Sunday, October 30th 2022
Intel's Next-Gen Desktop Platform Intros Socket LGA1851, "Meteor Lake-S" to Feature 6P+16E Core Counts
Keeping up with the cadence of two generations of desktop processors per socket, Intel will turn the page of the current LGA1700, with the introduction of the new Socket LGA1851. The processor package will likely have the same dimensions as LGA1700, and the two sockets may share cooler compatibility. The first processor microarchitecture to debut on LGA1851 will be the 14th Gen Core "Meteor Lake-S." These chips will feature a generationally lower CPU core-count compared to "Raptor Lake," but significantly bump the IPC on both the P-cores and E-cores.
"Raptor Lake" is Intel's final monolithic silicon client processor before the company pivots to chiplets built on various foundry nodes, as part of its IDM 2.0 strategy. The client-desktop version of "Meteor Lake," dubbed "Meteor Lake-S," will have a maximum CPU core configuration of 6P+16E (that's 6 performance cores with 16 efficiency cores). The chip has 6 "Redwood Cove" P-cores, and 16 "Crestmont" E-cores. Both of these are expected to receive IPC uplifts, such that the processor will end up faster (and hopefully more efficient) than the top "Raptor Lake-S" part. Particularly, it should be able to overcome the deficit of 2 P-cores.
Intel could find itself with a similar product differentiation problem it faced with the 11th Gen Core "Rocket Lake-S" desktop processors, where the physically low CPU core-count compared to the previous-generation (8-core vs. 10-core for "Comet Lake-S"); meant that both the Core i7-11700K and i9-11900K ended up being 8-core/16-thread processors. Here, we could see 6P+16E being the core-config of nearly all top SKUs, segmented by clock-speeds; while the mid-tier SKUs end up being 6P+8E.
Besides the CPU, "Meteor Lake-S" is expected to debut the new Xe-LPG graphics architecture for the iGPU, which could meet DirectX 12 Ultimate logo requirements. The iGPU on the "Meteor Lake-S" processor is expected to feature 4 Xe Cores, which works out to 64 EUs, and 512 unified shaders. This would still be a significant uplift from the iGPU of "Raptor Lake-S" with 32 EUs.
Intel is expected to restore CPU core-counts back to current levels with the 15th Gen "Arrow Lake-S" (2024-25). These chips are expected to come with core-configurations of up to 8P+16E. While the E-cores are expected to remain the same, the P-cores get a performance uplift, besides the addition of more cores. The "Compute Tile" (the die with the CPU cores) of "Meteor Lake-S" is built on the Intel 4 node (isopower characteristics comparable to TSMC 5 nm); while those of "Arrow Lake-S" will be built on the Intel 20A node (Intel is hyping 20A to be a pathbreaking node competitive with TSMC's sub 2 nm nodes).
Source:
Wccftech
"Raptor Lake" is Intel's final monolithic silicon client processor before the company pivots to chiplets built on various foundry nodes, as part of its IDM 2.0 strategy. The client-desktop version of "Meteor Lake," dubbed "Meteor Lake-S," will have a maximum CPU core configuration of 6P+16E (that's 6 performance cores with 16 efficiency cores). The chip has 6 "Redwood Cove" P-cores, and 16 "Crestmont" E-cores. Both of these are expected to receive IPC uplifts, such that the processor will end up faster (and hopefully more efficient) than the top "Raptor Lake-S" part. Particularly, it should be able to overcome the deficit of 2 P-cores.
Besides the CPU, "Meteor Lake-S" is expected to debut the new Xe-LPG graphics architecture for the iGPU, which could meet DirectX 12 Ultimate logo requirements. The iGPU on the "Meteor Lake-S" processor is expected to feature 4 Xe Cores, which works out to 64 EUs, and 512 unified shaders. This would still be a significant uplift from the iGPU of "Raptor Lake-S" with 32 EUs.
Intel is expected to restore CPU core-counts back to current levels with the 15th Gen "Arrow Lake-S" (2024-25). These chips are expected to come with core-configurations of up to 8P+16E. While the E-cores are expected to remain the same, the P-cores get a performance uplift, besides the addition of more cores. The "Compute Tile" (the die with the CPU cores) of "Meteor Lake-S" is built on the Intel 4 node (isopower characteristics comparable to TSMC 5 nm); while those of "Arrow Lake-S" will be built on the Intel 20A node (Intel is hyping 20A to be a pathbreaking node competitive with TSMC's sub 2 nm nodes).
113 Comments on Intel's Next-Gen Desktop Platform Intros Socket LGA1851, "Meteor Lake-S" to Feature 6P+16E Core Counts
The platform/socket longevity as an advantage is a myth AMD fans have created. Let's keep it this way.If E-cores are just 15% faster for MTL it's enough to make MTL faster than RPL even if MTL P-Cores are exactly the same as RPL P-Cores.
You would rather be forced to buy a dead platform (AM4) because you can't afford DDR5 and a $300 motherboard (AM5)? That strategy doesn't see to be working out too well for AMD.
also makes me wonder if there's any market for pure E core chips at all.
If a platform affords one the ability to upgrade to the latest processors and the performance and the price is right then people will be more likely to upgrade.
In addition, you have to consider that not everyone buys the latest processors. If you purchased an X370 motherboard, you can upgrade to a 2000, 3000, or 5000 series CPU at any time. Ryzen 8000 series could be out and AM4 owners can be snagging 5000 series processors at steep discounts. You are getting a significant performance benefit at a very low cost. Considering that platform longevity is most certainly a factor.
That might be why AM4 CPUs and motherboard still dominate the top seller lists on Amazon and other eRetailers.
"the vast majority"? Depends what you mean by that. The vast majority of people don't know what a CPU is in the first place. Considering this is an enthusiast forum, I'll assume you mean the vast majority of enthusiasts. With that in mind, I'd contend that the upgrade rate of enthusiasts is entirely variable based on a number of conditions. If socket longevity increases, CPU performance makes large jumps generation over generation, and prices are reasonable then all of those would lead to increase upgrade rate. Coincidentally, those are all hallmarks of the AM4 platform.
Intel is absolutely missing out by not committing to a longer term platform.
In regards to Intel's next gen platform / CPUs, it will be very interesting to see how Intel's tiles perform and what kind of configurations they will offer.
The reason for this is that the diagram in this article showing a 6 P arrangement seems to me to refer to the Meteor Lake notebook and desktop range, the U/P/H platform as Intel calls it. What Intel are also introducing with the Meteor Lake mobile range are a second type of E core, the LPE (Low Power Efficient) core. Intel has released some firm information about this range including that these CPUs would have up to 14 cores, arranged as 6 P + 8 E/LPE. This ties in with the diagram. If I remember correctly Intel were planning at one stage to release the mobile Meteor Lake some time before the desktop range but are not planning to do so now. This would explain the early release of information about Meteor Lake particularly about the mobile parts, and why although some of it will also apply to the desktop the maximum of 6 P cores definitely will not.
And platform longevity is not a myth. 5800X3D sales surpassed Zen 3, Zen 4, Alder Lake and Raptor Lake sales combined once people saw the benchmarks.
The fact that a user can install one of the fastest gaming CPU's on a 5 year old motherboard is a pure win for consumers.
Personally, I've only done an in-socket upgrade once in my life, and that was a circumstantial planned event : I bought a R5 3600X after the 5000-series was launched because the 5000-series was getting priced-guauged during the silicon apocalypse. Later upgraded to a 5950X once the prices came back down to earth.I'd present an example of Sony and ASUS phones, but you could just say they're not as popular in general as Apple/Samsung.
So I'll present another datapoint : Apple sells more units of the larger variants of the iphone than the smaller variants, while being priced higher and making more margin per unit.
Here: browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?q=5800X3D
Compare with 12900K: browser.geekbench.com/v5/cpu/search?q=12900K
Suddenly it looks like 12900K is a lot more popular or 5800X3D owners ... eschew benchmarking only people buy the 5800X3D because it's such a powerhouse, right? And they don't run benchmarks? Stop BS'ing me.
On every poll at WCCFTech rabid AMD fans proclaim they will buy AMD GPUs ten times over meanwhile store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey/videocard/ - AMD's GPU share has been stagnant over the past decade, around 20%.
AMD's fans echo chamber is the biggest echo chamber I've ever seen in my entire life. Apple fans pale in comparison.
Here are some links for real sales:
www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Computer-CPU-Processors/zgbs/pc/229189
6 Ryzen's in Top10
5800X3D at #12 and 12900KF at #19
Also www.notebookcheck.net/Strong-Ryzen-7-5800X3D-sales-leave-Raptor-Lake-and-Zen-4-trailing-in-its-wake.664759.0.html
1400 units sold. 12900K less than 30.
But please keep telling how 12900 is supposedly selling better...
But supposedly no one is upgrading on the same socket and everyone is keeping their for the entire lifetime of the socket (the Intel narrative).