Will anyone be left to buy it by next year?

As someone who very much enjoyed every entry and expansion in this franchise, pouring an unknown amount of time into each, D4 is boring af.

I am a fool for spending 200eur on 2 copies of D4. I thought it was the safest bet out there. I struggled to get thru the campaign, and just meh'd out hours into S1. This game needs serious work, and no drop rate and spell dmg tweak is going to save it. I wont be spending another penny, no matter how shiny the next thing is, until its dramatically improved.

Major let down of a game.

As long as I can go back to the older content, and bulldozer any mob while feeling op, my past investment in the game is protected. Otherwise they are just milking my wallet...

so we pay for every update until it's a full game?
version 0.7, 0.8, 0.9, 1.0 for probably 50 bucks each... great!

HisDivineOrderWill anyone be left to buy it by next year?

I assume if that happens they will cancel the content like they did for overwatch and start planning the next entry. Given the sales of Diablo 4, clearly there are always simps who will continue to buy new entries into the franchise.

It wasn't a bad game, it just needs way more content for the amount of time that it makes you play.

HisDivineOrderWill anyone be left to buy it by next year?

Yeah, no, done with Blizzard, D4 was the last time I get screwed over by that company.

phanbueyIt wasn't a bad game, it just needs way more content for the amount of time that it makes you play.

They had all the winning recipes they needed the loot system from all the previous Diablo titles and additional systems, rolling, crafting etc. But they thought: "Hey, let's throw that all out the window and make a turd with good graphics."

Legacy-ZAYeah, no, done with Blizzard, D4 was the last time I get screwed over by that company.


They had all the winning recipes they needed the loot system from all the previous Diablo titles and additional systems, rolling, crafting etc. But they thought: "Hey, let's throw that all out the window and make a turd with good graphics."

The voice acting was good, the cutscenes were well done (that last battle cutscene was pretty sick) -- whole package was great, but by level 55 it was obvious they were just looping the same content to extend runtime.

And then the progression slowed even more, and the enemies were all the same, and all the animations were the same the loot had an extra attribute - woo.

Probably 30 hours of content in the entire game just stretched out to 120+. Getting to level 100 takes 10x longer than it should. And then when they extended that town portal animation, that's when I was like "ok I'm done" -- clearly their priority was to deliver as little as possible and to maximize the amount of time it consumed. No thanks.

Play through campaign, slay some mobs, and done - $35 game at best.

phanbueyThe voice acting was good, the cutscenes were well done (that last battle cutscene was pretty sick) -- whole package was great, but by level 55 it was obvious they were just looping the same content to extend runtime.

And then the progression slowed even more, and the enemies were all the same, and all the animations were the same the loot had an extra attribute - woo.

Probably 30 hours of content in the entire game just stretched out to 120+. Getting to level 100 takes 10x longer than it should. And then when they extended that town portal animation, that's when I was like "ok I'm done" -- clearly their priority was to deliver as little as possible and to maximize the amount of time it consumed. No thanks.

Play through campaign, slay some mobs, and done - $35 game at best.

I found the campaign great.

The rest is very lacking. I had been planning to play D4 for a very very long time, I was severely disappointed.

"We've got plans, we have storylines that go well into the future. When you look back and realize that there were 11 years between Diablo III and Diablo IV, that feels like we didn't live up to our players, our community, and what they deserve. That's something we are rectifying in D4 with our seasons and our expansions."

If they want to make more content for me to buy, that's fine - I'll buy it if I perceive it as worthwhile. To frame it like they're doing me a favor by selling me content is insulting.

Also, the first expansion for D3 came out 2 years after the base game launched. Maybe he meant to say there were 9 years between the last D3 expansion and D4, but during those 9 years there were plenty of game changes and improvements that nobody had to pay for. With regard to extended storylines, in my experience expansion storylines are usually not compelling and tend to worsen the story when taken as a whole (though there are exceptions - e.g. Brood Wars).

All that said, I have enjoyed D4 so far and I didn't think the grind to 100 was that terrible. I think D3 has better pacing with regard to season journey completion, but it took them years to get there. And the grind in either game is nothing compared to D2/D2R (for better or for worse).

phanbueyIt wasn't a bad game, it just needs way more content for the amount of time that it makes you play.

I remember reading that the developers said that it wasn't intended to be a "forever" game. Basically, not a game where you exclusively play it like a Destiny sort of thing. One where you jump in for a while and complete new content, move on to something else, and then come back when new content comes around.

That was actually quite exciting for me as I'm not fond of that type of game except the decisions they make are encouraging people to just grind ungodly amounts of hours to get good stuff and level up. It seems like most people would be much happier if they could drop 20-40 hours into playing and get a character fully leveled with all of the uniques on offer for that character. Then come back for the next season/expansion when new items are introduced and do the same loop again but with new items and abilities to collect. If you want to play more, then start a new character with a different class. I got to like level 75 on my season 1 character and just felt burned out. I had gotten a single drop of most of the unique items I was looking for but those were very underpowered as they dropped at lower levels. The thought of "it's going to take another 20 hours to get those items again" just made me quit. Not to mention having never gotten one of the "ultra rare uniques" across two characters leveled up to that point.

How the leveling and "ultra rare uniques" are tuned currently seems like they are afraid that people will get all of the items/reach level 100 and stop playing which goes completely against that stated intention. If you make that content so hard to get, the player who only wants to spend a reasonable amount of time is just going to shrug and give up. It's almost impossible to make a game where the people who exclusively play it always have something to grind for, and if you prioritize these people then most players are just going to feel left out.

phanbueyThe voice acting was good, the cutscenes were well done (that last battle cutscene was pretty sick) -- whole package was great, but by level 55 it was obvious they were just looping the same content to extend runtime.

And then the progression slowed even more, and the enemies were all the same, and all the animations were the same the loot had an extra attribute - woo.

Probably 30 hours of content in the entire game just stretched out to 120+. Getting to level 100 takes 10x longer than it should. And then when they extended that town portal animation, that's when I was like "ok I'm done" -- clearly their priority was to deliver as little as possible and to maximize the amount of time it consumed. No thanks.

Play through campaign, slay some mobs, and done - $35 game at best.

Yeah I had a slightly different perspective on the campaign which I found was mostly just running around the same map doing similar things as you do AFTER the campaign: the odd dungeon, a few fetch or heal this or that guy quests, I mean sure, it had some okay moments but I practically didn't care for it.

A big part of the campaign-letdown element for me was the freedom you had to go anywhere straight from the get-go. The 'world map' quickly became a gimmick, oh yet another area of rocks and trees, or maybe no trees this time, with yet another weak spread of mobs and the same events. Oh, nice, I get to run halfway round the world now for the next quest step. It struck me that I saw the same mob types all across the world, with little rhyme or reason as to why.

Cutscenes, agreed, voice acting similar... but the game just oozes meh. Power scaling feels crappy, and most if not all of the neat stuff you can do in builds is clearly pre-cooked and artificial. There is no baseline of rules and stats you can really play with to make something unique; you just max out a skill and there is only one best way to do it, and get defensives otherwise. I got bored already past level 40, clawed my way through the second half of the campaign and then had a lovely world map grind for renown ahead of me, doing below-par dungeon content to get all unlocks. And then you get into T3/T4 and its practically the same thing except now some areas of the map turn red for even more meh loot and meh mob clubbing. You go up in tiers until you keep dying and then you're left grinding content that's too easy again to maybe get a higher ilevel version of what you already have. That's the endgame loop in a nutshell. Well yay? I lasted until level 86.

The game just lacks ANY content that is really worth grinding for. Everything is slammed down in the meticulous balancing act 'because online' and according to this dev 'to keep the live service going' which is actually saying 'we want to spoonfeed you as long as possible so you keep logging in'. Its not ever about making the best possible game, its about keeping a live service on air to eventually siphon money. And they seriously think that 'making all skills equally viable' is The Way. Why would players like to be on the same pace of treadmill whatever they fancy playing? Where does that leave the incentive to try another build then? Blizzard is the active fun police, effectively. I noticed this first hand; have a Sorcerer running off Lucky Hit and vulnerable effects, something they heavily promote as damage enhancers, and they literally nerfed it back down to the level of many other affixes like +damage%. What?! So now it matters even less what kind of stats I roll then?

Its not about amount of content, I think. There are many dungeons and areas; its mostly that all of the content it does have feels like the same thing. This is all about design. The idea to make 'Aspects' like they exist in the game for example. HOW is it a great idea to create a system that makes EVERY legendary drop interchangeable? Another one: Armor as the one definitive stat for defense. No, you don't need to stack Resistances the olde way... just get Armor and perhaps check off one resistance type here and there, and you are done. Sorcerer? Armor. Barbarian? Get Armor. Druid? Hey, maybe stack Armor. Rogue, surely you can dodge right? Nope, Armor.

They are clearly plagued by the idea of angry community saying this or that isn't balanced enough, because then everyone might play the same meta and oh no maybe they'll hit Tier 100 too soon and leave the game! Blizzard in for the rescue: 'why don't we make everything the same, so it doesn't even matter!' Its so shortsighted, its unreal.

/rant. Also the game is uninstalled and it ain't comin back, I'm closing the Blizzard book definitively. Good memories... except not of the last decade.

phanbueyThe voice acting was good, the cutscenes were well done (that last battle cutscene was pretty sick) -- whole package was great, but by level 55 it was obvious they were just looping the same content to extend runtime.

And then the progression slowed even more, and the enemies were all the same, and all the animations were the same the loot had an extra attribute - woo.

Probably 30 hours of content in the entire game just stretched out to 120+. Getting to level 100 takes 10x longer than it should. And then when they extended that town portal animation, that's when I was like "ok I'm done" -- clearly their priority was to deliver as little as possible and to maximize the amount of time it consumed. No thanks.

Play through campaign, slay some mobs, and done - $35 game at best.

I think this is where all games are headed, or at least those that are developed by the big name corporations. Another thing to consider, games are more complex with respect to graphics, coding, etc., vs what they were back in the days before "season passes" with the exception of some MMO games(prior to pay-to-win/pay-to-progress) where paid subscriptions were required. And lets not forget that many of these games are released in an unfinished beta state or worse.

I haven't played Diablo IV, but it does seem to be lacking in variety for character classes and balance. The loot system is also way too RNG-ish.
The thing that boggles my mind is the game only has 5 classes yet they were having problems with balance between them.

They should do what they did back in the days of Bard's Tale 1-3, World of Xeen, etc. When you make a good game, you don't need to screw around with cranking out half a dozen expansions/add-on content and can move on to an entirely new sequel.

MentalAcetylideI haven't played Diablo IV, but it does seem to be lacking in variety for character classes and balance. The loot system is also way too RNG-ish.
The thing that boggles my mind is the game only has 5 classes yet they were having problems with balance between them.

The problems with balance aren't real problems, they're Blizzard bean counter problems. Players must be stuck on content for a measurable amount of time, no class can be allowed to progress through a dungeon too much faster than another. Mobility is the only space they don't really touch in that aspect, but they literally count the mob burn down times for different builds/skill setups and balance accordingly. So it doesn't matter if you see high numbers, you're still going to be nerfed to the pace of everything else. And yeah that's a moving target because players keep figuring out ways to break the system, and as a result the game has tons of hidden rules underneath the description and it feels super artificial, all progress is very gradual, and no class or build truly excels until you find some half obscured interaction they haven't touched on yet.

Vayra86The problems with balance aren't real problems, they're Blizzard bean counter problems. Players must be stuck on content for a measurable amount of time, no class can be allowed to progress through a dungeon too much faster than another. Mobility is the only space they don't really touch in that aspect, but they literally count the mob burn down times for different builds/skill setups and balance accordingly. So it doesn't matter if you see high numbers, you're still going to be nerfed to the pace of everything else. And yeah that's a moving target because players keep figuring out ways to break the system, and as a result the game has tons of hidden rules underneath the description and it feels super artificial, all progress is very gradual, and no class or build truly excels until you find some half obscured interaction they haven't touched on yet.

I think some of it is due in part to player behavior, possibly fueled by past MMO game design where if one does not keep their ass planted in front of the computer for 12+ hours per day, they will fall too far behind. Games are becoming less of a "game" and more of a "job". I'm curious of how well Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen is going to do when it gets released. I know I ended up hating Everquest after spending around 2 years playing it and being in the top guild on the server when I stopped playing it.

Why can't they release on thursday or friday?

Always curious to see how many people wouild call in sick lol

This game is dead. Don't waste your money. There is no sense of progression. It looks pretty but that gets old.

Just reading the comments, I can sympathize with Blizzard decision. Even the people commentung here don't want the same thing from the game, Blizzard whoever is left over there probably realized this and woefully against better judgement decide tried to make something that target everyone, somehow never getting the memo on how that rarely almost never works out.

So they are trying to ripp us off even more with beta patches for this alpha release of the game?? Thanks, but no thanks.
Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice....

Never, ever, ever again. They could tell me Diablo V is out tomorrow, I would never buy it even at $10. And I remember all the reviews I read about that piece of garbage were praising it and rating it the highest scores... These guys should be sitting in jail, including game reviewers, until they have finished reimbursing every single one of us. When I think I spent $69 for it, I could've purchased so many other things like used tires or chewed gums and feel better about my new acquisitions.
:banghead:

KelutrelAs long as I can go back to the older content, and bulldozer any mob while feeling op, my past investment in the game is protected. Otherwise they are just milking my wallet...

Given that Diablo IV scales enemies consistent with the player's level, even on the easy mode, you'll never get that truly OP feeling, even with min-maxing your build.

TotallyJust reading the comments, I can sympathize with Blizzard decision. Even the people commentung here don't want the same thing from the game, Blizzard whoever is left over there probably realized this and woefully against better judgement decide tried to make something that target everyone, somehow never getting the memo on how that rarely almost never works out.

Diablo 3's RMAH was just the first clumsy misfire, but it defined what Blizzard was going to do from then on out, and thus far, I believe nothing really worked out long term for them, while most franchises have taken substantial damage. They managed to kill Overwatch by simply adding the number 2, Starcraft is near dead; Warcraft is a relic by now; Diablo is irreparably damaged since Immortal, and it doesn't help that 4 feels very much like a mobile cheese game and has about the same depth to it.

Blizzard really should have just listened to the old geezers who've been saying for ages Diablo 2 was the best Diablo ever made. It still is. Even the remaster plays better than 3 or 4. Perhaps not quite as much QoL features, but the game is just more interesting, the drops more weighty and the whole atmosphere just works better. Its so good, even in 2023 you can take the clunkier movement and other limitations for granted and just enjoy the whole progression curve until you hit a wall somewhere, which, contrary to 3 and 4, is very likely unless you follow a build guide.

Even now you can fire up Grim Dawn and recognize all the good stuff from D2 clearly, while the game just expands on that massively. More classes, more choices, more build directions, finely tailored progression... yes, its more of all we already know. But the execution is just so much better, and that's all we want out of an ARPG really. ARPGs need to have those omfgwtfbbq moments where you pick up something new and it just skyrockets you past everything for a while. Diablo 3 and 4 lack that entirely.

DahitaNever, ever, ever again. They could tell me Diablo V is out tomorrow, I would never buy it even at $10. And I remember all the reviews I read about that piece of garbage were praising it and rating it the highest scores... These guys should be sitting in jail, including game reviewers, until they have finished reimbursing every single one of us. When I think I spent $69 for it, I could've purchased so many other things like used tires or chewed gums and feel better about my new acquisitions.
:banghead:

Well in defense of the reviewers... I too thought the first 30 odd levels were okay. But just moments later you discover those levels were okay only because you were still adding new skills and passives from the class tree so things actually changed a bit over time. When that ends... the real game appears and its a vast sea of nothingness...

DahitaNever, ever, ever again. They could tell me Diablo V is out tomorrow, I would never buy it even at $10. And I remember all the reviews I read about that piece of garbage were praising it and rating it the highest scores... These guys should be sitting in jail, including game reviewers, until they have finished reimbursing every single one of us. When I think I spent $69 for it, I could've purchased so many other things like used tires or chewed gums and feel better about my new acquisitions.
:banghead:

Indeed.

Sadly most of the people that worked for D2 are no longer with Blizzard. But they actively helped with other quality games such as Path of Exile or Grim Dawn. Sadly, I don't think that whomever agreed to some of the decisions for D4 gameplay and mechanics, ever played D2, not to mention the other 2, POE and GD.

Its simple. Be a suit:
Our plan of microtransactions didn't work with the seasonal model. The "product" don't fit mature players.
Ok. 3 seconds later anyone in the room.
The same efford will be on annual paid upgrades + less aggresive seasons to get money from the expansions. PR will love our "shift" and "we heard".
MBA thumbs up, takes the idea. Millionaire bonus.
Go on.

swirl09As someone who very much enjoyed every entry and expansion in this franchise, pouring an unknown amount of time into each, D4 is boring af.

I am a fool for spending 200eur on 2 copies of D4. I thought it was the safest bet out there. I struggled to get thru the campaign, and just meh'd out hours into S1. This game needs serious work, and no drop rate and spell dmg tweak is going to save it. I wont be spending another penny, no matter how shiny the next thing is, until its dramatically improved.

Major let down of a game.

Same here. First impression might have been OK but that is only because the love to the franchise. I wish i had spent the money for something else. D4 is not what Diablo has been all about I think and the changes they are making in the name of "better" don't seem to give better experience. i might consider playing it again at some point but for now there are 2 games I have in mind that bring way more to the table. I'd rather keep on playing diablo 2 remastered instead if i were to play diablo.