# Becoming a "professional" system builder?



## Ditto1958 (Jul 28, 2009)

Does anyone know if there is a forum for people who build systems "professionally?" I.e. people who do it for a job, either self-employed, or for an employer, or people who do it sort of as a side job?

I'm going to be relocating to another state soon. When I get there I won't be licensed in my current field for at least a year, so it's likely that whatever employment I get will pay less than what I am making now. I'll likely be forced to try to supplement my income with other things. 

One thing I've thought about is building computers. I love doing it, and wonder if it's possible to do some of it for pay.  When I read reviews at Newegg.com, many of them seem to be written by people who build systems for a living.

I've got a lot of questions about this, though, and I'm wondering where the best places might be to ask them.


----------



## IINexusII (Jul 28, 2009)

yeah theres lots of people who make systems for other people and get paid. im sure someone here does it. also one of them is tjharlow on youtube, heres his channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/tjharlow?blend=1&ob=4 you can maybe ask him


----------



## phanbuey (Jul 28, 2009)

There is a bunch of people here that do it as extra income... Ive sold about 20 systems in the past two years, so I wouldn't say that I do it professionally by any means...  

But in my limited experience, the hardest parts are 
1.  Support support support.  They will not be calling India... they will be calling your house, unless you explicitly state that if they break it they fix it.  Still, they will be calling your house.
1.  Finding customers (as in any business)
2.  Differentiating yourself from all the other builders.


Really the majority of my customers fall into two categories:
1.  Total noobs (not meant as an insult - just that these people have no idea how a computer works... these are the people that say their computer has a virus if anything is wrong with it).  Worst customers ever, if they download something and it doesn't work through no fault of yours, they will call you.  Tell these people to buy a dell regardless of how much they want to pay.
2.  Wanna-be enthusiasts, usually ppl that want to build a rig w/ special features/cooling but don't wanna do it themselves, they pay well, are easy to upsell, and troubleshoot their own issues and install their own OSes, so for me this is the sweet spot.

I also would stay away from building systems that cost less than $1500, not as much money to be made.


----------



## vbx (Jul 28, 2009)

At this day and age, I would assume it would be a little hard to start making income building rigs.  Maybe if you already started, and already have "word of mouth" going on, it would be ok.

If you do decide to build rigs, remember to always use a legit licensed version of the OS you're using.  Unless you're using Linux. 

Because, if you somehow pissed off your customer, they can report you to a local authority and you'll be pretty much f'd.


----------



## AltecV1 (Jul 28, 2009)

im one of the "Wanna-be enthusiasts" i dont know how do wire the case wires so i payd 15$ extra that the buisness were i bought my parts,do resemble the rig no body has teached me how to do that


----------



## DRDNA (Jul 28, 2009)

There is ALWAYS room for success in this arena..You have to be very wise though!


----------



## aj28 (Jul 29, 2009)

Finding customers is always the most difficult part of that type of job. Once you find them, however, word-of-mouth based on a quality job is the easiest way to get repeat business. It's more the breaking in than anything else which is difficult... There are so many "technicians" out there these days, and yet so few of them have an honest dedication to quality and all the right know-how, combined with the business and people skills necessary to maintain a business of that sort. Even certifications are slowly beginning to lose their meaning... You really do have to go out and talk to people, or know them already, if you intend to make good money off of it.


----------



## Ditto1958 (Jul 29, 2009)

*My questions about this*

As I believe I indicated in my original post here, I am interested in doing this, but have some questions. 

Once I have customers, my biggest question is how could I ever make a profit from this with the prices of pre-built computers from HP and Dell so low these days? I'm very happy with what I can get by buying components from Newegg and putting together exactly the system I am looking for. I would think, though, that many people would just look at bare specs and price and think the HP with support and warranty is a much better deal.


Let's assume, though, that I do have some people who want me to build them computers. How would I work it? Should they decide what they want and then give me the money to order the components? Or, should they order them and then bring everything to me when it comes?

Is buying from Newegg, Amazon, etc.,  the cheapest way to get components? Or can system builders get them wholesale for less?


----------



## Disparia (Jul 29, 2009)

^-- Why I stopped.

I used to build custom systems back in the early 2000's. Did just under 300 machines. But prices started dropping, more and more people wanted sub-$1K machines, and it just wasn't fun anymore. Would like to do it again, but more as a hobby (build a themed computer, play a bit, sell it off). Anyhoo...

Not a huge profit gainer, but you can offer to "build and test". Try to get the market of people who would like a nice machine but for whatever reason are hesitant to build their own. Makes it easier to support them, especially if this is a temporary endeavour.

Unless you're moving a lot of machines buying from Newegg.com is easier/just as cheap as buying from a tiered wholesaler.


----------



## SNiiPE_DoGG (Jul 29, 2009)

So here is my advice as an experienced builder for customers, not a professional, but experienced 

-ALWAYS build on a platform you know like the back of your hand, because if you dont know the motherboard BIOS inside out, the motherboards common issues, and the right stable yet capable BIOS for the board when you sell the system; you WILL after countless long hours and months trying to fix problems in a customers system.

-following the above point, NEVER EVER build a system with a board you have not used. If you must build on an unfarmiliar platform make sure you at least use the Brand of board you know best and take some extra time to learn the ins and outs of the board before you sell it off.

-NEVER sell a system with a) super fast RAM b) known unreliable ICs such as Micron D9GMH - you will go through major headaches with tech support if the ram you put in a system starts to fault.

-similar to previous points once again - stick to cases you know, working in the same case over and over speed things up and helps you improve you time/$ ratio


----------



## Disparia (Jul 29, 2009)

+1 to that.

Back then I'd never build on a VIA based board.


----------



## MilkyWay (Jul 29, 2009)

selling some pcs or building for friends and family is just doing it on the side, doing it professional is like selling pcs and hardware for a living or as a second job like you do it all the time for extra cash not just a here and there you do it


----------



## PaulieG (Jul 29, 2009)

I've been selling custom systems on the side for years. I've slowed down on this, because the profit margin has decreased significantly, considering that prebuilts now have very aggressive pricing. When working with the average consumer, it's hard to convince them that you are offering a superior product for the money. So, I've focused on marketing only high end system, plus I offer a "mobile PC repair service". I also occasionally contract with local PC shops to take emergency calls for them. I've made enough money selling and doing repairs about 5 hours a week, to support my hardware addiction. 

IMHO it's really hard to thrive in this market as a new player....unless you market exceptionally well.


----------



## Black Panther (Jul 29, 2009)

phanbuey said:


> 1.  Total noobs (not meant as an insult - just that these people have no idea how a computer works... these are the people that say their computer has a virus if anything is wrong with it).  Worst customers ever, if they download something and it doesn't work through no fault of yours, they will call you.  Tell these people to buy a dell regardless of how much they want to pay.



I don't agree with refusing these customers.

Perhaps my view isn't morally correct...... but I'd just charge them for the work they expect me to do on their pc if they keep insisting.  They think they got a virus? Sure... I'll remove the virus, against payment obviously.

More on topic, once I got a quote for parts from Scan in Malta (franchise of Scan UK). After giving me the quote, they told me they'd charge ONLY €25 for assembling the pc themselves!
That's why I don't think I'd go for it as a job myself here. As a hobby okay I assemble my own stuff, but I'd never go for all the hassle (including having to give after sales service, support, getting calls, warranty stuff etc...) just for €25 per system.

*Unless* you purchase parts in bulk wholesale and can make good profit off the parts... that'd be another story...


----------



## TheMailMan78 (Jul 29, 2009)

Then you have guys like me. I build them for free. I enjoy it.


----------



## 3volvedcombat (Jul 29, 2009)

I want to be a costum rig builder to you know......
Ive built at least 20 computers then taken them apart and built them agian XD. 

Ive notice (freinds that want to be hardcore with a rape computer) Scream when something is wrong with a overclock. For some resone if your going to offer servercies to costumers that want overclocks. Cold leds. and water cooling (i need to get into that ) that you need to be a pro at it. They will message you on xfire. Call your house if something dosnt go right or if a overclocked somehow screwd the computer up over ruining a raid array .

I realy want to get certified to with proof that im qualified but im only 15 right now. The computer shop wont hire me. And i would rather work at the computer store. When it comes to offering special pluses to your work. You have to be sure. I know for the rest of my life when im going to overclock a system apon request. Im going to tell the costumer the bads, and the goods in a simple way and let him choose what he wants to do. Then im going to overclock a system to a acheivable easy speed then orthose the bastard for 48 hours strate >.<. Im getting ready to build another system for sub 250$ for my self. Cause i got a free mobo and proc. Im dedicated and ready to learn about water cooling, Sleeving wires, and moding cases with my dads tools (rox my sox every tool in the world XD). I eventualy be doing that for extra pay. And i love building systems lulz


----------



## BroBQ (Jul 29, 2009)

take a look at this site ...

http://www.technibble.com/


----------



## phanbuey (Jul 29, 2009)

Morrison5891 said:


> take a look at this site ...
> 
> http://www.technibble.com/



Thank you for this... Excellent.


----------



## Meecrob (Jul 29, 2009)

one easy way to get some business is to under cut places like geekfraud, i mean geeksquad, the charge like 85bucks just to look at a system, if the cant fix it, u still pay 85bucks, if you want the system cleaned up(remove spyware and such) ur looking at paying at least 160 and listening to them tell you that any system you have needs to just be replaced because its to old(even if you bought it from them 6 months ago and the same geekfraud rep said it would last you years) 

I charge like 25/hr for good clients, 35-45/hr for people who are "aol users"(the total noobie's), more if the systems some damn clusterfuk OEM job that requires alot of extra work to deal with.

you can just go hang around bestbuy and the like in the tech section handing out cards and telling people you can build them a better rig OR clean up the OEM box they buy and do a clean install of the apps they need(easy money and alot of people will bite if u explain why cleanings a good idea)


----------



## 3volvedcombat (Jul 29, 2009)

phanbuey said:


> There is a bunch of people here that do it as extra income... Ive sold about 20 systems in the past two years, so I wouldn't say that I do it professionally by any means...
> 
> But in my limited experience, the hardest parts are
> 1.  Support support support.  They will not be calling India... they will be calling your house, unless you explicitly state that if they break it they fix it.  Still, they will be calling your house.
> ...



I would def understand what he means there. I live in a city were people acctualy dont know a shits worth about computers and every computer around me is a dell..... Theres some freinds and freinds of freinds that have cash and so on but dont know a worth shit about computers. I under stand and go with (1.) Stay away from those people. Or tell them to read a book and research about computers in the first place. Stay AWAY FROM TOTAL NOOBS. Out of know were thell call you, message you, or do something and say that there computer is lagy. I THINK THATS BULL SHIT. i go over there and notice no diffrence over at a freinds house, and the explian to me that xfire or some program is starting slow and its acting up *face palm instantly*. People need smarts if there ganna pay people that can build and wire tire Beautifal systems and overclock them for 1500+ dollars.


----------



## 3volvedcombat (Jul 29, 2009)

Meecrob said:


> one easy way to get some business is to under cut places like geekfraud, i mean geeksquad, the charge like 85bucks just to look at a system, if the cant fix it, u still pay 85bucks, if you want the system cleaned up(remove spyware and such) ur looking at paying at least 160 and listening to them tell you that any system you have needs to just be replaced because its to old(even if you bought it from them 6 months ago and the same geekfraud rep said it would last you years)
> 
> I charge like 25/hr for good clients, 35-45/hr for people who are "aol users"(the total noobie's), more if the systems some damn clusterfuk OEM job that requires alot of extra work to deal with.
> 
> you can just go hang around bestbuy and the like in the tech section handing out cards and telling people you can build them a better rig OR clean up the OEM box they buy and do a clean install of the apps they need(easy money and alot of people will bite if u explain why cleanings a good idea)



Thats acctualy a realy good idea. I live were 200,000 Pop and no one knows about there hardware. Thats a realy god damn good idea. Im just afraid of geekfraud/squad will come shoot my ass down and send me home


----------



## BroBQ (Jul 29, 2009)

phanbuey said:


> Thank you for this... Excellent.



Its a great site for anyone in the business...


----------



## Meecrob (Jul 29, 2009)

only if they get your addy and can figure out how to program it into their gps, then you can alwase outrun them, they drive vw bugs of course 

most geek squad reps are RETARDED, my buddy bought an extened warr on the zune he just had to have, it died, they tried to use a macbook to test it, then tried to use a pc that didnt have the zunesuit to test it, desided it was broken because he couldnt get into it to move files......(the screen was dead, not the hdd) 

the way you get to go to peoples homes as a geeksquad rep, you sell like make alot of sales in store of shit and services people dont need, you only keep that status by selling people more stuff they dont want/need when you go to their homes to fix stuff......u dont even need to know how to recover files or the like, just how to sell them norton's current version and how to sell them programs they probbly got no use for!!!

oh and how to convince soccer mom's and grannys that their computers to old and needs replaced......thats an important skill!!!


----------



## Creatre (Jul 29, 2009)

This is interesting stuff. I've always considered doing this as a kind of side thing when work/school is light, and may pick it back up again. Doing 1 or 2 decent builds a month gives adequate money to spend on  your own computer and hobbies, however doesn't get you too involved or overwhelmed.


----------



## BroBQ (Jul 29, 2009)

Meecrob said:


> one easy way to get some business is to under cut places like geekfraud, i mean geeksquad, the charge like 85bucks just to look at a system, if the cant fix it, u still pay 85bucks, if you want the system cleaned up(remove spyware and such) ur looking at paying at least 160 and listening to them tell you that any system you have needs to just be replaced because its to old(even if you bought it from them 6 months ago and the same geekfraud rep said it would last you years)
> 
> I charge like 25/hr for good clients, 35-45/hr for people who are "aol users"(the total noobie's), more if the systems some damn clusterfuk OEM job that requires alot of extra work to deal with.
> 
> you can just go hang around bestbuy and the like in the tech section handing out cards and telling people you can build them a better rig OR clean up the OEM box they buy and do a clean install of the apps they need(easy money and alot of people will bite if u explain why cleanings a good idea)



Anytime I run into a client using AOL I laugh. But in the end I talk them out of using it.


----------



## Meecrob (Jul 29, 2009)

same, but its the TYPE OF USER.

its been a long standing policy/convention around here(where i live) and on alot of forums to refer to the clueless noobs as AOL users, Now its more used for the kinda noob who dosnt really want to know about computers but likes to act like they know what they are on about anymore.

I get good lulz out of people who think they know computers but are just spouting talking lines from ads (tv and paper ads), it honestly is quite comical to see morons talking out their ass convincing other morons that they know what they are on about, then you walk up and take the wind out of their sails.

one of the big ones anymore for me is the slew of people who badmouth vista, but when you ask them if they ever used it they admit they havent or they only have played with it on boxes at stores.

Vista was HORRIBLE at first, but service packs have turned it into the better choice IMHO.

I have server 2008 running on an athlon xp@1150mhz with 1.5gb ram and its FASTER THEN xp home was!!!!(tweaked to workstation its still faster then xp was...) once the temps around here drop i plan to ramp that cpu back up to 2+gz but it hit 106f here yesterday, even with the ac going in the main office, the temps still are a bit warm where that puter is.]

Hell my buddy who had nothing good to say about vista after 2weeks of using it on his new laptop(just after vista came out), he wiped and put 2k3 on the laptop, well he was using my system and desided to give vista another shot and found it was faster then what he had setup (vista sp2 native) 

oh and sales of win7 make me LuLz, its  just vista with tweaks to the service manager and some gui changes really, but it also has some restrictions that vista dosnt got, Win7 locks you into using MS codecs for any formats that MS has a codec for, if you have coreAVC installed, it wont work because MS has its own h264/avc decoder built into 7....(you can hack it into working but it dosnt work for everybody) 

I will stick with what I have, at least i can make use of better codecs


----------



## phanbuey (Jul 29, 2009)

Yeah but most people (like me) don't give a flying f* what codec they use as long as their pr0n plays properly and doesnt take too long to launch


----------



## Meecrob (Jul 29, 2009)

for me, its more about anime and even movies, and the fact that i paid for coreavc, so i want to use it!!!


----------



## phanbuey (Jul 29, 2009)

the point is: its a moneymaking hobby unless you setup shop replete with investors, accountants and 1065 Tax forms and the like.

Whoever started geeksquad was a genius.


----------



## Meecrob (Jul 29, 2009)

when geeksquad started it was good, but it was an independent tech support company, not part of a retail store chain, it was after it went to being owned by bestbuy that it became geekfraud and all about selling crap people as much crap as possible......


----------



## neatfeatguy (Jul 30, 2009)

Meecrob said:


> only if they get your addy and can figure out how to program it into their gps, then you can alwase outrun them, they drive vw bugs of course
> 
> most geek squad reps are RETARDED, my buddy bought an extened warr on the zune he just had to have, it died, they tried to use a macbook to test it, then tried to use a pc that didnt have the zunesuit to test it, desided it was broken because he couldnt get into it to move files......(the screen was dead, not the hdd)
> 
> ...



I work with an older guy (he actually worked with some of the big shots that now run Best Buy when they were just getting their feet wet) and he's got some stupid, talking skill and the fact that he comes off sounding smart because he remembers things he's read - even though he might not have any first hand knowledge about what he's read about, he remembers the facts...

I've seen customers come into our showroom location looking for basic, cheap modified mortar for tile installation and by the time he gets done talking with these people....they've left with buying expensive installation systems and tools they probably didn't even know existed.

Usually a week later or so the customers come back and return half the stuff they bought before because they never even needed those items for their installation job.

Maybe that's just how Best Buy has worked since the beginning? They get someone to sound smart and uneducated people take the bait and buy crap they don't need. 

As for building systems, you might want to also learn to do some modding work. There are some decent cases out there that are just bland looking....learn to mod them a bit and make them look different. It'll help your work stand out.

At first I really liked the clear side panel on my tower and the blue LED light on the side fan....but now the thing is just too damn bright and annoying. I'd much more enjoy a case with a fan and some sort of filter/mesh screen over it with a soft LED light glow coming from the inside instead of this lightsaber blue glow screaming at me. I suppose I could take the LED out, but I'm really just too lazy.

At work I tend to be the "go to" guy for PC questions. The people there know I know a good amount about putting PCs together and how things work, so I'm pretty much the first one they ask when there's a problem. I can build a PC, I can navigate through BIOS enough to make sure things are set up correctly, I can trouble shoot most problems and I have an ok understanding about XP to solve most issues that arise in the OS.... I've put a few PCs together for personal home use for some co-workers and I've made a few hundred bucks on the side, but I'm not sure if I'd want to have a large customer base calling me because they accidentally unplugged their computer (or some cord) and their PC won't boot....only to drag my ass over to their place to find out something is unplugged.

I'd tear my hair out....best of luck on your endeavor though and hopefully things work out in your best interest.


----------



## neatfeatguy (Jul 30, 2009)

phanbuey said:


> Whoever started geeksquad was a genius.



Whoever started Domino's Pizza was a genius....in 1998; Domino's Pizza was purchased for roughly $1billion (yes, that's a "B").

I wouldn't mind having had just 1% of that purchase....mmmm....money.


----------



## Cuzza (Jul 30, 2009)

neatfeatguy said:


> Maybe that's just how Best Buy has worked since the beginning? They get someone to sound smart and uneducated people take the bait and buy crap they don't need.



Isn't that just salesmen / big business retail in general?


----------



## BroBQ (Aug 6, 2009)

marketing is key


----------



## grunt_408 (Aug 6, 2009)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Then you have guys like me. I build them for free. I enjoy it.



Thats me they are all for love


----------



## Kantastic (Aug 6, 2009)

I just took apart my whole system and put it back together. It took like almost 3 hours but it was the most exciting thing ever, especially for a first timer like me. I was afraid that I'd break something in the process because I had to force some of the hardware out of my cramped case. I can definitely see myself doing more and more of this in the future, and possibly even for some extra cash here and there.


----------



## dieselcat18 (Aug 7, 2009)

Whoever started geeksquad was a genius.[/QUOTE]



neatfeatguy said:


> Whoever started Domino's Pizza was a genius....in 1998; Domino's Pizza was purchased for roughly $1billion (yes, that's a "B").
> 
> I wouldn't mind having had just 1% of that purchase....mmmm....money.




Whoever started Netflix was a genius....... next


----------



## grunt_408 (Aug 8, 2009)

Kantastic said:


> I just took apart my whole system and put it back together. It took like almost 3 hours but it was the most exciting thing ever, especially for a first timer like me. I was afraid that I'd break something in the process because I had to force some of the hardware out of my cramped case. I can definitely see myself doing more and more of this in the future, and possibly even for some extra cash here and there.




It is good fun doing stuff like that for the first time  After you have done it countless times you end up like me. I took apart my old P35 based Pc the other night stripped it all down took out the motherboard and removed the IFX-14 and changed it out with my Xigmatek Dark Night. Put it all back together and  running in  little over an hour.


----------



## Bot (Aug 9, 2009)

i think it could work out well it all depends on your approach and your willingness.
as you can see in this thread many tried and many still doing it. may it hobby, amateur, semi-pro or professional. everybody has there own experience and style and way of doing things.

i started as a repair technician and at some point had repaired so many machines that i was curious and felt comfortable enough to build my own .. shortly after got hook on it and still do it. majority of my work is still repairs and upgrade, exchanges, etc. not too many people are comfortable enough to go to a small business or individual and shell out good bucks without having the "extended dell/compaq/hp warranty" only to find out that they will have to jump to many hoops and pay a premium to get their equipment repaired.

geeksquad, was a good thing to happen because it really boosted my business. now i finally had someone really to be compared to for clients. they have a set price table and it is fairly easy to beat it and still be profitable. 

don't be afraid to take on work that you might not like or prefer or are in anyway crazy about. those are often the people that give you the best word-of-mouth promotion because they know that what they ask of you is not the most popular thing to do but it's important to them. 

there are very few businesses that would employee or contract an individual to build computers, mostly because they sign up for service contracts with big business and get good kick backs from that. nothing a joe-blow system builder can compete with .. unless it's a very specific machine.

stay ethical, do good business, forget about the quick buck and if you register as a business make sure you get your tax paperwork sorted from day one .. it can be far more then just a nightmare.

go to trade shows, fairs, conventions, etc .. not for fun but for connections, clients, experience, etc .. see it as an investment


----------

