# Running Batman:Arkham City on an AMD card!



## MoondanceR (Nov 6, 2011)

Hi everyone!
I recently purchased this new PC with an AMD Grahpics Card, and since Batman:Arkham City is based on PhysX, I wanna buy a Nvidia card for this purpose. The question is: does the Nvidia card has to be an impressive one to run PhysX smoothly? Or a cheap card will do the trick?

The cheapest Nvidia cards available in my country's market are:
Asus EN210 SILENT/DI/1GD3 (43$) (I'm not sure if it supports PhsyX)
Asus EN8400GS SILENT/DI/1GD2(LP) (40$)

Or should I use a card like this one:
Asus ENGT430/DI/1GD3(LP)

My PC:
Motherboard: ASUS M4A89TD Pro /USB 3.0 (AMD 890FX chipset)
CPU: AMD PHENOM II X6  1090T 3.2/3.6GHz 9MB CACHE AM3 64BIT BLACK EDITION
Graphics Card: XFX HD 6950 2GB GDDR5
RAM: TwinMos DDR3 4GB X2
PSU: Thermaltake TR2 RX 550W

I also heard that PhysX is disabled when an AMD card is detected, is that true?
I need your urgent help because Batman is going to be released next week.


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## the54thvoid (Nov 6, 2011)

Hi there,

This thread will have all the answers you need.

http://www.techpowerup.com/forums/showthread.php?t=135891


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## TC-man (Nov 6, 2011)

MoondanceR said:


> Hi everyone!
> I recently purchased this new PC with an AMD Grahpics Card, and since Batman:Arkham City is based on PhysX, I wanna buy a Nvidia card for this purpose. The question is: does the Nvidia card has to be an impressive one to run PhysX smoothly? Or a cheap card will do the trick?
> 
> The cheapest Nvidia cards available in my country's market are:
> ...



Hi,

like the first game, the sequel is playable without a nVidia videocard, but then it will look like the console versions (although you can run the game at a much higher resolution of course with your setup), i.e. without the Physx enhancements which in my opinion is not a big deal at all, since it merely offers a visual enhancement rather than a gameplay improvement (e.g. flying newspapers, breakable tiles on the ground, breakable glass/windows, volumetric mist etc.). With your HD6950 you run the game with software Physx (instead of hardware accelerated Ageia physx which adds the earlier mentioned "enhancements") which is fine.

I don't know if you can use a nVidia videocard as physx card if you don't have a motherboard with Lucid Hydra support and are using an AMD HD6950 as the primary videocard, but it highly unlikely you can do that without Lucid Hydra, since nVidia blocks the usage of a Geforce videocard as Physx card in combination with an AMD(-ATI) videocard in their Geforce drivers. But it seems that there were patches/hacks (as shown by the54thvoid) to use nVidia videocard in combination with an AMD videocard. Also the Geforce videocards you mentioned earlier are not good enough for Ageia Physx, I think you need at least a Geforce 9600GT/GT240 if you want Ageia Physx in the supported games properly (I guess comparable Ageia Physx capable cards nowadays are GT430/440).

Here is an interesting (yet relatively old) article about Ageia physx, how nVidia  tried to "trick everyone" and how the performances are with different videocards combinations:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/nvidia-physx-hack-amd-mnbvc xzradeon,2764.html


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## Recus (Nov 6, 2011)

TC-man said:


> With your HD6950 you run the game with software Physx



Software Physx runs on CPU.

Many forums recommend to use GTS 440/450.


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## TC-man (Nov 6, 2011)

Recus said:


> Software Physx runs on CPU.
> 
> Many forums recommend to use GTS 440/450.




I know that, I should have worded that more properly; also the Tomshardware article I have linked should have explained about the software Physx is via the processor.

I never understand why some games developers are choosing Ageia Physx over Havok which can do everything what Physx can do in terms of ragdolls, physics etc. (that Havok can do all these in software via CPU), except creating a barrier for PC gamers who do not own or are planning to buy NV videocards.


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## MoondanceR (Nov 7, 2011)

Thank you all for your help. I really appreciate it.
However, there is no 440 or 450 available in the market here. So, it's either 430 or 520. What do you think?


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## MoondanceR (Nov 7, 2011)

I should mention that I can't afford more than 100$ for the PhysX card, because I just spent 2000$ on the new PC.


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## TC-man (Nov 7, 2011)

MoondanceR said:


> I should mention that I can't afford more than 100$ for the PhysX card, because I just spent 2000$ on the new PC.




Hi,

I think the GT430 (the difference between GT430 and GT440 is the higher gpu/mem clock and the usage of DDR3/DDR5 - correct me if I am wrong) is good enough for Ageia Physx since it has 96 shaders (the same amount of shaders on a GT240/440); perhaps it's not good enough for Physx APEX in Mafia II, but it should do the job in Batman: Arkham Asylum/City. The GT520 is likely too slow, because it only has 48 shaders. 

Make sure you buy the videocard in a shop where you can return the card/get your money back when you don't like the performance after all when using the card for Ageia Physx. Also a "beefier" card like the GTS450 or even the GTX550ti would be too heavy to handle for your Thermaltake 550W PSU in combination with the already installed Phenom II X6 and HD6950.

EDIT

I have found a review of the GT430 as a Physx card and it works pretty well in Mafia II with Ageia APEX Physx being set on "High". I guess I was wrong about the performance of a GT430 as an Ageia Physx card, as seen in the Mafia II test in the mentioned review. So with your HD6950 (+unofficial patch/hacks to run NV & AMD videocards simultaneously) the GT430 should run Ageia Physx in Batman: Arkham City pretty well.


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## erixx (Nov 7, 2011)

i wouldn't spend anything in the region of 100 coins for a questionable feature in a crappy kid game. but if you love to max the grafix in all or many games, it might make sense.... to just have 1 good nvidia card for grafix in your pc....


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## MoondanceR (Nov 8, 2011)

TC-man said:


> Make sure you buy the videocard in a shop where you can return the card/get your money back when you don't like the performance after all when using the card for Ageia Physx.



You obviously have never heard of Syria. We have nothing like this in here. If you buy something, you stick to it whether you like or not. Besides, one can consider himself lucky if he was able to return an already broken item.

Thank TC-man for your help, I think I'm gonna go with the ASUS GT 430, I was wrong about its cost though, 85$ (4200 SYP). I'll be back with testing results as soon as I'm able to buy the card, things are pretty bad in Syria these days. If you guys heard of the Arab Spring, then you'd know what I'm talking about.


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## MoondanceR (Nov 8, 2011)

erixx said:


> i wouldn't spend anything in the region of 100 coins for a questionable feature in a crappy kid game. but if you love to max the grafix in all or many games, it might make sense.... to just have 1 good nvidia card for grafix in your pc....



I can assure you that it's not a crappy kid game


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## erixx (Nov 8, 2011)

hey, it is not the kid that's crappy, but the game  lol

(just teasing: if it only was a FPS game... )


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## bbmarley (Nov 8, 2011)

try a 9600gt for physx card


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## KingPing (Nov 9, 2011)

bbmarley said:


> try a 9600gt for physx card



this

or a GTS240, the 430GT is too weak for some games, and the 520GT is even worse, actually is funny, the newer the card the worst it is jeje.


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## erocker (Nov 9, 2011)

KingPing said:


> this
> 
> or a GTS240, the 430GT is too weak for some games, and the 520GT is even worse, actually is funny, the newer the card the worst it is jeje.



Some of those GT 430's have a 256 bit memory bus. That plus the 96 "Cuda cores" that it has may it a pretty good PhysX card. I'm interested in the results. 

Found some: http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/foru...edicated-gt-430-hybrid-physx-mini-review.html



> No Physx
> 
> BATMAN: AA - min 100, avg 187, max 243
> Mafia II - 57.4fps
> ...


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## crazyeyesreaper (Nov 9, 2011)

Damn you erocker you beat me to the punch with the same data.


GT 430 is plenty for physx

GT 240 was the sweet spot for Physx effects 430 is a bit better at Physx on the whole the typical Nvidia 400 series cards were just far better at doing physx in general then previous GPU series 







most people in this thread have no idea wtf there talking about at this point

No Physx

 BATMAN: AA - min 100, avg 187, max 243
 Mafia II - 57.4fps
 Alice Madness Returns - 110FPS

 With Physx HIGH no GT 430

 BATMAN: AA - min 13, avg 33, max 41
 Mafia II - 17.2fps
 Alice Madness Returns - 28 FPS

 With Physx HIGH - GT 430 installed

 BATMAN: AA - min 56, avg 116, max 177
 Mafia II - 36.7fps
 Alice Madness Returns - 72FPS

 With Physx HIGH - GTX 460 installed

 BATMAN: AA - min 61, avg 119, max 178
 Mafia II - 39.1ps
 Alice Madness Returns - 77FPS

 Mirror's Edge

 AMD 6970 Physx Off- 242fps
 AMD 6970 + GT 430 Physx On - 128fps
 AMD 6970 + GTX 460 Physx On - 132fps

 Cyrostatis Benchmark – High settings 1920x1200 DX10

 AMD 6970– Total Time 688.108s
 Total Frame count 9821
 Average fps 14.3
 Minimum fps 5.3
 Maximum fps 167.5

 AMD 6970 + GT 430 – Total Time 147.212s
 Total Frame count 9821
 Average fps 66.7
 Minimum fps 43.1
 Maximum fps 153.9

 AMD 6970 + GTX 460 – Total Time 143.754s
 Total Frame count 9821
 Average fps 68.3
 Minimum fps 44.2
 Maximum fps 161.1


essentially in the end going from a cheap GT 430 to a GTX 460 or better will only net a 1-4 fps improvement which isnt worth the effort. get the GT 430 and put it in do whats needed to get Physx working via driver work around and there you go.


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## MoondanceR (Nov 9, 2011)

thank you all for the great tips, I really appreciate your help.
Although I checked the market here and there's no gt 240 so it's now definitely a gt 430 and there are three modules available: 
http://www.msi.com/product/vga/N430GT-MD1GD3-OC.html#?div=Overview

http://www.asus.com/Graphics_Cards/NVIDIA_Series/ENGT430_DC_SLDI1GD3/#overview

http://www.asus.com/Graphics_Cards/NVIDIA_Series/ENGT430DI1GD3LP/#overview

would you prioritize them for me, illustrating the pros and cons of each one?


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## Recus (Nov 9, 2011)

MoondanceR said:


> thank you all for the great tips, I really appreciate your help.
> Although I checked the market here and there's no gt 240 so it's now definitely a gt 430 and there are three modules available:
> http://www.msi.com/product/vga/N430GT-MD1GD3-OC.html#?div=Overview
> 
> would you prioritize them for me, illustrating the pros and cons of each one?



With 128bits.

Btw, AC delayed till November 25.


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## MoondanceR (Nov 10, 2011)

maybe because it's overclocked! The MSI one is 10$ more expensive than the other two, does the core clock speed improve the PhsyX performance? Does it consumes more power? (I apologize for asking too many questions, but I want to learn and you guys are the best)


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## crazyeyesreaper (Nov 10, 2011)

no it dosent, help

its ROP count that matters for Physx and shader count to an extent,

after a certain amount is available it dosent matter

GT 430 is just as good as a 460 because it surpasses the sweet spot on specs overclocking wont help much not if its only 10mhz look at the bench numbers

430 to 460 is a 1-4fps bump and yet the 460 in most games by itself is 3x the performance  3x the capability 1% performance difference

again get the cheapest GT 430 you can get it wont matter.


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## MoondanceR (Dec 21, 2011)

I couldn't find a 430 gt 
the results from using gt240:
settings:
1920 X 1080
Anti Aliasing: 8X MSAA
Detail Level: extreme
Direct X 9
V Sync: off
Everything else: yes
PhysX: High

GPUs: hd6950 + gt240
Drivers: 11.12 + 285.62
PhysX: 9.11.0621
works with v1.05ff

Batman Arkham City
minimum: 16
maximum: 59
Average: 36

What's your opinion on these results?


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