Dr. DroThe only reason anyone should buy a 7800 XT over a 4070 Super is if they use Linux, making the Windows driver situation inconsequential, and even then thanks to the AI push Nvidia has been spending some time on their Linux stack. If AMD doesn't watch out, then their Linux advantage will be reduced to just an "open source advantage", which will surely strain things with anyone who stops short of being a Stallmanian free software activist.

Nvidia's driver on Linux is already open source as well, it's just not upstreamed like amdgpu is.

I think my time of discrete cards may be coming to an end. I'm hoping Valve makes a serious go of Steam Deck But Home Console and gives me an offramp. Nvidia's pricing me out, AMD's given up on the discrete market, and Intel's on borrowed time.

So I'll just wave bye bye to the enthusiast market and save a lot of money. Thanks for all the fish, Jensen.

HisDivineOrderThanks for all the fish, Jensen.

nvidia buyers are more to blame. As a long time nvidia user i just doesn't get it and all this hype around nvidia to me there is nothing special about it.

I understand when GTX 970 was better than R9 290X (10 years ago) but now situation is way better for AMD. And the most dumbest thing is that market share shows complete opposite. There are too many sheeps in market and they are not even thinking just buying.

Kritnvidia buyers are more to blame. As a long time nvidia user i just doesn't get it and all this hype around nvidia to me there is nothing special about it.

I understand when GTX 970 was better than R9 290X (10 years ago) but now situation is way better for AMD. And the most dumbest thing is that market share shows complete opposite. There are too many sheeps in market and they are not even thinking just buying.

I wonder if anyone here realizes that labeling people as "sheep" for adopting popular choices tends to ensure they won't be dissuaded, instead of being "punk" and embracing the alternative... even if there were any reason whatsoever for the average Windows gamer to pick a Radeon over an equivalently priced GeForce, which there largely isn't (the latter does everything the former does, but the opposite is not true, with many caveats sometimes the Radeon MAY be a little faster, usually this is not the case either), they won't just because you insulted their intelligence by calling them sheep...

HisDivineOrderAMD's given up on the discrete market

Wait, what? Aren't they just doing the same what they did with Polaris and RDNA1, having a generation or two with mid-end cards and then have some beefier again?

RuruWait, what? Aren't they just doing the same what they did with Polaris and RDNA1, having a generation or two with mid-end cards and then have some beefier again?

That's what I think.

Just a pause to pull their balls together, then they will be back swinging.

RuruWait, what? Aren't they just doing the same what they did with Polaris and RDNA1, having a generation or two with mid-end cards and then have some beefier again?

HisDivineOrder is simply doing what people do EVERY generation of GPUs. The wail and gnash their teeth at how GPUs are too expensive and how they are TOTES going to buy a console instead. They were already thinking about moving to a console, and seed validation for their justifications on forums to help convince themselves, because they dont REALLY want to buy a console, if they did they would have done it already. In 4 years, he'll be here telling us why the RTX 6090 is SOO expensive, its making him want to go to consoles, and how AMD only bothers competing with the RTX 6070 and there's no hope for PC users.

Because lets be frank, consoles are a totally different animal. It's like growing up with macs then declaring you're gonna go to only android tablets. Consoles are locked down, with terrible software "sales" and the last few generations have had horrible user experiences. Just Cause 3's console port was not an outlier, it was an indicator of where we are going. Nobody who has spent decades running gaming PCs is going to go to a console just because "its expensive". PC gaming has ALWAYS been an expensive hobby, people just have very selective memories.

Dr. DroI wonder if anyone here realizes that labeling people as "sheep" for adopting popular choices tends to ensure they won't be dissuaded, instead of being "punk" and embracing the alternative... even if there were any reason whatsoever for the average Windows gamer to pick a Radeon over an equivalently priced GeForce, which there largely isn't (the latter does everything the former does, but the opposite is not true, with many caveats sometimes the Radeon MAY be a little faster, usually this is not the case either), they won't just because you insulted their intelligence by calling them sheep...

No, they wont. They're meatshielding their choice of GPU to make themselves feel validated in their choice.

It's popular to hate on Nvidia because they are so far ahead of the competition. AMD has relied on being the underdog for 15 years now, and since they now make billions that excuse just doesnt fly anymore. I'm surprised he had the self restraint to not call them "nGreedia". You can post margin graphs and financial statements that show the Geforce division is no more profitable per GPU now then they were 4 or 6 years ago, and it'll just get brushed off because that doesnt tell the story they want. You can say you want a new big AMD GPU and they'll rally to tell you all you want is a discounted nvidia flagship, even if youve bought only AMD for the last decade.

For whatever reason GPUs cause basic decorum to just fly out the window.

Ef the rumors. Also no one is buying a 5080 at $1500 even if it comes close to a 4090 with 16 gigs of vram. Lets not kid ourselves. The 5080 is there to make the 5090 look like a great value. I bet the same ones hoping for the 5090 launching sky is the limit pricing were the same ones that claimed the same thing about the 4090. The same 4090 that launched at $1599 and was available at microcenter for $1519 with membership discount.
Nvidia wants you to focus on the current end of life 4090 supply pricing and not the 95% of the life span that held an average price of the 4090 around $1700. Last month according to Pcpartpicker the 4090 was available at $1700.
Nvidia tactics 101 spread rumors sky is the limit pricing, come out with $1900 to $2499 for the 5090 and $1199 5080 and watch the consumers gobble it up en masse! :kookoo: :shadedshu:o_O

GodrillaEf the rumors. Also no one is buying a 5080 at $1500 even if it comes close to a 4090 with 16 gigs of vram. Lets not kid ourselves. The 5080 is there to make the 5090 look like a great value. I bet the same ones hoping for the 5090 launching sky is the limit pricing were the same ones that claimed the same thing about the 4090. The same 4090 that launched at $1599 and was available at microcenter for $1519 with membership discount.
Nvidia wants you to focus on the current end of life 4090 supply pricing and not the 95% of the life span that held an average price of the 4090 around $1700. Last month according to Pcpartpicker the 4090 was available at $1700.
Nvidia tactics 101 spread rumors sky is the limit pricing, come out with $1900 to $2499 for the 5090 and $1199 5080 and watch the consumers gobble it up en masse! :kookoo: :shadedshu:o_O

Again, you talk about "the consumer" like you're not one of them. You've got a better solution? Please, please tell me how to upgrade a video card with a solid high-end card for the next three to four year. I thank you in advance for enlightening us poor silly "consumers".

Sound_CardThis is a flatly disingenuous argument. It does not matter if Intel or AMD have billion+ dollar values. You are making a false equivalence and intentionally muddying up the argument.

Nvidia is exploiting its consumer base via brand loyalty and market psychology. Nvidia can justify its outrageous prices precisely because its customer base rationalizes it. This is just like Apple but even worse.

Huh? You do know there is a company out there selling 8core chips for over 500$. In 2025. 8 cores. Bud, bud, come on now.

Dr. DroI wonder if anyone here realizes that labeling people as "sheep"

The more I read about sheep, ngreedia and burning connectors the more it makes me want to buy nvidia. I kid you not, wasn't even interested in the 5090, and then I read a bunch of comments on the thread and im like "im buying it". Honest to god, amd's fans are the best marketing for nvidia. They make you hate amd and love nvidia instead.

JustBenchingHuh? You do know there is a company out there selling 8core chips for over 500$. In 2025. 8 cores. Bud, bud, come on now.


The more I read about sheep, ngreedia and burning connectors the more it makes me want to buy nvidia. I kid you not, wasn't even interested in the 5090, and then I read a bunch of comments on the thread and im like "im buying it". Honest to god, amd's fans are the best marketing for nvidia. They make you hate amd and love nvidia instead.

It's hilarious how Nvidia is absolutely evil for releasing a super halo graphics card with never before seen extreme specifications that make even its exceptionally well endowed predecessor look like a toy, but when AMD does something like that, releasing an extreme product based on technology they are actually equally masters at (and this is no crime!) it gets a pass, no, it actually gets praise. Hypocrisy, much?



It gets better!

TheinsanegamerNHisDivineOrder is simply doing what people do EVERY generation of GPUs. The wail and gnash their teeth at how GPUs are too expensive and how they are TOTES going to buy a console instead. They were already thinking about moving to a console, and seed validation for their justifications on forums to help convince themselves, because they dont REALLY want to buy a console, if they did they would have done it already. In 4 years, he'll be here telling us why the RTX 6090 is SOO expensive, its making him want to go to consoles, and how AMD only bothers competing with the RTX 6070 and there's no hope for PC users.

Because lets be frank, consoles are a totally different animal. It's like growing up with macs then declaring you're gonna go to only android tablets. Consoles are locked down, with terrible software "sales" and the last few generations have had horrible user experiences. Just Cause 3's console port was not an outlier, it was an indicator of where we are going. Nobody who has spent decades running gaming PCs is going to go to a console just because "its expensive". PC gaming has ALWAYS been an expensive hobby, people just have very selective memories.

People are saying they're switching to consoles every generation, because some of them ARE switching to consoles, or Steam Decks, or just dropping games all together and finding a more enjoyable hobby. Instead of having any respect for someones dissatisfaction with the market and personal opinion people decide to pile on them with insults.

Consoles are completely different than PC gaming, but it is much more easily accessible than PC gaming and much cheaper to get into than a PC. Unfortunately building a PC at the same price as a console is gone and I don't expect it to ever come back thanks to gamers accepting increasing prices and continually finding excuses to defend their favorite company monopolizing the market abusing their consumers.

TheinsanegamerNNo, they wont. They're meatshielding their choice of GPU to make themselves feel validated in their choice.

It's popular to hate on Nvidia because they are so far ahead of the competition. AMD has relied on being the underdog for 15 years now, and since they now make billions that excuse just doesnt fly anymore. I'm surprised he had the self restraint to not call them "nGreedia". You can post margin graphs and financial statements that show the Geforce division is no more profitable per GPU now then they were 4 or 6 years ago, and it'll just get brushed off because that doesnt tell the story they want. You can say you want a new big AMD GPU and they'll rally to tell you all you want is a discounted nvidia flagship, even if youve bought only AMD for the last decade.

For whatever reason GPUs cause basic decorum to just fly out the window.

On the other hand people are meat shielding for team green to feel better about their confirmation bias.
It isn't hate to state the facts on what Nvidia is doing to the market and their users but if you the feel the need to call it hate, whatever if it makes you feel better.
It costs billions to design and produce GPU's, which AMD simply doesn't have to compete with Nvidia on the high end, then at the same time the Nvidia mindshare wants AMD to give away their GPU's at a 50% discount compared to the Nvidia card because they heard some Nvidia users say the drivers sucked 10 years ago.
I have yet to see proof that Nvidia is losing money on Geforce cards, the fact is Nvidia has shifted the product stack around since the RTX series, you don't get the die size and class of card you used to because Nvidia keeps cutting down the cards below the xx90 class to increase their margins while you pay more to get less.

Dr. DroIt's hilarious how Nvidia is absolutely evil for releasing a super halo graphics card with never before seen extreme specifications that make even its exceptionally well endowed predecessor look like a toy, but when AMD does something like that, releasing an extreme product based on technology they are actually equally masters at (and this is no crime!) it gets a pass, no, it actually gets praise. Hypocrisy, much?

Except the CPU market isn't remotely the same as the GPU market, AMD is delivering performance at a value Intel isn't, a ton of cores with better efficiency with more PCI-e lanes at a much lower cost than Intel.
Grabbing at straws much?

Garrusbecause 120fps is perfect for OLED, it is smooth and gives you a better than console experience, i play all my games at a locked 120fps on a 360hz monitor



The point of Strix Halo is to advertise the true cost of building a system.

Intel's new motherboards and CPUs are $300 each, the cheapest ones. That's $900 total for RTX 4060 plus Intel 245K + motherboard.

AMD literally has $900 USD to play with.

If I can have a mini ITX motherboard with a built in Strix Halo plus iGPU + 32GB of ram, I'll buy it for $900.

I have an OLED too, and have various different hz monitors... you don't need 120 FPS on OLED at all. 60 locked is just as smooth. Variable refresh works too. Lots of TV content is 50 FPS - perfect frametimes just the same. You're talking about a total and utter non issue, ergo a want, not a need. You even said it yourself, you're playing at 1/3rd the framerate the monitor can refresh elsewhere.

You've told yourself a marketing story, perfectly illustrating the point and the self-imposed problem. A problem that above all things is pretty much fixed because of VRR anyway. The only reason you say what you say is because you've placed your personal target for what is 'good' far above the mainstream, and into the 'mediaphile' territory.

Hecate91People are saying they're switching to consoles every generation, because some of them ARE switching to consoles, or Steam Decks, or just dropping games all together and finding a more enjoyable hobby. Instead of having any respect for someones dissatisfaction with the market and personal opinion people decide to pile on them with insults.

Consoles are completely different than PC gaming, but it is much more easily accessible than PC gaming and much cheaper to get into than a PC. Unfortunately building a PC at the same price as a console is gone and I don't expect it to ever come back thanks to gamers accepting increasing prices and continually finding excuses to defend their favorite company monopolizing the market abusing their consumers.

People are lying hypocrites and what people say does very often not reflect what people actually do. The proof is in the stats. The price and revenue of hardware keeps going up. And no, it doesn't matter jack shit what some randoms on forums say about their supposed (projected) preferences:



Consoles aren't growing at an alarming rate - but PC games noted the highest revenue growth in 2024, fighting over about a quarter of the market and growing faster than mobile (which is either an exception or a growing % of people getting into the advantages of PC gaming... which need no further explanation I reckon on TPU):



Also... building PC at the same time as console is gone? Why? Because the price for a console or a PC is higher now than before? Again, so much for perception and enter reality:

- You can build a gaming PC for 1000,- without any issue, just the same as you could a decade ago, and it will play games at good settings and FPS that way. Insert an x60~x70 class card, a midrange CPU and some storage and you're done no differently than you were back in the day.

- Consoles cost no more than they did back in the day. 450-500,-

I don't think much has changed honestly... people let themselves get mislead by perception and marketing fakery, but in the meantime almost everyone with some income owns a tablet or two, a phone, a TV, a laptop or PC, and one or more consoles. The growth of mobile gaming has NOT supplanted PC or console gaming, it just got added on top. We just got so used to all of that its considered for granted... but I remember old days where saving up (quite a while!) for a PC was a real thing you did, not unlike saving up for a console.

lepudrukIt's irrelevant, as long as you pay your own bills and can afford such luxuries. Money has little value in the afterlife, you know?

I agree, but that bold part, apparently is problematic for people who constantly complain about price. They want something they don't want to (ergo can't really) afford. There's something truly twisted about buying expensive monitors and then complaining the resolution and refresh rate can't be properly used because it requires a bigger hardware expense. In my world, that's short sighted stupidity, and nothing else. Irrelevant? Not really, because now you've got a hardware setup supposedly forcing you to overpay to get it running properly.

Its like buying a muscle car and then complaining about the poor fuel economy because gas prices have increased by 0,03 ct.

Hecate91People are saying they're switching to consoles every generation, because some of them ARE switching to consoles, or Steam Decks, or just dropping games all together and finding a more enjoyable hobby. Instead of having any respect for someones dissatisfaction with the market and personal opinion people decide to pile on them with insults.

Consoles are completely different than PC gaming, but it is much more easily accessible than PC gaming and much cheaper to get into than a PC. Unfortunately building a PC at the same price as a console is gone and I don't expect it to ever come back thanks to gamers accepting increasing prices and continually finding excuses to defend their favorite company monopolizing the market abusing their consumers.

Personally I just prefer having an older-gen console along with PC because why not. Still no hurry for getting a PS5 though as I'm not going to upgrade my 1080p60 TV soon. A XSX could be a thing though.

DahitaAgain, you talk about "the consumer" like you're not one of them. You've got a better solution? Please, please tell me how to upgrade a video card with a solid high-end card for the next three to four year. I thank you in advance for enlightening us poor silly "consumers".

I am talking about the market as a whole ( summation of whales and poors for the simple minded) . Unless you have not been paying attention mostly everyone is talking shyte about 16 gigs of vram and the inflated pricing. How do we know it will not sell well north of $1199? We can extrapolate the 4080 data and 4080 super. The market rejected the 4080 at $1199 and was okay with the 4080 super at $999 and sometimes at $949.
The 4090 performance for $1599 in 2022 was great but in 2025 the same performance with less vram for $1500 is just highway robbery. It has nothing to do with poors in which by the way are desperate for decent hardware based on the B580 initial wave results sold out instantly.
Mark my words if the 5080 at 16 gigs of vram even if it comes close to the 4090 performance north of $1199 will just collect dust.
So what's your fetish with rumors now?

JustBenchingThe more I read about sheep, ngreedia and burning connectors the more it makes me want to buy nvidia. I kid you not, wasn't even interested in the 5090, and then I read a bunch of comments on the thread and im like "im buying it". Honest to god, amd's fans are the best marketing for nvidia. They make you hate amd and love nvidia instead.

Because what AMD has is a cult ... and yes there's a difference between fanboys and cultist.

freeagentHere on Amazon they range from 3400CAD to 7000CAD.

Doesn't seem like a good deal to me :confused:

But don't you save the tax right now?? ;)

Dr. DroI wonder if anyone here realizes that labeling people as "sheep" for adopting popular choices tends to ensure they won't be dissuaded, instead of being "punk" and embracing the alternative...

Polite words will not help either. RTX 4060 Ti 16GB, RTX 4070 Vanilla, RTX 4070 Ti Vanilla all these weak gpus are selling like a hot cakes when they were released really poor value for what you get. AMD RX 7700 XT, RX 7800 XT, RX 7900 XT was clearly a better deal than nvidias alternatives at the time but still for some reason there are many times more nvidia buyers even if performance per dollar is not so great. My point is these people even at higher prices probably still will buy nvidia gpus over amd alternatives that applies to new gen RTX 50 Series. Over time it gets worse and worse not any better lets say if amd is about 20% faster overall for the same price does it means that AMD will sell more than nvidia ? No it will not! At this stage it doesn't even matter how good or stable drivers are that's how deluded people are.

Dr. DroIt's hilarious how Nvidia is absolutely evil for releasing a super halo graphics card with never before seen extreme specifications that make even its exceptionally well endowed predecessor look like a toy, but when AMD does something like that, releasing an extreme product based on technology they are actually equally masters at (and this is no crime!) it gets a pass, no, it actually gets praise. Hypocrisy, much?

Why does one have to imply another? People are upset at prices that more than doubled over the last 5 years for high end graphic cards. Why are you so salty about common sense? It had nothing to do with being a "fan" of either brands. Relax.

Prices going from "No way I'm paying that much" all the way to "No fucking way I'm paying that much".

In the end the difference tends to be more academic than anything for the rest of us.

Guess the one place it will really hurt is the used market, as older cards get stuck at stubbornly high resale prices because the new stuff just doesn't move the performance to price needle as much as we'd like.

DahitaWhy does one have to imply another? People are upset at prices that more than doubled over the last 5 years for high end graphic cards. Why are you so salty about common sense? It had nothing to do with being a "fan" of either brands. Relax.

Ah yes I'm salty for pointing out the sheer hypocrisy. CPU company (at least the one you like, otherwise it's an Emergency Edition or a Scam Edition, Intel Inside, Idiot Outside after all) releases a high end CPU: Yayy!

GPU company releases high end GPU: Reeeeeee!

Hecate91Except the CPU market isn't remotely the same as the GPU market, AMD is delivering performance at a value Intel isn't, a ton of cores with better efficiency with more PCI-e lanes at a much lower cost than Intel.
Grabbing at straws much?

Have you even tried following your own thought process. An RTX 5090 hyper GPU has just as much value to its target audience as a Threadripper has to its own target audience.

Dr. DroAh yes I'm salty for pointing out the sheer hypocrisy. CPU company (at least the one you like, otherwise it's an Emergency Edition or a Scam Edition, Intel Inside, Idiot Outside after all) releases a high end CPU: Yayy!

GPU company releases high end GPU: Reeeeeee!



Have you even tried following your own thought process. An RTX 5090 hyper GPU has just as much value to its target audience as a Threadripper has to its own target audience.

You are not understanding (or choose not to) what I'm saying. Leave AMD out of the picture for once second, if you can.
The 3090 came out at $1,499 MSRP in 2020.
This rumor says the $5090 MSRP will be $2600 four years later.

That's an increase of 73%. in 4 years (and 4 months).

Do you not understand people being upset at the rumored price hike?

Dr. DroIt's hilarious how Nvidia is absolutely evil for releasing a super halo graphics card with never before seen extreme specifications that make even its exceptionally well endowed predecessor look like a toy, but when AMD does something like that, releasing an extreme product based on technology they are actually equally masters at (and this is no crime!) it gets a pass, no, it actually gets praise. Hypocrisy, much?



It gets better!

www.techpowerup.com/cpu-specs/xeon-platinum-8593q.c3416

I know you love gagging on Intel but this is the closest offering Intel makes, for $12,400.00 merely 3X the price sir.....

DahitaYou are not understanding (or choose not to) what I'm saying. Leave AMD out of the picture for once second, if you can.
The 3090 came out at $1,499 MSRP in 2020.
This rumor says the $5090 MSRP will be $2600 four years later.

That's an increase of 73%. in 4 years (and 4 months).

Do you not understand people being upset at the rumored price hike?

Again, the Threadripper is the perfect analogy: 1950X (August 2017) started with a $999 MSRP. The 2990WX (2018) was $1799. The 3990X (2020) was $3990. 300% markup in 3 years so far. The Zen 3 model was canceled so they could sell them as $10K EPYC chips instead. And now the 7980X is $4999 MSRP. AMD has been doubling TR prices gen on gen just because they can. 500% increase in flagship MSRP in 7 years.

Titan X Pascal (2016 halo) was $1200. Assuming the RTX 5090 releases at $2499, this is a 208% markup over 8 years. $2499 is a likely scenario, but it could also be $1999 (the same price point they pitched the 3090 Ti at), in which case, the markup would be only 166.6%.

Guess which one is being vilified for "extorting" their customers. Turns out, this is a surgical assessment of the situation:

TheinsanegamerNNo, they wont. They're meatshielding their choice of GPU to make themselves feel validated in their choice.

It's popular to hate on Nvidia because they are so far ahead of the competition. AMD has relied on being the underdog for 15 years now, and since they now make billions that excuse just doesnt fly anymore. I'm surprised he had the self restraint to not call them "nGreedia". You can post margin graphs and financial statements that show the Geforce division is no more profitable per GPU now then they were 4 or 6 years ago, and it'll just get brushed off because that doesnt tell the story they want. You can say you want a new big AMD GPU and they'll rally to tell you all you want is a discounted nvidia flagship, even if youve bought only AMD for the last decade.

For whatever reason GPUs cause basic decorum to just fly out the window.

Steevowww.techpowerup.com/cpu-specs/xeon-platinum-8593q.c3416

I know you love gagging on Intel but this is the closest offering Intel makes, for $12,400.00 merely 3X the price sir.....

www.techpowerup.com/cpu-specs/epyc-9965.c3904

Bargain, the EPYC 9965 is $14813 :nutkick:

This is enterprise hardware, another pricing realm altogether. The non-Pro Threadripper is a consumer product in the same vein a RTX 5090 is a consumer product. It caters to the segment of if you need to ask it's not for you etc.

DahitaYou are not understanding (or choose not to) what I'm saying. Leave AMD out of the picture for once second, if you can.
The 3090 came out at $1,499 MSRP in 2020.
This rumor says the $5090 MSRP will be $2600 four years later.

That's an increase of 73%. in 4 years (and 4 months).

Do you not understand people being upset at the rumored price hike?

64cores VS 64 faster cores, AMD is 1/3 the price and faster.

192 cores VS 64 cores and AMD is still $116 cheaper per core.

Total platform ownership there is no comparison which is why AMD is killing Intel in CPU space. This thread is about GPU's and HALO products that few will actually own/buy.