# First Ethash ASIC mining machine is ready for pre order today, 4/3/18



## yotano211 (Apr 3, 2018)

I just got an email some hours ago that the 1st batch of the ASIC machine for Ethash or ETH mining will be ready for pre order now and delivery start after 16 July 2018 but before 31 July 2018.

Hashing algorithm: Ethash

    Power consumption: 800W

    Hashrate: 180MH/s
$800

https://shop.bitmain.com/product/detail?pid=00020180403174908564M8dMJKtz06B7&utm_source=mass email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=e3-announcement

Not as fast as I thought but for $800, its much cheaper than any ETH mining machine.


----------



## hat (Apr 3, 2018)

At current rates that's what about $6/day? Provided it isn't rendered incompatible by some update to the algorithm...


----------



## silentbogo (Apr 3, 2018)

hat said:


> At current rates that's what about $6/day? Provided it isn't rendered incompatible by some update to the algorithm...


Assuming that it will need around 1-1.2kW, it should make around $80+/mo at current rates. If the ETH rate goes up with an official release(e.g. physically shipping ASICs to buyers), then it will go up by a lot.
So far the best ROI comparing to any graphics card($800 for the unit + $105 for a PSU), but not enough to call it a money-making machine.


----------



## yotano211 (Apr 3, 2018)

hat said:


> At current rates that's what about $6/day? Provided it isn't rendered incompatible by some update to the algorithm...


I went to a ETH calculator and only got about $3.67 per day after power cost at .09 cents for power.



silentbogo said:


> Assuming that it will need around 1-1.2kW, it should make around $80+/mo at current rates. If the ETH rate goes up with an official release(e.g. physically shipping ASICs to buyers), then it will go up by a lot.
> So far the best ROI comparing to any graphics card($800 for the unit + $105 for a PSU), but not enough to call it a money-making machine.



It says it needs 800 watts.


----------



## silentbogo (Apr 3, 2018)

yotano211 said:


> It says it needs 800 watts.


That's the ASIC draw before the PSU. I'm just taking the worst case scenario, cause who knows whattaheck their APW3+++ is actually capable of... (claimed efficiency is near 80+PLATINUM, but it's priced just like a refurbished 12V server PSU from the past decade).


----------



## R-T-B (Apr 3, 2018)

I lost a small fortune in litecoin ASICs so I'll be steering clear of this personally.  That and I don't plan on playing the mining game at all beyond years end.


----------



## yotano211 (Apr 4, 2018)

The limit per order was 1, its now at 5. I guess many angry people told bitmain about the limits so bitmain raised the limit to 5.


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 4, 2018)

hat said:


> At current rates that's what about $6/day? Provided it isn't rendered incompatible by some update to the algorithm...



Actually it is a lot more for those people who steal electricity from their unknowing employers facilities.  Sadly, this is why mining did so well for so long is my theory, especially in China where they have massive farms built in the mountains stealing electricity. What does that make it, if your electricity is free? like $100+ per day?


----------



## hat (Apr 4, 2018)

Heh, $6/day is what I expect one machine to do without factoring in electricity cost...


----------



## verycharbroiled (Apr 4, 2018)

well, seems theres the possibility that ethereum may change algos (theres a poll i believe 55% of respondents support it). its just an informal poll so not official or anything. so the e3 may very well be dead out the door

maybe useful for other ethash stuff but thats a small market.

EDIT: links

https://www.ccn.com/ethereum-users-support-hard-fork-to-brick-ethereum-asic-miners-poll/

reddit link below but comes up as an image


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/ethereum/comments/883oth


EDIT dunno why the second link to reddit comes up as an image, too lazy to figure it out.. forum seems to change the link on its own *grumble*


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 4, 2018)

I just wish it would all die. so annoying, IRS is going to get a lot of people too who think they are being slick, already reading a lot of stories of IRS making people pay loads and loads of back taxes and those people can't pay it back since the price crashes, lol... IRS doesn't play around. they prob will get their wages garnished within 6 months forcibly. its the only branch of government that works well, and one I intend to stay far away from.


----------



## verycharbroiled (Apr 4, 2018)

lynx29 said:


> I just wish it would all die. so annoying, IRS is going to get a lot of people too who think they are being slick, already reading a lot of stories of IRS making people pay loads and loads of back taxes and those people can't pay it back since the price crashes, lol... IRS doesn't play around. they prob will get their wages garnished within 6 months forcibly. its the only branch of government that works well, and one I intend to stay far away from.



pretty easy to set aside some cash from profits for taxes as you sell, maybe put that cash  into CDs or something till tax time.. and taxes from trades/sells/etc are pretty easy with the websites and programs nowadays. give it all to your cpa and let him/her do the hard stuff.

and hey if you had to pay taxes that means you made money. this is good, yes?


----------



## dorsetknob (Apr 4, 2018)

yotano211 said:


> The limit per order was 1, its now at 5. I guess many angry people told bitmain about the limits so bitmain raised the limit to 5.



Or the Pre order sales based on 1 per order were so low that indicated the take up on pre orders was a potential failure   so they Raised the limit in an attempt to shift Stock (Pessimistic viewpoint )


----------



## cdawall (Apr 5, 2018)

The only benefit to this right now is price. $800 for 180mh/s is not beatable with the current market. The wattage is about dead even with a polaris or pascal based rig. 

Remember delivery isn't until end of July as well, it will be curious what GPU prices will be down to by then.


----------



## xkm1948 (Apr 5, 2018)

GPU price have to come down quite a lot to match this. So the ASIC either provides great hash rate or provides great price.



lynx29 said:


> I just wish it would all die. so annoying, IRS is going to get a lot of people too who think they are being slick, already reading a lot of stories of IRS making people pay loads and loads of back taxes and those people can't pay it back since the price crashes, lol... IRS doesn't play around. they prob will get their wages garnished within 6 months forcibly. its the only branch of government that works well, and one I intend to stay far away from.



Exactly this. Miners will be swarmed with IRS notifications for unpaid tax soon. Only other way is say miners can actually offshore their own assets by coverting to a citizen from one of those tax haven countries.


----------



## cdawall (Apr 5, 2018)

xkm1948 said:


> Exactly this. Miners will be swarmed with IRS notifications for unpaid tax soon. Only other way is say miners can actually offshore their own assets by coverting to a citizen from one of those tax haven countries.



Why? I paid taxes on mine exactly how the IRS requested, I would wager quite a few people did the same as me.


----------



## R-T-B (Apr 5, 2018)

lynx29 said:


> I just wish it would all die. so annoying, IRS is going to get a lot of people too who think they are being slick, already reading a lot of stories of IRS making people pay loads and loads of back taxes and those people can't pay it back since the price crashes, lol... IRS doesn't play around. they prob will get their wages garnished within 6 months forcibly. its the only branch of government that works well, and one I intend to stay far away from.



There is no need to wish it all a quick death.  The market is already turning to a gamers favor.  Expect ups and downs for a while, and just plan accordingly.


----------



## xkm1948 (Apr 5, 2018)

cdawall said:


> Why? I paid taxes on mine exactly how the IRS requested, I would wager quite a few people did the same as me.



There are people who paid 0 cent over their net gain from cryto-mining or crypto-trading. These are the people that will be targeted by IRS.


----------



## cdawall (Apr 5, 2018)

xkm1948 said:


> There are people who paid 0 cent over their net gain from cryto-mining or crypto-trading. These are the people that will be targeted by IRS.



Only if they profited over 20k using a US based company to do so. There was not an implementation to catch those outside of that batch.


----------



## R-T-B (Apr 5, 2018)

cdawall said:


> Only if they profited over 20k using a US based company to do so. There was not an implementation to catch those outside of that batch.



Unfortunately, he's right.  Furthermore, they had to be using coinbase.


----------



## hat (Apr 5, 2018)

Is there a source on that? Only asking because I've been worried about that. That said, I'm still not sure I even reached ROI on my graphics cards yet, so whether or not I profited anything at all is rather debatable at this point...


----------



## R-T-B (Apr 5, 2018)

hat said:


> Is there a source on that? Only asking because I've been worried about that. That said, I'm still not sure I even reached ROI on my graphics cards yet, so whether or not I profited anything at all is rather debatable at this point...



The coinbase IRS reporting was covered here on TPU earlier this year.

https://www.techpowerup.com/241884/lawyering-up-coinbase-to-send-data-on-13-000-users-to-the-irs

For the nitty gritty of it, find the coinbase blog post, and IIRC, they'll email you if required to report your earnings.



> That said, I'm still not sure I even reached ROI on my graphics cards yet, so whether or not I profited anything at all is rather debatable at this point...



Until ROI is hit, it's nothing to worry about.


----------



## xkm1948 (Apr 5, 2018)

More and more laws and regulations on crypto currency are on the way. The wild west days are numbered now. Sure blockchain maybe here to stay, you can also be sure that governments will put out more laws to tax it.


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 5, 2018)

cdawall said:


> Why? I paid taxes on mine exactly how the IRS requested, I would wager quite a few people did the same as me.



You should have joined a major top 50 company, worked your way up, and kept your money in an offshore bank account like they do, they hardly ever pay taxes on anything.


----------



## cdawall (Apr 6, 2018)

lynx29 said:


> You should have joined a major top 50 company, worked your way up, and kept your money in an offshore bank account like they do, they hardly ever pay taxes on anything.



I wrote off all of my HW and was able to cover most of the part I was being taxed on


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 6, 2018)

cdawall said:


> I wrote off all of my HW and was able to cover most of the part I was being taxed on



You good sir, are now a hero of mine.


----------



## moproblems99 (Apr 10, 2018)

xkm1948 said:


> Sure blockchain maybe here to stay, you can also be sure that governments will put out more laws to tax it.



How do you tax block chain?


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 10, 2018)

moproblems99 said:


> How do you tax block chain?



whenever you go to cash out. and if you try to buy stuff with Bitcoin from a company say a soda or a hotel, those companies will be taxed heavy for using it, etc. thats the future anyway, only way blockchain can work is something like ANON Monero coin, but even then how is a hotel going to get away by allowing that without the government knowing eventually and being hit hard or closed down for using it... so all coins at the end of the day are basically still reliant on fiat currency, which is what makes them weak, governments have militaries and can enforce their laws, blockchain has to play the run and hide game forever.


----------



## moproblems99 (Apr 10, 2018)

lynx29 said:


> whenever you go to cash out. and if you try to buy stuff with Bitcoin from a company say a soda or a hotel, those companies will be taxed heavy for using it, etc. thats the future anyway, only way blockchain can work is something like ANON Monero coin, but even then how is a hotel going to get away by allowing that without the government knowing eventually and being hit hard or closed down for using it... so all coins at the end of the day are basically still reliant on fiat currency, which is what makes them weak, governments have militaries and can enforce their laws, blockchain has to play the run and hide game forever.



So what you are saying, is to tax the currencies and purchases themselves.  Which if I recall...we do so already.  You can't just put moar taxes on teh blockchainz - it doesn't work that way.  Again, and this is not directed at you lynx, but please, please actually do a little research on things before trying to have a discussion.

EDIT: 

This is why the articles that @R-T-B is writing about crypto is really a community benefit for TPU.  So people can understand the things they hate and not just say: 'ooooo.....my precious gpus are soooooo expensive, its all teh minerz faultz......die, die, die'.  RTB is not trying to make everybody like mining or convince everybody they should jump on the bandwagon.  He is just trying to get people to understand what it is and what happens.  That way, people can actually say: 'You know, what I really do hate mining.' or, just maybe, they might understand that it is effectively (largely dependent on the coin/situation) the same as folding and tone down the baseless the hate. In fact, it may actually push them into mining curecoin so they can do a 'good thing'.

If nothing else, it will help them stop parroting this BS about the environment.  There are some that are generally concerned about the environment but I surmise many of them are just making use of the copy and paste function.

EDIT 2:  More edits...anesthesia and meds have not worn off it, sorry


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 10, 2018)

moproblems99 said:


> So what you are saying, is to tax the currencies and purchases themselves.  Which if I recall...we do so already.  You can't just put moar taxes on teh blockchainz - it doesn't work that way.  Again, and this is not directed at you lynx, but please, please actually do a little research on things before trying to have a discussion.
> 
> EDIT:
> 
> ...



eh, this is all a scam and always was. Purdue University found security holes in the Ethereum, loads of other issues. also most websites don't charge tax like newegg, etc if paying with fiat currency, however, cryptocurrencies will be specifically targeted in the future. so no, if you own Bitcoin, you login to newegg, and buy products in bitcoin, your not paying taxes on it because your circumventing an Exchange.  thats what governments will be setting their sights on next, because they are fine with fiat flowing freely, they control it and it gives them power, they know they can not control Bitcoin so they will be looking at websites like newegg in the future, requesting back purchases to tax if paid in crypto, etc. this is my prediction anyway, Fiat owners need not worry, is also my prediction.


----------



## moproblems99 (Apr 10, 2018)

lynx29 said:


> your not paying taxes on it because your circumventing an Exchange



Ah, but you are paying taxes on it, sales or use tax.  I think they could also easily implement a requirement  to business to charge an X% fee on every purchase made with crypto.  That would be pretty trivial to implement by a business and in my opinion would not be an undue burden on them.  Now, making them figure out all the sales taxes....that is most definitely an undue burden - but let's save that for a different thread.



lynx29 said:


> Fiat owners need not worry, is also my prediction.



I have to say you may be wrong there.  Governments want all money owed to them, regardless of where it came from lol.


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 10, 2018)

moproblems99 said:


> Ah, but you are paying taxes on it, sales or use tax.  I think they could also easily implement a requirement  to business to charge an X% fee on every purchase made with crypto.  That would be pretty trivial to implement by a business and in my opinion would not be an undue burden on them.  Now, making them figure out all the sales taxes....that is most definitely an undue burden - but let's save that for a different thread.
> 
> 
> 
> I have to say you may be wrong there.  Governments want all money owed to them, regardless of where it came from lol.




newegg doesnt charge sales tax to anyone except people that live in those states, most people don't claim it on their taxes and everyone knows it... congress has said nothing about it in 12+ years... they only forced Amazon because Amazon grew so big. so i am not sure i understand your counter argument


----------



## moproblems99 (Apr 10, 2018)

lynx29 said:


> newegg doesnt charge sales tax to anyone except people that live in those states, most people don't claim it on their taxes and everyone knows it... congress has said nothing about it in 12+ years... they only forced Amazon because Amazon grew so big. so i am not sure i understand your counter argument



I could be wrong but I think Amazon has to follow the same tax laws as Newegg - ie, collecting taxes in states they have a presence in.  Honestly, at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if Amazon has some sort of presence in every state.


----------



## Space Lynx (Apr 10, 2018)

moproblems99 said:


> I could be wrong but I think Amazon has to follow the same tax laws as Newegg - ie, collecting taxes in states they have a presence in.  Honestly, at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if Amazon has some sort of presence in every state.



Amazon collects taxes all 50 states as required by a new law just passed last year, for some reason, that law does not apply to newegg, BHPhotovideo etc. I have no idea how it went down, but thats how it is now.


----------



## moproblems99 (Apr 10, 2018)

lynx29 said:


> Amazon collects taxes all 50 states as required by a new law just passed last year, for some reason, that law does not apply to newegg, BHPhotovideo etc. I have no idea how it went down, but thats how it is now.



Thank you, I must look into that.  In any case, if the Gov wants to tax crypto, it would be trivial for business to implement.  However, I'm just not entirely sure they will go that route as that will give lobbyists a new weapon.


----------

