Wednesday, July 5th 2017
Update on the Intel X299 Platform "VRM Disaster"
We have some updated information on the X299 Platforms VRM issues from the same overclocker who initially discovered the issue, renowned overclocker der8auer. In an updated YouTube video, der8auer first updated his viewers with new information on his testing techniques, and basically concluded that all issues initially detected (throttling included) are still is an issue even after extensive testing, only in some instances it is difficult to detect not only if you are throttling, but even specifics such as what precisely is throttling. He goes into extensive detail, but a brief summary of the videos main points can be found below for your consumption.
His first major point is to watch power consumption. If it drops drastically, something is probably throttling. It does not mean (as some critics assumed) that the X299 system is not as energy hungry as reported: It is, it just has the nasty habit of not always reporting a throttle in clock rate. Furthermore, throttles can happen "back and forth" very quickly, and CPU-Z's refresh rate is not fast enough to always catch these. He recommends using HwInfo for frequency and VRM temp monitoring purposes.
Second, once you know there is a throttle occurring, there are two major types of throttling. The first is CPU throttling, which will occur via the multiplier backing off on the CPU cores slowly. The second is VRM throttling, which will manifest itself as a sharp drop in multiplier instantly (in his example, it went from 4.5 GHz to 1.2 GHz during a VRM throttle). These dramatic drops are related to VRMs and the poor build issues on various boards. Sadly, as of right now these issues still exist as a very complex minefield for potential buyers to navigate.
Third, he backed off his criticism of the 8-pin connectors saying they were probably okay for "moderate overclocking" (being that he is an extreme overclocker, that's probably enough for most of us "24/7ers"). The initial issue of overheating cables appeared to be more the cable design of the Superflower PSU than an actual limit of the 8-pin CPU connector. He still says it is better to get an 8+4 or 8+8 pin board if pursuing "serious overclocks", however.
Oh, and just to make it more confusing, in several UEFIs you can raise the throttle-temp point for the CPU (though most 24/7 overclockers probably shouldn't) and on some boards, even more throttling types are present (GIGABYTE seems to have some kind of "VCCIN throttle" that kicks in randomly if left on auto).
The end result of all this? I would say it's a very confusing and very strange product landscape, the likes of which is not likely to be friendly to overclockers, neither casual nor extreme. Pick your boards carefully dear user, perhaps this time even more so than most.
Source:
YouTube user "der8auer"
Second, once you know there is a throttle occurring, there are two major types of throttling. The first is CPU throttling, which will occur via the multiplier backing off on the CPU cores slowly. The second is VRM throttling, which will manifest itself as a sharp drop in multiplier instantly (in his example, it went from 4.5 GHz to 1.2 GHz during a VRM throttle). These dramatic drops are related to VRMs and the poor build issues on various boards. Sadly, as of right now these issues still exist as a very complex minefield for potential buyers to navigate.
Third, he backed off his criticism of the 8-pin connectors saying they were probably okay for "moderate overclocking" (being that he is an extreme overclocker, that's probably enough for most of us "24/7ers"). The initial issue of overheating cables appeared to be more the cable design of the Superflower PSU than an actual limit of the 8-pin CPU connector. He still says it is better to get an 8+4 or 8+8 pin board if pursuing "serious overclocks", however.
Oh, and just to make it more confusing, in several UEFIs you can raise the throttle-temp point for the CPU (though most 24/7 overclockers probably shouldn't) and on some boards, even more throttling types are present (GIGABYTE seems to have some kind of "VCCIN throttle" that kicks in randomly if left on auto).
The end result of all this? I would say it's a very confusing and very strange product landscape, the likes of which is not likely to be friendly to overclockers, neither casual nor extreme. Pick your boards carefully dear user, perhaps this time even more so than most.
43 Comments on Update on the Intel X299 Platform "VRM Disaster"
You know what they say, when you get older you forget the lessons you learned earlier in life and have to learn them all over again.
Despicable :pimp:Every Ryzen supports RAM for its rated speeds with 2667 MHz being the max in dual channel, unless we're talking about (Intel) XMP which even Intel doesn't guarantee for all its processors.
This so-called "VRM disaster" thing is just a sign of the times, whining about anything that will generate clicks.
As far as what can be done... vendors can make a better VRM sink and make a v2 or offer it up for a trade in/make us pay for it.
As it stands, these are good at stock in a case with some airflow. Overclocking seems to change things dramatically depending on the overclock.
But to summarise, to reach a CPU power draw of ~400w requires (at least on ASUS boards) a power limit increase and the disablement of (somewhat hidden) throttling mechanisms in BIOS, combined with running Prime95 with small (12k) FFTs. This results in VRM temperatures greater than 100°C unless assisted by direct active cooling. Basically the heatsinks are not good enough on X299 motherboards.
Of course, I'm looking at CPU power draw over the EPS connectors only, not full system, so anything like this being a serious issue would have been obvious right away, since I see real-time power draw over those wires. AFAIK, I'm the only person that does this... most reviewers report full system power for power consumption.
Isn't this the same dude that said we should push to 5 GHz and delid? (I know that it is, but... perspective).