# How does PSU efficiency affect me and do I really need an 80 Plus Gold Power Supply?



## newtekie1 (Aug 25, 2010)

*First an explanation of what exactly the efficiency of a PSU means.*

The efficiency rating on a PSU is simply a rating for how well the PSU converts the AC power it recieves from the outlet to DC power the components of the PC can use.

So, for simplicy sake, lets say your PC components are drawing 100w of power.  If you have a PSU that is 80% efficient, it will really draw 125w from the AC outlet.

I've seen people say that you take the Wattage rating of the PSU, and the efficiency is how much power the PSU can really output for your component.  That means that a 500w PSU, rated for 80% efficiency will only be able to supply 400w.  *This is wrong.*  A 500w PSU should be able to output 500w to your PC components in one form or another.  Efficiency has nothing to do with this.

*Well if I have a PSU that is rated for 80% efficiency, where does the other 20% go?*

Simple answer: Heat.  Any electricity not converted from AC to DC is given off as heat.

*Will there ever be 100% efficient Power Supplies?*

I'm one that lives by the moto "nothing is impossible", so I'm not going to say flat out no.  However, I will say that it is highly highly unlikely, and none of use will probably see it in our lifetimes or our childrens lifetimes.

*If I have a 500w PSU, does that mean it will always draw 500w of power?*

No.  The amount of power drawn is determined by the components of the computer and how much they require.  The amount of power drawn will only be equal to what is needed, and no more.  If all the components of a computer require 300w to run, then the "load" on the PSU will be 300w and hence the power draw of the PC will always be 300w+Inefficiency no matter if it is a 500w PSU or a 1000w.

*So what do the different 80 Plus ratings mean?*

The basic 80 Plus rating means that the PSU is rated for at least 80% efficiency at 20% load, 50% load, and 100% load.

The 80 Plus Bronze rating means that the PSU is rated for at least 82% efficiency at 20% load, 85% at 50% load, and 82% at 100% load.

The 80 Plus Silver rating means that the PSU is rated for at least 85% efficiency at 20% load, 88% at 50% load, and 85% at 100% load.

The 80 Plus Gold rating meas that the PSU is rated for at least 87% efficiency at 20% load, 90% at 50% load, and 87% at 100% load.

The 80 Plus Platinum(bet you didn't know there was a Platinum) rating means that the PSU is rated for at least 90% efficiency at 20% load, 92% at 50% load, and 89% at 100% load.

Now, that doesn't mean that the PSUs perform exactly at those numbers, but they are close enough, and of course you probably aren't going to use exactly 50% load or whatever, but it is close enough to give a good idea of what a PSU is capable of.

*What is in it for me?*

Ah, good question!  I made some quick charts to show how much you save in a year over a standard 80% efficient 80 Plus PSU by going with an 80 Plus Bronze/Silver/Gold/Platinum:












Some information about these charts. 

This assumes a 12 Cent/KwH energy rate, if you pay more for your electricity, then the numbers will be slightly higher.

This also assumes the computer is running an average of 10 hours per day, again if your computer is on longer, then your savings will be greater.

Also remember, "load" in that chart is the percentage load of the capability of the PSU.  So 20% load on the 500w PSU would be 100w, that is actually a pretty good area for where a computer would idle.

Now of course the other benefit, as I kind of hinted at earlier, is heat.  The PSU will put out less heat.  Now how much less heat will a Gold PSU output over a Bronze?  Well probably not a whole lot, certainly not enough to worry about since it is being expelled right out the back anyway.  However, I made a few more charts to show exactly how much less heat will be output by the different rated power supplies compared to an 80 Plus PSU.











So with an 800w PSU, even at full load, you are looking at about 100w of heat.  That might seem like a lot, but to put it in perspective, space heaters generally start at 500w and go up from there.  A 500w space heater will warm a 10' x 10' room up about 10°F, so the extra 100w from the inefficiency might make the room temp rise 2°F.

Of course that heat also builds up in the PSU, as a hot PSU looses efficiency.  However, that comes down to the cooling system in the PSU, and how effective it is.

*What if I'm upgrading from a non-80 Plus Power Supply, what are my savings?*

Ah, another good question, and another few charts.

This first chart is how much money you will save over a year.  Again, the same rules as above apply, 12 Cents per Kwh, 10 hours per day running.






This chart also assumes that your current PSU is 70% efficient at 20% and 100% load, and 75% efficient at 50% load.  Without measuring the exact amount, it is impossible to know what efficienty your current PSU is really running at, but these number are pretty good guesses for a non-80 Plus PSU.

Now what about the heat savings?  Well, here is another chart.






*Conclusion:*

Is a 80 Plus Gold PSU necessary?  Well, I'm not going to answer that for you, that is up to you to decide.  Look at the savings over a year, and make the decision.  How many years are you going to be using this PSU?  Will it make up for the price difference?  You have to answer all this before deciding if a 80 Plus gold PSU is right for you, or if a cheaper 80 Plus Bronze is the way to go.

I can say, personally, I'd be fine with an 80 Plus Bronze Power Supply and the only way I'd go with an 80 Plus Gold would be if the prices was very close.  Of course an 80 Plus Gold PSU would probably be a great savings for anyone building dedicated Folding or Crunching machines.


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## t_ski (Aug 25, 2010)

Good read


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## AsRock (Aug 25, 2010)

Sweet, just the reason i got mine as my usage is around 200w - 350w 350w being the best efficiency for my PSU.  I got my details from [H] some time ago.

Nice read.


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## enaher (Aug 25, 2010)

really nice, to know


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

very nice read. i too have heard many people think the efficiency is what it can actually output and i always have to tell them they're wrong lol. Nice for new people to read as well, should be stickied.


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## theonedub (Aug 25, 2010)

^ Seriously, the amount of people that think that astounds me


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## assaulter_99 (Aug 25, 2010)

Seems we have a guru for everything on tpu, games, headsets, psu's, gpus! Jeez! Thats why I love to stick around so much! Great read btw, hope it helps clearing some peoples mind.


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

i got a bit excited with all that tech talk, and now the thread is all stickied.


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## assaulter_99 (Aug 25, 2010)

Mussels said:


> i got a bit excited with all that tech talk, and now the thread is all stickied.



I saw what you did there, man behave yourself!


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## MilkyWay (Aug 25, 2010)

The transformers aren't 100% efficient is because there is energy loss, some of it is lost to heat ect. That's why there probably wont be 100% efficient because some it is always lost; unless they invent some new transformer or something else to do the job of a transformer.

Power grid transformers are 98% and above efficient, Experimental transformers using superconducting windings achieve efficiencies of 99.85% even such a small increase saves a lot of money.

EDIT: Efficiency is just that the computer needs like 250w for example but it will draw more than that because they lose energy.

A pc needing 250w will use about 294w at 85% efficiency.
It needs the extra because if it just drew just 250w from a wall it wouldn't be able to supply 250w when its converted by the transformer. It loses about 46w at 85% efficiency. So it needs to draw more power to make up the lost energy.


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## newtekie1 (Aug 25, 2010)

Thanks guys, glad everyone likes it.  Thanks Mussels for stickying it...gross...

I think I'm going to add a few different usage senerios to make up a few different charts to add to the one I've got.

What power supply ratings does everyone thing I should use?

I was thinking adding a chart for 1000w, 650w, 500w?

Also adding a chart for 12 and 24 hours usage per day?

Oh well, I'll do that tomorrow, I posted that just before leaving work, and I just made it home...I love commuting...


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> Thanks guys, glad everyone likes it.  Thanks Mussels for stickying it...gross...
> 
> I think I'm going to add a few different usage senerios to make up a few different charts to add to the one I've got.
> 
> ...



take your time, and make segments. cover all the basics of PSU's - for example, i still run into people who think a 500W PSU draws 500W all the time. I'd suggest clarifying a little bit more about upgrading PSU's as well, you dont mention older PSU's for comparison - a cheap passive PFC model vs an 80+ gold, would save a toooon of power, for example.


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## MilkyWay (Aug 25, 2010)

Its actually using more than 500w to convert 500w. Thats just like the max it can convert factoring in loss.
So again its like 500w is drawing more power to make up for the loss it has?

EDIT: So the more efficient a PSU is the less extra it has to draw from a wall.


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> Thanks guys, glad everyone likes it.  Thanks Mussels for stickying it...gross...
> 
> I think I'm going to add a few different usage senerios to make up a few different charts to add to the one I've got.
> 
> ...




go for 400W, 500W and 800W. that covers the actual consumption of every system out there.

stick with 10 hours only for the chart, because its very easy for people to math it to their situation from there - EG, * 2.4 to go from 10 hours to 24 hours


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## Anarchy0110 (Aug 25, 2010)

One of the toughest question I've ever faced in my PC life. And now here's the answer. Thanks TPU


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## JATownes (Aug 25, 2010)

Great read.  Thanks Newtekie.  I am sure I will point to this thread more than once when trying to explain PSU efficiency to n00bs.  Thanks again.


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

another note, make sure you emphasise on the heat.

as PSU's got hotter the efficiency goes down, making them get hotter again... its a vicious cycle that screws you over in summer 

a more efficient PSU heats up less, thus staying more efficient.


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

could you just set up graph so that it simply goes every 100 watts or so? i think it'd just look nicer with more info and be easier to grasp. 

like i'm thinking 500-1000 with 100watt intervals on bottom of graph. N then you'd  have like 4 different colored lines for the different 80% ratings. With the left side covering the extra wattage you draw from an outlet.

Like if i got it correctly. 500watts at 80% efficiency will actually draw ~600watts due to the efficiency at converting dc to ac? That's my understanding and im just now starting to get into PSU's lol


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

a_ump said:


> could you just set up graph so that it simply goes every 100 watts or so? i think it'd just look nicer with more info and be easier to grasp.
> 
> like i'm thinking 500-1000 with 100watt intervals on bottom of graph. N then you'd  have like 4 different colored lines for the different 80% ratings. With the left side covering the extra wattage you draw from an outlet.
> 
> Like if i got it correctly. 500watts at 80% efficiency will actually draw ~600watts due to the efficiency at converting dc to ac? That's my understanding and im just now starting to get into PSU's lol



you're on the right track.

in order for an 80% efficient PSU (lets assume its actually 80% efficient, for this) to deliver 500W of power to your system (which is a very high figure, unless you're running 2 or more video cards) would draw 600W at the wall.

that 100W extra would end up being heat output inside the PSU - so in that example, going from an 80% PSU to a 90%  one, would save you 50W of power - as well as 50W of heat.

also keep in mind the easy comparison to an electric heater. i've got a small one here that goes from 1000W to 2000W - you could say that saving 100W of heat output from your PC, is saving you 1/10th the heat the heater would have made (or alternately, for every ten hours your PC is on, its the same as having that heater on for one hour)

when you think of how hot a room can get from having a heater (even on low) for an hour, you start to realise just how much these heat and power savings can really add up.


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

yea i forgot bout the thermal part of it aswell


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## zithe (Aug 25, 2010)

Faith[ROG].Anarchy said:


> One of the toughest question I've ever faced in my PC life. And now here's the answer. Thanks TPU



Questions where asking could save you a bit of pain:

Question 1 : "What PSU do I need?"
Question 2: "Which hole does it go in?"


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## Tatty_One (Aug 25, 2010)

Very nice read thank you, well written, concise and to the point.... just how I like them!  I see a potential reviewer for TPU here


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

as much as newtekie contradicts by being specific on things in an argument i'm surprised he hasn't already tried to be a reviewer just to prove all his points haha


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

a_ump said:


> as much as newtekie contradicts by being specific on things in an argument i'm surprised he hasn't already tried to be a reviewer just to prove all his points haha



TPU reviewers are veeeery heavily screened - i applied and didnt make it in, and i used to be a reviewer at 3DChipset.


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

mussels weren't big enough XD. yea i noticed there's only a handful of people that do em.

OT: sorta lol, have we created a thread section that's just strait up full of informative threads like this? if not we should, just like a thread section not postable unless a thread is moved by a mod for its informative status.


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## W1zzard (Aug 25, 2010)

good writeup



> Will there ever be 100% efficient Power Supplies?


second law of thermodynamics says no. but you can get arbitrarily close to it.


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## HossHuge (Aug 25, 2010)

I use this website for two reasons.  To learn and to help others.  

And anyone who helps teach me, I appreciate.

Edit:  I also use this website for laughs.  Some of you guys are really funny.


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

yep, TPU be the bomb compared to when i'm on guru3d. Just more of a community lol. 

I've personally always wondered when computers wouldn't need PSU's, just be connected directly to the socket with like voltage chips to handle the different voltages. course dunno if that is possible lol


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

a_ump said:


> yep, TPU be the bomb compared to when i'm on guru3d. Just more of a community lol.
> 
> I've personally always wondered when computers wouldn't need PSU's, just be connected directly to the socket with like voltage chips to handle the different voltages. course dunno if that is possible lol



not with current technology, its not.


then again, in the future they wont bother with this crap - it'll be an internal PSU + battery, powered via wireless transmission (they already have cordless rechargers for various things, its just working on how much power can be transmitted safely, and how far)


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

never did understand how they transmitted power through the air lol. Speaking of what could become, i feel like its taking forever lol. Yea we now have NB's integrated to the CPU or the SB/NB combined, but still Computers havent really changed in the past 15yrs. I wonder what the next revolutionary change to Computers will be.


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

a_ump said:


> never did understand how they transmitted power through the air lol. Speaking of what could become, i feel like its taking forever lol. Yea we now have NB's integrated to the CPU or the SB/NB combined, but still Computers havent really changed in the past 15yrs. I wonder what the next revolutionary change to Computers will be.



same way they transfer TV signals, cell phone signals, 802.11b/g/n and cordless doorbells - with magic.


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

haha i suppose. Idk radio frequencies are one thing but the whole wireless charging thing, like the that ipod/pad/phone charger pad that you just set your devices on it, just cant' comprehend how the electricity would get through the air to its designation


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## Mussels (Aug 25, 2010)

a_ump said:


> haha i suppose. Idk radio frequencies are one thing but the whole wireless charging thing, like the that ipod/pad/phone charger pad that you just set your devices on it, just cant' comprehend how the electricity would get through the air to its designation



it doesnt. conversion process. electricity -> radio waves (or magnetic waves) -> electricity


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

haha i understand it, it just baffles me. we humans are amazing mofo's


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## Munki (Aug 25, 2010)

Nice write up, very informative. 


As for wireless electricity, if it does in fact use magnetic waves, I don't feel comfortable having any of my hdds within the vicinity.


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## a_ump (Aug 25, 2010)

psh HDD, u know that it'll cause cancer XD


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## zithe (Aug 25, 2010)

Mussels said:


> not with current technology, its not.
> 
> 
> then again, in the future they wont bother with this crap - it'll be an internal PSU + battery, powered via wireless transmission (they already have cordless rechargers for various things, its just working on how much power can be transmitted safely, and how far)



It's actually surprising how much we could do safely. Even over a hundred years ago tesla did something like it with what he called wireless resonant inductive coupling.


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## newtekie1 (Aug 25, 2010)

I changed up the charts a little, making them bar graphs.

Are they too confusing?



W1zzard said:


> good writeup
> 
> 
> second law of thermodynamics says no. but you can get arbitrarily close to it.



I'm still one that says nothing is impossible, or rather nothing is impossible until we believe it is impossible.


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## Munki (Aug 26, 2010)

a_ump said:


> psh HDD, u know that it'll cause cancer XD



Id rather have my hdd. Cancer just falls under everything else that exists in today's world.


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## LAN_deRf_HA (Aug 26, 2010)

zithe said:


> It's actually surprising how much we could do safely. Even over a hundred years ago tesla did something like it with what he called wireless resonant inductive coupling.



I'm not sure what kind of effects tesla's method would have on other electronics at this point. There weren't really any complex electrical devices at the time. As for transmitted power in general it's a pretty terrible idea in radial form. We'd need a fusion reactor on every block to make the power waste feasible and extensive testing to prove we aren't frying ourselves and interfering with other technologies. Centralization is always the wrong approach for this type of thing. Redundancy and independence is the way to go.


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## genta3d (Oct 22, 2010)

Since I need some power, I pick any good brand PSU as long it says 80+. Right now Im still using silverstone 750, which some times ago this is the best PSU I can get with my budget. But still its very lovely since in my area the electricity unstable, even its drop, my system never fail. So I guess 80+ mark doesnt only mean the efficiency, but a "high end" mark to. What I mean is the PSU has some safety for the system. (Sorry cannt speak english much).


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## newtekie1 (Oct 22, 2010)

Generally, yes.  PSUs with 80+ ratings tend to have better build quality than those that don't.  However, you also have to consider that the 80+ rating is somewhat new to the PSU market, so if you bought a PSU before they were used, you could still have a very well build unit.  A silverstone 750w should be very well built.


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## claylomax (Oct 26, 2010)

Remember that if you use a 240v grid, efficiency goes up around 2%; many Silver units would qualify for Gold on a 240v grid. This is because the 80plus tests are done on a 120v grid. Most of the world uses 220-240v.


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## hv43082 (Oct 31, 2010)

Very nice write up.  Simple and to the point.  Unfortunately my Corsair HX1000 is DEAD.  Literally would not power up my computer even at stock setting.  Hope Corsair RMA is quick.


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## Charly (Oct 31, 2010)

nice sticky


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## Steevo (Nov 8, 2010)

Awesome. Few people truly understand the power use to efficiency factors.


And a dollar is a dollar.


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## nesco1801 (Nov 16, 2010)

Its all about who has the biggest...

I mean LESSER carbon footprint.

God damn hippies. And every one of them is using 850W PSU to power his single 5770 rig.


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## RejZoR (Nov 16, 2010)

Well, realistically i'd only need a 400W PSU for my system. But have decided for a 750W one and i'll probably not gonna replace it till it dies. Plus, since i've made it more silent with less air flow it's good that it's rated higher so you have some reserve as far as heat goes. Bigger and more powerful PSU's tend to have better heatsinks...


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## UseNow (Nov 16, 2010)

Good read, thanks.


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## Mussels (Nov 16, 2010)

nesco1801 said:


> Its all about who has the biggest...
> 
> I mean LESSER carbon footprint.
> 
> God damn hippies. And every one of them is using 850W PSU to power his single 5770 rig.



overkill yes, but PSU's are more efficient when they arent at max load


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## Completely Bonkers (Nov 16, 2010)

But also inefficient at low loads (<15%).  An 800W PSU driving an CPU idling at 50W will probably be only 50% efficient or worse.

Get a PSU to match your "idle" system, not just your "OC overload stresstest".

http://www.google.co.uk/images?hl=e...UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&biw=1040&bih=1060

Test your idle load. Whatever it is, take 5x this number for your PSU rating. If that isnt enough for your RAID and GPUs then obviously you will need a higher wattage PSU; but be aware that at idle you are horribly inefficient.

*Let's do some numbers:*

A mainboard and GPU idling at 60W

Take 5x 60W = 300W for your PSU.

Oh dear, that wont cover the SLI and RAID HDDs. OK, so we need a PSU at 700W.  That's fine, but be aware that at idle you will probably be at 50% efficiency or worse.

Shame.

So for a gaming rig, you will be inefficient most of the time you arent gaming.  But for a 24/7 server or NAS rig, make sure you do the numbers to ensure low heat, high efficiency, low power bills.


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## nesco1801 (Nov 16, 2010)

Mussels said:


> overkill yes, but PSU's are more efficient when they arent at max load




Thats what I've said. Its all about carbon footprint 

Anyway PSU's are less efficient on lower  end of curve also.

I'll get better and stronger PSU just to ease my paranoia, and so I can SLI one day


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## Mussels (Nov 16, 2010)

some of these users fold and crunch, so they dont idle - or the systems off when they arent gaming, thus load is more important than idle.


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## Completely Bonkers (Nov 16, 2010)

Agree. Depends on usage profile.

For workstations, gamers, crunchers, best to get a PSU that is 2x the average "loaded" profile, and hit that 50% "most efficient" line, as well as having scope for high load situations.


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## newtekie1 (Nov 16, 2010)

Completely Bonkers said:


> But also inefficient at low loads (<15%).  An 800W PSU driving an CPU idling at 50W will probably be only 50% efficient or worse.
> 
> Get a PSU to match your "idle" system, not just your "OC overload stresstest".
> 
> ...



That isn't necessarily true.  If you pick a number like 85w, which is not an unrealistic point for a high end computer to idle at, a lot of modern 80+ Gold/Silver/Bronze PSUs are still over the 80% efficiency mark.


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## Mussels (Nov 17, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> That isn't necessarily true.  If you pick a number like 85w, which is not an unrealistic point for a high end computer to idle at, a lot of modern 80+ Gold/Silver/Bronze PSUs are still over the 80% efficiency mark.



85W is actually pretty low for an idle, even systems running on IGP's tend to idle at 70W+ - few gaming systems get below the 100W mark.


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## gourygabriev (Sep 28, 2011)

Also wanted to add that a good amount of Electric Providers also do their tiered billing, meaning their cost per kilowatt isn't a fixed, flat-rate but there is a premium added to people who use a lot of electricity. Like people who are using <100% of what is the allotted KW in a household will get like a lower $/KW compared to someone who is using 120% of what their allotted KW for a household. If I remember correctly, someone who is using 200% of the allotted KW per household is paying roughly 3x per KW compared to someone who used <100%. Instead of the bill going 2x the cost, they actually have to pay 6x more for using twice the amount. Last time I've checked, there were 5 different tiers being used by my Electric Provider (PG&E) in my area. 

So I guess picking an 80 gold efficient power supply has its merits so people can save as much energy to keep them away from the higher tier of billing.


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## billcat479 (Oct 15, 2011)

I read a review on the standards, it was pretty much like what you put up there. They then focused on the marketing side, the increase in cost for a higher rated supply and the chance of it even making the ratings they claim are suspect.
  The only flip side is how many computers are used in the U.S.
  While the single user numbers are very small the total world use is increasingly huge in wasted power. It is important.
  This is the one side where it makes any sense but the high cost going from bronze to gold rating is crazy.
    Oh, Don't be putting the loss on the transformers, they are very low resistance and don't waste very much power they just convert it to equal but different voltage and current levels.  The power regulators and resistors  and rectifying circuits that are the bad guys. The huge heat sinks aren't on them just for kicks, 
  It's the Converting to DC and regulation that eats up the main loss of power. DC is a very power unfriendly source of energy. That one light bulb guy wanted to use DC power stations but they couldn't run big enough power lines to power even a small city and he was shoved aside by Westinghouse and friends. Using AC is why power stations get away with being so far away though it still is a huge waste in the lines. They do use liquid cooled superconducting lines close to the major cities to help out the line losses. Too bad they haven't got the room temp. superconducting figured out. That would be as huge as Fusion power generators.


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## wwqzelasi (Apr 26, 2012)

Great post!Thank you for all the things learned from here and congratulations for the good work.


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## Digital1 (Nov 30, 2013)

A few days ago I upgraded from an 80+ bronze Silver Power psu(Which I've got to say has been a great psu since i've had it), to a Corsair AX 860i 80+ Platinum. I'm not clued up on rails and other technical stuff like a lot of you on here, but I did enough research to realise that if I wanted to protect my other components in my case I should maybe invest in better psu. It has eaten away at a big chunk of my Christmas money but hopefully it will save me money eventually and also save me from a lot of stress that blown components can cause.


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## EarthDog (Nov 30, 2013)

People need to do the math on how much you are saving from say silver to platinum. Unless you use a distributed platform, it really is MAYBE a couple/few dollars per year.

As far as what psu to get. Unless you are clocking an AMD fx octcore to the moon under water, a quality 550w psu will power ANY single gpu system while overclocking both cpu and gpu as well as easily being able to support custom water and fans.


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## Mussels (Nov 30, 2013)

EarthDog said:


> People need to do the math on how much you are saving from say silver to platinum. Unless you use a distributed platform, it really is MAYBE a couple/few dollars per year.
> 
> As far as what psu to get. Unless you are clocking an AMD fx octcore to the moon under water, a quality 550w pain will power ANY single gpu system while overclocking both cpu and gpu as well as easily being able to support custom water and fans.


 

the money savings are tiny, unless you're coming from a generic PSU with passive PFC. the real benefits are that the quality PSU;'s have lower ripple (longer hardware life), lower temps (longer hardware life), lower noise (more sanity for owner) and a fancier sticker (more money for the manuf.)


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## Arjai (Dec 13, 2013)

Awesome thread!!!!!!!!

I learned more here, on this thread, than, probably, a three credit course at college!


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## HD64G (Dec 31, 2013)

If no one said it, I just want to add that when some PSUs say on their labels 500W max, this isn't the true wattage they can provide. They say another figure too about continouous power which is normally much lower. For example, my TR2 470W (which isn't mine for the last 2 years thankfully-terrible PSU) was 470 max and 310 continuous. This means that it provides only 310W and even this is not sure. It has 70% efficiency and gets hot when providing only 200W and produces coil whine at 250W. So, in cheap PSUs the max must be totally ignored. Only continuous is important and even this with a big reservation.


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## newtekie1 (Jan 1, 2014)

That is generally something you see on cheap power supplies, the better supplies tend to advertise the continuous load capability.  Honestly, Thermaltake hasn't really put out a good power supply in a few years, they've really gone down hill.


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## Tonduluboy (Nov 8, 2014)

Great Info! Thanks!
I been here longer than my registration date, but this is the 1st time i read this articles.
Now i know exactly why i bought my 80+ bronze PSU ( normally i just buy without 80+ certified psu)


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## RCoon (Nov 8, 2014)

Tonduluboy said:


> Great Info! Thanks!
> I been here longer than my registration date, but this is the 1st time i read this articles.
> Now i know exactly why i bought my 80+ bronze PSU ( normally i just buy without 80+ certified psu)



Bit of a necro for this thread. Almost 4 years old


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## Mussels (Nov 9, 2014)

RCoon said:


> Bit of a necro for this thread. Almost 4 years old




not much has changed in PSU's since then


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## assaulter_99 (Nov 9, 2014)

Indeed, same old...


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## Tonduluboy (Nov 10, 2014)

4 years but  old thread but still informative to a newbie like me


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## Gmr_Chick (Nov 21, 2014)

Thank you for this article.  

Since this article/thread was created in 2010, there's since entered a new rating in the 80 Plus program - Titanium. Not that it would really matter, but would it be possible to update this with the new 80 Plus level?


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## Kissamies (Nov 24, 2014)

Going fine with a bronze certified PSU, what matters to me is that the PSU is filled with Japanese caps. Well, polymers can be Chinese, but electrolytics can't when I'm recommending a PSU.


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## Ensefalon (Oct 30, 2020)

MilkyWay said:


> The transformers aren't 100% efficient is because there is energy loss, some of it is lost to heat ect. That's why there probably wont be 100% efficient because some it is always lost; unless they invent some new transformer or something else to do the job of a transformer.
> 
> Power grid transformers are 98% and above efficient, Experimental transformers using superconducting windings achieve efficiencies of 99.85% even such a small increase saves a lot of money.
> 
> ...



Stop blaming the transformer! Diodes are the ones stopping current from going backward!

The real thing is however, transformers in those power supplies are very tiny, and yet also very efficient as frequency is modulated into DC without the need for an 8 lb. iron core.
Power grid transformers are inefficient because their cores are huge and typically have a lower Fs than the current going through them.


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## xman2007 (Oct 31, 2020)

Ensefalon said:


> Stop blaming the transformer! Diodes are the ones stopping current from going backward!
> 
> The real thing is however, transformers in those power supplies are very tiny, and yet also very efficient as frequency is modulated into DC without the need for an 8 lb. iron core.
> Power grid transformers are inefficient because their cores are huge and typically have a lower Fs than the current going through them.


And the award for thread necro of the year goes to........ 





> *DRUMROLL.........*


 @Ensefalon

Well done, replying to a 10 year old thread and even replying to someone like the thread just popped up on latest posts 10 minutes ago


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## X71200 (Oct 31, 2020)

That's definitely a good late night of drinking post...


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## SadisticWaifu (Feb 4, 2021)

Things I really wanted to know, really nice read.


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## Nater (Feb 8, 2021)

*listens to Seasonic 80+ Titanium*

I think I paid about an extra $70 or so to not hear anything.  So there's that part of the equation as well.


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## Hardcore Games (Mar 4, 2021)

I went from bronze to platinum and using the power monitor suggests the HX1000i has paid for itself a few times over now

the payback is accelerated every time i play a game


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