Thursday, October 20th 2016

NVIDIA Claws Back Console Chips Business: Nintendo Switch Announced

After months of speculation, the lid is off Nintendo's "NX" project, with the company finally announcing today its much-awaited games console, the Nintendo Switch. With an expected release slated for March 2017, the console blurs the line between a games console and a handheld device, by making use of a docking station which will allow it to connect to a television, much like a traditional games console, while instantly entering a so called "portable mode" when it is undocked. As both a console and a portable device, the Nintendo Switch will use cartridges known as Game Cards, displaying games in a "high definition display" embedded on the console while on the go, with two detachable Joy-Con controllers stepping in as input devices.

For PC hardware enthusiasts, that may not be all too interesting. What is arguably more interesting is that this games console will make use of NVIDIA hardware: most notably, a custom Tegra processor is the one pulling out all of the console's processing needs, with the graphics being served by what the company calls "the same architecture as the world's top-performing GeForce gaming graphics cards."
According to an NVIDIA blog post, the Nintendo Switch's gaming experience is supported not only by custom hardware design with its Tegra chip, but also by leveraging "fully custom software", including "a revamped physics engine, new libraries, advanced game tools and libraries." According to NVIDIA, new gaming APIs were created so as to fully harness the Tegra processor's performance, with their newest API, NVN, being built specifically to bring lightweight, fast gaming to the masses. The console also features hardware-accelerated video playback, as well as custom software for audio effects and rendering. All of this is delivered through a custom operating system, devised for full system integration with the GPU in a bid to increase both performance and efficiency.

After having successfully embedded their technology in Microsoft's XBOX One and Sony's PS4 and upcoming PS4 Pro, as well as the troubled Nintendo Wii U, AMD had effectively achieved full control of the console gaming ecosystem (not counting the many Android systems in the same vein, such as the OUYA, for example). This design win by NVIDIA may come as a surprise, after a company representative's past remarks regarding console's design wins resulted in razor-thin margins, which was purportedly the reason NVIDIA chose not to pursue the XBOX ONE, PS4 or Wii U designs with their own technology. One could however argue that AMD's IP portfolio was better suited for any one of those consoles, due to the company also being able to develop x86-x64 CPUs. At the same time, it can also be argued that NVIDIA's own product line is, in this case, the best match for the Switch's design philosophy, considering that the GPU technology integrated within the custom Tegra chip is almost certainly more energy efficient than AMD's current offerings (considering, of course, NVIDIA's Pascal undisputed energy efficiency over AMD's latest GCN implementation). All things considered, though, it does seem like AMD still has control of the living room - at least when it comes to their respective implementation's power levels and PC-relevant characteristics.
Sources: NVIDIABlogs, Nintendo Switch
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54 Comments on NVIDIA Claws Back Console Chips Business: Nintendo Switch Announced

#26
Xzibit
erockerThere is no mention that this Tegra proc is Pascal. If so, good! If not, not worth even looking at.
Dev kit info

CPU:
Four ARM Cortex-A57 cores, maximum 2GHz
L2 cache, 2MB
64-bit ARMv8
Crypto extension enabled

GPU:
NVIDIA second-generation Maxwell architecture
256 CUDA cores, maximum 1GHz
1024 FLOPS/cycle
Texture: 16 pixels/cycle
Fill: 14.4 pixels/cycle

Main memory:
Capacity of 4GB
Bandwidth: 25.6 GB/s
VRAM: Shared

System Memory:
Capacity: 32 GB, Maximum transfer rate 400 MB/s
USB
USB 2.0 and 3.0
Video Output
60 fps, at maximum of 1920x1080 pixels
Or 30 fps at 3840x2160 pixels
The screen:
6.2" IPS LCD 1280x720 pixels
Capacitance method, 10-point multi-touch
Posted on Reply
#27
the54thvoid
Super Intoxicated Moderator
...Dev Kit.

Not production model. More likely the x2 version for the March 2017 release.
Digital Foundry also reports that Switch dev kits are currently using the X1 model. But here's the interesting bit: Nvidia is already gearing up for its successor, the X2. The X1 utilizes what's called Maxwell architecture, while the X2 uses what's called Pascal architecture - but don't get too hung up on the wording there. Basically, all you need to know is that the way Nvidia constructs its X1 chip is based on 2014 technology, while the X2 is based on 2016 technology.
If they did put a Maxwell in then they deserve to fail.
Posted on Reply
#28
semantics
XzibitDev kit info

CPU:
Four ARM Cortex-A57 cores, maximum 2GHz
L2 cache, 2MB
64-bit ARMv8
Crypto extension enabled

GPU:
NVIDIA second-generation Maxwell architecture
256 CUDA cores, maximum 1GHz
1024 FLOPS/cycle
Texture: 16 pixels/cycle
Fill: 14.4 pixels/cycle

Main memory:
Capacity of 4GB
Bandwidth: 25.6 GB/s
VRAM: Shared

System Memory:
Capacity: 32 GB, Maximum transfer rate 400 MB/s
USB
USB 2.0 and 3.0
Video Output
60 fps, at maximum of 1920x1080 pixels
Or 30 fps at 3840x2160 pixels
The screen:
6.2" IPS LCD 1280x720 pixels
Capacitance method, 10-point multi-touch
The gpu and memory bandwidth seems entirely anemic. 256 cuda cores even their lowest end mobile gpu had more then that, shared 4gb memory with that throughput seems terrible.

Also those flops/cycle single precision one assumes that's different. I think all current nvidia gpus are 2 fma instructions per a cuda core times the base clock. That's 4 fma instructions per a cuda core.

The internal storage may seem small but i'm guessing those SD cards type games is where it will be stored etc so it's not that big of a deal outside of production cost is likely twice that of dual layered blu-ray. That being said it's probably more powerful than the Wii U and that Wii U had some good looking HD games, not alot but some.
Posted on Reply
#29
Xzibit
the54thvoid...Dev Kit.

Not production model. More likely the x2 version for the March 2017 release.



If they did put a Maxwell in then they deserve to fail.
Dev kits are similar to the Jetson TX1 Dev kits if not the same or modified.

The take away is the rumored 720p 60fps target. Might be okay for a hand held but tablets and phones are already at a higher resolution. I suspect the 1080p is upscaled when docked. They are also reporting vents and a possible fan inside the unit.

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#30
jabbadap
the54thvoid...Dev Kit.

Not production model. More likely the x2 version for the March 2017 release.

If they did put a Maxwell in then they deserve to fail.
Should be pascal, or nvidia does not know what is their current top performing geforce :D :
Nintendo Switch is powered by the performance of the custom Tegra processor. The high-efficiency scalable processor includes an NVIDIA GPU based on the same architecture as the world’s top-performing GeForce gaming graphics cards.
Posted on Reply
#31
esrever
semanticsAlso those flops/cycle single precision one assumes that's different. I think all current nvidia gpus are 2 fma instructions per a cuda core times the base clock. That's 4 fma instructions per a cuda core.
They are likely talking about half precision which is what nvidia quotes for their X1. It will be 500GFLOPs of single precision if the cores are maxwell.
Posted on Reply
#32
Prima.Vera
Why don't we just simplify all that PR crap to this:

Is a new portable console, similar to PS Vista/DS/Shield with a TV output.

Done.

P.S.

Is using cartridges again?? Did they learn nothing from the DS ??
Posted on Reply
#33
ShurikN
FluffmeisterThey will still pocket more cash than AMD get from Microsoft and Sony. :p
And you know that how...
Posted on Reply
#34
eidairaman1
The Exiled Airman
ZoneDymoNot sure what is so troubled about the WiiU, I mean yeah its not selling as much as the others but with that criteria everything but the most succesfull product in a category can be considered "troubled".

Anywho, pretty cool I guess, hope those rendered images are not final though I mean, what is up with that "D-pad" being 4 buttons... come on nintendo you have a damn patent on the traditional D-pad, use that thing!
the name Wii again confused many
Posted on Reply
#35
hardcore_gamer
ShurikNAnd you know that how...
Can't argue with rectum-derived facts. :)
Posted on Reply
#37
BiggieShady
the54thvoidIf they did put a Maxwell in then they deserve to fail.
Wow, it *is* a Maxwell Tegra X1 in a dev kit ... it's a shield reskinned ... what's the point putting x1 in a dev kit, when they squirt a new (modified) arch each year and it's obvious by release it will have to be pascal ... and devs need to code close to the metal for this little machine to use pascal goodies like smp.
Ah, fuck it, it's nintendo, they went with 4000 series AMD VLIW GPU for a Wii-U ... they have a fetish for old tech, so anything is possible
Posted on Reply
#38
nexus_a
semanticsThe gpu and memory bandwidth seems entirely anemic. 256 cuda cores even their lowest end mobile gpu had more then that, shared 4gb memory with that throughput seems terrible.

Also those flops/cycle single precision one assumes that's different. I think all current nvidia gpus are 2 fma instructions per a cuda core times the base clock. That's 4 fma instructions per a cuda core.

The internal storage may seem small but i'm guessing those SD cards type games is where it will be stored etc so it's not that big of a deal outside of production cost is likely twice that of dual layered blu-ray. That being said it's probably more powerful than the Wii U and that Wii U had some good looking HD games, not alot but some.
Apparently the dev kit used Tegra X1 chip and the real console will have X2.

Also when undocked it runs at 720p to conserve battery and reduce temp. When docked (connected to TV) it runs at 1080p.
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#39
Xzibit
nexus_aApparently the dev kit used Tegra X1 chip and the real console will have X2.

Also when undocked it runs at 720p to conserve battery and reduce temp. When docked (connected to TV) it runs at 1080p.
Reports of battery life don't look so good. Its going to be playing at 720p on a 6-7 inch screen. Its also thick so it shouldn't have a small battery or its draining it fast which past Tegra products have been known for.
Battery life is probably one of the biggest mysteries of the Nintendo Switch. Unfortunately, things don’t look good as of now. Laura Kate Dale stated that she’s heard about mediocre battery life, with a source from Ubisoft talking about a maximum battery life of three hours.
Posted on Reply
#40
Ithanul
Hell, I could care less about the battery life.

For the love of all mighty, just give me a darn Pokemon, Fire Emblem, and/or Advance Wars game on that thing so I can finally game those on a sweet big TV screen.

Plus, I'm glad they gone to cartridge base. Far easier to store and faster load times.
Posted on Reply
#41
IceScreamer
If anything, the concept itself looks neat, but the hardware looks underwhelming.
Posted on Reply
#42
Aquinus
Resident Wat-man
Just because it can be a handheld device and be plugged into a TV doesn't mean that it does either of those tasks well. Just think of all the people that would rather have a real tablet than just an over-sized smartphone or the people that realized that having an over-sized smartphone ends up sucking at being a phone and a tablet instead of doing either task well...
Posted on Reply
#44
Aquinus
Resident Wat-man
Nintendo just doesn't want to jump on the x86 gravy train. :laugh:
Posted on Reply
#45
BiggieShady
I have a feeling this thingy will have low power mode when detached, and auto overclock (boost) when in dock. And the bulky dock will also serve as a heatsink in contact with tablet aluminium body :wtf:
Posted on Reply
#46
Aquinus
Resident Wat-man
BiggieShadyI have a feeling this thingy will have low power mode when detached, and auto overclock (boost) when in dock. And the bulky dock will also serve as a heatsink in contact with tablet aluminium body :wtf:
I'm waiting for a lawsuit about it catching fire. :laugh:
Posted on Reply
#47
Vayra86
TheGuruStudBoy, Nintendo keeps failing, now.

Good luck. What happened to a real console?
Really? They've had console best sellers in the past years, and not just one, but most of them. The first Wii introduced console gaming to a whole new category of 'gamers' and effectively created its own market for a while.

When I see this, I see a crapload of really good ideas implemented in a really good way.

- Docking: adopted in business and it works there. Microsoft develops Continuum. The whole world is considering or using docking solutions, Nintendo adopts it in the console and uses it to double down on the investment for consumers.
- Same screen multiplayer: you see those controllers? Small, perhaps not very ergonomic, but they do enable split/same screen multiplayer side by side. Not a single other console on the market has this right now, let alone handhelds.
- Low-power / mobile oriented games: synergy with the smartphone market, again potential for huge numbers of new customers

These are all things the current consoles do not, can not offer.

All of the above still doesn't mean I'm buying one. But hey.
Posted on Reply
#48
BiggieShady
Vayra86split/same screen multiplayer side by side
With all that split screen it makes sense why maxwell arch has multiple viewport rendering (beside multi resolution render support in shadow warrior on pc) ... I may be reaching but with pascal's simultaneous multi projection, probably you'll be able to stick the tablet into nintendo's VR headset (coming soon maybe) ... tablet already has rails on the side :laugh:
Posted on Reply
#49
AsRock
TPU addict
Seems pretty cool but price is going matter a lot and those mini joypads eek enjoy that hand\finger pain.
Posted on Reply
#50
Steevo
Vayra86Really? They've had console best sellers in the past years, and not just one, but most of them. The first Wii introduced console gaming to a whole new category of 'gamers' and effectively created its own market for a while.

When I see this, I see a crapload of really good ideas implemented in a really good way.

- Docking: adopted in business and it works there. Microsoft develops Continuum. The whole world is considering or using docking solutions, Nintendo adopts it in the console and uses it to double down on the investment for consumers.
- Same screen multiplayer: you see those controllers? Small, perhaps not very ergonomic, but they do enable split/same screen multiplayer side by side. Not a single other console on the market has this right now, let alone handhelds.
- Low-power / mobile oriented games: synergy with the smartphone market, again potential for huge numbers of new customers

These are all things the current consoles do not, can not offer.

All of the above still doesn't mean I'm buying one. But hey.
I love that word. It doesn't really mean anything other than "I have no idea what really works, but here is a world to let you know I have no soul because I sold it".

Docking, if by docking you mean people who plug their laptop into a monitor, plug in a keyboard and mouse, and plug it into the wall where it lives for 99% of its life and then they go on to use their phones for the mobile part of work. Yes, Docking is a thing. you could almost say that the Wii U has docking, and its terrible.

Same Screen Multiplayer, never been done before. I mean, we have had split screen multi-player since video games became GUI based and some before, but never on the same......... wait a minute......

Low Power Synergy mobile games on..... a tablet without access to google play or apple store thing, which has millions of games....... cause everyone wants to sign up to write games for Nintendo now, with their online store, and make it big, and umm. Will it have 3G/4G so I can take it on a flight and play games, listen to music, read, e-mail, facebook, video chat too? I wish someone would invent a mobile device that could do all that..... with a nice camera, and the ability to download apps. I should patent that idea.


So lets see.

Consoles currently offer easy friendly competitive split screen on some games, others have co-op play with networking using proprietary standard network protocols or an easy to use world wide networking interface.

Docking... well you got other consoles there, they all have lost a lot of marketshare cause everyone wants to do the dock, as a fact its very popular in places, some they consider the initial insertion to be a bit rapey, but we strongly believe that docking is the way of the future, they aren't going to dock themselves you know. Imagine, a group of friends over without any docking taking place!!!

Low-Power, we should really look into this, see if there is a market for mobile devices that can do everything!!! It could be the next big thing since the uhhh, Zune?
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