# Metro Exodus Ditches Steam for Epic Games Store as Timed Exclusive



## btarunr (Jan 28, 2019)

Metro Exodus is an upcoming post-apocalyptic first-person shooter that could be a trilogy finale. Just weeks ahead of its launch on the PC platform, 4A Games made a groundbreaking announcement: that the game will not be available to order on Steam, at least from tomorrow through Feb 14, 2020, and that its PC version will be an Epic Games Store timed exclusive. The game will launch at USD $49.99 in North America, and 59.95€ in the EU. 

Pre-order sales of the game have stopped on Steam, however, those who bought the pre-order on Steam have the option of either receiving the game upon launch, or canceling their pre-order for a full refund. Those who choose to stick to Steam will get their game as usual, including update patches, and support on Steam Community. Epic Games Store is vacuuming game studios in droves due to a favorable revenue sharing deal compared to Steam, when lets developers keep 88 percent of the sales. 





*View at TechPowerUp Main Site*


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## Lightning (Jan 28, 2019)

Steam said:
			
		

> Later today, sales of Metro Exodus will be discontinued on Steam due to a publisher decision to make the game exclusive to another PC store.
> The developer and publisher have assured us that all prior sales of the game on Steam will be fulfilled on Steam, and Steam owners will be able to access the game and any future updates or DLC through Steam.
> We think the decision to remove the game is unfair to Steam customers, especially after a long pre-sale period. We apologize to Steam customers that were expecting it to be available for sale through the February 15th release date, but we were only recently informed of the decision and given limited time to let everyone know.


Killing one channel with millions of possible buyers for a bit more money per sale from a _way_ smaller market (Epic Game store).
Marketing 9000+.


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## diatribe (Jan 28, 2019)

One less sale I guess.  Too bad, I wanted to give it a play through.  But there's no way I'm adding any more launchers on my machine.


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## Deleted member 158293 (Jan 28, 2019)

Companies buying exclusivity (monopoly) always ends up expensive for the consumer long term.


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## the54thvoid (Jan 28, 2019)

yakk said:


> Companies buying exclusivity (monopoly) always ends up expensive for the consumer long term.



Yes, destroy the competition then once there is no other alternative, raise prices significantly.


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## Joss (Jan 28, 2019)

One less customer here.


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## Lightofhonor (Jan 28, 2019)

You could say they are leading the EXODUS from Steam?


I'll see myself out.


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## R0H1T (Jan 28, 2019)

the54thvoid said:


> Yes, destroy the competition then once there is no other alternative, raise prices significantly.


Sounds like every monopoly or wannabe monopolist ever


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## nickbaldwin86 (Jan 28, 2019)

this is the world they are forcing us to live in these days 

Why cant we just pick the game up from any platform that could run it. I mean I know it would be weird if it was open to EA (Origin)  but Steam is level playing, or should be.


I wish I would have preordered, I don't ever but if I would have known this I would have just so all Metro games were on Steam.


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## UrbanCamper (Jan 28, 2019)

As of right now it is still available on Steam. Supposedly, if you buy before the change over(later today) you will still be able to access through Steam.

As a side note a company called Tencent Holdings Limited owns 48% of Epic games. It is a Chinese company and is the largest gaming company in the world. They also handle the majority of money transactions for gaming in China. not sure how that shakes out with Epic.

I just got it on Steam.


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## AusWolf (Jan 28, 2019)

One more bloatware on my PC for just one game. I love the Metro series, but I think I'll say "thanks, but no thanks" this time. Sad.


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## human_error (Jan 28, 2019)

I bet this will be a timed exclusive to maximize the number of gamers buying it from Epic before making it available on steam a little later on to sell to gamers who only want it on steam.

I'm hoping that all of this is going to push Valve to be more price competitive for developers. Valve are not wanting for money but the question is where does the loss of revenue from game sales on other stores overtake the loss of revenue they'd get by lowering their fee for all games on steam.


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## silentbogo (Jan 28, 2019)

Here we go, one more game I'll never get to enjoy. 
At least they will fulfill their obligations for steam pre-orders.
The only way I will switch to Epic Store, is if they get at least half as many games as Valve.  So far, having Division 2 and Metro Exodus under the belt can hardly be a reason for me (or anyone else) to even download the installer. There's like 2 dozen games, third of which isn't even out yet, third of which are free, and another third is small indie crap, that Epic will give away for free until there's nothing to give away.



UrbanCamper said:


> As a side note a company called Tencent Holdings Limited owns 48% of Epic games.


That's good to know. I wasn't aware of that, but it makes sense now (Tencent OP making indirect move on western market).


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## Deleted member 158293 (Jan 28, 2019)

UrbanCamper said:


> As a side note a company called Tencent Holdings Limited owns 48% of Epic games. It is a Chinese company and is the largest gaming company in the world. They also handle the majority of money transactions for gaming in China. not sure how that shakes out with Epic.



Tencent bought into many platforms in recent years with games like League of Legends.  Looks like they are really targeting Valve with Steam & Dota2.


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## Gasaraki (Jan 28, 2019)

Great... I can see the reason but customers will now have to install ANOTHER client.

It looks like people on here love the Steam monopoly.


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## UrbanCamper (Jan 28, 2019)

According to Steam if you buy it on Steam you can download and play on Steam. Did I say Steam enough?

As per this article.  https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/20...otgun/steam+(Rock,+Paper,+Shotgun:+Steam+RSS)


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## AusWolf (Jan 28, 2019)

From the FAQ on Steam:
*"Will Metro Exodus ever return to Steam?*
_Yes - Metro Exodus will return to Steam and on other store fronts after 14th February 2020."_


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## 8tyone (Jan 28, 2019)

Good move, I will support 4A Games no matter what!


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

Lightning said:


> Killing one channel with millions of possible buyers for a bit more money per sale from a _way_ smaller market (Epic Game store).
> Marketing 9000+.



I don't blame them, EPic Games probably offered them so much money they can all retire tomorrow if they want. This was more a direct attack on Steam from Epic than it was about this particular game. Gotta survive in this world, take the money and run baby.

Also, I believe some if not all Epic contracts lately state, "if x game does not sell x amount of copies in x amount of time, we will refund you the difference" so its a no risk situation.

that fortnite money is unstoppable baby.  and quite frankly steam's 30% margin shares are outdated, it made sense when box game sales were taking 60% margin shares and steam undercut them... now its all digital and steam has someone undercutting them. this is good for everyone imo, this will eventually force gabes hand - and companies will get more money in their pocket allowing them to make more games or hire more people for better quality games, alternatively, companies can sell games on steam and epic games and just pro-rate the price, if you want to pay $10 to steam for the community then do it, but if you want to pay less then buy it off epicgames.  i suppose that is also a fair idea. would be interesting to see who would win, indie games would prob win on epic, AAA still on steam, but who knows.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 28, 2019)

Bad news for Steam is that the Epic store pre order is $49.99. That’s a full $10 cheaper.

GOG so far has 1,203 people signed into the community wishlist for Exodus.


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

AusWolf said:


> From the FAQ on Steam:
> *"Will Metro Exodus ever return to Steam?*
> _Yes - Metro Exodus will return to Steam and on other store fronts after 14th February 2020."_



seems like such a bad publicity to allow this, lol.  loads of bad publicity all for 16 days of a sale window?  unless they check they wrote was massive... which im sure it was, this is a huge mistake...


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## ab3e (Jan 28, 2019)

Lets all be serious now and accept the fact that Steam has done nothing to improve the platform for years. STEAM literally prints money and they invested none of it back into the platform. Not to mention the shady games and cash grabs that can be launched on the platform with almost no oversight. Let them feel a bit of pressure, as for me I don't care I will support 4A games because developers like them deserve our support now more then ever. All all of you victims out there that cannot install another launcher I hope you will be able to survive this 1st world problem, pathetic, bunch of depressed sad space monkeys. You think STEAM gives a damn about you.... refund policy arrived years after public outcry only when Australia sued their lazy asses and won and the EU was breathing down their neck they finally caved. And you all defend STEAM, pathetic and sad.


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

ab3e said:


> Lets all be serious now and accept the fact that Steam has done nothing to improve the platform for years. STEAM literally prints money and they invested none of it back into the platform. Not to mention the shady games and cash grabs that can be launched on the platform with almost no oversight. Let them feel a bit of pressure, as for me I don't care I will support 4A games because developers like them deserve our support now more then ever. All all of you victims out there that cannot install another launcher I hope you will be able to survive this 1st world problem, pathetic, bunch of depressed sad space monkeys. You think STEAM gives a damn about you.... refund policy arrived years after public outcry only when Australia sued their lazy asses and won and the EU was breathing down their neck they finally caved. And you all defend STEAM, pathetic and sad.



lets not forget steam was the first one to require client login drm for exclusive games LOL but gabe is a god now so we all must worship him and forget the double standard, lol


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 28, 2019)

I took a look at the Epic Store. They so far are the only ones listing Rbel Galaxy: Outlaw, a prequel to Rebel Galaxy.  Epic might be worth looking at is all I am saying, for those not 100% committed to GOG or Steam.


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> I took a look at the Epic Store. They so far are the only ones listing Rbel Galaxy: Outlaw, a prequel to Rebel Galaxy.  Epic might be worth looking at is all I am saying, for those not 100% committed to GOG or Steam.



i use every client out there personally, never had an issue. epic games has already given me 2 free games i intended to buy at some point lol, sure why not. this is capitalism baby and gabe needs to learn that the 30% model is outdated, it wasn't ten years ago, but it is now. time to compete.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 28, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> I took a look at the Epic Store. They so far are the only ones listing Rbel Galaxy: Outlaw, a prequel to Rebel Galaxy.  Epic might be worth looking at is all I am saying, for those not 100% committed to GOG or Steam.


Whichh I REALLY WANT!


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## TheOne (Jan 28, 2019)

I was for another digital store until they started doing exclusives.


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## R0H1T (Jan 28, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> this is capitalism baby.


Be careful what you wish for 


the54thvoid said:


> Yes, destroy the competition then once there is no other alternative, raise prices significantly.


So long as GOG, Steam et al are healthy & profitable it's good for the consumers. The day they turn to red/go bust we'll see exactly what we're seeing in the GPU space or CPUs previously for a good decade, if not more.


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## Manu_PT (Jan 28, 2019)

And they keep hurting PC gaming. Yes I know some don´t care about having 10 different stores installed to play games, but a lot do and this starts to be another factor in favour of consoles.


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## Deleted member 158293 (Jan 28, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> seems like such a bad publicity to allow this, lol.  loads of bad publicity all for 16 days of a sale window?  unless they check they wrote was massive... which im sure it was, this is a huge mistake...



1 year & 16 days


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

R0H1T said:


> Be careful what you wish for So long as GOG, Steam et al are healthy & profitable it's good for the consumers. The day they turn to red/go bust we'll see exactly what we're seeing in the GPU space or CPUs previously for a good decade, if not more.



oh? lower prices is a bad thing and more profit for the game makers? sure thing. also i could care less if gaming died, its one of my many hobbies, i will simply read more adventures instead of play them, welcome to 1st world issues.



yakk said:


> 1 year & 16 days



my brain must have died, lol thanks for clarifying, that makes more sense.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 28, 2019)

The only issue I have with Epic is it’s just a storefront that well, appears to be poaching games.  Steam is WAY more than just a storefront and we all know it..


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## ab3e (Jan 28, 2019)

We need to support 4A Games as a publisher, put aside this stupid linear and tunnel vision way of thinking. They are a small studio they do need funds and if Epic were able to help them out good for them. We always cry about greedy AAA publishers and about miscrotransaction and how they ruin the art of creating video games. Now instead of supporting an amazing developer we hide behind a stupid insignificant things like installing a new launcher. Well I guess we do not deserve publishers like them. When all of us will swim in the vast ocean of microtranscation purgatory in a few years don't cry because we deserve every single drop of it.


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## R0H1T (Jan 28, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> oh? *lower prices* is a bad thing and more profit for the game makers? sure thing. also i could care less if gaming died, its one of my many hobbies, *i will simply read more adventures* instead of play them, welcome to 1st world issues.
> 
> 
> 
> my brain must have died, lol thanks for clarifying, that makes more sense.


Who said lower prices, for consumers, is a bad thing? But not some of these "introductory" prices, which can get jacked up when there's a monopoly or just one store selling that game.

Good to know, if it weren't for insane prices of hard/soft cover books these days I'd also read more. Reading books on a tablet, e reader is not something I fancy - having grown up in a time/place where the feel of books IMO will never be usurped.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 28, 2019)

Lightning said:


> Killing one channel with millions of possible buyers for a bit more money per sale from a _way_ smaller market (Epic Game store).
> Marketing 9000+.



I think the game sells itself anyway, the platform isn't relevant at all.

Which is the actual take away here, I think. Its just a store, people. Steam too, no matter how much additional BS they build around it.



ab3e said:


> We need to support 4A Games as a publisher, put aside this stupid linear and tunnel vision way of thinking. They are a small studio they do need funds and if Epic were able to help them out good for them. We always cry about greedy AAA publishers and about miscrotransaction and how they ruin the art of creating video games. Now instead of supporting an amazing developer we hide behind a stupid insignificant things like installing a new launcher. Well I guess we do not deserve publishers like them. When all of us will swim in the vast ocean of microtranscation purgatory in a few years don't cry because we deserve every single drop of it.



Precisely! Its not even about 'the DRM' anymore, which in the case of the double DRM of back when with Steam moving to buggy Uplay + shitty servers is absolutely justified.


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

R0H1T said:


> Who said lower prices, for consumers, is a bad thing? But not some of these "introductory" prices, which can get jacked up when there's a monopoly or just one store selling that game.
> 
> Good to know, if it weren't for insane prices of hard/soft cover books these days I'd also read more. Reading books on a tablet, e reader is not something I fancy - having grown up in a time/place where the feel of books IMO will never be usurped.



I go to the public library, and if they don't have the book I want they order it for me. Evergreen Indiana is a united one state library, it's pretty neat, and free. I guess I am set even if the book industry begins to fail since I have such a large backlog. Cheers for reminding me.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 28, 2019)

ab3e said:


> We need to support 4A Games as a publisher, put aside this stupid linear and tunnel vision way of thinking. They are a small studio they do need funds and if Epic were able to help them out good for them. We always cry about greedy AAA publishers and about miscrotransaction and how they ruin the art of creating video games. Now instead of supporting an amazing developer we hide behind a stupid insignificant things like installing a new launcher. Well I guess we do not deserve publishers like them. When all of us will swim in the vast ocean of microtranscation purgatory in a few years don't cry because we deserve every single drop of it.


Well said. I’m going to vote with my wallet and get Exodus on Epic.  There is no guarantee it will ever come to GOG, and it’s cheaper on Epic than Steam. 

Steam has become a middle aged parent totally out of touch with their kids.  Frankly it reeks of mothballs.  It is a confusing jumble of so many worthless games and early access, some which never finish, and a few good ones.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 28, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> Well said. I’m going to vote with my wallet and get Exodus on Epic.  There is no guarantee it will ever come to GOG, and it’s cheaper on Epic than Steam.
> 
> Steam has become a middle aged parent totally out of touch with their kids.  Frankly it reeks of mothballs.  It is a confusing jumble of so many worthless games and early access, some which never finish, and a few good ones.



The last time I browsed Steam and ended up with an interesting game to play was... I honestly can't remember. Its always been just a store for me. With a neat library and workshop function, but game devs can manage that last one just fine themselves, they only had to connect to it.

I must say if I compare that to for example GOG as a store, GOG seems to be so much neater, more organized, less cluttered and better curated.


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## Ravenmaster (Jan 28, 2019)

Valve are getting exactly what they deserve here for being greedy with fees.


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

Ravenmaster said:


> Valve are getting exactly what they deserve here for being greedy with fees.



like most monopolies they just became lazy until competition arrived, hopefully gabe re-thinks his strategies.


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## silentbogo (Jan 28, 2019)

ab3e said:


> Lets all be serious now and accept the fact that Steam has done nothing to improve the platform for years.


That's a bit of a narrow view. Check out Jim Sterling's channel. He had lots to say about it this year, including a big "sitdown" with steam curators, improvements of the game validation process, cleaning up the mess and banning dishonest "developers".
There are still problems, for sure, but there has been lots of movement in the right direction.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 28, 2019)

silentbogo said:


> That's a bit of a narrow view. Check out Jim Sterling's channel. He had lots to say about it this year, including a big "sitdown" with steam curators, improvements of the game validation process, cleaning up the mess and banning dishonest "developers".
> There are still problems, for sure, but there has been lots of movement in the right direction.



Well, given the % of the market they own, they should be doing a hell of a lot more. This feels like a skeleton crew at work. Valve time may apply for their gaming, but a marketplace won't accept it.


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## Ravenmaster (Jan 28, 2019)

lynx29 said:


> like most monopolies they just became lazy until competition arrived, hopefully gabe re-thinks his strategies.


Yeah hopefully he'll shit can Artifact after its lackluster following and finally make Half Life 3 (the game pretty much every man, woman and dog wanted to be announced at TI7 but wasn't).


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## Space Lynx (Jan 28, 2019)

Vayra86 said:


> Well, given the % of the market they own, they should be doing a hell of a lot more. This feels like a skeleton crew at work. Valve time may apply for their gaming, but a marketplace won't accept it.



I like how it still takes this multi billion dollar private company called Steam 2 weeks sometimes to reply to a question to customer service. Absolutely amazes me. I asked about the Christmas knock-knack badge from the 2018 holiday, and why it is permanent on everyones profile page, I hate that brown turd right at the top of my steam profile and crafting new badges doesn't slide it over like other badges get slid over... I spent a lot of time making my profile pleasing to the eye as a lot of people I know have.  Valve and Gabe just do not get it anymore, old and lazy and out of touch. I am really glad Epic Games is kicking major butt lately, and this is only the beginning I think, they are coming at Steam like a freight train with insane amounts of Fortnite money to back them up, because they know Fortnite won't last forever and they want a more permanent foundation.


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## CrAsHnBuRnXp (Jan 28, 2019)

One less game I wont get to not finish.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 28, 2019)

yakk said:


> Companies buying exclusivity (monopoly) always ends up expensive for the consumer long term.


I highly doubt there's any exclusivity agreement involved.  Epic Games Store simply makes an offer that makes everyone else look like highway robbery (and it's true, really).  Costs to distribute games are constantly falling but the amount distributors ask for does not.  It's past due time for that to change.  Developers/publishers deserve a bigger share.


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## etayorius (Jan 28, 2019)

Well, that's unfortunate. Now I won't get to experience their game, and they won't get to experience my money. Lose/lose.

Anyway, why can't it be on both stores or all the other ones out there too? i can't believe how people are defending this nonsense with "Developer will earn more cash in Epic Store". This is basically giving the finger to Steam consumers. I own over 450 Titles on Steam and i am not about to give up my library for one or two titles. I will no longer support any other Digital Store appart from Steam and GoG. This is not Competition, this is a new low for Deep Silver. Poor Metro Devs.

Back in the days of physical distribution copies retailers took nearly half the cash of every sale, and everyone was ok with it. Steam comes with their new System of Digital Distribution taking only a 30% and everyone moves there with joy. Now a decade later everyone shitting on Steam because they are supposedly being "unfair" to Developers. Trading in a few extra % Cash instead of all the possible sales on Steam. Idiotic move, plus all the hate from the PC Gamers out there, which are 95% of Steam users. Publishers are just getting greedier and want every little extra cash possible. I think Steam could offer to cut their 30% to 20% to basically every title on Steam and it's still fair because of the massive amount of Steam users there.


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## Diverge (Jan 28, 2019)

If all game manufacturers stop releasing on steam, I guess I'll go back to playing cracked copies of games.. Same goes for all the tv/movie content providers moving to their own streaming services.... People don't want dozens of accounts, services, etc... at least I don't.


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## Joss (Jan 28, 2019)

Please don't forget what Valve did and is doing for Linux. They're not just another greedy monopoly.


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## TheGuruStud (Jan 28, 2019)

TheOne said:


> I was for another digital store until they started doing exclusives.



This is clearly how you make valve bend. If everyone starts jumping ship, then they'll have to lower prices. Steam markup is the same as apple, insane.


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## TheOne (Jan 28, 2019)

TheGuruStud said:


> This is clearly how you make valve bend. If everyone starts jumping ship, then they'll have to lower prices. Steam markup is the same as apple, insane.



Epic is definitely a developer first store.


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## SN2716057 (Jan 28, 2019)

"The game will launch at USD $49.99 in North America, and €59.95 in the EU. "

Wow, I'll wait when the game cost 5 euro..on gog.


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## Deleted member 158293 (Jan 28, 2019)

FordGT90Concept said:


> I highly doubt there's any exclusivity agreement involved.  Epic Games Store simply makes an offer that makes everyone else look like highway robbery (and it's true, really).  Costs to distribute games are constantly falling but the amount distributors ask for does not.  It's past due time for that to change.  Developers/publishers deserve a bigger share.



I'm all for lower prices to consumers, also curious what initiatives Valve may close down in order to cut costs and offer a comparable service to grea competition.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 28, 2019)

TheOne said:


> Epic is definitely a developer first store.


Except the Launcher is nothing but a glorified storefront.  I actually had to check if it even had a friend list.  Well...yeah it wanted to access my Steam and my Facebook...GTFOH! Steam has an entire backbone not just a storefront,  Community Hubs, Friends list that makes it effortless to play with friends. Workshop support to make game mods easier to access. I mean Steam has it all, Epic has nothing...


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 28, 2019)

yakk said:


> I'm all for lower prices to consumers, also curious what initiatives Valve may close down in order to cut costs and offer a comparable service to grea competition.


They already make more than the competition via their marketplace/microtransactions which GOG/Epic Games Store don't offer.



INSTG8R said:


> Except the Launcher is nothing but a glorified storefront.  I actually had to check if it even had a friend list.  Well...yeah it wanted to access my Steam and my Facebook...GTFOH! Steam has an entire backbone not just a storefront,  Community Hubs, Friends list that makes it effortless to play with friends. Workshop support to make game mods easier to access. I mean Steam has it all, Epic has nothing...


Most people have moved to an agnostic platform like Discord.  I honestly get a little annoyed when someone contacts me via Steam because it's very in-your-face.

Steam workshop is something that costs developers money to implement.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 28, 2019)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Most people have moved to an agnostic platform like Discord.


Ford  you know damn well we’re on both   Discord is also trying their hand in this too.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 28, 2019)

Game sales is a side feature in Discord rather than main.  Discord has a better distribution price structure than Epic Games Store does but it's surprisingly not gaining much traction, especially compared to Epic Games Store.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 28, 2019)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Discord isn't gaining traction like Epic Games Store is though and it's a side feature rather than main.


I agree it’s mainly social hub/VOIP app.


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## TheOne (Jan 28, 2019)

INSTG8R said:


> Except the Launcher is nothing but a glorified storefront.  I actually had to check if it even had a friend list.  Well...yeah it wanted to access my Steam and my Facebook...GTFOH! Steam has an entire backbone not just a storefront,  Community Hubs, Friends list that makes it effortless to play with friends. Workshop support to make game mods easier to access. I mean Steam has it all, Epic has nothing...



They are still working on features for the Store, though any changes will be designed so the developers will come first, like the opt-in review system they are working on.

Also am I the only one who thinks it's funny that Sweeney thinks it is ok to force people to use his store?


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 28, 2019)

TheOne said:


> Also am I the only one who thinks it's funny that Sweeney thinks it is ok to force people to use his store?


Who is being forced?  

What I hear here are a bunch of first world complainers.  None of this is a real issue in this world.  People should really step back and listen to themselves.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 28, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> Who is being forced?
> 
> What I hear here are a bunch of first world complainers.  None of this is a real issue in this world.  People should really step back and listen to themselves.


I literally have ALL of them...but Epic is really sparse but the Bethesda one is pretty sparse too.


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## TheOne (Jan 28, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> Who is being forced?
> 
> What I hear here are a bunch of first world complainers.  None of this is a real issue in this world.  People should really step back and listen to themselves.



If a game you want on the PC is locked behind their storefront, then you are forced to abandon it or use their storefront.

Which is funny since Sweeney has been attacking Microsoft for years over walled gardens.


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## MonsterMawd (Jan 28, 2019)

Gabe can simply match Epic's offer. Instead he cries that it's unfair to the Media, so people turn on the developer. 

How about Gabe goes back to making great games instead of crying?

If you're a fan of the series, you'll support the developer. If not, then don't.


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## INSTG8R (Jan 28, 2019)

Well it’s not hurting sales...
https://store.steampowered.com/search/?filter=topsellers&os=win


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## B-Real (Jan 28, 2019)

diatribe said:


> One less sale I guess.  Too bad, I wanted to give it a play through.  But there's no way I'm adding any more launchers on my machine.


Have you read the whole news?

"that the game will not be available to order on Steam, at least from tomorrow through Feb 14, 2020" So you will probably be able to still pre-order it on Steam 1 day before its release - if you want to.


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## Markosz (Jan 28, 2019)

$49.99 in NA
59.95€ in the EU 

What? That's 37% more converted to my local currency. Doesn't make sense, isn't it mixed up?


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## Fluffmeister (Jan 28, 2019)

Half-Life 3 confirmed.


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## TheGuruStud (Jan 28, 2019)

TheOne said:


> Epic is definitely a developer first store.



I remember when valve made games lol. I didn't think they'd get this lazy and just scrooge mcduck all that cash. Sad times.


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## B-Real (Jan 28, 2019)

Markosz said:


> $49.99 in NA
> 59.95€ in the EU
> 
> What? That's 37% more converted to my local currency. Doesn't make sense, isn't it mixed up?


In Hungary, retail price of Metro Exodus PC is about 25-30% lower than the average price of physical editions - 12000 Ft compared to 16000-17000 Ft of other AAA game prices. Check your retail store prices too. You may have the same situation in your country.


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## FYFI13 (Jan 28, 2019)

I'm definitely not going to support yet another game store nor use another launcher. Even though I am a big fan of Metro series.
How do i even know they don't get bankrupt in a year and then my games will be lost. Steam was here for ages and i trust it. Not to mention functionality.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 28, 2019)

TheOne said:


> If a game you want on the PC is locked behind their storefront, then you are forced to abandon it or use their storefront.
> 
> Which is funny since Sweeney has been attacking Microsoft for years over walled gardens.


You completely missed my point. No one is “forcing” you to do anything.  What you have are First-World problems that pale in comparison to just about anything.  Everything you do with gaming is a luxury.


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## TheGuruStud (Jan 29, 2019)

FYFI13 said:


> I'm definitely not going to support yet another game store nor use another launcher. Even though I am a big fan of Metro series.
> How do i even know they don't get bankrupt in a year and then my games will be lost. Steam was here for ages and i trust it. Not to mention functionality.



WUT? Epic has been around longer than valve. And that's the risk you take with any online service. Games can be removed at ANY time and you're SOL.


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## etayorius (Jan 29, 2019)

TheGuruStud said:


> This is clearly how you make valve bend. If everyone starts jumping ship, then they'll have to lower prices. Steam markup is the same as apple, insane.




What is Steam doing to hurt you as a customer? why is people worrying about devs not getting "enough" for each sale?


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## TheGuruStud (Jan 29, 2019)

etayorius said:


> What is Steam doing to hurt you as a customer? why is people worrying about devs not getting "enough" for each sale?



Go away meat shielder.


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## etayorius (Jan 29, 2019)

TheGuruStud said:


> Go away meat shielder.



LOL!! nice debate. Which means you got nothing to debate but defend this dick move from both Epic and Deep Silver. In my eyes you're as much of a tool as you think i am for Steam. You're no better lolol


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## TheGuruStud (Jan 29, 2019)

etayorius said:


> LOL!! nice debate. Which means you got nothing to debate but defend this dick move from both Epic and Deep Silver. In my eyes you're as much of a tool as you think i am for Steam. You're no better lolol



Competing is a dick move? Yeah, um, like I said. You're a shill. Bye.


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## etayorius (Jan 29, 2019)

Oh i see, you can give your opinion and defend both Epic and Deep Silver, but i can give my opinion and defend Steam? yeah, i'm such a shill lol. I asked you a fair question, but you decided to get your feathers ruffled and wet your panties. Sorry, if you can't handle the internet then you should not be out here giving your opinion. People will think different to you and will question you at every move 

Why can't the damn thing be on both Stores or in all the others?  should i not question this move of giving the finger to me and PC Gamers out there whom of which 95% of them are on Steam? Ohh geee how dare i! lolol

Get off the internet, you can't handle it. You're too much of fragile tissue

Don't reply by the way, just go on with your fragile life.


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## Kissamies (Jan 29, 2019)

Nope, not going to install another launcher. Weird how many games have been from other stores rather than Steam recently.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 29, 2019)

etayorius said:


> LOL!! nice debate. Which means you got nothing to debate but defend this dick move from both Epic and Deep Silver. In my eyes you're as much of a tool as you think i am for Steam. You're no better lolol


How is it a “dick move”? Businesses aren’t run for charity.  If Deep Silver and 4A can pay less money from each sale to a storefront, well, that’s what you do.  They are in business to make money. Period.  

The fact that they have identified a product (a game) that people will pay them for is good for you and for them. It is a product for them to make money on.


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## hat (Jan 29, 2019)

Bad move? Threads like this often get littered with comments like "not installing another launcher", "not buying" etc. Clearly people don't want every launcher from every publisher installed to play games.


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## JcRabbit (Jan 29, 2019)

Markosz said:


> $49.99 in NA
> 59.95€ in the EU
> 
> What? That's 37% more converted to my local currency. Doesn't make sense, isn't it mixed up?



Wait, did I get this right?! Europeans have to pay $69.99 (at +- 1.14 exchange rate) for exactly the same game that costs North Americans 'only' $49.99 to buy? A *digital* release?

Either they got it the other way around or this is straight up robbery (and discrimination lol).


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## INSTG8R (Jan 29, 2019)




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## Prima.Vera (Jan 29, 2019)

Fluffmeister said:


> Half-Life 3 confirmed.


Of whos? Plutonium, Cesium, Polonium, Uranium...?


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## Schrodinger's Bodybag (Jan 29, 2019)

I can't tell you how many launchers I've had over the past decade+ where I've purchased games from. Guess how many are still around? Not many, and for good reason. All I see is another launcher that will be either dead or a ghost town populated mostly by indie games in 5-10 years.

Yes folks, it's big bad Steam's fault for users not researching games before making an informed buy. Not surprising since these people seem to think advertising and publicity are apparently free in the real world. In almost all corners of the world market, you pay a premium for leading the proverbial horse to the water. Yet 30% is apparently too steep of a charge for moving more product than *any* other digital distributor out there; considering Steam doesn't put out takedown orders on other digital distributors they aren't the bad guys here. Yet we get people who hail Epic when they force developers into restricting(albeit temporary) contracts... 

Furthermore, the "product" is an intangible thing that can be replicated an infinite amount of times for the cost of the electricity it takes to run the servers. 



INSTG8R said:


> View attachment 115282


This guy gets it. 



Hating success is the meta thing to do so I don't think I'm going to stop any virtue signalers from getting their daily dose of dopamine from shouting down a big bad evil corporation. So in the end it doesn't really matter, can't fix stupid. 

Steam is as big as it is for a fuckin' _reason_, if you _still_ can't figure it out then that's your problem.


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## chinmi (Jan 29, 2019)

Well, that another games I'm going to skip purchasing.
It's not because I have to install another launcher, but because steam always have regional pricing for people like me that stay in 3rd world countries. 
On epic store launcher it's gonna be us$50. regardless on where your countries is. Before on steam if I preorder it's around $25, the reason I don't pre-order is because.... I just don't do pre-order games without reading the release review first.
Using USA standard pricing it's so expensive for us. (For comparison, minimum wage in USA is about $10/hour or so right ? well in my country it's more or less $250/MONTH !)

Guess I'm gonna buy it on steam next year... the price should comes down a lot after a year or so..... or maybe they release the goty version with all dlc included too next year


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 29, 2019)

INSTG8R said:


> View attachment 115282


I get why Steam is great for you.  But for alot of people like me, it's just another store, since only 3 of those are things I use, and yet, I'm plenty ok already on other platforms that may or may not have those 3.  For many like me, it's just a place to find the game I want.


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## hat (Jan 29, 2019)

Schrodinger's Bodybag said:


> Steam is as big as it is for a fuckin' _reason_, if you _still_ can't figure it out then that's your problem.



Steam came during a time when many of us were buying physical discs, which were inconvenient (swapping discs to play), prone to damage, and took up a lot of physical room in one's living space, not to mention physical resources to produce and the logistics (and resources involved with logistics) to physically move them. So, you could buy the disc, or you could create a Steam account, purchase it from the comfort of your own home, download the thing and play. And all you had to do to launch the game was select it from a list of your other games. There were no discs to occupy your physical space, swap around when you wanted to play game _x_, risk damaging, or spend resources to manufacture and ship, and there was no more hunting for updates, as Steam automatically keeps everything up to date.

In short, Steam offered a lot of convenience in a time when no one else did. They were the first to the market... and people were generally okay with installing Steam on their computer to get that convenience. Now, digital downloads are a standard... but everybody and their brother wants you to install _their_ launcher (and no-one else's), mostly because of market share. Everyone wants a piece of the pie Steam created, and now, to the detriment of the end user, you have to have 10 launchers installed (and associated accounts to keep track of) if you're a serious gamer. Maybe you had Steam for years, but you don't want to miss out on the latest Battlefield or Assassin's Creed game... whoops, there's 3 launchers already! Maybe you really liked the Metro series, so now you need to add a fourth to enjoy the latest one.


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## chinmi (Jan 29, 2019)

INSTG8R said:


> View attachment 115282


you forgot 1 thing : REGIONAL PRICING !!!


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 29, 2019)

Schrodinger's Bodybag said:


> I can't tell you how many launchers I've had over the past decade+ where I've purchased games from. Guess how many are still around? Not many, and for good reason. All I see is another launcher that will be either dead or a ghost town populated mostly by indie games in 5-10 years.
> 
> Yes folks, it's big bad Steam's fault for users not researching games before making an informed buy. Not surprising since these people seem to think advertising and publicity are apparently free in the real world. In almost all corners of the world market, you pay a premium for leading the proverbial horse to the water. Yet 30% is apparently too steep of a charge for moving more product than *any* other digital distributor out there; considering Steam doesn't put out takedown orders on other digital distributors they aren't the bad guys here. Yet we get people who hail Epic when they force developers into restricting(albeit temporary) contracts...
> 
> ...


You are so ANGRY.  Like I said, first world problems.  I’m gonna guess you’ve never had real tests in your life, like pulling someone from a wrecked car, having live rounds fired at you while trying to keep your buddies alive, or seen the misery and starvation in countless numbers of down on their luck 3rd world countries, wonder how you were going to feed your family, or had 3 friends die within 6 months. 

Just a few of the kinds of things people face in this world or have faced multiple counts of, that put your anger at....let me get this straight, another launcher; a company that merely offered a lower fee to a publisher and studio, who are going to then make more money (which is their JOB), in perspective.

First world problems.


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## hat (Jan 29, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> You are so ANGRY.  Like I said, first world problems.  I’m gonna guess you’ve never had real tests in your life, like pulling someone from a wrecked car, having live rounds fired at you while trying to keep your buddies alive, or seen the misery and starvation in countless numbers of down on their luck 3rd world countries, wonder how you were going to feed your family, or had 3 friends die within 6 months.



Of course there are bigger problems in the world... but this thread isn't about that. It's about a game being pulled from Steam so it can be exclusively on Epic's store (for a period of time). Some of us aren't going to like that.



rtwjunkie said:


> Just a few of the kinds of things people face in this world or have faced multiple counts of, that put your anger at....let me get this straight, another launcher; a company that merely offered a lower fee to a publisher and studio, who are going to then make more money (which is their JOB), in perspective.



Or, maybe not? By selling your product exclusively at the Epic store, you're effectively shutting out those who would buy it if it were also on Steam (but not exclusively at Epic). Those are lost sales. There's quite a few people who have said in this thread alone on our own little corner of the net, that they won't be buying it for that reason.


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## L|NK|N (Jan 29, 2019)

People bitching when there weren't enough games on the PC, people bitching when Valve introduced Steam, people bitching when there are too many games on Steam, people bitching about not enough competition to Steam, people bitching when there is too much competition to Steam. Will it ever end?!?! I guess our PCs just can't handle the extra space for an extra program shortcut.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 29, 2019)

hat said:


> Of course there are bigger problems in the world... but this thread isn't about that. It's about a game being pulled from Steam so it can be exclusively on Epic's store (for a period of time). Some of us aren't going to like that.


Exactly my point. This thread is about a news item. What I’m talking about is the anger some people are displaying over this inconsequential bit of news. It’s a tidbit in the course of life, and if that is the thing that stirs up anger compared to real misery then I truly feel sorry for those people.  It shows how shallow and oblivious people can be.


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## hat (Jan 29, 2019)

LiNKiN said:


> People bitching when there weren't enough games on the PC, people bitching when Valve introduced Steam, people bitching when there are too many games on Steam, people bitching about not enough competition to Steam, people bitching when there is too much competition to Steam. Will it ever end?!?! I guess our PCs just can't handle the extra space for an extra program shortcut.



You can't please all of the people all of the time... only some of the people some of the time.  



rtwjunkie said:


> Exactly my point. This thread is about a news item. What I’m talking about is the anger some people are displaying over this inconsequential bit of news. It’s a tidbit in the course of life, and if that is the thing that stirs up anger compared to real misery then I truly feel sorry for those people.  It shows how shallow and oblivious people can be.



I dunno. Maybe you have a valid point. For me, I do have Steam and Origin (begrudgingly so) because there were games on it I was kinda interested in for stupid cheap. It's another account to keep track of. Sure, I can handle it, but I don't really want to...


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## lexluthermiester (Jan 29, 2019)

Dear DEVS;

*GOG.com* 

Get on it!
(pun intended)

Thank You.


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## TheOne (Jan 29, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> You completely missed my point. No one is “forcing” you to do anything.  What you have are First-World problems that pale in comparison to just about anything.  Everything you do with gaming is a luxury.



No you missed mine, I ignored that because you trivializing others opinions because you disagree doesn't change anything, if you want to play a game they have exclusive rights to you will have to go through them, there are reasons people dislike things, its not always just outrage for the sake of outrage.

The question is how much outrage should you feel over this, like you said this isn't the end of the world, but it is something people will have to deal with in their everyday lives, what we need is an agnostic platform that these stores can link to so you need only one login and one program, and the publishers can still control their products and run their own store.

Now personally I don't care to much about this, well not yet anyway, the only game that really affected me was The Walking Dead - The Final Season, I do have a passing interest in Metro Exodus, but if I did buy it, it would probably be next year anyway when it is on sale.


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## etayorius (Jan 29, 2019)

It took Origin like 6 years to be "Tolerable" and they are still missing a lot of features, also they don't even own 5% of the whole Digital Distribution Pie. Last i checked Steam still owned 95% of the big pie, so if Epic thinks people will abandon Steam and move to their store they are completely out of their mind, but they got every right to try lol. I can however see some people using both, but i seriously doubt people will be ditching  Steam in masses. Steam biggest features are Regional prices, Seasonal Sales, Refund System (which Epic copy and pasted) a Massive Community, A humongous Library, Wishlist, Achievements, Gifting System and most importantly Curating, Rating and Commenting System. If i recall correctly, Epic does not want any sort of community and even less a rating system for titles in their store. They are effectively trying to silence users from Boycotting or negatively affecting the sales of their games. This should be in everyones interest as consumers.

I'm totally cool with people moving to Epic, at the end of the day i don't even see them even taking away 5% of Steam user base. But why do some people get so upset when anyone voices their opinion of not buy it on Epic Store? I been reading comments in Deep Silver and Metro FB post, and even on articles by PC Gamer and some Videos by ReviewTechUS and The Quartering, and all i see is *massive backlash toward Epic Store and Deep Silver*. Some people are literally raging with anyone who disagrees with Metro moving exclusively to Epic . Why is it so important for them that Devs get a "fair" cut of the sales from Digital Distribution sales? what do these People (as consumers) get from commenting against other people opinions? I have seven a couple guys commenting on FB Deep Silver "Announcement" also in PC Gamer comments, and still raging for over several  dozen comments... literally, scrolling down and seeing these guys for comments after comment going nuts.

Anyway, why can't the game be on both stores at the same time? i honestly don't think Deep Silver moved into Epic exclusivity for a  couple bucks per sale, there's got a better deal under the table. I don't blame them for wanting to cash in all the extra $$$, but giving the finger to Steam user base after the game almost launches is really is a "D" move.

Why do i choose Steam over any of the others launchers out there? i been there since 2008, and no one gave a big stinking F about PC Gaming back then. It was all about the consoles... PC Gaming was dying and only Steam was there offering incredible value. Back in 2004-2006 i was totally against the idea of DRM and Steam too, i bash on them at every turn i could, but after i first got my free Steam from one of my friends in around 2008 i quickly started to like it. I remember Physical game copies going for over $1,000-1,200 MXN which i always thought it was excesively high... but i could get the same game on Steam without having to go outside and deal with traffic for only $150-200 MXN in one of those Flash Holiday Sales, they were so cheap that it changed my whole mentality toward Steam DRM. And then the Regional prices on top of  the already low Steam prices, it was CRAZY! i quickly ramped up over 200 titles on steam by 2011. I now own exactly 426 Titles there in over 10 years and i honestly don't want another Launcher, GoG, Steam and Bethesda.launcher are already too much for me.

It's not like Steam is giving out pirated copies of games to their userbase or not keeping all the cash for themselves, also no one forced every Dev/Publisher to go to Steam, they did because it was a whole lot cheaper to release it on Steam than having to put a lot of cash into the Disc, Art, Cover, Manual and Shipping Physical copies, and there WAS NOTHING ELSE supporting PC Gaming back in the time. It was the same Devs/Publishers always giving consoles priority and ignoring PC. A decade later now every dev out there is crying about "unfair" cut. Heck i happily pay $60 USD over the $50 USD epic offers simply because 95% of my titles are on Steam, the rest 5% is on GoG, but they are mostly early 90's games i used to play back then. Also, if a publisher/dev does a shady move on Steam, i reserve the right to change my rating and literally let some steam go in the review of the game. As a modder, this Review TOOL is super important, it allowed ME as a consumer to Punch Rockstar in the face when they started banning Single Players modders. It also allowed other Modders and Users to punch Bethesda in the face when they tried to push Paid mods... *i was actually for it* because for once i might get something back out my Skyrim mods :/ But the majority had spoken, that's democracy.

The review system on Steam is a very powerful Tool for users to interact with Devs and Publishers. It can be abused? certainly, like EVERYTHING in life. But it's none the less an option on Steam, and IT WILL NOT ever be on Epic. They want you to silently buy games and F off if you don't like it. They even didn't had the same Refund until people started lashing out on them. I repeat, Epic does not want any sort of critique to their store or interaction between users and Devs/Publishers of such titles. And Steam is the bad guy huh? Steam with all their faults they are still the preffered platform by 90% of PC Gamers. And they have a lot of crap too, like shitty constant updates breaking features needing another update. Or the horrible support they offer, seriously it is horrible... luckily i had only requested support once when i lost my phone and could not access my account, it took a frigging week for them to reply. That's how bad it is... or was, i don't know because i don't need their support that much. Everything mostly works.

For those reasons i will remain on Steam as my main platform for the foreseeable future, you don't agree? you want to dump steam and move to Epic? it's your right and that's perfectly fine, you're not supposed to think like me, but i reserve the right to voice my opinion and choose where i buy and play my games. I take pride of being part of Steam super toxic community, and i think i speak at least for 70-80% of Steam user base, which you know... it recenlty just peaked at 50M users. Good luck to Epic trying to even get to 5M in the next 7 years, like EA with Origin. They are giving Fortnite kiddies too much credit.


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## VulkanBros (Jan 29, 2019)




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## ab3e (Jan 29, 2019)

are we talking about a singleplayer FPS game that you will finish in about 22 hours or "WOW 2 the second coming of Jezuz" or a looter shooter perhaps a space sim in which you will spend hundreds of hours ? What forums do you need, cloud save wasn't a feature when i was growing up and miraculously I survived. I still have a folder with saved games from 2007 on my external harddrive. Epic is aware of these shortcomings and all these features will be available but it will take some time. After you finish with Metro Exodus close it or unistall the launcher if that tingles your fetish revenge ideas. As I stressed earlier supporting the developer that care about games is more important than your single minded way of viewing things, not all developers have buckets of money. 4A games are the people who managed to finish Metro Last Light in their studios in Ukraine while it was invaded by "allegedly" Russian forces and separatist, power was out most of the time, plus the stress and panic. I recommend watching the interview online about the difficulties of finishing Metro LL. And here we sit bickering about a stupid launcher and our 1st world problems.


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## Easo (Jan 29, 2019)

No!
Common, I was going to preorder this (yes yes, no preorders,). I DO NOT want even more launchers. 
So yeah, they will get my money... one year later after it will be on a sale... 
Fine, Steam might be too greedy, will not argue with that, but for as a gamer - end price does not change, but I get the obstacble of another launcher. Steam, GoG, Origin, uPlay, Epic Store, plus some more. Enooughhhhhhhh


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## Legacy-ZA (Jan 29, 2019)

Big fan of the Metro series, that being said; I will not buy it, I do not want 50 different clients on my machine. I like to consolidate.


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## jabbadap (Jan 29, 2019)

INSTG8R said:


> View attachment 115282



Don't really care any of those features. Only one I care is: can you back up your game on Epic Games Store?


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## Franzen4Real (Jan 29, 2019)

silentbogo said:


> The only way I will switch to Epic Store, is if they get at least half as many games as Valve..



I'm actually quite the opposite. The day they have half as many games as Steam, is the day they start going downhill with piles and piles and piles of worthless garbage games that your have to wade through... just like Steam.

I would prefer to have my games in one client, but don't really care all that much if they are in 2 or 3. Definitely not enough to boycott a good game altogether just out of spite.


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## silentbogo (Jan 29, 2019)

TheGuruStud said:


> Steam markup is the same as apple, insane.


Games haven't became expensive because of Steam, they became expensive due to ever-increasing Publisher markups (and "production value", whatever that means nowadays).
Steam's commission is flat 30%, which includes lots of stuff including hosting, advertising, sales assistance and campaign optimisation, various technical features not available elsewhere (Proton, flexible controller support), post-sales revenue (trading cards, in-game items etc), community features etc. 
Oh... and 10-times bigger exposure, if that's of any importance 



Franzen4Real said:


> Definitely not enough to boycott a good game altogether just out of spite.


It's not out of spite, it's common sense. If a developer/publisher company wants to be an asshole and change their mind about availability mere 3 weeks before release - I won't be going out of my way just to give them money. If 4A wants to take a risk - I'm not gonna be a part of it at my own expense. If I skip Exodus - nothing bad is going to happen. I've survived without ME: Andromeda, never regretted not going to Origin for Crysis 3, not concerned with what's going on with Origin, and definitely don't miss that short time I spent with Bethesda Launcher.

Plus, it smells just as bad as pre-orders: with preorders you are committed to a game without knowing whether it's shit or not, and with buying a game on a new platform you are getting committed to this platform without a guarantee that it won't disappear next month/year due to lack of content publishers or content consumers.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 29, 2019)

etayorius said:


> Well, that's unfortunate. Now I won't get to experience their game, and they won't get to experience my money. Lose/lose.
> 
> Anyway, why can't it be on both stores or all the other ones out there too? i can't believe how people are defending this nonsense with "Developer will earn more cash in Epic Store". This is basically giving the finger to Steam consumers. I own over 450 Titles on Steam and i am not about to give up my library for one or two titles. I will no longer support any other Digital Store appart from Steam and GoG. This is not Competition, this is a new low for Deep Silver. Poor Metro Devs.
> 
> Back in the days of physical distribution copies retailers took nearly half the cash of every sale, and everyone was ok with it. Steam comes with their new System of Digital Distribution taking only a 30% and everyone moves there with joy. Now a decade later everyone shitting on Steam because they are supposedly being "unfair" to Developers. Trading in a few extra % Cash instead of all the possible sales on Steam. Idiotic move, plus all the hate from the PC Gamers out there, which are 95% of Steam users. Publishers are just getting greedier and want every little extra cash possible. I think Steam could offer to cut their 30% to 20% to basically every title on Steam and it's still fair because of the massive amount of Steam users there.



I don't understand how you can even be 'a Steam customer'. Are you also just a customer at one supermarket? Are you cautiously avoiding any other supermarkets? Or clothing brands? Or cars? Or vegetable farmers? I mean... where's the logic here?

PC Gamers are not by definition 'Steam users'. They have an account there, yes, which makes sense because the store has steadily built to a near-monopoly. But they also have accounts elsewhere, for example with literally _every publisher_ they buy games from and log in for, for example. Even you have that, and all Steam is, is a way to save you one or two extra clicks to get you where you want to be - ingame.

Also, I am lost as to how you feel you 'lose' anything by having multiple launchers and/or libraries at stores. Not to mention the fact that you can still put game shortcuts anywhere you want regardless of the store they're linked to. I'm also wondering why you think Steam has 'reach' as in: they can bring the game to thousands of customers. They don't. Steam only advertises on its own platform and the vast majority barely browses the store, and many people disable the popups Steam gives you pre- and post-game launch. There's a good chance a large audience will never see a game within/through Steam, but elsewhere in marketing and buys a Steam key somewhere, because there aren't any other kinds of keys available. That's what I do...

Care to elaborate? I'm honestly curious about the thought process here.

Last, the cost/benefit aspect for developers and publishers - a 30% cut for a store that is digital is quite a lot, still. Half the sale price for a physical store was also, always essentially too much. I think you misunderstand how pricing really works under the hood... That 30% cut on a game sale price can go two ways: 1. _cut into the development budget _which literally means *you get less game because Steam wants its cut*, or 2. _increase the sale price_ of games. Every expense will in the end always land in the customers' lap. Why would you support that, feeding the middle man that is never going to bring you any game at all? (Not even Half life 3... )


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## siluro818 (Jan 29, 2019)

Competition would be for Epic to distribute Metro Exodus at lower prices (for all regions) in parallel with Steam's distribution.

This is not competition, this is BS, not to mention I've lost all respect for Epic after they completely halted any and all development on the crowdsourced UT title, disregarding years of work by so many people and telling so many lies in the process.

All because they hit the underage jackpot with Fortnite, which is what we owe this Epic store nonsense to also for that matter.

I will not be playing the exclusives game on the PC front, much like I refuse to do so about console titles.

Metro Exodus will be purchased from the CPY store, thank you very much lol


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## avenger001 (Jan 29, 2019)

Is this another game launcher i will have to install to play this game?


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 29, 2019)

Yes.  Epic Games Store is a lot like GOG Galaxy, Steam, Origin, uPlay, Battle.net.


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## etayorius (Jan 29, 2019)

Vayra86 said:


> I don't understand how you can even be 'a Steam customer'. Are you also just a customer at one supermarket? Are you cautiously avoiding any other supermarkets? Or clothing brands? Or cars? Or vegetable farmers? I mean... where's the logic here?
> 
> PC Gamers are not by definition 'Steam users'. They have an account there, yes, which makes sense because the store has steadily built to a near-monopoly. But they also have accounts elsewhere, for example with literally _every publisher_ they buy games from and log in for, for example. Even you have that, and all Steam is, is a way to save you one or two extra clicks to get you where you want to be - ingame.
> 
> ...



Sure. as you know, Steam represents 90-95% of the PC Market out there with 50 Million users, so by definition... *NO*, *Steam does not represents ALL PC Gamers*, _but they certainly represent a overwhelming *majority*_. No wonder why Metro and Deep Silver FB posts are filled with such a massive angry reactions. Regarding the launcher, it's very simple. I Choose not to have many of them cluttering my Desktop and i prefferably want my Games on a single Library. Second, i could care less how Devs and Publishers or Retailers split the cash between them when i buy one of their games, after all... *i am paying for the game,* it's not like i am stealing them. I would also i happily pay more to have it on Steam with all their features. It's just a matter of choice, really. Nothing more nothing less. You're more than welcome to buy your titles in Epic. You asked a fair question and i replied with my opinion. Others might not agree or think that it's dumb, but it's ok.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 29, 2019)

etayorius said:


> Sure. as you know, Steam represents 90-95% of the PC Market out there with 50 Million users, so by definition... *NO*, *Steam does not represents ALL PC Gamers*, _but they certainly represent a overwhelming *majority*_. No wonder why Metro and Deep Silver FB posts are filled with such a massive angry reactions. Regarding the launcher, it's very simple. I Choose not to have many of them cluttering my Desktop and i prefferably want my Games on a single Library. Second, i could care less how Devs and Publishers or Retailers split the cash between them when i buy one of their games, after all... *i am paying for the game,* it's not like i am stealing them. I would also i happily pay more to have it on Steam with all their features. It's just a matter of choice, really. Nothing more nothing less. You're more than welcome to buy your titles in Epic. You asked a fair question and i replied with my opinion. Others might not agree or think that it's dumb, but it's ok.



Would I be correct in summarizing most of your arguments as 'comfort choices'? There is no judgement in that, by the way. Just an observation.


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## etayorius (Jan 29, 2019)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Yes.  Epic Games Store is a lot like GOG Galaxy, Steam, Origin, uPlay, Battle.net.



You forgot to Throw Microsoft Store in there... GoG is ok, no issues with it because you really own the games there and also they are pro consumer.



Vayra86 said:


> Would I be correct in summarizing most of your arguments as 'comfort choices'? There is no judgement in that, by the way. Just an observation.



Yes, i think you might be right.


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## jabbadap (Jan 29, 2019)

etayorius said:


> You forgot to Throw Microsoft Store in there... GoG is ok, no issues with it because you really own the games there and also they are pro consumer.
> 
> Yes, i think you might be right.



... And with GoG you don't really have to use their software(That galaxy thingy), just load the game files and you are good to go.


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## lexluthermiester (Jan 29, 2019)

Vayra86 said:


> I don't understand how you can even be 'a Steam customer'. Are you also just a customer at one supermarket? Are you cautiously avoiding any other supermarkets? Or clothing brands? Or cars? Or vegetable farmers? I mean... where's the logic here?


I actively avoid Walmart and a few other stores I don't like for various reasons. Does that count? The concept and reasoning is similar.



FordGT90Concept said:


> Yes. Epic Games Store is a lot like GOG Galaxy, Steam, Origin, uPlay, Battle.net.


Except that GOG's Galaxy is not required to play the game you buy and own on GOG. Everyone else "Client" is required.


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## SystemMechanic (Jan 29, 2019)

What about Physical copies ? I am cancelling mine if it aint on Steam..why not release on both platforms so ppl buy where ever they want to.


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## FordGT90Concept (Jan 29, 2019)

lexluthermiester said:


> Except that GOG's Galaxy is not required to play the game you buy and own on GOG. Everyone else "Client" is required.


Out of curiosity, I checked.  I stopped the Epic Games Store application, ran Edith Finch directly from its executable, and Edith Finch started Epic Games Store.  The Epic Games Store application seems to have the same kind of integration that Steam does so, you're right, GOG Galaxy is clearly the winner in terms of independence.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 29, 2019)

Ubersonic said:


> Well **** Deep Silver then.
> 
> I bought the first two games on release and was planning on doing the same with the third until they pulled it from Steam, now I'll be getting it from Bittorrent, their loss for trying to boost profits with anti-consumer practicses /spit.


Do you realize how juvenile that thinking is? Are you 12?  I bet you try to save every bit of money you can, just like a business does. Only when a business does it they are some evil monster.


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## Ubersonic (Jan 29, 2019)

Hopefully, if we're lucky, Valve may be able to file a lawsuit to get the game back on Steam, as the vast majority of the advertising for the game was done by Valve based on contracts that DS reneged on.  It's a small chance tho.



rtwjunkie said:


> Do you realize how juvenile that thinking is? Are you 12?  I bet you try to save every bit of money you can, just like a business does. Only when a business does it they are some evil monster.


Look kid this isn't about a business saving money, this is about a business profiteering via anti-consumer practices.  Exclusivity is the cancer of the videogames industry, a cancer that after decades of ravaging the console market has (thanks to these ****s) just crept over and infected the PC market.


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## silentbogo (Jan 29, 2019)

Ubersonic said:


> Hopefully, if we're lucky, Valve may be able to file a lawsuit to get the game back on Steam, as the vast majority of the advertising for the game was done by Valve based on contracts that DS reneged on. It's a small chance tho.


It's been publicly confirmed that Exodus will be an Epic exclusive for for launch period. It will be available on Steam in 2020 (a year after release), if Gaben doesn't do the "counter-strike"(pun intended) by denying re-listing.

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1089973166489915394


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## Ubersonic (Jan 30, 2019)

silentbogo said:


> It's been publicly confirmed that Exodus will be an Epic exclusive for for launch period.


I didn't ask that, I was just saying hopefully there may be a chance (albeit a very small one) that once Valve have time to meet with their lawyers/etc they may be able to find a way to force the devs to honour their original contract due to the amount Valve have already spent advertising their product.

Hell, if we're super duper lucky then maybe Epic/Deep Silver may realise that the negative press they're getting from all this is costing them much more than losing sales to Steam would have done and remove their exclusivity lock.  However that too is very unlikely as the whole reason they went for exclusivity is because they knew that being cheaper than steam wouldn't be enough to take sales from steam hence why they went the anti-consumer route in the first place.


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## SniperHF (Jan 30, 2019)

lexluthermiester said:


> Everyone else "Client" is required.



This is actually not strictly true, at least with Steam anyway.
There are a number of games on Steam that will run straight from the .exe without Steam open.  Divinity Original Sin  1&2 are an example.

But most developers/publishers choose to integrate with Steam as a form of DRM.



siluro818 said:


> Competition would be for Epic to distribute Metro Exodus at lower prices (for all regions) in parallel with Steam's distribution.



Yes I think this is sort of a fundamental flaw with the games space in general.  No games retailer is actually a retailer, they are a marketplace.  The publishers set the prices, control the keys, etc.
It's not like a retailer where say Steam goes to Deep Silver and says I want 20,000 keys to sell on Steam what price will give you give me let's negotiate.  The publisher actively controls their space on Steam including the price.

I just don't know that there's a way to fundamentally realign the industry away from this.  Since publishers got this control with the digital distribution boom, they'll never want to give that up.


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## silentbogo (Jan 30, 2019)

Ubersonic said:


> I didn't ask that, I was just saying hopefully there may be a chance (albeit a very small one) that once Valve have time to meet with their lawyers/etc they may be able to find a way to force the devs to honour their original contract due to the amount Valve have already spent advertising their product.


4A(or Koch/THQ to be more specific ) will fulfill their obligations to Steam/Valve by honoring all pre-orders. I doubt their contract has any provisions for "future" or "expected" sales.


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 30, 2019)

Ubersonic said:


> Look kid


LMAO. You are a child in age terms. You literally know nothing of me or that word would never have come out of your keyboard. Your reaction, just as with all the other angry people is so indicative of 1st worlders totally oblivious to what is really important in this world, and shows a clear sense of selfishness.  It’s infantile.


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## Ubersonic (Jan 30, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> You literally know nothing of me or that word would never have come out of your keyboard.


Well if you don't want people to assume you're a little kid don't act like one, try being polite to other posters instead of just randomly flaming them to initiate conversation and people will probably be nicer back to you


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## bajs11 (Jan 30, 2019)

Already have Steam and Origin and I am not going to get another launcher just to play this game


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## rtwjunkie (Jan 30, 2019)

Ubersonic said:


> Well if you don't want people to assume you're a little kid don't act like one, try being polite to other posters instead of just randomly flaming them


Well, let’s recap, shall we? You joined a conversation I was already part of from page 1.  Your contribution was to curse out Deep Silver, and then state your intention to pirate the game because the store it’s sold from is not to your liking, which is not only morally wrong, it is explicitly against the rules of this site.  

Yet, you seem to think those childish actions merit a “hi, how are you? Glad to have you join the conversation!”?


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## 95Viper (Jan 30, 2019)

Enough bickering back and forth.
Get back on topic.

Thank You.


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## bajs11 (Jan 30, 2019)

UrbanCamper said:


> As of right now it is still available on Steam. Supposedly, if you buy before the change over(later today) you will still be able to access through Steam.
> 
> As a side note a company called Tencent Holdings Limited owns 48% of Epic games. It is a Chinese company and is the largest gaming company in the world. They also handle the majority of money transactions for gaming in China. not sure how that shakes out with Epic.
> 
> I just got it on Steam.



One more reason not to get this new platform

according to this article Tencent is among the largest internet companies in the world.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/11/18/world/asia/china-internet.html


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## Vayra86 (Jan 30, 2019)

INSTG8R said:


> View attachment 115282



FTFY 






Ironically, the most crucial item in my book, is missing: 2 hour tryout / free refund option. That IMO is the only unique selling point Steam really has. The rest is just 'its easy and I can do it all from one place' - which is inherent with being locked to the platform because you're lazy.



silentbogo said:


> Plus, it smells just as bad as pre-orders: with preorders you are committed to a game without knowing whether it's shit or not, and with buying a game on a new platform you are getting committed to this platform without a guarantee that it won't disappear next month/year due to lack of content publishers or content consumers.



Of course not. There is a legal obligation to keep your license to the product intact. Epic going broke means you need to be provided access to the license in another way, and its not rocket science how that'll be worked out.



bajs11 said:


> One more reason not to get this new platform
> 
> according to this article Tencent is among the largest internet companies in the world.
> https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/11/18/world/asia/china-internet.html



In that case, please hand over... almost everything else that's in your home, because it also contains stuff 'Made in China'.


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## Easy Rhino (Jan 30, 2019)

Oh good so I am  not the only one who hates having more than one gaming client (Steam, Origins, Ubisoft) on my system. Seriously can we go back to the days of games on disc and it plays on anything regardless of internet? How lame. Everything is ruined.


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## Kissamies (Jan 30, 2019)

Easy Rhino said:


> Oh good so I am  not the only one who hates having more than one gaming client (Steam, Origins, Ubisoft) on my system. Seriously can we go back to the days of games on disc and it plays on anything regardless of internet? How lame. Everything is ruined.


Well, optical drives on PCs are a pretty rare sight these days.


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## TheOne (Jan 30, 2019)

Vayra86 said:


> Ironically, the most crucial item in my book, is missing: 2 hour tryout / free refund option. That IMO is the only unique selling point Steam really has.



Epic copied Steams Refund Policy.

https://www.epicgames.com/site/en-US/store-refund-policy


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## jabbadap (Jan 30, 2019)

Chloe Price said:


> Well, optical drives on PCs are a pretty rare sight these days.



Heh, I still have one, but can't even remember when I last used it. Was probably even before current build... But why not any of these physical games come on USB ROM?


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## bajs11 (Jan 30, 2019)

Vayra86 said:


> In that case, please hand over... almost everything else that's in your home, because it also contains stuff 'Made in China'.



there is a difference between "made in" and controlled by

manufacturers like Samsung and Apple are neither created nor controlled by the regime

from the NYT article


> That’s why the best way for tech companies to thrive in China is to make themselves useful to the state. Nearly everyone in China uses WeChat, making the social network a great way for the authorities to police what people say and do. SenseTime, whose facial recognition technology powers those fun filters in video apps, also sells software to law enforcement.


fyi WeChat is developed by Tencent

also
https://www.ft.com/content/e90c3800-aad3-11e8-94bd-cba20d67390c


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## Easy Rhino (Jan 30, 2019)

Chloe Price said:


> Well, optical drives on PCs are a pretty rare sight these days.



True. It could even be as simple as putting the game on a cheap thumbdrive.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 30, 2019)

bajs11 said:


> there is a difference between "made in" and controlled by
> 
> manufacturers like Samsung and Apple are neither created nor controlled by the regime
> 
> ...



True, that. And its an interesting thought. If a little bit hypocritical... But definitely valid in the larger scheme of things yes. China's degree of control and influence over the internet and in tech is scary. But, I'm just as scared by the US companies doing similar things, just in a different way. As much as Bill Clinton used to think that 'the internet will make China an open society', that same open society in the West is just as easily used to exercise a similar form of power and control, except the way its being done is a bit more nuanced and 'we' have (the illusion of?) more influence on the process. We just package it differently. I think this is a different discussion though 

On the other hand, if Chinese state support gets us big budget, quality games, I'm not complaining at all. Regardless of the store they're sold in. But this may very well be a divide&conquer attempt from Tencent, I can see that.


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## xorbe (Jan 30, 2019)

How does EpicVR compare to SteamVR?


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## lexluthermiester (Jan 31, 2019)

SniperHF said:


> There are a number of games on Steam that will run straight from the .exe without Steam open. Divinity Original Sin 1&2 are an example.


While that's true, it's mostly older/classic titles and is the exception rather than the rule. At least from what I've seen, but that is admittedly a limited experience as I have only a few titles on Steam and most are older/classic titles.


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## bajs11 (Jan 31, 2019)

Vayra86 said:


> True, that. And its an interesting thought. If a little bit hypocritical... But definitely valid in the larger scheme of things yes. China's degree of control and influence over the internet and in tech is scary. But, I'm just as scared by the US companies doing similar things, just in a different way. As much as Bill Clinton used to think that 'the internet will make China an open society', that same open society in the West is just as easily used to exercise a similar form of power and control, except the way its being done is a bit more nuanced and 'we' have (the illusion of?) more influence on the process. We just package it differently. I think this is a different discussion though
> 
> On the other hand, if Chinese state support gets us big budget, quality games, I'm not complaining at all. Regardless of the store they're sold in. But this may very well be a divide&conquer attempt from Tencent, I can see that.



That I do agree
but the large corporations here in the West have been scrutinized by both journalists, the users/customers and politicians. They are usually accountable for their actions.
While the same can't really be said of the corporations controlled by authoritarian regimes, at least not in their own countries anyway then even if they get banned or punished here in the west the regime have their ways to retaliate, as we have seen in the Huawei case.

Of course, I wouldn't mind buying games developed by Chinese developers. In fact one of my favorite games Alice nightmare returns were developed by them (rip Spicy Horse)
but they may will encounter the same problem there. That the state may will influence or use the developers or simply censor titles they don't like.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/11/18/world/asia/china-movies.html



> When was the last time you watched a movie with a Chinese villain?
> If you can’t remember, that may not be too surprising. Take the 2012 remake of the Cold War drama “Red Dawn.” It depicted Chinese enemies invading an American town.
> At least it did until the script was leaked and angered the Chinese state media.
> In the end, MGM spent $1 million digitally erasing evidence of the Chinese Army, frame by frame, and substituting in North Koreans instead.



Lets hope the same won't happen to the gaming industry. I am actually surprised that they haven't banned Fallout games.


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## Vayra86 (Jan 31, 2019)

bajs11 said:


> Lets hope the same won't happen to the gaming industry. I am actually surprised that they haven't banned Fallout games.



An interesting one, that last quote you placed there. Look at the typical Hollywood formula, and how the US flag & its soldiers are typically depicted  I don't think I need to say more. The only difference with China is that we _also _ allow content like Jarhead alongside the heroic same-old. But at the same time, there is só much noise on the big budget titles that most don't even know the 'other' movies exist, they sure as hell aren't mainstream. So again, 'we' go about it differently, but there are similar powers at work here, with largely the same goal: control of hearts and minds, both domestic and abroad. Its cultural export, as well, and this is tightly controlled by _every country._ The only reason we aren't actively asking for censorship elsewhere is because we simply don't need to - there's no market for Chinese content in the West, and if there is, its super niche. But we don't refrain from similar measures on other markets, think about solar panels for example. Regardless, Chinese actions like this are a threat to us, and this works both ways of course.

Anyway. This is getting strangely political, I'm dropping it now


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## Kissamies (Feb 1, 2019)

jabbadap said:


> Heh, I still have one, but can't even remember when I last used it. Was probably even before current build... But why not any of these physical games come on USB ROM?


I had a BD-ROM drive few years ago, and I used it about five times just for movies. For my retro rigs, they need a DVD drive for installing games (and an OS for the Socket A machine)


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## John Naylor (Feb 1, 2019)

My preference lies with   GOG ... https://www.gog.com/ 

Aside from MMOs, if it requires an internet connection. I'm not playing.


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## Liquid Cool (Feb 1, 2019)

As a huge fan of of Metro...I'll be waiting for a GOG release.

Closed my accounts at EA, Ubisoft, Battle.net, and Twitch as well.

Lost 200 games, but gained better sleep at night...wouldn't go back.

Same feeling I had after giving Windows the boot.  I don't have that(or any) daunting EULA(s) bothering me.  With Debian...there are no EULA's.

Best,

Liquid Cool


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## psyko12 (Feb 2, 2019)

I'm all in to supporting 4A as a fan of Metro series and the book, but does EPIC have offline mode to play the game? If not a years wait is ok for me.


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 2, 2019)

Nope.  You can't even see your library in the client without being online and it has no "offline mode."  This is what I got when I tried to launch the What Remains of Edith Finch with my NIC disabled:


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 2, 2019)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Nope.  You can't even see your library in the client without being online and it has no "offline mode."  This is what I got when I tried to launch the What Remains of Edith Finch with my NIC disabled:
> View attachment 115570


Well that’s not cool.  People have internet go down. Do they not understand this concept?  I recommend getting the game on GOG!


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## FordGT90Concept (Feb 2, 2019)

I don't think Epic Games will stop the game once it is already running.  That's something the game developer would have to bake into their executable.

But when you have no internet access, the Epic Games client literally changes you to "offline" so it doesn't even know who you are until it can go back online.  Here's hoping they fix that but for the time being, it's very internet dependent.


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## vega22 (Feb 3, 2019)

We need more competition and epic have the bank to take valve on.

If this also means people making games earn more money and are able to make better games then even better.


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## Super XP (Feb 8, 2019)

vega22 said:


> We need more competition and epic have the bank to take valve on.
> 
> If this also means people making games earn more money and are able to make better games then even better.


In a perfect world. In the real world, why on earth would people want to buy this game on Epic? Epic offers Nothing where as Steam offers everything needed to ensure your purchase and support is ongoing. 

I'll postpone my purchase till there's a Steam Release. 
I also see very low sales, with an early Steam Release to further mitigate bad sales.


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## rtwjunkie (Feb 8, 2019)

Super XP said:


> Nothing where as Steam offers everything needed to ensure your purchase and support is ongoing.


Why Steam?  Support for a game, no matter what game client it is on, lasts only as long as the developer keeps providing patches and support.  Steam or any other client is just a distribution means for them and has no inherent advantage.

If support for a game disappears, the fault is with a dev and/or publisher.


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## Super XP (Feb 8, 2019)

rtwjunkie said:


> Why Steam?  Support for a game, no matter what game client it is on, lasts only as long as the developer keeps providing patches and support.  Steam or any other client is just a distribution means for them and has no inherent advantage.
> 
> If support for a game disappears, the fault is with a dev and/or publisher.


Yes but I have OLD games I purchased on Steam and to this date they get updated with patches and firmware or what ever. We are talking about 10+ year old games lol

So the publishers provide the updates. OK. Anyhow I'll still wait for a Steam Release. Don't like the Epic store front. Perhaps opinion will change. We'll See.


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## hat (Feb 10, 2019)

FordGT90Concept said:


> Nope.  You can't even see your library in the client without being online and it has no "offline mode."  This is what I got when I tried to launch the What Remains of Edith Finch with my NIC disabled:
> View attachment 115570


Oh, that sucks. Guess I have another reason to stay away from the Epic (fail) launcher.


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## 64K (Feb 10, 2019)

Hell, the half-assed Epic Store doesn't even have a search bar. Does this inspire confidence that the site will be maintained over the years?


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## silentbogo (Feb 10, 2019)

64K said:


> Hell, the half-assed Epic Store doesn't even have a search bar. Does this inspire confidence that the site will be maintained over the years?


They don't need a search bar, all of their titles fit on one page


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## 64K (Feb 10, 2019)

silentbogo said:


> They don't need a search bar, all of their titles fit on one page



You're right, and that's funny right now,  but bear in mind that they intend to give away a game every 2 weeks this year and they seem intent on paying other Publishers to make their games an Epic Store exclusive.


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## silentbogo (Feb 10, 2019)

64K said:


> You're right, and that's funny right now, but bear in mind that they intend to give away a game every 2 weeks this year and they seem intent on paying other Publishers to make their games an Epic Store exclusive.


That's what made it even funnier - they don't have enough indie titles to last until summer for this bi-weekly giveaway. Maybe if I wait 'till september - I'll get metro for free )))


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