Monday, June 6th 2022
Intel LGA1851 to Succeed LGA1700, Probably Retain Cooler Compatibility
Intel's next-generation desktop processor socket will be the LGA1851. Leaked documents point to the next-generation socket being of identical dimensions to the current LGA1700, despite the higher pin-count, which could indicate cooler compatibility between the two sockets, much in the same way as the LGA1200 retained cooler-compatibility with prior Intel sockets tracing all the way back to the LGA1156. The current LGA1700 will service only two generations of Intel Core, the 12th Generation "Alder Lake," and the next-gen "Raptor Lake" due for later this year. "Raptor Lake" will be Intel's last desktop processor built on a monolithic silicon, as the company transitions to multi-chip modules.
Intel Socket LGA1851 will debut with the 14th Gen Core "Meteor Lake" processors due for late-2023 or 2024; and will hold out until the 15th Gen "Arrow Lake." Since "Meteor Lake" is a 3D-stacked MCM with a base tile stacked below logic tiles; the company is making adjustments to the IHS thickness to end up with an identical package thickness to the LGA1700, which would be key to cooler-compatibility, besides the socket's physical dimensions. Intel probably added pin-count to the LGA1851 by eating into the "courtyard" (the central gap in the land-grid), because the company states that the pin-pitch hasn't changed from LGA1700.
Sources:
BenchLife.info, VideoCardz
Intel Socket LGA1851 will debut with the 14th Gen Core "Meteor Lake" processors due for late-2023 or 2024; and will hold out until the 15th Gen "Arrow Lake." Since "Meteor Lake" is a 3D-stacked MCM with a base tile stacked below logic tiles; the company is making adjustments to the IHS thickness to end up with an identical package thickness to the LGA1700, which would be key to cooler-compatibility, besides the socket's physical dimensions. Intel probably added pin-count to the LGA1851 by eating into the "courtyard" (the central gap in the land-grid), because the company states that the pin-pitch hasn't changed from LGA1700.
197 Comments on Intel LGA1851 to Succeed LGA1700, Probably Retain Cooler Compatibility
Is it not worth buying Intel because they change sockets every 2 gens? Or more worth buying AMD because they don't?
For ME it does not bother me and never has. For me new CPU means new board that's it. For others i guess it is different and that is upto them right or wrong upto them.
You are also kind of confused. You still seem to not realize that people who upgrade every generation are those who probably will replace the whole package (CPU+Mobo+RAM and probably +GPU). People who do NOT upgrade often would be extremely happy finding out that "You know that you can upgrade just the CPU and NOT the whole platform?". But most consumers out there, do not know that. You also say it in you post (oh man, you keep throwing arguments against your point of view and don't even realize it).
That's all from me.
Be good.So, for AMD CPUs they have to WIN EVERY SINGLE TEST OUT THERE, to be called the best.
For Intel CPUs a few wins in some tests are enough.
OK. :peace:
Meanwhile Intel also beats all AMD chips in some applications.
So none are the best then?!.
Secondly, the CPU landscape has shifted dramatically since the days of the 2500K and even 6700K days. Yes Intel is still dominating in terms of revenue per year, but now AMD is strong, especially in Server. Hell the 5800x3d, with slower IPC than the 12900K, toppled the 12900K in gaming, while consuming less power and having less IPC. Not good. And to drive the point home, the 5800x3d is drop-in compatible with x370 motherboards from years ago. Those users can upgrade to a very potent gaming champion CPU without needing to buy a new motherboard. The same is not true for Intel customers who bought say a 9990K on z390 from years ago. Also, the 12900K is likely being held back by not having more L3 cache.
Anyways, returning to the competitive landscape, Apple left and introduced its own M-series silicon that puts Intel's perf per watt to shame. Qualcomm is entering the market, and will offer a high performance ARM CPU to the market in 2H 2023 (Nuvia)... which could be a strong competitor in the thin and light Windows laptop space and could incent Dell, Lenovo and others to offer an ARM line of laptops, spending less money on Intel CPUs.
Intel recognizes this shift in the market place and will be offering IPC uplifts and increased core counts. Hopefully it also addresses performance per watt in the thin and light space. Intel of present is different than the Intel of past. Intel of past faced little competition and offered quad cores for years on mainstream platforms, with meager IPC updates each generation. I still have my old 6700K which was a very potent performer. The 7700K and even 8700K were not worth the money at all. But starting with Rocket Lake, continuing to Alder Lake, and will continue with Meteor Lake and Arrow Lake, Intel has and will continue to significantly increase IPC and core counts. This is different than we've seen over the past 10 years.
So a generational upgrade now is not the same as generational upgrades in the 14nm++++ days. You're getting more for your money if you upgrade. IPC uplifts and core count increases provide a compelling reason for upgrading. But Intel is making it more difficult than it otherwise needs to be for some users to upgrade because those users have to get rid of their perfectly capable motherboards in order to upgrade.
One point of good marketing is to make it as easy as possible for consumers to find, discover, and purchase your product. You want to be as frictionless as possible. Changing platforms so frequently serves as a disincentive for certain users (who don't want to throw away their perfectly working motherboards with BIOSes that have been debugged and are stable) to buy new Intel CPUs...
If your marketing strategy has an inherent disincentive for customers to purchase your product (compared to the competition) then it's a marketing strategy that needs to be called into question.
I'm not saying Intel needs to support a platform for 5 years like AM4. But with the beefy power delivery system of z690, why did Intel move from LGA1200 to LGA1700/1800 on Z690 instead of going straight to LGA1851 on z690, and let Z690 remain in market for 3 generations instead of only 2? 3 generations out of a motherboard is good use of that motherboard, and makes it much easier and less costly for users to continue to purchase new Intel CPUs.
For www, multimedia, office, processing home videos and light games, the need for an upgrade is not expected in the foreseeable future. For games I have another system and only the video card will decide the need for a processor upgrade. Now the 11600K works perfectly with the 3070Ti.
As a price (Sept. 2020), 10500 + Z490 = 5600X without motherboard (Dec. 2020-2021)
No hard feelings, our brain is just very complex. ;) And o lot of our hehaviour is just simple Psychololgy101.
So, in short, it's not about money, but rather I'm pointing out that just because the socket may be physically the same doesn't mean the rest of the system is going to run its best with it... if at all. As far as my personal finances, sure, I have more money now then I did when I was a teenager and just getting into PCs, but I also have more responsibilities. Like bills, and a family to support. My 2600k is still working just fine, and the only reason my server is as new as it is, is because I kept running into issues with the AM3 system it used to be, so I got frustrated with it and rebuilt the whole thing, making payments over the course of some number of months to cover the cost.
Whilst they gain chipset sales, they no doubt lose CPU sales, if I had to buy a new board for 5600G, I 100% would not have purchased the 5600G, and likewise if a 12xxx series intel chip worked on Z370 I would probably have upgraded to the model with no E cores by now, and indeed i did upgrade from 8600k to 9900k, which was able to as same socket.
Better in gaming, but weaker in applications (lower frequencies). It's a big problem because it only shows its strength with a top video card and the weaknesses in all other tasks. If you don't have a super video card, you should be aware that you bought a more expensive processor with performance below 5800X. For the same money, better 5900X or 12700K.
You know that this is an importand parameter in marketing and that's why companies try their best to get the best spots in benchmarks? The casual consumer sees the 12900K being on top of benchmarks while running under the best watercooling someone can buy and hitting occasionally 300W power consumption and is so super wow excited, that then goes and buys an i5 or an i3, even a Pentium, something with that little magic sause in it to enjoy an idea of that great tchnology. The same in GPUs. People where drooling looking at Titan numbers, then going and buying a GT 710!
Try inserting an Alder Lake in that Z490 mobo. :)Yeah it was. I was thinking that someone who needs to be conservative in spending will appreciate a cheap way to upgrade. Years latter with better income and more money to spend, the same person would insist on not putting hard limits in spending, but buying the best for themselves.
Your experience with 775 and compatibility was probably a result of a bad choice. A CPU not yet supported for your motherboard was chosen as the new CPU for your system.
I had great experiences back then with AM2 790FX and 790GX. I gone from a dual core Athlon to quad core Phenom and then a Thuban before moving on an AM3 platform to utilize DDR3. And even then kept a motherboard with the 790GX a little longer as a second system. Didn't had any problem on AM2/3. Rock solid platforms. Still using an AM3+ mobo with an unlocked 645(free cores...yeah!!!). If I had problems with it, I would have sold it.
Edit: Hey, it was also known as 17xx/18xx initially, so we can dream some more.