Friday, March 3rd 2017
AMD Responds to Ryzen's Lower Than Expected 1080p Performance
The folks at PC Perspective have shared a statement from AMD in response to their question as to why AMD's Ryzen processors show lower than expected performance at 1080p resolution (despite posting good high-resolution, high-detail frame rates). Essentially, AMD is reinforcing the need for developers to optimize their games' performance to AMD's CPUs (claiming that these have only been properly tuned to Intel's architecture). AMD also puts weight behind the fact they have sent about 300 developer kits already, so that content creators can get accustomed to AMD's Ryzen, and expect this number to increase to about a thousand developers in the 2017 time-frame. AMD is expecting gaming performance to only increase from its launch-day level. Read AMD's statement after the break.
AMD's John Taylor had this to say:
"As we presented at Ryzen Tech Day, we are supporting 300+ developer kits with game development studios to optimize current and future game releases for the all-new Ryzen CPU. We are on track for 1000+ developer systems in 2017. For example, Bethesda at GDC yesterday announced its strategic relationship with AMD to optimize for Ryzen CPUs, primarily through Vulkan low-level API optimizations, for a new generation of games, DLC and VR experiences.
Oxide Games also provided a public statement today on the significant performance uplift observed when optimizing for the 8-core, 16-thread Ryzen 7 CPU design - optimizations not yet reflected in Ashes of the Singularity benchmarking. Creative Assembly, developers of the Total War series, made a similar statement today related to upcoming Ryzen optimizations.
CPU benchmarking deficits to the competition in certain games at 1080p resolution can be attributed to the development and optimization of the game uniquely to Intel platforms - until now. Even without optimizations in place, Ryzen delivers high, smooth frame rates on all "CPU-bound" games, as well as overall smooth frame rates and great experiences in GPU-bound gaming and VR. With developers taking advantage of Ryzen architecture and the extra cores and threads, we expect benchmarks to only get better, and enable Ryzen excel at next generation gaming experiences as well.
Game performance will be optimized for Ryzen and continue to improve from at-launch frame rate scores."
Two game developers also chimed in.
Oxide Games, creators of the Nitrous game engine that powers Ashes of the Singularity:
"Oxide games is incredibly excited with what we are seeing from the Ryzen CPU. Using our Nitrous game engine, we are working to scale our existing and future game title performance to take full advantage of Ryzen and its 8-core, 16-thread architecture, and the results thus far are impressive. These optimizations are not yet available for Ryzen benchmarking. However, expect updates soon to enhance the performance of games like Ashes of the Singularity on Ryzen CPUs, as well as our future game releases." - Brad Wardell, CEO Stardock and Oxide
And Creative Assembly, the creators of the Total War Series and, more recently, Halo Wars 2:
"Creative Assembly is committed to reviewing and optimizing its games on the all-new Ryzen CPU. While current third-party testing doesn't reflect this yet, our joint optimization program with AMD means that we are looking at options to deliver performance optimization updates in the future to provide better performance on Ryzen CPUs moving forward. "
Source:
PC Perspective
"As we presented at Ryzen Tech Day, we are supporting 300+ developer kits with game development studios to optimize current and future game releases for the all-new Ryzen CPU. We are on track for 1000+ developer systems in 2017. For example, Bethesda at GDC yesterday announced its strategic relationship with AMD to optimize for Ryzen CPUs, primarily through Vulkan low-level API optimizations, for a new generation of games, DLC and VR experiences.
Oxide Games also provided a public statement today on the significant performance uplift observed when optimizing for the 8-core, 16-thread Ryzen 7 CPU design - optimizations not yet reflected in Ashes of the Singularity benchmarking. Creative Assembly, developers of the Total War series, made a similar statement today related to upcoming Ryzen optimizations.
CPU benchmarking deficits to the competition in certain games at 1080p resolution can be attributed to the development and optimization of the game uniquely to Intel platforms - until now. Even without optimizations in place, Ryzen delivers high, smooth frame rates on all "CPU-bound" games, as well as overall smooth frame rates and great experiences in GPU-bound gaming and VR. With developers taking advantage of Ryzen architecture and the extra cores and threads, we expect benchmarks to only get better, and enable Ryzen excel at next generation gaming experiences as well.
Game performance will be optimized for Ryzen and continue to improve from at-launch frame rate scores."
Two game developers also chimed in.
Oxide Games, creators of the Nitrous game engine that powers Ashes of the Singularity:
"Oxide games is incredibly excited with what we are seeing from the Ryzen CPU. Using our Nitrous game engine, we are working to scale our existing and future game title performance to take full advantage of Ryzen and its 8-core, 16-thread architecture, and the results thus far are impressive. These optimizations are not yet available for Ryzen benchmarking. However, expect updates soon to enhance the performance of games like Ashes of the Singularity on Ryzen CPUs, as well as our future game releases." - Brad Wardell, CEO Stardock and Oxide
And Creative Assembly, the creators of the Total War Series and, more recently, Halo Wars 2:
"Creative Assembly is committed to reviewing and optimizing its games on the all-new Ryzen CPU. While current third-party testing doesn't reflect this yet, our joint optimization program with AMD means that we are looking at options to deliver performance optimization updates in the future to provide better performance on Ryzen CPUs moving forward. "
126 Comments on AMD Responds to Ryzen's Lower Than Expected 1080p Performance
Availability of cores is not the issue here, multithreading is actually hard. And by hard, I mean expensive.
Instead of blaming devs they could simply say that "All of these titles were developed pre-Ryzen and as such won't be fully optimized for our brand spanking new architecture. We are working with major studios to alleviate the issue and hope to see better performance going forward as new games come out that have been developed with Ryzen in mind and new versions of our chips ship that are more gaming oriented."
That's all they had to say.
Instead they accused gaming devs of developing and optimizing ONLY for Intel, despite the fact that AMD has cpu's out and they are used for gaming. Without optimization and with the massive performance deficit between bulldozer gen4/vishera based chips and the intel offerings would have made gaming improbable on any AMD cpu.
Obviously the game devs had to be doing some optimization for AMD. Throwing them under the bus like that and then saying "but we're counting on them to fix it" isn't a great idea. "Let's piss off the people we need to fix the issue" is a great way to ensure Ryzen's 1080p performance remains lackluster.
Had they gone with my quote from above it would go over better and its more honest.
However, I'll say that whatever you pair it with the Ryzen processors aren't that bad at gaming, even if you do pair it with a GTX1080Ti or a Titan XP. And I'm sure there will be a good number of people buying GTX1080Ti cards and pairing them with Ryzen processors. The reason being that no one buying those cards is going to be playing at 1080p. And that is where people are going wrong. They are focusing too much on the 1080p benchmarks. The 1080p benchmarks have a place, they are done for a reason, I know that. They use the beefiest card/s possible, at basically the lowest resolution people are playing at, to limit the GPU bottleneck as much as possible and try to move the bottleneck to the CPU. The problem is that essentially becomes a synthetic benchmark to me. Because that is a scenario that will almost never happen.Actually, $329. And it isn't that I think they got lazy. I think it is the same reasoning behind why Ryzen 1080 benchmarks aren't that reasonable. They are programming to the majority. The majority have 4-core or less processors. So that is what they program for.
Ryzen is going to force Intel to lower prices on their 6 and 8 core chips. So it isn't just that the AMD chips are reasonable now, it will make Intel's reasonable, and overall a lot more
peoplegamers are going to be buying them.Intel:
6800K (yeah, I know, not what you posted exactly) - $380
MSI X99A Raider - $159
GTX 1080 (I already had this from launch day, with my previous setup.) - $650
Total = $1189
Before chucking out numbers, maybe want to check your facts. The motherboard alone you're just crazy pants. Now I would have liked to have waited for Ryzen launch, but after seeing reviews of day one, I'm OK with having my machine for 6-9 months before the bugs and issues get ironed out with the Ryzen platform.
Remember, boost is only 2c/4t.
No matter what the internet hype was in regard to gaming, 8 core CPUs are not targeted at gaming in the current single core environment.
Having said that, it is obvious that AMD has some work to do to create compilers to bring some games up to the natural performance levels that one would expect from chips that have similar IPC to Intel's eight core chips.
Apart that tiny fact that making game from dual core to quad, hexa or octa friendly isnt "just like that". In many cases (FPS mostly) its near impossible. If we dont mind that even if it was possible you dont have that much to occupy those extra cores with. Sure you can probably have FPS that uses six cores. Only problem will be that one core will go to 100% load and rest up to whole freaking 5%.
Low-lvl approach (Vulkan, Mantle however is that called now) wont help, power aint there. By that I mean single-core computing power. And if its not there, you wont get more.
But IMHO these CPUs are great for that price and do we all really need top CPUs for gaming? Not rly.. Lately I could actually use 6 cores, so Im glad they made them.
Ryzen today is "pretty good CPU for pretty good price". If you want the best, sure buy Intel. But thing is, very few do need the best. There is Ferrari, Bugatti, Koenigsegg.. and majority of ppl drives something from Ford, VW or some asian stuff.
Clearly, there are bios/cpu/scheduling issues and/or the games are only meant to run well on Intel. Otherwise, they would be within a reasonable margin of 6900K. That is not happening except in some games in some reviews. The reviews are all over the place.
And why did I see big losses at 1080 in some games, but noticeable leads at 1440? That should be impossible. Shit is jank and needs to be sorted. Reviewers and AMD need to get their shit straight. This could be worse than all the stupid bulldozer reviews that were inconsistent.
Or maybe because they just love conflict no matter what happened
AMD needs to (eventually) sell to 4 and 6 core chips to the average Joe and do so at a profit. It will be tough if the game performance leaves much to Intel.
And as for blaming devs ,amd are stating facts, theirs is a NEW arch that needs some software optimisation to attain the full performance potential ,you bet and thank god ,because the sAme old shit wasn't cutting it for me I prefer my innovation to be both different and worthwhile and not just another 100 mhz bump, so yay back to you devs and engine devs ,while you're at that dx12 render path to take advantage of Moar cores do us all a favour, look into ryzen optimisation and possibly don't use Intel's compiler,as Ive no doubt its latest version will insist everything has to be 256bit aes encrypted or some such malougins.
@Batou1986 ,you get what you pay for ,Intel or amd,if you buy a low end cheap motherboard you get low end performance and will end up a moaner.
I overclocked my friends 6320 on you're board two nights ago because he finally got a evo 212 like I told him.
Nightmare, his throttled all the time at stock settings,I was forced into bclk clocking it by the crapness of his board, I've had his chip easily do 4.5 in my rig but not in his, 4.3 max.
Point being you're reference and perception have been affected by your purchase choices and you should have chosen better imho.