Tuesday, December 17th 2019
AMD "Renoir" APU iGPU Configuration and Platform Spread Detailed
AMD's upcoming "Renoir" silicon will be the company's most important, as it will sit at the heart of not just desktops, but also notebooks and ultraportables. A brilliant report by _rogame on Reddit compiles the chip's many iGPU variants along with iGPU device-IDs, and slots them in various platform variants. Renoir will target four key market segments characterized by TDP: 15 W ultraportables, 45 W mainstream notebooks, 65 W mainstream desktops, and 35 W low-power desktops.
As for the iGPU itself, "Renoir" was last reported as being a processor that combines "Zen 2" CPU cores with an iGPU that has SIMD machinery from the "Vega" architecture, but with updated display- and multimedia-engines from "Navi." According to _rogame, Renoir's iGPU will have up to 13 NGCUs, which work out to 832 stream processors. AMD internally marks the iGPU as RV B##, where RV refers to "Radeon Vega," and B## referring to the iGPU variant. The commercial name of the iGPU will be different. B12 is the highest variant, with 12-13 CUs, B10 has 10-11 CUs, B8 has 8-9 CUs, B6 has 6 CUs, and B4 has 3-4 CUs. The B12 configuration will be exclusive to the mobile parts. The desktop parts cap out at B10. Renoir is expected to dominate AMD's processor launch cycle through the first half of 2020.
Source:
_rogame (Reddit)
As for the iGPU itself, "Renoir" was last reported as being a processor that combines "Zen 2" CPU cores with an iGPU that has SIMD machinery from the "Vega" architecture, but with updated display- and multimedia-engines from "Navi." According to _rogame, Renoir's iGPU will have up to 13 NGCUs, which work out to 832 stream processors. AMD internally marks the iGPU as RV B##, where RV refers to "Radeon Vega," and B## referring to the iGPU variant. The commercial name of the iGPU will be different. B12 is the highest variant, with 12-13 CUs, B10 has 10-11 CUs, B8 has 8-9 CUs, B6 has 6 CUs, and B4 has 3-4 CUs. The B12 configuration will be exclusive to the mobile parts. The desktop parts cap out at B10. Renoir is expected to dominate AMD's processor launch cycle through the first half of 2020.
63 Comments on AMD "Renoir" APU iGPU Configuration and Platform Spread Detailed
The new Gx naming? It's supposed to be for chips with better GPU. Isn't it intuitive?
Personally, I would LOVE it if AMD stopped screwing around and made a powerhouse APU for desktop that would have enough graphical horsepower to basically gut the low end dGPU market. It would need 4GB of embedded HBM2, but personally I wouldn't care if the entire APU package was the size of threadripper and required 200W (as long as it has 8c/16T at least) and cost $500.
I've been following patents for about 5 years now, and from what I've seen, AMD has the IP to do this... So perhaps I'm the only one that wants an APU with the power of the new gaming consoles?
LPDDR4X and higher speed DDR4 have no future with DDR5 around the corner which will make it worthwhile to change their APUs. Also, no, the memory performance isn't there, even with something like 3733 LPDDR4X these things are still memory bandwidth starved.I cringe reading this, on the other hand it seems that you take this too seriously. I explained why, it's not worth it, as with any other company they care only about what's going to yield results.
It is curious though that you bring this up, are you aware that there have been practically zero innovations in the last decade or so with anything that was GPU and mobile related from Intel ? When AMD trashed them in this area in terms of performance Intel was suddenly able to come back with a newly developed architecture with LPDDR4X and all that. If Intel was so concerned with the well being of their mobile users why have they sold them gloried display adapters all this time ? It seems like AMD raising the bar tremendously was just them not caring about mobile. These are some interesting theories indeed.Too costly and complicated for now, if AMD ever gets some considerable market share I suspect they will pull this off eventually.
Yes & this is why we'll need HBM in there somewhere, ddr5 or ddr6 will not solve that problem.
Is there anything objectively interesting or is this just an extreme opinion that you identify with?
Actually, this is where weird AMD launch strategy makes sense (by coincidence; likely for the first time). Mobile Zen4 will come a year after desktop Zen4, so both just in time for appropriate DDR5.
In a world dominated by mobile devices, LPDDR4(X) will soon be the most popular RAM (maybe it already is). And it's really fast as well.
What I think is annoying though from those product leaks if true, the desktop tops out at 10cu, while the notebook parts get 12cu. That makes little sense to me, give me power budget and all the cus! 12 CU and a 15W power budget means a couple hundred MHz if the CPU cores are doing anything.
I still think it's sad that the best IGP that AMD has made in recent years was for Intel... 4GB of HBM that could be used as cache for the CPU... or that monster in the One X... Beautiful...
BTW mobile APU having more CU makes sense I think. Nvidia tactic maybe. More cores but all clocked very low. And desktop APU having too much power doesn't make sense. While I'll dream on my little dream, it's an expensive upgrade path tbh. Instead of just upgrading CPU or GPU individually when needed you have to upgrade the APU that won't be cheap if it is a decent CPU as well as sub-$200 dGPU-slaying iGPU. Not to mention it'll be memory bandwidth starved on DDR5 or whatever DRAM tech is used.
The DDR5 launch will actually happen with the mobile world first. Unless your point was something else entirely?
www.anandtech.com/show/14655/samsung-starts-production-of-lpddr55500-devices-12-gb-of-dram-in-a-smartphoneYeah unfortunately you can't (easily, if at all?) upgrade LPxxx as far as I know, so if the OEM's pulled the same trick you're stuck with that till the end of product's life.
Though considering how things have been with my Fury X, the drivers can be moody, since that 'Vega' is really more of a baby Fury, since it uses Polaris CUs with HBM attached. I think that's also why you are seeing the new APU getting the Vega compute units because OpenCL performance on the Fury branch was never great.
Smartphones are getting LPDDR5 next year.
LPDDR4's first appearance in smartphones: Samsung S6, early 2015.How can I know if it goes against my opinion, if I haven't seen it?
Seriously, some of us just don't watch vlogs.
And the ARM-powered MacBooks will be in the Air lineup - probably with an x86 variant available as well.
MacBook Pro will remain on x86. :)
7nm and Zen2's improved memory speeds are absolutely perfect for mobile APUs but AMD isn't woke enough to get it onto their mobile line as a priority.
I'm super glad that Zen2 and Navi happened on desktop, since I'm a desktop user first and foremost. However, the mass market is mobile-first. Laptops outsell desktops 3-1. AMD should be focusing on Mobile products first. That's where the money is, that's where they need to gain marketshare. It's mind-boggling that AMD are willing to concede this vastly larger market to Intel by using prior-gen architecture and process nodes. At times, their mobile line is two generations behind their current offerings; If I was a laptop manufacturer, I wouldn't be interested.
But if I’m in my thinking of a possible MS Surface thats a great way to break back in and prove themselves.in low power portables so the stronger models should sell themselves.
Given that the Surface Laptop 3 is only pre-ordering still (some lucky few might get theirs before Christmas), it's going to be something that's two years out of date by the time it's available for mainstream buyers. That's pretty awful for something that a lot of people will replace every 2-3 years.
If MS waited and used a Renoir APU with 7nm power efficiency gains and presumably AMD recommended memory speeds (DDR4-3200/CL14 or DDR4-3600/CL16) then the AMD would likely spank the Intel in most, if not all, of the tests - and at a lower price.
As it is, it's AMD's 2-year-old architecture on a 2-year-old manufacturing process going up against Intel's single most significant and advanced offering in the last 5 years, in a market segment where architectural efficiency and process node are quite literally the deciding factor. Power efficiency is what determines the size/weight/thickness/performance/temperature/noise/battery life of a laptop and despite their 'launch date' the Ryzen 3580U and 3780U are old and tired; It's a miracle that there's even any comparison between them and the Intel Ice-Lake options at all!
Edit:
Now I think about it, even the "Vega IGP" in the AMD APUs is likely just a rebrand. GCN5 differed from GCN4 as used by Polaris in the 570/580/590 almost entirely by HBM, HBCC and rapid-packed maths - primarily for gaining traction in the server/compute market. Guess what the Vega IGPs are missing; Yep - all of things I just mentioned. They're Polaris cores, in all but name - two generations behind Navi/RDNA already.