# Microsoft Announces Surface: New Family of PCs for Windows



## btarunr (Jun 19, 2012)

Today at an event in Hollywood, Microsoft unveiled Surface: PCs built to be the ultimate stage for Windows. Company executives showed two Windows tablets and accessories that feature significant advances in industrial design and attention to detail. Surface is designed to seamlessly transition between consumption and creation, without compromise. It delivers the power of amazing software with Windows and the feel of premium hardware in one exciting experience.



 

 

 




*Advances in Industrial Design*
Conceived, designed and engineered entirely by Microsoft employees, and building on the company's 30-year history manufacturing hardware, Surface represents a unique vision for the seamless expression of entertainment and creativity. Extensive investment in industrial design and real user experience includes the following highlights: 
Software takes center stage: Surface sports a full-sized USB port and a 16:9 aspect ratio - the industry standard for HD. It has edges angled at 22 degrees, a natural position for the PC at rest or in active use, letting the hardware fade into the background and the software stand out.
VaporMg: The casing of Surface is created using a unique approach called VaporMg (pronounced Vapor-Mag), a combination of material selection and process to mold metal and deposit particles that creates a finish akin to a luxury watch. Starting with magnesium, parts can be molded as thin as .65 mm, thinner than the typical credit card, to create a product that is thin, light and rigid/strong.
Integrated Kickstand: The unique VaporMg approach also enables a built-in kickstand that lets you transition Surface from active use to passive consumption - watching a movie or even using the HD front- or rear-facing video cameras. The kickstand is there when needed, and disappears when not in use, with no extra weight or thickness.
Touch Cover: The 3 mm Touch Cover represents a step forward in human-computer interface. Using a unique pressure-sensitive technology, Touch Cover senses keystrokes as gestures, enabling you to touch type significantly faster than with an on-screen keyboard. It will be available in a selection of vibrant colors. Touch Cover clicks into Surface via a built-in magnetic connector, forming a natural spine like you find on a book, and works as a protective cover. You can also click in a 5 mm-thin Type Cover that adds moving keys for a more traditional typing feel. 
*An Amazing Windows Experience*
Two models of Surface will be available: one running an ARM processor featuring Windows RT, and one with a third-generation Intel Core processor featuring Windows 8 Pro. From the fast and fluid interface, to the ease of connecting you to the people, information and apps that users care about most, Surface will be a premium way to experience all that Windows has to offer. Surface for Windows RT will release with the general availability of Windows 8, and the Windows 8 Pro model will be available about 90 days later. Both will be sold in the Microsoft Store locations in the U.S. and available through select online Microsoft Stores.










*Contributing to an Expanded Ecosystem*
One of the strengths of Windows is its extensive ecosystem of software and hardware partners, delivering selection and choice that makes a customer's Windows experience uniquely their own. This continues with Surface. Microsoft is delivering a unique contribution to an already strong and growing ecosystem of functional and stylish devices delivered by original equipment manufacturers (OEMs) to bring the experience of Windows to consumers and businesses around the globe.





*View at TechPowerUp Main Site*


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## cedrac18 (Jun 19, 2012)

These are going to be so expensive. 1080p on the pro version i hear.


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## btarunr (Jun 19, 2012)

Yup, the Pro has 10.6-inch 1920x1080 capacitive touchscreen. The RT isn't too bad, either (10.6-inch with 1366x768).


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## jalex3 (Jun 19, 2012)

If I had any real interest in buying a tablet I'd look at the pro. I don't though so I wont.


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## Chaitanya (Jun 19, 2012)

better start saving for it now.


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## 1c3d0g (Jun 19, 2012)

So what can this possibly do that a Zenbook Prime or an X1 Carbon cannot do? Hopefully the price will be a consolation...


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## sergionography (Jun 19, 2012)

:O this looks freaking awesome! microsoft finaly paying more attention to design than just be a bunch of nerds





1c3d0g said:


> So what can this possibly do that a Zenbook Prime or an X1 Carbon cannot do? Hopefully the price will be a consolation...



look better offcourse! and push microsoft hardware to compete with apple. I personaly care about performance and what hardware runs what, but for most people that isnt the case
its obvious here microsoft picked a certain theme which looks beautiful, and is sticking to it across the board(products). thats a very good thing with products as most people arent nerdy enough to even know what hardware runs what, so design is what pushes sales
im assuming the new xbox might have the same design theme which will be interesting


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## v12dock (Jun 19, 2012)

x86 or arm?


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## cedrac18 (Jun 19, 2012)

RT is Arm, pro is x86


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## btarunr (Jun 19, 2012)

cedrac18 said:


> RT is Arm, pro is x86





v12dock said:


> x86 or arm?



RT uses NVIDIA Tegra 3 quad-core ARM SoC, while Pro uses Intel Core i5 "Ivy Bridge" dual-core ULV.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 19, 2012)

Wow, I'm shocked Microsoft would enter the market with their own hardware.  OEMs aren't going to be happy.




btarunr said:


> RT uses NVIDIA Tegra 3 quad-core ARM SoC, while Pro uses Intel Core i5 "Ivy Bridge" dual-core ULV.


A product to compete with other tablets on the market and a desktop replacement, nice!


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## cedrac18 (Jun 19, 2012)

hmmm we need some korean MMOS with touchscreen support they will play well on the intel HD4000


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## btarunr (Jun 19, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Wow, I'm shocked Microsoft would enter the market with their own hardware.  OEMs aren't going to be happy.



This product will be sold through OEMs such as Dell, HP, etc., just like EVGA, ASUS, et al. sell reference design GeForce graphics cards.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 19, 2012)

Ah, so they can brand it as their own.  Very clever Microsoft, very clever indeed.


Edit: This source says RT will likely be $500 or less while Pro will be around $1000.

Microsoft is no longer just a software company...


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## Totally (Jun 19, 2012)

I'd love to see an AMD trinity model.


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## NC37 (Jun 19, 2012)

Well...I guess its better than the poopy brown color Zune they did...


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## DannibusX (Jun 19, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Microsoft is no longer just a software company...



They haven't been "just a software company" since 2001.


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## btarunr (Jun 19, 2012)

DannibusX said:


> They haven't been "just a software company" since 2001.



Since early-1990s. They started selling their own branded 2-button serial ball mice.


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## rooivalk (Jun 19, 2012)

and they're designing mouse since 1983


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## Delta6326 (Jun 19, 2012)

I like the looks. Now to me ables to game on it...


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## Drone (Jun 19, 2012)

DannibusX said:


> They haven't been "just a software company" since 2001.



Right. It seems that everyone ignored Microsoft's first tablet pc in the late 90s.


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## KissSh0t (Jun 19, 2012)

I have a "Microsoft Comfort Optical Mouse 3000", Great feeling Mouse to hold in your hand.. Microsoft make Keyboards too~ Since... 1994?


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## RejZoR (Jun 19, 2012)

Erm, hasn't ASUS already "invented" this with their modular Transformer tablets that you can attach a keyboard to them and turn them into PC or a notebook?


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## NdMk2o1o (Jun 19, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Ah, so they can brand it as their own.  Very clever Microsoft, very clever indeed.
> 
> 
> Edit: This source says RT will likely be $500 or less while Pro will be around $1000.
> ...



$1000 for a tablet PC???? 

I really hope not, like the look of the pro, if it's going to be that expensive can't see it being a success.


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## Completely Bonkers (Jun 19, 2012)

+1 to MS for taking the initiative after so many years of uninspiring netbooks and ULV luggables.

Shame on the PC industry that MS has to take the _*lead *_in hardware design.

One year earlier would have been a real win for MS. However, today, Apple is ready with "retina" Ipad/MacBooks. At least this new Surface competition will make Apple bring retina to Air much faster. Expect Apple refresh sooner than 1 year.

Apple needs to make bootcamp much more obvious/easy esp. XP (eg letting people install existing unused licenses) to the new Macbook/air range.  That would make me a buyer.

***

Observation: there are a lot of "girl" colours in MS marketing and products today. I guess they now see 50% of their consumer market as no longer being c:\ based.


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## rainwilds (Jun 19, 2012)

Very nice. I have been waiting for a tablet with keyboard like interface with Windows 8. Very cool indeed.


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## St.Alia-Of-The-Knife (Jun 19, 2012)

MS surface, the new Zune


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 19, 2012)

Does this have the potential to beat the iPad? Yes. Will it beat the iPad? No.


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## Soylent Joe (Jun 19, 2012)

I hope they also do a 7-inch version with the ARM processor and Windows RT. That would be perfect.


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## Scrizz (Jun 19, 2012)

I want one just b/c


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## imitation (Jun 19, 2012)

Does anyone else have the feeling that these (esp. the RT variant) will be locked down enough to be totally unuseable? "Secure" Boot, Microsoft-Appstore-only, etc... ?


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## johnnyfiive (Jun 19, 2012)

C Sharp developers rejoice! Now you have another reason (aside from Mango and Apollo) to start developing applications on Microsoft platforms. This is an exciting release! I'll definitely be interested in checking one out and possibly purchasing one.


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## XNine (Jun 19, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Wow, I'm shocked Microsoft would enter the market with their own hardware.  OEMs aren't going to be happy.
> 
> A product to compete with other tablets on the market and a desktop replacement, nice!



I wonder if this has anything to do with MS denying HTC hardware rights for Windows 8 Tablets?


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## cadaveca (Jun 19, 2012)

Let me know when I can take my pc game, and have the video stream to this, and the input from this, wirelessly within my home LAN.

Heck, I want to play XBOX360 games on my Digital cable box. Oh wait...


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## Totally (Jun 19, 2012)

RejZoR said:


> Erm, hasn't ASUS already "invented" this with their modular Transformer tablets that you can attach a keyboard to them and turn them into PC or a notebook?



Asus did not invent the detachable keyboard, it was just the most recent, before this.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 19, 2012)

DannibusX said:


> They haven't been "just a software company" since 2001.


I was semi quoting the CNN Money article:


> Still, it's a radical shift for the world's largest software company.


Yeah, they're a little off the mark.  Zune is effectively the same thing but minaturized and Microsoft is the only company that sells Zunes.




NdMk2o1o said:


> $1000 for a tablet PC????
> 
> I really hope not, like the look of the pro, if it's going to be that expensive can't see it being a success.


That's what Windows 7 tablet PCs run for now.




XNine said:


> I wonder if this has anything to do with MS denying HTC hardware rights for Windows 8 Tablets?


http://www.mb.com.ph/articles/361903/microsoft-tells-htc-to-stay-away-from-windows-8-party


> Microsoft has reportedly excluded HTC Corp. from its list of Windows 8/RT product development party. Citing HTC’s lack of experience in developing tablet computers and that the Taiwan hardware vendor is not selling enough devices, the software giant barred HTC from joining the high-tech industry’s latest jab at removing Apple from the top of the tablet totem pole.


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## dwade (Jun 19, 2012)

I believe this is the future of computing. Add in a Thunderbolt port and plug in a high end GPU for serious graphics power. Now, I'm really agreeing with those who said the consoles will die. This is the concept in which consoles will eventually become: Xbox Mobile. Not only that, but as a PC replacement in the near future as well. The aforementioned Thunderbolt EGPU along with upcoming Intel CPUs that put ARM's turtle speed CPU to rest for a real desktop experience in a tablet form factor... until then.


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## Drone (Jun 19, 2012)

I see Surface as another flop by MS. People either buy ultrabooks or they buy ipads. I don't believe this thing's gonna be ipad killer.


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## Static~Charge (Jun 19, 2012)

DannibusX said:


> They haven't been "just a software company" since 2001.





FordGT90Concept said:


> I was semi quoting the CNN Money article



The writer at CNN Money should do a little basic research before opening his mouth....


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## Ravenas (Jun 19, 2012)

This will not beat the iPad. 

The Surface will be as successful as the Zune. The Zune has been axed by Microsoft, this will be as well.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 19, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> This will not beat the iPad.


I wouldn't be so quick to judge.  That CNN Money article I linked to was by far the hottest page on CNN Money last time I checked.  There is a lot of interest in it.




Ravenas said:


> The Surface will be as successful as the Zune. The Zune has been axed by Microsoft, this will be as well.


The Zune was axed because Windows Phone 7 completely replaced it.  Why would people buy a $200 Zune HD when they could get a Nokia Lumia 900 for $100 with contract?  It's shocking Apple hasn't ended the iPod and iPod Nano yet.


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## trickson (Jun 19, 2012)

I hope this puts Apple in it's place once and for all! Great job MS! A tad late IMHO and seems like nothing more than a copy cat/Johnny come lately thing. But if MS can price this under or at the apple ipad offering then this could be a game changer.


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## Ravenas (Jun 19, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I wouldn't be so quick to judge.  That CNN Money article I linked to was by far the hottest page on CNN Money last time I checked.  There is a lot of interest in it.
> 
> 
> 
> The Zune was axed because Windows Phone 7 completely replaced it.  Why would people buy a $200 Zune HD when they could get a Nokia Lumia 900 for $100 with contract?  It's shocking Apple hasn't ended the iPod and iPod Nano yet.



Lol the windows 7 phone sucks. 

Furthermore Nokia, the company manufacturing the phone, is going down the shitter. They just axed 20% of the labor. The Windows 7 phone will be another failure.

The only reason the Xbox 360 still exists is because Apple and Google allow it to.


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## Avelict (Jun 19, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Lol the windows 7 phone sucks.
> 
> Furthermore Nokia, the company manufacturing the phone, is going down the shitter. They just axed 20% of the labor. The Windows 7 phone will be another failure.
> 
> The only reason the Xbox 360 still exists is because Apple and Google allow it to.



Lol imagine if Apple decided to design their own console >.> 

With their budget they'd be shipping consoles with 680's in 'em.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 19, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Lol the windows 7 phone sucks.


It does not.




Ravenas said:


> Furthermore Nokia, the company manufacturing the phone, is going down the shitter. They just axed 20% of the labor. The Windows 7 phone will be another failure.


I blame stupid consumers (pay much more for an iPhone 4S and get less):
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303640104577436443119293310.html

Nokia's hands are tied when they only ship 2 million units compared to Apple's 35 million units.  Nokia is fighting a monopoly.  I suggest watching the video at the bottom of this link:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/14/nokia-layoffs_n_1595599.html




Ravenas said:


> The only reason the Xbox 360 still exists is because Apple and Google allow it to.


Xbox 360's primary competitor is Sony's PlayStation 3.  What does that have to do with Apple and Google?


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 19, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> This will not beat the iPad.
> 
> The Surface will be as successful as the Zune. The Zune has been axed by Microsoft, this will be as well.



The Zune was an entertainment novelty. This has a real business application to it. Thats something the Zune never had. Will it be as big as the ipad? No. But this isnt even close to being another Zune.


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## trickson (Jun 19, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> The Zune was an entertainment novelty. This has a real business application to it. Thats something the Zune never had. Will it be as big as the ipad? No. But this isnt even close to being another Zune.



The only reason it will not be as big as the iPad is because it is a Johnny come lately product. If MS wants this to beat Apple then it will have to make sure the price is right!


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 19, 2012)

5 ways Microsoft's Surface may be better than an iPad (keyboard, size, power, USB ports, Xbox SmartGlass)


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## cadaveca (Jun 19, 2012)

trickson said:


> The only reason it will not be as big as the iPad is because it is a Johnny come lately product. If MS wants this to beat Apple then it will have to make sure the price is right!



Not really. This is just one peice of a much larger vision for home media and entertaintment that Microsoft envisioned years ago. This, and all the tech featured in it, is really nothing new, at all, or "Johnny-come-lately" as you so bluntly put it.

I don't think Microsoft is trying to beat Apple. They are trying to provide something much different than what Apple has in mind, I think.


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## Hilux SSRG (Jun 19, 2012)

I think this has a good shot of getting a chunk of [Apple's] marketshare and edging out Samsung.

Not everyone wants to be in Apple's garden prison.  This seems to be more business-friendly.


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## _Zod_ (Jun 19, 2012)

Hilux SSRG said:


> I think this has a good shot of getting a chunk of [Apple's] marketshare and edging out Samsung.
> 
> Not everyone wants to be in Apple's garden prison.  This seems to be more business-friendly.



So they can be in Microsoft's walled in garden instead? I'd prefer to roam free via android thank you. If you are talking about the Pro version, well it will too expensive to compete with the iPad anyway.


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## Ravenas (Jun 19, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> The Zune was an entertainment novelty. This has a real business application to it. Thats something the Zune never had. Will it be as big as the ipad? No. But this isnt even close to being another Zune.



It will be around for a short time, however, it will eventually disappear just like the Zune. Sadly for Microsoft, they take forever to realize a product isn't going to make it.


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## Hilux SSRG (Jun 19, 2012)

_Zod_ said:


> So they can be in Microsoft's walled in garden instead? I'd prefer to roam free via android thank you. If you are talking about the Pro version, well it will too expensive to compete with the iPad anyway.



I hope you are joking when referring to Apple's vs Microsoft/Google's walled in gardens?

Personally, I'd rather not have Google know anything about me if I have a choice. 

I think MS is marketing the Pro version as an ultrabook competitor moreso than strictly tablet, but there is much overlap between the two categories.


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## Rhyseh (Jun 20, 2012)

Everyone seems to be missing where this product absolutely trounces the competition and that is that it is both a tablet and a fully functional PC in one. This is going to make waves in the business community, finally a tablet device that supports current business infrastructure, that can be controlled be group policy and secured by technologies that are already present in 90% of big businesses.... No more half baked solutions that you currently have to implment to make Apple and Android based devices work in big enterprises (not to mention the extra support costs that come with these devices)... This is a device that has the potential to be easy to implement, have low implementation costs and has a positive ROI (something all the other tablet devices lack).

Tablet devices are all well and good on their own, but for any serious business user you still cannot replace the laptop/desktop with one, the same goes for fully functional OS's on tablet devices they are just too unwieldy to use efficiently on the move. This product has overcome this limitation. I'm expecting very healthy sales figures from this product and windows 8 in general.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 20, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> It will be around for a short time, however, it will eventually disappear just like the Zune. Sadly for Microsoft, they take forever to realize a product isn't going to make it.



I think it'll do fine assuming pricing is in the right area. The Zune was about 8 years or more late to the game. the Surface is only 3-4 years late. And one of the strong points I am reading about with the Surface is its legitimate keyboard. Not something big and clunky like what is offered from 3rd party for the iPad.



Rhyseh said:


> Everyone seems to be missing where this product absolutely trounces the competition and that is that it is both a tablet and a fully functional PC in one. This is going to make waves in the business community, finally a tablet device that supports current business infrastructure, that can be controlled be group policy and secured by technologies that are already present in 90% of big businesses.... No more half baked solutions that you currently have to implment to make Apple and Android based devices work in big enterprises (not to mention the extra support costs that come with these devices)... This is a device that has the potential to be easy to implement, have low implementation costs and has a positive ROI (something all the other tablet devices lack).
> 
> Tablet devices are all well and good on their own, but for any serious business user you still cannot replace the laptop/desktop with one, the same goes for fully functional OS's on tablet devices they are just too unwieldy to use efficiently on the move. This product has overcome this limitation. I'm expecting very healthy sales figures from this product and windows 8 in general.



+1


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## Galas (Jun 20, 2012)

It's an excellent piece of hardware. Like most of Microsoft hardware.
But ... it runs Windows, and IE. 
No, neither the iPad nor the top of the line Android flavoured tablets (Samsung, Asus, etc)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSaXj1vIGxo


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 20, 2012)

They're pre-production models they demo so all the bugs aren't worked out.  That's why they have a spare available in case it does decide to act up.  Usually the address the problem right after it occurs on stage.


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## Galas (Jun 20, 2012)

I don't really mind what happened on stage... it still runs Win / IE


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 20, 2012)

Galas said:


> I don't really mind what happened on stage... it still runs Win / IE



uh according to your system specs you have a system that runs windows?

And the Surface is a PC in tablet form you will be able to choose whatever browser you want.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 20, 2012)

Thought I read somewhere that the Surface Pro version comes with Google Chrome pre-installed too (Google is as committed to dethroning Apple as Microsoft is).


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## Wile E (Jun 20, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I wouldn't be so quick to judge.  That CNN Money article I linked to was by far the hottest page on CNN Money last time I checked.  There is a lot of interest in it.
> 
> 
> 
> The Zune was axed because Windows Phone 7 completely replaced it.  Why would people buy a $200 Zune HD when they could get a Nokia Lumia 900 for $100 with contract?  It's shocking Apple hasn't ended the iPod and iPod Nano yet.



It was axed because it didn't sell well, because nobody liked it. Mobile interfaces have never been a strong area for MS.



FordGT90Concept said:


> It does not.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The iPhone 4S is way better for most consumers than Win7 handsets. There is a shitload more you can do with it. Sorry, but Win Phone 7 is a piece of locked down crap, just like iOS, but it has even less available for it. How does that not suck exactly?

Now, all that said. I like this product. I would love to have a Pro version. This fits the power user niche quite nicely. I get my toy, but then I also get a work computer when I need it. All I would need to make it perfect is a keyboard dock option that added some extra battery (like the Transformer) and preferably an ethernet port.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 20, 2012)

Wile E said:


> The iPhone 4S is way better for most consumers than Win7 handsets. There is a shitload more you can do with it. Sorry, but Win Phone 7 is a piece of locked down crap, just like iOS, but it has even less available for it. How does that not suck exactly?


iPhone 4S doesn't have 4G, Lumia 900 does.  iPhone 4S does not have an FM tuner, Lumia 900 does.  iPhone 4S has a 3.5" screen, Lumida 900 has 4.3".  That's just scratching the surface, and oh yeah, it retails for $200 less.

Most people say Windows Phone 7 is much easier to use than iOS too.  This is off topic, so I'll stop there.




Wile E said:


> All I would need to make it perfect is a keyboard dock option that added some extra battery (like the Transformer) and preferably an ethernet port.


It is too thin for RJ45 jacks.


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## Wile E (Jun 20, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> iPhone 4S doesn't have 4G, Lumia 900 does.  iPhone 4S does not have an FM tuner, Lumia 900 does.  iPhone 4S has a 3.5" screen, Lumida 900 has 4.3".  That's just scratching the surface, and oh yeah, it retails for $200 less.
> 
> Most people say Windows Phone 7 is much easier to use than iOS too.  This is off topic, so I'll stop there.
> 
> ...


And despite that, the Lumia still has WAAAAYYYYYYYY less available for it in terms of apps, peripherals and integration into things like car stereos.

And I was talking about an alternative, slightly larger, keyboard dock with an additional battery, some extra ports and an rj45.


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## naoan (Jun 20, 2012)

Rhyseh said:


> Everyone seems to be missing where this product absolutely trounces the competition and that is that it is both a tablet and a fully functional PC in one. This is going to make waves in the business community, finally a tablet device that supports current business infrastructure, that can be controlled be group policy and secured by technologies that are already present in 90% of big businesses.... No more half baked solutions that you currently have to implment to make Apple and Android based devices work in big enterprises (not to mention the extra support costs that come with these devices)... This is a device that has the potential to be easy to implement, have low implementation costs and has a positive ROI (something all the other tablet devices lack).
> 
> Tablet devices are all well and good on their own, but for any serious business user you still cannot replace the laptop/desktop with one, the same goes for fully functional OS's on tablet devices they are just too unwieldy to use efficiently on the move. This product has overcome this limitation. I'm expecting very healthy sales figures from this product and windows 8 in general.



What kind of business realllly need tablet over noteboook or ultrabook/thin anyway?


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## MilkyWay (Jun 20, 2012)

Drone said:


> I see Surface as another flop by MS. People either buy ultrabooks or they buy ipads. I don't believe this thing's gonna be ipad killer.



They said that about Android Smartphones and they do pretty well against iphones now.
Previous Windows tablets are a bit meh but this is Microsoft taking it serious now with Windows 8 for ARM with a proper tablet orientated OS.


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## Galas (Jun 20, 2012)

nvidiaintelftw said:


> uh according to your system specs you have a system that runs windows?
> 
> And the Surface is a PC in tablet form you will be able to choose whatever browser you want.



Yeap. I actually put that AFTER posting my previous comment. I knew some MS lover would point it out.

Yes, I Have 1 of 5 PCs running windows at home. It's my gaming rig. Of course MS is way ahead in that department. 

Based on my daily basis of multiple OS usage is why I said so.


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## ensabrenoir (Jun 21, 2012)

Hhhhhmmmmmmm................tablets.....now I get it


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## pcexpert (Jun 21, 2012)

I have only one question: 
"Will the good old x86/x64 PC applications, that we have now working on Windows 7 or XP, WORK on Surface with Windows RT ?"

If not then this is just a waste of money and time...


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 21, 2012)

Windows 8 RT is no different than Windows Phone 7 or iOS in that all applications must be coded for it and are either preinstalled or obtained through Microsoft's Store:
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/...ndows-for-the-arm-processor-architecture.aspx

Windows 8 Pro will have all the benefits of Windows 7, at least as far as backwards compatibility and software availablity is concerned.

Said differently, Windows 8 Pro Surface competes with MacBook Air and Windows 8 RT Surface competes with iPad.


Edit: Caveat: Apparently Microsoft ported the .NET Framework to ARM so applications built for .NET could be recompiled (or already compiled for "Any CPU") to work on Windows 8 RT.  At least that is my understanding of it.


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## Bundy (Jun 21, 2012)

This is a great product in concept and a serious contender to replace my business laptop. My next purchase is going to be a tablet of some sort, mainly due to the easy carrying shape they offer plus convenience of use on planes. Laptops are old school and iPads are toys when serious business needs are considered.

I think Microsoft have placed themselves right in the middle of a big customer base.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 21, 2012)

It's the 1980s all over again!  Apple dominated a market, Microsoft introduced a similar product for the business minded, and Microsoft mopped the floor with Apple. XD

The multi-billion dollar question is: does history repeat?


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## babash*t (Jun 21, 2012)

This should read 'Microsoft have announced a new way of ripping whatever's left of the average PC user's money'


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## remixedcat (Jun 21, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> iPhone 4S doesn't have 4G, Lumia 900 does.  iPhone 4S does not have an FM tuner, Lumia 900 does.  iPhone 4S has a 3.5" screen, Lumida 900 has 4.3".  That's just scratching the surface, and oh yeah, it retails for $200 less.
> 
> Most people say Windows Phone 7 is much easier to use than iOS too.  This is off topic, so I'll stop there.
> 
> ...



show me something like poweramp or moboplayer for windows phone 7.... 
show me something like farproc wifi analyzer or amped wireless wifi analytics....
does it have DSP?


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 21, 2012)

We've been over this before.

You use niche software and Android was intended for niche users.  99/100 people never use wireless analytical software and Windows is targeted at the 99% that simply want internet access, not the 1% that want more than that.

It has Zune for music and everything that comes out of a phone sounds like shit anyway so DSP is about as useful as putting lipstick on a pig.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

Here's how all this is going to work:

Apple will continue to dominate smart phone sales. Android users will eventually begin to leave Android for safer and more reliable Microsoft Phones.

The Microsoft Surface is going to be a flop. People are going to buy a similarly priced laptop instead of this.

At best, the Microsoft Surface will lure people into a Windows Store.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Here's how all this is going to work:
> 
> Apple will continue to dominate smart phone sales. Android users will eventually begin to leave Android for safer and more reliable Microsoft Phones.
> 
> ...



Do you understand that most field reps want tablets at this point and this windows tablet will work SEAMLESSLY with 99% of companies infrastructure?


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Do you understand that most field reps want tablets at this point and this windows tablet will work SEAMLESSLY with 99% of companies infrastructure?



The iPad does this and is cheaper and less bulky.

Furthermore, this is more of an extremely overpriced laptop than a tablet.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

No it doesnt. I know first hand there are intergration problems. As for "cheaper" show me an iPad with an i5 and 128gb SSD. No? Ok then.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> No it doesnt. I know first hand there are intergration problems. As for "cheaper" show me an iPad with an i5 and 128gb SSD. No? Ok then.



I don't need to because I can find a windows laptop with the same specs at way better price than this metro piece of overpriced hardware...

It's not a tablet, it's an overpriced laptop that Windows fanboys get a hard on about.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> The iPad does this and is cheaper and less bulky.
> 
> Furthermore, this is more of an extremely overpriced laptop than a tablet.



Where are you seeing over priced. The prices haven't even been released yet. other then people predicting that the RT will be 400-500 and then Pro 800-1000.

And it is a tablet that can be used to do work on like a laptop. 

Ipads and other tablets are nothing but toys. The OS and programs and functionality of those tablets do not work to well when you want to get work done in a seamless fashion. While the Surface will have a PC OS on it that all corporations have on their desktops and such that will work the same way so they can get things done. The Surface is built to allow people to get things done, while other tablets are just toys. I know so many people who have Ipads and such and use them only to play games and mess around on. It might sounds bias but its the truth.



Ravenas said:


> I don't need to because I can find a windows laptop with the same specs at way better price than this metro piece of overpriced hardware...
> 
> It's not a tablet, it's an overpriced laptop that Windows fanboys get a hard on about.



Wait but you didn't show us that you could find that so called "better laptop." Because you won't be able to find a 3rd gen i5 proc with a 128gb SSD for under $1000

Also go use a touch screen laptop that can be put into tablet form and tell me that Metro UI is a PoS for it. Because honestly Metro UI yeah it sucks for desktops, but it is a great UI for tablets.


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## Completely Bonkers (Jun 21, 2012)

If the prices are RT 400-500 and Pro 800-1000, then Apple doesnt have anything to worry about. It will not cannibalize the "iOS consumer" market.

However, if prices are  RT 250-350 and Pro 450-550 then I'm shorting Apple stock.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 21, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> No it doesnt. I know first hand there are intergration problems. As for "cheaper" show me an iPad with an i5 and 128gb SSD. No? Ok then.


MacBook Air is the closest and it is not a tablet.


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## MxPhenom 216 (Jun 21, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> MacBook Air is the closest and it is not a tablet.



yeah and its like what $2000, and probably doesn't even have a 3rd gen i5?


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> MacBook Air is the closest and it is not a tablet.



Exactly. The Air is the only thing even close to this. Microsoft made a tool. Not a toy.

Now I wait to be called a fanboy.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> MacBook Air is the closest and it is not a tablet.









That took all but 2 seconds. These are somewhat high prices too due to the thin product line.



> yeah and its like what $2000, and probably doesn't even have a 3rd gen i5?



1099$ for a macbook air with better gpu, better processor, and same ssd.

That's besides the point were talking about windows products.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 21, 2012)

nvidiaintelftw said:


> yeah and its like what $2000, and probably doesn't even have a 3rd gen i5?


$1000-$1500

I think they have been updated to include Ivy Bridge processors (I think HD 4000 is only in Ivy Bridge):
http://www.apple.com/macbookair/specs.html


Surface Pro has to be cheaper but the question is: how much?


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> http://www.techpowerup.com/img/12-06-20/197a.jpg
> 
> That took all but 2 seconds. These are somewhat high prices too due to the thin product line.
> 
> ...



So you expect companies to buy Apples and install windows 8? When they could just buy a Surface in bulk for their reps with full support from Microsoft?


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> $1000-$1500
> 
> I think they have been updated to include Ivy Bridge processors (I think HD 4000 is only in Ivy Bridge):
> http://www.apple.com/macbookair/specs.html
> ...



http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20120619PD210.html


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> So you expect companies to buy Apples and install windows 8? When they could just buy a Surface in bulk for their reps with full support from Microsoft?



The laptop I mentioned was an Acer. Please read before your Microsoft fanboy juices spur all over the keyboard. 

FordGT was the one talking about the macbook air and I correct him on the price.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> The laptop I mentioned was an Acer. Please read before your Windows fanboy juices spur all over the keyboard.
> 
> FordGT was the one talking about the macbook air and I correct him on the price.



Yeah I'm a Windows fanboy......Oh here look at this on my desk. 






See you don't get it. This is a WORK TABLET. Reps want tablets now. Not laptops.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20120619PD210.html


I don't think that's right.  Microsoft wouldn't even consider the Surface RT if they couldn't match or get under iPad's $500 price point.  The Surface Pro price sounds about right.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 21, 2012)

That first link is the 2002 Microsoft Surface "Unit" (which is a giant box where one side is a touch screen for installation in ATMs and the like)...not 2012/2013 Microsoft Surface.  ...they really shouldn't have recycled that name.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> You don't get it my friend:
> 
> http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee692038(v=Surface.10).aspx
> 
> ...



Yeah a laptop. Great.  Ok Ill try again........REPS DO NOT WANT LAPTOPS ANYMORE.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Yeah a laptop. Great.  Ok Ill try again........REPS DO NOT WANT LAPTOPS ANYMORE.



Lol it is absurd to think that a rep would want something bigger than something else if they are focused on portability.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Lol it is absurd to think that a rep would want something bigger than something else if they are focused on portability.



Its not only about portability. Its about presentation. I can tell you have never worked in a cooperate environment.


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## cadaveca (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> You don't get it my friend:
> 
> http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ee692038(v=Surface.10).aspx
> 
> ...



But it's not a touchscreen?


I just today spoke to a multi-billion company(oil and gas) about remote deployment, and guess what software they want to run, and guess what hardware?

And guess what type of interface they wanted? TOUCHSCREEN. 


No laptop has touchscreen. Because then it is a tablet. You keep coming up with failed alternatives to surface, because none of them are TOUCHSCREEN.

Why touchscreen? EASE OF USE.


Companies want to limit the functionality, to limit error, but at the same time, offer a wide variety of functionality that *isn't limited by processing power*. The Surface was designed with those characteristics in mind.


Yes, many companies, including healthcare, want tablets. TOUCHSCREEN TABLETs. And yes, many of them, right now, are using iPads. The number one complaint? LACK OF HORSEPOWER.


So, find a TOUCHSREEN LAPTOP for less than the Surface, as Mailman said, *with similar specs*, not alternatives that don't offer the same functionality.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I don't think that's right.  Microsoft wouldn't even consider the Surface RT if they couldn't match or get under iPad's $500 price point.  The Surface Pro price sounds about right.



You're right. The Surface has a 10.6'' screen which is bigger than the laptop I mentioned a larger keyboard. The laptop I mentioned was bulky too.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> Its not only about portability. Its about presentation. I can tell you have never worked in a cooperate environment.



Lol please sir you have no idea about me so please don't even start to think you do.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Why touchscreen? EASE OF USE.



Lol windows 8 is easy to use???


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## cadaveca (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Lol windows 8 is easy to use???



When customized to the needs of a user, yes, it is. 

It is a good alternative to Windows7 for power users? NOPE. I never made that claim, but Windows 8 does have a very specific purpose in the market, and Surface very neatly targets part of the ecosystem that Windows 8 is all about.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Lol please sir you have no idea about me so please don't even start to think you do.



1. Don't double post.

2. The fact you keep bringing up laptops vs tablets shows me you are out of the loop. Most reps in the field are in sales. This is why they are IN THE FIELD. They don't need or want a laptop. They do very light data entry for PO's and such and need to be SEAMLESSLY connected to a corporate infrastructure. They also need to present well. This is something ALL tablets do leaps and bounds better then any laptop. If is was about being "cheap" Levono would have been out of business years ago.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> WHen customized to the needs of a user, yes, it is.
> 
> It is a good alternative t oWIndows7 for power users? NOPE. I never made that claim, but Windows 8 does have a very specific purpose in the market, and Surface very neatly targets part of the ecosystem that Windows 8 is all about.



Oh lord help... It has to be customized to a company full of employees who are going to bitch about every little IT thing... Sounds like a disaster to me.


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## cadaveca (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Oh lord help... It has to be customized to a company full of employees who are going to bitch about every little IT thing... Sounds like a disaster to me.



Sounds like every day in the field, to me, now, and since technology first made an appearance in the workplace. Ask any IT Manager. Whether it's limiting client-side features like disk defrag, ability to install new programs, or the like, this is part and parcel of what the industry is all about. But thanks for the conversation, anyway.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> But it's not a touchscreen?
> 
> 
> I just today spoke to a multi-billion company(oil and gas) about remote deployment, and guess what software they want to run, and guess what hardware?
> ...



Boom goes the dynamite.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

TheMailMan78 said:


> 1. Don't double post.
> 
> 2. The fact you keep bringing up laptops vs tablets shows me you are out of the loop. Most reps in the field are in sales. This is why they are IN THE FIELD. They don't need or want a laptop. They do very light data entry for PO's and such and need to be SEAMLESSLY connected to a corporate infrastructure. They also need to present well. This is something ALL tablets do leaps and bounds better then any laptop. If is was about being "cheap" Levono would have been out of business years ago.



Everything that can be done in the field can be done better (at this point) with an iPad at a cheaper price point.



cadaveca said:


> Sounds like every day in the field, to me, now, and since technology first made an appearance in the workplace. Ask any IT Manager. Whether it's limiting client-side features like disk defrag, ability to install new programs, or the like, this is part and parcel of what the industry is all about. But thanks for the conversation, anyway.



Yes please go about customizing a windows 8 tablet to make it easy to use. I can't wait to see this.


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## cadaveca (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Yes please go about customizing a windows 8 tablet to make it easy to use. I can't wait to see this.



It's no different than the billions of office boxes already running Windows in office world-wide. That's part of what Microsoft sells to businesses.

I see you do not subscribe to the Microsoft Technet Newsletters then, because this is a recurring theme in those.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> It's no differnt than biollions of office boxes already runnign Windows. That's part of what Microsfot sells to businesses.
> 
> I see you do not subscribe to the Microsoft Technet Newsletters then, because this is a recurring theme in those.



Please continue to dance around the topic... 

The iOS is easier to use than Windows 8 on any level.


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## cadaveca (Jun 21, 2012)

Uh, here, I've leave you with this(no dancing involved, altohugh, i do love to two-step):



> PCL Construction recognized an opportunity with Windows To Go and how it could enable the work styles of its employees. Working with Windows 8 Release Preview versions of Windows To Go, PCL Construction employees can carry their entire managed corporate desktop and bring it along with them on a small bootable USB drive wherever they go – on the jobsite, from a field office, or from the comfort of their own home computer. They decided on an early implementation of Windows 8 to get feedback from users quickly and in an effort to remove any potential adoption barriers when Windows 8 rolls out to all employees.



and this:



> Russ Rosen, CIO of Rooms To Go, stated, “Windows 8 provides Rooms To Go the ability to develop a custom point of sale application that takes advantage of continuous connectivity, and provides a natural touch interface to allow for a cost-effective experience for our sales associates across 175 stores.”



Sure, not everyone like WIndows. But many, in fact, the majority of businesses do. Even secure ones:



> Finally, the Dutch Public Prosecution Service, through their partner Sparked, is planning to outfit their employees with custom line-of-business applications accessing a Microsoft SharePoint backend on Windows 8 tablet. These applications allow prosecution officers to remain effective and productive whether working in an office, courtroom or while mobile.




http://windowsteamblog.com/windows/b/business/

No dancing involved, just real COMPANY statements about everything I have said in previous posts here in this thread. Personally, I don't care what people use, or think. But I won't deny that Microsoft is on to something here.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> Sure, not everyone like WIndows. But many, in fact, the majority of businesses do.
> 
> http://windowsteamblog.com/windows/b/business/



Oh wow... Companies will finally update from Windows XP because Microsoft is releasing a Tablet tablet that uses Windows 8?


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## cadaveca (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> Oh wow... Companies will finally update from Windows XP because Microsoft is releasing a Tablet tablet that uses Windows 8?



That's not what I said. But ok, if that what you want to think I said, please, be my guest. 

We could have an intelligent discussion, rather than arguing, too, but I guess not that, either, eh?



But directly, yes, there have been companies that are looking for exactly that..an EVOLUTION to how they do busines, as long as it remains affordable, and profitable.


Damn, I did too much marketing today, I'm just in that mode. Time to go play some games.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> That's not what I said. But ok, if that what you want to think I said, please, be my guest.
> 
> We could have an intelligent discussion, rather than arguing, too, but I guess not that, either, eh?



I think people will buy this product and love it. People have a passion for Microsoft products because it is a Microsoft product (just like anything else).

Now for it being a tool. It certainly is... However, I don't believe it's the best tool in the shed.

Things that I think will kill this tablet no matter how many testimonials and opinions and facts you give me:


Price
Size
OS w/ Worse Reviews Vista
Being late to the party


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## cadaveca (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> I think people will buy this product and love it. People have a passion for Microsoft products because it is a Microsoft product (just like anything else).
> 
> Now for it being a tool. It certainly is... However, I don't believe it's the best tool in the shed.
> 
> ...



You could be right. Price isn't that big of a deal in volume purchasing(prices are negotible based on volume), size is what was asked for(literally), and OS reviews currently that take WIndows 8 negatively typically aren't done by companies. In fact, I posted three testimonials above, by companies, saying that they liek what Windows 8 has to offer (as did the company I spoke to today).

I mean, I'm not one to tell peopel that if they want to buy something, they are wrong in doing so. There are benefits to be had with Windows 8 that other OSes don't offer without signifigant monetary and time investment. All that Microsfot is trying to do with SUrface, is to take a lot of that confusion about specs, pricing, and features, out of the equation, and offering a platform by which custom solutions can be designed, and then deployed.

The problem with iOS is that it doesn't offer that flexibility, nor does it have the large number of available properly-trained developers and existing applications that can be leveraged like Windows does.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> The problem with iOS is that it doesn't offer that flexibility, nor does it have the large number of available properly-trained developers and existing applications that can be leveraged like Windows does.



Yeah but it plays Angry Birds like a motherf@#ker. Work related intergration? Not so much.


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## Ravenas (Jun 21, 2012)

cadaveca said:


> You could be right. Price isn't that big of a deal in volume purchasing(prices are negotible based on volume), size is what was asked for(literally), and OS reviews currently that take WIndows 8 negatively typically aren't done by companies. In fact, I posted three testimonials above, by companies, saying that they liek what Windows 8 has to offer (as did the company I spoke to today).
> 
> I mean, I'm not one to tell peopel that if they want to buy something, they are wrong in doing so. There are benefits to be had with Windows 8 that other OSes don't offer without signifigant monetary and time investment. All that Microsfot is trying to do with SUrface, is to take a lot of that confusion about specs, pricing, and features, out of the equation, and offering a platform by which custom solutions can be designed, and then deployed.
> 
> The problem with iOS is that it doesn't offer that flexibility, nor does it have the large number of available properly-trained developers and existing applications that can be leveraged like Windows does.



I don't think the buisiness world wants to fork up the money for a new OS, new hardware, a volume of Microsoft Surfaces, and everything that goes along with it just so they can seemlessly use the Microsoft Surface. Firstly, we are nearing an election year, so the buisiness world if going to be cautious of many things in regards to finances. Secondly, the money that goes along with what I previously mentioned. Lastly, you have to take in to consideration Apple's position in the tablet market right now. To say the least, they are completely dominating everything in sight in terms of tablets. If Apple felt the surface was a threat to their buisiness, they would just drop the price of the iPad even further.

It just seems like there is too much against the product right now in terms of the buisiness world and personal world, in my humble opinion.


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## TheMailMan78 (Jun 21, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> I don't think the buisiness world wants to fork up the money for a new OS, new hardware, a volume of Microsoft Surfaces, and everything that goes along with it just so they can seemlessly use the Microsoft Surface. Firstly, we are nearing an election year, so the buisiness world if going to be cautious of many things. Secondly, the money that goes along with what I previously mentioned. Lastly, you have to take in to consideration Apple's position in the tablet market right now. To say the least, they are completely dominating everything in sight in terms of tablets. If Apple felt the surface was a threat to there buisiness, they would just drop the price of the iPad even further.
> 
> It just seems like there is too much against the product right now in terms of the buisiness world and personal world, in my humble opinion.



Ah ok so they will just buy old laptops without a touch screen and run XP, OR they will buy iPads that don't integrate with their infrastructure and are vastly under powered compared to the Surface? Wow! You are really on to something!


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## 1freedude (Jun 22, 2012)

I don't give a shit what the OS is...if the app that is running is not finger friendly, might as well use a Treo.  The developers have to think about button placement, what the button next to the other button will do if accidentally pressed, minimizing menu accesses, clarity of the next task...none of this has to do with hardware or os.  Besides arm vs x86


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## remixedcat (Jun 22, 2012)

you can still integrate ipads into windows based networks with vmware view and vmware vsphere. many businesses allready have vmware vsphere and remote desktops so adding an ipad to that and using the remote vmware view desktop is easy as installing an app from the app store. the employee can use the same remote desktop on all vmware view supporting devices like android, ios, etc.... and use the same workstation they do at work or whatever.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 22, 2012)

How about just entire a domain name, username, password, and you're in?  VMWare is a bad idea in a business environment--just another thing to go wrong costing money instead of making it.


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## DannibusX (Jun 22, 2012)

I forsee the biggest customer base for the Surface being State and Federal governments.


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## remixedcat (Jun 22, 2012)

you can install windows 8 on a mac with bootcamp or vmware fusion... vmware fusion can even run bootcamp partitions!


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## remixedcat (Jun 22, 2012)

FordGT90Concept said:


> How about just entire a domain name, username, password, and you're in?  VMWare is a bad idea in a business environment--just another thing to go wrong costing money instead of making it.



is there an ipad app for that that's as reliable as using vmware??? and as secure??? show us please! 

and vmware also scales and has fault tolerance. not just a remote desktop, but a remote desktop that's scalable and fault tolerant. want more RAM? just log into vmware vsphere client and add RAM in a few clicks. You also get way more controls and security then using regular domains. each remote desktop is isolated and dedicated. way more secure then regular user/domains. 


webhosts use this all the time.

and vmware is used by tons of companies of all sizes and it's actually more reliable to have a cloud server network, redundant SANs and thin clients then it is to have old school servers. 

if you got a cloud then you just add the RAM, cores, etc with the vmware console rather then physically powering off a server and upgrading the RAM. and with vmware you can even upgrade the whole cluster by just adding a machine to it seamlessly. and if one server fails the vm is instantly moved to a different server with no downtime becuase the data is stored on the SAN.


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## Wile E (Jun 22, 2012)

remixedcat said:


> is there an ipad app for that that's as reliable as using vmware??? and as secure??? show us please!
> 
> and vmware also scales and has fault tolerance. not just a remote desktop, but a remote desktop that's scalable and fault tolerant. want more RAM? just log into vmware vsphere client and add RAM in a few clicks. You also get way more controls and security then using regular domains. each remote desktop is isolated and dedicated. way more secure then regular user/domains.
> 
> ...



He's not talking about iPad. He's talking about Win 8 and surface. No matter how you slice it, Win 8 will integrate into the infrastructure of a Windows based work environment better than any other option, period. It's fully native. No need for any third party tools like VMware. VMware is a band aid solution, not native integration.


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## remixedcat (Jun 22, 2012)

this is for businesses allready using vmware or considering moving to cloud based infrastructure.... and the example was in regards to the ipads cant be used for work purposes comment..... 

(PLEASE NOTE: this is not the same "cloud" as file storage sites, this is private clouds managed by your company and not an external entity)


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## FordGT90Concept (Jun 22, 2012)

Only journalistic buinsesses have invested heavily in iPad.  I doubt that is likely to change seeing as they, in particular, spearhead the cult of Apple (and always have).

Most other businesses are sticking with what they know (desktops and laptops).  They haven't ventured into tablets/netbooks/ultrabooks yet.  They're the masses that will likely buy up Windows 8 Pro in droves.


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## Wile E (Jun 22, 2012)

iPads can be used for business, and currently are, but they are buggy and don't work nearly as well as a native product, hence companies all but begging for something like Surface.


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## Bundy (Jun 22, 2012)

Ravenas said:


> The iPad does this and is cheaper and less bulky.
> 
> Furthermore, this is more of an extremely overpriced laptop than a tablet.





Ravenas said:


> Lol please sir you have no idea about me so please don't even start to think you do.



I am a travelling rep and I have read these and your other posts in this thread. You haven't a clue. What reps want are tablets running their corporate software. The only thing that will stop the surge to windows tablets will be HTML based corporate portals. I can't see that happening yet.


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## pr0n Inspector (Jun 22, 2012)

I think it's worth repeating that there will be zero 3rd party programs on Windows RT's "desktop". It's metro-only for non-MS apps.


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