# Norton buying Avast... ugh



## trparky (Aug 12, 2021)

Norton is buying Avast Antivirus. Needless to say, I won't use anything that's even remotely connected to that garbage software company (Norton).

Any suggestions as a replacement?


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## moproblems99 (Aug 12, 2021)

Avast has been trash for ages.  Just use Defender.


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## 95Viper (Aug 12, 2021)

The best Windows antivirus software for home users - AV-TEST - The Independent IT-Security Institute

I, personally, use Defender on most... I, also, use Vipre on some desktops, as, I have a couple of Lifetime Licenses.


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## Chomiq (Aug 12, 2021)

It's like super cancer.


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## Bill_Bright (Aug 12, 2021)

I agree with moproblems99. Microsoft Defender (formally Windows Defender) works great as long as you keep it current - the same requirement regardless your security solution.

That said, regardless our primary security solution of choice, we all should have a secondary security scanner on hand for double checking. I typically use and recommend Malwarebytes for that. In all the years I have used Microsoft Defender (including its sibling, Microsoft Security Essentials on W7) Malwarebytes has never, not once found anything Defender let slip by, except a couple "wanted" PUPs (potentially unwanted programs).

Norton, BTW, is an excellent security program. The problem is, it is a rip-off, at least in my opinion. It cost money to buy and then you have to pay and pay again to keep renewing it. And why when there are several effective free program out there, including the one already built into Windows? My other issue with Norton is their scare and intimidation tactics they use on people (especially new users at the end of their free trial periods) to get them to purchase or renew the product. I find it disgraceful, at best.

As far as Avast, Norton has a long history of buying competing products, taking their technologies (if any) then discontinuing that product. So I am going to assume before long, Avast will become a thing of the past.


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## trparky (Aug 12, 2021)

Bill_Bright said:


> Norton, BTW, is an excellent security program.


I'd beg to differ; their software is like a boat anchor. It can drag even the most powerful machine to its knees. Over bloated crap, that's what Norton is.

I'd like a software-based firewall (which Avast did offer) to be able to monitor and block any outgoing connections but unfortunately this is where the Windows Firewall is seriously lacking.


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## Splinterdog (Aug 12, 2021)

Norton is simply bloatware nowadays. The amount of laptops and PCs that come in for repair that almost grind to a shuddering halt when booted up is remarkable. Most of my customers don't even realise this, so if they're not paying for it, I advise them to get rid asap.
Wherever possible I only use Defender and not even Malwarebytes because that too has become a pain in the neck.


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## BlackSun59 (Aug 12, 2021)

I've been using Avast free for over 10 years and it's worked beautifully for me. I will wait and see what happens. If Norton F's it up, I'll use something else.
UPDATE: I was going to consider using Avira if Avast gets messed up, but Norton already bought them, too, last year.


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## Bill_Bright (Aug 12, 2021)

trparky said:


> I'd beg to differ; their software is like a boat anchor. It can drag even the most powerful machine to its knees. Over bloated crap, that's what Norton is.


I am not disputing that. In fact, I totally agree. Norton, for years, has been the very definition of "bloatware". And IMO McAfee is right up there with it. 

Perhaps I should have been more clear when I said it was an excellent "security" program. 

What I guess I should have said is that it is excellent at keeping systems secure and free of malware. Because it is! 

But the fact is, most, if not all of the popular security programs are more than adequate at keeping our computers free from infection and exploitation by the bad guys AS LONG AS they are kept current. 

So while I personally use and recommend Microsoft Defender, I really don't care as long as users use a decent program, keep it and their OS current, and they are not "click-happy" on every unsolicited link they see. 



Splinterdog said:


> Wherever possible I only use Defender and not even Malwarebytes because that too has become a pain in the neck.



I've not had any pain in the neck problems with Malwarebytes so can't speak to that. I have the Premium version on this machine only because many years ago, they had a "too good to pass up" offer on a "lifetime" license, before they discontinued selling lifetime licenses.  So I still take advantage of it. But on my other systems, I use the free version for double checking and again, Defender has never let anything unwanted or malicious slip by.  Note the free version is "on demand" only. It does not have a "real-time" scanner component. The Premium version does. 

BTW, one thing I've found to be really nice about Malwarebytes Premium is it plays real well together with Microsoft Defender. It does not cause conflicts or hog resources.  So if you want to use both at the same time, no problems. You just have to go into Malwarebytes control panel, and in Settings > Security, make sure the toggle for "Always register Malwarebytes in the Windows Security Center" is set to off. If you don't do this, Defender will gracefully step out of the way and disable its real-time component, leaving only Malwarebytes running full time.


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## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Aug 12, 2021)

What about Kasbersky internet security ?

i'v been using it for a long time, and its among the top scoring AV softwares.

Also, while i haven't used it, i heard good things about BitDefender.


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## Remeca (Aug 12, 2021)

Bill_Bright said:


> *So while I personally use and recommend Microsoft Defender*, I really don't care as long as users use a decent program, keep it and their OS current, and they are not "click-happy" on every unsolicited link they see.


Same, although yesterday I had the first false positive since I started using it, when trying to run userbenchmark. It refused to let me download the benchmark, until I forced it to ignore it. That process is easy enough though, so that's a bonus.


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## delshay (Aug 12, 2021)

Well I'm a long standing user of Norton & I can only say over the 15+ years I have never had a virus.


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## Audioave10 (Aug 12, 2021)

Only used Malwarebytes and Defender here with a hardware firewall in the router. Norton & McAfee were always bloatware to me.


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## Bill_Bright (Aug 12, 2021)

Well, all I can say about false positives is they are unavoidable. I've been lucky and Defender has never (yet) tagged one for me.

Regardless, false positives sure are better than false negatives! 



Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:


> What about Kasbersky internet security ?


If you can trust a company based in Russia, with its CEO a Russian oligarch billionaire who was trained by the KGB and is a friend of Putin, then sure, go ahead and put Kaspersky on your PCs. Me? Never. 

Don't believe all that? Google is your friend. 

Of course Kaspersky and Putin deny all that. You can trust Putin, right?

I have no doubts Kaspersky is fully capable of protecting your system from all malware (at least all malware not previously approved by the FSB).


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## trparky (Aug 12, 2021)

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to turn the built-in Windows Firewall into something actually useful?


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## Bill_Bright (Aug 12, 2021)

trparky said:


> Does anyone have any suggestions on how to turn the built-in Windows Firewall into something actually useful?


My suggestion is to just leave it alone. It works just fine with its default settings.


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## 95Viper (Aug 12, 2021)

Maybe, some of these reads will help:

How to Find and Use the Windows 10 Firewall

10 Best Free Firewall Programs

Windows Firewall Control - Managing Windows Firewall is now easier than ever
Program Overview


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## trparky (Aug 12, 2021)

Bill_Bright said:


> My suggestion is to just leave it alone. It works just fine with its default settings.


I kind of like outbound communication controls, I like to know what's trying to get access to the Internet on my system.


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## P4-630 (Aug 12, 2021)

Lol, we already use NortonLifeLock for some years now so for us likely there won't change much.


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## Deleted member 24505 (Aug 12, 2021)

Both turds, so i don't give a owl cry


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## Bill_Bright (Aug 12, 2021)

trparky said:


> I kind of like outbound communication controls, I like to know what's trying to get access to the Internet on my system.


Okay but that's totally different than suggesting Windows Firewall is not "useful". 

Suggesting it is not "useful", then saying you like outbound controls is like saying your automatic transmission in your car is not useful because you like to shift manually. 

WF is extremely effective at doing what a firewall is supposed to do. And while you can control outbound communications, it was never intended to be that flexible - say through a simple UI. Microsoft understands this so you can, if you chose, use a 3rd party FW if you prefer that type of "hands on" control. 

I personally have not seen a need for that type of control in many years, so I can't suggest an alternative.


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## Dr. Dro (Aug 12, 2021)

A wee bit OT, but just wondering if any of you fellas remember avast v4? It had a cool skin that looked like a car stereo, and unless my memory fails me now, it used about 8 MB of RAM. Those were the days...

I would suggest you try ESET NOD32, it used to be my favorite third-party AV after avast became increasingly bloated, with locked out features behind additional subscriptions even if you had a Premier sub like I used to. But honestly, Microsoft's built-in Defender is great and will work just fine if you need to have any sort of real-time, proactive security on your system.


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## silentbogo (Aug 12, 2021)

trparky said:


> Norton is buying Avast Antivirus.


It's a perfect match. Stopped using Norton over 15 years ago, and dropped Avast more than 10 years ago.
Both turned to obnoxious overweight dumpster trucks.


BlackSun59 said:


> I've been using Avast free for over 10 years and it's worked beautifully for me. I will wait and see what happens. If Norton F's it up, I'll use something else.


Probably got lucky, cause you ran it on hi-end hardware. Even paid version runs like trash on mid-to-low-end PCs and laptops. Just few days ago had to delete a preinstalled Avast on client's laptop (quite beefy Lenovo Legion), all due to complaints that the PC becomes laggy in Chrome or MS Office. Removal immediately cured all issues, and improved startup by 25sec. Not even gonna mention all the adware and upsell-nagging that comes with it.



Solid State Soul ( SSS ) said:


> What about Kasbersky internet security ?
> 
> i'v been using it for a long time, and its among the top scoring AV softwares.


It was good when it came out. Unfortunately due to political conflicts in my country it's Kaspersky labs is under sanctions.
Used a paid version for ~5 years, then switched to KAV free until it lasted (downloads were blocked in Ukraine around 2015, and updates were blocked 2 years later).



Bill_Bright said:


> If you can trust a company based in Russia, with its CEO a Russian oligarch billionaire who was trained by the KGB and is a friend of Putin, then sure, go ahead and put Kaspersky on your PCs. Me? Never.
> 
> Don't believe all that? Google is your friend.
> 
> ...


Dude, I live in Ukraine, and even with personal disgust towards Putin, I'm very-very skeptical of all of this ridiculous bullshit.
Mass media (_khm... Bloomberg again... khm-khm..._) likes to throw sensational headlines around, skew facts, or outright make shit up to get more sweet clicks and ad revenue.
1) Just because Eugene Kaspersky is a former intelligence officer does not make him automatically Putin's best friend. Just like going to the same post office as Pavel Nakonechnyy does not make me a prospective powerlifter. It's no secret that Putin likes to arrange occasional meetings with rich and/or powerful people which he can't control, like Eugene Kaspersky, or more recently - Vitalik Buterin, but reasons are completely opposite.
2) A story with stolen data was an embarrassing flop on NSA's side. What happened, is that some dude, who worked as a contractor at NSA, tried to steal a potent zero-day exploit, some tech docs and source code, in order to sell it on black market (allegedly). Since this was essentially a malware, and dude forgot to turn off automatic sample submission for unknown threats, KAV did exactly what it was supposed to - e.g. submit a sample of unknown malware for analysis. I don't see how this makes Kaspersky Labs bad guys. So, instead of running the story with a boring title of "NSA breached by a third-party sub-contractor.... again...." they intentionally twisted and turned into "Putin is spying on you!!!", because it was trendy at the time. What makes matters worse, is the continuation of this story, where dude disabled KAV, downloaded pirated MS Office and got hacked in the process, thus leaking all of that stuff to some randoes on the internet, before he even had a chance to sell it.  Of course, he claimed that he "accidentally" put it onto a flash drive, and then "accidentally" copied it to his home computer...  
3) I'm also 99% sure that this leaked NSA malware was a base for infamous RDP exploits that appeared in late 2017 - early 2018 and caused a bit of havoc all over the world.


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## windwhirl (Aug 12, 2021)

trparky said:


> I kind of like outbound communication controls, I like to know what's trying to get access to the Internet on my system.



Well, ESET does have a fully interactive mode for its firewall, in which you get asked about every in or outbound connection (of course, you also get the choice of making a rule to allow such connections in the future). I'm not sure if I want to recommend ESET. It's decent software, sure, but it's not quite at the level it used to be, at least if all those tests from AV-Comparatives and AV-Test are to be believed. Maybe other security software has a similar feature.


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## P4-630 (Aug 12, 2021)

trparky said:


> I like to know what's trying to get access to the Internet on my system.











						GlassWire - Personal Firewall & Network Monitor
					

GlassWire is a modern personal firewall and network monitor with over 32 million downloads. Download GlassWire free!




					www.glasswire.com


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## windwhirl (Aug 12, 2021)

P4-630 said:


> GlassWire - Personal Firewall & Network Monitor
> 
> 
> GlassWire is a modern personal firewall and network monitor with over 32 million downloads. Download GlassWire free!
> ...


Hmm, kinda want to try that, but it's not clear to me what the differences are between the free version and the paid ones.


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## P4-630 (Aug 12, 2021)

windwhirl said:


> Hmm, kinda want to try that, but it's not clear to me what the differences are between the free version and the paid ones.



I use the free version, I know with the paid version you can block any connection but I can do the blocking with norton.


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## lexluthermiester (Aug 12, 2021)

trparky said:


> Norton is buying Avast Antivirus. Needless to say, I won't use anything that's even remotely connected to that garbage software company (Norton).


One less-than-stellar company buying out another weak-sauce company. The world will hardly flinch..



trparky said:


> Any suggestions as a replacement?


Comodo. IMHO, they provide the best protection available. The AV/AM is excellent, the Firewall is second to none making microsoft's in-built effort look like amateur-hour and the HIPS app/program management utility provides fine-grained controls of any software that runs, or attempts to run, on a PC. This combination of features makes Comodo the clear choice for anyone serious about personal digital security. The Sandboxing feature is especially useful for apps/programs you're not sure you can trust. There is a learning curve(about an hour or two worth of time), but it's very much worth the effort.

The free version is exceptional.





						Best Internet Security Software 2022 | Antivirus Total Security
					

Comodo's best internet security software is an advanced best antivirus total security for web threats. The best internet security and Computer security software.




					www.comodo.com
				




However $40 a year for 3 PC's, the premium version is MORE than worth it.


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## GerKNG (Aug 12, 2021)

who cares about norton or avast?
for the normal user, Windows Defender.
for people who do shady things all day long and need real ransomware protection = Kaspersky.


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## windwhirl (Aug 12, 2021)

When looking up the details of AVAST and Norton's deal, I also got the news (for me at least) of Norton acquiring Avira.









						NortonLifeLock acquires Avira in $360M all-cash deal, 8 months after Avira was acquired for $180M
					

Only eight months after getting acquired for $180 million, Avira is changing hands again, for double the value: NortonLifeLock today announced that it would acquire the German security firm for around $360 million in an all-cash deal. The M&A deal is the latest of a series of consolidations and...




					techcrunch.com
				




That's four brands gone into one. AVG, Avast, Avira. All Norton now.

And then we have the engine rebrands: G Data, Total Defense and Vipre using Bitdefender's technology, Total AV using Avira's (well, Norton's now, I suppose)...

Feels like they're consolidating into a handful of companies. Nothing new showing up.


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## Solid State Soul ( SSS ) (Aug 12, 2021)

Bill_Bright said:


> If you can trust a company based in Russia, with its CEO a Russian oligarch billionaire who was trained by the KGB and is a friend of Putin, then sure, go ahead and put Kaspersky on your PCs. Me? Never.
> 
> Don't believe all that? Google is your friend.
> 
> ...


Man let me tell you something, not caring about politics and giving zero fudge about whatever political climate people are going trough is the best thing that's ever happened to me, i will always continue to use what i like and what works for me, politics and all this make believe scary crap around it can go fudge itself,  just take it easy and enjoy life,  F politics,


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## DrCR (Aug 12, 2021)

Adding an additional mention of Comodo. When I think of WinOS software firewalls, they come to mind. I'm not sure there's really a reason to bother now that WinOS is what it is now though.


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## lexluthermiester (Aug 12, 2021)

GerKNG said:


> for the normal user, Windows Defender.


That's so wrong it's painful to read.


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## the54thvoid (Aug 12, 2021)

Isn't it more the case these days that viruses aren't so much picked up but 'accrued' by ill-informed web practices. I mean, i recall downloading a music file years ago from Limewire and when I opened it up, it was a total shitshow of browser hijacking nasty porn.

And then there's social engineering to gather personal info to allow hackers to 'infiltrate' your system. Or hacks on major sites to gain access to your p/words and credit card data.

I use MS and not much else. And apart from the 50k I loaned the Nigerian Princess, I'm pretty sure I'm fine.


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## GerKNG (Aug 12, 2021)

lexluthermiester said:


> That's so wrong it's painful to read.


enlighten us with your infinite wisdom.


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## Splinterdog (Aug 12, 2021)

lexluthermiester said:


> That's so wrong it's painful to read.


What the...?


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## windwhirl (Aug 12, 2021)

the54thvoid said:


> Isn't it more the case these days that viruses aren't so much picked up but 'accrued' by ill-informed web practices.


Yeah, I think these days it's mostly that you go to some shady site, get some file from there and boom, red alerts across your screen. Plus browsers including some basic shielding against some malicious domains, Windows shipping with AV by default, etc., I think the metaphorical security wall surrounding most users' PCs has definitely gotten harder to crack.


the54thvoid said:


> I mean, i recall downloading a music file years ago from Limewire and when I opened it up, it was a total shitshow of browser hijacking nasty porn.


I'll bet that was fun to watch 


the54thvoid said:


> And then there's social engineering to gather personal info to allow hackers to 'infiltrate' your system. Or hacks on major sites to gain access to your p/words and credit card data.


Indeed. I think attacks are getting more sophisticated, but they're also taking more effort on the bad guys' part, so following that idea I think they're shifting the target, not as much focus on individual users but rather larger institutions.


lexluthermiester said:


> That's so wrong it's painful to read.


Do clarify on that.


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## lexluthermiester (Aug 12, 2021)

GerKNG said:


> enlighten us with your infinite wisdom.





windwhirl said:


> Do clarify on that.


I already have, please see above..

EDIT:
Allow me to elaborate further. 

IF you trust microsoft, then going with Defender and the default firewall is better than nothing at all. 

IF you do not trust microsoft, there are many MUCH better options.

Go with microsoft's stuff if all you want is the bare minimum protection for bare minimum effort. But as we have all seen with the malware, ransomware and virii as of late, the bare minimum is NOT safe and microsoft's stuff does not actively protect users from it. Dare I say that even Norton is better than microsoft(I feel dirty even suggesting such, but it's the reality)! If you are serious about your digital security, leaving well enough alone to microsoft is at best unwise and at worst foolish beyond reason.


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## dirtyferret (Aug 12, 2021)

the54thvoid said:


> it was a total shitshow of browser hijacking nasty porn.



you downloaded 2 girls 1 cup too?


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## 95Viper (Aug 12, 2021)

Stay on topic.
Stop the trolling and thread crapping.

*EDIT: *Thread closed... use News thread for discussion --> NortonLifeLock and Avast to Merge to Lead the Transformation of Consumer Cyber Safety


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