# Renault to DRM your car!



## qubit (Nov 13, 2013)

Well, ain't this just great: now your car manufacturer can remotely disable your car. 

Remind me to give Renault a miss... until they all start doing it.

_Health Warning: this is an interesting and controversial subject, as DRM always is. Please keep it civil and don't flame or troll me for my opinion about it, or each other._





Source: TechDirt


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## radrok (Nov 13, 2013)

Another reason to keep guzzling gas!! 


Jokes aside, society (consumers mostly) needs to draw a line on this matter.


That's way too much control taken from the customer.


Anyway people can just send them a message by voting with their wallet.


What puzzles me is if people care enough to fight against this or they are going to eat the whole thing without doing anything.


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## Nordic (Nov 13, 2013)

I wonder how this could be hacked. As in you stop paying the rental fee, you tear out the data collecting parts and, and make the battery work on your terms. Renault would probably sue though.


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## qubit (Nov 13, 2013)

james888 said:


> I wonder how this could be hacked. As in you stop paying the rental fee, you tear out the data collecting parts and, and make the battery work on your terms. Renault would probably sue though.



Indeed, regular petrol and diesel cars have been vulnerable to hacking for some time through the test port on the engine management unit. I think some might even be vulnerable wirelessly, but don't quote me.


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## TheoneandonlyMrK (Nov 13, 2013)

qubit said:


> Indeed, regular petrol and diesel cars have been vulnerable to hacking for some time through the test port on the engine management unit. I think some might even be vulnerable wirelessly, but don't quote me.


.

Mostly car engine hacker's are mearly using the expensive service diagnostic pcs not remotely hacking but the future may yet bring back the "chiper" 
I see it as fairly reasonable if they were to use it reasonably and it might even start of like that


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## leeb2013 (Nov 13, 2013)

looks like I'll have to keep running my V8 until electric cars get hacked.

Also, what's the chance of your electric internet connected car getting a virus and refusing to run, or worse, refusing to stop!!


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## Nordic (Nov 13, 2013)

leeb2013 said:


> looks like I'll have to keep running my V8 until electric cars get hacked.
> 
> Also, what's the chance of your electric internet connected car getting a virus and refusing to run, or worse, refusing to stop!!



That would be called stuxnets evil twin


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## remixedcat (Nov 13, 2013)

This kinda crap won't help adoption that's for sure.

If they want more electric car adoption they will need to get rid of this kinda bs. Nobody wants to pay another monthly bill. If I buy the damn thing with cash its mine.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 13, 2013)

If you was rich enough, could you not just buy the battery out right? or tell them to fuck off if they say no.


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## Fourstaff (Nov 13, 2013)

Delicious. There is an emergency and your car wouldn't move because it cant connect to the web.


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## HTC (Nov 13, 2013)

Fourstaff said:


> Delicious. There is an emergency and your car wouldn't move because it *cant connect to the web.*



Looooooooooool


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## qubit (Nov 13, 2013)

tigger said:


> tell them to fuck off



I do like that option.


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## Jack1n (Nov 13, 2013)

Maybe a third party could manufacture their own battery for this,but it might be illegal to do so.


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## HTC (Nov 13, 2013)

Maybe they are just making it seem like electric cars are the next best thing IF you don't mind the DRM and, since most do mind and object to it, gas/diesel cars is the alternative.

It's a subtle way to make sure people buy gas/diesel cars instead of electric ones.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 13, 2013)

qubit said:


> I do like that option.



They're French anyway, should be a ban on the English buying French muck, we all know the English and the French have, shall we say history.


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## HTC (Nov 13, 2013)

tigger said:


> *They're French anyway, should be a ban on the English buying French muck*, we all know the English and the French have, shall we say history.



Would you still think that if other manufacturers "took the hint" and did the same?


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## Deleted member 24505 (Nov 13, 2013)

HTC said:


> Would you still think that if other manufacturers "took the hint" and did the same?



No it's an English thing, we dislike the French, or everyone I know does anyway.


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## RCoon (Nov 13, 2013)

tigger said:


> No it's an English thing, we dislike the French, or everyone I know does anyway.



I dont think that's the case anymore, we just like making fun of them for surrendering a lot and little-man syndrome brought upon them by Napoleon. I don't dislike the French because of what happened hundreds of years ago. That's not to say I like them much either, nor do I like any engineering that was ever exported from that country (even their bridges are designed by british engineers), so I'd never buy their stuff anyway.
Sadly my family are French/Irish descendants, though we only advertise the Irish part, so maybe I'm the wrong person to offer an opinion, but I'm no French sympathiser, that's for sure


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## qubit (Nov 13, 2013)

I don't think we should get into an English-French thing as it can come across a bit racist.

Let's just stick to the issue which is this awful DRM, regardless of where the company originates from. They are all as bad as each other in the end anyway, more or less.


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## RCoon (Nov 13, 2013)

qubit said:


> I don't think we should get into an English-French thing as it can come across a bit racist.
> 
> Let's just stick to the issue which is this awful DRM, regardless of where the company originates from. There all as bad as each other in the end anyway, more or less.



I like to think of car manufacturers similar to motherboard or peripheral vendors. Some have their fans, and some people have personal preference. Sometimes some stupid vendor decides to dump DRM on something (Razer for example), at the end of the day, clueless customers (of which 90% of PC owners and 90% of car owners ARE clueless), and will not care until something bad happens, while the rest of us will wise up, and buy something else.

As with all things that we find utterly ridiculous, even if this is bad for customers and everyone hates it(see: Razer driver DRM, Origin Software, EA license activation/deactivation, Windows 8 Start menu), they are not going to listen and fix it, I guarantee it.


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## Frick (Nov 13, 2013)

RCoon said:


> As with all things that we find utterly ridiculous, even if this is bad for customers and everyone hates it(see: Razer driver DRM, Origin Software, EA license activation/deactivation, Windows 8 Start menu), they are not going to listen and fix it, I guarantee it.



You misuse the term "everyone".

This is pretty silly though, and I have a feeling this is one thing that can actually properly backlash. After Top Gear reports on it anyway...


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## RCoon (Nov 13, 2013)

Frick said:


> You misuse the term "everyone".
> 
> This is pretty silly though, and I have a feeling this is one thing that can actually properly backlash. After Top Gear reports on it anyway...



OK, not everyone, but I should imagine all of us? Unless you are some kind of DRM cookie monster, and relish in Razer's senseless acts of throwing DRM at you for your insatiable need to be connected to all the things.

Play SimCity with your Razer mouse whilst driving your Renault car(while using google maps on your iphone/android). Every DRM user's needs met. You'd be datamined so hard, GCHQ or the NSA would be better at finding your soulmate in life than most dating websites.


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## qubit (Nov 13, 2013)

+1, it's likely to spread like a cancer, like restrictive practices normally do.

I do wish the general population weren't so bloody clueless, then these big companies wouldn't be able to force this garbage upon us since we'd just vote with our wallets. They would then have to remove it or go bust.

This doesn't apply to just tech either. Think how many people you meet every day that are generally ignorant and clueless in life. It's hardly fair to say "everyone", but there sure are a lot of them. Far too many. :shadedshu


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## remixedcat (Nov 13, 2013)

Google is now also gonna ban non store distributed extensions now so they can control what goes on there.. Yep its the end of side loading.. 

So now you have that as well


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## THE_EGG (Nov 13, 2013)

Good thing I didn't get myself one of those then! Citroen FTW!  I'll stick with my built in air-conditioning fragrance and no cup-holders thankyou (mango cartridge atm, smells delicious).

The battery rental scheme actually sounded like a good idea until they mentioned about data mining


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## Tatty_One (Nov 13, 2013)

It's not really a cause for concern..... does anyone actually buy a new Renault these days?  I mean anyone, they depreciate so fast you can pick up a 6 month old car for about half price lol.


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## Fourstaff (Nov 13, 2013)

Tatty_One said:


> It's not really a cause for concern..... does anyone actually buy a new Renault these days?  I mean anyone, they depreciate so fast you can pick up a 6 month old car for about half price lol.



2nd hand Renault sounds tempting, do they last or do they automatically break down into a thousand pieces for recycling past their 3rd birthday?


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## RCoon (Nov 13, 2013)

Tatty_One said:


> It's not really a cause for concern..... does anyone actually buy a new Renault these days?  I mean anyone, they depreciate so fast you can pick up a 6 month old car for about half price lol.



I do actually need to buy a car right now. Get paid in 10 days and need to find something that doesn't cost copious amounts and doesn't disassemble itself when a sparrow farts.


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## Tatty_One (Nov 13, 2013)

Fourstaff said:


> 2nd hand Renault sounds tempting, do they last or do they automatically break down into a thousand pieces for recycling past their 3rd birthday?



They are a bit hit and miss in reliability, go for the smaller models such as Clio's but avoid anything below the 1.2 petrol model engines unless you like getting out to push up long hills 



RCoon said:


> I do actually need to buy a car right now. Get paid in 10 days and need to find something that doesn't cost copious amounts and doesn't disassemble itself when a sparrow farts.



Just take a look at older cars on the road that will give a benchmark to longevity, Nissan Micra's, Vauxhall Corsa's, fiesta's, Mitsibushi Colt's, Toyota Yaris etc, rule of thumb generally is Jap Cars in most cases are fairly high on the reliability front, Germans not bad of course but expext to pay much more, even at 5 years + age which I am guessing is where you will be looking.


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## qubit (Nov 13, 2013)

RCoon said:


> I do actually need to buy a car right now. Get paid in 10 days and need to find something that doesn't cost copious amounts and doesn't disassemble itself when a sparrow farts.



I don't know what sort of car you're after, but the Hyundai i10 is a solid, reliable little car. I have a couple of friends who have them and are pleased with it. You may want something bigger though, as the boot space is tiny. Hyundai are a decent brand overall. The likes of Toyota and Honda are even better, though they might well cost quite a bit more.

And no DRM.


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## RCoon (Nov 13, 2013)

Tatty_One said:


> They are a bit hit and miss in reliability, go for the smaller models such as Clio's but avoid anything below the 1.2 petrol model engines unless you like getting out to push up long hills
> 
> 
> 
> Just take a look at older cars on the road that will give a benchmark to longevity, Nissan Micra's, Vauxhall Corsa's, fiesta's, Mitsibushi Colt's, Toyota Yaris etc, rule of thumb generally is Jap Cars in most cases are fairly high on the reliability front, Germans not bad of course but expext to pay much more, even at 5 years + age which I am guessing is where you will be looking.



yeah, I was looking at an '05 almera last week, but it seems most of those cars you mentioned are the ones that are for sale around my area


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## HTC (Nov 13, 2013)

qubit said:


> I don't know what sort of car you're after, *but the Hyundai i10 is a solid, reliable little car.* I have a couple of friends who have them and are pleased with it. You may want something bigger though, as the boot space is tiny. Hyundai are a decent brand overall. The likes of Toyota and Honda are even better, though they might well cost quite a bit more.
> 
> And no DRM.



How much does it turbo more then the I7? And is it better then the Iphone? And how does it compare to the Ipad?

Finally: when is the "J" version supposed to debut?

Sorry: couldn't resist 


On topic, Renault is a brand widely used over here. My dad's Renault lasted quite a while: particularly with the amount of abuse he threw @ it.


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## Tatty_One (Nov 13, 2013)

Hyundai I10 came 93rd our of 118 in the JD Power survery, thats even below the Citroen C3!   Having said that, Hyundai and Kia do get better year on year.  I would possibly go for a 4 or 5 year old Kia as they come with a 7 year warranty if I wanted a little runaround.


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## qubit (Nov 13, 2013)

Tatty_One said:


> Hyundai I10 came 93rd our of 118 in the JD Power survery, thats even below the Citroen C3!   Having said that, Hyundai and Kia do get better year on year.  I would possibly go for a 4 or 5 year old Kia as they come with a 7 year warranty if I wanted a little runaround.



I'm surprised they rank so low as they've had quite good reviews and people as a whole are happy with the brands.


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## Frick (Nov 13, 2013)

RCoon said:


> OK, not everyone, but I should imagine all of us? Unless you are some kind of DRM cookie monster, and relish in Razer's senseless acts of throwing DRM at you for your insatiable need to be connected to all the things.



The main complaint was actually that you bunched Windows 8 Start Meny in there, but I was classy and didn't bring up specifics.


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## RCoon (Nov 13, 2013)

Frick said:


> The main complaint was actually that you bunched Windows 8 Start Meny in there, but I was classy and didn't bring up specifics.



I see, another debate for another time in another thread (which I don't intend to be part of). Stay classy


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