RedelZaVednoIF Nvidia would really want to solve the DIY market GPU shortage problem for 90% of gamers, it should flood DIY retail market with 4 gigs 3050 /3050TI GPUs priced at $149/199.
7.2/8.7 Tflops performance (probably even better because these are mobile versions), should be enough to get us through mining craze cheaply. But it looks like NVidia has no interest in doing that.

That wouldn't happen even if Bitcoin would be at 1/2 in the span of one month. They've been milking hard since the RTX thing. Still banging my head on not buying some damnnnn GPUs as I saw this coming when prices started to rise up here and there after the 2018 crypto crash. The second hand market had a hotspot in summer '19, one I'd suspect will be happening one more time mid 2023

Legacy-ZAYes yes, I know this is an unpopular opinion; As a gamer only, I am glad. Miners will get their dedicated product range, yes, your re-sell value won't be much, but I am glad the secondary market will luck out in the sense that, no cards have been mined to death with and will not be circulating causing gamers harm that thinks they scored a great deal.

Gamers get the cards they want, new or second hand, knowing that they didn't work in the mines 24/7.

All in all, this situation was caused by greed only, people only have themselves to blame. Scalpers and Miners, you can't expect to buy up the whole inventory and not get backlash eventually, the products don't reach their intended audience.

2nd hand mining cards don't harm gamers, they help them. I've purchased numerous video cards dirt cheap thanks to mining and was only able to fit them into my gift budget thanks to the lower price. Over 8 gifted RX 480s / 580s and every single one of them is running perfectly to this day. I paid $80 - 100 each for them, that was an insane deal. They were far cleaner than any used GPU from a regular person I've purchased as well.

In any case it's not like gamers were ever being tricked into buying a mined on GPU anyways. It should be apparent the guy with 300 RX 580s is a miner.

What does hurt gamers is allocating a guaranteed minimum amount of silicon to miners, which assures that mining will bite into the number of cards gamers can get their hands on. Miners can still use gaming cards to mine and to boot they now also get a guaranteed minimum number of cards dedicated to them. To top that off, buying cheap 2nd hand cards will no longer be a choice as mining card are now worthless to gamers. Now those people who would have otherwise purchased a used mining card on the cheap will then be forced to buy from a now even more limited supply of cards. You aren't talking about a small number of potential cards being taken off the market either. Hundreds of thousands of mining cards that aren't useful for gaming anymore? That will ensure gaming GPU prices remain high.

Make no mistake, Nvidia did this to increase it's profits. It's profiting off miners and it's profiting off the fact that this move will prevent the price of their cards dipping due to a flood of mining GPUs on the market. This will hurt gamers guaranteed.

RedelZaVednoBecause you won't see 3050(TI) on retail shelves, if it has more than 4 gigs of VRAM as more GDDR would make it useful for mining ETH & co.

nVidia already gimped the 3060, not via memory, but performance, I don't know how much the 3050Ti is going to perform, but probably near a 2060 or just under it, the normal 3050 will probably be a joke.

evernessince2nd hand mining cards don't harm gamers, they help them. I've purchased numerous video cards dirt cheap thanks to mining and was only able to fit them into my gift budget thanks to the lower price. Over 8 gifted RX 480s / 580s and every single one of them is running perfectly to this day. I paid $80 - 100 each for them, that was an insane deal. They were far cleaner than any used GPU from a regular person I've purchased as well.

In any case it's not like gamers were ever being tricked into buying a mined on GPU anyways. It should be apparent the guy with 300 RX 580s is a miner.

Speak for yourself then, not me.

Legacy-ZASpeak for yourself then, not me.

For starters, I'm not. You clearly don't seem to care to discuss the logic of your position though. You didn't even read my comment, posting less than a minute after it was online. It's actually impossible for you to have read the whole thing before making this comment.

qubitGive it 5 minutes and the hash rate limiter will be hacked again. :laugh:

It wasn't hacked before so it can't be hacked again. It'd be the first time.

Legacy-ZAnVidia already gimped the 3060, not via memory, but performance, I don't know how much the 3050Ti is going to perform, but probably near a 2060 or just under it, the normal 3050 will probably be a joke.

3050/3050TI will be out in August, but only in laptops or so it seems atm. Pretty decent specs 16/20CUs (2048/2560 shaders), boost clock speed (1740 MHz/1695 MHz), FP32 Performance 7.2/8.7... This should put put them somewhere in range of RX 5600 XT/RTX 2060 in 1080p gaming. But only 4 gigs of GDDR6 is limiting factor at 1440p, using UHD textures would be especially problematic.

evernessinceFor starters, I'm not. You clearly don't seem to care to discuss the logic of your position though. You didn't even read my comment, posting less than a minute after it was online. It's actually impossible for you to have read the whole thing before making this comment.

Then look to my previous posts, you don't seem to understand. I understand both sides, both parties now get what they want. Simple.

You just annoy me; as you want to somehow make out that miners are somehow heroic by gracing us with their cheap second-hand shit, they run 24/7, there are a lot of people not so lucky with their second-hand purchase. Also, these were probably GPU's the average gamer would have been able to afford if miners didn't keep buying up all the GPUs at marked-up prices, setting the precedent for continuous price increases. Don't bring inflation into this, as I will prove your wrong in a flash.

evernessince2nd hand mining cards don't harm gamers, they help them. I've purchased numerous video cards dirt cheap thanks to mining and was only able to fit them into my gift budget thanks to the lower price. Over 8 gifted RX 480s / 580s and every single one of them is running perfectly to this day. I paid $80 - 100 each for them, that was an insane deal. They were far cleaner than any used GPU from a regular person I've purchased as well.

In any case it's not like gamers were ever being tricked into buying a mined on GPU anyways. It should be apparent the guy with 300 RX 580s is a miner.

What does hurt gamers is allocating a guaranteed minimum amount of silicon to miners, which assures that mining will bite into the number of cards gamers can get their hands on. Miners can still use gaming cards to mine and to boot they now also get a guaranteed minimum number of cards dedicated to them. To top that off, buying cheap 2nd hand cards will no longer be a choice as mining card are now worthless to gamers. Now those people who would have otherwise purchased a used mining card on the cheap will then be forced to buy from a now even more limited supply of cards. You aren't talking about a small number of potential cards being taken off the market either. Hundreds of thousands of mining cards that aren't useful for gaming anymore? That will ensure gaming GPU prices remain high.

Make no mistake, Nvidia did this to increase it's profits. It's profiting off miners and it's profiting off the fact that this move will prevent the price of their cards dipping due to a flood of mining GPUs on the market. This will hurt gamers guaranteed.

i think everyone understand this. nvidia does not get anything from second hand market. and when the market being flooded with used cards they also have to lower the price of brand new GPU to encourage sales.

MxPhenom 216In silicon? Good luck

Hmmmm, ask intel and amd about silicon protections. I am fully aware that most of their troubles were side channel. Point being, just because it is in silicon don't mean shit.

Legacy-ZAThen look to my previous posts, you don't seem to understand. I understand both sides, both parties now get what they want. Simple.

You just annoy me; as you want to somehow make out that miners are somehow heroic by gracing us with their cheap second-hand shit, they run 24/7, there are a lot of people not so lucky with their second-hand purchase. Also, these were probably GPU's the average gamer would have been able to afford if miners didn't keep buying up all the GPUs at marked-up prices, setting the precedent for continuous price increases. Don't bring inflation into this, as I will prove your wrong in a flash.

No, again that's not the point I was making. Had you not replied within 30 seconds of my original comment and actually read you would realize that. I mearly pointed out that used mining cards are good for gaming and that taking a chuck of cards out the of the total allowance is bad. I never made a judgement call on whether miners are good or bad. God, just fricking read the post next time before commenting.

sepheronxHuh, hope my Alienware I ordered to come by June doesn't have this limiter. If so, I guess I'll have to cancel my order.

Call me. I'll buy it.

Legacy-ZAThen look to my previous posts, you don't seem to understand. I understand both sides, both parties now get what they want. Simple.

You just annoy me; as you want to somehow make out that miners are somehow heroic by gracing us with their cheap second-hand shit, they run 24/7, there are a lot of people not so lucky with their second-hand purchase. Also, these were probably GPU's the average gamer would have been able to afford if miners didn't keep buying up all the GPUs at marked-up prices, setting the precedent for continuous price increases. Don't bring inflation into this, as I will prove your wrong in a flash.

Well said. The miners aren't helping PC gamers. They are doing nothing but hurting PC gaming.

Gaming video cards were intended for gamers. Not miners.

64KWell said. The miners aren't helping PC gamers. They are doing nothing but hurting PC gaming.

Gaming video cards were intended for gamers. Not miners.

Yes, miners hurt gamers except for when they sell their used card for cheap. No one was making the argument that miners are good for gamers in general.

I find this more complicated than it looks:
When the mining craze will end, they'll have to take into account all that used gpus coming in hot.
Prices will go down and that new 4xxx series will be a hard sell.

I don't think that they had the time to change the 4xxx series so that it makes sense against
3xxx being dumped on the market at stupidly low prices.

moproblems99Call me. I'll buy it.

ill take that into consideration ;)

Then again, I am not sure.

The 3080 is a solid GPU all in all. I mean, Ray tracing and DLSS 2 is nice. I do have a 6800xt but I have been more inclined to Nvidia 3080 simply because of DLSS 2.

sepheronxill take that into consideration ;)

Then again, I am not sure.

The 3080 is a solid GPU all in all. I mean, Ray tracing and DLSS 2 is nice. I do have a 6800xt but I have been more inclined to Nvidia 3080 simply because of DLSS 2.

I have a 6900xt and my temps are crazy in rdr2. my junction temp is like 88C on HZD but in RDR2 it hits 110C and I lock up. That is with a 75mv UV.

moproblems99I have a 6900xt and my temps are crazy in rdr2. my junction temp is like 88C on HZD but in RDR2 it hits 110C and I lock up. That is with a 75mv UV.

is it only that game? In honesty, I have not played much games on my 6800xt, nothing at least demanding. But if I had RDR2 I would give it a shot and see what I get.

It is a warm card but the case I got it in has good airflow so I am not too worried about temps so far.

Is your 6900xt watercooled or is it just standard?

sepheronxis it only that game? In honesty, I have not played much games on my 6800xt, nothing at least demanding. But if I had RDR2 I would give it a shot and see what I get.

It is a warm card but the case I got it in has good airflow so I am not too worried about temps so far.

Is your 6900xt watercooled or is it just standard?

AMD Reference. Stock Clocks. It isn't just RDR2, CP2077 does too. The only other game I have played is HZD. All games peg the card at 99% but HZD stays about 20C cooler on the Junction.

evernessinceYes, miners hurt gamers except for when they sell their used card for cheap. No one was making the argument that miners are good for gamers in general.

Except the unfortunate gamers that go for these used mining cards for an upgrade with no warranty and I have seen too many posts about problems with used cards that have been sold by miners.

The bottom line is that miners have no business in PC gaming hardware to begin with much less all of the harm that they are bringing to our hobby.

What if crypto doesn't crash for years? How will all of these gamers that need an upgrade going to be able to get a card new or used?

This is not only going to affect PC gaming today but it will affect PC gaming in the future as well because most gamers simply can't afford the ridiculously priced GPUs from scalpers and may just leave PC gaming which will have a domino effect with Developers neglecting PC game versions because there will be less money in it for them.

moproblems99AMD Reference. Stock Clocks. It isn't just RDR2, CP2077 does too. The only other game I have played is HZD. All games peg the card at 99% but HZD stays about 20C cooler on the Junction.

I'd recommend cleaning the thermal paste off and then applying a generous amount of non-conductive paste.

moproblems99AMD Reference. Stock Clocks. It isn't just RDR2, CP2077 does too. The only other game I have played is HZD. All games peg the card at 99% but HZD stays about 20C cooler on the Junction.

It all depends what you have the card in (airflow and alike). Try undervolting it in wattman as well, may overall help.

My friend has a 3080 and gets overheating issues with certain titles.

64KExcept the unfortunate gamers that go for these used mining cards for an upgrade with no warranty and I have seen too many posts about problems with used cards that have been sold by miners.

The bottom line is that miners have no business in PC gaming hardware to begin with much less all of the harm that they are bringing to our hobby.

What if crypto doesn't crash for years? How will all of these gamers that need an upgrade going to be able to get a card new or used?

This is not only going to affect PC gaming today but it will affect PC gaming in the future as well because most gamers simply can't afford the ridiculously priced GPUs from scalpers and may just leave PC gaming which will have a domino effect with Developers neglecting PC game versions because there will be less money in it for them.

I actually had to put a stop to building customers PC's due to lack of GPU's. Miners are part of the problem, but there are shortages of PS5's as well. Shortages of 6700, 6800 and 6900 cards and I can tell you, they aren't all that great for mining either (can't mine on PS5 as far as I'm aware).

Then there are mining farms where they get something like dozens upon dozens of GPU's and in each case, the answer they give when people ask "how you get those cards?" Is: "friend works in the retail field so he gives me heads up or allows me to pre order from him".

A very crooked market everything is. Scalpers, insiders, etc.

64KThe bottom line is that miners have no business in PC gaming hardware to begin with much less all of the harm that they are bringing to our hobby.

Sorry, GPUs are General Processing Units now.

sepheronxTry undervolting it in wattman as well, may overall help.

Already on a 75mv undervolt. And I still get 110 LOL.

Wish I lived nearby you so I could help out. Always hard to guide over text.

I assume if you take it apart, you won't void your warranty? If not, then replacing the thermalpades with something like thermalright stuff, and some Noctua thermal paste should help greatly.

64KExcept the unfortunate gamers that go for these used mining cards for an upgrade with no warranty and I have seen too many posts about problems with used cards that have been sold by miners.

The bottom line is that miners have no business in PC gaming hardware to begin with much less all of the harm that they are bringing to our hobby.

What if crypto doesn't crash for years? How will all of these gamers that need an upgrade going to be able to get a card new or used?

This is not only going to affect PC gaming today but it will affect PC gaming in the future as well because most gamers simply can't afford the ridiculously priced GPUs from scalpers and may just leave PC gaming which will have a domino effect with Developers neglecting PC game versions because there will be less money in it for them.

The same could be said of any used card, mining or otherwise. You aren't making an argument against mined on cards, you are making an argument against used in general. There are far more posts of people having issues with non-mined on cards than mined on cards. Mind you, it's pretty easy to mitigate problems in either case by simply testing a card when you receive it and giving it a quick look over. The vast majority of GPU returns happen within the first two months. After that period, that probability of issues drastically drops. If you purchase used (including mined on cards) and properly test, the statistical chance of you running into an issue is the same between the two. Both mining cards and used cards can be treated poorly, although from my experience mining cards arrive in better shape typically than gaming cards. Some used gaming cards are in pretty terrible condition.

In addition, it is possible to get a used card (including a mined on one) with a warranty. ASUS, MSI, and EVGA all offer transferable warranty. Again, it's really the same consideration you'd have to make if you are buying used anyways.

The bottom line is that miners have no business in PC gaming hardware to begin with much less all of the harm that they are bringing to our hobby

What if crypto doesn't crash for years? How will all of these gamers that need an upgrade going to be able to get a card new or used?"

I'd like to point out that video cards are also used in medical imaging devices (among other industries). I have personally sold GTX 780 Tis to a hospital. The fact of the matter is, if crypto on GPUs is long term (and I'm not sure that it is) it is up to AMD and Nvidia to address that demand. You can't really fault them in the case of Covid-19 as the demand spike was very sudden and large but they would have to be complete fools to not increase production to meet the demand from a market that is increasing in size.

"This is not only going to affect PC gaming today but it will affect PC gaming in the future as well because most gamers simply can't afford the ridiculously priced GPUs from scalpers and may just leave PC gaming which will have a domino effect with Developers neglecting PC game versions because there will be less money in it for them."

This is true and ultimately it's a problem AMD, Nvidia, and potentially Intel have to face. Again though they would have to be crazy to simply let customers walk away.

sepheronxWish I lived nearby you so I could help out. Always hard to guide over text.

I assume if you take it apart, you won't void your warranty? If not, then replacing the thermalpades with something like thermalright stuff, and some Noctua thermal paste should help greatly.

Yeah, I don't have a warranty so pulling the cooler off is no big deal. I am going to do the backplate thermal pads and see what happens. If have to pull the heatsink, a block is going back on it. A block is going on it eventually. I just don't want to do it right now because reasons.