# Asus AM5 X670E price is an extortion



## AM4isGOD (Aug 19, 2022)

https://www.pcgamer.com/x670e-asus-pricing-leak/

What a ridiculous price. Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich.


----------



## jesdals (Aug 19, 2022)

Well show them your restraint then


----------



## freeagent (Aug 19, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> What a ridiculous price. Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich


Generally ROG stuff isn't mainstream.. they always carry a steeper price.

Any word on what the others are doing pricewise? Bet they are getting up there too..


----------



## cvaldes (Aug 19, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich.


Modern DIY PC building is mostly for the rich these days regardless of the CPU socket.

The era of cheap CPUs and GPUs is past. Pandemic-related supply chain cost increases and inflation aren't going to bring back the Good Ol' Days anytime in the immediate future.

That said, you can still piece together a stellar performing PC today. Buyers need to reframe their budgets to today's reality. That's not a one-time exercise, this needs to be done on a regular basis.


----------



## ir_cow (Aug 19, 2022)

The only way to "fight" back is just not to buy. The next socket may be cheaper. But most likely it will be the same or more expensive.


----------



## cvaldes (Aug 19, 2022)

I doubt if competitive Intel-based motherboards will be substantially cheaper.

Let's face it, either accept the higher price points or sit on the sidelines until AM5 motherboards come down in price. 

The latter might take a couple of years. B650 based mobos are expected to be cheaper than the X670E models, but my current understanding is that overclocking is not a feature of the B650 chipset. Only time will tell whether or not this claim is true, we haven't seen any B650-based boards in the market.


----------



## Zach_01 (Aug 20, 2022)

Let’s just see those prices again when the platform launch officially happens with availability around the globe

Price postings from a couple of retailers or a hype does not tell me much. Maybe they thinking of laying the ground for overpricing and user digestion. Don’t fall for that and don’t buy overpriced just because it’s the next best thing


----------



## Kissamies (Aug 20, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> https://www.pcgamer.com/x670e-asus-pricing-leak/
> 
> What a ridiculous price. Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich.


How about posting the thing, not just the link?



> Early pricing for AMD's upcoming X670E and X670 motherboards briefly appeared on a German reseller's site suggesting that upgrading to Zen 4 is going to be a very costly affair. This was already expected to some extent due to the shift to DDR5 and the fact that the first motherboard chipsets are high-end offerings.
> 
> If the pricing for the Asus motherboards on the site are real, you're looking at paying up to €1,475 ($1,499) for the top Asus ROG Crosshair X670E Extreme (opens in new tab) motherboard and €483 ($490) for the most affordable Asus Prime X670-P offering. Gulp.


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 20, 2022)

Who would have guessed these ridiculous designs with a trillion redundant features would eventually get to a gargantuan price point? Who in the honest hell other than advanced case modders need an OLED panel for pretty graphics on the motherboard? Back in my day a ultra high end motherboard spared no expense in the things that actually mattered, like the CPU VRM area or storage connectivity ports.

I guess the last no nonsense ultra high end motherboard coming from Asus for a modern socket is the Crosshair VI Extreme. I can't wait for some money loaded fella to upgrade to AM5 and list theirs for a nice price.


----------



## ir_cow (Aug 20, 2022)

Dr. Dro said:


> Who would have guessed these ridiculous designs with a trillion redundant features would eventually get to a gargantuan price point? Who in the honest hell other than advanced case modders need an OLED panel for pretty graphics on the motherboard? Back in my day a ultra high end motherboard spared no expense in the things that actually mattered, like the CPU VRM area or storage connectivity ports.
> 
> I guess the last no nonsense ultra high end motherboard coming from Asus for a modern socket is the Crosshair VI Extreme. I can't wait for some money loaded fella to upgrade to AM5 and list theirs for a nice price.


Once you increase the PCB layer count and add more MOSFETTs, not much left to do.


----------



## silentbogo (Aug 20, 2022)

freeagent said:


> Generally ROG stuff isn't mainstream.. they always carry a steeper price.
> 
> Any word on what the others are doing pricewise? Bet they are getting up there too..


I think the point was not to point fingers at the top, but to show a supposed price spread from asus, where something like Prime variant that's been considered "as mainstream as it gets" will cost half-a-grand. 
MSI leak also does not bring optimism to the table.








						Pricing for MSI X670 Motherboards Leaked, Lowest End Variant Costs up to 374 Euros
					

Following the recent Ryzen 7000 leaks, momomo_us now shared the MSI X670 motherboard listing on Twitter. What a day for leaks! It appears that some




					appuals.com
				



With current info the starting point will be around $350, which is more than I paid for my entire x470 combo(minus GPU), or nearly twice as much as I paid for my x570 "sidegrade".


----------



## TheLostSwede (Aug 20, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> https://www.pcgamer.com/x670e-asus-pricing-leak/
> 
> What a ridiculous price. Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich.


That's not the real pricing.
See my news piece about the Gigabyte boards from Computex and add 10% and that's where the board prices should end up.
Obviously, Asus will be 20-30% more than that, but that's already the norm.


----------



## puma99dk| (Aug 20, 2022)

This is kinda why I want the B650 boards to be released with the X670/670E which will lead to more people moving to Zen 4 because 9 out of 10 people will proper go B650 instead of X670E and some will go X670 depending on prices.


----------



## cvaldes (Aug 20, 2022)

puma99dk| said:


> This is kinda why I want the B650 boards to be released with the X670/670E which will lead to more people moving to Zen 4 because 9 out of 10 people will proper go B650 instead of X670E and some will go X670 depending on prices.


It will sort itself out in time.

It's fine that AMD and their motherboard partners release the X670E boards first to well-moneyed early adopters until manufacturers can improve silicon yields, AMD can improve the AGESA, and prices come down from stratospheric levels. Was it the same when AM4 debuted?

ASUS is staggering the release of their X670 boards. There will eventually be ProArt and Prime boards as the new platform trickles down to consumer levels.

Remember that it's not just the board cost, it's also minimally the CPU and RAM as well.


----------



## silentbogo (Aug 20, 2022)

cvaldes said:


> Was it the same when AM4 debuted?


Not really. The whole point of 300/400-series was "cheap and fast", which played out nicely for AMD, given that people were willing to ignore things like broken XMP/AMP and other small issues. 
500-series started out a bit expensive, but quickly leveled-out to more acceptable prices.
Now, this situation is different: new socket, new platform, and there is no longer an option to settle for a "cheaper last-gen board".


----------



## Toothless (Aug 20, 2022)

"Only for the rich."

Learn to save money. You kids and your avocado toasts and Starbucks.


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 20, 2022)

Will AM5 mean years of Ageesa updates/fixes though. Hopefully not so much.

"Learn to save money" try saying that to all those struggling with high bills ATM and see how funny it is.


----------



## Toothless (Aug 20, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> Will AM5 mean years of Ageesa updates/fixes though. Hopefully not so much.
> 
> "Learn to save money" try saying that to all those struggling with high bills ATM and see how funny it is.


I am struggling with bills. I work extra to afford the toys I want. It's pretty funny.


----------



## chr0nos (Aug 20, 2022)

Toothless said:


> I am struggling with bills. I work extra to afford the toys I want. It's pretty funny.


try that with a salary of $25 USD daily, only 5 days of the week....


----------



## P4-630 (Aug 20, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> What a ridiculous price. Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich.



Or get one of these: https://wccftech.com/gigabyte-x670e...led-flagship-x670-aorus-xtreme-around-500-us/


----------



## thesmokingman (Aug 20, 2022)

He's just pissed that his username is tied to AM4 now that AM5 is god.


----------



## P4-630 (Aug 20, 2022)

thesmokingman said:


> He's just pissed that his username is tied to AM4 now that AM5 is god.


We don't know yet but he could change it if he wants to...


----------



## Toothless (Aug 21, 2022)

chr0nos said:


> try that with a salary of $25 USD daily, only 5 days of the week....


K, I make $25/hr and normally work five days a week. Your point isn't valid besides I can work overtime if I want to.

Reread what you said. Maybe it's time to move?


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 21, 2022)

Toothless said:


> K, I make $25/hr and normally work five days a week. Your point isn't valid besides I can work overtime if I want to.
> 
> Reread what you said. Maybe it's time to move?



He meant daily though, and in most of the Americas that is a high end salary


----------



## AlwaysHope (Aug 21, 2022)

Affordability for new AM5 socket motherboards is a relative term, mostly confined to the 1st world. Perspective is everything.


----------



## chr0nos (Aug 21, 2022)

Toothless said:


> K, I make $25/hr and normally work five days a week. Your point isn't valid besides I can work overtime if I want to.
> 
> Reread what you said. Maybe it's time to move?


move he says, with that salary... LOL


----------



## Toothless (Aug 21, 2022)

chr0nos said:


> move he says, with that salary... LOL


Something something.. swimming?


----------



## Mussels (Aug 21, 2022)

Pre release prices are ALWAYS high, and the tax on the premium parts is always there


Aussie prices here, but the spread from top to bottom within a chipset is massive


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 21, 2022)

P4-630 said:


> We don't know yet but he could change it if he wants to...



Won't  be changing it, Tigger died, thought i'd have a AMD related name this time


----------



## GerKNG (Aug 21, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> What a ridiculous price. Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich.


that's like complaining about mercedes having the S-Class.

what about X670, B650?


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 21, 2022)

GerKNG said:


> that's like complaining about mercedes having the S-Class.
> 
> what about X670, B650?



What chipset is the S-class then? bit of a difference between a car price and a expensive motherboard.

It's more like complaining because a tech company charge a higher price for a luxury class release product


----------



## xtreemchaos (Aug 21, 2022)

i look forward to getting one in 5 years or so, im as poor as a church mouse with a wooden leg. but all comes to those who wait or so thay say. im not fazed at the price to be honest for a top board thay all start out that way.


----------



## Assimilator (Aug 21, 2022)

Toothless said:


> Something something.. swimming?


Your lack of concern for those less fortunate than yourself is offensive in every possible way.


----------



## Toothless (Aug 21, 2022)

Assimilator said:


> Your lack of concern for those less fortunate than yourself is offensive in every possible way.


This is hardly the place to discuss things such as that. It's offensive for you to assume I have a lack of concern. Topic dropped and maybe you should follow that.


----------



## phill (Aug 21, 2022)

Please everyone, play nice    Its not rock solid or set in stone...  Time for a brew and a biscuit!!


----------



## Toothless (Aug 21, 2022)

phill said:


> Please everyone, play nice    Its not rock solid or set in stone...  Time for a brew and a biscuit!!


I like a mocha frappes and donuts. Do I get one of those? They're easy on the gums.


----------



## Gmr_Chick (Aug 21, 2022)

Dr. Dro said:


> Who would have guessed these ridiculous designs with a trillion redundant features would eventually get to a gargantuan price point? Who in the honest hell other than advanced case modders need an OLED panel for pretty graphics on the motherboard? Back in my day a ultra high end motherboard spared no expense in the things that actually mattered, like the CPU VRM area or storage connectivity ports.
> 
> *I guess the last no nonsense ultra high end motherboard coming from Asus for a modern socket is the Crosshair VI Extreme. *I can't wait for some money loaded fella to upgrade to AM5 and list theirs for a nice price.



Louder for da peeps in da back!  

I consider myself apart of the OG Ryzen gang -- I remember the MASSIVE amount of teething issues AM4 had, especially in regards to memory (everybody HAD to have GSkill's Flare X sticks because it was one of the few that was actually guaranteed to work on the new platform, but even then you still had to keep your fingers crossed). I remember getting the R5 1600 and wondering what to pair it with. My dad (RIP) ended up getting me the Crosshair VI Hero, a board I still love to this day even though I no longer have one. At the time, spending $230 to $250+ on a board...well, it was considered high-end, and the VI Hero was about as good at it got back then. Until the drool-worthy VI Extreme came along to supplant it, anyway. I guess what I'm trying to say is, back then you got a whole lot more for your money, but not anymore. Now, $200 is -- if you're lucky -- the entry level price you're going to pay if you want a board that isn't total wouldn't-even-trust-an-i3/R3-on-it level dogshit. 

I used to get so excited picking out parts for a build, buying them, etc. And now it's like, with everything so far out of reach in terms of pricing, all I find myself thinking about now is the crazy board prices vs. what you're actually getting for all that money. You're either getting a fuckton of mostly useless features with insane power phases and giant VRM heatsinks, or boards so stripped that they look like they'll burst into flames if you even so much as look at them funny. And that just makes me really sad.


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 22, 2022)

Gmr_Chick said:


> Louder for da peeps in da back!
> 
> I consider myself apart of the OG Ryzen gang -- I remember the MASSIVE amount of teething issues AM4 had, especially in regards to memory (everybody HAD to have GSkill's Flare X sticks because it was one of the few that was actually guaranteed to work on the new platform, but even then you still had to keep your fingers crossed). I remember getting the R5 1600 and wondering what to pair it with. My dad (RIP) ended up getting me the Crosshair VI Hero, a board I still love to this day even though I no longer have one. At the time, spending $230 to $250+ on a board...well, it was considered high-end, and the VI Hero was about as good at it got back then. Until the drool-worthy VI Extreme came along to supplant it, anyway. I guess what I'm trying to say is, back then you got a whole lot more for your money, but not anymore. Now, $200 is -- if you're lucky -- the entry level price you're going to pay if you want a board that isn't total wouldn't-even-trust-an-i3/R3-on-it level dogshit.
> 
> I used to get so excited picking out parts for a build, buying them, etc. And now it's like, with everything so far out of reach in terms of pricing, all I find myself thinking about now is the crazy board prices vs. what you're actually getting for all that money. You're either getting a fuckton of mostly useless features with insane power phases and giant VRM heatsinks, or boards so stripped that they look like they'll burst into flames if you even so much as look at them funny. And that just makes me really sad.



I had a Hero too, ended up side grading to the B550-E because AMD pulled that stunt and refused to supply motherboard manufacturers with updated AGESA for the X370. The C6H had like 14 USB ports, and the type you actually want to have too... imagine that. 

A chance appeared to grab a VIII Impact for a nice price here, which is also a no nonsense board but I'm getting second thoughts because I have 4 16 GB sticks and I'd obviously have to downgrade to 32 GB... mini ITX format and all that.


----------



## Mussels (Aug 22, 2022)

phill said:


> Please everyone, play nice  Its not rock solid or set in stone... Time for a brew and a biscuit!!


ROCK AND STONE!
Too much DRG.

These boards come out with insane prices and no stock, so that early reviews make Asus look great for AM5.

Then the launch boards come out still overpriced but cheaper, with inferior everything - and people who never bother reading past the brand name to the product itself, will gobble them up.

It's common for all brands


----------



## Gmr_Chick (Aug 22, 2022)

Dr. Dro said:


> I had a Hero too, ended up side grading to the B550-E because AMD pulled that stunt and refused to supply motherboard manufacturers with updated AGESA for the X370. *The C6H had like 14 USB ports, *and the type you actually want to have too... imagine that.
> 
> *A chance appeared to grab a VIII Impact for a nice price here, which is also a no nonsense board* but I'm getting second thoughts because I have 4 16 GB sticks and I'd obviously have to downgrade to 32 GB... mini ITX format and all that.



That's one of the reasons I loved the VI Hero - all those rear USB ports!  I think it had 4 of each - 4x USB 2.0 and 4x USB 3.0 - didn't it? Unless you had A LOT of USB devices, the VI Hero pretty much had you set for life, lol.

I briefly had the VIII Impact a couple years ago...damn fine board it was, but an awkward size. At least Asus could say they were the only big motherboard maker to feature a Mini-DTX board in their AM4 line up. But in typical ASUS fashion, such a privilege cost an arm and a leg. To be fair though, it did feature everything but the kitchen sink for such a small board.

Anyway, the main thing I want to see all the big motherboard markers make for AM5 is Micro-ATX boards. Well...scratch that. I want the big makers to make *GOOD* Micro-ATX boards for AM5, just like they do for Intel. But it's kinda sad how even Micro-ATX is even dying on the Intel side nowdays, which is kinda baffling. I mean, I feel like it's a nice middle ground -- you get all the features of a fullsize board, but don't sacrifice too much like with Mini-ITX, especially where the rear I/O is concerned. So yeah, I want to see more Micro-ATX for AM5.


----------



## TheLostSwede (Aug 22, 2022)

Gmr_Chick said:


> Anyway, the main thing I want to see all the big motherboard markers make for AM5 is Micro-ATX boards. Well...scratch that. I want the big makers to make *GOOD* Micro-ATX boards for AM5, just like they do for Intel. But it's kinda sad how even Micro-ATX is even dying on the Intel side nowdays, which is kinda baffling. I mean, I feel like it's a nice middle ground -- you get all the features of a fullsize board, but don't sacrifice too much like with Mini-ITX, especially where the rear I/O is concerned. So yeah, I want to see more Micro-ATX for AM5.


Gigabyte has four B650 mATX boards planned, with a couple of Aorus boards, which should be a bit better than what we've seen so far. Nothing really high-end though.


----------



## mama (Aug 22, 2022)

xtreemchaos said:


> i look forward to getting one in 5 years or so, im as poor as a church mouse with a wooden leg. but all comes to those who wait or so thay say. im not fazed at the price to be honest for a top board thay all start out that way.


You don't look like a church mouse.


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 22, 2022)

Gmr_Chick said:


> That's one of the reasons I loved the VI Hero - all those rear USB ports!  I think it had 4 of each - 4x USB 2.0 and 4x USB 3.0 - didn't it? Unless you had A LOT of USB devices, the VI Hero pretty much had you set for life, lol.
> 
> I briefly had the VIII Impact a couple years ago...damn fine board it was, but an awkward size. At least Asus could say they were the only big motherboard maker to feature a Mini-DTX board in their AM4 line up. But in typical ASUS fashion, such a privilege cost an arm and a leg. To be fair though, it did feature everything but the kitchen sink for such a small board.
> 
> Anyway, the main thing I want to see all the big motherboard markers make for AM5 is Micro-ATX boards. Well...scratch that. I want the big makers to make *GOOD* Micro-ATX boards for AM5, just like they do for Intel. But it's kinda sad how even Micro-ATX is even dying on the Intel side nowdays, which is kinda baffling. I mean, I feel like it's a nice middle ground -- you get all the features of a fullsize board, but don't sacrifice too much like with Mini-ITX, especially where the rear I/O is concerned. So yeah, I want to see more Micro-ATX for AM5.



Ughh I am so tempted, so, so tempted... the guy is asking about the same as a B550-F goes for on it and it's in mint condition, especially now that AM5 is about to drop, high end AM4 motherboards will eventually begin to dry up and that is such an interesting board, strong VRM, hardware buttons and compact form factor... I would slap my 5950X in it and call it a day. The only thing is that I have two Dominator Platinum kits in both cases i'd be with either 8 or 32 GB, which is half their capacity 

I agree with good micro ATX boards, but seems like that's a format that is usually relegated to budget machines for some reason.


----------



## Chomiq (Aug 22, 2022)

Nothing burger. We had same stories before with prices on listings pulled out of the ass before official launch.


----------



## silentbogo (Aug 22, 2022)

TheLostSwede said:


> Gigabyte has four B650 mATX boards planned, with a couple of Aorus boards, which should be a bit better than what we've seen so far. Nothing really high-end though.


There was also a "photoshoot" of AsRock B650 boards, which in the best traditions of the company are sharing PCB with x670 counterparts. May be one of the cheaper options, but I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for B650-based GB Aorus lineup. GB may had some f#$%ups in other hardware areas over the past few years, but they really pulled their s$%^t together in enthusiast motherboard segment.


----------



## Dirt Chip (Aug 22, 2022)

The main factor will the $$$ difference between intel and AMD mobo`s.
And to a more important degree the cost of CPU+mobo+DDR5 of blue vs. red.

Just ~4 more month to know...


----------



## DeathtoGnomes (Aug 22, 2022)

I have to say this whole thread is nothing but FUD starting with the clickbait.  Look what the conversation dove into, moaning about wages and who earns what. One conversation was worth reading, I wont point out the obvious here.


----------



## dgianstefani (Aug 22, 2022)

Who cares? AMD early adopter advantage has always just been AGESA bugs and hardware issues in the CPUs, at least for the first year or so. Even longer if you intend to upgrade to newer cpu generations. 

From what it seems am4 isn't dead yet and may get more 3dcache chips or even a backported zen4. 

Even so, the 5800x3d and 5950x are more than capable for pretty much any gaming or workstation task today. 

But sure. Tell me more about how you *need* pcie 5 when random reads on ssds haven't broken 100MB yet (farewell optane, you'll be missed), and gpus barely saturate pcie 3 x16.


----------



## Mussels (Aug 22, 2022)

dgianstefani said:


> Who cares? AMD early adopter advantage has always just been AGESA bugs and hardware issues in the CPUs, at least for the first year or so. Even longer if you intend to upgrade to newer cpu generations.
> 
> From what it seems am4 isn't dead yet and may get more 3dcache chips or even a backported zen4.
> 
> ...


Don't you mean all early hardware?


----------



## dgianstefani (Aug 22, 2022)

Mussels said:


> Don't you mean all early hardware?


Not really. Intel and Nvidia, both with some exceptions, have their shit together on launch, with issues generally resolved within a month or two of updates. Take the boosting algorithm "hardware flaw" in rtx 3000, or bios issues with recent Intel CPUs. 

Its not "early hardware" its launched hardware. These things should and can be fixed in testing. 

However with Zen... USB issues 3 years after release, audio issues, cores not boosting, etc etc. 

I wouldn't say RX graphics have a different story, although their drivers have improved in general, they still have issues that were present on launch day and we're almost at the release of a new generation. Their shadowplay equivalent for example is still a joke.

Another example would be thunderbolt on AMD which is still a coin flip if it will work correctly if you're doing something complex, like using a docking station with lots of things connected etc. 

Point is these things are advertised and they aren't ready. 

Reason why RX graphics a good deal cheaper than RTX? Despite raster competitiveness, the experience is better with nvidia in general, and people are willing to pay for that.


----------



## Mussels (Aug 22, 2022)

dgianstefani said:


> Not really. Intel and Nvidia, both with some exceptions, have their shit together on launch, with issues generally resolved within a month or two of updates. Take the boosting algorithm "hardware flaw" in rtx 3000, or bios issues with recent Intel CPUs.
> 
> Its not "early hardware" its launched hardware. These things should and can be fixed in testing.
> 
> ...


Yeah i'm just gunna laugh at that.

Go look at how the Arc launch is going. Or the exploding 30 series cards. Or gigabytes exploding PSUs.
Hell just search exploding PC hardware and enjoy the ride.


----------



## dgianstefani (Aug 22, 2022)

Mussels said:


> Yeah i'm just gunna laugh at that.
> 
> Go look at how the Arc launch is going. Or the exploding 30 series cards. Or gigabytes exploding PSUs.
> Hell just search exploding PC hardware and enjoy the ride.


Intel is producing its first gpu for consumers and you're surprised? We're talking about zen, core, RX, and rtx here and you know that. AMD has been producing cpus and gpus for decades.

The fact you're comparing AMDs attitude to timeliness in supporting the cpus which brought them back from the brink of bankruptcy, to a single oem's failed psu implementation as some kind of "that's acceptable" because other companies have fuck ups too" attitude is... Concerning. You're a mod, maybe think like one.

Another cogent point would be that if Intel wanted a bug free architecture for their introduction into GPU maybe they shouldn't have hired an ex AMD engineer.


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 22, 2022)

I'm gonna have to agree with AM4's bumpy ride and still unresolved issues... there's one bug in AGESA right now that makes overclocking a pain due to it causing throttling once EDC exceeds processor fused value, it has been there on all versions later than 1.2.0.3c and it's really a bother... the USB bug, oh god that was a nasty one... and the lies from PR, all of that are things I will 100% account for

Radeon's getting their stuff together though. They have my full vote of confidence.


----------



## mama (Aug 22, 2022)

dgianstefani said:


> Intel is producing its first gpu for consumers and you're surprised? We're talking about zen, core, RX, and rtx here and you know that. AMD has been producing cpus and gpus for decades.
> 
> The fact you're comparing AMDs attitude to timeliness in supporting the cpus which brought them back from the brink of bankruptcy, to a single oem's failed psu implementation as some kind of "that's acceptable" because other companies have fuck ups too" attitude is... Concerning. You're a mod, maybe think like one.
> 
> Another cogent point would be that if Intel wanted a bug free architecture for their introduction into GPU maybe they shouldn't have hired an ex AMD engineer.


Or maybe they should have hired someone from Nvidia?


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 22, 2022)

Dr. Dro said:


> I'm gonna have to agree with AM4's bumpy ride and still unresolved issues... there's one bug in AGESA right now that makes overclocking a pain due to it causing throttling once EDC exceeds processor fused value, it has been there on all versions later than 1.2.0.3c and it's really a bother... the USB bug, oh god that was a nasty one... and the lies from PR, all of that are things I will 100% account for
> 
> Radeon's getting their stuff together though. They have my full vote of confidence.



Strangely, mostly Intel stuff just works from launch, not  really counting the Asus motherboard problem which was not Intels  fault.

I will be buying AM5 from launch, just hope  it goes as smoothly as the ADL one did for me, worked out of the boxes with zero problems ever.


----------



## Sunny and 75 (Aug 22, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> What a ridiculous price. Guess AM5 ROG will be only for the rich.


That's called early adopter tax, it has always been and going to be so, for AM5 (1718) when the platform comes out in September this year and will remain to be so for LGA1851 in Q4 2023 when MTL-S launches and every other product release that brings *real *performance and technological uplift.

Not necessarily related but the recent mining boom for example took like 20 months to perish. In general, it takes like 6 weeks to 6 months for new product releases to stabilize in terms of pricing and availability.


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 22, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> Strangely, mostly Intel stuff just works from launch, not  really counting the Asus motherboard problem which was not Intels  fault.
> 
> I will be buying AM5 from launch, just hope  it goes as smoothly as the ADL one did for me, worked out of the boxes with zero problems ever.



This upgrade round will be Navi 31 + an OLED display for me. I could maybe get a X570 motherboard (such as the C8I I mentioned earlier) if I find a Crosshair series board for a great deal, but that'd be about as far as I could stretch. To tell you the truth, I just want high frame rate 4K gaming, and I guess with Navi 31 my PC as it stands could do that for me. Otherwise most of my computing needs are met by a Core 2 Duo or something.


----------



## xtreemchaos (Aug 22, 2022)

mama said:


> You don't look like a church mouse.


ive got me cat suit on to keep the other mice away from my church, its a mouse eat mouse world   .


----------



## Palladium (Aug 22, 2022)

I don't give a flying expletive to overpriced halo products with spotty QC like the much cheaper ones anyway soooo...


----------



## Chomiq (Aug 22, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> Strangely, mostly Intel stuff just works from launch,











						Intel Alder Lake gaming CPUs can’t play some PC games, but there is a fix
					

Intel's new gaming processors are causing problems in some gaming PCs, thanks to DRM incompatibilies




					www.pcgamesn.com
				











						Intel Promises Improved DX11 & Legacy API Gaming Performance on Arc GPUs
					

Intel has confirmed that they will be bringing improved DX11 & Legacy API gaming performance to Arc GPUs in a recent video.




					wccftech.com


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 22, 2022)

Chomiq said:


> Intel Alder Lake gaming CPUs can’t play some PC games, but there is a fix
> 
> 
> Intel's new gaming processors are causing problems in some gaming PCs, thanks to DRM incompatibilies
> ...



In their defense, the DRM compatibility issue was not Intel's fault: it was restricted to some third-party DRM engines and applications that understandably never saw a host processor with a hybrid architecture and two CPUIDs with mismatching instruction sets. Alder Lake is the first such design to mass market, preceded only by the relatively rare Lakefield (Core i5-L16G7) mobile processor that had 1 Sunny Cove P-core and 4 Tremont E-cores (funnily enough this was also the first and so far only Foveros 3D-stacked product to ship), and all likelihood the same issues with Denuvo and other anti-tamper or DRM software also occurred on Lakefield, except that it had no strength for gaming and only really shipped in one Samsung laptop as far as I'm aware.









						Intel® Core™ i5-L16G7 Processor (4M Cache, up to 3.0GHz) - Product Specifications | Intel
					

Intel® Core™ i5-L16G7 Processor (4M Cache, up to 3.0GHz) quick reference with specifications, features, and technologies.




					www.intel.com
				




Arc's software is a mess, but did anyone have honest beliefs that their driver stack would be as mature as AMD's, let alone NVIDIA's on launch day? That would never happen.


----------



## Vayra86 (Aug 22, 2022)

It never ceases to amaze me how people consider PC hardware upgrades some sort of human rights issue whenever the price doesnt fit their budget.

Entitlement generation and then wondering why prices soar to new heights... idiocy at its finest.

Exercising consumer power most often means: dont buy, wait until the deal suits you instead.


----------



## Chomiq (Aug 22, 2022)

Dr. Dro said:


> Arc's software is a mess, but did anyone have honest beliefs that their driver stack would be as mature as AMD's, let alone NVIDIA's on launch day? That would never happen.











						Intel DG1 GPU Specs
					

768 Cores, 48 TMUs, 24 ROPs




					www.techpowerup.com


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 22, 2022)

Chomiq said:


> Intel Alder Lake gaming CPUs can’t play some PC games, but there is a fix
> 
> 
> Intel's new gaming processors are causing problems in some gaming PCs, thanks to DRM incompatibilies
> ...



How many ageesa updates have there been? AM4 still is not perfect, it never will be.

ARC is not even out yet so irrelevant


----------



## P4-630 (Aug 22, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> Strangely, mostly Intel stuff just works from launch


This is the experience I have with intel since 2006, no tweaking needed to run at it's default best and no memory (XMP) issues.


----------



## Chomiq (Aug 22, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> How many ageesa updates have there been? AM4 still is not perfect, it never will be.
> 
> ARC is not even out yet so irrelevant











						ASRock Challenger Arc A380 Video Card A380 CLI 6G OC - Newegg.com
					

Buy ASRock Challenger Arc A380 6GB GDDR6 PCI Express 4.0 ITX Video Card A380 CLI 6G OC with fast shipping and top-rated customer service. Once you know, you Newegg!




					www.newegg.com


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 22, 2022)

P4-630 said:


> This is the experience I have with intel since 2006, no tweaking needed to run at it's default best and no memory (XMP) issues.



This is exactly my point.


----------



## Chomiq (Aug 22, 2022)

P4-630 said:


> This is the experience I have with intel since 2006, no tweaking needed to run at it's default best and no memory (XMP) issues.


Seeing how XMP is literally a standard introduced by Intel I wouldn't expect any issues on Intel cpu's. Still, somehow magically almost everyone having memory/XMP issues on AMD has a Corsair kit.


----------



## Sunny and 75 (Aug 22, 2022)

Vayra86 said:


> Exercising consumer power most often means: *dont buy, wait until the deal suits you instead.*


Couldn't agree more!


----------



## Dr. Dro (Aug 22, 2022)

Chomiq said:


> Intel DG1 GPU Specs
> 
> 
> 768 Cores, 48 TMUs, 24 ROPs
> ...



DG1 was a prototype, the closest thing to it being Tiger Lake as far as I'm aware. It also largely runs on the existing code base for older iGPUs, iirc.


----------



## jesdals (Aug 22, 2022)

I cant help to wonder if the next gen motherboards with dual chipset just is a easy fix for getting an on die gpu in next gen cpus and that with better production quality / lower nm production we will se a revision / version with only one chipset? Perhaps a indication that the AM5 socket simply is to small to fit all the ambition on the AMD team?


----------



## Chomiq (Aug 22, 2022)

Dr. Dro said:


> DG1 was a prototype, the closest thing to it being Tiger Lake as far as I'm aware. It also largely runs on the existing code base for older iGPUs, iirc.


Ah yes, I forgot that them having decades of experience making iGPU drivers doesn't count.


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 22, 2022)

Chomiq said:


> Seeing how XMP is literally a standard introduced by Intel I wouldn't expect any issues on Intel cpu's. Still, somehow magically almost everyone having memory/XMP issues on AMD has a Corsair kit.



excuses


----------



## Palladium (Aug 22, 2022)

Chomiq said:


> Seeing how XMP is literally a standard introduced by Intel I wouldn't expect any issues on Intel cpu's. Still, somehow magically almost everyone having memory/XMP issues on AMD has a Corsair kit.



_Technically_ XMP worked on my old 8700K and Corsair LPX..If I ignored the ungodly high 1.3V running through the SA.


----------



## Vayra86 (Aug 22, 2022)

Chomiq said:


> Ah yes, I forgot that them having decades of experience making iGPU drivers doesn't count.


It literally does not count - they had to conclude very late in their development of ARC that those drivers dont work for their discrete line up - at all.

Their decades worth of experience caused them to not even know this beforehand, go figure. They now have only the most rudimentary support to run games at all, entirely leaning on devs to implement DX12 proper; anything earlier runs like horse shit moving uphill


----------



## TheLostSwede (Aug 24, 2022)

silentbogo said:


> There was also a "photoshoot" of AsRock B650 boards, which in the best traditions of the company are sharing PCB with x670 counterparts. May be one of the cheaper options, but I'm still keeping my fingers crossed for B650-based GB Aorus lineup. GB may had some f#$%ups in other hardware areas over the past few years, but they really pulled their s$%^t together in enthusiast motherboard segment.


You should send your thanks to HiCookie and Sofoklis at Gigabyte for that.


----------



## Mussels (Aug 29, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> Strangely, mostly Intel stuff just works from launch, not  really counting the Asus motherboard problem which was not Intels  fault.
> 
> I will be buying AM5 from launch, just hope  it goes as smoothly as the ADL one did for me, worked out of the boxes with zero problems ever.


It's like apple: The intel stuff works because a lot more of it is locked down and hidden away.
AMD are like the linux of the hardware world, they expose it all and let you make or break it yourself.

Extreme (and outdated) example, my i7 6700 on a H170 board.
Compared to ryzen at the time, it's RAM stability was unparalleled: Because it was locked to 2133, where the ryzen boards would try higher speeds (and be unstable because of it)


Yes, we all love the freedom of tweaking and overclocking - but we're also all pissed off when we have issues we cant figure out easily, or automatic defaults don't work stable. The brands just have a different approach to it there, intels slow and steady approach bought them time to test everything and slowly unlock each generation, where AMD went balls deep on Zen 1 with a lot of unanswered questions.


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 29, 2022)

Mussels said:


> The intel stuff works because a lot more of it is locked down and hidden away.



Tell that to my bios


----------



## Mussels (Aug 29, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> Tell that to my bios


HEY INTEL BIOS.

Bit vague on what BIOS you mean, be it intel or AMD - and what i said is valid as an over-arching theme. Z series intel boards have everything unlocked, but so does an AMD B550.

People are just less tolerant of any sort of problem, on 'general purpose' hardware


----------



## AM4isGOD (Aug 29, 2022)

What i meant, and you know is, open the boxes, put it together, it boots up and works, no issues with ram, or usually CPU (i know you will pick at this bit shrug). I have done it countless times with different board, with different bios, and never had a failed post.

AMD had to have a ton of Ageesa updates from the start of AM4, and they still are to make them work correctly.

Also, what exactly is locked down and hidden away in a Intel bios?

But hey, lets not get into anything silly. I can't be arsed anymore. They both work with whatever updates are required.


----------



## Vayra86 (Aug 29, 2022)

AM4isGOD said:


> What i meant, and you know is, open the boxes, put it together, it boots up and works, no issues with ram, or usually CPU (i know you will pick at this bit shrug). I have done it countless times with different board, with different bios, and never had a failed post.
> 
> AMD had to have a ton of Ageesa updates from the start of AM4, and they still are to make them work correctly.
> 
> ...


Exactly, and if you DIY your rig surely a little tinkering shouldnt scare you off either. But its certainly true that AMD does not always 'just work', I totally get the sentiment.

However lately Intel setups have also been far from problem free, mostly relating to OC settings defaulted to on. Different beast but results often aint funny.


----------



## R-T-B (Aug 29, 2022)

Toothless said:


> "Only for the rich."
> 
> Learn to save money. You kids and your avocado toasts and Starbucks.


Try not eating, that's a cool trick!

I also hear if you reconnect your sewage line to your tap line and quit paying for water service, you could save hundreds!  Also, whatever you do, do not go to the hospital for the resulting sepsis, it is expensive and only for noob millenials.

I think quite a few here missed the fact that toothless was being partially sarcastic.  The "avacado toast and Starbucks" thing is meme material at this point.


----------

