DenverYou're forgetting that consoles are unique systems without the huge range of combinations of components that PCs have, consoles achieve a much higher level of optimization, especially in terms of memory consumption.

QUANTUMPHYSICSI personally can't buy anything less than the highest end model simply because I already know what to expect. The lower models will PALE in comparison and Nvidia's highest end model will blow away all of the competition until the Ti model shows up.

Then the 5000 series will rear its head, wash, rinse, repeat...

I'm comfortable with my Strix ROG 4090, but I am extremely disappointed I had to buy this instead of an EVGA model. I hope EVGA eventually gets back into GPU cards.

pavleDon't get all too excited, just yesterday I saw Daniel Owen's video about RTX 3070 Ti 8GB and it can't even play Resident evil 4 Remake (with high textures) because of "only" 8GB of VRAM, core is plenty powerful enough. Maybe nvidia will store their users' textures in a cloud. :wtf:

modmaxThe official PS5 technical specifications are as follows:
CPU: 8x Zen 2 Cores at 3.5GHz.
GPU: 10.28 TFLOPs, 36 CUs at 2.23GHz (variable frequency)
GPU Architecture: Custom RDNA 2.
Memory: 16GB GDDR6/256-bit.
Memory bandwidth: 448GB/s.
GPU: 10.28 TFLOPs which is half of a 3070 ti
don't buy any games as the 3070ti video card alone costs almost twice as much as a ps5...

Fry178Love how many ppl think if the card has more vram, the game will automatically use more and/or max.
sure there are exceptions, but those are usually less than a dozen, and when you shell out +100$/E for a game, those should have the funds for new hw,
as nothing but the top one or 2 cards will actually have enough vroom to drive the game at 4k with ultra settings.

while im fine with the HP the card has, i want to keep it longer than just a year or 2, so i probably go with a 4070.

MS FS vram use

@xxxsonic1971
why?
you actually believe the only games played are AAA FPS @4K and 240 Hz on rigs with a +5k price tag?

if it gets a decent price (doubt it), many ppl i know, would be getting it as a nice upgrade over their 1060 3/6gb.

rvalenciaPS5 / XSX consoles have OS memory reserve, hence expect 13.5 GB to be available for games. 10 GB to 12 GB VRAM is the minimum.

antuk1510GB VRAM at max as games still need sound, logic data and other files.

Fry178@rvalencia
yeah, everyone plays in 4k, everyone plays horrible console ports not optimized for pc, so we really need at least 12gb on a 4030 or higher..
what utter rubbish..

rvalencia

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1298299408363278337

PS5's OS reserve is 2 GB, hence 14 GB is allocated for PS5 games.


Killzone Shadow Fall's memory usage for 1080p rendering resolution. PS4 allows 5.0 GB for the game.

For 4K, scale everything in GPU's memory by 4X and it will land on 12288 MB or 12 GB. The remaining 2GB is enough for the CPU. Other PS5 games may use 11 GB GPU and 3 GB CPU.

Consoles don't have a gaming PC double data memory storage issue.

Both 8 GB and 10 GB VRAM is DOA.

antuk15Digital Foundry claimed higher OS reserve for PS5 and they are more reliable than this guy on Twitter.

And KZ:SF has zero influence on how next gen games will be used.

Stick to Gamespot System Wars.

Fry178@rvalencia
your clearly missing the point: not every game is from 2023. not every game is a high fps shooter, not every game has high res textures, not every person on the planet has the same requirements for hw/games.
are we now all going to drive +500HP cars just because most sportscars now do? right..

fact: +50% of the planets non-console gamers are on res lower than 2/4k, so dont project what you want, to others.

rvalencia

You are wrong i.e. 8 GB VRAM is not enough.

How much PS5 RAM is reserved for OS?
The PS5 has two pools of RAM. The main pool of RAM is 16 GB GDDR6 SDRAM, a RAM designed with high bandwidth rates for maximum gaming performance. The other pool of RAM is 512 MB DDR4 SDRAM Memory manufactured by SK Hynix. This RAM is mainly used by the OS for background tasks.

TLOU P1 for PS5 indicates small CPU RAM usage and big GPU RAM usage.

You are wrong.

I'm not a current member of Gamespot's System Wars forum. Again, You are wrong.


You missed the point on fine wine vs sour milk.

antuk15Imagine being so desperate to prove a point you resort to sing a shitty port :laugh:

I would also suggest you stop using out of date videos and test data as the game has actually seen some good improvements with the latest patch alone reducing VRAM consumption by ~1GB.

bearClaw5Which makes console comparisons irrelevant.

rvalencia
You can't handle the truth when 8 GB VRAM is below PS5's and XSX's VRAM allocation.

Fact: Windows 10's OS and non-gaming apps still consume dedicated GPU's VRAM. Look in the mirror.

For desktop PCs, Windows 10/11 OS-dedicated VRAM usage can be reduced by enabling IGP and letting the OS manage the dedicated GPU as a slave GPU co-processor like in the laptop's IGP-dGPU hybrids.

All AMD's desktop Zen 4 (RDNA 2-based IGP) and most Intel Alder Lake / Rocket Lake SKUs are APUs with IGP capability. PC IGP can handle the desktop graphics usage while the dedicated GPU can be fully allocated to the game.

AMD's desktop Zen 4's RDNA 2-based IGP with 128-bit DDR5-6000 has up to 96 GB/s memory bandwidth that is attached to IGP's frame buffer pointer which is considerably higher than PCIe 4.0 16 lane's 32 GB/s limitations. The same benefit for most Intel Alder Lake / Rocket Lake SKUs with IGP.

Your Intel Core i5 12400F Alder Lake doesn't have IGP capability, hence you can't allocate desktop graphics usage to the IGP while conserving RTX 2070S 8GB VRAM for games. PC IGP is not useless for conserving GPU's VRAM.

Game consoles don't have PC's spare IGP that can conserve GPU's VRAM usage.



RTX 3080 10 GB = 45 fps average
RTX 3080 12 GB = 55 fps average
10 GB VRAM influenced the frame rate difference.

RTX 3070 Ti 8 GB / 3070 8GB is slower than RTX 3060 12 GB.
RTX 3070 Ti 8 GB =17 fps average
RTX 3070 8 GB = 17 fps average
RTX 3060 12 GB = 27 fps average

RTX 2080 Ti 11 GB has a 41 fps average. When compared to RTX 3070 / RTX 3070 Ti, the RTX 2080 Ti was able to maintain good performance with 11 GB VRAM.

Without VRAM issues, RTX 3070 and RTX 2080 Ti have similar results i.e. 67 fps with 1440p ultra quality without raytracing.






The console comparison is relevant when PC's inefficiencies are known. Read www.techpowerup.com/306713/directx-12-api-new-feature-set-introduces-gpu-upload-heaps-enables-simultaneous-access-to-vram-for-cpu-and-gpu

Microsoft has implemented two new features into its DirectX 12 API - GPU Upload Heaps and Non-Normalized sampling have been added via the latest Agility SDK 1.710.0 preview, and the former looks to be the more intriguing of the pair. The SDK preview is only accessible to developers at the present time, since its official introduction on Friday 31 March. Support has also been initiated via the latest graphics drivers issued by NVIDIA, Intel, and AMD. The Microsoft team has this to say about the preview version of GPU upload heaps feature in DirectX 12: "Historically a GPU's VRAM was inaccessible to the CPU, forcing programs to have to copy large amounts of data to the GPU via the PCI bus. Most modern GPUs have introduced VRAM resizable base address register (BAR) enabling Windows to manage the GPU VRAM in WDDM 2.0 or later."

A shared pool of memory between the CPU and GPU will eliminate the need to keep duplicates of the game scenario data in both system memory and graphics card VRAM, therefore resulting in a reduced data stream between the two locations. Modern graphics cards have tended to feature very fast on-board memory standards (GDDR6) in contrast to main system memory (DDR5 at best). In theory the CPU could benefit greatly from exclusive access to a pool of ultra quick VRAM, perhaps giving an early preview of a time when DDR6 becomes the daily standard in main system memory.


Better late than never.



CPU + GPU unified memory architecture is nothing new, just hasn't been done for consumer-level Windows software but you can get unified memory with NVIDIA CUDA or AMD HIP in Linux right now.

antuk15You're definitely the same guy from System Wars as you post the same long dibble posts that he does in the same style.

But once again, stop posting charts from out of date sources.

Fry178@rvalencia
and you keep ignoring the facts that most ppl on this planet do NOT own a nextgen console (35M out of 7 billion ppl),
nor is the majority playing above FHD, heck, more desktops run 720p than 2k,nor is everyone playing the same game.
so for more than 50% of gamers on this planet, its irrelevant to have more than 10gb.

ignoring the fact the ppl dont magically have more funds to buy something with more vram,
so those ppl shouldnt buy anything (lets say the gpu broke), and just look at a black screen? lol

(note on the side: i do not consume either.)

rvalenciaFor the money, AMD GPUs has VRAM advantage. RTX 4060 Ti 8 GB is inferior to RTX 3060 12 GB or RX 6700 XT 12 GB.