# AMD or Intel, this is the question.



## vultusprime (Jan 11, 2020)

Hello everyone!
This is my first post here, Happy New year.

My aging Sandy Bridge system has been in need of replacing for over two years, but never got round to it. It's always the same, money is needed elsewhere and you keep delaying until your PC is over 8 years old!

I would like to make a premise by saying that I am not a fan of either blue or red team. 
True, that all computers I owned in the past, except for one, were Intel. But back in 2006 I got my very first AMD Athlon 64, which was a very good CPU.

Right now I am looking to buy a new computer. It's main purpose is gaming at 1080p, from simple online card games, to triple A titles.
I am not really interested with the performance benefits in other applications. Gaming is where I want my PC to perform at its best.

At first I was going to buy Intel and the choice was between the i5 9600k and the i7 9700k (the 8700k seemed out of stock). But when the new Ryzen were released (3600, 3600x, 3700x) I was very impressed, especially over the Ryzen 5 3600. Here was a budget CPU with plenty of gaming power. It could be paired with a relatively cheap B450 motherboard, unlike the Z390s for Intel.

With any new technology there are always a few rough edges to be smoothed out, so I waited a few months to see what would happen.

But as of now there are quite a few people still complaining about high temperatures on idle and especially at full load. Some complain of temps in the mid 80s at full load. I read that ZEN2 throttles at 95C and will shut down at 105C. I understand  this, but the idea of having my new CPU at 80C only because I am watching a youtube video is worrying.

This is the point of this lengthy post, I am worried that after buying a Ryzen 5 3600, or maybe even a 3700X if possible, I will start having problems with high temps and also high core voltages. I am aware that many other people are quite happy with their new Ryzen and temps are in their mid 70s at load. I would be very happy if that was the case with me. 

But are these real problems? Is it a good idea to buy a Ryzen 3000 today? Is it a safe choice?

On the other side of the rainbow Intel only has the i7 9700K to offer (the i9 is too expensive and in my opinion unnecessary just to play games). 
But even the i7 feels "old" as it is without HT and I'll need to spend more. But it seems more stable and with less problems than the Ryzen 3000, please correct me if I'm mistaken.

These are the parts I'd like to get, but I am a little unease about it. Should I venture into new territory and get the 3600/3700X or stick with Intel and the i7 9700K?


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## Bill_Bright (Jan 11, 2020)

This thread is likely just going to end up in a pi$$ing contest between Intel and AMD fans so I am not going there. 

It is great you stated gaming will be the primary purpose of this machine. But you failed to state your budget. 

Since you did not include a monitor, keyboard, mouse or speakers on your list, can we assume they will not be included in this build (at least for budgeting purposes)? 

As far as your listed items, the only thing I will comment on is your PSU - that is an excellent choice, but way more power than you need. You could easily get by with a 550W PSU. I would recommend 600 - 650W to allow for future upgrades and quieter operation.


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## XL-R8R (Jan 11, 2020)

A Scythe Fuma 2 instead of the Noctua, a cheaper case and the Win 10 key from an online seller will allow the upgrade to the 3600X plus the 5700XT.

The rest of the build is pretty solid.




_(I would probably also go 5700XT either way as the price difference between the XT and non-XT is very little in most regions of the world)_


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## vultusprime (Jan 11, 2020)

Bill_Bright said:


> This thread is likely just going to end up in a pi$$ing contest between Intel and AMD fans so I am not going there.
> 
> It is great you stated gaming will be the primary purpose of this machine. But you failed to state your budget.
> 
> ...


Hello buddy, thanks for the reply. I am not trying to start a p...contest between Intel and AMD, but I simply would like to know how to chose. This is the main question of the post.
My budget is around that, 1300 - 1400 US$. The other stuff like monitor keyboard and such I already have from my current system.
Yes I know that 750W is a lot but to be honest I feel much better with more power in reserve, On my 8 years old system I also have the same PSU and it's still running strong (knock on wood)


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## Camper7 (Jan 11, 2020)

I would go for AMD Ryzen 7 3700X for sure. Had Intel since core i7 2600K was new.
Liquid cooling will solve the temps. Intel has about 10% slower core performance and they are much more expensive. Or wait for the Ryzen 4000-series for desktop builds.


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## dirtyferret (Jan 11, 2020)

It's a good build but you can probably get the Noctua U12s for $5-10 more


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## vultusprime (Jan 11, 2020)

64K said:


> Welcome  @vultusprime. No one is saying you are trying to start a back and forth from Nvidia fans and AMD fans. It's just how these threads usually end up and it's tiresome after the hundreds and hundreds of them I've seen over the years but I don't think you intend that to happen.
> 
> I will speak on the GPU that you are looking at. The RX 5700 that you are looking at is a very good choice for 1080p gaming and should last you for a while.
> 
> ...


Hello, and thank you for the welcome. Yes it is not my intention to create discord. Maybe we can look at it from a different point of view. 
Let's forget about Intel and only focus on the new Ryzen 3000 series. Taking into consideration the "problems" I have mentioned in my post, should I be worried about buying a 3600/3700X, are these CPUs ok?


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## Boatvan (Jan 11, 2020)

People can argue about this ad nauseam until the end of time. There are facts out there that can be in favor of one side or the other. It isn't black and white like the internet makes you think. Some people (like my dad, a tech industry member since 1980) are not comfortable to change (which is fine!). He happens to like intel. That is for him to decide. I on the other hand (a noob in the industry of 8 years) defected from intel to AMD due to the price point. I like my AMD, dad likes his intel. 

My point is if you are looking for a clear answer here or any forum, you will get a bunch of members who are fanatical to a side, thus causing a little strife and salt for everyone. 

The way I chose was to do my own research. Determine what I was willing to pay, if it fit my use-case, and if I was comfortable with my choice. That is merely my method, but feel free to ask around if you think that is right. I am not here to steer one way or the other, just my advice on picking one.


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## oxrufiioxo (Jan 11, 2020)

My 3900X system is just as stable as my 9900k system it also runs cooler and quieter while gaming it's also being pushed less hard but the h115i platinum does a slightly better job on it than my h150i pro does on my 9900k. The R5 3600 is currently a much better buy than any similar intel chip especially considering you're not buying a 2080 ti also.


I would probably go with the XT version of the gpu if it fits in your budget and I just left the case you already put into your list.
You can get an oem windows license for like 15 bucks don't waste 140 of your budget on a retail version. 






						System Builder
					






					pcpartpicker.com


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## Tatty_One (Jan 11, 2020)

Moved to System builders advice forum.


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 11, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> Hello, and thank you for the welcome. Yes it is not my intention to create discord. Maybe we can look at it from a different point of view.
> Let's forget about Intel and only focus on the new Ryzen 3000 series. Taking into consideration the "problems" I have mentioned in my post, should I be worried about buying a 3600/3700X, are these CPUs ok?



Do not worry, 3600 and 3700s are performers, meet the needs of users. Remember a better gpu does wonders for games, id grab a sapphire rx5700 pulse, performance of the 5700 can be upped without spending for an xt.


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## vultusprime (Jan 11, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> My 3900X system is just as stable as my 9900k system it also runs cooler and quieter while gaming it's also being pushed less hard but the h115i platinum does a slightly better job on it than my h150i pro does on my 9900k. The R5 3600 is currently a much better buy than any similar intel chip especially considering you're not buying a 2080 ti also.
> 
> 
> I would probably go with the XT version of the gpu if it fits in your budget and I just left the case you already put into your list.
> ...


Hi buddy, thank you for your suggestions. I am curious about the M.2 solid state drive. Is the ADATA better/faster than the Intel 660p?
You think that the Noctua u12s will be better than the U9s at cooling the 3600?
Did you suggest the x570 because it doesn't need to have a bios update. Are the B450 more troublesome? To tell you the truth I feel a little strange using a motherboard with a chipset fan. In the past I had some problems with the fan constantly breaking after 1-2 years.



Tatty_One said:


> Moved to System builders advice forum.


sorry for posting in the wrong place


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## oxrufiioxo (Jan 11, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> Hi buddy, thank you for your suggestions. I am curious about the M.2 solid state drive. Is the ADATA better/faster than the Intel 660p?
> You think that the Noctua u12s will be better than the U9s at cooling the 3600?
> Did you suggest the x570 because it doesn't need to have a bios update. Are the B450 more troublesome? To tell you the truth I feel a little strange using a motherboard with a chipset fan. In the past I had some problems with the fan constantly breaking after 1-2 years.




Tha Asus X570 Tuf has a substantially better power delivery than any B450 board and even most of the X470 boards so my logic is if you ever down the road upgrade to a 12 or 16 core 4000 series cpu your vrm won't be causing you thermal throttling. The B450 Tomahawk Max is the best alternative imo.

The intel drive is slower than the XPG  as a boot drive I would go with the XPG over the intel drive for gaming it will not matter. The intel drive uses QLC vs TLC on the Xpg they both will probably last 5+ years for a typical user. Newegg seems to have inaccurate information on the warranty length both drives come with 5 year warranties according to their manufacturer websites.   

The u12s will be better than the u9s due to it being a larger cooler. How much better I couldn't say probably 4-5c under heavy load, but considering they're nearly identically priced def go with the u12s as it can handle a stock 3900X no problem.

My chipset fan on my x570 board only comes on during startup otherwise the chipset is never warm enough for it to turn on. I think for most users unless your ambient is stupidly high the chipset fan is a non issue.


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## biffzinker (Jan 11, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> But as of now there are quite a few people still complaining about high temperatures on idle and especially at full load. Some complain of temps in the mid 80s at full load. I read that ZEN2 throttles at 95C and will shut down at 105C. I understand this, but the idea of having my new CPU at 80C only because I am watching a youtube video is worrying.


You shouldn't have an issue with CPU temperatures while just watching a YouTube video. If your CPU temperature is to high then it comes down to a bad mount with the heatsink or poor airflow through the case etc.

My 3600 CPU temperatures watching a YouTube video:


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## IceShroom (Jan 11, 2020)

Avoid Corsair RAM, especially Vengence LPX. Buy RAM from other brand.


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## Camper7 (Jan 11, 2020)

IceShroom said:


> Avoid Corsair RAM, especially Vengence LPX. Buy RAM from other brand.


Why? I have used Corsair for years and there was no problem.


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## dirtyferret (Jan 11, 2020)

Camper7 said:


> Why? I have used Corsair for years and there was no problem.


Same

They also get their RAM from Samsung so you would be boycotting at least half the brands out there for your RAM, SSD, GPU, cell phone, router, etc etc


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## Camper7 (Jan 11, 2020)

dirtyferret said:


> Same
> 
> They also get their RAM from Samsung so you would be boycotting at least half the brands out there for your RAM, SSD, GPU, cell phone, router, etc etc


I buy parts based on quality, reliability and price. Brand doesn't matter to me. About GPU is use one brand only for other reasons.


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

I've always liked AMD not as much into Intel. There is ONLY ONE real way to go today that is Ryzen, Intel has great chips and all just not AMAZING. JMHO.


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## ixi (Jan 11, 2020)

It all goes down to how much money do you wanna spend on your upcoming pc and what kind of deals do you get for components . Both will do good in gaming and other stuff.


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## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

ixi said:


> It all goes down to how much money do you wanna spend on your upcoming pc and what kind of deals do you get for components . Both will do good in gaming and other stuff.


Yeah I'm not sure that's the who point of the OP's title.
If it's a question about the better CPU it's as we all know AMD Ryzen they are Absolutely Phenomenal   Even the first gen Ryzen chips are just obliterating Intel (popularity wise) no one is talking hey look at this new Intel no it's WHAT THE HECK DOES AMD HAVE FOR US NEXT!
I think that AMD has the best headroom for upgrades than Intel's line up right now. And Intel's line is right now suffering from age and the Ryzen backlash it's just to good of a CHIP to really NOT want one, So Intel just pack's on the speed again (Much like the P4 days when they couldn't hold a candle to the Athlon).
That said best price performance upgrade path and best over all performance for everything from gaming to editing video there is just one word you need to know at this point in time and for the next 10 years and that word is RYZEN!


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## Zach_01 (Jan 12, 2020)

R5 3600 here with AIO Corsair H110i 280mm for cooling and liquid metal for TIM.
I dont have a case, my ambient this time is 22C avg and the CPU idles around 28~30, gaming = 48~52C, and max load (CB-R20) = 62C. With AIO's fans (2x140mm) 800~1200rpm.
I expect those temps to go up inside a case with air tower but you should stay under or around 70C for max load. Its more than acceptable.
And keep case under nice airflow. If I had a case I would prefer as many fans as possible with lower rpm, than fewer with high rpm.

Key points of cooling other than a great CPU cooler:
High case air flow
High heat transfer rate between CPU and heatsink, meaning = mount pressure and thermal paste (application and material)

What's your monitor's resolution?
If you have a windows7 key that its not used any more you can use it for win10. Its legit. If not then buy a win10 key online on a sale(under 40$ at least). You can find it even with 10~20$ and save more than 100$ on this to by a bettet GPU and/or something else.
Like +40$ on that GPU will get you a Gigabyte gaming OC 5700XT (~400$). +40 on ram will get you a 3600 kit (100~110$), and prefer a GSkill kit that is on QVL of the board you choose. Corsair ram and ZEN2 are not doing well.


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## Melvis (Jan 12, 2020)

AMD! there is no question its the superior eco system right now.


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## GhostRyder (Jan 12, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> Hello everyone!
> This is my first post here, Happy New year.
> 
> My aging Sandy Bridge system has been in need of replacing for over two years, but never got round to it. It's always the same, money is needed elsewhere and you keep delaying until your PC is over 8 years old!
> ...


I would say AMD, I just did a tiny build using a 3600X and love it (Still love my 8700K main system).

Might I make a few suggestions to your build?
1: I would go with a smaller power supply, 750Watt is overkill (I would say 500-600Range)
2: Put that money towards getting the 5700XT
3: Do you have a windows 7 Key, it will still unlock windows 10 which would remove that cost.
4: Check around, I got my 3600X processor for the price of the 3600, they are on sale a lot I have noticed (Though its not necessary, just saying might wanna look before ordering)
Those are my biggest suggestions at the moment, but its a solid looking build!


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## moproblems99 (Jan 12, 2020)

Zen 2 cpus mess with voltages at idle quite a bit so I would get the largest cooler you can get to smooth out those fan oscillations.  I would also go with the 5700xt to get you some longevity.

With the new consoles coming out I think there will be a graphics jump soon that will knock down gpus a peg or two.  Graphic requirements have been kind of coasting the last few years so I may buy a little higher in anticipation of this.


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## ShrimpBrime (Jan 12, 2020)

My 8700k is faster than my 2700x for 3D. Any Intel at 5ghz and up with memory 4000mhz and up.... Is hard for Amd to beat.

Id wait It out. See what Ryzen 4000 chips bring to desktop.... So my cheap ass can buy a 3000 series already.


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## Liquid Cool (Jan 12, 2020)

I've got the R5 2600...runs very cool.  I don' t see why the R5 3600 would be any different.  I'd say go for it.  I couldn't be happier with my set up.  It's been 100% trouble free and dead quiet.  Exactly what I like in a pc.

Best of luck whatever you do... .

Liquid Cool


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## Super XP (Jan 12, 2020)

3 Choices
Ryzen 3700X 
Ryzen 3800X
Or wait for the ZEN3 design coming in 2020.


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## vultusprime (Jan 12, 2020)

trickson said:


> Yeah I'm not sure that's the who point of the OP's title.
> If it's a question about the better CPU it's as we all know AMD Ryzen they are Absolutely Phenomenal   Even the first gen Ryzen chips are just obliterating Intel (popularity wise) no one is talking hey look at this new Intel no it's WHAT THE HECK DOES AMD HAVE FOR US NEXT!
> I think that AMD has the best headroom for upgrades than Intel's line up right now. And Intel's line is right now suffering from age and the Ryzen backlash it's just to good of a CHIP to really NOT want one, So Intel just pack's on the speed again (Much like the P4 days when they couldn't hold a candle to the Athlon).
> That said best price performance upgrade path and best over all performance for everything from gaming to editing video there is just one word you need to know at this point in time and for the next 10 years and that word is RYZEN!


Hello buddy, thanks for the reply.
my point was never about performance, but rather if the Ryzen 3000 CPU series may have problems, specifically related to over heating on full load, or even on idle.
The need of liquid cooling for a 3600 seems excessive and costly. I simply would like to have peace of mind knowing that my new CPU will not give me problems.


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## Super XP (Jan 12, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> Hello buddy, thanks for the reply.
> my point was never about performance, but rather if the Ryzen 3000 CPU series may have problems, specifically related to over heating on full load, or even on idle.
> The need of liquid cooling for a 3600 seems excessive and costly. I simply would like to have peace of mind knowing that my new CPU will not give me problems.


Ryzen processors don't need water cooling. They have no problems. You don't have to worry. 
I think the water cooling was recommended because they are not expensive and offer great cooling. They are closed loop water coolers, thats what is being used lately because they are quiet versus air coolers.


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## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> Hello buddy, thanks for the reply.
> my point was never about performance, but rather if the Ryzen 3000 CPU series may have problems, specifically related to over heating on full load, or even on idle.
> The need of liquid cooling for a 3600 seems excessive and costly. I simply would like to have peace of mind knowing that my new CPU will not give me problems.


First off the Ryzen Chips are amazingly cool! Also there is NO need to liquid cool that is just snake oil IMHO. and Way too many things can go wrong with it best to just get one of these and call it a day, https://www.newegg.com/noctua-nh-d15/p/N82E16835608045 
Like I said before the best path is AMD Intel is good and all just NOT as good.


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (Jan 12, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> Hello buddy, thanks for the reply.
> my point was never about performance, but rather if the Ryzen 3000 CPU series may have problems, specifically related to over heating on full load, or even on idle.
> The need of liquid cooling for a 3600 seems excessive and costly. I simply would like to have peace of mind knowing that my new CPU will not give me problems.


this is nonesense ALL modern cpus are made to perform as fast as they can WITHIN a thermal and power envelope, neither Intel nor Nvidia are doing anything different to AMD.

i have two systems set up crunching 100% load 24/7 a 2700x with a stock cooler and my main 3800x on custom water , flat out all the time both run hot 72/82 degrees C as they are meant to without issues, you wont see this load with games , heat is not a decider between intel and AMD , if it is Intel run hotter not cooler then AMD.


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## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

theoneandonlymrk said:


> heat is not a decider between intel and AMD , if it is Intel run hotter not cooler then AMD.


Unless you need a room heater as well. LOL Then Intel all day long!


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## Durvelle27 (Jan 12, 2020)

To the OP this is my system suggestion based off your budget. It will offer amazing performance for the next few years. 






						System Builder
					






					pcpartpicker.com
				




If you want to save a few dollars CPU can be dropped down to a 3600X


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (Jan 12, 2020)

trickson said:


> Unless you need a room heater as well. LOL Then Intel all day long!


true i need two AMD systems to warm my ass atm.


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## Lindatje (Jan 12, 2020)

AMD Ryzen 3000 serie, easy one.


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## Kissamies (Jan 12, 2020)

R5 3600 would be my weapon of choice.



Liquid Cool said:


> I've got the R5 2600...runs very cool.  I don' t see why the R5 3600 would be any different.  I'd say go for it.  I couldn't be happier with my set up.  It's been 100% trouble free and dead quiet.  Exactly what I like in a pc.
> 
> Best of luck whatever you do... .
> 
> Liquid Cool


Another 2600 owner here, running with custom loop but probably I have some air in the loop since temps aren't as low as I've excepted, but still nothing to complain. When AMD released the first Ryzens ~3yr ago, tables were turned and Intel became the toaster CPU maker.


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## eidairaman1 (Jan 13, 2020)

Camper7 said:


> Why? I have used Corsair for years and there was no problem.



AM3 and AM4 have corsair troubles, rare kits work on AMD. However corsair caters to intel mainly...


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

Weird, I've heard that Corsair works on AM4 just like every other brand.


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## Super XP (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> Weird, I've heard that Corsair works on AM4 just like every other brand.


It does and it works very well too. 
Corsair caters to both AMD and Intel. There's no one sidedness with that company as far as I know.


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## moproblems99 (Jan 13, 2020)

Super XP said:


> It does and it works very well too.
> Corsair caters to both AMD and Intel. There's no one sidedness with that company as far as I know.





Chloe Price said:


> Weird, I've heard that Corsair works on AM4 just like every other brand.



I don't think it is intentional by any means.  However, if you search through TPU for memory issues on Ryzen, most of them will be Corsair.


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## IceShroom (Jan 13, 2020)

Camper7 said:


> Why? I have used Corsair for years and there was no problem.


For some reasons Corsair RAMs have compitability issuse with Ryzen cpu, that is why. It is not G.skill vs Corsair vs Other RAM manufacture.


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## EarthDog (Jan 13, 2020)

Stick to the qvl... chances are it works. Even corsair.

As for the thread: 


Lindatje said:


> AMD Ryzen 3000 serie, easy one.


this really..


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## Super XP (Jan 13, 2020)

moproblems99 said:


> I don't think it is intentional by any means.  However, if you search through TPU for memory issues on Ryzen, most of them will be Corsair.


I prefer GSkill for Ram, but prefer Corsair for there cases and CPU looped water cooling. I like the quality from both companies. 

Side note, IMO GSkill offers better value for timings and speed over Corsair.


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## JackCarver (Jan 13, 2020)

If it‘s main purpose is gaming get the 9700K. Steve from GamersNexus gave the same advice. The 8 cores are plenty enough for gaming and it‘s gaming performance is better than that from amd, even without HT...


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## Chomiq (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> Weird, I've heard that Corsair works on AM4 just like every other brand.


It varies, but some folks reported problems with LPX kits. From what I recall RGB Pros have no issues.

But yeah with ram choice I'd suggest checking the QVL and browsing some of the builds on PCPP.


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## dirtyferret (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> Weird, I've heard that Corsair works on AM4 just like every other brand.



Are you trying to tell me alienating 25% of the market isn't a good business practice?


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## tiggywombat (Jan 13, 2020)

Very easy to decide.

If money is not an issue, then go for Intel with 9700K, since that is your first preference.

If you want to save money, and want the most 'bang for buck' value, get the AMD Ryzen 5 3600 with a decent B450 motherboard like B450M pro4 or something better.

For me, I upgraded my i7 3770 to a Ryzen 5 3600, everything is working smooth even on a cheap B450 motherboard. I also bought a 16GB kit of DDR4 2666Mhz and OC-ed to 3200Mhz with a few timing tweaks. I chose AMD because I'm a practical guy who loves buying things which give good value for money.


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

The thing here is that there's no more upgrade path coming for LGA1151v2. I did a similar horrible mistake few years ago when I had a Z170 motherboard, I went from Pentium G4400 -> G4560 -> i5-7600K and what did I do next? Of course I slapped an i7-7700K there.


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## JackCarver (Jan 13, 2020)

Yes Z390 mainboards are more expensive than most of the B450 mainboards. But if you look at the cheapest Z390 mainboard, for example the Asrock Z390 Phantom Gaming 4S at mindfactory.de, it costs 107€. But you get a very reliable 8-phase VRM. The MSI B450 Pro is cheaper but you only get a 4-phase VRM, so the mainboards overclocking stability is not as good as the Z390 one. If you want a B450 mobo with 8-phase VRM you can buy the ASUS TUF Gaming for around 102€. So it‘s not cheaper if you want the same quality. 
Another thing is the 9700K...it is very expensive compared to the Ryzen 5 3600, but you get around 14% more gaming performance, but I agree, question is if that‘s worth the extra charge...
So yes pricewise take the Ryzen System


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

You missed my point. AM4 will still be supported with Zen3, LGA1151v2 doesn't have anything more powerful coming anymore.

....and it's still the same Skylake from 2015, just with MOAR CORES and higher clocks. Even the upcoming Comedy Lake is the same, 14nm+++++++++++++ and more cores & clocks.


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## EarthDog (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> You missed my point. AM4 will still be supported with Zen3, LGA1151v2 doesn't have anything more powerful coming anymore.
> 
> ....and it's still the same Skylake from 2015, just with MOAR CORES and higher clocks. Even the upcoming Comedy Lake is the same, 14nm+++++++++++++ and more cores & clocks.


one has to play the balancing game with EOL sockets. I mean, it's nice to be able to drop in another CPU in a few years, but to what end in 3 years? Pcie 4.0 and ddr4? Wht about 5.0 and ddr5? I dont want a 7-10 year old mobo. I'd rather pay the $200 again in 3-4 years and get the latest and greatest. Look at x470... no pcie 4.0... but hey the new cpu works!


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> one has to play the balancing game with EOL sockets. I mean, it's nice to be able to drop in another CPU in a few years, but to what end in 3 years? Pcie 4.0 and ddr4? Wht about 5.0 and ddr5? I dont want a 7-10 year old mobo. I'd rather pay the $200 again in 3-4 years and get the latest and greatest. Look at x470... no pcie 4.0... but hey the new cpu works!


Good point there, but usually it takes time when the new PCIe gen is actually needed. For now, RX 5500 XT 4GB seems to be the only one which is bottlenecked by PCIe 3.0..

And hey, some still use Sandy Bridge as their daily driver!


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## EarthDog (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> Good point there, but usually it takes time when the new PCIe gen is actually needed. For now, RX 5500 XT 4GB seems to be the only one which is bottlenecked by PCIe 3.0..
> 
> And hey, some still use Sandy Bridge as their daily driver!


Right. It does take time... but there are those who prefer and can sit on the same mobo and features for say 7 years, and there are those who when updating their CPU, would like access to all the new features or perhaps need them. If a system is going to last through the CPUs user defined life, a 7+ year old mobo may not cut it. For example, does your Z69 pro3 have M.2 slots for PCIe based SSDs? It really does depend on what the user does, expects from their hardware feature wise, and budget. It isn't as cut and dry as some may make it out to be.


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Right. It does take time... but there are those who prefer and can sit on the same mobo and features for say 7 years, and there are those who when updating their CPU, would like access to all the new features or perhaps need them. If a system is going to last through the CPUs user defined life, a 7+ year old mobo may not cut it. For example, does your Z69 pro3 have M.2 slots for PCIe based SSDs? It really does depend on what the user does, expects from their hardware feature wise, and budget. It isn't as cut and dry as some may make it out to be.


Nope, 2x SATA3 and 4x SATA2  But in fact the only annoying thing in that motherboard is that it doesn't have an USB3.0 header for the front USB. Well, I'll just get a cheap USB3.0 PCIe card from ebay which as a header.


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## EarthDog (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> Nope, 2x SATA3 and 4x SATA2  But in fact the only annoying thing in that motherboard is that it doesn't have an USB3.0 header for the front USB. Well, I'll just get a cheap USB3.0 PCIe card from ebay which as a header.


Just an example of missing technology from something so old... buying an AIC for USB 3.0 helps, but takes away from the money saved... even if it is only a few dollars. But yeah, no M.2 SATA/PCIe at all, no native USB 3.0... personally, I NEED those things.


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## JackCarver (Jan 13, 2020)

> You missed my point. AM4 will still be supported with Zen3, LGA1151v2 doesn't have anything more powerful coming anymore.



I have an Core i7 8700K and I wouldn’t ever buy a cpu of the coffee lake refresh, I wait till Comet Lake or the cpus after that. AM4 has exact one upgrade option left and you can use it only if you buy direct one cpu of the next generation, I wouldn‘t ever do this so also with am4 I would have to replace the Mainboard....


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Just an example of missing technology from something so old... buying an AIC for USB 3.0 helps, but takes away from the money saved... even if it is only a few dollars. But yeah, no M.2 SATA/PCIe at all, no native USB 3.0... personally, I NEED those things.


You must keep in mind that it's my 2nd PC/HTPC which is built with ~200EUR total spent, not my daily driver gaming PC.


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## EarthDog (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> You must keep in mind that it's my 2nd PC/HTPC which is built with ~200EUR total spent, not my daily driver gaming PC.


I hear ya (though not the point). Just stating that a system can be really long in the tooth for many keeping their board that long just to be able to drop a new processor in. Money doesn't grow on trees in my world either, but, my needs require me to budget and save for what I want and need.


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

JackCarver said:


> I have an Core i7 8700K and I wouldn’t ever buy a cpu of the coffee lake refresh, I wait till Comet Lake or the cpus after that. AM4 has exact one upgrade option left and you can use it only if you buy direct one cpu of the next generation, I wouldn‘t ever do this so also with am4 I would have to replace the Mainboard....


I'm truly wondering why. Intel has been using the same architecture since 2015 just with those updates I mentioned above. AMD has improved with every Ryzen gen.

Well, that isn't my concern, but I just wonder why.


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## Cherry2Blost (Jan 13, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> Hello everyone!
> This is my first post here, Happy New year.
> 
> My aging Sandy Bridge system has been in need of replacing for over two years, but never got round to it. It's always the same, money is needed elsewhere and you keep delaying until your PC is over 8 years old!
> ...



Hi that 3600/3700X would be great, course an i5 would be perfectly fine too, but having had Ryzen since Gen 1... the 3600 is a very nice bit of kit, the B450's are $ for $ better value but choice is yours.
As for NVME SSD I would actually forget the Intel one and go for the Sabrent 1TB TLC available for similar money on Amazon... Better performance for same money..

I did a comparison on my Ryzen 3800X system running X470 as follows. I purposely used 3GB so as to try to swamp the Cache on Samsung 970 Evo.... Sabrent is a blooming good drive IMHO. Course you could always go X570 and PCIe 4.0 Sabrent for that really sweet Gen 4 SSD Speed 

As for Ryzen Temps, nah as long as you use decent paste (TG), have good airflow routing and a half decent (stock even) cooler you needn't worry, I mean my 8 core All Core OC @ 4300 only hits mid 60's on Prime so...... But i5 will game quite nicely at 1080p as would an i3 or an i7... heck your uplift from Sandy Bridge will be about 20% by going to a new i5 so that's a pretty good uplift... isn't it?


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## trickson (Jan 13, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> You missed my point. AM4 will still be supported with Zen3, LGA1151v2 doesn't have anything more powerful coming anymore.
> 
> ....and it's still the same Skylake from 2015, just with MOAR CORES and higher clocks. Even the upcoming Comedy Lake is the same, 14nm+++++++++++++ and more cores & clocks.


Exactly why AMD is the real clear choice. 
Intel much like AMD during the FX era is stuck (For now) with adding more cores and more speed Not much coming from them now AMD they got all kinds of goodies.
Also why would ANYONE suggest the B450 Chipset for the AMD Ryzen? It's old and well not even as close to nice as the X470 or the X570.
The B450 Chipset is NOT going to give the performance it's just NOT.


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## RealNeil (Jan 13, 2020)

vultusprime said:


> my point was never about performance, but rather if the Ryzen 3000 CPU series may have problems, specifically related to over heating on full load, or even on idle.



The Ryzen 3000 series 3600 has better thermal performance than the 1600X that I built for my wife. Her PC is in a small case with an AMD RGB CPU Cooler and three 120mm case fans. It stays in the 35c range at stock and gets up to the low 50c range at full load.

I like your parts list and the only change I would make is for the 5700XT, specifically the Sapphire Radeon Pulse card. This one is a great p[erformer and is priced right too. It will slay 1080P gaming without any problems at all.
Here is a link to look at:  *https://bit.ly/2Tk3y3r*

As others have already pointed out, this better GPU would be paid for by reducing costs on the overkill PSU that you selected. (I love the Seasonic brand though) Just get a smaller size. (550W-600W)


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## Kissamies (Jan 13, 2020)

trickson said:


> Exactly why AMD is the real clear choice.
> Intel much like AMD during the FX era is stuck (For now) with adding more cores and more speed Not much coming from them now AMD they got all kinds of goodies.
> Also why would ANYONE suggest the B450 Chipset for the AMD Ryzen? It's old and well not even as close to nice as the X470 or the X570.
> The B450 Chipset is NOT going to give the performance it's just NOT.


B450 is just fine. I had a X470 motherboard before but it broke and I couldn't RMA it. I see no difference in performance in any means.


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## Cherry2Blost (Jan 13, 2020)

Nothing Wrong with B450, I have the worlds worst (apparently) X470 board and my 3800X works just fine and dandy on it


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## bogmali (Jan 13, 2020)

This thread has turned into a huge sidebar conversation, OP I believe you got enough recommendation to make a decision so I am shutting this down.


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