# NVIDIA RTX 3060 Hashrate Limiter Defeated, GeForce 470.05 Driver Unlocks Full Mining Performance



## btarunr (Mar 15, 2021)

NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 hash-rate limiter has been defeated, by the company itself, through a driver update. The RTX 3060 was announced by NVIDIA to be meant purely for gamers as it came with measures that make them unviable for mining. The card purportedly had a hash-rate limiter that detected workloads from typical crypto-currency mining algorithms, and spooled down GPU clock speeds, halving the mining efficiency of the card. The idea was to sour the milk for miners, so there could be inventory for gamers. PC Watch reports that the latest GeForce 470.05 drivers distributed by NVIDIA to developers through the Windows Insider Program defeats the hash-rate limiter, significantly improving mining performance of the RTX 3060. With this driver out in the open, miners are sure to pick up RTX 3060 cards to go with it; and simply ignore all future driver updates through NVIDIA's official driver channel.

HardwareLuxx.de and ComputerBase have each independently verified that GeForce 470.05 drivers "restore" mining performance on RTX 3060 cards back to levels their hardware is capable of—roughly matching that of the RTX 2070 Super. This development confirms that the hash-rate limiter was purely driver based, and NVIDIA hoped to artificially throttle mining performance of RTX 3060 cards by simply adding this limiter to all compatible versions of GeForce drivers since the card's launch; but those behind the 470.05 special drivers probably forgot to implement it. Probably because it is based on a different branch of the source code, which is developed in parallel. NVIDIA earlier claimed that the hash-rate limited is a much more sophisticated mechanism involving a "secure handshake between the driver and system-firmware that prevents tampering." So much for that.



 



*View at TechPowerUp Main Site*


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## Gralorn (Mar 15, 2021)

I’m not surprised.


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## Xaled (Mar 15, 2021)

NVIDIA hoped to _seem that they_ throttled mining performance of RTX 3060 cards by simply adding this limiter to all compatible versions of GeForce drivers since the card's launch; _and after spreading the fake news,_ those behind the 470.05 special drivers _were told to not _implement it


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## ShurikN (Mar 15, 2021)

The way you are meant to be played.


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## Kissamies (Mar 15, 2021)

Cool, now they can be sold with even higher price.


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## P4-630 (Mar 15, 2021)

btarunr said:


> but those behind the 470.05 special drivers probably forgot to implement it.


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## the54thvoid (Mar 15, 2021)

I no longer care. I've given up on any further PC upgrades. The entire tech environment has gone to shit and the big corporations don't care who buys their products (oddly enough). Both Nvidia and AMD have been entirely disingenuous with their committments to PC gamers.

Screw them.


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## ThrashZone (Mar 15, 2021)

Hi,
Knew it was all show and no teeth.
Mining lawyers are sad lol


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## TheUn4seen (Mar 15, 2021)

And that's that for this stupidity.
This really was a shitty move no matter how you look at it. A lot of people who buy a GPU for gaming actually do single-GPU mining in free time just to offset the cost. I personally do just that, my 3080 is mining whenever I don't use the computer. Underclocked and limited to around 200W it chugs along at around 85MH/s which is more than enough to pay for my monthly electrical bill and a gigabit connection with some spare change left.


the54thvoid said:


> I no longer care. I've given up on any further PC upgrades. The entire tech environment has gone to shit and the big corporations don't care who buys their products (oddly enough). Both Nvidia and AMD have been entirely disingenuous with their committments to PC gamers.
> 
> Screw them.


Wait, did you really think corporations care about you or any consumer? It never worked like this. Honestly, if I was weaving and selling baskets, I really wouldn't care if you used my product to blow up a kindergarten, as long as you paid in full. Corporations care even less.  It's all about marketing and believe me, sincerity never had any place in the market.


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## bug (Mar 15, 2021)

Yeah well, it's not like 3060s were collecting dust on shelves and will now be gone because of this. So who cares?


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## R-T-B (Mar 15, 2021)

the54thvoid said:


> I no longer care. I've given up on any further PC upgrades. The entire tech environment has gone to shit and the big corporations don't care who buys their products (oddly enough). Both Nvidia and AMD have been entirely disingenuous with their committments to PC gamers.
> 
> Screw them.


I feel you.  The sad reaction is because it's well...  sad.



bug said:


> Yeah well, it's not like 3060s were collecting dust on shelves and will now be gone because of this. So who cares?


Exactly.  Even without mining sales, we were screwed anyways.


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## ozzyozzy (Mar 15, 2021)

PR PR PR PR PR PR


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## the54thvoid (Mar 15, 2021)

TheUn4seen said:


> Wait, did you really think corporations care about you or any consumer? It never worked like this. Honestly, if I was weaving and selling baskets, I really wouldn't care if you used my product to blow up a kindergarten, as long as you paid in full. Corporations care even less.  It's all about marketing and believe me, sincerity never had any place in the market.



You missed the bit in brackets where I said 'oddly enough'. 

I've always stated companies owe no loyalty to consumers. Though, in reality, it's very good business to listen to those who buy the product.


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## Bubster (Mar 15, 2021)

Ngreedia just keep showing its true colors...


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## Legacy-ZA (Mar 15, 2021)

I think they saw, that their 3060 doesn't sell well, not only to miners, but gamers, it's a sad excuse for an "upgrade" this day and age.


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## GT610 8GB DDR3 (Mar 15, 2021)

Nice job! nvidia! I am going to sell my PC and buy PS5!


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## birdie (Mar 15, 2021)

I fully support the reversal of the decision to artificially limit mining performance. The limit never made sense in the first place.

GPUs have stopped being graphics accelerators over a decade ago, they are massively parallel computing devices and must continue to perform this way.

And neither NVIDIA, nor AMD can control where their GPUs go. *Period.* Whoever believes this is possible should go and make this possible.


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## Fluffmeister (Mar 15, 2021)

Indeed, with AMD drip feeding the market with tiny volumes of cards, they need not bother.


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## bug (Mar 15, 2021)

the54thvoid said:


> You missed the bit in brackets where I said 'oddly enough'.
> 
> I've always stated companies owe no loyalty to consumers. Though, in reality, it's very good business to listen to those who buy the product.


Well, miners are customers. Customers willing to pay way more for the goods you make. If you were AMD or Nvidia, what would you do?

Edit: The only glitch with that, is AMD and Nvidia still sell their chips at the previously negotiated prices. It's the AIB partners that pocket the difference.


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## dicobalt (Mar 15, 2021)

That was quick.


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## bug (Mar 15, 2021)

dicobalt said:


> That was quick.


The laughable part is it was self inflicted. Hackers didn't need to lift a finger.


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## Bones (Mar 15, 2021)

Looks like the drivers have been pulled, I'm there ATM and the latest shown is ver 461.72.


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## Kissamies (Mar 15, 2021)

bug said:


> Yeah well, it's not like 3060s were collecting dust on shelves and will now be gone because of this. *So who cares?*


Mostly those who would buy a 3060 for gaming, now toy money miners grab every card there is and there's no cards for gamers (at least with a reasonable price)?


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## windwhirl (Mar 15, 2021)

All I have to say about this fail is:









Bones said:


> Looks like the drivers have been pulled, I'm there ATM and the latest shown is ver 461.72.


Too late, someone already grabbed them and it's probably distributing them somewhere as we speak.


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## RedelZaVedno (Mar 15, 2021)

LOL, that was SERIOUSLY *FAST HACKING*


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## thesmokingman (Mar 15, 2021)

Lmao, what was the point in all this insanity?

lol the driver is rehosted around the net...


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## PaulieG (Mar 15, 2021)

TheUn4seen said:


> Wait, did you really think corporations care about you or any consumer? It never worked like this. Honestly, if I was weaving and selling baskets, I really wouldn't care if you used my product to blow up a kindergarten, as long as you paid in full. Corporations care even less.  It's all about marketing and believe me, sincerity never had any place in the market.



Most any luxury hobby that involves high end products are pretty much marketed by the consumer, reviewers and influencers. I have a large private gym attached to my home. One piece of strength training equipment I own cost me $1400 2 years ago. It now sells for $2600 when it's in stock because people still buy it at inflated prices and it's a raved about machine. I'm also an avid mountain biker, and luckily I bought my newest high end bike a year and 1/2 ago because now it sells for $650 more than it did and at last check there was a 6 month wait on the model because it is well reviewed and people will still pay for it. Corporations don't care, and will always charge you what you're willing to pay and are not above dramatizing actual supply chain issues.


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## mechtech (Mar 15, 2021)

I think everyone called that one............................


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## thesmokingman (Mar 15, 2021)

mechtech said:


> I think everyone called that one............................


I don't think anyone called who would defeat the limiter, especially Nvidia themselves rofl.


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## InVasMani (Mar 15, 2021)

All your cryptocurrency are belong to base.


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## Kissamies (Mar 15, 2021)

windwhirl said:


> Too late, someone already grabbed them and it's probably distributing them somewhere as we speak.


This. What you put on the internet, will remain on the internet.


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## marcomarti (Mar 15, 2021)

2021--: After 20 years of electronic revolution I could become a miner.


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## RedelZaVedno (Mar 15, 2021)

PaulieG said:


> Most any luxury hobby that involves high end products are pretty much marketed by the consumer, reviewers and influencers. I have a large private gym attached to my home. One piece of strength training equipment I own cost me $1400 2 years ago. It now sells for $2600 when it's in stock because people still buy it at inflated prices and it's a raved about machine. I'm also an avid mountain biker, and luckily I bought my newest high end bike a year and 1/2 ago because now it sells for $650 more than it did and at last check there was a 6 month wait on the model because it is well reviewed and people will still pay for it. Corporations don't care, and will always charge you what you're willing to pay and are not above dramatizing actual supply chain issues.


I never considered DIY PC building as a luxury hobby and now I'm priced out of the market  Joking aside, I've been assembling DIY PCs since 1992 and I could always get something reasonably priced with decent performance until 2016 mining craze happened and everything went downhill from then on. I always laughed when people argued that PC gaming is coming to an end but now I'm not so sure anymore. There was never a time when MSRP mid range GPU exceeded price of a whole gaming console and not being faster on top of that. There is a limit what most PC gamers are willing to pay before they abandoning gaming altogether or migrate to consoles and we're beyond that point imho.


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## GAR (Mar 15, 2021)

oh Fk these miners already.


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## kruk (Mar 15, 2021)

LOL, this is basically a "We care about miners" driver ... So now miners will be able to choose between CMPs and RTX cards, while gamers will be left with overpriced leftovers.


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## Dyatlov A (Mar 15, 2021)

I think Nvidia did intentionally this mistake, because for their partners better to sell the GPUs behind the market. Now miners have the driver for forever for 3060. And it is very unwelcome for earth supporting more CO2 emission, because of nonsense mining.


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## Rage Set (Mar 15, 2021)

Dyatlov A said:


> I think Nvidia did intentionally this mistake, because for their partners better to sell the GPUs behind the market. Now miners have the driver for forever for 3060. And it is very unwelcome for earth supporting more CO2 emission, because of nonsense mining.



While I don't condone mining, based off your assertion, when I game with my gpu, it's zero emissions? What about video editing?


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## TheUn4seen (Mar 15, 2021)

PaulieG said:


> Most any luxury hobby that involves high end products are pretty much marketed by the consumer, reviewers and influencers. I have a large private gym attached to my home. One piece of strength training equipment I own cost me $1400 2 years ago. It now sells for $2600 when it's in stock because people still buy it at inflated prices and it's a raved about machine. I'm also an avid mountain biker, and luckily I bought my newest high end bike a year and 1/2 ago because now it sells for $650 more than it did and at last check there was a 6 month wait on the model because it is well reviewed and people will still pay for it. Corporations don't care, and will always charge you what you're willing to pay and are not above dramatizing actual supply chain issues.


Well, pragmatic pricing at it's best. Do you want to make a millennial socialist screech with anger? Tell him that most items are priced at whatever the market will bear - while it's not entirely true, for some reason this phrase really makes some less intelligent people angry. Honestly, if I could sell a sip of water for a thousand euros to thirsty people, I would have no problem doing it - and in corporate world it's nothing. My wife is a corporate analyst/auditor and she freely admits that if kidnapping children and selling their organs would be profitable in a long term, every corporation would do it. Actually, I could use a reasonably priced, healthy kidney...


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

PaulieG said:


> Most any luxury hobby that involves high end products are pretty much marketed by the consumer, reviewers and influencers. I have a large private gym attached to my home. One piece of strength training equipment I own cost me $1400 2 years ago. It now sells for $2600 when it's in stock because people still buy it at inflated prices and it's a raved about machine. I'm also an avid mountain biker, and luckily I bought my newest high end bike a year and 1/2 ago because now it sells for $650 more than it did and at last check there was a 6 month wait on the model because it is well reviewed and people will still pay for it. Corporations don't care, and will always charge you what you're willing to pay and are not above dramatizing actual supply chain issues.



So now pc gaming has became a luxury hobby. Right.
I thought luxury hobby was for example collecting expensive cigars, not overpriced pieces of silicon.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

the54thvoid said:


> I no longer care. I've given up on any further PC upgrades. The entire tech environment has gone to shit and the big corporations don't care who buys their products (oddly enough). Both Nvidia and AMD have been entirely disingenuous with their committments to PC gamers.
> 
> Screw them.



Do you really believe the gaming and DIY market will fall on its ass because we mine a few crypto coins now, and people are sore out of luck for a GPU upgrade for a few months?

Come on. Give it a night's rest  This will recover, I have zero illusions. There is demand, simple, and the current supply isn't equipped for the vastness of it right now. This cannot last, all growth ends at some point, and generally then gets the reality check.

All I do is look forward to my bargain bin priced GPU in the future. And I light a candle every night for my 1080, talk a little bit to it, and cuddle it goodnight.



CandymanGR said:


> So now pc gaming has became a luxury hobby. Right.
> I thought luxury hobby was for example collecting expensive cigars, not overpriced pieces of silicon.


Gaming was always a luxury hobby, but the entry point was kids and not adults.

Its definitely luxury.. and certainly not a cheap hobby. Never was. If anything the price of entry has gone down massively. You can game on a phone


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## the54thvoid (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> Do you really believe the gaming market will fall on its ass because we mine a few crypto coins now, and people are sore out of luck for a GPU upgrade for a few months?
> 
> Come on. Give it a night's rest  This will recover, I have zero illusions.



Eh? 

You seem quite capable of extrapolating posts to make a new hypothesis. Where did I say gaming would collapse? I said I've lost interest. That I've given up on upgrades. I stated they (Nvidia and AMD) don't actually care about gamers (they don't). At what point did I even mention gaming would fall on it's ass? Stop creating narratives that people don't post.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

the54thvoid said:


> Eh?
> 
> You seem quite capable of extrapolating posts to make a new hypothesis. Where did I say gaming would collapse? I said I've lost interest. That I've given up on upgrades. I stated they (Nvidia and AMD) don't actually care about gamers (they don't). At what point did I even mention gaming would fall on it's ass? Stop creating narratives that people don't post.



My apologies. It just follows on the idea that Nvidia and AMD wouldn't care.

I think they DO care, because after crypto, that's their market again.

And beyond that... about narratives, you seemed mostly agitated that companies somehow lied to you through their recent actions. But maybe I'm wrong.


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## DeathtoGnomes (Mar 15, 2021)

CandymanGR said:


> So now pc gaming has became a luxury hobby. Right.
> I thought luxury hobby was for example collecting expensive cigars, not overpriced pieces of silicon.


pc gaming has been a luxury for, what seems like, forever. Us/We Real Gamers have known that since 1974 ( just an arbitrary year  ).


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## Deleted member 205776 (Mar 15, 2021)

I am so surprisedn't


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> Do you really believe the gaming and DIY market will fall on its ass because we mine a few crypto coins now, and people are sore out of luck for a GPU upgrade for a few months?
> 
> Come on. Give it a night's rest  This will recover, I have zero illusions. There is demand, simple, and the current supply isn't equipped for the vastness of it right now. This cannot last, all growth ends at some point, and generally then gets the reality check.
> 
> ...


"Not a cheap hobby" and "luxury" are two different things. A really expensive hobby is for example karting (which is MUCH more expensive than... some intentionally overpriced gpu's).
Luxury is a different thing.
Entry level is not gaming on a phone. Thats low end! Are you serious? What the f? Gaming was NOT expensive until 2 years ago. A 300 euros card is still viable (GTX 1060 6gb in 1080p is perfectly fine still). Then the whole fiasco with mining came for 2nd time, and now a GTX 1660 S costs 600 euros. Its even worse. But dont try to tell me gaming was expensive. It never was.
I can name ALL the systems i have build over the years. More than 25 GPU's it was just for myself. It NEVER was expensive as you imply.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

CandymanGR said:


> "Not a cheap hobby" and "luxury" are two different things. A really expensive hobby is for example karting (which is MUCH more expensive than... some intentionally overpriced gpu's).
> Luxury is a different thing.
> Entry level is not gaming on a phone. Thats low end! Are you serious? What the f?


Perhaps. But let's rewind.... early PC GPUs weren't cheap. What came after that, wasn't cheap.

Right now, you can game at 1080p with a relatively low-end GPU just fine. The cost of entry has really not gone up. It has gone down. Currently, gaming is unobtanium for everyone - we know this. But that's not the norm, is it? In my personal experience, the norm was and still is, that gaming is coming in through every crack it finds in devices where it can somehow run. PC games are getting ported to _phones now_. Yes. Low-end? Certainly! But the movement is clear.

And entry level... is entry level. We can find a few dozen more words for it... low-end definitely is much the same as entry level. Entry level is console level, fixed devices basically. It could be a phone. It could be a Switch. It could be a crappy PC leftover from somewhere. Entry level is certainly not 'mid range PC' because those demands grow with every gen. If that is your definition of gaming then yes, its certainly expensive to even begin... and maybe even luxury?


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

DeathtoGnomes said:


> pc gaming has been a luxury for, what seems like, forever. Us/We Real Gamers have known that since 1974 ( just an arbitrary year  ).


My God. really? Yes i paid 150$ in today's money for my C64 in 1985.
I paid 180$ in today's money for my Atari 520 STFM.

Oh yeah.. Soooo expensive!

P.S. You are not the only... old guy here.



Vayra86 said:


> Perhaps. But let's rewind.... early PC GPUs weren't cheap. What came after that, wasn't cheap.



I use to buy my own GPU's with my own money while i was still a student. Gaming GPU's i mean, not like Cirrus logic 5428. It wasnt expensive.
3dfx voodo was a bit expensive until nvidia came with TNT2 (same price, did include video output) and fucked them up with Geforce. On the contrary, back then the cheapest solution won (nvidia). It wasnt fastest.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

CandymanGR said:


> I use to buy my own GPU's with nmy own money while i was still a student. Gaming GPU's. It wasnt expensive.


Define expensive. Right now you can find GPUs for 180 MSRP just as well. And they do a lot more.

Every time we see someone dive into the actual numbers, what we get is pretty much the same price point corrected for inflation since the inception of PC gaming. Some peaks, some lows... but the _trend_ is still that we're either maintaining certain price levels, or that they go down, or that you get more while paying the same.

That's not 'getting more expensive' in my book. You can't expect that growth to last forever, physics has its limits...

Don't misread me - I feel you, I live with the same emotion tbh, but if you take a step back, and zoom out a bit more than 2020-2021, this is just a fly on the wall and gaming has been growing since forever, and likely will. It can't do that if GPUs remain this expensive, or if no alternatives are found. The market will readjust.

Oh and BTW... the C64 and Atari were _consoles. _Definitely not PCs with dedicated GPUs as they are in this discussion.


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> Define expensive. Right now you can find GPUs for 180 MSRP just as well. And they do a lot more.
> 
> Every time we see someone dive into the actual numbers, what we get is pretty much the same price point corrected for inflation since the inception of PC gaming. Some peaks, some lows... but the _trend_ is still that we're either maintaining certain price levels, or that they go down, or that you get more while paying the same.
> 
> That's not 'getting more expensive' in my book. You can't expect that growth to last forever, physics has its limits...



So there is no inflation in prices because of mining then, right?

You have some nerve asking this. "Expensive" is paying 600 euros for a card with MSRP of 200. Which part exactly you dont understand?


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

CandymanGR said:


> So there is no inflation in prices because of mining then, right?
> 
> You have some nerve asking this. "Expensive" is paying 600 euros for a card with MSRP of 200. Which part exactly you dont understand?



You're acting as if I priced those GPUs at 600. Read the above, my last ninja-edit.

I'm not there to troll you saying all is well in the world or anything. I see the problem. But I also define it as a temporary one.


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (Mar 15, 2021)

birdie said:


> I fully support the reversal of the decision to artificially limit mining performance. The limit never made sense in the first place.
> 
> GPUs have stopped being graphics accelerators over a decade ago, they are massively parallel computing devices and must continue to perform this way.
> 
> ...


Hmnnn defence posture Z = ?.


Totes ball's ,defeated by incompetence, though the pr speak will no doubt paint it asss good for gamer's.


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> You're acting as if I priced those GPUs at 600. Read the above, my last ninja-edit.



Wrong again. I act like that because you more or less justify those prices as normal, because after all gaming is a.. luxury!



Vayra86 said:


> Oh and BTW... the C64 and Atari were _consoles. _Definitely not PCs with dedicated GPUs as they are in this discussion.



Haha.. What.. are  .. you .. talking.. about?
PC=Personal Computer. C64 and Atari ST were computers, they even had mouse and Graphical OS. Dedicated gpus? They had Video chips (C64 had the VIC II) and I start to think you dont know much.
Also, WHO TOLD YOU PC's were always have had discreet GPUs? Have you ever heard of CGA? Tandy? Those in the first PC's were sometimes (*edited) integrated to the board.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

CandymanGR said:


> Wrong again. I act like that because you more or less justify those prices as normal, because after all gaming is a.. luxury!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Key word: dedicated GPU. That's what the discussion is about. And what you can do with them - which was why I referred to C64 etc as consoles more so than a PC that you can upgrade. If the C64 wasn't entry level gaming I don't know what is.

If you want to argue semantics like that you can do it alone.


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## medi01 (Mar 15, 2021)

So "it's not only in drivers" right?
Or I guess it was, what a "shocker"...


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> Key word: dedicated GPU. That's what the discussion is about. And what you can do with them - which was why I referred to C64 etc as consoles more so than a PC that you can upgrade. If the C64 wasn't entry level gaming I don't know what is.
> 
> If you want to argue semantics like that you can do it alone.


C64 was the BEST gaming machine of its era. It wasn't... entry level. No other 8bit had the abilities of the C64. Not the CPC's and certainly not the ZX. And even the BBC was close but it was worse. And thats that.

Now the dedicated gpu is something that happened through the years as evolution. So stop using it as an example. You are wrong in EVERYTHING you said. At least accept it.
The point that gaming is a luxury is the most stupid thing i have heard. You confuse the words "luxury", with "expensive" and "overpriced". And to avoid this, you are accusing me of arguing about semantics. Great.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

CandymanGR said:


> C64 was the BEST gaming machine of its era. It wasn't... entry level. No other 8bit had the abilities of the C64. Not the CPC's and certainly not the ZX. And even the BBC was close but it was worse. And thats that.
> 
> Now the dedicated gpu is something that happened through the years as evolution. So stop using it as an example. You are wrong in EVERYTHING you said. At least accept it.
> The point that gaming is a luxury is the most stupid thing i have heard. You confuse the words "luxury", with "expensive" and "overpriced".



And you confuse inflation with 'I paid $180 bucks in 'todays money'. That means in yesterdays money, that was a pricy machine.... I'm not so sure you're making the right comparisons with that example to make your point... Especially because back then, there was no hierarchy in GPUs at all, and competition plus technology was early adoption.

We're now talking about a market with radically different devices, 30-40 years ahead in time. If you just want to find the argument, you'll always find it.... If you want to say I'm wrong in everything, knock yourself out... But a reality check seems in order... plus... I even literally said to you: I feel much the same as you about the current situation - but its *not the norm*.


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> And you confuse inflation with 'I paid $180 bucks in 'todays money'. That means in yesterdays money, that was a pricy machine.... I'm not so sure you're making the right comparisons with that example to make your point... Especially because back then, there was no hierarchy in GPUs at all, and competition plus technology was early adoption.



Pricey doesnt mean expensive. That's why we have different words to describe the level of overprice (pricey, expensive, overpriced).
Pricey maybe. EXPENSIVE no. The IBM PC was expensive back then, costing about 10 times the cost of C64.
I refer to the price because i had too. Everything was expensive in 1985 if you want to take it there. Even a color CRT tv. But it was expensive for us Greeks. For the average American, it wasnt. Stop using the inflation as an excuse, it is not. Back then the economy wasn't as unified as now, and there were import taxes everywhere. If anything else, back then costs were higher. There were many reasons to bring the price of a product higher, especially back then which for example C64 was mostly made in USA. Thats why it is even worse today to pay overpriced prices.



Vayra86 said:


> We're now talking about a market with radically different devices, 30-40 years ahead in time. If you just want to find the argument, you'll always find it.... If you want to say I'm wrong in everything, knock yourself out... But a reality check seems in order... plus... I even literally said to you: I feel much the same as you about the current situation - but its *not the norm*.



My card bought at launch at 336 euros. Two years later the cost was higher because of mining. Then it droped at 250 for 1-1 year and a half. New generation came (RTX 2xxx) and now the same thing started with them, and is happening again, and actually it is even worse.
It is impressive how sure you are that it is not the new norm with the cryptocurrencies! I wonder who really needs the reality check here.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 15, 2021)

CandymanGR said:


> Pricey doesnt mean expensive. That's why we have different words to describe the level of overprice (pricey, expensive, overpriced).
> Pricey maybe. EXPENSIVE no. The IBM PC was expensive back then, costing about 10 times the cost of C64.
> I refer to the price because i had too. Everything was expensive in 1985 if you want to take it there. Even a color CRT tv. But it was expensive for us Greeks. For the average American, it wasnt. Stop using the inflation as an excuse, it is not. Back then the economy wasn't as unified as now, and there were import taxes everywhere. If anything else, back then costs were higher. There were many reasons to bring the price of a product higher, especially back then which for example C64 was mostly made in USA. Thats why it is even worse today to pay overpriced prices.



Interesting view on the matter because I obviously didn't live in Greece at the time, but in the Netherlands. But I do know from my young years (34 now, born '86) that electronics were most definitely luxury items and had only just gone 'mainstream' for example for a color TV. Maybe a disconnect we also have in conversation is the definition of luxury. In my book that is everything you don't need and can't make yourself. Base necessities, the rest is luxury.

But let's put that vision of the past next to the current state of things.
- We have a pandemic
- We have trade wars that are only just now starting to cool down - or... some people hope they do, actually. Realistically though it seems the US is going to maintain some sort of weight against China.
- We have crypto.

Is this situation that different? Or is just that we've lost touch with general disappointment in life about systems not doing what they're supposed to do.

And with that perspective I also feel this is temporary. We've either gone addicted to peace... and this will recover... or we're so fed up we start shooting and gaming truly is luxury


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> Interesting view on the matter because I obviously didn't live in Greece at the time, but in the Netherlands. But I do know from my young years (34 now, born '86) that electronics were most definitely luxury items and had only just gone 'mainstream' for example for a color TV. Maybe a disconnect we also have in conversation is the definition of luxury. In my book that is everything you don't need and can't make yourself. Base necessities, the rest is luxury.
> 
> But let's put that vision of the past next to the current state of things.
> - We have a pandemic
> ...



Borned 1975. 46 years old. Just for the shake of the conversation.
Maybe we understand the word luxury different. For me luxury is something you might need (not necessary), but it is on a overstated level you DONT really need.
I will give you a crude example: Not everyone needs a car. It is NOT necessary. But it is essential in the world we live today. But a... golden car is a luxury (i exaggerate the example, to emphasize what i mean). Something like this.


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## Deleted member 205776 (Mar 15, 2021)

All GPUs are golden nowadays...


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## proxuser (Mar 15, 2021)

austrian scalpers sells it for 800 and it cost 629 on local store in vienna. there are at least 15 i have seen from gigabyte. just funny some people.


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## Deleted member 205776 (Mar 15, 2021)

proxuser said:


> austrian scalpers sells it for 800 and it cost 629 on local store in vienna. there are at least 15 i have seen from gigabyte. just funny some people.


Can confirm lol


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## DonKnotts (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> people are sore out of luck for a GPU upgrade for a few months?


That's funny, all I've been reading is that this "bubble" is probably going to last for around a year to two years before it finally f*cks off and we can finally hope for things to get back to something close to normal again. It's been more than a few months already, and shows absolutely no signs of ending any time soon, so I'm curious about where you're getting your timeline of a few months.


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## RedelZaVedno (Mar 15, 2021)

$399/479 MSRP price take on mainstream xx60 class GPU makes it a luxury product when you can buy digital PS5/XboX X for the same price. Lower mid range GPUs used to cost 1/2 to 2/3 the price of a gaming console and were faster or at least on pair with consoles. Not anymore.


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## R-T-B (Mar 15, 2021)

Legacy-ZA said:


> I think they saw, that their 3060 doesn't sell well, not only to miners, but gamers, it's a sad excuse for an "upgrade" this day and age.


lol it's literally sold out.  Put the GTX 1080 back on the market for the right price and it'll sell at this point.


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## Space Lynx (Mar 15, 2021)

ShurikN said:


> The way you are meant to be played.



Love this x10.


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## R-T-B (Mar 15, 2021)

Bones said:


> Looks like the drivers have been pulled, I'm there ATM and the latest shown is ver 461.72.


They are insider drivers.  Not pulled, but not on the nvidia website either.


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## CandymanGR (Mar 15, 2021)

RedelZaVedno said:


> $399/479 MSRP price take on mainstream xx60 class GPU makes it a luxury product when you can buy digital PS5/XboX X for the same price. Lower mid range GPUs used to cost 1/2 to 2/3 the price of a gaming console and were faster or at least on pair with consoles. Not anymore.


I could argue that this is market manipulation and eventually amd and nvidia are going to be responsible for breaching the antitrust laws. But that's just me.


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## evernessince (Mar 15, 2021)

Fluffmeister said:


> Indeed, with AMD drip feeding the market with tiny volumes of cards, they need not bother.



At the start that was true (same as Nvidia) but stock trackers show AMD has picked up the pace over the 2 1/2 weeks.



kruk said:


> LOL, this is basically a "We care about miners" driver ... So now miners will be able to choose between CMPs and RTX cards, while gamers will be left with overpriced leftovers.



That was the point all along.  By making mining cards Nvidia was guarantying a minimum amount to be dedicated to mining.  It was never intended to help gamers.  On top of that, those cards will be useless to gamers, zero resale value.  It's a win-win-win for nvidia.  They pretend to care about gamers, miners get a guaranteed amount of cards, and they reduce pesky 2nd hand cards that will surely hit the market once mining cools off again.  With less 2nd hand gaming cards on the market people are forced to buy more full price GPUs.  Even at MSRP, Nvidia's GPUs are not good value.


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## xorbe (Mar 15, 2021)

According to reddit posts, it only mines full speed in a primary slot, only 1 mines full speed per system, and doesn't mine full speed if using a riser.


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## BSim500 (Mar 15, 2021)

DeathtoGnomes said:


> pc gaming has been a luxury for, what seems like, forever. Us/We Real Gamers have known that since 1974 ( just an arbitrary year  ).


That's actually not far off where it all started. The oldest PC game on GOG is Akalabeth (1979) - essentially "Utima 0". The oldest PC game I own is Colossal Cave Adventure (1976), a reference to which can be found in Kentucky Route Zero & Thimbleweed Park. 



Vayra86 said:


> Oh and BTW... the C64 and Atari were _consoles. _Definitely not PCs with dedicated GPUs as they are in this discussion.


Atari / C64 / VIC20 / ZX Spectrum / BBC-Acorn Micro, etc, were all regarded as Micro-Computers. There was definitely a big difference between those vs the much more limited function "consoles" even going all the way back to the Magnavox Odyssey.


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## Renald (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> Interesting view on the matter because I obviously didn't live in Greece at the time, but in the Netherlands. But I do know from my young years (34 now, born '86) that electronics were most definitely luxury items and had only just gone 'mainstream' for example for a color TV. Maybe a disconnect we also have in conversation is the definition of luxury. In my book that is everything you don't need and can't make yourself. Base necessities, the rest is luxury.
> 
> But let's put that vision of the past next to the current state of things.
> - We have a pandemic
> ...


Let's take a step and look at people who actually studied what is "luxury" like Maslow in a certain way :




(this doesn't cover the whole subject at all)

Even if our physiological needs are fulfilled, we cannot say the same for the safety needs due to pandemic : personal security isn't guaranteed, unemployment is at our door, some resources (not taking electronics into account) are missing, health is threatened every day ...
Only the top of the pyramid is luxury, no the rest even if in our mind it's like "Isn't that so hard to live in a dictatorship ?Nahhh"


My point is : we were quite a the top of this hierarchy before 2020. You couldn't play your favorite game ? Not that bad because you could travel, be somewhere else, see your friends, family, work on yourself, whatever. We were "the most we could be". So reaching for more lower tier desire was luxury at the time.
Now you're freaking stuck on our safety needs. Videogames comes with connecting with people and a bit of freedom for others. It's a bubble of fresh air, not only a luxury.

If we're so pissed, it's not because Nvidia is screwing us (they always do) like never before, but mostly because we are in desperate need of an escape.
We aren't all a big rich and happy family, with 2 kids and a dog, with a house and a garden. We all have our shitty lives going on, and cutting this is putting everyone on edge.

This is a long term situation, which will continue until the end of the Covid pandemic so people can travel and do something else. So let's say ... 2 more years ? because people are stupid and will break any curfew.
Edit : I do not criticize your post, just complement it. I agree about the "when the pandemic will be over", even if I don't see that coming any time soon.


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## Deleted member 205776 (Mar 15, 2021)

How did we get here from a thread about NVIDIA loosening the panties they had in a knot?


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## Fouquin (Mar 15, 2021)

Vayra86 said:


> Perhaps. But let's rewind.... early PC GPUs weren't cheap. What came after that, wasn't cheap.


That's actually not true at all. GUI accelerators for AT compatibles weren't much more than $300 for the home consumer markets. More expensive accelerators existed, obviously, and between 1992 and 1994 there were some very expensive 3D accelerators using OpenGL (then still under the distribution of SGI) but entry cost, capable 3D accelerators existed and then thrived after 1996. Voodoo was $150 (Only $251 in 2021 dollars), Voodoo 2 raised that to $249 and $299 depending on model, still only just cracking $500 in 2021 dollars. Those were flagship 3D accelerators of their day for less than $500. A wide range of workstation oriented accelerators existed at the same time for exuberant prices, but that's no different than today. What is different is that a mid-tier consumer card currently costs more than almost any flagship consumer card in the last 25 years, even adjusted for inflation. Even the legendary flagship 8800 Ultra with its astonishing $830 MSRP in 2007 ($1,052 today) is falling far short of the selling price of an RTX 3060 Ti; 4 steps down from flagship.


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## damric (Mar 15, 2021)

GT610 8GB DDR3 said:


> Nice job! nvidia! I am going to sell my PC and buy PS5!


Well they mine in laptops now, so what's to stop them from mining on consoles soon?


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## spnidel (Mar 15, 2021)

this whole "hashrate limiter" thing seems like a psyop to get people to like them more
"hey look, we care about gamers so much, we're going to cripple the mining capabilities of our drivers!"... and then they accidentally "forget" to implement it in one of their revisions
well, they tried, and since it's the effort that counts I guess I'll buy nvidia over amd!


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## Caring1 (Mar 15, 2021)

xorbe said:


> According to reddit posts, it only mines full speed in a primary slot, only 1 mines full speed per system, and doesn't mine full speed if using a riser.


If true this is great news for Gamers that like to mine too.
Miners on the other hand would need multiple systems to be able to mine with multiple cards.


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## bug (Mar 16, 2021)

Nvidia fending off miners:


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## R-T-B (Mar 16, 2021)

xorbe said:


> and doesn't mine full speed if using a riser.


How on earth could the driver know if you are using a riser?

Smells fishy.


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## xorbe (Mar 16, 2021)

R-T-B said:


> How on earth could the driver know if you are using a riser?
> 
> Smells fishy.



I don't know enough about board hw capabilities to comment on that.  I could postulate ideas, but it would just be wags.


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## R-T-B (Mar 16, 2021)

xorbe said:


> I don't know enough about board hw capabilities to comment on that.  I could postulate ideas, but it would just be wags.


I do though.  It basically can't.  A link is a link.


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## InVasMani (Mar 16, 2021)

Rage Set said:


> While I don't condone mining, based off your assertion, when I game with my gpu, it's zero emissions? What about video editing?


Except I don't know of any game players individually running dozens or even hundreds of the highest end GPU's they can acquire running them 24/7 for 365 days a year. Not even legitimate business LAN centers operate like that in fact. In fact miner's have converted LAN centers into mining rig centers and I'm absolutely positive are consuming more electricity than they were prior by a large degree. Keep trying to pretend mining is great. I could game my entire lifetime and not consume the waste energy a individual miner has in 6 months with some of the mining farms they operate. That's especially true as gaming hardware performance and efficiency improves over time, but these miner's are in bum rush to mining their pyramid fantasy coins that become harder and harder to mine along with and more earth damning over time. 

It doesn't matter if the tech behind it mining the phony coins improves the blockchain human extinction disease algorithm itself will make them a even more power hungry vampire to the planet consuming all the hardware resources and power driving it along the way until we're in the apocylpse and fall of soceity brought down upon us all by miners. It won't stop unless it's outlawed and if it continues undeterred they'll strip mine every planet resource to produce new GPU's to mine the next lottery fantasy coin at a higher hash rate than before because it's needed if they are to keep pace with the non linear algorithm black hole power vacuum that is the mining greed for speed hot pursuit high stakes.


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (Mar 16, 2021)

R-T-B said:


> I do though.  It basically can't.  A link is a link.


I suppose it would be limited to pciex3x1 over a mining riser so it could detect that difficulty.


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## lexluthermiester (Mar 16, 2021)

Gralorn said:


> I’m not surprised.


Exactly. It is unfortunate but predicable.


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## Darmok N Jalad (Mar 16, 2021)

We all got dumped at the dance for the guy who brought the alcohol.


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## hat (Mar 16, 2021)

"Oops". Oh well, I never liked the idea anyway.


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## Darmok N Jalad (Mar 16, 2021)

InVasMani said:


> Except I don't know of any game players individually running dozens or even hundreds of the highest end GPU's they can acquire running them 24/7 for 365 days a year. Not even legitimate business LAN centers operate like that in fact. In fact miner's have converted LAN centers into mining rig centers and I'm absolutely positive are consuming more electricity than they were prior by a large degree. Keep trying to pretend mining is great. I could game my entire lifetime and not consume the waste energy a individual miner has in 6 months with some of the mining farms they operate. That's especially true as gaming hardware performance and efficiency improves over time, but these miner's are in bum rush to mining their pyramid fantasy coins that become harder and harder to mine along with and more earth damning over time.
> 
> It doesn't matter if the tech behind it mining the phony coins improves the blockchain human extinction disease algorithm itself will make them a even more power hungry vampire to the planet consuming all the hardware resources and power driving it along the way until we're in the apocylpse and fall of soceity brought down upon us all by miners. It won't stop unless it's outlawed and if it continues undeterred they'll strip mine every planet resource to produce new GPU's to mine the next lottery fantasy coin at a higher hash rate than before because it's needed if they are to keep pace with the non linear algorithm black hole power vacuum that is the mining greed for speed hot pursuit high stakes.


I wonder if this also puts a strain on local law enforcement? Now they can't tell who's growing pot in the basement and who is just mining.


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## Prima.Vera (Mar 16, 2021)

nGreedia still thinks we are suckers or stupid or what??


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## Midland Dog (Mar 16, 2021)

theres no point to even caring about PC upgrades anymore. huang can suck my wang and give my pascal free software support for another 4 years, f \/ ck him


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## nBagasW (Mar 16, 2021)

Prima.Vera said:


> nGreedia still thinks we are suckers or stupid or what??


They don't care about our intelligence. What they really care and know for sure is their product will still sell well regardless.


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## Caring1 (Mar 16, 2021)

Title is click bait, the hash rate limiter wasn't beaten, it was simply replaced by a new driver with different limits.


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## R-T-B (Mar 16, 2021)

Caring1 said:


> Title is click bait, the hash rate limiter wasn't beaten, it was simply replaced by a new driver with different limits.


What is the end effect, friend?


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## Zubasa (Mar 16, 2021)

Prima.Vera said:


> nGreedia still thinks we are suckers or stupid or what??


Given some users are already on Copium right off the first page, nVidia got that right.


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## Legacy-ZA (Mar 16, 2021)

Bones said:


> Looks like the drivers have been pulled, I'm there ATM and the latest shown is ver 461.72.



This is the internet, where once live, the damage is done, I can already see the countless miners that will host it for download.


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## Chomiq (Mar 16, 2021)

Meanwhile at mindfactory (which had about 1000+ units just recently):


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## Ibotibo01 (Mar 16, 2021)

Nvidia choose miners over gamers and developers. Thus, we will show what gamers and developers' power is in the next line-up of Nvidia. I like the Jeff Bezos's thought about customers' power on the internet, 
*" If you make customers unhappy in the physical world, they might each tell 6 friends. If you make customers unhappy on the Internet, they can each tell 6,000 friends. "*
​


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## birdie (Mar 16, 2021)

Ibotibo01 said:


> Nvidia choose miners over gamers and developers. Thus, we will show what gamers and developers' power is in the next line-up of Nvidia. I like the Jeff Bezos's thought about customers' power on the internet,
> *" If you make customers unhappy in the physical world, they might each tell 6 friends. If you make customers unhappy on the Internet, they can each tell 6,000 friends. "*
> ​


Let me break it to you: https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/

AMD fans for some reasons believe the world revolves around them and their tirades in the comments sections of multiple websites mean anything. They mostly mean nothing.


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## InVasMani (Mar 16, 2021)

Darmok N Jalad said:


> I wonder if this also puts a strain on local law enforcement? Now they can't tell who's growing pot in the basement and who is just mining.


That's more beneficial than bitcoin at least it provides some sanity value or reefer madness whichever you wish to believe.


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## CandymanGR (Mar 16, 2021)

Darmok N Jalad said:


> I wonder if this also puts a strain on local law enforcement? Now they can't tell who's growing pot in the basement and who is just mining.


Actually you can use LED UV lamps now, which they consume very little power and have a similar effect as the sun (to the plant). Actually Ultra Violet Rays make the plant to produce a higher concentration of the substance. Just fyi. 
* Sorry for the off topic.


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## Ibotibo01 (Mar 16, 2021)

birdie said:


> Let me break it to you: https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/
> 
> AMD fans for some reasons believe the world revolves around them and their tirades in the comments sections of multiple websites mean anything. They mostly mean nothing.


OK boomer, I'm not a fanboy of neither companies. Just don't want to buy overpriced products. Competition is good for every consumer but if Nvidia become the one GPU producer, you won't be able to buy RTX XX70-80. AMD needs DLSS or something Nvidia does not have. Consumers buy Nvidia because of the marketing strategy and technology. Now, Nvidia and AMD think only their money, how can they increase? Mining is free estate for them but if miners doesn't want to do mining and cryptocurrencies' values decrease, Nvidia and AMD will focus on the gaming sector and say sorry for gamers but if gamers  choose Intel, AMD and Nvidia will make better GPUs, maybe mining limiters will apply every GPUs. Also RTX 3060's performance is really bad(RTX 2060S+5%) for $329 but RTX 3060 Ti is too powerful for RTX 3060 and only for $70. Maybe RTX 3050 will be same performance with GTX 1060 6GB. If AMD make good products which include better Ray Tracing performance and DLSS performance than Nvidia's, i will buy AMD. Also, RTX 4000 series would be better than the RTX 3000 series in price/performance if you don't buy overpriced GPUs.


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## mouacyk (Mar 16, 2021)

Biggest NVidia trollol


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## DeathtoGnomes (Mar 16, 2021)

R-T-B said:


> What is the end effect, friend?


two dwarves walk into a bar?


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## TheinsanegamerN (Mar 16, 2021)

ITT: whiners whining about lack of stock during a pandemic and prices on GPUs being high, again. 

Because 2006 never happened.


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## B-Real (Mar 16, 2021)

Seeing the amount of 3060 stocks in Hungarian webshops, I'm not surprised at all: they are as well double the MSRP price as other 3000 models, however, their raw performance is underwhelming: ~2070 performance and below 2070S RT performance with nearly the same power consumption.


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## Caring1 (Mar 16, 2021)

DeathtoGnomes said:


> two dwarves walk into a bar?


And the Barman says, No miners allowed?
On topic, if the report is correct that one card can game and mine unlimited, but multiple cards are restricted, then it's a win for gamers.


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## Vayra86 (Mar 16, 2021)

Fouquin said:


> That's actually not true at all. GUI accelerators for AT compatibles weren't much more than $300 for the home consumer markets. More expensive accelerators existed, obviously, and between 1992 and 1994 there were some very expensive 3D accelerators using OpenGL (then still under the distribution of SGI) but entry cost, capable 3D accelerators existed and then thrived after 1996. Voodoo was $150 (Only $251 in 2021 dollars), Voodoo 2 raised that to $249 and $299 depending on model, still only just cracking $500 in 2021 dollars. Those were flagship 3D accelerators of their day for less than $500. A wide range of workstation oriented accelerators existed at the same time for exuberant prices, but that's no different than today. What is different is that a mid-tier consumer card currently costs more than almost any flagship consumer card in the last 25 years, even adjusted for inflation. Even the legendary flagship 8800 Ultra with its astonishing $830 MSRP in 2007 ($1,052 today) is falling far short of the selling price of an RTX 3060 Ti; 4 steps down from flagship.
> 
> View attachment 192583



Maybe its just my view and general financial situation at the time then. I stand corrected. But even so - midrange gaming was readily available until a few years back for as little as 250-300 too. And the stack of GPUs covers a much wider range of performance, plus the market has gone much more mainstream now. These are all elements in price inflation but they don't directly spell that 'gaming is more expensive'. When it comes to the last few generations, yes. But let's rewind a bit to just prior to that... Nvidia released Maxwell, and the 970 was a perf/buck king for the midrange. Then came Pascal, and a mining wave. Pascal still ended up at good price in the hands of gamers... and the performance cap was quite a leap - even in the midrange. Yes, we did pay a bit more. But we got a bit more too.

Then.... AMD stopped competing against anything over a 1070-1080 in performance, while their Pascal answer was even worse than their Maxwell answer at the time. And the performance capped out for them. Release after release, no goal posts were moved. Then... well... Turing... RT inflation because no competition... and then pandemic + mining.

Basically the stars have aligned in the worst possible way since 2018-2019. But at the same time... we have a competitive AMD GPU stack now, even if none are available - the race is reigniting, which means if supply picks up, price will be going down. And yes, we will pay RT tax. Yes, we will pay node tax. The demand is still high. But unobtanium for gaming is just not an option, that'd be self destruction for numerous companies, not just AMD or Nvidia - and that touches on a last argument to consider: if you want to drag gamers back into the game, you'll be doing things to motivate them. Price bumps are not it, but another perf/buck king certainly is.



Renald said:


> Let's take a step and look at people who actually studied what is "luxury" like Maslow in a certain way :
> View attachment 192575
> (this doesn't cover the whole subject at all)
> 
> ...



This is a great argument you make in that regard. You're right. The options are getting brutally limited.

But... this pandemic is lasting for a year now. A year! We're slowly moving towards an exit strategy and we need measures to prevent new events better... but this is going to be a temporary thing. I don't think its fair to determine that as a norm, even if a year feels long by now. Maybe we're getting guided by that emotion a bit too much here.


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## R-T-B (Mar 16, 2021)

DeathtoGnomes said:


> two dwarves walk into a bar?


and mine each other to death, yes.



Caring1 said:


> And the Barman says, No miners allowed?
> On topic, if the report is correct that one card can game and mine unlimited, but multiple cards are restricted, then it's a win for gamers.


I hope that report is correct.  It would certainly limit the drivers usefulness to true mining farms.


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## birdie (Mar 17, 2021)

UnknownAnon said:


> You obviously are one of those miners that hate gamers with how toxic and condescending you sound lol and actually any company can control where their products go initially by just putting the mining reduction on ALL cards. If you want to mine get with the times and learn was Ascii is. I mean you have to be an idiot not to want to increase hashrates by 300% just to spite gamers and content creators who these cards were intended for. You sound almost as bad as the idiots trying to justify buying out stock and reselling as a "Genuis" business move. When any real businessman goes through the procedures to become a AUTHORIZED DEALER for the product they are scalping so at least their customer gets those small things like warranties. You kids and your easy money schemes never end lol wait till cryptocurrency dies. It's a worse idea than a floating exchange rate haha. "I have nothing to back my money but please accept it as worth more than your "gold backed" money" sounds like a bunch of conmen putting value where there is none hahaha


I've *never* mined. Anything else you wanna accuse me of? I know what ASCII is and I won't be surprised if I'm older than you.

Anyways, you have zero real arguments and a lot of ad hominem in your comment, so reported.

Oh, you've signed up just to reply to me, OMG. Perhaps you're someone on these forums who doesn't want to tarnish his karma. Moderators see your IP address - make sure you've used VPN to leave this comment 'cause otherwise the comment will be immediately traced to your real account.


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## 64K (Mar 17, 2021)

Not surprised at this news. Apparently there is so much money to be made in mining right now. that miners see it as worthwhile to pay scalpers up to 3 times what the cards MSRP is set at.
I don't think this mining craze will end until there is so much cryptocurrency mined that it forces down mining. That probably will not happen during the Ampere lifespan.

Nvidia is going to have to take more action but that probably won't happen since they reported a 61% increase in revenue from last year. How do you go to a board meeting and tell the investors that they are going to try anything more to stop all that money coming in from miners?


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## DeathtoGnomes (Mar 17, 2021)

R-T-B said:


> and mine each other to death, yes.


Hi-Ho...


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## Why_Me (Mar 17, 2021)

AMD Has No Issues With Users Mining on RDNA2 GPUs
					

Mine to your heart's content




					www.tomshardware.com


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## londiste (Mar 17, 2021)

Why_Me said:


> AMD Has No Issues With Users Mining on RDNA2 GPUs
> 
> 
> Mine to your heart's content
> ...


Well, that is all relative.

They say RX 6700XT gets 47.5 MH/s when tuned for mining, at 120W.
RTX 3060 without limiter gets about the same at 110W.
RTX 3070 gets a little above 60 MH/s in similar circumstances and settings.

AMD has slightly less reason to worry about miners buying all of their cards. Not much less but a little.


----------

