WatchThe80sI wonder if it would have helped if they give the 285K 16 P-core and 8 E-core, than what it came out with.

16P would be probably to expensive to manufacture, but they could have made it with 12P and 8E. Also they could do something like F version without NPU.
On the other hand it seams Panther Lake will be mobile only so they need some room for Arrow Lake Refresh for the next year.

DavenThank you for the sources! I forgot about that rearview comment. Even though the conventional wisdom around here is that Pat is doing a good job at Intel, I would argue the opposite. Pat is the worst Intel CEO and most likely the last. That’s saying a lot given the crap his predecessors threw out daily.

Called it on Pat the moment he signed for the job. He's old boys, old world, and smells like old socks.

This is not the kind of leadership that will enact real change. They're mostly good at finding ways to keep sailing as they used to. The sail's a heavily torn rag at this point, but it will catch all the wind it can for its last voyage... Or put differently, candles flicker wildly before going out.

And in the meantime, under Pat's leadership, Core overcooked into degradation territory, there is no performance leadership, and there is loss of market share, while they're still riding their core architecture. Their latest chiplet approach looks like a messy hack job with a numerous different processes for individual chiplets. Its a complete mess, you can just see the grasping at straws happen in front of you.

WatchThe80sI wonder if it would have helped if they give the 285K 16 P-core and 8 E-core, than what it came out with.

The P cores are just way too big for Intel to push past 8. The last time they went past 8 on the desktop was the 10900k, which was 10C. They quickly dropped back to 8C and then went with E cores shortly after.

You sure they can´t go 12x p-core only?

Merluzthe real shocking news is that in US these cpu went sold out...

Mostly OEMs I bet...

What @Crackong and @dj-electric wrote make sense, but it’s still strange. Right now a 14600k and a decent z790 board cost the same, if not less, than a 7800x3d. And if for some die-hard gamers the best gaming CPU (7800x3d at the moment) is a must, the 14600k at current prices is clearly a steal compared to 5800x3d.

dj-electricTo be fair, Mindfactory is where you go when you need AMD products. It has a tight cooperation with AMD on both marketing in-site and on deals and coupons for AMD and AMD related products.
For some years now Mindfactory has basically served as AMD's statistics hat trick when it comes to "sales in Europe".

All that said, im still not surprised.

You're desperately reaching. You mean the same retailer that was dogpiling on crap Zen 5 sales just a couple of months ago and before that, for the past 2+ years declaring Nvidia outselling AMD's GPUs month after month is actually in cahoots as a marketer for AMD? Really???

www.techpowerup.com/325533/mindfactory-only-sold-a-few-dozen-amd-ryzen-7-9700x-and-ryzen-5-9600x

Also a hardware retailer advertising the hardware they're selling and cooperating on hardware launches is a "statistics hat trick"? Pass me whatever blue-coloured copium you're on. It may come as a shock to you -- but all hardware retailers in every country coordinate their launch sales with releases from hardware companies. Shocking, I know...

docnorthWhat @Crackong and @dj-electric wrote make sense, but it’s still strange. Right now a 14600k and a decent z790 board cost the same, if not less, than a 7800x3d. And if for some die-hard gamers the best gaming CPU (7800x3d at the moment) is a must, the 14600k at current prices is clearly a steal compared to 5800x3d.

It depends what you need. If you want to buy frequently the latest hardware, then 14600k is not latest, if you think about good value for the money then it's better to buy 7700 and in 2-3 years you can replace CPU keeping the motherboard.

docnorthWhat @Crackong and @dj-electric wrote make sense, but it’s still strange. Right now a 14600k and a decent z790 board cost the same, if not less, than a 7800x3d. And if for some die-hard gamers the best gaming CPU (7800x3d at the moment) is a must, the 14600k at current prices is clearly a steal compared to 5800x3d.

this is so true.
the balance of cost and performance is often forgotten when we focus the talks of gaming. the price of the 7800x3d has fallen to inflation in those months.

Am*You're desperately reaching. You mean the same retailer that was dogpiling on crap Zen 5 sales just a couple of months ago and before that, for the past 2+ years declaring Nvidia outselling AMD's GPUs month after month is actually in cahoots as a marketer for AMD? Really???

Why not? Same brand, yet apples and oranges. I can imagine more than a few people around that currently prefers AMD CPU's and Nvidia GPU's. Yeah, that exact combination.

Am*Shocking, I know...

Equally shocking is that mindfactory STILL have zero retail Arrow Lake listed. Not even out of stock. Only tray. I don't know why, all I know is that it's not normal.

You KNOW that will affect sales.

That alone is a reason not to buy.

My impression is that "Mind Factory" is of a place that hardware enthusiasts buy their hardware for DIY purpose. If that is the case, DIY market is very small, and even if they don't sell at all, it does not mean that Intel is not moving more CPUs via OEMs or PC makers like Dell and Lenovo. We should get a better idea if Intel's Arrow and Lunar Lake sale by the next quarterly earnings.

fun fact:
they don´t sell asus products - with a vengeance

SL2Why not? Same brand, yet apples and oranges. I can imagine more than a few people around that currently prefers AMD CPU's and Nvidia GPU's. Yeah, that exact combination.

Then you've completely dismantled your own argument. People building their PCs in Europe can buy whatever hardware they want. If people wanted the 285K so badly and Mindfactory didn't stock it, they could've gone elsewhere and bought it and Intel would've been tripping over themselves to announce what a success it is, but even massive US retailers who easily sell 20x the number of computer parts that any EU retailer does (like Newegg) admitted they had almost no stock -- not because it sold well, but because they had almost none to sell to begin with. Caseking (another German retailer) claimed they only received about 5 units in stock of the 285K for sale to begin with and has them on pre-order only for almost another week.

SL2Equally shocking is that mindfactory STILL have zero retail Arrow Lake listed. Not even out of stock. Only tray. I don't know why, all I know is that it's not normal.

Again, you can blame nobody except Intel for that. Most likely Intel doesn't feel confident in their sales of this CPU to the DIY market (especially after the reviews they got). 285K has been only been a paper launch with just pre-orders since launch day here at both Scan and Overclockers UK from what I can see -- some of the biggest hardware sellers here in the UK, and I haven't seen it be listed as in stock even once. Only CPUs they have physical stock of are 265K and below. And it's been a whole week since launch. Both are official Intel partners and order/deal directly with the company, not via any distributors -- so why not put the blame on where it belongs with Intel instead of spinning up nonsensical conspiracy theories, since Intel clearly have no confidence in releasing their flagship CPU to the public?

I had a similar experience when the Arc A310 was announced and wanted to grab one. Not a single retailer I called here in the UK had heard of it, been briefed on it by Intel or stocked it for like 6 months, whilst Chinese OEMs and system builders had tens of thousands of them. Go figure.

Am*Then you've completely dismantled your own argument.

May be you should look up what I replied to, specifically. I'm not blaming anyone, just poining out that the same people can prefer AMD CPU's but not AMD GPU's.

Am*Again, you can blame nobody except Intel for that.

I'm not blaming anyone here.

Get your facts straight before posting and stop jumping to conclusions, perhaps with a tad less attitude lol

Merluzthe real shocking news is that in US these cpu went sold out...

I dont expect this to be Intels most successful launch, but they will still sell, there is many people who dont upgrade often and first time buyers, so if e.g. you coming from something like Haswell it will still be a big jump of an upgrade.

WatchThe80sI wonder if it would have helped if they give the 285K 16 P-core and 8 E-core, than what it came out with.

Would you like double the price and an extra 100-150W TDP?

chrcolukWould you like double the price and an extra 100-150W TDP?

Of course not, just playing with the, why not make it different? Intel could say it, we have the performance but you need a big watercooler to cool it.
That aside, why they don't make a low end cpu with only E-cores, it's cheaper, uses less power why not make a 8 or 12 E-coresonly cpu? Or they just don't even want to hear about E-cores anymore?

WatchThe80sOf course not, just playing with the, why not make it different? Intel could say it, we have the performance but you need a big watercooler to cool it.
That aside, why they don't make a low end cpu with only E-cores, it's cheaper, uses less power why not make a 8 or 12 E-coresonly cpu? Or they just don't even want to hear about E-cores anymore?

The N100 is e-core only. Although its not a removable socket CPU. In my opinion for where it is in the market, its a good chip, its popular for enthusiast firewall builds.

SL2May be you should look up what I replied to, specifically. I'm not blaming anyone, just poining out that the same people can prefer AMD CPU's but not AMD GPU's.

I'm not blaming anyone here.

Get your facts straight before posting and stop jumping to conclusions, perhaps with a tad less attitude lol

I saw what you replied to -- no need to try and deflect. What GPUs people prefer to pair their CPUs with is irrelevant to what I said. If the lack of stock for the 285K had a high chance of affecting sales, nobody would be more incentivised to fix the situation than Intel. As it happens, they're too busy supplying it to OEMs/system builders over retail versions because that's obviously where they expect the demand to come from (that's why MindFactory have tray/OEM CPUs for sale and not boxed/retail ones). And it makes sense -- since easier to cool and less power hungry CPUs would be at the top of the list of requirements for system builders but not so much for DIY builders/enthusiasts.

What I find funny is whenever Intel and Nvidia dominate the sales charts, it's business as usual -- but as soon as AMD are on top, it becomes an "AMD biased retailer"...just stop with the nonsense conspiracy theories already, it's beyond embarrassing at this point. People will buy whatever hardware they want and the sales will reflect that.

Not surprised. After the Raptor fiasco and disappointing performance, I don't understand who would want these?

chrcolukI dont expect this to be Intels most successful launch, but they will still sell, there is many people who dont upgrade often and first time buyers, so if e.g. you coming from something like Haswell it will still be a big jump of an upgrade.

this is true, I still have an old htpc with a broadwell 5775C and the idea is to updgrade later this year or the next one, but if there are 14th gen intel gpu still in stock, I doubt that the new one will enter my radar. also, considering the only heavy task of this htpc is gaming, the x3d cpus are the favourites.

my understating is that many people, in the pc hardware market, buy stuff without thinking too much, only because "it's new".

Am*I saw what you replied to

Lol nope. Such a weak post.

You're twisting everything people post here, no need to just counter attack, just admit it.

You said:

Am*You're desperately reaching. You mean the same retailer that was dogpiling on crap Zen 5 sales just a couple of months ago and before that, for the past 2+ years declaring Nvidia outselling AMD's GPUs month after month is actually in cahoots as a marketer for AMD? Really???[/URL]

I was pointing out that AMD CPU and GPU market doesn't have the same leverage and mind share, so there's no point in just assuming that they're treated the same way:

SL2Same brand, yet apples and oranges. I can imagine more than a few people around that currently prefers AMD CPU's and Nvidia GPU's. Yeah, that exact combination.

Am*What I find funny is whenever Intel and Nvidia dominate the sales charts, it's business as usual -- but as soon as AMD are on top, it becomes an "AMD biased retailer"...just stop with the nonsense conspiracy theories already, it's beyond embarrassing at this point.

You're talking about someone else, I never even hinted at that. If my reflection that they don't have any Arrow retail makes you assume that I have a conspiracy theory, despite me saying that I don't know why, well.. that's on you. All I wanted to say is that it will affect sales.

Maybe you should try to keep track of who said what. Embarrasing is the word.

You're the only one twisting words and backpedalling now. The first post you replied to was quoting me asking how Mind Factory can be called an AMD biased source when a lot of the time, it posts results that literally work against AMD and the first thing you said was "Why not?":

Now suddenly you're gaslighting and backpedalling by claiming you never said it:

SL2You're talking about someone else, I never even hinted at that.

You should take your own advice and "just admit it":

SL2Such a weak post.

You're twisting everything people post here, no need to just counter attack, just admit it.

And you should at least learn how to spell the word before using it -- 'embarrassing' is the word, not:

SL2Embarrasing is the word.

SL2Lol nope.

Foot, meet mouth.