Friday, July 8th 2011
Foundry Delays to Push Back NVIDIA Kepler Launch to 2012
It looks like foundry issues are back to slow down the launch of NVIDIA's next generation high-end GPU, codenamed Kepler. The delay may push Kepler's launch to 2012, it was expected to launch by late 2011. The 28 nanometer silicon fabrication process at TSMC, a principal foundry partner of NVIDIA, is producing unsatisfactory yields. Add to that, Kepler's performance is lower than expected.
TSMC's 28 nm process at Fab 15 facility has already seen delays, which have even shaped AMD's designs in a big way. AMD had originally planned to design high-end VLIW4 chips on the 32 nm process at TSMC, but later decided to wait for the 28 nm process, leading to plans of 32 nm GPUs being scrapped by both GPU designers. TSMC was supposed to be in a position take orders of high-end 28 nm GPUs by Q4 2011, and was set to start pilot production for its 20nm process technology in the third quarter of 2012.
TSMC's major client apart from GPU vendors, that relies on new bulk manufacturing process, Qualcomm, hasn't yet adjusted its 28nm process schedule and is set to launch three new products, 8960. 8270 and 8260A using dual-core Krait architecture in the fourth quarter of 2011.
AMD's first 28 nm GPUs, under the "Southern Islands" family are on course for 1H 2012. Around the same time, AMD will also release APUs based on the 28 nm process, codenamed "Krishna" and "Wichita", that replace Ontraio and Zacate.
Source:
DigiTimes
TSMC's 28 nm process at Fab 15 facility has already seen delays, which have even shaped AMD's designs in a big way. AMD had originally planned to design high-end VLIW4 chips on the 32 nm process at TSMC, but later decided to wait for the 28 nm process, leading to plans of 32 nm GPUs being scrapped by both GPU designers. TSMC was supposed to be in a position take orders of high-end 28 nm GPUs by Q4 2011, and was set to start pilot production for its 20nm process technology in the third quarter of 2012.
TSMC's major client apart from GPU vendors, that relies on new bulk manufacturing process, Qualcomm, hasn't yet adjusted its 28nm process schedule and is set to launch three new products, 8960. 8270 and 8260A using dual-core Krait architecture in the fourth quarter of 2011.
AMD's first 28 nm GPUs, under the "Southern Islands" family are on course for 1H 2012. Around the same time, AMD will also release APUs based on the 28 nm process, codenamed "Krishna" and "Wichita", that replace Ontraio and Zacate.
76 Comments on Foundry Delays to Push Back NVIDIA Kepler Launch to 2012
I hope that you are not suggesting that there's any kind of preference for Nvidia amongst Steam users, and that for non Steam users AMD is prefered. That would be ridiculous.
For me the survey is enough proof, but sure is not the only one:
www.jonpeddie.com/publications/add-in-board-report/
That Nvidia sells more cards is a fact. That Nvidia tends to dominate the higher end segments, while AMD sells more on the lower end segments (and integrated), is also suggested by nearly every analist. Since we are talking about Kepler, hence high-end, I could care less how many cards are sold in the low end segments (mostly for HTPC) and even taking all segments into account Nvidia sells 60% of cards. Pretending that reality is different, because it does not relate to your graphics card election is wrong. Don't try to find some obscure reasons for explaining what is cristal clear by just looking at facts...
For example, If I go to my account in Steam I think it shows that I have a GTX280, thats only because I havent bothered logging on to steam for about 2 years..... nothing more sinister than that, so I can confirm that your conclusion that I might be insinuating that steam is biased in favour of NVidia is unfounded...... clearer?
Edit: noone.... well I am not and have not suggested that anyone sells more cards than NVidia, I am simply pointing out that in my opinion Steam does not reflect all users and there is not "firm" evidence, thats not to say I think your wrong, meerly that there may be more steadfast ways of prooving your point.
And if there is any preference, that would be for AMD, because Valve has been promoting Ati cards on their games for a very long time. I'm not saying there's any preference, only that if there had to be one, it makes more sense to be in favor of Ati. Of the 5 Ati cards that I've bought in the last years (for me or friends) 3 had a discount cupon for some Steam game, none of the Nvidia ones had any.
And just as a side note, in 2010 50% of games sales were digital, and most of them are Steam. So Steam represents PC gamers better than anything else.
Not sure where you get this from, we seem to speak the same language but you continue to make wrong assumptions.... So I will say it again, and hopefully it will be even clearer, I don't care who sells the most cards, i dont care if more or less Nvidia or AMD users register on steam, what I do care about however is to try and get the fullest and most accurate picture when stating facts, you have just said that 50% of games were digital in 2010, that means 50% were not, therefore just by the law of averages there are probably as many gamers out there that dont play on steam (actually probably a lot more), so as I said before, whilst steam is a good indicator, it clearly does not speak for all gamers..... nothing more sinister than that, so please, stop this assumptions rubbish, you don't have to turn everything into a green or red side or assume everyone else is.
Now regarding the discussion between you and me. You think that Steam survey is not a good source. And you are wrong and I'm telling you why. 50% of games sold digital, most from Steam. By the law of average, and contrary to your assumption, FAR more than 50% of gamers must use Steam, because it only takes 1 game bought through steam to be an Steam user. If this year you bought 100 games and only 1 was from Steam, guess what? You are an Steam user.
And honestly, I still fail to see the relevance of your posts. It doesn't matter if Steam users represent 50%, or 5% of gamers*. To think that a higher proportion of Nvidia users than AMD users get Steam is ridiculous and nonsensical.
* How many serious surveys do you know that were conducted with more than 5% of the targeted population? I'll save your time: NONE.
blog.shrinkingviolence.com/2010/02/TSMC-40nm-28nm-yield.html
judging by the prices on new egg and comparing to reviews by w1zz, you will get the cheapest GTX580 for 499$ and the cheapest HD6970 for 329$ (both reference),
price differences = 51%
performance differences (2560X1600) = 9%
Power Consumption differences (peak) = 22%
So... you should probably go with a pair of HD6870 for 350$ total. there are enough good graphics solutions below 499$
They don't need the 580 to compete with AMD's best, because they already have cards that do that. In every high-end and performance spot, Nvidia has cards that directly compete with AMD offerings and currently sell for $30 less or so.
GTX570 which is as fast as the HD6970 is selling for $30 less and consumes about the same. It consumes a little bit more when load is 100% and a little less than the 6970 when on idle or playing blu-ray.
Same for GTX560, way cheaper than 6950, similar performance, small consumption difference, smaller die-area... For every high-end/performance AMD card Nvidia has a good answer that is selling at better prices and nobody really cares for 20W more on power consumption. Yes and you can get a GTX570 for $309.
The fact of the matter is that as the Steam survey demostrates there's far more GTX580 than there is HD6970. There's very little speculation to be made. Whether you think the HD6970 is much better becomes irrelevant when facts demostrate that gamers do not think like you, as is demostrated by their wallets. Of course the GTX570 and GTX560 ti sells even more, much more.
OT, I struggle to understand why there would be so much enthusiasm to portray this late delivery issue like it's a football game deserving opposing views. A more mature look at this situation would see that we are all losers when new technology is delayed, no matter what manufacturer.
And if we judge them by the same standard as you are judging Steam, they are not facts more than Steam survey is anyway. They take into account shipments to the most important retailers and OEMs, but they do not take ALL of them into account either. These analist firms still provide statistics, like anyone else, based on a few retailers and then extrapolate according to expectations. Pretty close to relality, but not 100% sure.
Your last example makes no sense to me either. Arguably americans and europeans (if we even dare to generalise and take europeans as an homogeneous group) have very different tastes and cultures, but Steam does not represent any differentiated demographics compared to gamers in general*, and have members from all countries, ethnics and ages. If there is any distinction, please, tell me which one it is, because there lies the key to our disagreement.
* And ceratinly none regarding GPU election.
* It must suck to be you, living in this world and distrusting statistics to such a degree. No one takes them 100% seriously but... And what about meds, you must not take meds, they are tested on what 0.001% of human population? And food? The additives may be perjudicial to you! And let's not start talking about cosmetics or bath products. Ugh they must be banned on your home. Just trying to be sarcastic while making a point. :p
but it doesn't matter, I mean why speculate and you can get actual numbers?
www.bit-tech.net/news/hardware/2011/05/17/amd-graphics-cards-gain-market-share-from-n/1 while amd is on an upswing, Nvidia simply sells more cards. Stock prices further back that up as investors will flock to the better performer. Right now Nvidia is pulling in nearly double the market cap as AMD.
You couldn't be more retarded! Or ignorant.
I HATE my ATI it's one of the worst hardware mistakes I've ever made - and I've said so many times.