# Best Overall AIO CPU Cooler for Overclocking 10900K / Upcoming Zen3 5950X



## urawzrd (Oct 20, 2020)

According to GamersNexus, arctic freezer ii 360mm and EK 360mm AIO are top contenders, but he didn't really seem to compare it to a lot of other brands that I heard some good things about.. (e.g. Alphacool Eisbaer 360 or Swiftech h360x, etc)...

Can anyone shed some light? 
Thank you


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## Th3pwn3r (Oct 21, 2020)

I can just say that I got the 280mm from Arctic since the 360mm was out of stock and I'm very happy with it. Build quality is pretty good but I did notice the screw holes weren't tapped that will on the radiator but luckily they all worked.


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## harm9963 (Oct 21, 2020)

I will slam my Enermax  Liqmax  lll 360 on my 5900x 








						Enermax LIQMAX III ARGB 360 AIO Review
					

Enermax looks to assert its dominance in the all-in-one liquid cooler market with its LIQMAX III ARGB 360 mm offering. It offers exceptional cooling performance, acceptable noise levels, and a plethora of lighting modes. As such, it manages to deliver in more ways than one.




					www.techpowerup.com


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## John Naylor (Oct 21, 2020)

1.  If looking for quality reviews, youtube is best avoided.  reading PCPer and other text based articles and then making videos about what you read isn't all that informative.

2.  A $50 air cooler will outperform almost every 2 x 120 AIO and many 3 x 120s on the market.

3.  To hit desired price points, AIO vendors generally use cheap aluminum radiators which also succumb to galvanic corrosion after the useful life (18 - 24 months) of the corrosion inhibitors expire) ... this requires the use of extreme speed fans.  Pump rate are also inadequate, especially if expanding the loop.

4.  The Swiftech H360 is basically a collection of Swiftech's custom loop products pre-assembled at the factory.    The pump is easily capable of handling the addition of more radiators and blocks tho with 2 rads and more than 2 blocks id want a dualie like the Swiftech 35x2.

So if it's an AIO that ya want w/o corrosion issues and capability for expansyion, great performance and onlt about twice as loud as an air cooler (H100i is 11 times as loud)  ... I have installed  a half dozen Swiftechs, I have changed the coolant twice.  To make that latter job easier ... I installed a G-1/4 MxM 10mm fitting on th e side port, then a F XF Valve, another MxM  and finally a G-1/4 Tee F x F x F tee (branch up) with plugs on top and remaining side port..

When you need to add coolant, take off the plug at top of tee, put a thick book under front of case, open valve a bit and sloely fill thru tee top port ... when ya want to drain, take of the side port on the tee , connect a G-1.3 M x compression fitting attached to 3 feet of flex tubing, open valve and drain.

Some references on aluminum rads (if upou can't click links, copy paste into url window then delete the 2 spaces after the // ... I didnt wanna clog the post with big blocks.

https://  martinsliquidlab.wordpress.com/2012/01/24/corrosion-explored/
https://  www.youtube.com/watch?v=HC1kzO_gIp4
https://  www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=a_r4tWpMHHI


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## xkm1948 (Oct 21, 2020)

$50 air cooler > any 240 or 360 AIO? Care to back up your claim with our own TPU reviews?


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## oxrufiioxo (Oct 21, 2020)

A lot of it will depend on the fans it comes with and how much noise you're willing to tolerate. Price wise you will not beat the Arctic coolers when compared to other AIO but their warranty is pretty short. I would go with something that comes with a 5 or 6 year warranty which typically means the manufacturer actually has confidence in their product. I really like the new h150i elite from Corsair but literally any
360 AIO will get the job done on a 5950X. The 10900K will be more of an issue and it will sorta depend on what voltage yours requires to hit whatever frequency you're trying to hit although from reviews I have seen you don't gain as much performance as you do heat from overclocking it.   


According to AMD the 5900X/5950X will be no different than the 3900X/3950X power/heat wise and my 3900X is cooled by a h115i platinum easily.


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## sneekypeet (Oct 21, 2020)

oxrufiioxo said:


> According to AMD the 5900X/5950X will be no different than the 3900X/3950X power/heat wise



Agreed, but the CCD are smaller no? Could be a difference in the way they cool, but without one in hand, I am just guessing. (you know, more heat in a smaller area might make it slightly tougher to cool as efficiently as the 3-series?!?!?!?!)


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## Vya Domus (Oct 21, 2020)

John Naylor said:


> A $50 air cooler will outperform almost every 2 x 120 AIO and many 3 x 120s on the market.



No it wont.


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## oxrufiioxo (Oct 21, 2020)

sneekypeet said:


> Agreed, but the CCD are smaller no? Could be a difference in the way they cool, but without one in hand, I am just guessing. (you know, more heat in a smaller area might make it slightly tougher to cool as efficiently as the 3-series?!?!?!?!)




Good point but given that they are on an identical process it shouldn't be too different.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Oct 21, 2020)

xkm1948 said:


> $50 air cooler > any 240 or 360 AIO? Care to back up your claim with our own TPU reviews?



Maybe not a $50 one but a D15 would give them a run for their money imo


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## FinneousPJ (Oct 21, 2020)

If you can fit a D15 in your case I really don't see the point in an AIO.


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## harm9963 (Oct 21, 2020)

This is one of the reason why got my AIO.


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## FinneousPJ (Oct 21, 2020)

harm9963 said:


> This is one of the reason why got my AIO.View attachment 172661


According to the review, the Enermax *360 mm *AIO is 4% better than NH-D15S and 3% better than NH-D15, while the NH-D15S offers 20% better value and the NH-D15 offers 8% better value. Nope, I still don't get it. And the *360 mm* AIO is way bigger than the air cooler.



			https://tpucdn.com/review/enermax-liqmax-iii-argb-360-aio-liquid-cooler/images/relative_perf.png
		




			https://tpucdn.com/review/enermax-liqmax-iii-argb-360-aio-liquid-cooler/images/perf_dollar.png


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## Deleted member 24505 (Oct 21, 2020)

FinneousPJ said:


> According to the review, the Enermax *360 mm *AIO is 4% better than NH-D15S and 3% better than NH-D15, while the NH-D15S offers 20% better value and the NH-D15 offers 8% better value. Nope, I still don't get it. And the *360 mm* AIO is way bigger than the air cooler.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



For 3 degrees load i would still prefer the D15 myself


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## Turmania (Oct 21, 2020)

I agree get a d15 if it fits, and you never have to worry about a cooler ever. I have nzxt x62rev2. Loving it, neber had a problem with it. But still next pc will be air cooled,jon rgb, no nore cable clutter. Just going simple.


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## freeagent (Oct 21, 2020)

tigger said:


> Maybe not a $50 one but a D15 would give them a run for their money imo



Thermalrights True Spirit 140 Power is 50 bucks, and is as good as D15..


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## Deleted member 193596 (Oct 21, 2020)

as much as i respect highly scientific testing methods.

i had almost every single Corsair AIO (even the coolit pump models) and the liquid freezer 280 (awful dirt cheap quality but decent performance)

and now i have the kraken X73.
Put the Pump to 85% (inaudible) and it beats every single AIO by a Lot.

in my case with a h150i with a gen 6 asetek Pump at 100% Pump speed the kraken ran almost 10°C cooler.

my 10850k runs at 5.1 GHz and it is not easy to even reach 70°C as a peak in CB R20 (need several runs in a loop)
the h150i peaked at around 80 at the first run.


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## Tatty_One (Oct 21, 2020)

From my own experience having used AIO's for over a decade without any failure (on my 3rd as my CPU's get more power hungry) I would recommend artic cooling simply because they compete with pretty much the best but tend to be a bit cheaper, I currently have the Freezer II 280mm (*£*79.99 or *$*89.99) and it is really good, there appear to be only a couple of 360mm AIO's that can better it (by a small margin) but are a fair bit more expensive, the Noctua NH D15 is a brilliant air cooler and gets within 5 degrees of it, if those 5 degrees are within acceptable limits and the D15 is significantly cheaper then it could be the way to go, other than that, I can't imagine how much better Artic's 360mm would be,...…..

i9 9900K @ 5Gig 1.35v









						Arctic Liquid Freezer II 280 liquid cooler review
					

Today, we are reviewing an AIO cooler from Arctic: the LIQUID FREEZER II 280. The series has been introduced on the 9th of December this year. Arctic is no “newbie” in the AIO segment of the mark... Core i9 9900K OC at 5000 MHz 1.35 volts




					www.guru3d.com


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## kapone32 (Oct 21, 2020)

urawzrd said:


> According to GamersNexus, arctic freezer ii 360mm and EK 360mm AIO are top contenders, but he didn't really seem to compare it to a lot of other brands that I heard some good things about.. (e.g. Alphacool Eisbaer 360 or Swiftech h360x, etc)...
> 
> Can anyone shed some light?
> Thank you


I can vouch for the Eisbear, especially the Aurora . Unfortunately Alphacool is not popular in English on Youtube. Watch the KitGuru review of the Eisbear Aurora. You don't need to change the fans and with a little effort you can add your GPU. There is also the fact that the rad and CPU block are copper. I started with 1 Eisbear and now have a few Alphacool products.


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## Th3pwn3r (Oct 21, 2020)

John Naylor said:


> 1.  If looking for quality reviews, youtube is best avoided.  reading PCPer and other text based articles and then making videos about what you read isn't all that informative.
> 
> 2.  A $50 air cooler will outperform almost every 2 x 120 AIO and many 3 x 120s on the market.
> 
> ...



I'm pretty sure Gamers Nexus is far more credible and knowledgeable than you and I put together. Not to mention the crazy testing they actually do and not just talk on forums.



tigger said:


> Maybe not a $50 one but a D15 would give them a run for their money imo



A D15 is $100 give or take. They also don't perform nearly as well.



FinneousPJ said:


> If you can fit a D15 in your case I really don't see the point in an AIO.



Because you lack knowledge. For starters COMPATIBILITY, those huge air coolers can really block ram among other things, then there's the sag that does/can/might happen over time. That's the scary one, I have a D15 installed and I should learn how to post pictures because that thing is sagging like a lead GPU would. There's also something called heat transfer/heat soak to consider.



Turmania said:


> I agree get a d15 if it fits, and you never have to worry about a cooler ever. I have nzxt x62rev2. Loving it, neber had a problem with it. But still next pc will be air cooled,jon rgb, no nore cable clutter. Just going simple.



Fitting a D15 is no easy task and just the thought of doing a build and having clearance issues sucks for anyone building their first or only machine. AIOs generally fit much easier although I will admit I had to mod my case to fit my Arctic 280mm cooler into my mid tower and I had a pretty large CoolerMaster heatsink 410(?) I think that fit just fine.



freeagent said:


> Thermalrights True Spirit 140 Power is 50 bucks, and is as good as D15..


I didn't even know Thermalright was still in business.  Do you have any proof of your claim? If that's true I may recommend it to my cousin who is about to do a build and may not want an AIO.

Anyhow, the big reasons to stay away from AIOs are if you're worried about failure, leaks, pump wine or things of that sort. AIOs have come a long way and usually outperform air coolers easily and for less money. The Arctic 280mm AIO is $100 give or take and will beat the brakes off of just about anything else performance per dollar.


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## FinneousPJ (Oct 21, 2020)

Th3pwn3r said:


> Because you lack knowledge. For starters COMPATIBILITY, those huge air coolers can really block ram among other things, then there's the sag that does/can/might happen over time. That's the scary one, I have a D15 installed and I should learn how to post pictures because that thing is sagging like a lead GPU would. There's also something called heat transfer/heat soak to consider.



I thought I said "if you can fit it [in your case]", yes, and on your mobo. My D15 does not sag at all. Perhaps you have made an error installing or using it. As for performance, I already posted a chart showing it within 3% of a 360 mm AIO.

However, the sag discussion reminds me: if you're transferring your PC often, an AIO is probably your best option.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Oct 21, 2020)

I have tallish RGB pro ram in my PC and there was no clearance issue at all, also fitting a D15 is a breeze and certainly no more difficult than fitting a AIO or custom waterblock.


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## urawzrd (Oct 22, 2020)

kapone32 said:


> I can vouch for the Eisbear, especially the Aurora . Unfortunately Alphacool is not popular in English on Youtube. Watch the KitGuru review of the Eisbear Aurora. You don't need to change the fans and with a little effort you can add your GPU. There is also the fact that the rad and CPU block are copper. I started with 1 Eisbear and now have a few Alphacool products.



What cpu you paired with it? Mind sharing temps of any overclocking that you may have? Trying to get a rough comparison of that with the EK AIO, swiftech etc


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## kapone32 (Oct 22, 2020)

urawzrd said:


> What cpu you paired with it? Mind sharing temps of any overclocking that you may have? Trying to get a rough comparison of that with the EK AIO, swiftech etc


I started with a 1700 and then 2600 and none of those CPUs went past 45 C on load. My theory for OC Ryzen is try to get all cores within 100 MHZ of the boost so the 1700 was 4.0 GHZ @ 1.25 V and the 2600 was 4.2 GHZ@ 1.25 V. The idle would usually be  2 or 3 degrees above ambient. The best thing about using a 360 RAD (I have a 420) is you don't have to run your fans at high RPMs as an example I used Noctua Redux and those would run at around 650 RPM (300-1700 RPM)  which means you can't even hear them. I tried to use the Eisbear with my TR4 setup but because it did not cover the entire IHS it didn`t work well. I ordered a block and ended up using a GPU block with a pump installed on the block. I was able to use the rad (420) to cool the CPU and GPU but I added an Eisstation to improve flow and volume (and another Vega 64). The Eisbear Aurora has been reviewed by KitGuru and it is near the top  in their charts. If you are conflicted look at the price and reliability history of this vs the EK but I do know that Alphacool rads are very high quality. The best thing though is the Alphacool is G1/4 so you can easily expand this to RAM, NVME, those cool new rectangular reservoirs and GPU(s).


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## freeagent (Oct 22, 2020)

Th3pwn3r said:


> I didn't even know Thermalright was still in business.  Do you have any proof of your claim? If that's true I may recommend it to my cousin who is about to do a build and may not want an AIO.
> 
> Anyhow, the big reasons to stay away from AIOs are if you're worried about failure, leaks, pump wine or things of that sort. AIOs have come a long way and usually outperform air coolers easily and for less money. The Arctic 280mm AIO is $100 give or take and will beat the brakes off of just about anything else performance per dollar.



Probably not the kind you are looking for.. but still informative.









						Cooling - Thermalright's TRUE Spirit 140 "Power" - New Air Cooling King?  Mini Review
					

Introduction  I've been wanting to write a comparative review for some time now and I hope that this will be of use to some of you.  With so many AIO...




					forums.bit-tech.net
				




I have both True Spirit 140 Power and Le Grand Macho RT, and the both perform similarly. TPU has one on LGMRT, they have a TS140D in that review, I would avoid that cooler personally.









						Thermalright Le Grand Macho RT Review
					

Thermalright's Le Grand Macho RT is massive in size, weighing in at 1060g with the fan. Capable of being used passively, it offers users a near-silent operation and top-tier performance when paired with the TY-147B fan. The competition should take note as Thermalright looks to steal the...




					www.techpowerup.com
				




Steve at GN is one of the few toobers that I watch, hes a good kid.


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## dgianstefani (Oct 22, 2020)

skip the AIO trash. 

Get a optimus WB and a good pump/reservoir combo, singularity computers makes good ones. Get a full copper rad and done.


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## Beertintedgoggles (Oct 22, 2020)

Th3pwn3r said:


> Because you lack knowledge. For starters COMPATIBILITY, those huge air coolers can really block ram among other things, then there's the sag that does/can/might happen over time. That's the scary one, I have a D15 installed and I should learn how to post pictures because that thing is sagging like a lead GPU would. *There's also something called heat transfer/heat soak to consider.*



I wonder if you even know what that means.....  Having a higher "heat soak" means it will take the system (in this case the system is the cpu/cooler) longer to reach it's maximum temperature.  It doesn't mean it will cool any better.  A block of copper has a high heat soak value compared to an aluminum heat-pipe cooler but the heat-pipe cooler will typically have a lower maximum temperature due to a higher surface area.  Water cooling has such a high heat soak value do to the heat capacity of water.  However, if you run folding@home 24/7 that won't matter.  The maximum temperature is what matters.  I'm always surprised when people think that just because your heat transfer medium is water that it will magically work so well.  News flash, the radiator is what dissipates the heat and that is still a metal/air boundary.   The benefit of a higher heat soak is that the thermal spikes will be attenuated (the temp will rise slower but if you keep the applied load constant it will eventually reach its maximum).  The benefit of water:  smaller instantaneous changes in temp, the ability to move your heat dissipation (radiator) outside of the case or in a spot where it is directly exhausted, and on custom loops the ability to add more surface area with larger or more radiators.  The down side:  possible leaks, corrosion, pump noise (heat-pipes are silent and both require fans unless running passive radiators which can apply to both), etc.  And before you accuse me of lacking knowledge, I was running water back when we used heater cores and aquarium pumps.  Sorry for the rant but accusing others of lacking knowledge then being unable to upload a picture??? Hello hypocrisy.


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## kapone32 (Oct 22, 2020)

dgianstefani said:


> skip the AIO trash.
> 
> Get a optimus WB and a good pump/reservoir combo, singularity computers makes good ones. Get a full copper rad and done.


Or buy the Alphacool Eisbear which is basically the same thing.


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## John Naylor (Oct 22, 2020)

xkm1948 said:


> $50 air cooler > any 240 or 360 AIO? Care to back up your claim with our own TPU reviews?



Of course ... care to apologize after ?

First if you are going to attempt to criticize, at least quote the post correctly  ... skip the fraudulent fake quote where ya have to change what was actually said in order to try and make an argument that can't be made in face of the data.

Here's what was actually stated:

"A $50 air cooler will outperform *almost every* 2 x 120 AIO and *many* 3 x 120s on the market."

I should have clarified that I was only refering to CLC type coolers.... but I'll live with what I wrote.  

Second, Cooler performance includes cooling performance and noise.

Third, you have to be able to actually buy them



			https://tpucdn.com/review/scythe-fuma-2-dual-tower-cpu-cooler/images/temp_oc_aida64.png
		

AIDA 64 on OC'd CPU
-Scythe Fuma 2 = 80C / 40 dbA

First the outright losers that get beat in both categories

-ID Cooling Zoomflow 240 = 83C / 52 dba
-ID Cooling Auraflow 240 = 83C / 49 dba
-ID Cooling Dashflow 360 = 83C / 48 dba
-Coolermaster ML240 = 82C/ 42 dbA
-Silentium PC Navis EVO = 81C / 45 dbA
-Deepcool Captain 240 pro = 81C / 48 dbA

Now the ones that tie for temps , but lose in the noise category ... noise is the tiebreaker so the CLC AIos lose

Corsair 150i Pro = 80C / 43 dbA
Deepcool Castle 360 EX = 80C / 46 dbA

*That's 8 clear and uncontested wins*

Now the ones that split victories ....win in temps but lose in the noise category.   Every CLC cooler on the list, that beats the Scythe in Temps, loses in noise.  So what constitutes a win ?  

-H240 X3= 79C / 46 dbA ... 1C for 1.52 times as loud ... Air Cooler FTW and at aoir is 35% of the price
-Aerocool P7 L240 = 79C / 44 dbA ... 1C for 1.32 times as loud ... Air Cooler FTW ... not a available and was 40% of the price
-Alphacool Eisbaer LT240 = 79C / 46 dbA ... 1C for 1.52 times as loud ... Air Cooler FTW at 50% of the price
-Alphacool Eisbaer Extreme = 79C / 41 dbA ... 1C for for 1 dbA ... finally a competitive product ... not a win, but a tie and unavailable to buy ... the smaller 280 is 4-5 times the price
-Corsair 100i Pro = 79C / 53 dbA ... a measly 1C and 2.5 freakin' times as loud ... need 30 foot KB, mouse and monitor cables for that one ... Air Cooler with huge beatdown.  Not worth it if free
-Fractal Design Celsius = 78C / 45 dbA  ... At 2C almost significant, but not worth being 1.41 times as loud ... Air Cooler FTW at 47% of the price
-Reeven NAIA 240 = 78C / 47 dbA  ... Again, 2C almost significant, but not worth being 1.62 times as loud ... Air Cooler FTW ... half the price and CLC is unavailable, was
-Swiftech H360 = 78C / 47 dbA  ... Again, 2C almost significant, but not worth being 1.62 times as loud ... Air Cooler FTW ... at AC is 1/3 the price
-EK MLC Phoenix 360 = 75C / 51 dbA ... Finally a significant advantage in cooling over the air cooler ... but again hampered by the fact that it's hard to sit in the same room with something that is 2.14 times as loud.

So, in summary .....

1.  The single review doesn't include the entire market and what is here, includes most of the better performing AIOs .... The rest of the Corsair line for example gets wiped.  So the statement that *most* 240s and *many* *360s* can't measure up has been satisfied.

2.  The air cooler has 8 uncontested wins where it tied or beat the AIOs in temp performance and won the noise performance categories.  We have a big fat 0 uncontested wins for the AIOs as no AIO has ever outperformed the air cooler.

3.  The only AIO that was competitive in both categories was the Alphacool Eisbaer Extreme.  If you want to argue that 1C counts more than 1 dbA . Id have to say "let's agree to disagree", but that still doesn't invalidate the statement that the air cooler outperforms *many* 360s ... the data above clearly shows that it does.


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## bonehead123 (Oct 22, 2020)

maybe try a few of these, hahahaha 






Only ~$10 each.....


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## kapone32 (Oct 22, 2020)

"-Alphacool Eisbaer Extreme = 79C / 41 dbA ... 1C for for 1 dbA ... finally a competitive product ... not a win, but a tie and unavailable to buy ... the smaller 280 is 4-5 times the price"

Hasn't this been replaced by the Aurora? Where AIOs differentiate from Air coolers is much more than just flat out performance. 

AIO Pro:

1. They have a much smaller socket foot print than Air Coolers. If you have a X299 or X399 board it makes installing quad channel RAM much easier. If you have a Mini ITX or Micro ATX board an AIO is some cases a no brainer.
2. They can be configured to be much quieter at the same temps as an Air cooler.
3. They put little gravitational stress in vertically mounted boards.
4. They don't interfere with fan headers around the CPU socket. Some boards even have 2 4 Pin headers between the socket and the I/O. Install your air cooler before you mount the board and you may rue that.
5. If you get the right one there is potential for expansion into GPU+ Water cooling.
6. Subjectively some AIO heads are just beautifully illuminated.
7. They add to the overall airflow in your case. If configured properly.

Cons:

1. In some cases you are relegated to an Asetek based unit, that is what you are referencing.
2. The generally cost more than an air cooler.
3. The potential for failure is higher.
4. The fans on some can be less than desirable.
5. Any AIO is based on the pump and all pumps must fail at some point.

Air cooler 

Pros:

1. Excellent reliability as only the fans can fail
2. Excellent selection of variety and price
3. Don't use any extra power 
4. Can add to the overall airflow directed at the back of the case.
5. Does not require 2 fan headers to operate
6. Can add extra cooling to your VRM.

Cons:

1. Can be a real pain in the butt to install
2. No expandable options
3. Are more dependant on the quality of the fan(s)
4. Are more fraught with bad options than AIOs regardless of cost.
5. Have a much bigger socket footprint making them less than desirable on HEDT with double RAM slots.
6. Are very much specified for Mini-Itx or Micro ATX cases.

At the end of the day there is nothing wrong with either selection. The fact that there was a time when there were no cases that supported anything other than a 120/140 rad. It is true that a good (Noctua DH14) Air cooler can rival any AIO but the industry has obviously adopted AIOs so even though you may have problems with AIO based cooling applications they are here to stay. I just wish 280MM AIOs had more selection.


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## jesdals (Oct 22, 2020)

The Artic Liquid Freezer II 280 or 360 would be my go to - cheap, easy to install (if you have 3 arms or wits) and cools empressive in front mounts. Installed the 360 in the Lian Li Lancool 2 in the front on a MSI Mortar Max with a 3600X enabling 1900MHz Infinity settings and my nephew installed the 280 in a Phanteks phanteks p350x on a MSI Tomahawk b450 board, in the front enabling boost clock above 4500MHz on his 3800x and both systems with low 60´s c. And was impressed by the low sound from the fans


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## urawzrd (Oct 24, 2020)

Thanks for all the feedback.. but overall which AIO would you guys recommend for any overclocked zen3 system?


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## dont whant to set it"' (Oct 24, 2020)

1st : make sure it's compatible.
2nd : it may be super ok with the boxed cooler ( for the 65W parts) and here I add from first hand experience with my 3300x + wraith spire , all-core oc at 4.3GHz @ 1.2V to 1.225V set in Bios with untouched fan profile (standard setting).

 It boils down to what is it that you want to do. 
Are you mind set on getting an above average quality cooler that performs great whilest it's close to inaudible unless you lean a ear towards it and taking it from there with oc'ing the chip?

There's a point with zen2 CPU's that no matter what cooling you have, be it of the shelf air or aio from wich the chip gets so hot in an instant that the sistem crashes when applying full cpu utilization.
I've seen mine via temperature sensors jump 35 degrees C one second into the full cpu test and then over 50 degrees C by the 3rd second @  4.55GHz | 1.4375V ultimately crashing because it gets so hot in virtually an instant and this was with a Prolimatech Megahalems all available fans maxed out.


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## oxrufiioxo (Oct 24, 2020)

urawzrd said:


> Thanks for all the feedback.. but overall which AIO would you guys recommend for any overclocked zen3 system?




Hard to say given nobody on this forum has a zen 3 chip. It could behave identically to zen 2 or drastically different. 

As long as you go with a 280/360 you'll be fine.
I would either be grabbing the EK Aio or the corsair h150i elite personally. I really like the arctic coolers but their short warranty has them crossed off my list . 2 year warranty is pretty pathetic when you can get a 5 or 6 year warranty on competing aio.


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## Deleted member 203344 (Oct 24, 2020)

Paying close to $2000 for a GPU and almost $1000 for a CPU I personally would never risk potential water damage or thermal damage from an AIO .. everyone is entitled to their choices but thats my take on the issue .. happy to live with 3-5 degress difference for the peace of mind and not betting on a manufacturer of an AIO paying for damage to my PC internals as a result of failure of their product .. good luck with that .. to each their own .. when you consider the very little you gain with an AIO compared to a top shelf air cooler in tangible measured benefits the potential risks far outweigh the minimal gains.
Lets not get into points of failure .. if an air cooler drops a fan you replace it with another fan .. even a case fan until you can grab a better replacement and thats about it ... with an AIO a leak or a pump failure will result in a throwaway typically leaving some sort of damage and a PC thats unusable.


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## Zach_01 (Oct 24, 2020)

The fundamental “problem” with ZEN2/3 chiplet design is its thermal density. Having a really small area producing most of the heat that it is not even on the center of package can be an issue. 99,9% of the blocks (custom or AIO) are not designed for it.
Thankfully AMD solders IHS to die(s) and maximizes the heat transfer to it. Still the center of the heat source is off-center of IHS.

Another “issue” of ZEN2 is constant temp spikes of the cooling control temperature (Tctl/Tdie aka the HotSpot), and we really don’t know if this is the same with ZEN3. There is a high possibility.
Many air cooler users report constant fan rpm spikes and that can be annoying. This can be partially resolved by setting a custom fan rpm/temp curve but also with introducing a few seconds delay (3-5sec) fan response to CPU temp.
The ultimate control for these temp spikes is to have a water loop and set the fans to response to water temp, which I find to be the proper way of controlling the CPU temp. Temp spikes interval is rather quick and can’t heat (spike) the water temp. At least no more than 0.1~0.2C

I can’t suggest an AIO and which one. But just want to give some insight of Ryzen latest thermals. Intel (only) users can’t really offer that. What ever you choose just think also what thermal paste you are going to use. Fast heat transfer to cooler’s coldplate (air or water) can be beneficial for a chiplet design.
But to be honest the amount of money, time or/and effort that needed to invest for this does not reflect to an equal ROI. Far from it.
Personally, I don’t mind.

I started using the AIO on the Ryzen system with a paste (TIM) rated at 8.5W/mk thermal conductivity. After six months I switched to a TIM with almost a x10 the thermal conductivity and saw a 3-6C reduction depending the load situation.

I had the 280mm AIO from previous build with a CPU (Oced) ~200W or even more. The AIO already counts about 3.5 years of usage. Working always with low pump speed(noiseless) and low to medium fan speeds, with the best position that you can install a closed water loop, I expect it to last long.
Best position for best performance and integrity of AIO components. For these reasons I’m not really concerned about leaks but only pump failure at some point.
Monitoring water temp and keep it as low as possible (fan noise trade-off) minimizes the leak contingency because of the lower internal pressure. I’m monitoring and set alerts for water temp, pump rpm and CPU temps and I’m a lot more complacent that I will not damage CPU in case of pump failure.

Yes an AIO or a water loop in general is a far more complex cooling device that needs proper attention.
As I said before, personally I don’t mind the trouble, the time, the effort and/or the increased expenses and the attention. But this is just me.

A user should consider all the aspects of such a cooling device and what it’s usage implies.


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## Th3pwn3r (Oct 24, 2020)

FinneousPJ said:


> I thought I said "if you can fit it [in your case]", yes, and on your mobo. My D15 does not sag at all. Perhaps you have made an error installing or using it. As for performance, I already posted a chart showing it within 3% of a 360 mm AIO.
> 
> However, the sag discussion reminds me: if you're transferring your PC often, an AIO is probably your best option.


You said that but you totally discredit everything else with obvious bias. And it's not a matter of error during install. I think it has to do with the cooler being attached since those coolers were first created. I'd guess the setup is over 10 years old, maybe 15. Can't even recall but the board is a socket 775, it's so old it still has an IDE header lol. Hell, I never even mentioned noise but both air and water setups can get louder than one likes. In my posts I discuss pros and cons to both. In your posts you don't. 

I would like to say there's a video that Linus Tech Tips has where he shows a Noctua air cooler putting a lot of AIOs to shame but it also competed against a lot of 'junk' AIOs.


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## freeagent (Oct 24, 2020)

I had the first gen H100 back when they were new and I thought it was pretty decent too. Using a clocked X5690 on a good board with no real fear of volts as long as it was winter  With the stock fans it was "ok", was using a D14 prior.. and when I put real fans on, that made all the difference. I sold my D14 after that. But after a couple of years trying to tame that beastly CPU, performance started to taper off. That would have been the permeation I suppose. And then the pump noise.. don't got to get into that.. Anywhoo, back on air and haven't really looked back. I still push volts, still move air.. nothing different has changed from my AIO days, still using the same fans too, with some new comers. If you approach air and AIO cooling with some forethought, and are willing to experiment you can achieve similar results using both. I do prefer air though.. but can see the appeal, especially if tech has improved and things I mentioned are no longer a problem. I still like a lot of air moving over my components, even with AIO.

I  big fans


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## Kissamies (Oct 24, 2020)

Here in Finland Arctic Liquid Freezer II is a popular and highly recommended AIO, size depending on the case it's going to be installed.


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## kapone32 (Oct 26, 2020)

urawzrd said:


> Thanks for all the feedback.. but overall which AIO would you guys recommend for any overclocked zen3 system?


Arctic Freezer 240, 360 or Eisbear Aurora 280.


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## RandallFlagg (Oct 26, 2020)

kapone32 said:


> "-Alphacool Eisbaer Extreme = 79C / 41 dbA ... 1C for for 1 dbA ... finally a competitive product ... not a win, but a tie and unavailable to buy ... the smaller 280 is 4-5 times the price"
> 
> Hasn't this been replaced by the Aurora? Where AIOs differentiate from Air coolers is much more than just flat out performance.
> 
> ...



Nice factual response with references, pros/cons.

My biggest problem with air coolers that can effectively cool 125W+ TDP chips is what you mentioned => how massive they are.  

The Scythe 2 you note is $60 and has two fans, two towers, it's ridiculously big as many such air coolers are. As you noted, gravity becomes a thing in a tower or mini tower, especially 12, 24 months after initial install.  

I'd really like to see more 120mm AIO reviews.


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## kapone32 (Oct 26, 2020)

Chloe Price said:


> Here in Finland Arctic Liquid Freezer II is a popular and highly recommended AIO, size depending on the case it's going to be installed.


Thanks to Gamer's nexus that is actually one of the most expensive AIOs to buy in Canada.


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## Vya Domus (Oct 26, 2020)

kapone32 said:


> 6. Can add extra cooling to your VRM.



Not really, in fact they'll just create hotspots around that area making it even worse. You can set an AIO to exhaust all the heat completely out the case driving air temperatures in the case lower.


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## freeagent (Oct 26, 2020)

125w shouldn't be that big of a deal. Even a shitty 212 Evo is rated for something like 150w. A lot of those old Westmeres are 130w CPU's. Mind you they aren't running at 4700mhz either. I'm guessing that's where the heat comes from.


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## Verbatim (Oct 26, 2020)

View attachment 173380
[/QUOTE]
Scythe mugen


RandallFlagg said:


> Nice factual response with references, pros/cons.
> 
> My biggest problem with air coolers that can effectively cool 125W+ TDP chips is what you mentioned => how massive they are.
> 
> ...


Gelid Phantom is not as big especially with single 120mm fan installed and performs extremely well very close to NH-D15 wich is way bigger and costs ~ 2.5X more.

There are no AIO cooling in market that comes even close to it's P/P ratio. In terms of performance temp is about the same as 280mm/360mm AIO that costs ~ 3X/4X more.

Tested with Ryzen 3700X.

Nothing against AIO but it just doesn't perform for the money it costs.


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## DasherDarren (Jan 8, 2021)

Just use a Noctua NH-D15 it's very good.


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## dgianstefani (Jan 8, 2021)

Alphacool Eisbaer 240/360 or a Swiftech AIO.


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## kapone32 (Jan 8, 2021)

Verbatim said:


> View attachment 173380


Scythe mugen

Gelid Phantom is not as big especially with single 120mm fan installed and performs extremely well very close to NH-D15 wich is way bigger and costs ~ 2.5X more.

There are no AIO cooling in market that comes even close to it's P/P ratio. In terms of performance temp is about the same as 280mm/360mm AIO that costs ~ 3X/4X more.

Tested with Ryzen 3700X.

Nothing against AIO but it just doesn't perform for the money it costs.
[/QUOTE]
In an interesting time a DH15 costs just as much as a decent 280 or 360 AIO. My Nepton 280 would compete with it though and did not cost as much. The best thing about the DH15 is the performance but the worst thing about it the size. The Alphacool Eisbear Aurora 280 would be a pretty good choice. I am going to be ordering the block/reservoir unit when i am ready to upgrade my Threadripper build.


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## freeagent (Jan 8, 2021)

I was reading through a little bit.. I like how people compare AIO/CLC to 50 dollar air coolers and then call the cooler shit. Well yeah.. its a 50 dollar air cooler lol what did you expect?? Not exactly a fair fight.. D15 is ok.. but its only popular because its the only good cooler the masses know of, hence the most regurgitated name on the interwebz. I like its performance, but it blocks your ram.. so If you are like me and have multiple sets.. taking that fan off gets old pretty quick. I know that from my D14. good cooler, but a pain in the balls to use. Thermalright makes really good coolers too, but their marketing, distribution, and customer service are nearly non existent in North America. If I wasn't able to get a Thermalright, I would be running some kind of Noctua, or CLC. I almost bought a Noctua and Mugen over the holidays while waiting for my AM4 mount to come. Glad I didn't..


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