# Best 5.1 speaker setup for gaming rig/consoles



## Am* (Oct 19, 2012)

I'm in a bit of a dilemma over what to get for a 5.1 setup.

I have a sound card with optical in/out as well as the analog 5.1 connections. I've never set up a 5.1, but I was wondering if I could connect an analog 5.1 set to my sound card and have the consoles connect via optical in on my card to output the sound over 5.1 analog? Is this possible, or would I need a home cinema system to do this?

And which 5.1 set would be ideal (would these work ok and have a decent sound, or should I go for something better)? I mainly want to go 5.1 for audio positioning in games, as I use my headphones less and less nowadays and my stereo speaker setup just isn't ideal anymore.

Any other suggestions are welcome.


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

Optical is not really digital, it just claims it is.  Which is why I abandoned my pursuit of a 5.1 system.

You have to have a full on HDMI signal to get full digital sound, private message Bumblebee, he is the audio expert here.


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## FreedomEclipse (Oct 19, 2012)

Phusius said:


> private message Bumblebee, *he* is the audio expert here.



*She


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

FreedomEclipse said:


> *She



I was wondering why one of the replies from her said no baby... lol  I just kept that thought to myself at the time 


If your interested, I just purchased YAMAHA YAS-101 2.1CH Front Surround System (Black)...

Can't wait to hook it up and test it out


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## Dent1 (Oct 19, 2012)

Phusius said:


> Optical is not really digital, it just claims it is.  Which is why I abandoned my pursuit of a 5.1 system.
> 
> You have to have a full on HDMI signal to get full digital sound, private message Bumblebee, he is the audio expert here.



Optical is digital.


To the OP. Buy the receiver and speakers separately.

The receiver, you are looking for numerous optical, coaxial and HDMI outputs / inputs. Support for HD standards i.e. Dolby Digital True HD and DTS Masters etc.

For speakers, you want wooden bookshelf and/or floor standing speakers.

I like my bookshelves to have a low frequencies of <50Hz and floor standings to have 5-40Hz but that is a personal preference of mine.


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## Am* (Oct 19, 2012)

Phusius said:


> Optical is not really digital, it just claims it is.  Which is why I abandoned my pursuit of a 5.1 system.
> 
> You have to have a full on HDMI signal to get full digital sound, private message Bumblebee, he is the audio expert here.



What do you mean it's not digital? I thought it was.

Also I'm afraid I can't use HDMI, as it doesn't support 120Hz. That and because I haven't installed the audio drivers for my GPU, to prevent it screwing with my sound card.


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

Am* said:


> What do you mean it's not digital? I thought it was.
> 
> Also I'm afraid I can't use HDMI, as it doesn't support 120Hz. That and because I haven't installed the audio drivers for my GPU, to prevent it screwing with my sound card.



I don't know I was going to buy a 5.1 system just yesterday and a quick google search and Bumblebee confirmed, that most sound cards do not support Optical signal conversions to Dolby Digital, DTS, and other such features.  You will get 5.1 analog only.  Apparently only the really expensive sound cards support optical DTS, Dolby Live, etc.


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## Am* (Oct 19, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> Optical is digital.
> 
> To the OP. Buy the receiver and speakers seperately.
> 
> ...



I'm not fussed about the Dolby standards or anything. The sound card already has THX TruStudio Pro and Dolby Digital Live, which sounds good enough to me and has its own settings to tweak. I don't want to have to spend more money on stuff like DTS from a home cinema receiver when I'm almost never going to use it. I'd just like a 6 channel setup for games and let my sound card to do any tweaks to the sound (so long as it is 5.1 and not upmixed stereo, I'm not fussed). Is it good enough to do that?


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

Am* said:


> I'm not fussed about the Dolby standards or anything. The sound card already has THX TruStudio Pro and Dolby Digital Live, which sounds good enough to me and has its own settings to tweak. I don't want to have to spend more money on stuff like DTS from a home cinema receiver when I'm almost never going to use it. I'd just like a 6 channel setup for games and let my sound card to any tweaks to the sound. Is it good enough to do that?



My Xonar DG also supports THX and Dolby Live, however, it does not support it through a optical cable, the way Bumblebee was explaining it to me.  You need to speak to Bumblebee, she is the expert on audio.


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## Dent1 (Oct 19, 2012)

Am* said:


> What do you mean it's not digital? I thought it was.



It is digital. He is mistaken.



Am* said:


> I'm not fussed about the Dolby standards or anything. The sound card already has THX TruStudio Pro and Dolby Digital Live, which sounds good enough to me and has its own settings to tweak. I don't want to have to spend more money on stuff like DTS from a home cinema receiver when I'm almost never going to use it. I'd just like a 6 channel setup for games and let my sound card to any tweaks to the sound. Is it good enough to do that?



The Xonar DG  doesn't support Dolby Digital Live. Also, even if it did you'd only get Dolby Digital Live through a sound card's output, not input. So if your intention is to connect your console to your soundcard it will not work.

Most modern receivers come with the HD formats as standards. Admittedly, apart from playing back certain Blu Ray movies which have the new True HD and Masters soundtracks I doub't you'll need it, you could find a standard receiver which can output regular Dolby Digital and DTS. You might shave £100 of the price - But as I said most new receivers come with the HD formats as standard so there is no escaping it.




Am* said:


> I thought the sound card would take the signal from the console over optical, and just add the effects before outputting it over analog? I'm not sure, but I can't think of why it shouldn't work.



That won't work, and even if it did you'd be stuck with a very compressed stereo signal.

The easiest way is to get a receiver. Connect your console directly to the receiver via HDMI or SPDIF. Then connect your PC to the receiver's secondary HDMI or SPDIF input.



Am* said:


> I'm not using a DG. If I recall correctly, the DG only had Dolby Live for headphones. I'm using a Recon3D ATM. I'm not sure if it can do this or not, but my DG couldn't from when I tried.



The Soundblaster Recon 3D can output Dolby Digital Live via SPDIF-OUT. Like most soundcards, I don't think it can input DDL. Anything inputted via SPDIF-IN will be outputted back out as stereo.


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## Am* (Oct 19, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> You can only get Dolby Digital Live through the sound card's output, not input. So if your intention is to connect your console to your soundcard it will not work.
> 
> Most modern receivers come with the HD formats as standards. Admittedly, apart from playing back certain Blu Ray movies which have the new True HD and Masters soundtracks, you could find a standard receiver which can output regular Dolby Digital and DTS. You might shave £100 of the price - But as I said most new receivers come with the HD formats as standard so there is no ecaping it.



I thought the sound card would take the signal from the console over optical, and just add the effects before outputting it over analog? I'm not sure, but I can't think of why it shouldn't work.



Dent1 said:


> The Xonar DG  doesn't support Dolby Digital Live. Also, even if it did you'd only get Dolby Digital Live through a sound card's output, not input. So if your intention is to connect your console to your soundcard it will not work.



I'm not using a DG. If I recall correctly, the DG only had Dolby Live for headphones. I'm using a Recon3D ATM. I'm not sure if it can do this or not, but my DG couldn't from when I tried.


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

I just hope my new Yamaha Soundbar sounds amazing, will be using my SPDIF on my Xonar DG sound card... sigh I wish this audio stuff wasn't so complicated.


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## Am* (Oct 19, 2012)

Phusius said:


> I wish this audio stuff wasn't so complicated.



Same here. And here was me thinking I would just hook up a bunch of cables and be done with it. Sounds like a real PITA to setup.

But just to verify -- if my sound card can't receive through optical in and output to analog, then what is the TOSLINK input used for on the card?


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## Dent1 (Oct 19, 2012)

Phusius said:


> I just hope my new Yamaha Soundbar sounds amazing, will be using my SPDIF on my Xonar DG sound card... sigh I wish this audio stuff wasn't so complicated.



In all honesty. I'm sure it will sound "amazing", probably more than enough for the average person. Bit pricey, you are paying for the Yamaha tag.

But for the specification you can get 4 wooden bookshelf speakers at the same price and it would sound better. (Not that the Soundbar won't sound nice too)

I wouldn't recommend the Yamaha Soundbar unless you had a small room and needed the space.



Phusius said:


> Yeah, I have to do soundbar, I am in a little bedroom, not even room for a 5.1 system with small speakers.



I downgraded from 5.1 to 2.1 due to space. When I move out, hopefully I will have a big enough space to have proper 5.1 again.




Am* said:


> Same here. And here was me thinking I would just hook up a bunch of cables and be done with it. Sounds like a real PITA to setup.
> 
> But just to verify -- if my sound card can't receive through optical in and output to analog, then what is the TOSLINK input used for on the card?



Depends on the soundcard in question. Some will have less limitations that others. It really does vary card to card.

But generally speaking, you can connect your console via Toslink input or the SPDIF-IN. But, most modern soundcards will not re-encode and apply Dolby Digital Live encoding from that particular input. So you'll end up with a PCM Stereo signal being outputs back through the SPDIF-OUT. Most soundcards don't allow simultaneous analogue and digital usage (excluding front panel audio) , so it's unlikely that you'll be able to output audio via analogue if you have imitated SPDIF-IN and even if you could it'll still be stereo.


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> In all honesty. I'm sure it will sound "amazing", probably more than enough for the average person. Bit pricey, you are paying  for the Yamaha tag.
> 
> But for the specification you can get 4 wooden bookshelf speakers at the same price and it would sound better. (Not that the Soundbar won't sound nice too)
> 
> I wouldnt recommend the Yamaha Soundbar unless you needed the space.



Yeah, I have to do soundbar, I am in a little bedroom, not even room for a 5.1 system with small speakers.


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## Am* (Oct 19, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> Depends on the soundcard in question. Some will have less limitations that others. It really does vary card to card.
> 
> But generally speaking, you can connect your console via Toslink input or the SPDIF-IN. But, most modern soundcards will not re-encode and apply Dolby Digital Live encoding from that particular output. So you'll end up with a PCM Stereo signal being outputs back through the SPDIF-OUT. Most soundcards don't allow simultaneous analogue and digital usage (excluding front panel audio) , so it's unlikely that you'll be able to output audio via analogue if you have imitated SPDIF-IN.



Thanks. Gonna trawl through the manual for a bit to see if it'll get me anywhere further.


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## Dent1 (Oct 19, 2012)

Am* said:


> Thanks. Gonna trawl through the manual for a bit to see if it'll get me anywhere further.



If you need any further help just ask. 

I'm good at finding cheap deals on receivers and speakers. 

BTW are you from England?


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

Asus Xonar Essence is $187 on Newegg right now, it looks like it supports it all.  So I guess if I want my Yamaha to truly output 7.1 Dolby I have to get that now huh?

It looks like my onboard audio support 8 channels, the xonar dg however does not...  well fuck me like a goat...  guess I will try Yamaha with my onboard and sell my DG.

Realtek® ALC889 is model of my audio chip onboard.  Its one of the better ones apparently.   http://www.realtek.com.tw/products/productsView.aspx?Langid=1&PFid=28&Level=5&Conn=4&ProdID=173


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## Dent1 (Oct 19, 2012)

Phusius said:


> Asus Xonar Essence is $187 on Newegg right now, it looks like it supports it all.  So I guess if I want my Yamaha to truly output 7.1 Dolby I have to get that now huh?
> 
> It looks like my onboard audio support 8 channels, the xonar dg however does not...  well fuck me like a goat...  guess I will try Yamaha with my onboard and sell my DG.
> 
> Realtek® ALC889 is model of my audio chip onboard.  Its one of the better ones apparently.   http://www.realtek.com.tw/products/productsView.aspx?Langid=1&PFid=28&Level=5&Conn=4&ProdID=173



Be very careful. 

Dolby Digital is traditionally 5.1 speakers, 7.1 Dolby Digital is only available in HD format (Dolby Digital True HD) and can only be outputted via HDMI output. However, Xonar Essence is deceiving it's customers because it doesn't have HDMI inputs or outputs and thus can not support the 7.1 in HD format.  It only supports 7.1 via analogue, which is fine if that is what you are after. But please bear in mind 7.1 via analogue isn't Dolby Digital. By definition Dolby Digital needs to be decoded by a supported receiver through a digital connection i.e. Digital Coaxial, SPDIF or HDMI.




Phusius said:


> Yes, but this Yamaha is virtual 7.1 on a 2.1 system.  So I don't think it will be an issue, also, just installed my Realtek drivers... it sounds just as good as my Xonar DG... and  it turns out since my MoBo is high end it is one of the better Realtek chips.



What you are getting is just sound. Very good quality sound. But unfortunately it isnt Dolby Digital. You need a hardware receiver as an inbetween. There is no escaping it.


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## Phusius (Oct 19, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> Be very careful.
> 
> Dolby Digital is traditionally 5.1 speakers, 7.1 Dolby Digital is only available in HD format (Dolby Digital True HD) and can only be outputted via HDMI output. However, Xonar Essence is deceiving it's customers because it doesn't have HDMI outputs and thus can not support the 7.1 format.  It only supports 7.1 via analogue, which is fine if that is what you are after. But please bear in mind 7.1 via analogue isn't Dolby Digital. By definition Dolby Digital needs to be decoded by a receiver through a digital means



Yes, but this Yamaha is virtual 7.1 on a 2.1 system.  So I don't think it will be an issue, also, just installed my Realtek drivers... it sounds just as good as my Xonar DG... and  it turns out since my MoBo is high end it is one of the better Realtek chips.

Edit:  Testing some songs with this Realtek... sounds more clear, highs and lows seem better then using the Xonar DG...   xonar dg = ebay.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 20, 2012)

I was thinking of doing some gift ideas for Christmas ($75-500) headphones, amplifiers, digital-analog-converters, speakers.  people pleasers and how to hook them up lol

not a bad idea!


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

Well folks, after a LOT of reading/searching around, I found out that the sound card, from the looks of it, can indeed output audio from optical in to analog output, as Creative's website and their "quick start" guide states:



> 24-bit Digital-to-Analog conversion of digital sources : up to 96 kHz sample rate to analog outputs



The only problem is, I don't know how many channels it will convert the audio TO. Their USB Recon3D doesn't have 5.1 analog output, but can take optical/digital and output to gaming headsets over analog headphone output. This image from Creative's website...







...suggests that it can indeed take sound from optical in and convert it to analog output. Nowhere does it say whether the output would be upmixed stereo or true 5.1 channel...which puts me back to square one.

If anyone can suggest a decent priced home cinema or a speaker system, please feel free.



Dent1 said:


> If you need any further help just ask.
> 
> I'm good at finding cheap deals on receivers and speakers.
> 
> BTW are you from England?



I am indeed. And seeing as I have no idea what the usual going rate for 5.1 speaker systems is, I'd really appreciate some help on this.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 21, 2012)

Am* said:


> Well folks, after a LOT of reading/searching around, I found out that the sound card, from the looks of it, can indeed output audio from optical in to analog output, as Creative's website and their "quick start" guide states:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



what is your budget?


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

BumbleBee said:


> what is your budget?



Around £100-£200. But I'd prefer it to be around the £100 mark. Most people I know use expensive surround setups to fill a massive room with sound...my room is tiny and I just want the surround positioning to improve immersiveness of games. So long as the satellite speakers aren't tinny/crap and are about as good/no worse than these, I'm happy.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 21, 2012)

how big is your room?


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

BumbleBee said:


> how big is your room?



About 3mx3m, excluding the space taken by my bed. The speakers will be surrounding my office chair & desk.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 21, 2012)

don't even bother with 5.1 speakers.


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

I plan on changing places in 4 months time. Either way, I'm still going for a 5.1 setup.


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## Dent1 (Oct 21, 2012)

Am* said:


> If anyone can suggest a decent priced home cinema or a speaker system, please feel free.



Sure.



Am* said:


> I am indeed.



I thought so, when you said "Gonna trawl" it was a give away.





Am* said:


> Around £100-£200. But I'd prefer it to be around the £100 mark. Most people I know use expensive surround setups to fill a massive room with sound...my room is tiny and I just want the surround positioning to improve immersiveness of games. So long as the satellite speakers aren't tinny/crap and are about as good/no worse than these, I'm happy.



Those speakers are terrible. £100 won't get you much.  

I might be able to find you a non HD receiver for around £100 and two pairs of bookshelf speakers for £100. I doubt you'll have enough money for a subwoofer and centre speaker. But you can add that later. Don't be tempted to get a hometheatre in a box, the speakers they come with are often below mediocre.


Edit:

Get this receiver today!  Onkyo XSR309 £100

http://www.richersounds.com/product/av-receivers/onkyo/txsr309/onky-txsr309-blk

It's been reduced massively. I bought mine last year for almost £300 :| - It supports all the HD standards (Dolby Digital True HD and DTS Masters) not that you'll need it. But it's the cheapest you'll find a big brand HD receiver.

As for speakers. Get 1 pair of Wharfedale Diamond £49.99 and mix and match it with the Wharfedale CR30.4 floorstanding speakers. Brings you slightly over budget but it's the best combo. To stay on budget get 2 pairs of Wharfedale Diamond and you are dead on £200.


http://www.richersounds.com/product/bookshelf-speakers/wharfedale/diamond-9.0/whar-9.0-blk
http://www.richersounds.com/product/floorstanders/wharfedale/cr30.4/whar-cr30.4-blk


If you are hesitant, you could get the receiver + Floorstanding speakers. Test it out for a week or so. Then add the bookshelf speakers if you are impress what you are hearing thus far.




Am* said:


> The only things I see separating the expensive £200+ sets from budget sub-£100 setups are inputs and RMS ratings and I don't plan to have them anywhere near maximum volume.



£200+ isn't expensive. I'd say £200-300 is the sweet spot for normal people. There are audiophones whom spend £2k on a receiver, and will drop 5k on speakers. They'll even spend £100 on a HDMI cable.

The difference is also build quality. Most home theatres in a boxes are plastic, bookshelf speakers are wooden, sometimes the finest English oak. Average satellite for a HTIB is about 300g, whereas a bookshelf speaker weighs about 1Kg-5Kg. HTIB satelite usually have only 1x small 3.5" woofer so it struggles on low frequencies. Bookshelf will have a typically have at least 1x 10" woofer and bass reflex ports so it can reproduce low frequencies better. Also HTIB satellites don't often have tweeters so the high frequencies suffer and distort. Also with bookshelf speakers, the cables can be changed to higher grade copper.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 21, 2012)

your room is too small. come back when you got a bigger one or go with headphones.


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> Sure.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If those speakers are that bad, my expectations are pretty low as it is. If the theatre in a box for £100 can match them, it's good enough for me. If it can beat them, I'll be over the moon. I can't bring myself to spend more than £200 for the whole set though, no matter how good they are. The only things I see separating the expensive £200+ sets from budget sub-£100 setups are inputs and RMS ratings and I don't plan to have them anywhere near maximum volume (just loud enough for me to game on and hear everything happening around me in-game).


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## BumbleBee (Oct 21, 2012)

might be able to get a pair of KRK Rokit 5 for £200-£225


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## Dent1 (Oct 21, 2012)

Onkyo TX-SR309 5.1 AV Receiver £100

[yt]26aRAm6hL-w[/yt]

This is the CR30.1 Model. Just to give you an idea of the size as its similar to the CR30.4 which I recommended earlier £99










Wharfedale Diamond 9.0 £49

[yt]zzFyl-sTXwE[/yt]

Centre speaker is missing - but can be added later. Subwoofer is optional as the floorstanding speakers can produce good low frequencies already.




BumbleBee said:


> when you put large speakers in a small untreated room you run into problems with standing waves, reflections and comb filtering.
> 
> in english.. booming bass, reverb and a terrible image.



I agree. You need a big room for 5.1 otherwise stick with 2.0 - in which case receiver + floorstanding is the best 2.0 configuration 

Think the OP is moving to a bigger house soon, so hopefully it can accommodate 5.1 well.




st.bone said:


> Well since you insist on a 5.1, and if you don't mind stretching your budget then Logitech Z906 will do what you want @ $340
> Logitech Z906 500W 5.1 Speakers




Edit:

OP is in the UK, the cheapest I can find the Logitech Z906 is £290 which is more than what I spec'd above. Frankly, Logitech Z906 couldn't compete with the Whafedales in terms of audio quality or build quality either and would lack the input/outputs and features of the Onkyo receiver too.

http://www.scan.co.uk/products/logitech-z906-51-surround-sound-speakers-500w-rms


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## BumbleBee (Oct 21, 2012)

when you put large speakers in a small untreated room you run into problems with standing waves, reflections and comb filtering. 

in english.. booming bass, reverb and a terrible image.


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## Protagonist (Oct 21, 2012)

Well since you insist on a 5.1, and if you don't mind stretching your budget then Logitech Z906 will do what you want @ $340
Logitech Z906 500W 5.1 Speakers


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## Phusius (Oct 21, 2012)

Bumblebee is an audio Goddess.  Bow before her.

Btw Bumblebee I still haven't made up my mind


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## BumbleBee (Oct 21, 2012)

KRK also sells a 10" active subwoofer that you can buy later on

http://www.amazon.co_uk/dp/B001QWEWFA/?tag=tec053-21

you can daisy chain everything together. all you need to do is connect your source (digital-analog-converter, sound card, CD Player, iPod, etc.)


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> Onkyo TX-SR309 5.1 AV Receiver £100
> 
> [yt]26aRAm6hL-w[/yt]
> 
> ...



Is there any way to get speakers that sound as well but in a much smaller form factor? Also that receiver has a zillion connections I'd never, ever use -- is there anything similar at say a third of a cost, with just some optical inputs and analog outputs?

Also I've looked into the Z906 before, and they seem to have a lot of negative reviews from ex-Z5500 owners saying it's inferior to its predecessor, and the Z5500 was cheaper (I remember it being under £200)...definitely not going anywhere near the Z906 at that price. 



BumbleBee said:


> when you put large speakers in a small untreated room you run into problems with standing waves, reflections and comb filtering.
> 
> in english.. booming bass, reverb and a terrible image.



I suspected that. Hence why I'd like to go with much smaller speakers. What about these?


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## cdawall (Oct 21, 2012)

Am* said:


> I suspected that. Hence why I'd like to go with much smaller speakers. What about these?



That should be fine for what you want if you ever want more the receiver can push a bigger set of speakers.


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## Dent1 (Oct 21, 2012)

Am* said:


> Is there any way to get speakers that sound as well but in a much smaller form factor? Also that receiver has a zillion connections I'd never, ever use -- is there anything similar at say a third of a cost, with just some optical inputs and analog outputs?



Third of the cost. No, because we are looking at entry level receivers here. This is the starting price of AV equipment. It's natural that you won't need all the connections at first. But over time you'll start to utilise them. i.e. In the future you might buy multiple consoles' you don't want to have to keep unplugging and fiddling. You might buy a Freeview box or subscribe to Sky whom broadcast in Dolby Digital etc. 




Am* said:


> Also I've looked into the Z906 before, and they seem to have a lot of negative reviews from ex-Z5500 owners saying it's inferior to its predecessor, and the Z5500 was cheaper (I remember it being under £200)...definitely not going anywhere near the Z906 at that price.





Agreed, its overpriced. The z-5500 isn't really good on paper either outside the realms of PC speakers.



Am* said:


> I suspected that. Hence why I'd like to go with much smaller speakers. What about these?



As cdawall said, it would do what you want. Your requirements are not ambitious so anything will suffice you.

In terms of value for money it isn't great. The receiver is pretty old and has no support for DTS HD or True HD, no front panel connnections, no USB connections, so you can't charge your Ipod or playback or sync it conveniently.

Speakers are terrible. Like no better than PC speakers. Each satellite only weights 400g. Those woofers must be tiny. The Wharfedales, weight 4.2Kg each! That speak volumes in terms of build quality. 

For the sake of saving £21, I can't justify that HTIB compared to what I recommended.


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> Third of the cost. No, because we are looking at entry level receivers here. This is the starting price of AV equipment. It's natural that you won't need all the connections at first. But over time you'll start to utilise them. i.e. In the future you might buy multiple consoles' you don't want to have to keep unplugging and fiddling. You might buy a Freeview box or subscribe to Sky whom broadcast in Dolby Digital etc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



So if that set is bad value at £180 quid, do I need to look back at those Pioneer SHS100 speakers for better value for money, and save the rest for a better receiver later on? I haven't got my consoles yet, and my PC's sound card wouldn't need an AV receiver. My main concern right now is my PC. Should I just get a sub-£100 5.1 set for now and forget the receiver and/or better speakers until I upgrade later on down the line? If so, what's the best sub-£100 5.1 set I can buy? I wouldn't feel right spending over £200 on something of which I have no knowledge of value of or have anything better to compare to. Until I spend some time with a cheaper set, that is. At the same time, I don't want to buy a crap set that would want me to return them on arrival, so any suggestions on what a decent sub-£100 set 5.1 looks like and any features I specifically need to look for?


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## Dent1 (Oct 21, 2012)

Am* said:


> So if that set is bad value at £180 quid, do I need to look back at those Pioneer SHS100 speakers for better value for money, and save the rest for a better receiver later on? I haven't got my consoles yet, and my PC's sound card wouldn't need an AV receiver. My main concern right now is my PC. Should I just get a sub-£100 5.1 set for now and forget the receiver and/or better speakers until I upgrade later on down the line? If so, what's the best sub-£100 5.1 set I can buy? I wouldn't feel right spending over £200 on something of which I have no knowledge of value of or have anything better to compare to. Until I spend some time with a cheaper set, that is. At the same time, I don't want to buy a crap set that would want me to return them on arrival, so any suggestions on what a decent sub-£100 set 5.1 looks like and any features I specifically need to look for?




http://www.richersounds.com/product/speaker-packages/pioneer/s-hs100/pion-shs100

Richer Sounds are doing Pioneer SHS100 for £99 as a promotion but it's missing the receiver. There is nothing sub £100. HTIB start at around £150-250. HTIB Speakers are often around the same specification and build quality across the board, the price variations for HTIB is the receiver which has +1 or -1 feature and/or connection. The speakers on the Yamaha YHT196 are on the same level as the Pioneer SHS100.

It's not that the Yamaha YHT196 is a rip off, it's the typical price I'd expect. It just isn't value for money compared to buying separate components.


If you were to buy the Pioneer SHS100 and Onkyo receiver together (£200). It would be better value than Yamaha YHT196 (£179) as you'll benefit from a much better and modern receiver (and you'll have a center speaker and subwoofer unlike the seperates I quoted for £200). But ultimately sound quality would be better if you buy away from a package speaker set.





Am* said:


> and my PC's sound card wouldn't need an AV receiver.



You've got the Creative Recon 3D Fatal1ty? It supports Dolby Digital Live. The main benefit of that feature is to encode 5.1 signals to Dolby Digital 5.1 for your receiver to decode. It's in your best interest to connect your PC to your AV receiver!


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> http://www.richersounds.com/product/speaker-packages/pioneer/s-hs100/pion-shs100
> 
> Richer Sounds are doing Pioneer SHS100 for £99 as a promotion but it's missing the receiver. There is nothing sub £100. HTIB start at around £150-250. HTIB Speakers are often around the same specification and build quality across the board, the price variations for HTIB is the receiver which has +1 or -1 feature and/or connection. The speakers on the Yamaha YHT196 are on the same level as the Pioneer SHS100.
> 
> ...



Almost all of the PC games I use don't seem to care about Dolby Digital. Only thing I see in the options is the number of channels they can utilise. So I still can't understand why I'd need a receiver when the sound card can output the raw sound directly from analog outputs.

But as far as speakers go, are the Pioneers as good as it gets for a £100 5.1 speakers set?


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## Dent1 (Oct 21, 2012)

Am* said:


> Almost all of the PC games I use don't seem to care about Dolby Digital. Only thing I see in the options is the number of channels they can utilise.



But it's supported on the sly. If you look at the back of the box of any modern PC game e.g. BF3, Assassins Creed series you'll see the Dolby Digital logo. But when you go into the audio option there is no Dolby Digital option. This is because game developers don't want to pay for a Dolby license. So what they've done is given the game five separate audio channels, so when Dolby Digital Live is enabled in the soundcard's driver it converts and encodes PCM 5.1 into Dolby Digital 5.1 ready for the AV receiver to decode. This way they bypass the licensing issues. Pretty much all games today have 5 audio channels or more.


It's the same concept with consoles, Xbox has a encoder chip built into its audio card which works similar to Dolby Digital Live, and it essentially detects the five audio channels and encodes it to Dolby Digital for the receiver to decode. The Dolby soundtrack was never present on the disc at all despite the logo on the back!



Am* said:


> So I still can't understand why I'd need a receiver when the sound card can output the raw sound directly from analog outputs.





Analogue can not output Dolby or DTS. 

Also in some cases, if you run across a game, mp3 or video  which was recorded in stereo and you've got 5.1 speakers you'll have 3 redundant speakers. Whereas a receiver you can up mix it to Prologic 5.1 or DTS NEO 5.1.




Am* said:


> But as far as speakers go, are the Pioneers as good as it gets for a £100 5.1 speakers set?



For HTIB, yes its as good as it gets. But the Pioneers are just speakers. You still need a receiver.


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## Am* (Oct 21, 2012)

Dent1 said:


> But it's supported on the sly. If you look at the back of the box of any modern PC game e.g. BF3, Assassins Creed series you'll see the Dolby Digital logo. But when you go into the audio option there is no Dolby Digital option. This is because game developers don't want to pay for a Dolby license. So what they've done is given the game five separate audio channels, so when Dolby Digital Live is enabled in the soundcard's driver it converts and encodes PCM 5.1 into Dolby Digital 5.1 ready for the AV receiver to decode. This way they bypass the licensing issues. Pretty much all games today have 5 audio channels or more.
> 
> 
> It's the same concept with consoles, Xbox has a encoder chip built into its audio card which works similar to Dolby Digital Live, and it essentially detects the five audio channels and encodes it to Dolby Digital for the receiver to decode. The Dolby soundtrack was never present on the disc at all despite the logo on the back!
> ...



Thanks. I'll buy those Pioneers until the Onkyo receiver comes back in stock, or until I see a better one for the money. I appreciate the help, fella.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 22, 2012)

I still wouldn't buy the Pioneers. in the UK rooms are much smaller. 9x9 is like a childs bedroom in the US.

active monitors and speakers (PC) are designed for listening at close distances typically 3 feet this is called a close-field or near-field. the sound reaches your ears with minimal room acoustics.

if you want surround sound that bad buy the Logitech Z906.


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## Dent1 (Oct 22, 2012)

BumbleBee said:


> if you want surround sound that bad buy the Logitech Z906.



The Z906 cost £290.

The the pioneer speakers + Onkyo receiver is £200 (More inputs/outputs, features, HD audio standards, integrated FM Radio, and he can upgrade the speakers later)

TBH I'm not sold on the Pioneer speakers either, but Logitech would be my last choice. OP seems reluctant to buy bookshelf, floorstading or active monitor.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 22, 2012)

I don't like Logitech speakers either but the room is very important and determines how well the speakers perform.


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## eidairaman1 (Oct 22, 2012)

BumbleBee said:


> I don't like Logitech speakers either but the room is very important and determines how well the speakers perform.



Personally I felt the x530s were pretty good, but no longer produced.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 22, 2012)

what are you comparing them to?


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## eidairaman1 (Oct 22, 2012)

BumbleBee said:


> what are you comparing them to?



at the time nothing because where i was at the time i didnt have any speakers till i bought that set.

btw I still have a set of Labtec Spin 70s here heh


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## BumbleBee (Oct 22, 2012)

one more thing.

when you move up a receiver line you do get more features and connections but you also get better amplifier stages, power supply, higher quality parts, room correction, digital-analog-converters, analog-digital-converters, video processors, etc which makes a better experience.

I have a Marantz SR6004 receiver, DVDO Edge video processor and Emotiva XPA-5 power amp. it's better to buy separates than to put all your eggs in one basket and buy a flagship receiver.

also Monoprice $5 HDMI cables are just fine


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## cdawall (Oct 22, 2012)

BumbleBee said:


> one more thing.
> 
> when you move up a receiver line you do get more features and connections but you also get better amplifier stages, power supply, higher quality parts, room correction, digital-analog-converters, analog-digital-converters, video processors, etc which makes a better experience.
> 
> ...



I just went flagship back in the day H/K AVR 347 so onboard DCDi by Faroudja, 55wx7 in H/K speak which is 95w a channel in yamaha speak. Looking at the AVR3600/3650 here soon...I wont buy a mid/low end receiver again just not worth it to me had this one for 5-6 years now moved 3 times and it has always been perfect for me.


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## BumbleBee (Oct 23, 2012)

here is a good example why it's a good idea to go with separates.

this is the power amp I mentioned. it weighs 70lbs! three times as much as my receiver


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