# But it's 1151!!?



## thebluebumblebee (Aug 21, 2017)

How many times do you think we're going to see that confused question with Intel's version "A" and "B" of socket 1151?


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## EarthDog (Aug 21, 2017)

Que?


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## Liviu Cojocaru (Aug 21, 2017)

I think he's talking about the new Coffe lake CPU's with the 300 series MB that have the same socket as the 200 series...


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## R00kie (Aug 21, 2017)

Someone will actually try and stick the coffee lake cpu in a Z270 board, an we'll get craploads of posts saying that they fried their cpu/mobo, unless Intel will put some kind of a disclaimer on the box.


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## bonehead123 (Aug 21, 2017)

umm, I love the smell of fried cpu & mobo in da mornin 

*as long as it aint mine !*


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## thebluebumblebee (Aug 21, 2017)

gdallsk said:


> Someone will actually try and stick the coffee lake cpu in a Z270 board, an we'll get craploads of posts saying that they fried their cpu/mobo, unless Intel will put some kind of a disclaimer on the box.


Yeah, that will help


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## cdawall (Aug 21, 2017)

gdallsk said:


> Someone will actually try and stick the coffee lake cpu in a Z270 board, an we'll get craploads of posts saying that they fried their cpu/mobo, unless Intel will put some kind of a disclaimer on the box.



Key way will probably change


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## JalleR (Aug 21, 2017)

it is not the first time that happens....... 2011, S775, S370 and  socket A

on the S775 and S370 it just did´not boot if you put in the wrong chip


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## IceScreamer (Aug 21, 2017)

Yea, they'll probably add some sort of a notch on the processor and the socket itself, at least they should.


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## ERazer (Aug 21, 2017)

hopefully they change the cpu notches

ninja


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## thebluebumblebee (Aug 21, 2017)

I don't understand why they didn't call it anything but 1151. They could have called it 1152 and no one would have been the wiser - okay, someone would have eventually counted the pins and pointed it out, but so what.


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## DeathtoGnomes (Aug 21, 2017)

Need to add the option "I dont give a s**t". Not that I wouldnt vote this way


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## R00kie (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> I don't understand why they didn't call it anything but 1151. They could have called it 1152 and no one would have been the wiser - okay, someone would have eventually counted the pins and pointed it out, but so what.


LGA2011 and 2011-3 comes to mind


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## EarthDog (Aug 21, 2017)

Ahh... ok. Well, its been done before and I don't recall a large influx of threads... people are stupid, but...


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## thebluebumblebee (Aug 21, 2017)

gdallsk said:


> LGA2011 and 2011-3 comes to mind


But those are not mainstream sockets.


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## EarthDog (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> But those are not mainstream sockets.


So now it is limited to mainstream sockets? Point was, there is a precedence. Product stack be damned. 

I'm sticking with one thread.


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## niko084 (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> But those are not mainstream sockets.



That's a good point, between the buyers of those lines generally knowing a bit more and being far less common..
Might even trick up the more experienced person just ordering parts quickly without verifying compatibility.


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## R00kie (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> But those are not mainstream sockets.


Mainstream or not, point is Intel has already done this before. If they do it again this way with 1151, there might not be as much confusion.


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## Countryside (Aug 21, 2017)

Only reason why Intel created the 300 series chipset is because they had nothing better to do.


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## Devon68 (Aug 21, 2017)

1151 v2 maybe? But there will be a lot of new builders that will make a mistake if they dont clearly advertise it as a different socket with the same amount of pins.


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## thebluebumblebee (Aug 21, 2017)

niko084 said:


> That's a good point, between the buyers of those lines generally knowing a bit more and being far less common..
> Might even trick up the more experienced person just ordering parts quickly without verifying compatibility.


Pcpartpicker is your friend!


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## niko084 (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> Pcpartpicker is your friend!



I had never seen that before.
Pretty cool and something I'll pass that onto people who ask me too many questions.


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## peche (Aug 21, 2017)

at least boxes comes with the warning....


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## Sasqui (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> I don't understand why they didn't call it anything but 1151. They could have called it 1152 and no one would have been the wiser - okay, someone would have eventually counted the pins and pointed it out, but so what.



What'll happen is A LOT of people buying the wrong motherboards (or CPUs).  Assuming they key the slot and CPU, there will be a few that jam the CPU in the socket with a hammer.


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## dorsetknob (Aug 21, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> What'll happen is A LOT of people buying the wrong motherboards (or CPUs).  Assuming they key the slot and CPU, there will be a few that jam the CPU in the socket with a hammer.



fun straighten that lot out


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## Ahhzz (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> I don't understand why they didn't call it anything but 1151. They could have called it 1152 and no one would have been the wiser - okay, someone would have eventually counted the pins and pointed it out, but so what.


No doubt.... not looking forward to my A+ refresher with that.....


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## qubit (Aug 21, 2017)

dorsetknob said:


> fun straighten that lot out


Right, I'll race ya!  What a mess, lol.

Yes, I think having the same number of pins will lead to a lot of confusion which could have been so easily avoided. The best way out if this imo, is to either have them keyed differently, or more likely have the mobo companies add "unofficial" support in their products, always something I think is a bit dicey in the long run. I would buy a mobo that's made specifically for my CPU, not a hack job, end of story.


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## Ahhzz (Aug 21, 2017)

qubit said:


> Right, I'll race ya!  What a mess, lol.
> 
> Yes, I think having the same number of pins will lead to a lot of confusion which could have been so easily avoided. The best way out if this imo, is to either have them keyed differently, or more likely have the mobo companies add "unofficial" support in their products, always something I think is a bit dicey in the long run. I would buy a mobo that's made specifically for my CPU, not a hack job, end of story.


To be fair, not many people look to see how many pins their processor needs when they order it, they just check to see which board/chipset it requires. Mostly, the only ones who go around trying to fit random chips into random boards would simply look up the chip, and match it to a board. Noone's going to count holes and go "Hey, that has as many holes as there are pins in this motherboard!! I'll just cram it in here!"


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## qubit (Aug 21, 2017)

Ahhzz said:


> To be fair, not many people look to see how many pins their processor needs when they order it, they just check to see which board/chipset it requires. Mostly, the only ones who go around trying to fit random chips into random boards would simply look up the chip, and match it to a board. Noone's going to count holes and go "Hey, that has as many holes as there are pins in this motherboard!! I'll just cram it in here!"


No, I don't think that there are too many people like that. That would be dumb for sure, lol.

What I'm thinking about is where people are looking at many mobos trying to decide which one to get and then start getting confused. Mobos are often organized by socket name in online stores, so even if they know about the differences, they can forget to check properly when juggling so many variables at once. This will make it even more confusing when a mobo is listing their processor, but it's not made totally clear that this is manufacturer support rather than an official Intel one.


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## silentbogo (Aug 21, 2017)

thebluebumblebee said:


> How many times do you think we're going to see that confused question with Intel's version "A" and "B" of socket 1151?


Not the first and definitely not the last.



thebluebumblebee said:


> But those are not mainstream sockets.


Now, you don't have to look too far to find a mainstream socket examples: the same LGA1151 had a nice flop with chipset restrictions on Xeon E3 CPUs. Same socket, same notches... yet still no bueno. 
LGA775 was another one, with several CPU generations and dozens of chipsets from more manufacturers than you can possibly imagine, and with support of almost all generations of DDR memory, and even some weird-ass transitional models with both DDR2 and DDR3 support. Crazy sh%t!


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## EarthDog (Aug 21, 2017)

Like anything, due diligence is extremely helpful. 

Frankly, if you are shoving square pegs in ever so slightly different square holes (lololol), not sure one should be building a pc if you cant figure out how to make sure stuff fits together. At stores, there are people that can help. Online sites like pcpartpicker show compatibilty. Mobo sites have cpu compatibility lists. Intel site shows the chipset... etc. 

Im sure something could have been made more obvious, but, i just dont think it will be a huge issue. If it is, well, humanity makes me shed another tear.


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## newtekie1 (Aug 21, 2017)

This is why marketing by pin count isn't the best practice. AMD's system of naming sockets works better.

But even that wasn't perfect. And that is why CPU support lists are a thing that exists.


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## dorsetknob (Aug 21, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> Now, you don't have to look too far to find a mainstream socket examples: the same LGA1151 had a nice flop with chipset restrictions on Xeon E3 CPUs. Same socket, same notches... yet still no bueno.
> LGA775 was another one, with several CPU generations and dozens of chipsets from more manufacturers than you can possibly imagine, and with support of almost all generations of DDR memory, and even some weird-ass transitional models with both DDR2 and DDR3 support. Crazy sh%t!



Now don't ignore Socket 775 and the Fact it could be Modded to take Xeon 771 That was and Still is Bitchen brilliant


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## Vya Domus (Aug 21, 2017)

dorsetknob said:


> Now don't ignore Socket 775 and the Fact it could be Modded to take Xeon 771 That was and Still is Bitchen brilliant



Always wanted to do that with my 775 system back in the day but never got around to doing it.


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## niko084 (Aug 21, 2017)

dorsetknob said:


> Now don't ignore Socket 775 and the Fact it could be Modded to take Xeon 771 That was and Still is Bitchen brilliant



That was a cool trick, used to my advantage a few times for saving money on much faster chips.

Speaking of socket compatibility....
Anyone old enough to remember overdrive cpus? --- If you're not sure, lookup 486SLC2, these were awesome!


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## dorsetknob (Aug 21, 2017)

niko084 said:


> Anyone old enough to remember overdrive cpus?


yup there are lots of us Sometimes we refer to ourselves ass the TPU Elder Statsmen
we Even have this War Medal


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## johnspack (Aug 22, 2017)

Pentium overdrive,  yep.  Hey I remember 8088 cpus....   This new socket system though is going to have me pulling what's left of my hair out when trying to build new systems for clients.....


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## Sasqui (Aug 22, 2017)

dorsetknob said:


> fun straighten that lot out



Crazy to think that someone probably tried it


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## Komshija (Aug 22, 2017)

It would be a lot better solution if they slightly increased physical dimensions of the CPU (eg. length and width both increased by 1 mm) and added extra two notches.


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## Flaky (Aug 22, 2017)

We already had that with lga1150v1. Ask people who wanted broadwell on their z87, they remember 

Funny thing is: there is no good technical reason for dropping backward compatibility.


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## dorsetknob (Aug 22, 2017)

Flaky said:


> Funny thing is: there is no good technical reason for dropping backward compatibility.


Its a commercial decision by intel to push the Sale of New Chip sets to Motherboard manafacture's ( and therefore motherboards sales by partners).


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## newtekie1 (Aug 22, 2017)

dorsetknob said:


> Its a commercial decision by intel to push the Sale of New Chip sets to Motherboard manafacture's ( and therefore motherboards sales by partners).



We really don't know that until we see that pinout of the socket.  It very likely could be a pinout change to support the extra cores, exactly like they did with socket 775.


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## Flaky (Aug 22, 2017)

Do we even have the pinout for lga 1151? I looked for it, and couldn't find. Pinouts were provided for previous platforms in official datasheets, but I found none in docs for 6th gen and newer.


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## dorsetknob (Aug 22, 2017)

newtekie1 said:


> It very likely could be a pinout change to support the extra cores, exactly like they did with socket 775.



And the Several chip Set change's to Support the later CPU's  which had more core's and higher FSB


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## eidairaman1 (Aug 22, 2017)

cdawall said:


> Key way will probably change




Id say pin/pad layout too


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## zbam (Aug 23, 2017)

What if we all stop buying intel ?  I am assuming most of the people in this forum are after price/performance rather than brand commitment. Maybe we can send a message to intel who knows..


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## silentbogo (Aug 23, 2017)

Flaky said:


> Do we even have the pinout for lga 1151? I looked for it, and couldn't find. Pinouts were provided for previous platforms in official datasheets, but I found none in docs for 6th gen and newer.


Chapter 9 (pg.126).
https://www.intel.com/content/dam/w...sktop-6th-gen-core-family-datasheet-vol-1.pdf


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## notb (Aug 23, 2017)

zbam said:


> What if we all stop buying intel ?  I am assuming most of the people in this forum are after price/performance rather than brand commitment. Maybe we can send a message to intel who knows..


Yes, because Intel cares about few hundred active users on this forum...

And I'm pretty sure you're wrong about the "being after price/performance". It's just that quite a lot of brand-committed people here prefer the company that usually wins in "price/performance", not the one that wins in "just works" and - as a result - popularity.
On the contrary, most people buying Intel CPUs (or rather: PC with Intel CPUs) are not committed to a brand - they just don't care.

In other words: it's pretty easy to be a fanboy of the underdog company. I mean: if you want to stand out as a PC user, you will naturally be leaning towards the smaller, more "enthusiast-friendly" company - not the big mammoth that runs the industry. And by all means, we are all "standing out" here - building our PCs and spending hours on this forum.
A normal consumer buys a laptop, checks his e-mail and goes to the cinema.


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## ppn (Aug 23, 2017)

Not happening. I5-8400 is the Zen killer.
There was a photo of socket 1152 not so long ago. but nobody noticed.


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## zbam (Aug 23, 2017)

notb said:


> Yes, because Intel cares about few hundred active users on this forum...
> 
> And I'm pretty sure you're wrong about the "being after price/performance". It's just that quite a lot of brand-committed people here prefer the company that usually wins in "price/performance", not the one that wins in "just works" and - as a result - popularity.
> On the contrary, most people buying Intel CPUs (or rather: PC with Intel CPUs) are not committed to a brand - they just don't care.
> ...



we all, like the whole PC users  but you have strong points that I cant disagree.


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## Flaky (Aug 23, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> Chapter 9 (pg.126).
> https://www.intel.com/content/dam/w...sktop-6th-gen-core-family-datasheet-vol-1.pdf


Thanks! Revision history shows that they added the pinout at the beginning of this year. Still better later than never 

There's a lot of RSVD pins. So, intel can do whatever they want, and physically make new cpus unable to run on older motherboards.
Just like with 1150 and broadwell.


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## bug (Aug 23, 2017)

gdallsk said:


> Someone will actually try and stick the coffee lake cpu in a Z270 board, an we'll get craploads of posts saying that they fried their cpu/mobo, unless Intel will put some kind of a disclaimer on the box.


Is it the same socket though? Same number of pins doesn't necessarily mean the same physical arrangement.


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## R00kie (Aug 23, 2017)

bug said:


> Is it the same socket though? Same number of pins doesn't necessarily mean the same physical arrangement.


Different notch alignment probably.


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## Vya Domus (Aug 23, 2017)

They could literally make the socket in the shape of a triangle and some idiot would still manage to try and fit the wrong CPU in it.


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## silentbogo (Aug 23, 2017)

gdallsk said:


> Different notch alignment probably.


Why? There already is compatibility guideline in place. If someone can't read - they should not build computers either.
Even something simple as an extra notch (or it's placement) on the socket should result in OEMs ordering new LGA1151 variant sockets from foxconn, which will add few more dollars to BOM and the final price.
Same old socket is much easier and cost effective.


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## R00kie (Aug 23, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> Why? There already is compatibility guideline in place. If someone can't read - they should not build computers either.
> Even something simple as an extra notch (or it's placement) on the socket should result in OEMs ordering new LGA1151 variant sockets from foxconn, which will add few more dollars to BOM and the final price.
> Same old socket is much easier and cost effective.


Which still adds to the confusion for the first time builders.


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## silentbogo (Aug 23, 2017)

gdallsk said:


> Which still adds to the confusion for the first time builders.


First time builders and mortal people in general are always confused and clumsy, regardless of the socket and compatibility situation. My job would be meaningless, if there were no people who stick 1155 CPUs in 1150 sockets, break HDMI ports with USB flash drives, put thermal compound in the socket, overclock 125W CPUs on entry-level boards, cause house fires with cheap chinese power supplies, drop gadgets in subways and busses, and spill coffee on their laptops. It's unavoidable, and a simple 1151 mishap won't cause any more distress that's already there.


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## R00kie (Aug 23, 2017)

silentbogo said:


> First time builders and mortal people in general are always confused and clumsy, regardless of the socket and compatibility situation. My job would be meaningless, if there were no people who stick 1155 CPUs in 1150 sockets, break HDMI ports with USB flash drives, put thermal compound in the socket, overclock 125W CPUs on entry-level boards, cause house fires with cheap chinese power supplies, drop gadgets in subways and busses, and spill coffee on their laptops. It's unavoidable, and a simple 1151 mishap won't cause any more distress that's already there.


It just adds more work for us, that could’ve been avoided in the first place.


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## newtekie1 (Aug 23, 2017)

gdallsk said:


> Which still adds to the confusion for the first time builders.



If a first time builder doesn't check the CPU compatibility charts of their motherboard, they deserve to get screwed.  First time builders tend to be over-cautious, and spend extra time ensuring compatibility, in my experience.


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## R00kie (Aug 23, 2017)

newtekie1 said:


> First time builders tend to be over-cautious


Or over-confident


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## DeathtoGnomes (Aug 23, 2017)

notb said:


> Yes, because Intel cares about few hundred active users on this forum...
> 
> And I'm pretty sure you're wrong about the "being after price/performance". It's just that quite a lot of brand-committed people here prefer the company that usually wins in "price/performance", not the one that wins in "just works" and - as a result - popularity.
> On the contrary, most people buying Intel CPUs (or rather: PC with Intel CPUs) are not committed to a brand - they just don't care.
> ...


This. 

a PC user would favor higher performance or "*-per-dollar" or appearance (not just RGB), over any favoritism to any one brand.


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## P4-630 (Aug 23, 2017)

Sasqui said:


> What'll happen is A LOT of people buying the wrong motherboards (or CPUs).  Assuming they key the slot and CPU, there will be a few that jam the CPU in the socket with a hammer.


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## Eric3988 (Aug 23, 2017)

Kinda disappointing I won't be able to upgrade my CPU with anything meaningful without buying the mobo and another copy of Windows too. Oh well, hopefully by the time I'm ready to do that 8 cores will be the new i7 and 16 the AMD


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