# Does anyone know what chips these muskins have?



## PaulieG (Mar 7, 2008)

http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146755



Anyone know for sure if these sticks are Micron D9's? If not, what are they?


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## PaulieG (Mar 7, 2008)

Anyone?


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## Hawk1 (Mar 7, 2008)

I dont think so. According to somone in the xtremesystems thread here, they are saying they are Powerchips. 

I'd love to be able to snag the box though (Europe only they were saying)


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## panchoman (Mar 7, 2008)

they should be micron d9gmh (b6-3) chips on a brainpower pcb if im not mistaken.


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## mrw1986 (Mar 7, 2008)

I believe Mushkin only uses Microns...correct me if I'm wrong please, which I probably am.

EDIT: I am wrong, they use Elpida, Promos, and Aeneon, but on very very few models. Rest are all Micron D9.

EDIT AGAIN: Pancho is right, they are Micron D9GMH (B6-3) on Brainpower PCB


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## ntdouglas (Mar 7, 2008)

mrw1986 said:


> I believe Mushkin only uses Microns...correct me if I'm wrong please, which I probably am.
> 
> EDIT: I am wrong, they use Elpida, Promos, and Aeneon, but on very very few models. Rest are all Micron D9.
> 
> EDIT AGAIN: Pancho is right, they are Micron D9GMH (B6-3) on Brainpower PCB



Are you guys for sure? Because with there latest ram, there not disclosing what drams there using.


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## Hawk1 (Mar 7, 2008)

ntdouglas said:


> Are you guys for sure? Because with there latest ram, there not disclosing what drams there using.



Exactly, I'm now reading a (traslated) German site and the guy also says, as in the extreme system thread (sorry for the poor google translate)


> I think the Power chips are consumed, which is why such a low price can be realized
> 
> Information on Power Chips!
> 
> ...



If you can decipher half that, my hats off to you. 

Link

Bottom line, that's two people saying they are/may be Powerchips. Since Mushkin has not said anything yet, I would hold off for confirmation, if D9's are your goal.


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## panchoman (Mar 7, 2008)

according to ramlist, most new muskin modules are all micron d9's on brainpower pcbs(allow higher voltage, etc. good thing to have). some of the older modules use aenon, etc. but the new ones are all d9's at this point.. if the model numbers not listed there (in this case it is) i'd check on a different site just in case.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 7, 2008)

I've written into Mushkin myself, and they have told me that they are not Micron chips but, they wouldn't tell me what type of chips they are... I asked four different questions and got a one sentence run on... 
I'm still waiting on them to reply to my reply. Also I've pm ketxxx to see if he could find out for me.... I'm wanting to buy a pair myself

Plus, it stated that it wasn't "power chip" but doesn't say what that is...


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## panchoman (Mar 7, 2008)

EDIT: NOT MICRON!!!! the newer version of this ram isn't micron anymore.. 

http://www.ocforums.com/showthread.php?t=545514

and apparently muskin wants to keep it a secret for a while..


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## Hawk1 (Mar 7, 2008)

panchoman said:


> according to ramlist, most new muskin modules are all micron d9's on brainpower pcbs(allow higher voltage, etc. good thing to have). some of the older modules use aenon, etc. but the new ones are all d9's at this point.. if the model numbers not listed there (in this case it is) i'd check on a different site just in case.



Got a link? The ramlist I'm looking at shows the 2x1GB model kit (996525) with the D9's. I don't see the new 2x2GB models listed (996593)

Edit: NVM, I'm slow on the replys


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## panchoman (Mar 7, 2008)

oh, my bad... was too lazy to look up the model number


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## PaulieG (Mar 7, 2008)

My guess is that it's Samsung high binned IC's. I'm not sure what the big secret though. Surely they wouldn't use less than the best in the Redline series. That would just be wrong...Then again OCZ has used power chips in their Reapers...


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## PaulieG (Mar 7, 2008)

I just emailed Mushkin about this. I hope they tell me what chips these are. I'm ok with high binned Samsung.


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## ntdouglas (Mar 7, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> I just emailed Mushkin about this. I hope they tell me what chips these are. I'm ok with high binned Samsung.




There not going to tell you what they use.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 7, 2008)

ntdouglas said:


> There not going to tell you what they use.



That is right, they will have a bot write you back and bull-sh1t you. It's all ready happened twice to me. A one line run on sentence that didn't get anything from.
I'm sorry to say but its the worst support service I've seen from a place so far.


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## ntdouglas (Mar 7, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> That is right, they will have a bot write you back and bull-sh1t you. It's all ready happened twice to me. A one line run on sentence that didn't get anything from.
> I'm sorry to say but its the worst support service I've seen from a place so far.




Like I said in another thread, something is going on over there. They really don't have anything for sale.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 7, 2008)

Yeah, your right there... The forum is great, but as of their service... I just hope its not like that when I buy my redlines.


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> That is right, they will have a bot write you back and bull-sh1t you. It's all ready happened twice to me. A one line run on sentence that didn't get anything from.
> I'm sorry to say but its the worst support service I've seen from a place so far.



Ok, I got 2 emails from them. One was obviously a bot response. Then I received the following:

"Hi,

Sorry but we stopped disclosing the chips used in out newer kits.  These
kits do very well on low voltage, being 2x2GB they are no using micron
d9's, but I would say the next best thing.


Mushkin Support".

What's this crap? Why not disclose? I want an answer. I did already order them, as I was reading that people in the mushkin forums did quite well with them on my MB. If they don't clock well, they are going back. Is it me, or are alot of brands moving away from D9's on their high end sticks? OCZ Reapers are Powerchip and this Redlines are anybody's guess...


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## EastCoasthandle (Mar 8, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> http://www.newegg.com/product/product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146755
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone know for sure if these sticks are Micron D9's? If not, what are they?



Check here
From the look of it they use Micron D9GMH (B6-3)  Brainpower PCB


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## KBD (Mar 8, 2008)

I was able to get an answer out Muskin in their forums when i was inquiring about a 2GB kit of DDR2-1066 XP series, first the guy told me the don't disclose then he says they are D9s. So yea, they are behaving kinda weird.


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

EastCoasthandle said:


> Check here
> From the look of it they use Micron D9GMH (B6-3)  Brainpower PCB



No, Mushkin did tell me this much. They are NOT D9's. He refered to them as "the next best thing". Anyone have an idea what the next best chips to D9's would be?


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

KBD said:


> I was able to get an answer out Muskin in their forums when i was inquiring about a 2GB kit of DDR2-1066 XP series, first the guy told me the don't disclose then he says they are D9s. So yea, they are behaving kinda weird.



I was told by Mushkin that they are not using D9's.


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## Dr. Spankenstein (Mar 8, 2008)

Those are different part numbers. 

I had Mushkin make me a set of (2x1GB) XP2-6400 and they were D9. But from a little snooping around it seems they have switched chips when they make their 2GB sticks.

I would not assume D9 for 2GB sticks from Mushkin. Not that what they put in is bad, they've ALWAYS used top notch chips. It just might not be the "volt-lovin'" D9s.

Don't know if this will influence you decision or not...


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## EastCoasthandle (Mar 8, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> No, Mushkin did tell me this much. They are NOT D9's. He refered to them as "the next best thing". Anyone have an idea what the next best chips to D9's would be?



There is no such thing using DDR2 that I know of.  The next cheapest alternative that behaves similar to D9 are PSC variant.


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## KBD (Mar 8, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> I was told by Mushkin that they are not using D9's.



No, you misunderstand, i wasnt talking about redlines you asked about, i was asking them about XP series DDR2-1066 RAM that are D9, i just posted that as an example of their weirdness, first they say they don't disclose, then the guy tells me they are D9


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

Dr. Spankenstein said:


> Those are different part numbers.
> 
> I had Mushkin make me a set of (2x1GB) XP2-6400 and they were D9. But from a little snooping around it seems they have switched chips when they make their 2GB sticks.
> 
> ...



Yeah, I read those post. I'm still puzzled why know one has been able to find out what exactly these chips are...I've spend hours searching google/forums.


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

KBD said:


> No, you misunderstand, i wasnt talking about redlines you asked about, i was asking them about XP series DDR2-1066 RAM that are D9, i just posted that as an example of their weirdness, first they say they don't disclose, then the guy tells me they are D9



I'm guessing it all depends on the rep you're talking to. I'm going to keep bothering them. I don't understand why they want to keep it secret. It just defies logic to me. Well, I will have the sticks on monday, and I can't wait to see how they perform.


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## KBD (Mar 8, 2008)

If it is any help, i was talking to Greg in their forums, very nice guy, very helpful.


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## ntdouglas (Mar 8, 2008)

KBD said:


> If it is any help, i was talking to Greg in their forums, very nice guy, very helpful.





Greg is awesome. I've got over 200 posts  there.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 8, 2008)

I've went everywhere, talked to both a bot and a real person now, and then to the forums, and its not d'9s but a new chip. They want to be hush hush so they can get more then the redlines on it. I'm going to be buying the set because Its not like the real person pushed me away from it. 
I just wish they where able to say. But time will tell


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> I've went everywhere, talked to both a bot and a real person now, and then to the forums, and its not d'9s but a new chip. They want to be hush hush so they can get more then the redlines on it. I'm going to be buying the set because Its not like the real person pushed me away from it.
> I just wish they where able to say. But time will tell



Well, I think the secrecy is retarded. I sent a detailed pm to Greg, the Mushkin support site admin, requesting more information. I'm hoping he'll be willing to talk.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 8, 2008)

yeah, I sent a pm to ketxxx about it also. He use to work for Mushkin so I'm hoping to hear from him also.


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> yeah, I sent a pm to ketxxx about it also. He use to work for Mushkin so I'm hoping to hear from him also.



Here is my thread over at Mushkin, just in case you want to follow it..
http://forums.mushkin.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?p=39354#39354


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## Cold Storm (Mar 8, 2008)

Yeah I will watch that thread. I thank you paulieg and hope we can find out soon what it is!


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## WarEagleAU (Mar 8, 2008)

Them Samsung, Infineon and Hynix chips are pretty awesome as well though, just not so much as them Microns. Im shocked to see how many other ic makers there are and how some of these so called uber modules dont use micron d9s. Hell, one of Crucials rams may use a different ic, but thats the only one.


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## KBD (Mar 8, 2008)

I think thats the case cause Micron owns Crucial, so they get the better chips.


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

The policy came in place after our d9 based 2x2GB last year, chips got found out, our supply got hurt and thats when the policy started.

Sorry about this, but next best thing to d9's would be the best I can say.  This kit does very well on low voltage, better then my 2x2GB d9 based kit, but under high voltage 2.3v+ the d9's do reach better speeds.


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## calvary1980 (Mar 8, 2008)

so the mushkin redlines don't use micron d9 anymore or ever did? because according to this they did and I know in order to submit a memory entry to this site you need a photo. 

PC2-8000 XP2 REDLINE 4.0-5-4-11 @ 2.2 ~ 2.35V Micron D9GMH (B6-3) Brainpower PCB
991525 / 996525

- Christine


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

Bad policy is all I can say.  Hurt supply? I would think that sales would be a good thing. I think I might just send them back when I receive them.


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## calvary1980 (Mar 8, 2008)

I guess Mark can stop sweating, he doesn't have to turn trix 4 redlines lol.

- Christine


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

calvary1980 said:


> so the mushkin redlines don't use micron d9 anymore or ever did? because according to this they did and I know in order to submit a memory entry to this site you need a photo.
> 
> PC2-8000 XP2 REDLINE 4.0-5-4-11 @ 2.2 ~ 2.35V Micron D9GMH (B6-3) Brainpower PCB
> 991525 / 996525
> ...



The redline 2x1GB does use d9's, thats well know and will not change, without a model # change.

Our XP2-6400 -XP-9200 512MB/1GB sticks are d9's, which I can say cause its well know.

All our current 2GB sticks, are not.


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## PaulieG (Mar 8, 2008)

gdogg said:


> The policy came in place after our d9 based 2x2GB last year, chips got found out, our supply got hurt and thats when the policy started.
> 
> Sorry about this, but next best thing to d9's would be the best I can say.  This kit does very well on low voltage, better then my 2x2GB d9 based kit, but under high voltage 2.3v+ the d9's do reach better speeds.



Greg, I just read your post at Mushkin. I guess I could understand if you guys didn't disclose the specific chip. The least you guys could say who manufactures them.


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> Bad policy is all I can say.  Hurt supply? I would think that sales would be a good thing. I think I might just send them back when I receive them.



Last year we were the first to release a PC2-8500 2x2GB kit, along with XP2-6400 2x2GB and HP2-6400 2x2GB.

We had many asking us which chips were used, and eventually competition purchased the remaining of the chips we were using in these kits.

This is why the policy is being enforced, our chips are also being relabel now also.


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## calvary1980 (Mar 8, 2008)

didn't even know mushkin made 2x2 redlines. you mean relabel like this? http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/3137/imageviewbt3.jpg

- Christine


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

calvary1980 said:


> didn't even know mushkin made 2x2 redlines. you mean relabel like this? http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/3137/imageviewbt3.jpg
> 
> - Christine



Yup exactly like that.


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## calvary1980 (Mar 8, 2008)

thanks for the info, definitely can't be cheaper to relabel. congratulations on your entrance to the graphics card market.

- Christine


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## Cold Storm (Mar 8, 2008)

Well, thank you Greg for letting us know more. It gives me more likes to want to get these chips. I was talking with Sneeky about going 4gbs, and he and Namslas showed me them. I do have to say they are great looking, and the reviews show nothing but greatness.


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

calvary1980 said:


> thanks for the info, definitely can't be cheaper to relabel. congratulations on your entrance to the graphics card market.
> 
> - Christine



Thanks, our gpu's for version 1 of our 8800GT in eu has been doing well.  Version 2 we hope to bring to north america


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> Well, thank you Greg for letting us know more. It gives me more likes to want to get these chips. I was talking with Sneeky about going 4gbs, and he and Namslas showed me them. I do have to say they are great looking, and the reviews show nothing but greatness.



Ya, I have seen the same, with the price I have been wanting to grab one since release.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 8, 2008)

gdogg said:


> Ya, I have seen the same, with the price I have been wanting to grab one since release.



Beginning of next month I should be able to snag a kit up. Will look nice with my Blood Iron board! To bad the cooler overs the red. 
Thanks again


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## sneekypeet (Mar 8, 2008)

gdogg said:


> The policy came in place after our d9 based 2x2GB last year, chips got found out, our supply got hurt and thats when the policy started.
> 
> Sorry about this, but next best thing to d9's would be the best I can say.  This kit does very well on low voltage, better then my 2x2GB d9 based kit, but under high voltage 2.3v+ the d9's do reach better speeds.



so previous sets of 2X2GB were good stix , then the stock of these "magic" IC's were bought, now the stix perform well on less voltage but dont clock for poop?

Did I understand this statement correctly?

Seems to me what you are saying is that Mushkin is selling so-so ram and labling as Redline to gain sales on a previously built up name!


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## calvary1980 (Mar 8, 2008)

forget redlines I think the next time Mushkin has a tent at an event they should hire some of those european models and send some my way  i'll buy Mushkin for the rest of my life 

+1 sneeky

- Christine


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

sneekypeet said:


> so previous sets of 2X2GB were good stix , then the stock of these magic IC's were bought, now the stix perform well on less voltage but dont clock for poop?
> 
> Did I understand this statement correctly?
> 
> Seems to me what you are saying is that Mushkin is selling so-so ram and labling as Redline to gain sales on a previously built up name!



What it was, our 2x2GB kits from last year, have all been discontinued for about 7 months now.  They did very well with increased voltage.

Our new 2x2GB kits , do very well with low voltage (better then i've seen d9's every do personally).  But will not scale much higher, the more voltage you pump into it. (2.1v is about were it stops getting gains from voltage)


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## sneekypeet (Mar 8, 2008)

so then there is an obvious cap on this newer release of 2X2GB kits that the D9's could overcome with voltage?


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

sneekypeet said:


> so then there is an obvious cap on this newer release of 2X2GB kits that the D9's could overcome with voltage?



Just different chips, react differently.

Being as these have done 1100Mhz 1.9v for edlonko in the review he did in our official forums and many reach same or better speeds then him.

But he also only gained 8Mhz from 2.1v 1108Mhz .


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## sneekypeet (Mar 8, 2008)

Ahh I get ya now....so it will OC somewhat just that you cant get Volts to solve the issues with this ram, as it wont respond to the same voltage D9's will.

Impressive ...1100MHz for a 2GB stick, but I think I speak for a few of us here ,  we expect more...lol


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## EastCoasthandle (Mar 8, 2008)

gdogg said:


> The policy came in place after our d9 based 2x2GB last year, chips got found out, our supply got hurt and thats when the policy started.
> 
> Sorry about this, but next best thing to d9's would be the best I can say.  This kit does very well on low voltage, better then my 2x2GB d9 based kit, but under high voltage 2.3v+ the d9's do reach better speeds.



Are you using PSCs?  Most 2x2048 kit's I've seen so far use PSC ICs.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 8, 2008)

gdogg said:


> Just different chips, react differently.
> 
> Being as these have done 1100Mhz 1.9v for edlonko in the review he did in our official forums and many reach same or better speeds then him.
> 
> But he also only gained 8Mhz from 2.1v 1108Mhz .



Yeah, it was his review that made me want them. I want a kit to where I can get 1100mhz. Keep it at where its at on my board.


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## Greg0101 (Mar 8, 2008)

EastCoasthandle said:


> Are you using PSCs?  Most 2x2048 kit's I've seen so far use PSC ICs.



We do use powerchip in alot of our EU kits.


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## EastCoasthandle (Mar 8, 2008)

gdogg said:


> We do use powerchip in alot of our EU kits.



Couldn't we take that as a hint...


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## PaulieG (Mar 9, 2008)

EastCoasthandle said:


> Couldn't we take that as a hint...



Hey guys, after giving it some thought, I think we need to stop digging for more information. I think it was nice of Greg to chime in, and he did clarify some things. I will get my Redlines on Monday, and will reserve judgement on these "mystery chips" until then. It still frustrates me, but I'm guessing that all of the manufacturers are going to start keeping these secrets to fend off the competition.


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## sneekypeet (Mar 9, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> Hey guys, after giving it some thought, I think we need to stop digging for more information. I think it was nice of Greg to chime in, and he did clarify some things. I will get my Redlines on Monday, and will reserve judgement on these "mystery chips" until then.



If we stop digging how will we ever know?


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## PaulieG (Mar 9, 2008)

sneekypeet said:


> If we stop digging how will we ever know?



Well, digging at Greg on this thread. We'd like him to come back...


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## Cold Storm (Mar 9, 2008)

I'm stopping. I'll be getting a stick, and waiting for yours and what you chime in with on Mondayish Tuesday.


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## PaulieG (Mar 9, 2008)

Cold Storm said:


> I'm stopping. I'll be getting a stick, and waiting for yours and what you chime in with on Mondayish Tuesday.



As soon as I get them installed and play with 'em a little, I'll start another thread with the results.


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## Hawk1 (Mar 9, 2008)

Paulieg said:


> As soon as I get them installed and play with 'em a little, I'll start another thread with the results.



Thanks, I'll be interested in the results as well. I've been considering 2x2 sticks, and these are looking nice.


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## Cold Storm (Mar 9, 2008)

sounds sweet. And I'm happy to know that I'm not the only one thinking the sticks will be a good buy. I just hope I wasn't wrong with wanting them also.


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## PaulieG (Mar 9, 2008)

Maybe we can get Greg to help out with setting etc. I'll work on it.


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## WarEagleAU (Mar 9, 2008)

So in order to achieve better memory speeds, you have to increase your voltage, is that what you are saying?


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## Dr. Spankenstein (Mar 9, 2008)

Nope. It's about tweaking the timings. They've shown that these chips don't respond to voltage like D9s do.

Fast, but not the Mushkin fast I've grown accustomed to.


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## WarEagleAU (Mar 9, 2008)

I see now. I thought when I posted it was the last page, I didnt know this had a 3rd


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## Mushkin Mike (Mar 9, 2008)

Hi paulieg and all 
Just want to give you a heads up that if any of you are using a Maximus formula for testing these stick, you will need to do a bios update to achieve more overclocking potential. 
Bios 1003 and 1004 can be found and XS forums i believe.
What it does is open up tRFC options which have proven to be one of the keys to 2x2 overclocking, the new bios also really opes up the redlines.
I personally have a Maximus myself so just thought i would share the info with you fine folk here.

Link for the 1004 bios:
http://rapidshare.com/files/97357451/MF1004.zip


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## Wile E (Mar 9, 2008)

Mushkin Mike said:


> Hi paulieg and all
> Just want to give you a heads up that if any of you are using a Maximus formula for testing these stick, you will need to do a bios update to achieve more overclocking potential.
> Bios 1003 and 1004 can be found and XS forums i believe.
> What it does is open up tRFC options which have proven to be one of the keys to 2x2 overclocking, the new bios also really opes up the redlines.
> ...


How stable is that BIOS for you?

And do you guys have any 2GB sticks that will do 1300MHz on 2.3V or less?


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## Mushkin Mike (Mar 9, 2008)

Hi there, I actually just flashed my bios today and am still in the works of test my Redlines,Hp2 and XP2 sticks.

As for overclockability i can not really guarantee anything, but with the right hardware those Redlines reach some great speeds. 


Please also note that exceeding the max advertised voltages will void your warranty,


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## hat (Mar 9, 2008)

mrw1986 said:


> I believe Mushkin only uses Microns...correct me if I'm wrong please, which I probably am.
> 
> EDIT: I am wrong, they use Elpida, Promos, and Aeneon, but on very very few models. Rest are all Micron D9.
> 
> EDIT AGAIN: Pancho is right, they are Micron D9GMH (B6-3) on Brainpower PCB



Sounds about right. I know Crucial so I only buy Crucial. Great prices too. These Crucials were free, DDR2 533 4-4-4-12, no heatspreader, but Samsung chips. But they are Crucial's bottom of the barrel memories... all of Crucial's Ballistix, Tracer, and Lanfest are Micron D9's. Except for DDR1 and maybe DDR3 (I have a hunch DDR3 is just DDR2 with high latencies sacraficed for high MHz, it's even the same package type... 240 pin...) I had some Ballistix DDR1 but it sure as hell wasn't D9's, they're DDR2 chips.


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## Greg0101 (Mar 9, 2008)

Hey, Paulieg , I just sent you the timings you asked for.

Mushkin Mike , the XP2-8500 2x2GB is actually an EU only kit, sorry think I forgot to tell you.


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