Wednesday, June 21st 2017

After Kaspersky's Shots Across the Bow, Microsoft Reacts

You probably have heard about security giant Kaspersky having previously fired some shots (figurative ones, which translated into a very real antitrust complaint recently) towards Microsoft. The gist of the issue stands on Windows' handling of third party security software suites, with Windows sometimes removing those suits' installations on basis of "incompatibility" with more recent Windows versions. Other points of conflict mention the coloring in Windows Defender, where a user's security status appears as "not green", which leads customers towards believing that even though their systems have a third party security software installed, only Windows Defender can really and fully protect them (which is visually conveyed by the Window adopting a green coloring when customers select to activate Windows Defender.)
Granted, Microsoft's response was indirect - probably looking to distance themselves from the matter as much as possible - but it was a response of sorts. In a blog post, Microsoft reiterates that Windows Defender is shipping with Windows so users have a fallback protection on at all times, before they have been able to install their third-party security program of choice, or even in case such a protection expires for any reason. In a blog post, Microsoft states that it is in the consumers' best interest to always have an extra security solution being available without user input, so as to reduce exposure time while customers look for and choose another (or the same) security third party.

The company mentioned the WannaCry debacle, and how it is their mission to provide a full-blown, safe computing environment for users, on top of which they can then add third party solutions. Remember the browser antitrust investigation which resulted in Microsoft including a browser choice window for new installations? That could be one of the possible future solutions by Microsoft to avoid an antitrust investigation - if it really is found that Microsoft is using somewhat underhanded tactics. But that, like most things, is open to debate.
Sources: Microsoft Blogs, Tom's Hardware, Tom's Hardware
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36 Comments on After Kaspersky's Shots Across the Bow, Microsoft Reacts

#26
DeathtoGnomes
FordGT90ConceptMicrosoft Security Essentials and Windows Defender were born out of the need to fight viruses that can prevent the successful installation of Windows and later, Windows security updates. The research they had to do there lead to branching off to a basic system to counter malicious software that security updates can't fix. The only thing one really can fault Windows Defender for is not being as intrusive, meticulous, and heavy handed as the third party solutions. Microsoft basically delivered what most people wanted. Popularity of third party antivirus programs therefore plummeted.
I agree, m$ did an ok job on not being intrusive with WinDef, but they have plenty of other products that are, they had to cave on something... eventually. :rolleyes:

On the other hand, I would like to disable Window Defender from continuously re-adding its notification(MSASCui.exe) to HKLM/Run, just goes to show how much m$ loves to be intrusive in one way or another. :shadedshu:
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#27
kn00tcn
TheLaughingManIt working, being simple to use, using very little memory and resources, and letting me uninstall it when I feel like it. These are all thinks Kaspersky struggled to provide when I was using a log time ago. I hope things have gotten better, but I don't care about going back to check. I just tossed it in the pile of software I have quality working replacements for like Firefox, MS Office, Nero, and a few others.
dont mean to necro, but i didnt login for a few months

so basically you blacklist entire software FOR LIFE based on a bad experience at one point in time? shouldnt this mean no more windows if you used it at the start of vista, no more amd if you used their cards/drivers in 2011, ignoring how good ryzen is based on how bad amd was last few years, no more modern linux based on how messy & uncompatible it was a few years ago, the list goes on

you could at least take a look eventually if some software is claiming to have changed, or has users reporting that it has, or if there's a large enough userbase
Posted on Reply
#28
TheLaughingMan
kn00tcndont mean to necro, but i didnt login for a few months

so basically you blacklist entire software FOR LIFE based on a bad experience at one point in time? shouldnt this mean no more windows if you used it at the start of vista, no more amd if you used their cards/drivers in 2011, ignoring how good ryzen is based on how bad amd was last few years, no more modern linux based on how messy & uncompatible it was a few years ago, the list goes on

you could at least take a look eventually if some software is claiming to have changed, or has users reporting that it has, or if there's a large enough userbase
Hardware is not software. I do have a Ryzen 1800X and no I don't use any of AMD's current software offerings. I never used Vista because I knew to avoid it. I have never had an issue with an Linux distro I couldn't fix in 15 minutes and a web search. So I hope that helps you someone because I still have no reason to check any software I have dropped in the past.
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#29
StrayKAT
DeathtoGnomesm$ could try and make(sell) Security software, but I they seriously doubt have the ability to be competitive and still have personnel left over to cater to their enterprise customers. Nope, its just basic, bottom of the line, barebones type effort put in its security software to placate the consumer, knowing full well the majority of m$ consumers will go with 3rd party security. If it takes a 3rd party to get m$ to react to fix something, maybe there is a bigger issue inside the m$ bedchambers.

For all this to work, people have to put egos aside and actually work better together, there seems to be too much "my way or the highway" developers there.
I haven't once thought of going third party since they integrated this. Not sure how the market is now though. There was a lot of bloated software last I checked (Norton, McAfee). If it's still like that, good riddance.

edit: lol.. damnit.. old thread.
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#30
Shihab
StrayKATI haven't once thought of going third party since they integrated this. Not sure how the market is now though. There was a lot of bloated software last I checked (Norton, McAfee). If it's still like that, good riddance.

edit: lol.. damnit.. old thread.
It has gotten worse, with AV vendors now buying snake-oil software (Tuneup -> AVG, CCleaner ->Avast) left and right.
Ironically, these bloatware seem to be LESS secure now they are owned by security vendors. :rolleyes:
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#31
rtwjunkie
PC Gaming Enthusiast
ShihabyoooIt has gotten worse, with AV vendors now buying snake-oil software (Tuneup -> AVG, CCleaner ->Avast) left and right.
Ironically, these bloatware seem to be LESS secure now they are owned by security vendors. :rolleyes:
How is that? CCleaner was bought at about the time the security breach happened. As soon as it was discovered it was announced. It literally had nothing to do with Avast's purchase of the company. In a month after acquisition, merged companies still operate independently most of the time. Culture, software, procedures of parent company always take awhile to be adopted.
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#32
Shihab
rtwjunkieHow is that? CCleaner was bought at about the time the security breach happened. As soon as it was discovered it was announced. It literally had nothing to do with Avast's purchase of the company. In a month after acquisition, merged companies still operate independently most of the time. Culture, software, procedures of parent company always take awhile to be adopted.
Which is why I started with "ironically." But yes, my sentence seems to imply more causation than I intended; I stand corrected.
Posted on Reply
#33
DeathtoGnomes
ShihabyoooWhich is why I started with "ironically." But yes, my sentence seems to imply more causation than I intended; I stand corrected.
Why stand when you can sit? implying that software is snake-oil isnt right, someone else might swear by it, that it works flawlessly for them. CCleaner does have its good points even if it did delete every single save from my Steam games.
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#34
Frick
Fishfaced Nincompoop
TheLaughingManI have never had an issue with an Linux distro I couldn't fix in 15 minutes and a web search.
Then you're doing something wrong.
Posted on Reply
#35
Shihab
DeathtoGnomesWhy stand when you can sit? implying that software is snake-oil isnt right, someone else might swear by it, that it works flawlessly for them. CCleaner does have its good points even if it did delete every single save from my Steam games.
I know many who swear that some random fruit or what's not cures cancer, but I personally wouldn't be changing my diet to it because someone else thinks it works. Placebo's well known to attach beneficial labels to things that isn't. And while I might admit the existence of some remote case scenarios in which CCleaner does have benefits, in general it is nothing but half redundancies (uninstaller, startup modifier component, etc) and the rest is most of the time "snake oil" (registry cleaner component, disk cleaner, etc).
Posted on Reply
#36
lexluthermiester
DeathtoGnomesI agree, m$ did an ok job on not being intrusive with WinDef, but they have plenty of other products that are, they had to cave on something... eventually. :rolleyes:

On the other hand, I would like to disable Window Defender from continuously re-adding its notification(MSASCui.exe) to HKLM/Run, just goes to show how much m$ loves to be intrusive in one way or another. :shadedshu:
Windows Defender started out being a great addition but MS screwed it up in so many ways. As a default, it is deleted from every installation of Windows I do, along with Internet Explorer[been doing that since Windows 98] and Edge.
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