So what is the virtual pitch fork squad going to bash AMD for now?

Obviously an annoying issue for those that experienced it, but it was clearly not a hardware flaw as some seemed to suggest.

Just ANUTHA reason not to buy Rev1 of any pc hdwr..... :D

The REAL question is (IMHO): why this was not discovered & fixed PRIOR to release ?????

Anyone ever used that Bug Report Tool?

bonehead123Just ANUTHA reason not to buy Rev1 of any pc hdwr..... :D

The REAL question is (IMHO): why this was not discovered & fixed PRIOR to release ?????

Umm AFAIK this popped up in one of the AGESA updates after Zen 3 release. This has nothing to do with hardware revisions.

TheLostSwedeSo what is the virtual pitch fork squad going to bash AMD for now?

Obviously an annoying issue for those that experienced it, but it was clearly not a hardware flaw as some seemed to suggest.

Intel has always been the more stable platform, dating back to the days when third parties were making chipsets for their CPUs. It seems AMD is keeping that tradition alive.

All this will be fixed generally when stop support of older generations like USB 2.0, PCIe 1/2/3.0, 1G network controller, VGA and DVI, COM and other ancient "technologies" and reduce size of BIOS and drivers. Too many old compatibles, too long code=more bugs
Who can old tech, there is second hand market!

TheLostSwedeSo what is the virtual pitch fork squad going to bash AMD for now?

Obviously an annoying issue for those that experienced it, but it was clearly not a hardware flaw as some seemed to suggest.

Or is it a hardware flaw covered up by a software fix that affects performance? That's my guess. I bet people doing tests before and after will find USB performance will be worse after this update.

Another reason to buy Intel. Stability from the get go.

bugIntel has always been the more stable platform, dating back to the days when third parties were making chipsets for their CPUs. It seems AMD is keeping that tradition alive.

Please provide supporting evidence because I'm pretty sure that is a total myth. I know I've read an article or two about it in the past but can't seem to find one at the moment.

ZareekPlease provide supporting evidence because I'm pretty sure that is a total myth. I know I've read an article or two about it in the past but can't seem to find one at the moment.

I wouldn't say "always" but I would say in general Intel has had the more stable platforms. But then again they tend to stick with the same platform with just minor improvements for a decade, so it makes sense.

u might wonder if thats why Intel releases a New motherboard Series with every processor update that they dont face problems like this..

AMD should have just released a X670, B650 motherboards with ryzen 5000 series..

TheLostSwedeSo what is the virtual pitch fork squad going to bash AMD for now?

Obviously an annoying issue for those that experienced it, but it was clearly not a hardware flaw as some seemed to suggest.

It wasn't all that widespread, either. Though it was definitely far from being an isolated issue.

TumbleGeorgeAll this will be fixed generally when stop support of older generations like USB 2.0, PCIe 1/2/3.0, 1G network controller, VGA and DVI, COM and other ancient "technologies" and reduce size of BIOS and drivers. Too many old compatibles, too long code=more bugs
Who can old tech, there is second hand market!

Not gonna happen anytime soon. For that matter, just yesterday I bought a relatively recent Bluetooth adapter from TP-Link and it's USB 2.0.

Few, if any, manufacturers are going to implement USB 3.0 on any device if said device doesn't need the extra speed/power.

Everything else, probably same story or it's so ingrained somewhere that removing it brings far more headaches.

ZareekPlease provide supporting evidence because I'm pretty sure that is a total myth. I know I've read an article or two about it in the past but can't seem to find one at the moment.

Yup that sounds like wild speculation and would require proof.

bugIntel has always been the more stable platform, dating back to the days when third parties were making chipsets for their CPUs. It seems AMD is keeping that tradition alive.

Proof on that, or it's hearsay.
I mean, it's not as if Intel haven't had their fair of issues over the years.
In fact, at one point, SiS made a better chipset for Intel than Intel did, not long after Intel banned third party chipsets.

TheLostSwedeSo what is the virtual pitch fork squad going to bash AMD for now?

Obviously an annoying issue for those that experienced it, but it was clearly not a hardware flaw as some seemed to suggest.

Not had any issues with mine but good to see AMD on top of it.. Put the Intel name on a pile of shit they will say it is better.. Ignore them!

TumbleGeorgeAll this will be fixed generally when stop support of older generations like USB 2.0, PCIe 1/2/3.0, 1G network controller, VGA and DVI, COM and other ancient "technologies" and reduce size of BIOS and drivers. Too many old compatibles, too long code=more bugs
Who can old tech, there is second hand market!

Sorry what? What kind of utter drivel is this?
What does I/O and physical interfaces have to do with it?
If you have an issue with drivers, take that up with Microsoft. Most drivers are tiny in Linux.
PCIe is a backwards compatible technology by design. Ethernet doesn't cause any known issues. USB is in every single modern computer.
Sure, we can get rid of VGA and DVI, but considering that most VGA ports today use a D/A chip and takes a digital signal from the GPU, it's hardly an issue.
DVI uses more or less the same standard as HDMI, so should we get rid of HDMI too then?
COM ports might not be useful to you, but the serial bus is still used in a ton of devices. It's not something that's going to have a detrimental effect on the system.
Sure, tidy up the code, but that's not the same as getting rid of still widely used standards just because you don't like them.

fancuckerAnother reason to buy Intel. Stability from the get go.

Can you please provide proof of this?
There seems to be a fair amount of issues with Intel these days too and always have been.
Shit, Intel used to make some horrible motherboards back in the days.

Fatalfuryu might wonder if thats why Intel releases a New motherboard Series with every processor update that they dont face problems like this..

AMD should have just released a X670, B650 motherboards with ryzen 5000 series..

Why? What new technology could they possibly have added that would've made sense?
And if this is a USB issue that is not exclusive to the 5000-series CPUs or the two (by two different companies I should point out) 500-series chipsets, as it clearly affects the 400-series in some cases as well, what use would a new chipset have been? Please enlighten me.

TheLostSwedeCan you please provide proof of this?
There seems to be a fair amount of issues with Intel these days too and always have been.
Shit, Intel used to make some horrible motherboards back in the days.

I doubt any of them can provide any proof they just prefer intel platforms.

I was on socket 1366 for 10 years and now AM4 1 1/2 years and this platform is just as stable as my previous intel rig.

windwhirlIt wasn't all that widespread, either. Though it was definitely far from being an isolated issue.

Not saying it didn't affect people. But it seems to be somewhat blown out of proportion if it has taken this long for people to complain.

MakaveliI doubt any of them can provide any proof they just prefer intel platforms.

I was on socket 1366 for 10 years and now AM4 1 1/2 years and this platform is just as stable as my previous intel rig.

Which is fine.

The truth is that AMD has rushed out their platforms and as an early adopter on the first gen Ryzen and the third gen Ryzen platforms I can honestly say there have been issues.
Have they been fixed? Yes, but it did take about three months each time to get the platform to where it should've been at launch.
Part of the reason here is that AMD is a much smaller company than Intel and doesn't have the resources Intel have.
At the same time, AMD put too much trust in the ability of the board makers, who are used to get finished reference platforms from Intel to base their own designs on.
AMD turned up with a tray of chipsets and said call us if you're having any problems.
So yes, AMD can do a lot better, but considering the resources Intel has and the way they do things, shouldn't their platforms be flawless at launch in comparison then?
At least that's what it sounds like here.

It feels like a lot of people like to throw some crap out on the internet because they think they know something.
I spent over a decade of my life as a tech journalist and I started back in the days when you had 20-odd motherboard manufactures to choose from and 6-7 chipset vendors and at least four x86 CPU manufacturers.
I remember testing the first DDR 133MHz capable chipset from VIA with a stick of some crap RAM they sent along. I could never get that stick of RAM working and they could never figure out why.
I remember testing the first ATA-66 controller from Promise, turned out the company that supplied it hadn't been given the latest firmware update for it, so I spent three days trying to get it working, when in fact, it couldn't work at ATA-66 speeds.
I mean, this is nothing new or unique, but if all it takes is a firmware/BIOS/UEFI update to fix the problem, it's really not a big deal.
When you have to a hardware recall, because something i borked on the hardware side, that's when you have serious problems.

I haven't had any USB issues with my current x570 board with my 5900x. I did have some WHEA errors from time to time while gaming, but that was before AGESA 1.2.0.0. I haven't had a single issue with any crashing in the past 6 weeks or so since the 1.2.0.0 AGESA was released for my board from ASRock.

I cannot recall any stability issues from any other build I've done in the past with AMD or Intel. I can say that I've experienced some performance loss when they released software patches for security issues on my last Intel build. Sure, it wasn't a stability issue, but apparently a glaring enough security risk that the patch actually hindered performance some.

Neither company is without their faults. It's a good thing when they are able to fix the faults and the consumers can continue to utilize the hardware as needed. Why one needs to blast one company over the other, that just seems childish.

windwhirlFew, if any, manufacturers are going to implement USB 3.0 on any device if said device doesn't need the extra speed/power

Dinosaurs! Don't buy their products anymore and they will be forced to produce and offer up-to-date hardware.

TheLostSwedebut the serial bus is still used in a ton of devices

Put this for resicle. In this hardware has many gold and other useful metals. :)

TheLostSwedeProof on that, or it's hearsay.
I mean, it's not as if Intel haven't had their fair of issues over the years.

VIA had to respin KT266 into KT266A and KT400 into KT400A, for example. And that's just otoh.
Mind you, they both ended up as excellent chipsets, but the initial problems is something Intel managed to avoid.

TheLostSwedeIn fact, at one point, SiS made a better chipset for Intel than Intel did, not long after Intel banned third party chipsets.

Was that the chipset that employed a crossbar-switch design? My memory is failing me.

TumbleGeorgePut this for resicle. In this hardware has many gold and other useful metals. :)

Sorry, but I don't think you understand the difference between an standard, interconnect and a physical interface.

newtekie1I wouldn't say "always" but I would say in general Intel has had the more stable platforms. But then again they tend to stick with the same platform with just minor improvements for a decade, so it makes sense.

I can agree with that for the most part, Intel on Intel motherboards were very solid. AMD was a roll of the dice with some third party chipsets and some motherboard makers would skimp on the power delivery and filtering. I only ever bought premium motherboard brands, so I've never had issues.

bugVIA had to respin KT266 into KT266A and KT400 into KT400A, for example. And that's just otoh.
Mind you, they both ended up as excellent chipsets, but the initial problems is something Intel managed to avoid.

Was that the chipset that employed a crossbar-switch design? My memory is failing me.

I personally don't think it is appropriate to blame AMD for the sins of VIA. It wasn't the AMD platform but rather the execution of it by a third party. The AMD platforms made by AMD have historically been just as solid as their Intel counterparts.

bugVIA had to respin KT266 into KT266A and KT400 into KT400A, for example. And that's just otoh.
Mind you, they both ended up as excellent chipsets, but the initial problems is something Intel managed to avoid.

Was that the chipset that employed a crossbar-switch design? My memory is failing me.

Uhm, the A versions weren't just plain respins though. It's like calling 200-series of Intel chipsets a respin of the 100-series.
Yes, the KT266 had an issue with AGP 4x, but I don't know what the KT400 was supposed to suffer from.

It was back in 2003, I worked at MSI in the UK at the time. It must've been the SiS 655 which had dual channel RAM. Unfortunately it's so long ago that I can't find any reliable benchmarks...
But yes, it was a bit of a one off from SiS, but it showed that Intel could face some real competition on the chipset side of things.

ZareekI personally don't think it is appropriate to blame AMD for the sins of VIA. It wasn't the AMD platform but rather the execution of it by a third party. The AMD platforms made by AMD have historically been just as solid as their Intel counterparts.

I don't think he did, it looks like he blamed VIA for VIA's mistakes.

AMD put out some terrible chipsets, the 750 chipset was a turd for example. I mean, not even MSI (or possibly Biostar, too long ago) wanted to put their name on the first board with the 750 chipset.
Then Asus finally brought one out and things improved a bit, but AMD would've been screwed back in the day if it wasn't for Nvidia and VIA and to a lesser extent ALi and SiS.

I have that issue with my usb dac. Been fine for a while but happens.

While I can understand that not every bug is fixed on launch day, stability issues plaguing the platforms months after a product release is simply not good enough. And keep in mind that we are not talking about "theoretical" problems here, but something breaking system stability which is a deal breaker for anyone using a computer for something productive. It took about ~3 months before Zen 2 became reasonable stable, and Zen 3 is four months in and still getting regular stability improvements, and then I believe this particular issue is chipset related. AMD needs to step up their game here and do more extensive testing, even if this means products will need a month delay and larger groups of testers.