# Undervolting i7 9750H



## tojemojeime24 (Aug 26, 2020)

so i have a problem with using throttlestop(my cpu is i7 9750h, it is such a good thing to use but in my case, fps goes down from 400 to 200(sometimes to 100) and it becomes unplayable... what can i do to get my temps down and fps up, temps went from 90 to 75 and i like it but fps...


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## unclewebb (Aug 26, 2020)

The 9750H is a 45W processor that can easily run at 60W or more. You have set both of your turbo power limits to 32W. That will reduce maximum performance. Set your power limits back to their default values, at least 45W for the long turbo power limit and 60W for the short turbo power limit. 

Set the core and cache offset voltages both to -100 mV. If you only set the core offset voltage, and leave the cache at +0.0000, your undervolt will not work. 

Set Speed Shift Max back to 45. If your laptop runs too hot, create a ThrottleStop profile with reduced turbo ratio limits instead.

Check the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits option.

Laptops with the 9750H run extremely hot. That is normal. Some people disassemble their laptops so they can replace the thermal paste. When this procedure is done on an assembly line, it is not always done right.

Check the Nvidia GPU box in the Options window if you have an Nvidia GPU. This is useful information when trying to determine why your computer is throttling. You need to see whether the problem is the CPU or the GPU that is throttling. 

Turn on the ThrottleStop Log File option and go play a game for at least 15 minutes. When finished, exit your game and then exit ThrottleStop. Open up your ThrottleStop / Logs folder. Attach your log file to your next post so I can see how your laptop is performing.


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## tojemojeime24 (Aug 26, 2020)

there it is


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## unclewebb (Aug 26, 2020)

CPU and GPU performance looks fairly consistent while you are playing. Were your FPS consistent during that log file? The CPU is mostly running at 4000 MHz and the GPU at about 1860 MHz. There is some PL2 power limit throttling showing up in the log file. Did you adjust your power limits higher yet? CPU and GPU temps are OK so you can go higher.

Did you set the core and cache voltage offsets?


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## tojemojeime24 (Aug 26, 2020)

Did you set the core and cache voltage offsets? I have set them to -99.6, thats fine right? FPS was pretty good during this session but i know it can go so much higher...I did everything u said, were can i adjust power limits , what is pl2..? btw ty so much for this help...


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## unclewebb (Aug 26, 2020)

PL2 is the short term turbo power limit. The throttling caused by this during your log file was very slight. The long and short turbo power limits are adjusted near the top of the TPL window. Your original screenshot shows these both at 32. Did you adjust these? They can go higher for more performance but that also creates more heat. You get to decide how you want your laptop to run.


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## tojemojeime24 (Aug 27, 2020)

I have put it to 45, I found it ok

should i change these cores active thing and do you maybe know how can i put throttlestop to start every time i turnn on pc


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## unclewebb (Aug 27, 2020)

Use the Task Scheduler to start ThrottleStop when Windows starts.






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tojemojeime24 said:


> I found it ok


If your laptop is running OK, no need to change anything.


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## tojemojeime24 (Aug 27, 2020)

I did do that with task scheduler but it doesnt work


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## unclewebb (Aug 28, 2020)

If you follow the guide exactly, it works.

Delete the task you created and follow each step in the guide.


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## tojemojeime24 (Aug 28, 2020)

my problem is back, again very laggy during gaming(drops from 300 to 100 fps in a second) could you give me the TPL tab settings


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## unclewebb (Aug 28, 2020)

I do not own a 9750H. I have no magic settings. Run another log file. If your FPS is dropping that much, the log file should show something. Your CPU might be too hot and thermal tbrottling or the voltage regulators might be too hot.


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## Netherscourge (Aug 29, 2020)

Try this:

In FIVR:

1. Set your IccMax slider for both Core and Cache to 250.00.
2. Set your Power Plane PPO Current limit to 140.
3. Lower your voltage offset on both the CPU and Cache to -125

In TPL:
1. Change your TPL Boosts to 70 Long and 90 Short and uncheck the clamp.
2. Change your Speed shift to Min 1 and Max 45.
3. Change your Intel CPU power balance to 16 and your Intel GPU power balance to 16. Leave the TDP balance at 0.

TS Main Screen - the only three things that should be checked are SpeedShift, Speed Step and C1E.

Clear all your Limit alerts, clear your Max Temps and uncheck ProChot if it has a check in it - now rerun your benchmarks.

Your goal is No Errors during the TS Bench, no PL or EDP throttling and AVERAGE temps under 90. (You might hit 90 briefly, which is fine. As long as your running steady under 90, you're good to go).

NOTE - when you first boot up your laptop, you will almost always trigger power alerts because Throttlestop doesn't start undervolting until AFTER you log into your laptop or PC. That's normal. You want to clear your PL limit alerts before any testing, so as not to be confused.

If that works and all you get is thermal throttling, try dropping your CPU freqs  - running 12 cores at 4.0ghz will get hot. Maybe drop the Freq range to 40, 39, 38, 37, 36, 35. People hate dropping CPU speed, but consider your rated CPU base freq is actually 2.6GHz, not 4.5GHz. 

Hope this helps! This is what my CPU is set at.


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## AOne (Aug 29, 2020)

As above, but use Core:Cache ratio of 2:1. Increase Core offset to -200mV.


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## PPDeluXe (Aug 31, 2020)

I had tried to undervolt myself, and thought I was doing okay. I got a CINEBENCH score of 2806 but was receiving thermal errors throughout.



Netherscourge said:


> Try this:
> 
> In FIVR:
> 
> ...





AOne said:


> As above, but use Core:Cache ratio of 2:1. Increase Core offset to -200mV.



After using the above tips from Netherscourge and AOne I received *no errors* and an average CINEBENCH score of around 2950.

I am super happy with these results, so thank you very much.

I am just wonder, is there be a certain Speed Shift - EPP range that I can play around with to see different results? It's currently set at 128.

Also, I still reached temps up to 98 degrees during the cinebench, but no warning, is that safe? Have the above settings somehow change the tolerance of that warning, because I used to receive warnings at those temps?


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## AOne (Aug 31, 2020)

If you have no warning, all should be OK. The temps are high, but it depends on your room temperature. If it's above 30 C, it's probably normal. Check the differences between CPU temp cores. If they're above 12-15 degrees Celsius, maybe you should consider changing the thermal paste (the factory applied usually sucks).


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## unclewebb (Aug 31, 2020)

@PPDeluXe - The Intel default thermal throttling temperature is 100°C. You should not see any throttling or any warnings before your CPU reaches this temperature. Some laptop models lower this a few degrees. Post a screenshot of ThrottleStop. It will show on the main screen what your laptop is set to. Your log file shows just a tiny hint of throttling so I am going to guess that your laptop has set the PROCHOT temperature to 98°C.

Post a screenshot of the Options window too. The PROCHOT Offset value in the Options window can be used to control the maximum temperature as long as it is not locked. This is probably set to 2. (100°C - 2 = 98°C)



PPDeluXe said:


> but no warning


I am pretty sure that towards the end of your Cinebench run when the multiplier starts to drop below 40.00, you should see the word PROCHOT on the main screen turn red. This shows that thermal throttling has occurred. When done testing, if this is red, you can click on it and it will reset this information within the CPU. Your CPU is well protected regardless of your ThrottleStop settings so no worries.

If you use the Task Manager and increase the Windows priority of Cinebench, you might be able to reach the 3000 point level. Also minimize the background tasks. Get the C0% under 0.5% before you run Cinebench.

An EPP setting of 0 is for maximum CPU speed. A setting of 80 is a good compromise. I prefer 80 to 128. You might not need to set this in ThrottleStop. Windows 10 can control EPP. Clear the Speed Shift EPP box in ThrottleStop and switch Windows power profiles. Watch in the FIVR monitoring table to see what EPP value the CPU is using. Some laptops set this automatically to an appropriate value.


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## PPDeluXe (Sep 1, 2020)

AOne said:


> Check the differences between CPU temp cores. If they're above 12-15 degrees Celsius, maybe you should consider changing the thermal paste (the factory applied usually sucks).


This is something I should definitely consider in the future, thank you.



unclewebb said:


> Your log file shows just a tiny hint of throttling so I am going to guess that your laptop has set the PROCHOT temperature to 98°C.


PROCHOT 97°C, amazing guess  You people always impress with your knowledge and analytical skills.

For reference to the below, I have an HP Omen 15" laptop i7-9750, GTX 1660 Ti
@unclewebb This morning I noticed that after all the startup had completed, I'm idling at 4000MHZ+ which seems to me like the turbo is constantly enabled. Disabling the turbo in TS works, but it shouldn't even be turbo'ing and wasn't behaving like this before yesterday's tests.
I tried removing the undervolt by deleting the .ini file and shutting down the computer, but this didn't work.

Out of further curiosity to see if I could get back to normal, I restored the BIOS back to default. This too did not work.

My GPU is idling between 300-360MHz but I'm not sure if this is normal or not because I never bothered to look before.

Is there any way to truly get my settings back to default? I really want to undervolt but I also want to be able to revert.

Thanks for your help


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## unclewebb (Sep 1, 2020)

PPDeluXe said:


> which seems to me like the turbo is constantly enabled.


Intel CPUs are designed to use full turbo boost whenever they have something to do. This is normal. It is never a good idea to hold an Intel CPU to 800 MHz if it has a task that it needs to complete. The quicker it gets background tasks processed, the larger percentage of time the cores can spend in the low power C7 state. A core in C7 is disconnected from the internal clock and it is disconnected from the voltage rail so it is sitting idle at 0 MHz and 0 volts. This is how modern CPUs save power.

Your idle screenshot shows that your computer is nowhere near idle.



 

Big difference.

The Windows power plan controls your CPU speed. Open the Windows Power Options and set the Power Plan to Balanced. Windows 10 has a slider in the notification area that you can adjust to fine tune the power plan.

Your CPU speed is not the problem. Applications have been added to your computer that are loading the CPU when they should not be. They do not go idle so your CPU is not idle. How much time does your idle CPU spend in the C0 state processing background tasks? When properly setup, Windows 10 and ThrottleStop are extremely efficient. Many other apps are not.



http://imgur.com/Sjo8mtn


Here is an interesting paper by some smart guys at Berkeley. They found that slowing a CPU down was not the answer.


			https://www2.eecs.berkeley.edu/Pubs/TechRpts/2009/EECS-2009-140.pdf


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## PPDeluXe (Sep 1, 2020)

Thanks so much for your informative reply, @unclewebb 

I guess the best thing for me to do is start from a clean windows install, then work from there


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## unclewebb (Sep 1, 2020)

PPDeluXe said:


> a clean windows install


I use this method.








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I use O&O Shutup10 to disable some of the more offensive bits and pieces of Windows 10.





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Use the ThrottleStop C0% data to keep a close eye on what your computer is up to. Anytime you install something new, check to see if the idle C0% has changed. Some software is so poorly written that it is like dragging a boat anchor behind your car.


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## Netherscourge (Sep 4, 2020)

PPDeluXe said:


> I had tried to undervolt myself, and thought I was doing okay. I got a CINEBENCH score of 2806 but was receiving thermal errors throughout.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Glad it helped! I actually kept going and was to juggle the offsets a bit more. I lowered my CPU Core offset to -250.00 and bumped my CPU Cache Offset to -115.2. That's the absolute lowest I can go on both before I get errors. It's different for every CPU though - they are not all created equal. -125/-125 is a solid baseline though. Some people suggest a 2:1 ratio, which is pretty close to mine. Mine wound up being 2.17 : 1

My Cinebench score is 2507, but I have a 1650, not a 1660ti.

My Max GPU temp was 60C and max CPU temp was 87 just now during the test. No throttling.

***One interesting thing I have noticed - if I keep Throttlestop minimized in the systray during Cinebench, I stay under 90C. If I have the TS window open with the Limit window, during Cinebench to monitor the temps and limit in real time, I can get up to 92C.

***Another interesting thing - if I do the "Boralus Test" in World of Warcraft with TS minimized in the systray, I hit 60FPS with no throttling whatsoever and temps stay in the low 80Cs. If I do it with with the TS window open in front of the WoW game window, I get Power Throttling and an occasional game crash to desktop.

- Not sure what's up with that? I've repeated this multiple times with the similar results - leaving TS open in front of whatever app or game I'm running causes performance issues. But if I keep it in the systray, there's no performance hit at all and everything works great.

^EDIT - never mind. The issue seems to be gone. Just installed two HP software component updates this morning. Wondering if that fixed it? /shrug


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## madseason (Jan 6, 2021)

Hi,
I went through this topic, tried different settings, but it did not go so well.
I have a dell xps 15 with this CPU. Did the thermal paste change, some thermal pads - temps are under control, under load in Cinebench r23 it mostly stays under 95, with peaks to 100.
Difference between undervoling and not is only 100 points. Am I doing something wrong? Is this sore even good or bad?

Under FIVR Core and Cache are booth set to -99.6 and IccMax to 255.75

I use it most of time with as workstation with my EGPU - 3060Ti and external monitor. So iGPU and dGPU are disabled, as there are some issues with it while gaming with eGPU.
And it has been tested while "docked" with eGPU.



			Dell XPS 15 7590 Performance Results - UserBenchmark
		

This shows that this CPU gets to 45th percentile.



http://imgur.com/EU7FM8n


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## Empecial (Jan 6, 2021)

Netherscourge said:


> Your goal is No Errors during the TS Bench, no PL or EDP throttling


hey man. i know im kind of digging in the forums here but i found your guide and really wanted to give it a try since i got the same CPU, but whatever i do i really cant seem to NOT get the EDP or PL warnings. And after following the guide, it sadly ended in no success. what could be done from here? i've already repasted, which seems to be working atleast a bit.


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## Faide (Jan 6, 2021)

madseason said:


> Hi,
> I went through this topic, tried different settings, but it did not go so well.
> I have a dell xps 15 with this CPU. Did the thermal paste change, some thermal pads - temps are under control, under load in Cinebench r23 it mostly stays under 95, with peaks to 100.
> Difference between undervoling and not is only 100 points. Am I doing something wrong? Is this sore even good or bad?
> ...


Your FIVR panel is showing that its locked and the top right table is showing no offset on core and cache which i believe means your bios is not letting you undervolt the CPU.


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## unclewebb (Jan 6, 2021)

@madseason - Looks like Dell has disabled CPU voltage control.







The latest version of ThrottleStop makes it clear when voltage control is disabled.









						ThrottleStop 9.2.9
					

ThrottleStop 9.2.9 https://www.techpowerup.com/download/techpowerup-throttlestop/  New Features - added 10850K / 10900K support including a new Turbo Group access window. - updated the TS Bench and the C State window for the 10 core CPUs. - enabled Limit Reasons support for Comet Lake CPUs. -...




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If this feature is important to you, try installing an older BIOS version. After you do that, go into the BIOS and look for the Reset to Factory option. That has worked for many users with various Dell laptops.

You can also disable this lock by editing some UEFI variables.


__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/Dell/comments/fzv599

@Empecial - You did not post any screenshots of how you have ThrottleStop setup. No way for me to help you or make suggestions without seeing that info.


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## transcripto (Jan 20, 2021)

i need help with my dell xps 7590. i just read all the explanations and tips but i still have issues with cpu clock speeds and frequencies. My cpu is stuck at 800mhz and I have not been able to find a solution. I have removed the battery, I have changed thermal paste and thermal pads, I have tried configurations on TP and Intel XTU, but nothing. I wish you could help me, I will share some screen.

I wish you could help this suffering soul u_u


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## unclewebb (Jan 20, 2021)

transcripto said:


> I wish you could help this suffering soul


There are two things you can try. Go into the TPL window and check the Lock option in the Turbo Boost Power Limits section. After you do this, open the FIVR window and make sure that Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits is checked. 

That will take care of two of your power limits. The problem is that there are three unique sets of turbo power limits. The third set is controlled internally. Dell is one of the few companies to use this third set of power limits. What your computer is doing is it is forcing one or both of the turbo limits to 0 or very close to 0. This causes constant power limit throttling. Either PL2 or PL1 will light up red in Limit reasons when this is happening. If it is the third set of power limits that is causing this, there is no magic that ThrottleStop can do. Intel XTU and ThrottleStop do not have access to this third set of limits.

If this is the case, the only likely fix is a new motherboard. You can try running on battery power or switching to a different power adapter. Something stupid like one 10 cent sensor has gone bad. Now your laptop is unusable. Thanks Dell. Great design.


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## transcripto (Jan 20, 2021)

unclewebb said:


> There are two things you can try. Go into the TPL window and check the Lock option in the Turbo Boost Power Limits section. After you do this, open the FIVR window and make sure that Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits is checked.
> 
> That will take care of two of your power limits. The problem is that there are three unique sets of turbo power limits. The third set is controlled internally. Dell is one of the few companies to use this third set of power limits. What your computer is doing is it is forcing one or both of the turbo limits to 0 or very close to 0. This causes constant power limit throttling. Either PL2 or PL1 will light up red in Limit reasons when this is happening. If it is the third set of power limits that is causing this, there is no magic that ThrottleStop can do. Intel XTU and ThrottleStop do not have access to this third set of limits.
> 
> If this is the case, the only likely fix is a new motherboard. You can try running on battery power or switching to a different power adapter. Something stupid like one 10 cent sensor has gone bad. Now your laptop is unusable. Thanks Dell. Great design.


I'm crying :c

What do u think about this thread: 




__
		https://www.reddit.com/r/Dell/comments/a27e1l


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## unclewebb (Jan 20, 2021)

transcripto said:


> What do u think about this thread:


Give it a try and see if it fixes your problem.

I have read that if you have checked the FIVR - Disable and Lock Turbo Power Limits box in ThrottleStop, you no longer have to disable the DPTF driver. Try disabling it and see if it makes any difference. Your laptop is already broken. Hard to make it run worse than it runs now.


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## budafuko (Jan 16, 2022)

i dont want to read all the posts but your PL1/PL2 should not be set to 32 respectively. the long power max should be clamped at 75 and the short power max should be unclamped at 100


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## tojemojeime24 (Feb 10, 2022)

Hello guys, so I am actually the guy who started this topic year and a half ago (HELIOS 300 - PH315-52 (i7-9750H)), and after 1st week of being here I forgot about it :/
I was playing CS:GO without using TS for couple of months and temps were not going over 83-86C and one day after driver or windows update it made my temps go to 92-94
I downloaded TS again and set some basic stuff how I remembered but I dont think I did it correctly.

So what exactly happens to me, while my temps are 90+if I turn TS on it makes them lower but my FPS goes down so hard and it becomes unplayable (I mean not that bad but from 300+FPS to around 100-150)- Also I found out that "Turn on" button does basically nothing because when I open TS it automatically does its thing, regardless of being on/off... SO what here should I change and why does my FPS crahses so hard once again?


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## unclewebb (Feb 10, 2022)

@tojemojeime24 - The version of ThrottleStop you are using is more than 3 years old. Start by downloading an updated version.

Gaming oriented laptops need regular maintenance. When was the last time you opened up your laptop and cleaned out the heatsink and fan? Have you ever looked at the thermal paste and replaced that? When your CPU temperatures start going up, this is a good first step to find out why.

Setting Speed Shift EPP to 128 can reduce maximum performance. I would suggest setting EPP no higher than 84.



tojemojeime24 said:


> I found out that "Turn on" button does basically nothing


ThrottleStop can be used to adjust the majority of Intel CPUs that have been produced during the last 15 years. The Turn On - Turn Off button only controls the clock modulation and set multiplier functions. You are not using either of those features so you are right, the Turn On button is not needed for your laptop.

Update ThrottleStop and post some new pictures. Include the Options window. If the PROCHOT Offset feature is not locked, you can decrease the PROCHOT Offset value which raises the thermal throttling temperature. Your laptop is set to thermal throttle at 92°C which is too low compared to the Intel recommended 100°C value.

When you update ThrottleStop, delete all of the WinRing0 related driver files. The WinRing0 driver is no longer used with the latest version of ThrottleStop.

Here is a new thread for ThrottleStop related discussions.









						ThrottleStop
					

Optimize and tweak your Intel processor




					www.techpowerup.com
				




There is piles of useful information in that thread. I am sure there is some information in there about setting up a 9750H. Most users get their best results when they set the CPU core offset to a bigger number compared to the CPU cache. If the cache offset is stable at -100 mV, the core offset might be stable at -175 mV. There is no requirement to set these two offset voltages equal to each other.

Set IccMax for the core and the cache to the maximum value, 255.75. This tells the CPU to ignore this setting which helps avoid any throttling.

In the new ThrottleStop version, the PP0 Current Limit is now called Power Limit 4. It is just a different name for the same thing. You have this limit set to 130 which is OK. I prefer to set this limit to 0 so the CPU avoids using this.

The rest of your settings look OK. I think the biggest problem is that your laptop is overdue for a spring cleaning. Post a ThrottleStop log file that includes about 15 minutes of gaming. This will help me see if there are any problems.

Newer BIOS versions usually disable CPU voltage control so avoid updating your BIOS.


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