# Maybe an upgrade for christmas?



## Bigjohn (Dec 14, 2010)

I have an EVGA 780i motherboard - that's a keeper for me at this time.
There are 2 components that I might be able to upgrade (My system is Water Cooled - and I don't want to invest to much - nor buy new water blocks if I can help it).

8gb ram (maxed out)
E8400 dual core (clocked to 3.6ghz)  <<good cpu, but would a quad core do better?)
Evga 260gtx core 216 (love this, but if I can find a better card inexpensively enough - double plus if it can use the same water block!)
Or add in a second 260gtx to go SLI?

All suggestions welcome guys...
I'm not a major FPS gamer  - play mainly Supreme Commander Forged Alliance (believe it!)...

So - what say you?


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## newtekie1 (Dec 14, 2010)

I think if Supreme Commander is your main game, then a Quad would likely definitely be the best choice.  If you drop a Q9650/9550 in there and get it up to 3.6GHz+ you will be set CPU wise for a few years to come with games.

Then focus on the graphics card next.


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## cdawall (Dec 14, 2010)

Quad core or just a second gtx the quad is a great choice


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## Bigjohn (Dec 14, 2010)

cdawall said:


> Quad core or just a second gtx the quad is a great choice



Thanks.  WOW, even with the core i series out and running INTEL is pretty damn proud of those Core2Quads!
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80569Q9550  -- 275$$!


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## cdawall (Dec 14, 2010)

Any of the q series chip qould be an upgrade q8400 hell a q6600 would help


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

$275? You could move over to a Phenom II quad for that plus have some left. Where are you pricing that chip at?


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## Josh154 (Dec 14, 2010)

thats newegg prices


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## cdawall (Dec 14, 2010)

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php...be149b4cc5429ddc8504657cb224ab15967fa06ffe879

Q9450


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## newtekie1 (Dec 14, 2010)

Bigjohn said:


> Thanks.  WOW, even with the core i series out and running INTEL is pretty damn proud of those Core2Quads!
> Intel Core 2 Quad Q9550 Yorkfield 2.83GHz LGA 775 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80569Q9550  -- 275$$!





JrRacinFan said:


> $275? You could move over to a Phenom II quad for that plus have some left. Where are you pricing that chip at?



That is because these chips are just that damn good.  The Q9650 is only a percent or two behind the 965 BE and the 965 has a 400MHz clock speed advantage.  Clock for clock the Q9650/9550 is faster than the Phenom II, and both will pretty much top out at about the same clock speeds under air.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 14, 2010)

Josh154 said:


> thats newegg prices



Right.
The reason I'm kind of tight focused here is to have no requirement to replace or modify my cooling loops in any way...... even if I add a second video card the second/new card would stay on AIR cooling...


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> That is because these chips are just that damn good.  The Q9650 is only a percent or two behind the 965 BE and the 965 has a 400MHz clock speed advantage.  Clock for clock the Q9650/9550 is faster than the Phenom II, and both will pretty much top out at about the same clock speeds under air.



Yah and the 965 is near half the price.


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## cdawall (Dec 14, 2010)

What if you did swap to amd and got an ok 880g board and phenom x6?


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## newtekie1 (Dec 14, 2010)

JrRacinFan said:


> Yah and the 965 is near half the price.



Not when you factor in a board comparable to the 780i w/ 3 true PCI-E x16 slots that can push the 965 over 4GHz to compete with the Q9650@3.8GHz+.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 14, 2010)

cdawall said:


> What if you did swap to amd and got an ok 880g board and phenom x6?



I'd have to completely redo the cooling loops, and, perhaps need to buy new waterblock....

But great discussion guys! keep it coming!


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> Not when you factor in a board comparable to the 780i w/ 3 true PCI-E x16 slots that can push the 965 over 4GHz to compete with the Q9650@3.8GHz+.



Never said anything about motherboards besides OP is running a single card anyways and Tri SLI is a waste. 780i can be resold also if need be.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 14, 2010)

JrRacinFan said:


> Never said anything about motherboards besides OP is running a single card anyways and Tri SLI is a waste. 780i can be resold also if need be.



True.  But Im only going to have a day to get the system back up and working... If I just upgrade the CPU I won't have to reinstall the OS, nor will I if I just upgrade the video card...

How are the 400 series cards compared to my 260gtx?


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

Bigjohn said:


> If I just upgrade the CPU I won't have to reinstall the OS



Reinstall? What's that?  Got Windows 7?  It migrates pretty well between different hardware architectures, i'd say about 99.9999999% near flawless. 

Yes, my point is, I am still on the same installation of Windows 7 that I've migrated between AMD and Intel about 4 times now over the past year. No problems here. 



Bigjohn said:


> nor will I if I just upgrade the video card...



Whats the fun in that!? 

@newtekie

Another point regarding your 3x 16x slots. 8x slots arent noticeably slower anyways.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 14, 2010)

LOL
I've been playing with Windows since before 3.0...
This version was upgraded from win98 to Win2k to XP, then registry hacked onto XP64... through 3 different mainboards / CPUs.
It just takes more than a minute... and if you forget a step, you start over (better have a backup!)

Win7 has some issues that I just don't care for.


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## newtekie1 (Dec 14, 2010)

JrRacinFan said:


> Reinstall? What's that?  Got Windows 7?  It migrates pretty well between different hardware architectures, i'd say about 99.9999999% near flawless.
> 
> Yes, my point is, I am still on the same installation of Windows 7 that I've migrated between AMD and Intel about 4 times now over the past year. No problems here.
> 
> ...



It is always best to re-install whenever changing the motherboard, even when using the same platform.

Yes, Win7 and Vista will handle switching over and usually work, however it is never as smooth as a fresh install.

As for the x8 slots, yes there really isn't a noticeable difference, but even still to get a decent board that will push a 965BE up over 4GHz is going to bring the cost up to the same as just getting a Q9650 or even higher.

Then add to that the fact that all decent AMD boards these days use DDR3 and the 780i uses DDR2, so add some more cost on top.  Yes, he can sell his old RAM and motherboard to recoup some of the cost, but the used hardware segment isn't exactly booming, and it probably wouldn't get $150 for the 8GB of RAM and motherboard combined.


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## cdawall (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> It is always best to re-install whenever changing the motherboard, even when using the same platform.
> 
> Yes, Win7 and Vista will handle switching over and usually work, however it is never as smooth as a fresh install.
> 
> ...



Agreed get any of the q series chips and call it good


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> Then add to that the fact that all decent AMD boards these days use DDR3 and the 780i uses DDR2, so add some more cost on top.  Yes, he can sell his old RAM and motherboard to recoup some of the cost, but the used hardware segment isn't exactly booming, and it probably wouldn't get $150 for the 8GB of RAM and motherboard combined.



Oh really?? What about the 790x board I got for sale? Even at that nearly 75% of AM2+/3 can push a 965 to 4GHz easily. Oh and take a peak here: 

This is the Athlon II x4 635($115 cpu) pitted against the Q9650($250 cpu).

This is 965 Black vs Q9650


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## newtekie1 (Dec 14, 2010)

JrRacinFan said:


> Oh really?? What about the 790x board I got for sale? Even at that nearly 75% of AM2+/3 can push a 965 to 4GHz easily. Oh and take a peak here:
> 
> This is the Athlon II x4 635($115 cpu) pitted against the Q9650($250 cpu).
> 
> This is 965 Black vs Q9650



I don't see what the Q9650 destroying the 635 has to do with anything.
And yes, as I said the 965BE is pretty close in performance to the Q9650 within 1% like I said despite a 400MHz clock advantage.

And I have a hard time believe that 75% of AM3 boards will do the 4.0GHz+ needed to surpass the Q9650@3.6GHz+ considering that the last review done on TPU of the 970BE coudln't get it over 3.9GHz in a Crosshair IV Formula.


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> I don't see what the Q9650 destroying the 635 has to do with anything.
> And yes, as I said the 965BE is pretty close in performance to the Q9650 within 1% like I said despite a 400MHz clock advantage.
> 
> And I have a hard time believe that 75% of AM3 boards will do the 4.0GHz+ needed to surpass the Q9650@3.6GHz+ considering that the last review done on TPU of the 970BE coudln't get it over 3.9GHz in a Crosshair IV Formula.



In the end, go AMD, sell your current s775 and come out with a quad upgrade for half the cost of the Q9650 with performing just as good. That's all i am saying. Oh and that's the 970BE which in point isn't that great.
Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptop Computers, L...
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 ...

I bet the OP could get $150, leaving his upgrade at a leftover cost of ~$125, little over the cost of the chip.


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## cdawall (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> I don't see what the Q9650 destroying the 635 has to do with anything.
> And yes, as I said the 965BE is pretty close in performance to the Q9650 within 1% like I said despite a 400MHz clock advantage.
> 
> And I have a hard time believe that 75% of AM3 boards will do the 4.0GHz+ needed to surpass the Q9650@3.6GHz+ considering that the last review done on TPU of the 970BE coudln't get it over 3.9GHz in a Crosshair IV Formula.



Hand me tpus chip and board and I bet I can get that chip 4.2ghz stable in linx. Its a review they don't have the time to tweak like I would or you would or jr would etc.


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## newtekie1 (Dec 14, 2010)

JrRacinFan said:


> In the end, go AMD, sell your current s775 and come out with a quad upgrade for half the cost of the Q9650 with performing just as good. That's all i am saying. Oh and that's the 970BE which in point isn't that great.
> Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptop Computers, L...
> G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 ...



Add another $70 to that for 8GB of RAM to match the 775 setup.

Yes, that would be a good setup, no it wouldn't perform the same as the Q9650, but it would probably be close enough.


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> Add another $70 to that for 8GB of RAM to match the 775 setup.
> 
> Yes, that would be a good setup, no it wouldn't perform the same as the Q9650, but it would probably be close enough.



Try $40 but granted it is a touch slower ram but at a lower voltage
GeIL Value PLUS 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM D...

EDIT:

Also another point I need to add THAT I DO AGREE WITH YOU is, if gaming a higher clocked dual core is good enough. So even if moving over to quad I know I wouldn't be happy coming from an e8400. I myself personally would want to go Xeon X3440 or i7 8x0 (4 core 8 thread), skipping over s775 and am3 quads. Which also brings up another moot point, How soon is Intel releasing it's Sandy bridge lineup with P67 boards? In reality my point is this, don't go out and just buy something. Put some thought and research into things.


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## newtekie1 (Dec 14, 2010)

JrRacinFan said:


> Try $40 but granted it is a touch slower ram but at a lower voltage
> GeIL Value PLUS 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM D...
> 
> EDIT:
> ...



For his gaming, Supreme Commander, a quad definitely will show an improvement over the Dual.


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 14, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> For his gaming, Supreme Commander, a quad definitely will show an improvement over the Dual.



Very VERY true.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 14, 2010)

Thanks for all the good info guys.


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## Josh154 (Dec 14, 2010)

Idk it wouldn't be that bad to just drop a new chip in that 780i. Im dropping a q9450 in my 750i for christmas over the q6600. Their great chips still and i found one for $180 new.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 15, 2010)

Ok. SO dropping in a QUAD replacement is what I think I'll be doing.

Recommendations on "best bang for the buck" - 200 max? (175 would be better....) on a C2Quad?


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## Josh154 (Dec 15, 2010)

Bigjohn said:


> Ok. SO dropping in a QUAD replacement is what I think I'll be doing.
> 
> Recommendations on "best bang for the buck" - 200 max? (175 would be better....) on a C2Quad?



q9550's can be found for 180USD and im not sure about what a q9650 goes for. Do you need to buy new? If so the only place i can think of new for a c2q for under 200 would be a 9450.


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## Dent1 (Dec 15, 2010)

Bigjohn said:


> Ok. SO dropping in a QUAD replacement is what I think I'll be doing.
> 
> Recommendations on "best bang for the buck" - 200 max? (175 would be better....) on a C2Quad?



No such thing as "bang for your buck" with the C2D Quads, they are overpriced. Maybe you can find a Q9xxx on Ebay but if you are expecting a bargain buying new forget it.

For $200 you could pick up a Phenom II X4 and AM3 motherboard and you'll have the prospect of getting a X6 next year. Or you could spend $160 and buy a Athlon II X4 and AM3 motherboard again allowing for expansion for a X6 next year. Your current DDR2 memory can be used, both options will give you the performance of the C2D at the same price whilst giving you room to upgrade.

Edit: Selling your E8400 and socket 775 mobo will make the upgrade nearly free.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 15, 2010)

Dent1 said:


> No such thing as "bang for your buck" with the C2D Quads, they are overpriced. Maybe you can find a Q9xxx on Ebay but if you are expecting a bargain buying new forget it.
> 
> For $200 you could pick up a Phenom II X4 and AM3 motherboard and you'll have the prospect of getting a X6 next year. Or you could spend $160 and buy a Athlon II X4 and AM3 motherboard again allowing for expansion for a X6 next year. Your current DDR2 memory can be used, both options will give you the performance of the C2D at the same price whilst giving you room to upgrade.
> 
> Edit: Selling your E8400 and socket 775 mobo will make the upgrade nearly free.



I hear you - but 2 objectives exist:
Can't mess up my water loops (so a new mobo is out of the question unless there is an AM3 out there with virtually the same layout that will accept the same water block/mounting that I have on the 780i mobo.

and
Needs to be doable in a DAY.
(I use the PC for business too...)


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## newtekie1 (Dec 15, 2010)

For $200 you are going to want to look for a Q9550 or Q9505 used.  But I say go big or go home, and just spend the extra $100 for a Q9650.


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 15, 2010)

Dent1 said:


> No such thing as "bang for your buck" with the C2D Quads, they are overpriced. Maybe you can find a Q9xxx on Ebay but if you are expecting a bargain buying new forget it.
> 
> For $200 you could pick up a Phenom II X4 and AM3 motherboard and you'll have the prospect of getting a X6 next year. Or you could spend $160 and buy a Athlon II X4 and AM3 motherboard again allowing for expansion for a X6 next year. Your current DDR2 memory can be used, both options will give you the performance of the C2D at the same price whilst giving you room to upgrade.
> 
> Edit: Selling your E8400 and socket 775 mobo will make the upgrade nearly free.



Already been there Dent1. Read throughout the thread.


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## Josh154 (Dec 15, 2010)

Yeah it's up to you man. A q9550 would be a sweet upgrade. Man im rocking a q6600 and it does everything i need it to and doesn't bottleneck me any. Im thinking about getting a 9550 though just to be more futureproof.


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## brandonwh64 (Dec 15, 2010)

Here is some Q9550s for sale

200$

160$

No Price shown

203$

Q6600 110$

210$

Ask if he will part


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## Bigjohn (Dec 15, 2010)

brandonwh64 said:


> Here is some Q9550s for sale
> 
> 200$
> 
> ...


Thanks... will check those out... 
I can pick up a Q9300 for $100 New In Box... - good deal? or not so much?


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## brandonwh64 (Dec 15, 2010)

Q9550 = 12mb cache
Q9300 = 6mb cache

I would go for the 12mb for longevity


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 15, 2010)

Q6600 for $110? I'd go that route. Only reason, you got the watercooling to help keep the 65nm counterpart a little cooler.


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## Josh154 (Dec 15, 2010)

Yeah that chip for $110 is a b3 though. You can easilly find g0's for about $100 bucks. I paid $100 for my g0.


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## Bigjohn (Dec 15, 2010)

Josh154 said:


> Yeah that chip for $110 is a b3 though. You can easilly find g0's for about $100 bucks. I paid $100 for my g0.



Umm? english?


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 15, 2010)

Bigjohn said:


> Umm? english?



B3 requires a touch more voltage over G0 and doesn't clock quite as good. Requires more tweaking to get stable.


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## newtekie1 (Dec 15, 2010)

brandonwh64 said:


> Here is some Q9550s for sale
> 
> 200$
> 
> ...



That Xeon X3360 is a damn good deal for $160, I might pick that one up myself.


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## JrRacinFan (Dec 15, 2010)

newtekie1 said:


> That Xeon X3360 is a damn good deal for $160, I might pick that one up myself.



Was sold on 12/10. =/


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## brandonwh64 (Dec 15, 2010)

Yea some are sold but there is still some available around 200-210


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## Bigjohn (Dec 16, 2010)

Y'all got me thinking... If I can find a board for an AMD PhenomII x4 (970) that has a similar enough layout.... I might just go all the way...

Or get the 9450....

Oh, if I didn't have 2 kids in college....


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## Josh154 (Dec 16, 2010)

Bigjohn said:


> Y'all got me thinking... If I can find a board for an AMD PhenomII x4 (970) that has a similar enough layout.... I might just go all the way...
> 
> Or get the 9450....
> 
> Oh, if I didn't have 2 kids in college....



Shoot i ain't even in college yet im still in high school


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## AlienIsGOD (Dec 16, 2010)

Q9450 FTW!!!  Good chip rite there !!  I run mine at 3ghz with my crappy CM GeminII, but ive had it up as high as 3.5-3.6ghz


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## Bigjohn (Dec 16, 2010)

Josh154 said:


> Shoot i ain't even in college yet im still in high school



I've built over  300 computers with my 2 hands, not including the upgrades I did to TRS-80 mod3's back in the day....
I still have a working 386 in the basement, and a 486dx2/66....
My first hard drive was as large as a shoe box, cost me $399, and held a whopping 5MB of data (thats Mega bytes...).  it's amazing that a chip the size of my thumbnail can hold 16gb and slip into a phone more powerful than my first PC...

John


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## Josh154 (Dec 16, 2010)

Yeah haha and im sure when I get to be your age ill be saying the exact same thing  technology is amazing at how fast new things are developed.


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