# Need a short video card.



## newtekie1 (Oct 29, 2009)

I'm putting together a Mini-ITX machine for LAN parties, because I'm tired of lugging my main rig around...

LIAN LI PC-Q07
ZOTAC GF9300-G-E
CORSAIR 4GB (2 x 2GB)
Intel Pentium E5200
Seagate Momentus 500GB
SAMSUNG Black 22X DVD-R
OCZ ModXStream Pro 500w

I need a decent video card to go with it.  I'm looking for something in the 9800GT or better range, but it has to be 8" or less to fit in the case.


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## Soylent Joe (Oct 29, 2009)

I had a HD 4670 a while back and I think it was about 5" in length, ran cool, no additional power. I also know that the GT220 is pretty short.


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## Jstn7477 (Oct 29, 2009)

Some of the 9800GT Energy Efficient models should be fairly short, and they don't need any extra PCIe power cables.


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## Soylent Joe (Oct 29, 2009)

This 4850 looks a good bit shorter than the other ones.


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## Jstn7477 (Oct 29, 2009)

Soylent Joe said:


> This 4850 looks a good bit shorter than the other ones.



Looks longer than this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814261046

There are other 9800GT EEs with better coolers/more RAM.


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## MT Alex (Oct 29, 2009)

If you are willing to substitute one Lian Li for another, I had my HD 4870 in one of these:  LIAN LI PC-V351B Black Aluminum MicroATX Desktop Computer Case 

It is $50 more, but still has a small footprint, and offers more options to pack a more powerfull system.  Anyway, good luck, I'll keep my eyes open for a small GFX.  My old 8800 gtx was short and fairly powerfull, might go well with the mid range processor, I had mine with an Athlon x2 64 4200+ and it was a fine rig.


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## bigsharn (Oct 29, 2009)

The 4850 is about 9" without power connectors


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## Soylent Joe (Oct 29, 2009)

MT Alex said:


> If you are willing to substitute one Lian Li for another, I had my HD 4870 in one of these:  LIAN LI PC-V351B Black Aluminum MicroATX Desktop Computer Case
> 
> It is $50 more, but still has a small footprint, and offers more options to pack a more powerfull system.  Anyway, good luck, I'll keep my eyes open for a small GFX.  My old 8800 gtx was short and fairly powerfull, might go well with the mid range processor, I had mine with an Athlon x2 64 4200+ and it was a fine rig.



+1 I like that idea. It'll open up a lot of new options for you.


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## BUCK NASTY (Oct 29, 2009)

Jstn7477 said:


> Some of the 9800GT Energy Efficient models should be fairly short, and they don't need any extra PCIe power cables.



+1 on the 9800GT

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814500113


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## LittleLizard (Oct 29, 2009)

my vote goes toward a 4670


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## Frick (Oct 29, 2009)

9800GT is better than teh 4670, and only what? 3cm longer?


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## twicksisted (Oct 29, 2009)

I cant seem to drum up any info on short cards myself... though you have probably thought of this already... but looking at that case setup youll definately need to go with a modular PSU or you'll have a helluva job finding space for all the excess wiring... lian li's are great though... should be a great build


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## InTeL-iNsIdE (Oct 29, 2009)

twicksisted said:


> I cant seem to drum up any info on short cards myself... though you have probably thought of this already... but looking at that case setup youll definately need to go with a modular PSU or you'll have a helluva job finding space for all the excess wiring... lian li's are great though... should be a great build



It will be an ITX PSU  

HD 5750 FTW


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## twicksisted (Oct 29, 2009)

InTeL-iNsIdE said:


> It will be an ITX PSU
> 
> HD 5750 FTW



It takes an ATX psu.... even though its an ITX case (according to the specs).
HD5750 sounds like the best bet for sure if that is less than 8"


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## Fishymachine (Oct 29, 2009)

hd 5750,probably Sapphire(I personally don't like the reference cooler) or you could wait for a Asus


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## [Ion] (Oct 29, 2009)

I strongly suggest that you choose the Silverstone SUGO SG05-B instead of the Lian-Li PC-Q07.  Although the Silverstone doesn't have a full ATX power supply (micro ATX) and doesn't take a full 5.25" optical drive, the interior space is far better managed.  The SG05 will take any dual-slot card up to 9.5", and, will take a GTX 260 with a few mods.  Furthermore, the SG05 will take larger heatsinks such as the Cooler Master GeminII, and the front fan will give the case far better airflow than the Lian Li could ever have.


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## Paintface (Oct 29, 2009)

4670 , also very low on power usage and quiet. I installed several of them from HIS into friend their computers. performance is on par with the 3870 which is actually quite good for such a small card.


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## newtekie1 (Oct 29, 2009)

MT Alex said:


> If you are willing to substitute one Lian Li for another, I had my HD 4870 in one of these:  LIAN LI PC-V351B Black Aluminum MicroATX Desktop Computer Case
> 
> It is $50 more, but still has a small footprint, and offers more options to pack a more powerfull system.  Anyway, good luck, I'll keep my eyes open for a small GFX.  My old 8800 gtx was short and fairly powerfull, might go well with the mid range processor, I had mine with an Athlon x2 64 4200+ and it was a fine rig.



The PC-V351B is too big and too expensive, though a very nice case.  I'm really looking for as small as possible.  The PC-V351B is over double the size of the PC-Q07.



[Ion] said:


> I strongly suggest that you choose the Silverstone SUGO SG05-B instead of the Lian-Li PC-Q07.  Although the Silverstone doesn't have a full ATX power supply (micro ATX) and doesn't take a full 5.25" optical drive, the interior space is far better managed.  The SG05 will take any dual-slot card up to 9.5", and, will take a GTX 260 with a few mods.  Furthermore, the SG05 will take larger heatsinks such as the Cooler Master GeminII, and the front fan will give the case far better airflow than the Lian Li could ever have.



I looked at the Silverstone, and it has some better features, but all the MicroATX power supplies I've ever seen suck.  FSP is really the only reputable brand that puts out MicroATX power supplies, and they only have up to a 300w.  Definitely not a PSU I want to run something like a GTX260 with.

I'm not to worried about heatsinks, since I'll be using a stock Intel heatsink(for once)...  Not the stock heatsink from the E5200, the stock heatsink from a Q6600.  That should be good enough for at least 3.0GHz, I'll have to see how the board overclocks also.  I might drop in the CNPS7000-Cu I have laying around if the stock cooler isn't good enough, see how that does.



Paintface said:


> 4670 , also very low on power usage and quiet. I installed several of them from HIS into friend their computers. performance is on par with the 3870 which is actually quite good for such a small card.



I've had a HD4670 in the past, didn't really like it, performance wasn't really what I expected.  If I was going to do that, I've already got a 9600GT sitting around that I could use that would outperform it.

I'm also really leaning towards an nVidia card, since the rig will just sit on my workbench and Fold whenever it isn't being taken to LAN parties.

Does anyone know how long a standard GTS250 is?  I'm thinking I would like to pick up one of those, since the stock cooler is nice, and would vent out the back of the case.  It would take a little modifying of the PCI bracket to work, but since the case doesn't really have any other fans, having the card blowing out the back would be a bonus.  Plus, since the power connector is off the side, the card could go all the way up to the front of the case and I wouldn't have to worry about power connectors sticking out further.

Edit: Damn, according to nVidia the standard GTS250 is 9 inches...who knew they listed that on their site?!?!


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## Jstn7477 (Oct 29, 2009)

newtekie1 said:


> Edit: Damn, according to nVidia the standard GTS250 is 9 inches...who knew they listed that on their site?!?!



Yeah, the reference cards that require PCIe power connections aren't very space optimized at all, as everyone just seems to throw all of the VRM components near the end of the board. At least it seems some 9800 GT EE manufacturers reorganize the board to use up more empty space. With the 9800GT EE, you can save power, save space, and generate less heat at the small expense of 50MHz core/ 100MHz shader (which can probably be regained). They even give you the same 256bit GDDR3 (1800MHz DDR) that is on regular 9800 GTs too.


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## SNiiPE_DoGG (Oct 29, 2009)

The 5750 is faster, more power efficient, DX11 and about the same size as the 9800gt EE, nuff said


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## newtekie1 (Oct 29, 2009)

I'm thinking I'll go with this GTS250.

It seems like it is short enough, but the PCI-E power connector off the edge of the board worries me.  



SNiiPE_DoGG said:


> The 5750 is faster, more power efficient, DX11 and about the same size as the 9800gt EE, nuff said



You forgot $40 more expensive, requires a PCI-E connector(consumes more power, not more power efficient), and fails terriblely at folding, the primary use of the card.


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## SNiiPE_DoGG (Oct 29, 2009)

wow dude, that post was EDIT: Bias-tastic


> I'm thinking I'll go with this GTS250.
> ...but the PCI-E power connector off the edge of the board worries me





> [dont want 5750 because it] requires a PCI-E connector





> (consumes more power, not more power efficient)








not to mention a this 5750 is only $10 more than that gts250 your considering


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## newtekie1 (Oct 29, 2009)

SNiiPE_DoGG said:


> wow dude, that post was EDIT: Bias-tastic
> 
> 
> 
> ...



You were talking about the 9800GT EE, which makes your statements completely wrong.  The 9800GT EE consumes less power than a HD5750.

Yes, the GTS250 is a different case, but you were not comparing that, I added that, then corrected your statements.  Two totally different issues.

And I didn't say I didn't want the HD5870 because of the extra power connector, I could care less about the extra power connector, I was say it requires an extra power connector because it uses more power.

If we were talking about the HD5750 and GTS250 your statements would be more correct.  However, I've also already stated my reasons for not wanting an ATi card previously in the thread.  The HD5750 still gets outperformed by the GTS250 in the intended primary use(or hell the 9600GT I'm going to be using as a temperary card).


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## SNiiPE_DoGG (Oct 29, 2009)

but the 9800gt EE has quite a poor gaming performance no? 550mhz core clock and a cut shader clock as well.

you are correct as far as folding performance, but why make such large sacrifices in performance per watt just to have some more folding points? (yes the ati card doesnt fold well, but it *does* fold )


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## newtekie1 (Oct 29, 2009)

SNiiPE_DoGG said:


> but the 9800gt EE has quite a poor gaming performance no? 550mhz core clock and a cut shader clock as well.
> 
> you are correct as far as folding performance, but why make such large sacrifices in performance per watt just to have some more folding points? (yes the ati card doesnt fold well, but it *does* fold )



The 9800GT EE isn't even really being considered, I don't know why you think it is...

But anyway, the gaming performance is far from poor, it is only a 50MHz core clock, nothing major, and it has been shown in pretty much every review that the clock speed can be set back to stock without issue.

Yes, it is worth the sacrifice in performance per watt to go with the GTS250 for more folding points, in fact I don't give a rat's ass about performance per watt, or even power consumption in general.  The GTS250 plays everything out, that is all that matter to me when it comes to gaming performance, and folds like a champ which is the bonus that pushes it over the edge.


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