Yet another reason why I hate Apple, iOS and that I will never buy an iPhone again (loving my OnePlus 5, but the camera sucks not gonna lie).

What else You expect from egoistic Apple? Oranges?
They suck and so does their stupid policies.

The only way this can be stopped, is if the devs stop feeding the rotten apple ecosystem (sacrificing the iOS auditory, but staying free from censorship and bad business practices).
Let them be empty, like Tizen, or filled with garbageware, like MS store.

apple is and always will be the edge lord of the tech industry. I swear they always do stupid shit like this just to stay in the headlines and frankly i find it annoying, there should be an option on tpu to filter out anything that has the word "apple" attached to it.

Oh yes Apple because any lan remote app can recognize a steam controller and other devices right?
FFFFFFFFFFFF so irresponsible.

Isn't whining about Apple's ecosystem being a walled garden a bit redundant?

People are an interesting bunch on their own, though. Windows adds an app store, nobody wants it. Apple adds an app store (with no possibility to bypass it), people flock to iOS. Just try to come up with a business model for these cases.

bugIsn't whining about Apple's ecosystem being a walled garden a bit redundant?

People are an interesting bunch on their own, though. Windows adds an app store, nobody wants it. Apple adds an app store (with no possibility to bypass it), people flock to iOS. Just try to come up with a business model for these cases.

Its the EXPERIENCE man, the experience! Using Apple products front to back is making our lives so much better. Apple fans get up out of bed as better humans.

Not really though. I have an Iphone SE now and almost daily do I come across some 'feature' that is objectively crap, badly designed, unintuitive or what not. However people ever said this was the polar opposite I just cannot understand.

Most recent example: Set an alarm, I wanted to lower the alert volume so I go into 'edit', select a tune and press the volume button down to lower the volume. Iphone won't have it. Volume cannot be adapted. So every morning I wake up with a way too loud alert noise. So much for comfort. On Android? You do it the easy way. Pick sound, set volume through an easy to find slider or just adapt volume on the fly by using the volume button on the spot (not just for alarms but also for video and ringer etc.)...

Seriously. Apple fans who speak of the better experience... I can now objectively state they are blind and deluded. I could give half a dozen other examples of evidently worse design on the Iphone than it was on Android two years back... let alone today.

You're not in their target segment, that's why you do see things the same way.

A non tech savvy user can both be mesmerized by things that appear to magically work and completely oblivious to the fact their device may have missing features or is making them jump through unnecessary hoops. And if you only know one platform, that makes it even harder to be able to assess it correctly.

As for the alarm, I've been using a progressive ringtone for years. Initially through a 3rd party alarm clock, but eventually the default clock also picked up the feature.

I would be curious to hear Apple's specific explanation for the denial, since the reason listed was a bit vague (even it's likely related to the Apple not liking the ability to use Steam controllers). Maybe there is a legit security concern in there.

As for the Apple hate, although a big part of their model is ease of use, there are still many highly techie people that like and use Apple. At least in my case I used various Android phones for many years and finally got tired of all of the issues and bloatware. In the end the #1 requirement for a smartphone to me is for it to work when I need it to. Being a techie actually increases the importance of that if anything. Just because we have the knowledge to load different firmware versions, troubleshoot apps, root/bootload, etc. etc. doesn't mean we want to spend our time doing it just to morph a phone into something semi-reliable. My experience has been that Apple has done significantly better in that regard.

silentbogoThe only way this can be stopped, is if the devs stop feeding the rotten apple ecosystem (sacrificing the iOS auditory, but staying free from censorship and bad business practices).
Let them be empty, like Tizen, or filled with garbageware, like MS store.

That is a good point.

Although in this case it might not be the best example. I say this because I believe Samsung has a Steam Link app available for their Smart TVs running Tizen and has for a long time.

I get your point though,....

dozenfuryI would be curious to hear Apple's specific explanation for the denial, since the reason listed was a bit vague (even it's likely related to the Apple not liking the ability to use Steam controllers). Maybe there is a legit security concern in there.

It would let you buy games from something else than the app store, denying Apple's 30% cut.

OctaveanAlthough in this case it might not be the best example. I say this because I believe Samsung has a Steam Link app available for their Smart TVs running Tizen and has for a long time.

Well, I think I went too harsh on Tizen OS and Samsung. They've even changed their policies few years back from highly restrictive to more liberal (similar to Android), and encouraged devs to develop for their platform by constantly running contests and giving out rewards for high quality software. Many restrictions were also lifted, while curation was still on a good level (not as many crappy apps and buggy ports). But that was mostly a consequence of them failing to become the new Apple, while using the business model of Google.

If they don't change their minds... Valve should publish a jailbreaking guide to allow people to use their phones as they see fit.

It really amazes me how Apple has all this money with the shit they put out there for consumer use.

Dave65It really amazes me how Apple has all this money with the shit they put out there for consumer use.

They cater to non techies first. And a lot more people are non techies out there than there are techies. Though that's not the only explanation.

Apple always did whatever they wanted with the store. If they don't like something about you bad luck your product won't make it into the store.

bugThey cater to non techies first. And a lot more people are non techies out there than there are techies. Though that's not the only explanation.

Oh come on, this app is easy to use as 1, 2, 3. And once valve figure their way to pair ds4 controllers easily like in pc you won't need to spend money on an android controller. Must be something about pushing Apple TV.

Believe it or not, I am an iPhone user but I'm also a self-professed geek as well. Astounding, I know.

I build my own systems, I tweak my own systems, I've even done some overclocking, I've written programming code, etc. Yep, I have my geek card in my wallet. But you know what? I also own an iPhone. Why? Because when it comes down to it I want a phone that I can depend upon. I want to know that when I need it to work, it will work.

I also like the whole concept that if I have a hardware problem with my iPhone I can simply walk into an Apple Store and within half an hour I'm walking out with a new device in hand. My brother has an iPhone as well and something happened to his iPhone while he was on a military exercise; somehow a rather large rock landed on it and smashed the shit out of it. He walked into the Apple Store, said that he had Apple Care Plus on it, paid the deductible, and within half an hour he had a new device in hand. I like knowing that if something does happen all I need to do is take a trip to my local Apple Store and I walk out happy.

As far as Android is concerned I will never touch Google's data collection Trojan horse. Yes, that's right... I called it a Trojan horse. Let's build an OS, build an ecosystem of apps and services that (naturally) people will want, give it away for free, and then sit back and watch as all of that juicy personal data comes rolling in. Not only that but you carry it with you everywhere you go, it's the perfect little wiretap and people voluntarily buy them. I will never use an Android device again, at least not until Google starts caring about our privacy and not just playing lip service to try and placate the masses.

trparkyBelieve it or not, I am an iPhone user but I'm also a self-professed geek as well. Astounding, I know.

I build my own systems, I tweak my own systems, I've even done some overclocking, I've written programming code, etc. Yep, I have my geek card in my wallet. But you know what? I also own an iPhone. Why? Because when it comes down to it I want a phone that I can depend upon. I want to know that when I need it to work, it will work.

I also like the whole concept that if I have a hardware problem with my iPhone I can simply walk into an Apple Store and within half an hour I'm walking out with a new device in hand. My brother has an iPhone as well and something happened to his iPhone while he was on a military exercise; somehow a rather large rock landed on it and smashed the shit out of it. He walked into the Apple Store, said that he had Apple Care Plus on it, paid the deductible, and within half an hour he had a new device in hand. I like knowing that if something does happen all I need to do is take a trip to my local Apple Store and I walk out happy.

As far as Android is concerned I will never touch Google's data collection Trojan horse. Yes, that's right... I called it a Trojan horse. Let's build an OS, build an ecosystem of apps and services that (naturally) people will want, give it away for free, and then sit back and watch as all of that juicy personal data comes rolling in. Not only that but you carry it with you everywhere you go, it's the perfect little wiretap and people voluntarily buy them. I will never use an Android device again, at least not until Google starts caring about our privacy and not just playing lip service to try and placate the masses.

So Apple doesn't do this as well? Everyone does it and if it's not one of them it's the apps you install on the phones that will. Since when is one company (apple) better then a community of companies (android, Sam, LG, etc etc) I look at consoles with crossplay. Should have been done years ago, still Sony doesn't do it with microsoft. Wtf walled garden shit

silentbogoor filled with garbageware, like MS store.

To be fair, GooglePlay has it's fair share of garbage too.

trparkyI also own an iPhone. Why? Because when it comes down to it I want a phone that I can depend upon.

Till your battery runs down and dies. Apple's devices don't have user replaceable batteries. That is frequent problem. Then there is the problem of Apple deliberately running the devices slower as the battery ages. Unacceptable.

trparkyLet's build an OS, build an ecosystem of apps and services that (naturally) people will want, give it away for free, and then sit back and watch as all of that juicy personal data comes rolling in. Not only that but you carry it with you everywhere you go, it's the perfect little wiretap and people voluntarily buy them.

Except that you can turn all that crap off, or at the least severely limit it.

lexluthermiesterApple's devices don't have user replaceable batteries.

So do a lot of Android devices, namely Samsung devices. Non-removeable batteries aren't just an "Apple Thing" but has become part of the Android ecosystem as well.

lexluthermiesterExcept that you can turn all that crap off, or at the least severely limit it.

Yes, unless of course you get yourself a carrier branded device (like most people do) for those devices are locked down as well. Samsung devices are especially so, what with Samsung Knox, eFuses, and locked bootloaders that many carrier branded devices come with.

trparkySo do a lot of Android devices, namely Samsung devices. Non-removeable batteries aren't just an "Apple Thing" but has become part of the Android ecosystem as well.

You're totally right on that one. And it's as big a problem with those devices too. However with Android you at least have choices and options. With Apple you do not.

trparkyYes, unless of course you get yourself a carrier branded device (like most people do) for those devices are locked down as well.

With carrier devices, many of those the unwanted apps can be disabled and don't run. Additionally, a firewall that does not require root can be installed to allow only trusted apps access to the net, effectively cutting everything else off. The Apple store has no such firewall app. Apple will not allow it. A company that requires you to blindly trust them and does not allow for options to use your own security methods is completely untrustworthy. Unacceptable.

We're a bit off-topic.. Back to your regularly scheduled discussion.

trparkyI also like the whole concept that if I have a hardware problem with my iPhone I can simply walk into an Apple Store and within half an hour I'm walking out with a new device in hand. My brother has an iPhone as well and something happened to his iPhone while he was on a military exercise; somehow a rather large rock landed on it and smashed the shit out of it. He walked into the Apple Store, said that he had Apple Care Plus on it, paid the deductible, and within half an hour he had a new device in hand. I like knowing that if something does happen all I need to do is take a trip to my local Apple Store and I walk out happy.

Yes, who would think that emptying your wallet would make it easy to get a brand new phone?

Only Apple could think of that. Steve Jobs, still inspiring people.

lexluthermiester…. Then there is the problem of Apple deliberately running the devices slower as the battery ages. Unacceptable.

There's also their admission they deliberately slowed older devices down also, but not altogether off topic, as we are discussing Apple's business practises.

I hate to derail too much, but I'd be happy with the MS Store if it basically became the Xbox store on PC. Giving Steam and GOG a run for their money. As it is, the options aren't there. With the Xbox slowly dwindling and they themselves having the PC market in their grasp because of Windows, I do not understand why they don't capitalize on it. I think PC gaming's time has finally come (again). And they'd get even more people if things simply worked as simply as they do as the Microsoft store (I mean, it's simple to install Forza/Cuphead/etc and work as easily as any console game. If that was for every game with as many options as GOG, they'd have a winner).