Neo_MorpheusI have the weird suspicion that we might need another PowerVR moment where the industry find another “work smarter, not harder “ way, especially with RT.

Neo_MorpheusI have the weird suspicion that we might need another PowerVR moment where the industry find another “work smarter, not harder “ way, especially with RT.

Chrispy_"old games" includes titles like CP2077, God of War Ragnarok, Horizon Forbidden West, Elden Ring (with RT), Ratchet and Clank, Jedi Fallen Order - these are all old titles (up to 6 years old) that will cause a 4070 to stumble at 4K, and fail to qualify as "high-refresh" in 1440p.

Chrispy_We have very little info on the 9060 models yet, but presumably they'll outsell the 9070 models and need FSR4 even more.

AusWolfThe 4070 isn't a 4K card

Hecate91It seems like Nvidia doesn't want to take a hit on profit margins to allocate larger dies, or doesn't want to spend the R&D on creating a chiplet architecture for their consumer gpu's. I said it in a another thread if AMD can make a chiplet for consumers then Nvidia definitely can, its significantly done for cost reasons but allows more for efficient use of die space, if Nvidia wants to keep their profit margins astronomically high then they need to implement a chiplet architecture to increase raster performance, instead of resorting to graphics trickery with fake frames.

Chrispy_"old games" includes titles like CP2077, God of War Ragnarok, Horizon Forbidden West, Elden Ring, Ratchet and Clank, Jedi Fallen Order - these are all old titles (up to 6 years old) that will cause a 4070 to stumble at 4K, and fail to qualify as "high-refresh" in 1440p.

Vayra86This was obvious to me from the onset. Already we saw tweaks to reduce the amount of actual calculating being done. We're already moving further and further away from truly accurate RT, but rather use singular rays to 'determine' what else needs to happen. It all looks brutally inefficient nonetheless, with PT being the king of the castle of waste.

Neo_MorpheusI have the weird suspicion that we might need another PowerVR moment where the industry find another “work smarter, not harder “ way, especially with RT.

JustBenchingWhy are people in here so salty because other people aren't buying the brand they want them to buy? The last few weeks I've been reading the same stuff over and over and over again. Sheep buy Nvidia because stores tell them not to buy amd and whatever other excuse you guys are coming up with.

Let's for once have a decent amd card and then we can look at the sales. I'm pretty confident they will be good.

Vayra86Last I heard Cyberpunk got a long overdue FSR update but its still not great and people on TPU wondered what had changed at all.


Read this just now.. but... that's very simple, Nvidia shows us how that works right? They introduce features that will make games run like you bought a low - end card (create problem) and then they introduce features that fix that performance and still allow you to use the performance hogging features and feel like you didn't actually buy something underspecced for the features on offer.

And the kicker is, Nvidia isn't wrong because they pull this forward and innovate on it. Because they lead, they get to dictate how the paradigm works. AMD never takes that risk/chance, and a big reason they do not do this is because they feel they can't = lack of relevant competence in the company.

Hecate91Because people are tired of the same people always going "but nvidia" in every AMD thread, or the same stuff over again saying AMD is screwed. And yes people do buy Nvidia because a store tells them to, or friends tell them to buy nvidia because they heard the outdated claim of the drivers being bad.

Vayra86Last I heard Cyberpunk got a long overdue FSR update but its still not great and people on TPU wondered what had changed at all.

Hecate91Because people are tired of the same people always going "but nvidia" in every AMD thread, or the same stuff over again saying AMD is screwed. And yes people do buy Nvidia because a store tells them to, or friends tell them to buy nvidia because they heard the outdated claim of the drivers being bad.

If the cards are good, we can wait and see, I don't see the need for a bunch of threads spreading FUD about launch when AMD never said the launch would be right after CES.

Hecate91I'm not surprised, because Cyberpunk is essentially an Nvidia tech demo game. CDPR put little effort into actually implementing good FSR like most AAA devs because it's easier to add DLSS when Nvidia hands companies piles of money to implement the feature first.

Hecate91As for marketing features, I agree AMD sucks horribly at it, they really could've made sure features worked right before launch and put some ambition behind making sure consumers know about the feature, and I think AMD should be spreading more awareness on their features which aren't locked down to their brand.

TheinsanegamerNMy favorite thing to see repeated ad nauseum is 'well well well people just buy nvidia because they are dumb poopy heads and cant see AMD is clearly better, its just mindshare bro, AMD just needs marketing bro".

Like, the concept that people want consistent support, better RT, and better upscaling so they buy nvidia is just a totally lost concept, no the consumer just buys what they are told, they have no free will!


So....... game devs use DLSS and ignore FSR because nGREEDia pays them, and at the same time AMD's features suck? Surely their focus on DLSS has NOTHING to do with AMD's features sucking. Hmmm......

remekraThat is what we could argue nvidia is doing now. Working smarter, rather than harder. Upscale with AI with minimal loss of detail, generate a frame or two instead of rendering it and also use ReSTIR for GI and DI.
People like to say that Path Tracing performance is shit, without even considering that real time Path Tracing was a pipe dream 4-5 years ago, it took minutes to render one frame. And with ReSTIR is also working smarter because you don't need to take into account every sample. And it completely removes any trickery when it comes to lighting the game. You place whatever light you like, wherever you want and you have GI, DI in real time.

JustBenchingIf we assume RT /PT is the target then Upscalers are absolutely needed (and probably so is FG). Even if we get 100% gen on gen improvements that's not enough to keep up with RT demands. Im not sure people understand how insanely taxing RT.

If RT / PT isn't the target then what is? Graphics have pretty much stagnated the traditional way, RDR2 back in 2018 was already good enough, why would anyone really care about gpus anymore?

Vayra86I've always been convinced the RT push is a gamble. There is no conclusion yet whether it'll be here to stay, especially in its current form. PT is also an innovation. Is it one in the right direction? We don't know.

freeagentIt isn't, but it can still play a good chunk of games at 4K.

AusWolfI don't disagree, but selling one's sympathy for DLSS as a "must-have feature" rather than a personal opinion is a bit daft, especially when 45% of people on a front page poll say they don't use any upscaling.

Chrispy_Just frame-gen really. FSR3 with framegen was still pretty smeary, but so is DLSS in CP2077, so it's hardly an AMD-only problem.

Chrispy_I also fall into the "would rather not use DLSS unless I have to" but sometimes the display resolution outpaces the hardware power available, and sometimes the game isn't optimised very well so you have to do something to get the framerate up to acceptable speeds.

Vayra86've always been convinced the RT push is a gamble. There is no conclusion yet whether it'll be here to stay, especially in its current form.

Neo_MorpheusAgreed.

TheinsanegamerNMy favorite thing to see repeated ad nauseum is 'well well well people just buy nvidia because they are dumb poopy heads and cant see AMD is clearly better, its just mindshare bro, AMD just needs marketing bro".

Like, the concept that people want consistent support, better RT, and better upscaling, and AMD is generally worse at these things so they buy nvidia is just a totally lost concept; no the consumer just buys what they are told, they have no free will!

TheinsanegamerNSo....... game devs use DLSS and ignore FSR because nGREEDia pays them

Hecate91Exactly, and everyone whined when FSR got added to a game first, but there was nothing when Indiana Jones only had DLSS.

Neo_MorpheusI have the weird suspicion that we might need another PowerVR moment where the industry find another “work smarter, not harder “ way, especially with RT.

Vayra86I've always been convinced the RT push is a gamble. There is no conclusion yet whether it'll be here to stay, especially in its current form. PT is also an innovation. Is it one in the right direction? We don't know.