start happening) not on the monitor with the display port adapter but one that's on a dvi port. i was really not looking forward to getting this problem as i knew before buying that basically everyone else running eyefinity was but now i see it as a very minor issue that is more than made up for with the extra screen space.

But i accept that it is an old issue that can be very annoying for some people but if it is a hardware limitation thus unfixable why does ati keep adding "fixed corrupt cursor" to the driver fixes list?


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

Becuase I bitch about it so much, they now admit it's an issue, at least, and maybe they can pull some driver magic to fix it, but I highly doubt that they will ahve any success implementing a driver fix. They've listed it as fixed in the release notes, several times now, only to have it appear in the next month's notes as "a known issue".

You, bear, will be able to switch to a multi-stream box, when they come out, because you have 6-series, and this will eliminate the problem. So all is not lost for you. 5-series owners, unfortunately, do not have this option. I bought 5-series cards specifically for Eyefinity, so yeah, it's a sore point for me.

It's doesn't happen on the DP monitor for me, most often, either...it's on the DVI monitors that the cursor shows up corrupt most often. But give it some time, and you'll see it on the DP monitor as well.


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## bear jesus (Nov 8, 2010)

cadaveca said:


> You, bear, will be able to switch to a multi-stream box, when they come out, because you have 6-series, and this will eliminate the problem. So all is nto lost for you. 5-series owners, unfortunately, do not have this option. I bought 5-series cards specifically for Eyefinity, so yeah, it's a sore point for me.
> 
> It's doesn't happen on the DP monitor for me, most often, either...it's on the DVI monitors that the cursor shows up corrupt most often.



for me so far it's been a non issue so i doubt i would want to change form my current setup, but i admit one of the reasons i was happy waiting to upgrade is so that ati or nvidia worked out the bugs with triple monitor setups... it did not work out so well  but i admit if i had got the 5xxx cards and been dealing with this issue for the past year while expecting a fix i would be pretty pissed by now.


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## lashton (Nov 8, 2010)

function69 said:


> Ain't that the truth
> 
> I'd prefer for the card to come out asap, so the price war begins.
> Plus, I can't wait to see how 6970 stacks up against gtx 580 that comes out this Tuesday!



And with the green team you will be buying new cards when tour cards fan stops


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

bear jesus said:


> for me so far it's been a non issue so i doubt i would want to change form my current setup, but i admit one of the reasons i was happy waiting to upgrade is so that ati or nvidia worked out the bugs with triple monitor setups... it did not work out so well  but i admit if i had got the 5xxx cards and been dealing with this issue for the past year while expecting a fix i would be pretty pissed by now.


Well, it wouldn't really be a config change for you...the multi-stream box would connect to one single DP output, and then that box connects to all monitors. It would just be a simple addition, and would eliminate 2 cables coming out from the pc. That single cable, could, as well, also connect USB to the monitors, as well, further eliminating cable clutter. But i do not think that the AMD cards offer the proper hardware for USB over DP1.2...time will tell...


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## newtekie1 (Nov 8, 2010)

So a 6-pin and an 8-pin means it is breaking the 300w barrier.  I wonder by how much...


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## the54thvoid (Nov 8, 2010)

Is a 6 pin not 75W and an 8 pin 150W and the PCI express 75W?  That makes 300W tops.

Would you not need 2 x 8 pins to crash over 300W?

And even if i'm right? i'm sure it's not that straight forward...


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## bear jesus (Nov 8, 2010)

cadaveca said:


> Well, it wouldn't really be a config change for you...the multi-stream box would connect to one single DP output, and then that box connects to all monitors. It would just be a simple addition, and would eliminate 2 cables coming out from the pc. That single cable, could, as well, also connect USB to the monitors, as well, further eliminating cable clutter. But i do not think that the AMD cards offer the proper hardware for USB over DP1.2...time will tell...



I'm using 3 dvi monitors with one on an active display port adapter so it would involve buying 2 more adapters the multi stream box and all for a problem that i don't really see often and does not have a negative effect on my usage, to be honest i would rather keep that money to go towards a 6970 or 580 

But i admit if i was using display port monitors i would grab the box so i had the ability to add more monitors.


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

nah, the multistream boxes will do DVI-D/HDMi/VGA/DP out, just DP in.  I'm hoping they'll sell for about $69.99.

See page 7:

http://www.amd.com/us/Documents/AMD_Radeon_Display_Technologies_WP.pdf


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## bear jesus (Nov 8, 2010)

cadaveca said:


> nah, the multistream boxes will do DVi-D out, just DP in.  I'm hoping they'll sell for about $69.99.



Oh i assumed it was display port in and out, if your right about the rough price that would make it a pretty awesome thing to have, i will have to keep an eye out for one.


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## TRIPTEX_CAN (Nov 8, 2010)

LOL driver problems.. I'm pretty surprised. 


"I accidentally . the driver" 

When AMD is apparently months ahead of the competition to release these products (5000/6000) I would think taking a month extra to pound out driver conflicts before launch would be a good thing.. NOPE 10.10y hotfix is on the way.


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

Basically, it's exactly as that pic shows.

Except the TH2G only does max 1680x1050 per screen, when using 3. AMD's solution supports HD res, plus 3D, etc.


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## overclocking101 (Nov 8, 2010)

so it looks like the 6970 is only 1 inch to 2 inches longer then the 5870 comparing the photos of the backside, that is if the core is located on the same plece on the pcb which it looks to be so. also, no bios OR drivers?? this close to launch?? one would think with all the hype this stuff would have been sorted, also with leaked benches etc and people getting cards already one would think they have it sorted, but who knows now a days


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## newtekie1 (Nov 8, 2010)

the54thvoid said:


> Is a 6 pin not 75W and an 8 pin 150W and the PCI express 75W?  That makes 300W tops.
> 
> Would you not need 2 x 8 pins to crash over 300W?
> 
> And even if i'm right? i'm sure it's not that straight forward...



Nah, PCI-E 2.0 does 150w, IIRC.

That is why the GTX470 pulling 232w can make do with two 6-pin connectors or the HD5970 pulling 304w needs a 6-pin and an 8-pin.  At least that is the way I've always understood it.


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## EarthDog (Nov 8, 2010)

75W at the slot for PCIe2.0. Go to PCIsig and looksee. I thought the same thing for the longest time as well. Sites reports ALL OVER that its 150W at the slot too. 

I didnt read this entire thread, but aside from driver/bios issues, I thought yields were single digits from TSMC on these things (if true, anyone want to bet that dope charlie doesnt report this?!!).

http://www.techeye.net/chips/amds-cayman-christmas-card-delayed-say-taiwanese-sources


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## newtekie1 (Nov 8, 2010)

EarthDog said:


> 75W at the slot for PCIe2.0. Go to PCIsig and looksee. I thought the same thing for the longest time as well. Sites reports ALL OVER that its 150W at the slot too.
> 
> I didnt read this entire thread, but aside from driver/bios issues, I thought yields were single digits from TSMC on these things (if true, anyone want to bet that dope charlie doesnt report this?!!).
> 
> http://www.techeye.net/chips/amds-cayman-christmas-card-delayed-say-taiwanese-sources



Then how do cards that pull 300w+ get away with only a 6-pin and an 8-pin?


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## EarthDog (Nov 8, 2010)

Thats a logical statement I have no answer to and actually asked myself. I can only point you to PCIsig again for clarification and this thread I particpated in when I thought the same thing. My guess is that the 75/150 watt numbers for the 6/8 pins are not a hard wall.

http://www.overclockers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=614657

Specifically post #9 ^^

Link form there, look at slide 39 (link below)http://www.pcisig.com/developers/ma...c_id=b590ba08170074a537626a7a601aa04b52bc3fec

Also, what cards pull over 300W from the factory? Not the 5970. Not the 480... not the GTX 295...


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## HalfAHertz (Nov 8, 2010)

I think that pci-e will be 150W


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## cadaveca (Nov 8, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> Then how do cards that pull 300w+ get away with only a 6-pin and an 8-pin?



8-pin =150w
6-pin =75w
slot =75w in highpower mode.

total=300w.

but bear in mind, 6-pin max is NOT jus 75w...it's 150w, dependant on wiring(wire gauge specifics for 150w via ATX PSU spec).

Since I have yet to see a site actually measure power consumption @ the slot(near impossible), any power usage numbers are suspect at best, if not outright faked.


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## Wile E (Nov 9, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> Then how do cards that pull 300w+ get away with only a 6-pin and an 8-pin?



Because an 8 pin is just a 6 pin with 2 more grounds. There are no additional 12V leads.


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## Imsochobo (Nov 9, 2010)

cadaveca said:


> Becuase I bitch about it so much, they now admit it's an issue, at least, and maybe they can pull some driver magic to fix it, but I highly doubt that they will ahve any success implementing a driver fix. They've listed it as fixed in the release notes, several times now, only to have it appear in the next month's notes as "a known issue".
> 
> You, bear, will be able to switch to a multi-stream box, when they come out, because you have 6-series, and this will eliminate the problem. So all is not lost for you. 5-series owners, unfortunately, do not have this option. I bought 5-series cards specifically for Eyefinity, so yeah, it's a sore point for me.
> 
> It's doesn't happen on the DP monitor for me, most often, either...it's on the DVI monitors that the cursor shows up corrupt most often. But give it some time, and you'll see it on the DP monitor as well.



They already admitted this is a issue in march.
officially.
Unofficially already in jan/feb.
and its pretty much fixed, but not for everyone.
I used to have it, but after 10.7 it was completely gone, havent seen it again.
A mate, updated bios. solved.
another made, upgraded , mobo, that solved it.
another one, still have issues.


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## caleb (Nov 9, 2010)

They should place the damn leads on the PCIE or on additional power outlet on the motherboard.I always thought its a temporary solution with that additional cable until they change the interface standard to be compatible with the new power demands. If that's impossible they should at least move the GFX power socket towards back of the case so its not in the middle of everything.


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## largon (Nov 9, 2010)

> Originally Posted on *TechEye*
> 
> 
> According to our sources, yields for Cayman are still in the single digits


In other news, TSMC considers refreshing the company logo for accuracy:

Now / Future









newtekie1 said:


> Then how do cards that pull 300w+ get away with only a 6-pin and an 8-pin?


Simple. 
Such cards overload them 6/8pin plugs. They draw more current than spec'ed from the plugs. PCIe slot power is hardly used at all on modern cards because it's nigh impossible to _load balance_ several so different voltage sources such as PCIe slot's tiny power traces and 6/8pin plugs' 18-gauge wiring. 

For example HD5970 draws <15W from the PCIe slot under Furmark.


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## xtremesv (Nov 11, 2010)

"Apparently the company is yet to finalize a launch driver and BIOS for the HD 6970"

Maybe AMD saw GTX580 was better than expected and now they have to overclock 6970 and optimize drivers to overtake Nvidia.


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## bear jesus (Nov 11, 2010)

xtremesv said:


> "Apparently the company is yet to finalize a launch driver and BIOS for the HD 6970"
> 
> Maybe AMD saw GTX580 was better than expected and now they have to overclock 6970 and optimize drivers to overtake Nvidia.



The driver i assume is just because AMD has a talent for constantly updating drivers every couple days  but i have to wonder if they wanted to know how the 580 performed before setting the final clocks to see if they could beat the 580 with a bump in clock speeds/possibly voltage to go with it.

Although that could just be wishful thinking on my part as i want a really powerful single card/chip to run games across 3 monitors.


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## LAN_deRf_HA (Nov 11, 2010)

xtremesv said:


> "Apparently the company is yet to finalize a launch driver and BIOS for the HD 6970"
> 
> Maybe AMD saw GTX580 was better than expected and now they have to overclock 6970 and optimize drivers to overtake Nvidia.



Better than expected? Nobody knew about it until very recently. It came out of the blue and launched relatively soon after it was announced, and technically it was worse than expected if your expectations were based on the numbers nvidia marketed. Not sure what else the expectations would be based on.


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## n-ster (Nov 11, 2010)

A single GPU matching a 5970 is pretty impressive


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## a_ump (Nov 11, 2010)

n-ster said:


> A single GPU matching a 5970 is pretty impressive



i guess you could say that but the fact that this single GPU is released almost(if not) a year after the HD 5970 makes it a little moot point. I personally find AMD's improvements in the HD 68XX series more impressive than the release of the GTX 580. I mean if you think about it the GTX 580 should be out for a good while. I can't imagine Nvidia releasing another higher end GPU(GTX 680?) for a while, not till 28nm anyways. Judging from the past yr or so, anyone that thinks about it for a second can't logically think that they've already got something else up their sleeve for cayman. If they had such resources already then they would've released it like a nuke, catching everyone's eye, whereas the GTX 580 imo is more like a "We finally did it". 

Though we shall see if AMD's rumored delays are massive, though i read it only got bumped from the 22nd of nov to the 29th.


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