# my audiophile system.



## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

FINALLY I have them!!!
The Klipsch Reference Premiere 6000F and 5000F They are hands down the absolute best speakers I have EVER had.
A Denon AVR8302 a Denon DP297 turntable and a Denon DRM-400 tape deck.
I am still waiting to get a center a sub and the 4 rear speakers but wow for now I am very very HAPPY!
I have some vintage DBX studio book shelf speakers and Sony for the rear and a Sony for the center they are ok but yeah need to be replaced with Klipsch!
Also my main gaming system is hooked up to the Denon as well as the NEW 4K Sony TV. The best system I have EVER had!

















Oh and that is a sub that is powered by a klipsch 150 watt amp and a Diesel audio 800 watt that really slams!


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## oobymach (Jan 10, 2020)

I wouldn't put the sub so close to the pc, especially if you have an hdd in it. Big magnets in subwoofers and the noise they produce might fuck with your system, otherwise looks good.


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## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

oobymach said:


> I wouldn't put the sub so close to the pc, especially if you have an hdd in it. Big magnets in subwoofers and the noise they produce might fuck with your system, otherwise looks good.


LOL not on your life the sub is powerful and all but there is NO way that it can even begin to mess with my computer or even a cassette tape, Why I know this? I have set cassette tapes on top of that thing for years now! LOL it is totally safe magnetic shelled boom box.

What I really need to do is setup my system right. The space I have to work with really has my all messed up. It's my sectional couch really, It is screwing my entire room up and I can't just fix it I need a plan!!!


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## sam_86314 (Jan 10, 2020)

trickson said:


> LOL not on your life the sub is powerful and all but there is NO way that it can even begin to mess with my computer or even a cassette tape, Why I know this? I have set cassette tapes on top of that thing for years now! LOL it is totally safe magnetic shelled boom box.


He was probably suggesting that the vibration from the sub could negatively affect any mechanical drives in the system.

I still keep my (much smaller) subwoofer a few feet away from my system just to be safe.


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## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

sam_86314 said:


> He was probably suggesting that the vibration from the sub could negatively affect any mechanical drives in the system.
> 
> I still keep my (much smaller) subwoofer a few feet away from my system just to be safe.


I will test it for you. I will see just how much shaking AN AMD system can take. 
If anything does happen oh well I will fix it. as far as sound there is only the rattling of the pictures on the wall and my glass ware in my hutches that I hear. I have yet to have any ill effects from the position of the sub to the computer (YET) , If I shake it apart you will be the first to know and see. 
Deal?


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## freeagent (Jan 10, 2020)

Nice man, that should liven things up a bit. I didn't consider the spinners before, that's a good point lol. I haven't had a problem with vibrations and my computer either. I don't let er rip like I used to because the kids complain too much, but before they were born I enjoyed high current thoroughly. As long as you don't have any loose screws you should be ok  Not sure if extra rubber would help, as the case will pick it up from the air. My Define R4 was good for that because of the sound deadener inside. But even with other cases I didn't have problems.

Edit:

I didn't have it directly beside it though..


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## Easy Rhino (Jan 10, 2020)

Those are nice speakers but ... puts on snob hat... they are not audiophile. Great for movies though.


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## lexluthermiester (Jan 10, 2020)

trickson said:


> FINALLY I have them!!!
> The Klipsch Reference Premiere 6000F and 5000F They are hands down the absolute best speakers I have EVER had.


Nice! That whole setup is quality! Very cool indeed!



Easy Rhino said:


> puts on snob hat


Laughing because of this, not at you.


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## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

Easy Rhino said:


> Those are nice speakers but ... puts on snob hat... they are not audiophile. Great for movies though.


Exactly what a snob would say. LMAO! 
I mean it's not an audiophile setup unless you have $70,000 Dollar wires and $10,000 Dollar speakers (Each). so yeah...(slaps snob hat off)...
I did some more rearranging as best I can. I got each speaker 5 and 1/2 inches apart, so far it sounds like really AMAZING! Even better now. more separation



.

Oh and yes tested out the system at 3/4 power. Never been able to get my system to -10 with the other speakers they would clip and stutter and the sound would just get all distorted. NOT NOW!!!   playing Afroman colt 45! Bumped so hard I thought my ears were going to start to bleed!
And the computer did not even vibrate not a tingle because all the sound waves face forward.


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## EarthDog (Jan 10, 2020)

Solid setup! 

Center that TV though... it's bothering me, lol.

Also, you drive those four speakers up front together? As what channels or A/B and dual L/R? You can use the 5000f as rear L/R channels if you want. Then all you need is a sub and center. 

...or are these two different systems? 

Anyway, cool on the speakers!


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## heky (Jan 10, 2020)

Wanted to suggest exactly the same as @EarthDog did, run the 5000f as rear L/R channels.

Congrats on the speakers, am an audio junkie myself, running the DALI Zensor Speakers and Denon Amp. Best i can afford atm and am really super pleased with the sound they produce...


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## Vayra86 (Jan 10, 2020)

Audiophile or not, cool speakers; but acoustics with your setup now can't be good. There is a LOT more to gain from centering your speakers in the room and above all, get them the hell away from that left hand side wall. Soundwaves bounce all over the place there, killing your stereo image.

If you want to improve this, in a simple way;

- Place sub in the corner left wall there, set it at fixed volume on a monotonous test sound or song and move to your ideal listening position. If you get more audible bass at the same volume, its an improvement; you want to turn the volume knob down as far as possible while still having good reproduction; and that is all about setting the position right. Bass waves are omnidirectional so it won't hurt your stereo or surround image to move it. When in doubt between several positions; if the sub has a Phase knob, try playing with that and every time moving back to your listening position to see if you get better reproduction. Moving the sub to the corner and you can move the left front speaker more toward the middle and away from that wall.

- Front speakers next to one another are going to kill clarity. Have you considered a quadrophonic setup?


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## Metroid (Jan 10, 2020)

Great setup, need a lot of space for that, those speakers are huge hehe, I'm still happy with top end headphones but my hearing will determine if I will need something like you have hehe in the future.


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## P4-630 (Jan 10, 2020)

Hope your neighbors live far away......


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## INSTG8R (Jan 10, 2020)

Vayra86 said:


> Audiophile or not, cool speakers; but acoustics with your setup now can't be good. There is a LOT more to gain from centering your speakers in the room and above all, get them the hell away from that left hand side wall. Soundwaves bounce all over the place there, killing your stereo image.
> 
> If you want to improve this, in a simple way;
> 
> ...


This guy gets it


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## Frederik S (Jan 10, 2020)

Cool setup you definitely have enough power for the room size it seems 

A top tip for anyone looking to improve their understanding of room acoustics have a look at Room Equalization Wizard (REW) and its simulation software.

Generally use the best set of speakers do not double up on the L or R it is a comb filtering nightmare, plus phase issues with different cross overs and drivers in the speakers. Try and get it a bit away from the side wall to avoid excessive filtering effects from early reflections. The room gain per speaker here is also very different as two sit in the corner and one set is against a back wall. 

There is a lot to gain by tweaking the room or adding a DSP for room correction. I usually use a MiniDSP and have a UMIK-1 which is good enough for my imperfect listening rooms.


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## XL-R8R (Jan 10, 2020)

I'm still trying to get over this image: 








Playing music from YouTube - even on a decent hand-held device, let alone nice Klipsch speakers - is very painful to any discerning audiophile!



However!  This is still a pleasing setup to look at and will sound fantastic, I expect..... even if the TV is hung in a wonky fashion.


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## phill (Jan 10, 2020)

I take it you have a 2.1 speaker setup as I don't see a center speaker?  

By the center box I'm guessing that is a cinema/AV amp?  

Just re-read your first post, why would you want 4 front and rear speakers?  Am I missing something there?

I love my Linn/Celeston setup but I'd love to give it a bit of an upgrade...  I'd love to get some floorstanders as well, my book shelf speakers are great but I'd like something a little bigger, obviously for a bigger room


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## freeagent (Jan 10, 2020)

phill said:


> I love my Linn/Celeston setup but I'd love to give it a bit of an upgrade...



Nice.


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## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

yes the speaker setup is less than ideal I have managed to get them 15" from the wall and 6" apart the sound is WAY WAY 10000% better now. The T.V. is Centered on me lol, 
Yes the speakers are setup with the RP6000F on main front channel "A" and the RP5000F are on Chanel "B". Like I said with my living room ( It's NOT a theater) the huge sectional couch is a huge obstacle that just can not be changed. So It is what it is. 
All I can do is small incremental adjustments.



phill said:


> I take it you have a 2.1 speaker setup as I don't see a center speaker?
> 
> By the center box I'm guessing that is a cinema/AV amp?
> 
> ...


yes the center speaker is hard to find it is above the Denon stereo, Look see that purple cover? Yep that is the center speaker. 
As far as the speaker setup goes I am limited (Much like 90% of the normal population) as what I can do with speaker placement or even furniture placement. short of a total living room remodel , see the fire place (fake azz thing) is really the major issue and one that I am hoping next year to get rid of! 
Once I get the house refinanced I am remolding my living room making it a theater! 
Till then I am stuck with things the way they are and have to work around it (if possible) 
I have brought the speakers almost 2 full feet from the wall and separated them to 6 1/2" apart and the sound is absolutely incredible. just moving them from the wall! 
I'm thinking of trying out some "insulation" just a small square placed on the wall behind the speakers where the Port is located. See if that softens the blow sorta speak. 
But so far the little bit I have doen has made a HUGE impact in the quality of the sound.


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## EarthDog (Jan 10, 2020)

trickson said:


> I have brought the speakers almost 2 full feet from the wall and separated them to 6 1/2" apart and the sound is absolutely incredible. just moving them from the wall!
> I'm thinking of trying out some "insulation" just a small square placed on the wall behind the speakers where the Port is located. See if that softens the blow sorta speak.
> But so far the little bit I have doen has made a HUGE impact in the quality of the sound.


If that helps, imagine what it would be like when it is actually set up properly. 

Honestly, I'd just put the 5000fs away if you dont have room to put them as rear speakers. I cant imagine what that sounds like setup like that firing all kinds of sound out..

It will, technically, sound a lot better (how professionals would set it up) with just the two speakers up there with proper spacing from each of the walls. But all four up there bends the needle towards college dorm as opposed to audiophile.


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## phill (Jan 10, 2020)

trickson said:


> yes the speaker setup is less than ideal I have managed to get them 15" from the wall and 6" apart the sound is WAY WAY 10000% better now. The T.V. is Centered on me lol,
> Yes the speakers are setup with the RP6000F on main front channel "A" and the RP5000F are on Chanel "B". Like I said with my living room ( It's NOT a theater) the huge sectional couch is a huge obstacle that just can not be changed. So It is what it is.
> All I can do is small incremental adjustments.
> 
> ...


When I bought the house I was looking at it thinking how could I set this up to make it like a cinema and the easiest option was to TV in front the window, sofa back and then speakers in the places they need to be, a typical 5.1 system really 

My living room isn't massive, about 5m x 3.5m to 4m wide I think roughly?  I'd love to have something near double that size if I could and when I move the room sizes will definitely have to be bigger than what I have now otherwise, whats the point..  You can't really move my setup around much so its a little limiting but otherwise, it's lovely.  

You'll find as soon as you move big speakers especially away from the wall and place them correctly, the boominess of the bass will go, it'll become tighter and a lot more punchy.  I found having too big a speakers for the room makes things worse, so making sure you have the right space for the sized speaker you have really plays a part in it.  

I hope one day I can go spending and buy myself another nice setup like I did when I bought my Linn gear.  I think a new house for us, will definitely need it


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## Vayra86 (Jan 10, 2020)

trickson said:


> yes the speaker setup is less than ideal I have managed to get them 15" from the wall and 6" apart the sound is WAY WAY 10000% better now. The T.V. is Centered on me lol,
> Yes the speakers are setup with the RP6000F on main front channel "A" and the RP5000F are on Chanel "B". Like I said with my living room ( It's NOT a theater) the huge sectional couch is a huge obstacle that just can not be changed. So It is what it is.
> All I can do is small incremental adjustments.
> 
> ...



Cool. Keep tweaking when you get new ideas. About the channel A/B; if you want to go quadrophonic with that you can; just position speakers correctly, so front left aligning with channel B's front right and vice versa. That way any positional and panning audio will be correct in the stereo image.


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## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

Thanks for all the great suggestions. It is getting better for sure. My living room is huge really it's this stupid fire place and sectional couch .
I must say this that I mainly only uses the 7.1 stereo setting on my AVR-8302, So the "A-B" channel issue is really NOT an issue.
I actually have a total of 10 speakers hooked up to my 7.1 surround sound system so I really have a shizt ton of sound filling my room.
The question is how well it sounds, I can only tell you this.

FANTASTIC!

Can it be better ? Sure there is always room for improvement and tuning.
Now that said YES this is an AUDIOPHILE SYSTEM!

You know it doesn't HAVE to cost 10000000000000000000000 Bucks to be an AUDIOPHILE SETUP!

You know what really pisses me off? It's all these "Special" names people give and then say NOPE your  setup is just a college dorm room setup! WTF?
Unless you have every thing just right and have SPENT the right amount of cash you can not consider your system or YOURSELF Audiophile?
OKAY so let me get this right, Unless I have the best speakers ones that cost $25,000.00 or more have a Marantz Tube amp and $70,000.00 dollar wiring and setup each speaker absolutely perfect to the square MM I am NOT an audiophile? I'm just a college kid setting up a dorm room system?
This is why so many people are turned off from all the SNAKE OIL you AUDIOPHILES try to sell US and why so many do not have nice systems.
The audiophile world is so screwed up and filled with so much snake oil and BS it's just a huge turn off.
I do consider myself a HUGE audiophile and a huge music lover.


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## EarthDog (Jan 10, 2020)

Being an audiophile doesn't mean you need to spend a ton of money on your setup. However, part of being an audiophile is learning and knowing how to get the best sound out of your system... whatever parts you may have. All we are saying is all 4 speakers across the front like that isnt remotely optimal for proper sound and sound staging.


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## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

Vayra86 said:


> Cool. Keep tweaking when you get new ideas. About the channel A/B; if you want to go quadraphonic with that you can; just position speakers correctly, so front left aligning with channel B's front right and vice versa. That way any positional and panning audio will be correct in the stereo image.


This is exactly how I have it setup.
To tell you the truth as an old audiophile I just loved quadraphonic sound back in the day it was AMAZING! and since I know that my living room doesn't support full on Dolby surround sound ( because of the way its laid out) I went ahead and setup 7 channel stereo on purpose, Giving me the "Simulated" quadraphonic sound. I say simulated because it technically no longer exists.
Does anyone remember the ledzeplin 8 track tape and the alpine 8 track quadraphonic deck? I paired that with a _Lafayette_ tube amp and JBL speakers. Yeah I'm NOT an Audiophile.



EarthDog said:


> Being an audiophile doesn't mean you need to spend a ton of money on your setup. However, part of being an audiophile is learning and knowing how to get the best sound out of your system... whatever parts you may have. All we are saying is all 4 speakers across the front like that isnt remotely optimal for proper sound and sound staging.


I agree there. But remember one also has a room to work within.
The main part of being an audiophile is tuning in the room and system. I have it setup perfectly for 7 channel stereo sound. Tuning the speakers is done now tuning the system. Trimming the base and treble things like that.

Just a side note for everyone. The TV is NOT mounted "OFF" I have it on a swing arm it is just pushed over to the side because I sit ( THIS FING SECTIONAL COUCH!) literally to the left of the entire thing!
So in order for me to "see" it better I just pushed it more to the front of my face. and it still isn't "IN front of me"
So here is what it all looks like now.


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## phill (Jan 10, 2020)

I'm lucky to have a fairly simple room for where my cinema is setup to, it does take over my front room a little and Sophia loves to try and pull at the speaker cable for the surround speakers sometimes but it works well for me and has done for 9 years I've lived here   I've had the same setup at various different houses before hand and it's never felt great there.  That said, I'd love to separate out my Hi-Fi to my stand and get a few more consoles on my TV stand as there's no room for anything there much at the moment...  

Ah, one day


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## newtekie1 (Jan 10, 2020)

I I just picked up these for my living room, so basically the same setup as you!

Yes, I'm just poking fun at you Trickson. You have an awesome setup.  Unfortunately for me, I've gone completely deaf in certain audio ranges and partially deaf in others, so a setup like that would be wasted on me these days.  But in my youth, I would have been dooling!  Just don't turn it up too high, or you'll end up like me.


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## trickson (Jan 10, 2020)

newtekie1 said:


> I I just picked up these for my living room, so basically the same setup as you!
> 
> Yes, I'm just poking fun at you Trickson. You have an awesome setup.  Unfortunately for me, I've gone completely deaf in certain audio ranges and partially deaf in others, so a setup like that would be wasted on me these days.  But in my youth, I would have been dooling!  Just don't turn it up too high, or you'll end up like me.


what do you think of them?

The main thing I can hear with these speakers is the distance from the wall. 
I have tested at various positions and found for my room the distance is 20" from the wall, this is perfect giving me the best in sound.


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## freeagent (Jan 11, 2020)

They are begging for a power amp, they all are


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

freeagent said:


> They are begging for a power amp, they all are


What kind of unit do you have?
I find that the Denon AVR 3802 is more than powerful enough to drive them and the Denon quality of sound is really showing through finally, A great AVR system needs great speakers. 
I am MORE than sold that Klipsch is hands down the BEST speaker for the money you can get and any one that wants true quality "AUDIOPHILE" sound.
Klipsch keepers of sound! Denon Where sound is perfected!


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## newtekie1 (Jan 11, 2020)

trickson said:


> what do you think of them?
> 
> The main thing I can hear with these speakers is the distance from the wall.
> I have tested at various positions and found for my room the distance is 20" from the wall, this is perfect giving me the best in sound.



Did you click on the link?


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

newtekie1 said:


> Did you click on the link?


forgive me, What link? 
I used my audiophile memory my skill my hearing and a tape measure. 
It's not at all hard to tune in a room once you have the right speakers. And it doesn't take a pro to install. Hell you wont trip on or see wires all over the place at all.


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## Deleted member 193706 (Jan 11, 2020)

newtekie1 said:


> I I just picked up these for my living room, so basically the same setup as you!
> 
> Yes, I'm just poking fun at you Trickson. You have an awesome setup.  Unfortunately for me, I've gone completely deaf in certain audio ranges and partially deaf in others, so a setup like that would be wasted on me these days.  But in my youth, I would have been dooling!  Just don't turn it up too high, or you'll end up like me.


 I just picked up a $20 set exactly like this thinking I'm going to be the boss compared to my $10 desktop 2.0 speakers


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

r9370 said:


> I just picked up a $20 set exactly like this thinking I'm going to be the boss compared to my $10 desktop 2.0 speakers


I'm still waiting for pictures. If you can get a set of RP5000F for 20 bucks at any retail shop new I will GIVE YOU mine!


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## freeagent (Jan 11, 2020)

trickson said:


> What kind of unit do you have?
> I find that the Denon AVR 3802 is more than powerful enough to drive them and the Denon quality of sound is really showing through finally, A great AVR system needs great speakers.
> I am MORE than sold that Klipsch is hands down the BEST speaker for the money you can get and any one that wants true quality "AUDIOPHILE" sound.
> Klipsch keepers of sound! Denon Where sound is perfected!



Nothing fancy, an old NAD T748, some old Mission M series, and an old Monitor Audio FB-210, and an old Tannoy 8 inch sub, and an old Monster HDP1800 line conditioner. I've got some Mirage towers tucked away. I bought them after I heard them on a Classe amp, when I was anti AVR. I would like to build another stereo again, just Left and Right, and maybe a sub. This setup still rattles the house, and my kids come first. One day I will upgrade everything.


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## newtekie1 (Jan 11, 2020)

trickson said:


> forgive me, What link?
> I used my audiophile memory my skill my hearing and a tape measure.
> It's not at all hard to tune in a room once you have the right speakers. And it doesn't take a pro to install. Hell you wont trip on or see wires all over the place at all.




The word "these" in my original post is a link. Also, highlight my original post.


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

newtekie1 said:


> The word "these" in my original post is a link. Also, highlight my original post.


LOL OKAY! Now I see them.
HAHA! Funny that would be a bit of a stretch to say that they are just like mine. even if you have hearing loss you can surly tell the difference from them to well Klipsch! LOL.


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## newtekie1 (Jan 11, 2020)

trickson said:


> LOL OKAY! Now I see them.
> HAHA! Funny that would be a bit of a stretch to say that they are just like mine. even if you have hearing loss you can surly tell the difference from them to well Klipsch! LOL.



I'm sure I could tell a difference, but it's just not worth the money for me anymore unfortunately.


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## bobbybluz (Jan 11, 2020)

Speaking of Klipsch here's a letter company founder Paul Klipsch wrote. The "MGW" power amp is a typo, it's supposed to be BGW. He used the BGW 250C as his personal reference power amp for evaluating the speakers his company made. I have a 250B, two 250C's and two 250D's in my BGW collection along with a 500D, 750B and 7500 Proline II. I did Pro audio for several years and 99% of my main system is used recording studio gear.


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

One thing is for sure I can now hear the singers BREATHING! It's Amazing what great speakers can do. I can hear things I haven't heard in a long time since my Polk audio setup really.

Now I know I'm going to ware out my tape deck! I can't stop listening to it!


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## MainSource (Jan 11, 2020)

have you looked into dolby atmos, you would need a new reciever, but with 10 speakers you could make a good atmos system, well you would need some of the speakers on the ceiling. google dolby atmos setups and they have tons of room diagrams with recommended speaker locations for many different kinds of rooms. Also I would get a few bi-pole speakers for your surround, klipsh makes them and so does polk and fluance for cheap. nice bongs btw,lol. one more thought, do you have another room in the house , one with 4 walls enclosed or a basement that you could re-purpose into a theater room? your right, that room isnt ideal, no biggy though


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

MainSource said:


> have you looked into dolby atmos, you would need a new reciever, but with 10 speakers you could make a good atmos system, well you would need some of the speakers on the ceiling. google dolby atmos setups and they have tons of room diagrams with recommended speaker locations for many different kinds of rooms. Also I would get a few bi-pole speakers for your surround, klipsh makes them and so does polk and fluance for cheap. nice bongs btw,lol. one more thought, do you have another room in the house , one with 4 walls enclosed or a basement that you could re-purpose into a theater room? your right, that room isnt ideal, no biggy though


Yes and no I am not going to atmos. It's just not what I want. I just like nice clear clean sound I don't need some over head field of sound not in this room. That is good for big theaters not living rooms. 
IMHO Atmos is more of that snake oil they try to sell you. Unless you are watch movies with plains or birds or crap flying over your head them Atmos speakers are just dead drivers with a powered amp that is not driving them. LOL. Tell me on what planet do they dub music in Dolby atmos? LOL SNAKE OIL! 
So no that is just one setup I can not buy into. Nor will I be cutting into my ceiling and installing speakers this is not a department store.


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## freeagent (Jan 11, 2020)

trickson said:


> Tell me on what planet do they dub music in Dolby atmos? LOL SNAKE OIL!











						Music Like Never Before - Dolby Atmos Music
					

Dolby Atmos Music is reinventing how songs are made and experienced. Feel music in a whole new way.




					music.dolby.com


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

freeagent said:


> Music Like Never Before - Dolby Atmos Music
> 
> 
> Dolby Atmos Music is reinventing how songs are made and experienced. Feel music in a whole new way.
> ...


LOL yeah that is so mainstream lol.
Still NOT going to go Atmos at all anytime ever. 
Snake OIL!


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## Easy Rhino (Jan 11, 2020)

trickson said:


> Exactly what a snob would say. LMAO!



Those are honestly really great speakers. I am going to get similar ones but with the atmos speakers on the top for movies.


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## freeagent (Jan 11, 2020)

trickson said:


> LOL yeah that is so mainstream lol.
> Still NOT going to go Atmos at all anytime ever.
> Snake OIL!



You asked.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 11, 2020)

Thanks to TPU my old living room literally shows up in image search if you Google my PSB Alpha HT1 setup, believe me it freaked me out for awhile.. but yeah I’m totally down with the measuring tape but I‘m at 20cm from my walls...


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

From the size of the driver's you would never guess such BIG clean clear sound can come out even at low volume they sound grand and tall big and deep.
I've been eyeing these for about 2 years now. I've never seen speakers made from a ceramic metallic material before.
And the size? All this big base and tall notes from 5" and 6" drivers? No popping, Clipping/cracking and most of all no distortion just NONE!
You wont need a ton of power to drive them they sound just as fantastic at low volume.
I am truly blown away at the quality and the price. The Klipsch Reference Premier series speakers are hands down the best speakers the average human audiophile can buy.
I plan to replace all my speaker now with Klipsch reference series.
They put a massive amount of R&D in these speakers (That is my guess).

I would definitely recommend them to anyone wanting TRUE audiophile sound that wont cost you $70.000.

I also need to add a bit of a side note here. As my Denon is the system the Computer is the Sound card. And this I'm still tuning in.


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## freeagent (Jan 11, 2020)

$70K doesn't get you much in the Audiophile world


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## trickson (Jan 11, 2020)

I centered my sectional couch more separated the speakers even more and I put some insulation on the wall behind the main speakers ports softening out the sound even more, I was getting more base and sound bouncing than needed in the room from the wall. 
It made a huge difference (It's just an old audiophile trick now they have fancy sound blocking tiles and all that but this works great and was free.


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## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

Lose the 5000f's...swap the sub to corner and turn the gain down on it as needed. 

Boom. Stereo soundstage.


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## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Lose the 5000f's...swap the sub to corner and turn the gain down on it as needed.
> 
> Boom. Stereo soundstage.


Actually I changed the position's of the speakers now I am getting some really cool sound I will be putting the RP5000F's where they should be soon as I get new wire and connectors, But for now ,RIGHT now I do get Dolby surround sound that actually sounds AMAZING!  
It was really just the position of the front speakers in reference to the front side speakers. I had them backwards making the sound come out all messed up no longer! 
And once I get them where they should be or closer to that "Area" it will only get better. 




Oh and another thing I noticed with these speakers, They are (If it is even possible) sounding better each day. How can this be?
I mean I know about the breaking and all that but this is really weird.


----------



## freeagent (Jan 12, 2020)

You are breaking them in, and they are loosening up, that's why they sound better.


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

freeagent said:


> You are breaking them in, and they are loosening up, that's why they sound better.


It sure is nice to hear.
I also noticed something that is very odd , Now keep in mind all I did was eliminate the bare wire hookup and went with banana clips and I soldered all connections and ran 16 gauge wire to the rear speakers not 14 and now My DBX soundfield 3x2 RS plus sound absolutely AMAZING even the Sony's sound better. Soldering the wire really helped out a ton. I can not tell you how important that little thing is. that and the size and quality of the wire I still have cheep wire 100 foot roll was 12 bucks soon as I can afford good wire I bet it will blow my mind even more!

A true Audiophile setup is one that you can NOT stop listening to. IMHO. And I can NOT stop listening to mine NOW This Denon AVR-3802 really SHINES BIG, BOLD AND BRIGHT NOW!


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

trickson said:


> that and the size and quality of the wire I still have cheep wire 100 foot roll was 12 bucks soon as I can afford good wire I bet it will blow my mind even more!


Bet it wont.. 









						Do Expensive Speaker Cables Sound Better?
					

Different speaker wires offer different performance characteristics based on their material, thickness, and length. Price is rarely a contributing factor.




					www.lifewire.com
				






I'm still unclear how these are wired...your system. Are your speakers hooked up to FL/C/FR/LS/RS/LR/RR or just A/B and stereo? I see earlier you mentioned stereo and '7 channel stereo'... but now mention sides etc.


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Bet it wont..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah I'm just joking on that.
It is better now that the right size (NOTE the word SIZE) wire is driving them. That is the most important thing. I was using the crap I had from my bedroom setup.

My setup is hooked up exactly the way you would hook up any normal Dolby surround sound, All that is confusing you is the very placement of the speakers and as I have stated before my area is well NOT a theater it is a Ranch HOME this means crappy hillbilly layout. with a stupid gas fireplace as the main focal point and NOT an entertainment system.

SO I am getting surround sound just _Not _the way it is truly meant to be but I can hear it and it sounds okay. TBH I am going to need a Amp to drive the Dolby or NEO6 it's not "Loud" enough not at all like 7 channel with this going it much "louder".


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

Just joking, yet you doubled down on the point...lol. Anyway, size may not have been the issue... read the article and do the math. Fill in the knowledge gaps. 

Yeah, your placement is what it is due to the room, but with rear sounds coming from the front... ick! I'd rather run stereo, personally.

I have a fireplace too. My speakers flank the fireplace (needs to be wider, honestly) with the audio components off to the left, subwoofer in the right corner. I dont have a rear wall so I mounted two shelves high and behind the sitting area and used bookshelf speakers for my surrounds. The center channel is currently above the monitor helping to bring the soundstage up to the monitor (though it stretches it quite a bit since my towers are on the floor). This summer I am ditching the front towers and going to flush wall mounts next to the tv and a larger sub since I am losing some bass (not base, mind you) in going to smaller wall mounts. This will be a proper front sound stage.


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Size may not have been the issue... read the article and do the math.
> 
> Yeah, your placement is what it is due to the room, but with rear sounds coming from the front... ick! I'd rather run stereo, personally.
> 
> I have a fireplace too. My speakers flank the fireplace (needs to be wider, honestly) with the audio components off to the left, subwoofer in the right corner. I dont have a rear wall so I mounted two shelves high and behind the sitting area and used bookshelf speakers for my surrounds. The center channel is currently above the monitor helping to bring the soundstage up to the monitor (though it stretches it quite a bit since my towers are on the floor). This summer I am ditching the front towers and going to flush wall mounts next to the tv and a larger sub since I am losing some bass (not base, mind you) in going to smaller wall mounts. This will be a proper front sound stage.


All I know for the hooking up of the speakers is what the denon says. I hooked them to channel "B" not sure but that I was to believe would be the R/L "side channel".
The "Front" are Front L/R.
So you would have sound Surrounding you the Front Channel is Front L/R , Front SR/SL.  Right?
I do not want to hook up front R/L speakers and Rear R/L speakers that would be stupid right? 
In other words I do not want to have my rear speakers in the front with the front left and right Speakers now do I? 

OMG I think I just confused myself and gave myself a headache.


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

trickson said:


> All I know for the hooking up of the speakers is what the denon says. I hooked them to channel "B" not sure but that I was to believe would be the R/L "side channel" Te "Front" are Front L/R.
> So you would have sound Surrounding you the Front Channel is Front L/R , Front SR/SL.  Right?
> I do not want to hook up front R/L speakers and Rear R/L speakers that would be stupid right?


See... this is why you are confusing (at least me)... now we are back to A/B and L/R which is NOT how you connect "any dolby surround sound".What you just described in the previous post is simple STEREO, not surround. 

Surround sound has unique sound/data for each channel in the case of 5.1+. Front L/R, Center, and Rear L/R (+ sub channel) for 5.1 surround. You're just pushing L/R through four speakers up front (for whatever reason).

If you want true surround, when your room can handle it, you'll have to connect the speakers where they are supposed to go... which for surround purposes are not "B" speakers. Speakers on  "B" are intended to use in other rooms (not the 'A" room) for example, not a stereo sound wall. B is not the  "side channel"...yikes.


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> See... this is why you are confusing (at least me)... now we are back to A/B and L/R which is NOT how you connect "any dolby surround sound".
> 
> What you just described in the previous post is simple STEREO. Surround sound has unique sound/data for each channel... Front L/R, Center, and Rear L/R for 5.1 surround. You're just pushing L/R through four speakers up front (for whatever reason).


OH for the LOVE of GOD! If you hook it up the way that they tell you then it's WRONG?! WTF! I am confused. There are like ONLY 2 Speaker configurations that are given for setting up this SYSTEM! I have seen the MANUEL!
Unless I am missing a shit ton of information and have been given BS for the 30 years then yeah send me and exact diagram of the way that they should be hooked up for a room like mine.
I am ONLY going by the Manuel.
This is an older system Not some new Atmos thing I'm lucky it has Dolby.

AND NO I'M NOT GOING TO GET RID OF ANY SPEAKERS FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

Who's manuel? Manual. 

See my edits in previous post...

If the receiver is surround sound, each channel has its own speaker outputs, bud. A/B is stereo L and R. Not side, not surround, nada. Stereo.

Edit: I've mentioned MULTIPLE times in your thread here to simply run stereo L and R until you get room to add surround speakers and connect them in the proper location on your receiver.


----------



## revin (Jan 12, 2020)

trickson said:


> the Dolby or NEO6 it's not "Loud" enough not at all like 7 channel with this going it much "louder"


umm That's because {7Channel Stereo} is sending pretty much the same signal to ALL the speaker's but as a simulated stereo, where as the  "Dolbys" are NOT supposed to be the same volume, that's what makes the ambiance and illusion of multi Channel sound.


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

revin said:


> umm That's because {7Channel Stereo} is sending pretty much the same signal to ALL the speaker's but as a simulated stereo, where as the  "Dolbys" are NOT supposed to be the same volume, that's what makes the ambiance and illusion of multi Channel sound.


Well one thing is for sure it sounds great Dolby or not Surround or not it still sounds great. I would think that they would offer you speaker connections to hook up speakers to NOT to leave them open. Also NOT a very good Idea to leave an Open channel on any amp. IMHO. I've watch my systems fry because of that!


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

trickson said:


> Also NOT a very good Idea to leave an Open channel on any amp. IMHO. I've watch my systems fry because of that!


That statement is patently false. Wow...


----------



## revin (Jan 12, 2020)

Yea @trickson  It seems you don't understand the How a Surround sound system works. My $2,500 Pioneer receiver{s} are "Surround" capable, but I only use Stereo 99% of the time.
If the speaker's are Not connected to the Output, they just are Not active perse


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

revin said:


> Yea @trickson  It seems you don't understand the How a Surround sound system works. My $2,500 Pioneer receiver{s} are "Surround" capable, but I only use Stereo 99% of the time.
> If the speaker's are Not connected to the Output, they just are Not active perse


Okay Yeah I just learned some thing and I thank you all. SO yes NOW I have them hooked up the way they should be the thing that confused me was this label one says SURR-Back one says SURR-B I have them hooked up right now and am going to just get rid of the Sony's I was using in the back.
Okay so it's Thanks to you all hooked up the way it SHOULD BE!

For the LOVE OF GOD I was running in 7 channel mode not in Surround! I'M a huge Dipshiztz!


----------



## freeagent (Jan 12, 2020)

7 channel stereo is fun, and puts out good sound, but movies and tv should definitely be in Dolby or DTS. Unless you enjoy craploads of bass and minimal channel separation in everything media related.


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

freeagent said:


> 7 channel stereo is fun, and puts out good sound, but movies and tv should definitely be in Dolby or DTS. Unless you enjoy craploads of bass and minimal channel separation in everything media related.


Well one thing is for SURE thanks to guys here I have it hooked up correctly now. Man It sounds even better if that is possible!
Seriously THANK YOU ALL!

So I have just one more question now that "B" Channel is off what is it used for? I have 2 speakers that can be hooked to it but where should they be located if hooked up? Or is it just best to leave channel "B" off?


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

trickson said:


> Well one thing is for SURE thanks to guys here I have it hooked up correctly now. Man It sounds even better if that is possible!
> Seriously THANK YOU ALL!


Just to be sure...lol...

...NOW how is each speaker connected to the receiver? What sound (stereo? 5.1+?) are you expecting to get out of that physical connection?


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Just to be sure...lol...
> 
> ...NOW how is each speaker connected to the receiver? What sound (stereo? 5.1+?) are you expecting to get out of that physical connection?


Hooked up just like you all said to hook it up the SUR-B is no longer going to be used. It's the channel you guys said is "B" and used for another room or multi zone. No longer the small RP5000's are hooked up on SURR - A The DBX Speakers are on SURR Back.


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 12, 2020)

....and the sound mode you are expecting out of that config is......?


So to make sure I understand you have....


6000f - Speaker A, L/R
5000f - Speaker B, L/R

What else is connected and to what on the receiver?


----------



## trickson (Jan 12, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> ....and the sound mode you are expecting out of that config is......?
> 
> 
> So to make sure I understand you have....
> ...


NO not any more. The RF5000F are on the SURR. Back Channel.

Moving the speakers is the only thing to do now and I can if I put one on a stand on the other side of my couch. But not just yet.


----------



## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

WOW Okay so lots more tuning of my Audio system and I have it perfectly setup for what I like 7.1 Channel stereo.
I moved my 12" Subwoofer to the back of my sectional couch got my front speakers separated and toed in a lot better now for all listening possessions.

I have to say that putting the sub behind the sofa is AMAZING! 
If you can do it try it, You will not regret it.  
More bass, More feeling it for sure.
Try it out see for yourself. I am sticking with it.


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 20, 2020)

trickson said:


> I have it perfectly setup for what I like 7.1 Channel stereo.


This again, lol...Soooooooooooo, are you running 7.1 surround or stereo? Stereo is, by definition, two distinct channels of audio (you can have more speakers, but just saying). When you say 7.1 that explicitly means 7 distinct channels plus the subwoofer. Which is it?

Every person's room is different. So just generically stating to stuff a sub behind a sofa is "amazing" just may not be an improvement for others. If I did that, I would lose bass response as currently mine sits in a corner...and the couch doesn't have a wall behind it. Each room has its own acoustic properties and each person has their own preference on how they want their equipment to sound.


----------



## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

A and B if your reciver can do this, is set up so yes you can run them as a set in the front if you want to hook different types of speakers to your system to get a much fuller frequency response, for I run 2 subs in my main Onkyo system and have one, a Polk 12", and my Bic PL 200 knob set all the way to the max for the deeper stuff since it gets really really low and loud, to fill up what my bic 8" set cannot get low enough to do. But back to the reciever, if you dont run different sets on the b side, there should be a setting to do zone 2/3/4 etc, and run wires and speakers to different parts of your room to run the audio from your set up to them without having to blast it in one room to hear it in another. Also most "newer" amps have 2 subs that can be used also for doing the same to run a sub in the other room, or for what I do, or needed sometimes, if I read right, Atmos uses it in the Atmos setting.

My system consits of a Acoustic Image GT 338 I use at a center I got at goodwill for $6, BIC America Venturi DV64 2-Way Tower for front sides, a Polk Audio PSW505 sub (crossover set to 100HZ), and a bic acoustech PL200 (set to its lowest range), with a pair of BIC Acoustech PL-66 Surround Speakers all set up to a Onkyo TX RZ810 for $250 from Onkyo due to my TX NR809 died due to the recalled DTS chip going bad, so I was able to just send them the serial sticker off the back of it and got that one for the $250 shipped. I know it does Atmos but at some point with my tax money Id like to get a totally matching set of https://www.amazon.com/BIC-Acoustec...?keywords=bic+speakers&qid=1579537352&sr=8-35 and then I can use my set in Atmos mode.

My PC rig is a Denon AVR 2808CI, a set of vintage JVC towers, SP 95WD, a Onkyo center I got off shopgoodwill.com for $3, A onkyo sub, I got from Goodwill for $35, that some mice decided to eat away the foam surrounds of the speaker that I replaced with a JVC 10" for free with cracked medium I fixed with super glue, silicone goo, and packing tape and has held up for over 3 years with being beat on a daily basis, and a set of Daytons I got off of Bargain Hunt for $20.

But op I can tell you that if you really want to make it sound great, you need to run all the same speakers makes (do as I say not as I do for the moment, only due to me having very limited funds on SS and only time I got good money to use for high ticket items is at tax time), for the bic line I mentioned has all the same speakers in them so that if your watching movie and a plane on it for example,  doesnt sound like a toy model behind you then becomes a full on jet liner in front of you. Id suggest also if you can run two subs, can be same or different, IMO, so that you can adjust them with the crossovers in the back to hit that sweet spot with the bass, for running just one in the lowest setting can miss out on the mids, from what I can tell with my ears, but running 2 of them adjust one at like 100HZ and max out the other to its lowest. Also if you dont want to kill your amp you dont want to just shove the wires in the banana jacks, need to either screw them all in or get banana jacks for them and do it that way for your introducing resistance to the amp without them getting a secure tight connection, And on the subject of not blowing amps you should also run the same length wires to all your speakers and the same gauge as well, so that way the resistance from your wires coming from the amp is equal and wont stress it as much due to resistance being off going to all your speakers.


----------



## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> This again, lol...Soooooooooooo, are you running 7.1 surround or stereo? Stereo is, by definition, two distinct channels of audio (you can have more speakers, but just saying). When you say 7.1 that explicitly means 7 distinct channels plus the subwoofer. Which is it?
> 
> Every person's room is different. So just generically stating to stuff a sub behind a sofa is "amazing" just may not be an improvement for others. If I did that, I would lose bass response as currently mine sits in a corner...and the couch doesn't have a wall behind it. Each room has its own acoustic properties and each person has their own preference on how they want their equipment to sound.


WOW okay here maybe this explain things.

First ..






UNLESS I AM MISSING SOMETHING OR HAVE SOME HOW MISS READ THIS THEN WTF!
WTF IS this just 2 channel stereo too? I mean..........

And I also SAID IF YOU ARE ABLE to do this TRY IT!
And YES it is AMAZING!
Don't be a jelly hater man I know my system is a total AUDIOPHILE DREAM!


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 20, 2020)

What I believe your receiver is doing is sending the stereo signal (L/R) to all seven speakers (maybe check the manual and confirm?). In order to have distinct channels you need to be running in one of the surround modes... pro logic, 5.1, etc. I have no idea how that 7ch stereo mode divides things up as in what signal (L or R) is going to which speakers. You should be able to find a sound test that sweeps from L to R (your receiver may have a noise generator/tone function, note) to see which speakers are on, what. I have to imagine though that it sets it up properly as it knows what speaker outputs are active.

I believe someone else also mentioned before when you were on about this stereo thing is that just because all the speakers are louder doesn't mean it sounds better. Surround sound has distinct channels with audio specific to each to give you that feeling you are IN what you are watching. So if you are listening to movies and tracks that have surround encoded in them, it is best to use it that way. Generally, audiophiles don't eschew from using the proper soundtracks and coding. If it is stereo, 7ch is cool, but I find I like a more proper sound stage with just two properly spaced and tuned speakers. As I said earlier, 7ch stereo just reminds me of things I used to do back in college for more noise when partying, but if you like it, you like it! 

If I was you, I would look in to some guides for setting things up and working it in your room as it fits. The shotgun method can be a fun process, but knowing some tips and tricks along with what you learned from your room acoustics in trial and error, can prove invaluable to setting things up as an 'audiophile' would. It just seems to me you believe you are getting true surround sound in that 7ch stereo mode, but that isn't how it works. 



trickson said:


> Don't be a jelly hater man I know my system is a total AUDIOPHILE DREAM!


lol, you don't even know......I'm really just trying to share what I learned over the decades (and learn from others who posted in here as well who seem even more knowledgeable).


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## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> What I believe your receiver is doing is sending the stereo signal (L/R) to all seven speakers (maybe check the manual and confirm?). In order to have distinct channels you need to be running in one of the surround modes... pro logic, 5.1, etc. I have no idea how that 7ch stereo mode divides things up as in what signal (L or R) is going to which speakers. You should be able to find a sound test that sweeps from L to R (your receiver may have a noise generator/tone function, note) to see which speakers are on, what. I have to imagine though that it sets it up properly as it knows what speaker outputs are active.
> 
> I believe someone else also mentioned before when you were on about this stereo thing is that just because all the speakers are louder doesn't mean it sounds better. Surround sound has distinct channels with audio specific to each to give you that feeling you are IN what you are watching. So if you are listening to movies and tracks that have surround encoded in them, it is best to use it that way. Generally, audiophiles don't eschew from using the proper soundtracks and coding. If it is stereo, 7ch is cool, but I find I like a more proper sound stage with just two properly spaced and tuned speakers. As I said earlier, 7ch stereo just reminds me of things I used to do back in college for more noise when partying, but if you like it, you like it!
> 
> ...


LOL. I am doing all kinds of "new" things , Experimenting with my new Klipsch RF series Speakers and my fixed sub, It's fun.
Mostly all I know is what I am reading and what I am trying out, If it works and makes better sound for me  then I want to share that.
All I can tell you is what I am hearing out of my system. You can argue wires and length and speaker placement and all that and yes that does help. I have improved with re-arrangement and testing the speakers at different locations in the room. I am finding the best spots for each one it takes time. And lots of testing not to mention looking at tons of room configurations online about speaker placement.
I never thought of putting the sub behind the sofa and well heard about it online (LIKE EVERYONE DOES) tried it out and I am AMAZED!
Loudness is just 90% of my goal .

So I thank you for your insight and knowledge I am trying it all out where I can if I can.
Thank You. 

Also I was being sarcastic when I said that jelly thing.


----------



## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

In the setting where you see that 7.1 is where you should be also able to see what I mentioned about the "zone" thing, for in that setting on my Denon I get 7.1/2ch/Front B Bi Amp/Front A Bi Amp/Zone 2-3 mono/Zone 3/Zone 2 as my settings with in there. If I want to listen to say my music streamed Ill set my receiver to DTS Neo Cinema, if in stereo, I set it to pure direct or just direct. If I want the center to be more "specious" Id set the am p in setting from Cinema to Music, not sure if that your amp without reading your manual will do that but both my Denon 2808CI and my "newer" Denon AVR S530BT in my bedroom pretty much using the same interface, though my older unit has much more features.

Also if you can do this for it makes my old vintage JVC speakers come to life little more when really listening to my MP3's is in Parameter is where you can set it to cinema or music, if you did or did not, set cinema eq to off, unless you used the mic to set it all up, which I dont, been doing amps and home theater for over 35 years and like to do it all myself and the times I did use the mic I just did not like what it set my amp up to be "right". Should also be able to, depending on source, set sound to low, med, high, and HQ. I set mine to HQ for I like myself what it does to the sound coming out of my old set. Also, if your not running full 7.1, front, center, sides, and rears, set it in that menu to turn off your SB's and run them speakers to your sides of your listening spot. There really isnt much out there unless your doing true 7.1 to make use of the back, and then the amp will use its software to simulate the rears, but look on your screen for it should tell you what its picking up and dishing out, and if you dont see in the input the SB icons, then I wouldnt really worry to much about setting up to push out in 7.1 and just use 5.1. Again this is my likeness, and how I run my Denon and sound. But in sound parameter you can turn the SB's on and off according to what you are watching, for without using dedicaded rears when it uses its software your missing out on some sounds that it would make out of those speakers that could of been sent to the sides instead of getting dead sound that isnt there, if you like to hear the room filled with music from all speakers without using stereo 7.1 where it just pumps all the same stuff to all the speakers.

IDK if this will help you, but if you need more help lmk what it is your trying to do and Ill look at your manual to see exactly what it does and help you if need be to set it up.


----------



## Vayra86 (Jan 20, 2020)

Can I just chime in to say I absolutely love the liberal use of audiophile in this topic. Its almost like reading a parody, brilliant 



trickson said:


> LOL. I am doing all kinds of "new" things , Experimenting with my new Klipsch RF series Speakers and my fixed sub, It's fun.
> Mostly all I know is what I am reading and what I am trying out, If it works and makes better sound for me  then I want to share that.
> All I can tell you is what I am hearing out of my system. You can argue wires and length and speaker placement and all that and yes that does help. I have improved with re-arrangement and testing the speakers at different locations in the room. I am finding the best spots for each one it takes time. And lots of testing not to mention looking at tons of room configurations online about speaker placement.
> I never thought of putting the sub behind the sofa and well heard about it online (LIKE EVERYONE DOES) tried it out and I am AMAZED!
> ...



Cool to see you're looking at acoustics now! Did you consider / do you know about the use of bass traps? PERFECT DIY material!









						Bass trap - Wikipedia
					






					en.wikipedia.org
				




Not long and you'll be like this dude





Great read!








						An Anechoic Chamber for SPCR - Silent PC Review
					

It’s a hemi-anechoic chamber, to be precise. A silent, echo-free room for measuring computer gear that’s been an impossible dream for nearly seven years: We made it happen with the great support of the SPCR community, and it works… to the tune of 11 dBA! Settle down for a long and winding story…...




					www.silentpcreview.com
				






EarthDog said:


> What I believe your receiver is doing is sending the stereo signal (L/R) to all seven speakers (maybe check the manual and confirm?). In order to have distinct channels you need to be running in one of the surround modes... pro logic, 5.1, etc. I have no idea how that 7ch stereo mode divides things up as in what signal (L or R) is going to which speakers. You should be able to find a sound test that sweeps from L to R (your receiver may have a noise generator/tone function, note) to see which speakers are on, what. I have to imagine though that it sets it up properly as it knows what speaker outputs are active.
> 
> I believe someone else also mentioned before when you were on about this stereo thing is that just because all the speakers are louder doesn't mean it sounds better. Surround sound has distinct channels with audio specific to each to give you that feeling you are IN what you are watching. So if you are listening to movies and tracks that have surround encoded in them, it is best to use it that way. Generally, audiophiles don't eschew from using the proper soundtracks and coding. If it is stereo, 7ch is cool, but I find I like a more proper sound stage with just two properly spaced and tuned speakers. As I said earlier, 7ch stereo just reminds me of things I used to do back in college for more noise when partying, but if you like it, you like it!
> 
> ...



7 channel stereo can also just be an expanded stereo image across all seven speakers, so its great for panning sounds (ie helicopter flyby etc) but the outermost and center speakers won't be doing much a lot of the time. For music, the use of it is highly questionable. For movies, its a surprisingly effective stand in for surround.

Its also a living hell to get that sorted out without rogue soundwaves all over the place


----------



## EarthDog (Jan 20, 2020)

Vayra86 said:


> Can I just chime in to say I absolutely love the liberal use of audiophile in this topic. Its almost like reading a parody, brilliant


LOL, glad I wasn't the one to say it!! But surely by my posts the writing was on the wall and it was only a matter of time before a meltdown.


----------



## Vayra86 (Jan 20, 2020)

trickson said:


> UNLESS I AM MISSING SOMETHING OR HAVE SOME HOW MISS READ THIS THEN WTF!
> WTF IS this just 2 channel stereo too? I mean..........



Thumb rule about audio(phile): the source has *certain characteristics*, and *anything *you do with it other than feed those in the exact way they are recorded to your speakers is going to alter the sound (and makes it different from the original = not audiophile). So if you have a stereo recording (2ch) that is what the best output will be. And it also means you want to use a very (or entirely) flat EQ. No extra bass or treble! A good setup can achieve clarity without that.



EarthDog said:


> LOL, glad I wasn't the one to say it!! But surely by my posts the writing was on the wall and it was only a matter of time before a meltdown.



Its not an issue, I seriously detest the overblown audiophile push. But doing it like in this topic, just 'with what's available'... that is major bonus points IMO. Anyone can buy a 6000 dollar setup, who cares 

I just have mad respect for people that go out and are open to learning stuff  We need more of that.


----------



## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

Vayra86 said:


> Can I just chime in to say I absolutely love the liberal use of audiophile in this topic. Its almost like reading a parody, brilliant
> 
> 
> 
> ...


LOL LOVE it!
I am a super huge fan of a certain thing that 7.1 stereo does Quadraphonic sound and yes I have it set up for 7.1 (Or at least It's really close to surround sound actually. I'm a few feet ( 2 ) away from having Surround A Left and Surround A Right in full surround position. I am out of speaker wire and well it is close enough for me really. It would cost me another $40.00 Bucks for more wire and TBPH I am really happy with this setup now. 
You can argue 7.1 Dolby surround till the cows come home what it really comes down to is your personal preference. I have my system hooked up correctly.    I can not get t the "B" Channel is for multi ch setup and or remote speakers (speakers for another room).
My Denon AVR-3802 maybe 18 years old but it still DOES WORK and in full 7.1 Dolby surround DTS Jazz Rock stereo and mono movie and there maybe another ones here is a link to the stats it's no slouch   But  I prefer 7.1 stereo in this mod to ME it sounds AMAZING and like quadraphonic used to sound to me (Beleive me or not but sound is coming from all around me and it is so sweet!). If that makes any sense. 


*Being an Audiophile is hard... *


----------



## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

OH I forgot, to help you get the levels right, since ears are not always the very best thing, and you really dont want to use the auto setup in the amp using the mic, I use a DB sound meter on my phone and sit in my, special spot, and run the test tone through each speaker getting them all to the same sweet spot using the app on my phone that way. Im getting old and need help in that department I guess, but it seems to get it all set right that way for me.


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## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

funboy6942 said:


> OH I forgot, to help you get the levels right, since ears are not always the very best thing, and you really dont want to use the auto setup in the amp using the mic, I use a DB sound meter on my phone and sit in my, special spot, and run the test tone through each speaker getting them all to the same sweet spot using the app on my phone that way. Im getting old and need help in that department I guess, but it seems to get it all set right that way for me.


Hmmm I will try this out. Sounds like fun.
Thanks. 

**Edit** Just another killer side note My computer has Nahimic 3 And this is really really cool it makes things sound really good. There are tons of setting and it does enhance the sound and quality of sound as well.


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## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

Saying "audiophile" I think was done by rich snobs so they can say that because they have deeper pockets then you and can whip out their audiophile penis at you cus their stuff costed them 10 grand and yours was a wimpy 1K or less for that matter. I dont consider myself one, though I been messing with stuff since I was a kid and cant tell shit from good, to great, for I remember my speakers I made that sounded good to me as a kid when I tore apart my headphones and stuck them in Styrofoam cups, and saw how I was able to project the sound out of them, and from that part on I did all I could with the means I had to make my stuff sound good to me. My first "real" surround AMP was back in about 93-94 when I bought a sony amp at best buy that was supposed to be a stereo unit for $99 and when I got it home it was a Sony "high end" dolby pro-logic unit, and was stoked, and had to go find more speakers, and that set me off from there to find good sounding surround amps to buy and replace. 

Since then I like the challenge of being able to find cheap stuff at like good will and the likes and do stuff to make it all sound good, though a perfect matched set is the very best, and I love Bic stuff IMO, for it has the best warranty out there, and not "audiophile" grade, but to get a set with matching speakers in every unit is key, I had it in the past, but due to life happening, had to sell it off, but really would like to have it again. I got my eye on that Bic set I put up little ways up, for they have the same exact speaker and horn in each speaker to make sure the sound stays constant all the way around you. I like what I have, but when I am playing stuff in 5.1 or 7.1 and it goes around me I hate it when it sounds different as it goes around the room due to each speaker being a different brand and freq response.

My passive woofers weight came loose a year after buying my surrounds for my main rig, and I called Bic up, and a human picked up and said hello, told them what had happened, and without a single more question asked me for my address, no receipt, and 5 days later had a replacement, I like that, and when I can buy new, its Bic, but thats my experience with them, and IMO sound fantabulus to me, even the Bic front, though not the same as the rears, sound great for the $200 I paid for them.


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## Jetster (Jan 20, 2020)

No center channel?


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## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

trickson said:


> Hmmm I will try this out. Sounds like fun.
> Thanks.
> 
> **Edit** Just another killer side note My computer has Nahimic 3 And this is really really cool it makes things sound really good. There are tons of setting and it does enhance the sound and quality of sound as well.


Bypass that crap, use HDMI or Spdif, and use your receiver to "enhance" the sound, thats what it was made for, IMO, and can be more "pure" that way. I hate that enhancing stuff, like sound blaster crystalizer stuff, what garbage, IMO. I run a spdif from my on-board for it just takes the bits non messed with to my receiver and then use pure direct for stereo, or Ill do DTS NEO:6 Cinema if I want to enhance it to get a surround stage using all my speakers kinda as one to get a much more fuller range freq response then just what my JVC's can do.

Try this and see what you think, if you like room filling music:
Use the phone app, sound meter thing and get all your speakers as close as you can to all the same DB levels
Set ur sound card to its highest it can put out be it dd or dts, or for my card its max that my receiver can handle is 24 bit 192K
Set ur amp to DTS NEO:6 Cinema
Set amp crossover to 80HZ all around for each speaker
Make sure in DD setting that compression is turned off
Make sure Late Night is set to off
Sub set to LFE+Main since the fronts and rears cannot get to that 20hz sweet spot that you will need the sub to have all that freq from all the speakers under the 80HZ go to the sub
and then play music from this Spotify link and let me know what that does for you, but use it as a starting point and tweak as needed for your ears 








						5.1+ Surround Sound Audio Test
					

5.1+ Surround Sound Audio Test · Playlist · 837 songs · 7.7K likes




					open.spotify.com


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## Vayra86 (Jan 20, 2020)

funboy6942 said:


> Bypass that crap, use HDMI or Spdif, and use your receiver to "enhance" the sound, thats what it was made for, IMO, and can be more "pure" that way. I hate that enhancing stuff, like sound blaster crystalizer stuff, what garbage, IMO. I run a spdif from my on-board for it just takes the bits non messed with to my receiver and then use pure direct for stereo, or Ill do DTS NEO:6 Cinema if I want to enhance it to get a surround stage using all my speakers kinda as one to get a much more fuller range freq response then just what my JVC's can do.
> 
> Try this and see what you think, if you like room filling music:
> Use the phone app, sound meter thing and get all your speakers as close as you can to all the same DB levels
> ...



The crystalizer... hehe. I think it should be viewed as a way to enhance dull sounding speakers, but yeah. Use with care... there will be clipping and I could even hear it on as little as the 10% setting on it. But FWIW it does the job quite well if you want definition or have shit hearing. (Like me... I lost a few higher frequencies over the years. Crystalizer on and its like they're back)


----------



## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

funboy6942 said:


> Saying "audiophile" I think was done by rich snobs so they can say that because they have deeper pockets then you and can whip out their audiophile penis at you cus their stuff costed them 10 grand and yours was a wimpy 1K or less for that matter. I dont consider myself one, though I been messing with stuff since I was a kid and cant tell shit from good, to great, for I remember my speakers I made that sounded good to me as a kid when I tore apart my headphones and stuck them in Styrofoam cups, and saw how I was able to project the sound out of them, and from that part on I did all I could with the means I had to make my stuff sound good to me. My first "real" surround AMP was back in about 93-94 when I bought a sony amp at best buy that was supposed to be a stereo unit for $99 and when I got it home it was a Sony "high end" dolby pro-logic unit, and was stoked, and had to go find more speakers, and that set me off from there to find good sounding surround amps to buy and replace.
> 
> Since then I like the challenge of being able to find cheap stuff at like good will and the likes and do stuff to make it all sound good, though a perfect matched set is the very best, and I love Bic stuff IMO, for it has the best warranty out there, and not "audiophile" grade, but to get a set with matching speakers in every unit is key, I had it in the past, but due to life happening, had to sell it off, but really would like to have it again. I got my eye on that Bic set I put up little ways up, for they have the same exact speaker and horn in each speaker to make sure the sound stays constant all the way around you. I like what I have, but when I am playing stuff in 5.1 or 7.1 and it goes around me I hate it when it sounds different as it goes around the room due to each speaker being a different brand and freq response.
> 
> My passive woofers weight came loose a year after buying my surrounds for my main rig, and I called Bic up, and a human picked up and said hello, told them what had happened, and without a single more question asked me for my address, no receipt, and 5 days later had a replacement, I like that, and when I can buy new, its Bic, but that's my experience with them, and IMO sound fantabulus to me, even the Bic front, though not the same as the rears, sound great for the $200 I paid for them.



Exactly! Rich snobs and Youtube click bate Experts have overused and abused the Audiophile acronym.

I'm from the OLD school where 8 track tapes and quadraphonic sound was the thing to have. I'm not a fan of Dolby surround sound I'm not a fan of any of that so called fancy crap I just like good clean sound that encompasses me in it's rich crisp fullness. I don't need to hear a jet fly over my head nor do I want or need full surround sound mostly because the center speaker in surround sound mode IS the MAIN speaker you hear! And THB F that! You can split the hair any way you like but in Full surround sound mode in ANY setting ON ANY system the Center speaker becomes the MAIN focal point of ALL the sound, In movies this is okay just not music.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 20, 2020)

trickson said:


> LOL LOVE it!
> I am a super huge fan of a certain thing that 7.1 stereo does Quadraphonic sound and yes I have it set up for 7.1 (Or at least It's really close to surround sound actually. I'm a few feet ( 2 ) away from having Surround A Left and Surround A Right in full surround position. I am out of speaker wire and well it is close enough for me really. It would cost me another $40.00 Bucks for more wire and TBPH I am really happy with this setup now.
> You can argue 7.1 Dolby surround till the cows come home what it really comes down to is your personal preference. I have my system hooked up correctly.    I can not get t the "B" Channel is for multi ch setup and or remote speakers (speakers for another room).
> My Denon AVR-3802 maybe 18 years old but it still DOES WORK and in full 7.1 Dolby surround DTS Jazz Rock stereo and mono movie and there maybe another ones here is a link to the stats it's no slouch   But  I prefer 7.1 stereo in this mod to ME it sounds AMAZING and like quadraphonic used to sound to me (Beleive me or not but sound is coming from all around me and it is so sweet!). If that makes any sense.
> ...



Quadrophonic is a four-speaker setup  Quadro = quad 4

y'know like quad damage in quake

The idea is to double up on your stereo effect. Ideally, and if you want to look at a major improvement, reduce speaker count to 4 and buy another sub, get two subs one for each channel. Now thát is a good investment to enhance your setup keeping all else the same. Dual sub can not only separate the bass from each L/R channel (you just plug red on one and white on the other). But you also feed each one mono so they gain a shitload of definition. And with sub, less is more; if you can drive them at lower volume there is less vibration = less distortion and rumble.

Its really something to have a clear panning bass wave, too.

Then you will learn the definition of 'tight bass'  Im a basshead FYI. Played dubstep gigs for a few years n all


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## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

Vayra86 said:


> Quadrophonic is a four-speaker setup  Quadro = quad 4
> 
> y'know like quad damage in quake
> 
> The idea is to double up on your stereo effect. Ideally, and if you want to look at a major improvement, reduce speaker count to 4 and buy another sub, get two subs one for each channel. Now thát is a good investment to enhance your setup keeping all else the same. Dual sub can not only separate the bass from each L/R channel. But you also feed each one mono so they gain a shitload of definition. And with sub, less is more; if you can drive them at lower volume there is less vibration = less distortion and rumble.


Yes that was my very first system. I had a sweet 8 track (think it was an Alpine or kenwood Quadraphonic player, Hard to remember way back then.) A Marantz quadraphonic stereo system (May have been Pioneer), All in all I loved them days. JBL speakers and tube Amp's.


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## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

trickson said:


> Exactly! Rich snobs and Youtube click bate Experts have overused and abused the Audiophile acronym.
> 
> I'm from the OLD school where 8 track tapes and quadraphonic sound was the thing to have. I'm not a fan of Dolby surround sound I'm not a fan of any of that so called fancy crap I just like good clean sound that encompasses me in it's rich crisp fullness. I don't need to hear a jet fly over my head nor do I want or need full surround sound mostly because the center speaker in surround sound mode IS the MAIN speaker you hear! And THB F that! You can split the hair any way you like but in Full surround sound mode in ANY setting ON ANY system the Center speaker becomes the MAIN focal point of ALL the sound, In movies this is okay just not music.


Im also from old school, but I do like my movies with surround sound, and if you set up as I mentioned above, it doesnt pump everything out the center like it was in mono, I HATE THAT WITH A PASSION!!!!! Setting it up like that you get vocals out the center, and then excellent "separation" of all the rest to all the other speakers. Its great if you want room filled sound, and also good if all your speakers are different for it will get you a good balance hitting all the freq mixed together coming from all of them. Listening to my music with DDl or DTSI all that crap comes out my center and is dull af, and hardly anything goes to my other speakers giving me that old quad like sound like back in the day. But I would say you need a decent center IMO, for that tiny thing the OP has in the picture I would think is killing his sound stage, IMO. Need a center if not matching with a MIN of a 5 1/4 with a good tweet to reproduce decent mids and highs. My pc rig's Onkyo speaker has a 6" and a great tweet in it, so it really makes the surround sound good, for a good tweet is important to get the snap of the cymbals reproduced also though it and not just the sides, and helps with vocal sound as well making it not sound "muddy".

But again, if you want spacious sounding "stereo" without it all coming out mostly the center and nothing really going to the sides, do as above and listen to the music in that link to make it sound pretty good, again, IMO. And I do listen to stereo mostly when Im playing my records.


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## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

Vayra86 said:


> Quadrophonic is a four-speaker setup  Quadro = quad 4
> 
> y'know like quad damage in quake
> 
> ...


I'm working on this very thing!


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## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

trickson said:


> I'm working on this very thing!


 If you want to do that, with just one sub, though as I mentioned I suggest running 2 one at 100hz and the other as low as it can be set to for I too love my bass in music and movies, but why not just get a amp with a & b front, run a set behind you, and in front of you, select stereo, or pure on the receiver, no enhancements, and turn on A & B to play at the same time, and then BAM you got quad. Just sit in your spot, and use the phone, meter app, and lever it out all around you and enjoy! This way youre bypassing the center and rears competently, and then if you have a good amp, when you want surround, just turn off the B speaker selection, and then it will run in surround. Unless Im missing something that will make it not happen this way


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## Vayra86 (Jan 20, 2020)

trickson said:


> I'm working on this very thing!



Sweet. When you got it set up, put speakers at 11 and drop this one










Or this one.










If this tickles you. PM


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## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

Give this a shot to for us old schoolers for if you give it time will produce some of the lowest of the lows, and on my main rig with 2 subs knocks shit off walls:










if you like old school mixes give this a whirl:










and if you like that stuff need to check my thread here for more at the end of my crap I wrote:









						Razer Tiamat 7.1 v2 and Logitech Artemis G633/933 with Realtek set up.
					

I just want to start off that this is a IMO only with spending several days and weeks tweaking and messing around with my 1220-VB realtek sound chip and both these headsets in my possession. This may, or may not work with other sound cards, or other chip models for I have but 2 boards one with a...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




And Vayra86 thats some good sounding stuff right there


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## EarthDog (Jan 20, 2020)

> Exactly! Rich snobs and Youtube click bate Experts have overused and abused the Audiophile acronym.


Audiophile isn't an acronym. 

If there is abuse of the word, I can pin it to one person.............lol.

HOOLEEEEEEEEE JAHHHHHHHHVIS! (I'll give someone an atta boy if they know where that reference is from.



Vayra86 said:


> Sweet. When you got it set up, put speakers at 11 and drop this one
> 
> Or this one.
> 
> If this tickles you. PM


These make my PC speakers (sub) 'chuff', lol.


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## funboy6942 (Jan 20, 2020)

what sub you got for my onkyo amp sub with my repaired JVC did well with it. Looking forward to trying this out on my other rig to see how it sounds


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## trickson (Jan 20, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Audiophile isn't an acronym.
> 
> If there is abuse of the word, I can pin it to one person.............lol.
> 
> ...


It's from rich snobs that think because they can drop $70K on wires and $100K on system and speakers they have the "Best" sound money can buy.
It's a BULL SHITZZ Term used by snobs.
There is NO such thing as a "True audiophile" Everyone is an Audiophile!
To me it is an Acronym referring to rich snobs that have this filter or this sub or this setup but it's always better than yours!
Just type in Audiophile in Youtube this guy pops up.










I'm Not sure about you but there are several guys like this that I have to call out as audiophiles. COME on man!
If you have to ask why then you are NOT an AUDIOPHILE LOL!


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## verycharbroiled (Feb 2, 2020)

oobymach said:


> I wouldn't put the sub so close to the pc, especially if you have an hdd in it. Big magnets in subwoofers and the noise they produce might fuck with your system, otherwise looks good.



i dunno. my htpc with one spinner for media has lived on top of my cerwin vega RE30 mains with 160 watts rms from an onkyo receiver ( the CV has 12" woofers,  and its set to no low cutoff for the mains as i also use the cerwin vegas 12s for low freq, they roll off around 35 hz i believe..  and i use an ampeg bass amp (400 watts into 2x10 drivers) several feet away. the ampeg picks that up (35 hz and under as well as up to 80ish hz)  to a point (and i dont always use the sub so i need the mains to carry as much a possible for those times.

with the ampeg bass amp and cabinet the floor shakes to the point stuff vibrates off tables and such. but no errors in the HD which is maybe 5 years old and going strong. WD greens fwiw.

the kodi PVR also records to that drive.

although i am in the process of moving some media to my nas but thats for convenience (space) more than anything else. the pvr will continue recording to the spinner on the htpc.

for subs.. pour a concrete pad that goes to the foundation. im half joking but ive seen it done.

probably just lucky i havent messed the spinner up. but it is in a anti vibration mount, but thats to prevent vibrations from getting out of the drive, not into it afaik..

if you cant feel it in your bones, its not music.


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## robot zombie (Feb 2, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Audiophile isn't an acronym.
> 
> If there is abuse of the word, I can pin it to one person.............lol.
> 
> ...


Time for an upgrade then! My ~$100 dayton tenner just shook a few of my posters off of the wall playing that first one   I've never seen it do that before. I didn't even hear them crawling down.


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## erocker (Feb 2, 2020)

trickson said:


> There is NO such thing as a "True audiophile" Everyone is an Audiophile!


Heh!



trickson said:


> If you have to ask why then you are NOT an AUDIOPHILE LOL!


WAT?

In all actuality though, a "phile" just means denoting a fondness for a specific thing. Anyone can be an audiophile or whatever kind of "phile".

I think you're totally correct on the snobbery thing. Plenty of "audiophiles" who try to define being an audiophile through opinion of their own level of taste. That's almost the definition of a snob.


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## lexluthermiester (Feb 2, 2020)

erocker said:


> I think you're totally correct on the snobbery thing. Plenty of "audiophiles" who try to define being an audiophile through opinion of their own level of taste. That's almost the definition of a snob.


Well said.


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## vectoravtech (Feb 4, 2020)

trickson said:


> Exactly what a snob would say. LMAO!
> I mean it's not an audiophile setup unless you have $70,000 Dollar wires and $10,000 Dollar speakers (Each). so yeah...(slaps snob hat off)...
> I did some more rearranging as best I can. I got each speaker 5 and 1/2 inches apart, so far it sounds like really AMAZING! Even better now. more separation
> 
> ...


this photo is clearer


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## trickson (Feb 7, 2020)

erocker said:


> In all actuality though, a "phile" just means denoting a fondness for a specific thing. Anyone can be an audiophile or whatever kind of "phile".
> 
> I think you're totally correct on the snobbery thing. Plenty of "audiophiles" who try to define being an audiophile through opinion of their own level of taste. That's almost the definition of a snob.


Thank you.
I agree so many self proclaimed audiophiles on youtube are nothing more than rich snobs that can afford dropping 70K each year then brag about it and tell you how much better there setup is because they have 70k in wires with standoffs.  
Reality is so much more simpler than this. and you have summed it up perfectly. 
I have a fondness for cassette taped music. I have a HUGE tape collection and pick up more and more each year. 
I even record my own tapes (my personal preference). 
I am looking for a real to real setup to add to my Denon system. 
I always thought that an audiophile was someone that not only collected music on some form of media (records, tapes, CD's) But also one that has an outstanding setup, Meaning one of moderate to excellent quality. Not a Fisher or some sharp all in one stereo or boom box. ( I think you know what I mean).   
As for bragging rights? Well yes I do have that as well. 
With the Denon AVR-3802 pushing Klipsch RF5000F and RF 6000F speakers And my sweet Vintage Studio DBX speakers the sound from my system is beyond my dreams! 
Just absolute fantastic sound ! 100% TRUE sound, fantastic quality and clarity at the best price I could have ever imagined. 

As an Audiophile I feel I have achieved the best balance of quality and clarity. 

Oh and yeah the Klipsch RF speakers look even better than they sound! 
If you ever get a pair you will NOT want the covers on.


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## funboy6942 (Feb 7, 2020)

My audiophile setup, for my pc rig, consists of a Denon AVR-2808CI I got at goodwills online store for like $30. Some vintage JVC speakers I got from my neighbor when he was packing up to move and put them in the trash. A Onkyo center I got from goodwill. And my rears are some really old Jensen speakers I got for free when I bought a radio at Circuit City back in the very early 2000's. I just upgraded my "monitor" to a TCL 43" 4K I got at best buy last night for $225 and to me it sounds and looks fantastic, so its Audiophile grade  

When I get my taxes though, I plan on getting a whole matching 5.1 DCM speaker set with towers and same speakers and tweeters in each speaker, so the tone will match all around me when Im driving a car, or flying a plane, or what have you, I just need it to all sound the same no matter where the sound is coming from, and found a matching set of discontinued DCM stuff for $349 brand new on fleebay. Looking forward to getting and testing it out  Cannot afford much more then this, but the price is right, and had DCM stuff in the 90;s that absolutely kicked all forms of butt, in sound and loudness, to me, and was owned and believe they still are, by MTX which has been around forever, and backed by a 10 year warranty :O


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## trickson (Feb 8, 2020)

funboy6942 said:


> My audiophile setup, for my pc rig, consists of a Denon AVR-2808CI I got at goodwills online store for like $30.


Yeah that is an amazing buy and system. Add some Klipsch or Polk Audio speakers to it and you will be really Amazed!
The Denon AVR systems are just the absolute best (IMHO) in Audio equipment anyone can have. There AVR line is hands down the best there is. This is of-course my opinion. I have had and have other sytems yet none have ever held a candle to any of my Denon systems. And DON'T even THINK any Marantz or some  Yamaha can they just suck plain and simple. Yes I even have a Yamaha receiver it blows when you compare it to my Denon.


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## funboy6942 (Feb 8, 2020)

Well I have a Polk and BIC  sub, with my BIC sub being 5 years older then my Polk, and I have already had to replace the sub speaker in my Polk once already for it blew, and its not pushed no where near as much as my BIC is and still is, so Im not a big fan in regards to that brand. The rest of my home theater system consists of a Onkyo TX-RZ810 I got from Onkyo when my TX-NR809 units DTS chip broke and they did a recall on that unit because of that, and did the trade in and got that unit for $250 through them. The rest of my speakers are BIC, I like BIC and their 7 year warranty they have, and I beat the living piss out of them with the 2 subs I have, as I wait for my Polk to kill another speaker, and will continue to buy BIC for my Home Theater set up. My PC speaker set up is a hodge Podge mix of cheap, or cheaply bought stuff. But me to you, I would look into bic IMHO, for they have the best warranty out there for speakers, aside of DCM and MTX's 10 year warranty, and not get something basied on name itself, fo ryou really are buying the name with cheap parts thrown in at most times. Look on Amazon at the BIC line, or even Dayton, and see that they are praised up and down for quality and sound, and I only bought the Polk for my system because its jsut doing the 120HZ or above, where my BIC Acoustech PL 200 does the really deep low stuff,  https://www.amazon.com/Bic-Acoustec...81239&sprefix=BIC+Ac,instant-video,165&sr=8-4, that can be had now for the same price as a Polk 12" entry sub that I have blown up already once.

Again in my honest opinion, I wouldnt look into something because of the name, but because I am disabled and have a ton of time to my name, I been lucky enough to do research on forums after forums, and youtube after youtube, and ready reviews with afine toothed comb weeding out paid for reviews, and then because my purchases need to be a one time only, and mainly at tax time when I have money for being on SSI you dont have jack shit to your name the rest of the year to do anything with, I have really found that BIC and Dayton and some bad ass sleeper sets you can buy, again IMO. If you have money for Klipsch, though Ive owned many a sets of them back in the day, with my last bad taste in my mouth every owning them ever again, was their 2.1 and 5.1 systems back in the early 2000's when their subs just go poof, and then buying the Logitech Z5500 set to replace them and saw really how crappy they really were also in the sound department against a computer parts manufacture, vs a legit speaker manufacture, and they kicked all forms of ass beating them up daily with no distortion what so ever, with everything set to max, bass and all, and they just took it all and sounded like a mofo, when my Klipsch set up I had to turn the bass down when I wanted to jam because the sub would fart, then my 2.1 sub died, and since I had money at the time, decided I loooooove Klipsch and bought into the hype, and bought the 5.1 even though there was reviews after reviews of people like me saying the subs were blowing up, but f that, this is Klipsh, they wont let me down, they are stupid, and less then a year later my 5.1 sub blew up. So when someone mentions Klipsch, I really go, no, nope, no way for me. And even to this day they are still having problems with their subs blowing up, just google klipsch Sub Blown, and see all the goodness that comes up :O

So for me Ive owned Polk, blew a speaker, Ive own Klipsch and blew subs, Ive owned BIC, havent blown anything and my speakers are over 10 years old now and still going strong. Ive owned Pioneer, and JVC, and Onkyo, and Ive only had one bad thing go with my Onkyo and that was the DTS chip which they stood up and took it like a man and sold me a $800+ Receiver for $250 because of it. Im a fan of Denon BUT ONLY, ONLY, the older stuff made in Japan. Their newer line stuff is made in China, for I got one for $80 at bargin hunt, and when I got it home was like, WTF, its no longer made in Japan, but china, noooooooooo, say it isnt soo Denon, say it isnt soooooooooo!

This video is why I LOVE me some Onkyo, and I did love older Japan made Denon, but will stick with Onkyo stuff if I can afford it because it is the best bang for buck money if your looking for great quality and sound with a company that does have your back if the need arises. 







 well over stated power out this bad boy I got, and for the last 2 years it get used daily for over 12 hours a day between me, my son and daughter using it 

Sorry for the long story, but had to give my opion, and why I really dont see me ever buying another Klipsh, polk, or Denon units anymore, any time soon, unless they are given to me, or was at a extremely heavily discounted price, for I dont normally buy into brand names unless they are proven not to have a name, but the guys, or parts used are well below sub par, making fools who hear the name go, oh it cost over $12000, and its name is XXXX, I got to have it without looking them up to see whats the what on them. Some Onkyo speakers are just that as well. They say onkyo, but have the cheapest drivers in them, especially the stuff in a box crap. The head units are so so, but the speakers, though tuned for that system, and sound good for what they are, are no good for any other application, IMO. Im looking forward to getting my cheap pc system, just so I can have matching sets. Yeah, cheap DCM stuff backed by a 10 year warranty, and Im not expecting much, but I really need matching speakers all the way around me to enjoy my sound more then having a car in front of me with my JVC's with 12's in them roar and growl, and then when I pass the car, the tone of the growl changes due to drivers being different in the rears, though Im getting the low growl from my sub still with the crossover from them going to my sub to make up that lacking, its just the tone man, the tone, sound like in front, and sounds like in back, really taking away the sound stage in games and movies for me. Its ok when I play music, for all the different tones, make up for one hell of a great sounding music as it hits almost every frequency because they are all different drivers (front, rears, center), just anything else, and all them different drivers, kill the sound stage  And I just cannot stress this enough, for Im not claiming Im a audiophile by any means, just a guy that likes good sound for his buck, but if you want the best sound and longevity out of your system, it is a must that if it is a home theater that you use the same makers of speakers with the same exact drivers in size and tweeters if you are after that perfect home theater, no 8" up front and 6" in the rears for it will for sure throw the sound off especially when watching movies or games if your after that immersion with sound and video to come together. ALSO, so you dont kill your amp make sure to use the same rated cables all around, and not easy to do but the same length to all of them as well so as not to stress out the amp, for it will have the same equal resistance going to all of them, for power likes to mostly go to the path with the least resistance, and amps dont care for stress that much  

But op, if you like Klipsch, thats your bag, but if you get an itch, and since they are not "too" expensive I highly recommend you trying out the BIC like, or Dayton line, BIC over Dayton IMO, but Dayton is very close, only falling behind because of lesser warranty. But Bic IMO will not let you down and can save a TON of money and not lose that sound ur after in the process. 

If you have $1300 shipped in your pocket at some time, and want the "ultimate" sound sound package with all matching all around you for that sound and feel, then this is what I suggest, again as always IMO, https://www.amazon.com/Marantz-BIC-...4878&sprefix=BIC+Ac,instant-video,165&sr=8-11.

I had the PL69 set up with the 6 1/2" speakers, and still have my rear set up, had to sell off all the rest as time went on due to needing money at some points to make ends meet, but still have my rears, and at some tax time will upgrade my home theater to the 8" versions like I listed, but so that they are all matching, and best bang for the buck with pitch perfect bass, and tones all around you, I recommend that set up to everyone if they have the means. If not, go cheaper with their standard bic line, and match all the speakers for the most part all they sell have the same drivers pretty much in them all, just different cases and towers, and do a match that way on the cheap, but their Acoustech is their top of the line they make, and sound freaking amazing, again, IMO, but for what you paid for just your two front towers pretty much,  could of got all of these and a brand new Marantz amp to go along with it  and still be one hell of a happy man because you got kick ass tunes, on the cheap without buying into the brand name game, saved a ton, looks fantastic, and a new amp also to boot


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## trickson (Feb 8, 2020)

I hear you.
When I buy goods and they turn out to be less than what I expected or break before "I feel it is time" I tend not to buy from that manufacture again. 
Also every manufacture has a product that sucks or most do. It's just the way things are.
But I have never had any issues with my Klipsch speakers nor my Klipsch sub. In fact I added a second one the first one sounded so good.
I have been doing my share of research. I did mine the old fashioned way, I went to the stores and shop's to listen to them first hand hours of it.
I've heard a lot of speakers and for many reasons ( I've listed before) I went with Klipsch, I've listened to countless systems and found for the price at the time the Denon AVR-3802 was the very best for the price point I was looking for. It's not HDMI or Atmos ( None of that was out at the time.) But it is just right for ME! Perfect power/ sound/ clarity and balance for me.
I'm not a fan of Marantz In fact I really think they suck. Marantz is like you said Buying something for name sake.
One thing is for sure the audio industry has a ton of different things / gadgets / speakers / receivers / amps and wires that it can get awfully confusing and frustrating at times. 
I just try to keep it as simple as possible.
I have no plans ever to get rid of or change out the speakers or system at all. Maybe a center Klipsch speaker but that is about it.
My Audiophile system is just about complete as I need to get a Denon CD player next.


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## funboy6942 (Feb 8, 2020)

My only mention to marantz was because if you search up that bic line, its $1300 with the marantz, and $1500 without one  WTF??? Can always take the Marantz and sell it off bringing all them goodness speakers to less then a grand total 

Im really bad on my stuff, for I run it like it was stolen, and anytime now when the kids or wife isnt home, Im pissing off the neighborhood. So if a amp doesnt pass my tests, I never buy again. I really haven't had problems with Pioneer or JVC amps in the past, but I like the beef of a good Onkyo or Denon (older), and as you can see with the test of my newer Onkyo, they are very relaxed with the ratings of their stuff still to this day with their middle of the ground goods. I like the way they sound vs the other, and Yamaha isnt all to bad either, but still like them two over them all out there, and dont get me started on Sony, for they were the best back in the day for everything, it didnt matter what it was, for you knew if it had sony on it, there was no need to look further into anything really for the price to bang of buck was always there, but damn did they fall off the cliff as of lately, for now its more like the others, buying into the name, with cheap ass crap thrown into it.

Glad you like your Klipsch, and glad to hear, though amazed, your sub amp is still working, but you must not pound ur system for hours and days on end Im assuming for it to still be alive 
Wish I had the money to try out some "newer" Klipsch speakers, non subs, but as I pointed out for the price of your two towers could of had the top of the line bic stuff, and a Marantz, you could sell off, and had money in your pocket to go out to eat several times over, and sound as good, and dare I say maybe better


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## trickson (Feb 8, 2020)

funboy6942 said:


> My only mention to marantz was because if you search up that bic line, its $1300 with the marantz, and $1500 without one  WTF??? Can always take the Marantz and sell it off bringing all them goodness speakers to less then a grand total
> 
> Im really bad on my stuff, for I run it like it was stolen, and anytime now when the kids or wife isnt home, Im pissing off the neighborhood. So if a amp doesnt pass my tests, I never buy again. I really haven't had problems with Pioneer or JVC amps in the past, but I like the beef of a good Onkyo or Denon (older), and as you can see with the test of my newer Onkyo, they are very relaxed with the ratings of their stuff still to this day with their middle of the ground goods. I like the way they sound vs the other, and Yamaha isnt all to bad either, but still like them two over them all out there, and dont get me started on Sony, for they were the best back in the day for everything, it didnt matter what it was, for you knew if it had sony on it, there was no need to look further into anything really for the price to bang of buck was always there, but damn did they fall off the cliff as of lately, for now its more like the others, buying into the name, with cheap ass crap thrown into it.
> 
> ...


I rock out like no other. LOL. my system is on for about 15 hours a day every day and I jam out about 75% of the time. I mean hold out at -10 for an hour long jam out. Yeah I am NOT kidding, I love music LOVE it loud and yeah all the time.
I just have this thing against Marantz like you and Klipsch subs yeah maybe even more so. They are just horrible absolute horrible pieces of junk IMTHO.
Every time I hear that name Marantz all I see is a snob that has too much cash to piss away and absolutely NO sound taste at all. 
Again just my opinion.
Marantz is like a Daewoo to me.
And for Sony, I totally agree with you. Spot on!


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## freeagent (Feb 9, 2020)

I'm pretty sure at the time your amp was new, Marantz and Denon were owned by the same company. 

Edit:

Umm... Yep!









						Polk Audio, Denon, Marantz, and Boston Acoustics are now all brands from the same company
					

The Verge is about technology and how it makes us feel. Founded in 2011, we offer our audience everything from breaking news to reviews to award-winning features and investigations, on our site, in video, and in podcasts.




					www.theverge.com


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

freeagent said:


> I'm pretty sure at the time your amp was new, Marantz and Denon were owned by the same company.
> 
> Edit:
> 
> ...


It's a common misconception, I can see where you are making your mistake.
See just because one big business owns several different companies or rather several small companies are owned by a "Parent" Company that there products will all be the very same.
That is a HUGE mistake in thinking. 
It's just not true.
Marantz is still JUNK and will always remain JUNK IMHO.
Denon is #1 and really has been #1 in the audio industry for quite some time ( Like 20+ Years).
LMFAO!!! I just did this google search #1 AVR systems for the last 20 years

So there is that!


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## freeagent (Feb 9, 2020)

I don't know.. I've had both.. they each have their pros and cons.


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

freeagent said:


> I don't know.. I've had both.. they each have their pros and cons.









The Pro's surely out way any con's I can find! 
Not only are they sleek and sexy looking but wow the BIG sound the Crisp , Clean, Clear sound from Titanium LTS Vented Tweeter with Hybrid Tractrix® Horn 
I mean just look at the spec's!
Klipsch RP-6000F


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## freeagent (Feb 9, 2020)

You should use your AVR as a preamp and get yourself a nice power amp to feed those, if you really want to do them justice..


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

freeagent said:


> You should use your AVR as a preamp and get yourself a nice power amp to feed those, if you really want to do them justice..


I looked into this but I'm not sold just yet. This system has a lot of power and does a great job driving them.
If I could just find a good one to test it out first then maybe...


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## freeagent (Feb 9, 2020)

125w continuous doesn't sound like much, but those are tough conditions.. Your amp is now close to 20 years old, and you beat on it pretty good by the sounds of it..  If the AVR isn't getting hot and doesn't make any weird noises then Id say she's good to go.


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

freeagent said:


> 125w continuous doesn't sound like much, but those are tough conditions.. Your amp is now close to 20 years old, and you beat on it pretty good by the sounds of it..  If the AVR isn't getting hot and doesn't make any weird noises then Id say she's good to go.


Yeah it's got this fan that comes on when she gets hot. It keeps the AMP nice and cool when I get blasting. I also take it to the audio shop once a year for maintenance and a full systems check.
I know it sounds like it's OLD but it still does every thing I need and want. And I really love this particular model, I haven't had one issue with it at all ever. And my audio tech said it's a rock solid system.


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## freeagent (Feb 9, 2020)

Hey man, lots of things that are old sound way better than some of the newer stuff. The 20 year old bit came when I was thinking of caps and such. As long as you take care of her, she’ll take good care of you.


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

freeagent said:


> Hey man, lots of things that are old sound way better than some of the newer stuff. The 20 year old bit came when I was thinking of caps and such. As long as you take care of her, she’ll take good care of you.


Yep just like a good car. If you treat her well she will always start. LOL.
I have 20 year or older DBX studio bookshelf speakers that are still AMAZING , Dare I say as good as my Klipsch?! YES! I have them hooked to this system now and have NO intention of replacing them. Unless they blow out and even then I may have them completely fixed then. But till then they are rocking hard and sound AMAZING!


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## freeagent (Feb 9, 2020)

My Monitor Audio FB210 has gotta be at least 20 years old now, she still pounds. It’s only 500w but it’s pretty decent. It won’t knock the air out of your lungs, or make you feel like your gonna poo. But it sounds good.


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

freeagent said:


> My Monitor Audio FB210 has gotta be at least 20 years old now, she still pounds. It’s only 500w but it’s pretty decent. It won’t knock the air out of your lungs, or make you feel like your gonna poo. But it sounds good.


Make you go poo if I had that system......


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## freeagent (Feb 9, 2020)

I bought that sub in 2009 I think. It was a demo unit that had been auditioned a handful of times, and sat in a corner for about a decade, I only paid a buck a watt


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

I have hooked up two 12" subwoofers to my Amp put them behind my sectional sofa and WOW you can really feel it and hear it now!

*AMAZING! 




*


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## EarthDog (Feb 9, 2020)

trickson said:


> View attachment 144405
> 
> View attachment 144406


Is one of those (bottom pic, looks like rear right) firing diagonally in the room while the other (top pic, looks like rear right) is pointed directly to the left towards the other speaker (not diagonally like the other)?


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Is one of those (bottom pic, looks like rear right) firing diagonally in the room while the other (top pic, looks like rear right) is pointed directly to the left towards the other speaker (not diagonally like the other)?


LOL.
Here they are in real time.


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## EarthDog (Feb 9, 2020)

Ahh, ok.. weird optical illusion in the first set. 

Why not mount them with the terminals to the wall? It would look better (that rear right) at the  very least. 

I'd go terminals to the wall and swap L and R cabinets so they are angled in towards the seating area.


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> Ahh, ok.. weird optical illusion in the first set.
> 
> Why not mount them with the terminals to the wall? It would look better (that rear right) at the  very least.


It was or rather is the only way to mount them for my sound preference.


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## EarthDog (Feb 9, 2020)

trickson said:


> Terminals?


speaker terminals... where you plug in the speaker wire to the speaker cabinet. 

(Also, see my edit above)


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> speaker terminals... where you plug in the speaker wire to the speaker cabinet.
> 
> (Also, see my edit above)


I tried them every way possible even that way it just didn't sound right. It was like the right was getting to much or the left or not even hearing them at all.

I even had them on the celling and that sounded horrible.


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## EarthDog (Feb 9, 2020)

trickson said:


> I tried them every way possible even that way it just didn't sound right. It was like the right was getting to much or the left or not even hearing them at all.
> 
> I even had them on the celling and that sounded horrible.


That rear left will likely be more pronounced considering it has 2 walls (sound reflection) versus 1.

 Just looks cleaner mounted with terminals hidden away... no tacky terminals lighted by a lamp.


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## trickson (Feb 9, 2020)

EarthDog said:


> That rear left will likely be more pronounced considering it has 2 walls (sound reflection) versus 1.
> 
> Just looks cleaner mounted with terminals hidden away... no tacky terminals lighted by a lamp.


You know I really thought that to but nope it is not happening. I think mainly because both walls are insulated. LOL yeah I do not see the terminals anyway I mean really I don't.


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## bobbybluz (Feb 12, 2020)

This is the power section of my living room stereo. The speakers picture was taken a few years when I was in the process of moving:


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## trickson (Feb 12, 2020)

WOW AMAZING SETUP! ^^^
Looks like an electronics floor show exploded in there ! YES!  

May I please have the BGW 7500?


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## bobbybluz (Feb 12, 2020)

I had that 7500 custom built by BGW in 1985 back when I sold, installed and serviced Pro audio equipment. It's in use driving the EV Sentry 100A's on top of the speaker stacks. Here's the outboard equipment rack. I don't use it much anymore since I do almost everything on computers these days. I use a Mackie 24 channel 8 buss mixer to control the inputs. The Denon on top of the rack is only used for a preamp for my Technics 1200 M3D turntable.


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## trickson (Feb 12, 2020)

Yeah that is all pretty SWEET! Love it all really and that Denon . I would LOVE to have some of that setup, But that's what the jellylike in me say's because I really am super stoked and more than AMAZED at my setup now.


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## bobbybluz (Feb 12, 2020)

Nearly everything came off Craigslist or Ebay dirt cheap. I paid $50 for the Denon at a garage sale 4-5 years ago. I got the two Crown XLS 1500's for $150 each with the tags still on them from a guy on his way to prison for DUI. The XLS 2502 was bought new at a deep discount through the radio station I worked at when I bought it.


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## funboy6942 (Feb 12, 2020)

I hope you make a lot of money for that electric bill of yours must be out of the world!


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## bobbybluz (Feb 12, 2020)

It doesn't get used everyday and the Class D Crown power amps are extremely efficient. The BGW's are Class AB and really aren't power suckers like Class A tube amps. It all runs on a single 15 amp circuit and it's never tripped the breaker. It doesn't get played loud either, it's for realistic audio reproduction not sonic warfare (I'd use my band PA for that).


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## trickson (Feb 12, 2020)

bobbybluz said:


> It doesn't get used everyday and the Class D Crown power amps are extremely efficient. The BGW's are Class AB and really aren't power suckers like Class A tube amps. It all runs on a single 15 amp circuit and it's never tripped the breaker. It doesn't get played loud either, it's for realistic audio reproduction not sonic warfare (I'd use my band PA for that).


I have mine setup for sonic warfare as well as sound quality.

"Realistic audio reproduction"
Fantastic terminology; A true Audiophile at heart you are. 
That is so GOOD a line man I need to use it in my sig I LOVE IT! If that is okay of-coures?. 

OMG A ROLLS MIXER EQ!!! HOLY SHITZZZZZZ! DUDE your system is AMAZING! Yeah you sure have mine beat, But I got you on power consumption lol Bet the power company hears a siren every time you start that up! LOL SO SWEET!


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## bobbybluz (Feb 12, 2020)

I bought seven of those Crest FA-901 power amps from a mega-church for $90 each in mint condition. Sold four at a nice profit and kept three. I've sold one since that picture but still have the other two in that rack. That's a Stewart PA-1000 at the bottom. I have 5 more BGW's in my basement; a 500D, two 250C's and two 250D's. I bought one of these a few weeks ago for one of my A/V production workstations and may buy another: https://www.parts-express.com/dayto...bluetooth-42-usb-aux-in-headphone-s--300-3840


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## trickson (Feb 12, 2020)

bobbybluz said:


> I bought seven of those Crest FA-901 power amps from a mega-church for $90 each in mint condition. Sold four at a nice profit and kept three. I've sold one since that picture but still have the other two in that rack. That's a Stewart PA-1000 at the bottom. I have 5 more BGW's in my basement; a 500D, two 250C's and two 250D's. I bought one of these a few weeks ago for one of my A/V production workstations and may buy another: https://www.parts-express.com/dayto...bluetooth-42-usb-aux-in-headphone-s--300-3840


DANG! Them are nice looking amps I like the price to! And well Dayton IMHO is right up there with Denon!

PLEASE PEOPLE POST SOME PICTURES! I want to see your your setups!


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## funboy6942 (Feb 12, 2020)

Im stoked for I just got a set of DCM KX12 Series 2 speakers for $40. Only down side is I got to drive 3 hours to go pick them up, but well worth it. I had the KX10's back in the 90s and loved them soooo much, but couldnt afford the 12" versions, and now like 20+ years later I can, and pick them up monday to make my system go boom boom


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