# sennheiser pc 350's what the heck?



## DEFEATEST (Dec 26, 2008)

Hi guys, happy holidays! I was lucky enough to get a pair of sennheiser pc 350's from santa to replace my Zalman Theatre 5.1's and am I'm quite dissapointed in the sennheisers so far. Am I doing something wrong here? I have them hooked up to my trusty xfi xtreme music which my Zalmans just sounded incredible on IMHO. But these senns sound like 30 dollar headphones??? and they werent 30 bucks! I get that I have lost the surround sound but I just dont feel the "atmosphere" in the games that I play, kinda feel like im in a box running around. I'm sure I'm doing something wrong as these heaphones have gotten decent reviews. Is it just a case of the new sound and my ears not used to it?


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## Cold Storm (Dec 26, 2008)

The thing about headphones is that you have a thing called "burn in time" it's the time that it takes for the headphones to "wear in" in order to get the crisp sound. Any type of headphone that costs over  $70ish dollars need to have that burn in time. Best thing I can say to you is this. Run music with the headphones on, while your doing the little things. This will help burn in the headphones faster. Do it for about 4 days, then try them.

Also note that every headphone is built differently. For instance, If I want to have a good bassy type headphone then I'll go with some Audio Technica ATHAD500-700. Or if you want a good all around sound then go with the Sennheiser HD 595-650 series.. 

Give the Sennheiser's some time to burn in. Then if they still suck, just sell them off and go from there. But, I believe with them you'll see the difference after hours of burn in time is done.


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## DEFEATEST (Dec 26, 2008)

I'll give that a try thanks! They are bassy enough for me thats for sure. Not what I expected. Could also be my settings.


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## Gilletter (Dec 26, 2008)

check your settings for sound output... if I keep my sound set to quad, and put headphones on it sounds like ass... but if I change it to 2 stereo, my lil' cheapies sound damn good


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## Cold Storm (Dec 26, 2008)

Well. the thing about the Sennheiser PC350 is that they use the HD 595 drivers on the headphones. With that, your getting some of the quality that is the Sennheiser HD 595's. Meaning, they will be needing to have a burn in time due to the drivers that they used.

The xtreme Music can make things rather bassy if you set it up right. I've had one for awhile, till I went to have the caps taken out and just linked together. With every headset, you will have to play with the way your set-up is on your card. It's best to make multi set-ups to know what to use for this or that. Everyone is different about how they like their sound. I take after my father. Bass!! Lol.


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## AsRock (Dec 26, 2008)

As Cold Storm storm said about burn in well it goes for all speakers. Thing is whats great to one person is horrible to another even more so when it comes to sound.

I've never liked there headphones there's few i do.  Technics are about the only one with a few exceptions as a lot do not go low enough on the base response for me or have to much mid range.  I know for a fact i would not like them but thats me.


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## Cold Storm (Dec 26, 2008)

I'm in the process of grabbing a pair of Equation Audio RP-21 for myself as my headphones. 

Asrock is right.. It all depends on the person wearing the headset. 

Also, a great place to go and read up on headphones is a web-site called Head-fi. It's forum based, and as I see viewers of this thread, Sneekypeet knows quite well of the site.


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## DEFEATEST (Dec 26, 2008)

Should I be using some drivers? The headphones didnt come with a setup disk or anything. Is there drivers I should download for them?


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## lemonadesoda (Dec 26, 2008)

Just to check:

1./ Check your soundcard and make sure that all treble/bass/aural exciters are set to ZERO
2./ Make sure the impedence setting is correct on the soundcard (if you have that option)
3./ Set to stereo headphones, NOT, anything else whatsoever
4./ Make sure and EAD/filters etc. are OFF

Remember that your ears got used to your old set up and take a while to "retune" themselves.  You could also try running your soundcard into a hi-fi amplifier and then drive your headphones from the amp. It is sounds very different, then your soundcard set up is all wrong or CANT drive your headphones properly.


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## Cold Storm (Dec 26, 2008)

DEFEATEST said:


> Should I be using some drivers? The headphones didnt come with a setup disk or anything. Is there drivers I should download for them?



There isn't any drivers needed. when I said that they used the HD595 drivers, it was ment that your headset is but a clone of the Sennheiser HD595. If you ever open it up you'll see a small device. That does everything for the headphones. 

Sorry about confusing you on the matter. I tend to forget about telling people what "drivers" are in headphones.


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## AsRock (Dec 26, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> There isn't any drivers needed. when I said that they used the HD595 drivers, it was ment that your headset is but a clone of the Sennheiser HD595. If you ever open it up you'll see a small device. That does everything for the headphones.
> 
> Sorry about confusing you on the matter. *I tend to forget about telling people what "drivers" are in headphones*.




LOL, i never really thought about it till you said LMAO.


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## Cold Storm (Dec 26, 2008)

AsRock said:


> LOL, i never really thought about it till you said LMAO.



Lol. It doesn't even start to happen till you go with the whole 5.1 channel stuff.. Then you do have drivers with the Mic/style headsets. But, it's not used for the computer.. Just the circuit that's in the headset itself...


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## King Wookie (Dec 26, 2008)

As lemonadesoda said, check your card settings.

Turn off all the so called sound enhancing software. It just degrades the sound.
And do check that both the sound card software and games are set for 2 channel. Otherwise you will not hear half the audio.

Once you've done that, you can try turning on any settings 1 at a time, to see if they help or hinder the sound.


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## AsRock (Dec 26, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> Lol. It doesn't even start to happen till you go with the whole 5.1 channel stuff.. Then you do have drivers with the Mic/style headsets. But, it's not used for the computer.. Just the circuit that's in the headset itself...




Well i was thinking confused by "Driver" as it's how a speaker is designed.  Maybe just me lol..  Had just woke up when i read the thread.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudspeaker#Driver_types


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## Cold Storm (Dec 26, 2008)

AsRock said:


> Well i was thinking confused by "Driver" as it's how a speaker is designed.  Maybe just me lol..  Had just woke up when i read the thread.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudspeaker#Driver_types



lol.. Now I get what your thinking at! lol..


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## DEFEATEST (Dec 27, 2008)

Well , here's what I did. I have 3 splitters coming out of my xfi sound card. I like it that way I dont have to keep going back there to plug/unplug headphones and 5.1 speakers. Anyhoo, I hooked both pairs of headphones up at the same time. So my Zalmans and the Sennheisers and ran them both on headphone settings. I then ran them both through my fave games at the moment (BF2, left4dead, COD4 and far cry) and I also ran some tunes through them. Everything from ACDC to placido domingo! And I dont what the heck I'm doing wrong but my Zalmans sound waayyy better to me. Like insanely better. And for games, my zalmans were set to headphones and they still sounded way better. ( I usually have them set to 5.1) I don't know if its just me or WTF but that really pees me off!! My wife would sh$t if she knew I was complaining! I begged for them for xmas  I will let the burn thing run it's course but I can't imagine it making that much of a difference. When I shoot a gun in a FPS, it feels like I'm holding it close to my body with the Zalmans. With the senns it feels kinda like I'm watching someone play a FPS on youtube. I'm not kidding. I mean the senns are not bright at all, it always feels like Im in a box kinda, no real highs or lows. I could prolly reinstall my xfi drivers...... sooo lost and dissapointed!


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## Tau (Dec 27, 2008)

DEFEATEST said:


> Well , here's what I did. I have 3 splitters coming out of my xfi sound card. I like it that way I dont have to keep going back there to plug/unplug headphones and 5.1 speakers. Anyhoo, I hooked both pairs of headphones up at the same time. So my Zalmans and the Sennheisers and ran them both on headphone settings. I then ran them both through my fave games at the moment (BF2, left4dead, COD4 and far cry) and I also ran some tunes through them. Everything from ACDC to placido domingo! And I dont what the heck I'm doing wrong but my Zalmans sound waayyy better to me. Like insanely better. And for games, my zalmans were set to headphones and they still sounded way better. ( I usually have them set to 5.1) I don't know if its just me or WTF but that really pees me off!! My wife would sh$t if she knew I was complaining! I begged for them for xmas  I will let the burn thing run it's course but I can't imagine it making that much of a difference. When I shoot a gun in a FPS, it feels like I'm holding it close to my body with the Zalmans. With the senns it feels kinda like I'm watching someone play a FPS on youtube. I'm not kidding. I mean the senns are not bright at all, it always feels like Im in a box kinda, no real highs or lows. I could prolly reinstall my xfi drivers...... sooo lost and dissapointed!



Disable all that headphone mode garbage and set it to defaults (2 channel stereo)  also ditch those splitters are they are adding considerable line noise.

Also i find it hard to beleave those headphones are using the same drivers as the 350's are 38mm drivers and the 595s are larger.

Something to also note is your looking at 400+hours to break those in, not 4 days.

I have not heard the 350s myself though I have used pretty much the entire HD lineup 500s up to 650's and i can say when setup correctly any HD series should SMOKE those zalmans.

I would return the 350s if you can and get a pair of 555's or 595s, though if you do be prepared to also invest in an amp for them, as well as soem decent cables, as any sound card will not have NEAR the power required to drive those cans properly.

I use a pair of HD500's with an external mic without any issues, no feedback/background noise nothing.  Mind you I also listen at sensible volume levels...

Also dont run those headphones over ~50-60% volume for a few months untill they start to break in, as you can develope poor reflex habbits for the drivers.  Just leave the headphones playing a mix of music on all the time, this will accelerate "break in"

If you are still not impressed with those cans, or dont want to bother with a HD series/amp i would suggest investing in another pair of zalmans.

on the note about breakin you will notice a HUGE improvement, like night to day comparison.


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## Cold Storm (Dec 27, 2008)

Here you go from the mouth of a Sennheiser rep himself stating that the PC 350 has the same drivers as the 595



As for everything else Tau. You are right on the fact that it will take somewhere towards 400 hours in order to get them "broken in".. 

I just don't feel the need to tell someone to go and grab all that for just the little things. Yeah, I only have the small babies, but even listing to the HD650's and having that hand built amp running it off tubes, I don't feel the need for it. That's me, and my best friend goes crazy over it. But, that's a true Audiophiler there.. has a home made portable amp just for the grado's that he has.. 

If he feels like doing so, then your leading him in the right direction, but for just leasury stuff.. Those PC350's should be good enough. And like you have said also. If he doesn't like them in a few weeks, sell it, and buy another Zalman set.

Suomi!


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## Tau (Dec 27, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> Here you go from the mouth of a Sennheiser rep himself stating that the PC 350 has the same drivers as the 595



I saw that post, im willing to bet their not though.

The drivers are not even the same physical size, let alone comparable spec.

by same driver maybe they mean the cone is the same.... not the rest of the magnets, coil, diaphrams etc... 

the HD595s are more headphone than the 350s could ever aspire to be, and will sound 500 times better.


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## Tau (Dec 27, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> Here you go from the mouth of a Sennheiser rep himself stating that the PC 350 has the same drivers as the 595
> 
> 
> 
> ...



HD650's are nothing special, frankly i think their a bit of a waste with so many other more viable options out there...


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## Cold Storm (Dec 27, 2008)

As for the HD650 reference.. You have your own thoughts on it, as does others. 

It could be that it's just the coils that are used the same for the PC350 as the HD595's. You'll have to go into the data sheets all together just to know what the truth is.. 

The Hd's are more then what the Pc's can ever be. They are built that way.


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## DEFEATEST (Dec 27, 2008)

Well I am a man who does not quit so I will take your advice, though I do find it strange that a company would put a set of "gamer" headphones on the market that take 400 hours to "break in". you know what I mean? Especially if you need an amp and all that jazz to really get out of them what they can give. And how do reviewers give these things great scores on gaming? Do they break them in? Thanks for all you help guys and I'll keep at er'

Def

Also where would I find default 2 channel settings in xfi console or in windows console? Not seeing either. Its not 2.1 speakers is it?


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## Frederik S (Dec 27, 2008)

It depends on how you define great sound really.The Zalman headphones pump out a lot of bass, and if you lean towards a bass heavy sound that could be it. Plus the surround feature is nice in some games that fully supports it. Like all the other said try turning off all the effects in the X-Fi suite and make sure you are not using the wrong output setup 2.1/4.1/5.1 it should be set to headphones. 

I seriously doubt that Sennheiser would put the HD595 drivers in a closed set of headphones. I believe they have only done that once when they put HD555 drivers in one of the lower end closed headphones with horrible results. Making closed back headphones is hard because you are constantly battling the reverberations from the enclosure. So all of a sudden dampening, and enclosure material begins to matter.

And yea the Sennheiser HD650s are beast, you just need a fully balanced source, amplifier, and upgrade cable then they sound amazing


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## Tau (Dec 27, 2008)

DEFEATEST said:


> Well I am a man who does not quit so I will take your advice, though I do find it strange that a company would put a set of "gamer" headphones on the market that take 400 hours to "break in". you know what I mean? Especially if you need an amp and all that jazz to really get out of them what they can give. And how do reviewers give these things great scores on gaming? Do they break them in? Thanks for all you help guys and I'll keep at er'
> 
> Def
> 
> Also where would I find default 2 channel settings in xfi console or in windows console? Not seeing either. Its not 2.1 speakers is it?



I dont use an xfi card so im not sure on that end, just make sure its all set to default, and any effects are all switched off.  everything set to neutral.

I actually just had a lengthly conversation with a friend of mine who owned a pair of PC350s, and he was not impressed at all with them, so judging from his description of them, and yours i think your on the money with em.  but they may get better after breakin, and once they are being properly drivin...  though i wouldent hold my breath.





Frederik S said:


> It depends on how you define great sound really.The Zalman headphones pump out a lot of bass, and if you lean towards a bass heavy sound that could be it. Plus the surround feature is nice in some games that fully supports it. Like all the other said try turning off all the effects in the X-Fi suite and make sure you are not using the wrong output setup 2.1/4.1/5.1 it should be set to headphones.
> 
> I seriously doubt that Sennheiser would put the HD595 drivers in a closed set of headphones. I believe they have only done that once when they put HD555 drivers in one of the lower end closed headphones with horrible results. Making closed back headphones is hard because you are constantly battling the reverberations from the enclosure. So all of a sudden dampening, and enclosure material begins to matter.
> 
> And yea the Sennheiser HD650s are beast, you just need a fully balanced source, amplifier, and upgrade cable then they sound amazing



^^ I remember when they did that,

I agree the 650's are nice... but alot of people expect to be able to plug those into their ipod and have them sound great...  they dont think about what they need to drive those babys.

Personally i like the AKG 701's


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## twicksisted (Dec 27, 2008)

I got a pair of the sennheiser HD600
They sound fantastic on my 12 channel mackie mixer (through a pre-amp) but absolutely suck balls through my soundcard straight.

Thing is they need a preamp as they need amplification and the soundcard dosent hav e the power to run them properly.

If you going to get a good pair of cans, you need to amp them with enough juice or they wont sound great


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## servermonkey (Dec 27, 2008)

i  these things....i got 2 and a xfi card.


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## Tau (Dec 27, 2008)

twicksisted said:


> I got a pair of the sennheiser HD600
> They sound fantastic on my 12 channel mackie mixer (through a pre-amp) but absolutely suck balls through my soundcard straight.
> 
> Thing is they need a preamp as they need amplification and the soundcard dosent hav e the power to run them properly.
> ...



The soundcard is basically acting as your preamp in this situation, and without amplification your doing more harm than good to those cans.

It depends how much you like your sound, and how well you can hear   Myself I will never go back down from my current setup (BSR EQ3000 EQ, Techniks G-90 amp, all custom sheilded and balanced cables throughout the system)  Everything else just doesent stack up


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## Frederik S (Dec 28, 2008)

Tau said:


> Personally i like the AKG 701's


Of course you do they are awesome, a bit tricky to find suitable amp for though. I keep mine because of their expansive sound stage and because they are good allarounders much like the HD580s / HD600s. Nothing like a good set of headphones to keep you company when you are writing reviews 

And btw the EF1 sounds like it is made for the AKG K701s sweet combination. 

Back on topic. If you want a really good set of headphones to use with your PC you should check out either the HD 555/595 or the Beyerdynamic DT770 80 ohm version. The Beyers are very bass heavy.


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## DEFEATEST (Dec 28, 2008)

So is there a sound card I could get that would do these pc 350's justice? I have a xfi extreme music right now. It still bothers me that a company would put these headphones on the market for "gamers" and not tell them they need an amp and to let them "burn in " for 400 hours before they can really experience the sound. Thats bs if you ask me. Like who do they think their market is anyway? A bunch of audiophile gamers?


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## Frederik S (Dec 28, 2008)

I don't think you need an amp for the PC 350s. It is 108 dB/mW so basically a normal sound card is enough. You could probably gain some sound quality by using them with an amp, but I doubt the difference will be big.


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## Kursah (Dec 29, 2008)

I've been considering this set of cans over the last few days...really I'm stuck between a rock and a hardplace atm because my Turtle Beach HPA2's bit the dirt the other day, and it's something I cannot repair unfortunately...while they were great I'm ready for something else, something new.

I also have the X-Fi Xtreme Music PCI sound card, overall it's a decent card, with EQ tuning I've been able to make some very cheap headsets sound decent...but I'm a slight bass-head, to the point I like it to be there, be well rounded and match the rest of the sound when it's prevelent in the sound processing. I've read a lot of good and quite a few mixed results of this headset, watching this thread has me questioning them and wishing there was a way I could try them out before I laid down the cash to own them...I could buy almost 3 more sets of HPA2's and have decent 5.1 output and a built in amp/volume unit for the price of these along with easy tunability...but I've heard so much good about Sennheiser as a brand, I've just yet to actually listen to them.

I will be watching this thread and seeing what happens, it definately has my interest for sure! I hope you get everything up to par Defeatest!


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## DEFEATEST (Dec 29, 2008)

Ya , I'm still stumped here. I'm going to just use them for a while and go from there. Still got my Zalmans right beside me so if I don't seem to warm up to them, well then I guess it's back to zalmans for me. As it stands, I dont recommend these at all, especially given the price. How I'm stuck is that they cost my wife around 250 thru ebay and we also paid duty on them, so sending them back if that's even possible- and I would still be out around a hundred bucks.(considering duty and shipping) If I had bought them locally , they would have been back on day 2. I'm going to try hooking them up to a decent sound system and see if they seem any better on that. That way I would know that my pc just doesnt have the juice for them.


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## King Wookie (Dec 29, 2008)

Err, where these bought new?


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## DEFEATEST (Dec 29, 2008)

Sorry, ya they are totally new. From a reputable dealer as well.


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## FLIXZR (Jan 4, 2009)

I'm having the same problem as you deafest, i got the pc350's too, and my other headset, (Icemat siberia's) sound wayyy better  and the pc350's sound like crap


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## DEFEATEST (Jan 4, 2009)

good to know I'm not nuts! grrrrrrrrrr


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## Kursah (Jan 4, 2009)

I did some more research on these...it's about 50/50 some love them and they work very well, some hate them. And it doesn't really matter what they are using to drive them...kind of dissapointing for a headset that is so expensive. I decided to just get another set of Turtle Beach HPA2's, I know the work well..they sound great, the surround works quite well, they come with an amplifier and you can control the level for each channel and have a master volume, and they're extremely comfy.

I know sennheisers are touted for sound quality, and they better sound good for the price...but if they don't come with an amp and need one...i'm just not that much of an audiophile to want to pay money for a little amp setup in a damn altoids can ran by a 9v battery to make my headphones sound better...i'll get what works and save a ton of money! But I'd still like to try these out still, but from what I've seen it seems the PC350's are a failure, maybe when they're 40-50 bucks I'll try em out. I hope you guys get it all sorted, I really do...if not sell them to someone that's willing to deal with em!


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## DEFEATEST (Jan 5, 2009)

I'm wondering if someone has tried them on a real hi-fi setup? If so what do they think. All I have is my yamaha receiver that I use for my surround sound on my TV. I have my 360 hooked up to it. Now I did try the headphones on it and found no difference.   Quite a few folks have been suggesting an external amp for these. I dont mind doing that if the sound is like MUCH better. Don't wanna spend another hundred bucks for a bit better.


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## Kursah (Jan 5, 2009)

It'll drive more power to the headset that's for sure, but I find it hard to spend 30-50 bucks on an amp in an altiods mints can lol. The kits don't appear to be too shabby. There are a lot of different suggestions I've read for braking sennheisers in, dunno if it's relevant to a certain model or all of them. Some say overnight, some say 100hours, lol...an amp would probably help a little, but really you should have pretty solid sound output from your reciever I would assume.

I'd say maybe call Sennheiser and see what the deal is, they might offer suggestions, I hear they have pretty good customer service.


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## pentastar111 (Jan 6, 2009)

My girlfriend bought me a pair for Christmas...I couldn't be happier, they sound great, after the "burn in". My HD580's needed the same thing.


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## DEFEATEST (Jan 6, 2009)

So how long did this burn in thing take you  penstar? in hours.  Also some folks I know have been looking at me all funny like when I talk about "burn in" telling me they have never heard of it, and these guys are audiophiles. And I found this  http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/34579/127865.html  I guess it does say they can benifit from it.


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## pentastar111 (Jan 6, 2009)

DEFEATEST said:


> So how long did this burn in thing take you  penstar? in hours.  Also some folks I know have been looking at me all funny like when I talk about "burn in" telling me they have never heard of it, and these guys are audiophiles. And I found this  http://forum.ecoustics.com/bbs/messages/34579/127865.html  I guess it does say they can benifit from it.


 Been running them since christmas, so a little less than 50 hrs...I really like the clarity.  They are not "audiophile" phones like the 580's, but then they aren't supposed to be. But, I think they are well built, quite a bit better than the fatality pro's I have (though these are also a very nice headset) Back to the break-in...they were a little "tin cannish" when i first used them, Now they are very nice sounding, something I'm sure will only get better with another week or so of usage. Also in regards to "burn-in". I always thought of it like breaking in a car or bike engine, kind of getting everything to seat properly as it were...speakers when new are very stiff, so getting them to respond "correctly' is not always possible when first out of the box. After the break in the speakers should and will have loosened up enough to be very responsive to signals. And depending on how much you use them depends on how long your break in time will be...I work nights so I can spend most of the day at my computer, so I can have a set of cans broke in in about a week to 2 weeks. All in all, burn-in to me is just another phrase, "breaking them in" is probably more appropiate. One other note, I am running a small "amp" so it does boost the sound a bit. but then again I like running through a seperate amp no matter what headphones i'm using, I can adjust the sound at the amp, it just gives me more control.


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## DEFEATEST (Jan 10, 2009)

Well tonight I hooked up the ol' Zalmans after using the senns only for the last week or so and I gotta say that I was taken back by how much the senns have grown on me. When I plugged in the zalmans and played some left4 dead, I actually preferred the senns over the Zalmans. In the first week of so I couldnt stand the senns over the Zalmans. Very odd. The Zalmans sound much different to me now! Although I still think there is a "tin can" sound to the senns, they are growing on me and maybe my ear was just tuned to the old set. Lets hope they keep growing on me!


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## Madchuckles (Feb 9, 2010)

You could try this popular mod that people are doing.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f4/modding-sennheiser-pc350-headset-406187/


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