Tuesday, January 18th 2022

PSA: GPU-Z shows PCI-Express x16 for Radeon RX 6500 XT / Navi 24. It really is x4

AMD announced the Radeon RX 6500 XT and RX 6400 at CES just a few days ago. These new entry-level cards debut the company's first 6 nm GPU, codenamed "Navi 24"—the smallest chip from the RDNA2 family. Navi 24 is barely the size of a motherboard chipset, roughly 100 mm² in die size. The chip only features a 64-bit wide GDDR6 memory interface, needing just two memory chips to achieve 4 GB of memory size. While AMD has been fairly quiet about it, people quickly found out that the Navi 24 GPU only uses a PCI-Express 4.0 x4 host interface. While the physical connector is x16, there is only enough signal traces for x4.

Even the most updated 2.43.0 public version of GPU-Z misreports the bus interface as PCIe x16 4.0 though, which will certainly lead to confusion in the reviewer community who trust GPU-Z to report the correct specs and speeds for their articles. Maybe that's the reason why AMD has decided to not send us a sample this time—a first in 15 years.

Update Jan 20th: GPU-Z 2.44.0 has been released, which properly reports the PCIe bus configuration of RX 6500 XT.


The underlying technical reason for this misreporting is that since a few generations AMD has designed their GPUs with a PCI-Express bridge inside, which makes things much more flexible and helps to separate the IP blocks. The bridge distributes the transferred data to the various subdevices, like the graphics core and HD Audio interface, as displayed in the screenshot above. Internally the GPU core operates at x16, despite the external PCIe 4.0 interface, only the link between the GPU's integrated bridge and the motherboard runs at x4. Since current GPU-Z does not know that the running GPU is Navi 24 it asks the graphics core for its link speed and width, which happily reports "PCIe x16 4.0" (instead of "PCIe x4 4.0"), which is of course correct from the perspective of the graphics core. The problem is that upstream a bottleneck exists that operates at only x4. For supported GPUs, GPU-Z is of course aware of such a topology and will check the upstream devices for bottlenecks, but this capability has to be added on a case-by-case basis. This situation also affects the reported PCIe speed, too. For example on older Intel systems, which don't support PCIe 4.0. Internally the GPU always operates at PCIe 4.0, even on PCIe 3.0 or older motherboards.

We plan to correct this with an update to GPU-Z shortly.
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57 Comments on PSA: GPU-Z shows PCI-Express x16 for Radeon RX 6500 XT / Navi 24. It really is x4

#51
Nihilus
windwhirlIt's clickbait when you're using numbers from one card to apply it to a completely different one that's not even on the same architecture.

Heck, I could even consider it false advertisement.

Oh, and if he's effectively passing off 6500 XT numbers as 5500 XT's, and if there's an effective NDA over the RX 6500 XT, that's also breach of NDA.
So glad we have white knights like you to look out for our ultra low IQ PC afficianadoes.

Title: Will PCI-E x4 cripple the 6500xt

First 5 minutes in and before showing benchmarks:
(Paraphrasing) "I will caveat by saying the 6500xt will be using the newer RDNA 2 architecture while the 5500xt using the older RDNA. While this may alleviate some of the bandwidth issues, I don't expect there be a big difference". (Hint-hint) And no one should as game cache alleviates vram bandwidth bottlenecks and not system memory bandwidth deficiencies.

Steve did not break any NDA. That's like saying you are breaking NDA by reducing clocks on a 2080 to get "simulated" 2070 Super performance. Your claims are so far fetched.

Anyone could have made this test in the last 2 years. Nobody did simply because no one would of imagined AMD doing something as cheap and scummy as this.
Posted on Reply
#52
KaitouX
Also, reply that Steve gave to someone in the comments:
There's really no good way to spin it, the 6500 XT shouldn't be a desktop product. There are even more inexcusable shortcoming that you don't mention here which we will outline in our review.
For me it really reads like the same issue is present in the 6500 XT.
Posted on Reply
#53
Sabotaged_Enigma
What truly hurts on Navi 24 is the lack of 4K encoding, otherwise it could be a good choice for entry-level cheap PC and primary productivity.
PCIe 4.0 x4, 4 GB 2250 MHz 64-bit GDDR6, 16 MB Infinity Cache, etc, these specs are all Navi 24 needs. I fully understand.
But why, why no support for 4K encoding???
Posted on Reply
#54
W1zzard
cellar doorIsn't this an AIB only launch - maybe they simply are expecting an AIB partner to send one to TPU. Did they specifically give you a "NO"?
The way AMD is doing these launches recently is that they collect the samples from AIBs, and then AMD distributes those cards.
For the previous two launches this made many AIBs unhappy because tons of their samples just disappeared or went to people they never heard of, while other AIB cards were sent to the high-profile reviewers.
Posted on Reply
#55
HD64G
W1zzardThe way AMD is doing these launches recently is that they collect the samples from AIBs, and then AMD distributes those cards.
For the previous two launches this made many AIBs unhappy because tons of their samples just disappeared or went to people they never heard of, while other AIB cards were sent to the high-profile reviewers.
So, maybe this change of them not sending review samples is for all media and not for TPU only? Have you contacted AMD about this?
Posted on Reply
#56
Snoop05
To get this thread back on topic, in fact same happens on Linux - i have manually set my bios to Gen3x8 for testing, and the usualy interfaces in /sys/class/drm/card0/device/ were reporting 16GT/s link speed (Gen4) and x16 width, but thankfully there are also files specific to AMDGPU (in that same path) that do actually show correct link speed and width.
Posted on Reply
#57
ego
this is a marketing strategy by amd to push people to amd motherboards because intel does not have to many pci 4 boards
Posted on Reply
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