BwazeNot to gamers they don't. Unless you live in a very wealthy part of the world. As far as I know RTX 4090 were starting to dissappear from the overstocked warehouses right about when USA started limiting what China could import as their AI accelerators. Coincidence, I'm sure.

4090 is at spot 31 on Steam Hardware Survey, beating every single Radeon 6000 and 7000 GPU

4090 sold 3 times better than 6800XT from 2020, which have been dirt cheap on many occations

I know 3 people IRL that only play games using a 4090, for many people, the price is not that crazy for what you actually get. 4090 is the only true 4K/UHD+ capable GPU today.

las4090 is at spot 31 on Steam Hardware Survey, beating every single Radeon 6000 and 7000 GPU

At 0.87%. As relevant as are Bentleys on the street.

BwazeAt 0.87%. As relevant as are Bentleys on the street.

But if you go to the wealthy area of a city i'm sure you see plenty of Bentleys!
A 4090 is something only people who think a few grand is pocket change are buying. Most gamers aren't buying expensive nvidia cards, the super cards seem to be nvidia wanting to sell more of the 4070Ti and 4080 as those weren't a good value.

It does not matter. I'm pretty sure there wasn't a sudden influx of wealth to gamers so they all rushed to buy RTX 4090's, a year after it was released - before that there were tonns in warehouses, and in EU there still are.

las4090 sells like hotcakes really, which is why price went up, so this does not affect all "gaming" cards, even tho 4090 is kind of a hybrid here

It doesn't, the price went up because Nvidia likely sent most of their 4090 cards to China before the export ban.
The steam hardware survey is not the most precise of surveys, maybe I would trust it if it were polling every steam user, and I'm sure Steam is polling a lot of gaming cafes which use Nvidia cards.

lasGamers can be thankful that the lower tier GPUs are not interresting for AI or you would see the same thing happen as back during the mining craze. 90-95% of PC gamers buy in the sub 1000 dollar segment anyway.

The lower tiers aren't interesting at all, and are overpriced like the 4060 and 4060Ti for example which should've been the 4050 and 4050Ti because of bandwidth and VRAM.
The top GPU's in the steam hardware survey as of December 2023 are the RTX 3060 and GTX 1650, cards selling for less than $300.

lasEVGA stopped making GPUs because they became worse and worse over the years, their designs in general were lacking in the last years they were active in the GPU market, with several issues on both vrm, pcb and design in general, they were not really selling alot of cards and could not afford to stay competitive, so they pulled the plug and focussed on other areas. EVGA is not doing well right now. I would not be surprised if the company is sold or closes down in a few years. Selling OEM PSUs and cheap stuff like mice and keyboards is not going to work well. Their mice and keyboards are not even great and their PSUs also dropped in quality since their entry in this market with the first Super Flower designs.

Stop selling GPUs was the first nail in the coffin for EVGA most likely. I don't see them survive long without it. It was what they became known for.

AIBs earn tons of money right now. I know for sure since i work with B2B in the hardware sector. Numbers right now are climbing not dropping and they will go up way more in 24 and 25.

Your claims go against what reputable tech reviewers like Gamers Nexus have said. EVGA stopped making GPUs because the margins in designing a cooler,board, marketing, and the top notch support EVGA had just isn't profitable anymore.



Nvidia can just come up with a card design and undercut what AIB can sell theirs for and still make their massive profit margins. Nvidia being anti-competitive with their own AIB's, the crappy 12VHPWR connector, and cracking PCB's on the 4080 and 4090 because the coolers AIB's have to use are too massive and it isn't a surprise that EVGA left the GPU market.
You must be working for Nvidia if you believe they didn't push EVGA out of the graphics card market.

BwazeAt 0.87%. As relevant as are Bentleys on the street.

7900 XTX is at 0.32%

7900XT, 7800XT, 7700XT is not even on the top 100 list.

Are these relevant then? :laugh:

AMDs most popular dGPU is RX580 from 2017 at 0.93% - at spot 29

Nvidia owns the top 10 and have done for years. Top 10 stands for 35% of GPUs listed and Nvidia pretty much dominate top 20 and top 30 as well. Around 75% GPU marketshare and this is even with iGPUs thrown into the mix. If you remove iGPU from both Intel and AMD, Nvidia probably sits at 85-90% dGPU marketshare on Steam.

But sure, you can keep acting like AMD is going well in the dGPU sector, not that I care much. I know the numbers behind since I work in the B2B business in Europe. Nvidia ships tons of dGPUs compared to AMD. AMD mostly ships CPUs, which is also what they do best.

las7900 XTX is at 0.32%

7900XT, 7800XT, 7700XT is not even on the top 100 list.

Are these relevant then? :laugh:

AMDs most popular dGPU is RX580 from 2017 at 0.93%

Nvidia owns the top 10 and have done for years, the top 10 stands for 35% of GPUs listed and Nvidia pretty much dominate top20, top30 as well

RX580 is at spot 29

Never said they are. AMD has much smaller market share, even if you count everything, I have no idea what you're trying to prove.

BwazeNever said they are. AMD has much smaller market share, even if you count everything, I have no idea what you're trying to prove.

I am trying to prove that even the worst priced Nvidia GPUs outsells everything from AMD with ease, meaning AMD has serious issues in this market. Yet alot of users on this forum act like AMD is doing well in terms of GPUs, which is laughable really. Nvidia dominates completely in both gaming, enterprise and AI.

Lets hope AMD can regain marketshare with Radeon 8000 series and deliver something great in the enterprise and AI market as well. This is where the big money are.

But lets not forget that AMD is mainly making CPUs and APUs. This is their prime business. Not GPUs, even tho AMD GPU users likes to think that.

las4090 sells like hotcakes really, which is why price went up, so this does not affect all "gaming" cards, even tho 4090 is kind of a hybrid here

Gamers can be thankful that the lower tier GPUs are not interresting for AI or you would see the same thing happen as back during the mining craze. 90-95% of PC gamers buy in the sub 1000 dollar segment anyway.

EVGA stopped making GPUs because they became worse and worse over the years, their designs in general were lacking in the last years they were active in the GPU market, with several issues on both vrm, pcb and design in general, they were not really selling alot of cards and could not afford to stay competitive, so they pulled the plug and focussed on other areas. EVGA is not doing well right now. I would not be surprised if the company is sold or closes down in a few years. Selling OEM PSUs and cheap stuff like mice and keyboards is not going to work well. Their mice and keyboards are not even great and their PSUs also dropped in quality since their entry in this market with the first Super Flower designs.

Stop selling GPUs was the first nail in the coffin for EVGA most likely. I don't see them survive long without it. It was what they became known for.

AIBs earn tons of money right now. I know for sure since i work with B2B in the hardware sector. Numbers right now are climbing not dropping and they will go up way more in 24 and 25.


Intel have been building fabs for years to regain lead. Pat Gelsinger is turning Intel around as fast as he can.

Intel 4 this year (Meteor Lake), Intel 20A in Q4 (Arrow Lake) and then 18A next year.

TSMC hit a wall as well and it struggling to go lower than 3nm right now (Which Apple has priority on).

However, Apple wants chip production outside of Asia only, which is why they forced TSMC to build more fabs outside of Asia.

Apple would jump to Intel for sure when Intel regain lead. Both are US companies.

It makes perfect sense if you read news and officials statements in the last few years. Intel has always came back eventually.

Also, TSMC has been pushing up prices as well. They will be forced to cut prices when Intel regains lead, or atleast get to same processes

This is extremely optimistic rhetoric, I doubt even the CEO is so positive. Moving factories from Taiwan to the US tends to increase prices, not decrease them. In addition to the lack of adequate labor, employees want to earn more and work less. The only reason for the movement is more of a political issue than one of optimizing the logistics chain.

Given Intel's incredibly long list of consecutive failures, I tend to have serious doubts about its ability to compete with TSMC, it doesn't even make sense in fact if TSMC employees work harder.

To be honest, my hope is that Samsung will get a decent enough process to gain the attention of AMD and Nvidia, and win contracts to manufacture mid-end GPUs and below, perhaps with the pressure that demand for AI chips is putting on. at TSMC this scenario will appear soon.

lasI am trying to prove that even the worst priced Nvidia GPUs outsells everything from AMD with ease, meaning AMD has serious issues in this market.

And how thas that help the situation where the cheapest cards (from any vendor) cost more than the most expensive gaming consoles, and on the other hand the most expensive cards for 2000 EUR don't achieve comfortable 60 Hz in some games at 4K, even before turning ray tracing on?

DenverThis is extremely optimistic rhetoric, I doubt even the CEO is so positive. Moving factories from Taiwan to the US tends to increase prices, not decrease them. In addition to the lack of adequate labor, employees want to earn more and work less. The only reason for the movement is more of a political issue than one of optimizing the logistics chain.

Given Intel's incredibly long list of consecutive failures, I tend to have serious doubts about its ability to compete with TSMC, it doesn't even make sense in fact if TSMC employees work harder.

To be honest, my hope is that Samsung will get a decent enough process to gain the attention of AMD and Nvidia, and win contracts to manufacture mid-end GPUs and below, perhaps with the pressure that demand for AI chips is putting on. at TSMC this scenario will appear soon.

Nvidia could easily use Samsung right now, and still win. They did last gen with great succes. They still produce 3000 chips at Samsung as we speak. 3000 series still sell, mainly the 3060 and 3070 series. AMD however, would not be able to compete using a subpar proces and forced to use TSMCs best.

Intel pretty much followed their 4 fabs in 5 years roadmap so far. Pat Gelsinger is turning Intel around as fast as possible. Intel regaining CPU marketshare and did for long.

If Intel is able to launch 20A this year, then they only need 18A in 2025 and TSMC will be behind, because they struggle hard with reaching 2nm and will be stuck at 3nm till 2025 probably.

BwazeAnd how thas that help the situation where the cheapest cards (from any vendor) cost more than the most expensive gaming consoles, and on the other hand the most expensive cards for 2000 EUR don't achieve comfortable 60 Hz in some games at 4K, even before turning ray tracing on?

My 4090 can very easily get 60 fps in pretty much any game with raster. In 99% of games breaking 100 fps is easy as well, on maximum settings without RT/PT.

A console is just a locked down piece of hardware using a locked ecosystem that will milk you dry over time. I own a PS5. Nothing impressive about the hardware and you are paying big time for multiplayer, cloud saves, games (sony and ms needs a big cut which adds to the price) and accessories. Most heavy users will probably also need to buy a new console at some point because its dying.

A console will never be a PC. I can play 10.000+ games on PC, mod games, get free games, mod games to my liking, free multiplayer and I could go on.

AMD is not the winner in the console market anyway. Microsoft and Sony are.

I bet Nvidia earned alot more on Switch than AMD earned on PS5 and XSX and Switch 2 is coming soon, featuring Nvidia chip again, with DLSS support this time.