Wednesday, August 27th 2008
Phenom FX in the Works, AMD to take Another shot at...Kentsfield
The transition of the K10 architecture by AMD to the 45nm silicon fabrication process is stirring up interesting revelations these days. First, it was about surprisingly low power consumption of the quad-core Phenom parts, and then about the overclocking headroom those 45nm parts provided, at least the engineering samples did so far. And now, news coming in that AMD could be resurrecting the "FX" series of extreme performance products. Over the past three or so years, the performance trail AMD products had over Intel's made it close to impossible for AMD to sell parts that provide performance tuning advantages such as unlocked FSB multiplier settings for a premium, like it did back when K8 reigned the performance segment. "Black Edition" chips made up for that deficit by providing consumers overclocking advantages while not charging a significant premium and at the same time, safeguarding the "FX" title, not letting it dilute.
Come AMD Deneb core and lot seems to be on offer. To begin with, unlike the Windsor core that had a maximum FSB multiplier of 16.0x, initial reports suggest the Deneb to sport a maximum 25.0x multiplier, 200 MHz x 25 = 5.00 GHz, with the FSB left to play with. Considering at 2.30 GHz the Deneb draws in 57.3 W (according to findings), it should still leave enough room for AMD to sell premium products clocked at high frequencies.
From Reviewage's findings, there seem to be two Phenom FX processors in the making. The numbering seems to take off where it last left at the Athlon64 FX 74. The two chips, Phenom FX 80 and Phenom FX 82 could be clocked at 4.00 GHz and 4.40 GHz respectively (stock speeds). An interesting statement is that at 4.00 GHz, the Phenom FX 80 should outperform an Intel Kentsfield core clocked at 5.00 GHz, implies it has to be faster than the Kentsfield on a clock-to-clock basis. This opens up an interesting debate on how these parts compare to the succeeding Yorkfield chips. This should also open gates for several models to enter the market at various clock speeds.
Source:
Reviewage
Come AMD Deneb core and lot seems to be on offer. To begin with, unlike the Windsor core that had a maximum FSB multiplier of 16.0x, initial reports suggest the Deneb to sport a maximum 25.0x multiplier, 200 MHz x 25 = 5.00 GHz, with the FSB left to play with. Considering at 2.30 GHz the Deneb draws in 57.3 W (according to findings), it should still leave enough room for AMD to sell premium products clocked at high frequencies.
294 Comments on Phenom FX in the Works, AMD to take Another shot at...Kentsfield
and that's why I asked btarunr to state this in the first post , as this thread is 11 pages so far and this post will be buried in two days .
www.tomshardware.com/news/phenom-amd-4ghz,6249.html
I already posted that shot saying no one really knows what is what (voltage and for some reason the stepping is not shown) please read from the start and you will see that this shot is from the site below. look at the STEPPING (right now its over c1/2) deneb processor is based on C0 stepping . It is assumed that C0/? stepping will replace present B3 stepping , which are based on 65 nm processors phenom.
this is the site that posted that picture, good try though :p
www.expreview.com/news/hard/2008-08-01/1217578981d9645.html
this url shows the OEM/standard (not FX) cpu the deneb will most likely come as 3+ghz and even they will overclock to over 4ghz which we all know (@ 4ghz not even you will be disappointed matey)
www.expreview.com/news/hard/2008-07-12/1215832034d9447.html
www.xtremesystems.org/Forums/showthread.php?t=199643
and this is what I called over hyping the deneb , and this hurts AMD more than benefiting them .
I'm an AMD fan , and I wish they regain the performance crown as much as the next guy , but
spreading fake ... umm , spreading not so reliable news from an unknown and dishonest site is not a good thing for AMD , as I said before .
anyway , I really want to believe that it is true , but not through reviewage .
btw, thanks X1REME for the original review site , I took the screen shot from the AMD forum thread I posted its link in the previous post .
This is fake.
Unless Phenom FX architecture is 100% different from Phenom Deneb and Phenom Agena. Can AMD comes up with a new architecture this fast?
Phenom FX over 4GHz and this is stock speed at extreme low voltage. This is like 2-3 years in the future.
Everyone know that Intel Core 2 Duo can clock really high at low voltage, but why Intel didn't clock it higher? If I remember right, the researchers intended to make a CPU that can run at least 10 years without problems.
So, a Phenom FX 45nm over 4GHz at extreme low voltage, suprassed all current techs, and this can last lat least 10 years without problems. I think this is really hard to believe.
currently i have an Intel set-up with ATi gpu but will go all amd very soon (spider platform), just like before the c2d, why? because the i7 will cost you an arm and a leg to adopt and personally i think people like not so informed should be aware that there is going to be an alternative from AMD which will hopefully cost half the price and be up to par performance.
You have to understand AMD is not as rich as Intel and fan boys like you (No offence) actually advertise for it from forums etc. (just like the gpu)
Also dont forget that AMD constantly lives with the fear that it is out-resourced and out-spent compared to Intel. If it reveals too much about its future strategy and Intel likes that strategy there is a theoretical chance that Intel could take this idea and deliver a product way before AMD. This was probably a key reason for the company to switch its entire communications strategy and remains completely quiet (e.g GPU) about a new product until it exactly knows its specs/place and capabilities, and is convinced that Nvidia/Intel can’t beat it to market anymore.
as you can see Intel is ahead of AMD (6 to 12 Months) and the only way to catch up was to miss a few on the road map (I have already listed and showed the road map in the previous post)
sorry mate but having a CPU in this age and day for 10 years is ridiculess, not saying AMD will go down that path (Nvidia Anyone)
Many retailers have life-time warranty for their products, but that not what they wanted to tell customers, they wanted to tell them that "our products can work perfectly fine in years that we confident enough to give you a life-time warranty".
AMD miss few on the road map?
AMD Athlon 90nm -> Brisbane 65nm -> Phenom.
The performance inreassed through new generation is not big. They pushed out Phenom in hurry to have a quad-core. Why don't they just skip Brisbane and go straight to Phenom/Kuma? What the hell were they doing? And now, you're telling me AMD gonna have a Phenom FX clock at 4GHz at extreme low voltage?
I can't see your points. If they say it can be Overclock to 4GHz, I can believe this, but a Phenom default speed at 4GHz will need a hardproof.
I don't want to argure with you over something not released, i'm telling you my points, it depends on you and the way you understand it.
Either way, like i said who cares?
Unless it really looks like that...
www.madshrimps.be/vbulletin/f22/amd-phenom-overclocked-4ghz-ln2-57206/
www.maximumpc.com/article/news/overclockers_break_4ghz_barrier_amd_processors
www.fudzilla.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=9082&Itemid=1
pipe dreams are not real
The road map in 2009 is going to be drastically different to the one shown (8-12 cores, bulldozer, fusion etc will come earlier or overly changed).
If the OEM DENEB Is 3.2/3.4 and Even 3.6, do you think the Deneb FX will be anything but faster. (Just look at the history of AMD FX) :toast:
And when did I say AMD couldn't use HT? I said the current HT is already faster than what we need. We will see no benefits from increasing it's speed. Only multi-socketed servers will see the benefits.
And the AMD designers did have a great design with K8, AT THE TIME. This is the point you are missing. K10/10.5 are just updates to K8. the architecture itself is aging. AMD needs either a completely new architecture to compete with Intel, or at least some major, MAJOR revisions to K10. The die shrink is not major enough.
You guys can continue to believe this news item, if you wish, but I think you are just setting yourselves up for another disappointment. yes, AMD is making some good tweaks and changes, but you are all failing to realize that Intel is as well. Until AMD releases a new arch, they are gonna stay behind Intel. The Core 2 arch is flat out more efficient than K8/10/10.5.
Furthermore, I seriously doubt we'll even see 3.6GHz deneb released. And if they do, Intel will just answer back with their own high-clocked parts. Besides, didn't AMD hint to 3GHz Phenoms before they even released? We see how that turned out, don't we?
We all know Intel is sandbagging the clock speeds anyway, otherwise we wouldn't be seeing such high overclocks. My quad does 4Ghz on less than 1.4V as it is, let alone the newer 45nm steppings.
AMD is just not gonna win this round. I still hold my hopes up for the next arch tho.
Releasing more cores in a single package can and will help, but Intel can do that as well, so that point is moot too.
If AMD is sticking with the K10 arch, I fear their only hope is that Intel hits a wall with their Core 2 arch, like they did with P4.
Keep in mind, I'm speaking of this purely from a performance perspective. I've not brought price into this, which is where AMD can make up the difference. (which they finally have with the current round of Phenom price cuts)
oh and don't forget AMD can pack more transistors than Intel with newer tech, so imagine what AMD is gonna do with the 45nm shrink (lots more transistors/cache)
Only hope AMD have if that the NEXT gen CPU from intel doesn't do as good as everyone says it will.
Food for thought.
AMD AM2 X2 6400 3.2GHz 65nm
AMD AM3 X2 6400 1.9GHz 45nm
Can anyone see it?
Intel has already hit a wall as they have fully used the cache and have over spilled to L3 cache (copied amd again). have already used the integrated memory controller (copied amd again). so what next (a wall as most say, especially AMD)