# RBE - General information and discussion



## BAGZZlash (Mar 9, 2008)

RBE - Radeon BIOS editor

Current version: v1.18

Further references
- A great video BIOS database for many cards is provided by Techpowerup.com.

- Techpowerup.com also provides WinFlash, the tool you might want to use to extract the BIOS image from your video card and to flash the modified BIOS image upon it. If you dislike flashing tools for Windows, use ATIFlash and a boot disc or USB stick instead.

- Once again techpowerup.com: You can use their tool GPU-Z to extract your video BIOS as well. Note that clock settings changed with RBE are not properly displayed by GPU-Z, use the hardware monitor function of Rivatuner for that.

- If you have an older ATI video card, try RaBiT. 

- For nVidia users, there's the NiBiTor.


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## CrackerJack (Mar 9, 2008)

i posted a thread like this awhile back, but i only had the .98 verision. This one looks better


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## jakal (Mar 10, 2008)

Did anybody try this cool utility??


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 10, 2008)

jakal said:


> Did anybody try this cool utility??


Back in good old germany, I have a lot of testers and buddies providing me hints. I can say, RBE has reached some level of maturity by now. Look here.  
I would appreciate it to have RBE join the league of useful utilities of Techpowerup.com. Put a Techpowerup.com-Logo into it and have a section in the download area for it. Does anyone know who to discuss this with?


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## asb2106 (Mar 10, 2008)

now there is no way of upping the voltage with a flashed bios right??


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 10, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> now there is no way of upping the voltage with a flashed bios right??



Depends on what you mean by "flashed BIOS". If it means you modified a BIOS with RBE and then flashed it onto your video card, then no. RBE does not support BIOS images already modified. You will have to use your original BIOS for that.
In any other case, the answer should be yes!  For example, you downloaded an alternative BIOS. Maybe you have a 3870 from Sapphire and you flashed a 3870-BIOS from, say, Club3D onto it, for any reason. Then you can extract this BIOS from your card, modify clocks and/or voltages and flash it upon your card again.
Perhaps you just tell us what you're planning to do...


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## asb2106 (Mar 10, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Depends on what you mean by "flashed BIOS". If it means you modified a BIOS with RBE and then flashed it onto your video card, then no. RBE does not support BIOS images already modified. You will have to use your original BIOS for that.
> In any other case, the answer should be yes!  For example, you downloaded an alternative BIOS. Maybe you have a 3870 from Sapphire and you flashed a 3870-BIOS from, say, Club3D onto it, for any reason. Then you can extract this BIOS from your card, modify clocks and/or voltages and flash it upon your card again.
> Perhaps you just tell us what you're planning to do...



well i have heard that there is no "bios modifier" that can change the voltage.  I thought I heard that you can change it in the bios, but it will not go any higher that what the hardware on the card will allow(which is like 1.35 or something).


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 10, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> well i have heard that there is no "bios modifier" that can change the voltage.  I thought I heard that you can change it in the bios, but it will not go any higher that what the hardware on the card will allow(which is like 1.35 or something).



Of course you can't get higher than the hardware allows. But yes, RBE can modify the voltage!


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## Darknova (Mar 10, 2008)

I can verify it works.

Flashed my card last night. Edited it to boot up at 300Mhz and 2.25Ghz, 2D same, 3D is 816 and 2.5Ghz.

Works really well.

Kudos to you BAGZZlash


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## CrackerJack (Mar 10, 2008)

last time i check it can edit any of the supported cards voltages, i changed mine to 1.3 and then 1.5.


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## asb2106 (Mar 10, 2008)

Darknova said:


> I can verify it works.
> 
> Flashed my card last night. Edited it to boot up at 300Mhz and 2.25Ghz, 2D same, 3D is 816 and 2.5Ghz.
> 
> ...



well with no mods I got my card to 904/2830


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## asb2106 (Mar 10, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> last time i check it can edit any of the supported cards voltages, i changed mine to 1.3 and then 1.5.



did you actually measure it with a multi meter??

And what core speeds were you able to achieve??


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## Darknova (Mar 10, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> well with no mods I got my card to 904/2830



Awesome lol. Mine started bugging out at 830 though. All I do is play games, and I can play Crysis at near max and 1680x1050, so I didn't see any point in trying to break it tbh


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## asb2106 (Mar 10, 2008)

Darknova said:


> Awesome lol. Mine started bugging out at 830 though. All I do is play games, and I can play Crysis at near max and 1680x1050, so I didn't see any point in trying to break it tbh



cant really argue there, the only thing that kept me pushing was the ATI 3k 3dmark forum.  Gotta compete, have you posted your results over there??  Its in my sig


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## Darknova (Mar 10, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> cant really argue there, the only thing that kept me pushing was the ATI 3k 3dmark forum.  Gotta compete, have you posted your results over there??  Its in my sig



Yup I have. Not for a long time though lol. I only really did it when I first got the card so I could see what it could do, and that was before my motherboard became unstable (fixed now though) and the GPU was only at 800, so I may just post a new run when I get a chance


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## asb2106 (Mar 10, 2008)

Darknova said:


> Yup I have. Not for a long time though lol. I only really did it when I first got the card so I could see what it could do, and that was before my motherboard became unstable (fixed now though) and the GPU was only at 800, so I may just post a new run when I get a chance



you should, I have been helping with updating over there, we are trying to get all 3k scores we can!


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## Darknova (Mar 10, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> you should, I have been helping with updating over there, we are trying to get all 3k scores we can!



Hehe cool, well when I get a chance I'll give it another shot at OCing my CPU, and run 3Dmark again


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## asb2106 (Mar 10, 2008)

Darknova said:


> Hehe cool, well when I get a chance I'll give it another shot at OCing my CPU, and run 3Dmark again



looking forward!


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## CrackerJack (Mar 10, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> did you actually measure it with a multi meter??
> 
> And what core speeds were you able to achieve??





no i didn't use a meter. but i can get higher speeds more stable. 800/1100 will crash after about 30min. but when there set to 1.5 they won't. Play cod4 for about 5 hours no problem


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## W1zzard (Mar 13, 2008)

this tool is now an official tpu utility... i will support the author with infos on bios layout but he will code it


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## gR3iF (Mar 13, 2008)

Hey nice tool. It worked really good for me with an 3870, only one thing is the missing fan controll is holding me back. Can you somehow get this to work?


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## trog100 (Mar 13, 2008)

W1zzard said:


> this tool is now an official tpu utility... i will support the author with infos on bios layout but he will code it



nice one.. 

trog


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## asb2106 (Mar 13, 2008)

has anyone been able to confirm that by going up with the volts in the bios editor will result in a "real" higher 3d voltage.  I have tried other software in the past that said it upped voltage but with a multimeter I was able to confirm it had not.


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 13, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> has anyone been able to confirm that by going up with the volts in the bios editor will result in a "real" higher 3d voltage.  I have tried other software in the past that said it upped voltage but with a multimeter I was able to confirm it had not.


I read of several people complaining about not properly changed voltages. What card exactly do you have? It's not unlikely that your card is not capable of changing the voltage. RBE just instructs the BIOS to change the voltage to the value set. What the card make of it, is on it's own.
Maybe you will have to apply a hardware-mod like the famous "pencil-mod".


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 13, 2008)

gR3iF said:


> Hey nice tool. It worked really good for me with an 3870, only one thing is the missing fan controll is holding me back. Can you somehow get this to work?


What do you mean, "holding you back"? Isn't the 3870 fan control panel working for you?


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 13, 2008)

W1zzard said:


> this tool is now an official tpu utility... i will support the author with infos on bios layout but he will code it



Once again and in public: Thank you for everything you already helped me with. This was more than I did imagine. I'm excited about the things to come!


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## Frogger (Mar 13, 2008)

BAGZZlash just wanted to say THANKS for this fine tool have been using v0.98 for my clients this new v looks to be great also 

ps Welcome to TPU hope you enjoy it here


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## mandelore (Mar 13, 2008)

been using RBE for a lill while now, this new one looks very impressive


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## HousERaT (Mar 13, 2008)

Perhaps people can list the card they're using the bios mod for and what the before and after experience was like?

Example:  I was using a XXXXX Card with stock bios clocks of XXXXX and after switching my volts and clocks to XXXXX my new overclock is XXXXX.

Same for fan control. 

Thanks
The RaT


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## Name Change (Mar 13, 2008)

Using this tool Can I take out clock lock on HD3870 of mine.


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## HousERaT (Mar 13, 2008)

Name Change said:


> Using this tool Can I take out clock lock on HD3870 of mine.


No, and it says that in the FAQ. 

You have to use a bios that isn't locked.


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## ghost101 (Mar 13, 2008)

When i upped the BIOS voltage to 1.327v, i only got ~1.275v which is up from the 1.21v i got wthout the bios tweak. i had to use a pencil mod to get the rest of the way to 1.4v.

This was with the computerbase.de bios editor. This tool reads the same volts in the BIOS i used, so cant imagine it being any different.


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 14, 2008)

Name Change said:


> Using this tool Can I take out clock lock on HD3870 of mine.


For sure? I'd appreciate approved data on that.



HousERaT said:


> No, and it says that in the FAQ.
> 
> You have to use a bios that isn't locked.


Yes, but it also says that RBE can clock beyond then 862 MHz limit. Just "unlocking" for software overclocking isn't possible by BIOS patching. You will need a completely new BIOS for that.



ghost101 said:


> When i upped the BIOS voltage to 1.327v, i only got ~1.275v which is up from the 1.21v i got wthout the bios tweak. i had to use a pencil mod to get the rest of the way to 1.4v.
> 
> This was with the computerbase.de bios editor. This tool reads the same volts in the BIOS i used, so cant imagine it being any different.


As I said before: All one can do is to instruct the BIOS to set the voltage selected. But the hardware has to implement that. If it doesn't, a hardware mod seems inevitable.


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## W1zzard (Mar 14, 2008)

the voltages in the bios are horribly implemented. basically there is a list of voltages you can choose from but this list almost never matches the reality, also there are many boards where voltage control isnt possible but the bios still advertises it


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## gR3iF (Mar 14, 2008)

Yeah that is exactly what i mean. Then fan controll doesnt work with a 3850 or a 3870 for me.
I would really apreciate it if this feature is running. If you need any information let me know.


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 14, 2008)

gR3iF said:


> Yeah that is exactly what i mean. Then fan controll doesnt work with a 3850 or a 3870 for me.
> I would really apreciate it if this feature is running. If you need any information let me know.


I was planning to do some more research on that either way during the next few days. Let' just wait and see what come out if it after all.


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## asb2106 (Mar 14, 2008)

W1zzard said:


> the voltages in the bios are horribly implemented. basically there is a list of voltages you can choose from but this list almost never matches the reality, also there are many boards where voltage control isnt possible but the bios still advertises it



there is the answer I was looking for... Thanks Wiz

Does anyone know what boards might legitimately make that voltage change?


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## Simri (Mar 14, 2008)

ATIWinFlash Tips/Help

You can use ATIWinFlash as ATIFlash/FlashROM in Windows

start --> run --> cmd
cd ... "C:\ATIWinFlash_2.0.0.2"
ATIWinflash -h (help)
ATIWinflash -f -p 0 BIOS.rom (flash+force)

Warning !!!  
after/next/following: ATIWinflash -f -p 0 BIOS.rom *wait 1-2min*


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## EastCoasthandle (Mar 14, 2008)

Hmm, 
This program read my 2d clock voltage as 1 for my HIS 2900XT.  I don't think that's correct 
Also, I get 3 dots for 3d voltage.


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 14, 2008)

@BAGGZZ

Thank you for the time you've spend developing RBE and making it available to the community. Good stuff! Hertzlichen dank!

I run ran RBE.  It would be GREAT if you made the software compatible with R4xx and above (ie X800 and above). I know this is extra work on your side... but it is exactly these cards where we do a lot of hacking 

P.S. 

1./ I tried to load an X800 BIOS and it *crashed* with a script error.

2./ How does your "2xxx" fan control work? Does fan speed control work for other cards also?


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## FR@NK (Mar 14, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> It would be GREAT if you made the software compatible with R4xx and above (ie X800 and above). I know this is extra work on your side... but it is exactly these cards where we do a lot of hacking



Older cards dont have voltages controlled in software or bios. On the x800 the voltages are controlled by resistors on the card.


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## trog100 (Mar 14, 2008)

so even with 3xxxx cards that can be bios voltage altered its still hit and miss as to what voltages u actually get.. ??

trog


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## HousERaT (Mar 14, 2008)

I think it would make sense is this thread was moved down into the TPU "Our software" section.  What do you folks think?


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## kup (Mar 14, 2008)

trog100 said:


> so even with 3xxxx cards that can be bios voltage altered its still hit and miss as to what voltages u actually get.. ??
> 
> trog



It's only hit and miss as far as the PCB being flashed to. My GeCube has no software (or bios) voltage control so regardless of what I set it is up the the voltage regulators on the board to set the stock voltage of 1.33v. This leaves hardmodding the board as the only control option.

If the PCB has the correct 2D and 3D power circuitry implemented then the bios set voltages should be as close to correct as the hardware allows (variations as per on all hardware is what I mean).


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## W1zzard (Mar 14, 2008)

HousERaT said:


> I think it would make sense is this thread was moved down into the TPU "Our software" section.  What do you folks think?



there will be a sub-forum etc. for rbe when it's a bit more mature


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 14, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> @BAGGZZ
> 
> Thank you for the time you've spend developing RBE and making it available to the community. Good stuff! Hertzlichen dank!
> 
> I run ran RBE.  It would be GREAT if you made the software compatible with R4xx and above (ie X800 and above). I know this is extra work on your side... but it is exactly these cards where we do a lot of hacking


Mmmh, I don't think I will support older cards than 2xx0 series. I promise to look after it, so maybe... But my policy is to carry on after the death of BIOS modding for ATI cards with RaBiT. RaBiT should support you video card.



EastCoasthandle said:


> Hmm,
> This program read my 2d clock voltage as 1 for my HIS 2900XT.  I don't think that's correct
> Also, I get 3 dots for 3d voltage.


This is not an issue. Please refer to the in-program FAQ for that.



gR3iF said:


> Yeah that is exactly what i mean. Then fan controll doesnt work with a 3850 or a 3870 for me.
> I would really apreciate it if this feature is running. If you need any information let me know.


This is what I was trying to tell. However, could you tell me exactly what card you have and send me your BIOS?


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## mandelore (Mar 14, 2008)

3 dots for voltage means its automatically/preset vallued. just over write these dots with correct voltage


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## Name Change (Mar 14, 2008)

hmm i flashed my bios to 870/2450. how do I know if these clocks are the ones working since only program that detects clocks are atitool. gpuz only detects 800/2400 stock. How do i know if clocks are working 3d mode.


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## trog100 (Mar 14, 2008)

run the rivatuner monitor while a 3d app is running.. 

trog


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## Name Change (Mar 14, 2008)

I have tried and still says stock clocks. Maybe i should try to re-flash the card...


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## asb2106 (Mar 14, 2008)

kup said:


> It's only hit and miss as far as the PCB being flashed to. My GeCube has no software (or bios) voltage control so regardless of what I set it is up the the voltage regulators on the board to set the stock voltage of 1.33v. This leaves hardmodding the board as the only control option.
> 
> If the PCB has the correct 2D and 3D power circuitry implemented then the bios set voltages should be as close to correct as the hardware allows (variations as per on all hardware is what I mean).



yes, does anyone know what boards can do that??


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## trog100 (Mar 14, 2008)

rivatuner is correct.. if the speed dosnt crank up its not doing so.. believe what it tell u.. 

trog


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## trog100 (Mar 14, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> yes, does anyone know what boards can do that??



as yet no.. 

or at least no list exists..

trog


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## asb2106 (Mar 14, 2008)

Name Change said:


> I have tried and still says stock clocks. Maybe i should try to re-flash the card...



why dont you just change the core and mem speed in riva and have it apply the speeds at boot?

its a much safer method than flashin a bios.  Adjusting in riva wont void warrenties either!  what they dont know cant hurt them!  

and yes, trog is the ultimate master of knowledge(HEHE J/K), but he does know what hes talking about, hes got 2 of these cards


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## asb2106 (Mar 14, 2008)

trog100 said:


> as yet no..
> 
> or at least no list exists..
> 
> trog



bummer, Im buying one in the next upcomin week, and that would be nice to not have to mess with an iron, Id like to get 1.4, 1.5 maybe, and call it a day, I just want to get to like 950core.

Oh and before - that was not a personal attack - just a joke


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## trog100 (Mar 14, 2008)

i try to keep up to date with the cards.. one thing is clear.. some chips go better than others by 50 mhz or so even at the same voltage..

the HIS 850 core turbo must have speed binned chips..  some other cards come with better chips but its pot luck.. 

i think bios volt modding is for any bios crippled 3850 cards.. again some are bios crippled some probably hard wire crippled..

the partners seem to be playing to their hearts content..  too many variations on a theme..

trog


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## DonGeilo (Mar 15, 2008)

Hi, you have a nice tool there.

I have this Card, http://geizhals.at/deutschland/?a=294666&t=alle&plz=&va=nachnahme&vl=de&v=l#filterform

with the attached Bios 

and i have these problem





My Card have an Fan Control, but i can´t go under 30%.


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## lemonadesoda (Mar 15, 2008)

BAGGZZ said:
			
		

> Mmmh, I don't think I will support older cards than 2xx0 series. I promise to look after it, so maybe... But my policy is to carry on after the death of BIOS modding for ATI cards with RaBiT. RaBiT should support you video card.



Just some thoughts:

1./ Make sure RBE doesnt *CRASH* when you load an incompatible BIOS... but reports "this is an xzy BIOS, RBE is not compatible" and refuse to load.
2./ Have a drop down box allowing older cards... with then a help statement like "RBE cannot edit this BIOS... try using xyz with a link to xyz"
3./ GPU-Z *is* compatible with older cards ;-)
 I agree, RaBiT is probably fine for all older cards. Does it do the X1xxx series? But a link to the TPU download section for RaBiT would be nice. Remember us old-timers know about RaBit, but the community is full of new people and they would appreciate the link, or HELP file.


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 15, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> 1./ Make sure RBE doesnt *CRASH* when you load an incompatible BIOS... but reports "this is an xzy BIOS, RBE is not compatible" and refuse to load.
> 2./ Have a drop down box allowing older cards... with then a help statement like "RBE cannot edit this BIOS... try using xyz with a link to xyz"
> 3./ GPU-Z *is* compatible with older cards ;-)
> I agree, RaBiT is probably fine for all older cards. Does it do the X1xxx series? But a link to the TPU download section for RaBiT would be nice. Remember us old-timers know about RaBit, but the community is full of new people and they would appreciate the link, or HELP file.



ad 1.) Of course there will be a handling for that.
ad 2.) I don't think that's useful. But as I said: I'm checking on some things and if that will come out positively, there will be some changes... Don't want to say any more about this right now! 
ad 3.) Who said it doesn't? But that's not really comparable. However, I posted a link to RaBiT and to NiBiTor in this thread's first post. Can't do more than that to help with research. And no one who is unable or too lazy to use google should tinker with BIOS flashing anyway.

Please don't get this wrong: I'm really greatful for any hints and thoughts you or anyone might have. Thanks to all!


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## AozRoon (Mar 17, 2008)

Hi BAGZZlash !

I am using your great RBE since the 0.95 version and I have just discovered today that 1.07 version allows now to edit fan speed thresholds ! Very nice improvement ...

I have noticed, when monitoring my card (2900Pro 512bits), that the temperature thresholds are not the same to increase or decrease the fan rotation speed.

For instance, by default, the fan speed goes up from 25% to 31% whenever the temperature become more than 50°C but decrease from 31% to 25% when temperature fall down below 45°C (not 50°C). This is obviously to avoid the fan to change too often its speed.

In RBE 1.07 (which I did not test yet) you seems to allow to edit the temperature threshold for the fan speed to increase, but do you have the project to allow editing the decreasing fan speed thresholds ? Or perhaps the gap between those thresholds is fixed (5°C in our example).

Thanks a lot !

Aoz.


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 17, 2008)

AozRoon said:


> Hi BAGZZlash !
> 
> I am using your great RBE since the 0.95 version and I have just discovered today that 1.07 version allows now to edit fan speed thresholds ! Very nice improvement ...
> 
> ...



Hi!

Thanks for the cheers! 
Yes, this feature is called 'Hysteresis'. It's easy to implement this, but I didn't think that anyone would be eager for this. I'll remember you for the next release.


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## AozRoon (Mar 17, 2008)

Hi BAGZZlash !

After tests, it seems that it is the histeresis threshold (5°c) which is coded in the bios, and not the fan speed decreasing temperatures thresholds.

That means that increasing the 25%->31% temperature threshold from 50° to 55° also leads to an increase of the 31%->25% threshold from 45°->50°.

Which sounds really good ! So you don't have any work to do on this side, 5°c for the histeresis is ok.

Amazing tool this RBE !! Our HD2900 are no more noisy 

 t h a n k   y o u   B A G Z Z l a s h   ! !


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## NicolasG (Mar 18, 2008)

Unfortunately, it does not work with Mobility Radeon HD 2600 BIOS. Does not even want to load it.


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## pablo NZ (Mar 18, 2008)

Hi BAGZZlash, I can't save the original BIOS off my Sapphire 3870, so being a knowledgeable guy I was wondering if you might know a resolution. Details in the thread below:

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=55497

Sorry if this is off topic


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 20, 2008)

RBE v1.08 just released! Have fun!


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## cool_recep (Mar 20, 2008)

Release Notes...



> Added some new bugs. Because most of the code is completely new, there will be some bugs for sure.



LOL...


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## AozRoon (Mar 20, 2008)

BAGZZlash, you should work for AMD 

Thanks


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## AsRock (Mar 20, 2008)

It messed my games up as i tried this a few days ago.  2D was fine don't know about the fan but 3D was a complete mess when i tried to set fan and clocks to 830\930.

This was v1.07.  Anyone tried 1.08 with a 2900/XT ?


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## VuurVOS (Mar 20, 2008)

I like to see if possible a option to set a minimum fan speed for the HD3870?


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 20, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> I like to see if possible a option to set a minimum fan speed for the HD3870?



There will be some more options for 3xx0 fan control in the next version. Let's wait and see...


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 20, 2008)

AsRock said:


> It messed my games up as i tried this a few days ago.  2D was fine don't know about the fan but 3D was a complete mess when i tried to set fan and clocks to 830\930.
> 
> This was v1.07.  Anyone tried 1.08 with a 2900/XT ?



What was the matter? Can you explain a little more?
You should try v1.08. I's completely rewritten!


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## mikek75 (Mar 20, 2008)

Cheers for this Bagzzlash, I've just used it to adjust the fanspeed on my ASUS 3870. It was getting to 90c. I lowed the threshold from 73c to 55c and increased the steepness from 48 to 70.

Just ran 3dmark06 and the temperature hovvered around the 72c mark, fanspeed increased to 42% as monitored by Rivatuner.


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## AsRock (Mar 20, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> What was the matter? Can you explain a little more?
> You should try v1.08. I's completely rewritten!



Well not going try it with 1.07 again.  BUT i'll try it with 1.08 for sure in fact after this post lol.


The problem was in 3D that there was many mixed up colours on screen.  IF 1.08 does it to i'll see if i can take a screenshot of it.

Screenshot not possible and 1.08 does the same thing.  All though 1 game started then every thing went corrupt after about 5 seconds then monitor turns off.  Guessing the GPU is crashing for some reason.

The coruption is lines with multiple colored pixels.


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## Mad-Matt (Mar 21, 2008)

just tested 1.08 of rbe with my 3870 using latest sapphire bios from this site and it seems to be working well.

Is this the right place for a feature request ? 
Is it possible to change in the bios the pal/ntsc mode of the card like on previous ati cards.  The 3870 is the first ati card ive had that for whatever reason doesnt have the jumper switches for setting pal mode.  Id like to be able to do this as its the only way I can get pal modes such as 720x576 to show up in the display options.  handy for emus where i want exact pal screen mode


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## VuurVOS (Mar 21, 2008)

Mad-Matt said:


> just tested 1.08 of rbe with my 3870 using latest sapphire bios from this site and it seems to be working well.
> 
> Is this the right place for a feature request ?
> Is it possible to change in the bios the pal/ntsc mode of the card like on previous ati cards.  The 3870 is the first ati card ive had that for whatever reason doesnt have the jumper switches for setting pal mode.  Id like to be able to do this as its the only way I can get pal modes such as 720x576 to show up in the display options.  handy for emus where i want exact pal screen mode



Some HD3870 have those swiches like my Sapphire.


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## Name Change (Mar 21, 2008)

Which clocks should I change in RBE only 3d high or 3d high and low to same oc... When i change only 3d high my clocks don;t change... This in my stock clocks...


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 22, 2008)

I usually change both 3D settings.


----------



## DonGeilo (Mar 25, 2008)

DonGeilo said:


> Hi, you have a nice tool there.
> 
> I have this Card, http://geizhals.at/deutschland/?a=294666&t=alle&plz=&va=nachnahme&vl=de&v=l#filterform
> 
> ...




Sorry for Quote, but nobody answered me.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 25, 2008)

DonGeilo said:


> Sorry for Quote, but nobody answered me.



Try v1.08. If it doesn't work, wait for v1.09.


----------



## DonGeilo (Mar 25, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Try v1.08. If it doesn't work, wait for v1.09.



okay, V1.08 doensn´t work, i can fix the fancontrol, but the Fan doesn´t go under 30%. Did you need a Bios from my GeCube Card to Fix this ?


----------



## pnovack (Mar 26, 2008)

*PowerColor 3850 AGP problem*

Hi,
I have a problem with 3850 AGP card. PowerColor card use good cooling system and that's why i bought this card (not Sapphire one). But then i  realized it could be mistake. Fan is constantly working at 100%. It's sounds like a small hair dryier. From the other hand GPU has always temperature below 55 C... but i don't need that. Even in 2D mode fan works at 100%! Radiator is big and made of copper and fan is also big, so it hasn't work as fast as it is. Could RBE help with that? Unfortunately i'm a modding noob (have never changed BIOS).

This is problem has every user of this card... so fixing/changing this would be a great thing...


----------



## trog100 (Mar 26, 2008)

pnovack said:


> Hi,
> I have a problem with 3850 AGP card. PowerColor card use good cooling system and that's why i bought this card (not Sapphire one). But then i  realized it could be mistake. Fan is constantly working at 100%. It's sounds like a small hair dryier. From the other hand GPU has always temperature below 55 C... but i don't need that. Even in 2D mode fan works at 100%! Radiator is big and made of copper and fan is also big, so it hasn't work as fast as it is. Could RBE help with that? Unfortunately i'm a modding noob (have never changed BIOS).
> 
> This is problem has every user of this card... so fixing/changing this would be a great thing...



i have a gigabyte 3870 card that comes with a small zalman heatsink/fan.. the fan has no speed control and simply runs flat out all the time.. sounds similar to the way your card is done.. the only difference being the little salman cooler does a reasonable job and isnt noisy..

u might have to think about a cooler change.. the fan u have might not have any speed control.. just a simple two wire job.. 

trog


----------



## CrackerJack (Mar 26, 2008)

DonGeilo said:


> okay, V1.08 doensn´t work, i can fix the fancontrol, but the Fan doesn´t go under 30%. Did you need a Bios from my GeCube Card to Fix this ?



what temp did you set for 30%?


----------



## repsol23 (Mar 26, 2008)

pnovack said:


> Hi,
> I have a problem with 3850 AGP card. PowerColor card use good cooling system and that's why i bought this card (not Sapphire one). But then i  realized it could be mistake. Fan is constantly working at 100%. It's sounds like a small hair dryier. From the other hand GPU has always temperature below 55 C... but i don't need that. Even in 2D mode fan works at 100%! Radiator is big and made of copper and fan is also big, so it hasn't work as fast as it is. Could RBE help with that? Unfortunately i'm a modding noob (have never changed BIOS).
> 
> This is problem has every user of this card... so fixing/changing this would be a great thing...



I have the exact same card and mine seems to have been working properly when I had the fan.  If I am not mistaken it would run 100% anytime it was above 45 - 50C.  I have been able to cool my case to around 25C and my card temps never above 40 C and fan never broke more than 80% or so and would run as low as 40% with no load.  I now use chilled water and temps never reach more than 21-22C.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 27, 2008)

Please everyone try v1.09!


----------



## DonGeilo (Mar 27, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Please everyone try v1.09!



Hi, I have try it.

When i juse this 

 settings, my fan doesn´t go under an doesn´t go over 30%.

I was fixed at 30%.

Now i will try the table settings.

But the fan doesn´t go under 30% there to.


----------



## CrackerJack (Mar 27, 2008)

DonGeilo said:


> Hi, I have try it.
> 
> When i juse this
> 
> ...





Try to keep an eye out for the temps. What's the temps during gaming?


----------



## DonGeilo (Mar 27, 2008)

The problem is that the fan doesn´t go under and over 30% when I create a bios with the editor.


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 27, 2008)

I got a smilair problem with RBE 1.09. I can't get the fan speed at min 30%


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 27, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> I got a smilair problem with RBE 1.09. I can't get the fan speed at min 30%



What card do you have and did that happen with older RBE versions as well?


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 27, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> What card do you have and did that happen with older RBE versions as well?



I have a (Build By ATI/RED PCB/DUAL SLOT) Sapphire HD3870. With the older version I lowered the thresshold to  55 degrees and it worked. I didn't try this with the newer version. I only tried to raise the min fan speed. I first tried 30% and a reboot later I tried 50%. 50%must create some more noise and lower the temps. Temps are also the same like before


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 28, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> I have a (Build By ATI/RED PCB/DUAL SLOT) Sapphire HD3870. With the older version I lowered the thresshold to  55 degrees and it worked. I didn't try this with the newer version. I only tried to raise the min fan speed. I first tried 30% and a reboot later I tried 50%. 50%must create some more noise and lower the temps. Temps are also the same like before



So what is the problem, do you want your minimum fan speed above or below 30%? First of all, you should try reading your actual fan duty using RivaTuner's hardware monitor. Then, you should find out if the settings made using RBE do any change at all. If they do, try the settings "duty cycle min" and "Tmin". If the settings' meanings are somewhat unclear to you, you should click the blue hint link for some explanation. Then come back again and tell me what's the problem.


----------



## Tim_HKG (Mar 28, 2008)

To: BAGZZlash

Firstly, thanks for your wonderful program! I'd like to change the clock settings from 777/1126 to 830/1200, which parts on the picture should I modify? Besides, will it affect the power-saving function of "PowerPlay" after the modification? Please "circle" the parts to be modified on the below picture. 

Thanks in advance!


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 28, 2008)

@TIM_HKG
You only need to change the *State 2 - mode 3 - "high 3D"* speeds. Your Powerplay stays the same except that your card is running 830/1200 in 3D mode


----------



## AsRock (Mar 28, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> What was the matter? Can you explain a little more?
> You should try v1.08. I's completely rewritten!



Ok, found the issue. Happy to say it was not due to your program.

Issue is in the ram on top side of the card ( Heat ).  Been meaning to make a cooler for it just not got around to it lol..


----------



## intel igent (Mar 28, 2008)

Any possible mods for 3850 AGP cards?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 28, 2008)

intel igent said:


> Any possible mods for 3850 AGP cards?



Did you try?


----------



## Tim_HKG (Mar 28, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> @TIM_HKG
> You only need to change the *State 2 - mode 3 - "high 3D"* speeds. Your Powerplay stays the same except that your card is running 830/1200 in 3D mode



Thanks for your help and BAGZZlash, his program!


----------



## Raven (Mar 28, 2008)

Tried with RBE 1.09, x1950pro AGP version. I saved the bios with Atiwinflash 2.0.0.7

I receive this error message:






Thanx!


----------



## CrackerJack (Mar 28, 2008)

Raven said:


> Tried with RBE 1.09, x1950pro AGP version. I saved the bios with Atiwinflash 2.0.0.7
> 
> I receive this error message:
> 
> ...



This is for HD 2k series and up! Use Rabit for the 1k series, it works great.


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 28, 2008)

Raven said:


> Tried with RBE 1.09, x1950pro AGP version. I saved the bios with Atiwinflash 2.0.0.7
> 
> I receive this error message:
> 
> ...


The problem is your graphics card. Its too old for the editor. You need RaBiT. This answer was also written in the starters post.


----------



## CrackerJack (Mar 28, 2008)

isn't that what i just said


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 28, 2008)

I know  I started to write before your posted you message so we created more or less a dubble post....


----------



## CrackerJack (Mar 28, 2008)

lol


----------



## AsRock (Mar 28, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> RBE - Radeon BIOS editor
> 
> Current version: v1.09
> 
> ...



BTW  Thank you for all your time you put in to this and supporting the 2900  ..


----------



## Raven (Mar 28, 2008)

OK... thanks!


----------



## pnovack (Mar 31, 2008)

*i don't get the point ...*



repsol23 said:


> I have the exact same card and mine seems to have been working properly when I had the fan.  If I am not mistaken it would run 100% anytime it was above 45 - 50C.  I have been able to cool my case to around 25C and my card temps never above 40 C and fan never broke more than 80% or so and would run as low as 40% with no load.  I now use chilled water and temps never reach more than 21-22C.



So, it looks like this fan (PowerColor 3850 AGP) has a speed controll. But how you manage to cool this card below 40 C? That fan and copper radiator are very efficient but still you can't reach such low temeperatures even in 2D mode... and noisy fan works at 100% speed. Have you used watercooling?? I want to remain with PowerColor cooler if its possible...


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 31, 2008)

pnovack said:


> So, it looks like this fan (PowerColor 3850 AGP) has a speed controll. But how you manage to cool this card below 40 C? That fan and copper radiator are very efficient but still you can't reach such low temeperatures even in 2D mode... and noisy fan works at 100% speed. Have you used watercooling?? I want to remain with PowerColor cooler if its possible...


Maybe he lowered his gpu clock and did some undervolting. A good airflow could also cause this.


----------



## repsol23 (Mar 31, 2008)

pnovack said:


> So, it looks like this fan (PowerColor 3850 AGP) has a speed controll. But how you manage to cool this card below 40 C? That fan and copper radiator are very efficient but still you can't reach such low temeperatures even in 2D mode... and noisy fan works at 100% speed. Have you used watercooling?? I want to remain with PowerColor cooler if its possible...



I will try to explain for the moment as I don't have much time to post pics of my rig.  I had a 7800gs before the powercolor and it was connected in watercooling setup that cooled my CPU/NB/Vid card(2 blocks on card).  As soon as I got my new card I simply took the old card out the loop but didn't put the new card onto water, just used the fan.  Since my setup allows me to pull air off my cooled down radiator (can get as low as 3C at times) into my case, I can then cool down my case temps to as low as 23C (according to everest).  Therefore when using the fan on my Powercolor and cool case temps I was able to get very low temps with the fan.  Now that the card is watercooled I never seem to break 24C, up a little from 20C originally due to the warm temperatures in my room.  Not only is the temps outside rising, but I also have an AC unit blowing all the hot air off the radiator into my room making it quite uncomfortable at times.  I am gonna have to chill my room just to keep myself cool, sheesh its just a never ending cycle!!

First pic is a side shot, the rad on the back is the last stop before the liquid goes back to the chiller.  THis allows me to extract cool air into the case by means of 3 120 fans.  Once pushes fan into rad, one between the rad and the case pulls air in, then last one in the case helps pull a little more.  I use this setup because I also have a couple of air filters sandwiched in between the rads and fans to help keep dust to a minimum!!  I live in the desert where winds (like today) can reachs gusts of up to 60 mph and dust ends up everywhere.

Second pic is of my aerocool controller showing the temp on the cpu block, shows 3.8C just blurry due to having to lower resolution for posting here.

I just recently upgraded to the 3850agp card, and I am already looking at doing another upgrade.  I am giving the Asrock 4coredual sata2 a shot with a e6700 cpu.  Will be basically just switching mobo and cpu and all else will remain the same, hopefully this will be an easy transition over to socket 775.  I have been on this P4 3.2e @ 3.9ghz for nearly about 2 years now and am ready to move up.


----------



## Howcomes (Apr 1, 2008)

Latest version doesnt work on VISTA SP0...not sure if it was ever supposed to or not


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 1, 2008)

Howcomes said:


> Latest version doesnt work on VISTA SP0...not sure if it was ever supposed to or not




Never had a problem here. Did you ran as admin?

I've tested on:
Vista x86 SP0 + SP2
Vista x64 SP0 + SP2
XP x86
XP x64 Pro

Haven't test it on MC Edition!


----------



## gamalrizaldi (Apr 5, 2008)

hi BAGZZlash

thanks for the tool, its easy to tweak the bios with this tool.. and now i can get the 100% full speed fan at anytime, like we all know atitool and rivatuner cant always lock the speed fan to 100% at all time.. coz i dont care with the noise, i just wont the card to be cool..
i have sapphire hd3650 256mb ddr3 with default speed 725/800, it can go to 775/975 without artifact in atitool with default voltage (1.25v read in RBE1.09)

i need help here BAGZZlash, i wanted the card to go faster than 775/975 with the voltage tweak, i already try to raise the voltage to 1.3 and 1.35, but its always bsod when core clock is set to 800/1000 in atitools scan4artifacts. same in mem clock too, if i set to 750/1000 the artifact will comes but no bsod.. it seems the mem clock stuck @975 and the core @775 even i raise the voltage..

one thing that i dont know is; is the voltage really raisin up? in fact in gpuz or rivatuner cant read the real voltage, can you help me resolve this issue.. just wondering to set this card to 800/1000, coz in idle this card just have 40 degree celc @ 775/975, full load at 65 degree celc..

sorry 4 my bad grammer, cheers 2 BAGZZlash, thx 4 this great tool btw =D


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 6, 2008)

gamalrizaldi said:


> hi BAGZZlash
> 
> thanks for the tool, its easy to tweak the bios with this tool.. and now i can get the 100% full speed fan at anytime, like we all know atitool and rivatuner cant always lock the speed fan to 100% at all time.. coz i dont care with the noise, i just wont the card to be cool..
> i have sapphire hd3650 256mb ddr3 with default speed 725/800, it can go to 775/975 without artifact in atitool with default voltage (1.25v read in RBE1.09)
> ...



RBE can just program the video card to set the voltages entered. It's uncertain if those settings are applied well by the card. It depends on the voltage transformer used by the video card vendor. Some video cards just don't apply those settings but most of the cards simply can't exceed a hardware limit given by the transformer. In those cases, a hardware mod is inevitable.


----------



## gamalrizaldi (Apr 6, 2008)

look like the newest rbe cant load the sapphire radeon 9600xt agp 128mb ddr tinybga samsung bios from gpuz..


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 6, 2008)

gamalrizaldi said:


> look like the newest rbe cant load the sapphire radeon 9600xt agp 128mb ddr tinybga samsung bios from gpuz..



It NOT made for 9600xt,

2k Series And Higher, Check the first page.


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 10, 2008)

*Modding Bios on poercolor 3850 512Mb*

Ati tool will OC my card to 776/1066 is it worth my while trying to mod bios? how mush higher may it go?

To increase the voltage do I just increase the state2 mode 3 high3d voltage, save, reflash with ati flash, reboot then try to OC again and see if it goes higher.

What is a safe volatge level for this card.

Bit of a nebee, and want to push card but not fry it.

Are the state 2 modes 1 and 2 for powerplay, as the powercolor card has all set to same frequencies, and does not move between frequencies with games desktop etc.

Thanks for any help.


----------



## erocker (Apr 10, 2008)

I just finished making a HIS tubo bios with increased voltage and higher fan speeds.  Could anyone who actually knows what they are doing take a look at the pics, and make sure everything looks ok?  Thanks.


----------



## Tatty_One (Apr 10, 2008)

erocker said:


> I just finished making a HIS tubo bios with increased voltage and higher fan speeds.  Could anyone who actually knows what they are doing take a look at the pics, and make sure everything looks ok?  Thanks.



That looks fine to me, not sure how the stock cooler handles temps at the increased voltage but mu first thoughts were that your initial fan speeds were a bit high but it's better to be safe than sorry when playing with them volts!.....good job!


----------



## erocker (Apr 10, 2008)

The extra voltage is for headroom, incase someone wants to take the OC further.  My cards currently have the same clocks, with the fans set at 89% via RivaTuner but my volts are at 1.30v.


----------



## Dr. Spankenstein (Apr 10, 2008)

Are we still stuck with using only unaltered BIOSes to begin with? If so, I wonder why?


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 10, 2008)

Dr. Spankenstein said:


> Are we still stuck with using only unaltered BIOSes to begin with? If so, I wonder why?



no we can use edited bios now


----------



## erocker (Apr 11, 2008)

Yeah, I must say this program is completely awesome!  Adjusted the bios' for my cards, plus someone else's card, all a success!  I've turned my 3870's into fire breathing monsters!  Getting 900+ on the cores and they are staying cool!


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 11, 2008)

*Tool for flashing?*

What do you guys use to re-flash card?

If done from dos prompt bootable CD etc. what are the command parameters.

a step by step guide for us newbees would be a big help.

Powercolor HD3850 512Mb with 776/1056 with ATItool.

Bios on powercolor sets all speeds to same at 2d & 3D (720/900), is this disabling powerplay? would changing 2D and low3D to lower speeds (300/900)) re-enable it?

thanks in advance.


----------



## Tatty_One (Apr 11, 2008)

Richard Shepherdson said:


> What do you guys use to re-flash card?
> 
> If done from dos prompt bootable CD etc. what are the command parameters.
> 
> ...




http://reference.techpowerup.com/Video_BIOS_Flashing

and......ATi flash 3.49........

http://www.techpowerup.com/downloads/855/ATIFlash_3.49.html

or

Winflash 2.0.0.7.....

http://www.techpowerup.com/downloads/1019/.html


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 11, 2008)

*Winflash*



Tatty_One said:


> http://reference.techpowerup.com/Video_BIOS_Flashing
> 
> and......ATi flash 3.49........
> 
> ...



Does the winflash utility work with the HD3850 cards? as I would feel happier flashing with a windows utility than a DOS one.

Whilst you're in the answering mood, thanks for that, is modding the bios as easy as RBE makes it look, load, mod speeds &/or voltages then save and reflash.

It looks very staight forward, but worried about killing card

thanks again for help.


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 11, 2008)

Richard Shepherdson said:


> Does the winflash utility work with the HD3850 cards? as I would feel happier flashing with a windows utility than a DOS one.
> 
> Whilst you're in the answering mood, thanks for that, is modding the bios as easy as RBE makes it look, load, mod speeds &/or voltages then save and reflash.
> 
> ...



it should work, there's really no boundry for winflash.


----------



## HTC (Apr 11, 2008)

Great utility you have here, dude: congratz.

Just checked the BIOS collection and i see 10 different BIOS available for HD 3870 from Sapphire. Which one should i go for? Advice, anyone?


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 11, 2008)

HTC said:


> Great utility you have here, dude: congratz.
> 
> Just checked the BIOS collection and i see 10 different BIOS available for HD 3870 from Sapphire. Which one should i go for? Advice, anyone?



i would go with this one.
http://bios.techpowerup.com/vgabios/5394/Sapphire.HD3870.512.080109.html

i was choose's the lower clock speeds, or the one close to the default clocks. But if your card is working fine, then i wouldn't use any of those. If your going edit your bios, just use your own bios. And you can get it from gpu-z


----------



## HTC (Apr 11, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> i would go with this one.
> http://bios.techpowerup.com/vgabios/5394/Sapphire.HD3870.512.080109.html
> 
> i was choose's the lower clock speeds, or the one close to the default clocks. But if your card is working fine, then i wouldn't use any of those. If your going edit your bios, just use your own bios. And you can get it from gpu-z



I would do that but i'm far too much of a noob to be messing around without knowing what i'm doing. I'm just aiming for a decent overclock, without exagerating.


----------



## Tatty_One (Apr 11, 2008)

Richard Shepherdson said:


> Does the winflash utility work with the HD3850 cards? as I would feel happier flashing with a windows utility than a DOS one.
> 
> Whilst you're in the answering mood, thanks for that, is modding the bios as easy as RBE makes it look, load, mod speeds &/or voltages then save and reflash.
> 
> ...



BIOS modding is actually very easy, I have probably done 50 or more then flashed it afterwards.  It is understandable to be nervous on the first attempt, you cannot kill a card from a bad flash, you just cannot boot the card so you would have to do either a blind re-flash of the old BIOS (blind as in black screen, just typing on the keyboard the commands very carefully) or borrow a card to reboot then re do the BIOS/Flash.

Seeing that the Winflash release date is March 2008 I would feel fairly confident it would support the 3850.


----------



## erocker (Apr 12, 2008)

Winflash does work with the 3850 and it works very well!  just make sure that your are running your system very stable (stock if necessary) when you do it.  Once you hit flash, your system will seem to lock up, just wait and it will work.


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 12, 2008)

*Newbee seeks more advice*

Thanks for the advice guys, had no problem modding bios and reflashing.

Checked bios on card flashing had worked.

But, even though the new bios has flashed to the card, the card still behaves like standard,

Old bios 720/900, 720/900, 720/900
Modded bios 300/900, 300/900, 783/1053

card still boots up at 720/900 and does not rise to higher clock on running 3D app.

am i missing something?

Also raising voltage from 1.22 to 1.35 on 3D gives no more overclock.

Any advice.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 12, 2008)

Richard Shepherdson said:


> Thanks for the advice guys, had no problem modding bios and reflashing.
> 
> Checked bios on card flashing had worked.
> 
> ...



Sometimes you need to reinstall your video card driver.


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 12, 2008)

*Still no go*

flashed card again, reinstalled video driver, and Rivatuner still says card is running at 715/900 with no rise to 783/1053 when 3D program run.

rechecked bios on card by downloading it and opening in RBE, and it is as set
300/900, 300/900, 783/1053.

any ideas?

Thanks


----------



## ultraboy (Apr 13, 2008)

I had the same problem with Richard i.e. modded bios does not have any effect on VGA card (Sapphire 2600xt GDDR4). Tried that with RBE 1.07, 1.08, and 1.09 - all similar results.


----------



## VuurVOS (Apr 13, 2008)

Richard Shepherdson said:


> flashed card again, reinstalled video driver, and Rivatuner still says card is running at 715/900 with no rise to 783/1053 when 3D program run.
> 
> rechecked bios on card by downloading it and opening in RBE, and it is as set
> 300/900, 300/900, 783/1053.
> ...





ultraboy said:


> I had the same problem with Richard i.e. modded bios does not have any effect on VGA card (Sapphire 2600xt GDDR4). Tried that with RBE 1.07, 1.08, and 1.09 - all similar results.



I think it is the best, if both of you post the orginal bios and the modded bios on the bug report:
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=57156


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 13, 2008)

*Big Thanks*



VuurVOS said:


> I think it is the best, if both of you post the orginal bios and the modded bios on the bug report:
> http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=57156





posted to bug report forum, got answer, I had to change the state 4 settings aswell, set them to 783/1053 same as 3D and works a charm.

Ultraboy give it a go

Big thanks to Vuurvos for advice.


----------



## VuurVOS (Apr 13, 2008)

Your welcome


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 13, 2008)

Richard Shepherdson said:


> posted to bug report forum, got answer, I had to change the state 4 settings aswell, set them to 783/1053 same as 3D and works a charm.
> 
> Ultraboy give it a go
> 
> Big thanks to Vuurvos for advice.



Hadn't the states been locked by default? Did you explicitly open the lock?


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 13, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Hadn't the states been locked by default? Did you explicitly open the lock?



The states were locked by default and I left them such, the only states I could alter were

State 2 modes 1, 2 & 3 and state 4 mode 1

but

If I alter the values in states 2 only, the new bios has no affect on the behaviour of the card. If I also alter state 4 mode 1 to the same values as state 2 mode 3 then the card behaves as the bios is modded i.e power play works card runs at OC settings in 3D.

i.e 
720/900, 720/900, 720/900, 720/900 standard bios
300/900, 300/900, 783/1053, 720/900 modded bios no affect
300/900, 300/900, 783/1053, 783/1053 modded bios works as intended

Only thing that seems to have no affect is the voltage increase, as there seems to be no increase in OC headroom.

Card is powercolor HD3850 512Mb PCS


----------



## ultraboy (Apr 14, 2008)

Richard Shepherdson said:


> ...Ultraboy give it a go...



Thanks. I did, but seem to have problem with entering State 3&4 value. 

Will post in the bug report forum.


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

ultraboy said:


> Thanks. I did, but seem to have problem with entering State 3&4 value.
> 
> Will post in the bug report forum.



which card do you have?


----------



## ultraboy (Apr 14, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> which card do you have?



Sapphire 2600xt GDDR4.


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

ultraboy said:


> Sapphire 2600xt GDDR4.



ok, those states are for the 3k series. as far as i know. 

there lock on my card too (2900)


----------



## ultraboy (Apr 14, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> ok, those states are for the 3k series. as far as i know.
> 
> there lock on my card too (2900)



Ahhh..that might explain why.  

As mentioned in the bug report thread I could change State 3 in RBE V 1.08 (but not later version), though the card still load at default (800/1100).


----------



## sneekypeet (Apr 14, 2008)

Sorry for the noobish question comming here...

Can I put "any" voltage in the slots for 3Dvoltage? Of course I mean within reason, but does it look for a specific set/group of voltages?


----------



## AphexDreamer (Apr 14, 2008)

Does anyone know if this would work with the HD3870X2 BIOS and how one would go about Flashing the HD3870X2 with out bricking it (Preferable)? I read somewhere you need to flash it twice or something like that, which scares me cause HOW THE FUDGE WOULD I DO THAT??

Thanks.


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

sneekypeet said:


> Sorry for the noobish question comming here...
> 
> Can I put "any" voltage in the slots for 3Dvoltage? Of course I mean within reason, but does it look for a specific set/group of voltages?



idk man, i never went higher than 1.5v. but i never actually test to see if it was really running at 1.5v anyway.


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

AphexDreamer said:


> Does anyone know if this would work with the HD3870X2 BIOS and how one would go about Flashing the HD3870X2 with out bricking it (Preferable)? I read somewhere you need to flash it twice or something like that, which scares me cause HOW THE FUDGE WOULD I DO THAT??
> 
> Thanks.



the should work with 3870 x2, give me a sec and i'll try it. but going about flashing it. just use atiflash.  and use this command: atiflash.exe  -pa  biosname


----------



## sneekypeet (Apr 14, 2008)

anyone got the time to put together a tutorial with pics for both voltage mods(so we know what all needs changing to accomplish it) and clockspeed mods.

I promise a fat thank you under the posting of it!!!!!


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

AphexDreamer:

3870 x2 will work!!! Just uncheck the lock box, and then can adjust all the settings. But you won't be able to adjust fan speeds


----------



## AphexDreamer (Apr 14, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> the should work with 3870 x2, give me a sec and i'll try it. but going about flashing it. just use atiflash.  and use this command: atiflash.exe  -pa  biosname



I hope your 100% right. Let me know how your flash goes and if its successful, if you don't mind PM'ing me instruction on how to do so that would be great (If you remember and all).

EDIT: Ahh so I can edit its BIOS sweet, then I just need to worry about flashing it, thanks.


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

AphexDreamer said:


> I hope your 100% right. Let me know how your flash goes and if its successful, if you don't mind PM'ing me instruction on how to do so that would be great (If you remember and all).
> 
> EDIT: Ahh so I can edit its BIOS sweet, then I just need to worry about flashing it, thanks.



i don't have 3870 x2 sorry, but i've flash tons of cards though. and this one shouldn't be any different.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Apr 14, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> i don't have 3870 x2 sorry, but i've flash tons of cards though. and this one shouldn't be any different.



Ok, thanks anyways.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 14, 2008)

sneekypeet said:


> Sorry for the noobish question comming here...
> 
> Can I put "any" voltage in the slots for 3Dvoltage? Of course I mean within reason, but does it look for a specific set/group of voltages?


Yes, you can enter 1000 volts to these slots if you want. It depends on the card, what it makes of it. There are cards that seem to not have a changeable voltage transformer at all, but must cards transformers will limit at about 1.4 volts. RBE correctly programmes the BIOS to set the voltage entered, but due to hardware limitation, this might not be enough. You need to convince yourself using a multimeter to be sure about your voltages. If you reached the hardware limit, a hard mod (many tuturials can be found in the internet) is inevitable.



AphexDreamer said:


> Does anyone know if this would work with the HD3870X2 BIOS and how one would go about Flashing the HD3870X2 with out bricking it (Preferable)? I read somewhere you need to flash it twice or something like that, which scares me cause HOW THE FUDGE WOULD I DO THAT??
> 
> Thanks.



Yes, you can alter a 3870 X² BIOS. Due to this card actually has 2 boards with 2 BIOSes, you have to flash the exact same BIOS file to both of the boards. I don't know if this can be done using WinFlash, but I'm certain ATIFlash can do the job!


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

Winflash should work, i would think. You wouldn't think it would work, because of winflash showing the device as one, on a single gpu card. But idk, surely somebody has tried it. lol


----------



## Richard Shepherdson (Apr 14, 2008)

*Max voltage*

Any advice as to the max voltage I could safely put an powercolor HD3850 512Mb

Default 1.22 tried 1.3 & 1.35 no increase in OC ability still stuck at 783/1053 55degrees under load.

don't know if this is one of the cards that can not be over volted in bios, or is there an issue with the powercolor bios/

thanks for any help.


----------



## lemonadesoda (Apr 14, 2008)

What's the different between TPU RBE and Computerbase BIOS editor? Is it the same tool, just BRANDED differently? Is one updated "quicker" than the other? WHich one should I use? 
http://www.computerbase.de/downloads/treiber/grafikkarten/ati/computerbase_ati_bios-editor/ THANKS


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 14, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> What's the different between TPU RBE and Computerbase BIOS editor? Is it the same tool, just BRANDED differently? Is one updated "quicker" than the other? WHich one should I use?
> http://www.computerbase.de/downloads/treiber/grafikkarten/ati/computerbase_ati_bios-editor/ THANKS



i've used that one too, but i believe after the release they only started doing the 3k series.



sorry i take that back that's a newer one then i've used. work it works on  my cards too.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 14, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> What's the different between TPU RBE and Computerbase BIOS editor? Is it the same tool, just BRANDED differently? Is one updated "quicker" than the other? WHich one should I use?
> http://www.computerbase.de/downloads/treiber/grafikkarten/ati/computerbase_ati_bios-editor/ THANKS


Why don't you download this Computerbase program and see for yourself? It's a completely different program. It has it advantages, but there are several disadvantages just as a poor fan support for example or non-changable BIOS information.



lemonadesoda said:


> WHich one should I use?


You should use RBE, of course!


----------



## lemonadesoda (Apr 14, 2008)

OK BAGZZ, but it is NOT OBVIOUS that the TPU one is better... since YOU are credited on BOTH programs! 

OK... so TPU version is the one to use! Thanks.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 14, 2008)

lemonadesoda said:


> OK BAGZZ, but it is NOT OBVIOUS that the TPU one is better... since YOU are credited on BOTH programs!
> 
> OK... so TPU version is the one to use! Thanks.




Yeah, I helped the guy with some things...


----------



## Igor (Apr 14, 2008)

Every one of us knows voltmod through modding the bios doesn't work with Powercolor HD 3850 cards. But i have HD 3850 from Sapphire, i tried to edit the bios with computer base ati radeon bios editor, no go. Is it possible to mod voltage in RBE?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 14, 2008)

Igor said:


> Every one of us knows voltmod through modding the bios doesn't work with Powercolor HD 3850 cards. But i have HD 3850 from Sapphire, i tried to edit the bios with computer base ati radeon bios editor, no go. Is it possible to mod voltage in RBE?



The computer base program does pretty much the same as RBE: Programming the BIOS to set certain voltages.
If hardware doesn't put it into practice, it won't work! Use a hard mod, then.


----------



## chenakos (Apr 15, 2008)

Hello all!

I am new in here, reading interesting stuff from this forum.

Recently I upgraded my Asus Terminator P4 533A (initally purcheased barebone system in 2003) with a GeCube Ati Radeon HD 2400 Pro AGP 512Mb. Rest hardware in the system is a P4 2.4GHz, 1GB DDR RAM, onboard sound. The AGP slot is up to 4x, while the VGA card is up to 8x, but nobody is perfect!

Anyway, I needed some video card boost for my system in order to go on playing games. So I bought the above Ati HD 2400 Pro AGP.

My problem now is that the video card's fan is making some noticeable noise while the rest of the fan on CPU and case work only when temperatures rise (the fans also rise thier speeds). Ati's fan is working constantly, with no reduction in its speed. So I am thinking to use RBE and modify ATI's fan settings in the card's BIOS, so the fan will work in lower speeds.

Because it's the first time I am gonna flash my video card's BIOS I would like some help here, please!

Below, there are pictures of the BIOS taken from the ATI HD 2400 PRO AGP as it appears in RBE.

The last pic is from the alternation I did in the "Fan Settings" section in RBE, in order to lower somehow the fan speed of my video card.

1. Can someone tell me if this Ati HD 2400 Pro AGP 512MB BIOS has any control over its fan speed? RBE shows that normally this card's BIOS controls the fan as it is shown in picture 3 (look up table) before the alternation i made of course!

2. Is this change I am showing here at pic 4 at the look up table going to change the Fan speed of my video card?

Many thanks in advance!


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 15, 2008)

chenakos said:


> Hello all!
> 
> I am new in here, reading interesting stuff from this forum.
> 
> ...



RBE shows what's programmed to the fan controller on boot up. If the card ignores the controller, maybe by using a fixed fan voltage, the controller can control nothing of course. You can check using RivaTuner's hardware monitor whether your fan speed is really constant or the look up table values are being used.
Why don't you just hit the "set all settings to recommended values" button? If you really wanna use the look up table, you can do so but I think you should consider using transfer function because it is more sophisticated.


----------



## AphexDreamer (Apr 16, 2008)

How do you fix powerplay issue with the HD3870X2, anyone know?


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 16, 2008)

AphexDreamer said:


> How do you fix powerplay issue with the HD3870X2, anyone know?



try to pm Dr. Spankenstein he might know


----------



## wow_lon (Apr 16, 2008)

hi BAGZZlash! I'm new here and I registered to thank you for your very useful application! I've been having problems with the fan control of my GeCube HD 3850 (256MB). I set the fan this way:










The fan speeds up as temperature rises, I can here it! But the fan never go down even if the temperature already went down. It gets stuck at that speed. It will only reset if I reboot or put the computer to sleep. Does it have something to do with the PWM control? I set it this way:






Does flashing the BIOS using Winflash and ATIFlash have differences? I hope you can help me! Thanks again!


----------



## VuurVOS (Apr 16, 2008)

@wow_lon 
Did you have this issue also when you try it with a newer/older bios version?


----------



## chenakos (Apr 16, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> RBE shows what's programmed to the fan controller on boot up. If the card ignores the controller, maybe by using a fixed fan voltage, the controller can control nothing of course. You can check using RivaTuner's hardware monitor whether your fan speed is really constant or the look up table values are being used.
> Why don't you just hit the "set all settings to recommended values" button? If you really wanna use the look up table, you can do so but I think you should consider using transfer function because it is more sophisticated.



So is there someone in here that may know if Fan Regulation is possible in ATI RADEON HD 2400 PRO AGP 512MB through change in its BIOS?

Regarding the controller you state, is there any way that I might bypass it?

Using the "set all settings to recommended values" button, the graph changes with higher values. I will try to post a picture and show you what I mean. Transfer function is a nice solution, but I am first interested if this might work at all, regulating fan speed through BIOS.


----------



## wow_lon (Apr 17, 2008)

@VuurVOS

The problem was solved! I used the BIOS from the TPU archive, edited the fan control and flashed it in DOS mode. The fan works now! I think it has something to do with Hysteresis, I set it to zero as well as the Tmin this time and it worked!


----------



## erocker (Apr 17, 2008)

*Bad flash, where to go from here?*

So, yeah, I got a flash failed in ATi WinFlash and now my subsytem ID doesn't match anything.  Anyone have any suggestions?


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 17, 2008)

erocker said:


> So, yeah, I got a flash failed in ATi WinFlash and now my subsytem ID doesn't match anything.  Anyone have any suggestions?



use force flash, in atiflash


----------



## erocker (Apr 17, 2008)

I cannot get any display upon reboot, I'm using my other card at the moment.  how do you do this force?


----------



## Dr. Spankenstein (Apr 17, 2008)

in dos mode use the command: atiwinflash -f -p 1 "BIOSname".bin.

The "-f" switch forces the flash, regardless of vendor id msimatch. The important part is the "1" so you flash the card in the second slot.


----------



## erocker (Apr 17, 2008)

I can't use dos mode because the card doesn't display anything.

*Wait, so have the working card in the first "normal" slot, have the bad card in the 2nd "slave" spot and flash it?


----------



## sneekypeet (Apr 17, 2008)

Dr. Spankenstein said:


> in dos mode use the command: atiwinflash -f -p 1 "BIOSname".bin.
> 
> The "-f" switch forces the flash, regardless of vendor id msimatch. The important part is the "1" so you flash the card in the second slot.



I knew I was on the right path....thanks DR. 
I was trying to talk him through it on MSN, but i told him to get confermation!


----------



## Dr. Spankenstein (Apr 17, 2008)

erocker said:


> I can't use dos mode because the card doesn't display anything.
> 
> *Wait, so have the working card in the first "normal" slot, have the bad card in the 2nd "slave" spot and flash it?



That's the ticket! The "1" drives the flash to that PCI slot.

Get to it!


----------



## erocker (Apr 17, 2008)

I can't get atiflash to boot from my USB drive.  I have the usb to boot from as a boot device and have it changed in the bios.


----------



## erocker (Apr 17, 2008)

Here it is..


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 17, 2008)

erocker said:


> Here it is..



i'll got it, give me just a sec


----------



## erocker (Apr 18, 2008)

Problem solved.  Floppy drive to save the day!  

*I'm so glad Asus decided to put a floppy connector on a Maximus!


----------



## PaulieG (Apr 18, 2008)

I just started messing around with RBE. I downloaded the bios for my card, and loaded it into RBE. Why am I getting this error message?


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 18, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> I just started messing around with RBE. I downloaded the bios for my card, and loaded it into RBE. Why am I getting this error message?



Everybody gets that. It just lets you change the error message.

You can check erocker pic
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=54776&page=5

#117


----------



## asb2106 (Apr 18, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> I just started messing around with RBE. I downloaded the bios for my card, and loaded it into RBE. Why am I getting this error message?



I changed mine to say
"You forgot to plug the PCIe Power in you dumb ass!"

Its a nice reminder when I have a brain fart!


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 18, 2008)

asb2106 said:


> I changed mine to say
> "You forgot to plug the PCIe Power in you dumb ass!"
> 
> Its a nice reminder when I have a brain fart!



love it, just wonder if anybody has change it too something like that


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 19, 2008)

OK so, let's say I loaded up my HD2600 Pro's bios into RBE from ATIWinflash. In the clocks tab, I can type in a voltage and it will set it at that? Like if I want to push it to 1.25v, I can do that?


----------



## VuurVOS (Apr 19, 2008)

If the voltage regulator on your videocard can do that, then it will be possible ^^. But a higher voltage will cause a shorter lifespawn and more heat. I suggest that you increase it with small staps. 

For example: default is 1.10 volt. Try to increase to 1.15 volt and then 1.20volt. If you do 1.50volt at once it can kill you card.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 19, 2008)

It would be my first ever ATi bios mod. Is Winflash safe? Should I adjust all states that are listed?


----------



## VuurVOS (Apr 19, 2008)

I never had problems with ATIwinFlash. If something goes wrong, the fault isn't caused by ATIwinFlash. My suggest is that you only change the 3D states.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 19, 2008)

Mmk thanks, I am going to just look around sme more information and once I feel confident enough I will try it. Is it better to flash in safe/vga mode? Or just exit out all current running processes?


----------



## VuurVOS (Apr 19, 2008)

JrRacinFan said:


> Mmk thanks, I am going to just look around sme more information and once I feel confident enough I will try it. Is it better to flash in safe/vga mode? Or just exit out all current running processes?



The best/safest way to flash your card is in dos. You can do it with a bootable usb stick with atiflash and bios on it


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 19, 2008)

Thanks tho but I found a way to try out a different voltage through Ati Tray Tools. Gave me an extra 4 mhz gpu and 10 mhz mem. So I am not even going to bother. Thanks tho.


----------



## PaulieG (Apr 19, 2008)

Jr, I'm kinda at the same place as you are. Winflash works to an extent, though I can't get it to correctly change the subsystem ID, so that I can flash my card with the ATI clock speed fix bios. i'm worried if I force flash it in Dos, I'll fubar the card permanently.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 19, 2008)

Does the driver voltage transitions actually work tho thats my question, even tho that should be in a thread of its own.


----------



## Fitseries3 (Apr 20, 2008)

problem... i flashed my new bios to my 3870 and now CCC, traytools, amdgpuclocktool, etc cant recognize my card. gpu-z says it's the same exact card though.

what do i do to fix this?


----------



## erocker (Apr 20, 2008)

fitseries3 said:


> problem... i flashed my new bios to my 3870 and now CCC, traytools, amdgpuclocktool, etc cant recognize my card. gpu-z says it's the same exact card though.
> 
> what do i do to fix this?



Did you flash it with the correct subsystem-ID?


----------



## Fitseries3 (Apr 20, 2008)

erocker said:


> Did you flash it with the correct subsystem-ID?



i just left the VT one there. is that bad? i guess i should've change it to ATI?


----------



## erocker (Apr 20, 2008)

Yes, just reflash it with the correct subsystem ID.


----------



## Fitseries3 (Apr 20, 2008)

ok.... reflashed.... works... but... same problem. memspeed is locked. what now?


----------



## Dr. Spankenstein (Apr 20, 2008)

I can't wrap my head around why the mem would be locked....

So you'll adjust the slider, then when you click "Apply" it snaps back to default?


----------



## PaulieG (Apr 20, 2008)

I think that some of the RBE setting don't stick. I've tried to change the subsystem ID's on several bios, but I keep getting a "subsystem mismatch" when I try to flash my card.


----------



## Fitseries3 (Apr 20, 2008)

it wont slide at all.


----------



## VuurVOS (Apr 20, 2008)

fitseries3 said:


> ok.... reflashed.... works... but... same problem. memspeed is locked. what now?


Did you tried to reinstall your VGA drivers ?



Paulieg said:


> I think that some of the RBE setting don't stick. I've tried to change the subsystem ID's on several bios, but I keep getting a "subsystem mismatch" when I try to flash my card.


Try an older version of ATIwinflash (v2.0.0.2). I fixed on this why the subsystem mismatch and could flash without a problem (correction without forcing ) a Sapphire HD3870 Atomic bios in my Sapphire HD3870 Build By ATI.


----------



## wow_lon (Apr 21, 2008)

*Powerplay Issue?*

Can this issue be fixed by modifying the BIOS of an HD 3850? When I play a game like NFS ProStreet, I experience poor performance. When I checked Rivatuner, GPU usage is only about 30%! The clocks are fine, not lowering down to 2D clocks, but the GPU usage is still very low it affects the performance!







The graph above was taken while playing NFS Prostreet. The part there where the GPU usage is almost at 100% is when I was at the game menus. But when it's in the actual game, the actual race, the GPU usage goes down to only 30-40%. The part there where there is almost no GPU usage is when I pressed CTRL+TAB to check Rivatuner. I also experience it in Assassin's Creed, and other games too, even at the lowest possible setting and resolution.

Can it be fixed by modifying the BIOS? Thanks in advance for your replies...


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 21, 2008)

What power supply are you using? It may be "stuck" in low power 3d mode. Hmmmm ....


----------



## wow_lon (Apr 21, 2008)

@JrRacinFan

Thanks for the reply. I'm using a HEC Winpower 550W PSU. It might not be popular in your place, but I can say it's a reputable one.


----------



## JrRacinFan (Apr 21, 2008)

Yeah, it's not too too bad a psu. It was one of my pondering moments to ask 'tis all.  

Figured I may as well ask, since 75% of problems with gaming rigs are psu related.


----------



## wow_lon (Apr 21, 2008)

I will try another PSU this coming weekend just to be sure... TY


----------



## gamalrizaldi (Apr 25, 2008)

the newest RBE cant work with my sapphire hd3650 gddr3 256mb.. rbe can load the bios, can modif the bios and save the edited bios, and the atiflash can update the vga, but after restart the system, the windows cant identify the vga.. but still work with rbe 1.09 with no problemo at all..


----------



## erocker (Apr 25, 2008)

gamalrizaldi said:


> the newest RBE cant work with my sapphire hd3650 gddr3 256mb.. rbe can load the bios, can modif the bios and save the edited bios, and the atiflash can update the vga, but after restart the system, the windows cant identify the vga.. but still work with rbe 1.09 with no problemo at all..



Did you uninstall and reinstall your drivers?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 25, 2008)

gamalrizaldi said:


> the newest RBE cant work with my sapphire hd3650 gddr3 256mb.. rbe can load the bios, can modif the bios and save the edited bios, and the atiflash can update the vga, but after restart the system, the windows cant identify the vga.. but still work with rbe 1.09 with no problemo at all..



ATI uses three device IDs for denoting 3600 series video cards. RBE writes just one of them to the file. So listen to Frankyboy, reinstalling the driver should solve the problem. Please tell me, if it does, because if not, I will have to change the internal device ID handling in RBE.


----------



## mdm-adph (Apr 25, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> ATI uses three device IDs for denoting 3600 series video cards. RBE writes just one of them to the file. So listen to Frankyboy, reinstalling the driver should solve the problem. Please tell me, if it does, because if not, I will have to change the internal device ID handling in RBE.



I was getting that exact same problem when I was flashing my HD 3650, too -- thought something was wrong so I eventually just flashed it back to the original bios with atiflash.  

So, reinstalling the drivers will do it?  I'll definitely try that later today -- by the way, thanks for making such a wonderful and easy to use program!  Good UI is such a forgotten thing when people usually make modding programs. 

By the way, whose lips are those in the "about" picture?


----------



## CrackerJack (Apr 29, 2008)

Alright I can tell and show you that the volt changes do WORK. (For Me)  

Default 1.0 on 2D Clock States





Changed to 1.1 on 2D Clock States





I've gotten up to 1.2, don't know if I should go any higher, Since i'm only on stocking cooling. But with 1.2 XP Pro wouldn't load up, just keeps restarting. But with Vista it's fine.


----------



## chenakos (Apr 30, 2008)

Hello everybody!

I'm writing about my GeCube ATI HD 2400 PRO AGP 512MB, which I purchaced 2 months ago. I upgraded my Asus Terminator P4 533A (initally purcheased barebone system in 2003). The hardware in the system is a P4 2.4GHz, 1GB DDR RAM, onboard sound. The AGP slot is up to 4x, while the VGA card is up to 8x, but nobody is perfect!

The problem was the video card's fan that was making some noticeable noise while the rest of the fan on CPU and case work only when temperatures rise. ATI's fan was working constantly, with no reduction in its speed.

I though I'd use RBE and modify ATI's fan settings in the card's BIOS, so the fan will work in lower speeds. But I wasn't able to find info about the fan controller in HD 2400PRO and if it really can regulate the fan speed.

So I though to unplug/disable the fan that was attached on the heatsink of HD 2400 PRO and let it cool passively using just the heatsink.

Of course there was no noise any more coming from the ATI video card and my system was once more silent as it used to.

I noticed though a slight increase in the GPU Temperature of about 10degrees C. When the fan was working the GPU had a temp at idle mode of 49-62 degrees C. When I disabled the fan the GPU in idle mode had a temp of 61-69 degrees C. Moreover I tried to stress the GPU to see how it is affected to the temperature without any fan help-just the heatsink.

I worked the GPU at 92-98% for about 40minutes constantly and the rising of the temp was about +5degrees C. Most of the time video card's temp was 69-71degrees C and for sometimes I saw it to reach 80-81degrees C and then back again to 69-71C for the rest of the time.

Now what I would like to ask you all is your opinion about this method. The attached heatsink is quite large (covers the half of card's PCB) so I think that disabling the fan won't make any major difference, or am I wrong??? About the rise of the temps: are those values acceptable for idle mode, or this maybe damage my card real soon?

Waiting for your wise comments...


----------



## VuurVOS (May 1, 2008)

@chenakos
You need some airflow. I suggest that you cut off the power connector of your gpu fan and connect it directly to a powermolex.

You have a few option:

```
Yellow(12volt)  Black(ground)  Black(ground)  Red(5volt)  Fan speed
        x             x                                   100%
        x                           x                     100%
                      x                           x       less than 50%
                                    x             x       less than 50%
        x                                         x       around 70%
```
The black wire must always be in one of the black connectors except for the Yellow/Red combination. There you must connect red(fan) with yellow(molex) and black(fan) with red(molex). I think the best combination for you is Yellow/Red. Its quiet and it is still cooling enough. I did this with my Arctic ATI Silencer 4. It was too noisy at full speed.


----------



## BAGZZlash (May 1, 2008)

mdm-adph said:


> So, reinstalling the drivers will do it?  I'll definitely try that later today -- by the way, thanks for making such a wonderful and easy to use program!  Good UI is such a forgotten thing when people usually make modding programs.


Thanks!  Did reinstalling the driver actually work?



mdm-adph said:


> By the way, whose lips are those in the "about" picture?


It's Ruby's! Never watched "Whiteout", the ATI Direct3D 10 techdemo?



chenakos said:


> I though I'd use RBE and modify ATI's fan settings in the card's BIOS, so the fan will work in lower speeds. But I wasn't able to find info about the fan controller in HD 2400PRO and if it really can regulate the fan speed.


Why don't you just go ahead and try it out?



VuurVOS said:


> @chenakos
> You need some airflow. I suggest that you cut off the power connector of your gpu fan and connect it directly to a powermolex.
> 
> You have a few option:
> ...


Nice posting, as always. Thanked you deputyly.


----------



## chenakos (May 1, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> @chenakos
> You need some airflow. I suggest that you cut off the power connector of your gpu fan and connect it directly to a powermolex.
> 
> You have a few option:
> ...



I see what you suggesting here VuurVOS. Instead of powering the fan with 12Volts, giving it a 7Volts power so that it rans in lower speeds. That is a nice trick and I will definetely try it, although I am also thinking to try the Black/Red combination so I will set the fan ran even lower.

With some easy maths I found that the Yellow/Red combination turns the fan at 58%, while the Black/Red combination rans it at 41%.

The issue here is silence, so 41% is better than nothing. The thing is if 41% still adds up a the notisable noise to the overall system noise (which is fairly low though).

On the other hand, I still don't know if these 80degrees C that I saw the GPU reaching in full load are harmful to the GPU, or they are an acceptable temperature value between working conditions? 

But again, hotter days are coming this Summer so increased ambient temperature always adds up some extra degrees C..


----------



## chenakos (May 1, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Why don't you just go ahead and try it out?



I actually did tried it out with no success. At the end of the BIOS flashing work it gave me an error message and it stopped there... Maybe it had to do something with the "1" index I wrote at the flashing command in DOS mode - but that was the index I initially used to backup my original BIOS .

So now I am trying  other solutions.


----------



## VuurVOS (May 1, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Nice posting, as always. Thanked you deputyly.


Deputy is reporting SIR  I am always trying to do my best


----------



## chenakos (May 19, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> @chenakos
> You need some airflow. I suggest that you cut off the power connector of your gpu fan and connect it directly to a powermolex.
> 
> You have a few option:
> ...



Done it! I used the Red/Black combination and now the fan works in lower speeds of course, while not making any noise at all! Temperatures are as when I first installed the card in my pc.

I think that GeCube should do this from the begining as there's no need for this card to have its fan running at 100% to keep it cool! Practice showed that when fan works in lower speeds cools GPU same as when it runs at full speed. Plus the card becomes noise-less.

Many thanks VuurVOS!

People having same kind of problem, first try this and then everything else.


----------



## n0tiert (May 19, 2008)

Hi all,

I modded my HD2600Pro AGP with Artic Cooling Accelero S1 V2 + Turbo Module.

Link: http://www.arctic-cooling.com/vga2.php?idx=147

Temp is arround 35° C idle and arround 38° C load.
All seems running well so far, my question is now, does the Fan Settings in Bios corrupt the Card timings if there is no GPU Fan Attached ?
or can I disable the fan function at all ? 

Coz sometimes the game just stops in single colored screen. could be a driver prob
in Bioshock, Crysis i play over hours and COD MW just blows after level loaded

Fan from Turbo module is connected to 3Pin Molex > PSU and not on GPU onboard fan connector 

thx

n0tiert


----------



## BAGZZlash (May 19, 2008)

n0tiert said:


> Does the Fan Settings in Bios corrupt the Card timings if there is no GPU Fan Attached ?


Of course not.



n0tiert said:


> or can I disable the fan function at all ?


No.



n0tiert said:


> Coz sometimes the game just stops in single colored screen. could be a driver prob
> in Bioshock, Crysis i play over hours and COD MW just blows after level loaded


I'm sure this is an issue of your individual system. May be due to driver problems, but not necessarily. Hard to tell with the amount of information. Please refer to the TechPowerUp software help forum for this. Maybe these folks can help you.


----------



## VuurVOS (May 20, 2008)

n0tiert said:


> Hi all,
> Coz sometimes the game just stops in single colored screen. could be a driver prob
> in Bioshock, Crysis i play over hours and COD MW just blows after level loaded


Which COD do you play? If it is COD4, it can be a drivers issue. I also have that problem when crossfire is activated.


----------



## n0tiert (May 22, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> Which COD do you play? If it is COD4, it can be a drivers issue. I also have that problem when crossfire is activated.



yeeahh it´s COD4 , 

it´s kinda weird ... i checked almost every Rev. of the Catalyst and i also used the driver wich came with the card... same problem..
all rates´s cpr/gpu/fsb are stock ... might be an Hardware prob i think !
i´ll popoff the Accelero and bring the f#@k Card back to the Store and buy a 3870 PCI
and get a new mobo !

my rig:

AMD x2 4200+ so939
2gb MDT@2.5-3-3-8 200MHZ
MSI-7094 Neo2-V Stock & PCI/AGP Lock (SLIC)
Sapphire HD2600 AGP 512MB DDR2


----------



## VuurVOS (May 22, 2008)

n0tiert said:


> yeeahh it´s COD4 ,
> 
> it´s kinda weird ... i checked almost every Rev. of the Catalyst and i also used the driver wich came with the card... same problem..
> all rates´s cpr/gpu/fsb are stock ... might be an Hardware prob i think !
> ...



Did you tried to contact ATI about your issue? Did you tried a clean windows installation?


----------



## VuurVOS (May 28, 2008)

When can we expect RBE v1.11 with lots of new functions ?


----------



## BAGZZlash (May 28, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> When can we expect RBE v1.11 with lots of new functions ?



v1.11 will be out soon, but the changes will be mostly under the top. It won't offer stunning new features,  but some bug fixes, including the fan settings when using look up table mode (the problem with some default values you discovered ). I hope, confusion regarding the device ID of 3650 cards will be a matter of the past from now on. Some more bugfixing will be included as well. 
Bugs, that aren't real bugs (e.g. problems with overclocking using overdrive) can't be fixed because these issues are more due to the driver. Among other things.
I got some ideas for additional features, but unfortunately I have little time for coding at the moment (I'm entering the final phase of my studies). And to be honest: I like spending my little free time outside in the sunshine with my girlfriend more than coding at the moment...


----------



## HydroIT (Jun 3, 2008)

Why is the "Fan Settings" button disabled when I load up a bios file?


----------



## VuurVOS (Jun 4, 2008)

What for graphics card do you have?


----------



## HydroIT (Jun 4, 2008)

3870x2


----------



## VuurVOS (Jun 5, 2008)

Its not possbile to change the fanspeed of the hd3870 x2 -> http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=748619&highlight=fan+3870#post748619

Long life the search function


----------



## DTV DRAGON (Jun 8, 2008)

hi guys I realy want to try to oc my card. i have a sapphire hd3850 agp 512mb and running at 720/950 useing CCC I want to go abit higher but am a little unsure of what i exactly set or how high, etc.. Iam wondering if anyone would be willing to modd my stock bios for me so i could flash it. I know that is asking alot but thought ide rather be safe and get bashed or try it myself and be sorry cause i just fubared my $200.00 card  lol so if anyone would care to give it a try i would be more than greatful  I will post my bios here for you more talented people to take a look at, hope iam not out of line asking this  thanx Dragon

i see i cant upload .rar zip files so i will need winzip, so if anyone can help i will get winzip and upload the bios ill wait before i upload to see  thanx again


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 8, 2008)

Have you tried ATI Tool?


----------



## DTV DRAGON (Jun 8, 2008)

yes i have but never had good success with it,  also tried rivatuner, it said it had my card oc;ed but never had any increase in benchmarks etc.. in fact they went down!  Dragon


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 8, 2008)

The thing about flashing a card higher than what you have gotten to is that no one knows how it will perform.  And if something goes wrong with a bad flash, it can be fixed so long as you have a PCI card to use.


----------



## DTV DRAGON (Jun 8, 2008)

yeah dark2099 i see your point, its not like i can go out and replace it with a new one, maybe i should try atitools once more or be happy with what i have  thanx for your sound advice  Dragon


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 8, 2008)

What version did you initially try of ATI tool?


----------



## DTV DRAGON (Jun 8, 2008)

to tell you the truth i cant remember and after the headache with it i just deleted from computer, what version would you suggest i try, cause i will definetly give it another shot, thanx for your help  Dragon


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 8, 2008)

I use the latest beta.

http://www.techpowerup.com/wizzard/ATITool_0.27b4.exe


----------



## DTV DRAGON (Jun 9, 2008)

thanx i will give it a try later tonight, are you useing this for a hd3850 agp  or?  thanx Dragon


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 9, 2008)

I have 2 HD 3870's.  We actually have a nice thread on the 3850 AGP cards where you might be able to get more help.

http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=50040


----------



## richardsmth (Jun 9, 2008)

Dude! You've left me speechless ;-)...that was a really nice one mate….hope we can pull more of this kind


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 9, 2008)

richardsmth said:


> Dude! You've left me speechless ;-)...that was a really nice one mate….hope we can pull more of this kind



Thanks, man!  Comments like this are my salary. Make me keep motivated.


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 21, 2008)

Figured I would upload this here, got a 4850 today, pulled the BIOS from GPU-Z 0.24, RBE reads some stuff pretty well, not everything.  This is from a Visiontek HD 4850.  The BIOS file is actually a ZIP, not a renamed BIN file.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 21, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> Figured I would upload this here, got a 4850 today, pulled the BIOS from GPU-Z 0.24, RBE reads some stuff pretty well, not everything.  This is from a Visiontek HD 4850.  The BIOS file is actually a ZIP, not a renamed BIN file.



Thanks, man.  You should also consider uploading the file to the official TechPowerUp VGA database. You can use GPU-Z to easily do that.
Did you already use RBE to over-/underclock your card?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jun 21, 2008)

I may be way off, but a conversation earlier with him led me to believe he was looking for support for his card.

IIRC he stated the fan tab is greyed out and he has no options with OC tools to try to fix the fan speeds.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 21, 2008)

sneekypeet said:


> I may be way off, but a conversation earlier with him led me to believe he was looking for support for his card.
> 
> IIRC he stated the fan tab is greyed out and he has no options with OC tools to try to fix the fan speeds.



I already figured that fan control is not possible at the moment for 4850 cards. This is due to several changes ATI applied to the new card's fan control mechanism.
But again: Does changing the clock settings actually work?


----------



## sneekypeet (Jun 21, 2008)

Sorry I dont have that information for you. I know that he hasnt flashed it at all tho!


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 22, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> I already figured that fan control is not possible at the moment for 4850 cards. This is due to several changes ATI applied to the new card's fan control mechanism.
> But again: Does changing the clock settings actually work?



I didn't try flashing the BIOS or changing anything in the BIOS since I was mostly looking for fan control for now.


----------



## Jip (Jun 22, 2008)

i was trying to flash my 4850 after had modify the bios via RBE... No match


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 22, 2008)

Jip said:


> i was trying to flash my 4850 after had modify the bios via RBE... No match



Excuse me: What did not match? Be more specific, please.


----------



## Jip (Jun 22, 2008)

i've trying the frequencies... bt not applicate after reboot... 

Pass 625 to 750 and 993 to 1100MHz...
but no match after reboot


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 22, 2008)

Jip said:


> i've trying the frequencies... bt not applicate after reboot...
> 
> Pass 625 to 750 and 993 to 1100MHz...
> but no match after reboot



Did you really test under load? Using RivaTuner?


----------



## jimmyz (Jun 22, 2008)

Hi there BAGZZlash, I would love to use the RBE to mod my 4850's but it seems the clockspeeds don't change after flashing. even though I changed all of the 3-d speeds it will still show 625 when re-booted by both CCC and GPU-Z. any help is appreciated. In my case it flashes fine and says it is successful but the speeds are the same as before? When I tried to set bios higher than 700 i had to re-load drivers, but it still didn't show the increase and benches are the same score.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 22, 2008)

jimmyz said:


> Hi there BAGZZlash, I would love to use the RBE to mod my 4850's but it seems the clockspeeds don't change after flashing. even though I changed all of the 3-d speeds it will still show 625 when re-booted by both CCC and GPU-Z. any help is appreciated. In my case it flashes fine and says it is successful but the speeds are the same as before? When I tried to set bios higher than 700 i had to re-load drivers, but it still didn't show the increase and benches are the same score.



Damn, that's really unfortunate. More research on those cards will be necessary.
Can the clocks be changed at all, for example using software overclocking tools like RivaTuner?


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 22, 2008)

Rivatuner and ATI too currently are unable to properly detect info on the cards so you cannot OC them with 3d party programs, only CCC and AMD OC utility.


----------



## CrackerJack (Jun 22, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> Rivatuner and ATI too currently are unable to properly detect info on the cards so you cannot OC them with 3d party programs, only CCC and AMD OC utility.



i'm trying to work on that. But i just need more info on the card.


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 22, 2008)

Oh...deff keep me updated on that CJ, I am about to see if I can flash my card.

EDIT: BIOS flash seemed to work, changed the state 2 mode 3 "high 3d" clocks only.  Screenshot of the BIOS open in RBE and GPU-Z 0.24 which detected the BIOS flash.


----------



## CrackerJack (Jun 22, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> Oh...deff keep me updated on that CJ, I am about to see if I can flash my card.



if you can get me a copy of your "system info" and upload here. that would be awesome


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 22, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> if you can get me a copy of you "system info" and upload here. that would be awesome



What system info do you need exactly?


----------



## CrackerJack (Jun 22, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> What system info do you need exactly?



well just the "device id" mainly.

just post a screen shot of gpu-z


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 22, 2008)

There is one a few posts up with the flashed clocks.


----------



## CrackerJack (Jun 22, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> There is one a few posts up with the flashed clocks.



ok it's the same info i had before. just wanting to double check.


try this:
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=63362


----------



## dark2099 (Jun 22, 2008)

Clicky clicky linky linky.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 22, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> well just the "device id" mainly.
> 
> just post a screen shot of gpu-z



Did you see a 4850 that hasn't 0x9442 as the device-ID?
Do you know if W1zzard already found out something about all the new stuff with the 4850?


----------



## CrackerJack (Jun 22, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Did you see a 4850 that hasn't 0x9442 as the device-ID?
> Do you know if W1zzard already found out something about all the new stuff with the 4850?



no i haven't. no sure don't either.


----------



## jimmyz (Jun 23, 2008)

Hey CrackerJack, great to see you are working on the RT. 4850 issue, so far it seems the other info is missing such as the memory AMT. and type, what info could I get for you to help you along ? I will be by my pc for a while today, if you want hit me up on MSN I'm  jimmyz@insightbb.com


----------



## W1zzard (Jun 25, 2008)

RBE supports 48xx fan control and overclocking now. Expect a release in the next days


----------



## ghost101 (Jun 25, 2008)

W1zzard said:


> RBE supports 48xx fan control and overclocking now. Expect a release in the next days



Now we can stop this overdrive nonsense. Also, just wondering can we expect an atitool update in the next month or so? (yep a long shot I know )


----------



## GoldenTiger (Jun 26, 2008)

W1zzard said:


> RBE supports 48xx fan control and overclocking now. Expect a release in the next days



Woot... will it work with the 4870? Mine's coming in tomorrow .


----------



## Astennu (Jun 26, 2008)

W1zzard said:


> RBE supports 48xx fan control and overclocking now. Expect a release in the next days



Nice !!

If you need someone to test it i'm willing to help 

The same for the other people that are writing programs to support the HD4850.


----------



## boblemagnifique (Jun 26, 2008)

I am interest too , i have recieved 5x HD4870 today for the test and i would like found the max frequency


----------



## battlestar (Jun 27, 2008)

Anyone had similar issues on my prob?



Battlestar said:


> Hi I have a problem regarding the RBE latest version. I set the fan into default settings and it shows on GPU-Z 50% fan speedand it drops my temps from 72deg to 61deg , my problem is it underclock my *GPU Clock* into 500Mhz but the *Default Clock* remains 625 Mhz with same Memory 993Mhz I think. Is this normal? Sorry I can't provide screenshot still here @ the office  Anyways, I revert my default BIOS and still waitin' for your answers





Battlestar said:


> Hmm Im not sure buddy, But Im pretty sure when you check on GPU-Z  under Graphics Card Tab at the botton you can see this following:
> 
> *Using RBE with 50% FanSpeed* (I used the *Set all fan settings to recommended values* that's why came up 50% FanSpeed)
> GPU Clock: *500Mhz *Memory:9XXMhz
> ...


----------



## 2r4z0r2 (Jun 27, 2008)

can this tool change the voltages on ati 3870x2 cards?


----------



## bichonn (Jun 27, 2008)

I have one of those ASUS EAH 3870/G (not the top!) with Hynix memories, combined with a Connect3d! The crossfire is working fine, but ...:
This ASUS has a two wire fan (called Glaciator) and this fan is always running 100%.
I also noticed that RBE shows that the PWM ramp is ON!

Question:
-Is it normal to have a PWM ramp ON with a 2 wires fan?
-Will the fan regulate if I change the setting from all-the-time-100% to different values according to the temp?

Thanks in advance for your answers

Edit: I have tried different bios from different manufacturer, but it always comes out with  bugs! I guess it is because of the hynix memories chips!


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 27, 2008)

2r4z0r2 said:


> can this tool change the voltages on ati 3870x2 cards?



If the hardware supports it, yes. Unfortunately, I suppose your card (i.e. its voltage transformer) does not support higher or even freely programmed voltages at all. Therefore, I think you have to pencil- or hardmod to gain more voltage.



bichonn said:


> I have one of those ASUS EAH 3870/G (not the top!) with Hynix memories, combined with a Connect3d! The crossfire is working fine, but ...:
> This ASUS has a two wire fan (called Glaciator) and this fan is always running 100%.
> I also noticed that RBE shows that the PWM ramp is ON!
> 
> ...



The fan controller is built into the GPU. So even your card has one, and it can be programmed by the BIOS. Therefore, it can be programmed to use PWM ramp or not. However, your card does not use its fan controller for it uses a two-wired power connected fan only. There's no way to do something about it on software level, sorry.


----------



## 2r4z0r2 (Jun 27, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> If the hardware supports it, yes. Unfortunately, I suppose your card (i.e. its voltage transformer) does not support higher or even freely programmed voltages at all. Therefore, I think you have to pencil- or hardmod to gain more voltage.



ok so NONE of the 3870x2 boards support the software voltage increase? can anyone confirm this? or is there someone who successfully softmodded the voltage increase?


----------



## bichonn (Jun 27, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> If the hardware supports it, yes. Unfortunately, I suppose your card (i.e. its voltage transformer) does not support higher or even freely programmed voltages at all. Therefore, I think you have to pencil- or hardmod to gain more voltage.
> 
> 
> 
> The fan controller is built into the GPU. So even your card has one, and it can be programmed by the BIOS. Therefore, it can be programmed to use PWM ramp or not. However, your card does not use its fan controller for it uses a two-wired power connected fan only. There's no way to do something about it on software level, sorry.



Thanks a lot for this clear answer!
I am going to dump this card right the way! thumb down asus!


----------



## mdm-adph (Jun 27, 2008)

Forgive me for being out of loop (if I am), but by "fixed some issues with 3600 cards" does that mean that we can flash our cards now without having to reinstall our drivers?  Or does that still need to be done afterwards?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 27, 2008)

mdm-adph said:


> Forgive me for being out of loop (if I am), but by "fixed some issues with 3600 cards" does that mean that we can flash our cards now without having to reinstall our drivers?  Or does that still need to be done afterwards?



It should mean that exactly, thank you for asking this! 
Yeah, this should work now. It's not tested though 'cause I don't have a 3600. Would you give it a shot and keep me updated?


----------



## CrackerJack (Jun 27, 2008)

Hey bagzzlash, I've notice everytime i open a my bios "2900GT" it doesn't show up in the Video Card Section, like the rest do.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 27, 2008)

CrackerJack said:


> Hey bagzzlash, I've notice everytime i open a my bios "2900GT" it doesn't show up in the Video Card Section, like the rest do.



Hi!

This is not an issue of RBE. There's simply no Device-ID saved into the BIOS (it's 0x0000, most likely). My 2900 pro (this) and some 2900 XTs show the same behaviour. I noticed it for some FireGL-cards, also.


----------



## mdm-adph (Jun 27, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> It should mean that exactly, thank you for asking this!
> Yeah, this should work now. It's not tested though 'cause I don't have a 3600. Would you give it a shot and keep me updated?



You got it, Judge Fudge.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jun 27, 2008)

mdm-adph said:


> You got it, Judge Fudge.



Sorry, I can't listen. I'm far too busy - being delicious! 
But seriously: It worked without reinstalling, right?


----------



## mdm-adph (Jun 28, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Sorry, I can't listen. I'm far too busy - being delicious!
> But seriously: It worked without reinstalling, right?



Sure did!  Do the new clocks not show up in GPU-Z, though?  Flashed the defaults on my 3600 to 820/940, but the defaults still show up as 725/800.


----------



## jimmyz (Jun 29, 2008)

mdm-adph said:


> Sure did!  Do the new clocks not show up in GPU-Z, though?  Flashed the defaults on my 3600 to 820/940, but the defaults still show up as 725/800.



 run a 3d app and look again.


----------



## tvdang7 (Jun 29, 2008)

jimmyz said:


> Hi there BAGZZlash, I would love to use the RBE to mod my 4850's but it seems the clockspeeds don't change after flashing. even though I changed all of the 3-d speeds it will still show 625 when re-booted by both CCC and GPU-Z. any help is appreciated. In my case it flashes fine and says it is successful but the speeds are the same as before? When I tried to set bios higher than 700 i had to re-load drivers, but it still didn't show the increase and benches are the same score.



same here. i got to change my 2d clocks however. they are set to 160/500  but 3d still doesnt work. my fan control seems to work but i dont have that box like ati tool does. i just move the graph around to my liking.

THE FAN GETS SUPER LOUD!

visiontek 4850 here btw.


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 4, 2008)

Im sort of disappointed in my Visiontek 4850(s) I have 2 of them in CrossfireX and figured with the core being the same as the 4870 that it would go to the 700mhz no problems, but while 3dmark06 stable I crash out of Crysis & Grid, lowering it down to 675 has been stable.  I figure the major difference has to be the voltage.

So has anybody tried to increase the voltage via bios for the 4850's and see how it works?

Also I am totally new to RBE, is there any extra step or process I should be aware of since I have two video cards?  Well actually that would be a question for the bios rip/flash utility not RBE.  Right now I have issues with that as ATI Winflash will not run in Vista x64 for me.  Just acts like its going to load but never does.


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 4, 2008)

ViciousXUSMC said:


> Im sort of disappointed in my Visiontek 4850(s) I have 2 of them in CrossfireX and figured with the core being the same as the 4870 that it would go to the 700mhz no problems, but while 3dmark06 stable I crash out of Crysis & Grid, lowering it down to 675 has been stable.  I figure the major difference has to be the voltage.
> 
> So has anybody tried to increase the voltage via bios for the 4850's and see how it works?
> 
> Also I am totally new to RBE, is there any extra step or process I should be aware of since I have two video cards?  Well actually that would be a question for the bios rip/flash utility not RBE.  Right now I have issues with that as ATI Winflash will not run in Vista x64 for me.  Just acts like its going to load but never does.


I think increasing the voltage within the bios isn't possible, you must do a voltmod to get more mhz.

For flashing I suggest that you use a bootable usb stick. How to make one? Click  HERE


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jul 4, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> I think increasing the voltage within the bios isn't possible, you must do a voltmod to get more mhz.
> 
> For flashing I suggest that you use a bootable usb stick. How to make one? Click  HERE



The maximum voltage for 4850 cards reachable using BIOS modding seems to be 1.20 to 1.21 volts. For more, you need to do a hardmod.
To gain maximum via BIOS modding, simply set a value silghtly above this 1.20V (e.g. 1.3 volts) to be sure to reach max.


----------



## dark2099 (Jul 4, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> The maximum voltage for 4850 cards reachable using BIOS modding seems to be 1.20 to 1.21 volts. For more, you need to do a hardmod.
> To gain maximum via BIOS modding, simply set a value silghtly above this 1.20V (e.g. 1.3 volts) to be sure to reach max.



For doing that, would I change the volts that are being displayed as "---"?  Check pics if I am unclear.


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 4, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> For doing that, would I change the volts that are being displayed as "---"?  Check pics if I am unclear.



I got this from the FAQ

_Q: Why do I get three dashes instead of a number in some of the 'voltage' boxes?
A: Those voltages are 'fused', as ATI calls it. I suppose this means that it's the driver that sets these voltages. However, you can just leave this as it is or you can overwrite the dashes with any numeric value you like._


----------



## dark2099 (Jul 4, 2008)

I know what it mean, I was asking if those were the correct ones to change.


----------



## tomcug (Jul 4, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> I know what it mean, I was asking if those were the correct ones to change.





BAGZZlash said:


> Hi!
> 
> I figured what may be part of the problem finding appropriate slots to overclock 48x0 cards. As you know, some clock info settings of RBE are locked by default. As this was helpful for 3xx0 cards, it might be disturbing for 4xx0 cards, which is why from RBE v1.12 on, it will be turned off by default.
> In RBE v1.11, it's on by default and so, it kicks in: RBE loads the BIOS and displays the clocks, but due to the lock, all locked clocks are the same. Again, for 3xx0 cards, these clocks really were the same, but not for 4xx0 cards.
> ...



I think this should help you


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

Hmm 4850 only has 1.05v stock?  1.2 would be more than enought I am stable 675 on the core and have not pushed the memory much yet but its stable at 1000.

Quick noob question, uisng the CCP you can max the core at 700mhz, via bios mod can I take it higher if desired or is it still locked thru some means.

edit: never mind had to look at it a few times, I see that you have 710 on there to mark the places to place the overclocked numbers, and I would assume that you can go higher since you put 710 there.  The voltage readins tho are in different low speed areas and I guess 1.05 was used as a lower than stock number to save energy and make it run cooler?

So what is the stock voltage then for the "high" clock areas?  plus should I expect any major changes in temps with the max of 1.2v? 

My temps are pretty low I put AS5 on there and locked the fans at 50% currently via the profiles.

Actually that leads me to yet another question, I was told by a forum member on NBR that for the bios changes to work and stick that you need to disable your profiles and turn off overdrive.  Otherwise it wont work.


----------



## dark2099 (Jul 5, 2008)

Via BIOS flashing you can take it higher, just test the clocks to be sure they are stable, best method to use is the artifact scanner in ATI Tool


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

Well I crashed out of Grid & Crysis @ 700mhz core and I believe it was due to my overclock (got video driver error) 675 has been stable.   700mhz was stable for 3dmar06 looped a few times.

But the increase to 1.2v should be enough to get 700mhz on the core.  I am also running crossfire so that probably adds more complications to the entire process.

I still have not got good details on how to flash bios on a crossfire setup, as in how to determine what card it goes too and winflash for me wont run so I will have to find a cheap usb stick and use ATI flash I guess.


----------



## dark2099 (Jul 5, 2008)

Get a cheap USB stick and flash each card individually, meaning take one out, flash the one that is in the system, take that one out, put the other one in and flash that one.


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

No choice in that?  Its a tight fit well the 2nd card is anyways so I would not like to take the cards out if I do not have too.


----------



## dark2099 (Jul 5, 2008)

I have done it with both cards in, and the CF bridges installed and I think it may have messed things up a bit, you can try, but I would suggest otherwise.


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

I can take it out, just a pain, gotta disconnect the tower, take it into another room, ect ect.

However the end result is worth it, and nothing would be worst than a bad flash then id have to go buy or borrow a card lol.

Still I need to learn 2 things first, the stock voltage so I know if its even woth my time/effort to do this for 1.2v and the best way to setup fan control.  As fan control was the initial reason I wanted to do this anyways, god knows why the fans run so slow stock.


----------



## tomcug (Jul 5, 2008)

ViciousXUSMC said:


> I can take it out, just a pain, gotta disconnect the tower, take it into another room, ect ect.
> 
> However the end result is worth it, and nothing would be worst than a bad flash then id have to go buy or borrow a card lol.
> 
> Still I need to learn 2 things first, the stock voltage so I know if its even woth my time/effort to do this for 1.2v and the best way to setup fan control.  As fan control was the initial reason I wanted to do this anyways, god knows why the fans run so slow stock.



Stock voltage for 3D is 1,084V. I've increased 3D voltage to 1,22V and managed to reach 750MHz. If you send me your BIOS, I can modify it for you


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

I may do that but I should have no problems modifying it RBE is very straight forward it looks like.

Just gotta decide how to set the fans (look up table I can do, not sure how the other method works)

How much did you see your temps go up from the 1.084 to 1.22? and that only helps with core not memory correct? (need manual hardmod for memory if I am not mistaken)


----------



## tomcug (Jul 5, 2008)

ViciousXUSMC said:


> I may do that but I should have no problems modifying it RBE is very straight forward it looks like.
> 
> Just gotta decide how to set the fans (look up table I can do, not sure how the other method works)
> 
> How much did you see your temps go up from the 1.084 to 1.22? and that only helps with core not memory correct? (need manual hardmod for memory if I am not mistaken)



You're right, it help only with core overclocking. After voltage mod I've got 70 °C with fan set to 100%. If you send me your BIOS, I'll modify fan settings for you too


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

I just got ATI tool and running the artifact tester, temps are higher than I thought at full load 675/1000 and 50% fan speed it seems to max out at high 80s (88 so far highest) so I am gonna go raise the speed to say 75 and see if it drops temps.

Also for what ever reason ATI tool is only loading one of the two video cards, even tho I just checked and crossfire is enabled.  Is this a known issue?

edit: 75% wow thought I broke something at first as it just went from silent to a nice loud noise, temps droped pretty quickly from 88/89 to 82/83 on the main temp reading.

the 1/2/3 temps went from about 89/90/89 to 80/86/79 so what ever gpu temp#2 is on gpu-z its still high, so given that its a good possibility thats is why 700/1050 was not stable is temps, and also that means I may not handle the volt increase depending on how much hotter it gets.


----------



## tomcug (Jul 5, 2008)

If I were you, I'd change thermal grease to Arcitc Silver 5 and raise fan speed to 100%.


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

I already did AS5 before I even installed them, considering fan speed 75% was loud I think 100% would be insane, also I would be concerned with the life of the fans running 100% for extended amounts of time.


----------



## tomcug (Jul 5, 2008)

If you don't like noise, the only thing you can do is to change cooling.


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jul 5, 2008)

30$ for a good aftermarket cooler 60$ for 2 cards, I dont think that 40mhz on the core is much worth it  maybe if I was to go so far as to volt mod the memory then it could add up to more.


----------



## tomcug (Jul 5, 2008)

You should consider the fact that with better cooling and pencil mod your card would be able to reach frequencies over 800MHz


----------



## newdelirium (Jul 14, 2008)

Hello,
I have a Saphhire radeon HD3850 512Mo. I want to increase this voltage but when I change the voltage with RBE and I flash the card, I have no gain on my overclocking so I suppose the voltage is not change.
I use a gecube bios because I lost my original bios but the two bios are compatible.

What is the problem ? 







Thanks.


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 14, 2008)

What do you guys think of the current interface for setting the clockspeed? I find it unhandy to find which clock info is the right ones 

(*NOTE:* If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand/read )


----------



## dark2099 (Jul 14, 2008)

newdelirium said:


> Hello,
> I have a Saphhire radeon HD3850 512Mo. I want to in increase this voltage but when I chage the voltage with RBE and I flash the card, I have no gain on my overclocking so I suppose the voltage not change.
> I use a gecube bios because I lost my original bios but the two bios are compatible.
> 
> ...



If you have a moment, browse this thread and pull your card out and compare it.  The Sapphire card might not allow for software voltage control.


----------



## newdelirium (Jul 14, 2008)

dark2099 said:


> If you have a moment, browse this thread and pull your card out and compare it.  The Sapphire card might not allow for software voltage control.



Apparently, I can change the voltage of my card, the resistor is placed horizontally.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jul 14, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> (*NOTE:* If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand/read )





But seriously: Any hint on this will be appreciated. Most people say something like: "Just put the clock infos for the 3D fullscreen mode at hand and for the boot mode and for the 2D mode and so on". The problem is that this varies from card to card and it is uncertain, which clock info is there for what. The actual RBE gives some hints, but that's all. So this is a real challenge: Post suggestions on how to improve the GUI!


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 15, 2008)

I think groupboxs would be handy.

*Lock defaults boot clocks*
This is maybe handy to get your card always bootable. I suggest the checkbox is always true unless you uncheck it.

*Use boot RAM clocks*
Cards like the HD4870 needs the same RAM clocks every where otherwise the screen will get corrupted for a second when switching between states. This must be enabled for cards like the HD4870 or guys who wants everywhere the same RAM clocks

*Show all states*
This button is activated when there are more states available than listed. When you press on this button you get a full list of available states (like the way it is shown in currect version (RBE 1.12)).

*Undo changes*
The name of the button says enough


----------



## passionne (Jul 15, 2008)

Does RBE work with 4870 cards ? What is the maximum possible GPU voltage ?


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 15, 2008)

passionne said:


> Does RBE work with 4870 cards ?


Yes since version RBE 1.11

You can try to set a higher voltage in the bios and check if you can overclock more.


----------



## passionne (Jul 15, 2008)

I don't have the 4870 card yet. I am hesitating between this card and the GTX280. On the Nvidia card, GPU voltage cannot be increased by software. On ATI card, it seems that it is possible (4850) which is an advantage.

Of course, if I were sure that it is the case and how many volts can be added, it would help me in my decision.


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 15, 2008)

Not much if it is possible. At max I think 0.15 volt. With the default gpu voltage the HD4870 can run 825/1100.


----------



## passionne (Jul 15, 2008)

And what is the default voltage ?


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 16, 2008)

The default voltage is 1.263 volt. I will try later today to look how fast my HD4870 can go.

*EDIT:* GPU 865Mhz, RAM 1175 Mhz (not completly 3dmark stable, if you clock 25mhz lower the heat/(maybe) not enough voltage problem is gone)


----------



## passionne (Jul 16, 2008)

OK, thank you.

I owned a 2900 pro a few months ago and, by increasing the GPU voltage by 0.2 V (software), I was able to overclock it further by 10 % (900 -> 990 Mhz).

So, with 0.15 V more on the 4870, I think that the gain will be between 5 and 10 %. Your result will enable to confirm that or not.


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 17, 2008)

Sorry mate. I found no succes stories with a HD4870 soft voltmod. At the moment only the HD4850 can use of a softmod


----------



## passionne (Jul 17, 2008)

OK, thank you for your feedback.


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## LifeOnMars (Jul 20, 2008)

hi guys, looking to flash my powercolor hd4850 but don't know where to start ( is there a guide anywhere?) I have already downloaded atiflash and RBE both the latest versions. So, any help for a total noob at this sort of thing.


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## markino (Jul 23, 2008)

Hi - does this program work on Gecube 3870 Turbo (oc) cards?


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## BAGZZlash (Jul 23, 2008)

markino said:


> Hi - does this program work on Gecube 3870 Turbo (oc) cards?



Like this one for example? Of course.


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## markino (Jul 23, 2008)

Hi Bagzzlash - thanks for the reply.

Is that bin file a bios? What does it do (change)?

I'm thinking about getting one of these cards (Gecube 3870 turbo), but I was hoping I could use your program to adjust the Powerplay 2d settings - at the moment these cards use a bit more power at idle than a reference 3870. Will it do that?

thanks again


----------



## markino (Jul 25, 2008)

Does anyone know?


----------



## tomcug (Jul 25, 2008)

Of course, it will do that. You can adjust clocks as you want with this tool.


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## VuurVOS (Jul 25, 2008)

markino said:


> Is that bin file a bios? What does it do (change)?


Yes, the bin is a binary file of your bios. What does RBE change? It change values within the bios file.



markino said:


> I'm thinking about getting one of these cards (Gecube 3870 turbo), but I was hoping I could use your program to adjust the Powerplay 2d settings - at the moment these cards use a bit more power at idle than a reference 3870. Will it do that?


If you can change those clocks/volt correctly otherwise if you lower it too much your card could cause your system unable to boot or will crash switchen between those clock states.

Few tips
1. Never edit the boot clocks. If you edit those wrong your system will unable to boot.
2. Lower the voltage in small steps. I suggest you dont edit the lower 3D and higher 3D states because the graphics card is more often in 2D mode than 3D mode (if you use mostly your pc for office/msn/download etc)
3. Make a backup of the orginal bios
4. Make a backup plan if the flash goes wrong (blind flash, pci graphics card etc)
5. Have a second pc which you can use for internet to search information if something goes wrong.


----------



## markino (Jul 25, 2008)

Thanks Vuurvos, all good tips.

tomcug - I know what the tool is designed to do - I have read through all 14 pages of this forum! 

I was asking about THIS specific card (Gecube 3870 Turbo) - I believe that this card has a non-standard bios which is not compatible with other cards, and I wanted to know that this tool could work with it specifically.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jul 25, 2008)

markino said:


> Thanks Vuurvos, all good tips.
> 
> tomcug - I know what the tool is designed to do - I have read through all 14 pages of this forum!
> 
> I was asking about THIS specific card (Gecube 3870 Turbo) - I believe that this card has a non-standard bios which is not compatible with other cards, and I wanted to know that this tool could work with it specifically.



If RBE can open the BIOS file, it can surely process it. RBE has a sophisticated BIOS analysis routine ensuring it to tinker only with settings safe to be tinkered with.
One exception, though: If the card uses a non-standard fan which isn't controlled by the card's internal fan controller, programming the controller correctly can't afflict the fan, of course.


----------



## markino (Jul 25, 2008)

Thanks Bagzzlash - I've just found out that the card does not have thermal monitoring! I didn't think you could still buy cards that don't have thermal monitoring, especially overclocked cards.

Presumably this would mean I couldn't set the fan to different speeds depending on temperature - so I think I'll have to send the card back anyway.


----------



## markino (Jul 25, 2008)

Okay, I have now ordered the proper thermally monitored card.

Bagzzlash - when you say 'a non-standard fan which isn't controlled by the card's internal fan controller', do you mean a fan that is connected to the motherboard etc? So any fan that is connected to the 3870 itself should be fine?


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## VuurVOS (Jul 25, 2008)

Every fan with 2 wires has no fan control. Even as the bios support it. For fan control you need a fan with 4 wires (those fans have PWM support)


----------



## markino (Jul 25, 2008)

It is a 4-wire fan which I believe is connected to the card itself.


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 25, 2008)

If you post the link/model of the card here, we could confirm it for you


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## markino (Jul 26, 2008)

Thanks VuurVOS - it's the:

RADEON RV670XT , 512MB GDDR4, HDMI, Dual DVI (2 Dual link, HDCP) / TVO(HDTV), Dual Slot Fansink with Thermal monitoring, O/C Edition (X-Turbo III)

seen at this link:

http://www.gecube.com/products-detail.php?prod_cat_pid=213&prod_cat_id=214&prod_id=69097


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## BAGZZlash (Jul 26, 2008)

markino said:


> Thanks VuurVOS - it's the:
> 
> RADEON RV670XT , 512MB GDDR4, HDMI, Dual DVI (2 Dual link, HDCP) / TVO(HDTV), Dual Slot Fansink with Thermal monitoring, O/C Edition (X-Turbo III)
> 
> ...



If you like my advice, don't buy a pre-OC-card that's equipped with a fan that's different than the reference design. Just buy a cheap reference-3870 like the one from Sapphire. Apply your overclocking via RBE and be happy then saving hard earned money.


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## markino (Jul 26, 2008)

Well, I bought it mainly for the fan, which is supposed to be efficient and quiet. I didn't buy it for the overclocking, as I knew I'd be likely to overclock it later if I wanted to (which I probably wouldn't bother to do).

Anyway, it actually costs less than a lot of the other reference 3870 cards.


----------



## markino (Jul 26, 2008)

By the way, Bagzzlash - from the point of view of your software, why is the fan on this card non-reference? It is still just a fan that is controlled by the card/bios, isn't it?


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## VuurVOS (Jul 26, 2008)

Its hard to see how many wires the fan has. 

Like BAGZZlash said buy another card. factory overclocked cards cost often too much for the extra preformance. If you realy want a silent card, buy the cheaper reference card and put an Arctic Twin Turbo or Arctic Accelero S1 Rev. 2 (Passive) on it.


----------



## markino (Jul 26, 2008)

Thanks, but I've already bought this one. I don't really want the hassle of fitting a different cooler to it, especially when I've already bought this one specifically for the cooler.

And I did already say that I didn't buy this card for the overclocking, and that it wasn't more expensive than other 3870 cards - it was actually cheaper. And it's WAY cheaper than buying both a more expensive reference card AND a 3rd party cooler.

Anyway, if I did want to overclock, this card is guaranteed to overclock up to a certain amount - most reference cards are not. Although from what I have ready, overclocking these cards doesn't give much performance increase anyway.

I'm much more concerned with getting it to run cool and quiet, and using as little power as possible.

Again, as I already mentioned, it is a 4-wire fan, as you can see here:
http://www.digital-daily.com/video/gecube_hd3870/


----------



## Mavke (Jul 28, 2008)

Is there any work ongoing to also allow on the ATI based BIOS's to increase/decrease the core voltage, memory voltage and also to tweak the memory timings?


----------



## Muhad (Jul 30, 2008)

*Questions about RBE*

1. will it work on 3870 cards?
2. how do you load the bios that is already on the card?


----------



## alexp999 (Jul 30, 2008)

Muhad said:


> 1. will it work on 3870 cards?
> 2. how do you load the bios that is already on the card?



1, Yes
2, Download GPU-Z and use the bios dump button


----------



## Muhad (Jul 30, 2008)

Thanks, got it.


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## Muhad (Jul 30, 2008)

Ok, dumped and loaded the video card bios.

Only thing that I have noticed is that there is a message 'YOU HAVE NOT CONNECTED THE POWER CABLE TO YOUR VIDEO CARD.PLEASE REFER TO THE 'GETTING STARTED GUIDE' FOR PROPER HARDWARE INSTALLATION.' 

BUT it is plugged in!


----------



## Jadawin (Jul 30, 2008)

Muhad said:


> Ok, dumped and loaded the video card bios.
> 
> Only thing that I have noticed is that there is a message 'YOU HAVE NOT CONNECTED THE POWER CABLE TO YOUR VIDEO CARD.PLEASE REFER TO THE 'GETTING STARTED GUIDE' FOR PROPER HARDWARE INSTALLATION.'
> 
> BUT it is plugged in!



Yes, but this is just the text of the message, which you could edit there. It's not telling you that you haven't plugged in the power cable


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## 3d_jc (Jul 31, 2008)

*RBE and 4870 : strange things happening*

Hi there.

Got me a birthday present in a form of a shiny new 4870. So far so far, but the auto settings of the fan brings my GPU to 80°C, too hot for my liking.

Lets go to the moding board then. Extract the bios fine (yeap, the full 128k). Alter temps by 5° (not changing anything else), save flash, and .. hmm weird, I have now an airplane in by PC case ! It was regulating arround 80° out the box, and changing the values by 5° brings me to a board tryng to achieve 62° about.  Tried a few thing and came to the following observations :

- load bios, not changing anything, save bios, produces a different bios file. FC orig.bin, saved.bin gives :

0000DF03: 17 2F
0000DF3E: 5E 5D
0000DF40: 79 7A
0000DF41: 87 80
0001F3B5: FF EE

- some time settings combinations produce a file atiwinflash does not recognize as a vbios (it complains at flashing time, not file opening time)

Wonder what's going on

3d_jc


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## FR@NK (Jul 31, 2008)

First of all dont use winflash  load dos and use ATIflash.


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## BAGZZlash (Jul 31, 2008)

3d_jc said:


> - load bios, not changing anything, save bios, produces a different bios file. FC orig.bin, saved.bin gives :
> 
> 0000DF03: 17 2F
> 0000DF3E: 5E 5D
> ...



On loading a BIOS, RBE analyzes the fan settings programmed to the BIOS and checks if there are several inconsistencies (which are not so rare because the video card vendors seem to be not so much caring about it, trust me on that). If inconsistencies are detected, they are corrected automatically. That's why the files differ.
This can't be the source of you fan issue.



3d_jc said:


> - some time settings combinations produce a file atiwinflash does not recognize as a vbios (it complains at flashing time, not file opening time)



What combinations are those supposed to be?

Did anyone else experience this kind of behaviour yet? Seriously, please report issues like these.


----------



## 3d_jc (Jul 31, 2008)

I plan to do the following :
- open my default bios, saved it, flash it to see if it performs like defaut
- change ° 1 by 1 for lets say a 10° range to see :
--> how do my temps evolve
--> when does atiwinflash complain

Would that help ?

3d_jc


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## 3d_jc (Jul 31, 2008)

Actually, it is even funier that than. Opening, saving default bios produces a file atiwinflash doesn't recognize as valid. If I change the temp range however, it might work, or not, some combination oddly work, some not.

My extracted bios, in case it might help : Here

Now do I risk to brik my shader love if I use the dos flasher with a flash the windows version doesn't want ? Note the the windows flasher works beautifully for me when it does accept the bios

Thanks a lot

3d_jc


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## BAGZZlash (Jul 31, 2008)

3d_jc said:


> Actually, it is even funier that than. Opening, saving default bios produces a file atiwinflash doesn't recognize as valid. If I change the temp range however, it might work, or not, some combination oddly work, some not.
> 
> My extracted bios, in case it might help : Here
> 
> ...



Okay, having this and after some thinking: The reason is that WinFlash is calculating the checksum wrongly!  This has been known before (see RBE's internal FAQ). The problem is that ATI violates the PCI standards with its new 128 kB sized BIOSes and due to this, WinFlash calculates the checksum not of the entire file but only a part of it. This is a really unpleasant issue because WinFlash usually does not offer to force a flash which will be necessary to flash such a file because WinFlash is fooled by the BIOS itself to think that the checksum was incorrect.
Again, this is a problem caused by ATI, not RBE. Try using ATIFlash to flash your BIOS, use the force option if necessary.


----------



## 3d_jc (Jul 31, 2008)

Ok, will do the temp testing tomorow then 

3d_jc


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## BAGZZlash (Jul 31, 2008)

I just added display for the checksum WinFlash calculates. This feature is to come with RBE v1.13. Thanks again for the hint.

Let's just hope ATI fixes this mistake in a future WinFlash version.

@ FR@NK: The text you just removed wasn't wrong, this is actually true also. Thanks by the way for answering!


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## VuurVOS (Jul 31, 2008)

Can we get a sneak preview ?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Jul 31, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> Can we get a sneak preview ?



Sure, but I'm afraid this is nothing too exciting. Moreover, I'm not sure if this is how it will look eventually.

Everything okay:






Divergency between the two checksum algorithms:


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## 3d_jc (Aug 1, 2008)

ok, this is definitively weird.

First of all, you can force atiwinfash to flash like you do for the dos version ("atiwinflash -f -p 0 mybios.rom")

So I tried to flash the bios resulting from just opening and saving my extracted bios. I was expecting a no change in behaviour. Well , not so

Initial bios regulates arround 82°
Saved bios regulates arround 71°

So there is something in your bios 'changes' that the (or my ?) 4870 does make use of

Initial bios is Here
Saved bios is here

Also, just to confirn, I have after flashing the 'saved' version, I have re-extracted with GPU-Z, to make sure the winflash wasn't part of the issue, the two file are 100% identical, so I don't need to go to dos 

3d_jc


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## Vit3D (Aug 1, 2008)

Hi all.

Have practically the same problem as *3d_jc* described.
After testing my new MSI HD4870 I decided to change fan control, coz it's default settings simply huge. 
I extracted BIOS using GPU-Z v0.2.6
Made fan control modification in RBE (v1.12) ("Set all settings to recommended ....)
When I used ATIWinFlash I got msg  "BIOS file not found" (or like this) 
and with ATIFlas (DOS boot from USB) the error was - "0FL01 - Invalid PC Bios Image".

As I understand the problem is in some incompatibility in checksum calculation in RBE and ATI bios flash tools.
But I'd like to ask is it safe to force (-f) flashing such BIOS if ATI bios flash tools did not recognize it's checksum correctly?


----------



## 3d_jc (Aug 1, 2008)

Yes, you can go ahead, the checksum is insconsistent for the reason described earlier. Tried it this morning, didn't have any issue

3d_jc


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## Vit3D (Aug 1, 2008)

Thanks *3d_jc* ! 
And one more question - my main OS is WinXP x64, so I think it's better for me to use DOS tool to avoid some x64 compatibility problem in ATIWinFlash (if it has some), correct?


----------



## 3d_jc (Aug 1, 2008)

i can't quite say for XP 64, but I'm using Vista 64 SP1 and atiwinflash works like a charm for me, but then again, your experience may differ :s

You'r probably on the safer side using the DOS version

3d_jc


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## 3d_jc (Aug 1, 2008)

3d_jc said:


> ok, this is definitively weird.
> 
> First of all, you can force atiwinfash to flash like you do for the dos version ("atiwinflash -f -p 0 mybios.rom")
> 
> ...



After using that bios for a day, I can also add that is is not only a question of shifting temps, it is also a much more aggressive slope as well for the fan regulation, it will very agressively try to cool it at 72° or so. I just had for exemple 1400 RPM at 71° and 2400 at 74°

Side question BAGZZlash, do you plan to enable us to change the bios max clock values ?

Thanks de lot for your help

3d_jc


----------



## markino (Aug 2, 2008)

To answer my own question - this worked well with a Gecube 3870 OC Edition Turbo etc (model XHD370XTG4-E3). Bios attached.

Currently running idle with the GPU at 297mhz in 2d on 1.0v, memory at 558, stable (as far as I can tell) at 45-6 degrees c and entirely passive (ie fan at 0%). Running 3d full tilt with the GPU at 850.50, memory at 1197 on 1.327v (I haven't tried reducing the voltage down at this end yet, there may be some headroom), stable at about 90 degrees c with around 50% fan, which is still very quiet. Obviously I could ramp the fan up more, but the card seems reasonably happy running at this temp.

I also haven't tried reducing the 2d voltage below 1.0v - seems ridiculous that it could run happily on so little power and I don't want to push my luck. But who knows.

Full system power consumption (without monitor) is 69-71 watts idle, about 200 watts gaming (5000+ Black Edition passively cooled by Scythe Ninja, Abit NF-M2 nview motherboard, 2GB ram, 2 x 7200 drives and a DVD burner).

Incidentally, that idle power consumption is only about 3w more than my 7600gt, which is an insanely low power card, so I think the 3870 is performing pretty well from an efficiency point of view.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Aug 2, 2008)

3d_jc said:


> After using that bios for a day, I can also add that is is not only a question of shifting temps, it is also a much more aggressive slope as well for the fan regulation, it will very agressively try to cool it at 72° or so. I just had for exemple 1400 RPM at 71° and 2400 at 74°



To explain this in more detail: In RBE's fan control tab, click on "What do all the settings mean?" and read the explanations there. You can see that the transfer function is *not* a function of Tmax. That's why many BIOSes' transfer function is programmed to be like this:






The transfer function's actual value will not meet up with Tmax at 100% fan duty. As you can imagine, this may lead to an unexpected behaviour regarding the actual transfer function. Please note that the slope of a transfer function like this is less steep than it should actually be to meet Tmax at 100% fan duty.
As RBE loads a BIOS, the slope is calculated to do exactly this and thus, the transfer function is consistent again. Of course, this leads to a steeper transfer function as Tmax remains unchanged. You can see this if you load your both BIOSes (one after the other) into RBE. Look at the slope box in the fan tab and compare the two BIOSes. If you like your slope to be less steep, just move your Tmax more to the right or your Tmin more to the left. 



3d_jc said:


> Side question BAGZZlash, do you plan to enable us to change the bios max clock values ?



I am, but I need information on this that are hard to acquire. Don't expect this any soon, sorry.


----------



## Vit3D (Aug 2, 2008)

Today I changed BIOS fan control in my MSI HD4870.
Everything works fine now, a lot of thanks for this great tool!!!  
In 2D applications GPU temperature stabilize at 50C with fan speed  2380 RPM (35%), so practically no additional nose from card fan and (most important) no extra hot in case 

For this result I used such settings:
Tmin - 42, Tmax - 101
Duty cycle min - 18
(Tspole - 22)
Hysteresys - 10, Tmin Hysteresys - 4
PWM ramp 1
Also I leave native MSI Spin up settings -- 84 and 2

Thanks again!!!


----------



## kingkongtol (Aug 3, 2008)

hi..., my first reflashing bios with RBE, quite easy, i like it...
might i ask?, how much max voltage allowed at bios?
in rbe i change all voltage values, except clock info 01&02, is it the right way, if wrong, which clock info allowed to change?
im using 4850, HIS but with MSI's bios.
thanks...


----------



## The Haunted (Aug 5, 2008)

I edited a asus top 4870 bios with rbe and when i flashed it with atiflash, the model number 
and bios number were blank, i rebooted and the card bricked... i resurrected it with my old pci
s3 virge/dx (bad ass card) and now the card is fine. The bios looked alright when i saved it, 
what did i done wrong?


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 6, 2008)

Did you forced the flash? Did you check the modded bios if those values are filled in. How did you do the flash when you card got bricked? Was it under Windows/Dos? 

It would be handy if you post your "dangerus modded" bios in the "RBE bug report" thread. Its a shame you didn't made a copy of the bios which was on your bricked card.


----------



## The Haunted (Aug 6, 2008)

Here is my modded bios everything looks fine. I dont understand why it doesnt work. http://myfreefilehosting.com/f/c5914d232b_0.13MB


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 7, 2008)

The Haunted said:


> Here is my modded bios everything looks fine. I dont understand why it doesnt work. http://myfreefilehosting.com/f/c5914d232b_0.13MB



How did you flash? ATIWinflash or ATIflash. And which version did you use? Did you forced the flash? And did it also happend with a reflash of the "evil" modded bios? 

I think you did it under Windows. It can cause a corrupt flash because other program's are still running in the background. With dos you dont have that problem.


----------



## The Haunted (Aug 7, 2008)

I always flash with the latest atiflash version in dos, never had any problems flashing.
I just modified my bios with rbe and when i flash with it it display something like this:
model version (previous):9440
model version(current):
bios version (previous):whatever...
bios version (current):

This only happen with a bios that i modified myself as i wanted to change the 2d mode clock to see if i could get a more stable overclock.
 Look like the bios is missing information but everything seem fine when i reopen it with rbe...
( i saved it as a .rom)
oh and i use --> atiflash -p -f 0 name.rom <-- command tp bypass the ssid check (cant flash a 4870 without this)


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 8, 2008)

I check it and you right but there is some stuff changed after creating the bios. I tried to recreate your modded bios with a clean top bios of asus. During flashing I saw the same thing. After the flash I did directly a recovery. With RBE I saw some changes at the Fan settings.  The changes are
-Tmin -> 0
-PWM ramp on -> activated
-PWM ramp (%) -> 1
-hysteresis(%) -> 0
-Tmin hysteresis -> 0

I know why this happend. For the HD3800 serie you must hack the fan controls when using the lookup table. RBE is doing this automaticaly when selecting lookup table. 

But I think this is not needed anymore because the asus hd4870 top bios already has a look up table of its own and it will proberly work on the other hd48** aswell

I also use the look up table for my hd4870 bios (113-B50701-105) but they didn't cause any problems. The only difrents with the fan control with the asus is 
- a higher Spin up cycle
- a higher Tmin (also anonther Tslope(%) but thats automaticaly calculated by RBE).

Until BAGZZlash is coming back from holiday, I suggest you use the 113-B50701-105 (hd4870 beta) bios or the Diamond HD4870 XOC (overclock bios which is far beter than the top)


----------



## axel 66 (Aug 14, 2008)

*Low 3DMark 06 Scores [4850]*

Hi guys

I'm new to the forums and the 4850 card.

I've just bought a Sapphire 4850 Toxic card, and overclocked it using RBE (great tool!).

But I think I'm getting low 3DMark scores (please see attached screen shot)

System Info:
CPU = AMD Dual Core 3800+ (2.2GHz)
Mem = 3 GB DDR (400)
G-Card = Sapphire 4850 Toxic
Mobo = Gigabyte GA-K8NXP-SLI

In GPU-Z I see the new clock speeds (720/1200) so I know the overclock has worked which does get me an increased score in 3DMark over the default clock settings, but I think they are both low compared to others I've seen (I know that my CPU and mem are dated)

I've tried both 8.6 and 8.7 drivers, tried the AMD Clocking Tool (uninstalled now)

3Dmark settings are all default.

Please see screen shot with more details (RBE, GPU-Z, 3Dmark)

Thanks for your help in advance.

Axel 66


----------



## ghost101 (Aug 14, 2008)

Why arent you running all the tests? I can only see an SM2 score there. All 3 scores combine (not additively) to make an overall score.

After you do, you should expect a score around ~9k. The CPU becomes a huge bottleneck (especially yours) in 3dmark06, as well as the hd4k cards generally not performing well in 3dmark06.


----------



## ShadowFold (Aug 14, 2008)

What is your full 3dmark score? And do games run fine? The AMD X2 is a pretty big bottleneck tho..


----------



## DOM (Aug 14, 2008)

lol you need to run the full test 

Welcome to TPU


----------



## axel 66 (Aug 14, 2008)

Thanks for the quick relies guys 

Ah, sorry I just done the top two tests, the attached screen shot is the complete test.

Basically I'm the the proccess of updating my machine (new mobo, Intell CPU, DDR2 mem)

Are these scores ok going on my system stats?

Thanks for your help

Axel 66


----------



## ShadowFold (Aug 14, 2008)

That score seems normal for your setup. The X2 is a huge bottleneck and the 4000's werent as good at 3dmark as the older ATi's.


----------



## axel 66 (Aug 14, 2008)

ShadowFold said:


> That score seems normal for your setup. The X2 is a huge bottleneck and the 4000's werent as good at 3dmark as the older ATi's.





ShadowFold said:


> What is your full 3dmark score? And do games run fine? The AMD X2 is a pretty big bottleneck tho...



Thats good then, should get betterr scores once new PC is built.

And yes games seem to run like a dream compared to my 7600 GT 

Thanks again

Axel 66


----------



## JC316 (Aug 14, 2008)

It's your CPU thats giving you the bottleneck. Overclock it some and you will see those scores skyrocket.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Aug 14, 2008)

I got 11700 with my card stock and chip at 3.2ghz for comparison.


----------



## axel 66 (Aug 14, 2008)

JC316 said:


> It's your CPU thats giving you the bottleneck. Overclock it some and you will see those scores skyrocket.



Sweet, the CPU is overclocked a bit.  I will try and OC it a bit more.  I have a aftermarket cooler so think I could get a bit more out of it.



tigger69 said:


> I got 11700 with my card stock and chip at 3.2ghz for comparison.



tigger69 
Is that 3.2ghz out of the same CPU as mine (3800+)?

Thanks

Axel 66


----------



## quantan (Aug 15, 2008)

*How to edit bios 4850?*

I'm having Sapphire 4850, and i want to edit my bios like as bios of Sapphire 4850 Toxic. So, i used RBE 1.13.
After searching on internet, i get some informations:
-Clock info 00: clock when boot
-Clock info 01,02,03: clock when use Powerplay with low,middle,high level
-Clock info 04,05,06: clock UVD
-Clock info 07,08,09: standard settings
---> Are they right?
I've edited bios with clock info 675/1100, and saved it. Then I opened that bios and saw the Standard Clock (in Additional features) didn't change (still 625/993) although Clock info changed(675/1100).
How can i change the Standard Clock?
Second, how do i find out Voltage suitable for clock 675/1100? 1.12V is OK?
And finally, will my vga be stable with clock 675/1100?
Thanks for reading.


----------



## gareth170 (Aug 15, 2008)

i think Clock 01,02,03 and 07,08,09: are both use Powerplay but the high levels is the 3d clocks


----------



## tomcug (Aug 15, 2008)

I think this should help you:






I don't know if your card'll be stable at 675/1100MHz. It depends on your card. Some need lower voltage, some need higher voltage to reach that frequency. Also, you can't change these clocks in Additional features, because they're only Overdrive settings, your card'll be running at speeds you'll set in Clock settings.


----------



## steve30x (Aug 19, 2008)

Ive used RBE to edit the bios of my 4870 but the software is very picky with what I do with it.


----------



## platinumyahoo (Aug 24, 2008)

*anyone want to edit my bios to increase CCC limit?*

Im not sure what to do to increase CCC limits, and i need my fan to go to max. anyone want to edit my bios to add some voltage and raise CCC limit?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Aug 24, 2008)

platinumyahoo said:


> Im not sure what to do to increase CCC limits, and i need my fan to go to max. anyone want to edit my bios to add some voltage and raise CCC limit?



Why don't you read the tutorial and learn how to do it yourself?


----------



## steve30x (Aug 24, 2008)

That tutorial is a big help BAGZZlash but the new Catalyst 8.8 drivers are very picky with what is done with th bios. Ive just stuck with a pre moded bios from ATI (795 / 1100 max in ccc 990 / 1250) and modified the fans to be quiet under Idling but keep the GPU cool under gaming.


----------



## tomcug (Aug 24, 2008)

If you send me your BIOS and write what you want me to with it, then I'll modify it for you.


----------



## Muhad (Aug 24, 2008)

*Question about the clock settings*

There are ten clock setting groups. I think I understand that the 7,8 and 9 groups (UVD) are for 3D processing. Hence to over-clock for gaming 7,8 and 9 are the only ones to change. Am I correct?
Thanks.


One more question, does Overdriver have to be on for the card to over-clock?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Aug 24, 2008)

Please read the tutorial, it will answer all of your questions.


----------



## Muhad (Aug 24, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Please read the tutorial, it will answer all of your questions.



I read the tutorial. It doesn't say, in any way I can understand, exactly what I need to know.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 24, 2008)

Muhad said:


> I read the tutorial. It doesn't say, in any way I can understand, exactly what I need to know.



if you don't understand what you don't understand....I can't understand even if I want to understand!

Please tell what you don't understand so we can help you beter


----------



## Muhad (Aug 24, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> if you don't understand what you don't understand....I can't understand even if I want to understand!
> 
> Please tell what you don't understand so we can help you beter





I would like to know which of the ten over-clock groups are used for 3D over-clocking?
I just want to over-clock for gaming.

How do you increase the ccc limits?

Is it mandatory to have the ccc overdrive enabled to be able to over-clock?

Thanks in advance.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 24, 2008)

If you use RBE, It can tell you which are the higher 3D states. You must click on a state like "Power saving for notebooks in battery mode, high.........". We you click on it you see green yellow and red states. The red state is the 3D state.  Some cards have more states called "Power saving for notebooks in battery mode, high.........". You must edit those aswell.

I see you have a VisionTech HD3870 OC is this correct ?


----------



## peach1971 (Aug 24, 2008)

Thanks, BAGZZlash! 
Worked perfectly on my GeCube HD3850 Turbo-X lll


----------



## BAGZZlash (Aug 24, 2008)

peach1971 said:


> Thanks, BAGZZlash!
> Worked perfectly on my GeCube HD3850 Turbo-X lll



Kein Problem. Bin doch froh, wenn's klappt!


----------



## Muhad (Aug 24, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> If you use RBE, It can tell you which are the higher 3D states. You must click on a state like "Power saving for notebooks in battery mode, high.........". We you click on it you see green yellow and red states. The red state is the 3D state.  Some cards have more states called "Power saving for notebooks in battery mode, high.........". You must edit those aswell.
> 
> I see you have a VisionTech HD3870 OC is this correct ?




Yes it's a Visiontek HD3870 OC version 1, with the shroud cover, not the orb style which is version2. This card is awesome for $129. lol

see in my screenies to see how I have the over-clock groups set up right now.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 24, 2008)

Muhad said:


> Yes it's a Visiontek HD3870 OC version 1, with the shroud cover, not the orb style which is version2. This card is awesome for $129. lol
> 
> see in my screenies to see how I have the over-clock groups set up right now.



It looks good but why are you using rbe 1.12 when 1.14 is out? (1.14 has more functions)


----------



## peach1971 (Aug 24, 2008)

> Kein Problem. Bin doch froh, wenn's klappt!


Huch! 
Germans again, LOL


----------



## Muhad (Aug 24, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> It looks good but why are you using rbe 1.12 when 1.14 is out? (1.14 has more functions)



I didn't know about 1.14 until today.
Why would it matter? 
The 1.12 version works great!


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 24, 2008)

Muhad said:


> I didn't know about 1.14 until today.
> Why would it matter?
> The 1.12 version works great!



With 1.14 you can edit the overdrive limit so you can overclock your card with the overdrive pannel which is located in Catalyst Control Center.


----------



## Muhad (Aug 24, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> With 1.14 you can edit the overdrive limit so you can overclock your card with the overdrive pannel which is located in Catalyst Control Center.



I just checked out 1.14. I see what you are talking about. One heck of a nice utility.

Did you see my other post showing my screen shots of my over-clock settings?
Just wondering if they are anywhere near correct.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 24, 2008)

Muhad said:


> I just checked out 1.14. I see what you are talking about. One heck of a nice utility.
> 
> Did you see my other post showing my screen shots of my over-clock settings?
> Just wondering if they are anywhere near correct.



They looked good if your card is capable to do those speeds (840mhz)


----------



## AsRock (Aug 24, 2008)

peach1971 said:


> Huch!
> Germans again, LOL



If ya needed to know what he said lol.

No problem. Been happy but when it works!


----------



## Muhad (Aug 24, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> They looked good if your card is capable to do those speeds (840mhz)




Runs perfectly at 840/1200 with linear fan speed. Fan speed actually changes when in 3D mode. 

Just to clarify, my settings are NOT forcing 2D mode to run at 840 ... 2D should still be at 800 ... correct? 

Sure appreciate the help!


----------



## BAGZZlash (Aug 24, 2008)

AsRock said:


> If ya needed to know what he said lol.
> 
> No problem. Been happy but when it works!




I think he understood well because he declares to be located in Germany.
However, you did translate this into english using an automatic translation, didn't you?


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Aug 26, 2008)

*Modded bios not working*

What did i do wrong?

The first pic is my stock bios.The second pic is what i edited but my clocks have not changed in ccc or gpu-z.I flashed it with winflash2012.

Will they only change when i am playing a game? or 3d app?


----------



## Muhad (Aug 26, 2008)

tigger69 said:


> What did i do wrong?
> 
> The first pic is my stock bios.The second pic is what i edited but my clocks have not changed in ccc or gpu-z.I flashed it with winflash2012.
> 
> Will they only change when i am playing a game? or 3d app?




I am guessing here, but maybe changing the Clock 08 group will solve your problem.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Aug 26, 2008)

I have just flashed the stock one back for now just in case.

If i edit my stock one like that,i can flash it fine with atiwinflash2012.I have some pre modded ones but i cant try them cause i cant be arsed to set up a floppy and i have no usb mem stick.The modded ones have differant checksums and winflash wont flash them to my card.

Is there a way to use my usb hdd to flash?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Aug 26, 2008)

tigger69 said:


> What did i do wrong?
> 
> The first pic is my stock bios.The second pic is what i edited but my clocks have not changed in ccc or gpu-z.I flashed it with winflash2012.
> 
> Will they only change when i am playing a game? or 3d app?



Please read the tutorial for help on that.


----------



## tomcug (Aug 26, 2008)

Man, you have to change clocks in Clock info 03, 04, 05, 06, 09 groups.


----------



## nafets (Aug 26, 2008)

Tigger, start with your stock BIOS.

Edit only the GPU/MEM and voltage values in Clock Info 03 and 09. Those are your 3DHP (Gaming) states...

Leave the other Clock Info states as they are.


----------



## HousERaT (Aug 26, 2008)

On the next version of RBE can you set up an increased values tab (method 1) for 4850 cards so that the standard clocks remain standard but the upper limits are something like 1000/1400 for us voltmodding people?  720/1200 isn't gonna do much for us.  Any chance to getting method 2 (no hash) working?  I like how this program is coming along.  Seems like you got conservative after 1.13.


----------



## Muhad (Aug 29, 2008)

*Concerning RBE v1.14*

Has anyone tried the 'Method 2 -No Hash' option on the 'Additional Features' tab?

If so, does it work? 

My card is the Visiontek 3870 OC. It runs just fine at 840/1200, but I would like to go higher with the GPU clock. But setting the clocks on the 'Clock Settings' tab above 840 only turns off CCC Overdriver. 

Any help would be appreciated.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 31, 2008)

It worked on my hd4870


----------



## Muhad (Aug 31, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> It worked on my hd4870



Well it doesn't work with my Visiontek 3870 OC.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 31, 2008)

Explain. How far did you increase the limit? What was the effect?


----------



## Muhad (Aug 31, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> Explain. How far did you increase the limit? What was the effect?



AT 840/1200 all ok, but any higher and the CCC Overdrive stops working, and the overclock speeds have no affect and the card runs at the default speeds.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 31, 2008)

Which max overdrive values did you use above 840/1200 ?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Aug 31, 2008)

For a 3870, there should be no problem using method one. It spends lots of overdrive headroom.


----------



## mr_ppp (Sep 6, 2008)

*Powercolor PCS bios - no powerplay option*

Hi there,

It was recommended that i post my stock Powercolor PCS Extreme Bios for the powers that be to look at and maybe find a way to enable powerplay on this board in the next version of RBE

This card is a non reference 4870 which cannot be flashed with other bios's due to the hardware differences and does not allow powerplay to be enabled (greyed out)

I hope this bios helps in finding a solution


----------



## BAGZZlash (Sep 6, 2008)

mr_ppp said:


> Hi there,
> 
> It was recommended that i post my stock Powercolor PCS Extreme Bios for the powers that be to look at and maybe find a way to enable powerplay on this board in the next version of RBE
> 
> ...



Good news: This BIOS' powerplay functionality will be supported in the next release of RBE. Until then, use the one attached. It's just the BIOS you attached with enabled powerplay, so I just did what the next RBE version will be capable of. Please keep me updated if it worked. 

View attachment Powercolor 4870 PCS Extreme - Powerplay.zip


----------



## fulch (Sep 7, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Good news: This BIOS' powerplay functionality will be supported in the next release of RBE. Until then, use the one attached. It's just the BIOS you attached with enabled powerplay, so I just did what the next RBE version will be capable of. Please keep me updated if it worked.


Happy to report back that your mod's on this bios work fine on my Powercolor PCS Extreme.

Ati tray tools now allows 1.083 as the lowest voltage and GPU-Z reports VDDC Current of 5.4A instead of the previous 9.0A with core @ 550 and memory @ 225.

I'm sorry but I don't have any other tools to measure wattage or current drawn but hopefully the above results do prove that powerplay is now functional on this board.

Many thanks to you BAGZZlash for all your excellent work !!!


----------



## AsRock (Sep 7, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> I think he understood well because he declares to be located in Germany.
> However, you did translate this into english using an automatic translation, didn't you?



Yeah lol ..


----------



## PennySavre (Sep 7, 2008)

*Need some help understanding how to edit the BIOS right*

I have an HD 4850, the BIOS file to it, and Radeon BIOS Editor installed. What I would like to do is increase fan speed, and also raise voltage to try to get better overclocking. Um, I've tried RBE and don't know what to do to edit these thing into the BIOS file. How do I do it?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Sep 7, 2008)

PennySavre said:


> I have an HD 4850, the BIOS file to it, and Radeon BIOS Editor installed. What I would like to do is increase fan speed, and also raise voltage to try to get better overclocking. Um, I've tried RBE and don't know what to do to edit these thing into the BIOS file. How do I do it?



Please read the tutorial, it should answer all of your questions.


----------



## Hayder_Master (Sep 7, 2008)

see the tpu fourms go to graphic card's and go to the ati , im read too much thread's about this


----------



## mr_ppp (Sep 7, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Good news: This BIOS' powerplay functionality will be supported in the next release of RBE. Until then, use the one attached. It's just the BIOS you attached with enabled powerplay, so I just did what the next RBE version will be capable of. Please keep me updated if it worked.
> 
> View attachment 18071



Thanks BAGZZlash

The new bios is working great

Looking forward to the next version of RBE!


----------



## EastCoasthandle (Sep 9, 2008)

*Is there a way to increase the clock rate for the Stream Processors?*

The new 4870 1Gig cards are coming in at:
-GPU 800MHz
-Mem 3600
-SP 800MHz

The current 4870 512M cards come in at:
-GPU 750MHz
-Mem 3600
-SP 750MHz

Is there a way that RBE can gain access to the SP to increase the clock rate?


----------



## alexp999 (Sep 9, 2008)

afaik only nvidia cards can have independant clock rates for SP's.
Doesnt the clock rate for SP's increase with core clock rate anyway?


----------



## EastCoasthandle (Sep 9, 2008)

Hmm, that's something I would like to know.  Is the clock rate for the SPs on 4800 series card dynamic?


----------



## jimmyz (Sep 9, 2008)

EastCoasthandle said:


> Hmm, that's something I would like to know.  Is the clock rate for the SPs on 4800 series card dynamic?



 No it is locked to the core freq.


----------



## nafets (Sep 9, 2008)

If you want to increase the SP's speed, just OC the Gpu Core. Simple...


----------



## EastCoasthandle (Sep 9, 2008)

So the SP is dynamic then, thanks.  But there is no way to increase SP clock rate higher then core clock rate.


----------



## Sonido (Sep 9, 2008)

For ATI cards, the SP's are locked in with the core speed, as the gentleman before you stated. nVidia, on the other hand, are capable to changing those speeds individually. Why do you think there are so many different versions of the same card. They edit a few settings here and there and call it a new release, which is smart actually. For the current 4870 512 MB editions, OC the card to 800/900 to get the same "performance". I use performance like that because of the frame buffer.


----------



## Arska (Sep 10, 2008)

I've never done a video card bios flash before (mobo bios flashing is familiar to me) so I have some questions.

Is it a problem if I set boot-up clocks to lower values than ccc limit? I don't have ccc installed. Normally I use 300/250 (core/mem) with ATT for desktop. I wouldn't need to go that low for boot-up, but maybe something like 400/400? I'm not happy with my 4870 running at 80 C before ATT takes over at the end of boot-up.

Is it a problem to set spin up cycle to 30-40? I assume this helps with the occasional high speed spinning. And if I use the fan spin up fix, is there any point to changing spin up cycle?

The card is a fully standard MSI 4870 (yet).


----------



## BAGZZlash (Sep 10, 2008)

Arska said:


> Is it a problem if I set boot-up clocks to lower values than ccc limit?


No, should be no problem.



Arska said:


> Normally I use 300/250 (core/mem) with ATT for desktop. I wouldn't need to go that low for boot-up, but maybe something like 400/400?


If 300/250 is stable for you for desktop, it should be stable for boot up as well.



Arska said:


> I'm not happy with my 4870 running at 80 C before ATT takes over at the end of boot-up.


That is no problem at all. The 4870 can take even much higher temperatures. Anyway: Setting low clocks during boot up should be no problem. 



Arska said:


> Is it a problem to set spin up cycle to 30-40?


Yes as the maximum value the controller (and thus RBE) allows is 7.



Arska said:


> I assume this helps with the occasional high speed spinning.


No. There's a dedicated spin up fix option in RBE.



Arska said:


> And if I use the fan spin up fix, is there any point to changing spin up cycle?


No.


----------



## Arska (Sep 10, 2008)

Thanks for the answers.



BAGZZlash said:


> Arska said:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



There's a setting in RBE, Spin up cycle (%). It's 84 in my default bios. Did you perhaps mean some other setting?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Sep 10, 2008)

Arska said:


> Thanks for the answers.
> 
> 
> 
> There's a setting in RBE, Spin up cycle (%). It's 84 in my default bios. Did you perhaps mean some other setting?



I see. I was referring to "Spin up time". Sorry, my bad.
In that case, you can change the setting to some other value. This might make the spin up bug vanish, but maybe not. It should be safer to use the spin up bug fix for this.


----------



## Arska (Sep 10, 2008)

Yes, you're right. I guess with the fan fix the cycle % would only matter during boot (and maybe a driver reload).


----------



## gareth170 (Sep 10, 2008)

*can a HIS HD4850 ICEQ4 bios be flashed to a sapphire 4850?*

can a HIS HD4850 ICEQ4 bios be flashed to a sapphire 4850?


----------



## MilkyWay (Sep 10, 2008)

probly but i dont know why youd want to? it might change the clock speeds but you be as well just overclocking in that case


----------



## btarunr (Sep 10, 2008)

Watch out. I don't think the memory timings match.


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## gareth170 (Sep 10, 2008)

im asking because i want a bios that as 1.20v and still be able to use overdrive. i know RBE can modify my bios but it stops overdrive from working


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## BAGZZlash (Sep 10, 2008)

gareth170 said:


> im asking because i want a bios that as 1.20v and still be able to use overdrive. i know RBE can modify my bios but it stops overdrive from working



Why don't you just use the method one overdrive hack of RBE? Will make any 4850 to do overdrive up to 800 MHz.


----------



## gareth170 (Sep 10, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Why don't you just use the method one overdrive hack of RBE? Will make any 4850 to do overdrive up to 800 MHz.



but if i change the voltage of the 3d clocks (03, 09) to 1.20v, it stops overdrive from working


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## BAGZZlash (Sep 10, 2008)

gareth170 said:


> but if i change the voltage of the 3d clocks (03, 09) to 1.20v, it stops overdrive from working



Then keep it. Using Overdrive, the PowerPlay settings won't kick in anyway.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Sep 10, 2008)

In my bios,the vgpu is modified to 1.158,and overdrive works fine,card is fine ocing to 750 core too with riva tuner so the voltage must be enough.I run it at 700/1100 24/7 which is fine for all my games.


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## gareth170 (Sep 10, 2008)

tigger69 said:


> In my bios,the vgpu is modified to 1.158,and overdrive works fine,card is fine ocing to 750 core too with riva tuner so the voltage must be enough.I run it at 700/1100 24/7 which is fine for all my games.



can u send me your bios or do a screenshot?


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## Deleted member 24505 (Sep 11, 2008)

Here is *all* i have modified with rbe.






Heres my cat8.8 pics









I have attached my bios.


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## sik1977 (Sep 13, 2008)

*4870 PowerPlay and RBE 1.14*

Dear all,

I recently upgraded from a 3870 to a 4870. I have had some experience with flashing BIOS on my HIS 3870 (for Fan Fix purposes).

The 4870 I have bought is from Force3D (I think they are the owned by Inno3D) with their non-reference DHT-Freezer Cooler http://www.force3d.com/press/13_8_08_dht.html

Due to the non-reference cooler, the fan settings in the BIOS are very different from reference cards/BIOS. I am more interested in lowering the 2d Clock speeds from 500Mhz to 300Mhz like the 3870. But before trying that, I want to know if its even possible or advisable with 4870. Presently 2D clocks are set at 500Mhz with same 1.263V for 2d and 3d clocks (no other clocks are available in the lower left bottom corner of RBE screen, so I assume my card only supports one voltage (as explained in the RBE tutorial, which I have read of course before posting).

So can I change the 2D clocks to 300Mhz and would it save power in idle mode compared to 500Mhz.


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## VuurVOS (Sep 13, 2008)

It doesn't save any thing. You realy must do a supreme powerplay fixed and lower the voltages to 1.083v in 2d mode. The best thing you can do to save power is underclocking the memory, but this will cause flikkering on the screen when switchen betweens stages if you edit the bios

The best solution for this is ATT auto overclocking. In 2D mode you set the ram on 200mhz (some bioses need a higher ram speed!) and in 3d mode you let the card on the normal speeds. With auto overclocking the card will automatic switch for you to the 3d profile with higher ram clocks.


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## ernstblaauw (Sep 18, 2008)

I have a Sapphire HD4850. I really love to enable PowerPlay, but the option is greyed out. So, hereby I attach my BIOS so you can maybe enable PowerPlay for this card in the next version? I hope this is helpful to you .


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## DaveL (Sep 24, 2008)

*Catalyst won't recognize card after flash*

I use RBE and winflash to flash a ATI HD 2400 pro card. The problem is although flash went smoothly, the card with new bios won't be recognized by catalyst driver anymore. No matter how small and insignificant changes I made to the bios.

My question is : is it ture that certain card just can't be tweaked, maybe some kind of builtin check against it. 

I would like to know more facts before spending more time, especially if it's something may not be possible to do.

Thanks.


----------



## VuurVOS (Sep 24, 2008)

DaveL said:


> I use RBE and winflash to flash a ATI HD 2400 pro card. The problem is although flash went smoothly, the card with new bios won't be recognized by catalyst driver anymore. No matter how small and insignificant changes I made to the bios.
> 
> My question is : is it ture that certain card just can't be tweaked, maybe some kind of builtin check against it.
> 
> ...


Did you also tried a older catlyst driver ? Which type of changes did you make? Can you post a copy of the bios?


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## DaveL (Sep 25, 2008)

I was using the latest CCC (8.9). I just tried 8.1 and no luck. Also tried ATIFlash instead of ATIWinFlash and result is the same. 

I'm pretty much convinced that certain card like mine cannot be flashed or it will not be recognized by driver.

Both original and modified bios are in the zip file. The only change of the new bios is a slight increase (110MHz -> 120MHz) of one of the clock speed.


----------



## VuurVOS (Sep 25, 2008)

DaveL said:


> I was using the latest CCC (8.9). I just tried 8.1 and no luck. Also tried ATIFlash instead of ATIWinFlash and result is the same.
> 
> I'm pretty much convinced that certain card like mine cannot be flashed or it will not be recognized by driver.
> 
> Both original and modified bios are in the zip file. The only change of the new bios is a slight increase (110MHz -> 120MHz) of one of the clock speed.


I think I found the problem.  RBE has change other settings alswell. The bios has a look up table for the fan speeds. When RBE detects a look up table it does automatically a fix/patch.


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## DaveL (Sep 25, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> I think I found the problem.  RBE has change other settings alswell. The bios has a look up table for the fan speeds. When RBE detects a look up table it does automatically a fix/patch.



VuurVOS, thanks for looking into it. 

Just curious, you know why RBE is doing this fix to the lookup table? I would assume it's a necessary fix for something. If that's the case, too bad my card doesn't like this table to be modified.


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## VuurVOS (Sep 27, 2008)

DaveL said:


> VuurVOS, thanks for looking into it.
> 
> Just curious, you know why RBE is doing this fix to the lookup table? I would assume it's a necessary fix for something. If that's the case, too bad my card doesn't like this table to be modified.



Why RBE is doing this? It was necessary fix for the hd3800 series, otherwise the fan lookup table didn't work like expected.

The bios in the attachment of this post has a increased gpu value in clock 01. I increased it to 120 mhz.


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## U2|Dude (Sep 27, 2008)

Hey folks, has anyone had problems with "CheckValid" error msg? If yes, which BIOSes were you trying to feed into RBE? My *Palit HD3870 (DDR3)* BIOS gets a "kick out the door" as a "non-ATi". ComputerBase BIOS Editor opens it fine, but it has too few features.


----------



## Martin.v.r (Oct 4, 2008)

this Is not a 3870x2 TOP bios,but a org:mod bios  to *BAGZZlash* 
but is ther a tool to edit rbe.exe fil to a higher oc in ccc ?  no error whit 945 both gpu, run super to all 3D-mark test 01/03/05/06 I am on watercooling.


----------



## Nrby (Oct 6, 2008)

U2|Dude said:


> Hey folks, has anyone had problems with "CheckValid" error msg? If yes, which BIOSes were you trying to feed into RBE? My *Palit HD3870 (DDR3)* BIOS gets a "kick out the door" as a "non-ATi". ComputerBase BIOS Editor opens it fine, but it has too few features.



I have a Palit HD3850 Super (DDR3) and am experiencing the same problem


----------



## BAGZZlash (Oct 6, 2008)

Nrby said:


> I have a Palit HD3850 Super (DDR3) and am experiencing the same problem



Please post your BIOS so I can check if the adjustment I've implemented for RBE v1.16 kicks in here as well.


----------



## Martin.v.r (Oct 6, 2008)

here is the 3870x2 bios,there can run 945/1044 on Watercooling.  851/945/954/1100
hope you can lock it up a little more on gpu..  to 9XX


----------



## Nrby (Oct 6, 2008)

BAGZZlash said:


> Please post your BIOS so I can check if the adjustment I've implemented for RBE v1.16 kicks in here as well.



Here is the Palit HD3850 Super (DDR3) Bios ... I believe it's default ... but I have problems controlling the fan speed ... in fact I can't control it at all it's at 100% all the time ... and that's the reason I am trying to edit some settings from the Bios


----------



## BAGZZlash (Oct 6, 2008)

Nrby said:


> Here is the Palit HD3850 Super (DDR3) Bios ... I believe it's default ... but I have problems controlling the fan speed ... in fact I can't control it at all it's at 100% all the time ... and that's the reason I am trying to edit some settings from the Bios



Yep, works with RBE v1.16. 
Expect it soon!


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## Martin.v.r (Oct 8, 2008)

have you had a look at the 3870x2 bios ?


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## BAGZZlash (Oct 8, 2008)

Martin.v.r said:


> have you had a look at the 3870x2 bios ?



I'm telling you for the third time now: Read the tutorial. If you had, you wouldn't keep asking this.


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## Martin.v.r (Oct 8, 2008)

I got the Signature HD 3870 X2 - 851-954-945-1100, but the rbe will not as I would,I have understand this bios tool.
has problems with changing the Signature
Therefore, If you can change the clock in the Signature, a right-oc for me. ?
to 87X to 97X  on the gpu, Perhaps you can put max oc, in ccc for 1000


----------



## BAGZZlash (Oct 8, 2008)

Martin.v.r said:


> I got the Signature HD 3870 X2 - 851-954-945-1100, but the rbe will not as I would,I have understand this bios tool.
> has problems with changing the Signature
> Therefore, If you can change the clock in the Signature, a right-oc for me. ?
> to 87X to 97X  on the gpu, Perhaps you can put max oc, in ccc for 1000



That signature is a _hash protected digital signature_. It can not be changed. READ. THE. TUTORIAL.


----------



## Martin.v.r (Oct 8, 2008)

ok.


----------



## Coolsys (Oct 11, 2008)

I've got a Problem. I have 2 modified Bios basing on the same Bios. Only differences are on Page1 with informations about the card. But why do changed informations prevent the bios from working on the card?
here is a link to both bios-files: http://www.datei-upload.eu/file.php?id=bf83416010b63be439721adc1b684212

Bios with "Wekiva Board..." is *not *working
Bios with "RV770XT .." is working.

Could you have a look on it?


----------



## VuurVOS (Oct 11, 2008)

Coolsys said:


> I've got a Problem. I have 2 modified Bios basing on the same Bios. Only differences are on Page1 with informations about the card. But why do changed informations prevent the bios from working on the card?
> here is a link to both bios-files: http://www.datei-upload.eu/file.php?id=bf83416010b63be439721adc1b684212
> 
> Bios with "Wekiva Board..." is *not *working
> ...



The part numbers are diffrent. I see you have a second generation hd4870. If you want to work with the bios, you must force the flash. And since the part number is diffrent, it can cause troubles if you flash it.


----------



## Coolsys (Oct 11, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> The part numbers are diffrent. I see you have a second generation hd4870. If you want to work with the bios, you must force the flash. And since the part number is diffrent, it can cause troubles if you flash it.



It's no Problem to flash the Bios. But i want to know why one is working and the other one not. I don't think that a different P/N could be a Problem.


----------



## VuurVOS (Oct 11, 2008)

Coolsys said:


> It's no Problem to flash the Bios. But i want to know why one is working and the other one not. I don't think that a different P/N could be a Problem.



One bios is for the reference card and the other not. Thats why there is a different part number. This is mostlikly the issue. Or one other possiblity is you mod the bios too far so it doesn't boot (I saw you edit those)


----------



## Coolsys (Oct 11, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> One bios is for the reference card and the other not. Thats why there is a different part number. This is mostlikly the issue. Or one other possiblity is you mod the bios too far so it doesn't boot (I saw you edit those)



I had flashed both Bios on my card and both are based on the same latest sapphire bios.
The only thing i want to know is why the bios with edited informations doesn't work, while the other does.


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## VuurVOS (Oct 11, 2008)

Coolsys said:


> I had flashed both Bios on my card and both are based on the same latest sapphire bios.
> The only thing i want to know is why the bios with edited informations doesn't work, while the other does.



Sorry I tough one of those bioses where from the reference card. Maybe you mod it too far. Try the same bios but with less modifications (also use not too low/high values)


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## Coolsys (Oct 12, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> Sorry I tough one of those bioses where from the reference card. Maybe you mod it too far. Try the same bios but with less modifications (also use not too low/high values)



Why should it be a problem with a "too far" modded bios?? 
The Bios should work anyway, because the card doesn't care about its name..


----------



## VuurVOS (Oct 12, 2008)

Coolsys said:


> Why should it be a problem with a "too far" modded bios??
> The Bios should work anyway, because the card doesn't care about its name..


Its true but even when the basic is the same, there can be some things diffrent. Like the Diamond HD4870 XOC bios which doesn't like to have your memory at 225mhz (artifacts). The normal 100 bios doesn't have that issue and can run at 200mhz. They have the same base but the memory does work diffrent. 

Just make a new bios mod with a higher boot values (the orginal are the best). And please do not underclock your gpu so far since it doesn't safe much energy. The best gpu value is the orginal of 500mhz in idle and in 3d mode 750mhz. Memory speed should be okay but you can beter try a higher value like 250mhz


----------



## Coolsys (Oct 12, 2008)

But it is the same Bios. If the checksum wouldn't be different i could save the working Bios only with changed informations and it would'nt only with the difference in the informations.
Like a BMW that can't drive if i write Chrysler on it.


----------



## VuurVOS (Oct 12, 2008)

Coolsys said:


> But it is the same Bios. If the checksum wouldn't be different i could save the working Bios only with changed informations and it would'nt only with the difference in the informations.
> Like a BMW that can't drive if i write Chrysler on it.


The problem with the bios editor is, you only can edit certain bytes. If you increase or change something, it must fit in the orginal byte location. So if you need more bytes for a longer/bigger string or then it wouldn't fit. Same goes for a smaller string. Luckly RBE gives an error when this happens.

Why do you want to use a sapphire bios on the reference card of ati? (the first generation hd4870 of sapphire is a reference card of ati) The 113-B50701-105 bios has powerplay and you won't lose you warrenty so long you dont edit/mod it. If you use tools like ATI Tray Tools to underclock/overclock automaticaly when needed you also save energy on the save way without a lot of flikkering.


----------



## Silverel (Oct 12, 2008)

lol, wut?


----------



## Coolsys (Oct 12, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> The problem with the bios editor is, you only can edit certain bytes. If you increase or change something, it must fit in the orginal byte location. So if you need more bytes for a longer/bigger string or then it wouldn't fit. Same goes for a smaller string. Luckly RBE gives an error when this happens.
> 
> Why do you want to use a sapphire bios on the reference card of ati? (the first generation hd4870 of sapphire is a reference card of ati) The 113-B50701-105 bios has powerplay and you won't lose you warrenty so long you dont edit/mod it. If you use tools like ATI Tray Tools to underclock/overclock automaticaly when needed you also save energy on the save way without a lot of flikkering.



It doesn't do this in my case 

And i don't see any flicker - everythings fine, like it should. Just for "perfection" i would like to have the original informations instead of sapphires in my bios. But as you say it couldn't be made with RBE i disclaim perfection .


----------



## VuurVOS (Oct 13, 2008)

Coolsys said:


> It doesn't do this in my case
> 
> And i don't see any flicker - everythings fine, like it should. Just for "perfection" i would like to have the original informations instead of sapphires in my bios. But as you say it couldn't be made with RBE i disclaim perfection .



Are you sure, since every hd4870 (first generation bug?) had this issue when changing ram speeds. When the ram speed is changed you saw for a blink of an eye a flikker on the screen. Maybe I must try the new sapphire hd4870 bios on my card


----------



## Coolsys (Oct 14, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> Are you sure, since every hd4870 (first generation bug?) had this issue when changing ram speeds. When the ram speed is changed you saw for a blink of an eye a flikker on the screen. Maybe I must try the new sapphire hd4870 bios on my card



I can see something when i quit a game, but i think it is the same like every other graphic-card except HD4870.
You are welcome to try it yourself .


----------



## VuurVOS (Oct 14, 2008)

Coolsys said:


> I can see something when i quit a game, but i think it is the same like every other graphic-card except HD4870.
> You are welcome to try it yourself .



Thats sounds same like the flikker issue. Its only happends when switching from a 3D to a 2D state.


----------



## tiodrakul (Oct 17, 2008)

I *really* need the spin up bug fix enabled to 4870X2, my card have this bug (stay on 100% fan speed all time) but RBE do not enable the fix option, help!


----------



## tiodrakul (Oct 17, 2008)

I have the spin up bug on a 4870X2 (100% fan speed all time), but RBE do not allow me to use the fix, what i can do? the noise at 100% is insupportable


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## VuurVOS (Oct 17, 2008)

tiodrakul said:


> I *really* need the spin up bug fix enabled to 4870X2, my card have this bug (stay on 100% fan speed all time) but RBE do not enable the fix option, help!





tiodrakul said:


> I have the spin up bug on a 4870X2 (100% fan speed all time), but RBE do not allow me to use the fix, what i can do? the noise at 100% is insupportable


Posting your problem once is enough. The spin up bug is unwanted spin ups, that isn't the same like 100% fan all the time.

Do you have this issue before you boot the system into windows/linux? Do you have this issue with the orginal bios?

Can you give more info about the card, maybe you have a card with a 2/3 wire fan so it will run at 100% all the time. Can you provide the orginal&modded bios or a screenshot of the fan settings.


----------



## tiodrakul (Oct 17, 2008)

Strange, I do not remember to post double on this thread, but...

Lucky, i found the problem, after some hours thinking. the PWM-control wire from fan are broken (and difficult to see without carefull examination), I fix then and now the fan respond to control. But thanks for the reply



VuurVOS said:


> Posting your problem once is enough. The spin up bug is unwanted spin ups, that isn't the same like 100% fan all the time.
> 
> Do you have this issue before you boot the system into windows/linux? Do you have this issue with the orginal bios?
> 
> Can you give more info about the card, maybe you have a card with a 2/3 wire fan so it will run at 100% all the time. Can you provide the orginal&modded bios or a screenshot of the fan settings.


----------



## jcusimano2 (Nov 5, 2008)

*Something about RBE irritating me*

if I increase the overdrive values using the first method then after booting my card likes to have a core of 800Mhz because that is what the signature file says/is even though I have it clocked at 780 or 810 or whatever and if I open a 3d intensive program for a second then it will snap back to where it is supposed to be. Now if I clock my card where the signature fils says like 800 core then the problem usually isn't there. How fdo I stop this it has always been like this too I was just too lazy to write about it


----------



## jcusimano2 (Nov 8, 2008)

*Why doesn't raising the upper limit wo5rk right?*

When I raise the upper limit in bios after flashing the stupid clocks go th wharever the lower limit is when that is incorrect. My lower limit is 780/925 and it goes to 800/1100 it has always done this to me but I have not wrote about it. Why does the raising of the upper limit not work correctly??


----------



## VuurVOS (Nov 8, 2008)

jcusimano2 said:


> When I raise the upper limit in bios after flashing the stupid clocks go th wharever the lower limit is when that is incorrect. My lower limit is 780/925 and it goes to 800/1100 it has always done this to me but I have not wrote about it. Why does the raising of the upper limit not work correctly??



Your using method 1 to raise the Overdrive Limit? Then it is normal because with method 1 you also change the standard ram/gpu clock displayed in GPU-Z. The real clocks are programmed on the clock settings page.


----------



## jcusimano2 (Nov 19, 2008)

Thanks a lot Vuurvos for your help I do believe I understand now so can you answer one more question so are you saying that so if 1.263 & 1.276 are both just labels (and even though version 100 has a max of 1.276 & 105 has a max of 1.263) then both of these max voltages even though the labels are slightly different if I measured with a dimm 1.263 & 1.276 will be the exact same voltage?? So these voltages are the same just the labels are slightly different for the max on the different versions? & enabling superior play I thought was a dis advantage since it also lowered the max voltage but in reality the label just lowers a little but the voltage is the same. So having superior powerplay is a plus since you can lower idle volts = temps too.

                                Am I understanding this right??

                                                          Joe


----------



## jcusimano2 (Nov 19, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> Your using method 1 to raise the Overdrive Limit? Then it is normal because with method 1 you also change the standard ram/gpu clock displayed in GPU-Z. The real clocks are programmed on the clock settings page.




    Well actually even going to the clocks setting page my core would be 800 untill I opened & closed a 3D app and then it would bounce correctly to 780 & then back to 500 so I still haven't overcome this obstacle but don't care anymore since I am not using this feature anymore. I just flash 825/925 to state 3 with RBE & be done with it.

                         But I am curious as to if I have the voltage labels understood correctly in my previous post

                                                         Thank you

                                                                    joe


----------



## VuurVOS (Nov 19, 2008)

Totally correct If you post you bios, I could try to find out why it is bouncing that way.


----------



## jcusimano2 (Nov 19, 2008)

VuurVOS said:


> Totally correct If you post you bios, I could try to find out why it is bouncing that way.




here and right when you boot immediately go to the middle tab in Gpu-z (Clock settings)


----------



## ir_cow (Nov 21, 2008)

*video card id*

hey all, after doing other stuff for a while i came across the new version of RBE but i noticed that the new FirePros are named Gls

 V3750 , V5700 , V7760 , V7770 , V8700 Duo ,V8750 all seem effected. i dont think is that big of a deal but might confuse some people as even on the Ati website its stated as "FirePro"


----------



## a_non_moose (Nov 28, 2008)

I've been looking into RBE as Ati Tool seems to be unsupported on 4850's.

I've not come across any info on editing a HIS Radeon 4850 via browsing/searching, so I don't know
what to expect out of overclocking.

CCC tests up to 700Mhz core speed just fine, but doesn't seem to touch the memory.

Anyone seen any settings/experience floating around?


----------



## Spyral01 (Dec 5, 2008)

Hi all I got a question

I want to edit my HD 3870 device ID to HD 4850 or 4870
Reason is that the HD48xx cards get a lot of new feature in the drivers
E.g. Cat 8.12 stream,
Fan speed control
Dynamic contrast

If I edit the bios will these features work
And if something goes wrong can I revert back to the original Hd 3870 bios ?


----------



## VuurVOS (Dec 6, 2008)

Spyral01 said:


> Hi all I got a question
> 
> I want to edit my HD 3870 device ID to HD 4850 or 4870
> Reason is that the HD48xx cards get a lot of new feature in the drivers
> ...



*Dont do it*. The HD4800 series has a diffrent gpu chip so the drivers and new features will not work.


----------



## Spyral01 (Dec 6, 2008)

Thank you

I will just go and buy a 4850


----------



## swaaye (Dec 29, 2008)

*38x0 BIOS editing*

Has anyone else run into problems with CCC after modifying and flashing a BIOS? I've been tweaking my 3850 with RBE for the better part of a year now. It's a rather rare occurrence and I don't know what causes it but CCC will crash. Not the control panel itself, but some service that seems to be running. 

I've tried lots of different clocks, different 2D/low3D/high3D settings. I've tried that "locked settings" check box. I'm not sure if I'm seeing the result of some incompatible BIOS settings, card instability (power management issues?) or something else. I'm editing my card's original BIOS (a GeCube 3850 Turbo 512MB PCIe). I have also referenced ATI OEM BIOSes from the  database here.

Also, why do I still see the card's original clock speeds reported by various programs after a flash? For example, Everest will still see the original 725/900 settings when it reports clock speeds. After I've flashed to 750/950, it'll say I have a % overclock instead of those being the new default clocks. GPU-Z also sees the original clocks alongside the new flashed clocks. Are these still in the BIOS somewhere or stored in the drivers somehow?


----------



## kkbob33 (Dec 30, 2008)

*4850 flash issues*

I have been trying to flash my 4850 bios with a .rom i made with RBE1.8(http://www.techpowerup.com/downloads...tor_v1.18.html). The flash works, its just that the drivers will not recognize them.

i have tried every driver from 8.10 and up with various different flashes and the only flash that the drivers will recognize is the stock bios.

I tried without increasing the voltage, increasing the voltage with the pulldown menu, and just rehashing the CCC limits.

Im kicking myself trying to figure out how i can maintain a high overclock with a voltmod to pair with a 4870


does anyone have any experience with this. Got a solution?

I am including the stock and hashed versions of the bios.


----------



## elloco (Dec 30, 2008)

*HD4850 and Clock States*

Hi
sorry if the post does not go here.
I have a question about the HD4850 and the clock states. Because I want to change the low clocks (clock 01 and 07) to 160/500, the problem is that im using vista, so the VGA never use that clock because of the aero. So I wanted to know if i set the medium clocks (Clock 02 and 08) to 160/500 too, will have a problem because are the same as the low clocks or if vista will run slow.
Thanks in advance.


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## vanillaportal (Dec 31, 2008)

i ran 160/500 on vista (w/AERO on) before, there was not slow down at all. for my powercolor card, powerplay uses clock 07 when I am on desktop (w/ AERO on).


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## elloco (Dec 31, 2008)

Great! 
thanks for the answer


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## kkbob33 (Jan 5, 2009)

kkbob33 said:


> I have been trying to flash my 4850 bios with a .rom i made with RBE1.8(http://www.techpowerup.com/downloads...tor_v1.18.html). The flash works, its just that the drivers will not recognize them.
> 
> i have tried every driver from 8.10 and up with various different flashes and the only flash that the drivers will recognize is the stock bios.
> 
> ...



anyone?


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## V ii R u S (Jan 5, 2009)

*XpertVision HD4870 BIOS  help needed*

okay so ive tryed flashing my BIOS with atiflash, ive tryed to different BIOSes 1. Diamond HD4870 XOC black edition
2. ASUS top BIOS
both bricked my card, so i used a x1600xt to put the original BIOS back on my 4870.

next i tryed using RBE to edit the orginal BIOS, this worked, i tryed 825mhz core clock and Mem at 1000mhz, but i got throttling and artifacts on the last test of 3dm06. also it was stuttering all the way through.

Next i tryed modding the original BIOS again this time to 1100mem (i know my card can do this, with CCC no problem) and 810 core clock, but this time the driver wouldnt install >.<

i think it needs more voltage but in RBE it has a list of voltages that will work(4 of them) and my card is already running at the highest one. Can i set it to run at higher voltages  or will it just revert to the nearest one in the list?

also does anyone know of a BIOS that works with a XpertVision Radeon HD4870 sonic dual edition 512mb?  ive tryed looking for ages, but with no joy.
Im not totally sure if im getting artifacts because of lack of voltage or something else, can someone, anyone help please?

any help would be much appreicated


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## maxcherry2 (Jan 8, 2009)

*HD 4850 Voltage in RBE how to get to 1.2v?*

Hi I would like to say I think the work on these forums is great and the support you guys give is excellent.

I hope I can get some help to please.

I have a HD4850 512mb card it is a non reference made by Gigabyte. 

I can open up the BIOS using RBE and I can modify the clocks no problem this all seems to work fine.

However when I first open the original BIOS RBE has checked the tick box saying it has been modified before? 

All of the Voltages just have the 3 _ _ _ dashes so I think this means they are driver controlled. 

Now I have seen on other peoples BIOS’s they have posted on the Extremesystems article that they have raised there stock voltage to 1.2v by changing these figures to over that some put 1.263V some put 1.3v some say it doesn’t matter if you put 1.4v because the card will only reach 1.2v which is fine by me as a starting point.

Now if I use any of the above voltages and flash the card it will post go to windows splash screen then goes off?

However if I use any of the preset voltages in the drop down box in RBE it flashes and works fine, however the maximum voltage I can select is 1.152 or something like that. Now the instructions for RBE seems to suggest you have to match the voltage with one of these amounts in the list so how can the others users seem to get away with any number? Or is the 1.152 in the BIOS giving me 1.2 at the card.

Gigabyte also has a windows app (I know!) that can raise the cards voltage and this seems to work it is called GUD however I have not got this loaded or enabled thoughts any of the above process I also have overdrive in CCC disabled.

Come on guys any thoughts?


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## LiveWire195 (Jan 12, 2009)

*Powercolor ATI HD 2600 XT Tech Issue*

First of I have to say I love your software.  I figured out how to use everything except when I overclock it past the stock clocks, the pc doesn't reconize the card, I have tried installing drivers again but no luck.

Any care to shed some light on my error?


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 12, 2009)

LiveWire195 said:


> First of I have to say I love your software.  I figured out how to use everything except when I overclock it past the stock clocks, the pc doesn't reconize the card, I have tried installing drivers again but no luck.
> 
> Any care to shed some light on my error?



Thanks.  Try not changing the voltages, the vendor ID and the video card ID. Disable overdrive.


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## LiveWire195 (Jan 12, 2009)

I didn't modify the voltage and the vendor ID.  I dont know how to disable overdrive


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## Random Murderer (Jan 12, 2009)

i'm gonna jump on the bandwagon here and say i absolutely love this program as well.
i've used it to edit my 4870's bios as well as 3 or 4 3870 bioses.


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 12, 2009)

Random Murderer said:


> i'm gonna jump on the bandwagon here and say i absolutely love this program as well.
> i've used it to edit my 4870's bios as well as 3 or 4 3870 bioses.



Nice to hear that, thank you!


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## LiveWire195 (Jan 12, 2009)

Can anyone help me?...


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## mav2000 (Jan 27, 2009)

Hey Bagz, Your program is absolutly super. But I am facing a funny problem. I am not able to use it anymore is it loads and shows in the taskbar and system tray but just will not open. ANy ideas? I am using windows vista ultimate sp1.


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 27, 2009)

mav2000 said:


> Hey Bagz, Your program is absolutly super. But I am facing a funny problem. I am not able to use it anymore is it loads and shows in the taskbar and system tray but just will not open. ANy ideas? I am using windows vista ultimate sp1.



I'm having a fix for this waiting for the next release. Until then, try this workaround.


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## Flash (Jan 28, 2009)

I would like to ask a few questions in regards to this nifty tool I just discovered today.

1. If I press the button in Fan Settings to use the recommended values, would it not imply it fixes the bug spin too and I don't need to make a selection in Additional feature. Why there is no changes in Fan Settings once you click to fix the bug spin, what exactly it modifies?

2. If at Enable Superior Powerplay I select Disable, does it mean I will no longer have power play and my card will run at the default 750/900 all the time? If indeed it disables power play what clock info will it use?

3. For Increased overdrive limit, there is a HD4870 (Method 1 Hash) that has 800Mhz/1100mhz with 990mhz and 1200mhz for CCC values. If I click "change to these values, isn't there a bit possibility my card will go bust? I mean there is no guarantee that my card can run up to 800mhz/1100mhz memory. TBH I never seen someone having his 4870 running so high (I think the highest I seen was 800/1000) My card could display articafts, lockup, give BSOD with only 780mhz/1000mhz right? Isn't that why there is recommended when you OC to set your clock and memory by 5-10mhz at a time? How safe it is to use this feature and select the HD4870 800/1100/990/1200 option?

4. I do not want to use CCC for overclocking. I also understood that CCC loosen the timings on the GPU RAM. How does RBE handle in in this regards?

5. Something related to question 3. I just saved a BIOS with the HD4870 800/1100/990/1200. Now the actual settings are 800/1100, however the clock settings did not change, and they still are 750/900 Boot, 200/500 power saving/thermal, 500/500 UVD and 750/900 Accel 3D. Also it did not changed when selecting disable to Enable superior power paly

6. A game called EVE Online, when played in window mode, GPU switches to the 200/500 settings (750/900 if played in full screen). Which Clock info needs to be change to fix that?

7. (if you have any idea, I already made a thread specific for this). Any idea what clock info makes RivaTuner to detect my clocks as 200/500 instead of 750/900 like everybody's else?

8. When using other BIOS for the same card (in my case the HIS 4870) I noticed that this BIOS I downloaded from techpowerup also has a voltage of 1.27. How is this possible when my cards BIOS maximum was 1.26 and the Help said it's hardwired into my card. The BIOS was selected under HIS 4870, the card I have.

Thank you, I attached my original BIOS for reference (NOTE, CHANGE .TXT to .RAR).


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## mav2000 (Jan 28, 2009)

Thanks BAG that worked wonders.


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 28, 2009)

Flash said:


> 1. If I press the button in Fan Settings to use the recommended values, would it not imply it fixes the bug spin too[?]


That's a nice suggestion. I will add this to the next version, if I don't forget. 



Flash said:


> Why there is no changes in Fan Settings once you click to fix the bug spin, what exactly it modifies?


It fixes one byte (or a few, I don't remember right now and am too lazy to look it up ) in the BIOS. It is not noticable in the usual fan settings.



Flash said:


> 2. If at Enable Superior Powerplay I select Disable, does it mean I will no longer have power play[?]


No. Only the *superior* powerplay features are gone then.



Flash said:


> 3. For Increased overdrive limit, there is a HD4870 (Method 1 Hash) that has 800Mhz/1100mhz with 990mhz and 1200mhz for CCC values. If I click "change to these values, isn't there a bit possibility my card will go bust? I mean there is no guarantee that my card can run up to 800mhz/1100mhz memory. TBH I never seen someone having his 4870 running so high (I think the highest I seen was 800/1000) My card could display articafts, lockup, give BSOD with only 780mhz/1000mhz right? Isn't that why there is recommended when you OC to set your clock and memory by 5-10mhz at a time? How safe it is to use this feature and select the HD4870 800/1100/990/1200 option?


Increasing the overdrive headroom does not mean your card runs these clocks all the time. Nothing will change at all if you don't have overdrive enabled.



Flash said:


> 4. I do not want to use CCC for overclocking. I also understood that CCC loosen the timings on the GPU RAM. How does RBE handle in in this regards?


RBE doesn't handle anything regarding overdrive. It simply increases the clocks headroom. All disadvantages regarding overclocking using overdrive remain.



Flash said:


> 5. Something related to question 3. I just saved a BIOS with the HD4870 800/1100/990/1200. Now the actual settings are 800/1100, however the clock settings did not change, and they still are 750/900 Boot, 200/500 power saving/thermal, 500/500 UVD and 750/900 Accel 3D. Also it did not changed when selecting disable to Enable superior power paly


First of all, you should read and understand the RBE tutorial carefully. It seems you didn't (entirely) understand several basics of the powerplay mechanism yet. Please be sure to entirely understand what you are doing before tinkering with your BIOS.



Flash said:


> 6. A game called EVE Online, when played in window mode, GPU switches to the 200/500 settings (750/900 if played in full screen). Which Clock info needs to be change to fix that?


You need to understand your BIOS. The RBE tutorial will help you doing so. Then, you can answer this question yourself.



Flash said:


> 7. (if you have any idea, I already made a thread specific for this). Any idea what clock info makes RivaTuner to detect my clocks as 200/500 instead of 750/900 like everybody's else?


Look into that thread.



Flash said:


> 8. When using other BIOS for the same card (in my case the HIS 4870) I noticed that this BIOS I downloaded from techpowerup also has a voltage of 1.27. How is this possible when my cards BIOS maximum was 1.26 and the Help said it's hardwired into my card. The BIOS was selected under HIS 4870, the card I have.


The reported values are irrelevant. Think about it: The reported values are valid only for the video board the BIOS has been extracted from.


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## Random Murderer (Jan 28, 2009)

i just read the tutorial and learned a few things i did not know about rbe.
however, now i also have a few questions not answered in the tutorial...
in section 3.4.2, you describe how the hysteresis and pwm ramp work, but you don't say a word about the spin up cycle, spin up time, or pwm ramp(%) settings.
what are they and what do they do?


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 28, 2009)

Random Murderer said:


> i just read the tutorial and learned a few things i did not know about rbe.
> however, now i also have a few questions not answered in the tutorial...
> in section 3.4.2, you describe how the hysteresis and pwm ramp work, but you don't say a word about the spin up cycle, spin up time, or pwm ramp(%) settings.
> what are they and what do they do?



You're welcome! 
I didn't mention anything about those settings because there is a link in RBE's fan settings tab (click "What do all the settings mean?") explaining that. After all, it's not that important (except for PWM ramp, you may wish to enable that because it brings some psychoacoustic advantages).
Have fun using that stuff!


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## Random Murderer (Jan 28, 2009)

BAGZZlash said:


> You're welcome!
> I didn't mention anything about those settings because there is a link in RBE's fan settings tab (click "What do all the settings mean?") explaining that. After all, it's not that important (except for PWM ramp, you may wish to enable that because it brings some psychoacoustic advantages).
> Have fun using that stuff!



cool, just flashed the new bios and going to reboot now 

EDIT:
i'm happy the fan isn't constantly spinning up and down now.


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## Flash (Jan 28, 2009)

Thank you for answering so fast 



BAGZZlash said:


> No. Only the *superior* powerplay features are gone then.



Ok, I did as the FAQ said, and opened a saved BIOS with them Disabled (Enable/Already Enabled was checked). Nothing changed tho . I guess they are already hard coded? 



BAGZZlash said:


> Increasing the overdrive headroom does not mean your card runs these clocks all the time. Nothing will change at all if you don't have overdrive enabled.



Well what I was reffering to is that the "standard clocks". If the increase overdrive limit tab, does only that, increasing the overdrive in CCC only and nothing more, the expresion "Standard clocks" made me think the standard clocks will change too. For example under actual settings, it's Standard Clocks 750/900 (which are the rated clocks), with the upper limit 790/1100 (same numbers I have in CCC). Now with the Hash check method, and the included 4870 settings, it says "standard clocks" 800/1100 and upper limit 990/1200. Compared between, at least myself, I understand that the limit in CCC will now be 990/1200 and the GPU clocks will not be 800/1100.



BAGZZlash said:


> First of all, you should read and understand the RBE tutorial carefully. It seems you didn't (entirely) understand several basics of the powerplay mechanism yet. Please be sure to entirely understand what you are doing before tinkering with your BIOS.



This would be related to the above statement. I thought that a new "standard clocks" means it will change the standard 750/900 clocks to a 800/1100 value.



BAGZZlash said:


> You need to understand your BIOS. The RBE tutorial will help you doing so. Then, you can answer this question yourself.



Ok, I think I just know. Because my windows mode (which I guess is the notebook blabla powerplay state structure) is 200/500 on the line for all low, medium and high modes. For it to activate to 750/900, it has to detect a 3D acceleration state, which I guess it's done when entering full screen. If you stay in window mode, it uses the windows state, and since my windows state is 200/500 for all 3 modes, it only uses 200/500, even tho it's an actual game.

Now my question is the following: in the FAQ you gave a nice rule when windows might find it self in low, medium or high. But is there an actual written "rule" in the BIOS when it switches between the low, medium, high that you can check? Or it's just a "it should" because that's how it's hard-wired.

What I'm trying to say, is there a way for an average joe like me to know when the modes change and what triggers them?





BAGZZlash said:


> The reported values are irrelevant. Think about it: The reported values are valid only for the video board the BIOS has been extracted from.



Ok, so basically, it's safe to assume that the max voltage wired in the card is the value found in the original BIOS? Therefore when you flash to a different 4870 BIOS, any voltage which is over the maximum voltage found in the original BIOS might not work? And if it doesn't and you select a 1.276v when your card maximum is 1.265v, by selecting 1.276 will it crash/damage the card, or the card will simply run with the voltage nearest to the one you selected, that being 1.265v? (or what i'm trying to say is something similar you write in the FAQ "various things may happen") Or just use the voltages that were available with the original BIOS and ignore all other values in the different 4870 BIOS to be safest?

Regarding changing BIOS with another 4870 BIOS, how "viable" is it. I'm asking this because of the huge BIOS database you can select on this website. Is there a reason why to use this method vs changing the settings yourself (to the same settings you would find the the other BIOS you want to switch) in your own BIOS?


A new question. If the clocks for the core and memory decrease, you save power. By decreasing the voltages also, I guess you save even more. 
Now if my BIOS has 200/500 @ 1.10v, 500/500 @ 1.20v and 750/900 @ 1.26v (1.26v being the max), and I want to change the value to 200/900 (first value), is it safer to just set it @ 1.26v rather than 1.20v? 

Another question: What exactly is that Hysteresis % value. I mean I have read the FAQ, wikipedia the word (not native english speaker), read the guru3d forum explanation by unwinder, but I just can't exactly get it. If you could just give me an example what is the difference having hysteresis % - 4 and hysteresis % - 24, everything else identical.


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## Flash (Jan 29, 2009)

*Fan Fix changes Spin up time.*

Just noticed that if you choose the fan fix, the spin up time goes from 2 to 4. Not sure if this is intended.


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## Random Murderer (Jan 29, 2009)

BAGZZlash said:
			
		

> On the right side, there is the vendor and the device ID. If you have a card from, say, ASUS, it can happen that the display states "0x1002 - ATI..." however. Many video card vendors seem to simply forget to put their vendor ID into the BIOS or use the ATI stock BIOS. You can change this information (as well as the device ID), but this is again protected using that digital signature described earlier. So after changing this and flashing such a BIOS to the card, Catalyst might not recognize the card anymore. However, there's no point in changing one of those items anyway. You can't turn a 2900 Pro wondrously into a 4870X2.



does this mean catalyst won't detect the card at all or you have to reinstall catalyst to get it recognized?


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 29, 2009)

Flash said:


> What I'm trying to say, is there a way for an average joe like me to know when the modes change and what triggers them?


I don't think so. I don't know how the triggering mechanism works and I don't know how to find out. Maybe the folks in the general graphics cards threads know more about this. If you find some information, tell me. 



Flash said:


> Ok, so basically, it's safe to assume that the max voltage wired in the card is the value found in the original BIOS? Therefore when you flash to a different 4870 BIOS, any voltage which is over the maximum voltage found in the original BIOS might not work?


You can find the voltages the card is able to set (regarding the _original_ BIOS) in the pulldown menu in each clock info mode voltage setting box. Also, see the list of selectable voltages in the lower left of the clocks tab (I made that before I put those pulldown menus into the clock info boxes, so this list is a little obsolete ). The card should be able to implement those voltages. If you enter a voltage different than those in the list (e.g. an even higher voltage), tha card can't do it, so this is pointless. I'm not sure what happens in those cases. It seems to depend on the catalyst driver version. Sometimes people report that the driver won't even recognize the card any more. The least that could happen is that the nearest possible voltage or the lowest or highest possible voltage is being applied.

A voltage of, say, 1.263V means, say, "voltage mode 4" internally for the BIOS and the voltage controller. Now flashing some other BIOS to the card that reports a voltage of, say, 1.276V can also mean "voltage mode 4" to the card, so the controller still implements 1.263V. So you have to distinguish between what is reported and what this value is being interpreted as internally.



Flash said:


> Regarding changing BIOS with another 4870 BIOS, how "viable" is it. I'm asking this because of the huge BIOS database you can select on this website. Is there a reason why to use this method vs changing the settings yourself (to the same settings you would find the the other BIOS you want to switch) in your own BIOS?


It's always safer to use your own BIOS (even an RBE-tuned one) rather than flashing a BIOS from some other card to your card. I can hardly imagine cases in which it is really necessary to do that.



Flash said:


> A new question. If the clocks for the core and memory decrease, you save power. By decreasing the voltages also, I guess you save even more.
> Now if my BIOS has 200/500 @ 1.10v, 500/500 @ 1.20v and 750/900 @ 1.26v (1.26v being the max), and I want to change the value to 200/900 (first value), is it safer to just set it @ 1.26v rather than 1.20v?


Voltage means stability. Higher clocks mean the need for more voltage to run stable. For lower clocks, you can save some power by using lower voltages. People lower the voltages until the card becomes unstable and then rise the voltage a little again to remain stable. That's the usual method of undervolting a card.



Flash said:


> Another question: What exactly is that Hysteresis % value. I mean I have read the FAQ, wikipedia the word (not native english speaker), read the guru3d forum explanation by unwinder, but I just can't exactly get it. If you could just give me an example what is the difference having hysteresis % - 4 and hysteresis % - 24, everything else identical.


This can most easily be understood considering the look up table mode.
Imagine your card switches from 25% fan duty to 33% at a temperature of 50°C. So the temperatures rises... 48°C, 49°C, 50°C. Not the fan turns up, the temperature may rise to 51°C at first but due to heavy fan duty, the temperature falls to 50°C and 49°C. Without hysteresis, the fan duty now falls to 25% immediately. This means the card becomes hotter again and the fan duty switches back to 33% and so on.
Using hysteresis, the fan will turn up to 33% if the temperature crosses 50°C. Now if the temperature falls back to 49°C, the fan will remain at 33% until the temperature falls a litte more. So hysteresis prevents the fan to switch between two fan duty modes all the time.


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## Alessio (Jan 29, 2009)

Random Murderer said:


> does this mean catalyst won't detect the card at all or you have to reinstall catalyst to get it recognized?



catalyst won't detect the card at all


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 29, 2009)

Random Murderer said:


> does this mean catalyst won't detect the card at all or you have to reinstall catalyst to get it recognized?





Alessio said:


> catalyst won't detect the card at all



Correct. Be careful with that, Random Murderer. Have your original BIOS and ATIFlash on a bootable device ready if you decide to play around with that.


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## Flash (Jan 29, 2009)

The original BIOS saved with GPU-Z is .bin. Do you have to manually change .bin to .rom or it will work to flash it as .bin too?


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## VuurVOS (Jan 29, 2009)

Flash said:


> The original BIOS saved with GPU-Z is .bin. Do you have to manually change .bin to .rom or it will work to flash it as .bin too?



it will work as bin file also. Its all about the content of the file, the extention doesn't really matter.


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## Random Murderer (Jan 29, 2009)

BAGZZlash said:


> Correct. Be careful with that, Random Murderer. Have your original BIOS and ATIFlash on a bootable device ready if you decide to play around with that.



i just wanted to change the vendor id, but that's fine. i won't tinker with it.


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## panfist (Jan 31, 2009)

I just got a 4870 1GB and I'm messing around with RBE but I must not be doing something right.

I installed RBE to C:\program files (x86)\RBE
I installed ATIWinFlash to C:\program files (x86)\RBE\winflash.
I installed ATIFlash to C:\program files (x86)\RBE\atiflash.

I open up RBE, I go to "Acquire," I browse to ATIWinFlash, and I get a dialog box that says "No ATI Video Card found. Try WinFlash directly. If that doesn't work, try ATIWinFlash." So then I browse to ATIFlash instead of ATIWinflash, and I get the same message. I have tried opening up those executables directly and nothing happens.

In device manager it shows ATI Radeon HD 4800 Series. GPU-Z says the same thing.


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## Flash (Jan 31, 2009)

ATIFlash is to be used in DOS. Which I have the problem to actually boot in DOS for 4 days now. I just wish ATIFlash was bootable


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## panfist (Jan 31, 2009)

Flash said:


> ATIFlash is to be used in DOS. Which I have the problem to actually boot in DOS for 4 days now. I just wish ATIFlash was bootable



Yeah, the chances that I'm going to boot into DOS just to see if I can squeeze my card core past 790MHz is pretty small...and by pretty small I mean zero.


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## VuurVOS (Jan 31, 2009)

Flash said:


> ATIFlash is to be used in DOS. Which I have the problem to actually boot in DOS for 4 days now. I just wish ATIFlash was bootable


Why don't you make a bootable usb stick with ATIFlash on it?



panfist said:


> Yeah, the chances that I'm going to boot into DOS just to see if I can squeeze my card core past 790MHz is pretty small...and by pretty small I mean zero.


Did you try the latest version of ATIWinFlash ?


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## panfist (Jan 31, 2009)

VuurVOS said:


> Did you try the latest version of ATIWinFlash ?



I don't know what you mean by "try." 

I downloaded it. I pointed to it from within RBE. I also tried double-clicking the exectutable. It says it's missing a critical file and then it just kept running taking up an entire core and then some (50-60% total). I could not end the process, I had to restart.

I don't know what file it's missing; I downloaded the most recent version and extracted all the files together in a folder.

Also, is there a source of documentation for ATIFlash and ATIWinFlash? Because I had no idea until Flash posted above that ATIFlash was a DOS App.


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## VuurVOS (Jan 31, 2009)

panfist said:


> I don't know what you mean by "try."


Did you "use" (try) the latest version of atiwinflash?



panfist said:


> I downloaded it. I pointed to it from within RBE. I also tried double-clicking the exectutable. It says it's missing a critical file and then it just kept running taking up an entire core and then some (50-60% total). I could not end the process, I had to restart.
> 
> I don't know what file it's missing; I downloaded the most recent version and extracted all the files together in a folder.
> 
> Also, is there a source of documentation for ATIFlash and ATIWinFlash? Because I had no idea until Flash posted above that ATIFlash was a DOS App.


Which OS are you using? Which version of ATIWinFlash did you download? Version 2.0.1.5 is at the moment the latest version available.


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## panfist (Jan 31, 2009)

VuurVOS said:


> Did you "use" (try) the latest version of atiwinflash?
> 
> 
> Which OS are you using? Which version of ATIWinFlash did you download? Version 2.0.1.5 is at the moment the latest version available.



See 5 posts up where I linked directly to the version I downloaded.

See my system specs which says I'm using Vista X64.


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## BAGZZlash (Jan 31, 2009)

panfist said:


> I also tried double-clicking the exectutable. It says it's missing a critical file and then it just kept running taking up an entire core and then some (50-60% total). I could not end the process, I had to restart.
> 
> I don't know what file it's missing; I downloaded the most recent version and extracted all the files together in a folder.



You are not the first person to encounter that error. Seems to be a random WinFlash issue. Try googleing for that error message to find out what causes this error. If you can't get WinFlash to work, your only option is making a bootable disc, USB stick, hard disk, CD/DVD, ZIP disc or anything else to boot to DOS and run ATIFlash. There are tons of tutorials on the internet explaining how to do that; it's not that hard. However, using real DOS in order to flash any device such as video cards is recommended anyway. Windows can be unstable so flashing from within windows can be risky.


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## Flash (Jan 31, 2009)

Yea, it took me 5 days to manage to actually boot from pure DOS, making a bootable CD, where my drive would be detected (not even setting the SATA port to IDE in BIOS worked), and had to use a PS2 keyboard, my USB wouldn't work, even tho I have it enabled in the mobo BIOS.

Oh, and I don't have a thumb drive, except a mp3 flash player, but I can't create a DOS start-up disk with it.


Anyway, I'm writing here just to comment that even tho I modified the FAN settings in BIOS (only Tmin, from 58 to 50, and the minimum duty cycle from 0 to 10%), these modifications gave no result.

The fan is still lazy, as in going to let's say 18% at 63c where the slope in BIOS said at 63c it should be 33%.

I did not changed anything for hysterisis or PWM.

P.S. Is MS-DOS that a floppy disk gets when formated a real DOS as you put it BAGZZlash? What classify DOS as REAL DOS?
P.S.2 How on earth when I used Caldera DOS, I was able to see my NTFS partitions? I was totally sure DOS does not see NTFS, only FAT.


----------



## VuurVOS (Feb 1, 2009)

panfist said:


> See 5 posts up where I linked directly to the version I downloaded.
> 
> See my system specs which says I'm using Vista X64.


Thank you captain obvious, but it is very unhandy to put your information in there. Its very easly to overlook since many site use texts ads in there text. Also your system spec's could have been out of date. I always ask for them to get the latest information.



Flash said:


> Anyway, I'm writing here just to comment that even tho I modified the FAN settings in BIOS (only Tmin, from 58 to 50, and the minimum duty cycle from 0 to 10%), these modifications gave no result.
> 
> The fan is still lazy, as in going to let's say 18% at 63c where the slope in BIOS said at 63c it should be 33%.
> 
> I did not changed anything for hysterisis or PWM.


Did you try to make a dump of the flashed bios and checks if the modified FAN settings are set? Its too easy to say it doesn't work. 

Does your fan have fan control or does it use a thermal sensor on the cooler it self? I am not sure about it since HIS ICE Q series have not the refence fan.



Flash said:


> P.S. Is MS-DOS that a floppy disk gets when formated a real DOS as you put it BAGZZlash? What classify DOS as REAL DOS?


A real dos is MS-DOS which doesn't run in protected mode like under windows. Otherwise a crash in dos in protected mode would have been recoveryable for the operating system, since this isn't possible DOS will crash.



Flash said:


> P.S.2 How on earth when I used Caldera DOS, I was able to see my NTFS partitions? I was totally sure DOS does not see NTFS, only FAT.


Caldera DOS isn't the orginal dos but a dos compatible operating system which can have extra's like NTFS. Since I only use FreeDOS (dos compatible) and MS-DOS, I dont have an idea what kind of extra's they have above FreeDOS and MS-DOS.


----------



## Flash (Feb 3, 2009)

So should I understand FreeDOS does not see the NTFS partitions either? Also I had some problems with my USB keyboard. Even tho it's enabled in mobo BIOS, I still had to use a PS2 keyboard.

And regarding RBE, can you flash your BIOS with a file ending in .00R or do you have to rename it to .ROM?


----------



## nafets (Feb 3, 2009)

Flash said:


> And regarding RBE, can you flash your BIOS with a file ending in .00R or do you have to rename it to .ROM?



Yes, it works fine with the weird endings. Renaming it is fine too. Doesn't change the integrity of the BIOS.


----------



## VuurVOS (Feb 4, 2009)

Flash said:


> So should I understand FreeDOS does not see the NTFS partitions either? Also I had some problems with my USB keyboard. Even tho it's enabled in mobo BIOS, I still had to use a PS2 keyboard.


USB keyboards works perfect, only your motherboard must support usb legacy. NTFS not sure, my hd's are in raid so I can't see them in dos


----------



## LuxZg (Feb 7, 2009)

Sorry for jumping in like this, but this is one of the places where I believe a lot of people will be interested about the following info... Especialy VuurVOS (if you still own HD4870  )

It seems that it's possible to force 2D clocks for GDDR5 memory *on HD4870 cards in BIOS *after all, *and AVOID the flickering issue*.
http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=1191319#post1191319

Don't get all too happy, because only one user reported it so far (nafets), so it needs further confirmation, but he says that keeping 2D clocks for memory at 450MHz while 3D clocks are at 900MHz - there is no flickering, and temperatures/consumption in 2D is lowered.
I'm thinking that it's maybe 2:1 ratio so for those overclocking it could be that it's not 450 2D/1000 3D but 500MHz 2D/1000MHz 3D (I'm only talking about memory clocks here).

I'm just sending out the word for now, as I'm selling my card in 2 days and don't want to bother (or risk) with flashing just before buyer arrives, but I'll probably test these once I get new card later next week (Gainward HD4870 1GB Golden Sample... I hope  ).

But if this is true and confirmed, we would probably have a lot of things happening... RBE could include a check if 2D/3D are at right frequency and perhaps warn about flickering issue and recommend a different setting, and VGA manufacturers (and ATi/AMD) would maybe finaly post a real "low 2D power" BIOS for HD4870 cards..

So here it is everyone, you have the info, it's up to you if you'll help or not - but I hope at least several people will try it... and hopefully confirm it


----------



## VuurVOS (Feb 7, 2009)

LuxZg said:


> Sorry for jumping in like this, but this is one of the places where I believe a lot of people will be interested about the following info... Especialy VuurVOS (if you still own HD4870  )
> 
> It seems that it's possible to force 2D clocks for GDDR5 memory *on HD4870 cards in BIOS *after all, *and AVOID the flickering issue*.
> http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?p=1191319#post1191319
> ...



Thx for the info. I will test it after my raid 5 is rebuilded


----------



## frashman (Feb 25, 2009)

Flash said:


> Anyway, I'm writing here just to comment that even tho I modified the FAN settings in BIOS (only Tmin, from 58 to 50, and the minimum duty cycle from 0 to 10%), these modifications gave no result.
> 
> The fan is still lazy, as in going to let's say 18% at 63c where the slope in BIOS said at 63c it should be 33%.
> 
> I did not changed anything for hysterisis or PWM.



Hi,
I got similar problems like him. I just played around with this TechPowerUp ATI RBE Program. Modified my ATI Radeon Sapphire HD4850 BIOS.

My idea was, to get my Arctic Cooling TwinTurbo Fan always running at a minimum of 45%.

But instead of staying at a minimum duty of 45% it stays 0% duty cycle.
Than speeds up with raising temperature like before. So it doesn't what it should.

Any ideas?

My setup:
Tmin °C 60
Tmax °C 105
Tslope % 20
Duty cycle min %45

Hysteresis %0
Spin up cycle % 0 (also tested 45)
Tmin Hysteresis °C 4 (also tested 0)
Spin up time (units) 2 (also tested 0)

PWM RAMP enabled 1% (also tested disabled)


Thanks
Frashman


----------



## VuurVOS (Feb 25, 2009)

frashman said:


> Hi,
> I got similar problems like him. I just played around with this TechPowerUp ATI RBE Program. Modified my ATI Radeon Sapphire HD4850 BIOS.
> 
> My idea was, to get my Arctic Cooling TwinTurbo Fan always running at a minimum of 45%.
> ...



You must lower the Tmin to 0. Otherwise it must become 60 degrees before the fan starts spining at 45%


----------



## frashman (Feb 25, 2009)

VuurVOS said:


> You must lower the Tmin to 0. Otherwise it must become 60 degrees before the fan starts spining at 45%



Hey Thanks i will try it.


----------



## theorw (Mar 2, 2009)

Hi! NOOB QUESTION i know,but i am having problems with the checksum...
I oced my 4850 to 750/1103 and in tests it runs at 770/1175 nice.The thing is that when i set to 1175 in RBE119 it cant save the bios cause of check sum error.It says that i must use an unmodified bios,the original one but i don t have it anymore...So can anyone find me a way to rise the memory via bios...Thanks in advance...


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 2, 2009)

theorw said:


> Hi! NOOB QUESTION i know,but i am having problems with the checksum...
> I oced my 4850 to 750/1103 and in tests it runs at 770/1175 nice.The thing is that when i set to 1175 in RBE119 it cant save the bios cause of check sum error.It says that i must use an unmodified bios,the original one but i don t have it anymore...So can anyone find me a way to rise the memory via bios...Thanks in advance...



If I get it correct, you saw benchmarks where the card runs 770/1175 ? I would never overclock it directly to those speed since every card is different.  Just do it in small steps otherwise it can happy your system wont boot anymore since you overclock it too high.

Also you are using a modified bios for editing? This is realy unhealthy for the bios. Everytime you modified the modified bios, it will incease a chance of a corrupt bios. Always use a clean/orginal copy of your hd4850. If you dont have it anymore you can download it from techpowerup's vga bios database.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 2, 2009)

theorw said:


> The thing is that when i set to 1175 in RBE119 it cant save the bios cause of check sum error.It says that i must use an unmodified bios,the original one but i don t have it anymore.


What manufacturer is your card from?
Just look here if you find your BIOS. And backup your original BIOS next time! 



VuurVOS said:


> Everytime you modified the same bios, it will incease a chance of a corrupt bios.


No. But RBE will run out of bytes for checksum balancing. That's what happened to theorw.


----------



## VuurVOS (Mar 2, 2009)

BAGZZlash said:


> No. But RBE will run out of bytes for checksum balancing. That's what happened to theorw.



I would call it a corrupt bios because it got broken by editing it too much.


----------



## theorw (Mar 2, 2009)

Guys,thanks for all the advice,but i ve oced many cards before(1900xt>714/1714-3870>932/2450).Only this time is the 1st that i have problem with the RBE.So even if RBE cant produce the same checksum,can i save the bios with different checksum and reinstall the card???
@VUURVOS,i did nt see the clocks on benches,i benched my card on these clocks but via rivatuner not via BIOS...


----------



## theorw (Mar 2, 2009)

BAGZZlash,i have sapphire 4850 1gb...


----------



## theorw (Mar 2, 2009)

ok so far i managed to mod a bios from a sapphire 4850 1gb.I only changed 3d clocks to 750-1150 and their volts and tuned the fan too.I have also pencil moded  1.342core and 2.34 memory.The ONLY problem is the different checksum...Do u think i should flash it...?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 2, 2009)

Just post your modified BIOS and I'll see what I can do about it.


----------



## theorw (Mar 2, 2009)

Thanks a million.Try to put the memory on 1175,i know it works and the core 770 if u can.
By the way,change the file to >7501103.RAR<cos i had a little trouble uploading...


----------



## BAGZZlash (Mar 2, 2009)

Okay, I managed to reset most of the checksum correction bytes. You're good to go with this BIOS but please remember to backup it and future BIOSes from now on, deal? 

This file is actually a ZIP file.
View attachment 7501103.zip


----------



## theorw (Mar 2, 2009)

Million thanks again!!I buckit up right now...I was just palying cod4 maxed at 781/1175 so i think thats what i put!Oh and add the bios to the TPU collection cos i thing its missing from there!


----------



## theorw (Mar 2, 2009)

I just did it.It worked!Thanks again!


----------



## benjey (Mar 10, 2009)

I've a question concerning "fan settings" in RBE v1.19: After saving changes to a rom-file an reloading it, my fan setting is completely messed up? Anyone have the same problem?
Before Save/Load: 


After Load:



Thanks,
Ben

(HIS Radeon HD 4670 IceQ)


----------



## theorw (Mar 10, 2009)

Upload your bios here and maybe me or someone else can try and save it according to your pics...!


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## benjey (Mar 10, 2009)

Maybe you could do something like this:
Threshold:  0   40   50   60   70   80   90   100
Fan speed: 0    0    30   50   70  100  100  100
Hysteresis: 5

That would be great!
Thanks!


----------



## theorw (Mar 10, 2009)

Man u sure have a weird bios!
I tried  the values u said and i saved and the result was the same as yours exactly
Its problem of your bios 4 sure
Why dont u try a different bios,from an othe 4670 that u can mod later???


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 11, 2009)

Don't flash that BIOS to your card! This is most likely a bug in RBE. I will look into it this afternoon.
How did you acquire your BIOS, using GPU-Z?


----------



## benjey (Mar 11, 2009)

I aquired the BIOS with GPU-Z v0.3.2 and winflash 2.0.1.5. The same thing happens either way.

@theorw: I want to stick with my original BIOS at the moment, but I'm going to try another one if it's really a BIOS related problem and not a bug in RBE. Or I finally mount that passive cooler I've lying around here somewhere...


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 11, 2009)

Can you send/post this original BIOS as well, please?



benjey said:


> Before Save/Load: [url]http://www.bilder-space.de/thumb/10.03akn8lf20tSJaGFj.jpg[/URL]


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## benjey (Mar 12, 2009)

That's the original file.


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## BAGZZlash (Mar 12, 2009)

Thanks. Well, just as I expected: This BIOS does not have a fan script and therefore, there is no fan control at all. Maybe the fan actually controls itself or it runs at the same speed at all times. The bug in RBE however was that it didn't recognize that there is no fan script and hence, RBE interpreted some more or less random bytes inside the BIOS as look up table for the fan script. I fixed this bug, so the fix will be part of the next release.

Maybe your card does have a fan controller as well as the fan maybe is actually controllable. The probability for this is very low, but maybe flashing some other BIOS onto the card might enable you to control the fan. You can use the soon-to-come RBE v1.20 for testing any BIOS if it indeed has a fan script.
Is your fan controllable using some software tool (ATT, RivaTuner)? If yes, go ahead and try some other BIOS.  Both Sapphire  4670 BIOSes in the TPU database actually have fan scripts, for example.


----------



## benjey (Mar 12, 2009)

ATT more or less crashes immediately (I've just the icon in the taskbar and it uses 100% CPU power, but does nothing else) and RivaTuner works well but can't change the fan speed either. So I guess you are right and there is no fan controller on my card. 
The fan always runs with the same speed which is really annoying and I've hoped that the manufacturer used a constant function for fan control. I'm going to test RBE v1.20 with another BIOS to be sure.

Thanks for figuring all that out!


----------



## thirtythirty (Mar 25, 2009)

Hello, I think the first message in the wrong thread, so I try it here again:

Hi y'all!

I have a strange problem with fan settings:
I modified my BIOS with RBE this way:

My setup:
Tmin °C 40
Tmax °C 106
Tslope % 21
Duty cycle min %15

Hysteresis %24
Spin up cycle % 0
Tmin Hysteresis °C 4
Spin up time (units) 0

PWM RAMP enabled 1% (also tested disabled)


When I started my PC the first time, the fan run at 40%, @40 °C; the second time I started it, it worked as intended, the third time, this morning, the fan was at 10% @ 70°C after 10mins. Tryed to edit the bios a second time, and tryed to edit my safed BIOS file again, and I have always the same problem.
Mybe someone can help me with this.
My Card is a Sapphire HD 4870 1GB;


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## TurdFergasun (Apr 2, 2009)

*RBE: 4870 fan settings finally set right*

finally got my 4870 fan settings right after the 4th flash and playing around with the different settings.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a325/Mr_Sanchez/4870tempval.jpg

RBE fan settings can be seen in the screenshot

vddc slave#1 temp is set to max temperature (89c) under a 780core clock and 1080 mem. freq. with spinning atitool 3d cube for about 1/2 hour, current temps are at stock clocks with cube still running. i've read that with stock bios fan speeds, max vddc temps hit around 95-100c under gaming let alone atitool which tends to heat up cards higher than normal gaming.  Not 100% on stock temps tho never tested it stock with gpu-z, but the back-grill of the card with stock fan speeds used to be too hot to touch for more than a split second, now it's nice and cool enuf to touch always, and no more pulsing to 80% when it starts heating up. idles quietly and cool, with fan spinning around 15-25% almost completely inaudible.  main reason for this bios for me was to run this card cool under osx86, and now it's great for windows games and osx.


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## ViciousXUSMC (Apr 9, 2009)

Hey BAGZZlash been awhile.

I am one of the new Asus W90 owners it has two 4870 mobile cards in it but in windows and gpuz it reports as a 4870X2, I ripped the bios with gpu-z and opened it with the new RBE 1.20 version and here is what we see:







I have one small problem with my machine, I get a "flicker" or a bounce to the screen that I only really see in game menus when I think the cards would be prone to swiching between high and low 3d clocks and If I remember from a past discussion the ram timings should be the same for both.  The ripped bios shows they are not the same so I think maybe this is the problem.

I moved them all to 600mhz and flashed and upon boot all seemed well, I saw 600mhz but opening firefox to report on the forums and I got the white flashing screen of death.  So something is not right yet.

Maybe because its dual cards I need to flash both cards for stability.

Anyways the big question today for me is, can I tell these mobile cards that they are desktop cards so that we can install new ATI drivers?  We are stuck with old drivers and so far all attempts to modify drivers for install have failed on Vista & Win7 (they got it working on XP).  If I can do that what exactly do I need to do?

Off topic: I am using winflash 2.0.0.7 because the "new" version at the time did not work in Vista x64 but I was very lucky to find out an older version works.  Anybody know if the newest version of winflash has this fixed yet?


----------



## BAGZZlash (Apr 9, 2009)

ViciousXUSMC said:


> Hey BAGZZlash



Hi there! 



ViciousXUSMC said:


> If I remember from a past discussion the ram timings should be the same for both.  The ripped bios shows they are not the same so I think maybe this is the problem.


Yeah, could be the cause. But I don't know if I'd rather decide do live with that issue because running the RAM at high clocks all the time eats a lot of power which is not very nice especially  for a notebook.



ViciousXUSMC said:


> Maybe because its dual cards I need to flash both cards for stability.


Of course you need to do that.



ViciousXUSMC said:


> Anyways the big question today for me is, can I tell these mobile cards that they are desktop cards so that we can install new ATI drivers?


Theoretically you could do that. RBE has the functionality already. But changing the DeviceID using RBE is still not recommended, though: The DeviceID (and several other things inside the BIOS) are protected by a digital signature, so changing the DeviceID will void the signature and the driver will refuse to work. Don't do that.



ViciousXUSMC said:


> We are stuck with old drivers and so far all attempts to modify drivers for install have failed on Vista & Win7 (they got it working on XP).  If I can do that what exactly do I need to do?


I'm not so much into drivers. You should ask this question in the general ATI forum. It should  be possible if I'm not completely wrong.



ViciousXUSMC said:


> Anybody know if the newest version of winflash has this fixed yet?


Why don't you try yourself? I'm very pleased with WinFlash 2.0.1.7.

Oh, and one other thing: Please be sure to upload both (unmodified) BIOSes to the TPU database. It can be done easily using GPU-Z. Thanks, man!


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Apr 9, 2009)

Well I got the flash to work fine.

First of all despite being two seperate cards I am 99.9% sure its a 4870x2 now like Asus claimed as one card has a master bios and the other a slave bios.

I tried the ID thing and didnt break my system but it didnt help.  I just saw one card in the device manager and gpu-z called it a "generic ati graphics adapter" the drivers would not install windows just kept saying I already have the most up to date drivers installed.

I did get one thing out of it useful so far, the no hash method worked for extending the overdrive limits, next thing I will do is see if the voltage can be increased via the bios like my desktop 4850's could.

Oh and yeah the new version of winflash works, I never made it back to edit my post.


----------



## Pappa (May 7, 2009)

*Rbe & Msi 4890 (r4890-t2d1g-oc)*

BAGZZlash,

I have used RBE in the past to change my voltages on 4870's. Thank you.  I just bought a MSI 4890 and would like to change the voltages but RBE v1.20 won't open the BIOS file. I see others are using it to MOD their 4890 BIOS but for some reason it won't open the MSI BIOS. Don't know why, its an ATI reference board design. I wonder if MSI has blocked your program?

I've attached my BIOS (extracted with ATIFLASH). What do you think?

Pappa


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## BAGZZlash (May 7, 2009)

Problem is that MSI uses a line break inside the specs string. This is unusual and unexpected to RBE so it can't handle it.
I used this occasion to improve this part of code in RBE which was long overdue. You can use this inofficial version to modify your BIOS. But be careful:


How did you extract your BIOS? It's a GDDR5 card but still the BIOS is < 128 kB and therefore, most probably corrupted. Please use most recent versions of GPU-Z or WinFlash to extract your BIOS. For more information, read this.
The new code in the specs string analysis part of RBE is not yet widely tested. After modifying and saving your BIOS, just load it into RBE once again and check the checksums (i.e. compare if both checksums of original BIOS and modified BIOS are alike).

Now enjoy using RBE!


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## Pappa (May 8, 2009)

BAGZZlash,

Thank you for the fast response and quick fix! I'll try it this weekend.

Pappa



BAGZZlash said:


> Problem is that MSI uses a line break inside the specs string. This is unusual and unexpected to RBE so it can't handle it.
> I used this occasion to improve this part of code in RBE which was long overdue. You can use this inofficial version to modify your BIOS. But be careful:
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## BAGZZlash (May 8, 2009)

Pappa said:


> BAGZZlash,
> 
> Thank you for the fast response and quick fix! I'll try it this weekend.
> 
> Pappa



Okay! 
Keep me updated, would you?


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## Pappa (May 11, 2009)

*UPDATE MSI 4890 RBE change*

BAGZZlash,

UPDATE: Used the revised version of RBE this weekend to "up" voltage on my msi 4890 OC.

It worked! Thanks!

Pappa



BAGZZlash said:


> Okay!
> Keep me updated, would you?


----------



## mike5 (Jun 2, 2009)

Thank you BAGZZlash!

This is an amazing piece of software. I managed to:
1. enhance the 2D Performance, what was needed, since the original card switches between 240 and 500 GPU and even sometimes 850 in 2D.
2. Reduced the RAM to fully enough constant 900 MHz.
3. Completely redone the fan-profile. Now my card stays silent all the time in 90 percent of usage. I believe my fan-profile is much better than the original! The manufacturer just want to be on the sure side.
Another thought: i strongly believe the original bios is only made to be fine in benchmarks, not to be fine in daily usage.

Again, BAGZZlash. you did a great job!

mike5


----------



## mike5 (Jun 2, 2009)

*Modified BIOS, works perfect!*


----------



## ViciousXUSMC (Jun 3, 2009)

Im back with new questions.  My last W90 was defective, many units where and I just got my replacment unit yesterday.

I was brave and took the 4870X2 that this unit comes with and tried an experiment.  it comes with two 4870M cards in crossfire and one has a master bios and one a slave bios.  No matter what we tried we could not get new drivers to work for the cards.  So we tried to flash the slave card to a master.

And it worked!  It gave us two 4870's in crossfire.

Now the old unit looked like this in Winflash after I flashed both cards to master - http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/3E9O3xdIIpu05_NhufinFA?feat=directlink

the thing to notice here are the "flash type" for both cards is the same.

Now my new unit I got has this - http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/zTGe1-EiR9lRlIi9aT30Zw?feat=directlink

The master card for what ever reason has a different flash type now.

Not thinking much of it since the CRC was the same, the bios size was the same, and figuring that the flash type was just the "type of flash" it used but the bios would be the same, I flashed my old modified bios over the new Master and it hung forever and never flashed.

When I rebooted I had the black screen with no video and broke my card.

Luckily i was able to recover.  because I had flashed the slave to a master first and even though it was hard as hell I was able to swap the cards around and reflash the original master bios back to the master via atiflash.

Was I just unlucky and had Winflash fail on me or does this "flash type" actually mean something significant?  Im almost afraid to mess with it anymore, but I figure if I edit the new bios instead of using my old one and use ATIFlash again that it should work (only was flashing the master to increase the overdrive limit)


----------



## john01john (Jul 25, 2009)

Spin up time----What does that mean?

4 or 2,Which one do you like?


----------



## VuurVOS (Jul 25, 2009)

john01john said:


> Spin up time----What does that mean?
> 
> 4 or 2,Which one do you like?


Spin up time is the time the fan gets to spin up. I like 4 because the fan gets a longer spin up cycle when the computer is powering on


----------



## Ben_UK (Aug 2, 2009)

Hey there,

Haven't really followed this thread in a while.

Can I just ask a very quick question?

Are the custom built 4870 boards still unmoddable via RBE?

Thanks.


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 3, 2009)

Ben_UK said:


> Hey there,
> 
> Haven't really followed this thread in a while.
> 
> ...


Little bit unclear but I think you mean the volt mod? If the card isn't using the right voltage regulators like Volterra VT11xx, then it isnt possible (yet). If you find away todo it with rivatuner etc then report it with all the info you have.


----------



## lowkickqop (Aug 5, 2009)

I flashed my XFX 4890 XXX bios and it went bad. I have been trying to restore the original bios. I have a backup. When I try to boot with the card in it just beeps. I unplugged the card from the pcie slot and plugged it back in and it actually showed up in my windows for a minute then I went into RBE editor and it showed my card but when i hit anaylyze flash windows crashed. I have unplugged it a few times since and cleaned the drivers. It has not showed up again since. Any idea how I can make it show up again? I have tried to use ati flash and followed the tutorial exactly. It did let me into my hard drive where I put the files but now it's saying invalid dir. So what can I do?


----------



## VuurVOS (Aug 5, 2009)

lowkickqop said:


> I flashed my XFX 4890 XXX bios and it went bad. I have been trying to restore the original bios. I have a backup. When I try to boot with the card in it just beeps. I unplugged the card from the pcie slot and plugged it back in and it actually showed up in my windows for a minute then I went into RBE editor and it showed my card but when i hit anaylyze flash windows crashed. I have unplugged it a few times since and cleaned the drivers. It has not showed up again since. Any idea how I can make it show up again? I have tried to use ati flash and followed the tutorial exactly. It did let me into my hard drive where I put the files but now it's saying invalid dir. So what can I do?



Very very long one liner. My tip. Make a new thread for clearly your problem and exlain how you got the invalid dir error. Use some screenshots. Sometimes an image can tell more than 1000 words. 

Otherwise I can't understand if you don't understand what you don't understand....even if I want to...


----------



## AJ Rimmer Bsc.Ssc. (Sep 29, 2009)

HIS [H487FN1GP] HD 4870 Fan 1GB (256bit) GDDR5 PCIe.  

virgin bios


hoping someone has a fan speed fix,as this is the 2 wire fan with no access to fan control,and it runs hotter than my arse when covered in custard.


----------



## BAGZZlash (Sep 29, 2009)

Sorry, RBE can't do magic. If it is a 2-wired fan, it is *not controllable*. Face it.


----------



## AJ Rimmer Bsc.Ssc. (Sep 29, 2009)

BAGZZlash said:


> Sorry, RBE can't do magic. If it is a 2-wired fan, it is *not controllable*. Face it.



i think your wrong there sir......

my mrs could control it,she trys to control everything...so i am aiming her at my card


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## glenboy (Oct 3, 2009)

hiya bagzz
i have 3 x 5850s coming and i want to open up the ccc limits to a much higher level but i'm sure that even an asustop 5850 won't have theccc limits i'm looking for i want 1200gpu and 1400 memory limit, could i use the signature file save from asustop 5870 and then use that sig file in rbe on the 5850 bios or might it work using the method 2 way,thanks in advance and RBE is a brilliant utility


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## BAGZZlash (Oct 3, 2009)

No, don't do that!
On the one hand, signature saving isn't working properly for 5xx0 cards anyway yet, on the other hand it has never been a good idea to interchange signatures among different video card types. Don't do it.


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## glenboy (Oct 3, 2009)

ok i'll wait a bit till rbe is updated and maybe there will be a few 5850 bioses to choose from then as well


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## Zíon (Oct 5, 2009)

BAGZZlash said:


> Sorry, RBE can't do magic. If it is a 2-wired fan, it is *not controllable*. Face it.


Not exactly true... mine has a 2-wired fan and fan control works fine.

I sent you an email a couple days ago (Oct 2nd) about 4870/4770/5770 programmable VRM
Pls check your mail !


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## newfellow (Oct 5, 2009)

Since when has GPU fans have had 3 pins?

Anyway, just checked RBE seems, damn nice software. Tested all sort of BIOS editors in past couple days for ATI cards seems this one actually works very well and has all the features needed to tweak these cards.

Although, I am wondering does the hardware rule nr.1 apply here still "Always flash in DOS". Kinda have still something even against to MB BIOS flashing on OS.


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## A64 Now! (Oct 16, 2009)

hello BAGZZlash

I have a question for you,Could you please help me?
i have send a PN @ you


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## overclocking101 (Oct 16, 2009)

ok i flash rbe modded bios to my 4870 512mb and it shows clock speed of 80mhz! and it was set to be 800. i used the over/underclocking utility in rbe. maybe this has something to do with it??


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## BAGZZlash (Oct 16, 2009)

overclocking101 said:


> ok i flash rbe modded bios to my 4870 512mb and it shows clock speed of 80mhz! and it was set to be 800. i used the over/underclocking utility in rbe. maybe this has something to do with it??



You mean you used the clocking wizard? Could you post the modded BIOS?


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## A64 Now! (Oct 16, 2009)

ok


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## Methanoid (Oct 20, 2009)

*Tricking OS on VGA ID*

Is it possible to flash a modded BIOS to a Radeon HD4650 to persuade the OS that its in fact a HD4670? Presumably changing the chip to RV730XT and the Videocard ID to HD4670?

You may think this is a mad thing to do (when leaving the clocks unchanged and when 4650s have DDR2/3 and 4670s have DDR3/4/5) but there is a good reason. Apple are now using 4670 in the new iMac and hence there will be drivers for the 4670 in OSX. Unfortunately there is (and won't ever be) no low profile HD4670 so all I have is a 4650 but I'd like to run an OSX Hackintosh.

So it would be nice to persuade OSX that my 4650 is a 4670!


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## BAGZZlash (Oct 20, 2009)

As far as I know, Mac-video-cards are kind of incompatible to those used in PCs. All I can suggest is to flash a genuine-Mac-4670-BIOS to your 4650.


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## W1zzard (Oct 20, 2009)

Methanoid said:


> Is it possible to flash a modded BIOS to a Radeon HD4650 to persuade the OS that its in fact a HD4670? Presumably changing the chip to RV730XT and the Videocard ID to HD4670?
> 
> You may think this is a mad thing to do (when leaving the clocks unchanged and when 4650s have DDR2/3 and 4670s have DDR3/4/5) but there is a good reason. Apple are now using 4670 in the new iMac and hence there will be drivers for the 4670 in OSX. Unfortunately there is (and won't ever be) no low profile HD4670 so all I have is a 4650 but I'd like to run an OSX Hackintosh.
> 
> So it would be nice to persuade OSX that my 4650 is a 4670!



did you try with the normal drivers? chances are they still support the card, otherwise try to look for something similar to a windows inf file that specifies which device ids are supported by a driver, or grab a hex editor and try to replace the 4670 device id with the 4650 device id in the driver


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## BAGZZlash (Oct 21, 2009)

W1zzard said:


> [...] or grab a hex editor and try to replace the 4670 device id with the 4650 device id in the driver


This will most likely not work due to the hash protected digest zone in the BIOS.


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## W1zzard (Oct 21, 2009)

in the driver, not the bios. but dunno if it must be digitally signed on macos


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## BAGZZlash (Oct 21, 2009)

W1zzard said:


> in the driver, not the bios.


Sorry, didn't read thoroughly.


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## dante`afk (Apr 14, 2010)

any1 can help on this ?



dante`afk said:


> hmm, this is somehow strange
> 
> the stock vcore on stockclocks with stock bios is for load 1.1250. but this voltage is not recorded in the bios.
> 
> ...




short discussion from here http://forums.techpowerup.com/showthread.php?t=120022


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## tor [tt] (May 19, 2010)

Hi everyone, I have a strange problem with RBE, or maybe I have a lack of knowledge, well, the thing is I have two 4890 in crossfire and I can't switch the fans to the factory defaults using RBE. Before I decided to switch back I had been using modified bioses with no problems for a very long time(the only thing I changed was fan control). So my action are the following- I take the native bioses(which were taken from my cards by RBE and were not modified), then I open them by RBE, I go to the Fan Settings and I see that RBE puts incorretc values on the graph(the speed of the fan is too high for such a small temparature). What shal I do? Is there a way to go back to the factory default fan settings?
PS I tried flashing those unmodified bioses but to no vail- the noise was horrible


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## kakarott007 (Jun 24, 2010)

hi guys. could somebody tell me if there are any chances to see memory voltage tweaks for 5850/5870 in RBE sometime soon?


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## mechtech (Jun 25, 2010)

New XFX 4770 bios directly from xfx support.  Can't upload through gpuz cause its not on the card yet.  SO here you go.


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