# Apple Introduces All New MacBook Pro with Retina Display



## btarunr (Jun 11, 2012)

Apple today unveiled an all new 15-inch MacBook Pro featuring a stunning Retina display, all flash storage and quad-core processors in a radically thin and light design. Measuring a mere 0.71 inches and weighing only 4.46 pounds, the completely redesigned MacBook Pro sets a new standard in performance and portability for pro users.

"The MacBook Pro with Retina display pushes the limits of performance and portability like no other notebook," said Tim Cook, Apple's CEO. "With a gorgeous Retina display, all flash architecture and a radically thin and light design, the new MacBook Pro is the most advanced Mac we have ever built."






The new MacBook Pro Retina display is the world's highest resolution notebook display with over 5 million pixels, 3 million more than an HD television (2880 x 1800). At 220 pixels-per-inch, the Retina display's pixel density is so high the human eye cannot distinguish individual pixels from a normal viewing distance, so text and graphics look incredibly sharp. The Retina display uses IPS technology for a 178-degree wide viewing angle, and has 75 percent less reflection and 29 percent higher contrast than the previous generation.

Featuring a precision engineered aluminum unibody design and an all flash storage architecture, the all new MacBook Pro is the lightest MacBook Pro ever and nearly as thin as a MacBook Air. Flash storage that is up to four times faster than traditional notebook hard drives enables the all new MacBook Pro to play four simultaneous streams of uncompressed 1080p HD video from internal storage.* The flash storage architecture also delivers improved reliability, instant-on responsiveness and 30 days of standby time.

The MacBook Pro with Retina display features the latest Intel Core i7 quad-core processors up to 2.7 GHz with Turbo Boost speeds up to 3.7 GHz, NVIDIA GeForce GT 650M discrete graphics, up to 16 GB of faster 1600 MHz RAM and flash storage up to 768 GB. Two Thunderbolt and two USB 3.0 ports allow pro users to connect to multiple displays and high performance devices, and a new HDMI port offers quick connectivity to HDTVs.

The MacBook Pro battery delivers up to 7 hours of wireless productivity, and uses advanced chemistry and Adaptive Charging technology to provide up to 1,000 recharges.** The MacBook Pro also features a FaceTime HD camera, glass Multi-Touch trackpad, full-size backlit keyboard, dual microphones, enhanced speakers, 3-stream 802.11n Wi-Fi and a thinner MagSafe 2 power port.

OS X Lion, iPhoto, iMovie, iTunes and other Apple apps including Aperture and Final Cut Pro X have been updated to take full advantage of the new MacBook Pro with Retina display. The updated Aperture 3.3 also includes revolutionary new image adjustment features and now supports a unified photo library so photographers can move seamlessly between iPhoto and Aperture.

The all new MacBook Pro ships with OS X Lion. Starting today, customers who purchase a Mac are eligible for a free copy of OS X Mountain Lion when it becomes available. Mountain Lion introduces innovative features including the all new Messages app, Notification Center, system-wide Sharing, AirPlay Mirroring, Game Center and the enhanced security of Gatekeeper. With iCloud built into the foundation of OS X, Mountain Lion makes it easier than ever to keep your content up to date across all your devices.

*Pricing & Availability*
The 15-inch MacBook Pro with Retina display is available through the Apple Online Store (http://www.apple.com), Apple's retail stores and Apple Authorized Resellers. The 15-inch MacBook Pro is available with a 2.3 GHz quad-core Intel Core i7 processor with Turbo Boost speeds up to 3.3 GHz, 8 GB of memory and 256 GB of flash storage starting at $2,199 (US); and with a 2.6 GHz quad-core Intel Core i7 processor with Turbo Boost speeds up to 3.6 GHz, 8GB of memory and 512 GB of flash storage starting at $2,799 (US). Configure-to-order options include faster quad-core processors up to 2.7 GHz, up to 16 GB of memory and flash storage up to 768 GB.

Additional technical specifications, configure-to-order options and accessories are available online here.

*Testing conducted by Apple in June 2012 using preproduction MacBook Pro configurations. For more information visit this page.

**The Wireless Web protocol testing was conducted by Apple in June 2012 using preproduction MacBook Pro configurations. Battery life and charge cycles vary by use and settings. For more information visit this page.

*View at TechPowerUp Main Site*


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## NC37 (Jun 11, 2012)

I don't see an optical and no HDD option either...pass. Thing is gonna be all pretty but you'll end up carrying a ton of extra devices.


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## theeldest (Jun 11, 2012)

The WWDC (still going on) stated optical drives are still in the macbook pro line and the SSDs go up to 768GB.


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## Fairlady-z (Jun 11, 2012)

I like the resolution and GPU for a clean looking laptop to bad its not windows based lol.... I dunno nothing against apple, but I hate change.


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## theeldest (Jun 11, 2012)

Fairlady-z said:


> I like the resolution and GPU for a clean looking laptop to bad its not windows based lol.... I dunno nothing against apple, but I hate change.



Boot camp lets you install windows directly with full driver support.

EDIT: honestly, I hate apple and their fans but they make some of the best laptops. Solid design and make good use of graphics hardware to accelerate the operating system.


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## Leon2ky (Jun 11, 2012)

So what is the actual resolution...


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## sc (Jun 11, 2012)

I hope that having a crappy GPU with such a resolution will be the start of Apple's downfall.


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## v12dock (Jun 11, 2012)

I wonder how much that display cost alone


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## theeldest (Jun 11, 2012)

Leon2ky said:


> So what is the actual resolution...



2880x1800 on the 15.4" Mac Pro


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## wickerman (Jun 11, 2012)

NC37 said:


> I don't see an optical and no HDD option either...pass. Thing is gonna be all pretty but you'll end up carrying a ton of extra devices.



I have not had to use a CD in years, even buying boxed software you often have the option of downloading the installer and using your boxed key without issue. The only reason my desktop has an optical drive is for ripping blurays, I honestly can't remember the last time it was used to install software or games. Obviously my own needs probably differ from yours but I imagine more people would want an optical drive as a precaution "just in case" rather than because they use it daily.

Also I am blown away by that resolution, suddenly I feel a bit shamed with my 2560x1440 panel lol. Hopefully this is a sign of great things to come and we will see higher resolutions coming to desktops very soon. It is an absolute shame to have such powerful gpus like we have today and be limited to such pitifully low resolutions. 2560x1440/2560x1600 is no stress for even a single high end gpu, never mind SLI/Crossfire. 

The GT 650M should be enough power for most things, hell of a step up from HD 4000, but isn't it basically going to match the new GT 640? I mean 384 shaders from GK107 and 128bit bus with DDR3? Although the core/shader speeds are probably lower. Still...you wanna find the best balance of performance and power efficiency, cant imagine that display is as efficient as the usual suspects.


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## Completely Bonkers (Jun 11, 2012)

*The MacBook Pro packs a Retina display with a 2880 x 1800 resolution (or 220ppi)*

+1

Top dollar spec.  Why oh why does it always take Apple to move the goalposts forward?!

Job well done. Now come on PC competition. Where the hell are those high res displays for laptop and for desktop??? Hmmm?  Here's looking at you, you lame PC OEMs.


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## Woodhull (Jun 11, 2012)

Looks like the 13" is limited to HD4000, and 1280 x 800.  The 15" non-retina version gets the 650M and is 1440 x 900.


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## Easy Rhino (Jun 11, 2012)

2880x1800. Love Apple for continuing to push hardware.


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## repman244 (Jun 11, 2012)

Easy Rhino said:


> 2880x1800. Love Apple for continuing to push hardware.



Yes but imagine that resolution on a laptop running Windows and it's horrible DPI setting, without proper DPI scaling I wouldn't buy it.


Looks like a solid setup, but can't help and wonder about how hot will it get...


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## Easy Rhino (Jun 11, 2012)

repman244 said:


> Yes but imagine that resolution on a laptop running Windows and it's horrible DPI setting, without proper DPI scaling I wouldn't buy it.
> 
> 
> Looks like a solid setup, but can't help and wonder about how hot will it get...



since it is an apple product im positive OSX looks beautiful on it... why spend a premium for an apple laptop only to get rid of one of the reasons it costs so much?


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## repman244 (Jun 11, 2012)

Easy Rhino said:


> since it is an apple product im positive OSX looks beautiful on it... why spend a premium for an apple laptop only to get rid of one of the reasons it costs so much?



Oh sorry, I didn't word my post very well...what I meant was, when these displays hit the laptops running Windows and it's bad DPI scaling it won't look as good as the Mac running OSX which does have better DPI scaling AFAIK.


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## Easy Rhino (Jun 11, 2012)

repman244 said:


> Oh sorry, I didn't word my post very well...what I meant was, when these displays hit the laptops running Windows and it's bad DPI scaling it won't look as good as the Mac running OSX which does have better DPI scaling AFAIK.



i see. i wonder if the microsoft people are working on fixing that problem.


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## Frick (Jun 11, 2012)

Completely Bonkers said:


> Job well done. Now come on PC competition. Where the hell are those high res displays for laptop and for desktop??? Hmmm?  Here's looking at you, you lame PC OEMs.



They're coming. In 2013 they will come in hordes I think.


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## wotevajjjj (Jun 11, 2012)

Awesome, I don't like apple products, but it's great to see at least someone is pushing it. First the ipad 3, now this, I really seem to like it.


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## Patriot (Jun 11, 2012)

Does anyone have the real resolution...

is it 2560x1440 or 2560x1600?

2560x1800 would be nearly 4:3 and they are not quite that stupid... though some of the buyers...


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## aayman_farzand (Jun 11, 2012)

It's rare to see Apple pushing the hardware envelope. Love the new Pro specs, hate the price :|


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## Woodhull (Jun 11, 2012)

Frick said:


> They're coming. In 2013 they will come in hordes I think.



I bet the next generation of video cards will properly run the new resolutions, too.  I can't imagine what detail settings you would need to run BF3 on a 650M at 1800p.


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## Easy Rhino (Jun 11, 2012)

aayman_farzand said:


> It's rare to see Apple pushing the hardware envelope. Love the new Pro specs, hate the price :|



sorry but i must interject. apple has been pushing hardware since the ipod. they were the first to stick that much computing power in a small mobile device.


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## FreedomEclipse (Jun 11, 2012)

NC37 said:


> I don't see an optical and no HDD option either...pass. Thing is gonna be all pretty but you'll end up carrying a ton of extra devices.



hardly a negative point....there are hundreds of small 10.1 or 11.6" laptops/netbooks/ultrabooks out there that *DONT* have an optical drive. 

I dont have an optical drive on my laptop and i got rid of the one on my PC cuz i dont use it at all. most of my games are downloaded from services like STEAM or have an online installer which bypasses the need to install off CD.

Obviously I do have a slimline optical drive though just for my laptop and i occasionally bring it out when i need to burn stuff either on my PC or laptop otherwise I have no use for it, I dont rent DVD movies, I dont need to install stuff because everythings  already installed, and all my music is in mp3 or flac format so all i need is a USB stick to transport them around.

honestly, the Optical drive is looking more and more like the floppy drive every day that goes by.


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 11, 2012)

Patriot said:


> Does anyone have the real resolution...
> 
> is it 2560x1440 or 2560x1600?
> 
> 2560x1800 would be nearly 4:3 and they are not quite that stupid... though some of the buyers...



2880x1800

Cant order soon enough


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## johnnyfiive (Jun 11, 2012)

Really awesome display and laptop altogether, Apple always getting it done when it comes to build quality and features. My only question is, how is Diablo 3 going to run at 2880x1800 on a GT650 1GB card? Of course you can always lower the resolution, but I'm definitely curious to see how it does at the native res.


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## Kantastic (Jun 11, 2012)

Unless Asus or Samsung can come up with something close, I might finally pay a visit to the Apple store in anticipation of college.


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## phanbuey (Jun 11, 2012)

I wish they would refresh the 13" line with the higher spec screen.  My current 13" is a beast that I can upgrade to 16GB of ram, with the 128GB SSD and a creappy 1280x800 screen.

A $1,400 mid range variant with the nice screen would be fantastic.


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## Crap Daddy (Jun 11, 2012)

About that resolution. Can somebody explain to me what is the difference between digital resolution and VGA resolution since in GT650M specs it say max for digital 3840 x 2160 and max for VGA 2048x1536? And how can you see the icons at that res on a 15" screen?


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## vanyots (Jun 11, 2012)

Crap Daddy said:


> About that resolution. Can somebody explain to me what is the difference between digital resolution and VGA resolution since in GT650M specs it say max for digital 3840 x 2160 and max for VGA 2048x1536? And how can you see the icons at that res on a 15" screen?



Digital is the resolution you get out of your digital outputs(DVI, HDMI, DislayPort), and VGA is he analog resolution from the VGA port.

And icons can scale too, and can be 64x64 or even 256x256 pixels


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## phanbuey (Jun 11, 2012)

Crap Daddy said:


> About that resolution. Can somebody explain to me what is the difference between digital resolution and VGA resolution since in GT650M specs it say max for digital 3840 x 2160 and max for VGA 2048x1536? And how can you see the icons at that res on a 15" screen?



VGA refers to a video feed that is going from an analog VGA cable (it is the smaller monitor cable, usually has a blue port) it is an older standard.  The limit of the resolution is a result of the cable and not the card. 

You can see the icons because OSX uses different DPI scaling than windows.  Everything up sizes correctly, so you just have super sharp display without needing a magnifying glass.


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## Soylent Joe (Jun 11, 2012)

Goddammit I'm so happy there's still such an innovative company like Apple around. As long as the prices don't go up between generations, I'm planning on getting a 13" 2012 MBP.


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## phanbuey (Jun 11, 2012)

Soylent Joe said:


> Goddammit I'm so happy there's still such an innovative company like Apple around. As long as the prices don't go up between generations, I'm planning on getting a 13" 2012 MBP.



They haven't updated the 13" with the goodies tho.  If they could stuff a 650M and a dual core ivy with even a 1440x900 screen (like the current air screen) I would totally go for it.


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## Soylent Joe (Jun 11, 2012)

phanbuey said:


> They haven't updated the 13" with the goodies tho.  If they could stuff a 650M and a dual core ivy with even a 1440x900 screen (like the current air screen) I would totally go for it.



Yeah I just saw that. Nothing very exciting with the 13". Probably will make a pass until they release a 13" high res edition.


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## Wrigleyvillain (Jun 11, 2012)

Soylent Joe said:


> Goddammit I'm so happy there's still such an innovative company like Apple around. As long as the prices don't go up between generations, I'm planning on getting a 13" 2012 MBP.



Wait...what forum is this? 

Man too bad it's not the fat cat days around work anymore; we'd be getting a whole bunch of these. Seeing in person might be worth a lunchtime trip to the Apple store.


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 11, 2012)

Wrigleyvillain said:


> Wait...what forum is this?


Already placed my order. 

2.6/16gb ram/512 SSD.

This is my work-top though. I will use the shit out of every 1 and 0 it can process. Time to put my Developer account to work!


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## Steevo (Jun 11, 2012)

I admit, crapple may be the scum of the earth but that display is supah smooth.


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 11, 2012)

NOTE TO ANYONE ORDERING: THE MEMORY IS SOLDERED IN MACBOOK AIR STYLE.

Order it with what you'll want.


INB4HATERS:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/5688/apple-ipad-2012-review/13

Its crazy we're getting to the point that sockets are impairing our battery life :O 

Its little details like this, that I really admire the people that get to work on those projects.


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## OneCool (Jun 11, 2012)

*Starting* at $2800 


To rich for my blood


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 11, 2012)

OneCool said:


> *Starting* at $2800
> 
> 
> To rich for my blood



$2199 not $2800. Just over baseline Macbook Pro price.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 12, 2012)

Completely Bonkers said:


> Job well done. Now come on PC competition. Where the hell are those high res displays for laptop and for desktop??? Hmmm?  Here's looking at you, you lame PC OEMs.


Most consumers think they're useless/not willing to pay for it.  High res screens have been available for a long time but only the professional market buy them (specifically radiology) because they are cost prohibitive.

Put bluntly, only Apple can get away with selling $500+ monitors included (thanks to brand loyalty) with the computer price whereas Dell, HP, Lenovo, Acer, etc. cannot.  The bulk of their computer sells come in at half the price Apple sells for.


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## radrok (Jun 12, 2012)

Good Apple, now sell me a 30" 4K res Cinema Display  with Dual-Dual-DVI and I'll be veeery happy, heck even a 27" 2880x1800 would be good.


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## repman244 (Jun 12, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Put bluntly, only Apple can get away with selling $500  monitors included (thanks to brand loyalty) with the computer price whereas Dell, HP, Lenovo, Acer, etc. cannot.



You have an option of a 10-bit IPS DreamColor panel with HP's elitebook workstations which costs around $400-500, can't remember if Dell and Lenovo offer such panel as well.
The fact is that there are much better laptops (hardware/component wise) that cost 2-3 times more than MBP, but they mostly don't come in such small thickness (I'm talking about workstation laptops) and battery life suffers as well.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 12, 2012)

The "DreamColor" laptops are aimed at graphics/video professionals as they come with Quadro/FirePro cards (adds about 400-500% to the cost of graphics alone).  DreamColor is also only up to 1920x1080 on the screen I'm looking at: http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsuppor...askId=&prodSeriesId=4096175&prodTypeId=321957

Mac Book Pro doesn't even come close to the offerings of the Quadro/FirePro.  Correct me if I'm wrong but you can't even get a Quadro/FirePro in an Apple product (even the $2500+ Mac Pro). This is why graphics designers are moving increasingly to Windows-based computers.  Adobe, specifically, requires NVIDIA Quadro (CUDA cores) for some components of their master suite.


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## repman244 (Jun 12, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> The "DreamColor" laptops are aimed at graphics/video professionals as they come with Quadro/FirePro cards (adds about 400-500% to the cost of graphics alone).  DreamColor is also only up to 1920x1080 on the screen I'm looking at: http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsuppor...askId=&prodSeriesId=4096175&prodTypeId=321957
> 
> Mac Book Pro doesn't even come close to the offerings of the Quadro/FirePro.  Correct me if I'm wrong but you can't even get a Quadro/FirePro in an Apple product. This is why graphics designers are moving increasingly to Windows-based computers.  Adobe, specifically, requires NVIDIA Quadro (CUDA cores) for some components of their master suite.



Yes they are exotic but the colour reproduction is amazing. Yes maximum resolution is 1080p and to even use it you need a FirePro/Quadro to enable 10-bit support, but all workstation models come with either a FirePro or a Quadro. 

I don't know about Apple's "desktop" line of computers but no there are no FirePro/Quadro for laptops.
About CUDA, AFAIK a normal gaming card is better in CUDA due to higher clocks compared to Quadro which is more optimized for OpenGL. Although I could be very wrong since I don't have a Quadro card...


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## anonymous6366 (Jun 12, 2012)

Not an apple fan but that laptop is gonna be baller. Of course its overpriced as shit though lol


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 12, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Mac Book Pro doesn't even come close to the offerings of the Quadro/FirePro.  Correct me if I'm wrong but you can't even get a Quadro/FirePro in an Apple product (even the $2500+ Mac Pro). This is why graphics designers are moving increasingly to Windows-based computers.  Adobe, specifically, requires NVIDIA Quadro (CUDA cores) for some components of their master suite.



iirc Adobe products on OS X don't require Quadro(which would be stupid, since theres only ever been like 2-3 ever made since the Intel transition.). I could be wrong.

They also work on Ati GPU's, whereas on Windows they do not.


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## OneCool (Jun 12, 2012)

Dippyskoodlez said:


> $2199 not $2800. Just over baseline Macbook Pro price.



$2200 

Too rich for my blood 

I mean come on how much you think Apple will have in that thing with parts,labor,shipping and r&d cost...hell even through in marketing?I bet they still make *close* too a grand on each one :shadedshu

BTW if you show up at your local coffee house with only a 256 ssd in your MacBook fucking PRO you will be laughed at....soo much so they will black ball you for ever!!


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 12, 2012)

Dippyskoodlez said:


> iirc Adobe products on OS X don't require Quadro(which would be stupid, since theres only ever been like 2-3 ever made since the Intel transition.). I could be wrong.
> 
> They also work on Ati GPU's, whereas on Windows they do not.



http://www.adobe.com/products/creativesuite/mastercollection/tech-specs.html



> Windows:
> •Dedicated GPU card required for SpeedGrade (for optimal performance in SpeedGrade and for GPU-accelerated features in Adobe Premiere Pro and After Effects: NVIDIA Quadro 4000, 5000, or 6000 or other Adobe-certified GPU card with at least 1GB of VRAM recommended); visit www.adobe.com/products/premiere/extend.html for supported cards
> 
> Mac OS:
> •Dedicated GPU card recommended (for optimal performance in SpeedGrade and for GPU-accelerated features in Adobe Premiere Pro and After Effects: NVIDIA Quadro 4000 or other Adobe-certified GPU card with at least 1GB of VRAM recommended); visit www.adobe.com/products/premiere/extend.html for supported cards


SpeedGrade requires CUDA and they recommend Quadro because of driver optimizations for Adobe products.

SpeedGrade specifically: http://www.adobe.com/products/speedgrade/tech-specs.html


> Windows:
> •Dedicated GPU card with at least 1GB VRAM (NVIDIA Quadro 4000, 5000, or 6000 recommended)
> 
> Mac OS:
> •Dedicated GPU card with at least 1GB of VRAM recommended (for optimal performance: NVIDIA Quadro 4000 for Mac)


PNY makes the Quadro 4000 for Mac.  That's your only choice though.  It's the only Quadro card, as far as I can tell, that NVIDIA makes Mac drivers for.


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 12, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> PNY makes the Quadro 4000 for Mac.  That's your only choice though.  It's the only Quadro card, as far as I can tell, that NVIDIA makes Mac drivers for.









Given the GT 650 just appeared for Macs, would stand to reason they just need to add it to the list.

My comment stands


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 12, 2012)

Only the "Quardo 4000 for Mac" could do 10-bit color and that can only be installed in Mac Pro.


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## Hotobu (Jun 12, 2012)

Too expensive, too used to Windows.

Awesome display though.


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## starstarman (Jun 12, 2012)

I dunno there were so many iFans and Apple Fanboys here!


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## Yo_Wattup (Jun 12, 2012)

No offence btarunr, but it would be nice to see a bit more effort put into your news articles. It is obvious that you just do a simple cut and paste - which is usually fine, and I do appreciate that you get hold of news incredibly quickly, but not when important pieces of information like the resolution of the screen are left out. 

Maybe a more thorough proofread? I dunno, I'm not a journalist, just trying to give some constructive criticism.

Sorry if I wasted anyone's time.


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## jigar2speed (Jun 12, 2012)

sc said:


> I hope that having a crappy GPU with such a resolution will be the start of Apple's downfall.



They don't have games which will revel how crappy their hardware is.


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## Kantastic (Jun 12, 2012)

starstarman said:


> I dunno there were so many iFans and Apple Fanboys here!



Find me any other laptop that comes close to Apple's new MBP specs & form factor for ANY price.


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## hardcore_gamer (Jun 12, 2012)

220ppi is enough for a retina display. This is false marketing.


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## Hotobu (Jun 12, 2012)

hardcore_gamer said:


> 220ppi is enough for a retina display. This is false marketing.



Well first of all I don't think it can technically be "false" marketing because "retina display" is just a nebulous term that Apple uses synonymously with "high pixel density." Second of all it's not just about ppi, it's about ppi relative to the distance of the viewer. In this case 220 ppi on a 15" display with a viewing distance of "arm's length" is proportional to what they've coined as "retina displays" on their other devices.


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## Yukikaze (Jun 12, 2012)

Okay. This thing might well be the first Mac I'll shell money for. I'm looking for a laptop upgrade, and since my laptop runs linux anyway, I don't need windows on it. Also, since that upgrade is free via a research grant, I don't care how overpriced Macs are (which is my typical objection)...

Edit: Now I just need to wait for the local supplier to get his act together...


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## Prima.Vera (Jun 12, 2012)

Fairlady-z said:


> I like the resolution and GPU for a clean looking laptop *to bad its not windows based lol.*...



To bad? To good! Have you ever seen how Windows 7 is scaling to that resolution??? hahaha. Not to mention Java/Flash/Active X .... It would have been a total disaster!


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## hardcore_gamer (Jun 12, 2012)

But...


It can't play crysis.


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## Completely Bonkers (Jun 12, 2012)

Apple, sell me a 2880x1800 desktop display with DVI or mini-display port (not just thunderbolt) in somewhere between 20" and 24" format and you've got THREE pre-sales waiting right here. I'll upgrade ALL MY MACHINES


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## pr0n Inspector (Jun 12, 2012)

So I opened apple.com to download the new iTunes then I saw this HOLY CRAP 2880x1800 JESUS CHRIST IT ACTUALLY HAPPENED!


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## Moose (Jun 12, 2012)

This is the first mac that I've even slightly liked, nice resolution and finally they made it look as though macs aren't for retards. However still let down by the lack of a decent operating system and how would I install windows 7 with no optical drive (usb stick of course but still crap)? Oh and the price never forget that, and the specs apart from the screen are shit for the price.

I mean that graphics card is utter shit Ive found a £450 laptop with a better gfx card and a quad core cpu in it.


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## johnnyfiive (Jun 12, 2012)

All of you Apple haters need to visit an Apple store and use a 27" iMac. The display and resolution is simply beautiful. After experiencing that, just imagine how nice the 2880x1800 display is going to look on the 15.4" screen....amazing stuff.


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## Frick (Jun 12, 2012)

Moose said:


> This is the first mac that I've even slightly liked, nice resolution and finally they made it look as though macs aren't for retards. However still let down by the lack of a decent operating system and how would I install windows 7 with no optical drive (usb stick of course but still crap)? Oh and the price never forget that, and the specs apart from the screen are shit for the price.
> 
> I mean that graphics card is utter shit Ive found a £450 laptop with a better gfx card and a quad core cpu in it.



Herp derp.


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## acerace (Jun 12, 2012)

johnnyfiive said:


> All of you Apple haters need to visit an Apple store and use a 27" iMac. The display and resolution is simply beautiful. After experiencing that, just imagine how nice the 2880x1800 display is going to look on the 15.4" screen....amazing stuff.



OS plays big roles on how beautiful it is.


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## Psychoholic (Jun 12, 2012)

My 27" dell U2711 @ 2560x1440 looks beaufiful... i can imagine how this looks.  I do wonder at what point do the pixels get so small that we can no longer tell a difference in quality.


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 12, 2012)

Psychoholic said:


> My 27" dell U2711 @ 2560x1440 looks beaufiful... i can imagine how this looks.  I do wonder at what point do the pixels get so small that we can no longer tell a difference in quality.



That's the point of "retina"  Not being able to see the pixels at the used distance.


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## Psychoholic (Jun 12, 2012)

And my point was, i dont know if i could see the pixels on a 1920x1080 15" screen either.  Not sure because i dont think i have seen one.


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## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 12, 2012)

Psychoholic said:


> And my point was, i dont know if i could see the pixels on a 1920x1080 15" screen either.  Not sure because i dont think i have seen one.










or you can reference

http://goo.gl/dNkj6

You will see 1080p(15.4in lcd) pixels until you get about 24 inches away.

Macbook pro is for about ~15in and beyond.


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## Moose (Jun 12, 2012)

Frick said:


> Herp derp.



A typical mac user response no justification as they know (or should know) they are wrong.


----------



## Frick (Jun 12, 2012)

Moose said:


> A typical mac user response no justification as they know (or should know) they are wrong.



Hurr durr.


----------



## Depth (Jun 12, 2012)

I came in here to watch all the hate...

Must be something wrong with the internet today. Can't find much.


----------



## Fourstaff (Jun 12, 2012)

This will make so many professionals happy.

Gamers need not put their names in the waiting list.


----------



## Depth (Jun 12, 2012)

Depth said:


> I came in here to watch all the hate...
> 
> Must be something wrong with the internet today. Can't find much.





Fourstaff said:


> This will make so many professionals happy.


----------



## Frick (Jun 12, 2012)

Depth said:


> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-2wOnmYLEHmc/Ty1wQTmX-dI/AAAAAAAAAG8/j2ql8l6-v3A/s1600/mother-god-meme.jpg


----------



## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 12, 2012)

Moose said:


> A typical mac user response no justification as they know (or should know) they are wrong.



You post was so blatantly wrong, refuting your claims is trivial.



> finally they made it look as though macs aren't for retards.


Because owning a brilliantly engineered device, means you need to be trying to find better ways to waste money on inefficiency, and half baked feature creep? You must work for a large US corporation as management.  Don't you have a meeting about having meetings to go to?



> However still let down by the lack of a decent operating system



OS X has exponentially more baseline features and capabilities every major update than any version of windows has ever had. Not only do they implement by default an overwhelming majority of open standards like SSH, VNC, SAMBA, but Apple also openly releases the code to these, AND contributes.




> and how would I install windows 7 with no optical drive (usb stick of course but still crap)?



Because even the great microsoft, that injects endless streams of steroids into legacy interfaces even has a simple, and _significantly faster solution_ to optical media. Apple also targetted this specific machine as giving up legacy interfaces, on top of the fact that a cdrom will not physically fit in the chassis, because it is simply too thin @ .71 inches, which is also why it does not include Ethernet.



> Oh and the price never forget that, and the specs apart from the screen are shit for the price.



Theres always a premium for miniaturization of technology. Apple is the bleeding edge. I'm sorry Dell hasn't figured out how to make an Ultrabook for you to buy yet.



> I mean that graphics card is utter shit Ive found a £450 laptop with a better gfx card and a quad core cpu in it.



That £450 won't be .71 inches thick, with 7+ hours of battery life(Or offer dual thunderbolt). You'll be lucky to see 4, and you won't have a 1080 screen, let alone 2880x1800. This argument is pretty much heresy without a link, anyways.


----------



## FordGT90Concept (Jun 12, 2012)

Dippyskoodlez said:


> OS X has exponentially more baseline features and capabilities every major update than any version of windows has ever had.


...because Microsoft gets sued when they add features to Windows (EU called it "bundling").




Dippyskoodlez said:


> Because even the great microsoft, that injects endless streams of steroids into legacy interfaces even has a simple, and _significantly faster solution_ to optical media. Apple also targetted this specific machine as giving up legacy interfaces, on top of the fact that a cdrom will not physically fit in the chassis, because it is simply too thin @ .71 inches, which is also why it does not include Ethernet.


And this is why Apple is full of fail.  Fancy screen and what are you going to do with it?  Look at low resolution internet pictures?  What about music?  Oh right, handcuff yourself to iTunes and an internet connection.  What you're describing is a lack of features, not features.  This is no different than Mac OS X's incapability to run on off-the-shelf x86 systems without substantial hacking.  Virtually all computers out there today rely on USB (except Macs) for interfacing with cameras, mice, keyboards, flash sticks, etc.  Optical drives are also common place for music, movies, installing software, transferring files, etc.  Apple may be ignorant of their customers' needs but they are the exception, not the norm.




Dippyskoodlez said:


> Theres always a premium for miniaturization of technology. Apple is the bleeding edge. I'm sorry Dell hasn't figured out how to make an Ultrabook for you to buy yet.


I have yet to find a sane person that has a problem with a laptop 1" thick.  Considering all the flexibility you lose for that .29", most choose thick.  Need I remind you Mac marketshare is still ~6%.  If you want to fail, you copy Mac.


----------



## Fourstaff (Jun 12, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I have yet to find a sane person that has a problem with a laptop 1" thick.  Considering all the flexibility you lose for that .29", most choose thick.  Need I remind you Mac marketshare is still ~6%.  If you want to fail, you copy Mac.



When you are carrying tens of kgs worth of books to and from university everyday you would appreciate the smaller form factor. If you don't like Apple, then its not for you. Just like Rolls Royce etc.


----------



## Kantastic (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I have yet to find a sane person that has a problem with a laptop 1" thick.  Considering all the flexibility you lose for that .29", most choose thick.  Need I remind you Mac marketshare is still ~6%.  *If you want to fail, you copy Mac.*



Tell that to Android users, Ultrabook users, smartphone users, and tablet users. Apple was the pioneer is shaping today's portable electronics industry; other companies are just playing follow the leader.

Do I own any Apple products? No.
Do I agree with their business practices? No.
Do I appreciate everything they've done for the computing industry? Yes.


----------



## FordGT90Concept (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> When you are carrying tens of kgs worth of books to and from university everyday you would appreciate the smaller form factor. If you don't like Apple, then its not for you. Just like Rolls Royce etc.


The weight is about the same.  4.46 lbs for MacBook Pro 15" and 5.22 lbs for first random 15" computer I Googled that just happened to be an HP.  You're talking minimal differences on both metrics.


----------



## Kantastic (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> The weight is about the same.  4.46 lbs for MacBook Pro 15" and 5.22 lbs for first random 15" computer I Googled that just happened to be an HP.  You're talking minimal differences on both metrics.



Aluminum Unibody vs. plastic.


----------



## Yo_Wattup (Jun 13, 2012)

Dippyskoodlez said:


> You post was so blatantly wrong, refuting your claims is trivial.
> 
> 
> Because owning a brilliantly engineered device, means you need to be trying to find better ways to waste money on inefficiency, and half baked feature creep? You must work for a large US corporation as management.  Don't you have a meeting about having meetings to go to?
> ...



Do you HAVE to be such a fanboy.. really?


----------



## Kantastic (Jun 13, 2012)

Yo_Wattup said:


> Do you HAVE to be such a fanboy.. really?



Do you really not have any other argument besides crying fanboyism? How about something constructive with citations?


----------



## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> The weight is about the same.  4.46 lbs for MacBook Pro 15" and 5.22 lbs for first random 15" computer I Googled that just happened to be an HP.  You're talking minimal differences on both metrics.



Possibly, but I ran out of ways to explain why Macs are so popular in my uni, library trips suggests 30% of the laptops are Macs of some sort.



Yo_Wattup said:


> Do you HAVE to be such a fanboy.. really?


What has Apple done to earn your unconditional hatred for them? 

While I personally will not really buy Apple stuffs (besides MBA and iPod), I believe they shaped the last decade more than possibly any other tech companies through their sheer marketing power and innovation.


----------



## FordGT90Concept (Jun 13, 2012)

Kantastic said:


> Tell that to Android users, Ultrabook users, smartphone users, and tablet users. Apple was the pioneer is shaping today's portable electronics industry; other companies are just playing follow the leader.


Pioneer, no.  What they did was throw Apple fanaticism into markets they weren't already beat in.  Don't remember the PalmPilot, BlackBerry, Windows Mobile, and all the other portable devices that pre-dated the iPhone?  Ultrabook is an Intel technology which happened as a response to tablet computers (tabletizing the dimensions of the laptop). Tablets also existed long before (e.g. Microsoft Tablet PC in 2000) Apple introduced the iPad.  All Apple did in the last decade and a half is take an existing product they didn't make, remake it with a few Apple finishing touches, and market it as being "hip."  Apple has a brilliant marketing team and little else.




Kantastic said:


> Aluminum Unibody vs. plastic.


It's not aluminum, it's magnesium alloy, the same shit the PC industry has been using for at least a decade in rugged and semi-rugged computers.  Why does Dell, HP, Acer, etc. not use magnesium alloy in their laptops?  Because very few laptops are sold for more than $1500 which is the minimum a respectable computer shrouded in magnesium alloy costs (and that's still for integrated everything).




Fourstaff said:


> Possibly, but I ran out of ways to explain why Macs are so popular in my uni, library trips suggests 30% of the laptops are Macs of some sort.


I don't know how but Apple managed to build a cult following.  As I said in the reply to Kantastic, it probably has to do with Apple marketing their products as being "hip."  I'd rather think that the younger generations are just too daft to see through advertising (an epidemic in the making).


----------



## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I don't know how but Apple managed to build a cult following.  As I said in the reply to Kantastic, it probably has to do with Apple marketing their products as being "hip."  I'd rather think that the younger generations are just too daft to see through advertising (an epidemic in the making).



Imperial College is not known to be hip. You find departments running solely on Linux, and things like that. And yet you still get a sizeable number of Apple users, from students to professors.


----------



## FordGT90Concept (Jun 13, 2012)

Apple markets to individuals, not businesses/campuses/etc.  They individually joined the cult, not the campus at large (cost prohibitive).  You know IT people hate dealling with Apples on their networks so all the backbone and institutional computers are not Apple.  As you said, they're Linux likely to avoid Windows licencsing costs.  Around here, they all run Systemax, Gateway (now Acer), or Dell running Windows.  The Apple computers are relegated to specific departments like keyboarding and art/graphics.


----------



## Moose (Jun 13, 2012)

The main point is the screen isn't worth the premium! Nor any other of the crap "features"


Dippyskoodlez said:


> OS X has exponentially more baseline features and capabilities every major update than any version of windows has ever had. Not only do they implement by default an overwhelming majority of open standards like SSH, VNC, SAMBA, but Apple also openly releases the code to these, AND contributes.


Err, as others have said, why would I want a load of crap like itunes forced upon me? I'll choose what I want thank you. Also when I can install it on any computer THEN we'll talk about openness. Also their latest mountain lion's new "feature" which you pay for is a calendar, wow I can get free calanders.



> Apple also targetted this specific machine as giving up legacy interfaces, on top of the fact that a cdrom will not physically fit in the chassis, because it is simply too thin @ .71 inches, which is also why it does not include Ethernet.


Just because Apple are to stupid not to make it a little thicker so it can fit useful ports like ethernet doesn't make it an excuse. Them wanting to give up ethernet doesn't mean everyone else does, lol wireless is hardly a replacement.



> Theres always a premium for miniaturization of technology. Apple is the bleeding edge. I'm sorry Dell hasn't figured out how to make an Ultrabook for you to buy yet.
> 
> That £450 won't be .71 inches thick, with 7+ hours of battery life(Or offer dual thunderbolt). You'll be lucky to see 4, and you won't have a 1080 screen, let alone 2880x1800. This argument is pretty much heresy without a link, anyways.



Lol, Apple is hardly bleeding edge with a gpu like that try playing a game on that screen (if osx supports it! So no) 1fps bleeding edge for you.
Acer Aspire 5560G Laptop - Laptops | Ebuyer.com link to a great deal. Must mean the screen costs £1500!



Kantastic said:


> Tell that
> to Android users, Ultrabook users, smartphone users, and tablet users. Apple was the pioneer is shaping today's portable electronics industry; other companies are just playing follow the leader.


I'm an android user my better than iphone galaxy s2 costs me £10 per month less than Apple's 4s



Kantastic said:


> Aluminum Unibody vs. plastic.


Not all pcs are plastic and not all plastic is bad.


----------



## Maban (Jun 13, 2012)

If I had the money and it was $400 cheaper I'd definitely consider one. It's nice to see the specs almost catch up with the price.


----------



## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

Moose said:


> The main point is the screen isn't worth the premium! Nor any other of the crap "features"
> 
> Err, as others have said, why would I want a load of crap like itunes forced upon me? I'll choose what I want thank you. Also when I can install it on any computer THEN we'll talk about openness.
> 
> ...



If you think the screen is not worth the premium then this product is not for you. Don't like iTunes? You can install Winamp in Mac. There are alternatives if you look around. You can get USB to Ethernet for $5, so its a non issue there. Macs are not for gamers, hence they don't really care much about good graphics etc, just something there in case you have some free time and you want to game a bit. I would say SGSII and iPhone 4S serves different crowd, one calls for flexibility and the other functionality and ease of use. Source: time spent playing with friend's phones.


----------



## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> The weight is about the same.  4.46 lbs for MacBook Pro 15" and 5.22 lbs for first random 15" computer I Googled that just happened to be an HP.  You're talking minimal differences on both metrics.



No, a 15" with *comparable specs* matches closer to 6-8lbs+. "Random 15" computer" does not have a 1080+ screen, and a GT650+, letalone Thunderbolt. Link, or I'm calling *bullshit.* The specs for the laptop you linked are utterly pathetic to call comparable.

```
[U]1366 x 768[/U] LCD
8GB Ram [U]1333MHz[/U]
Core i[B]5[/B]
750GB [U]5400 RPM HDD[/U]
[U]6-Cell Lithium-ion[/U]
```
A comparable Dell Latitude clocks in at $2346 and still isn't 1:1 comparable. (And for a $200 premium OVER a Macbook Pro, you get 5.46lbs using a **4 cell** battery.)



FordGT90Concept said:


> ...because Microsoft gets sued when they add features to Windows (EU called it "bundling").



Thats why Microsoft removed Hyperterminal?





> Fancy screen and what are you going to do with it?  Look at low resolution internet pictures?


You have a screen higher than 600x200? You're not allowed to view my sigpic. Please unload this webpage.  Thats the dumbest half baked argument I have ever seen. You're really scrounging the bottom of the barrel for hate, aren't you?




> What about music?  Oh right, handcuff yourself to iTunes and an internet connection.



I actually actively use iTunes, Spotify, Amazon Mp3 store. I have no DRM. I'm also in the *middle of Afghanistan*. Don't you *dare* tell me I'm tethered to the internet. Thats flat out ignorance. I sometimes go days to weeks without "internet" access[Commercial civilian, not DOD network. 99.8% uptime, whats up bro?]. Internet is my *job* here.




> What you're describing is a lack of features, not features.  This is no different than Mac OS X's incapability to run on off-the-shelf x86 systems without substantial hacking.  Virtually all computers out there today rely on USB (except Macs) for interfacing with cameras, mice, keyboards, flash sticks, etc.  Optical drives are also common place for music, movies, installing software, transferring files, etc.  Apple may be ignorant of their customers' needs but they are the exception, not the norm.



Common? Yes. Mandatory? Not even close. They aren't ignorant of needs; Have you seen the thicker 15" Macbook Pros with DVDROMs still? Apparently not.  You're hating on a product that is targeted, and designed for people not wanting certain legacy interfaces. The CDROM is well on its way to being the next floppy disk.



> I have yet to find a sane person that has a problem with a laptop 1" thick.  Considering all the flexibility you lose for that .29", most choose thick.



 A Macbook Air Vs. an 8Lbs Sager  is a significant difference when you are constantly moving, letalone lugging around 100lbs of gear. Civilian side, it's convenient to have a nice thin, elegant design. Why do people have V8 mustangs, despite driving 35mph-75mph daily?  This also coming from someone with the name FordGT90Concept.  It really can be comparable to cars.




> Need I remind you Mac marketshare is still ~6%.  If you want to fail, you copy Mac.


Need I remind you Apple is the most profitable company in the world?

Don't copy success, Don't copy being innovative, Copy failure(GM), or RIM



FordGT90Concept said:


> Ultrabook is an Intel technology which happened as a response to tablet computers (tabletizing the dimensions of the laptop).


Please, keep telling yourself that. If you don't believe that the pictures are nearly carbon copies of the Macbook Air, you're just blind. 




> which is the minimum a respectable computer shrouded in magnesium alloy costs (and that's still for integrated everything).


$999 Macbook Air costs $1500? Sup.  Thats a pretty good joke.




> I don't know how but Apple managed to build a cult following.



Its probably their strict attention to detail, and actually caring about their users experience, instead of feature creep, and bloatware.

Why does Porsche have the prestigious following that they do?


----------



## repman244 (Jun 13, 2012)

I have just one question:

At what type of workloads are these laptops aimed?

And I'm not trolling, I'm genuinely interested.


----------



## freaksavior (Jun 13, 2012)

This thread is winning.


----------



## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 13, 2012)

repman244 said:


> I have just one question:
> 
> At what type of workloads are these laptops aimed?
> 
> And I'm not trolling, I'm genuinely interested.



Anything you want to, really. These machines are perfectly capable of Photoshop and video editing, to gaming to an extent(GT650 isn't the highest end, but its a tradeoff for battery life and mobility.)

I'd say a majority of the market are general users (read: students), Developers [programming], Multiplatform development [OS X, Linux, and windows in a single box], Photoshop, Video editing, etc. 

Some people just don't want windows, too.


----------



## FordGT90Concept (Jun 13, 2012)

Dippyskoodlez said:


> No, a 15" with *comparable specs* matches closer to 6-8lbs+. "Random 15" computer" does not have a 1080+ screen, and a GT650+, letalone Thunderbolt. Link, or I'm calling *bullshit.* The specs for the laptop you linked are utterly pathetic to call comparable.
> 
> ```
> [U]1366 x 768[/U] LCD
> ...


Take your pick.
SONY VAIO SVS15113FXS Notebook Intel Core i5 3210M... 4.42 lbs.
SONY VAIO SVS15116FXS Notebook Intel Core i7 3612Q... 4.42 lbs.

DELL XPS 15z (X15z-7502ELS) Notebook Intel Core i7... 5.54 lbs.
HP ENVY 15-3040NR Notebook Intel Core i7 2670QM(2.... 5.79 lbs
TOSHIBA Qosmio F755-3D350 Notebook Intel Core i7 2... 5.4 lbs.
ThinkPad W Series W520 (42763LU) Notebook Intel Co... 5.75 lbs.

SONY VAIO CB Series VPCCB27FX/B Notebook Intel Cor... 6.30 lbs

MSI G Series GT600NC-004US Notebook Intel Core i7 ... 7.7 lbs.




Dippyskoodlez said:


> Thats why Microsoft removed Hyperterminal?


You're link says right on it that it was superceded by other programs.  I'm talking about the EU lawsuit that forced Microsoft to separate Internet Explorer, Windows Media Player, and other programs from the EU release of Windows.  Mac OS X still comes with Safari and iTunes last time I checked.




Dippyskoodlez said:


> You have a screen higher than 600x200? You're not allowed to view my sigpic. Please unload this webpage.  Thats the dumbest half baked argument I have ever seen. You're really scrounging the bottom of the barrel for hate, aren't you?


24" 1920x1200  I don't see how this is relevent to the discussion at all.





Dippyskoodlez said:


> I actually actively use iTunes, Spotify, Amazon Mp3 store. I have no DRM. I'm also in the *middle of Afghanistan*. Don't you *dare* tell me I'm tethered to the internet. Thats flat out ignorance.


A friend of mine can't stop using iTunes because he bought over 1000 songs that are protected AAC from iTunes.  In order to use them in other software, he has to remove the protection and that's easier said than done.  As I said, handcuffed.

Obviously, Apple discontinued protected AAC when other MP3 download stores popped up everywhere and Apple was losing business to the DRM free retailers.  They did not, however, retroactively remove DRM on DRM protected music previously purchased.




Dippyskoodlez said:


> Common? Yes. Mandatory? Not even close. They aren't ignorant of needs; Have you seen the thicker 15" Macbook Pros with DVDROMs still? Apparently not.  You're hating on a product that is targeted, and designed for people not wanting certain legacy interfaces. The CDROM is well on its way to being the next floppy disk.


I just built a brand new, $4000 computer for someone and guess what he asked for?  A floppy!  It also has two Bluray burners because he's taking VHS, converting it to DVD, then enhancing it, and burning it to Bluray.  FDD are on their way out, yes, because Intel killed it (no more FDD header on motherboards).  You're kidding yourself if you don't think optical disks won't be around for another 10 years at least.  They're far from done.





Dippyskoodlez said:


> A Macbook Air Vs. an 8Lbs Sager  is a significant difference when you are constantly moving, letalone lugging around 100lbs of gear. Civilian side, it's convenient to have a nice thin, elegant design. Why do people have V8 mustangs, despite driving 35mph-75mph daily?  This also coming from someone with the name FordGT90Concept.  It really can be comparable to cars.


Look what you talked about there: weight, not thickness.  I explicitly was talking about thickness.  Guess you don't care about thickness either. 




Dippyskoodlez said:


> Need I remind you Apple is the most profitable company in the world?
> 
> Don't copy success, Don't copy being innovative, Copy failure.


That's what happens when you're an evil corporation and exploit the poorest people on Earth.  Oh, I'm sorry HP, Dell, Microsoft, etc. actually cares about their employees enough to compensate them fairly.  When's the last time a Systemax, Inc. factory had a riot?  Oh, never.

GM got dragged down by unions, excessive branding, and bad management that refused to compete.  Apple had some of those problems in the 1990s but not in the 2000s.  I fail to see how that's relevant.




Dippyskoodlez said:


> Please, keep telling yourself that. If you don't believe that the pictures are nearly carbon copies of the Macbook Air, you're just blind.


I guess all cars are carbon copies because they have 4 wheels and a steering wheel.  All laptops, regardless of make and model, have similar components with the same requirements.  This is why all laptops have similar shapes and sizes.  I feel like I'm being Captain Obvious.




Dippyskoodlez said:


> $999 Macbook Air costs $1500? Sup.  Thats a pretty good joke.


MacBook Air is aluminum, not magnesium alloy.  Yeah, very funny. 






Dippyskoodlez said:


> Its probably their strict attention to detail, and actually caring about their users experience, instead of feature creep, and bloatware.
> 
> Why does Porsche have the prestigious following that they do?


Like Porsche, they control every aspect of the design from hardware components to operating system and software.  They can thoroughly test everything because there's only a handful of variables and they have their own supply chain as well (built by Apple, sold by Apple, supported by Apple).  Buy a Dell, for example, it's built by Dell, sold by Best Buy, supported by any techie with computer knowledge.  Their facism gives them a leg up in some regards but, again, the handcuffs.

Most people I run into can't tell me why they like their Apple product without spewing Apple sales lines (e.g. "it just works").  It has all the hallmarks of fantacism so I'll call it what it is: fantacism.


----------



## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> 1 4.42 lbs.
> 2 4.42 lbs.
> 
> 3 5.54 lbs.
> ...


(I numbered them for easy reference.) 1-6 Don't even come close in CPU, LCD, GPU, or HDD. 7 and 8 are  1.5 -> twice the Macbook pro weight for comparable performance.


> You're link says right on it that it was superceded by other programs.  I'm talking about the EU lawsuit that forced Microsoft to separate Internet Explorer, Windows Media Player, and other programs from the EU release of Windows.  Mac OS X still comes with Safari and iTunes last time I checked.


The EU suit was because they could not be removed without breaking windows itself.  Don't bother with details that completely obliterate your completely invalid argument, that would give credit to yourself.

OS X apps are 100% removable. Hyperterminal was superceded by *non microsoft apps*, as detailed inn my link that you did not read. Leave out more details that completely destroy your baseless argument, please. This is much too easy.




> 24" 1920x1200  I don't see how this is relevent to the discussion at all.


Computers are only for gaming and surfing low resolution kitten pictures, you're right.




> In order to use them in other software, he has to remove the protection and that's easier said than done.  As I said, handcuffed.


Step 1.) Delete ALL DRM FILES.
Step 2.) Redownload from iTunes Cloud for Free.
Step 3.) ???
Step 4.) Profit!

Handcuffed sure is a good description.



> You're kidding yourself if you don't think optical disks won't be around for another 10 years at least.  They're far from done.



Some people still use DOS (My Grandma.).

Personally, once I get home, I will probably never touch a CDROM again. I'm not forcing you to buy a CDROM, but I specifically wanted a Macbook without one. Apple too, thinks theres people that don't want one. Wheres the issue here? Don't buy it if *you* don't like it. *I* don't want to waste money on a CDROM.




> That's what happens when you're an evil corporation and exploit the poorest people on Earth.  Oh, I'm sorry HP, Dell, Microsoft, etc. actually cares about their employees enough to compensate them fairly.


I'm sorry, but you can say with 100% certainty Dell, HP, IBm have never OEm's a single Foxxconn product, and Foxxconn is the only OEM with these problems?

Dude, get real. Take your blind fold off! Please!




> GM got dragged down by unions, excessive branding, and bad management that refused to compete.  Apple had some of those problems in the 1990s but not in the 2000s.  I fail to see how that's relevant.



Relevant? GM is now a BURDEN on the american government, because its "too big to fail", Apple is atleast contributing to things by providing jobs and not requiring taxpayer money to stay afloat.

Please though, politics need to halt here though. This is about a Macbook Pro, not Ethics.




> Like Porsche, they control every aspect of the design from hardware components to operating system and software.  They can thoroughly test everything because there's only a handful of variables and they have their own supply chain as well (built by Apple, sold by Apple, supported by Apple).  Buy a Dell, for example, it's built by Dell, sold by Best Buy, supported by any techie with computer knowledge.  Their facism gives them a leg up in some regards but, again, the handcuffs.



I'm apparently employed by apple, since I help support people that use Macs. 

Well poop, I want my paycheck, please!

Any computer is handcuffed in some way; Be it CPU socket, OEM feature decision, or having items soldered directly on. Any Car is handcuffed in similar ways; Cobalts generally only have a 4 cylinder. Guns are limited to Calibers. Etc. Its a cost benefit analysis for the user. Use what *you* want.




> Most people I run into can't tell me why they like their Apple product without spewing Apple sales lines (e.g. "it just works").  It has all the hallmarks of fantacism so I'll call it what it is: fantacism.




But they're probably happy. Isn't that the point of buying one product over another? I bought a Cobalt. I'm happy with it. Can I take it apart and put it together again? Maybe if I tried, but off hand, no. But does that make me a fanatic for using a product I like? This makes no sense.


----------



## hv43082 (Jun 13, 2012)

This is going to be my new laptop. So freaking sweet.


----------



## Yo_Wattup (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> .
> 
> 
> What has Apple done to earn your unconditional hatred for them?



What? When did I say or even imply that I dislike apple? Ease up on that tweak dude. I was just mentioning that that user had a ridiculous amount of fanboyism and it was painful to read his post. He was not posting anything factual, just attacking anyone who looked like they didn't like apple... a little like yourself... 

My god, you apple guys get so defensive....


----------



## Dippyskoodlez (Jun 13, 2012)

Yo_Wattup said:


> . He was not posting anything factual, just attacking anyone who looked like they didn't like apple... a little like yourself...
> 
> My god, you apple guys get so defensive....


----------



## Moose (Jun 13, 2012)

I love how macs are always compared to cars, ok we'll do that for a mac you take a, lets say, porche chassis and stick a lawnmower engine in it and charge the same you would a porche.

In a pc (or linux based machine) you take whatever chassis you want and stick whatever engine you like in it, W16 inside a bugatti veyron chassis anyone?

Yes the fastest pc is faster than the fastest mac.


----------



## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

Moose said:


> Yes the fastest pc is faster than the fastest mac.



No doubt about that, but a Mac can do things a PC can't and with Boot Camp Macs can do everything PC can.


----------



## Frick (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> but a Mac can do things a PC can't



What would that be?


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## acerace (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> No doubt about that, but a *Mac can do things a PC can't* and with Boot Camp Macs can do everything PC can.



What? iCloud?


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

Frick said:


> What would that be?



Final Cut Pro for one


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## alucard13mmfmj (Jun 13, 2012)

hxxp://news.yahoo.com/next-gen-macs-big-step-games-005643807.html

"Apple made a number of announcements during its Worldwide Developers Conference yesterday (June 11), including some that could change the way gamers look at its laptops forever, with the new MacBook Pro."

It seems Apple trying to market it's new MacBook as a gaming laptop?...  While I'm sure it would be _decent_ in gaming, I wonder how much it'll cost. I'm guessing 2,000 US dollars.

I do like apple for the looks of its computers and solid exterior build. The other parts don't really interest me... I think the thing that annoys me is the single button mouses for MACs >.>. You'll be surprise how many I still run into these single button mouses.


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## Aquinus (Jun 13, 2012)

alucard13mmfmj said:


> I do like apple for the looks of its computers and solid exterior build. The other parts don't really interest me... I think the thing that annoys me is the single button mouses for MACs >.>. You'll be surprise how many I still run into these single button mouses.



Then plug a two button mouse into the Mac? You need a right click? Hold control. You have a trackpad? tap it with two fingers. This is a non-issue with modern Macs. I like my MBP because it's an i5 that gets 7 hours of battery life, even after heavy battery use after 1 year. I can't complain, granted I also didn't have to buy it, my job provides a MBP 13" Mac for all full time employees. So if you take the price out of the picture, Apple makes pretty nice products.



Fourstaff said:


> Final Cut Pro for one


Ever use Adobe Premiere? Please, continue the list of software that makes a difference for the average user.


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## repman244 (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> Final Cut Pro for one



Windows: Adobe Premier, Sony Vegas, and if I remember correctly Avid as well...

So far the only advantage of MBP is the battery life for such a thin laptop. 
But being thin only brings more heat and I somehow fail to see this machine running heavy workloads, of course I could be wrong and Apple actually improved cooling a lot, but it's thickness doesn't suggest that.


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## Aquinus (Jun 13, 2012)

repman244 said:


> But being thin only brings more heat and I somehow fail to see this machine running heavy workloads, of course I could be wrong and Apple actually improved cooling a lot, but it's thickness doesn't suggest that.



Apple products actually don't run any hotter than other solutions, you just feel is because the alumninum chassis conducts heat from the CPU (and GPU if you have discrete video,) but that is half of the reason Apple started using the aluminum chassis, you don't want to keep the heat in, you want to get it out and the aluminum chassis does that.

My MBP 13" does get warm, but certainly no hotter than my Dell Studio 1735, in fact I would say the actual air that comes out is cooler, but the chassis get hotter, but that was also what Apple was trying to do, so it really is a non-issue.

I personally like OS X as an OS. It's very solid and very fluid. I like it a lot better than the monstrosity that is Windows 8 and Metro. 

Personally, I've been liking *nix with X and i3 window manager until I want to play a video game, in that case I use Windows 7, but honestly, OS X is a good intermediary.


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

Aquinus said:


> Ever use Adobe Premiere? Please, continue the list of software that makes a difference for the average user.



No, I haven't used either software, but around me people use either one or the other but not both at the same time, so if you are working with a Final Cut group you are more or less forced to get one. 

That is more or less the only reason I managed to extract other than people getting Mac for looks or they are Mac trained.


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## repman244 (Jun 13, 2012)

Aquinus said:


> Apple products actually don't run any hotter than other solutions, you just feel is because the alumninum chassis conducts heat from the CPU (and GPU if you have discrete video,) but that is half of the reason Apple started using the aluminum chassis, you don't want to keep the heat in, you want to get it out and the aluminum chassis does that.
> 
> My MBP 13" does get warm, but certainly no hotter than my Dell Studio 1735, in fact I would say the actual air that comes out is cooler, but the chassis get hotter, but that was also what Apple was trying to do, so it really is a non-issue.
> 
> ...




For me, I can't stand a hot body of the laptop, especially when the keyboard area is hot and causing your hands to sweat like crazy (it could be my hands ), the exhaust is there to vent out the hot air so why not use it instead of using the whole body (Don't get me wrong, I understand what you are trying to say when talking about the aluminium shell).
However it could be my type of workload which is mostly CAD/Rendering/Photo editing where the laptop is usually running at highest usage, both GPU and CPU, yes it's a bit noisy when it's fan ramps up but I can't imagine having a thinner laptop with a small fan inside 

I like OS X for it's DPI scaling which Win 7 lacks, I hope it will be improved for Win 8 since it will be used on wide variety of devices with different resolutions and display sizes


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## Aquinus (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> That is more or less the only reason I managed to extract other than people getting Mac for looks or they are Mac trained.



I find OS X more intuitive than other solutions, their support is also amazing considering at least where I live, can actually bring the physical computer to the Apple Store and I will know that when I get it back I wont:

A: Pay a single cent except for the gas to get there.
B: It will work when I get it back.
...and last but not least (my favorite,)
C: If you have a Apple product with a known hardware issue that has caused issues with your machine, they will fix it for free regardless of the status of your warranty.

Finally as a Systems Admin who manages dozens of mobile Macs, I can tell you that administration of remote systems on Macs is amazing. So all in all, I find that I have to fix Apple laptops at lot less than PC laptops. Apple products just simply have less issues with both hardware and software, and if it is in warranty, Apple makes it simple for the user. You're buying that user experience, you're not just buying hardware.

My laptop has only crashed after being put to sleep and woken up multiple times over the course of multiple weeks with the exception of the Airport utility, which just doesn't work half of the time for me but that could be because of how I configured the laptop and our network, so I could have introduced that bug.


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## Moose (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> with Boot Camp Macs can do everything PC can.



The thing about boot camp is you've turned it into a pc, as soon as you talk about stuff you run on that you are complimenting windows and it's ability to be installed on anything, microsoft don't lock it to certain computers.


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## repman244 (Jun 13, 2012)

I found some pictures of a disassembled unit: http://forum.notebookreview.com/app...2-teardown-lots-pics-ifixit-56k-warning.html#

The glued battery


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

Moose said:


> The thing about boot camp is you've turned it into a pc, as soon as you talk about stuff you run on that you are complimenting windows and it's ability to be installed on anything, microsoft don't lock it to certain computers.



Microsoft primarily provides software and no more, Apple is an integrated system manufacturer. Its quite a lot different, for example you can build your own Caterham 7 off parts you choose, but you can only buy a Ford as is.


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## Prima.Vera (Jun 13, 2012)

repman244 said:


> I have just one question:
> 
> At what type of workloads are these laptops aimed?
> 
> And I'm not trolling, I'm genuinely interested.



Browsing internet, office work, some movies/music usage, but mostly bragging with it.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> No doubt about that, but a Mac can do things a PC can't and with Boot Camp Macs can do everything PC can.


Again, that's not a feature of Mac, it's a feature of Windows being able to run on just about any hardware out there.  Try to install Mac OS X on an off the shelf DOS box.  Can't do it or if you can, it's full of headaches.  Apple installs firmware on their hardware to prevent its OS from being installed on non-Apple hardware (a.k.a. DRM).  Again, a testament to Windows' flexibility,  Apple's clever marketing (spinning a con into a pro), and fanatacism (beliving the lie).




Fourstaff said:


> Microsoft primarily provides software and no more, Apple is an integrated system manufacturer. Its quite a lot different, for example you can build your own Caterham 7 off parts you choose, but you can only buy a Ford as is.


Microsoft provides a foundation, namely WDM which allows any manufacturer to easily write drivers for their product that will work on Windows.

Mac, on the other hand, only supports the hardware it is compiled to support in the firmware.  Those options are very, very limited and most off-the-shelf products have no support at all.

Never heard of an upfitter apparently.  For example, you can't buy a Ford with a CNG system directly from the factory.  You have to buy the vehicle from Ford and have an upfitter install a CNG system.  The vehicle is still warrantied by Ford but Ford did not do all the final assembly on the vehicle.


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Again, that's not a feature of Mac, it's a feature of Windows being able to run on just about any hardware out there.  Try to install Mac OS X on an off the shelf PC.  Can't do it or if you can, it's full of headaches.  Apple installs firmware on their hardware to prevent its OS from being installed on non-Apple hardware.  Again, a testiment to Windows' flexibility and Apple's clever marketing (spinning a con into a pro).



Whether that is a feature or a pain in the ass its still a fact. Windows build their OS in such a way that you can run it everywhere, whereas Mac OS is tied down to the machine and that is how their business plans worked since 1970s.

If you actually compare a MacBook and a HP/Dell/etc with similar specs the Mac OS premium is not that much. The cost of a MacBook Pro is only slightly more than a similarly spec'ed Alienware, something which is well known to overprice their stuff by about 20% or more and still have poorer build quality.



FordGT90Concept said:


> Microsoft provides a foundation, namely WDM which allows any manufacturer to easily write drivers for their product that will work on Windows.
> 
> Mac, on the other hand, only supports the hardware it is compiled to support in the firmware.  Those options are very, very limited and most off-the-shelf products have no support at all.
> 
> Never heard of an upfitter apparently.  For example, you can't buy a Ford with a CNG system directly from the factory.  You have to buy the vehicle from Ford and have an upfitter install a CNG system.  The vehicle is still warrantied by Ford but Ford did not do all the final assembly on the vehicle.



Microsoft doesn't manufacture much hardware, if at all hence it is to their advantage if you can easily write a driver so your product can run on Windows. Mac on the other hand, wants to control the entire ecosystem so that the end users will have the best experience (and earning a fair bit of coin in the way). Different approaches to the same idea, for example democracy works very well in US while you have a more or less an authoritarianism in Singapore, and you cannot really say neither country is not successful. One thing to note is that if you have a smaller headcount in your environment (eg smaller number of users, smaller population etc) its direct control from top down is the better option than one which has a big headcount. In that sense you can say Apple has grown too big and popular for its userbase. 

As a side note I have never encountered problems with using anything I plug into a Mac and there is usually a workaround (mostly through Linux) for the more pesky ones.

Yes I have never seen any options to fit CNG in UK or elsewhere by Ford, so I automatically assumed you cant. Change that car to something else which has that property.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 13, 2012)

I linked to this one a while ago in this thread (and that was without trying very hard):
MSI G Series GT600NC-004US Notebook Intel Core i7 ...

It's better equiped than the MacBook Pro or equal to it in every way except monitor and battery life and it's $700 less.


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I linked to this one a while ago in this thread (and that was without trying very hard):
> MSI G Series GT600NC-004US Notebook Intel Core i7 ...
> 
> It's better equiped than the MacBook Pro or equal to it in every way except monitor and battery life and it's $700 less.



Yup the MSI G series is really powerful and has very good bang for buck, but its an exception these days rather than the norm. Even Asus G series doesn't come close. Criticisms include being much more bulky and plasticky than a MacBook and the end user have to be slightly more careful when handling one. Source: playing around with GX660R, GT680 and GT780 and asking for the owner's experiences. the owner of GT680 also owns a MBA and uses both machines depending on what he wants to do (MBA for work and outside home stuff, GT680 stays in his room for gaming).


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 13, 2012)

For $700 difference, who is really going to complain?  You could buy an ultrabook too for that difference, or a tablet.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 13, 2012)

Easy Rhino said:


> sorry but i must interject. apple has been pushing hardware since the ipod. they were the first to stick that much computing power in a small mobile device.



yeah and now they buy bullshit patents and try to start patent wars on the competition when they make a better product then apple. yay! Seriously though


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## cadaveca (Jun 13, 2012)

THe new macbooks look good, but boy, are they pricey!


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> For $700 difference, who is really going to complain?  You could buy an ultrabook too for that difference, or a tablet.



That laptop series along with MBA 11" and Asus K5x series are what I usually recommend people to get if they want a laptop, I give plenty of love to them 



nvidiaintelftw said:


> yeah and now they buy bullshit patents and try to start patent wars on the competition when they make a better product then apple. yay! Seriously though



Patent trolls are nothing new, Apple stands to lose more or less everything they spent on their R&D and their raison d'etre if they don't do that. Nasty, but that is how quite a lot of companies in the tech industry work.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> That laptop series along with MBA 11" and Asus K5x series are what I usually recommend people to get if they want a laptop, I give plenty of love to them
> 
> 
> 
> Patent trolls are nothing new, Apple stands to lose more or less everything they spent on their R&D and their raison d'etre if they don't do that. Nasty, but that is how quite a lot of companies in the tech industry work.



I remember microsoft getting in trouble in the 1990s about buying out companies and getting stupid patents. Apple has been just going about it like its no ones business.


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

nvidiaintelftw said:


> I remember microsoft getting in trouble in the 1990s about buying out companies and getting stupid patents. Apple has been just going about it like its no ones business.



Microsoft was almost completely monopolising the market back in the 1990s, Apple is no where close to that position yet. When they get there no doubt people will start to antithrust them back in line.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> Microsoft was almost completely monopolising the market back in the 1990s, Apple is no where close to that position yet. When they get there no doubt people will start to antithrust them back in line.



A buddies dad who is a super apple fanboy said that Microsoft is still a big monoply. And I replied yeah maybe in the 1990s.


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## Fourstaff (Jun 13, 2012)

nvidiaintelftw said:


> A buddies dad who is a super apple fanboy said that Microsoft is still a big monoply. And I replied yeah maybe in the 1990s.



They are still dominant, but not to the point monopolising:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems#Web_clients


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## Moose (Jun 13, 2012)

Fourstaff said:


> Microsoft primarily provides software and no more, Apple is an integrated system manufacturer. Its quite a lot different, for example you can build your own Caterham 7 off parts you choose, but you can only buy a Ford as is.



It is actually true that we shouldn't really be comparing a mac as a whole (apple hardware and apple os) with windows (microsoft os) or even with a pc (oem/user built hardware and microsoft os). Microsoft isn't responsible for the pcs that companies churn out, so we should split the mac in half and compare the os with windows and then the hardware with every other computer manufacturer and personal build in the world.

On a forum like this where people are interested in customisation and very much choosing their own parts and os and fitting them together, the opinion is going to always be that a complete system is annoying and uncustomisable, customising before purchase for $200 for some RAM is too expensive compared to doing it yourself.

Therefore unless you are technically able and this just happens to have the exact specs for the exact price! you want, this is going to mainly appeal to people who buy a computer on looks, who wouldn't be able to upgrade one anyway, or who don't even understand the specs and just think Apple are so amazing that they must be right and everything "will just work" *cough* ethernet, games, fixing it, and in reply to an earlier comment ethernet via usb is not a viable replacement, ever.


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## mandis (Jun 14, 2012)

Patriot said:


> Does anyone have the real resolution...
> 
> is it 2560x1440 or 2560x1600?
> 
> 2560x1800 would be nearly 4:3 and they are not quite that stupid... though some of the buyers...



Hahaha!! you're funny!


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