# anyone running vista?



## Deleted member 24505 (Jan 9, 2007)

i have got a copy of windows vista 32bit,i am sorely tempted to try it.i have run the upgrade advisor and it seems to be saying i have no major problems with the upgrade.

what do you guys think? is it worth a look?

also coz its 32bit,will 32bit xp progs run on it?


----------



## Greek (Jan 9, 2007)

tigger ive been runin vista 32bit for one month now, everything works for me apart from alcohol 120 but i use daemon tools anyway, i have the business version from college so its legit 

try it all ma games workand now with nvidia releasing proper dirvers im happy


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jan 9, 2007)

were do i get the video driver from m8? i am probs gonna try it tonite.all your games work ok?


----------



## xylomn (Jan 9, 2007)

I'm still waiting for my uni to put it on the msdnaa  

I'm not putting it on my main rig for a while though gonna run it on a second rig just to play with it


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jan 9, 2007)

well i have vista on,was a bit of a feck about.the disc kept coming up with an error,so i booted from it and it worked.it did not like my raid 0 setup so i had to install it onto my new 250gb disc.now i have xp/vista on duel boot somehow.

it looks bloody nice.


----------



## technicks (Jan 9, 2007)

Tigger can you install some games and tell me if you see any major difference.
They at MS say that Vista is very orientated for games and visual performance.


----------



## peach1971 (Jan 9, 2007)

Yeah tigger go, yeah tigger go!


----------



## L|NK|N (Jan 9, 2007)

Just in case anyone wants to know or cares, I was reading this months Games for Windows, and they ran 3dmark 06 in both XP and in Vista 6 or so times.  Consistently Vista performance was 5-15% slower than XP.  Sure when they get everything optimised itll prolly go the other way.  But not knowing how long makes me wanna wait on upgrading to vista right away.


----------



## Dirtypants (Jan 9, 2007)

i have had vista 32 bit since nov 17, and i have had no problems with it so far. i made a major upgrade though, and right now i am running my 8800gts on it with base windows drivers. back when i had my x1800xl though, it was running older games fine like hl and cs 1.6, but when i tried to play newer games like nfsc, it would not load up the game, even when i ran it as the admin. my guess is that this issue and many others will be fixed soon after the consumer release on the 30th.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Vista = crap for games. This is just my opinion. Any OS that makes gaming *slower* is not worth it. And what are the advantages of having Vista? I can't see anything that looks good. Slower gaming is anything but an advantage


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 11, 2007)

the only thing i see in vista is DX10...and i dnt even have a DX10 GFX card, so it wont be that great anyway


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

When you install Vista you're basically saying "I want worse performance and less FPS". That's all it is. POS!!


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 11, 2007)

lmao

its bound to get better

Wait for SP1 to come out of it...it should be right then ...well hopefully


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

OSX FTW TBQFH.


----------



## Easy Rhino (Jan 11, 2007)

i was running vista on a spare rig (1.3ghz AMD) and it performed alright. i turned all those stupid visual effects off. i wouldnt recommend bothering with it until you have a reason too. sure it sucks now with games but that will only improve...hopefully...


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

It's Microsoft...you can't expect a miracle.


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 11, 2007)

yeah its *cough* only *cough* Microsoft, one of the largest companies in the world


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

For all the wrong reasons. Come on...their OS's randomly mess up and they have like 20000000000000000000 viruses attacking their OS's every day.


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 11, 2007)

but, they still pwn the OS market, as overpriced and dodgy as they are (or as dodgy and uber easy to hack and get free copies) 

and it aint their fault for the viruses...its the dudes that make the virsues...


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Nah it is their fault. People know that Mac OS's are like....impenetrable...so they think "Hey I will look uber 1337 if I can hack Mac OS's" but they fail and move on to Windows.


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 11, 2007)

yeah, MS is really vunerable...but its heaps better than MAC OS!


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

OSX FTW TBQFH....!!!!1!!11!!!1!


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Nah it is their fault. People know that Mac OS's are like....impenetrable...so they think "Hey I will look uber 1337 if I can hack Mac OS's" but they fail and move on to Windows.



No, they just figure that people who use Macs have nothing of value to steal 

M$ is targeted because it has the biggest market share and most people use it. If you want to cause havoc why target something which most people DON'T use? think about it genius.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Most games are designed using Macs. Without a Mac you wouldn't have such great games.


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 11, 2007)

dont defend macs...they suck


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

They OWN


----------



## peach1971 (Jan 11, 2007)

> Wait for SP1 to come out of it...it should be right then ...well hopefully



Forget about that.
Any update won´t disable that tilt bits AES-128 encryption shit.



> In order to prevent active attacks, device drivers are required to poll the underlying hardware every 30ms to ensure that everything appears kosher. This means that even with nothing else happening in the system, a mass of assorted drivers has to wake up thirty times a second just to ensure that... nothing continues to happen. In addition to this polling, further device-specific polling is also done, for example Vista polls video devices on each video frame displayed in order to check that all of the grenade pins (tilt bits) are still as they should be. We already have multiple reports from Vista reviewers of playback problems with video and audio content, with video frames dropped and audio stuttering even on high-end systems



another quote from http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt


----------



## WarEagleAU (Jan 11, 2007)

Im sure Vista will be better. Same thing for Windows XP when it came out.


----------



## Deleted member 3 (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Most games are designed using Macs. Without a Mac you wouldn't have such great games.



Source? I see no reason to use Macs for designing games. I would love to know why they would be better for that purpose.


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Vista = crap for games. This is just my opinion. Any OS that makes gaming *slower* is not worth it. And what are the advantages of having Vista? I can't see anything that looks good. Slower gaming is anything but an advantage



That's what folks said during the Win9x -> NT-based OS' (NT4/2000) transition, almost verbatim...



* It's TOUGH to win, if you stick by older OS' by MS... because they're moving forward once more, & you can see what happened to the 9x series of Win32 Operating Systems by now...

Primarily, they're a business, & one that has to keep us buying... they aren't out to make a better OS (or any software) primarily, but instead are in the business of MAKING MONEY, above all else - you really HAVE to keep that thought in mind, imo @ least.

Keep us buying...

APK

P.S.=> I remember being @ a LAN party that 3dfiles.com back in 1998 @ a local mall @ nite once most of its stores closed (once famous gaming site online - now known as "majorgeeks.com" & only Tim Tibbetts is left, & Ben is gone now) that that site held, & their co-owners (Ben & Tim) ribbed on me for playing Quake II on NT 4.0... & I was like "Well, give it time: You'll find out what happens, IF you stick by the 9x series in another 1-2 years"... apk


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

And the irony is they'd still rip you for it nowadays.


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> And the irony is they'd still rip you for it nowadays.



Those 2 especially/probably... lol!



(NO 'biggie'...)

APK

P.S.=> I've GOT to get around to "giving VISTA a go" myself... one of these days! apk


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

I'm sure you know of many ways to get back at them


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> I'm sure you know of many ways to get back at them



MANY...



* Ah, doesn't matter to me... it's the past!

(AND THE FUTURE, IS NOW!)

APK


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Well, at the moment I suppose the main point is Vista is a pile of bollocks for now


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Well, at the moment I suppose the main point is Vista is a pile of bollocks for now



Well, by "living vicariously" thru others (mainly, folks here who have tried it earlier on)? It seems alright for many things, but gaming using OpenGL games isn't one of them... 

I also heard MS is 'backpeddling' on that note, & making it so you CAN put OpenGL back into VISTA 'natively' like it was in NT/2000/XP/Server 2003...

Zek showed us what OpenGL games look like under VISTA, & it's NOT nearly as nice as it does displayed natively via OpenGL only (not translating OpenGL API calls to DirectX 10 ones, as it did during "Z"'s demo to us).

APK

P.S.=> Security-wise, it's better than XP, & in some ways, better than Server 2003 (VISTA's 'base-code') even... lots of 'under-the-hood' type features many folks aren't aware of... but, the gaming issue is one MS has to resolve to every customer's satisfaction, imo @ least... especially OpenGL gamers, like myself! I like that API better for SOME reason (IDSoftware's my fav 'game software oem' is why, & they use it)... apk


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

It won't stay secure for long....I assure you


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Alec§taar said:


> Primarily, they're a business, & one that has to keep us buying... they aren't out to make a better OS (or any software) primarily, but instead are in the business of MAKING MONEY, above all else - you really HAVE to keep that thought in mind, imo @ least.



So is Apple, so by what you just said you are saying Apple is as bad as M$....


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> It won't stay secure for long....I assure you



Well, time & history are on YOUR side on that note, so you're @ little risk w/ that statement most likely.

It's had patches for the OS itself (1 I know of) & for IE7 (1-2 I know of)...

So, you're most likely safe in your statement.

Still, it's got a few things going for it (like having Server 2003 as its codebase underpinnings) like UAC, IE7 'protected mode', Address Space Randomization, etc. et al...

(& more that I am NOT even beginning to touch that have improved in it vs. older MS OS')...

APK


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Darknova said:


> So is Apple, so by what you just said you are saying Apple is as bad as M$....



Well, it's true... They've got employees to pay, & stockholders as well!



APK


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Apple has some amount of decency in their work. Unlike MS. I'm only using MS because I'm too young to afford a Mac.


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Apple has some amount of decency in their work. Unlike MS.



How so?



Casheti said:


> I'm only using MS because I'm too young to afford a Mac.



Did you say that, because of others' telling you that, or did you arrive @ that conclusion YOURSELF, somehow?

If so, well again:  How so??

APK


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Apple has some amount of decency in their work. Unlike MS. I'm only using MS because I'm too young to afford a Mac.



Funny, I've done a lot of BETA testing for M$ and always had good responses, never had a problem with Customer Service (possibly the best I've ever used). Now I will admit they are incredibly misguided with Vista, but everyone can make mistakes, and they will learn from them.
What you fail to grasp is that M$ doesn't delibrately make their software "open" to hackers. Hackers find a way in. Anything that can be made can be broken. It is impossible to close every hole, because holes can be created. Hackers are constantly looking for ways to breach M$ security and it will always happen. I will once again point you to the fact that M$ dominates the market so they are going to be targeted.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Alec§taar said:


> How so?



I just don't really like MS and the way they do things. All this liscensing rubbish is making the consumer mad. And the consumer comes before anything else in the world of business. It's really putting me off Vista. And what's this whole Hollywood thing about? Freakin' mess if you ask me. And the whole shabang about FORCING us to get Vista for DX10.



Alec§taar said:


> Did you say that, because of others' telling you that, or did you arrive @ that conclusion YOURSELF, somehow?



Well I came to this conclusion myself after seeing a Macintosh G5 Running OSX 10 for £5000. The first computer I ever used was a Mac. I thought they were great little things. Then I finally used a modern up to date G5 at a friends house (his father owns one of the first established media companies in Britain) and he had a lot of powerful Macs. I sat there for hours amazed at these things. The skill of the way they were made. Macs are a thing of beauty as well a sleeping power machine. And when I turn old enough to get a steady job and some money coming in, one of those things is mine.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

I can't help but think thats the first useful post I've ever made. Actually I have had my fair share


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> I just don't really like MS and the way they do things.



Well, I look @ it, THIS way: They're ontop of their game... how far wrong can they be, since they ARE really in that very position?



Casheti said:


> All this liscensing rubbish is making the consumer mad.



Doesn't make ME angry @ all... it's 'risky' making blanket statements like that one my man, too general.



Casheti said:


> And the consumer comes before anything else in the world of business.



Yea, up until the point where you spend your money w/ them... & generally then, you aren't SO 'important' anymore, lol... the next 'sucker' is.



Casheti said:


> And what's this whole Hollywood thing about? Freakin' mess if you ask me.



This I have NO idea what you mean... explain?



Casheti said:


> And the whole shabang about FORCING us to get Vista for DX10.



Prime selling point that one:  Gaming, imo @ least, IS the largest single software market there is (aside from the OS itself & also certain peripheral softwares that deal in security or the feeling thereof in AntiVirus/AntiSpyware etc.).

Force folks to nab the ONLY OS THERE IS WITH IT? Eventually, once games for it release, folks will HAVE to upgrade to VISTA, & also new hardwares for said new API version (DirectX).



Casheti said:


> Well I came to this conclusion myself after seeing a Macintosh G5 Running OSX 10 for £5000.



That's cool enough... I like OS X myself to be blunt about it. 

Thing is though, it doesn't have as many apps, for as many purposes, & as of as "high" a quality that Microsoft & Win32 have going for them.

It's what keeps me around, & has KEPT me around, Win32 & Microsoft stuff for more than 15 years now...

APK


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> I can't help but think thats the first useful post I've ever made. Actually I have had my fair share



LOL! Oh man... that's "future signature material" if ever I saw it... another "CASHETI CLASSIC"...



APK

P.S.=> Someone get a thermometer out & check Casheti's temperature... I think he MAY be ill! lol... apk


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Apart from the fact that every Windows PC I have ever used has said "This program needs to close" or "This program has encountered an unexpected error" or "Windows needs to restart for changes to take effect". I HATE all that crap. Macintosh's just work, and that's the kind of machine I want.

"Not responding"

"Not responding"

"NOT FUCKING RESPONDING"


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Apart from the fact that every Windows PC I have ever used has said "This program needs to close" or "This program has encountered an unexpected error" or "Windows needs to restart for changes to take effect". I HATE all that crap. Macintosh's just work, and that's the kind of machine I want.
> 
> "Not responding"
> 
> ...



I've seen Mac's do that man... heck, I've seen most every kind of computer do that @ times... it happens!

APK

P.S.=> As far as your getting older & being able to afford one? Give it time - you'll be there one day, most likely... it's inevitable! apk


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Alec§taar said:


> I've seen Mac's do that man... heck, I've seen most every kind of computer do that @ times... it happens!
> 
> APK



Well in all honesty I've never had a Macintosh crash on me.



Alec§taar said:


> As far as your getting older & being able to afford one? Give it time - you'll be there one day, most likely... it's inevitable!



Let's hope so


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Well in all honesty I've never had a Macintosh crash on me.



Oh, I believe it... but, like your getting older & being able to afford one? Well, cost ISN'T generally in a Mac's favor over PC's, but give THIS point of yours time too, because it happens.

APK

P.S.=> Gotta go for now, nice discussion & points from all involved... see ya later folks! apk


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Alec§taar said:


> Doesn't make ME angry @ all... it's 'risky' making blanket statements like that one my man, too general.
> 
> 
> This I have NO idea what you mean... explain?
> ...



I agree, Licencing is only a problem if you are using a pirated version of Windows. I have a fully legit version, why should I worry?

Obviously you didn't read The Cost of Vista article. Do a google search on it. It will take around 15 minutes to read.

Maybe you don't know how DX10 works then? It is NOT compatible with DX9 at all. It is the first time DirectX has been completel rewritten since DX3. The Video drivers for XP can not run DX10 and will never be able to. The drivers in Vista are completely different, and again, incompatible with DX9 or below. While I do find this disturbing, knowing how DX10 works makes up for that. It is much much more efficient and produces much better results for the same amount of processing power as we have now, however the hardware architecture required are different as you know.



Casheti said:


> Apart from the fact that every Windows PC I have ever used has said "This program needs to close" or "This program has encountered an unexpected error" or "Windows needs to restart for changes to take effect". I HATE all that crap. Macintosh's just work, and that's the kind of machine I want.
> 
> "Not responding"
> 
> ...



That is the programmers fault, NOT M$'s


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Darknova said:


> That is the programmers fault, NOT M$'s



Happens with all MS program's whether they made them or not. It's happened to me a lot before on the Microsoft Office based programs.


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Happens with all MS program's whether they made them or not. It's happened to me a lot before on the Microsoft Office based programs.



Well obviously you are too stupid to use M$ programs. I've never had that problem. The ONLY times I ever have problems are when I overclock and it becomes unstable. If you don't know how to take care of a PC you can't blame the Company who made the program.

This is exactly the thing that keeps me in work. I work as a Computer Technician, and I see this every day. So thank you


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

How can you accuse me of not being able to use an Office Program correctly? What's there to do? Type, save and print...man that sure is complicated. Think I need some lessons on how to do complicated shit like that...they just generally fuck up whenever they want to.


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> How can you accuse me of not being able to use an Office Program correctly? What's there to do? Type, save and print...man that sure is complicated. Think I need some lessons on how to do complicated shit like that...they just generally fuck up whenever they want to.



The Office Program is simple, looking after a computer obviously is beyond your comprehension. I never have problems, Office has never crashed on any computer I've had. They don't "fuck up whenever they want to" they fuck up because you have done something wrong at some point.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Like press print...and then it freezes?? YEAH THAT'S TOTALLY MY FUCKING FAULT...


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jan 11, 2007)

vista is gone,i had a rc1 key and the version i had had a hack to activate with the rc1 key.suprise suprise dint work.and i got a nvidia driver for x86 32bit vista,dint work.neither did the x-fi 32 bit driver.

i'll give it some credit tho',it asked for the driver disc for my freecom usb dtv stick,i put the disc in and it worked.the only thing i had in that failed was the x-fi card(suprise suprise creative )

it does look nice,and it ran pretty smooth on windows tho',just so long as you dont want it primarily to play games,otherwise its poo.mebbe it might be better when dx10 comes along but who knows or dares to dream.

i wont be trying it again tho' till its been out a while and got its feet under the table,and all the software has working drivers.

btw dont anyone even think of finding an activation crack for it,microsoft have learnt a lot from the xp wga experience.no one is gonna hack the activation on vista.unless some else knows otherwise


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Like press print...and then it freezes?? YEAH THAT'S TOTALLY MY FUCKING FAULT...



This is what you don't seem to understand, if you've got something that is making the OS unstable then everything else becomes unstable as a result. My current build has been through 3 hardware changes and numerous re-activations, and I still don't have any problems or instability. Obviously I know how to look after a PC.


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jan 11, 2007)

oh and btw,i have a fully licensed version of xp.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Obviously your job helps you a lot...and I am unlucky. Nothing more. There is nothing wrong with the way I treat PC's. Defrag once a week. Clean registry twice every day. Run virus scan every day. Yeah that sure is a bad way to treat a PC. Your job is obviously an advantage over my unskilled non qualified brain.

P.S My XP is also legit.


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Obviously your job helps you a lot...and I am unlucky. Nothing more. There is nothing wrong with the way I treat PC.s Defrag once a week. Clean registry twice every day. Run virus scan every day. yeah that sure is a bad way to treat a PC. Your job is obviously an advantage over my unskilled non qualified brain.
> 
> P.S My XP is also legit.



I'm completely self-taught, no qualifications relevant to PCs. I got lucky when I got a job at my local computer shop.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

I ddn't mean PC qualifications. I meant no qualifications whatsoever. And being around PC's must surely rub off on your experience with them.


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> I ddn't mean PC qualifications. I meant no qualifications whatsoever. And being around PC's must surely rub off on your experience with them.



Yes, but it's not hard to keep your PC running stably. I've helped numerous clients whose PC's crashed for "no reason" was always to do with something they had done - downloaded viruses, spyware, bad overclock, badly written program etc.
I've never seen a "healthy" PC that crashes or has problems for no reason, and if you ask anyone who does the same job as me they will ALL agree. It is always the end-user's fault, a lot of the time due to ignorance or blind stupidity.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Are you calling me stupid and ignorant?


----------



## Deleted member 24505 (Jan 11, 2007)

my system was running sweet for months,until my little nastly virus writing twat screwed it.a healthy pc should run for a long time with no problems.if you have problems,it aint healthy.

and yes it was my fault,warez site oops.not again tho',no more warez sites for me.


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

tigger69 said:


> my system was running sweet for months,until my little nastly virus writing twat screwed it.a healthy pc should run for a long time with no problems.if you have problems,it aint healthy.



Exactly my point.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Answer my question....


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Answer my question....



I'm not calling you stupid. Ignorant, possibly. You don't know what you did to cause your PC to be unstable...that about sums it up.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

Neither do you...


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> Neither do you...



No, but chances are if I got a look at your PC I'd be able to find out and fix it.


----------



## Casheti (Jan 11, 2007)

If I knew where you lived and could be bothered to waste money and send you my PC I'd put you to the test. But I won't because I'm poor and can't be without my beast.


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Casheti said:


> and can't be without my beast.



I know how you feel


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Darknova said:


> Obviously you didn't read The Cost of Vista article. Do a google search on it. It will take around 15 minutes to read.



This will explain the "hollywood" stuff that Casheti was talking about? I take everything I read w/ a grain of salt & especially consider the source, to be honest about it... some of the folks that write some articles aren't ALL that qualified @ times, or just make some bad mistakes &/or assumptions.

(So, that all said - Do you have a link to this article you mention by any chance as well? Thanks!)



Darknova said:


> Maybe you don't know how DX10 works then?



A fair enough 'handle' on DirectX as a whole... I've actually written some wares using it (screensavers) here & over time.



Darknova said:


> It is NOT compatible with DX9 at all. It is the first time DirectX has been completel rewritten since DX3.



Yes, aware of that here... but, big efficiency improvements are also a result of said rewrite... a GOOD thing!



Darknova said:


> The Video drivers for XP can not run DX10 and will never be able to.



Makes sense, but those drivers will probably be THAT much better for it.



Darknova said:


> The drivers in Vista are completely different, and again, incompatible with DX9 or below.



Not new to me... as I stated before - I've seen this over time now, a few times in fact, w/ Ms' OS'... 9x -> NT-based, & even NT4 -> 2000/XP really.

Nothing new. Transitions are ALWAYS like this... worst I have seen? 16-bit Win3.x -> 32-bit (hybrid really 16/32) Win9x series, imo.



Darknova said:


> While I do find this disturbing, knowing how DX10 works makes up for that. It is much much more efficient and produces much better results for the same amount of processing power as we have now, however the hardware architecture required are different as you know.



Yes... I agree, & what I was leading to above as well.



Darknova said:


> That is the programmers fault, NOT M$'s



Agreed... they, & their "quality assurance" testers really, IF any existed @ all.

APK


----------



## Darknova (Jan 11, 2007)

Alec§taar said:


> This will explain the "hollywood" stuff that Casheti was talking about? I take everything I read w/ a grain of salt & especially consider the source, to be honest about it... some of the folks that write some articles aren't ALL that qualified @ times, or just make some bad mistakes &/or assumptions.
> 
> (So, that all said - Do you have a link to this article you mention by any chance as well? Thanks!)



http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt There you go!

And I too take it with a pinch of salt. I do know that this was originally what was going to be done, but some of it was dropped, but I'm not sure how much or what.


----------



## Alec§taar (Jan 11, 2007)

Darknova said:


> http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt There you go!



Excellent, & thanks... adding this to my daily lunchtime reading list right now!





Darknova said:


> And I too take it with a pinch of salt. I do know that this was originally what was going to be done, but some of it was dropped, but I'm not sure how much or what.



Gonna find out shortly as to what you mean by the statement... & again, thanks for a read that may 'enlighten me' moreso!

APK


----------



## peach1971 (Jan 11, 2007)

> & again, thanks for a read that may 'enlighten me' moreso!



Yes, the link was a pleasure to me, too.


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 11, 2007)

tigger69 said:


> btw dont anyone even think of finding an activation crack for it,microsoft have learnt a lot from the xp wga experience.no one is gonna hack the activation on vista.unless some else knows otherwise



Someone will get around it. Where there is a will, there is a way . I can almost guarantee it...


----------



## xylomn (Jan 12, 2007)

anything that can be done can be undone


----------



## Pinchy (Jan 12, 2007)

exactly


----------

